Sony SXRD 50" and 60" - Oct/Nov [Text View] - Page 23

Dennis Dickerso

10-12-05, 07:12 PM

Hi all,

Just got back from looking at my second 60" SXRD and with similar results. The picture was noticeably soft. I noted this yesterday when I compared a different 60" to the 720 Sony LCDs nearby, but the difference was on modest. Today, however, the neighboring sets were a Mitsu and Samsung 1080p and the difference was much more pronounced. Subjectively the 60XBR1 looked maybe 85% as sharp as the other two. A friend who was with me and even the salesman agreed that the Sony just looked a bit fuzzy. :( In fact, the thought that struck me was that I would have expected the comparison to have turned out in the exact opposite way (ie, wobulated 1080p DLP looking 85-90% as sharp as the SXRD). What's even more bizarre is that the Qualia 70" in another room was much sharper as well, so I don't think that it's just the smaller screen sizes that were giving this impression. And the sets were right next to each other on the wall so I doubt that it was a feed problem in this case (the salesman even said that they'd moved the set yesterday because they thought this might be the issue, but that it made little difference). Even the 50" Sony A10 LCD looked sharper to us.

As yesterday, the set was driven on the component input and the pro mode was engaged. It did occur to me later that I didn't check to be certain that the NR was turned off nor that the DRC mode was set to Cinemotion. Either of these things may make an improvement in the level of detail in the image. I will try to go back this evening and play with these settings. I will also visit the one other store in the area that's supposed to have one of these on display.

This situation is driving me nuts, as I'm seeing rave after rave about these sets from owners and now from WSR as well with the high level of detail as one of the main points! :confused: Not only that, but the 50" SXRD that I saw looked demonstrably clearer than either 60". Something must be out of whack with the setup for these sets, but I have a hard time blaming the feed in this case since the 1080p DLPs right next to it presumably would have similar issues.

A rolloff of the component vs. the HDMI or OTA inputs is the only thing I can think of that may account for this issue. A possible reason why this may not be getting flagged by owners is that they are probably only using component inputs for DVD, if at all, and using either the OTA tuner or a satellite box with HDMI for HD. If the component input were rolling off the highest HD frequencies it probably wouldn't be too noticeable at DVD signal bandwidths (even 480p). This theory is leant some credence by the fact that the Qualia was, according to the salesman, being driven through it's HDMI port and looked much sharper.

So the question then is, has anyone compared the difference between the HDMI and component inputs for an HD signal on their set? If so, does the component input produce any noticeable softening vs. HDMI?

Sorry for the long post. I really want to buy this set, but I need to figure out what the heck's going on before plunking down $4-5k.

Thanks,
Alan

Might it not be that the 70" Qualia uses a larger chip (so its magnified less by the optical train), while the 50" and 60" share the same, smaller chipset?

brenzo

10-12-05, 07:40 PM

I have been waiting all summer to buy the Sony 70"Qualia unitl I read about the 60"SXRD. However, I want a 70" display. Does anyone know if Sony plans or has schedueld to release a 70" SXRD? Any advice? Already have 60" Sony XBR bought last fall. Thanks for the info.

mondo3

10-12-05, 08:17 PM

There's a 50" now on display at the St. James FS in Winnipeg. Listed at cdn msrp. I'm very glad to see that the screen is not reflective like a plasma display as my livingroom has high sun exposure. While I din't care for the speakers, it's not a show stopper. I did find the reflective black border to be quite distracting though. There was no remote around, so I couldn't experiment with the settings. They were playing The Incredibles dvd (strangely enough, all the other tv's were showing a high def loop). I was impressed with the black levels and non SDE.

Jake Sm

10-12-05, 08:28 PM

A smaller set will always look sharper, better simply because it has
greater pixel density,

That would be assuming the pixel size is the same in both units, that the fill factor is the same in both units , and the light engine is the same in both units.

which in effect makes it higher resolution.

No, but it may APPEAR that way.

Bill

10-12-05, 08:39 PM

I brought my wife to CC in Danvers, MA where they had recently put a 50" SXRD on display. She wasn't crazy about the shiny bezel and wondered if there was a model that didn't have speakers since I was going to use mine. I told her that I thought the set look like a serving tray with handles on either end and that if they had a monitor I would have opted for it. Having speakers on a set like the Sony seems to me to be like putting training wheels on a Harley.
All the units of various manufacturers on display in the display room at CC were in need of fine tuning (too saturated for a start) which I am sure will suprise no one. That being said, at first glance I thought the Sony had the best picture but I wasn't sure if I would be aware of the difference at home without the side by side comparison. They were all tuned to an HD Discovery Channel program on the Australian outback. Suddenly there was a shot of the outback as night was falling, all the sets had the same picture and were uniformly black on the bottom on the screen - except the Sony. The Sony displayed discernable shades of green and detail of the foliage. That blew me away. Some of you might say it was just that the Sony was better adjusted that the others - I don't believe it. Based on that and many of the reviews above I am getting the 60" SXRD.

You're seeing what CRT watchers have always seen and even more than SXRD. It is called shadow detail.

Jake Sm

10-12-05, 08:53 PM

I suppose its possible that if someone is used to regularly viewing a 50" TV and then view a 60"+ TV it is entirely possible that the bigger TV will look softer

yes, look at your 4 mega-pixel camera as a 3x5 then look at it as an 8x10...quite a differance.

concussion

10-12-05, 08:56 PM

westa6969

10-12-05, 08:58 PM

Hello West, did you look at Resellerratings they have a "O" you could be the first to give them a rating. http://www.resellerratings.com/seller7265.html

I am thinking also of buying from them same price as OneCall's had, I just like to see the price under 4 bills.

Good luck
Not everyone is rated by resellerratings - what's more important is their BBB rating, Dunn & Bradstreet listing and INC500 Awards and the fact they are authorized dealers for Sony and most other manufacturers.

They have a section on their website with testimonials and their customer base includes many Fortune 500 companies and universities and they are GSA approved. The warranty is from Warrantech and at a good price and they are the premier Warranty company. I'm a Professional Purchasing and IT Manager trained in Ecommerce Security so I'm pretty thorough on doing background checks of my vendors at work and then at home. You'll find many On-line vendors are not listed through resellerratiings - they are good to use but many won't be found there as much like "MySimon" comparison shopping system the manufacturers listed must pay a fee to participate - most are not free nowadays. Not trying to sell anyone on where to buy actually just trying to help folks make a safe and secure transaction based upon research that's been done on DTVCity in Atlanta but your welcome to dig further and hope you find the deal of a lifetime!

Yes, Onecall and Vann's are also excellent and Sony authorized but they were still selling MSRP last I looked. Good vendors to consider though and I've bought through Vann's before with excellent service. Thanks :D

Tele-TV

10-12-05, 11:38 PM

AbMagFab

10-12-05, 11:49 PM

concussion

10-12-05, 11:51 PM

AlanM

10-12-05, 11:52 PM

I suppose its possible that if someone is used to regularly viewing a 50" TV and then view a 60"+ TV it is entirely possible that the bigger TV will look softer. That has been my experience after having had a 50" TV for the past three years. Fwiw...
The 50" Samsung DLP looks sharper TO ME* than the 61" model.
The 52" Mitsubishi DLP looks sharper TO ME* than the 62" model.
The 50" SXRD looks sharper TO ME* than the 60" model.
*YMMV ;)

FWIW, I did try to account for this today by standing further back (about 1/3) from the SXRD than the Sammy and Mits. And I stood in closer when looking at the 50" SXRD as well. As long as the set fills the same degree of arc in the field of vision the perceived detail level should be equivalent, all else being equal.

Also, in an earlier post I recounted my experience at CC where a 60" A20 and 60" XS (1366 X 768 IIRC) were flanking the SXRD and both looked clearer (though just a bit). However, the SXRD clobbered the other two for contrast, black level and shadow detail, as well as SDE / smoothness (no contest in those areas). I repeated this experiment tonight at a different CC with similar results. I made absolutely certain that NR was turned off and tried the extreme ranges of all the controls related to sharpness (sharpness, DTE, and detail enhancer) just to see what would happen. I realize that normally all of this stuff should be turned way down or off but I wanted to give it a shot. I still could not achieve the level of sharpness and detail that I was seeing in the 60" LCDs nor a 61" Sammy 720p :eek: nearby. I also tried the various DRC setting and DRC palettes to no avail.

The truly mystifying part of this is that I can tell from looking at the density of the pixel grid up close (have to be at like 6" !!) the SXRD chip is easily capable of greater detail than these other sets. It just seems like the signal that it's being handed by the internal electronics is not up to the task in the settings that I've seen.

I really don't mean to seem critical of these sets. In fact, I fully intended to buy one as soon as I could see a good demo. I think it's just bugging me that, based on the early feedback, I really expected these things to show a certain degree of overall PQ improvement compared to the 1080p DLPs (which are definitely not flawless either) but, so far, I'm not personally seeing it. Of course YMMV (and apparently in this case it does for just about everyone but me). :(

Thanks for all feedback and ideas,
Alan

skijackz

10-13-05, 12:06 AM

Okay, just picked up my 60" XBR1 and I love it! Looks amazing.

Question - The PC VGA port works fine, but my laptop went to 1280x1024, and the TV shows this in a 4x3 box. I know I can zoom it and stretch it, but does anyone know if the VGA port on this TV will accept a 1080x1920 signal?

I'd like to get 1-1 pixel mapping if possible. Hopefully I won't need to use a DVI port and a super expensive graphics card?

What video card do you have? I know that the latest ATI drivers need to be modified for Widescreen. I learned the hard way with my Dell D810 widescreen.

Also, why are you using the VGA port? Most new video cards have a DVI port and if you are using the PC as an HTPC, make the connection with a DVI->HDMI adapter. Much better resolution. Somebody earlier stated that Sony had crippled the VGA port but I don't know if that is true or not.

HomeGuy

10-13-05, 12:23 AM

I've logged about 50 hours of viewing on my 60" SXRD and can tell you that I made the right deciscion to buy this set. The PQ is amazing and much better than the Pioneer Plasma it replaced. I don't find the PQ soft at all but very sharp. I have 0 complaints and think that Sony has a winner here. I also was watching an industry meeting on HD and compression. It doesn't sound like 1080P will be here any time soon. I would say a few years from what was being said. The biggest culprit to poor PQ is the compression being used. Therefore, I can't wait for HD DVD. Once these players come out it'll bring our new Sonys to a new level of performance that can't be achieved with the overly compressed signals we have now and low rez DVD.

CHG

10-13-05, 12:24 AM

Yes, Onecall and Vann's are also excellent and Sony authorized but they were still selling MSRP last I looked. Good vendors to consider though and I've bought through Vann's before with excellent service. Thanks :D

Looks like Onecall has the 60" back in stock. I able to get in on the pretty good discount that they were offering on their earlier shipment. Don't know if they will still honor that price or not, but can't hurt to call. Price was much better than on their website. Rumor had it that the new batch would not be sold at the discount price anymore.

AlanM

10-13-05, 12:46 AM

Hi Alan M,

As I type this I'm in a hurry.

In regards to your FIRST paragraph, I'm not quite sure what your saying. At one point you say the 60" SXRD looks soft. But then later it sounds like your saying the SXRD was more sharper than the Mits and Samsung. Can you please clarify for me? Thanks.

I saw the SXRD in action [50"] for the first time. The picture was noticeably soft. Even in Pro Mode. There was a 3 LCD, I believe it was the A10 (it definitely was a 50"), and at least to me, the picture was sharper (but up close you saw SDE). So if my assumptions about what you're saying in your first paragraph are correct, then we pretty much have the same view.

I thought the Mits 6262'8' was sharper.

Thanks for listening. Matthew

Hi Matthew,

Whew, glad to hear I'm not the only one who's run up against this. :)

To clarify, I felt that the 60" SXRD looked soft compared to the Mits and Samsung 1080p. However, I felt that the 50" SXRD that I viewed looked pretty sharp, *but* that was in a different store with what appeared to be a better feed. And it only looked sharper than the ~50" 720p/768p DLPs and LCDs in the vicinity (the A10 was not one of these, however). No 1080p DLPs were nearby for comparison.

To sum up, from my brief exposure to the 50" and greater time with the 60":

50" SXRD detail > 50" 720p/768p DLP and LCD (as it should be)

60" SXRD detail < 60" 720p/768p DLP and LCD *AND* 50/60" 1080p DLP (what the heck?!?)

This is a little over-generalized but these are basically the trends that I've perceived.

It just seems like something's out of whack here. I will revisit the 50" to see if my initial observation holds. I keep hoping that the 60" softness is somehow related to the showroom setup, but I've had no luck figuring it out yet. All the early reviews have been so positive that I feel like I must be missing something. That's where my component input softening theory came from, though that appears to have been previously disproven.

BTW, I'm in agreement with you on the 62628. It's a nice set. A little noisy in dark areas sometimes, but I've read that turning off the edge enhancement fixes most of that. It's definitely on my short list if I can't get the SXRD to pan out.

Alan

AlanM

10-13-05, 12:52 AM

pinedsa

10-13-05, 01:21 AM

roller11

10-13-05, 02:49 AM

If that is what you are watching then it makes perfect sense to use that material as a factor. I'm sorry you don't seem to get it. Everyone has their own criteria.

No, you don't get it. The original poster asked the forum about hi def viewing
on the SXRD. The "doesn't make sense" part was that he would be perplexed as to why he saw no difference when his judging basis was lo def. I suppose you would judge a color TV using archive black and white movies from the 30's.

roller11

10-13-05, 02:54 AM

with good HD material (for example: The Office) this TV is sharp!

"Office" is amazing, have you seen "Out of Practice"? That prog alone would
make me trade my 1280x720 DLP for a hi rez set. Comment?

roller11

10-13-05, 03:03 AM

The biggest culprit to poor PQ is the compression being used. Therefore, I can't wait for HD DVD. Once these players come out it'll bring our new Sonys to a new level of performance that can't be achieved with the overly compressed signals we have now and low rez DVD.

You make it sound like all shows have poor PQ, and I could not disagree more.
Check out Leno, Office, Out of Practice, Close to home, Yes Dear, Still Standing,
SNL, and a few others, the PQ is jaw dropping. Granted there are still some terrible PQ progs (exactly three
on CBS...King of Queens, 2.5 Men, NCIS) but in between the two above extremes are a host of others that are very good.

roller11

10-13-05, 03:16 AM

Huh? Based on what I've read and experienced Comcast (or any other cable co) cannot deny you access to HD locals. So, if you get Comcast cable (even if only at the basic level) then you already should have the ability to get HD locals because they are broadcast unencrytped in-the-clear so all you need is a QAM-capable cable tuner such as in newer TVs or through an external tuner like Samsung 451 or LG 4200.

Oh, how I wish it was that simple! The deal is that Comcast has choosen to not install the hardware, the infrustructure for HD in many of the areas they service.
Has nothing to do with the issues you raise.

Or, are Comcast not feeding Longmont at all?

C only provides SD digital in Longmont. All HD I get is strictly OTA.

Btw, I thought you were in Boulder.

No, Longmont. Just curious, are you in Boulder? I'm asking cause I was
under the impression that one can't get OTA CBS in Boulder.

AlanBuck

10-13-05, 08:52 AM

I think I've logged about 20-25 hours on my 50" SXRD and feel much the same way that you do. Anything I've watched that seems a bit soft seems to be source related but with good HD material (for example: The Office) this TV is sharp! The more I watch this TV the more I like it. I've even managed to get the wife's approval, not just on the PQ but also the cabinet design.

I finally saw the 60 inch SXRD at BB last night. I found it to look even more impressive than than the one at CEDIA. It simply blew away all the other RPTV's on display for clarity, black level, and color accuracy. The Samsung 720P DLP next to it looked really bad in comparison. It even blew away the 50 inch Panny plasma, which was my former favorite. When Sony gets the SXRD in a slimmer case, count me in for sure! These TV's are awesome beyond a doubt, and set a new standard in RPTV overall PQ. If the price matches your budget, and it fits in your space, go for it!

AlanBuck

10-13-05, 08:55 AM

"Office" is amazing, have you seen "Out of Practice"? That prog alone would
make me trade my 1280x720 DLP for a hi rez set. Comment?

Those are both great shows for PQ. They even look amazing on my A-10, and no doubt even better on the SXRD. Leno, and Letterman are also great to show the true potential of any HDTV.

Blue

10-13-05, 10:25 AM

Does anyone have some real world experience with how these SXRD sets are supposed to perform with lots (and I do mean lots) of background light? My brother's penthouse condo has floor to ceiling windows behind the seating area.

Also, what is your impression of the off axis viewing angles when compared to plasmas, LCDs or the sony LCD-RP?

Thanks in advance for your input.

derekj

10-13-05, 11:08 AM

No, you don't get it. The original poster asked the forum about hi def viewing
on the SXRD. The "doesn't make sense" part was that he would be perplexed as to why he saw no difference when his judging basis was lo def. I suppose you would judge a color TV using archive black and white movies from the 30's.

If I was watching b&w on a regular basis and it's appearance was important to me? Why yes I would. If all I'm watching is dvds, then I'm going to use that. If I'm watching SD then I'm taking that into consideration also. WTF would you care what anyone's criteria is?

That poster said he'd be viewing mostly SD and DVDs. Instead of getting all preachy and saying this like "Posts like this one never cease to amaze me... What were you thinkin'??", you could have easily pointed out that there might be better sets suited for what he wants. Maybe this set does do all that better than the others out there?

As for your comment of "The sole purpose of a set like the SXRD is to deliver uber Hi definition" - you are clearly wrong. If that was the case, then it wouldn't have anything less than component inputs and would likely take a 1080p signal. It also would likely be a monitor.

HomeGuy

10-13-05, 12:12 PM

Ken Ross

10-13-05, 02:18 PM

I made absolutely certain that NR was turned off and tried the extreme ranges of all the controls related to sharpness (sharpness, DTE, and detail enhancer) just to see what would happen. I realize that normally all of this stuff should be turned way down or off but I wanted to give it a shot. I still could not achieve the level of sharpness and detail that I was seeing in the 60" LCDs nor a 61" Sammy 720p :eek: nearby. I also tried the various DRC setting and DRC palettes to no avail.

Alan

Alan, I had the same experience at one point yesterday in demoing the SXRD at my local CC. But I changed some settings (I'm not sure what finally impacted the sharpness) and the detail & sharpness was definitely there relative to anything in the area.

But, FWIW, I have noticed in many instances a lower rez TV will actually look sharper than a higher rez display. The best example of this I've ever seen was the Sharp LCDs. For some reason their 45" 1920X1080 display ALWAYS looks soft to me no matter what store I was in and no matter what was alongside of it. This happened every single time....even yesterday at CC. In fact, the other Sharp LCDs with lower rez, always look significantly better. I'm sure this isn't just a question of a smaller screen looking sharper. At least in the case of the 45" Sharp, something else appears to be going on.

Tele-TV

10-13-05, 02:21 PM

Thank-you to:

PCFreakX, Tony, & UG for your recent PM correspondence with me. I'll have to "catch-up" w/ you PCFX as soon as possible. Thanks for your understanding.

Thanks Alan M for your response to my post and to anyone else I forgot (need to catch up, IN-ORDER :) with the posts).

Back to the SXRD:

Just got back from Ken Crane's :mad: (DVD Planet) again where I was cecking out the 50-SXRD, one thing I know for sure, I decided today I will NOT be buying anything EVER from KC. Because of the employee's attitude (ESPECIALLY one today that help me make this decision, thanks, jerk!). :D Sorry for the rant. So it looks like it will be BB or Fry's (in no particular order right now, depends on price and EW). I "miss" GG.

1. Do any of you guys know in the San Gabriel Valley (SGV) [locally] to Montebello
where I view a 60" SXRD? Thnx. Didn't think about but should have swung by BB Pasadena (Pasa) rnear KC on the way home. [Off to call BB Pasa & Industry.]

In MY opinion the 50" is just NOT big enough for ME. It doesn't have that umph. My viewing distance will be no closer than 12' (much further than my original estimation of 8' feet [need new tape measure not long enough : ) ].

Thank-you and bless you guys. And Mr. Sorry (always sorry) :o Matthew says for the horrible grammar and formatting of this post.

Tele-TV

10-13-05, 02:24 PM

For all you guys who managed or will proably manage to pull off a price match with Sunshine (even if your on the West Coast), CONGRATS! Seriously.

:cool:

Tele-TV

10-13-05, 04:55 PM

Just wanted to give a heads-up for anyone in the So Cal San Gabriel Valley region that's looking for a place to see the 60" SXRD on display (PLEASE see Post Title). Thanks.

AlanM

10-13-05, 05:05 PM

Alan, I had the same experience at one point yesterday in demoing the SXRD at my local CC. But I changed some settings (I'm not sure what finally impacted the sharpness) and the detail & sharpness was definitely there relative to anything in the area.

But, FWIW, I have noticed in many instances a lower rez TV will actually look sharper than a higher rez display. The best example of this I've ever seen was the Sharp LCDs. For some reason their 45" 1920X1080 display ALWAYS looks soft to me no matter what store I was in and no matter what was alongside of it. This happened every single time....even yesterday at CC. In fact, the other Sharp LCDs with lower rez, always look significantly better. I'm sure this isn't just a question of a smaller screen looking sharper. At least in the case of the 45" Sharp, something else appears to be going on.

You know I had a very similar experience at lunch today. I went over to CC determined to get a better result than previously. It occurred to me that the 60" LCDs I was comparing to were probably torched to the max and that the detail "enhancing" features on these sets might be giving a false sense of sharpness. I guessed that all things being equal that the SXRD could post a better showing. After playing around with these features for a while I finally arrived at settings that gave the SXRD the advantage in detail. It wasn't a huge difference, but, combined with the increased smoothness and better contrast, the overall improvement in the image was clear. On my personal scale of 1 to 10 the SXRD was now around a 9 vs the LCDs which were coming in at around an 8. FWIW I rate the Mitsu 62628 at 9 as well, but have not found a location where a direct comparison is possible. I expect that I would have a preference in a head-to-head competition.

I also looked at a 50" at the nearby Tweeter and found it to be on even footing with a 50" 1080p Samsung when viewing the omnipresent Mitsubishi nature loop (ie, "Duckvision"). This was with no adjustment on my part, so my earlier observation that the 50" seemed to compete with its peers better than the 60" (OOTB at least) still holds, with the caveat that the 60" does appear to have room for improvement with diligent adjustment.

FWIW, I agree with you on the Sharp panel. I suppose lower relative contrast, poor pixel response time, or poor scaling could all be culprits in that outcome.

As always YMMV,
Alan

roller11

10-13-05, 06:15 PM

roller 11: I totally agree that some of the HD programming on D is amazing and very enjoyable to watch. However, the current 1080i and 720P signals I'm getting from D are compressed. Some HD channels are more compressed than others. The other factor is bitrate. I believe it tops out at around 19mbs on D

It is illegal for OTA broadcasters to compress HD material, I assumed it would
be the same for satellite. Are you saying that D can legally compress
any HD material to whatever extent they want, thereby benefiting from saved
bandwidth, more commercials, more progs, higher profits, etc.... all at the expense of paying customers? If an HD signal is compressed, then it isn't really HD anymore
and shouldn't be called such.
My only experience with satellite is Voom, which I had and returned for a full
refund before they went bust. The PQ was excellent, as good as OTA so I
assume it was not compressed. Are you comparing true HD progs. (like "Office"
as opposed to "King of Queens") satellite vs OTA? In other words, why do
you think D compresses their signal?

where, I believe, Blu-Ray can handle up to 36mps which will push the PQ on our new sets to a new level.

A quick calculation shows that at 30 fps, a 1920x1080 image at 24 bits perpixel requires 1.49 giga bits/second, and that doesn't even include h and v blanking period.. I believe that Mpeg encoding decreases that requirement , can anyone shed some light on this?

bhaaf

10-13-05, 07:03 PM

jkv4

10-13-05, 07:13 PM

Sekhar

10-13-05, 07:48 PM

FYI: Fry's has the 60" on sale at $4499 today (10/13).

av1kevin

10-13-05, 08:15 PM

Marc Alexander

10-13-05, 08:20 PM

It is illegal for OTA broadcasters to compress HD materialNo its not. Any OTA broadaster that multicasts recompresses the HD feed. See the HDTV forums for more info.

roller11

10-13-05, 08:49 PM

No its not. Any OTA broadaster that multicasts recompresses the HD feed. See the HDTV forums for more info.

When I was reading about the "broadcast flag", I recall there was something about how the networks had to broadcast umcompressed video, or something like that.
I'm just going from memory, but my impression was that congress, knowing full well
the providers would abuse the system anyway they could, stipulated this as a sort
of consumer protection measure. Can anyone elaborate on this?

roller11

10-13-05, 08:56 PM

You should spend more time over in the HDTV Programming forum where there is regular "discussion" (mostly criticizing) about DirecTV's strangulation of their HD and it is generally referred to as HD-Lite. lets not make this thread into a DirecTV HD-Lite discussion. If I had not fairly recently bought a HDTivo receiver I would be seriously considering switching to cable.

Thanks for the tip. Since Comcast denys me ABC HD programming, I'm always looking into alternatives and this is the first time I've heard that D** is
"watering down" their HD. I'll check out the other thread, but meanwhile, two questions:
Does D** admit they are doing this, and does Dishnetwork do the same thing?
Also, have you compared, say, "office" on NBC , cable vs OTA? In other words,
does Comcast do the same thing as D**?

dsaumkc

10-13-05, 08:58 PM

Well I just hope you guys don't have any issues with your new toy. Sony sucks for customer service. In the industry Sony is a four letter word. Make sure you spend the extra bucks and purchase an after market warranty. They will treat you far better than Sony will. LG is a much better manufacturer than Sony.

Biggest load of B.S. I've ever heard.... FYI Kevin,

LG headquaters is in Korea and currently have NO service centers in the united states unless done by Zenith repairmen.. Here's what you get when you search for a service center to fix your LG television if it breaks...

LG Service Centers in the US (http://www.lge.com/support/service_center_gcsc.jsp) ..... Nothing...

Let's have a history quiz on LG shall we? LG or Lucky Goldstar was a merger between Lucky Chemical company and GOLDSTAR Electronics.. You old enough to remember GOLDSTAR? The KOREAN based electronics company that made low quality electronics with cheap parts.. Has anyone EVER said anything good about GOLDSTAR? If so, I'm curious to hear that one....

And I'm not even a SONY fanboy... Just a realist... Your comment is both ludicrious and without fact.....

msleb

10-13-05, 09:12 PM

Anybody order their TV for Sunshine and received it. I ordered on Sept. 30th and nothing. Spent about an hour one week ago on the phone to talk to them and they said it shipped on the 3rd. Of course when I ordered it they said I would have a tracking number but I didn't receive anything. I'm getting a bad feeling about this! Getting time to talk to my credit card company.

I'm in the exact same boat--felt reasonably comfortable with them based upon others' early and successful experiences and payment with a major cc (not using paypal, which doesn't always give you the same dispute options as using the cc directly). I ordered Sept 27 and my status remains "sent to warehouse". No one by phone or email really gives a straight answer either...

AUPigskin--

10-13-05, 09:21 PM

Anybody order their TV for Sunshine and received it. I ordered on Sept. 30th and nothing. Spent about an hour one week ago on the phone to talk to them and they said it shipped on the 3rd. Of course when I ordered it they said I would have a tracking number but I didn't receive anything. I'm getting a bad feeling about this! Getting time to talk to my credit card company.

BHAAF,
We ordered the EXACT same day and have been told the EXACT same story (which could be a good sign??!!). I ordered 2 SXRDs on the 30th, they said they were
"drop shipped" (not really sure what this term means) from Sony the next Monday (3rd) instead of Thursday (6th) as quoted on the phone when ordering and are waiting from Sony with tracking information. I have become a little iritated at the lack of information but they did say it would be 10-14 business days from the day of order (30th). If you call them tomorrow, let me know what they say, as I believe I'm in the same boat...

R Harkness

10-13-05, 09:50 PM

The best example of this I've ever seen was the Sharp LCDs. For some reason their 45" 1920X1080 display ALWAYS looks soft to me no matter what store I was in and no matter what was alongside of it. .

Ken, I agree with your observations about the softness of that particular display.
It always looks soft to me as well, and in fact others felt this way on the plasma forum and I remember quite a few discussions about it.

However, I was just looking at the similar-sized, same-rez Sony LCD flat panels today (XBR, Bravia etc) and they were stunningly sharp. It's always hard to tell
which piece of the technology puzzle might be changing the look of a display, and despite high-res numbers may perhaps be undermined by poor implementation somewhere else in the chain.

Even though I'm excited about 1080p displays, I am still undecided as to how much actual impact the jump to 1080p has over 720p in displays 70" and smaller.

easycruise

10-13-05, 09:53 PM

From the "Widescreen Review" Nov' 05 issue...In post #5710.

""Colorimetry was exceptionally accurate
for both digital and analog, 1080i, and
480p; the exception was green, which was
very saturated. Although not accurate, this
saturated green had a pleasing effect.
Chapter 3 of The Lord Of The Rings: The
Fellowship Of The RingDVD has several
good tests of the color green. Green fungus
on the trees was almost Day-Glo! Although
the green of the grass and trees is intense,
subtle differences were evident between
drier greens and lusher greens.""
-------------
In my in-store comparisons with the Mits 50" DLP and the 50" SXRD, I thought that it was a close call. But I too saw the problem with the greens in the SXRD. It was especially pronounced when watching a football game. I leaned towards the Mits because of this green problem with the SXRD. This kind of reminds me of the problem with the Hitachi plasma where it couldn't get the color red correct, it always had a orange hue to it.

BTW, "drop ship" only means that the product is shipped direct from manufacturer to customer, bypassing the shipping to the middleman.

easycruise

10-13-05, 10:02 PM

Even though I'm excited about 1080p displays, I am still undecided as to how much actual impact the jump to 1080p has over 720p in displays 70" and smaller.

The impact I see is a better SD picture, for unknown reasons. The ED plasmas always seemed to show SD better over the HD plasmas, with logical reasoning. But it still was not acceptable to me. But now, 1080p sets like the SXRD show SD programming with a very acceptable picture. That's one of the 3 bugaboos that has been solved for me. I still have one bugaboo left before I finally make the leap to a HDTV, that being a HD Tivo over cable. The Comcast DVR has too little space for our family's needs.

Marc Alexander

10-13-05, 10:02 PM

Dsaumkc, I definitely consider Sony a 10x better manufacturer than LG. However, the LG service center search is misleading. With large displays, you generally do not send them to a service center you have in-home service by an authorized service provider (no matter who the manufacturer is). I presently live near the LG service center in Huntsville, AL. I've toured the service facility and seen the displays being worked on.

Roller11, HDTV programming forum buddy...all the info you need is there.

Ken Ross

10-13-05, 10:07 PM

Ken, I agree with your observations about the softness of that particular display.
It always looks soft to me as well, and in fact others felt this way on the plasma forum and I remember quite a few discussions about it.

However, I was just looking at the similar-sized, same-rez Sony LCD flat panels today (XBR, Bravia etc) and they were stunningly sharp. It's always hard to tell
which piece of the technology puzzle might be changing the look of a display, and despite high-res numbers may perhaps be undermined by poor implementation somewhere else in the chain.

Even though I'm excited about 1080p displays, I am still undecided as to how much actual impact the jump to 1080p has over 720p in displays 70" and smaller.

Rich, the allure of those 45" Sharps has always eluded me. You know I'm pretty objective and that's caused me to continually return to look at those Sharps thinking 'this time I'll see it look good'. But it never does. Yet the 37" Sharp displays a beautiful picture. Go figure. Now, as you say, those Sony Bravias are a completely different story! Those are flat out the best looking directview LCDs I've ever seen. I'm really looking forward to the larger versions of those! My only concern with the Bravia, and this was only after repeated viewings, is the low level detail in shadow areas. When I saw this panel adjacent to a 50" Panny plasma, there was better shadow detail on the plasma.

I'm with you on the 1080p issue as you probably know. I just don't believe there will be a significant difference in the apparent sharpness or perceived resolution of these displays at typical viewing distances. It seems at least Home Theater Mag feels that way too. As you've heard me say many times, there are just so many other ingredients that go into a great picture other than rez. I think we're really close to maxing out on the impact that resolution will make on displays that will typically FIT into the average sized home.

AUPigskin--

10-13-05, 10:17 PM

I presently live near the LG service center in Huntsville, AL.

What a small world the world-wide-web is....a fellow Huntsvillian... In case you didn't know, HHGreggs has both the 50" and 60" SXRDs if you haven't seen them or don't own one....

VizGuy

10-13-05, 10:47 PM

Yet another Huntsvillian here....
I was also looking at the HHGregg here in Huntsville, and they have both SXRD's on display.
I was watching GreenBay pound the snot out of the Saints in HD at the store.
It was sweet (both the picture and the pounding).

wtr1

10-13-05, 10:48 PM

wtr1

10-13-05, 10:49 PM

Viz: make that still another Huntsvillian. I'm in the old, Big Cove area.

JimP

10-13-05, 11:03 PM

jkv4

10-13-05, 11:33 PM

jvrobert

10-14-05, 01:49 AM

[I wish there was a "RPTV as a TV display" semi-permanent thread for these questions]

So people have had time to play with these now, a few questions.

First, has anyone gotten 1:1 pixel mapping from a PC over DVI using 1080i?

Can someone post a nice full screen shot of a windows desktop at 1080i with 1:1 pixel mapping?

So the way I understand it is that you would deinterlace, then scale on the PC. The PC video card would then re-interlace to 1080i and output to TV, then the SXRD can use 3:2 pulldown to get a perfect 1080p image. How many frames per second would this be, 24? 30?

Has anyone played any FPS games at 1080i from a PC over DVI yet? How do movies scaled on the PC look?

Tons of questions, I know...

I'm really, really torn between this TV and the HP DLP. If Sony had been competent enough to put a 1080p HDMI input on these I would already own one.

If I can get a "virtual" 1080p 1:1 pixel mapping using 1080i over DVI then I'm pretty much decided on the SXRD - that's good enough and I doubt I'll play many high frame rate games on it anyway.

JOHN HANSON

10-14-05, 09:21 AM

A Sony rep has already said Sony may sell a kit for the KDS-R60XBR1 and KDS-R50XBR1. Here is the quote and link to the interview in PCworld:

"The rep said that at some point Sony may sell a kit to upgrade these sets to native 1080p, but it'll be a dealer-installed part."

I can't enter URL yet, but search under Google News for KDS-R60XBR1 and scroll down to the Sep 9th story from PCWorld.
I HAVE A R60 ON ORDER AND ALL THE LIT SAYS IT IT DISPAYS IN 1080P AND THAT IT DE-INTERLACES FROM 1080I, SO WHATS UP WITH 1080P NATIVE?

CSonntag

10-14-05, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Gary_Kreie
A Sony rep has already said Sony may sell a kit for the KDS-R60XBR1 and KDS-R50XBR1. Here is the quote and link to the interview in PCworld:

"The rep said that at some point Sony may sell a kit to upgrade these sets to native 1080p, but it'll be a dealer-installed part."

I can't enter URL yet, but search under Google News for KDS-R60XBR1 and scroll down to the Sep 9th story from PCWorld.

This is exactly the question I asked yesterday in the JVC D'ILA vs SONY SXRD thread (would Sony offer a SW/HW upgrade to 1080p?), but nobody had apparently heard about the above newsbyte. Seems like this would solve THE BIGGEST reservation that people are having with SXRD. Of course, it's not a sure thing, and may not even result in a true upgrade given the relative lack of 1080p source material. But, now at least the JVC D'ILA vs SONY SXRD face-off can be on equal footing based on display capabilities.

Now if only November would get here so we can finally have this good ol' fashioned shoot-out!

Treasure Hunter

10-14-05, 01:15 PM

I came across an issue that I think you all should be aware of. I am ready to purchase a 50" XSRD and I have been reading postings looking for a reputable company to purchase from at a good price. I cam across a post by member: westa6969 concerning DTVCity.com. Here's an excerpt of his post:

[QUOTE=westa6969] Welcome as a new member but we aren't allowed to actually post anything other than MSRP and no linking to discounts at least until a moderator see's it but I recommend a Sony authorized on-line dealer DTVCity with a 30 day return policy - you won't see the price until you'll place it in the cart and it includes a free 2 yr warranty and an inexpensive upgrade to 5 year and includes bulbs.

I want to buy from an authorized dealer, so I went to the Sony website to verify DTV's status. Well, they do NOT appear on the website as an authorized dealer. I could find no mention of this company on any Sony website. I made a call to DTVCity.com. The salesperson assured me they were indeed authorized. I told them I couldn't verify that on Sony's website. I told him I would call Sony directly to verify his claim. He reassured me they were authorized dealers and if I found out differently, to call him back and let him know! Well, imagine my surprise at that answer. I thought, "something smells fishy here." This company isn't really sure of their status or they are lying.

I looked at the banner on DTV's website and see three different companies listed, Sony, Panasonic, and Pioneer. All on the same banner. If you click further you go to a Sony website that doesn't have anything to do with being an authorized dealer.

I thought I would call Sony to verify the claim made by DTV. A simple question..." is this company an authorized dealer?" should be easy to answer. Not so with Sony. I spent well over an hour on the phone with them, talking to various departments, supervisors and managers. I heard all sort of answers, such as: If they have a banner, they are authorized...(well anyone can post a banner and link it to any website!) One person told me that Sony has hundreds of authorized dealers. I said "why are there only a hanful listed on your website?". She couldn't answer that, except to say Sony can't keep track of all the dealers out there. I asked about connecting me to a company representative who deals with the procedure for authorizing dealers. She said she didn't know of any office that does that! I said, "you mean to tell me your company suggests to consumers that they purchase from a Sony authorized dealer, but you have no idea who they are?" She basically told me Sony can't keep track of all these companies, and she didn't know who does!

This bring up a some important questions, in my mind. If Sony can't keep track of these dealers, or doesn't care who uses their banner, what validity does being authorized really have? If they care about this issue, shouldn't there be a phone number, or some sort of contact for consumers to verify the claims made by dealers? Can any dealer post a banner on their website and proclaim themselves as authorized dealers? How do we, the consumer protect ourselves when we can't get a proper answer from the very people asking us to use authorized dealers?

I do not know if DTVCity.com is or isn't authorized. Sony's website says no, DTV says yes. No one knows for sure. Who do we trust? How many dealers are out there luring in customers with false claims?

I have a criticism of Sony. If Sony can't answer a simple question like the one I posed to them, do they really care about who is or isn't authorized? Does the distinction of being an authorized dealer mean anything at all? Maybe they don't care as long as there is a huge network of dealers selling their product. I used to think they were a reputable company that cared about it's consumers. Now I get the impression they are just another huge corporation that is more worried about their bottom line than the people purchasing their products.

Who do you trust with your expensive purchase? Me, I don't trust anyone right now. Your comments on this subject are greatly appreciated.

AUPigskin--

10-14-05, 01:36 PM

Who do you trust with your expensive purchase? Me, I don't trust anyone right now. Your comments on this subject are greatly appreciated.

Let me start off with the Sony definition of "authorized" dealer:

- access to Sony product managers and specialized customer service representatives

- special product promotions.

In addition Sony Authorized Internet Dealers are required to:

· Provide a toll-free telephone number for customer product inquiries

· Provide an e-mail product inquiry service with 24-hour response time

· Provide notice of the level of security offered to customers for online transactions

· Display the dealer's policies on privacy and use of customer information

· Send order status via e-mail within 12 hours of order placement

· Ship products within 48 hours of order acceptance

· Provide customers with the option to pick up products at a retail store

· Offer convenient return procedures

· Offer "white glove" delivery and setup service for major home audio-video systems or components

· Provide a customized installation guide and offer installation for mobile electronics products

I have also called Sony specifically about "authorized" dealers, how to verify, etc. and received the same response you did. Note the list online showing authorized dealers is for ONLINE DEALINGS only, not in-store. Bottom-line, Sony states they will honor warranties (this is really what this whole issue is about, isn't it?) as long as you have proof of sale and the Sony warranty card, authorized dealer or not...

CFoote

10-14-05, 01:39 PM

I'm sorry guys but with such an expensive purchase (and the hassle of returning such a bulky, expensive item) it makes sense to spend the extra couple of hundred bucks to buy one locally.

CSonntag

10-14-05, 01:41 PM

Treasure Hunter

10-14-05, 02:02 PM

It's amazing that Sony has no trouble in determining who, and who is not, authorized when it comes time to honoring an owner's warranty claim!

Exactly, and Sony posts this disclaimer on their website:

" Sony authorized dealers are required to take steps to insure the integrity of your Sony purchase. Some unauthorized dealers have sold products with altered or obliterated serial numbers. Products with tampered serial numbers void the Sony Products Warranty. In addition, there have been reports of unauthorized dealers selling used products as new.

We have have not audited unauthorized e-tailers or other unauthorized dealers to determine if they meet the high customer service standards our authorized dealers are required to meet. As we generally have no relationship with unauthorized e-tailers, if you experience any difficulty with their service, we may be unable to help you.

We recomend you only purchase Sony consumer electronic products from Sony Authorized Internet Dealers "

They are in effect saying...Buy from an authorized dealer or suffer the consequences, but they can't tell you definitively who these dealers are...so I guess you are on your own.

Treasure Hunter

10-14-05, 02:09 PM

BTW I called OneCall after talking to DTVCity. Onecall, who is listed as authorized, gave me a fairly matching price (with delivery). They also stressed to me that DTVCity is NOT an authorized dealer. I can see the start of a mini war brewing here between etailers.

westa6969

10-14-05, 02:21 PM

I'm sorry guys but with such an expensive purchase (and the hassle of returning such a bulky, expensive item) it makes sense to spend the extra couple of hundred bucks to buy one locally.
I wish you well and I will gladly be your Guinea Pig for DTVCity - But mine won't be delivered until I return from my Florida vacation later this month.

Read the customer testimonials and research their BBB Standing and do some homework and the savings can be a helluva lot more than a few bucks. Safer at an expense at B&M though as I bought two LCD FP's the past 9 months and saved a total of $1400.00 on those two TV's versus the SALE price at CC or BB and that's not chicken feed.

DTVCity have a 30 day return policy just like TVA and it's no more a hassle with such a return policy. Sony doesn't appear to have the strict dealer policy of NEC/Pioneer but all that counts is when you exhaust your 30 day return time is Warranty Coverage and we've yet to find anyone that has stated Sony has a policy like Pio/NEC. None exists on their website - No Disclaimer can be found of such a Statement or condition of Sale - Consumer Contract Law would require a Public Posting in writing and has anyone ever see one? Go to Pioneer and the first thing that pops up is their Disclaimer and in absence of any such Policy it would not be enforceable. Let's face it if DTVCity was ripping off all these customers they certainly would not hold this membership in BBB and ON-line Practices Standards they must comply with - they wouldn't survive on-line for very long and they've been selling on-line since 1997. Use a credit card that's protected also.

I've been shopping on-line for 8 years now and saved a fortune and got caught in one bait and switch on shipping fee's that cost me $75.00 extra but I saved $600 on the purchase so I just don't buy from Plasmahouse again and they get a negative rating as a result. Considering my home is filled with collections of Art and Antiques and electronics purchased on-line that have saved a tremendous amount of money over the past 8 years instead of making folks like CC/BB shareholders rich when they don't even give a damn how they display their product or lack the ability to train their people - they are box movers and warranty sellers and that's it.

Buy where ever you choose and makes you feel safe but God could the credit card companies make it any safer? Do your homework but not every on-line dealer is in a conpiracy to cheat us. The TVA Samsung Power Buy had over 250 sales and every one of them were able to return a set during that 30 days if needed and BB still doesn't have 1080P's where I'm at and TVA had them 2 months ago a better price than any B&M until now they are catching up on price and inventory. Good Luck and I regret the one gentleman didn't find my assistance useful. Good Luck! :D

sbailie

10-14-05, 02:46 PM

As far as Sony customer service - I recommend going straight to the top. I purchased a Sony 36" WEGA big tube about 3.5 years ago (no extended warranty) and when it died, Sony sent a guy out to fix it. After about 6 weeks - it died again, and my brand new 32" LCD flatscreen just got here free of charge.

Sony CS Just got an A+ from me.

JimP

10-14-05, 02:55 PM

[QUOTE=Treasure Hunter]Exactly, and Sony posts this disclaimer on their website:

" Sony authorized dealers are required to take steps to insure the integrity of your Sony purchase. Some unauthorized dealers have sold products with altered or obliterated serial numbers. Products with tampered serial numbers void the Sony Products Warranty. In addition, there have been reports of unauthorized dealers selling used products as new.

We have have not audited unauthorized e-tailers or other unauthorized dealers to determine if they meet the high customer service standards our authorized dealers are required to meet. As we generally have no relationship with unauthorized e-tailers, if you experience any difficulty with their service, we may be unable to help you.

We recomend you only purchase Sony consumer electronic products from Sony Authorized Internet Dealers "

You guys are so overlooking the obvious. :rolleyes:

Want to find out just how authorized an etailer is, call Sony warranty and tell them that your set needs service and you bought it from whoever. See what Sony says. :D

Treasure Hunter

10-14-05, 03:03 PM

[

You guys are so overlooking the obvious. :rolleyes:

Want to find out just how authorized an etailer is, call Sony warranty and tell them that your set needs service and you bought it from whoever. See what Sony says. :D

JimP, please enlighten us as to what to expect from Sony. There are plenty of us who are wanting to buy and we can certainly use any info you have to make an educated choice.

PaulGo

10-14-05, 03:07 PM

It seems as long as it is a new (rather than refurbished) product with a valid serial number the warranty will be honored. The key word seems to be we "recommend" rather that we "require".

hadleyfarm

10-14-05, 03:08 PM

Picked up my 60" SXRD last week - good deal ($4,100) and good service from CC.

Thanks to all for enduring my questions & concerns (more to come no doubt!).

CSonntag

10-14-05, 03:16 PM

Picked up my 60" SXRD last week - good deal ($4,100) and good service from CC.

Thanks to all for enduring my questions & concerns (more to come no doubt!).
I didn't think we were allowed to post purchase prices on the forum...

JimP

10-14-05, 05:01 PM

JimP, please enlighten us as to what to expect from Sony. There are plenty of us who are wanting to buy and we can certainly use any info you have to make an educated choice.

I was just thinking that if the whole purpose of buying from only a Sony authorized dealer relates to whether they would provide warranty service, it would seem if you called their service number and said that you needed service and bought from a particular dealer, they would tell you in a hurry whether or not they were authorized. Certainly they would have a way of knowing who they extend the warranty to and who they don't.

CSonntag

10-14-05, 05:05 PM

It's amazing that Sony has no trouble in determining who, and who is not, authorized when it comes time to honoring an owner's warranty claim!
Exactly what I said a few posts above... ;)

msleb

10-14-05, 05:11 PM

bhaaf and msleb: I would be MOST interested in what you hear from Sunshine, one way or another. Of course, 10-14 business days is not up yet, but I suspect that neither of you has that "warm, fuzzy" feeling right now.

I really hope that they come through for you because they did have very good customer feedback and an excellent price.
Well, you are right--warm and fuzzy is not what I'm feeling. If I don't hear anything (they've failed to reply to any emails, and I keep missing them by phone) I will contact my CC company to see if they can really stick to their stated policy of charging a 15% ordre cancellation charge. I will keep everyone posted

AUPigskin--

10-14-05, 05:36 PM

It seems as long as it is a new (rather than refurbished) product with a valid serial number the warranty will be honored. The key word seems to be we "recommend" rather that we "require".

DING..Ding...ding...we have a winner. A lot of you are missing the mark. Sony cannot always tell you if it was bought from an authorized dealer when trying to utilize the warranty (nor does IT MATTER), rather they check the SERIAL Number to see if the unit is a legit Sony product. Again, straight FROM SONY, if you have a bill of sale and warranty card, they will honor the warranty. The real question is what is the return policy for online dealers and evaluating that risk...

CFoote

10-14-05, 05:40 PM

Buy where ever you choose and makes you feel safe but God could the credit card companies make it any safer? Do your homework but not every on-line dealer is in a conpiracy to cheat us. The TVA Samsung Power Buy had over 250 sales and every one of them were able to return a set during that 30 days if needed and BB still doesn't have 1080P's where I'm at and TVA had them 2 months ago a better price than any B&M until now they are catching up on price and inventory. Good Luck and I regret the one gentleman didn't find my assistance useful. Good Luck! :D

I agree westa, the internet stores are, for the most part, a great way to save money. Most of the time you don't pay tax and you get the product without the salesmanship of a high school kid :D However, if you push hard enough you can get some similar savings at a local B&M. I happen to live close to New Hampshire which is sales tax free, and I probably will go up there to get a TV at some point (god knows what I will end up choosing).

I just get nervous with these random electronic e-tailers pop up. If the set arrives damage, good customer service doesn't seem to be these guys forte. I'm not saying your e-tailer or anyone elses e-tailer is like that -- just that a lot are.

Let us know once the SXRD arrives! :cool:

CSonntag

10-14-05, 05:49 PM

I happen to live close to New Hampshire which is sales tax free, and I probably will go up there to get a TV at some point (god knows what I will end up choosing). Let us know once the SXRD arrives! :cool:
That brings up an interesting idea, at least for me: has anybody who lives in the Northwest outside of Oregon actually purchased a unit in Oregon to avoid the sales tax? If so, did they deliver to you outside of state (e.g. Northern California)?

I'm guessing that the delivery fee might negate the sales tax savings, but just wondering...

bholub

10-14-05, 06:14 PM

abe's of maine comes up on pricegrabber.com as the lowest price for me (lower than sunshine) -- they have 4 of 5 stars from over 3,000 reviews (i've never ordered anything from them; but i might be soon:))

bhaaf

10-14-05, 07:54 PM

abe's of maine comes up on pricegrabber as the lowest price for me (lower than sunshine) -- they have 4 of 5 stars from over 3,000 reviews (i've never ordered anything from them; but i might be soon:))
I wouldn't order from Sunshine until I hear of someone receiving one.

AUPigskin--

10-14-05, 08:16 PM

I wouldn't order from Sunshine until I hear of someone receiving one.

In fairness, Bombthroat received his from Sunshine and had no problem...

Did you have any luck today with Sunshine? When I called today, they acted surprised that I had not heard from the delivery folks so they put a "tracer" on the delivery. I should have information about within 24 hrs (although they are closed Saturday)...

stevel

10-14-05, 08:20 PM

I spent about an hour and a half with the 60" SXRD at Tweeter in Nashua, NH last night. Their HD feed was from a Comcast cable box and it looked wonderful - smooth and vibrant. Not a trace of SDE or SSE could be seen. The screen did a good job of neutralizing glare, though you could see purplish casts from the reflected showroom lights. I switched the video mode to Pro and turned off NR - it seemed to help make things look "more real".

Most of my evaluation was done with Digital Video Essentials and the Sony NS90 DVD player by component video. Yes, I know it's DVD but my wife is largely interested in watching DVDs so it was gratifying to see how wonderful even SD DVD looked on this set. It was sometimes hard to believe that it was still SD.

At my wife's request, we looked at some SD cable stations. They looked awful. Truly awful. My wife said it gave her a headache to look at it, whether we had the image zoomed or not. I don't know if it was the source, but I do know that most HDTVs do a poor job at SD. The perhaps saving grace is that my home signal source is DirecTV which should be better than cable. I currently have a DSR-704 DTiVo but will get the HD-DTiVo. I'm just crossing my fingers that SD is watchable, or I'll never hear the end of it.

My wife thought that the picture looked soft compared to the Sony A20 we had looked at the week before, though comparing to the A10 that was sitting next to it, I thought that any lack of "sharpness" was in fact lack of edge enhancement. A lot depended on the image being shown - some were like watching IMAX but others seemed a bit fuzzy. I could not do a direct comparison to other sets, but I found the HD and DVD images quite pleasing.

As for the Dumbo ears - both of us hate them. But my wife allowed as how she wouldn't veto the set because of them (and is thinking of how to disguise them by training a plant over them!) Those of you who think they can be removed - think again. They are an integral part of the frame that wraps around the set.

I was annoyed that Tweeter would do no more than price-match local stores, which meant for now, the 5% off that CC is advertising. They touted their 60 day price match, but I would be charged $80 for delivery (in-town), whereas CC has free delivery.

I will have to go into BestBuy and see if they're showing or listing the set. Our store does have a "Magnolia" section. The local CC did not have the SXRD on display when I looked a few days ago.

I am definitely going to buy the set and from a local dealer, but have not decided which one yet. I like Tweeter - I bought my 53" XBR from them back in 1998 - but their unwillingness to budge on the price (and the delivery fee) is a turnoff.

The hardest part now is finding something to put it on. The standard glass and aluminum stands are inappropriate for our living room, and the more we looked at the Salamander Synergy, the less we liked it (especially for the price). Time to hit the furniture stores and see what we can find in the way of a "sideboard" or "credenza" that is 20" or so high.

Since I have to replace my entire signal chain, I've already started by ordering a STR-DA7100ES and a DVP-NS90V from Crutchfield, and already have a 7M HDMI cable from Impact Acoustics. Got to replace my speakers too (no room for the towers with the new set.) Isn't it great what Sony is doing for the economy? :D

CFoote

10-14-05, 09:26 PM

Steve, get in touch with a gentleman named HadleyFarm, he bought his SXRD in NH for a great price. Just send him a private message to save a good chunk of $$$ :cool:

BIGskinny

10-14-05, 11:40 PM

Has anyone found the 50 or the 60 in the Houston Texas area? If so please let me know. Or better yet, if anyone has purchased one, please give me some feedback from the store?

n2nrush

10-14-05, 11:59 PM

That was a nice read stevel.

I'm in the same boat as you...as far as upgrades. I have all Sony ES equipment, but it's about 9-10 years old. I want to go the same route you are with the AVR and DVD player.

The biggest surprise of my SXRD quest has been my wife. Over the last 20 or so years, she has never been interested in any of my electronic purchases. I don't know what it is, but she is totally getting into learning about tv's, the nomenclature, and the best part...the best deal out there.

She even went to a B&M at her lunch break today just to see if they had a 60" (which they did). She saw the friggin thing before I did! She called me and told me all about it...how she twisted the salespersons arm trying to get him to match some internet prices.

ahh what a woman!

n2nrush

10-15-05, 12:03 AM

My wife also did the Sony call asking about DTVcity with similar results. They could find no information whatsoever in ther system about the company. They list themselves as an authorized reseller...whatever that means.

Lord Ace Man

10-15-05, 01:38 AM

If the forum members recall.

The first set was received with a somewhat suspect box stating MADE IN JAPAN from an unauthorized online retailor.

In one of the older threads a member from Japan states that sets aren't sold in Japan. Killing the theory that sets are made in Japan The set's optical engine is made in Japan then sent to PA for final assembled into the chassis.
In another thread, a member post his pics and it shows that he purchase 2 sets and his labels clearly states assemble in usa.

What's truly amazing. Stores like CC, BB, Tweeters and many other B&M who purchase millions of electronics form sony can't get their hands on this set. They keep getting their delivery dates push back. Yet somehow this store call shop sunshine is one of the first to get their hands on this set. How? I dunno! Perhaps they are huge shareholders in SONY.

Isn't it funny that when this set was so hard to get. That someone actually got it faster then even the man upstairs from shop sunshine. Now that this set is almost everywhere. I hear that people are having delivery problems/confirmation getting this set even when their credit card have been charge. To top it off you will be charge 15% restocking fee if you change your mind or would like a return.

I'm pretty sure you will receive your set. Just a matter of when?
Not adding any fuel to the fire here. Not discrediting Bombthroat, but something sure don't smell right nor add up.

Curt Anderson

10-15-05, 02:12 AM

Lord Ace Man. I ordered my Set from SonyStyle.com and it had a identical "Made In Japan" Label. And the box was identical as far as I can tell. So I really don't feel calling that box suspect is fair.

See here.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v97/CurtWRX/HT/MadeInJapan.jpg

I believe it was clearly accepted earlier, that there are in fact 2 different versions(?) of the SXRDS floating around. Labeled "made in Japan" and "made in USA". My "Made in Japan" set shipped from PA to me though.

LowTech123

10-15-05, 03:30 AM

Hi, I am new to this and was wondering if someone could clarify for me whether the SXRD (LCoS) TVs can also occasionally get burnt or stuck pixels similar to LCD RPs? Thanks

yardman

10-15-05, 06:59 AM

Hi, I am new to this and was wondering if someone could clarify for me whether the SXRD (LCoS) TVs can also occasionally get burnt or stuck pixels similar to LCD RPs? Thanks

Stuck pixels yes, three pixels feed each pixel on the screen so 1 stuck pixel would be difficult to see in a field of 1080X1920X3=6,220,800. Burn is really a Plasma thing. Some early High output heat producing front LCD projector showed some fading but that was extreme and years ago.

AUPigskin--

10-15-05, 08:39 AM

ninoe99

10-15-05, 11:43 AM

Has anyone found the 50 or the 60 in the Houston Texas area? If so please let me know. Or better yet, if anyone has purchased one, please give me some feedback from the store?

The 50 SXRD was on display yesterday at BB West Oaks...I am checking out a couple of stores today as well to test out the PQ on it.

jstenuf

10-15-05, 03:26 PM

Boy am I confused...

I dragged my wife down to the local Magnolia this afternoon to compare the 60" XBR1 to the 61" Samsung 6168. After all I had read in this thread I expected the Sony to blow the Samsung out of the water but that didn't happen. After about an hour of looking at several DVDs at 480p via component my wife and I agreed that the Samsung was a whisker better. I had both sets set to Standard display for the comparison. As far as color, both sets seemed pretty equal to me although the Sony had a slight purple tinge on all the blacks displayed. I assume that can be adjusted out. Is that correct? We both thought that the fine detail of stuff like hair and grass was slightly better with the Samsung. I delibertately brought our copy of Sin City to look for the rainbow effect. Neither one of us saw it.

So what do you guys think? Are they really this close? Was the Sony somehow set wrong? We really didn't look at much HD content because most of what we will be viewing will be SD and DVDs. Would the Sony look better for HD content but not DVDs? ???

I spent the better part of yesterday (10/15) going to CC first then BB and finally Ultimate comparing the 60" XBR to other sets. The CC dis[lay featured the 60" XBR nxst to a Samsung 71" DLP. IMO the Samsung blew away the Sony. The Samsung had better blacks, contrast, resolution and color saturation while the Sony picture was soft with maybe slightly better flesh tones. The sales person and I tried various setting on the Sony and the Samsung, but nothing helped the Sony. Major disappointment. The local BB did not have the Sony so off I went to Ultimate. The feed at Ultimate to the 60" XBR was unbelieveably bad. All of the TV's on their back wall looked just as bad. So I cannot make a judgement of the Ultimate display. I will try Sears to see what they have, but at this point the Sony is starting to fall from my short list.

Lord Ace Man

10-15-05, 04:25 PM

djwilso

10-15-05, 05:38 PM

I spent the better part of yesterday (10/15) going to CC first then BB and finally Ultimate comparing the 60" XBR to other sets. The CC dis[lay featured the 60" XBR nxst to a Samsung 71" DLP. IMO the Samsung blew away the Sony. The Samsung had better blacks, contrast, resolution and color saturation while the Sony picture was soft with maybe slightly better flesh tones. The sales person and I tried various setting on the Sony and the Samsung, but nothing helped the Sony. Major disappointment. The local BB did not have the Sony so off I went to Ultimate. The feed at Ultimate to the 60" XBR was unbelieveably bad. All of the TV's on their back wall looked just as bad. So I cannot make a judgement of the Ultimate display. I will try Sears to see what they have, but at this point the Sony is starting to fall from my short list.

I'm not "anti-Samsung" or anything, but it seems like their DLP sets have a real problem with video lag, whereas other brands, including Sony, don't have this problem.

I wish you luck in finding an HDTV that you will be glad you bought.

Dennis

PaulyC

10-15-05, 06:07 PM

Well I went to CC today in Woodland Hills to check out the 50 which I havent seen yet, I had already sat down with the 60 for awhile at Fry's but wanted to see them in different enviroment competing with others... They have the 50 and the 60 there.

Im sure Im getting the 50 due to the size of my LA apartment, but wanted to make sure it was impressive first, They had Jeff Corwin's Discovery show in 1080i, so this was a good represtation of things to come... Some setting changes, Pro, Iris wow...kick it up to 5, and you will see the light haha, i dont know if id keep it there, your lamp will probably last a month, but the brightness while still keeping detail is insane, i went back down to 3, Color Settings Neutral, I dont know why all these are on warm by default?

First off the 50 like its bigger brother just looks great, the new Sammy 61 1080p was right next to it, and the CC in Woodland Hills is great because its wide open so you can really walk around and get a good idea of the matchup.

I can see how some would like the Sammy, its really sharp, good detail, but the amount of artifacts I was seeing with the exact same sourrce was pretty bad, there was what Ive come to learn as SSE major on the Sammy's, the Sony has it too but its slight and seems to happen occasionally, where the Sammy just has it all the time.

Some are calling the Sony "softer", its TACT sharp, its just displaying things more naturally. From literally 25 feet away ( again this CC is wide open I recommend you go) the salesperson and I were watching as you could see the detail of tiny ants crawling on the nose of the Crocodile's in this Corwin show, along with the individual hairs of a kangaroo not only could you see the hairs, but you could see them clearly, no noise, which I believe would be a testament to the 1080l to 1080p upconversion..
Again the details, blacks, shadows, and yes Sharpness are really superior then anything ive seen on other RPTV's.

So now should I get the 60 or 50? :( I know IM gonna want the 60 eventually but the 50 is seriously more then enough tv for my room.

A couple things to note, CC already has these displayed at discounted prices, which i think is news? the 60 was a few hundred off MSRP, and the 50 was a few hundred off MSRP, still a lot more then other vendors but a cool sign,

stevel

10-15-05, 06:54 PM

That was a nice read stevel.

I'm in the same boat as you...as far as upgrades. I have all Sony ES equipment, but it's about 9-10 years old. I want to go the same route you are with the AVR and DVD player.
Yeah - I have mostly ES electronics as well, including the TA-E9000ES control preamp and N9000ES multichannel amp. Perhaps someone will want them on eBay... The old TV (53" XBR) and possibly the DVD player (a beautiful DVP-7700) will go to a local charity such as a senior center.

[quote]The biggest surprise of my SXRD quest has been my wife./quote]

My wife watches more TV than I do, and she went from saying "why replace it if it's still working" to "bigger (and brighter) is better". She's trusting me to make SD watchable on the new set - I hope I don't disappoint her.

maximum360

10-15-05, 07:15 PM

My wife asked me what the point was of selling my 51" CRT HDTV if I was only going to buy a 50" SXRD. I never brought it up again. 60" SXRD to be delivered tuesday. :D

gweempose

10-15-05, 08:02 PM

My wife asked me what the point was of selling my 51" CRT HDTV if I was only going to buy a 50" SXRD. I never brought it up again. 60" SXRD to be delivered tuesday. :DOn those rare occasions where my wife actually suggests spending more on electronics, I have learned to run with it before she changes her mind. :)

gazelle

10-15-05, 09:25 PM

My wife asked me what the point was of selling my 51" CRT HDTV if I was only going to buy a 50" SXRD. I never brought it up again. 60" SXRD to be delivered tuesday. :D

Your mom didn't raise no dunces ;)

Hokiiie@BB

10-15-05, 10:05 PM

RowdyUSP40

10-15-05, 10:21 PM

New wife?? Are you kidding me?!?! I strongly suggest you set a precedent NOW!! And buy what you want!

gazelle

10-15-05, 10:25 PM

First time poster so please be gentle....this site has helped me tremendously this year...

Man....you guys help me and hurt me...

I was going bald before but now pulling out my hair has to stop...so I post...

PLEASE SOMEONE GIVE ME A REASON TO BUY THE 50" SXRD instead of the Sammy HL-R5078W. My new wife is hung up on the speakers but I think everything I have heard and seen has me leaning SXRD...especially because I have asked the Easter Bunny for a PS3.

Price not a concern...Quality is what I am concerned with...I watch 20 hours of ESPNHD a day and then I sleep...close to that at least...

Just need some help with planning my next investment...my wedding was the most recent.

Thanks to all and look for me to contribute tremendously on anything I can.

HOKIIIE@BB

The Sony SXRD to the Samsung DLP is like going from the sublime to the ridiculous, imo.

The best way to convince her is to find a setup where she can compare the two with HD feeds, SD feeds, and a DVD demo. She will convince herself the quality of the picture is so vastly better on the SXRD she would never want the Samsung any longer even if she thought of it as a gorgeous piece of furniture. When you come right down to it, at least 90% of the reason for buying a TV should be PQ or you are not making a very wise decision...

Artwood

10-15-05, 11:42 PM

Why can't the Video Display manufacturers hire some interior designers that could come up with sets that had aesthetically pleasing cabinets? Is it because Japanese and Korean Display manufacturers make ugly TVs just like they make ugly cars? I'm not saying the TVs or the cars are bad--no they're great--they're just preponderantly UGLY!

steve ans

10-16-05, 12:30 AM

I differ with Artwood. Sony's sets are very attractive with the exception of the A10 models, which IMO look cheap. I like the side speakers.

TRIANGLE

10-16-05, 01:45 AM

First time poster so please be gentle....this site has helped me tremendously this year...

Man....you guys help me and hurt me...

I was going bald before but now pulling out my hair has to stop...so I post...

PLEASE SOMEONE GIVE ME A REASON TO BUY THE 50" SXRD instead of the Sammy HL-R5078W. My new wife is hung up on the speakers but I think everything I have heard and seen has me leaning SXRD...especially because I have asked the Easter Bunny for a PS3.

Price not a concern...Quality is what I am concerned with...I watch 20 hours of ESPNHD a day and then I sleep...close to that at least...

Just need some help with planning my next investment...my wedding was the most recent.

Thanks to all and look for me to contribute tremendously on anything I can.

HOKIIIE@BB

Hello Hokiiie,

I do not have the time but could no let you buy a TV you will return next year.
( HD-DVD & Blu-ray)

Color wheel, rainbow effect that would be one reason to not get the DLP over the SXRD. some DLPs should never pass trough Quality Control.
Now you want 1080p TRUE 1080 you do not want to get a DLP ( wobbulation)
Most importantly DLP technology is tricking your eyes can cause headaches ...

so if you want to watch couples hours a day you may want to use a different technology.

Well bottom line HD-ILA or SXRD.

Sorry if I hurt people sensitivity. We are not at BB or CC here, we all know what's going on with TVs. I am sure DLP owners like their set mainly because they did not see what a SXRD or HD-ILA can do. If you get a DLP for less a $1000 that might worth it.

TRIANGLE

wtr1

10-16-05, 09:21 AM

hokiiie: several have already covered the Samsung lip sync and video lag issues that the Sony does not appear to have. I was very close to buying the Samsung, but I just did not like all the problems/ failures that I was seeing in the Samsung threads. From my vantage point, it would appear that Samsung has a quality control problem. A few of the posters are on their 3rd set. Thus far, we have had one problem set that I can identify on the Sony threads. That speaks volumes to me.

Just one man's opinion.

snbeall

10-16-05, 11:58 AM

Now you want 1080p TRUE 1080 you do not want to get a DLP ( wobbulation)

TRIANGLE

From what I understand, although the display chips themselves have 1080 pixels and obviously run at 1080P, the set will not accept a 1080P input. I don't understand it. Is a 1080P capable interface really that much extra manufacturing cost? Admittedly, I skipped from the early pages through about 175 pages, and whether it accepted 1080P over HDMI had not been resolved.

Big Worms

10-16-05, 12:57 PM

Well finally saw this set and able to compare it to the Samsung 1080p. The Samsung produces a very nice picture, but I thought the Sony was just better. I won't say that it "blew it away" but I really liked the picture on the Sony. The one question I have and hopefully I can get an unbiased opinion, but the Sony seemed to have way better shadow detail. Has anybody noticed this when comparing, or was the Samsung set up wrong?

As far as the style of the case, I honestly think it grows on you. I sat there wathching the set and honestly because of the case it seemed to give much more focus on just the screen. I felt this way with both the 60" and the 50". I like it!

The big factor for me was if I could get the wife to see which one she liked. She immediately said no to the ears but I told her to please look at both and get an honest opinion on which looked better. At the end she also agreed that the Sony was just better. She was actually the one that pointed out how much better the shadow detail was.

Just wanted to give my .02.

HomeGuy

10-16-05, 01:21 PM

Big Worms

10-16-05, 01:26 PM

Big worms. Did you point out the side speakers or was it something she pointed out. Just curious. I think the side speakers add some elegance to the cabinet. I just don't like the extra width it takes up. I wonder if that is your wife's beef too.
She pointed them out to me. She just felt that they looked weired sticky out side the tv. Last year everyone was doing to but she started to see all the sets are doing the speakers underneath and she really liked that look. And also like you said she felt the tv was much bigger because of them (which I agree). But after really watching the set, we both actually liked the way the screen popped out. She even told me that if we got this set she likes the 60" version and that would be the one she would want. :D

strikeeagle

10-16-05, 05:38 PM

Guys,

What are folks using for "stands" for these large TVs?

Thanks.

strikeeagle

tonydeluce

10-16-05, 05:44 PM

I had problems with black crush/shadow detail (lack of) on the Samsung 5078. I have not had any such problems with my SXRD. Also, IIRC, there was a problem in the Samsung 1080p TVs with them losing picture settings when you switch input sources and/or picture modes that would result in black crush. This gathered a lot of attention in the main Samsung 1080p threads a few weeks ago but has since faded. I'm sure that if you are willing to put the time ino it you can get the Samsung to look very good.

There is an issue ( or least was an issue on the initial releases). Simply
sending the discrete code for Movie mode corrects it. With default movie
mode settings, I get really good shadow detail and black levels - no black
crush.

If we can believe the measurements in HomeTheaterMag then I suspect
the Sony SXRD has better blacks than the currently 1080p DLPs...

msleb

10-17-05, 12:23 PM

In response to my order with Shop Sunshine (shopsunshine.com):

Well, you are right--warm and fuzzy is not what I'm feeling. If I don't hear anything (they've failed to reply to any emails, and I keep missing them by phone) I will contact my CC company to see if they can really stick to their stated policy of charging a 15% order cancellation charge. I will keep everyone posted

Update (for what its worth): Spoke with Sunshine Customer Service--they may be faking it well, but it felt like I actually got someone who wasn't just blowing smoke in my direction. He apologized for their methodology that left the order status webpage stuck on "sent to warehouse". He said this order comes straight from their distributor in California (I guess my set will earn frequent traveler miles: PA-->CA-->MA) directly to a local trucking company.

I ordered on Sept 30 (10 business days ago--it just feels longer) and allegedly the local delivery company will have it before this week is out, and then another several days until I can arrange delivery to my house....Sounds somewhat promising, but we'll see...

For those of you that either picked up their unit or had curbside delivery, was it reasonably easy for 2 able-bodied adult men to handle?
Thanks
I'll let everyone know if it really arrives and in what condition....

PS I did speak with CC company--the issue over whether I am liable for a 15 % cancellation charge is sticky--they couldn't actually answer that until I cancelled and was charged. Given that I am reluctant to take a chance on owing $600 I will wait another week or so and see...

bhaaf

10-17-05, 12:43 PM

In response to my order with Shop Sunshine (shopsunshine):

Update (for what its worth): Spoke with Sunshine Customer Service--they may be faking it well, but it felt like I actually got someone who wasn't just blowing smoke in my direction. He apologized for their methodology that left the order status webpage stuck on "sent to warehouse". He said this order comes straight from their distributor in California (I guess my set will earn frequent traveler miles: PA-->CA-->MA) directly to a local trucking company.

I ordered on Sept 30 (10 business days ago--it just feels longer) and allegedly the local delivery company will have it before this week is out, and then another several days until I can arrange delivery to my house....Sounds somewhat promising, but we'll see...

For those of you that either picked up their unit or had curbside delivery, was it reasonably easy for 2 able-bodied adult men to handle?
Thanks
I'll let everyone know if it really arrives and in what condition....

PS I did speak with CC company--the issue over whether I am liable for a 15 % cancellation charge is sticky--they couldn't actually answer that until I cancelled and was charged. Given that I am reluctant to take a chance on owing $600 I will wait another week or so and see...

We ordered at the same time. I live in So Cal., so well see. Mine will probably ship from New York. I'll post when I get info.

Gary_Kreie

10-17-05, 09:24 PM

This is exactly the question I asked yesterday in the JVC D'ILA vs SONY SXRD thread (would Sony offer a SW/HW upgrade to 1080p?), but nobody had apparently heard about the above newsbyte. Seems like this would solve THE BIGGEST reservation that people are having with SXRD. Of course, it's not a sure thing, and may not even result in a true upgrade given the relative lack of 1080p source material. But, now at least the JVC D'ILA vs SONY SXRD face-off can be on equal footing based on display capabilities.

Now if only November would get here so we can finally have this good ol' fashioned shoot-out!

Here is the link to the article:

http://blogs.pcworld.com/staffblog/archives/000882.html

Treasure Hunter

10-17-05, 09:53 PM

Has anyone ordered a set from OneCall? I know they are an authorized dealer, and have them in stock? I'd like to hear about your experience with them. They gave me a really good price on the phone, and if I use my American Express card American Express will double the warranty, so no need to buy an extended warranty! I'm getting close to buying...hope to hear some good things about them.

2112Raiders

10-17-05, 10:15 PM

Has anyone ordered a set from OneCall?

I ordered from OneCall (Patrick sales rep) last Saturday. They shipped out the set the same day as the order. Waiting on delivery for this Wednesday (I hope).......

Glad you got a good price. Patrick had said that the price they were charging was going to go up. I got 10% off minus another $300 and free shipping.........

wtr1

10-17-05, 10:43 PM

maximum360

10-17-05, 11:09 PM

I'm waiting for my set from Onecall as well. They told me it would be here tuesday but the delivery company is another story...they said around wednesday. I called today and the delivery company said it was on its way to Pennsylvania and then Baltimore right after. As soon as it hit Baltimore I should get a call.

msleb

10-17-05, 11:11 PM

bhaaf and msleb: I also ordered from Sunshine on Sep 30. I inquired last Friday about my shipment. This morning I received an email that I should expect delivery on Thursday, Oct 20. If that happens, the delivery will have been within the 10-14 business days that I was quoted when I ordered.

Here's wish'n and hope'n!!!

wtr1,
May I ask where you live? Supposedly their supplier is in CA, so if you are closer than I am that would account for something.
Also, did you receive an email from Sunshine, or from a local trucking company? Did the email say that YOU would receive shipment on 10/20, or that the LOCAL Co would receive it then?
Please keep us posted, and let me know how tough it is to bring inside from curb.
Good luck! (fingers crossed for you)

CHG

10-17-05, 11:55 PM

wtr1

10-18-05, 07:18 AM

Janibrewski

10-18-05, 02:22 PM

Has anyone ordered a set from OneCall? I know they are an authorized dealer, and have them in stock? I'd like to hear about your experience with them.

Just ordered this morning. They say I should have it late this week or early next, which I'm interpreting to mean by Wednesday of next week!

Clean, quick, good deal (10% and $300 off, no shipping).

This is my second internet TV purchase (first was 23" A10 from ButterflyPhoto) and so far so good.

uzombie

10-18-05, 02:35 PM

Folks,

When you get your set, post a link to picture and please tell us how you "really" like the set! :)

(Want the 50"...waiting for the $)

space2001

10-18-05, 03:12 PM

I am happy that they will offer an upgrade kit at some point, that is nice. just don't feel like paying for the upgrade :P

maximum360

10-18-05, 03:39 PM

I would like to encourage the current and future owners to contact Sony and impress on them our desire to have the optional 1080p upgrade.

I'm sure current owners can make them aware of how much was spent on the purchase and how dismayed they would be that this should have been included to begin with but they are willing to relent if at least the option is available. I'm sure adding that the crippled HDMI that's now available will not be able to take advantage of future Sony products like Blu Ray and the PS3. I'm sure HTPC users have enough to complain about. ;)

If we had a name and email/telephone number to some higher up individual in the Sony camp that might lend an ear and may have so say so in the matter it would help as well...
Those interested in a future SXRD purchase can stress how their purchase decision will be based primarily on whether Sony will offer the 1080p upgrade, while noting that displays on the verge of release have this option (HP 1080p DLP, etc.).

If we don't do anything I'm sure the words of that one 'rep' will be all we ever hear of a 1080p upgrade.

Markriz

10-18-05, 04:09 PM

msleb: I live in North Alabama. I received the email from Danny at Shop Sunshine who I have talked with, several times, on the telephone. He said that my estimated time of arrival was October 20th. I suppose that you could take that a couple of ways, but I am taking it as arrival at my door.

I suspect that you should get yours around the same time.

I'll let you know when I actually receive it.

Wait'n.

I'm in the same boat as you, waiting for delivery.

I placed my order for the 60" from Shopsunshine on the Sept 29th. It's been over 20 days, but I haven't heard from any shipping company. Both times I called them they said its "on the way to you" and I should be hearing something shortly. Last time was 10 days ago.

When I called and ordered it on the 29th, they said they had 6 physically in stock in the warehouse. I'm about a two hour drive, so I'm not sure why it would take 20+ days and counting if they shipped it even remotely close to when I ordered it. I was charged for the TV on my credit card when I ordered.

Sure, they could have ordered it and are having it drop shipped from Sony. But that's not what they told me on the phone when I ordered.

I sent them an email today (they are closed today and tomorrow) that if I don't have a tracking number by Friday, I'm cancelling. I'd like to see them try to hit me with any fees whatsoever. I already chatted with my credit card company and I'm prepared to dispute the charge.

Here is their cancellation policy:
If you cancel an order before it ships, a refund will be issued less a 5% processing fee of charging and refunding your credit card. If you request cancellation of an order after the order has shipped, you will be responsible for all shipping charges even if you refuse the package and do not sign for the delivery.

I hope other folks that ordered from here have a better experience that I've been having. If I had to do it over, I'd have waited and just bought it from CC, who has it and can deliver it in two days.

Mark

paulbf1

10-18-05, 04:49 PM

Now I see why their resellerratings.com rating is so low. I'd bet a donut to a dollar (I'll keep it clean :) ) that they didn't have it in stock when you called and that they still don't have them. Legally, you can request that your credit card company reverse the charge as they did not fulfill their end of the contract. Whatever you do, make sure you post this on the ratings sites (resellerratings.com, bizrate, etc).

I'm in the same boat as you, waiting for delivery.

I placed my order for the 60" from Shopsunshine on the Sept 29th. It's been over 20 days, but I haven't heard from any shipping company. Both times I called them they said its "on the way to you" and I should be hearing something shortly. Last time was 10 days ago.

When I called and ordered it on the 29th, they said they had 6 physically in stock in the warehouse. I'm about a two hour drive, so I'm not sure why it would take 20+ days and counting if they shipped it even remotely close to when I ordered it. I was charged for the TV on my credit card when I ordered.

Sure, they could have ordered it and are having it drop shipped from Sony. But that's not what they told me on the phone when I ordered.

I sent them an email today (they are closed today and tomorrow) that if I don't have a tracking number by Friday, I'm cancelling. I'd like to see them try to hit me with any fees whatsoever. I already chatted with my credit card company and I'm prepared to dispute the charge.

Here is their cancellation policy:
If you cancel an order before it ships, a refund will be issued less a 5% processing fee of charging and refunding your credit card. If you request cancellation of an order after the order has shipped, you will be responsible for all shipping charges even if you refuse the package and do not sign for the delivery.

I hope other folks that ordered from here have a better experience that I've been having. If I had to do it over, I'd have waited and just bought it from CC, who has it and can deliver it in two days.

Mark

bhaaf

10-18-05, 05:29 PM

When I ordered from Sunshine on Sept. 30 they told me it was in stock. Drop ship from some other place is not in stock. I was told by Andy and I wrote it all down at the time that there would be no charge if they did not ship the product, there fault. I'm cancelling the order at the end of the week if it has not arrived. I'll be more than happy to dispute the claim if they try to charge me. I'll also be more than happy to report them to the Better Business Bureau and pass the word around to all. This is about what I expected from the past reviews of sunshine. Live and Learn, the hard way.

AUPigskin--

10-18-05, 06:23 PM

bhaaf,
You have a PM...

Owen

10-18-05, 06:31 PM

mesh

10-18-05, 06:48 PM

Other then possible future PS3 games, what advantage to you expect to get out of a 1080p input?

BluRay and HTPC’s will work fine with 1080i.

As long as the SXRD can do good quality motion adaptive and weave deinterlacing, not just simple bob, I cant see how a 1080p input will offer any significant advantage.

The advantage is if you're outputing from a pc you get much better pic quality and a high rez at a good refresh rate. I want 1080p becuase of my HTPC and im sure others feel the same way.

ca1ore

10-18-05, 08:29 PM

I must say, with all the teeth-knashing that has been going on about 1080i vs. 1080p, it will be very interesting to see down the road if it makes any difference. Will an HTPC set to 1080p into a RPTV look better than a 1080i inout signal scaled to 1080p by the TV? On a 50"/60" RPTV, I'm thinking the answer is probably NO.

Simon

stevel

10-18-05, 09:03 PM

IIRC, a company can only charge your credit card when they are ready to ship your order.
Not so - try ordering a PC from Alienware, for example. Most vendors indeed don't charge until they ship, but there's no requirement for them to do that.

Artwood

10-18-05, 09:26 PM

Only the true AVS prophets worship 1080p now. Next year when everybody has it the Plants will find true religion!

George Cifranci

10-18-05, 10:29 PM

For those of you that either picked up their unit or had curbside delivery, was it reasonably easy for 2 able-bodied adult men to handle?
Thanks

I got mine delivered by Circuit City. 2 guys took it out of the box outside and carried it in through my front door. I wouldn't say it was "easy" but 2 strong guys were able to handle it ok.

wtr1

10-18-05, 10:29 PM

paulbf1

10-19-05, 01:01 AM

Only the true AVS prophets worship 1080p now. Next year when everybody has it the Plants will find true religion!

And the point of this non-sequitur is???????????

roller11

10-19-05, 03:05 AM

The advantage is if you're outputing from a pc you get much better pic quality and a high rez at a good refresh rate. I want 1080p becuase of my HTPC and im sure others feel the same way.

How do you figure? If your PC puts out 1080i/30, then the SXRD does the
deinterlacing and you wind up with 1080p/30 displayed. If the same set accepts
1080p, then the deinterlacing is done by the PC and passed to the TV as
1080P/30. Either way, 1080P/30 is displayed.

Not exactly an answer to the question of "does the SXRD handle 1080i from
a PC on the HDMI input?", but I've tried both 1080i and 720p out from
my PC using the Fusion 2 tuner card and an nvidia 6800 graphics card, and I can't tell
any difference playing HDTV recordings (OTA .tp files). This on my 1280x720 DLP.

Owen

10-19-05, 06:37 AM

The advantage is if you're outputing from a pc you get much better pic quality and a high rez at a good refresh rate. I want 1080p becuase of my HTPC and im sure others feel the same way.

If the display can do 2:2 pull down and weave deinterlace, that is just not true.
I have been using a HTPC for 6 years, connected to both interlaced and progressive displays.
I am also the dude who started the whole FFDShow resize-sharpen thing a couple of years ago, so I have not been sitting on my hands for these 6 years either.
I know a good quality picture when I see one.

1080i 60Hz should look identical to 1080p 30fps on the SXRD for PC use.
There should be ZERO interline or full screen flicker on the SXRD with a 1080i input.
If there is, the deinterlacer in the SXRD is no damn good, and the Sony should be avoided at all cost.

HomeGuy

10-19-05, 07:03 AM

I don't know if 1080P inputs will future proof your set but I can tell you that last night I watched Hitch Hicker's Guide to the Galaxy on DVD and the PQ was jaw dropping. So if 480I looks so awesome I can only imagine what a good 1080i signal will look like on the SXRD. It's plenty sharp for me. This set should keep me happy for many years to come.

drhill

10-19-05, 09:15 AM

If the display can do 2:2 pull down and weave deinterlace, that is just not true.
I have been using a HTPC for 6 years, connected to both interlaced and progressive displays.
I am also the dude who started the whole FFDShow resize-sharpen thing a couple of years ago, so I have not been sitting on my hands for these 6 years either.
I know a good quality picture when I see one.

1080i 60Hz should look identical to 1080p 30fps on the SXRD for PC use.
There should be ZERO interline or full screen flicker on the SXRD with a 1080i input.
If there is, the deinterlacer in the SXRD is no damn good, and the Sony should be avoided at all cost.

You are right there isn't any appreciable difference for watching movies and such from our pc at 1080i 60 or 1080p 30. But you forget that there are these things called "games". These wonderful little inventions provide hours of entertainment and can look quite nice. They also look a lot smoother when you play them at a frame rate consistantly at or above 60 compared to 30. ;)

As there won't be broadcast sports for quite some time at 1080p 60 (and finally seeing 720p 60 broadcast compared to the 1080i broadcast, there isn't much difference in sports except lost resolution because of motion, which still isn't that great and not worth the resolution tradeoff) it isn't a big deal for that. Game is a completely different matter and is important. There will be some 1080p games for the PS3. There will be and is already a ton of games on the pc you can play at 1080p.

dsaumkc

10-19-05, 10:56 AM

There will be and is already a ton of games on the pc you can play at 1080p.

Oh really? Got any titles for me? I'd like to check that out!....

Dolphran

10-19-05, 11:17 AM

1080i 60Hz should look identical to 1080p 30fps on the SXRD for PC use.
I agree it should LOOK identical, but perhaps not "sound" or "feel" identical. Deinterlacing (other than "bob" deinterlacing which yeilds a 1920x540 picture) will cause video delay. Video delay can cause lip-sync issues (thus inferior "sound") and cause games that rely on human reflex timing to "feel" different (even to the point of unplayability). These issues can be very important to many of us.

Owen

10-19-05, 12:22 PM

Gaming is a totally different ball game to normal PC use, or typical HTPC use (video playback).

There is no doubt that 60fps is better then 30fps for games, all else being equal. Unfortunately the people who are jumping up and down about the need for 1080p input so they can play games, seem to be forgetting about video processing delay that is present in all digital displays.
Not much point in a 1080p 60fps input, if the TV imposes a 200ms video delay.
It would be very interesting to compare a display with a 1080i 60Hz (30fps) input, and say 50ms processing delay, compared to a display with 1080p 60fps input, and say 200ms processing delay for gaming use.
Video processing delay will screw your gaming up very nicely, yet people seem to only concentrate on 1080p 60 being the holly grail.

The weave deinterlacing that would be used to deinterlace a 1080i 60Hz PC output to 1080p 30fps is a very simple process, that should introduce negligible processing delay.
The delay caused by the normal video processing functions of the display will dominate.
Processing delay can vary very significantly between different brands and models.
Even 720p displays can have VERY significant video processing delay. Samsung DLPs are one good example.

Life was not meant to be simple. :D

drhill

10-19-05, 12:51 PM

Oh really? Got any titles for me? I'd like to check that out!....

Any game with custom resolutions. Half Life 2, Doom 3, F.E.A.R., etc.

drhill

10-19-05, 12:52 PM

Owen

10-19-05, 01:17 PM

Lord Ace Man

10-19-05, 03:36 PM

AkaStp: it is a common "practice" to charge a card at the time of order and ship at a later date. That does not necessarily mean that there is a problem. I don't like the "practice" but there is nothing that I can realistically do about it other than refuse to do business with companies that do it.

That FACT that Sunshine has not issued me a shipping/ tracking number is very bothersome. But, there have been a few times that I received the shipping/ tracking information AFTER I actually received the item. Go Figure???

I'm not bashing or defending Sunshine. They specifically told me, several times, that it would take 10-14 business days for delivery. They are not late...........yet!

My bottom line is the same as others have mentioned.

Hope'n and Wait'n.

It's not common practice to charge a card before item is ship unless the vendor states that as their policy or items that are special order.

What vendors normally do is authorize your card for a certain amount at the time of order to make sure your card is valid. Then process the actual transaction when item is ship.

Can you imagine hotel and car rental companies having a field day with prepaid reservation several months in advance. Even hotels have a no charge policy if you cancel within their cancellation period. You might want to investigate with your CC if your item wasn't deliver within the time frame as promise. Perhaps you might be able to avoid 5/15 percent surcharge.

wtr1

10-19-05, 04:35 PM

Ace: I do not intend to pay a surcharge if they do not deliver. My bank is just down the street from where I work. I will go see them if I must.

Haven't received the TV yet, but the 14 business days aren't over.........yet.

Hope'n and Wait'n.

LL3HD

10-19-05, 05:21 PM

I finally saw the beast yesterday and I was very disappointed.

It was at Circuit City in Westbury. I walked in and spotted it a mile away (the dumbos). CC is either more interested in selling other sets or they do not want to push the SXRDs. They have the 60” set in a far left corner of a big room up against a wall on about a 45 degree viewing angle. It is a horrible place to have any set. The reason for my disappointment was the evident drop off on that angle. :( I didn’t realize that the set had such a critical viewing sweet spot. This is a concern for me because of my seating arrangements in my living room- sectional, chairs, love seats. My entertainment room is a living room first, HT last, WAF :rolleyes: .

I will definitely make a trip to another store and reevaluate.

Tele-TV

10-19-05, 05:27 PM

Since the TV is made in America (or assembled at least), there is no luxury tax. so in Ontario, we just pay PST and GST (15%). The cheapest I've seen here is not even close to what I can get it for in the US. In fact, when converted there is over a $1000.00 difference. I'm all for supporting the Canadian economy, but not when the difference is that exaggerated.

Rahi

- I'm still on Page 190 of this thread. Trying to catch-up. :D

:p [in a Shocked, BUT Silly Mood] .....

For the guys (and myself) that were wondering about Rahi seeing the 60" SXRD 20% off of $5,000 on a BB computer, I just realized he is in Canada. Wait-a-minute, JUST realized something, the MSRP on the SXRD's in Canada are highe though. So I'm not sure what's going on (LOL).

When I called BB (U.S.) couple of days ago about the 60", they told me no discount/MSRP price currently on the SXRD.

Matthew

MultimediaMike

10-19-05, 07:13 PM

Big Worms

10-19-05, 08:26 PM

MultimediaMike, what setting was the SXRD in?

stevel

10-19-05, 09:16 PM

I didn’t realize that the set had such a critical viewing sweet spot.
It doesn't. 45 degrees is rather extreme for anything other than direct view or plasma. I found the SXRD set to have a much broader viewing angle side to side than many competing RP sets. It's pretty good vertically, too, but not quite as much so. The Qualia 006 is a bit better in this regard, but not $7000 better.

If viewing at a significant angle is important to you, then you don't want ANY RPTV. Go plasma.

drhill

10-19-05, 09:19 PM

Obviously the lack of 1080p input did not dissuade you from purchasing an SXRD, and I’m glad to hear that video delay is no a problem, although I have no intention of ever playing games myself.

As a matter of interest, what video card would be required to run a fast action game at 1920x1080p 60 with all the detail turned on in the game, two 7800 cards in SLI mode?

My HTPC is running a 7800 on an AMD 64 X2 4600. I can probably loan a game like Doom 3, just to see what it would look like on my 57” screen at 1080i.
I have not even looked at a game in 6 years, so I am curious what they are like these days.

Dear f'n lord, why do you have that system if you don't play games? HTPC can't take up that much power.

I used to run Doom 3 at 1744x988i with all the settings on sans AA at around 30fps. I only have a P4 2.6HT & ATI x800pro. Your system beats mine like it was a red headed step child.

jvrobert

10-19-05, 09:28 PM

Dear f'n lord, why do you have that system if you don't play games? HTPC can't take up that much power.

I used to run Doom 3 at 1744x988i with all the settings on sans AA at around 30fps. I only have a P4 2.6HT & ATI x800pro. Your system beats mine like it was a red headed step child.

WMV/h.264 decoding takes a lot of horsepower, and encoding takes a whole lot of horesepower. I don't plan to play many games on my TV (I prefer a normal 21" CRT monitor for that), but I went with a similarly hard-core machine for my HTPC.

Plus, if you want to do software deinterlacing/scaling (instead of using PureVideo) that also takes a lot of CPU for a 1080 image.

daytoncj

10-19-05, 09:29 PM

i saw the 60" today and was blown away. compared it next to the old a10 and the newer samsung. the picture was stunning to say the least. standing less than two feet away i could not see any screen door effect. granted it had an hd program on but again, after seeing the mitsu 1080p i thought the sony was much clearer, brighter, and overall just smoother.

RowdyUSP40

10-20-05, 12:58 AM

I know this has been said may times here but, I have to say again. You can't tell how good these TVs are at these stores (most) with horrid feeds and especially not doing some setting adjustments.
The SD on the 60" in my home looks better than just about all the HD feeds at the stores I viewed the SXRD at.

iasm

10-20-05, 02:27 AM

even though i cant use the sxrd because of the width i was looking forward to seeing the set.I saw one today for the first time and was really disappointed.The picture was really dark and a lot of detail was lost.The set was at Frys by the front door so the area was very bright.Maybe the set was not set up correctly.

lipcrkr

10-20-05, 05:06 AM

Rusty104

10-20-05, 08:06 AM

Thanks to all on this forum for shedding info on the Sony SXRD. It helped in making my mind up in getting one. My particular thanks to HADLEYFARM for his assistance in helping me get the unit for a SUPER price.

Oskiebabu

10-20-05, 04:32 PM

Oskiebabu

10-20-05, 04:39 PM

To continue, I was lucky enough to go to a friends house with the 60" SXRD that had been ISF calibrated and he had not removed his Samsung 50" DLP yet. With the same feeds off of a JVC D-VHS the difference in non-animation and non-sports was very significant. All 5 people in the room were in complete agreement.

Gary_Kreie

10-20-05, 05:37 PM

Thanks for the photo Curt. Guess I was wrong about sets made in Japan. SORRY. What I read from sony press release and posting from the forum made it seem like sets were assemble in USA only.

My box also said Made in Japan. But I know the TV was shipped from Pennsylvania -- SonyStyle -- where the sets are assembled.

JimP

10-20-05, 07:13 PM

Uninvited Guest

10-20-05, 07:35 PM

Fry's is the worst place to look at TV's. Hell, if they had Catherine Zeta Jones on display she'd look like Joan Rivers.You need to go there with your beer goggles on ;)

ISO Perfect HDTV

10-20-05, 08:06 PM

Obviously the lack of 1080p input did not dissuade you from purchasing an SXRD, and I’m glad to hear that video delay is no a problem, although I have no intention of ever playing games myself.

As a matter of interest, what video card would be required to run a fast action game at 1920x1080p 60 with all the detail turned on in the game, two 7800 cards in SLI mode?

My HTPC is running a 7800 on an AMD 64 X2 4600. I can probably loan a game like Doom 3, just to see what it would look like on my 57” screen at 1080i.
I have not even looked at a game in 6 years, so I am curious what they are like these days.

you have enough horse power in your HTPC to play whatever you want at 1920x1080p
I have P4 3.4 and an overclocked 6800gt and i can play Doom 3 @ 1280x1024 high details

ISO Perfect HDTV

10-20-05, 08:43 PM

rlb

10-20-05, 10:04 PM

ISO Perfect HDTV

10-20-05, 10:08 PM

Setup (expecially Iris, dynamic iris, and brightness) have a major impact on black levels. The A10 isn't close on black levels if the SXRD is setup properly.

I didn't have enough time to set it up properly, i just used pro mode with Iris 2
but i couldn't find the advanced settings.

AUPigskin--

10-20-05, 10:12 PM

RowdyUSP40

10-21-05, 12:25 AM

DrAV

10-21-05, 02:16 AM

I also saw the SXRD 60" for the first time today at BB, and after all the reviews and opinions i read here for the past 2 weeks, I brought a chain with me to anchor myself down expecting to get blown away like many others :D

IMHO the TV is nice.........very nice actually (after i set it in Pro mode)
it had a good HD feed (the BB guys must have checked this forum cause all the TVs were looking good today) :) , lots of Discovery HD, Universal HD and other demos also connected to many 720p TVs like the A10, the Samsung, the Panasonic LCD......
and all i can say is the SXRD looked better as of course it should, but by no means a great deal better, blacks were good but i cannot say they looked better then the DLPs or even then the A10. I didn't see any SDE or SSE. and definitely was best viewed at 8-10 feet.
The Plasmas in the back all had a sharper image, but overall I liked the smooth picture of the SXRD better.
I'm going to have to take another look at it and compare it to other 1080p RPTVs
but i liked what i saw with the exclusion of the design and the black bezel actually can reflect light and bother you :eek:

I saw the same thing at the local BB until I connected my Sony HD Camera up. I used component inputs on the Sony 60" SXRD and a 62" Mit DLP sitting next to it even though I could have used the 1394/ilink inputs on the Sony. The SXRD became the clear winner then. The Mit 62" DLP looked washed out and pale and the image was rather soft and almost unfocused compared to the 60" SXRD next to it. The salesperson also agreed hands down that the SXRD looked better. When they ran the standard canned HD feed the Mit only looked slightly worse.

IMHO I find it a bit hard to believe that lower resolution Plasmas had a sharper image.

I may be ready to make the move. Is Sunshine the best deal around or is there something better??

DrAV

10-21-05, 02:32 AM

I spent the better part of yesterday (10/15) going to CC first then BB and finally Ultimate comparing the 60" XBR to other sets. The CC dis[lay featured the 60" XBR nxst to a Samsung 71" DLP. IMO the Samsung blew away the Sony. The Samsung had better blacks, contrast, resolution and color saturation while the Sony picture was soft with maybe slightly better flesh tones. The sales person and I tried various setting on the Sony and the Samsung, but nothing helped the Sony. Major disappointment. The local BB did not have the Sony so off I went to Ultimate. The feed at Ultimate to the 60" XBR was unbelieveably bad. All of the TV's on their back wall looked just as bad. So I cannot make a judgement of the Ultimate display. I will try Sears to see what they have, but at this point the Sony is starting to fall from my short list.

The Sony is most likely getting a bad feed into it. I've seen the same kind of thing on a 50" SXRD where it looked much worse. Then I ran my HD Camera into the sets and the Sony clearly blew them away. Much more saturated, sharper and more life like. It really is superior technology compared to the DLPs but it can look worse if it gets a bad feed.

Markriz

10-21-05, 10:26 AM

For those wondering,
My Sunshine shipment finally has a tracking number and I verified that it WAS picked up by the freight line today (ETA next Wednesday). Sunshine seems to have been straight with me the whole time, and instead of the quoted 14 bus. day delivery, it looks like it will be at worst 18 bus. days due to a Sony shipment mistake.

Bernie

Also good news here on the Sunshine front.
My shipment was also picked up yesterday (Thurs), and is on schedule for delivery next Tuesday. Took a little longer than I'd hoped but I'm relieved that it's finally shipped. (Shipping to me via Manna Distribution Services, which has a web page to track status.)

Can't wait!!

Mark

FatNoah

10-21-05, 11:04 AM

...blacks were good but i cannot say they looked better then the DLPs or even then the A10...

Something was seriously wrong with the set then. The A10 with its IRIS mode can produce some good blacks, but there is no comparison when it comes to shadow detail. The next time you look at the SXRD, try to compare the level of detail discernable in shadowed areas. This is one of the places where the SXRD really shines when compared with LCD RPTVs.

deconvolver

10-21-05, 11:17 AM

I've now viewed the Sony 60" SXRD next to both the regular WEGA LCD, and 1080P DLPs from Mitzubishi 62628, Samsung 6168, and even Toshiba 62HM195 and the DLP's, featuring Texas Instruments HD4 1080P native display is CLEARLY SUPERIOR to the LCoS based SXRD. Blacks are much deeper, text is much sharper, the picture is Brighter, and Color/Contrast are much more vivid. Almost "eye-popping" in fact. The SXRD was not that much better than it's less expensive grand wega sibling.
Oh, and the price tag for the 61-62" DLPs are $500-1000 less. Heck, even the INCREDIBLE Toshiba 72" 72HM195 1080P is just $ 4999 (same as the 60" SXRD)
Hmm, aren't you just commenting on where the relative user settings for contrast, brightness, sharpness and color happened to be set? If so then you are showing exactly why most sets come set up in torch mode with brightness, contrast, saturation and sharpness turned up to horrendously unrealistic eye-popping cartoon levels. Maybe the SXRD had simply been correctly adjusted?

Dixie Flatline

10-21-05, 11:25 AM

(Shipping to me via Manna Distribution Services, which has a web page to track status.)
Uh, I don't know about you, but I'd be a little worried about the name of the shipper. You might want to double-check that they're not going to drop the set from the sky onto your front lawn... :eek:

RowdyUSP40

10-21-05, 12:04 PM

Dixie Flatline

10-21-05, 12:37 PM

"Uh, I don't know about you, but I'd be a little worried about the name of the shipper. You might want to double-check that they're not going to drop the set from the sky onto your front lawn... "

Why should he be worried about the name of the shipper?!? :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Think "manna from heaven". (Biblical reference: in the book of Exodus, when the Israelites are wandering in the desert without food, Yahweh drops mysterious tasty food called "manna" from the sky so they don't starve. Exodus 16 or thereabouts.) So when I see "Manna Distribution Services", I have to wonder if they make their deliveries from low-flying aircraft. :p

Markriz

10-21-05, 12:54 PM

Think "manna from heaven". (Biblical reference: in the book of Exodus, when the Israelites are wandering in the desert without food, Yahweh drops mysterious tasty food called "manna" from the sky so they don't starve. Exodus 16 or thereabouts.) So when I see "Manna Distribution Services", I have to wonder if they make their deliveries from low-flying aircraft. :p

haha I'll make sure I'm not sitting outside in a lawn chair around the scheduled time!
"Look dear! Here comes the TV! Hmm it's coming in awful fas.." <splat>

RDO CA

10-21-05, 03:04 PM

[QUOTE=Owen]Gaming is a totally different ball game to normal PC use, or typical HTPC use (video playback).

There is no doubt that 60fps is better then 30fps for games, all else being equal. Unfortunately the people who are jumping up and down about the need for 1080p input so they can play games, seem to be forgetting about video processing delay that is present in all digital displays.
Not much point in a 1080p 60fps input, if the TV imposes a 200ms video delay.
It would be very interesting to compare a display with a 1080i 60Hz (30fps) input, and say 50ms processing delay, compared to a display with 1080p 60fps input, and say 200ms processing delay for gaming use.
Video processing delay will screw your gaming up very nicely, yet people seem to only concentrate on 1080p 60 being the holly grail.

The weave deinterlacing that would be used to deinterlace a 1080i 60Hz PC output to 1080p 30fps is a very simple process, that should introduce negligible processing delay.
The delay caused by the normal video processing functions of the display will dominate.
Processing delay can vary very significantly between different brands and models.
Even 720p displays can have VERY significant video processing delay. Samsung DLPs are one good example.

Owen
Having read your posts for a while I respect your Knowledge in this area and would be interested in your thoughts about this post about the new HP 1080P DLP set---this was posted by Reldan

" am primarily a HTPC user. It's the reason I bought this TV. I don't even have cable or a standalone DVD player hooked up right now.

After using the set for the night I must say I'm more than pleased. As a monitor this set will work better than any other on the market right now. It has a built in PC Aspect which gives you no over or underscan AND 1:1 pixel mapping at 1920X1080. It has a built it toggle between Video and PC grayscale levels.

I can't say anything about the VGA port, as I see no reason not to connect my PC (with x800 Pro vid card) through DVI-HDMI. DVDs look superb using Zoomplayer with DScaler and FFDShow (upscaling to 1080p).

Battlefield 2 looks absolutely insane. I can't describe how lush and detailed everything looks, and how the water shimmers as it catches the light just so... The PQ on this set is so good that it makes the Toshiba 62HMX94 I was using last week put on a dunce cap and cry in the corner. I can hardly believe the graphics I'm seeing now are coming from the same source as when I saw them on the Tosh set.

Oh, and I've tested it with Tekken 5 on PS2 and Soul Calibur 2 on Gamecube. Zero lag. This set doesn't need a game mode like the Toshibas, it simply doesn't have a latency problem at all with game consoles.

I've seen SXRD at Huppins (online known as Onecall) and I must say I'm impressed. To me this looks just as good though, and with the 1080p over HDMI it definately was the better choice for my needs (HTPC user).

Quote:
Originally Posted by dk0r
I intend to use this display as a HTPC, especially for gaming, and am wondering how this display will handle over/under-scan issues?

Also, 1.Are over/under-scan issues just TV dependent? or are they Video Card dependent, or both?
2.What kind of video card are you using? 3.Are you using DVI to HDMI, or straight VGA ? and 4.Would using DVI to HDMI or straight VGA have an affect on over/under-scan issues?

All I know is that if you send this TV a 1920X1080 60 Hz signal from your PC with DVI-HDMI and put the set on PC Aspect Ratio and PC DVI Color, it will correcly give you 1:1 pixel mapping at 1080p with no over/underscan and correct PC level grayscale (1-255). Any newer ATI or NVidia graphics card with the latest drivers will be able to do this, and if you didn't have a newer card you wouldn't be able to run games in 1920X1080 anyways (it's roughtly equivalent to running in the more common 1600X1200 in terms of framerates).

Battlefield 2 looks better on this TV than it does on my 19" Sony LCD monitor. I look forward to years of insane gaming on this set. "

Roy

msleb

10-21-05, 03:14 PM

Also good news here on the Sunshine front.
My shipment was also picked up yesterday (Thurs), and is on schedule for delivery next Tuesday. Took a little longer than I'd hoped but I'm relieved that it's finally shipped. (Shipping to me via Manna Distribution Services, which has a web page to track status.)

Can't wait!!

Mark

Yep, Me too--hopefully I'll have my set by Wed. If that is true, my only complaint would be in the somewhat misleading impression Sunshine gave about delivery timetable and their (lack of) communication during the wait.
On the other hand, the price was great, and if it all ends well I'll be very happy

roller11

10-21-05, 04:18 PM

Besides the solid blacks on the Sony SXRD, what really impresses me over every DLP and LCD rear projection I have seen is the the shading, partcicularly the grey shading. Almost every DLP is pathetic in that area. DLP's look great on animated films and on sports where shading is almost non-existant and bright popping colors make the screen look impressive. But in watching old film noire movies and any movies with evening and nightime shots, the SXRD blows them out of the water.

.

This is the one thing my 1280x720 DLP does poorly, dimly lit areas.
AKA "clay faces", it's as though the DPP tech can't resolve low level light scenes,
the colors seem to be gray instead of a dimly lit brown skin tone.
It is most obvious in prime time dramas, like 'Ghost whisperer' on CBS.
Of course the newer DLP may have corrected this problem, and I have yet to
verify that the same problem doesn't exist on the SXRD. That's why
I'm taking my PC to the B&M so I can watch selected .tp files that
I've recorded onto my hard drive, files that really show off this problem.
If the SXRD has 'clay faces', these files will reveal it. And this is a prob
that will never show up in a B&M showroom cause they never have
HDTV primetime dramas playing.

Rob Tomlin

10-21-05, 05:55 PM

There is a decent review of the 60 inch SXRD in the recent issue of Widescreen Review. In short, thumbs up!

Janibrewski

10-21-05, 06:13 PM

I ordered from OneCall on Tuesday, the TV arrived today (Friday).

72 hours - now that's service.

Yippie!

TwinTurboZX

10-21-05, 06:35 PM

Fry's is in bed with Mitsubishi, always has been so don't expect to see a correctly set up SXRD on display in their stores. I was there last week and they had the 60" sitting on a high TV stand on top a platforum. The screen was about 6.5 feet off the ground. I made a few adjustments and it looked fantastic. Although I had to stand on my toes to be at a better vantage point with respect to the screen. It was in a very dimly lit corner and the blacks were excellent. The picture had a very smooth look to it compared to the A10 next to it, not to be confused with "softness".

Owen

10-21-05, 07:00 PM

1.Are over/under-scan issues just TV dependent? or are they Video Card dependent, or both?

Underscan is TV dependent, but can be compensated for on a PC.

2.What kind of video card are you using?

7800, 6600GT, 9600Pro

3.Are you using DVI to HDMI, or straight VGA ? and

Component

4.Would using DVI to HDMI or straight VGA have an affect on over/under-scan issues?

It should not.

All I know is that if you send this TV a 1920X1080 60 Hz signal from your PC with DVI-HDMI and put the set on PC Aspect Ratio and PC DVI Color, it will correcly give you 1:1 pixel mapping at 1080p with no over/underscan and correct PC level grayscale (1-255). Any newer ATI or NVidia graphics card with the latest drivers will be able to do this, and if you didn't have a newer card you wouldn't be able to run games in 1920X1080 anyways (it's roughtly equivalent to running in the more common 1600X1200 in terms of framerates).

If you get no overscan with a 1920x1080p input, it is VERY likely you are NOT getting 1:1, as most, if not all RPTV’s have overscan designed into the optics.
1:1 mapping should result in overscan, unless an overscan compensated resolution is used.
It would seem that PC mode is scaling the image down to fit the screen.

The PC levels thing is no big deal, as the display can only be calibrated for one task.
If you use your PC to play video, you should calibrate for video levels. PC applications and games will then look wrong, as they expect PC levels.
You just can't have it both ways, unless the TV has programmable presets you can call up for different tasks. (many do)

Treasure Hunter

10-21-05, 08:11 PM

I am ready to buy a 50" set and I am looking for a good price. I don't know what everyone is paying, but I've read that some are getting good deals. If anyone would like to share where they got their sets, I'd love to hear from you. You can PM me or post here. I've been looking all over ( I probably missed some places) and can do no better than 10%. Hopefully someone can turn me onto a better deal. TIA :)

V1cK

10-21-05, 08:14 PM

Treasure Hunter

10-21-05, 08:39 PM

I just paid $2550 for the 50". I probably don't count though because I work at the place I bought it and that was my discount price...

That's a fabulous price. If you want to make some money, buy me one, add a few hundred and ship it out to me!!! ;) ;) ;)

rahivictory

10-21-05, 08:39 PM

Dear All,

Took the plunge today! 60", mathcing stand, 4 year warranty with bulb replacement, monster hts 1600, monster ultra 1000 hdmi cables x2, free DVD player, two free DVDs of my choice, and 175 in best buy dollars all for less than the retail of the TV alone!

Thanks for everyone's input advice and help. Still wish someone could answer the OPPo vs Sony 3100 ES DVD player question so I can jump the last hurdle...

Rahi

roller11

10-21-05, 09:16 PM

You have a Samsung DLP? I've seen the same thing on newer Samsung DLPs. Never seen such a thing on Sony A10 or SXRD though.

Yes, a 61" HLN model.
Doesn't surprise me that you've seen it on the newer DLPs (I'm assuming you mean 1920x1080, or the HD2+ chipset models.) Closeups of actors faces in still or
near still scenes will sow the prob. That's because typically the light source will be
on one side of the face, so a shadow is cast across the other side of the face.
As the skin tone comes out of the shadow, gray/greenish/red striations
are seen instead of a smooth gradual lightning of the brown skin tone. It's like there aren't
enough bits on the lower end of the palette to resolve dim lighting.
A TV service guy told me that this is by far the biggest complaint of customers
that have DLP sets, and generates the most service calls.

DrAV

10-22-05, 02:32 AM

DrAV

10-22-05, 02:36 AM

Has anybody actually received their sets from Sunshine? All I've heard is complaints. Anyone have a good experience? Please post, I'd like to know before attempting to buy from them.

Thanks!

Curt Anderson

10-22-05, 04:56 AM

Has anybody actually received their sets from Sunshine? All I've heard is complaints. Anyone have a good experience? Please post, I'd like to know before attempting to buy from them.

Thanks!

There seem to be a few on their way to buyers right now. (Tracking #'s) I'd play it safe and wait a few days for those members to snap some photos of their SXRDs bought from Sunshine.

stevel

10-22-05, 08:16 AM

AUPigskin--

10-22-05, 08:21 AM

Has anybody actually received their sets from Sunshine? All I've heard is complaints. Anyone have a good experience? Please post, I'd like to know before attempting to buy from them.

Thanks!

Bombthroat was the first forum member to get an SXRD and it happened to be from Sunshine.

I have a couple SXRDs on order from Sunshine. I placed the order on Sept. 30 and was quoted 10-14 business days for delivery. They said there were 10 in-stock at the time but it turns out the SXRDs were to be 'drop-shipped' straight from Sony to my house. When I did not receive my shipment on the Sunshine ETA, they said Sony "misshipped" the set, it went to them instead of me. I now have a tracking number, the TVs are in-transit, and the freight line called yesterday to coordinate delivery for Wednesday.

Bottom-line, instead of 14 bus. days, it will take 18 bus. days. Not sure what to think of the "in-stock" claim in the beginning but their customer service seemed pretty helpful (I called almost every other day).

FWIW: This is my second order with Sunshine. I ordered a 36" Wega from them 4 years ago with no problems...

JimP

10-22-05, 09:14 AM

ttenrag

10-22-05, 04:00 PM

Does anyone know if Sony plans to make a 42inch size?

AbMagFab

10-22-05, 04:15 PM

Does anyone know if Sony plans to make a 42inch size?

1080p at anything less than 50 inches doesn't look any different than 720p. The tech is different, but you really can't see the additional resolution.

In other words, I doubt we'll see 1080p sets at less than 50" (until the tech becomes very very inexpensive).

Rob Tomlin

10-22-05, 04:42 PM

1080p at anything less than 50 inches doesn't look any different than 720p. The tech is different, but you really can't see the additional resolution.

In other words, I doubt we'll see 1080p sets at less than 50" (until the tech becomes very very inexpensive).

I agree.

stevel

10-22-05, 07:33 PM

I expect RPTVs smaller than 50" to disappear. LCD and Plasma are taking over that range, maybe SED in the future.

n2nrush

10-22-05, 09:35 PM

Thanks to all who have posted the plethora of info on this Thread!

I pulled the trigger at a Grand Opening (Simi Valley) BB yesterday. They price matched a local B&M plus an additional $100.00 coupon the B&M had online.

It came to exactly a 12.52% discount off of MSRP. I bought the 4 yr warranty (w/bulbs) as well. They had some Reward Zone program that costs ten bucks a year, but It paid for itself and got me somewhere between $115-$150 in BB bucks.

It was a painless experience (aside from having to decline the "monster hdmi cables and power conditioner pitch a few times)

See you all in the owners thread...
n2n

Rudy1

10-23-05, 04:46 AM

ptwat

10-23-05, 07:21 AM

Have any of you owners found issues with convergence of the panels on your set? I recall one of our senior members stating that if an SXRD set displayed misconvergence in any area of the screen there was nothing that could be done to eliminate it.
I just saw one on display at a B&M that exhibited what appeared to be mis-convergence. White objects had a green halo on one side and a red halo on the other side. The SXRD next to it did not with the same feed. If I stood back from the set some the general feeling was that the picture was out of focus.

ehlarson

10-23-05, 09:53 AM

Schillacci

10-23-05, 10:41 PM

Hey guys, newbie here. After lots of reading and researching, I finally pulled the trigger on a 50" SXRD. Delivery from Circuit City is confirmed for tomorrow afternoon. I managed to get what I think is a good deal. 10% off the Tv, and stand, plus the typical in-store credit. I was pretty close on ordering on-line but after reading the long wait stories from some folks here I decided to pay a little extra and go for the local retailers.

Anyway I can't wait to get home tomorrow and get to play with this baby....

I have a question for the experts out there. I have a lot of video material in Pal format (I relocated from Europe last year), and I was wondering if Sony has by chance make the SXRD's multisystem. That seems to be the norm with every Tv they sell in Europe, but for some reason is not the case here in the US. Has anybody tried playing Pal material in these new sets?

Thank you all for all your help.

dsaumkc

10-23-05, 11:12 PM

Curt Anderson

10-24-05, 04:01 AM

You will be pleased to know that your new SXRD is PAL compatible..

There is an NTSC/PAL switch on it... CONGRATS!

Where is said switch?

Rusty104

10-24-05, 08:59 AM

I opted for the CC four warranty partly because of the bulb replacement. The salesman told me that there was unlimited replacement during the warranty period. When I got home and read the coverage it said "replacement of the ORIGINAL" bulb. When I picked up my tv yesterday I asked them about that. The salesman said the policy had been changed to "unlimited" because the competition had forced it (pointing a thumb to BB next door). I would have canceled my policy were it not for the increased coverage. I will call the warranty number today to verify the unlimited bulb coverage.

Schillacci

10-24-05, 10:46 AM

I also got CC's protection plan and they also told me that bulb replacements were included. I asked them several times about it since it sounded like an excellent deal and they assured me that when the bulb dies they install you a new one at no charge.

Schillacci

10-24-05, 10:47 AM

You will be pleased to know that your new SXRD is PAL compatible..

There is an NTSC/PAL switch on it... CONGRATS!

I have not seen anything in the user's manual about this switch. Is this confirmed?

Still awaiting delivery later tonight....

dsaumkc

10-24-05, 11:11 AM

I have not seen anything in the user's manual about this switch. Is this confirmed?

Still awaiting delivery later tonight....

I'm trying to find where I saw it... I will look later when I get home unless someone can do it faster...

I'm pretty sure I saw it the other day when installing mine into the wall...

I looked in my manual this morning to be sure and I can't see it anywhere.. so it's possible that I'm just losing my mind from A/V insanity... lol..

rlb

10-24-05, 12:10 PM

Oskiebabu

10-24-05, 12:18 PM

Jim P- I presume the Samsung DLP was ISF calibrated as my friend had the Sony SXRD ISF calibrated and he is a noted video nut who wants the best he can get (without spending $13k)

xb1032

10-24-05, 08:47 PM

Treasure Hunter

10-24-05, 08:57 PM

Tele-TV

10-25-05, 02:14 PM

I hope all is well in SXRD land. :D I wish could say the same (well, if I even had one already). Just "waiting" for the right price on the 60."

1. (- UG: Thanks for your help about Sony Reward Points.)

2. [ :o - OFF-TOPIC - Was telling Tony this morning that I saw Rainbows for the time yesterday. IF you want anymore info, info just tell me which of the many Rainbow Threads (LOL) you want me to meet you in. Thanks.)

3. Also, I couldn't believe I saw a (SONY) 30" [XBR-910] (OPEN BOX, though :( ) at Fry's for a great price. If it was (brand) new, I would have just whipped out the plastic without thinking about it. :p :D Would have put that Tv in my game room. Taken out the 27-FV15 (first gen flat Wega) out of the game room. And then moved the 27" to my parent's room to replaced their 27" [non-flat] Sony that makes a high-pitched *humming noise most of the time. My parent's TV was manufactured in *March 1995 [Indiana Jones Adventure Gran Opening]. Boy! they sure don't make TV's like that use to.

*EDIT* Forgot to mention when I saw the TV, the green blob issue (some) people mention with the 960 popped into my head.

Thank-YOU guys - Matthew [=] :rolleyes:

stevel

10-25-05, 07:50 PM

I'm well aware of avs rules about posting prices, so I'll ask this way. If anyone knows of any good deals on the 60xbr1 or wants to share with me what price they got can you let me know via a pm. I'm down to a couple of TVs and this is one of them and am wondering how much retailers will deal on this TV.

Judging from my own experience and what I've read here, there's at least 20% a retailer can play with. Some online sellers discount a bit more than that, and some have been able to get local stores to price match the online sellers. YMMV. Two of the three stores I approached would not budge except to say they would price match other local stores. The third was more flexible.

wtr1

10-25-05, 10:46 PM

wtr1

10-25-05, 10:47 PM

Did someone post on this thread which DVR to get from Comcast and which to stay away from?

If so, please post it again or send me a PM.

TIA!!!

gazelle

10-25-05, 11:03 PM

xb1032: I just received my 60" from Shop Sunhine at about a 20% discount, maybe a little more depending how you count shipping. Read their policy and conditions very carefully!!!!

WOW!!!! This set is something special.

Congrats. Glad to hear everything went OK. Now sit back, relax, and enjoy the set :) It's really something, isn't it?

xb1032

10-25-05, 11:41 PM

thanks wtr1! I plan on hitting up HH Gregg for the best price, then getting another HH Gregg to try to beat it, then see if Sears will do the same plus get 10% off for opening a Sears card. We'll see. I may end up going for one here in a few weeks.

As far as the Sony Reward points go for the credit card, I know you get 3 cents back for every dollar spent, but during the holidays they do 5 cents for every dollar. Can't remember when that starts. It's cool because they'll credit your card if you just ask after making a purchase.

n2nrush

10-26-05, 07:58 PM

Another scoop...

Along with the price match I got from BB (12.5% off of MSRP from a local B&M, and the $130 or so Reward Bucks), I did one better. On Sunday, they advertised a gift card give away (from $100-$500) depending on the price of the HDTV that you purchased.

I took in the receipt from the previous Friday and asked if they'd honor the advertisement for the free gift card....They did, and I figured it would be the $300 one because of my price matched purchase total. To my surprise, it was the $500 card.

Oh, and I took advantage of the 18 months no interest as well. It will be delivered tomorrow!

Peas-out

Dixie Flatline

10-26-05, 08:19 PM

CJArciola, III

10-26-05, 08:21 PM

Sound & Vision's Al Griffin gave an excellent review of the SXRD 50" set (Nov '05)...good blacks, good shadow detail, no SDE, excellent resolution, good grey scale and color decoder. The only fault was that it could not handle 1080p input material.

DrAV

10-26-05, 08:36 PM

"in stock" often means in the manufacturer's warehouse in Japan.

4 days beyond estimated delivery isn't bad. Works out to $250 a day savings over MSRP.

What will get you is the "business day" language. 14 business days sounds too much like 2 weeks when its actually closer to 3.

I agree entirely. It may be hard for some to wait given this is a very cool toy but the savings that you are getting is definitely worth it. I'd rather have a set drop shipped directly from Sony then have it first go to a distribution warehouse.

SammiK

10-26-05, 08:38 PM

HomeGuy

10-26-05, 08:42 PM

I got 20% off MSRP at PC Richards. Also, 18 months interest free financing. The tax was about the same amount for shipping if I bought it online.

bigtvluvr

10-27-05, 09:31 PM

tonydeluce

10-27-05, 10:01 PM

If someone is allowed, what's the MSRP on the 50" SXRD model ???
$3999

bigtvluvr

10-27-05, 11:03 PM

$3999

Ugg....I'm catching up on HDTV's once again, this seems like a 40% jump from the 50" price on the older Sony WEGA LCD's I was looking at earlier this year (maybe not the older "XS" model, but still a 30% jump from that model).

Is this all because of the redesign (speakers) and the 1080P format? Are companies which introduce 1080P formats going to still make 1080i and 720P models, maybe we can get good deals on those sets, either the discountinued older ones or new models with the less-detailed digital format?

JimP

10-28-05, 02:41 AM

Ugg.......snip...

Are companies which introduce 1080P formats going to still make 1080i and 720P models, maybe we can get good deals on those sets, either the discountinued older ones or new models with the less-detailed digital format?

The previous generation of fixed pixel displays are 720p or some close variation such as 768p. I don't know of any fixed pixel displays that are 1080I. What you may be thinking of is where all these sets take a 1080I signal, then deinterlace and scales it to the displays native resolution.

wtr1

10-28-05, 08:55 AM

Jim: a friend of mine claims to have a Mits that is 1080I. Seems strange, but that is what he says and I asked him about it a couple of times.

JimP

10-28-05, 09:22 AM

wtr1

May be a CRT rear projection display. Fixed pixel displays, DLPs, LCDs, LCOS, SXRD, plasma, etc. are all progressive, therefore "P".

deconvolver

10-28-05, 09:36 AM

Ugg....I'm catching up on HDTV's once again, this seems like a 40% jump from the 50" price on the older Sony WEGA LCD's I was looking at earlier this year (maybe not the older "XS" model, but still a 30% jump from that model).

Is this all because of the redesign (speakers) and the 1080P format? Are companies which introduce 1080P formats going to still make 1080i and 720P models, maybe we can get good deals on those sets, either the discountinued older ones or new models with the less-detailed digital format?
The 50" rp-lcd model is still current and much less expensive than the SXRD. The SXRD is a better display, hence the price difference.

strikeeagle

10-28-05, 11:15 AM

I have a 60" SXRD on order, but the Hitachi 55HDS52 caught my eye at CC yesterday. Am I losing it??? Can someone please offer a comparison???

Help!!!

DBEX

10-28-05, 11:37 AM

The 60" is now posted on Best Buy's website...

AUPigskin--

10-28-05, 11:57 AM

Jim: a friend of mine claims to have a Mits that is 1080I. Seems strange, but that is what he says and I asked him about it a couple of times.

WTR1: I have both a 1080I and 1080P Sony. 'i' is a CRT, 'p' is a digital display. My guess is your friend has a Mits CRT...

stevel

10-29-05, 06:02 PM

The SXRD is an XBR model line, and that's always been a premium priced line. It does have additional technology, such as the auto-iris, lacking in the LCD models.

bigdaddy10

10-29-05, 08:19 PM

Let me first start by saying that I own a Toshiba 62HMX94 and I am very happy with it. Yesterday I was at Best Buy buying a DVD and I went to the television section and peeped at the Sony SXRD. I was totally blown away. The SXRd was sitting next to the Toshiba 62HM95, I could easily make a comparison between the 2 due to the fact that I look at a Toshiba every day and can tell when it is calibrated correctly. I could see right away that the Toshiba needed to be calibrated. After finally tracking down a salesman I finally convinced her that I needed to calibrate the Toshiba to make a fair comparison of the 2 televisions. She found the remote and put some batteries in it and I calibrated the Toshiba exactly like I have mine at home. It did look better but it still did not compare to the Sony.

I've always been leery of some reviews in AVS because I feel that most people are just justifying their purchase and wanted to feel better about spending so much $$$$$ on a television. The reviews on this television are warranted. I've never seen a finer picture on a RPTV. Dark inky blacks, accurate color reproduction and noticeable difference in contrast ratio to any other television I've seen.

I gave the remote back to the salesperson and before I could walk away they were resetting the Toshiba back to the Factory HOT Sports settings. I asked her why she would do that when everyone there could obviously see that it looked better after I calibrated it. She told me that they are supposed to keep all televisons set to factory defaults and that every night they reset every TV back to those defaults before they leave the store every night. If this is true that means that the Sony was at factory defaults and still looked as good as it did. After I told her that was silly I walked away extremely impressed with the SXRD.

bigtvluvr

10-30-05, 01:16 AM

The previous generation of fixed pixel displays are 720p or some close variation such as 768p. I don't know of any fixed pixel displays that are 1080I. What you may be thinking of is where all these sets take a 1080I signal, then deinterlace and scales it to the displays native resolution.

Yeah, probably! You know more than me it seems....

All the previous Sony WEGA LCD's were 720P....now that the new SXRD is 1080P I was wondering what happened to the 720P sets...will they keep making them? Or only sell what they have left.

bigtvluvr

10-30-05, 01:17 AM

wtr1

May be a CRT rear projection display. Fixed pixel displays, DLPs, LCDs, LCOS, SXRD, plasma, etc. are all progressive, therefore "P".

Isn't SXRD just a newer type of LCD? It replaced the 3rd generation of Sony WEGA LCD's so I figured SXRD was just some proprietary Sony LCD technology, no ?

bigtvluvr

10-30-05, 01:19 AM

I got 20% off MSRP at PC Richards. Also, 18 months interest free financing. The tax was about the same amount for shipping if I bought it online.

Can I ask which store you got it at?

I've found PCR pricing to be all over the map...sometimes below and sometimes above MSRP. And on newer "hot" HDTV's, I'd expect them to be above MSRP.

JimP

10-30-05, 01:37 AM

Isn't SXRD just a newer type of LCD? It replaced the 3rd generation of Sony WEGA LCD's so I figured SXRD was just some proprietary Sony LCD technology, no ?

It looks like for the moment that Sony will continue to offer LCDs as well as SXRDs. Although they are not the same technology, it seems that some feature of the LCDs are incorporated in the SXRDs.

JimP

10-30-05, 01:40 AM

I gave the remote back to the salesperson and before I could walk away they were resetting the Toshiba back to the Factory HOT Sports settings. I asked her why she would do that when everyone there could obviously see that it looked better after I calibrated it. She told me that they are supposed to keep all televisons set to factory defaults and that every night they reset every TV back to those defaults before they leave the store every night. If this is true that means that the Sony was at factory defaults and still looked as good as it did. After I told her that was silly I walked away extremely impressed with the SXRD.

Althought it sounds fairly stupid of a retailer to adjust the sets to out of the box settings when they're usually fairly off, it might go a long way to get manufactures to do a better job of calibrating their TVs before shipping them out.