Reaper,

Thanks. I tell ya though, the colors look different in real life. Definately helps though. I think I've narrowed it down to about four colors, now I need to make a decision. I'm hoping maybe when I go look at carpet one of the four will jump at me.

Bud

Yeah, there are a ton of variables, my lighting, your monitor, the way they took the source images, etc. I think it helps but I always tell people that they must make the final decision and I think it should be based on samples...

Man, I can't believe how much trim costs! I started trimming out the windows in the gameroom. I've have to rip down 1x8s to trim out the inside of the windows before putting on the sill and casing. I'll post some pictures tomorrow.

Bud

Bud...

I'm right there with ya! I just went and got some chair rail for the theater and I nearly fell over when the total came up!!

The things you do for perfection!!

Sean

Sean,

That's an understatement!

Here is the trim in the gameroom. Since the basement is 2x6 construction, I had to rip down 1x8s to trim out the top and sides of the window before putting up the casing. I also had to get extra wide sills and rip them down to the right width. Hence, I had a lot of waste (money and wood).

http://images14.fotki.com/v255/photos/6/649633/3002014/DCP_2184-vi.jpg
http://images7.fotki.com/v117/photos/6/649633/3002014/DCP_2185-vi.jpg http://images14.fotki.com/v257/photos/6/649633/3002014/DCP_2186-vi.jpg

I need to figure out where to get stain grade trim for the HT room. I don't think HD carries stain grade crown and base molding I'm looking for. I'm hoping my doors will be deliver to HD this week so I can start that next.

Bud

I wanted to wish everyone a Merry Xmas and Happy Holidays! I hope Santa brings you all your home theater goodies!!!

Bud

Bud,

Nice job on the window molding. I have not purchased my stain-grade material yet but I'm sure I will have sticker shock when I do.

Can't wait to see your final product :)

Hey Steve.

Thanks. I may be able to order my molding through my neighbor the builder, although his wife is in the hospital expecting twins, so he's not around much!

Looking forward to following your progress as well.

Bud

Bud,

The theater and basement look fantastic. I finished reding the thread the last couple of days and it has inspired me to get started on my own theater. It became a storage area after we finished our remodel and that was 3 years ago.

I really like your soffit design and will definitely use a variation of that in my own theater. Keep up the great work and enjoy your Christmas and New Years.

Danconio,

Well thank you, welcome and Happy Holidays to you. Glad you like the soffits, I do too.

Bud

It's hard to believe the last year has gone by as fast as it has. It's been a year now since I've joined AVS. Time sure flies when you're having fun!

Bud

Hey Bud,

My brother owns a cabinet shop and has all his stain grade stuff cut for him at a shop in Cartersville. I forgot the name of it, but my brother says that typical maple is usually a dollar more per foot than the Home Depot paint grade. Of course they will run solid mahogony or cherry if you like.

Ben

Ben,

Cool. Thanks. Do they sell to the public? I would assume so. When you get the chance, ask your brother what the name of the place is. Hey, can you get me a Carada 104 Inch Diagonal Criterion 1.78 to 1? PM me your address and I'll put a check in the mail. How long does that take?

Just got back from the Depot, turns out my doors won't be in until January 16th. I was hoping they'd be here this week. I have other stuff to keep me busy though (like a stage and riser).

Bud

but my brother says that typical maple is usually a dollar more per foot than the Home Depot paint grade.
Damn! How much are you all paying for trim? We have a custom wood outfit here that sells poplar stain grade trim for about $1.30 per foot.

The casing in the photos is MDF, which is 1.09 a foot. The same casing in pine was 1.69 a foot. The 5 1/4 inch base molding I plan on using is also MDF and 1.09 a foot. Not sure on the crown. I don't think HD sells stain grade trim (maybe some pine). I'm already in like 400.00 for the windows between the sill, the 2x8s I had to rip down and the casing. Tomorrow I'll pick up the base molding for the gameroom. I'll have to either go after the stain grade from the place Ben was referring to or find it elsewhere, so not sure how much at this point yet.

Bud

Even though I'm on vacation this week, I'm having a hard time getting quality time down in the basement. The kids are out this week and my wife is working about half time, so I'm spending a lot of time watching the kids. I managed to convince them to go out for dinner at a place next to HD and happen to mention that I need some lumber for the stage and riser. Hopefully I'll have a few hours here or there to get started this week.

http://images12.fotki.com/v253/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0008-vi.jpg

Bud

Here ya go as promised in the email!!!! :D http://www.mouldingsunlimited.com/

mouldings unlimited (http://www.mouldingsunlimited.com/)

just by the last pic.without the wording i knew what is next on the list. the stage and risers. i can't wait.

are those 2x8?

i have been debating 2x8's or 2x10's.

Here ya go as promised in the email!!!! :D http://www.mouldingsunlimited.com/

mouldings unlimited (http://www.mouldingsunlimited.com/)

Hey Mike, thanks, I appreciate it! Good stuff on their site.

Bud

just by the last pic.without the wording i knew what is next on the list. the stage and risers. i can't wait.

are those 2x8?

i have been debating 2x8's or 2x10's.

Larry,

You are correct, they're 2x8s. I'll do a 2x8 stage with a smaller rounded edge in the front. The riser will be 2x8s as well. Have you looked at the riser calculator? I'm backing into the riser height and will adjust the screen accordingly. I didn't want to go any higher because I didn't want a step. I think anything over 8 inches requires a step. I'm using the steps in the house as a guide. I'm It may force me to raise the screen a little higher though. Heck, those are the cheap seats anyway, so if it's not perfect, so be it!

Bud

Bud..

Here's hoping you get some time to work on your space this week!!

Sean

Actually bought two rolls today. One for me and one for Jason (jikkjack). Packed the two kids in the truck and headed over to NB Handy in Duluth to get it. Took almost a hour each way, plus another half hour at Burger King to keep the kids at bay.

http://images12.fotki.com/v251/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0010-vi.jpg

At least I've got it now. $185.00 plus tax (and gas). Not bad.

Bud

Since I watched the kids this morning and most of the afternoon, the wife didn't mind too much when I went back to Home Depot to pick up insulation and plywood for the riser. When I got back I had to run the electric and boxes for the front of the riser, started framing it out and filling it with two layers of R19. I topped it off with 3/4 plywood (glued and screwed). I don't think I'm putting another layer on. It is quite solid as is. It's now 8 inches and I don't want to go any higher. I plan on adding a spacer (like 1/2-3/4 inch) and 1/2 round to the front of that to give me a rounded overhang . Too tired to route tonight.

Framing on 30lb roofing felt, electric for outlet run, wires for shakers to front row, boxes installed:
http://images12.fotki.com/v252/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0012-vi.jpg

Insulation (2 layers of r19):
http://images116.fotki.com/v696/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0013-vi.jpg

Plywoodeded (see, I can invent words too). Step lights are at the perfect location:
http://images14.fotki.com/v255/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0014-vi.jpg

Funny thing I'll share here. I ran the outlet in the front of the riser to the back of the outlet of the riser on the wall directly behind it. I had to actually fish through the drywall and insulation to run the wire. When I was doing it, it dawned on me that this was a Carlon adjustable box, so I wondered if I adjusted it ALL the way, would the box come out of the frame? Sure enough, I was able to pull the blue box right out of the wall, which made it a hell of a lot easier to fish the wire since the whole was so much bigger. I ran the wire through the back of the box then just screwed it right back in!

Bud

Getting fired up. I ordered these a few days ago from Best Buy.

Enemy of the State
Gladiator
Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World
Braveheart
War Of The Worlds

And I bought these from Tweakophyte in the For Sale section of AVS. Thanks Warren!

xXx (widescreen special edition)
Good Will Hunting (Collector's Series)
Spiderman 2 (widescreen special edition, 2-disc, with slipcover)
The Fast and the Furious Collectors Edition (BB PV)
Leon The Professional, uncut international version
ID4 Independence Day 5-star collection (Sealed, 2-disc)

Not bad. Like I said, getting fired up!

Bud

Bud,

Keep the work and pic coming. I understand completely about packing up the kids and making the trip. Luckily, I have not had to do much of that -- YET :rolleyes:

I really want to get some work done tomorrow or Friday on my HT. However, my wife has some honey-do's for me first. Plan to get those punched out quickly so I can get moving :)

BTW -- How many feet are on that role of Linacoustic RC? How big is the whole role - height and width? I need to be sure I can put that in the back of my SUV. I think I can get that here in Dallas also.

Steve,

Whatever you need to do to keep moving forward! ;)

It's 47.5 inches wide and 100 feet long (if you look real close, you can see it on the label). I'm thinking I'm going to use about 80 feet when all is said and done (Front wall completely, half walls sides/rear and soffits). I'm going to wrap some PVC drain pipes from the half bath thats over the HT room as well. Surprisingly, its pretty light. Will fit in an SUV, np, assuming you don't have a back seat or its removed, depending on the vehicle of course.

I just measured the roll, it's about 26-27 inches across.

Bud

Bud..

Here's hoping you get some time to work on your space this week!!

Sean

I'd say a linacoustic run and a riser was time well spent! I'm hoping to get the stage done over the next few days and finish up the back of the damn soffit. From there, I go back to tile the bathroom over the next few weekends and squeeze in some more trim while I wait forever for my doors to come in.

Bud

Bud,

Looking mighty nice! What lights are you using for the steps?

I spent a good bit of the day running water lines and re-routing my main house drain in the basement. I can surely relate to the kid situation. Work was going along just fine, then I heard my daughter screaming over the monitor, so work ended.... It must be really nice to see the riser and stage underway. The end is getting closer!

I checked in yesterday on my Homeboy Buds thread and Noticed he picked up Some woooood. So I figured I would check in today and then all the sudden...Boom! I saw the platform was finished. Now that was super fast Bud!

I figured it would be a few days before you got to it being that you had to watch the kids. Now your getting me nervous, I'm gonna have to move faster :D

But I must say, Its coming along Awesome!

I need to get some of those Step lights in 120v. (Single Gang Box Size) Any links to share with a Brother? :)

Ruben

Jerrod and Sandman,

Thanks for the compliments. Here are the Incandescent step lights I bought. They're solid and pretty cheap for that matter. I'm using 25 Watt aquairum bulbs in them.

http://www.prolighting.com/noname.html

I thought when I got them that they were huge, but they're not, just the right size.

Here are a few more that they sell:

http://www.prolighting.com/steplighting.html

Bud

I got to see Bud's Theater and Basement last night when I went to pick up my roll of linacoustic and let me tell you it LOOKS AWESOME!!!!! The pictures are great but it was much better to see it in person to really get to look and ask questions about the construction. GREAT JOB BUD!!

I hope my theater and basement turn out just like yours.

Jason

Jason,

Thanks dude. Always nice talking to someone who appreciates and understand HT tech speak.

Bud

Just ordered some MA rack shelves and accessories from Worthington. Just got an account setup. The stuff adds up quick. Hopefully I'm covered now from that standpoint, although I'm sure I'll be filling in the some of the rack with blanks/vent panels and I'll need to get some of those.

Bud

Hi Bud,

I'm a neighbor of yours just to the north in the Raleigh area. I plan on starting my basement finishing project in the summer. Almost 1850 sf, so it's a big job.

Anyway, like you in Georgia, we don't get extremely cold weather here in Raleigh. But I'm a bit concerned about how to finish large expanses of the basement floor. I will probably put tile in some areas, but I'm not certain about the large living and HT areas. My concern is that in the winter time, carpet with pad won't sufficiently decouple the rooms from the 60 degree concrete floor. And as everyone with a basement, I'm always a bit concerned about water infiltration (especially when one of those pesky hurricanes come around).

How are you planning on handling the floors? Are you going to use a platon/dricore type of subfloor? Put carpet over that or maybe engineered wood?

I would appreciate any thoughts you have.

Regards,
Scott

Hey Scott,

For the gameroom, I plan on an engineered hardwood or laminate. I plan on making a decision in the next few weeks when I've had time to do some research. I'll probably cover certain sections with area rugs anyway. The bathroom floor will be tiled. I had considered dricore throughout most of the basement at one time, but it would have cost me about an extra 2K, so I gave that idea up. I then thought about dricore just in the HT room, but it just doesn't get that cold in there. I'll probably just carpet and use the rubber pad in there. For 90% of the time you're in there, you're feet will be off the ground anyway, since you'll be sitting in a nice recliner. The room should be warm enough with all the equipment running.

I think Dricore would be the way to go if you want to spend the money on it. It adds less than an inch to the height and it seems easy to work with. Our Home Depot just stopped carrying it, but I hear others still do. Its also gone up in price some since I started looking at it. Keep in mid though that when you rough in your doors, to consider the extra inch of height if you go the dricore route. Hate to have to cut the doors down if you don't have to. Makes sense to plan ahead if you're starting from scratch.

Bud

We haven't had any issues at all with water at all. Its bone dry, thankfully, even with the remnants of hurricanes coming through.

Thanks for the reply Bud.

I haven't had any water problems either, but there's always a first. I'd hate to put down $$$$ in carpet and pad to have it ruined in one storm. The first time you get water damage on the floors, the platon/dricore would have more than paid for itself. I'm a bit overly paranoid though since the hurricane cycle seems to be on a upswing.

I'm also weighing the pros/cons of engineered or laminate hardwood. I don't like the look of the cheap stuff. The v-grooves they put in them to hide the joints is very unattractive IMO. But to go with the better quality stuff costs as much as platon + subfloor + solid red oak + finishing (if I do it myself). I'd like to hear how the ecomonics work out for you. Perhaps you can find a better product/deal that makes it attractive in your situation.

I'm sure you'll post more as you make your decisions. :)

A new Carada 104 Inch Diagonal Criterion 1.78 to 1 (http://www.carada.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=PROJECTION-SCREEN-H104C) has been ordered (thanks Ben!) and should arrive Wednesday or Thursday of next week. I was going to go with a 100", but figure I could squeeze out just a couple more.

I plan on a few hours today working on the stage, then hopefully wrap up the back soffit before I get back to the grind on Tuesday.

Bud

I ordered the AE900, should be here next week. I wanted to make a decision so could wrap up the back soffit and I don't think I could make the Mits HC3000 work (and look) like the way I wanted it to with its offset. I'm now going to mount under the soffit and the AE900 gives me the flexibility to do so. I used the 200 rebate as incentive to get a mount and get my butt moving on finishing up the room.

I know, I know, don't put it up because construction will stop.

Bud

A new Carada 104 Inch Diagonal Criterion 1.78 to 1 (http://www.carada.com/detail.aspx?ID=104) has ben ordered (thanks Ben!)

Bud, what screen material are you going with? I also have a AE900U and I am leaning towards the BW screen material.

Bud...

If you don't mind me asking,.. what was your budget for doing your finshed space?! Are you still on budget? ;)

Bud, what screen material are you going with? I also have a AE900U and I am leaning towards the BW screen material.

Classic Cinema White. I asked Ben Harper about it and he said I didn't need to go with the Brilliant White, wouldn't make too much or a difference with the AE900. I guess depends on your room conditions as well. Now that I have the windows covered, I have control over the light. I'll let you know how I make out.

Bud

Bud...

If you don't mind me asking,.. what was your budget for doing your finished space?! Are you still on budget? ;)

Sean,

I assume you're referring to the HT room only? The construction materials sort of blend together. Budget on left (actual on right).

Projector - 2000 (AE900U - 1800, mount 199.00)
Speakers - 2000 (Ascends - 900, Sonance S622TRs - 800)
Sub - 500 (Used Hsu VTF II MKII - 325.00)
Receiver - 1000 (Yamaha RXV2600 - 900)
IR Stuff - 250 (Buffalo Electronics - 200)
Screen - 500 (Carada 104 inch - 650ish)
Lighting - 500 (6" cans, 4" cans w/ trim, step and rope lights - (450ish)
Dimmers - 300 (X10 Dimmers, controller and IR534 - 500ish)
Remote - 300 (not purchased yet)
Rack and shelves - 500 (MA Slim 5-43 - 250, shelves - 400)
Cables and wire - 300 (RG59, RG6, CAT6, CAT5 - 450)
Lumber for stage/riser/screen wall - 200 (2x8, 2x4s, Plywood - 500)
GOM and Linacoustic- 1000 (not purchased yet)
Trim - 500 (not purchased yet)
Doors - 400 (3 solid pine 6 panel doors - 600ish)
Carpet - 1000 (not purchased yet)
Seating - 2500 (not purchased yet)
Misc - 1000 (insulation, 300)
Beer - infinity (ongoing)

Budget 14750 (Actual to date approx - 9225)
(Yet to purchase - 6000)

Cost at completion - 15225

Now that was off the top of my head. I did not think through the costs for lighting/dimmers and cables. I also underestimated a few things. Overall, that's about right. I still have other things like flooring in the bar/gameroom, cabinets in the concession area, more trim in the gameroom, counter tops, tile, vanity, toilet, etc. I'm looking at propbably at 10K right there.

Bud

Bud,

Are you having each phase of this project inspected by your city? I was just wondering because I have never heard you mention an inspection or inspector.

~Josh

Bud...

Yeah, I was pretty much talking about the theater space. The only reason I asked was your last few post you've made some pretty big purchases and with all the construction you've done so far, it seemed like you're pouring a ton of money into your space, and yet doing alot of the work yourself.

Don't get me wrong, I think your space is going to be fan-fricken-tastic!!! I wish I could be there to lend a hand in some way!!

Sean

Beatboy...

You didn't just use the "I" word did ya?!!! :eek:

Sean

Sean,

True, been on a spending spree lately, but I'm at the point where I needed to either spread the cash over the whole basement (flooring, cabinets) or get the equipment required to keep the HT room moving. I guess you figured out which one I'd rather spend the cash on. Having the equipment will make me move quicker, trust me. The projector held up the soffit, the lack of a screen held up the screen wall. Not having the speakers held up the proscenium building. So it's all correlated (in my mind) and now I can get the items in the critical path done.

Bud

Josh,

I'm going to ignore that question.... for now.

Bud

Is there an unwritten rule that we should not have our projects inspected? lol I just had my plumbing inspection and passed. Also had the framing inspection and got a partial pass. He wants me to add some more insulation for a fire stop.

~Josh

Every time AVSers get to the stage part, they complain about the sand. Carrying sand. Lots of sand. I'm not sure what the big deal really is. You get yourself a hand truck and you throw down a piece of plywood as a ramp and just move it! Seriously, I know its a pain. I'm lucky I have a short downhill walk to the back door.
http://images12.fotki.com/v2/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0019-vi.jpg

I bought 24 bags of playsand. It was dry. Really dry. It was outside under the overhang at Home Depot, wrapped in plastic. I bought 24 bags, but ended up loading them myself as the guys in the orange aprons walked by. Same thing the other day when I'm loading 3/4 plywood. Guys are just walking by. Anyway, I ended up with 26 bags of sand. Go figure. :D I ended up with 2 and 1/2 extra bags after I was all done!
http://images14.fotki.com/v257/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0020-vi.jpg

Built the stage 26 inches deep (rectangular part) and made out of 2x8s. I had plenty of short boards left over form the riser. Used 30 lb roofing paper and caulked the insides where it meets the roofing paper. I used just over two bags of sand per opening.
http://images15.fotki.com/v262/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0021-vi.jpg
http://images15.fotki.com/v262/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0022-vi.jpg
http://images15.fotki.com/v264/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0023-vi.jpg

The curved portion is eight feet wide, about 12.5 inches at the widest part. I made it out of 2x4s with a piece of siding I ripped down to the width of a 2x4 for the curved part.
http://images12.fotki.com/v252/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0024-vi.jpg
http://images14.fotki.com/v258/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0025-vi.jpg

Kids just love sand. My son wanted to help as soon as I said "Sand".
http://images14.fotki.com/v250/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0026-vi.jpg

Here is the stage 95% complete. Top is 3/4 plywood glued and screwed. I still have to add the 1.5 inch half round to give me a lip for the carpet.
http://images116.fotki.com/v696/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0028-vi.jpg

Bud

Bud,

Have been following your progress. Room is going to be awesome!!! BTW, didn't we all have a fantastic "blue tape screen" at some point in our construction? I know I did. Had about 12 different sizes and placements too!

PS I pulled a permit on my HT/basement redo. No problems, I just went back in and uncovered/did all the illegal stuff after final inspection. Like putting the solid core door on the HT with no egress window HAHA!! :)

Hey Bud,

I'm curious why you didn't go the typical route with lining the inside of the stage with plastic and putting the sand on top, instead of the presumably more time consuming (and possibly not as air-tight?) caulking.

Great progress Bud. Happy new years.

Tim,

Lazy! Not sure what the theory is about being air tight and the purpose of using plastic with these things. I didn't have the plastic on hand and the only thing I was concerned with was containing the sand in the stage. I'm not worried about moisture, the roofing paper should take care of that. Is there a real good reason for the plastic besides keeping the sand in the cavity? If there is, oh well. I used a boat load of construction adhesive on the top, I'm not sure if people put plastic on the top before the plywood. I consider that to be the same concept as the bottom when it comes to sealing.

Didn't take long to caulk at all and frankly, I didn't wait until it was completely dry either. I don't think there will be any sand coming out of those joints.

Bud

Great progress Bud. Happy new years.

Hey Dave,

Thanks! Happy New Years to you as well!

Bud

Bud,

Have been following your progress. Room is going to be awesome!!!

Thanks man!

Bud

Bud,

Hard to tell from the pics, but how much of a gap did you leave between the stage and the walls?

As always, it's so inspiring watching your progress. Do you keep track of the time you spent working down there? From the progress you make it seems that either you are able to spend a lot of time working, or perhaps a master carpenter in a former life :) .

Bud

Awesome amount of work for a DYI project. I envy your energy and dedication to this project. When do anticipate completing it?

Also, if not an impolite question, at the end of the project could you post a labor and materials cost breakdown and what you think you saved by doing it yourself?

Thanks.

Hey richh,

From what I gather, Bud spends every waking moment he can without upsetting the wife and kids. Even with the kids he bribed them once with Burger King in order to spend some time on theatre business :D

Bud,

Keep up the great work! Very inspirational. Happy New Year's. 06 will be great for you with that new theatre!! :)

Hey Richh,

Thanks. I don't keep track of my time, but its an interesting point. I have taken a few days off here or there (from work) to speed things up. When mudding, I would take an hour to an hour and half do do some sanding, mud, whatever in the morning when the kids left for school. I work out of the house, so by 7:30 AM I can usually get down there for a little time to do the little things. I haven't do it lately. I sometimes would go down during lunch. On the weekends, I try to get whatever blocks of time in where I can. It can be tough sometimes though, especially during this time of the year.

Not sure about my former life, but I do enjoy the building/construction process and seeing the end results. Oh and about 1/8+ inch gap around the sides.

Bud

R-U-Q-R-U,

Thanks. I'm an amateur compared to many of the folks here. My father-in-law is very handy and I bounce a lot of questions off him. He always said that this wasn't rocket science and that having the right tools is half the battle. You need to understand the correct techniques/code and best practices. Of course, you need to know your limitations as well. I only do minor electrical stuff. I won't mess with breakers and the box.

Actually, I'm pretty goal oriented and stubborn. Once I make up my mind and want something or want to do something, I get tunnelvision and am pretty persistent. Just the way I'm wired, I suppose.

I can only guesstimate some of the cost savings since I never had bids for a lot of it, just the drywall, really, but I have no problem doing that. Oh yeah, on the timeframe, It'll be end of February or beginning of March timeframe. The wife will have a typical year end busy period the first few weeks in January, which will slow me down some in the next few weeks.

Bud

Hey richh,

From what I gather, Bud spends every waking moment he can without upsetting the wife and kids. Even with the kids he bribed them once with Burger King in order to spend some time on theatre business :D

Bud,

Keep up the great work! Very inspirational. Happy New Year's. 06 will be great for you with that new theatre!! :)

Thanks and HNY to you too! I actually do cross that line now and then, I can tell. My wife has been pretty patient with the whole thing. Actually, she rarely comes downstairs to see the progress, I have to coax her down there or pretend to need her opinion on something! She's got her hands full with work and kids. I think she'll be happy the first time she sits in the Berks though...

Bud

and that having the right tools is half the battle.
Of course, any reason to buy tools is a good thing. :)

Tim,

Lazy! Not sure what the theory is about being air tight and the purpose of using plastic with these things. I didn't have the plastic on hand and the only thing I was concerned with was containing the sand in the stage. I'm not worried about moisture, the roofing paper should take care of that. Is there a real good reason for the plastic besides keeping the sand in the cavity? If there is, oh well. I used a boat load of construction adhesive on the top, I'm not sure if people put plastic on the top before the plywood. I consider that to be the same concept as the bottom when it comes to sealing.

Didn't take long to caulk at all and frankly, I didn't wait until it was completely dry either. I don't think there will be any sand coming out of those joints.

Bud
As far as I know, the only reason is to hold the sand in there.. haven't heard of people putting plastic over the top, but I suppose it's possible.. more often just roofing felt (then another layer of felt between layers of plywood). I would just imagine that all it takes is enough vibration of the stage and some time to have the stage slightly vibrate up and down and have sand leak out as well. Probably not, but with plastic there's no chance of that happening, and it also helps "hold the stage down" by having the plastic go over the top of the joists. I don't think there's any reason to have the sand air tight (or even anywhere close to it). The only reason I mention it is because it seemed like quite a bit more work to caulk than just lay plastic down, but apparently not! :)

Bud...

Yeah, I was pretty much talking about the theater space. The only reason I asked was your last few post you've made some pretty big purchases and with all the construction you've done so far, it seemed like you're pouring a ton of money into your space, and yet doing alot of the work yourself.

Don't get me wrong, I think your space is going to be fan-fricken-tastic!!! I wish I could be there to lend a hand in some way!!

Sean

Sean,

BTW, With the money saved, you can make(justify?) those big purchases. The trade-off is that it takes a lot longer. I can live with that. Also, airfare to Atlanta is pretty reasonable!

Bud

Tim,

Nah, it took maybe 5-10 minutes. I cut the caulK end pretty large and ran through it pretty quick, used a scrap piece of shim to force it in the joints. Its not like a pretty exposed caulk along a tub or anything. I think I used about 5 tubs of caulk total, stuff I had laying around. Keep in mind too that the carpet will be on top and holding it back as well. Even through they'll be a few joints there with the carpet, unlikely I'll ever see a grain of sand.If so, I'll plug it with more caulk!

Of course, any reason to buy tools is a good thing. :)

I hear you there! :p

Bud

More tools improves craftmanship. there is also a fine line of budgeting your tools. for example the mudd boxes are very expensive and i am not willing to spend that much money when an assortment of mud knives will do.

work on my current basement has been done better than the basement i did in 1995. because of more tools.

one thing i didn't have in 95 are grip rights. these tools are great for the extra hand. It seems i use them all the time for different parameters of the job.

Happy New Year everyone! I hope you all have a great 2006!

Bud

As far as I know, the only reason is to hold the sand in there.. haven't heard of people putting plastic over the top, but I suppose it's possible.. more often just roofing felt (then another layer of felt between layers of plywood). I would just imagine that all it takes is enough vibration of the stage and some time to have the stage slightly vibrate up and down and have sand leak out as well. Probably not, but with plastic there's no chance of that happening, and it also helps "hold the stage down" by having the plastic go over the top of the joists. I don't think there's any reason to have the sand air tight (or even anywhere close to it). The only reason I mention it is because it seemed like quite a bit more work to caulk than just lay plastic down, but apparently not! :)

Peronally I'm not 100% sold on the sand thing for the complete stage... however I definitely am no expert, but listen to common sense instead. I wonder if putting sand in heavy plastic bags, sealing them up, then lining them into the stage cavities would be an option as well.

AH yes.. and Happy New Year to all!

I know a lot of us blindly follow procedures like herds of cattle since we don't know any better and that's how others have done it based on professional designs. I do it too. Maybe its "Home Theater Pressure", not sure. I was thinking the sand was going to be such a hassle based on other threads and comments from others. I was thinking doing it partially with insulation at one point like others have. After getting the sand (not a big deal IMO because I was able to hand truck 4-5 bags at a time around the house), caulking and filling the stage, it was really not a big deal to do and would do it again if I built another theater. I'd rather be safe than sorry if there were sound transfer or resonant issues with the stage. As far as plastic goes, it will help contain the sand in the cavity. The last thing you want is the sand to do is leak out of the bottom of the stage if it were disturbed, you'd never be able to get it back in place without having to rip the whole thing down. Maybe its there for later when you decide to remove the stage to prevent a mess? Who knows. I'm not the expert, just one of the herd.

Bud

Bud,

Stage looks great. Wish I had room for a stage in my design. Oh well, one more thing I "don't" have to build :p

BTW -- I'm with you on the kid juggling. My wife has been very helpful in this area this week since I'm on vacation. However, most of my work is done between 8:30pm and 10:30pm after the kids go to bed. I guess since I have the HT bug, it does not bother me much. My friends are supportive but think I'm a bit crazy putting in all the hours. I look at it this way -- it's fun, I'm learing a bunch and I save a few bucks doing it myself :D

Bud,
HAPPY NEW YEAR!
Yes it is fun to build.

Larry

Hey Bud,

Theater seems to be coming along great. You are a few steps ahead of me in construction so it's nice to check your progress and see what I'm up against. How deep is your stage?? It seems shallower than the one I am planning on which is 4'. I would like to go shallower just so it will be cheaper and easier to build, but can't seem to find a way to do so. What besides your speakers are going behind it? I am putting my LCR and SW behind mine as well as my equipment rack which is why I need the depth. Look forward to seeing your progress.

Hey Bud, really looking great!

Reminds me that I should be working in the basement this winter... naaahhh

Randy

ps: I feel your pain on trim prices. Sheeze

Sean,
Also, airfare to Atlanta is pretty reasonable!

Bud

You know I've never been to 'Hotlanta', and helping to build a home theater sounds like a good reason to go!! :D ;)

Sean

Sean,

I like how you volunteer after drywall and mud! You'd love it here. Lots of Double Ds here as well ....

Bud

Here are a few updated pictures. I haven't had a lot of time to do much, something has come up recently. Anyway, I did finish the under portion of the back soffit finally. The projector came yesterday and I mounted it to verify I didn't have any VB, dead pixels, stuck mirrors, zits or pimples. By going with the AE900 and its mounting flexibility, I was able to easily mount the unit under the soffit and adjust it accordingly. Pretty amazing in that way. This allowed me to abandon the "in the soffit" projector box design.

When I bought the AE900, I bought a Peerless PRS-UNV-B: Universal Ceiling Mount- Black (http://www.visualapex.com/accessories/accessory_details.asp?chPartNumber=PRS-UNV-B&MFR=Peerless&Type=Projector_Ceiling_Mount) from Visual Apex. I probably should have done some research first, but I was giddy. Anyway, even though I can probably adjust the mount maybe another 3/4 of an inch closer to the ceiling, it's still not exactly where I want it. Solution? Sell the mount and get another. I bought the Chief RPA-225 (https://www.brightandsleek.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=RPA225) from Bright and Sleek, although looks like the price went up.

Anyway, he's a shot from the stage area:
http://images15.fotki.com/v264/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0031-vi.jpg

There are a few things I wanted to point out here. I took down some of the original framing and boxed out an area were I deck screwed two 3/4 pieces of plywood to the framing. I drywalled around that. This serves a couple of purposes. One, it gives a very rigid area for mounting the projector. Two, it allows me to get into the soffit. There is a clean out drain for a sink for a half bath above the soffit. IF I even need to, I can put down the projector and pull off the plywood to get in there. Granted I will have to remove some fabric to do so since the whole area under the soffit will be Linacoustic and GOM. Last, but not least, two 3/4 pieces of plywood gives me 1.5 inches, which equates to 1/2 drywall plus 1" of Lincoustic. Good for covering with fabric.

Here's a closer shot of the AE900 mounted:
http://images14.fotki.com/v257/photos/6/649633/3052581/Mountcloseup-vi.jpg

Now I still intend to build a box to hide the projector, thermostats and wiring. Not to keep it quiet. I ran it under low lamp conditions and its extremely quiet. Can't really hear it while sitting under it. I just prefer a cleaner look. I'll leave it open in the front for venting and will use some sort of vent cover for the back for intake. I'll make sure it has hinged doors to get to the controls and the cables as well. I have some ideas, but will probably just build a prototype. I may even cover with GOM to match.

Another shot of the AE900 mounted:
http://images116.fotki.com/v696/photos/6/649633/3052581/Mountcloseup2-vi.jpg

At the moment, what you see if pretty "fugly", IMO, but I intend to clean it up nicely. Stay tuned.

Next steps, cover the wood cove with drywall, edge it, start ripping furring strips and paint the ceiling and concession area. Oh, and the doors are in and waiting at HD for me. They called last week, even though they told me the 16th they'd be in. Go figure.

Bud

Hey Bud,

Theater seems to be coming along great. You are a few steps ahead of me in construction so it's nice to check your progress and see what I'm up against. How deep is your stage?? It seems shallower than the one I am planning on which is 4'. I would like to go shallower just so it will be cheaper and easier to build, but can't seem to find a way to do so. What besides your speakers are going behind it? I am putting my LCR and SW behind mine as well as my equipment rack which is why I need the depth. Look forward to seeing your progress.

Jon,

The rectangular portion is right at 26 inches wide. The farthest part of the curved portion of the stage is another 12.5 inches. I was limited by the postion of the door into the concession area. I could have gone maybe another 6 inches, but I didn't want it to look cramped. I plan on on the Ascends (LCR) and my Hsu VTF2 sub. It's deep enough for the sub and then some for the sub, which was my biggest concern. My equipment rack is off to the side in a separate closet, but can understand what you're doing. I ended up reversing the rack and closet door to give me more depth to get behind it.

Bud

Hey Bud, really looking great!

Reminds me that I should be working in the basement this winter... naaahhh

Randy

ps: I feel your pain on trim prices. Sheeze

Thanks. I can see the finish line now. If I had my kegorator installed, I'd never leave the basement... I take that back, IF I had the kegorator installed, I'd have to go outside, cuz I haven't finished the bathroom!

Bud

Sean,

I like how you volunteer after drywall and mud!


Hey, timing is everything my friend! :p As much as I would have like packing my suitcase with drywall dust laidened cloths to bring back.


You'd love it here. Lots of Double Ds here as well ....



I'm thinking your refering to Atlanta as a whole!!? :D :D

Sean

Keeps getting better and better!! It's funny you changed your mind about how you have it mounted. I'm kinda "copying" your soffit design cuz I like it so much, but I had already decided to have my pj mounted under it like you have yours now. I noticed in the pic that your lens shift is all the way down. Is that because that's just where it was at the time, or is it that far because it HAD to be? I've heard the 900 has a big range on the shift, so I'm guessing that with it higher up, it'll still be within range? Should be. How far above the screen will it be? Anyway, keep up the great work man! You're an inspiration to us all!

HTScotty,

Thanks. I had originally planned on an underneath mount, but because Ben Harper recommended I look at the Mits HC3000, I really wanted to make it work. Especially since he can get a great price on them. I thought about the extra effort and wasn't sure I could get it to work exactly how I wanted it to, so I went with the more flexible approach. Don't get me wrong, I could have just mounted it from the ceiling, but its not the look I was shooting for.

On the lens shift, it didn't have to be all the way down. I don't think the projector is exactly level either, I think it's point up some. There is some slight keystoning. I wanted to make sure I didn't get a dud. When I first turned on the projector, the picture was higher than the top of the outlined screen area in blue tape. It was below the soffit, but didn't measure it. I've been just playing with different viewing heights so I can figure out my screen position based on different seating positions on and off the riser. I've also been popping in non-16:9 movies, so I've centered the picture vertically (think black bars top and bottom). I have not played a standard 16:9 movie at this point. Will try soon.

When I first turned the projector on, the picture was almost as wide as the wall. Probably 130" diag.. I mounted the projector at about 13 feet, I think. The range/screen size adjustment of this thing is great. Picture is pretty sweet too. I have not done any calibration at this point since its going to come down shortly.

Bud

Bud,

I've been reading this thread for a couple months and have taken many idea's away from your room as well as other's rooms. Keep on trucking and git-r-dun before the nice weather arrives! I'm just starting mine but am gonna sub out some of the work to save a little time but am shooting for a July 4th unveiling.

Keep the great posts and pics coming!

Brian

Brian,

Glad you find this thread and ideas helpful. Not sure the weather is going to stop me at this point, I'm too far along and can taste it. Good luck on your build! I'll be keeping an eye on your thread as well.

Bud

Oh man. I run out to do an errand and find a tower of boxes on my doorstep. I'm glad I invested in a hand truck. I ordered some shelving in different sizes (2 space, 3 space and 4 space) and a long 15 AMP vertical power outlet.

http://images15.fotki.com/v263/photos/6/649633/3055203/100_0052-vi.jpg

Bud

It's like Christmas all over again!! :D

Sean

Yeah, except I don't have to give stuff this time! Just kidding. Just to myself I suppose...

Bud

Well you'll be giving the "gift" of a GREAT home theater to your family!!

Sean

I went ahead and called Comcast today to get another HD STB. I believe it's a Motorola DCT6200 (http://broadband.motorola.com/consumers/products/dct6200/default.asp), although my current box has DVI and the Motorola info on the DCT6200 doesn't show DVI. Maybe its the 6208 (http://broadband.motorola.com/dvr/dct6208.asp) which includes a DVR (it has a record feature, but I don't subscribe and don't use it). I'm confused. I guess I'll find out tomorrow.

I'm also going to discuss this rats nest:
http://images15.fotki.com/v262/photos/6/649633/2312531/100_0053-vi.jpg

I have HDTV now and cable internet through comcast. My CAT5 and three phone lines are nicely organized in a structured wiring cabinet. I have purchase a second for the RG59 and RG6. I'll find out tomorrow if Comcast will restructure/remove all the damn splitters and replace with something equivalent to a Channel Plus DA-550BID Distribution Amplifier (http://www.tselectronic.com/chanplus/da550bid.html?tse_Session=c82a331253956510b8452a14bf6c95a1). I picked up one of these up on ebay, but not sure its exactly what I need for my purposes or not.

Bud

... Channel Plus DA-550BID Distribution Amplifier. I picked up one of these up on ebay, but not sure its exactly what I need for my purposes or not.

Bud


Bud

About 9 months ago i change out a Channel master passive splitter with the Channel Plus distribution amplifier. Wow what a difference. We have charter cable and i split the single to eight TV in the house. we got a much better picture with the DA-550BID. Also got a better picture on channel 2-5. The old passive splitter had snow on the lower channels.

It is more then the amplifier because in the old configuration I had a ratshack amplifier before the splitter.

Even the wife noticed a difference, in my book that is the real test.

Hey Greg, thanks for the reply. Great news. Do you also have a cable modem? I guess if there is an issue, I could split it prior to the 550BID. I assume you have no issue with HDTV either through it? Not sure of the technical aspects, frequency limits and that stuff.

Bud

Hey Greg, thanks for the reply. Great news. Do you also have a cable modem? I guess if there is an issue, I could split it prior to the 550BID. I assume you have no issue with HDTV either through it? Not sure of the technical aspects, frequency limits and that stuff.

Bud

Yes we have a cable modem, it splits off before the 550BID. We get HDTV via Antenna signal not cable (we are close to Los Angles). We only have the extended cable package.

Cool, thanks Greg. I'll post results tomorrow from Comcast. Trying to track down the shipping on the DA-550BID from the seller.

Bud

Hi Bud,

Great Thread. The more time I spend in the AVS forum the more I realize I'm not alone. I'm doing a very similar project and was curious about your plans for the bar.

How wide will the outside of the bar be?

How will you support it?

Keep up the good work.

Dave

Hey Dave.

Thanks. I'm not sure how far you've gone back in the thread. Take a look at the design for the bar itself. It'll have some modifications since I've thought through a few things, but here is the link to the design of the bar:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6585440&&#post6585440

The measurements are as follows:
http://images12.fotki.com/v252/photos/6/649633/2311872/bar1-vi.jpg

I used this design as a basis for the framing, so the measurements should be pretty accurate.

The bar was framed out with 2x6s to handle the PVC and copper. The actual support of the bar top will be on the 2x6s and corbels (http://www.invitinghome.com/Corbels/OW_Corbels_List1.htm) I plan to install once I've finalized the look of the outside of the bar (under the counter). A combination of the two should be sufficient.

Bud

Bud,

You are selling yourself short on the bar. It looks great - especially with the overhead angled soffit you constructed. I think you need to snap a few pics of that to show folks as I think it's one of the best bar layouts I've seen.

Oh, and now that sheetrocks done I'll have to swing by and lend a hand (or just drink your beer)!

Ben

Ben,

Thanks, dude. The bar was born out of necessity. Actually I should say the design was born out of necessity. I didn't start out with that shape, I was thinking more rectangular, but wanted to be able to walk though that area without having to walk around the bar. Originally I was going to drop a pool table in the middle of that room and with a rectangular bar, it would have been an obstacle course, hence the angled corner.

From there I had to deal with the laminate support right there as well as the ductwork, so the soffits were born. I wanted to have pendants over the bar. I had them put in the kitchen when we had the house built and really like them. The problem I had was that there was a metal return directly over where the lights needed to be. I figured I'd build something put run the the electrical, but thought the existing soffit would be way too low unless I used cans, which is why its smaller. I also wanted to make sure the pendants dropped over specific sections above the bar, what is why it ended up angled to mimic the angles of the bar. I guess necessity is the mother of invention, huh?

Here's a shot of the ceiling/soffit in bar area.
http://images116.fotki.com/v694/photos/6/649633/2373380/100_0058-vi.jpg

You can see the in ceiling speakers in the bar and if you look close, you can see a spec on the bottom of the picture which is the IR receiver that will be tied into the rack back in the HT room. I also ran HDMI, component, RG6, CAT 5, RS232 and speaker wire into that same wall the IR received is on. I plan on a plasma on that wall at some point.

Should be pretty sweet when it's painted, cabinets are in and beer if flowing.

Bud

Hey Greg, thanks for the reply. Great news. Do you also have a cable modem? I guess if there is an issue, I could split it prior to the 550BID. I assume you have no issue with HDTV either through it? Not sure of the technical aspects, frequency limits and that stuff.

Bud
Bud,
Check the link for the splitter you posted. It says "The DA550BID offers a 5-42 MHz return path for bi-directional communication for use with cable modems and pay-per-view applications."

You shouldn't have to worry about splitting the line for your cable modem. Still looking good!

Bud,
Check the link for the splitter you posted. It says "The DA550BID offers a 5-42 MHz return path for bi-directional communication for use with cable modems and pay-per-view applications."

You shouldn't have to worry about splitting the line for your cable modem. Still looking good!

Jerrod,

Yeah, I saw that so I knew it was bidirectional, but I didn't put two and two together or I must have spaced. Thanks.

BTW, these things are not cheap, so I took advantage of the one I saw on ebay. I think the guy has a few more left. Look at item number 5831179774. Great deal on these puppies for anyone who is interested.

Bud

Nice!

BTW, these things are not cheap, so I took advantage of the one I saw on ebay. I think the guy has a few more left. Look at item number 5831179774. Great deal on these puppies for anyone who is interested.

Bud

They are a good price. But part of the price reduction is because there is NO power supply!

Ahh! You're kidding! Crap!

Thats what his description stated:

Features Bi-directional CATV applications
12 volt bi-directional IR remote control from any TV location
Antenna or CATV input: 5-806MHz reverse 5-42Mhz
Maximum input level: +20dBmV with 48 channels
2 modulator inputs
8 outputs up to 150'
Expandable to up to 64 TV ouputs with additional units
Can be powered remotely using media center wall plate
Power supply NOT included <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Width, height, depth: 6.3" x 1.25" x 4.5"
Bottom of Form


Sorry for being the bearer of bad news.

Its ok, I just looked. On the phone with Channel plus now, getting the part number to order it. Damn. Too good to be true!

Bud

Its ok, I just looked. On the phone with Channel plus now, getting the part number to order it. Damn. Too good to be true!

Bud
Bud,

Was thinking of buying one myself. Did you ever find out about the power supply specs (voltage, amps, connector type)? Also, did you ever get a cost on the replacement CP power supply? I have a ton of extra power supplies at the house, so one I have might fit the unit specs.

Swithey and Greg,

I just ordered the power supply (http://www.mtx-sales.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=159). Came to about 26 bucks with shipping. Still not a bad deal. The people at Channel Plus told me the part number (350-086) and that the power/IR adapter comes with the power supply. I also confirmed the part number and the specs. Its the right one. Check out the contents section on page two of the DA-550BID manual (http://www.channelplus.com/pdf/manuals/DA-550manual.pdf).

Whew! Good find Greg, thanks!

Bud

The power supply has a non-standard connector. See picture below:

http://www.stargateunofficial.com/graphics3/cplus.jpg

Also the power supply is 15VDC 300mA

The power supply has a non-standard connector.

Also the power supply is 15VDC 300mA
Greg,

Ah, 15volts is a bit off the wall. I may not have one of those. Damn, may need to buy the one Bud got. Thanks.

Well, Comcast showed up late, but at least showed up. It's the same HD STB, the Motorola 6200 without the DVR. I went ahead and hooked it up, I had some crimp on F connectors, so I temporarily used those. HD pictures like Discovery HDTV look amazing. SD looks not that great. Looking forward to getting some compression fittings and the DA550BID and see if that makes a difference. The installer basically handed me the box and said what I had was fine, although if I requested Comcast to, they could reconfigure the distribution for free (but he couldn't do it then for some reason). I'll try the DA550BID and if I'm not satisfied, I'll get their Comcast butts back here.

The kids and I just watched Madagascar and now we're watching a Rugrats movie. The wife has been out of town all week, so having the projector up and watching movies with them has kept them happy and preoccupied.

Bud

Oh and BTW, the installer told me that all the lower analog channels will be going digital in the near future, which will improve those. He said something about analog sets will require a small box though. Not sure when and all the detais. I think this was slip.

Bud

Oh and BTW, the installer told me that all the lower analog channels will be going digital in the near future, which will improve those. He said something about analog sets will require a small box though. Not sure when and all the detais. I think this was slip.

Bud

Sounds right. IF all channels are digital you need a STB for all TV's. The kicker is will they charge you for basic cable channels that used to "FREE" on your analog TV? That is, for sets that get basic without an STB and now will require one will they hit you for $5/month or so per box?

Man, lots of catching up to do on your thread..

Anyway, I made a structured distribution panel as well (though I just mounted everything to a piece of plywood). I bought a Channel Vision HS-16 16-way splitter (http://store1.yimg.com/I/gadgetpro_1836_294716) and Comcast came out and supplied me with an amplifier, and wired everything (except the 16 cables to the rooms) with they're high quality compression coax terminators, all for free. It works great.

Regarding STBs.. they simulcast in analog and digital, so whichever display you connect to the STB is digital, and everything else (just straight off the coax) is analog, but works without an STB. That's how I currently have mine -- one STB (HD DVR.. $10/month extra is the best money I spend every month!).

By the way, what do you mean by "pendants" above your bar?

That is, for sets that get basic without an STB and now will require one will they hit you for $5/month or so per box?

Not sure, but I'll guess we'll find out in the near future.

Bud

Tim,

That thing is a beast! Right now I have 7 hookups, although I have many more runs throughout the house that are just not active, like the kids rooms. I have an amplifier now that Comcast supplied (not sure if you can tell by the picture of the rats nest), which is why the installer said I shouldn't have any issues with the splitters. No much signal loss with those splitters he said. My SD channels are OK on smaller sets, but on my 51 Hitachi, its not the best. Maybe I'll get lucky like Greg and it'll improve.

I have not jumped on the DVR thing yet. I know people swear by it. I haven't seen it in action. May be worth a look.

On the pendants, something like this, although a different style. These are "mini" pendants, which is the type I'll use. I bought them already, they're in a boxes in storage. Maybe if I have some free time, I'll hook one up and snap a shot of it.
http://image.lightingshowplace.com/prodimages/mfeiss/imageHuge/P1068ORB.jpg

Bud

BTW, just got back from HD. I had to go pick up my 6 doors, just got around to getting them, since the wife is back from her trip. Someone from HD actually helped me put them in the back of the truck this time. Amazing!

Bud

Hi Bud, Thanks for the info on the bar. I was curious of the width of the bar top section, its not on the drawing. I was planning on 24" but your design is similar to what I have in our kitchen, that bar top is 14.5" wide. Also what material are you planning for the bar top?

Also wondering if you can tell me how to add images to your posts, I signed up for fotki but I don't know how to add images directly to the posts, any info would be appreciated.

Here's one that I want to add to my construction thread, my current layout.

http://images14.fotki.com/v256/filev7LR/469cc/8/821852/3067921/GranTheaterO_drwing16Nov05.jpg

Thanks,

Dave

Dave,

The top of the bar will be about 18 inches wide, the counter on the cabinets will be your typical 24-25 inches. I hope to do granite, thats what we have upstairs in our kitchen. I like the look. I thought about wood or doing something else more creative, but I'm leaning towards granite right now.

As far as posting images, you just need to use the "Post reply" button to the left at the top and bottom of each page versus the "Quick Reply" area at the bottom of the page. Gives you an icon (circled below) that you can use that will prompt you for the image location. OR you can put " and " tags around the URL for the picture.

http://images12.fotki.com/v210/photos/6/649633/2370847/post-vi.jpg

Bud

Hi Bud,

I really appreciate the help. I tryed it and it work perfectly, thanks again.

As far as the bar goes from my link, I'm going to wait until drywall is complete then I'll a 2x6 wall like yours and make the final decisions inside the room with my wife. Thanks for the ideas.

Keep up the good work, I'll be following your progress.

Dave

Bud,

Everything is looking AWESOME!!!! I am a bit jealous. Mine is coming along, but I think you will beat me. Hey out of curiosity, you said you work from home, which makes working on the project easier some times. What do you do for work?

~Josh

Bud,

Everything is looking AWESOME!!!! I am a bit jealous. Mine is coming along, but I think you will beat me. Hey out of curiosity, you said you work from home, which makes working on the project easier some times. What do you do for work?

~Josh

Josh,

Male prostitute extroidanaire.... :eek:

I actually manage software development projects. I'm a certified project manager with a large "International Business" that also makes "Machines". They also just announced a freeze on their pension plan. Lucky me. This will be my 17th year. I have developers in India, China, Brazil, Belarus and of all places, Tampa. Doesn't make a lot of sense to be in a typical office with the people I deal with daily. I came up through the programming ranks, did tech lead and architecture work, then got into project management about 6 years ago. My educational background is as follows. BS in Electronic Engineering Technology, minor in Computer Science from University of Hartford (CT). MS in Computer Science from Southern Tech. MBA from Emory University and Masters Certificate in Project Management from George Washington University.

Size 11 shoe.

EDIT: No need to be jealous, you're right there and it'll be just as nice.

Bud

Hi Bud,

I really appreciate the help. I tryed it and it work perfectly, thanks again.

As far as the bar goes from my link, I'm going to wait until drywall is complete then I'll a 2x6 wall like yours and make the final decisions inside the room with my wife. Thanks for the ideas.

Keep up the good work, I'll be following your progress.

Dave

Dave,

Saw your layout initially, but when I just looked again, got an error. Anyway, I had to plan it out that way because I had a dependency to get the wall if for the plumber to run the PVC and copper for the sink. I went down to Home Depot and sat down with a kitchen person who helped with the design. It doesn't cost anything and it sure helps to visualize and plan what you want. I'd recommend it to anyone thinking about using cabinets for a bar.

Bud

Chief mount (RPA225) came today. Took about 15 minutes to pull down the Peerless and mount the Chief. I like the result. Will post pictures tomorrow.

Bud

I actually manage software development projects. I'm a certified project manager with a large "International Business" that also makes "Machines". They also just announced a freeze on their pension plan. Lucky me. This will be my 17th year. I have developers in India, China, Brazil, Belarus and of all places, Tampa. Doesn't make a lot of sense to be in a typical office with the people I deal with daily. I came up through the programming ranks, did tech lead and architecture work, then got into project management about 6 years ago. My educational background is as follows. BS in Electronic Engineering Technology, minor in Computer Science from University of Hartford (CT). MS in Computer Science from Southern Tech. MBA from Emory University and Masters Certificate in Project Management from George Washington University.Wow, we have pretty similar backgrounds.. you just seem to have more experience than me. :) I worked for the same company (if I can figure out your code correctly.. ;)) I did for five years, and was rejoicing the day I left -- far too much politics and nothing got done due to upper mgmt (not related to PMs, mind you :)). I also have a CS degree (minor in math), albeit it's a BS in CS.

I think we're all migrating to the same Internet location. I have a similar background (BS Engineering, MS Engineering Management) as well, except never worked for a Fortune 500 and a few years back I gave up coding and moved into marketing, for a software company of course.

Birds of a feather share stories of their Home Theaters together.

Now if only I could figure out a way to retire early and spend more time working on the HT.

Take care,

Dave

Dave,

Doesn't surprise me really. I think us computer/engineering types like to tinker, figure things out and stretch the noggin. Once I finish the build, I'll need to find a new obsession or I'll go insane.

Tim,

I hear ya and good for you. I'm second generation and half my family either works there or has worked there. Same with my wife's side, including her. She's got 20 years in. Makes for dull dinner conversation!

Bud

Geez all this talk of education and work makes me feel inadequate :o All I have is a BS in BS. :D I'm a delivery driver but think of myself as pretty handy so hopefully when I get my HT going I'm not overwelmed :p

Nah, just spend all your waking time reading AVS and you can produce a theater just as nice as all the others!

Bud

Here are a few (blurry) shots of the projector on the new mount. As you can see, I picked up at least 2 inches, maybe three.

http://images8.fotki.com/v139/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0130-vi.jpg
http://images14.fotki.com/v255/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0129-vi.jpg

HTScotty,

On the lens shift thing. I made sure that the mount upper portion of the mount was perfectly level (back to front) prior to attaching the projector this time. When I turned the projector on, the image was about 4 inches above the blue tape with the lens shift all the way down. I ended up tilting the projector down some and then corrected with the fine vertical adjustment. When I build the screenwall, I'll actually raise the screen a little now. Based on my calculations and my seating preferences, I think it'll work out better than where the current screen position is.

Bud

Here's a side by side (more like top to bottom) comparison of the two mounts.

New Chief mount:
http://images8.fotki.com/v160/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0132-vi.jpg

Old Peerless Universal mount:
http://images15.fotki.com/v266/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0032-vi.jpg

EDIT: Updated blurry photo!

Bud

Bud...

I have to admit (fuzzy pictures and all) that the Chief mount looks much nicer and cleaner than the Peerless. I say it was a good choice in swaping the two out.

Sean

Sean,

I guess with the universal mounts, they have to accommodate mutiple machines obviously, so its designed with all that flexibility in mind and that adds to the height factor. It's actually a pretty nicely designed mount and would have kept it if the right height was there. If I had kept it, the projector box would be much lower than I'd like it to be. Anyway, another problem solved.

Bud

Looking good Bud,

Quick question - Did you expose the electrical outlet or is it hidden in the ceiling? I am trying to decide. Seems that putting it up in the ceiling - it would look nicer, but it would be hard to change the plug if one where to change projectors and it required a different power supply cord.

Jason

Jason,

I think you have to have it exposed, it may be a fire hazard if not. Not sure. It's there, its behind the projector attached to a stud and drywalled. It'll be covered by the projector box as well though.

Bud

Yes, you have to have the outlet exposed. Even a junction box that has a blank plate on it (e.g. to splice wires together to extend a run) needs to be accessible. That doesn't mean you can't paint it or hide it in a (removable) box like Bud just mentioned.. :)

Good news!

Got an email and a tracking number from Ascend, the speakers have offically been shipped. I ordered those back on Dec. 15. I think they'll be here on Monday. Also, the Carada screen should be here any day now.

Bud

Good news!

Got an email and a tracking number from Ascend, the speakers have offically been shipped. I ordered those back on Dec. 15. I think they'll be here on Monday. Also, the Carada screen should be here any day now.

Bud
Bud,

I've heard that these speakers are just unbelievable sounding for the price. Please comment on them once you get them installed!! BTW, what AMP(s) are planning to use with these speaker?

Steve,

I will post my comments when I have them up and running. I have the Yamaha RXV2600, although I only fired it up to make sure it worked. I have not attempted to even use it yet. I needed banana plugs before I could try it out. The mail just came and sure enough, they're here.

Also in the mail today from Monoprice was my DVI/HDMI cable to connect my HD STB to the Yamaha and my gender changers for the RS232 cable I ran to the projector (outside the conduit). I actually reversed the cable by mistake, so I had female to female at the projector and male to male at the other end, although I don't plan on connecting it in the near future. I only mention it to ensure people don't make the same mistake.

Bud

Guess what arrived today? Looks like its time to build that screen wall.

http://images14.fotki.com/v256/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0138-vi.jpg
http://images14.fotki.com/v256/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0137-vi.jpg

BTW, its still in the box, the other thing is an old bedframe I'm getting rid of!

Bud

Bud,

I've heard that these speakers are just unbelievable sounding for the price. Please comment on them once you get them installed!! BTW, what AMP(s) are planning to use with these speaker?

You lucky dog you.... I can't wait until I'm in that phase. Please do let us know what you think of the Ascends. Did you order their new upgraded 340 series? (can't recall the name) If so was that why there was the delay? I am planning on the Axiom M80's which are quite a bit more, but if these can fill my 21' X 16' theater with a good SW, that could save me some serious $$$. The only thing that is really holding me back is they don't have a dipolar or quadpolar surround speaker.

Have fun!!

Jon,

They're the CMT 340 Special Editions (SEs). The just went into production this past week. They're not advertised yet on the website, just discussed in the Ascend forums. I called them directly to get my name on the list when they came out. I went with LCR only, I have inceilings for surrounds...

Bud

Let me see Bud -

- projector? check
- receiver? check
- speakers? check
- screen? check
- subwoofer? check

Anyone here want to make a wager that progress is going to slow?

Ben

Funny guy! And where might you be on your build, Mr. Harper? Oh, thought so!

Got plenty to do still and will keep pluggin.... plan on taking some time off towards the end of the month to do at least my tile work. Got a theater, need a restroom...

EDIT: Oh.. and looking forward to breaking out the framing nailer and starting your space!

Bud

Looking good Bud. I myself finally made it to the Fabric point. I spent nearly 2 weeks farting around with color Samples of Stains, but now that's out of the way, the fabric seems to be moving along.

You got so many pages in your thread that I don't know if you ordered your GoM yet. But if you didn't, make sure you get all you need at the Same time. I ordered a second Roll of Black from the same Place a couple months later and it was a Slightly different Black and different Weave. Good thing it's not going to butt up against the first black GoM I got.

Ruben

Ruben,

Thanks. I have not ordered GOM yet. Plan to do so shortly, but thanks for the tip. Good timing on your GOM, I'll be watching for tips and techniques from your end. Did you order through fabricmate?

Lots of pages here, I changed the number of posts per page to 60, so that certainly helps.

Bud

Hey Bud,
Great job on the theatre so far.. I took the entire day yesterday to view your entire thread from start to end.. and i was amazed at all the work you have put into it .. Like you i too am in the Atlanta area, Powder Springs, Ga. to be exact. At this very moment we are in the process of building our Home in a subdivision in which there is a basement that i intend to do something similar. Part of it will be a dedicated HT, no windows in the design.. and the other half will be a gym / play area for my wife and boys. Estimated time to move in is middle to late Feb 06. I cant wait to get settled in so that i can start my construction of my HT. Please keep up the good work because between you and Sandman I have learned a ton.. take care and thanks for posting such an awsome thread!!!!

Max

Hey Max,

Thanks. Welcome to the forum and thread. LOL, an entire day? Pretty funny. Good luck with the new house, February is almost upon us. I hear Powder Springs is booming. Is the new house on Powder Springs also?

Bud

Awesome!!! Almost there...

gary

keep up the great work Bud. Your thread is a wealth of knowledge. :)

Max, Bud, Jason and all other north Atlanta HT geeks

We are literally within a few miles of each other. Need to plan a gathering soon otherwise we are just slackers!

Hurry up and finish Bud so we can trash your place first!

Ben

Ben,

I think Jason plans on coming by Tuesday night when the Ascends arrive, you're welcome to come by as well. I should have the frame together and maybe even the screen wall done.

Max, and as Ben puts it, you "north Atlanta HT geeks", you guys are welcome as well!

Bud

Gary and Larry,

Thanks guys! Keep up the work yourselves. I'll be watching!

Bud

Max, Bud, Jason and all other north Atlanta HT geeks

We are literally within a few miles of each other. Need to plan a gathering soon otherwise we are just slackers!

Hurry up and finish Bud so we can trash your place first!

Ben

North Atlanta Home Theater Geek Present!!

Ruben,

Thanks. I have not ordered GOM yet. Plan to do so shortly, but thanks for the tip. Good timing on your GOM, I'll be watching for tips and techniques from your end. Did you order through fabricmate?

Lots of pages here, I changed the number of posts per page to 60, so that certainly helps.

Bud

I ordered through Fabricmate as well. Its funny, because they said they are following my thread as well. They were bugging out when they found out I was SandmanX from AVS :D

They recently Raised their prices to $12.50 a yard as well. Not the end of the world but its a few bucks more now. Also, they have super fast delivery, and black seems to be the hardest to get because its always out of stock. I think they just got some more black back in at GoM.

Ruben

Tuesday sounds good Bud. I can bring a few PJs (Z3, Z4, and HX1) if you want to do a quick comparison.

Ben

That's fine, although now that I've got the AE900, not sure I would want to be tempted by something else!! We can do it around 7:00 if thats OK. I can order some pizza and I'll pick up some beer. Jason, that ok with you?

Bud

Finished three doors yesterday that will be painted yesterday. This includes the door to the mechanical room/workshop, closet by the bar and the bathroom. Did all the casing as well. I also did the molding around the entrance into the gameroom. The three other doors for the HT room are solid pine, which I'll stain when I get there. I do not plan on install these doors until after I get all the painting done inside (ceiling, concession area) and out of the HT room. I do not want to get any paint or primer on the doors. I need to do the base and crown before I can paint as well. I'll be ordering the base and crown through my neighbor the builder (paint grade stuff) so it'll get delivered and I won't have to deal with hauling 16 pieces of trim on top of the truck.

I also picked up some nice 2x4s for the screen wall. Today I will pull the screen frame out of the box and put it together. With the Criterion Series, the black trim is much bigger, so I may have go to back to a 100" screen from the 104". I need all the room I can get on the sides for the proscenium.

Here are a few picks of yesterdays work:
http://images15.fotki.com/v263/photos/6/649633/3002014/100_0163-vi.jpg
http://images15.fotki.com/v267/photos/6/649633/3002014/100_0165-vi.jpg
http://images15.fotki.com/v262/photos/6/649633/3002014/100_0164-vi.jpg

Also, my in-laws will be here on Friday for about two weeks, which means I'll need to do the tile work in the bathroom pretty soon we can make final connections for the bathroom plumbing. I may end up taking a day or two to wrap that up in the next week or so.

Bud

Bud,

Looking REAL good. I can't wait to see those Pine doors. Do you plan to keep them natural color or stain them somthing darker?

I feel like I'm standing still on my HT compared to yours. Note to self -- "Must move faster, must move faster! :D

Steve,

Thanks. I plan on staining them a darker color. I also plan on building a few lightboxes and staining those, the crown, base, the hand railing up the steps. I'd like to match or compliment the color the cabinets in the concession area and bar.

You're doing great and I assume you'll pass me in no time!

Bud

Bud and Ben -

Tuesday night sounds great. Got in late from Savannah last night so I have been catching up on the progress. I'll bring the beers - just tell me what kind you guys like.

Ben - Looking forward to meeting you. I hear a rumor that you are starting/or have started a business selling HT equiptment, screens, and other HT stuff and have great prices to quote a reliable source. Looking forward to discussing that with you as well!

Jason

Ben and Jason,

Will one of you guys bring a HDMI cable with you tomorrow? I need to test the S97 to the 2600 and the cable that Panasonic provides may be the cause of the problem I'm having. I don't have an extra. Thanks.

Bud

Ascends arrived in great condition. Others in the speaker forum mentioned UPS trashed their boxes. Anyway, ran downstairs and hooked them up and ran through some of the demo material posted out here. They sounds great. I'm no audiophile, but they are very clean and crisp, from the little time I just spent with them.

http://images15.fotki.com/v266/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0178-vi.jpg

I'll post some close ups probably tomorrow.

Bud

Cool! Doesn't it feel awesome to get new electronics?

Reaper,

Yes and very addicting!

Bud

Bud,

Your Ascends are delivered the same day I ordered mine..... if you have any ideas on how to make 2 weeks go by without thinking about them, please let me know. Better yet, the new Hsu sub I ordered won't be ready until March sometime. That's going to be painful!

I'll be interested to hear more thoughts about them, and also about the Carada screen because I'll probably get one of those. Don't you feel great since you're past the drywall stage? I wish I was!

Jerrod, I think I ordered my Ascends a month ago. You know what helps, having older speakers ? I had old Infinitys, so at least I had something to tie me over. I bought my Hsu used, so can't help you there! So far I'm very happy with them. Played a variety of movies scenes and music and they seem very crisp. People have said they've heard things with these speakers in scenes they never heard before, I can attest to that. Great product at a great price.

On the Carada screen. I'm about to do a long post on my situation with that. Looks to be pretty sweet as well.

I'm very happy to be done with drywall. BUT, now I wish I was done with trim, paint, doors, etc. Just a different hump to get over. Smaller humps, but humps!

Bud

Couple of shots of the Ascends:

http://images16.fotki.com/v272/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0183-vi.jpghttp://images6.fotki.com/v91/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0181-vi.jpg

Bud

OK, need your opinions here. Ben, you too please.

I may have made a mistake on the screen size I ordered, which has impacted my progress on the screen wall and proscenium. I have a few options, so I'll throw them out here. If there are other options, let me know.

In my original plan, I was going to go with a 100" diagonal screen. This would leave me roughly 24" on the sides to build the proscenium to house the sub and speakers. I planned on a screen wall 12"-14" off the back wall to put my center channel above/below the screen and have it hidden.

I thought I could sneak in a few more inches on the screen and ordered a 104" screen. I also went with the Carada Criterion, since it had nicer trim. Screen came. Pretty nice, actually.

Well the extra width and the LARGER trim has increased the width of the screen by about 12" inches. This in turn leaves me with only 18 inches on the sides (24-12/2) versus the 24 I planned on. I could fit the Ascends in on the side easily and shrink down the proscenium some, BUT the subwoofer is 16 inches wide. I had planned on building speaker like covers for access to the speakers and sub, but its now just too tight to get the sub in there. I now have an inch on either side to play width. Make sense?

So here are dome of my options:

No proscenium, all front speakers/sub exposed to the theater.
Get a new smaller sub. Maybe even two, like the Hsu STF-1s.
Get a smaller screen. Go back to 100 inches or smaller. Get the other Carada type with the smaller trim.
Open the wall directly left of the stage (behind proscenium, like a bump out) that shares the equipment closet. Make it a little larger to accommodate the extra width of the sub and make a smaller proscenium.
Put the sub in the equipment closet. Its immediately next to the stage.
Move to wall that shares concession are cabinets, install in cabinet and open wall.


http://images15.fotki.com/v268/photos/6/649633/2875265/Speakers-vi.jpg

There are trade-offs for all these options obviously. I'd like to keep the sub and hide it, but I'm not hung up on it. I'd like to keep the screen size, but that's the cause of the problem.

Any other ideas?

Bud

Bud,

If I understand you correctly you are building a false wall 12"-14" infront of the existing wall in the picture so you can house the center channel into it?!!

Can you build the prosceniums to house the left/right speakes and then "kick" out the bottom of them by 2-3 inches to house the sub on one side, and the other side could be for a future sub or storage?!
That way you have the full width for your nicer bigger screen but have the space below for a sub.

Sean

Sean,

The screenwall would have the center channel and the screen itself, hide the wiring, Linacoustic behind it. like this:
http://images12.fotki.com/v240/photos/6/649633/2875265/topstage2-vi.jpg

I think I understand what you're saying. Like this?

Bud

Ya.

I guess I wasn't entirely sure as to your design when I suggested that. Your buidling that false wall as stand alone by the looks of your drawing. I thought your were building out the entire wall and then "traying" the screen itself.

Like

http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/5650/screenwall26at.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I'm not sure of your speaker or sub dimensions, you might be able to 45 the sides.

Thought about the treying. It would keep the screen on the back wall, similar to a shadow box. If I were to do that and keep the bumped out portion (depth, I guess) for the sub across the front of the whole stage, I'd lose most of the stage. The required depth for the sub is like 22 inches, the stage is 26 inches. If I were to build it out the sub area and stop it at the dotted line (in your diagram) than I'd still have most of the stage.

Bud

Your design is quite similar to mine Bud, I have built my proscenium already. Left and right speakers on either side of the screen, center channel is above the screen in the soffit and sub is directly below the center channel. I am currently working on "boxing" in the area below the screen to house the sub and create a shadow box. I factored this in to the design so my stage is deeper.

I personally wouldn't leave the speakers exposed. I did this on my first theater and thought it never looked finished.

I am not fond of corner loaded subs so I keep them out near the center of the wall to reduce "boomy" bass. I also have a second identical sub in the rear of the room. If you are considering moving to two smaller subs this may be a good route to go for several reasons. You will have more even bass throughout the room, you will lose less depth on your stage if you go the shadowbox method to mention just a few.

With subs more is better 4 being ideal, but it will be more difficult to set up as well. I wouldn't recommend recessing it into a wall as that opens up a whole new can of worms. It will alter the performance of your sub, for the same reason corner loading alters its performance. I was considering recessing my subs into the walls as well but the experts say it is a big no-no.

You could also look at putting your sub elsewhere in the room. My first room had the sub, a sonotube monster, on the rear seating riser. Yours is may be small enough to hide behind you back row.

Looking great so far Bud! The proscenium is a fun build as it really starts looking like a real theater now.
Rob :)

Hey Rob,

Thanks for the reply. I agree, I like the hidden look and thats what I wanted all along.

Every option has its compromises. As so many others would say, I wish I had another few feet of width and length in the room. I don't have a large riser nor stage because of the characteristics of the room. The dimensions, the doors, etc. I'm sure I'll hear arguments from folks that say my room is bigger than theirs. Point being that I don't have enough room on the riser for a sub unless I give up seating, since its so tight.

If I go the shadow box type route, I think I'd alter it some so it would have some angles both top and bottom to give it some character. I'd have to bump out the bottom some due to the sub depth, similar to what Sean was referring to. I'm big on the symmetrical look, so I'd probably do both sides the same and a variation of it on the top, just not as deep. I would though have to put the sub in the corner or lose most of the stage. Again, another compromise. Where the sub is sitting now, sounds good to me, although I haven't moved it around too much. I need to see what impact it'll have int he corner.

Bud

Bud,

I would take the easy way out and reduce the screen size (maybe just because I'm lazy!). Given all the options that have been presented, reducing the screen seems to be the only option that will allow you to continue down your original (and seemingly most desired) plan.

Just curious, do you have one of the HSU front firing subs or is it down-firing? Could dictate placement.

Ben

Ben,

Down-firing. I may prototype a shadow box (or parts of) I had in mind since I have the lumber. That would allow me to at least see if its feasible to keep the screen size and still keep in line with the look I was trying to achieve. If that doesn't work, I'll have to look at possibly going smaller (say it isn't so!).

Bud

Bud,

If you have your heart set on the larger screen, wouldn't changing the sub be the path of least resistance. Those Hsu subs hold their value well (in terms of reselling it); or perhaps they would give you credit towards some smaller ones.

Just a thought...

Gerry

Gerry,

Definately a possibility. I actually got the VTF-2 MK2 from Audiogon used and got a pretty good price on it, so not sure I could get a credit on it. I'm sure I could sell it though privately.

Bud

I threw together some lumber today for a screen wall. It still needs cripple studs, be secured to the stage and soffit, etc, so its not done. I may even pull the wall out from 12-14 inches so the center channel is flush with the screen, like my original design. The goal here was to see just how big the screen would be (physically).

The actual viewing dimensions of the screen are a little smaller than the inside of the box opening. The outer dimensions of the screen with the trim will cover the opening and the upper and lower 2x4 supports in the picture. The actual bracket will be mounted on these horizontal 2x4x. If I go with a smaller screen, I could frame out the interior of the box and easily make it smaller. It'll all be covered with GOM anyway.

The painted screen you see if what was inside the blue tape That was a 100" screen (87.2 inches wide by 49 inches high) if I measured it correctly. You can see the difference in size between the two. The new 104" screen has a viewing area of 90.6 inches wide by 51 inches high. Anyway, I have just about 17 inches on each side of the outer 2x4s.

If you look close at the screen capture, you can see the difference between the painted screen on the wall and the overlap of the picture. The image is almost identical to the actual new screen size.

http://images15.fotki.com/v263/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0185-vi.jpg
http://images14.fotki.com/v257/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0189-vi.jpg
Bud

Man!!! Sure is looking nice Bud. I'm a huge fan of larger screens so I would try my hardest to keep the screen you have rather than send it back for a smaller one. It looks like the front LR speakers will fit if they are to be placed over your sub on some sort of shelf or stand. That way you don't have to lose the screen size or proscenium. Good luck.

Bud:

A golf video, is what your using. Man is that un-exciting.

Greg,

HA! It was actually INHD "Lesson from the Pros" on Comcast. A cloudy day at that. I wasn't trying to really do a test of the projector, just to get an image up so you could see the difference in screen sizes! I haven't done any calibration or tweaks. Seems all the paused videos I've tried to take pictures of just don't come out.

Bud

Greg,

Just for you, buddy! You can still see the difference in Nemo and Ice Age, but Incredibles is in a different format.

http://images15.fotki.com/v263/photos/6/649633/3117221/100_0198-vi.jpg
http://images15.fotki.com/v265/photos/6/649633/3117221/100_0195-vi.jpg
http://images15.fotki.com/v263/photos/6/649633/3117221/100_0196-vi.jpg

Bud

Now that what i'am talking about, I can get excited about a good movie.

Looking good Bud

o no bud now your not going to finish :eek:

actually it is very hard not to do but once you have your fix you'll be back at it.

Larry,

Nah. I'm half-stalled until I get this damn screenwall figured out though. I order the base and trim molding for the non-HT room next week and I think I'm going to take two days off next week to tile my bathroom. I need to figure out what tile I want still, though.

Bud

Future Ascend SE owners,

For you guys who are considering the Ascend SEs, here is the Ascend SE Owners thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=629769). Good reviews there as well as more pictures.

BTW, I'm loving them! Enjoy!

Bud

Man!!! Sure is looking nice Bud. I'm a huge fan of larger screens so I would try my hardest to keep the screen you have rather than send it back for a smaller one. It looks like the front LR speakers will fit if they are to be placed over your sub on some sort of shelf or stand. That way you don't have to lose the screen size or proscenium. Good luck.

Jon,

Thanks. Even though I haven't actually done anything with it yet, I'm getting attached to it. Must be destiny. Still a little tight though for the original design.

Going to also demo the Hsu STF-1 (http://www.hsustore.com/stf1.html) and see what happens. I've read good things about it, but expect it won't perform like my VTF-2 MK2 (http://www.hsustore.com/vtf2.html). I ordered it through Ascend, so I can send it back within 30 days if I decide on another route.

Bud

Bud,

Is something like this possible:

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/4893/alternative6sa.jpg

You could simply add a removable GOM wrapped filler piece to take up the gap at the bottom between the farthest outside cripple stud and the areas to the left/right of the screen. Or you could try to make those parts of the proscenium that are right and left of the screen have a little bump out at the bottom that fill in the gap.

Hey Tom,

Definitely an option. I think this is what Sean (MaximAVS) was eluding to. Jason and I talked about that the other night as well, but I dismissed it initially. After looking at it some, I was thinking that as long as it didn't look too "boxie (sp)" that it may work. I was thinking of 45 degree angles from the inside box corners to the screenwall. Your picture looks good two dimensionally. I'll draw up something to show you what I was thinking.

I placed the sub there today to listen to it. It sounds fine to me, although slightly different from where it was, I think. I'm Definitely thinking center above the screen as well, which would alow me to still have some stage.

Bud

EDIT: I hate this spell checker, its worthless!

This is a top view, but shows you what I was thinking about the sub "box" if you will. The red area would go up almost to the bottom of the screen. The blue area would be above the sub obviously I thought about angling that if it would look right and if I had the real estate to do so. The green box would be a small soffit like are above the screen to house the center channel. This would sort of hard to draw from the front.

Comments?

http://images15.fotki.com/v260/photos/6/649633/2875265/topstage3-vi.jpg

Bud

Bud,

I have an HSU STF-1 two streets away from you (Rob H. street) that I think the owner (or really his wife) would rather not have. Just put it in last Saturday. Nice sub, but definitely not a VTF-2.

If interested, let me know.

Ben

Ahhh yes - sorry, missed his picture: it pays to fully read every post first! MaximAVS has given me some good ideas in the past, it must have rubbed off :)

Are the 34 degree angle strickly for looks, to get away from the "multiple boxes" look, or is there some functionality to it?

Ben,

Whats up with that? Were you going to replace it? If it works out, I could ship the other one back to Ascend. No problem there.

Bud

This latest drawing looks like a winner to me. I really like how the red sub boxes are angled back to the procenium. That gives the stage a very nice depth dimension and finished look.

Jason,

I'm liking that design as well. I thought about doing a smaller angled version at the top for symmetrical reasons, but not sure at this point.

Bud

I agree... the latest drawing is actually what I was thinking of as I read your first description of your issue.

Bud...

That last design is what I was eluding to in my previous post.. But I couldn't draw fast enough at work to post a picture!! :o

I would really try and keep that bigger screen. Nothing worse than sending a perfectly good screen back and stall your progress on the wall until the new one gets there!

After you add the boxed out area above the screen for the center, will you get a shadow on your screen from the projector?!

Sean
I love the progress thus far!!

Sean,

Good point and question, but I don't think so. The actual screen will rest on top of the framed out area you see now, not in the frame itself. The Criterion Series trim around the screen is pretty wide, it's 3.25 inches, which I accounted for. Take a look at the trim:

http://www.carada.com/projector-media-screens-home-office/Criterion-Series-Engineering-Drawing.jpg

The center channel is like 11 inches deep and you need a few inches, so I'l looking at the front of that box to be at about 14 inches. I picked up almost 4-5 inches from the back wall already. Here's how .. the 3.5" for the stud width, a small gap between the screen wall and drywall, almost probably 1", and then the screen itself is off the wall. So that means I'm looking at only a 9-10 inch box anyway.

I'll definitely verify before install installing any framing though!

Bud

OK, here's a followup to my Channel Plus post a few weeks ago.

My ChannelPlus DA-550ID arrived a few minutes ago. I paid for the damn thing on December 29th. I got like on email response from this joker on Jan 5th stating he shipped it then. I sent him a nasty email yesterday as well. It looks to be in good shape, although the three pins for the adapter were bent, but fixable. I went back and read some of the feedback and although this guy had like a 98% favorable rating, he's a pompous ass.

I did receive the power supply about two weeks ago. It did NOT have the damn adapter for it like I was told by the Channel Plus folks. I though maybe the seller would have included it. Nope.

Good news though. I called Channel Plus technical support and they just dropped one in the mail for me.

Abierce and whoever else who might have purchased one of these without the power supply, I'd suggest you call Channel Plus customer service if you need the adapter as well. Their number is 800.999.5225. The part number for the power supply is 350-086.

Will hopefully install inthe next two weeks.

Bud

Glad you got the channel plus all worked out.

I though the power supply and the little adaptor was going to be the problem. The adaptor is very odd, and did not look like it was an off the shelf part. That was why i brought it up several weeks a go. The little parts can be a bear to get some times. Sounds like the manufacture is giving you better support then the E-bay seller did.

Bud,

What about keeping your original screen wall like you wanted it and just building an access panel between the cripple studs like this?:

http://img358.imageshack.us/img358/9511/panel9ck.jpg

Hey Tom.

The depth of the rectangular portion of the stage is 26 inches and the depth of the sub is like 20 inches. If I move the sub more towards the center, than unlikely I could do the angle into the screen to make it look right, I'd probably would have to do a shadow box all the way across the front and lose the stage almost entirely. I really think the combination of last drawing with your support legs shifted inward could possibly be the way to go. If I leave the screen wall up against the drywall, I wouldn't have to even move those legs in, since I have just enough room to squeeze in. I think if I were to pull the whole screen wall forward to have a straight up and down screen wall (no box across the top) with the center behind it, I'd have to definitely notch.

I'm thinking I need to put the screen frame together and just mount that to see if that helps me.

Bud

Uh oh. I see it now. First the screen frame gets built. Then it's "Let's see what it looks like with the screen on". Then, before you know it, it looks like this for 2 months:

http://img358.imageshack.us/img358/6051/gollum0ry.jpg

All kidding aside, you're probably right. Start mocking it up and seeing if it will work sounds like the best course of action before you actually start constructing what would be a final product. The angled sides seem like they would look pretty cool.

Not gonna happen, my friend, trust me! Thanks for your ideas, BTW.

Bud

I hope you left that Ebay seller negative feedback describing the situation..

Hey Max,

Thanks. Welcome to the forum and thread. LOL, an entire day? Pretty funny. Good luck with the new house, February is almost upon us. I hear Powder Springs is booming. Is the new house on Powder Springs also?

Bud



Hey there Bud,
Yes the new house is in Powder Springs.. and you are right the place is booming ..Had the Pre drywall walk through yesterday and now just needs to be signed off on by the the main builder and a few touch ups as far as the wiring and plumbing goes and then up with the drywall.. they tell me to expect to start thurs or friday of next week...
keeping the faith..
Max

Here's a combination of the two designs that I'm thinking about. At least another option. It would have a flat front screen wall like the first design, allow the sub to be tucked under the corner of the screen and have the angles towards the screen wall. It'll cut the size of the stage some and bring the screen forward a little (does that make the screen look bigger?!?!?).

Any comments on this one?
http://images16.fotki.com/v274/photos/6/649633/2875265/topstage4-vi.jpg

Bud

Ben,

I think Jason plans on coming by Tuesday night when the Ascends arrive, you're welcome to come by as well. I should have the frame together and maybe even the screen wall done.

Max, and as Ben puts it, you "north Atlanta HT geeks", you guys are welcome as well!

Bud


Well have been doing some work on packing up the old house and getting ready for the move still debating where to do the extended stay or an apartment .. with the boys and dog.. looks like we may have to go the apt route.. especially because of his weight ( the dog that is ) .. extended stay is 45lbs and under .. and unfortunately black lab is 75 plus... well either way i have not been on the blog in a few days and i am sorry that i missed the invite to come out to your place. Sure would have taken you up on that .. would have loved to seen your progress in person. hopefully the invite will extend to a later date?.. Know you all had a good time and to hear those top notch speakers had to be a blast.. if you do it again please keep me in mind and i will be sure to check the blog on a daily basis.. Thanks
Oh and hey and what's going on to Ben and all the other "north Altanta HT geeks".

Go Steelers!!!!

and as always "Keep the Faith!!"
Max

Max,

I'm sure we'll have another "meet" in the near future. The last was just an impromptu thing.

Tim,

Haven't left any feedback at this point, but definitely plan on it.

Bud

Another question for you guys. Is there any issue with turning a downward firing sub sideways? This sub has two ports, although you can plug one. Does it matter if a side port faces forward? I could pick up about 4 more inches it I turned the sub 90 degrees so the front faces the wall.

Bud

That shouldn't be a problem turning it 90 degrees, especially being a downfiring sub. Try it each way in a standard room (with furniture and carpet, etc) and see what the differences are.

Bud - Great work on the theater - I sent you an private message - check it when you get the opportunity.

Here is where I am with the screen wall now. I ran out of 2x4s and need to purchase some long screws, so thats where it ended today. Wanted to thank Sean(MaximAVS) and Tom (Snakehunter) for making me rethink the bump out to hide the sub.

Here's the first shot. I had to change the support and move it towards the inside, then resupport the whole frame. Also made some temporary shelves to hold the front channels. I pulled the wall out based on the original design, so the speakers will be hidden comletely now.
http://images16.fotki.com/v273/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0228-vi.jpg

Here's a close up of the sub framing. The bottom angle 2x4 will actually be above the sub. The bottom will be open where it meets the stage so I can slide the sub in and out. I didn't have to turn it sideways either. I will have to build speakerl-like grills so I can get back behind the GOM.
http://images16.fotki.com/v275/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0229-vi.jpg

Just to make sure my screen height/framing was correct I went ahead and put the screen together and mounted it. Looks like I'm good to go.
http://images15.fotki.com/v267/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0230-vi.jpg

I will try and call Ascend to cancel my STF-1 order. Ben, looks like I won't need it.

Bud

Coming Along Nicely Bud. I can't wait to get my screen wall up like you. Seems like all the detail work never ends and you never see any major advances until it does end. Spending days to stain stuff, Seems like nothing is getting done over my place.


Couple Questions...

Don't you think the Side speakers might be a little to close to the walls? I'm not sure about that area but I always see people telling other people here that the main speakers are to close to the side walls. I think it has allot to do with Reflections and imaging.

Also, the Center channel being that Low to the ground, are the people in back going to hear it fine?

Reason I ask is because I ultimately wanted to do the Same speaker set up as you to avoid a Perforated screen. After consulting with BPape he informed me that the speaker placement I wanted to do was bad for Imaging. I was going to put my mains on each sides of my 10 foot wide screen in my 15 foot wide room which would of given me 2.5 feet of space on each side for my 14" wide speakers.

Ruben

Hi Bud,

I had thought you had planned to put your center channel above the screen. I know with our HT rooms we have to make a lot of compromises, was this one of them? Did you run out of room above the screen?

D. Erskine has said if you cannot mount your center channel behind the screen then go above it. It is much more difficult for the human ear to localize the sound the higher it is and it will sound more like it is coming from the actors on the screen rather than below it. I'm not criticizing it, just curious. My last room had the ctr. channel below as well and it still sounded very good although sometimes it did sound like the voices weren't anchored to the actors.

I like how you worked out your sub location problem it looks great.

Rob :)

Looks great so far, and is what I would have probably ultimately decided as well. :) I'm also wondering about the center channel placement..

Bud,

Looks like its all working out pretty well. Can you post an updated schematic of your final screen wall design with dimensions for reference.

Hey guys. Lots of questions. Let me address them in order.

Ruben,

Absolutely too close to the corners, but I don't have a lot of width. The only way to get more room in the corners is to go smaller on the screen. I also really wanted to go above the screen with the center channel as well, but again, just not enough room. I would have had to deal with the reflections off the soffit as well. I do plan on Linacoustic on the back wall, a few feet on the sides and in front of the screen as well as the soffits. I realize that the back row will suffer some, but I expect to be sitting in the front row.

Rob,

Yes, definitely a compromise. You also nailed it, out of room. It would have just been too tight. I also spent a lot of time thinking, tinkering and staring at the screen over the weekend and decided to take the crown around the whole room, where as before I was going to stop at the screen wall. I think it'll give me a more finished look. That's why you see the extra board up there to ensure I have a nailing surface for the crown. I'm pretty happy with the way I think the sub will come out. I was a little nervous about it until I saw where the screen ended up. I also had to rip out one of the top boards where the frame was boxed for the screen to give me just a little more height, so lost some more real estate there.

Tim,

I know, I know. I wanted it above, but I also wanted the screen exactly where it ended up AND I still got the sub I wanted. Like I said, I'm more of a video guy than and audio guy...

Mike,

I'll be happy to post a new drawing with dimensions once I finish up the last few things on it.

Bud

Well if it makes you feel any better, I definitely Vote for the Bigger Screen instead of the better speaker placement. :)

Right Now I have a 62" Toshiba DLP in my Family Room and when someone told me to do a 90" screen in the Dedicated theater because it was the national code recommended size, I thought, what's the point of building a whole dedicated theater with a 90" screen? I mind as well stick with my 62" toshiba.

Too many people here are worried about the rules of the 1.2 x width verses seating distance. It all comes down to what the individual likes in the end.

To me, this is all about that "Big Screen Experience" in your crib, Ya Dig? :D

Ruben

Ruben,

I dig. You try and do your best to follow the guidelines, but sometimes you have to stray for a variety of reasons, but mostly it comes down to room limitations, measurements and funding.

BTW, I have a 51" Hitachi in the family room and when I came up yesterday after watching the NFL playoffs some, I was like "Man, that TV looks so small". The screen is four times its size. Pretty amazing. That was my own "wow factor". :p

Bud

Bud,

I have learned so much reading your thread. Thanks.

BTW do you ever sleep? You post at all hours :D

Bud...

You framing job looks great!! You banged that up pretty quick after a redesign! :D

The sub fits nicely! I have one question. I'm not sure how you are covering your floor, or what you'll be finishing the front of the wall with, but do you need the 2x4 that is in front of the sub?! It seems like you could cut that segment out, and make for easier removal and replacement of the sub without having to lift it over that bottom plate!

I think the angles for the columns give some nice interest to them.

Sean

R-U-Q-R-U,

Good! I'm glad. Thanks. I'm one of those 5-6 hour sleepers with maybe an extra hour on the weekends. Kids will do that to you. When you finally get the kids to bed is when you have some time to yourself and they're up at the crack of dawn ....

Bud

Hey Sean,

Actually, the angled piece you see won't be attached. It's there until I get my screws to put it together. That piece will reside on top, which will be supported by a vertical piece and there will be another angled piece from there to the screen wall. It'll be completely open on the bottom.

Planning on black GOM on the front wall. I'll have to build some speaker grill type covers to cover the sub areas and then again for the speakers. I think I may attempt to angle the wall slightly for the speakers as well, still need to think through that. It'll give it some visual interest versus a flat wall all the way across. I plan on black rug across the stage and still need to create a lip for it.

The redo wasn't bad really. It helps to have a sawsall, compound mitre and a framing nailer. I spent more time staring and thinking about it than actually doing it!

Bud

I spent more time staring and thinking about it than actually doing it!

Bud
Bud,

I think we work the same way. I spend both Sat and Sunday working and got stuff done - but not as much as I had hoped. Since I have kids too, weekdays between 8PM and 10:30PM are my prime time to work on the HT. I feel like I'm on my own time while in the garage working and can run at my own speed. However, I think I'm really burned out on "Josh Tesh Radio".. it's the only station my $10 Walgreens radio will pickup. Maybe I need to get something better for the garage ;)

Can't say I blame you. I would've been burnt out in about 5 seconds with JT on the radio. Ugh!

Bud

I plan on black rug across the stage and still need to create a lip for it. Bud

You probably already know this, but in case not, you can use a half round for the lip.

As far as what You and Swithey said about spending more time thinking and looking than building, I can definitely relate. Sometimes I spend hours in the room thinking up ideas. More time goes into thinking than actually building over here. that's for sure.

Ruben

Actually, was looking for it at Home Depot. Need to take a ride over to their competitors to see if they have it. Thought about ripping some large dowels and even construction something from 1/4 rounds. I know they have at the trim place that was mentioned a few weeks ago, I may just wait until I get up there to get the stain grade stuff.

Bud

They should have boards for the horizontal part ("run") of steps at any lumber shop.. Ask them about that, and see what they come up with..

Took a half a day off today and finished the sub sections of the screen wall. I need one more 2x4 to finish out the proscenium because I cut one board short (56.5 versus 65.5... crap!). I also put linacoustic behind the screen wall and then ran out of time. I did pick up 5/4 lumber at HD today, so I can do around the baseboard, doors and up around ceiling for the crown. The cameras battery went dead, so I didn't get a full screenwall shot.

Left sub box:
http://images15.fotki.com/v268/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0233-vi.jpg

Right sub box:
http://images16.fotki.com/v276/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0234-vi.jpg

Here's my HD run. Anyone need nails? Got some for every registered AVSer.
http://images15.fotki.com/v269/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0232-vi.jpg

Bud

Bud

I started with 5lb drywall screw boxes. I quickly realized to get the 25lb pail.

Larry

Yep, a huge price difference.. I've gone through several 25lb pails as well, for my remodeling.

The proscenium is looking great, Bud! I can't wait to see it with the GoM.

Hey guys. Question. Since I need to build grills to cover the speakers and allow me access, I was thinking of using these Magnetic Grill Guides (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=329-045) from Parts Express.

http://www.partsexpress.com/images/329-045m.jpg

My only concern is if they'll affect the speakers. I actually ordered a set when I ordered something else. I was very impressed on the strength of these suckers. I mean I could not pull them apart with my fingers, I actually had to pry them apart with a knife. I also bought the Heavy Duty Grill Guides (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=260-367) just in case.

What do you think?

Bud

Camera battery is recharged. Here's a shot of the screen wall now. Notice the left side proscenium isn't done yet because I need that 2x4.

http://images16.fotki.com/v271/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0235-vi.jpg

Bud

Bud...

MAN!! That's looking fantastic my friend!!

You should have reaper bang you out an updated design with the new screen wall and some color choises, cause it's not far now!!

Sean

I also bought the Heavy Duty Grill Guides (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=260-367) just in case.

What do you think?

Bud


No experience with the magnets, but I used the heavy duty guides for my grills and they work well. I drilled a pilot hole through the grill and into my colums so I knew exactly where to drill the holes for the guides.

Your screen wall looks great. I like your solution for the sub placement, that bottom right corner of the screen wall would be perfect for another sub.

My only concern is if they'll have any ill affects on the speakers. I actually ordered a set when I ordered something else. I was very impressed on the strength of these suckers. I mean I could not pull them apart with my fingers, I actually had to pry them apart with a knife. I also bought the Heavy Duty Grill Guides (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=260-367) just in case.

What do you think?

Bud

Hey Bud...my Klipsch Reference speakers have the magnetic grill guides rather than the plastic heavy duty ones like you also mentioned. I much prefer the magnetic ones. They just have a better feel to them and I can't imagine how they would affect the speakers negatively. My old speakers had the plastic ones and they became loose fitting over time. I'm going with the magnetic ones. Thanks for the link BTW, these were exactly what I was thinking of getting. I only wish I saw the link 2 days ago when I ordered my grill cloth from them.

Thanks guys. Its coming along nicely (and slowly).

One reason I'm leaning towards the magnets is the furring strips. Where the furring strips on the wall meet the 2x4s for the proscenium, I'm going to lose an inch of the 2x4, which means I need to widen the 2x4 on the wall to have the necessary surface area for the grill guides. Now, if I end the furring strip an inch or so from the 2x4 on the side wall, I can staple the GOM on the side of the furring strip that faces the screen wall. It also allows me to "slip" the grill in between the furring strip and the proscenium without any obstruction. Like this:

http://images16.fotki.com/v274/photos/6/649633/3018602/Magnetdraw-vi.jpg

Bud

Bud,

I like the idea of the magnets too. -- go for it. I may do the same thing. Luckily, I have not made my Parts Express order yet. I wonder if they would be strong enough to hold fabric wall panels (assuming I had them in the corners and a few along the parameter). It sure would be easier than building french cleats to hold them on.. hmmm

Steve,

Buy a set, they're cheap. I'm amazed how strong these things are. I would think depending on how big the panels are and the material used, it should work. Worst cast you can use them to put your kids artwork on the fridge, although not sure you'd ever get them off.

Bud

Not much to add. Just wanted to compliment you on your progress and thank you for your time put into educating us. Looks great.

Z06Racer,

Thanks and welcome.

Bud

Those magnets look like a great solution. I might be able to use them for my removable panels. Do you think 8 of them would hold a GPowers' type fabric fram up that is 24"wide x 60" tall?

J-dubb

Those magnets look like a great solution. I might be able to use them for my removable panels. Do you think 8 of them would hold a GPowers' type fabric fram up that is 24"wide x 60" tall?

J-dubb

Not sure, I guess it depends on what you make them out off. I'll have to prototype something and try it I guess. They are cheap though, so you could try it and worse case you lose 5 bucks. I probably won't get to mine for a week or two. I'll post my results.

Bud

Damn Bud, are you for hire!... You are kicking a.. my friend. A true inspiration to us all.

Drew

Hi Bud,

I have been looking for something just like that for my speaker covers as well. Looks like just what I need, I wanted something that doesn't require alot of depth. I will be interested to see how they work out.

Keep up the good work. I finally started my own thread and I will slowly catch up on it to where I am now....only a 1 1/2 years later.

Thanks Drew. Hopefully I can get the furring strips and Linacoustic up this weekend. I've been neglecting to measure the rooms for molding, but will also do that this weekend and get it ordered on Monday.

Bud

Rob,

Thanks and glad the magnetics will work out for you. Don't worry about how long it takes, it'll be done before you know it. I tell ya, I'll be bored silly when its all said and done.

Bud

Camera battery is recharged. Here's a shot of the screen wall now. Notice the left side proscenium isn't done yet because I need that 2x4.


Bud


droool...That screen looks SAWEEEET! Excellent job on the proscenium. Even if it is not done yet, that is a perfect replication of the drawing. Fantastic work as always.
:D
Jason

Bud,

I have not seen your thread in a while.
Great work. I bet you can almost taste it at this point. :)
I have a question. Perhaps this has been discussed already, but are you going to leave the proscenium open and just cover it with fabric or are you going to go the traditional route and use MDF then cover MDF with fabric?

Craig