Still no clock or guide in Houston for over a week. I've tried so many things I have forgotten what they are, I am sure most have been the wrong thing to do.

Anyway as of today, I ran the G test for the first time (I think), and this is what I got:

As you can see, it was on the screen about 1.5 min when I took the picture. Ok, I considered that a "fail"? I have no idea.

Then I ran the G test again; it went through Flash, VBI, and ATSC test in about 5-10 seconds (not enough time to take a picture), all 3 "PASS" and then went into reset (looked like an automatic soft reset to me?) "SONY" appeared on the TV screen for 2 seconds?

Then the unit turned itself "off" and there it sits with no clock

any ideas?

Well, you are just unlucky. I have run the G* Test at least 1000 times, and only had the reset happen once, and that was last Wednesday. I'd turn it back on and check your clock in the 753 menu, and see if it is correct now. If it is not, then do the G* Test again. Then check the 753 menu clock again. You are getting packets off that channel so it should be able to set the 753 menu clock. The front panel clock may take a little longer.

Mark

Same problem here, Clock is not being updated here in Detroit.

Here in Northern Virginia, my clock problem started on March 13.
It's displaying 10 hours ahead.:(

1. Digital Zip Codes to be used to receive TV Guide On Screen! I am trying that one now, all by itself

As a test, I did a TVGOS reset and entered the substitute zip code 00038 for Buffalo on my 2nd box and left it overnight. It did not acquire a host.

The counts in the HostChan column should not increment while the recorder is turned on. The recorder gets data from the host channel when it is turned off and from the VBI channel when it is turned on.

I have seen the HostChan packets counting up twice, once in the log I just posted (when the clock channel, and host channel were identical, I might add). And last Wednesday when I finally got a host channel when using the 'VBI Search Channel' method. Other than that, maybe you're right.

No.
Could you elaborate a little more? As you can see the ZipcodePkts did start counting again when the clock channel set correctly, so why the definitive 'No'?

Mark

Just chiming in to update the situation in SE PA (Comcast); suburban Philadelphia.

For about a month, everything was smooth. I had a full lineup, Comcast opened up all of the extended basic channels as clearQAM, and daily listings were error-free. I attribute this to the host channel showing up as 1:93-0 ... which is a non-existant analog channel. My theory was that Comcast was somehow stripping the TVGOS data and putting it onto a channel that you can't tune to.

Anyways, it worked perfectly.

Until about a week ago. The Host Channel switched to 1:0-2 ... which is the analog channel for my local CBS station. Initially, listing downloads were fine, but they soon became more sporadic. A couple of times, I had full days of "No Listings". Sometimes, the Day 1/2/4 listings would overwrite good listings. For example, tonight's DWTS was fine when downloaded from Day8, but our nights ago, the download got botched and DWTS was switched to No Listing and the Day 2 and Day 1 downloads didn't fix it.

The funny thing is that Analog 2 has tons of VBI info coming in (as seen on the G* Test) ... much more than the digital version of CBS (3-1).

Anyways, I'll try setting a midnight recording on Analog 2 tonight to make sure it's tuned to channel 2 for the downloads.

ft

At this point I am trying anything - not yet to sledge hammer, but getting close.

Ok, have run G test about a dozen times in the last 40 minutes or so, just to see what I get, all on digital 11-1 the local CBS

Just over 90% of the time all three items "PASS" (flash, VBI, ATSC).
Once ATSC "failed" and 3 times I think VBI "failed"

As of now, the clock reset itself to 12:00AM and is counting and the Sony Box is still "on" but will turn off at 1:00AM (less than 20 min to go).

For the first time "ever" I am receiving ATSC slicer data stuff? and a few other screens

pics

if anyone would like to interpret the pic that would great.

Should I leave the box "on" or "off" at this point (tuned to digital CBS OTA)?

Seriously - Is the Pic 6931 something new? I do not think I have seen that before? I dunno!

As a test, I did a TVGOS reset and entered the substitute zip code 00038 for Buffalo on my 2nd box and left it overnight. It did not acquire a host.


I think that is a "dead end" as others have told me.......but it may be something to remember for the future.........not know what is happening with the DTV mess........funny it is Sony and macrovision that suggested it.......but then again 90% of their info has been wrong.

So whats going on here, All of a sudden everyone is having problems? I had been going along just fine, I just did a tv guide reset and it once again picked up the wrong time:confused:
Since everyone is having problems, including myself, it sounds to me like its a TVGOS problem, not a local station problem. Sounds like the local stations are not getting the guide data sent to them, so they can't send it out to us. Just my guess.

I'm getting clock data, but no guide data.

Ok, in the last hour I did the stuff just posted above.

Unit reset clock to 12:00AM and I have left it "on" - thinking the 1:00AM would roll around AND it would then turn itself "off"

I just went back to the room to take a look see.

AND it now reads 7:34AM - It is now exactly 1 hour "off" - the correct time here is 8:34AM DST............the box thinks it is "standard" time (see pictures posted above).

The box is still "on" digital CBS.

I could leave it "on" till it turns itself "off" at 1:00AM (about 18 hours from now?). OR turn it "off" now?

I am inclined to leave it "on"

any thoughts on this? anyone?

I think this means I am getting digital clock from CBS........but the box does not know yet it is Daylight Savings Time?

pic 6934 shows a lot of data being "rejected", this may be TV Guide Data Listings and it may be rejected because the box is "on" ? Just a guess.

Pic 6937 compare that to pic 6929 above - the Sony Box has figured out it is DST; but the time should be showing 9:00AM not 8:00AM

Pic 6936 compare that to pic 6931 above.

lots of info screens show a lot of stuff coming in........."no data" for listings at this point.

"Easter egg"??? :confused:

Couldn't help but notice that entry.

Ok, in the last hour I did the stuff just posted above.

Unit reset clock to 12:00AM and I have left it "on" - thinking the 1:00AM would roll around AND it would then turn itself "off"

I just went back to the room to take a look see.

AND it now reads 7:34AM - It is now exactly 1 hour "off" - the correct time here is 8:34AM DST............the box thinks it is "standard" time (see pictures posted above).

The box is still "on" digital CBS.

I could leave it "on" till it turns itself "off" at 1:00AM (about 18 hours from now?). OR turn it "off" now?

I am inclined to leave it "on"

any thoughts on this? anyone?

I think this means I am getting digital clock from CBS........but the box does not know yet it is Daylight Savings Time?

Stop, and take a breath a minute. :)
Your software patch version has reverted back to 00.00.00. It has to upgrade to 08.05.40, and then to 08.06.44, before your clock will be right
again. I believe you can just leave your unit on (although I've got the upgrades before with it off) and tuned to this channel.

Mark

"Easter egg"??? :confused:

Couldn't help but notice that entry.


Serious though, is that new in pic 6931 or has it always been there?

Looks like there is some 4G Host ID stuff is new there too?

Ok, I will leave box alone for awhile.

but I still have the sledge hammer ready just in case I have to nudge it a little.

HoustonPerson; that one screen shot you posted with the VBI & ATSC test. The the VBI test failed, but the screen does show a VBI count. This is unlike my situation where the VBI test fails and I receive no VBI count from my digital host channel.

Since everyone is having problems,

Include me with everyone.

But. As I keep on writing my problems are only with two 500's.

On the very same feed, my 250 is functioning perfectly [God I hope I'm not jinxing it].

If anyone can figure out why the 250 is OK maybe we can deduct the problem with the rest.

At this moment I have attached an antenna to one of the 500 to see if a download from the digital OTA channel changes anything.

G* comcast 705, left unit on all night....

Did not get any listings last night.
I am going to try all today on Fox 702 since it is passing VBI packets.
Berkley Jim had some success with that.
I know if we wait long enough this will get a fix sent out....just trying to get by until then.


Cw
Bay Area, CA

I had a conversation from an engineer from our "digital host" station and he asked me the same question I have thought about asking here. Something HustonPerson is questioning also:

For all of you that claim you are receiving data from only a digital host station, how can you be sure these listing aren't from the analog host, assuming the analog host is still supplying data??

metro Detroit OTA. After several days with bad clock and no listing updates the clock reset late last night and the unit received a full week of listings.

Host channel ID is blank.

For the first time in about 2 years the unit was tuned to the local PBS analog station when turned off. Relevant?

Day 6 and still no listings after the factory service reset.

Last night I tried the G*-leave-ON to the FOX channel on cable.

753 show 700+ zipcode packets. I'm not sure how many zipcode updates one should expect per day.

(I have received the software update and I get the TVGOS advertisements.)

Next, I'll just turn it off for two days and see what happens.

I noticed a 500 sold for $700 plus $35 shipping with 35 bids on eBay. I'm tempted to list the unit, but I feel I need to be fully functional before selling it.

Have you done a G* Test while tuned to your digital CBS channel? That is the easiest way to know whether your CBS station is sending TVGOS data.

It turns out that may not be an accurate indicator after all. The G* Factory Test shows VBI packets on WLTX-DT, the CBS station in Columbia SC. Nevertheless, someone reported in the Columbia local thread this morning that she had spoken with an engineer at WLTX who told her that they are not sending TVGOS data, nor (apparently) do they plan to.

So, what's in those VBI packets? I see them only on this station.

So far, only one station in my area has been confirmed to carry digital TVGOS (WTVI-DT in Charlotte), and it's too weak and too far away for me. If no station in either Greenville or Columbia SC steps up in the next three months, I'm hosed. :(

I too here in Atlanta,GA have one unit that is an hour off. Software still has not updated after a couple of days. Both units locked up when I tried to record a morning show. Time froze. One unit reset itself after a period of time with the correct time. The other unit digital audio was not coming through, so I did a soft reset. The time came back an hour behind (standard time). All zeros in the software. Afer the first day, back up to 08.05.44? but still not the correct time. Today, the same software version and still off 1 hour. The audio problem was with my AVR. Somehow with the lockup it change my audio input setting for that unit.
Also, checked the digital host for my area and have found that is is not working( CBS 46.1) I am currently stuck with analog host channel 2, ABC. Does anyone know if CBS 46.1 has decided to drop TVGOS?
Thanks, Michael

Since everyone is having problems...........

I better knock on wood when I say this, but aside from a few spontaneous reboot episodes several months back my two HDD500's (OTA & Charter cable) have been working fine. I seem to always have a full 8 days of listings. :)

The only issue I have is that one of my units doesn't have PLDHD in the channel lineup. The other unit does have PLDHD in the lineup, but it never gets any listings for that channel. :confused:

Knock, knock, knock ............. ;)

On another note, I'm pretty sure that the "Easter Egg" field has always been there. I think I stumbled on to it a while back and thought it was rather unusual.

Ok, the unit has been “on” about 3 hours since my last post. The clock is still exactly one hour off.

Pic 6946 shows the SW is updated to 08.05.40 – still shy of what it was last week under analogue – 7 days ago when it died.

It appears that with each sw update, many of the counters on the info screen start over at “zero”?

For example “EasterEgg” page is now back to zero again picture 6942

ATSC slicer page is back to zero picture 6943

You will notice “failing clock” and “clock set” are: 0:0-0 picture 6945

Look closely at pic 6938 thru 6941 – If I recall correctly (yes someone can correct me); under the analogue routine schedule downloads were 180, 60, and 30 minute time frames. Under this new 4 pages of schedule they appear to be: 180, 50, 60, 30, and 20 minutes and a few more of them?

On picture 6947 my VBI is 0:0-0, host is blank, and Host ID: 0xFFFF - - Keep in mind the unit has not been turned “off” since I start all this early this morning. But I have entered and exited all these screens several times.

In one of my previous pictures (earlier this morning), I had a page with many (few thousand) “rejects” of Downloads – at that time the sw was 00.00.00 – now that page is 100% zeros on sw 08.05.40

IMO it seems as if the unit is attempting to do something.

I still do not know if matters would be improved with the unit “on” or “off”

I had a conversation from an engineer from our "digital host" station and he asked me the same question I have thought about asking here. Something HustonPerson is questioning also:

For all of you that claim you are receiving data from only a digital host station, how can you be sure these listing aren't from the analog host, assuming the analog host is still supplying data??

My analog PBS (my old reliable analog host) turned off their signal on 01/05/2009. They installed a Digital antenna in its place, and started transmitting on their old analog frequency on Feb. 17. I know I have no analog host. If I did I wouldn't be having the problems I'm having.

HoustonPerson believes that these problems would have magically evaporated if the transition had happened on Feb. 17. I, on the other hand, think this board is going to be flooded with people who discover their units are broken after June 12. Either because of glitches with switching to a digital host (possibly fixable), or because there is no digital stations carrying the TVGOS in their area (not fixable). For those of you who have an analog host still transmitting, you should hope that it stays that way until macrovision sends out a software version that fixes these issues, presuming they are even working on the problem.

Mark

pics

Ok, the unit has been “on” about 3 hours since my last post. The clock is still exactly one hour off.

Pic 6946 shows the SW is updated to 08.05.40 – still shy of what it was last week under analogue – 7 days ago when it died.

It appears that with each sw update, many of the counters on the info screen start over at “zero”?

For example “EasterEgg” page is now back to zero again picture 6942

ATSC slicer page is back to zero picture 6943

You will notice “failing clock” and “clock set” are: 0:0-0 picture 6945

Look closely at pic 6938 thru 6941 – If I recall correctly (yes someone can correct me); under the analogue routine schedule downloads were 180, 60, and 30 minute time frames. Under this new 4 pages of schedule they appear to be: 180, 50, 60, 30, and 20 minutes and a few more of them?

On picture 6947 my VBI is 0:0-0, host is blank, and Host ID: 0xFFFF - - Keep in mind the unit has not been turned “off” since I start all this early this morning. But I have entered and exited all these screens several times.

In one of my previous pictures (earlier this morning), I had a page with many (few thousand) “rejects” of Downloads – at that time the sw was 00.00.00 – now that page is 100% zeros on sw 08.05.40

IMO it seems as if the unit is attempting to do something.

I still do not know if matters would be improved with the unit “on” or “off”

HoustonPerson,

Check your reset page (no need to post a picture ;)), Just go up one screen from the intial 753 menu screen. If your PowerOn field says N/A, instead of having a time/date in that field, you need to run the G* test again, or you;ll never get VBI data (like you have been experiencing over the last few days). Also, when the version updates to 08.06.44, you may have to do this again, to get the VBI data to come in.

Mark

My analog PBS (my old reliable analog host) turned off their signal on 01/05/2009. They installed a Digital antenna in its place, and started transmitting on their old analog frequency on Feb. 17. I know I have no analog host. If I did I wouldn't be having the problems I'm having.

HoustonPerson believes that these problems would have magically evaporated if the transition had happened on Feb. 17. I, on the other hand, think this board is going to be flooded with people who discover their units are broken after June 12. Either because of glitches with switching to a digital host (possibly fixable), or because there is no digital stations carrying the TVGOS in their area (not fixable). For those of you who have an analog host still transmitting, you should hope that it stays that way until macrovision sends out a software version that fixes these issues, presuming they are even working on the problem.

Mark

Kind of sort of maybe yes no could be I dunno.

IMO if we had a clean switch on Feb 17th at least would know real quick assuming CBS is sending out something the Sony Box can work with.

It appears to me both our analogue stations quit sending TV Guide at midnight March 9th for Houston.

I think ?? KWG in Houston has his Sony Box working correctly; but I have not heard from him in a week or so? I think there are about 5 others in Houston like me, that have not yet been able to make it work with CBS digital.

I do know, and have know for some time the low power, and at least a dozen RF conflicts in my area do cause all sorts of problems that are now much worse between Feb 17th and June 12th - it is a mess for many in our area. Assuming the DTV is completed June 12th, it will clean up the airwaves a lot, eliminate all RF conflicts, and 4 or more of the stations will finally go to full power. Of course "none" of that would have happend if the "switch" was done like it was supposed to be in the first place. But that is all water under the bridge now.

Still no clock or guide in Houston for over a week. I've tried so many things I have forgotten what they are, I am sure most have been the wrong thing to do.

Anyway as of today, I ran the G test for the first time (I think), and this is what I got:

As you can see, it was on the screen about 1.5 min when I took the picture. Ok, I considered that a "fail"? I have no idea.

Then I ran the G test again; it went through Flash, VBI, and ATSC test in about 5-10 seconds (not enough time to take a picture), all 3 "PASS" and then went into reset (looked like an automatic soft reset to me?) "SONY" appeared on the TV screen for 2 seconds?

Then the unit turned itself "off" and there it sits with no clock

any ideas?

See post 14432 regarding the G* Test. I don't know why it happens, but your recorder did a spontaneous reset. This behavior has been reported by others, but no one has offered a good explanation of why this happens.

At this moment I have attached an antenna to one of the 500 to see if a download from the digital OTA channel changes anything.

After several hours of the OTA digital feed this 500 is almost totally populated for a week- just missing some here and there for Sunday.

But no ads are showing.

I've removed the antenna and am hoping it now someone magically resumes getting data off the analog cable feed that is populating the 250 with no problem.

Thanks mabuttra

Ok power on was NA

so did the G test thing again...........first time it failed.......second time it passed.

Now I have a date in the power on AND data in the next three fields too.

When it does to the next sw update I will do the G test again.

The box is still "on" and will leav it "on"...........look at the info screen again later today etc.

It turns out that may not be an accurate indicator after all. The G* Factory Test shows VBI packets on WLTX-DT, the CBS station in Columbia SC. Nevertheless, someone reported in the Columbia local thread this morning that she had spoken with an engineer at WLTX who told her that they are not sending TVGOS data, nor (apparently) do they plan to.

So, what's in those VBI packets? I see them only on this station.

So far, only one station in my area has been confirmed to carry digital TVGOS (WTVI-DT in Charlotte), and it's too weak and too far away for me. If no station in either Greenville or Columbia SC steps up in the next three months, I'm hosed. :(

You are right, just because the VBI packets are counting up, is not 100% conclusive that it is TVGOS data, but it is a pretty good indication that it is. You may be the first person who is getting data during this test that apparently isn't TVGOS data. In fact I'm skeptical that it isn't, and if it were me, I would check the time in the 753 menu, and if it is correct look around at some of the other data in these screens, to see if there is any data counts getting updated.

I do know this though, if the DHG doesn't receive VBI data during the G* Test, there is absolutely zero chance that channel will update the TVGOS guide.
No matter how long it sits there tuned to that station. :)

Mark

I have seen the HostChan packets counting up twice, once in the log I just posted (when the clock channel, and host channel were identical, I might add). And last Wednesday when I finally got a host channel when using the 'VBI Search Channel' method. Other than that, maybe you're right.


Could you elaborate a little more? As you can see the ZipcodePkts did start counting again when the clock channel set correctly, so why the definitive 'No'?

Mark

The clock set channel only carries the informtion used to make adjustments to the clock to keep it accurate. The time zone packets come via the host channel or the VBI channel. They are completely separate. Just because changes to items occur in close proximity to each other doesn't mean they are necessarily related.

Ok, the unit has been “on” about 3 hours since my last post. The clock is still exactly one hour off.

Pic 6946 shows the SW is updated to 08.05.40 – still shy of what it was last week under analogue – 7 days ago when it died.

It appears that with each sw update, many of the counters on the info screen start over at “zero”?

Houston, deep breath, deep breath. You are making progress.

As others have posted, when a SW update downloads it seems to "turn off" the VBI flow and it resets a whole bunch of things to zero. Just do the G* test again to restart VBI. When the latest SW downloads (08.06.44) it will again stop VBI. Your clock should adjust for DST once you get that update.

At that point you are probably going to have to turn the unit off and hope it finds a host to build your channel lineup. I don't think any of us that have tried have been able to get that to happen with the unit left on.

Thanks mabuttra

Ok power on was NA

so did the G test thing again...........first time it failed.......second time it passed.

Now I have a date in the power on AND data in the next three fields too.

When it does to the next sw update I will do the G test again.

The box is still "on" and will leav it "on"...........look at the info screen again later today etc.

Excellent. It may take several hours to get the next update.

Mark

At this point I am trying anything - not yet to sledge hammer, but getting close.

Ok, have run G test about a dozen times in the last 40 minutes or so, just to see what I get, all on digital 11-1 the local CBS

Just over 90% of the time all three items "PASS" (flash, VBI, ATSC).
Once ATSC "failed" and 3 times I think VBI "failed"

As of now, the clock reset itself to 12:00AM and is counting and the Sony Box is still "on" but will turn off at 1:00AM (less than 20 min to go).

For the first time "ever" I am receiving ATSC slicer data stuff? and a few other screens

As of this set of screens, you have not received a time zone packet yet. Without getting time zone information your recorder cannot set the clock to the correct local time. Also, without a correctly set clock you can't get a host channel (others will disagree with me on this). My experience is that you can't receive time zone packets with the recorder on (others wil disagree with me on this also). Time zone data is broadcast much less frequently than all of the other types of data so it could take a long time for you to receive this.

I do know, and have know for some time the low power, and at least a dozen RF conflicts in my area do cause all sorts of problems that are now much worse between Feb 17th and June 12th - it is a mess for many in our area. Assuming the DTV is completed June 12th, it will clean up the airwaves a lot, eliminate all RF conflicts, and 4 or more of the stations will finally go to full power. Of course "none" of that would have happend if the "switch" was done like it was supposed to be in the first place. But that is all water under the bridge now.

I understand your frustration of seeing the end in sight for all of your RF interference problems, only to have that date moved forward another 4 months.

Mark

pics

if anyone would like to interpret the pic that would great.

Should I leave the box "on" or "off" at this point (tuned to digital CBS OTA)?

Seriously - Is the Pic 6931 something new? I do not think I have seen that before? I dunno!

The first two screens are not relevant to your problem. The third screen shows that you are receiving TVGOS data on your VBI channel.

As of this set of screens, you have not received a time zone packet yet. Without getting time zone information your recorder cannot set the clock to the correct local time. Also, without a correctly set clock you can't get a host channel (others will disagree with me on this). My experience is that you can't receive time zone packets with the recorder on (others wil disagree with me on this also). Time zone data is broadcast much less frequently than all of the other types of data so it could take a long time for you to receive this.

ImTheOne,
I think his clock is correct, just off an hour. I think he received a Timezone packet previously, but the counts have been wiped out since then.

Mark

Since everyone is having problems, including myself, it sounds to me like its a TVGOS problem, not a local station problem. Sounds like the local stations are not getting the guide data sent to them, so they can't send it out to us. Just my guess.

I'm getting clock data, but no guide data.

Two recorders, both OTA. One has a digital host, the other has an analog host. Both recorders have correct time and full eight days of listings. Sounds more like regional problems with broadcast equipment to me.

Thanks possumgirl, intheone, maburtta...........I'm off to the grocery store now, back later this afternoon.

Worse today than yesterday. Mostly no listing with a few no titles thrown in, so something must have downloaded, just not actual listings.

I wonder if many of the disappearing transmissions, particularly from the PBS stations, might be contractual? Since all of these analog stations were supposed to disappear 2/17, perhaps their contracts/agreements with Macrovision have expired and one end or the other is pulling the plug on the inserters? Just speculation on my part.

Ok, in the last hour I did the stuff just posted above.

Unit reset clock to 12:00AM and I have left it "on" - thinking the 1:00AM would roll around AND it would then turn itself "off"

I just went back to the room to take a look see.

AND it now reads 7:34AM - It is now exactly 1 hour "off" - the correct time here is 8:34AM DST............the box thinks it is "standard" time (see pictures posted above).

The box is still "on" digital CBS.

I could leave it "on" till it turns itself "off" at 1:00AM (about 18 hours from now?). OR turn it "off" now?

I am inclined to leave it "on"

any thoughts on this? anyone?

I think this means I am getting digital clock from CBS........but the box does not know yet it is Daylight Savings Time?

When your recorder reset itself, it likely went back to the 08.01.42/00.00.00 version of the software. You have also likely received a time zone packet and a software update to 08.01.42/08.05.40, which uses the old daylight savings time dates. Once your recorder updates to 08.01.42/08.06.44, the time will display correctly. You can confirm all of this by looking in the 753... information screens.

pic 6934 shows a lot of data being "rejected", this may be TV Guide Data Listings and it may be rejected because the box is "on" ? Just a guess.

Pic 6937 compare that to pic 6929 above - the Sony Box has figured out it is DST; but the time should be showing 9:00AM not 8:00AM

Pic 6936 compare that to pic 6931 above.

lots of info screens show a lot of stuff coming in........."no data" for listings at this point.

Guide listings data is being rejected because you don't have a channel lineup yet.

Sounds more like regional problems with broadcast equipment to me.

Yes/Maybe and no.

I'm on Cablevision in the NYC area. Our analog feed came from PBS channel 13. It was also transmitted by Cablevision on the scroll channel 14.

Channel 13 is now failing the VBI test. Cable Channel 2.1 CBS is also failing the VBI test.

OTA Channel 2.1 CBS is passing the test and today gave me almost complete listing.

It seems obvious that Cablevision is stripping the data from the CBS 2.1 feed and converting it to send on analog Channel 14.

There is some difference we are not aware in our units, that for my 250, that converted data is good and usable, but for my two 500 it is somehow deficient.

HoustonPerson; that one screen shot you posted with the VBI & ATSC test. The the VBI test failed, but the screen does show a VBI count. This is unlike my situation where the VBI test fails and I receive no VBI count from my digital host channel.

Your test failed because you have no data on the tested channel. HoustonPerson's test failed because the recorder did not receive the TVGOS data within the first 18 seconds of the test. His test will pass if he presses 2 or exits the test and immediately reruns the test.

I had a conversation from an engineer from our "digital host" station and he asked me the same question I have thought about asking here. Something HustonPerson is questioning also:

For all of you that claim you are receiving data from only a digital host station, how can you be sure these listing aren't from the analog host, assuming the analog host is still supplying data??

Digital downloads occur on a different schedule and for different durations than analog downloads. Look in the 753... information screens at the last download time and match it to the download schedule. This will tell you if you downloaded from an analog or a digital source.

It turns out that may not be an accurate indicator after all. The G* Factory Test shows VBI packets on WLTX-DT, the CBS station in Columbia SC. Nevertheless, someone reported in the Columbia local thread this morning that she had spoken with an engineer at WLTX who told her that they are not sending TVGOS data, nor (apparently) do they plan to.

So, what's in those VBI packets? I see them only on this station.

So far, only one station in my area has been confirmed to carry digital TVGOS (WTVI-DT in Charlotte), and it's too weak and too far away for me. If no station in either Greenville or Columbia SC steps up in the next three months, I'm hosed. :(

Tune your recorder to WLTX-DT, disable the auto off feature if you use it, leave your recorder on overnight, check to see if you have listings for day 8 the following morning. If you do, the engineer doesn't know what he is talking about and your recorder will be fine. Don't take everything you hear on faith.

Ok, the unit has been “on” about 3 hours since my last post. The clock is still exactly one hour off.

Pic 6946 shows the SW is updated to 08.05.40 – still shy of what it was last week under analogue – 7 days ago when it died.

It appears that with each sw update, many of the counters on the info screen start over at “zero”?

For example “EasterEgg” page is now back to zero again picture 6942

ATSC slicer page is back to zero picture 6943

You will notice “failing clock” and “clock set” are: 0:0-0 picture 6945

Look closely at pic 6938 thru 6941 – If I recall correctly (yes someone can correct me); under the analogue routine schedule downloads were 180, 60, and 30 minute time frames. Under this new 4 pages of schedule they appear to be: 180, 50, 60, 30, and 20 minutes and a few more of them?

On picture 6947 my VBI is 0:0-0, host is blank, and Host ID: 0xFFFF - - Keep in mind the unit has not been turned “off” since I start all this early this morning. But I have entered and exited all these screens several times.

In one of my previous pictures (earlier this morning), I had a page with many (few thousand) “rejects” of Downloads – at that time the sw was 00.00.00 – now that page is 100% zeros on sw 08.05.40

IMO it seems as if the unit is attempting to do something.

I still do not know if matters would be improved with the unit “on” or “off”

Reset means just that. Setting things back to an initial state, which in many cases is zero. Your clock is off by 1 hour because you are at 08.05.40 and not yet at 08.06.44. The additional information in your download schedules is the download schedule for a digital channel. You don't have a host channel yet and you can't get a host channel until you turn the recorder off and let it find one. Counts on many of the screens reset when you get a software update. I would suggest that you turn your recorder off and leave it off overnight.

HoustonPerson,

Check your reset page (no need to post a picture ;)), Just go up one screen from the intial 753 menu screen. If your PowerOn field says N/A, instead of having a time/date in that field, you need to run the G* test again, or you;ll never get VBI data (like you have been experiencing over the last few days). Also, when the version updates to 08.06.44, you may have to do this again, to get the VBI data to come in.

Mark

This is not correct.

ImTheOne,
I think his clock is correct, just off an hour. I think he received a Timezone packet previously, but the counts have been wiped out since then.

Mark

I started reading from where I left off last night and didn't see that you and Possumgirl were also responding to HoustonPerson's posts. As of this message, what I posted is correct. I also responded to subsequent messages that show additional progress. Then I started seeing your replies and those of Possumgirl.

Two recorders, both OTA. One has a digital host, the other has an analog host. Both recorders have correct time and full eight days of listings. Sounds more like regional problems with broadcast equipment to me.

How did you succeed in getting the one unit to be digital host only since you obviously have an analog host still available? We have similar setups since I also have 2 units, both OTA only, and I cannot make them stop seeing the analog host.

Last week I once again put my 500 through test. No problem getting clock and both SW updates. After restarting VBI (and reinputting my setup info for good measure) I left it on for 24 hours hoping for a channel lineup. No luck of course.

So I figured since it had never "seen" the analog host I'd try one more thing. I reset user config once to retain the SW updates. Did the G* test being sure 2-1 displayed in both fields, again input setup info, issued the Search Current VBI and turned it off for 24 hours. No surprise the next day when I had my channel lineup and found the host channel was analog 11.

Now my other unit has displayed 2-1 as its host for months but, as I've mentioned before, it's still using 11 whenever it's turned off.

This is not correct.
What is not correct about this? This is exactly what HoustonPerson's problem was. His unit has been a brick for probably a week (and I'm partly to blame because I never suggested that he do a G* Test, because I assumed he already had, until today). His unit basically had never come out of reset mode, and the Power On field indicating N/A proved that.

Mark

How did you succeed in getting the one unit to be digital host only since you obviously have an analog host still available? We have similar setups since I also have 2 units, both OTA only, and I cannot make them stop seeing the analog host..............

I have both of my HDD500's hooked up to OTA and cable. I also recently purchased a Mits TV that runs version 9.something TVGOS. I have a PBS analog station and a CBS digital station that broadcast TVGOS data OTA, and the analog TVGOS from the PBS station also comes in over cable. I've never tried the G*test on the QAM digital CBS channel, so I don't know if it passes the TVGOS data or not. According to the "host ID" field in the diagnostics all three of the devices are using the analog cable PBS station as the TVGOS host.

I read in an earlier post today about the ImTheOne method to use the last d/l time to determine if the host is analog or digital. I plan to look at that, but I probably won't have time to look at it tonight.

I purchased a Sony DHG HDD250 about three weeks ago, a new but refurbished unit from a friend of a friend who was reselling them. The machine worked great, until a 30 power outage on Wednesday evening of last week (4 March). Now, the clock will not set correctly and I sometimes have trouble getting the guide information. The clock is usually somewhere between 11.5 hour and 20 minutes late.

I'm trying to read through the comments in this thread but am a bit overwhelmed. Is the somewhere that the diagnostic information/trouble shooting procedures are spelled out other than in this thread? I'm in the Dallas/Fort Worth area (Fort Worth side) if that helps and get my signal solely over the air.

Thanks so much.

Quote below from an engineer at our local (Hartford, CT) PBS station. Possible that the same thing has been happening across the country as there seems to be a much higher reported rate of listings failures without stable digital TVGOS feeds:

"CPTV has been informed that Macrovision / GemStar had decided to stop uploading the TV Guide data to their analog encoders after 2/28/2009, because their budget forecast only allowed for that length of time.

Origionally, analog OTA broadcasts were to have ceased on Tuesday February 17, 2009, but the government later extended that date to June 12, 2009.

So in the mean time...No further analog TVGuide updates until...

AT&T is scheduled to install the DSL network for the digital encoder updates on Thursday March 19, 2009. Then it will be up to Macrovision / GemStar to do the rest.

CPTV has been informed that...

"With the correct cable headend equipment, the Gemstar ATSC data can be converted to VBI data and the data would then be available on the basic cable tier. A DTV PAL converter box can also provide the ATSC data>VBI data conversion for Gemstar legacy equipment."

And that...

"Gemstar will definitely work with the cable systems carrying their TV Guide data once the data is available for decoding."

So there is still hope for legacy equipment."

I purchased a Sony DHG HDD250 about three weeks ago, a new but refurbished unit from a friend of a friend who was reselling them. The machine worked great, until a 30 power outage on Wednesday evening of last week (4 March). Now, the clock will not set correctly and I sometimes have trouble getting the guide information. The clock is usually somewhere between 11.5 hour and 20 minutes late.

I'm trying to read through the comments in this thread but am a bit overwhelmed. Is the somewhere that the diagnostic information/trouble shooting procedures are spelled out other than in this thread? I'm in the Dallas/Fort Worth area (Fort Worth side) if that helps and get my signal solely over the air.

Thanks so much.

Need a little more info to see if the power outage did anything other than mess with your clock.

Go into your guide screens and navigate across the top to setup and select it. Move down one to Change Settings but do not press select. Instead, enter the following number from your keypad: 753159852. That will display an info screen.

Look in the top left corner at the GMT date/time. The time should be exactly 5 hours ahead of your current time. Also you should see [3] following the time. Now just below there are some data lines. The second line should start 08.01.40/08.06.44. If you don't have 08.06.44, what is there?

Lastly, press DOWN twice on the remote to go to the clocks 1 screen. In the offset (sec) from UTC you should see -21600.

I'm in the Dallas area. Last week it would appear Channel 13 stopped their TVGOS signal, even though I had contacted them and they said it would continue until June 12. I have two 250s, one 500, and a Panasonic analog only DVR running TVGOS v9. Last week, all of them did not have listings past Monday, and the Host Channel was blank. I'm OTA only.

Friday night at 1:30am, I did the G* Test on CBS 11.1 on the 500, got the usual 1023-66532 number, channel up, channel back to 11.1, G* Test now showed channel as 11.1. I then performed the Force Host Channel setting and shut it off.

I did the same thing on one of the 250s, but I never could get the G* Test to display 11.1, so I did NOT perform the Force Host Channel setting.

The next day, I checked them around 5pm and both had fully populated the listings for all eight days. The Host Channel was still blank and the Clock Set Channel was 19, which I believe is what CBS digital really is.

I did the G* Test on the other 250 last night, but haven't had a chance to check it. I did a Force Host Channel setting on the Panasonic, but also have not had a chance to check on it.

I've never had the host channel be blank before, but it seems to be working. I had guide data through next Sunday as of last night.

Also, I have a Pioneer plasma running TVGOS v8, the same as the Sony's are running, that is working fine, and its host channel is 13! Go figure.

Anybody in Dallas having similar results?

You are right, just because the VBI packets are counting up, is not 100% conclusive that it is TVGOS data, but it is a pretty good indication that it is. You may be the first person who is getting data during this test that apparently isn't TVGOS data. In fact I'm skeptical that it isn't, and if it were me, I would check the time in the 753 menu, and if it is correct look around at some of the other data in these screens, to see if there is any data counts getting updated.

I do know this though, if the DHG doesn't receive VBI data during the G* Test, there is absolutely zero chance that channel will update the TVGOS guide.
No matter how long it sits there tuned to that station. :)
Mark
First, I'm wondering what happens if the G* test is performed on a TVGOS station at a time when no download is being broadcast....

That question aside - with respect to use of the G* test, I've had a generally puzzling experience during the last week, beginning when the SF area Sony and LG3410a units stopped receiving TVGOS downloads...

During the entire 4 days with no downloads on my Sony (and ever since), CBS 5.1, the local digital host, passed the G* test, as did analog 5 (at least for me), but not analog 9 (PBS). Both my Sony and my LG has long had PBS 9 as their host channels. (In passing, when I noticed that analog 5 had vbi packets, I pushed my LG to analog 5 as host - successfully, since it has since received normal nightly downloads and shows 5 as its host channel...)

I left my Sony alone (aside from doing G*tests), turned off overnight as usual, but received NO downloads until Saturday night (when I left the unit on after doing a G* test)...to all appearances (based on the G* test), 5.1 continued to broadcast data during the week, but no one (as far as I know from this thread) had a unit that was actually getting it...So perhaps there was something unexpected or deficient ABOUT the data...and given that it began on the same day that ANOTHER station stopped broadcasting data (i.e., PBS 9), it's either a remarkable coincidence or had to do with what Marcosightless was SENDING them...

As for where the data the Sony has been receiving are coming from, who knows? The download record on my unit shows ZERO downloads since 3/9...despite seemingly normal overnight downloads the last 2 nights, except of course for no host channel...(I'm talking about the multiple page-record that follows the multiple pages of DL schedules...) The LastDLDtart and LastDLEnd both have n/a...

Finally, doesn't the vbi test on any analog channel pass if CC is being broadcast? I've actually been puzzled that right now on the major network analog stations in the SF area, I get vbi only on CBS 5 (at least in the afternoon....I haven't been checking in the evening, when it may be more likely that CC is being broadcast...)

Would be interested to know if anyone still gets the VBI packets from WLTX channel 19 in Columbia, S.C. but the engineer I spoke to knew exactly what I was talking about and he advised they were sending out their digital data but were not supporting the TVGOS. He was adamant about that because I asked him twice. I asked if they were at some point going to support TVGOS and he said no.

Would be interested to know if anyone still gets the VBI packets from WLTX channel 19 in Columbia, S.C. but the engineer I spoke to knew exactly what I was talking about and he advised they were sending out their digital data but were not supporting the TVGOS. He was adamant about that because I asked him twice. I asked if they were at some point going to support TVGOS and he said no.
Although it won't help your situation, because it sounds like the guy you were talking to DID know whether or not they broadcast TVGOS data, you might be amused by my commentary in another thread about my experience talking with engineering at our local PBS station, because I was amused at how little they DID know about their TVGOS broadcasts (other than that they existed!)...http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16051192#post16051192

In the never-ending saga....

A few people have insisted that if you do a brief recording at, say, 12:30 AM on the (presumed) digital host channel, then you'll get your program listings. That didn't work for me, but that could be because I have yet to get a channel lineup.

Dave Kristol

First, I'm wondering what happens if the G* test is performed on a TVGOS station at a time when no download is being broadcast....


Some data is transmitted 24/7. According to this message (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15963759#post15963759) courtesy of bwall23, clock data is sent out 4 times a minute. I know ZipcodePkts come in regularly also. So, there is other data besides Guide data being broadcast all the time.


That question aside - with respect to use of the G* test, I've had a generally puzzling experience during the last week, beginning when the SF area Sony and LG3410a units stopped receiving TVGOS downloads...

During the entire 4 days with no downloads on my Sony (and ever since), CBS 5.1, the local digital host, passed the G* test, as did analog 5 (at least for me), but not analog 9 (PBS). Both my Sony and my LG has long had PBS 9 as their host channels. (In passing, when I noticed that analog 5 had vbi packets, I pushed my LG to analog 5 as host - successfully, since it has since received normal nightly downloads and shows 5 as its host channel...)

I left my Sony alone (aside from doing G*tests), turned off overnight as usual, but received NO downloads until Saturday night (when I left the unit on after doing a G* test)...to all appearances (based on the G* test), 5.1 continued to broadcast data during the week, but no one (as far as I know from this thread) had a unit that was actually getting it...So perhaps there was something unexpected or deficient ABOUT the data...and given that it began on the same day that ANOTHER station stopped broadcasting data (i.e., PBS 9), it's either a remarkable coincidence or had to do with what Marcosightless was SENDING them...


You lost me a little on some of this, but if you are wondering why the Sony didn't find another host channel, first it takes 3 days for the Sony to give up on a host channel, so it will sit there looking stupid ignoring the channel with data, preferring the channel without data. After 3 days I'm not sure what happens (because I never waited that long before trying to intervene). Secondly there is some mystery about what happens on the digital side. My unit with a blank host channel got data for 2 nights, and then locked in on the correct host channel... and that was the end of my downloads. No Listings for the next 2 nights. I'm going to give it one more night, and then reset my user configuration in hopes that it will lose its host channel, since that seems to be the only way my unit will download guide data now.


As for where the data the Sony has been receiving are coming from, who knows? The download record on my unit shows ZERO downloads since 3/9...despite seemingly normal overnight downloads the last 2 nights, except of course for no host channel...(I'm talking about the multiple page-record that follows the multiple pages of DL schedules...) The LastDLDtart and LastDLEnd both have n/a...


I know my LastDLStart, and DLTimer fields showed N/A until my host locked in (LastDLEnd still shows N/A, does that mean the downloads are neverending?). Now they show times, but apparently my Sony has decided not to do anything during those times. :(


Finally, doesn't the vbi test on any analog channel pass if CC is being broadcast? I've actually been puzzled that right now on the major network analog stations in the SF area, I get vbi only on CBS 5 (at least in the afternoon....I haven't been checking in the evening, when it may be more likely that CC is being broadcast...)

I always read that, but I never witnessed it myself.

Mark

Two recorders, both OTA. One has a digital host, the other has an analog host. Both recorders have correct time and full eight days of listings. Sounds more like regional problems with broadcast equipment to me.
Not sure, I've sent an email to the engineer at my local PBS station and they told me to contact TVGOS if I had any problems.

So theres no way to hook these things up to the internet, even with an external adapter box, CAT5 into the adapter box, USB out? I don't know......I know I'm grasping at straws, but these things shouldn't be this hard to operate, its becoming very frustrating.

Thanks

somebody please help im about to sell this thing because all i do is have problems with it. Both of them dont pick up channel listings and display the wrong time. Also both of them do not work at all with the cable card inserted, every channel says no signal. I have 250 hd's and comcast cable

I am going to turn it "off" tonight. Nothing has really change since noon or so. Except counts on most screens have accumlated all day. Clock is still off by 1 hour. and sw verstion is 08.05.40.

I have noticed if the box is accidently turned off, it usually sets most of the accumlator fields back to zero - to get them started again requires the G test.

I dunno..........two peeps have said leave it "on" all night and one has said to turn it "off".

somebody please help im about to sell this thing because all i do is have problems with it. Both of them dont pick up channel listings and display the wrong time. Also both of them do not work at all with the cable card inserted, every channel says no signal. I have 250 hd's and comcast cable

Did you get the Cable Cards from Comcast? I'm not sure on this, but I think Comcast has to program the cards to translate the channels (frequencies) the programming is actually on to the channels that Comcast's channel listing gives.

You did do a channel scan after getting the Cable Cards, didn't you?

Dave Kristol

How did you succeed in getting the one unit to be digital host only since you obviously have an analog host still available? We have similar setups since I also have 2 units, both OTA only, and I cannot make them stop seeing the analog host.



This was done as part of my recovery from a full TVGOS reset testing. In my area I have multiple analog channels with TVGOS data and one digital channel (9.1). I ran into a problem with getting the clock set (we exchanged posts related to this) and decided to complete the procedure and come back to the clock issue at a later time. Here's the sequence of events:
turned recorder off
performed soft (front panel) reset
turned recorder on
performed TVGOS factory reset
performed 2nd TVGOS factory reset
tuned to 9.1
ran G* Test
received 08.05.40 software
ran G* Test
received 08.06.44 software
entered setup information (zip code, etc.)
forced clock set channel to 9.1
waited for clock to get correct time
(here's where the problem occurred - no time zone packets for two days - ran parallel test and discovered I only receive time zone packets from the digital channel with recorder turned off - decided to continue test and address clock later)
forced clock set channel to 13-0 (analog) [I should have left it set to digital]
tuned back to 9.1 (now VBI channel)
entered 963214785 command and waited for info box to clear
turned recorder off and left off overnight
next morning:
1 time zone packet received (presumably from analog channel)
clock had correct time
host channel was 9.1
clock set channel was 9.1
channel lineup downloaded
partial listings for the full 8 days downloaded
later:
full listing for 8 days
last download time matches download from digital schedule

I need to rerun the test using a digital clock channel to confirm that the process works completely digitally, but I wanted to see how long the digital host would stick before I do this. Previously, I have only been able to keep a digital host channel for a few days before the recorder switches to an analog host channel on its own.

Last week I once again put my 500 through test. No problem getting clock and both SW updates. After restarting VBI (and reinputting my setup info for good measure) I left it on for 24 hours hoping for a channel lineup. No luck of course.



You can't get a channel lineup without a host channel and you can't get a channel lineup with the recorder on. The channel lineup comes from the host channel. The recorder downloads from the host channel when it is turned off and from the VBI channel when it is turned on. I have never seen it receive data on the host channel when it is turned on. Others do not agree with this, but this has been my experience.

What is not correct about this? This is exactly what HoustonPerson's problem was. His unit has been a brick for probably a week (and I'm partly to blame because I never suggested that he do a G* Test, because I assumed he already had, until today). His unit basically had never come out of reset mode, and the Power On field indicating N/A proved that.

Mark

The Power On field has nothing to do with HoustonPerson's problem.

Not sure, I've sent an email to the engineer at my local PBS station and they told me to contact TVGOS if I had any problems.

So theres no way to hook these things up to the internet, even with an external adapter box, CAT5 into the adapter box, USB out? I don't know......I know I'm grasping at straws, but these things shouldn't be this hard to operate, its becoming very frustrating.

Thanks

In order to get TVGOS data from the Internet into your recorder, you would need a device that has a network interface card as input and an RF signal as output. It would have to take the TVGOS data it receives from an Internet source and insert it into the correct position of the VBI in the RF signal. When you attach this device to your recorder's antenna-in connection, it would look to the recorder like the data currently being broadcast by your television station. You can't use the USB port for this. It's not connected to a place inside the recorder that would enable it to process TVGOS data.

Have faith, if all goes well the problems that we are experiencing during the transition will go away and the recorders will behave as they did before all of the transition issues interfered with our enjoyment of these machines.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16059505

Yes/Maybe and no.

I'm on Cablevision in the NYC area. Our analog feed came from PBS channel 13. It was also transmitted by Cablevision on the scroll channel 14.

Channel 13 is now failing the VBI test. Cable Channel 2.1 CBS is also failing the VBI test.

OTA Channel 2.1 CBS is passing the test and today gave me almost complete listing.

It seems obvious that Cablevision is stripping the data from the CBS 2.1 feed and converting it to send on analog Channel 14.

There is some difference we are not aware in our units, that for my 250, that converted data is good and usable, but for my two 500 it is somehow deficient.

Another possibility is that Cablevision either hasn't installed digital inserters yet or doesn't have them set up properly. Others have posted that their digital stations have had these types of problems and are currently working through them. I am OTA only so I am blissfully ignorant of what the various cable companies are doing:).

As far as your two 500s go, I'm wondering if they have gotten into a strange state and need to go through a reset procedure. There are a number of posters here who have 500s and I don't recall anyone else posting with a problem similar to yours. Have you done any diagnostic tests or tried any level of reset?

This was done as part of my recovery from a full TVGOS reset testing...
...
forced clock set channel to 9.1
...
forced clock set channel to 13-0 (analog)
...


Sorry, but I must have missed it in the flurry of info - how do you "force" the clock set channel?

Thanks
Jim

Another possibility is that Cablevision either hasn't installed digital inserters yet or doesn't have them set up properly. Others have posted that their digital stations have had these types of problems and are currently working through them. I am OTA only so I am blissfully ignorant of what the various cable companies are doing:).

As far as your two 500s go, I'm wondering if they have gotten into a strange state and need to go through a reset procedure. There are a number of posters here who have 500s and I don't recall anyone else posting with a problem similar to yours. Have you done any diagnostic tests or tried any level of reset?

The local PBS in my area of CT (CPTV) is retaining the TVGOS because the local CBS affiliate isn't CBS owned & operated. An employee of CPTV on the Hartford, CT HD broadcast forum stated that Macrovision/Gemstar just contacted them a few days ago to tell them that they had stopped transmitting analog data on the national level. So, he explained that the local affiliate (CBS or PBS) has to install new digital TVGOS equipment for OTA and cable. Then they need a dedicated DSL connection set-up. Then they have to wait for MV/Gemstar to start sending them the data.

CPTV should have the DSL up any day now. But who knows how long it will be before MV/Gemstar finishes things on their end and begins sending CPTV the data. So, my point is that this could take a while and we will just have to be patient.

FYI, he was also informed by MV/Gemstar that local cable companies can install a device that will take the digital ATSC guide and convert it to VBI for basic tier customers. That doesn't mean they will, just that they can.
Also, supposedly, the DTV PAL converter box can accept digital ATSC OTA data and convert the TVGOS data to VBI for legacy devices hooked up to it.

As I read through some older posts, I see that 'cheneyp' already posted the info I just posted above. Sorry to duplicate, but from the frantic posts I've been reading it sounds like people need to be reminded that many people are working hard on getting the guide data for our DVRs. Be patient! Or...you could flood ebay with super-cheap Sony DVRs that I'll gladly snatch up.

somebody please help im about to sell this thing because all i do is have problems with it. Both of them dont pick up channel listings and display the wrong time. Also both of them do not work at all with the cable card inserted, every channel says no signal. I have 250 hd's and comcast cable

I don't know about Comcast, but with TIme Warner i've yet to find a cable channel with either clock or guide data. I get that data from a UHF antenna. PBS used to provide it but now its CBS HD and Fox 11 analog. Last night, after I reset my 500 unit, I got the clock back within seconds by running the g-test while tuned to CBS HD.

With regard to the cable cards, I suggest you get tech support from Comcast. My 500 unit has a cable card, and I get all the cable channels.

Ray

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16059505


Ok, its simple..........what are you hinting at in your link? I do not see it?

I do know the local PBS station died.

And the local CBS has "absolutely no idea" what they are doing (with or without TV Guide).

Left the unit "on" all night. That basicaly lock it up again; except I could at least turn it on and off; but could not change channels, bring up guide, or anything else. clock never fixed itself either

You may remember when PBS died last week.........the box went semi "crazy" again and would lock up fairly quick (just like it did with the pre transition phase in January). It keep locking up until I eliminated the "scheduled" recordings so we could watch most of what was "recorded"

So last night with what ever ailment previous week; it must have locked up with the zillions of data packets received since it was never turned "off".

Soft boot done this am.............no clock..........unit is un-frozen.......info screen says back to 00.00.00.

I probably should have been a part of the "sit tight" crowd; except the unit did acquire the lock problem from what ever this "pre-transition" crap creates here in Houston.

My wife said last night...................How did we ever watch TV without this thing? We are missing about 80% of our shows, and lose a lot of life due to hours of commercials.

I think you should sit tight and see what happens, I'm having the same problem in Detroit with nothing filling in and no time update, Not getting lockups, Just no data. It does suck having to go back to a crappy VCR at this point to tape my shows.:mad:

The Power On field has nothing to do with HoustonPerson's problem.

The Power On field is an indication that the DHG (or TVGOS more specifically) has not come completely out of reset. Granted, once the field is set it is useless to look at, but after a reset (either performed by the user, or spontaneously), if that field is N/A, then the VBI data will never start getting processed by the DHG, until a G* Test (or some other method that hasn't been determined yet) has been run. The fact that HoustonPerson's unit was a brick for a week, proves this. He runs a G* Test, and his unit shows life again. I don't think I mentioned this before, but I noticed in the first pictures he posted back then that his Power On field was N/A, and thought to myself, he needs to run a G* Test or nothing is going to happen. He was getting so much help and advice at the time that I didn't chime in. Also, his declarations that he had tried everything to get it working again, left me with the assumption he had done this simple test, which IMO should be the first thing anyone attempts before doing any more troubleshooting. Because if you aren't getting packets off your host channel, you aren't going to get anywhere, no matter how many resets you perform. The reset should be an absolute last resort, and should never be performed if there is no VBI data found on any channel. Of course I'm just speaking to the choir now. :)

Mark

Complete the full reset about one hour ago and turned it off. Did this because of the "two" pre transition lockups - this has been the "only" thing to un-lock the unit in this DMA.

I did leave on CBS digital when turned "off".

Clock has come back in one hour; however, it is still exactly 1 hour off. When I did the Full Reset under analogue, it took the clock 4 hours to come back..........but it was correct.

Already know the sw went back to 00.00.00; but I checked and the unit was receiving something........and many screens looked promising.

First G test failed...........second G Test passed. I think this is normal because no mapping had been completed.

As some have said clock could remain wrong until it gets the latest sw (never got there yet) OR our local CBS gets up to par............still have a couple of emails pending there........but they could be completely clueless.

My goal is to leave it off for a long time - have not yet decided how long. I did this on the other Full Reset back in January........and it became 100% perfect again; until PBS died last week.

Please refer to post #14564 above and pictures 6938 thur 6941:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=537711&page=486

Those four pages are the digital download schedule AFAIK?

This first line item on page one has a start time of 07:49 Is that EST or CST?

I will assume it is CST that my box would use for Houston; and not have to go through conversion from EST to CST?

I think my brain is going to explode with all this great information. But my feedback on recent posts:

My cable company also started sending every non-premium channel in clear QAM on or about 3/1/09. I don't have a cable card. I do have an MS Word document showing the 70+ channels and their channel numbers. Using the "Favorites" function has helped too.

You don't get guide updates or ads with the unit off but recording. I used the wrong times for a manual recording, which made day 8 have a no-listing screen. It all filled in after a one hour power off this morning.

Packets are always displayed on my host channel. When TVGOS data is present the packet rate is very fast and the host channel is a valid number. Guessing that the slow rate is V9 or SAP or Closed Caption data the DHD doesn't use, and the packet rate is low. Haven't found a V7 host yet, so my LG is still a high quality VCR. But it does have an indicator that shows when TVGOS data is being received. The LG knows it's TVGOS data, it just doesn't understand it.

An update of the TVGOS version does reset most counters and other information. I had to do that last week. It took three days to recover from a complete wipeout to 100%.

My VCR tapes (from PBS last year) were useless during the rebuild. No packets, no PSIP data, no nothing. I'm now worried what will happen if I lose my analog host since I have no digital host.

Hope this information helps someone.

Quote below from an engineer at our local (Hartford, CT) PBS station. Possible that the same thing has been happening across the country as there seems to be a much higher reported rate of listings failures without stable digital TVGOS feeds:

"CPTV has been informed that Macrovision / GemStar had decided to stop uploading the TV Guide data to their analog encoders after 2/28/2009, because their budget forecast only allowed for that length of time.

Origionally, analog OTA broadcasts were to have ceased on Tuesday February 17, 2009, but the government later extended that date to June 12, 2009.

So in the mean time...No further analog TVGuide updates until...

AT&T is scheduled to install the DSL network for the digital encoder updates on Thursday March 19, 2009. Then it will be up to Macrovision / GemStar to do the rest.

CPTV has been informed that...

"With the correct cable headend equipment, the Gemstar ATSC data can be converted to VBI data and the data would then be available on the basic cable tier. A DTV PAL converter box can also provide the ATSC data>VBI data conversion for Gemstar legacy equipment."

And that...

"Gemstar will definitely work with the cable systems carrying their TV Guide data once the data is available for decoding."

So there is still hope for legacy equipment."

Based on the info provided in this post, I would have to believe that my two HDD500's and my Mits LCD (with TVGOS V-9.x) must have switched over from analog PBS to digital CBS as the host channel, since I still have full listings on all 3 units. I have received listings in the past from my CBS digital channel by doing the G*test. I have not looked in several weeks to see what my current host channel was, but I will look tonight to see if it has changed since that would serve to confirm the info that cheneyp has provided.

IMTheOne - You stated you have one unit on digital host and one on analog host. Is that still the case?

Another possibility is that Cablevision either hasn't installed digital inserters yet or doesn't have them set up properly.

As far as your two 500s go, I'm wondering if they have gotten into a strange state and need to go through a reset procedure. There are a number of posters here who have 500s and I don't recall anyone else posting with a problem similar to yours. Have you done any diagnostic tests or tried any level of reset?


On the first possibility, it doesn't explain why the 250 is getting data from Cablevision on that same Channel 14 perfectly.

I did a front panel reset on both 500.

As I mentioned yesterday. On one of the 500, I attempted a digital download OTA and it worked. So it's not the state of my 500's, it's what Cablevision and/or TVGOS are transmitting.

Further proof is found here:

In a post that has nothing to do with our SONY's, but just with the TVGOS from Cablevision, comes this post:

Downloaded TV guide seems not to be working

"Has anyone else noticed that the TV Guide (not the cable box guide, the one downloaded by the TV) seems not to be working? It's not working on 2 TV's with this feature. I had this problem once before. It's supposed to come down, I believe, on Channel 13 or 14. But it seems not to be working. Anyone else who has a TV that can receive the Guide notice this? When it is received, it seems to be incomplete. I don't know if Cablevision just doesn't care or if its temporary.

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22073677-Downloaded-TV-guide-seems-not-to-be-working

The Big Question remains. Whatever is happening - at least in the Cablevision area- is effecting my 500's, it's effecting other people's TV, why is it not effecting my 250?

The local PBS in my area of CT (CPTV) is retaining the TVGOS because the local CBS affiliate isn't CBS owned & operated. An employee of CPTV on the Hartford, CT HD broadcast forum stated that Macrovision/Gemstar just contacted them a few days ago to tell them that they had stopped transmitting analog data on the national level. So, he explained that the local affiliate (CBS or PBS) has to install new digital TVGOS equipment for OTA and cable. Then they need a dedicated DSL connection set-up. Then they have to wait for MV/Gemstar to start sending them the data.

CPTV should have the DSL up any day now. But who knows how long it will be before MV/Gemstar finishes things on their end and begins sending CPTV the data. So, my point is that this could take a while and we will just have to be patient.

FYI, he was also informed by MV/Gemstar that local cable companies can install a device that will take the digital ATSC guide and convert it to VBI for basic tier customers. That doesn't mean they will, just that they can.
Also, supposedly, the DTV PAL converter box can accept digital ATSC OTA data and convert the TVGOS data to VBI for legacy devices hooked up to it.
How nice of them to turn the analog signal off nationwide before the digital signals were ready nationwide. What knucklehead was in charge of that? :rolleyes:

Good thing I still have clock data, I guess I'll have to set up some manual recordings then.

This is incorrect. We are still getting Onscreen data today from Fox 23 analog in Tulsa and our local PBS still doesn't have the digital onscreen up yet. They were supposed to have that up by last week, so I guess they are still having problems integrating the Onscreen equipment with theirs.

But for a couple 3 outages on the past 3-4 weeks - also still getting guide data in Phoenix via analog PBS KAET 8 (I assume this since KPHO CBS 5 will NOT be the host channel for digital TVGOS).

Gonna be up to Macrovision to sign an agreement with some other PHX station to provide digital TVGOS. Hopefully us TVGOS customers won't be 'Twistin' in the Wind'...

The Power On field is an indication that the DHG (or TVGOS more specifically) has not come completely out of reset. Granted, once the field is set it is useless to look at, but after a reset (either performed by the user, or spontaneously), if that field is N/A, then the VBI data will never start getting processed by the DHG, until a G* Test (or some other method that hasn't been determined yet) has been run. The fact that HoustonPerson's unit was a brick for a week, proves this.
Mark

Your logic is faulty. This is not the first time that you have taken two completely unrelated things and claimed one is dependent upon the other. The Power On field is set to N/A during a reset. This is one of many indications that the recorder has completed the reset. The recorder can and does receive TVGOS data while the Power On field is set to this value. If you doubt this, do a reset, then turn your recorder off and leave it off overnight without running a G* Test. The fact that HoustonPerson's unit was a brick for a week in no way proves any of your statements. I hope that you are not offended, because I have no doubt that you mean well and are trying to be helpful, but I am wasting my time debating with you about how the recorders work.:cool:

Aside from the actual problems HoustonPerson is experiencing, one additional problem is that he is trying to apply the advice of several people and things that one person is telling him to do may interfere with things that another is telling him. The sequence of actions taken during a recovery is important and can cause or prevent additional problems.

IMTheOne - You stated you have one unit on digital host and one on analog host. Is that still the case?

Yes, I've been waiting to see how long the digial host will stick before continuing with my testing. The first time I forced a digital host channel I used a modified version of Frank70's procedure, but the recorder reverted to an analog host after a few days. It looks like the PBS stations in my area may have stopped carrying TVGOS data (I need to run some G* Tests again to verify that this isn't temporary). To the best of my knowledge, that will leave only one analog source if this is permanent. At this point I am about to pass my previous record for length of time with a digital host. Also, the recorder seems to be downloading from the digital host channel when turned off overnight.

Ok, yesterday was futile. Today may be the same?

Did Full Factory Reset early this morning (unit locked up etc) see previous post for actions taken, testing, etc.

Turned unit “off” after that, and notice clock came back in about an hour; but was off exactly one hour (just like yesterday). This would imply that with the unit off it still got from 00.00.00 to 08.05.40; but that was not confirmed. I left it off to see if it would get correct time within the 4 hours. It did not; it was still off by 1 hour.

In attempting to read the digital download schedule it appeared I had the opportunity to “peak” between 10:45AM and 10:55AM so that is what I did, these are the observations:

1. Clock still wrong by exactly one hour
2. Power ON was NA of course; but after G Test it had a date-I don’t think that is important to me?
3. First G Test “failed”, second and subsequent “pass”
4. Look at all screens sw is now 08.05.40 – various data coming in on various screens some the same as yesterday some of it different……..nothing outstanding that I could see.

I left the unit on digital 11-1 local CBS and turned it “off” at 10:54AM should have been two minutes to spare HA!

Assumptions on my part:

I think TV Guide On Screen Houston will not work until the unit gets passed 08.05.40. I do not think that will happen until the clock is correct. Since the unit got to 08.05.40 and a clock at just 1 hour “off” within an hour of being turned “off” – it should be able to fix itself with correct time within 4 hours and certainly 24 hours. I do not think that is going to happen because I do not think CBS local is sending out the correct stuff with the correct time, to make it function correctly.

In other words, I think it is dead until Macrovision and/or the local CBS fix it.

I think TV Guide On Screen Houston will not work until the unit gets passed 08.05.40. I do not think that will happen until the clock is correct.

I think you need 08.06.44 first then your clock will correct itself.

On the first possibility, it doesn't explain why the 250 is getting data from Cablevision on that same Channel 14 perfectly.


Silly me. Clearly it was too late at night when I responded and my brain was asleep.:o

On one of the 500, I attempted a digital download OTA and it worked. So it's not the state of my 500's, it's what Cablevision and/or TVGOS are transmitting.



This is truly puzzling, especially that your 250 isn't affected. I can't think of any reason that a 250 would behave differently than a 500 with respect to TVGOS data. I'm sure that you've already checked that all of the recorders are on version 08.06.44 of the TVGOS software. And I know that the firmware version differences are only supposed to affect HDMI compatibility with certain displays, but it wouldn't hurt to see if they are the same or different versions. I don't have cable so I can't run any tests to try to help out.

And I know that the firmware version differences are only supposed to affect HDMI compatibility with certain displays, but it wouldn't hurt to see if they are the same or different versions.

I wrote previously that they are different. The only obvious difference between the units, other then the size of the hard drive of course.

The version on the 250 is .06
On both 500's, it's .05

I wrote previously that they are different. The only obvious difference between the units, other then the size of the hard drive of course.

The version on the 250 is .06
On both 500's, it's .05

Your 250 has newer firmware and it is the only one of your 3 units that is currently working?

I would upgrade one of your 500's to the .13 firmware and see what happens...............

This might be a strange question- if I can even articulate it properly.

It always seemed to me -since the ads showed up a couple of years ago- that when I clicked on TV Guide or the Recording screen, if I saw ads, it meant a successful data download. If I saw ads and moved to the 8th day, it was always filled.

Yesterday, I connected an antenna and downloaded OTA the almost complete listings that I was not able to get from Cablevision. As I mentioned previously, although I had listings, I had no ads.

Over night I removed the antenna, ran the G-test on cable channel 14 (passed) and shut down the machine.

So I turn on the Sony this morning and I'm greeted by ads. I think that a happy development- presumingly meaning it downloaded data.

No such luck. The eighth day is missing.

Could yesterday's OTA download have stored ads to show today and further out even though they were not visible yesterday.

Or more plainly. Is the appearance of ads NOT proof of a successful data download.

Also: If just a random occurrence, or because of the download yesterday from a source that is not my Host channel, I had a freeze (in one instance) of playing while recording. It caused a spontaneous reboot. Did a G-test to get the clock back to correct time immediately [the test is on the same channel 14 that is not downloading the data properly for the 500's].

Your 250 has newer firmware and it is the only one of your 3 units that is currently working?

I would upgrade one of your 500's to the .13 firmware and see what happens...............

I know. I've been thinking about doing just that.

The only thing is that the units are usable and I am very weary of doing anything that might change that status.

With so many having issues with TVGOS, maybe the prudent decision is not to do anything for a while and see if the vendors fix what's wrong.

The only thing is that the units are usable and I am very weary of doing anything that might change that status.


I've update the firmware in both of mine. The first one (that I bought new) came with .05 firmware, and I updated it quite a while back. The second one I bought used from someone here a few months ago. It had old firmware when it arrived, and I updated it after I had it a few days. I actually have a third 500 in shipment to me now, again purchased from someone here on the forum. If it doesn't have .13 firmware, I'm sure I will update it quickly.

The update procedure is really simple, and no recordings or other settings are lost in the process.............

Well, I'm still without a channel linup, but overnight my received zipcode packets went from 700+ to 1400+. Thus, with correct time and TVGOS advertisements coming through, I figure I'm setup correctly. It is just a matter of waiting for TV Guide to send my zipcode with the channel lineup choices.

I gave in yesterday and made a schedule of manual recordings.

I should have programmed manual recordings as soon as I achieved correct clock time some days ago.

I've update the firmware in both of mine.

I update firmware when necessary. On these DVR's the assumption has always been that it really made no difference.

The problem doing it now is that as the freeze evidenced last night I have no way of knowing if and how the bad data and other download may have effected the units.

I don't want to possibly turn it into a brick.

I don't think I will do anything until the data is fixed by TVGOS/Cablevision or I know definitely that this status is permanent.

I am only posting my experiences in case it helps anyone smarter and more knowledgeable then me concerning these issues get some idea that may help us all.

I was wondering if many people people still use their DHG with a cable card? I have TWC, use a cable card with the system and have found that I can't get most of the new HD channels since they use the switched video. And as I see other people posting, I am now having issues with the time not being accurate, I think I lost my host channel. I am thinking it sadly maybe time to retire the old Sony and get a HD DVR from TWC as much as a I dread it. But I want to get all my HD channels!

Could yesterday's OTA download have stored ads to show today and further out even though they were not visible yesterday.



Absolutely yes. There is a section in the 753... screens that have an ad schedule. Most of it is in hex values that probably describe where to place the ad, but the start date for the ad and the length of time to display it are readable. Whenever I've looked at it I see current day and next day in the date column.

I update firmware when necessary. On these DVR's the assumption has always been that it really made no difference.

The problem doing it now is that as the freeze evidenced last night I have no way of knowing if and how the bad data and other download may have effected the units.

I don't want to possibly turn it into a brick.

I don't think I will do anything until the data is fixed by TVGOS/Cablevision or I know definitely that this status is permanent.

I am only posting my experiences in case it helps anyone smarter and more knowledgeable then me concerning these issues get some idea that may help us all.

Generally, I leave it alone when its not broken. But I thought that you had indicated that all three of your DHG's were hooked up to the same signal source, and one of them was getting listings while the other two were not. And since the one that was getting listings had newer firmware . . .

Generally, I leave it alone when its not broken. But I thought that you had indicated that all three of your DHG's were hooked up to the same signal source, and one of them was getting listings while the other two were not. And since the one that was getting listings had newer firmware . . .


Not getting listings but the grid is still available and the clock is correct- which makes manual recording possible.

As long as it stays at least at that level, I'll curse under my breath, maybe occasionally do what I did yesterday and attempt to fill the grid OTA, even as I wonder if that is screwing up something too which caused the freeze last evening, and wait a while doing nothing else hoping for this to be resolved in the near future- or not.

Plenty of time to start experimenting, maybe in a couple of months when shows go into reruns.

By doing the G* test, leave it on routine, I am getting my lineup partially to fill. The most obvious missing are the HD major networks. I get the program listing for the non-HD channel, just not the 702,705,707, etc (comcast)

Cw

Well, I'm still without a channel linup, but overnight my received zipcode packets went from 700+ to 1400+. Thus, with correct time and TVGOS advertisements coming through, I figure I'm setup correctly. It is just a matter of waiting for TV Guide to send my zipcode with the channel lineup choices.

I gave in yesterday and made a schedule of manual recordings.

I should have programmed manual recordings as soon as I achieved correct clock time some days ago.

I have three of these and only one has the right time. Manual recordings are pretty easy (at least as easy as a VCR) if you have the right time set. But I have one that is 23 minutes off and another one that is 5 hours and 8 minutes off and I'm constantly screwing up setting recordings on those two as I mentally calculate how early/late to set recordings .....

Not getting listings but the grid is still available and the clock is correct- which makes manual recording possible.

As long as it stays at least at that level, I'll curse under my breath, maybe occasionally do what I did yesterday and attempt to fill the grid OTA, even as I wonder if that is screwing up something too which caused the freeze last evening, and wait a while doing nothing else hoping for this to be resolved in the near future- or not.

Plenty of time to start experimenting, maybe in a couple of months when shows go into reruns.

Realizing that you don't want to do anything that might compromise your ability to use the recorder in its current state, you could try rescanning the channels and re-entering the Zip Code information. I don't have any rational explanation why this might help, but it shouldn't hurt anything or do anything to prevent you from using the recorders. Normally I would suggest doing a soft reset beforehand, but recently the soft resets seem to set the software back to the default version (I don't remember them as always doing that before). Another hypothesis that you don't want to test is that your TVGOS software has somehow gotten corrupted in the 500s and needs to be reloaded. Doing this will affect your clock. Just some random thoughts.

Ok, yesterday was futile. Today may be the same?

Assumptions on my part:

I think TV Guide On Screen Houston will not work until the unit gets passed 08.05.40. I do not think that will happen until the clock is correct. Since the unit got to 08.05.40 and a clock at just 1 hour “off” within an hour of being turned “off” – it should be able to fix itself with correct time within 4 hours and certainly 24 hours. I do not think that is going to happen because I do not think CBS local is sending out the correct stuff with the correct time, to make it function correctly.

In other words, I think it is dead until Macrovision and/or the local CBS fix it.

When my unit locked up and I did a reset(warm) it took several days of leaving it off before the correct software and time came back. I too kept messing with it in the first day or two and it never updated. So I left it alone yesterday--off all day and overnight. I happen to get up around 1:31 this morning and saw that the unit had the correct time. This morning about 9:00 I checked the software version and it was correct, but noticed that day 8 had some listings missing. Sure that it will correct itself, just have to be patience.
Michael

Ok, after a few days of chat box, email, and today's phone calls - I may have made some real progress - tho the box is still not working. HA!

In order for the box to work correctly it does have to have the correct time.......it will not get the correct time (or unlikely) on version 08.05.40........but it cannot make itself go to the correct time so that it can continue updating with a digital host (unlike it did before with an analogue host).

After getting through first two lines of telephone support with Sony.........the first two levels said the box will never work with a digital host.

Finally spoke with a product specialist (he could read script better in English so that makes him a specialist). Anyway, seriously; we got down to Houston specific problems.........he said that time element is controled by Macrovision and not the local CBS - the local station are not to be modifying that TV GUIDE data stuff.

He said both Sony and Macrovison are aware of the problem, and that Sony is working on a solution. They do not know when. They should send me a email AND that solution should be on their support page for the DHGHDD500.

That is what the Sony man said.

So we shall see.
--------------------------------------------------

I suggest everyone call Sony 1-800-222-7669 (this is considered a television video product). Get pass at least the first tier support.........and ask for a "product specialist". Be specific to your city.

See what kind of response you get.

When my unit locked up and I did a reset(warm) it took several days of leaving it off before the correct software and time came back. I too kept messing with it in the first day or two and it never updated. So I left it alone yesterday--off all day and overnight. I happen to get up around 1:31 this morning and saw that the unit had the correct time. This morning about 9:00 I checked the software version and it was correct, but noticed that day 8 had some listings missing. Sure that it will correct itself, just have to be patience.
Michael

yes there may be a lot of truth in all of that too...........my plans are to leave it off for a few days.........it may wake up.

On Sunday, there was a two hour power outage here in Shoreline, just north of Seattle. One of my DHGs recovered nicely. A second DHG lost its TVGOS firmware, but fairly quickly got to 08.05.40, which currently lands one in DST limbo with a one hour offset. Last night I ran the G* test and left it *ON*. I was trying to wait for the clock to correct itself, but couldn't resist peeking at the 753159852 info and was pleasantly surprised to find the TVGOS firmware listed as 08.06.44.

I'm not clear on what excursions (other than the obvious two, power off and channel changing) will cause the G* test to stop running, so to be safe I restarted the G* test and found the on screen clock corrected, while the front panel clock was still an hour behind. Within seconds of starting the test, however, the front panel clock updated to match the on screen clock.

So did restarting the G* test nudge things along, or was this just coincidence?

ps box #3 is en-route to Mt. Pleasant after having fallen into a deep dark INF 0000080 hole. I learned from the drill the phone tech ran me through that there is apparently a "magic window" of about 60 seconds power unplugged time that will attempt to run an HDD format, on the way back up, but even that did not help.

Well,
I just did a full factory Default reset on mine and will let it sit now and see what happens. I am hearing people in Detroit are getting the listings so I'm betting on something not being set right in my 500, So back to scratch and we will wait and see.

I was wondering if many people people still use their DHG with a cable card?

I use my SONY with cable card and receive my entire channel line-up. I also have a 2 tuner HD cable DVR. It is made by PACE and has to be rebooted every other day if I want to access VOD. Every time it reboots, it comes up with no guide information (all guide and channel information is stored in RAM). The M-Card in the PACE also lockups when recording channels that have marco-blocking issues. This cable card lockup will not let analog or any DVR play back work until the box is rebooted. The SONY's cable card has never locked up.

The SONY is rock solid and the PACE needs to be rebooted weekly.

If the SONY had two tuners and external storage expansion, it would be my only DVR.

I hope my cable company doesn't deploy SDV.

Just When You Thought It Was Safe ...
................. I have not experimented with the hidden Reset, Commit, Save, and Restore Flash Memory commands or the Commit All Data command, but if they allow access to the TVGOS software, we may be able to do this ourselves. Has anyone been brave enough to fool around with these commands? If so, what have you found out about the data they can access?


HoustonPerson -

Can you please ask your contact at Sony about these functions? If these can be used to flash the newer version of TVGOS software into the DHG's, then many of the recovery steps can be eliminated. Of course, this would only be of benefit to those of us who currently have working TVGOS software that is updating it's listings daily.

In order for the box to work correctly it does have to have the correct time.......it will not get the correct time (or unlikely) on version 08.05.40........but it cannot make itself go to the correct time so that it can continue updating with a digital host (unlike it did before with an analogue host).



If that info came from Sony then they don't know how it works! :eek:

Even with a strictly analog recovery, you get correct time at ver. 08.05.40. On a solely digital recovery, I had correct time, then 08.05.40, then 08.06.44.

I have three of these and only one has the right time. Manual recordings are pretty easy (at least as easy as a VCR) if you have the right time set. But I have one that is 23 minutes off and another one that is 5 hours and 8 minutes off and I'm constantly screwing up setting recordings on those two as I mentally calculate how early/late to set recordings .....
I'm not sure if my process would help your clock problem, but I began with G* test to the digital TVGOS station getting me time an hour off. I did a G*-and-leave-on to the same station overnight with the auto-off feature disabled. This got me a software update. After the software update another G* test to the digital station with VBI gave me the correct time.

I had left a brief polite message on their 800 number voicemail some days ago. I did not tell them my phone number, but their voicemail must record the caller's ANI. I missed the return call today, but the man from TV Guide left a message with my ticket number and asked for my email, so I could advise him of my status. He mentioned something to the effect that they now think channel 5.1 in the San Francisco bay area should be operational.

I'll try not say anything stupid as I tell him about my missing channel line-up.

I'm not sure if my process would help your clock problem, but I began with G* test to the digital TVGOS station getting me time an hour off. I did a G*-and-leave-on to the same station overnight with the auto-off feature disabled. This got me a software update. After the software update another G* test to the digital station with VBI gave me the correct time.

I don't even have a local station transmitting analog let alone digital TVGOS data yet so I can't even get the software updates....

On Sunday, there was a two hour power outage here in Shoreline, just north of Seattle. One of my DHGs recovered nicely. A second DHG lost its TVGOS firmware, but fairly quickly got to 08.05.40, which currently lands one in DST limbo with a one hour offset. Last night I ran the G* test and left it *ON*. I was trying to wait for the clock to correct itself, but couldn't resist peeking at the 753159852 info and was pleasantly surprised to find the TVGOS firmware listed as 08.06.44.

Subako, what channel did you run the G* test on? What host channel is 753... info showing? I'm just curious if your DHG(s) recovered from base firmware with only CBS digital host available (Kiro). I am also in the Seattle area and found that PBS analog (KCTS9) is no longer passing VBI which seems to be the case for analog PBS nationwide.

Just check the box. Turned it on for a "look see"

sw is now 08.06.44
and box finally has correct time (first just the Guide screens with correct time..........then the front panel got correct time while playing around.....)

Will continue to leave it "off" - it seems to do mo better that way.

So from about 6AM to 3:30pm: Went from full factory reset to correct time and 08.06.44

It is "off" now, will not turn "on" till tomorrow. Maybe a grid with a Day 8 in the morning?

HoustonPerson -

Can you please ask your contact at Sony about these functions? If these can be used to flash the newer version of TVGOS software into the DHG's, then many of the recovery steps can be eliminated. Of course, this would only be of benefit to those of us who currently have working TVGOS software that is updating it's listings daily.


I do not have a contact.........you just have to force yourself thru on the phone and ask for "product specialist"

If that info came from Sony then they don't know how it works! :eek:

Even with a strictly analog recovery, you get correct time at ver. 08.05.40. On a solely digital recovery, I had correct time, then 08.05.40, then 08.06.44.


I did not explain myself good on this.......did not really come from Sony, that part came from me. I was trying to say the clock and the sw version were circular. Which came first the chicken or the egg.

Anyway mine finally updated the clock and sw, I do know which was first. The unit was "off" when that occured sometime over the last 4 hours.

I think full factory reset is the key to getting back and working again, I just got done doing one as well and for the first time the Time updated while I was doing a G code test on my CBS digital station. While it is an hour off because of the software version I think we are on the right track now, Either that or TVGuide just fixed their problems today and we are finally seeing it work correctly again.

Quote below from an engineer at our local (Hartford, CT) PBS station. Possible that the same thing has been happening across the country as there seems to be a much higher reported rate of listings failures without stable digital TVGOS feeds:

"CPTV has been informed that Macrovision / GemStar had decided to stop uploading the TV Guide data to their analog encoders after 2/28/2009, because their budget forecast only allowed for that length of time.

They're still uploading analog data to the UNC-TV stations in North Carolina. My OTA host channel is analog WUNF (ch 33) in Asheville NC, and I have a full eight days of listings, i.e. through next Tuesday.

Beginning a week ago, a lot of us from the SF area who started experiencing problems on Tuesday started posting what we were doing and what was happening...mostly people who had been posting fairly freequently before, and therefore were already tracking our units' for potential problems...

I wonder if there are others who weren't so actively tracking their units' behavior, and who either did NOT experience such problems OR who saw that downloads were not appearing, but just left your units untouched.....?

If so, did your units recover over the weekend to resume getting downloads without your having intervened???

and/or

Were your units previously receiving downloads from analog PBS, in which case what happened in terms of host channel change? or were they set up to get regular downloads from CBS 5.1? or from other channels (e.g., CBS 5 analog...which happens to be where my LG 3410a has been telling me it's getting data for the last week, unlike my Sony, which has had its host channel blank since last Tuesday, like other SF area people who have posted in the last week...)

Because of the details we have (and don't have) about this past week's episode in the SF area, I thought it would be useful to inquire whether others around SF had DIFFERENT experiences than those who posted about losing regular TVGOS downloads for 4 or 5 days...

Thanks - Tony

(PS...if you respond, it would be helpful if you would specify whether you get your TVGOS listings from OTA or from cable...)

Subako, what channel did you run the G* test on?
My DHGs are set for OTA and cable. I ran the G* test on KIRO 7-1 OTA.
What host channel is 753... info showing?

The 753... info shows host channel blank.

Zip Code 98155
Host State 0xA0
Host ID 0xD
Host Chan
VBI Chan fffffffd

I'm just curious if your DHG(s) recovered from base firmware with only CBS digital host available (Kiro). I am also in the Seattle area and found that PBS analog (KCTS9) is no longer passing VBI which seems to be the case for analog PBS nationwide.

I'm pretty sure the firmware update was all digital from KIRO7-1. Whether there was some analog assist is not totally clear because although my analog cable only RDRs have had NO listings for some time now, their clocks are *NOT* drifting. I do not know where they are getting their clock updates, because I, like you, see no VBI info from KCTS9 analog (Comcast cable channel 90).

They're still uploading analog data to the UNC-TV stations in North Carolina. My OTA host channel is analog WUNF (ch 33) in Asheville NC, and I have a full eight days of listings, i.e. through next Tuesday.

That may be the case, or, your local PBS channel may have bought the equipment to generate VBI from the digital feed. I was just repeating what I heard from someone that works at my local PBS.

Your logic is faulty.
Ok :p


The recorder can and does receive TVGOS data while the Power On field is set to this value. If you doubt this, do a reset, then turn your recorder off and leave it off overnight without running a G* Test. The fact that HoustonPerson's unit was a brick for a week in no way proves any of your statements.


This is how I stumbled onto this phenomenon, I did that very thing, and in the morning it hadn't done anything. Then I ran a G* Test and of course it passed. As I was looking in the 753 menu I noticed the Power On field had a date and time that was about two minutes old (remember I had reset the unit the night before). The next time I reset the unit (about a week later), I went into the 753 menu, and had no VBI packets updating. I went and looked at the Power On field and it was N/A. I ran the G* Test, and the packets started coming in, and the Power On field indicated the current time. So my conclusion is that when someone says my unit isn't working, and I see this picture (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=136472&d=1236880966), I would tell them to run a G* Test. I realize my unit isn't behaving exactly as it should, and my VBI data hanging on reset (and having to run a G* Test to get it going again) could be a sign of that. This could also explain why your unit gets data when Power On is N/A and mine doesn't.


I hope that you are not offended, because I have no doubt that you mean well and are trying to be helpful, but I am wasting my time debating with you about how the recorders work.:cool:


The only time I take offense, is when you quote one of my posts, and then respond with nothing but "That is incorrect", or "No". It would help if you would explain what it is wrong with it, and maybe other people (apparently I can't ;)) will learn from it.


Aside from the actual problems HoustonPerson is experiencing, one additional problem is that he is trying to apply the advice of several people and things that one person is telling him to do may interfere with things that another is telling him. The sequence of actions taken during a recovery is important and can cause or prevent additional problems.

I didn't feel that any of the advice he was getting yesterday was contradictory. In fact, when I saw your responses (and Possumgirl's for that matter), I was glad to see that you were giving him the same advice that I had.

Mark

I was wondering if many people people still use their DHG with a cable card? I have TWC, use a cable card with the system and have found that I can't get most of the new HD channels since they use the switched video. And as I see other people posting, I am now having issues with the time not being accurate, I think I lost my host channel. I am thinking it sadly maybe time to retire the old Sony and get a HD DVR from TWC as much as a I dread it. But I want to get all my HD channels!

I have TWC and a cable card in my 500 unit. That unit receives all the free HD channels including ABC Family, TNT, and all the major network channels. My 250 unit doesn't have a card and it receives all the major network channels in HD, except at channel numbers like 75.485.
Ray

FWIW:
2 500's - OTA only-S.V. 1.2.13 on both (For those that care)
Last Friday
1st machine G*test was run with channel showing 2-1 and 963214785 run and unit left on over night. next day host and clock set showed 2-1.
Currently showing no host and 3-0 as clock set. All listing and correct clock.

Last Friday
2nd machine G*test was run same as first and left on. Next day no host showed, clock set was 2-1, listing and clock OK.
I then tried to do the G*test again and aaaagh, I hit the dreaded "Reset to Factory Default".
I tried getting the clock using 2-1 but never did.
I gave up on digital and set to 0-2 and off over night. Got the clock back next day.
By the way, I never lost ads or the 44 sw.
Tried another G*test and aaaaagh again, hit "Reset to Factory default".
(Should never use the wheeled select button after drinking beer!)
Now the second machine will not get time no matter what.
Did a soft reset and lost the 44 sw.
It also appears that 0-11 and 0-2 have stop sending data here, no VBI from either after many tries.
Good VBI data from both 2-1 and 3-1.
I left on 3-1 and turn off over night and got nothing.
will try 2-1 tonight and see tomorrow.
One odd thing I noticed, the machine thats working shows 2.1 WBBMDT on the front screen but the other shows 2.1 CBS2 Ch?
So much for periods of being brain dead!
I guess I'll have to try and recover in a totally digital world...

Last night I left both my 250 and 500 units on all night, tuned to CBS HD, until a few minutes ago. The 250 has guide data through next Tuesday. It also has ads:it has firmware version .05. The 500 unit has guide data through next Monday. Tuesday is blank. Also, no ads; it has firmware version .06. Conclusion: the old firmware is better.

By the way, yesterday I happened to notice the manufacturing dates, May and June 2005. I wonder what is the last manufacturing date?

Ray

Users with the clock only an hour behind are lucky. I'm on Comcast in Northern New Jersey and the clock has been behind by seven and a half hours since yesterday despite my soft(front buttons) and hard(unplugging unit) resets. Forcing to digital WCBS doesn't solve clock problem. Listings are for full 8 days,so data is coming but clock info is incorrect.

Update: G* corrected time problem.

My DVR is not the exact same unit most of you are tracking in this thread. My unit does not have an ATSC tuner within. I watch ATSC OTA via several tuners and converters. I do use the on-screen guide, but usually set recordings manually. I am in the Sacramento, CA DMA.

Up until the DST change on 3/8/09 all was working great. On Monday 3/9/09 I noticed that all recordings went long, one by more than 2 hours. It did the same on Tuesday. On Tuesday I still had Guide data, but I didn't check for more than the current day.

As of sometime THUR 3/12/09 when I turn on the unit it defaults to a screen that displays "no guide data". I went through a setup and reselected my DMA, which at that time was listed. 24 hours later, still no data. Now the selection for the DMA is not there.

On FRI I performed a cold power up and another setup. That stopped the bad behavior it had from the time change, but now 4 days later still no guide data. My post in a local thread led me here. I have no issues with firmware or software updates. The only real problem now is the lack of data.

Users with the clock only an hour behind are lucky. I'm on Comcast in Northern New Jersey and the clock has been behind by seven and a half hours since yesterday despite my soft(front buttons) and hard(unplugging unit) resets. Forcing to digital WCBS doesn't solve clock problem. Listings are for full 8 days,so data is coming but clock info is incorrect.

You and I are probably on the same Comcast network (Union). I have had little problem getting a good clock, but I have been unable to get channel lineup or program listings. I wonder why our results are so different!

Dave Kristol

Lets give Sony credit for being able to design and manufacture a product that -when not working right- screws us each in our own unique different way.

You and I are probably on the same Comcast network (Union). I have had little problem getting a good clock, but I have been unable to get channel lineup or program listings. I wonder why our results are so different!

Dave Kristol

Have you tried forcing host channel with digital WCBS? I lost listing two weeks ago but the forcing gave me the listings.

Up until the DST change on 3/8/09 all was working great. On Monday 3/9/09 I noticed that all recordings went long, one by more than 2 hours. It did the same on Tuesday. On Tuesday I still had Guide data, but I didn't check for more than the current day.

As of sometime THUR 3/12/09 when I turn on the unit it defaults to a screen that displays "no guide data". I went through a setup and reselected my DMA, which at that time was listed. 24 hours later, still no data. Now the selection for the DMA is not there.As noted in this and other threads, TVGOS is no longer available via analog off-air broadcasts in most markets.

For the most part, the only people getting TVGOS now are those with devices that (a) incorporate an ATSC tuner, or (b) are connected to a cable provider (like Comcast) that is converting the digital version of TVGOS to analog VBI. A few broadcasters may be doing this too, but that appears to be the exception, not the rule.

You and I are probably on the same Comcast network (Union). I have had little problem getting a good clock, but I have been unable to get channel lineup or program listings. I wonder why our results are so different!

Dave Kristol

Dave,

About a week ago, there was a discussion on here about ZipcodePkts, and TimezonePkts. Originally I thought you said you were getting ZipcodePkts, but no TimezonePkts, but then later you indicated that you weren't getting either. The reason I ask is, if you are getting ZipcodePkts, but not TimezonePkts, have you considered trying to change your zipcode to another one in your area? Maybe your zipcode isn't in the list of zipcodes that TVGOS is sending out. I don't know how that could happen though.

Mark

Beginning a week ago, a lot of us from the SF area who started experiencing problems on Tuesday started posting what we were doing and what was happening...mostly people who had been posting fairly freequently before, and therefore were already tracking our units' for potential problems...

I wonder if there are others who weren't so actively tracking their units' behavior, and who either did NOT experience such problems OR who saw that downloads were not appearing, but just left your units untouched.....?

If so, did your units recover over the weekend to resume getting downloads without your having intervened???

and/or

Were your units previously receiving downloads from analog PBS, in which case what happened in terms of host channel change? or were they set up to get regular downloads from CBS 5.1? or from other channels (e.g., CBS 5 analog...which happens to be where my LG 3410a has been telling me it's getting data for the last week, unlike my Sony, which has had its host channel blank since last Tuesday, like other SF area people who have posted in the last week...)

Because of the details we have (and don't have) about this past week's episode in the SF area, I thought it would be useful to inquire whether others around SF had DIFFERENT experiences than those who posted about losing regular TVGOS downloads for 4 or 5 days...

Thanks - Tony

(PS...if you respond, it would be helpful if you would specify whether you get your TVGOS listings from OTA or from cable...)

I'm in SF Bay Area. My unit is 51min slow. I noticed this over the weekend, but didn't do anything. I still had listings until today. I thought the time would self correct. It didn't as of yesterday, so I unplugged the unit for 1min to see if that would help.

Today, clock is still off and now no listings. Was getting listings off of PBS OTA. Will try to switch to 5.1 tonight after reading how to do this.

Dave,

About a week ago, there was a discussion on here about ZipcodePkts, and TimezonePkts. Originally I thought you said you were getting ZipcodePkts, but no TimezonePkts, but then later you indicated that you weren't getting either. The reason I ask is, if you are getting ZipcodePkts, but not TimezonePkts, have you considered trying to change your zipcode to another one in your area? Maybe your zipcode isn't in the list of zipcodes that TVGOS is sending out. I don't know how that could happen though.

Yeah, and I probably got them confused. I have gotten a bunch of ZipCodePkts but only one TimeZonePkt. I did try changing my Zip Code to that of a nearby town, to no avail. I would perhaps have to change it to a Zip Code that isn't served by my particular Comcast office. I guess that might be worth a try.

What's the consensus on what a TimeZonePkt is for?

Dave Kristol

Like Cubit100, I had left messages at TVGOS. I got my call back today and I talked with the tech for about 25 min. about the Sony. KPIX in S.F. did have an outage last Tues. It was fixed and back to "normal" on Friday. He is familiar with the Sony recorder and said Sony has "refused to respond to them (TVGOS) regarding HDD DHG250/500". The Sony is not supported or certified to work with the digital signal. He said that anything I'm receiving via the digital signal would only be "partially functional and circumstantial":(. "The Sony software requires analog support to function"(duh).
Bottom line here folks is you cannot get a channel lineup or gird without a host channel (sorry Cubit) You cannot get a host channel without analog support (their you go ImTheOne). Ads, and software will load and best of all the digital clock will load and work properly (oh boy):o. Back to the vcr days.
Now, if you already have a channel lineup and grid, the data will load with the force procedure or without the procedure. But fellow DHG'ers, if you loose the lineup and grid, it's done, finished....instant vcr. You will not get the grid back after a reset! I have 4 of these dogs, and now 3, and 1 vcr. I hold my breath when I get a reboot.
For the cable folks with your little cards that have cable company's attached to them and covert digital TVGOS to analog, you may have a second wind.
Ebay will be busy.

Fox, so what should we avoid doing at all costs to avoid losing the channel lineup/grid? I have an empty one now, so it sounds like I'm OK as long as long as it remains there?

I noticed I lost 9.1 from the grid over the weekend though. I think this was my previous host channel.

After going through step 8 of the following procedure,
http://www.spiffspace.com/forum/index.php?topic=25.0

I got my clock back. But will wait until tomorrow morning per the instructions to see if my grid fills out and to complete the procedure.

If it's Sony that's unresponsive, perhaps we need to start some kind of mass mailing/communication blitz to convince Sony to take some action on this. In this economy, I would hope they'd value their customer base.

What's the consensus on what a TimeZonePkt is for?


Here is some info from Gemstar about the clock and timezone packets. bwall23 posted this same info on another board here.


Inserters send clock packets four times per minute to devices. These are in UTC time. When a device first searches for a host, it will accept UTC time from any Gemstar host. Once it finds a host station acceptable to its Zip Code, it will receive a time zone packet, which will tell it how much to offset from UTC time. These packets arrive several times per hour. The device should then set itself to local time.


Clear as mud huh? I don't know what this "host station acceptable to its Zip Code" means. It makes it sound like there is data floating around from dozens of different hosts, but only one will satisfy your DHG.

Here is what I experienced last weekend. I got downloads Thursday night, and Friday night, and my host channel was blank. Saturday afternoon my host channel was set, and all seemed well (my DHG had picked out a host channel on its own without me trying to "force" it). At the same time (not sure which happened first, or if it was related), I got 2 TimezonePkts. Why it took 2 days to get a Timezone packet, I don't know. I was quite happy Saturday evening anticipating that it was going to download its 3rd night of data in a row. But No, I got no data that night, or the 2 nights since.

Mark

But fellow DHG'ers, if you loose the lineup and grid, it's done, finished....instant vcr.

Sounds like doom and gloom, hope not...

Wouldn't the solution be to have (or get hold of) a 6-hour VCR tape of an analog host, output on ch 3/4 to at least get an initial host & channel grid? I know I'll have one ready. But with digital transition not complete in Canada until August 2011, I will have lots of time to wait. (:

My Sony has successfully read XDS station id/call VBI data from old tapes of fading 1,000 mile away analog stations received by skip (such as SDPTV 2 South Dakota, NETV 3 Nebraska, etc). A nice steady strong local signal should provide solid readable VBI data.

As long as there are Canadian and US Cable analog hosts to make VCR tapes from, these things shouldn't be bricks. VCR tapes can be sent through the mail.

If it's Sony that's unresponsive, perhaps we need to start some kind of mass mailing/communication blitz to convince Sony to take some action on this.

My recent experience with Sony...

I talked to Sony Canada today about my issues with the Toronto host dropping "Air" channels on Mar 1 and only having "Cable" channels. Since these units were never sold in Canada, the tech knew right away that I had bought it in the US (first thing he asked). Still, despite this being a unit that was never marketed or sold in Canada, he was very helpful. He listened patiently and understood the issue with no "Air". He even asked if I tried entering a US zip code to confirm the unit was operating OK. He said he was going to contact Macrovision directly about the problem - in no way did I feel he was pulling my leg or ignoring me, quite the opposite.

Mind you this was a Macrovision issue and not a Sony issue, but nevertheless I felt supported.

... But fellow DHG'ers, if you loose the lineup and grid, it's done, finished....instant vcr. You will not get the grid back after a reset! I have 4 of these dogs, and now 3, and 1 vcr. I hold my breath when I get a reboot....
fox200 and eitakura:

well, at this point, I take anything TVGOS, Sony, or whoever says with a grain of salt...

That aside, as I've mentioned several times in the last week, apparently CBS 5 is broadcasting analog TVGOS data...at least it's broadcasting version 7, since my LG 3410a is getting a download every night and - unlike our Sonys - the 3410a absolutely requires analog data...(AND, on my Sony, CBS 5 has vbi packets, according to the G* test...) for the sake of others on this thread, I kind of wish you - i.e., fox200 - had asked about analog 5 when you had Macrovision on the phone...

Of course, that fact doesn't solve problems in the long term...and for my Sony, I haven't tried to force the unit to analog 5, since Sunday I've been getting nightly downloads without a host channel, and why make trouble for myself...but if I weren't getting those downloads, I would look long and hard at trying to force my unit to analog 5...

And, if it is true that the Sony will not function in a pure digital environment, once one loses the channel lineup, then what about the DTVPal, as a way to boot it back up to functionality?

If you believe Macrovision, the DTVPal is supposed to support ALL legacy devices...of course, it is clear that the special data required for the Pal to function in TVGOS mode is not available in most areas yet, and - more problematical - I am not sure that it will REALLY support legacy devices that have a digital tuner, contrary to what Macrovision says (or, I should say, "said" - because I haven't tried to contact them since the end of the summer, and maybe what they say is no more reliable than what Sony says)

And, by the way, this isn't an issue of Sony's design, but rather of TVGOS, and they are the ones who claim legacy units will be supported...

The only thing that is clear is that nothing is clear, I'm afraid, but I'm certainly hanging onto my two high-quality high-def recorders until what the TVGOS people have told is is determined to be untrue...which we won't really be able to tell until analog TVGOS disappears...and I guess it has half-way done so at this point...

Yeah, and I probably got them confused. I have gotten a bunch of ZipCodePkts but only one TimeZonePkt. I did try changing my Zip Code to that of a nearby town, to no avail. I would perhaps have to change it to a Zip Code that isn't served by my particular Comcast office. I guess that might be worth a try.

What's the consensus on what a TimeZonePkt is for?

Dave Kristol

The time zone packet sets the Timezone Element, Timezone Version, and Offset (sec) from UTC fields. This information is used by the recorder to display GMT as local time for both the onscreen and panel clocks.

Like Cubit100, I had left messages at TVGOS. I got my call back today and I talked with the tech for about 25 min. about the Sony. KPIX in S.F. did have an outage last Tues. It was fixed and back to "normal" on Friday. He is familiar with the Sony recorder and said Sony has "refused to respond to them (TVGOS) regarding HDD DHG250/500". The Sony is not supported or certified to work with the digital signal. He said that anything I'm receiving via the digital signal would only be "partially functional and circumstantial":(. "The Sony software requires analog support to function"(duh).
Bottom line here folks is you cannot get a channel lineup or gird without a host channel (sorry Cubit) You cannot get a host channel without analog support (their you go ImTheOne). Ads, and software will load and best of all the digital clock will load and work properly (oh boy):o. Back to the vcr days.
Now, if you already have a channel lineup and grid, the data will load with the force procedure or without the procedure. But fellow DHG'ers, if you loose the lineup and grid, it's done, finished....instant vcr. You will not get the grid back after a reset! I have 4 of these dogs, and now 3, and 1 vcr. I hold my breath when I get a reboot.
For the cable folks with your little cards that have cable company's attached to them and covert digital TVGOS to analog, you may have a second wind.
Ebay will be busy.

Contrary to what you were told, my tests have shown great promise. I have successfully gone from a complete reset with default software, no clock, and no channel lineup back to normal operation with the latest software, a correct clock, a complete channel lineup, and a full eight days of listings. The only analog assist used during this process was using an analog clock channel to get a timezone packet (and this is one of the things that your tech guy said would work in the digital world). Now that my recorder has abandoned its digital host channel and reverted to its analog ways I plan to resume testing to complete a fully digital recovery. Don't give up hope yet.:)

As noted in this and other threads, TVGOS is no longer available via analog off-air broadcasts in most markets.

For the most part, the only people getting TVGOS now are those with devices that (a) incorporate an ATSC tuner, or (b) are connected to a cable provider (like Comcast) that is converting the digital version of TVGOS to analog VBI. A few broadcasters may be doing this too, but that appears to be the exception, not the rule.As I see it, it is not enough for the device to incorporate an ATSC tuner, it must also read and parse the data stream of the digital broadcast to find the guide data.

Are there any devices out there, whether industrial, consumer or professional, that will take the data from an ATSC signal and provide it in some form (baseband video is fine with me)? I can then add it to video VBI and/or modulate it as needed.

As noted in this and other threads, TVGOS is no longer available via analog off-air broadcasts in most markets.



Here's the scorecard from my area: 2 of 5 analog PBS stations still carry TVGOS data, 1 of 2 analog CBS stations carry TVGOS data, and 1 of 1 CBS digital stations carry TVGOS data. I didn't bother testing the digital PBS stations.

Beginning a week ago, a lot of us from the SF area who started experiencing problems on Tuesday started posting what we were doing and what was happening...
Because of the details we have (and don't have) about this past week's episode in the SF area, I thought it would be useful to inquire whether others around SF had DIFFERENT experiences than those who posted about losing regular TVGOS downloads for 4 or 5 days...

Thanks - Tony



I have a Sony 250 and a Pioneer Kuro plasma that have both lost their guide data late last week !!!
The Sony was OTA and the pioneer was connected to Comcast basic. Both TV guide systems got the data from PBS (channel 9 in SF) but now both show no host channel.
The Pioneer has a screen that comes up when I press the guide that states Clock data is O.K. , search for TV guide data channel "in progress" channel lineup "complete" and listing data "scheduled @ 3:00 AM 3/18/2009.
The Sony just has no guide data like others...
FYI:
I saw yesterday (can't remember where) that some of the digital broadcasts (including SF CBS 5.1) had issues with the device that inserts the TVGOS data into the digital signal so they removed it (Macrovision issue to be resolved) !!!

I think the Pioneer will come back since it is only 15 months old but hopefully the Sony too ???

Todd

I have a Sony 250 and a Pioneer Kuro plasma that have both lost their guide data late last week !!!
The Sony was OTA and the pioneer was connected to Comcast basic. Both TV guide systems got the data from PBS (channel 9 in SF) but now both show no host channel.
...

thanks for the info...I'm kind of disappointed that no one's Sony (including my own) has found TVGOS data on CBS 5, since that's where my LG3410a has been getting data since last Wednesday...

I don't really understand why 5 would be broadcasting version 7 data, but not version 8...

I'm also confused about why it just happened that both the PBS 9 data and the CBS 5.1 data disappeared on the same day (Tuesday) last week, if the reason for the 5.1 data going down was an inserter problem, but the PBS data stopped because Macrovision stopped supplying it - concidence? I don't buy it!

As noted in this and other threads, TVGOS is no longer available via analog off-air broadcasts in most markets.
I don't know where you get the "most markets"...seems from the threads I've followed that a lot of the markets still have analog stations that are broadcasting TVGOS data

My Sony switched over yesterday from longtime OTA host analog PBS to analog CBS (Chicago).

I don't know where you get the "most markets"...seems from the threads I've followed that a lot of the markets still have analog stations that are broadcasting TVGOS dataPerhaps I should have used "many markets." It'll be all in a few short months. Hopefully by then, the DTVPal STB will work as described.

Need a little more info to see if the power outage did anything other than mess with your clock.

Look in the top left corner at the GMT date/time. The time should be exactly 5 hours ahead of your current time. Also you should see [3] following the time. Now just below there are some data lines. The second line should start 08.01.40/08.06.44. If you don't have 08.06.44, what is there?

Okay.
On 3/16/2009 at 8:28pm in Fort Worth (US Central Time, 1:28am GMT), the time shown was 3/16/2009 9:43 [2].
The second line showed 08.01.42/08.06.44

Interestingly, the time displayed on the clock on the DVR unit was, I think 1:43 am (much closer to GMT) and the program listings was showing using that time to determine what it thought each channel was showing.

Lastly, press DOWN twice on the remote to go to the clocks 1 screen. In the offset (sec) from UTC you should see -21600.

Yes, the offset(sec) from UTC showed -21600
The Time Zone Element was 16, Time Zone Version 48

What do I do now?

The time zone packet sets the Timezone Element, Timezone Version, and Offset (sec) from UTC fields. This information is used by the recorder to display GMT as local time for both the onscreen and panel clocks.

Well, I've now gotten two of them. My clock has been correct for many days now, even handling the DST rollover correctly. However, I see no connection between TimeZonePkts and getting channel lineups/listings, which seems to be the implication of some posts. An incorrect time would affect what listings are shown, but it shouldn't prevent the listings from loading altogether.

But then, as posted last night, the situation may be bleak for me without an analog host channel. At least I've got an HD VCR.

Dave Kristol

Like Cubit100, I had left messages at TVGOS. I got my call back today and I talked with the tech for about 25 min. about the Sony. KPIX in S.F. did have an outage last Tues. It was fixed and back to "normal" on Friday. He is familiar with the Sony recorder and said Sony has "refused to respond to them (TVGOS) regarding HDD DHG250/500". The Sony is not supported or certified to work with the digital signal. He said that anything I'm receiving via the digital signal would only be "partially functional and circumstantial":(. "The Sony software requires analog support to function"(duh).
Bottom line here folks is you cannot get a channel lineup or gird without a host channel (sorry Cubit) You cannot get a host channel without analog support (their you go ImTheOne). Ads, and software will load and best of all the digital clock will load and work properly (oh boy):o. Back to the vcr days.
Now, if you already have a channel lineup and grid, the data will load with the force procedure or without the procedure. But fellow DHG'ers, if you loose the lineup and grid, it's done, finished....instant vcr. You will not get the grid back after a reset! I have 4 of these dogs, and now 3, and 1 vcr. I hold my breath when I get a reboot.
For the cable folks with your little cards that have cable company's attached to them and covert digital TVGOS to analog, you may have a second wind.
Ebay will be busy.

There is a lot of truth in your statements and we all receive conflicting statements. When I finally did reach a "Sony person that cared" yesterday. He (Sony) identified the problem as a "Sony" problem and that they are working with Macrovision to bring the box up to par with the new digital downloads.

He did "not" have information if this "correction" would be through OTA downloads or a firmware fix - so that part of the mystery remains? He said I would be contacted via email AND this would be on their support page when it occurs.

As I suggested yesterday, all should be contacting Sony for a Support Specialist - be specific to your city. See my previous post on this.

Now I do have "zillions of positive items" to report on from overnight being "off" - However, still no Grid Guide (like your statement above). But the changes are coming fast and furious, and a G Test is insant pass (tho not required now and may only delay box downloads), and VBI counts are now 4 times clock counter speed (maybe more).

Yes it does make sense that "Sony" would make a fix for the box to kill the "analogue hunt" - but the DL patches alone may kill that too?

The information now inside the Sony box is many times more than when it was analogue. I hope to post a summary with pictures later; but will be out a few hours.

If you believe Macrovision, the DTVPal is supposed to support ALL legacy devices...
Didn't someone in the other thread get the PAL to work in Houston?

Contrary to what you were told, my tests have shown great promise. I have successfully gone from a complete reset with default software, no clock, and no channel lineup back to normal operation with the latest software, a correct clock, a complete channel lineup, and a full eight days of listings. The only analog assist used during this process was using an analog clock channel to get a timezone packet (and this is one of the things that your tech guy said would work in the digital world). Now that my recorder has abandoned its digital host channel and reverted to its analog ways I plan to resume testing to complete a fully digital recovery. Don't give up hope yet.:)

Yes. I don't understand nor support the "it won't work" scenario either. I reset my Guide program with only digital stations enabled AND the analog PBS station no longer broadcasting the TVGOS. My machine, starting from the default software version, no clock, no channel lineup...etc. updated completely within 1 day. It has been working beautifully (knock wood) for over a month now. My digital host has never changed, nor have I awakened to no guide data. I followed the "lockup problem" resolution and then did a G* test tuned to my digital host and the clock came back after 20 minutes.

Now...my advantages may be these...1. There are only 6 actual OTA stations that broadcast a total of 10 digital channels in my area. 2. I do not have a third party service like Cable or Satellite attached. Purely OTA. 3. I only have one station broadcasting the TVGOS data and, therefore, is not in competition with any other TVGOS signal.

Yes. I don't understand nor support the "it won't work" scenario either. I reset my Guide program with only digital stations enabled AND the analog PBS station no longer broadcasting the TVGOS. My machine, starting from the default software version, no clock, no channel lineup...etc. updated completely within 1 day. It has been working beautifully (knock wood) for over a month now. My digital host has never changed, nor have I awakened to no guide data. I followed the "lockup problem" resolution and then did a G* test tuned to my digital host and the clock came back after 20 minutes.

Now...my advantages may be these...1. There are only 6 actual OTA stations that broadcast a total of 10 digital channels in my area. 2. I do not have a third party service like Cable or Satellite attached. Purely OTA. 3. I only have one station broadcasting the TVGOS data and, therefore, is not in competition with any other TVGOS signal.

bm4wood, can you make these comparisons for me? Thanks.


Pic 6948 – Can you compare the "ID line" and "SW line" with your unit please?

Pic 6955 – My schedule DL now has upgraded to vers “84”. What is your version number?

Pic 6956 – No actual TV Guide downloads here. I am assuming my box is just not yet “updated” enough to receive them. Are you showing actual downloads now?

My Sony Box has 25 analogues stations and 33 digital stations – and unfortunately the CBS local 11-1 (RF31) is “low power” and in “RF conflict”


Thanks

For all those who feel that they have or will have bricks soon, I will take them off your hands. Seeing that a brick cost about 35 cents these days, I think it would be a fair deal. Hey I may even pay for the shipping.
Electronics and obsolescences these days go hand in hand, so why be surprised that these machines or others will last forever? Anything that is software driven and at the mercy of daily program updates can and in most cases have setbacks and problems arise. Compound this with more than one party, one place and you see what happens. Plus throw in vendor changes, analog phase outs( not all at the same time mind you) and you have a mess. Then all the conjecture about what may or may work and when, how long, etc... Enough information exist here to show what works and where. If all markets were the exact same then our units would all behave the same way. But that is not the case. Too many humans at the controls.
Now, about those BRICKS?

bm4wood, can you make these comparisons for me? Thanks.


Pic 6948 – Can you compare the "ID line" and "SW line" with your unit please?

Pic 6955 – My schedule DL now has upgraded to vers “84”. What is your version number?

Pic 6956 – No actual TV Guide downloads here. I am assuming my box is just not yet “updated” enough to receive them. Are you showing actual downloads now?

My Sony Box has 25 analogues stations and 33 digital stations – and unfortunately the CBS local 11-1 (RF31) is “low power” and in “RF conflict”


Thanks

Called my wife to have her look at it. Here's what it shows.
System Info
ID - 8H077-3050T21-7V08T/FFFFFFFF12345678
SW - 08.01.42/08.06.44/00.00.00/000012C/64/0000

VBIDLSched
VER = 80

VBIDL
PAGE IS FULL. Here's sample information:
DLID = 70 (a few different numbers down the line)
STATE = inactive (two of them display "blacklisted")
LstAtStrt = 3/18/09 6:43:22 (date and times all the way down)
LstSuStrt = N/A (same all the way down the line...if this stands for "last successful start" then this column may not mean anything since i am successfully getting guide data)

Well, I've now gotten two of them. My clock has been correct for many days now, even handling the DST rollover correctly. However, I see no connection between TimeZonePkts and getting channel lineups/listings, which seems to be the implication of some posts. An incorrect time would affect what listings are shown, but it shouldn't prevent the listings from loading altogether.

But then, as posted last night, the situation may be bleak for me without an analog host channel. At least I've got an HD VCR.

Dave Kristol

You only asked about the time zone packets so that was all the information I provided. For recovery from a complete reset, the connection is as follows. In order to get channel listings you need to have a channel lineup (grid). In order to get a channel lineup you need to have a host channel. In order to get a host channel you need to have a correct clock and information provided by Zip Code packets. In order to get a correct clock you need to have the latest version of the TVGOS software and you need to get at least one Time Zone packet. In order to get Zip Code packets you need to have entered correct setup information (including Zip Code).

If you get to the point where you have a channel lineup and you lose any of the data that you needed to get to that point (e.g. your host channel), you can still get channel listing updates.

The program information in my channel grid filled out overnight and confirmed that my new host channel is 5-1 (I'm in SF Bay Area).

Only problem is I lost 9-1 (PBS HD) somewhere along the way and don't know how to get it back.

Hopefully this sticks.

Called my wife to have her look at it. Here's what it shows.
System Info
ID - 8H077-3050T21-7V08T/FFFFFFFF12345678
SW - 08.01.42/08.06.44/00.00.00/000012C/64/0000

VBIDLSched
VER = 80

VBIDL
PAGE IS FULL. Here's sample information:
DLID = 70 (a few different numbers down the line)
STATE = inactive (two of them display "blacklisted")
LstAtStrt = 3/18/09 6:43:22 (date and times all the way down)
LstSuStrt = N/A (same all the way down the line...if this stands for "last successful start" then this column may not mean anything since i am successfully getting guide data)

This must be the single most important line.....so maybe my unit will get that today:
ID - 8H077-3050T21-7V08T/FFFFFFFF12345678
SW appears to be the same now.

ver on download is different......but this may be a slight difference from DMA to DMA..........mine was ver 80 last nite before bed and this morning it was ver 84 - so that must be a none issue

And on your DL page (where mine is blank); I assume you are receiving DLIDs of:
70
81
27
97

A guess on my part.

Again thanks for the info; I think that ID line is the key; because I have not seen that one yet - tho I have seen 3 others during last 24-30 hours as it has gone thru its multiple updates.

Unless it is a coincidence, I just confirmed something new- to me at least.

As you know, my two 500's are not filling the grids even when my 250 is doing fine.

This morning I checked one 500 again and again it was empty while the 250 next to it was filled.

On a chance I ran the G-test on the Host channel (it passed) and left on the unit. It's been on for a couple of hours. I just checked and the eighth day is now filled.

So what does it mean that what we thought we knew is now upside down (at least for this one 500)? To get data the device must be left ON not off.

Still the question of why this is true for the 500 and not the 250 remains in any case.

The normal procedure when running the G*test is to tune to your CBS digital host channel, start the G*test, and leave the unit ON. :)

1. Is there a command to force a digital station host?

2. Would a DTVpal converter be able to receive an OTA digital host and provide the analog VBI into the antenna input of the Sony?

Unless it is a coincidence, I just confirmed something new- to me at least.

As you know, my two 500's are not filling the grids even when my 250 is doing fine.

This morning I checked one 500 again and again it was empty while the 250 next to it was filled.

On a chance I ran the G-test on the Host channel (it passed) and left on the unit. It's been on for a couple of hours. I just checked and the eighth day is now filled.

So what does it mean that what we thought we knew is now upside down (at least for this one 500)? To get data the device must be left ON not off.

Still the question of why this is true for the 500 and not the 250 remains in any case.

If you have an existing channel lineup, even if you do not have a host channel, you can always get it to fill by tuning to a digital channel having TVGOS data and leaving the recorder on. The recorder can download listings updates from the VBI channel. Just make sure that it is on during the time scheduled for an ID70 download. You should get the full 8 days of listings this way. Running the G* Test isn't necessary.

The normal procedure when running the G*test is to tune to your CBS digital host channel, start the G*test, and leave the unit ON. :)

Yes. Except that this isn't a digital channel- it's my usual analog channel.

It is possible that Cablevision is - since the analog feed ended- using this channel to transmit what I believe is a conveted digital to analog signal.

If you have an existing channel lineup, even if you do not have a host channel,

I have a Host channel. It's 14. It's been 14 for years. It's the same 14 on all three units.

Channel 13 PBS analog was also available. No more.

CBS 2.1 digital is available OTA but Cablevision is stripping it out- and likely converting the signal to analog to run on 14.

I need to test the second 500 but from the one result it seems that if Cablevision is now converting the digital signal to analog, either there is something wrong in the signal or the 500 is receiving it differently then the 250.

The 250 accepts it as usual while off, the 500 must be on.

I need to test this again tomorrow to make sure it wasn't a fluke and when I get a chance to test the other 500.

1. Is there a command to force a digital station host?



Turn the recorder on
Tune to the digital station
Run the G* Test to confirm the presence of TVGOS data
Tune to a different channel
Tune back to the digital station you just tested
Issue a 963214785 command
Wait until the info box disappears (you can wait as short as the time it took for G* Test packets to start counting, but box disappearing is the safest)
Turn the recorder off
Wait overnight and check host channel in morning
If you still have analog host channels available, you probably wound up with an analog host anyway, but sometimes this works even with analog channels present

2. Would a DTVpal converter be able to receive an OTA digital host and provide the analog VBI into the antenna input of the Sony?

From what I have read on this thread, I think that the answer is yes once all of the necessary equipment is in place and working properly.

My digital host is back.

After unsuccesful attempts over the past couple of weeks, I now have WNED 17.1 Buffalo as my host once again. The analog goes away April 16th, so I should have no problem making it stick after then since our analog cable version of WNED does not carry TVGOS (Cogeco Cable, Canada).

My problem was probably more related to intermittent signal though as my rotor is U/S. Wind last night blew antenna towards Buffalo.

thanks for the info...I'm kind of disappointed that no one's Sony (including my own) has found TVGOS data on CBS 5, since that's where my LG3410a has been getting data since last Wednesday...

I'm also confused about why it just happened that both the PBS 9 data and the CBS 5.1 data disappeared on the same day (Tuesday) last week, if the reason for the 5.1 data going down was an inserter problem, but the PBS data stopped because Macrovision stopped supplying it - concidence? I don't buy it!

I'm in San Jose and get VBI packets on both 5 and 5.1. I'm not sure which one is really the host though as the field is blank. I'm assuming it's 5.1 as the clock channel recently set itself to 5.1. It's Possible KQED transfered their inserter to KPIX for use on their analog channel 5. Who knows? I have a gut feeling that I haven't had any of these transition problems because I have no cable to contend with.

...
Issue a 963214785 command
Turn the recorder off
Wait overnight and check host channel in morning
...



What event occurs "overnight" that makes this work?

Okay.
On 3/16/2009 at 8:28pm in Fort Worth (US Central Time, 1:28am GMT), the time shown was 3/16/2009 9:43 [2].
The second line showed 08.01.42/08.06.44

Interestingly, the time displayed on the clock on the DVR unit was, I think 1:43 am (much closer to GMT) and the program listings was showing using that time to determine what it thought each channel was showing.

Yes, the offset(sec) from UTC showed -21600
The Time Zone Element was 16, Time Zone Version 48

What do I do now?

Looks like the only problem is that you don't have current GMT and that's easily fixed. Tune to your host channel and run the G* test.

Using your remote press the Menu button and then the Screen Mode button, then from the keypad enter 9012. That displays a new menu. Move down to the bottom for TV Guide and select it. On the next menu move down to G* test and select that. That should do it.

You can go back to the 753... screen and see if GMT is now current and you definitely need to see [3] not [2] after the date/time. If it didn't work, just try the G* test again.

Comcast Northern New Jersey-accidentally hit the factory default reset when trying to do G* last night. Lost the channel lineup and tried resetting it overnight with zip code ,etc. No channel lineup today. Appears you can't get channel lineup in present situation. Before this I was receiving listings on a daily basis.

Just When You Thought It Was Safe ...
................. I have not experimented with the hidden Reset, Commit, Save, and Restore Flash Memory commands or the Commit All Data command, but if they allow access to the TVGOS software, we may be able to do this ourselves. Has anyone been brave enough to fool around with these commands? If so, what have you found out about the data they can access?


I sure wish we could come up with a way to learn more about these functions. I can understand that no one wants to risk turning their precious HDDxxx into a boat anchor (certainly not me :p). But there are a number of HDD250's on ebay right now. If we could get 20 of us to put up $20 each, we could collectively buy one of these and have it shipped to one of us for testing. (I would nominate Marc Fontana or ImTheOne). After the testing is completed, the names of the 20 (suckers) could be put in a hat and one of us could assume ownership, or it could be resold on ebay and refunds issued from the proceeds. All of this assuming it doesn't end up as the proverbial boat anchor, in which case we would each be out only $20. :(
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
With this in mind...I'd be willing to donate (invest) $20 to the experiment to discover what some of these service commands will do for us.

Looks like the only problem is that you don't have current GMT and that's easily fixed. Tune to your host channel and run the G* test.

Using your remote press the Menu button and then the Screen Mode button, then from the keypad enter 9012. That displays a new menu. Move down to the bottom for TV Guide and select it. On the next menu move down to G* test and select that. That should do it.

You can go back to the 753... screen and see if GMT is now current and you definitely need to see [3] not [2] after the date/time. If it didn't work, just try the G* test again.


I'll give this a try this evening and let you know how it works.

One question, how do I know which is my Host Channel?
Is that PBS? CBS? Analog or digital?
I know it varies by region/city. Is there a web site which lists the host channels in various areas?

Many, many thanks.

What event occurs "overnight" that makes this work?

The recorder takes the information that it has stored and searches for a host channel, presumably starting with the channel where you issued the Search VBI Channel command. It can only acquire a host channel while it is turned off. I don't know exactly how long this process takes, but I imagine that it varies greatly depending upon how many potential host channels there are in the area, reception, signal strength, mood of the TVGOS gods:D, etc., hence overnight.

Comcast Northern New Jersey-accidentally hit the factory default reset when trying to do G* last night. Lost the channel lineup and tried resetting it overnight with zip code ,etc. No channel lineup today. Appears you can't get channel lineup in present situation. Before this I was receiving listings on a daily basis.

Check your software version before you do anything else. If it has been reset to the default (which sometimes happens on the first TVGOS Factory Reset instead of the second), you will need to wait for your recorder to update its TVGOS software from version 08.01.42 to 08.05.40 and then again to 08.06.44 before you can reacquire your host channel, channel lineup, and channel listings.

I'll give this a try this evening and let you know how it works.

One question, how do I know which is my Host Channel?
Is that PBS? CBS? Analog or digital?
I know it varies by region/city. Is there a web site which lists the host channels in various areas?

Many, many thanks.

According to Rabbit Ears (http://www.rabbitears.info/market.php?request=tvgos) your digital host should be KTVT 11.1. You can also check what channel your unit is using. From the first page of the 753... screen, go RIGHT to the next page and see what is listed as your Host Channel. Additionally, from the Clocks 1 page, go RIGHT to the Clocks 2 page and see what is listed as your Clock Set channel. Even if they are different, any of them should get you correct GMT.

I sure wish we could come up with a way to learn more about these functions. I can understand that no one wants to risk turning their precious HDDxxx into a boat anchor (certainly not me :p). But there are a number of HDD250's on ebay right now. If we could get 20 of us to put up $20 each, we could collectively buy one of these and have it shipped to one of us for testing. (I would nominate Marc Fontana or ImTheOne). After the testing is completed, the names of the 20 (suckers) could be put in a hat and one of us could assume ownership, or it could be resold on ebay and refunds issued from the proceeds. All of this assuming it doesn't end up as the proverbial boat anchor, in which case we would each be out only $20. :(

I'd be willing to do the testing if there are enough people interested in this.

I have a Sony 250 and a Pioneer Kuro plasma that have both lost their guide data late last week !!!
The Sony was OTA and the pioneer was connected to Comcast basic. Both TV guide systems got the data from PBS (channel 9 in SF) but now both show no host channel.
The Pioneer has a screen that comes up when I press the guide that states Clock data is O.K. , search for TV guide data channel "in progress" channel lineup "complete" and listing data "scheduled @ 3:00 AM 3/18/2009.
The Sony just has no guide data like others...
FYI:
I saw yesterday (can't remember where) that some of the digital broadcasts (including SF CBS 5.1) had issues with the device that inserts the TVGOS data into the digital signal so they removed it (Macrovision issue to be resolved) !!!

I think the Pioneer will come back since it is only 15 months old but hopefully the Sony too ???

Todd

I have a year old Pioneer Kuro connected with analog cable and it lost it's listings two weeks ago.

Check your software version before you do anything else. If it has been reset to the default (which sometimes happens on the first TVGOS Factory Reset instead of the second), you will need to wait for your recorder to update its TVGOS software from version 08.01.42 to 08.05.40 and then again to 08.06.44 before you can reacquire your host channel, channel lineup, and channel listings.

The version is 08.01.42 but will the software be transmitted from the digital host? VBI packets are being received from digital WCBS in NY and the time is correct.

Since doing a full Factory reset yesterday, My clock did update to 1 hour off and I am now on software version 8.05.40, Here's hoping it continues today and I see guide data again.

My Sony switched over yesterday from longtime OTA host analog PBS to analog CBS (Chicago).

Mine now shows no host, and I have no listings....

Where is the Magic 8 Ball now?

The version is 08.01.42 but will the software be transmitted from the digital host? VBI packets are being received from digital WCBS in NY and the time is correct.

The version number to which I am referring is on the first (Section System-System Info) screen of the 753159852 information display, not on the G* Test screen, which will always show version 08.01.42. If your default software version is installed, the second line (the one under the line that starts ID: ) begins with 08.01.42/00.00.00/. This will update first to 08.01.42/8.05.40/ and then to 08.01.42/08.06.44/. The updates will be transmitted regardless of whether your host is analog or digital and will occur automatically, although some people have found it necessary to run the G* Test again after the first software update occurs.

I'm in San Jose and get VBI packets on both 5 and 5.1. I'm not sure which one is really the host though as the field is blank. I'm assuming it's 5.1 as the clock channel recently set itself to 5.1. It's Possible KQED transfered their inserter to KPIX for use on their analog channel 5. ...
I doubt anybody switched an inserter over, because, ever since December, I've noticed that both analog channels, 5 and 9, have had vbi packets, except since last week, when the packets on 9 stopped...and of course 5.1 has had packets at least since last summer, which is when I started occasionally monitoring them using the G*test...

I have been puzzled, though, since I started looking more fully at the diagnostics screens, that the DL schedule shows schedules for FIVE different analog stations (as well as one digital)...the only trouble is no one has suggested how to associate the 4 digit station IDs with actual analog stations in the area

The version number to which I am referring is on the first (Section System-System Info) screen of the 753159852 information display, not on the G* Test screen, which will always show version 08.01.42. If your default software version is installed, the second line (the one under the line that starts ID: ) begins with 08.01.42/00.00.00/. This will update first to 08.01.42/8.05.40/ and then to 08.01.42/08.06.44/. The updates will be transmitted regardless of whether your host is analog or digital and will occur automatically, although some people have found it necessary to run the G* Test again after the first software update occurs.

The 7531 check does show 08.01.42/08.06.44 so I'm alright there but I noticed that check also shows my host channel as blank. Is that a problem with eventually getting the channel line-up to download?

My Sony switched over yesterday from longtime OTA host analog PBS to analog CBS (Chicago).

That's interesting, because I don't see any packets on OTA analog 2. In fact the ONLY place I see packets is on CBS-HD (both OTA and cable).

Oh, and after several days of no listings and leaving the DVR alone, the host channel went blank, then today a new "host" appeared --- cable 73, which has no VBI packets. Of course no listings were updated. Figure that out.

Like Cubit100, I had left messages at TVGOS. I got my call back today and I talked with the tech for about 25 min. about the Sony. KPIX in S.F. did have an outage last Tues. It was fixed and back to "normal" on Friday. He is familiar with the Sony recorder and said Sony has "refused to respond to them (TVGOS) regarding HDD DHG250/500". The Sony is not supported or certified to work with the digital signal. He said that anything I'm receiving via the digital signal would only be "partially functional and circumstantial":(. "The Sony software requires analog support to function"(duh).
Bottom line here folks is you cannot get a channel lineup or gird without a host channel (sorry Cubit) You cannot get a host channel without analog support (their you go ImTheOne). Ads, and software will load and best of all the digital clock will load and work properly (oh boy):o. Back to the vcr days.
Now, if you already have a channel lineup and grid, the data will load with the force procedure or without the procedure. But fellow DHG'ers, if you loose the lineup and grid, it's done, finished....instant vcr. You will not get the grid back after a reset! I have 4 of these dogs, and now 3, and 1 vcr. I hold my breath when I get a reboot.
For the cable folks with your little cards that have cable company's attached to them and covert digital TVGOS to analog, you may have a second wind.
Ebay will be busy.

Sounds like you spoke to Jay at TVGOS. Unless it was a different guy with the exact same information I got some weeks ago. The weird thing is that right now I have everything --- SW version, clock, lineup --- but have not been able to get new listings for six days.

If you have an existing channel lineup, even if you do not have a host channel, you can always get it to fill by tuning to a digital channel having TVGOS data and leaving the recorder on. The recorder can download listings updates from the VBI channel. Just make sure that it is on during the time scheduled for an ID70 download. You should get the full 8 days of listings this way. Running the G* Test isn't necessary.

Even this no longer works for me, although there are plenty of packets on CBS-HD cable and OTA. Under normal circumstances, I would do a soft reset to get rid of any strange glitches. But I am afraid to lose my clock, etc. in the current environment.

I think the VBI activity is misleading here. Comcast told me they were not getting TVGOS data on their CBS fiber feed earlier this week, even though VBI somethings show up in the Sony G*Test. I'll have to follow up with Comcast. OTOH, I get a good enough signal with an indoor antenna to get CBS OTA, and the "G*Test leave it on" method doesn't get me listings from there either.

Here is what I experienced last weekend. I got downloads Thursday night, and Friday night, and my host channel was blank. Saturday afternoon my host channel was set, and all seemed well. At the same time, I got 2 TimezonePkts.
[...]
I was quite happy Saturday evening anticipating that it was going to download its 3rd night of data in a row. But No, I got no data that night, or the 2 nights since.


Yesterday evening with the recorder off, I did a TV Guide/Exit reset. My host channel went blank, and my guide downloaded last night. I also got 2 TimezonePkts. So you don't need a host channel to get TimezonePkts. I was hoping I could go a couple of days without a host channel to see if this "downloads happen without a host channel, but stop with a host channel" pattern continued. When I got home tonight, my host channel was set again, I also am up to 6 TimezonePkts. I'll see if I get downloads tonight but I'm skeptical.

Mark

Even this no longer works for me, although there are plenty of packets on CBS-HD cable and OTA. Under normal circumstances, I would do a soft reset to get rid of any strange glitches. But I am afraid to lose my clock, etc. in the current environment.

I understand the hessitation to do a reset. Last night I successfully did the soft reset, but the time before I lost everything, and started over at patch 00.00.00.


I think the VBI activity is misleading here. Comcast told me they were not getting TVGOS data on their CBS fiber feed earlier this week, even though VBI somethings show up in the Sony G*Test.

The digital CBS station here lost the TVGOS data for 12 days, a month ago, yet during that time I was able to reset my DVR, and get software patches, and a clock from their channel. No listings of course. I contacted someone else from Wichita, on this board, who verified that they were having problems too. We each independently talked to people at the CBS station who acknowledged that they were having problems. So the VBI activity can be misleading.

Mark

Sounds good - you probably have more time available than I do at the moment. Unfortunately, I've already sold the HDD250 I was experimenting on, and I don't want to risk it with the HDD500, especially during Lost season...

I'm ready to move forward with this if enough people are willing to commit. Even if we could get only 8 people at ~50 each, that would be fine as far as I'm concerned. I'm in............. :D

This must be the single most important line.....so maybe my unit will get that today:
ID - 8H077-3050T21-7V08T/FFFFFFFF12345678
SW appears to be the same now.
[...]
Again thanks for the info; I think that ID line is the key; because I have not seen that one yet - tho I have seen 3 others during last 24-30 hours as it has gone thru its multiple updates.

I believe, that ID is a unique number that must be generated when the unit is reset (since you have seen it change). Besides the DHG, I have a panasonic DMR-E95H DVR that uses TVGOS, and it has an ID number that is in the same format as that number (the part before the /), 5 digits, a dash, seven digits, a dash, and then 5 more digits. I don't believe it is significant.

Mark

Ok so how do you run a G* test?

Thanks

Ok so how do you run a G* test?

Thanks

Use these instructions (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16069903#post16069903)that I posted earlier today for another person that needed to do it to fix his clock issue.

Use these instructions (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16069903#post16069903)that I posted earlier today for another person that needed to do it to fix his clock issue.
Thank you

One more question, should I turn off my PBS analog channel now since they don't broadcast the TVGOS information anymore, to prevent it from locking on to it?

Thanks

Thank you

One more question, should I turn off my PBS analog channel now since they don't broadcast the TVGOS information anymore, to prevent it from locking on to it?

Thanks

I don't think it will make any difference either way. At least turning channels off has never stopped my units from using a channel if they wanted to. :D

You only asked about the time zone packets so that was all the information I provided. For recovery from a complete reset, the connection is as follows. In order to get channel listings you need to have a channel lineup (grid). In order to get a channel lineup you need to have a host channel. In order to get a host channel you need to have a correct clock and information provided by Zip Code packets. In order to get a correct clock you need to have the latest version of the TVGOS software and you need to get at least one Time Zone packet. In order to get Zip Code packets you need to have entered correct setup information (including Zip Code).

If you get to the point where you have a channel lineup and you lose any of the data that you needed to get to that point (e.g. your host channel), you can still get channel listing updates.

I have latest software version. I have a correct clock. I am getting ZipCodePkts. I have entered my correct Zip Code in Setup. I do not have a Host Channel and I do not have a channel lineup.

Dave Kristol

The 7531 check does show 08.01.42/08.06.44 so I'm alright there but I noticed that check also shows my host channel as blank. Is that a problem with eventually getting the channel line-up to download?

I'm in Summit and have been having the same problem on Comcast: correct TVGOS software, correct clock, no channel lineup.

Dave Kristol

My clock and VBI channel have both changed sometime this week to 5.1 here in the Bay Area. The host channel is blank, but I have full listings for all channels (haven't had to do any resets).

Tony - on your prior question, I did do the G* select 5.1, then left on to force the guide last weekend, so don't know if KPIX CBS5 would have been picked up on its own.

Rick

The 7531 check does show 08.01.42/08.06.44 so I'm alright there but I noticed that check also shows my host channel as blank. Is that a problem with eventually getting the channel line-up to download?

You will need to get a host channel before the channel lineup will download. It sounds like everything else on your recorder is set properly. You should leave the recorder off overnight and check for a channel lineup in the morning. If you don't have it by then, there are other fields in the 753... screens we can look at to diagnose the status of your recorder.

Even this no longer works for me, although there are plenty of packets on CBS-HD cable and OTA. Under normal circumstances, I would do a soft reset to get rid of any strange glitches. But I am afraid to lose my clock, etc. in the current environment.

I think the VBI activity is misleading here. Comcast told me they were not getting TVGOS data on their CBS fiber feed earlier this week, even though VBI somethings show up in the Sony G*Test. I'll have to follow up with Comcast. OTOH, I get a good enough signal with an indoor antenna to get CBS OTA, and the "G*Test leave it on" method doesn't get me listings from there either.

Look at the download schedule, find an ID70 download that you can observe, enter the 753... information screens during the scheduled download time, go to the Section Reception-VBI Stats screen, see if the counts are increasing for the listings-related fields. This will tell you if the TVGOS data you are seeing on your channel is understood by your recorder.

Thank you

One more question, should I turn off my PBS analog channel now since they don't broadcast the TVGOS information anymore, to prevent it from locking on to it?

Thanks

Turning channels off in the Edit Channel list only causes them to be skipped when you press the channel up/down buttons, turning channels off in the Channel Editor of the channel lineup only prevents the listings from appearing in the listings grid. Neither will prevent your recorder from using an analog channel to download data or clock information.

I have latest software version. I have a correct clock. I am getting ZipCodePkts. I have entered my correct Zip Code in Setup. I do not have a Host Channel and I do not have a channel lineup.

Dave Kristol

One of the posters on the west coast said that the cable company there will not be supporting TVGOS fully (this post was a couple of pages back and I'm too lazy at the moment to find it and give proper credit and reference). The gist was that you can get a correct clock and you can download listings if you already have a grid, but that if you have a reset and lose your channel lineup, you will not be able to get a host channel and therefore will not be able to get a channel lineup. I am not having this problem with my local OTA digital CBS channel, but you should probably call your cable company to see if their inserters are providing all of the necessary information you need to get your host channel and channel lineup back.

Getting a channel lineup, STEP#1 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16074597)

That's interesting, because I don't see any packets on OTA analog 2. In fact the ONLY place I see packets is on CBS-HD (both OTA and cable).Spoke too soon - not getting anything anymore as of today. My time's still good, but once I lose power who knows. I was able to set a couple of recordings tonight using the blank grid blocks, because I still have the channels listed.

But the host channel was listed as 2 analog yesterday for some reason, and I was still getting listings.

I'd hook up the Pal and test it out, but I can't receive WBBM-DT right now. Thank our wonderful government for that.

bwall23 had posted this in the TV Guide thread:
-----------------------------------------------
Just wanted to clarify my earlier post for those that didn't get my subtle hint...

TVGOS needs to take control of it's CE device (that it's built into) in order to extract a channel map. It tells the device to scan through all the channels it knows about (that were scanned by the device or that get mapped by a cablecard) and monitors each channel for a period of time while it harvests info like station, channel#, etc.

This info is wiped out after certain resets, so if you're experimenting after resetting your device, be aware that you'll need to turn the device off for up to 24 hours so the TVGOS can control it and scan through those channels itself.

If you don't do this, you'll never get a channel lineup since it doesn't know what channels you can receive.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

I will assume that is true - I am not there just yet.

I looked at my Sony Box yesterday AM and again last night about 7PM. Still no Guide Grid or Listings. Just by "looking" it may be preventing the grid and listings from building?

I do know that my Sony has locked into the Digital CBS host via OTA (only source connected). The reject page shows it has "rejected" about 1.5 million TV Guide stuff meant for the "listings" but cannot put them there because of no "grid". My Sony also has tons of ads, correct time is 100% perfect (matches CBS digital host exactly AND Verizon wireless cell phones LOL).

Under the "old" style analogue download routine there were only 3 types of downloads total AND they all repeated at least three and most 4 times a day.

Under the "new" style digital downloads routine there are now a minimum of (8) EIGHT download types per day AND they only repeat patterns ONCE per day.

Under the "old" routine downloads arrived independently; under the "new" routine two can arrive at the same time (like a 180 minute with a 20 minute). That type of event occurs several times during a single 24 hour period.

That alone implies it could take much longer than just 24 hours. Perhaps as long as 4-5 days after a full factory reset?

Both "old" and "new" routines appear to have an "inactive state" (no downloads) from about 7:30PM to 10:30PM - the time frame most would be watching recorded shows.

So based on all this............I will do the "TV Guide Rain Dance" tonight at 8PM - turn it on and see what I got.

Without analog or a new software patch from TVGOS, you will never see the grid on that unit.

Patch from TVGOS or from Sony?

So for those of us getting clock data, VBI info, channel grid, ran the G* test, did the 953... but no guide date, what steps should we try to get guide data, is there simple step by step instructions somewhere?

Thanks

I'd be willing to do the testing if there are enough people interested in this.What are you guys trying to do??

Yea, I'm starting to think until a patch is issued are Sony's are going to have to be used manually as long as you can get the correct clock, My HDD500 has done nothing over the last 2 nights, I am an hour off and stuck at the 8.05 software version. I guess at least I have a clock which I'm sure will be correct soon based on the old Daylights saving time change. I guess at least I can still use it as long as I get the time correct. Still irritates me that their is no manual way of setting the clock on this unit. Really kind of stupid omission by Sony on this one.

While my 250 continues to function as it always has, I have learned more about the 500.

The 500 seems to only be getting data if I run the G test on the host channel and leave the unit on.

I did that on the 11:32PM download last evening -designated as 27 -and have ads today. No grid data for the eighth day however so listing were not downloaded- only ads.

I also see on the various screens that while packets for the well functioning 250 are in the many millions, for the 500 they are significantly less.

Finally, maybe this means something, or not, on the "Section VBI DATA VBIDLSCHED" screen, under the version column, the functioning 250 has version "88", the malfunctioning 500 has version "84". Does it mean anything? And how and when does that version change?

Finally, maybe this means something, or not, on the "Section VBI DATA VBIDLSCHED" screen, under the version column, the functioning 250 has version "88", the malfunctioning 500 has version "84". Does it mean anything? And how and when does that version change?


Ok, your 250 works perfectly? - all 8 days? - Digital OTA? (or cable?)

My 500 which is OTA only - with only digital CBS as source (analogue Guides are gone in this area). Have gone thru versions 70,80, and 84 was the last one I got yesterday (I am not turning on until after 8PM tonight).

Is that the only difference you see between the 250 and 500 is the 88 vs 84?

Regarding this pic post;
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=137072&d=1237384725
would someone explain the download schedule times? Yes, I do realize they in in UTC (or GMT if you perfer).

1. The 1st & 2nd collumns, are those number suppose to represent a ceratin day of the week?
2. Looking ate the current time of 11:14, the 1st schedule time is shown as 7:37. Am I to assume this was previous to the current time of 11:14?
3. Looking at the '81' entries: 5:37, 17:57 & 3:37, these are not in time order. How are these to be interperted?
4. Is the quality range 1-9 in collumn 5?
5. What are the differences between the three types in collumn six: 2, 3 & 4?

My main concern is trying to figure out when the last D/L was and when the next one is scheduled? Every time I look at that screen it confuses me more. Actually that screen isn't as messed up as the ones I have see here as far as the times appearing to be out of order.

DLID Houston Start Duration Quality Type
Time GMT

81 22:49 3:49 50 6 3
27 23:44 4:44 60 6 4
81 0:49 5:49 50 6 3
81 1:09 6:09 20 6 3
27 1:34 6:34 20 6 4
27 1:44 6:44 60 6 4
81 1:59 6:59 20 6 3
27 2:24 7:24 20 6 4
70 2:49 7:49 180 6 2
70 2:49 7:49 30 6 2
97 3:24 8:24 60 6 6
70 4:29 9:29 60 6 2
97 5:04 10:04 60 6 6
27 5:54 10:54 60 6 4
27 6:09 11:09 20 6 4
70 6:34 11:34 30 6 2
70 6:59 11:59 180 6 2
97 7:09 12:09 60 6 6
70 8:14 13:14 30 6 2
97 8:49 13:49 60 6 6
81 9:54 14:54 20 6 3
70 10:04 15:04 180 6 2
70 10:19 15:19 30 6 2
97 10:54 15:54 60 6 6
70 11:59 16:59 30 6 2
97 12:34 17:34 60 6 6
81 13:09 18:09 50 6 3
81 13:39 18:39 20 6 3
70 14:04 19:04 180 6 2
70 14:04 19:04 30 6 2
97 14:39 19:39 60 6 6
70 15:44 20:44 30 6 2
97 16:19 21:19 60 6 6
27 17:24 22:24 20 6 4
27 18:04 23:04 60 6 4


I believe the digital downloads create 8 differnt types. The old analogue was only 3 types. NOTE this was based on version 76.........my unit has last updated to version 84..........and the start times have changed "slightly"

Sorry the columns will not align in the paste

DLID HoustonTime GMT Duration Quality Type

The second column from the DL schedule I felt was "machine type" specific..........therefore not needed for this chart?

Ok, your 250 works perfectly? - all 8 days? - Digital OTA? (or cable?)

My 500 which is OTA only - with only digital CBS as source (analogue Guides are gone in this area). Have gone thru versions 70,80, and 84 was the last one I got yesterday (I am not turning on until after 8PM tonight).

Is that the only difference you see between the 250 and 500 is the 88 vs 84?

250 works perfectly- hope it stays that way. Firmware version .06 (the 500's are .05)

I don't know that there are no other differences on those screens.

It's just that this difference, the version 88 (working) vs the 84 (not working) stood out when I checked the download times.

Also even as they sit side by side, getting the exact same cable feed, the download times seem to be different but only by a couple of minutes.

I have another 500- at my mother's home some miles away but off the same cable company and host channel- malfunctioning exactly like my 500- I need to check its version (84 or 88) when I get a chance to visit her.

Regarding this pic post;
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=137072&d=1237384725
would someone explain the download schedule times? Yes, I do realize they in in UTC (or GMT if you perfer).


3. Looking at the '81' entries: 5:37, 17:57 & 3:37, these are not in time order. How are these to be interperted?


They are in order if you change it from GMT to your time. Subtract 4 hours and convert from a 24 to a 12 hour clock.

For example, if you are on the East coast:

5:37 = 1:37 AM
17:57 = 1:57 PM
3:37 = 11:37 PM


.............................................

Is your clock correct? I ask because I just realized, my clock is correct, and my download times for the "81" download (on my 500) are exactly one hour off yours.

At

4:37 = 12:37 AM
16:57 = 12:57 PM
2:37 = 10:37 PM

What are you guys trying to do??

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16070467&postcount=14721

It would be great to be able to flash TVGOS V-8.06.44 into the DHG's, so that after a full factory reset 8.06.44 would be the starting software version the DHG would use to aquire the time, channel lineup, and program listings. No one seems willing to risk their own unit to test the "Flash" functions in the service menu. My thought was to do a group purchase of a unit on ebay for testing purposes, thereby spreading the risk if it becomes a brick. The window to try this is closing as June 12th approaches.

Well after stating I was stuck this morning on my HDD500 it up and updates me to 8.06.44 and I now have the correct time, Sure took its time getting there, From a full factory reset to where I am now was 2 nights. I did not leave it on either. I also notice on the one screen that I have gone from ver.84 to ver. 88. I guess now its going to be a wait and see tonight to see if I get a grid back or not. Not holding my breath after hearing people not getting anything although I can hope the ver. 88 might get me what others are not getting with ver. 84.

Well after stating I was stuck this morning on my HDD500 it up and updates me to 8.06.44 and I now have the correct time, Sure took its time getting there, From a full factory reset to where I am now was 2 nights. I did not leave it on either. I also notice on the one screen that I have gone from ver.84 to ver. 88. I guess now its going to be a wait and see tonight to see if I get a grid back or not. Not holding my breath after hearing people not getting anything although I can hope the ver. 88 might get me what others are not getting with ver. 84.

Lucky Dog......ok you are at 88. If it is "off" for at least 24hours (like 8pm to 8pm the next day) AND when you turn it "off" it is left on your Digital Host (like CBS or whoevver); then that implies you will finally have a Grid with Guide - so the current theory goes.

Lucky Dog......ok you are at 88. If it is "off" for at least 24hours (like 8pm to 8pm the next day) AND when you turn it "off" it is left on your Digital Host (like CBS or whoevver); then that implies you will finally have a Grid with Guide - so the current theory goes.

Crossing my fingers that this happens, I have been keeping it on the Host channel when I turn it off. I guess we will see.:cool:

Crossing my fingers that this happens, I have been keeping it on the Host channel when I turn it off. I guess we will see.:cool:

Are you saying you did a full reset and starting from scratch it now has a digital host and it looks like it may become functional?

Cable or OTA host?

Are you saying you did a full reset and starting from scratch it now has a digital host and it looks like it may become functional?

Cable or OTA host?

I am a bit confused about the Host thing, The Host channel is blank but the VBI has my CBS Digital in it. I honestly thought I was getting my guide from CBS Digital all along since I did a full reset a few months ago when I lost my analog PBS (So I thought, I cant verify that now). My guide quit updating for a few days. I have both cable and OTA plugged into it. I am using the OTA CBS Digitial as the host channel while turning the HDD500 off. I have no idea if it will work if I don't leave it on that channel at this point. And as far as it becoming functional I guess we will see if I get anything tonight now that I am all up to date.

Looks like the only problem is that you don't have current GMT and that's easily fixed. Tune to your host channel and run the G* test.

Using your remote press the Menu button and then the Screen Mode button, then from the keypad enter 9012. That displays a new menu. Move down to the bottom for TV Guide and select it. On the next menu move down to G* test and select that. That should do it.

You can go back to the 753... screen and see if GMT is now current and you definitely need to see [3] not [2] after the date/time. If it didn't work, just try the G* test again.

This process appears to have worked. The time reset to the correct time and it continues to be correct this morning. I lost the program information in the channel guide when I did the reset. I assume that started to fill in last night but didn't have a chance to check this morning.

Thanks again for the detailed steps in fixing this issue.

I am a bit confused about the Host thing, The Host channel is blank but the VBI has my CBS Digital in it. I honestly thought I was getting my guide from CBS Digital all along since I did a full reset a few months ago when I lost my analog PBS (So I thought, I cant verify that now). My guide quit updating for a few days. I have both cable and OTA plugged into it. I am using the OTA CBS Digitial as the host channel while turning the HDD500 off. I have no idea if it will work if I don't leave it on that channel at this point. And as far as it becoming functional I guess we will see if I get anything tonight now that I am all up to date.

The VBI field will show whatever channel you're tuned to when you enter the diagnostics menus.

The VBI field will show whatever channel you're tuned to when you enter the diagnostics menus.

OK, That makes sense, I cant say I have seen the host channel not be blank since I reset it a few months ago when I thought they had changed to Digital. For that few months it was still getting the data and I wasn't leaving it on any specific channel at that point.:confused:

Quote from referenced link:

TVGOS needs to take control of it's CE device (that it's built into) in order to extract a channel map. It tells the device to scan through all the channels it knows about (that were scanned by the device or that get mapped by a cablecard) and monitors each channel for a period of time while it harvests info like station, channel#, etc.



I have a slightly different take on the process of acquiring a channel lineup. I agree with you that the recorder needs to be turned off and the TVGOS software takes control to create the channel lineup, but I don't believe that this is done by scanning through the channels for the following reasons. My channel lineup includes many channels that my recorder doesn't receive, including cable channels (I am OTA only). My channel lineup also includes channels that are local to me and I could receive if I rotated my antenna, but are not currently scanned into my recorder's channel memory (i.e. they are not included in the CH +/- List and if I tune to them with the remote the recorder displays No Signal).

I believe that the recorder gets its channel lineup from information included in the download based upon the host channel Station ID. This explains why I have different channel lineups (including different numbers of channels in the lineup) when my two recorders have different host channels that are in different geographical areas. It also explains why you can't get a channel lineup without a host channel even if you are getting TVGOS data and have a correctly set clock. I think that embedded in the download there is a list for each station ID that specifies which channels are in that station's reception area (both OTA and cable) and the state (on or off) of each channel in the channel lineup.

The TVGOS bug bites here in the NY area. Wife asks : so where did my recording go ?

We have two HDD 250's set up OTA with a rock solid NYC signal.

Checked TVGOS, and all entries were blank. The Record List was all greyed out. It was the same for both boxes.

Our last scheduled recording was March 14th, which took normally. It would appear that TVGOS stopped eight days prior, or whatever the fully stocked time frame is. We always had a properly populated guide. This also was the same for both boxes-they have different recording schedules.

Our clocks were off a few hours for one day a week or so ago, but reset themselves. I thought nothing of it at the time-again both units.

Today I enter the dreaded service menus for the first time in three years of HDD ownership.:eek:

The Gemstar test finds packets on 2-1, the CBS station, no packets on 13 PBS analog (the prior host) and no packets on Analog CBS 2. It passes ATSC, Fails VBI, as it should.

There is a Blank on the Host Channel in the other service menu.

So, with two boxes, both well broken in and working correctly, I took the aggressive and passive approaches.

Box #1

I have reset the guide in full, and am running the "find host" function tuned to 2-1. All channel and "to record" listings are gone. I will then leave the box off for the next 24 and see if anything arrives.

Box #2

Tune to 2.1. Leave box on. Walk Away.:D

Box #2

Tune to 2.1. Leave box on. Walk Away.:D

As an experiment a couple of days ago I attempted to get data off 2.1 OTA in NYC. It was successful for the morning download [it was on from about 9AM to 1PM]

But I didn't just tune to it and left it on, I first ran a G-test and left it alone. That G -test may be a crucial first step.

Has anyone in the Bay Area been able to force a digital host channel on cable? I can do G* test and leave it on 705 and fill out my lineup. But if I leave the DHG off, nothing comes over.

Another topic....what is the official word on why sony quit producing the DHG series of DVR's? And why have they not expand or improved on the system.
Is this just too small of a niche market with Dish and Cable being so large?

Cw

Another topic....what is the official word on why sony quit producing the DHG series of DVR's? And why have they not expand or improved on the system.
Is this just too small of a niche market with Dish and Cable being so large?

Cw

My guess has always been that they ended the product because of cable company pressure.

What are you guys trying to do??

WS65711 made a proposal in post 14721 based on a question I asked in post 13939. We are talking about jointly purchasing a used 250 on E-bay and testing some of the unpublished commands that deal with flash memory (and possibly some of the other unpublished commands from the list of 66). If the tests don't turn it into a brick, we would come up with a method of deciding who gets it.

Yea, I'm starting to think until a patch is issued are Sony's are going to have to be used manually as long as you can get the correct clock, My HDD500 has done nothing over the last 2 nights, I am an hour off and stuck at the 8.05 software version. I guess at least I have a clock which I'm sure will be correct soon based on the old Daylights saving time change. I guess at least I can still use it as long as I get the time correct. Still irritates me that their is no manual way of setting the clock on this unit. Really kind of stupid omission by Sony on this one.

You should be able to get the 08.06.44 software update. Try tuning to a channel that has TVGOS data, running the G* Test, and leaving the recorder on. It sounds like you have correct GMT, but the wrong DST parameters, so your clock should be correct once you get the update.

While my 250 continues to function as it always has, I have learned more about the 500.

The 500 seems to only be getting data if I run the G test on the host channel and leave the unit on.

I did that on the 11:32PM download last evening -designated as 27 -and have ads today. No grid data for the eighth day however so listing were not downloaded- only ads.

I also see on the various screens that while packets for the well functioning 250 are in the many millions, for the 500 they are significantly less.

Finally, maybe this means something, or not, on the "Section VBI DATA VBIDLSCHED" screen, under the version column, the functioning 250 has version "88", the malfunctioning 500 has version "84". Does it mean anything? And how and when does that version change?

FWIW, both of my 250s have version 88.

As an experiment a couple of days ago I attempted to get data off 2.1 OTA in NYC. It was successful for the morning download [it was on from about 9AM to 1PM]

But I didn't just tune to it and left it on, I first ran a G-test and left it alone. That G -test may be a crucial first step.

Excellent. I won't do that, just turn it on, and see what happens. I have two "vcr" recordings set, one for tonite, but will make sure it is otherwise unused and on channel 2-1, CBS. The downstairs unit still has the greyed out recordings in the grid-the only 'blue' are the timers.

This way we can see if the G* Test is needed. The upstairs unit had the G* Test done, of course. I'm trying the downstairs unit in "grandma" mode.

You should be able to get the 08.06.44 software update. Try tuning to a channel that has TVGOS data, running the G* Test, and leaving the recorder on. It sounds like you have correct GMT, but the wrong DST parameters, so your clock should be correct once you get the update.

Yea the update finally happened this morning as far as software version. I am now at 08.06.44 with the correct time. Am I to assume that is as far as it is ever going to go now? I am not totally unhappy at this point as it is still very much usable by manually recording at this point. Would still be nice if the grid would come back and start functioning again though.:(

This process appears to have worked. The time reset to the correct time and it continues to be correct this morning. I lost the program information in the channel guide when I did the reset. I assume that started to fill in last night but didn't have a chance to check this morning.

Thanks again for the detailed steps in fixing this issue.

Don't assume that just yet, Many here are not getting the grid back after a full reset. I finally got back to correct time and software version today and that took 2 days to do so. We will see tonight if a grid will come back but based on what I am seeing here I'm not holding my breath.

WS65711 made a proposal in post 14721 based on a question I asked in post 13939. We are talking about jointly purchasing a used 250 on E-bay and testing some of the unpublished commands that deal with flash memory (and possibly some of the other unpublished commands from the list of 66). If the tests don't turn it into a brick, we would come up with a method of deciding who gets it.

I was hoping there might be some interest in doing this. But it's looking like no one (but me) is willing to risk anything at all. There doesn't seem to be any flood of responses in the forum, any no one has PM'd me about it either.

You didn't mention that if the tests are successful (and don't turn it into a brick) we may manage to do for ourselves what Sony has thusfar not done for us.......... make the DHG's more compatible (maybe fully compatible) after analog goes away.

Another topic....what is the official word on why sony quit producing the DHG series of DVR's? And why have they not expand or improved on the system.
Is this just too small of a niche market with Dish and Cable being so large?

Cw

I seem to recall that there was some speculation a long while back that the reason had to do with content protection issues and the possibility of lawsuits.

My guess has always been that they ended the product because of cable company pressure.

I think it's a combination of market forces and that.

These boxes came out way ahead of the Digital curve, and were set at a videophile price. I'm sure Sony took a loss when I got mine at the Sony Outlet Store in a plain brown box and not even on display, for $299 each.

These are NOT remotely ready for J6P and prime time. The TVGOS system and the Sony software don't always coexist happily, and I'm convinced that there were two competing teams of engineers who didn't like each other, or maybe did but spoke different languages.

This is one heck of a buggy gadget, and if there was a 'HDD 350' we'd all be saying AVOID the 250/500 series...but there is not.

Practically, the Manufacturers are making all the DVR's they can for the Satellite and Cable companies. It's much easier to deal with orders of ten thousand boxes with the Cable/Sat company doing the programming and tech support, not you. Most folks are happy to drop $7 per month for a box, with no upfront. If the box lasts eight years, the cable/sat company has done very well-you less so long term.

Sony is stuck, as they sell a lot of HDD devices in Europe, Japan and Australia. If you check the price points, they are not cheap.

I've had good experience with the extended service plan and the folks at the service center. So there is support. They are not telling us anything, even by a "magic 8 ball" method, though.

So, take the fact most people here use cable/sat, add in the fact that your last product lost you money (corporate memory) and then toss in a pinch of fear, as the cable/sat boxes are all controlled by a "mother ship". Given the history of the RIAA/MPAA folks, you'd not want to make a box some hacker can get into, and be sued for "not protecting content", as if you insure against every motivated hacker on the planet.

So, you take orders for 100,000 boxes with no operating systems from Cable companies, and live a quiet life.

Excellent. I won't do that, just turn it on, and see what happens. I have two "vcr" recordings set, one for tonite, but will make sure it is otherwise unused and on channel 2-1, CBS. The downstairs unit still has the greyed out recordings in the grid-the only 'blue' are the timers.

This way we can see if the G* Test is needed. The upstairs unit had the G* Test done, of course. I'm trying the downstairs unit in "grandma" mode.

Easy test. Tune to 2-1, enter the 753... information screens, go to the Section ATSC-ATSC Slicing screen, observe the TVG field. If the count is increasing, you don't need to run the G* Test.

FWIW, both of my 250s have version 88.

And what is your status? Is all well with your downloads? Cable or OTA? And where are you located?

Yea the update finally happened this morning as far as software version. I am now at 08.06.44 with the correct time. Am I to assume that is as far as it is ever going to go now? I am not totally unhappy at this point as it is still very much usable by manually recording at this point. Would still be nice if the grid would come back and start functioning again though.:(

I'm not sure where you are located. People in SF, NY, and Houston seem to be having trouble with full recovery, but others (myself included) have gotten everything back after a full reset. If you still have a channel lineup, you can force listing updates if they don't happen automatically. Otherwise, you need to be able to acquire a host channel in order to recover your channel lineup.

I was hoping there might be some interest in doing this. But it's looking like no one (but me) is willing to risk anything at all. There doesn't seem to be any flood of responses in the forum, any no one has PM'd me about it either.

You didn't mention that if the tests are successful (and don't turn it into a brick) we may manage to do for ourselves what Sony has thusfar not done for us.......... make the DHG's more compatible (maybe fully compatible) after analog goes away.

As you noted, not too many people realize the significance of this testing. I guess that if the help isn't free, they aren't interested.

Well, first I did the TVGOS reset. Then I did the G* test on my local (Dallas where the local PBS analog station no longer sends out Guide data) CBS station after verifying they are xmitting TVGOS data and left the unit on overnight (auto-off is turned off) for the past 3 nights. I'm still on 8.01.42 firmware and the clock is still wrong. No TV Guide of course.

Anyone out there have any ideas?