From CNET : "two larger sets: the 55-inch KDF-E55A20 and the 60-inch KDF-E60A20. They include numerous features these models lack, such as picture-in-picture, an extra HDMI input, and 1,366x768 LCD panels."

I don't get how having true 720P quality is a bad thing. Isn't it better than 768 so that there is no scaling involved?
Am I missing something here because I was looking for him to say that true 720p and 1:1 pixel mapping was a great feature :cool: :confused: :confused:

It appears this could be a simple 200 dollar solution to the terrible sound of the new set. I've read many reviews from major mags saying its great. Has anyone here used the ZVOX 315, or know of anyone who has?

BTW, does the 50 in A10 Sony have audio outputs on the rear of the set? If so would I plug the audio cable into the REAR of my TV.........OR.......plug them in the cable STB, and then run the cables directly to the 315?

I too am looking for a cheap, small alternative to sound. My room is too small or a 5 or 6.1, so I was looking for a nice 2 or 3.1 system, or something like the zvox 315.

I'd be interested in hearing anyone's opinion on a nice 2 or 3.1 sys or something in a box. Any thoughts?

From CNET : "two larger sets: the 55-inch KDF-E55A20 and the 60-inch KDF-E60A20. They include numerous features these models lack, such as picture-in-picture, an extra HDMI input, and 1,366x768 LCD panels."

I don't get how having true 720P quality is a bad thing. Isn't it better than 768 so that there is no scaling involved?
Am I missing something here because I was looking for him to say that true 720p and 1:1 pixel mapping was a great feature :cool: :confused: :confused:


Katzmeier is generally a trusted and very competent reviewer. But it's no secret that he has a major — almost blinded — bias toward Samsung DLPs. Those models can do no wrong to him.

I did find the review a bit off putting, since his chief criticism of last year's model was the silver aesthetics and he barely mentioned that vast improvement in this A10. Plus, value is one of the criteria and he didn't even mention what a striking price point it is, while giving better reviews to sets that are thousands more and he claims are over priced.

While I have no vested interest, yes, the review did have a strong whiff of built-in bias.

Katzmeier is generally a trusted and very competent reviewer. But it's no secret that he has a major — almost blinded — bias toward Samsung DLPs. Those models can do no wrong to him.

I did find the review a bit off putting, since his chief criticism of last year's model was the silver aesthetics and he barely mentioned that vast improvement in this A10. Plus, value is one of the criteria and he didn't even mention what a striking price point it is, while giving better reviews to sets that are thousands more and he claims are over priced.

While I have no vested interest, yes, the review did have a strong whiff of built-in bias.


So, who is this Katzmeier? Can you post a link to his review. I have no idea of what your talking about..........unless........its the guy who wrote the CNET review.

I think all of those posts requesting that mysteriously dissapear when owners read these threads :)
They're more interested in how to fix the sound by somehow adding speakers and no receiver. :rolleyes:

They're more interested in how to fix the sound by somehow adding speakers and no receiver. :rolleyes:


Well maybe not "perfect" but Google the "ZVOX 315". I've spent hours last night reseaching it but feel confident enough to buy it sight unseen. It is relatively small, inexpensive, great sound, easy to hookup and.......IS able to let you control sound volume with the Sony remote. There are tons of reviews (very recent ones) on the net about this. Just spend time reading their material. Their website is www.zvoxaudio.com

Well maybe not "perfect" but Google the "ZVOX 315". I've spent hours last night reseaching it but feel confident enough to buy it sight unseen. It is relatively small, inexpensive, great sound, easy to hookup and.......IS able to let you control sound volume with the Sony remote. There are tons of reviews (very recent ones) on the net about this. Just spend time reading their material. Their website is www.zvoxaudio.com

thanks for the info. Looks like a viable solution and a good product....especially w/the 30-day return policy, including refund of shipping costs (you pay only to return).

Well maybe not "perfect" but Google the "ZVOX 315". I've spent hours last night reseaching it but feel confident enough to buy it sight unseen. It is relatively small, inexpensive, great sound, easy to hookup and.......IS able to let you control sound volume with the Sony remote. There are tons of reviews (very recent ones) on the net about this. Just spend time reading their material. Their website is www.zvoxaudio.com

Thanks for your time:
Just ordered mine, base on your research. I have a large sound system for movies but needed something for t.v and didn't want to blow my expensive amps watching local news ext. Now all my sound problems are fixed. I just need the 50a10 to complete everything. :D

Thanks for your time:
Just ordered mine, base on your research. I have a large sound system for movies but needed something for t.v and didn't want to blow my expensive amps watching local news ext. Now all my sound problems are fixed. I just need the 50a10 to complete everything. :D

Keeping in mind that I'm deaf, I find the "TV" sound from the 50a10 quite good.:D

Thanks for your time:
Just ordered mine, base on your research. I have a large sound system for movies but needed something for t.v and didn't want to blow my expensive amps watching local news ext. Now all my sound problems are fixed. I just need the 50a10 to complete everything. :D

Keep us posted on the sound quality.

Widest distance top width 46 5/8"


Thanks for that, but I'm looking for the measurement of the top ledge perpendicular to the screen(from front to back)..... looks to be about 2-3 inches

Lander215 and ANYONE ELSE, on the manual it says the 50in viewing distance should be 6.5 ft and great, so you think or ANYONE ELSE think 7.5 to 8 ft(my distance) is to short of a distance for the 50 or should I go with the 42. I just dont want to regret that I got the 42 and it is too small. Will I lose HD picture quality when watching on the 50 in from my distance.

Also with the 42, CC does not have it in their Warehouse. By the way Lander215, did CC say when they would be getting the 42.

Thanks for that, but I'm looking for the measurement of the top ledge perpendicular to the screen(from front to back)..... looks to be about 2-3 inches

2 3/8" including the front picture frame (1/2")

How's the cable tv picture on the Sony 42inch A10?
1. HD
2. SD
3. analog

Do we have the Pixel Response time for this unit or the contrast ratio??
Also, do these tv's have PIP?

Lander215 and ANYONE ELSE, on the manual it says the 50in viewing distance should be 6.5 ft and great, so you think or ANYONE ELSE think 7.5 to 8 ft(my distance) is to short of a distance for the 50 or should I go with the 42. I just dont want to regret that I got the 42 and it is too small. Will I lose HD picture quality when watching on the 50 in from my distance.

Also with the 42, CC does not have it in their Warehouse. By the way Lander215, did CC say when they would be getting the 42.

Well, I was originally going to get the 42a10 since a 42" HDTV makes a 32" SDTV when in that mode and I currently have a 32" normal TV. But, after looking at last year's models in stores I decided I'm gonna go with the 50." My viewing distances are 8.5-9.5 feet so a 50" is supposed to be the right size. But more importantly I went and looked at last year's models in the stores, and I would get right up in front of the 50" - at about 3-4 feet - and still thought the picture looked good. At one store I also tuned in SD broadcasts and thought the picture looked as good as my current TV. Finally, since I plan on buying the set from a local B&M store (probably Sears) I'll just take advantage of the 30 day "happiness is guaranteed" return policy and return the 50" and go with the 42" if I find the 50" too big.

This might not help, but I would suggest spending some quality time at a store - even with last year's models or the 55A20 and see what you think.


Mitch

If I do get this Sony 42", it will be sitting on a shelf that is 30 inches high. So the top of the tv would be 60" high. Does that sound like it will be too high.

i just spent 1 hour viewing the 50a10.
i think it is a great set.i was sitting 10 ft away.
saw nothing but a great picture on hd and dvd at tweeter.
but i will say u need 2 be at least 10 ft away.
remote control is easy 2 use. i am getting the 42a10. :)
i am sold!!!

2 3/8" including the front picture frame (1/2")


Awesome!

Thanks
RJ

Those of you who have seen the A10's, does the cabinet angle towards the center of the tv at the rear. And if so how far back on the tv does the cabinet begin to angle back?

Lander215, I ordered the 50 in, but you think that will be too big. I am about 8 ft away from front of tv to where my eye sight would be. Will HD pq be very bad then.

How would you rate this tv to your 42we655, alot better?


Strickly personal opinion.........but sitting 8ft back I would get the 42 inch A10. I sit 13 feet back............we'll be getting the 50 inch in 2 weeks. BTW, when I looked at the 50 inch at 8 ft at Sears I was overwhelmed.....not as sharp as say 13 or 15+ feet back. I hope this helps in your decision.

so why does it say in the owner's manual that 6.5 or more is good for the 50 in. Does anyone know when the 42in will be instock at CC. My 50 in is coming next saturday so I have a few days to decide if I want to stick with the 50 or go with the 42.

Just wanted to report I ordered my 50A10 from crutchfield yesterday. Allegedly 5-7 days for delivery as the TV is coming from Virginia and I'm in California. Just a note though to anyone considering Crutchfield, if you ask them to deal on the TV they can reduce the price by a small but in no way negligible amount just to make the pricing more competitive. They did this for me without haggling at all. Just a thought!

Could someone possibly posted a large picture of the REAR of the 50 A10.
I plan to use the ZVOX 315 external powered speakers. As I understand it you go into the audio (I believe) menu and turn the speakers OFF.........then, you go to "variable" mode which allows you to use the Sony remote to control the volume.

Two questions: exactly where do you run the two plugs RCA jacks, I think which have a single "mini-plug" that goes into input 1 of the 315. Which connect specifically is the "audio-output" jack in the back of the set? Secondly, when I hook the "audio output" to the rear of the 315 will that ALSO carry the audio from the DVD (which is the "PC" output on the back of my Sammy HLN437W) and then bypass the TV speakers then going directly into the 315?

1)You would use the line-out audio rca jacks on the back of the A10. 2)If your DVD audio has a direct input to the A10 (not to a receiver) then audio from the DVD will be output through the 315, not the tv speakers

1)You would use the line-out audio rca jacks on the back of the A10. 2)If your DVD audio has a direct input to the A10 (not to a receiver) then audio from the DVD will be output through the 315, not the tv speakers


Thanks for the response..........however I need to SEE exactly where on the rear of the A10 the "Audio Out" plug is, that's why I asked if someone could post of large picture of the REAR of the set. It is good to hear, as I suspected, that the DVD sound will indeed go directly into the 315.......after, of course being re-channeled from the TV to the 315.

kmil,

I understand that you did not like the sound from the TV. Another poster said they turned on the automatic sound leveling (whatever it is called) and the simulated surround sound, and the sound was much better.

Did you try this too, and still did not like the sound?

I have a 1996 or so plain Sony 32" TV I will be replacing. If the sound is at least as good as this, which I am sure is way below par these days, I will be happy (since I feed through a sound system when watching DVDs anyways).

kmil,

I understand that you did not like the sound from the TV. Another poster said they turned on the automatic sound leveling (whatever it is called) and the simulated surround sound, and the sound was much better.

Did you try this too, and still did not like the sound?

I have a 1996 or so plain Sony 32" TV I will be replacing. If the sound is at least as good as this, which I am sure is way below par these days, I will be happy (since I feed through a sound system when watching DVDs anyways).

Good Points! No, I do not, as of yet, have the TV. I will buy the 50 inch in 2 wks to the day. Secondly, I spent a long time at Sears yesterday fooling around with the Sound option and yes...........the TruSurround XT improved the sound quite a bit. Unfortunately, I heard some (little) rumbling at certain frequencies. This is a "no-no". On the other hand I still feel that a sound consol unit like the ZVOX 315 should considerably improve the sound. Too bad I can't listen to a unit before I buy it so I could hear the TV and the difference with the Zvox 315.

how is gaming with this system for people who have the tv already. is there any lag, how does pq look. I have the xbox system and am wondering how it looks.

Also, how is it connecting from pc to tv. Is it easy. What is the native resolution when you connect the two.

kmil,

I understand that you did not like the sound from the TV. Another poster said they turned on the automatic sound leveling (whatever it is called) and the simulated surround sound, and the sound was much better.

Did you try this too, and still did not like the sound?

I have a 1996 or so plain Sony 32" TV I will be replacing. If the sound is at least as good as this, which I am sure is way below par these days, I will be happy (since I feed through a sound system when watching DVDs anyways).


I did not try it with the auto sound "leveler", however I did try it with the TruSurround XT and the set did sound better. I guess I'll have to try it with the auto sound leveler AND the surround turned on. Thanks!

Any comments on the picture quality of Standard Definition. I have Insight Cable and would be interested in any comments as to the quality of SD, especially on cable and Insight in particular. Thanks!

I'm sorry, but anyone who does not use an external sound system on a $2000 and up HDTV is a borderline moron. Perhaps these people need to be educated in the reason HDTV exists in the first place. 2 words: "home theater". Even a cheap HTIB would be sufficient. What is the purpose of watching a movie with 8 billion lines of resolution if ya can't hear the damn thing?

There doesn't seem to be anyway for me to set the avsforum.com up so that all listings come up with the latest postings FIRST! Any help on this would be appreciated. It seems kinda ridiculous to have to hit "Last" in order to get the latest postings. I didn't know the "proper" place to post this so here I am.

I'm sorry, but anyone who does not use an external sound system on a $2000 and up HDTV is a borderline moron. Perhaps these people need to be educated in the reason HDTV exists in the first place. 2 words: "home theater". Even a cheap HTIB would be sufficient. What is the purpose of watching a movie with 8 billion lines of resolution if ya can't hear the damn thing?

Pardon the pun, but I "hear" you!

Lander215, I ordered the 50 in, but you think that will be too big. I am about 8 ft away from front of tv to where my eye sight would be. Will HD pq be very bad then.Personally I think that sitting twice the diagonal distance from a 720p TV would be fine. Still it does partly depend on your eyesight so you might want to see how well a 50" RP LCD looks to you from that distance.


Sure would be nice if someone with the TV would HOOK UP THEIR PC AND TRY IT FOR US ALREADY... ahem. :rolleyes:Part of the problem is I think may of the people who want this TV for 1:1 pixel mapping are also the people waiting to find out if it can actually do 1:1 pixel mapping. One of those chicken and the egg problems.


I don't get how having true 720P quality is a bad thing. Isn't it better than 768 so that there is no scaling involved?
Am I missing something here because I was looking for him to say that true 720p and 1:1 pixel mapping was a great feature :cool: :confused: :confused:1280x720 is actually better for HDTV but for many reasons it is easy for display manufacturers to hype the benefits of 1366x768. Mainly because it is a bigger number.


Two questions: exactly where do you run the two plugs RCA jacks, I think which have a single "mini-plug" that goes into input 1 of the 315. Which connect specifically is the "audio-output" jack in the back of the set? Secondly, when I hook the "audio output" to the rear of the 315 will that ALSO carry the audio from the DVD (which is the "PC" output on the back of my Sammy HLN437W) and then bypass the TV speakers then going directly into the 315?On page 17 of the user manual, which can be downloaded here (http://www.sonystyle.com/intershoproot/eCS/Store/en/documents/specifications/kdfe42a10_manual.pdf), you can see what the back of the TV looks like. Their is an audio out, which is listed as jack number 8, which you can use for the speaker system.

We really need to test for blurring/smearing/lag on native 60fps 720p sources. I would suggest using some fast sports action on ESPN-HD (make sure the STB is outputting 720p) and the game Soul Calibur II in 720p mode on the Xbox (the only 720p console game that I know is 60fps most of the time).

I'm sorry, but anyone who does not use an external sound system on a $2000 and up HDTV is a borderline moron. Perhaps these people need to be educated in the reason HDTV exists in the first place. 2 words: "home theater". Even a cheap HTIB would be sufficient. What is the purpose of watching a movie with 8 billion lines of resolution if ya can't hear the damn thing?

I think your being a bit harsh calling us "borderline moronic." Now that I've finally saved enough cash to pay for my new tv, I cant hold back. I'm willing to buy cheap sound, if it helps, until I can do it right. In 7 or 8 months, I'll have enough cash for a nice sound sys to boot.

i watch the space shuttle launch at tweeter on the 50a10.
all i can say it was great!!!

There doesn't seem to be anyway for me to set the avsforum.com up so that all listings come up with the latest postings FIRST! Any help on this would be appreciated. It seems kinda ridiculous to have to hit "Last" in order to get the latest postings. I didn't know the "proper" place to post this so here I am.
User CP->Control Panel-> Edit Options (under Settings)-> Thread Display Option->Thread Display Mode

I am hooking my pc up to the E50A10 tonight. I will post details and possibly screenshots of Half Life 2, Battlefield 2, etc.

I think your being a bit harsh calling us "borderline moronic." Now that I've finally saved enough cash to pay for my new tv, I cant hold back. I'm willing to buy cheap sound, if it helps, until I can do it right. In 7 or 8 months, I'll have enough cash for a nice sound sys to boot.

Sorry, was a little harsh, but my point is investing in a HDTV should always include a 5.1 or higher sound system. The speakers on any TV is just an afterthought. Even a basic system will be a huge improvement over the internal speakers of the TV. I'm not just talking about hearing explosions in the rear left or right speakers but diologue will be clearer and more meaningful with a decent center speaker. Heck, i get goosebumps listening to "Iron Chef" on my Harmon Kardon/Polk surround system....LOL.

Just brought home the 50" A10 tonight; Christmas 2005 came a few months early. I was waiting for the 42" , but couldn't wait any longer and I have the room in my ent. ctr. for the 50" after taking off the pocket doors

This puppy is sweet. I am so glad I got the 50". What an awsome HD view. I'm replacing a 36" tube and thought all along the 42" was best for my room and boy was I wrong! My sofas are between 6 & 8ft away and the view is awesome! Even standard cable looks good.

My local B&M retailer had the 50" in stock and the 42" will be in within 10 days. and with only a $300 difference between the two models, my decision was made. Also an added bonus, as a Sony dealer they are currently offering 18 months same as cash!

My best advise for those on the fence whether to go 42" or 50": If you have the room for the 50", go for it because in the world of HDTV, BIGGER is always BETTER! You won't be disappointed

Do we have the Pixel Response time for this unit or the contrast ratio??
Also, do these tv's have PIP?

I'm guessing 8ms-12ms RT and 1500:1 CR.
No PIP but most STB's will do PIP. So, unless you use a CC the PIP feature on a TV is no biggie.

What are STD's ... I mean STB's? -seriously, what are they?

What are STD's ... I mean STB's? -seriously, what are they?

STB = Set Top Box = the converter box from the cable company or satellite service.


Mitch

I am hooking my pc up to the E50A10 tonight. I will post details and possibly screenshots of Half Life 2, Battlefield 2, etc.Very eager to hear the results and just curious but are you planning to hook it up by DVI and/or VGA?

What are STD's ... I mean STB's? -seriously, what are they?

I believe they mean "Set Top Box"

I'm sorry, but anyone who does not use an external sound system on a $2000 and up HDTV is a borderline moron. Perhaps these people need to be educated in the reason HDTV exists in the first place. 2 words: "home theater". Even a cheap HTIB would be sufficient. What is the purpose of watching a movie with 8 billion lines of resolution if ya can't hear the damn thing?

Well, I will take a stab at this (having been rightly accused more than once of being a moron).

When I watch DVDs, I of course pipe the sound through my 5.1 DD system with the 5 speakers and sub-woofer. When I just flip on the tube to watch the news, I do not. Perhaps I should always pipe the sound through the home theater system, but I just cannot be bothered when watching regular TV, and nor can my other family members.

Therefore, the built-in speakers are probably good enough for me. I unfortunately still have not seen (or heard) an A10 yet. Peace.

Personally I think that sitting twice the diagonal distance from a 720p TV would be fine. Still it does partly depend on your eyesight so you might want to see how well a 50" RP LCD looks to you from that distance.


Part of the problem is I think may of the people who want this TV for 1:1 pixel mapping are also the people waiting to find out if it can actually do 1:1 pixel mapping. One of those chicken and the egg problems.


1280x720 is actually better for HDTV but for many reasons it is easy for display manufacturers to hype the benefits of 1366x768. Mainly because it is a bigger number.


On page 17 of the user manual, which can be downloaded here (http://www.sonystyle.com/intershoproot/eCS/Store/en/documents/specifications/kdfe42a10_manual.pdf), you can see what the back of the TV looks like. Their is an audio out, which is listed as jack number 8, which you can use for the speaker system.


Thanks, you are a gentleman and a scholar. Take the rest of the day off!

Well, I will take a stab at this (having been rightly accused more than once of being a moron).

When I watch DVDs, I of course pipe the sound through my 5.1 DD system with the 5 speakers and sub-woofer. When I just flip on the tube to watch the news, I do not. Perhaps I should always pipe the sound through the home theater system, but I just cannot be bothered when watching regular TV, and nor can my other family members.

Therefore, the built-in speakers are probably good enough for me. I unfortunately still have not seen (or heard) an A10 yet. Peace.

Bothered? I guess i'm in the minority, i come home, turn the TV and A/V receiver on by pushing 2 buttons, then watch whatever is on.....then, when it's time for bed i push 2 buttons on the remote again to shut off.

Bothered? I guess i'm in the minority, i come home, turn the TV and A/V receiver on by pushing 2 buttons, then watch whatever is on.....then, when it's time for bed i push 2 buttons on the remote again to shut off.

I agree. I could see how some might not want the entire 5/7.1 on during basic playback due to noise or bass but my system is setup to where I am not annouyed by any excessive bass or loudness. I would never think of having a set of quality speakers and receiver and consider using the 2x15w built in TV speakers. ProLogicII is balanced to make most of the sound come from the center which just makes it sound like true TV. Now if someone had their surround modes setup with alot of filler front/rear content then I could see it sounding like garbage from normal TV, but at the same time that would make for inaccurate DVD playback. Nothing like the volume control to do wonders. My 2cents.

Very eager to hear the results and just curious but are you planning to hook it up by DVI and/or VGA?

OK, first of all I was dlpwanter, but had to change my name after ditching the dlps.

So, I hooked up the pc tonight to mess around. I played some Half Life 2 and Far Cry and took some screenshots. Everything worked fine with the tv and the games looked great. I had the resolution set to 1280 x 720 with a refresh rate of 60 hertz. Here are a few shots.

I have to update some things I had previously posted regarding the E50A10:

Fan sound- I couldn't hear it before because my set was almost completely enclosed in a built in entertainment center. Now, I removed a shelf and I can hear it even from 20 feet away. However, it is not very loud. It sounds like moving air, not whiny or buzzy. With even a very small amount of tv volume I can't hear it at all.

Wide zoom mode- After watching this more, I noticed that the outside edges are stretched more than the middle part, but you don't really notice it.

I said I would try to take some pictures of dark scenes. I tried to take a bunch of pictures of the battle in LOTR- Two Towers, but they didn't turn out to well. Here are a couple for what they are worth. One is a distant shot of the battle scene, and the other is a closeup of orks in the rain.

OK, first of all I was dlpwanter, but had to change my name after ditching the dlps.

So, I hooked up the pc tonight to mess around. I played some Half Life 2 and Far Cry and took some screenshots. Everything worked fine with the tv and the games looked great. I had the resolution set to 1280 x 720 with a refresh rate of 60 hertz. Here are a few shots.

I have to update some things I had previously posted regarding the E50A10:

Fan sound- I couldn't hear it before because my set was almost completely enclosed in a built in entertainment center. Now, I removed a shelf and I can hear it even from 20 feet away. However, it is not very loud. It sounds like moving air, not whiny or buzzy. With even a very small amount of tv volume I can't hear it at all.

Wide zoom mode- After watching this more, I noticed that the outside edges are stretched more than the middle part, but you don't really notice it.


Thanks for the shots. I look forward to actually using a pretty nice HTPC (my first) on it. Right now it just sits on the stand and looks pretty. The 32" Sony CRT is great but not for desktop icons or text. How sharp is normal typing and fonts? Close to computer LCD panels or more like cheaper computer LCD panels that are slightly blurry?? Can't wait, couple more weeks till I get mine.

Just came back from ken cranes in long beach, ca. 50 inch A10 looked amazing over the other sets there. Anyway, i do all my tv watching 6.5 feet away, so i brought a tape measure and i sat down exactly how i would at home at the same distance. Needless to say, the picture quality was awsome at that distance and i it wasn't so big i had to look around and get dizzy for objects moving around the screen. They won't have any in stock till Aug. 18th, but i mentioned to the sales guy about the Sears 10% Friends and family sale and he gave it to me same discount on the spot. so i got the set for 2250, so about 2800 for set and 5 year warranty. Now .. just have to wait for it to be in stock. So being 7 feet away from this set is not a bad thing. Maybe older generation models but this set looks amazing even 4 feet away. Go and try it for yourself and don't deny yourself a bigger set if there is little to no difference in pic quality over the smaller set.

Sorry, was a little harsh, but my point is investing in a HDTV should always include a 5.1 or higher sound system. The speakers on any TV is just an afterthought. Even a basic system will be a huge improvement over the internal speakers of the TV. I'm not just talking about hearing explosions in the rear left or right speakers but diologue will be clearer and more meaningful with a decent center speaker. Heck, i get goosebumps listening to "Iron Chef" on my Harmon Kardon/Polk surround system....LOL.

Ok: I have an expensive sound system to watch movies with, But I don't want my system on when watching basic T.V " news, ext. A few years back I blowed out a receiver, because I used it all the time for every program. I just don't have that kind of money to keep buying replacements. I want good basic sound when watching SD programs. I think I'm like the majority of people that don't watch movies 24/7. Sheech!!! :confused:

Thanks for the shots. I look forward to actually using a pretty nice HTPC (my first) on it. Right now it just sits on the stand and looks pretty. The 32" Sony CRT is great but not for desktop icons or text. How sharp is normal typing and fonts? Close to computer LCD panels or more like cheaper computer LCD panels that are slightly blurry?? Can't wait, couple more weeks till I get mine.


I actually didn't test out any typing...sorry. It is kind of a pain to move everything so maybe I will test later.

Ok: I have an expensive sound system to watch movies with, But I don't want my system on when watching basic T.V " news, ext. A few years back I blowed out a receiver, because I used it all the time for every program. I just don't have that kind of money to keep buying replacements. I want good basic sound when watching SD programs. I think I'm like the majority of people that don't watch movies 24/7. Sheech!!! :confused:

Perhaps i should explain further, i hardly ever watch DVD's, and when i do it's thru the PC. I have Comcast digital cable premium, which includes every station available including 16 hi-def stations. I do a lot of channel surfing so my viewing habits will consist of sports, cable movies, news, just about anything. My STB is connected to my A/V receiver via digital audio out. I have a sub and 5 speakers. When a 5.1 program comes on it automatically picks it up, if i'm watching a non 5.1 program i still get great clear crisp sound even though the program isn't in 5.1. What i don't understand is what you mean by SD programs.......if you are watching "The Last Samurai" on a regular HBO station (non HD) are you saying you are bypassing your expensive sound system and listening to the movie on the crappy internal TV speakers? If you are you should be arrested. As far as blowing out a receiver because you used it all the time is a rediculous statement.

I said I would try to take some pictures of dark scenes. I tried to take a bunch of pictures of the battle in LOTR- Two Towers, but they didn't turn out to well. Here are a couple for what they are worth. One is a distant shot of the battle scene, and the other is a closeup of orks in the rain.

When you say it didn't turn out well do you mean the pictures or the actual TV picture during dark scenes? I guess the better question is how well did the Sony render the dark scenes in LOTR? Where you able to see detail in the clothing?

So, I hooked up the pc tonight to mess around. I played some Half Life 2 and Far Cry and took some screenshots. Everything worked fine with the tv and the games looked great. I had the resolution set to 1280 x 720 with a refresh rate of 60 hertz. Here are a few shots.Terrific news. It looks to me as though the VGA input can do 1:1 pixel mapping. Since I am considering the VGA input for the X-box 360 it was fairly important that it could do that. It will also be nice in case I decide to get a HTPC.


I actually didn't test out any typing...sorry. It is kind of a pain to move everything so maybe I will test later.You have given us a good amount of information and we are quite grateful for that. If you do test again though here is an old test pattern (http://www.marky.com/misc/testpatterns/Digital_TestPattern_ByMark.bmp) that has been used by a lot of AVS members to determine whether a display could do 1:1 pixel mapping. You save the image to your hard drive and than set it as your wallpaper with the tile setting. The test pattern was originally posted here (http://archive.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=90884). Something to note though is that any type of image enhancement can also blur the image. And if you could test both the VGA and DVI inputs it would be most appreciated. Also to get 1:1 pixel mapping with DVI input you might have to change the display area setting, which is found on page 70 of the user manual.


When you say it didn't turn out well do you mean the pictures or the actual TV picture during dark scenes?I am pretty sure that lcd.guy was referring to the pictures. It is pretty hard to get a good picture in a dark room with a normal camera. Also lipcrkr if cobbway doesn't want to use his AV receiver all the time does it really matter? It really isn't something that needs to be argued over since it is a personal preference.

Am I correct in assuming SD means standard digital over CATV or Directv??? I have both Directv and an OTA antenna for my locals and again assume SD only refers to the signal through Direct.

I am picking up my A10 on 8/13 and am somewhat concerned about all the SD pic quality statements. As I watch all local stuff using OTA w/antenna can I again assume that SD pic comments don't apply here???

Thanks

...Am I correct in assuming SD means standard digital over CATV or Directv???...

No, SD is commonly refered to for Standard Definition, or the old non-digital format.

A regular DirecTV receiver will output an analog SD signal, although it is better than non-digital OTA (over the air) since it travelled digitally, and also a digital SD signal (via the component output).

An HD DirecTV receiver can output an HD signal.

If you are picking up ATSC (the new HD digital TV) broadcasts OTA, then this will be the best source you can get at the moment, since it was not reprocessed/recompressed.

The worse current format is the old format OTA signal, or analog cable.

So taking one step further SD doesn't affect me correct as I have D*** thru sony HD-100 HD STB and OTA digital for locals.

So taking one step further SD doesn't affect me correct as I have D*** thru sony HD-100 HD STB and OTA digital for locals.

It only affects you for the non-HD channels on DirecTV (the vast majority of them) and the non-HD channels OTA. If you are in an urban area, you hopefully get all your locals in digital. If you have a VCR or gaming console hooked up, then that is SD too.

DVD players are kind of in-between, since their output is better than SD was. A progressive scan DVD player is a notch above a regular DVD player too, but it still cannot output a signal as good as HD TV.

Man I hope Sears or Circuit City gets this TV in my town soon. If anybody sees it in the Fort Walton Beach, FL area, let me know. Like others here, I'm worried about my viewing distance of 8FT being too short for the 50". I'm probably still going to get it because I surely won't be in an apartment forever.

I'm surprised to see people worried about the speakers. I have a nice home theater system, so I'm only worried about using the speakers for SD channels on cable. I can't imagine the built-in speakers being too bad for that. It's definitely wouldn't shy me away from the TV if the PQ is good.

Owners, keep posting pics! Hopefully I'll be posting my own pics in a month or so. This TV has me excited so far.

I've had the A10 a few days, but am exchanging it for the 60A20. A few observations about the A10: mine had a dead pixel which, while not a big deal for some, is a big deal for me. It's considered "within specifications" by Sony and won't be repaired. The A10 would definitely benefit from a calibration. Although Sony TV's are well-known to push reds, the A10 I received had a very strong red push. Skin colors were way off; reds looked orange. But the biggest surprise for me was, even with the much discussed iris and other video upgrades, the picture did not look as good to me as the picture I get on my calibrated 50-inch Sony WE610.
I know that a "good picture" is subjective, but to my eyes, the A10 doesn't live up to the hype. Perhaps my opinions would be different if I saw the A10 after calibration. YMMV.

I know this is continuing what is really an off-topic discussion, but if the only thing that is keeping you from using your 5.1 system for all TV watching is a need to push extra buttons to turn the AMP on, etc., I recommend getting a programmable remote. I have the Home Theater Master MX-700 and I set it up so that my family members simply push a single button that turns on the necessary components and sets the right inputs and sound modes, etc. (Macros are your friend.)

Just a suggestion,


Mitch

Thanks for the shots. I look forward to actually using a pretty nice HTPC (my first) on it. Right now it just sits on the stand and looks pretty. The 32" Sony CRT is great but not for desktop icons or text. How sharp is normal typing and fonts? Close to computer LCD panels or more like cheaper computer LCD panels that are slightly blurry?? Can't wait, couple more weeks till I get mine.

Here's a tip, if you Windows XP is slightly fuzzy you need to ge into the "display" mode and find "Clear Type". That will sharpen things up substantially, especially the fonts, text, and icons. You'll be blown away by the improvement. My point is that if you did NOT have Clear Type activated before getting the A10 things will be fuzzy and as a result they will probably be VERY fuzzy on the large A10 screen since, of course, the "problem" will only get worse.

If anyone has used or is using the ZVOX 315 to replace the TV speakers please let us know about your experiences........with the new Sony A10 in particular.

;) I said I would try to take some pictures of dark scenes. I tried to take a bunch of pictures of the battle in LOTR- Two Towers, but they didn't turn out to well. Here are a couple for what they are worth. One is a distant shot of the battle scene, and the other is a closeup of orks in the rain.

Those dark pictures look good. What setting do you have your Pro black on. Also I have a canon digital camera and when I take a screen shot I will get a black streak. My question is what shutter speed do you use on your camera to capture the pure picture you have. ;)

Here's a tip, if you Windows XP is slightly fuzzy you need to ge into the "display" mode and find "Clear Type". That will sharpen things up substantially, especially the fonts, text, and icons. You'll be blown away by the improvement. My point is that if you did NOT have Clear Type activated before getting the A10 things will be fuzzy and as a result they will probably be VERY fuzzy on the large A10 screen since, of course, the "problem" will only get worse.

What display mode are you talking about? Is it on the puter or T.V. I'm sorry I'm kind of out of the tech world. I have Xp and went to display and could not find clear type. Thanks ;)

OK, first of all I was dlpwanter, but had to change my name after ditching the dlps.

So, I hooked up the pc tonight to mess around. I played some Half Life 2 and Far Cry and took some screenshots. Everything worked fine with the tv and the games looked great. I had the resolution set to 1280 x 720 with a refresh rate of 60 hertz. Here are a few shots.

I have to update some things I had previously posted regarding the E50A10:

Fan sound- I couldn't hear it before because my set was almost completely enclosed in a built in entertainment center. Now, I removed a shelf and I can hear it even from 20 feet away. However, it is not very loud. It sounds like moving air, not whiny or buzzy. With even a very small amount of tv volume I can't hear it at all.

Wide zoom mode- After watching this more, I noticed that the outside edges are stretched more than the middle part, but you don't really notice it.

Thanks very much for being patient zero.

I have really appreciated all the info people in this forum provide.
I hope to purchase the set early next week, but only having a 27" CRT I will be
the ultimate noobe but will contribute with reviews and pictures too.

Quick questions for the forum, will a center channel speaker be too high if it sits
on top of the TV? Assuming the stand height of 20.25" as the sony stand is, the
center would be 53" high. I will be using the 5.1 system, having mastered the
multiple button pushing... :D

Additionally, is there a big loss of signal quality if everything is pumped through
my Yahama 650 receiver then to the television through component?

I've had the A10 a few days, but am exchanging it for the 60A20. A few observations about the A10: mine had a dead pixel which, while not a big deal for some, is a big deal for me. It's considered "within specifications" by Sony and won't be repaired. The A10 would definitely benefit from a calibration. Although Sony TV's are well-known to push reds, the A10 I received had a very strong red push. Skin colors were way off; reds looked orange. But the biggest surprise for me was, even with the much discussed iris and other video upgrades, the picture did not look as good to me as the picture I get on my calibrated 50-inch Sony WE610.
I know that a "good picture" is subjective, but to my eyes, the A10 doesn't live up to the hype. Perhaps my opinions would be different if I saw the A10 after calibration. YMMV.

Thanks for the info. Relatively speaking, its kind of not fair to compare a calibrated set with a non-calibrated one (you yourself know the major differences!). I too noticed that Sonys always push red -- the XBRs are a little bit better in this regard, but even out of the box they have a tough time.

Report back once you get the A20 in the A20 thread and let us know what you think.

Well, I will take a stab at this (having been rightly accused more than once of being a moron).

When I watch DVDs, I of course pipe the sound through my 5.1 DD system with the 5 speakers and sub-woofer. When I just flip on the tube to watch the news, I do not. Perhaps I should always pipe the sound through the home theater system, but I just cannot be bothered when watching regular TV, and nor can my other family members.

Therefore, the built-in speakers are probably good enough for me. I unfortunately still have not seen (or heard) an A10 yet. Peace.

That is exactly what I do as well and most of my friends too.
Of course we have monthly Morons Annonymous meetings :p

I've had the A10 a few days, but am exchanging it for the 60A20. A few observations about the A10: mine had a dead pixel which, while not a big deal for some, is a big deal for me. It's considered "within specifications" by Sony and won't be repaired. The A10 would definitely benefit from a calibration. Although Sony TV's are well-known to push reds, the A10 I received had a very strong red push. Skin colors were way off; reds looked orange. But the biggest surprise for me was, even with the much discussed iris and other video upgrades, the picture did not look as good to me as the picture I get on my calibrated 50-inch Sony WE610.
I know that a "good picture" is subjective, but to my eyes, the A10 doesn't live up to the hype. Perhaps my opinions would be different if I saw the A10 after calibration. YMMV.


Shite!
That sucks. You honestly think the old 50 inch model was better?
I have been watching the pages closely to see comments like that because the old models are still being sold all over the place here in Toronto with no mention of the A10's coming for a month or more.
If anyone else here feels the same way, let us know.
Thanks

I've had the A10 a few days, but am exchanging it for the 60A20. A few observations about the A10: mine had a dead pixel which, while not a big deal for some, is a big deal for me. It's considered "within specifications" by Sony and won't be repaired. The A10 would definitely benefit from a calibration. Although Sony TV's are well-known to push reds, the A10 I received had a very strong red push. Skin colors were way off; reds looked orange. But the biggest surprise for me was, even with the much discussed iris and other video upgrades, the picture did not look as good to me as the picture I get on my calibrated 50-inch Sony WE610.
I know that a "good picture" is subjective, but to my eyes, the A10 doesn't live up to the hype. Perhaps my opinions would be different if I saw the A10 after calibration. YMMV.

What is a dead pixel and how do you see it. I have always being a Crt ownrer. :eek:

So, I hooked up the pc tonight to mess around. I played some Half Life 2 and Far Cry and took some screenshots. Everything worked fine with the tv and the games looked great. I had the resolution set to 1280 x 720 with a refresh rate of 60 hertz. Here are a few shots.


THANKS for the PC info! I've been lurking here for days waiting for someone to try this.

Did you need to use Powerstrip or any other 3rd party software to get this to work? Or did Windows detect and treat the A10 like a monitor?

-------------------------------------------------------------

Regarding sound, I'm in a similar position as some of you wanting to go a notch better than the TV speakers. If I get the A10, it'll be for the home theater, but the 32" CRT HDTV that I currently have will be moved up to the den, since our old 27" CRT died recently. I was just using TV speakers with the 27", but want to do better when I move the 32" up there. I'm not looking to do a full blown surround sound up there, but want something better than the TV speakers for movies and games. I see some of you mentioning this ZVOX thingy. Looks pretty interesting, I've never heard of it before.

The temporary 19" I have up there now has some really poor audio with a loud hiss, so I had to do something for now. I hooked up my Philips AZ2555, which you can see at Amazon, though it's no longer available.

*waits for laughter to die down*

I know, I know, but it actually sounds good, and I believe I'm going to keep it in place when I move the 32" up there. Built-in sub, RCA audio inputs, USB input, remote control, and portable. I bought it to take with me when we go on vacation. I use the RCA inputs for the XBOX and the USB input for the laptop, and is a big improvement over hotel TV and laptop speakers. Granted, it looks like something you'd see in a 12-year-old's bedroom. There's a similar unit, the Hummer HBB-1000Y MusixStation, that has similar functionality with somewhat better aesthetics. It was much more expensive than the Philips at the time I was buying, but you can find it greatly discounted now. The Philips is discontinued and would be an eBay find. So for some of you wanting the functionality of the ZVOX but not liking the price tag, here's something else to consider, especially if you can hide it behind a pair of A/V cabinet doors and not have to look at it except when it's in use.

Another option would be the Logitech Z-680's, with DD/DTS decoder and multiple inputs. I think I'd buy these before I'd buy the ZVOX, even if I just kept the surround speakers in the A/V cabinet.

What display mode are you talking about? Is it on the puter or T.V. I'm sorry I'm kind of out of the tech world. I have Xp and went to display and could not find clear type. Thanks ;)

On you computer,right click on your desktop and choose properties.
Choose the Appearance tab, click Effects.
In the Effects dialog box, select the 'Use the following method to smooth edges of screen fonts' check box.
Click ClearType in the list.
Click okay or apply

What is a dead pixel and how do you see it. I have always being a Crt ownrer. :eek:
A dead pixel is one that doesn't turn on. It's always dark. A stuck pixel is always one color. They can get stuck to various colors. A pixel stuck to a dark color isn't very noticeable, but one that's stuck to a bright color can be annoying. I had an old 15" CRT monitor with stuck pixels.

OK, first of all I was dlpwanter, but had to change my name after ditching the dlps.

So, I hooked up the pc tonight to mess around. I played some Half Life 2 and Far Cry and took some screenshots. Everything worked fine with the tv and the games looked great. I had the resolution set to 1280 x 720 with a refresh rate of 60 hertz. Here are a few shots.

I have to update some things I had previously posted regarding the E50A10:

Fan sound- I couldn't hear it before because my set was almost completely enclosed in a built in entertainment center. Now, I removed a shelf and I can hear it even from 20 feet away. However, it is not very loud. It sounds like moving air, not whiny or buzzy. With even a very small amount of tv volume I can't hear it at all.

Wide zoom mode- After watching this more, I noticed that the outside edges are stretched more than the middle part, but you don't really notice it.
Ok, in my book, you are officially "The Man". :D The PC shots looks awesome and I can't see much, if any overscan. I assume you hooked it up via the VGA PC input? Looks like our guess was right that it would accept 1280x720p even though the manual didn't list it! Great news. :D

OK, first of all I was dlpwanter, but had to change my name after ditching the dlps.

So, I hooked up the pc tonight to mess around. I played some Half Life 2 and Far Cry and took some screenshots. Everything worked fine with the tv and the games looked great. I had the resolution set to 1280 x 720 with a refresh rate of 60 hertz. Here are a few shots.

I have to update some things I had previously posted regarding the E50A10:

Fan sound- I couldn't hear it before because my set was almost completely enclosed in a built in entertainment center. Now, I removed a shelf and I can hear it even from 20 feet away. However, it is not very loud. It sounds like moving air, not whiny or buzzy. With even a very small amount of tv volume I can't hear it at all.

Wide zoom mode- After watching this more, I noticed that the outside edges are stretched more than the middle part, but you don't really notice it.
What input did you use, VGA or DVI/VGA to HDMI?

What display mode are you talking about? Is it on the puter or T.V. I'm sorry I'm kind of out of the tech world. I have Xp and went to display and could not find clear type. Thanks ;)


I'm not a techie either and know that "Clear Type" is buried in the menus, afterall...........Bill Gates has got to make money too. Do This:

Go to "Control Panel"
then: "Display Properties"
then: "Effects"
then: go to the second line "Use Following Method to Smooth Edges of Screen
Fonts"
FINALLY: Choose "Clear Type"

You will se a SUBSTANTIAL improvement IMHO.........hope this helps. I know the AVS Forum has been VERY helpful to me in the last few years. Hats off to the
powers behind the scenes!

With reference to the poster who asked what SD is.

SD in not analog. Analog is ............ uh, analog.

Digital television is defined by the number of lines of resolution transmitted. When a DIGITAL signal is transmitted with the same number of lines of resolution as the current ANALOG signal, it is referred to by the FCC as a standard definition signal (SD). When the lines of resolution transmitted reach 720 and beyond, it is a high definition signal.

Frequently, people on this forum discuss the picture quality of SD. It becomes anybody's guess as to whether or not they are talking about SD (digital) or analog. Both types of signals are important to a future HDTV purchaser since we will be watching both analog and digital signals for some time to come. Eventually, analog will pass away and SD and HD will be here to stay.

I would love it if everybody would specify if they are talking about analog or standard definition digital when they make their comments. I really, really, really want to know what they are talking about. Surely, it would also be of great benefit to all readers.

i known me and a few others went back and forth looking at last years model and this years model. ithink the new model was better.

OK, I been playing with my new 50A10 all weekend. The girlfriend is getting a little ticked :rolleyes:

I agree with LCD Guys review. The only thing I'll add is the SD looks REALLY good if the signal is decent.

On to computer hook up, I have a GT6800 VC with DVI out. If I input into the TV via DVI to HDMI, the image is too large for the TV. The taskbar is pretty much gone. And when you use the HDMI input you don't many adjustments through Wege Gate. In the manual (pg 82) the WXGA resolution is listed as 1280 X768. I can't seem to get my PC to display this Res. The closed option is 1280 x 720 (aka 720P). I'm still play around with different PC display setting. I will have to say at the moment I'm a little disappointed in the HDMI. I was hoping for a 1:1 pixel ratio.

On the other hand the PC VGA input looks good. The res is set to 1280 x 720. Far Cry, half life, and doom3 look beautiful. The only issue with the PC input is it does not fill the whole screen. I have about a 3/4" black boarded all the way around.

I'm still playing around with the setting and will keep you posted. FYI, the post was done on the tv.

But now the girlfriend is dragging me outside (kicking and screaming).... :eek:

Thanks for the information. How clear is text on it? You can answer when she loosens your leash a bit :p

When you say it didn't turn out well do you mean the pictures or the actual TV picture during dark scenes? I guess the better question is how well did the Sony render the dark scenes in LOTR? Where you able to see detail in the clothing?


I meant the pictures didn't turn out well. The tv looked great and the detail in dark scenes was really good.

...But now the girlfriend is dragging me outside (kicking and screaming)....

Solution: Upgrade girlfriend to higher tech model. :-)

SD can be analog or digital.

I sit corrected. Thanks.

I agree that to eliminate confusion, people should specify SD analog or SD digital.

I *think* most SD complaints in the forums are about SD analog, right?

OK, I been playing with my new 50A10 all weekend. The girlfriend is getting a little ticked :rolleyes:

I agree with LCD Guys review. The only thing I'll add is the SD looks REALLY good if the signal is decent.

On to computer hook up, I have a GT6800 VC with DVI out. If I input into the TV via DVI to HDMI, the image is too large for the TV. The taskbar is pretty much gone. And when you use the HDMI input you don't many adjustments through Wege Gate. In the manual (pg 82) the WXGA resolution is listed as 1280 X768. I can't seem to get my PC to display this Res. The closed option is 1280 x 720 (aka 720P). I'm still play around with different PC display setting. I will have to say at the moment I'm a little disappointed in the HDMI. I was hoping for a 1:1 pixel ratio.

On the other hand the PC VGA input looks good. The res is set to 1280 x 720. Far Cry, half life, and doom3 look beautiful. The only issue with the PC input is it does not fill the whole screen. I have about a 3/4" black boarded all the way around.

I'm still playing around with the setting and will keep you posted. FYI, the post was done on the tv.

But now the girlfriend is dragging me outside (kicking and screaming).... :eek:




I wish you guys would stop all this talk about using the TV for a computer monitor, and tell us what we REALLY want to know...how is the pic quality on HD broadcasts, and DVD playback! :) One person has posted a good review for the TV, and one says the 2004 model was better. That would really suck if the PQ is going backwards on these things! Let's hear more reviews about pic quality. Thanks to all!

Richard Paul- Unfortunately, I don't have a dvi connector to connect my pc to the tv. The next time I hook it up I will test out that image you showed me.

;)

Those dark pictures look good. What setting do you have your Pro black on. Also I have a canon digital camera and when I take a screen shot I will get a black streak. My question is what shutter speed do you use on your camera to capture the pure picture you have. ;)


I have the tv in standard mode with the iris set on 2. I used a Canon Powershot S50 in auto mode with the flash off. So, I don't know what the shutter speed was.

Thanks for the info. Relatively speaking, its kind of not fair to compare a calibrated set with a non-calibrated one (you yourself know the major differences!). I too noticed that Sonys always push red -- the XBRs are a little bit better in this regard, but even out of the box they have a tough time.

Report back once you get the A20 in the A20 thread and let us know what you think.

It seems odd to me that a $2500.00 TV made by a leading electronics company such as Sony needs to be 'calibrated'. Why aren't these things set up correctly at the factory? Is Sony too ignorant to set up their TV's properly in the first place? Doesn't say much for their abilities does it? Does any brand of RPTV get things right straight from the box? I would think Sony would have people competent enough to get things set as close to perfect as possible, but it appears that they don't.

Re: Red push, etc

So, has one of the owners tried to go into the service menu yet? Check out the threads for last year's model to see if the old button sequence will still let you in.

You can start by looking here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=331875

Ok, in my book, you are officially "The Man". :D The PC shots looks awesome and I can't see much, if any overscan. I assume you hooked it up via the VGA PC input? Looks like our guess was right that it would accept 1280x720p even though the manual didn't list it! Great news. :D


Thanks! The games looked really good. I used the vga connector. The pictures don't really do them justice. I verified that it was set to 1280 x 720 for the games.

For the other person, I didn't need to use any special software to get it to work. Windows XP picked it up fine.

dont dismiss Sony so much, all brands will have a tv now and then that has it problems. I am excited to receive this tv, and everyone shouldn't blast it because one person had a problem. I guarantee if that person replaces it with another A10, his review maybe alot different.

Thanks Jeeper78. I meant to say a stuck pixel, not a dead one. It was stuck on green, and is very noticeable.

It seems odd to me that a $2500.00 TV made by a leading electronics company such as Sony needs to be 'calibrated'. Why aren't these things set up correctly at the factory? Is Sony too ignorant to set up their TV's properly in the first place? Doesn't say much for their abilities does it? Does any brand of RPTV get things right straight from the box? I would think Sony would have people competent enough to get things set as close to perfect as possible, but it appears that they don't.

They're set up correctly at the factory to look good next to other manufacturer's competing sets, which are also set up correctly at THEIR factories to look as good as possible in the typical overlit BB or CC showroom where most people will be judging the sets. Sony would have to be ignorant of how the typical buyer chooses a TV to set them up any differently; in a showroom, a brighter display usually looks better and attracts more customers. This is how all the major manufacturers set up their sets, so there's no basis for slagging of on Sony for doing it too. They don't want to sacrifice sales by trying to calibrate the sets for a home environment rather than a sales environment, and to do so would be pointless anyway, because it's impossible to calibrate for each individual viewing environment where the set may eventually end up. The proper setup for one person's near-dark home theater room is very different than the setup for another person's bright, window-filled living room. Rather, I think it's odd to spend $2500 on a TV and then be peeved about putting a little time in to adjust the TV to your own environment and viewing preferences.

If you want something to complain about, though, you should complain about the crappy viewing environment that stores like BB and CC put these TVs in in the first place, which don't come close to resembling ANYONE's home. It's impossible to judge these sets accurately in their showrooms.

Just got back from my local Sears store in CT..what a waste of time. Guy had no idea about the set or even how to check when it would be available (he used the online site to find its availability). Plus, lousy showroom setup..proj sets where high up on shelves each set sitting on their own shelf. If you were 7 ft tall it would be a perfect display height. They put the plasmas at a much lower level. What a store... only 50 miles from NYC...you think I was in the wilderness. They knew nothing. CC and Best Buy probably are also in the dark. This area seems to be the last to get anything...don't know why, either.

Anyone have any idea how I might take advantage of the Sears Friend's and Family discount while out of town? I'll be in San Diego from the 10th to the 15th. Can I order early at my own local store, and then call up for a price adjustment? Or order from a Cali store, and specifiy delivery to my home address?

It appears from the posts on http://www.retail-worker.com/forum/about4236.html where some Sears employees apparently lurk that the Sears August Friends & Family sale will be by invitation only and not open to just anyone who happens to walk in off the street. If true, major bummer. :(

I wish you guys would stop all this talk about using the TV for a computer monitor, and tell us what we REALLY want to know...how is the pic quality on HD broadcasts, and DVD playback! :) One person has posted a good review for the TV, and one says the 2004 model was better. That would really suck if the PQ is going backwards on these things! Let's hear more reviews about pic quality. Thanks to all!

Careful! Careful! It's comments like these that are going to confuse people....remember, the poster has a CALIBRATED 2004 WEGA and was comparing it to a NON CALIBRATED 2005 WEGA....there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE IN PICTURE QUALITY WITH CALIBRATION....

Thank you :D

Went to Sears, Best Buy and a local (Rhode Island) electronics place. Both Sears and Best Buy's displays were basically ripped apart... many open spots for TVs. Both of those places indicated new TV's were coming in weekly. Only the Sears guy knew exactly what I was talking about. In fact, I'd say the Sears guys were all better informed than any of the other stores... speaking of which, at the local place when I asked about the 42 LCD projection, the sales guy took me right to the 46 inch CRT projection. Nice. But he did say that they get all their new stock for Christmas arrives by the end of Sept. Can't say I knew that before. Still not very helpful.

I wish you guys would stop all this talk about using the TV for a computer monitor, and tell us what we REALLY want to know...how is the pic quality on HD broadcasts, and DVD playback! :)

I'm with you on this one! I'm surprised about how many people are using it for a computer monitor!

Just got back from my local Sears store in CT..what a waste of time. Guy had no idea about the set or even how to check when it would be available (he used the online site to find its availability). CC and Best Buy probably are also in the dark. This area seems to be the last to get anything...don't know why, either.

I'm in the same situation. At Sears, Best Buy, and Circuit City in my local area, you practically have to pull up the Sony web site and show them the TV before they comprehend what you're talking about. Plus, I called several stores to ask if they had it. Sears in particular was like "yeah, we definitely have that one." I got there and lo and behold it was a 2004 model.

I might end up taking a trip to Orlando next weekend just to see this TV and decide if I want to buy it.

I'm with you on this one! I'm surprised about how many people are using it for a computer monitor!

I'm just testing it for other people. I won't ever use it as a computer monitor. ;)

As far as HD quality goes...I haven't ever seen one that looked this good. Granted, that is comparing it to tvs mainly in stores with whatever feeds they show...but I have looked at hundreds.

I'm with you on this one! I'm surprised about how many people are using it for a computer monitor!

Why the surprise? It offers a VGA input, so it's clearly intended for this use, so why wouldn't we talk about it?. Naturally, people looking for a large screen monitor are going to have an interest in this unit. There's plenty of discussion here about SD, HD, and DVD content as well, which is great, because I'm going to be using this unit for all this.

I've been looking at a couple 37" flat panel LCDs, but haven't been able to bring myself to drop ~$2K on a unit with (1) a screen that small, and (2) not that great PQ for anything other than PC input. The new A10's are in the same price range, are bigger, and from what I read here will have great PQ for movies, consoles games, and PC use. This is perfect for me, just what I've been looking for. DVD via HDMI, PC via VGA, and consoles via component.

If one of my local stores doesn't get this soon, I'm going to break down and order it online.

I'm with you on this one! I'm surprised about how many people are using it for a computer monitor!

Most of us are not using it as a "computer monitor". We are using it as an HTPC. My PC is integrated with the TV and the surround sound. I don't surf the internet on the TV, i have a 19" LCD computer monitor for that. What i do is play DVD's and PC games thru the computer. The PC DVD software is so much better than a stand alone DVD player, lots more options. Same with gaming, XBOX and PS2 are no match for PC gaming. So an HTPC (home theater personal computer) immerses you into an entertainment complex. Without getting off the sofa i can play Half Life 2 in hi-def widescreen 5.1, pop in a DVD, or just watch hi-def TV all from the sofa. The whole idea of a large HDTV is to take advantage of the technology. This is why i call out people who mostly use the TV speakers or use the TV just for DVD's etc. And i haven't even begun to touch upon the fact that an HTPC gives you many more options even if you don't play games or if you use a stand alone DVD player. Just visit the HTPC forum to learn more.

Careful! Careful! It's comments like these that are going to confuse people....remember, the poster has a CALIBRATED 2004 WEGA and was comparing it to a NON CALIBRATED 2005 WEGA....there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE IN PICTURE QUALITY WITH CALIBRATION....

Thank you :D

Are you saying that it has to be calibrated thru the service menu? If so most people need to know it might void the warranty or screw up everything if they don't use a back up. Otherwise the poster is returning the TV due to a dead pixel. You can't tell me this poster didn't try to calibrate this TV to the best possible picture and decide to return it. This negative review bothers me, he didn't see any improvement with the CBP, which is a dealbreaker for a lot of us, otherwise we would have bought the old WE series. This TV needs to be a lot better than the WE. The CBP is about 2 1/2 years old, used on the 70XBR series so it's been around for awhile.
The Philips 9630 plasma is about the same price as the 50A10, plasmas are coming down in price and plasmas give better blacks. Waiting for some more reviews.

Are you saying that it has to be calibrated thru the service menu? If so most people need to know it might void the warranty or screw up everything if they don't use a back up. Otherwise the poster is returning the TV due to a dead pixel. You can't tell me this poster didn't try to calibrate this TV to the best possible picture and decide to return it. This negative review bothers me, he didn't see any improvement with the CBP, which is a dealbreaker for a lot of us, otherwise we would have bought the old WE series. This TV needs to be a lot better than the WE. The CBP is about 2 1/2 years old, used on the 70XBR series so it's been around for awhile.
The Philips 9630 plasma is about the same price as the 50A10, plasmas are coming down in price and plasmas give better blacks. Waiting for some more reviews.

Yea I am most definitely referring to service menu settings. Proper calibration does NOT void your warranty. Opening the cabinet and snipping wires does, as that is to be expected. And yes, obviously you need to write down all your settings. Quite frankly the calibration DVDs only get you about 80-85% of the way there -- which is pretty good, but I'd rather spend the extra $150 and get a pro to do it whom has a expensive color analyzer amongst other little goodies in their toolchest....

We do not know if the poster tried to calibrate the TV or not. Sounds to me like h didn't, because he said he was comparing the set to his calibrated one. We do not know if the poster had his WEGA IV professionally calibrated or if he did it on his own. Maybe he'll chime in and we can determine better what happened.

It's one review, and while I respect the review I don't really think much of it since it wasn't a fair comparison. If both sets were calibrated using similar equipment than I would certainly raise my eyebrows a bit...

Have you ever had your TV calibrated? You definitely need to. There is a night and day difference, especially on black levels.

I just got back from Soundtrack, ( UE in Colorado) picked up the 50A10 for 2,249.00. Got a nice 2 level glass and black lacquer stand for $299.00. A great day's shopping. Now I have to wait for Aug 3rd for the LCD but that will give us time to re-arrange things, get rid of the 57" RPTV and run cables further down the wall.

I'm a happy camper, the floor model was outstanding. The audio is not an issue, going into the av receiver anyhow. But I did crank it up on the floor and it wasn't all that bad. Now bad audio has to be the sound coming from my LCD Apex 30" display in the bedroom. That is terrible...............
I played with the iris control and actually thought it looked best at setting 1. But I guess that all depends on the room lighting etc. Folks I agonized between this and the 55A20 for over an hour. Never thought I'd say this but I'm willing to give up a few inches for better PQ. Anyhow, my room isn't that large and I think the 50 will be a better fit.

I'm thinking of getting the cable card instead of the STB Moxi. Have to see how the OTA looks with antenna, but that can wait until we get the rest of the HD broadcasts into the area. Right now we only have Fox and CBS. I'll also be testing the HDMI with the Sammy DVD. More later.

Once someone does get the E50A10 calibrated, or if you just know what you are doing, please post your settings.

Just wait for the UMR thread. :)

Any of you considering the new Oppo Upconverting DVD player that everyone is talking about these days? Seems to be the cat's meow for $200.

I am. If anyone hooks an Oppo up to an A10, please let us know how it works out.

I just got back from Soundtrack, ( UE in Colorado) picked up the 50A10 for 2,249.00. Got a nice 2 level glass and black lacquer stand for $299.00. A great day's shopping. Now I have to wait for Aug 3rd for the LCD but that will give us time to re-arrange things, get rid of the 57" RPTV and run cables further down the wall.


Please let us know what you think once you get this...especially what you think of non-HD cable. I'm trying to decide if I should return my 55-A20 for a 50-A10 because non-HD cable looks terrible on most channels. While it might be something with my individual TV rather than just another of the same TV I think I'd be happier with the A10 due to the iris & it's a little smaller (I think 50" would be better for my situation).

I am. If anyone hooks an Oppo up to an A10, please let us know how it works out.

I picked up the Oppo about a week ago and am expecting to get the 50A10 delivered early this week. Excited to see how everything turns out.

I was going to wait for the Sears F&F sale (which may or may not be open to the public), when I came across a great price online. I won't mention the price here, but check Amazon.com ;)

Aaaaiaihgh. I can't believe after 4 months of shopping I finally pulled the trigger.

I was going to wait for the Sears F&F sale (which may or may not be open to the public), when I came across a great price online. I won't mention the price here, but check Amazon.com ;)

Aaaaiaihgh. I can't believe after 4 months of shopping I finally pulled the trigger.


I checked with friend at local Sears the F&F sale IS.........repeat......IS indeed open to the public. They have promised me I'd get 10% off the current price (whatever it is) on the date 8/14 of the sale. End of story. Its just not publicly advertised.

I went to Tweeter in Cary NC yesterday. They said they had the 50" in the store but they hadn't had a chance to set it up yet. They said it would be on display today or tomorrow. Anyone seen an A10 it the Raleigh Area?

The Tweeter in Raleigh said that it wouldn't be in until 8/12 and set up a few days later.

What is a dead pixel and how do you see it. I have always being a Crt ownrer. :eek:Pixels on LCDs can sometimes be stuck or dead, which at normal viewing distance it not usually noticeable. The number of affected pixels depends greatly on the quality and resolution of the LCD panels being used. It is not uncommon though to get 1 or 2 dead/stuck pixels on a 720p RP LCD. Especially since if you think about it the number of pixel elements is three times the resolution of the display.


On to computer hook up, I have a GT6800 VC with DVI out. If I input into the TV via DVI to HDMI, the image is too large for the TV. The taskbar is pretty much gone. And when you use the HDMI input you don't many adjustments through Wege Gate. In the manual (pg 82) the WXGA resolution is listed as 1280 X768. I can't seem to get my PC to display this Res. The closed option is 1280 x 720 (aka 720P). I'm still play around with different PC display setting. I will have to say at the moment I'm a little disappointed in the HDMI. I was hoping for a 1:1 pixel ratio.Something to note is that for HDMI you definitely want to aim for 1280x720 since that is the actual LCD panel resolution. 1280x768 is only allowed for the VGA input to supposedly make it more compatible with some games and programs. As for the overscan on the HDMI input that is fairly typical even with digital displays because of an old problem. Imagine that a cable box is converting analog signals to digital and than sending them out over HDMI/DVI-HDCP. Because cheap analog circuits tend to have problems with the far edges of an image this can cause a wavy or distorted pattern to appear on the edges of a 1:1 pixel mapped display. Display manufacturers did not want to get complaints from people about this issue since it is fairly hard to explain so even digital displays usually have overscan even on the digital inputs. The reason that VGA usually doesn't have overscan is because display manufacturers expect that input to be used for computers.

Now their are still two possibilities for getting 1:1 pixel mapped video over the HDMI input. The first is that their is a "display area" setting for the different inputs that can be found on page 70 of the user manual. This setting may allow for 1:1 pixel mapping with the HDMI input. Besides that their is also the chance that a setting in the service menu may set the HDMI input to 1:1 pixel mapping. Granted I am hoping that it can be done with the display area setting but if you are careful service menus are quite safe to use.


On the other hand the PC VGA input looks good. The res is set to 1280 x 720. Far Cry, half life, and doom3 look beautiful. The only issue with the PC input is it does not fill the whole screen. I have about a 3/4" black boarded all the way around. That is very interesting. Is any part of the screen being cut off such as the taskbar? Also I posted a test pattern here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5962170&&#post5962170) that may help determine if you are getting 1:1 pixel mapping.


Thanks! The games looked really good. I used the vga connector. The pictures don't really do them justice. I verified that it was set to 1280 x 720 for the games.Just curious but does that mean both games natively supported 720x1280 or did you have to edit their settings?


I'm with you on this one! I'm surprised about how many people are using it for a computer monitor!Just to clarify but 1:1 pixel mapping is good for any input source. Whether that source be HTPC, game console, or HD STB all will benefit from it. Also the VGA input can be used not only for computer use but also for the X-box 360.


Are you saying that it has to be calibrated thru the service menu?Almost all TVs need to be calibrated through the service menu regardless of manufacturer. Some service menus though are easier to use than others.


This negative review bothers me, he didn't see any improvement with the CBP, which is a dealbreaker for a lot of us, otherwise we would have bought the old WE series. This TV needs to be a lot better than the WE. The CBP is about 2 1/2 years old, used on the 70XBR series so it's been around for awhile.The reviewer did give a negative review of picture quality compared to his calibrated display but that doesn't mean he didn't see any improvement in contrast ratio. And several reviews have noted that the new model looks better than last year's so I think it is a bit early to jump on that one review. Also the dynamic iris was actually first used in the HS51, while the term CBP was the one that was first used 2.5 years ago. Trust me if Sony had started using the dynamic iris 2.5 years ago than by now every front/rear projector would current have one.


Once someone does get the E50A10 calibrated, or if you just know what you are doing, please post your settings.It may take a few weeks but once someone who is good at calibration gets the TV they will usually post their settings for it.

Please let us know what you think once you get this...especially what you think of non-HD cable. I'm trying to decide if I should return my 55-A20 for a 50-A10 because non-HD cable looks terrible on most channels. While it might be something with my individual TV rather than just another of the same TV I think I'd be happier with the A10 due to the iris & it's a little smaller (I think 50" would be better for my situation).

The iris is cool but I really didn't see that much improvement due to the iris alone. I think the smaller screen size is largely responsible for the improved PQ. After I get this home and calibrated I'll be able to tell more. As far as your poor SD quality, most cable users experience this and find that splitting the coax and bringing it straight into the TV on another input avoiding the cable box altogether is the way to go for now. You'll be switching back and forth on your inputs but the improved PQ will be worth it. You could also try a cable rated signal booster, that has helped in some cases.

The iris is cool but I really didn't see that much improvement due to the iris alone. I think the smaller screen size is largely responsible for the improved PQ. After I get this home and calibrated I'll be able to tell more. As far as your poor SD quality, most cable users experience this and find that splitting the coax and bringing it straight into the TV on another input avoiding the cable box altogether is the way to go for now. You'll be switching back and forth on your inputs but the improved PQ will be worth it. You could also try a cable rated signal booster, that has helped in some cases.


I ordered signal booster from newegg two days ago because it was cheaper than CC. On cc site this had alot of good reviews. Below is the link to newegg and most of you know how to get to CC site. :D

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16833999501

Been lurking here for a few months now. Just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their inputs on the Sony A10s. BTW, this is my first de-virginized post.

So it seems its confirmed that we're getting 1:1 pixel mapping with the VGA input and not so with the HDMI input although this may change if there is a service menu setting to adjust this.

I'm really on the fence between the Sony KDF-E50A10 and the Panasonic PT-52LCX65. It seems with every post the pendulum swings the other way and then back again. The panny RPTV LCD is nice with a few adjustments but it only has one RF input which is a real deal breaker for me. Otherwise, a perfect set.

I was going to wait for the Sears F&F sale (which may or may not be open to the public), when I came across a great price online. I won't mention the price here, but check Amazon.com ;)

Aaaaiaihgh. I can't believe after 4 months of shopping I finally pulled the trigger.
Amazon.com doesn't even have a listing for it... :confused:

Amazon.com doesn't even have a listing for it... :confused:


Here you go;;; Don't look at first price just go to shipping cart and you will see a good price ;) Link below

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000A2K3Y6/qid=1122869764/sr=8-1/ref=pd_bbs_sbs_1/102-6568281-9712131?v=glance&s=electronics&n=507846

Went to Sears, Best Buy and a local (Rhode Island) electronics place. Both Sears and Best Buy's displays were basically ripped apart... many open spots for TVs. Both of those places indicated new TV's were coming in weekly. Only the Sears guy knew exactly what I was talking about. In fact, I'd say the Sears guys were all better informed than any of the other stores... speaking of which, at the local place when I asked about the 42 LCD projection, the sales guy took me right to the 46 inch CRT projection. Nice. But he did say that they get all their new stock for Christmas arrives by the end of Sept. Can't say I knew that before. Still not very helpful.

I feel your pain! I'm in RI too(east bay) and I've looked at local B&M with no success. Sears in Swansea Mall has to one of the worst electronics dept I've seen. Like someone mentioned before all the sets are either on floor level or you gotta be the abominable snowman to be at proper viewing height! Sales critter was clueless. CC not in the system(warehouse) yet. BB....."dunno". :mad: :mad: Will continue to look!

I just got back from Soundtrack, ( UE in Colorado) picked up the 50A10 for 2,249.00. Got a nice 2 level glass and black lacquer stand for $299.00. A great day's shopping. Now I have to wait for Aug 3rd for the LCD but that will give us time to re-arrange things, get rid of the 57" RPTV and run cables further down the wall.

I'm a happy camper, the floor model was outstanding. The audio is not an issue, going into the av receiver anyhow. But I did crank it up on the floor and it wasn't all that bad. Now bad audio has to be the sound coming from my LCD Apex 30" display in the bedroom. That is terrible...............
I played with the iris control and actually thought it looked best at setting 1. But I guess that all depends on the room lighting etc. Folks I agonized between this and the 55A20 for over an hour. Never thought I'd say this but I'm willing to give up a few inches for better PQ. Anyhow, my room isn't that large and I think the 50 will be a better fit.

I'm thinking of getting the cable card instead of the STB Moxi. Have to see how the OTA looks with antenna, but that can wait until we get the rest of the HD broadcasts into the area. Right now we only have Fox and CBS. I'll also be testing the HDMI with the Sammy DVD. More later.
so, are you saying that pq is better on the A10 than on A20?

I feel your pain! I'm in RI too(east bay) and I've looked at local B&M with no success. Sears in Swansea Mall has to one of the worst electronics dept I've seen. Like someone mentioned before all the sets are either on floor level or you gotta be the abominable snowman to be at proper viewing height! Sales critter was clueless. CC not in the system(warehouse) yet. BB....."dunno". :mad: :mad: Will continue to look!


Do you think this is a Sony ploy to make it look like a shortage, thus keeping demand up for their 50A10's. I'm not going to buy from online because if I get one with a dead pixel it's going back " Heck if a pixel has the sniffles it's going back". I have to get the 30 day no hassle return policy. The 50A10's are so close I can smell them. :D

Please let us know what you think once you get this...especially what you think of non-HD cable. I'm trying to decide if I should return my 55-A20 for a 50-A10 because non-HD cable looks terrible on most channels. While it might be something with my individual TV rather than just another of the same TV I think I'd be happier with the A10 due to the iris & it's a little smaller (I think 50" would be better for my situation).

Non HD cable will look pretty bad on almost all HD televisions...and the larger the screen the worse it looks. The retailers cleverly show only HD broadcasts in their showroms...espcecially INHD and DiscoveryHD, which tend to show the best quality pictures of all HD stations. I had a FAR better non- HD picture on my old Sony 36 inch WEGA, than on my 42 GWIV HD TV. But then again, the HD broadcasts look awsome! I'll take the tradeoff any day...and I tend to mostly watch the HD channels now.

They're set up correctly at the factory to look good next to other manufacturer's competing sets, which are also set up correctly at THEIR factories to look as good as possible in the typical overlit BB or CC showroom where most people will be judging the sets. Sony would have to be ignorant of how the typical buyer chooses a TV to set them up any differently; in a showroom, a brighter display usually looks better and attracts more customers. This is how all the major manufacturers set up their sets, so there's no basis for slagging of on Sony for doing it too. They don't want to sacrifice sales by trying to calibrate the sets for a home environment rather than a sales environment, and to do so would be pointless anyway, because it's impossible to calibrate for each individual viewing environment where the set may eventually end up. The proper setup for one person's near-dark home theater room is very different than the setup for another person's bright, window-filled living room. Rather, I think it's odd to spend $2500 on a TV and then be peeved about putting a little time in to adjust the TV to your own environment and viewing preferences.

If you want something to complain about, though, you should complain about the crappy viewing environment that stores like BB and CC put these TVs in in the first place, which don't come close to resembling ANYONE's home. It's impossible to judge these sets accurately in their showrooms.

I agree a lot showrooms are terribly bright, such as Best Buy and Circuit City, although I have seen quite a few in the Indianapolis area that are as dark as a room at home, such as HH Gregg, and Ovation. I still fail to see why the manufacturers can't at least make the TV's easily user adjustable, instead of having to get into the service menu to achieve a good picture. Also, I read comments on Sony's having a red-push? That wouldn't seem to impress store customers in any type of lighting. I really think Sony and others could do this better. :mad:

Do you think this is a Sony ploy to make it look like a shortage, thus keeping demand up for their 50A10,s. I'm not going to buy from online because if I get one with a dead pixel it's going back " Heck if a pixel has the sniffles it's going back". I have to get the 30 day no hassle return policy. The 50A10's are so close I can smell them. :D


I'm not sure about a shortage ploy, but as we have seen from forums like this one, these sets are going to be in great demand regardless. I mean we have an official thread, few actual owners, less than widespread availability at B&M retailers, etc. The hype is unbelievable. Seriously, we have nearly 400 replies in this thread and 1500 in the other Sony LCD RP thread and probably only 10-20 people have ACTUALLY SEEN the set(guessing). Bottom line, its early, but its hard to be patient.
I agree with opting for a no hassle return policy. If you want my $2500, I wanna physically see it with my own eyes and take it home with my own hands! :D :D

Non HD cable will look pretty bad on almost all HD televisions...and the larger the screen the worse it looks. The retailers cleverly show only HD broadcasts in their showroms...espcecially INHD and DiscoveryHD, which tend to show the best quality pictures of all HD stations. I had a FAR better non- HD picture on my old Sony 36 inch WEGA, than on my 42 GWIV HD TV. But then again, the HD broadcasts look awsome! I'll take the tradeoff any day...and I tend to mostly watch the HD channels now.


Alan,
This is well know fact, but some significant improvement can be made in terms of better SD on HD sets. What are your thoughts on using composite on seperate input for SD/analog or splitting coax and using the TV's tuner for SD/analog? Any experience with either of these solutions?

Joanr,

You mentioned you got a nice black lacquer stand for $299.00. Could you please tells us the make & model?

Thanks in advance,
Mike

Alan,
This is well know fact, but some significant improvement can be made in terms of better SD on HD sets. What are your thoughts on using composite on seperate input for SD/analog or splitting coax and using the TV's tuner for SD/analog? Any experience with either of these solutions?

The DVR boxes that Comcast uses in Denver output at Native Rate through the component outputs. If you use component the SD stations will get to the TV at 480i, so the set will do the scaling. This should allow you to get similar picture quality to the TV's internal tuner. Give it a try, Lew

Just curious but does that mean both games natively supported 720x1280 or did you have to edit their settings?

BF2 does not natively support widescreen resolutions. You can use this shortcut to use any resolution "X:\Program Files\Battlefield 2\BF2.exe" +menu 1 +widescreen 1 +szx 1280 +szy 720
but it will look stretched. Depends if that bothers you or not.

HL2 natively supports Widescreen resolutions. You just need to change it in the Options menu after loading the game.

Any videos or even more pics of HL2/BF2 on the E42 or E50 would be greatly appreciated.

Nobody who has this set has mentioned their settings for the Iris and Brightness. This TV is fairly unique in that it has both of these features. So the question is....do you increase the brightness if the iris setting is low? Do you do the opposite? Do these two settings have to be set at the opposite or can the iris and brightness be both set to low/high for best PQ?

Non HD cable will look pretty bad on almost all HD televisions...and the larger the screen the worse it looks. The retailers cleverly show only HD broadcasts in their showroms...espcecially INHD and DiscoveryHD, which tend to show the best quality pictures of all HD stations. I had a FAR better non- HD picture on my old Sony 36 inch WEGA, than on my 42 GWIV HD TV. But then again, the HD broadcasts look awsome! I'll take the tradeoff any day...and I tend to mostly watch the HD channels now.

I have Comcast and I think SD channels look great on my E50A10, but it all depends on the channel. Some channels are fuzzy, especially the ABC/CBS/NBC channels. But they were fuzzy on my 32" crt. Other channels, especially the digital non-hd channels look perfect. I have seen other tvs at stores trying to do SD and they don't come close. Could be the feeds at the stores, but I have never seen an hdtv in a store do SD as good as this.

tweeter has 150 sets !!!
(50a10) no 42a10 yet!

I'm considering selling my main gaming tv right now so I can replace it with a 42" A10 model. I already have a 42" WE610 (GW3) in my living room but I also have a 34" Sony XBR910 in the basement which is the "gaming tv" of the house. So, i'm considering selling the 34-XBR910 right now.



So, i've been closely monitoring these new Sony A10 models but i've also considered just buying one of the 42" WE655 models on a closeout price instead. Throughout this investigating one question keeps coming back to me. If some of these new features on the A10 are so great why wouldn't Sony even offer them on the more expensive A20 models?



In my comparison of the A10 and the current WE655 I can't help but notice that the A10 has lost quite a few nice features of the WE655. The twin view PIP is gone, the memory card reader is gone, the sound is weaker, and the resolution has even been decreased. Some may say 1280 x 720 is better, but if that were always the case why would Sony still offer the higher resolution panel in the upgraded models?



In a nutshell it just seems to me that many people in this thread are just assuming that the A10 is gonna be this big improvement over the WE655. If this dynamic Iris was a huge upgrade why on earth wouldn't Sony include it in the recently released and more expensive A20 models? It make no sense. If you believe the lower resolution of the A10 is not gonna be visibly different than why does Sony still offer the upgraded resolution in the higher priced models?



It just seems to me that it's very possible that Sony cut corners on this newer A10 model to save money and that in fact the WE655 could very well be the better overall tv. Does the A10 offer some nice extras over the 655? Sure, the PC input is nice as is the extra side component input. But, besides those two inputs and the dynamic iris there are no other additions over the WE655 and i've already pointed out numerous things that were removed from the A10 models.




So, i'm not saying that the A10 is inferior to the WE655. I'm simply questioning the blind glee that some seem to be showing this newer model even though it seems like it may be a downgrade in many ways on paper. It also seems odd that if this special "iris" feature were so great Sony would have made sure to include it on their more expensive A20 line. Anyone else agreeing with me or wondering the same things?

So it seems its confirmed that we're getting 1:1 pixel mapping with the VGA input and not so with the HDMI input although this may change if there is a service menu setting to adjust this.
So just because there is overscan on the HDMI input, does that mean it's not 1:1? I wouldn't think so. It just means that the projector is projecting past the edges of the physical screen, right? :confused:

I have Comcast and I think SD channels look great on my E50A10, but it all depends on the channel. Some channels are fuzzy, especially the ABC/CBS/NBC channels. But they were fuzzy on my 32" crt. Other channels, especially the digital non-hd channels look perfect. I have seen other tvs at stores trying to do SD and they don't come close. Could be the feeds at the stores, but I have never seen an hdtv in a store do SD as good as this.

Where are you located LCD Guy?

I will try splitting the signal before the box to see if that improves anything. I can deal with a slightly fuzzy picture but the white lines that are constantly rolling up my screen on some channels is really annoying. I haven't seen anyone talk about this and I did some searches and couldn't find anything either. If I'm seeing this am I right to guess there's definitely a problem with my TV?

so, are you saying that pq is better on the A10 than on A20?

It stands to reason. Both models are displaying at near the same resolutions. The larger screen will show more pixilation. But it's mostly a matter of preference and tradeoffs. The SDE on the 55" was noticable from a distance where I would be seating people. Not so with the 50". I opted for the smaller set is all. I would have had no problem taking the 55" if I had a larger viewing area in my living room. Both sets are awsome!

It stands to reason. Both models are displaying at near the same resolutions. The larger screen will show more pixilation. But it's mostly a matter of preference and tradeoffs. The SDE on the 55" was noticable from a distance where I would be seating people. Not so with the 50". I opted for the smaller set is all. I would have had no problem taking the 55" if I had a larger viewing area in my living room. Both sets are awsome!

What's your viewing distance?

Joanr,

You mentioned you got a nice black lacquer stand for $299.00. Could you please tells us the make & model?

Thanks in advance,
Mike

That would be the TechCraft PTV48B in glass and shiny black finish. Just Google Tech Craft TV stands and you'll get plenty of links. Now I'd like to find a glass and black DVD rack that would hold over 500 cases. I'll be willing to bet they make one also. The TV stands are nice and a lot cheaper than Sony's in most cases. Assembly is a breeze!

Tigerriot:

For me the 50A10 does not have the large silver wings for speakers with the large unattractive silver casing that surrounds the picture ( distracts from Viewing). We have had several people that has seen the 50a10 in stores and stated the PQ was better then the old model. We had one owner that posted dark scenes that looked great to me with good detail. The twin view or pip is no biggie at all. I had PIP and thought I would use it but never did because it was a distraction. also it fits the space I need without having the large ugly silver picture frame. There was one owner that did not want to adjust the color and return the T.V for the A20. I believe he really wanted the larger screen anyways. So if you buy the older model it's no skin off my back and it will be one less costomer that I have to worry about getting the A10 before me. "LOL" :cool:

Tigerriot, while I agree Sony did cut some features, whether or not the features were desireable are up to you. I'd gladly trade the memory stick, PIP (I think I've used PIP twice in the 9 years I've owned a TV with it), and loads of plastic for the A10s more attractive design and iris. The sound makes no difference to me. In the end we'll see how the picture quality stacks up.

If you feel you need those extra features Sony cut, please, by all means buy with what makes you feel comfortable. It's a lot of money and there's no need to be unhappy with such an expensive product.

For me, it's a must have with the new models. 5 year extended warranty is what I need :D
I was at BB in Muncie Indiana yesterday July 31st. According to Asst Asst Asst Asst Mgr the 50A10 is due to arrive there August 21st. It can be had for below MSRP. A discount amount that could allow you to buy an average TV stand. I did see this information on the screen and validated what he was saying. Although, arrival/ship dates in systems are always estimates...

Originally Posted by Tigerriot
So, i've been closely monitoring these new Sony A10 models but i've also considered just buying one of the 42" WE655 models on a closeout price instead. Throughout this investigating one question keeps coming back to me. If some of these new features on the A10 are so great why wouldn't Sony even offer them on the more expensive A20 models?

This is a good question, does anyone have any idea why?


In my comparison of the A10 and the current WE655 I can't help but notice that the A10 has lost quite a few nice features of the WE655. The twin view PIP is gone, the memory card reader is gone, the sound is weaker, and the resolution has even been decreased. Some may say 1280 x 720 is better, but if that were always the case why would Sony still offer the higher resolution panel in the upgraded models?

What comparison, on paper or in person. Have you seen the two set next to
eachother?

It seem that the a10 and a20 have different LCD Panels, a10 Panel Type: LCD 0.73" (1280 x 720), a20 Panel Type: LCD 0.87" (1366 x 768). Since the a20 is based on the WF frame, maybe the are using the same (older) panels and that
is why they don't have 1280 x 720 (better?) resolution. PIP, memory card, sound
gone, oh well.

In a nutshell it just seems to me that many people in this thread are just assuming that the A10 is gonna be this big improvement over the WE655.

Some have seen it and say its better to their eye.

If this dynamic Iris was a huge upgrade why on earth wouldn't Sony include it in the recently released and more expensive A20 models?

Again, good question, anyone have any ideas?

It make no sense. If you believe the lower resolution of the A10 is not gonna be visibly different than why does Sony still offer the upgraded resolution in the higher priced models?

I think it is as simple as using the WF chassis and panels with new internals but
who knows.

If anyone has an other ideas, I was hoping to buy me e50a10 soon. :D

If anyone has an other ideas, I was hoping to buy me e50a10 soon. :D


I believe the reason Iris isn't used on the A20 is because of the larger screen. The 55" & 60" needs all the Light Rays it can muster to get a decent bright picture. So since the larger screen is a factor the Iris control is already built in. This is just my theory. :cool:

cobbway,


I can understand the exterior opinions being favorable of the A10 model. I'm very pleased with it myself. :)


But my comments were regarding the picture quality and whether or not this newer model from Sony is truly an "upgrade" over the previous WE655 model. There are some pretty amazing deals to be had for the WE models right now. So, I think it's worth discussing whether or not the picture quality and features truly have improved with the A10.



At this point we have seen a handul of people report that they have seen the A10 and have been impressed. I've learned over the years though that these early reports can often be questionable and many times people will just be so excited to see a new set that they immediately decide that it's the perfect tv that they've been looking for. The early reports almost always seem to be very positive no matter what. It's just human nature that most people get overly excited about seeing the new model, even if the picture truly isn't a leap over the previous model. So, I take it all with a grain of salt at this point.


I just wanted to start a discussion about why people think Sony chose to no include this iris feature in the new and more expensive A20 models. Also, why they chose to go with the lower resolution panels in the A10 models?

I believe the reason Iris isn't used on the A20 is because of the larger screen. The 55" & 60" needs all the Light Rays it can muster to get a decent bright picture. So since the larger screen is a factor the Iris control is already built in. This is just my theory. :cool:
Could be, the A20 uses the XL2100, 120w bulb, same as the we610 and xbr 950.
The A10 uses a new bulb, XL2400, not sure of the watts. But again it appears Sony
is using older parts, was the we610 and xbr950 very bright, maybe its a good thing,
or is the bulb not really that important for the TV?

Tigerriot

Have you seen the two sets together? If not, please let us know when you do.
I would like to hear your thoughts when you can do a real comparison, not sure when I will be able to.
Thanks.

Ok guys: I have messed up big time and I let my wife in on this. She knows about me ordering a sound system ( ZVOX ) to watch SD stations while saving my expensive audio system for Movies and HD.

"Now here is the kicker".
She has seen the picture where the long gated empty void that the sound was suppose to come out but won't be used.
She stated she was going to use that as a place for some kind of flower arrangement :mad:
I'm not going to watch football games with flowers stuck around it. :mad:

Maybe I can beat her to it an stick artificial IVory in there as a trade off :confused:
Any other Ideals please advise and please hide this post before your wife see's it :(

Tigerriot,

Does seem to be some inconsistancies in how Sony is doing this.

Does anyone have the panel specs to see if the A10's 720 panel has more light leakage when compared to the WE610 and 655's (768 or 788?) Could be that it needed the dynamic iris due to more light leakage?????

Ok guys: I have messed up big time and I let my wife in on this. She knows about me ordering a sound system ( ZVOX ) to watch SD stations while saving my expensive audio system for Movies and HD.

"Now here is the kicker".
She has seen the picture where the long gated empty void is that the sound was suppose to come out but won't be used.
She stated she was going to use that as a place for some kind of flower arrangement :mad:
I'm not going to watch football games with flowers stuck around it. :mad:

Maybe I can beat her to it an stick artificial IVory in there as a trade off :confused:
Any other Ideals please advise and please hide this post before you wife see's it :(


Where's your imagination? Just tell her that it also serves to ventilate the electronics and you can't block it in fear of a melt down. Do hide the user manual, though. :D

Any other Ideals please advise and please hide this post before you wife see's it :(

Maybe you could paint some teeth around it, like they did with old war planes. :D

Ok guys: I have messed up big time and I let my wife in on this. She knows about me ordering a sound system ( ZVOX ) to watch SD stations while saving my expensive audio system for Movies and HD.

"Now here is the kicker".
She has seen the picture where the long gated empty void is that the sound was suppose to come out but won't be used.
She stated she was going to use that as a place for some kind of flower arrangement :mad:
I'm not going to watch football games with flowers stuck around it. :mad:

Maybe I can beat her to it an stick artificial IVory in there as a trade off :confused:
Any other Ideals please advise and please hide this post before you wife see's it :(

You're toast! ;)

Okay, drill a 1/2" diameter hole in the back of the sound port. Run some tubing from a sump filled with water behind the tv stand into the hole. Use a pump to cascade water down and out of the sound port into a river rock covered catch basin below the tv. Use some fiber optic lighting to change the color of the water orange/red so it looks like lava pouring out from the bottom of your set. :cool:

NYC is not the wilderness??

Tigerriot,

Does seem to be some inconsistancies in how Sony is doing this.

Does anyone have the panel specs to see if the A10's 720 panel has more light leakage when compared to the WE610 and 655's (768 or 788?) Could be that it needed the dynamic iris due to more light leakage?????

A10 Panel Type: LCD 0.73" (1280 x 720)
A20 Panel Type: LCD 0.87" (1366 x 768)

If that helps.

No, I have not seen the new A10 models. If I had don't you think I would have injected my own personal opinion?


I made it clear that often times the first reports of a new set can be very questionable. People on these boards have often made up their mind that the new set is gonna be the holy grail and therefore the moment they see it in person they proclaim it the holy grail. ;)


It just seems to me that if these new features, such as the Iris, were a marked improvement Sony would have included them on their more expensive models. Maybe the iris does in fact add something to the picture but i'm just not so sure considering the facts. Not to mention Cnet has now released their official review for the new A10 model and they rated it the exact same as last year's WE655 model. Don't you think if there was some big improvement it would have been noted in the review? The reviewer makes no mention of any improvements over last year's WE655 model. In fact, he make a point of mentioning the things that were removed from last year's model such as the picture in picture.

http://reviews.cnet.com/Sony_KDF_E50A10/4505-6482_7-31453800.html?tag=topprods

A10 Panel Type: LCD 0.73" (1280 x 720)
A20 Panel Type: LCD 0.87" (1366 x 768)

If that helps.

Close :)

Isn't there a spec that deals with light leakage? Fill ratio, maybe??

You're toast! ;)

Okay, drill a 1/2" diameter hole in the back of the sound port. Run some tubing from a sump filled with water behind the tv stand into the hole. Use a pump to cascade water down and out of the sound port into a river rock covered catch basin below the tv. Use some fiber optic lighting to change the color of the water orange/red so it looks like lava pouring out from the bottom of your set. :cool:

that would keep the TV cooler and from over heating, but would be a major distraction. I'm really leaning on the ventilation Ideal. Just tell her I found out it wasn't only for sound but to keep air moving through the system. Luckily she doesn't know about this Site ;)

The Cnet review was discussed earlier or in another thread and the consensus was that the reviewer for Cnet did a pretty poor job in the review. I don't believe they even mentioned the new iris feature at all among other things.

The reviewer makes no mention of any improvements over last year's WE655 model. In fact, he make a point of mentioning the things that were removed from last year's model such as the picture in picture.

http://reviews.cnet.com/Sony_KDF_E50A10/4505-6482_7-31453800.html?tag=topprods

His review was discussed earlier and determined he was DLP brain washed. He didn't mention Iris Because he did not use it. I believe you have to set it from the menu :rolleyes:

His review was discussed earlier and determined he was DLP brain washed. He didn't mention Iris Because he did not use it. I believe you have to set it from the menu :rolleyes:

Didn't he have trouble using the wegagate menu?

cobbway,


I can understand the exterior opinions being favorable of the A10 model. I'm very pleased with it myself. :)


But my comments were regarding the picture quality and whether or not this newer model from Sony is truly an "upgrade" over the previous WE655 model. There are some pretty amazing deals to be had for the WE models right now. So, I think it's worth discussing whether or not the picture quality and features truly have improved with the A10.



At this point we have seen a handul of people report that they have seen the A10 and have been impressed. I've learned over the years though that these early reports can often be questionable and many times people will just be so excited to see a new set that they immediately decide that it's the perfect tv that they've been looking for. The early reports almost always seem to be very positive no matter what. It's just human nature that most people get overly excited about seeing the new model, even if the picture truly isn't a leap over the previous model. So, I take it all with a grain of salt at this point.




I have seen both the current 42 and the new 50 inch A10 at Sears
Consider, if you will, that in general the smaller screen will have an advantage in sharpness over the larger screen. Granted its a small difference......but you CAN see it. Heres my point: I saw the current 42 sitting right next to the new 50 inch A10 and I could see a difference! Was it a quantam leap, NO!.......was it noticeable.......YES....you can take that to the bank, as Baretta used to say! The point is, bottom line the new 50 inch had a clearer and sharper picture than the current 42. I would suspect it should have been the other way around.





I just wanted to start a discussion about why people think Sony chose to no include this iris feature in the new and more expensive A20 models. Also, why they chose to go with the lower resolution panels in the A10 models?



See my answer in the middle of this post. Sorry for the confusion. Its the answer about comparing the clarity of screen sizes. My reply is the SECOND to last paragraph above starting with, "I have seen both the current......................".

It just seems to me that if these new features, such as the Iris, were a marked improvement Sony would have included them on their more expensive models.


They are using the dynamic iris on the SXRD models coming out at the end of the year, and those are most expensive models they will have besides the Qualia, which also has some form of the iris I believe. It seems to me more likely they basically resused the existing engine and case for the A20, rather than putting forth the expense to redesign everything to take advantage of the new technologies. I have know idea why they decided to redesign the A10 first. Maybe the A20 will be the first to be redesigned using Sony's new HTPS lcd panels with higher contrast next year, but they weren't quite ready yet. They could have decided to tweak what they had, rather than going through two redesigns in a row. Then you would have three levels of panel technology, and I assume they would have the dynamic iris at that point as well. That would make more sense, with the A10 slotting in at the bottom of the quality/feature scale like its price and size indicate. Not the odd situation we have now with the more expensive, larger A20 behind the A10 in quality and features.

No, I have not seen the new A10 models. If I had don't you think I would have injected my own personal opinion?


I made it clear that often times the first reports of a new set can be very questionable. People on these boards have often made up their mind that the new set is gonna be the holy grail and therefore the moment they see it in person they proclaim it the holy grail. ;)


It just seems to me that if these new features, such as the Iris, were a marked improvement Sony would have included them on their more expensive models. Maybe the iris does in fact add something to the picture but i'm just not so sure considering the facts. Not to mention Cnet has now released their official review for the new A10 model and they rated it the exact same as last year's WE655 model. Don't you think if there was some big improvement it would have been noted in the review? The reviewer makes no mention of any improvements over last year's WE655 model. In fact, he make a point of mentioning the things that were removed from last year's model such as the picture in picture.

http://reviews.cnet.com/Sony_KDF_E50A10/4505-6482_7-31453800.html?tag=topprods

The A20s are basically the same as last year's models, minus a few features and with a new name. Why they chose to upgrade the smaller models but not the larger ones is anyone's guess, but I don't think it can be inferred from that that the iris doesn't make a difference or that PQ hasn't been improved. My guess is that the A20s are just a stopgap until Sony figures out what to do with their midrange models. The SXRDs will be their high-end models (and will also have the adjustable iris like the A10s), the A10s are the entry grade models, and next year there will likely be a new mid-range model or upgrade to the A20s. Maybe they haven't figured out yet whether they want those mid-range models to be SXRD or LCD, and are waiting to see how the new A10s and SXRD sets sell before deciding.

Looks like dealer cost on the 50" A10 is $1875. I saw it on the computer at 6th Ave electronics. They will sell below MSRP by $300 but dont have them in yet.

I saw the e50a10 at Ultimate Electronics in Maple Grove, Minnesota this weekend. Here are my impressions. The TV was next to the e55a20 and some Samsung DLP’s. The room was dimly lit. I’m not by any means a tv reviewer expert. I’m just offering my opinion because I don’t see may actual tv reviews in this thread. I’m on the fence between DLP and LCD. And, I’ll spend the money to get a plasma unless I can find a projection tv I like.

The Store:
1. Poor salesman who gave me bad information and even outright wrong answers to questions I asked.
2. Wouldn’t adjust any color settings or anything else on the tv.
3. Would only display the tv with the manufacturers original settings.
4. It’s nice to compare displays in a dark cool room.
5. Got a hassle when I asked about a pricematch to Sears 10% off Sale.
6. Didn’t check the sound because too many other tv’s were on with sound and the salesman was a hassle to deal with.

The Bad:
1. I saw a meaningful amount of SSE at any distance from the tv with solid bright white or bright blue colors. Didn’t see any SSE on the a20 or Sammy DLP’s. Unless there is a fix for this, this is close to a deal breaker for me.
2. There is a significant amount of red push. Anything that is a solid red color bled into the surroundings. I know they want the tv to look “better” than the adjacent tv in a brightly lit showroom, but this is way more than I can accept.
3. The greens were also set way to high, but not as bad as the reds.
4. Blacks are about 80-90% of the Adjacent DLPs and slightly better than the e55a20.
5. DLP’s looked more filmlike than the e50a10.
6. The Wife said she liked the Samsung DLP’s better than the e50a10. (lip-sync issue notwithstanding).
7. A bit of claymation effect (especially on peoples’ faces) when objects were moving slowly.
8. Motion blurring when displaying somewhat fast moving objects.

The Good:
1. Much richer, deeper and more lifelike colors than the a20 or Sammy DLP’s. Especially on stationary objects.
2. Very bright and realistic display.
3. SD tv looked very good.
4. Very attractive slim cabinet.
5. No SDE at 7’.
6. I preferred the e50a10 over the Sammy DLP’s and the e55a20 unless the issues in “The Bad” were showing up, which is only a small percent of the time anyway.

The Summary:
1. I was very much leaning toward getting this tv based on the talk at this forum until I saw it. I still think it is a very good tv and decent price. But the fact is, it’s not the “no-brainer” decision to get this tv that I was hoping for.
2. I know a lot of the stuff in this post just covers the DLP vs. LCD differences, but I still think they are important because this tv isn’t the panacea for all of projection LCD’s shortcomings.
3. Don’t get my salesman at UE. I’m quite sure they other salesmen that are very good and helpful, so try for one of them.

I just wanted to start a discussion about why people think Sony chose to no include this iris feature in the new and more expensive A20 models. Also, why they chose to go with the lower resolution panels in the A10 models?

Not sure what good it would do, why they didn't upgrade the A20's is anyones
guess. Unless the Sony gods come down from the mountain to tell us.

Maybe a new thread is in order, people could theorize to their hearts content. :p

are there any stores in NYC that have the 50a10 on display

Hey guys, I am really really interested in the new 42' sony. I have bought so many tvs in the past month and returned them that I am sick of reading about tvs now. I've bought the smasung slim fit 30' HDTV and returned it do to color bleed in the corners and an hour glass shape when playing some games. After that I bought the Polaroid 32' LCD HDTV and returned that after noticing motion blur with my xbox. After that I bought the 32' westinghouse LCD. Very noticeable motion blur and ghosting on that one as well *SIGH* So after that I said I will just shell out the rest of the money to get a samsung 32' LCD. I bring it home yesterday and the picture quality is worst than the westinghouse, granted no ghosting, but still little blurring. But the picture is fuzzy even you can notice it with HD channels.

I'm sick of this. I called my local BB today and they said they could order me the new 42' model and have it delivered to my house for free with 100 off the listed 1999.99 price. I am a huge video gamer and was wondering if I should just go ahead and return the sammy for this one? The sammy cost me just a little over 2200.00 I have comcast HD if that helps too. Thanks in advance.

Well, i've got some cool news for the Chicagoland area folks. :D


Abt Electronics just got in the 50" A10. I just talked to a guy I know there and he said they just got them in today. He said they'll likely have a floor model out later today or early tomorrow morning.


That means i'll finally be able to see one myself tomorrow afternoon. Seeing as i've owned a GW III for the past year I think I can give another good perspective for many of you who are waiting to hear more about this tv and how it compares to Sony's previous LCD Projection sets.

The first person in Houston who wants one of these calibrated by me will get a price break. Send me a PM.

please post reviews. Help will be appreciated. Please compare to the HL-R5067 if someone can. Thoughts between the two?

The first person in Houston who wants one of these calibrated by me will get a price break. Send me a PM.

Can't wait to see your "UMR Does..." thread.

Would this tv be an improvement over the 32' LCD samsung I have now?

I think any of the good Sony LCD Projection sets would be an improvement over flat panel LCDs. The reason is that LCD Projection sets simply do not suffer from bad motion blurring. There is some but for most people it's almost undetectable. I'm a pretty picky viewer and i'm never bothered by motion blur on my LCD Projection set.

Thanks for the quick response. Can anyone tell me the response time on the new 42' LCD. My g/f is pretty pissed off because I keep returning tvs but I just will NOT settle on something I'm paying almost 2000$ for.

Like I said this tv will be used for video gaming, HD programing and standard. I have comcast HD.

Also can someone tell me if the resolution on this tv is better than the 1388 x 1024 my current sammy has? Thanks in advance.

No one will be able to give you true response time figures for LCD Projection sets. Thats because i've never seen a single manufacturer that publishes numbers for these sets. The bottom line is that they're probably right behind plasmas which basically means they're pretty darn good and way better than most flat panel LCD tvs.


In reference to resolution. Almost all the current LCD Projection sets have the same or better resolution as that flat panel you currently have. They're very good for their size.

In a nutshell i'm just telling you not to worry about LCD Projection sets and reponse times and resolution. You're always gonna get more tv for your money with an LCD Projection.

Thanks man!

I'm just confused as to what resolution is better for 720P. Would it be the 1366x788 or the 1028x720 that this one has.

I am also in Chicago and my local BB said they could order it for me and shipped to my house in a week.

I'm also in the Chicago land area, and the BB around me said they can have it shipped to my house in 10 days.

I'm just confused as to what resolution is better for 720P The 1388x1024 or the 1024x720 that this tv has, well at least I think thats the resolution. Thanks.

An earlier post from someone that join AVS today said he seen Claymation on the 50a10 he saw at a store. First of all this will be the first time I heard of claymation on a LCD RP. It's been widely known on DLP though. My question is could it be with the red push he was talking about make the faces un-nataral and make it look like clay :confused:

Wow, you picked up on all the AVS slang really fast for being registered 1 day! Heck of a first post ;)


I saw the e50a10 at Ultimate Electronics in Maple Grove, Minnesota this weekend. Here are my impressions. The TV was next to the e55a20 and some Samsung DLP’s. The room was dimly lit. I’m not by any means a tv reviewer expert. I’m just offering my opinion because I don’t see may actual tv reviews in this thread. I’m on the fence between DLP and LCD. And, I’ll spend the money to get a plasma unless I can find a projection tv I like.

The Store:
1. Poor salesman who gave me bad information and even outright wrong answers to questions I asked.
2. Wouldn’t adjust any color settings or anything else on the tv.
3. Would only display the tv with the manufacturers original settings.
4. It’s nice to compare displays in a dark cool room.
5. Got a hassle when I asked about a pricematch to Sears 10% off Sale.
6. Didn’t check the sound because too many other tv’s were on with sound and the salesman was a hassle to deal with.

The Bad:
1. I saw a meaningful amount of SSE at any distance from the tv with solid bright white or bright blue colors. Didn’t see any SSE on the a20 or Sammy DLP’s. Unless there is a fix for this, this is close to a deal breaker for me.
2. There is a significant amount of red push. Anything that is a solid red color bled into the surroundings. I know they want the tv to look “better” than the adjacent tv in a brightly lit showroom, but this is way more than I can accept.
3. The greens were also set way to high, but not as bad as the reds.
4. Blacks are about 80-90% of the Adjacent DLPs and slightly better than the e55a20.
5. DLP’s looked more filmlike than the e50a10.
6. The Wife said she liked the Samsung DLP’s better than the e50a10. (lip-sync issue notwithstanding).
7. A bit of claymation effect (especially on peoples’ faces) when objects were moving slowly.
8. Motion blurring when displaying somewhat fast moving objects.

The Good:
1. Much richer, deeper and more lifelike colors than the a20 or Sammy DLP’s. Especially on stationary objects.
2. Very bright and realistic display.
3. SD tv looked very good.
4. Very attractive slim cabinet.
5. No SDE at 7’.
6. I preferred the e50a10 over the Sammy DLP’s and the e55a20 unless the issues in “The Bad” were showing up, which is only a small percent of the time anyway.

The Summary:
1. I was very much leaning toward getting this tv based on the talk at this forum until I saw it. I still think it is a very good tv and decent price. But the fact is, it’s not the “no-brainer” decision to get this tv that I was hoping for.
2. I know a lot of the stuff in this post just covers the DLP vs. LCD differences, but I still think they are important because this tv isn’t the panacea for all of projection LCD’s shortcomings.
3. Don’t get my salesman at UE. I’m quite sure they other salesmen that are very good and helpful, so try for one of them.

what exactly is the infamous "red push"

Red Push is really just another way of saying that the color red is way too strong from the factory settings. Tv manufacturers intentionally punch the red up to make the tv stand out and look more vibrant on a showroom floor. It catches people's eyes but a real professional tv should not look that way.

how can you get red of the red push, what setting do you need to adjust.

Can someone who has this tv already post their settings

Claymation? Silkscreen? Blurring? You guys are scaring the hell out of me.

You can fix the red push one of two ways.


First you can just turn down the color on the tv a bit. This isn't really a fix to the problem but it will reduce the strength of the reds and thus things will look a bit more normal.


The real way to fix red push is to go into the tv's service menu and actually adjust the red that way. Sometimes it's easier to do on certain sets.


Please, don't ask me what a service menu is next. :) I don't want to fill this thread up with talk about the basics of tv calibration. Thanks.

I know that. just was wondering if there was an easier way, than having to go into the service menu. I had the 42we655 before and there was not really any red push that I could see. Just really didnt know what the term meant. Thanks for clearing it up for me.

Red Push is not always gonna be noticable to most consumers as they probably are not aware of what the red should look like when properly calibrated.


For instance, I have a 51" Sony WS655 CRT RPTV in my basement and it actually has a feature in the regular menu where you can turn the red push off. In that menu it's labeled "variable red axis" and when you flip between on and off you can clearly see the difference it makes.


So, some of the top of the line sets off that adjustment right in the regular menu but there aren't many tvs that do that.

Red push is where yellows are too orange while the gray can be OK. For signals connected via component cables it can be corrected with an attenuator on the Cr line. A better fix is to change the color decoder settings in the service menu, umr was able to do this with earlier GW series sets and can probably do it for the GW-V sets too. I hope that umr will post some info after he calibrates one of these sets.

....I hope that umr will post some info after he calibrates one of these sets.

I will post a thorough review once I get a chance to calibrate one. I have an A20 scheduled in two weeks.

Can someone reccomend the DVD's that setup the calibration for your TV? Which one is the best one?

I will post a thorough review once I get a chance to calibrate one. I have an A20 scheduled in two weeks.
I'd imagine it's going to be a few more weeks before someone schedules an A10. Only a few seem to have them already. I'm very interested to see what you end up doing with the iris settings.

Where are you located LCD Guy?

I will try splitting the signal before the box to see if that improves anything. I can deal with a slightly fuzzy picture but the white lines that are constantly rolling up my screen on some channels is really annoying. I haven't seen anyone talk about this and I did some searches and couldn't find anything either. If I'm seeing this am I right to guess there's definitely a problem with my TV?

I live in Fresno, CA. The fuzzy picture has always been that way from Comcast. I don't know about the white lines. If you don't have them on your other tv maybe it is your new tv.

Claymation? Silkscreen? Blurring? You guys are scaring the hell out of me.

I own this tv and have not seen any of the above issues. With all of the Samsung dlps I noticed serious blurring and clamation effects, but have not seen them once on my E50A10.

Can someone reccomend the DVD's that setup the calibration for your TV? Which one is the best one?

I doubt you really want the best, but if you do I would purchase AviaPro. I would purchase Avia if you are only going to purchase one. The blue filter supplied with DVE is too dark to use effectively.

I hope you realize that these DVD's alone will not allow you to calibrate your TV. Instrumentation and specific display knowledge is required. I am know selling software to use with a quality instrument that would enable the enthusiast to have a very credible measurement system at under $1000.

I have had the A10 since Saturday. Haven't played around too much but it has been great. Have extensively watched DLPs and LCDs at friends' houses but this is my first set. Couple of comments based on some of what is popping up in this forum:

- SDE effect - I have to get pretty close up to the screen (walk up to it) and look for it to notice. No worse and no better than any LCD I have seen...and I did a lot of research.
- Silkscreen, Blurry Motion, Claymation?? - I have noticed none of this and I have watched a lot of sports (soccer and baseball) and some movies/TV Shows.
- SD Content - I have Comcast and the Digital channels are very good (better than I have seen elsewhere. The Analog channels are just OK. I think the guy who mentioned a "white line" going up the screen was watching Analog channel. Fortunately, Comcast in my area has 40% of their Analog channels digitally simulcast and plans to be at 100% by the end of the year.
- Black Levels - Great, granted I have not tested any telltale scenes (LOTR, etc.)
- PQ - Great.
- Sound - Not as bad as I thought it would be based on reviews...but still leaves something to be desired.
- Fan sound - very faint...if you listen for it when the volume is completely down you can make it out. Non factor.
- Color - Reds and Green do "push" dramatically. I'm not sure I understand why people are making such a big deal about this. Everyone I talk to says you have to get a set of this quality calibrated anyway.

On that note, any recommendations for someone to calibrate in the NJ area?

I doubt you really want the best, but if you do I would purchase AviaPro. I would purchase Avia if you are only going to purchase one. The blue filter supplied with DVE is too dark to use effectively.

I hope you realize that these DVD's alone will not allow you to calibrate your TV. Instrumentation and specific display knowledge is required. I am know selling software to use with a quality instrument that would enable the enthusiast to have a very credible measurement system at under $1000.

The TV will cost less than 2K, but calibration is 1K? I'd rather not pay that much. $40 for a DVD calibration should be good enough for me.

The TV will cost less than 2K, but calibration is 1K? I'd rather not pay that much. $40 for a DVD calibration should be good enough for me.

ISF Calibratation can be done for between $300-400 dollars, I don't think anyone is expecting you to purchase the equipment to do this or even know how to do this.

Can someone reccomend the DVD's that setup the calibration for your TV? Which one is the best one?

Use a THX-certified DVD that has a video setup menu on the disc to optimize the picture. Various titles contain this menu....X-Men is an example. THEN, have your tv professionally calibrated.

...On that note, any recommendations for someone to calibrate in the NJ area?

I would contact Eliab at www.avical.com.

Does anyone know if Sony redid the digital part of these new sets to directly work with the HDMI signal? In the previous version I read that they convert the HDMI back to analog component video and fed it into the same analog switch that is used for the other inputs on the back of the set.

- Color - Reds and Green do "push" dramatically. I'm not sure I understand why people are making such a big deal about this. Everyone I talk to says you have to get a set of this quality calibrated anyway.area?

Does that mean lower quality sets can't be helped with calibration?

Or maybe higher quality displays should come calibrated.


You observation is quite acute. And agrees with the mediocre CNET review. It is sounding like these later GWs are arriving even in worse tune than previous generations. Red push, is like standard equipment, anymore.

That's a shame. But good tweaking, and the incoporation of the iris should yield some stunning results.

Does anyone know if Sony redid the digital part of these new sets to directly work with the HDMI signal? In the previous version I read that they convert the HDMI back to analog component video and fed it into the same analog switch that is used for the other inputs on the back of the set.

There were rumors to that effect -- umr do you know anything about this?

Does that mean lower quality sets can't be helped with calibration?

Or maybe higher quality displays should come calibrated.


You observation is quite acute. And agrees with the mediocre CNET review. It is sounding like these later GWs are arriving even in worse tune than previous generations. Red push, is like standard equipment, anymore.

That's a shame. But good tweaking, and the incoporation of the iris should yield some stunning results.

It's kind of sad but these TVs are kind of 'base' models....they are not Sonys high end "XBR" line, which in the past has had more adjustments than the regular series (at least that was the case with the CRT sets, I'm not sure on the projection units). That's not to say a good calibration won't make a tremendous difference in picture quality -- it will.

I would think the Qualia would be pretty darn good out of the box, but I honestly haven't read that 10,000 reply post yet, so maybe someone can summarize :D

I'd love to see a UMR Does Grand WEGA V thread :D

OK back to the A10s....come on owners, I'd love to see some more pictures and thoughts! :p

The Qualia:
- Excellent color decoding out of the box.
- Fair gray scale out of the box.
- Excessive filtering/enhancement without service mode tweaks

Previous Grand Wegas all had color decoder, gray scale and filtering/enhancement issues.

I have not seen the Service Manual for the new sets so I don't know if they are converting to analog twice, but it is guaranteed that the LCD panels are analog. The SXRD (Qualia) panels are analog as well.

I have not seen a Sony TV yet that does not benefit from some serious service mode tweaking. That includes the Qualia and XBR lines.

Personally, I prefer the Sony line for adjustability. Their OTB settings though are not what I would choose.

Just to clarify my calibration comment...everyone I talk to says that you need to calibrate this type of set. That means EITHER get someone to do it or do it with a DVD, tweaks, etc. I wasn't very clear in initially coveying my thought.

local store finally set their 50" model up. it was in between a 60" XS sony and a 52" mitsu diamond dlp. both the others probably cost twice as much almost.

the source was comcast hd. the A10 more than held its own. i didn't spend a lot of time... the set hadn't been dialed in. the A10 seemed to be cranked up on color. the mitsu looked nicer, more natural, on a woman's yellow dress, but i would like to have seen the sony adjusted. greens were greener on the sony; blue tint on the mits. however... the A10 easily was better than the mitsu on black levels. the whites were also more white. the pq on the A10, for this feed, was very film-like. the XS seemed to jerk along in spurts as the camera panned; the A10 was a smooth pan. shadow detail was much better on the A10 than on the dlp. screendoor was maybe there, barely noticeable at about 8-9 feet. no sound to listen to, so no comment on that. the design is a huge improvement looks-wise over previous WEGAs, imo. the 50" A10 was about the same overall width as the WE series 42". plus the better lookin cabinet. i kinda wish the dark gray bezel was even darker, like dull black almost. oh well on that.

i think i'm sold on it, esp at the price. my only consideration is whether i want this or something like a 42" plasma, mainly cuz it would look better in the room at the moment, then maybe add a front projector in the family room for real movie experience... decisions, decisions... (one comment - what's up that the 3 store guys couldn't have taken a few min from their busy standing around schedule to adjust the color sometime over the past few days???)

Just to clarify my calibration comment...everyone I talk to says that you need to calibrate this type of set. That means EITHER get someone to do it or do it with a DVD, tweaks, etc. I wasn't very clear in initially coveying my thought.

And my somewhat sarcastic remark did not add any clarity.....I was still in agreement with the intent of your message.
Of course 'any' set can benefit from calibration..the more potential the display has, the greater difference it seems to make.
:)

Anyone know if Sony offers an extended warranty when you register the A10 online? Sears price for the extended warranty seems a little on the high side. Thanks in advance.

No, I have not seen the new A10 models. If I had don't you think I would have injected my own personal opinion?


I made it clear that often times the first reports of a new set can be very questionable. People on these boards have often made up their mind that the new set is gonna be the holy grail and therefore the moment they see it in person they proclaim it the holy grail. ;)


It just seems to me that if these new features, such as the Iris, were a marked improvement Sony would have included them on their more expensive models. Maybe the iris does in fact add something to the picture but i'm just not so sure considering the facts. Not to mention Cnet has now released their official review for the new A10 model and they rated it the exact same as last year's WE655 model. Don't you think if there was some big improvement it would have been noted in the review? The reviewer makes no mention of any improvements over last year's WE655 model. In fact, he make a point of mentioning the things that were removed from last year's model such as the picture in picture.

http://reviews.cnet.com/Sony_KDF_E50A10/4505-6482_7-31453800.html?tag=topprods

The 2 1/2 year old Sony 70" XBR series has the Cinema Black feature. I wouldn't call $7000 cheap.

That means i'll finally be able to see one myself tomorrow afternoon. Seeing as i've owned a GW III for the past year I think I can give another good perspective for many of you who are waiting to hear more about this tv and how it compares to Sony's previous LCD Projection sets.

I'm looking forward to reading your opinions on this.

Also, after reading your posts in this topic (you make some excellent points about the new A10s) I'm considering the KDF50WE655. Have you seen an A20? How do you think the picture compares? The 655 doesn't have 3LCD technology, right? Does it use the WEGA Gate?

The Qualia:
- Excellent color decoding out of the box.
- Fair gray scale out of the box.
- Excessive filtering/enhancement without service mode tweaks

Previous Grand Wegas all had color decoder, gray scale and filtering/enhancement issues.

I have not seen the Service Manual for the new sets so I don't know if they are converting to analog twice, but it is guaranteed that the LCD panels are analog. The SXRD (Qualia) panels are analog as well.

I have not seen a Sony TV yet that does not benefit from some serious service mode tweaking. That includes the Qualia and XBR lines.

Personally, I prefer the Sony line for adjustability. Their OTB settings though are not what I would choose.
umr - so conversion back to analog is common for this type of display? Doesn't that go against the whole DVI/HDMI's "all digital is mo' better" thought process, or am I worrying my little nogin over nothing? Thanx in advance.

JD

Hi, I'm a bit confused by what seem to be conflicting statements...

First you say...
2. There is a significant amount of red push. Anything that is a solid red color bled into the surroundings. I know they want the tv to look “better” than the adjacent tv in a brightly lit showroom, but this is way more than I can accept.
3. The greens were also set way to high, but not as bad as the reds.

Then you say...
1. Much richer, deeper and more lifelike colors than the a20 or Sammy DLP’s.

If you could not get to adjust the picture settings to correct the red and green push to get the colors more accurate then how can you say that the A10's colors were richer, deeper and more lifelike colors than the a20 or Sammy DLPs? Am I misunderstanding something?

I'm not trying to be difficult, just trying to understand where the colors are really at on the A10.

Good point, I should have been more clear.

1. When the red push and other “Bad” items weren’t evident, the picture on the A10 was very good and lifelike and I preferred it over the Sammy DLP’s. Unfortunately, the salesmen wouldn't let me try to knock the color levels back down to see if I could correct the red push or any other problem. Apparently, UE has a “Customers don’t touch the remote” type of rule. I am not keen on spending money, if required, on professional calibration to fix known problems. I’d rather use that money towards a plasma or other tv that didn’t need professional calibration. So, does anyone know if this problem can be fixed without entering the service menus?

2. The SSE issue was very evident even at 7’ to me. Is there a way to minimize or eliminate this problem?

3. Even without being able to tweak the settings, I think this is a decent value for a new set. However, I think it is misleading for any reviewer to imply this set is without drawbacks. In other words, any post lacking even a small amount criticism loses all credibility with me.

4. I only offer my unlearned opinion in the near absence of real reviews in this thread. I would love to hear more reviews and impressions from people who actually have this set in their house and have had the time to tweak the settings rather than reading about speculation on why Sony did this or that or left certain features out. The A10 is what is, so instead, let’s talk about what it is and whether or not the public should pay over $2,200 for this “boob-tube”.

I have been following all threads pertaining to the new Sony's with the attention that one would alot for the next door neighbour that tends to sunbathe in the nude and has a Playboy body. :D
That said,
I have come to realize that reading other people's reviews of the televisions in question is a waste of time. If they had objective comments or complaints then it would be worthy but to endure subjective commentary is useless.
For those that have posted the reviews, I think it is cool of you to spend the time and I don't mean to criticize you(s) but I do criticize the overall review process.

There
Take Care
Tec :p :)

I'm sorry but, did someone say naked Playboy body...? :D No wonder you've lost patience for us...we're not nearly as attractive and quite frankly, when it comes to Playboy nakedness, we're not as interesting...

I agree that a lot of the reviews are "wow" and "super" and maybe over-enthusiastic, but that's the problem with "user reviews" instead of those by "unbiased" sources (ie- magazines, online sources, etc). People have a vested interest in what they've just bought and want to feel good about it.

Jason

Good point, I should have been more clear.

1. When the red push and other “Bad” items weren’t evident, the picture on the A10 was very good and lifelike and I preferred it over the Sammy DLP’s. Unfortunately, the salesmen wouldn't let me try to knock the color levels back down to see if I could correct the red push or any other problem. Apparently, UE has a “Customers don’t touch the remote” type of rule. I am not keen on spending money, if required, on professional calibration to fix known problems. I’d rather use that money towards a plasma or other tv that didn’t need professional calibration. So, does anyone know if this problem can be fixed without entering the service menus?

2. The SSE issue was very evident even at 7’ to me. Is there a way to minimize or eliminate this problem?

3. Even without being able to tweak the settings, I think this is a decent value for a new set. However, I think it is misleading for any reviewer to imply this set is without drawbacks. In other words, any post lacking even a small amount criticism loses all credibility with me.

4. I only offer my unlearned opinion in the near absence of real reviews in this thread. I would love to hear more reviews and impressions from people who actually have this set in their house and have had the time to tweak the settings rather than reading about speculation on why Sony did this or that or left certain features out. The A10 is what is, so instead, let’s talk about what it is and whether or not the public should pay over $2,200 for this “boob-tube”.



1. Probably not, but going into the service menu isn't a big deal. At least you can adjust the color decoder via the service menu with the Sony LCDs. It's fairly trivial to do this with Avia. This community is very lucky to have UMR - our Sony Grand Wegas are all orders of magnitude better than the ones whose owners have never been able to reference his information.

2. I refuse to perpetuate the use of this "SSE" moniker. Search the Internet - it's not referenced. Period. Please stop using it. If what you're seeing is motion blur, call it motion blur. Same for temporal dithering, internal reflections, or posterization. If it's motion blur, it's likely being caused by the source. Same for posterization (also known as clay-face) Sony LCDs have enough bit depth (partly due to the fact that they're analog) that "clay face" is not an artifact that the display causes. DLPs have clay-face, LCDs no clay-face.



I guess you'd have to see the dramatic differences that UMR's service menu tweaks can make before you can understand just how worthless out of the box reviews are. Good or bad. One service menu setting turns off a filter that basically blurs everything. I'm not even joking. It's like a veil has been lifted after you remove the setting and increase the sharpness.


This set is simply an evolutionary step - Sony has been making sets like this since the late 90s. (making this the 6th generation if you count the KL-W9000) That means that there isn't much to wonder about - it's going to be good. If you still have concerns, buy from a place with a 30 day return policy and just get a different one if you don't like how it looks after you tweak it.

The Qualia:
- Excellent color decoding out of the box.
- Fair gray scale out of the box.
- Excessive filtering/enhancement without service mode tweaks

Previous Grand Wegas all had color decoder, gray scale and filtering/enhancement issues.

I have not seen the Service Manual for the new sets so I don't know if they are converting to analog twice, but it is guaranteed that the LCD panels are analog. The SXRD (Qualia) panels are analog as well.

I have not seen a Sony TV yet that does not benefit from some serious service mode tweaking. That includes the Qualia and XBR lines.

Personally, I prefer the Sony line for adjustability. Their OTB settings though are not what I would choose.

UMR, just out of curiosity does the Panasonic PT-52LCX65 use analog panels as well? Is it fairly common for these RPTVs to use analog panels? What's the trade off/benefit? Thanks

Just ordered mine , should be here Wed. Smokin price. Can't wait. HTPC here I come.

"1. Probably not, but going into the service menu isn't a big deal. At least you can adjust the color decoder via the service menu with the Sony LCDs. It's fairly trivial to do this with Avia. This community is very lucky to have UMR - our Sony Grand Wegas are all orders of magnitude better than the ones whose owners have never been able to reference his information."

Does the A10 allow for service access without putting in a secret code like turning the TV off, pressing 5, sprinkling salt on the remote, pressing 14, reciting the Gettysburg address, then pressing channel +?

Tigerriot,

Thanks for the info about Abt having the new sets. I'll have to take go & take a look. While I am interested in the 42" model, I'd like to at least check out the 50" version to see what it looks like. My local BB in the western burbs still didn't have an A10 as of last Friday. They did have the old 42" for $1499. Great price, but I don't want that big gray/silver look.

Mike

Joanr,

Thanks for TV stand info,

Mike

So, i've been closely monitoring these new Sony A10 models but i've also considered just buying one of the 42" WE655 models on a closeout price instead. Throughout this investigating one question keeps coming back to me. If some of these new features on the A10 are so great why wouldn't Sony even offer them on the more expensive A20 models?Their are several reasons the iris may not have been on the A20 models. One potential reason is that they decided that for their larger TVs only the 50" and 60" SXRDs that are coming out this October would have the dynamic iris. Another is that Sony might have decided to recycle the old model cabinets for the A20's and that they were not capable of supporting a dynamic iris.


In a nutshell it just seems to me that many people in this thread are just assuming that the A10 is gonna be this big improvement over the WE655. If this dynamic Iris was a huge upgrade why on earth wouldn't Sony include it in the recently released and more expensive A20 models? It make no sense. If you believe the lower resolution of the A10 is not gonna be visibly different than why does Sony still offer the upgraded resolution in the higher priced models?Just to clarify this but their has only been one other display to ever get the dynamic iris from Sony and that was the HS51. Many other displays have had CPB or a variable iris, but the HS51 was the very first Sony display to get a dynamic iris. And the KDF-E42/50A10 are now the second line of displays to get it. And when the new Sony SXRDs, which are coming out this October, are released they will be the third line of displays to get it. The iris is a major update to front/rear projector technology and by next year I think it will be found on all but the lowest priced front/rear projectors.


It just seems to me that it's very possible that Sony cut corners on this newer A10 model to save money and that in fact the WE655 could very well be the better overall tv. Does the A10 offer some nice extras over the 655? Sure, the PC input is nice as is the extra side component input. But, besides those two inputs and the dynamic iris there are no other additions over the WE655 and i've already pointed out numerous things that were removed from the A10 models.If you don't believe the dynamic iris will make a difference and honestly think the current WE655 model is the better deal than you probably should buy it while it is discounted. Personally I wouldn't because I think the dynamic iris will make a great difference in picture quality based on what is has done on the HS51. To me a dynamic iris and a PC input are very great additions to have and though the A10 is far from perfect my guess is that it will easily be a better display than the WE655.


So just because there is overscan on the HDMI input, does that mean it's not 1:1? I wouldn't think so. It just means that the projector is projecting past the edges of the physical screen, right? :confused:That is a possibility. Most RP LCDs and DLPs though do not project past the edge of the screen more than a little. As such I would guess that most of the cropping is still being done by the display and might therefore be changed in the service menu.


I'm sick of this. I called my local BB today and they said they could order me the new 42' model and have it delivered to my house for free with 100 off the listed 1999.99 price. I am a huge video gamer and was wondering if I should just go ahead and return the sammy for this one? The sammy cost me just a little over 2200.00 I have comcast HD if that helps too. Thanks in advance.It depends if your planning on getting an X-box 360. If so the VGA input on the Sony might make it worth while. Also the larger screen size and dynamic iris would most likely make the display better for gaming than a 32" flat panel LCD.


Does anyone know if Sony redid the digital part of these new sets to directly work with the HDMI signal? In the previous version I read that they convert the HDMI back to analog component video and fed it into the same analog switch that is used for the other inputs on the back of the set.Though the final input signal for LCD panels is analog it is always best to keep the signal digital until it reaches the panels. Their are certain ways I think that this can be tested but my guess is that the WEGA engine with the new TV's probably keeps the digital signal digital until it reaches the LCD panels. It would be nice though to know that for certain.


The 2 1/2 year old Sony 70" XBR series has the Cinema Black feature. I wouldn't call $7000 cheap.Though Sony now lumps the dynamic iris together with the name Cinema Black Pro I am fairly certain that no Sony TV before the HS51 had a dynamic iris. The dynamic iris is very new and this is the first year that manufacturers have started including one in their TVs.

Though the final input signal for LCD panels is analog it is always best to keep the signal digital until it reaches the panels. Their are certain ways I think that this can be tested but my guess is that the WEGA engine with the new TV's probably keeps the digital signal digital until it reaches the LCD panels. It would be nice though to know that for certain.




In previous sets, Sony converted digital signals to analog pretty early on in the circuitry.

But if you think about it, what difference does it make as long as the picture looks good and by most accounts better than the competition.

So is it confirmed that the A10 has dynamic iris? I thought it just had advanced iris not like hs51 which has dynamic iris. Difference being that the iris is adjustable but not dynamic.

UMR, just out of curiosity does the Panasonic PT-52LCX65 use analog panels as well? Is it fairly common for these RPTVs to use analog panels? What's the trade off/benefit? Thanks

All LCD panels are driven analog. The benefit is you have fewer problems with loss of resolution. Devices like D-ILA and DLP tend to have problems with posturization that is caused by loss of bit depth. Analog circuitry does not have that problem.

umr - so conversion back to analog is common for this type of display? Doesn't that go against the whole DVI/HDMI's "all digital is mo' better" thought process, or am I worrying my little nogin over nothing? Thanx in advance.

JD

All digital is not very common and many of the displays that offer it are rather poor in my opinion. Minimizing the number of digital to analog conversions is a desirable goal, but it is not a necessity or decisive factor. My favorite display technology today is SXRD and it is driven analog. My second favorite is Brillian's LCoS which also happens to be analog.

Many digital display devices have to use tricks to display an image that cause more objectionable display artifacts.

So is it confirmed that the A10 has dynamic iris? I thought it just had advanced iris not like hs51 which has dynamic iris. Difference being that the iris is adjustable but not dynamic.Yes the A10's have a dynamic iris which can be found in the user manual (http://www.sonystyle.com/intershoproot/eCS/Store/en/documents/specifications/kdfe42a10_manual.pdf) on page 9.


Also for those that have a black frame while using the TV's VGA input their are 4 display settings for the VGA input that can be seen on page 71 of the user manual. Two of which will cause a black frame to appear around the picture.

Thanks for the quick response. Can anyone tell me the response time on the new 42' LCD. My g/f is pretty pissed off because I keep returning tvs but I just will NOT settle on something I'm paying almost 2000$ for.

Like I said this tv will be used for video gaming, HD programing and standard. I have comcast HD.

Also can someone tell me if the resolution on this tv is better than the 1388 x 1024 my current sammy has? Thanks in advance.

The 42" Grand Wegas are shipping now. Received ours yesterday.

What is the size of the box? I would like to know what sort of vehicle I would need to cart this thing home. I live in CT and might just zip up to MA to take advantage of the tax free day on 8/14 if I can get the KDF-E50A10 home.


The box size of the Sony e50A10 is 50"x37"x20.5 inches.

It's kind of sad but these TVs are kind of 'base' models....they are not Sonys high end "XBR" line, which in the past has had more adjustments than the regular series (at least that was the case with the CRT sets, I'm not sure on the projection units). That's not to say a good calibration won't make a tremendous difference in picture quality -- it will.

It boggles the mind that a $2500 TV is a "base model". For the vast majority of people, spending $2500 on a TV is unthinkable. Even for those that consider it, it's a serious financial commitment and probably rationalized by using the TV for the next 10 years. Being new to the big screen market, it’s disappointing to me that you’re required to spend an additional $300-$400 to get the full potential out of a TV you just spent so much money on. Since hardly any people will ever be able to afford the ultra-expensive models, I wish Sony would supply better out of box picture settings for the TVs they sell the most. Sure, you can go to this forum and get setting tips from knowledgeable people like umr, but most people aren’t that technologically capable. Quite frankly, they shouldn’t have to be. After all, it is just a TV, it’s not like they’re converting their house into a smart house or something.

After reading most of this thread, it’s become clear to me that the user reviews are only useful as fodder to pass the time until I can actually see this thing for myself. It’s crazy that anyone could order such an expensive TV sight unseen.

"I wish Sony would supply better out of box picture settings for the TVs they sell the most. Sure, you can go to this forum and get setting tips from knowledgeable people like umr, but most people aren’t that technologically capable. Quite frankly, they shouldn’t have to be. After all, it is just a TV, it’s not like they’re converting their house into a smart house or something."



You have to keep one thing in mind while browsing this forum. 99.9% of the people in the world have no idea what people like us are even talking about. They don't even know that the tv comes from the factory with red push and the like. It's just not something that most consumers will ever know or ever care about. So, you don't really have to feel bad for them. They're probably just thrilled with whatever tv they buy. It's only us crazies that actually give a darn about this stuff. :D



Also, I don't exactly think it's nuts to buy a tv without seeing it. At least in the case of this new A10 LCD Projection set. Thats because people know the track record of Sony and LCD Projection tvs. They're very good tvs and we all know that this new set will be at least as goof if not better than the previous model. So, if someone can get a good deal now and pre-order it I don't see a problem.


I'll be visiting a local store in a few hours to get my first look at the A10 with my own eyes. You can be sure i'll report back to this board later in the afternoon to give my opinion. I've owned a WE610 Sony LCD Projection set for over a year now and i'm considering picking up the A10 as my basement gaming tv as well.

So is it confirmed that the A10 has dynamic iris? I thought it just had advanced iris not like hs51 which has dynamic iris. Difference being that the iris is adjustable but not dynamic.

I think it is only manually changed with a range of 1-5 and pre-factory setting of 2.

You have to keep one thing in mind while browsing this forum. 99.9% of the people in the world have no idea what people like us are even talking about. They don't even know that the tv comes from the factory with red push and the like. It's just not something that most consumers will ever know or ever care about. So, you don't really have to feel bad for them. They're probably just thrilled with whatever tv they buy. It's only us crazies that actually give a darn about this stuff. :D

You are exactly right. gsmayes, I completely agree with you, but you have found a forum where we are OBSESSED with this stuff -- probably TOO obesessed! As a result we jump into this stuff WAY deeper than your average consumer would.

I would agree that Sony should make the 'out of the box' settings better, but you have to realize that ALL companies have these sets tweaked for a bright, bold picture since that is what will sell when John Doe drives to the store and starts looking at TVs. Sony is definitely not catering us, the tweakers, with the A10. They leave that to the Qualia line, which very few can afford.



I'll be visiting a local store in a few hours to get my first look at the A10 with my own eyes. You can be sure i'll report back to this board later in the afternoon to give my opinion. I've owned a WE610 Sony LCD Projection set for over a year now and i'm considering picking up the A10 as my basement gaming tv as well.

Awesome! Please try out the iris and see if it makes any difference. Of course the store will probably be bright enough that it will be tough to see any difference in black levels, but try anyway :D

The 42" Grand Wegas are shipping now. Received ours yesterday.

Congrats! I think you are the first owner of the 42! Give us the scoop! :D

:p

You have to keep one thing in mind while browsing this forum. 99.9% of the people in the world have no idea what people like us are even talking about. They don't even know that the tv comes from the factory with red push and the like. It's just not something that most consumers will ever know or ever care about. So, you don't really have to feel bad for them. They're probably just thrilled with whatever tv they buy. It's only us crazies that actually give a darn about this stuff. :D



.

That is exactly it. Most people just go to the store once, maybe twice, google their possible model purchase, ask 2.4 people what they think about it, call their mother twice, brother once and go buy the thing. :p

TV's are setup to sell not to be accurate. The marketing departments have proven that TV's that are too bright and have excessive blue in the image sell better. Manufacturers are rewarded mostly by the number of units they can sell at a price above their cost. Accurate performance has been proven to hurt the bottom line. Once one manufacturer started doing this all followed suit to try and keep their market share intact.

Thats why I think manufacturers should offer an option in the user menu though so you can manually turn off red push if the owner so desires.


Thats one of the beautiful features of my 51" Sony WS655 CRT RPTV. Right there in the user menu is an option to turn off the red push and wala, i've got near perfect colors. :D Of course Sony has decided to only include this brilliant option in a few of their tv models.

Just received this:



Recently you asked us to email you when the Sony KDF-E42A10 became available.

The Sony KDF-E42A10 is now in-stock and available for purchase. Because availability is limited, we encourage you to visit our site as soon as possible.

Thank you for this opportunity to earn your business.

Sincerely,

Your Vanns.com Customer Service Team

... Being new to the big screen market, it’s disappointing to me that you’re required to spend an additional $300-$400 to get the full potential out of a TV you just spent so much money on....

However, you can get a significant percentage of the way there by calibrating with a DVD such as Avia or Digital Video Essentials that you can buy for $40 or rent for $5. That, plus some selected service mode tweaks from this forum, is all that I'm planning on doing.

You are exactly right. gsmayes, I completely agree with you, but you have found a forum where we are OBSESSED with this stuff -- probably TOO obesessed! As a result we jump into this stuff WAY deeper than your average consumer would.

I would agree that Sony should make the 'out of the box' settings better, but you have to realize that ALL companies have these sets tweaked for a bright, bold picture since that is what will sell when John Doe drives to the store and starts looking at TVs. Sony is definitely not catering us, the tweakers, with the A10. They leave that to the Qualia line, which very few can afford.





Awesome! Please try out the iris and see if it makes any difference. Of course the store will probably be bright enough that it will be tough to see any difference in black levels, but try anyway :D

I played with the Iris at Sears the other day. The screen background was very light.......read "sky". You can clearling see the effect of the Iris change as you move it from the "1" to "5" position. The Iris does have a definite positive impact on the PQ. Set the Iris where YOU like it as it appears to be a set it and forget it thing! I hope this helps.

You are exactly right. gsmayes, I completely agree with you, but you have found a forum where we are OBSESSED with this stuff -- probably TOO obesessed! As a result we jump into this stuff WAY deeper than your average consumer would.

I would agree that Sony should make the 'out of the box' settings better, but you have to realize that ALL companies have these sets tweaked for a bright, bold picture since that is what will sell when John Doe drives to the store and starts looking at TVs. Sony is definitely not catering us, the tweakers, with the A10. They leave that to the Qualia line, which very few can afford.





Awesome! Please try out the iris and see if it makes any difference. Of course the store will probably be bright enough that it will be tough to see any difference in black levels, but try anyway :D

I played with the Iris at Sears the other day. The screen background was very light.......read "sky". You can clearling see the effect of the Iris change as you move it from the "1" to "5" position. The Iris does have a definite positive impact on the PQ. Set the Iris where YOU like it as it appears to be a set it and forget it thing! I hope this helps.

You are exactly right. gsmayes, I completely agree with you, but you have found a forum where we are OBSESSED with this stuff -- probably TOO obesessed! As a result we jump into this stuff WAY deeper than your average consumer would.

I would agree that Sony should make the 'out of the box' settings better, but you have to realize that ALL companies have these sets tweaked for a bright, bold picture since that is what will sell when John Doe drives to the store and starts looking at TVs. Sony is definitely not catering us, the tweakers, with the A10. They leave that to the Qualia line, which very few can afford.





Awesome! Please try out the iris and see if it makes any difference. Of course the store will probably be bright enough that it will be tough to see any difference in black levels, but try anyway :D


I played with the Iris at Sears the other day. The screen background was very light.......read "sky". You can clearling see the effect of the Iris change as you move it from the "1" to "5" position. The Iris does have a definite positive impact on the PQ. Set the Iris where YOU like it as it appears to be a set it and forget it thing! I hope this helps.

You are exactly right. gsmayes, I completely agree with you, but you have found a forum where we are OBSESSED with this stuff -- probably TOO obesessed! As a result we jump into this stuff WAY deeper than your average consumer would.

I would agree that Sony should make the 'out of the box' settings better, but you have to realize that ALL companies have these sets tweaked for a bright, bold picture since that is what will sell when John Doe drives to the store and starts looking at TVs. Sony is definitely not catering us, the tweakers, with the A10. They leave that to the Qualia line, which very few can afford.





Awesome! Please try out the iris and see if it makes any difference. Of course the store will probably be bright enough that it will be tough to see any difference in black levels, but try anyway :D


I played with the Iris at Sears the other day. The screen background was very light.......read "sky". You can clearling see the effect of the Iris change as you move it from the "1" to "5" position. The Iris does have a definite positive impact on the PQ. Set the Iris where YOU like it as it appears to be a set it and forget it thing! I hope this helps.

You can clearling see the effect of the Iris change as you move it from the "1" to "5" position..

What specifically was the effect on PQ as the iris moved from "1" to "5" position?

What specifically was the effect on PQ as the iris moved from "1" to "5" position?


Sorry, I thought that would be fairly obvious.........from 1 to 5 the picture got progressivlely "darker" (background). It never got so dark as to be unwatchable. It seems 2 or 3 is a "good" postition. But to paraphrase Shakespeare: (as it is with "beauty") the quality of the picture is in the eye of the beholder!

How do the brightness and iris settings interact with each other? As the iris levels have been described here, it seems like they would have the same effect.

All digital is not very common and many of the displays that offer it are rather poor in my opinion. Minimizing the number of digital to analog conversions is a desirable goal, but it is not a necessity or decisive factor. My favorite display technology today is SXRD and it is driven analog. My second favorite is Brillian's LCoS which also happens to be analog.

Many digital display devices have to use tricks to display an image that cause more objectionable display artifacts.

Just to clarify then, with the A10 display the HDMI is irrelevant, and an add on simply for convenience? Using component cables will be sufficient, or actually preferred, since this would eliminate a conversion process?

Thanx.

JD