Could you power the Studio 100's with a receiver like the Onkyo 805? The Onkyo 805 allows you to bi-amp the main speakers. The 805 is rated at 130 wpc into 8 ohns. Thanks!

Could you power the Studio 100's with a receiver like the Onkyo 805? The Onkyo 805 allows you to bi-amp the main speakers. The 805 is rated at 130 wpc into 8 ohns. Thanks!

I have a Integra 8.8 powering 100's, CC690 and 4-FXi3 surrounds and it sounds good, but I have a small room (12x18x8). I'm on the fence about getting a separate amp or 4-590's to replace the FXi3's.
Just not sure what amp to get, 5 channel and use the Integra to push the backs or 7 channel. If I get a separate amp would it sound any better?
I'm currently looking at, Rotel, Parasound and Emotiva all in the 200+ wpc.
I should just be happy this is the best my system has ever sounded. :D
I keep think so far everything I've bought has improved my system and at some point I'll just be wasting $$.

The 100's will like the extra power and so will you, but I say no to dropping another 2K on the 4-590's. I have them and love them but I don't think you would hear a difference that will justify the cash.

Maybe your dealer will let you take a demo home to try out for a couple of days.

Babel Fish:

Your setup sounds like a dream! That would be my ideal setup as well. I was just wondering if your setup could be run by any of the latest receivers instead of having to go to separates? Thanks!

thanks! :) I saved 4 years for the whole setup... lol I made a separate savings account to put all my bonuses and extra cash into...

I am using the Denon 4308. The denon can handle the 100s just fine but there was a difference when I put the A5 on them. I still need to do more testing to determine the amount of difference but everything is boxed up right now because I just put drywall up :( I will keep you posted. Personally I would feel that any new receiver (130+wpc) should be fine for now and then you can add an amp later.

Could you power the Studio 100's with a receiver like the Onkyo 805? The Onkyo 805 allows you to bi-amp the main speakers. The 805 is rated at 130 wpc into 8 ohns. Thanks!

805 should be fine.. later you can get an amp if you feel that it is not sounding right.

Heh folks... I've been talking with a local fellow who wants to sell me a pair of ADP 470 surrounds that are supposed to be brand new in the box! I'm currently using 100 v.3's, cc590 centre and def tech mythos 5 towers for the rears.

I've been checking around and it appears the adp 470 model is about 3 or 4 years old.

My question is... what the heck are they worth and do you think they will give me a better sound than my Mythos towers?

The ADP's will be placed on a rear wall.

Thanks for the help.

Heh folks... I've been talking with a local fellow who wants to sell me a pair of ADP 470 surrounds that are supposed to be brand new in the box! I'm currently using 100 v.3's, cc590 centre and def tech mythos 5 towers for the rears.

I've been checking around and it appears the adp 470 model is about 3 or 4 years old.

My question is... what the heck are they worth and do you think they will give me a better sound than my Mythos towers?

The ADP's will be placed on a rear wall.

Thanks for the help.
they will at least timbre match your other paradigms.

Heh folks... I've been talking with a local fellow who wants to sell me a pair of ADP 470 surrounds that are supposed to be brand new in the box! I'm currently using 100 v.3's, cc590 centre and def tech mythos 5 towers for the rears.

I've been checking around and it appears the adp 470 model is about 3 or 4 years old.

My question is... what the heck are they worth and do you think they will give me a better sound than my Mythos towers?

The ADP's will be placed on a rear wall.

Thanks for the help.

I'm thinking they went for around 950-970 MSRP. Start by offering him 450-500?

I did the same thing, replaced Def Tech bipolar surrounds with ADP470s, after I had the rest of my V3 system setup. They are obviously timbre matched better, but it wasn't the biggest improvement of my Paradigm HT speaker upgrade. Buying them used is probably the best way to go.

Make sure you mount them so that you are perfectly in the "null". I temporarily mounted mine on 6' ladders, moved them around, and played pink noise through each, to get the right location. Mine are mounted on the sides.

Question for Studio 40 Owners and Users:

I happened to be out of town last week and came across a Paradigm dealer who doesn't move a lot of stock. He seemed really happy to get someone actually looking at better equipment and shot me what seemed like a good deal at the time (>$1000) for a new, in-the-box pair of black Studio 40 V4.

My first question is, did I overpay, get a good deal or what?

2nd question is, wow, the bass is really week on these when new. Do they loosen up very much with use?

It may just be me.. I'm going from a set of Klipsch RF-3 II which are highly efficient and prettty good bass performers as well. The 40s don't go anywhere close to as low nor do they pump out the volume like the RFs, but my untrained ear can detect more natural vocals on the 40s. What else should I be looking for?

Also, I have an SVS PC-Plus/2, so ultimately, the bass is not a huge deal, but it'd be nice not to have to depend on it. Thanks for your insight and replies!

I'm no expert and someone with more technical knowledge will chime in but in my experience, the Paradigms are not as effecient as other speakers out there, meaning they do need a good source of input. I only have the Titans at the moment but compared to the pair they replaced, I have to watch movies at a much higher volume.

As far as efficiency goes, the Monitor line is extremely efficient, which is probably closer to what you had with the Klipsch and the studio's are a little bit less. What are you driving them with...?

The Studio's tend to open up a bit more with a cleaner higher power amp. I think you got a good deal, if not a great deal on those speakers... Is this just a 2 channel rig? otherwise I would be looking to scarf up more inventory from that guy with his prices, he is obviously looking to start a good relationship with you... Center Channel, maybe some surrounds.. :)

The Plus/2 should be great with those 40's... Congrats..

I recently purchased a pair of Studio 20's (v4) and I'm powering them with a Marantz SR7001 with Marantz 125w monoblocks.

I was planning on adding a Velodyne DD10, but now I'm wondering whether upgrading to the Studio 60's would be a better option. I can still trade up at my dealer. Upgrading to the Studio 60s would be about $200 less than buying the DD10 (I would probably get the DD from Ebay).

Which do you think would be better for music?

My room is about 12' x 18' x 8'. Speakers on one of the smaller walls.

Warpdrv,

I should have mentioned that I'm powering them with a yamaha rx-v1000 receiver.
I have existing speakers for that make up the difference in the 5.1 speaker arrangement, but will eventually change out the center and rears for Paradigm brand.

I don't recall to the exact number off hand, but I believe he quoted a price of about $9xx on the 590 center and about the same for the ADP rears. He suggested going with the 290 as the center at a cost of about $4xx.

[I was planning on adding a Velodyne DD10, but now I'm wondering whether upgrading to the Studio 60's would be a better option. I can still trade up at my dealer. Upgrading to the Studio 60s would be about $200 less than buying the DD10 (I would probably get the DD from Ebay).

This system is mainly used for music, but I do watch movies also. However, I wouldn't really be taking advantage of the room shaking bass for movies since I'm in a Townhouse. My room is about 12' x 18' x 8'. Speakers on one of the smaller]

imho, I THINK YOU ANSWERED YOUR OWN QUESTION.

As a upgraded sub is unnecessary at this point. Moving up to the Studio 60 v4 will provide better sounding bass from the lower mids to the bottom. It may even negate the desire to upgrade the sub. However, if you do upgrade, look to HSU, SVS or even Earthquake, instead of Velodyne which to many has dropped from favor given first rate competition from other brands.

Living in a towne house will certainly preclude you from ever "cooking your system" unless of course its isolated within the basement! Thus the logic to need more sub is suspect.:cool:

Besides, the Studio 60's will be generating sound more often than your sub. So look to enjoy the sonics the 60's will bring you most of the time. It's the law of diminishing returns....:D

Question for Studio 40 Owners and Users:

I happened to be out of town last week and came across a Paradigm dealer who doesn't move a lot of stock. He seemed really happy to get someone actually looking at better equipment and shot me what seemed like a good deal at the time ($970) for a new, in-the-box pair of black Studio 40 V4.

My first question is, did I overpay, get a good deal or what?

2nd question is, wow, the bass is really week on these when new. Do they loosen up very much with use?

It may just be me.. I'm going from a set of Klipsch RF-3 II which are highly efficient and prettty good bass performers as well. The 40s don't go anywhere close to as low nor do they pump out the volume like the RFs, but my untrained ear can detect more natural vocals on the 40s. What else should I be looking for?

Also, I have an SVS PC-Plus/2, so ultimately, the bass is not a huge deal, but it'd be nice not to have to depend on it. Thanks for your insight and replies!

You got more than a good deal, you got a great deal, latest model and nearly 35% OFF!!!!!!! dealer cost is only 60%, WOW!:eek: Double WOW!:eek::eek::

Go back there and buy some more at those prices! Where are they located? Maybe we can help some members of this forum who desire to buy Paradigm?:)

I guess thats what I was thinking. I want more bass than the 20's, but don't really need the sub 40hz stuff because it will probably just irritate the neighbors. I do want to get the best (smoothest) performance possible from 40-100hz though. I would probably end up setting the subsonic filter to the 32hz setting on the velodyne.

I guess thats what I was thinking. I want more bass than the 20's, but don't really need the sub 40hz stuff because it will probably just irritate the neighbors. I do want to get the best (smoothest) performance possible from 40-100hz though. I would probably end up setting the subsonic filter to the 32hz setting on the velodyne.

Forget screwing with the sub sonic filter, its slope is too steep ans starts somewhere about 130-150 and will hurt the fundamentals below 100 and likely interact with the 80hz crossover settings on your HTR. Just leave it alone.

I would imagine the walls between apartments is made of brick, and no one lives below you. It shouldn't be much of an issue.:rolleyes:

You got more than a good deal, you got a great deal, latest model and nearly 35% OFF!!!!!!! dealer cost is only 60%, WOW!:eek: Double WOW!:eek::eek::

Go back there and buy some more at those prices! Where are they located? Maybe we can help some members of this forum who desire to buy Paradigm?:)

Care to weigh in on the second question? Would I be better off returning the 40s and going with some 60s?

Also, what kind of stand is everyone using for the Studio 40s? I bought the S-stands for just over $100, but they seem very light.

In case anyone is wondering where I bought these speakers at, it is at Risley's Audio & Video in Evansville, In. The salesman (Mark Rea) said they can definitely not sell online, but said he would work out good similar good deals with anyone that comes into the store. I had posted my purchase price, but Mark did ask that I didn't mention specific prices.

He seemed really good to work with and when I mentioned that I may want to go with another model, said they would do what it took to take care of me.

The Studio's tend to open up a bit more with a cleaner higher power amp.

Warpdrv,
How much cleaner higher power?
My current Integra has 140 wpc, it sounds good, but if I add an amp say 200 wpc or more would it sound better?
I know this is a loaded question, but I'm looking for some insight before I spend the dollars.
The local shop doesn't stock separate amps so I can't take one home to demo.

Care to weigh in on the second question? Would I be better off returning the 40s and going with some 60s?

Also, what kind of stand is everyone using for the Studio 40s? I bought the S-stands for just over $100, but they seem very light.

In case anyone is wondering where I bought these speakers at, it is at Risley's Audio & Video in Evansville, In. The salesman (Mark Rea) said they can definitely not sell online, but said he would work out good similar good deals with anyone that comes into the store. I had posted my purchase price, but Mark did ask that I didn't mention specific prices.

He seemed really good to work with and when I mentioned that I may want to go with another model, said they would do what it took to take care of me.

Most of the time the j-29 stands are used for the Studio 60's in my shop. Check out the Paradigm site to see the others available.

The Studio 60's are the way to go, no brainer!!!

You got more than a good deal, you got a great deal, latest model and nearly 35% OFF!!!!!!! dealer cost is only 60%, WOW!:eek: Double WOW!:eek::eek::



Dealer cost is 60% off? :eek:

I thought Dealer cost was more like 35-40% off, hence all the dealers reluctance to give better than 10-15% off :confused:

Dealer cost is 60% off? :eek:

I thought Dealer cost was more like 35-40% off, hence all the dealers reluctance to give better than 10-15% off :confused:

It is 60% OF list price.

The manner in which i responded made it convoluted when I stated he got 35% OFF, as dealer cost is only 60% (of list).

Does that explain it?;)

Yes, now it makes sense!

Yet him getting 35% OFF is really amazing...

I paid $900 for a pair of used studio 60 v.3's, which is 40% off the list price when they were purchased new.

Paradigm issued a press release on the Studio Reference Esprit On-Walls back in November:

http://www.avrev.com/news/1107/29.paradigm201.shtml

Does anyone know if these are in dealer's hands now or when they're expected to be released? Even better if you've heard them and have some impressions. I wouldn't mind reducing the footprint of my theater and these seem to fit the bill.

dleto:

Does the Whalen TV Stand give you enough height and support for the CC690 to be placed on the shelf under the TV? Are the shelves glass/wood/metal? Thanks

Warpdrv,
How much cleaner higher power?
My current Integra has 140 wpc, it sounds good, but if I add an amp say 200 wpc or more would it sound better?
I know this is a loaded question, but I'm looking for some insight before I spend the dollars.
The local shop doesn't stock separate amps so I can't take one home to demo.

I would imagine that all depends on how loud you like to listen and what the amp section of your Integra is REALLY rated to... I like to have an amp for cleaner more impactful sound when the transient spikes in movies demand it... I listen sometimes at high volumes..

Did I notice a huge difference between my Pioneer amp section to my Rotel 1095? Not huge, but deffinately better performance... I simply feel that if the manufacturer builds a speaker to handle high amounts of power, I like to provide it as close to the full potential as possible...


Emotiva is coming out with a XPA-5 200x5wpc amp in a few months for $699, Im going to get one for my new system, and see how it performs.

http://emotivalounge.proboards54.com/index.cgi?board=amps&action=display&thread=1192051012

All,

I have just returned from auditioning a few brands of speakers (music only). The paradigm's real stood out for me, in particular the Titans.

I want to purchase a 5.1 set up, and I think i am going go with the following;

Titans L/R
ADP190's for rears
As for the centre not sure to go with the CC190 or the CC290. Is the 290 worth 200USD more?

Anyone have a similar setup? I intend it to be used 70/30 Movies/Music.

I have been quoted a price of 1350/1550. What is the likelihood of getting discount? (I know if you don't ask you don't get..)

I didn't get to hear the ADP190's so are they OK, better speakers out there?

As for the .1 Paradigms Subs are no use to me I need a dual voltage one, thinking of eD or HSU.

Many thanks in advance for an advice.

Would 20% off MSRP be considered a good deal on new Paradigm Studios?

I didn't get to hear the ADP190's so are they OK, better speakers out there?


I have the ADP190's as sides in my theater and am 'super' pleased. Monitor 11's L/R and CC390 inda middle. For movies I really like the 190's, for music not as much. They are bipole so the direct sides (Klipsch) I had sounded better for Music IMHO, not because they were better just suited MCH HiRez surround music better.
Enjoy!

Joe

Would 20% off MSRP be considered a good deal on new Paradigm Studios?

What dealer is giving you this kind of discount??

Jeez, around on the Front Range you'd be lucky to get 10% off MSRP and that's by begging. Paradigm (and other manufacturers) need wider dealer networks so there is some semblence of competition.

Dan

What dealer is giving you this kind of discount??

Jeez, around on the Front Range you'd be lucky to get 10% off MSRP and that's by begging. Paradigm (and other manufacturers) need wider dealer networks so there is some semblence of competition.

Dan

Part of it is competition....and if you're a dealer, the fact the Paradigm is protecting your account by not flooding the dealer market, and holding a short discount with no internet sales, allows some stability for dealers, and loyalty. No dealer likes having to compete with Best Buy, internet, at cut rate prices. Paradigm is trying to keep their product semi-high end, and high end dealers aren't gonna carry it (where it can be compared to higher end gear by the consumer) if they whore their dealer networks out.

Good for the dealer, not necessarily that good for the customer that knows what they want (like I). So I tend to just buy used.

Besides the lack of dealer competition, Paradigms Dealer cost is not that much below list...so even 10% is cutting into their bottom line once you take into account the dealer is paying for the shipping costs, etc.

Someone on here seemed to think the dealer markup was actually pretty high, so 10% would seem fairly skin-flintish to me.

Dan

Issue: Correcting hooking up speaker wire

Just a quick question before I hook up my new Paradigm speakers with my Pioneer Elite receiver. Had very bad flu last 2 weeks, could not set up new system, and forgot exactly what my dealer said about correctly connecting the speaker wire. However, please verify or correct me on the following set up instructions. I do not want to damage my new system or have to rewire everything.

I have two different sets of speaker wires.

Set#1
The fronts and center wires have arrows (i.e.>>>) on the outer lining going in one direction. I believe my dealer said the arrows should ultimately lead to the speakers.

Example (Beginning Receiver) ">>>>wire>>>>wire>>>>"(Speaker End)

Set#2
The rear channels speaker wires just have various wording and the flow or direction of the wording should lead to the speakers.

Example (Beginning Receiver) "Speaker wire gauge...upgrade...quality tested etc, etc"(Speaker End) Is this also correct?

Thanks all

Issue: Correcting hooking up speaker wire

Just a quick question before I hook up my new Paradigm speakers with my Pioneer Elite receiver. Had very bad flu last 2 weeks, could not set up new system, and forgot exactly what my dealer said about correctly connecting the speaker wire. However, please verify or correct me on the following set up instructions. I do not want to damage my new system or have to rewire everything.

I have two different sets of speaker wires.

Set#1
The fronts and center wires have arrows (i.e.>>>) on the outer lining going in one direction. I believe my dealer said the arrows should ultimately lead to the speakers.

Example (Beginning Receiver) ">>>>wire>>>>wire>>>>"(Speaker End)

Set#2
The rear channels speaker wires just have various wording and the flow or direction of the wording should lead to the speakers.

Example (Beginning Receiver) "Speaker wire gauge...upgrade...quality tested etc, etc"(Speaker End) Is this also correct?

Thanks all

It matters not.

dleto:

Does the Whalen TV Stand give you enough height and support for the CC690 to be placed on the shelf under the TV? Are the shelves glass/wood/metal? Thanks

Jimmy,
The CC690 fits perfect on the shelf. The shelfs are glass somewhat cheap but they work. Metal cross members and wood uprights. After I put the CC690 on the shelf I pushed down with very little movement. The weakest link I would say are the glass shelfs.
I also took the feet off the speaker and added felt to make it easier to slide it in.
My local BB had one on the floor assembled plus they had them in stock.

Jimmy,
The CC690 fits perfect on the shelf. The shelfs are glass somewhat cheap but they work. Metal cross members and wood uprights. After I put the CC690 on the shelf I pushed down with very little movement. The weakest link I would say are the glass shelfs.
I also took the feet off the speaker and added felt to make it easier to slide it in.
My local BB had one on the floor assembled plus they had them in stock.

Can't comment on the 690 fitting (I have my 590 on the top shelf), but I feel this is a very good quality stand for the price. I searched for a long time and couldn't find anything else under $1000 that I liked. The Whalen is sturdy and looks really nice too.

Would 20% off MSRP be considered a good deal on new Paradigm Studios?

My dealer gave me the ADP-590's for $565ea. This was a few days after I bought the v4 60's and cc-590 from him at list. Although a discount is great I don't have a problem with paying list as his return policy is more then fair. I returned my adp-590 about 3 months later because of some delaminating and he swapped them for new. Good customer service is more important to me the 5-6% off.

Having said that who is giving 20% off?

DN

Basically I was just asking a hypothetical question when I asked about a 20% discount. I've checked the pricing of many speaker brands and some speaker lines (i.e. Klipsch, Definitive Tech, etc.) seem more willing to discount than other speaker lines such as Revel or Paradigm.

Klipsch seems to be the most willing to discount with the brands I've checked so far. Also, they are available on some websites and you can order them at discounted prices. Definitive Tech of course is found in BB and other places and they seem more willing to discount as well and you can find these used on Ebay and other places.

From what one dealer told me, Paradigm's dealer cost is 60% of MSRP and brands like Klipsch and Definitive Tech have a dealer cost of 50% of dealer cost, therefore more likely to throw in a discount. Of course, I could be wrong. I'm going off what one dealer told me.

Is the ADP-190's mainly used in the middle of the room or can you use them in the rear as surrounds in a 5.1 set up? The only reason I ask this is because I was looking at a picture of them without the cover and notice speakers facing forward and 2 more speakers facing backwards. If I have them in a 5.1 as rear surrounds then those other 2 speakers would be hitting the back wall (the sound) is that what I want to happen? The seats will be backed up to the rear wall and elevated on a riser. So do I go with the ADP190's or something like the ATOMS or even the Mini Monitor?

The local dealer confused me even more the other day! The salesman told me that I should put the same speakers all around my room. So if I go with Monitor 7's as planned up front that I should use another set of Monitor 7's for surround in the rear! What sense does that make? He based that on what top of the line recording studios have as their setups. Now if he meant that I should keep the same size speakers in the rear that I have up front then that I do understand since the Atoms and Monitor 7's both have 5-1/2 inch drivers.

I appreciate the help or suggestions!!

Thanks!

Is the ADP-190's mainly used in the middle of the room or can you use them in the rear as surrounds in a 5.1 set up? The only reason I ask this is because I was looking at a picture of them without the cover and notice speakers facing forward and 2 more speakers facing backwards. If I have them in a 5.1 as rear surrounds then those other 2 speakers would be hitting the back wall (the sound) is that what I want to happen? The seats will be backed up to the rear wall and elevated on a riser. So do I go with the ADP190's or something like the ATOMS or even the Mini Monitor?

The local dealer confused me even more the other day! The salesman told me that I should put the same speakers all around my room. So if I go with Monitor 7's as planned up front that I should use another set of Monitor 7's for surround in the rear! What sense does that make? He based that on what top of the line recording studios have as their setups. Now if he meant that I should keep the same size speakers in the rear that I have up front then that I do understand since the Atoms and Monitor 7's both have 5-1/2 inch drivers.

I appreciate the help or suggestions!!

Thanks!

I'll give the sales person the benefit of the doubt. He MAY have meant, you run speakers from the same series/brand and Not the same speaker model....

If he meant something other, he's a moron!:(

The mistake most HT beginners make is they place the "surrounds" BEHIND where they sit, OR in other words Directly opposite across the room from the front/center channels!!! that is incorrect, period........

The Surrounds ideally should be placed slightly behind where you sit, mounted mid way about 2/3'rds up the wall.

The rear wall position is for what are "presence or ambiance" speakers. that is other 2 channels in a 7.1 vs. 5.1 system.

The Atoms or Minis would be perfect for that! Some systems place presence speakers between the Front channel L & R speakers.

The ADP series is a bi pole it radiates in two directions at once. Its purpose is to spread the sonics across a wider area for those sitting behind the ideal sitting location.

Hoope that answers your question:)

As of a result of damage to my studio 20's v.3, I may have to replace my rear channels in my current set up (FRONT: 40's V.3; CENTER: 570; REAR: 20's V.3; SUB: Sesmic 12).

It it my understanding the current version is 4. Is there is a difference between version 3 & version 4, as it pertains to sound?

How would the version 4 blend with the version 3 set up?

I have a pair of Atoms v.3. Thinking about upgrading to a 5.1 setup.

Options are:

Front: Atoms, or Monitor 7
Center: CC-190
Subwoofer: PDR-8 ($299) or DSP-3100 ($499)
Surround: Atoms

The main indecision is the sub. Will the PDR-8 versus DSP-3100 give a noticeable difference? PDR-8 reviews range from fairly good to “anemic”. Unfortunately Paradigm seems to have discontinued the cheery color version (to match my Atoms). The DSP series is new, so not much reviews yet, and they seem a bit too large for my space.

Will the Monitor 7 on the front instead of the Atoms give a difference? Any other suggestions on this price range (e.g Monitor 9 or 11 at the front) ?
Space is about 10’ X 14’

As of a result of damage to my studio 20's v.3, I may have to replace my rear channels in my current set up (FRONT: 40's V.3; CENTER: 570; REAR: 20's V.3; SUB: Sesmic 12).

It it my understanding the current version is 4. Is there is a difference between version 3 & version 4, as it pertains to sound?

How would the version 4 blend with the version 3 set up?

The v4 series are noticeably better sonically. They are airier, deeper and wider staging, plus slightly more efficient. IMHO, your weakest component is your Paradigm subwoofer. For newbies and the uninformed it'll do, but at this stage when you're asking about version compatibility tells me you've sonically matured. As such, you should also move to a better designed sub like a HSU, SVS or EPIK. These models will add a significant improvement to your sound.

Now to the main speakers; the cc570 is very close to the 590---keep it,
40 v3 fronts, good enough... convert to the ADP series for the surrounds ...move to the ADP 390 or 590 and you will enjoy a dramatic improvement in surround sound and sonic fireworks because they a re Bi polar and radiate is 2 directions. This provides folks which are sitting in a less than ideal seat the opportunity to hear the sound effects better.

If music is your primary interest, the surround channels don't come into play anyway. If you listen to SACD (which is a dead or dying product and soon to leave the scene) the ADP series will provide more than adequate sound.

There you have it!;)

I have a pair of Atoms v.3. Thinking about upgrading to a 5.1 setup.

Options are:

Front: Atoms, or Monitor 7
Center: CC-190
Subwoofer: PDR-8 ($299) or DSP-3100 ($499)
Surround: Atoms

The main indecision is the sub. Will the PDR-8 versus DSP-3100 give a noticeable difference? PDR-8 reviews range from fairly good to “anemic”. Unfortunately Paradigm seems to have discontinued the cheery color version (to match my Atoms). The DSP series is new, so not much reviews yet, and they seem a bit too large for my space.

Will the Monitor 7 on the front instead of the Atoms give a difference? Any other suggestions on this price range (e.g Monitor 9 or 11 at the front) ?
Space is about 10’ X 14’

Please read my post below regarding subwoofer choices. Kill the Paradigm sub....period.

Floor standers are murder if you have little kids.....if you don't, I will continue.

The monitor 7's are adequate, not stellar. For the Dollar value the Titan, Mini & Atom are the sweet spot in that series.

Move up to the Mini monitors v5 for the fronts(or the others), center CC290 v5, if soundtracks or TV is your interest, go with ADP 190 or 290v5 surrounds mounted on the side walls. Don't place speakers on the REAR WALLS or in the Rear of the room!!! That is heresy in a 5.1 system!!!:(:(:(

As for music, read post below.

Mind you you made no reference to your electronics or cabling:rolleyes::rolleyes: That alone is suspect in my mind.

Thats all for now until I have a cup of coffee---- I get the sense, you're on a beer budget....... If so, don't expect much from any HTIB system or a $$$ down sizing from my speaker suggestions. You get what you pay for;)

As of a result of damage to my studio 20's v.3, I may have to replace my rear channels in my current set up (FRONT: 40's V.3; CENTER: 570; REAR: 20's V.3; SUB: Sesmic 12).

It it my understanding the current version is 4. Is there is a difference between version 3 & version 4, as it pertains to sound?

How would the version 4 blend with the version 3 set up?

you can do what i did take your favorite piece of music play it in the 2channel
mode then go to the dealer play the same piece on the v4's while trying
to use the same or close to the same amp or receiver see if you notice
a slight or pronounced difference also keep in mine the demo rooms are
usually treated so they are for the most point going to sound great.

I just discovered this thread as so much of my time had been researching flat screens. I'm a big Paradigm fan and one day hope to improve on my exisiting set up: Monitor 7's with a CC350, Monitor 3's and then Atoms as rears while using an NHT sub. I use Mini's upstairs for music only......The reason for my post is that I always felt the 7's were too low......and all the choices for stands were "wood", weak, or too costly for me.
I went to a local landscaping yard and had them cut 2 7" x7" x 15" stands for the Monitor 7's using scraps from their broken fence post pile. Then I had them cut me a piece from a broken step also 7" high for my sub.....all in GRANITE and beautiful......the tops and bottom are smooth and level while the edges all have that natural stone look. Did I say solid? Speaker stand weighs about 50#'s, while the Sub stand is close to 100#'s.

I just picked up my new studio 100's they are great except for one thing, I was examining them and shined a flash light inside of the port and saw that one of the speakers has padding blocking the back of the port. What can I do? I tried to move it with a coat hanger but no luck. I guess I'll have to bring it back to my dealer. this is really frustrating because I paid alot of money (to me) for quality speakers and this happens. Now I have to drive a total of four more hours to the dealership. Have any of you had this problem before? Do you think it has anything to do with the magnashield? Also has anyone heard of the magnashield affecting the sound quality? Please help me with this! thanks all, AVKIK.

I heard a lot of talk about the SVS sub but I have not heard it in person yet. I am not bad mouthing anything I have not listened to. I heard a lot of good things about that sub. However I DID demo the PDR-8 v.3 recently at the store along with a pair of Monitor 7's and they let me crank it up as loud as I wanted. I brought with me a CD that had 1 hip hop song, 1 rock song, 1 movie soundtrack song and 1 jazz song and I was impressed with the sound of the sub and the 7's. For my room which is 15x17 those speakers will do me good.

Ginovino,

I am still a little confused about your response to my earlier post #6289. I was going to push my seats back to the wall in my 5.1 set up but after reading your post I should move them forward so that the surround speakers that are on the side walls are behind the seats. But do I use the ADP's, Atoms or Mini Monitor? Or do I slide the seats back to the rear wall and place those speakers in the middle of the room? Well now that I think of it that would be a 7.1 system right if I put them in the middle of the room so I should keep them in the back of the room, just slide my seats up some.

Is the Mini Monitor light enough to be mounted to the wall or placed on a shelf attached to the wall?

I heard a lot of talk about the SVS sub but I have not heard it in person yet. I am not bad mouthing anything I have not listened to. I heard a lot of good things about that sub. However I DID demo the PDR-8 v.3 recently at the store along with a pair of Monitor 7's and they let me crank it up as loud as I wanted. I brought with me a CD that had 1 hip hop song, 1 rock song, 1 movie soundtrack song and 1 jazz song and I was impressed with the sound of the sub and the 7's. For my room which is 15x17 those speakers will do me good.

Ginovino,

I am still a little confused about your response to my earlier post #6289. I was going to push my seats back to the wall in my 5.1 set up but after reading your post I should move them forward so that the surround speakers that are on the side walls are behind the seats. But do I use the ADP's, Atoms or Mini Monitor? Or do I slide the seats back to the rear wall and place those speakers in the middle of the room? Well now that I think of it that would be a 7.1 system right if I put them in the middle of the room so I should keep them in the back of the room, just slide my seats up some.

Is the Mini Monitor light enough to be mounted to the wall or placed on a shelf attached to the wall?

Chuck , Sorry if I confused you. To clarify myself, the ADP series or any Bi polar speaker is used on the side walls for the widest surround sound.

It Is suggested/recommended surround speakers be placed slightly behind where you sit and about 2/3's of the way up each side wall.

Rear wall speakers are added AFTER you set up the 5.1 system. Rear wall speakers are referred to as "presence" speakers. You can also place presence speakers in the front of the room between the L & R channels. Thus the 7.1 channel setup.

Move your couch or chairs out into the room so that you CAN place the Surrounds as I described earlier.

The Atoms or Minis if placed on the back/rear walls will then become the 7.1 presence channels (assuming HTR or amplifier has 7 discrete amplifier channels). Both the minis and atoms are rear ported and need space to breathe! I would use the Paradigm/Premier adjustable wall MB-60 mounts. These allow the ability to angle the Atoms or Mini speakers in several directions and move them out off the wall about 5 inches.

I keep telling you to forget the Paradigm subs!!!! for same or less money you can get state of art HSU, Epik, SVS or AF123 MFW-15($599). Any of these will blow the most expensive Paradigms away like yesterdays news.

Why is that so hard to understand?:(

Folks ask me for advice, and then either don't follow it or do something to the contrary. Starting tonight, I am going to take a sabbatical from anymore free assistance. I find myself typing this answer shaking my head.:mad:

I just picked up my new studio 100's they are great except for one thing, I was examining them and shined a flash light inside of the port and saw that one of the speakers has padding blocking the back of the port. What can I do? I tried to move it with a coat hanger but no luck. I guess I'll have to bring it back to my dealer. this is really frustrating because I paid alot of money (to me) for quality speakers and this happens. Now I have to drive a total of four more hours to the dealership. Have any of you had this problem before? Do you think it has anything to do with the magnashield? Also has anyone heard of the magnashield affecting the sound quality? Please help me with this! thanks all, AVKIK.

Magnashield are only found in the center channel CC190, 290, 390, 590, 690, c1, c2 series because they are placed so closed to the TV's and receive RF radiation.

So after struggling to find suitable housing for the CC690 without choking the sound from the drivers I decided to modify my existing stand. This is the ubiquitous Bush glass and steel unit that is readily available at certain big box retailers. Six holes, matching the previous ones in size, were drilled into the steel frame and the center shelf relocated. I don't believe that the structural integrity was compromised given the strength of the boxed steel members.

Before:

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0017.jpg

After:

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0020.jpg
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0021.jpg
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0022.jpg
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0023.jpg


Because the weight is all in the front I had to come up with a solution for a center support. I am temporarily using a piece of gray PVC cut to fit and deburred with a dremel. It will be painted flat black until a more appropriate replacement is found. It would probably be fine without the support, but I don't want to take any chances.

I did check out the Whalen stand that was mentioned previously but I did not care for the cherry finish and it was not a sturdy as the Bush stand.

The sound is considerably improved and well worth the hassle. For those searching for the perfect solution you might just find it in your toolbox.

oi-punx:

Looks like you did a great job and got what you needed with your TV stand. The stand looks very sturdy and the CC690 looks awesome in it. I can't tell, but do you have the CC690 tilted upwards a little in the front? Do you get a fairly seamless blend or soundfield with your main speakers by having the CC690 that low to the ground? Thanks.

I just picked up my new studio 100's they are great except for one thing, I was examining them and shined a flash light inside of the port and saw that one of the speakers has padding blocking the back of the port. What can I do? I tried to move it with a coat hanger but no luck. I guess I'll have to bring it back to my dealer. this is really frustrating because I paid alot of money (to me) for quality speakers and this happens. Now I have to drive a total of four more hours to the dealership. Have any of you had this problem before? Do you think it has anything to do with the magnashield? Also has anyone heard of the magnashield affecting the sound quality? Please help me with this! thanks all, AVKIK.
You can email your dealer a photo before the long drive.
Can you tell it's foam or a pad? Foam should not affect the bass sound. Although you probably can't hear the difference, it's still annoying.

Aww, come on ginovino don't stop giving advice. Whether people have liked your advice or not, the exchanges have been very informative and entertaining for the rest of us. Keep up the good work.

Well I bought my used but in mint condition PDR-8 v.3 sub online for $270 and hooked it up over the weekend and it sounded great. For now I am happy with it. But I can always upgrade to the SVS or similiar sub later on. I am not sweating it right at the moment.

Thanks for your advice Ginovino!!!

Well I bought my used but in mint condition PDR-8 v.3 sub online for $270 and hooked it up over the weekend and it sounded great. For now I am happy with it. But I can always upgrade to the SVS or similiar sub later on. I am not sweating it right at the moment.

Thanks for your advice Ginovino!!!

So now you have a used -run of the mill- out of production, Mini-sub which will be worthless on the used market in a year-- When for another $300 or so, you could owned a brand new top ranked sub from one of the direct Internet sellers??

There you have it Kmart shoppers.. first hand HOT off the presses...!
Go figure...... :confused::confused::confused:

ps , please return my advic:pe

Before one asks for your advice or calls upon your knowledge, you would think they were attracted to your previous disclosures in earlier postings and thus have a rudimentary comprehension of your Sonic political leanings.

I realize there are many insecure folks out there and are seeking reassurances that the magical Electro-Widget model xyz they bought was a good purchase for $1.17 on a Wednesday in July 1936. But maybe they could have gotten it for less if they bought on Thursday.

"he who hesitates is lost"

Reading through this forum takes some doing I admit. Thats why there is a search tool to assist you. Among the membership are numerous knowledgeable folks, many with facts that make my recommendations pale by comparison.

Nor am I adverse to buying on the used market. HOWEVER, YOU NEVER BUY DOWNWARD, YOU BUY VALUE GOING UP BEYOND WHERE YOU COULD PREVIOUSLY NOT AFFORD WHEN IT WAS NEW!;)

I pride myself on giving advice(when asked) that I have taken myself during my 50year audio journey. I have tripped up many times during that mission. So I try to reduce the learning curve for many who ask me questions.

I am not one of those "friends" who suggest you buy the latest whoop de do Sonic wonder of the moment (mind you they never own one of them, THEMSELVES!) and get you to experiment with your money!!!!

Your money is my money and, I treat it with respect.

Thus when speaking of respect, don't thank someone for their advice if you never planned to use it. Thats disingenuous. :(:(:(

Do you think it has anything to do with the magnashield? Also has anyone heard of the magnashield affecting the sound quality? Please help me with this! thanks all, AVKIK.

Magnashielding is mounted on the speaker magnet..

I just picked up my new studio 100's they are great except for one thing, I was examining them and shined a flash light inside of the port and saw that one of the speakers has padding blocking the back of the port. What can I do? I tried to move it with a coat hanger but no luck.

If the 'padding' is white fluffy gauze/cotton like, then it is not blocking the port per se, it is part of the internal dampening....don't remove it!

Thus when speaking of respect, don't thank someone for their advice if you never planned to use it. Thats disingenuous. :(:(:(

With all due respect, I think you're taking this, or your advice too absolutely.

You are 1 persons opinion and advice giver on a internet forum. Just because someone who asked you or I for advice doesn't follow it, that is their choice. We don't know their situation fully. A person on a budget that lives in a small apt with angry neighbors isn't really gonna be that disadvantaged with a small used paradigm sub as someone else. I think it's great that you voice your opinion on Paradigm subs....and it is dually noted.

Again, if you're gonna get upset when those asking your advise don't follow it, then posting here on AVS may become an exercise in frustration.

I for one wouldn't follow your advise on cabling, yet I wouldn't necessarily ignore your advise on speakers. That would be selective advise taking, we all do it as humans and I'm sure you do it too.

So after struggling to find suitable housing for the CC690 without choking the sound from the drivers I decided to modify my existing stand. This is the ubiquitous Bush glass and steel unit that is readily available at certain big box retailers. Six holes, matching the previous ones in size, were drilled into the steel frame and the center shelf relocated. I don't believe that the structural integrity was compromised given the strength of the boxed steel members.

Before:

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0017.jpg

After:

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0020.jpg
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0021.jpg
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0022.jpg
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d107/sjoipunx/DSC_0023.jpg


Because the weight is all in the front I had to come up with a solution for a center support. I am temporarily using a piece of gray PVC cut to fit and deburred with a dremel. It will be painted flat black until a more appropriate replacement is found. It would probably be fine without the support, but I don't want to take any chances.

I did check out the Whalen stand that was mentioned previously but I did not care for the cherry finish and it was not a sturdy as the Bush stand.

The sound is considerably improved and well worth the hassle. For those searching for the perfect solution you might just find it in your toolbox.

That thing is awesome. Makes me want one :) I have the 590 but now I have something to wish for...

What size tv is that. I have a similar 55" Sony and have always kept an eye out for a good stand upgrade with more shelving that is not $1000.

DN

With all due respect, I think you're taking this, or your advice too absolutely.

You are 1 persons opinion and advice giver on a internet forum. Just because someone who asked you or I for advice doesn't follow it, that is their choice. We don't know their situation fully. A person on a budget that lives in a small apt with angry neighbors isn't really gonna be that disadvantaged with a small used paradigm sub as someone else. I think it's great that you voice your opinion on Paradigm subs....and it is dually noted.

Again, if you're gonna get upset when those asking your advise don't follow it, then posting here on AVS may become an exercise in frustration.

I for one wouldn't follow your advise on cabling, yet I wouldn't necessarily ignore your advise on speakers. That would be selective advise taking, we all do it as humans and I'm sure you do it too.

You couldn't have stated it any better:D

I liken my burst of frustration to my years of dealing with customers who incessantly visits your shop asks for Demos of a product, asks for advice, uses up your available customer time and leaves buying zilch. This goes on for extended periods of time. Then one day, that person shows up and, in conversation unrelated to the their current information gathering visit, lets out that they purchased the item which they researched on your WATCH from someplace else!:eek:

My nature is to help folks given the human condition as it is, especially newbies. For a moment, I forgot this forum is NOT my store and thus I cannot uninvite the visitor from the premises. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Thanks for the sanity check!;)

Before one asks for your advice or calls upon your knowledge, you would think they were attracted to your previous disclosures in earlier postings and thus have a rudimentary comprehension of your Sonic political leanings.

I realize there are many insecure folks out there and are seeking reassurances that the magical Electro-Widget model xyz they bought was a good purchase for $1.17 on a Wednesday in July 1936. But maybe they could have gotten it for less if they bought on Thursday.

"he who hesitates is lost"

Reading through this forum takes some doing I admit. Thats why there is a search tool to assist you. Among the membership are numerous knowledgeable folks, many with facts that make my recommendations pale by comparison.

Nor am I adverse to buying on the used market. HOWEVER, YOU NEVER BUY DOWNWARD, YOU BUY VALUE GOING UP BEYOND WHERE YOU COULD PREVIOUSLY NOT AFFORD WHEN IT WAS NEW!;)

I pride myself on giving advice(when asked) that I have taken myself during my 50year audio journey. I have tripped up many times during that mission. So I try to reduce the learning curve for many who ask me questions.

I am not one of those "friends" who suggest you buy the latest whoop de do Sonic wonder of the moment (mind you they never own one of them, THEMSELVES!) and get you to experiment with your money!!!!

Your money is my money and, I treat it with respect.

Thus when speaking of respect, don't thank someone for their advice if you never planned to use it. Thats disingenuous. :(:(:(
Whoa Gino! My post (6304) was meant as an attempt to encourage you to continue to offer the (what I consider) very respectable advice. I intended it to be lighthearted, but I guess it didn't come across that way. I apologize. I assure you that there was nothing disingenuous about it. I'm just a newbie trying to learn all that I can from those of you who have been there.

BTW, I have used some of your advice and will again if the opportunity arises and it fits my situation. Hang in there man.

You couldn't have stated it any better:D

I liken my burst of frustration to my years of dealing with customers who incessantly visits your shop asks for Demos of a product, asks for advice, uses up your available customer time and leaves buying zilch. This goes on for extended periods of time. Then one day, that person shows up and, in conversation unrelated to the their current information gathering visit, lets out that they purchased the item which they researched on your WATCH from someplace else!:eek:



That is the burden of high-end retail. It's a tough business, but at least a line like Paradigm helps out with it's dealer protection policies...not that great for the customer seeking bottom line prices, but better for the dealer trying to make a cut.

To unAvol,

You will see I edited the post you responded to. I inadvertently quoted you when my vitriol was actually directed at post #6305

My apologies to you sir! The encouragement of fleaman and yourself had me step back, take a deep breath and sigh....

The stress's of winding down a Audio business after 28 years has my nerve endings quite raw and exposed. The comments in that post which set me off brought back years of frustration at the hands of the types of customers that I chastise in a later post #6312.

Let those customers go to Best Buy or Circuit city and use up the unlimited time available from their "Stellar- founts of useless information" personnel and ultimately get duped and over charged for crapola you wouldn't have in your garage.

The days of the Mom & Pop Audio salon are all but over. It now requires millions of dollars of investment and overhead costs, insurances and stylish buildings, plus having the proper staff on payroll to perform HT installations, be able to read blueprints and electrical surveys inorder to satisfy the customer who desires the all inclusive complete home system.

You need staff who can program computer controlled whole house remotes.

Many times you must keep these folks on full time salary or loose them to the competition, even when business is slow or not existent!

Not some pimple faced kid, working part time after schoo.
l
The mom & Pop shop are the corner stones of the Audio & video business, we are the first line to separate the crap from the crown jewels.

For most of the more astute membership, I am proselytizing and standing on soapbox preaching to the choir, for this I am guilty. Though for the remainder, if the shoe fits.........there is always Bestbuy:D

Is anyone out there running a Studio 6.1 or 7.1 system?

I have a 5.1 set up and wonder what ya'll have to say about your 6.1 / 7.1

I can see a 6.1 using 3 adp's but not a 7.1

What are you using in either case?

Thx

DN

Is anyone out there running a Studio 6.1 or 7.1 system?

I have a 5.1 set up and wonder what ya'll have to say about your 6.1 / 7.1

I can see a 6.1 using 3 adp's but not a 7.1

What are you using in either case?

Thx

DN

7.1 System:

Paradigm Studio 20 v.3 (fronts)
Paradigm Studio CC-470 v.3 (center)
Paradigm Studio ADP 590s v.4 (side surrounds)
Paradigm Atoms v.3 (back surrounds)
SVS PB12-NSD (subwoofer)

Thanks for the info guys. I now realized that I have an even bigger problem on my hands, I noticed that the rubber around my tweeter has a bubble in it. Upon closer examination I realized that it has an actual slit or hole in it. I called my dealer today about the padding in the port hole and he said he will fix it at the shop. Now I have to tell him about the tweeter:mad: By the way ginovino the studio 100's that I have are magnashielded because I ordered them that way because I have a crt tv and don't want to take a chance of the speaker interfeering with it. Again does anyone know if the magnashield would in any way affect the sound? Also has anyone noticed that there metal port hole has nasty grooves in it? Both of mine do but one is worst than the other. Do you think I should ask if I can have it replaced? I know the grooves wont affect the sound but I have a little OCD and would like them to be perfect and not look like crap since I paid so much money for them. Thank you all so much. Avkik

I can't tell, but do you have the CC690 tilted upwards a little in the front? Do you get a fairly seamless blend or soundfield with your main speakers by having the CC690 that low to the ground? Thanks.

The speaker is flat and level although there are provisions for tilting it upwards several degrees. The dispersion on it is really wide vertically so I don't hear a need to adjust it. The blend with the mains is very natural, incredibly full and powerful even with my modest amplification.

What size tv is that. I have a similar 55" Sony and have always kept an eye out for a good stand upgrade with more shelving that is not $1000.

It is a 60". I often see the stand on sale and it comes in different finishes. It would fit a 55" flat panel or microdisplay with no problems.

7.1 System:

Paradigm Studio 20 v.3 (fronts)
Paradigm Studio CC-470 v.3 (center)
Paradigm Studio ADP 590s v.4 (side surrounds)
Paradigm Atoms v.3 (back surrounds)
SVS PB12-NSD (subwoofer)

Caesar!

Very nice indeed! you have made good use of what seems to be limited space.

I guess 20x15x9ft???

I bet if you moved up to a some serious floor standers, you would have a really knockout sound as you have lots of open space in the front. The 590 & 690 v4 centers , got rid of that midrange hollowness that earlier units tended to have with the midrange voicing.

The newest Atoms V5 are the best ever and have space, staging and depth that will astound you.

What cabling are you using to wire your speakers ?:confused:

Thanks for the info guys. I now realized that I have an even bigger problem on my hands, I noticed that the rubber around my tweeter has a bubble in it. Upon closer examination I realized that it has an actual slit or hole in it. I called my dealer today about the padding in the port hole and he said he will fix it at the shop. Now I have to tell him about the tweeter:mad: By the way ginovino the studio 100's that I have are magnashielded because I ordered them that way because I have a crt tv and don't want to take a chance of the speaker interfeering with it. Again does anyone know if the magnashield would in any way affect the sound? Also has anyone noticed that there metal port hole has nasty grooves in it? Both of mine do but one is worst than the other. Do you think I should ask if I can have it replaced? I know the grooves wont affect the sound but I have a little OCD and would like them to be perfect and not look like crap since I paid so much money for them. Thank you all so much. Avkik

1. Put your OCD aside and don't worry about the port...

2. You can easily remove one of the woofers and fix that padding with a Philips head screw driver... carefully remove driver, and move the padding out of the way of the port... If you need to use some glue of some kind to stick it back on the wall, then there you go... easy..

3. The Tweeter replacement will be a dealer only scenario..

Caesar!

Very nice indeed! you have made good use of what seems to be limited space.

I guess 20x15x9ft???

I bet if you moved up to a some serious floor standers, you would have a really knockout sound as you have lots of open space in the front. The 590 & 690 v4 centers , got rid of that midrange hollowness that earlier units tended to have with the midrange voicing.

The newest Atoms V5 are the best ever and have space, staging and depth that will astound you.

What cabling are you using to wire your speakers ?:confused:

Wow -- good guess. Room is 20 x 16 x 7' 9" (drop ceiling took it down from 9 feet).

I would eventually like to move up to the 690 center (I don't think the 590 will be enough of an upgrade from my 470 -- might as well go with the 690 at that point). But after buying the ADP 590s before setting up this room, not to mention the projector and the screen, I'm not ready for a new center yet.

I actually don't know the exact cabling brand for the speaker wires, as the electricians (this was a new construction home) ran the in-wall wiring. I told them 14 gauge (upgrade from 16 gauge) -- but that's all I know.

Hi, I'm looking for some feedback. I've got Studio 40s up front and a CC-570 in the center of my 5.1 home theater setup. Speakers are Version 3. I'm thinking going with ADP 470s for the surrounds (used or demos). Another choice would be to use Studio 20s for surrounds. 80 per cent of listening will be for movies and 20 per cent for music. The ADPs will look better on the wall. I'd appreciate any thoughts from other owners who are using either the ADP 470s or Studio 20s as surrounds. Thanks.

Hi, I'm looking for some feedback. I've got Studio 40s up front and a CC-570 in the center of my 5.1 home theater setup. Speakers are Version 3. I'm thinking going with ADP 470s for the surrounds (used or demos). Another choice would be to use Studio 20s for surrounds. 80 per cent of listening will be for movies and 20 per cent for music. The ADPs will look better on the wall. I'd appreciate any thoughts from other owners who are using either the ADP 470s or Studio 20s as surrounds. Thanks.

What were you using for surrounds previously (not that it matters now)?
Studio 20's would not be a good choice. They are monopole speakers and are designed to be listened to head on, whereas Di / Bi polar direct their sound in 2 directions at once.

The ADP series is your choice. With 80% of your listening movies and TV that is where the majority of your 5.1 signal will emanate from. For the 20% of the music you will listen to, I bet 100% will be 2 channel.... see my point?

The 20's in the rear will (almost)never even get to be heard.Nor will they provide the ambiance needed for true surround sound effects.

In an earlier post I made that point, probably to fall on deaf ears.

here is a link explaining why bi polar are better suited for surround sound.
http://www.paradigm.com/en/pdf/dipolar_confusion.pdf

As the 470's are an older model and no longer made, you may want to consider going to the 390 or 590's instead. Sonically the new models are about 2 steps up musically.

Though if money is an issue, you could live with the v3 470's.

[QUOTE=ginovino;12920276]What were you using for surrounds previously (not that it matters now)?
Studio 20's would not be a good choice. They are monopole speakers and are designed to be listened to head on, whereas Di / Bi polar direct their sound in 2 directions at once.

Ginovino, thanks for the reply. Just to be clear, these would be side surrounds (in other words, my rear channels). Would the 390s match up as far as timbre is concerned? The 590s are a little more than I can spend right now.

Yes, they will sonically match ( similar DNA). place the ADP390's on the side walls, and the 20's in the rear walls.

does paradigm list the msrp for their products anywhere on their website? i've looked but cant find them. if not, can someone post the msrp for some of their lower to mid priced center channel speakers. i am finally upgrading the very old denon dra-435r to a surround sound receiver and i need a center to go with my 3se's and titan's, and velodyne dls. there is no paradigm showroom near me, so i need a little help, thanks.

[QUOTE=ginovino;12920276]What were you using for surrounds previously (not that it matters now)?
Studio 20's would not be a good choice. They are monopole speakers and are designed to be listened to head on, whereas Di / Bi polar direct their sound in 2 directions at once.

Ginovino, thanks for the reply. Just to be clear, these would be side surrounds (in other words, my rear channels). Would the 390s match up as far as timbre is concerned? The 590s are a little more than I can spend right now.

that might not be totally true in this day and time the rears are discreet channels with the new codecs and not synthesized as in the earlier years
you might find the 20's in the rear for dolby tru-hd ,dts-master and hi-res
audio have a lot to offer.

I think you know by now I am a Paradigm dealer however, unable to sell out of state.

I assume you will want the speakers in plain Black ash.. The Black ASH CC series Center channel speakers are magnetically shielded for placement in front of your TV. The Atoms do come in white for extra cost.

Here are the list prices
CC690 @ $1349-old $
CC590 @ $979- old $
CC390 @ $629- old $
CC290 @ $429- old $


Titans @ $558-new$
Minis @ $399-new$
Atoms @ $299-new$

Plus add about 10-12% to those OLD$ numbers for price increase.

The dealer cost is 60% of list plus shipping.

I own studio 60s, adp 450s, cc 450.

I am thinking of going on wall or in wall keeping paradigm, cc and surrounds. May I ask what would be best bet within paradigm series?

Just added the CC-390 and ADP-390's to my HT system last night (already had the M11's). They sound incredible!

I was also able to audition to the newly released PS 14" front-ported sub at my Paradigm dealer yesterday afternoon. The PW-2200 sounds awful compared to this new sub :eek: It also looks as good as it sounds! You guys really need to go to your dealer and listen to it! Very tight bass. The Paradigm sub is back onto my list.

BR

I think you know by now I am a Paradigm dealer however, unable to sell out of state.

I assume you will want the speakers in plain Black ash.. The Black ASH CC series Center channel speakers are magnetically shielded for placement in front of your TV. The Atoms do come in white for extra cost.

Here are the list prices
CC690 @ $1349-old $
CC590 @ $979- old $
CC390 @ $629- old $
CC290 @ $429- old $


Titans @ $558-new$
Minis @ $399-new$
Atoms @ $299-new$

Plus add about 10-12% to those OLD$ numbers for price increase.

The dealer cost is 60% of list plus shipping.

I am thinking of upgrading my 8 year old Def Tech speakers to the S8s and C5. I have read some reviews especially on Audiogon that the S series, and particularily the S6s and S8s sound 'edgy'; 'brittle'; 'forward', etc. I've also heard that this 'forwardness' in the upper register has now been tamed with the series II S series due to using a different tweeter. Is this your take on the new S8s/C5? I would love to hear your impression as a Paradigm retailer.
TIA,
Bish

I am thinking of upgrading my 8 year old Def Tech speakers to the S8s and C5. I have read some reviews especially on Audiogon that the S series, and particularily the S6s and S8s sound 'edgy'; 'brittle'; 'forward', etc. I've also heard that this 'forwardness' in the upper register has now been tamed with the series II S series due to using a different tweeter. Is this your take on the new S8s/C5? I would love to hear your impression as a Paradigm retailer.
TIA,
Bish

When you move up the Paradigm line to the Signature series , you are entering rarefied air territory price wise. Frankly, they would NOT be my first, 2nd, 3rd or even 4th choice!

There are so many excellent speakers out there which fail into that price point it should be considered a shoppers paradise! A few that come to mind are the Vanderstine 2ce Sig II or 3A, PSB Synchrony or platinum, Thiel CS-2.4,
or the new Home theater line of Magnepan speakers. Any of these will easily outperform the the S8 in a direct comparison. Especially hot right now is the baby maggie.

I know this is heresy coming from a Paradigm dealer. The Paradigm strengths come from the middle rungs of their ladders, not at the top and certainly not their subwoofers.

I bet I got you by surprise:eek:

When you move up the Paradigm line to the Signature series , you are entering rarefied air territory price wise. Frankly, they would NOT be my first, 2nd, 3rd or even 4th choice!

There are so many excellent speakers out there which fail into that price point it should be considered a shoppers paradise! A few that come to mind are the Vanderstine 2ce Sig II or 3A, PSB Synchrony or platinum, Thiel CS-2.4,
or the new Home theater line of Magnepan speakers. Any of these will easily outperform the the S8 in a direct comparison. Especially hot right now is the baby maggie.

I know this is heresy coming from a Paradigm dealer. The Paradigm strengths come from the middle rungs of their ladders, not at the top and certainly not their subwoofers.

I bet I got you by surprise:eek:

Good advice gino....

Also take a gander at the Aerial Acoustics... they are supposed to be some super fantastic... http://www.aerialacoustics.com/
Also check on Audiogon, to get some better prices on used equipment..

Good advice gino....

Also take a gander at the Aerial Acoustics... they are supposed to be some super fantastic... http://www.aerialacoustics.com/
Also check on Audiogon, to get some better prices on used equipment..

Thanks for the flowers!

Not knowing what this member has in mind and reading he hasn't been active with speakers since his DEF TECh of years back, leads me to assume, he has a rough road to hoe going forward.

I like Aerial products since I heard their 10T about 25 years ago.

The best bargain out there right this moment is the baby Maggies for $500 direct from Magnepan!!!!!:eek: Imagine Fronts and surrounds that will make your socks curl for $1000.00, (I'm tempted myself) just add a center and a AV123, SVS or HSU sub and you have realism that exists no where else at that price point!:eek::D:D:D

Thanks for the flowers!


The best bargain out there right this moment is the baby Maggies for $500 direct from Magnepan!!!!!:eek: Imagine Fronts and surrounds that will make your socks curl for $1000.00, (I'm tempted myself) just add a center and a AV123, SVS or HSU sub and you have realism that exists no where else at that price point!:eek::D:D:D


Haven't hear the Maggies... Always liked the Martin Logan's but didn't think the price point was the greatest... I'll have to get me a demo of the Maggies... which models are the baby maggies... and are they $500 each or set of 4? pardon my ignorance...

Oh and if you could please point me to the "straight from maggie" link... you got my interest here... :)

Haven't hear the Maggies... Always liked the Martin Logan's but didn't think the price point was the greatest... I'll have to get me a demo of the Maggies... which models are the baby maggies... and are they $500 each or set of 4? pardon my ignorance...

Oh and if you could please point me to the "straight from maggie" link... you got my interest here... :)

The Magnepan MMG is $500 a pair!!!!!

You must buy directly from Magnepan. They a have 60 day trial where you can return them minus shipping.

WE don't sell Magnepan, because we were Martin Logan dealers,but thats another story (If their not careful, they will go the way of M&K...).

here is the link:

http://www.magnepan.com/model_MMG

Thanks gino.... cool stuff indeed...

86db and 4ohm it will require a lot of power if someone likes it loud.

FWIW...I listened to a pair of S2's last week and they were some of the sweetest speakers I have ever heard.
I couldn't believe such a small monitor could produce such a full & rich sound.
The width and depth of the soundstage was amazing.

To my ear, their performance across the board was heads and tails better than the Studio 100's (which were the speaker I went to audition in the first place).

Just my 2 cents...

Hello all! So happy I found this forum!

Anyways, I would like your opinions on my roughly 8-9 y/o HT setup.

Integra DTR-5.3 (first version)
Integra CDC-3.1 via Coax S/PDIF
older Toshiba DVD Player via component / optical S/PDIF
Paradigm Monitor 7 v2's (L/R)
Paradigm CC-350 (Center)
Paradigm PS-1000 (Sub)
Niles in-cealing speakers (Surrounds) .... its been awhile... not even sure of the
model...

Now the TV is a REAL Dinosaur. Its an OLD 62" Hitachi Ultravision 4:3 RPTV
I enjoy all the wonders of BD/HDDVD in my family room setup with a 32" Sharp HDTV, but the only TV that will be able to take the HUGE Hitachis place is going to be might pricey so im still sitting on that. Im waiting for a 60"-70" 1080p model to come into my price range.

building my home theater and i need a stand to put my 690 on. the premier at 400 is crazy if you ask me. anyone using one that works well that's not 400? thanks!

building my home theater and i need a stand to put my 690 on. the premier at 400 is crazy if you ask me. anyone using one that works well that's not 400? thanks!
I'm sure you could find something here that would work for you... :)

http://www.racksandstands.com/Center-Channel-l5-c7-A3921%7E10370.html

http://www.standsandmounts.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=279

i guess my question should have read what are you using for your 690 with the weight of this thing i'm afraid to just use any stand. i currently have it 31inches off the ground. would 18 or 22 make much difference? also how about mounting it high above a projector screen say 7-8 feet off of the ground what would yield the best sound? thanks again!

i guess my question should have read what are you using for your 690 with the weight of this thing i'm afraid to just use any stand. i currently have it 31inches off the ground. would 18 or 22 make much difference? also how about mounting it high above a projector screen say 7-8 feet off of the ground what would yield the best sound? thanks again!

low and angled towards your head would probably sound best so what ever
puts you just below the screen. remember a rug on the floor will help kill
those first order reflections a rug on the ceiling well you get the point.

Ginovino:

I know that in the price range of the Paradigm Signature speakers, you have a lot of choices for speakers.

In the price range of the Paradigm Studio Reference, how do you feel about them? In their price range, would you have better choices for speakers other than the Magnepans? (what about the Def Tech Mythos ST's?). Also, sent you a PM.

PTLurking:

I had narrowed down my search for HT speakers to the Paradigm Studio Reference vs the Def Tech Mythos ST's. My pick for Paradigm was the 100's and I haven't auditioned the S2's. I have read a great review on the S1 v2 which has the new tweeter and is a sealed enclosure and alot of people are saying the same comments you are.

Making a choice for a speaker purchase can be very nail biting. If I order the Paradigms, it will take 3 weeks to get my speakers. I told the dealer that's enough time to wonder if I've made a big mistake or not with my decision. You guys are great, love this thread.

Someone else mentioned this previously about where to find prices for Paradigm speakers and I would also like to know where I could find out this information.

Someone else mentioned this previously about where to find prices for Paradigm speakers and I would also like to know where I could find out this information.

Here you go:

http://www.bradfordshifi.com/prices.html

Had My monitor 7's and cc170 with a pdr10 and some ls/fx for sides and small denon speakers for rears, found out the dealer wanted to get rid of the left over version 4's he had.... so I picked up some adp170's for cheap and a pair of atoms this week...

Monitor 7's
cc 170
Pdr10..... the only part lacking at the moment...
adp 170's
atoms

yamaha rxv661
ps3 and hd cable box for sources

PTLurking:

I had narrowed down my search for HT speakers to the Paradigm Studio Reference vs the Def Tech Mythos ST's. My pick for Paradigm was the 100's and I haven't auditioned the S2's. I have read a great review on the S1 v2 which has the new tweeter and is a sealed enclosure and alot of people are saying the same comments you are.

Making a choice for a speaker purchase can be very nail biting.

JimmyDaves,

I would strongly recommend the S2's...IF... you can afford the price tag ($2400+) and your listening will gravitate to 2.0 or 2.1 ch music.
IMHO...you cannot beat a well designed monitor for 2ch music.

However...If the vast majority of your listening will be 5.1 or 7.1 movies, then the Paradigm Studio's may be a better choice $ for $.

Something else to consider...If you have a decent sub, you may choose to save a few bucks and go with Studio 20's.

Find a dealer that will let you audition the entire Studio lineup as well as the
S2. Listen to a well recorder music CD in 2ch (no sub) mode, 2 ch + sub, and then a 5.1 movie sound track. This will help you make a final decision.

Clear as mud...right?
Good luck!

Pete

PS> If speaker cabinetry is important to you (WAF, etc...) the Paradigm Signature line is right up there with the best!

Please check Videogon immediately!!! There is a pair of S4 V2 for sale right now for $2400!!!! From the Dabluguy(me he he). Get on it quickly!

Why do I keep hearing here the Atom's are $300/pair, when all the reviews I read, state $250/pair.

I'm planning on going to my local dealer next week, but if they're $300/pair, that's out of my budget. Because I still need speaker cables, stands, etc. I was planning on $250 + tax for these...






-Nick :)

[QUOTE=UWisconsin97;12939822]Why do I keep hearing here the Atom's are $300/pair, when all the reviews I read, state $250/pair.

I'm planning on going to my local dealer next week, but if they're $300/pair, that's out of my budget. Because I still need speaker cables, stands, etc. I was planning on $250 + tax for these...

You must have just returned from the planet Saturn:eek::eek:

If you have been following this thread over the last few weeks, I and others have been advising the readership almost hourly of the price Increases by Paradigm across their product lines.

The Atoms went from $249 a pair to $298 a pair (up 17.5%), minis $379 to $438 (13.5%) and Titans $499 to $558 (10.5%) and so on up the line. :rolleyes:

So I guess you won't be using traditional speakers in your system then:confused:

Maybe some string and a couple of used "Dixie" brand coffee cups from "Dunkin Donuts":D

Why do I keep hearing here the Atom's are $300/pair, when all the reviews I read, state $250/pair.

I'm planning on going to my local dealer next week, but if they're $300/pair, that's out of my budget. Because I still need speaker cables, stands, etc. I was planning on $250 + tax for these...

-Nick :)
Look up a few posts - I posted a link to a site where the MSRPs are listed for many brands. The Atoms are $149 - each.

In the next week I'm going to start replacing my lower-end klipsch synergy 5.1 in a den sized HT. Paradigm fronts/center is where I'll start, yet it's a hard choice for me between Titans + stands or the Monitor 7's, given the price difference is minimal. I'm unsure if the floorstanders will sound "bad" in a smaller room, or if it's not the best choice since I may move all into a larger room someday.

Edit: I decided to not be lazy and reread the last couple dozen pages of this thread :p

Monitor 7's
CC 290 or 390
Mini's
Keep Klipsch sb12 until I can add a hsu or svs

When you move up the Paradigm line to the Signature series , you are entering rarefied air territory price wise. Frankly, they would NOT be my first, 2nd, 3rd or even 4th choice!

There are so many excellent speakers out there which fail into that price point it should be considered a shoppers paradise! A few that come to mind are the Vanderstine 2ce Sig II or 3A, PSB Synchrony or platinum, Thiel CS-2.4,
or the new Home theater line of Magnepan speakers. Any of these will easily outperform the the S8 in a direct comparison. Especially hot right now is the baby maggie.

I know this is heresy coming from a Paradigm dealer. The Paradigm strengths come from the middle rungs of their ladders, not at the top and certainly not their subwoofers.

I bet I got you by surprise:eek:

i think your shining these people on a little. i have heard most of these and while they all have good qualities, i would not compare a $500 pair of maggies to a $6500 pair of s8's. you know i had to edit this post. qoute : any of these will easily outperform the s8: thats just ridiculous. sorry.

i have heard the psb's ,thiel's,and the s8's but not at the same time in a direct a b
comparison they all have there strong and weak points although not many but easily
outperform is pushing it and i can't say for the maggies i have not heard them but
if they did indeed stay even or pull away from the s8's for 500.00 they should be on
the cover of every hi-fi mag out there.

i think your shining these people on a little. i have heard most of these and while they all have good qualities, i would not compare a $500 pair of maggies to a $6500 pair of s8's.

There is always a twit among the bystanders who finds a way to miss the point of the statement entirely.

what is the point, I am trying to make sir???? Don't just stand there slack jawed:(

Respond!

For those among YOUR followers who need to be spoon fed the answer, spending $6500 for a pair of speakers allows you to visit that upper strat.. where some of the best designs ever made reside. Including ribbon designs among others. While you may have had the good fortune and opportunity to sample Ribbon and electrostatic designs, the vast majority of members HAVE NOT. Thereby, I make an effort to encourage them to try them out even the $500 models!

Maybe, just maybe they will widen their horizons a "scosch" and learn about speakers other than Paradigm (for all intents and purposes a glorified well made middle of the road product in the scheme of things). I liken Paradigm to the wonderful period when well designed Dynaco products ruled the entry level "everymans" electronics.

It brought followers to the well to drink, where many decided they would like to sample "water from another well" or a different beverage altogether.

This and other forums are places to share ideas and possibly learn. To accuse me of "shining these people on", is insulting and implies I have a sub rosa agenda and purpose to my streams of consciousness. You sir, are banal.

There is always a twit among the bystanders who finds a way to miss the point of the statement entirely.

what is the point, I am trying to make sir???? Don't just stand there slack jawed:(

Respond!

For those among YOUR followers who need to be spoon fed the answer, spending $6500 for a pair of speakers allows you to visit that upper strat.. where some of the best designs ever made reside. Including ribbon designs among others. While you may have had the good fortune and opportunity to sample Ribbon and electrostatic designs, the vast majority of members HAVE NOT. Thereby, I make an effort to encourage them to try them out even the $500 models!

Maybe, just maybe they will widen their horizons a "scosch" and learn about speakers other than Paradigm (for all intents and purposes a glorified well made middle of the road product in the scheme of things). I liken Paradigm to the wonderful period when well designed Dynaco products ruled the entry level "everymans" electronics.

It brought followers to the well to drink, where many decided they would like to sample "water from another well" or a different beverage altogether.

This and other forums are places to share ideas and possibly learn. To accuse me of "shining these people on", is insulting and implies I have a sub rosa agenda and purpose to my streams of consciousness. You sir, are banal.

from your post i think everyone can figure out who the twit is. sorry i missed your point. you are obviously way above my level. thanks for the witty conversation. i will value your advice from now on. :confused: thanks

i have heard the psb's ,thiel's,and the s8's but not at the same time in a direct a b
comparison they all have there strong and weak points although not many but easily
outperform is pushing it and i can't say for the maggies i have not heard them but
if they did indeed stay even or pull away from the s8's for 500.00 they should be on
the cover of every hi-fi mag out there.


I own a pair of Studio 60s, Magnepan MMGs and a very old pair of Thiel CS3s.

The MMGs are a great value for the $$$, but they do have limitations. No lower bass, low efficiency, low dynamics, tricky room placement and average to high playback levels needed to make them come "alive". I wouldn't recommend them for HT.

I consider the Maggies and the Thiels to be more "audiophile" speakers, in that they can make certain music sound great, but not always (the Magnepans more so than the Thiels). And they reveal any crap electronics used upstream.

The Paradigm 60s are more of an all around good performer, more forgiving. Great for HT!

I own a pair of Studio 60s, Magnepan MMGs and a very old pair of Thiel CS3s.

The MMGs are a great value for the $$$, but they do have limitations. No lower bass, low efficiency, low dynamics, tricky room placement and average to high playback levels needed to make them come "alive". I wouldn't recommend them for HT.

I consider the Maggies and the Thiels to be more "audiophile" speakers, in that they can make certain music sound great, but not always (the Magnepans more so than the Thiels). And they reveal any crap electronics used upstream.

The Paradigm 60s are more of an all around good performer, more forgiving. Great for HT!

As this response will insult many self appointed keepers of the faith sitting in judgment on this forum, I ABSOLUTELY CONCUR WITH YOUR ASSESSMENT!:):):) OF THOSE SPEAKERS on all points!

YOU SIR, ARE WELL VERSED AND SHOW AN ASTUTENESS RARELY FOUND IN THIS HOT BED OF WELL MEANINGS..(INCLUDING I)!

Note my number of postings are limited here as I have spent my time on mostly 2 channel issues in another forum. Thus my bias has reared its head. I prefer accuracy and sonic intimacy to bombastic and artificial ambiences.

These subtle sonic gems are not be found in the models so frequently discussed and held in high esteem in these surroundings.

Nevertheless, as I stated in a prior posting, they don't know what they don't know. You can't keep them down on the farm forever!

Great post! I will add you to my dance card with your permission!:):):)

did i miss something this is a paradigm owners thread i think people realize there are
other choices, no one here or least as long as i have been reading them has said they
make the best but what they do is make is a speaker that a lot of people like and
can afford. i have heard a few that i thought were slightly better but they also require
stock in an electric company to afford running amps that will power a half inch drill.

i own the s8's c5 with integra 9.8 with an earthquake cinenova amp. i just replaced my anthem avm 30 with the integra for the new audio codecs and hdmi. hated to do it cause i really did like the anthem but the upgrade price was to steep for me. paradigm sigs have a very full and neutral sound to me. good things sound good, bad things sound bad.another speaker i really liked was jm labs 1027 be. they impressed me. but i got a great deal on the sigs and for me it all comes down to what i can afford. ps: sorry about my last post but if you read the other guys posts it seems to be a reoccuring theme with him

i own the s8's c5 with integra 9.8 with an earthquake cinenova amp. i just replaced my anthem avm 30 with the integra for the new audio codecs and hdmi. hated to do it cause i really did like the anthem but the upgrade price was to steep for me. paradigm sigs have a very full and neutral sound to me. good things sound good, bad things sound bad.another speaker i really liked was jm labs 1027 be. they impressed me. but i got a great deal on the sigs and for me it all comes down to what i can afford.

that sounds like a great setup have you noticed any difference with the
integra good bad or the same also what did you use for surrounds.

i only have monitor 7's for surrounds but they seem to do the job.i do notice better picture quality. integra has a better video processing chip. sound quality was a touch different, not better, not worse, just slightly different sonically. it's worth the money i guess. i had a rotel 1066 pre with a rotel 1095 amp before the anthem. nice stuff but the integra and cinenova are in a higher class

As this response will insult many self appointed keepers of the faith sitting in judgment on this forum, I ABSOLUTELY CONCUR WITH YOUR ASSESSMENT!:):):) OF THOSE SPEAKERS on all points!

YOU SIR, ARE WELL VERSED AND SHOW AN ASTUTENESS RARELY FOUND IN THIS HOT BED OF WELL MEANINGS..(INCLUDING I)!

Note my number of postings are limited here as I have spent my time on mostly 2 channel issues in another forum. Thus my bias has reared its head. I prefer accuracy and sonic intimacy to bombastic and artificial ambiences.

These subtle sonic gems are not be found in the models so frequently discussed and held in high esteem in these surroundings.

Nevertheless, as I stated in a prior posting, they don't know what they don't know. You can't keep them down on the farm forever!

Great post! I will add you to my dance card with your permission!:):):)

i rest my case:D

i thought it would be since paradigms and integra are on the neutral side,i have the
integra 10.5 powering the studios and like it, still looking at the sigs for future upgrade.

i had an integra 7.2 before the rotel and loved it's sound. then i got a deal on the old integra seperates, don't remember the numbers. i only had them for 2 days and took them back. hated them, totally different sound, kinda harsh. i had studio 100's v2. great speaker for the money. i dont make a lot of money so it's taken me a few years to work my way up. i also have belkin power conditioner, pioneer elite dvd, panasonic blu- ray, d-link media, hitachi ultravision 55", and infocus projector but it's taken me 10 years.

did i miss something this is a paradigm owners thread i think people realize there are
other choices, no one here or least as long as i have been reading them has said they
make the best but what they do is make is a speaker that a lot of people like and
can afford. i have heard a few that i thought were slightly better but they also require
stock in an electric company to afford running amps that will power a half inch drill.

It seems that the magnet to these growing dialogs are a number of postings of my experiences as a dealer for Paradigm products. Especially the shortcomings of the subwoofer series and the strength of their middle tier series. This had been compounded by the Paradigms price increase 3 weeks ago. Thereby making many affordable models less so.

Its like being a Medical doctor, when folks become aware, natural tendencies
is to ask medical questions and not expecting straight answers!

Guilty as charged, though I will not succumb nor acquiesces!:)

It seems that the magnet to these growing dialogs are a number of postings of my experiences as a dealer for Paradigm products. Especially the shortcomings of the subwoofer series and the strength of their middle tier series. This had been compounded by the Paradigms price increase 3 weeks ago. Thereby making many affordable models less so.

Its like being a Medical doctor, when folks become aware, natural tendencies
is to ask medical questions and not expecting straight answers!

Guilty as charged, though I will not succumb nor acquiesces!:)

are you still a paradigm dealer?

Has anyone who's owned the Studio 100's or 60's as mains used a pair of them also as surround speakers? Would it make any sense to do this? I can see if someone is using the 5 speakers for 5 channel music, but in home theater use would it be just as effective?

After a lot of reading and listening, I've come up with 3 different potential/possible home theater systems. Which one would you choose and why.

1. Studio 100v4's, CC690, ADP590 + sub of your choice.

2. Studio 20v4's for all 5 channels + sub of your choice.

3. Studio 60v.4 or 100.4; CC690; Studio 60v.4 or 100v.4 surrounds + sub


Regarding configuration #2, you could substitute a dedicated center speaker like the cc590 or cc690 if you wish. (Just a note - Home Theater gave one of its highest ratings ever to configuration #2 - Five Studio 20v4's and no sub).

Has anyone who's owned the Studio 100's or 60's as mains used a pair of them also as surround speakers? Would it make any sense to do this? I can see if someone is using the 5 speakers for 5 channel music, but in home theater use would it be just as effective?

yes i did use my studio 100's for surrounds after i bought my s8'8and it did sound great but the v2's were actually bigger than my s8's so ;)it looked kind of absurd in my small room so i just used my monitor 7's and sold the 100's

After a lot of reading and listening, I've come up with 3 different potential/possible home theater systems. Which one would you choose and why.

1. Studio 100v4's, CC690, ADP590 + sub of your choice.

2. Studio 20v4's for all 5 channels + sub of your choice.

3. Studio 60v.4 or 100.4; CC690; Studio 60v.4 or 100v.4 surrounds + sub


Regarding configuration #2, you could substitute a dedicated center speaker like the cc590 or cc690 if you wish. (Just a note - Home Theater gave one of its highest ratings ever to configuration #2 - Five Studio 20v4's and no sub).

Are these your Christmas wish list??:confused::confused:

Or is this a case of mental masturbation;)

Putting aside your room layout and sonic qualities (or lack thereof) I will assume you have 1st rate electronics in place along with something other than Ratshak lamp cord.

Then my choice would Studio 100v4, CC690V4, ADP590v4 and MinisV5 for the 7.1, this system would be a about a 60% music & 40% movie.

I have failed to make mention to the readership, a recent inexpensive system tweak that works!

Audioquest Sub-3 48dbv powered sub woofer cable. This has to be the among the all time best kept secrets. Readily available in lengths up to 15m[and very reasonably priced. I would estimate it improved the sonics(depth, speed, punch/articulation)about 25% on REL and Paradigm units we have on display.
Had I been aware of these cables, i could have added another $250 to every HT sale!!:o

Please help.

Last night I had a few friends over for the 'Final Cut' of Blade Runner and during the opening scene with flying cars and smoke stacks I heard a 'CRACKLING' coming from the front left channel.........Here are the setup details.

Monitor 11 v5 L/R Bi-Wired
CC390 v5 C
ADP190 v5 SL/SR
other SBL/SBR
SVS PB12/Plus2
Onkyo 805......

Needless to say the movie was put on hold while I soiled myself (actually I investigated the noise). So what I found out was that the bottom woofer on the left channel is what is 'Crackling'. I went into the Onkyo setup screen and put the test tone on that channel to verify. It was more subdued with the test tone than during the film or during a 5.1 DVD-A I threw in for testing.

I am using Audyssey in the Room and it had my Fronts set to Full Range. I changed them to 80Hz (THX) and the sound was almost non-existent. We continued the movie and I only barely heard the crackling a time or two. Now the "Guests" didn't think the noise during the opening scene was anything other than soundtrack, so needless to say they didn't find my panic to be called for, but I was playing Madden earlier in the day at a good volume and didn't hear it. As a matter of fact I watched 3:10 to Yuma a week or two prior at a LOUD level with these guys and heard nothing of the "Crackling".

Ultimately here is the situation on the speaker, maybe Ginovino can help with some direction hear. If I find the woofer to be bad can I order another one and replace it myself (I am physically able to do it, I just mean is this an option with Paradigm). I bought the Monitor 11's from a member hear a month or two ago, so there is no dealer warranty I assume. Now the CC390 and the ADP190's did come from a local Stereo Shop and they would probably assist me however they can........

Anyone else have this experience and if so what would you recommend to be my first step?

PLEASE AND THANK YOU!!!!!
Joe

Please help.

Last night I had a few friends over for the 'Final Cut' of Blade Runner and during the opening scene with flying cars and smoke stacks I heard a 'CRACKLING' coming from the front left channel.........Here are the setup details.

Monitor 11 v5 L/R Bi-Wired
CC390 v5 C
ADP190 v5 SL/SR
other SBL/SBR
SVS PB12/Plus2
Onkyo 805......

Needless to say the movie was put on hold while I soiled myself (actually I investigated the noise). So what I found out was that the bottom woofer on the left channel is what is 'Crackling'. I went into the Onkyo setup screen and put the test tone on that channel to verify. It was more subdued with the test tone than during the film or during a 5.1 DVD-A I threw in for testing.

I am using Audyssey in the Room and it had my Fronts set to Full Range. I changed them to 80Hz (THX) and the sound was almost non-existent. We continued the movie and I only barely heard the crackling a time or two. Now the "Guests" didn't think the noise during the opening scene was anything other than soundtrack, so needless to say they didn't find my panic to be called for, but I was playing Madden earlier in the day at a good volume and didn't hear it. As a matter of fact I watched 3:10 to Yuma a week or two prior at a LOUD level with these guys and heard nothing of the "Crackling".

Ultimately here is the situation on the speaker, maybe Ginovino can help with some direction hear. If I find the woofer to be bad can I order another one and replace it myself (I am physically able to do it, I just mean is this an option with Paradigm). I bought the Monitor 11's from a member hear a month or two ago, so there is no dealer warranty I assume. Now the CC390 and the ADP190's did come from a local Stereo Shop and they would probably assist me however they can........

Anyone else have this experience and if so what would you recommend to be my first step?

PLEASE AND THANK YOU!!!!!
Joe
it sounds like the problem i had a year ago with the system off gently push
on the suspected speaker cone trying not to bottom it out and listen for any
noise should be dead quiet if not voice coil is dragging and yes your dealer
can order you replacement parts.

It seems that the magnet to these growing dialogs are a number of postings of my experiences as a dealer for Paradigm products. Especially the shortcomings of the subwoofer series and the strength of their middle tier series. This had been compounded by the Paradigms price increase 3 weeks ago. Thereby making many affordable models less so.

Its like being a Medical doctor, when folks become aware, natural tendencies
is to ask medical questions and not expecting straight answers!

Guilty as charged, though I will not succumb nor acquiesces!:)

I know your feelings about Paradigm subs......however, I'm looking to trade in my PS-1000 for a bit of an upgrade. I'm looking at the new DSP-3200 or the Ultracube 10" subs.
I can get full $$ for the PS-1000 on the trade at my local hi end shop. My room is 11' by 23' and opens at one end to the kitchen. I have the Monitor 9's, CC290, and the ADP-190's for surrounds.
I've given the DSP's and the Ultracube a listen but the acoustics in the shop are lacking. I'm curious how much punch and accuracy that little Ultra has compared to the DSP.
I'm open to any Paradigm owner's comments and even suggestions about comparable sub's outside the Paradigm line in the $600-800 range. It's more convenient to stick with the Paradigm's of course but I'm flexible.
Gracias!

it sounds like the problem i had a year ago with the system off gently push
on the suspected speaker cone trying not to bottom it out and listen for any
noise should be dead quiet if not voice coil is dragging and yes your dealer
can order you replacement parts.

Heading to the "man cave" now to try it out. Thanks and I will post the findings....

Thanks Oztech

OK Looks like you are onto something here.....I gently placed my thumb and fore finger at 12 and 6 respectively (tried the same thing at 3 and 9)on the woofer and listened as I pushed in and let the woofer come back out on its own. I hear a "TICKING", almost like a wire might be touching the woofer as it goes in and out. It is faint but there is definitely a ticking......

So if this is the same issue you had, what exactly should I ask my local dealer for so I don't have to repeat this whole scenario to them?

Thank again!
Joe

[QUOTE=UWisconsin97;12939822]Why do I keep hearing here the Atom's are $300/pair, when all the reviews I read, state $250/pair.

I'm planning on going to my local dealer next week, but if they're $300/pair, that's out of my budget. Because I still need speaker cables, stands, etc. I was planning on $250 + tax for these...

You must have just returned from the planet Saturn:eek::eek:

If you have been following this thread over the last few weeks, I and others have been advising the readership almost hourly of the price Increases by Paradigm across their product lines.

The Atoms went from $249 a pair to $298 a pair (up 17.5%), minis $379 to $438 (13.5%) and Titans $499 to $558 (10.5%) and so on up the line. :rolleyes:

So I guess you won't be using traditional speakers in your system then:confused:

Maybe some string and a couple of used "Dixie" brand coffee cups from "Dunkin Donuts":D

Ouch dude! :eek: Excuse me fore not "being on top of things", like you are. You are my hero for knowing everything! :rolleyes: ..and belittling me, instead of simply informing me. You're a real class act.. :cool:

I'm sorry, I spent a great deal of time and money into high-end headphones, and I sold a lot off to purchase a small, budget minded, 2.0 speaker setup. In case speakers just aren't my "cup of tea".

Now, I'd like to try speakers.. the next time I know something that you don't know, you're damn right I'm going to belittle you as well, instead of informing you. Maybe you'd like to apologize for your tone and attitude, and we can put this behind us, or you can be an "Internet bad ass", that you seem to be, and not be apologetic.






-Nick :)

[QUOTE=ginovino;12940067]

Ouch dude! :eek: Excuse me fore not "being on top of things", like you are. You are my hero for knowing everything! :rolleyes: ..and belittling me, instead of simply informing me. You're a real class act.. :cool:

I'm sorry, I spent a great deal of time and money into high-end headphones, and I sold a lot off to purchase a small, budget minded, 2.0 speaker setup. In case speakers just aren't my "cup of tea".

Now, I'd like to try speakers.. the next time I know something that you don't know, you're damn right I'm going to belittle you as well, instead of informing you. Maybe you'd like to apologize for your tone and attitude, and we can put this behind us, or you can be an "Internet bad ass", that you seem to be, and not be apologetic.

-Nick :)


Far from it... You have no idea how many PM's I answer daily and attempt to assist folks who are really in need of guidance. These folks continue to PM me and I continue to help them as best I can. The PM's come in from some of largest posters on this thread! Among them are some of the most knowledgeable folks I've encountered.

I have been known to put my mouth in motion before putting my brain in gear.
Though gladly, less and less of that happens.

Your quip to me, shows a wee bit of thin skin:rolleyes: So I will acquiesce to your need to be soothed. Consider yourself soothed with my printed retraction of accusing you of spending time on Saturn.:p

So this doesn't get lost.......in the shuffle!

Quote:
Originally Posted by oztech http://images.avsforum.com/avs-images/retro/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12946090#post12946090)
it sounds like the problem i had a year ago with the system off gently push
on the suspected speaker cone trying not to bottom it out and listen for any
noise should be dead quiet if not voice coil is dragging and yes your dealer
can order you replacement parts.

Heading to the "man cave" now to try it out. Thanks and I will post the findings....

Thanks Oztech

OK Looks like you are onto something here.....I gently placed my thumb and fore finger at 12 and 6 respectively (tried the same thing at 3 and 9)on the woofer and listened as I pushed in and let the woofer come back out on its own. I hear a "TICKING", almost like a wire might be touching the woofer as it goes in and out. It is faint but there is definitely a ticking......

So if this is the same issue you had, what exactly should I ask my local dealer for so I don't have to repeat this whole scenario to them?

Thank again!
Joe
__________________
My SACD Library on SA-CD.net (http://www.sa-cd.net/library/4278/1)
Last edited by jkreidler : Today at 12:02 PM.

yes i did use my studio 100's for surrounds after i bought my s8'8and it did sound great but the v2's were actually bigger than my s8's so ;)it looked kind of absurd in my small room so i just used my monitor 7's and sold the 100's

Is bass a bit too pronounced with Studio 100's? I used other floorstanding speakers as surrounds, they boomed more than my liking.

[QUOTE=ginovino;12940067]

Ouch dude! :eek: Excuse me fore not "being on top of things", like you are. You are my hero for knowing everything! :rolleyes: ..and belittling me, instead of simply informing me. You're a real class act.. :cool:

I'm sorry, I spent a great deal of time and money into high-end headphones, and I sold a lot off to purchase a small, budget minded, 2.0 speaker setup. In case speakers just aren't my "cup of tea".

Now, I'd like to try speakers.. the next time I know something that you don't know, you're damn right I'm going to belittle you as well, instead of informing you. Maybe you'd like to apologize for your tone and attitude, and we can put this behind us, or you can be an "Internet bad ass", that you seem to be, and not be apologetic.

since i assume the speaker is out of warranty take the driver out just to
make sure nothing is touching the back side of the cone it could be this
simple and if nothing is touching the cone then proceed to dealer. the sound
i had was a light sandpaper rubbing sound when bass dynamics hit hard
it would sound horrible.funny thing is it was the center bass speaker on
the right channel factory paid for it.




-Nick :)

somehow hit the wrong post it won't let me change it sorry .

[QUOTE=UWisconsin97;12946153]


Far from it... You have no idea how many PM's I answer daily and attempt to assist folks who are really in need of guidance. These folks continue to PM me and I continue to help them as best I can. The PM's come in from some of largest posters on this thread! Among them are some of the most knowledgeable folks I've encountered.

I have been known to put my mouth in motion before putting my brain in gear.
Though gladly, less and less of that happens.

Your quip to me, shows a wee bit of thin skin:rolleyes: So I will acquiesce to your need to be soothed. Consider yourself soothed with my printed retraction of accusing you of spending time on Saturn.:p


I see from you're posts you're really knowledgeable in this section of audio. I do however wish you used different terms/attitude while making you're reply. It was pretty uncalled for, IMO. But, I know each one of us isn't perfect, and doesn't have the best of days, but I feel like you think I'm just some "newbie" around here. I have lots of experience with high-end equipment, just not as much for speakers.

I mentioned I have been away from AVS for some time, while I was into high-end headphones, and like I said, I'd like to get my feet wet with a decent pair of "budget" speakers, because I don't feel like splurging lots of money on something I won't like..


In regards to the "thin skin" comment; I don't have "thin skin", rather I don't tolerate "mean" people around here.. very simple. These things don't bother me, however I wish you would have showed a little more respect towards me, instead of "assuming" I knew nothing.. ;)

Yes, I'm a little behind in the "current" times, but there's lots for me to read up on, and it all hasn't gotten caught up with me yet: I apologize, for not being "current" with the news.





-Nick :)

After a lot of reading and listening, I've come up with 3 different potential/possible home theater systems. Which one would you choose and why.

1. Studio 100v4's, CC690, ADP590 + sub of your choice.

2. Studio 20v4's for all 5 channels + sub of your choice.

3. Studio 60v.4 or 100.4; CC690; Studio 60v.4 or 100v.4 surrounds + sub


Regarding configuration #2, you could substitute a dedicated center speaker like the cc590 or cc690 if you wish. (Just a note - Home Theater gave one of its highest ratings ever to configuration #2 - Five Studio 20v4's and no sub).

Jimmy,
I like 1 and 2, but would need to know room size, treatments, Amp/AVR and Music/Movies % to make final decision.

Another option I would be 3- Studio 20's in the front and ADP590 sides + sub of your choice(more for movies).

I currently have option 1 without the ADP590's, just didn't have the funds at the time so I'm still using my old surrounds.

Please let us know which way you go and your thoughts afterward.

I own studio 60s, adp 450s, cc 450.

I am thinking of going on wall or in wall keeping paradigm, cc and surrounds. May I ask what would be best bet within paradigm series?

May I re request attention to this issue too?

most on walls are a serious compromise in sound can't beat physics for actual
volume relative to speaker size and frequency range in which you want it to
extend to.

Is bass a bit too pronounced with Studio 100's? I used other floorstanding speakers as surrounds, they boomed more than my liking.

no. i did not think so. if it's not to your liking you can always adjust crossover points

[QUOTE=ginovino;12946321]


I see from you're posts you're really knowledgeable in this section of audio. I do however wish you used different terms/attitude while making you're reply. It was pretty uncalled for, IMO. But, I know each one of us isn't perfect, and doesn't have the best of days, but I feel like you think I'm just some "newbie" around here. I have lots of experience with high-end equipment, just not as much for speakers.

I mentioned I have been away from AVS for some time, while I was into high-end headphones, and like I said, I'd like to get my feet wet with a decent pair of "budget" speakers, because I don't feel like splurging lots of money on something I won't like..


In regards to the "thin skin" comment; I don't have "thin skin", rather I don't tolerate "mean" people around here.. very simple. These things don't bother me, however I wish you would have showed a little more respect towards me, instead of "assuming" I knew nothing.. ;)

Yes, I'm a little behind in the "current" times, but there's lots for me to read up on, and it all hasn't gotten caught up with me yet: I apologize, for not being "current" with the news.





-Nick :)

don't apoligize to this guy. he's an idiot.

i always wondered how it was derived that a speaker is too big for a room other than
the obvious if the cabinet is dimensionally to large or due to cabinetry it can not have
the distance from the walls.some of the bookshelves i have heard were in fact very
deep inclosures and needed to be away from the walls the same distance as their
taller cousin.most of the designs now the floorstanders are just taller than their bookshelf
counterpart.

Please check Videogon immediately!!! There is a pair of S4 V2 for sale right now for $2400!!!! From the Dabluguy(me he he). Get on it quickly!

Gino... How do you like the S4's .v2...
I find them to be beautiful looking, and I have been taken with the Paradigm sound, with the Studio's... Love to hear your thoughts...

If I may ask... Also comparing them to other speakers you have sold in your store... I'm thinking about a very nice looking set of speakers, for my small bedroom....

Hi,
Hope those of you who own these can help me out. I was originally running Paradigm Cinema 70 series with Denon AVR-2808ci amp. Very well balanced sound for a small system. I was recently able to upgrade my fronts to Paradigm Titans ver. 3 for free so I went and purchased a CC-190 center. With the old speakers I was able to put the center under the tv pointing up. Obviously with the new center it had to go behind the tv. I have a 50 SXRD and so I mounted the cc-190 just above the tv pointing down around ear level. The tv has bookshelves about 2ft deep on either side with the tv flush to the front of the bookshelves. With this setup the Titans are on the bookshelves about ear height and the cc-190 set back about 12" atop of the tv. I have noticed after playing about quite extensively with Audessey calibration and setup that while it is a step above the Cinema 70 series, the center doesn't seem as spatial as it should be. It could be because of the bookshelves on either side, or perhaps because the cc-190 isn't the best match. Now I'm going to built a bridge over the tv to house the cc-190 flush with the front of the tv, but what I'm wondering is should I have picked up the cc-290? The speakers are closer to the same size as the Titans and was wondering if this would provide more headspace? The voices sound just a little boxy sometimes, though most the time sound fine. I would appreciate comments from those of you who have compared the cc-190 to the cc290.
Budget constraints as they are, I could go for the cc-290, but would like to know if you think it would be worth it. I'm slowly understanding how important a center channel is, but must keep it within reason.

Thanks
Phil

Okay, semi-newbie here... I currently have a dedicated HT, Onkyo 905, 7.1 setup with little Cinema 100's. I use it mostly for HT, a little for music. Sony Black Pearl with a Stewart FHG3 110" screen (if that matters). No additional sound treatment in the room.

I'm looking at the Studio 100v4/CC690/ADP590 (x4, surrounds and backs). I'm planning to pair it with a PB13-Ultra. Little mid-life crisis here, and I figure upgrading my HT is better than the alternatives... :)

Is this a good setup? Is there something better for movies/TV? Is there a sub you think is better paired for this?

Also, the fronts and center will need to be pretty close to the wall (ideally backed up to it). I assume the center will be fine, but will the 100's be okay? I know I won't get the full bass, but the sub should round it out, right? Or will I be distorting the 100's?

It's so hard to tell without lugging my Onkyo around and the PB13 (when I get it).

Also, what's list price on these things? And typical discounts (I assume 10-30% max)?

Thanks in advance for any advice!

(I was looking at B&W, but quickly realized the 803D was the only one I could live with, and it's just too hard to justify that kind of cash for my room, and I think I'd be underpowering them anyway, and the center is just huge).

(I am also still considering the Axiom's, as they seem comparable, but at about 60% of the price of the Paradigm setup... just impossible to hear them anywhere. And the PSB's... And the Asperion's... so if anyone can compare, that would be helpful too!)

i think you will like what you are getting but the 100's will sound better if there is
anyway to get a foot of clearance behind them it will not kill them they just sound
better.

i think you will like what you are getting but the 100's will sound better if there is
anyway to get a foot of clearance behind them it will not kill them they just sound
better.

Okay, I could do a few inches, but the problem is the screen is almost the full wall width, and the left side is also where the main door is, so I'm already kind of blocking the main entrance. I can probably squeeze them closer to the screen edge, which will give me room to move them forward. As long as someone doesn't come running in the room looking over their shoulder!

And this won't distort the sound?

I know it's subjective, but if they're at "100%" at a foot or two away from the wall, what would you say they are at only 6" from the wall? And what mostly will be impacted?

Im looking at getting either the cc590 or the cc690. Obviously i would like to get the 690, but it could only fit on the bottom shelf of my stand (Bello 8501hg). The 590 would fit on the top shelf. Would it kill the sound to place the center on the bottom and not have it closer to ear level?

Heres a link to the stand to give you more of an idea of distance from ground....

http://www.bello.com/index.php?partition=show_product&prod_id=223

sometimes you can get away with things size and shape of room will dictate final
result so you will just have to play with the location for the best results to your ears
but usually close to back wall and side walls can make most speakers a little boomy.
i realize we all had to make what we have work especially if its not a dedicated ht room
which i don't have either.

Im looking at getting either the cc590 or the cc690. Obviously i would like to get the 690, but it could only fit on the bottom shelf of my stand (Bello 8501hg). The 590 would fit on the top shelf. Would it kill the sound to place the center on the bottom and not have it closer to ear level?

Heres a link to the stand to give you more of an idea of distance from ground....

http://www.bello.com/index.php?partition=show_product&prod_id=223

i have mine on an older bello stand thats in the middle shelf about 18 inches
off the floor i use the adjustable feet to angle it towards my head.

Okay, I could do a few inches, but the problem is the screen is almost the full wall width, and the left side is also where the main door is, so I'm already kind of blocking the main entrance. I can probably squeeze them closer to the screen edge, which will give me room to move them forward. As long as someone doesn't come running in the room looking over their shoulder!

And this won't distort the sound?

I know it's subjective, but if they're at "100%" at a foot or two away from the wall, what would you say they are at only 6" from the wall? And what mostly will be impacted?

Have you asked your dealer if you can demo them in your room? (with the option of downsizing to 60s, 40s or 20s?)

Have you asked your dealer if you can demo them in your room? (with the option of downsizing to 60s, 40s or 20s?)

I'll try today... I'm going there at lunch, and I'll ask.

And place to see list pricing for these?

Please help.

Last night I had a few friends over for the 'Final Cut' of Blade Runner and during the opening scene with flying cars and smoke stacks I heard a 'CRACKLING' coming from the front left channel.........Here are the setup details.

Monitor 11 v5 L/R Bi-Wired
CC390 v5 C
ADP190 v5 SL/SR
other SBL/SBR
SVS PB12/Plus2
Onkyo 805......

Needless to say the movie was put on hold while I soiled myself (actually I investigated the noise). So what I found out was that the bottom woofer on the left channel is what is 'Crackling'. I went into the Onkyo setup screen and put the test tone on that channel to verify. It was more subdued with the test tone than during the film or during a 5.1 DVD-A I threw in for testing.

I am using Audyssey in the Room and it had my Fronts set to Full Range. I changed them to 80Hz (THX) and the sound was almost non-existent. We continued the movie and I only barely heard the crackling a time or two. Now the "Guests" didn't think the noise during the opening scene was anything other than soundtrack, so needless to say they didn't find my panic to be called for, but I was playing Madden earlier in the day at a good volume and didn't hear it. As a matter of fact I watched 3:10 to Yuma a week or two prior at a LOUD level with these guys and heard nothing of the "Crackling".

Ultimately here is the situation on the speaker, maybe Ginovino can help with some direction hear. If I find the woofer to be bad can I order another one and replace it myself (I am physically able to do it, I just mean is this an option with Paradigm). I bought the Monitor 11's from a member hear a month or two ago, so there is no dealer warranty I assume. Now the CC390 and the ADP190's did come from a local Stereo Shop and they would probably assist me however they can........

Anyone else have this experience and if so what would you recommend to be my first step?

PLEASE AND THANK YOU!!!!!
Joe

My setup is almost identical (weird) but I am using the Pioneer 94. I also listened to Blade Runner this weekend. I did not hear anything like you did. As a matter of fact it was the cleanest version I've ever heard. I am assuming that you were listening to the Blu-ray version...

BR

Hi,
Hope those of you who own these can help me out. I was originally running Paradigm Cinema 70 series with Denon AVR-2808ci amp. Very well balanced sound for a small system. I was recently able to upgrade my fronts to Paradigm Titans ver. 3 for free so I went and purchased a CC-190 center. With the old speakers I was able to put the center under the tv pointing up. Obviously with the new center it had to go behind the tv. I have a 50 SXRD and so I mounted the cc-190 just above the tv pointing down around ear level. The tv has bookshelves about 2ft deep on either side with the tv flush to the front of the bookshelves. With this setup the Titans are on the bookshelves about ear height and the cc-190 set back about 12" atop of the tv. I have noticed after playing about quite extensively with Audessey calibration and setup that while it is a step above the Cinema 70 series, the center doesn't seem as spatial as it should be. It could be because of the bookshelves on either side, or perhaps because the cc-190 isn't the best match. Now I'm going to built a bridge over the tv to house the cc-190 flush with the front of the tv, but what I'm wondering is should I have picked up the cc-290? The speakers are closer to the same size as the Titans and was wondering if this would provide more headspace? The voices sound just a little boxy sometimes, though most the time sound fine. I would appreciate comments from those of you who have compared the cc-190 to the cc290.
Budget constraints as they are, I could go for the cc-290, but would like to know if you think it would be worth it. I'm slowly understanding how important a center channel is, but must keep it within reason.

Thanks
Phil

IMHO, you should have gone with the 290. The 290 is a better (perfect) match to your Titans. As many tend to do (I have also done the same in the past), we skimp out on the center channel. If you're watching Dancing with Wolves, obviously not an issue... ;).

Also, try as hard as you can to get the centre closer to the picture as much as possible and also at the same line as your mains. Audessey does a great job but it can't do miracles (and you want the least processing possible).

I hope this helps some...

BR

So this doesn't get lost.......in the shuffle!

Quote:
Originally Posted by oztech http://images.avsforum.com/avs-images/retro/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12946090#post12946090)
it sounds like the problem i had a year ago with the system off gently push
on the suspected speaker cone trying not to bottom it out and listen for any
noise should be dead quiet if not voice coil is dragging and yes your dealer
can order you replacement parts.

Heading to the "man cave" now to try it out. Thanks and I will post the findings....

Thanks Oztech

OK Looks like you are onto something here.....I gently placed my thumb and fore finger at 12 and 6 respectively (tried the same thing at 3 and 9)on the woofer and listened as I pushed in and let the woofer come back out on its own. I hear a "TICKING", almost like a wire might be touching the woofer as it goes in and out. It is faint but there is definitely a ticking......

So if this is the same issue you had, what exactly should I ask my local dealer for so I don't have to repeat this whole scenario to them?

Thank again!
Joe

I had this problem a few weeks ago. Exactly as you describe on a set purchased mid December, so quite new. It does seem like a wire on the coil scratching the magnet. I am very sure it was a defective driver, I have been breaking my new set in quite gently, and tthe other 9 bass drivers in my system have exhibited no problems. (2 100v4, cc-690, 2 adp-570)

I contacted my dealer via e-mail with the serial numebr of the 100 in question, describing the "scratching" -- he contacted Paradigm who requested that the driver be removed to identify some numbers on the driver itself. I pulled the driver myself, located 56167 07-107 printed in "dot matrix yellow" on the inside surface of the cone itself.

I don't have the replacement yet, but I understand it has shipped. I hope it comes soon, it has been about three weeks now since I placed the request.

I ultimately left the bass driver out of the cabinet -- this way I can still enjoy the speakers. (Leaving the defective driver in the cabinet disconnected doesn't work, as pressure from the other drivers moves the inactive one and the scratching remains quite evident.)

-P

Have you asked your dealer if you can demo them in your room? (with the option of downsizing to 60s, 40s or 20s?)

Well, the only Paradigm dealer in my area doesn't have the CC690 on display, so I listened to the 40's with a CC590, and a couple surrounds (and some okay Velodyne). Only listened to a little bit, but they sounded pretty good. A little narrow or missing some midrange, I think. Is that to be expected with the 40's and 590?

They only have a 3-day full refund policy, so I can't try until I'm really ready to buy (which won't be for a couple weeks).

He said he could move the 100's, but is it worth listening to the 100's with the 590?

Also, any recommended 5.1 material to really test these out? Mostly for movies/TV.

Thanks!
-Mark

My setup is almost identical (weird) but I am using the Pioneer 94. I also listened to Blade Runner this weekend. I did not hear anything like you did. As a matter of fact it was the cleanest version I've ever heard. I am assuming that you were listening to the Blu-ray version...

BR

Rock,
Yes it was BD. BTW, the did a great job on the Transfer. Looked like it was a recent film! I have backtracked to determine that it was the Bottom Woofer in my M11. I spoke with my local Paradigm dealer today and they are ordering me a new woofer that I will change out....:mad:

Oh well, we'll see how it goes.
Thanks,
Joe

Well, the only Paradigm dealer in my area doesn't have the CC690 on display, so I listened to the 40's with a CC590, and a couple surrounds (and some okay Velodyne). Only listened to a little bit, but they sounded pretty good. A little narrow or missing some midrange, I think. Is that to be expected with the 40's and 590?

They only have a 3-day full refund policy, so I can't try until I'm really ready to buy (which won't be for a couple weeks).

He said he could move the 100's, but is it worth listening to the 100's with the 590?

Also, any recommended 5.1 material to really test these out? Mostly for movies/TV.

Thanks!
-Mark

the 100's v3 and 570v3 have worked for me ,satisfied so far.

the 100's v3 and 570v3 have worked for me ,satisfied so far.

Mostly movies or music?

I think the main difference to the v4's is the tweeter from the Signature line has been brought down to the Studio line?

You don't find the center is missing some midrange balance with the FR/FL?

Also, what's the main difference between the 40's and 60's? and 100's for that matter? Is it all bass, or is there some midrange? While the 690 seems to have some additional mid-range, the 40 and 60 look to have almost the same cones, and the 100 seems to have more for bass.

I'm wondering how much I'll get out of the 100's if I have a PB13-Ultra (especially if I have to put them closer to the wall)? And if I step down, what do the 60's get me over the 40's?

Ok, new question. I would like to add some bi/dipole surrounds to the mix I have. The ADP-190 is the recommended matching unit, but at $599 a pair it is really expensive.

So I was looking at the Athena - AS-R1.2 Bi-Pole Surround Sound Speaker. They are being closed out and can be had for $300 for all 4 that I want.

Would these be so different than my current front channel that it would be a bad idea?

Front L/R - Titan v.3
Center - CC170
Rear L/R - Atom v.3
HSU SFT-2 Sub

I would remove the Atom's and add the 4 Athena's to the mix for 7.1 sound.

What do you guys think?

Mostly movies or music?

I think the main difference to the v4's is the tweeter from the Signature line has been brought down to the Studio line?

You don't find the center is missing some midrange balance with the FR/FL?

50/50 and only the dome was changed not the actual driver and now
the sigs use a beryllium dome.

Thanks I will return CC-190 and pick up CC-290. Yes, I'm building a bridge between the two bookshelves to support the new center.
Phil

IMHO, you should have gone with the 290. The 290 is a better (perfect) match to your Titans. As many tend to do (I have also done the same in the past), we skimp out on the center channel. If you're watching Dancing with Wolves, obviously not an issue... ;).

Also, try as hard as you can to get the centre closer to the picture as much as possible and also at the same line as your mains. Audessey does a great job but it can't do miracles (and you want the least processing possible).

I hope this helps some...

BR

Also, what's the main difference between the 40's and 60's? and 100's for that matter? Is it all bass, or is there some midrange? While the 690 seems to have some additional mid-range, the 40 and 60 look to have almost the same cones, and the 100 seems to have more for bass.

I'm wondering how much I'll get out of the 100's if I have a PB13-Ultra (especially if I have to put them closer to the wall)? And if I step down, what do the 60's get me over the 40's?

It's mostly more bass....but bass is a tricky area to deal with, both within the speaker and the room.

Basically if you're just interested in HT surround stuff, then you can get away with a separate sub handling most of the lows. But, if 2ch music is important to you, then it's better to have a pair of towers that handling as much of the freq range as possible, from top to bottom, in a nice smooth phase free manner.

With a separate sub, you run into time alignment/phase issues, crossover point issues (transitional), etc. The result is more and bigger dips and peaks in your low end to low-mid area.

Bass is the meat of most music, w/o your basically eating a vegan dinner.

but with a separate sub you can place it where it performs best which is not the same
location for your front speakers usually.

They only have a 3-day full refund policy, so I can't try until I'm really ready to buy (which won't be for a couple weeks).

He said he could move the 100's, but is it worth listening to the 100's with the 590?

Also, any recommended 5.1 material to really test these out? Mostly for movies/TV.

Thanks!
-Mark

That stinks, my dealer gives 30 days plus 1 year to upgrade. I would say if you are interested in getting the 100s, then yes, have the guy move them. If you were to call/email Paradigm, they would tell you all the Studio line matches well with each other. IMHO, the differences in the line are for different room sizes and configuations, your dealer should be able to tell you what is best. Make it his problem too, he's the one getting the comission. My fav demo is Masters and Commander, lots of FX, surround, and some music too (all in the first 5 minutes of the movie!)

Also, what's the main difference between the 40's and 60's? and 100's for that matter? Is it all bass, or is there some midrange? While the 690 seems to have some additional mid-range, the 40 and 60 look to have almost the same cones, and the 100 seems to have more for bass.

I'm wondering how much I'll get out of the 100's if I have a PB13-Ultra (especially if I have to put them closer to the wall)? And if I step down, what do the 60's get me over the 40's?

Paradigm's web site is so difficult now, they used to have a comparison chart showing the entire Studio speaker line specs (v3s). All "appeared" to use pretty much the same drivers, but in different configurations. The 60s have more cabinet (which equals to a little more bass response) than the 40s, plus since they are towers, no stands are needed.
I own 60V3s; they have one port in the front, one in the back. I have to keep mine pulled out enough so that the front baffles are pass my RPTV, which makes them 16" from the back wall, I have had them closer to the back wall, but it affected the imaging more than anything else, that was due to the RPTV. Too close to the wall will make most speakers sound "boomy" .

I started out with 20s, found them to be harder to place in my room (again boominess) than the 60s, go figure :confused:

That stinks, my dealer gives 30 days plus 1 year to upgrade. I would say if you are interested in getting the 100s, then yes, have the guy move them. If you were to call/email Paradigm, they would tell you all the Studio line matches well with each other. IMHO, the differences in the line are for different room sizes and configuations, your dealer should be able to tell you what is best. Make it his problem too, he's the one getting the comission. My fav demo is Masters and Commander, lots of FX, surround, and some music too (all in the first 5 minutes of the movie!)



Paradigm's web site is so difficult now, they used to have a comparison chart showing the entire Studio speaker line specs (v3s). All "appeared" to use pretty much the same drivers, but in different configurations. The 60s have more cabinet (which equals to a little more bass response) than the 40s, plus since they are towers, no stands are needed.
I own 60V3s; they have one port in the front, one in the back. I have to keep mine pulled out enough so that the front baffles are pass my RPTV, which makes them 16" from the back wall, I have had them closer to the back wall, but it affected the imaging more than anything else, that was due to the RPTV. Too close to the wall will make most speakers sound "boomy" .

I started out with 20s, found them to be harder to place in my room (again boominess) than the 60s, go figure :confused:
as you said it is hard since the room will play a key role a dealer should
let you try one then the other he still makes a sale and a future sale when
handled right.

but with a separate sub you can place it where it performs best which is not the same
location for your front speakers usually.

That doesn't solve time alignment or crossover issues.

That doesn't solve time alignment or crossover issues.

most modern pre-pro' and recievers handle this quite well with adjustable
crossovers and notch filters and distance from speaker and room conditions.
a full range speaker that can handle the full spectrum will demand a very
high price and even those companies offer their sub not to mention the power
requirement for a full range.

most modern pre-pro' and recievers handle this quite well with adjustable
crossovers and notch filters and distance from speaker and room conditions.
a full range speaker that can handle the full spectrum will demand a very
high price and even those companies offer their sub not to mention the power
requirement for a full range.

Those features, while helpful, are not total fixes. They in no way compare to a properly implemented full range speaker. Adjusting time and phase does not get you perfect time alingment and phase, it gets you the best approximation of it. The room adds it's own comb filtering to the reciept, and you can't take that out. Yes, you get that with a full range speaker too, yet at least the transition from bottom to top is more seamless than a separate sub.

Again, if 2ch hifi music isn't the priority, then a sub is a very economical way to go, especially since it's really necessary in a 5.1 set up anyway.

Those features, while helpful, are not total fixes. They in no way compare to a properly implemented full range speaker. Adjusting time and phase does not get you perfect time alingment and phase, it gets you the best approximation of it. The room adds it's own comb filtering to the reciept, and you can't take that out. Yes, you get that with a full range speaker too, yet at least the transition from bottom to top is more seamless than a separate sub.

Again, if 2ch hifi music isn't the priority, then a sub is a very economical way to go, especially since it's really necessary in a 5.1 set up anyway.

So are you saying if my main use is HT, I'm better off going with something like the 40's to minimize the low-end conflicting with my sub?

If I don't mind spending the money, is there any harm it getting the 100's and a good sub? Or will I really have a big problem with the low-end of the 100's cancelling/phasing with the PB13-Ultra? (I have a Onkyo 905, with the Audessey calibration built-in, if that matters.)

So are you saying if my main use is HT, I'm better off going with something like the 40's to minimize the low-end conflicting with my sub?

If I don't mind spending the money, is there any harm it getting the 100's and a good sub? Or will I really have a big problem with the low-end of the 100's cancelling/phasing with the PB13-Ultra? (I have a Onkyo 905, with the Audessey calibration built-in, if that matters.)

If you're on a budget, main use is HT, then it would be cheaper to go 40's with a sub than 60's with a sub.

But for 2ch music, you'd be better off playing full range through the 60's than the 40's with a sub.

In general, HT 5.1 is and always should be run with a sub...hence the .1 of the 5.1 system. But for 2ch music, you're better off w/o the sub running, and in that case, the 60's would be better than the 40's....or, if you're room is big enough (lots of cubic feet to be filled by the speakers), 100's w/o sub on would be good for 2ch. music.

With movies/HT, you have the option in the receiver to send the .1 channel or sub/low freq's to the sub, mains (L/R), or both, in my case I always have the .1 channel 100% only to the sub. If your sub is small or weak, and those big booming special effects aren't hitting big enough, you can set it so that the mains share some of the sub duties for added oomph. Again, it's not as critical to get the sub singing with the mains in perfect harmony with 5.1 movies as it is with 2ch music, with in my case, I avoid subs.

If you're on a budget, main use is HT, then it would be cheaper to go 40's with a sub than 60's with a sub.

But for 2ch music, you'd be better off playing full range through the 60's than the 40's with a sub.

In general, HT 5.1 is and always should be run with a sub...hence the .1 of the 5.1 system. But for 2ch music, you're better off w/o the sub running, and in that case, the 60's would be better than the 40's....or, if you're room is big enough (lots of cubic feet to be filled by the speakers), 100's w/o sub on would be good for 2ch. music.

With movies/HT, you have the option in the receiver to send the .1 channel or sub/low freq's to the sub, mains (L/R), or both, in my case I always have the .1 channel 100% only to the sub. If your sub is small or weak, and those big booming special effects aren't hitting big enough, you can set it so that the mains share some of the sub duties for added oomph. Again, it's not as critical to get the sub singing with the mains in perfect harmony with 5.1 movies as it is with 2ch music, with in my case, I avoid subs.


Not really on a budget (meaning I could get the 100's and the PB13-Ultra). It looked like the actual floor space required is about the same for the 100's as the 60's and 40's (the depth and width all seemed about the same). The distance from the walls will be different, though.

So - budget not being an issue, but distance from the wall being a potential issue (could be as little at 6" or so), should I just get the 100's, or would it really be better to get the 60's or 40's? Again, 5.1/6.1/7.1 is the bulk of what I'll be playing in here.

Sort of off-topic, but will my 905 be smart enough to direct 2-ch music entirely to the FL/FR (no sub), and 5.1/6.1/7.1 to the sub using whatever crossover I set?

Not really on a budget (meaning I could get the 100's and the PB13-Ultra). It looked like the actual floor space required is about the same for the 100's as the 60's and 40's (the depth and width all seemed about the same). The distance from the walls will be different, though.

So - budget not being an issue, but distance from the wall being a potential issue (could be as little at 6" or so), should I just get the 100's, or would it really be better to get the 60's or 40's? Again, 5.1/6.1/7.1 is the bulk of what I'll be playing in here.

Sort of off-topic, but will my 905 be smart enough to direct 2-ch music entirely to the FL/FR (no sub), and 5.1/6.1/7.1 to the sub using whatever crossover I set?

Floor space is just an issue of whether you have to place the speakers right against the wall (which accentuates bass...usually not in a good way if you already have enough of it), or have space to pull the speakers out for a more 'open' sound (meaning the low end isn't as cloudy or muddy). With small bass light speakers (like 40's vs. 100's), you could in theory place the 40's against the wall with less ill effect than the 100's (in fact, in some rooms it could help to place 40's right up against the walls)....but it's really room dependent, every room is different. The wall effect is even worse if there's a corner involved (corner close to 1 or both speakers).

If you have a lot of cubic feet volume (big room), budget isn't an issue, and 2ch music is to be played, then 100's would be a no brainer for me.

Every receiver has a 'stereo' mode which allows you to send full range signal (music) only to the L/R, no sub involved, this is the mode you would be on when listening to a CD, even if you played the CD on your DVD player. A CD is only 2 ch, there is no separate sub track/channel on a CD. When you put in a DVD movie, you would chose 'movie' mode, or surround mode, Dolby digital, DTS, etc. Some receivers allow you to mix in your sub even in 'stereo' mode, you would have to put your ear up to the sub while in that mode to make sure it isn't working, and if it is, find the sub level or on/off setting in the 'stereo' mode to adjust/turn it off.

Floor space is just an issue of whether you have to place the speakers right against the wall (which accentuates bass...usually not in a good way if you already have enough of it), or have space to pull the speakers out for a more 'open' sound (meaning the low end isn't as cloudy or muddy). With small bass light speakers (like 40's vs. 100's), you could in theory place the 40's against the wall with less ill effect than the 100's....but it's really room dependent, every room is different. The wall effect is even worse if there's a corner involved (corner close to 1 or both speakers).

If you have a lot of cubic feet volume (big room), budget isn't an issue, and 2ch music is to be played, then 100's would be a no brainer for me.

Every receiver has a 'stereo' mode which allows you to send full range signal (music) only to the L/R, no sub involved, this is the mode you would be on when listening to a CD, even if you played the CD on your DVD player. A CD is only 2 ch, there is no separate sub track/channel on a CD. When you put it a DVD movie, you would chose 'movie' mode, or surround mode, Dolby digital, DTS, etc.

Is the only thing I'm giving up with the 40's (compared to the 100's) bass? Or am I giving up mid-range as well? The specs make it look like the 60's and 100's just add more bass cones, but no additional mid-range cones?

For example, in X.1 material, with the crossover set to send bass to my PB13 sub, will the 40's basically be the same as the 100's? Or do the 100's give me something else/more?

If I'm not losing anything with the 40's, is it worth getting the CC690 with the 40's? The 690 seems to have more midrange cones (unless I'm misunderstanding the specs), which for X.1 material is pretty important. But would it just be horribly mismatched?

Is the only thing I'm giving up with the 40's (compared to the 100's) bass? Or am I giving up mid-range as well? The specs make it look like the 60's and 100's just add more bass cones, but no additional mid-range cones?

For example, in X.1 material, with the crossover set to send bass to my PB13 sub, will the 40's basically be the same as the 100's? Or do the 100's give me something else/more?

If I'm not losing anything with the 40's, is it worth getting the CC690 with the 40's? The 690 seems to have more midrange cones (unless I'm misunderstanding the specs), which for X.1 material is pretty important. But would it just be horribly mismatched?

Like I mentioned, it's somewhat room dependent...if you have a really big room, cubic feet wise, then going with the 100's would be the safer bet.

The biggest difference between the 40's and 100's is the bass. Is it the only difference? I can't say for sure as I don't know if the speaker box for the mid-range driver is different (larger or smaller) on the 100's over the 40's, or if the crossovers are the same...but it wouldn't surprise me if they were. It would seem that the mid-range an up would be the same between them, but don't forget that more bass or lack there of, has an aural impact on how you perceive the mid-range to high end. The bassy'er 100's may not sound as 'open' as the 40's due to the extended low end of the 100's, even if they measure the same on the mid-range on up. Also remember that 100's will be able to play lower bass at higher volumes cleaner than the 40's.

The reason you see a lot of bass cones on the 100, with no additional mid range cones is because it takes a lot of surface area to produce deeper and deeper bass. You can go up in size with the woofer...12", 15" etc., but that size gets hard to control (too much mass for fast transients), while you could get a faster speaker with smaller speakers multiple speakers instead (3x 8" vs. 1 big 15"). Clean bass is one of the hardest things to produce, it takes a lot of amps and speakers to do so.

Again, in a HT 5.1 set up, having big mains is not as critical. In 2ch music though, full range mains, sized to your room, is the only way to go IMO.

Is the only thing I'm giving up with the 40's (compared to the 100's) bass? Or am I giving up mid-range as well? The specs make it look like the 60's and 100's just add more bass cones, but no additional mid-range cones?

For example, in X.1 material, with the crossover set to send bass to my PB13 sub, will the 40's basically be the same as the 100's? Or do the 100's give me something else/more?

If I'm not losing anything with the 40's, is it worth getting the CC690 with the 40's? The 690 seems to have more midrange cones (unless I'm misunderstanding the specs), which for X.1 material is pretty important. But would it just be horribly mismatched?

the crossovers are different the 40 bass crossover at 500hz the 100 at 300hz
the 100 is a 3 way speaker the 40 is a 2.5 all the specs on the paradigm
website and according to their manuals on same site the studios all perform
better away from the walls the measurements on same site.note midrange
on the 100 not having to cover as broad of the frequency band might have
something to due with it being a little tighter.

Okay, I need to go to another Paradigm dealer (found another one about 30 more miles away), and hope they have a better setup. I'll test with moving the speakers around to see if it makes a significantly negative difference to me.

I'd prefer to get the 100's, but if it's just going to make things sound worse overall (if I can't put them 2-feet from the wall), then I might have to go with the 40's (which shouldn't have the same problems, given the lack of bass drivers).

Now I'm wondering if I should try out the B&W's again? The 804S's sounded pretty good, and the room I was listening in was a little smaller than my room, and the 804's were in the corners close to the wall (like my room). Maybe they're a better fit? I abandoned B&W because I really liked the 803D's, and they are physically just too large for my room, especially with that monstrous center.

Trying to get to the other Paradigm dealer this afternoon...

Ok, new question. I would like to add some bi/dipole surrounds to the mix I have. The ADP-190 is the recommended matching unit, but at $599 a pair it is really expensive.

So I was looking at the Athena - AS-R1.2 Bi-Pole Surround Sound Speaker. They are being closed out and can be had for $300 for all 4 that I want.

Would these be so different than my current front channel that it would be a bad idea?

Front L/R - Titan v.3
Center - CC170
Rear L/R - Atom v.3
HSU SFT-2 Sub

I would remove the Atom's and add the 4 Athena's to the mix for 7.1 sound.

What do you guys think?

Shock,

My take on this is that if your are strictly listening to movies, it might be okay. That said, you will most likely listen to music sometimes (either HD audio or even 7.1 "stereo"). In the latter case, you will not like what you hear. There will be a difference that will be noticeable. I am sure that a dealer can give you 15-20% off MSRP that will bring you closer to your budget.

Also, I would move the Atom to the SB (surround back) position and add the ADP's as your surround. I think that you will quite happy with that setup.


Hope it helps.

BR

Can the Atom's be wall-mounted, if so, is there a corresponding center which call also be wall-mounted?

A local dealer told me that the Cinema series was made in China, and not directly made by Paradigm, can anyone confirm/deny?

Can the Atom's be wall-mounted, if so, is there a corresponding center which call also be wall-mounted?

A local dealer told me that the Cinema series was made in China, and not directly made by Paradigm, can anyone confirm/deny?

See my signature for a shot of Atoms mounted on the back-wall in my 7.1 setup.

You need the Premier MB-60 mount -- here's a picture someone has posted:


http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/hardware-sale-trade/212549-premier-mb-60-swiveling-wall-mount-brackets.html

Very nice setup!

Thanks for the quick reply. Any idea if any of the Center's can be wall mounted too?

Very nice setup!

Thanks for the quick reply. Any idea if any of the Center's can be wall mounted too?

I'm not sure if the centers can be wall mounted.

Okay, I'm getting irritated.

First, there appears to be only two Paradigm dealers in Maryland/DC/VA. But it's impossible to tell on the lousy Paradigm website.

Of the two, one looks like a front for a drug dealer - it was in a hole-in-the-wall place, with 70's wood paneling, and a few speakers stacked in the hallway. Some scary guy came out, and I asked if he had the 100's with the 690 set up, he simply said "no", so I left.

The second one is a lot better, but they only have the 40's set up with a 590. He said there was no way he would set up a 690 since they are too expensive. I asked him if he could set up the 100's (which he had lined up withe the 60's, disconnected, in another room), and he said just call him a day ahead of time. But no 690.

Since the center channel is kind of the most important thing for HT, I'm stuck.

I actually went back to considering B&W's, went to one of many local B&W dealers (all very nice), and ended up back where I was before - the only B&W's that sound amazing are the 803D's and HTM2D, which means I'm spending like $18K on a 5.1 system, which is almost 3 times a 7.1 setup with Paradigm Studios, and while I could swing it, I simply can't justify the cost to myself. And the HTM2D is freaking huge. The 804S's sound average, no better than the Paradigm's (I think?), and are twice the price.

Anyone have any suggestions? I'd really like to hear the Paradigms with the 690 center, but they won't do it, and they only have a 3-day full return (which isn't enough to let the speakers break-in).

And anyone in MD/DC/VA know a dealer that is any good? Anything close to a Myer-Emco-type store?

If I were you, I'd call Paradigm for more dealer locations. There has to be more than 2 in that area. Paradigm only sells/supports dealer stores, so they should be able to help you out.

Viaav, LLC
20140 Scholar Drive
Suite 313
Hagerstown, MD 21742

http://www.viaav.com/index.htm

MD Phone: 301-714-0110
DC Phone: 202-686-2922

LINCOLN LECTRONICS
1358 LINCOLN WAY EAST
CHAMBERSBURG, PA
17201
717-263-4012

Viaav, LLC
20140 Scholar Drive
Suite 313
Hagerstown, MD 21742

http://www.viaav.com/index.htm

MD Phone: 301-714-0110
DC Phone: 202-686-2922

According to the Paradigm site, they aren't an authorized dealer? The nearest dealer to 21742 is in PA (according to the Paradigm site).

Are you recommending these guys?

According to the Paradigm site, they aren't an authorized dealer? The nearest dealer to 21742 is in PA (according to the Paradigm site).

Are you recommending these guys?

AbMagFab,
If you want to take a road trip to NJ, my local dealer has the 40's 60's 100's CC690, s6's and a few more, all setup in one room.
He has good prices and stands behind what he sells.
The place is in Medford, NJ
Let me know I'll meet you up there as I live 1/2 mile from there. :D

According to the Paradigm site, they aren't an authorized dealer? The nearest dealer to 21742 is in PA (according to the Paradigm site).

Are you recommending these guys?

Again, you should call Paradigm, their website probably isn't updated.

I doubt that anyone that carries Paradigm isn't a dealer, Paradigm sells directly to dealers I believe and there isn't enough mark up for them to sell to other dealers/stores.

And anyone in MD/DC/VA know a dealer that is any good? Anything close to a Myer-Emco-type store?

Hey, I'm not in DC anymore, but used to be a few years back. I'd suggest these guys:

http://www.avsofmd.com

They're in Laurel, so not sure how much of a drive it is for you. I used to be in McLean/Tyson's Corner and they're who I went to when I bought my Paradigm Studio 20's.

Coincidentally, I also bought a pair of B&W's from Myer-Emco as well. I now no longer own them or the studio 20's. Swapping out speakers is an expensive habit of mine. :D

Hey All,
I need a little bit of help/advice with my Paradigm surrounds...
My 5.1 system is a tad bit old, so bear with me..
Fronts - 3SE Minis
Center -CC-300
Rears - Atoms
Sub - SVS PB10

My sitting area is against the back wall.
The Atoms are mounted on the back wall, 7ft off the ground and pointing down and to the center of the room. Due to positional constraints, they can not point any more inward or downward.
Placing them on the side walls is difficult as there is an alcove on one side that would make them not equidistant from the listening area.

My questions are thus:
Would I be better served with Bipoles above the sitting area? if so, which ones might complement my other speakers?
Should I move my Atoms to the side walls and just increase the output for the one that is a tad further away??

In advance, thanks for the help...
bama

Hey, I'm not in DC anymore, but used to be a few years back. I'd suggest these guys:

http://www.avsofmd.com

They're in Laurel, so not sure how much of a drive it is for you. I used to be in McLean/Tyson's Corner and they're who I went to when I bought my Paradigm Studio 20's.

Coincidentally, I also bought a pair of B&W's from Myer-Emco as well. I now no longer own them or the studio 20's. Swapping out speakers is an expensive habit of mine. :D


They are the guys who:
1) Have a 3-day return policy (nothing longer for in-house testing)
2) Don't have, and won't put a 690 on display
3) Don't have any real listening room

Their prices seem okay (he said a 15% discount on a 7-speaker buy), but if I can't hear it, I can't buy it.

They are the guys who:
1) Have a 3-day return policy (nothing longer for in-house testing)
2) Don't have, and won't put a 690 on display
3) Don't have any real listening room

Their prices seem okay (he said a 15% discount on a 7-speaker buy), but if I can't hear it, I can't buy it.



Well, there are two dealers in the Southeast Va. area, Domes (who I use) and the Sound Shop. Should be at least one in the Richmond and Charlottesville areas. Do a road trip to listen, then order from the dealer of your chose.

Another way to find all the dealers near you, is to come up with all the zip codes that are in the radius area that you will be willing to travel, plug them into the locator.

Okay, now I'm considering the Signature line. I haven't heard them yet, but I'm thinking they might be closer to the B&W 803D (better high-range sound)?

Any thoughts on the main sound differences between the Signature and Studio lines?

Since I think it might make more sense (since I'm almost all HT, minimal music) to go with the smaller cabinets (smaller cabinet seems to = better midrange), the Signature line becomes more cost effective. How's this setup:

S4's + C3 (or C5) + 4x ADP1's + SVS PB13-Ultra?

-Versus-

100's (or 40's) + CC690 + 4x ADP590 + SVS PB13-Ultra?

Is the C5 worth it? I'm guessing I'll have the same problem with dealers having a C5 out as I did with them having a CC690 out.

What are the general thoughts here on the Signature line, and the setup I listed above? It's basically close to double the same setup with the Studio line (10K v. 5K), so is it close to double the quality/sound? (I know this is subjective, I'm just asking for opinions before I spend time seeking out dealers in other states.)

If you make your way through this thread, the general concensus, that the Sig's are a small step above the Studio's in performance, not double the performance.

I personally would love a set of Sig's but I don't want to spend double the money for looks alone, and just a small step up in performance... I found that to better the Studio 100's the 803D's were the step I would have to move to over the 100's in comparing them... The 803's are great speakers, and sound smooth and fantastic, but I didn't have the chance to compare them to the Paradigm Sigs. my dealer doesn't stock them... So I saved the money and bought the 100's.

These are the things I have read here... thats all...

If I had the money, I would buy the Full Sig setup, as they are one of the most beautiful speakers I have ever seen, but one needs to listen first and compare, then make a descision... Have you had a chance to compare the Studio's to the Sigs..

I would love to hear your thoughts on this..

Okay, now I'm considering the Signature line. I haven't heard them yet, but I'm thinking they might be closer to the B&W 803D (better high-range sound)?

Any thoughts on the main sound differences between the Signature and Studio lines?

Since I think it might make more sense (since I'm almost all HT, minimal music) to go with the smaller cabinets (smaller cabinet seems to = better midrange), the Signature line becomes more cost effective. How's this setup:

S4's + C3 (or C5) + 4x ADP1's + SVS PB13-Ultra?

-Versus-

100's (or 40's) + CC690 + 4x ADP590 + SVS PB13-Ultra?

Is the C5 worth it? I'm guessing I'll have the same problem with dealers having a C5 out as I did with them having a CC690 out.

What are the general thoughts here on the Signature line, and the setup I listed above? It's basically close to double the same setup with the Studio line (10K v. 5K), so is it close to double the quality/sound? (I know this is subjective, I'm just asking for opinions before I spend time seeking out dealers in other states.)
I was going for Studio 100's, but my "evil" dealer enticed me with Signature. They do have similar sound, Signature "show off" a bit in every perspect; you get more details, and strange enough, details are more "tangle", "engage" with each other. Frankly, if it was not side-by-side, I probably wouldn't know what I missed. Many think the improvement is not worth of the difference in price - I agree when Signature 8 = 2 x Studio 100; but I like the sound, I compromised and took Signature 4.

Okay, now I'm considering the Signature line. I haven't heard them yet, but I'm thinking they might be closer to the B&W 803D (better high-range sound)?

Any thoughts on the main sound differences between the Signature and Studio lines?

Since I think it might make more sense (since I'm almost all HT, minimal music) to go with the smaller cabinets (smaller cabinet seems to = better midrange), the Signature line becomes more cost effective. How's this setup:

S4's + C3 (or C5) + 4x ADP1's + SVS PB13-Ultra?

-Versus-

100's (or 40's) + CC690 + 4x ADP590 + SVS PB13-Ultra?

Is the C5 worth it? I'm guessing I'll have the same problem with dealers having a C5 out as I did with them having a CC690 out.

What are the general thoughts here on the Signature line, and the setup I listed above? It's basically close to double the same setup with the Studio line (10K v. 5K), so is it close to double the quality/sound? (I know this is subjective, I'm just asking for opinions before I spend time seeking out dealers in other states.)


For the money I'd go with the 100's + CC-690 (just bought my 690 center and it should be here soon!!) and if you aren't going to be listening to DVD-Audio, SA-CD, and Blu-ray concert discs then go with the ADP590 for the sides and the Studio 20's or 40's for the rear and shelf mount them or get a wall bracket. DO NOT go with dipolar speakers for the rear, DO NOT!. As Hudson says in Aliens: "Game over, man. Game over!" If you want multi-channel music in your life then go with 20's or 40's all around for the surrounds.

Dan

I was going for Studio 100's, but my "evil" dealer enticed me with Signature. They do have similar sound, Signature "show off" a bit in every perspect; you get more details, and strange enough, details are more "tangle", "engage" with each other. Frankly, if it was not side-by-side, I probably wouldn't know what I missed. Many think the improvement is not worth of the difference in price - I agree when Signature 8 = 2 x Studio 100; but I like the sound, I compromised and took Signature 4.

So you felt the Sig4's (+center) were better than the 100's (+center)?

For the money I'd go with the 100's + CC-690 (just bought my 690 center and it should be here soon!!) and if you aren't going to be listening to DVD-Audio, SA-CD, and Blu-ray concert discs then go with the ADP590 for the sides and the Studio 20's or 40's for the rear and shelf mount them or get a wall bracket. DO NOT go with dipolar speakers for the rear, DO NOT!. As Hudson says in Aliens: "Game over, man. Game over!" If you want multi-channel music in your life then go with 20's or 40's all around for the surrounds.

Dan


My surrounds have to be wall mounted, so they need to be the ADP's. My rears could be 40's, but if I'm going with the Sig4's, I'm not putting Sig4's for rears!

Why are you so opposed to the ADP's for surrounds/rears, for HT use?

Dipolars and bipolars completely ruin the back surround effect. You are supposed to know that these sounds are eminating from the back of you, not in some nebulous area out in god knows where.

Dipolar speakers were designed primarly for the old days of Dolby Surround decoding with a mono matrix surround to create the illusion of depth where there was none with this ancient surround technology. Now we have 5.1 and 7.1 discrete surround tracks.

If for space reasons you need ADP1's or ADP3's on the sides then do that, but you shouldn't use them for the back speakers. Go for S2's if need be.

Wondering if anyone else's Paradigm Studio's have this around the outside of the midrange woofer... See attached... It almost looks like the woofer got wet but I know it didn't. The speakers still sound good but I don't think this is right. Anyone have any clue what could cause this? Thanks -Mark

Dipolars and bipolars completely ruin the back surround effect. You are supposed to know that these sounds are eminating from the back of you, not in some nebulous area out in god knows where.

Dipolar speakers were designed primarly for the old days of Dolby Surround decoding with a mono matrix surround to create the illusion of depth where there was none with this ancient surround technology. Now we have 5.1 and 7.1 discrete surround tracks.

If for space reasons you need ADP1's or ADP3's on the sides then do that, but you shouldn't use them for the back speakers. Go for S2's if need be.

The ADP's though have a pretty big front-firing driver. You still think the S2's would be a better choice? How about the S1's, or are they just too small?

Depends on the size of the room and how much frequency range you want your surrounds to have. There can still be quite a bit of mid bass (and depending on the mix) lower bass frequencies recorded in the surround channels that are directional in nature. This can be especially true of multi-channel music.

The Haunting in DTS-ES 6.1 surround has an ungodly amount of panned low bass effects in all the channels.

Depends on the size of the room and how much frequency range you want your surrounds to have. There can still be quite a bit of mid bass (and depending on the mix) lower bass frequencies recorded in the surround channels that are directional in nature. This can be especially true of multi-channel music.

The Haunting in DTS-ES 6.1 surround has an ungodly amount of panned low bass effects in all the channels.

Okay, I can do S2's for the rears, but definitely not the surrounds. Do you think it's worth it just for the rears, if I have to use ADP's for the surrounds?

Yes, but I'd definitely do the matching Signature surrounds rather than mixing in speakers from the Studio line. You want timbre (voice) matching all the way 'round.

Dan

As I mentioned briefly a few posts back I just placed an order for the Studio CC-690 center speaker.

Now I'm looking for advice on a couple good 12" tall center speaker stands that won't break the bank, but are of decent quality. This sucker is so big you need two for stability it seems.

Thank you!!

mark.hannis, It definately looks like your woofer got wet at some point. It also looks like your phase plug is dented. It's hard to tell but do you have the version 3 or 4 studios? Because I would think the version 4 would be hard to stain because it's aluminum. The version 3 might stain a little easier cause the woofer is mica loaded polymer. HMM weird.:confused:

Yes, but I'd definitely do the matching Signature surrounds rather than mixing in speakers from the Studio line. You want timbre (voice) matching all the way 'round.

Dan

Yup, the ADP1 and ADP3 are signature ADP's. So I'd be getting:

S4's for fronts (maybe S6's if they sound a lot better)
C3 or C5 for the center (again, if the C5 sounds a lot better)
ADP1's for the surrounds
S2's for the rears

I of course need to go and listen to all this, but does that seem like a reasonable set up? Any additional recommendations (like the avoid ADP's where possible)? How about the S4's v S6's and the C3 v C5?

Version 3... The phase plug is the shiney thing in the front? If so thats not dented its just a bad picture... Whats weird is that all of the mid ranges look like this on the floor standing 60's and the center channel. I'm kind of freaking out right now because the speakers are less then a year old and baby the heck out of them.

Added additional photos.

UPDATE: Just lightly brushed the woofer with a tissue... Appears the the discolor was a light layer of DUST. How weird is that??? (I knew my apt had air problems... didn't think it was that bad I'm not a smoker or anything)

UPDATE: Just lightly brushed the woofer with a tissue... Appears the the discolor was a light layer of DUST. How weird is that??? (I knew my apt had air problems... didn't think it was that bad I'm not a smoker or anything)

Maybe something to do with the design of the phase plug as there is an air gap there while regular speakers have a dust cover (which is to keep dust from going into the speaker, not really going out?).

Hi,

I need some help qith some questions please. I am currently using a 5.1 system and looking to upgrade to 7.1 channel.
I have cc-690 center , studio20 L/R front , ADP-590 for the surrounds.
The ADP's are about 6ft high [this is the bottom of the speaker]. Now I was looking at moving the studio20's to the rear for the 6/7th channel and adding either the studio40 or 60 for the L/R front.

My real question is, If the ADP's are high up should the studio20 be at the same height, or could I get away with them being on the j-29 stands being at ear level? would this kill the surround/rear effect as the studio20 would be right at me? the studios would be about 5-6ft behind me.

Next question is, is the studio40 and 60 esentially the same? I see it has the same woofer/tweeter and mid so would it be more of what I like [Free standing or the use of a stand, or is it a big difference from the 2?

trev

As I mentioned briefly a few posts back I just placed an order for the Studio CC-690 center speaker.

Now I'm looking for advice on a couple good 12" tall center speaker stands that won't break the bank, but are of decent quality. This sucker is so big you need two for stability it seems.

Thank you!!

Hey Dan, try these
http://www.standsandmounts.com/
http://www.racksandstands.com/

Otherwise, just search google for 12" speaker stands.

Version 3... The phase plug is the shiney thing in the front? If so thats not dented its just a bad picture... Whats weird is that all of the mid ranges look like this on the floor standing 60's and the center channel. I'm kind of freaking out right now because the speakers are less then a year old and baby the heck out of them.

Added additional photos.

UPDATE: Just lightly brushed the woofer with a tissue... Appears the the discolor was a light layer of DUST. How weird is that??? (I knew my apt had air problems... didn't think it was that bad I'm not a smoker or anything)


You are so stoked. I was bummed out for you. Call the cleaning lady but tell her to stay away from the Digms.

Yup, the ADP1 and ADP3 are signature ADP's. So I'd be getting:

S4's for fronts (maybe S6's if they sound a lot better)
C3 or C5 for the center (again, if the C5 sounds a lot better)
ADP1's for the surrounds
S2's for the rears

I of course need to go and listen to all this, but does that seem like a reasonable set up? Any additional recommendations (like the avoid ADP's where possible)? How about the S4's v S6's and the C3 v C5?

I'd go S6's, C5, ADP1, S2's. For the money that would be one hell of a good system!

Hey Dan, try these
http://www.standsandmounts.com/
http://www.racksandstands.com/

Otherwise, just search google for 12" speaker stands.

Thanks for the sites! Actually, I should have been more specific and asked for owners of the CC-690 or C5 who use a stand or stands to mention what they are using and why they like the product or not.

Thanks!

I'd go S6's, C5, ADP1, S2's. For the money that would be one hell of a good system!

That is the system that I wanted for my bedroom... in cherry... freakin awesome... Beautiful speakers, I hope you enjoy the Sigs... I am truly jealous, as right now I can't afford to buy them. But soon...

Thanks for the sites! Actually, I should have been more specific and asked for owners of the CC-690 or C5 who use a stand or stands to mention what they are using and why they like the product or not.

Thanks!

Your welcome dan... You should easily be able to find a stand for the 690 there as well.. tons of products for way less then Paradigms stands.
Just take your time searching, you will find what you need, tons of options out there buddy..

Personally I like this one... Lovan makes some beautiful as well as sturdy stands...
http://www.racksandstands.com/Lovan-L-ML2CB-1887-LV1096.html

Hello, I am looking for some advice about upgrading my cc-260 center channel I have now. I am looking at the cc-390, it looks awful big! I have for fronts monitor 5's version 3 and focus's version 3 also for the surrounds. My sub is a diy shiva 12" in a 85liter sealed enclosure. I plan on buying a projector real soon. The projector leads me to asking about the new center. I like the one I have, but I want to have a better one for the bigger screen size. Do you think the cc-390 n would timbre match with the older monitor 5's? Any suggestins would be great. Thanks guys

Hey All,
I need a little bit of help/advice with my Paradigm surrounds...
My 5.1 system is a tad bit old, so bear with me..
Fronts - 3SE Minis
Center -CC-300
Rears - Atoms
Sub - SVS PB10

My sitting area is against the back wall.
The Atoms are mounted on the back wall, 7ft off the ground and pointing down and to the center of the room. Due to positional constraints, they can not point any more inward or downward.
Placing them on the side walls is difficult as there is an alcove on one side that would make them not equidistant from the listening area.

My questions are thus:
Would I be better served with Bipoles above the sitting area? if so, which ones might complement my other speakers?
Should I move my Atoms to the side walls and just increase the output for the one that is a tad further away??

In advance, thanks for the help...
bama

They might be old but I'm sure they sound great!

I would probably go with another solution alltogether. Have you thought of using in-walls? Paradigm have a really great series of in-walls called the AMS line. I would suggest that you place those about 2 feet above your seating area in the back wall but seperated from one-another as much as possible (to about 2 feet away from the edge of your couch.

The reason I recommend these is two-fold: one is that you get them a little more behind you so that you will hear them better and two, these speakers have a more omni-directional sound so, again, you will hear them better.
I have 5 sets of these in my house. They sound great and they have lots of power. I will also be using these as my surround backs once I install the ceiling in my HT Room.

I hope it helps.

BR

Would no one here have an answer or some help with this?
Please

Hi,

I need some help qith some questions please. I am currently using a 5.1 system and looking to upgrade to 7.1 channel.
I have cc-690 center , studio20 L/R front , ADP-590 for the surrounds.
The ADP's are about 6ft high [this is the bottom of the speaker]. Now I was looking at moving the studio20's to the rear for the 6/7th channel and adding either the studio40 or 60 for the L/R front.

My real question is, If the ADP's are high up should the studio20 be at the same height, or could I get away with them being on the j-29 stands being at ear level? would this kill the surround/rear effect as the studio20 would be right at me? the studios would be about 5-6ft behind me.

Next question is, is the studio40 and 60 esentially the same? I see it has the same woofer/tweeter and mid so would it be more of what I like [Free standing or the use of a stand, or is it a big difference from the 2?

trev

Hi,
I currently have cc-290 for center, Titan v3 for fronts and small cinema 70 series for surrounds. I want to change the 70's so I thought I would purchase some new Titans and move the v3 to the back. But now that I read the spec's I'm thinking that I might be better off with the Mini's as they have the same size speaker as the cc-290's. I was wondering what your opinions would be.

Thanks
Phil

Hey Trev..... try the 20's out at ear level and see how they do... you will obviously be level setting them with the rest of the system and get the performance you need...
Its all about experimentation. If you don't like it, you can move to get them up higher, I think they will be ok, although I prefer slightly elevated.

As far as the 40's vs 60's, You should listen if you have the oppertunity.
You will get a bit more bass out of the 60's, and they will be less likely to be as punchy in the mid range... I don't have enough in house experience with either, gots me 100's right from the get go... Huge room...

thx for the info Warpdrv. I have the PS1200 so I';m not to worried about less punchy , But I do get what you are saying. I'm worried about my daighter 14months old messing with them [dirty/ripping the front off] and what not. I could be wrong but...
I know also being on stands is bad as they could tip. Do you know how sturdy the 60's.. or I should say your 100's are?
I will get out to the store this weekend and have a listen. but peoples opinions are always welcomed.

The 40's are bolted to the stands as far as I know... and sturdy as well...

The 100's/60's are plenty sturdy, your baby would be hard pressed to knock over any of these products. as far as her dirty fingers I can't help that, nor can I stand it... ewww

My 16 yr old is disghusting... Blecgh... I'm constantly --- Wash your freakin hands will ya !!!!!

Hello, I am looking for some advice about upgrading my cc-260 center channel I have now. I am looking at the cc-390, it looks awful big! I have for fronts monitor 5's version 3 and focus's version 3 also for the surrounds. My sub is a diy shiva 12" in a 85liter sealed enclosure. I plan on buying a projector real soon. The projector leads me to asking about the new center. I like the one I have, but I want to have a better one for the bigger screen size. Do you think the cc-390 n would timbre match with the older monitor 5's? Any suggestins would be great. Thanks guys
I asked Paradigm customer service if a cc-190 v.5 was timbre matched to Monitor 5 v.3s, they told me yes. I upgraded to a cc-190 from a cc-170 to go along w/ my monitor 5 v.3 mains. I'm no expert, but the cc-190 sounds better matched than the cc-170 was. I'm guessing the cc-390 would be a good match also.

Hello;
I'm a newbie to the Paradigm owners family, I just bought these Paradigm speakers from my local dealer here in Brighton, Michigan:
- (2) Frt Monitor Series 9
- (1) Center CC-390
- (4) Rear/back surrounds ADP-390

I budgeted around $2k (or so) for my speakers (w/o sub-woofer), these fit my price point, I went to a few dealers and listened to different brands and really liked the Paradigm Monitor series price/value/performance.

I went with the Series 9 instead of the series 11 Fronts, reason being is my room is not super large, 14.5 wide x 18.5 deep by 8.75 tall, 2,300 cubic feet of volume. If I was around 3000 cubic feet volume would have opted for the Series 11's to fill that bigger space, hopefully the Series 9's will fill my HT room fine.

They will go into my in process basement HT, driven by the newly bought A/V Denon AVR-4308CI.
Here they are, 2 weeks ago, waiting for me to finish the basement HT.
I could not wait any longer, so just last week I opened them up and temporairly replaced my Atlantic Technology 350's family room speakers with them
(see this link for those AT 350's (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=13006905&postcount=95) )

That family room is open/big, and the Series 9's filled it very well, so I feel confident they will do good in the basement HT.

I know, kinda weird showing speakers in a box, but I can't tell you how excited I was to pick these up that snowy/cold Friday evening here in Brighton Michigan.
http://lh3.google.com/mtbdudex/R4GHZFVhq7I/AAAAAAAAA14/w0c9ggHzuDM/s800/IMG_5886.JPG

http://lh4.google.com/mtbdudex/R4GHdVVhq8I/AAAAAAAAA2A/J90PiPN3kdM/s800/IMG_5887.JPG

Once the HT is set-up I'll let you know how great they sound.

Would no one here have an answer or some help with this?
Please

Your rears and rear surrounds should be roughly the same height but the Paradigms are such a great off axis speaker that the difference of a foot shouldn't matter, the only way to tell is to set it up both ways (or have someone do it for you) and take the "Pepsi Challenge" by A+B'ing the two configurations. My guess is that you would notice it more on multi-channel music (SACD, DVD-Audio) than on movies because movies will have more quick ambient effects that come and go...does this make sense?

On the Studio 40s vs. 60s...you need to listen to these in your home theater room. If you're prepared to spend ~1500+ on a pair of speakers you should do it from an A/V store that is OK with you taking both sets home knowing you will be bringing one pair back. The obvious differences are that the floor standers will be more "full range" sounding than the 40's...my guess is that the 40's will sound a little "quicker" as they have less internal air to move. I opted for the 20's as they are the quickest and have excellent bass extension for a bookshelf.

So, in short, let your ears be the judge and not your mind...

Hello;
I'm a newbie to the Paradigm owners family, I just bought these Paradigm speakers from my local dealer here in Brighton, Michigan:
- (2) Frt Monitor Series 9
- (1) Center CC-390
- (4) Rear/back surrounds ADP-390

I budgeted around $2k (or so) for my speakers (w/o sub-woofer), these fit my price point, I went to a few dealers and listened to different brands and really liked the Paradigm Monitor series price/value/performance.

I went with the Series 9 instead of the series 11 Fronts, reason being is my room is not super large, 14.5 wide x 18.5 deep by 8.75 tall, 2,300 cubic feet of volume. If I was around 3000 cubic feet volume would have opted for the Series 11's to fill that bigger space, hopefully the Series 9's will fill my HT room fine.

They will go into my in process basement HT, driven by the newly bought A/V Denon AVR-4308CI.
Here they are, 2 weeks ago, waiting for me to finish the basement HT.
I could not wait any longer, so just last week I opened them up and temporairly replaced my Atlantic Technology 350's family room speakers with them
(see this link for those AT 350's (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=13006905&postcount=95) )

That family room is open/big, and the Series 9's filled it very well, so I feel confident they will do good in the basement HT.

I know, kinda weird showing speakers in a box, but I can't tell you how excited I was to pick these up that snowy/cold Friday evening here in Brighton Michigan.
http://lh3.google.com/mtbdudex/R4GHZFVhq7I/AAAAAAAAA14/w0c9ggHzuDM/s800/IMG_5886.JPG

http://lh4.google.com/mtbdudex/R4GHdVVhq8I/AAAAAAAAA2A/J90PiPN3kdM/s800/IMG_5887.JPG

Once the HT is set-up I'll let you know how great they sound.

Looking forward to your mini review/feedback. Nice pictures.

Just out of curiosity, did you ever consider the CC290 for your center channel and what was your CC390 purchase decision based on.

Thanks

I'd go S6's, C5, ADP1, S2's. For the money that would be one hell of a good system!

i got the S6 / C5 / ADP3's and Sig Servo. Now i'm trying to find a pre/pro to go with my Anthem A5, any ideas ??

i got the S6 / C5 / ADP3's and Sig Servo. Now i'm trying to find a pre/pro to go with my Anthem A5, any ideas ??

Onkyo Pro 885, or sister unit Integra 9.8

Looking forward to your mini review/feedback. Nice pictures.

Just out of curiosity, did you ever consider the CC290 for your center channel and what was your CC390 purchase decision based on.

Thanks

My 2.35:1 CIH tbd screen is quite wide (diag 120" or 128" or ?? is tbd) , so honestly I picked the CC390 because I am mounting it directly below the screen and wanted a wide soundstage, CC390 being wider than the CC290.
It's just gonna look cool there!!
Basic iamge:
http://lh6.google.com/mtbdudex/R5V1y1VhrVI/AAAAAAAAA98/YwfPPpe_Hvg/s800/HT%202.35%201%20CinemaWideScreen%20layout.jpg

i got the S6 / C5 / ADP3's and Sig Servo. Now i'm trying to find a pre/pro to go with my Anthem A5, any ideas ??

So how do you like it? I have an Onkyo 905. Will be gettiing the S6/C5/ADP1's in a few weeks.

Curious - why the ADP3's? They don't seem to be all that much better, but are like double the price of the ADP1's?

I just picked up a brand new set of "Mini's" for $400, out the door, brand new. The store owner and I had a few things in common, and cut the price for me.


I am now enjoying my speakers to the fullest. These are SOME awesome bookshelf's. :D






-Nick :)

Where to buy paradigm speakers online? Thanks.

Where to buy paradigm speakers online? Thanks.


You can't buy them new, online. You can however buy used, but you cannot hear them first. If you go to your local Paradigm dealer, you can hear them first hand.

hey guys...

I am currently trying to decide which Paradigm speakers I want tp purchase for my to-be-built dedicated HT. I am currently using Focal Chorus 836v's and the matching center and surrounds in my living room HT. I LOVE the sound of the 836's. However, I am NOT impressed with the "small" 2-way center Focal has provided for this system. So since learning about the BIG 3-way centers that Paradigm has, I have decided I want Paradigm in my dedicated HT.

I am really interested in the Monitor series. Specifically the 11's, the CC390 and the ADP390 surrounds. I like the large drivers each use and of course the price point. Since the budget estimate w/o speakers is coming in around 40k, I would like to try and keep the budget under 50k by going with an inexpensive speaker system.

However, my concern is; I have quite a discerning ear and have been pleased with my Focal 836's.

Will the Monitor 11's (considering they are in a different price category- $1200 'Digms vs $3000 Focals) live up to my expectations?

I know... I need to go listen to them. But it won't be fair since a dealers room/environment is not the same as mine.

Your (Paradigm Expertise) thoughts and opinions will be appreciated.

Thanks.

Hello;
I'm a newbie to the Paradigm owners family, I just bought these Paradigm speakers from my local dealer here in Brighton, Michigan:
- (2) Frt Monitor Series 9
- (1) Center CC-390
- (4) Rear/back surrounds ADP-390

I budgeted around $2k (or so) for my speakers (w/o sub-woofer), these fit my price point, I went to a few dealers and listened to different brands and really liked the Paradigm Monitor series price/value/performance.

I went with the Series 9 instead of the series 11 Fronts, reason being is my room is not super large, 14.5 wide x 18.5 deep by 8.75 tall, 2,300 cubic feet of volume. If I was around 3000 cubic feet volume would have opted for the Series 11's to fill that bigger space, hopefully the Series 9's will fill my HT room fine.

They will go into my in process basement HT, driven by the newly bought A/V Denon AVR-4308CI.
Here they are, 2 weeks ago, waiting for me to finish the basement HT.
I could not wait any longer, so just last week I opened them up and temporairly replaced my Atlantic Technology 350's family room speakers with them
(see this link for those AT 350's (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=13006905&postcount=95) )

That family room is open/big, and the Series 9's filled it very well, so I feel confident they will do good in the basement HT.

I know, kinda weird showing speakers in a box, but I can't tell you how excited I was to pick these up that snowy/cold Friday evening here in Brighton Michigan.
http://lh3.google.com/mtbdudex/R4GHZFVhq7I/AAAAAAAAA14/w0c9ggHzuDM/s800/IMG_5886.JPG

http://lh4.google.com/mtbdudex/R4GHdVVhq8I/AAAAAAAAA2A/J90PiPN3kdM/s800/IMG_5887.JPG

Once the HT is set-up I'll let you know how great they sound.

Congrats! I'm sure you'll love them. I have the same except I got the M11's instead of the M9's. I love my setup.

BR

Looking forward to your mini review/feedback. Nice pictures.

Just out of curiosity, did you ever consider the CC290 for your center channel and what was your CC390 purchase decision based on.

Thanks

I've auditioned the M9's and M11's with the CC-290 and CC-390. Although the 290 sounded great, I didn't feel that it was a great match to these fronts. IMHO, 390 is perfect with these. I also find that the 290 is great with the Titans.

BR

Where to buy paradigm speakers online? Thanks.

Paradigm only allows sales from customer installers and/or mid/higher end specialty stores. No one is allowed to sell these over the net. Don't be intimidated by these stores. I have found that most Paradigm dealers, have great relationships with their customers. I don't know if this is because Paradigm is very selective of their dealers or what but I always feel welcome when I walk into a Paradigm retailer.

BR

hey guys...

I am currently trying to decide which Paradigm speakers I want tp purchase for my to-be-built dedicated HT. I am currently using Focal Chorus 836v's and the matching center and surrounds in my living room HT. I LOVE the sound of the 836's. However, I am NOT impressed with the "small" 2-way center Focal has provided for this system. So since learning about the BIG 3-way centers that Paradigm has, I have decided I want Paradigm in my dedicated HT.

I am really interested in the Monitor series. Specifically the 11's, the CC390 and the ADP390 surrounds. I like the large drivers each use and of course the price point. Since the budget estimate w/o speakers is coming in around 40k, I would like to try and keep the budget under 50k by going with an inexpensive speaker system.

However, my concern is; I have quite a discerning ear and have been pleased with my Focal 836's.

Will the Monitor 11's (considering they are in a different price category- $1200 'Digms vs $3000 Focals) live up to my expectations?

I know... I need to go listen to them. But it won't be fair since a dealers room/environment is not the same as mine.

Your (Paradigm Expertise) thoughts and opinions will be appreciated.

Thanks.

Phil, IMHO, the Studio 100's sound more like the 836's. They are a bit cheaper than the Focals but the MSRP is double that of the M11's. That said, you will lobe the CC-690. It is much like my CC390 but richer and more detailed.

My Paradigm dealer rep's Paradigm and Focal. His place would be great for your 3-way comparison but unless you live in Calgary, that won't happen. You will obviously need to do a comparison between the Monitors and Sudios for yourself. Only you can determine if the added cost is worth it. In my case, I am very pleased with the M11's, CC-390 and ADP-390's.


BR

Shock,

My take on this is that if your are strictly listening to movies, it might be okay. That said, you will most likely listen to music sometimes (either HD audio or even 7.1 "stereo"). In the latter case, you will not like what you hear. There will be a difference that will be noticeable. I am sure that a dealer can give you 15-20% off MSRP that will bring you closer to your budget.

Also, I would move the Atom to the SB (surround back) position and add the ADP's as your surround. I think that you will quite happy with that setup.


Hope it helps.

BR


Thanks a bunch for the advice. That is what I thought, so I will go see if I can find a nice set of ADP150, 170 or 190's used and get the brackets for the Atoms. Thanks!

Phil, IMHO, the Studio 100's sound more like the 836's. They are a bit cheaper than the Focals but the MSRP is double that of the M11's. That said, you will lobe the CC-690. It is much like my CC390 but richer and more detailed.
BR

How does the cc590 compare with the cc690? I was going to match up the cc590 with my Studio 100 v4's. Unfortunately the cc690 won't fit in my current setup.

D

Thanks Bigrock66. I know... you are right on that I just need to listen to them.

Then if I do want the Studios, I will have to "sell" the new HT price-tag to the little lady. She is pretty cool, but 50k for an HT when she wants to spend 30k+ on a bathroom renovation....

I suggested we arm wrestle to determine which one we do first!

You can't buy them new, online. You can however buy used, but you cannot hear them first. If you go to your local Paradigm dealer, you can hear them first hand.

So, what the best way to get a good price?
I went to a Paradigm dealler in Portland OR, but they will not negotiate MSRP price. I asked them about Studio 100, but they said it will be MSRP :(
It may be some discount if I would by something else, but I am not sure I am ready yet, I have some mini as my rear speaker and 5 year old central cc270. i know it would be good to upgrade central at least , but it's getting too expensive.
Thanks

hey guys...

I am currently trying to decide which Paradigm speakers I want tp purchase for my to-be-built dedicated HT. I am currently using Focal Chorus 836v's and the matching center and surrounds in my living room HT. I LOVE the sound of the 836's. However, I am NOT impressed with the "small" 2-way center Focal has provided for this system. So since learning about the BIG 3-way centers that Paradigm has, I have decided I want Paradigm in my dedicated HT.

I am really interested in the Monitor series. Specifically the 11's, the CC390 and the ADP390 surrounds. I like the large drivers each use and of course the price point. Since the budget estimate w/o speakers is coming in around 40k, I would like to try and keep the budget under 50k by going with an inexpensive speaker system.

However, my concern is; I have quite a discerning ear and have been pleased with my Focal 836's.

Will the Monitor 11's (considering they are in a different price category- $1200 'Digms vs $3000 Focals) live up to my expectations?

I know... I need to go listen to them. But it won't be fair since a dealers room/environment is not the same as mine.

Your (Paradigm Expertise) thoughts and opinions will be appreciated.

Thanks.

You need to go listen, of course. Your "discerning ear" might like things that sound like junk to me, and vice versa.

That being said, if you really have a discerning ear, the Monitors should sound pretty bad to you. The studios are a pretty big step up, and the Signatures are a big quality step up as well (I think more significant in a number of ways, but probably not in terms of objective measurements).

Anyway, I've learned (the hard way) that you should really spend the most money on speakers. Then likely Projector/Screen, then Amp/Pre. So for your kind of budget, you should be spending ~10K for speakers, ~8K for TV/Projector/Screen, and ~1-3K for your amp. Assuming your 50K includes room construction. IMO.

And for 10K, you can get the Signatures. For 5K you can get the Studios. I wouldn't consider anything less, you'd just regret it later.

What dealer is giving you this kind of discount??

Dan



Dan, I saved $50 on my brand new Mini's. I paid $399, including tax and 12ft of speaker cable.

However, the store I got them from is remodeling, and adding 4 more audition rooms, so they were having a "remodeling sale", and I got a really good deal. And to boot, the store owner and I have a lot in common, and I would not hesitate to spend more money there.


I would like to audition the S20's after their done remodeling.





-Nick

Anyone have current list prices for Paradigm speakers, specifically the Signature line?

So, what the best way to get a good price?
I went to a Paradigm dealler in Portland OR, but they will not negotiate MSRP price. I asked them about Studio 100, but they said it will be MSRP :(
It may be some discount if I would by something else, but I am not sure I am ready yet, I have some mini as my rear speaker and 5 year old central cc270. i know it would be good to upgrade central at least , but it's getting too expensive.
Thanks


See my post above..


I didn't ask for a price discount after one audition. For the past month, I went to his store once a week to audition various Paradigm speakers, and just "small-talk" with him. Partially, because I've owned high-end headphones, and never a pair of speakers, so my knowledge is limited in this area.

I think it paid off in the long-run. ;)

Anyone have current list prices for Paradigm speakers, specifically the Signature line?


http://www.bradfordshifi.com/prices.html


This is "suggested" and could vary on various stores, locations, etc.

The MSRP of my Mini's were $449, I ended up paying $399 for them, as suggested in the above link, but he mentioned that there was a recent price increase, which is why the Mini's were $449 at the time of my purchase (yesterday), instead of $399.


Nevertheless, for $400, these are some very special speakers. :D






-Nick :)

And for 10K, you can get the Signatures. For 5K you can get the Studios. I wouldn't consider anything less, you'd just regret it later.

And for about $3k you can get a nice set used surround Studio set with 60 v.3's as the mains, matching v.3's for the center and sides, and a nice sub (probably not Paradigm though).

The audible difference between the Sigs or newer studio V.4's will be very negligible, but the minimum $2k savings isn't at all negligible.

And for about $3k you can get a nice set used surround Studio set with 60 v.3's as the mains, matching v.3's for the center and sides, and a nice sub (probably not Paradigm though).

The audible difference between the Sigs or newer studio V.4's will be very negligible, but the minimum $2k savings isn't at all negligible.

That is completely suibjective, and you should state something like "to me".

In addition, the Studio v.3's are considered by many to be a step back from the v.2's, and it's not until the tweeter upgrade on the v.4's that the Studio's got a significant improvement (that tweeter is from the Signature v.1). The Signature v.2's upgraded the tweeter at the same time.

In any case, you have to listen to the speakers yourself, and decide what you hear and what it's worth to you.

I can say, without question, that the Signature v.2 line is worth double the Studio v.4 line, to me and my ears. And that's all that matters (to me). I have to buy them and calibrate them for my room, which I'll be doing in the next few weeks, and I'll post back.

hey guys...

I am currently trying to decide which Paradigm speakers I want tp purchase for my to-be-built dedicated HT. I am currently using Focal Chorus 836v's and the matching center and surrounds in my living room HT. I LOVE the sound of the 836's. However, I am NOT impressed with the "small" 2-way center Focal has provided for this system. So since learning about the BIG 3-way centers that Paradigm has, I have decided I want Paradigm in my dedicated HT.

I am really interested in the Monitor series. Specifically the 11's, the CC390 and the ADP390 surrounds. I like the large drivers each use and of course the price point. Since the budget estimate w/o speakers is coming in around 40k, I would like to try and keep the budget under 50k by going with an inexpensive speaker system.

However, my concern is; I have quite a discerning ear and have been pleased with my Focal 836's.

Will the Monitor 11's (considering they are in a different price category- $1200 'Digms vs $3000 Focals) live up to my expectations?

I know... I need to go listen to them. But it won't be fair since a dealers room/environment is not the same as mine.

Your (Paradigm Expertise) thoughts and opinions will be appreciated.

Thanks.

If you liked the Focals then you should not consider anything less than the Studio v.4's. They're in a whole other league from the Monitor line.

I am slowly building a system around Studio 100's, CC-690, another pair of Studio 100's for the sides and at least Studio 40's for the back surrounds.

I'd have gone with another Studio 100 for the center if I had the room to do an acoustic transparent screen, but I don't and the CC-690 is actually a very nice speaker for being horizontally oriented.

Dan

The audible difference between the Sigs or newer studio V.4's will be very negligible,...

I disagree with you there!

...but the minimum $2k savings isn't at all negligible.

That I will agree on.

It all comes down to what you can afford and are willing to pay.

FWIW...I spent 2 hours listening to the Studio 100's back to back
with the S2's on 2 channel music and to my ear the S2's were a big step up in SQ. The biggest difference was how smooth the mids and highs sound on vocals, brass & symbals.

I'm not saying the Studio 100's are bad.
I think they are a great bargain.
But the Signature line is truly a major step up...and to some...worth the extra $$$'s.

Pete