This is a Paradigm thread, so the B&W's will suck here :D

BTW - if you can tell the difference between the two without measurements I give you alot of credit.... sometimes you need to walk away from the specs and just sit down and enjoy what they have to offer, personally I came away feeling that the S8's had much more presence in the mids and tweeters were incredibly detailed coming extremely close to a ribbon like quality..... The 803D just didn't do it for me, but that was the older version, haven't heard the new D.

Personally, I don't run my systems without subwoofers, so the lows were of no interest to me...

The V5 Studio's are quite often compared to the V1 Sigs, do they sound similar? I know that you own some V1 Sigs, have you heard the v5 Studio's? I would like to know if all the hype is true or if it's just marketing. You've never tried your s8's full range before?

I'm looking to purchase in ceiling speakers to act as my rear speakers in my HT setup. I currently have a Denon 3808 and am running Studio 60s up front with a CC-590 and a Sub 15. My seating position is about 12 feet away from the speakers and projection screen.

I have narrowed down my selection to the SA-15R-SM and the SA-15R-30. I am trying to achieve the best clarity from the "rear" speakers and would like to know what the main differences are between these two?
Also, does anyone know what the MSRP on these speakers is?

Thanks for your help.

Mark

If you had the Studio 100s v5 and the 690 v5 what Signature speaker would match the cost in terms of price only. I am guessing the S4 would match the cost of the 100s but I am just not sure. Same question for the center. Thanks.

The V5 Studio's are quite often compared to the V1 Sigs, do they sound similar? I know that you own some V1 Sigs, have you heard the v5 Studio's? I would like to know if all the hype is true or if it's just marketing. You've never tried your s8's full range before?

I have heard the .v5 100's at the dealer - both him and I feel that they are just a touch better then the .v4's that I had.... I only have the S4 .v1's and they are still fantastic IMO, wasn't able to compare them directly, but either way I would still choose the .v1 Sig S4's with a integrated sub over the new Studio 100's, and if you could get the .v2 S4's I would take them over the .v1's - the tweeter and mid's are just a nice step up.

I have never run the S8's full range, you can poop on my head if you feel it necessary, but my S8's are in a room so huge there is no way they could ever offer enough bass IMO, so I cross them over pretty high, which many would chastize me for, but I could care less. I spent far more on my DIY subs and amps then the S8's. There is no way the bass of the S8's could ever come even close to the sound quality of my subs..... I bought them because they are beautiful works of art - they look and sound fantastic - basically serve the purpose of a line array at this point with the woofers limping along with my chosen crossover point...

This is a Paradigm thread, so the B&W's will suck here :D

BTW - if you can tell the difference between the two without measurements I give you alot of credit.... sometimes you need to walk away from the specs and just sit down and enjoy what they have to offer, personally I came away feeling that the S8's had much more presence in the mids and tweeters were incredibly detailed coming extremely close to a ribbon like quality..... The 803D just didn't do it for me, but that was the older version, haven't heard the new D.

Personally, I don't run my systems without subwoofers, so the lows were of no interest to me...

:):) I already listened s8 v2 with anthem d2v&p5 combo. It didn't impressed me enough. That's probably because source wasn't a good one, it was a 7 series marantz cdp. It won't be an equal comparison but imo, 804s and ma7000 was better but I firmly believe that's because of ma7000 and mcd500. Right after that I listened 804s with rotel, it didn't sounded the same. I am now waiting for 803d and usher be20s to come to their dealers. I hope they won't sound better than s8s to me, I don't want to spend more than half of my budget to speakers. :D one of this three will replace my s100s.

I have heard the .v5 100's at the dealer - both him and I feel that they are just a touch better then the .v4's that I had.... I only have the S4 .v1's and they are still fantastic IMO, wasn't able to compare them directly, but either way I would still choose the .v1 Sig S4's with a integrated sub over the new Studio 100's, and if you could get the .v2 S4's I would take them over the .v1's - the tweeter and mid's are just a nice step up.

I have never run the S8's full range, you can poop on my head if you feel it necessary, but my S8's are in a room so huge there is no way they could ever offer enough bass IMO, so I cross them over pretty high, which many would chastize me for, but I could care less. I spent far more on my DIY subs and amps then the S8's. There is no way the bass of the S8's could ever come even close to the sound quality of my subs..... I bought them because they are beautiful works of art - they look and sound fantastic - basically serve the purpose of a line array at this point with the woofers limping along with my chosen crossover point...

You should run your s8's the way they sound the best to your ears. You havce to listen to them, not me. I have to say that your setup sounds awesome and would love to have that in my house. I have the s1 v2 so I'm fimilar with the sound of the Be tweeter and they sound great. I've been debating selling them and getting some Monitor Audio PL 100's or trading up to the s2's. I can't decide which ones I want to get though. Thanks for the thoughts on the v5 Studio's vs v1 Sigs.

exciting and fun it is!!it never gets old!!

as far as the SA25's will do a fine job paired with the ADP590's!!I've only heard these once and they did sound great!!it was in a dedicated room but none the difference!!

if in walls are you only option then these will do you just fine!!now this is JMO,but if you have the ability to put what I call direct firing speakers in the rears e.g. studio 10's or 20's and they fit the budget that's my prerference!!you can direct or point them more in direction you want if necessary!!but if not dont fret cause the SA25's wont disappoint you!!

Well the only reason for the inwalls is the extra room it allows me... I guess I could use the 10s but as the seats are so closed to the rear wall I was trying to accomplish a bit of distance from the listening position

I want to thank this thread for all the helpful information and expertise that I have learned. I finally paid for my paradigm speakers yesterday. I paid $3500 for Studio 60s, CC590, and a SUB 12. If you guys want to have the name of the dealer I bought it from here in souther california, you can PM me. I am now going to buy a reciever for these babies. Do you think the Denon 591 (http://www.usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/5302.asp) reciever will be adequate? Will there be enough wattage to power these speakers? But I also dont want to spend more on a reciever with features that I wouldnt need.

You should run your s8's the way they sound the best to your ears. You havce to listen to them, not me. I have to say that your setup sounds awesome and would love to have that in my house. I have the s1 v2 so I'm fimilar with the sound of the Be tweeter and they sound great. I've been debating selling them and getting some Monitor Audio PL 100's or trading up to the s2's. I can't decide which ones I want to get though. Thanks for the thoughts on the v5 Studio's vs v1 Sigs.

Thanks, its been a long journey, and the next upgrade of the subs should be happening very soon.... It'll be the sickest thing ever...

I had some seat time with the PL300's and they are pretty good, ribbon is pretty nice but they don't seem to offer the dispersion of the Be tweet.... vertical presence was off a bit, but the Cabinet is really awesome looking in the Ebony - I was totally diggin the build quality... I do prefer the .v2 S2's, which I have as well, but thats me

Good luck with your choices and auditions - thats the fun stuff...

Salk also makes some amazing sounding stuff - their ribbon tweeter implementation is really great and SQ of all their speakers are spectacular...

Here's my question... one that I can't find much information on. The Mini MK3's, are they the same as the Mini Monitors? When did Paradigm make them? Where are they in the Paradigm totem pole? Would they be a good match with the CC-370's or should I upgrade?

The MkIIIs were made in the early to mid 90s. Older Paradigms used fabric tweeters rather than metal and are less bright than current models.

Thanks, its been a long journey, and the next upgrade of the subs should be happening very soon.... It'll be the sickest thing ever...

I had some seat time with the PL300's and they are pretty good, ribbon is pretty nice but they don't seem to offer the dispersion of the Be tweet.... vertical presence was off a bit, but the Cabinet is really awesome looking in the Ebony - I was totally diggin the build quality... I do prefer the .v2 S2's, which I have as well, but thats me

Good luck with your choices and auditions - thats the fun stuff...

Salk also makes some amazing sounding stuff - their ribbon tweeter implementation is really great and SQ of all their speakers are spectacular...

I find my 100's sound better with a higher crossover as well(100hz) but don't have enough subs right now for perfect intergration. With the size of my room dual subs should be enough. Everything is more dynamic and has less distortion with a higher crossover, that's what I find. You'll have to post pics of the new monsters when there're all finished.

Well the only reason for the inwalls is the extra room it allows me... I guess I could use the 10s but as the seats are so closed to the rear wall I was trying to accomplish a bit of distance from the listening position

good point!!stick with your original plan and go with the in walls!!you'lll be surprised in thier performance!especially after you run your room EQ!

keep us posted!!!

I want to thank this thread for all the helpful information and expertise that I have learned. I finally paid for my paradigm speakers yesterday. I paid $3500 for Studio 60s, CC590, and a SUB 12. If you guys want to have the name of the dealer I bought it from here in souther california, you can PM me. I am now going to buy a reciever for these babies. Do you think the Denon 591 (http://www.usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/5302.asp) reciever will be adequate? Will there be enough wattage to power these speakers? But I also dont want to spend more on a reciever with features that I wouldnt need.

do you ever plan on going to 7.1?if so I would'nt buy this particular one!!

also even if it cost you a bit more try to buy an AVR with the latest Audyssey Multi EQ XT!!you wont regret it!!

The MkIIIs were made in the early to mid 90s. Older Paradigms used fabric tweeters rather than metal and are less bright than current models.

Ah, thanks a lot for clearing that up for me. If these speakers are that old, I'm impressed as to how good they sound. I can't wait to get the CC-370 in to see what a difference that would make.

If you had the Studio 100s v5 and the 690 v5 what Signature speaker would match the cost in terms of price only. I am guessing the S4 would match the cost of the 100s but I am just not sure. Same question for the center. Thanks.

If you're looking at budget, the Studio 100 is priced close to the Signature S2 and the S4 is no longer available. The S6 are about double the Studio 100s. As for centres, the 690 is about the cost of the C1... skip the studio series!!

:):) I already listened s8 v2 with anthem d2v&p5 combo. It didn't impressed me enough. That's probably because source wasn't a good one, it was a 7 series marantz cdp. It won't be an equal comparison but imo, 804s and ma7000 was better but I firmly believe that's because of ma7000 and mcd500. Right after that I listened 804s with rotel, it didn't sounded the same. I am now waiting for 803d and usher be20s to come to their dealers. I hope they won't sound better than s8s to me, I don't want to spend more than half of my budget to speakers. :D one of this three will replace my s100s.

You hope they don't but, deep down inside you want them to. That's what makes this hobby so much fun. Happy listening. :)

just curious if anyone has experience with the following subwoofer - this is a hard one to find at much less than list price- but just wonding if anyone has listened to it- i have a chance to pick one up -but wanted to get some feedback.

Also - thoughts on the CC290V5 Center - have a chance to pick up a demo model for $220 - would be used initially in an unmatched system wiht two Vandersteen 2Ce's until i can find a matching center. After that it will move to my family room to complement two older Paradigm Monitor 9's (about 8 years old).

You can message directly back to me. Sorry for posting this in the owners thread since i have not purchased yet - But i do have the Monitor 9s and a set of paradigm surrounds.

just curious if anyone has experience with the following subwoofer - this is a hard one to find at much less than list price-

There is a 3400 on Agon now at a nice discount:

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?homesubw&1279138166&/Paradigm-DSP-3400-v.1-14-Inch-

If you don't care about the veneer and PBK-1, the subwoofer to get in that $800-$1k range is the Epik Empire. DUAL 15" woofers, in an opposed+sealed configuration.

http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/empire.html

...or the Rythmik F15 if you prefer sound quality over output. Nicer finish options vs. the Epik also:

http://www.rythmikaudio.com/F15.html

I love Paradigm, I just think their subwoofer offerings below the Reference subs (Sub12/15/25/1/2) don't stack up well against the ID competition.

I am saving up for the SVS Ultra13.

I want to thank this thread for all the helpful information and expertise that I have learned. I finally paid for my paradigm speakers yesterday. I paid $3500 for Studio 60s, CC590, and a SUB 12. If you guys want to have the name of the dealer I bought it from here in souther california, you can PM me. I am now going to buy a reciever for these babies. Do you think the Denon 591 (http://www.usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/5302.asp) reciever will be adequate? Will there be enough wattage to power these speakers? But I also dont want to spend more on a reciever with features that I wouldnt need.

That's a very nice speaker setup chanmanx2k. The biggest concern I'd have with that AVR is that if you decide you want more power, it doesn't have preouts to connect an external amp. So if you get down the road and decide you want an amp you'll have to buy a new AVR/processor to use it. The 120 WPC spec looks good on the surface, but if you read the fine print it tells you that it's really going to deliver 75 WPC with 5 channels driven. Otherwise, it has a decent feature set.

just curious if anyone has experience with the following subwoofer - this is a hard one to find at much less than list price- but just wonding if anyone has listened to it- i have a chance to pick one up -but wanted to get some feedback.

Also - thoughts on the CC290V5 Center - have a chance to pick up a demo model for $220 - would be used initially in an unmatched system wiht two Vandersteen 2Ce's until i can find a matching center. After that it will move to my family room to complement two older Paradigm Monitor 9's (about 8 years old).

You can message directly back to me. Sorry for posting this in the owners thread since i have not purchased yet - But i do have the Monitor 9s and a set of paradigm surrounds.

I can't speak on how it will match with your other speakers, but that's a very good price on a cc290...assuming it's in good shape.

...or the Rythmik F15 if you prefer sound quality over output. Nicer finish options vs. the Epik also:

http://www.rythmikaudio.com/F15.html

I love Paradigm, I just think their subwoofer offerings below the Reference subs (Sub12/15/25/1/2) don't stack up well against the ID competition.

I agree, the Rythmik would be top on my list, very accurate & excellent for music. Don't underestimate its' output either, it's not a weak sister by any means. The dual 12's I had were close to keeping up with my 4 X 15" IB sub in a 13x24 room.

I can't speak on how it will match with your other speakers, but that's a very good price on a cc290...assuming it's in good shape.

pretty much mint shape- i a sound room where it proabbaly does not get handled much. Full warranty. Probably wont get the original packaging but figured for that price i cant go wrong.

There is a 3400 on Agon now at a nice discount:

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?homesubw&1279138166&/Paradigm-DSP-3400-v.1-14-Inch-

If you don't care about the veneer and PBK-1, the subwoofer to get in that $800-$1k range is the Epik Empire. DUAL 15" woofers, in an opposed+sealed configuration.

http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/empire.html

...or the Rythmik F15 if you prefer sound quality over output. Nicer finish options vs. the Epik also:

http://www.rythmikaudio.com/F15.html

I love Paradigm, I just think their subwoofer offerings below the Reference subs (Sub12/15/25/1/2) don't stack up well against the ID competition.



I was actually looking at a Vandersteen Center and Sub- they have a sub with 3 8" drivers - their claim is that the smaller driver is more accurate- anyway all their stuff is excellent but expensive- but i found one used for about a grand that is tempting me- the HSU VTF3 is a high chioice but the looks dont appeal to me much. the Paradigm sub just looks cool- i saw the one on Audiogon also

Is there a profound difference between the CC-190 and CC-290? I'm thinking about getting a center channel to compliment my Paradigm v6 Titan Bookshelf Monitors. The nearest dealer here has the 190 for $299. Good price? Any suggestions or tips would be highly welcome. Thanks in advance.

$300 seems steep if that speaker is what I think it is.
I guess I'm comparing it to used prices though, since those're what I know. I'll go downstairs and see what my CC is though.

I'm looking to purchase in ceiling speakers to act as my rear speakers in my HT setup. I currently have a Denon 3808 and am running Studio 60s up front with a CC-590 and a Sub 15. My seating position is about 12 feet away from the speakers and projection screen.

I have narrowed down my selection to the SA-15R-SM and the SA-15R-30. I am trying to achieve the best clarity from the "rear" speakers and would like to know what the main differences are between these two?
Also, does anyone know what the MSRP on these speakers is?

Thanks for your help.

Mark

The SM version is a stereo speaker, meant for 2 channels of amplification. The SA 30 is a 30 degree angled SA 15 that is meant to angle in towards the listening position or out towards a wall. The will both sound the same, but they are for different applications. You would use 2 SA-15R or 2 SA-15R 30 for rears. They would be a perfect sonic match for the rest of your system. I don't have my price book in front of me at the moment to give you MSRP pricing on them.

$300 seems steep if that speaker is what I think it is.
I guess I'm comparing it to used prices though, since those're what I know. I'll go downstairs and see what my CC is though.

Thanks for the heads up. Any info would be appreciative. I think that this CC-190 this dealer is quoting is the newest version. To think I could get two Mini Monitors for a quoted $350 makes the $299 price kinda wild to me...!

Is there a profound difference between the CC-190 and CC-290? I'm thinking about getting a center channel to compliment my Paradigm v6 Titan Bookshelf Monitors. The nearest dealer here has the 190 for $299. Good price? Any suggestions or tips would be highly welcome. Thanks in advance.

The 190 retails for $299. The 290 offers a fuller sound, the 190 is a pretty small center channel when it comes to Paradigm centers, we only spec them in when size is an issue. The 290 for $250 more is much better.

The 190 retails for $299. The 290 offers a fuller sound, the 190 is a pretty small center channel when it comes to Paradigm centers, we only spec them in when size is an issue. The 290 for $250 more is much better.

Thanks for the response as this answers my question fully. The dealer representative I talked to suggested I go with the 290 for fuller sound, so I suppose I'll wait until I have enough dough to buy it. He retailed the beast to I think around $450. So that sounds in line to what you priced. Good to know!

THE HOLIDAY ON MONDAY DELAYED MY SPEAKERS ANOTHER DAY so I will not get them unit June 3rd. Sorry I just needed to vent and now that my old speakers sold and are gone it is just me and a little sound bar on my TV.

Alright I feel better now, sorry. :o

THE HOLIDAY ON MONDAY DELAYED MY SPEAKERS ANOTHER DAY so I will not get them unit June 3rd. Sorry I just needed to vent and now that my old speakers sold and are gone it is just me and a little sound bar on my TV.

Alright I feel better now, sorry. :o

hey DL I knew exactly how you feel!!I did the same thing.boxed up all the old speakers and diconnected everything and then was told some of the speakers were on back order!!had to listen to those darn cheap little speakers on the TV:rolleyes:

but hey,they'll be here before you know it and you'll be posting pictures:D

just trying to cheer you up a little;)

hey DL I knew exactly how you feel!!I did the same thing.boxed up all the old speakers and diconnected everything and then was told some of the speakers were on back order!!had to listen to those darn cheap little speakers on the TV:rolleyes:

but hey,they'll be here before you know it and you'll be posting pictures:D

just trying to cheer you up a little;)

You have no idea how many photos I am going to post on here when they arrive. It will be like a new parent and their first child. I just hope there is no damage during shipping. I work in the transportation industry so I know these things can happen from time to time.

I just want to reiterate how much I love my Paradigm speakers. I'm really, really, happy. LOL.

Thanks for the response as this answers my question fully. The dealer representative I talked to suggested I go with the 290 for fuller sound, so I suppose I'll wait until I have enough dough to buy it. He retailed the beast to I think around $450. So that sounds in line to what you priced. Good to know!

I just got the 290 for $345 Canadian, so I'm sure if you looked around you could get a better price. I would give it a try anyway.

Hey guys I was wondering can I hurt my speakers by playing them too loud before a couple hundred hours? I am playing my S4s at about -12dB on my Pioneer SC-27 but it seems as if they go any louder they might burst. So is -12dB too loud for a brand new pair of sigs? Does this pose any threat?

Hey guys I was wondering can I hurt my speakers by playing them too loud before a couple hundred hours? I am playing my S4s at about -12dB on my Pioneer SC-27 but it seems as if they go any louder they might burst. So is -12dB too loud for a brand new pair of sigs? Does this pose any threat?

If the picture is true indicator, it's a small room with quite a few bare walls. That combination is likely why it is so loud at -12 db, you're effectively in an echo chamber. The Sigs should be fine, but your ears might not be. ;)

I just remodeled our home theater room and sold my Monitor 9 v1 so I'm looking for new fronts. The rooms is fairly small, 13.5' x 13.5' with viewing/listening area about 10' from the screen. I have a LCR-350 for my center, 2 8" ceiling mounted surrounds and a Sony SA-WM250 (8" active subwoofer) so I'm looking for matching fronts and limited to bookshelf type speakers. I was looking at the Atom, Mini or Titan.

I have an older receiver and looking to upgrade to probably an Onkyo SR-508 or 608 unless there are any other suggestions. I can only see a 5.1 setup given the room arrangement, the door is in the back center of the room. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

I just got the 290 for $345 Canadian, so I'm sure if you looked around you could get a better price. I would give it a try anyway.

Wow $328 is a good deal. I'll try to shop around and see if I can manage something like that. Who knows, maybe you're getting a domestic discount!

I find my 100's sound better with a higher crossover as well(100hz) but don't have enough subs right now for perfect intergration. With the size of my room dual subs should be enough. Everything is more dynamic and has less distortion with a higher crossover, that's what I find. You'll have to post pics of the new monsters when there're all finished.

If you follow odyssey at all, they recommend 120 crossover for LFE, anybody crossing over the 100s at 120?

If you follow odyssey at all, they recommend 120 crossover for LFE, anybody crossing over the 100s at 120?

I prefer the Iliad.:)

Actually, Audyssey and most folks on these boards recommend raising the LPF for the LFE channel (which is decidedly NOT the crossover to any other speakers) to 120 Hz so you don't lose info from the dedicated low frequency effects (.1) channel. Generally, Audyssey and others on this board do recommend setting even speakers like the 100s so that they are subject to bass management, if only because the biggest room problems are typically inthe bass and Audyssey has significantly more corrective filters available for the subwoofer channel to deal with this. But the most typical suggestion is 80 Hz, because you potentially begin to be able to localize the sub at higher crossover levels. Many of us use lower than 80 Hz crossovers for our speakers that can handle lower frequencies. I sure would not start at 100 or 120 for Studio 100s unless you had a really intractible bass issue in those frequencies and noticed significantly better correction using the higher crossover.

hey guys (especially Rick and Z) here's some more pics of my bedroom set-up. All comments are much appreciated:

just a few more

I prefer the Iliad.:)

Actually, Audyssey and most folks on these boards recommend raising the LPF for the LFE channel (which is decidedly NOT the crossover to any other speakers) to 120 Hz so you don't lose info from the dedicated low frequency effects (.1) channel. Generally, Audyssey and others on this board do recommend setting even speakers like the 100s so that they are subject to bass management, if only because the biggest room problems are typically inthe bass and Audyssey has significantly more corrective filters available for the subwoofer channel to deal with this. But the most typical suggestion is 80 Hz, because you potentially begin to be able to localize the sub at higher crossover levels. Many of us use lower than 80 Hz crossovers for our speakers that can handle lower frequencies. I sure would not start at 100 or 120 for Studio 100s unless you had a really intractible bass issue in those frequencies and noticed significantly better correction using the higher crossover.

Right you are, I was getting settings confused. I think with my current setup I have 120 LPF & 80 one the mains. I going to be hooking up Dual ULS15 so I am hoping not to have a bass issue. How low would you recommend using for the 100s?

I just had a demo with some Paradigm mini monitors for fronts with the CC190 center. They sounded great, especially with a good sub. They seemed pretty bright as opposed to warm. Is this a correct assesment on Paradigm?

I was quoted at $765 for the three speakers. If I add the atom monitors for surround I am looking at $1030. Does this sound like a good price? How are these in comparison to the Cinema product line for HT?

I prefer the Iliad.:)

Actually, Audyssey and most folks on these boards recommend raising the LPF for the LFE channel (which is decidedly NOT the crossover to any other speakers) to 120 Hz so you don't lose info from the dedicated low frequency effects (.1) channel. Generally, Audyssey and others on this board do recommend setting even speakers like the 100s so that they are subject to bass management, if only because the biggest room problems are typically inthe bass and Audyssey has significantly more corrective filters available for the subwoofer channel to deal with this. But the most typical suggestion is 80 Hz, because you potentially begin to be able to localize the sub at higher crossover levels. Many of us use lower than 80 Hz crossovers for our speakers that can handle lower frequencies. I sure would not start at 100 or 120 for Studio 100s unless you had a really intractible bass issue in those frequencies and noticed significantly better correction using the higher crossover.

If multiple subs are used the localization becomes a non issue and free's the reciever of trying to play low notes that eat up headroom. I'm using MCACC and the PBK with careful setup of each. Until I get another Sub 15 the crossover has been moved back to 80hz. After the second sub is added I will try 100hz again and see how it sounds, but I still think that having the amp and speakers playing well above their range sounds more dynamic and has less distortion. The only thing is that you need multiple subs to combat the localization.

just a few more

slick looking bedroom setup man :cool:

If multiple subs are used the localization becomes a non issue and free's the reciever of trying to play low notes that eat up headroom. I'm using MCACC and the PBK with careful setup of each. Until I get another Sub 15 the crossover has been moved back to 80hz. After the second sub is added I will try 100hz again and see how it sounds, but I still think that having the amp and speakers playing well above their range sounds more dynamic and has less distortion. The only thing is that you need multiple subs to combat the localization.

Never had a multisub setup but it seems to me that if your subs are outputting frequencies that your ears identify as directionally emanating from the subs, adding subs just makes those sounds seem to come from more locations that are not (perhaps) spatially related to the "main" part of the sound.

Right you are, I was getting settings confused. I think with my current setup I have 120 LPF & 80 one the mains. I going to be hooking up Dual ULS15 so I am hoping not to have a bass issue. How low would you recommend using for the 100s?

Play with it. I've only heard the 100s for limited time periods but they seem to have very solid bass atleast to 40 Hz-ish. It may be that in your room the sub blends betterwith the L&R at some specific crossoverfrequency (my general bias at least used to be that this would typically be a lower frequency crossover so you get more of the coherent voice of the main speakers.

I will say, however, that in my system when it's set up right, (using 3 different sets of front speakers over time, with the sub between the front L & R speakers) I've fiddled with different crossovers from 40 to 100 and while there may be some differences, they are not startling, or even significant to me. So it becomes a question of how much you want to offload the harder work of deeper frequencies from the 100s (which may be kind of personal preference) versus how much you want to take advantage of the higher level of Audyssey correction in the sub channel. I recommend that, especially if you listen near reference from time to time, you at least try the "tried and true" 80 Hz crossover, just because another of my general biases is speakers working less hard will generally sound better than speakers working hard. I am reasonably certain that the 100s themselves will not be offended by having the higher crossover setting. It's us users who fret over not making (or letting) them play just as deep as they are able to.

It's us users who fret over not making (or letting) them play just as deep as they are able to.

This is entirely untrue, unless you do not have a capable sub.

If the dual ULS-15's sound as good as everyone says they do, why wouldn't you cross your 100's over at the THX recco'd 80hz? Even if the 100's are rated to 44hz, most will recco crossing at least 1 octave higher. The dual subs will do a MUCH better job of reproducing anything under 80hz, so use the 100's for their strengths and use the ULS-15's for their strengths. Why would you buy two great subs that can do justice and reference levels (115db peaks in the sub range of 20 to 80hz or so) and replace them with tower speakers that simply can't?

I have S2's, supposedly rated to 52hz according to Paradigm's site. I cross them at 120hz. That relieves my amps significantly of anything below 120hz which therefore makes my fronts/center and rears sound cleaner with more power while my separate proamp does justice for my dual subs.

Take a note from Warpdrv. The man has S8's (S8's!!) and crosses his fronts above 100hz I believe (possibly 120 or 150) for a reason. His subs are way more capable than his S8's below that range.

But maybe we're just plain dumb ... ;)

I need some help setting up my Denon AVR-789 with my Monitor 7s.
When playing with the crossover freqs., I don't hear a difference between setting it at 40hz and at 250hz. Since my ears apparently suck, what should I have them crossovered (not a word :p) at?

I don't have a sub, if that changes anything. I just don't want to give my new speakers really low sounds and have them break on me.

I need some help setting up my Denon AVR-789 with my Monitor 7s.
When playing with the crossover freqs., I don't hear a difference between setting it at 40hz and at 250hz. Since my ears apparently suck, what should I have them crossovered (not a word :p) at?

I don't have a sub, if that changes anything. I just don't want to give my new speakers really low sounds and have them break on me.

If you just have the 7s in front, there's nothing to cross over. They would cross over to the sub. Surrounds and center may cross over to the fronts. If you have surrounds and can't hear a difference, pick one. Did you run Audyssey? What crossovers were suggested after the autosetup routine? Don't go any lower than that. But again, if there's no sub and no surrounds or center, no crossover setting is going to do anything.

If you just have the 7s in front, there's nothing to cross over. They would cross over to the sub. Surrounds and center may cross over to the fronts. If you have surrounds and can't hear a difference, pick one. Did you run Audyssey? What crossovers were suggested after the autosetup routine? Don't go any lower than that. But again, if there's no sub and no surrounds or center, no crossover setting is going to do anything.

Well my center channel is waiting on cables to be run across the ceiling, so its just a 2.0 setup at the moment.
I guess I just really know how a crossover works.

If I set the receiver to crossover the front speaker channels to 80Hz, won't it cut out all signals lower than that, so that the speakers only receive/play the higher freqs?

hey DL I knew exactly how you feel!!I did the same thing.boxed up all the old speakers and diconnected everything and then was told some of the speakers were on back order!!had to listen to those darn cheap little speakers on the TV:rolleyes:

but hey,they'll be here before you know it and you'll be posting pictures:D

just trying to cheer you up a little;)

If you follow odyssey at all, they recommend 120 crossover for LFE, anybody crossing over the 100s at 120?

That seems like a waste of the speakers given what they are capable of doing. You are also asking a lot from the sub to handle 25 to 120. Not disagreeing but it just seems like a waste of a good speaker that is fully capable of going to 45-50 and up.

Well my center channel is waiting on cables to be run across the ceiling, so its just a 2.0 setup at the moment.
I guess I just really know how a crossover works.

If I set the receiver to crossover the front speaker channels to 80Hz, won't it cut out all signals lower than that, so that the speakers only receive/play the higher freqs?

AFAIK, you'd have to tell the receiver you have a sub. Otherwise, it will not set a crossover when there is nothing to cross over to. At least that's the way my 989 seems to work. Why do you want to dump part of the frequencies for the fronts? If you just want to hear what it sounds like, go crazy. Set the sub to yes and try different crossover points.

hey guys (especially Rick and Z) here's some more pics of my bedroom set-up. All comments are much appreciated:

just a few more

great job with the camera Kw!!very nice setup!!wish I could set one up in my room!!I guess I'm lucky enough to have one in the living room:rolleyes:

I know that setup has to rock in that room!!I'm a little jealous;)

thanks for posting pics of your setup!!

Well my center channel is waiting on cables to be run across the ceiling, so its just a 2.0 setup at the moment.
I guess I just really know how a crossover works.

If I set the receiver to crossover the front speaker channels to 80Hz, won't it cut out all signals lower than that, so that the speakers only receive/play the higher freqs?

you're correct!they will only play from 80Hz and above.if you dont have a sub try going lower if your speakers are capable!!

you're correct!they will only play from 80Hz and above.if you dont have a sub try going lower if your speakers are capable!!

K, thanks :).

Does anyone know what my Mon7 V.3s are capable of? I want to go as low as possible without risking destroying something in the speaker.

Just to make sure: Even without a sub, the crossover settings will still block those frequencies off from the speakers, right?

The 190 retails for $299. The 290 offers a fuller sound, the 190 is a pretty small center channel when it comes to Paradigm centers, we only spec them in when size is an issue. The 290 for $250 more is much better.$299 is the pre-April 1st price. Current FMV for the CC-190v.6 is $349 US.

Also, the SA-15R lists for $449ea, SA-15R-SM for $529ea, SA-15R-30 for $599ea.

I've used the SA-15R-SM's on a few occasions as a surround to emulate the dispersion of a dipole, or bipole in this case, by paralleling the input terminals, as long as the amp can handle the load (which most Studio-based systems have). It helps to decrease the directivity that normally occurs when you use a ceiling speaker as a surround, especially for any listeners located under the speaker.

you're correct!they will only play from 80Hz and above.if you dont have a sub try going lower if your speakers are capable!!

No, a cross-over of 80 will simply cause what is sent to the fronts/centre, etc. to roll off at 80hz. So your reciever will still send a signal to your fronts and other speakers below 80hz, but rolling them off at 12db I believe (or was it 24db?).

With dual ULS-15's, trust me, please, there is ZERO reason to cross your speakers at anything below 80hz. Let your speakers do what they do best, play signals above 80hz while your GREAT subs take care of the signals below that.

But by all means, do set up your subs correctly (ensure phase and signal level are correct), and try a 40hz, 60, 80 and even 100hz cross over. If you've setup your subs correctly, you will most definitely enjoy the 80hz or possibly 100hz the most. The subs are simply WAY more capable at reproducing those frequencies.

Don't waste the $2.5k or whatever you spent on the HSU duals which are known for their SQ.

I did this same test with my bro and his Mirage OM-7s (rated to 30hz I believe, so EVEN lower than the 100's). He insisted on crossing at 40/60hz and even leaving them as "large" until we did this test. Now he crosses at 80hz with his SVS TV-12 Ultra and everything has more punch and sounds better.

But to each his own!

No, a cross-over of 80 will simply cause what is sent to the fronts/centre, etc. to roll off at 80hz. So your reciever will still send a signal to your fronts and other speakers below 80hz, but rolling them off at 12db I believe (or was it 24db?).

With dual ULS-15's, trust me, please, there is ZERO reason to cross your speakers at anything below 80hz. Let your speakers do what they do best, play signals above 80hz while your GREAT subs take care of the signals below that.

But by all means, do set up your subs correctly (ensure phase and signal level are correct), and try a 40hz, 60, 80 and even 100hz cross over. If you've setup your subs correctly, you will most definitely enjoy the 80hz or possibly 100hz the most. The subs are simply WAY more capable at reproducing those frequencies.

Don't waste the $2.5k or whatever you spent on the HSU duals which are known for their SQ.

I did this same test with my bro and his Mirage OM-7s (rated to 30hz I believe, so EVEN lower than the 100's). He insisted on crossing at 40/60hz and even leaving them as "large" until we did this test. Now he crosses at 80hz with his SVS TV-12 Ultra and everything has more punch and sounds better.

But to each his own!
Umm, I don't have any subs. I'm simply trying to make sure that allowing the speakers to receive signals under 80Hz wouldn't break them.

Sorry, got you mixed up with pgodden, in any event, the comment that a 80hz cross over prevents anything below 80 going to your fronts is not necessarily true!

You might look at the manual to confirm, but as I said before, I don't think that you can turn on a crossover if the receiver does not think there is a speaker (in this case a sub) to send the crossed over info to. So tell your receiver you have a sub, then put the crossover wherever you want to. If the receiver thinks there's a sub, it will implement whatever crossover you select, rolling off the bass that goes to the main speakers.

You can look at the specs on the Paradigm website to see how low the 7s are specified to go.

You can look at the specs on the Paradigm website to see how low the 7s are specified to go.

Specs are here (http://paradigm.com/en/paradigm/speaker_only-specification-17-1-2-4.paradigm).
Is that 41Hz what I'm looking for? What about the 700Hz thing?
Only problem is that the V.6 is a whole other beast compared to my V.3s. Extra one of those black lower speakers (with the flat center, not the sharp center like the top woofer). I wonder how much better the new ones are :confused:.

Umm, I don't have any subs. I'm simply trying to make sure that allowing the speakers to receive signals under 80Hz wouldn't break them.

sorry but what I really meant to say was to set your speakers to fullband or full range if you dont have a sub.that's what Audyssey would probably set your speakers at anyway!!not sure if raising the trim levels would change much beigns you dont have a sub!!also in your AVR you must select "no sub"!!

but start with the full range/band setting and see what they sound like and tinker with your trim settings to see if this will change anything for you listening tastes!!

Sorry, got you mixed up with pgodden, in any event, the comment that a 80hz cross over prevents anything below 80 going to your fronts is not necessarily true!

lol.......Hi pbc,
I was about to meniton that unitl I saw your post.

if setting your L/R and center to 80Hz isnt that where the roll off sends anything below 80Hz to your sub "if" one has one?I'm not saying it doesnt for sure send anything below the 80Hz to all three fronts,but isnt that the whole idea of setting the trim levels to get roll off to the sub so the fronts dont have to handle the load below 80Hz?

BTW....didnt you send some speakers ot paradigm to get repaired?did you get them back yet?

Z

a little off topic but do any of you guys watch Palladia HD channel.they're always having live concerts on.this weekend it's a 3 day marathon of classic rock concerts.I'm watching Journey Live in Manilla!!

pretty awesome.and they have plenty more to come thru the weekend and monday!!check it out!!!

No, a cross-over of 80 will simply cause what is sent to the fronts/centre, etc. to roll off at 80hz. So your reciever will still send a signal to your fronts and other speakers below 80hz, but rolling them off at 12db I believe (or was it 24db?).

With dual ULS-15's, trust me, please, there is ZERO reason to cross your speakers at anything below 80hz. Let your speakers do what they do best, play signals above 80hz while your GREAT subs take care of the signals below that.

But by all means, do set up your subs correctly (ensure phase and signal level are correct), and try a 40hz, 60, 80 and even 100hz cross over. If you've setup your subs correctly, you will most definitely enjoy the 80hz or possibly 100hz the most. The subs are simply WAY more capable at reproducing those frequencies.

Don't waste the $2.5k or whatever you spent on the HSU duals which are known for their SQ.

I did this same test with my bro and his Mirage OM-7s (rated to 30hz I believe, so EVEN lower than the 100's). He insisted on crossing at 40/60hz and even leaving them as "large" until we did this test. Now he crosses at 80hz with his SVS TV-12 Ultra and everything has more punch and sounds better.

But to each his own!

So let me get this right in this pea brain of mine if I understand you correctly. I will try to make this as non tech as possible so even I can understand what Im saying.
I know if I have this question others out there do also. And thats what many of us are here to do, learn. So, If I understand you correctly, the x-over at 80 on my fronts/center still allows everything below 80 to be played by the speaker, but the signal below 80 gets "rolled off" at a certain decibel level (not played full volume setting in reference to your amplification) That signal below 80 (if that is where you have your sub set too) is sent to and picked up by the sub and played to the volume level that you have your sub set to. You have to adjust your phase alignment on the sub to make sure that the beats or signals of your mains (even though they are not playing full power on those signals below 80) play at the same time so you dont for a lack of better words hear it twice, once on the mains at the "roll off" then again by the sub. Is that correct?
So what happens if you have your mains x-over at 80 and your sub is set to 40 or 120? And, what determins the roll-off db? Or has that

Anyone? Anyone?

No, a cross-over of 80 will simply cause what is sent to the fronts/centre, etc. to roll off at 80hz. So your reciever will still send a signal to your fronts and other speakers below 80hz, but rolling them off at 12db I believe (or was it 24db?).

With dual ULS-15's, trust me, please, there is ZERO reason to cross your speakers at anything below 80hz. Let your speakers do what they do best, play signals above 80hz while your GREAT subs take care of the signals below that.

But by all means, do set up your subs correctly (ensure phase and signal level are correct), and try a 40hz, 60, 80 and even 100hz cross over. If you've setup your subs correctly, you will most definitely enjoy the 80hz or possibly 100hz the most. The subs are simply WAY more capable at reproducing those frequencies.

Don't waste the $2.5k or whatever you spent on the HSU duals which are known for their SQ.

I did this same test with my bro and his Mirage OM-7s (rated to 30hz I believe, so EVEN lower than the 100's). He insisted on crossing at 40/60hz and even leaving them as "large" until we did this test. Now he crosses at 80hz with his SVS TV-12 Ultra and everything has more punch and sounds better.

But to each his own!

Thanks pbc, This is the same that I have heard elsewhere on the board. It is my understanding that it is better to send more rather than less to the Subwooofers as they can handle the lowere frequencies much better and hence unloading that responsibility from the Main Receiver.

I know the studio 100s are rated down into the 40s, I will probably start by crossing them over at 80 and let the HSU handle everything else

vision,

That's sort of right. Crossovers aren't brick walls, they don't just stop at the set frequency. If you set your speakers' crossover to 80hz, that's the point where everything below that frequency will begin to diminish in "volume".
Just for examples sake (these aren't real numbers), at 70hz the signals' volume could be down 50% and at 60hz down 75%. The amount or quickness of that reduction is called the slope, the steeper the slope the more of a "brick-wall" effect you're going to get but it's never absolute.

The idea then is to have the slopes of the speaker and sub to intersect to form as straight a (volume) line as possible through the crossover point.

Thanks pbc, This is the same that I have heard elsewhere on the board. It is my understanding that it is better to send more rather than less to the Subwooofers as they can handle the lowere frequencies much better and hence unloading that responsibility from the Main Receiver.

I know the studio 100s are rated down into the 40s, I will probably start by crossing them over at 80 and let the HSU handle everything else

That depends on what you're after, if it's reducing the load on your amps that would work, but if it's musical "accuracy" you want, you might want to measure the in-room response of your mains and see where they begin to drop off and maybe set the crossover about 10db above that.

Basically this is what Audyssey Pro does when it calculates the crossovers, it will "recommend" a crossover to use on a drop down list, with the preferred frequency being the first selectable option.

That depends on what you're after, if it's reducing the load on your amps that would work, but if it's musical "accuracy" you want you might want to measure the in-room response of your mains and see where they begin to drop off and maybe set the crossover about 10db above that.

Basically this is what Audyssey Pro does when it calculates the crossovers, it will "recommend" a crossover to use on a drop down list, with the preferred frequency being the first selectable option.

Ah ok...makes sense to me. I guess especially in the case of Music. I am using the Audyssey Multi EQ in the Onkyo 3007, it doesnt set crossovers effectivly as the people from Audyssey recommend raising the crossover right away regardless of what they are set at. like yourway better, is there a way to do it with out Pro?

Ah ok...makes sense to me. I guess especially in the case of Music. I am using the Audyssey Multi EQ in the Onkyo 3007, it doesnt set crossovers effectivly as the people from Audyssey recommend raising the crossover right away regardless of what they are set at. like yourway better, is there a way to do it with out Pro?

Well unfortunately, the on-board Audyssey is at the mercy of what Onkyo or the manufacturer determines as a large or small speaker so it can't set or recommend crossovers below that point. I think most use the ability to play below 80hz in-room as the "large" setting with no crossover. If Audyssey had its' way there would be no such thing as a "large" speaker and all speakers would be crossed over appropriately.

The only way to do it without Pro would be to use something like REW to measure your speakers' response and then set the crossovers, or by ear I guess.

vision,

That's sort of right. Crossovers aren't brick walls, they don't just stop at the set frequency. If you set your speakers' crossover to 80hz, that's the point where everything below that frequency will begin to diminish in "volume".
Just for examples sake (these aren't real numbers), at 70hz the signals' volume could be down 50% and at 60hz down 75%. The amount or quickness of that reduction is called the slope, the steeper the slope the more of a "brick-wall" effect you're going to get but it's never absolute.

The idea then is to have the slopes of the speaker and sub to intersect to form as straight a (volume) line as possible through the crossover point.
Thanks rnr,
Now that makes sense to me, in fact all the sense in the world. I know a lot of you veteran audiophiliacs out there probably rolled your eyes when I asked that question and said "vision", your a d&%$#*s. But, I bet just as many went Aha, now I understand. You see we are all at different levels here. And it is a response like rnr just gave that makes me come to this board. It is greatly appreciated.
So to the listener that sets a x-over at 80 without a sub, yet he tells the system that a sub is present, will still hear those frequencies below 80, but at a volume that will diminish proportional to the slope or roll off?

So does this correspond to the setting of large and small on your speakers?
So in theory in my 5.1 when I set my surround 20's to small the low frequencies do not go to the fronts and the sub is activated to pick up. But the frequency of the mains with a x-over at 80 will still play those frequencies, but at diminishing volumes or "roll off" corresponding to the slope and the x-over setting?
Any newbs, like me, out there trying to understand the basics with your 5.1 set your speakers to large and see if your sub activates. Then set your surrounds to small but leave fronts to large and see what happens.
And please tell me that I am not the only one on this forum that just realized this. :o

So to the listener that sets a x-over at 80 without a sub, yet he tells the system that a sub is present, will still hear those frequencies below 80, but at a volume that will diminish proportional to the slope or roll off?


Yes, but that would be pointless. The slopes AFIK, are pretty steep so you would hear virtually nothing at 10hz or so below the crossover.

So does this correspond to the setting of large and small on your speakers?
So in theory in my 5.1 when I set my surround 20's to small the low frequencies do not go to the fronts and the sub is activated to pick up. But the frequency of the mains with a x-over at 80 will still play those frequencies, but at diminishing volumes or "roll off" corresponding to the slope and the x-over setting?
Any newbs, like me, out there trying to understand the basics with your 5.1 set your speakers to large and see if your sub activates. Then set your surrounds to small but leave fronts to large and see what happens.
And please tell me that I am not the only one on this forum that just realized this. :o

Any signal below the crossover point for any speaker will be sent to the sub and not to other speakers - unless you specifically "tell" the system to send those signal to the mains, which you might do if you have full range speakers and no sub.

Any signal below the crossover point for any speaker will be sent to the sub and not to other speakers - unless you specifically "tell" the system to send those signal to the mains, which you might do if you have full range speakers and no sub.

Thanks rnr, makes sense.

Well unfortunately, the on-board Audyssey is at the mercy of what Onkyo or the manufacturer determines as a large or small speaker so it can't set or recommend crossovers below that point. I think most use the ability to play below 80hz in-room as the "large" setting with no crossover. If Audyssey had its' way there would be no such thing as a "large" speaker and all speakers would be crossed over appropriately.

The only way to do it without Pro would be to use something like REW to measure your speakers' response and then set the crossovers, or by ear I guess.

Thanks thats great info

Thee last 2 pages have been very enlightening. Thank you RnR and this is exactly why I come to this board as well. I feel like I just learned another very important thing today. ;)

Well unfortunately, the on-board Audyssey is at the mercy of what Onkyo or the manufacturer determines as a large or small speaker so it can't set or recommend crossovers below that point.

I should clarify that statement. Audyssey can't set the crossovers automatically if they're below the manufacturers "large" designation but when you manually change them it still does EQ properly with those crossovers "in mind"... so to speak.

And you can't, with typical consumer gear, set the kind of mismatched rolloffs for the crossover that he described. If you could, then there would be a range of frequencies in between the mains and sub that would play back at lower volume than they should - - there would be a holein the overall frequency response. But a typical receiver lets you select only one crossover point for the hand-off from mains to sub. Typically the crossover point is, by definition, the frequency at which both mains and sub are 3 dB "quieter"--when you add 2 equal signals together the sum is 3 dB louder, so this brings it back to where it should be or "flat" frequency response.

hi everyone.

I managed to audition the anthony gallos 3.5 over the weekend (and also the 5ls :P). I also auditioned the paradigm studio 100s.

I am thinking of going back to listen to the 3.5s again . But from the experience, the sound stage of the 3.5 is pretty cool and vocals were crystal clear. We listened to linkin park as one of the songs and man the vocals were really distinct from the music - that was good for us.

With the paradigms the linkin park track sound more mushed together. the vocals didn't come out as clear or crisp as the gallos but honestly when we had say the instrumentals (pianos) on the studios - that was very, very, very nice.

I was just wondering if anyone had had to make a decision between the studio 100s and the gallos 3.5. I understand there is no perfect speakers but I just wanted to know if there is anyone in the same boat and what they are considering now or perhaps what has influenced them to choose one over the other?

Also it would be great to know if someone who owns or even demoed the paradigm signature 8s and the gallos - what would you say the differences are? thanks again for all your input

That depends on what you're after, if it's reducing the load on your amps that would work, but if it's musical "accuracy" you want, you might want to measure the in-room response of your mains and see where they begin to drop off and maybe set the crossover about 10db above that.

Basically this is what Audyssey Pro does when it calculates the crossovers, it will "recommend" a crossover to use on a drop down list, with the preferred frequency being the first selectable option.

Curious. I know that Audyssey will cross my S2's at 40hz, but the S2's are rated to 47hz IIRC per Paradigm, but in any event, the thought of passing a reference level peak of 105 (or is it 115 at 40hz) to my S2 at that frequency or anything below say 80 would frighten me.

That's the reason I thought most recco'd setting the x-over 1 octave above the -3db point if you have a capable sub(s)? To protect from over driving the woofers on the speakers, and not just to relieve your amp of some duty?

The further up you go with crossover, the more likely the subwoofer becomes localizable, say above 110 - 120hz, but keep in mind that generally the people with 1 sub are the ones that have issues with this.... your Duals on the front wall below your speakers, so your less apt to have an issue....

I am very close to pulling the trigger on the SVS PB13-Ultra and wanted to know if it works nicely with the Studio 100s? I am going to get it in the gloss black so it will run about $1900 delivered. Can anyone comment on how well the Ultra works in their set up or recommend another sub. I watch 60% movies and listen to 40% music.

Curious. I know that Audyssey will cross my S2's at 40hz, but the S2's are rated to 47hz IIRC per Paradigm, but in any event, the thought of passing a reference level peak of 105 (or is it 115 at 40hz) to my S2 at that frequency or anything below say 80 would frighten me.

That's the reason I thought most recco'd setting the x-over 1 octave above the -3db point if you have a capable sub(s)? To protect from over driving the woofers on the speakers, and not just to relieve your amp of some duty?

They maybe be rated to 47hz, but might be capable of playing lower depending on placement in the actual room.

I think we can over think this thing a bit too much, most speakers do fine in a 2ch setting with no crossovers at all. The only thing you might have to protect against in an HT environment is the LFE that reaches lower frequencies than music typically does. There's usually settings in the pre-amp or receiver to limit that channels' range if you're directing it to your mains.

I am very close to pulling the trigger on the SVS PB13-Ultra and wanted to know if it works nicely with the Studio 100s? I am going to get it in the gloss black so it will run about $1900 delivered. Can anyone comment on how well the Ultra works in their set up or recommend another sub. I watch 60% movies and listen to 40% music.

At that price point I'd get two Rythmiks, which besides possibly giving more output and musical accuracy, would give you the option of placing them to negate room modes.

Or two Epic Emipres.

i'm waiting on some S2s to come on ebay or audiogon.....whichever first....but i want them for $1300 and no more. i should have bought them when i bought the S4s now they are gone.

Dude get the SVS you wont be disappointed!!

I am very close to pulling the trigger on the SVS PB13-Ultra and wanted to know if it works nicely with the Studio 100s? I am going to get it in the gloss black so it will run about $1900 delivered. Can anyone comment on how well the Ultra works in their set up or recommend another sub. I watch 60% movies and listen to 40% music.

I've never heard the Ultra but at that price, have you heard the Paradigm Sub12? I have 2 of them and they are excellent.

Well, my speakers are apparently being tested in the anechoic chamber as the P&S dept didn't hear anything wrong with the CC.

Can't imagine it's anything but, given the swapping of receivers and speaker cable!!

At that price point I'd get two Rythmiks, which besides possibly giving more output and musical accuracy, would give you the option of placing them to negate room modes.

Or two Epic Emipres.

+1 to either of these options. For sheer output i'd vote for the Empires, for better overall SQ I'd vote dual Rythmiks :cool:

At that price point I'd get two Rythmiks, which besides possibly giving more output and musical accuracy, would give you the option of placing them to negate room modes.

Could you please expand on this?

Here is my plan for a 5.1 system


Paradigm Monitor 9 version 6 Mains
Paradigm CC 390 version 6 center
Paradigm Mini Monitor version 6 surrounds
Rythmic F15SE Subwoofer

Considering I will be mating the paradigms to the Rythmic F15 what should I set my xovers at?


I am thinking about 80Hz and setting the fronts to large:confused:


P.S. Keep in mind I will eventually upgrade to a 7.2 system with a 2nd F15 and either another pair of Minis or perhaps 2 ADP 390s

Considering I will be mating the paradigms to the Rythmic F15 what should I set my xovers at?..
I am thinking about 80Hz and setting the fronts to large:confused:



There's nothing wrong with 80hz, it's a THX standard crossover. With a Rythmik in the mix you'll probably want to crossover your mains there too.

If you do go to two subs, you should have a room correction in your receiver that is capable of running two subs or else blending them properly can get very tricky. You can't just plop two subs into a room willy-nilly and expect good results.

hi everyone.

I managed to audition the anthony gallos 3.5 over the weekend (and also the 5ls :P). I also auditioned the paradigm studio 100s.

I am thinking of going back to listen to the 3.5s again . But from the experience, the sound stage of the 3.5 is pretty cool and vocals were crystal clear. We listened to linkin park as one of the songs and man the vocals were really distinct from the music - that was good for us.

With the paradigms the linkin park track sound more mushed together. the vocals didn't come out as clear or crisp as the gallos but honestly when we had say the instrumentals (pianos) on the studios - that was very, very, very nice.

I was just wondering if anyone had had to make a decision between the studio 100s and the gallos 3.5. I understand there is no perfect speakers but I just wanted to know if there is anyone in the same boat and what they are considering now or perhaps what has influenced them to choose one over the other?



Did you notice this difference on all songs or just linkin park? what other songs did you listen to by the same artist and other artist.

If you noticed this difference across the board I would go with the gallos. If you only noticed it on one track then more listening is needed before making a final decision.

At that price point I'd get two Rythmiks, which besides possibly giving more output and musical accuracy, would give you the option of placing them to negate room modes.

Do you need to buy an EQ to control subs? I think my 4308 can only control one sub not 2 so how it is done?

Did you notice this difference on all songs or just linkin park? what other songs did you listen to by the same artist and other artist.

If you noticed this difference across the board I would go with the gallos. If you only noticed it on one track then more listening is needed before making a final decision.

We had also played songs by diana krall, some cello pieces on both speakers. The studios had a warmer, reverb effect to it that made it feel as if you were present with all the cello /piano /classical pieces. Every note was just gliding through. Superb.

The vocals as mentioned before were less crisp. With the Diana krall track, there was a lot more hiss audible compared to on the gallos. I then watched TDK bluray to hear the centre perform and the vocals /dialogue were once again 'mushy'.

We watched Xmen on the gallos and I found that the dialogue was clear but it was a strange feeling to 'feel' that the dialogue was not coming from the centre speaker - it was like i couldn't detect the position of the speaker from which the dialogue was coming out from.

Additionally for S8 owners, would you be able to tell me if the S8's would be crispier than the Studio 100s? I am still trying very hard to audition the S8s but at this point in time no such luck. So if some of the privileged owners could help me out here, I'd appreciate that greatly! :D

Additionally for S8 owners, would you be able to tell me if the S8's would be crispier than the Studio 100s? I am still trying very hard to audition the S8s but at this point in time no such luck. So if some of the privileged owners could help me out here, I'd appreciate that greatly! :D

What city do you live in? It might help if the local members knew where you lived... Thanks. :D

What city do you live in? It might help if the local members knew where you lived... Thanks. :D

HEHEHE true! But the reason I didn't go there is because I assumed that everyone here is mainly from the States or close. I am actually residing in Australia.

HEHEHE true! But the reason I didn't go there is because I assumed that everyone here is mainly from the States or close. I am actually residing in Australia.

You might have some local members in Australia with some S8.. ;)

There's nothing wrong with 80hz, it's a THX standard crossover. With a Rythmik in the mix you'll probably want to crossover your mains there too.

If you do go to two subs, you should have a room correction in your receiver that is capable of running two subs or else blending them properly can get very tricky. You can't just plop two subs into a room willy-nilly and expect good results.

Oh I will get a receiver or pre pro with room correction software for sure......

I am looking at several solutions from the Denon 4810 and 4311 to the HK 7550HD to the Onkyo 3007 to my current favorite, the Outlaw audio 998 (Trinnov)....

You might have some local members in Australia with some S8.. ;)

guess what?!!??!?! I managed to score a demo of the S8s this weekend. A shop where I demoed the Studio 100s was meeting with the paradigm folks today and yeah they will have the S8s for me to listen to.

The boss also asked me to re-listen to the studios. He said the demo guy made a slight mistake when we were in last saturday.

guess what?!!??!?! I managed to score a demo of the S8s this weekend. A shop where I demoed the Studio 100s was meeting with the paradigm folks today and yeah they will have the S8s for me to listen to.

The boss also asked me to re-listen to the studios. He said the demo guy made a slight mistake when we were in last saturday.

Glad to hear it. Looking forward to your thoughts. :D

guess what?!!??!?! I managed to score a demo of the S8s this weekend. A shop where I demoed the Studio 100s was meeting with the paradigm folks today and yeah they will have the S8s for me to listen to.

The boss also asked me to re-listen to the studios. He said the demo guy made a slight mistake when we were in last saturday.

Glad to hear it, can't wait to get you impressions on them.

Do you need to buy an EQ to control subs? I think my 4308 can only control one sub not 2 so how it is done?

Oh, I thought that receiver had dual sub outs. :rolleyes:

You'd have to run a Y splitter and set up each sub manually using their PEQ's and a measuring device like REW before running Audyssey. Another option is something like the SVS AS-EQ1 or Audyssey's SubEQ which are Audyssey based EQ's that work with your receivers' Audyssey and will do dual subs but that ups the price significantly.

Since this is the Paradigm thread, I'll keep it short and refer you to the subwoofer or audio setup forums which will have a lot more info on setting up dual subs.

Oh I will get a receiver or pre pro with room correction software for sure......

I am looking at several solutions from the Denon 4810 and 4311 to the HK 7550HD to the Onkyo 3007 to my current favorite, the Outlaw audio 998 (Trinnov)....

I know very little about Trinnov as an RC but I'm always a little wary of smaller companies like Outlaw who outsource production and don't really develop much of their own stuff, just because HDMI and its' implementation is such a moving target.

The 4810 is likely the strongest option of that list with three sub outs and Audyssey Pro capability. The 4311 should have dual subs & Pro capability.

I am very close to pulling the trigger on the SVS PB13-Ultra and wanted to know if it works nicely with the Studio 100s? I am going to get it in the gloss black so it will run about $1900 delivered. Can anyone comment on how well the Ultra works in their set up or recommend another sub. I watch 60% movies and listen to 40% music.

Hi DenonLover,

I cant speak about the difference between the other suggested subwoofers..but, I’ve been happy with my SVS-PB13 and studio 100’s combo. It’s very deep, hits you in the chest and grabs ya by the baby maker’s. Sending my lows (80hz and below) for music and home theater was a major improvement. The only negative thing I’ll say…..is it’s a very large beast and it put my wife into emotional shock. For the first 24HR’s, the only word I heard her say was “Noooooo”. She just kept moaning it over and over………

However, I’m confident you’ll find many satisfied customers at the “Official SVS Ultra 13 thread”

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=889659

I’ve been happy with my subwoofer so I haven’t really been shopping…but, their use to be a ranking with musical and a home theater scores. This one is outdated.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=9164136&postcount=8

http://www.tweakcityaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11

Hope this helps!

Ttt

i'm looking to purchase in ceiling speakers to act as my rear speakers in my ht setup. I currently have a denon 3808 and am running studio 60s up front with a cc-590 and a sub 15. My seating position is about 12 feet away from the speakers and projection screen.

I have narrowed down my selection to the sa-15r-sm and the sa-15r-30. I am trying to achieve the best clarity from the "rear" speakers and would like to know what the main differences are between these two?
Also, does anyone know what the msrp on these speakers is?

Thanks for your help.

Mark

Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12

This is a highly recommended speaker set up by my Paradigm dealer, and it has also been a highly recommended set up on Perfect Vision.
Now for my two questions.

SURROUNDS...since my surrounds are on the side walls and are about 8 inches from the back wall, would it be better to get the Studio 10's or maybe the Studio 20's for the rear surrounds over the Studio ADP-590's ? My reason is that some of the 590's speakers will ( may ? ) bounch off the rear wall. If I got either the 10's or the 20's I could mount them on the side wall and aim them where I wanted and no sound would bounce off the rear wall. They would be mounted about 6 1/2 feet high. And not to mention the 590's are about $1400.00 pair..while the 10's are $400.00 each or the 20's are $600.00 each....saving a few $$$$ would be great, but if the 590's would sound and work better, then they'll be chosen.

SUBWOOFER...while my current sub sounds good, it would be nice to get something better. I did not get to hear any of the Paradigm subs , since they did not have any in stock. They also sold both demos of the 12 and 15.

So, I somewhat find it hard to spend $2000.00 for the Sub12...let alone $2800.00 for the Sub 15. I'm open to suggestions for other subs that would hopefully be under $1000.00. I love good tight bass, and lots of it. And one that could work well in my size room. And I'm not opposed to keeping my Klipsch KSW-15 sub as long as it would sound good with the Paradigm's.
If you've heard the Paradigm subs, are they good ? Worth the $$$ ? I really can't afford the 15, so, would the 12 work for my room ?

I FORGOT TO MENTION THAT THIS SET UP WILL BE USED FOR ABOUT 95 % MOVIES AND 5% MUSIC

UPDATED...this is also for a 5.1 set up

Thanks in advance

Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12

This is a highly recommended speaker set up by my Paradigm dealer, and it has also been a highly recommended set up on Perfect Vision.
Now for my two questions.

SURROUNDS...since my surrounds are on the side walls and are about 8 inches from the back wall, would it be better to get the Studio 10's or maybe the Studio 20's for the rear surrounds over the Studio ADP-590's ? My reason is that some of the 590's speakers will ( may ? ) bounch off the rear wall. If I got either the 10's or the 20's I could mount them on the side wall and aim them where I wanted and no sound would bounce off the rear wall. They would be mounted about 6 1/2 feet high. And not to mention the 590's are about $1400.00 pair..while the 10's are $400.00 each or the 20's are $600.00 each....saving a few $$$$ would be great, but if the 590's would sound and work better, then they'll be chosen.

SUBWOOFER...while my current sub sounds good, it would be nice to get something better. I did not get to hear any of the Paradigm subs , since they did not have any in stock. They also sold both demos of the 12 and 15.

So, I somewhat find it hard to spend $2000.00 for the Sub12...let alone $2800.00 for the Sub 15. I'm open to suggestions for other subs that would hopefully be under $1000.00. I love good tight bass, and lots of it. And one that could work well in my size room. And I'm not opposed to keeping my Klipsch KSW-15 sub as long as it would sound good with the Paradigm's.
If you've heard the Paradigm subs, are they good ? Worth the $$$ ? I really can't afford the 15, so, would the 12 work for my room ?

I FORGOT TO MENTION THAT THIS SET UP WILL BE USED FOR ABOUT 95 % MOVIES AND 5% MUSIC

Thanks in advance

I have the same sized room and I also just made a decision last week to make a change but my system was not as nice you yours. I agree with everything they said except the sub, or the sub I would look at SVS PB13 Ultra for $1600 or you will also be told to check out the Rythmik subwoofer. Good luck with your decision and pretty much everybody in here knows way more than I do but I thought I would jump in. :D

I ended up going with the Studio 100s, CC-690, and the 590 rears and I think I am going to be buying the PB13 Ultra unless I can continue to talk myself out of it.

Ferrari,

If I read you correctly you're doing a 5.1 set up? If that's the case the position you mention for the ADP's is actually not a bad one. It will create a much more enveloping sound field than direct radiators like the 10's.

If you're doing 7.1 and thinking ADPs for both side and back, and you've got more than about three feet from either back or side walls to the listening position then direct radiators (10's or 20's) would work. Inside that distance from the listening position the diffusion of the ADPs would be a real benefit.

As to the sub, it's hard to recommend Paradigm's when you can get the equivalent of their 15" Servo from Rythmik at the price they sell it for. The niche internet companies are tough to beat, and as I recommended earlier the Rythmik would be my personal first choice having had the pleasure of owning a pair.

So my old receiver just died and I pulled the trigger on an Onkyo sr-608. After doing some research I'm nervous that the receiver is not equipped to power my speaker setup. I currently have 2 millennia 200's (left, right) a millennia 20, two millennia ADPs, and an ultracube 10.
Will this receiver hold it's own? Thanks in advance!
Btw, I use this setup mostly for watching tv/movies.

Hello folks,

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12


Personally I think the CC-490 wont' be able to keep up with the 60s. I have this exact same setup except I have a CC-590 for the center and I wish I had spent the extra coin to get the 690. Even the 590 doesn't really have the depth in the low end to match the 60s. This is most evident when you play a white noise sample around the room. The good news is that for movies it still works quite well. The center channel is very distinctive and easy to hear. But if you do any multi-channel music listening (like SACD) you may notice the difference in the center channel.

I also have the SUB-12. And yes it is an awesome subwoofer (it also weighs 90 pounds). Is it worth $2000? Well, maybe. I didn't do much comparison shopping on the sub so it is possible that you can find one just as good for less. I can say that the SUB-12 does an awesome job in my setup and provides an excellent diffuse (non-localized) sound.

So my old receiver just died and I pulled the trigger on an Onkyo sr-608. After doing some research I'm nervous that the receiver is not equipped to power my speaker setup. I currently have 2 millennia 200's (left, right) a millennia 20, two millennia ADPs, and an ultracube 10.
Will this receiver hold it's own? Thanks in advance!
Btw, I use this setup mostly for watching tv/movies.

So you are wondering if a 100w per channel receiver can power your set up? The truth is I do not know but I do know you will likely have your crossovers set to 80 so you will not likely be pushing them as hard as you might think. Do you have a sub to handle the lower end? Do you listen to music or watch movies and is it at reference levels?

I was going through the same thoughts just a few weeks ago and I decided not to get the amp. Good luck and not sure if I helped you. :o I get my speakers tomorrow at 3pm and I can promise everyone lots of photos of my new toys. I just hope no one will get sick of seeing all of the photos. I cannot wait to get them home tomorrow!!!!

Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12

This is a highly recommended speaker set up by my Paradigm dealer, and it has also been a highly recommended set up on Perfect Vision.
Now for my two questions.

SURROUNDS...since my surrounds are on the side walls and are about 8 inches from the back wall, would it be better to get the Studio 10's or maybe the Studio 20's for the rear surrounds over the Studio ADP-590's ? My reason is that some of the 590's speakers will ( may ? ) bounch off the rear wall. If I got either the 10's or the 20's I could mount them on the side wall and aim them where I wanted and no sound would bounce off the rear wall. They would be mounted about 6 1/2 feet high. And not to mention the 590's are about $1400.00 pair..while the 10's are $400.00 each or the 20's are $600.00 each....saving a few $$$$ would be great, but if the 590's would sound and work better, then they'll be chosen.

SUBWOOFER...while my current sub sounds good, it would be nice to get something better. I did not get to hear any of the Paradigm subs , since they did not have any in stock. They also sold both demos of the 12 and 15.

So, I somewhat find it hard to spend $2000.00 for the Sub12...let alone $2800.00 for the Sub 15. I'm open to suggestions for other subs that would hopefully be under $1000.00. I love good tight bass, and lots of it. And one that could work well in my size room. And I'm not opposed to keeping my Klipsch KSW-15 sub as long as it would sound good with the Paradigm's.
If you've heard the Paradigm subs, are they good ? Worth the $$$ ? I really can't afford the 15, so, would the 12 work for my room ?

I FORGOT TO MENTION THAT THIS SET UP WILL BE USED FOR ABOUT 95 % MOVIES AND 5% MUSIC

UPDATED...this is also for a 5.1 set up

Thanks in advance

I would highly recommend you go to at least a CC590 or a CC690!!you wont regret the extra $$!!I have a sub 15 and I'm more that satisfied with it's performance!!I didn't have the opportunity to test out too many other subs so I really cant say if there are subs that will perform as good as the sub 15 for less $$.all I mainly wanted all paradigms when I upgraded my system!!I also heard the sub 12 and its a great sub too!!
one thing I do like about the paradigm subs is the PBK-1 sub EQ system that I also purchased to EQ the sub.
I'm sure there are others here that have had experiance with more than one make of sub that can give there input!!
also I wanted to deal with one dealer for warranty purposes!!

good luck with your choice.keep us posted!!

edit:I recommend the 590's for your surrounds.to keep it short!!you'll love em!!

guess what?!!??!?! I managed to score a demo of the S8s this weekend. A shop where I demoed the Studio 100s was meeting with the paradigm folks today and yeah they will have the S8s for me to listen to.

The boss also asked me to re-listen to the studios. He said the demo guy made a slight mistake when we were in last saturday.
Hi ph3ng,

On my local forum, DTV Forum, a guy in Melbourne is selling his complete set of Paradigm Signature speakers - S8 v2 fronts, C3 v2 Center, S1 v2 Surrounds with Paradigm Stands.

Please refer to this thread:

http://www.dtvforum.info/index.php?showtopic=88391&hl=paradigm

Hope this helps.

Cheers.

Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12

This is a highly recommended speaker set up by my Paradigm dealer, and it has also been a highly recommended set up on Perfect Vision.
Now for my two questions.



If spending $2k to $3k is daunting and you want to keep it closer to $1k and you are partial to sealed subs, go with the F15 sub from Rythmik Audio (also available at Ascend Acoustics). It'll be about $1k with shipping. But won't do you justice in that size room with the huge openings. Alternatively the HSU ULS15 will also fit the bill, though slightly more expensive, but offers wireless connectivity and a sleeker looking cabinet.

Given you're post that you want 95% HT and you have a large room to fill, I'd personally recco two ported subs instead which will come out a tad more than $1k...:

E.g. ...

2 of these
http://www.svsound.com/products-sub-box-pb12nsd.cfm

2 of these
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-2-mk3.html

Both will be slightly more than your budget, but offer much more impact/slam in that size room.

If you are stuck to one sub and not married to sealed, I'd stretch the budget and go with say an SVS PB13 sub (under $2k)...

Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12

This is a highly recommended speaker set up by my Paradigm dealer, and it has also been a highly recommended set up on Perfect Vision.
Now for my two questions.

SURROUNDS...since my surrounds are on the side walls and are about 8 inches from the back wall, would it be better to get the Studio 10's or maybe the Studio 20's for the rear surrounds over the Studio ADP-590's ? My reason is that some of the 590's speakers will ( may ? ) bounch off the rear wall. If I got either the 10's or the 20's I could mount them on the side wall and aim them where I wanted and no sound would bounce off the rear wall. They would be mounted about 6 1/2 feet high. And not to mention the 590's are about $1400.00 pair..while the 10's are $400.00 each or the 20's are $600.00 each....saving a few $$$$ would be great, but if the 590's would sound and work better, then they'll be chosen.

SUBWOOFER...while my current sub sounds good, it would be nice to get something better. I did not get to hear any of the Paradigm subs , since they did not have any in stock. They also sold both demos of the 12 and 15.

So, I somewhat find it hard to spend $2000.00 for the Sub12...let alone $2800.00 for the Sub 15. I'm open to suggestions for other subs that would hopefully be under $1000.00. I love good tight bass, and lots of it. And one that could work well in my size room. And I'm not opposed to keeping my Klipsch KSW-15 sub as long as it would sound good with the Paradigm's.
If you've heard the Paradigm subs, are they good ? Worth the $$$ ? I really can't afford the 15, so, would the 12 work for my room ?

I FORGOT TO MENTION THAT THIS SET UP WILL BE USED FOR ABOUT 95 % MOVIES AND 5% MUSIC

UPDATED...this is also for a 5.1 set up

Thanks in advanceI would recommend Studio 20's and a CC-590 in the front instead of 60's and CC-490, unless you plan on running the front L&R full range when listening to music.

I would keep the ADP-590's, they will perform fine in that position.

The SUB12 is a great sub, and fantastic looking (if it will be visible in your installation), but if you can fit the larger, and cheaper ($1798), SVS Ultra-13 in the room it would be tough to beat. But I would ask your dealer if they would work with you price-wise on the SUB12 beforehand.

pbc,

I'm sure you know that even with a large opening to another room bass can be made good and powerful at the listening position. In fact there may be a slight advantage in terms of less room modes to deal with. That open space, in a way, can behave similar to a bass trap to improve accuracy. Sub placement can play a big role in achieving what you're after.
In my previous room (14 x 24 ) I had a man-door opening to a hallway and a 12' opening to a 15' x 15' foyer with an 18' ceiling. I had the tiny but powerful Seismic 12 in there and it was more than ample, in fact rocked the whole house. At least for movies, I didn't find it all that accurate for music because I had to corner load the sub for that kind of output and to compensate for the openings' effect.
All I'm trying to say is there's more than one way to skin a cat depending on what you're after. Some of the subs being mentioned here are HUGE and don't always pass the WAF. I think sealed servos, regardless of brand (Velodyne, Paradigm, Rythmik etc.) kind of give you the the best blend of all things bass without being the size of a fridge.
That being said.. if one can build an infinite baffle sub into the room somehow..........:p:p:p

Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12

This is a highly recommended speaker set up by my Paradigm dealer, and it has also been a highly recommended set up on Perfect Vision.
Now for my two questions.

SURROUNDS...since my surrounds are on the side walls and are about 8 inches from the back wall, would it be better to get the Studio 10's or maybe the Studio 20's for the rear surrounds over the Studio ADP-590's ? My reason is that some of the 590's speakers will ( may ? ) bounch off the rear wall. If I got either the 10's or the 20's I could mount them on the side wall and aim them where I wanted and no sound would bounce off the rear wall. They would be mounted about 6 1/2 feet high. And not to mention the 590's are about $1400.00 pair..while the 10's are $400.00 each or the 20's are $600.00 each....saving a few $$$$ would be great, but if the 590's would sound and work better, then they'll be chosen.

SUBWOOFER...while my current sub sounds good, it would be nice to get something better. I did not get to hear any of the Paradigm subs , since they did not have any in stock. They also sold both demos of the 12 and 15.

So, I somewhat find it hard to spend $2000.00 for the Sub12...let alone $2800.00 for the Sub 15. I'm open to suggestions for other subs that would hopefully be under $1000.00. I love good tight bass, and lots of it. And one that could work well in my size room. And I'm not opposed to keeping my Klipsch KSW-15 sub as long as it would sound good with the Paradigm's.
If you've heard the Paradigm subs, are they good ? Worth the $$$ ? I really can't afford the 15, so, would the 12 work for my room ?

I FORGOT TO MENTION THAT THIS SET UP WILL BE USED FOR ABOUT 95 % MOVIES AND 5% MUSIC

UPDATED...this is also for a 5.1 set up

Thanks in advance

I can't really comment much to your thread but I hope to get some clarity from some of the other reponses concerning the APD-590s. I have a slightly larger room that I am looking into speakers for and was told that the ADPs aren't ideal unless they are located directly to the sides of the listening area or on the back wall. It sounds like the OP wants to mount the ADPs on the side walls but significantly back from the listening area. From what I've read you do not want either side of the ADPs directed towards the listening area and want them directed to a wall to radiate the sound. Am I wrong or mis-interpreting that? I was hoping to use ADPs in my room but was convinced that I was going to have to go with either Sudio 10s aimed towards the listening area or ceiling mounted speakers because there is no available wall space to the sides of the listening area.

As far as the other speakers, I have listened to all of the Studio front speakers and I agree that the CC490 would not be the best match for the 60s. I like the idea of going with 20s and the 590 or staying with the 60s and jumping up to the 690 (just make sure you have the space for the 690). I'm no expert so take my comments with a grain of salt. On the other hand, I am in a very similar situation to you and have spent quite a bit of effort weighing the costs versus benefits and compatiability of the Studio speakers.

Matt

(just make sure you have the space for the 690)....

Matt

Matt makes a very good point. I am dealing with trying to fit this monster into my room as I write this. 37 inches long is a huge space to fill. :o

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12


I have similar set up, but my room is a bit bigger, maybe 25+ x 40+ w/20' ceiling - I am fine with the CC-490, it is great for movies, but I wish I had gone with at least the 590 - a $$ decision at the time, unfortunately.

I also initially considered going with 10s or 20s for surrounds, but am glad I went with the 590s - they handle their surround duties well!

there is an interesting article on dipoles on Paradigm's website
http://www.paradigm.com/en/pdf/dipolar_confusion.pdf

re: the center, if you have the money, go big! if not, the 490 will be fine, but keep in mind, upgrading later may be a PITA, as far as size diff & fitting into entertainment center...

J

Matt makes a very good point. I am dealing with trying to fit this monster into my room as I write this. 37 inches long is a huge space to fill. :o

I put my 690 in this. Be careful it is a tight fit on that 1st shelf!
http://www.bushfurniture.com
/jsp/productdetail4NEW.jsp?id=VS11550A-03&id6=&id7=SE1&id8=

I find that reading di-pole articles from Paradigm would not give me an objective viewpoint of them since Paradigm is selling them and wants to advertise them as best as they could to boost sales. is there any other excerpts???

I find that reading di-pole articles from Paradigm would not give me an objective viewpoint of them since Paradigm is selling them and wants to advertise them as best as they could to boost sales. is there any other excerpts???

You might let Google be your friend.

http://www.hometheatermag.com/bootcamp/25/index2.html

I found this and had ideas for Dipole and Direct radiating/monopole.

DenonLover posted....I get my speakers tomorrow at 3pm and I can promise everyone lots of photos of my new toys. I just hope no one will get sick of seeing all of the photos. I cannot wait to get them home tomorrow!!!![/QUOTE]



DennonLover....did you order the SVS PB13 Ultra sub ? I'm just starting to read reviews on it and it sounds promising. But a previous poster ( zwalls ) said he or she has the Sub 12 from Paradigm and it does a very good job too. please let us know what you got after you've hooked it all up and give it a test run.

Thanks

I find that reading di-pole articles from Paradigm would not give me an objective viewpoint of them since Paradigm is selling them and wants to advertise them as best as they could to boost sales. is there any other excerpts???

Not really, they're still selling direct radiators - so they get your coin either way! ;)

I can't really comment much to your thread but I hope to get some clarity from some of the other reponses concerning the APD-590s. I have a slightly larger room that I am looking into speakers for and was told that the ADPs aren't ideal unless they are located directly to the sides of the listening area or on the back wall. It sounds like the OP wants to mount the ADPs on the side walls but significantly back from the listening area. From what I've read you do not want either side of the ADPs directed towards the listening area and want them directed to a wall to radiate the sound. Am I wrong or mis-interpreting that? I was hoping to use ADPs in my room but was convinced that I was going to have to go with either Sudio 10s aimed towards the listening area or ceiling mounted speakers because there is no available wall space to the sides of the listening area.

As far as the other speakers, I have listened to all of the Studio front speakers and I agree that the CC490 would not be the best match for the 60s. I like the idea of going with 20s and the 590 or staying with the 60s and jumping up to the 690 (just make sure you have the space for the 690). I'm no expert so take my comments with a grain of salt. On the other hand, I am in a very similar situation to you and have spent quite a bit of effort weighing the costs versus benefits and compatiability of the Studio speakers.

Matt

I have the ADP590'S mounted about 3' to 4' in front of me and about 3" from the ceiling do to a big window on one wall so I had to mount them high.one thing I feel is great about the 590's is that I feel they are the right speaker if your setup "isnt" ideal.

I do have a 7.1 setup with the 10's for rears but.the 590's sound and work great in MHO even though they are more in front of me instead of directly on the side and also higher than they actually should be!!

If I could only do a 5.1 I'd definitly go with the 590's no matter where I had to mount them.now once again this is JMO but the 590's would provide a better envelope of sound than direct firing speakers!!

just my $.02:)

DenonLover posted....I get my speakers tomorrow at 3pm and I can promise everyone lots of photos of my new toys. I just hope no one will get sick of seeing all of the photos. I cannot wait to get them home tomorrow!!!!



DennonLover....did you order the SVS PB13 Ultra sub ? I'm just starting to read reviews on it and it sounds promising. But a previous poster ( zwalls ) said he or she has the Sub 12 from Paradigm and it does a very good job too. please let us know what you got after you've hooked it all up and give it a test run.

Thanks[/QUOTE]

Hi ff,
I'm a he:D just so you'ld know!!and I have a sub 15 which I think the OP doesnt want to spend that much money but,I have heard the sub 12 as well and thought it performed great!!
but I also am bery satisfied with the performance with the sub 15 in both music and HT.this thing can blow the walls down if you want it to,but also very accurate and clear with both HT/music!!:)

DennonLover....did you order the SVS PB13 Ultra sub ? I'm just starting to read reviews on it and it sounds promising. But a previous poster ( zwalls ) said he or she has the Sub 12 from Paradigm and it does a very good job too. please let us know what you got after you've hooked it all up and give it a test run.

Thanks

Thanks Zwalls but I had the day from hell and could not get over to pick up my speakers. At 2pm when I was going over to pick them up I got a call was was told we had a last min meeting for 25 people and I was presenting? Really. I am 45 mins from LA and the meeting just started? Long story short it looks like I will be picking them up tomorrow morning. I am going to order the PB13 Ultra in the piano black tonight or tomorrow. I have been waiting for this day to come and I am so bummed right now you would not believe it. I will be taking lots of photos and you should see them up tomorrow and I hope I can get the Ultra to ship out this week after I order it. I will call them in the morning to confirm. Did I mention I can't wait? :p

Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12

This is a highly recommended speaker set up by my Paradigm dealer, and it has also been a highly recommended set up on Perfect Vision.
Now for my two questions.

SURROUNDS...since my surrounds are on the side walls and are about 8 inches from the back wall, would it be better to get the Studio 10's or maybe the Studio 20's for the rear surrounds over the Studio ADP-590's ? My reason is that some of the 590's speakers will ( may ? ) bounch off the rear wall. If I got either the 10's or the 20's I could mount them on the side wall and aim them where I wanted and no sound would bounce off the rear wall. They would be mounted about 6 1/2 feet high. And not to mention the 590's are about $1400.00 pair..while the 10's are $400.00 each or the 20's are $600.00 each....saving a few $$$$ would be great, but if the 590's would sound and work better, then they'll be chosen.

SUBWOOFER...while my current sub sounds good, it would be nice to get something better. I did not get to hear any of the Paradigm subs , since they did not have any in stock. They also sold both demos of the 12 and 15.

So, I somewhat find it hard to spend $2000.00 for the Sub12...let alone $2800.00 for the Sub 15. I'm open to suggestions for other subs that would hopefully be under $1000.00. I love good tight bass, and lots of it. And one that could work well in my size room. And I'm not opposed to keeping my Klipsch KSW-15 sub as long as it would sound good with the Paradigm's.
If you've heard the Paradigm subs, are they good ? Worth the $$$ ? I really can't afford the 15, so, would the 12 work for my room ?

I FORGOT TO MENTION THAT THIS SET UP WILL BE USED FOR ABOUT 95 % MOVIES AND 5% MUSIC

UPDATED...this is also for a 5.1 set up

Thanks in advance

Hey FF,
Everybody seems to have an opinion here. Read this and chime in on my reasoning. I just went through this. If you dont listen to a lot of music and want that home theater fee\ling, Forget the 60's. Go to the 100's. Drop the 490 or the 590 and Go to the 690. This my friend is your foundation. If you dont listen to music, and you just want the rumble for HT, look elsewhere for the sub. You can sure shake the house for a lot less than the Sub12. Go cheaper on the sub. Or just keep the sub you have. I have the 20v.4. I recently auditioned the 590 and the DSP3200 in my house for a couple of weeks. I would recommend the DSP3400 for just a little more boom (if you want to stay with paradigm). IMO these are not very musical subs, but will do great for HT. If you ask most why they go with the more expensive or not necessarily more expensive but better, its because they like the way they blend with music. I listen to music a lot and only upgraded to the Sub 15 for that reason. And the 590 just did not cut it, so hence the 690 and was glad I did. There is just no comparison.

As for the surrounds, drop them and put your money into the fronts or the better sub. If you want surrounds buy them used. Look at all the posts on there that say get an external amp to drive your fronts and let the receiver drive the surrounds. Why? Think about it. (hint unless you have a gymnasium they just dont do that much) I have a room very similar to yours and moved my 20 to the rear. I could probably drop them and not notice it that much.
Save your money on the surrounds and put it into your front speakers. With the money Especially the 690 IMO go large up front for the HT. I say it again For Home Theater IMO go large in the front. Just My 2 pennies
again
100's
690
Keep your sub or go cheaper, but if you have the cash get a 12 to keep all digms
Save money on the surrounds and buy used.
good luck

DenonLover posted....I get my speakers tomorrow at 3pm and I can promise everyone lots of photos of my new toys. I just hope no one will get sick of seeing all of the photos. I cannot wait to get them home tomorrow!!!!



DennonLover....did you order the SVS PB13 Ultra sub ? I'm just starting to read reviews on it and it sounds promising. But a previous poster ( zwalls ) said he or she has the Sub 12 from Paradigm and it does a very good job too. please let us know what you got after you've hooked it all up and give it a test run.

Thanks[/QUOTE]

Long story, but I will get them tomorrow now. I am ordering the PB13 Ultra tomorrow and I hope to have it late next week. :)

[QUOTE=ferrari fan;18717841]Hello folks,
I need your help in a few areas, and hopefully you own or have heard the Paradigm speakers I'm going to mention. Hopefully this posting won't be too long, so bear with me please.

My set up currently follows :
Fronts.......Klipsch RF -3ll
Center.......Klipsch RC-3ll
Surrounds...Klipsch RS-3ll
Sub...........Klipsch KSW-15
Reciever...Onkyo TX-SR875
Amp for front 3 speakers....Emotiva XPA-3 ( on order )
The Onkyo will power the 2 surrounds when the Emotiva arrives.

Room size is 15' x 20' x 8' high and open to a kitchen on one side, living room on the other. I sit 10 feet from my Pioneer Elite PRO FHD-1.

I'm very strongly looking at the Paradigm Studio Series speakers....
Front's.... Studio 60
Center.... Studio CC-490
Surrounds...Studio ADP-590
Sub........SUB 12


Lucky for you this is a Paradigm thread, because there really isn't a wrong answer. It all comes down to budget. My room is 15'3 x 18'6 x 7'6 and I have the 100's, 690, 20's for the rear, 590's for the sides, 10's for the heights and 2 sub12's. This fills my room nicely. If you can afford 100's I would get them, and if not I would at least upgrade your list to a cc590/690. Basically if you want to stay in the studio line up, get the best you can afford and you will be happy. Good luck.

Everybody seems to have an opinion here. Read this and chime in on my reasoning. I just went through this. If you dont listen to a lot of music and want that home theater fee\ling, Forget the 60's. Go to the 100's. Drop the 490 or the 590 and Go to the 690. This my friend is your foundation. If you dont listen to music, and you just want the rumble for HT, look elsewhere for the sub.
.
.
Keep your sub or go cheaper, but if you have the cash get a 12 to keep all digms

Not sure I understand why exactly you'd say "if it's for HT and not music go with the 100's instead of the 60's"?

IMO, the sub is the second (if not first) most important piece of an HT system, with the CC being the other.

A "great" sub will negate (or greatly reduce anyhow) the need for large floor standing speakers in all but the biggest rooms as it can handle the frequencies below say 120hz and sound great doing it.

As for the CC, the 590 will be more than enough to fill his room with sound.

But if the OP is not budget constrained whatsoever, then, yes, get the 690 and 100's and 2 great subs.

But I will almost gaurantee you that crossed at 80hz or 100hz, with a great sub (or possibly 2) like the ULS-15, the Sub 15, the Rythmiks, etc, you wouldn't notice a difference between the 100's and 690 combo and the 60's and 590 combo.

But it's not my money .. ;)

Not sure I understand why exactly you'd say "if it's for HT and not music go with the 100's instead of the 60's"?

IMO, the sub is the second (if not first) most important piece of an HT system, with the CC being the other.
A "great" sub will negate (or greatly reduce anyhow) the need for large floor standing speakers in all but the biggest rooms as it can handle the frequencies below say 120hz and sound great doing it.

As for the CC, the 590 will be more than enough to fill his room with sound.

But if the OP is not budget constrained whatsoever, then, yes, get the 690 and 100's and 2 great subs.

But I will almost gaurantee you that crossed at 80hz or 100hz, with a great sub (or possibly 2) like the ULS-15, the Sub 15, the Rythmiks, etc, you wouldn't notice a difference between the 100's and 690 combo and the 60's and 590 combo.

But it's not my money .. ;)

I share the same opinion that for HT, the most important two speakers are the center channel and subwoofer. For music obviously the left and right channel are the most critical with the subwoofer being an important second speaker.

Hello Paradigm owners. Would the Paradigm Studio 60's paired with their smallest center channel be overkill for my 12x12x8 living room? I'm looking to upgrade my ht from my Energy set up which consists of RC 10 bookshelves, RC Mini CC and RC Mini surrounds. I want to start with the front three speakers and slowly build up to 5.1. The speakers would be used for movies, gaming and music in about equal proportion.

i can first hand tell you that..........DEFINITELY NOT!!!!!! I have S4s in my room with a C3 center and ULS-15 subwoofer and honestly i tihnk it is very good. I have a Pioneer SC-27 as the receiver and i watch at an average volume level of -15dB in a 15'x10'x8' room and if it wasnt for the harshness i experience (i guess because of lack of room treatment) at -12dB i would be listening at a way louder level. it definitely isnt overkill and i am actually looking to add another sub soon. If you listen at moderate levels then you should be more than ok with those 60s and CC-590. IMO you can even get the CC-690 for that room. If anyone had the C5 when i bought my C3 i would have bought it and i honestly dont think it would have been overkill. I am actually afraid that my set-up wont service a larger room. For some odd reason i have that weird feeling......and it got me a bit scared cause i'd be very angry if it doesnt fill the bigger room i have planned for them.

Well, our newest family members are home and I thought I would share some of the photos of their trip home and set up. I need to get to work so I wanted them to play for the day while I am out working. I am going to let them play straight through until Saturday morning so they are broken in before I start to push them. I hope there are not to many photo's for you guys, enjoy.

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/727/img1965s.jpg (http://img594.imageshack.us/i/img1965s.jpg/)

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/4770/img1966q.jpg (http://img413.imageshack.us/i/img1966q.jpg/)

http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/3128/img1967i.jpg (http://img52.imageshack.us/i/img1967i.jpg/)

http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/7191/img1970d.jpg (http://img688.imageshack.us/i/img1970d.jpg/)

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/8497/img1972v.jpg (http://img413.imageshack.us/i/img1972v.jpg/)

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/6376/img1973k.jpg (http://img80.imageshack.us/i/img1973k.jpg/)

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/7255/img1974zi.jpg (http://img266.imageshack.us/i/img1974zi.jpg/)

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/3043/img1975i.jpg (http://img139.imageshack.us/i/img1975i.jpg/)

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/2354/img1976z.jpg (http://img229.imageshack.us/i/img1976z.jpg/)

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/9687/img1977y.jpg (http://img8.imageshack.us/i/img1977y.jpg/)

http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/1769/img1978q.jpg (http://img153.imageshack.us/i/img1978q.jpg/)

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/663/img1979i.jpg (http://img444.imageshack.us/i/img1979i.jpg/)

http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/2915/img1980gf.jpg (http://img690.imageshack.us/i/img1980gf.jpg/)

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/8254/img1981q.jpg (http://img80.imageshack.us/i/img1981q.jpg/)

QUOTE=DenonLover;

Well, our newest family members are home and I thought I would share some of the photos of their trip home and set up. I need to get to work so I wanted them to play for the day while I am out working. I am going to let them play straight through until Saturday morning so they are broken in before I start to push them. I hope there are not to many photo's for you guys, enjoy.


They look great, I bet you're happy right about now. You should hook the 690 up too and let it play. I have the same speakers and they take a really long time for the drivers to loosen up. The good news is, they sound great anyway. Now if you're still thinking about a new AVR, go and get yourself a 4810ci and let the magic happen.:D Have fun.

QUOTE=DenonLover;

Well, our newest family members are home and I thought I would share some of the photos of their trip home and set up. I need to get to work so I wanted them to play for the day while I am out working. I am going to let them play straight through until Saturday morning so they are broken in before I start to push them. I hope there are not to many photo's for you guys, enjoy.


They look great, I bet you're happy right about now. You should hook the 690 up too and let it play. I have the same speakers and they take a really long time for the drivers to loosen up. The good news is, they sound great anyway. Now if you're still thinking about a new AVR, go and get yourself a 4810ci and let the magic happen.:D Have fun.

If I was any happier I would need to be committed! I did hook the center up and it too is breaking in as we speak. After using the killer speaker wire for the fronts and center, I am going to see if I can get some for the rears too. How long did it take for your speakers to loosen up?

I ordered the SVSPB13 Ultra and I was told it would ship out today and I should have it no later than mid week next week. As for the AVR I am either going to upgrade to the 4311CI or go with an Anthem Pre/Pro and amp. I am really going back and forth right now and I am not sure what I am going to do yet. I can wait to get back from work today and play with these and get the room set up.

Denonlover very nice setup and when the sub arrives nothing but aural bliss.

Well, our newest family members are home and I thought I would share some of the photos of their trip home and set up. I need to get to work so I wanted them to play for the day while I am out working. I am going to let them play straight through until Saturday morning so they are broken in before I start to push them. I hope there are not to many photo's for you guys, enjoy.

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/727/img1965s.jpg (http://img594.imageshack.us/i/img1965s.jpg/)

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/4770/img1966q.jpg (http://img413.imageshack.us/i/img1966q.jpg/)

http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/3128/img1967i.jpg (http://img52.imageshack.us/i/img1967i.jpg/)

http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/7191/img1970d.jpg (http://img688.imageshack.us/i/img1970d.jpg/)

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/8497/img1972v.jpg (http://img413.imageshack.us/i/img1972v.jpg/)

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/6376/img1973k.jpg (http://img80.imageshack.us/i/img1973k.jpg/)

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/7255/img1974zi.jpg (http://img266.imageshack.us/i/img1974zi.jpg/)

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/3043/img1975i.jpg (http://img139.imageshack.us/i/img1975i.jpg/)

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/2354/img1976z.jpg (http://img229.imageshack.us/i/img1976z.jpg/)

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/9687/img1977y.jpg (http://img8.imageshack.us/i/img1977y.jpg/)

http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/1769/img1978q.jpg (http://img153.imageshack.us/i/img1978q.jpg/)

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/663/img1979i.jpg (http://img444.imageshack.us/i/img1979i.jpg/)

http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/2915/img1980gf.jpg (http://img690.imageshack.us/i/img1980gf.jpg/)

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/8254/img1981q.jpg (http://img80.imageshack.us/i/img1981q.jpg/)

Can I say I am jealous. Piano Black. VERY VERY NICE.

Wow nice pictures man! you weren't kidding when you said you were going to post a lot. Hope more is coming!

Wow nice pictures man! you weren't kidding when you said you were going to post a lot. Hope more is coming!

Thanks everyone. The only way I was able to pass the time waiting was to look at everyone's photos. Lots more on their way. :D

Thanks for the pictures and sharing.

Hey Denon, Sweet!!!!

BTW: Nice truck :eek:

haha i agree with the "truck"; you were "just" able to bring everything home!

BTW I just discovered the subscription based "Society of Sound" over at the B&W website and I recommend those who haven't heard of it give em a try. Some real nice quality music there.

DenonLover....SWEET :) I though you would pick them up in say....a TRUCK. But you squeezed all of that into your Ford. Congraulations Trent. I'm jealous , but happy for you at the same time. Looking forward to seeing the rest of the photos when all is set up. Perhaps you could call in sick tomorrow, friday :rolleyes: That way you could hook up the surrounds and relax after your hell day from yesterday and listen allllll weekend.

Side note, replyed to your pm.

I just want to thank all of you guys that have responded to my thread from a few days ago. Being somewhat embarresed about saying this, but yes, I'm somewhat on a budget. But, I have listened to many speakers over that last month or so and liked the Paradigms the best.

So that I've decided to see what I could afford, hence the Studio 60's over the 100's for example...savings of possibly $1000.00. I'll admit right off that my dealer and I have not talked prices...yet, but I plan on doing so this weekend or next. I'm just going off the prices I found for the Studio series on a few places that I saw posted when Paradigm announced the new Studio line up at CES in January 2009.

Examples :
Studio 60....$999.00 each
Studio 100...$1499.00 each
Studio CC-490...$$799.00
Studio CC-590...$1199.00
Sub 12....$1999.00

Since I'm going to have to slightly modify the stand that my tv sits on so that I can shoe horn in a center channel as it's not high enough. I'm going to listen to the CC-590. Listening to you guys did make sense on having a very good center channel as I did not think about it at the time. Like I said, this set up is about 95% movies and 5% music so that does make excellent sense. The CC-690 wont fit due to width.


Also, I'm leaning towards the SVS PB13 Ultra due to reviews, suggestions, and yes, maybe even cause it's a bit cheaper. Or I may just keep my sub, who knows. But a guy at work already wants my Klipsch set up, so keeping my sub may not be an option. We'll see what prices my dealer gives me. I'll also be driving up to see Denon Lovers dealer since he so kindly gave me their name and they are only 55-60 miles from me.

Again, I thank all of you that have responded to my original posting, and PLEASE CONTINUE to do so as it will further help me and others.

Thanks,
Marshall

Also, I'm leaning towards the SVS PB13 Ultra due to reviews, suggestions, and yes, maybe even cause it's a bit cheaper.

If you tell your dealer "I'm buying an SVS PB13-Ultra unless you sell me the Sub12 for cheaper", I guarantee they'll at least match the $1800 shipped price, and probably beat it. Now, the Sub12 may not be a 'better' sub than the SVS, just different. The upcoming SVS SB16-Ultra will be better competition for the Sub12, since they are both sealed.

For home theater, consider getting bookshelf fronts (Studio 20s, for instance) over the floorstanders. Since you will crossing over to your sub at ~80Hz, there is basically no difference between them besides price and aesthetics.

Spending priorities for home theater speakers should go Sub(s)->Center->Mains->Surrounds.

Man, I am seriously jealous. Very nice. Congrats.

The Sub 12 likely performs similar to the F112 in terms of output/SQ, possibly close to the F113.

For HT, IMO, the PB13 is the better choice if your room can accodate the size (it's a VERY large subwoofer ... you can see some pics of it in the link to my HT below compared to my salamander stand and to the S2's). Personally, having heard the F113 in my room and in another room in a sub listening session (along with the PDigm Servo 15v2, Velo DD18, Axiom EP600), very few chose the F113 over the PB13 for "slam and impact" and that "HT Wow" factor and a very close second to the F113 in terms of SQ.

It will also put a big smile on your face in comparison to the KSW-15 you currently have. Much cleaner and deeper.

If size is a concern, the Sub 12 is also a great choice and should also be better than your Klipsch I would think.

If you tell your dealer "I'm buying an SVS PB13-Ultra unless you sell me the Sub12 for cheaper", I guarantee they'll at least match the $1800 shipped price, and probably beat it. Now, the Sub12 may not be a 'better' sub than the SVS, just different. The upcoming SVS SB16-Ultra will be better competition for the Sub12, since they are both sealed.

For home theater, consider getting bookshelf fronts (Studio 20s, for instance) over the floorstanders. Since you will crossing over to your sub at ~80Hz, there is basically no difference between them besides price and aesthetics.

Spending priorities for home theater speakers should go Sub(s)->Center->Mains->Surrounds.

So, did I screw up then? - I purchased a SVS PB12NSD, CC590, and two Studio 100s (the studio 100s arrive next week!!!), my four surrounds are the existing Infinity Primus bookshelf speakers

I just want to thank all of you guys that have responded to my thread from a few days ago. Being somewhat embarresed about saying this, but yes, I'm somewhat on a budget. But, I have listened to many speakers over that last month or so and liked the Paradigms the best.

So that I've decided to see what I could afford, hence the Studio 60's over the 100's for example...savings of possibly $1000.00. I'll admit right off that my dealer and I have not talked prices...yet, but I plan on doing so this weekend or next. I'm just going off the prices I found for the Studio series on a few places that I saw posted when Paradigm announced the new Studio line up at CES in January 2009.

Examples :
Studio 60....$999.00 each
Studio 100...$1499.00 each
Studio CC-490...$$799.00
Studio CC-590...$1199.00
Sub 12....$1999.00

Since I'm going to have to slightly modify the stand that my tv sits on so that I can shoe horn in a center channel as it's not high enough. I'm going to listen to the CC-590. Listening to you guys did make sense on having a very good center channel as I did not think about it at the time. Like I said, this set up is about 95% movies and 5% music so that does make excellent sense. The CC-690 wont fit due to width.

Thanks,
Marshall

I posted an ad on Audiogon looking for paradigm speakers, and several dealers responded. I think you could hunt around for a better deal.

DenonLover: those are gorgeous speakers. Congratulations and I hope you have a excellent weekend enjoying them. :)

As a dual Sub 12 owner I will second the comments by pbc above. For HT purposes, if you can accommodate it, the PB13 is very likely the better single sub solution. It will have an output and extension advantage over the Sub 12.

As for the AVR I am either going to upgrade to the 4311CI or go with an Anthem Pre/Pro and amp. I am really going back and forth right now and I am not sure what I am going to do yet.

Did you decide against the upcoming Anthem MRX receivers?

Thanks Zwalls but I had the day from hell and could not get over to pick up my speakers. At 2pm when I was going over to pick them up I got a call was was told we had a last min meeting for 25 people and I was presenting? Really. I am 45 mins from LA and the meeting just started? Long story short it looks like I will be picking them up tomorrow morning. I am going to order the PB13 Ultra in the piano black tonight or tomorrow. I have been waiting for this day to come and I am so bummed right now you would not believe it. I will be taking lots of photos and you should see them up tomorrow and I hope I can get the Ultra to ship out this week after I order it. I will call them in the morning to confirm. Did I mention I can't wait? :p

I feel your pain brother!!but tomorrow will be so sweet;)

we'll be waiting on those pics.be carefull and take your time setting things up!!they're not light:D

edit:didn't realize this was yesterdays post!duh

Hey FF,
Everybody seems to have an opinion here. Read this and chime in on my reasoning. I just went through this. If you dont listen to a lot of music and want that home theater fee\ling, Forget the 60's. Go to the 100's. Drop the 490 or the 590 and Go to the 690. This my friend is your foundation. If you dont listen to music, and you just want the rumble for HT, look elsewhere for the sub. You can sure shake the house for a lot less than the Sub12. Go cheaper on the sub. Or just keep the sub you have. I have the 20v.4. I recently auditioned the 590 and the DSP3200 in my house for a couple of weeks. I would recommend the DSP3400 for just a little more boom (if you want to stay with paradigm). IMO these are not very musical subs, but will do great for HT. If you ask most why they go with the more expensive or not necessarily more expensive but better, its because they like the way they blend with music. I listen to music a lot and only upgraded to the Sub 15 for that reason. And the 590 just did not cut it, so hence the 690 and was glad I did. There is just no comparison.

As for the surrounds, drop them and put your money into the fronts or the better sub. If you want surrounds buy them used. Look at all the posts on there that say get an external amp to drive your fronts and let the receiver drive the surrounds. Why? Think about it. (hint unless you have a gymnasium they just dont do that much) I have a room very similar to yours and moved my 20 to the rear. I could probably drop them and not notice it that much.
Save your money on the surrounds and put it into your front speakers. With the money Especially the 690 IMO go large up front for the HT. I say it again For Home Theater IMO go large in the front. Just My 2 pennies
again
100's
690
Keep your sub or go cheaper, but if you have the cash get a 12 to keep all digms
Save money on the surrounds and buy used.
good luck

+1
music is a big reason I went with the paradigm sub 15.of course to match my 100's and the CC690 as well.since I setup the new system I find myself doing 90% music and 10% HT.at least for now.I've finally been able to view a # of movies but I'm really enjoying music now and especially with the sub 15.it's right on the money!!to me very accurate.the bass sounds the way it was recorded!!good or bad;)

Hello Paradigm owners. Would the Paradigm Studio 60's paired with their smallest center channel be overkill for my 12x12x8 living room? I'm looking to upgrade my ht from my Energy set up which consists of RC 10 bookshelves, RC Mini CC and RC Mini surrounds. I want to start with the front three speakers and slowly build up to 5.1. The speakers would be used for movies, gaming and music in about equal proportion.

I dont think it would be overkill.heck,you could go with 60's if you wanted to!

I dont consider myself and expert but I'm sure the ones that are would tell you to spend most of your money on your speakers.they are the most important.especially your sub and 3 fronts!!you might also want to consider one step up on the center too!!

JMO;)

If I was any happier I would need to be committed! I did hook the center up and it too is breaking in as we speak. After using the killer speaker wire for the fronts and center, I am going to see if I can get some for the rears too. How long did it take for your speakers to loosen up?

I ordered the SVSPB13 Ultra and I was told it would ship out today and I should have it no later than mid week next week. As for the AVR I am either going to upgrade to the 4311CI or go with an Anthem Pre/Pro and amp. I am really going back and forth right now and I am not sure what I am going to do yet. I can wait to get back from work today and play with these and get the room set up.

WHOO HOO DL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I answered one of your post before I got to this one thinking it was from today and didn't realize it was yesterdays post!!sorry bout that.

glad to see you finally have you new babies.I forgot you were getting them in piano blk!!:eek::eek:
that's really what I wanted but the xtra $ and the wife rathered the rosenut!!

congrats again fella!!looking forward to your reviews.especially after you get your sub in!

Thanks everyone. The only way I was able to pass the time waiting was to look at everyone's photos. Lots more on their way. :D

Hmmmmm.........we might not see you for a few days while your breaking in your new speakers:p

I just want to thank all of you guys that have responded to my thread from a few days ago. Being somewhat embarresed about saying this, but yes, I'm somewhat on a budget. But, I have listened to many speakers over that last month or so and liked the Paradigms the best.

So that I've decided to see what I could afford, hence the Studio 60's over the 100's for example...savings of possibly $1000.00. I'll admit right off that my dealer and I have not talked prices...yet, but I plan on doing so this weekend or next. I'm just going off the prices I found for the Studio series on a few places that I saw posted when Paradigm announced the new Studio line up at CES in January 2009.

Examples :
Studio 60....$999.00 each
Studio 100...$1499.00 each
Studio CC-490...$$799.00
Studio CC-590...$1199.00
Sub 12....$1999.00

Since I'm going to have to slightly modify the stand that my tv sits on so that I can shoe horn in a center channel as it's not high enough. I'm going to listen to the CC-590. Listening to you guys did make sense on having a very good center channel as I did not think about it at the time. Like I said, this set up is about 95% movies and 5% music so that does make excellent sense. The CC-690 wont fit due to width.


Also, I'm leaning towards the SVS PB13 Ultra due to reviews, suggestions, and yes, maybe even cause it's a bit cheaper. Or I may just keep my sub, who knows. But a guy at work already wants my Klipsch set up, so keeping my sub may not be an option. We'll see what prices my dealer gives me. I'll also be driving up to see Denon Lovers dealer since he so kindly gave me their name and they are only 55-60 miles from me.

Again, I thank all of you that have responded to my original posting, and PLEASE CONTINUE to do so as it will further help me and others.

Thanks,
Marshall

I think you will be more than satisfied with the 60's and the CC590!!I "was"doing 50/50 HT/music until I bought the new speakers.you "MAY" find yourself doing the same thing I did and want to listen to more music because they'll sound so good!!

now I'm a big paradigm fan and when it comes to the subs I'll always recommend the sub12 or 15!!but I also have not listened to too many others so I really cant say that they are much better than some of the other subs that others have suggested here!!all I can tell you I dont think I would trade my sub15 for anything else in it's class.except maybe a sub25!I have a fairly large room and it does more than enough for one sub!!

just my $.02!!good luck with your choices;)

So, did I screw up then? - I purchased a SVS PB12NSD, CC590, and two Studio 100s (the studio 100s arrive next week!!!), my four surrounds are the existing Infinity Primus bookshelf speakers

Nope!!!I would'nt say so!!as long as your ears like what you have!!congrats on your choices!!pics must follow:D

DenonLover....SWEET :) I though you would pick them up in say....a TRUCK. But you squeezed all of that into your Ford. Congraulations Trent. I'm jealous , but happy for you at the same time. Looking forward to seeing the rest of the photos when all is set up. Perhaps you could call in sick tomorrow, friday :rolleyes: That way you could hook up the surrounds and relax after your hell day from yesterday and listen allllll weekend.

Side note, replyed to your pm.

I had 3 buddies with trucks and ALL of them were busy so I thought I would try and do it in my company car. That Ford Fusion held all of those speakers with ease; granted there was not much room left except in the truck. I set the speakers up and ran them through a quick set up to get everything dialed in and it sounds MUCH better.

Problem: We ordered all new furniture from Ethan Allen and at the same time we have different people coming to our home each day picking up our old stuff so the room is a work in progress while we wait 12 weeks for everything to be made and delivered.

I can't wait until the new couches and entertainment center arrive so I can finish setting up the room once and for all! My wife loves watching 'Glee' and she was smiling from ear to ear. Wait until the SVS sub arrives next week that I forgot to tell her about? It doesn't happen very often but I was lucky to find a wife who loves audio as much as I do and will be fine with it.

Good luck on your purchase and I called Bill to tell him you would be calling him at some point. You are going to love your Studio 60s and the studio 100s are too big for the place we are in now but we are moving into a much bigger home soon and will be able to put it all to use.

WHOO HOO DL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I answered one of your post before I got to this one thinking it was from today and didn't realize it was yesterdays post!!sorry bout that.

glad to see you finally have you new babies.I forgot you were getting them in piano blk!!:eek::eek:
that's really what I wanted but the xtra $ and the wife rathered the rosenut!!

congrats again fella!!looking forward to your reviews.especially after you get your sub in!

Hey Zwalls, the Rosenut was my first choice and the wife told me thy would not go well in our room so she asked me what my second choice was and it was her first choice so we went with the piano black and now I am glad I did. I have not had a grin on my face this big and for this long in many years. No buyers remorse here. :D

I think you will be more than satisfied with the 60's and the CC590!!I "was"doing 50/50 HT/music until I bought the new speakers.you "MAY" find yourself doing the same thing I did and want to listen to more music because they'll sound so good!!

now I'm a big paradigm fan and when it comes to the subs I'll always recommend the sub12 or 15!!but I also have not listened to too many others so I really cant say that they are much better than some of the other subs that others have suggested here!!all I can tell you I dont think I would trade my sub15 for anything else in it's class.except maybe a sub25!I have a fairly large room and it does more than enough for one sub!!

just my $.02!!good luck with your choices;)

I hope having a good sub, both musically, but a bit more so for the HT side will get me back into listining to music much more than I do now, which is very little. I wish my local dealer had the 12 and / or the 15 in stock. He even sold his demos, so I have not heard them. And like you, I kind of like all my stuff to match, both sound wise and looks.

And while I'm leaning towards the SVS at this point, the huge size does have it's drawbacks. Perhaps use it as a coffee table :rolleyes: Just curious, how big is your room ? And how does the Sub 15 sound for movies ?

Did you decide against the upcoming Anthem MRX receivers?

I had no idea they were AVRs, I somehow thought they were going to be entry level pre/pros. I will end up with a newer Denon 4311 or I might need to wait a few months more and step up to the Anthem 50V. I like the idea of having a high end and a low end option.

DenonLover: those are gorgeous speakers. Congratulations and I hope you have a excellent weekend enjoying them. :)

Thanks caupina!! I actually find myself wiping them down after I leave finger prints? What is wrong with me. :o

If I was any happier I would need to be committed! I did hook the center up and it too is breaking in as we speak. After using the killer speaker wire for the fronts and center, I am going to see if I can get some for the rears too. How long did it take for your speakers to loosen up?

I ordered the SVSPB13 Ultra and I was told it would ship out today and I should have it no later than mid week next week. As for the AVR I am either going to upgrade to the 4311CI or go with an Anthem Pre/Pro and amp. I am really going back and forth right now and I am not sure what I am going to do yet. I can wait to get back from work today and play with these and get the room set up.

I can't really say how long it took to break them in, I think they're still getting better every time I hear them. All I can say for sure is they sounded better after a couple of 100 hours. It sounds like a lot but really it isn't. With these speakers you could play any crap on them and it wouldn't matter because you would still be grinning just from looking at them. Good choices on the avr front, can't go wrong with any of those.

And while I'm leaning towards the SVS at this point, the huge size does have it's drawbacks. Perhaps use it as a coffee table :rolleyes:

That's what I did when I had my PB13 at the back of the room (room is 17x12x9 or so) ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161463&stc=1&d=1261356507

Compared to my old Mirage OM200 in the same spot ....


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161460&stc=1&d=1261355981

The PB13 eventually moved up to the front ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161466&stc=1&d=1261356833

Before being replaced by a couple sealed DIY subs ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=176473&stc=1&d=1274736349

Still have the PB13 as I want to run some tests compared to the DIY's.

That reminds me, I need to call P'Digm to see if my speaker are repaired so I can pick them up!

Hey Zwalls, the Rosenut was my first choice and the wife told me thy would not go well in our room so she asked me what my second choice was and it was her first choice so we went with the piano black and now I am glad I did. I have not had a grin on my face this big and for this long in many years. No buyers remorse here. :D

LMAO........I'm crankin up!!I'm totally satisfied with the rosenut as well.I think no matter what finish they have on them the sound makes them all look good:D
glad your happy and it will just get better once you have everything the way you want them!!keep us posted though!!

I hope having a good sub, both musically, but a bit more so for the HT side will get me back into listining to music much more than I do now, which is very little. I wish my local dealer had the 12 and / or the 15 in stock. He even sold his demos, so I have not heard them. And like you, I kind of like all my stuff to match, both sound wise and looks.

And while I'm leaning towards the SVS at this point, the huge size does have it's drawbacks. Perhaps use it as a coffee table :rolleyes: Just curious, how big is your room ? And how does the Sub 15 sound for movies ?

my room is 21x19x8!!about 3192 cubic ft!!dont get me wrong,when it comes to movies,you better not have something on a fireplace mantle and make sure everything hanging on the wall is very secure because this thing will knock em off!!the punch and wham is phenomenal!!this thing moves a lot of air!!I can only imagine if I had 2 but I just dont see where I need 2!!

I guess what I meant was it performes flawlessly for movies and just as accurate for music.the best of both worlds.as far as the size it's big.it almos takes 2 ppl to pick it up out of the box!!check the specks on Paradigms site to see how it compares in size as the SVS your looking at!!I also like the idea that they all match!!

you wont be disappointed;)

That's what I did when I had my PB13 at the back of the room (room is 17x12x9 or so) ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161463&stc=1&d=1261356507

Compared to my old Mirage OM200 in the same spot ....


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161460&stc=1&d=1261355981

The PB13 eventually moved up to the front ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161466&stc=1&d=1261356833

Before being replaced by a couple sealed DIY subs ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=176473&stc=1&d=1274736349

Still have the PB13 as I want to run some tests compared to the DIY's.

That reminds me, I need to call P'Digm to see if my speaker are repaired so I can pick them up!

WOW! What made you want to go the duel DIY route when you had the PB13 Ultra? I would love to hear what your thoughts are in some AB tests. Also, what speakers did you need to have Paradigm repair? I never get tired of seeing the signature speakers. Looking good pbc.

I had no idea they were AVRs, I somehow thought they were going to be entry level pre/pros. I will end up with a newer Denon 4311 or I might need to wait a few months more and step up to the Anthem 50V. I like the idea of having a high end and a low end option.



Thanks caupina!! I actually find myself wiping them down after I leave finger prints? What is wrong with me. :o

dont worry!!I think most of us are the same way.everybody wants to touch them when they see em and I'm standing there with my speacial cloth I use to wipe them down when they finish:rolleyes:

That's what I did when I had my PB13 at the back of the room (room is 17x12x9 or so) ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161463&stc=1&d=1261356507

Compared to my old Mirage OM200 in the same spot ....


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161460&stc=1&d=1261355981

The PB13 eventually moved up to the front ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=161466&stc=1&d=1261356833

Before being replaced by a couple sealed DIY subs ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=176473&stc=1&d=1274736349

Still have the PB13 as I want to run some tests compared to the DIY's.

That reminds me, I need to call P'Digm to see if my speaker are repaired so I can pick them up!

I always love to see your pics!!

I thought you had pick up your speakers already.:confused:let us know what they found!!

I will end up with a newer Denon 4311 or I might need to wait a few months more and step up to the Anthem 50V. I like the idea of having a high end and a low end option.


The piano black scares me (b/c I'm anal about fingerprints too), but man those look super sweet.

I don't see any "low end" options in your setup. :p :)

Thank you Unavol! Since we are making so many changes to the room and wait for another 10 weeks for the furniture to arrive here is what we will be living with until them. I am finally running some DVD Audio disks through it and holy s***. I did take the time to go in and change the setting to bi wire in the amp and change the speaker size and run a 3 location audyssey set up for the room. I know it is kind of ghetto to have the rear speakers just sitting on the floor but I do not want to start running wire under carpet and such until everything arrives. One last thing to note is that the AVR is working much harder and is starting to run much hotter than it ever has in the past. I remember it being cool to the touch but no more...

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/2060/img1998s.jpg (http://img198.imageshack.us/i/img1998s.jpg/)

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/9185/img1991um.jpg (http://img42.imageshack.us/i/img1991um.jpg/)

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/4091/img1992f.jpg (http://img171.imageshack.us/i/img1992f.jpg/)

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/561/img1996im.jpg (http://img43.imageshack.us/i/img1996im.jpg/)

http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/1628/img1997h.jpg (http://img692.imageshack.us/i/img1997h.jpg/)

dont worry!!I think most of us are the same way.everybody wants to touch them when they see em and I'm standing there with my speacial cloth I use to wipe them down when they finish:rolleyes:

hahahaha...I feel you guys...I'm the same way...nothing shines brighter than my speakers and electronic gear :D

One last thing to note is that the AVR is working much harder and is starting to run much hotter than it ever has in the past. I remember it being cool to the touch but no more...


Maybe it's time for amps.

Maybe it's time for amps.

Denon 1611 Bluray player is next later this month and then I am going to go into a holding pattern to determine how I want to move forward with the AVR or Pre/Pro. I want to give this Denon AVR time to see if it is up to the task or not? :rolleyes:

One last thing to note is that the AVR is working much harder and is starting to run much hotter than it ever has in the past. I remember it being cool to the touch but no more...

Trent....two things come to mind on your heat issue with the AVR. When I went from my Pioneer Elite VS-45TX to an Onkyo 875, the Onkyo was hot to the touch, and I'm not kidding. They just run that way I guess from what everybody who had one posted. I got a 4 or 5 inch computer fan that turns about 800 rpm, so very, very quiet, even if you put your ears right next to it. I placed it right over the hot spot, and now the Onkyo barely gets warm. And this is on movies with tons of action, like Saving Private Ryan on the beach landing scene. I have it set up to turn on with the Onkyo. Costs less than $30.00....providing you have any money left :D with a small power transformer. I'll see if I can find the place where I bought it on the web if you like, or anybody else for that matter.


Now as far as working your AVR harder than in the past, I just bought, and recieved yesterday an Emotiva XPA-3 amp that will power my front 3 speakers and my Onkyo will have more than enough to power the surrounds. This is a highly recommended amp, especially for those of us, meaning me, that have never had an amp. And it won't break your banking account. I believe that in the past I have had plenty of power from the Onkyo, as well as the Pioneer to power all 5 speakers. But the vast majority of people who have amps says you get more detail, clarity, spaciousness. I'll be hooking it up tomorrow while re-wiring my surrounds to 12 guage wire and we'll see what happens.

Link for the amp I bought http://emotiva.com/xpa3.shtm


EDIT decided to put the link to the fan and power supply
110v AC to 12v DC Power Supply http://www.coolerguys.com/840556029977.html
Fan http://www.coolerguys.com/sff21.html

Trent....two things come to mind on your heat issue with the AVR. When I went from my Pioneer Elite VS-45TX to an Onkyo 875, the Onkyo was hot to the touch, and I'm not kidding. They just run that way I guess from what everybody who had one posted. I got a 4 or 5 inch computer fan that turns about 800 rpm, so very, very quiet, even if you put your ears right next to it. I placed it right over the hot spot, and now the Onkyo barely gets warm. And this is on movies with tons of action, like Saving Private Ryan on the beach landing scene. I have it set up to turn on with the Onkyo. Costs less than $30.00....providing you have any money left :D with a small power transformer. I'll see if I can find the place where I bought it on the web if you like, or anybody else for that matter.


Now as far as working your AVR harder than in the past, I just bought, and recieved yesterday an Emotiva XPA-3 amp that will power my front 3 speakers and my Onkyo will have more than enough to power the surrounds. This is a highly recommended amp, especially for those of us, meaning me, that have never had an amp. And it won't break your banking account. I believe that in the past I have had plenty of power from the Onkyo, as well as the Pioneer to power all 5 speakers. But the vast majority of people who have amps says you get more detail, clarity, spaciousness. I'll be hooking it up tomorrow while re-wiring my surrounds to 12 guage wire and we'll see what happens.

Link for the amp I bought http://emotiva.com/xpa3.shtm


EDIT decided to put the link to the fan and power supply
110v AC to 12v DC Power Supply http://www.coolerguys.com/840556029977.html
Fan http://www.coolerguys.com/sff21.html

Your Onkyo 875 also has 140 watts per channel or the same as my Denon 4308. I will order the fan after I get the new unit that will be housing my amp and thank you for the link! I am going to see how this Denon does and try and push it for now to see how it holds up before I get another amp (for now). It has less to do with the money and more to do with wanting to see how far I can push it.

I would love to hear more about your new 3 channel amp and how well you like it. Our tastes seem to run parallel and I have kept that amp in the mix as am option if I need it. Thanks Marshall!

Your Onkyo 875 also has 140 watts per channel or the same as my Denon 4308. I will order the fan after I get the new unit that will be housing my amp and thank you for the link! I am going to see how this Denon does and try and push it for now to see how it holds up before I get another amp (for now). It has less to do with the money and more to do with wanting to see how far I can push it.

I would love to hear more about your new 3 channel amp and how well you like it. Our tastes seem to run parallel and I have kept that amp in the mix as am option if I need it. Thanks Marshall!

I have the same speakers as you do and my reciever( Pioneer Elite sc-07 140x7) does much better when crossed over to my sub. When running the 100's full range it almost has enough juice, only at high volumes do you notice the lack of power. Above -10 it does great but any louder and I can tell it's starting to stress the amp. Once you get your sub it should take some of the load off of your amp by handling the lowest notes. You have a pretty good reciever so I think your right in trying it first to see if it will work, that's also what I'm doing. I might get an amp one day, but for now I'm trying the same tactic as you.

I have the same speakers as you do and my reciever( Pioneer Elite sc-07 140x7) does much better when crossed over to my sub. When running the 100's full range it almost has enough juice, only at high volumes do you notice the lack of power. Above -10 it does great but any louder and I can tell it's starting to stress the amp. Once you get your sub it should take some of the load off of your amp by handling the lowest notes. You have a pretty good reciever so I think your right in trying it first to see if it will work, that's also what I'm doing. I might get an amp one day, but for now I'm trying the same tactic as you.

Well after selling the sub I went in and moved the cross over to 40 to go full range and tonight watching Avatar at 0 volume sounded great but it was pushing it a bit and the amp was nice and warm/hot. I will move the cross over back to 80 once the sub arrives like you mention and I bet I will be alright. I love the Pioneer Elite's and glad to hear its holding up too.

Trent....two things come to mind on your heat issue with the AVR. When I went from my Pioneer Elite VS-45TX to an Onkyo 875, the Onkyo was hot to the touch, and I'm not kidding. They just run that way I guess from what everybody who had one posted. I got a 4 or 5 inch computer fan that turns about 800 rpm, so very, very quiet, even if you put your ears right next to it. I placed it right over the hot spot, and now the Onkyo barely gets warm. And this is on movies with tons of action, like Saving Private Ryan on the beach landing scene. I have it set up to turn on with the Onkyo. Costs less than $30.00....providing you have any money left :D with a small power transformer. I'll see if I can find the place where I bought it on the web if you like, or anybody else for that matter.


Now as far as working your AVR harder than in the past, I just bought, and recieved yesterday an Emotiva XPA-3 amp that will power my front 3 speakers and my Onkyo will have more than enough to power the surrounds. This is a highly recommended amp, especially for those of us, meaning me, that have never had an amp. And it won't break your banking account. I believe that in the past I have had plenty of power from the Onkyo, as well as the Pioneer to power all 5 speakers. But the vast majority of people who have amps says you get more detail, clarity, spaciousness. I'll be hooking it up tomorrow while re-wiring my surrounds to 12 guage wire and we'll see what happens.

Link for the amp I bought http://emotiva.com/xpa3.shtm


EDIT decided to put the link to the fan and power supply
110v AC to 12v DC Power Supply http://www.coolerguys.com/840556029977.html
Fan http://www.coolerguys.com/sff21.html

I did the same thing with my 906. I've got a Cooler Guys dual 80mm fans on the 906. the heat generated is mainly from the processors. IMHOP the xpa-3 helped big time. Running 100s,690 and 590 surrounds.

EDIT decided to put the link to the fan and power supply
110v AC to 12v DC Power Supply http://www.coolerguys.com/840556029977.html
Fan http://www.coolerguys.com/sff21.html


hi FF,
which model fan/fans do you actually have.there are a few different models and some run at higher db's than others.I like to get 2 but I dont want to get one that I can hear!!
thanks for your input and this link!!

Does anyone have any experience with or opinons on using the Millenia 10 Hybrid for rear surrounds? Any input would be helpful! Also can you use Dipoles on a rear wall or hang them from a ceiling, I have ADP190s. Thanks!

Jeff

Well after selling the sub I went in and moved the cross over to 40 to go full range and tonight watching Avatar at 0 volume sounded great but it was pushing it a bit and the amp was nice and warm/hot. I will move the cross over back to 80 once the sub arrives like you mention and I bet I will be alright. I love the Pioneer Elite's and glad to hear its holding up too.

Denonlover, your sig. pics have convinced me to shellac my skin in Piano Black. Awesome.

Denonlover, your sig. pics have convinced me to shellac my skin in Piano Black. Awesome.

Thanks CDPA! I was expecting Paradigm to ship me something that looked amazing and they sent me something that even surprised me. They are a work of art and I could not be more impressed with their quality of workmanship. :D

Any chance that Paradigm comes out with a Sig. speaker the same size as the Studio 10? That's the largest size I can fit in my setup right now.

Any chance that Paradigm comes out with a Sig. speaker the same size as the Studio 10? That's the largest size I can fit in my setup right now.They do (actually a little smaller cabinet):

http://www.paradigm.com/en/reference/fronts-signature-signatures1(pbe)-model-2-17-1-69.paradigm

They do (actually a little smaller cabinet):

http://www.paradigm.com/en/reference/fronts-signature-signatures1(pbe)-model-2-17-1-69.paradigm

Yeah, I'm not sure that would be an upgrade from the Studio 10; it seems too small.

Hi Guys,

Just picked up Studio 40 v4 and are looking for speaker stands and speaker cables.

Please recommend some speaker stands and speaker cables from fellow Paradigm owners. :confused:

Thank you.

Yeah, I'm not sure that would be an upgrade from the Studio 10; it seems too small.

i was listening to both recently... the studios don't even compare. you NEED to listen to them. otherwise, take a look at the SE series as well...

Hi Guys,

Just picked up Studio 40 v4 and are looking for speaker stands and speaker cables.

Please recommend some speaker stands and speaker cables from fellow Paradigm owners. :confused:

Thank you.

possibly the paradigm J-29 stands and I use 12AWG copper wire from monoprice.com

this is what I use!!

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10239&cs_id=1023901&p_id=3844&seq=1&format=2

possibly the paradigm J-29 stands and I use 12AWG copper wire from monoprice.com

this is what I use!!

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10239&cs_id=1023901&p_id=3844&seq=1&format=2

J-26 are the stands for the 40's or S4's. I think the number refers to the height and to get the tweeters ear height he'd likely need 26" stands if he didn't go with Paradigm.

I just use Home Depot 12/2 in-wall since it's twisted and has the extra sheilding. Wrap it up in Techflex and it looks like $80/ft speaker cable and sounds better. ;)

Yeah, I'm not sure that would be an upgrade from the Studio 10; it seems too small.

I haven't heard the S1's but I have the S8 v.3's and I'm of the opinion that the tweeter alone would be worth the price of admission over the Studio 10.
What you might loose in bass extension you'd gain in overall sound quality I think. The S1's are smaller but not by whole bunch, I think the pics are a bit misleading. What you need to take into consideration is the bottoms aren't flat, so they need a specific stand or some kind of feet. I'm not sure if they come with any.

I can vouch for the S1's. They are a step up from the Studio 10's for sure. Rubber feet are included, along with a diagram of where to place them, if you intend to shelf mount. To stand mount them properly/safely I believe you will need to purchase the matching Paradigm stands.

Fyi, some have said that the S1's can present a heavy load for the average AVR, especially if you like to listen at spirited levels. I haven't noticed since I'm running an Anthem A5. Sounds reasonable though, seeing that they're a sealed design with an anechoic sensitivity rating of 87dB.

Thanks for the info on the Sigs. I'll have to go listen to them.

J-26 are the stands for the 40's or S4's. I think the number refers to the height and to get the tweeters ear height he'd likely need 26" stands if he didn't go with Paradigm.

I just use Home Depot 12/2 in-wall since it's twisted and has the extra sheilding. Wrap it up in Techflex and it looks like $80/ft speaker cable and sounds better. ;)
thanks for the info, should i consider 18" inch stand too?

I am trying to use other brand rather than the paradigm stand.

is monoprice cable really 12 gauge?

thanks for the info, should i consider 18" inch stand too?

I am trying to use other brand rather than the paradigm stand.

is monoprice cable really 12 gauge?

The idea with stands is that with the speakers on them the tweeters should ideally be close to ear height when your sitting in your main listening position. It's not the end of the world if they aren't, but it's a good rule of thumb to go by.

No idea what monoprices' speaker cable is like, but the simple truth is coat hangers wouldn't sound any different than high end cables, just let price and gauge for the distance be the guide.

J-26 are the stands for the 40's or S4's. I think the number refers to the height and to get the tweeters ear height he'd likely need 26" stands if he didn't go with Paradigm.

I just use Home Depot 12/2 in-wall since it's twisted and has the extra sheilding. Wrap it up in Techflex and it looks like $80/ft speaker cable and sounds better. ;)

J-23 or S-22 are the recommended stands for a Studio 40

J-23 or S-22 are the recommended stands for a Studio 40

My bad, I thought it was a 3" difference between the two. So yeah it is the 23's.. there is no 26.

hi FF,
which model fan/fans do you actually have.there are a few different models and some run at higher db's than others.I like to get 2 but I dont want to get one that I can hear!!
thanks for your input and this link!!

Zwalls, I have the 800 rpm fan. The model number is SFF21D. And as I mentioned in my other post, it's very, very, very quiet, even whe you put you head up to it. I Had also failed to mentione that I had also purchase a fan cover in black and a set of Rubber Fan Mounts in blue to hold the cover onto the fan. The fan mounts also come in black. I wrapped the fan wires with black electrical tape to make it look a bit better.

Rubber Fan Mounts http://www.coolerguys.com/rfanmntcc.html

Fan guard http://www.coolerguys.com/840556082705.html

I took two quick photos, now all I have to do is fiqure how to put a picture in my post since I've never done it :o Even though it looks like the fan sticks out like a sore thumb in the pictures, it's really not that bad. After all it keeps my Onkyo nice and very, very cool :)

http://http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r32/sdguy38/Fan-01.jpg

http://http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r32/sdguy38/Fan-02.jpg

I would love to hear more about your new 3 channel amp and how well you like it. Our tastes seem to run parallel and I have kept that amp in the mix as am option if I need it. Thanks Marshall!


Well, I got my new Emotiva XPA-3 hooked up :D It took about 3 hours TOTAL to do so :eek: which also included clean up and re-doing the cables behind my stand that holds all my gear. I had decided quite some time ago to replace the tiny 22 guage wire that I had installed many, many years ago for my two surrounds....before I knew better about cheap tiny guage wire.

Just 1 hour 45 minutes alone for the right rear as I had to remove the carpet and then tuck the wire underneath it and run it near the sliding door. A royal pain in the ass, but well worth it as you don't see any wiring what so ever.

Everything worked perfectly the first time :D I re-ran Audyssey and listened to a few tracks from Fleetwood Mac : Say You Will on DVD Audio which is in 5.1 and all of Alan Parsons : On Air which is a DTS 5.1 cd. Everything sounded MUCH better. The fronts and the surrounds. The fronts were noticebly clearer, and had more deapth. Well worth the $599 for the amp. I highly recommend it.

Then I plan to really test out the amp. Tonight I'll be watching Saving Private Ryan on blu ray. I've had it since it came out, but was saving it for when I got the amp and had everything hooked up. I'm especially looking forward to hearing the beach landing scene as I know how intense the surround will be. And since the Emotiva will be working the fronts, and my Onkyo will be handeling the rears, should be near pure bliss. Total bliss once I get my new Paridigms :D

Zwalls, I have the 800 rpm fan. The model number is SFF21D. And as I mentioned in my other post, it's very, very, very quiet, even whe you put you head up to it. I Had also failed to mentione that I had also purchase a fan cover in black and a set of Rubber Fan Mounts in blue to hold the cover onto the fan. The fan mounts also come in black. I wrapped the fan wires with black electrical tape to make it look a bit better.

Rubber Fan Mounts http://www.coolerguys.com/rfanmntcc.html

Fan guard http://www.coolerguys.com/840556082705.html

I took two quick photos, now all I have to do is fiqure how to put a picture in my post since I've never done it :o Even though it looks like the fan sticks out like a sore thumb in the pictures, it's really not that bad. After all it keeps my Onkyo nice and very, very cool :)

http://http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r32/sdguy38/Fan-01.jpg

http://http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r32/sdguy38/Fan-02.jpg

This is going to sound like a very dumb question but do you have the fan blowing in or out? :o I am guessing you are sucking the air out but just want to make sure.
Well, I got my new Emotiva XPA-3 hooked up :D It took about 3 hours TOTAL to do so :eek: which also included clean up and re-doing the cables behind my stand that holds all my gear. I had decided quite some time ago to replace the tiny 22 guage wire that I had installed many, many years ago for my two surrounds....before I knew better about cheap tiny guage wire.

Just 1 hour 45 minutes alone for the right rear as I had to remove the carpet and then tuck the wire underneath it and run it near the sliding door. A royal pain in the ass, but well worth it as you don't see any wiring what so ever.

Everything worked perfectly the first time :D I re-ran Audyssey and listened to a few tracks from Fleetwood Mac : Say You Will on DVD Audio which is in 5.1 and all of Alan Parsons : On Air which is a DTS 5.1 cd. Everything sounded MUCH better. The fronts and the surrounds. The fronts were noticebly clearer, and had more deapth. Well worth the $599 for the amp. I highly recommend it.

Then I plan to really test out the amp. Tonight I'll be watching Saving Private Ryan on blu ray. I've had it since it came out, but was saving it for when I got the amp and had everything hooked up. I'm especially looking forward to hearing the beach landing scene as I know how intense the surround will be. And since the Emotiva will be working the fronts, and my Onkyo will be handeling the rears, should be near pure bliss. Total bliss once I get my new Paridigms :D

I was laughing when I read your post. I did the same damn thing with my rears today. I picked up all of the carpet to hide my wires and had to run to Home Depot to get the 2 sided tape to cover the seam in one open area of the carpet. I need a really good amp like the one you have and you need a really good sub like the one I have coming. Let's make a pack to just do it! :D

This is going to sound like a very dumb question but do you have the fan blowing in or out? :o I am guessing you are sucking the air out but just want to make sure.


I was laughing when I read your post. I did the same damn thing with my rears today. I picked up all of the carpet to hide my wires and had to run to Home Depot to get the 2 sided tape to cover the seam in one open area of the carpet. I need a really good amp like the one you have and you need a really good sub like the one I have coming. Let's make a pack to just do it! :D


Trent, no it's not dumb at all. After all, it may work either way. But I have mine blowing out as I figure with the fan sucking the hot air out of the AVR on top, cool air will enter from sides and bottom.

That SVS subs still sounds great. I need to get the dementions from their website and measure to see if it fits where my current sub sits. I don't really have the space to put it anywhere other than where my current sub is located which is in between the tv and left front speaker. I'll try and take a few photos tomorrow of my set up ( yes, Klipsch ) not Paradigms....yet, now that I've figured out how to post photos in my posts.

thanks for the info, should i consider 18" inch stand too?

I am trying to use other brand rather than the paradigm stand.

is monoprice cable really 12 gauge?

if 12 AWG is what you order then yes it's really 12 gauge.it's what I orderd from them and have all seven of my speakers connected with the 12!!you cant beat the price.!!and everything sounds great!!

Trent, no it's not dumb at all. After all, it may work either way. But I have mine blowing out as I figure with the fan sucking the hot air out of the AVR on top, cool air will enter from sides and bottom.

That SVS subs still sounds great. I need to get the dementions from their website and measure to see if it fits where my current sub sits. I don't really have the space to put it anywhere other than where my current sub is located which is in between the tv and left front speaker. I'll try and take a few photos tomorrow of my set up ( yes, Klipsch ) not Paradigms....yet, now that I've figured out how to post photos in my posts.

Here are some of the stats you are going to need if you move forward with the SVS PB13 Ultra.

* Size: 27” D x 20.5 " W x 22" H (w/o grill)
* Warranty: 3 year "bumper to bumper"
* Support: Free 7 day/week customer service
* Weight: 155 pounds

Here are a few more but not as useful as trying to see if yu are going to have room for it to fit.

# Exclusive SVS Ultra-13" high-output woofer
# 750 watt BASH amp with room compensation
# Computer Assisted Design (CAD) enclosure
# Cast and chromed SVS badging
# Front-firing configuration with co-located vents
# Distinctive curved perforated magnetic grill
# "Stackable" form factor allows easy dual subs
# 3.5" high-flow flared ports CURVE (TM) tuning
# Assembled in the Ohio SVS factory
# Choice of wood veneers, gloss or text. black
# Two grill choices, fabric or stylish steel
# Selectable Sealed, 20Hz, 15Hz or 10Hz modes
# +/- 3 dB 18 Hz-150 Hz (anechoic) in 20hz mode

Zwalls, I have the 800 rpm fan. The model number is SFF21D. And as I mentioned in my other post, it's very, very, very quiet, even whe you put you head up to it. I Had also failed to mentione that I had also purchase a fan cover in black and a set of Rubber Fan Mounts in blue to hold the cover onto the fan. The fan mounts also come in black. I wrapped the fan wires with black electrical tape to make it look a bit better.

Rubber Fan Mounts http://www.coolerguys.com/rfanmntcc.html

Fan guard http://www.coolerguys.com/840556082705.html

I took two quick photos, now all I have to do is fiqure how to put a picture in my post since I've never done it :o Even though it looks like the fan sticks out like a sore thumb in the pictures, it's really not that bad. After all it keeps my Onkyo nice and very, very cool :)[/IMG]

thanks for the info!!looks like I'm going to order a couple of em!!

I just bought a pr of brand new in box ADP-590v5 for $1230, at an authorized dealer, after taxes. You guys getting better prices?

Well I sold the sub yesterday and went into my AVR and removed the sub from my setup and it did not sound very good? It seems you need to re-run the audyssey software and when it checked for the sub and could not find it, it then removed the sub from it's settings and everything starting sounding good once again. In fact it sounded better than it has to date. When I checked the cross overs it had it set for advanced with the sub gone and I am guessing it removed the crossovers all together and allowed me full range? I hate to say it but I think my old sub was mudding up the sound or I just did not have the sub settings correct? It sounds much better now with the sub gone. The mid bass is amazing but I am missing the deeper sub bass (for now).

Anyone had issues with W5's sounding a little hollow? I had supposed it is because the wall is faux wood paneling with block 2 inches behind that. Tonight I took a solid door leftover from some remodeling (speaker is behind an AT screen), mounted the speaker on that and still does not sound right. I have swapped the speaker and the problem stayed in the same place so it is not the speaker. I have an Anthem D1 and it is choosing a 60 Hz crossover for the L/R and 90 Hz for the center. Looking at the graph the calibration process generates you can see why it is treating it differently but I do not see why the speaker is coupling with the room this way if that is what is happening.

I just bought a pr of brand new in box ADP-590v5 for $1230, at an authorized dealer, after taxes. You guys getting better prices?

That sounds about right. That was within $75 of what I paid just 2 weeks ago. :rolleyes: You are really going to like them!!

That sounds about right. That was within $75 of what I paid just 2 weeks ago. :rolleyes: You are really going to like them!!
At the end of the day, we are probably gonna have the exact same setup, lol

At the end of the day, we are probably gonna have the exact same setup, lol

Good for you and all I can say is you are going to love it! Be prepared to spend many hours setting it up and setting it up again while moving this until you get the sound you want. The speakers have been on for 4 days straight as they break in ad this morning will be the first time I will to have them run around the clock for break in.

How are you going to set it up? Are you getting everything in stages and how far along are you? Are you deployed right now? :confused:

I just bought a pr of brand new in box ADP-590v5 for $1230, at an authorized dealer, after taxes. You guys getting better prices?

nope!!that seems like a great deal!!congrats!you have a great dealer!

Well I sold the sub yesterday and went into my AVR and removed the sub from my setup and it did not sound very good? It seems you need to re-run the audyssey software and when it checked for the sub and could not find it, it then removed the sub from it's settings and everything starting sounding good once again. In fact it sounded better than it has to date. When I checked the cross overs it had it set for advanced with the sub gone and I am guessing it removed the crossovers all together and allowed me full range? I hate to say it but I think my old sub was mudding up the sound or I just did not have the sub settings correct? It sounds much better now with the sub gone. The mid bass is amazing but I am missing the deeper sub bass (for now).

I'll sure be curious as to how your new sub sounds once you get it setup and rerun Audyssey!!

Does anyone have any experience with or opinons on using the Millenia 10 Hybrid for rear surrounds? Any input would be helpful! Also can you use Dipoles on a rear wall or hang them from a ceiling, I have ADP190s. Thanks!

Jeff

Anyone have opinions on my post? I'm moving soon and need a direction. Thanks again.

Jeff

Awesome pics DenonLover, enjoy!

Awesome pics DenonLover, enjoy!

Thanks John, I was feeling like the proud father of my new baby looking back at the photos. :rolleyes:

Anyone have opinions on my post? I'm moving soon and need a direction. Thanks again.

Jeff

cant help you with the mellenia's but the dipoles would be just fine in the rear if that's your best location for mounting your speakers!!

ok guys i think i have just pushed my S4s to the limit......without any external amplification and through the sole use of my SC-27 at -9dB and the Live Free Die Hard tunnel scene i just made the cloth of the speakers grills come off.....OMG i am in total shock right now. The S4s just produced some mid bass slam that i never thought could have come from them. This scene was surreal....given i have never pushed anything as hard as i did just now, i am now in amazement......i will be doing this only one more time (for my girl to hear) ever without getting an external amplifier. I am saying this because the voices were not as clear as they usually are at -15dB so i am guessing there wasnt enough power being supplied to the fronts. a second subwoofer is in order also.

ok guys i think i have just pushed my S4s to the limit......without any external amplification and through the sole use of my SC-27 at -9dB and the Live Free Die Hard tunnel scene i just made the cloth of the speakers grills come off.....OMG i am in total shock right now. The S4s just produced some mid bass slam that i never thought could have come from them. This scene was surreal....given i have never pushed anything as hard as i did just now, i am now in amazement......i will be doing this only one more time (for my girl to hear) ever without getting an external amplifier. I am saying this because the voices were not as clear as they usually are at -15dB so i am guessing there wasnt enough power being supplied to the fronts. a second subwoofer is in order also.

:eek::eek: Did the grill come off or just the cloth?

Recently I was listening to some music much louder than normal (the wife and kids were gone) and someone's bicycle helmet was sitting on the sub :mad:...until it hit a pretty low bass note and bounced it off. I just looked over there, smiled and thought...that helmet wasn't supposed to be there in the first place. :D

The new PB13 Ultra just arrived today and I am trying to find a home for this monster. I figured once it was here I would worry about it then. I just would like to confirm the setting from others. Fronts and center should be set to small and crossed over at 80 and sub is set for about 10:30 on the gain.

http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/3397/img2008z.jpg (http://img517.imageshack.us/i/img2008z.jpg/)

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/4733/img2011zc.jpg (http://img42.imageshack.us/i/img2011zc.jpg/)

DenonLover, That sure looks great. Very happy for you and your better half. The new sub makes your 100's look tiny :eek:

DenonLover, That sure looks great. Very happy for you and your better half. The new sub makes your 100's look tiny :eek:

Thanks buddy. I am starting to get that feeling like my musical additions over the coming years are going to be diminishing returns. This system really has me smiling. I want to upgrade my BD player and then I think I am going to take a break.

Nice looking setup denonlover. I got a pair of studio 100 V5 myself and I love them for music and movies. How does that 690 center channel sound down low like that? I love the piano finish option on those speakers but I got the black ash finish on my studios.

Thanks buddy. I am starting to get that feeling like my musical additions over the coming years are going to be diminishing returns. This system really has me smiling. I want to upgrade my BD player and then I think I am going to take a break.

hey DL,
I see you finally got that little tiny sub you've been waiting on!!:pdoes it sound as good as it looks?

Are Sigs. a major upgrade over Studio's when music is your major concern? And do Sigs. compare favorably with other brands with a rep. for good music reproduction in the same price range?

Nice looking setup denonlover. I got a pair of studio 100 V5 myself and I love them for music and movies. How does that 690 center channel sound down low like that? I love the piano finish option on those speakers but I got the black ash finish on my studios.

The CC-690 down low that like sounds alright and but great. I tested it up higher and when I did it changed the sound in a good way and raised the sound stage. It will be like this for another 8-10 weeks until all of our new furniture arrives. I think the black ash looks great, but I wanted it try the piano finish.

If I had to prioritize the speakers in order of importance to me I would say the center was the best purchase I made, next was the sub, then the fronts and the rears.

hey DL,
I see you finally got that little tiny sub you've been waiting on!!:pdoes it sound as good as it looks?

I am re listening to all of my favorite DVD-A discs right now and this thing is AMAZING. I had to back down the gain to about 10 o'clock and after changing the speakers to small and setting the cross overs I could not be happier. It really fills in everything down low and makes it so I do not need to listen to the volume quite so loud. I would do it all over again and not change a thing. :D

Are Sigs. a major upgrade over Studio's when music is your major concern? And do Sigs. compare favorably with other brands with a rep. for good music reproduction in the same price range?

I think what speaks volumes for me, is that even if I money were no object, I'd still buy the Sig S8's for my mains.

I think what speaks volumes for me, is that even if I money were no object, I'd still buy the Sig S8's for my mains.

Thanks. Have you listened to some of the speakers with great reps. for music?

DenonLover, That sure looks great. Very happy for you and your better half. The new sub makes your 100's look tiny :eek:

Ferrari fan, when are you going to come down this way to have a listen? When you leave you are only going to want to have the CC-690 for your center. I sat in my leather chair in front of the speakers for over 2-hours straight and I could not move. Each time I wanted to get up I heard a new sound I have never heard before. I am very pleased with Audyssey and the way they set it all up. I can tell there could be a little better mixing of the mains with the sub but not much and that is after some very critical listening.

Your time will come my friend, and when it does it will taste just as good or better. :rolleyes:

Are Sigs. a major upgrade over Studio's when music is your major concern? And do Sigs. compare favorably with other brands with a rep. for good music reproduction in the same price range?

I consider myself a Big Paradigm fan.
Music is very important to me, more than Ht.

I started out with Monitor 11's-great for Ht-OK for music.
Dealer let me Audition Studio 60 for 2 weeks-great for both music and HT.
Still looking for something "smoother" for music,-ended up with the Sig S-6.

I believe that the Sig series strength is Music! Maybe a little overkill for HT unless you've got the money.

I Also listened to B&W cm-5 and cm-7,and the sierra one (which i bought)
Hope this helps.

I consider myself a Big Paradigm fan.
Music is very important to me, more than Ht.

I started out with Monitor 11's-great for Ht-OK for music.
Dealer let me Audition Studio 60 for 2 weeks-great for both music and HT.
Still looking for something "smoother" for music,-ended up with the Sig S-6.

I believe that the Sig series strength is Music! Maybe a little overkill for HT unless you've got the money.

I Also listened to B&W cm-5 and cm-7,and the sierra one (which i bought)
Hope this helps.
Thanks, I'm considering the Sig 4's for fronts, and a Rhythmik sub.

Thanks, I'm considering the Sig 4's for fronts, and a Rhythmik sub.

I think that would be a great set-up! Never heard the S-4's but they would
be the minimum I would want for fronts. I also am also using a Rhythmik sub
with the s-6's,great sub...I believe one of the best values out there for
ID subs.

I am re listening to all of my favorite DVD-A discs right now and this thing is AMAZING. I had to back down the gain to about 10 o'clock and after changing the speakers to small and setting the cross overs I could not be happier. It really fills in everything down low and makes it so I do not need to listen to the volume quite so loud. I would do it all over again and not change a thing. :D

glad to hear your satisfied with your new setup!!I've pretty much done the same thing as far as relistening and rewatching just about everything!!

I find myself rebuilding my music library since getting the new speakers.before the upgrade I was doing about 50/50 HT/music and now it's more like 80%music and 20% HT!!

Well, PDigm replaced the tweeter and mid driver in my C3, said my S2 was fine (thought it was, but figured I'd have them take a look at it anyway since I was dropping off my C3). Haven't had a chance to listen to them much yet as I was away in San Diego for a few days, but the little I did before leaving seemed to sound fine (didn't crank it).

glad to hear your satisfied with your new setup!!I've pretty much done the same thing as far as relistening and rewatching just about everything!!

I find myself rebuilding my music library since getting the new speakers.before the upgrade I was doing about 50/50 HT/music and now it's more like 80%music and 20% HT!!

That is so funny that you said that about moving more towards music. I bought the speakers more for HT but now finding myself doing the same and listening to mostly music in the short time I have had these. What sun do you have Zwalls?

Thanks buddy. I am starting to get that feeling like my musical additions over the coming years are going to be diminishing returns. This system really has me smiling. I want to upgrade my BD player and then I think I am going to take a break.

When you get a new blu ray player, get the OPPO BDP-83. It's $499.00, but well worth it. It's my 3rd blu ray player and the best so far. Not to mention the cheapest too :D First one was about $800.00, the second $650.00 If you have lots of older standard dvd's, it will up-convert them to near high def quality.

Edit...forgot to mention that the Oppo will also play SACD and DVD-audio

Ferrari fan, when are you going to come down this way to have a listen? When you leave you are only going to want to have the CC-690 for your center. I sat in my leather chair in front of the speakers for over 2-hours straight and I could not move. Each time I wanted to get up I heard a new sound I have never heard before. I am very pleased with Audyssey and the way they set it all up. I can tell there could be a little better mixing of the mains with the sub but not much and that is after some very critical listening.

Your time will come my friend, and when it does it will taste just as good or better. :rolleyes:


I may be coming up your way this weekend to see your dealer. Not sure yet. If I do, I'll try and give you a ring so I can see and hear your set up.

Thanks. Have you listened to some of the speakers with great reps. for music?

Sure, a whack of them. B&W's, Martin Logan, Totem, Focal etc. I've heard just about everything available in this market. The caveat there though is I heard them in store listening rooms which varied considerably. Regardless, I can say with certainty that my desire to upgrade speakers is no more.

I have to say while the v.1's were excellent, the addition of the Be tweets in the v.2 & up put the Sigs in elite speaker territory.

When you get a new blu ray player, get the OPPO BDP-83. It's $499.00, but well worth it. It's my 3rd blu ray player and the best so far. Not to mention the cheapest too :D First one was about $800.00, the second $650.00 If you have lots of older standard dvd's, it will up-convert them to near high def quality.

I am going back and forth between the Oppo-83 at $499 and the Denon DBP-1611 for $399. The 1 additional thing I must have a great sound quality for my DVD-A and SACDs. Both meet my needs and will be replacing my PS3 that I am likely going to sell since I was using it for only movies. The only reason I ever kept it around was I kept thinking Gran Turismo was going to come out at some point! :mad:

Thanks, I'm considering the Sig 4's for fronts, and a Rhythmik sub.

Excellent set up. That's what I had before moving to the S8's, & music was outstanding;

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z212/RNRGAGNE/JAN30TH010.jpg

I am going back and forth between the Oppo-83 at $499 and the Denon DBP-1611 for $399. The 1 additional thing I must have a great sound quality for my DVD-A and SACDs. Both meet my needs and will be replacing my PS3 that I am likely going to sell since I was using it for only movies. The only reason I ever kept it around was I kept thinking Gran Turismo was going to come out at some point! :mad:

Wheee Doggies, that sure is one big "O" SVS Sub. Looks like great setup. I have the same fronts and center and Still have my PS3. Purchased Oppo bdp83 at recommendation of Pdigm dealer. Good advice, thanks:) I havent heard the Denon, so I cant compare those. But I can say that in my listening environment that you could definitely hear a difference in the PS3 and the OPPO 83. The highs were higher and lows lower. Clearer presence. The PS3 had a muffled sound to it when compared. Just keep in mind if you net flix or anything similar that the Oppo doesnt have that. but you can buy at about 80 bucks another wifi to log onto internet to download firmware. If anyone has any other info on Oppo streaming netflix please post.
Good luck

Excellent set up. That's what I had before moving to the S8's, & music was outstanding;


That setup is like HT P**n. Remind me again, what are the IB's and how are they powered? They look like the Lambda series of drivers from AE?

Wheee Doggies, that sure is one big "O" SVS Sub. Looks like great setup. I have the same fronts and center and Still have my PS3. Purchased Oppo bdp83 at recommendation of Pdigm dealer. Good advice, thanks:) I havent heard the Denon, so I cant compare those. But I can say that in my listening environment that you could definitely hear a difference in the PS3 and the OPPO 83. The highs were higher and lows lower. Clearer presence. The PS3 had a muffled sound to it when compared. Just keep in mind if you net flix or anything similar that the Oppo doesnt have that. but you can buy at about 80 bucks another wifi to log onto internet to download firmware. If anyone has any other info on Oppo streaming netflix please post.
Good luck

Thanks visionquest69!

That is why I was leaning towards the Denon unit. For only $399 it also includes Netflix and we do use netflix steaming on our PS3 currently so an all in one solution is key. Excellent DB quality, DVD-A/SACD, and Netlix for $399 that will have firmware for 3D. Sign me up. There needs to be a compelling reason for me not to get the Denon for that price. My name is DenonLover so I feel like I would be betraying my screen name if I did not do it?

Key features of the Denon DBP-1611UD:

* Universal disc player (Blu-ray, DVD-Audio, SACD, DVD, CD)
* 3D Blu-ray compatible via a firmware update coming in the fall
* Netflix and YouTube streaming
* 1GB onboard memory
* $400 list price; available in June

Key step-up features of the Denon DBP-2011UDCI:

* Anchor Bay video processing (ABT2015 chip)
* 7.1-analog outputs
* RS-232 port; IR inputs/outputs
* $800 list price; available in August