Add Cooling Fan to A/V Cabinet [Text View] - Page 2

bricot

04-01-08, 01:56 PM

bricot,

yeah, I was looking at something like the SilenX 4 channel controller from frozencpu.com. It might even cut some of the 14 db noise to less than that with a little slower speed, and it will control up to 4 fans. So this leaves me room to grow if I want to add fans elsewhere in the unit I'm building. The two I am putting now are going to be in a shelf above my LCD in order to exhaust some or the hot air behind the unit.

Thanks for the input.....DMAN

I found a 6 fan controller, which you can double up fans and control 2 fans off each channel. The corners of the cabinet I am building are mitered to 45 degrees and I'm thinking of putting one 80mm fan on each corner for each shelf. This would give me 2 fans per shelf blowing filtered air in then i will run 1 - 2 fans out of the back.

Coolerguys are 4 - 6 weeks out from production on a thermal controller set to kick on anything plugged into it at 80 degrees.

I'll try and post a pic of my cabinet design tonight.

DMAN11

04-01-08, 04:38 PM

bricot,

where is that 6 fan controller from?? sounds interesting. and can't wait to see the pics...

DMAN

gosurf

04-01-08, 05:42 PM

Yes I do. I have about 8-9 inches above it and about 2" on each side. There will also be space behind it as the shelf that it's gona sit on is only 20" deep and I'll have it all the way to the front. There will be no doors or anything like that, so it will get plenty of air to it.... And of course, I will have 6" X 1.5" slots cut out of the backs of the shelves for wires to pass through and extra heat exhaust too.

You think that will suffice? or should I go ahead and order at least 1 more fan?....

I'm attaching a pic of the concept pic I did for the unit........

Thanks......DMAN

DMAN,

That is going to be a very nice set up. What size is the TV?

Here is what my receiver manual says "...Leave 8" of free space at the top and sides and 4" at the rear. The rear edge of the shelf above the receiver shall be set 4" away from the rear panel or wall..." Yours is probably similar so you may be a little thin on the sides, but it looks like your receiver should be ok. I would try it without a fan, monitor the receiver temperature - you can get another fan later if you need to.

Make sure the airflow can go from low to high behind your TV. The warm air will want to do this naturally, but the fans in the shelf above the TV could also draw cold air in over the top of the TV which reduces the amount of hot air that they exhaust. I read a good article about this not too long ago - I will try to find it and post a link.

DMAN11

04-02-08, 12:35 AM

DMAN,

That is going to be a very nice set up. What size is the TV?

Here is what my receiver manual says "...Leave 8" of free space at the top and sides and 4" at the rear. The rear edge of the shelf above the receiver shall be set 4" away from the rear panel or wall..." Yours is probably similar so you may be a little thin on the sides, but it looks like your receiver should be ok. I would try it without a fan, monitor the receiver temperature - you can get another fan later if you need to.

Make sure the airflow can go from low to high behind your TV. The warm air will want to do this naturally, but the fans in the shelf above the TV could also draw cold air in over the top of the TV which reduces the amount of hot air that they exhaust. I read a good article about this not too long ago - I will try to find it and post a link.
Thanks gosurf,,,,, the compliments are much appreciated. I have a Sony Wega 50" LCD, and it is gonna have about 3" around the sides and top, so not sure if the cold air intrusion will affect the hot air exhaust or not. If it does though, how bout this for a remedy.....I can put a "petition" if you will with something like a piece of trim across the top to minimize the cold air coming in from the top and it will be forcing the hot air out through the back??? What do you think?

As for the manual, I'm hoping 2 out of 3 is gonna do it for me,,,,cause hey, 2 out of 3 aint bad....hehehe And like I said before, I can always add a fan behind the receiver if I need to.

We got everything primed, textured, and 1st coat of paint done so far. After second coat of paint, it's on to building shelves,,,,, and then figuring out how I'm gonna route wires, what new cables I'll need to buy, and all that fun stuff....

I'll keep you guys informed of the progress.

DMAN

bricot

04-02-08, 12:49 AM

bricot,

where is that 6 fan controller from?? sounds interesting. and can't wait to see the pics...

DMAN

Coolerguys had the 6 port unit.

Here is one view of the cabinet, it will have a pivoting glass door in the front. The shelves end 6" before the back of the cabinet for running wires. the back has two doors attached with european style cabinet hinges.
The holes are where i will mount the speakers on the inside with flush mount black filter screens on the outside over the holes. I am going to try it with the fans mounted in intake mode (positive pressure) bring air in through the filtered screens and out through 1 - 2 fans/vents in the back.

http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/2016/avcabinetassembledfansvrx4.jpg

boomer-sooner

04-08-08, 05:45 AM

The 604/674/705 has a power switcher on the back, the 605 does not. I have a thermo coupler inline on mine that is set for 80 degrees, when it reaches that temp then the fan comes one, when the receiver is off and temp is under 80 it shuts off automajically.

Could explain this setup? Any pics? I've got the Onkyo 605 as well, along with a PS3 that generates a lot of heat. Thanks to this thread, I've figured out exactly what I want to do but I really don't want to just leave the fans on non-stop. How does the inline thermocouple work?

Also, does everyone mount the body of the fan on the outside or inside? I can't wait to get this done. I'm so paranoid about the heat in my cabinet as it is.

Erick298

04-11-08, 03:07 AM

here is my setup. the two 80mm fans that push like 22 cfm amount of airflow. both are exhaust. the receiver is fine, im just worried about the ps3 because as u know the fans kick in when it gets to a certain temp in the ps3 which i am experiencing even though i have these two fans installed. the ps3 get pretty loud for 10 min or so then the fans slow down. the cabinet has doors on them but i have them open really most of the time.

any suggestions? do u think getting different fans that have more airflow or get the fans that attach to the ps3?

gosurf

04-15-08, 01:49 AM

Erick - When both cabinet doors are open, the fans are mostly just exhausting room air, not the warm air from your ps3. Try closing the cabinet door infront of the fans. That may help pull cool air across/through the unit and exhaust the warm air.

stoneag

04-16-08, 02:10 PM

bricot

04-21-08, 11:10 AM

Here is a basic sketch of my situation. I am able to mount the two fans behind the a/v gear because the build-in is about 30" deep. The question is whether or not to draw air in from the front of the enclosure holding the equipment (not shown) or draw air from the shelf below (should be at room temp) and exhaust out the front of the a/v enclosure. I have purchased 2 of the scythe fans that will power on with the receiver. I am also debating the benefit of constructing wedges to direct the air flow towards the front rather than straight up.

I could also do one intake and one exhaust in the back but it seems that may short circuit the flow. Venting anywhere but through the shelf the equipment is sitting on isn't an option.

Thanks for any thoughts.

Can't open your drawing. I wouldn't mount both fans in the back with one in exhaust and one in intake mode, your likely to get areas of no circulation. I would draw air in from the front and across your components and out the back in that scenario. There are quite a few people that have gone with mounting fans in the center of the shelves blowing up through their components from shelf to shelf and exhaust out of the top. What ever you do try to use the natural thermal effects of heat rising, chimney effect, etc.

If your going to with positive pressure you need a 2 to 1 (intake to exhaust) ratio.

sskkant

04-22-08, 12:55 PM

I used LUX Programmable thermostat - WIN100 luxproducts.com/thermostats/win100.htm , very effectively to turn the fans in the cabinet ON when the temp in the cabinet reached 90.

It has a power outlet that turns ON and OFF at the temp setting. I connected the vent fans plug to the outlet and presto its done. If you need pictures or more explanation on this email me at sskkant@hotmail.com

-Sri

sabes

05-27-08, 08:52 PM

Why do you think you even need to vent it going to outdoors? Seems like a lot of unnecessary work. And like you mention, preventing moisture from getting in and building up could be a real problem, and also one that may be near impossible to deal with without spending a lot of money. Besides if it really get so hot inside that cabinet that it needs to be vented to the outdoors, then it's probably time to consider routing some sort of a small dedicated A/C device just to the cabinet. Installing cooling fans and venting to the room itself, should provide all the circulation you will need to prevent overheating.

anyone seen any such a/c devices?

Johnla

05-28-08, 05:01 AM

anyone seen any such a/c devices?

Yeah, they are called the smallest air conditioner that you can find, and then adapting it to work with a cabinet. And then you will need to figure out how to duct the hot air exhaust from the A/C unit itself to the outside, otherwise it will also heat up the room if you just let it exhaust into the room. Otherwise just buy the smallest window mount A/C unit that you can find put it in a window, or a outside wall, or in a basement or garage, and make up some form of ductwork that runs the cooled air from it into the cabinet instead of the room. There are also few portable two piece air conditioners that you could buy that come with a flexable duct to put in a window for the hot exhaust, which might make it a little easier to do but also at a higher cost. Or you can do a search for "Enclosure air conditioners", and come up with sites like this http://www.eicsolutionsinc.com/thermoelectric_cooling_systems.htm
And there are also the small air conditioners that are designed for server rack use, which would probably be easy to use as a A/V cabinet A/C unit also, and those seem to start at about $3,000 and up.

So if you thought there was something you might find for for $50-$75 or so and that is dedicated and designed to do this, that is probably not going to happen.

mgorsk02

05-28-08, 09:34 AM

First off -- Thanks everyone in this thread for all your input. I ended up getting 4 S-Flex fans and using a 4.5 inch hold saw and velcro as mouting (all ideas I got from this thread). I have 4 levels of my completely enclosed (glass front) cabinet that are now always cool. As a test I left my PS3, SA8300HD, XBOX360, Wii, and Sony Receiver all on for about 4 hours yesterday and I had no problems. Before, the PS3 would go into turbo fan mode (very distracting for me) and heat would really build up.

Now for my problem. I was positive that my Receiver had a switched outlet. I was wrong. This would have been perfect because I want the fans to come on when I am watching or playing anything on the TV. I don't like leaving stuff on when I am not home and it seems like a waste to leave them on 24 hours a day.

Does anyone know of a device that will switch one AC outlet on through an IR command? Ideally I would like to use my Harmony One to send the ON command with every activity and then shut off when I end it. I looked and looked but can only find RF devices. Are there any other options aside from buying a new receiver with an AC outlet?

sabes

05-28-08, 09:37 AM

Yeah, they are called the smallest air conditioner that you can find, and then adapting it to work with a cabinet. And then you will need to figure out how to duct the hot air exhaust from the A/C unit itself to the outside, otherwise it will also heat up the room if you just let it exhaust into the room. Otherwise just buy the smallest window mount A/C unit that you can find put it in a window, or a outside wall, or in a basement or garage, and make up some form of ductwork that runs the cooled air from it into the cabinet instead of the room. There are also few portable two piece air conditioners that you could buy that come with a flexable duct to put in a window for the hot exhaust, which might make it a little easier to do but also at a higher cost. Or you can do a search for "Enclosure air conditioners", and come up with sites like this http://www.eicsolutionsinc.com/thermoelectric_cooling_systems.htm
And there are also the small air conditioners that are designed for server rack use, which would probably be easy to use as a A/V cabinet A/C unit also, and those seem to start at about $3,000 and up.

So if you thought there was something you might find for for $50-$75 or so and that is dedicated and designed to do this, that is probably not going to happen.

thanks - very helpful. i am unfortunately resigned to the fact that this may be expensive, but losing my components to heat would be even worse! anyone implement an a/c system?

mak99

05-29-08, 08:15 PM

thanks - very helpful. i am unfortunately resigned to the fact that this may be expensive, but losing my components to heat would be even worse! anyone implement an a/c system?
Hey, I work for a mechanical contractor and would love to sell everyone here a dedicated HVAC system for their gear!!! :rolleyes:

Personally, I think it's talking overkill with AC for your gear, unless you have an impressive, high-$$ installation in a poorly/non-ventilated closet. For the equipment stands/racks/cabinets/gear and such that are being described here (like my own), installing some small fans and smartly-located inlets should do the job 99% of the time.

Bring the air into your cabinet from an opening near the floor, this is where air will be coolest (hot air rises!). I just bought a white, plastic toe-kick grill from Home Depot last week to install in my built-in bookcase cabinet - it's about 2" x 10" and cost less than $10. It will be on the bottom shelf of the cabinet, and you will not see it with the doors closed. The grille will be about 4" from the floor.

Locate a small fan up high within the cabinet to exhaust the warmer air out, preferable close to your hotter gear (amps, DVRs, etc.). Or at the least, drill some decent sized holes in lieu of any fans to let the heat escape.

I just bought two Scythe SFF21D fans to place on the extra 1.5" dia holes in the top rear of my cabinet (plenty of depth behind the LCD TV) to draw the air thru. (There are five 1.5" dia holes evenly spaced, for cable routing and ventilation). I had the guys in the shop make two small square metal "cans" to use, about 5"x5"x5", with an open top and bottom to use as plenums. The bottom opening of these cans will sit over the 1.5" hole, and the fan will be screwed to the top opening as it has a 1" flange all around (3" square opening). I will have two of these fan/cans assembly for placement flexibility.

Personally I think this is overkill, but my Yamaha amp does heat up quite a bit over a few hours of TV or HD DVD watching...

sabes

05-29-08, 09:48 PM

Hey, I work for a mechanical contractor and would love to sell everyone here a dedicated HVAC system for their gear!!! :rolleyes:

Personally, I think it's talking overkill with AC for your gear, unless you have an impressive, high-$$ installation in a poorly/non-ventilated closet. For the equipment stands/racks/cabinets/gear and such that are being described here (like my own), installing some small fans and smartly-located inlets should do the job 99% of the time.

Bring the air into your cabinet from an opening near the floor, this is where air will be coolest (hot air rises!). I just bought a white, plastic toe-kick grill from Home Depot last week to install in my built-in bookcase cabinet - it's about 2" x 10" and cost less than $10. It will be on the bottom shelf of the cabinet, and you will not see it with the doors closed. The grille will be about 4" from the floor.

Locate a small fan up high within the cabinet to exhaust the warmer air out, preferable close to your hotter gear (amps, DVRs, etc.). Or at the least, drill some decent sized holes in lieu of any fans to let the heat escape.

I just bought two Scythe SFF21D fans to place on the extra 1.5" dia holes in the top rear of my cabinet (plenty of depth behind the LCD TV) to draw the air thru. (There are five 1.5" dia holes evenly spaced, for cable routing and ventilation). I had the guys in the shop make two small square metal "cans" to use, about 5"x5"x5", with an open top and bottom to use as plenums. The bottom opening of these cans will sit over the 1.5" hole, and the fan will be screwed to the top opening as it has a 1" flange all around (3" square opening). I will have two of these fan/cans assembly for placement flexibility.

Personally I think this is overkill, but my Yamaha amp does heat up quite a bit over a few hours of TV or HD DVD watching...

this is useful info - thanks - sounds like we've got similar setups. my airholes/chimneys behind my plasma just aren't sufficient, so i guess the best thing is to add the fans and a cold air vent at the bottom of the cabinet. enough of the a/c flights of fancy...

mak99

05-29-08, 10:37 PM

this is useful info - thanks - sounds like we've got similar setups. my airholes/chimneys behind my plasma just aren't sufficient, so i guess the best thing is to add the fans and a cold air vent at the bottom of the cabinet. enough of the a/c flights of fancy...
I'll try to post up a pic of my fan/can arrangement, not sure my description is quite adequate! Good thing the guys in the shop knew exactly what I was describing to them... ;)

patniemeyer

06-02-08, 12:11 PM

A small 12v computer fan venting continuously near the top of the cabinet will be inaudibly quiet and will cool the entire cabinet just fine... I have a 3" fan that's not even fully open to the outside (partially obstructed) and it keeps my Vip622 and Mac mini perfectly cool. It cost about $5 plus an AC adapter.

Now, when I run my XBox I open the cabinet door... but for general use a little trickle of air exiting near the top of the cabinet is all that's needed to vent the hot air and draw in some cool.

Pat

yamahaSHO

06-02-08, 12:49 PM

I was able to set it up to where I didn't have to open the cabinets even to play Xbox.

bricot

06-02-08, 12:53 PM

jlaavenger

06-23-08, 07:59 AM

I'm thinking this looks like a good solution.
http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g36/c15/s566/list/p1/Fans-12_Volt_Fans-250mm_x_30mm_LED_Fans-Page1.html

I have this entertainment center. http://www.flickr.com/photos/19174313@N04/2560633533/
The bottom center door has a glass panel option and has one shelf inside. The other two bottom doors have fabric panel replacement options each with one shelf and all have vents in the bottom. I'm thinking one fan each at the back of the three enclosures.
BTW, The bridge above the TV is adjustable. And the TV stand is exactly 57" wide. (For the TV I'm going with either the LN52A750 or the Pioneer 111fd)

My components will include:
Monster AVS 2000 Voltage Stabilizer
Monster HDP 2400 Reference center
Sony PS3 (60gb)
Oppo 983H (DVD Player)
Dish Network 722vip DVR
a JVC VCR
and either
Pioneer VSX-01THX or the Denon 2309CI AVR

Any advice? Is this a good solution? What kind of power supply would I need?

Heboil

06-24-08, 05:16 PM

I have a separate cubby hole cut into a wall in my home theater to house my gear. The "cubby" room is actually a little cubicle I built out of drywall in my furnace room. The backside of this equipment cubicle is a sheet of pegboard with handles that allow me to remove it. I cut a large hole in the pegboard to allow even more air flow, but the equipment rack still gets too overheated. As the room is soundproofed from the equipment, could I put a 9" window fan on the backside of the pegboard and exhaust the air out into the furnace room? I can set it to air exchange, so one takes in, one exhausts.

LINK (http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=974742&Ntt=974742&catalogId=10053&langId=-15&storeId=10051&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=51%20112108&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber)

Just don't want to go to the length of building all this out of computer parts and wall warts when I can get something pre-built and inexpensive that will do the same job for me. Thanks.

jlaavenger

06-24-08, 05:34 PM

RichTJ99

07-14-08, 10:06 PM

Does someone sell a 4 fan temp controlled power unit (plug all four fans into the temp controlled power unit?

jlaavenger

07-14-08, 11:54 PM

RichTJ99

07-15-08, 09:57 PM

Hi,

I ended up making my own kit (parts are on the way). I had one question on mounting the fans. I noticed some talk of using isolators to make the fans not vibrate. How is this done? Do I just get some rubber to put between the back of the cabinet & the fan (so the screws are sitting on the rubber itself)?

Im a little confused on the isolation techniques.

Thanks,
Rich

MrEastSide

07-19-08, 12:20 AM

I decided to do a little custom cooling. When I realized that the power adapter that came with the cooler I ordered had 4 pin connectors that fit standard PC fans I bought 3 PC fans from my work. I rigged them all together and made a sweet fan/light bar. And with this many fans going my receiver runs about 25 degrees cooler, sometimes better. Now, granted, these pictures were taken after the receiver had been on for a while and I just started the fans up. So that's why it still reads 113.

The original cooler ended up not being what I thought it was which is why I bought these once I realized I had the power adapter.

http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m337/MeatyKnuckle/DSC_0158.jpg

http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m337/MeatyKnuckle/DSC_0160.jpg

http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m337/MeatyKnuckle/DSC_0162.jpg

http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m337/MeatyKnuckle/DSC_0164.jpg

http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m337/MeatyKnuckle/DSC_0165.jpg

Jetmeck

07-19-08, 02:41 AM

So some receivers have a temperature sensor and readout built in ?

NickyD

07-19-08, 11:12 AM

I decided to do a little custom cooling. When I realized that the power adapter that came with the cooler I ordered had 4 pin connectors that fit standard PC fans I bought 3 PC fans from my work. I rigged them all together and made a sweet fan/light bar. And with this many fans going my receiver runs about 25 degrees cooler, sometimes better. Now, granted, these pictures were taken after the receiver had been on for a while and I just started the fans up. So that's why it still reads 113.

The original cooler ended up not being what I thought it was which is why I bought these once I realized I had the power adapter.

So how good does it work, especially with the 360 running. My setup is similar to what you have with my 360 over my receiver and I need to get better cooling. I have one fan that has helped but I jsut have not mounted anything permanent. Are you just leaving these fans on top of the receiver and do you have any venting out the back?

WilliamZX11

07-19-08, 01:24 PM

The original cooler ended up not being what I thought it was which is why I bought these once I realized I had the power adapter.

http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m337/MeatyKnuckle/DSC_0165.jpg

Don't you find the blue LED fans just a little distracting? Would drive me nuts.

MrEastSide

07-19-08, 02:40 PM

^ To be honest, it's not quite as bright as it looks in the pictures. That was taken with absolutely every light in the room off. I rarely watch TV with no lights on at all. And with a light on it's not intrusive at all. But, even with the lights off it's not as bad as it appears. I can also slide it to the back vents of the receiver and then it is out of sight. But, I was concerned about the blue lights once I put it all together. It just hadn't really occurred to me in the beginning.

So how good does it work, especially with the 360 running. My setup is similar to what you have with my 360 over my receiver and I need to get better cooling. I have one fan that has helped but I jsut have not mounted anything permanent. Are you just leaving these fans on top of the receiver and do you have any venting out the back?

It's just these three fans on the top. And then in the rear corner you may be able to see another fan. I added that one just cause I had it, but it doesn't bring the temp down any further than the 3 when they run alone. The receiver was running at around 120F before and with these fans it stays around 98F most of the time. Of course, your mileage will vary depending on the receiver, other heat generating components you have near the receiver, where you place the fans on the receiver, etc... I did have to tinker around a bit with fan placement. I ran the receiver with the fans over each area of vents for a few days until I figured out where the best spot was. It's also, surprisingly whisper quiet. I can't hear the things unless I am down on the floor right next to the receiver.

yamahaSHO

07-19-08, 02:42 PM

Why 3 - 80mm fans instead of 2 - 120mm fans?

aaronwt

07-19-08, 02:57 PM

Why 3 - 80mm fans instead of 2 - 120mm fans?

One 120mm fan should be enough

yamahaSHO

07-19-08, 03:00 PM

I was just thinking of cooling area when I said 2 - 120's, but I agree that a single 120mm would get the job done and be more quiet.

MrEastSide

07-19-08, 03:58 PM

Well, a 120 would have worked fine I'm sure. I just thought maybe having a little strip with the 3 80mm fans would look nicer than just slapping a large 120mm over the receiver. The 80mm fans cover the vents perfectly. So I just put 3 of them together because it almost matches the front vents perfectly. You can't hear them as it is so the noise is a non-issue.

blackfordgr

07-19-08, 05:40 PM

if you use a 12dc wall wart as you call it. can you solder 2 12v computer fans to it or should you have 1 fan per power source?

Bob7145

07-20-08, 12:49 PM

blackfordgr

07-20-08, 04:50 PM

1 wall wart should do it. Compare the Amp rating on the wart to the fans. Most computer fans draw very little current especially the quiet ones.:) Best if you can put a molex plug on the wart for connecting the fans.

http://www.crazypc.com/products/cableswires/cables.htm#wireconverters

the fans i have dont have a plug on the end. just bare wires so i thought about solder the correct wires together then use heat shrink tubing to protect it. Im thinking i need 4 fans total. 2 on the upper part and 2 inthe lower part, maybe have the upper fans exhaust the heat out since heat rises and have the lower fans blow in. here is what my entertainment stand looks like.
http://i.walmartimages.com/i/p/00/04/26/66/60/0004266660591_215X215.jpg

Dexterryu

07-25-08, 03:51 PM

I'm having heat issues with both my 360 and PS3. My cabinet is enclosed so I need to find a way to get some ventalation. Here are a couple of pics oo my setup (not the best pic for this question, I know).
Front: http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e332/dexterryu/CIMG1055.jpg
Side: http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e332/dexterryu/CIMG1058.jpg

The first action item I have is to get the power strip and surge protector out of the cabinet (was a bad idea to put them in there to begin with). So that should help some. The next thing I'm planning is to get some fans going in there.

I'm thinking of buying two of these: http://www.coolerguys.com/840556082224.html

I'd like to put one in the back of each of the two compartments. I think that should help immensely. The question is on each kit should I mount one fan in for cooling and one fan out for exhaust? Would it be better to just have them both exhaust?

Bob7145

07-25-08, 04:54 PM

the fans i have dont have a plug on the end. just bare wires so i thought about solder the correct wires together then use heat shrink tubing to protect it. Im thinking i need 4 fans total. 2 on the upper part and 2 inthe lower part, maybe have the upper fans exhaust the heat out since heat rises and have the lower fans blow in. here is what my entertainment stand looks like.
http://i.walmartimages.com/i/p/00/04/26/66/60/0004266660591_215X215.jpg

Right, I mentioned those connectors because they are inexpensive and you just cut they wires on the connector you wish to use and solder them to your fan. This way you can use the SilentX fan controller mentioned earlier in this thread.

Or just buy new fans with connectors on them. They are pretty inexpensive. But so is a 120V 12" fan!:)

iamhowie

07-30-08, 08:43 AM

Is it better to use intake pulling air in or exhaust to lower the cabinet temperature?

blackfordgr

07-30-08, 08:47 PM

i think it would be better to get that hot air out. but i think i might do one fan blowing in and one sucking out.

trekguy

07-31-08, 01:48 PM

Most cabinets are not air tight. Lots of air can enter around the doors for example. PC builders know that one fan for intake and one for exhaust will not move a great deal more air that one fan exhaust fan. Use the slowest and quietest fans you can get, mounted high as exhaust fans.

If necessary you can drill some holes in the base or low back of the cabinet to allow more are to enter. Ideally you will force the incoming are to make at least one 90 degree turn so that dust drops out, but that is not always possible as a retrofit.

I have a somewhat crowded cabinet with solid pull out shelves. Air can move past the front and back edges of each shelf. As I added more and different hardware I found some hot spots and added an interior fan to improve circulation. I now have two exhaust fans mounted at the top rear, and because my doors are weather stripped for noise control, a row of intake holes beneath the lowest shelf but toward the front.

I used two fans so that I could run them at a lower voltage and reduced noise level.

FORIAMBILL

08-20-08, 08:43 PM

I've crammed my avr into a semi open hole in my cabinet (open in front). There's about an inch above the receiver. My STB is behind a closed door, with plenty space immediately around it. should I go with fans that sit on the components like this (http://www.buyextras.com/evavcoblfanf.html), or vent holes in the back of the cabinet with fans like this (http://www.coolcomponents.com/Cabinet-Vent--Black-wPower-Supply_p_8-196.html).

here's my cabinet
http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff276/FORIAMBILL/IMG_1792.jpg

MrEastSide

08-23-08, 12:31 AM

Bob7145

08-23-08, 06:30 AM

ccotenj

08-24-08, 12:16 PM

FORIAMBILL,
Whatever that is under the AVR, take it out! Even with it out a fan on top of the AVR would just recycle the hot air unless the air has somewhere to go. A second fan behind the AVR at the top of that compartment would help some. Moving the AVR out of the cabinet would be best.

+1... that avr has got to be baking in there...

move the avr to the bottom shelf, and put the middle shelf as far up as possible and relocate the center channel there... put what is under the avr and the center channel somewhere else...

and then put in a fan(s)...

veekay

08-26-08, 10:55 AM

Has anyone had much success getting a PS3 running in an enclosed cabinet without sounding like a jet engine gone wrong? The 360 has no problem running with the door closed and barely even kicks the fan up, but the PS3 just won't stay out of the level 3/4 fan range even with multiple exhaust fans taking out the heat.

I know it is a mess in there, but so far everything works fine aside from the dysfunctional PS3. Keeping the door open does help the issue, but of course also defeats the purpose of being "enclosed" and lets all the noise out. Unless Sony redesigns the horribly inefficient cooling system in the PS3 I'm not sure what to try next aside from what was mentioned.

Larger picture Here (http://www.evildude.com/rack.jpg)

http://www.evildude.com/racksmall.jpg

Bob7145

08-26-08, 09:28 PM

I have never used one of these but looks good.
http://www.kellsystems.co.uk/24u_server_cabinet.asp
My 24U cabinet has dark acrylic door and 2 120mm fans on top.

ciscore

08-27-08, 02:11 PM

For people looking for a cheap solution, I just found an old 4.5V sony walkman AC adapter in my basement. I'm running 2 80mm PC fans on it that I had laying around the office and they're basically silent. Also, they should pull plenty of air to suck the hot air out of my TV stand.

NickyD

08-28-08, 08:47 AM

veekay

08-28-08, 03:48 PM

Yes, dual fans sucking out the air and venting it in another location. Seems no matter how many fans I throw at that thing it just doesn't like having that door closed.

NickyD

08-28-08, 04:01 PM

Yes, dual fans sucking out the air and venting it in another location. Seems no matter how many fans I throw at that thing it just doesn't like having that door closed.

I don't know what to tell you, it looks like you have good ventilation, especially with the fans. Have you put any fans on the sides as well to maybe push air to the back of the unit? I don't know if this would help some. Can you move the PS3 to the lower rack and see if this helps. Last suggestion if you haven't done it already is to push the PS3 as far back as possible so that the rear is just out of the cabinet, other than that I am at a loss for you.

veekay

08-29-08, 01:44 PM

NickyD

08-29-08, 03:50 PM

Tried that too. Even a fan in the front to blow into the intake and one on the side. I had even made a ducting system to take the air directly out the back and route it out of the cabinet. The silly thing is that the air temp is very cool so I don't know why the fans insist on turning up so high

Wow, I can't believe that yours is that bad. How old is the PS3? Maybe there is a problem and it needs to go in for repair. I guess you can always put in on a block of dry ice, this should help some:)

Norky

08-30-08, 09:27 PM

I wanted to jump into this thread to ask how hot is too hot for a cabinet with av equipment?

In our motorhome we have a cabinet that has a dvd/vcr player, Hugh DirecTV DVR and 1 other additional direcTB receiver.

The temperature in the cabinet seems to run around 85-90°, is this too hot?
I have read this thread and there is a lot of discussion on how to cool the cabinets but could not find anything on what optimum temperature is.

Thanks in advance!

E-A-G-L-E-S

08-30-08, 09:35 PM

What would one reccomend to someone who's racks(2) are i na closet?
Above is the attic, the door to the closet stays open until bedtime, then fully open during any use.
So it seems the AC from the room is the cold air in(through the open door) and a fan to the attic on the ceiling of the closet would suck the rising hot air out.

What type of "inexpensive" options would that person have?

veekay

08-31-08, 10:24 PM

PS3 itself isn't the issue - tried with another one I have and it does the exact same thing. The cooling system on the PS3 is crappy, plain and simple, but shouldn't be this bad with such low temps circulating around. Maybe in a few more revisions it will be able to better cool itself - the rev 3 heatsinks are looking a little better so far, but of course that would have to be retrofitted onto the older 60gb unit.

Norky

09-01-08, 01:19 PM

NickyD

09-02-08, 08:45 AM

Since there has been no reply to my question on 8/30 about how hot is too hot for a cabinet housing av equipment, I must have not posted in the right place.

Can someone direct me to the proper AVS Forum to post the question again or perhaps a completely different forum website?

Thanks!

Sorry but I can't give you a specific number. I would imagine it all depends on what and how much equipment in the cabinet/same area. Some equipment creates more heat ie my Onkyo 905 puts out some serious heat. Your best bet is to get a temp gauge and see what your cabinet gets to. I would try to keep the cabinet as cool as possible, especially if you have alot of equipment.

ccotenj

09-02-08, 08:53 AM

Norky

09-03-08, 03:59 PM

Thanks for the replies.

I did not even think of checking the manuals! Will do so right away.

ccotenj

09-03-08, 05:48 PM

Thanks for the replies.

I did not even think of checking the manuals! Will do so right away.

well, it's never a bad thing to rtfm... ;)

bricot

09-08-08, 10:30 AM

I've been told that temps above 85 start degrading internal components .... fwiw.

swnewell

09-08-08, 09:27 PM

I have been looking for a decent looking, low cost (< $75), cooling solution for my Onkyo 805 receiver. It is in an open AV rack w/ 12" free space above. However, after a few CDs at moderate to loud volume it gets rather hot (can touch, but is hot). Since the rack is open I want something that looks betteer than a CPU fan on top the case.

After reading this thread I think I am going with the following:

- Comcool Cooling Stand Kit with Dual 120mm Fans, Large (~16" W x ~12.5" D x ~1.5" H). The kit is "all metal and black powder coated to match virtually any black component in your setup." (http://www.coolerguys.com/ccstandk.html)

Kit contains:
(2) 120mm Black Fan Grill / Guard
(1) 110v AC to 12v DC Power Supply with 4 Pin Molex Adapter
(2) Enermax Marathon Quiet Enlobal 120mm Fans 17 dBA, 44 CFM
(1) 3 pin Y-Adapter
(2) 4 pin to 3pin power adapters
(5) Rubber case foot bumpers

If the Ebermax fans are to loud (I sit 4' from the AV rack) I plan to replace w/ Scythe S-FLEX 120mm S-FDB Quiet Fans. I may also add the Coolerguys Thermal Fan Controller (On @ 86°F Off @ 81°F), but initially I plan to run off the switched power output from the receiver.

Coolerguys have appeared multiple times in this thread, but I have not seen if anyone has tried the Comcool Cooling Stand Kit. If so, did it perform as advertised?

Thanks

FThera

09-14-08, 12:55 PM

Grimdeath

09-14-08, 01:03 PM

I'm redoing my inclosed AV Cabinet and adding a couple of Scythe S-Flex 120mm fans. Does anyone have an opinion on were I should put the warmer running components (top or bottom). The components will include the "new" 80 gig PS3, and a Denon 1909. Intake air enters at the bottom front and around the door.

There are three levels in my cabinet. The bottom and middle have fan intakes. The top is an exhaust (all fans are 80mm). On the bottom I have my receiver. In the middle I have my Motorola DVR. On the top I have the PS3. The PS3 generates sooo much heat I found the best spot was the top shelf in my case. Otherwise, all the other components got fed hot air from the PS3.

DaveN

09-20-08, 08:58 PM

What size hole saw do you use for the 120mm Scythe fans? What is the fan diameter? I've ordered them based on this thread with the controller, grill, etc. but they won't be here until the end of next week.

AV TechnologyGuy

09-26-08, 01:48 PM

Be sure to establish a forced air path through your components. This is a vry common mistake, even amongst porfessionals. If not, the cool air will just remain somewhat idle in one area or run across the back of the components which is virtually ineffective.

paxtrix

09-26-08, 04:25 PM

blackfordgr

09-30-08, 10:48 AM

curious to know how many fans can you run off a 9vDC, 800ma adapter?

AV TechnologyGuy

09-30-08, 01:39 PM

It depends on the fans. You need to consider the current draw of the fans you use, but usually they do not require much. I often see four inch fans fans rated around 450mA. You still need to consider flow rate, noise, and failure (such as a fuse).

blackfordgr

09-30-08, 01:48 PM

mak99

10-01-08, 03:59 PM

Although my Onkyo 905 has never shut down and I have a very open custom built cabinet/closet with a return vent, I purchased the Antec A/V Cooler ($69.99) http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=75007# today from Fry's during lunch. I was wondering if anyone has used this cooler as of yet. After reading some of the issues others have been having I said what the heck, might as well add a little extra cooling.
FWIW, I was using this same cooler on top of my Onkyo 805, but was not too happy with it for a few reasons...

I felt the fan noise was noticeable, even on the low setting. And this was with the amp behind the frosted glass doors of my Salamander Synergy rack.
This cooler took up quite a bit of vertical space in my rack (almost 2"), compared to the cheap-o, ugly fan cooler (http://www.buyextras.com/evavcoblfanf.html#product_reviews) that the Antec replaced. My rack is a Twin 20 (17.75" clear height) with five components total, so space is at a premium. This would not be a concern if your rack has more real estate available.
The overall footprint of the cooler (~17"x14") covering almost the entire top of the Onkyo. I felt this might not allow heat to escape from areas not under the two Antec fans. The Onkyo manual calls for 8" clear above, IIRC. I'm sure I was worried about nothing... :o
The obnoxious blue light on the front! Of course, nothing a bit of electrical tape wouldn't fix. But still should have an option to disable the blue light...

I ended up removing the Antec (still need to sell!) and replaced with two dual-fan Cool Components (http://www.coolcomponents.com/Dual-Fan-Cooling-Unit_p_6-189.html) coolers (bought off fleaBay for less than $20 ea!) which I like much better - quieter, more fan speed adjustments, smaller footprint (6"x4") and vertical height (1"), and no dang lights!

Plus, you can precisely locate these smaller fan units directly above the hotter area of the amp. With the Antec, you just don't have this level of flexibility...

Just my two cents - hope this helps!

dahmanator

10-02-08, 12:18 AM

It sounds like a lot of folks have had success with the the SilenX 4 channel fan controller. I received mine today to pair with three Scythe S-FLEX (SFF21D) fans. I am thinking something is wrong with the controller. I can't get all three fans to spin up at the same time. If I plug in all three, none will spin up. If I plug in one, it will spin. Sometimes I can get two to spin up but never three. I don't have anything to see how much power is actually getting to the fans, but it seems like they probably aren't getting enough.

Has anyone else seen this behavior?

Thanks...

yamahaSHO

10-02-08, 07:28 AM

My first one was bad and wouldn't spin any fans. I returned it and got another and the new one works like it should. I would try returning it for another.

blackfordgr

10-03-08, 09:03 PM

i have 2 fans running. one shows 0.30amps and the other is 0.14amps.

dahmanator

10-03-08, 10:09 PM

I have another one on the way. We'll see how it goes.

-fingers and toes crossed

WilliamZX11

10-04-08, 11:00 AM

i have 2 fans running. one shows 0.30amps and the other is 0.14amps.

Your adapter is rated 800ma, which equals .8 amps. Your total load will be .44 amps. Your adapter is fine, no worries.

blackfordgr

10-05-08, 11:04 AM

Your adapter is rated 800ma, which equals .8 amps. Your total load will be .44 amps. Your adapter is fine, no worries.

so i could possibly add another fan and be safe. cool

Doc_Kracken

10-13-08, 08:25 AM

I am running two small silenx fans , one at the top exhaust, one at the bottom intake, I power both by a variable 12v adapter set to 9v, plugged into the switched outlet on the back of my HK AVR they come on when the AVR turns on, they are very quiet and work great. I have a cable box, receiver, cd player, and dvd player in the cabinet, with glass door, hope this helps...................the whole thing was under $50 to put together

dahmanator

10-13-08, 01:01 PM

I have another one on the way. We'll see how it goes.

-fingers and toes crossed
They sent me a replacement unit and when I plugged the new power supply into the original fan control unit, all the fans spun up. Looks like a bad power supply on the original.

mcjasonb

11-03-08, 09:54 PM

i plugged a fan into the switched AC plug thats in the back of my receiver. so anytime it's on the fan is on. and when it is turned off the fan turns off with it. i have it on the lowest speed setting. figured it would help pull hot air out of it even though it is pretty open around it.
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n159/cavalier94sq/IMG_3701.jpg

jlaavenger

11-04-08, 09:30 AM

What is considered normal for cabinet temps when the PS3 or Dish VIP722 is running? I have the three fan cooling solution from Cooler Guys http://www.coolerguys.com/840556082231.html sucking air out and my temp runs as high as 95 or 96 degrees F. when running. Is this acceptible? Or do I need to look at addition cooling?

chris88

11-07-08, 01:10 PM

How does the noise generated by the fans amplify? For example if I have 3 20dBA fans running is that the same as one 60dBA fan?

yamahaSHO

11-07-08, 02:17 PM

I can't explain it, but the answer is no. 60 dBA is CONSIDERABLY louder than 20.

emcgrath

11-08-08, 08:25 PM

It's called logarithms. 2 20 dBa fans are twice as loud as one. A factor of two is 3 dB. That means that they are 23 dBa. A factor of 3 is 4.7dB. So 3 20dBa fans is about 25 dba.

HTrayne

11-09-08, 12:28 AM

Hmmm...

Two PC power supply fans. Free

One 12v 300mA power supply with the end cut off Free

Tiny bit of solder and shrink tubing Free!

Nice cool components with barely a whisper from the fans Priceless.

Seriously. that's exactly what I did. The fans sit directly on top of my gear. Near the back of each piece. They cannot be seen unless you look really hard.

I tried line voltage fans. The whine was intolerable.

I'm PC-ignorant, but is this as easy as buying the fans and a power supply/adapter and plugging them into the wall or a switchable AVR outlet?

If so, how much noise is too much? Is anything under 30db ok? What CFM rating am I looking for? Can anyone point me in the right direction on Newegg or elsewhere as to what power outlet/adapter I need to buy?

I'm building a media closet for 1-2 AVR's, 2 HD receivers, a PS3, 360 Elite, a VCR, and maybe one other gaming system. I'll then be using the the shelves above and below for DVD storage. I'm not sure how many fans I should use.

Any help would be great - thanks!
Thanks!

carquote

11-12-08, 02:07 AM

Hey guys,

I'm new to the thread and am looking for a way to vent my new 80GB PS3 which is enclosed in the top cabinet of a pier behind doors as well as my amp and other components in the base of my TV stand. The PS3 seems to run very hot and with the doors open and an ambient room temp of around 70F the temp inside the cabinet with the PS3 was quickly up to 97F :eek: I know something needs to be done about this.

I have 3 Yate Loon D12SL-12 120mm case fans and 2 ~5v wall warts. I planned on using on wall wart wired to a fan for the PS3 cabinet and then one for each shelf of the TV stand since the air between the 2 shelves seems completely blocked off. I priced 4.5" hole saws but they seem to go for around $35 plus the price of the mandrel which is really more than I want to spend on a saw I will probably never use again. Any have any suggestions on how else to make a fairly neat and round hole that won't destroy my new entertainment center?

For the 2 fans for the TV Stand I planned on piggy backing the molex connectors and running it off the 5V wall wart but am concerned it wont be enough voltage to power both fans adequately. The other option was to get a fan controller, but the fan for the PS3 in the pier is a far distance from the TV stand and I am unsure how to get that fan wired to the controller if I mount it in the TV stand.

Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance for the help!

Here are some pics of my entertainment center:

http://www.ashleyfurniture.com/Showroom/LargeProductImage.aspx?PageId=Showroom&SetDomTab=1&ItemNo=W551-23

Johnla

11-13-08, 07:32 AM

I priced 4.5" hole saws but they seem to go for around $35 plus the price of the mandrel which is really more than I want to spend on a saw I will probably never use again. Any have any suggestions on how else to make a fairly neat and round hole that won't destroy my new entertainment center?

One alternative to a hole saw, is a adjustable hole/circle cutter. Just be advised that they do NOT work as nice and clean as hole saws do, and they also tend to leave a more ragged edge. So if you decide to get one, pratice on a few pieces of scrap wood first, that is close to the same as what your entertainment center is built with where you intend to put the fans.

$12 plus whatever S&H costs are.

http://www.cvfsupplycompany.com/cihocuad.html

And $20 at your local Sears.

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00925293000P?mv=rr

carquote

11-13-08, 05:51 PM

Thanks for the help johnla! It's a shame I need this size hole saw. The 4 inch saws are much cheaper. I suppose the 4" saw won't work well and would cause excessive noise due to the fan being restricted and not fully vented?

EDIT: I just ordered a set of hole saws that includes a 4" saw, so I will try that and hope that the slightly smaller size does not cause any problems.

Now to figure out how to wire the fans. I found an old Motorola Surfboard cable modem power brick that is 12v 1.25A. I also have a 5.9v 375ma, a 5v 850ma and a 5v 550ma. Out of curiosity I cutoff the proprietary end of the cable and was expecting to see a red and black wire. To my surprise there was only a white insulated wire that was covered by a silver shielding wire much like a cable wire is covered by the shielding. Could the white wire be the power and the silver shielding the ground? I have never seen this before with a power cord.

Anyone know of a good place for me to ask some electrical questions. I need to figure out the best way to wire the fans up since I want the two fans that will go in the base of my TV stand to be on whenever my TV is on (will plug into UPS that TV is connected to as the trigger) and then have the other 120mm fan in the top of my pier go on when I use my PS3. I was thinking of either just wiring the wall wart and fan for the pier to a light switch to have it go on and off when needed and then connecting the two fans for the base together via 4 pin molex piggyback and plugging the wall wart into my UPS as the trigger. I'm not sure which wall warts I should use though. I was also thinking I might be able to use the 12v 1.25A power brick to power all 3 fans and just but I''m not sure what effects have 3 fans on hat size adapter will have. I know i will have more than enough power, but will the 12v be too much and cause the fans to be too loud, or will having the three wired together cause the fan to slow down to a reasonable level?

Josette

11-24-08, 10:41 AM

I bought a fan panel with a couple of 4 1/2 inch, 115v fans. I mounted them above and behind my receiver, so they blow air over the top of it and out the front of the entertainment center. First I had them wired in parallel - they produced a ton of airflow, but they were so loud they could only be used when I had some music cranked way up. So I wired them in series, figuring they might run at 1/2 their previous speed. No, they ran at about 5% of their previous speed. They were fairly quiet, but barely provided any airflow over the receiver. I suppose it was a little cooler than it would have been without them, but still too warm for my tastes.

So I got a variable speed control for a ceiling fan. Well, I found out that at any speed that keeps the receiver cool, they're too loud. The two fans run at almost the same speed, but not quite. It's like two notes that are slightly out of tune, drives me nuts. So then I disconnected one fan. It got rid of the out-of-tune problem, but it's still too loud.

Bah! I'm about ready to go back to the two of them wired in series. I'm kind of wondering about the 12v fans, if they would provide much airflow at all. I suppose I could throw away another fifty bucks and find out.

I'm going to end up spending more trying to keep the receiver cool than I paid for the damned receiver in the first place. :mad: Should have just bought a Sony instead of this overheated Onkyo.

EDIT: I was fooling around with it some more and discovered something. My fans are mounted to an aluminum panel that's about 18" long and 5 or 6 inches high. When I put my hand on the panel, the noise reduced by about 50%. The fan can't seem to find what speed it wants to run at, it goes whoom-whoom-whoom for a while, then WHOOM-WHOOM-WHOOM as it increases its speed, then back to whoom-whoom-whoom, etc. Anyhow, it's apparently setting up a pretty good resonance in the aluminum panel. I took a rubber golf club grip, cut it to length, and stuck it between the back of the panel and the wall behind the entertainment center. It actually seems to have helped, the rubber seems to be absorbing some of that vibration and quieting it down. It still gets even quieter when I hold my hand against it, so I'm thinking maybe three more golf club grips. Cheaper than fans I guess :)

bricot

12-01-08, 12:16 PM

Finally completed my TV stand, changed the design from a separate component rack to one integrated with the TV. Used the Enlobal fans - very quiet. Used the low temp controllers so the fans kick on at 86 degrees and off at 76. I have used 2 controllers one in each component areas so they are cooled separately.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=125548&stc=1&d=1228151458

xKRUZx

01-06-09, 05:56 PM

mycatsnameis

01-07-09, 02:44 PM

Has anyone used the 80 mm (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=108&cp_id=10804&cs_id=1080401&p_id=2885&seq=1&format=2) or 120 mm (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=108&cp_id=10804&cs_id=1080401&p_id=2886&seq=1&format=2) Enermax fans that Monoprice sells for this type of cooling set up? I've got three built-in cabinets with AV gear in separate rooms to cool. I've used Monprice cables and wall mounts for all my plasmas and am pretty happy with the price/quality ratio they provide.

I don't think they offer any 12v => 120V transformers though so would probably have to go and buy those from some of the suppliers listed in this thread.

xKRUZx

01-07-09, 05:39 PM

Post #243
I use 2 of the 80mm ENERMAX Enlobal fans to cool my Onkyo 605. I have them in the rear of the cabinet exhausting air. I just completed the cooling fan setup last week so I can not comment on thier longevity. I can tell you that they are very quiet and move plenty of air. I connected the fans to an attic fan thermostat set to 85°F and placed it on top of the receiver over the hotest spot (right rear). The fans come on after the receiver has been on for about 5 minutes and turn off about 5 minutes after the receiver is turned off. Hope this helps - let me know if you want pics or other info.

mycatsnameis

01-08-09, 10:21 AM

D'oh! read througb teh first 8 pages and then skipped ahead. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction.

A general question, I see people talking about recycling 12V power supplies from other gear to drive these computer fans with Molex connectors. I'm assuming that requires some electrical know how and cutting and splicing of the power cords right? Are there any hwo-to's for this type of work?

jstandfest

01-08-09, 11:22 PM

Hello, first time poster. I've read through this whole thread (all 12 pages) with great interest. I am going to install ventilation fans in my audio/video enclosure. I have a custom made built-in stand that is fully enclosed except for the front of the unit where I've currently got a 5-disc DVD changer, DirecTV DVR unit, old PS2 and a Pioneer receiver that is about to be replaced by an Onkyo 606 (which I've been told runs hot). The clearances around my components are fairly tight, 2-4" side and top clearance around all units.

My question is, I'm going to get one of the Cabcool801 or 802 units from coolerguys.com and each of these units comes with one or two Enermax Enobal marathon 80mm fans respectively that move 24cfm of air each. Would one fan setup to exhaust my enclosed cabinet on a temp controller be enough or should I go with the two fan unit?

Thanks for the help and wealth of information everyone on this site contributes to make it great.

DaveN

01-09-09, 05:55 AM

xKRUZx

01-09-09, 04:58 PM

Anyone else having a problem location a SilenX 4 controller? Did they stop manufacturing them?

msdmoney

01-09-09, 08:32 PM

Anyone else having a problem location a SilenX 4 controller? Did they stop manufacturing them?

I just received one today from FrozenCPU.com, for my new tv stand, along with four of the Scythe 120mm S-Flex fans.

I bought the Shemore TV Stand from Costco. I love the stand, but my 360 got the 2 red rings the first night (two red rings means overheated). Partially my fault for leaving the 360 PSU inside the cabinet, but it made me realize I needed something more to dissipate the heat.

The cabinet already has mesh screens on each of the shelves and at the bottom of the cabinet, perfect for an intake fan. Unfortunately the covers at the back of the cabinet are solid except for the slits for cables, so I will probably have to cut holes in the top of those for an exhaust (i'd rather not though). I might just try an intake fan at the base, and the exhaut at the cable slit. If they had added the mesh screens to the back of the cabinet it would have been perfect.

xKRUZx

01-10-09, 09:36 PM

I just received one today from FrozenCPU.com, for my new tv stand, along with four of the Scythe 120mm S-Flex fans.

You must have ordered the last one last week because all the sites mentiond in this thread and a general Google search is showing they are all out of stock.

Must be a fire-hazard issue with it. ;) I'll give you $20 for yours. :D

bricot

01-12-09, 10:53 AM

I have been told that temps above 88 degrees starts shortening component life.

I went with the low temp version of Coolerguys temp controller, I think it kicks on at 83 and off at 76.

I am very happy with the 120mm Enermax Enlobal fans I put in my cabinet, I have to get up and look through the filter screens to see if I can read the fan label in order to see if they are on or not, they are dang quiet.

Since I was cutting my 4" holes in thin material, I used a compass to draw the correct size circle and a Rotozip to cut the hole. Used the wide blue painters tape to cover the area, drew the circle on it, cut with rotozip through the tape, nice clean edges. The rotozip didn't seem to want to take off like a router does.

Josette

01-13-09, 11:06 PM

I finally ditched my 115 volt fans - just too noisy. Got some Scythe S-Flex fans, 800 rpm. Put one on top of the receiver, pulling the hot air up and out, and two more in a panel behind/above the receiver, bringing in cool air from behind the entertainment center.

Now my Onkyo is cool, and the fans are really nice and quiet. And they say money can't buy happiness :D

Josette

01-15-09, 09:43 AM

pdawg17

01-16-09, 01:49 PM

I don't know a lot about woodworking, etc so...:

If I screw fans into my built-in and then decide they are too loud and need different fans will I be able to screw new fans into the same holes I made for the original fans or will it be too loose? Or since the fans are going inside the cabinet but fan grills are going outside will just be putting screws all the way through and the grills somehow attach on the outside?

joeblack111

01-20-09, 10:15 PM

TomP10

01-23-09, 09:42 AM

PerfectCr

01-23-09, 08:42 PM

TomP10

01-23-09, 10:22 PM

The Tophinator

01-25-09, 04:59 AM

Dumb question. I've built PC for years and done tons of custom mods. One thing I don't know is how would I use a PC fan (with the 3-pin connectors) in a home theater application. Is there some kind of converter in order to be able to plug it into the wall? Sorry if this is a stupid question. Thanks!

After reading what others here have done I went thru my junk pile at work and picked out a 12v transformer and PC fan that would run within it's capacity. (the PC fan only needs two of the three connectors. I also scrapped a three pin connector to make it easier to remove the fan from the transformer).

http://www.tophersworld.com/images/pcfan_power.jpg

I did find the PC fan I used to be noisy within my home theater so I upgraded the fan to a 120mm silent one that also used low enough energy I could have used two. It still didn't have enough draw sitting between my Surround unit and my stand so I built a box to go between the two and force the air out the back.

http://www.tophersworld.com/images/pcfan_power_3.jpg

It's hardly noticeable to see or hear.

PerfectCr

01-25-09, 07:32 AM

Wow thanks. Maybe I'll buy an A/C fan from FrozenCPU.com. :)

bricot

01-26-09, 11:14 AM

Love the look of the mod... what filter/cover did you use on the exterior?

- Tom

Thanks, the red in the floors made the cabinet look a little less red than it was in the shop, I stained it a cherry.

I got these from cooler guys ( 120mm Aluminum Fan Filter Grill in Black or Silver 840556035336 qty 4 $ 3.95 Color = Black).

Not sure what your mounting them into, I mounted them into 1/8" oak plywood - the space between the panel and the fan was too great for stock fan screws to work, so I used black brads (found in craft stores), poked them through the holes in the paneling, bent over the dog ears and hot glued them in place. Works great so far.

dbone1026

02-11-09, 04:09 PM

I just recently got a built in wall unit for my family room. One of the cabinets is set up to be an A/V cabinet. The devices that will be in the cabinet:

Cable/DVR box
PS3
Xbox 360
HTPC
Receiver (in the pic you will see an HDMI splitter in its place, been fighting with Butterfly Photo for some time over a defective receiver they sold me :mad:)

Since it is a built in there is no access to air at the back of the cabinet. The cabinet was designed with slits at the top to allow airflow out. There is a small space from the end of each shelf to the back of the cabinet to allow airflow. Also, there is a space between the bottom of the cabinet and the floor. Any suggestions on what the best way to cool the cabinet, and what components to use? The first picture attached is the top of the A/V cabinet where the slits are to allow air out. The second picture attached is the inside of the cabinet.

xKRUZx

02-11-09, 05:11 PM

dbone1026

02-11-09, 05:31 PM

Hmmmm....a couple PC fans mounted horizontally to the top of the inside of the cabinet over the slat openings might be a start.

The air would be drawn in through the doors (I assume they have some gaps) through all six shelf compartments, and out through the top.

While the 6 seperate shelves might look good, I think the shelves themselves are your greatest barrier to an efficient air flow. Maybe remove a few and stack some components?

I actually drilled a few dozen 1/8" holes in my one shelf...its twice as wide as yours but then again I didnt have any venting in mine. My AVR sits below the shelf and my 360, BDK35, and DVR sit on the shelf. I have dual Scythe 80 fans mounted on the back wall high in the cabinet. It works well for me.

Thanks for the reply. I was thinking about putting some fans on the underside of the slits as you mentioned. I am sure there is a small gap where the doors are but it is pretty minimal (plus I have a child lock over the knobs to keep my son out, so I am sure that further restricts air). Did you find that drilling holes in the shelf helped? I was thinking about doing something similar as you mentioned the shelves are a big block to airflow? Currently if I use my PS3 I need to leave the cabinet door open. If not then soon after I turn it on it sounds like an airport in my house... Ideally I would like to have fans that only turn on after the inside reaches a certain temperature.

dbone1026

02-12-09, 09:59 AM

So I had a chance to look at my cabinet again last night. The shelves actually have a cut out in the back (kind of like a 1/4 moon) which should allow sufficient air to move from the back up and out through the grills/slits at the top of the cabinet. I was thinking about getting a cooling stand for my receiver and htpc which would be positioned towards the back where the cut out is to move the air up towards the top of the cabinet. I would then get a fan cooler to place on the underside of the grills/slits to push the air out through the grills. What do you guys think?

Cooling Stand - http://www.coolerguys.com/ccstandk.html
Dual Fan Cooler - http://www.coolerguys.com/840556082224.html

xKRUZx

02-12-09, 10:35 AM

I'll have to take some pictures of my setup over the weekend. The shelf holes help, I also have a 1" holesaw hole for routing cables from above and below the shelf which helps the airflow similar to your cutout. I think the 1/8" holes help as well but its only my AVR below.

Those dual metal cooling contraptions seem like overkill and look noisy. Plus they are a ton of money.

If you really want a thermostat, Coolerguys sells a temp controll that kicks on at 84. I just ran my AC/DC molex converter to my AVR switched outlet so when its on the fans are on.

dbone1026

02-12-09, 11:12 AM

AV TechnologyGuy

02-12-09, 03:24 PM

Remember to try to get the air to travel through the audio and video equipment. A common mistake is to have fans at the back or front of the enclosure which just moves the air around the the components and cools them minimally. This is due to the fact that the moving air will take the path of least resistance. If that occurs, then there will still be air that remains "static" and uncooled.

uniquetreatone

02-16-09, 10:59 PM

trekguy

02-22-09, 01:19 PM

I have a Laurier(cortana?) tv stand.I see everyone drills holes in the back of the cabinets but not in the floor.I have 3 fans blowing out air the in each compartment but my ps3 fans still blows pretty loud sometimes.I ordered 2 more fans because I was thinking of cutting holes in the floor of the cabinet and place the fans here to blow air up into the compartments and out to the top back to the exhaust fans.The fans are all Scynthe S-Flex 1600 rpm.If this is the wrong thing please let me know.Man I was reading this thread too long it's time for me to get to work.
Air intake openings should be located as far from the exhaust port as possible. If that is not practical a baffle of some sort should be used to force the intake air to a position where it will flow up through and over the equipment. I use a pull out shelf on full extension slides to baffle the intake air which enters from the bottom of the cabinet. Holes in the shelf direct the air flow up under the heat sinks of the receiver. Forcing the air to turn corners also causes it to drop some of the dust is carries.

There is little/no benefit from adding intake fans, but there may be a gain from adding either an internal circulation fan or a second exhaust fan.

uniquetreatone

02-24-09, 12:07 PM

thanks trek guy. I followed your advice and it worked out. I have not heard the fans on my ps3 since and all my other componets are cool to touch.Thanks again.

Zzz..oltan!

02-26-09, 03:22 AM

Just wanted to thank the OP for this thread. Also AVSForum rocks! My receiver keeps going into protect mode due to insufficient ventillation. I just finished placing an order for some parts found in this thread from Coolerguys. Hope my troubles will be gone...

Thanks again, guys. :)

Zzz..oltan!

02-26-09, 03:47 AM

BTW, stuff ordered from Coolerguys:

120mm Chrome Fan Grill / 840556041153 6 0.90
Guard
Fan Case Screws Black or 840556020424 8 0.36 Color = Silver
Silver ( pack of 4)
Mechatronics Fan 840556081456 6 0.99
Mounts/Fan Vibration
Isolators VI-1- Quantity
(4)
Coolerguys 120x120x25mm 840556088417 2 12.95
USB Fan with Grill
4-Pin Molex power 840556087083 1 3.95
splitter 12 inch Black
Sealed
110v AC to 12v DC Power 840556087977 1 10.95
Supply with 4 Pin Molex
(500mA)
Velcro Tie Wrap 3/4 inch 840556052968 10 0.89
velcro wrap-Black (sold
per foot)
Scythe S-FLEX (SFF21D) 840556025443 2 14.95 Model Option = SFF21D 800rpm
(SFF21E) (SFF21F)
(SFF21G) 120mm S-FDB
Quiet Fans
Subtotal 93.82
Shipping 10.00
Tax 0.00
Total 103.82

TheWind

03-14-09, 06:58 PM

I don’t have switched outputs on any of my AV equipment. Therefore, I want/need an inexpensive thermostat on/off control for my DIY AV fan.

Does anyone have experience with either of the following two thermostat products or have an opinion on which might be better?

“Coolerguys Thermal Fan Controller” > http://www.coolerguys.com/840556086611.html

“Cool Components Basic Temp Controller” > http://www.coolcomponents.com/Basic-Temp-Controller--88-Degree-OnOff-Only_p_13-220.html

I’ve also seen posts, in this thread, recommending “attic fan thermostats” for this purpose. That looks like a good way to go, but I’ve called and driven around and the only thing I’ve found is both very large and too expensive. I haven’t found one online that seems “certain enough” to order. (Some don’t give dimensions and that could result in a “big” surprise.) I assume that’s what is being used here:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Receiver-Amp-thermo-controlled-chassis-top-cooling-fan_W0QQitemZ260370447711QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain _0?hash=item260370447711&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 %7C301%3A0%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

If I could get just the thermostat controller, or something like it, at a good price that might be good. – Fwiw, I won’t be putting it directly on my receiver; just near it.

If anyone knows of other such products that might be as good, or better, please let me know!

Thanks,
Dave

bricot

03-16-09, 10:43 AM

TheWind

03-17-09, 12:56 PM

CNibbana

03-17-09, 08:14 PM

I'm using two of the low temp thermal fan controllers from coolerguys and they work well.

Are they reliable at turning on at the specified temp?

bricot

03-23-09, 10:41 AM

bricot,

Thanks. When you say “low temp thermal fan controllers”, do you mean an almost identical unit that turns on and off at slightly lower temps than the one that I linked to?

How long have you been using them? Any issues?

Back when I ordered them they had two options for the on/off temp range, it looks like with the new version they have gone with a single temp range. (They also used to have a choice of internal or external probe but the button is gone, thats the empty square you see in the picture) Not sure if it does both now or not. I am using the external probe routed to a corner that I think probably gets the least air flow.

I've been using them for ~6 months, I ordered them shortly after they started producing them, I had issues with the earlier model (within days) but they replaced them with the model you linked to and they have worked fine ever since. I still check every once in awhile when I've been running something for awhile, see if the fans are running and then open the door and stick my hand in check air temp and circulation. They are doing a great job, really like the 120mm Enlobal fans, very quiet.

bricot

03-23-09, 10:51 AM

Are they reliable at turning on at the specified temp?

I haven't tested the advertised 'On' temp specifically, on a number of occasions I have grabbed the probe between my fingers and the fans would kick on within a couple of seconds. I did this out in my shop this winter which was pretty cool and my finger weren't at their normal temp :D

I was constantly opening the door and checking air temps after I first got all my components in and running, the fans would be running and the air inside the cabinet was barely warmer than the house air @70 degrees. I havent thought of anything that I could dial in at 87 degrees to test the trigger point.

topperdude

03-23-09, 12:03 PM

I am using an Antec A/V cooler (http://www.antec.com/Believe_it/product.php?id=NTE=)on top of my Yamaha receiver. Currently, the A/V cooler is plugged into the Yamaha's switched power outlets and it gets turned on everytime the receiver is turned on. I would like to turn it on only when the temperature reaches a certain point within the cabinet - I wonder if there is a thermal sensor product that I can plug into the receiver and the A/V cooler into this sensor so it will switch on/off power to the Antec A/V cooler only when the temperature reaches a certain point? The thermal fan controllers linked in recent posts in this thread seem to be for only the type of fans that are used in PCs?

Thanks for any input,
-Topper

pwygant

03-24-09, 10:58 AM

rvp819

03-24-09, 11:30 AM

I just ordered a Noctua 80mm fan to help draw heat out of my AV cabinet, and I'm looking for a ducting solution so the fan will draw air above my receiver instead of near the back panel where it will be installed.

Does anyone have any suggestions aside from flex duct used for HVAC or clothes dryer, available at the hardware store.

Thanks!

topperdude

03-24-09, 02:06 PM

Topperdude:

How do you like the Antec Cooler? I bought mine about a week ago and honestly I don't think it does anything to my components? My setup is currently as follows:

http://www.jsp-industries.com/Pages/Bolero.html (High end piece of furniture from Canada. I needed a large opening for my Center. It has front glass doors and Chimney style ventilation for air.

On the left I have my Amp on the bottom with about 5 inches of clearance and top shelf houses my HD DVR.

On the right I have my DVD player on the top (Doesn't ever get even warm) and my PS3on the bottom shelf.

The AMP and DVR compartment gets hot as heck and I initially bought the Antec unit to keep the DVR cooler, but after much testing I found that the AMP is what is sending the heat up so I placed it on top of the amp. All in all, that area still gets extremely hot and I think I'm just going to send back the Antec unit as it is too loud on the high setting.

Does jigsawing bigger holes in the back help out at all you think? The back ventilation openings are fairly small and I might even drill large 1 inchholes everywhere.

I dont have much experience with the Antec A/V cooler unit yet as we just installed it this past weekend into our living room wall unit (http://www.peerlessfurn.com/Item.aspx?ItemID=-899690803&ItemNum=CE10870EC-CE). I did read some good reviews about it on newegg, amazon as well as independant reviewers before purchasing (even though Antec's own literature says it only moves between 5.5CFM to 8 CFM of air - go figure :rolleyes: ) .

Anyhow, we have the A/V cooler with the other components in left lower cabinet (the one with glass doors and three shelves). This cabinet only has one 2" hole in the back (verified with my 2" hole saw), and about 1/3 to 1/2 of the hole is used to route the different wires in/out of the unit. The components are stacked as follows: The power conditioner/surge protector (PF30L) on the bottom shelf, Wii + Popcorn hour + network switch (SMC7004BR) in the middle shelf, the receiver (RX-V1200) on the topmost shelf, the A/V cooler on top of the receiver such that the top of the receiver + bottom of cooler is roughly aligned with the hole in the back and finally, an original Xbox with XBMC on top of the Antec cooler. Not sure if this will provide enough air flow but keeping our fingers crossed.

In case we need additional cooling, I wonder if a product such as the Antec Spotcool fan (http://www.antec.com/Believe_it/product.php?id=ODA=), placed near the rear 2" hole might help push warm air out of the cabinet? We hope to avoid drilling additional holes in the cabinet, so would appreciate any input from forum members.

Would also appreciate input regarding my original query regarding a power plug with temperature sensor that turns on power (to A/V cooler) when temperature reaches a certain level and turns off when it is cool enough - does such a product exist and if so any pointers to a good place where I can purchase this?

Thanks,
-Topper

TheWind

03-26-09, 01:56 AM

....they have worked fine.... They are doing a great job....

Thanks – I ordered a Coolerguys Thermal Fan Controller (and its AC/DC adapter) today!

Would also appreciate input regarding my original query regarding a power plug with temperature sensor that turns on power (to A/V cooler) when temperature reaches a certain level and turns off when it is cool enough - does such a product exist and if so any pointers to a good place where I can purchase this?

My guess is that you’re better off with the fan just plugged into your receiver, like you have it now. If I had a switched outlet available with my setup, I wouldn’t bother with getting a “thermal controller” because it would just add more wires, plugs and expense without any significant benefit. – I won’t have first hand knowledge until after my order arrives, but I assume that a receiver will get hot enough to activate a “thermal controller” very quickly, so the fan will be on at least as long with a “thermal controller” as without one.

As far as a product that does this, there are several mentioned in this thread, including three in my one of my previous posts. Here’s one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Receiver-Amp-thermo-controlled-chassis-top-cooling-fan_W0QQitemZ260370447711QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain _0?hash=item260370447711&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 %7C301%3A0%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

You should take a look at the sellers other items too.

bricot

03-30-09, 11:10 AM

Thanks – I ordered a Coolerguys Thermal Fan Controller (and its AC/DC adapter) today!

My guess is that you’re better off with the fan just plugged into your receiver, like you have it now. If I had a switched outlet available with my setup, I wouldn’t bother with getting a “thermal controller” because it would just add more wires, plugs and expense without any significant benefit. – I won’t have first hand knowledge until after my order arrives, but I assume that a receiver will get hot enough to activate a “thermal controller” very quickly, so the fan will be on at least as long with a “thermal controller” as without one.

The problem with the switch outlets that I saw was that when you turn off the receiver then off goes the fan but the receiver is still as hot as it was that required cooling. I didn't want that heat building up in my cabinet baking my components until passive cooling dropped the temp. If you have run your stuff for awhile and heated up everything inside the cabinet, including the interior of the cabinet, I would think the temp would spike if everything just turned off. I have other components as well, like my satellite receiver in there that are running when my receiver isn't.

I know my fans run for awhile after shutting everything down before the temp drops enough for them to turn off.

TheWind

03-31-09, 02:25 AM

Bricot,

Yeah, I guess I can see that there can be some benefit/advantage in using the thermal controller rather than the switched outlet.

Btw, my Coolerguys Thermal Controller is now doing its thing in my open backed, mini entertainment center. My need is to keep my JVC RX-702 receiver (digital amplification) cool. It’s, without question, the hottest running piece of audio/video equipment I have ever used – nothing else ever came close. This Thermal Controller is exactly what I wanted. I have it running a SilenX Ixtrema Pro Series 120mm Fan (14dBA/72cfm). If I turn off everything, have the room very quiet and carefully listen, I can hear it, but just barely. I could have returned it (to Fry’s) and tried the SilenX 11db or 9db version, but this 14dBA/ 72cfm fan does a really amazing job of keeping the receiver cool and the sound is pretty much imperceptible most all the time.

Thanks again

jszei

04-03-09, 03:25 PM

TheWind

04-03-09, 09:27 PM

I will be putting in some Noctua fans inside my cabinetry.
The Noctua fans are the quietest fans on the market by the way, I've done a bit of research. Here's some info.
http://noctua.at/main.php?show=nf_s12_p12_comparison&lng=en

I'll also be using the fan controller from Cooler Guys.

My equipment includes a Marantz AVR, a PS3, Directv box and most likely a Blu-ray player when Oppo releases theirs. I will also have the Panamax M5100-PM in the cabinet.

Based on that load does anyone know how many fans it will take to cool an enclosed cabinet with them? My thought is 1 fan pushing air in at the base and 1 fan pulling air out at the top. Is that enough circulation?

Thanks

Those Noctua fans look nice. But, fwiw ~ Maybe I’m missing something, but the SilenX Ixtrema Pro Line seems to generate much greater airflow while being quieter and a little less expensive.
Noctua NF-P12 @ 1300 RPM 54.32 CFM 19.8 dB(A)
Noctua NF-P12 @ 1100 RPM ? 16.9 dB(A)
Noctua NF-P12 @ 900 RPM ? 12.6 dB(A)

SilenX IXP-76-18 1400 RPM 90 CFM 18 dB(A)
SilenX IXP-74-14 1200 RPM 72 CFM 14 dB(A)
SilenX IXP-74-11 1100 RPM 46 CFM 11 dB(A)
SilenX IXP-74-09 800 RPM 38 CFM 9 dB(A)

Not trying to say “mine’s quieter than yours”, or such. I’m just suggesting that you might get much better circulation with a SilenX Ixtrema Pro without giving up anything.

jszei

04-05-09, 12:34 AM

I'm using the NF-S12 in my cabinet

Size 120x120x25 mm
Bearing SSO-Bearing
Blade Geometry Straight-Blade-Design
Rotational Speed (+/- 10%) 1200 RPM
Rotational Speed with U.L.N.A. (+/- 10%) 600 RPM
Airflow 81 m³/h
Airflow with U.L.N.A. 41 m³/h
Acoustical Noise 17 dB(A)
Acoustical Noise with U.L.N.A. < 6* dB(A)
Input Power 1,44 W
Input Current 0,12 A
Voltage Range 4-13 V
MTBF > 150.000 h
Scope of Delivery
Ultra-Low-Noise Adaptor (U.L.N.A.)
4 Vibration Compensators
3:4-Pin Adaptor
4 Fan Screws
Warranty 6 years

stoneag

04-05-09, 09:23 AM

Those Noctua fans look nice. But, fwiw ~ Maybe I’m missing something, but the SilenX Ixtrema Pro Line seems to generate much greater airflow while being quieter and a little less expensive.
Noctua NF-P12 @ 1300 RPM 54.32 CFM 19.8 dB(A)
Noctua NF-P12 @ 1100 RPM ? 16.9 dB(A)
Noctua NF-P12 @ 900 RPM ? 12.6 dB(A)

SilenX IXP-76-18 1400 RPM 90 CFM 18 dB(A)
SilenX IXP-74-14 1200 RPM 72 CFM 14 dB(A)
SilenX IXP-74-11 1100 RPM 46 CFM 11 dB(A)
SilenX IXP-74-09 800 RPM 38 CFM 9 dB(A)

Not trying to say “mine’s quieter than yours”, or such. I’m just suggesting that you might get much better circulation with a SilenX Ixtrema Pro without giving up anything.

I have a PS3 and Marantz SR4002 with an HD-20 HD-DVR and use 2 Scythe fans http://www.coolerguys.com/sff21.html at 800rpm. I have all my equipment in an enclosed built in beside a gas fireplace. there is probably 12" between the fireplace and the A/V stuff and I rarely have the fireplace on but the fans are both exhausting the warm air trapped behind the components into the wall behind the built in and out into the room from an air register a few inches from the ceiling in the room behind the TV room. Since doing this set up, I have not had my PS3 fan go above a slight hum and is not audible from my viewing area about 10 ft away. Previosly when watching standard DVDs the fan would get to it's highest level in 20-30 mins. and was so loud that it forced raising volume of the movie.

jszei

04-06-09, 11:38 AM

I have a PS3 and Marantz SR4002 with an HD-20 HD-DVR and use 2 Scythe fans http://www.coolerguys.com/sff21.html at 800rpm. I have all my equipment in an enclosed built in beside a gas fireplace. there is probably 12" between the fireplace and the A/V stuff and I rarely have the fireplace on but the fans are both exhausting the warm air trapped behind the components into the wall behind the built in and out into the room from an air register a few inches from the ceiling in the room behind the TV room. Since doing this set up, I have not had my PS3 fan go above a slight hum and is not audible from my viewing area about 10 ft away. Previosly when watching standard DVDs the fan would get to it's highest level in 20-30 mins. and was so loud that it forced raising volume of the movie.

Thanks Stoneag, this is very similar to what I'm doing. My cabinet will be next to the gas fireplace as well. It's good to know that the heat from the fire doesn't impact the heat in the cabinet.
I haven't cut into the wall yet but I don't think I'll be exhausting into the wall itself but instead to the side of the cabinet. I can regulate the Noctua fans to spin at a lower RPM if needed.

IMaNewbie

04-10-09, 11:03 PM

USB powered fans?
2 devices: Tivo HD and PS3
Glass door enclosed tv stand: http://www.elite-inds.com/series_product.aspx?ProductID=746

I am thinking of placing two USB powered fans (one for each side) as an exhaust toward the rear of cabinet where there already is a hole for cables. There are only 2 products I've really come across for this. Any comments on using these USB fans.. not mentioned in the entire thread until now. I think they should work for me since they are "plug & play" and my devices act as switches when I plug the fans into their USB ports.

http://www.coolerguys.com/840556088417.html
http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/Product.aspx?C=1165&ID=1801

gcjones1

04-11-09, 07:13 AM

I have two of the Mobile Fan II's hook upto a USB Hub and it works great. The USB hubs is connected to my TV, so they only turn on when the TV powers up.

ccotenj

04-11-09, 10:28 PM

TheWind

04-23-09, 02:51 PM

did you put the fan right on top of the avr blowing down onto it, or did you mount it? i have an small open backed cabinet that an avr is baking in, and i'm trying to decide the best way to go about it...

Sorry if it seemed that I have ignored your question!! Somehow, I just plain missed your post and since there hasn’t been any recent activity in this thread, (or so I thought) I haven’t even looked at it. – Till today.

Anyway, fwiw after almost two weeks (Again, sorry!): I hang my fan off the back of my open backed, mini entertainment center.

With the grill screws, I attached rubber strips to the fans intake side. I then used stick-on Velcro tabs to affix the other end of the rubber strips to the top of the shelf above the JVC so the fan hangs down directly behind the JVC. It pulls air, from the front, across the top and bottom of the JVC RX702.

To achieve the best airflow:
I raised the JVC slightly by putting ½ inch rubber bumpers on the JVC’s feet.
In my setup, angling the fan slightly upward greatly increased airflow under the JVC while still providing great airflow in the larger, open space above the JVC.
The front of my entertainment center has swinging glass doors which I leave closed in the most open way. (You know how those magnetic click-closers have two closed positions.) This results in about ½ inch gap between the two doors as well as an increased opening around the doors.

If you are considering the SilenX fans, I still don’t know whether to recommend the 14db one that I kept or the 11db one, which I never tried.

cigga24

05-07-09, 03:36 PM

I have two of the Mobile Fan II's hook upto a USB Hub and it works great. The USB hubs is connected to my TV, so they only turn on when the TV powers up.

Dude you may have just saved me $20. I was thinking of getting a usb fan for my ps3 but after reading all 14pgs of this thread i was sold on the ac-dc plug.

Question, i read my owner manual (pioneer 5080hd) and it doesnt say anything about usb power. It says i cant connect a hub to it though but i'm wondering if two fans would be less power than a digicamera which would count as one device. Does your tv say it can power multiple devices? In any case i can plug the hub into my power conditioner and just do a 24/7 setup.

Also is either of these usb fans as quiet as the dc fans? I cant find any db/cfm specs on them?

Bob7145

05-16-09, 07:58 PM

New SilentX cabinet cooling kit. 2 high flow fans, controller, ducts, expandable to 5 fans. :)
http://www.crazypc.com/products/ixa-ccs-1800.html

crakarjax

05-18-09, 10:06 AM

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1148054

Posted that yesterday. Cost me about $15, but I had a lot of stuff lying around.

terriblecow

05-18-09, 01:52 PM

New SilentX cabinet cooling kit. 2 high flow fans, controller, ducts, expandable to 5 fans. :)
LINK

This Silenx option looks nice and easy, but I can't find anywhere if it's temperature controlled or just always on.
I think the dial there may be for fan speed, but I don't really know.

Anybody got any ideas???

myoda

06-11-09, 07:18 AM

Is there a way to toggle the temp readout on the Onkyo 806 to display Farenheit? Also, not to sound like a noob, what do the other readings mean? (see attached) The Antec A/V cooler looks nice, but I don't think it does anything for my receiver at either the high or low speeds. Under load, the receiver does not exceed 55 degrees C, about 125 F, which is pretty hot. I have a open back cabinet, and can feel hot air ducting from the rear of the A/V cooler, but see no relative temp drop. Holds steady with or without the Antec unit. Comments? Thanks.

Bob7145

06-13-09, 04:09 AM

For best performance (cooling) a fan should be placed on top of the receiver blowing UP, sucking the hot air out of the amp.
For those with equipment in a cabinet... do you think your car would overheat if you left it running full throttle in the garage with the door closed? :)

crakarjax

06-13-09, 01:53 PM

39CentStamp

06-14-09, 09:56 AM

No. It would stall due to lack of oxygen.

WARNING! KIDS DONT TRY THIS AT HOME!

If you decide to ignore the warning please be sure that you are not in the garage with the car thats running while the door is closed.

:)

addict777

06-24-09, 08:49 PM

I have a Middle Atlantic 44u enclosed rack that had heat problems. I recently purchased a ERK-10FT-FC by Middle Atlantic fan unit which is thermostat controlled, which is nice, but talk about noisy. This 10" fan cannot run while watching a movie. Its too loud.

My enclosed rack in my theater room actually sits within the attic. The cool air from theater room is sucked in from the vents at bottom of rack and hot air is sucked out the top with the above model fan unit. So it works great, but its just too noisy...

Anyone out there know if the 10" fan tha can be purchased so I can swap them out with a quieter one from another manufacturer?

Any help would be appreciated. I am glad I found this site. There is alot of good information here...

crakarjax

06-25-09, 09:46 AM

Bob7145

06-25-09, 12:45 PM

I have a 24U cabinet that came with 2 120V 120mm X 25mm fans in the top. NOISY. Swapped them out with 2 120mm x 25mm 12v (computer) fans with another fan placed directly on top of the AVR and the SilentX multi-fan controller with the wall wart plugged into the switched AVR outlet. Placing the AVR on the top shelf just below the cabinet fans helps too. :)

Fans - http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l1/g36/Fans.html?id=aJAgZghu

250mm 12v fan - http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g36/c331/s566/list/p1/Fans-12_Volt_Fans_-_LED_UV-250mm_x_30mm_LED_Fans-Page1.html

360mm 12v - http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g36/c331/s856/list/p1/Fans-12_Volt_Fans_-_LED_UV-360mm_x_30mm_LED_Fans-Page1.html

Scarfather

06-30-09, 10:34 PM

AV TechnologyGuy

07-02-09, 04:09 AM

Scarfather,

It is a very good idea to cool your components. It will extend the life and inprove performance. Electronics perfrom better when they are cool. Some actually misbehave when the temperature is beyond room temperature. There ar a lot of myths about cooling and how it is done. Put simply, you need to establish a forced path. That means that the air can only pass over your components. Putting a fan at the back is usually not effective because it just draws air across the back of the components. This is known as "Thermal Management."

Here are some simple solutions:

ATM - Active Thermal Management (http://www.contractorsav.com/active-thermal-management-products)

You can make a large hole in the bottom of your shelves, beneath your components. Make sure that through the wholes is the only significant path for the air to travel. Draw the air out from the top of the encloure with some sort of fan.

Hopefully, this helps.

Bob7145

07-02-09, 12:30 PM

Most AV cabinets are furniture designed to hide electronics, kinda like storing chocolate above a stove.
Server cabinets aren't too pretty but work real well. Mine is a 24U (about 5') tall, 25" x 25" with a magnetic (like refrigerator) acrylic door, designed for vertical airflow. Fans at the top. Standard 19" rackmount ventilated shelves, powerstrip, drawers, HTPC, power amp, AVR.

More stuff, pretty good variety. :) http://www.acousticpc.com/acoustirack.html

bricot

07-06-09, 02:04 PM

So what's the best thing to do: cool the component or push the hot air out of the cabinet?

I'm looking to keep my Onkyo 605 and PS3 cool. I know that blowing air in the cabinet is not good because it will increase the amount of dust.

I am pushing air into the cabinets (Positive pressure), I use filter screens on the fans, that way ANY air coming into the cabinet is filtered. This works very well for me, I opened it up the other day and still no need to dust!

Positive pressure makes sense to me, because air is forced out of every crack and crevice, if you are pulling air out that means unless you have an air tight cabinet (except for you're intake hole) then you are drawing dusty air in from around glass door's, etc.

Scarfather

07-07-09, 12:04 PM

Suntan

07-07-09, 02:08 PM

I don't have enough space to put a cooling device on top or in between components. And cooling the ps3 seems like somewhat of a difficult task.
My intention is to try to blow out the hot air generated from the onkyo receiver and maybe place one of the cooling fans right next to the ps3 blowing air in it so it keeps cool.

Even getting airflow through the cabinet to help evacuate the buildup of hot air will help quite a lot. If you can keep the cabinet supplied with "room temperature" air and your components are spaced such that natural convection can allow the hot air to move up and away (in otherwords don't stack STBs right on top of each other and don't block the fan on the PS3) your equipment should be able to servive.

-Suntan

Suntan

07-07-09, 02:15 PM

I am pushing air into the cabinets (Positive pressure), I use filter screens on the fans, that way ANY air coming into the cabinet is filtered. This works very well for me, I opened it up the other day and still no need to dust!

Positive pressure makes sense to me, because air is forced out of every crack and crevice, if you are pulling air out that means unless you have an air tight cabinet (except for you're intake hole) then you are drawing dusty air in from around glass door's, etc.

In addition, putting fans at the inlet (versus drawing air through an enclosure with a fan at the outlet) will be more efficient and you will get more airflow. Depending on the design of the fan used the difference may be minor or it may be significant.

I personally would not decide fan placement solely based on this, but also based on issues such as packaging, fan location, safety, noise, etc.

Also, keep in mind that your filters will most likely be blocking a lot of air from moving through. If you ever find that it is a hot day and your components are getting a bit “sweaty,” the easiest thing would be to just remove the filters and let more air through. Again, depending on the design of the fan in use, the difference can be significant.

-Suntan

bricot

07-13-09, 02:19 PM

In addition, putting fans at the inlet (versus drawing air through an enclosure with a fan at the outlet) will be more efficient and you will get more airflow. Depending on the design of the fan used the difference may be minor or it may be significant.

I personally would not decide fan placement solely based on this, but also based on issues such as packaging, fan location, safety, noise, etc.

Also, keep in mind that your filters will most likely be blocking a lot of air from moving through. If you ever find that it is a hot day and your components are getting a bit “sweaty,” the easiest thing would be to just remove the filters and let more air through. Again, depending on the design of the fan in use, the difference can be significant.

-Suntan

Ya, I figured that filters cut down efficiency so I 'over fanned' a little, I have 1 120mm fan per shelf, I've done spot checks for temp and the temps have been fine. This thread reminded me...so I went and vacuumed out the filters this weekend :)

DMJ

07-16-09, 12:35 AM

Any reason I can't use 80mm fans? 120 (5" fans are pretty large and my cabinet has glass doors so I'm pretty sure I'd see them.

I'm thinking I'll go with the
Two (2) SilenX IXP-54-14 80mm Case Fan
Two (2) 80mm chrome grills ( http://www.coolerguys.com/840556041184.html )
Cooler Guys 500mA DC supply ( http://www.coolerguys.com/840556087977.html )
Cooler Guys Thermal Fan Controller ( http://www.coolerguys.com/840556086611.html )

I know the 120mm fans will push more air, but each of these fans push 32CFM at 14 decibles and my cabinet is only 25"x15"x15". I'm thinking two fans will be overkill, but what do I know? :confused:

Any thoughts?
Thanks

crakarjax

07-16-09, 03:22 PM

DMJ

07-16-09, 03:31 PM

120mm fans are MUCH quieter than 80mm.
Thanks for the reply.
Going for equal CFM, yes. But, like I said, my cabinet is very small and I don't need as much air movement. I do not want to see these fans either and since I have glass doors I think I'd see 5" fans while I might not see 3" fans.

Any other reasons?

DMJ

07-21-09, 10:59 PM

Well, I put my kit together. As I was hoping, the two 80mm fans are pushing air through my smaller enclosure nicely. The SilenX fans really are quiet. I'm definitely going to use them for my projector enclosure when I make it. I'm really happy with most of my kit, I wish I'd bought a fan to put on the receiver and cable box.

Thanks

DMJ

07-22-09, 10:24 PM

Testing

I just did some quick tests with and without the fans.

Before cutting off the fans the temps were 93.6 (lower shelf) 103.4 (upper shelf).
After one hour without fans temps rose to 108.8 (LS) 109.6 (US).
After 10 minutes of turning the fans back on it's down to 96.8 (LS) and 105.2 (US).

Obviously the fans are working :) The upper shelf is cooler just by having air flow past it. But, I'd like the upper shelf to have air blowing directly on the components so I'll probably add another fan or two. I know the 120m fans move more air, but the 80mm size is much easier hole to hide.

amheck

07-24-09, 05:40 PM

New SilentX cabinet cooling kit. 2 high flow fans, controller, ducts, expandable to 5 fans. :)
http://www.crazypc.com/products/ixa-ccs-1800.html

Has anyone had a chance to try this system yet?

I have a TV console with a closed left and right section, and each side has 1 shelf.

I was thinking about trying the SilenX cabinet cooling kit, but that only gives me 1 fan per side. Adding additional fans is possible, but gets expensive.

If you guys think 2 fans per sealed location is better (1 intake and 1 outtake), what about four 120mm fans, 4 metal grills, and this controller?
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5931/bus-101/SilenX_4_Channel_Fan_Controller_w_ACDC_Adapter_IXA-FCEX.html

DMJ

07-24-09, 06:58 PM

Has anyone had a chance to try this system yet?

I have a TV console with a closed left and right section, and each side has 1 shelf.

I was thinking about trying the SilenX cabinet cooling kit, but that only gives me 1 fan per side. Adding additional fans is possible, but gets expensive.

If you guys think 2 fans per sealed location is better (1 intake and 1 outtake), what about four 120mm fans, 4 metal grills, and this controller?
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5931/bus-101/SilenX_4_Channel_Fan_Controller_w_ACDC_Adapter_IXA-FCEX.htmlAaron,
Why would you buy a fan speed controller? I guess I could maybe see it if your fan was close to your ear when seated, but these fans are really silent.

The kit looks well put together, but these would seem like a better choice (add your own fans).

Cooler Guys 500mA DC supply ( http://www.coolerguys.com/840556087977.html )
Cooler Guys Thermal Fan Controller ( http://www.coolerguys.com/840556086611.html )

You can add up to 8 fans to the fan controller with the cooler guys splitter. Give Cooler Guys a call, they're great.

amheck

07-24-09, 07:31 PM

Hey Dan, thanks for the thoughts. The reason why I figured the fan speed controller would be nice is that I could hook up all 4 fans with just 1 AC plug.

I do like the idea of the thermal controller, but I'm a little hesitant on where to put the sensor. On one side of our console table, I have the PS3 and Wii. On the other side, I have my HTPC. I'm just worried with only 1 sensor, I'm going to have to chose which side to monitor the temp on. Of course, you can have 2 of these thermal sensors, but then that's 2 AC plugs.

Again, yeah, I don't need the voltage control on the controller I linked. If there's another unit that can power 4 fans, I'd like to just plug it into the switched outlet on my AVR and just have them come on whenever. Is there something similar to the thermal controller you linked, that can control 2-4 fans, without the temp sensor?

I hope that all makes sense.........

Aaron

DMJ

07-25-09, 01:29 AM

Aaron,
If you just want constantly running fans you can just buy the power supply. It's 4 prongs but the SilenX fans (probably all fans) come with a 4:3 converter so they'd plug in fine. If you want multiple fans, get some splitters. I'm crunched for outlets too, so I added an octopus. The fans barely use any power so it's not a big deal to add it.

I can't help with the rest of your questions, but this is a cheap way to get cooling.

amheck

07-27-09, 05:46 PM

Incase this helps anyone out in the future, I talked to cooleruys today. For my situation, where I want 4 fans with no temp controller, they recommend:

one of these http://www.coolerguys.com/840556090236.html
and two of these http://www.coolerguys.com/840556000037.html
and one AC adapter http://www.coolerguys.com/840556029977.html

I asked about fans, saying I had seen a lot of mention about the Scythe Slip Streams. Jose said the 1200rpm version was a good flow/noise ratio fan.

For 120mm fan, I'm currently looking at a hole saw on ebay. 120mm=4.72"
Would I be ok with a 5" hole saw, or should I look for a 4 3/4" saw? Planing on getting the metal grill covers if that makes a difference.

GaryRanson

07-27-09, 07:49 PM

amheck,

You will want a 4-1/2" hole saw.

I just picked up some supplies from Coolerguys last week and all went as planned with the 4-1/2" saw.

Thanks for the info on the 1200 RPM fans as I went with two 800s and temps are in the low 90s. I would like to get them down to 80s if possible.

amheck

07-27-09, 08:01 PM

amheck,

You will want a 4-1/2" hole saw.

Thanks for the confirmation. Found a bunch of cheap hole saw sets on ebay (and I mean CHEAP) but the 4 1/2" size doesn't seem to common. Maybe I'll head to Lowes/HD and see how much they are there.

GaryRanson

07-27-09, 08:06 PM

I bought mine at Lowes and they are not inexpensive but in my mind, well worth it.

Lowes had two types, one with the built in arbor and the other where you have to buy a separate arbor. I went with the separate type in case I ever need to make other size holes.

GaryRanson

07-27-09, 08:35 PM

Part numbers I bought at Lowes:

Lenox #12204 (6L hole saw arbor for 3/8" drill)
Lenox #12191 (4-1/2" (114mm) Wood and Metal hole saw)

amheck

07-28-09, 02:57 PM

Hey guys,

Getting ready to place an order. Any idea which might be the best guards?

http://www.coolerguys.com/120grills.html

On one hand, the mesh ones that capture dust might be nice, but I don't want to add additional noise (whistling?) nor make it so these need to be removed often for cleaning. Wondering if the simple metal guards for a buck might be the ticket. None of these will be showing in my setup.

stc4life

07-28-09, 05:36 PM

Get your hole saw at HarborFreight.com. They are super cheap.

GaryRanson

07-28-09, 09:11 PM

I looked and there are no 4-1/2" hole saws at HarborFreight.

amheck,

I picked up this one as I did not want to restrict airflow and will vacuum out the fans every 6-12 months:

http://www.coolerguys.com/840556082705.html

ink124

07-30-09, 05:17 PM

I'm thinking about using a pair of 120mm fans as exhaust for a closet (small closet, probably about 40 cubic feet) inline with the Coolerguys DC supply and thermal fan controller. I thought about going the bathroom fan route, but may not because of space constraints (planning to exhaust into exterior wall). Any reason I should be concerned about using the PC fans in this fashion?

GaryRanson

08-02-09, 01:08 PM

I figured that this thread is due for a pic.

I ended up using two Scythe S-FLEX SFF21F fans (120mm, 1600 rpm) with a CoolerGuys Thermal Fan Controller and Power Supply. So far temps just above the amplifier have been running 4-10 degrees above ambient depending upon use.

I have had my new setup for just over 3 weeks now and I am very happy. It includes:

Panasonic TC-P54V10
Denon AVR-2310CI
Motorola DCT-3416
Sony PS3
3x B&W LCR600 S3
B&W ASWCM Sub
Custom cabinet cooling

ink124

08-03-09, 02:17 AM

The Tophinator

08-03-09, 02:18 AM

I just upgraded my TV stand to a nice AV cabinet. The Onkyo 606 loves to run super hot so I modified the removable magnetic rear doors a little bit. I added two Thermaltake Silent cat 1600RPM 16Db 62CFM fans, a cooler guys controller and used the 600MA power supply I had for one fan by making a 3 pin to Molex adapter. I also bought a couple chrome grill off Ebay.

The fans blow out and have been keeping the system really cool.

http://www.tophersworld.com/images/home_theater_202.jpg

The cabinet.

http://www.tophersworld.com/images/home_theater_205.jpg

Mike_WI

08-04-09, 09:42 AM

Interesting thread.
I scanned it, but may have missed some things.

What are people using for taking temperature measurements.

I saw this at Amazon and it looked interesting...
Mastercool MSC52224A Infrared Thermometer
http://rover.ebay.com/ar/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?mpt=1705501186&adtype=1&size=1x1&type=3&campid=5336055023&toolid=10001Link (http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html?ie=UTF8&location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2FMastercool-52224A-SP-MSC52224A-Infrared-Thermometer%2Fdp%2FB000TM7HXC%2Fref%3Dtag_dpp_lp_edpp_ttl_in&tag=5336055023-20&linkCode=ur2&camp=1789&creative=9325)

http://rover.ebay.com/ar/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?mpt=1568199496&adtype=1&size=1x1&type=3&campid=5336055023&toolid=10001 http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/410lSuXMJ9L._AA253_.jpg (http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html?ie=UTF8&location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2Fgp%2Fproduct%2Fimages %2FB000TM7HXC%2Fref%3Ddp_otherviews_1%3Fie%3DUTF8%26s%3Dauto motive%26img%3D1&tag=5336055023-20&linkCode=ur2&camp=1789&creative=9325)

Mike

bandit4

08-06-09, 02:04 AM

Hello!

bandit4

08-06-09, 02:07 AM

Hello all!
I just got a new entertainment center... http://www.ashleyfurniture.com/Showroom/LargeProductImage.aspx?PageId=Showroom&SetDomTab=1&ItemNo=W423-21 ...to house my Samsung UN55B8000, PS3, Scientific Atlanta HD DVR and Dell Studio PC.

My problem is I have been noticing a lot of heat build up. I have the DVR located in the center top shelf behind the glass door. I have the PC and the PS3 located on the right hand side behind the right door. The PC is on the upper shelf and the PS3 is on the lower shelf. I have to leave the doors open to cools things off.

I have been reading this entire thread and have gotten some nice ideas. What do you all think of 3 of these USB fans... http://www.coolerguys.com/840556088417.html ... One attached to the PS3, another to the PC and the third to the DVR?? The PC and the PS3 fans would only come on when they are turned on and the DVR fan would always be on.

I would use a filter on each fan. Is this a good setup? Should I have the air blowing in as per Bricot's #413 post? Or should I have the air blowing out? Any help or advice would be appreciated! Thanks!

Suntan

08-11-09, 12:31 PM

... One attached to the PS3, another to the PC and the third to the DVR?? The PC and the PS3 fans would only come on when they are turned on and the DVR fan would always be on.

I would not hook two fans up in the same "air compartment" such that only one or the other may be on at a time. If one of the fans is not running, the open space around the non moving fan is a prime opening for the air from the other fan to short curcuit through. in the most severe case of this, all the air will just circulate in the one fan opening and back out the other. If you then had them mounted close together, you would get little to no benefit from the one fan being on.

At the very least, if you set them up so one comes on per component, at least set one high as an exhaust fan and set the other low as a supply fan. that way you still maintain flow through even with only one fan running.

I would use a filter on each fan.

I wouldn't, you just kill all the airflow these thing can provide. Seriously, those two fans will likely not have enough to keep a PC and a PS3 ventilated if it is even remotely hot in your room, adding a filter on will cut at least 50 to 75% of the air they can move, making it that much harder. I suggest you go filterless and just vacuum your carpet more often. ;)

Further, if your setup allows (fans are located out of the way, no kids with inquisitive little fingers, etc.) run those fans with no shielding too. You would be amazed at how much airflow gets reduced when you put those little round bar fan shields on. Take them off and you will get a lot more airflow (and the fan will most likely run quiter too.)

Lastly, running fans as supply instead of exhaust can have advantages, but their advantages become significantly reduced if your cabinet has a lot of leakage points. (IE: If the supply air leaks out along the bottom of the door right by where it was blown in, it's not doing much to force the hot air out the top.) Whereas if you run fans as exhaust and you have leakage, its not really as big of a deal, as even if you are pulling air in around the top of the door, you are still going to be pulling cooler air in and most likely evacuating the hotter air out the back. Long story short, if you run those fans as supply fans, weatherstrip those door openings and make a dedicated exhaust opening up top.

-Suntan

bandit4

08-11-09, 11:25 PM

Suntan,
Thanks for the reply, help and advice!

I gave up on the idea of usb fans and I got this from Newegg:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811998069
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811992005
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812706011
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811999344

I bought two of the Silverstone fans

I was also thinking, for the same price, I could have gotten this from Coolerguys.

http://www.coolerguys.com/840556089544.html

Not sure which setup is better. The one from Newegg has better thermal control and better fans.

I hear what you say about filters. The only thing is I am a nut a when it comes to dust:). The 2 seperate shelves I have to cool are not that big, so I think this setup should do fine. I wont know though till I have it all up and running...

Thoughts??

ink124

08-25-09, 11:52 PM

Have my exhaust all set up. Here are a couple of pics.

This is outside of my media closet. Vent hole up top in the photo.
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/8399/img7347.jpg (http://img507.imageshack.us/i/img7347.jpg/) http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/img7347.jpg/1/w427.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img507/img7347.jpg/1/)

This is the other side of that vent hole (2x120mm Thermaltake fans).
http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/2343/img7366p.jpg (http://img269.imageshack.us/i/img7366p.jpg/) http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/img7366p.jpg/1/w640.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img269/img7366p.jpg/1/)

Bucks13

09-01-09, 08:25 PM

hello all, relatively new to the forums, though i've been looking and learning for a little while.

i just got a new tv stand, and it is getting pretty hot in there, or so i think. between 120-125 F i think.

i'd like to add some fans for cooling, but am not too sure about placement. since i have two sides of the stand, each with two sections that have wire pass-throughs, where should i put the fans? i have about 6 inches of workable space between the edges and the wire pass-throughs.

i was thinking i could put them a couple inches away, blowing inward to force air out of the wire pass throughs. that way, if they are too closely spaced, and the hot air out of the wire hole is going back in through the fan, i could put a barrier on the back to separate it.

any thoughts or opinions??

here is my setup. the most heat is building up on the bottom left (denon) and top right (dvr).

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk38/kmonsoon/TVStand2.jpg

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk38/kmonsoon/TVStand.jpg

RandallVR

09-02-09, 01:44 AM

Funny I came across this posting. I was just shopping this weekend for an enclosed cabinet and from all of these postings I guess I too should be considering how to keep the equipment cool.

Thanks for all the tips!

GaryRanson

09-02-09, 09:06 AM

Bucks13,

Check out my pics in post #436 of this thread as I had a similar situation to you.

Bucks13

09-02-09, 11:31 AM

Bucks13,

Check out my pics in post #436 of this thread as I had a similar situation to you.

that look pretty good. should work for my setup i'd say...do you have both fans blowing in, out, or one in and one out?

GaryRanson

09-02-09, 01:46 PM

that look pretty good. should work for my setup i'd say...do you have both fans blowing in, out, or one in and one out?

I have both fans extracting air which results in cooler air being drawn in through the open front of the cabinet and across the equipment.

Since my A/V Receiver generates more heat that my PVR I positioned the fans so that the A/V Receiver is exposed to one and a half fans and the PVR "sees" half a fan.

Bucks13

09-02-09, 02:40 PM

I have both fans extracting air which results in cooler air being drawn in through the open front of the cabinet and across the equipment.

Since my A/V Receiver generates more heat that my PVR I positioned the fans so that the A/V Receiver is exposed to one and a half fans and the PVR "sees" half a fan.

i see, that makes sense for your setup. since i have a closed tv stand (which you can't tell from my pictures since the doors are open) should i have the fans force air in to the stand? i figure i'll have a better chance of maximizing the cool air inside the cabinet if i force it in with the fans, rather than trying to pull it in through the smaller diameter wire holes.

does this sound about right?

GaryRanson

09-02-09, 03:22 PM

I am not a thermal design engineer but the Whhite Paper from Middle Atlantic titled "Controlling the temperature inside equipment racks" advises that it is always better to focus on removing the heat, rather than adding cold air.

sic0048

09-02-09, 03:37 PM

Ink124 and Bucks13,

You need to have air flow through the cabinet or closet. Simply having a fan blow in to or out of an otherwise sealed space isn't going to improve the airflow very much.

Ink - I would recommend placing a second vent at the bottom of the closet. Either on the same wall, or on the door itself (obviously it would be less obvious if placed on the wall). The lower vent does not need any fans. The cooler air will automatically flow into the closet to replace the air that is being blown out of the closet by the upper fans. You might even get creative and build an air duct for the lower vent so the incoming air is vented at the bottom of your equipment rack. This would ensure good air flow through the rack instead of just up the wall.

Bucks - You might want to drill holes in the bottom of the cabinet to allow more air flow to enter or exit (depending on the direction your main fans are blowing).

Bucks13

09-02-09, 06:49 PM

so you don't think the wire pass-through holes would be enough to pull in or push out?? thought it's not a big deal, i'm trying to reduce the amount of drilling/sawing hahaha.

ink124

09-02-09, 10:01 PM

Ink124 and Bucks13,

You need to have air flow through the cabinet or closet. Simply having a fan blow in to or out of an otherwise sealed space isn't going to improve the airflow very much.

Ink - I would recommend placing a second vent at the bottom of the closet. Either on the same wall, or on the door itself (obviously it would be less obvious if placed on the wall). The lower vent does not need any fans. The cooler air will automatically flow into the closet to replace the air that is being blown out of the closet by the upper fans. You might even get creative and build an air duct for the lower vent so the incoming air is vented at the bottom of your equipment rack. This would ensure good air flow through the rack instead of just up the wall... [snip]

Agreed! I actually was hoping that the gap under the door was sufficient. However, after noticing that the fans are on more often than I'd like, I will likely add an intake vent (similar to the one for exhaust) towards the bottom of the door. I may place fans as well just to help with air circulation.

sic0048

09-03-09, 10:58 AM

so you don't think the wire pass-through holes would be enough to pull in or push out?? thought it's not a big deal, i'm trying to reduce the amount of drilling/sawing hahaha.

It certainly wouldn't hurt to try it with the smaller holes. Just be sure to monitor the situation and be willing to try something else out if the temps are higher than you expected.

Think of it this way. The fan holes alone are much bigger than the wire holes. So right away there is not going to be an equal flow of air because less air will be entering the cabinet than potentially could exit. Physics will only allow an equal amount of air to flow, so the air exiting the fan holes will not be as much as it potentially could be. By adding more intake holes, you increase the amount of air available to flow out of the fan holes - thereby increasing the amount of air exiting the cabinet.

If the hardware is adequately cooled with the restictive air flow, then there is no need to add more holes. But the amount of air moved though the cabinet will be limited to the smaller of the intake or vent holes, not the larger of the two.

DMJ

09-03-09, 11:00 AM

Agreed! I actually was hoping that the gap under the door was sufficient. However, after noticing that the fans are on more often than I'd like, I will likely add an intake vent (similar to the one for exhaust) towards the bottom of the door. I may place fans as well just to help with air circulation.

Before you drill a hole you might want to see if the fans turn off when the door is open. Leaving the doors open might not help. I know my DVR runs hotter than the controller would like and it doesn't matter if the door is open or closed. I can leave it by itself, outside of the cabinet and it's too hot. The only time it cools down enough is when it's off. I think the "on" temperature for the controller is too low for most devices.

The only thing that I think would help, and something I might try is putting a fan directly on the DVR, blowing (or removing) the air directly from it's surface.

ink124

09-03-09, 11:18 AM

Before you drill a hole you might want to see if the fans turn off when the door is open. Leaving the doors open might not help. I know my DVR runs hotter than the controller would like and it doesn't matter if the door is open or closed. I can leave it by itself, outside of the cabinet and it's too hot. The only time it cools down enough is when it's off. I think the "on" temperature for the controller is too low for most devices.

The only thing that I think would help, and something I might try is putting a fan directly on the DVR, blowing (or removing) the air directly from it's surface.

I've left the door open and it does help. I should probably get a temperature sensor of some kind... But you got me thinking, if I placed a few fans on my components themselves to help circulate the stagnate air inside the closet, that can only help, right?

DMJ

09-03-09, 12:14 PM

I've left the door open and it does help. I should probably get a temperature sensor of some kind... But you got me thinking, if I placed a few fans on my components themselves to help circulate the stagnate air inside the closet, that can only help, right?

Fans blowing on or pulling air from each heat source is the most recommended (and probably best) way to cool components. Otherwise you're just hoping that enough air flows through. I didn't do it downstairs, but it's just the cable box that was making the Slingbox and wi-fi hot. Indirect airflow fixed that problem. Upstairs I'll be going with a fan directed into the projector cabinet. It has it's own fan so I won't mess with that.

Actually, the upstairs DVR is the newer version with a built-in fan, so I probably won't add a direct one there either. But, the receiver will get one (maybe two) directly on it.

Bucks13

09-03-09, 01:45 PM

It certainly wouldn't hurt to try it with the smaller holes. Just be sure to monitor the situation and be willing to try something else out if the temps are higher than you expected.

Think of it this way. The fan holes alone are much bigger than the wire holes. So right away there is not going to be an equal flow of air because less air will be entering the cabinet than potentially could exit. Physics will only allow an equal amount of air to flow, so the air exiting the fan holes will not be as much as it potentially could be. By adding more intake holes, you increase the amount of air available to flow out of the fan holes - thereby increasing the amount of air exiting the cabinet.

If the hardware is adequately cooled with the restictive air flow, then there is no need to add more holes. But the amount of air moved though the cabinet will be limited to the smaller of the intake or vent holes, not the larger of the two.

that makes nothing but sense! right now i'm just using a cheap little temp gauge to determine how hot it really is in there...it's palced on the front right corner of the avr. with all component off i'm sitting in the low 100s i think, and i've seen up to about 128 while watching a blu ray (loudly), with an average around the 118 i think.

i'll probably just put the fans in, try blowing in and try blowing out, measure my temps and see the results...if it's not very effective then i'll start drilling new holes.

any suggestions on the proper temp that i should see? maybe low to mid 90s?

Bucks13

09-04-09, 11:30 AM

so what do you guys think about this setup?

http://www.coolerguys.com/840556088875.html x4
http://www.coolerguys.com/840556088776.html x1
http://www.coolerguys.com/840556026983.html x1

do you think i'll need that big of a power supply? 5 Amps seems like a lot, but the fan didn't list it's current usage...i just don't know if it'll be larger than the next size down, 2 Amp supply.

GaryRanson

09-04-09, 11:57 AM

Bucks13

09-04-09, 01:38 PM

Bucks,

This PS would be adequate to power four of those fans:

http://www.coolerguys.com/840556087977.html

really, all 4 fans would be less than .5 amp? sweet.

i know a decent amount about electronics and electricity, but not about cooling fans, so your information helps...thanks.

EDIT: i lied, i just saw the current rating for those fans...0.08 A or 80 mA. so yeah, that one would be plenty to power all four fans...thanks

Chevron07

09-04-09, 04:20 PM

GaryRanson

09-04-09, 04:28 PM

You excedded the power supplies capability drawing 14.4W out of a 12W supply.

Chevron07

09-04-09, 04:41 PM

Is that 14.4w for just the one fan, or were two of them drawing 18.8w? Any suggestions on what type of supply I should look for? The fans are perfect for my application so I'd rather not swap them out.

Edit: I thought only giving the fans 10v would slow them down and draw less amps.

GaryRanson

09-04-09, 06:51 PM

Yes, 12V x 1.20A = 14.4Watts

That does seem a high current requirement for a 12V fan. What type of fan is this?

You need to first determine the number of fans that you will use and their total current requirement before picking a power supply.

Running 12V fans at 10V will slow the fans down.

duvetyne

09-04-09, 06:56 PM

running a 12VDC fan on 10VAC will probably destroy the fan fairly quickly.

GaryRanson

09-04-09, 10:39 PM

Whoops! I missed that a 10 VAC supply was being used. Not good.

Bucks13

09-05-09, 08:12 PM

so what does everybody think about smaller fans? i think 120 mm is too big to put 4 in my stand...so i was thinking about going with 92 or so...opinions?

GaryRanson

09-05-09, 09:13 PM

Bucks 13,

The reason that people use the 120mm is that for a given airflow, the fan generally run slower and thus quieter.

DMJ

09-05-09, 10:07 PM

so what does everybody think about smaller fans? i think 120 mm is too big to put 4 in my stand...so i was thinking about going with 92 or so...opinions?

I felt the same way, which is why I went with 80mm fans for the downstairs cabinet. I definitely would be able to see the fans if I'd gone with 120mm. The 80mm fans cool things down sufficiently, as you can see from my post with temperature readings.

I think the whole back of cabinet thing is trusted too much anyway. Getting airflow directly onto the component seems just as important (if not more so). There's too many nooks and cranny's that aren't getting air on them, their only hope of cooling is the little vent holes. How well does a back of the cabinet fan's airflow get inside of the nooks?

Bucks13

09-05-09, 11:55 PM

Bucks 13,

The reason that people use the 120mm is that for a given airflow, the fan generally run slower and thus quieter.

yeah, that makes sense. i just can't see drilling 4 3/4" holes in the back haha. and mounting even bigger fans. i'd be able to see them i think.

I felt the same way, which is why I went with 80mm fans for the downstairs cabinet. I definitely would be able to see the fans if I'd gone with 120mm. The 80mm fans cool things down sufficiently, as you can see from my post with temperature readings.

I think the whole back of cabinet thing is trusted too much anyway. Getting airflow directly onto the component seems just as important (if not more so). There's too many nooks and cranny's that aren't getting air on them, their only hope of cooling is the little vent holes. How well does a back of the cabinet fan's airflow get inside of the nooks?

i don't know about the nooks, but definitely the cranny's... just kidding. i wish i had more room inside to add more fans for airflow and direct air. oh well, maybe multi small fans.

crakarjax

09-06-09, 08:18 PM

Speaking of amps and voltage... I had a couple of fans sitting around, and dug up a wall wart to see what would happen.

The fans said:

DC 12V
1.20A

and the power supply said:

10V AC 1200mA 12VA

This ran for a little while, but the power supply got really hot and the system stopped working. Can anyone tell me what power supply I need for these fans?

You excedded the power supplies capability drawing 14.4W out of a 12W supply.

That's not true... the only relevant metric is the amperage. Running the fan at 10v will simply run it slower. I am running a 12v fan with a measly 5v power supply, for the sole purpose of running it slow.

Either your power supply is bad (or the specs are over-stated) or your fan consumes more current than it states. If your supply isn't sufficient you will burn up your fan, not the power supply.

Johnla

09-07-09, 01:06 AM

Either your power supply is bad (or the specs are over-stated) or your fan consumes more current than it states. If your supply isn't sufficient you will burn up your fan, not the power supply.

Ummmm, maybe using a AC voltage power supply to try and run DC voltage devices is not a great way to go either.... ;)
Did you miss the fact that he said the fan is a 12v DC fan, and the output of the power supply is 10v AC and not DC?

duvetyne

09-07-09, 01:32 AM

the only relevant metric is the amperage.

No, the relevant metric is VA.

Bucks13

09-07-09, 10:17 PM

ok so i'm thinking about going with 4 x 80 mm fans that are rated at either 28.7 CFM @ 20 dB, or 40.2 @ 32.4 dB. which would be the more beneficial noise/heat removal ratio?

i was thinking i'd be able to go with the higher b/c i'm working with a closed tv stand, which i figure will muffle most, if not all of the fan noise. plus i'll be mounting them on the inside of the unit.

Bob7145

09-08-09, 01:14 AM

TFC Triebwerk 120mm x 55mm Mid Speed Fan (62 CFM, 21 dBA, 1200 RPM)

http://www.heatsinkfactory.com/tfc-triebwerk-tk-122-nb-multiframe-120mm-x-55mm-mid-speed-fan-1800-rpm.html

Bucks13

09-08-09, 06:26 AM

http://www.heatsinkfactory.com/tfc-triebwerk-tk-122-nb-multiframe-120mm-x-55mm-mid-speed-fan-1800-rpm.html

that's a hell of a fan! but i think i'm going to stick with the smaller size considering the size of my tv stand.

Johnla

09-09-09, 01:40 AM

that's a hell of a fan!

Naaa, that's wimpy. ;) Now THESE, (http://www.bigassfans.com/)are some serious fans!!:D:)

Bucks13

09-09-09, 02:08 PM

Naaa, that's wimpy. ;) Now THESE, (http://www.bigassfans.com/)are some serious fans!!:D:)

haha well i guess it's all relative. we actually use those in my plant...good airflow at low rpms...

crakarjax

09-16-09, 08:51 PM

Ummmm, maybe using a AC voltage power supply to try and run DC voltage devices is not a great way to go either.... ;)
Did you miss the fact that he said the fan is a 12v DC fan, and the output of the power supply is 10v AC and not DC?

I assume that was a typo ;)

No, the relevant metric is VA.

I don't think so... volt-amp means Watts. Just because a device is rated at a certain wattage doesn't mean that it will put out that much power. On the other hand, running a device from a supply with not enough amperage WILL burn out the motor. At least, that's what I remember from my college days.

lajaro

09-17-09, 10:45 AM

Haven't read through all 481 previous posts, but here's how I did mine to keep the fans down on the PS3 and XBOX 360.

Quiet 120mm PC fan (rated for 12v DC, but runs at as low as 5v with very low current draw - somewhere around 10mA). Made by Silenx. Cost: $15 each. Any fan with similar specs would do though. This one comes with extra adapter which makes wiring easier.

Old DC power wart rated at 5V DC (used the one that came with an old Nokia cell phone). Rated 5V DC, 700mA

Cut connector off cell phone charger.

Connect black power lead to black leads on fan adapters (I've hooked up two to the same power).

Red adapter wires to white lead in phone charger (might be white, red, or black with white stripe - all depends on what they used to code the wires). If it doesn't power up, just switch them - no harm done as long as the two wires don't touch.

Install them as an exhaust at the back of the unit to draw hot air out (cabinet already designed to use convection for cooling so cool air is drawn in from underneath).

Cut 120mm hole in back panel on each shelf (no more than 3 inches clearance from wall but that's ok). Installed one of each for each shelf where the XB0x 360 and PS3 are.

Wall wart hooked up to IR triggered power strip (and added to my URC macro).

Result:
Fans run silent and just fast enough to suck the hot air out. as a test, I've left both systems on overnight with the amp powered up on the bottom shelf. PS3 was folding and Xbox was running a game demo (can't remember which). The cabinet didn't get hotter than 28 deg Celsius and the system fans were still on low.

Without the fans, the game systems will ramp up their fans in under 10 minutes, and that's only with one of them running at a time.

jbdawson

09-30-09, 07:17 PM

Hey guys,

I ordered a fan & thermal fan control kit from coolerguys but have a couple questions. I'll be using the fan on my Onkyo receiver which gets really hot even though its in a open shelf. Would you guys suggest I put the fan facing in toward the the receiver, or on the unit facing out pushing hot air out?

Also for this thermal controller I saw a video from coolerguys saying to tape it to the area which gets most hot, do I tape it to my receiver with normal electrical tape? Or is there some other special tape I need to use?

Bucks13

10-03-09, 11:56 AM

Bucks13

10-04-09, 08:45 PM

ok so i just got my setup finished and while they do a great job of getting the hot air out (closed cabinet only around high 70s) my wife thinks they are too loud.

this may not be the right place, so tell me if i'm out of line, but is anybody interested in some 80mm scythe fans? they're the kama series, 2500 rpm. they push around 30 cfm @ ~30 dB. i just ordered the s-flex i think that are only 12 dB, but only push around 20 cfm.

let me know!

htskinner

10-05-09, 09:37 AM

keep in mind i'm no expert, but from what i gather, it's better to pull hot air away...so you might want to point the fan so that it sucks hot air out from the receiver.

as for the tape, electrical should work, but with the elevated temperatures, it may soften the adhesive, causing a bit of a mess if you pull the tape off. you could try HVAC aluminum duct tape. it's specifically made for high temps, so the adhesive may hold better. hell, you may not even have to tape it on if you can just place it there without it falling off.

good luck.

Figured i'd help with a little insight, i've built a ton of computers and the general consensus is to have the same amount of airflow in as you do out of a case/enclosed area. The idea is to create a steady flow of positive pressure, if you have all of your fans doing the same thing (pushing air in or pulling it out) you will just create negative pressure and the hot air will stay put in the area... tomshardware wrote a pretty good article awhile back on case cooling etc.. that would also apply to AVR cooling. Sorry for not having a direct link though..
I'm cooling a onkyo avr on an open rack with a couple of 80mm artic cooling case fans mounted to a simple bracket, spliced through a thermal sensor and plugged to a 8v supply.. Pretty easy setup and total cost of maybe 15 bux.. its pretty easy to get a thermal sensor, most CPU cooling solutions have one and you can also get one separately... I dont see paying 50 bux for a solution that you can easily make/customize for under 20.

Bucks13

10-05-09, 03:41 PM

htskinner

10-05-09, 04:15 PM

you're not saying that you need to force air in while forcing it out, are you? what i mean is that you would have at least 2 fans per cavity, one blowing in and the other blowing out.

i would think that as long as you had a hole(s) similar in size to the fan port to allow air transfer, you would still get a circulation. for example, i have one fan per 3 cavities, all of which have similar sized wire pass through holes, which i feel gives adequate air flow.

what do you think? sound good?

You are correct i was just saying that it is best to create a positive airflow. The best way this is usually performed is by blowing air in one side/endand sucking it out on the other side/end. Depending on the size of the cavity having a fan sucking air out might not make a difference, however it probably will since the fan blowing air in might not be strong enough to create pressure that would force air out of the other hole in the cavity, instead it could possibly be fighting itself since the pressure inside would not allow it to move air into the cavity (like trying to add more water to a glass that is already full). Not saying that is happening but it is very much a possibility.

Think of it like this, in a room with a drop ceiling the supply vent and return vent are placed on opposite sides for a reason, usually to pull the air being blown out of the supply across the room into the return vent, creating positive air flow and not letting any air "sit" in the room.

hope that makes sense?
Either way any air movement is usually good air movement

crakarjax

10-05-09, 11:38 PM

DMJ

10-06-09, 02:04 PM

It's been said that air blowing over the case isn't enough. I'm adding a fan that will sit on top of the hotter cases and blow directly into them.

You probably won't have to tape down your sensor, you're over thinking it.

Bob7145

10-07-09, 12:50 AM

Fans always work better blowing into free air ie: no restriction.
If there is a restriction close to the blades (blowing against a case) the blades will cavitate, make more noise and flow less air if any. There are certain fans that are made for blowing against restriction (blowers!) or thick high speed (noisy) axials. Even the 120 x 25mm fan I use on top of the AVR (blowing up-exhaust) works better and makes less noise by slightly raising it with rubber pads.
Forget the thermal switches. If the equipment is on, it needs cooling. Turn it on and leave it on!
Look at server rack cabinets. They have Exhaust fans at the top and no Intake fans.

htskinner

10-07-09, 09:41 AM

Bucks13

10-07-09, 11:12 AM

I don't think aluminum tape is a good idea on electrical wires. A bit risky. Gooey electrical tape is a huge pain though. 3M electrical tape holds up well.

i was under the impression that there were no exposed wires...but i know what you're saying about tape that is conductive haha

Bucks13

10-07-09, 11:12 AM

You are correct i was just saying that it is best to create a positive airflow. The best way this is usually performed is by blowing air in one side/endand sucking it out on the other side/end. Depending on the size of the cavity having a fan sucking air out might not make a difference, however it probably will since the fan blowing air in might not be strong enough to create pressure that would force air out of the other hole in the cavity, instead it could possibly be fighting itself since the pressure inside would not allow it to move air into the cavity (like trying to add more water to a glass that is already full). Not saying that is happening but it is very much a possibility.

Think of it like this, in a room with a drop ceiling the supply vent and return vent are placed on opposite sides for a reason, usually to pull the air being blown out of the supply across the room into the return vent, creating positive air flow and not letting any air "sit" in the room.

hope that makes sense?
Either way any air movement is usually good air movement

i understand what you're saying. makes sense.