I called Sonystyle and they said that they will start shipping preorders on the 23rd of September. They said that they are getting around 200 units and that they had about 190 preorders. Who knows if that is true. The guy said they have one in their showroom and it looks good. I'm going to wait until I can get a 60" for around 3600.000. I have a feeling that the prices will drop fast on these sets. 5-6k is a hefty price tag and with a flood of 1080P sets, older 720P sets and Plasmas dropping I think that Sony will have no choice but to meet a lower price point.

Following up on this - I have an old 4x3 50" Mits and just moved up to a 55" A20 (may get the 60" SXRD before my 30 days is up). Anyway, I knew going to a widescreen format would effectively decrease the viewable SD image I was used to. So I did some measurements. I don't recall them exactly, but the basic 4x3 measurements (with panels on the sides) were:

50" A10 - about 40"
55" A20 - 45.5"
60" A20 - about 49"

Great point--Another way I always compare 4x3 with 16x9 is to look at height of pic and this is pushing me to the larger size.
on a 4x3 36" set that I have now the screen height is 21.6" and a 60 in 16x9 is 29.4 so you get a larger size pic--- but if you think about viewing a 2.35:1 aspect DVD on the 36" 4x3 its is only 12.3 " in height and the 60" is 22.3 which is just a little larger than watching a full 4x3 program on my old 36" I sure don't want to go smaller than the old set soooooooooooo I think I will go up to the 60 instead of the 50

Roy

Hi

Will the Sony SXRD be able to accept 1080p as an input or just 1080i ? The PS3 might be 1080p.

Hi

Will the Sony SXRD be able to accept 1080p as an input or just 1080i ? The PS3 might be 1080p.

Only 1080i unfortunately.

Hi

Will the Sony SXRD be able to accept 1080p as an input or just 1080i ? The PS3 might be 1080p.


Only 1080i, yet!

First of all, I would like to thank all the members who have posted info in regards to sony's new SXRD tv. Your information was extremely valuable in helping me decide on a set sight unseen.
My current 12 year old sony 53 inch xbr RP tv has been in need of service for several months, rather then spend another 4-500.00 in service. I decided to wait til fall when 1080 sets would become available.
While shopping this past weekend for an mp3 player for a gift. Just by chance I notice that the store had less big screen tv's on the floor then normal. I ask the salesman if they were expecting any new xbr sony sets. He didn' t know of any nor did his manager and upon looking up the model through the internet. He came back with info that the sets were due in 9/17. Next thing you know, we were typing out the order. My downpayment was for the 60 inch along with 5 years extended service and tv stand.

Now that manufacturers are releasing 1080p sets. I'm some what confuse. Is it true that 1080p sets won't except 1080p source and only 1080i?
If this is the case why spend thousand's more on a set?
Since these sets used 120 watt bulb is this brighter and hotter then the current sony models?
Is there any info on bulb life for SXRD set?

Thanks for any info you can provide.

Lord Ace Man

Now that manufacturers are releasing 1080p sets. I'm some what confuse. Is it true that 1080p sets won't except 1080p source and only 1080i? It is true in regards to the Sony SXRD. Don't know about any of the other yet to be released 1080p sets

If this is the case why spend thousand's more on a set? This subject has been beat to death here. Go back a few pages and you'll get an ear full.


Since these sets used 120 watt bulb is this brighter and hotter then the current sony models? Not if it was the same bulb, but the SXRD sets use a different bulb. Wattage is a measure of power consumption, not brightness.

Is there any info on bulb life for SXRD set? You might make some assumptions based on the Qualia 006 as it also has SXRD technology, but its being powered at 200 watts. I've not heard of any authoritative predictions of bulb expectancy by Sony.

Thanks to none of you for your information on the SXRD sets. My Mits RPTV needs commission and is out of service. My wife and I decided that we should buy a new TV with a more pleasing form factor, however we have yet to see anything in stores in the 50" range that really wows us (at least under $6000), so now we have to wait for these SXRD sets to come out to check them out.

If it wasn't for AVSForum, I probably wouldn't know about these sets and wouldn't have to endure a month with no TV...and football season is starting!!!!

Seriously though. Despite its meanderings, this thread has been very helpful to me as well.

Now that manufacturers are releasing 1080p sets. I'm some what confuse. Is it true that 1080p sets won't except 1080p source and only 1080i?



in Sony's very own PR release on these upcoming SXRD sets, they stated that there are no 1080p inputs because the MPAA is leary of copyright issues. So we once again can blame the MPAA for holding technology back.

Thanks to none of you for your information on the SXRD sets. My Mits RPTV needs commission and is out of service. My wife and I decided that we should buy a new TV with a more pleasing form factor, however we have yet to see anything in stores in the 50" range that really wows us (at least under $6000), so now we have to wait for these SXRD sets to come out to check them out.

If it wasn't for AVSForum, I probably wouldn't know about these sets and wouldn't have to endure a month with no TV...and football season is starting!!!!

Seriously though. Despite its meanderings, this thread has been very helpful to me as well.

Yes, sometimes ignorance is bliss...I wonder why my boss is always so blissful?

I don't think any set will accept 1080P until the industry agrees on a standard to use with encryption so you can't bootleg movies and re-sell them. I really don't think it's a problem.

I just wanted to thank everyone for their response to my question about the 50" or 60" at 10'. It seems as though the consensus is that I can get the 60" so that's where I'm leaning. I'll definitely view one in person before making the final call. Thanks again for the input. I really hope these sets are as impressive as I think they will be. Time will tell.

I don't think any set will accept 1080P until the industry agrees on a standard to use with encryption so you can't bootleg movies and re-sell them. I really don't think it's a problem.

If this is true then why can you (for $3000.) have Sony refit a Qualia 004 with a 1080p Input?

Roy

If this is true then why can you (for $3000.) have Sony refit a Qualia 004 with a 1080p Input?

Roy

External scalers, deinterlacers, video processors, etc. ...

In most peoples opinion, is this SXRD going to be comparable in PQ to the current plasmas (Panasonic, Pioneer), based on how the Qualia looks so far? I know it's all speculation at this point, but what else is there to do until CEDIA anyway?

If this is true then why can you (for $3000.) have Sony refit a Qualia 004 with a 1080p Input?

Roy

I think another thread here mentioned that the current HDCP decoder chips available aren't yet fast enough to decode 1080p. If that's the case, it's not exactly a case of the MPAA saying no to 1080p, but rather the manufacturers being unable to provide inputs that can handle both 1080p and protected content.

If true, then presumably the 1080p refit for the Q4 is not HDCP-compliant and would only be able to display unencrypted sources.

emprie you beat me to the punch. Ahmen

In most peoples opinion, is this SXRD going to be comparable in PQ to the current plasmas (Panasonic, Pioneer), based on how the Qualia looks so far? I know it's all speculation at this point, but what else is there to do until CEDIA anyway?

The Qualia comes as close as any RPTV I've seen to matching plasma PQ, though I still give plasma a slight edge. I think the new SXRDs will look somewhat less plasma-like, especially if they use a matte screen.

I think another thread here mentioned that the current HDCP decoder chips available aren't yet fast enough to decode 1080p. If that's the case, it's not exactly a case of the MPAA saying no to 1080p, but rather the manufacturers being unable to provide inputs that can handle both 1080p and protected content.

If true, then presumably the 1080p refit for the Q4 is not HDCP-compliant and would only be able to display unencrypted sources.

for $3K, i would hope that what sony is providing is capable of decoding 1080p hdcp... :)

Why would Sony care what the MPAA says about inputs for a display?

Now they may have a say in outputs for HD-DVD and Blu-Ray. They certainly have leverage there. But the display makers should make the best displays they can and not worry about the source side.

Unfortunately, the diplay makers will also have to make the source devices. And in the case of Sony, they are also a movie studio.

What is stupid is that even with 1080i outputs or inputs, internal scalers will still display at 1080p. So the MPAA is downgrading it one step for no reason other than to exercise control.

Why would Sony care what the MPAA says about inputs for a display?

Now they may have a say in outputs for HD-DVD and Blu-Ray. They certainly have leverage there. But the display makers should make the best displays they can and not worry about the source side.

Unfortunately, the diplay makers will also have to make the source devices. And in the case of Sony, they are also a movie studio.

What is stupid is that even with 1080i outputs or inputs, internal scalers will still display at 1080p. So the MPAA is downgrading it one step for no reason other than to exercise control.Ever heard of Sony Pictures (http://www.sonypictures.com/)?

I'd say Sony has a vested interest in protecting intelectual property in the video entertainment industry.

The Qualia comes as close as any RPTV I've seen to matching plasma PQ, though I still give plasma a slight edge. I think the new SXRDs will look somewhat less plasma-like, especially if they use a matte screen.

have you seen a properly calibrated 50vs810 or 60vs810 ?

great picture the hitachi's do have...

Ever heard of Sony Pictures (http://www.sonypictures.com/)?

I'd say Sony has a vested interest in protecting intelectual property in the video entertainment industry.It is also called screw the consumer :rolleyes:

It is also called screw the consumer :rolleyes:And we don't even get dinner and a movie. :mad:

This announcement today looks like there will be continued pressure downward on prices that could be good for this set also --I think the conversion is about $9000 us dollars if I figured right.

TOKYO (Reuters) - Matsushita Electric Industrial Co. (6752.T) said on Thursday it will start selling a high-definition 65-inch plasma television in Japan from November 1 for less than 1 million yen.

Roy

...I called Sonystyle and they said that they will start shipping preorders on the 23rd of September.... The guy said they have one in their showroom and it looks good.

:eek:
What set do they have on display???
And where is this showroom????

for $3K, i would hope that what sony is providing is capable of decoding 1080p hdcp... :)

I suppose it's possible they have some limited, and therefore expensive, supply of 1080p-capable HDCP chips. That would explain the exorbitant price and the lack of these inputs as standard equipment.

have you seen a properly calibrated 50vs810 or 60vs810 ?

great picture the hitachi's do have...

Actually, the first time I saw a Qualia it was right next to a 60" Director's Series Hitachi, and it made the Hitachi look pretty bad. Admittedly I have no idea how either of those sets were calibrated, but side-by-side the Qualia had much better black levels, much more contrast, and much less SDE and SSE.

I've seen a lot of Hitachi's at different stores and haven't yet seen one that comes close to plasma PQ, but that's pretty much true of all LCD-RPs.

Lord Ace Man


Is it true that 1080p sets won't except 1080p source and only 1080i?


Yes, they will except 1080p, which unfortunately means they won't accept 1080p. ;)

Yes, they will except 1080p, which unfortunately means they won't accept 1080p. ;)


Well, actually, he intially used a double negative, so.... ;)

...I called Sonystyle and they said that they will start shipping preorders on the 23rd of September.... The guy said they have one in their showroom and it looks good.

I'd also like to know where this is! I just called the one in Boston, and they said they wouldn't have one for display until the 23rd.

I have a 43" Pioneer Plasma that is pretty new (forget the model #) and while it doesn't have any SDE it does have its own noise on bad feeds. The noise is like what you would see in a photograph for lack of a better analogy. Some Plasmas have much better color saturation, clarity and CR then most if not all LCD and DLP sets. The next generation of sets could change all this. Especially if the Sony hits the 5k to 1 CR mark as advertised. The Sammy claims greater CR but I couldn't see it when I viewed the latest 1080P sets from them and I played with the adjustments. The new JVC sets look to be intersting too if they can get their act together. I'm not worried about 1080P inputs. That's going to be a while before it's all sorted out. Bear in mind that the new SOnys will not be at the MSRP for very long since they want to move product and the competition from Plasma, DLP, LCOS, etc will be quite strong this year.

That’s all well and good. Now please, HomeGuy, back to the main topic, you stated some info, please clarify your post. Where is this show room? What set do they have in this show room?

I'm not sure I called the 800 number on the Sonystyle.com site and spoke to a gentleman who said they had one of the newer sets on his showroom floor. That is all I know. We should see the sets showing up soon at the Magnolia stores and some high end B&M stores ( I hope). I don't think there will be a mad rush to buy thses sets given the MSRP and all the other new sets coming out.

:confused:

Terrific.

This is par for the course, on this inane thread.

Showroom is probably at their technology center (where they held the press conference on 8/16) near Pittsburgh.

in Sony's very own PR release on these upcoming SXRD sets, they stated that there are no 1080p inputs because the MPAA is leary of copyright issues. So we once again can blame the MPAA for holding technology back.

They're obviously lying through their teeth. Why would a 1080p _input_ in any way contribute to piracy?

More importantly, there aren't people out there saying "I refuse to pirate until there's 1080p!". If anything, people would prefer to pirate straight 480p/i since it doesn't take up nearly as much space.

I think another thread here mentioned that the current HDCP decoder chips available aren't yet fast enough to decode 1080p. If that's the case, it's not exactly a case of the MPAA saying no to 1080p, but rather the manufacturers being unable to provide inputs that can handle both 1080p and protected content.

If true, then presumably the 1080p refit for the Q4 is not HDCP-compliant and would only be able to display unencrypted sources.

Ahh, now that makes more sense. But Sony is making it sound like a political issue, when it's really a technical issue - they can't make it work.

I guess they need a future incentive for the next round of upgraded sets.

I think another thread here mentioned that the current HDCP decoder chips available aren't yet fast enough to decode 1080p. If that's the case, it's not exactly a case of the MPAA saying no to 1080p, but rather the manufacturers being unable to provide inputs that can handle both 1080p and protected content.

If true, then presumably the 1080p refit for the Q4 is not HDCP-compliant and would only be able to display unencrypted sources.

That is no excuse for them to not provide 1080/60p input for unprotected content - like that out of a game system - Since logically the HDCP decoder chip wouldn't come into play at all in this situation. If this is the case, I can bet there will be a hack available for these first generation sets.

Rogo has a sense of humor. He likes funny things.

As for his being a "moderator", he continues to fell entitled to speak his mind. How do you people think these thousands of posts get moderated? It's not 2-3 guys trawling the boards trying to catch the flaming and off-topic stuff. It's the "Report Post" button. I could've used that and there's a good chance things could've disappeared or people received moderator missives etc. Instead, I took it to the source.

No good deed goes unpunished.

I still have a sense of humor and have posted more than a few messages whose sole purpose was to raise a smile. And, yeah, I'm also entitled to speak my mind. I'm sorry some people don't see it that way.

That is no excuse for them to not provide 1080/60p input for unprotected content - like that out of a game system - Since logically the HDCP decoder chip wouldn't come into play at all in this situation. If this is the case, I can bet there will be a hack available for these first generation sets.

If I understand how these things work correctly, I don't think you can bypass the HDCP chip for one kind of signal (1080p) and keep it enabled for all the others. I believe the chips are hard-wired to the inputs, so you either enable HDCP for all resolutions or none of them. The SXRDs will have 2 HDMI inputs, which will be enough for an STB passing HD and an eventual Blu-Ray/HD-DVD player, both of which will have at least some HDCP content. So providing an input for unprotected 1080p/60 would probably have required a third HDMI port. It's hard to argue that they should have provided an extra port that is crippled anyway.

Then again, the HDCP chip may have nothing to do with the lack of 1080p. Someone posted that on another thread and it seems to make sense, but it's only one unverified source.

I think another thread here mentioned that the current HDCP decoder chips available aren't yet fast enough to decode 1080p. If that's the case, it's not exactly a case of the MPAA saying no to 1080p, but rather the manufacturers being unable to provide inputs that can handle both 1080p and protected content.

If true, then presumably the 1080p refit for the Q4 is not HDCP-compliant and would only be able to display unencrypted sources.

The chips are already out:
http://www.siliconimage.com/products/productfamily.aspx?id=1

Rogo has a sense of humor. He likes funny things.


Perhaps Rogo just pawn in game of life :D

Rogo be more like knight or bishop. No king status till Rogo hit 30K

Has anyone been able to figure out if these have a reflective or a matte screen? I would certainly prefer shiny :)

Originally posted by FatNoah

Thanks to none of you for your information on the SXRD sets.

You're quite welcome. It wasn't easy packing a half page of pertinent info into more than 2,350 posts. Obviously we should all be working as speechwriters for Fidel Castro.

Rogo be more like knight or bishop. No king status till Rogo hit 30K

Rogo's value to these forums, in my opinon, has nothing to do with his
number of posts but with his ability to cut through most of the bull sh$t
that continues to get posted here in an attempt to influence people's
decisons for ulterior motives. Rogo sets the record straight.

Some will achieve many times the number of posts of Rogo but still
contribute nothing but Bull Sh$t. Rogo has a tremendous amount of
knowledge that he organizes and posts to the benefit of us all.

Thanks Rogo :-)

I can't imagine these sets would have a reflective screen but anything is possible.

uninvited,
been sober for over a month now ;) Honestly there listed in the latest crutchfield print, could've been just them getting a jump on sales, I haven't called them myself.

The manual says to keep the back of the tv at least 4" from the wall to allow for cooling. How critical is this? This may sound moronic, but since i will be only 8' from the screen, every inch is critical to me. What if i just put it, say 1" from the wall, its only a very small narrow part of the tv that is the very back anyway. I dont want to hurt the set, but sitting so close, every inch of space is precious to me!

Also, does the strap to hold it down come with the tv or with the official stand, or do you have to buy it separately?

See, i CAN post on topic! :D

yankeeman

Good question. I don't know that anybody would actually know the answer to it, though. If it were me, I'd follow the 4" spacing as to place it closer would keep me worried that I'm toasting some electronics. If something were to go wrong with the TV, I'd not want the service tech saying that it was caused by poor air circulation.

The strap comes with the Sony stand.

Honestly there listed in the latest crutchfield print, could've been just them getting a jump on sales, I haven't called them myself.
Ordered KDSR60XBR1 last week from Crutchfield and received Confirmation in the mail yesterday:

"We expect to ship the above item on 9/19/05"

Hopefully this is for real and we should have less than a month for real time postings and of course by then some of the stores should receive some of those initial shipments. Ooops! Gotta change my signature as I had an open mind to more than one set and SXRD came along sooner than expected - perhaps now I go from being accused of being the Samsung Whore for posting reviews to the Sammy Traitor - I think they still have an Awesome 1080P set I just chose the Sony based upon cross comparisons and the Qualia in many areas too long to post here and they have a way to go for QC in Mexico Plants to match up with Sony Reliability and potential for Qualia+ PQ.

Can't wait! :)

Ordered KDSR60XBR1 last week from Crutchfield and received Confirmation in the mail yesterday:

"We expect to ship the above item on 9/19/05"

Hopefully this is for real and we should have less than a month for real time postings and of course by then some of the stores should receive some of those initial shipments. Ooops! Gotta change my signature as I had an open mind to more than one set and SXRD came along sooner than expected - perhaps now I go from being accused of being the Samsung Whore for posting reviews to the Sammy Traitor - I think they still have an Awesome 1080P set I just chose the Sony based upon cross comparisons and the Qualia in many areas too long to post here and they have a way to go for QC in Mexico Plants to match up with Sony Reliability and potential for Qualia+ PQ.

Can't wait! :)You didn't hear about the fire in the assembly line plant last week? Everything SXRD is delayed 3 months.





Just kidding ;).... congratulations on your purchase.

You didn't hear about the fire in the assembly line plant last week? Everything SXRD is delayed 3 months.

Just kidding .... congratulations on your purchase.


Ok, I can't take that kind of shock when it's the first thing I see on AVSFORUM in the morning!!! My wife is really breathing down my neck to get a plasma (not a bad problem), but I've managed to delay the big purchase until we can check one of these babies out in person!

Ok, I can't take that kind of shock when it's the first thing I see on AVSFORUM in the morning!!! My wife is really breathing down my neck to get a plasma (not a bad problem), but I've managed to delay the big purchase until we can check one of these babies out in person!THAT'S FUNNY! I'm in exactly the same boat. I've held off so long she would almost let me get anything just to have something.

Sorry 'bout the shock ;)

The manual says to keep the back of the tv at least 4" from the wall to allow for cooling. How critical is this? This may sound moronic, but since i will be only 8' from the screen, every inch is critical to me. What if i just put it, say 1" from the wall, its only a very small narrow part of the tv that is the very back anyway. I dont want to hurt the set, but sitting so close, every inch of space is precious to me!

Also, does the strap to hold it down come with the tv or with the official stand, or do you have to buy it separately?

See, i CAN post on topic! :D

I would be very careful about reducing or blocking off air flow. All Microdisplays run rather hot and although the SXRD probably doesn't run as hot as a DLP, 90' to 95' fahrenheit is normally considered the maximum safe operating temperature for any display. The right answer is: follow the manufacturer's instructions, but if you insist on putting it closer, get a thermometer and measure the temperature where the airflow is exiting the rear of the set. Don't forget that the interior operating temperature is always going to be a few degrees warmer than your measurement. Don't take unneccessary chances with an expensive display. A few inches closer is not likely to matter if the PQ of the SXRD's is anything near the hype. Sony lists 6 1/2' as the minimum viewing distancw for the 50" set and 7' for the 60" set.

The strap comes with the matching stand if you purchase it....

Westa

What price quote did you receive from crutchfield, I asked if they could go any lower and they took off $xxx. Just curious if you was able to purchase for a cheaper price than advertised. I have not decided on sxrd or samsung 6178/6168 but would appreciate your input.

Since we are not supposed to talk $$ amounts I will use a percentage. I got 15% off the MSRP (60 inch model) at Tweeter here in town (Arlington VA). This was after I put down 25% and agreed to an extended warranty and stand. They charged my amex but I have not received anything in the mail as of yet.

Keep us up to date on the progress Westa.. I will as well.

Thanks stepmback

Sorry I didn't realize there was a certain protocol with $ amounts. Crutchfield stated sxrd's to ship mid September. They also mentioned the Toshiba was due out on Sept 2nd. I believe I'm only considering the samsung and sony at this point. Thanks again for your feedback.

Also, does the strap to hold it down come with the tv or with the official stand, or do you have to buy it separately?

See, i CAN post on topic! :DFYI, If you don't buy a Sony stand you can purchase the buckle as a separate part. You have to supply your own strap. You can buy online. Search for part number 403371801 at the link below:
http://servicesales.sel.sony.com

Does anyone care to take a guess at how much the 60" SXRD will be around
Christmas time (like at the Good Guys)? Thanks.

Does anyone care to take a guess at how much the 60" SXRD will be around
Christmas time (like at the Good Guys)? Thanks.

Yes, at Good Guys probably $4999 but they will probably have
a "no tax" or throw in a DVD player promo.

Based on Sony's prior XBR pricing strategy I wouldn't look for
a significant price reduction until way after Christmas.

Being new to the RPTV arena, I have learned much from the regulars here. I'm as excited as the rest to replace my 30" CRT with the 60" SXRD. I think it may take me a while to upgrade the rest of my components though. They are all Sony ES but pre-DD 5.1.

Here's my question:
Should the DVD player be brand specific ie: Sony? I know CA9ES needs to be replaced, but I want to provied the best signal possible to the SXRD.

n2n

Yes, at Good Guys probably $4999 but they will probably have
a "no tax" or throw in a DVD player promo.

Based on Sony's prior XBR pricing strategy I wouldn't look for
a significant price reduction until way after Christmas.

Thanks Tony. I had a feeling, especially at high end stores that the price would not be discounted for quite some time (especially a Sony prduct, let alone XBR). But thought I asked (anyways). :)

That's totally up to you. Personally, I wouldn't want to pay a premium for the name on a DVD player. There are quite a few varying opinions regarding which player to use, upscaling or not, etc. I think that probably depends on the quality of this TV's internal scaler, so I would wait and see, if I were in the market for a new DVD player.

Here's my question:
Should the DVD player be brand specific ie: Sony? I know CA9ES needs to be replaced, but I want to provied the best signal possible to the SXRD.

n2nIt doesn't need to be brand specific. I would recommend a HDMI compatible DVD player at the minimum.

Personally, I have selected either the Sony DVP-NS90V, $200 MSRP, (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?CategoryName=hav_DVD_DVDPlayers&ProductSKU=DVPNS90V) or DVP-NS70H, $150 MSRP, (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DVPNS70H&Dept=tvvideo&CategoryName=hav_DVD_DVDPlayers) (-10 to -15% for street price). They should be available in the next week or so. Since both offer HDMI connections I'm leaning more towards the DVP-NS70H since I don't plan to use it much for SA-CD playback. I plan save the big bucks to purchase a HD Blu-Ray player so I see no reason to invest too much in a DVD player. These should be good enough for DVD now.

It doesn't need to be brand specific. I would recommend a HDMI compatible DVD player at the minimum.

Personally, I have selected either the Sony DVP-NS90V, $200 MSRP, (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?CategoryName=hav_DVD_DVDPlayers&ProductSKU=DVPNS90V) or DVP-NS70H, $150 MSRP, (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DVPNS70H&Dept=tvvideo&CategoryName=hav_DVD_DVDPlayers) (-10 to -15% for street price). They should be available in the next week or so. Since both offer HDMI connections I'm leaning more towards the DVP-NS70H since I don't plan to use it much for SA-CD playback. I plan save the big bucks to purchase a HD Blu-Ray player so I see no reason to invest too much in a DVD player. These should be good enough for DVD now.

I dunno if I'd so quick to run out and get an upscaling dvd player simply because of the hdmi option. I own at samsung hd 850 and the hdmi picture is not as good as the component... mostly because the tv does an inherently better job of upscalling I presume. which is most likely the case with these Sonys as well...

Here's my question:
Should the DVD player be brand specific ie: Sony? I know CA9ES needs to be replaced, but I want to provied the best signal possible to the SXRD.

n2n


On the Sony website, one unit they recommend is the RDR-VX515 which is a DVD recorder & VHS combo player which looks interesting. I might get it, and the vhs part could be used to easily convert some of my vhs tapes that i have made myself to dvd. I know the picture wont look great on a big set, but i also have a 23" Samsung lcd flat panel in my computer room with a dvd player hooked up to it, and they would be okay on that set. I would prefer buying a dvd recorder rather than getting a Tivo as i know my wife would balk at the monthly fee, whereas she wont look at it as a monthly fee if we just make it part of the original transaction when i buy this along with the big tv, stand, etc.

Being new to the RPTV arena, I have learned much from the regulars here. I'm as excited as the rest to replace my 30" CRT with the 60" SXRD. I think it may take me a while to upgrade the rest of my components though. They are all Sony ES but pre-DD 5.1.

Here's my question:
Should the DVD player be brand specific ie: Sony? I know CA9ES needs to be replaced, but I want to provied the best signal possible to the SXRD.

n2n

Out of curiosity, what replaces the ES line now ? Can't see anything on sonystyle. Or am I missing something ?

Wrote Sony and they said they don't sell any ES on sonystyle any more. They just said go to an authorized dealer. I replied to them that was pretty stupid not to have info on their products on their own web site whether they sold it online or not, but got the same canned reply back. So if you want ES info go to Crutchfield's I guess.

On the Sony website, one unit they recommend is the RDR-VX515 which is a DVD recorder & VHS combo player which looks interesting. I might get it, and the vhs part could be used to easily convert some of my vhs tapes that i have made myself to dvd. I know the picture wont look great on a big set, but i also have a 23" Samsung lcd flat panel in my computer room with a dvd player hooked up to it, and they would be okay on that set. I would prefer buying a dvd recorder rather than getting a Tivo as i know my wife would balk at the monthly fee, whereas she wont look at it as a monthly fee if we just make it part of the original transaction when i buy this along with the big tv, stand, etc.

I would not purchase a DVD/VCR recorder. Sony or not. For all the pro-Sony guys out there, I am one too, many of the lower end Sony products are made or many of the parts are from Samsung. We have even been able to swap out VCR parts btween the Sony and Samsung units. If you want to convert your VCR tapes to DVD, hook up a VCR to your computer and do it that way or buy a 6 pack for one of your friends who can hook you up.


About samsung product, the reliability of the product is not really all that good...across the board. One terrible thing about samsung is the repair parts issue. They will substitute parts regularly, not communicate anything, and it will appear that parts are no longer available after a product is 6 months old sometimes. Too, it is frequently the case that the sub part do not even work. I see people looking into getting the Sammy product, but ask any technician what he would get, and I bet it would not be a Samsung. Just wanted to drop that before ya go dropping all your money on a set.

About the SXRD potential PQ... I think it will blow most of the other sets away. If you go to a retailer and look at all the sets, without looking at the brands, which one stands out? Usually when I go, the Sony LCD sets are the ones that stand out with the best overall linierity of the brightness and the vividness of the colors. The Sammys have rainbows, the JVC and Mitsubishi brightness seems inconsistant across the screen and looks almost like the lense is a bit dirty. If Sony can reduce the size of the pixels to eliminate the Screen Door Affect, keep the brightness and color as vivid as it currently is or make it better, I think they will have a winner.

Granted the Sony LCD sets have a nice picture but there is the SDE that is very visible, boxy pixels and the contrast is flat. There pq at suggested viewing distances is very livable and not at all bad and probably better then anything else, imho except maybe the Dila sets or certain Plasmas. I'm hoping that the SXRD sets solve all the issues previous mentioned. However, I want to see the set before shelling out 5k for one of these sets in a 60". The dumbo ears is going to piss my wife off too because the set is going to hang over a bit. If the new JVC set is discounted and has a similiar picture I will buy that since the speakers are on the bottom of the set I can get a 70" set and it'll take up the same room as the 60" Sony. By the way does anyone know the contrast ratio of the Qualia?

Granted the Sony LCD sets have a nice picture but there is the SDE that is very visible, boxy pixels and the contrast is flat. There pq at suggested viewing distances is very livable and not at all bad and probably better then anything else, imho except maybe the Dila sets or certain Plasmas. I'm hoping that the SXRD sets solve all the issues previous mentioned. However, I want to see the set before shelling out 5k for one of these sets in a 60". The dumbo ears is going to piss my wife off too because the set is going to hang over a bit. If the new JVC set is discounted and has a similiar picture I will buy that since the speakers are on the bottom of the set I can get a 70" set and it'll take up the same room as the 60" Sony. By the way does anyone know the contrast ratio of the Qualia?

The Qualia 06 claimed 3,000 to 1 but I don't think any professional reviewer
measured over 2,000 to 1 ....

I was kind of wondering about the speaker thing too. The new Sony 3LCD sets have the sound coming out of a pair of chambers off the bottom of the set. It looks better to be sure, and was probably cheaper to manufacture that way too. Maybe they feel the sound would be better coming off those big ear looking things, or maybe they feel it looks better and will apeal to the masses more. Who Knows???

Maybe they feel the sound would be better coming off those big ear looking things, or maybe they feel it looks better and will apeal to the masses more. Who Knows???
Or maybe they just decided to save a ton of money (on their car insurance) by reusing the XS cases...;) BTW, the sound really is pretty decent (on the XS) for TV speakers, but I'll never use them as we run everything through our HT.

Jason

Why doesn't somebody produce a set that has detachable speakers that can mount on the sides and top and/or bottom--then you'd satisfy everyone on planet earth. If you didn't want to use them you also wouldn't have to. Produce the set in silver, black, and charcoal gray.

I personally don't use TV speakers, but I wonder what would happen if a company produced a set with its own speakers that were also the greatest speakers in the universe. I think alot of people still wouldn't use them and you'd still have some that would say--I can't use the greatest speakers in the history of the universe because they don't fit some two-bit shelves or entertainment center I currently have.

How anyone can spend thousands on a set and restrict themselves to fitting it into crummy shelving or entertainment centers--I can never fathom. Those type of people are usually friends with people who place their display over their fireplace--are distracted by it--and then claim their display is great and fancy themselves as interior designers!

Why doesn't somebody produce a set that has detachable speakers that can mount on the sides and top and/or bottom--then you'd satisfy everyone on planet earth. If you didn't want to use them you also wouldn't have to. Produce the set in silver, black, and charcoal gray.

I personally don't use TV speakers, but I wonder what would happen if a company produced a set with its own speakers that were also the greatest speakers in the universe. I think alot of people still wouldn't use them and you'd still have some that would say--I can't use the greatest speakers in the history of the universe because they don't fit some two-bit shelves or entertainment center I currently have.

How anyone can spend thousands on a set and restrict themselves to fitting it into crummy shelving or entertainment centers--I can never fathom. Those type of people are usually friends with people who place their display over their fireplace--are distracted by it--and then claim their display is great and fancy themselves as interior designers!

Sharp LCD has been doing this for years. They make various models - some
that detach on the side and some that detach on the bottom...

Wow...a sensible and on-topic post by Fartwood? Do I smell ( ;) ) a new leaf being turned over? :D I absolutely agree about the detachable speakers (as I'm sure most people do), but I think I'd take the new SXRD in the old XS case without the removable speakers now instead of waiting maybe 4-6 months until they could put out a completely new set with removable speakers...unless of course it included 1080p inputs, too! As far as offering the set in different colors, that seems like a stretch, but you never know...

Jason

Wow...a sensible and on-topic post by Fartwood? Do I smell ( ;) ) a new leaf being turned over? :D I absolutely agree about the detachable speakers (as I'm sure most people do), but I think I'd take the new SXRD in the old XS case without the removable speakers now instead of waiting maybe 4-6 months until they could put out a completely new set with removable speakers...unless of course it included 1080p inputs, too! As far as offering the set in different colors, that seems like a stretch, but you never know...

JasonIf I had to wait another 4-6 months.... my wife would have aready collected on my life insurance policy by then :eek:

Not me...my wife would be happy to keep our 10 yr old 35" POS CRT for another 10 years...I'm strikin' while the iron is hot and she's feeling agreeable. :D

Jason

Mr. Jason Coleman and Mr. Uninvited Guest: I authored a smell-o-vision post once before but not too many people could appreciate its nuance!

The two of you may be surprised to know that I'm really considering buying an SXRD 60" if it's just a small improvement over the current Qualia. I don't know whether to wait for 1080p Plasma, wait for REAL 1080p input SXRD, wait to see if LG's LCoS might have REAL 1080p and a decent picture, or just say to hell with it and buy the SXRD 60". What do yall think? I know it's pretty silly to ask such a question as 1080pPlasma isn't out yet and we don't know what quality it or LG's LCoS set will have, but what do yall think? I could wait or buy--how would yall advise me?

P.S. I make no apologies for using the word yall--Fartwood is sophomoric, but I loved Animal House so such appelations do not bother me.

Mr. Jason Coleman and Mr. Uninvited Guest: I authored a smell-o-vision post once before but not too many people could appreciate its nuance!

The two of you may be surprised to know that I'm really considering buying an SXRD 60" if it's just a small improvement over the current Qualia. I don't know whether to wait for 1080p Plasma, wait for REAL 1080p input SXRD, wait to see if LG's LCoS might have REAL 1080p and a decent picture, or just say to hell with it and buy the SXRD 60". What do yall think? I know it's pretty silly to ask such a question as 1080pPlasma isn't out yet and we don't know what quality it or LG's LCoS set will have, but what do yall think? I could wait or buy--how would yall advise me?

P.S. I make no apologies for using the word yall--Fartwood is sophomoric, but I loved Animal House so such appelations do not bother me.

Refer to this thread http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6098077#post6098077

...I'm really considering buying an SXRD 60"...what do yall think?
Hey, I think they'll definitely be worth looking at, and may be the top contender until (maybe) 1080p plasma arrives. And $5k for a set that might match or even rival the pq of the Qualia sounds like a bargain to me!

Fartwood is sophomoric...
A keeper nonetheless...:D :p

Jason

Refer to this thread http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6098077#post6098077
I'm sure that Farty McCarty knows his 1080p! :)

Jason

Not me...my wife would be happy to keep our 10 yr old 35" POS CRT for another 10 years...I'm strikin' while the iron is hot and she's feeling agreeable. :D

Jason

Exactly the same situation here! We are watching a 36" set, but my wife could be happy with a 13" set. After two years of trying to get her to agree to a new set, she is finally willing to go for the SXRD (i dont know how that ever happened!), so i am going for it!

I'm sure that Farty McCarty knows his 1080p! :)

Jason
What are you talking about? I was answering his question whether to wait or not. He asked so I answered him.

Refer to the thread like I said.

I think its obvious that the NEW fake 1080p tvs are a marketing scheme.

Exactly the same situation here! We are watching a 36" set, but my wife could be happy with a 13" set.
My problem is that we've also got a front PJ that she really loves for HD & DVD, so the SXRD is quite a bit smaller, yet more expensive...but watchable during the day.

After two years of trying to get her to agree to a new set, she is finally willing to go for the SXRD (i dont know how that ever happened!), so i am going for it!
Tell me about it...! :D

Jason

What are you talking about?
Okay, okay...take it easy...I was only indicating that The Fartmeister makes his way around to many, many threads so I'm sure he was aware of that one.

Jason

Okay, okay...take it easy...I was only indicating that The Fartmeister makes his way around to many, many threads so I'm sure he was aware of that one.

Jason
Im not upset i was just lost. I get it now. Thanks

...i was just lost
Thus the user name...;)

Jason

THAT'S FUNNY! I'm in exactly the same boat. I've held off so long she would almost let me get anything just to have something.

My wife and I stopped by the local BB/Magnolia after work today. The A10's looked pretty good and my wife was impressed. Then we went to the local SonyStyle and checked out a 70" Qualia. She couldn't stop talking about how good it looked. Now she can't wait for the 23rd either (date store said they'd have one on display). It was my first look at a Qualia too. I was definitely impressed...to say the least.

On a side note, the Sony HD Video camera looked really good hooked up to a 50 screen! :)

Does your wife have a sister...? :D ;) :p

Jason

Mr. Jason Coleman and Mr. Uninvited Guest: I authored a smell-o-vision post once before but not too many people could appreciate its nuance!

The two of you may be surprised to know that I'm really considering buying an SXRD 60" if it's just a small improvement over the current Qualia. I don't know whether to wait for 1080p Plasma, wait for REAL 1080p input SXRD, wait to see if LG's LCoS might have REAL 1080p and a decent picture, or just say to hell with it and buy the SXRD 60". What do yall think? I know it's pretty silly to ask such a question as 1080pPlasma isn't out yet and we don't know what quality it or LG's LCoS set will have, but what do yall think? I could wait or buy--how would yall advise me?

P.S. I make no apologies for using the word yall--Fartwood is sophomoric, but I loved Animal House so such appelations do not bother me.Mr. Artwood,
I must say I'll a little startled by your proclaimation.

When I began this little quest for 'video fire' we were looking for something larger than our 6yo 40" widescreen CRT RPTV in the $2-3k range. After a brief survey of what was available in that price range, I must say we were greatly disappointed. So, after much soul searching, we agreed the $4-6k range was more practical to meet our expectations. While I liked the 50" Mitsu plasma, with kids in the house I was concerned about burn-in and really didn't think the picture was as great as everyone claimed. Next was RPTV LCD and DLP more disappointment. Each had their issues, I see rainbows to cap it off. As for LG I have always thought of them as an 'Also ran', not much of an innovator. The Qualia 006 was perfect for our situation but blew the budget and really in the grand scheme of things was a waste of money that could be better spent in other places of our life. Even if money were not a consideration I personally don't care to spend that much on this form of entertainment.

As burn-in is being pressed as less of an issue I guess the 65" 1080p plasma would be something I would seriously consider if it were in the $4-6k. But at $9k I would want to see it next to a Q006 before making a decision. That's more of an apples vs. apples fight. Even so, it's not something practical for me to contemplate.

I'm making the assumption the the 60" SXRD set will be 'good enough' to last me 4-6 years. At that time I expect I will be able to afford the next 'good enough' 1080p (or higher) technology without paying the early adopter tax like the Qualians and plasma buyers have done. I will have a great device to make the best use of the content currently available.

As for 'real 1080p' I really think we have 2-4 years before the content catches up to the hardware. So why pay for something you can't use today. With prices falling so fast and features exponetially growing, you will want hardware contemporary with the content available in the future. So why blow your wad today when we are in somewhat of a transitional period? We may always be. Sony appears to be on an annual cycle so I think in the spring you will see the next gen of HTPS LCD sets announced, maybe 1080p like Epson has been demo'ing. I wouldn't expect to see an SXRD revision until next fall. What if you wait another year only to be left wanting whatever rumor is around the corner.

In the past I bought cars thinking I would keep them for 10 years or more. Well when it gets to the 80k mile point I usually already have that itch for something new. Sure it has life left in it but there are models with standard features that were only available from premium manufactures when I originally purchased. So I have realized that it will always be a process of evolution and replacement. I guess for me the TV is the same process. The hardest part is drawing the line and taking the plunge.

Thanks for the discussion.

edit: php spell check is the Devil

My wife and I stopped by the local BB/Magnolia after work today. The A10's looked pretty good and my wife was impressed. Then we went to the local SonyStyle and checked out a 70" Qualia. She couldn't stop talking about how good it looked. Now she can't wait for the 23rd either (date store said they'd have one on display). It was my first look at a Qualia too. I was definitely impressed...to say the least.

On a side note, the Sony HD Video camera looked really good hooked up to a 50 screen! :)

I stopped by the local high end video store today to see my fourth Qualia. The first one I saw was at another branch of the same store, and it looked fantastic. The next two I saw were at a couple different Tweeters, and they ranged from looking very good to looking a bit iffy. Seeing this one tonight in a quality setting really satisfied me about just how fantastic those sets can look when fed good signals and set up properly. The room was not overlit or crowded, and the signal didn't look like it had been split 50 different times before making it to the TV. From the front, you could easily confuse a Qualia with a very big, highly detailed plasma. SSE, which is the bane of my RPTV existence, was barely noticable when I looked for it and invisible when I didn't. Boy do those TVs look good; it's a testament to how good they are that even with the $5K 60" versions only a month away, I'm still tempted by them (luckily I don't have $13K burning a hole in my pocket). I'm almost... ALMOST... tempted to pre-order the 60" (if only I could get over that little nagging voice in the back of my mind that tells me I need to see the TV before buying it; other people may have WAF to contend with, I've got VIMHAF -- Voice In My Head Approval Factor). I told the salesman that I was waiting for the new 60" SXRD and he said they would have em in a couple weeks. I think that's a bit optimistic, but he didn't give an exact date so he may have been guesstimating.

Of the Three or Four 1080p offerings of the LCOS variety, which set(s) give the appearance of being rushed to market the most?

Wow...a side of UG that we've never seen...the serious and sober and wise UG rears his logical head! Good points made...particularly regarding the "good enough for now" notion. We're rarely if ever going to find the ultimate piece of gear because there's always the next best thing sticking its nose out at you from around the proverbial corner. I've been on the hunt for a new TV for years now, and have finally "settled" on the SXRD because I think that it's going to be the best bang-for-the-buck product at that price point with the features that we need. We could wait for them to drop in price, or wait for the 1080p plasma sets to arrive, but we'd be in the same situation that we're in now...do we buy the set that best fits the current bill, or do we continue to hold out for the next technological advancement to make its way into consumer TVs? I'd love to wait for OLED to really make its way into the market and buy a 100" set that can be rolled up or hung on a wall like a poster, but who knows when that will happen? And how long do we really want to wait to upgrade? For us, it's finally become a matter of "good enough for now" and we'll consider upgrading again a few years down the road and maybe get 1080p plasma or OLED or whatever happens to be riding that bleeding edge of technology at that moment. I'm certainly thinking wireless!

Jason

Wow...a side of UG that we've never seen...Damn! I thought I was logged in under my other user account... 'rogo' :D

Nope, there'll be a total lack of disrespect for you and your measly posting numbers...you slacker! ;)

Jason

Wow...a side of UG that we've never seen...the serious and sober and wise UG rears his logical head! Good points made...particularly regarding the "good enough for now" notion. We're rarely if ever going to find the ultimate piece of gear because there's always the next best thing sticking its nose out at you from around the proverbial corner. I've been on the hunt for a new TV for years now, and have finally "settled" on the SXRD because I think that it's going to be the best bang-for-the-buck product at that price point with the features that we need. We could wait for them to drop in price, or wait for the 1080p plasma sets to arrive, but we'd be in the same situation that we're in now...do we buy the set that best fits the current bill, or do we continue to hold out for the next technological advancement to make its way into consumer TVs? I'd love to wait for OLED to really make its way into the market and buy a 100" set that can be rolled up or hung on a wall like a poster, but who knows when that will happen? And how long do we really want to wait to upgrade? For us, it's finally become a matter of "good enough for now" and we'll consider upgrading again a few years down the road and maybe get 1080p plasma or OLED or whatever happens to be riding that bleeding edge of technology at that moment. I'm certainly thinking wireless!

Jason

I have been buying displays in the $3k to $4k range every year and then
selling them to friends in the $2k or so range. Cost of ownership has only
been about $100 to $150 dollars a month and I am always up to date with the
latest and almost greatest.

But, sooner rather than later, I hope to find a set that I will be satisified with for
a few years and will splurge a bit more. I am thinking one more next year,
probably a FP or maybe a 70 in. 1080p plasma with a 1080p input ( just so I can
say I have it :-), hopefully with 15,000+ to 1 CR and inky blacks with great color
accuracy and resolution to hold me over until 80 in. SED is $15k or less. Opps, I
must be dreaming..

Of the Three or Four 1080p offerings of the LCOS variety, which set(s) give the appearance of being rushed to market the most?

Hard to say, since none have hit the market yet. The Sony's are definitely ahead of schedule; whether that implies rushed or not, I don't know. Even so, given JVC's history of QC problems, I'd take a rushed Sony over an on-schedule JVC.

Nope, there'll be a total lack of disrespect for you and your measly posting numbers...you slacker! ;)

JasonSet the bar low enough and you'll always make your goals. :D

Set the bar low enough and you'll always make your goals. :D
Aim Low...I used to take those Air Force posters and turn them 180 degrees just to make myself feel good...Hell, you might even surprise yourself with how productive/constructive you are! :)

Jason (the non-slacker, mr. back to work)

The only reason I think now should be a good time to buy is I don't believe 1080p inputs will come in Fall of 2006--I think they'll come in Fall of 2007. I also don't think 65-inch 1080p Plasma will rapidly drop in price. The only reason I would wait to check out to see the LG LCoS product is that it may be the first one with 1080p inputs and it has the BEST HD tuner available for uncompressed OTA HD. Still, I'd go with whichever one had the best Picture Quality. Given all of that I'll probably wind up buying the SXRD 60". The only reason I wouldn't purchase it would be if it were significantly worse Picture Quality wise to the Qualia. In that event I'd probably purchase a Panasonic 1080p 50" Plasma--I wouldn't like going with the smaller size, but would if it had great Picture Quality. If all these sets sucked I'd probably grit my teeth and buy a Mitsubishi 1080p DLP 73-inch--mainly for the size and for the HD PVR. If all these choices sucked I could simply wait. I agree that now is a time of transition. I'm mainly looking for the best display I can get right now to last me for 5 years--at that time SED should blow everything away!

Aim Low...I used to take those Air Force posters and turn them 180 degrees just to make myself feel good...Hell, you might even surprise yourself with how productive/constructive you are! :)

Jason (the non-slacker, mr. back to work)
http://us.st5.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1856_7636881

I like your wife. Anyway, I was reading a review on the Qualia 006 and a few things distrubed me. I guess not even a 13K set is perfect. Overall the review was glowing, http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article.asp?section_id=7&article_id=810&page_number=1&preview=

1. The Qualia has a reflective screen. The one thing I love about Sony LCD's is the matte screen that doesn't have any hot spots or any glare in a bright room. This could be a deal breaker. I hated the glare that I got from my 65" Tosh.

2. Blacks are not as good as a CRT. It doesn't sound like the 5k to 1 ratio in the Sony ads were met.

3. Uniformity was slightly worse than DLP, with minor color variations across the screen on gray fields.

4. The 006 did a mediocre job of maintaining a consistent level of black;

5. Convergence issues.

My heavens. So many good posts. :)

The only reason I think now should be a good time to buy is I don't believe 1080p inputs will come in Fall of 2006--I think they'll come in Fall of 2007. I also don't think 65-inch 1080p Plasma will rapidly drop in price. The only reason I would wait to check out to see the LG LCoS product is that it may be the first one with 1080p inputs and it has the BEST HD tuner available for uncompressed OTA HD. Still, I'd go with whichever one had the best Picture Quality. Given all of that I'll probably wind up buying the SXRD 60". The only reason I wouldn't purchase it would be if it were significantly worse Picture Quality wise to the Qualia. In that event I'd probably purchase a Panasonic 1080p 50" Plasma--I wouldn't like going with the smaller size, but would if it had great Picture Quality. If all these sets sucked I'd probably grit my teeth and buy a Mitsubishi 1080p DLP 73-inch--mainly for the size and for the HD PVR. If all these choices sucked I could simply wait. I agree that now is a time of transition. I'm mainly looking for the best display I can get right now to last me for 5 years--at that time SED should blow everything away!

Which is it? First you are going to wait until later *this* year to see
if LG LCOS has 1080p inputs and then you say you don't believe they will
happen until 2007.

the LG LCoS 1080p sets do accept 1080p over the HDMI inputs

it has been confirmed in the thread below

http://www.dtvforum.info/index.php?showtopic=22728

I was imed the link to the thread by someone on my contact list

Hard to say, since none have hit the market yet. The Sony's are definitely ahead of schedule; whether that implies rushed or not, I don't know.

I was referring more to the actual main release of the new (SXRD) product line, in the way that Sony has decided to do with the SXRD sets. I would have expected Sony’s (Sub $13k) SXRD technology to have been released with it’s own style, not a re-use of an earlier LCD product chassis.

The SXRD is a new product/technology release, (IMO) one deserving of it’s own style?

I can understand Sony’s desire to get the cost as competitive as possible but not at the cost of a unique identity for the product. You have SXRD, 1080p resolution, Dynamic IRIS, and last years LCD Chassis with non-detachable side speakers. Plus earlier posts indicate Sony positioning the SXRD to challenge DLP sets like never before.

Seems odd unless they were a little rushed to have a 1080p offering in line with the competition … some can even claim it as being ahead of schedule I guess.

Even so, given JVC's history of QC problems, I'd take a rushed Sony over an on-schedule JVC.

JVC has been selling 720p LCOS type sets for over a year now but were unique in there D-ILA product style (to include a unique chassis). It’s true that posts describe problems that JVC owners have encountered but I will expect Sony to have similar challenges in the 1st generation SXRD sets. I guess what really matters is how well the manufacture’s handle the warranty on sets that sell for under 5k. JVC has a history of warranty dealings w/LCOS where as Sony doesn’t yet and the majority of JVC owners that are posting problems seem determined in having JVC fix the problems as opposed to giving up on the set entirely. Some have gone to great lengths to get it just right and JVC hasn’t seemed to flinch at working with them.

Of course they didn’t have a choice in an alternative LCOS <5k offering until now so maybe it has been more of an early adopters willingness to work out the bugs with the first LCOS sets available.

How is Sony on warranty issues for LCD sets as an indication of what to expect from them on the SXRD’s?

Convergence issues on a qualia? How can that be?

http://us.st5.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1856_7636881

Amazing.

I read this image as in "owning 5 McDonald's franchises".

I guess I am a glass-half-full guy.:)

I was referring more to the actual main release of the new (SXRD) product line, in the way that Sony has decided to do with the SXRD sets. I would have expected Sony’s (Sub $13k) SXRD technology to have been released with it’s own style, not a re-use of an earlier LCD product chassis.

The SXRD is a new product/technology release, (IMO) one deserving of it’s own style?

I can understand Sony’s desire to get the cost as competitive as possible but not at the cost of a unique identity for the product. You have SXRD, 1080p resolution, Dynamic IRIS, and last years LCD Chassis with non-detachable side speakers. Plus earlier posts indicate Sony positioning the SXRD to challenge DLP sets like never before.

Seems odd unless they were a little rushed to have a 1080p offering in line with the competition … some can even claim it as being ahead of schedule I guess.



JVC has been selling 720p LCOS type sets for over a year now but were unique in there D-ILA product style (to include a unique chassis). It’s true that posts describe problems that JVC owners have encountered but I will expect Sony to have similar challenges in the 1st generation SXRD sets. I guess what really matters is how well the manufacture’s handle the warranty on sets that sell for under 5k. JVC has a history of warranty dealings w/LCOS where as Sony doesn’t yet and the majority of JVC owners that are posting problems seem determined in having JVC fix the problems as opposed to giving up on the set entirely. Some have gone to great lengths to get it just right and JVC hasn’t seemed to flinch at working with them.

Of course they didn’t have a choice in an alternative LCOS <5k offering until now so maybe it has been more of an early adopters willingness to work out the bugs with the first LCOS sets available.

How is Sony on warranty issues for LCD sets as an indication of what to expect from them on the SXRD’s?

I was an early adopter of Sony's first HD tv. An expensive 65" set that quickly developed multiple problems. The service that I received from Sony's 800 number was abysmal, and it was only thru the good graces of my Dallas dealer, Stereo East, that I was eventually able to receive a refund. Having said that, I have a 67" Samsung 1080 DLP on pre-order with TVA, but am seriously considering waiting for the 60" SXRD. Just go with a dealer with whom you have an established relationship if you are truly concerned about quality issues. Hopefully, the 60" SXRD sets are more like generation 1.5 rather than 1.0.

Does your wife have a sister...?
Yes. She's married. They're getting a 42" plasma. :rolleyes:


After a brief survey of what was available in that price range, I must say we were greatly disappointed. So, after much soul searching, we agreed the $4-6k range was more practical to meet our expectations
I'm in the same boat. I'd rather pay $4k for something I'll love for the next few years vs. $2k for something I'll always be thinking "I should have spent the extra 2k" about.

Seeing this one tonight in a quality setting really satisfied me about just how fantastic those sets can look when fed good signals and set up properly. The room was not overlit or crowded, and the signal didn't look like it had been split 50 different times before making it to the TV. From the front, you could easily confuse a Qualia with a very big, highly detailed plasma.

The Qualia I saw was right next to an A10, and about 10' away from a plasma. Standing about 5' away from the 70" screen (drool!), I didn't notice SSE and SDE was almost none. At my home viewing distance of 8-14', I couldn't really see any SDE at all. BTW, am I the only one that goes to Television stores with a tape measure and measures viewing distance? Knowing this crowd, probably not.

Regarding the picture itself, the black level was not comparable to the plasma, but color and sharpness were. Black detail was also very good, and far superior to the other RPLCDs in the room. Even from low angles, I didn't really see any glare from the screen...but maybe that's because I'm used to the protective screen on my CRT RPTV which suffers from that quite a bit.

If these new sets don't blow me away like I'm hoping, it'll be like Christmas came and you found Santa dead in the chimney with all your presents burned to a crisp...or something like that. I've never been good with similes...though I'm decent with smilies. :p

I know I have a tiny post-count, so I'll probably be ridiculed...but I have been a member since 2001. That has to count for something, right? :)

If these new sets don't blow me away like I'm hoping, it'll be like Christmas came and you found Santa dead in the chimney with all your presents burned to a crisp...or something like that. I've never been good with similes...though I'm decent with smilies. :p We wondered why the house smelled so bad all though January. :eek:

HOMEGUY,

Hi. I believe it was you who said in one of your posts that you were going to wait for the SXRD (size, 60"??) to come down to 3,6000. I'm going to have to wait :( on my SXRD purchase as well. There is some things I need to take care of first. And then hopefully by then, the price will have down came down a little. [ :confused: ]

Is there anyone else who is going to wait till around Chirstmas time, OR after Christmas to get their SXRD? OR just even a month (October) after their release in September?

Thanks - Matthew

Is there anyone else who is going to wait till around Chirstmas time, OR after Christmas to get their SXRD? OR just even a month after their "release" (October)?

As much as I hate it, I imagine I will wait until the LG shows up. I certainly will wait until members of this board have gotten a good look at these sets. Like some others, I have been waiting a long time to make my move and am getting very impatient living in NTSC nation.

Terrific.

This is par for the course, on this inane thread.

__________________
Larry

Larry...believe we have careered far beyond inane, but a correction of your post would be simple. An addition of the letter s properly positioned should suffice.

I think that if you look hard enough you are going to find an issue with just about any tv you look at.

I went to training at sony down in Irvine once just after the flat CRT direct view sets came out. People were buying the sets and complaining about pincushion, non-linear pictures misconvergence in the corners and so on. Basically, it was just some of the issues that were inherent to flat screen CRTs at the time. Now that technology has gotten better, so have these picture issues.

The thing that was funny was that Pete, the Sony trainer, said that he wished Sony would build a "Perfect" tv. Something that no one could find anything wrong with at all. Sure it would cost an unbelievable amount of money, but that way we could say "If you want perfect, you should go buy the perfect set."

I think that what it comes down to is how much are you willing to spend and how much are you willing to put up with. If you want a "perfect" set...save your pennies. If you are willing to put up with some of the digital artifacts associated with different technologies, pick your poison and go for it. PQ is so subjective anyway.

I have seen a phrase "silk screen effect" (SSE) a few times in these posts. What is that refereing too?

Thanks

This is great! When I first read this thread this morning, I thought I was on the wrong thread. All of a sudden, there were thoughtful, balanced discussions of where the new SXRDs factor into each poster's buying decisions. Even some comments that would have produced big flames a few days ago were greeted with good humor and constructive responses. Wow! Maybe we'll be back to fighting in a few hours, but I really appreciate the respite.

With regard to the SXRD, I'm leaning toward buying a 60" when they arrive. I'm uncomfortable with a pre-order, but I've come pretty close. I've been looking for an HDTV for a long time and I think this set may have enough going for it to finally "take the plunge" (which sounds like more fun than "pulling the trigger"). I'd love a 70" SXRD, but I don't want to make a financial investment that large.

I agree that the SXRD cabinet could be more stylish, but it's not horrible either. I wish the speakers were removable, but I disagree that they should have been placed on the bottom. The bottom placement is a performance compromise that only helps if you have a small-width space for installation. Given the nitpicking we do on this forum about every little picture detail flaw, I'm surprised that so few people criticize the compromised audio imaging of bottom-mount speakers. It only goes to show how different most AVS members are than most tv consumers, who tend to actually use the speakers that come with the tv.

Hope the SXRD sets arrive on schedule and come as close to "perfect" as $5,000 will get you these days.

SDL

SDL: Most of us only use the TV speakers for TV shows. When there is a movie or good HD feed the real AV gear comes out and does its thing. I have Klipschorns for mains, Heresys for rears a Forte for a center channel, and a Sherbourn monoblock amp. I'm not bragging but I would much rather have a 70" set fit into my space and give up a little bit of performance and use my high end audio gear then have speakers that take away from viewing experience just to get stock TV speakers on the side which will be fair at best. I've listened to these speakers on the Higher end SOny LCD sets withthe same cabinet and they are nothing to talk about. A joke if you will but on par if not better then other sets.

I just wished someone had one of these sets for review. These new sets may be a watered down version of the Qualia and on par with the JVC D-aila. If this is the case I'll take 70" JVC set (under 4k) with bottom speakers over the new Sony sets. I would give up some CR for the awesome experience of viewing a 70" set at 12-14'. I use to have a 65" Tosh and I loved the size of that set. One thing for sure I think anyone who buys this set sight unseen is brave. I almost did that with new Sammy 1080P set and when I saw it I was not happy with the soft film like picture (the term "film like" make me nervous)

Anybody have experience with Mosquito video processor?

Mosquito Noise Reducer (http://www.algolith.com/index.php?id=home_theater11&L=0)

The BEFORE and AFTER examples are interesting. We seem to put so much emphasis on only resolution and contrast wrt PQ, but I am just as bothered by these artifacts. I always assumed these mosquito artifacts were inherent in upscaling 480i, but come to think of it, I can change the resolution of my computer LCD without seeing them. So it seems they are actually a result of compression algorithms used when recording the DVD (and, or course, in transmitting SD video) which can't be seen on a 32" screen, but do show up on a big screen.

Granted its a very pricey piece of equipment, but I wonder how a $5000 60" SXRD would compare to a $3000 60" LCD + $2500 Mosquito processor with respect to total PQ experience. Maybe a clean, artifact-free 768p display would be better than an unprocessed 1080p one? Or maybe the anticipated higher CR of the 1080p would outweigh the presence of mosquito artifacts?

Other reviews:

hometheaterhifi.com (http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_12_1/algolith-mosquito-video-noise-reducer-3-2005.html)

hedmag.com (http://www.hedmag.com/Product-Reviews/Video-Electronics/Digital-Deet-3.asp)

Of the Three or Four 1080p offerings of the LCOS variety, which set(s) give the appearance of being rushed to market the most?

It is down to 3 companies that will release a 1080p LCoS in any sort of large quantities by the end of the year. Hitachi has postponed their LCoS sets this year due to poor chip yields. That leaves you with Sony, JVC and LG. The new smaller SXRD sets are using a smaller and cheaper chip then the 006, but also has the benefits of improved performance. To the best of my knowledge, no one on this board has seen the new chips in action, but looks to be the one to beat when you factor in reputation and reliably. JVC who has been mass producing LCoS technology longer then anyone, had a 1080p demo unit out last year, with the general consensus being it was slightly better then or on par with the 006. The initial MSRPs were high 9K for the 70" and 6.5 for the 61". In August, JVC also redesigned their LCoS chips going to a smaller .7 chip and also increasing its performance and contrast ratio. Again, no one has seen these redesigned chips in action either, but their biggest concern was cost so it should perform very nice. There are some etailers taking preorders, but JVC has been very quite about the release of these sets so who know if the will make their late October/early November release. LG chip is made by a 3rd party supplier called Spatalight (sp?) It was demoed at LG and the few that saw it, thought it was a great looking set but a hair under the 006 and the JVC in PQ. Their chip has also been slightly redesigned improving contrast and address a heat issue generated by the LG light engine. They are still on tract to release their 71" in limited quantities around Oct/Nov of this year followed shortly by a 62" set. They are expected to be priced very aggressively against the other sets, with a street of around 3.5K for the 62" to just under 5k for the 71" IMO based on specs, demos, insider reports I would rank as follows:

Picturei Quality
1. JVC (slightly)
2. Sony
3. LG

Price:
1. LG (large advantage)
2. JVC
3. Sony

I've seen posts indicating that these SXRD sets are first generation...IMO, these are third generation implementations and accordingly have introduced improvements over the predecessors...first gen, Q 004 (albeit FP, still using SXRD panels), second gen Q006 (RPTV)...

I like your wife. Anyway, I was reading a review on the Qualia 006 and a few things distrubed me. I guess not even a 13K set is perfect. Overall the review was glowing, http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article.asp?section_id=7&article_id=810&page_number=1&preview=

1. The Qualia has a reflective screen. The one thing I love about Sony LCD's is the matte screen that doesn't have any hot spots or any glare in a bright room. This could be a deal breaker. I hated the glare that I got from my 65" Tosh.

2. Blacks are not as good as a CRT. It doesn't sound like the 5k to 1 ratio in the Sony ads were met.

3. Uniformity was slightly worse than DLP, with minor color variations across the screen on gray fields.

4. The 006 did a mediocre job of maintaining a consistent level of black;

5. Convergence issues.

1. Hopefully the SXRDs won't have a reflective screen. This one is a simple
decision by Sony as to whether to have one or not.

2, The Qualia 06 claimed 3K to 1 CR. I believed it was measured as 2K to 1.
No Microdisplay including DLP has CRT blacks. DLP so far, especially
the new 1080p "wobulated" DLPs do have excellent black levels and
though not as good as CRT they are no longer are a problem. To me,
BL and CR are the key items to watch on these new sets. Note that because
CRTs have almost zero BL they have very high CRs and something like 30K
to 1 CR is considered necessary to see *all* the shadow detail in film.
10,000 to 1 will be very enjoyable and will enable us to see most
shadow detail. I really hopy Sony delivers in this area.

3. This one is new to me - hopefully the new sets will be better.
Of course, light uniformity accross a 70 in. screen is
more difficult than 60 in. and the largest DLP RP out when
the article was written was 61 in. But this sounds like
something more serious than that. I have never noticed this
on the Qualia 06 but I typically don't stare at test patterns :-)

4. This is a known issue with the Qualia 06. Bright objects
surround by dark areas raised the BL of the dark areas.

5. Every 3 chip solution will have the possibility of convergence
problems. Actually every 3 chip *has* convergence errors
but most are not perceptible by us.

I've seen posts indicating that these SXRD sets are first generation...IMO, these are third generation implementations and accordingly have introduced improvements over the predecessors...first gen, Q 004 (albeit FP, still using SXRD panels), second gen Q006 (RPTV)...

The chips in the SXRD sets are 3rd batch of SXRD chips from Sony ( they made
a 4k cinema chip after the chip in the Qualia 04 / 06 ) .. And since it appears
one can almost replace LCD panel with SXRD panels, Sony has had more
experience with these than any other company :-)

I bet Sony ships more LCD RPs in one week than JVC does D-ILAs in a year :-)

The proof will be in the pudding. I say go LCoS if it puts out a better picture than the Qualia. Among JVC, Sony, and LG buy whichever one looks the best. The hardest decision would be if the LG was the 2d best in picture quality by a hair and was the least expensive and offered REAL 1080p while the other two didn't! Decisions, decisions...Don't you just love it!

tonydeluce: My original idea was to wait until seeing LG's 1080p inputs being fed a movie by PC and if that feature would be worth the money. I thought others might not have 1080p inputs until 2007--maybe I'm wrong--maybe they will come sooner. I will say this though--I'd take better Picture Quality from 1080 deinterlaced to 1080p over lesser picture quality from REAL 1080p anyday. I prefer REAL 1080p, but more than that I just want the best Picture Quality. If the Sony or JVC sets blow me away--REAL 1080p wouldn't be worth it to me to wait for with there being such SCANT 1080p content. I figure Sony will PROBABLY be the best of the three, but I'd regret my decision if I didn't at least give the other two sets a look.

Tony,

Not sure that SXRD would be drop in replacements for LCD. Not sure that is what you meant, though.

LCD RPTVs are transmissive. LCoS is reflective. Totally different light engine is needed. Also, my understanding is that transmissive engines are much easier to assemble to avoid convergence problems than reflective engines. Of course, I could be wrong...

Lex

Interesting post. Sorry for the run on sentences in my previous post. Anyway, I called JVC and was told that the new sets are shipping in September. That'll be great since many new sets are hitting the shelves at that time so hopefully we'll see some discounts.

Tony,

Not sure that SXRD would be drop in replacements for LCD. Not sure that is what you meant, though.

LCD RPTVs are transmissive. LCoS is reflective. Totally different light engine is needed. Also, my understanding is that transmissive engines are much easier to assemble to avoid convergence problems than reflective engines. Of course, I could be wrong...

Lex

Sony's claim when retooling the PA facility for SXRD sets was
that only minor modifications were necessary. They proably meant
swapping out the light engine, LCD panels, and few other items. In any
case, I believe you catch my drift :-) I personally don't see how
anyone could use JVC in the same sentence as Sony but heh, that
is just me :-)

And you are correct, light must pass through LCD panels but LCOS
panels are reflective...

The proof will be in the pudding. I say go LCoS if it puts out a better picture than the Qualia. Among JVC, Sony, and LG buy whichever one looks the best. The hardest decision would be if the LG was the 2d best in picture quality by a hair and was the least expensive and offered REAL 1080p while the other two didn't! Decisions, decisions...Don't you just love it!

tonydeluce: My original idea was to wait until seeing LG's 1080p inputs being fed a movie by PC and if that feature would be worth the money. I thought others might not have 1080p inputs until 2007--maybe I'm wrong--maybe they will come sooner. I will say this though--I'd take better Picture Quality from 1080 deinterlaced to 1080p over lesser picture quality from REAL 1080p anyday. I prefer REAL 1080p, but more than that I just want the best Picture Quality. If the Sony or JVC sets blow me away--REAL 1080p wouldn't be worth it to me to wait for with there being such SCANT 1080p content. I figure Sony will PROBABLY be the best of the three, but I'd regret my decision if I didn't at least give the other two sets a look.

They will all do 1920x1080 resolution so if you are watching nature scenes
on a "cooked" HD feed they will look similiar. So it will come down to your
application. If the JVC ends up being super bright then it might be the
best application for daytime weekend sports if you can't control the lighting
somewhat. If Sony delivers on the CR and BL, then it might be the best
set for film sources with dark content. This combination of CR and BL have
a great affect on PQ - the colors look more rich have more "pop" - and shadow
detail becomes more observable.

In my opinion, once you have the resolution, CR and BL are the most important
things to look for ( assuming the set is bright enough for you and gray scale and
color decoding is accurate and none of have not been much of a problem lately ).

Note that because
CRTs have almost zero BL they have very high CRs and something like 30K
to 1 CR is considered necessary to see *all* the shadow detail in film.
10,000 to 1 will be very enjoyable and will enable us to see most
shadow detail. I really hopy Sony delivers in this area..
The real on/off CR of properly calibrated CRT FP is < 10,000:1. Some experts suggest that for proper shadow detail the optimal calibration is ~ 8,500:1 for the top 9" models. CRT RPTVs typically have lower on/off CR than the FP.

The on/off CR of 35mm projected film in an ideal screening room has been measured at ~1,500:1. Commercial 35mm Film has max CR of 10,000:1 (density 4). Real world motion picture films are likely < 5,000:1

You don't need 30k:1 or even 5k:1 to see all the shadow detail in film. ANSI CR, well that is a different story!

Sony's claim was marketing-speak, I guess, Tony. Lex is right that the light engines are nearly entirely different.

Sony's claim was marketing-speak, I guess, Tony. Lex is right that the light engines are nearly entirely different.

I agree. The light engines would have to be different...

You can not go wrong with the SONY SXRD 60 for $4999.

Let's be realistic here if you want the best picure forget about plasma and DLP 1080p. If the JVC is $1000 less you really want to check it out before getting the SONY.



Mr. Jason Coleman and Mr. Uninvited Guest: I authored a smell-o-vision post once before but not too many people could appreciate its nuance!

The two of you may be surprised to know that I'm really considering buying an SXRD 60" if it's just a small improvement over the current Qualia. I don't know whether to wait for 1080p Plasma, wait for REAL 1080p input SXRD, wait to see if LG's LCoS might have REAL 1080p and a decent picture, or just say to hell with it and buy the SXRD 60". What do yall think? I know it's pretty silly to ask such a question as 1080pPlasma isn't out yet and we don't know what quality it or LG's LCoS set will have, but what do yall think? I could wait or buy--how would yall advise me?

P.S. I make no apologies for using the word yall--Fartwood is sophomoric, but I loved Animal House so such appelations do not bother me.

The real on/off CR of properly calibrated CRT FP is < 10,000:1. Some experts suggest that for proper shadow detail the optimal calibration is ~ 8,500:1 for the top 9" models. CRT RPTVs typically have lower on/off CR than the FP.

The on/off CR of 35mm projected film in an ideal screening room has been measured at ~1,500:1. Commercial 35mm Film has max CR of 10,000:1 (density 4). Real world motion picture films are likely < 5,000:1

You don't need 30k:1 or even 5k:1 to see all the shadow detail in film. ANSI CR, well that is a different story!

Our ability to perceived differences in CR will also depend on other
variables, i.e. the lighting conditions of the room, the source material,
human variations, etc.

There are a number of "experts" who believe 30,000 to 1 measured CR
is required to see *all* the recorded shadow detail. But in any case, if
Sony delivers on the BL and CR specs they are claiming, then these new
SXRD sets are going to be better th an the Qualia 06 in this area...

I think that if you look hard enough you are going to find an issue with just about any tv you look at.

I went to training at sony down in Irvine once just after the flat CRT direct view sets came out. People were buying the sets and complaining about pincushion, non-linear pictures misconvergence in the corners and so on. Basically, it was just some of the issues that were inherent to flat screen CRTs at the time. Now that technology has gotten better, so have these picture issues.

......

Thanks

HI JEEPDUDE,

I KNOW :) this is an SXRD thread, but I was wondering if one of the Sony Flat (Screen) CRT Direct View's you went to training for was the non HD, SONY
XBR-250 (the precedessor to I believe the HD version of the Wegas)? I have this set/TV and when you use the component input you get HORRIBLE! banding (never seen a problem like that on a TV before ). I remember someone saying they fixed it by going into the service menu (SM) and adjusting the value of a "feature" (don't remember what "feature" right now). Of course Sony never [officially] acknowledged the problem. I never did call someone to go into the SM (not comfortable doing stuff like that myself).

I WOULDN'T CALL MYSELF VIDEOPHILES (LOL) LIKE YOU GUYS (not that there is anything wrong with that), but sometimes there are things you just can't live with. :)

[Just remebered something. One time when I was watching my dad's friend's Mits 52725 (720p) DLP and there was a "stock" ticker at the bottom of the screen, there was OBVIOUS bowing of the image. So much to the point of where I couldn't look at it for a few seconds without getting queasy.]

THANKS! - Matthew

HI JEEPDUDE,

I KNOW :) this is an SXRD thread, but I was wondering if one of the Sony Flat (Screen) CRT Direct View's you went to training for was the non HD, SONY
XBR-250 (the precedessor to I believe the HD version of the Wegas)? I have this set/TV and when you use the component input you get HORRIBLE! banding (never seen a problem like that on a TV before ). I remember someone saying they fixed it by going into the service menu (SM) and adjusting the value of a "feature" (don't remember what "feature" right now). Of course Sony never [officially] acknowledged the problem. I never did call someone to go into the SM (not comfortable doing stuff like that myself).

I WOULDN'T CALL MYSELF VIDEOPHILES (LOL) LIKE YOU GUYS (not that there is anything wrong with that), but sometimes there are things you just can't live with. :)

[Just remebered something. One time when I was watching my dad's friend's Mits 52725 (720p) DLP and there was a "stock" ticker at the bottom of the screen, there was OBVIOUS bowing of the image. So much to the point of where I couldn't look at it for a few seconds without getting queasy.]

THANKS! - Matthew

Actually, I think the flat screens, WEGA, sets are around 7-8 years old. They didn't offer a HD set back then. But to qnswer your question, Most manufacturers make the same boards to fit in a number of different sets. The difference typically are hjust features; comb filter, inputs, PIP, blah blah blah. The feature register you are refering to are some settings in the EEPROM of the set that tells the set what features it should have. I would STRONGLY reccomend not messing with it unless you have a service manual to tell you what the settings should be for your set. If you make an adjustment you might be telling the set it has PIP but it does not, you loose the pix. If you get the service manual, you can go through the setting to make sure everything is cool though.

How big a difference is there really between True 1080p and not?

There are a number of "experts" who believe 30,000 to 1 measured CR

Who are those "experts"?

There is not a device in existence that will produce 30k:1 CR calibrated to d65.

The source film print is likely to be < 5,000:1 CR.

The 35mm projector is likely < 2,000:1 CR. I know, this a real stunner! projected 35mm film does not have the dramatic blacks of a CRT FP.

How big a difference is there really between True 1080p and not?
The only "true" 1080p60 source material is WMV HD titles, all 10 or so of them!

Every thing else currently, and for the forseable future is 1080i60 or 720p60.

OTA HD will not go to 1080p60. The broadcasters would rather use the extra bandwidth for more channels.

DBS and cable are already reducing the horizantal resolution of their 1080i broadcasts. ( The concensus is somewhere between 1280 to 1440 instead of 1920 )

Next gen HD DVDs ( HD DVD and Blu Ray ) will be 1080i.

While the PS3 is capable of 1080p, most people will be happy if there is a majority native 720p games, instead of lower resolutions.

It is within the realm of possibility that more WMV HD titles will be produced in the future--who knows? Maybe one day the PC and the TV will actually work seamlessly together!

The only "true" 1080p60 source material is WMV HD titles, all 10 or so of them!

Every thing else currently, and for the forseable future is 1080i60 or 720p60.

OTA HD will not go to 1080p60. The broadcasters would rather use the extra bandwidth for more channels.

DBS and cable are already reducing the horizantal resolution of their 1080i broadcasts. ( The concensus is somewhere between 1280 to 1440 instead of 1920 )

Next gen HD DVDs ( HD DVD and Blu Ray ) will be 1080i.

While the PS3 is capable of 1080p, most people will be happy if there is a majority native 720p games, instead of lower resolutions.

If it is true that the cable cos. will have the ability to only send you the 1 or 2 channels that you are viewing in the future don't you think that would let them send full res of 1920x1080 when they have it available since they would not be using much bandwidth.

Roy

I've decided, after much reading on this forum, and much thought, to buy the new 50" Sony KDS-R50XBR1. I may pre-order it. I only wish I could get it today for 1k less. I have decided, after (probably way too much) consideration and study of this site, that Sony is still the answer.

The chips in the SXRD sets are 3rd batch of SXRD chips from Sony

The SXRD will incorporate Sony’s first batch of LCOS designed chips for use in under $5k Sets. During the same month JVC will be utilizing a second generation of LCOS chips designed for use in under $5k sets.

I am not at all insinuating that Sony has not gained experience in the release of LCOS based products like the 004, 006, or cinema series. I just don’t believe it would be accurate to consider the 50/60” SXRD as a superior generation as compared to what has been used in the more expensive products.

I bet Sony ships more LCD RPs in one week than JVC does D-ILAs in a year :-)
Sony is clearly the King of LCD-RP, no argument, and it is very likely that they will sell more RP LCD TV’s than the sales of JVC D-ILA’s and SXRD’s put together.

Sony will likely discontinue RP-LCD though as soon as it is feasible to convert all production to LCOS. What’s interesting is that it’s unlikely Sony would have even continued it’s RP-LCOS endeavor had it not been for DLP. Sony couldn’t afford to ride with RP-LCD taking a second seat to DLP.

With the SXRD holding as Sony’s Mid-Grade product with a clear advantage over DLP Sony will be able to concentrate on the development of FED technology that will need to be ready to compete with the mass availability of Toshiba/Cannons SED panels in 2007. So it’s likely the next “no cost spared” Qualia product will be a first generation FED product.

Sony has had more experience with these than any other company :-)

RP-LCD? Yes
LCOS, I don’t think so…. I think JVC has had more experience with LCOS.

So you might expect the following in product standings for <$5 >50” RP-Sets for the next 18-Months.

Economy Phase Out: Now :RP-LCD :Sony
Economy: Eventually : DLP-1080p:Whomever
Mid-Grade: Sept.2005 :LCOS-1080p :Sony/JVC/LG
Superior: ~2Q? 2006: SED/FED-1080p Toshiba/ Sony Qualia

I personally don't see how anyone could use JVC in the same sentence as Sony but heh, that is just me :-)

JVC hasn’t really been in the Consumer level TV/display spotlight, but the RP D-ILA products have been a recent exception. JVC and Sony will be going head to head on these LCOS sets which is the reason Sony is ahead of schedule ;) I think the JVC press release regarding a September release of 2nd generation LCOS based 1080p sets was published in January 2005. Sony just let everyone know a few weeks ago that they would be offering a competing product ahead of a later planned release schedule.
(IMO) It appears Sony’s following JVC in LCOS not the other way around.

Sony still may have the ability to deliver the better product but that remains to be seen!
I think the Dynamic Iris definitely gives them an advantage, but JVC may surprise everyone with 1080p Inputs….? Is the SXRD coming equipped with D6500K? It will be a great thing to be able to compare these two sets as they are released now simultaneously. Another large decision making factor for many will be what appears to be a 30% price difference in the same size sets between the two manufactures. It just seems like Sony might be stretching a little on the SXRD in order to come to market at the same time as JVC.

The SXRD will incorporate Sony’s first batch of LCOS designed chips for use in under $5k Sets. During the same month JVC will be utilizing a second generation of LCOS chips designed for use in under $5k sets.

I am not at all insinuating that Sony has not gained experience in the release of LCOS based products like the 004, 006, or cinema series. I just don’t believe it would be accurate to consider the 50/60” SXRD as a superior generation as compared to what has been used in the more expensive products.


It is very accurate if you read what improvments the new chip bring. The only thing that is in question is how the screen that the Qualia uses helps the picture, because the 50/60 SXRD will use a matte screen. Here is some info on the new chips.

"The panels produce a contrast ratio of 5000:1. Refinements to the panel circuit layout enabled Sony to reduce the pixel pitch on an individual panel to just seven micrometers, resulting increased pixel density, yields, quick response time and a brilliant film-like picture."

The chips the Qualia used had a CR of 3000:1.

The SXRD will incorporate Sony’s first batch of LCOS designed chips for use in under $5k Sets. During the same month JVC will be utilizing a second generation of LCOS chips designed for use in under $5k sets.


What kind of twisted logic is that? You could have said: this is JVC's first
1080p LCOS for RP and is Sony's second gen 1080p LCOS for RP , right?
Get real! In any case just try to compare Sony's Silicon Fabrication experience
with JVC's. Come on man, get serious!


Sony is clearly the King of LCD-RP, no argument, and it is very likely that they will sell more RP LCD TV’s than the sales of JVC D-ILA’s and SXRD’s put together.

Sony will likely discontinue RP-LCD though as soon as it is feasible to convert all production to LCOS. What’s interesting is that it’s unlikely Sony would have even continued it’s RP-LCOS endeavor had it not been for DLP. Sony couldn’t afford to ride with RP-LCD taking a second seat to DLP.


You are dreaming here. Sony is deeply committed to LCD sales and will continue
to invest heavily in this department for the foreseeable future. Don't expect LCD
projection from Sony to go away anytime soon.



With the SXRD holding as Sony’s Mid-Grade product with a clear advantage over DLP Sony will be able to concentrate on the development of FED technology that will need to be ready to compete with the mass availability of Toshiba/Cannons SED panels in 2007. So it’s likely the next “no cost spared” Qualia product will be a first generation FED product.


I hope SXRD delivers the BL and CR so that your first statement is correct.
I have no problem with your second statement. I am not going to comment on
your last statement but I assure if you in the next few months there will
be a major announcement that will render your last statment flat out wrong.


RP-LCD? Yes
LCOS, I don’t think so…. I think JVC has had more experience with LCOS.

So you might expect the following in product standings for <$5 >50” RP-Sets for the next 18-Months.

Economy Phase Out: Now :RP-LCD :Sony
Economy: Eventually : DLP-1080p:Whomever
Mid-Grade: Sept.2005 :LCOS-1080p :Sony/JVC/LG
Superior: ~2Q? 2006: SED/FED-1080p Toshiba/ Sony Qualia



JVC hasn’t really been in the Consumer level TV/display spotlight, but the RP D-ILA products have been a recent exception. JVC and Sony will be going head to head on these LCOS sets which is the reason Sony is ahead of schedule ;) I think the JVC press release regarding a September release of 2nd generation LCOS based 1080p sets was published in January 2005. Sony just let everyone know a few weeks ago that they would be offering a competing product ahead of a later planned release schedule.
(IMO) It appears Sony’s following JVC in LCOS not the other way around.

Sony still may have the ability to deliver the better product but that remains to be seen!
I think the Dynamic Iris definitely gives them an advantage, but JVC may surprise everyone with 1080p Inputs….? Is the SXRD coming equipped with D6500K? It will be a great thing to be able to compare these two sets as they are released now simultaneously. Another large decision making factor for many will be what appears to be a 30% price difference in the same size sets between the two manufactures. It just seems like Sony might be stretching a little on the SXRD in order to come to market at the same time as JVC.

ROTFLMAO on the idea that JVC can compete with Sony in any category of RPs. Do you
know how large of a company Sony is? - do you understand how great their influence
is on their distrubtion channel? - their engineering resources? - their semiconductor
experience? I give JVC a year - two years max to have their LCOS lunch eaten.

Oh well, a few years from now we can look back on all this and...

Okay, is it off-topic to discuss a component to go with the SXRD????? Some may think so, i am not so sure.

Here is a quick question, you can flame me if its off-topic, but its important. If you guys who are buying a new SXRD also had to buy a good dvd recorder that will throw a really nice picture onto this particular set and also be used as the dvd player that will play your movies on the SXRD, what would you get? I asked this question in the dvd recorder area of the forum and only got one response, i thought that since we are talking about the SXRD here it might get more responses. I am not looking for HD, just a progressive scan dvd recorder that will give me the best picture. I am not worrying about keeping the price low. Thanks.

The SXRD will incorporate Sony’s first batch of LCOS designed chips for use in under $5k Sets. During the same month JVC will be utilizing a second generation of LCOS chips designed for use in under $5k sets.

I am not at all insinuating that Sony has not gained experience in the release of LCOS based products like the 004, 006, or cinema series. I just don’t believe it would be accurate to consider the 50/60” SXRD as a superior generation as compared to what has been used in the more expensive products.




Why not? Panasonic just announced a 65 inch 1080p plasma for <9K MSRP.

The SXRD prices are very much ballpark for next generation if you ask me. Remember, also, that the sets are 50 and 60 inch. It would have been completely impractical for Sony to have *not* used the Qualia 006 as a template.

Merely "equivalent" would be fine. Although a smaller screen size should increase PQ in theory, especially comparing a 50 to the 70 inch Qualia.

I have been researching for a TV for quite a while. I have rarely posted my opinions in these threads. I enjoy reading everyone’s opinions here. I need some advice. I have pre purchased 3 XBR1’s, 2 at online retailers and one at a local. All have their prose and cons. The first was threw one that has no shipping costs plus warranty expected delivery of September 19th. The other was a little more MSRP + Warranty + Tax but they gave me a free VCR/DVD combo (which I don’t really need) and an expected delivery of September 12th. The last one I went to was local which just opened. They were having a 10% off gift card promo with any purchase. They were already $500 off MSRP + 450 gift card. That’s a total saving of $950. This retailer has no idea as to when it will be coming in though. Should I wait or should I and save the money or should I get one sooner and pay more? My only concern is what if Sony cannot keep up with demand and these online retailers get them sooner. I would have to wait a long time to get one locally. I am 2nd on the list at one and 3rd at the other and 1st locally at my local retail store. I really need one soon. I have been purchasing 60+ inch TVs since Oct 2001 and every one has been either exchanged by the manufacture or currently they took the TV back and cut me a check for 5,000. I have been without a TV since Feb of this year. I saw some info on the Samsung 1080p DLPs. I loved the picture and my wife agreed so we purchased the 61” We received it three weeks ago. My wife and I loved the set we stayed up mesmerized by the picture. Then all of a sudden I began seeing rainbows. I couldn’t believe it! I told myself I can tolerate them but a week into owning the set my wife after an hour or so kept going to bed early and complaining of headaches. I had a hunch that it was the TV giving her the headaches so I asked her to not watch the TV one night. I never told her why either. She had no head aches that night. The next evening after we watched TV together again and she started with a headache again. I boxed up the TV and sent it back to the store. I am TV- less again.
I told myself no compromises this time. I want a TV no matter what the cost and I want it soon. This is where I called up the corporate company and asked them why the SonyStyle web site is stating the TV has Wega Gate when the Owners manual clearly states it does not. He said that is an old owner’s manual drafted in June when Wega Gate was just coming out. He said yes it does have Wega Gate. They will be posting a “final” new one on their web site in the coming weeks with updated changes. I asked what the other changes are. He asked me to be more specific. He would send my questions off to the Design team in San Diego. I asked him.
1. What is the highest computer resolution of the set.
2. Screen shiny or matte?
3.1080p threw HDMI?
I received a call soon after with the answers. I was told that if my video card supports higher resolutions (1920X1200) the TV would rescale the image to 1920X 1080p. So yes the TV supports 1080p in the VGA input. The screen is shiny much like the Sony LCD computer monitors that say XBrite on them. Regarding the HDMI input being 1080p the answer was yes both of them will support it. I have my answers but I cannot believe them until I see the manual myself. Has any one else been told this information? Any help on these topics will be helpful. Thanks

I have been purchasing 60+ inch TVs since Oct 2001 and every one has been either exchanged by the manufacture or currently they took the TV back and cut me a check for 5,000

Doesn't anyone here get out any more?

Sure. I have been out a couple of times...auditioning televisions. By the way, did the Symbionese Liberation Army ever release that Hearst girl?

The list price of the Panasonic 50PX50 plasma has dropped to $3999! One B&M website is offering 10% off of this, making this plasma $400 less than the 50XBR1. A same size plasma for less than a RPTV. How things have changed. $1400 less than the 60XBR1. No side speakers, too.

Tough choices once these sets can be compared. Life is so tough...

The list price of the Panasonic 50PX50 plasma has dropped to $3999! One B&M website is offering 10% off of this, making this plasma $400 less than the 50XBR1.You'll see similar discounts when these same stores start listing the SXRD, of course. Give it time.

I have been researching for a TV for quite a while. I have rarely posted my opinions in these threads. I enjoy reading everyone’s opinions here. I need some advice. I have pre purchased 3 XBR1’s, 2 at online retailers and one at a local. All have their prose and cons. The first was threw one that has no shipping costs plus warranty expected delivery of September 19th. The other was a little more MSRP + Warranty + Tax but they gave me a free VCR/DVD combo (which I don’t really need) and an expected delivery of September 12th. The last one I went to was local which just opened. They were having a 10% off gift card promo with any purchase. They were already $500 off MSRP + 450 gift card. That’s a total saving of $950. This retailer has no idea as to when it will be coming in though. Should I wait or should I and save the money or should I get one sooner and pay more? My only concern is what if Sony cannot keep up with demand and these online retailers get them sooner. I would have to wait a long time to get one locally. I am 2nd on the list at one and 3rd at the other and 1st locally at my local retail store. I really need one soon. I have been purchasing 60+ inch TVs since Oct 2001 and every one has been either exchanged by the manufacture or currently they took the TV back and cut me a check for 5,000. I have been without a TV since Feb of this year. I saw some info on the Samsung 1080p DLPs. I loved the picture and my wife agreed so we purchased the 61” We received it three weeks ago. My wife and I loved the set we stayed up mesmerized by the picture. Then all of a sudden I began seeing rainbows. I couldn’t believe it! I told myself I can tolerate them but a week into owning the set my wife after an hour or so kept going to bed early and complaining of headaches. I had a hunch that it was the TV giving her the headaches so I asked her to not watch the TV one night. I never told her why either. She had no head aches that night. The next evening after we watched TV together again and she started with a headache again. I boxed up the TV and sent it back to the store. I am TV- less again.
I told myself no compromises this time. I want a TV no matter what the cost and I want it soon. This is where I called up the corporate company and asked them why the SonyStyle web site is stating the TV has Wega Gate when the Owners manual clearly states it does not. He said that is an old owner’s manual drafted in June when Wega Gate was just coming out. He said yes it does have Wega Gate. They will be posting a “final” new one on their web site in the coming weeks with updated changes. I asked what the other changes are. He asked me to be more specific. He would send my questions off to the Design team in San Diego. I asked him.
1. What is the highest computer resolution of the set.
2. Screen shiny or matte?
3.1080p threw HDMI?
I received a call soon after with the answers. I was told that if my video card supports higher resolutions (1920X1200) the TV would rescale the image to 1920X 1080p. So yes the TV supports 1080p in the VGA input. The screen is shiny much like the Sony LCD computer monitors that say XBrite on them. Regarding the HDMI input being 1080p the answer was yes both of them will support it. I have my answers but I cannot believe them until I see the manual myself. Has any one else been told this information? Any help on these topics will be helpful. Thanks

Don't know if any of the new 1080P crap coming this Fall will be any good, but it can't be any worse than the garbage out there now. Another case of the Early Adapters getting the shaft!

The list price of the Panasonic 50PX50 plasma has dropped to $3999! One B&M website is offering 10% off of this, making this plasma $400 less than the 50XBR1. A same size plasma for less than a RPTV. How things have changed. $1400 less than the 60XBR1. No side speakers, too.

Tough choices once these sets can be compared. Life is so tough...

Its not so tough if youre a gamer...No worries with sxrd... Also once the brightness drops in plasma you can never get it back... Also when the plasma dies you cant fix it...Total bs imo...

Don't know if any of the new 1080P crap coming this Fall will be any good, but it can't be any worse than the garbage out there now. Another case of the Early Adapters getting the shaft!

Sticking to the 27 tube? :rolleyes:

Sticking to the 27 tube? :rolleyes:

I hope not, but if i have to wait so be it. You Want me to spend thousands of $ on one of the putrid 1080P sets out there now? They should pay you to test this garbage. They should pay you just to sit in front of it!! No thanks. I'll wait, check out this season's 1080P offerings. There are supposed be plenty coming. Maybe i'll get lucky and get surprised and one of them will actually be dependable and look good without a lot of weird picture noise and i'll scoop up that mofo! If not, i'll still have my cash in my pocket, dude!

I hope not, but if i have to wait so be it. You Want me to spend thousands of $ on one of the putrid 1080P sets out there now? They should pay you to test this garbage. They should pay you just to sit in front of it!! No thanks. I'll wait, check out this season's 1080P offerings. There are supposed be plenty coming. Maybe i'll get lucky and get surprised and one of them will actually be dependable and look good without a lot of weird picture noise and i'll scoop up that mofo! If not, i'll still have my cash in my pocket, dude!

If you really want to guarantee satisfaction go buy a Sony 57rp-crt...

I have been researching for a TV for quite a while. I have rarely posted my opinions in these threads. I enjoy reading everyone’s opinions here. I need some advice. I have pre purchased 3 XBR1’s, 2 at online retailers and one at a local. All have their prose and cons. The first was threw one that has no shipping costs plus warranty expected delivery of September 19th. The other was a little more MSRP + Warranty + Tax but they gave me a free VCR/DVD combo (which I don’t really need) and an expected delivery of September 12th. The last one I went to was local which just opened. They were having a 10% off gift card promo with any purchase. They were already $500 off MSRP + 450 gift card. That’s a total saving of $950. This retailer has no idea as to when it will be coming in though. Should I wait or should I and save the money or should I get one sooner and pay more? My only concern is what if Sony cannot keep up with demand and these online retailers get them sooner. I would have to wait a long time to get one locally. I am 2nd on the list at one and 3rd at the other and 1st locally at my local retail store. I really need one soon. I have been purchasing 60+ inch TVs since Oct 2001 and every one has been either exchanged by the manufacture or currently they took the TV back and cut me a check for 5,000. I have been without a TV since Feb of this year. I saw some info on the Samsung 1080p DLPs. I loved the picture and my wife agreed so we purchased the 61” We received it three weeks ago. My wife and I loved the set we stayed up mesmerized by the picture. Then all of a sudden I began seeing rainbows. I couldn’t believe it! I told myself I can tolerate them but a week into owning the set my wife after an hour or so kept going to bed early and complaining of headaches. I had a hunch that it was the TV giving her the headaches so I asked her to not watch the TV one night. I never told her why either. She had no head aches that night. The next evening after we watched TV together again and she started with a headache again. I boxed up the TV and sent it back to the store. I am TV- less again.
I told myself no compromises this time. I want a TV no matter what the cost and I want it soon. This is where I called up the corporate company and asked them why the SonyStyle web site is stating the TV has Wega Gate when the Owners manual clearly states it does not. He said that is an old owner’s manual drafted in June when Wega Gate was just coming out. He said yes it does have Wega Gate. They will be posting a “final” new one on their web site in the coming weeks with updated changes. I asked what the other changes are. He asked me to be more specific. He would send my questions off to the Design team in San Diego. I asked him.
1. What is the highest computer resolution of the set.
2. Screen shiny or matte?
3.1080p threw HDMI?
I received a call soon after with the answers. I was told that if my video card supports higher resolutions (1920X1200) the TV would rescale the image to 1920X 1080p. So yes the TV supports 1080p in the VGA input. The screen is shiny much like the Sony LCD computer monitors that say XBrite on them. Regarding the HDMI input being 1080p the answer was yes both of them will support it. I have my answers but I cannot believe them until I see the manual myself. Has any one else been told this information? Any help on these topics will be helpful. Thanks

WOW--If they actually understood your questions and their answers are true this set will fly out of the stores if the PQ is any where close to the Q006. Until this info I was thinking of waiting till spring 06 to wait for 1080P inputs on next gen.

Roy

HiDef good post. I'm not at all happy that the new Sonys have shiny screens. I hope they are not like the old CRT sets. If the sets supports VGA in 1080P then perhaps a converter could be bought if set top boxes are sold, in the future, that output in 1080P. I guess I'm going to have to wait to see the new JVC sets too.

The list price of the Panasonic 50PX50 plasma has dropped to $3999! One B&M website is offering 10% off of this, making this plasma $400 less than the 50XBR1. A same size plasma for less than a RPTV. How things have changed. $1400 less than the 60XBR1. No side speakers, too.

Tough choices once these sets can be compared. Life is so tough...

True, but remember the Panasonics are 720p, not 1080p....

I agree, if only all my decisions were this tough :D

WOW--If they actually understood your questions and their answers are true this set will fly out of the stores if the PQ is any where close to the Q006. Until this info I was thinking of waiting till spring 06 to wait for 1080P inputs on next gen.

Roy

Well thats very interesting, that's for sure. A contact I know in PA said no 1080p inputs....the press release from the Sony Technology Center said no 1080p inputs...don't get me wrong, this is good news, but I am not getting my hopes up.

I for one like the shiny screen -- I like the screens on the XBrite VAIOs and I also think the shiny reflective screen is what gives the Qualia picture a 3-d look. I'll be watching it in a dedicated light controlled room so reflections will be minimal.

SlickVic: I've never seen the screen on the XBrite but I do have a Plasma and the reflections are much better than my old CRT but they are still a distraction so I guess I'll have to wait for the set to be released to get a better idea.

I received a call soon after with the answers. I was told that if my video card supports higher resolutions (1920X1200) the TV would rescale the image to 1920X 1080p. So yes the TV supports 1080p in the VGA input. The screen is shiny much like the Sony LCD computer monitors that say XBrite on them. Regarding the HDMI input being 1080p the answer was yes both of them will support it. I have my answers but I cannot believe them until I see the manual myself. Has any one else been told this information? Any help on these topics will be helpful. Thanks


I also have heard from Sony people that the TV would upscale or rescale higher resolutions to 1080P through the HD-15 connection, but this is news to me that both HDMI ports will accept 1080P input. I've been told they would not by several Sony contacts so i would take this with a grain of salt until confirmed....

I for one like the shiny screen -- I like the screens on the XBrite VAIOs and I also think the shiny reflective screen is what gives the Qualia picture a 3-d look. I'll be watching it in a dedicated light controlled room so reflections will be minimal.

I'm not familiar with the XBrite screens. Could somebody with knowledge of these screens please elaborate.

I don't know if my standby analogy of using non glare glass actually applies to these RPTVs, but typically non glare glass diffuses the image from photographs making it softer and makes the blacks lighter. On more than one occassion I've thought of taking amonia to my GWIII to see if I could remove the coating. I suspect that it would help some, but just not enough. Then there is the explaining it to whoever I wind up selling it to.

[What kind of twisted logic is that? You could have said: this is JVC's first
1080p LCOS for RP and is Sony's second gen 1080p LCOS for RP , right?
Get real! In any case just try to compare Sony's Silicon Fabrication experience
with JVC's. Come on man, get serious! .

The reason I said what I did, the way that I did, was to emphasize that the product is not only the LCOS chip but also the rest of the TV. To me JVC has more experience producing under $5k LCOS RP TV’s than Sony. I don’t count the $13k Qualia as pertinent to the <$5k market.

You apparently do, I don’t agree.

You are dreaming here. Sony is deeply committed to LCD sales and will continue
to invest heavily in this department for the foreseeable future. Don't expect LCD
projection from Sony to go away anytime soon.

As to the possibility of Sony converting RP-LCD production to LCOS, I personally believe there would be a very good chance of it happening. Sony’s not going to want to loose business to DLP, why not produce the product that costs the same or less (LCOS) than LCD-RP and concentrate on it as the base RP-Product? Seems logical to me. Might also explain why the massively large and influential Sony decided to use an older LCD chassis for the debut of the SXRD.

I would imagine that you might be ultimately right in your indication of it happening “Any Time Soon” though. I fully anticipate Sony’s distribution channel to influence the sales of RP-LCD by not having as many SXRD’s as RP-LCD’s. thus the high sales of RP-LCD’s to follow.

I assure if you in the next few months there will be a major announcement that will render your last statement flat out wrong.

Sounds like exciting news!


ROTFLMAO on the idea that JVC can compete with Sony in any category of RPs. Do you
know how large of a company Sony is? - do you understand how great their influence
is on their distribution channel? - Their engineering resources? - Their semiconductor
experience? I give JVC a year - two years max to have their LCOS lunch eaten.


When I use the word compete it’s to describe my and other people’s willingness to buy a product based on it’s merits, not how large the company is that makes it or how great they’re influence on the market. Sony won’t earn my business by anything else but the product’s quality.

If Sony ends up selling 100 times as many SXRD’s than JVC but the JVC has a better overall picture I could care less why 100 times as many people chose to buy otherwise or whether Sony earns the title as most widely sold TV. Is the competition about what the majority of people might settle for?

Oh well, a few years from now we can look back on all this and...

What do you mean a few years from now? This is going down next month? I’m not going anywhere Tony, I’m as excited as anyone to see how these sets turn out.

I for one like the shiny screen -- I like the screens on the XBrite VAIOs and I also think the shiny reflective screen is what gives the Qualia picture a 3-d look. I'll be watching it in a dedicated light controlled room so reflections will be minimal.


I agree 100% with you, hopefully the reflections won't be too bad, but I definilty think the X-brite screens give the picture more depth and punch. It will be interesting because these will be the first time Sony used a screen like this for there big TV's. It won't be like previos XBR's and Qualia screens that are shinny because those are glass and those sets weight almost 200lbs and the Qualia weights over 200lbs I believe. This set is suppose to weight 112lbs. I actually am thinking back to the original Wega XBR that UMR owns, I believe those screens where also shinny but not made of glass so maybe it will be like those.. hmmm..

When I use the word compete it’s to describe my and other people’s willingness to buy a product based on it’s merits, not how large the company is that makes it or how great they’re influence on the market. Sony won’t earn my business by anything else but the product’s quality.

If Sony ends up selling 100 times as many SXRD’s than JVC but the JVC has a better overall picture I could care less why 100 times as many people chose to buy otherwise or whether Sony earns the title as most widely sold TV. Is the competition about what the majority of people might settle for?



Hello 1080p4me,

IF the JVC produces a set with a better PQ for your application, I see your point.

BUT consider this, if Sony is able to fabricate 100x the number of SXRD chips
they will have the economies of scale that will bring about a much lower
cost per chip. The new 1080p D-ILA chips occupy 35% more die area than the
new SXRDs and therefore are considerably more expensive ( assuming
same process ) even if the same number of sets were sold ( Die area vs.
cost is an exponential function not a linear function ). Sony doesn't sell on price
so this means much higher profits to fund even more R & D and if they choose
offer higher quality optics and electronics ( or perhaps even fund new cabinet
design :-)

Your original post detailed quite a bit of future market projections, etc.
so I assumed this was of interest to you.

So even IF this years JVC can come close to Sony, how long do you think
this will last with all of Sony's advantages? This is why I stated one year,
two years maximum until Sony eats JVCs LCOS lunch.

Best regards,

Tony

"Also once the brightness drops in plasma you can never get it back... "

In the first 5-10 years, you'd be very, very hard pressed to detect any loss of brightness. And I'm only posting this because of your repeated vitriol that's been paraded as fact.

I agree hard-core gamers might not be well served by plasmas -- if they are gaming >10 hours per week.

"Sony will likely discontinue RP-LCD though as soon as it is feasible to convert all production to LCOS."

Not any chance. They just announced a new generation of HTPS LCD parts a couple of months ago. It wll ship next year. The plan is definitely to keep RP LCD around for some time and to charge more for SXRD.

They can't abandon the low end (which is going to <$1,000 for a 42-inch RP set) and they won't slash their own margins on the high end for no reason (nor could they as SXRD production is still not large enough to cover their entire RP needs).

"Sony will likely discontinue RP-LCD though as soon as it is feasible to convert all production to LCOS."

Not any chance. They just announced a new generation of HTPS LCD parts a couple of months ago. It wll ship next year. The plan is definitely to keep RP LCD around for some time and to charge more for SXRD.

They can't abandon the low end (which is going to <$1,000 for a 42-inch RP set) and they won't slash their own margins on the high end for no reason (nor could they as SXRD production is still not large enough to cover their entire RP needs).

It's a totally absurd comment. Sony will be stepping up LCD RPTV production.

Sony has been eating everyone's lunch in the Microdisplay arena with their 3LCD's.

They are approaching sales of 40% of Microdisplays sold in this country being Sony 3LCD's. Everyone else is fighting for the crumbs.

These products have been an astounding success, the biggest in TV's since the invention of Color TV's. Why on earth would they abandon the most successful Microdisplay ever made that is still growing market share every week and threatens to drive all other competitors into price wars to merely try to capture a small fragment of Sony's dominance of the Microdisplay sector?


Sony may have their faults, but they are not stupid or insane. No one corners a market then abandons the product that got them there. They may improve on it, or reduce prices as production costs drop, but 3LCD's will be the dominant player in Microdisplays for the foreseeable future.


I agree SXRD & JVC D-ILA are likely to be the best 1080P displays this year, but neither they, nor any other LCoS or DLP based display will come close to the market penetration of the 3LCD's. You're talking about insignificant fleas on an elephant's back when you try to compare the sales of any other Microdisplay to LCD RP no matter how wonderful these displays prove to be....

I think Sony will have its hands full with the drop in Plasma prices, more companies producing LCOS based sets and the onslaught of newer 1080P sets. I could have picked up a Sammy 61" 1080P set for way under their MSRP so let the discounting begin. Panny Plasma sets PROBABLY have the PQ of what SXRD is trying to achieve right now. Well I haven't seen an SXRD set but I can tell you that the Panny blows away the DLP and LCD sets on the market. If Plasma prices could have fallen quicker it might have been Panny with a 40% market share. My wife knows nothing about TV's but she wanted a Plasma. Their is an attraction there because of the size. Women hate big TV's in general, but a thin set that can hang on a wall is sexy and appealing. I think the typical male has the assertion that bigger is better. I agree! There is much more impact on a larger set. Projection is the best but is limited to dark rooms and such. I just sold a 65" set and would like a 70" with 60" being the smallest one I would ever consider.

Re. JVC's supposed extra experience and putting out a second generation D-ILA, I was not aware that JVC had put out a 1080p D-ILA before?

I think Sony will have its hands full with the drop in Plasma prices, more companies producing LCOS based sets and the onslaught of newer 1080P sets. I could have picked up a Sammy 61" 1080P set for way under their MSRP so let the discounting begin. Panny Plasma sets PROBABLY have the PQ of what SXRD is trying to achieve right now. Well I haven't seen an SXRD set but I can tell you that the Panny blows away the DLP and LCD sets on the market. If Plasma prices could have fallen quicker it might have been Panny with a 40% market share. My wife knows nothing about TV's but she wanted a Plasma. Their is an attraction there because of the size. Women hate big TV's in general, but a thin set that can hang on a wall is sexy and appealing. I think the typical make has the assertion that bigger is better. I agree! There is much more impact on a larger set. Projection is the best but is limited to dark rooms and such. I just sold a 65" set and would like a 70" with 60" being the smallest one I would ever consider.

Sammy is notorious for fictitous MSRP's. They usually go for around half MSRP after they're around for 6-9 months and usually start selling around 30% below MSRP as soon as they're widely released. LCoS will be the coming contender for LCD RP in the microdisplay world, but not a serious one for a while. The LCD RP's just give the consumer too much bang for the buck and keep getting even cheaper. A lot of people feel exactly like your wife and will stick up their nose at any microdisplay. They want their Plasma! Needless to say, Plasma will be a big seller for a long time to come. Nothing else comes close to matching it's WOW Factor...

BenDover (love that childish name): The great thing about the JVC which I've posted before is the form. The 70" is about the same size as the 60" Sony SXRD.

BenDover (love that childish name): The great thing about the JVC which I've posted before is the form. The 70" is about the same size as the 60" Sony SXRD.

Does the JVC have a dynamic iris?

Tony...I don't know but I read a post from someone who was at a training seminar at JVC and saw the new sets which they said had CRT like blacks. This is all hersay but the new sets did get great reviews at CES so maybe they have gotten their act together. They have been around a long time and have been very innovative in many areas of HT so I wouldn't be so hard on them just because you hated the set you had. That was yesterdays news.

I for one like the shiny screen -- I like the screens on the XBrite VAIOs and I also think the shiny reflective screen is what gives the Qualia picture a 3-d look. I'll be watching it in a dedicated light controlled room so reflections will be minimal.

Let's face it...you either get a shiny screen that gives more of a 'looking through a window look' like a plasma provides, or you get the matte screen that reduces reflections, but imparts 'softer' look to the picture ,and introduces the so-called 'silk screen' effect....choose your poison. If it is shiny, and gives the SXRD more of a plasma look, I can deal with some reflection issues. Would be nice if SOMEONE has actually seen the thing and could verify what type screen they are really using.

Tony...I don't know but I read a post from someone who was at a training seminar at JVC and saw the new sets which they said had CRT like blacks. This is all hersay but the new sets did get great reviews at CES so maybe they have gotten their act together. They have been around a long time and have been very innovative in many areas of HT so I wouldn't be so hard on them just because you hated the set you had. That was yesterdays news.

Hi HomeGuy.

Forget about CRT blacks on the JVC :-) Whoever said that was smok'in some
really bad sh!t. Also consider that it was only a prototype at CES and that
they were using a bright nature scene HD feed and therefore we have
absolutely nothing to go on regarding the new JVC D-ILA BLs and CRs until
we see a production set.

The reason I ask regarding the dynamic iris is that the SXRDs will have one
and using such has proven to be a great way to increase CR and therefore
enable great shadow detail. If JVC doesn't use a dynamic iris this will
probably put them considerably behind the SXRDs. I guess they have
to save somehow considering the huge cost of their 1080p D-ILA chips.

But you are right, I will try to keep an open mind on their future sets...

Best regards,

Tony

I WOULDN'T CALL MYSELF VIDEOPHILES (LOL) LIKE YOU GUYS (not that there is anything wrong with that), but sometimes there are things you just can't live with. :)

THANKS! - Matthew


Someone's been watching way toooo much Seinfeld!! :D
Snoop

Re. JVC's supposed extra experience and putting out a second generation D-ILA, I was not aware that JVC had put out a 1080p D-ILA before?

I am giving JVC credit for manufacturing and distributing prior LCOS based under $5k sets.

I don't know if you guys read the headlines on the main page of the AVS forum, but Sony announced they are going to wipe out the "WEGA" name (calling it 'too old' and 'associated with tube sets') and will now be using the "BRAVIA" name.

So now we have BRAVIA (which is what the SXRD will be) and "QUALIA" :D

I don't know if you guys read the headlines on the main page of the AVS forum, but Sony announced they are going to wipe out the "WEGA" name (calling it 'too old' and 'associated with tube sets') and will now be using the "BRAVIA" name.

So now we have BRAVIA (which is what the SXRD will be) and "QUALIA" :DI believe BRAVIA is intended for use with the flat panel LCD sets, not rear projection micro displays.

Here's the original Sony PR:
http://news.sel.sony.com/pressrelease/6066

The real question, will they encourage everyone to pronounce BRAVIA as BRAWIA?

Since I'm the exiled Prince of Belgravia, that name is a little too close for comfort...

Wega means quality Bravia means???? It's probably the same guy who invented the dumbo ears on the new sets. I would have called the new sets Trinitron HD.

The real question, will they encourage everyone to pronounce BRAVIA as BRAWIA?

...too funny

I'll bet Queer Eye for the Str8 Guy will be the advertising screen shot.

...I called up the corporate company and asked them why the SonyStyle web site is stating the TV has Wega Gate when the Owners manual clearly states it does not. He said that is an old owner’s manual drafted in June when Wega Gate was just coming out. He said yes it does have Wega Gate. They will be posting a “final” new one on their web site in the coming weeks with updated changes. I asked what the other changes are. He asked me to be more specific. He would send my questions off to the Design team in San Diego. I asked him.
1. What is the highest computer resolution of the set.
2. Screen shiny or matte?
3.1080p threw HDMI?
I received a call soon after with the answers. I was told that if my video card supports higher resolutions (1920X1200) the TV would rescale the image to 1920X 1080p. So yes the TV supports 1080p in the VGA input. The screen is shiny much like the Sony LCD computer monitors that say XBrite on them. Regarding the HDMI input being 1080p the answer was yes both of them will support it. I have my answers but I cannot believe them until I see the manual myself. Has any one else been told this information? Any help on these topics will be helpful. Thanks

And the info you got is on the KDSR60XBR1??? Could you get them to email the info to you so you can post it here?

Thanks,
Sean

Wega means quality Bravia means???? It's probably the same guy who invented the dumbo ears on the new sets. I would have called the new sets Trinitron HD.

I'd assume it's a use of the root of "Bravo"...

Hopefully (in regards to SXRD) it would be more appropriate to use "Encore" in comparison to the Qualia 006. :)

I always felt "Wega" was too close to "Vega" anyway.

Wega means quality Bravia means???? It's probably the same guy who invented the dumbo ears on the new sets. I would have called the new sets Trinitron HD.While Qualia is come out of latin BRAVIA is plain old maketing 101:
BRAVIA, short for "Best Resolution Audio Visual Integrated Architecture,"

Maybe this is old news, but the manual to the KDS-R60XBR1 is on sonys web site

I can't post the URL for some reason, buy go to sonysyle, seach the KDS-R60XBR1 and click the Specifications tab -

You will see the PDF for the manual there.

Soon I'll have an oppurtunity to do a mock-up of the SXRD :D of how much room the TV will take up (where I want to put it). I don't know who I was kidding before, when I said in previous posts that I'm going to put 2 TV's side-by-side. Even if I did not put my AV rack in between them (and just my speakers right next to the SXRD), the SXRD and speakers will take up the length of the wall.

Got to measure (is 4 feet OR 4 inches [?], I'll have to check the 60" manual) from the wall then go from there. I'm just going to use some tape to do the mock-up so I know the "base" (not stand) dimensions. And a piece of cardboard for the "screen" if I can find one big/large enough ("thankfully" I work for a place that generates cardboard everyday).

Thanks.

I always felt "Wega" was too close to "Vega" anyway.

I always thought it was Vega. I thought it was the design of logo that confused people...the v with its shadow. Vega as in the star perhaps? "Research!"

Hey wait...I am not a techie, so not sure if this makes total sense. Is it possible, given Sony's famous record of red push, that Vega is an acronym for Very Egregious Gamma Adjustment?

Hello 1080p4me,
BUT consider this, if Sony is able to fabricate 100x the number of SXRD chips
they will have the economies of scale that will bring about a much lower
cost per chip. The new 1080p D-ILA chips occupy 35% more die area than the
new SXRDs and therefore are considerably more expensive ( assuming
same process ) even if the same number of sets were sold ( Die area vs.
cost is an exponential function not a linear function ).

While it is true that Sony can get more chips per wafer, you're assuming that Sony gets the same or better yields than JVC. These panels are notoriously tricky to make as several manufacturers have discovered. I don't know what Sony's yields are. Do you?

While it is true that Sony can get more chips per wafer, you're assuming that Sony gets the same or better yields than JVC. These panels are notoriously tricky to make as several manufacturers have discovered. I don't know what Sony's yields are. Do you?

Yes. I am assuming that the % yields will be about the same in the above analysis
but I believe Sony has the potential to produce a much higher yield. Defect
density will be inherently lower for a wafer with many more die per and this
tends to increase the yield substantially.

Both of these are new LCOS designs on a new process. Do you know which
one will yield better? If Sony uses 100X times as many chips who will have
the most opportunity to improve yields ? Whose semicoductor experience do
you believe has the higher chance of delivering higher yields?

The way Sony is gearing up production in PA it is apparent they believe
they will be having great yields to be able to supply the quantities they
are forecasting.

Both of these are new LCOS designs on a new process. Do you know which one will yield better? If Sony uses 100X times as many chips who will have the most opportunity to improve yields ? Whose semicoductor experience do you believe has the higher chance of delivering higher yields?

I've worked in both LCD and semiconductor manufacturing. All I can say is their are a number of other factors besides the ability to produce the most backplanes. Beyond that, I'm not willing to speculate.

The way Sony is gearing up production in PA it is apparent they believe they will be having great yields to be able to supply the quantities they are forecasting.

I hope you're right. I really want both companies to succeed. It's better for us as consumers. The more the merrier is what I say.

In fact, I have TV's from Sony, Samsung, JVC and Toshiba and I'm pleased with all of them. I'm probably easier to please than most, I guess.

In fact, I have TV's from Sony, Samsung, JVC and Toshiba and I'm pleased with all of them. I'm probably easier to please than most, I guess.

I have also had TVs from all the above - the only one I hated was
my 52 in. JVC D-ILA - I could never get use to the grey blacks and mud
for shadow detail.

Yes. I am assuming that the % yields will be about the same in the above analysis
but I believe Sony has the potential to produce a much higher yield. Defect
density will be inherently lower for a wafer with many more die per and this
tends to increase the yield substantially.

Both of these are new LCOS designs on a new process. Do you know which
one will yield better? If Sony uses 100X times as many chips who will have
the most opportunity to improve yields ? Whose semicoductor experience do
you believe has the higher chance of delivering higher yields?

The way Sony is gearing up production in PA it is apparent they believe
they will be having great yields to be able to supply the quantities they
are forecasting.

How can you assume that Sony can get better yields than JVC? Remember that JVCs parent company is Panasonic and they have more semiconductor mfr. experience than Sony. Unless someone has access the yield numbers, I wouldn't trust any info on this forum. As stated already, LCOS is a complex process and we have no idea of the detailed mechanisms governing yield. And you can bet that these companies aren't going to make that public. Whether you like the sets or not, JVC was mass producing LCOS RPTVs that were priced in line with Sonys low end LCDs. I don't know if they were buying in, but that experience delivering product goes a long way to making the next generation (re:1080p) a lot more manufacturable. Until we see what the new JVCs look like, making assumptions about their performance is tenuous. The only reliable info we have at this point is from those who saw the 1080 at CES, and it was pretty close the the Qualia.

Paul

I have also had TVs from all the above - the only one I hated was
my 52 in. JVC D-ILA - I could never get use to the grey blacks and mud
for shadow detail.

I don't doubt that.

From what I've read in these forums, this year's 'g' series has improved over the 'z' series and they're probably better than transmissive LCD TV's. Are they as good as Sony's sxrd's? Probably not but I bet (hope?) they'll be cheaper.

I don't doubt that.

From what I've read in these forums, this year's 'g' series has improved over the 'z' series and they're probably better than transmissive LCD TV's. Are they as good as Sony's sxrd's? Probably not but I bet (hope?) they'll be cheaper.

I have seen them and concede they may be an improvement over the first
gen but still far from acceptable. They can compete with most LCD projection
very well in my opinon ( exception would be the A10s ). You can count on the
JVC 1080p's being cheaper :-)

I believe the 1080P sets, from JVC, are re-designed form the 720P sets with increased rez and CR that I belive is close to 5k to 1, if memory serves. But I put very little subatance into numbers and would like to see one for myself. If the JVC sets are close to the new SXRD in PQ and cheaper I would buy JVC because of form factor. No dumbo ears to be more specific-I actually like the look of the dumbo ears but it makes the set way bigger then need be. A 60" SXRD is about the same width as a 70" JVC as I've posted before. Sony dropped the ball on this one.

I have seen them and concede they may be an improvement over the first
gen but still far from acceptable. They can compete with most LCD projection
very well in my opinon ( exception would be the A10s ). You can count on the
JVC 1080p's being cheaper :-)

Do you feel that the 50 inch A-10 is the equal of DLP overall, or inferior? I am on the fence to buy a 50 inch A-10 for around 2 grand ( and it fits my existing furniture), vs. pay at least double the price for the SXRD 60 inch ( since the dumbo ear 50 inch won't fit in my space anyhow). I will also have to buy a new piece of furniture to sit the thing on ( Ethan Allen has a nice plasma stand for about a Grand). I currently have a GWIII, and the black levels and shadow details are very wanting. Is the A-10 really that much improved? And if it is, how much better do you think the SXRD will be? All input is appreciated.

I believe the 1080P sets, from JVC, are re-designed form the 720P sets with increased rez and CR that I belive is close to 5k to 1, if memory serves. But I put very little subatance into numbers and would like to see one for myself. If the JVC sets are close to the new SXRD in PQ and cheaper I would buy JVC because of form factor. No dumbo ears to be more specific-I actually like the look of the dumbo ears but it makes the set way bigger then need be. A 60" SXRD is about the same width as a 70" JVC as I've posted before. Sony dropped the ball on this one.

They claimed 2000 to 1 on the 720p RPs and were measured at 700 to 1.
Let's hope they get closer to their spec on the 1080p sets :-)

Do you feel that the 50 inch A-10 is the equal of DLP overall, or inferior? I am on the fence to buy a 50 inch A-10 for around 2 grand ( and it fits my existing furniture), vs. pay at least double the price for the SXRD 60 inch ( since the dumbo ear 50 inch won't fit in my space anyhow). I will also have to buy a new piece of furniture to sit the thing on ( Ethan Allen has a nice plasma stand for about a Grand). I currently have a GWIII, and the black levels and shadow details are very wanting. Is the A-10 really that much improved? And if it is, how much better do you think the SXRD will be? All input is appreciated.

If your talking specifically for BL and CR, the 1080p DLPs are currently KING.
The SXRDs are likely, in my opinon, to be very close to the 1080p DLPs in
this area.

The A10s are much better than prior LCDs ( including GWIII ) or JVC LCOS
for BL and CR and some people prefer LCD projection over other technologies
or don't see much a difference so if you fall into that category "go for it'.

If your talking specifically for BL and CR, the 1080p DLPs are currently KING.
The SXRDs are likely, in my opinon, to be very close to the 1080p DLPs in
this area.

The A10s are much better than prior LCDs ( including GWIII ) or JVC LCOS
though and some people prefer LCD projection over other technologies
or don't see much a difference so if you fall into that category "go for it'.

Maybe I should just give the A-10 an in-home trial from a store that gives me 30 days return. If I like the A-10 I save a ton of cash..if not I can always return it, and go for the SXRD. Oh the decisions..lol :)

Let's face it...you either get a shiny screen that gives more of a 'looking through a window look' like a plasma provides, or you get the matte screen that reduces reflections, but imparts 'softer' look to the picture ,and introduces the so-called 'silk screen' effect....choose your poison. If it is shiny, and gives the SXRD more of a plasma look, I can deal with some reflection issues. Would be nice if SOMEONE has actually seen the thing and could verify what type screen they are really using.

If you mean reflections as looking through a window then yes. If you mean like looking through an opening and getting the 3D feeling then that has to do with picture quality, how close it looks like real life, then no. My Mits CRT-RPTV with its protective screen off accomplishes this quite nicely. One can have no reflections and virtualy no glare and have a great picture- the only kind acceptable to me.

If you mean reflections as looking through a window then yes. If you mean like looking through an opening and getting the 3D feeling then that has to do with picture quality, how close it looks like real life, then no. My Mits CRT-RPTV with its protective screen off accomplishes this quite nicely. One can have no reflections and virtualy no glare and have a great picture- the only kind acceptable to me.

I have never once seen a TV with a matte screen that has a good a PQ as one with a shiny screen. I have seen the Mits with the shiny screen on, and off, and the PQ is much better with it on in my opinion. If it wasn't better, they wouldn't have used it in the first place, and risk upsetting people in stores with the reflections. The picture loses contrast, and depth (the 3D feeling you see on plasmas) when the shiny screen is removed. The same will be true of the SXRD screen. We should soon know what type they actually used. I will be suprised if it is shiny though, since they show poorly in stores that way. I think the shiny screen cost Mitsubishi a lot of sales.

snip.... One can have no reflections and virtualy no glare and have a great picture- the only kind acceptable to me.


Gee, thanks for clearing that up. We wouldn't have known that by the 1,110 other similar OT posts on you predilection for CRT :rolleyes:

Gee, thanks for clearing that up. We wouldn't have known that by the 1,110 other similar OT posts on you predilection for CRT :rolleyes:

You obviously didn't get the point and only wanted to take a cheap shot. Hope you feel better now. This has nothing to do with CRT, this applies to screen type. I was just using my set as an example. There must be other display types with this type of screen. I don't care what type of display it uses but it better have a no reflections, virtually no glare screen. I don't know how anyone settles for less but that is just my preference. I don't think anyone would stand for it at a theater, why put up with it at home?

So do we just have it from one source that the screen is the reflective type instead of the matte XS-esque screen? If that's the case, I may end up rethinking our purchase...:( We just can't handle having a mirror in our great room...too many windows. Hopefully (much to the chagrin of many others) this info is incorrect and the SXRDs do have the matte screen (even if it slightly compromises PQ).

Jason

This has nothing to do with CRT, this applies to screen type. I was just using my set as an example. There must be other display types with this type of screen. I don't care what type of display it uses but it better have a no reflections, virtually no glare screen. I don't know how anyone settles for less but that is just my preference. I don't think anyone would stand for it at a theater, why put up with it at home?

Tube tvs, plasmas, computer moniters all have glass.. Imagine what they would like without them :( . I hope sxrds do have the glass but i highly doubt it...

I thought we collectively settled this along time ago.

Say it with me brothas and sistas...

The weight is the key...

... to reflec-tivity.

Here's the numbers:
60" XS955 = 113lbs = Non-reflective
60" SXRD = 112lbs
60" XBR = 173lbs = Reflective
70" XBR = 204lbs = Reflective
70" Q006 = 273lbs = Kirsty Alley = Reflective

I thought we collectively settled this along time ago.

Say it with me brothas and sistas...

The weight is the key...

... to reflec-tivity.

Here's the numbers:
60" XS955 = 113lbs = Non-reflective
60" SXRD = 112lbs
60" XBR = 173lbs = Reflective
70" XBR = 204lbs = Reflective
70" Q006 = 273lbs = Kirsty Alley = Reflective

"Kirsty Alley" :D

Ill take the Kristy alley Qualia anyday :)

...

[i]The weight is the key...

...

According to your key, I must be an optical mirror. :D

Just adding to the in(s)ane. :rolleyes:

Tube tvs, plasmas, computer moniters all have glass.. Imagine what they would like without them :( . I hope sxrds do have the glass but i highly doubt it...

I don't have to imagine- my set :) Oh, and my set outweighs a Qualia also :D

On a side note: while researching the data above, I noticed the 60" XBR RPTV has been removed from the SonyStyle website. The 70" XBR remains.

Just saw the latest SXRD ad in this month's "Home Theater" mag. and the screen is definitely *behind* the bezel i.e. matte type mounting but it appears fairly reflective in the ad. Just wanted to add to the foray here.

*Maybe* it's a different design altogether.

Just saw the latest SXRD ad in this month's "Home Theater" mag. and the screen is definitely *behind* the bezel i.e. matte type mounting but it appears fairly reflective in the ad. Just wanted to add to the foray here.

*Maybe* it's a different design altogether.Trouble maker ;) :D

Trouble maker ;) :D

I said "this month" but actually it's the October issue.

It looks pretty damn cool in the ad too. :)

"One incredible HD experience. Zero wheels."

Interesting post I just read in the Qualia owners' thread:


"Originally Posted by Zechman
The new sets will have the same rear panel for inputs (which is also the same as on the current XS line), the same iLink functionality, the same Memory Stick functionality, the same scaler (DRC-MFv2), the same input capability (no 1080p via HDMI), the same menus (see the manual), the same remote, the same CableCard slot, the same ATSC tuner, the same optical output from the tuner & CableCard, etc. etc. etc. The only differences that I've been able to find have been those related to the VGA input and the newer iris.

So you tell me. Very different, or near identical?

--Dwayne



While it remains speculation, it appears the new Sony SXRD televisions will benefit from newer, current technology, but likely will not have all the bells and whistles (quality?) of the Qualia flagship model. "



The last comment is not mine, but is part of the response.
Here if you want to see for yourself: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6110226#post6110226

I've got no clue what actresses have to do with this TV, but her name is Kirstie Alley and she is not particularly reflective.

So do we just have it from one source that the screen is the reflective type instead of the matte XS-esque screen? If that's the case, I may end up rethinking our purchase...:( We just can't handle having a mirror in our great room...too many windows. Hopefully (much to the chagrin of many others) this info is incorrect and the SXRDs do have the matte screen (even if it slightly compromises PQ).

Jason

check out the Sammy 1080p sets - great PQ and no reflections...

I've got no clue what actresses have to do with this TV, but her name is Kirstie Alley and she is not particularly reflective.

ROTLMAO :-)

I've got no clue what actresses have to do with this TV, but her name is Kirstie Alley and she is not particularly reflective.

LOL I'm not much for her reflection either.

check out the Sammy 1080p sets - great PQ and no reflections...
No thanks...I like the "zero wheels" concept...:p BTW, how are those paperweights? :D

Jason

I've got no clue what actresses have to do with this TV, but her name is Kirstie Alley and she is not particularly reflective.
We might need to hold out for the 70" to get the "whole picture!" :D

Jason

No thanks...I like the "zero wheels" concept...:p BTW, how are those paperweights? :D

Jason

LOL - they are doing great :-) I guess you can always comb your hair
while you brag about your new three chip :-)

We might need to hold out for the 70" to get the "whole picture!" :D

Jason

At the rate she is going you probably need to wait for the 80 in. :-)

check out the Sammy 1080p sets - great PQ and no reflections...Go oil your color wheel. ;)

Go oil your color wheel. ;)

Luckily I didn't spit out my water all over my keyboard. :D

Go oil your color wheel. ;)

I heard the squeak too - went to oil my color wheel and it turned
out to be sycore's last brain cell screaming for help...

I heard the squeak too - went to oil my color wheel and it turned
out to be sycore's last brain cell screaming for help...

And then.... there was just silence.

And then.... there was just silence.

There goes my wireless mouse - my frig'in side hurts now :-)

Dlp will be as reliable as these Sxrds as long as you use Mobil1 Synthetic for Oil.. :o

Go oil your color wheel. ;)

Was this a quote from SYCORE??

Dlp will be as reliable as these Sxrds as long as you use Mobil1 Synthetic for Oil.. :o

If you turn your DLP on and off a lot, you should use Castro GTX Start-Up Motor Oil (for the Color Wheel). :o

Let's face it...you either get a shiny screen that gives more of a 'looking through a window look' like a plasma provides, or you get the matte screen that reduces reflections, but imparts 'softer' look to the picture ,and introduces the so-called 'silk screen' effect....choose your poison. If it is shiny, and gives the SXRD more of a plasma look, I can deal with some reflection issues. Would be nice if SOMEONE has actually seen the thing and could verify what type screen they are really using.

I think it depends on your room setup as to which is better for each person. To me, a shiny screen does give a better looking picture, but if your room is set up so that the tv is in a spot where it will get reflections from windows or lights, then its better to have a matte finish. The only spot in my room luckily for me is in a place where i will get virtually no reflections, so for me personally, i do hope its got a shiny or at least semi-shiny screen. The best thing would be for the screen to be removeable so we all could be happy.

If you turn your DLP on and off a lot, you should use Castro GTX Start-Up Motor Oil (for the Color Wheel). :o

And don't forget that 68 pound paper weight disguised as a UPS so
that you don't have to wait 10 minutes to turn it back on :-)

And don't forget that 68 pound paper weight disguised as a UPS so
that you don't have to wait 10 minutes to turn it back on :-)
Yeah, I'd much rather trust all of my expensive gear to stuff made by Monster Cable...:p ;)
Who's ever heard of Panamax anyways??? They don't sell it at BB or CC, so it must be crap! :D

Jason

Well Tony you could always upgrade to colorwheel free DLP but you have to wear the proper viewing glasses:

http://store1.yimg.com/I/rainbowsymphony_1857_19058212.gif

The reason I said what I did, the way that I did, was to emphasize that the product is not only the LCOS chip but also the rest of the TV. To me JVC has more experience producing under $5k LCOS RP TV’s than Sony. I don’t count the $13k Qualia as pertinent to the <$5k market.

You apparently do, I don’t agree.

I think the point that was being made was that the chips used in the Qualia were part of the development that is now bringing us these new "lower-priced" SXRD chips. It seems you see the Qualia as a separate product. I don't think that's it. On the contrary, I think it gave Sony the perfect test run for mass production. The Qualia wasn't mass-produced by Sony's standards, but it's a far cry from internal-use-only prototypes. Perhaps the price jump from $10,000 to $13,000 when the Qualia first came out had to do with how many good chips they could output (not a semiconductor specialist here, so I won't get into the "yields" discussion). Perhaps they realized they had to price it higher and they corrected their expectations and found out where improvements had to be made. The early adopters (Qualia owners) got a TV with just about every feature out there as a "reward", if you want to call it that. I'll bet Sony paid a lot of attention to their feedback too.

Anyway, I think the Qualia was the perfect test bench and that it had everything to do with the ability to bring these chips below the $5000 price point.

Well Tony you could always upgrade to colorwheel free DLP but you have to wear the proper viewing glasses:

http://store1.yimg.com/I/rainbowsymphony_1857_19058212.gif
Phenomenal...absolutely phenomenal...my hat's off (perpetually) to you! :D :D :D

That's how I've always envisioned him...

Jason

Phenomenal...absolutely phenomenal...my hat's off (perpetually) to you! :D :D :D

That's how I've always envisioned him...

JasonGolly. I'm gonna have to up your salary. Okay, one extra anchovie on your pizza! :D

Go oil your color wheel. ;)

Hey! I own the trademark on the tag line! Seeing as I was the first to use it.
Along with,

Them rainbows must have you hyp-no-tized!

Those DLP Color wheel glasses rule, though.
Do you use them with the new TI 1080p "wobule" chip?

http://store1.yimg.com/I/rainbowsymphony_1857_19058212.gif[/QUOTE]



I hope the new Iris dont have this kinda effect..

check out the Sammy 1080p sets - great PQ and no reflections...

And rainbows at no extra charge :)

I think it depends on your room setup as to which is better for each person. To me, a shiny screen does give a better looking picture, but if your room is set up so that the tv is in a spot where it will get reflections from windows or lights, then its better to have a matte finish. The only spot in my room luckily for me is in a place where i will get virtually no reflections, so for me personally, i do hope its got a shiny or at least semi-shiny screen. The best thing would be for the screen to be removeable so we all could be happy.

Excellent points...but one thing is for sure...this bunch (including me) will NEVER be happy with ANY TV. We want perfection that doesn't yet exist. But I will stay aboard the upgrade wagon every couple years until I get there. :)

Hey! I own the trademark on the tag line! Seeing as I was the first to use it.
Along with,

Them rainbows must have you hyp-no-tized!

Those DLP Color wheel glasses rule, though.
Do you use them with the new TI 1080p "wobule" chip?
Well I saw it on MY computer. :D


All future classics! Where do I send the royalties?