There's also a specific thread on Lip Sync, so maybe that should go there, I dunno.

Either way I just want my TV :\

- D

I was thinking that maybe putting the TV in "game" mode is supposed to skip the dnie (which is largely considered the source of extra video delay). Since the DNIe is just an extra feature and comments have been made as to equaling its effect through normal tweaking. Why not put all the inputs to game mode and reduce the video processing. Then there would be little to no audio lag and (importantly for me) no game lag worries. And you can still pass the high quality signals to it. Can someone that has received their set (68 series if possible as that's what I'm waiting on) could test this theory? That would rock.

On the lip sync thing, it's like rainbows. As the sync goes from perfect to terrible, more and more people notice it. Only your own eyes/ears can tell you whether it's an issue for you.

So it seems like you only have a few choices:
- get the TV and see if it's a problem for you, if not great
- get an AVR or external audio delay device
- look for a display with less video processing delay (like a CRT)

I really think that TV vendors need 5.1 digital audio inputs for every source and a single 5.1 digital audio output that is sync'd to the display. Only that can 100% fix the problem, but that's highly unlike to happen in 2005 or 2006. So no use complaining about it.

As for me, I've put the 885 up on ebay and ordered a 985. I've spent too many hours working on PC DVD playback (at work) and know already that I can see a 50ms or greater lag without even trying. :-(

I respectably disagree with UCSB and anyone else that think we should calm down. We all have waited a very long time for this TV. This problem has been going on in one form or another for a long long time. People have this TV on order, many with delivery dates. I think we have a right to know NOW if there is a problem, prior to delivery and hours of setup. If not enough people have taken delivery to warrant a true test, I understand this and lets give the market more time to test. At this time to me and many people lip sync is a deal buster. Picture quality at this point is secondary. This issue should stay prevalent on this site until we have a consensus. I for one hope the pressure is kept up on this issue. My 5678 delivery date on is 8/5.


Because a receiver doesn't process audio at the same speed as a new digital TV doesn't mean there is something wrong with the TV any more than it means there is something wrong with the receiver. They are two seperate devices that do not communicate with one another and are performing very different tasks and unless there is a way to slow the faster process down it is pure luck if they are in perfect sync. The only way to guarantee this would be to slow all devices down so they all had the same delay no mater what they were processing or make all devices so fast there is no delay in anything. The later will never happen. If this was only an issue with Samsung the receiver companies and DVD players wouldn't be including delays. The delay is part of life just like adjusting contrast or anything else there is no way your TV can be responsible for how fast your receiver processes data. If I have a lip sync problem with my new 6768 I guess I will have to get a receiver that was built to work with these new digital TVs and adjust it.

After finally resolving my VGA cable issues, I sat down and watched some TV :) My configuration is pretty basic - HTPC --> VGA --> 6168 and HTPC --> Optical --> AVR. Windows XP Pro, 1920x1080@60Hz with screen enlarged fully to get what appears to be a 1:1 mapping (there is some slight overscan) I use SageTV as my HTPC front end and currently only have SD content. I was pretty pleased with the look of my recordings and live tv, but I am not the discriminating viewer that many of you are. I also threw in a few DVDs (Plextor 716SA in the HTPC) and was quite satisfied with the quality. The only strange thing was the widescreen DVDs would play with a fairly wide boarder all the way around the image - this was with the SageTV Aspect Ratio Mode set to "Source". I would have to set it to 16x9 to have the image fill the screen. I plan to investigate the rest of the TV settings in hopes to improve the image quality. *Edit* I experienced no audio/video lag during any viewing.

I am an avid online PC gamer and was pretty worried about the potential for lag. However, I am very happy to report that I experienced no lag while playing TFC and Natural Selection (both fast paced Half-Life mods). The only issues I found were the slight overscan caused by the 1:1 mapping and my mouse sensitivity. I increased the mouse sensitivity in game to account for the larger resolution but I don't have a solution for the overscan other than resizing the display in the TV menu before playing. The game detail was amazing and playing with surround sound was quite a treat. :) Game On!

UCSB, I respect and trust your abilities. I will anxiously wait for your opinion on the cause of the lag. There are many other qualified people on this forum that hopefully will chime in as well. I know many have already, and most don`t blame the TV. There just seems to be too much uncertainty, too many sources of lag, to much angst for something we all WANT to work out. p.s. I think we all should pitch in and buy HTWAITS a 1080p, so he can run test.

p.s. I think we all should pitch in and buy HTWAITS a 1080p, so he can run test.
Now that's the kind of problem solving I can get behind. :cool:

Since I don't have a 1080p set maybe this will give some prospective.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4087409#post4087409

Because a receiver doesn't process audio at the same speed as a new digital TV doesn't mean there is something wrong with the TV any more than it means there is something wrong with the receiver.

I've never heard of audio sync issues (that I can remember) in all these years in DLP front projectors. While that may be because lot of us use it with HTPCs and feed them correct resolutions ... I feel the the issue comes up because RPTVs are trying to do a lot of video processing which causes more video delay than is desirable (i.e. makes the delay obvious).

Do FP owners reading this point out / narrate any sync issues ?

I was thinking that maybe putting the TV in "game" mode is supposed to skip the dnie (which is largely considered the source of extra video delay). Since the DNIe is just an extra feature and comments have been made as to equaling its effect through normal tweaking. Why not put all the inputs to game mode and reduce the video processing. Then there would be little to no audio lag and (importantly for me) no game lag worries. And you can still pass the high quality signals to it. Can someone that has received their set (68 series if possible as that's what I'm waiting on) could test this theory? That would rock.FYI, I already tried setting my Component 1 source (connected to STB) to GAME, hoping it might solve the sync problem to a degree by removing some of the processing. No dice. I checked several channels/programs with this setup (I'm on TW by the way), and all exhibited the same or nearly the same sync problems.

Ok, I've got a stupid question for anyone in the know:

What kind of audio is a standard cable coax connection (I'm using RG6) able to supply? Since I don't recall a single person mentioning it, I assume that this is a dead end, but I'd like to know anyway. Here's where I'm headed with this question:

WALL (coax:A/V)---> STB (coax:A/V)---> 5078 (toslink:A)---> AVR

I can try this setup out, just wondering if it's even worth bothering. Wondering if this route could get 5.1 into the set (just as if I were using the internal OTA tuner) so that we can pass it on to the AVR. Thoughts?

Notes from third evening of testing:

I've begun noticing too many instances of lip sync problems with my Time Warner feed through the SA8300HD. So until I decide (if at all) to buy a delay device, I'm now sacrificing 5.1 on my cable viewing to get things synchronized. So here's my cable setup:

8300HD (component:V)---> 5078
8300HD (rca:A)---> 5078 (toslink:A)---> DENON 1803 AVR

There's been a bit of questioning of whether or not the tv would actually sync up the audio with the video before outputting the audio (either via internal speakers or toslink to AVR). I can confirm that at least in my experience so far tonight, it works perfectly! Over an hour of viewing multiple cable channels and programs ... zero lip sync problems. Also no 5.1, but my Denon does quite a nice job outputting DTS NEO 6 to my Paradigms, so for the time being I think I'll be quite happy. I won't sacrifice true, discrete 5.1 for DVD content, but I don't mind not having it for cable viewing (yet) since I don't get HBO and the like. BTW, I'll soon replace the component+rca from the 8300HD once I pick up a new HDMI cable.

To reiterate, I've had no perceptible lip sync problems on DVD with the following setup, although I need to watch a lot more before I am willing to stand by that statement over the long haul:

DVD-HD950 (hdmi:V)---> 5078
DVD-HD950 (digital coax:A)---> DENON 1803 AVR

The player is outputting 1080i, and the receiver is outputting true DTS or DD, whatever is available. No lip sync problems on LOTR so far, also none on Finding Nemo (I've never watched fish talk so closely before! ;) ).

Are you aware that Game mode is limited to 480i?Heh! Good point, I forgot that I read that in the manual (probably quickly became a repressed memory). That would explain why using GAME had no effect on my HD cable sources.

I'm pretty much decided on purchasing a HLR5078 myself but I must admit to being a bit apprehensive about making the purchase until I can be reasonably well assured that there won't be a lip synch problems (with S97 DVD player and a D*HDTivo feeding a Panny XR50 a/v receiver in my case) so if I do go ahead and purchase right away it will be from a local store with a good 30-day return policy. Welcome to the bleeding edge. ;)

I've had the 6168 since last Sunday. I've posted several times since. I've been messing with it every day. I've fed the following to the 6168: Samsung Sir-160 (Directv) at 1080i via DVI to HDMI. Samsung HD850 at 480p, 720p, and 1080i via HDMI and Component. I've fed an older model JVC prog scan player at 480p via component. I've fed the Xbox via component using 480i (SW EP2 DVD using game mode), 480p (SW Battlefront, Halo2, Forza), 720p (ESPN 2k4) and 1080i (MX vs Atv Unleashed).

Using the echo test: sound from the 6168 internal speakers using composite audio cables and HDMI vs sound from my Yamaha 5760 being fed directly from above listed items using optical cables.

Everything and I repeat EVERYTHING I listed and tried has needed a delay optimally of 100ms to get rid of the echo and visual lip synch delay. I think the echo is the best test since lips can be a source problem. The only thing that does not need a delay is audio coming out of the 6168 to the AVR. Which of course will only be 5.1 from it's internal tuners and 2.0 from HDMI or composite audio cables.

Believe it or not this is what I have found after nearlly a week of testing the 6168.

On the positve side it's only a 1/10 of a second delay for the best display I have seen yet. As far as the xbox I am a casual gamer. For games such as Halo 2 and Forza it took me a few minutes to adapt to the delay. Other games such as Links I did not have a rpoblem. I tried driving the ball several times and used mulligan to hit the ball again immediately and I had no problems from the start. There was however a delay since the tv speaker would echo with the AVR speakers until I put in a delay of at least 80ms. Sounded best with 100ms.

My previous tv was a Mits 55807 ( not prof calibrated). The 6168 has a much better picture, better inputs including two HDMI inputs, can except 720p the mits could not, internal tuners, and a far better anti glare screen. The only things the 55807 had better was 0 delay needed by my AVR ( I checked since I had read the Samsung problem for previous generations of DLP), and better blacks (still looks quite good on the 6168 though. (Blacks might be better than I'm getting with the HD850. It doesn't seem to pass BTB unless the 850 setup's brightness is at 5 instead of default 3. 4 and 5 crushes the whites though.)

If you are a serious gamer the delay may bother you. Despite the audio delay, which I no longer personally feel is a problem since I've left my receiver with 100ms delay for the past two days, I love this tv.....

For those of you who don't see a lip synch problem try the echo test. If not, using the echo test, please let us know.

Are you aware that Game mode is limited to 480i?

Didn't know that... oh well.

One more thing about the Xbox. I have a Logitech wireless controller. On the Mits I noticed it appeared to slightly lag a corded controller. I switched between the two all the time. I only use the corded when playing on Xbox live. It usually takes a few minutes to get used to the other controller after using just one of them for awhile. Similar to the difference I notice with a corded controller on the 6168 and the corded controller with the 55807 I sold a month ago. It just doesn't seem to be a problem with my level of game play. A hardcore gamer would probably think different though.

I also don't think the Xbox 360 will be any different as far as lag than the current Xbox. The lag between 108i and 480p appears to be the same to me using the echo test.

Heh! Good point, I forgot that I read that in the manual (probably quickly became a repressed memory). That would explain why using GAME had no effect on my HD cable sources.
I think you would also need a source that you were sure didn't have any sync problems. Maybe a "good" DVD with progressive mode turned off would work for a test.

I've had the 6168 since last Sunday. I've posted several times since. I've been messing with it every day. I've fed the following to the 6168: Samsung Sir-160 (Directv) at 1080i via DVI to HDMI. Samsung HD850 at 480p, 720p, and 1080i via HDMI and Component. I've fed an older model JVC prog scan player at 480p via component. I've fed the Xbox via component using 480i (SW EP2 DVD using game mode), 480p (SW Battlefront, Halo2, Forza), 720p (ESPN 2k4) and 1080i (MX vs Atv Unleashed).

Using the echo test: sound from the 6168 internal speakers using composite audio cables and HDMI vs sound from my Yamaha 5760 being fed directly from above listed items using optical cables.

Everything and I repeat EVERYTHING I listed and tried has needed a delay optimally of 100ms to get rid of the echo and visual lip synch delay. I think the echo is the best test since lips can be a source problem. The only thing that does not need a delay is audio coming out of the 6168 to the AVR. Which of course will only be 5.1 from it's internal tuners and 2.0 from HDMI or composite audio cables.

Believe it or not this is what I have found after nearlly a week of testing the 6168.

On the positve side it's only a 1/10 of a second delay for the best display I have seen yet. As far as the xbox I am a casual gamer. For games such as Halo 2 and Forza it took me a few minutes to adapt to the delay. Other games such as Links I did not have a rpoblem. I tried driving the ball several times and used mulligan to hit the ball again immediately and I had no problems from the start. There was however a delay since the tv speaker would echo with the AVR speakers until I put in a delay of at least 80ms. Sounded best with 100ms.

My previous tv was a Mits 55807 ( not prof calibrated). The 6168 has a much better picture, better inputs including two HDMI inputs, can except 720p the mits could not, internal tuners, and a far better anti glare screen. The only things the 55807 had better was 0 delay needed by my AVR ( I checked since I had read the Samsung problem for previous generations of DLP), and better blacks (still looks quite good on the 6168 though. (Blacks might be better than I'm getting with the HD850. It doesn't seem to pass BTB unless the 850 setup's brightness is at 5 instead of default 3. 4 and 5 crushes the whites though.)

If you are a serious gamer the delay may bother you. Despite the audio delay, which I no longer personally feel is a problem since I've left my receiver with 100ms delay for the past two days, I love this tv.....

For those of you who don't see a lip synch problem try the echo test. If not, using the echo test, please let us know.

If you were not using the 'echo test', would you have noticed a lip sync problem? That is the real test. I'm not 100% confident in the 'echo test' because I believe the TV's have a build in sync parameter in the service menu (still needs to be verified) and it just may be set to 100 ms delay. Thanks for the post it is very helpful when we can quantify the delay. Would you consider trying to find the minimum delay on your receiver where you can not perceive a lip sync problem without the echo test?

UCSB, I respect and trust your abilities. I will anxiously wait for your opinion on the cause of the lag. There are many other qualified people on this forum that hopefully will chime in as well. I know many have already, and most don`t blame the TV. There just seems to be too much uncertainty, too many sources of lag, to much angst for something we all WANT to work out. p.s. I think we all should pitch in and buy HTWAITS a 1080p, so he can run test.

Thanks, I'll do my best to contribute to the collection of data once the 5668 arrives. But, as more data comes in I think we will see some patterns.

I'm not 100% confident in the 'echo test' because I believe the TV's have a build in sync parameter in the service menu (still needs to be verified) and it just may be set to 100 ms delay.
The HLP sets have a delay value in the SM, but I don't have any idea how much delay is associated with the three(?) possible settings.

Under the "Option" menu the value of "Sound Delay" is set to "Delay 3". I think that's maximum delay, but I'm not sure.

I have never used the TV's speakers so I don't know if there is a lip sync problem using them. I'm also uncertain about the echo test too, but that's probably because I'm confessed. :eek:

The HLP sets have a delay value in the SM, but I don't have any idea how much delay is associated with the three(?) possible settings.

Under the "Option" menu the value of "Sound Delay" is set to "Delay 3". I think that's maximum delay, but I'm not sure.

I have never used the TV's speakers so I don't know if there is a lip sync problem using them. I'm also uncertain about the echo test too, but that's probably because I'm confessed. :eek:

I went into the Service Menu on my 5668 and didn't find a "Sound Delay" setting anywhere. Other ideas?

Anyone been able to get their Harmony remote to work with the 2 HDMI inputs to toggle between Sat and DVD player?

Anyone been able to get their Harmony remote to work with the 2 HDMI inputs to toggle between Sat and DVD player?

If you can get HDMI 2 working, please post the code for the command. I have a Philips pronto and can pick up the code and apply it to my unit. Also, if anyone finds a list of discrete codes for the HLR series, please post the address. I have sent an email to Samsung tech support, but have not heard back from them yet.

Am I missing something, or the the only way to swap PIP sound sources by going 4 levels deep through menus. Might as well just change the channel.

Is there a discrete code to accomplish same, or some hidden button I am missing?

Your help is appreciated.

I have been watching movies using a Sony mini-system, outputting through svideo to the tv.

Sound is produced directly by the mini-system.

NO PROBLEMS!!!!!!

Is lip sync only a digital video phenom?

I am an avid online PC gamer and was pretty worried about the potential for lag. However, I am very happy to report that I experienced no lag while playing TFC and Natural Selection (both fast paced Half-Life mods).

Thanks for the report GoobTheNoob! I am glad to hear you got the VGA working as your setup sounds very similar to mine (except that I am using Windows XP Media Center Edition instead of SageTv).

Again - I hear another satisified gamer. This makes me not worry that the tv is spending too much time processing the video (as well it shouldn't because it is being fed a 1080p signal already), which, in turn, makes me feel that the tv will not be a significant source of lip sync issues.

All you people banging your shoe on the podium about lip sync -- there are WAY to many variables in any given setup to be able to be very scientific about this (the two easiest to point out being source material and listener sensitivity).

If this is a "deal breaker" for you, I would simply arrange to drag your equipment to a store when you can hook it up and see how it works, or drag a tv to your home and if you are not satisfied, return it.

There will never be an definitive answer, either on this forum, from samsung reps, or elsewhere as to if these TV's have lip sync issues or not.

-reiner

moss312 , Thank you for your report. I believe you and I are in complete agreement. I'll be getting the Felston DD540 on Wednesday and I'm very confident something around a 100ms audio delay will do the trick for me.

I had two teenage nephews play Halo 2 on my Xbox for a couple hours yesterday (not in game mode). I didn't mention anything about delay and neither of them seemed to notice it. They are both avid gamers. Their only response was to ask their parents if they could get one of these 1080p DLPs.

I just got my HL-R5668W yesterday and love the set. It was a replacement for an HL-P5674W and it is a signifincantly improved picture. Anyway, I do seem to have one problem. Every once in a while a little white dot appears at one place on the screen. It goes away as soon as the scene changes and has only appeared about three times in about four hours of watching. Does anyone have any thoughts?

I just got my HL-R5668W yesterday and love the set. It was a replacement for an HL-P5674W and it is a signifincantly improved picture. Anyway, I do seem to have one problem. Every once in a while a little white dot appears at one place on the screen. It goes away as soon as the scene changes and has only appeared about three times in about four hours of watching. Does anyone have any thoughts?

How big is it? Is it the size of a pixel or larger?

If you were not using the 'echo test', would you have noticed a lip sync problem? That is the real test. I'm not 100% confident in the 'echo test' because I believe the TV's have a build in sync parameter in the service menu (still needs to be verified) and it just may be set to 100 ms delay. Thanks for the post it is very helpful when we can quantify the delay. Would you consider trying to find the minimum delay on your receiver where you can not perceive a lip sync problem without the echo test?

I don't understand. If there is no echo you are in sync with what the TV thinks the audio should be. What more would we need?

Also it seems obvious that any video signal which needs to be processed would delay the display of the video (variable, delay dependent on speed of processor and amount of processing needed) and therefore out of sync. This would hold true for all manufactures.

The only solution to this problem (for non gamers) seems to be:

a. Use audio delay

b. Buy a set that passes 5.1 from the TV audio out and adds the appropriate delay. This must be difficult to do. The manufacture that solves this could have a lock on the market other things being equal.

c. Live with the sync problem. It sounds like most viewers don't see the minimal delay on most sources because it is there on all sources.

Solution a could also solve sync problems that are source related.

6168 arrived yesterday. About 1 hour setting up the stand (instructions were pretty good) and another 1 hour setting up all the components and wires. Took about 43 seconds to hook up the TV, just the 5 component cables from the cable box and power cord. TV came right on and ...

Yep, it's stunning! No fine tuning at all. So glad I returned the D-ILA for the 1080p. It's really crisp where the D-ILA was fuzzy to me. I am thoroughy pleased with this set. And, yes, I do see the lip synch delay on all channels with sound sent through my old (5 years) Kenwood AVR. No delay of course when you use the TV speakers, so a real nice echo when you use both. The delay does not bother me (like the fuzz of the D-ILA) but I'll probably go for a new AVR with adjustable delay (which one should I buy?)

Anybody worried about whether or not this set will meet expectations should relax. It's a sock blower!

If you were not using the 'echo test', would you have noticed a lip sync problem? That is the real test. I'm not 100% confident in the 'echo test' because I believe the TV's have a build in sync parameter in the service menu (still needs to be verified) and it just may be set to 100 ms delay. Thanks for the post it is very helpful when we can quantify the delay. Would you consider trying to find the minimum delay on your receiver where you can not perceive a lip sync problem without the echo test?

Actually the first night I bought the 6168 my wife wanted to watch Miss Congeniality 2. Since I had spent a lot of money on this tv and I bought an ATI X800XL video card that morning (great card by the way, was on sale at BB), I decided to watch it with her. The movie was horrible. Picture was good though. After a few minutes of watching it I noticed the lips were off. After 10 minutes my wife of all people noticed the lips did not match (that was with out me mentioning to her I noticed the lips were off). She kept skipping chapters after that, because she agreed the movie was horrible, we finished it in just over 20 minutes. She went to bed.

Then I threw in a few dvds including SW EP2, Blade 2 (dts), spiderman 2. I could tell the lips were off. I think a 1/10th of a second is just the right amount of time were a lip will be closed instead of open when speaking. I've checked several dvds since then with the same results. I've played with the delay several times with different dvds, and the Xbox, 100ms seems just right. Originally I had it at 120ms. 100ms seems better. 80ms to 120ms appears to visually get rid of lip synch problem.


Side note: For me to hook up my ATI video card I need a 30ft VGA cable (found some on the internet at a descent price). I also need a wireless keyboard/mouse. Does anyone know of a wireless keyboard/mouse that will go through one wall and 30 ft of distance.

If you can get HDMI 2 working, please post the code for the command. I have a Philips pronto and can pick up the code and apply it to my unit. Also, if anyone finds a list of discrete codes for the HLR series, please post the address. I have sent an email to Samsung tech support, but have not heard back from them yet.

I started a separate thread on the HL-Rxxx8 discrete codes. Most of the HLP codes work (even power on, at least for me). However, I can not get any code to work for HDMI 2 or for Antenna.

How big is it? Is it the size of a pixel or larger?

It does seem to be about the size of a pixel, but it isn't a "fixed" pixel. I have an HD TiVo and I think it has only appeared when I am browsing through the TiVo's menus. It may've also appeared when watching TV, but I don't recall. I'll have to pay a bit more attention, but if it only appears on the TiVo menu screens, it's probably due to the TiVo and is something I can live with. The main reason I'm saying it's not a fixed pixel is because if the dot is there and I go to a new screen and then go back to the prior screen, it is no longer there. Could it still be a bad pixel if it only appears sporadically?

It does seem to be about the size of a pixel, but it isn't a "fixed" pixel. I have an HD TiVo and I think it has only appeared when I am browsing through the TiVo's menus. It may've also appeared when watching TV, but I don't recall. I'll have to pay a bit more attention, but if it only appears on the TiVo menu screens, it's probably due to the TiVo and is something I can live with. The main reason I'm saying it's not a fixed pixel is because if the dot is there and I go to a new screen and then go back to the prior screen, it is no longer there. Could it still be a bad pixel if it only appears sporadically?

I would check with Samsung if it continues. In the past Samsung would replace the chip if any pixel stuck in the on position.

a. Use audio delay

b. Buy a set that passes 5.1 from the TV audio out and adds the appropriate delay. This must be difficult to do. The manufacture that solves this could have a lock on the market other things being equal.

c. Live with the sync problem. It sounds like most viewers don't see the minimal delay on most sources because it is there on all sources.


d. Buy a really long optical or coaxial spdif cable. With the speed of light, 2 miles should be about right for optical. Coax can be shorter due to the velocity fact of between 66% and 75% (because of the capacity) - so 1.25 miles to 1.5 miles should work. ;)

I would check with Samsung if it continues. In the past Samsung would replace the chip if any pixel stuck in the on position.

Years ago, in the front projectors forum with DLPs, a way of possibly un-sticking a mirror was to tune to a channel without a signal. The rapid white, black and greys of the "noise" appeared to sometimes free the mirror.

Moss and Calbert: EXCELLENT POSTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Your results seem to confirm my "assumptions."

Is anyone using a cable card rather than a cable box????

I would like to confirm that the TV's optical output has 5.1 (rather than 2.0) when the cable input has 5.1.

Years ago, in the front projectors forum with DLPs, a way of possibly un-sticking a mirror was to tune to a channel without a signal. The rapid white, black and greys of the "noise" appeared to sometimes free the mirror.

My issue is that the pixel is NOT stuck, it just appears every once in a while. As soon as the scene changes, it disappears. Has anyone ever heard of a pixel problem such as this when the pixel is not stuck? I tried to attach a couple of pictures, but I got an error message that the pictures were too large (I guess I need to change the resolution on my camera?).

RMSko -- Maybe you could crop that portion of your picture, thus keeping the better resolution but reducing the picture's size. Leave enough of the surrounding image to provide context and reference.

d. Buy a really long optical or coaxial spdif cable. With the speed of light, 2 miles should be about right for optical. Coax can be shorter due to the velocity fact of between 66% and 75% (because of the capacity) - so 1.25 miles to 1.5 miles should work. ;)

That might fit in my crawl space. Do you have a source or do I need a bunch of connectors :)

Can anyone "confirm" 1:1 pixel mapping with 1080p 60Hz VGA, use the pixels tests?
Comments on banding using the gradient tests?
How does 1080i over HDMI look ?
How does 720p over HDMI look ?
If using a driver that allows you to keep 1:1 pixel mapping and adjust for overscan what is the resulting resolution?
Comments on how well the set scales when using PC game friendly resolutions?
Is there an option not to scale, that is just use say 1280x1024 mapped 1:1?

Moss and Calbert: EXCELLENT POSTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Your results seem to confirm my "assumptions."

Is anyone using a cable card rather than a cable box????

I would like to confirm that the TV's optical output has 5.1 (rather than 2.0) when the cable input has 5.1.

I don't have cable card, just Directv HD and an antenna connected directly to the 6168's built in tuner. The built in tuners cable/air will output 5.1 sound via the 6168's optical out. Remeber though, HDMI will only accept 2.0 on these tv's. Which means sending 2.0 through HDMI will output 2.0 to an AVR. So unless your using the built in tuners the tv will only output 2.0.

I started a separate thread on the HL-Rxxx8 discrete codes. Most of the HLP codes work (even power on, at least for me). However, I can not get any code to work for HDMI 2 or for Antenna.

have you guys tried calling or emailing Harmony support for this ? When I got my 659 a couple of years ago I had problems getting my harmony to learn the code for the power toggle on my receiver; I communicated through email, they resolved it within a day. From what I've read they are still very good at resolving these programming issues quickly

RMSko -- Maybe you could crop that portion of your picture, thus keeping the better resolution but reducing the picture's size. Leave enough of the surrounding image to provide context and reference.
Great suggestion. Attached are two files, one showing the white dot and the exact same screen without the white dot. The dot may appear bigger than it really was due to distortion from the flash. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Great suggestion. Attached are two files, one showing the white dot and the exact same screen without the white dot. The dot may appear bigger than it really was due to distortion from the flash. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

My guess is a sticking mirror and that's the effect that womble has on it...

My guess is a sticking mirror and that's the effect that womble has on it...

Do you think that's the case even though I'm pretty sure that I have never seen it on a TV broadcast and have only seen it on the TiVo setup screens? Also, if it was stuck, wouldn't it appear almost every other time I go to that setup screen? So far, it has only appeared a couple of times even though I have gone to that same setup screen about a dozen times?

Do you have a PC to hook up to test where you can display solid fields?

There is a program posted up a bit that lets you change the background so it would test all mirror angles.

Sounds like a non issue if it only happens as mentioned anyhow?

Do you have a PC to hook up to test where you can display solid fields?

There is a program posted up a bit that lets you change the background so it would test all mirror angles.

Sounds like a non issue if it only happens as mentioned anyhow?

Thanks, I may take a look at that program. I just did some tests on regular TV and with TiVo I am able to move the picture frame by frame. After moving one seen about 15 frames, I saw another white dot, but this one was in a completely different location. Is there any chance that this could be normal?

Do you think that's the case even though I'm pretty sure that I have never seen it on a TV broadcast and have only seen it on the TiVo setup screens? Also, if it was stuck, wouldn't it appear almost every other time I go to that setup screen? So far, it has only appeared a couple of times even though I have gone to that same setup screen about a dozen times?

I would vote for a faulty memory register causing an intermitant problem.
If it continues keep taking pictures of it for documentation and either get a new set or have the light engine replaced.

If its only seen on the TIVO I would retract this idea and focus on the TIVO

This rates a "wild guess" on my part. :cool:

I would vote for a faulty memory register causing an intermitant problem.
If it continues keep taking pictures of it for documentation and either get a new set or have the light engine replaced.

If its only seen on the TIVO I would retract this idea and focus on the TIVO

This rates a "wild guess" on my part. :cool:

Since I just saw it on live TV (albeit it in a different place on the screen and I also had to pause the picture and then move it one screen at a time to even notice it), I decided to call Samsung and have them take a look at it. As strange as it sounds, I'd really like the set fixed instead of getting an exchange since this set was itself an exchange of a defective HLP model. I'm hoping that it's something relatively easy to fix. I've taken a bunch of pictures, so hopefully that will help. Fortunately it's not really noticeable when watching live TV, it's just one of those things that you want to be perfect.

Since I just saw it on live TV (albeit it in a different place on the screen and I also had to pause the picture and then move it one screen at a time to even notice it), I decided to call Samsung and have them take a look at it. As strange as it sounds, I'd really like the set fixed instead of getting an exchange since this set was itself an exchange of a defective HLP model. I'm hoping that it's something relatively easy to fix. I've taken a bunch of pictures, so hopefully that will help. Fortunately it's not really noticeable when watching live TV, it's just one of those things that you want to be perfect.

Let me understand you correctly. Based on the first sentence you are still using the TIVO to see this problem? Can you get your hands on another TIVO box temporarily and see if you still have the problem?

I went into the Service Menu on my 5668 and didn't find a "Sound Delay" setting anywhere. Other ideas?
Have TVA send me the 61" model and I'll check. Either the "68" or the "78" will be fine. I'm not picky. :D

ECHO TEST

There have been several posts that reported NO lip sync when their audio receiver was connected directly to the source and not through the TV. However, the majority of posts indicate that there is lip syn when connected this way.

I was wondering if you (no lip sync) could run a simple test to help us confirm what "ground truth" actually is.

Could you turn up your TV's audio with your HT audio and confirm whether or not you hear an echo????

My "assumption" is that some people may "notice" lip sync more than others.

Thanks In Advance for all of your help.

Let me understand you correctly. Based on the first sentence you are still using the TIVO to see this problem? Can you get your hands on another TIVO box temporarily and see if you still have the problem?

Sorry - Let me try to explain. I've have been testing this with a particular page in the TiVo menu. If I go to that page, it is easy to navigate from that page to another page and then back again. When I do this, the white dot (pixel) appears about 1 out of every 8 times I return to that one (test) page, but it appears at the exact same place each time.

I have in addition tested this on live tv. I paused a movie and then advanced the picture one frame at a time. When doing this another white dot (pixel) appeared on the screen, but in a different place on the screen than what happened with the TiVo.

Unfortunately it's not really feasible to test it with another TiVo because these units go for about $800 and so I only have one. I'm pretty sure it is the TV though.

Sorry - Let me try to explain. I've have been testing this with a particular page in the TiVo menu. If I go to that page, it is easy to navigate from that page to another page and then back again. When I do this, the white dot (pixel) appears about 1 out of every 8 times I return to that one (test) page, but it appears at the exact same place each time.

I have in addition tested this on live tv. I paused a movie and then advanced the picture one frame at a time. When doing this another white dot (pixel) appeared on the screen, but in a different place on the screen than what happened with the TiVo.

Unfortunately it's not really feasible to test it with another TiVo because these units go for about $800 and so I only have one. I'm pretty sure it is the TV though.

Thanks
I am still leaning now toward a source, cable or possibly input issue as the white pixels are mainly seen when "paused" and this info is coming from outside the TV. Is this over HDMI? Component or both?

Sorry to grind on this. Ultimately Samsung will need to answer this, but I find it a challenge.

Thanks
I am still leaning now toward a source, cable or possibly input issue as the white pixels are mainly seen when "paused" and this info is coming from outside the TV. Is this over HDMI? Component or both?

Sorry to grind on this. Ultimately Samsung will need to answer this, but I find it a challenge.
No need to apologize, I'm delighted that you're willing to help. It is connected via HDMI. Interestingly, I do have a second HD TiVo because DirecTV sent me a replacement due to a completely unrelated problem with the other TiVo. I could give that a try, although it's a real pain because I have to de-activate my current TiVo with DirecTV and then activate this one and then do it all again in reverse, however, you've convinced me that it may be worth the effort.

Keep us posted.

I saw the same thing in a HD program within the last few days ... it was definitely in the source.
I don't think the problem is with the source, unless it is something that happens with all HD TiVos. I just connected a second HD TiVo to the same HDMI input (I realized I didn't have to activate the receiver with DirectTV to test this so it was easy to do) and the same white dot appeared at the exact same location. This would lead me to conclude it is a TV and not source issue. I would agree that it is more likely a source issue if the dot changed its location, but that was not the case.

Interestingly, I navigated through a number of menus on the HD TiVo and some of the menus have different colors. The white dot seemed to appear on only one set of the menu colors. However, this really may be meaningless since I didn't really test it on the other menu pages as much as I did on the page where I knew there could be a problem. I should note that even on the "problem" page, I needed to navigate back and forth about 10 times on the menu page in order for the dot to appear.

I don't think the problem is with the source, unless it is something that happens with all HD TiVos. I just connected a second HD TiVo to the same HDMI input (I realized I didn't have to activate the receiver with DirectTV to test this so it was easy to do) and the same white dot appeared at the exact same location. This would lead me to conclude it is a TV and not source issue. I would agree that it is more likely a source issue if the dot changed its location, but that was not the case.

Interestingly, I navigated through a number of menus on the HD TiVo and some of the menus have different colors. The white dot seemed to appear on only one set of the menu colors. However, this really may be meaningless since I didn't really test it on the other menu pages as much as I did on the page where I knew there could be a problem. I should note that even on the "problem" page, I needed to navigate back and forth about 10 times on the menu page in order for the dot to appear.

After seeing your pictures, it did not look like source related. If you haven't tried it yet, I would turn your TV off, unplug it for 10 minutes, and then turn it back on. There is a lot of firmware in these sets and sometimes an error can show up. Reset the TV and see if it disappears.

Also, make sure that you have good power conditioning if you are seeing problems crop up in a prior TV and then this new one.

After seeing your pictures, it did not look like source related. If you haven't tried it yet, I would turn your TV off, unplug it for 10 minutes, and then turn it back on. There is a lot of firmware in these sets and sometimes an error can show up. Reset the TV and see if it disappears.

Also, make sure that you have good power conditioning if you are seeing problems crop up in a prior TV and then this new one.

I'll definitely try a reset. As for the power conditioning, I'm using a Smart UPS and also a Brick so I think I'm okay with that. With my prior HLP TV, I had a problem with a green screen appearing every once in a while and a Samsung tech came out and just recommended a new TV. In hindsight, I think that problem may have actually been the TiVo. Once the TiVo was replaced, the green screen never appeared again. In fariness, the Samsung tech did say that there was something inherently wrong with the set that could not be repaired so I just went along with the swap just to make sure. Thanks for your help.

Back to my original guess. It seems that there might be a problem with the memory register for the DLP chip causing a drop in info for those mirror locations.

This is beginning to sound like a light engine swap and since we never guess right the first time followed by a processor board swap.

This is what happens when these things occur on the weekend you have to much time to pontificate.

I'm new here on AVS (and loving the info) What I was wondering is I'm interested in the Samsung 5078, Do y'all have any suggestions on the best place to purchase it? In addition are the warranty's really worth purchasing?

----------
Dave

By the way, I'm otherwise very pleased with this set. I'd like the few discrete codes that I'm missing, but I'm sure that will come. I also have a few other observations:

1. I began calibrating the set with DVE in both "Movie" and "Standard" mode. Believe it or not, but the brightness setting was perfect out of the box in both modes. This was far different with my HL-P5674, with that I had to make a number of adjustments. BTW - which setting do most people prefer, Dynamic, Standard or Movie?

2. I tried to calibrate the set using the HDNet Test Pattern, however, no matter what I did I couldn't get the number "10" to appear. You need that number in order to set brightness. I expect that this has something to do with the new 1080p chip.

3. I have a Denon 1910 DVD player connected via HDMI and a second DVD Player/Recorder (LiteOn) connected via component. I am relatively certain that this is a source issue, but with the Denon, when I am watching very dark scenes, the picture appears to distort itself (that really isn't a great description, but I don't know the best way to describe what is happening), however, this does not happen with the DVD player that is connected via component. It's more than likely due to the Denon, which is not very good. I was going to buy the new Samsung DVD player (anyone have any opinions), but decided to wait until the end of the year and see what happens with the HD DVD players.

Has anyone played with the Gamma setting in the SM? If yes, is it worth it?

Finally, from a cosmetic standpoint, I have my set built into the wall with some clam molding around the entire set. Then, I added some matching molding that covers the space between the bottom of the set and the speaker grill. It looks really cool and gives the impression that the speaker is separate from the set. I was able to do this b/c my laundry room is on the other side of the wall and there was no problem having the back of the TV set in that room. If anyone has a similar setup, I recommend you try it out. Attached is a picture.

Finally, from a cosmetic standpoint, I have my set built into the wall with some clam molding around the entire set. Then, I added some matching molding that covers the space between the bottom of the set and the speaker grill. It looks really cool and gives the impression that the speaker is separate from the set. I was able to do this b/c my laundry room is on the other side of the wall and there was no problem having the back of the TV set in that room. If anyone has a similar setup, I recommend you try it out. Attached is a picture.
Very nice clean look but did you allow for a source of fresh air to keep the TV cool in the cabinet?

See my experiences in the lip synch thread:
Go to my comments (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5960239#post5960239)

So to summarize we don't see enough audio lag to even notice in any of our inputs to date. The only time we could notice it is when we have two different feeds of the same material that go through two different paths. Then we receive an echo delay. Since I never plan on doing this. I don't have a problem.

Now I have to move on to the more compelling issues for me. Digital artifacts. In both the PS2 and the DVD source, we see a lot of noise and digital artifacts that I never noticed before on my 500 line, 40 inch CRT RPTV, a Tosh TW40F80. This is going to take some effort to figure out how much is the source vs the settings and TV's issues and all the appropriate settings to minimize/eliminate them.

Side note: For me to hook up my ATI video card I need a 30ft VGA cable (found some on the internet at a descent price). I also need a wireless keyboard/mouse. Does anyone know of a wireless keyboard/mouse that will go through one wall and 30 ft of distance.

I need about a 23ft - 25ft VGA cable, and my computers in the same room! I'm just going through the wall is all.... I'm looking at a cable from www.avcables.com that was recommended to me via a AVS Member.

as for the keyboard, I don't think any of them well, their max range is like 6-12 ft depending on the model. However what you can do is get a USB extension cable (they run from 5-40 ft I think) and run that through the wall with your other wires and just leave the receiver in your HT room.

- D

I see they came out with the new Logitech Harmony Remote 880 gor 250.Looks pretty impressive.
http://newsletter2.logitech.com/Logitech/general/logi-381/default.aspx?message_id=55919&MLM_MID=55919&MLM_UNIQUEID=e9b173ddbb&diid=1

edit:site has a demo on it

I need about a 23ft - 25ft VGA cable, and my computers in the same room! I'm just going through the wall is all.... I'm looking at a cable from www.avcables.com that was recommended to me via a AVS Member.

as for the keyboard, I don't think any of them well, their max range is like 6-12 ft depending on the model. However what you can do is get a USB extension cable (they run from 5-40 ft I think) and run that through the wall with your other wires and just leave the receiver in your HT room.

- D

BlueTooth keyboard/mouse would give that kind of range.

For those of you who don't see a lip synch problem try the echo test. If not, using the echo test, please let us know.

Good comments. I'm waiting on my 6168 (next week) and I have to say that if I don't see a lip synch problem, I'm sure not going to do an echo test to tell me I've got one. I'd rather be ignorant and happy! ;) Bill

Off the topic: Here is a little animated humor to keep spirits alive.Its a war between desktop icons.Hope you enjoy.
http://www.ykwong.com/funny/storyicon.swf

For anyone who cares, there is a 6168 on display at the Frys in Austin, TX.

Of course I show up to check it out, and a thunderstorm hits. Thirty seconds after I show up the power blinks out and the satellite feed drops out.

15 minutes it came back on and I got to play with it for a while. They had it set up next to last years Captain Kirk model and a Mits DLP, and they were displaying the same feed. The 1080p was much more bright, and detailed than both of its neighbors. I compared the two Sammys at corresponding setups to make sure they were on the same level and at all settings (movie, standard, warm, cool, etc...) were all much better on the 1080p including contrast, detail, and the amount of motion artifacts. I know this is far from a full review, but I just thought you guys might like to know theres a set to check out in Austin, and that it looks better at all settings than some other competing sets.

The HLP sets have a delay value in the SM, but I don't have any idea how much delay is associated with the three(?) possible settings.

Under the "Option" menu the value of "Sound Delay" is set to "Delay 3". I think that's maximum delay, but I'm not sure.

It was stated in one of the earlier video delay discussions on the HLN or HLP that the three settings correspond to 30, 60 and 90ms of delay. I do not recall where this information came from or whether it was somehow measured by an AVS member.

Very nice clean look but did you allow for a source of fresh air to keep the TV cool in the cabinet?
The beauty is there is no cabinet! The entire back of the TV is exposed in the room that is behind the room where I watch the TV. I cut a hole in the wall, framed it and then put the molding around it to finish it off. The TV is really in the other room sitting on a stand I made (it doesn't matter what the stand looks like since noone can see it). It's in my basement and the other room where the TV really is, is an unfinished part of the basement.

My experience so far:

I have the video delay too when sending audio to my reciever. My setup:

Motorola 6412 dual tuner STB -> HDMI (tributaries 3ft cable) and Component (monster cable) for comparison -> 6168 HDMI 1 and Component 1 inputs

Audio is STB -> optical from SPDIF -> into Yamaha HTR-5590 6.1 receiver

I haven't gotten my new Panny s97 DVD player from J&R yet (still backorder for over a month now)

When using component and HDMI and just using the TV's sound, the sound seems to be in line with the lips on the TV.

When using the sound from the speakers connected to my receiver and muting tv sound, the sound does seem to come before the lips move, which would mean I too have faster sound processing through the receiver and slower video from all the things the tv does for the picture to look so good.

When I put both tv sound and receiver sound on, I have the echo.

I went through my receiver's manual and only found a delay fetaure for the center channel or rear center channel, which doesnt help since I need all sound delayed. Can anyone confirm that my reciever can only delay those speakers? I guess I need to get the felston unit too.

Picture looks great. I still have the unusual issue where componet looks better than HDMI, using the same settings for both inputs. Hopefully someone here can connect both HDMI and component with the moto 6412 and test it too so I don't go crazy. Maybe its because I need to set the settings (brightness, color, sharpness, etc) to be different for each input and compare? But I really would have expected HDMI, not being converted to analog like component is, would look better on the same settings for the HD material.

Here's the thread I started in the HD hardware section hoping the experts there would know why, but haven't had luck yet.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=564111

...
Picture looks great. I still have the unusual issue where componet looks better than HDMI, using the same settings for both inputs. Hopefully someone here can connect both HDMI and component with the moto 6412 and test it too so I don't go crazy. Maybe its because I need to set the settings (brightness, color, sharpness, etc) to be different for each input and compare? But I really would have expected HDMI, not being converted to analog like component is, would look better on the same settings for the HD material.
I have found that the MOVIE setting is a lot better out of the box for DVD's and Games than STANDARD or DYNAMIC. I will tweak with DVE tonight when it gets dark.

For anyone who cares, there is a 6168 on display at the Frys in Austin, TX.

Of course I show up to check it out, and a thunderstorm hits. Thirty seconds after I show up the power blinks out and the satellite feed drops out.

15 minutes it came back on and I got to play with it for a while. They had it set up next to last years Captain Kirk model and a Mits DLP, and they were displaying the same feed. The 1080p was much more bright, and detailed than both of its neighbors. I compared the two Sammys at corresponding setups to make sure they were on the same level and at all settings (movie, standard, warm, cool, etc...) were all much better on the 1080p including contrast, detail, and the amount of motion artifacts. I know this is far from a full review, but I just thought you guys might like to know theres a set to check out in Austin, and that it looks better at all settings than some other competing sets.

Awesome, went last week and they said it wouldn't be there until around the 10th... Have to go check it out.

BTW, I had another thought... if there is video lag, wouldn't the best place to view it be at a store surrounded by other tvs? No one that has seen this series in stores has ever mentioned that the video looked behind the other tvs! Therefore I can only assume that the majority of the delay reports are preceived by those looking for it (no offense, I will probably do the same when mine arrives) and also due to sources... satelites I have heard have this problem more often then cable sources.

Just trying to continue thinking in that I won't have a problem with my games until I can try it myself.

I see they came out with the new Logitech Harmony Remote 880 gor 250.Looks pretty impressive.
http://newsletter2.logitech.com/Logitech/general/logi-381/default.aspx?message_id=55919&MLM_MID=55919&MLM_UNIQUEID=e9b173ddbb&diid=1

edit:site has a demo on it

Yup, I just received mine today from a seller off Ebay. I paid $194 for it.

Nice little remote, hope to have my 5688 TV soon to test it out on.

Yup, I just received mine today from a seller off Ebay. I paid $194 for it.

Nice little remote, hope to have my 5688 TV soon to test it out on.

I went ahead and paid $249 at BB. I have been tempted to return it since it cost so much, but the more I get used to it the better it seems. A real neat little gadget.

I also need a wireless keyboard/mouse. Does anyone know of a wireless keyboard/mouse that will go through one wall and 30 ft of distance.

Check out http://www.gyration.com/

I have found that the MOVIE setting is a lot better out of the box for DVD's and Games than STANDARD or DYNAMIC. I will tweak with DVE tonight when it gets dark.


post the settings you come up with when you can...thanks

I have been debating between the 61" and 67" and sit about 12' from where the set will be. Since there is not a 67" available yet to look at, would someone who has a 61" view from about 10' and tell me if it is ok or too overpowering. Thanks.

... would someone who has a 61" view from about 10' and tell me if it is ok or too overpowering. Thanks.
That's going to be personal preference. You need to see at least a 61" set (of any kind) or bigger so you can find out if it is too overpowering for you.

Good luck.

I have been debating between the 61" and 67" and sit about 12' from where the set will be. Since there is not a 67" available yet to look at, would someone who has a 61" view from about 10' and tell me if it is ok or too overpowering. Thanks.

I would recommend that you wait until the 67" sets are available and then go down and carefully evaluate this situation yourself. Whether or not the TV will be overwhelming is a personal preference call. But, even if it wasn't, there are other things that you will want to look at very carefully. Number one on my list would be how visible is video noise in the picture. I've been testing the 50", 56", and 61" sets and I don't have an answer to your question the on the 67" and 71" sets because I have not seen them yet. But, I am convinced that the issue will be balancing the impact of the larger screen against viewing distance, image sharpness, and ability to see video noise.

I hope to get out and look next week, but with the quality of the picture in most stores it might be hard to tell.

UCSB How far do you intend to sit from your TV? And which size did you decide on?

UCSB How far do you intend to sit from your TV?

I need to tell you that my personal preferences lean toward the smaller, sharper end of the scale. Plus, I have an existing custom cabinet that cost about $7,000. I feel that the 56" set that I have on order is about as big as I want to go on that cabinet. But, my viewing distances in the room range from 9.5' (my favorite, 100% of my viewing) up to 12'. I can reconfigure the room for any desired viewing distance on the fly.

I have been thinking of moving. If and when I finally move, I would open up the issue of the larger TV's again because I could redesign and rethink my HT space at that time. I like the larger screen sizes, but I personally would need to make sure that I was not so close to the screen that I was seeing the routine defects that exist in a DLP image (usually sent to the set from your DVD player or STB).

61" or 67" will provide a great experience for you ... it's just a good idea to go down and look before you buy.

Unfortunately Gazelle is still around. He's over in other threads (Sony) still slamming Samsungs.
Nice. :D

I see he's telling the folks over there that the A20 has the Iris and not the A10. I don't really have any idea, but the Sony watchers think it's the other way around. :rolleyes:

To all you lucky people that already have a 68 or 78...how is the TV Guide? Does it work good? I don't recall seeing any mention of this (most of this thread is about lip synch ;-)


For some reason I have not been able to get the tv guide to work on my 6168. I am not concerned since I use the tv guide in the 8300hd stb.

I went ahead and paid $249 at BB. I have been tempted to return it since it cost so much, but the more I get used to it the better it seems. A real neat little gadget.

yea I could have gotten it @ BB. The seller told me that BB bought a bunch of them from the 1st batch to sell, so many other sellers had to wait until last week to get more batches to sell.

The good with getting it @ BB was that you were the 1st to get it eearly, the bad was paying the premium price ($249) for it. That's why i waited & got it off Ebay for cheaper ($194) brand new, besides it's not like I really had a choice since my 5688 hasn't been released yet, so it was best to wait for me.

How long have you had yours?

It looks really kool, love the LCD screen & interactive macros, makes the remote come alive.

It seems the Qualia 06 powers on to the correct input when it receives a discrete code for an input. Can someone test to see if that is the case with the Samsung? Pretty sweet if it does.

I started a separate thread on the HL-Rxxx8 discrete codes. Most of the HLP codes work (even power on, at least for me). However, I can not get any code to work for HDMI 2 or for Antenna.

Okay! After I posted about lip sync delays, I was experimenting different channels looking for audio lag. One thing I should say is that it is difficult to look for them when the picture is so spectacular!
Anyway, I noticed considerable lag when watching Jay leno show on thursday night. Now, when I watch different programs on the same channel, I don't see much lag (almost none until you try hard to look for it).
Even discoveryHD did not have much lag. When I say much lag, you will noty notice them when you get immersed in the picture quality!
After 2 days of experimenting, this is my summary:
1. If the lip sync issues are considerable, it depends on one or more of these factors:
- STB. My comcast STB is set to 1080i, which means that it has to convert 720p to 1080i.
- Source. Different programs on same channels have different lags (or not).
2. I am not thinking of buying any audio delay unit. My receiver does not have any audio
delay capabilities.

Anyone who has not seen the TV: Wait until you see the TV. I think most of you will not be bothered by the audio lag, if any. Now, I am going to get back to enjoying my new TV!

The beauty is there is no cabinet! The entire back of the TV is exposed in the room that is behind the room where I watch the TV. I cut a hole in the wall, framed it and then put the molding around it to finish it off. The TV is really in the other room sitting on a stand I made (it doesn't matter what the stand looks like since noone can see it). It's in my basement and the other room where the TV really is, is an unfinished part of the basement.Sly setup there, my friend. :) Very nice. Where did you place your components (sorry if I missed that in an earlier post)?

Notes from fourth evening of testing:

I finally noticed a few lip sync events while watching Apollo 13 on my DVD-HD950 today. It's a copy that's a few years old (not the anniversary edition) ... haven't watched other movies all the way through yet, and I don't know if this particular DVD is necessarily a "clean" source to test from. More testing to come, of course. :D

Audio and video were synchronized beautifully for the first third of the movie or so ... then I began noticing the video lagging behind. Stopping and/or pausing didn't correct the effect, but jumping chapters definitely fixed the problem, at least for this DVD. If I didn't jump chapters, the lag "seemed" to grow with time. Again: I don't know if it's the source yet (I need to watch a lot more films). But I suppose it's possible I didn't notice any sync problems when playing the 950 earlier because I was skimming films and not watching any of them all the way through.

Earlier in the day I didn't notice any problems with the first third of Seabiscuit -- although I didn't watch any further.

By the way, I'm not obsessed about the lip sync discussion ... I'm only reporting to help others know what I'm seeing. I'm happy with the compromises I'm making for the time being until I decide to upgrade my AVR or pick up a Felston.

I know I can't quite make satisfactorily objective observations about the PQ of this set yet, as it's my first large screen, HDTV experience. Take my comments for what you think they're worth. The more time we spend with the 5078, the more impressed we become. At 9' on something like a 20 degree diagonal, my wife can sit up straight or lie down on the couch with no appreciable detriment to the brightness and contrast of the picture. I've never seen this before in a Samsung DLP ... I've always seen a quick dropoff with vertical changes in viewing position. I'm assuming the higher contrast is really helping the set here. It's uniformly bright corner to corner, and when fed a decent source the colors can be just jaw-droppingly natural and rich for a microdisplay RPTV.

Tomorrow it's time for another movie or two and some testing with the xbox. I'll also post some pics of the set in my matte black Hooker entertainment cabinet ... it fits beautifully.

To all you lucky people that already have a 68 or 78...how is the TV Guide? Does it work good? I don't recall seeing any mention of this (most of this thread is about lip synch ;-)

I have expanded basic cable from Comcast on one RF input and OTA antenna on the other one. I enabled TV Guide on the first night and by the next morning, it listed all channels except for the QAM channels on cable. OTA digital channels are listed. I have not tried scheduling anything through the guide.

i just did a test on my 10 year old CRT getting fed rca video from a DISH 942 DVR receiver and from the 942: optical to my NAD 753 receiver.
also ran video through my AVR to see if it changed anything , but it didn't.


SD no lip sync,

HD (downconverterted dish and OTA through the DVR) showed some lip sync on ABC and FOX and PBS i would say it was close to 1/10 second noticable after awhile.
other HD channels seemed fine.

************************************************************ ********
***********so i guess it could be the source, not the tv.*************** ************************************************************ ****

i think i might have to pull the trigger on a 6168, if i watch mostly SD and DVD and sync is only an issue with HD i can wacth those OTA with optical out from tv.
otherwise i can see how the felston works.

has anyone tried running coax from a STB whether cable or direct tv or dish --> tv . and then run optical out from tv to AV receiver and see if this solves sync issues? is this possible?

anyone figure out the 411 on the audio delay ]settings in the service menu???

seems odd that samsung would default the setting to max (someone said 3) its like they knew there was a problem.....

seems odd that samsung would default the setting to max (someone said 3) its like they knew there was a problem.....

It's not that there is a problem, it's that some people don't understand how digital TVs work.

-phil

I have solved my lip synce problem by running audio through my Denon AVR-3505 and adjusting the delay by 110m on all inputs. My sources are DirecTV HD Tivo, Sammy HD-950.

Does anyone now the keywords to the thread to remove the speaker base on the floating DLP models like the HLRxx68's?

oops. Found the base removal thread here.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=544846&highlight=remove+base

Is the Lip Sync issue only when it's connected to an external speaker system, (as opposed to just using the tv speakers)? Also has everyone here purchased their TV's from TVAuthority, if so what has been your experience with them? Good, Bad? If not TVAuthority where?

Calbert how is the video quality on the HD950 with your tv? Have you tried the HD JPG (not a feature on the HD850)?

I have the HD850 and I've noticed my older JVC Prog player has a slightly better more detailed picture than the HD850 (1080i). The HD850 is also not passing BTB unless I up the brightness to 5 which in turn crushes the whites. The HD850 only allows me to change the brightness. I noticed in the HD950 manual online it also allows contrast to be changed via the dvd player. I was wondering if the HD950 passed BTB out of the box or if it could be adjusted via it's own setup to fix BTB and not crush the whites?

Does anyone know the code to get into the service menu?

I recieved my Felston DD540 sound delay unit yesterday. Very small and easy to connect.
Bottom line, if you have lip sync issues and want a solution, this is the way to go. I've eliminated sync issues on all inputs: HDMI, Component and Svideo.
Svideo (SD Tivo): 100ms delay
Component (HD Cable): 100 to 125ms delay
HDMI (DVD Sammy 950): 100ms delay
HDMI (HDTivo): 175 to 250+ms delay

The Felston will delay up to 680ms, so you have plenty of room to dial it in. Plus, the remote makes fine tuning simple.

A no brainer IMO.

On a side note, the TV/Cable input keeps showing up when I toggle through the list of "sources". The manual states only connected inputs should show up. I don't have anything in this input, but yet, it comes up with a "snowy" picture stating that it can't find a signal. Any way to disable this input?

I recieved my Felston DD540 sound delay unit yesterday.


Maybe we can send the bill to Samsung,
should they have added a delay adjustment in the set?

Does anyone know the code to get into the service menu?
New information for HLR owners.

Originally posted by millerwill
BTW, it is not longer necessary to enter the Service menu to find out what firmware version you have. You can go to Function Help (pg 84 of the manual), set it to on and then press Info. Or you can get it and other diagnostic info as follows:

Mute-1-8-4-Exit will display screen 1 of Diagnostic Status
Mute-1-8-5-Exit will display screen 2 of Diagnostic Status
Mute-1-8-6-Exit will display screen 3 of Diagnostic Status

I got this directly from Samsung tech support, and it works.


Originally posted by millerwill
htwaits: Is it possible for you to give a step-by-step 'idiot proof' protocol for going into the SM and making this gamma change? I've never been into the SM and have always been nervous about the idea. But you sound like it's worth it. (Have a 6163.)
Can one idiot protect other idiots? ;)

Here are the "enter-SM" instructions for the HLN sets. They are the same for a HLP set but the contents of the SM and navigation keys are different. I haven't checked all the navigation instructions myself.

Find Samsung Firmware Version:

The firmware version installed on any set is recorded on the first page of the SM. There is a long ID number at the bottom of the page. The last three digits (HLN) or last four digits (HLP) are the firmware version of your set.

Remember that in any dealing with Samsung you are not supposed to know your firmware version.

Record your User Settings for "Picture" before you enter the SM. The HLP sets will revert to factory defaults for the UM when you exit the SM.

Instructions for accessing the Samsung Service Menu:

Anyone using these suggestions should know that the only change I have ever made to the SM is changing GAMMA from the default value to zero. I have never "messed around" in the SM. Remember that there is no reset function. If you see something that looks like one don't use it.

I can recommend, without any reservations, recording all original SM settings before making additional changes.

****** Thanks to LCH. 09/02/2003 ******

Turn Melody off in the user menu (allows entering the Service Menu from power On state without using a lamp cycle).

With the set ON, press Power-Mute-1-8-2-Power in quick succession.
(If the set is already off, just do Mute-1-8-2-Power )

The service menu should appear for the input you were viewing before keying the above sequence. Be sure to give the set enough time to complete the process(30-60 seconds).

While in the service menu, you can change inputs with the TV/Video button to view the SM for other modes.

Use the CH up, CH down & select keys to navigate the Service Menu. Press MENU to return to the main Service Menu after viewing individual functions.

Later, you will use the VOL(+) & VOL(-) keys to change the SM values.

" ... when you access the SM on the HLPxx63 (probably all HLP models), the directional arrows around the "Enter" button control navigation, not the volume and channel buttons ..." MacGyver1970.

To Exit the SM, power off. Leave it off for several(30) seconds. (until all cooling activity is complete)

Example steps to change GAMMA on a HLP5063 with firmware version 1011 and a build date of May 2004:

The SM main menu looks like this.

1. DDP1011 (The GAMMA setting is here.)
2. GM1601
3. DNIe
4. FLI2310
5. CXA2171
6. Vsp9437
7. Upd 64083
8. CCA
9. SP Actuator
10. OPTION (The tally of hours of lamp operation is in this menu.)

Ver: T_ATLNUS_1011 (this is the firmware version)

First record user menu entries for "picture" and enter SM.

Steps from the main SM.

1. Select DDP1011 using the directional arrow keys -- up and down.
2. Enter DDP1011. I used the right arrow key but maybe the "enter" key will work too.
3. Select GAMMA using the up or down arrow key.
4. I entered GAMMA using the right arrow key, but the "enter" key may also work.
5. I used the right and left arrow keys to change the value of GAMMA.
6. I used the up arrow key to return to the DDP1011 menu. Again, the "enter" key or "menu" key might do the same thing.
7. I returned to the main SM with the "menu" key.
8. Power off and wait for a full shut down to save entries that you have changed in the SM.

9. Power on after about 30 seconds and enter your user menu picture settings.

This change to GAMMA makes "some" owners happy. I feel that after setting GAMMA to zero and setting brightness with the DVE DVD that the details in dark scenes were improved. To really get the most out of our set I am getting an ISF calibration done by SethS.

As of 12/14/2004:
Mode = Cinema
contrast = 90
brightness = 45
sharpness = 0
color = 48
Digital NR = OFF
DNIe = OFF

Enjoy.

Send the bill to Samsung, they should have not released the set with these issues,
they should have added a delay adjustment in the set?
You may not have the whole "issues" picture in mind.

Audio/video Sync Problems:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4087409#post4087409

I have solved my lip synce problem by running audio through my Denon AVR-3505 and adjusting the delay by 110m on all inputs. My sources are DirecTV HD Tivo, Sammy HD-950.

Does anyone now the keywords to the thread to remove the speaker base on the floating DLP models like the HLRxx68's?

Look in FAQ's in POST #1 of the main 2005 Samsung thread.

Look in FAQ's in POST #1 of the main 2005 Samsung thread.

Thanks UCSB and thanks for all your hard work keeping this info current. Now that I am an owner, I stopped looking at the other thread. Can you post FAQ in this thread too?

Anybody match the OPPO with one of the New Samsung 1080p's yet? I have the OPPO, but still waiting for the 6768...have know way to test...looks good on HLN567 and Mits 55" crt.

yea I could have gotten it @ BB. The seller told me that BB bought a bunch of them from the 1st batch to sell, so many other sellers had to wait until last week to get more batches to sell.

The good with getting it @ BB was that you were the 1st to get it eearly, the bad was paying the premium price ($249) for it. That's why i waited & got it off Ebay for cheaper ($194) brand new, besides it's not like I really had a choice since my 5688 hasn't been released yet, so it was best to wait for me.

How long have you had yours?

It looks really kool, love the LCD screen & interactive macros, makes the remote come alive.


I have had it for just a few days. It works well with the 6168 and my 8300 stb.

Anybody match the OPPO with one of the New Samsung 1080p's yet? I have the OPPO, but still waiting for the 6768...have know way to test...looks good on HLN567 and Mits 55" crt.


The new Oppo uses the same Faroudja chip as the Denon 3910 so I suspect
you will observe MB on the same dvd scenes and I did...

After looking at the base of my 5668, I don't see how it can be removed. There is no seam in the plastic. I don't think it is assembled like the units in the base removal thread. Am I missing something?

After looking at the base of my 5668, I don't see how it can be removed. There is no seam in the plastic. I don't think it is assembled like the units in the base removal thread. Am I missing something?

5668 does not have a removable base!

The new Oppo uses the same Fajourdja chip as the Denon 3910 so I suspect you will observe MB on the same dvd scenes and I did...

After seeing macroblocking on both the Denon 3910 and Panasonic S97S, both of which use the Fajourdja chip, I also am concerned that the OPPO my have a macroblocking problem. You may want to return you OPPO and wait for a report about compatibility ... my advice, don't get outside of your return window on the player.

Hi all, I have been a longtime lurker forever it seems....even back when we were waiting for the HLP's. I have gained an unbelievable amount of knowledge from all the posters so thanks for that.

I am getting ready to purchase soon and had a question for the HTPC folks that already have the 6168W. Has anyone got 1080p 1920 X 1080 VGA working without any underscan/overscan and still retain 1:1 pixel mapping. This is a big issue for me and if it would not be able to be worked out I would probably drop down to the 6167 at 720p with no overscan/underscan. I saw some of the screenshots someone posted and to me that is not acceptable. I will be using Windows Media Center 2005 and and Nvidia 7800GTX.

Also just for the HTPC needs if I wasn't happy and dropped the resolution on the HTPC down to 1280 X 720 and use HDMI or VGA to the TV, the 6168 would scale that to 1080, yes this isn't the best soloution I know but if it would get around the overscan/underscan issues then it may be an option for me, and I would still have High Quality PQ for my other sources. Has anyone tried this?

No offense taken ... I understand everyone's interest in this issue is motivated by good intentions; ie., they want their purchases to work out. My HLR5668W will probably be arriving next week and I will see if I can get closer to an answer on this issue. I am in no way questioning peoples comments about this issue up to this point ... but, I am just having trouble keeping the hard data people are reporting in focus and context with so many comments swirling around the topic.

OK, so not to keep stirring up this "Lip Sync" issue again, but it obviously concerns me enough not to buy a Samsung and wait for other models to be released by other manufacturers (and I so wanted to pre-order one this weeekend!). The only other 1080P DLP I'm aware of that out there is the Sony. Does anyone know if that TV has experienced this problem. Now I realize that the Sony is much more expensive, but I'm just curious to know if it has this problem as well.

The only other 1080P DLP I'm aware of that out there is the Sony. Does anyone know if that TV has experienced this problem. Now I realize that the Sony is much more expensive, but I'm just curious to know if it has this problem as well.

Search the Q006 thread for Sync issues but at $10K more versus buying a $240 Felston makes the comparison kind of beyond reason. Sony doesn't make a DLP - two different technologies being compared-they make LCD and LCOS/SXRD. A Q006 at $13K and no discount plus a $1500 stand and delivery your looking at $15K for that Sony and it is their high end model. This Samsung compares very well and some think it surpasses it at around one third the price or less depending on size.

Would you rather pay an extra $10,000 to resolve the Sync or $240.00? Seems an easy choice unless one has the money for a Qualia - Most consumers don't. Perhaps the competitors may have this resolved? Toshiba, Mits, Panasonic - but they have no 1080P's being delivered and no Owners Thread exists for us to compare.

Considering Sony approached Samsung to join in one of the largest Electronics partnerships on the Planet tells you something - they have a mutual agreement to share in over 24,000 patents with both benefitting as a result - Sony was losing money hand over fist and they approached Samsung as they are quite profitable (the opposite) - the future will see improvements that benefit both but if Samsung was inferior Sony would not have developed the partnership they have now with Samsung. Hopefully Sammy is reviewing feedback here but then again the Sync is not with their TV it is with the split signal being sent to a foreign AVR device from what I've seen. :D

Calbert how is the video quality on the HD950 with your tv? Have you tried the HD JPG (not a feature on the HD850)?

I have the HD850 and I've noticed my older JVC Prog player has a slightly better more detailed picture than the HD850 (1080i). The HD850 is also not passing BTB unless I up the brightness to 5 which in turn crushes the whites. The HD850 only allows me to change the brightness. I noticed in the HD950 manual online it also allows contrast to be changed via the dvd player. I was wondering if the HD950 passed BTB out of the box or if it could be adjusted via it's own setup to fix BTB and not crush the whites?Sorry moss, haven't played with HD JPG yet.

Also, I can't answer your specific questions on passing BTB just yet. I still need to pick up a copy of DVE. If my local Ovation doesn't have it today, I'll order from Amazon tonight. I'm looking forward to optimizing the picture to the best of my ability, and will report back as soon as I do so. Kicking myself for forgetting to order it while waiting for my tv ;) .

Remember that I'm new to big-screen HDTVs, so I don't have the experience that others here have when it comes to systematic, detailed comparisons. On the other hand, I'm very happy with the 950 paired with my 5078. So far, when watching movies on the 950 at default settings ...

> via HDMI @1080i
> sharpness: 3 out of 5
> contrast: 3 out of 5
> brightness: 3 out of 5

and leaving the 5078 at its default settings in Movie mode ...

> Contrast: 70
> Brightness: 45
> Sharpness: 25
> Color: 45
> Color Mode: Warm 2 (not adjustable in Movie mode)

the two seem to play very nicely together. The picture seems quite sharp, yet without noticeable artifacts. Only a few tough scenes here and there had noticeable banding or mosquito noise, and haven't seen any macroblocking yet.

Interestingly, as soon as I switch the 5078 out of Movie mode, it tends to make digital artifacts more apparent (in any source). I can go into Custom mode and choose the same above settings as Movie, but the resulting picture will be a bit brighter, stronger in contrast and grainier. In Custom mode I need to move Sharpness down from 25 to zero to see the same level of smoothness I see in Movie at 25.

For example, Movie mode did a nice job of minimizing the banding and banded halos around the fish. Switch to Custom with the same settings, and the banding and halos instantly jumped out. As htwaits pointed out, Finding Nemo is an inherently difficult DVD to test against ... but it was an interesting disc to use for comparing the effects of working in both modes because the effects were so obvious. In short, I was able to play with contrast and brightness in Movie with better results than in Custom -- although to a degree you could probably chalk up those results to inexperience on my part. ;)

I'll let you know more specifically and reliably how things look with the 950 once I get DVE. But overall, out of the box, I'm really quite happy with both products.

I recieved my Felston DD540 sound delay unit yesterday. Very small and easy to connect.
Bottom line, if you have lip sync issues and want a solution, this is the way to go. I've eliminated sync issues on all inputs: HDMI, Component and Svideo.
Svideo (SD Tivo): 100ms delay
Component (HD Cable): 100 to 125ms delay
HDMI (DVD Sammy 950): 100ms delay
HDMI (HDTivo): 175 to 250+ms delay
It's good to finally hear from someone who has a DD540, but I'm confused by your posting. The DD540 appears to have only 2 inputs. Would you please explain how you have it connected to your components?

Would like to have some good info to post here...I guess officially I am an owner of a HL-R5078W...but....got the unit home yesterday...got it plugged in and connected and was dismayed to see that the fan is inop......no joy for me.....

I have tested my PS2 with SSX, TW Golf 03, and Medal of Honor Frontline. I only have an RCA hooked up the picture is really good. No lag noted in game mode. I cannot seem to get component working. I have changed the menu in the PS2. Anything I am missing before I delclare the cable a problem?

Would like to have some good info to post here...I guess officially I am an owner of a HL-R5078W...but....got the unit home yesterday...got it plugged in and connected and was dismayed to see that the fan is inop......no joy for me.....
Try reseating the fan plugs. I think someone else had the same problem.

I have tested my PS2 with SSX, TW Golf 03, and Medal of Honor Frontline. I only have an RCA hooked up the picture is really good. No lag noted in game mode. I cannot seem to get component working. I have changed the menu in the PS2. Anything I am missing before I delclare the cable a problem?
Its not set on Component - RGB in the PS2 is it?

Also did you make sure to reset the TV input mode to component with the PS2 on?

...
Interestingly, as soon as I switch the 5078 out of Movie mode, it tends to make digital artifacts more apparent (in any source). I can go into Custom mode and choose the same above settings as Movie, but the resulting picture will be a bit brighter, stronger in contrast and grainier. In Custom mode I need to move Sharpness down from 25 to zero to see the same level of smoothness I see in Movie at 25.

For example, Movie mode did a nice job of minimizing the banding and banded halos around the fish. Switch to Custom with the same settings, and the banding and halos instantly jumped out. As htwaits pointed out, Finding Nemo is an inherently difficult DVD to test against ... but it was an interesting disc to use for comparing the effects of working in both modes because the effects were so obvious. In short, I was able to play with contrast and brightness in Movie with better results than in Custom -- although to a degree you could probably chalk up those results to inexperience on my part. ;)

I'll let you know more specifically and reliably how things look with the 950 once I get DVE. But overall, out of the box, I'm really quite happy with both products.
I have found the same to be true. For TV and PS2 MOVIE mode is best. I like the colors and brightness better too. When watch DVD's in STANDARD I was very disappointed in seeing all sorts of digital artifacts. MOVIE modes seems to get rid of most of them.

I tried to use DVE last night to see if I could improve over MOVIE mode but I had to give up when I could not even get the brightness set correctly. It seems that I could not see the two bars on the left of the grayscale pluge pattern to set the brightness. I tried different settings in the HD950 and also the brightness control but these bars never showed up. Not sure what I am doing wrong.

Its not set on Component - RGB in the PS2 is it?

Also did you make sure to reset the TV input mode to component with the PS2 on?

I will try this and be right back!

Its not set on Component - RGB in the PS2 is it?

Also did you make sure to reset the TV input mode to component with the PS2 on?

I just checked my settings. I have the PS2 in the config menu on component, not RGB. I have the component 2 on the TV set to default (i.e. Not named). No luck. When I switch back to RCA, it works. I have checked both component inputs on the TV and they work. (The HDMI card is broken however and scheduled for replacement tomorrow). I have a second cable I bought from BB and can try. Hate to open a second package and have a problem with the TV or PS2.

Any other thoughts?

I just checked my settings. I have the PS2 in the config menu on component, not RGB. I have the component 2 on the TV set to default (i.e. Not named). No luck. When I switch back to RCA, it works. I have checked both component inputs on the TV and they work. (The HDMI card is broken however and scheduled for replacement tomorrow). I have a second cable I bought from BB and can try. Hate to open a second package and have a problem with the TV or PS2.

Any other thoughts?

Do you have another TV that can accept component (to test PS2 and cable)?

I have found the same to be true. For TV and PS2 MOVIE mode is best. I like the colors and brightness better too. When watch DVD's in STANDARD I was very disappointed in seeing all sorts of digital artifacts. MOVIE modes seems to get rid of most of them.

I tried to use DVE last night to see if I could improve over MOVIE mode but I had to give up when I could not even get the brightness set correctly. It seems that I could not see the two bars on the left of the grayscale pluge pattern to set the brightness. I tried different settings in the HD950 and also the brightness control but these bars never showed up. Not sure what I am doing wrong.


Believe me I'm no expert, but I have been reading for over a month...I think some wrote that you have to use DVE in 4x3. Someone correct if I'm wrong.

Still waiting for my 5668

Do you have another TV that can accept component (to test PS2 and cable)?

Afraid not. I jumped 10 years in technology. May need to find someone else to check or just open the other cable and take a look.

Spear,

Have you tried using a DVI->HDMI cable yet? If so, have you come up with a good modeline?

I tried it, but cannot get a modeline which does not produce a vertical double (ghost) image. I have tried going for 540p as well as 1080i.

VGA looks really good, but I was curious if HDMI might look better. Especially when combined with Myth's BOB deinterlacer/rate doubler.

With VGA, progressive sources look perfect. When watching an interlaced source, I do occasionally see some horizontal bleeding of white areas. It is minor, but there. Not sure what it is about interlaced sources which cause this.

Thanks,

John

Calbert how is the video quality on the HD950 with your tv? Have you tried the HD JPG (not a feature on the HD850)?



I just got the HD950 and am using it with an HL-R5668W. I had a Denon 1910 and had some horrible MB problems when I connected it to the 5668. I am pleased to report that I don't experience any MB problems with the 950 (I have it connected via HDMI). There was one strange audio problem out of the box. It had PCM on, which basically disabled Dolby Digital. Once I figured out how to turn that off, it was great. So far I'm pleased with the picture and will continue to evaluate it.

One great additional benefit of the 950 is the Anynet program. I have the 950 hooked up to HDMI 2 and there is no discrete code for that input taht I can use with my Pronto TSU7000. With Anynet, there is no need for that discrete code. I just set up a macro that selects "Anynet", the "scroll down" two times and then "enter". This will power on the 950 and switch the input to HDMI 2. Then, when I'm done and switch back to any other input, it automatically powers the 950 off. Even if you don't have a remote that accepts discrete codes, the Anynet program is great IMO.

Interestingly, the other discrete code I could not get to work was "Antenna", however, I'm using Anynet for that also and it works as a great substitute. I do it the same wasy as I do for the 950, except I don't need to program in the "scroll down" macros.

I just got the HD950 and am using it with an HL-R5668W. I had a Denon 1910 and had some horrible MB problems when I connected it to the 5668. I am pleased to report that I don't experience any MB problems with the 950 (I have it connected via HDMI). There was one strange audio problem out of the box. It had PCM on, which basically disabled Dolby Digital. Once I figured out how to turn that off, it was great. So far I'm pleased with the picture and will continue to evaluate it.


Have you also verified (e.g., with the DVE pluge bars) that the HD950 passes BTB over HDMI? Tx.

At the risk of being burned at the stake for heresy, if you want to wait to check out other 1080p DLP sets, and the Sony Qualia 006 is more than you want to spend, you might want to wait a while to check out the new 1080p DLPs that will be coming from Mitsubishi and Toshiba. There are some threads about them within the first couple of pages of this forum.

I beg forgiveness for inferring that the Qualia was DLP when in fact it was not. I guess the point I was trying to make was the Sony is a 1080P set and so it the Samsung. Even though the Sony is about 3 times more than the Samsung, that
doesn't mean that the Samsung shouldn't be able to align the Video/Audio properly if Sony has managed to do so. I am very pro-Samsung and really wanted to order one of these new sets, but I just can't get past this problem. Again, if all of the sets from everyone seemed to have this issue (or I heard more of it, which aside from some threads I really haven't), I'd be more accepting of it, but to have to buy another device or adjust the receiver settings just to make the TV 'fixed', I just don't find that to be normal. You can certainly make the argument that it's not the TV's fault, but it is if it cannot upconvert the video signal fast enough to keep up with the sound, than to me that's the TV. It just seems strange to me that most everyone in this forum is so accepting of this problem.

I have my 6168 for a little over a week now and I have a problem. I have noticed that many things look darker than expected. I have not been able to spend a lot of time adjusting things until today and have realized that dark areas show as monolithic - no real texture. A black suit for expample will look solid black - no cloth texture etc. I turned the contrast way down and cannot see texture in blacks until contrast is down to 20 or so, but then the overall picture is very dull.

Is this a defect for which I should call Samsung for service? or,
is it just way out of calibration in which case will a calibrator help, or
is there something in the service menu I can adjust myself for now (& if so, how do I get there)?

I am planning to have the set calibrated after a few months but don't think I can live with it as is until then.

This occurs through either dvd or stb, component or HDMI in any of the picture modes.

I would really appreaciate any insight.

thanks

Anyone know what the heck "Film Mode" does? The manual states (p. 63): "You can automatically sense and process film signals from all sources and adjust the picture for optimum quality." A bit cryptic, don't you think? Other than showing you how to turn it on or off, the only other thing the manual tells you is that it's available only for 480i content.

Hi guys,

I jumped on the Sammy boat and picked up a bunch of new audio/video equipment. Here's what I got:

TV - Samsung HL-R6768W
DVD - Samsung DVD-HD950
DirecTV HD Receiver with TiVo
AVR - Yamaha RX-V4600

After reading the owner's thread, I'm concerned about HDMI not passing 5.1 signal. Since my receiver has HDMI switching, I was planning to do:

DTV ---(HDMI 1)---> RX-V4600
DVD ---(HDMI 2)---> RX-V4600

and then

RX-V4600 ---(HDMI OUT)---> 6768

Will this work or will the output be HDMI 2.0? Any suggestions? Thanks in advance!
----------------------------------------------------

Thanks,
Steve

Previously posted this problem without reply. Maybe the image will help other get interested. This image was being fed from the THX Set-up on the Toy Story DVD using SVideo Input.

Two Issues:
1. You will see approximately 2 inches of the image is lost at the bottom; and
2. Vertical Lines Are Jagged.

Any advise is appreciated.

calbert Anyone know what the heck "Film Mode" does?

Cinema Smooth Film Mode 3:2 Pull Down
Powered by Samsung’s Cinema Smooth technology, 3:2 Pull Down corrects for the artificial frames created when films are converted to DVDs. The result is a clearer image without the subtle motion artifacts caused by 24-to-30 frames per second video conversion. This applies to the new 1080P's :D

It's good to finally hear from someone who has a DD540, but I'm confused by your posting. The DD540 appears to have only 2 inputs. Would you please explain how you have it connected to your components?


Sorry about the confusion. I wasn't real clear. I picked up two of the DD540's giving me four available sources.

Cinema Smooth Film Mode 3:2 Pull DownLOL, thanks! :D If they'd just called it 3:2 Pull Down ...

Sorry about the confusion. I wasn't real clear. I picked up two of the DD540's giving me four available sources.
OK, that makes sense! Thanks!

Previously posted this problem without reply. Maybe the image will help other get interested. This image was being fed from the THX Set-up on the Toy Story DVD using SVideo Input.

Two Issues:
1. You will see approximately 2 inches of the image is lost at the bottom; and
2. Vertical Lines Are Jagged.

Any advise is appreciated.Weird. Have you tried using any other connections? (component or HDMI?). Not that I have any particular reason for suspecting an S-Video connection, other than that you'll get better video quality if you at least jump up to component. FWIW, even on a 27" CRT I've always seen a noticeable jump in PQ between S-Video and Component. Not a very helpful suggestion, I know ... just thought I'd throw that out there. What DVD player are you using?

courtjstr :confused:

?#1 - Why an S-Video Cable on an HDTV or DVD? - Get rid of the S-Video- Use Component or HDMI if connections are available - S-Video is not a quality connection for HD/DVD's.

?#2 - What are we supposed to be seeing?I see an Oval but no image? Perhaps this is why there may be no responses?

I wish I could see what your requesting but at my end I do not see anything in the image other than the THX logo's below and an oval in light blue. Good Luck! :D

After reading the owner's thread, I'm concerned about HDMI not passing 5.1 signal. Since my receiver has HDMI switching, I was planning to do:

DTV ---(HDMI 1)---> RX-V4600
DVD ---(HDMI 2)---> RX-V4600

and then

RX-V4600 ---(HDMI OUT)---> 6768

Will this work or will the output be HDMI 2.0? Any suggestions? Thanks in advance!Steve, the HDMI spec will send 5.1 if the devices that send and receive an audio signal can send and accept 5.1. Many devices have an implementation of HDMI that won't send or accept 5.1, such as this year's Samsung tvs. Assuming that you're outputting the audio from your receiver to external speakers (ie, not trying to route the audio through the tv), and ...

1) Your DVD player's HDMI implementation can send 5.1, and ...
2) Your receiver's HDMI implementation can accept 5.1 ...

... then I don't think you'd have a problem. The setup you just described means that your 6768 isn't doing anything with the audio signal, it's just receiving video via HDMI at the end of the chain. So then you just need to learn what your player and receiver can do. I have the 950, but can't confirm that it can send 5.1 over HDMI because I don't have any components that will accept 5.1 ... so I can't test it. You might want to check in the DVD (Standard Def) forum for the 950 thread and see what other owners are saying. Same with your receiver ... there's probably an appropriate thread elsewhere that might help if the manual doesn't confirm anything for you. Good luck!

Side note: For me to hook up my ATI video card I need a 30ft VGA cable (found some on the internet at a descent price). I also need a wireless keyboard/mouse. Does anyone know of a wireless keyboard/mouse that will go through one wall and 30 ft of distance.

I recently got a Logitech "Cordless Desktop MX for Bluetooth". In testing I was able to make it to the top of the stairs on the 2nd floor and still have it pick up my typing with the computer in the basement. Once I went into a room on the 2nd floor it lost contact. One wall and 30 feet should be OK, since I had about 25 feet and two floor/ceilings.

courtjstr :confused:

?#2 - What are we supposed to be seeing?I see an Oval but no image? Perhaps this is why there may be no responses?



I think he is referencing the fact that the line that would form the outer box is missing at the bottom. It's like his vertical size is too large and the line is overscan/clipped. I don't think the test pattern he is using is a very good one any way. What should be seen as a circle in the center is an oval. It is kind of 3:4 content stretch to 9:16.

Here's a quick shot of my 5078 in its new home. It seems quite happy here ;) and fits with about 3/4" clearance above, 1/4" clearance on the sides and tons of space behind for air to circulate (the cabinet's a good 4" from the wall).

ps. Please forgive the nasty wallpaper around the top of the room ... was like that before we moved in, really ... repainting in next spring, probably.

I beg forgiveness for inferring that the Qualia was DLP when in fact it was not. I guess the point I was trying to make was the Sony is a 1080P set and so it the Samsung. Even though the Sony is about 3 times more than the Samsung, that
doesn't mean that the Samsung shouldn't be able to align the Video/Audio properly if Sony has managed to do so. I am very pro-Samsung and really wanted to order one of these new sets, but I just can't get past this problem. Again, if all of the sets from everyone seemed to have this issue (or I heard more of it, which aside from some threads I really haven't), I'd be more accepting of it, but to have to buy another device or adjust the receiver settings just to make the TV 'fixed', I just don't find that to be normal. You can certainly make the argument that it's not the TV's fault, but it is if it cannot upconvert the video signal fast enough to keep up with the sound, than to me that's the TV. It just seems strange to me that most everyone in this forum is so accepting of this problem.


If it isn't normal than why are the high end A/V recievers adding a delay so you can sync them with the high end TVs. If it was just Samsung the companies like Denon and Yamaha wouldn't be doing this they do this so high end systems can have the best possible viewing experience. You upgrade your DVD to get a better picture and don't complain, a high end home theater is not just a TV and buying a TV doesn't magically upgrade the rest of your system. Because of all of you I will probably notice the lip sync problem as soon as I get my new TV, but I am not going to whine and call Samsung a bad company if it bothers me I will get new equipment to solve the problem just like I ordered a new DVD with my TV.

courtjstr :confused:

?#1 - Why an S-Video Cable on an HDTV or DVD? - Get rid of the S-Video- Use Component or HDMI if connections are available - S-Video is not a quality connection for HD/DVD's.

?#2 - What are we supposed to be seeing?I see an Oval but no image? Perhaps this is why there may be no responses?

I wish I could see what your requesting but at my end I do not see anything in the image other than the THX logo's below and an oval in light blue. Good Luck! :D

The box should continue all the way around the circle, and as you can see the bottom horizontal line is missing.

The same thing is true when viewing a TIVO menu, with half of the text cut-off at the bottom of the screen.

I recently got a Logitech "Cordless Desktop MX for Bluetooth". In testing I was able to make it to the top of the stairs on the 2nd floor and still have it pick up my typing with the computer in the basement. Once I went into a room on the 2nd floor it lost contact. One wall and 30 feet should be OK, since I had about 25 feet and two floor/ceilings.

Thanks I probably buy the same then. I think Microsoft's only goes 6-12ft.




Can someone with the Samsung HD850 or HD950 try a different (possibly their older) Prog player and see if the picture is worse, same, or better. I'm returning my HD850. My older JVC XV-S60BK (of all things) actually has a slightly better picture using component than my HD850 using HDMI at 1080i. I'm wondering if anyone else has noticed the same. I'm wondering if the HD950 has a better picture than the HD850. I think they use the same chipset.

Calbert if you have any DVD's with THX optimizer such as Starwars DVDs. Select THX optimizer in the options menu. Under video it will give you a pluge test. Read the instructions (shadow for the THX) to see if you are passing BTB. Also see if you can see all four shades of white on the test before the pluge test.

On the HD850 I could not see the shadow unless I raised the brightness to 5. After raising it to 5 the whites would crush on the four shades of white test.
On the HD950 (in theory) it should also give you an option to lower contrast to get the four shades of white back. If you can test this for me I would appreciate it.

Hi guys,


After reading the owner's thread, I'm concerned about HDMI not passing 5.1 signal. Since my receiver has HDMI switching, I was planning to do:

DTV ---(HDMI 1)---> RX-V4600
DVD ---(HDMI 2)---> RX-V4600

and then

RX-V4600 ---(HDMI OUT)---> 6768

Will this work or will the output be HDMI 2.0? Any suggestions? Thanks in advance!
----------------------------------------------------

Thanks,
Steve

If any of your components do not pass the 5.1 signal via HDMI, the easy fix would be to use a separate optical cable from the component to the 4600 (I'm sure each component has an optical out and I'm sure that 4600 has a number of optical inputs. It would require you to buy some cables though.

Here's a quick shot of my 5078 in its new home. It seems quite happy here ;) and fits with about 3/4" clearance above, 1/4" clearance on the sides and tons of space behind for air to circulate (the cabinet's a good 4" from the wall).

ps. Please forgive the nasty wallpaper around the top of the room ... was like that before we moved in, really ... repainting in next spring, probably.Classy cabinet...TV looks great with cabinet...I am getting jealous...where's my TV!

asc002: I went to the Yahama page and looked at the 4600. It says that it is setup to handle HDMI 5.1.

Try it and see what happens.

You might also want to set up the Yahama for a 100 millesecond lip sync delay so that the audio comes out correctly.

Hmm, I currently have a Panny S97 which looks just great on my HLM507 (via HDMI-DVI cable) but I'm a bit worried by some of the comments posted thus far about the S97 and MB with the 68/78 models. I've been thinking that perhaps the Samsung 950 might be a better choice when I get my HLR5078, especially because of the lack of MB over HDMI and it sounds like the Anynet is a cool feature. What is the general feeling about PQ from those of you that are using the 950 with a 68/78? I wish the 950 were available in Silver though (its a WAF thing! ;-)

The PQ on the 950 is definitely better than my Denon 1910 was. It's also better than my other DVD payer, but that is not an upscaling player.

On Anynet, one thing I should mention is that it works from all of the inputs except PC. For some reason it's not available from PC mode. My regualr manual says to look at the Anynet manual for more information, however, my HL-R5668W didn't come with a separate Anynet manual. Did anyone get a separate Anynet manual with their set? Can this manual be downloaded?

The PQ on the 950 is definitely better than my Denone 1910 was. It's also better than my other DVD payer, but that is not an upscaling player.


I would really be interested in hearing how the Denon DVD 2910 does with any of the xx68 or xx78 sets that people are getting. I remember that UCSB had bad luck with a Denon 3910 and a xx78 in a Magnolia store, but it would be good to hear if others have similar results. With many people getting sets within the next few weeks, we will hopefully get enough data to get a complete picture of which DVD's do well with the Sammy 1080p sets.

FAPilot, I have same issue with my PS2, is it an older style model (not the new slimline model?).

I did alot of digging, and basically it boiled down to the fact that, during PS2's life before slimming down, there was like, what, 10 revisions? well...some of those didn't have component out working.
So theres good chance its just the PS2, and nothing can change it short out modding it or buying a new one =/. Sad.

I've had my 6168 for a few days now and am still thrilled. My HD receiver isn't here yet, but even some of the SD channels from Directv are terrific.
I've connected a couple of laptops thru the VGA connection and have gotten a decent display of the windows desktop though not at the highest resolution and limited success with any sort of video. But, of course, the display adapters on these laptops are limited.
Now my question. I'm buying an HTPC to go with my 6168 and would like suggestions for which display adapter I should select. Any advice appreciated!

I went to Fry's electronics today to see the new 1080P Samsungs. They had a 56 inch model on display. I felt it had a VERY nice picture, BUT not a LOT nicer than many other lower priced TV's on display. It was slightly better than the standard Samsung DLP's, and Sony Grand Wega IV's, but I wasn't saying WOW when I watched it. It was a sports program on HDnet...maybe some other material would impress more. The 50 inch plasmas nearby really blew it away for picture quality. The salesman was not thrilled with the new Sammys either..he felt they are overpriced for the slight gain in performance, and said a good plasma 50 inch will blow away all the Rear Projection TV's in the store.

Have had the 6168 for 4 days now. The HD channels are great, but not as awesome as I expected. I've worked with the settings a bit-following some of the suggestions here. The real problem, however, is the standard definition channels. Almost unwatchable. Artifacts, blurry, reminscent of the older rear projection tvs. Right now I'm running a Comcast HD box and using the cables they provided. Once the new Pioneer Elite VSX-74 TXVi is available I'll be using the HDMI inputs. So far, though-underwhelmed. Would appreciate any suggestions to improve the PQ on the standard definition channels.

Thanks calbert, RMSko, and wtr1. Once I receive the TV, I will report again. :) The waiting is killing me...

Steve

Spear,

Have you tried using a DVI->HDMI cable yet? If so, have you come up with a good modeline?

I tried it, but cannot get a modeline which does not produce a vertical double (ghost) image. I have tried going for 540p as well as 1080i.


I haven't spent much time with HDMI because I haven't been getting good results either. I've been using this modeline for HDMI:

ModeLine "ATSC-1080-60i" 74.25 1920 1960 2016 2200 1080 1082 1088 1125 Interlace

but the quality is significantly worse than VGA at 1080p. Text looks bad. I don't know if I'd describe it as a ghost image but things seem fuzzy in both horizontal and vertical directions. It also seems to be flickering a little bit. The strange thing is that I do *not* get 1:1 mapping with HDMI and there is no adjustment for the screen size. I see aliasing artifacts if I display "xsetroot -mod 2 2", whereas the same thing looks good on VGA at max size.

(I also have to turn off VblankSync with HDMI or the video driver would lock up when displaying video.)


VGA looks really good, but I was curious if HDMI might look better. Especially when combined with Myth's BOB deinterlacer/rate doubler.

With VGA, progressive sources look perfect. When watching an interlaced source, I do occasionally see some horizontal bleeding of white areas. It is minor, but there. Not sure what it is about interlaced sources which cause this.


Is this with your cheap VGA cable or your high quality one? I think you said you had to go to your cheap cable so that EDID would work properly but since you're explicitly setting your modeline (and can ignore EDID), I wasn't sure if you'd gone back to your high quality cable.

My regualr manual says to look at the Anynet manual for more information, however, my HL-R5668W didn't come with a separate Anynet manual. Did anyone get a separate Anynet manual with their set? Can this manual be downloaded?Yes, with my 5078: There's a 4-page document called "Anynet Guide (AV Device Control & Connectivity)" that's very easily lost in the stack of registration and safety papers. Document number at bottom of last page is: AA68-03575M (ENG). Unfortunately, nowhere does it even mention a PC device. On page 2, there's a chart that lists the compatible devices:

"Two devices can be connected"
------------------------------------------
DVD Player
DVD Combo
DVDR
DVDR/Combo

"One device can be connected"
------------------------------------------
DVD Receiver
DVDR/Receiver
AV Receiver

"Two devices can be connected"
------------------------------------------
Satellite STB
Cable STB
HD STB

I went to Fry's electronics today to see the new 1080P Samsungs. They had a 56 inch model on display. I felt it had a VERY nice picture, BUT not a LOT nicer than many other lower priced TV's on display. It was slightly better than the standard Samsung DLP's, and Sony Grand Wega IV's, but I wasn't saying WOW when I watched it. It was a sports program on HDnet...maybe some other material would impress more. The 50 inch plasmas nearby really blew it away for picture quality. The salesman was not thrilled with the new Sammys either..he felt they are overpriced for the slight gain in performance, and said a good plasma 50 inch will blow away all the Rear Projection TV's in the store.
Frys's is not the place to test TV's. Keep looking. There is NO plasma that has the same PQ as the 5668. I looked at them all. The feed is probably at fault. Also I would at least set the picture mode to MOVIE before I made any decision. Yes it will not be as bright but the quality is much better than Standard or Dynamic. You could probably run one of those modes or bring up the color on Movie if you really want to see people glow in the dark.

I am watching a show about Comets on Discovery HD via 1080i HDMI from
my Dishnetwork 941 with unaltered Dynamic mode and I have never seen
a better picture in my life. It really looks 3D! There is a shot when the host
moves his arm in and out of the screen and I had to blink to make sure I
wasn't seeing things. I am recording this on my 942 as a demo scene for
friends and family. Un-frig'in'-believable!

I have to really question the source components when I hear people that are
underwelmed because I have done nothing yet to calibrate the picture on my
6168.

Movie mode in a darkened room with DVDs with dark content and Dynamic
mode for broadcasts like Discovery HD, etc. seem to work great "right out
of the box"!

The box should continue all the way around the circle, and as you can see the bottom horizontal line is missing.

The same thing is true when viewing a TIVO menu, with half of the text cut-off at the bottom of the screen.
Did you check the aspect ratio mode? It looks like you are in one of the zoom modes. For that picture it looks like the set should be set to 4:3 or if you want the oval then 16:9. Is your DVD player set to 16:9 or widescreen? It looks like its sending out 4:3 material.

Sorry to go off topic but was just wondering ihow many of you guys bought the warranty as well and if u think it'll be a good idea...Also I wanna run all video through my receiver so I can leave my 6168 on one input...I was wondering if using a DVI-to-component (by ATI) would sacrafice a lot of video quality....thanks in advance....this forum has been a lot of help for first-timers like me

Calbert if you have any DVD's with THX optimizer such as Starwars DVDs. Select THX optimizer in the options menu. Under video it will give you a pluge test. Read the instructions (shadow for the THX) to see if you are passing BTB. Also see if you can see all four shades of white on the test before the pluge test.

On the HD850 I could not see the shadow unless I raised the brightness to 5. After raising it to 5 the whites would crush on the four shades of white test.
On the HD950 (in theory) it should also give you an option to lower contrast to get the four shades of white back. If you can test this for me I would appreciate it.I threw in Empire Strikes Back and checked out the THX Optimizer for you. Other than the 16:9 circle test, all tests were done in 4:3 mode (when I ran them in 16:9, I often got slightly erratic results). All tests were done in Movie mode unless noted otherwise:

The white test gave me no problems. In fact, with the 950 Brightness setting at the default, I could not adjust the 5078 Contrast or Brightness to in any way to make it not display all shades of white. As soon as I switch the 950 Brightness from 3 to 4, however, the whites become completely crushed. In that situation, no adjustment of the 5078 could make the shades of white visible.

The black test would not pass BTB. At the 5078's default brightness of 45, I could not see the THX logo or the 7th box. At 47, I could see the THX logo. At 49 and 50, I could finally see the 7th box. That's the threshold. Higher than 50 brightens the overall field of black to shades of grey, and no amount of adjustment will bring any other boxes into view (and I certainly couldn't see a drop shadow behind the THX logo).

The color test seemed somewhat irrelevant, as there were no adjustments that I could see that would allow me to alter the tint of each hue (Tint settings are only available in Composite and maybe S-Video I think). The good news is that red looked like red, magenta looked like magenta, and cyan looked like cyan.

The sharpness test seemed of limited use, since the 4078's resolution is so much greater than the source material. I was able to discern changes in the pattern as I adjusted the 5078, but I had no problems returning to the default 25 setting.

The geometry settings turned out just fine. The first one you have to be in 4:3 mode, the second one you have to be in 16:9 mode.

I settled on the following Movie mode settings:
> Contrast: 45
> Brightness: 47
> Sharpness: 25
> Color: 45

Note that I chose 47 for Brightness instead of 48-50 ... a slightly higher value might have helped on the THX black test, but when watching the Shelob's Lair scene in LOTR ROTK, I noticed an artificial dark halo around the bright area of a specific tunnel scene. Dropping Brightness back to 47 eliminated the halo.

BTW, I stated the 950's display settings in error earlier this evening: There is no "Contrast" setting. The available ones are:

> Sharpness: 3/5
> Brightness: 3/5
> Color Saturation: 3/5

Hope this is useful, sorry for the long post.

Have had the 6168 for 4 days now. The HD channels are great, but not as awesome as I expected. I've worked with the settings a bit-following some of the suggestions here. The real problem, however, is the standard definition channels. Almost unwatchable. Artifacts, blurry, reminscent of the older rear projection tvs. Right now I'm running a Comcast HD box and using the cables they provided. Once the new Pioneer Elite VSX-74 TXVi is available I'll be using the HDMI inputs. So far, though-underwhelmed. Would appreciate any suggestions to improve the PQ on the standard definition channels.

You didn't say which HD box from Comcast that you have ... I will assume it is a Motorola 5100, 6200, or 6412 ... you need to go into the setup menu on the Comcast STB and set the output to 16:9 and 1080i. You need to use quality component video or DVI/HDMI cables.

One thing to try, use a splitter to split your coax cable signal before the STB and route one cable directly into the TV. Find all of the SD, digital SD, and HD channels and run your tests using the sets built in tuners. This level of performance will be your baseline, then try to get your STB working up to this standard.

ADDED: If you don't know how to go into the setup menu ... find the Motorola manual online and it is described in the manual. I haven't done it in a while, but I think with the power OFF, you push the setup button.

Did you check the aspect ratio mode? It looks like you are in one of the zoom modes. For that picture it looks like the set should be set to 4:3 or if you want the oval then 16:9. Is your DVD player set to 16:9 or widescreen? It looks like its sending out 4:3 material.I agree. Courtjstr, make sure your DVD player is set to output a 16:9 signal. Then run the THX Optimizer with your tv in 4:3 mode until it asks you in the last test to switch your 16:9 tv to 16:9 mode. That should help with the geometry, at least with the oval problem. Not sure what's up with the bottom cropping, hopefully Chris is right and it's just that your tv's in a zoom mode. Let us know if it works. :)

Frys's is not the place to test TV's. Keep looking.

ditto. Fry's here in the San Francisco area has the distinction of being able to take an awesome 1080p TV and make it look no better than a 720p (which is not being displayed that well either). Find a high-end retailer with a nice setup if you want to get an idea of what these TV's can do.

I haven't spent much time with HDMI because I haven't been getting good results either. I've been using this modeline for HDMI:

ModeLine "ATSC-1080-60i" 74.25 1920 1960 2016 2200 1080 1082 1088 1125 Interlace

but the quality is significantly worse than VGA at 1080p. Text looks bad. I don't know if I'd describe it as a ghost image but things seem fuzzy in both horizontal and vertical directions. It also seems to be flickering a little bit. The strange thing is that I do *not* get 1:1 mapping with HDMI and there is no adjustment for the screen size. I see aliasing artifacts if I display "xsetroot -mod 2 2", whereas the same thing looks good on VGA at max size.

(I also have to turn off VblankSync with HDMI or the video driver would lock up when displaying video.)


Interesting. I will try it and see what happens. Thanks.

Is this with your cheap VGA cable or your high quality one? I think you said you had to go to your cheap cable so that EDID would work properly but since you're explicitly setting your modeline (and can ignore EDID), I wasn't sure if you'd gone back to your high quality cable.
It seems even worse with the low quality cable. Makes me wonder if my "high quality" cable is not quite good enough....

Thanks,

John

Question re: white flash across screen during movies ...

Randomly, but sometimes as often as once every 20 minutes or so, I get a very fast (fraction of a second) white flash that fills the entire screen while watching DVDs on my DVD-HD950. I'm using the HDMI cable that came with the player. The cable is rather thin and flexible ... the sheathing/insulation doesn't seem as sturdy as that of my AR optical cables for instance.

Does this sound like a simple cable problem? Tomorrow I'll dig back there and reseat both connectors, just wondering if that's a common problem with cheap HDMI cables.

The black test would not pass BTB. At the 5078's default brightness of 45, I could not see the THX logo or the 7th box. At 47, I could see the THX logo. At 49 and 50, I could finally see the 7th box. That's the threshold. Higher than 50 brightens the overall field of black to shades of grey, and no amount of adjustment will bring any other boxes into view (and I certainly couldn't see a drop shadow behind the THX logo).

I just want to make sure that I understand what you are saying here ... do you mean that the 950 failed BTB at brigntness = 45, but when you increased brightness into the 47 - 50 range it passed BTB?

I just want to make sure that I understand what you are saying here ... do you mean that the 950 failed BTB at brigntness = 45, but when you increased brightness into the 47 - 50 range it passed BTB?Sorry for the confusion, I may not be using the term "BTB test" appropriately. Here's a more clear explanation.

> 5078: Movie Mode
> 950: Outputting 1080i over HDMI
> 950: Brightness set at a constant 3 (default)

As you probably know the black test in the THX Optimizer has two rows across the top and bottom of the screen, divided into 10 blocks each. Each block is a different shade of black. There's also a THX logo in the middle with a drop shadow behind it. The instructions for this test indicate that some players will not be able to display the drop shadow behind the THX logo, and go on to state that in such a case, the best your player can do is to barely display the 7th block.

In the case of my above setup, these are the results of my testing:

> 5078 Brightness: 45: (logo: NO | shadow: NO | 7th box: NO)
> 5078 Brightness: 47: (logo: YES | shadow: NO | 7th box: NO)
> 5078 Brightness: 48-50: (logo: YES | shadow: NO | 7th box: YES)
> 5078 Brightness: 50+: (same as 48-50 except blacks become washed out)

At no time could I ever see the drop shadow or the last three blocks. I assumed these visual elements of the test were rendered in blacker-than-black, so that's why I claimed the 950 failed the "BTB test." My understanding of BTB may be incorrect, so certainly please correct me if I've got it wrong. Thanks for asking!

Sorry for the confusion, I may not be using the term "BTB test" appropriately. Here's a more clear explanation.

> 5078: Movie Mode
> 950: Outputting 1080i over HDMI
> 950: Brightness set at a constant 3 (default)

As you probably know the black test in the THX Optimizer has two rows across the top and bottom of the screen, divided into 10 blocks each. Each block is a different shade of black. There's also a THX logo in the middle with a drop shadow behind it. The instructions for this test indicate that some players will not be able to display the drop shadow behind the THX logo, and go on to state that in such a case, the best your player can do is to barely display the 7th block.

In the case of my above setup, these are the results of my testing:

> 5078 Brightness: 45: (logo: NO | shadow: NO | 7th box: NO)
> 5078 Brightness: 47: (logo: YES | shadow: NO | 7th box: NO)
> 5078 Brightness: 48-50: (logo: YES | shadow: NO | 7th box: YES)
> 5078 Brightness: 50+: (same as 48-50 except blacks become washed out)

At no time could I ever see the drop shadow or the last three blocks. I assumed these visual elements of the test were rendered in blacker-than-black, so that's why I claimed the 950 failed the "BTB test." My understanding of BTB may be incorrect, so certainly please correct me if I've got it wrong. Thanks for asking!

I just popped in Empire Strikes Back into my Denon DVD-3910 and checked the
THX Optimizer - I could see all 8 boxes distinctly ( could also see all 8
distinctly on my old JVC -DILA ). I also see the THX logo off the bottom right hand
corner. This is in Movie mode with *no* adjustments.

I will also run this test when I get my Pioneer Elite 59avi which is scheduled
for delivery on Tuesday.

I just popped in Empire Strikes Back into my Denon DVD-3910 and checked the
THX Optimizer - I could see all 8 boxes distinctly ( could also see all 8
distinctly on my old JVC -DILA ). I also see the THX logo off the bottom right hand
corner.

This is in Movie mode with *no* adjustments.

I will also run this test when I get my Pioneer Elite 59avi which is scheduled
for delivery on Tuesday.

The above is different than what I found on the Incredibles DVD.


The test on the Incredibles has 10 boxes above the THX and 10 boxes
below as well as four boxes to the left and four boxes to the right.
All boxes are distinct using unadjusted "Movie" mode. The THX logo
and shadow are clearly visible.

Calbert was correct regarding his interpretation of passing BTB:
Check out the following web page http://www.thx.com/mod/products/dvd/brightness.html

Calbert and Tony ... thanks for the careful testing and information.

Calbert ... One more question about your testing: Can you confirm that you were using an HDMI setting of RGB - Expand! It is the only HDMI setting that has the potential to send BTB.

============

From Manual:

HDMI
This setting is used when the unit is
connected by HDMI or DVI to Display
devices (TV, Projector, etc.).
- Resolution
• 480p : 720 x 480
• 720p : 1280 x 720
• 768p : 1024 x 768
• 1080i : 1920 x 1080
- Format
You can use this function to set HDMI or
DVI output's digital data RGB range.
• RGB-Normal : HDMI/DVI Limited range
RGB data output.
• RGB-Expand : HDMI/DVI Full range RGB
data output.
• YCbCr-(4:4:4) : HDMI Limited range
YCbCr-(4:4:4) output.
• YCbCr-(4:2:2) : HDMI Limited range
YCbCr-(4:2:2) output.
If you set the HDMI output resolution to
768p, you cannot use YCbCr format.
Limited range - Black/White and color level
displayed within Limited data range.
ex) When the bit depth is 8 bits
- Y : 16~235 - levels of brightness
- CbCr : 16~240 - levels of color
Ful range - Black/White and color level are
expressed within full data range.
ex) When the bit depth is 8 bits
- Y : 0~255 - levels of brightness
- CbCr : 0~255 - levels of color

This question was posted a few days ago and since it wasn't addressed I thought I'd bring it back up since it affects most of us who connect with HDMI only. I have my STB connected to HDMI 1 and DVD connected to HDMI 2. I am not running any other inputs to the TV.

The question was whether or not the "TV" input can be disabled as a source so that when the DVD is on you can hit the "Source" button on the TV remote and only have to toggle between "HDMI 1" and "HDMI 2" instead of having the "TV" souce come up with its snowy blank screen (since there is no coaxial input from my cable system). I suspect that this "TV" source is there by default, but wonder if anyone has found a way to disable it.

Not a huge problem, but rather a little bit of an annoyance. At least the loud hiss you would expect from a snowy screen is apparently automatically muted so you don't blow your speakers and/or ears out when the "TV" source is selected.

This question was posted a few days ago and since it wasn't addressed I thought I'd bring it back up since it affects most of us who connect with HDMI only. I have my STB connected to HDMI 1 and DVD connected to HDMI 2. I am not running any other inputs to the TV.

The question was whether or not the "TV" input can be disabled as a source so that when the DVD is on you can hit the "Source" button on the TV remote and only have to toggle between "HDMI 1" and "HDMI 2" instead of having the "TV" souce come up with its snowy blank screen (since there is no coaxial input from my cable system). I suspect that this "TV" source is there by default, but wonder if anyone has found a way to disable it.

Not a huge problem, but rather a little bit of an annoyance. At least the loud hiss you would expect from a snowy screen is apparently automatically muted so you don't blow your speakers and/or ears out when the "TV" source is selected.

I don't know if TV can be disabled, but why not get a better remote and use a macro with a discrete code to go directly between the devices.

I may have to consider that. Right now I have four remotes sitting on the coffee table. i have them figured out but they are driving the rest of the family crazy. Which remote do you suggest?

Wondering what DVD player people have found to be the best with the new 1080p Samsungs. Samsung 950? Oppo (which model)?

I would really be interested in hearing how the Denon DVD 2910 does with any of the xx68 or xx78 sets that people are getting. I remember that UCSB had bad luck with a Denon 3910 and a xx78 in a Magnolia store, but it would be good to hear if others have similar results. With many people getting sets within the next few weeks, we will hopefully get enough data to get a complete picture of which DVD's do well with the Sammy 1080p sets.

I have the Denon 1910, which is very similar to the 2910 as they both use the Faroudja decoder and I have to say it is horrible with my HL-R5668W. The macro blocking made it unwatchable. It was so bad that I replaced it with the Samsung 950, which has no macro blocking and is much much better.

Here's a quick shot of my 5078 in its new home.

Nice cabinet, I bet the cats love it too. There are plenty of perching spots. Too bad you have your electronics behind the glass doors, it would make an excellent place to put the cats while you are watching a movie. :)

I may have to consider that. Right now I have four remotes sitting on the coffee table. i have them figured out but they are driving the rest of the family crazy. Which remote do you suggest?

If you have the Samsung 950 DVD Player, the "Anynet" feature will help a lot.

Hello everyone. I just got the 6168 this past Friday (my first HD-TV) and I must say I pretty happy with it. I got a sweet deal through my friend who works at Samsung and saves a bundle.
I watched the Superbit Black Hawk Down edition using my Sammy DVD-HD 950 and it looked and sounded great.
I spent a few hours playing God of War on the PS2 through component Video and did not have any lag issues at all. The game also looked great. Tonight I am going to try some Xbox games and report that tomorrow.

Also, I am planning to start programming my Phillips Pronto Neo remote, and was wondering is anyone has discrete codes for this TV yet. Some of the code from the HLN models work but not all. I am looking for the code for the SWAP (PIP) button. It gets annoying to have to go through the menu screen to apply the swap (also as some of you know, this is not possible if one of the two inputs is connected through a digital connection).

One last question. Can you guys list you custom picture settings?. I am trying to find the best combo and was wondering what some of you use.

Thanks

Yes, with my 5078: There's a 4-page document called "Anynet Guide (AV Device Control & Connectivity)" that's very easily lost in the stack of registration and safety papers. Document number at bottom of last page is: AA68-03575M (ENG). Unfortunately, nowhere does it even mention a PC device. On page 2, there's a chart that lists the compatible devices:

"Two devices can be connected"
------------------------------------------
DVD Player
DVD Combo
DVDR
DVDR/Combo

"One device can be connected"
------------------------------------------
DVD Receiver
DVDR/Receiver
AV Receiver

"Two devices can be connected"
------------------------------------------
Satellite STB
Cable STB
HD STB

Thanks for posting this information. I don't think that was included with my set, but I'll look again when I get home. I'm not sure what help it will be though, b/c I don't even understand what is meant by those instructions. When it says "Two devices can be connected", do you think it means up to two of the devices of the type below the heading can be connected? Anyway, I may have confused things when I said it doesn't work when in PC mode. How Anynet works is that no matter what source you are watching (other than PC), if you press the Anynet button, it bring you to a screen that lets you pick which source you want to switch to and then when you pick that source, it switches to the input controlling that source and powers on the device - making it all very easy. For me, the Anynet button works when my source is using either HDMI input, either Component input, or the TV (antenna) input, but does NOT work if my source is using VGA. I would expect that is the way it's suppose to be. I may try to do some more research. It's a really great feature, especially since there is presently no discrete HDMI 2 code.

Frys's is not the place to test TV's. Keep looking. There is NO plasma that has the same PQ as the 5668. I looked at them all. The feed is probably at fault. Also I would at least set the picture mode to MOVIE before I made any decision. Yes it will not be as bright but the quality is much better than Standard or Dynamic. You could probably run one of those modes or bring up the color on Movie if you really want to see people glow in the dark.


Your cotention that NO plasma has a good a PQ as the 5668 seems to fly in the face of many reviews, and vitually every store saleperson I have ever discussed this with. A good plasma looks better than any of the micro-display televisions that I have seen. I own a Sony GWIV, so don't think I am a plasma freak..lol. When I go to stores, the better plasmas are clearly superior to the RPTV's all of all types. For what it is worth, Consumer Reports latest TV issue confirms that in the ratings also. Please note that I am not bashing the new Samsung. It has a great picture, and is probably the best RPTV out there at this time. In 50 inch size though, I would still contend that a $4000.00 retail plasma is superior. If you want/need a bigger TV, go for a good DLP, or LCD projection. The other isssue is whether or not the 1080P is worth the premium over the 720P models. The DLP's with the HD2+ chip have a great picture too, at a substantially lower cost.

Re: video/audio sync issues -
If it isn't normal than why are the high end A/V recievers adding a delay so you can sync them with the high end TVs. If it was just Samsung the companies like Denon and Yamaha wouldn't be doing this they do this so high end systems can have the best possible viewing experience.

You are dead on with the above, and I am surprised no one else has mentioned this already.

Question re: white flash across screen during movies ...

Randomly, but sometimes as often as once every 20 minutes or so, I get a very fast (fraction of a second) white flash that fills the entire screen while watching DVDs on my DVD-HD950. I'm using the HDMI cable that came with the player. The cable is rather thin and flexible ... the sheathing/insulation doesn't seem as sturdy as that of my AR optical cables for instance.

Does this sound like a simple cable problem? Tomorrow I'll dig back there and reseat both connectors, just wondering if that's a common problem with cheap HDMI cables.On Samsung,s HD941 we would get a green flash just like you explained. :(

I've spent the weekend messing with my 6168 that arrived on Friday. I watched a few DVDs and quite a few movies on DirecTV - all on my HTPC connected via VGA to the TV. Perhaps my eyes became more "critical" the more time I spent watching, but I do notice digital artifacts on many of the DVDs and all of the SD content - it's starting to bug me. The only HD content I have currently is one OTA channel. This signal strength meter, in the TV menu system under Channel, reports 5 bars. The PQ is decent but not overly impressive as I still see digital artifacts and pixelization. Is this to be expected with OTA broadcasts or should I continue questioning my purchase? :/

Has anyone got the TV Guide working? I configured mine but 2 days later, still no data.

Question re: white flash across screen during movies ...

Randomly, but sometimes as often as once every 20 minutes or so, I get a very fast (fraction of a second) white flash that fills the entire screen while watching DVDs on my DVD-HD950. I'm using the HDMI cable that came with the player. The cable is rather thin and flexible ... the sheathing/insulation doesn't seem as sturdy as that of my AR optical cables for instance.

Does this sound like a simple cable problem? Tomorrow I'll dig back there and reseat both connectors, just wondering if that's a common problem with cheap HDMI cables.


Thanks for the tests Calbert and Tony. As far as the flashes it might be the cable. With the HD850 I was using a different cable than it came with and did not have the flash problem.

The anynet functions sound great but I don't think I'll be ordering the HD950 because of the BTB problem. It doesn't appear there is a good HDMI player right now that doesn't have a problem. Panasonic and OPPO have MB. Samsung doesn't pass BTB without crushing whites. I'm still going to return my HD850, I guess I'll stick wih my old JVC for now.Sony makes an upconvert but I've read it has quality problems.

This question was posted a few days ago and since it wasn't addressed I thought I'd bring it back up since it affects most of us who connect with HDMI only. I have my STB connected to HDMI 1 and DVD connected to HDMI 2. I am not running any other inputs to the TV.

The question was whether or not the "TV" input can be disabled as a source so that when the DVD is on you can hit the "Source" button on the TV remote and only have to toggle between "HDMI 1" and "HDMI 2" instead of having the "TV" souce come up with its snowy blank screen (since there is no coaxial input from my cable system). I suspect that this "TV" source is there by default, but wonder if anyone has found a way to disable it.

Not a huge problem, but rather a little bit of an annoyance. At least the loud hiss you would expect from a snowy screen is apparently automatically muted so you don't blow your speakers and/or ears out when the "TV" source is selected.


Just bought the harmony 880 which allows you to hit a button for hdmi1 and then another button for hdmi2 or any other input you want.

Hi guys,

I jumped on the Sammy boat and picked up a bunch of new audio/video equipment. Here's what I got:

TV - Samsung HL-R6768W
DVD - Samsung DVD-HD950
DirecTV HD Receiver with TiVo
AVR - Yamaha RX-V4600

After reading the owner's thread, I'm concerned about HDMI not passing 5.1 signal. Since my receiver has HDMI switching, I was planning to do:

DTV ---(HDMI 1)---> RX-V4600
DVD ---(HDMI 2)---> RX-V4600

and then

RX-V4600 ---(HDMI OUT)---> 6768

Will this work or will the output be HDMI 2.0? Any suggestions? Thanks in advance!
----------------------------------------------------

Thanks,
Steve

Why buy the expensive RX-V4600 when you have 2 HDMI inputs on th DLP? There is no real need for HDMI switching unless you are going to add a 3rd device to the DLP. I have the same setup as you, just a cheaper receiver, but equal audio quality.

I also need a wireless keyboard/mouse. Does anyone know of a wireless keyboard/mouse that will go through one wall and 30 ft of distance.

Someone, I am sure, has already beaten me to the punch on this, but you'll want to check out the Gyration RF keyboards. Just take a look at newegg for them.

-reiner

Calbert was correct regarding his interpretation of passing BTB:
Check out the following web page http://www.thx.com/mod/products/dvd/brightness.htmlThanks for the link, Tony. Figure 5 is exactly what I see with the 950. Bummer, I now feel not good enough! :o Although, for a sub-$200 player that upconverts, I'm not really disappointed I suppose.

UCSB: Yes, I definitely had already set the 950 to use RGB-Expand ... one of the first things I did. I'll double-check tonight, maybe somehow the setting was lost with all of my fiddling around, but I highly doubt it.

I may have to consider that. Right now I have four remotes sitting on the coffee table. i have them figured out but they are driving the rest of the family crazy. Which remote do you suggest?

Can't go wrong with the Harmony. The three year old and the wife use it flawlessly.

Nice cabinet, I bet the cats love it too. There are plenty of perching spots. Too bad you have your electronics behind the glass doors, it would make an excellent place to put the cats while you are watching a movie. :)LOL :D They definitely make every effort to get in there when I've got the door open ...

Thanks for posting this information. I don't think that was included with my set, but I'll look again when I get home. I'm not sure what help it will be though, b/c I don't even understand what is meant by those instructions. When it says "Two devices can be connected", do you think it means up to two of the devices of the type below the heading can be connected? Anyway, I may have confused things when I said it doesn't work when in PC mode. How Anynet works is that no matter what source you are watching (other than PC), if you press the Anynet button, it bring you to a screen that lets you pick which source you want to switch to and then when you pick that source, it switches to the input controlling that source and powers on the device - making it all very easy. For me, the Anynet button works when my source is using either HDMI input, either Component input, or the TV (antenna) input, but does NOT work if my source is using VGA. I would expect that is the way it's suppose to be. I may try to do some more research. It's a really great feature, especially since there is presently no discrete HDMI 2 code.I know, I was a bit confused by the instructions, although I know it's hard to make sense of it out of context. Let me know tonight if you don't have the doc ... Since it's so short, I can quickly snap a few photos of it that should be readable and post them for everyone. I do like Anynet, it's a neat little feature.

Thanks for the tests Calbert and Tony. As far as the flashes it might be the cable. With the HD850 I was using a different cable than it came with and did not have the flash problem.

The anynet functions sound great but I don't think I'll be ordering the HD950 because of the BTB problem. It doesn't appear there is a good HDMI player right now that doesn't have a problem. Panasonic and OPPO have MB. Samsung doesn't pass BTB without crushing whites. I'm still going to return my HD850, I guess I'll stick wih my old JVC for now.Sony makes an upconvert but I've read it has quality problems.No problem. I enjoyed learning what the 950 can and can't do. Bummer if the Oppo does indeed have MB (assume it's using Faroudja) ... would have considered it as an alternative to the 950, but I'd rather not pass BTB than have MB. I need to spend some time in the DVD forum. ;)

I do have a big lip sync problem on the TiVo. Audio is going through the amp, video through the S-Video input. I'll need to figure out a work around for this. I'm trying to check if I have a lip sync problem on the DVD, but I haven't seen one.

I was noticing big lip sync issues on the Tivo via s-video too (audio via optical to the B&K), however, after turning off the digital noise reduction feature on the samsung they seem to have gotten so slight that I don't seem to notice them anymore.

Hey. Just got the Oppo DVD player and tried to connect it to the HDMI/DVI port on the Sammy 5678w. I get a Not Supported Mode message. It doesn't work. Has anyone had success with this DVD player and the new 1080p tvs?

Get the 6/28 firmware on there. Use the DVI button on the remote to switch modes. 1080i works wonderful with the Oppo. I've watched 3 or 4 films now on the 6168 and it's so good, I forget I'm not in the theater. My wife likes the Harry Potter films (which can be extremely dark at times), and I'm really really impressed with the Oppo/Samsung output.

Note that I was getting large lip sync delay if I used HDMI via input 1, but HDMI via input 2 seems to reduce the delay to unoticable amounts.

I have the Denon 1910, which is very similar to the 2910 as they both use the Faroudja decoder and I have to say it is horrible with my HL-R5668W. The macro blocking made it unwatchable. It was so bad that I replaced it with the Samsung 950, which has no macro blocking and is much much better.

The 1910 and 2910 are worlds apart. With my hlp6163, I had the 1910 initially and found it unacceptible, while the 2910 is superb. I'm hoping, of course, that it will also do well with the xx68's and xx78's.

Just bought the harmony 880 which allows you to hit a button for hdmi1 and then another button for hdmi2 or any other input you want.

Have you gotten that HMDI 2 button to actually switch your TV's input to HDMI 2? If so, did you program that button with a discrete code and if you did could you post the code. I haven't been able to get a code for HDMI 2.

Got my 6168 last friday and am happy with it so far. I have few questions which might have been answered in this forum but since it has grown so large I have hard time finding the answers I need.
1) How do I remove the base from 6168. Will removing base make it unstable??
2)Best possible stand for around 150$$. ( spent just too much on the tv.. and still need to get upconverting DVD player)
3)When tv is turned off I see an oval white area in the lower middle part of the screen. It is around 12 inch high and 5 inch wide. Not visible when the tv is on?? Is it normal or defective??

All answers and recommendations are welcome.

Got my 6168 last friday and am happy with it so far. I have few questions which might have been answered in this forum but since it has grown so large I have hard time finding the answers I need.

3)When tv is turned off I see an oval white area in the lower middle part of the screen. It is around 12 inch high and 5 inch wide. Not visible when the tv is on?? Is it normal or defective??



Is it such where you can take a picture of it and post it??

Got my 6168 last friday and am happy with it so far. I have few questions which might have been answered in this forum but since it has grown so large I have hard time finding the answers I need.
1) How do I remove the base from 6168. Will removing base make it unstable??
2)Best possible stand for around 150$$. ( spent just too much on the tv.. and still need to get upconverting DVD player)
3)When tv is turned off I see an oval white area in the lower middle part of the screen. It is around 12 inch high and 5 inch wide. Not visible when the tv is on?? Is it normal or defective??

All answers and recommendations are welcome.


1) I beleive you remove the 2 screws in the back near the base of the tv, activate the spring clip things then slide the base out.

I've spent the weekend messing with my 6168 that arrived on Friday. I watched a few DVDs and quite a few movies on DirecTV - all on my HTPC connected via VGA to the TV. Perhaps my eyes became more "critical" the more time I spent watching, but I do notice digital artifacts on many of the DVDs and all of the SD content - it's starting to bug me. The only HD content I have currently is one OTA channel. This signal strength meter, in the TV menu system under Channel, reports 5 bars. The PQ is decent but not overly impressive as I still see digital artifacts and pixelization. Is this to be expected with OTA broadcasts or should I continue questioning my purchase? :/

Has anyone got the TV Guide working? I configured mine but 2 days later, still no data.

After about three days or so I finally got all of the data in the TV guide... I am using Comcast as my cable provider... What picture mode are you running the TV in ? I found that when running it in standard (default) mode that pixelation and artifacts were pretty apparent... Switching to movie mode helped out a lot with this.. If you are using your PC for dvd play back you may want to play with FFDShow and play with some of the noise reduction filters.

No problem. I enjoyed learning what the 950 can and can't do. Bummer if the Oppo does indeed have MB (assume it's using Faroudja) ... would have considered it as an alternative to the 950, but I'd rather not pass BTB than have MB. I need to spend some time in the DVD forum. ;)

From a number of posts above it seems clear that there is going to be some compromise involved with any (relatively inexpensive) DVD player, primarily choosing between having MB'ing or not passing BTB.

Not passing BTB seems to me to be a killer; wouldn't this negate all the 'detail in dark scenes' that the 10,000 :1 CR of the 1080p sets has made possible? I would find this unacceptible.

I have a Denon 2910 with my hlp6163 and do (on relatively rare occasions) notice MB'ing; but I have not noticed it often enough for it to be a serious problem. It passes BTB with ease, and has overall outstanding PQ. I was concerned, however, about UCSB's report of very poor results with a Denon 3910 and an xx78 set at Magnolia. But then tonydeluce seems to think his 3910 does quite well with his 1080p set (though I believe he is going to replace it with a Pioneer Elite).

It will, of course, be very helpful to get more 'data' from those of you with these new sets, but it looks like it's going to be a very personal choice (as most of these things ultimately seem to be) about which defects they find least objectiionable.

I still have problems with my HDMI inputs. Images on both of them suck. It is entirely unwatchable with large red bands. I got a DVD player with HDMI input and tried that too. And it is the same. I also got messages twice - Once, it reported that HDCP has been compromised and the other time about DTCP is not supported or something like that.
I have samsung tech person coming in on thrusday. Anyone has problems with HDMI inputs?
All other inputs work great with no problems.

Anyone here using a Motorola 6200 box with their set? I have mine hooked up with component cables currently and I have noticed artifacts even when the cable box is turned off... Artifacts that sort of resemble what one would experience with a bad video card in a PC (pink / green specs). The box doesn't do this on a Toshiba 42H83 set, and regardless of what component input I use I still get the same artifacts. Using the same component cables with my xbox on the same component inputs gives me no artifacts, so I am wondering if this is just some sort of known issue with this box and this set (5668W)... My dual tuner dvr box will be here on Wednesday so hopefully there will be no artifact issues with the new box... I don't have a DVI - HDMI cable currently so I did not get a chance to test my 6200 box with the HDMI inputs..

Anyone here using a Motorola 6200 box with their set? I have mine hooked up with component cables currently and I have noticed artifacts even when the cable box is turned off... Artifacts that sort of resemble what one would experience with a bad video card in a PC (pink / green specs). The box doesn't do this on a Toshiba 42H83 set, and regardless of what component input I use I still get the same artifacts. Using the same component cables with my xbox on the same component inputs gives me no artifacts, so I am wondering if this is just some sort of known issue with this box and this set (5668W)... My dual tuner dvr box will be here on Wednesday so hopefully there will be no artifact issues with the new box... I don't have a DVI - HDMI cable currently so I did not get a chance to test my 6200 box with the HDMI inputs..

I have DCT 6200 and component inputs work fine. Only the HDMI inputs have problems. Try the HDMI inputs, if you have not done them already.

I may have to consider that. Right now I have four remotes sitting on the coffee table. i have them figured out but they are driving the rest of the family crazy. Which remote do you suggest?

You might look at a few at remotecentral.com. I don't have a Harmony, but they look nice to me. If you want to put in a lot of work, but get totally custom results, I can recommend the Philips Pronto TSU3000/TSU7000 that I own.

From a number of posts above it seems clear that there is going to be some compromise involved with any (relatively inexpensive) DVD player, primarily choosing between having MB'ing or not passing BTB.

Not passing BTB seems to me to be a killer; wouldn't this negate all the 'detail in dark scenes' that the 10,000 :1 CR of the 1080p sets has made possible? I would find this unacceptible.

I have a Denon 2910 with my hlp6163 and do (on relatively rare occasions) notice MB'ing; but I have not noticed it often enough for it to be a serious problem. It passes BTB with ease, and has overall outstanding PQ. I was concerned, however, about UCSB's report of very poor results with a Denon 3910 and an xx78 set at Magnolia. But then tonydeluce seems to think his 3910 does quite well with his 1080p set (though I believe he is going to replace it with a Pioneer Elite).

It will, of course, be very helpful to get more 'data' from those of you with these new sets, but it looks like it's going to be a very personal choice (as most of these things ultimately seem to be) about which defects they find least objectiionable.

The 3910 works great with the 6168 but there are a few scenes on a few
DVDs where the MB is very apparent. If the Pioneer 59avi does not give me
the same ballpark PQ as the 3910 I will definitely live the MB from time to time.
I also don't see it as a serious problem but after spending all this money on
a TV I have no problem spending just a little more to achieve perfection.

Not passing BTB will not negate all the shadow detail but may possible clip
some detail if not properly set up. If you set your DVD player up per the THX
instructions you should still get a very nice pictrure with very minimal clipping.

i thought the thx instructions where for that particular movie?

i thought the thx instructions where for that particular movie?

It is. You can also find BTB general test patterns on the Digital Video Essentials
DVD.

The 3910 works great with the 6168 but there are a few scenes on a few
DVDs where the MB is very apparent. If the Pioneer 59avi does not give me
the same ballpark PQ as the 3910 I will definitely live the MB from time to time.
I also don't see it as a serious problem but after spending all this money on
a TV I have no problem spending just a little more to achieve perfection.

Not passing BTB will not negate all the shadow detail but may possible clip
some detail if not properly set up. If you set your DVD player up per the THX
instructions you should still get a very nice pictrure with very minimal clipping.

Really looking forward to your report on how the Pio Elite does compared to the 3910. But I don't understand your last paragraph about BTB and shadow detail. Seems to me that if the player can't resolve those last few 'black bars' in the pluge pattern (I use DVE to set black and white levels), then it must not be able to resolve these features in actual scenes. ?? (But I'm certainly not expert in these matters.)

Some posts back I reported a "white dot" (stuck pixel) problem. Well I called Samsung and they are sending someone tomorrow to look at it (fantastic customer service!). They think there is definitely something wrong and based on past experience I won't be surprised if they install a new light engine. My only concern is that since the 1080p sets are so new, the service rep won't have a 1080p light engine, or worse, he'll put in a 720p light engine!

Really looking forward to your report on how the Pio Elite does compared to the 3910. But I don't understand your last paragraph about BTB and shadow detail. Seems to me that if the player can't resolve those last few 'black bars' in the pluge pattern (I use DVE to set black and white levels), then it must not be able to resolve these features in actual scenes. ?? (But I'm certainly not expert in these matters.)

BTB is a "margin" space that does not transmit picture info and is not meant to
be seen by the eye. Having a DVD player that transmits BTB gives you some
"breathing" space to avoid clipping of data that was meant to be seen.

From a number of posts above it seems clear that there is going to be some compromise involved with any (relatively inexpensive) DVD player, primarily choosing between having MB'ing or not passing BTB.
...

It will, of course, be very helpful to get more 'data' from those of you with these new sets, but it looks like it's going to be a very personal choice (as most of these things ultimately seem to be) about which defects they find least objectiionable.Well said ... couldn't agree more. Point well taken on the lack of BTB limiting shadow detail ... I probably would trade for BTB with MB if the MB wasn't too noticeable in most circumstances, but I need to learn more first. Thanks for the opinions on the 2910 ... I'll spend some time (to my wife's dismay, I'm sure :)) reviewing my options for a player before deciding what to do with my 950.

Get the 6/28 firmware on there. Use the DVI button on the remote to switch modes. 1080i works wonderful with the Oppo. I've watched 3 or 4 films now on the 6168 and it's so good, I forget I'm not in the theater. My wife likes the Harry Potter films (which can be extremely dark at times), and I'm really really impressed with the Oppo/Samsung output.

Note that I was getting large lip sync delay if I used HDMI via input 1, but HDMI via input 2 seems to reduce the delay to unoticable amounts.

Your our first OPPO reviewer. Are you seeing any macroblocking? Macroblocking would appear like video noise. It might vary by scene or DVD. You shouldn't have any problem seeing it based on results from Denon 3910 and Panasonic S97S. If you have Star Wars: Attack of the Clones, it will bring out any problems.

Your our first OPPO reviewer. Are you seeing any macroblocking? Macroblocking would appear like video noise. It might vary by scene or DVD. You shouldn't have any problem seeing it base on results from Denon 3910 and Panasonic S97S. If you have Star Wars: Attack of the Clones, it will bring out any problems.

The oppo uses the same Faroudja as the 3910 so will definitely produce MB but
the question is how much. Alledgedly the 3910 has done one of the best
jobs so far in minimizing the MB ( 2910 isn't that bad either ) from the Faroudja chip
so it will be interesting to hear hear darkmarks comments in this regard.

No problem. I enjoyed learning what the 950 can and can't do. Bummer if the Oppo does indeed have MB (assume it's using Faroudja) ... would have considered it as an alternative to the 950, but I'd rather not pass BTB than have MB. I need to spend some time in the DVD forum. ;)


BTB means? Black-to-black? Which is what?

And what is MB? microblocking? What artifact does this cause?

BTB means Blacker than Black.

I'm new here on AVS (and loving the info) What I was wondering is I'm interested in the Samsung 5078 -

- Do y'all have any suggestions on the best place to purchase it?

- Are the warranty's really worth purchasing?

Dave

Has anyone with HTPC tried to get 1:1 Pixel mapping without the overscan?
This is also a big issue for me since I will be using the TV as a big monitor.
People with HTPC... Please help. :(


Hi all, I have been a longtime lurker forever it seems....even back when we were waiting for the HLP's. I have gained an unbelievable amount of knowledge from all the posters so thanks for that.

I am getting ready to purchase soon and had a question for the HTPC folks that already have the 6168W. Has anyone got 1080p 1920 X 1080 VGA working without any underscan/overscan and still retain 1:1 pixel mapping. This is a big issue for me and if it would not be able to be worked out I would probably drop down to the 6167 at 720p with no overscan/underscan. I saw some of the screenshots someone posted and to me that is not acceptable. I will be using Windows Media Center 2005 and and Nvidia 7800GTX.

Also just for the HTPC needs if I wasn't happy and dropped the resolution on the HTPC down to 1280 X 720 and use HDMI or VGA to the TV, the 6168 would scale that to 1080, yes this isn't the best soloution I know but if it would get around the overscan/underscan issues then it may be an option for me, and I would still have High Quality PQ for my other sources. Has anyone tried this?

I'm new here on AVS (and loving the info) What I was wondering is I'm interested in the Samsung 5078 -

- Do y'all have any suggestions on the best place to purchase it?


Dave

I think it would be hard to beat TVA's Power Buy, from both price and service. You can find tons of info about it in this forum.

3)When tv is turned off I see an oval white area in the lower middle part of the screen. It is around 12 inch high and 5 inch wide. Not visible when the tv is on?? Is it normal or defective??

I'd wager you have an overhead light that is in the center of the room, right? The light from an overhead light often creates an odd internal reflection pattern that can look like what you describe when the TV is off. You won't see it when the TV is on since the light the TV emits is brighter than the reflections.

I have posted the picture of the tv with the white area in the lower middle part of tv (when it is off) on yahoo photo. Does anyone have the same whitish area on the screen?

http://photos.yahoo.com/gondalguru

After about three days or so I finally got all of the data in the TV guide... I am using Comcast as my cable provider... What picture mode are you running the TV in ? I found that when running it in standard (default) mode that pixelation and artifacts were pretty apparent... Switching to movie mode helped out a lot with this.. If you are using your PC for dvd play back you may want to play with FFDShow and play with some of the noise reduction filters.


I have been using Movie mode and I agree, it does help but some stuff is just plain ugly. I am using the PC for dvd playback. I tried to use ffdshow last night but it just caused SageTV to crash. I'll see if I can't find another build that works.

Has anyone with HTPC tried to get 1:1 Pixel mapping without the overscan?
This is also a big issue for me since I will be using the TV as a big monitor.
People with HTPC... Please help. :(

Check some of the posts in this thread. You will have to set up a custom resolution to get 1:1 Pixel mapping with no overscan.

Is it such where you can take a picture of it and post it??
I have posted the picture of the tv with the white area in the lower middle part of tv (when it is off) on yahoo photo. Does anyone have the same whitish area on the screen? Not visible when tv is on.

http://photos.yahoo.com/gondalguru

Has anyone with HTPC tried to get 1:1 Pixel mapping without the overscan?
This is also a big issue for me since I will be using the TV as a big monitor.
People with HTPC... Please help. :(

I was able to get 1:1 pixel mapping at 1920x1080 using the adjustment provided in the ATI catalyst center and also the adjustments in the TV. My PC crashed yesterday and everytime I reboot, the resolution gets reset to 1600x1200 as the catalyst center reports that the montior attached (in this case the TV) supports only up to that resolution. Also, when I was adjusting the screen using the catalyst center, the PC crashed! So, I did not mess with it yesterday. I will try it again today and post pictures, if possible.

Has anyone with HTPC tried to get 1:1 Pixel mapping without the overscan?
This is also a big issue for me since I will be using the TV as a big monitor.
People with HTPC... Please help. :(

I have tried by shrinking the screen size in the PC Wide mode settings but was unable to achieve 1:1. I use it at it's maximum size which appears to be 1:1 but I don't mind the overscan.

I have posted the picture of the tv with the white area in the lower middle part of tv (when it is off) on yahoo photo. Does anyone have the same whitish area on the screen? Not visible when tv is on.

http://photos.yahoo.com/gondalguru

That's a tough one. Does it only appear during the day??

Have you gotten that HMDI 2 button to actually switch your TV's input to HDMI 2? If so, did you program that button with a discrete code and if you did could you post the code. I haven't been able to get a code for HDMI 2.

The Harmony remotes work fine not having the discrete code for the HDMI 2 input.

Basically, you change the source input remote type to "Direct" and couple HDMI 1 + NextInput commands to make it go direct to HDMI 2.

Call Harmony for assistance. They need to hear that we need the HDMI 2 discrete code in their database.

It works perfectly on my HLR5668.

The Harmony remotes work fine not having the discrete code for the HDMI 2 input.

Basically, you change the source input remote type to "Direct" and couple HDMI 1 + NextInput commands to make it go direct to HDMI 2.

Call Harmony for assistance. They need to hear that we need the HDMI 2 discrete code in their database.

It works perfectly on my HLR5668.

Although a decent option and one I have used on my Pronto, it's not perfect. It's not so much of a concern for me anymore because I'm using the Anynet feature which accomplishes what I want, however, at some point it would be nice to get the discrete for HDMI 2.

Your our first OPPO reviewer. Are you seeing any macroblocking? Macroblocking would appear like video noise. It might vary by scene or DVD. You shouldn't have any problem seeing it based on results from Denon 3910 and Panasonic S97S. If you have Star Wars: Attack of the Clones, it will bring out any problems.


Now this is where things get complicated: Not every screen will display MB to the same extent, and on some screens it will be completely invisable, and on some screens it is so bad as to be unwatchable. Digital projection displays seem to show the problem the least (which is why there are so many DLP owners who have no idea what MB looks like), and phospher based displays (ie, CRT and plasma) seem to be the worst for it. Also, different tweakings of the chip (the FLI23xx series are very adjustable) can make the problem more or less apparent.


(I hope you don't mind me snagging a bit of your post carled).

I didn't notice any in the shows that I've viewed so far. I'll have to really watch for it now. But I suspect the DLP ignorance point up there is correct.

I have posted the picture of the tv with the white area in the lower middle part of tv (when it is off) on yahoo photo. Does anyone have the same whitish area on the screen?

http://photos.yahoo.com/gondalguruI had something similar to that with my HLN567 it was almost center in the screen looked like a oval light spot...once I moved it...it was pretty much gone...try moving it in a different location...see what happens.

Your cotention that NO plasma has a good a PQ as the 5668 seems to fly in the face of many reviews, and vitually every store saleperson I have ever discussed this with. A good plasma looks better than any of the micro-display televisions that I have seen. I own a Sony GWIV, so don't think I am a plasma freak..lol. When I go to stores, the better plasmas are clearly superior to the RPTV's all of all types. For what it is worth, Consumer Reports latest TV issue confirms that in the ratings also. Please note that I am not bashing the new Samsung. It has a great picture, and is probably the best RPTV out there at this time. In 50 inch size though, I would still contend that a $4000.00 retail plasma is superior. If you want/need a bigger TV, go for a good DLP, or LCD projection. The other isssue is whether or not the 1080P is worth the premium over the 720P models. The DLP's with the HD2+ chip have a great picture too, at a substantially lower cost.
I suppose there are a lot of variables so everybodys mileage varies. I for one site 8 feet from my 5668W. At that distance on all the 50" plasmas the SDE and resolution are an issue for me. Perhaps with a smaller mask and 1080 lines a plasma would look better. We will have to wait to see. None the less for what I see in all the retail stores today, I stand by my comment at my viewing distance. YMMV of course.

I had something similar to that with my HLN567 it was almost center in the screen looked like a oval light spot...once I moved it...it was pretty much gone...try moving it in a different location...see what happens.

It is probably just internal reflections from the room light when the TV is off. My Sony GWIV does exactly the same thing, and I have seen these comments on Samsungs also. Don't worry about it. If the TV looks fine when on, you have no problem.

I've spent the weekend messing with my 6168 that arrived on Friday. I watched a few DVDs and quite a few movies on DirecTV - all on my HTPC connected via VGA to the TV. Perhaps my eyes became more "critical" the more time I spent watching, but I do notice digital artifacts on many of the DVDs and all of the SD content - it's starting to bug me. The only HD content I have currently is one OTA channel. This signal strength meter, in the TV menu system under Channel, reports 5 bars. The PQ is decent but not overly impressive as I still see digital artifacts and pixelization. Is this to be expected with OTA broadcasts or should I continue questioning my purchase? :/

Has anyone got the TV Guide working? I configured mine but 2 days later, still no data.
Try MOVIE mode and drop the contrast and sharpness another 10 points each.

Our TV Guide works fine. Did you go into the setup mode for it? We don't really use it much and I don't really like it coming up when the set turns on. Have not checked to see if that can be disabled.

I suppose there are a lot of variables so everybodys mileage varies. I for one site 8 feet from my 5668W. At that distance on all the 50" plasmas the SDE and resolution are an issue for me. Perhaps with a smaller mask and 1080 lines a plasma would look better. We will have to wait to see. None the less for what I see in all the retail stores today, I stand by my comment at my viewing distance. YMMV of course.

8 feet on a 56 inch TV is pretty close...I can why a plasma might irritate you with SDE at that distance. I just feel plasmas have a more 3D feeling to the picture, but ALL of these technologies have their plusses and minuses. I am looking forward to seeing more of the 1080P Samsungs before I jump to any conclusion. I feel the pedastal style Samsungs with the HD2+ chip had a pretty awesome picture too. Does any current 50 inch tabletop model Sammy use that chip, or do I have to go with the 1080P model to get a really good pic on a 50 incher?

UCSB and moss, just to make sure I'm going to do one final pass with the HD950 and the THX Optimizer's BTB test, this time with the output set to RGB-Normal. As you said earlier, Normal sends the limited range of 16-235 levels of brightness. Like you, I was originally thinking that using Expand (which sends 0-255) would give me the best results on the 5078.

But I just did a bit of very preliminary reading on BTB for my own edification, and am now wondering if setting the player to send 16-235 instead of 0-255 might allow it to display the BTB values in those margins (0-15 and 236-255). Not sure if Normal will just compress the value range, or if it will actually set black at 16 and send the buffer values below. I'm doubtful, but I'll let you know anyhow.

After that, I'll shut up about the 950 in this thread ... :)

It is probably just internal reflections from the room light when the TV is off. My Sony GWIV does exactly the same thing, and I have seen these comments on Samsungs also. Don't worry about it. If the TV looks fine when on, you have no problem.Yep thats what they were called...internal reflections...had them...was never a problem with me.

The Harmony remotes work fine not having the discrete code for the HDMI 2 input.

Basically, you change the source input remote type to "Direct" and couple HDMI 1 + NextInput commands to make it go direct to HDMI 2.

Call Harmony for assistance. They need to hear that we need the HDMI 2 discrete code in their database.

It works perfectly on my HLR5668.

I did not have to do anything. The harmony website asks what tv, stb, etc, then it downloads all the buttons to the remote. I then delete those I dont need. I just left in the hdmi1 ,hdmi2 etc.

8 feet on a 56 inch TV is pretty close...I can why a plasma might irritate you with SDE at that distance. I just feel plasmas have a more 3D feeling to the picture, but ALL of these technologies have their plusses and minuses. I am looking forward to seeing more of the 1080P Samsungs before I jump to any conclusion. I feel the pedastal style Samsungs with the HD2+ chip had a pretty awesome picture too. Does any current 50 inch tabletop model Sammy use that chip, or do I have to go with the 1080P model to get a really good pic on a 50 incher?

8ft is not at all unreasonably close for a 56" set; the viewing distance/screen diagonal ratio is 1.7, still further away than the 1.5 ratio that is the 'design goal' for HD tv. (A 1.5 ratio would correspond to a viewing distance of 7 ft for this set.) Of course everybody may not like it this close, but that distance is what HD tv was designed for, and these 1080p sets are the first ones good enough to make it practical.

My take on the viewing distance thing is, that if you are wanting it to be like a movie theater, then you want to sit real close; but if you are just 'watching tv', then you don't.

Yep thats what they were called...internal reflections...had them...was never a problem with me.
Thanks guys. I can now stop thinking about it. It looks like internal reflection and I can't see it when i look at the screen from about the horizontal field.

8 feet on a 56 inch TV is pretty close...I can why a plasma might irritate you with SDE at that distance. I just feel plasmas have a more 3D feeling to the picture, but ALL of these technologies have their plusses and minuses. I am looking forward to seeing more of the 1080P Samsungs before I jump to any conclusion. I feel the pedastal style Samsungs with the HD2+ chip had a pretty awesome picture too. Does any current 50 inch tabletop model Sammy use that chip, or do I have to go with the 1080P model to get a really good pic on a 50 incher?

Actually, 8 feet is right in the middle of the range for "Recommended THX viewing distance" (link: http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html ). Yet it is slightly over the "casual viewing" maximum for a 56 inch tv. Funny thing that if the tv is THX quality, sitting 7.5' away would equate to a 61" tv and I know that would be nuts in my apartment.

Not to mention the higher the res the easier it is on the eyes while sitting closer.

Funny thing that if the tv is THX quality, sitting 7.5' away would equate to a 61" tv and I know that would be nuts in my apartment.

As many have said, there's no uniquely 'right' viewing distance; it's all what you like and what you get used to. Many, many people have commented in the Forum about the 'incredibly shrinking tv', about how grossly too large a new 'big screen' looks the first few weeks, and then how normal it looks afterward. That was certainly my experience about a year ago when going from a 10 year old 36" Proscan to the hlp 6163 I got then. And now THAT is beginning to look rather 'ordinary', so that I'm looking forward to stepping up even larger. This primarily because my children are now grown and out of the house, so it's just my wife and me, looking at hd tv (she loves HBO in hd, and I concur, and of course sports are unbelievable in hd) and dvd's. If I had children at home, and thus a more varied tv watching situation, I doubt I would want a screen this large. The great thing about these new 1080p sets is that they make it possible to be 'up close and personal' if that's what you want, and they are also superb at a further viewing distance.

Our TV Guide works fine. Did you go into the setup mode for it? We don't really use it much and I don't really like it coming up when the set turns on. Have not checked to see if that can be disabled.
Yes, I have that disabled. I think it's called something like "Auto Guide" in the TV Guide setup options.

Actually, 8 feet is right in the middle of the range for "Recommended THX viewing distance" (link: http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html ). Yet it is slightly over the "casual viewing" maximum for a 56 inch tv. Funny thing that if the tv is THX quality, sitting 7.5' away would equate to a 61" tv and I know that would be nuts in my apartment.

Not to mention the higher the res the easier it is on the eyes while sitting closer.

Sounds like the THX standard wants people to sit in the front one-third of the theatre..not for me! :) 8 feet is way too close for my taste to watch a 56 inch TV, but if some people like it, that is great. I would get dizzy watching it that close. It is not the pic quality that is a problem..it is the motion issue.