Blazing Ridge Cinema construction has begun! [Text View] - Page 6

chinadog

03-30-06, 09:48 AM

Tank,

I've heard you can use 3/4 inch without a problem. The linacoustic will compress some. I was originally going to use 2X lumber and rip them down to 1" furring strips, but found 5/4 (five quarter) lumber at Home Depot in the hardwood section. It's actual width is 1". I think its about 4-5 inches wide and 9 feet long. I just ripped/beveled them in half for the middle of the wall seams, but used them full width around the areas that I'll install the molding over. I didn't plan on a chair rail to hide the seams. Depending on how it comes out, I can also go back and add it to break it up some.

The GOM is pretty tough. I tried to pull it off a spot where I put a staple in it and it took a good yank. Its got some stretch to it, but not that much. Sagging and stretching should not be a problem if it's secured properly. It does cut pretty easily though, so sharp objects are a no-no.

On the batting, I think people think they need to put something behind the GOM to fill the void. There is some acoustic properties for highs with batting as well. I originally was going to Linacoustic the soffits, but decided not to do so after speaking with Bryan about it. I was then stuck with a void behind the soffit GOM of 1", but you'd never tell. It's pretty tight. I have the batting in the other room. Bryan's analysis doesn't call for it, so I'm not putting it up.

Bud

chinadog

03-30-06, 09:51 AM

I am considering that. I only need like 60'. Thats about $70 from novelty lights. Might be worth then extra $35 to have a spare 90' for "future" projects (or to replace this rope lighting when it burns out).

I may also go LED rope lighting, but 60' of that would cost me about $400 from this place http://www.wiedamark.com/. Good stuff but may be a bit pricey for such a small length.

I like to have the spare stuff for when/if any sections burn out. I can replace it in no time flat. I only need about 40 feet, so that's enough to replace it two times. I also have it for those other occasions when I need it.

bpape

03-30-06, 10:21 AM

HeyNow^

03-30-06, 10:22 AM

I bought a 150' spool of clear. As everyone already knows, the clear yellows over time. I replace my rope every couple of years. You will use whats left on future projects as well.

ginigma

03-30-06, 11:35 AM

I may also go LED rope lighting, but 60' of that would cost me about $400 from this place http://www.wiedamark.com/. Good stuff but may be a bit pricey for such a small length.What product are you specifically looking at there? I'm looking at the LED flex neon http://www.wiedamark.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=139
Anyone have any experience with this?

chinadog

03-30-06, 01:31 PM

My 35W PARs arrived for my 4" cans today. I needed five, but you have to buy by the case. So, I ended up with 15! Not a problem, I'll have neough for the next 10 years. They're much cheaper to buy online, even if you have to get a case. I bought these through PECLamp.com (http://store.peclamp.com/31014c.html) and they were less than 3.00 each.

I also bought a case of 65W BR30 Sylvanias for the rest of the larger floods. 30 to a case, I think I neeed 21. The case was 46.50 plus shipping. I little cheaper than 7.00 a bulb at Home Depot. I got these through Goodmart.com (http://www.goodmart.com/products/33209.htm).

When I ordered my trims and baffles, I also picked up 5 of the socket extenders (http://www.lighting-fixtures-ceiling-fans.com/store/PPF/parameters/1308_0/more_info.asp) for the 4" cans. Since I had to build the frames around the cans to staples the GOM to and though I'd be doing linacoustic under the soffits, I picked them up. Turns out I ended up needing them. Kinda pricey for what they are, but does the trick. Here a shot of the bulb and extender.
http://images17.fotki.com/v293/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0693-vi.jpg

Although I still need to make the rings for the trims, I went ahead and installed them and the bulbs. Here's what it looks like with the third bulb and the trim now.
http://images1.fotki.com/v290/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0694-vi.jpg

Flash on from the side:
http://images3.fotki.com/v24/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0695-vi.jpg

Flash off from the side:
http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0696-vi.jpg

The middle buld looks a little yellowish from the picture, but in person, not a hint of yellow with me looking at it.

Bud

bdtank

03-30-06, 01:45 PM

Bud-thanks so much for the quick response-I'll probably end up going the 3/4 route since I have a bunch of stock on hand. I'm hoping the linacoustic will not decompress enough to put pressure behind the GOM to cause a bulge. I need swim trunks, not a Speedo :) Thanks again.

Brad

bdtank

03-30-06, 01:53 PM

If you want something behind the GOM just for rigidity purposes, I've seen some people use styro- board 1" thick. It's basically inert acoustically but will tend to damp the drywall which would negate any positive effect in terms of bass absorbtion. All a matter of priorities.

bpape- thanks for the tip. My intention is to put the batting up for both filler and remedial sound treatment purposes from what I've gleaned in various posts on the subject (many of them yours in fact). I am such a newbie at this and trying to get my arms around all the nuances of sound properties while building my theater room is a bit like watching my 5yr old son spinning in circles until he can't stand anymore. The more I think-the more dangerous I get :)

chinadog

03-30-06, 02:09 PM

air2mag

03-30-06, 02:32 PM

Bud,
What brand of canned lighting did you go with? I looked through the thread but couldn't find it. I have been looking at the 5" Juno IC remodel style. Once my false wall is completed my room will be 17'X 15'. Based on what you have now, do you think 3 rows of two cans each will be enough for my room? Thanks!

Mike

chinadog

03-30-06, 03:21 PM

Mike,

I used Halo for the 6" cans, purchased from Home Depot by the box of 6. They were model number H7ICTs. The 4" cans were also Halos, model H99ICT from Lighting Fixtures & Ceiling Fans (http://www.lighting-fixtures-ceiling-fans.com/store/PPF/parameters/674_59/more_info.asp). I bought the trims and baffles for all my cans through them as well.

As far as your room dimensions are concerned, I would think so. The four cans I have is plenty for general lighting for my sized room (in addition to the accent lighting). In my other room in the basement, I used four cans per 16 foot x 12 foot section. Now if it was a kitchen, I'd say maybe not because you need task lighting. It also depends on how high your ceilings are. Lower ceiling will tend to reduce the circle of light put out by the cans (say my father-in-law).

Here's a good guide I refer to and point people to when the question comes up, hope it helps.

How to lay out recessed cans (http://www.forteelectric.com/Howtolayoutcans.html)

BTW, people moan about Halo quality and rattles. I wrapped the arms of the cans with electrical tape as a precaution and have not heard a sound.

Bud

swithey

03-30-06, 05:36 PM

What product are you specifically looking at there? I'm looking at the LED flex neon http://www.wiedamark.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=139
Anyone have any experience with this?
This is what I was thinking about -- LED Rope lighting:
http://www.wiedamark.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=201

However, the flex stuff would give a really even glow across the entire length. But at $29/ft, it's little over budget for me.

Milt99

03-30-06, 07:11 PM

Milt, where are your pictures, man?
Uh, on my PC. I spend too much time looking at your thread to post them. ;)
I plan on doing some in the near future.
I'm a little self-conscious about it I guess.

I got the Olfa cutter at Jo-Ann's Fabric.
Once again, looking good Bud!

ginigma

03-30-06, 08:50 PM

This is what I was thinking about -- LED Rope lighting:
http://www.wiedamark.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=201

However, the flex stuff would give a really even glow across the entire length. But at $29/ft, it's little over budget for me.Yeah, once I put it "in the cart" and saw the price for 30ft I decided I can live without that. I'll look into regular rope lighting. Another place I found in another thread is http://www.christmaslightsetc.com/rope-light.asp

chinadog

03-31-06, 07:07 AM

OK, here's an update to my light controller situation. I did talk to a person from Smarthome the other day about the Insteon controller. She was pretty knowledgeable with their products and after going back and forth with some ideas, she recommended a Powerlinc Controller (Model 1132CU) (http://www.smarthome.com/1132CU.HTML). I was a little skeptical, but understood what she was thinking. I went ahead and ordered it and it arrived yesterday.

The PowerLinc Controller is a "stand-alone home automation interface for controlling lights, appliances, heating/air conditioning systems and alarm systems" that you set up using your computer via a USB connection. It comes with software for setup, although its limited functionality because its a free version. I installed the software and plugged the unit in and away I went.

It works as advertised. I spent all this cash on an Omni Pro home automation system when the house was built and I'm amazed that you can spend 70.00 and get a lot of the same functionality.

I was able to setup scenes based on triggers for "premovie", "movietime" and "pause" pretty quickly. Basically, I have six X10 dimmers I want to control in the theater room and concession area. My controller (SMST6) that I have on the wall is fine for for controller the dimmers from the door, but for me to use it with a remote, I have to point at it (does not receive X10 signals, only transmits). Enter the PowerLinc. I set up a dummy X10 housecode (B8) for movietime and pause. When I sent the B8 address "ON", it triggers all the dimmers to the settings I want. (Rope light at 20%, riser light 20%, all other switches off). When I hit pause on the Harmony 880, it sends the signal "OFF" to the address, which triggers the "pause scene" and raises certain lights. Of course you need an IR543 to convert the IR signals from the H880 to X10 to do the scenes, but I had that already.

So far so good. I need some more time with it, but it seems to work as I want it to. You can apparently do much more with it as well. It's a decent alternative. I'll post more when I can about the setup. After programming it, I just stuck it in an outlet in my equipment closet and off we went.

Bud

swithey

03-31-06, 10:13 AM

mastiff34

03-31-06, 10:20 AM

Bud,
Thats fantastic, thanks for posting about the Powerlink, I think I will also go this way instead of a Graphic Eye.

I want to insteon my entire house anyways =).

ikeb

03-31-06, 10:35 AM

i just finished converting my whole house to insteon - converted all switches to keypadlincs and switchlinc dimmers and switchlinc relays. All lamps now have lamplincs. Am waiting for the new software that reads and writes to these objects. Also, waiting for motion sensors, thermostats, watering timmers and ir->rf converter - have everything working the way i want, but the software is the key - it will be out soon. All in all installed about 60 devices.

I'm very happy with the insteon - i considered x10, but prefered the newer technology for the long run.

jandawil

03-31-06, 11:10 AM

Bud,

Thanks for the detail on this item. I was hoping Insteon would come out with their own device that had functionality like this. This until is GREAT for X10, etc but it lacks the 2-way communication Insteon offers (which is why I like Insteon). I just keep saying to myself that by the time I'm ready to buy this stuff (hmm, in the next 4 weeks or so) they'll have an IR543 equivalent and something like the Powerlinc controller available. Yea, Yea -- I know, what have I've been smok'n :D

Please continue to tell us how it works as I may just have to get one too to get what I want unless I take the plunge and get something like Homeseer.

Hey Steve and Bud....keep me posted. I have the Insteon solution with the keypad dimmer as well and will be looking for the best way to control it with a remote. As of now I only have the Yamaha 2600 remote which will not do RF. Hey Bud...isn't the Harmony 880 IR only?? How do you get it to work with X10 or RF or am I better off calling Smarthome and letting them know my situation and what I am after?? Thanks guys.

swithey

03-31-06, 11:33 AM

Hey Steve and Bud....keep me posted. I have the Insteon solution with the keypad dimmer as well and will be looking for the best way to control it with a remote. As of now I only have the Yamaha 2600 remote which will not do RF. Hey Bud...isn't the Harmony 880 IR only?? How do you get it to work with X10 or RF or am I better off calling Smarthome and letting them know my situation and what I am after?? Thanks guys.'
Jon,

You can use ANY IR remote. You just need to buy the IR543 that converts IR to X10 commands.

http://www.smarthome.com/4040.HTML

herdfan

03-31-06, 11:42 AM

I want to insteon my entire house anyways =).
Don't want to high-jack Bud's thread, but if you are doing much with Insteon, you need this software www.power-home.com I have 61 devices (20+ more to go) and over 800 links. Its linking capabilities are incredible. Without it, I would not be as far into Insteon as I am.

jandawil

03-31-06, 11:43 AM

'
Jon,

You can use ANY IR remote. You just need to buy the IR543 that converts IR to X10 commands.

http://www.smarthome.com/4040.HTML

Got it...and than just assign X10 addresses to the Insteon dimmers????

chinadog

03-31-06, 12:44 PM

I just got back to my desk. I guess I hit a chord here with the controller. Besides the posts, I got a phone call from Jason shortly after he read the post.....

Bud

chinadog

03-31-06, 12:45 PM

Got it...and than just assign X10 addresses to the Insteon dimmers????

Jon

You can assigned X10 addresses to Insteon devices. Check out the Smarthome link.

http://www.smarthome.com/whatisinsteon.html

I was going to orginally use the Insteon controller to control my X10 dimmer scenes. I think that would still have worked. Since the Insteon controller I was looking at could receive and transmit, I think that would have worked. I may buy one just to play around with it.

Steve is correct, you just need the IR543 to convert IR to X10.

Bud

chinadog

03-31-06, 12:49 PM

Don't want to high-jack Bud's thread, but if you are doing much with Insteon, you need this software www.power-home.com I have 61 devices (20+ more to go) and over 800 links. Its linking capabilities are incredible. Without it, I would not be as far into Insteon as I am.

Thanks for that. I'll take a look when I can. I have the Omni Pro software, which really sucks. I know a lot of people use Homeseer with the Omni Pro, so will have to check for compatibility.

Bud

jandawil

03-31-06, 12:53 PM

Jon

You can assigned X10 addresses to Insteon devices. Check out the Smarthome link.

http://www.smarthome.com/whatisinsteon.html

I was going to orginally use the Insteon controller to control my X10 dimmer scenes. I think that would still have worked. Since the Insteon controller I was looking at could receive and transmit, I think that would have worked. I may buy one just to play around with it.

Steve is correct, you just need the IR543 to convert IR to X10.

Bud

I have the keypad dimmer (http://www.smarthome.com/2486d.html) from Insteon which I believe acts as the controller. It will controll the other Insteon dimmers.

I was wanting to use the Yamaha remote for now. I just need something that will convert the IR signal to X10 so it can opperate the keypad. On your Harmony remote, when you hit pause and the lights will go to the "pause scene" is that a macro that does that?? This is one area I still need to do much research on.

chinadog

03-31-06, 01:16 PM

I have the keypad dimmer (http://www.smarthome.com/2486d.html) from Insteon which I believe acts as the controller. It will controll the other Insteon dimmers.

I was wanting to use the Yamaha remote for now. I just need something that will convert the IR signal to X10 so it can opperate the keypad. On your Harmony remote, when you hit pause and the lights will go to the "pause scene" is that a macro that does that?? This is one area I still need to do much research on.

Jon,

Yeah, that's the controller. but X10 stuff can receive, transmit or both. The Insteon controller is two way (receives commands), which is why I was thinking about it.

Actually, with the H880, you have activities and devices. Activities are like "Watch a DVD". Devices are your components, IR543, projector, etc. You can assign devices to a specific activity. Example. Watch a DVD requires turning on the projector, making sure its on HDMI, turning on the Receiver, changing it to the DVD setting, turning on the DVD player, starting the movie, sending a command to the IR543 (in my case B8 "on" which then activities the scene on the Powelinc I defined with my PC). I've got that working fine.

I'm playing around with the Pause functionality still. You can customize the buttons/actions for a given command. So when you hit pause on the H880, it can send separate commands to all the devices. Even though you mean "Pause the DVD player", you can customize it to do something with that same push of the pause button to all the devices defined under "Watch a DVD". In my case, because of the way the IR543 works, the last X10 command should be "B8 ON". I should be able to define the pause button for IR543 command "OFF" (meaning "B8 OFF" since it remembers the last address sent to the IR543 unless you change it). Soooo, when I hit pause on the H880 it sends a signal to the DVD player to actually pause and sends the IR543 "OFF". I have the "OFF" scene defined to raise the rope light to 50%, concession are 75%, step light 100%, stage light 35%. I just need to test that part. It should work for the "play' button, it just reissues the "ON" command back to B8. Make sense?

I'll play with it and post those results.

Bud

chinadog

03-31-06, 01:30 PM

My GOM arrived for the walls! I also ordered 10 extra feet of the track and that came as well.

http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0700-vi.jpg

Bud

BritInVA

03-31-06, 01:48 PM

Bud - your rooms is looking great and your thread very informative.

I've been looking at these Insteon devices, are the following statements correct?

1) Each Light fixture that needs to be separately controlled should be on its own circuit and will need its own Insteon dimmer switch.

2) The Insteon controller can then be used as a 'master' switch and programed for scenes such as:
a) All On
b) Theater and Stage On, Rope off
c) Theater Dim, Stage Off, Rope On
d) Theater Dim, Stage On, Rope On

3) The Insteon dimmer switch could be in the HT closet with light 'just' controlled by the Insteon controller.

Thanks,
Mark

mastiff34

03-31-06, 01:50 PM

Mark,

I believe everything you said is correct from my research, except the different circuit part. They can all feed off the same 20 amp breaker, its the switches that control it.

-Matt

BritInVA

03-31-06, 02:06 PM

Matt - So the 'feed' from the panel can be the same to supply each Dimmer but will need a Dimmer and load circuit per set of lighting fixtures to be independently controlled.

Thanks,
Mark

suffolk112000

03-31-06, 02:24 PM

Bud, you just keep clipping along. :) Lookin great!!!

How much longer before you are completed?

Craig

chinadog

03-31-06, 02:31 PM

chinadog

03-31-06, 02:32 PM

Hey Craig, thanks.

Trying the get the HT room done in the next few weeks for visitors (minus probably carpet and chairs). The rest of the basement I just need to paint, tile and finish up the bath and do flooring. Maybe be the end of May.

Bud

mastiff34

03-31-06, 02:38 PM

Matt - So the 'feed' from the panel can be the same to supply each Dimmer but will need a Dimmer and load circuit per set of lighting fixtures to be independently controlled.

Thanks,
Mark

Yes. So essential, you could have say 3 lighting switches say:
Rope
HT Main
HT hallway to bathroom

each on the same 15amp circuit, but controlled by 3 Insteon switches/dimmers.

mastiff34

03-31-06, 02:44 PM

Mark,

I'm not up on all the Insteon stuff. Take a look at that link I posted a few replies back to Jon. In X10 land, you can be on completely different circuits/breakers. The issue is the phase and circuits on different sides of the breaker box talking to each other. There are ways around that though with Phase couplers, etc. X10 signals need to be boosted, depending on the square footage of the house, etc. Insteon devices receive the signal/command and repeats it even if its not intended for that device. Sort of like passing the baton. That's my understanding at least. No hands on experience with it. Matt probably knows better.

Bud

I am not sure I know any better, but I tell what I have figured out so far.

Essentially, I look at Insteon as generation 2 of x10, the main benefits are
The 2 way communication where the device actually repsponds to requests for it.
Unlike x10 where its a one way communication channel.

And, the really good thing is each Insteon device in your household acts as a repeater for the signal, so the more devices you add the more reliable your signal.
And it uses RF in addition to your power line wiring so its completely backwards compabilte with x10.

Now the biggest drawback, and I think Bud has already alluded to this is lack of products, but there coming we just gotta be paitent.

Here is a good article on it.
http://www.smarthome.com/whatisinsteon.html

BritInVA

03-31-06, 02:48 PM

Bud/Matt - Thanks for your insight - Hijack over :D

ginigma

03-31-06, 04:08 PM

Bud,

Thanks for the detail on this item. I was hoping Insteon would come out with their own device that had functionality like this. This until is GREAT for X10, etc but it lacks the 2-way communication Insteon offers (which is why I like Insteon). I just keep saying to myself that by the time I'm ready to buy this stuff (hmm, in the next 4 weeks or so) they'll have an IR543 equivalent and something like the Powerlinc controller available. Yea, Yea -- I know, what have I've been smok'n :D

Please continue to tell us how it works as I may just have to get one too to get what I want unless I take the plunge and get something like Homeseer.I've been following the Insteon stuff pretty closely, including purchasing their SDK so I can write (ok, hack) some code. It also gives me access to "inside" information on product releases. There are a lot of products in the pipeline, which is good. EHX is this week, so I would exect to see a lot of press releases about new products.

rsberg34

03-31-06, 05:10 PM

Wow Bud, you ihave made some great progress since I last checked....that will teach me to not stop in for a few days. Do you think you will make theater debut for the incoming visitors? By the look so fthings you will...looking great. You seem to have that GOM pretty much mastered...when it comes time I might have to hit you up for some advice...but thats light years away as it seems. As others have said, those of you that continue to show great detailed pics and give good explinations considerably help those of us that are just beginning or are about to.

Anyway...lookin good keep it up

chinadog

03-31-06, 07:56 PM

If you guys ever get GOM and it has little red tape on it... beware! Look closer at the roll.

http://images34.fotki.com/v1076/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0701-vi.jpg

Umm, someone seamed it together:
http://images1.fotki.com/v4/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0704-vi.jpg

I immediately called fabricmate and they were very cooperative. If I ran into problems they said they'd ship more on Monday.

I managed to get around it. Made some good progress tonight.
http://images1.fotki.com/v6/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0705-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v289/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0706-vi.jpg

Doesn't look as grainy in the pictures, more green. I'm OK with it, not in love with it, but its growing on me.

Bud

chinadog

03-31-06, 07:58 PM

reaper

03-31-06, 08:09 PM

Nice progress. I love the down lighting on the screen. Thanks for keeping us all updated!

chinadog

03-31-06, 09:48 PM

Nice progress. I love the down lighting on the screen. Thanks for keeping us all updated!

Hey man! Thanks. Glad you're still checking it out. I know you're pretty busy with the side business and that wonderful little addition to your family!

Bud

bpape

03-31-06, 11:47 PM

Lookin good bud. You'll be watching movies before you know it.

chinadog

04-01-06, 08:57 PM

Lookin good bud. You'll be watching movies before you know it.

Thanks Bryan. You're kiddin', right? I've probably gotten 250 hours on the lamp already.

Bud

chinadog

04-01-06, 09:17 PM

I few more shots of GOM. I finished the lower portion of the walls today and got the upper portion of the long wall done today as well. I had to cut some more beveled furring, picked up my other door as well as some 2x4s to rip/make panels and a bunch of staples.

Here goes:
http://images1.fotki.com/v8/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0708-vi.jpg
http://images1.fotki.com/v6/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0710-vi.jpg

Couple of things I wanted to share here. First, the length of the GOM with a little extra for the sides walls is 214 inches. I couldn't just roll it out on the floor, there wasn't enough room. I decided to measure out 100 inches at a time and mark both sides with painters tape. I'd also write on the tape the measurement, so I don't confuse it for a different measurement. I'd then roll that back up and roll out another 100 inches and mark it on both sides and mark it at 200. Then roll out the last foot or so and mark it with tape. Now I can draw a straight line and cut it. This method help me keep track of where I was for that piece and made sure I didn't mis-measure.
http://images2.fotki.com/v22/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0711-vi.jpg
http://images2.fotki.com/v22/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0714-vi.jpg

When I did the upper portion of the wall, I would lay it up on the furring strip on the wall and use push pins to hold it. I'd then go down the line stapling the whole piece right on top of the existing GOM on the lower wall. I'd make sure not to step on it and pull the pins out, so I just bunch it up on the floor close to the wall.
http://images5.fotki.com/v68/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0716-vi.jpg

After I had it stapled, I'd take the second piece of furring and lay it up on top of the first, making sure the beveled edge was correct. I then was able to predrill hole to go into the studs (marked by the nails/orange caps holding Linacoustic up). At the end where there was no stud, I used construction adhesive (very carefully, since you don't want it on the fabric). I then used 2 1/2 inch screws and attached the furring to the wall.
http://images115.fotki.com/v683/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0717-vi.jpg

chinadog

04-01-06, 09:32 PM

The next thing I did was pull it up and tack it in loosely using push pins. This GOM is not as durable as the other stuff, so if you pull it too much, it can damage it. When I meant pull it, I mean really pull it.
http://images2.fotki.com/v23/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0718-vi.jpg

I then started at the left side of the wall and started to pull the fabric tight while stapling the side. I left a furring strip to overhang the GOM around which will be hidden by the speaker panel, so I started there and worked my way towards the ceiling. From there, I went left to right stapling and pulling tightly up and away until I got to the end. Once I go to the end, I was started back down towards the until I got to the furring strip, pulling tightly from left to right and stapling. The furring strip is in the corner and the staples will be hidden by the adjacent walls furring strip. As you can see, there is a nice beveled edge on the wall now. If I decide later to put up a chair rail, I can do so, but I like the clean look at the moment. I'll have to take a close up of the beveled seam and post later. Looks deceiving, the seam is at 40 inches.
http://images32.fotki.com/v1108/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0719-vi.jpg

Tomorrow I'll finish up the rest of the fabric and try and get to the new door.

Bud

PamW

04-01-06, 10:35 PM

Keep it up, Bud...you are getting there!!!!

BritInVA

04-01-06, 11:20 PM

Your moving along fast Bud - you will soon be enjoying the fruits of all this hard work.

Mark

chinadog

04-01-06, 11:33 PM

Pam and Mark,

Soon! Very soon!

Bud

rsberg34

04-02-06, 08:55 AM

I like the beveled edge bud...looks very clean and sharp!!

Robert

SmX

04-02-06, 06:45 PM

chinadog

04-02-06, 07:25 PM

Hi Bud, Your coming along nicely. I noticed however that you have allot of pulls/ripples in the top of the botom panel in picture below. This may be because you are not using enough staples and not pulling the fabric in 2 directions as you staple. It happened to me as well when I did the soffit behind my screen and used less staples. Once I added more staples it fixed the issue. Another trick Is to use a Spray adhesive first before stapling, that will keep the fabric in place tightly while stapling.

http://images2.fotki.com/v23/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0718-vi.jpg

Actually, it was the combination of the depth of the staples and the number of staples. Even though I backed off the pressure, I neglected to use the adjustment initially on the staple gun itself. I figured that out. Luckily, the pulls are not noticeable with standard lighting. It can only be seen when I use the halogens or the flash.

Bud

chinadog

04-02-06, 07:32 PM

Here's a few shots from today. I installed the door and finished up the walls. Still need to build my panels to finish the front wall. I made a few mistakes today, but I recovered from them. I'll explain tomorrow. Too tired today to get into it.

http://images2.fotki.com/v23/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0722-vi.jpg
http://images12.fotki.com/v254/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0723-vi.jpg
http://images2.fotki.com/v23/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0726-vi.jpg

Bud

Milt99

04-02-06, 09:34 PM

Looking good Bud.
I know you're working hard, pal.
I looked through your thread to find the exact GOM code you're using and didn't find it.
I know it's the Lido family but from your pics it looks predominately gray.
I'm asking because I got a Lido sample named Yellowstone and it looks nothing
like your pics and all of the other Lido samples on the GOM site are even more different.
Trying to pick GOM colors is frustrating, so many but not the right one(s).
I finished my columns in basic black.
At this point I'm thinking all Charcoal, screw it.

chinadog

04-02-06, 10:47 PM

Milt,

It's actually a greenish color with some grey and black. Check this post out: Post 1039 - New GOM Samples (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7286119&&#post7286119)

It's called Pine Valley. You can order good sized samples from Guilford of Maine through the website at www.guilfordofmaine.com for free, but you can only order a few at a time. You'll have them in less than a week. Another good source for online samples is Silent Source (http://www.silentsource.com/gom_index.html). Don't make a hasty decision, it'll be a pain in the butt to remove later!

Bud

ebr

04-02-06, 10:53 PM

bbboza

04-02-06, 11:01 PM

Coming up nicely Bud!

Keep up the amazing work! :)

garykagan

04-02-06, 11:57 PM

Looking really great Bud, very nice!

Gary

chinadog

04-03-06, 12:29 AM

Hey Bud - great progress.

Don't take the following question the wrong way (cuz I like Insteon and am putting it in my new house) but...just curious...when you add up all that you've had to put together to get good scene control from your IR remote, is it over $545 (the online cost of a GE)...?

:|

Yes, after all the dimmers and the controls, you're about in the same ball park. It's the 6 dimmers that did it. They're cheaper now, too! I've been pretty happy with my X10 stuff and I have the whole house automation thing, so that was the deciding factor for me. I was biased going in.

Bud

chinadog

04-03-06, 12:31 AM

Gary and bbboza,

Thanks! Been a long journey.

Bud

chinadog

04-03-06, 11:17 AM

Well, I've had my second gallon of coffee this AM, took a few Advil and I'm feeling a little better, although little stiff. Its tough getting old.

I wanted to document a few mistakes so others don't repeat them.

As Ruben eluded to, you need a lot of staples for this stuff. Definitely get a good staple gun. When I did the soffits, it went pretty smooth. The Lido material was not as stiff as the FR701. When you staple the material I really tried to pull it taunt. Even doing so, the staples went below the surface and would pull strands of the material (think runs, although no that bad). You need to adjust the pressure and the depth of the staples. To get an even tightness of the material you need to use whole lot of staples. If you look close under the right light you can see some very tightly pulled lines in the material when the staples pulled it.

Measure twice and cut once! I made the dreaded mistake of starting to cut the material and realized that I messed up. I was cutting the back wall, which had a rough measurement of 140 inches. The side walls were 214 inches. I laid out the material for the back wall and started to cut 114 inches! Luckily I only cut 18 inches width-wise when I realized. I was able to roll out the material at cut it at 214. The initial cut full in the middle of the HT door, so I got lucky and was able to use it.

On the corners and beveled edge. Looks nice, I like it. When you do the "staple on the side, wrap and put the furring strip in the corner method", make sure of a few things.

Staple the correct side of the furring strip. I stapled the front side, not the hidden side, so I ended up cutting the furring strip off and doing it over. Luckily, I had enough extra even cutting off a few inches.

Watch the fingers. Yes, I put one side of the staple through my finger. I stapled it too close to the edge and it came out the other side when I was trying to pull the material tight. I used 1 inch staples, so it went in and I pulled my finger away quickly when I realized what happened. Luckily it didn't hit the bone.

I precut all my top furring strips with the beveled edge and labeled them. I measured my corner furring for the hidden seams, put them up temporarily, then temporarily put up the upper piece of GOM. I would then put a bunch of push pins in the temp furring strip so I knew exactly where to staple for the hidden corner. I pulled it all down and then stapled the furring strip to the material and rehung. What I neglected to do here was to put the horizontal beveled edge strip in before I measured for the corner. Turns out after handing the corner and putting in the first horizontal piece and staple that I realized the second piece of horizontal beveled edge to complete the wall was about two inches too long. Odd. Turns out I made the corner piece too long and I have two inches of furring thats not beveled in one corner. It was too late to go back. Oh well. (If this is confusing, I'll post a drawing. I have one picture on this).

When I stapled around the outlets and switches, I strayed some. I need to go get oversize plate to cover some staples. I'll also need to build a little extension for my step lights, there is just not overlapped metal to cover the area stapled.

Bud

GPowers

04-03-06, 01:19 PM

sdspga

04-03-06, 01:22 PM

chinadog

04-03-06, 02:10 PM

The fabric looks great.

You must have nerves of steel to cut into the GOM using lengths of 214 inches. If you screw up it is a very costly mistake. The though of trying to staple fabric along the entire length of a room was well beyond me. Trying to find a cost effect solution drove me nuts.

With the fabric frames the risk is much smaller. Installation just takes a lot more time.

But you are almost there. When does the carpet go in?

Greg,

I figured if I messed up the 214 inches, I could use most of it on back wall. I added maybe 6 inches onto the length of the sidewalls, so I felt pretty comfortable and doubled check the measurements like 4 times. I had a brain fart when I did the miscut.

I don't have a schedule yet on the carpet, although not that the fabric is up, I have a pretty good idea of what the carpet is going to look like. I'm still out on whether to do the carpet on the stage or just carpet the stage black. I also want to get the flooring in the concession area done first, I think I'll go with with a laminate in there and be done with it. This way the carpet installs can make the where they meet nice and I don't have to worry about it.

Still got plenty to do still. Need to make my speaker panels. Hopefully this week.

Bud

chinadog

04-03-06, 02:12 PM

Thanks for sharing the lessons learned, Bud. Everything is really looking great! I really appreciate the time you are taking to get pics up and post your thoughts. Hope you're not like me, I start getting excited (sloppy) towards the end of a project because I cannot wait to see the finished product. Continued best wishes.

Scott

Scott,

Thanks and no problem on the info. I'm not trying to rush, I'm trying to use my time more wisely, although the wife might argue with that logic.

Bud

ronnie_jackson

04-03-06, 02:20 PM

GPowers

04-03-06, 02:29 PM

I'm still out on whether to do the carpet on the stage or just carpet the stage black.

Bud

We are having the stage redone. The guy who did the orginal carpet install did not know how to do the radius/overhang. He messed it up. The screw ups are hard to see but I see them.

So I talked to a guy over the weekend about redoing the stage. He said he can get the same carpet, but I thing we are going to change the stage to black. Both the top and front of the stage.

barhoram

04-03-06, 02:50 PM

chinadog

04-03-06, 03:04 PM

Bud,

How are you doing to cutout for the outlets/switches? Are you putting the GOM up and then cutting the GOM for the outlets/switches after it is on the wall? Or are you precutting the holes? What are you using? blade? Scissors? Staple it before you cut? I am at this point, and was wondering the easiest way to do this. Thanks.

Sorry about not addressing that. I put the GOM over the switches and outlets, stapled as closely as possible. I'd then use scissors, snip in the middle then work my way towards the sides. From there you trim off the excess. I bought midway plates for the outlets and switches (there are three sizes of wallplates - standard, midway and jumbo), but I think I'll need to get the jumbo ones. I'm not thrilled about, they're large, but oh well. It's tough getting close blind. I think some people, in preparation for GOM adjust adjusted the boxes out slightly. to give them a pronounced edge to use as a guide. I have the adjustable boxes, I just forgot to do so.

Bud

chinadog

04-03-06, 03:06 PM

We are having the stage redone. The guy who did the orginal carpet install did not know how to do the radius/overhang. He messed it up. The screw ups are hard to see but I see them.

So I talked to a guy over the weekend about redoing the stage. He said he can get the same carpet, but I thing we are going to change the stage to black. Both the top and front of the stage.

I'd like to see pictures when you're done.

Bud

chinadog

04-03-06, 03:10 PM

Looking good Bud. I think you need to take a week off and let the batteries charge up again :)

I was out of town all last week, so no theater work for me. I think it helped because I was getting to the point where I was burning out and couldnt make clear decisions anymore. Its that theater blind thing.

Keep up the good work..... and Relax a little. :D Company can always come back later.

Ronnie

Ronnie,

Thanks. It may be a slow week, this week. I was going to take a few days off (from work), but it may be next week instead.

I got my Dremel circle cutting tool today. I have a bunch of little things like that to do still. I still need to do the rope light tracks, hook up the IR, do the extended trims for the 4" cans and extended trim for the step lights. I'm hoping to start staining this week too, but that may wait.

I'll work on the projector box on the weekend maybe.

Bud

chinadog

04-03-06, 07:14 PM

Actually, with the H880, you have activities and devices. Activities are like "Watch a DVD". Devices are your components, IR543, projector, etc. You can assign devices to a specific activity. Example. Watch a DVD requires turning on the projector, making sure its on HDMI, turning on the Receiver, changing it to the DVD setting, turning on the DVD player, starting the movie, sending a command to the IR543 (in my case B8 "on" which then activities the scene on the Powelinc I defined with my PC). I've got that working fine.

I'm playing around with the Pause functionality still. You can customize the buttons/actions for a given command. So when you hit pause on the H880, it can send separate commands to all the devices. Even though you mean "Pause the DVD player", you can customize it to do something with that same push of the pause button to all the devices defined under "Watch a DVD". In my case, because of the way the IR543 works, the last X10 command should be "B8 ON". I should be able to define the pause button for IR543 command "OFF" (meaning "B8 OFF" since it remembers the last address sent to the IR543 unless you change it). Soooo, when I hit pause on the H880 it sends a signal to the DVD player to actually pause and sends the IR543 "OFF". I have the "OFF" scene defined to raise the rope light to 50%, concession are 75%, step light 100%, stage light 35%. I just need to test that part. It should work for the "play' button, it just reissues the "ON" command back to B8. Make sense?

I'll play with it and post those results.

Bud
Here are the results working with the H880. I was able to control the light scene when I hit the "pause" button on the remote. I was able to change the light scene back when I hit "play". Took some fooling around with, but seems to work pretty well. I may have to fine tune some timings, etc., but thats the easy part.

The first shot here is the Smarthome Manager software triggers (on the left). This is the software that comes with the PowerLinc Controller. I used B8 as a dummy X10 device that I can send an ON of OFF signal to. I send "ON" when either I click on the "Watch a DVD" activity on the remote, or when I hit "Play" on the remote for the DVD player. When I click on "Pause" during a movie, it sends it "OFF" and runs that scene (a series of events, if you will). I also added a B9 device that I used to trigger as part of the shutdown activity, (turn lights up for exiting, shuts off all the equipment).
http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/3402899/PowerLincScenerControl-vi.jpg

This shot shows the setup for "watch a DVD". These are commands it issues:
http://images16.fotki.com/v287/photos/6/649633/3402899/H880DVD-vi.jpg

The tricky part was customizing the hardcoded buttons on the remote for Pause and Play. When You hit a button, you can define a command it sends to each device. That's it though. ONE command. So in order to add the control to the Pause button, I had to define an extra IR543 device. When you hit Pause, the first instance sends "LIGHT8" and the second instance sends "ON". When you hit Play, the first instance of the IR543 again sends "LIGHT8" and the second device sends "OFF". The IR543 then converts the commands to B8 ON or B8 OFF and the PowerLinc Controller just runs its events based on the trigger.
http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/3402899/H880PauseandPlay-vi.jpg

Bud

ebr

04-03-06, 10:06 PM

ronnie_jackson

04-03-06, 10:35 PM

I think he answered it in post 1321 above.

Yes, after all the dimmers and the controls, you're about in the same ball park. It's the 6 dimmers that did it. They're cheaper now, too! I've been pretty happy with my X10 stuff and I have the whole house automation thing, so that was the deciding factor for me. I was biased going in.

Bud

chinadog

04-03-06, 11:33 PM

Good work, Bud.

I have to say the Harmony is neat looking and my wife likes it but I like my MX-500 and MX-800 much better - better feel to the buttons, better layout (especially for play, pause, etc.) and better functionality (like macros on play, pause, etc.)

P.S. you ignoring my question about the cost of your lighting "scenes"....? ;)

Nope, not ignoring your question. Ronnie is correct!

I couldn't pass it up for 124.00 (after rebate). I still may take a look at some others. I still need a decent one for the family room anyway, although I have a Kameleon packed away somewhere.

Bud

ebr

04-04-06, 09:43 AM

Sorry, Bud - I missed the answer you didn't miss the question :o

chinadog

04-04-06, 10:24 AM

I temporarily hooked up my Buffalo IR control before the basketball game last night. As you might recall, I installed one receiver in the cove in the front of the room. Its also covered in GOM. I did however build a little trap door to access the receiver in case I have to replace it or something. I was able to get to it to verify the wiring, then reinstall it using the trap door. I'll have to segment my tracks when I install then and I'm sure I'll have to pull the rope light out for that whole section if I ever need to get back in, but at least I can do it.
http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/3402899/100_0731-vi.jpg

BTW, the receiver does work through the GOM and you can see the little green feedback light through the black GOM when you send it a command. I tried to get a shot of the little green light, but it just doesn't come out in the picture.

I put emitters on the Yamaha 2600 and the Moto 6412 and that's working fine. I'm trying to find the IR receiver on my Panasonic DVD-S97S. I looked in the manual, but its not in there. Anyone know specifically where the IR receiver is on the front panel? I'd like to have an idea prior to sticking it on.

Bud

chinadog

04-04-06, 10:27 AM

Here are some close ups of the beveled edge.

http://images16.fotki.com/v288/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0728-vi.jpg

http://images16.fotki.com/v289/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0729-vi.jpg

http://images16.fotki.com/v285/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0730-vi.jpg

Bud

MaximAvs

04-04-06, 10:40 AM

Bud...

Typically I keep up on your thread all day long, but in the past few days I haven't been able to. I got a promotion at work and it's actually turning out to be more work.... who knew!?

I really think everything in your space is looking great!!! It amazes me sometimes when I see where you've planned for items way in advance. Me I always seem to be retro fitting.

I have been reading everything about your GOM installation and the pictures have been terrific! But I'm having a hard time understanding the whole setup with furring strips, Fabricmate, staples, ..etc. If you could, could you draw a cross section of how you have all this attached?

Anyways, keep up the good work, and remember that this is supposed to be fun!! :D

Sean

chinadog

04-04-06, 10:48 AM

chinadog

04-04-06, 01:14 PM

Sean,

Here are few mockups, hopefully people will find them helpful, including yourself of course. I'm sure you'll have questions, so I'll just answer as you come up with them.

These two shots are for Black GOM around the soffit. You basically hang the fabric and staple from the corner where the soffit and wall meant and pull it up and over the cove. Staple around cans (if required) after its been attached to the top of the light trey. then you can staple the sides and push it into the track where two pieces of GOM meet.
http://images17.fotki.com/v293/photos/6/649633/3018602/frontright-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v289/photos/6/649633/3018602/backright-vi.jpg

The next two shots are for the lower portion of the wall. I stapled on the top of the furring strip first (going left to right), stapled the left side and then worked my way across the floor from left to right, pulling it taunt. The right side I would pull taunt and staple last.
http://images16.fotki.com/v288/photos/6/649633/3018602/rightwall-vi.jpg
http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/backwall-vi.jpg

The top piece was a little trickier with a beveled edge. You basically layout the fabric with push pins like you would the bottom of the seam. You staple the edge of the GOM right over the other piece of GOM. The two pieces lay on top of each other. After stapling, you put the second beveled piece in there and secure it to the wall. This creates the top part of the bevel. From there, it's like the bottom piece. Pull up the GOM to the furring strip in the corner of the wall and soffit, then staple left to right, making sure it's taunt.
http://images16.fotki.com/v287/photos/6/649633/3018602/Sidewalltop1-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v288/photos/6/649633/3018602/topwall2-vi.jpg

A breakdown of the beveled edge.
http://images16.fotki.com/v271/photos/6/649633/3018602/GOMbeveled-vi.jpg

This is the mistake I made in back left corner (will be hidden by seats anyway). You want to make sure the beveled edge goes all the way top the corner and not hit a vertical furring strip.
http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/backwall3-vi.jpg

chinadog

04-04-06, 02:30 PM

jikkjack

04-04-06, 02:51 PM

Looking great Bud! I can't wait to get to GOM and Furring strips...

ginigma

04-04-06, 03:56 PM

So Bud, how much will you charge me to do my theatre? :)

edmove

04-04-06, 04:04 PM

chinadog

04-04-06, 04:40 PM

This is very helpful as I am ordering my GOM this week. One questions. Don't you see the staples in th corners of the room? Can you post a close up of the corner? I am not seeing how the staple are hidden in a corner.

Also in this diagram you are not putting anty stables in the top strip (#3) right?

Thanks in advance.

Ed,

Here is how you do the corners and hide the staples:
http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/3018602/GOMcorner-vi.jpg

Here is a shot of the corner:
http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0740-vi.jpg

And the answer is yes, there are no staples in the top furring strip (#3). Both are stapled to the bottom strip. The top strip is there to create the beveled edge. If you're not doing beveled edges, this is the way to go. Beveled edge corners are a little trickier since you can't use butt joints.

EDIT and NOTE: The above diagram is for a standard hidden seam in the corner, not a beveled edge corner. In other words, this is the vertical boards in the corners, the hoizontal furring strips that create the beveled edge. when doing the beveled edges, when you get to the corners where they meet, you need to mitre them at 45 degrees.

Bud

chinadog

04-04-06, 05:14 PM

So Bud, how much will you charge me to do my theatre? :)

Make me an offer! :D

Bud

chinadog

04-04-06, 05:15 PM

Looking great Bud! I can't wait to get to GOM and Furring strips...

Once the screenwall panels are behind me, I'll be happy. Those should be pretty straight forward though.

Bud

chinadog

04-04-06, 05:46 PM

OK, another decision made.

I was going to run down to to some of the woodworkers stores and look at stain. That was the plan at least. I'm at the point where I want do some staining here and use the weekends to install the trim. I played around with the wood conditioners from Minwax in combination with their stain and an happy enough with the results. If someone can convince me to try something else, I'll listen.

I used one coat of conditioner and two coats of Rosewood on a piece of casing in the picture below. No poly at this point (but will plan on at least one coat of satin). I may add another coat just to see how dark it gets. They recommend two coats of the conditioner, which I would do when I start since it is pine. I ragged it on this time, but will use a brush.

http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0747-vi.jpg

You guys getting sick of me posting yet?!?!?

Bud

ronnie_jackson

04-04-06, 06:29 PM

The stain looks good Bud. You will find that the poly satin does indeed darken it a little and changes the look (at least that was my experience). I think 2 very thin coats of satin poly will be just right. Test it out and throw up another pic.

Your kidding about the posts right? We love this stuff :D Im just waiting on the pic of the 5.5 cotton and those home made T-hangers.

Ronnie

edmove

04-04-06, 06:30 PM

Okay, so in this diagram the last wall you put in (top in the image) has to be assembled off on the wall. Meaning that you have to streach the GOM on a frame and then place it on the wall. Otherwise you can't get to the stapled area on the edge, right?

http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/3018602/GOMcorner-vi.jpg

chinadog

04-04-06, 06:33 PM

The stain looks good Bud. You will find that the poly satin does indeed darken it a little and changes the look (at least that was my experience). I think 2 very thin coats of satin poly will be just right. Test it out and throw up another pic.

Your kidding about the posts right? We love this stuff :D Im just waiting on the pic of the 5.5 cotton and those home made T-hangers.

Ronnie

Ronnie, good info. Hold tight on the cotton. It's coming ....

Bud

swithey

04-04-06, 06:41 PM

chinadog

04-04-06, 06:43 PM

Okay, so in this diagram the last wall you put in (top in the image) has to be assembled off on the wall. Meaning that you have to streach the GOM on a frame and then place it on the wall. Otherwise you can't get to the stapled area on the edge, right?

Correct. You basically put the fabric on the floor, put the furring strip close to the edge leaving an inch or two of fabric. You take that inch or two and wrap the side of the furring strip and staple it on the side. You put it on the wall with and secure it, then pull the fabric to the next corner.

In this picture, you can see I left a gap in the corner between the side wall furring strip and the Linacoustic for the next furring strip.
http://images16.fotki.com/v282/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0403-vi.jpg

Bud

thegeek

04-04-06, 06:46 PM

You gets getting sick of me posting yet?!?!?

Bud

Nope, keep 'em coming.

sportrac

04-04-06, 06:53 PM

The Pictures are great, the information is very helpful, and the Theater is looking very nice.

GPowers

04-04-06, 07:10 PM

This is the mistake I made in back left corner (will be hidden by seats anyway). You want to make sure the beveled edge goes all the way top the corner and not hit a vertical furring strip.
http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/backwall3-vi.jpg

Here is a nother approach to the beveles in an inside corner.

http://www.stargateunofficial.com/Gallery/Pic/HTDoneWalls12.jpg

chinadog

04-04-06, 07:16 PM

Greg,

That's the way I should have done it! There is still a chance I do a chair rail (I can just cover the bevel) to break up the wall some, but I could do that at any time. I like at least having the option.

Bud

MaximAvs

04-05-06, 09:38 AM

Bud...

Thanks for the marked up pictures!! I was getting lost because I thought you were stapling the GOM to furring stripps AND tucking it into Fabric mate on all edges. Now I understand what you've done.

Thank you for the congrats!

BTW, have you decided on seating yet?! Are you getting theater seating or are you going the sofa/loveseat route?!

Your stain choice looks perfect! I say throw on a coat or two of poly and put that sucker up!!

You're theater is looking great!!! I can't wait for pics of the finished product!

Sean

chinadog

04-05-06, 09:49 AM

Sean,

Thanks. I think I'm going to go with two Berk 090's in the front and either three in the back or a 090 loveseat flanked by two 090s. That should fit. Gvies you a little extra seating if you need it.

Bud

chinadog

04-05-06, 06:52 PM

Just finished putting in the rope light tracks and re-resintalled the rope light. Ronnie, or others, did you find it tough pushing the rope light into the track? I got the track from the rope light folks, so I think its the correct size. I went up and got a wet sponge with a tab of liquid dishwashing soap and ran it down the track and the rope, worked much better that way, took about a quarter of the time getting it in. Regardless, it's not coming out anytime soon.

I installed it about half way on the cove, it seemed to look the best for me, rather than installing right up against the wall. When I did the front portion of the cove, I went up on the riser and I could barley see it, but wasn't happy about that. I went ahead and pull it out of the track, ripped out the track and moved it close to the wall. Looked much better. It has a nice even glow now, versus an up and down sort of look.

Bud

HeyNow^

04-05-06, 07:14 PM

chinadog

04-05-06, 08:23 PM

Bud,

I have two different tracks for my rope lights. One is aluminum gold colored cove track that is 2 inches plus wide at the top. The other is the clear 1/2 inch stuff. The rope light slipped in easily in the clear, and the aluminum is tight.

Randy.

Randy,

Interesting. This was the clear plastic 1/2 type. I used 3/4 double sided 3M tape from Home Depot to secure the track. It's not going anywhere. I think Ronnie said his track had the tape on it already when he got his from HD. For the IR trap door, I didn't even bother with the track, I stretched it between the two. The door is about 10 inches wide, but it's pretty tight going across.

Bud

ronnie_jackson

04-05-06, 08:45 PM

Randy,

Interesting. This was the clear plastic 1/2 type. I used 3/4 double sided 3M tape from Home Depot to secure the track. It's not going anywhere. I think Ronnie said his track had the tape on it already when he got his from HD. For the IR trap door, I didn't even bother with the track, I stretched it between the two. The door is about 10 inches wide, but it's pretty tight going across.

Bud

Yes, you are right. The rope is a pretty tight fit and your fingers will be sore after working it into the groove. I bought the 1/2" clear track. I found that if I rolled it a little as I was working it in, it went much smoother. The soap solution would have made it easy also. Good call.

Also, mine did already have the tape on it and its very sticky. I looked at it today to make sure its still secure. After 2 weeks, its still holding well. If it does come loose, its nothing a few strategically placed staples or liquid nails wont fix.

Ronnie

GPowers

04-05-06, 11:57 PM

Randy,

Interesting. This was the clear plastic 1/2 type. I used 3/4 double sided 3M tape from Home Depot to secure the track. It's not going anywhere. ..

Bud

That’s what I though. I also used the double sides tape to secure the plastic on the steps. BUT the heat of the rope lights melts the tape glue after about 9 or 10 month. Then the plastic strips start to move and fall down.

In the tray you do not have gravity working against you, but the tape will get hot and the glue will melt.

chinadog

04-06-06, 12:54 AM

Greg,

Will check it every few months. I wonder if thats in the new book??

Bud

chinadog

04-06-06, 11:35 AM

The stain looks good Bud. You will find that the poly satin does indeed darken it a little and changes the look (at least that was my experience). I think 2 very thin coats of satin poly will be just right. Test it out and throw up another pic.
Here's a shot with three coats of the rosewood and two coats of satin poly. They recommend three coats of poly, but not sure I'll do it. Its shinny enough.
http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0751-vi.jpg

Here's the old shot for comparison reasons:
http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0747-vi.jpg

It actually looks lighter, but its the light conditions I think. I didn't do any sanding on the sample piece. It's just a hair lighter than I really want. Should I go one more coat?

Bud

ronnie_jackson

04-06-06, 12:28 PM

hmmm, its hard to tell by the pic. The latest picture is brighter as you can tell by the white background. On my test peices, I made about 4 identical peices and stained them with varying set times on the stain and compared. Once I found the right amount of stain and set time, I made several more test pieces. Then I perfermoned the same process with the poly. That way I could see the difference side by side.

My experience was that the poly darkened it a little and made it richer looking. Do you think the poly made a difference? Its hard to tell from the pic because the lighting conditions seem to be a lot different?

Overall, I think it looks pretty good. Im actually a fan of darker woodwork, so my vote would be a little darker. I put two coats of stain on my wood and let each penetrate for 15 minutes before wiping them down. You may not want to go that dark though.

Ronnie

ebr

04-06-06, 01:00 PM

It looks like you got a pretty even stain take there but I want to make a suggestion in case you aren't already doing it. If that is pine (it looks like it) I highly suggest pre-treating the wood with a pre-stain conditioner before applying the stain. Makes a huge difference in how well a soft wood takes the stain.

Your samples look good, however, so my suggestion may be moot.

chinadog

04-06-06, 01:59 PM

Ronnie,

The light conditions are a little different. I'll try another sample piece, but I think I'm close. Maybe on more coat of stain. It definately looks better with poly. Does multiple coats make it any shinier? I mean satin is satin, but I don't want any reflects if I can avoid them.

ebr,

The wood is yellow pine (to match the doors) and I actually did two coats of the pre-stain wood conditioner, although not sure I mentioned it earlier. It looks like one blotch on the trim, I noticed that, which I expect you saw as well.

Bud

ebr

04-06-06, 02:10 PM

I figured you probably had - or had found some other type of pre-treat. Pine looks really bad if you don't use a conditioner and your samples looked nice and even.

Instead of another coat of poly, you might try going over it with some light steel wool and then putting furniture wax on it. Might give you the richness you want without the additional shine...

chinadog

04-06-06, 02:27 PM

The wax may just do the trick. I saw some at HD the other day, but didn't think I needed it. I'll give that a shot as well.

Bud

chinadog

04-06-06, 03:02 PM

I went ahead and put together my first speaker grill. I had ripped down some very straight 2x4s over the weekend and used those. I didn't do anything fancy, I just butt-jointed the corners, countersunk some 2 1/2 inch deck screws and gorilla glued the seams.

Here's a the first shot:
http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0753-vi.jpg

I'm attempting to use the magnetic grill guides. Because the panel fits in a groove on one side, I'm only planning on using the magnets on one side. Here is a close up of the gorilla glue magnets on the grill and on the screen wall.
http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0755-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v289/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0756-vi.jpg

When the glue sets up I'll give them a shot and see if I need to add any more. Then I'll paint them and wrap them in GOM.

Bud

chinadog

04-07-06, 10:03 AM

I finished up the side panels for the screen wall. I think I decided to wait until the carpet is in on the stage before I build the bottom panels. I figure that if I build them now and they go to the stage floor, then the carpet will butt up against the panel. If the carpet goes in first, then I can measure the exact height required to cover the enclosure. I also figure that with that small lip of stage in front of the sub enclosures, it'll be difficult for the carpet guy to work with that small area, putting in tack strips and wrapping the rounded edge. On the other hand, if I did the panels now, it would be a cleaner look probably.

Any one have any opinions on that?

OK, here is my halfassed spray paint job on the panel frames:
http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0758-vi.jpg

I went ahead and wrapped the panels and stapled the GOM using 1/2 inch staples. I made sure I didn't staple my magnets in the process (or my fingers for that matter). I then trimmed off the extra.
http://images14.fotki.com/v244/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0760-vi.jpg

Here is one panel installed. The magnets seem to work pretty well. To line them up with each other, I put the panels up and drilled through both frames with a small bit. I then went back and drilled the 3/8 inch holes for the magnets. You have to pay attention to the polarity obviously. A good way to do that is put a black mark with a sharpie on one side. This has to be done before you GOM, BTW.
http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0762-vi.jpg

Heres what it looks like from the back of the room in various lights and flash. You can't really tell there are even panels there. I left enough room for my crown molding to go around the top as well.
http://images16.fotki.com/v289/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0763-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v289/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0764-vi.jpg
http://images17.fotki.com/v297/photos/6/649633/2875265/100_0766-vi.jpg

I used this technique I mentioned before and seems to have worked out pretty well. I only used magnets on the screen side of the frame.
http://images16.fotki.com/v274/photos/6/649633/3018602/Magnetdraw-vi.jpg

Bud

jandawil

04-07-06, 10:38 AM

Looking real good Bud. It's funny that you can't notice the panels against the black paint and Linacoustis in the photos. I had the same issue, but you can see it in person and that's what counts. If you play with the brightness and contrast a bit on the pictures you can bring them out. I did my carpet first and than the panels. Your panels a built the same way mine are. I think mine looks very clean. One advantage of doing it in that order is they will be easier to remove if you even need to replace the GOM or get access to something. I plan on fashioning a hinging door on one for access to my gear and the carpet would hinder that. I also did my own stage carpet and used staples along the back and the panels hide them perfectly. I have worked with tack strips before and there is definately a reason I am not a carpet installer. I suck at it.

chinadog

04-07-06, 11:02 AM

Hey Jon,

Thanks. I'm not adverse to seeing the panels or not. The panels are 62 inches high and I have a gap of maybe an inch on the screen side. It's also about the same depth as the screen fram, about 1.25 inches, so it does blend really well. You really have to walk up to it and know what to look for, although it may just look like a seam. I think the bottom ones will be more obvious, but I have some thoughts on how to hide them better as well. I'm able to pull the screen off if I really had to. I've done it a few hundred times already, although I don't expect to to do that much once all is set. I believe you build your screen, so its a different scenerio.

Bud

nosdude

04-07-06, 11:22 AM

Keep it coming chinadog......i'm definitely following your lead when I get to the stage construction of my project. Just completed my ceiling design.

sdspga

04-07-06, 12:12 PM

chinadog

04-07-06, 12:54 PM

Keep it coming chinadog......i'm definitely following your lead when I get to the stage construction of my project. Just completed my ceiling design.
Looks like you've got your hands full, too. Pretty unique design, looks good!

Bud

chinadog

04-07-06, 01:00 PM

Bud,

A nice benefit of those side panels (as well as the black GOM on the soffit above the screen) is how much light they will soak up. I bought the flattest, blackest paint I could get and still have quite a bit of reflection from the screen. Your fabric is really going to "separate" the screen nicely!

I think I am going to start a new thread....."The reconstruction thread" or "The top 100 things I messed up while building my first HT". I wish the Blazing Ridge Cinema was under construction about a year and a half ago. Would have saved a lot of redo's. :) Oh well, maybe that is part of the fun.

Scott

Hey Scott.

The black GOM has done a great job of light control. I do see some reflection on the ceiling with the paint, but it's not bad really. Even with the frame painted black (pre-GOM), I could see the difference, although did still see a little reflection.

It seams like this thread has been around for a year and half already, although I think I fired it up in June, but was working for 6 months before that. I'll continue to update it after the HT room is done, I'll continue with the rest of the basement pictures and bring it to closure.

Bud

edmove

04-07-06, 01:19 PM

Where did you get the magnetic speaker guides? I may have to try that as well to cover my front stage.

Found these: MAGNETIC GRILL GUIDES 3/8" DIA x 3/16" H SET OF 8 (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=329-045&ctab=14#Tabs)

Cheers.

Ed - My HT Project (http://www.husar.us/blog/?cat=11)

chinadog

04-07-06, 01:22 PM

Ed,

Go to www.partexpress.com and do a search on "grill guides". Its on the bottom.

Bud

edmove

04-07-06, 01:51 PM

How far did you space them apart on your grills? Corners only?

Cheers.

Ed - My HT Project (http://www.husar.us/blog/?cat=11)

chinadog

04-07-06, 02:06 PM

Ed,

I put four on the vertical piece of the panel on the screen side. I'd say about every 15 inches. They're pretty (incredibly) strong. BUT, you want to make sure you have then at the correct depth. You want the two to touch ideally (one in the panel and the other in the wall). With GOM wrapped around the edges, you'll want them a little raised a little, since the wood panel won't be flush. I made the mistake of drilling on hole too deep, when I inserted the magnet, it went below the surface. Luckily I made it way too deep and just pushed a second magnet in and it force the first back. I suppose you could just glue or attach some metal bracket or something and put magnets only in the screen wall, or vice versa, but I think having two makes it stronger. Depends on the materials used for the framing of the panels.

Bud

ronnie_jackson

04-07-06, 03:22 PM

Very nice work on the proscenium so far Bud. I like it. I might steal that magnet idea for my center channel covers.

Ronnie

edmove

04-07-06, 05:13 PM

Any chance that a sub could rattle the magnets? I would be concerned with the metal making any noise. Even a little would be bad.

chinadog

04-07-06, 05:30 PM

Did you fill your stage full of sand? I haven't had any issues with playing around with it today. Buy a set of 8 for 5.00. You'll be surprised how strong they are. You can barely pull them apart. If you don't use them in your HT room, use them on your fridge!

Bud

Allen

04-07-06, 07:44 PM

Bud,

I have been thinking about piano hinges on one side and industrial velcro on the other to allow it to swing open like a door for access. Don't plan to have to access it much, but might need to from time to time. If the magnets don't rattle with strong base that might even be better.

Allen

chinadog

04-07-06, 08:33 PM

Allen,

The combination may be good, allows it to swing, but the magnets/velcro hold it in place when you need it to. The also have heavy duty speaker grill guides (plastic type) at PartsExpress. I picked up some heavy duty Velcro in case I needed it. I would think if the hinge is really holding the panel up, just about anything will hold it from opening.

Good thinking.

Bud

edmove

04-08-06, 01:04 PM

What is the color and maker of the paint you used on your ceiling? Also how many coats did you need?

Cheers.

Ed - My HT Project (http://www.husar.us/blog/?cat=11)

chinadog

04-08-06, 01:07 PM

Its posted back a ways, but its Sherwin Williams Georgian Bay (6509) and I did three coats and a tinted coat of primer.

Bud

ScottJ0007

04-08-06, 11:50 PM

Bud,
I just thought I'd thank you for your tip on the Georgian Bay. I bought some last weekend and painted part of my ceiling. It looks GREAT! I love the color.
- Scott

chinadog

04-09-06, 12:49 AM

Bud,
I just thought I'd thank you for your tip on the Georgian Bay. I bought some last weekend and painted part of my ceiling. It looks GREAT! I love the color.
- Scott

Scott,

Cool! I have to give credit where credit is due, to Doug (dcdell) for turning me on to the color first.

Here is a shot of his theater. He's got some great colors.
http://www.cogdells.com/Show-Final/images/IMG_1387.jpg

His construction thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=654564

Glad everyone likes it. Maybe its the new Milano Blue... :D I just put my Georgian Bay trims with my black baffles up. Need to put up another picture.

Bud

garykagan

04-09-06, 09:23 AM

I like the G-bay color as well - I'm also a bandwagon junkie with no hope of getting original ideas. I'm going with Benjamin Moore paints as I can get a better price on them. Anyone know the equilvlant of G-bay in BM paints?

Love the progress Bud,

Gary

chinadog

04-09-06, 10:53 AM

Gary,

Thanks. I'm sure they could color match it. Pick up a swatch at Sherwin Williams and go from there.

Bud

chinadog

04-09-06, 11:14 AM

Here are the painted trims in Georgian Bay with the black baffles. I ended up using sponge brush after attending to use one of the "make your own spray paint devices" failed miserably. Thanks Milt. I guess I need to get a register cover and paint that as well. Oh, and yes, I see the white speck on the trim in the second picture!

http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3422362/100_0777-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v300/photos/6/649633/3422362/100_0778-vi.jpg

Bud

chinadog

04-09-06, 11:21 AM

Here is the first batch of stained trim. I used the Minwax prestain, three coats of the water based Rosewood stain and two coats of the polyacrylic. I'll need to get some wax and see what happens. Still have a lot of staining to do still.

http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/3002014/100_0779-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v298/photos/6/649633/3002014/100_0782-vi.jpg
http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/3002014/100_0780-vi.jpg

Bud

Milt99

04-09-06, 12:32 PM

Trims look good Bud.
Yeah those damn specks. :)

chinadog

04-09-06, 03:25 PM

OK guys, need some opinions. Focused on the the projector box today. This is what I have so far. I used drawer slides to give me access. I still need to build the front, bottom and back access panels, so its no where near complete. I'll need to paint and GOM it as well. I also need to deal with the front vent, but I think I'm going to extend the front by about two inches.

Any comments on the design?

http://images8.fotki.com/v139/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0783-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v279/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0784-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v298/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0785-vi.jpg
http://images17.fotki.com/v293/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0786-vi.jpg
http://images17.fotki.com/v297/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0787-vi.jpg
http://images12.fotki.com/v251/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0789-vi.jpg

swithey

04-09-06, 04:13 PM

http://images16.fotki.com/v298/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0785-vi.jpg

Bud,

I love the idea of it sliding out away from the projector like a drawer. Do you plan to have a removable front plate to cover the front (attached with magnets)? Also the stain looks GREAT. I really like the color. Damn nice looking HT :)

chinadog

04-09-06, 05:13 PM

sdspga

04-09-06, 09:17 PM

Hey Bud,

I've always wondered about these boxes. If the PJ is completely covered up, it can't breathe. If it has openings to breathe, doesn't that let the sound of the fan escape (which I presume is the reason for the box in the first place)? I have the AE 700 and the fan set to low. I honestly can say that the noise is not the least bit distracting, however I am always open to new ideas.

Anyway, that being said........I think the drawer slides are ingenious. Love the stained trim and the painted baffles blend right in with the ceiling. BTW, the problem with DIY is that you know where every little problem lurks (like that miniscule white speck on the light trim). That would drive me nuts too, but no one else would ever notice. That's one of those instances where my wife just looks at me and nods (then goes and laughs when she is out of ear shot).

rsberg34

04-10-06, 07:30 AM

rsberg34

04-10-06, 07:32 AM

Oh yeah...the slides on the box is cool too...very nice idea and should prove handy in the future too.

Robert

chinadog

04-10-06, 07:34 AM

For me, I just want to hide the projector. Its not the noise.

I'll vent the back and I have that vent in front of the projector, which is actually an intake. I have a thermostat that will be inside the projector box that will kick in at a set temperature and turn on the inline fan that will pull the hot air from the box.

Even though its small, I was hoping when I put GOM on it, it'll blend a lot better. I don't want it to stick out like a sore thumb (or a swollen middle finger with a staple in it in my case....)

Bud

chinadog

04-10-06, 07:36 AM

Aint that the truth sdspga....dang wives and thier runnin off to laugh at you, lol

Mine does it too, I guess thats what seperates us from them...noticing the little stuff.

Love the stained trim Bud should look great when its up....ever give any thought to staining the hush box the same color instead of covering it with GOM? I wasnt sure if you had planned some kind of stained wood anywhere near the soffet or not but I doubt your going that route. Those cans with the matching trim pieces look great...good contrast between the Georgia Bay and the black.

Robert

I actually painted the projector box flat black last night. I'll use the black GOM to cover it so it blends better with that last piece of GOM I have to install. Didn't even think about staining it. That would have abeen a good idea as well.

Bud

chinadog

04-10-06, 08:58 AM

Doesn't quite stick out as much with just a little paint on it.
http://images17.fotki.com/v293/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0793-vi.jpg

Bud

chinadog

04-10-06, 09:41 PM

I've received a few questions on the IR setup and the light control. Here's what I've done with my setup and hopefully that clears things up some. Please let me know if this drawing is confusing or if you have any questions. Hopefully its legible enough. It's too big to post as an attachment.

http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/2311872/Hometheaterlightcontrol-vi.jpg
EDIT!!!
I changed this one more time (3rd time), since I figured out a better way to handles scenes using the SMST6. This one is the latest and greatest.

Bud

dc_pilgrim

04-10-06, 10:14 PM

Great post Bud, added straight to my reference file.

chinadog

04-10-06, 10:26 PM

Dave,

Replace the one you have, I just updated and replaced it for grammatical reasons.

Bud

dc_pilgrim

04-10-06, 10:37 PM

Easy enough. Thanks.

rsberg34

04-11-06, 06:57 AM

Thats a very informative post...thanks Bud!!

I cedrtainly dont know enough about that stuff. I want all the cool scenes like you have but I think I am going to hire that part out to the pros...unless a lightbulb flashes in my head before its time to put that stuff in. It just cornfuses me to all hell and back, lol

Robert

ebr

04-11-06, 08:59 AM

Robert, I don't want to disparage Bud's great work at all because he did an awesome job setting all this up, but you can have that same functionality much easier with a Lutron Grafik Eye. No programming, no X-10, no need to hire a professional (other than possibly an electrician).

So, if you are a DIY nut and love to tinker and put this stuff together, Bud has a great plan and setup. But, if you just want scene-based lighting you can go with a packaged solution.

chinadog

04-11-06, 09:36 AM

jikkjack

04-11-06, 09:37 AM

Hey Steve,

Thanks. I think I'm going to hinge the front on the bottom of the panel and either use magnets or velcro. This way, I can swing the front down and slide it back when required. I'm thinking of 1/4 masonite for the bottom panel and haven't decided on the back yet. Needs to be vented, though. I think when its all GOMed, it should look decent.

Bud

Bud,

I am just catching up on all of your progress and everything is looking great! I have been so busy working on our new deck I haven't been able to do any theater stuff lately. :(

Anyhow, I really like the projector box but I don't know about using magnets that close to the projector. Do you think that they are close enough to the PJ to have a negative impact?

chinadog

04-11-06, 09:47 AM

Here is what I'm thinking about as far as seating is concerned. Due to size limitations, I have some limited options on the seats. The riser is not very deep because of the door, so I'll have some overhang unfortunately. I'm not sure if I want to take up the complete width of the riser with the 4 seat combination or just go with three on the back row. I have sat in the 090s and although they seem a little short in the back for me, I'm ok with that. The way I expect the seating to be used is 50% me alone, 40% for the family of four and 10% more than four.

Any opinions or thoughts?
http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/3402899/Berks090s-vi.jpg
Bud

chinadog

04-11-06, 09:51 AM

Bud,

I am just catching up on all of your progress and everything is looking great! I have been so busy working on our new deck I haven't been able to do any theater stuff lately. :(

Anyhow, I really like the projector box but I don't know about using magnets that close to the projector. Do you think that they are close enough to the PJ to have a negative impact?

Not sure really, one reason I was thinking velcro. Better safe than sorry, I suppose.

How much do you have left on the deck?

Bud

ridetheducati

04-11-06, 09:57 AM

I vote for option B.

All members will have their own seat. I am not a big fan of love-seats.

ronnie_jackson

04-11-06, 10:31 AM

chinadog

04-11-06, 10:36 AM

Bud, My vote is for Option A.

I say fill up that back row with seating. Wall to wall. Especially since there is no need to walk around the back row. Do you have enough room to put another arm in between the double seat?

Ronnie

Nope. It comes out to 137 inches I think, so I'm short a few inches (don't go there... :eek: )

Bud

ebr

04-11-06, 11:07 AM

I agree with ebr, this is just one way of doing it and I went X10 because I had X10 and thought it would be cheaper for me to go that route versus the Lutron GE, but based on the number of dimmers, etc., it probably came out to abbott the same. Now, if you had two lights you want to control, thats another story. Every situation, room, budget, preferences are different obviously.

Bud

Good point. If you don't need 6 zones, the DIY route could be much cheaper.

Ridetheducati - you need a date :). Love seats can be good...

Tough call on the seating, Bud but I think you need to be careful about jamming them too close to the back/sides - even if you don't need to walk around them. Acoustics will be very difficult close to those boundaries.

StewartFan20

04-11-06, 11:22 AM

As far as your seating options go, I'm not sure if you have kids or not. If you do, you might want to consider Option A. It gives an extra seat for the kids friends and that's one less person who would have to be banished to the floor.

I'm going with four 090's in the back row which basically fills up the riser with wall-to-wall seating. Its a tight fit. But, with our kids always having friends over, I thought squeezing in the extra seat was worth it.

Just my thoughts.

-Bill

chinadog

04-11-06, 11:50 AM

Bill,

I have a four year old and a six year old. I'd rather have the kids and firends here than elsewhere.

ebr,

I've had to make some compromises with the back row on closeness to due lack or room. I believe I gave Bryan six seats for his acoustic calculations if it matters. I don't want to feel squished, but trying to maximize seating obviously.

Bud

sdspga

04-11-06, 11:54 AM

Bud,

I vote Option A. I have arms between all my seats, but the loveseat idea would be nice when it is just the wife and I. (Movies with no arm in between count as quality time I think)

If you had said more than 10% usage with the guys over, I would change my mind. Might be kind of wierd watching the Bears-Packers game with my buddy and I in that loveseat :)

Come to think of it, can you have Reaper re-render your theater to "Brokeback Ridge" Sorry, I couldn't pass that up. Slow day at work

Scott

chinadog

04-11-06, 12:04 PM

Scott,

Good point about the games, although if all the other seats were open and you guys were sitting in the loveseat, well, thats a whole different story.

Another point, for me, for serious movie enjoyment, I'd be in the front row and chances are I'll be in there myself at late at night. My wife won't watch a lot of movies at night unless we're all there watching the latest kid release. For family movies with the kids, I'd probably be in the back row anyway. For games, it doesn't matter much to me either way.

Bud

J-dubb16

04-11-06, 12:36 PM

chinadog

04-11-06, 12:54 PM

Bud,

What if you go with Option A, but with Berkline 088 in the rear. This is what I did to gain a little width. You will probably save about 12" or so in overall width.

I have 090 in the front row and the 088's in the back in tha same layout as you.

J-dubb

I thought about the 088/090 route, but discounted it for two reasons. First, I wanted to have the two rows uniform in appearance. The two types are too different for my taste. I believe Roman suggested at one point that there were two different types of Berks that are very similar in appearance and differ in size. That was the route I originally though about, putting 4 smaller ones in the rear and the larger in front. I can't find that info again though. I thought they were 094s and 084s or something, but every time I try to find them I get frustrated. I then figured I'd just do five 090s, then played around with the Berkline HT seating site and figured I had a few inches to play with with the loveseat combo.

Second, even though I plan on 50% of my time in front row, that still time in the back row. I have not sat in the 088s, but from what I hear, I don't think I'd fit (6'4", 250ish, proportional, not leggy), so I just figured I'd stick to things that fit me regardless where I sit. The 090s are even a small compromise.

Bud

GPowers

04-11-06, 02:51 PM

Had the same problem. I'am 6'4" 230 or sooo. We went with the 088's. For a couple of reasons.

First our room is only 15' by 20' and we did not want the chairs to over power the room or be out of scale. The 088's were the right scale.

We also wanted at least seating for eight. The 088' also fix that requirements.

The back of the 088's are low enough not to block you ears from getting the side channel speakers/surroundsound.

Cost was reasonable.

So we purchased 8 burk 088's

ebr

04-11-06, 03:48 PM

Bud, I'm going to be doing 8 088s as well - same reasons as Greg. Just FYI, the actual seating area difference between the two is 2.5". The rest of its in the armrest. I had the 090s in my last room and my wife and I could almost sit in one - they are big. So, anyway, you might consider 088s still...

chinadog

04-11-06, 04:01 PM

Eric,

Its the height of the back of the chair. 37.5 inches versus 41" for the 090s. I actually thought the 090's weren't high enough when I sat in them, but were doable. I have not sat in the 088s though.

Bud

chinadog

04-11-06, 04:02 PM

GPowers

04-11-06, 04:06 PM

According to all the pros you do not want the back of the chair to block your ears. If you block your ears, you inhibit the path of the surondsound. only hearing sound that comes from in front of you as you have block any sound coming from behind you.

And soundsound is one the big reasons we spend all this money on these dedicate home theaters.

chinadog

04-11-06, 04:10 PM

Good point!

Bud

larryep

04-11-06, 04:29 PM

hey chinadog,

i decided to go with 3 in a wedge for the rear and a loveseat for the front. i am going to se how that will fit and if i could use a chair in the middle of the loveseat i'll get one with two arms on each side. The ones i ordered are the 088. 088 would save room width wise. but if i remember right you are 6 foot 4 inches. Have you sat in 088? for me at 5, 10" they are a good fit.sorry as i caught up to your thread i relized you have not tried the088's.

chinadog

04-11-06, 04:40 PM

Larry,

I could do a wedge in the front row, the riser isn't depth enough. I have not tried the 088s. I need to reconsider the 088s if I can find one to try out.

Bud

chinadog

04-11-06, 04:43 PM

OK, I'll reconsider the 088s, but definitely want to sit in them. Need to find somewhere local in Atlanta.

Here are my options now:
http://images8.fotki.com/v154/photos/6/649633/3402899/Berks088sand090s-vi.jpg

I think two seats in the 088s won't be enough. I'd still have 24 inches on either side of the front row with three.

Bud

ebr

04-11-06, 05:00 PM

The 7-chair 088 setup looks great - but you have to be sure you like those seats.

larryep

04-11-06, 05:16 PM

Bud

berk builder is in Morristown, TN. it is 260 miles from you.

larryep.

GPowers

04-11-06, 05:18 PM

Option C. Does not look a crowded in as option A

chinadog

04-11-06, 05:19 PM

Eric,

Right, understand..

Larry,

Right, thats the factory. I understand the have "outlet sales" every quarter. I think BuffBakerGA went up there last year and got his seats there.

Bud

chinadog

04-11-06, 05:22 PM

Option C. Does not look a crowded in as option A

Yeah, gives me another 17 inches total on the sides.

Bud

richh

04-11-06, 06:20 PM

Bud,

I picked 088's for the same reasons as others have posted; wanting to maximize the number of guests my theater can hold with a limited width room. When reclined, it is very comfortable and my head is fully supported. When upright, it's more like sitting on a couch; there's no support for your head (for reference I'm 6'0").

One good thing about option C is the fact that the chairs are staggered. This should help with sightlines for the occupants in the second row as they would be looking between heads.

I would definitely try out some 088's if possible.

ronnie_jackson

04-11-06, 07:11 PM

If you go with the 88's, my choice is option C.

Ronnie

revans35

04-11-06, 07:15 PM

Bud,

If you do the 088s in the front for 2-3 seats, you should consider a wedge. I think that will give the front row a nice look.

Ryan

chinadog

04-11-06, 07:33 PM

Thanks guys. Seems I have some more work to do. I'll price out the wedge option as well.

Bud

chinadog

04-11-06, 07:43 PM

Here's the last image with option E.
http://images17.fotki.com/v295/photos/6/649633/3402899/Berks090s-vi.jpghttp://images6.fotki.com/v162/photos/6/649633/3402899/Berks088s3-vi.jpg

EDIT: I added the curved back row for Ronnie (option F).

Bud

richh

04-11-06, 07:58 PM

Thanks guys. Seems I have some more work to do. I'll price out the wedge option as well.

Bud

When I bought my chairs, it did not make a difference wedge vs straight. Both configurations were the same price. I ended up with a curved row of 5 for the back and a love seat flanked on either side by a wedged chair for the front.

chinadog

04-11-06, 08:35 PM

When I bought my chairs, it did not make a difference wedge vs straight. Both configurations were the same price. I ended up with a curved row of 5 for the back and a love seat flanked on either side by a wedged chair for the front.

Hey Rich,

Thanks. I just found that out from Kyle at Carolina Furniture Group.

Bud

ronnie_jackson

04-11-06, 09:13 PM

chinadog

04-11-06, 09:28 PM

Ok, Im with option E now. The wedge is the ONE.....

I had planned on buying wedges with mine, but I ran across a deal I couldnt pass up, so no wedges.

Just to make you work a little harder, try out a wedge on the inside of the outside 2 chairs of the back row.

Ronnie
Done. Editted the other file in the post above. The problem there is the riser depth. I only have like 66 inches and we're already hanging off.

Bud

ebr

04-11-06, 10:55 PM

Bud - don't wedge the back row. IMO that space is much better used getting the back row as far off the back wall as possible. Also, I notice you have left more than enough room to fully recline the rear seats and still have room to the front ones. Consider that you will pretty much never fully recline the seats (unless you're taking a nap) so, you can probably nudge that rear row a little further forward.

Can you tell I really don't like that back row along the back wall... :).

chinadog

04-11-06, 11:01 PM

Eric,

Good point about the reclining. I don't think I could do curved in the back row anyway. I'll have to play with how much room behind the seats once I have something in hand. If I go with seven seats, I may be buying one row at first, so that'll end up in front anyway. I'll have to figure that out. I take it you like option E?

Bud

ebr

04-11-06, 11:22 PM

Yeah, E has a nice feel to it - as long as the extra width of the curve doesn't encroach on your walkway to the back.

chinadog

04-11-06, 11:29 PM

Dave (dc_pilgrim) and others,

I updated the home theater light control drawing one more time. I was quizzing GPowers (Greg) on his light control and then it hit me. Instead of using the SMST6 to control scenes by mapping multiple X10 codes to its buttons, I just use one housecode... a trigger! I can define a button like "A" on the SMST6 to send "B8 ON", which the Powerlinc controller will interpret as a macro or scene and trigger all those other switches to whatever level I want them. Again, the Powelinc's control is done with the software and a USB cable to your PC. It's a beautiful thing. In fact, you could use the trigger to adjust the heat, turn on the fan in the equipment closet, whatever you want to automate. You could theoretically use the SMST6 and define multiple triggers per button.

Anyway, the diagram has been updated to reflect the light bulb that went off in my head. Must have sent it a trigger, I suppose. :p

Here's that post its (#1410):
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7464803&&#post7464803

Bud

chinadog

04-11-06, 11:31 PM

Yeah, E has a nice feel to it - as long as the extra width of the curve doesn't encroach on your walkway to the back.

Actually, I would think it would be better because the end seats leave a wider opening at the corners. The back of the middle seat would be the same distance to the back row regardless of which is there.

Ahhh, reread that. You're referring to the overall width. Got it.

Bud

rsh

04-12-06, 10:07 AM

Bud

If you ask me I would do either 6 090s or 6 (possibly 7) 088s , and I would stay with the straight configuration. There are several reasons for that. First, I like even numbers because if you have couples over, there is no chance someone will be without a seat. I also like a loveseat on 090s - you can put 3-4 kids in it if you have a movie party there. The 7 088s also look good just from esthetic point of view. The other good reason is, that when you order 6 or more seats shipping drops per seat and you save a nice chunk of money.

Regarding matching seats from different style groups. Yes, there were 079 style group, which was essentially a 090 chair with the back cushion very similar to 086 back cushion (check my website: http://www.rtheaters.com/page6.html to see the 086 style group). The 079 was dropped, BUT I CAN STILL GET IT FOR YOU (only specific pieces available - 52s and 53s and not for long - closeout deal)

Regarding 090s vs. 088s - this topic was discussed so much !!!

If you are 5'9" or taller and you want a head support you need to go with the 090s. Otherwise the 088s will do a nice job. These are comfortable smaller chairs, and many folks are happy with them.

Roman

chinadog

04-12-06, 10:39 AM

Roman, Thanks for the reply. Just sent you a PM.

I expect we won't be having many couple nights. We'll have ocassional family and a few friends here or there for sporting events.

I understand the 090s vs the 088s. I was really thinking 090s and these guys have convinced me to take a second look on the 088s. The combination of the 079s/086s might be the trick though. The 086s are the smaller of the two, correct? What are the back heights for those? Greg had a good point about blocking sound, although I expect to be in the front row most of the time.

Bud

rsh

04-12-06, 10:55 AM

Bud,

The 086 have dimensions of the 088s - same chair, different back cushion (http://rtheaters.com/bsch086.html) The 079 are essentially 090s with similar cushion of the 086.

Unfortunately the only pieces which are left on the 079s are 53 and 52.

53
IO

52
OI

The 090/079s will not block your surround sound unless you are shorter than 5'8" - 5'9"

Roman

chinadog

04-12-06, 11:09 AM

Roman,

Thanks, that's definately helpful, but unfortunate about the limitation on the 79s. I guess thats why they're a deal. I'll think through the new options.

Bud

dc_pilgrim

04-12-06, 11:44 AM

Bud - duly noted on the dimming materials. Still a ways off before I figure out dimming (insteon/X-10 vs Graphic Eye), but I appreciate the write up.

I am late to the game, but I like options A, C, and E for the seats. But its mostly a more is better approach.

chinadog

04-12-06, 12:00 PM

Dave,

I expect the technology will change anyway. I just got the Smarthome catalog and it looks like there are more and more Insteon products. Who knows what'll be availble when you're ready.

Bud

documentarymaker

04-12-06, 03:31 PM

Bud -

I got my 088's at Leather World in Norcross. About $400.00 a seat no power and covered in a gray nu-suede material. Theyre sitting there now in their warehouse waiting for me to finish the room.

Kevin -

PS.. they have them there in groups so you can sit on a bunch of the different model numbers..

chinadog

04-12-06, 03:35 PM

Kevin,

Thanks. Seems like there are a few options I can check out now in the area. I may be able to check them out Friday on the way to pick up my brother from the airport.

Bud

documentarymaker

04-12-06, 04:21 PM

what was cool about Leather world was that they had a bunch of different manufacturers represented. I think Palliser and a few other folks. A big area with just theater seating and all of them in groups of three and four so you could take measurements as well. . If you cant find something that works there.....

Kevin -

chinadog

04-13-06, 01:52 PM

I ordered paint grade trim for the basement this morning (minus the HT and concession rooms, which I'll get later and get stain grade) through my neighbor. He said he'd have it here today, although not sure I'd be able to do anything for a few days anyway. I calculated that I needed about 450 feet of crown and 150 feet of base molding. This includes an extra 10%. Not looking forward to seeing this bill...

Bud
Great Googly Moogly! (http://newmail.monsterserve.com/keepout/misc/googly.wav)

I just got the trim bill from my neighbor. ONLY 262.00! Man, paint grade crown for 0.29 a foot and 5 1/4" base for 0.69 a foot. That's like 1/5 of the Home Depot cost. No wonder his house is so nice, he gets everything so cheap!

Bud

chinadog

04-13-06, 03:24 PM

richh

04-13-06, 06:36 PM

Question for your folks that have the 088s. Are the armrests sufficient? Based on my calculations the 088s have are about 4.5 inches wide and the 090 armrests are 7 inches wide. Any comments there?

I'm trying to sit in them tomorrow, but was curious if anyone had opinions.

Bud

Depends on how big your arms are as well as how much your mid section spaces them out :) . This is where a curved section would help as those arms are about 8" near the backrest, tapering to about 5" in the front. That's plenty in my opinion, we've never had any issues with bumping elbows.

chinadog

04-13-06, 09:11 PM

Rich, thanks. True about the wedge, didn't think about that. I'm hoping I'll be able to sit in them tomorrow and see what happens.

Bud

jerrodshook

04-14-06, 01:36 AM

Damn... I was about 200 posts behind in your thread. I can't even remember everything I read, so I'll just say get back to work and quit worrying about chairs. :p

chinadog

04-14-06, 07:20 AM

It may be a few days.... my brother and his family arrive today, my sister and her family arrive next week. Between all the trips back and forth to the airport, Easter, Braves game, Aquarium visit, etc. I'm not going to get much done for about a week. Maybe some small things here or there. A few coats of stain on some trim, etc.

Oh and then there's work, that nasty little booger.

Bud

chinadog

04-14-06, 12:44 PM

OK, I lied. :rolleyes:

I snuck downstairs during lunch and put up my tracking for the last section of GOM around the projector. As you can see, the track goes around the box. When I put the sliding portion of the box up, I left myself about a 1/4 inch of room to allow the box to slide without touching the installed GOM on the soffit. I mitred the corners of the track and glued/screwed them. I actually put the front piece in the wrong position, but realized that and corrected it quickly.

I also need to order like 1 yard of black GOM for the box. :mad:

http://images17.fotki.com/v294/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0860-vi.jpg
http://images16.fotki.com/v288/photos/6/649633/3052581/100_0861-vi.jpg

Bud

dropper

04-14-06, 03:55 PM

Please forgive me, but what is GOM?

Thanks,
Keith

GPowers

04-14-06, 05:18 PM

Please forgive me, but what is GOM?

Thanks,
Keith

Guilford of Maine the company that makes the fabric. It a commercial
grade fabric that has an approved fire rating for wall surfaces

chinadog

04-14-06, 06:13 PM

Well, it took me 2 hours and 15 mins to get back from the airport today, normally 45 minutes with no traffic. MAN!

I went to Georgia Home Theater on Cobb Parkway in Marietta. They had the 88s and the 90s. I was surprised that my legs actually were supported as well as they were with the 88s. For me, it did feel a little small though. It's a tough call. If I had another foot or two in width, I'd definitely go the 090s route. I think they're a good size for me. Anyway, need to chew on it a little more.

Bud

ridetheducati

04-14-06, 09:50 PM

How long did you sit in the 88's? I have learned it takes roughly 30-45 minutes to get a feel for a chair. Like you, I am torn between (3) 88's or (2) 90's for my back row.

chinadog

04-14-06, 10:06 PM

Not too long, proably less than 10 mins each seat. I sat in a lot of traffic heading down there (about 1/2 an hour away) on the way to the airport, so I was pressed for time. Who knows, I may take another run down next week.

Bud

sdspga

04-14-06, 10:38 PM

Well, it took me 2 hours and 15 mins to get back from the airport today, normally 45 minutes with no traffic. MAN!

Well, that helps confirm it.....Atlanta traffic really is worse than Chicago. I thought doing battle on the Kennedy Expressway was bad, but I have always heard Atlanta is worse. You should stock some mannequins in the trunk so you can pull them out and use that carpool lane when necessary :)

Have a great weekend Bud!

Scott

jerrodshook

04-14-06, 11:27 PM

chinadog

04-15-06, 07:26 AM

!

Well, that helps confirm it.....Atlanta traffic really is worse than Chicago. I thought doing battle on the Kennedy Expressway was bad, but I have always heard Atlanta is worse. You should stock some mannequins in the trunk so you can pull them out and use that carpool lane when necessary :)

Have a great weekend Bud!

Scott

Scott,

Thanks.

I had 5 people in the car. The HOV lanes don't make a difference, since they eventually just merge into the regular highway 15 miles south of where I have to get off anyway. Those 15 miles are the worst, too. It was the early rush hour due to the holiday. I know ALL the shortcuts, tricks and traffic patterns, it was just bad timing.

Bud

chinadog

04-15-06, 07:28 AM

I'm thinking about the Berks a bit more now. I used to have a source to get the Coaster chairs at cost, but it's no more. The 88's would let me do a 3 row and 4 in the back... what you're thinking right?

BTW, the hushbox and the sliding deal is a great idea.

Thanks. Yeah, take a gander at those pictures I posted and that'll give you an idea of widths of 88s and 90s in multiple configurations.

Oh, and stop talking about chairs and get back to work. ;)

Bud

chinadog

04-16-06, 09:49 AM

Had the chance to finish out the GOM under the soffit around the projector. The first shot is a little blurry, but shows the GOMed area around the mounted portion of the box. I basically started by stapling on the back wall, then worked my way forward, making sure I tucked the section sides in the track as I went to keep it taunt. I had taken the projector down, so I just had to work around the mount by taking out the waste for the box, then kept tucking into the track I installed around it. I just kept tucking and trimming until the underside of the soffit was complete, then worked it up over the cove and stapled in the trey. I finished out the seams on the slanted part of the cove by using a cardboard piece to give me the clean edge and used brads to secure it. The second shot is with the box resinstalled. I have enough room to slide the box back without touching the GOM.

http://images16.fotki.com/v300/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0865-vi.jpg
http://images17.fotki.com/v296/photos/6/649633/3018602/100_0867-vi.jpg

I may have enough black GOM now to do the box, will try and get that done today if I have the chance.

Happy Easter!

Bud

jikkjack

04-17-06, 09:54 AM

Looks great Bud! Check your PM.

Jason

chinadog

04-17-06, 12:16 PM

Had a couple of hours this am, since I had taken the day off. Well, just had what I would call a major mishap. I was starting to stain the door jamb into the theater room when I dropped the half quart of stain I was holding! :eek: It went all over the place, including all over me. Most of it ended up on the outside of the theater room, but some ended up on the riser. Fortunately, not a single drop ended on the fabric on the walls. MAN, WAS I LUCKY! It ended up all over the walls on the outside of the theater room, the stairs, the floor and all over me. Luckily I was able to wipe down the jamb quickly before it messed that up. :(

Bud

ronnie_jackson

04-17-06, 12:31 PM

Thats what happens when you start drinking early in the morning. :D You better stick to the coffee from now on.

Ronnie

jandawil

04-17-06, 12:40 PM