What is Control4?

A quote from their web site:


Control4 offers a complete line of home automation products that makes sophisticated home automation solutions practical and affordable for every home. To find out more, click on the product links above.


Products offer integration and control solutions for lighting, distributed (whole-house) audio, audio/video, climate as well as interfaces with 3rd party products. It utilizes WiFi and ZigBee wireless protocols in addition to ethernet, and may not require extensive rewiring -- ideal for existing homes.

Lot's of information is available on their website, http://www.control4.com/.

Current product line is described at http://www.control4.com/products/components/complete.htm. The product pages there are required reading for anyone interested in this product.


I've heard it's all buzz and no product.

Products started shipping on April 29, 2005. This was approximately 5 months later than originally announched.

I received my first shipment on May 19th, others got theirs a week or so earlier.


Where can I buy it? I didn't see it at Good Guys / Best Buy / Fry's, etc.

Control4's policy is that they do not sell via retail. Their channel is through dealers and custom installers. So if you plan to acquire Control4 products, you need to find a dealer. Some dealers may be flexible on how work is split between them and their customers.

Tech support is through your dealer.

Products carry a 1 year warranty.

Aside: many posts have focused on how C4 should sell their gear, whether it's fair or not fair, whether customer installers and dealers should or shouldn't be involved. Feel free to go read those threads for insight to the debate.


Is it X10 / PLC based?

No. The control part of the system utilizes ZigBee (IEEE 802.15.4) mesh networking. "Mesh" means that every device is a repeater, so the more devices you have, the more robust the network is.


Is this the only Control4 thread?

No. Here are other ones in chronological order. Keep in mind that these threads started after Fall 2004 CEDIA. At that time, first ship date was to be November 2004 and there's a lot of discussion about vaporware, etc. As of today, the product is shipping, see above.

As far as I know, this is the first mention of Control4 on AVS:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=445561

jgist (Jim Gist) started this thread. He is the Director of Business Development at C4 (or something like that).

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=450480

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=486759

Add-ons to C4 thread

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=535426

Another long one. First discussions of shipping product in this thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=524567


How much does it cost?

See jacksonian's post below.

As a ball park, I would say starting in low-mid 4-figures, for a starter package.


Diagrams of sample Control4 Configurations

Before you start asking questions, look at these closely! And read the individual product spec sheets at http://control4.com/products/components/complete.htm -- each product has a pdf with lots of information.


Wireless Distributed Audio - http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0004-04.htm

Wired Distributed Audio - http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0005-04.htm

Wireless Zigbee Lighting - http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0006-04.htm.
This diagram shows Mini Touch Panel acting as a controller. Currently, Mini Touch Panel does not include controller functionality, and one of the standard controllers (Media Controller, HomeTheater Controller, Receiver Controller) is required.

Wired Ethernet Lighting - http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0007-04.htm
This diagram shows Mini Touch Panel acting as a controller. Currently, Mini Touch Panel does not include controller functionality, and one of the standard controllers (Media Controller, HomeTheater Controller, Receiver Controller) is required.

Home Theater (C4 Receiver) - http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0008-04.htm

Home Theater using your receiver - http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0009-04.htm. This scenario would also work if you have the Media Controller.

High Voltage Relay - http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0012-05.htm


-------

I will update this post with add'l questions and answers if i know them.

MSRPs I've been quoted (please feel free to correct and I'll edit so we can keep this all in one post near the top):

Controllers
Media Controller - $1499
Home Theater Controller -
Home Theater Receiver Controller -


Audio
Multi-Channel Amplifier - $1999
Audio Matrix Switcher -
WiFi Speaker Point -
Multi-Tuner AM/FM -
Multi-Tuner AM/FM/XM -

Touchscreens/keypads
10" Wireless Touchscreen - $1999
Mini Touch Screen - $649
Wireless LCD Keypad - $299
Extra Handheld Remote - $149
3 Button Keypad -
6 Button Keypad -

Lighting
Wireless Dimmer - $99
Wireless Switch -
Wireless Outlet Dimmer -

Climate
Wireless Thermostat - $199

Hi guys,

This is Eric Smith the CTO and founder of Control4 and of course (maybe I should be afraid to say because of the things I have read here) PHAST. I have been watching the threads both here and on Remote Central Since they started, and honestly I didn't want to get into the fray. This product is essentially my baby as was PHAST, and I didn't want to come off as defensive. I really just wanted to wait and let the product speak for itself.

Thanks to Max for starting this new thread.

I am very impressed by the way you all help each other out here. I am also impressed by the time that some of the professional installers take to chime in (even QQQ).

I can't guarantee that I will be able to be here and reply to issues every day, but I will try to answer questions from time to time.

We knew about the limitations on the music navigation on the remote control when we shipped the product, but we decided that was a minor annoyance compared to putting off shipping the product any further since those issues do not exist on the graphical based "Navigator" interfaces. There will be a patch before the summer is over that will resolve the issue. By the way, I have looked at how you choose a song on the IPod and practically every other digital music player ever conceived (I have a huge collection in my office). I travel with both a 40 gig IPod, and a 1 Gig Shuffle (For running) everywhere I go and I love them.

There have been question about whether the Mini TP has an issue like the one mentioned above. The 10.5" TP, MC (On Screen), and Mini TPs all have essentially the same interface except for some variations based on size, and whether you can touch them. So if you are happy with the interface on the MC, you should be please with the Mini TP and the 10.5" TP.

We will add the ability to configure the ripping bit rate soon, and we are also working finishing the work to support full bit rate .WAV files. FLAC will take a while while we work on a codec that will work with our hardware design.

I have not seen these posted, but in the spirit of full disclosure (because that is the kind of company we are trying to be), you will find as you add lots of music to your system that when you change rooms on any of the "Navigator" interfaces, that there is a substantial delay (i.e. 3 minutes) while the system builds pages. This is currently fixed, and there will be a patch at the end of May to make this very fast. The delay will still be there after you add new music to the first time anyone "refreshes" the navigators or changes rooms.

There was also a question about video switching. It is fairly easy to add almost any video switch to the system, and then the system will automatically manage routing of video signals throughout the house. It will even take care of issues like if you have 3 DSS receivers making sure that if one person is using a receiver that the next person that chooses a channel from the navigator interface that they will get one of the unused receivers. The system also will do the same thing with modulators.

I saw a concern with reliability of light switches. I will openly admit (or even apologize to QQQ, Alan, etc. although I must say that I will not admit any fiscal responsibility as AMX acquired PHAST from me and then pushed me out) that there were MAJOR problems with the early iterations of the PHAST dimmers. Nine months ago I removed my (sill working although the final (i.e. "Swimmer") rev.) PHAST dimmers and put in Control4 dimmers, and they work GREAT! The biggest problem with the PHAST dimmers was that the PHASTLink network referenced ground, and that could cause a single dimmer to lock up the entire network. That is not an issue with the C4 lighting products as they communicate on wireless notwork. They were also susceptible to static and lightning. UL requires a dimmer to not fry below 8000 volts. We decided to set the standard much higher. Our standard was set at 25000 volts (the maximum most static guns can generate), and it was that not only should the device not fry, but to pass our test, it would not even reset. We have also invested in a 6 figure HALT/HASS chamber to do extreme environmental stress testing on the products.

I will close for now, but I will come here often.

P.S. On June 6th we are starting the "4" Real tour. We will visit 31 Cities over 10 weeks. This will be a 4 hour hands on demo and QA session on the products open to anyone, but targeted at current and potential installers/dealers. I will be personally conducting each of these meetings so that you can get the real info right from the source. It will start in Boston and wind its way around the country ending in Seattle in mid August. I will post the dates/locations here when they are finalized. I hope to meet some of you (and QQQ if you reveal yourself I promise not to give up your non Super Hero alter ego (and I really mean that in the nicest way as you really impress me with the time you take to help others out)).

" It is fairly easy to add almost any video switch to the system, and then the system will automatically manage routing of video signals throughout the house. It will even take care of issues like if you have 3 DSS receivers making sure that if one person is using a receiver that the next person that chooses a channel from the navigator interface that they will get one of the unused receivers. The system also will do the same thing with modulators."

That is astounding!

I look forward to putting in a few of these systems if that kind of attention to detail is the norm with Control4.

Hi Eric,
Let me be the first to say welcome and thank you for joining us. Your post has already answered several of my big questions.

You mentioned that it would take a while for a FLAC codec that would work with the hardware. I'm starting the process of ripping all of my music to an archive format as well as to MP3. Do you think FLAC would be the most likely compressed lossless format you guys would support? So that would be the best archive file format?

Originally posted by esmith
Hi guys,

This is Eric Smith the CTO and founder of Control4 and of course (maybe I should be afraid to say because of the things I have read here) PHAST. I have been watching the threads both here and on Remote Central Since they started, and honestly I didn't want to get into the fray. This product is essentially my baby as was PHAST, and I didn't want to come off as defensive. I really just wanted to wait and let the product speak for itself.

Thanks to Max for starting this new thread.

I am very impressed by the way you all help each other out here. I am also impressed by the time that some of the professional installers take to chime in (even QQQ).

I can't guarantee that I will be able to be here and reply to issues every day, but I will try to answer questions from time to time.

We knew about the limitations on the music navigation on the remote control when we shipped the product, but we decided that was a minor annoyance compared to putting off shipping the product any further since those issues do not exist on the graphical based "Navigator" interfaces. There will be a patch before the summer is over that will resolve the issue. By the way, I have looked at how you choose a song on the IPod and practically every other digital music player ever conceived (I have a huge collection in my office). I travel with both a 40 gig IPod, and a 1 Gig Shuffle (For running) everywhere I go and I love them.

There have been question about whether the Mini TP has an issue like the one mentioned above. The 10.5" TP, MC (On Screen), and Mini TPs all have essentially the same interface except for some variations based on size, and whether you can touch them. So if you are happy with the interface on the MC, you should be please with the Mini TP and the 10.5" TP.

We will add the ability to configure the ripping bit rate soon, and we are also working finishing the work to support full bit rate .WAV files. FLAC will take a while while we work on a codec that will work with our hardware design.

I have not seen these posted, but in the spirit of full disclosure (because that is the kind of company we are trying to be), you will find as you add lots of music to your system that when you change rooms on any of the "Navigator" interfaces, that there is a substantial delay (i.e. 3 minutes) while the system builds pages. This is currently fixed, and there will be a patch at the end of May to make this very fast. The delay will still be there after you add new music to the first time anyone "refreshes" the navigators or changes rooms.

There was also a question about video switching. It is fairly easy to add almost any video switch to the system, and then the system will automatically manage routing of video signals throughout the house. It will even take care of issues like if you have 3 DSS receivers making sure that if one person is using a receiver that the next person that chooses a channel from the navigator interface that they will get one of the unused receivers. The system also will do the same thing with modulators.

I saw a concern with reliability of light switches. I will openly admit (or even apologize to QQQ, Alan, etc. although I must say that I will not admit any fiscal responsibility as AMX acquired PHAST from me and then pushed me out) that there were MAJOR problems with the early iterations of the PHAST dimmers. Nine months ago I removed my (sill working although the final (i.e. "Swimmer") rev.) PHAST dimmers and put in Control4 dimmers, and they work GREAT! The biggest problem with the PHAST dimmers was that the PHASTLink network referenced ground, and that could cause a single dimmer to lock up the entire network. That is not an issue with the C4 lighting products as they communicate on wireless notwork. They were also susceptible to static and lightning. UL requires a dimmer to not fry below 8000 volts. We decided to set the standard much higher. Our standard was set at 25000 volts (the maximum most static guns can generate), and it was that not only should the device not fry, but to pass our test, it would not even reset. We have also invested in a 6 figure HALT/HASS chamber to do extreme environmental stress testing on the products.

I will close for now, but I will come here often.

P.S. On June 6th we are starting the "4" Real tour. We will visit 31 Cities over 10 weeks. This will be a 4 hour hands on demo and QA session on the products open to anyone, but targeted at current and potential installers/dealers. I will be personally conducting each of these meetings so that you can get the real info right from the source. It will start in Boston and wind its way around the country ending in Seattle in mid August. I will post the dates/locations here when they are finalized. I hope to meet some of you (and QQQ if you reveal yourself I promise not to give up your non Super Hero alter ego (and I really mean that in the nicest way as you really impress me with the time you take to help others out)).
Eric,

Very funny and charming - glad I caught it. I am impressed with your post and genuinely wish you guys the best of luck. I honestly don't know who was to blame for PHAST - I just know I got screwed :D!

BTW, the thing I am impressed with the MOST of all by far IF you can pull it off is the auto generation of a REAL preprogrammed user interface. I genuinely believe that is the key to grabbing a HUGE piece of market share and possibly even major dominance for reasons I obviously need not explain to you since that's what you've created (though I still want to see how well you've pulled it off).

Thanks for posting Eric .
It isn't very often that a manufacturer, let alone the CTO, responds on this forum . You've not only answered some technical questions, but also a thorny political one (Phast) .
Jim has also done a great job before you, and endured much flaming in the process .:)

Originally posted by esmith
The biggest problem with the PHAST dimmers was that the PHASTLink network referenced ground, and that could cause a single dimmer to lock up the entire network. That is not an issue with the C4 lighting products as they communicate on wireless notwork. They were also susceptible to static and lightning.
There was also the issue that if you burped in their vicinity they would blow up. Sorry, I couldn't resist :D! Last such comment, I promise.

Also, even though you said you will come here often, I'm sure that you (and Jim) are very busy people. It would probably benefit all of us if you could have someone in your tech support dept. answer some of our questions directly on the forum, rather than having to go through the dealer . Ultimately it should save all of us a lot of time, money and aggravation .

You're incorrigible QQQ. :)

Welcome Eric.

Congratulations on shipping C4 gear. Thanks for stopping by.

As we're working with the product, how should we send to Control4 suggestions, enhancements, bug, etc. Should we go through our dealer or would you like to know about them directly?

I second AJF's suggestion to have tech support dept. periodically answer questions directly.

Cheers,
Max

Hey Guys,
Are any of you using the 3 or 6 button keypads? Also, have they said when they might be shipping any of the Mini Touchscreens ?

My order included a 6 btn keypad. Should be shipping shortly.

I know a lot of us have been frustrated about the remote not displaying tracks. I talked with Brent Huskins over the weekend. He said the LCD keypads should be released at the end of the month, and they share the exact same interface as the handheld remote. He was fairly sure that C4 would have the LCD keypad working correctly before it shipped, and that would mean a software update would be available for the handheld remote. So that sounds like good news.

Maybe you guys already figured this out, but I just learned how to check the disk space.

\\ then the ip address of your MC (which you can get quickly by hitting the setup button on the mc)

you can view the folders with your mp3s as well as the album art

Here's a good question. It looks like if you insert a disc in the MC it rips at 192. If you rip at a higher rate or .wav on a pc and then import, does the MC convert the track to 192 bit rate? I want uncompressed or lossless on my MC and don't want to waste time ripping directly to the MC now and then have to change later.

I'm not sure at what rate the MC is playing. But I've been ripping mine to FLAC as an archive and then making a LAME copy at the alt preset insane variable bit rate preset and loading those onto the MC and they sound great. You pose a good question, but I don't think it could play it at a different bitrate than it's recorded at, especially a variable bitrate like I did. But I could be wrong. I'm using dBpowerAMP to rip and convert my files. It's just as easy as WM10 and it supports just about every codec you could want. Thanks to TimmyB for the suggestion.

Stash, here's what Eric says about this, from his post above:

We will add the ability to configure the ripping bit rate soon, and we are also working finishing the work to support full bit rate .WAV files. FLAC will take a while while we work on a codec that will work with our hardware design.

OK guys, I found out from Eric that you can't get tracks on the handheld remote yet. He said they just didn't think anyone would be interested in drilling down to that level on the remote. But they've heard our requests and he believes it will be a future feature.

Also, he said a new software update would allow mounting additional hard drives via USB or over the network.

I guess a workaround right now is to create playlists. I belive this can be done via Composer or Navigator interface, but not LCD interface.

Thanks for finding out.

Eric,

Will Control4 be integrating with the Netstreams digilinx system and if so when?

A couple of answers.

We should have track access in the June version, and we should have the items sorted alphabetically by then too. This is just a software upgrade of Director running on the MC.

The 3 and 6 button keypads and the 3 way switches were just waiting for final UL approval which we got on Friday last week. They should ship almost immediately.

When we stream analog audio over the network we stream it at full 16 bit stereo 44.1KHz. When we play compressed audio we send it over the network compressed, and then convert it to 16 bit stereo 44.1 KHz.

I'm pretty sure we can even stream wav files now, but because they don't have tags, they won't identify correctly when scanned.

Eric

Just wanted to publicly thank Eric for getting to the bottom of a few issues I have had with the system. It looks like all the requests for the remote have been implemented for the end of June update. For those interested in what those issues were, see my post on the remote in the other Control4 thread.

I am amazed at how quickly Eric was able to get this done. While they should have been done before the release, I applaud them for releasing the issue and correcting it quickly.

I look forward to having Eric's continued input here.

Joe

Ditto .
Question:
When you have a component which C4 doesn't have the IR for in it's library, how is it taught to the system (using the original remote) ? Is it done at the MC or the C4 remote?

It's done at the MC. There is an IR window on the front of the MC that can be used to learn codes. Also, speaking of IR codes, it is rumored that C4 is going to allow the MC to receive IR commands from other universal remotes. This will be handy for the Harmony/pronto/Home Theater Master crowd that wants to run macros.

Thanks Stash . That great because the new Harmony 880 looks real nice and I'm going to buy one to replace my 659 when they become available on-line (I tried BB, no luck) .

I think it's been mentioned on the other thread, but I hope C4 is working on a nice hand-held, hard button and color lcd, theater remote . A step-up from their basic remote, similar to the 880 would be great .

Do the controlers provide support for 2-way rs-232 controll for the 3805? also what are the video sense ports for? I assume you would plug your dvd, STB, and other video devices in via composite the control can sense that and perform some sort of predefined routine.

One last thing. I would like to have the ability to map my digital cable music stations to selection on the touchscreen so I could select music>cable>jazz and it would set the stb to station 830. I am sure this is simple, and this is how my next door neigbor has his crestron setup. Can control4 do this?

I am very excited about this product! My neighbor has a creston that controls 4 audio zones with music, his home theatre and a mp3 server. he spent about 40 Grand on the whole setup, not including tv's, and I want to build a better system for a fraction of the cost!

this will be brief as I am between flights. the denon 3805 is 2 way, but only the power commands are captured inbound. this allows turning on or off the device to trigger programming. The video sensors do exactly the same thing. Route composite video through the MC and power will trigger an event. I have set this up in my house so that when the DVD turns on (like when I hit eject to put a rented DVD in), the projector and receiver automatically come on and select the DVD player.

With broadcast video channels, there is an option to check "Audio Only". this will cause the music channels to show up under "Radio" on all of the UI devices.

Eric or Jim,

Can you tell us more about the "4" Real tour . I'd especially like to know when and where you'll be in N.Y.

Hey AFJ,

We are taking the show on the road.

These will be 3-4 hour sessions shouwing you the hardware and software and allowing you the ability to have hands on time with the gear and Eric.

Be careful what you touch on Eric. ;)

Here are the dates as I have them noted.

The complete list should be on our web site in the coming days.

6-Jun Boston MA
7-Jun Newark NJ
8-Jun Washington DC


20-Jun Charlotte NC
21-Jun Atlanta GA
22-Jun Jacksonville FL
23-Jun Tampa FL
24-Jun Miami FL


Jim

Interested in the ability to list the entire DVD library. What DVD changers are supported for the cover art media? Is the GUI interface similar to Kaleidescape?
Thanks

"....allowing you the ability to have hands on time with the gear and Eric. Be careful what you touch on Eric." ;)
Jim

LOL
I think people will only want to put their hands on Eric if the equipment doesn't work as well as he says it does .
Thanks

Eric,
How will we receive the software updates? Will they download when we check for Composer updates? Or do we need to somehow log into the C4 system? Since I don't have my AMP yet, I haven't bothered with checking out the "My Control4" stuff.

I think Brent Huskins said the AMP and other May 31st released components should be arriving today, hope to have my system fully installed next week.

Hey Jacksonian, what equipment will you have in your final setup? I'm looking forward to the update for the remote and update that will allow IR control with a universal remote (MX 850).

Final setup will be:

1) Media Controller + Multi-channel Amplifier powering 8 zones of audio

2) Home Theater Controller providing a 9th audio zone and possibly controlling my theater equipment (depends on whether I like the setup better than my Harmony 669, if not, I'll upgrade to the Harmony 880).

3) Wireless Thermostat, Wireless switch for the fireplace, and 2 wireless dimmers to start. If the dimmers work well, then I will probably add about 10 more to complete the house, using some of the wireless outlet dimmers for lamps.

4) For right now, I'll have 3 of the handheld remotes. I'll probably add a couple of 3 button or 6 button keypads for things like controlling a "Leaving Home/Coming Home" or "Entertaining" lighting/music scene or for quick volume control in places like the kitchen.

I'm just not sure that the mini-touchscreens are going to be all that functional for me. As my wife pointed out, "I don't want to be standing at the wall searching for the album I want to play."

So, although I think the mini-touches are cool as heck, I'd rather wait for them to make a portable one. To me, I either want to use the nice interface on the big TV screen or I want to use the remote interface in my chair or I want to just hit a quick scene button or volume button on a keypad. I don't ever see wanting to use the mini-touch on a wall. I'm really hoping C4 will look at what Sonos has done and realize that we'd love to scroll through our album art and playlists on a nice color lcd portable keypad.

Hey AFJ,

We are taking the show on the road.

These will be 3-4 hour sessions shouwing you the hardware and software and allowing you the ability to have hands on time with the gear and Eric.

Be careful what you touch on Eric. ;)

Here are the dates as I have them noted.

The complete list should be on our web site in the coming days.

6-Jun Boston MA
7-Jun Newark NJ
8-Jun Washington DC


20-Jun Charlotte NC
21-Jun Atlanta GA
22-Jun Jacksonville FL
23-Jun Tampa FL
24-Jun Miami FL


Jim
Are you folks planning on having any San Francisco dates?

I know what you mean about the Mini Touchscreens Jacksonian . There are places I'd like to use them, but I also would want a few wireless touchscreens. Philips is just starting to ship a new T.S. control that might just fill the bill, the RC9800i :
http://www.homecontrol.philips.com/index.cfm

It's WiFi and Universal Plug and Play (UPnP) MSRP only $600 . Guys are just starting to review it on remotecentral: http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/mboard/rc-rc9800i/list.cgi

I'm not sure how well it can be integrated into a C4 system, but it's at least a good representation of what I would like to see added to their equipment list .

BTW, I have a question about the dimmers; when you send a command for a light to turn on, is there a noticable time lag til it responds ?

I have found no "noticable" lag time with the lights.

I downloaded an update for the Composer software yesterday using the "Update Composer" feature and everything went smoothly. I'm pleased to say that the transfer times for files seems to be noticeably faster. I transfer an average CD now in about half the time it took before. Still a hair slow, but much improved.

I also noticed some new icons and rooms in the design setup, but I'll say more in a couple of days when my AMP gets here and I get everything setup the way it will be finally (except for my thermostat--still waiting).

I'm super excited. Even now, scrolling through all of my music and picking just what I want anywhere in the house with the handheld remote is awesome. No, that's not necessarily revolutionary, but here's my take:

Control 4 has made a very nice media server to compete with Fireball at a much lower price, they've allowed you to play any of your music anywhere in the house like Sonos, they're offering a digital multi-room amplifier at a cost comparable to Niles (but with MORE amplified channels), they've made controllable dimmers and switches cheaper than the competition, and they've made it all work together from an easily USER (yes--USER)-programmable interface. Any of those alone would be reason for praise, but all together, I think that's an impressive accomplishment. :)

Well, the Control 4 system certainly does look interesting. I do have a couple of questions though:

1 - Are there example screenshots anywhere of the interface or programming software? It's hard to really get an idea of what the system can do and how easy it might be to program. Additionally, screenshots could help those of us who need visual stimulation to better understand a product's capabilities. ;)

2 - To that end, is there somewhere on the site that they have product manuals posted? If I've missed it, I apologize. I understand Control 4's distribution channel strategy, but I HATE having to go through a dealer just to get more information. No sense in wasting their time when I'm just curious. User manuals usually tell me most of what I want to know about a product.

Thanks in advance.

Jeff

Jeff,
I don't have any screenshots, but I can tell you my experience. I'm an average computer user. I've never had any programming experience, I can't get a wireless network to operate correctly, and I've never used an AMX/Crestron/etc...system before. I couldn't even program macros on my MX-500 remote, so I bought a Harmony.

That said, the Control4 setup has been fairly easy and painless. I'll have my AMP in a couple of days and will install my dimmers and switch, so I'll have some lighting and an 8 zone music system. I'll post my reports as soon as I can as far as setting up scenes, etc...

My impressions so far:
VERY much like the Harmony remotes in terms of philosophy. The Interviewer software asks you which rooms you're controlling, which components of the C4 system you're using, and which 3rd party components you're using, and what you want to do with them. Then it configures the system accordingly. Once you're familiar with the Composer software, you can simply add devices directly without going back through the Interviewer process.

The handheld remote works well. It scrolls through your music collection quickly and commands are carried out almost instantly. It's operated well all over my 3100 sf home. And since it uses Zigbee wireless, the addition of the dimmers/switches will strengthen the operating signal for it.

I know Control4 does not currently provide support for this, but supposedly it is coming sometime down the road.

Being able to view security cameras via the mini-touch screens.

So, does anyone have suggestions on a good security camera that will integrate with this? I suppose the system will have to be IP based.

I need an outdoor (ohio weatherproof), white, color camera that doesn't break the bank.

I don't really need the ability to pan/zoom, have audio, or GREAT night vision however something decent for night would be nice.

Anything fit this bill? I'll need 3-4 or them. I know there are a lot of other security camera posts, which I have been trying to read also.

Thanks.

I have been reading about Control4 and have some questions. I have an ELAN Z-series for audio distribution. For my home theater I have a Marantz 7500 A/V receiver with a SIMS2 projector, SONY DVD player and a MX-800 remote. I also have a security system. What I am not clear about is if and how the integration of these components would work with Control4. I am looking to add lighting control and climate control, but want to ensure that if I go with Control4 that I all these components can be integrated together. Can Control4 use the Marantz serial port or would I need to add yet another IR wire? Can I continue to use my MX-800 remote? And what of the ELAN Z-Series. If I put some speakers in my master bedroom and want to use the Z-series for the audio distribution can I use a Control4 panel to control the Z-series, lights and alarm, Thermostats, etc...

Thanks Jacksonian. That certainly does say a lot for the product's ease of use. Perhaps the Control 4 folks could make thye manuals available to anyone on their site as I would think those might have screenshots and ultimately kill 2 birds with one stone.

AMP should be here today, hope to get it installed tonight/tomorrow am, and also install my dimmers/switch. I was poking around the C4 website today and noticed this in the My Control4 section

"Thank you for you interest in MyControl4. Our web services are currently in development and testing.

MyControl4 web services will be available in convenient, affordably priced subscription packages combining multiple individual offerings. Initial general release is targeted for September, 2005.

Registering your system is the first step towards enabling MyControl4 web services, so register today. Limited beta testing opportunities will also soon be available."

I'll beta test anything they have!

BTW Jacksonian, when I installed my Niles system, I discovered that it had a 1 bad channel . Of course I dicovered this after having wired and programmed most of the zones . They sent me a new unit very quickly but it was a hassel to redo the whole thing .

So, if you're not hooking up all 8 zones right away, you may want to at least test all 16 channels to be sure they all work .

And thanks for the lighting reply Stash. A lag in response to a any button push can be not just annoying but problematic because people will tend to keep pushing that button if they don't get immediate satisfaction ( just like those conditioned response experiments that they do using animals :) ) .

Hmmm...so know one from Control4's answered my query - any "tour dates" on the West Coast, and specifically in the Bay Area?

The Tour Dates are for dealers/integrators only and you have to RSVP...not sure that C4 wants Home Owners there. More of a dealer event where likely pricing will be discussed.

It's kind of hard to accommodate both crowds and remain focused.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

No West Coast yet either way.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

We are still working out the details for California, but they will be in August. Brent is right; The target market for these events are potential dealers, but I don't think we'll kick anyone out. I will post them when we have the details finalized.

Next week we are doing Charlotte NC, Atlanta GA, Jacksonville FL, Tampa FL, and Ft Lauderdale FL starting Monday and ending on Friday.

Eric Smith

The Tour Dates are for dealers/integrators only and you have to RSVP...not sure that C4 wants Home Owners there. More of a dealer event where likely pricing will be discussed.

It's kind of hard to accommodate both crowds and remain focused.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
No, I understand, and we are system integrators :D

On another thread AJF / QQQ recommended that I post my questions here and that I may get more response and possible some off board pm . . . . . .

My questions have to do with Home Automation options. I've scrolled through various threads, and haven't come up with the answers (of if I did maybe I didn't know what I was looking at?).

I have been planning on (and am wired for) a Control4 system for: (1) automation of lighting, (2) hvac (4 systems), (3) distributed audio (currently 4 zones, but I could see up to 10-12 zones someday), (4) distributed video, (5) theater control; and (6) security system including status and cameras accessible via web. My audio distribution needs are currently 4 zones (with a total of 10 pair of speakers / volume controls). Home includes 4 hvac systems, dedicated theater, minimum 10 rooms with audio, currently 2 rooms with video distribution off of the main a/v closet, security system with glass breakage sensors, window & door opening sensors, and 5 security cameras.

My a/v consultants who did my pre-wire are really big on Control4 for the integration of these various systems. Also, another forum member who works for a very fine speaker company corresponded with me re: Control4 and that it appears to be an excellent system. Accordingly, my questions are not "can Control4 do what I want it to do" (I assume it can), but:

Question 1: what are the other system options to Control4?

I'm aware of Crestron and can research that option (my generally understanding of Crestron is that it is at a much higher price point). What other system options or combination of system options are available for the integration / automation of these systems?

If I use Control 4 (or another system)I would like my a/v guys to install and program (for all they have done for me I do not want to try to cut them out), but then I would like to have the full ability to go DIY thereafter (add switches, re-program, tweak, etc.). Accordingly . . .

Question 2:

What does it take (i.e., purchasing, installing, programming, etc.) to go DIY on Control4 or some other system which provides the Control4 level of integration? Any ideas on who I can speak with / p.m. off the board on these issues (if that is the better way to handle it)?


Thanks.

PS - I understand the business model of Crestron, Control4 and others to distribute their system, protocals, programming, products, etc. in the hands of licensed and trained installers and to keep that out of the hands of DIY. I don't fault any company for its business model, after all, it's their company and not mine. Accordingly, I am not trying to start a forum fight of what should a company do or not do. Seems like that's where we were headed to some degree in the other thread.


Thanks.

OK, I have my AMP all connected now. I'm running 8 zones of audio from the Media Controller to the AMP. I managed to get it all connected by just using the 4-5 pertinent paragraphs from the AMP user manual and a couple of tips from joemci (thanks, Joe). So right now when I fire it up, all 8 zones play, so I have to mute my porch speakers so I don't blast the neighbors. I haven't read the manual yet to do any programming so I can operate one room at a time yet.

I will say that the software update did a couple of things. 1) Artists & Albums are now organized alphabetically on the remote and GUI [something Joe was quick to point out being a pain without organization] 2) Changing tracks/albums now is clean and seamless, originally it would change with about a 1/8 second off in the timing of the beginning of the track.

I'm hoping to install my dimmers and switch soon, but I have vacation coming up next week, so it may have to wait. So far I'm impressed with the intuitive setup, especially since I haven't read the manual.

The AMP features are quite impressive to me. You can adjust the tone controls, gain, and balance for every output to tailor the sound for each individual room. And you can do that from the AMP front panel LCD or you can do it sitting with your laptop in each individual room connected to the Director via your wireless connection.

There's absolutely NO home networking knowledge/skill/task involved here. I simply plugged an ethernet cable into the Media Controller and then into my wired/wireless Belkin Pre-N router and it automatically did its thing. I connected the AMP to the router exactly the same. And I was surprised to see that the Media Controller popped up automatically on my laptop via the wireless connection. This was an issue I was originally concerned with since I suck at networking. But it's been absolutely plug and play monkeyproof.

By the way, the AMP seemed to pump out lots of clean sound with all 8 zones running fairly loud. This ain't just background music. I was blasting it in my workout room and it sounded very clean.

That's great . Thanks for the feedback Jacksonian .

Eric,
If you're reading, can you tell me if there's an easy way to turn on just one room at a time? Maybe I just need to program a scene or something, which I haven't gotten to yet. But it seems like an "All Off" or "Room Off" command on the remote would be helpful.

Westshore,

Thanks for posting a very detailed question that clearly states your question while making it clear you're not questioning the methods or trying to start a flame war. Your Question 1 is something I'd very much like to see answered by the folks at Control4 as well. While I also have no problem with an installer doing the initial install work (although I'm sure I could do much of it myself), the ongoing tweaking is something I definitely want to be able to do on my own.

Jeff

Well, I decided to try and get both of my questions answered. From the discussion I had with Amy in sales, it looks like no to both. Firstly, they don't have pdf versions of the manuals available for download even for customers or dealers. It's all printed materials.

Sidebar: Why do companies continue this practice nowadays? I know Control4 just started shipping product, but you had to have an electronic version of the manual before it was printed, right? There are lots of us who don't bother with printed manuals even if we have them and opt for the pdf version instead. It makes searching for specific words or sections much easier and certainly makes product investigation before the sale much easier to do yourself.

Secondly, they plan on releasing a scaled down (no word on just how scaled down) version of the programming software sometime in the next 6 months. Their warranty requires that install work be done by an authorized dealer and the implication was that ongoing programming, at this time, is also supposed to be done by dealers only. So, I guess DIYers who would like to do what myself and Westshore are interested in will have to wait.

That's unfortunate on both counts. :(

Jeff

Eric,
If you're reading, can you tell me if there's an easy way to turn on just one room at a time? Maybe I just need to program a scene or something, which I haven't gotten to yet. But it seems like an "All Off" or "Room Off" command on the remote would be helpful.

The amp switch functions have to be set up in programming.

Guess I just need to RTFM, huh? :)

Might help. :rolleyes: :)

But that takes all the fun (read frustration) out of it :) It's so much cooler when you think you're a genius for figuring it out without reading it. But alas, I'm not figuring it out, hah!

Did you run the interviewer to set it up? I know the update just came out a couple of days ago with the new drivers.

I tried Interviewer, but it wouldn't let you add the AMP in interviewer, you could only add it through the system design page in Composer. You could only add the Audio Matrix switcher in Interviewer.

Jacksonian,
Don't you need the audio matrix switcher to use the media controller as a music distribution system? I did not realize you could "assign zones" to the amp.

Mr. M.,

Actually, the Amp is suppose to be a matrix switcher as well as a 16 channel amp.

Unfortunately the amp does not have a driver yet to work the matrix switching portion. It now works as a traditional Amp with input 1 outputing to speakers 1, and so on. At this point it looks like the only solution is to get the matrix switcher they sell and an amp from another company.

Joe

I'd like to think they'll have a driver for the amp VERY soon. That was the whole point of it for me, not to have to buy some other Audio Matrix Switcher.

Joe, would you still be able to control the volume of each room if you did the Matrix switcher + 3rd part amp? I guess you could but you'd have to do an IR control from the MC to the 3rd party amp, right?

Brent, that is one of the questions I have asked the people at Control4. Most amps do not have volume controls - that is done at the pre-amp stage. So, I would assume the matrix switcher would be the volume control, but something else may have to be added.

At this point, the amp is fairly useless, but I agree that they probable should have a driver written very shortly!

Joe

You can always do what I did (in my incorrect attempt to setup the amp), use the front panel and assign the inputs. At least that way you can listen to one source in all of your zones for now. I've just been muting the rooms I don't want to use at the moment.

I too hope they get the driver up soon. The amp does seem useless without it indeed.....
I also hope they crank out another handheld remote soon. You know, one that is backlit and actually has a channel up & channel down button! But thats another story......
Mr. M

Hey guys,

The amp shipped beofre we released the new version of software with support.

I beleive the software will be released by months end.

Thanks

Jim

So nothing happened at all on this thread while I was on vacation? I was looking forward to reading all kinds of good stuff! :)

.....and we were all waiting patiently on your to return to bring life back to this thread....


:p

Does anyone know if the dimmer switches require a neutral wire? I've got Control4 equipment and dimmers arriving shortly (hopefully) - but an older house and some switches only have 2 wires.

I'm having the electrician pull neutrals where he can, but some may be inaccessible.

I have not had the opportunity to work with any Control4 products. Actually, i was more or less told I wouldn't have the opportunity. I contacted Control4, when the "buzz" started, about dealer information. A few days later I was contacted by my "rep". I was given the impression that Control4 is not out to set up "small" dealers, and that only the "big dogs" mattered at that time. I use the quotations loosely, as this was an intepretation on my part as to what I was being told. It's unfortunate that, if this is in fact Control4's current gameplan, the small specialist dealer will be unable to offer such a groundbreaking product. If the line is intended to offer control and integration, more affordably, to the "masses", it makes sense to me that smaller dealers in smaller markets could support the line quite well.
As a matter of fact, I'm currently researching lines of products for a proposal for a new construction home. To my knowledge, it would the first home in our immediate market to have such equipment. (Us rural folk are behind the times)
I write this post hoping to make Eric and Jim aware that smaller dealers can make a difference, even if we can't hit major numbers from the start.

Yes they require a neutral.

It is my understanding neutral is not required. Something about autosensing....

Anyone receive the Mini Touchscreen or 3 or 6 button keypads yet?

As far as the switches, do you mean that your house does not have ground as opposed to nuetral? From the directions there are many ways to wire the switches, but as far as doing it without a nuetral, it is probably best to talk with an electrician!

I have a mini-touch screen and like it. I certainly would like to see a wireless hand-held one, but the in-wall one works well. A few minor issues that need to be worked out to make navigating it easier, but overall a very easy screen to use. Right now you can not totally customize the layout, but there are a number of custom button screens that you can create to do any number of things such as all lights off, all on, all music off, turn on tv +dvd +receiver, etc.

Joe

Joe,
Are you able to program in lighting "scenes" rather than just all-on and all-off ?

I have not yet tried scenes and only have 2 switches since I am testing the system to put it in a new house we are building, but from fooling around with the software, it is very, very easy to program almost anything.

So, yes, you can program scenes such as when press button, dim theater lights, turn off hall lights, turn on kitchen lights to 30%, start popcorn machine, whatever you want. The nice thing is that it is all in easy to understand commands such as if this, then do this, and this, and this if this xzy is on, or abc if it is off, etc.

Joe

Thanks Joe .

First of all, thanks to Max, Jacksonian, joemci, and everyone else who is posting on this thread. Like many, I'm waiting to install Control4 in my new home until I hear the good and bad. Luckily, so far it certainly sounds more good than bad.

Back on the 19th, jgist said the new software should be out for the amp by month end. Have you all who have the amp had any luck with this new software?

Old press release I found:

http://www.orbitonline.com/index.cfm/press.release/pr_id/26

jterry1,
Still waiting on the AMP driver.

So there is no way for DIY to get the hardware ?

I just can't see myself taking day of to sit at home and wait for somebody to do something i can do myself and have fun.

So there is no way for DIY to get the hardware ?

I just can't see myself taking day of to sit at home and wait for somebody to do something i can do myself and have fun.
I recommend doing a search. Asked and answered several times. Find a dealer that will sell it to you without installing it. It's not complicated if you have a telephone or E-mail.

jterry1,
Still waiting on the AMP driver.


Run an update the driver is there. You may have to refresh your driver list also.
It does not show up in the interviewer though, I've had to manually enter it.

QQQ - very funny response!

As far as the amp driver, I should have weighed in earlier - the amp can be set up with the controller software right now. The driver that is missing is the one to have it set up in the Interview section and they are missing the on screen instructions to configure the network settings in the composser software. I can help out anyone trying to set up the amp if they need help.

However, at this time, I would recommend not getting the amp, but getting the switcher plus an external amp. One benefit is you can have 16 inputs and 16 rooms switched. As for why I really would choose this over the amp. I can explain to anyone interested - just send me a PM.

As for the switcher, I was told that it also does control volume, which was brought up in a previous question in this thread.

Hope that helps a bit.

Joe

It is my understanding neutral is not required. Something about autosensing....

Neutral IS required.

Max

I have not had the opportunity to work with any Control4 products. Actually, i was more or less told I wouldn't have the opportunity. I contacted Control4, when the "buzz" started, about dealer information. A few days later I was contacted by my "rep". I was given the impression that Control4 is not out to set up "small" dealers, and that only the "big dogs" mattered at that time. I use the quotations loosely, as this was an intepretation on my part as to what I was being told. It's unfortunate that, if this is in fact Control4's current gameplan, the small specialist dealer will be unable to offer such a groundbreaking product. If the line is intended to offer control and integration, more affordably, to the "masses", it makes sense to me that smaller dealers in smaller markets could support the line quite well.
As a matter of fact, I'm currently researching lines of products for a proposal for a new construction home. To my knowledge, it would the first home in our immediate market to have such equipment. (Us rural folk are behind the times)
I write this post hoping to make Eric and Jim aware that smaller dealers can make a difference, even if we can't hit major numbers from the start.

Control4 was very difficult to work with early on. However, we hung in there, and are now a "small dealer" in a rural area making money with Control4. We even have product shipped, installed, and working.

Can the Control4 Wireless Dimmer Switch (http://www.control4.com/cp/20-C4BF809F/index.htm) and Wireless Outlet Dimmer (http://www.control4.com/cp/23-06380337/index.htm) be used independently? Or is some sort of master controller necessary before any of the Control4 products can be used?

For instance, I have a single floorlamp that I'd like to control with a dimmer switch ... would just the switch and outlet components suffice? If so, what kind of wiring would need to be run to the switch ... would a single Romex cable providing line power suffice?

(Sorry in advance for the n00b query .... I checked the site and read the literature, but didn't see this addressed - couldn't find any of the product's manuals online, either?)

I've been waiting for a couple months to get my Control4 stuff - anyone know what's causing the long lead time?

I've ordered the Media Controller, dimmers, mini-touch pads and thermostats.

I wanted to thank everyone for all the great posts on this thread and this site in general. I am currently having an old house rehabbed and restored and was about to select a firm for whole house audio, home theater and home automation. I was leaning towards selecting a Crestron based system. Though after seeing a friend's Sonos system implemented throughout his house, it gave me great pause. I can afford a full Crestron implementation but seeing Sonos made me question the price/value of Crestron and also the technology backbone. I started searching for other alternatives (Sonos on steroids that can handle audio and a mix of other home automation) and that is when I stumbled across this web site and also across Control4 and Netstreams.

If this was a couple of years in the future, this might be a lot easier to decide but I am faced with a decision given that I have open walls and need to proceed with the wiring now but ultimate implementation is over the next 6 months. I am not trying to do this myself. I firmly believe in the value added of a great professional. Given the current flux in the industry, I would love some guidance. I have one generic question and many specific questions on Control4.

The generic question is what would you do? Use one of the new technologies Control4 or Netstreams or stick with existing? If this question is not appropriate for this thread then please ignore but I would love help with the specific questions below on Control4.

The Control4 specific questions:

1) What products are now out? When are the others expected?

2) Since I have not been able to see the product, what is the build quality?

The build quality seems very good for most of the components and the control panels

3) From a straight audio viewpoint, what is the sound quality?

At a demo, the system sound quality was good and should handle most whole house audio needs. The ability to connect digitally to another amp for demanding situations should be able to drive the level of sound quality desired


4) Would you recommend, using Control4 for Home Automation but still doing a separate home theater? Is Control4 only 2 channel?

The system has the flexibility to handle HT either way and still keep integrated into the overall system

5) What data is supported? MP3 and WAV? at what compressions for MP3? Will Control4 add AAC and others?

MP3 and uncompressed data are both handled currently. Other compression types are being worked on


6) I like the functionality listed and the price point of the Media Center but is the Media Center the only server supported? Is NAS supported with a Media Center? Can you back up the Media Center? Will NAS or other media servers be supported in the future? Can you hook up several Media Centers one system? How does the interface handle this? Does it show you one combined list of songs etc?

The Media Center appears to be both a processor and server. Very important - additional storage needs can be addressed by NAS which is fully supported by the Media Center. Also, all music is accessible by one unified interface and with multiple streaming. This should allow very low cost overall storage with high level of functionality.


7) What is the underlying operating system of the processors? (Is it linux like Sonos?)

Yes, Linux

8) Are there more screen shots? (like the song selection etc so that one can get a much better idea of the quality of the interface)

Actual screens have an overall good design and feel. They are also able to be customized

9) Given the IP technology, why is their a multichannel amp and other items that are typical of centralized implementation?

The system can be configured in a head/home run fashion like most Celestron etc.. are configured or in a fully distributed ethernet method like Nestreams or a combination. This flexibility can help fit with existing wiring or situation.

10) Can the distributed amps be put in the wall?

No it did not appear possible but future speakers might have direct amps

11) Does Control4 have the ability to use internet radio?

Not yet

12) Do you have a pc or mac or even browser interface similar to your control panels?

Coming out soon for both pc and mac.

13) How easy is it to add other functions later?

very easy

14) What is the proper way to wire for Control4? I like the wireless mesh network but do like the idea of putting in a strong wired backbone now since the walls are all open.

Depends on setup - see question 9

15) Many zones are great. I could see having 25 but is it easy to group and subgroup to be able to handle well. For example, 1st floor contains kitchen, sunroom, dining room, living room and music room. Second, what limits the number of zones in the system? For example, X piece of hardware is needed for every 8 zones.

Don't know yet - does anyone else?

16) I saw something about 10/100 for the network? Does Control4 work on a 1000 T network?

yes and yes. It is 10/100 and would work on a 1000

17) I assume that Control4 just plugs into the house ethernet network?

yes

18) Are the wired devices, also part of the wirless network? (i.e. do the wired pieces add to the mesh network?) For example, if you have a long wired connection to the garage and then want some wireless in the apartment above the garage, would that work?)

The wired speaker points are not but the wired control panels do

19) Is it easy to add a special amp or preamp for special spots for higher fidelity?

Very easy

20) Do people like the system?

Now that I have seen it live, I liked it a lot. I also liked the attitude of the folks at Control4. They have a great initial product but they are not sitting still but are working hard to further enhance. It seems that you could argue any one technical aspect but the overall package and price makes for a winning combination.

21) How is the synching? Sonos' seemed very good and I have read that Netstreams is superior? How is Control4's with several zones?

Very good synching

22) How can the HT Receiver be 7.1 if Control4 is limited to 2 channels?

it is but another HT receiver could be used and integrated if desired

23) What concerns would you have for using Control4?

Thanks in advance
Jim

If audio is controlled by Control4 and the network goes down then no audio. What happens if lights, hvac and sprinklers are controlled by Control4 and the network goes down. I would assume that the phyiscal light switches overrides? What does happen? What is an appropriate backup for each function?

If the network goes down then you would not have audio but the light switches would work, hvac and security would work manually. You would only lose the ability to control from the home automation center

Can the Control4 Wireless Dimmer Switch (http://www.control4.com/cp/20-C4BF809F/index.htm) and Wireless Outlet Dimmer (http://www.control4.com/cp/23-06380337/index.htm) be used independently? Or is some sort of master controller necessary before any of the Control4 products can be used?

For instance, I have a single floorlamp that I'd like to control with a dimmer switch ... would just the switch and outlet components suffice? If so, what kind of wiring would need to be run to the switch ... would a single Romex cable providing line power suffice?


No, I don't believe so. The Dimmer controls a load directly. Think of it as a regular switch that can be activated remotely.

To do what you want, you would need a controller (http://control4.com/products/components/controllers.htm), like the Media Controller, or the HomeTheater controller as the master 'brain'. You'd need the outlet dimmer for the floor lamp. And you'd need some way the trigger the on/off/dim/brighten event -- either the remote control (http://control4.com/cp/34-AF53B11E/index.htm), or a keypad (http://control4.com/products/components/keypads.htm) mounted on the wall, or a touch screen.

Obviously, this is quite a chunk of change for a single floor lamp. But if you want to do the whole house, it's a great system. The dimmers are great, btw.

Max

However, we hung in there, and are now a "small dealer" in a rural area making money with Control4. We even have product shipped, installed, and working.


HoofHouse, can you describe your customers' installations? What C4 products were used, how well it integrated with non-C4 devices, etc.

Thx,
Max

No, I don't believe so. The Dimmer controls a load directly. Think of it as a regular switch that can be activated remotely.

To do what you want, you would need a controller (http://control4.com/products/components/controllers.htm), like the Media Controller, or the HomeTheater controller as the master 'brain'. You'd need the outlet dimmer for the floor lamp. And you'd need some way the trigger the on/off/dim/brighten event -- either the remote control (http://control4.com/cp/34-AF53B11E/index.htm), or a keypad (http://control4.com/products/components/keypads.htm) mounted on the wall, or a touch screen.

Obviously, this is quite a chunk of change for a single floor lamp. But if you want to do the whole house, it's a great system. The dimmers are great, btw.

Max
Thanks for the info, Max ... then I'm very confused ... just how *is* the Wireless Dimmer Switch used? (http://www.control4.com/cp/20-C4BF809F/index.htm)

Oh, wait ... ok, I thikn I may understand what you're saying? The wireless dimmer switch is wireless in that the *controller* can control it ... the light it's dimming is hard-wired in?

Oh, wait ... ok, I thikn I may understand what you're saying? The wireless dimmer switch is wireless in that the *controller* can control it ... the light it's dimming is hard-wired in?

you are correct, wireless electricity is not quite here yet... :D

LOL! Congratulations read99, you've answered your own questions .
Welcome to the forum.

you are correct, wireless electricity is not quite here yet... :D
Heh...cute ;)

Just to clarify ... so when I'd first read the literature on the wireless dimmer switch + wireless dimmer outlet, I assumed that they interacted directly - that is, the switch (presumably powered via line voltage to the gangbox) sent a wireless signal to the dimmer outlet (plugged in to outlet), which in turn controlled the light connected to it.

Ach ... that's what I need for one specific application - wondering if anyone knows if such a product exists?

You can do that with the two items from Control 4. You can actually detach the load (in software) from the switch on the wall and then use it to control the receptacle dimmer that's plugged into the wall. You could also buy a Control 4 2-button keypad that looks identical to the Control 4 dimmers/switches and control the receptacle dimmer that way as well. The difference in the 2-button keypad from an actual dimmer is that it has no connections for controlling a hard-wired load directly. So, it can only control other items where as the dimmers can control the attached load or another item you specify (like the receptacle dimmer.)

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Brent,
Can the regular dimmers be programmed so that they initiate a scene ?

You can program the top and bottom button to do anything you want.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

You can do that with the two items from Control 4. You can actually detach the load (in software) from the switch on the wall and then use it to control the receptacle dimmer that's plugged into the wall. You could also buy a Control 4 2-button keypad that looks identical to the Control 4 dimmers/switches and control the receptacle dimmer that way as well. The difference in the 2-button keypad from an actual dimmer is that it has no connections for controlling a hard-wired load directly. So, it can only control other items where as the dimmers can control the attached load or another item you specify (like the receptacle dimmer.)

Brent Huskins
Media Design
Ok...but I presume one would still need a central controller to do this, right? Or can the switch/dimmer outlet be used independently? As Max had indicated, investing in a controller is quite a hefty proposition, just to control a single floorlamp ;)

Netarc, I'm pretty certain you still need a controller for this. It's the component that allows you to program the various devices.

If you're just doing a floorlamp, consider something like (gasp!) X10. (Though personally, I hate, Hate, HATE X10, but I've posted enough about that in other threads.)

If you have any inclination of automating more in the future, give Control4 another look.

Does anyone have details on DVD changers that are supported "out of the box" by the Media Controller?

I've heard that the Sony 777 will work but not sure about the 985. I'm sure any could be programmed, but since I haven't purchased yet - I'd like to get whatever works.

Sony DVP-CX985V 400 Disc DVD/CD/SACD Mega Changer
Sony DVP-CX777ES 400-disc changer

Thanks!

Yes, you need the controller. The smallest one retails for $599, but is capable of a ton more than just lighting control - which it does incredibly I might add.

As for the DVD changer, the 777 is the best one to use since it has 2 way serial control. The 985 does not have a serial port, so you can not do things like automatic cataloging of movies. The auto catalog feature is fairly cool in that it searches the database and creates a list of all movies in your changer and knows the location.

If you want to go less expensive and don't need the automatic cataloging of movies, then you can use any cd changer and simply enter them by hand to create a catalog of movies - actually you just enter the fisrt few words and it searches the AMG database and gives you all the titles that match with the cover art and movie notes.

Either way it is fairly cool, but the 777 is the easiest way to go.

Joe

The bad news about the 777 is that it's going away. Sony has already removed it from their website and many of my distributors are already out of them. Supposedly a new replacement is coming that incorporates HDMI and maintains the RS232 control, but it's yet to hit the market. Get a 777 while you can!

Brent Huskins
Media Design

You could also buy a Control 4 2-button keypad that looks identical to the Control 4 dimmers/switches and control the receptacle dimmer that way as well. The difference in the 2-button keypad from an actual dimmer is that it has no connections for controlling a hard-wired load directly. So, it can only control other items where as the dimmers can control the attached load or another item you specify (like the receptacle dimmer.)


Does the wireless 3/6 button keypad require any type of power or wiring at all?

I would presume something.

R_Willis, I believe you have to have power running to the wireless keypad. I think you can just tap the powerline from an adjacent switch. Don't know if you and do POE for the wireless keypads.

Is anyone using the media controller and remote to control all aspects of theater such as lights, dvd, tivo, plasma, receiver...

I need to control all these components but don't think the C4 remote can handle the task. The other alternative is to use something like the MX-850 with the RF extender to control all the components plus the media controller (mp3 plus lights). Are the IR codes out yet for the C4 media controller?

Why don't you think the C4 remote can handle the task?

Is anyone using the media controller and remote to control all aspects of theater such as lights, dvd, tivo, plasma, receiver...

I need to control all these components but don't think the C4 remote can handle the task. The other alternative is to use something like the MX-850 with the RF extender to control all the components plus the media controller (mp3 plus lights). Are the IR codes out yet for the C4 media controller?

This is exactly what is designed to do and more...

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Is anyone using the media controller and remote to control all aspects of theater such as lights, dvd, tivo, plasma, receiver...


I plan to, yes. That's the whole point of C4. It can control the above plus whole house audio, climate, etc.

Max

Is the simplest controller (HT controller) out in the market yet. Any experiences using it. I am told it retails for $599 (or is it 699), so that would be a great way to start using the system.

I saw that that it has very few relays and IR controls. Are the expander sets available as well (and indicative pricing?).

Thanks a ton.

Yes, it should be shipping already. It is $599. Relay and contact extenders are $179 for each box - you can see them on the web site.

A great way to start, and you can add a external hard drive to store media.

Joe

Couple questions I've had, that I want to ask:

1. Thermostat, is it backlit?

2. AMP-16 (AVM-16A1-B) Can this amp handle 6 sources and 6 zones? (looks to be able to handle 8), but I remember somebody saying something about only switching between 3 analog sources. Can this amp handle playing all 6 zones with 6 different sources at one time? Systems like the Russound, Channel Plus, Niles all have keypads that go with zones. Say your house/system is using 3 or 4 mini touch screens. Can I control any of the 6-8 speaker zones from any of the touch screens, or do you have to have a dedicated touchscreen kinda like in the other systems? (hope I made that somewhat clear)

3. Any plans for Control4 to add silver finishes as an option the major/main components?

4. Quality of the Home Theater Receiver Controller? Good sound? Digital amp right? I know a lot of people say that digital amps (referring to reading I've done on Sony's new 3000ES+ receivers) have a slightly different sound. Also, any plans to add DVI and/or HDMI support to this piece.

5. Mini-Touch screens, thermostats, 3/6 button keypads, dimmers? Which require a hard-wire power wire? (just dimmers?) Which require just a CAT5e wire? The CAT5e wire is just for POE right, none of them plug in to the controllers right, as everything is communicated wirelessly?

Thanks, still doing my research and working on completing my basement theater before taking the plunge into this head first!

I'm still waiting on my Home Theater Controller and Thermostat. I'll post as soon as I have them.

Hey jacksonian, did you get your receiver yet? Are you controlling everything with the media controller and remote?

I just received my receiver (4806) and get the plasma next week (5050). All my gear (HD Tivo and Sony DVD changer) will be going inside some built in cabinets so I need to get the remote setup asap. If the C4 remote works well then there is no need to get either an IR repeater or RF system for control. Just looking for someone else's experience.

Question - can wireless dimmer control low-voltage fixtures ?
Like monorail lights. Something with transformer.

yes

Brent Huskins
Media Design

yes



This is to my question about low voltage lights ?

You positive about this one ? Because only other solution is 100$ lutron dimmer. So instead of buying Lutron's dimmers i can but Control4 at the the price and have wireless control ?

Read the 2nd page of this (http://www.control4.com/documents/briefs/Control4-WirelessDimmer.pdf).

As long as you meet those requirements for Magnetic or Electronic Low Voltage, you'll be fine.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

If you want to be for sure, post a link to the exact rail system you've got and I'll check it out.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

If you want to be for sure, post a link to the exact rail system you've got and I'll check it out.


So far i got "Made in China" 5 lights system from home depot with wall mountable transformer.

and one system around fireplace:
5 lights: http://ylighting.com/model1137.html
and transformer:
http://ylighting.com/entran12out14.html

and i plan to install 2 systems like this:
http://ylighting.com/lm-sk-250e.html

Ifi can get the same functionally out of Control4 as with 100$ Lutron - it becomes no brainier - to get Control4 and start building the system.

My new plan is to buy one dimmer. If it works, buy more dimmers and remote panel. and if I'll be happy with it - may be start adding up other components.

I would always suggest using magnetic transformers is they are available as an option versus using electronic transformers. Electronic transformers can be very temperamental (with or without dimming.) That being said, Control 4 can work with both. They aren't real clear on the load information. You would want to have a 75% load or higher on the transformer.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Couple questions I've had, that I want to ask:

1. Thermostat, is it backlit?


Yes, according to http://control4.com/cp/46-65194D73/index.htm.


5. Mini-Touch screens, thermostats, 3/6 button keypads, dimmers? Which require a hard-wire power wire? (just dimmers?) Which require just a CAT5e wire? The CAT5e wire is just for POE right, none of them plug in to the controllers right, as everything is communicated wirelessly?


For *control*, you can either use wireless (ZigBee) OR ethernet (cat 5).

Here's my understanding: If it's a wireless device, then it needs 120V power. If it's an ethernet device, then it can use POE. Take a look at specifications for each device, they list power requirements.

Is it true that you can only get three streams from the media controller. Since the speaker points are ip are they able to get their own stream withou counting towards the three analog outs. I was under the impression that the media controller would stream to the matrix switcher over ethernet, but apparently you have to connect three pairs of audio cables between the media controller and matrix switch. So if i wanted more streams could I use speaker points connected to additional matrix switch inputs or does the media controller max out at three?

The IP streams don't count toward the total of analog outputs. You can add more analog outputs with speaker points, minitouch keypads, home theater controllers and possibly a music point (postponed) if they end up bringing it out or something similar as a replacement to the prototype.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

What are the options for local sources? Is there an "audio point" like in Netstreams?

You can use the speaker point, or the minitouch to input a local source - you could actually just extend the rca jacks off of the back of the minitouch over to your gear with a wall jack and connect local gear that way. The good news is that you don't need an additional audio point type device for that specific purpose.

Also, if you want to control the local device you can add the IR/serial extender which works via Zigbee to control a device from anywhere within the system.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

The IP streams don't count toward the total of analog outputs. You can add more analog outputs with speaker points, minitouch keypads, home theater controllers and possibly a music point (postponed) if they end up bringing it out or something similar as a replacement to the prototype.

Brent Huskins
Media Design


It seems That they would integrate this into their matrix switch and amp. Also the HTRC only has one alalog output for zone2. If I go with that I would have to add speaker point for each additional zone even though they are home run.

8 Ethernet speakerpoints would retail for $3200. Multi cahnnel amp plus matrix switcher is 3290 retail and I would only get three zones. Correct? I would also get 8 analog inputs for tuner/xm/etc. Is there a reason not to do it this way other than amplifier power.

Amp and switch plus 5 speakerpoints retails for $5200. What advantage does this give me over using just the speakerpoints. I'm not worried about the priceI'm just trying to figure out the best way to design the system. It seems like they would of made the 16 channel amp to be basically 8 speakerpoints in a box.

I'm trying to understand how the AMP16/Matrix Switch work also. Not sure I understand. I already have seven zones of speakers hardwired down into my basement where my main Control4 stuff would be located. My questions from earlier in the thread:

2. AMP-16 (AVM-16A1-B) Can this amp handle 6 sources and 6 zones? (looks to be able to handle 8), but I remember somebody saying something about only switching between 3 analog sources. Can this amp (AVM-16A1-B) handle playing all 6 (or 8)zones with 6 (or 8) different sources at one time? Say I want to listen to Am/Fm in the kitchen, sat in the bedroom, vcr in the front porch, and CD on the back porch all at once? Systems like the Russound, Channel Plus, Niles all have keypads that go with zones. Say your house/system is using 3 or 4 mini touch screens. Can I control any of the 6-8 speaker zones from any of the touch screens, or do you have to have a dedicated touchscreen for each set of speakers kinda like in the other systems? (hope I made that somewhat clear). I'd like to switch over to Control4 to make everything simple, but if need be, I'll just stick with my current whole-house audio system.


It seems That they would integrate this into their matrix switch and amp. Also the HTRC only has one alalog output for zone2. If I go with that I would have to add speaker point for each additional zone even though they are home run.

8 Ethernet speakerpoints would retail for $3200. Multi cahnnel amp plus matrix switcher is 3290 retail and I would only get three zones. Correct? I would also get 8 analog inputs for tuner/xm/etc. Is there a reason not to do it this way other than amplifier power.

Amp and switch plus 5 speakerpoints retails for $5200. What advantage does this give me over using just the speakerpoints. I'm not worried about the priceI'm just trying to figure out the best way to design the system. It seems like they would of made the 16 channel amp to be basically 8 speakerpoints in a box.

I'm trying to understand how the AMP16/Matrix Switch work also. Not sure I understand. I already have seven zones of speakers hardwired down into my basement where my main Control4 stuff would be located. My questions from earlier in the thread:

2. AMP-16 (AVM-16A1-B) Can this amp handle 6 sources and 6 zones? (looks to be able to handle 8), but I remember somebody saying something about only switching between 3 analog sources. Can this amp (AVM-16A1-B) handle playing all 6 (or 8)zones with 6 (or 8) different sources at one time? Say I want to listen to Am/Fm in the kitchen, sat in the bedroom, vcr in the front porch, and CD on the back porch all at once? Systems like the Russound, Channel Plus, Niles all have keypads that go with zones. Say your house/system is using 3 or 4 mini touch screens. Can I control any of the 6-8 speaker zones from any of the touch screens, or do you have to have a dedicated touchscreen for each set of speakers kinda like in the other systems? (hope I made that somewhat clear). I'd like to switch over to Control4 to make everything simple, but if need be, I'll just stick with my current whole-house audio system.


Any control can select any room. They can also be linked together to play the sam thing in multiple zones.

2. AMP-16 (AVM-16A1-B) Can this amp handle 6 sources and 6 zones? (looks to be able to handle 8), but I remember somebody saying something about only switching between 3 analog sources.

The confusion is coming between the capabilities of the AMP vs. the Media Controller. The AMP is essentially an 8x8 switcher + power supply for the 8 zones of audio. The MC only has 3 analog outputs for the music stored on its hard drive. So if you're only using hard wired speakers from your AMP, then you can only listen to at most 3 different analog streams of music from the media controller. BUT, you can always use a Speaker Point, Home Theater Controller, or Music Point (if it comes out) to receive a digital stream of music, and that's not counting the options Brent mentioned above with the wall pad.


Can this amp (AVM-16A1-B) handle playing all 6 (or 8)zones with 6 (or 8) different sources at one time? Say I want to listen to Am/Fm in the kitchen, sat in the bedroom, vcr in the front porch, and CD on the back porch all at once?
I believe so. You could use 3 of the inputs connected to the Media Controller for 3 different music streams, then use the other 5 inputs for your CD, VCR, Sat.

Systems like the Russound, Channel Plus, Niles all have keypads that go with zones. Say your house/system is using 3 or 4 mini touch screens. Can I control any of the 6-8 speaker zones from any of the touch screens

Yes.

or do you have to have a dedicated touchscreen for each set of speakers kinda like in the other systems?
No. You can control anything in any room with any remote or touchscreen.

Brent or anyone else, please correct me if I'm wrong on any of this.

It seems That they would integrate this into their matrix switch and amp. Also the HTRC only has one alalog output for zone2. If I go with that I would have to add speaker point for each additional zone even though they are home run.

8 Ethernet speakerpoints would retail for $3200. Multi cahnnel amp plus matrix switcher is 3290 retail and I would only get three zones. Correct? I would also get 8 analog inputs for tuner/xm/etc. Is there a reason not to do it this way other than amplifier power.

Amp and switch plus 5 speakerpoints retails for $5200. What advantage does this give me over using just the speakerpoints. I'm not worried about the priceI'm just trying to figure out the best way to design the system. It seems like they would of made the 16 channel amp to be basically 8 speakerpoints in a box.

jayson,
I'm not following what your setup is and what you're trying to do. I'm running 8 zones of audio hard wired. Then I'm going to add a Home Theater Controller (not the receiver) in my theater room so that I'll have a 9th audio zone. And that would be a digital stream not limited to the 3 analog streams from the media controller.

Man, you guys make this a whole lot more difficult than it has to be. Those with so many questions, I would suggest you visit a local dealer that sells the product and go through it with them as the questions here are simply getting out of hand, leading to some mixed up answers. Most are fairly simple questions as well that have been answered in the thread elsewhere, or could have been figured out by simply reading the cut sheets on the C4 web site.

I'll touch on one - the Media Controller can have seven output streams for the digital music. That is really the only hard number limited figure in the whole system. There are 3 analog outputs. The other 4 streams are either eithernet or wireless. You can get these streams from a variety of places - speaker point, mini touchscreen, audio point, and I think the home theater controller (not 100% sure on that though). They had to stop the number somewhere and I assume only had 3 outputs on the media controller for cost reasons. I think the 7 streams are enough, as I certainly know I will never have more that 7 people living in my house at any one time! I mean, even if you did, what are the chances that they would all want to listen to a different digital music source at the same time?

Joe

I agree with Joe. I read every Control4 thread from top to bottom and read every page of their website before I started asking questions here. I'll be glad to help anyone if they're stuck, but do your research first, otherwise everyone's going to get tired of answering the same questions over and over.

All,

I just posted diagrams of sample Control4 configuration for distributed audio, lighting and home theater. These are at the end of the first post in the thread. Go look at them. They're *very* useful. I learned a lot just by looking at the pictures, and I already have some of the gear.

Have fun,
Max

One note...the lighting only diagrams don't show a processor and realize that one is needed to make it work.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Thx Brent. I just updated notes by the links to the lighting diagrams.

On the Zigbee wireless lighting diagram, what do they mean by High/Low Zigbee signal? Is this related to the distance between devices?

It seems That they would integrate this into their matrix switch and amp.

Although a great add on it would likely increase the cost substantially. The aim of the switch is for traditionally wired environments.

Also the HTRC only has one alalog output for zone2. If I go with that I would have to add speaker point for each additional zone even though they are home run.

You could also use mini touch panels to output other streams off the media server portion of the HTRC...it's a little early to tell though because the HTRC isn't due out until 8/31/

8 Ethernet speakerpoints would retail for $3200. Multi cahnnel amp plus matrix switcher is 3290 retail and I would only get three zones. Correct? I would also get 8 analog inputs for tuner/xm/etc. Is there a reason not to do it this way other than amplifier power.

Amp and switch plus 5 speakerpoints retails for $5200. What advantage does this give me over using just the speakerpoints. I'm not worried about the priceI'm just trying to figure out the best way to design the system. It seems like they would of made the 16 channel amp to be basically 8 speakerpoints in a box.

It sounds like you need some system design help...feel free to contact me via PM for help.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

I believe so. You could use 3 of the inputs connected to the Media Controller for 3 different music streams, then use the other 5 inputs for your CD, VCR, Sat.

Brent or anyone else, please correct me if I'm wrong on any of this.

This is correct.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Thx Brent. I just updated notes by the links to the lighting diagrams.

On the Zigbee wireless lighting diagram, what do they mean by High/Low Zigbee signal? Is this related to the distance between devices?

That's really just showing how eloquent zigbee really is. All devices are talking to each other and depending on the distance and other surrounding devices zigbee will dictate the method. That diagram shows how zigbee can self-repair as one device fails without crashing the system. When the zigbee signal can be routed around a bad device that falls off the system it becomes quite powerful. It's definitely one of its strong features as a wireless protocol.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Brent,

Are there any advantages/disadvantages to using the Ethernet touchscreens (or Speakerpoints)
versus the Wi-Fi ? I have the Cat5 already in place, I'm just wondering if the Wi-Fi adds any functionality or strength to the network .

AJF, no there is no advantage to using the Wifi ones over ethernet. They are wifi, not zigbee, so they do not help the zigbee network. The ethernet ones are cheaper and since you have the wires in place, they would be the prefered unit.

Also, you do not need to take 110V power up to it as with the wifi ones. You simply need a POE injector, which runs $50 from them, but there are a variety of options for a POE intjector if you have more than one touch screen hooked up that will lower the cost per unit.

Joe

One more question on Lightning:
For example Me and my neighbor set up C4 in our houses. What should i do to stop my neighbor from controlling my lights wirelesly with his C4 equipment ?

Thanks Joe . I knew there was a good reason for all that Cat5 wire in my house :). Actually, right now I'm using it mostly for my Niles system, but I would be replacing those keypads with C4 touchscreens .
The LCD keypads look like a great option in some locations, but on their website, it looks like those are wireless only and would require line voltage . Is that correct?

AJF, from what I understand, they originally were only wireless, but there were a decent number of requests for wired ones, so I am pretty sure they are coming out with ethernet versions of the lcd keypad shortly.

Joe

Great, I think it's a steal at the price . The simple Niles keypads cost about the same .

The Wireless LCDs will be out 1st (scheduled 8/31/05 release) and possibly a wired version later - no date set though so it could be a while. The wireless LCD's do work on Zigbee though and NOT on WiFi ethernet to clarify. They require 110v.

As far as lighting goes the network is secure from controlling neighbors houses and vice versa. When the dimmers are linked to a processor they can't be controlled by another processor. Your neighbor would have to be initializing dimmers at the same time you are to create a problem (that could still be easily fixed.)

Brent Huskins
Media Design

I'm trying to decide which controller I should get so I can start to get a good feel for Control4's products. I'm debating between the $599 Home Theater Controller and the $1499 Media Controller. The Home Theater Controller seems to do a lot but from what I've seen, it doesn't offer support for WiFi and would have to be wired. I also have conflicting on the info for the Media Controller. One of the brochures I read indicated it supports 802.11b while another indicated 802.11g. Anyone know which is correct?

My main objective is to manage my media an do so w/ the best bang for my buck. I figured w/ the HTC I could mount the drives from my networked PCs and still have access to all my MP3s and such. Any words of wisdom on this would be much appreciated.

The 80gb hard drive in the media controller is nice but between my PCs, I have nearly a terabyte of storage so I don't want to pay an extra $900 just for the drive.

TIA!

The Wifi portion is an external Wifi router. Your choice b,g. This is the same same for any controller.

Hey Brent, question about the color LCD touchpad. My new house has an "open" layout so many zones open to each other and are very close. Can I install just one touchpad in a central location and control the source and volume for each of the zones (kitchen, formal dining, powder room, deck)? This would save me a ton of money compared to having keypads with volume control in each zone as well as reduce wall clutter. I think the answer is yes based on my experience with the media controller but I just wanted to confirm.

Stash, yes, you can control any room from one keypad. I have the mini touch panel and have been able to easily play songs, change volume, etc. in other rooms.

Has anyone created their own drivers yet? I know there are instructions on how to do this, just looking for real world feedback. I am going to create some drivers for the Denon AVR 4806 and the Pioneer PDP 5050HD. It sure would be nice if C4 would update its online driver database with current products.

Hey Brent, question about the color LCD touchpad. My new house has an "open" layout so many zones open to each other and are very close. Can I install just one touchpad in a central location and control the source and volume for each of the zones (kitchen, formal dining, powder room, deck)? This would save me a ton of money compared to having keypads with volume control in each zone as well as reduce wall clutter. I think the answer is yes based on my experience with the media controller but I just wanted to confirm.


You might think about putting 3 button keypads in some of the rooms so you don't always have to go to the touch screen to change the volume of the room your in.

With the three buttons: one could be vol up, two vol down, three room on/off

Question about Control4 Wireless Thermostat

My current thermostat is somewhat intelligent - it know how long it takes to cool\heat my house. So, if i want my house to be at 70 at 6:00PM - it will know when to start AC to get to cool house to 70 at 6:00PM.

Can Contol4's thermostat do this ?

I'm planning a 6-zone wired distributed audio setup, similar to http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0005-04.htm. In my case, I won't use any speaker points or audio points, all speaker wires will be homerun. I already have a B&K multi-channel amp instead of the C4 amp; I already have the MC and will get the Matrix Switch.

My question is -- how is volume controlled in individual zones? Which component is responsible for doing that? If I'm in zone 2, and hit up volume on the remote, which device interprets the command and raises the volume? Is it the Matrix Switch? I read the Matrix Switch manual and didn't see any discussion about this.

Thx,
Max

Question about Control4 Wireless Thermostat

My current thermostat is somewhat intelligent - it know how long it takes to cool\heat my house. So, if i want my house to be at 70 at 6:00PM - it will know when to start AC to get to cool house to 70 at 6:00PM.

Can Contol4's thermostat do this ?

You could program this logic...

Also, Control 4 is working on other HVAC integration to support non-C4 thermostats. What brand do you currently have?

Brent Huskins
Media Design

I'm planning a 6-zone wired distributed audio setup, similar to http://www.control4.com/documents/technotes/0005-04.htm. In my case, I won't use any speaker points or audio points, all speaker wires will be homerun. I already have a B&K multi-channel amp instead of the C4 amp; I already have the MC and will get the Matrix Switch.

My question is -- how is volume controlled in individual zones? Which component is responsible for doing that? If I'm in zone 2, and hit up volume on the remote, which device interprets the command and raises the volume? Is it the Matrix Switch? I read the Matrix Switch manual and didn't see any discussion about this.

Thx,
Max

The Matrix Switch physically manipulates the volume, balance and tone. The Controller tells it to do it at the time you want it to do it. It takes both devices to accomplish the task.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

You could program this logic...

Also, Control 4 is working on other HVAC integration to support non-C4 thermostats. What brand do you currently have?

Brent Huskins
Media Design

So, is it the matter of flipping "Bring house to programmed temperature at programmed time" vs "Start heating\colling at programmed time" switch ?

I currently got LUX, i believe model 9000

http://www.luxproducts.com/thermostats/tx9000.htm

The Matrix Switch physically manipulates the volume, balance and tone. The Controller tells it to do it at the time you want it to do it. It takes both devices to accomplish the task.

Brent,
Can the MC also do this on it's own if you aren't using the Matrix Switcher ? Also, have you heard anything more about the Video Switch that was mentioned by Eric ? Will it do video AND audio ?

Brent,
Can the MC also do this on it's own if you aren't using the Matrix Switcher ? Also, have you heard anything more about the Video Switch that was mentioned by Eric ? Will it do video AND audio ?

The MC or HTC won't physically do it on it's own. It needs to control the switch or a C4 amp (or a receiver as well - basically any device with built-in volume, even a TV). If you're using speaker points the MC or HTC controls the speaker point directly.

I would expect them to offer a Video only switch to complement the Audio Switch. I wouldn't doubt them to offer an A/V switch later down the road, but haven't heard any direct discussions of that. C4's philosophy is to offer flexibility, 2 separate devices makes more sense in accomplishing that as long as their priced right. So far so good on the pricing.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

So, is it the matter of flipping "Bring house to programmed temperature at programmed time" vs "Start heating\colling at programmed time" switch ?

I currently got LUX, i believe model 9000

http://www.luxproducts.com/thermostats/tx9000.htm


If you're talking about daily automation, it could be programmed to start the AC ahead of when you want it to cool to a certain set point so that at a given time it reaches that set point. Basically the same thing can be accomplished as your current unit; it just has to be approached differently. You could program it based on how may degrees the current temperature is above the desired set point and to start the routine so many minutes early per degree of drop needed.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Thanks Brent .

You could program it based on how may degrees the current temperature is above the desired set point and to start the routine so many minutes early per degree of drop needed.



How do i program it ? Do i need the special software from Control 4 that i wouldn't be able to get or can i use menus\buttons on the thermostat itself ?

You would use the composer software.

and create a scheduling agent...

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Jim and Eric, when will C4 be offering an updated remote. I have the media controller up and running but it is impossible to use the remote in dark locations. I have also noticed that there is a 2-3 sec lag from when you press a button until the action happens. I would be great to see you offer a remote with backlit keys and a better button config. Other than that the media controller is great (my wife loves it).

It would be nice if you could add some additional drivers to your online database (specifically the Denon 4806 receiver and Pioneer 5050HD plasma...wink, wink).

I also have some product suggestions. It would be nice to have some outdoor rated equipment such as a plug in control for landscape and holiday lights, outdoor keypads and volume controls, and an outdoor remote.

Keep up the good work!

The Pioneer PDP-5050HD is the exact same driver used for the Pioneer PDP-5040HD and 5045HD...use one of them and you'll be golden. The Denon will have to be custom created for the time being...it's too new of a model.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Thanks Brent! Do you think it would a good idea to try to modify the 5805 driver, or just start from scratch.

Also, is there any way to set the media controller to output video in a 16x9 format. Right now I am using the component outs but the image doesn't fill the entire screen.

I also have some product suggestions. It would be nice to have some outdoor rated equipment such as a plug in control for landscape and holiday lights,


Good call. I once suggested this and totally agree.

Also, anyone have an idea if the zigbee network would be strong enough to have switches/dimmers/etc in a detached garage that is ~20ft from the main house?

Thanks. Can't wait to finish my basement and home theater so I can order some stuff from Control4.

The 5805 is likely a good starting point, but it may be more simplified to just create one from scratch.

As far as 16 x 9 goes...it is in 16 x 9 but doesn't stretch to the edges. It's a fixed resolution...likely 480i. I've commented about this to tech and would like to see the ability to stretch and/or resize the image to fit the screen entirely.

If Roku Labs can do it on their $300 High Def Photo Bridge, Control 4 can do it on their $1,500 unit. Granted it may not be that simple, but it sure would be nice. BTW-the Roku's GUI quality is just excellent. The product itself needs work still, but the 720P GUI has razor sharp resolution on my Pioneer plasma. It allows you to select the desired output - 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i, etc. and then allows you to custom trim the edges to make it fit perfectly out to the last pixel. This feature really needs to be looked at from Roku. That's the one thing they've mastered.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

well everybody suggesting new products - i want watter resistant remote - so i can use one in whirlpool tub.

One like this would be great:

http://www.rticorp.com/images/u1_prodpage.jpg

It floats.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

I upgraded Composer to version 1.1 last night, which updated the drivers as well. I didn't see a driver for the C4 Thermostat, do others have it?

The driver for the C4 thermostat has not been released. That's why an agent would have to be used to do it right now along with contact closure or something similar.

The C4 Thermostat will change things substantial as it will have a specific driver designed for it. They are currently planning drivers for Aprilaire, Honeywell and RSC as well.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Max, I don't see the C4 Thermostat driver yet. I think Brent or Eric had said it wasn't ready yet. All I see is the Honeywell Envirazone driver. I'm anxiously waiting for the HTC and thermostat.

You may have already done this, but here's a tip with the Composer update. Make sure you update all the software versions in the Tools -> System Manager. Then update the drivers for your equipment by restoring defaults. I believe with this update you have to delete the Media Controller from your project and then re-add it to your project for the changes to take effect. And last (this is the part that I missed), physically unplug your MC and let it reboot. I kept having audio problems after the new update until I unplugged and rebooted.

On another note, I've ordered a Harmony 880 for the theater. I just really like that interface and it's very easy for my wife. I'm OK with C4 not making a killer HT remote, I think it would be impossible for them to make the best product in every category. I would like to see the C4 remote be a little easier to use in the dark though, and maybe a better button layout.

jacksonian,

I remember reading a while back that the MC can't be directly controlled using IR, but that it would be added in a future update .

Hi all, this is my first post but have been reading the forumns for quit a while now. Was extremely ignorant (still am) with this home automation concept, but extremely interested at the same time as i'm in the proccess of having a new house built. First off i was really leaning towards elan due to the price diff from crestron accomplishing close to the same things. I'm mainly doing doing 8-10 audio souces, home theatre, lighting control, thermostat etc...
My basic question is that with elan they have the paging system througout and the audio distribution, such as audio video door station, video on touchpanels, security camera control and viewing on touch panels and t.v.'s. I know they are completly diff systems, but i'm just trying to figure out the major diffs. Now does anyone know if this is somthing that conftrol 4 will add later, or if maybe it's already in talks. And if so would i basically just need to add RG-6 to the areas i want video distributon. I have read all the control 4 forums i could find, if you know of any other good ones with the info i am looking for please let me know.

Thanks for the help in advance,
X

Hi all, this is my first post but have been reading the forums for quit a while now. Was extremely ignorant (still am) with this home automation concept, but extremely interested at the same time as i'm in the process of having a new house built. First off i was really leaning towards elan due to the price diff from crestron accomplishing close to the same things. I'm mainly doing doing 8-10 audio sources, home theatre, lighting control, thermostat etc...
My basic question is that with elan they have the paging system througout and the audio distribution, such as audio video door station, video on touchpanels, security camera control and viewing on touch panels and t.v.'s. I know they are completely diff systems, but i'm just trying to figure out the major diffs. Now does anyone know if this is something that control 4 will add later, or if maybe it's already in talks. And if so would i basically just need to add RG-6 to the areas i want video distributon. I have read all the control 4 forums i could find, if you know of any other good ones with the info i am looking for please let me know.

Thanks for the help in advance,
X

AJF,
I'm not planning on using the Harmony to do anything with the C4 system. I will just have my Harmony stationed in my theater to control all my theater gear instead of using the Home Theater Controller and C4 remote.

OK guys, I think I am ready to pull the plug so to speak and go with C4. I need a couple of questions answered. Does the composer software run on XP? Can one use an existing PC tablet to run it instead of their touchscreens? Can I run it on a PC? Information on the software is sketchy on their website.

thanks in advance

OK guys, I think I am ready to pull the plug so to speak and go with C4. I need a couple of questions answered. Does the composer software run on XP?
thanks in advance

It is a drag and drop interface.

The Composer software is indeed made to run on Windows XP.

Requires (recommended):

Microsoft's .NET software
500mhz processor or higher
256mb RAM
80 mb Hard Disk space
Video Card Display capable of 1024x768 or higher
keyboard/mouse
TCP/IP-based home network

PabloReiter, just to clarify, the composer software is used to program the system, but does not control the system. You cannot load composer on a tablet PC and then use that PC to control lights, media, HVAC...

Pablo + Stash, yes Composer is only used to program the controller, but they will be coming out with a software version of the Navigator interface, which will run on Windows. I don't see why you could not use that on a Tablet PC instead of a touchscreen.

Thie software should be out by the end of the year and I am told will be available for free for C4 owners.

Joe

and create an scheduling agent...



That agent will be created on the thermostat ? I don't need a PC running 24/7 to support it ?

Could you please explain how drivers for other brand thermostat works ? i understand with C4 thermostat i can do 2 way communication to it using any C4 LCD screen.

How it will work with Honeywell ? How can my C4 touch screen get information from Honeywell on whats current temperature preset ?

My basic question is that with elan they have the paging system througout and the audio distribution, such as audio video door station, video on touchpanels, security camera control and viewing on touch panels and t.v.'s. ... Now does anyone know if this is somthing that conftrol 4 will add later, or if maybe it's already in talks.

While others have asked about paging/intercom and video on touchpanels in this and other threads, I haven't heard anything about these features.


And if so would i basically just need to add RG-6 to the areas i want video distributon. I have read all the control 4 forums i could find, if you know of any other good ones with the info i am looking for please let me know.

There are a few C4 threads on remotecentral, but they're more bitching and less content. ;)

From what i was told at the 4Real Tour the Mini touch screens have a mic and a speaker built in.......but they are not in use yet........I also asked about a phone mute like the Elan Com Controller Eric said there is a modem built into the MC which when enabled could be programed to mute the music when the phone rings............I would like them to come out with a door station for the front door, and waterproof controller. If they can deliver there product i think Control4 will revolutionize this industry.......and for video distribution they don't have a matrix switcher but there are plenty of switchers that are compatible with Control4..

Thanks guys for all the replies.

If I want to start with a simple system of 8-10 dimmers and come on at nite (outdoor lights) and turn off in the morning, and grow into a more complex system, I would need 8-10 dimmers (wireless), a home theater controller and nothing else?

thanks

Thanks guys for all the replies.

If I want to start with a simple system of 8-10 dimmers and come on at nite (outdoor lights) and turn off in the morning, and grow into a more complex system, I would need 8-10 dimmers (wireless), a home theater controller and nothing else?

thanks

i would add a 3 or 6 button keypad to easily change lighting scenes.......but you don't have to

Two questions:

Is there a way to gracefully shutdown the MC? Short of yanking out the power cord, that is.

I'm having problems updating Composer. Help->Check for Upgrades searches for a while, and then comes back with a failure. Has anyone else had this problem? Are there ports on the internet router I need to unblock (I did try running my PC in the DMZ, but no luck). Are there any settings I can tweak? Any other ideas?

Thx,
Max

Hey Max,
1) I don't think there's any other way. Just yank it and plug it back in. I don't think hitting the reset button will do it.

2) What kind of "failure" are you getting? I haven't had any trouble getting updates, but I know Joe did at one time, not sure what his resolution was. There shouldn't be any need to adjust your router settings. As long as you can connect to the web, you should be able to find it. I just downloaded the update without any problem.

All is well.

The Update problem has something to do with my PC, not C4.

I installed Composer on another XP box and it was able to get the update just fine. So I'm good to go. Thanks jacksonian.

Max

Max, I had the same problem as you and still have not been abe to fix it on the original computer. I was told that if you put a very early version of the program on your computer, you would have to fully remove all parts of it manually and then install a newer version for it to work.

I did as you and just installed one of the newer versions on another computer and it updates. An odd work around, but one that only a few of us who had the original software would ever have an issue with.

Joe

It's weird because I had that same early version, but never had any trouble with updates. I guess there was something different about my pc software environment at that time. I just hit "Update Composer" every few days to see if there's anything available. On a side note, I'm fairly impressed with the speed/frequency of the updates.

I've struggled with software issues lately too. The first two times I attempted an update it would never complete. Now I am having issues with all my media showing up multiple times on the mc navigator and remote (only one instance appears in composer). Started the second update this morning and I will try to finish tonight. Thus far I have been updating composer and then going into composer and clicking the update button in system status window. Do I need to reset the MC after this or do a restore defaults (where do I do this)?

On a side note C4 has been updating their device drivers. I now have my 4806 driver. I have been and am still very impressed with their equipment and the software is getting better and better. Now they just need to redesign the remote (or provide IR codes) and get their video output to fill a 16x9 screen.

is the Control4 XM tuner available yet and for how much?
is it possible to integrate Netstreams with C4? i prefer the C4 interface and expandability but prefer the music distribution scheme of Netstreams.

My dealer told me XM tuner is a month out.

Considering that C4 and Netscreams compete in the same space, I don't think they integrate. What about C4 music distribution scheme do you think could be improved?

Max

Stash,
I think your problems with it not finishing may have been a dialog box hidden behind the update window. That's what happened to me and I found mention of it in the update notice. For some odd reason the "finish installation" dialog box would open behind all the other boxes so you couldn't see it.

As for restoring the defaults, go to the System Design view, Items pane, My drivers tab, then right click on your media controller and then click "restore default list". I think you need to do this for any controllers and amps, but I'm not sure about switches, etc...

I also think you should delete and re-add the controller to the project and unplug/reboot it as well.

Has anyone integrated a DVD mega-changer with their C4 system yet ?

I'll post once I get it hooked up. I had a chance to play with a demo unit setup with the 777. It provides a similiar interface as the CD/MP3's. You can browse DVD cover art, make your selection and watch the movie.

Thanks Oregon .

It works great with one of my 777's as well. I've directly compared it to the Escient Fireball DVDM-300 and the Video Request unit...both of which I have. For the money, the Media Controller is definitely the best choice. It makes the original Sony interface looks ridiculous.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

FYI,

For those that have updated to 1.1.1 of the software. Version 1.1.2 will be out in 1 to 2 days...likely by Monday. They wanted to update something in regards to the Home Theater Controller that just shipped. Their updating procedure and notification to dealers has been excellent. They're on the right track.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Brent,
Is your 777 being controlled using RS232 ?
Also, any word on product releases such as the Video Switcher and LCD Keypads?

Video switcher may be last quarter, probibly next year. LCD keypads are slated for 8-31 release.

Thermostat 9-15

Having some C4 hardware/software trouble.

History:

moved into new house and setup c4 media controller
loaded media onto controller
controller identified media and pulled album art
setup and connected media controller...no sound
rebooted everything several time and rechecked all connctions...no sound
reverted to first version of composer software...sound
updated composer software...sound
loaded additional media...no album art
manually did edit and search to pull album art
another software update... double entries for all media
new software release (1.1.1.17)... back to correct media entries...no sound
tried rebooting and updating composer and controller several times...no sound
installed dimmers and switches in a 4 gang box (all wired the same)... only 2 of 4 can be identified on the network (tried manually entering the zigbee address)
did trouble shooting on dimmers, tried the reboot and reset sequence (nothing), dimmers LED lights up and properly turns the lights on/off/dim but won't connect to the network

Anyone have any ideas. The audio has to be software related because it has worked properly in the past. I have no idea about the dimmers. I will triple check the wiring. What might cause the dimmers to light up and control the lights but not connect to the network? Anyone have any ideas about the audio mystery? (I am using the optical out to my receiver)

Note: I am an end user and it is entirely possible all the issues have been caused by me and are not related to C4 hardware or software issues. I am technically proficient, and had the system up and running perfectly last week until the software updates came out (minus the dimmer issues)

TIA for any help.

Hey Stash,
I don't have much to offer other than to say that I did have *some* of the duplicate entries after the previous update. I've downloaded the latest update, but haven't had time to update the Media Controller yet, will do tomorrow or maybe just wait for the newer version by Monday. I haven't had any audio/no audio issues like you're describing, but I'm using the MC to the AMP since the AMP came out. I'm planning to install my dimmers and switch soon so I'll keep you posted if I have any of the same issues.

Stash,

Of the 3 dimmers in my original order, two worked perfectly and one exibited the same problem you describe. It would control the load when used manually, but wouldn't get recognized by the MC. I got it replaced through my dealer and now it all works.

It could be that two of your dimmers need to get replaced. I'm about to order six more dimmers for my family room / ht. I plan to build a test rig and test them when they arrive, before installing in the wall.

Max

Brent,
Is your 777 being controlled using RS232 ?
Also, any word on product releases such as the Video Switcher and LCD Keypads?

Serial control on the 777, yes.

The LCD is scheduled for an 8/31 release at this point.

Video Switcher is too far off to acturately predict...nothing official from Control 4. They already have drivers for Knox and Autopatch swithcers though. A few other video switcher drivers to come as well...officially.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Brent,
Is your 777 being controlled using RS232 ?
Also, any word on product releases such as the Video Switcher and LCD Keypads?


When i talked to Eric he said they had no plans of coming out with a Video Switcher.

Actually, In training (at the 1st of the year) they specifically mentioned a Video Switcher coming from Control 4 in the future, but no firm dates, etc. They even went as far to say that the Audio Switcher was designed with Video in mind. Meaning, that only a few production tweaks were needed to create their Video Switcher off of the Audio Switcher's platform. Sounds like something an auto maker would do. :)

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Have any of you guys registered your gear with C4?

I thought I saw a link previously, but can't find it now.

max

Our audio switch will be modified and released as a video switch at CEDIA. Don't use the audio switch as a video switch it wont work due to filtering


I guess it doesn't matter much whether they will have a video switch or not since they will support other companies' switchers as Brent mentioned .

Can a composite matrix switcher also switch RF ?

Switch RF???? Tell me how you would ever want to switch RF? Multiple antennas maybe? Multiple Basic Cable Companies, etc?

Brent Huskins
Media Design

I have my 3/dual tuner satellite receivers located in a utility closet and I'm using the RF outputs to send the signal to the 8 TV's located throughout the house (the picture is actually excellent) . When I go with C4, I'd need to also send the C4 GUI, DVD Megachanger signal, and Security Cameras etc .

I know I can use modulators to do this, but I also know that if my technically challenged family members need to change channels to use these different sources that it will be a problem .

Max, I did register with C4 a few weeks ago and you're right, the link is now missing. Don't know what that's a bout. I did see on the My Control4 page that they were hoping for services to start at CEDIA 2005. We'll see.

I have my 3/dual tuner satellite receivers located in a utility closet and I'm using the RF outputs to send the signal to the 8 TV's located throughout the house (the picture is actually excellent) . When I go with C4, I'd need to also send the C4 GUI, DVD Megachanger signal, and Security Cameras etc .

I know I can use modulators to do this, but I also know that if my technically challenged family members need to change channels to use these different sources that it will be a problem .

Are all 8 tv's getting all 3 dual tuner satellite receivers now? All on Channel 3 or 4? If you go with modulators, Control 4 can keep track of what the channel is for each source. Your family won't have to remember.

Preferably you would use a switcher instead. There are some good ones that are quite reasonable in price as well. This would give you better quality and more flexibility. It looks like you will have 6 + sources (the plus is associated to the number of cameras) going to 8 TVs. Sounds like you need an 8 x 8 switcher. That would give you room for 3 cameras, 3 Satellite Tuners, a DVD Megachanger and the C4 GUI. You could also add additional Home Theater Controllers around at the important TVs to offer independent GUI for those zones. This wouldn't require any modulators and could utilize the same cable you're currently using for your RF distribution. You might want to have a separate Component Video run for the DVD changer for the important TVs as well to get the most out of your DVDs. If Control 4 comes out with a "Video Point" for sending HiDef throughout your home over your existing Ethernet, that would be the ultimate solution. No announcements yet though.

Here's a good priced video switcher - http://www.knoxvideo.com/Products/kv_RS8x8.asp

This is the same brand that Control 4 was using in their training facility and a driver is already available.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Since the receivers are dual units, it's actually the same as having 6 receivers . Each TV receives the output from only 1 receiver (some rooms are combined into 1 zone, such as the kitchen and laundry) . The DVD changer would be located near my HDTV so I can hook it directly using component and use the RF out for the rest of the house . The cameras are on a quad switcher so only output 1 signal at a time .

All of the rooms have 2/RG6 runs but no Cat5 at the TV locations; why there's no Cat5 at these locations is a long sad story involving the professional installation company I hired to pre-wire my house .

So are you saying that that Knox switcher can switch either composite or RF ?

No not RF, what I'm saying is that you're looking at this the wrong way and need to forget about RF, unless you want to use modulators. The Sony DVD, Control 4 and likely your quad switcher don't have an RF output. That's why the modulators would be mandatory to accomplish a 100% RF system.

Knox is for composite, svideo or component switching.

Knowing how your gear works it sounds like you need a 12 in x 8 out switcher for composite video. Knox has a 16 x 16 (video only) at a good price. Other brands configure 12 x 8 but their likely higher than the Knox. Knox has a 12 x 8 with audio as well, but it's more expensive than the 16 x 16 video only by Knox, combined with the 16 x 16 audio switcher from Control 4.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Cam I send composite on RG6 at a maximum of about 70 feet ? I tried it recently and barely got a signal .

You should be able to do it fine with the proper terminations, etc. 100 feet is no problem. Do you have the specs for your cable? Is it Copper Clad Steel or Solid Copper? Quad or Dual shield? If it's really cheap CCS that satellite installers are notorious for using because it's the cheapest, you might be out of luck other than modulation.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

It's quad shielded, aluminum braid, and it looks like solid copper but I'll have to check it with a magnet . It's a very heavy cable made by Coleman, I looked up the model # on their site but it's not listed .

You should be fine with proper terminations.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

Thanks again Brent .

I started my Control4 installation this weekend and thought I'd post my first impressions of the system.

Unboxed the Media Controller, everything was clearly labeled and packaged well. I installed the MC into my rack, plugged in power cord, network and TV. The system powered up and I verified it obtained an IP address.

I installed the Composer software onto my laptop and was able to connect to Director (MC) with no problem. I put in a CD; the MC used the internet lookup feature to identify it and copied it to the hard disk.

I used “Interviewer” to setup two rooms, added the MC, remote and receiver. Finished the interviewer process and used the remote to start music playing. Pretty easy so far!

There wasn’t an available driver for the Denon receiver I have, so I modified one of the existing by overwriting the IR codes using my receiver remote and it worked fine. For the second zone, I made another copy of the driver and overwrote the input select and volume IR codes with the receiver’s zone 2 IR codes.

I added the Zone2 receiver driver to a new room – and was able to play a different audio stream in each room. I haven’t figured out how to get the volume control working for the 2nd zone. I haven’t been able to configure it to send the IR code for volume up and down. Anyone else using a two zone receiver?

Setup took about an hour – and I’ve spent a couple more hours trying to figure out how to control volume in the 2nd room.

So far, I’m impressed with the system. Next up - dimmers, switch for fireplace, two mini-touch panels, a Sony 777ES, matrix video switch and thermostats when they arrive.

oregun,
Welcome aboard! Nice to see the community of us early adopters growing. I'm not using a receiver in my system yet, so I can't help with your setup. I'm looking forward to my Home Theater Controller coming this week though. Let us know how your switch/dimmer installation goes. I'm especially interested since installing my dimmers/switch has been on my To Do list for 2 months now. :)

a Sony 777ES, matrix video switch and thermostats when they arrive.

You don't want to wait till next get Sony changer that suppose to be out in October ?

Do you know if whatever controls DVD changer can lookup titles on Internet or you need to manually enter names for all 400 DVDs ?

Yes, welcome aboard oregun. Nice writeup. There's about half a dozen of us out there now, from what I can tell, and our experience is similar to yours. Generally very positive, with some inevitable issues that do get resolved by our dealer, software updates, etc.

Jacksonian, go ahead with dimmer / lighting questions. I've now installed 3 dimmers and one 6 button keypad. Just ordered 6 more dimmers and another 6 btn keypad.

Max

I decided not to wait on the new Sony as some previous posts indicated it might not have RS232 control - and I figured it would be more expensive. Besides - I'm not good at waiting :)

The 777 arrived today, so I'll hook it up tonight and report back...

As I understand it, the Control4 integration works the same with DVD's as with CD's - it looks up cover art through the Internet. Interface is similar - you can browse by cover art, title, actor etc...

Ver. 1.1.2 is available for download now.

Damn work... Gets in the way! (Of course it also pays for all the toys)

It's that east coast/west coast thing...

Brent Huskins
Media Design

So... what's in the update?

A new 777 driver for auto look up when Discs are added and a fix for the HTC (which may impact the MC)

Brent Huskins
Media Design

FYI,
LCD keypads, wireless outlet dimmer and thermostat are now to be released on 10-31

Actually fortuneteller, per the 8/8/05 update on the dealer website the Wireless Outlet Switch is still 8/31 and the Wireless Outlet Dimmer moved to 9/30, but the LCD Keypads did move to 10/31. Also, the WIFI Mini Touchscreens and WIFI Speaker Points are now scheduled for 8/31 and the Thermostat, Multi Tuner with XM and Wireless Serial/IR Extender did bump to a 10/31 release.

Everything else has been released.

Also, the Home Theater Receiver/Controller and Amplified Switch Controller have been removed from their dealer release schedule (and from the main site) suggesting that these items have been shelved for the time being (which is OK by me.)

Here's the Recap:
3 1/2 weeks away...
Wireless Outlet Switch 8/31
WIFI Mini Touchscreens 8/31
WIFI Speaker Points 8/31

Almost 2 months away...
Wireless Outlet Dimmer 9/30

Almost 3 months away...
Wireless LCD Keypad 10/31
Wireless Thermostat 10/31
Multi Tuner with XM 10/31
Wireless Serial/IR Extender 10/31

Everything else has been released.

Shelved Items:
Home Theater Receiver/Controller
Amplified Switch Controller


Brent Huskins
Media Design

My bad, brent your right,I got the wrong date on the outlet dimmer.

Hey y'all -- look what I found!

http://www.mycontrol4.com/

(Pays to read user documentation sometimes :) )

I decided not to wait on the new Sony as some previous posts indicated it might not have RS232 control - and I figured it would be more expensive. Besides - I'm not good at waiting :)

The 777 arrived today, so I'll hook it up tonight and report back...

As I understand it, the Control4 integration works the same with DVD's as with CD's - it looks up cover art through the Internet. Interface is similar - you can browse by cover art, title, actor etc...

I am sooooo bad at waiting .... ;) Sony going to really 995 in next couple of weeks - consumer model - no RS232 and around November they should have 777 replacement - RS232 + HDMI + improved video processing.

How much you paid for your 777 ? Please post your setup experience - i am so tired of DVD boxes laying all over my house. And i'll have a perfect excuse to not let friends borrow my movies.

Hey y'all -- look what I found!

http://www.mycontrol4.com/

(Pays to read user documentation sometimes :) )

Isn't it odd though that there's not a link to that page from the main Control4 "My Control4" page?

Isn't it odd though that there's not a link to that page from the main Control4 "My Control4" page?

I agree. They're probably still building out the mycontrol4.com site. Looks like they're gonna launch the services at cedia.


I also wonder what the dealer part of the regular control4 site has. Brent, you've mentioned product delivery dates. What other goodies do they have there? Forums for dealers and installers to hang out at? Description of the secret C4 handshake? Bug database? Other technical information?

Curious minds are -- well -- curious.

Hi Guys,

I've been very busy running around the country doing the 4Real tour stops. I promised a member of this group that I would get online and post some answers to questions as soon as I got a chance. I am very impressed with the conversations that have been going on here.

Here are the Questions I see that have gone unanswered.

Question 1: Aprilaire
I am pretty sure the Aprilaire driver will be in the end of August release. In the C4 architecture we have a hardware/software abstraction layer that ensures C4 devices and other manufacturers devices look the same in the User Interface. The driver is bi-directional.

Question 2: Ir Input
it is our goal to finish IR in in the next few months. We will publich the Hex codes so that you can teach a learning remote the C4 codes. This way you will be able to used a non C4 remote to run the on screen system. We will also post a ton of generic C4 IR codes that can will fire "events" in the programming so that you can build macros.

Question 3: NetStreams Integration
We consider our Streaming technology system a fundamental piece of our product line and I would not anticipate tight integration with NetStreams. However, if NetStreams could be configured to appear as a Serial controlled Audio Switch, building the driver would be fairly simple.

Question 4: Video Switch
Our current Audio Switch would switch video if we just removed the preamp chips. I would not be surprised to see a 16x16 video switch announcement from Control4 in the next 6 months

Question 4: Switching RF
If your TV (Or Cable Box) has two selectable RF inputs You just have to put them both in when you "learn" the device and you need to setup the macro to swith to each of them. You will also have to manually add the second RF network and manually bind it to the second input on the device. Then the system should manage everything for you.