Paradigm Owners Thread [Text View] - Page 56

Mark S.

01-07-10, 03:45 PM

Anyone else have info on an AVR to match Paradigms?

We're running 2 different sets, one from an Onkyo 906, and the other on a Pioneer Elite SC-05. Both are spectacular and power them effortlessly. As long as you're buying a decent receiver, power won't be an issue, you should probably focus on if it does everything else you want, like # of HDMI inputs, video upscaling, connectivity, etc.

That is WAY too much for those speakers, if I'm reading your price list right. It should be:

Monitor 11's (MSRP $1399) less 20% $1119.20 (or cheaper)
ADP 390's (MSRP $699) less 20% $559.20 - or get some Atom/Mini Monitors instead
CC-290 (MSRP $499) less 20% $399.20
Not sure on the MSRP of the sub, but it should be at least 20% off.

Unless of course Paradigm recently raised their prices a lot but I don't think they did.

I'd take Studio 20's over those Monitor 11's any day (in fact, I did just that) - the sub will make up the difference. Also I would buy a Studio center channel, and use Atom Monitors for surrounds (surrounds hardly do anything, from my experience). Or, if you want to stay with Monitor stuff and save money, I would suggest buying Titan Monitors in place of the Monitor 11's for half the price, as they share the large bass driver of the Monitor 11. No need to spend the money on those 11's in my opinion.

We're using Atom monitors in 2 out of 3 of our setups and they are more than adequate as surrounds even in a very large room.

IMO if the quote is more than about $2500-$2600 I'd take my business elsewhere. I'm in Calgary Alberta and we have 2 Paradigm dealers here, perhaps you should give them a call.

Stylz25

01-07-10, 04:03 PM

We're running 2 different sets, one from an Onkyo 906, and the other on a Pioneer Elite SC-05. Both are spectacular and power them effortlessly. As long as you're buying a decent receiver, power won't be an issue, you should probably focus on if it does everything else you want, like # of HDMI inputs, video upscaling, connectivity, etc.

That is WAY too much for those speakers, if I'm reading your price list right. It should be:

Monitor 11's (MSRP $1399) less 20% $1119.20 (or cheaper)
ADP 390's (MSRP $699) less 20% $559.20 - or get some Atom/Mini Monitors instead
CC-290 (MSRP $499) less 20% $399.20
Not sure on the MSRP of the sub, but it should be at least 20% off.

Unless of course Paradigm recently raised their prices a lot but I don't think they did.

I'd take Studio 20's over those Monitor 11's any day (in fact, I did just that) - the sub will make up the difference. Also I would buy a Studio center channel, and use Atom Monitors for surrounds (surrounds hardly do anything, from my experience). Or, if you want to stay with Monitor stuff and save money, I would suggest buying Titan Monitors in place of the Monitor 11's for half the price, as they share the large bass driver of the Monitor 11. No need to spend the money on those 11's in my opinion.

We're using Atom monitors in 2 out of 3 of our setups and they are more than adequate as surrounds even in a very large room.

IMO if the quote is more than about $2500-$2600 I'd take my business elsewhere. I'm in Calgary Alberta and we have 2 Paradigm dealers here, perhaps you should give them a call.

I had a feeling I might be getting ripped off and the guy is telling me that 20% off is a great deal! I am going to call the Calgary dealers...hope they ship! Thanks so much for the info! Greatly appreciated! :) Any more info welcome!

Mark S.

01-07-10, 05:03 PM

I had a feeling I might be getting ripped off and the guy is telling me that 20% off is a great deal! I am going to call the Calgary dealers...hope they ship! Thanks so much for the info! Greatly appreciated! :) Any more info welcome!

20% off is a great deal, I just don't think his MSRP's were correct if (assuming I understood you correctly) AFTER discount it was $1500 for a pair of monitor 11's - that definitely is a rip off. A good deal is 20% off Paradigm's MSRP, which I believe to be $1399 for the monitor 11's. Anyways, as per my previous post, I'd buy Titan monitors to save some money if you're getting a sub anyways, or if you want to spend the money, get Studio 20's. Anyways, you can listen to them all for yourself and decide.

The 2 dealers in Calgary are "General Audio" and "Sounds of Music". Sounds of Music will likely give you a bit better price, but it can depend on who you talk to. Expect 20% off MSRP. I buy all my stuff from Sounds of Music. "Soundsaround" also sells Paradigm monitor stuff, but stay well clear of those crooks. Avoid that store at all costs.

For the price of shipping all those heavy speakers, I'd imagine it would be far cheaper for you to pay for a couple tanks of gas and make a day trip to Calgary. 2.5hr drive isn't that bad. A lot of what you're looking for is on display and available for demo here as well (at least it was last time I was in those stores, but call ahead if tha'ts your plan).

Hope that helps,

Mark

Pair4Dimes

01-07-10, 05:29 PM

yeungp

01-07-10, 06:03 PM

Hello,

For those that own the Studio 20 v3... could you recommend some stands in the sub-$200 range? The ones from Paradigm(like the J-29) are just too pricey. I've looked at the various online retailers such as standsandmounts.com, but it's a bit hard to judge quality through a picture.

Thanks in advance.

Mark S.

01-07-10, 06:16 PM

No...What happened was he gave him FULL MSRP on all the products individually... Then took 20% off that... Which is what most dealers do...

Dont know why people aren't happy with 20% off...Unless you know your dealer well...Dont expect more.

--

On another note... What would you guys want to see more from your paradigm dealer (besides a bigger discount hah) or any audio store for that matter? Stock/variety...etc

Oh ok, I see what he did there. However, it looks like his MSRP's are inflated unless Paradigm raised their prices recently. Assuming he isn't using the correct MSRP's, at those prices I would want 30-40% off.

Based on my experience here in Calgary, 20% off is a good deal, 15% off is about the minimum I'd accept if there were no alternatives, and 25-30% off is an awesome deal (I got 30 :D)

For your second question, I would like to see more of EVERY SINGLE item on display and easy to demo in an A/B comparison as you move through various brands and models.

Mark

Stylz25

01-07-10, 06:59 PM

We're running 2 different sets, one from an Onkyo 906, and the other on a Pioneer Elite SC-05. Both are spectacular and power them effortlessly. As long as you're buying a decent receiver, power won't be an issue, you should probably focus on if it does everything else you want, like # of HDMI inputs, video upscaling, connectivity, etc.

That is WAY too much for those speakers, if I'm reading your price list right. It should be:

Monitor 11's (MSRP $1399) less 20% $1119.20 (or cheaper)
ADP 390's (MSRP $699) less 20% $559.20 - or get some Atom/Mini Monitors instead
CC-290 (MSRP $499) less 20% $399.20
Not sure on the MSRP of the sub, but it should be at least 20% off.

Unless of course Paradigm recently raised their prices a lot but I don't think they did.

I'd take Studio 20's over those Monitor 11's any day (in fact, I did just that) - the sub will make up the difference. Also I would buy a Studio center channel, and use Atom Monitors for surrounds (surrounds hardly do anything, from my experience). Or, if you want to stay with Monitor stuff and save money, I would suggest buying Titan Monitors in place of the Monitor 11's for half the price, as they share the large bass driver of the Monitor 11. No need to spend the money on those 11's in my opinion.

We're using Atom monitors in 2 out of 3 of our setups and they are more than adequate as surrounds even in a very large room.

IMO if the quote is more than about $2500-$2600 I'd take my business elsewhere. I'm in Calgary Alberta and we have 2 Paradigm dealers here, perhaps you should give them a call.

I was told to get the ADP 390's for the surround since they would work better and re-create the surround sound better....but I was considering the Mini Monitors since they are cheaper but I would probly in the long run afterwords say something like " i should have just got the adp-390's" haha

ayrton

01-07-10, 07:33 PM

Do most of your dealers discount only on a "Set" of speakers, or do they give you a break on a single item? Something in the Studio/Sig. lines. Fronts/Center. :confused:
TIA

Pair4Dimes

01-07-10, 07:59 PM

MRSP is.. on v.6 (Canadian pricing..might be different in US)

Moni 11 $ - 759/each - $1528/pair
ADP 390 - $459/each - $928/pair
CC - 290 - $529/each

-----

For the other question about deals on Sig/Studios...

I've only had one person to ask me for 3 Studio 100s..most are quoted in pairs.
For centers its not a problem giving deals on single units. Don't know why a dealer wouldn't give you a deal on a CC-### or C# when purchasing the lone unit. :S

Dathon

01-07-10, 09:22 PM

I can't comment on the pricing, but having the Monitor 11s AND a subwoofer seems kind of redundant. The main advantage to the Monitor 11 is the extended bass response, which will be covered by your sub. Seems like you could save some money and get the Monitor 7 instead.

Actually full tower speakers for L/R are not redundant at all. I fail to see how some people can suggest the 7's or smaller bookshelves over the 9's/11's, unless space and budget is limited. Full tower speakers have their advantages, even when paired with a sub. Even with an 80Hz/100Hz cutoff, the woofers will still get some play. Get a test CD that has low test tones and fequency sweeps on it that pan left to right across the front soundstage. Try this with bookshelves and then with full towers. There is a difference.

Gritesh

01-07-10, 10:07 PM

For the price of shipping all those heavy speakers, I'd imagine it would be far cheaper for you to pay for a couple tanks of gas and make a day trip to Calgary. 2.5hr drive isn't that bad. A lot of what you're looking for is on display and available for demo here as well (at least it was last time I was in those stores, but call ahead if tha'ts your plan).
Mark

Great! Now instead of driving to the south side of Edmonton, I'm going to have to take my truck all the way to Calgary, thanks Mark S :p (kidding)

I'd do it for you Stylz!

Kimwyn

01-07-10, 10:12 PM

hey what happened to my post?

BRAC

01-07-10, 11:58 PM

Who are your dealers in Edmonton??? In my experience, a little shopping around and some aggressive haggling can usually get you 20-30 percent, even in Edmonton.

Get in good with a reputable dealer, then all this becomes much easier...;)

WOLVERNOLE

01-08-10, 12:03 AM

Frohlich

01-08-10, 07:53 AM

I am considering the Studio 100's for my L&R. I own a Denon AVR w/ "only" 130 wpc. I have heard and I can imagine that the Studio 100's would like a LOT of wattage. Would I be "OK" with my Denon AVR (I forget the #...38--) ,it has 130 watts per channel.
I am going with a 5.1 set-up...I have Studio Esprit for cc, and ADP590 for surrounds.
Thanks for your experienced advice.;)

That receiver would certainly drive those speakers (I had an older version at one point of the 100s) but it wouldn't allow you to get everything out of them that they have to offer. Quite frankly a 200 watt seperate amp would likely tighten up their bass and improve their soundstage. Just within the last few years I added an external amp to my receiver for left and right channels and it made a noticeable difference...especially for 2 channel music listening. For HT, I don't think you would notice nearly as much.

Stylz25

01-08-10, 10:55 AM

Anyone know the Canadian pricing for the Special Edition 5.1 Paradigm System?? I am looking into the Monitor 11 system but heard the Special Edition speakers were excellent

cornchip75

01-08-10, 11:27 AM

I am considering the Studio 100's for my L&R. I own a Denon AVR w/ "only" 130 wpc. I have heard and I can imagine that the Studio 100's would like a LOT of wattage. Would I be "OK" with my Denon AVR (I forget the #...38--) ,it has 130 watts per channel.
I am going with a 5.1 set-up...I have Studio Esprit for cc, and ADP590 for surrounds.
Thanks for your experienced advice.;)

I've had my 100's and the CC690 for just over a half year, and I still use a Yamaha that's 115WPC, paid $200 for it at FS 4 years ago! I works, but I have never really crancked it up to the point of ear bleeding, because I know that would be bad. The loudest I tested it was playing the opening scene of Quantum of Solace (my favorite HT demo scene to date), my SPL meter peaked at just over 105db during some parts. That includes the sub however. Personnaly, that was much louder than I want to watch movies.

Thake that FWIW,

Phil

stretch

01-08-10, 12:05 PM

I currently own a 5.1 system of the following.
LF/RF:Monitor 11 V.2
CC: Monitor 390 I believe
Rears: Mini Monitor V.2
SVS Powered Sub.
TV: Panny 65V10
Pioneer: BDP-320
Yamaha:VX: something (cant recall at this time) This reciever is about 9 years old, has NO HDMI ports at all.

My TV is new, BDP is new, and I want to give my sound a dose of newness. I have done an experiment with my CC, installing my Mini Monitors in parallel. I noticed a bit of a sound difference, it just sounded better, more precise, leading me to believe my CC is lacking in a way. The Mini's are good, but currently too big for my new room setup, looking to maybe either get new surrounds (but have NO clue what to get), or just keep them and get a new CC.
If I get new surrounds, I can take the MM's and run them along with my current CC. If I get a new CC, I could live with big pertruding MM's on stands behind my couch.

AND/OR,
Do I purchase a new reciever? Mine is old, but it still works, but would a new AVR help put some life into my system, with all the new calibration techniques they offer? I have never calibrated my system.

I mainly watch movies, not much music. And I game some with all speakers on. Sounds like a war zone.

How do my old Monitors rate against current Paradigm models? My speakers are also about 8 years old. They still work well for me, but then again I don’t have anything else to compare them to.

Advice on what my next purchase should be based on the above info is appreciated.

Thanks

Pair4Dimes

01-08-10, 12:13 PM

Anyone know the Canadian pricing for the Special Edition 5.1 Paradigm System?? I am looking into the Monitor 11 system but heard the Special Edition speakers were excellent

SE 1 - $718/pair
SE3 - $1659/pair
SE C - $599
SE Sub - $829

Full MSRP $3805

...You must go listen to them first... and compare it to both Monitor n Studio's before listening to others opinions. You are the one trying to get them not others.. gl

Stylz25

01-08-10, 12:15 PM

SE 1 - $718/pair
SE3 - $1659/pair
SE C - $599
SE Sub - $829

Full MSRP $3805

...You must go listen to them first... and compare it to both Monitor n Studio's before listening to others opinions. You are the one trying to get them not others.. gl

Thanks for the info and I will listen to them for sure! thx again :)

rnrgagne

01-08-10, 02:11 PM

AND/OR,
Do I purchase a new reciever? Mine is old, but it still works, but would a new AVR help put some life into my system, with all the new calibration techniques they offer? I have never calibrated my system.
I mainly watch movies, not much music. And I game some with all speakers on. Sounds like a war zone.
Thanks

I think we're at a stability period for HDMI receivers in general. Since you have a Blu Ray player, a new receiver that can transcode the new codecs like DTS HD MA etc and apply digital room correction is very likely a worthwhile upgrade. I maintain the the room corrections available now are the most significant improvement in audio to come along in a while.
Audyssey is the best out there right now IMO, but some of the others are still beneficial.

AbMagFab

01-08-10, 02:17 PM

ayrton

01-08-10, 02:32 PM

MRSP is.. on v.6 (Canadian pricing..might be different in US)

-----

For the other question about deals on Sig/Studios...

I've only had one person to ask me for 3 Studio 100s..most are quoted in pairs.
For centers its not a problem giving deals on single units. Don't know why a dealer wouldn't give you a deal on a CC-### or C# when purchasing the lone unit. :S

Thanks. I would be buy a pair, R/L and single Center. My bad wording. :o

stretch

01-08-10, 02:47 PM

I think we're at a stability period for HDMI receivers in general. Since you have a Blu Ray player, a new receiver that can transcode the new codecs like DTS HD MA etc and apply digital room correction is very likely a worthwhile upgrade. I maintain the the room corrections available now are the most significant improvement in audio to come along in a while.
Audyssey is the best out there right now IMO, but some of the others are still beneficial.

Thank you for the response. If I am reading correctly, the Audyssey balances out the room and makes necessary corrections up to a certain point. Will my current speakers sound better? Maybe crisper, or just by properly calibrating my setup, I will be better than I currently am? I "think" my speakers sound decent, but again, after hooking up the Mini Monitors along with the CC, it sounded MUCH better. Leading me to believe I am CC deficiant. I think I'll look around for a high end budget reciever, and go from there. Maybe try to find some decent priced Rear surrounds, or sell my MM's, and center channel, then buy a new center and surrounds? But then they would not be timber matched to my front towers. Will that matter much?
Would my rear surrounds have to be the same brand? I would think since its only small signals sent to the rears, that I can get away with a different brand. I'm looking for smaller in size, but not sound, the Mini Monitors are just too bulky to hang in my current setup.

rnrgagne

01-08-10, 05:27 PM

ARC is at least as good, if not better than Audyssey Pro. And ARC is superior to the non-Pro versions of Audyssey that you get in most AVRs.

I didn't factor ARC into the equation because it isn't relevant in this context, (I was talking about receivers, not pre-pros.) plus the cheapest unit you can get it in is $5000 - without amps! :eek:

Audyssey is readily available even in budget units and across a range of brands.

rnrgagne

01-08-10, 05:37 PM

[QUOTE=stretch;17881340]Thank you for the response. If I am reading correctly, the Audyssey balances out the room and makes necessary corrections up to a certain point. QUOTE]

Yes, it will level match your speakers, adjust the timing (i.e. delay or distance), and equalize for room acoustic influences. The net result is one of the most positive things you can do for a multi channel sound system.

It is highly likely it would enhance your center channels' performance. I would start by seeing what difference is achievable before giving up or re-assessing your speakers.

ayrton

01-08-10, 05:57 PM

stretch

01-08-10, 06:08 PM

Big improvement for me.
I had another brand AVR 140W/chnl without Audyssey running same exact system. (Studio 100/CC590/ADP 590 + Sub) Bought Onkyo 906 145W with Audyssey and sounds like a HT now instead of "Sounds".

This is using "Lossless" HD Blu ray sound in a HT environment.

[QUOTE=stretch;17881340]Thank you for the response. If I am reading correctly, the Audyssey balances out the room and makes necessary corrections up to a certain point. QUOTE]

Yes, it will level match your speakers, adjust the timing (i.e. delay or distance), and equalize for room acoustic influences. The net result is one of the most positive things you can do for a multi channel sound system.

It is highly likely it would enhance your center channels' performance. I would start by seeing what difference is achievable before giving up or re-assessing your speakers.

Thanks, that was the info I was looking for. Hopefully a new AVR will give life to the speakers once again. Note: its not that the speakers are bad, but a new sound would be great. This may be the ticket, I'll start researching the $700 range of AVR's over in the other section.

Thanks again..

TweakerInWA

01-08-10, 07:55 PM

Alrighty, for those of you that asked, here they are. W5's in the wild. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=156665&d=1256952386

Your stand is about 1.5" off center right of the PDP....Hope you've fixed that by now!!! :p

Great setup!!;)

TweakerInWA

01-08-10, 08:11 PM

RoyalTennenbaum

01-08-10, 11:39 PM

Pair4Dimes

01-09-10, 12:03 AM

Can any of you folks around the Buffalo/Syracuse/Albany/Toronto area recommend a Paradigm dealer with decent demo rooms and stock on hand? Currently running a S4/C3/S2 setup but wanted to take a listen to some S8's, I'm getting an itch to get into vinyl and will probably benefit using S8's for more "Full Range" 2ch audio. Although the S4's have yet to let me down in any regard..

My closest dealer is "Clarks Music" and they have more piano's in their showroom than speakers. :(

Toronto? ... If your travelling that far..Might as well go to Paradigm in Mississauga and listen to those S8's :D

.....................................

On another note.. I'm looking for a Audio component stand ... preferably Silver/Glass...4/5 Tier with wires hidden in the supports... Cant find anything here... maybe any American company that ship to Canada would even work.
Any suggestions :confused:

Dathon

01-09-10, 01:00 AM

First time Paradigm owner here with a could of setup questions.

I have a big room (40' long x 14' w x 8' high)
FL, C, FR - Cinema 330's
Surrounds - Cinema ADP's
Rears - CS-50 In-ceilings
Sub - DSP 3200

Pretty happy with the sound so far but a bit underwhelmed by the ADP's. They seem to handle surround when playing a movie fine but sound weak when playing music in 7 channel stereo; the CS-50's seem to dominate them.

I can upgrade to ADP 190's for $100/speaker. Granted I've just begun to listen, I'd like some other Paradigm owner's opinion on surrounds for this setup. Stay with the ADP's or upgrade?

Secondly, I have a second sub that I'm not using - a 10 year old JBL PSW1200 (10" driver, 1200 watts). My DSP 3200 is setup in the front of the room and kicks out good base but I really want to fill this big room. What's the opinion on adding a second sub (specifically the JBL that I have)? I have a Denon AVR-1910 receiver that has one sub out so if I did a second sub, I'd use a Y-connector out of the receiver to drive each sub. Want good bass but don't want to over do it or mis-match.

Don't take this the wrong way, but...You have a very large room, and you are trying to fill it with sound with small satellite speakers. 40' long is a lot of space. Adding another sub is only going to overwhelm the other speakers with bass. It will do nothing for filling the room for music. Maybe your dealer would let you try the ADP-190's? But really, for a room that size, if you want to fill it up with big bold sound, you need larger speakers all around. Of course that comes with a price increase though.

JohnGZ28

01-09-10, 06:38 AM

Don't take this the wrong way, but...You have a very large room, and you are trying to fill it with sound with small satellite speakers. 40' long is a lot of space. Adding another sub is only going to overwhelm the other speakers with bass. It will do nothing for filling the room for music. Maybe your dealer would let you try the ADP-190's? But really, for a room that size, if you want to fill it up with big bold sound, you need larger speakers all around. Of course that comes with a price increase though.

What he said.

That's a very large space you are trying to fill.

rnrgagne

01-09-10, 12:13 PM

Pretty happy with the sound so far but a bit underwhelmed by the ADP's. They seem to handle surround when playing a movie fine but sound weak when playing music in 7 channel stereo; the CS-50's seem to dominate them.

I can upgrade to ADP 190's for $100/speaker. Granted I've just begun to listen, I'd like some other Paradigm owner's opinion on surrounds for this setup. Stay with the ADP's or upgrade?

Secondly, I have a second sub that I'm not using - a 10 year old JBL PSW1200 (10" driver, 1200 watts). My DSP 3200 is setup in the front of the room and kicks out good base but I really want to fill this big room. What's the opinion on adding a second sub (specifically the JBL that I have)? I have a Denon AVR-1910 receiver that has one sub out so if I did a second sub, I'd use a Y-connector out of the receiver to drive each sub. Want good bass but don't want to over do it or mis-match.

That is quite a large room as others have suggested. I disagree that running two subs won't help, I think it certainly wont hurt. The thing is you have two different subs with different frequency responses so setting them up will be a bit tricky. Ordinarily I'd suggest a front-back configuration for two subs, but for that size room I think you should be going for output and stacking them at the optimum location.
Do the crawl test; place your current sub at your listening position or as close as you can get it, play some bass heavy material then literally crawl around on your hands and knees around the perimeter of the room or anywhere you could reasonably put a sub to see where the strongest bass response is. That is the spot you should place your subs.

Stack the smaller one on top of the bigger one. Then get your hands on an SPL meter and run a test signal from your receiver through one sub at a time and set each subs' volume dial so it is outputting the same SPL as the other.
You probably want to err on the low side with the weaker sub and on the high side with the stronger one. You should start with them at about 30%-40% volume and adjust to get about 75db to 85db - whichever is most "comfortable" for you.
I don't know if your receivers' test tones are at a fixed output (automatic volume output) if so adjust both subs' volumes, but if not when you do the first sub turn up the receiver's volume until the test tone is at one of the above levels. Then at that volume run a test tone through the second sub and set that sub's volume so it matches the first. It's probably a good idea to do the strongest sub first.

Having done that run the Denon's Audyssey following this excellent guide;

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14456895#post14456895

See if that gets you to where want, and if it's still wanting after that then you may want to look at other speaker options as the others have suggested.

You might want to look at the specs of both subs and make sure that you set the low pass filters and high pass filters so they match the weaker sub. These could be on the subs themselves, built in, or configurable in the Denon (LFE settings). But if the strong sub has a FR of 20hz to 150hz and the weaker 30hz to 100hz you might want your settings at 30hz on the bottom and 100hz on the top. Basically what you don't want to happen is the weaker sub to get signals it can't handle and bottom out or distort.

Oh, and if you don't want to get an SPL meter you could run the Audyssey with the strongest sub on see what it sets it at, at then re-run it with the weaker sub and note the difference and it if sets it at 3db higher, then turn up the sub's volume proportionately until Audyssey sets it at the same level as the first. That's a bit of a PIA, but it should work.

rnrgagne

01-09-10, 12:44 PM

Currently running a S4/C3/S2 setup but wanted to take a listen to some S8's, I'm getting an itch to get into vinyl and will probably benefit using S8's for more "Full Range" 2ch audio. Although the S4's have yet to let me down in any regard..

My closest dealer is "Clarks Music" and they have more piano's in their showroom than speakers. :(

I went from the S4 v.1's to S8's v.3's and I'm glad I did.
I've also re-discovered vinyl, I have a 25 year old B&O turntable with a new MMC4 cartridge I recently hooked up to my AVP and over 200 albums from days of yore! I am very pleasantly surprised at the sound quality and effectively doubled my music collection because of it.
It's an interesting sound having been in the digital world since cd's first came out. Organic comes to mind as a descriptor it's definitely different and not at all unpleasant. I don't think I would start a vinyl collection based on what I'm hearing, it's just not on par with good quality digital recordings to my ears, but it is definitely good enough to enjoy the material.

ayrton

01-09-10, 12:56 PM

Toronto? ... If your travelling that far..Might as well go to Paradigm in Mississauga and listen to those S8's :D

.....................................

On another note.. I'm looking for a Audio component stand ... preferably Silver/Glass...4/5 Tier with wires hidden in the supports... Cant find anything here... maybe any American company that ship to Canada would even work.
Any suggestions :confused:

Found this site for AV stands.
Hope it may help. Salamander Designs also has some nice stuff.

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/glass_tv_stand-showroom.html

http://www.salamanderdesigns.com/

WOLVERNOLE

01-09-10, 06:33 PM

TweakerInWA

01-09-10, 06:45 PM

Toronto? ... If your travelling that far..Might as well go to Paradigm in Mississauga and listen to those S8's :D

I'm only 3 hours from Mississauga, I'm assuming you say that because Paradigm has a factory there? Can you purchase factory direct if you go there or is it just a "Showroom"?.

Would make for a decent weekend outing if I could do a factory tour and catch a Leaf's game while I'm up there. I'm a huge hockey fan (Rangers) and want to see games in Montreal, Ottawa and Toronto now that I've planted roots after having to move every three years from place to place around the country (military).....:D

On a side note: How bout the World Junior Cup !!!!! Yeah Baby !!!! USA took the gold!! Three future Rangers Kreider/Stepan and Bourque !!!! Stepan and Kreider looked great !!! I plan on attending a few games next year in Buffalo !!!

rnrgagne

01-09-10, 07:12 PM

I'm only 3 hours from Mississauga, I'm assuming you say that because Paradigm has a factory there? Can you purchase factory direct if you go there or is it just a "Showroom"?.

Would make for a decent weekend outing if I could do a factory tour and catch a Leaf's game while I'm up there. I'm a huge hockey fan (Rangers) and want to see games in Montreal, Ottawa and Toronto now that I've planted roots after having to move every three years from place to place around the country (military).....:D

On a side note: How bout the World Junior Cup !!!!! Yeah Baby !!!! USA took the gold!! Three future Rangers Kreider/Stepan and Bourque !!!! Stepan and Kreider looked great !!! I plan on attending a few games next year in Buffalo !!!

It's about time you Yanks got into the best sport on the planet! But you didn't win it... our goalie gave it to you!

Okay, all kidding aside the US had some serious wheels on that team and I thought it was a pick-em after seeing that excellent New Years' Can/US tilt.

Oh, and one of our Canucks' first round picks was on that squad too - Schroeder!

TweakerInWA

01-09-10, 07:33 PM

It's about time you Yanks got into the best sport on the planet! But you didn't win it... our goalie gave it to you!

Okay, all kidding aside the US had some serious wheels on that team and I thought it was a pick-em after seeing that excellent New Years' Can/US tilt.

Oh, and one of our Canucks' first round picks was on that squad too - Schroeder!

Yeah, lot's of youngsters on both sides we'll be seeing soon in the NHL. Schroeder looked good, but there's no doubt Kreider and Stepan really impressed for team USA, and for both to be Ranger prospects is outstanding. But !!!, that means Glen Sather will probably end up trading them both for some under achieving overpaid vet **cough** Redden **cough**:mad: Worst signing in the history of the NHL !!!!:eek:

It was agreat tournament though, kinda suprised other countries looked so far behind Canada and the US this year, wasn't really a competition outside of us.... :confused: I watched Canada beat up on Latvia one day, then the USA team beat them up the next. I think they were out scored like 27-1 in two games, lol...now that's a beating, need a coaching change there...

benn600

01-09-10, 07:47 PM

Paradigm replaced the upper mid range driver for us and that did in fact include the tweeter (Sig C5 v2) and the problem is resolved completely. I really think it was just an arbitrary and unexplained failure.

Does anyone know when the Signature S10's will be released? I heard very soon but am getting anxious. We are happy with our v2 S8 system for the time being but I always like watching progress and reading about impressions, improvements, etc.

By the way: on the price issue. We live in the midwestern United States and I am surprised to hear about people getting 15 - 20% discounts. What is an appropriate discount on Signature equipment? Does living in Canada help decrease costs with freight, etc.? Our discount was a flat 10% off the MSRP costs and we bought shortly before the price increase late 2008. We were told that this was the maximum discount allowed by Paradigm for them to give on Signature equipment.

weird 23

01-09-10, 08:53 PM

Lamfada

01-09-10, 10:52 PM

Anyone suffered "buyer remorse" going either up or down re Studio 60's VS. 100's ?
The height of the 60's is better for my space as well as less power usage, but those four seven-inch speakers over the three 5 1/2" is quite a difference. Can a good sub (e.g. Paradigm Sub 12) make up the bass end I would lose between 100's VS. 60's ? :confused:
Thanks !

I am a first time Paradigm owner (and first time poster actually) but I just picked up both the Studio 100's and the 60's. What size space are you working with? In my 20x20 space, I can tell you from the last few days of fine tuning them that there is a noticeable difference in sound between the two speakers. I'm not saying that the 60's don't sound good because they definitely do, but the 100's seem to do it in a more effortless fashion, if that makes sense. As far as the Sub 12, I can't comment yet because mine won't be here until next week. After I get everything tuned, I will be in a better position to give my thoughts on the sub.

-Lam

PeeBee78

01-09-10, 10:58 PM

I just bought a Cinema 110 CT 5.1 Speaker set....

I have the two front and the two rear speakers sitting on the ground. I wanted to get some cheaper speaker stands for the front and rear speakers as they do not sit up on their own (the front ones anyway).

Do you have any recommendations on good speaker stands aside from the overpriced Paradigm ones (which I hear are not very sturdy)?

Has anyone tried the Monoprice speaker stands with these speakers? The front speakers are 6.6 lbs so it's heavier than what the rating on the website is...maybe they are good for the rear speakers?

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=108&cp_id=10828&cs_id=1082804&p_id=3021&seq=1&format=2

Thanks for your help!

WOLVERNOLE

01-10-10, 01:38 AM

I am a first time Paradigm owner (and first time poster actually) but I just picked up both the Studio 100's and the 60's. What size space are you working with? In my 20x20 space, I can tell you from the last few days of fine tuning them that there is a noticeable difference in sound between the two speakers. I'm not saying that the 60's don't sound good because they definitely do, but the 100's seem to do it in a more effortless fashion, if that makes sense. As far as the Sub 12, I can't comment yet because mine won't be here until next week. After I get everything tuned, I will be in a better position to give my thoughts on the sub.
-Lam
OK, congrats on the first post and welcome ! Well, my room in NARROW, but more importantly, I am squeezed in between my projector screen and wall (have floor standing speakers between the screen end and wall). I alsp have seating that is L-O-W, so the Studio 60's tweeter really lines up several inches lower and in line w/ our ears. Currently have and will presumably switch out of Def Tech towers (w/ side-firing, built-in subs L&R). DT may not be quite the "quality" of Paradigm, but I am kinda use to pounding bass from the fronts, obviously. I wonder if I would miss this from the 60's...in comparison to the Studio 100's (no sub built-in, but three 7" woofers). So I see respective advantages to 100's and to 60's. Oh, and I have a Denon AVR w/ 130wpc ( I hear both that it has/does not have enough wpc for the 100's , depending on who comments).
Best choice?
P.S. Room is 18'x10'x 7' 1/2 ceiling, so kinda small. Lamfada, what do you have/specs on power to those 100's?

csj0952

01-10-10, 03:59 AM

Pair4Dimes

01-10-10, 06:51 AM

I'm only 3 hours from Mississauga, I'm assuming you say that because Paradigm has a factory there? Can you purchase factory direct if you go there or is it just a "Showroom"?.

Would make for a decent weekend outing if I could do a factory tour and catch a Leaf's game while I'm up there. I'm a huge hockey fan (Rangers) and want to see games in Montreal, Ottawa and Toronto now that I've planted roots after having to move every three years from place to place around the country (military).....:D

On a side note: How bout the World Junior Cup !!!!! Yeah Baby !!!! USA took the gold!! Three future Rangers Kreider/Stepan and Bourque !!!! Stepan and Kreider looked great !!! I plan on attending a few games next year in Buffalo !!!

1.Well... Paradigms only factory is there... Pretty cool factory tour... Saw a stack of D2vs there .. Was a little tempting... haha

They have their million dollar show room there, got the S8's 2 Sub 25s C5 2 extra sub 12s? and Surrounds all around... Very nice set up... They also have the LTX500 projector with a 14000 dollar lens on it :D

2. I love Avery haha... He belongs in NY. But if your coming to town ( March 10th the Rangers come to visit.. Earlier than that ... Jan 14th the Philly comes to town..always 3+ fights in those games... very fun to watch.

3. I can make a list of a bunch of eligible juniors that could of played for Canada that were too busy in the NHL ... :eek: ... Non the less congrats... My hearts still broken... :(

Lamfada

01-10-10, 08:10 AM

Room is 18'x10'x 7' 1/2 ceiling, so kinda small. Lamfada, what do you have/specs on power to those 100's?

In that room I would think the 60's will sound great. They won't have the low end punch of the Def Techs with the built in sub, but I think they will sound just fine. Mine are being pushed by a Denon 4310 at 130 watts per channel. To my ear I think this is a good level for the 60's but I can hear the 100's wanting a little more. Having said that, I doubt they'll get any more because I am very happy with the way they sound.

-Lam

Geek From NJ

01-10-10, 09:17 AM

I bought used Paradigm Adp 170's in perfect condition for $175.00. Do you think I got a good deal? My dad has the new ADP 190's and I like my cabinet better. Sound wise I have yet to compare the two. So did I do good. price wise... I have them match to new Atoms, New CC and a new Ultracube 12 which I paid only $880 for the sub. Was that a good price on the sub as well?

Kai Winters

01-10-10, 09:32 AM

Guys, I'm too cheap to afford Studio 10s but I love them. If you had a limited budget or couldn't get studios, what would you do, who is Paradigm's little brother in the field of home audio?

Please see my thread at http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1215239

and post your reply so I don't miss it.

Thanks, Chris

The next is their Monitor line.
Link to Monitor:
http://www.paradigm.com/en/paradigm/fronts-monitor-series-1-2-4.paradigm

Link to varied "systems" by Paradigm:
http://www.paradigm.com/en/paradigm/downloads.php

I've been a big fan of the Monitor line for years. They sound very good and are "reasonable" though not cheap.
The Cinema line is the next down from the Monitors and while they are nice speakers I do not like the sound of them very much. They just seem to have a narrower sound stage...most likely because of the size and construction materials but are nice for limited room applications.

I own Atoms, Titans, Monitor 3's, Monitor 11's, CC170, CC290 and a PDR-12...I'm currently using the 11's/fronts and Atoms/surround with the cc290 and PDR-12.

I suggest if your budget is limited and you prefer the sound of higher end speakers you start slowly with just the fronts for example and as your budget allows add to the system. Over time you will have a much better system and at less cost than continuous upgrading. Just a thought.

I wish I had heard, and taken, this advice years ago. My system would be much better but we all do what we can when we can and I have no regrets.

rnrgagne

01-10-10, 01:16 PM

Anyone suffered "buyer remorse" going either up or down re Studio 60's VS. 100's ?
The height of the 60's is better for my space as well as less power usage, but those four seven-inch speakers over the three 5 1/2" is quite a difference. Can a good sub (e.g. Paradigm Sub 12) make up the bass end I would lose between 100's VS. 60's ? :confused:
Thanks !

The short answer is yes, and I would get a sub even for the 100's.
You room is fairly narrow and I would venture a guess you had your Def Tech's corner loaded, which could enhance, but more likely over-emphasize, the bass to begin with. Some people like this type of bass but, I'm more about accuracy for music; do that right and movies sound great too.
I would likely choose the 60's and a good sub over the 100's and no sub for that size room since you have limited L/R placement options. (You can really only move them forward or backward.) A sub should have more placement options so you can optimize it for that room.

I strongly maintain room acoustics/speaker interaction is the most critical aspect of getting good sound, check out some of the other posts I've made here, there's some good tips that would apply in your situation.

On the topic of power, 130w channel should power just about anything in that size room - 100's included, add a sub, and crossover your mains between 60hz to 80hz and you could probably reach insane SPL levels with half that power.

csj0952

01-10-10, 02:12 PM

I've heard PSB or monitor audio speakers sound similar to Studio 10s, true or untrue?

WOLVERNOLE

01-10-10, 02:41 PM

WOLVERNOLE

01-10-10, 02:44 PM

I've heard PSB or monitor audio speakers sound similar to Studio 10s, true or untrue?

I think similarly-sized PSB's sound "sorta" like the line directly below Studio, which are Paradigm's Monitor series...which I liked a lot when demoing. I just liked the Studio series somewhat better, and that was my "pain threshold" for price.

rnrgagne

01-10-10, 03:28 PM

Thanks for the feedback.
rnrgagne, you are right about the placement and accoustics being really important...more than I figured before this project. I think the 100's may really be cramped in there. I could "save" $1000 between the 60's and the 100's, get the same tweeter and box build, and put the $1000. toward a killer Paradigm "Sub 12." I was just thinking of evening the bass out a little more in the room with 100's, but even they won't "hit" like a small sub.

"evening" the bass out has more to do with placement and how room modes interact at the listening position than driver or speaker size does.

A quick look at your dimensions with a room mode calculator shows pretty decent bass performance with maybe a bit of an overlap at 60hz - but a fairly active mid-bass with lots of overlapping modes in the 150hz to 500hz range.

Placement+Treatments+Audyssey = Nirvana! ;)

osofast240sx

01-10-10, 03:30 PM

"evening" the bass out has more to do with placement and how room modes interact at the listening position than driver or speaker size does.

A quick look at your dimensions with a room mode calculator shows pretty decent bass performance with maybe a bit of an overlap at 60hz - but a fairly active mid-bass with lots of overlapping modes in the 150hz to 500hz range.

Placement+Treatments+Audyssey = Nirvana! ;)u have a link to that room mode calculator

TweakerInWA

01-10-10, 06:13 PM

1.Well... Paradigms only factory is there... Pretty cool factory tour... Saw a stack of D2vs there .. Was a little tempting... haha

They have their million dollar show room there, got the S8's 2 Sub 25s C5 2 extra sub 12s? and Surrounds all around... Very nice set up... They also have the LTX500 projector with a 14000 dollar lens on it :D

2. I love Avery haha... He belongs in NY. But if your coming to town ( March 10th the Rangers come to visit.. Earlier than that ... Jan 14th the Philly comes to town..always 3+ fights in those games... very fun to watch.

3. I can make a list of a bunch of eligible juniors that could of played for Canada that were too busy in the NHL ... :eek: ... Non the less congrats... My hearts still broken... :(

Yeah, and one of them is quickly becoming one of my favorite Rangers, Michael Del Zotto, his +/- is a little rough (steep learning curve for a 19y/o defensemen in the NHL), but for his age, his heart and talent far exceed the likes of Roszival and Redden, I love the kid and think he'll be an all-star one day.

Thanks for the info on upcoming games, I can't stand the Flyers....

Can you purchase anything there at the factory, or is it strictly for tours and demo's ?

rnrgagne

01-10-10, 07:01 PM

u have a link to that room mode calculator

No, but there's a ton of them out there. The one I have saved on my desktop came from Ethan Winer's Real Traps website.
The one I used when I built my room about five years ago was much better but I can't remember what it was called. :confused:

Pair4Dimes

01-10-10, 07:21 PM

Yea its strictly a tour of their woodshop/assembly line/ product lines (anthem as well) and the show room... Although, they do not have all their products hooked up and ready to listen to.

Only speakers you can listen to are those in the showroom.

Warpdrv

01-10-10, 07:27 PM

And why would you want to listen to anything but the Signature's... :D

SilverBlade

01-10-10, 07:55 PM

And why would you want to listen to anything but the Signature's... :D

Some people are on a budget and can't afford them. I'm only putting $2000 (before tax) into my 5.1 surround sound system (speakers + receiver)

JohnGZ28

01-10-10, 09:08 PM

Some people are on a budget and can't afford them. I'm only putting $2000 (before tax) into my 5.1 surround sound system (speakers + receiver)

He was just joking. Did you note the :D at the end of his post?

mjpearce023

01-10-10, 09:15 PM

I currenty have some monitor 3 and some mini monitors and a cc370. I feel like it's still to obvious where the speakers are. I want them to blend in better. My room is 13x 10 w 8 ft ceiling. I'm thinking of some studio 20s v3 or v4 but I don't know if my little denon will push them well. It's a 1608 that has 75 x 7. I could by amp them with the denon but I didn't know if I should get a 2 channel amp or what would be a good amp for 250 or 300$. I don't use a sub now so the 20 would be run full range. Any help would be great.

PeeBee78

01-11-10, 12:10 AM

Just following up to a message earlier....

Are there any stands besides the ones that Paradigm makes?

I need stands for the L and R front 110s...

And for the L and R rear ADPs...

Anyone try the ones from monoprice?

Thanks!

Pair4Dimes

01-11-10, 01:12 AM

Found this site for AV stands.
Hope it may help. Salamander Designs also has some nice stuff.

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/glass_tv_stand-showroom.html

http://www.salamanderdesigns.com/

Thanks!

Lamfada

01-11-10, 07:09 AM

And why would you want to listen to anything but the Signature's... :D

I know you were kidding but when I listened to them, I preferred the Studios over the Sigs. I can't really put my finger on why but they just sounded better to my ears.

-Lam

Awsomeclimber

01-11-10, 07:16 AM

Hello World..
Good evening all, my first post here so bear with me please..
Ill spend a lot of time reading the "how to hook stuff up" threads and try not to ask to many stupid questions..lol..

I did head for this thread but cant read the 13k posts on it (good effort lads!)

There is a Paradigm Ultra Cube 12 for sale (eBay) but its FAULTY..

I cant help but think it might be something simple, but it could blow out the budget as well.

Heres all I have on it..

THIS PARADIGM SUBWOOFER IS SOLD AS FAULTY.

THIS IS A TOP OF THE RANGE UNIT WHICH RETAILED AT AROUND AU$2000.
THE ULTRACUBE 12 HAS A 12 INCH SPEAKER.

IF YOU ARE NOT FAMILIAR WITH THIS MODEL THERE ARE PLENTY OF WEB SITES YOU CAN LOOK UP ,WHICH CAN GIVE YOU ALL THE SPECS AND INFORMATION ON THIS UNIT.

THE FAULT IS THAT WHEN YOU TURN IT ON ,THE SPEAKER JUST MAKES A LOUD THUMPING SOUND.

THIS UNIT NEEDS TO BE REPAIRED BY THE PARADIGM REPAIR AGENTS.

Has this been covered here allready.. Is it common, rare, is it just STUFFED? Cheers, Derek.

Bigred7078

01-11-10, 09:40 AM

I know you were kidding but when I listened to them, I preferred the Studios over the Sigs. I can't really put my finger on why but they just sounded better to my ears.

-Lam

interesting...

rnrgagne

01-11-10, 11:19 AM

I know you were kidding but when I listened to them, I preferred the Studios over the Sigs. I can't really put my finger on why but they just sounded better to my ears.

-Lam

Not surprising, the differences aren't extreme. Were it not for the "boxy" look of the Studio v.3's when I bought my first pair of Sigs, I wouldn't have bought them. At least not based on what I heard in the showroom, they didn't seem like much of an upgrade over the Studios. Once I had them in my own environment though, that opinion quickly changed.

The fact they sound better to your ears, is the key factor. It's one too many people overlook for whatever reason.

Pair4Dimes

01-11-10, 02:07 PM

I know you were kidding but when I listened to them, I preferred the Studios over the Sigs. I can't really put my finger on why but they just sounded better to my ears.

-Lam

I think you wallet will thank your ears later :D

GSD1

01-11-10, 02:36 PM

Anyone have any thoughts as to which is better. Paradigm 110ct, KEF 2005.3, or Def Tech Pro Cinema 800? I'm pairing with a Onkyo 807 and have a 25x30 space, satellites will be wall mounted. Listen to music/movies about 50/50. Can crank it up -- no one to complain for miles :-)

I'd really appreciate the help.. Thanks!!

Kimwyn

01-11-10, 02:45 PM

I know you were kidding but when I listened to them, I preferred the Studios over the Sigs. I can't really put my finger on why but they just sounded better to my ears.

-Lam

this is an extremely interesting comment. did you listen for music or HT?

dchaves

01-11-10, 04:06 PM

Could someone shoot me some ideas for a sub that would compliment a pair of Studio 20 v.5's? =<10"

TweakerInWA

01-11-10, 04:44 PM

=<10"

Is that an emoticon or are you saying smaller than a 10" sub ?:confused:

BigSwede

01-11-10, 04:50 PM

Have a pair of Studio 20s (not sure which version, I'm guessing v1 or v2?), buying a used CC-470, powered by a Denon AVR-2807. Looking for advice on IN-CEILING REARS and SUB to complete the 5.1 set-up. Would like to do as cost effectively (er, cheap) as possible but w/o compromising my existing equipment. Looking forward to your suggestions.

TweakerInWA

01-11-10, 05:02 PM

I know you were kidding but when I listened to them, I preferred the Studios over the Sigs. I can't really put my finger on why but they just sounded better to my ears.

-Lam

Maybe you have or had an ear infection (ruptured TM?)..I would recommend an ENT(Ear,Nose,Throat) specialist in your area, but I'm not sure of your location.. May have been something a simple Val Salva could have fixed, plug your nose close mouth and get your ears to pop...Possibly, and more logically I would attribute it to a common condition known as "Lagena Cochlear Wallititis" where the cochlear extends down to far as to interfere with vibration eminating from one's wallet....:eek:

Seriously,
they're both great speakers and you can't go wrong with either.... :)

BH0012

01-11-10, 05:45 PM

Looking for some advice here. I am working on outfitting my dedicated media room which is 20.5' deep x 15.5' wide and 9' high. This past weekend I went in to audition some monitor 9's and liked what I heard but was left wanting a little more. So then I listened to the Studio 60's and was sold on them. With the cc-590 center and adp-590 surrounds, would this be enough for a 7.1 setup in this size room or should I step up to something larger?

dchaves

01-11-10, 05:46 PM

Is that an emoticon or are you saying smaller than a 10" sub ?:confused:

equal to or less than 10" ;)

Also, I'm looking for a bang for buck stereo amplifier. Any suggestions?

Speed Daemon

01-11-10, 06:33 PM

I have a pair of Studio 80s, circa 2002. I have a choice of amplifiers:

2 Hafler TA 1600 (one at a time, bridged or bi-amped)
1 Harman-Kardon Citation 16
1 Crown DC-300A

The Crown amp sounds best with these, IMO.

The analog signal comes from a Lucid DA9624, fed by a M-Audio Audiophile 2496 AES/EBU output. All music is stored as files on a RAID5 array. I don't use this for watching TV. Listening to sound effects simply doesn't move me like music does.

I rip from CD using abcde, and play using Amarok. I store in the FLAC file format.

Awsomeclimber

01-11-10, 06:37 PM

Lamfada

01-11-10, 06:39 PM

this is an extremely interesting comment. did you listen for music or HT?

I was listening for music, although I am forced to admit to not having a demo disc with me. The dealer had the setups in two different rooms and grabbed a CD from the store music I believe. While I know it is not ideal, I was at least able to compare them on the same piece of music. They were both running off Denon 3808s (IIRC) and the Studios just seemed more "live" to me. Like they didn't try to do anything to the music. The Sigs appeared to have a distinct sound to them. Please don't get me wrong, I would have bought the Sigs as well because I thought they sounded great. Now I again have to caveat this by saying that I was not intimately familiar with the music and it is entirely possible that I got it backwards. But for me, that day in the showroom, the Studios just sounded better - I even went back and forth for over an hour because I couldn't believe it!
Of course, the Sigs were less expensive but they got some of my money anyway. I just ordered a Sub 12 once I decided on the Studios and this is something I was going to wait to do.
Just one person's experience, and I make no claims to have a "trained ear" or anything like that. I based my decision solely on what sounded right to me. Once I got them home, I think they are fantastic and would do it all over again.

-Lam

Lamfada

01-11-10, 06:41 PM

Maybe you have or had an ear infection (ruptured TM?)..I would recommend an ENT(Ear,Nose,Throat) specialist in your area, but I'm not sure of your location.. May have been something a simple Val Salva could have fixed, plug your nose close mouth and get your ears to pop...Possibly, and more logically I would attribute it to a common condition known as "Lagena Cochlear Wallititis" where the cochlear extends down to far as to interfere with vibration eminating from one's wallet....:eek:

Seriously,
they're both great speakers and you can't go wrong with either.... :)

Hahaha - That is certainly possible! I never claimed to be able to hear well ;-)

-Lam

Stylz25

01-11-10, 06:45 PM

osofast240sx

01-11-10, 06:47 PM

What AVR do you guys recommend for sound and powering a Paradigm Monitor 11 5.1 system for now? I have the Onkyo 807 in the basement but am thinking more and more if I could have a better AVR to suit the Paradigms?? thx for the info.the new anthem ones comming out in the spring:D

Stylz25

01-11-10, 07:44 PM

the new anthem ones comming out in the spring:D

You think I should return my Onkyo 807 and wait for HDMI 1.4?? I can wait a bit longer since all the CES 2010 is all about 3D and you need HDMI 1.4 or just keep my 807?

lt5686

01-11-10, 07:45 PM

Would the Phantom V3's ($198/pr) be a good start as the 2 front speakers when building a system?

I'm basically looking for something that is better than your average Best Buy speaker, but I am not as discerning that I need to spend $600+ per speaker.

Thanks

rnrgagne

01-11-10, 08:15 PM

Stylz25

01-11-10, 08:35 PM

I'd try it first, if you feel you need something more then go look. I don't see any reason why it wouldn't be up to the task. It has Audyssey MultEQ XT doesn't it?

It just has Audyssey MultEQ not the XT version......just wondering if I should get one that has that and other features but I don't need a 9.2 or 9.3 AVR for sure! lol hmmmm

rnrgagne

01-11-10, 08:47 PM

Just one person's experience, and I make no claims to have a "trained ear" or anything like that. I based my decision solely on what sounded right to me. Once I got them home, I think they are fantastic and would do it all over again.

-Lam

No reason to be defensive. Showrooms often suck for auditioning speakers. It always surprises me how poorly they set things up sometimes. Before I bought the Sig S8's I thought I'd pop into my local dealer and have a listen to the Studio 100 v.5's, they were set up in a dedicated room with an Anthem front end. But for some reason they had them stuffed in the corners.
I have a good friend that works there, (he obviously had nothing to do setting them up) and when we fired them up we both got up, without a word being said, to move them away from the corners because they sounded like crap. I wonder how many sales they lost because of that..:rolleyes:

Once placed closer to where they should be I got a much better feel for what they're capable of. The Studio line offers outstanding performance for the buck.

mjpearce023

01-11-10, 08:48 PM

Stylz25

01-11-10, 09:05 PM

2 quick questions- 1) Should I have an AVR that does Audyssey MultEQ XT or is MultEQ good enough??? (going with Monitor 11 Paradigm 5.1 system for now)
2) Do you guys recommend 12 gauge wire for all speakers or just the longer runs??(rears/surrounds)

Thanks.

Stylz25

01-12-10, 12:03 AM

Wondering if the Onkyo 807 AVR will be a good match power wise also for the monitor 11 5.1 system?? What AVR are you guys using to power your Paradigms and what do u guys recommend?

osofast240sx

01-12-10, 12:46 AM

osofast240sx

01-12-10, 12:48 AM

Wondering if the Onkyo 807 AVR will be a good match power wise also for the monitor 11 5.1 system?? What AVR are you guys using to power your Paradigms and what do u guys recommend?807 good
1007 better
5007 would be ideal

CODzilla

01-12-10, 01:26 AM

Recently my Klipsch Synergy C-3 Center channels mid-basses blew out so I was in the market for a new center. I read online about how great Paradigm speakers are and went to a local dealer and checked them out. The Monitor CC-290 v6 was pretty darn amazing. I got it for $450 [I don't know if thats a good deal or not]. I am eagerly awaiting the shop to get it in tomorrow to go pick it up because they didnt have it in black ash .

We auditioned it at the dealer and the voice coming from the center sounded so natural and clean and crisp it was amazing. Or maybe i forgot how a HT setup sounds with a center channel haha. Anyway, I can't sleep because I just want this thing in my living room already.
Good day all.

My setup isnt showing up yet, I guess because I'm a new member but

Center : Paradigm CC-290 v6
Fronts : Klipsch Synergy F-3
Rear : Klipsch Synergy S-3
Sub : Klipsch Synergy Sub-12
Receiver : Onkyo TX-NR901

Pair4Dimes

01-12-10, 02:02 AM

Awesome... now get rid of the other Klipsch stuff and you are in the club! !:D

..Just kidding... Congrats!

Lamfada

01-12-10, 06:49 AM

No reason to be defensive. Showrooms often suck for auditioning speakers. It always surprises me how poorly they set things up sometimes. Before I bought the Sig S8's I thought I'd pop into my local dealer and have a listen to the Studio 100 v.5's, they were set up in a dedicated room with an Anthem front end. But for some reason they had them stuffed in the corners.
I have a good friend that works there, (he obviously had nothing to do setting them up) and when we fired them up we both got up, without a word being said, to move them away from the corners because they sounded like crap. I wonder how many sales they lost because of that..:rolleyes:

Once placed closer to where they should be I got a much better feel for what they're capable of. The Studio line offers outstanding performance for the buck.

I'm sorry if that came across as being defensive, I definitely didn't mean it that way. I was just kind of posting that I was very happy with the Studios. Oddly enough, I did end up with a Sig center channel at the dealer's recommendation. I think he was simply trying to move one he had in stock, but I was happy with the way it sounded when paired with the 100's. The setup was most likely the cuplrit because I still believe that the Sigs are the better speaker. Of course, I not complaining about spending half as much! Although I have to admit that I'm curious to hear them set up properly now with an Anthem front end. Then again, maybe I shouldn't since my credit card is crying uncle right now. ;-)

-Lam

Stylz25

01-12-10, 10:34 AM

if you serious about your HT then yes MultiEq XT.
12awg always.

Really XT is worth the money? I am just concerned about spending 2000 on an AVR when I will upgrade in a couple years since all this HDMI 1.4 and 3D talk is going to come out with new AVR's,......hmmmmm anyone else have an opinion if I should get XT and if you can tell the diff between XT and just MultEQ?

osofast240sx

01-12-10, 10:53 AM

Stylz25

01-12-10, 11:05 AM

how big is your room?

I think its about 16' by 14' is the listening area but my basement room is 20' by 18' or so.....

Stylz25

01-12-10, 11:29 AM

rnrgagne

01-12-10, 11:39 AM

Really XT is worth the money? I am just concerned about spending 2000 on an AVR when I will upgrade in a couple years since all this HDMI 1.4 and 3D talk is going to come out with new AVR's,......hmmmmm anyone else have an opinion if I should get XT and if you can tell the diff between XT and just MultEQ?

XT has the same resolution for the subs as the standard MultEQ, but has 8 x the resolution for the rest of the speakers. The benefit of XT over MultEQ will be largley room dependent but, I would still put it at the top of my feature list if I were shopping today... even with a good room.

You have the 807, and it should be able to handle everything until the 1.4 units come out, and I don't think you'll have to spend $2k to get XT. Go to Audyssey's website they've got a listing of units with XT.. you can use that as a guide.

rnrgagne

01-12-10, 11:45 AM

Does anybody know if a Denon 1608 with 75 watts x7 would be enough power for some studio 20s v3 or up. I dont have a sub so they would be run as large. My room is 11 by 13 and I listen pretty loud to 2 channel music and movies.

That's a small enough room that it should be fine. I don't know if the 1608 has a bi-amp option but that's something to consider using if it does.

Stylz25

01-12-10, 12:15 PM

XT has the same resolution for the subs as the standard MultEQ, but has 8 x the resolution for the rest of the speakers. The benefit of XT over MultEQ will be largley room dependent but, I would still put it at the top of my feature list if I were shopping today... even with a good room.

You have the 807, and it should be able to handle everything until the 1.4 units come out, and I don't think you'll have to spend $2k to get XT. Go to Audyssey's website they've got a listing of units with XT.. you can use that as a guide.

Anyone know when the HDMI 1.4 units will be coming out? I think I am just going to take back my Onkyo 807 and then wait things out and do more research!

Kai Winters

01-12-10, 12:28 PM

What AVR are you guys using to power and run your Monitor Series of Paradigm?? Wondering since I am going to get the Monitor 11 5.1 system for now and really need opinions and info on the AVR to match them without spending like 2000 on an AVR for more of a midrange set of speakers....even though they sound amazing for so called midrange! haha I have the Onkyo 807 right now in my basement but I can still take it back and get a new AVR! Thx guys

Currently using a Pioneer Elite VSX-21THX...just got it 3 weeks ago and absolutely love it...previous avr was a 4 year old Yamaha RX-659...also did a great job...both have plenty of power...easily ear bleeding level with no clipping...also have a Monitor 11/5.1 system.

Stylz25

01-12-10, 12:32 PM

Currently using a Pioneer Elite VSX-21THX...just got it 3 weeks ago and absolutely love it...previous avr was a 4 year old Yamaha RX-659...also did a great job...both have plenty of power...easily ear bleeding level with no clipping...also have a Monitor 11/5.1 system.

Nice I heard the Pioneer Elites do sound very good! I am thinking of taking my Onkyo back and waiting a bit longer.....not sure why but it bugs me so much about all this HDMI 1.4 new AVR's coming out soon....happens with everything these days as technology improves so fast!

Dragon Reborn

01-12-10, 03:00 PM

Okay,
So I got my Special Edition's last night. I went with the SE3's for my fronts and the SE3 as my center.

So, has anybody else had a chance to review these speakers yet?

There seems to be a lot of conflicting info out there about this product line, including Paradigm's own website, magazine reviewers (Home Theater, Feb. 2010, review by Mark Fleischmann), and AVSforum user J Ritt. According to Mark Fleischmann, he mentioned that the SE3's have the G-PAL tweeter from the Studio line, but then he goes on to mention: "According to my company contact, Paradigm made these driver choices late in the design cycle, so you may see conflicting information in printed or online literature—including the manual." On Paradigm's website, they state that the SE3's have the H-PTD tweeter on one web page, and then on another page that they have the G-PAL. J Ritt states that they have the H-PTD.

Sooooooo, please correct this statement if I'm wrong ...

The Special Edition 3's have the Monitor series tweeter (H-PTD), and the Studio series mid-range and bass drivers.

So they are most similar to the Monitor 7's (in terms of design) with improved bass drivers, no?

Again, any additional reviews would be extremely helpful as there isn't a local dealer in my area that has them in the showroom. Thanks!

Awsomeclimber

01-12-10, 04:42 PM

THIS PARADIGM SUBWOOFER IS SOLD AS FAULTY.

THIS IS A TOP OF THE RANGE UNIT WHICH RETAILED AT AROUND AU$2000.
THE ULTRACUBE 12 HAS A 12 INCH SPEAKER.

THE FAULT IS THAT WHEN YOU TURN IT ON ,THE SPEAKER JUST MAKES A LOUD THUMPING SOUND.

THIS UNIT NEEDS TO BE REPAIRED BY THE PARADIGM REPAIR AGENTS.

Has this been covered here allready.. Is it common, rare, is it just STUFFED? Cheers, Derek.

Good morning.. The seller tells me it happened after a black out..

Any thoughts on "why" and can it be fixed cheaply? Thanks, Derek.

stephenmcgauley

01-12-10, 06:39 PM

So, has anybody else had a chance to review these speakers yet?

There seems to be a lot of conflicting info out there about this product line, including Paradigm's own website, magazine reviewers (Home Theater, Feb. 2010, review by Mark Fleischmann), and AVSforum user J Ritt. According to Mark Fleischmann, he mentioned that the SE3's have the G-PAL tweeter from the Studio line, but then he goes on to mention: "According to my company contact, Paradigm made these driver choices late in the design cycle, so you may see conflicting information in printed or online literature—including the manual." On Paradigm's website, they state that the SE3's have the H-PTD tweeter on one web page, and then on another page that they have the G-PAL. J Ritt states that they have the H-PTD.

Sooooooo, please correct this statement if I'm wrong ...

The Special Edition 3's have the Monitor series tweeter (H-PTD), and the Studio series mid-range and bass drivers.

So they are most similar to the Monitor 7's (in terms of design) with improved bass drivers, no?

Again, any additional reviews would be extremely helpful as there isn't a local dealer in my area that has them in the showroom. Thanks!
The se series uses all the same components as the studio series. The article states tha the final build if the speakers do indeed have the gpal tweeter along with the same midrange driver as the studio series. If you look at the pictures in te article you can slearly see that the tweeter and the phase plug are both gold same as the studio series. I also confirmed these specs with my dealer in st louis they said " they are the same drivers as the studio 10 in the se1 and the se3 drivers are the same as the studio 60, only in a different cabinet more similar to the cabinet in the monitor line" hope this cleared thins up as far as the se series goes

Dragon Reborn

01-12-10, 07:47 PM

The se series uses all the same components as the studio series. The article states tha the final build if the speakers do indeed have the gpal tweeter along with the same midrange driver as the studio series. If you look at the pictures in te article you can slearly see that the tweeter and the phase plug are both gold same as the studio series. I also confirmed these specs with my dealer in st louis they said " they are the same drivers as the studio 10 in the se1 and the se3 drivers are the same as the studio 60, only in a different cabinet more similar to the cabinet in the monitor line" hope this cleared thins up as far as the se series goes

Thanks for the info. Clear as mud, as they say. ;) Except that your info seems to contradict J Ritt's own experience when he received his SE3's, specifically, whether or not it has the G-PAL tweeter. :confused:

----------------

On another note, in my setup, would I be better off with Studio 20s or Studio 60s/SE3s? From my (basic) understanding, would the advantages that floorstanding speakers offer be negated by my necessary speaker placement?

In this pic, you can see that the LR speakers would be against the side wall of the shadow box, and the back of all 3 speakers would be very close the wall.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2518/4139379977_0d9b997f43_b.jpg

mmcelyea

01-12-10, 11:11 PM

The se series uses all the same components as the studio series. The article states tha the final build if the speakers do indeed have the gpal tweeter along with the same midrange driver as the studio series. If you look at the pictures in te article you can slearly see that the tweeter and the phase plug are both gold same as the studio series. I also confirmed these specs with my dealer in st louis they said " they are the same drivers as the studio 10 in the se1 and the se3 drivers are the same as the studio 60, only in a different cabinet more similar to the cabinet in the monitor line" hope this cleared thins up as far as the se series goes

Not to add confusion but i have seen the s3 and the tweeter looks exactly the same as the one in the monitor series. The midrange looks like a studio series. That was what I thought was announced also. The cabinet is more like the studio as it is a real wood veneer not vinyl like the monitor.

stephenmcgauley

01-12-10, 11:15 PM

Thanks for the info. Clear as mud, as they say. ;) Except that your info seems to contradict J Ritt's own experience when he received his SE3's, specifically, whether or not it has the G-PAL tweeter. :confused:

----------------

On another note, in my setup, would I be better off with Studio 20s or Studio 60s/SE3s? From my (basic) understanding, would the advantages that floorstanding speakers offer be negated by my necessary speaker placement?

In this pic, you can see that the LR speakers would be against the side wall of the shadow box, and the back of all 3 speakers would be very close the wall.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2518/4139379977_0d9b997f43_b.jpg
As far as the tweeter goes if paradigm is publishing in THE home theater magazine the specification of "G-PAL or gold-anodized pure aluminum" tweeter then that must be the correct specification or the author of the article would have no credibility at all. So I must trust the article and my dealer over someone on the forums, no offense J Ritt's just looking at facts.

I think that the studio 20's would be fine for your room, unless you really think you will gain that much from the larger towers but in all reality it looks like you already have 2 monster subs that can take car of the bass for you. Also if you put a taller speaker like the studio 60 you will then be raising the height of the tweeter which will affect the sound depending on your seating arrangement.

Dathon

01-13-10, 12:27 AM

Thanks for the info. Clear as mud, as they say. ;) Except that your info seems to contradict J Ritt's own experience when he received his SE3's, specifically, whether or not it has the G-PAL tweeter. :confused:

Here is a definitive answer, straight from the horse's mouth. Skip to around 5:25. The Paradigm guy says that they use G-PAL dome tweeter. Which corresponds to the specs on their website.

Cedia 2009 - Paradigm Booth tour (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2Oo8RHSJDM&feature=related)

WOLVERNOLE

01-13-10, 12:36 AM

csj0952

01-13-10, 02:37 AM

chester aldrid

01-13-10, 10:31 AM

osofast240sx,

what units have the xt installed.

chester

osofast240sx

01-13-10, 10:43 AM

osofast240sx,

what units have the xt installed.

chester

onkyo NR1007, NR3007, NR5007, PR-SC5507
NAD T175, T785,T775, T765
Denon 4810

WRXpilot

01-13-10, 11:02 AM

Question about Paradigm's dealer network; is there anywhere I can find a list of authorized dealers in my area?

The dealer locator on Paradigm's website is (purposefully, it seems) obtuse, and will only show me a single dealer when I put in my ZIP code. Unfortunately, that dealer has some very negative reviews when I Googled them, which doesn't make me very eager to give them my business.

I'm interested in a set of the entry-level Atom monitors, but Paradigm sure doesn't make it easy to actually buy their products.

rnrgagne

01-13-10, 11:29 AM

dryeye

01-13-10, 12:48 PM

Question about Paradigm's dealer network; is there anywhere I can find a list of authorized dealers in my area?

Just plug in some other local zip codes. Try this site for some help to find other zips near you. http://maps.huge.info/zip.htm

Need4spdnb

01-13-10, 01:09 PM

Question, I listened to the studio 20s, I fell in love with them. My pocket book didn't though.

I need 3 speakers for an upstairs apt that is 22ft by 15ft with high ceilings. No sub cause it's upstairs. I don't listen to alot of boomy hiphop, mostly rock and acoustic.

Will I be screwed if I go with the Studio 10s over the Studio 20s? :/

Also, should I have no problem driving these speakers with a Onkyo 707?

They are quoting me 1399 for the 10s (sell for 800 a pair separate) and the cc-490, I feel like I'm getting screwed there too.... :(

I might end up going with the B&W 685 which seems similar but for a heck of a lot less cost.

Also, if i want to keep the stands under $250 for the pair, what would you guys recommend? I know it's personal preference but what do you guys think looks good? I'd like to get some ideas....

The studio 10's have pretty good bass dynamics, considering how small they are. Of course, having good electronics helps, but I was pleasantly surprised at their bass output and clarity. Retail for the studio 10s and cc490 is $1600, so you are getting a pretty decent discount. As for stands, you could do the S series speaker stands from Paradigm. They have different heights (18,22,26,30" tall) and they retail for 150 a pair. They would work for the studio 10s.

As for the studio series vs, the B&W 6 series, do a search, many prefer the Paradigm's. To me, the 6 series looks like they have come straight from China with a premium price tag.

Where are you located at?

Dragon Reborn

01-13-10, 01:12 PM

Here is a definitive answer, straight from the horse's mouth. Skip to around 5:25. The Paradigm guy says that they use G-PAL dome tweeter. Which corresponds to the specs on their website.

The se series uses all the same components as the studio series. The article states tha the final build if the speakers do indeed have the gpal tweeter along with the same midrange driver as the studio series. If you look at the pictures in te article you can slearly see that the tweeter and the phase plug are both gold same as the studio series. I also confirmed these specs with my dealer in st louis they said " they are the same drivers as the studio 10 in the se1 and the se3 drivers are the same as the studio 60, only in a different cabinet more similar to the cabinet in the monitor line" hope this cleared thins up as far as the se series goes

Thanks for your input, folks. I took another look at the Home Theater mag article, and yes, the pictures of the tweeters do look like they are gold, so they must be the Studio-type G-PAL tweeters.

If so, the Special Edition series seems to represent a good blend of the Monitor and Studio lines, price-wise and tech-wise, no?

Need4spdnb

01-13-10, 01:14 PM

Doing some "historical research" on the Studio 60's, I noted that they use to have a 7" speaker for mid and a 7" for bass. That has been changed to twin 5 1/2" bass and a same-sized 5 1/2" mid. Can someone familiar with both V.ersions explain the practical difference now, in sound? Was this clearly an improvement?:eek:
Thanks for insight !

The big design difference between the V5 and V4 is the size of the cabinet. It is not nearly as deep as it used to be. The V4 studio 60 and 100 looked almost identical, aside from the extra bass drivers in the 100. They made the v5 60 have a much smaller footprint. It isn't nearly as wide or as deep, so the driver size had to decrease. That being said, the new v5 drivers have more output than the v4, so they were able to get pretty much the same performance while making the speaker sleeker. We had the v5 studio 60s on display for a while when they came out, and previously the v4 studio 60's. I didn't hear anything that lead me to believe they took a step backwards with their drivers. In fact, I felt they imaged much better than the previous version. The new cabinets also have curved backs, like the sigs, as opposed to boxed ones like the V4 studios.

Need4spdnb

01-13-10, 01:21 PM

What AVR are you guys using to power and run your Monitor Series of Paradigm?? Wondering since I am going to get the Monitor 11 5.1 system for now and really need opinions and info on the AVR to match them without spending like 2000 on an AVR for more of a midrange set of speakers....even though they sound amazing for so called midrange! haha I have the Onkyo 807 right now in my basement but I can still take it back and get a new AVR! Thx guys

The nice thing about the monitor series is that all the speakers are highly efficient, so it doesn't take a whole lot of power to make them sing. I would say any receiver with over 90watts a channel should do the trick. It all depends on what sub you are using, crossover levels, and how loud you listen. If you have a capable sub, crossing the speakers and sub at 80hz, and listen loud, you will be fine. If you listen loud and run the tower full range, you may want some more power.

csj0952

01-13-10, 02:35 PM

The studio 10's have pretty good bass dynamics, considering how small they are. Of course, having good electronics helps, but I was pleasantly surprised at their bass output and clarity. Retail for the studio 10s and cc490 is $1600, so you are getting a pretty decent discount. As for stands, you could do the S series speaker stands from Paradigm. They have different heights (18,22,26,30" tall) and they retail for 150 a pair. They would work for the studio 10s.

As for the studio series vs, the B&W 6 series, do a search, many prefer the Paradigm's. To me, the 6 series looks like they have come straight from China with a premium price tag.

Where are you located at?

I'm in Rochester, NY. I'm still worried that the Studio 10s that they aren't big enough for my room. My dealer has Studio 20s, not 10s. CC-490 compared to HTM61 (bigger than the 62)? I've heard the CC-590 blows BW out of the water....

Also, I have an Onkyo 707, is that good enough or should I consider a pair of SE speakers from Paradigm?

audiodaze74

01-13-10, 03:32 PM

they dont have the Studio 10s...thats odd. When will they be getting them in? every Paradigm dealer i went to had the 10s. Is that the only store around in say a 1 hour radius?

Stylz25

01-13-10, 03:57 PM

osofast240sx

01-13-10, 04:24 PM

Stylz25

01-13-10, 04:32 PM

the Audyssey will not let the 11's over power the 290's:)

Good to know!! Even just having Audyssey MultEQ should be good?? I know alot of my friends are telling me to get an AVR with Audyssey MultEq XT

osofast240sx

01-13-10, 04:49 PM

Good to know!! Even just having Audyssey MultEQ should be good?? I know alot of my friends are telling me to get an AVR with Audyssey MultEq XTeven the 607 with the 2EQ
707/807 with the MultiEQ
1007/3007/5007 MultiEQ XT

Stylz25

01-13-10, 04:51 PM

even the 607 with the 2EQ
707/807 with the MultiEQ
1007/3007/5007 MultiEQ XT

You think MultEQ would be good enough for me or would you recommend the 1007 that has MultEQ XT?? its another 500 bucks for the 1007 here compared to the 807 so I am not sure if its worth it and I dont need 9.2 AVR but I do like some of the added features! XT....THX Ultra to name a few

osofast240sx

01-13-10, 04:58 PM

You think MultEQ would be good enough for me or would you recommend the 1007 that has MultEQ XT?? its another 500 bucks for the 1007 here compared to the 807 so I am not sure if its worth it and I dont need 9.2 AVR but I do like some of the added features! XT....THX Ultra to name a fewIf i had a choice of being my main receiver between the 807 vs. the 1007. if it were me i would get the 1007 and bi amp the monitor 11's. GET the 1007 and don't look back:)

Need4spdnb

01-13-10, 05:07 PM

I'm in Rochester, NY. I'm still worried that the Studio 10s that they aren't big enough for my room. My dealer has Studio 20s, not 10s. CC-490 compared to HTM61 (bigger than the 62)? I've heard the CC-590 blows BW out of the water....

Also, I have an Onkyo 707, is that good enough or should I consider a pair of SE speakers from Paradigm?

The studio 10's might have a harder time in a room that size depending on your listening levels, you would probably be better off with the 20's but they are considerably more. And yes, the 590 blows the B&W out of the water.

If price is an issue, you could drop down to the SE speakers. We haven't sold many, but the customers that do have them love them. I would rather have studio's for a little bit more money and a sexier cabinet.

Dragon Reborn

01-13-10, 05:27 PM

If price is an issue, you could drop down to the SE speakers. We haven't sold many, but the customers that do have them love them. I would rather have studio's for a little bit more money and a sexier cabinet.

Other than the "sexier cabinet" (which I don't need ... in my setup, the speakers would be hidden), do you see any other HUGE advantage that the Studio 60s would have over the Special Edition 3s? My dealer mentioned that the rounded cabinet makes it sound better, but the extra $$$ for the Studio 60s may not fit my budget.

stephenmcgauley

01-13-10, 05:51 PM

Other than the "sexier cabinet" (which I don't need ... in my setup, the speakers would be hidden), do you see any other HUGE advantage that the Studio 60s would have over the Special Edition 3s? My dealer mentioned that the rounded cabinet makes it sound better, but the extra $$$ for the Studio 60s may not fit my budget.
It really would come down to listening to them and seeing if there really is a 500 dollar sound difference. I am sure there is some sound difference but I would be willing to guess that it is very very small and will hardly be that noticeable when doing a side by side test, and remember in a month you will forget that the 60's sounded a hint better, but you will have to wait to here them. I too am waiting for my dealer to get them so I can hear them.

peter_vfr

01-13-10, 07:15 PM

osofast240sx

01-13-10, 07:18 PM

it's the Titans I'm using as surrounds that are abit over the top!:pnothing a pair of ADP390's cant solve:D

csj0952

01-13-10, 07:43 PM

Has anyone heard the Paradigm SE bookshelves? How do they sound? I'm tempted on them since the Studio center channel is breaking my bank and the Atoms won't fill my 22x15 room with high ceilings I think....

Also still a contender is B&W 685 + CM-Center channel for 1100.

drumsky

01-13-10, 08:28 PM

okay, it's time i joined The Family. :D

i scored a 3.1 rig for the den just before football season started - Studio 40 v4s and a matching CC-590 on closeout from my local dealer. got a great deal, and i couldn't be happier. here's how i got there...

i bought my first decent set of speakers in january, 2005 - an Energy Connoisseur 5.0 set-up that i was VERY happy with and still remember fondly. mother nature being who she is, and the Army Corps of Engineers being who THEY are, my speakers and everything else on my "ground floor"/basement went swimming in 6 feet of "water" on august 29th, 2005. in case you don't know, i live IN new orleans. yep.... :(

when we finally got back into the upstairs of our house, i would've replaced my Connoisseurs but they had been discontinued and the new lines were all rear ported, which doesn't work for me as all my fronts go in a built-in cabinet in the "upstairs" den. after reading a lot here about what was available with a front port, i bought some PSB Image B25 bookshelves, unheard, off the web and was VERY happy with my purchase (thank you, PRAudio ). finally, this last summer, we had a few bucks layin' around and i got the green light to upgrade from the wife.

i did a LOT of listening locally and narrowed it down to 2 choices - B&W 600s and Paradigm Studios (i found out that my local Paradigm dealer also carried PSB so i could make a direct comparison, which i did, and i LOVED the Studios). when the Studio v4 went on "sale" due to the arrival of the v5 models, that sweetened the deal.

the day of the purchase, i TOOK MY WIFE with me (;)) to both dealers, along with my PSBs to compare at the B&W dealer.

the difference between the PSBs and the B&W 685s was definitely noticeable, but more subtle than we both felt the price difference justified (the B&W dealer here has always been tight LOL). we both felt that we'd have to step up to the CM Series to really notice a HUGE difference, and they were both significantly more expensive AND rear-ported.

when we then went to the paradigm dealer, the difference was MUCH larger... TO US. my wife, god bless her, noticed it RIGHT away, and was blown away.

she immediately said "let's buy these... TODAY!!!" :D

they were only about $500 more than the 685s for the fronts and about 300 more for the center. believe me, i have no buyers' remorse WHATSOEVER. best money i've ever spent.

the only problem i've had is that the CC-590 is so damm big that it totally torqued the wall unit shelf it sat on! :eek: as a result, i'm running 2.1 right now. i was originally intending to keep these bad boys in my den, use in-ceiling SA-10s for surrounds (sofa is up against wall), and get something better downstairs when i refinish my basement (still a ways away, post-Katrina :(). but really, the 40/590 combo will work GREAT, and also fulfill my goal of NEVER putting any HT stuff downstairs (except for TV and sub) that i can't carry upstairs by myself if another storm comes.

right now, i'm driving them with a denon 2310ci receiver, a denon 2010 bluray unit, and running an Energy S10.3 sub. all of those will STAY in the den, and be used with the speakers which replace the studios (i did like my PSB images for what they were, and something along those lines will be fine as part of a 5.1 system in the den - my wife will be using it 90% of the time anyway, once the basement is done LOL).

in my perfect world, after i finish my basement HT space i score a couple pair of either studio 20 v4s (if i can find them) or perhaps the new SE 1s to finish out the system. from what i've read recently in this thread, they have studio drivers, and are wall-mountable. this will be powered by something MUCH more substantial than my 2310. i may go back to onkyo (NR series), although the NAD carried by my dealer which he used to drive my 40s when i bought them sounded amazing. TBD.

and of course i'll need a MAJOR improvement in my subwoofage. the energy is actually damm good, for what it is (got it from vanns for 200 beans - can't complain about THAT), and will serve the DEN well. but i'm thinking more along the lines of DUAL ULS-15s. ;)

and finally, the room that used to be my drum studio (my drumming days are over for now, but THAT is a different, very long post LOL) will be turned into the 2-channel listening room. might just be time to get a set of Sigs for that if i can swing it. :cool:

in summation, i'm now a proud member of The Paradigm Family, and i couldn't be happier. :cool:

ps - my wife and i watched The Soloist on bluray last weekend, a good movie with a great classical score. halfway through, she remarked "these speakers REALLY sound great, hon. i'm really glad we bought them".

got love THAT!!! :rolleyes:

JohnGZ28

01-13-10, 08:34 PM

dchaves

01-13-10, 09:31 PM

I'm having trouble finding a good stereo amplifier for a pair of Studio 20's. Can anyone make some suggestions?

Kartoon2005

01-13-10, 09:37 PM

Can someone recommend me some bookshelf speakers under $400? either new or used is fine.

nelson57

01-13-10, 11:00 PM

okay, it's time i joined The Family. :D:

Congrats, welcome to the family, and enjoy!

Kai Winters

01-13-10, 11:23 PM

I am getting the Monitor 11(pair),ADP-390(pair),DSP-3200 and the CC-290.....you guys think the 11's are too much the the CC-290?? I cant fit or have a place for the CC-390....hope the 11's dont over power that center! any info appreciated guess thats what tweaking is for on the AVR's

I have the 11's with a 290 and use Atoms for surrounds with a PDR-12 sub.
The 11's and cc290 are a very good match in my opinion...I am very happy with the balance.
I also have Titans...daughter has them, and the Monitor 3's...son has those lol...I'd rather have the 3's for my surrounds but my wife gives me the "side eye" but accepts the Atoms...LOL...no complaints though, I love the Atoms.

ayrton

01-14-10, 12:13 AM

okay, it's time i joined The Family. :D

got love THAT!!! :rolleyes:

Great choice in speakers and wife. ;) Some aren't as smart as yours.
Welcome to the group.
You might try placing pontoons under your new Paradigms for the next flood. :D

WOLVERNOLE

01-14-10, 12:38 AM

Thanks need4....
Yea, when I was looking at Studio 60 reviews, I thought "Hey. its getting smaller than the earlier version !" but maybe in fact with the TWO 5 1/2" bass, it'll be tight yet bigger sounding than ONE 7" as in the last model (version).

I'd be replacing Def Tech towers w/ the built-in side-firing sub. I'll bet most folks would say "Paradigm over Def Tech" but it is hard to drop the built-in subs as they provided a nice bass fill, with a small footsize. I really do like both Def Tech, but especially Paradigm products.

The big design difference between the V5 and V4 is the size of the cabinet. It is not nearly as deep as it used to be. The V4 studio 60 and 100 looked almost identical, aside from the extra bass drivers in the 100. They made the v5 60 have a much smaller footprint. It isn't nearly as wide or as deep, so the driver size had to decrease. That being said, the new v5 drivers have more output than the v4, so they were able to get pretty much the same performance while making the speaker sleeker. We had the v5 studio 60s on display for a while when they came out, and previously the v4 studio 60's. I didn't hear anything that lead me to believe they took a step backwards with their drivers. In fact, I felt they imaged much better than the previous version. The new cabinets also have curved backs, like the sigs, as opposed to boxed ones like the V4 studios.

BigSwede

01-14-10, 02:03 AM

Trying to complete my 5.1 set-up, after a couple year delay due to basement renovation cost overruns! Just picked up a used CC-470 (v3) to go with my Studio 20s (v1 or 2?) and now working on some in-ceiling rears and a sub (I'm driving them w/ a Denon AVR-2807).

So, some questions that I'd appreciate your feedback on ...
1) how critical is "matching" the in-ceiling rears to the LCRs, mostly for movies (I don't anticipate doing much SACD / 5.1 music listening)?
2) am I correct in my understanding that the SA-15Rs would most closely match the Studio 20s? Where does the AMS series fall - in line w/ the Monitors?
3) Do you think the AMS (100 or 150) would be sufficient or is it too big of a trade off from the SAs? I'm trying to minimize cost so I can cross the 5.1 finish line!!
4) Any SUB suggestions - I'm really a sub newbie? Saw a used PS1000 on Audiogon but seem to read better reviews/comments about SVS and HSU vs. Paradigm on AVS and Audioholics.

I'd really appreciate your suggestions and / or advice!

BigSwede

01-14-10, 02:32 AM

btw, I thought I'd mention, that the sub will be used 50/50 or maybe 60/40 Movies - Music, so I do want a sub that will do well for 2.1 music listening.
Thanks!

The1stCav

01-14-10, 09:41 AM

I know too well the saying about opinions, however for what its worth, IMO I think the Studio's blow B&W away in many ways. I went and demo'd the B&W CM and 6 Series several times before I went and listened to the Studio 60's - I bought the 60's the same day I demo'd them. Point being I had no doubt which sounded better for me and that was the Paradigms - plus they are simply sexier. Now that I have the Studio 100's, 60's, and CC-590 (wishing I had the CC-690), I can say from my perspective - Paradigm's are several steps above the B&W's.

The1stCav

01-14-10, 09:55 AM

4) Any SUB suggestions - I'm really a sub newbie? Saw a used PS1000 on Audiogon but seem to read better reviews/comments about SVS and HSU vs. Paradigm on AVS and Audioholics.

I had never purchased or researched sub woofers before this build/purchase I did a few months ago, so I also did the list of questions here and many people were wonderful in helping me understand best bang for the buck options and so on.

I have to say on this question I am completely satisfied with the AV123 MFW-15's for sub woofers that I ended up purchasing. Last night I was watching Terminator Salvation and those (I got 2 of them) MFW-15's had the floor shaking, the sofa pulsing, (probably some upset neighbors as well in that mix) and me one happy movie watcher smiling because these sub's can handle it all. They use a lot of heavy low bass in that movie when the machines are in the scenes, and nothing was that "bad bass distortion" you get with lower end or poorly made sub woofers.

With music, I have never had anything but great Bass from these in 2.1 (well I think it would be 2.2 wouldn't it?). Seriously, from Diana Krall and Katie Meula to the Black Eyed Peas to Breaking Benjamin and Metallica, these simply hold their own at low volume to....well the "let's pray the neighbors aren't calling the cops" volume - I have been very happy with these at any volume level. They do just compliment those Studio 100's well.

For the price they are getting for the dual MFW-15's, they are very affordable when comparing to others and considering price/performance. They even came shipped with their own cotton slip covers.

http://hphotos-snc3.fbcdn.net/hs005.snc3/11235_1315398806422_1274259934_950440_1207076_n.jpg

http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs239.snc3/22665_1322261857994_1274259934_971992_736901_n.jpg

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs239.snc3/22665_1322264098050_1274259934_972042_3611655_n.jpg

Dragon Reborn

01-14-10, 11:06 AM

http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs239.snc3/22665_1322261857994_1274259934_971992_736901_n.jpg

I really like the photos of your room transformation, especially the before:( and after:D pics.

The1stCav

01-14-10, 12:26 PM

stephenmcgauley

01-14-10, 02:02 PM

raycer

01-14-10, 06:23 PM

I recently bought a pair of Monitor 7's v.6 off of Audiogon and am having a strange problem. When I ran Audessy on my Onkyo 705 I got an error message on the left front. I thought maybe I had wired it out of phase (unlikely, but things happen) so I switched the leads and got the same result. I then switched the speakers from right to left and got the same error message on the right front. The speaker seems to play fine, and generates the test tones, so I am at a loss as to what the problem may be. Any thoughts will be appreciated.

Dragon Reborn

01-14-10, 06:45 PM

Can anyone out there with a pair of the se 1s possibly write up a quick review? I spoke to my dealer and he said that they will not be displaying them because there is not enough floor space but said they sound wry close to the studio 20s? I find this hard to beleive sine they are specd identical to the studio 10s but he insisted that they sound closer to the studio 20s. I really like the studio 20s but if I can spend half the money for te se1s and get a similar sound sign me up.

Check out the current mag issue of Home Theater magazine (February 2010). Mark Fleischmann does a pretty thorough review of the SE1 + SEsub in a 5.1 setup. In short, he liked them a lot, giving the system full stars (if I remember correctly) for performance, value, and quality. I haven't seen any other online reviews for the SEs yet.:(

However, back in the Fall, 2009, there was some blind testing done where the SE1s supposedly outperformed $1000+ speakers:

http://www.cepro.com/article/paradigms_new_299_se_1_speaker_beats_1000_model_in_blind_lis tening_tests/D1/

I, too, wished that my local dealer had the Special Editions in the showroom. Unfortunately, I may have to rely on fellow AVSers and Mark Fleischman. My dealer has the Studio 60s, so I suppose I might be able to demo those to get a feel of what the SE3s would sound like. I am guessing that the SE3s are closer in sound to the Studio 60s than the Studio 20s.

Hopefully, more SE buyers will be able to post their experiences here! :o

karsty

01-14-10, 06:58 PM

Thanks - it was a lot of fun and I certainly enjoy music and movies now - where before it was a past time, now it is an experience! Took us 3-4 months total to get it all together, but well worth it. Now my wife wants to do the rest of the house..........I must figure out now how to wrangle enough out of her decorating money to get that CC-690 and explain to her why we need it so bad after just buying the CC-590. Not sure how that is going to go down, but that CC-590 is just too small and is like +3db higher than the rest of my speakers because it has to work harder than the 100's or 60's which actually ended up being negative DB numbers on the Pioneer SC-27 MCACC to balance the sound. In all though it was a very fun experience and now I am totally a Paradigm lover for life. Though my next house I will build a real HT and probably stock it with the Signatures and keep the Studio's for our den or something, either way those Studio's will always have a place in my heart as they are my first "Real" set of speakers I have ever owned.

Is the CC-690 even going to fit inside your new TV stand?!

schalliol

01-15-10, 12:51 AM

For what it's worth, I'm 1 week into my 60s with 690 and I have to say that I'm very impressed. As I mentioned before, I have a dual 12 push/pull MK sub. The v1 20s will go to the rear with the stands Paradigm sold for them at the time (filled with lead).

I have the system set up with an entertainment center (built a temp monitoing vent system for it) and the 690 aimed down slightly by placing layers of closed cell foam under the rear of the 690. I have the rosenut pair of 60s and chose the black ash 690. I'd anyone is interested in pics, please let me know.

boothy24

01-15-10, 02:04 AM

albireo13

01-15-10, 07:51 AM

Kai Winters

01-15-10, 08:42 AM

I'm currently in the process of upgrading my HT and trying to decide between the monitor or studio series for speakers.

Originally I had no plans for upgrading it but one of the channels on my old reciever started to crackle so I replaced it with a Yamaha RX-765 and also got a Yamaha YST-515 sub.
Once I hooked up the new reciever I could really hear how bad my old technincs speakers were and so here I am now.

My nearest dealer only has monitors to demo but i really like them.
My main question is whether my 765 reciever will be good enough to run the studios or whether I am better off going with the monitors, and hence save me a trip to hear some studios.
Studio setup: 20 or 60 front (undecided as yet), CC-490 centre, 10 rear.
Monitor setup: Monitor 7 front, CC-190 centre, Atom rear.

The reason for the smaller centre is for their height to fit my cabinet.

The 765 will run the Monitor line just fine. I was running Monitor 11's/cc290/Atoms and PDR-12 with a Yamaha 659 without a problem...plenty of power.

I suggest you go with the cc290 if able. I had/have the 190 and replaced it with the 290...when I was using only Monitor 3's for fronts... It was a major improvement, more pronounced dialogue, etc. well worth the cost.

If able I would suggest the Studio line...I got to listen to that line a few months ago and was impressed with the overall sound...wow...compared to the Monitor line, which also sounds great imo. Speakers you love can last well over a decade while a receiver generally has a shorter life span. The 765 should push the Studio's just fine...When I listened to them the shop was using a Marantz 6003? receiver and it was easily pushing the system.

RobBas

01-15-10, 09:51 AM

Thanks - it was a lot of fun and I certainly enjoy music and movies now - where before it was a past time, now it is an experience! Took us 3-4 months total to get it all together, but well worth it. Now my wife wants to do the rest of the house..........I must figure out now how to wrangle enough out of her decorating money to get that CC-690 and explain to her why we need it so bad after just buying the CC-590. Not sure how that is going to go down, but that CC-590 is just too small and is like +3db higher than the rest of my speakers because it has to work harder than the 100's or 60's which actually ended up being negative DB numbers on the Pioneer SC-27 MCACC to balance the sound. In all though it was a very fun experience and now I am totally a Paradigm lover for life. Though my next house I will build a real HT and probably stock it with the Signatures and keep the Studio's for our den or something, either way those Studio's will always have a place in my heart as they are my first "Real" set of speakers I have ever owned.

Nice post dude, I went from a Polk HTIB to v5 Studio 60's and a CC-690... I know one hell of a change and cost difference. I kind of feel the same way you do, hell I even added an SVS PB13 Ultra sub, yeah we went overboard but we do not regret it one bit. The difference in our BD, TV, music and gaming experience with that change is unmeasurable. I use my system everyday and we absolutely love it. Like you, I also plan in the next home to get some Sigs in a dedicated HT room.

rnrgagne

01-15-10, 11:28 AM

Hi,
Just ordered a pair of Studio 20s for my living room and am looking to order stands now. The Paradigm stands are too pricey for my.
Anyway, my question is .. what height stand is appropriate?

My feeling is to size them for the tweeter to be about ear level, for the listener sitting down. I measured this to be about 42-43" for me.
However, I won't have the speakers for another week or two so I can't measure the dimensions to the tweeter.

My gut feeling is maybe a 26" stand but, not sure. I'd like to order stands now, in order to have them when the speakers arrive.

Any help would be appreciated. What do other folks use?

Thanks,
Rob

If you go by Paradigms stands, the stands for the 20's or S2's are the J29's I had the J26's for my S4's. So I think you want 29" stands.

You're right though, you want the tweeters about ear height, and if you're seating isn't typical it might just require some math on your part to figure it out.

There is the option of "aiming" the tweeters to the listening position, by adjusting the stands' spikes. (If they're not too far off to begin with.)

J Ritt

01-15-10, 11:33 AM

Forgot to say...I'll also try snapping a couple of pics of the tweets in my ADP-390's, along with the tweets in my SE3's for comparison. Nothing like a good Friday conspiracy.:cool:

WOLVERNOLE

01-15-10, 11:40 AM

Frohlich

01-15-10, 11:45 AM

Probably means it can handle 350 watts peak but not something it could handle for a long period of time. I will say that from my experience adding a seperate amp helps with sounds stage and bass and will outperform the amps built into the receiver. I have a Denon 4810 but have a two channel amp to feed the left and right channels and did notice and improvement in sound (tighter bass, better soundstage,etc..). To get the most out of your studio 100s you would likely want a separate amp rated at least at 150wpc and more likely 200wpc will give them all they need to sound their best. You could look at many brands including Parasound, NAD, Anthem, Emotiva,etc... you can find quality used Amps on web sites like Audiogon and likely save some dough over buying something new. Well built amps can last 20+ years (unlike av receivers the technology does not render them obsolete after a few years).

Stylz25

01-15-10, 12:06 PM

J Ritt

01-15-10, 12:26 PM

Okay guys...I'm officially a knucklehead. :rolleyes: I went home and took some photos of the SE's vs. the Monitors. The tweets do indeed look different. When I took my last set of photos, I did so at night, and I didn't literally put them right up next to each other. This time I put them right next to each other, and got some daylight on them. They look darn similar unless you get them in the right light! I think the fact that the SE's have the same plastic "waveguide chassis" covering them as on the Monitor Series makes them look even more similar.

The Monitor ADP-390 tweeter clearly has the silvery/titanium color, while the SE's tweet is a gold color. Visually, they are indeed different. I apologize for saying that they were visually the same and causing confusion. You can see the pics here:http://img339.imageshack.us/g/img0466k.jpg/
I also snapped a few closeups of the other drivers on the SE's for anyone who wanted to see them.

As confirmed by Home Theater Mag, it's probably safe to say that the SE's do indeed have the G-Pal tweeters. That means all of the drivers in the SE's are the same as the Studio line. Now I'm really feeling good about the price I paid for these!:cool:

That said, there's still the issue of the stated specs. Here are some pics of the spec sheet from the SE owner's manual.
http://img339.imageshack.us/g/img0469xe.jpg/

I guess they did a production change after the manual was written and printed.

I'll post some listening impressions of the SE's after lunch. In short, they are awesome! :D

jd_cincy

01-15-10, 12:34 PM

rnrgagne

01-15-10, 01:09 PM

Yea, I know...this is a Paradigm section, but I am committed to either Studio 60's OR Studio 100's...and if I go 100's...the general concensus (and I've gone eye-bleery on the threads) is that the Studio 100's need some "help" power-wise, over my 130-wpc Denon AVR. Sooo, can folks please give some friendly advice on what would be a reasonable "supplement ?" / amp/ 2-channel amp? This is out of my area of concentration, and I am NOT familiar with supplemental power-type issues. I noted in Paradigm's website that they specify power to the Studio 100's as "15-350 W range, / 230 W max." This seems like "double-talk" to me.
Doing a quick search on Amps, I note names like Anthem, Parasound, Naim.:eek: Advice please !

If I recall correctly, you're using 5.1 right? This gives you the ability to bi-amp using four channels of your receivers amps, that'll improve headroom a bit.
I know it just messes you up when people recommend extra power for the 100's - believe me, it is an internet phenomenon, as I told you in a pm the 100's are actually more efficient than the 60's. Yes, they can handle big power and play nice with big power - but it is not always needed.
I'm not saying there can't be an improvement by going to an external amp, I just don't think it's likely to be as beneficial in your sized room as other things you can do like adding treatments, or a quality sub and hopefully both.
There is a very simple way to find out if you need it or not, and that's try it without it and see what you think. ;)

Kai Winters

01-15-10, 02:03 PM

Hey guys just wondering about the break in period for the Monitor 11 5.1 system? I just got this system and listened to a movie maybe a bit more on the high side and was worried about the break in for for these! Do you have to listen to the speakers at Medium to low level volume for like the first 100 hours?? thx guys.

The Paradigm site, or your owners manual, should give you info on break in period time.
I'd did nothing special breaking in my 11's other than just keeping the sound level reasonable for a few days...

Spaceman

01-15-10, 03:26 PM

I'm building a dedicated theater and have plans to retire my 5.1 M&K bookshelf system. My room is 12'6" x 19' and I'm considering Paradigm. 4 setups that fit my budget include:

Monitor 9s (2)
CC390 (1)
ADP 390 (4)

Monitor 7s (2)
CC290 (1)
ADP390 (4)

Titan Monitor (2)
CC290 (1)
ADP390 (4)

Mini Monitor (2)
CC290 (1)
ADP190 (4)

Sub to be determined. My current sub is a M&K V-75 Mark II. Perhaps I could keep this.

Based on my room size and my listening consisting of 90% movies/10% music, does one setup stand out? Are the 9s overkill? That setup wouldn't leave much in my budget for a good sub. Are the Minis too small for fronts? Has anyone used ADPs for side surrounds and Minis for rear surrounds?

fistofsouth

01-15-10, 03:46 PM

Howdy All. I'm planning on buying new speakers over the next couple of years (I buy the best I can afford piece by piece) and so I've been looking at Paradigm. For a while I wrote them off because the wife and I have decided that Gloss/Piano Black is our color for speakers and I had never seen any Paradigms in Piano Black. I now see that the Studio and Signiature Series offer Piano Black as an option and while the Signatures are a bit beyond my reach I could definately afford the Studio Series.

I'm a long-time Paradigm owner (almost 16 years) and although my tastes now lean towards British Speakers (KEF, Wharfedale, Monitor Audio, et al) I do still have a soft spot in my heart for Paradigm. I've listened to the Studio 60v5 and I like them if only for two-channel Classic Rock/Metal listening, but I have not been able to see a pair in Piano Black. From the Paradigm website it looks like the Studio Series in Piano Black are only half black with the rear portion of the speaker clad in a silver or metallic looking finish. It also looks like the metallic color differs from the outriggers on the speaker. Has anyone seen these speakers (Piano Black Studio 60v5) in person? If so how do they look? Is there some sort of metallic finish on the back? Does that finish differ from the metalic finish on the outriggers and drivers?

J Ritt

01-15-10, 03:55 PM

Some listening impressions of the SE3's and SE center...

I am really impressed with these speakers. I had a set of Boston Acoustic VR950's for about 10 years, and decided to make the switch to a different brand for the theater in my new house. I demoed a few things over the years, had heard some friends' gear, etc. I decided to try Paradigm this time around based on their strong reputation. I originally ordered Titan Monitors and a CC-290 as my front sound stage. I had some problems with the Titan's so they went back. I ended up with the SE3's and SE Center. I figured that if they shared components with the Studio line that everyone raves about, I wouldn't be disappointed.

I am definitely not disappointed. The sound great. I am not an audiophile. I've never owned speakers more expensive than these, and I don't have any friends with $10,000 speakers. That means my comparison is for the most part only against lower-end, consumer level speakers.

I have my SE's mated to an Elemental Designs A7S-450 sub (18" sealed with 1500W amp). I used Audyssey on my Denon 3808 to calibrate, and I'm running an Emotiva UPA-7 amp on my front 5 channels. My surrounds are ADP-390's and old Titan's for my rear surrounds.

In terms of sound, I don't know what else you would want or need out of a set of speakers. I've listened to a number of CD's over the past week, and on 2 channel music the SE3's are fantastic. I think the biggest difference with the SE's vs. the Titans is the sound stage. The sound is much more airy and detailed. I was listening to a live acoustic show (Dave Matthews and Tim Reynolds at Radio City), and you hear absolutely everything. You hear every brush of the fingers on strings, breathing, vibrations, etc. I think I heard a guy in 20th row break wind. The air in the room just feels full and enveloping. I got the chills four times while listening to this one CD. I've tried a number of other albums...some with female voices (norah jones, dixie chicks, gwen stefani), rap (jay Z, dr. dre, eminem), heavy metal (metallica, alice in chains), techno/trip-hop (crystal method, massive attack). They sound amazing to me on every album I've tried. They blend nicely with my sub, and I don't hear any gaps or voids in content.

On movies, it's the same story. For my first listen I ran the opening scene of the new Star Trek. The little bleeps and beeps from the bridge just floated in the air. It sounds like they're all around you, just hanging there. Although the center channel is quite small, it puts out plenty of sound in my room (24x15x8). Dialogue is crystal clear. As with 2-channel music, the sound stage is wide and enveloping. I sampled a number of other movies...transformers 2, up, underworld...they are great.

Wife test- amazingly, my wife was even excited about them. She likes the way they look much better than the Monitors, and she actually did admit that they sound really, really good.

I don't foresee wanting to upgrade at any time in the near future. I think these speakers offer a really good value, and that diminishing returns has to certainly kick in at anything above this level. I'm thrilled with how they sound.

I thought about getting the SE1's, but I really missed the look and sound of my Boston towers while I had the Titans on stands up front. I also thought the SE3's would be a bit more stable and damage resistant than the SE1's on stands (have a dog and about to have my first child).

In terms of value, the SE1's seem to be the hot ticket. You get the Studio line tweeter and mid/bass driver at roughly the same price as the least expensive Monitor towers (Monitor 7). You probably won't get quite as much bass, but I don't think that's a major concern for a lot of people. Many or most use a subwoofer to augment bass.

If you want/need more bass, greater power handling, or prefer the look of a tower, the SE3 is essentially the Studio 60 in a different cabinet for about $500 less (unless I'm missing something). There may be some minor component differences, but it seems like they are very similar.

I'm actually really surprised about my earlier confirmation that the G-Pal tweeter found its way into the SE line. I imagine Paradigm will cannibalize some of its Studio line sales with this SE line at a lower price. If they had gone with more of the mix and match of Studio and Monitor drivers as originally announced, I would imagine more people would have sprung the extra for the Studios. Hmmm...guess only time will tell.

Then again, this will likely put them in a stronger position vs. outside competition such as the B&W 600 series (685 at $600/pair, 683 at $1400/pair). i don't think it's coincidence that the SE's are priced identically. Also, they'll probably be able to squeeze more cash out of guys like me who were originally only considering the Monitor series...we don't have to make as much of a leap up to the Studio series for higher quality drivers.

Also, maybe this move could signal something new in the near future for the Studio series?

Regardless, I have no doubt the SE series will be a great seller for Paradigm. I expect to see a string of positive pro reviews of these coming out very soon.

karsty

01-15-10, 04:12 PM

From the Paradigm website it looks like the Studio Series in Piano Black are only half black with the rear portion of the speaker clad in a silver or metallic looking finish. It also looks like the metallic color differs from the outriggers on the speaker. Has anyone seen these speakers (Piano Black Studio 60v5) in person? If so how do they look? Is there some sort of metallic finish on the back? Does that finish differ from the metalic finish on the outriggers and drivers?

That silver metallic looking finish on the back of the Piano Black finish Studios is just the light reflection. I imagine Paradigm did this on purpose so that people can see that the Piano Black has some shine to it when light is aimed at it.

J Ritt

01-15-10, 04:13 PM

Dragon Reborn

01-15-10, 04:15 PM

As confirmed by Home Theater Mag, it's probably safe to say that the SE's do indeed have the G-Pal tweeters.[/B] That means all of the drivers in the SE's are the same as the Studio line. Now I'm really feeling good about the price I paid for these!:cool:

Good news, J Ritt!

Thanks for the close-up pics. Now we're officially all on the same page about the SE tweeters. G-PAL, yay! :D

That confirmation might just put me over the edge in buying them. And I just got the finance committee to sign off on them. :D

Dragon Reborn

01-15-10, 04:20 PM

J Ritt. Can you do me a favour and take a couple measurements?

How high off the floor is the bottom edge of the lowest woofer?

How high off the floor is the tweeter?

What is the depth of the speaker with the grill on?

Thanks!

Spaceman

01-15-10, 05:09 PM

Dragon Reborn

01-15-10, 05:22 PM

If I was to go with a pair of SE3's for the front, would it be better to go with an SE center vs. the CC290 or 390? The 390 looks pretty beefy compared to the SE center but not sure how it mates with the SE3's.

If you're going with an acoustically transparent screen, go with a 3rd SE3 instead of any horizontal center channel speaker. SE3s for LCR would give you the perfect matching soundstage, not to mention the inherent problems (lobing) of any horizontal MTM-design speaker.

stephenmcgauley

01-15-10, 05:53 PM

If I was to go with a pair of SE3's for the front, would it be better to go with an SE center vs. the CC290 or 390? The 390 looks pretty beefy compared to the SE center but not sure how it mates with the SE3's.
If you want a Beefier center to match you will want to look at the cc 590 because the 290 and 390 use the monitor drivers that won't match the studio drivers in the se series

Stylz25

01-15-10, 05:53 PM

Spaceman

01-15-10, 05:54 PM

If you're going with an acoustically transparent screen, go with a 3rd SE3 instead of any horizontal center channel speaker. SE3s for LCR would give you the perfect matching soundstage, not to mention the inherent problems (lobing) of any horizontal MTM-design speaker.

Good point as an AT screen is what I am planning to do. I guess the same concept would apply if I went with Monitor 7s or 9s. An added bonus is that the 3rd floorstander is cheaper than any of the stand alone centers, unless Paradigm charges more when not sold in a pair. Aren't they typically priced as a pair?

Dragon Reborn

01-15-10, 06:42 PM

Good point as an AT screen is what I am planning to do. I guess the same concept would apply if I went with Monitor 7s or 9s. An added bonus is that the 3rd floorstander is cheaper than any of the stand alone centers, unless Paradigm charges more when not sold in a pair. Aren't they typically priced as a pair?

Actually, I believe Paradigms are typically priced per speaker.

And, as you mentioned, a 3rd SE3 would be much cheaper than a Studio CC 590, the same price as a CC 290, and a bit more expensive than a SE CC.

I think almost everyone will agree that 3 matching LCRs are ideal (although not workable for a lot of people's set-ups unless they have an AT screen like us ;)).

fistofsouth

01-15-10, 06:59 PM

fistofsouth,
Per my recent input and comments...you may want to just consider the new Paradigm SE3's. They are gloss black the whole way around, and have the same exact drivers as the Studio 60's, and cost about $500 less. They are very simple and attractive. My pics are here: http://img94.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=paradigmsespeakers026.jpg

I appreciate the hint, but I just can't go for boxy speakers anymore. The audio-fiend in me will say it is because rounded enclosures reduce standing waves, but the truth is I like the way they look and more importantly the WIFE likes the way they look.

Stylz25

01-15-10, 07:10 PM

JRitt

01-15-10, 07:10 PM

Dragon, here are those measurements. I took the measurements from the very bottom of the cabinet closest to the floor, since the actual height off of the floor would vary slightly on spike depth, carpeting, etc.

How high off the floor is the bottom edge of the lowest woofer?
13 1/4" to the bottom edge of the lowest woofer

How high off the floor is the tweeter?
31" to the very center of the tweeter

What is the depth of the speaker with the grill on?
11 1/8" deep

Thanks!
No problem!

J Ritt

01-15-10, 07:14 PM

I appreciate the hint, but I just can't go for boxy speakers anymore. The audio-fiend in me will say it is because rounded enclosures reduce standing waves, but the truth is I like the way they look and more importantly the WIFE likes the way they look.
Amen. Get what you and your account manager like!:D

Stylz25

01-15-10, 07:40 PM

Dragon Reborn

01-15-10, 09:08 PM

weird 23

01-15-10, 09:16 PM

osofast240sx

01-15-10, 09:18 PM

weird 23

01-15-10, 09:34 PM

the paradigm sub 12

That's what I would like but still to big. I'm interested in the new Seismic but haven't heard much about it. Does anyone know how big the SE sub is?

osofast240sx

01-15-10, 09:40 PM

That's what I would like but still to big. I'm interested in the new Seismic but haven't heard much about it. Does anyone know how big the SE sub is?i think the have a new small sub

Audiophiliac

01-15-10, 10:32 PM

Seismic 110? The "Bulldog" sub as it has been coined. :) I do not see it in their site. Is it shipping?

Need4spdnb

01-15-10, 10:41 PM

Just wondering about the Crossover Hz setting to put for the Fronts Center and Surrounds??? Do you just set them for their high frequency setting ( ie. Monitor 11 is 48hz to 20khz so set it to 40 or 50 hz...ADP-390's set to 100 hz??)

Any help is appreciated sine I am not sure what to set the crossovers for the fronts and rears...i know the sub is 80hz usually....and yes I ran Audyssey but its not what I like so I am tweaking everything thanks guys. Or do you just set all the speakers to 80hz??

Do you set all the Crossover frequencies to 80hz? or what the speakers high freq response it??? help

Most will say crossover all your speakers at 80 and let the sub do the rest, assuming you have a capable sub. I have Sig W5s and Sig ADP3s and I cross them over at 80. Can they go lower, sure, but I would rather have the sub do 80 and below because a good sub will do it much better than a good speaker (most of the time). If you want to tinker, cross the 11's over around 60 and the center and surrounds at 80. I generally don't cross the center over lower because I don't want bass coming from it. As for the surrounds, I would cross those over at 80 as well. We have the 390s in one of our rooms running at 80 and they perform well there. You can go lower, but I prefer 80.

weird 23

01-15-10, 10:45 PM

Seismic 110? The "Bulldog" sub as it has been coined. :) I do not see it in their site. Is it shipping?

Yes that's the one, I don't know if it's shipping. There doesn't seem to be much info on that sub, does anyone know anything about it?

osofast240sx

01-15-10, 11:02 PM

That's what I would like but still to big. I'm interested in the new Seismic but haven't heard much about it. Does anyone know how big the SE sub is?http://www.hemagazine.com/files/Paradigm%20Seismic%20110.jpg

weird 23

01-15-10, 11:07 PM

http://www.hemagazine.com/files/Paradigm%20Seismic%20110.jpg

Is it shipping yet? If so, has anyone heard it? Or maybe the SE sub, has anyone heard that one?

Stylz25

01-16-10, 01:02 AM

Most will say crossover all your speakers at 80 and let the sub do the rest, assuming you have a capable sub. I have Sig W5s and Sig ADP3s and I cross them over at 80. Can they go lower, sure, but I would rather have the sub do 80 and below because a good sub will do it much better than a good speaker (most of the time). If you want to tinker, cross the 11's over around 60 and the center and surrounds at 80. I generally don't cross the center over lower because I don't want bass coming from it. As for the surrounds, I would cross those over at 80 as well. We have the 390s in one of our rooms running at 80 and they perform well there. You can go lower, but I prefer 80.

Thanks for the info...appreciate it! I will try that and if anyone could give me info on what all this crossover hz means it would be awesome since Im still a newbie! like what happend if I put Fronts=40hz Center=40hz and Surrounds=90hz what does all that mean? so 80hz(thx) for all is what most people do but why? thx guys

audiodaze74

01-16-10, 03:52 AM

http://www.hemagazine.com/files/Paradigm%20Seismic%20110.jpg

Holy Crap Balls...what IS that thing? Hope its better than the DSP-3400 which sucks!!!

weird 23

01-16-10, 04:47 AM

Holy Crap Balls...what IS that thing? Hope its better than the DSP-3400 which sucks!!!

Why do you think the DSP 3400 sucks?

TweakerInWA

01-16-10, 07:36 AM

Thanks for the info...appreciate it! I will try that and if anyone could give me info on what all this crossover hz means it would be awesome since Im still a newbie! like what happend if I put Fronts=40hz Center=40hz and Surrounds=90hz what does all that mean? so 80hz(thx) for all is what most people do but why? thx guys

The easiest way to say it,

The reason the subwoofer exsists in home theater is to reproduce low frequencies, thus freeing up the drivers in your L/C/R and surrounds to reproduce sound clearly and efficiently without trying to pump out the low frequency audio at the same time.
Driver developement has come a long way, but think about a single driver trying to reproduce an earthquake, dialogue and other sounds simultaneously... After considering that, you tell me..... Your best bet is to leave everything at 80hz and call it a day. Unless you listen to alot of 2ch audio there's no reason to do otherwise IMO....You start sending 60-40hz to your L/C/R and surrounds you're going to start running into issues (distortion), especially if you like to crank it up from time to time....

rnrgagne

01-16-10, 10:29 AM

I picked my first Sig's yesterday, a demo pair of S1 v2. The sound is amazing, except they are very limited when it comes to bass. Has anyone heard the new Seismic or SE subs? It will be used 100% for music, size is an important factor as it will be in our living room. I'm not looking for max output, just enough to fill in the bottom end. I prefer sealed subs vs ported. Any suggestions?

Thanks

I haven't seen or heard the above sub, but the Seismic 12 would be at the top of my list for a compact Paradigm sub. I used to have one, and it was outstanding for HT and good for music, about as good you could expect from a down-firing sub with passive radiators.

If you go outside the Paradigm box for small subs Velodynes DD series offers good performance in very small enclosures. A bit pricey though, but the added room correction would be useful for blending into a 2.1 system and since music is your top priority getting that right would have significant value.

I also like to recommend Rythmik Audio's servo controlled subs or kits. I had a pair of them and they were very accurate for music. I don't know that the cabinet size would match your goals though.

Bigred7078

01-16-10, 12:19 PM

http://www.hemagazine.com/files/Paradigm%20Seismic%20110.jpg

looks like a bulldog with its head cut off...

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg73/bigred7078/BulldogChampsBossWhiteEnglish2.jpg

lt5686

01-16-10, 02:00 PM

I just purchase a pair of the new Cinema Phantom floorstanding speakers to use as fronts.

Next on the list is a center channel speaker. I have a few choices.

I am looking at the following:

CC-170 (v2 or v3)
Reference cc-450
CC-130
CC-150
and finally CC-270 (v3)

Can anybody rank for me which would yield the best match?

I'm not an audiophile per se, just looking for something above average.

Thanks

pbc

01-16-10, 08:29 PM

Well, was watching Term Salvation at about -7 on my Onky 876 and it seems my brand new S2 has blown a tweeter. Sound is extremely distorted out of it. What the heck?

Could it be the 876's amp was not powerful enough (rated at 140 w x 7, but supposedly real power is closer to 125 with all ch driven)? I recently decided to remove my Sunfire amp from the system to try it without.

Could that have been the cause? Seems odd that the tweeter would be over driven given the quality of the Be tweeters. Don't even want to think what this is going to cost to replace!

weird 23

01-16-10, 08:31 PM

I haven't seen or heard the above sub, but the Seismic 12 would be at the top of my list for a compact Paradigm sub. I used to have one, and it was outstanding for HT and good for music, about as good you could expect from a down-firing sub with passive radiators.

If you go outside the Paradigm box for small subs Velodynes DD series offers good performance in very small enclosures. A bit pricey though, but the added room correction would be useful for blending into a 2.1 system and since music is your top priority getting that right would have significant value.

I also like to recommend Rythmik Audio's servo controlled subs or kits. I had a pair of them and they were very accurate for music. I don't know that the cabinet size would match your goals though.

I forgot to mention that I need to use the high pass filter( I think that's what it's called) because my amp (Marantz pm 8003) doesn't have a line in for a subwoofer. I think that may limit my options. I'll have check out the Velodyne subs as I don't think the Seismic can't be hooked up the way I need to. I've taken the advice that you and Brac gave me and ordered the GIK room treatment package #3, I think that should really help my HT system. The Studio 20's continue to impress me, I knew they were good and they have surpassed my expectations. I tried my Sub 15 with the S1's today and they sounded great together, but it's too large for the living room. I would like to thank you and Brac for the great advice on setting up my system, although I may need some more before it's finally finished.

AbMagFab

01-16-10, 08:33 PM

Any recommendation on getting just a FR/FL/C, and perhaps Sub, of the Cinema line? I have a friend who doesn't need surrounds, but does need the three fronts, and budget is around Cinema level. And they need to be wall mounted.

Thanks!

rnrgagne

01-16-10, 09:42 PM

I forgot to mention that I need to use the high pass filter( I think that's what it's called) because my amp (Marantz pm 8003) doesn't have a line in for a subwoofer. I think that may limit my options. I'll have check out the Velodyne subs as I don't think the Seismic can't be hooked up the way I need to. I've taken the advice that you and Brac gave me and ordered the GIK room treatment package #3, I think that should really help my HT system. The Studio 20's continue to impress me, I knew they were good and they have surpassed my expectations. I tried my Sub 15 with the S1's today and they sounded great together, but it's too large for the living room. I would like to thank you and Brac for the great advice on setting up my system, although I may need some more before it's finally finished.

If you need to use the sub's crossover you've got limited options. I think with the DD's you can remove the Marantz's jumpers and put the DD "in-line" and use it's auto eq & crossover - that should work pretty slick.

Getting an SMS-1 and a different sub is also another option that could work, but the DD's have it built in...

There's a guys selling a couple of DD 10's on either a-gon or videogon at $975 each..

They're pretty small 12" x 12" x 13" but can play down to 18hz :eek:

rnrgagne

01-16-10, 09:48 PM

weird 23

01-16-10, 11:28 PM

If you need to use the sub's crossover you've got limited options. I think with the DD's you can remove the Marantz's jumpers and put the DD "in-line" and use it's auto eq & crossover - that should work pretty slick.

Getting an SMS-1 and a different sub is also another option that could work, but the DD's have it built in...

There's a guys selling a couple of DD 10's on either a-gon or videogon at $975 each..

They're pretty small 12" x 12" x 13" but can play down to 18hz :eek:

What do you mean by removing the jumpers?

pbc

01-17-10, 09:45 AM

I seriously doubt it's the 876, it should have more than enough power and headroom, it also can handle lower impedances.
I think it's just a defective tweeter - it happens, IIRC that's the second blown Be tweeter I've read about.

Annoying as all heck though. Not a happy camper! Have flipped an email to the dealer (in Chicago) so hopefully they can figure something out for me given I really don't want to have to ship the speakers back there!

TweakerInWA

01-17-10, 10:09 AM

Annoying as all heck though. Not a happy camper! Have flipped an email to the dealer (in Chicago) so hopefully they can figure something out for me given I really don't want to have to ship the speakers back there!

They should just be able to send you the Tweet and it's as easy as 1-2-3 to replace on your own, then send them the faulty one back if they request it. Whip out an Alan wrench and your set....I've yet to replace any of the drivers or tweet's on the Paradigm's, but have done so on Klipsch, Logan's etc.. Looks easy enough on the Paradigms as well... maybe even easier...:)

Edit: Have you contacted Paradigm? Really great customer support, they just might help you cut out the middle man and send you the replacement directly....Just a thought. Heck Missasagua is right down the road from you if GTA means "Greater Toronto Area" Have you been to the factory ??? If not you should take a trip !!!

schalliol

01-17-10, 10:28 AM

I just picked up a set of 60s and CC-690, I thought maybe some of you might like to see them paired with a Sony ES Receiver I bought for the audio section over the video processing ability. I have been using V1 Studio 20s for the last 13 or so years with three different now I'll be moving those 20s to the rear (as previously mentioned). Some people have been concerned about some receivers being able to handle these guys (especially the CC-690), but I'm pleased to report that my 3100 ES effortlessly powers these guys and the sound is incredible. I don't have to push the amp at all, and I'm operating signal db ranges basically the same as I did with the 20s. These are paired with a dual 12" push/pull MK sub. The 3100 ES is more like the 6400 they sell today than any other in the line.

To the question...the audio stage (and additional zones) of the receiver seems to be working wonderfully, but of course this unit lacks HDMI (and none of the receivers support the new 3D standard). So, I'm figuring with a great TV, I should be able to just use HDMI for the video signals and use optical or coaxial for the audio. I assume that will work. Even the newest receivers don't seem substantially different other than in the video section. If I'm going to have 4 HDMI inputs, as well as component, it seems that I could use component for every classic connection (courtesy of upconversion) and then switch the HDMI inputs for HD connections. Do any of you see any downsides of doing this?

If curious, here are some pics with them and my noticeably ancient 27" Sony XBR (click each for high res). I chose the rosenut (what my 20s are) for the 60s and 690 in black ash. I'm planning on moving sometime next year and will then replace the TV (hopefully with a ~46" 3D supporting set Samsung, Sony XBR or Toshiba from what I'm seeing out of CES).

http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/HTsm.jpg (http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/HT.jpg)

http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/690sm.jpg (http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/690.jpg)

http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/60sm.jpg (http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/60.jpg)

TweakerInWA

01-17-10, 10:46 AM

schalliol

01-17-10, 11:26 AM

Looks sweet!, you're right about the TV looking out of place, lol :) Where the heck have you been the last five years?!!!
As for you hookup's, no issues there. Just wondering why all the fuss about the 3D stuff...It will be another 5- 10 years before it even matters. Heck, alot of stations don't even broadcast in HD yet and you're worried about 3D? BLAH !!!!! Go get yourself Pioneer Kuro plasma display before they evaporate and enjoy !!!!!! :)
Thanks for the comments!

As for the TV, I have some little tots and don't want them to destroy the TV since it will be right at their finger tips. I also want to buy a TV that I'll be happy with for a fairly long time and is basically the best TV I can get to fit in that horizontal width of 45". Sometime in the next year or so the kids should be responsible enough and I'll be able to afford a really high quality display for that size. As for 3D, there's now a 3D blu-ray standard and 3D programming is going to become available. I won't likely be using much 3D anytime soon, but I'd like the capability. I really was mainly pointing out that even the current receivers/pre-amps aren't compatible with HDMI 1.4 and such...but it doesn't matter if your TV supports it and so does your Blu-Ray.

Dathon

01-17-10, 11:30 AM

Thanks for the comments!

As for the TV, I have some little tots and don't want them to destroy the TV since it will be right at their finger tips. I also want to buy a TV that I'll be happy with for a fairly long time and is basically the best TV I can get to fit in that horizontal width of 45". Sometime in the next year or so the kids should be responsible enough and I'll be able to afford a really high quality display for that size. As for 3D, there's now a 3D blu-ray standard and 3D programming is going to become available. I won't likely be using much 3D anytime soon, but I'd like the capability. I really was mainly pointing out that even the current receivers/pre-amps aren't compatible with HDMI 1.4 and such...but it doesn't matter if your TV supports it and so does your Blu-Ray.

Just curious why you went with black ash for the CC? Better deal?

The1stCav

01-17-10, 11:44 AM

Just looking at that CC-690 w/o its cover creates a sudden urge to get a towel............OMG I WANT ONE!
(I have the CC-590 and it works harder than it should, the CC-690 would balance out my system, and all my digm's are in Black Ash, so that CC-690 you have is what I have been dreaming of the past few months)

Best wishes on the TV thing next year, it will be a nice addition to a very nice speaker system.

rnrgagne

01-17-10, 01:04 PM

What do you mean by removing the jumpers?

On the integrated Marantz, isn't there jumpers between "pre-out" and "amp in"? You would run the pre-out to the subs' L/R line in and the subs' L/R line out back to the "amp-in". That way you would be using the subs' built in x-over.

Dragon Reborn

01-17-10, 01:04 PM

To the question...the audio stage (and additional zones) of the receiver seems to be working wonderfully, but of course this unit lacks HDMI (and none of the receivers support the new 3D standard). So, I'm figuring with a great TV, I should be able to just use HDMI for the video signals and use optical or coaxial for the audio. I assume that will work...Do any of you see any downsides of doing this?

By only using coax or optical, you lose the lossless audio codecs, DTS-MA and Dolby TrueHD. Those need HDMI.

If curious, here are some pics with them and my noticeably ancient 27" Sony XBR (click each for high res).
http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/HTsm.jpg (http://www.schalliol.com/property/electronics/paradigm/HT.jpg)
Daaayyyuuum. Where's the betamax next to that TV? j/k :p

Sometime in the next year or so the kids should be responsible enough...

Are oxymorons allowed in this forum? :p

Stylz25

01-17-10, 02:15 PM

rnrgagne

01-17-10, 02:27 PM

Hey guys just have a quick question....I have the Onkyo 807 AVR with the Paradigm Montior 11 5.1 system....The Center speaker I have is the CC-290 since the 390 wont fit anywhere! lol I was wondering how to increase the cneter speaker volume??? The dialogue is pretty low and if I turn it up everything just gets louder and its still faint from the center speaker! Now do I change the level calibration up for the center speaker?? Any help is appreciated! thx

Just run the Audyssey properly, and use Dynamic EQ & Volume. It will properly level match the CC, and if you feel you still need to increase the cc's volume just go into the set up menu : speaker set up : levels : center; and raise the cc's level & save.

Please don't take offense, but I'm getting the sense from all the questions you ask here you really need to trust Audyssey, run it properly, leave it on and forget it. Because if you don't know how to raise the cc's level - you can't possibly know how to set up your system better than what Audyssey can do.

The1stCav

01-17-10, 03:03 PM

Are oxymorons allowed in this forum? :p

LMAO - Nice

Stylz25

01-17-10, 04:15 PM

schalliol

01-17-10, 04:53 PM

Just curious why you went with black ash for the CC? Better deal?
Since I am setting it on wood, I figured that black would be better. Of course since it's right next to the TV, black is less distracting too.

Just looking at that CC-690 w/o its cover creates a sudden urge to get a towel............OMG I WANT ONE! Best wishes on the TV thing next year, it will be a nice addition to a very nice speaker system.
Haha! Thanks! Indeed, the 690 is pretty darn exciting.

By only using coax or optical, you lose the lossless audio codecs, DTS-MA and Dolby TrueHD. Those need HDMI.
Ahh, I didn't know that. Thanks! Right now I use the Mac Mini and Squeezebox (on the right side) to output losslessly encoded audio, but that comes in the 2 channel variety and only hits up to CD quality as a result. For my headphone system, I have a Cambridge DacMagic, which takes those signals up to 192, kind of like the dcs Elgar. This is trickery of course, and I really want high quality source data!

Daaayyyuuum. Where's the betamax next to that TV? j/k :p
Hahaha. At first I thought you meant the JVC BR-DV3000 (http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/english/pro/prodv/br_dv3000/index.html) which is to the right of the TV, but you can barely see it. So, I get the poke about the TV. Heh, yeah, pretty sad. At least it was one sweet CRT in the day :D

Are oxymorons allowed in this forum? :p
Good point. I guess I figured my risk will be less then :)

Oh, one other point. Recently I asked about tilting the center on here. What I did was add about an inch of closed cell foam under the back of the speaker. This adds a bit of tilt, though the weight does compress the foam a bit.

BRAC

01-17-10, 05:17 PM

Hey guys just have a quick question....I have the Onkyo 807 AVR with the Paradigm Montior 11 5.1 system....The Center speaker I have is the CC-290 since the 390 wont fit anywhere! lol I was wondering how to increase the cneter speaker volume??? The dialogue is pretty low and if I turn it up everything just gets louder and its still faint from the center speaker! Now do I change the level calibration up for the center speaker?? Any help is appreciated! thx

Like rnrgagne said, I also suggest just doing a proper setup such as Audyssey, then leave it as is. You will adjust, eventually...

But, if you still feel the need for louder dialog, I know that many sources have a dialog enhancement feature. This is definately an option in the PS3. Plus, I think some AVR's may even have a seperate dialog enhancement feature. Check it out...

pbc

01-17-10, 05:27 PM

rnrgagne

01-17-10, 06:33 PM

BTW, this may seem like a dumb question. But is there a way to "confirm" for sure it's the tweeter? Dealer wants me to ship the tweeter back, but I want to confirm it's the tweeter and not say the woofer or something else?

When I run a test tone and put my ear to the woofer vs. tweeter, it "seems" like the distorted sound is coming from almost in between the two, but slightly more pronounced as my ear approaches the tweeter.

Would a cross-over issue also cause this?

I'm going to try calling Paradigm tomorrow to see if I can just bring the speaker there given how close they are. But apparently they may not allow this and force customers to deal through their dealer network (makes sense I guess).

Just play only the speaker in question with some material you're familiar with, it should be obvious if there's no treble. If it's distorting you might have to put your ear up to the tweeter. Generally though, they just don't work.

To determine if it's the crossover, swap tweeters with the one that does work.

Always check for loose speaker connections, frayed wires and stuff by switching the speaker in question to one of the channels that you know has no problem.