Mike what kind of HDMI audio issues are you having? input trouble or output trouble

-Gary

Mike, thanks. As optical is working ok I won't worry about it too much. I'll try HDMI audio again on the next firmware revision.

Allan

DirectViewer, see if the output is 50Hz.

" the picture width is about 70% of the screen width, and the picture is aligned with the right side of the screen. " After my upgrade to 1.07, I saw the same problem while before it was perfect. If I remember correctly it was output being 50Hz instead of 60Hz.

Whats worse is that with HDMI to the VP30 and then HDMI to my Panny PV500 I get nothing.

Actually discovered yesterday that I have the opposite issue! :rolleyes:

If I connect the SkyHD HDMI-DVI onto my display it fails to get a lock on the HDCP and I get the 1 sec of picture 1 sec of static issue. However going via the VP30 it works a treat! :cool:

I've not heard too many audio dropouts yet but only used HDMI audio for a few hours.

-Any update on if it will be possible to adjust Red, Green and Blue separately with a future firmware version?

Thanks. :)

I am planning to get an VP20, but read a review of the VP30 in Home Theater magazine in the bookstore today that put me off a bit. The VP30 did not have the new deinterlacer card. They compared it to a processor made by Key Digital and the NEC Theatersync. Using a HQV test disc, they really panned the VP30 which I don't understand, since Secrets DVD Benchmark testing showed it passed everything (even without the new deinterlacer card). The NEC was perfect in this report, which I guess is not surprising since the company that makes the HQV chip made the test disc and it costs twice as much.

Could the HQV test disc be rigged in some way to show off the Realta chip but unfairly test other processors?

Secrets does say this about the VP30 with the new deinterlacer card which is reassurring:

"One of the big differences I found with the ABT board compared to the SIL504 was diagonal line processing. This is a feature that was exclusive to the Faroudja based video processing chips for a long time. Using the HQV test disc and some of the Faroudja test patterns available I was able to compare the ABT to both Faroudja and Silicon Optix’s Realta processing. The ABT did a phenomenal job in every respect, matching the DCDi processing, and actually exceeding the performance of the HQV processing. Using real world material, the three solutions performed on a very similar level. The HQV chip in my reference Denon DVD-5910 had some difficulty with some of the Faroudja test material, but the ABT did just fine."

I thought the article was unfair since it didn't test the VP30 with the latest card.

dude, with the ABT102 board in the VP30, it is the top of the heap for SD sources right now, bar none

you can rest assured of that ;)

-Gary

I am planning to get an VP20, but read a review of the VP30 in Home Theater magazine in the bookstore today that put me off a bit. The VP30 did not have the new deinterlacer card. They compared it to a processor made by Key Digital and the NEC Theatersync. Using a HQV test disc, they really panned the VP30 which I don't understand, since Secrets DVD Benchmark testing showed it passed everything (even without the new deinterlacer card). The NEC was perfect in this report, which I guess is not surprising since the company that makes the HQV chip made the test disc and it costs twice as much.

Could the HQV test disc be rigged in some way to show off the Realta chip but unfairly test other processors?

Secrets does say this about the VP30 with the new deinterlacer card which is reassurring:

"One of the big differences I found with the ABT board compared to the SIL504 was diagonal line processing. This is a feature that was exclusive to the Faroudja based video processing chips for a long time. Using the HQV test disc and some of the Faroudja test patterns available I was able to compare the ABT to both Faroudja and Silicon Optix’s Realta processing. The ABT did a phenomenal job in every respect, matching the DCDi processing, and actually exceeding the performance of the HQV processing. Using real world material, the three solutions performed on a very similar level. The HQV chip in my reference Denon DVD-5910 had some difficulty with some of the Faroudja test material, but the ABT did just fine."

I thought the article was unfair since it didn't test the VP30 with the latest card.

The HQV test disc contains several patterns that test edge adaptive diagonal processing and odd cadences which the HQV part is good at and the Sil504 and many other deinterlacers are not as strong at. The ABT102 addresses this and passes all the deinterlacer related tests on the HQV disc.

There are some products out there that can do reverse telecine and edge adaptive deinterlacing for 1080i. The VP30 does only a simple BOB deinterlace for 1080i though DVDO is working on an HD version of the SD only ABT102 to address this. DVDO has stated that any such solution will be a new product and NOT an add-on for the VP30. DVDO however has always offered generous trade-in discounts for those wishing to upgrade to their latest and greatest products.

- Collin

don't adjust anything on the PJ
-Gary
That was the important thing for me to know. I took another shot at it and found that I had to change some of the output format details on the advanced menu, such as shift, sync, front door and back door. Thanks for your help. :D

The VP30 does only a simple BOB deinterlace for 1080i though DVDO is working on an HD version of the SD only ABT102 to address this.
Yes, this review did criticize the VP30 for not passing a 1080i deinterlace test (not sure what test), where as the $1700 Key Digital and $3500 NEC did.

I'm thinking of getting the new gen 70" JVC LCos which will accept 1080p. This is what CNET says of the current JVC:

"Overall, the image quality of the JVC is very good, and we were impressed by its sharp images. Unlike many 1080p HDTVs we've seen, the HD-61FH96 was able to resolve every pixel of a 1080i multiburst test pattern from our Sencore VP403 signal generator. The JVC also properly deinterlaced 1080i sources, putting the full 1080 lines on the screen with every frame. A number of 1080p HDTVs, such as the Mitsubishi WD-62628, process only one field at a time, displaying just 540 lines of picture information for every frame.

Does this mean the JVC 1080i deinterlacer may be better than the VP30's and I should set output from the VP30/20 to 1080i? Don't know if I can afford their upcoming improved 1080i deinterlacing model, but like you say, I could save up for an upgrade in the future if I'm not satisfied.

DirectViewer, see if the output is 50Hz.

" the picture width is about 70% of the screen width, and the picture is aligned with the right side of the screen. " After my upgrade to 1.07, I saw the same problem while before it was perfect. If I remember correctly it was output being 50Hz instead of 60Hz.
It was 60Hz allright, but while checking on it, I found the parameters that worked (see previous post). So thank you! :D

Mike what kind of HDMI audio issues are you having? input trouble or output trouble

-Gary
Oddball stuff like only the L/R channels being sent (which has been mentioned before) and also some kind of "de-sync" where the audio stopped completely when switching from one HDMI source to another. I'd switch from HDMI 1 to HDMI 2 for example and lose the audio completely. The DD icons would still display on my receiver as if sound was still there, but it was not playing. Turning on/off the display device or the receiver made it come back. Tested the receiver every way I could think of by disconnecting or turning off HDMI sources and the receiver had no problem, so it looks like the VP30 might have some trouble locking in on an HDMI signal when switching sources.

Mike

Yesterday I posted a general question in this forum requesting some recommendations for a Video Processor that would meet my needs. Based on other similar posts posts I've since come across, I'm guessing I might not get a response. For reference, that post is here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=687266). This is a follow-up post with questions specific to the VP30.

Based on my own research, I believe the DVDO VP30 may be the only Video Processor that will even come close to meeting my needs in the sub-$2000 price range. However, I just finished browsing through the VP30 Users manual that is available on the DVDO site, and now I'm concerned that it actually might not meet at leat 1 of my primary needs.

I'm running a front projection setup with a somewhat unique masking sysetm. You can find more details in the post I linked to above, but in short, the masking can be set into a 16:9 setting, and a Scope setting. The Scope setting is not centered within the 16:9 area, but rather is offset lower than center. (i.e. the top masking added to get to the scope configuration is 3 or 4 inches longer than bottom masking that is added). I'm able to compensate for this when watching DVDs because my DVD player is currently an HTPC running TheaterTek, which gives me complete AR control. I can stretch, squeeze, zoom, shrink, and shift the image to my hearts content. As such, for scope content, I retain the scope AR of the DVD, but shift the image down so that the active content fits perfectly within my masks. What I'd like to accomplish with a scaler is adding the ability to shift and scale content from other sources outside of TheaterTek in the same manner. For example, it would be nice to have this flexability with my HD DVR, and I'm also currently looking at adding an HD-DVD player to my setup.

I had assumed that the horizontal and vertical pan functions on the VP30 would allow me to do the same thing that TheaterTek allows. However, the users manual states that the Pan function can only be used after the image has been zoomed to any value greater than 100%. That won't be the case for me. The picture will still be 100%. I simply want to shift the visible content of a scope image vertically downward to be off-center (throwing away part of the bottom black bar in the process) so that it fits between my masks.

Am I correct in assuming the pan function will not do what I need it to do?
With the VP30, is there any other way to shift a non-zoomed image around the screen to fit it within my masks?


Thanks.

--
Bryce

I am pretty sure you can since you can adjust the "Porches" of the video signal that leaves the VP30. If the vertical porch is made larger (takes more time, the image moves towards the bottom. I ran into this when playing with the output to achieve native resolution.

I am not positive about the above, but I am sure someone here will kow for sure.

I am pretty sure you can since you can adjust the "Porches" of the video signal that leaves the VP30. If the vertical porch is made larger (takes more time, the image moves towards the bottom. I ran into this when playing with the output to achieve native resolution.

I am not positive about the above, but I am sure someone here will kow for sure.

I've fiddled around with the porch settings on my HTPC using PowerStrip and these seem to be very tightly integrated with the actual timing of the video signal. Typically I found that by the time I got the proch adjustments to where I wanted them, I'd lose sync with my projector or some other aspect of the picture wouldn't be quite right. Unless the VP30 handles porch adjustments a lot more gracefully than PowerStrip does, I don't think I'd want to rely on it to accomplish what I'm after...but then again, it may be a whole different ball of wax when using the VP30 vs. using PowerStrip on a PC.

--
Bryce

I haven't tried this specifically, but I think it can do it. Since the VP30 has controls for both the input aspect ratio and the output aspect ratio, I believe you can zoom (and pan) the input aspect ratio and then basically set the output AR so that it "undoes" the zoom and allows you to pan it back to wherever you like. I believe that is how people are doing things like shifting 2.35:1 LB content from the middle to the top/bottom which has been discussed in this thread. I haven't had much need to do that so I don't know the exact sequence. Maybe someone who has done it will chime in.

Mike

Am I correct in assuming the pan function will not do what I need it to do?
With the VP30, is there any other way to shift a non-zoomed image around the screen to fit it within my masks?


I am, in no way an expert on this, with the VP-30 being my first video processor I've owned. However, if you just need to shift up/down you will be able to do this just fine. Right now, I have a very temporary setup with my front projection system that has the image higher than I would like. When I'm watching a 2.35:1 movie, I tell the VP-30 that my "active" area is 2.35:1. Once I've done that, the VP30 allows me to shift the image up and down inside the 16:9 area. So I drop the 2.35:1 image all the way down to the bottom of the projectable area. It sounds like you want to do the same thing, but not as extreme as what I am doing right now.

I am currently doing this with my DVD player that is hooked up via component cables - however you should be able to do this with any source.

The only problem I (and others) are having with this right now is that the shifted positioning is not always saving in the 'Display Profiles'. This means that each time you want to do this shift, you have to set it up manually. I suspect that if you use your computer to send serial commands to the VP-30, that you might be able to automate this even without display profiles.

Jason

Hello. I saw this question opo up in this thread a long time ago (been trying to catch up), but I don't think it ever got resolved.

Has anyone else had trouble using a TWC NY Scientific Atlanta cable box with the vp30?

When I first turn it on, half the screen is black until I change the station.

Worse, when I'm watching the vp30 with another source, the cable box turns on and off by itself-sort of goes nuts. It only happend when hooked up to the vp30.

Any ideas?

I am, in no way an expert on this, with the VP-30 being my first video processor I've owned. However, if you just need to shift up/down you will be able to do this just fine. Right now, I have a very temporary setup with my front projection system that has the image higher than I would like. When I'm watching a 2.35:1 movie, I tell the VP-30 that my "active" area is 2.35:1. Once I've done that, the VP30 allows me to shift the image up and down inside the 16:9 area. So I drop the 2.35:1 image all the way down to the bottom of the projectable area. It sounds like you want to do the same thing, but not as extreme as what I am doing right now.


That sounds like what I'd like to do. From reading the users manual, I wouldn't think this was possible...but first hand experience is always more useful than what some manual says. :)

Thanks!

--
Bryce

hifichip76

Yes what you have observed is the current situation. It is related to the HDMI interface which I wager you are using. I see the same thing with my SA8300HD DVR's. The black areas are a SA problem, that is known. You will see them referred to as L shaped masks. It will happen even without the VP30 if you do switching of HDMI inputs to any HDMI repeater (The VP30 is an HDMI repeater as is a receiver that has multiple HDMI inputs). It is a timing problem that someday might get fixed, but it is a SA8300 problem although it might be triggered by the Vp30.

With regard to the SA boxes going crazy, I have seen that too, and in my situation I sometimes see them rebooting while recording a show. The reooting will happen more often if I switch between the two DVR's. I am sure it has to do with the HDCP feature (I am being kind calling that *&^*#%^#$# thing a feature). I suspect that the VP30 does not keep each HDMI input absolutely convinced that it is connected to a HDCP compliant display, but rather sometimes tells it the display is off (or even worse, not compliant). This could either be explicit or implicit - the result of a handshake timing error. The DVR should really not care about compliance of a display hookup while it is recording and should never reboot for any reason except bad code which I am sure the SA8300HD's are ridled with.

I would much rather that a "Repeater", especially one with a single output, would just tell all HDMI inputs - selected or not - that the display is fully HDCP compliant (if it truly is). Tjis would probably eliminate all of the problems seen on the vP30 with HDMI inputs. After all each of them would then believe that they are connected to a single display that is fully compliant. I am not talking about a repeater that feeds multiple downstream displays, but one like the VP30 that just feeds one.

Bottom line you are not alone. There is a solution.... Don't use HDMI. I have not gone there yet as I am sure there will be other problems.

Hi, I have a question:

I've just bought a 50" Sony 3LCD rear-projection unit, which has a native rate of 1280x720.

I was just wondering; in VP30 setup, I can choose 720P 60Hz (this TV won't accept 50Hz, unfortunately. :().
What would be the difference of feeding the TV 720P using that factory preset, and making a new User preset of 1280x720P (by changing 1280x768 for instance)?

Would there be a difference/benefit of doing so at all?

Thanks. :)

Hi, I have a question:

I've just bought a 50" Sony 3LCD rear-projection unit, which has a native rate of 1280x720.

I was just wondering; in VP30 setup, I can choose 720P 60Hz (this TV won't accept 50Hz, unfortunately. :().
What would be the difference of feeding the TV 720P using that factory preset, and making a new User preset of 1280x720P (by changing 1280x768 for instance)?

Would there be a difference/benefit of doing so at all?

Thanks. :)

If it works at the default setting and is 1:1 (use the VP30 test patterns to check this) then there's no need to create a custom one.

Hi, thanks. Yes, I seem to have 1:1 mapping at the 720P setting judging by the patterns.

I forgot a couple of other questions I had regarding this TV set:

With my previous plasma screen, I had to choose the correct Sync Type in order to get an image at all - on this new rear-projection unit, I get a picture no matter what Sync Type I choose - and I can't really say that I see any difference in quality either. So the question is; is there a 'correct' Sync Type anyway, that I should choose? If so - how do I find out which that 'correct' Sync Type is?

And:

I have hooked the VP30 up to this unit using HDMI - HDMI.

In the 'Color space' part of the VP30 menu, I can now choose among three of them; RGB, YCbCr 422 and YCbCr 444, and they all give me a picture. Which one of these should I use?

My source is a PAL digital cable box via SCART --> 4RCA cable (RGB+Sync), and a DVD player via 'normal' component cables.

Got my HD satellite installed yesterday (UK SkyHD) and it took me a while to spot it but it appears I was only getting 2 channel via HDMI from that too. Had to switch to Opti for 5.1. Not certain if it was down-mixed or just LR thou (I actually wanted to watch the film so didn't play around ;) ).

EDIT: Appears to be down-mixed to stereo or at least the dialog was clear in XxX2. ;) My display is connected via DVI so it won't be responding to audio challenges.


As it's so quiet over here I thought I'd reply to myself. ;)

From posts over on AVF it turns out that the SkyHD only outputs downmixed stereo over its HDMI port by design! :rolleyes: Sky say you can only use Opti if you want 5.1, talk about cutting corners.

Still at least it can't be blamed on the VP30.

Ailean, the Dish Network HDTV receivers are the same way, only 2.0 PCM over HDMI :( :mad:

I am so tired of all the HDMI garbage, it is one big cluster you know what, I enjoy the best possible picture from it, but thats it

-Gary

Thanks, Barrygordon!!!

HDMI should have been better regulated before they ever released any version of it...

.....
I have hooked the VP30 up to this unit using HDMI - HDMI.

In the 'Color space' part of the VP30 menu, I can now choose among three of them; RGB, YCbCr 422 and YCbCr 444, and they all give me a picture. Which one of these should I use?

My source is a PAL digital cable box via SCART --> 4RCA cable (RGB+Sync), and a DVD player via 'normal' component cables.

I'm no techie and know nothing about PAL issues here (if any) - but it would seem if you get a good picture with all settings, just choose what you think looks best. However, the tech difference is mostly btwn 444 and 422, with 444 being 8 bit processing and 422 being 10 bit. In theory, if your display and processor/scaler, etc can use it, the 10 bit (422) should make better use of the color information and yield somewhat truer color transitions due to more info. Most normal people probably couldn't see the difference btwn 8 and 10, but others would say they could or, at least, that you should opt for the one that potentially offers a better use of color. Again, unless you just prefer one image over the other. Hope that's of some use and somewhat correct. More knowledgable folk will likely chime in.

the tech difference is mostly btwn 444 and 422, with 444 being 8 bit processing and 422 being 10 bit. In theory, if your display and processor/scaler, etc can use it, the 10 bit (422) should make better use of the color information and yield somewhat truer color transitions due to more info.

Thanks. -Since it took some time to get a reply, I tried to research this myself. I think I've heard it said here before, that 4:2:2 is better than 4:4:4.

But from what I found when Googling, it seems 4:2:2 is used in order to 'compress' the signal compared to 4:4:4, where both brightness and colour is processed at the same level (or somesuch).
Like in this link. (http://computing-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/YCbCr+sampling)
I get the impression from that page that 4:4:4 is better than 4:2:2, but that it would "be overkill" to use it, as that page states.

So which is right?

I am so tired of all the HDMI garbage, it is one big cluster you know what, I enjoy the best possible picture from it, but thats it


I agree...it has been irritating and ridiculous.

In the way that manufacturers are trying to utilize it, it is failing.
Thanks to the studios' paranoia we are stuck with it.

Oh, and I hate that frickin connector! :mad:

I agree...it has been irritating and ridiculous.

In the way that manufacturers are trying to utilize it, it is failing.
Thanks to the studios' paranoia we are stuck with it.

Oh, and I hate that frickin connector! :mad:
That being said and considering the thread I am quite impressed with how well DVDO has interfaced with most devices. Not perfect of couse but quite good. :)

I've just bought a 50" Sony 3LCD rear-projection unit, which has a native rate of 1280x720.
[...] in VP30 setup, I can choose 720P 60Hz (this TV won't accept 50Hz, unfortunately. :().


OK - not a question this time - I just had to vent my joy; I thought my new rear-projection TV (Sony KDF-E50A11E) didn't natively support 1280x720 at both 50 and 60Hz, but just now I found out that it does after all!! :eek: Woohoo!

So now I have 1:1 pixel mapping at both 50 and 60Hz. The unit has optical overscan on the HDMI input, but thanks to the magnificent VP30 I was able to "put it back in its place" so to speak, by using Underscan etc. :)

-I was wondering how the TV could have such smooth motion before I hooked up the VP30, and show judder afterwards... It turned out I just hadn't set the settings correctly. I needed to choose both 720P 50Hz and set the framerate to 50 Lock, obviously. When I tried to set it to 720P 50Hz before, it wouldn't work, because I had set the framerate to 60 Unlocked already. Now it works!

Sorry - just had to 'vent' my happy feelings - this was great. :)

Ran into a snag today on the VP30. I already have two HDMI inputs and two optical audio inputs and when I go to connect a third (media server) device where I wanted to use composite video and L/R stereo RCA connectors, I remembered that the VP30 doesn't have any inputs for the old analog L/R audio sound. OK I thought, I'll just hook up the optical audio. Nothin' doin'. I already was using both of the optical audio inputs in conjunction with my HDMI 1 and HDMI 2 video inputs. I basically ended up getting shot down and had to bypass the VP30 for audio. My question is this. Why on Earth would a company supply a high end device with four HDMI inputs and only two optical audio inputs. Don't you think this device at least deserves 4 and 4: 4 HDMI inputs and 4 optical audio inputs to match? And don't you think the two composite video inputs deserve two matching analog audio L/R inputs?

Mike

In theory the HDMI inputs are to handle the audio as well as the video, so the optical inputs are left to be used for a source that does not have HDMI.

...I remembered that the VP30 doesn't have any inputs for the old analog L/R audio sound.Er... uhm... mine does. There's a left and right analog input right next to the optical inputs.

Jason

Mine has left/right audio inputs, pity they didn't work. Now that I've upgraded the firmware I can try them again.

In theory the HDMI inputs are to handle the audio as well as the video, so the optical inputs are left to be used for a source that does not have HDMI.
Yes, and hopefully I can go that route if/when they fix the HDMI audio issues with a firmware update. As of now, they simply don't work (properly) for audio. I still think you need 4 optical audio inputs. I see now that there is one analog audio input. It was "hiding" over on the right side which is hard to get to on my rack. I still think it deserves two analog audio inputs if you are going to have two composite video inputs.

Mike

Mine has left/right audio inputs, pity they didn't work. Now that I've upgraded the firmware I can try them again.

I've used mine without problem.

As for 4 optical, I'm actually happy they included coax inputs, since I hate optical (plugs are always falling out.) Still have to use optical for my DVR, but can and do use coax for the DVD player.

Yes, and hopefully I can go that route if/when they fix the HDMI audio issues with a firmware update. As of now, they simply don't work (properly) for audio. I still think you need 4 optical audio inputs. I see now that there is one analog audio input. It was "hiding" over on the right side which is hard to get to on my rack. I still think it deserves two analog audio inputs if you are going to have two composite video inputs.

Mike
Mike
What issues do you have with HDMI audio? I have no problem with my DVD player or my DVHS player---only with a cable DVR and this seems to be the biggest culprit for many posters.

Mine has left/right audio inputs, pity they didn't work. Now that I've upgraded the firmware I can try them again.


Mine work fine also...

I am using the VP30 with a Mits 65813 RPTV. If I am receiving a 1080i 4:3 picture I can use the zoom to stretch the image horizontally, but when I am receiving a 480i 4:3 image I can not stretch the image past the border. Is there a way to stretch a 480i 4:3 image horizontally?

I just hooked my new OPPO 970HD to the VP30/ABT102 (and then to my Optoma H79). This setup totally blows away my previous Pioneer Elite DVD player (which I was running at 480i). I've never connected a SDI player to my system. However, running HDMI (480i) into the VP30 produces the best picture I have ever seen on my system. Truly the best $150 I ever spent! SJ

i just upgraded my pre-amp to get around the audio limitations on the vp30. i keep my video and audio seperate :) i needed alot of digital audio in's... the only thing analog is my tube cd player :)

how would folks handle this situation below? :

lets say I pick up a Anthem AV-40 Pre-amp that features HDMI audio inputs and I want to run all the audio from my VP30 into one of the Anthem's HDMI inputs

I would prefer not to have to run the video thru the Anthem, but being HDMI is a single connection and I want to run HDMI audio to the Anthem it will be hard to get around it

for a few reasons including that I want to connect the Anthem's HDMI video output to the VP30 for it's video output and screens etc.

so connecting the VP30 HDMI output into the Anthem HDMI input and the Anthems HDMI output into a VP30 HDMI input wuldn't make much sense would it? ;) what a tongue twister :(

Guys would it work to get a 1in/2out Gefen HDMI splitter distribution amp and use it on the VP30 HDMI output, 1 output going to my PJ for the video and one to the Anthem for the Audio?

http://www.gefen.com/kvm/product.jsp?prod_id=2514

anyone ever did anything like this?

Thanks for the feedback guys

-Gary

Run everything to the VP30 first and then run the audio over optical/coaxial to the preamp. Except for HD DVD/BluRay, run that to the preamp first and the take the HDMI output of the preamp to the VP30 so the preamp will strip the PCM audio while sending the video on to the VP30.
Although I would think the 1 in two out HDMI splitter would work but I've never tried one. Maybe DVDO will put two HDMI outputs on their next scaler. It would definitely be a useful addition.

Mmmm infinite loop HDCP negotiations. ;)

In theory that might work Gary, with a couple of limiting issues;

1) The audio from the devices connected to the VP30 actually pass thru okay.

2) The Gefens mirror output 1 to output 2 so it may have the following issue,

If the PJ is on output 1 it may report that it doesn't handle audio so the source might only output 2 channel stereo. If the Pre-amp is on output 1 it may report that it handles different colour spaces or something video related then the PJ does and the source may switch to the wrong output.

The VP30 seems fairly good at allowing manual settings of these normally auto style features (I believe 1.08 will give us even more control) but some sources may have no control or just be plain stubborn.

I'm having similar thoughts about how to get my amps GUI on the screen without having it switch all my video (don't have HDMI but it's currently switching most of my SD Component sources). I have figured that if I use the Zone2 features I could get it to switch additional Coax/Opti audio inputs thru the VP30 for delay but the Pronto logic for that is too much of a nightmare.

I think I'm just going to use the 2nd Component output of the Amp to feed directly into the display and then use the Displays PiP feature so I can navigate the Amps GUI while still watching/listening to the sources switched thru the VP30.

Back to the Gefens, I've heard reports that the >1:2 boxes are actually better at feeding different model display/sink devices, probably different firmware or chips (i.e. 2:2, 4:2, 2:4 etc). But you do need to remember that this is NOT there intended use so results do vary.

Hey Josh, what's going on the 1.08 firmware update. I recall you stating that we should expect to see some pretty exciting new features by the end of MAY. No word since.

;)

-Gary

Mine has left/right audio inputs, pity they didn't work.

as posted by all others, mine also work. However, I wish DVDO had added/left on two analog audio outs. My Phillips 23" lcd only has analog, L/R inputs for audio. It would be nice to be able to feed the audio thru the Phillips when using it as a personal video moniter - as things are now, I can watch my cute little moniter, but the sound is routed thru the whole boat HT system. Not cool.

Mike
What issues do you have with HDMI audio? I have no problem with my DVD player or my DVHS player---only with a cable DVR and this seems to be the biggest culprit for many posters.
I have three issues with HDMI audio, two of which need to be corrected by DVDO on the VP30:

(1) When using the HDMI audio from my HD DVD player, the VP30 strips everything but the L/R channels. You can't even hear the dialog because the center channel is stripped.

(2) I get strange audio "de-sync" problems where when I switch from one HDMI source to another, audio goes dead until you switch off/on either the amp or the display device, forcing the VP30 to "re-sync" the HDMI signal. At least that's my theory. The symptom is that you simply lose audio altogether when switching HDMI sources.

(3) Since video and audio are in the same cable, this forces you to pass the HDMI video through the amp (Yamaha RXV-2600 in my case), thereby forcing an extra HDMI re-encode. I can't say I notice any PQ difference but I don't like the idea of the amp massaging the HDMI data after the VP30 has optimized the video. I don't want to do HDMI audio in and optical audio out on the VP30 either because that basically amounts to "downgrading" the signal in some cases as HDMI's audio capabilities are better than the optical/Toslink capabilities. If I'm going to do that, I might as well pass optical audio from start to finish.

Mike

Just a question , which is a better video scaler, the built-in video scaler of AVM50 or DVDO vp30 w/ AB102 ?

Just a question , which is a better video scaler, the built-in video scaler of AVM50 or DVDO vp30 w/ AB102 ?
The VP30+ABT102 is probably slightly better for SD deinterlacing, while the AVM50 is definitely better in HD deinterlacing.

I have three issues with HDMI audio, two of which need to be corrected by DVDO on the VP30:

(1) When using the HDMI audio from my HD DVD player, the VP30 strips everything but the L/R channels. You can't even hear the dialog because the center channel is stripped.

(2) I get strange audio "de-sync" problems where when I switch from one HDMI source to another, audio goes dead until you switch off/on either the amp or the display device, forcing the VP30 to "re-sync" the HDMI signal. At least that's my theory. The symptom is that you simply lose audio altogether when switching HDMI sources.

(3) Since video and audio are in the same cable, this forces you to pass the HDMI video through the amp (Yamaha RXV-2600 in my case), thereby forcing an extra HDMI re-encode. I can't say I notice any PQ difference but I don't like the idea of the amp massaging the HDMI data after the VP30 has optimized the video. I don't want to do HDMI audio in and optical audio out on the VP30 either because that basically amounts to "downgrading" the signal in some cases as HDMI's audio capabilities are better than the optical/Toslink capabilities. If I'm going to do that, I might as well pass optical audio from start to finish.

Mike
I believe DVDO is working on the audio issues with the HD-A1

Regardig the audio problems when switching HDMI sources I wonder how much of it is due to the receiver being in the HDMI chain. I fed HDMI through my Denon with wierd synch issues but never audio drop out. I assumed one too many devices in the chain. The HDMI switching without the receiver is good. So I assumed the receiver was the problem not the VP-30.

I am currently using HDMI in (fewer wires in the spaghetti ball) and HDMI to display and optical to receiver. I doubt my ears can hear the difference.

I believe DVDO is working on the audio issues with the HD-A1

Regardig the audio problems when switching HDMI sources I wonder how much of it is due to the receiver being in the HDMI chain. I fed HDMI through my Denon with wierd synch issues but never audio drop out. I assumed one too many devices in the chain. The HDMI switching without the receiver is good. So I assumed the receiver was the problem not the VP-30.

I am currently using HDMI in (fewer wires in the spaghetti ball) and HDMI to display and optical to receiver. I doubt my ears can hear the difference.
Initially I assumed the same thing, since turning off/on the receiver cleared the problem, but then I tried using the optical out on the VP30 with HDMI not even connected to the receiver. It did the same thing. In other words, I was passing audio into the VP30 via HDMI but out through the optical. The receiver was out of the loop for HDMI and was just getting the optical audio from the VP30. Sound still went dead when switching HDMI inputs on the VP30. This time though, turning off/on the receiver did nothing (sound still dead). I had to turn off/on the display and then the audio came back. That's why I surmised that it had something to do with the VP30 getting out of sync and killing the audio. All that I can think of that turning off/on the display would do is force the VP30 to resync the HDMI connection(s) because the HDMI cable is the only thing going between my display and any other devices, and it goes straight from the HDMI out on the VP30 to the display.

I don't know what is happening but it at least appears to be some issue with the HDMI protocol and it sure looks like the VP30 can get into a state where an HDMI "reset" is needed for audio to be picked up again. Strange.

Mike

Hello,
since yesterday I´m a proud owner of an ISCAN VP 30, unfortunately I have some problems with the HDMI connection to my SAMSUNG Plasma PS-50P5H.

After I turn both on I have a pink coloured OSD and white lines on the screen (sync lines)
When I connect a HDMI source, the picture is also pink coloured. And the lines increase. And no sound. (sound is processed via HDMI)
When I turn HDCP on I have an alternation between white snow, pink snow and a pink coloured picture with no sound.


I tried everything different cables, different formats, framerates etc. nothing works. Always the same result.

The software version is 1.07.

My german distributor is not very cooperative. I hope you can help me.

In my opinion there is a handshake problem with the HDMI interface with the Samsung?

Is there any solution to fix it.



Thanks in advance

Takker

Hey Josh, what's going on the 1.08 firmware update. I recall you stating that we should expect to see some pretty exciting new features by the end of MAY. No word since.

Hi Brian,

Josh posted in the ABT102 forum that DVDO expects to have a beta of 1.08 available "by this Friday at the earliest and early next week at the latest."

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7833210&#post7833210

Run everything to the VP30 first and then run the audio over optical/coaxial to the preamp. Except for HD DVD/BluRay, run that to the preamp first and the take the HDMI output of the preamp to the VP30 so the preamp will strip the PCM audio while sending the video on to the VP30.
Although I would think the 1 in two out HDMI splitter would work but I've never tried one. Maybe DVDO will put two HDMI outputs on their next scaler. It would definitely be a useful addition.
That's exactly how I would do it as well, and yes, two HDMI outputs would be very handy.

That's exactly how I would do it as well, and yes, two HDMI outputs would be very handy.
An alternative is that these (http://sewelldirect.com/gefenhdmisplitter2.asp) continue to come down in price. If you spent $2K on a video processor, what's another $268? ;) That's assuming, of course, that the splitter can handle all the VP30's video modes. Not sure on that, especially whether or not it'll handle 1080p... if you use that. Probably would work for most setups though.

Mike

If you had to buy a new scaler would it be a Iscan vp30

Do the Gefen boxes passs audio? I thought at one time the HDMI boxes didn't pass the audio correctly.

If you had to buy a new scaler would it be a Iscan vp30
As long as DVDO keeps their generous trade in policy I will stay with their products. I had their HD, HD+ and now the VP30. Prior to those I had the Holo3DGraph 1 and 2. All within the last 4 years. I will upgrade again when their next scaler is released.

(3) Since video and audio are in the same cable, this forces you to pass the HDMI video through the amp (Yamaha RXV-2600 in my case), thereby forcing an extra HDMI re-encode. I can't say I notice any PQ difference but I don't like the idea of the amp massaging the HDMI data after the VP30 has optimized the video....
Why do you think your receiver is re-encoding or massaging the HDMI video? I thought it would just extract the audio then pass through the video unaltered just like a HDMI switch. I have the Yamaha HTR-5990 and don't see anything in the manual to indicate that it alters the HDMI video inputs. In fact, it can't even add onscreen display info to HDMI video.

Thanks for the HDMI tips guys
forget the HDMI though, I picked up a Boston AVP7 to replace my Sherwood P-965, if anyone knows these units they will think I am nuts :D, so can you can guess why I did it??

one hint, Front Projection! ;)

I want to make it known my opinion on this matter, DVDO you MUST include 2 HDMI outputs on your next HD processor, so we can either do 2 displays(Front PJ and small LCD) or send video and audio separate ways, this is a must :)

actually 3 would be nice :D

-Gary

In setting up a zoom to get rid of the top/bottom bars on a 2.35:1 movie, I found that a zoom of 56% was needed to stretch the vertical to get rid of the bars. Logically, zooming by the same 56% would be needed on the horizontal in order to produce a zoomed but not distorted image. I found that the zoom isn't a simple percent of the width/height however because setting zoom to 56/56 didn't get rid of enough in the horizontal, making people tall and skinny. As an exercise, I multiplied the horizontal zoom by 16/9 and set the vertical zoom to 56 and the horizontal to 99 and it worked. Why should this be? The manual doesn't go over this topic. When you are zooming and you zoom to say 56, you are zooming to 56% of WHAT? When you do the math, you don't end up with 56% of anything I can come up with!

Confused...

Mike

Why would you want to eliminate so much of the picture?

Why would you want to eliminate so much of the picture?
I don't, but I'd rather lose a little of the edge of the picture and not burn in my plasma. That's really irrelevant to the question. I'm not shaking my fist at the OAR Gods. I just want an answer as to what the zoom is really doing. When you enter the same zoom in both hor/vert, it isn't doing what I'd expect and the number which according to the manual should be a percent, doesn't align with anything.

Mike

If you had to buy a new scaler would it be a Iscan vp30

Yes, despite the remote and audio bugs it is the best fit for my needs. I would also consider the Lumagen products.

- Collin

I don't, but I'd rather lose a little of the edge of the picture and not burn in my plasma. That's really irrelevant to the question. I'm not shaking my fist at the OAR Gods. I just want an answer as to what the zoom is really doing. When you enter the same zoom in both hor/vert, it isn't doing what I'd expect and the number which according to the manual should be a percent, doesn't align with anything.

Mike
Why not try the overscan. It will zoom in proportionally. Go to Input adjust and overscan is there. It should fill out the screen on a 2.35 film if you max it out, or at least come very close.

Why not try the overscan. It will zoom in proportionally. Go to Input adjust and overscan is there. It should fill out the screen on a 2.35 film if you max it out, or at least come very close.
I tried overscan but there are a couple of reasons I don't like using that parameter. First, it doesn't go quite far enough to fill the entire screen. Close but not quite. The second problem is that overscan doesn't save when you save user presets and it doesn't save when you save display profiles. Therefore, there is no way to quickly select back and forth between two overscan settings. It still gets me how the VP30 only saves a few parameters when you save a "preset" and a few others when you save a "display profile". Why there is no way to save all parameters is a mystery to me!

Mike

Sheesh - now accounting problems. DVDO swapped out my funky VP30 last month - a plus. As per usual, they charged my card - a core/surety. No problem.

Problem is, they received the unit back on MAY 19th - yet I just contacted my credit card company, and found that the charge had not been credited to my account yet. Great - 2000 bucks accruing interest that I was not aware of.

So anyone else who returns something to DVDO would be well advised to check, and see if and when the money returns to their account, so they don't get large, expensive surprises in their next monthly statement.

Dale (and Josh) - you might want to wake up your billing/accounting department.

Jon - I sent you a PM and I am confident that we can resolve this tomorrow (during business hours).

Appreciated. Thanks. Not like you have anything else to do. Sorry to have freaked. :o

Do the Gefen boxes passs audio? I thought at one time the HDMI boxes didn't pass the audio correctly.

You do have to be carefull which one you get, I believe most of the current models/firmwares work with audio and 1080p but double check before buying. ;)

I want to make it known my opinion on this matter, DVDO you MUST include 2 HDMI outputs on your next HD processor, so we can either do 2 displays(Front PJ and small LCD) or send video and audio separate ways, this is a must :)

actually 3 would be nice :D

-Gary

Ah but is that two HDMI outputs with mirrored outputs or two HDMI outputs with independant format outputs so you can do 1:1 NR on two different displays! :cool:

Ah but is that two HDMI outputs with mirrored outputs or two HDMI outputs with independant format outputs so you can do 1:1 NR on two different displays! :cool:

DVDO Marketting:
I'd settle for two HDMI outputs capable of being driven one at a time, each with a independant saved format with a hard coded button to select each. Since I drop the screen in front of my TV I don't need both.

you guys need to stop posting this billing type stuff in the open on AVS, that is not fair to any company such as DVDO, I just don't agree with it, these matters are best kept in private IMHO

-Gary

I think I figured out the zoom and there appears to be a bug with the horizontal zoom.

The manual states that the zoom is capped at 150%. The zoom values go from 0 to 100 which means that 0 is 100% zoom (no zoom) and 100 is 150% zoom. This means that for each increase in value, you get a .5% increase in zoom:

Value Zoom (%)
0 100
1 100.5
2 101
...
100 150

So the 56 value that I set for the vertical makes sense. 56 = 128% zoom which is what you need to counter the 2.35 versus 1.78 ratio and get rid of the top/bottom bars. I'd prefer the zoom parameter go from 100 to 150, but going from 0 to 100 makes as much sense and gives you even finer control as long as you know what it is doing. All looks good for the vertical zoom.

The problem comes in when you use the horizontal zoom. When you use the horizontal zoom, the same 56 value should produce the same 128% zoom that it produced on the vertical. When you put the 56 in the horizontal zoom, however, you only get about 115% zoom on a 16:9 set. You have to set the horizontal zoom to 56*(16/9) in order to get it right, so you end up having to use 56 in the vertical and 99 in the horizontal to get a 128% zoom in both directions to avoid distortion.

I believe the bug is that the VP30 is taking 128% of the vertical resolution and zooming in that many lines on the vertical. Works fine for the vertical, but I think they are zooming in the same number of lines on the horizontal rather than recalculating how many lines need to be zoomed on the horizontal by taking a percentage of the horizontal resolution. In 1080i mode for example, the 56 zoom (128%) should be taken from 1080 on the vertical and 1920 on the horizontal.

Josh, can this fix be slipped in on the 1.08 firmware? ;) I realize it is possible that it was designed this way for some reason, but I think you need to be able to zoom the same percentage in both directions regardless of your display aspect ratio. That way, setting the same zoom parameter in both H/V will give you an undistorted picture. The way it is right now, you can set a 150% max zoom for the vertical but only about a 130% zoom for the horizontal on a 16:9 set. Doesn't really make sense.

Mike

-Any update on if it will be possible to adjust Red, Green and Blue separately with a future firmware version?

Thanks. :)

?

Sorry if this has been mentioned before. I run a 2.35:1 CH setup with a panamorph via a HTPC. I'm looking to upgrade to a HD DVD player. The VP20 fits my bill better but I hear the VP30 has custom settings for consistant height set up. Can someone confirm this? THanks

I did try searching, but the thread is sooo long :)))

How do people feel about NOT having 1080i passthru??? I compared my hd+ (w/ passthru) and it provides a MUCH better picture than the vp30....

A few people commented that stripper boxes wont work with the VP30? Any comments (pm me if needed)

A weird problem that DVDO cant answer. I have a Front CRT running RGBHV... With the VP30 in RGB and ANY SYNC, I can reverse H and V or even remove them and it still works >?!!?!?!?!?

Thx!!!!!

I did try searching, but the thread is sooo long :)))

How do people feel about NOT having 1080i passthru??? I compared my hd+ (w/ passthru) and it provides a MUCH better picture than the vp30....

A few people commented that stripper boxes wont work with the VP30? Any comments (pm me if needed)

A weird problem that DVDO cant answer. I have a Front CRT running RGBHV... With the VP30 in RGB and ANY SYNC, I can reverse H and V or even remove them and it still works >?!!?!?!?!?

Thx!!!!!
I thought 1.05 & up firmware provided 1080i passthrough??

the original firmware was doing bob deinterlacing on 1080i ....

I=Josh, can this fix be slipped in on the 1.08 firmware? ;) I realize it is possible that it was designed this way for some reason, but I think you need to be able to zoom the same percentage in both directions regardless of your display aspect ratio. That way, setting the same zoom parameter in both H/V will give you an undistorted picture. The way it is right now, you can set a 150% max zoom for the vertical but only about a 130% zoom for the horizontal on a 16:9 set.

I would like to see this feature too. :)

How do people feel about NOT having 1080i passthru???It sucks. Specially because setting a 1080i display profile doesn't work. After I've switced to another DP, that 1080i profile outputs 1080p.

I thought 1.05 & up firmware provided 1080i passthrough??

the original firmware was doing bob deinterlacing on 1080i ....It does passthrough 1080i. When set to 1080P, I believe it still is doing bob deinterlacing. This won't change unitl we see the VP50, or whatever.


It sucks. Specially because setting a 1080i display profile doesn't work. After I've switced to another DP, that 1080i profile outputs 1080p. :confused:
My VP30 came with 1.05 firmware and since then I've upgraded to 1.07 and the ABT Precision Deinterlacing Card. I've always had 1080i passthrough and the 1080i profile doesn't switch to 1080P, unless I manually switch it. :confused:

Paul

I thought 1.05 & up firmware provided 1080i passthrough??

the original firmware was doing bob deinterlacing on 1080i ....

Nope,

Per DVDO there is no pass thru at this time...

:(

It does passthrough 1080i. When set to 1080P, I believe it still is doing bob deinterlacing. This won't change unitl we see the VP50, or whatever.


:confused:
My VP30 came with 1.05 firmware and since then I've upgraded to 1.07 and the ABT Precision Deinterlacing Card. I've always had 1080i passthrough and the 1080i profile doesn't switch to 1080P, unless I manually switch it. :confused:

Paul

1080i In - 1080i Out is still processed and not passed thru... There is no option in the menu system like on the HD+ to set it for pass thru..

1080i In - 1080i Out is still processed and not passed thru... There is no option in the menu system like on the HD+ to set it for pass thru..
Processed? It must be very minimal processing, as I don't see a difference when I send a 1080i HDMI signal from my Toshiba HD DVD player or when I connect the Toshiba directly to a Ruby projector.

Paul

Dang - my VP30 is STILL buggy. My newer stb, the LG4200a, was connected to the VP30 by component. Had some problems with some stations, thought it might be some kind of HDMI issue, so connected via DVI-> HDMI. Viola, all stations rock solid. Did not look any better to my eyes - actually seemed a bit denser, a less open image. But at least all channels came thru clearly, with no issues. Fine.

Went to turn on to watch Deadwood the next night. Good thing I started firing up the system half an hour early. VP recognized the signal - had the blue light - and audio went thru the coax/toslink chain, but only got a blue screen, with my Runco telling me that it was an unregistered signal. Went to display profile, reselected my User Profile, got that back. Messed around for 20 minutes - the best I got was about the top 1/4 of the picture displayed - still - in blue.

Finally gave up, reconnected with component, and all was well. Afterwards, went back to HDMI input, and display was once again working. In the words of Ben Stein, "Anybody, anybody?"

btw - was not a function of the HDCP option on menu - when I turned HDCP on, curtains closed off the display. Turn it OFF, curtains open, and my blue screen with the frozen top corner came back. So that part was/is working as designed.

Processed? It must be very minimal processing, as I don't see a difference when I send a 1080i HDMI signal from my Toshiba HD DVD player or when I connect the Toshiba directly to a Ruby projector.

Paul
I agree. Does anyone really think the VP30 is doing anything "degrading" to the signal when doing 1080i --> 1080i? If so, I can't see it.

Mike

The VP30 working with most input devices over HDMI with HDCP is buggy. It is not totally the fault of the VP30. I had a discussion with a friend who indicated that DVDO was one of the few companies to get the EDID table processing correct where other systems (displays) have been blown out of the water as input devices began requesting them.

Last night I was playing with the VP30 developing a program to save and restore settings (almost done). I was switching the inputs a lot as savings are saved in different memories based upon the selected inputs. At the same time my two DVR's (SA8300HD's) were recording and in powered as opposed to standby mode (might matter). Guess what; they both rebooted within 1 minute of each other. Good thing I get the west coast feed of HBO also.

Is that the VP30's fault? I don't think so, but we must say that the VP30 contributed to the problem.

It is definately the fault of the SA8300HD, a very buggy piece of equipment with some of the worst software from a reliability/ stability point of view I have ever seen. No wonder, there is a hardware vendor and at least two software vendors that provide components for the machine. Maybe with Cisco coming into the loop it will get better but I doubt it.

Under no circumstances should a machine have to reboot itself. After all before there was software did machines ever meltdown?. Re booting when one of the primary functions is to record programs when nobody is watching (display turned off) just because the interface between the system and the display (in its view) got hosed is unnecessary and inexcusable.

Now for the VP30 culpability. IMHO the VP30 would be a lot better and provide for more stable "Total Systems" if they never turned off the input sources as far as the input source can tell. That is, they should always handshake properly for HDMI/HDCP and indicate at all times that the display is whatever the display is no matter what the display is doing or what input is actually being connected by the VP30. I bet 90% of all HDMI/HDCP related "System level" problems would go away by this change. After all the real purpose of the VP 30 is to make the "SYSTEM" better.

Billing update:

(Gary doesn't want this posted here, but since so many, myself included, have trumpeted the virtues of DVDO's superb customer service, I honestly think that the occasions when they fall down on the job also deserve to be noted.)

Josh did indeed wake up someone in house; received apology over the phone, but they still didn't credit my account soon enough to save me a hefty finance charge on the deposit they were holding.

Define hefty:-> fair enough. I was charged $29.48 because they did not credit my account on their own after 4 weeks; it was only after posting here that my money got back. Will I miss a meal because of this? No. But it would buy another DVI-HDMI cable to replace the funky one I am beginning to think I got from DVDO, with my VP30.

And yes, I still like DVDO, and their customer support, and their extremely flaky VP30, but in the future, I'll treat their billing department with the same degree of trust I give a minumum wage cashier at J.C. Penneys.

Gary - you wanted to know how they resolved it - those are the facts. Case closed.

I do. It doesn't seem to look the same as passing a 1080i signal straight to the TV.

Last night, once again, I was watching a dvd and the vp30 suddenly lost the signal and the screen went blue.

Is there any new firmware that will stop this from happening? It seems to happen when the input select is set to AUTO, which rarely works anyway. If I can get it to pick up the only unit that's on, it will drop the signal after a few minutes.

I agree. Does anyone really think the VP30 is doing anything "degrading" to the signal when doing 1080i --> 1080i? If so, I can't see it.

Mike


On a 120" screen with a 9" CRT Front Projector, I def can see the diffference doing a A-B w/ a HD+ in passthru...

On a 120" screen with a 9" CRT Front Projector, I def can see the diffference doing a A-B w/ a HD+ in passthru...
How would you define the difference? Softer? Different color? I have noticed on some programming that 1080i sources look a little "cleaner" with the VP30 between the output device and the display. Where it starts out a little grainy, the VP30 seems to fix that a bit and make it look cleaner with less noise. I don't see this as image degradation, however, I understand that noise/grain can give the appearance of extra sharpness under some conditions. I just wonder what it is that people are seeing. Some of this stuff can be very subjective.

Mike

How would you define the difference? Softer? Different color? I have noticed on some programming that 1080i sources look a little "cleaner" with the VP30 between the output device and the display. Where it starts out a little grainy, the VP30 seems to fix that a bit and make it look cleaner with less noise. I don't see this as image degradation, however, I understand that noise/grain can give the appearance of extra sharpness under some conditions. I just wonder what it is that people are seeing. Some of this stuff can be very subjective.

Mike

Mike,

I see a change in color, almost looks like a digital picture (where I am analog CRT) and much more grain from the sharpness. When you are used to a 9" crt, you see it immed.

Mike,

I see a change in color, almost looks like a digital picture (where I am analog CRT) and much more grain from the sharpness. When you are used to a 9" crt, you see it immed.
OK. Thanks. You're probably not connected via HDMI then? I'm HDMI all the way, running HDMI from output device, through the VP30, and to the display. Wonder if that makes any difference?

Mike

OK. Thanks. You're probably not connected via HDMI then? I'm HDMI all the way, running HDMI from output device, through the VP30, and to the display. Wonder if that makes any difference?

Mike

Mike,

I am HDMI from the DirecTivo for both HD Sat and OTA... From the VP30 I go out RGBHV to the projector

Josh or Dale:

Question unrelated to firmware issues, etc. for once...

If I send a 720p signal via HDMI (w/o HDCP) to the VP30 and output same via Component @ 720p, is there any processing delay? I.e. would I still need to either route my audio through the VP30 or enter a delay into my processor, or is it basically zero (less than one frame/field) delay?

-John

Josh@DVDO,

Any update on when we can expect to see the 1.08 beta firmware? I'm sure I speak for everyone here when I say thanks for all the hard work you and the team at DVDO are doing to get all these bugs worked out of the VP30.

Josh@DVDO,

Any update on when we can expect to see the 1.08 beta firmware? I'm sure I speak for everyone here when I say thanks for all the hard work you and the team at DVDO are doing to get all these bugs worked out of the VP30.
I saw in another thread where Josh quoted end of last week at the earliest or beginning of this week at the latest, so I'm hoping for the next day or so. Unfortunately it looks like Josh and the crew from DVDO don't check this thread as often as I wish they would. I sent the info on the horizontal zoom bug early Friday morning and sent a PM to Josh as well as a bug report to help@dvdo.com in hopes that if it was a simple fix they could slip it in 1.08 before it was released. Josh still hasn't read his PM from me here, hasn't posted here, and there has been no reply to my email. I guess it's asking a lot to get a response within two business days but if I were within a day or two of releasing a major firmware update, I'd sure be here every day checking this thread to make sure there are no new issues that have surfaced that might be able to be incorporated. This isn't a knock on DVDO though, as we're lucky to have anyone here at all to talk directly to as that is a dying trend these days. :rolleyes:

Mike

mchaney - We have been doing limited Beta testing on software v1.08 and and as such all of the fixes and enhancements that will be included are already determined. I can certainly look at this issue that you are reporting but the likelihood of a fix being slipped into this next Beta release is very low. We are trying to eliminate a new bug that was introduced with the addition of Panorama (non-linear stretch mode) before we put this software into public Beta release.

if I were within a day or two of releasing a major firmware update, I'd sure be here every day checking this thread to make sure there are no new issues that have surfaced that might be able to be incorporated.

Mike

I only said I wouldn't disagree with the DVDO reps ;) - But I'd have to disagree with the above statement. IF I've been working on getting a firmware update tweaked, and beta tested, the LAST thing I'd be doing is searching for new bugs to fix, prior to releasing the update. Rumour has it that the puppy has been in beta for a while - nobody is going to add "features" the day before release. You can safely assume that anything that could be addressed, added, or fixed with a day's effort already has.

Any company that tries to address bugs and add things just before an update release will end up never adding anything, and never making an update. Much like the case of waiting for the next chip/video card/chipset/ whatever before buying a computer. We'd all still be running our IBM PCs or Apple IIs, waiting for the dust to settle.

Sometimes you just have to draw a line in the silicon.

I only said I wouldn't disagree with the DVDO reps ;) - But I'd have to disagree with the above statement. IF I've been working on getting a firmware update tweaked, and beta tested, the LAST thing I'd be doing is searching for new bugs to fix, prior to releasing the update. Rumour has it that the puppy has been in beta for a while - nobody is going to add "features" the day before release. You can safely assume that anything that could be addressed, added, or fixed with a day's effort already has.

Any company that tries to address bugs and add things just before an update release will end up never adding anything, and never making an update. Much like the case of waiting for the next chip/video card/chipset/ whatever before buying a computer. We'd all still be running our IBM PCs or Apple IIs, waiting for the dust to settle.

Sometimes you just have to draw a line in the silicon.
Spoken like an employee at a big company with a lot of red tape! On simple bugs that are one-liners, it is very possible to be proactive and make a final fix that just involves changing a multiplier or scalar value and get that tested in a day. If you can't find a bug like:

x_window=x_window-(y*hor_percent)*2

And fix it to:

x_window=x_window-(x*hor_percent)*2

and get that tested in a day, you have no business being in the support industry! Granted if your code is a spiderweb or the correction involves other features, it would have to wait. You'd have to weigh the simplicity of the fix to the seriousness of the problem. In this case, it is most likely a simple fix for a problem that can (and will) result in image distortion because horizontal scaling (zoom) does not work properly and requires a different scaling from the vertical.

Mike

A few noob questions:
1) Can I have input-dependent profiles for brightness, contrast etc in the VP30?
2) Should I calibrate the projector (Cineversum 70 Ultra) or the VP30 for brightness, contrast, tint etc.?
3) Which of the following would be better to use as test patterns: the projector's, the VP30's or DVE's?

Thank you

Spoken like an employee at a big company with a lot of red tape!
Mike

not quite - but whatever. actually spoken by someone who has written and dubugged production software. But whatever, dude.

A few noob questions:
1) Can I have input-dependent profiles for brightness, contrast etc in the VP30?
2) Should I calibrate the projector (Cineversum 70 Ultra) or the VP30 for brightness, contrast, tint etc.?
3) Which of the following would be better to use as test patterns: the projector's, the VP30's or DVE's?I am a bit of a n00b myself, but I think I can properly answer these - if I am wrong I'm sure someone else will correct me.

1)I can't test this right now, but I'm pretty sure that Picture Controls settings are associated with each input. So far I've found that just about everything is tied to individual inputs except for things under "Output Setup". And even that you can tie to individual inputs by turning "Auto" on, and then setting up different display profiles.
2 & 3)My understanding is this is the best way to calibrate your system:
-Get the VP30 set up with the proper output. This would mean using whatever is the best connection for your projector, and setting up the VP30 in a way that you've got 1 to 1 pixel mapping. The 1 to 1 might not be essential for calibration, but it puts you in the right refresh rate, and the projector might behave differently at different frequencies.
-Use the test patterns in the VP 30, and calibrate your projector with those patterns
-For your DVD player, use DVE, and calibrate either the DVD player or the VP30 (not sure which one is best) against the DVD patterns.
-For any other source, send out patterns from that source (DVE recorded to video tape for a VCR, HDNet test patterns for a DirecTV DVR, etc...), and then either calibrate that device's output, or use the settings in the VP30.

Hopefully that makes sense.


Jason

actually spoken by someone who has written and dubugged production software.
Ditto. But you're right about the "whatever, dude" part.

Mike

Not quite. Every time you change something in SW there needs to be a certain level of testing AND regression testing to make sure you didn't break anything in the process. I doubt that any company worth it's salt will change things on the fly without doing regression.

flyingvee is right.

Originally Posted by petesoulis
A few noob questions:
1) Can I have input-dependent profiles for brightness, contrast etc in the VP30?
2) Should I calibrate the projector (Cineversum 70 Ultra) or the VP30 for brightness, contrast, tint etc.?
3) Which of the following would be better to use as test patterns: the projector's, the VP30's or DVE's?

1)I can't test this right now, but I'm pretty sure that Picture Controls settings are associated with each input. So far I've found that just about everything is tied to individual inputs except for things under "Output Setup". And even that you can tie to individual inputs by turning "Auto" on, and then setting up different display profiles.

This is generally correct. Each input has individual picture memories for each accepted (i.e. processed) resolution. For example, the Composite video input each have picture memories for 480i (NTSC) and 576i (PAL) content. The same is true of the S-Video inputs. The HDMI inputs have individual picture memories for 480i/p, 576i/p, 720p-50/60, 1080i-50/60, VGA-60, SVGA60, XGA-60Hz, and SXGA-60 (12 total memories per HDMI input). These memories are automagically accessed when an specific resolution is detected. So if you want to adjust the picture of SD content on your HD-TiVO, you need to make sure that you are on that input and you are sending the VP30 480i.

2 & 3)My understanding is this is the best way to calibrate your system:
-Get the VP30 set up with the proper output. This would mean using whatever is the best connection for your projector, and setting up the VP30 in a way that you've got 1 to 1 pixel mapping. The 1 to 1 might not be essential for calibration, but it puts you in the right refresh rate, and the projector might behave differently at different frequencies.
-Use the test patterns in the VP 30, and calibrate your projector with those patterns
-For your DVD player, use DVE, and calibrate either the DVD player or the VP30 (not sure which one is best) against the DVD patterns.
-For any other source, send out patterns from that source (DVE recorded to video tape for a VCR, HDNet test patterns for a DirecTV DVR, etc...), and then either calibrate that device's output, or use the settings in the VP30.

This is generally correct, but to be perfectly clear:
1. Choose the correct output resolution/timing for your display and achieve 1:1 pixel mapping, if possible. Tip: There are many great threads on AVS Forum that discuss 1:1 pixel mapping and many users have posted their NR (native rate) timings.
2. Calibrate your display using the test patterns in the iScan VP30. This means that you are adjusting the controls on the display.
3. Calibrate each source using content as suggested above using the 'Picture Control' adjustments on the VP30.

These memories are automagically accessed when an specific resolution is detected.
Automatic can seem like magic at times. :p

Sorry, too good to pass up.. :D

After running o.k. for a day, my new VP30/ABT102, running 1.07, locked up and displayed the message:

Serious Error 11
Contact your dealer

I did indeed contact my authorized dealer, and was told that "error 11 was one of those that related to software". He said that version 1.07 had been a beta and was updated to final status last Friday, although no indication of the update would appear anywhere, and that I should download it and replace the 1.07 in my VP30.

I did download the allegedly new 1.07 from dvdo.com, but a file compar showed it to be identical to the one I had downloaded a few weeks ago.

Does anyone know anything about these "serious errors" and/or about a change to 1.07?

I think the dealer was being sincere and was confident in his information. He appears to be a large stocking distributor, to the point of having a large number of ABT102s in stock at the special $200 price.

According to the DVDO website it stopped being a beta firmware weeks ago.

[QUOTE=DirectViewer]After running o.k. for a day, my new VP30/ABT102, running 1.07, locked up and displayed the message:

Serious Error 11
Contact your dealer.]

I experienced this once also and promptly called DVDO. The fix was a hard reset. I recall the issue was related to hdmi handshaking, but am no longer absolutely certain. But then again, it seems like the only issues I ever have with my VP30 are hdmi- related.

According to the DVDO website it stopped being a beta firmware weeks ago.

It was moved from beta to production when the abt102 shipped (since its needed for that). There was no difference between 1.0.7 beta and 1.0.7. We do hope *grin* there will be a bigger difference between 1.0.7 and 1.0.8

Daniel.

Not quite. Every time you change something in SW there needs to be a certain level of testing AND regression testing to make sure you didn't break anything in the process. I doubt that any company worth it's salt will change things on the fly without doing regression.


Maybe so for any company that has never heard of RAD and limits themselves to one update per quarter. If you're smart enough about developing your code and testing procedures, you can be a lot more proactive than that! If you've been in business long enough, you'll learn that no matter how much "regression" testing you do, your final users (not the beta testers) will find numerous bugs that were never found by your small beta group.

flyingvee is right.

Of course he is: his post count is higher than mine. I'd never try to argue with someone on this board who has a higher post count than me... or maybe plays the guitar. ;)

Mike

1. Choose the correct output resolution/timing for your display and achieve 1:1 pixel mapping, if possible. Tip: There are many great threads on AVS Forum that discuss 1:1 pixel mapping and many users have posted their NR (native rate) timings.
2. Calibrate your display using the test patterns in the iScan VP30. This means that you are adjusting the controls on the display.
3. Calibrate each source using content as suggested above using the 'Picture Control' adjustments on the VP30.

1. How can I be sure that I have achieved 1:1 pixel mapping? Does that mean that I have to output only at the projector's native resolution (1280x720)?

2. Is there a guide about what is the desired "look" for i.e. the color bars pattern? In what way I am sure that I have calibrated the contrast or brightness correctly by using the VP30's patterns?

3. So, after having calibrated my display using the VP30's patterns, I can then use DVE for calibrating my DVD and my HTPC. The adjustments are made using the "Picture control" menu on the VP30. Is that correct?

(I told you I am noob)

I will tackle one of your 3 questions.

You check for 1:1 pixel mapping by using the VP30 test patterns provided for that purpose. There are three such patterns. (1) alternate 1 pixel horizontal lines, (2) alternate 1 pixel vertical lines, (3) alternate 1 pixel vertical and horizontal lines giving a 1 pixel cross hatch pattern (i.e. every other pixel in both the H and V directions are on). The best picture (assuming the VP30 is a better scaler than the Projector) should occur when the vp30 has a direct digital link to the projector and there is a 1:1 pixel mapping. The direct digital link means no analog or conversion (analog to digita) noise. This means that the Projector will (should NOT) do any scaling, all scaling having been done by the VP30. the VP30 is giving the Projector just what it was desigend to see. The correct number of bits on each horizontal line, the correct number of vertical lines. This is only the case when there is a 1:1 mapping.

Once this is done you should always output from the VP30 to the Projector this way. Let the VP30 do all input adjustments (Scale), after all that is why you bought it.

2. Is there a guide about what is the desired "look" for i.e. the color bars pattern? In what way I am sure that I have calibrated the contrast or brightness correctly by using the VP30's patterns?

3. So, after having calibrated my display using the VP30's patterns, I can then use DVE for calibrating my DVD and my HTPC. The adjustments are made using the "Picture control" menu on the VP30. Is that correct?(I told you I am noob)I would sit down and watch DVE first. There is a lot of very interesting information on that disc, including how to use the test patterns. Although some of the test patterns are different from what the VP30 has, it will still give you the basics on how to calibrate brightness, contrast, sharpness, and... "picture" (can't remember the other names for that control at the moment). You can then take that info, and use it to calibrate your projector to the patterns that the VP30 has. The VP30 patterns are not as extensive, but there should still be enough there for you to be able to do basic calibration.

Thanx a lot.

I understand that although it might sound impressive to have 1080i output from a DVD or scaler, the PQ is worse if you don't have a projector with the capability to show this resolution natively, which is exactly my case since the Cineversum uses HD2+ DC3 with 1280x720 native resolution.

Received my VP30 yesterday and I'm quite pleased at the output. Can wait till I get the ABT card next week.

3 Problems I'm running into.

#1) When I set parameters (ie: brightness, contrast, etc..) using the up and down buttons, my tivo or sat receiver wants to change the channel to 0.

#2) I'm running 2 outputs. One to a PJ via HDMI (Z4) and the other to a 27" LCD via component. The pj's works great but for some strange reason the 27" won't accept the 720p input when the manual states that it can handle it. So I'm going in 1080i. I wonder if the 720p is only with the DVI input. I'll have to investigate this on my end.

#3) I tried the software update and forgot about the disclaimer on the newer usb to serial driver, so my laptop crashed and was in the constant load abt file on the vp30. So I downloaded the older usb to serial driver from DVDO and when I went to update the driver, I received an error message (along the lines of) wrong driver for your specified hardware. Did anyone get this driver working in XP? So I ran a long serial cable from the desktop and applied the update.

The problems listed above are small glitches for me, but there's a work around so I'm happy.

to Josh: 2 things. Is the usb to serial fixed on the upcoming release and how about the ability to rename the presets? Chances are that I'll be using all 10 presets and trying to remember which preset is which is nearly impossible.

Thanks.

For those interested in such things HDMI related :p , this just in from CEA Smartbrief via TWICE...

"HDMI 1.3 connectors to be available before Christmas
CE products are expected to offer enhanced audio and visual performance with the new HDMI 1.3 connectors, which will be available in stores by the end of the year, according to Silicon Image marketing director Joel Lee. HDMI 1.3 connectors boost bandwidth from 4.95 Gbps to 10.2 Gbps, enabling HDTV and videos to increase viewable colors and improve color depth while allowing future HD-DVD and Blu-ray disc players to transport all of the two formats' optional high-bandwidth surround-sound codecs in native form. TWICE (6/19)"

Enjoy ,

Scott................ :rolleyes:

I have had error 11, error 8 and error 20. I have had all of these several times over the last couple of weeks. I have had it more with the last replacement unit than any of the others. Usually a hard reset will fix the problem, but each time I have to redo all of the settings. For a while this was happening twice a day, but I have not had any issues since fri. DVDO has asked to send it back, but I am waiting for it to happen again, so that I can send it back while it still has the error.

VP30 w/ABT102 and fw 1.07
Denon 3800 (480i) ----> VP30 (1080i) ----> Mits WS-65819
No digital inputs or output so no HDCP issues. Just component and s-vid.


Hadn't used the VP30 in over a week. Went to watch a movie and nothing is displayed on the tv. Just a blue screen that the tv displays when there is no signal. The vp had a solid blue light. The last time I watched a movie everything worked fine. I couldn't even get the info or menu from the VP30 to display.

Unplugged VP30 - no change
Hard reset - no change
DVD directly to the tv's components - works fine

Left VP30 unplugged while me and the kids watched the movie. After the movie plugged the vp back in and everything worked.

Anybody else experience this?

VP30 w/ABT102 and fw 1.07
Denon 3800 (480i) ----> VP30 (1080i) ----> Mits WS-65819
No digital inputs or output so no HDCP issues. Just component and s-vid.


Hadn't used the VP30 in over a week. Went to watch a movie and nothing is displayed on the tv. Just a blue screen that the tv displays when there is no signal. The vp had a solid blue light. The last time I watched a movie everything worked fine. I couldn't even get the info or menu from the VP30 to display.

Unplugged VP30 - no change
Hard reset - no change
DVD directly to the tv's components - works fine

Left VP30 unplugged while me and the kids watched the movie. After the movie plugged the vp back in and everything worked.

Anybody else experience this?

Yup. Welcome to the club. FWIW, usually happens when you have invited over friends, colleagues, or in-laws to impress. Hasn't happened to me for two days now. :p

For those interested in such things HDMI related, this just in from CEA Smartbrief via TWICE...

"HDMI 1.3 connectors to be available before Christmas


Don't just quote the part that looks good to you about early connectors. And then also leave out the more important part where it also stated that other than the PS3 release in November, that shipping of most new products with HDMI 1.3 probably won't be until the first quarter of 2007.

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6345214.html


"The first product incorporating an HDMI 1.3 connector is expected to be the Blu-ray-based PlayStation 3, due in November from Sony. HDMI 1.3 connectors could appear later on next-generation HDTV displays, next-generation Blu-ray and HD DVD players, A/V receivers, surround-sound preamp/processors and PCs.

Silicon Image expects “a number” of HDMI 1.3-equipped products to appear at January’s CES, many of which will ship in the first quarter. They will include AV receivers, high-definition flat-panel and rear-projection TVs, and DVD players, most likely high-definition disc players, the company said."

Silicon Image's HDMI debacle continues... :mad:

Has anybody successfully used the VP30 with a UXGA display (1600x1200)?

Has anybody successfully used the VP30 with a UXGA display (1600x1200)?
I think I may have when I was stuck with a 21" CRT monitor while between TVs but mostly I ran 1280x1024 (on both a 19" and 21" CRT).

Hi Josh,

You have mentioned the imminent release of the next VP30 firmware often over the last few days but there has been very little information of what it will hopefully fix.

Would it be possible to list the bugs the new firmware is trying to address so I can see if I need to get excited or not. Im not interested in new features, just bug fixes.

Regards
Hans

Would it be possible to change the firmware in the VP30 to allow the RGB component input to allow 480i so it could benefit from the abt102? Currently, it accepts 480p and up.

thx, Tom

Would it be possible to change the firmware in the VP30 to allow the RGB component input to allow 480i so it could benefit from the abt102? Currently, it accepts 480p and up.

thx, Tom

Hmm... I had a cheap Panasonic S-295 DVD-player that I hooked up to the VP30 via 'normal' component cables, and it did send 480i (and 576i) over component, as confirmed by the VP30s Info page. I now have a Pioneer that sends 480i and 576i over HDMI intead. Also received correctly by the VP30.

Maybe you just need a DVD-player capable of outputting 480i over component, or need to change the player menu?

-Or maybe I just misunderstand something here.

Hmm... I had a cheap Panasonic S-295 DVD-player that I hooked up to the VP30 via 'normal' component cables, and it did send 480i (and 576i) over component, as confirmed by the VP30s Info page. I now have a Pioneer that sends 480i and 576i over HDMI intead. Also received correctly by the VP30.

Maybe you just need a DVD-player capable of outputting 480i over component, or need to change the player menu?

-Or maybe I just misunderstand something here.

Hi John,
Thx for responding. The component inputs (w/ rca connectors) are accepting 480i ok. I'm refering to the RGB component (w/ bnc connectors).

Tom

-Or maybe I just misunderstand something here.

What Tom wants to do is use the RBGHV (bayonet connectors in the top row) for 480i and as he says, that input is documented at 480p and above only.

You were using (presumably) the component inputs which are the red-green-blue phono plugs...

Ah. I did think it was probably something I misunderstood. Well - that's just plain weird then, isn't it? Why would that output be different? Any technical reason?

I am seriously thinking about getting the VP30. After reading some of these threads I am beginning to wonder. I was all set to call my AV guys and order tonight. Should I wait? It seems there are some issues with this unit. Advice from owners would be welcome.

Thanks!

I am seriously thinking about getting the VP30. After reading some of these threads I am beginning to wonder. I was all set to call my AV guys and order tonight. Should I wait? It seems there are some issues with this unit. Advice from owners would be welcome.

Thanks!
I am happy with mine. I am feeding it 4 devices via HDMI (video is great) and use coax/optical audio on 2 of them. In one case my Dish receiver will not pass DD5.1 over HDMI so it has nothing to do with the VP-30

Most of my problems related to one tempermental input device and I get audio drop outs over HDMI. Everyone has a different setup and the problems seem to vary but HDMI audio problems seem to be #1.

Remember that you have 2-coax & 2-optical audio inputs as well and that is how I avoid problems. I believe Josh has said they are working on the audio issues and I have confidence they will solve most.

You might wait to get input here on firmware 1.08 which is coming soon

You might wait to get input here on firmware 1.08 which is coming soon
One can only hope. Josh was saying last week that it would be the end of last week or early this week. I'm thinking they are working hard on finalizing 1.08 and getting it out since Josh still hasn't even opened the PM I sent him almost a week ago on the zoom bug. I keep checking every day for 1.08 but the end of the week is coming and still no word. Still hoping...

Mike

Beta software v1.08 is now available here: http://www.dvdo.com/update/update-vp.php

This pre-release version of our software contains the following new features:

Added ‘Panorama’ Feature
Non-linear stretch can now be applied to a 4:3 signal so that it will fill a 16:9 screen with minimal perceptual distortion in the center of the screen. This mode can be turned ‘On’ or ‘Off’ in the Input Aspect Ratio submenu. Additionally this feature can be accessed in the IAR presets and it is titled ‘4:3 Stretch’.

Six Additional Output Format presets:

848x480, 1:1 timing for NEC 42” plasmas
1024x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 42” plasmas
(In addition to the existing 1024x768 VESA format)
1360x768, 1:1 timing for Fujitsu 50” plasmas
1360x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 50” plasmas
1366x768, 1:1 timing for Panasonic 50” plasmas
(In addition to the existing 1366x768 format)
1365x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 50” and 61” plasmas

Added Output Color Space Indicator to ‘Info’ Screen
The chosen output color space is now displayed in the ‘Info’ screen.

Added Audio Format Indicator to ‘Info’ Screen.
The audio signal that is detected on the selected audio input is now displayed in the ‘Info’ screen.

Added Automation Command for ‘Info’ Screen
The ‘Info’ screen can now be turned on and off with a discrete automation control. (0xA5). 0=off. 1=on

Frame AR and Active AR are both controlled when 'Auto AR' is set in 'HDMI Config' menu. This allow users with SKY HD, for example, to use this function so that they always get a full frame image.

This software version also addresses and corrects the following bugs:

Added SiI9031 interrupt monitor to address the audio “motorboating” issue.

When info screen was turned on via the remote it stayed on screen forever or until the ‘Exit’ button was pressed.

Made the test pattern generator (TPG) more consistent across reboots, i.e. fixed problem where TPG shows up across power cycles.

Changed the EDID Extended table so that it is more compatible with the audio features of some DVD and HD-DVD players. The correct audio output format selection for HD-DVD players is ‘Bitstream’.

"4:3" and "16:9" remote control button select corresponding profile.

Switching Improvement: Made sure that automatic input controls like Color Space or AR are set correctly, before picture is enabled.

The output frame rate could only be changed when active input video signal was present

Josh, Let me be the first to say thanks!!

WoooooooooHooooooooooo!!

--------------------------------------------------
EDIT: Got it loaded and have been playing with the Non-Linear Stretch. Nice.

Well I'm uploading it now!

Aaron - I am looking forward to your feedback. You should be happy to know that the Sony 975 and the Toshiba HD-DVD should all work HDMI audio in and coaxial/optical out (of course with 5.1 audio).

Sweet!. Yes the DD 5.1 audio is working with the Sony 975 over HDMI now. I have the A1 connected to my receiver for the 5.1 PCM so I'm not sending any audio to the VP30 any more.
My HDTiVos are working also. Just recently the audio went out on both my HDTiVos over HDMI with DD. They went out about two weeks apart. I thought it was the HDMI board but it must have been something else because after the 1.08 update I'm getting the 5.1 DD over the HDMi again to the VP30. This is excellent.
I don't plan on using Panorama since I like to see 4:3 content as 4:3 but I guess alot of people will welcome it.
This is defintely a worthwhile firmware upgrade.
Thanks DVDO.
Make sure you write down your settings before the upgrade. They were reset for me going from 1.07 to 1.08. I wrote mine down just in case so I'm glad I did that.

Almost there :).

I was hoping for an non-linear stretch for 16 x 9 media to 2.35:1 for us anamorphic and "scope" screen folks. Maybe next time around, Josh ??

Thanks for the update Josh! One question, what would cause the Panorama option to be grayed out?

Regards,
Nisi

enjoy the firmware guys, I have been using it a little while and things are pretty peachy if you ask me ;)

those that waited for NLS will be happy

anyone that can, please report how your Toshiba HD-DVD is doing thru the HDMI into VP30 and coaxial/optical output

-Gary

Gary - You should be able to get dts 5.1 out of the HD-DVD player (through the VP30), given that you have the HDMI audio output set to bitstream.

Thanks for the update Josh! One question, what would cause the Panorama option to be grayed out?

Regards,
Nisi

If the Frame AR set to 16:9. this will happen.

If you press the 4:3 button on the remote both the Frame and the Active AR will be set to 4:3/1,33:1 and then you can access Panorama.

Almost there :).

I was hoping for an non-linear stretch for 16 x 9 media to 2.35:1 for us anamorphic and "scope" screen folks. Maybe next time around, Josh ??

It is certainly something that we can consider. If you have an idea of how you would like that image non-linearly stretched, please send me that model (Josh@dvdo.com).

Thanks Josh, we all appreciate this update very much so

thanks DVDO, your software updates are timely and frequent ;)

-Gary

No matter what anyone else says or thinks, I believe that DVDO is the most responsive company to thier user community I have had the pleasure of dealing with. They may not satisfy everyone all of the time, but the sure do try to.

good idea Jimmy, I use 2.35:1 myself and might check this out if available

I agree 100% Barry

-Gary

The LED brightness function seems to be different. It appears the the status LED is dimmed with the display. In 1.07 you could dim the display without turning off the status LED. I can't do it with 1.08. What does the Normal option in the LED menu submenu do? It doesn't appear to do anything.

Thanks

guys, for those who have installed the 1.08 version, would it be possible to post some pictures of the 4:3 (normal) vs 4:3 using panorama? so we can see the NLS in action?

Unfortunately I don't have a display which I can use at the moment....

many thanks,

Marcelo

Aaron - I am looking forward to your feedback.

Hi Josh,

I see there are lots of new features in your 1.08 report but no mention in your report that the audio drop outs and remote control bugs have been fixed. Did I miss soemthing or are they still outstanding bugs??

If so any idea when we can expect these as I still think those should be top priority.

Hans

but no mention in your report that the audio drop outs

Did you bother to read the release notes?

Josh

I can't begin to tell you how dissapointed I am to see no mention of audio fixes in the 1.08 firmware. I don't know if the audio drop-out issue is addressed but just not listed, but the problem with the VP30 sending out a 96kHz PCM "click" when it sees no input is still just the same in 1.08. This problem has existed since day 1, and in some amps produces a loud click or pop, but with my Denon amp switches it into a "direct" audio mode. This problem has been confirmed by other Denon owners on this forum.

The reason I'm posting this message in this public forum is that I've never been able to get a response directly from DVDO about this problems. I've reported it with every single beta release and never had a response. When many of us reported audio problems still existing with 1.07, you posted a note telling us they were top of your priority list and to send you our reports and details. I, like many other no doubt did this, but have never had a response. If you know about this and it will be fixed at some stage, please let us know. If you have a list of audio issues that have been reported but you can't address, again please tell us.

I, and I think many others here, are just looking for feedback and a focus on fixing existing problems rather than adding new features. The audio problems for me make the VP30 unusable as an audio switcher. Since one of the key features for me was it's adaptive lip sync capabilities (which I can't use), this is extremely furstrating.

The VP30 is my third DVDO product. In general, your technology is superb and your trade in program is fantastic. I preordered a ABT102 and received (I think) the first in the UK and it's just brilliant. In the past, you guys have also been great at responding to questions and have continued to deliver exactly the right products long before anyone else at a compelling price. I'm a committed DVDO customer, but the "black hole" of communications around the audio problems and also the IR problems is really beginning to get me down.

pete S

Added Scaler Based Horizontal Oversampling for Analog Output
The scaler now does horizontal oversampling when the analog output is being used. The DAC oversampling is fixed at 2x.


Excellent timing Josh! I've just had to unplug my last HDCP enabled connection from the VP30 (SkyHD, there have been a few 'incidents' of it breaking HDMI inputs on plasmas, amps and scalers so I'm not taking any chances till the bug/fault is figured out and fixed.) so was thinking of putting my LCD TV back onto the analog output which will allow me to plug the PJ back in on the HDMI (without the expense of buying another switch/dist box).

However my brain is a little fuzzy on the use of the word 'oversampling' in a VP context, I'm guessing it's a good thing but what can I expect to see? :o

Josh

I can't begin to tell you how dissapointed I am to see no mention of audio fixes in the 1.08 firmware. I don't know if the audio drop-out issue is addressed but just not listed, but the problem with the VP30 sending out a 96kHz PCM "click" when it sees no input is still just the same in 1.08. This problem has existed since day 1, and in some amps produces a loud click or pop, but with my Denon amp switches it into a "direct" audio mode. This problem has been confirmed by other Denon owners on this forum.

pete S

I had no problem with my Denon 3805, Denon 2807, or Denon 3806 which I am currently using. When the VP30 receives no signal all my Denons were silent. I never heard a click or pop and they have defintely never gone into "Direct" audio mode unless I put it in that mode. Could this have something to do with the difference in power between the US and England?

Hi Aaron

Thanks for the feedback - I've had others confirm the Denon problem on here before, so it's interesting that it's not generic. If DVDO will tell me if they can or can't repro it, that would be great to know. Perhaps I just have a duff unit - although there are lots of post on hear about people reporting clicks which may well the be same thing.

If DVDO can't repro it, then perhaps I should try and get it swapped out, but need some guidance first. So, Josh, any comments?

Thanks again Aaron

Peter

Almost there :).

I was hoping for an non-linear stretch for 16 x 9 media to 2.35:1 for us anamorphic and "scope" screen folks. Maybe next time around, Josh ??
I agree. I think a general non-linear stretch should be made available for all modes. When you use the zoom feature and set vertical zoom to 56 to eliminate black bars on 2.35:1 material on a 16:9 plasma for example, you should be able to choose whether that zoom is "linear" or "non-linear". If you choose "non-linear", it could do the same type of thing that the panorama mode is doing (don't stretch at all in the middle and stretch more and more as you approach the edge): simply modify the amount of stretch to correspond to the amount of zoom chosen.

That... and please fix the zoom bug where the horizontal zoom percentage does not correspond to the same zoom in the vertical (posted earlier).

BTW, thanks for the update DVDO! I'm in the software business so I know that updates tend to bring out even more requests, but that doesn't mean we're not grateful for what we have! Josh, I would appreciate a reply to my zoom bug here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7841440&&#post7841440) Could you please confirm that it is/is not a bug and whether or not you plan to address it.

Regards,
Mike

The way the Panorama is implemented it doesn't perform any useful function for me. I am using D* and my HD-DVR sends a 16:9 regardless of whether it is a 4:3 picture or not. When the VP see a 16:9, the frame AR, active AR, and Panorama are grayed out and can't be used. So for any 4:3 material that is sent via D* it has no function. I expect it will be the same for other satellite and cable providers.

The only time I can get it to work, is by sending it a 4:3 from my DVD player. But in this case, it appears to only stretch horizontally.

Please tell me if I'm wrong or doing something wrong.

Thanks

I have install 1.08. I have seen no problems yet. The one issue I am having is loss of audio on my Denon 1905. I do not get motorboating or clicking, but I get silence. This only happens on channel changes on my DirecTV H20 and seems to happen randomly. It maybe a week or two before I can declare everything is okay.

On the panorama, the oppo 970hd does not automatically switch between aspect ratios. It will always send a 16:9 signal to VP30. I will put the request in to Oppo to fix this. This causes the panorama function to be unreachable from my dvd player unless I change the aspect ratio setting any time I am watching a 4:3 dvd. It would be nice for this to be available at all times. Then add the ability to specify in a IAR Preset for different settings. I will probably not use panorama I do not like the distortion it creates via most implementations, but I have not seen the quality of this one yet.

DR

right, the problem is that it only provides this for 480i/576i, but in this case you guys need it for 480p/576p.

mchaney,

what problem is that? Can you describe the H/V zoom issue more thoroughly? The fact that it's separated (i.e., you can have the hzoom and vzoom different) is a plus, not a minus. You might be looking for an option to zoom linearly, but that's a functional request, not a bug report...

I do not see the HDMI handshaking issue addressed in the release, or am I missing it?

Josh,

Any word on the HD PassThru??? I was hoping it would have been in this release...

Why was it not put in originally, since the HD+ had it... Just curious...

mchaney,

what problem is that? Can you describe the H/V zoom issue more thoroughly? The fact that it's separated (i.e., you can have the hzoom and vzoom different) is a plus, not a minus. You might be looking for an option to zoom linearly, but that's a functional request, not a bug report...
I outlined the problem in detail in this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7841440&&#post7841440) thread. A separate H/V zoom is definitely needed, that's not the problem. The problem is that the zooms don't match. While the manual eludes to the zooms being a percentage, they don't work that way. For example, if the zoom is based on a percentage, setting both the H/V zooms to the same value should produce a crop with no distortion. For example, setting the vertical zoom to 56 eliminates the black bars on 2.35 material on my plasma, saving me from burnin. You'd expect that setting the horizontal zoom to the same value (56) would create a crop with no AR distortion. Such is not the case. You have to set the vertical to 56 and the horizontal to 99 in order to get a straight zoom-in without distortion. I'm convinced this is a bug because the manual states that you can zoom 150% when in reality, you can only zoom to 150% in the vertical. On a 16:9 set, the horizontal zoom is limited to about 130%. Don't think it should be that way and I bet a lot of people are setting their H/V zooms to the same value thinking they have a straight zoom with no distortion when in fact this will produce tall/skinny people as the zooms don't match.

Mike

On the panorama, the oppo 970hd does not automatically switch between aspect ratios. It will always send a 16:9 signal to VP30.

Have you set the 970HD to an upscaled resolution, and if so why? You should be sending the VP30 a 480i signal from the 970HD. With a 480i signal, there is no difference between a 4:3 signal and a 16:9 signal. They're both 720x480 pixels.

The way the Panorama is implemented it doesn't perform any useful function for me. I am using D* and my HD-DVR sends a 16:9 regardless of whether it is a 4:3 picture or not. When the VP see a 16:9, the frame AR, active AR, and Panorama are grayed out and can't be used. So for any 4:3 material that is sent via D* it has no function. I expect it will be the same for other satellite and cable providers.
Sigh. The same is true for me. I use the HR10-250 also, so the panorama function is going to be useless to me too. I still think it makes the most sense to just implement a "linear" versus "non-linear" switch on the H/V zoom so that you can choose non-linear on an arbitrary stretch. Maybe next release?

Mike

I just upgraded my VP30+ABT102 with the new beta and I'm noticing alot more aliasing artefacts (ie. jaggies) with my SD PAL input than with the 1.07.

I've done the full reset ( standby+exit+power )

Does anyone else notice this too ?

The native rate for NEC panels is appreciated, but on my 50XR5 i get green vertical bars.. not white ones. My alternative settings for the 50XR5 don't have this problem.

1366x768, 1:1 timing for Panasonic 50” plasmas

Any ideas on how to do native rate on my TH-50PX20 Panasonic plasma? The only HD signal it will accept is 1080i/60 on HDMI and component. Some people mention hooking up to the PC connector but that's on the front of the set and it doesn't look like the VP30 can output to that connector anyway. Should I just keep running it at 1080i since that is what it seems designed for even though it's native resolution is 1366 x 768? It looks great with 1080i input but it might look even better doing native resolution... if it can be done.

Thanks,
Mike

I just upgraded my VP30+ABT102 with the new beta and I'm noticing alot more aliasing artefacts (ie. jaggies) with my SD PAL input than with the 1.07.

I've done the full reset ( standby+exit+power )

Does anyone else notice this too ?

The native rate for NEC panels is appreciated, but on my 50XR5 i get green vertical bars.. not white ones. My alternative settings for the 50XR5 don't have this problem.

Hi Andrew

I only had a very brief period of time to look this morning, but I think I agree with you - I think the PQ on 1.08 is worse than 1.07. I was going to reset to factory defaults later to see if it makes any difference. Otherwise it's back to 1.07 :-(. I wonder if this is to do with the horizontal scaling for analog outputs - are you running analog per chance?

Any ideas on how to do native rate on my TH-50PX20 Panasonic plasma? The only HD signal it will accept is 1080i/60 on HDMI and component. Some people mention hooking up to the PC connector but that's on the front of the set and it doesn't look like the VP30 can output to that connector anyway. Should I just keep running it at 1080i since that is what it seems designed for even though it's native resolution is 1366 x 768? It looks great with 1080i input but it might look even better doing native resolution... if it can be done.

Thanks,
Mike

Use the VP30 RGBHV outputs to the PC VGA connector should work at 1366x768 according to the manual, bit ugly thou having a VGA connector on the front (very bizzare :eek: ).

That should give you the best quality that the VP30/50PX20 combo can do but of course you won't be able to do it with HDCP source devices going into the VP30. :(

Hi Andrew

I only had a very brief period of time to look this morning, but I think I agree with you - I think the PQ on 1.08 is worse than 1.07. I was going to reset to factory defaults later to see if it makes any difference. Otherwise it's back to 1.07 :-(. I wonder if this is to do with the horizontal scaling for analog outputs - are you running analog per chance?

Doh! I guess I spoke too soon about switching back to analogue. :rolleyes:

Are you running PAL at 50 or 60Hz output? It maybe limited testing of the oversampling analogue feature with a 50Hz output... let us know what you can find with more testing, I won't even be able to flash 1.08 till Friday night.

Doh! I guess I spoke too soon about switching back to analogue. :rolleyes:

Are you running PAL at 50 or 60Hz output? It maybe limited testing of the oversampling analogue feature with a 50Hz output... let us know what you can find with more testing, I won't even be able to flash 1.08 till Friday night.

That was my thinking as well - i.e. that it may be a 50Hz thing - I'm running 50Hz locked for my PAL inputs. I'll try some 60Hz stuff tonight and see how it looks, but I'll try a factory reset first (just in case....)

Don't forget that the 1.08 firmware is labeled 'Beta', so it's not meant to be 'perfect' yet, but meant to be tested by those who are willing to test it, and then get back to DVDO with bug reports. I'm going to wait for the non-beta release myself. Even then I'll actually wait for the initial reports by users.

No, I'm running HDMI to a NEC 50XR5.

Its like the ABT102 isnt working.. oh well beta!

Mike in order to use the VP30 and native 1366x768 on your panasonic you will have to enter via DVI and use a DVI to HDMI adapter. HDMI inputs on Panasonic plasmas do not accept native rate, it is disabled.

Mike in order to use the VP30 and native 1366x768 on your panasonic you will have to enter via DVI and use a DVI to HDMI adapter. HDMI inputs on Panasonic plasmas do not accept native rate, it is disabled.
So that means coming out of the VP30 as HDMI to an HDMI --> DVI cable and then use a DVI --> HDMI cable to get the picture into the plasma? I'm not sure even that will work, as the owners manual states that only 1080i is available on any of the HD inputs. I don't even think 1366 x 768 will work using the component inputs. Most people are saying that the only way to get the native resolution is to go into the PC input on the front of the display.

Mike

So that means coming out of the VP30 as HDMI to an HDMI --> DVI cable and then use a DVI --> HDMI cable to get the picture into the plasma? I'm not sure even that will work, as the owners manual states that only 1080i is available on any of the HD inputs. I don't even think 1366 x 768 will work using the component inputs. Most people are saying that the only way to get the native resolution is to go into the PC input on the front of the display.

Mike

notanewbie has recommneded the preferred connection for a Panasonic commercial plasma, whereas the model that you referenced is a consumer model. You are correct that the front panel VGA/HD15 ahould be capable of accepting NR. You are also correct that this exact connector is not on the VP30, but using an HD15 to 5BNC breakout cable, one could connect a VP30 to this input. We sell this cable on ouir website and it is available from most cable vendors. You will to have the VP30 set to output RGB colorspace with H/V sync when you use this connection.

I am not trying to single anyone out, if you are having an issue with v1.08, it will be very helpful if your provide us more information about the issues that you are having including the sources that you are using the display and the settings on the VP30. We can not resolve these issues unless we know what they are. Please send all feedback to beta@dvdo.com. If you have specific questions that you would like a response to, please send me an email at Josh@dvdo.com.

The way the Panorama is implemented it doesn't perform any useful function for me. I am using D* and my HD-DVR sends a 16:9 regardless of whether it is a 4:3 picture or not. When the VP see a 16:9, the frame AR, active AR, and Panorama are grayed out and can't be used. So for any 4:3 material that is sent via D* it has no function. I expect it will be the same for other satellite and cable providers.

The only time I can get it to work, is by sending it a 4:3 from my DVD player. But in this case, it appears to only stretch horizontally.

Please tell me if I'm wrong or doing something wrong.

Thanks
I've now loaded 1.08 and tried it for myself and it works for me. I have my DirecTV HD Tivo (HR10-250) set to 1080i and yes, it passes a 16:9 1080i signal for 4:3 programs with black bars on the sides. All I did was set the Active AR to 1.33:1 and then turned panorama on and it worked perfectly. Keep your frame AR set to 16:9 and just set the Active AR to 1.33:1 and then the panorama works as you'd expect. Panorama is grayed out until you set the Active AR to something other than 16:9 but Panorama is the only thing grayed out: Active AR is not grayed out. I'm using HDMI in case that matters.

Mike

Changed the EDID Extended table so that it is more compatible with the audio features of some DVD and HD-DVD players. The correct audio output format selection for HD-DVD players is ‘Bitstream’.
Can you elaborate on this a bit more? Why is the "correct" setting Bitstream? What if you want to pass 5.1 channel PCM from the HD-DVD player to an HDMI receiver? Does this still not work?

Can you elaborate on this a bit more? Why is the "correct" setting Bitstream? What if you want to pass 5.1 channel PCM from the HD-DVD player to an HDMI receiver? Does this still not work?

I agree elaboration is in order here. I recall that version 1.0 of the VP30's firmware passed 5.1 channel PCM from the Toshiba HDA1 HD DVD player from the HDMI audio. There were many dropout problems though. With later versions of the firmware, only the Left and Right main channels passed when the A1 is set to PCM or Auto. That is still the case with 1.08. Using 1.08 and setting the A1 to bitstream results in the A1's DTS encoding being used.

Chaps

FYI, there definately seems to be a problem with 1.08 and the picture quality with 50Hz PAL sources. In comparison to 1.07, with a 576i/50Hz source, there are far more artifacts with 1.08. When I upgraded to 1.08, I thought I saw this, but I've just done a Factory reset (which made no difference) and then went back to 1.07. There's an immediate and obvious difference. It almost looks like it's getting the deinterlacing mode wrong, but I've tried manual setting and it doesn't make a difference.

I'm using 852*480 output via analog to my Pana series 3 screen, so I can't see if this is specfic to analog I'm afraid. I don't know if it makes a difference, but both I and the other poster who mentioned this earlier both have ABT102's.

Josh, I'll send the details into beta.

pete S

Chaps

FYI, there definately seems to be a problem with 1.08 and the picture quality with 50Hz PAL sources. In comparison to 1.07, with a 576i/50Hz source, there are far more artifacts with 1.08. When I upgraded to 1.08, I thought I saw this, but I've just done a Factory reset (which made no difference) and then went back to 1.07. There's an immediate and obvious difference. It almost looks like it's getting the deinterlacing mode wrong, but I've tried manual setting and it doesn't make a difference.

I'm using 852*480 output via analog to my Pana series 3 screen, so I can't see if this is specfic to analog I'm afraid. I don't know if it makes a difference, but both I and the other poster who mentioned this earlier both have ABT102's.

Josh, I'll send the details into beta.

pete S

I agree with the feeling something is wrong with PAL now ... also played with some of the settings without any good effect seems more jaggies at times.

Daniel.

someone report what happens when setting the Toshiba to PCM HDMI out and using the VP30 digital outputs optical/coaxial

with the previous firmware we only got the LR channels when Toshiba HDMI is set to bitstream or PCM
with the Toshiba HDMI set to downmix we got just that from the VP30 digital outputs

my system is disconnected right now :(

-Gary

someone report what happens when setting the Toshiba to PCM HDMI out and using the VP30 digital outputs optical/coaxial

with the previous firmware we only got the LR channels when Toshiba HDMI is set to bitstream or PCM
with the Toshiba HDMI set to downmix we got just that from the VP30 digital outputs

my system is disconnected right now :(

-Gary

I already did above. L-R main channels only from the VP30 digital out when the A1's HDMI audio is set to PCM (or auto).

I don't think the VP30 is going to pass thru the decoded 6 channel PCM from the Toshiba, it just isn't possible from what I gather

thanks Joe

-Gary

I don't think the VP30 is going to pass thru the decoded 6 channel PCM from the Toshiba, it just isn't possible from what I gather

thanks Joe

-Gary

Firmware version 1.0 of the VP30 passed 5.1 channels of sound when receiving PCM from the HDA1 HDMI audio. My audio processor noted it as "Dolby D" as opposed to 5.1 DTS when using bitstream from the HDA1 HDMI audio.

See this post: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7529730#post7529730

I don't think the VP30 is going to pass thru the decoded 6 channel PCM from the Toshiba, it just isn't possible from what I gather

thanks Joe

-Gary
If DVDO implemented the full "menu" of HDMI spec 1.1 the VP30 should pass multichannel PCM. I haven't tried it myself as I've shyed away from using the unit for audio based on reports of inconsistencies here.

Is there no one button or sequence that will allow you to choose an input preset? What I'm looking for is a sequence that will select preset 1, one that will select preset 2, and one that will select preset 3. I don't see any way to do this because if you use the preset menu manually, you never know where you were last: you could have been on preset 6, "User" at the bottom, or anything. Maybe I'm missing some key sequence that will go right to one of the presets without scrolling or at least pop you to the top of the list so you have a starting reference?

Mike

I believe that capability is only available through the automation (RS232) interface. In that interface you can directly select a preset or a display profile. DVDO was begining to implement a way to have an IR command do a simple (binary, on/off) RS232 sequence (e.g. open/close curtains). The commands would not be on the supplied remote but they would exist and the pronto hex format codes would be available so several learning remotes could use the commands.

Or have I been spending too much time in the pool?

I've now loaded 1.08 and tried it for myself and it works for me. I have my DirecTV HD Tivo (HR10-250) set to 1080i and yes, it passes a 16:9 1080i signal for 4:3 programs with black bars on the sides. All I did was set the Active AR to 1.33:1 and then turned panorama on and it worked perfectly. Keep your frame AR set to 16:9 and just set the Active AR to 1.33:1 and then the panorama works as you'd expect. Panorama is grayed out until you set the Active AR to something other than 16:9 but Panorama is the only thing grayed out: Active AR is not grayed out. I'm using HDMI in case that matters.

No can do.. The AR options are also grayed out, so I can't change the active AR to 1:33:1. I am connected to the VP via HDMI. I also have the H10-250 set for 1080i.

Did you bother to read the release notes?

Yes I did. It mentioned motorboating which I believe is a different problem to the audio dropouts.

If the Frame AR set to 16:9. this will happen.

If you press the 4:3 button on the remote both the Frame and the Active AR will be set to 4:3/1,33:1 and then you can access Panorama.

__________________
Josh Allen
DVDO/Powered by ABT

This doesn't work on my VP. Also the AR and panorama options are grayed out. Any suggestions

The LED brightness function seems to be different. It appears the the status LED is dimmed with the display. In 1.07 you could dim the display without turning off the status LED. I can't do it with 1.08. What does the Normal option in the LED menu submenu do? It doesn't appear to do anything.

Anyone else seeing this?

No can do.. The AR options are also grayed out, so I can't change the active AR to 1:33:1. I am connected to the VP via HDMI. I also have the H10-250 set for 1080i.
The only thing on that menu that is grayed for me is the panorama and that can be activated by simply changing the active AR to 1.33:1. Check your output settings. What is your output format set to? My output format is set to 1080i. There has to be some other parameter set somewhere that is graying out your active AR selection but I don't know what it is. Also make sure you set your user mode to "advanced" so you can see all functions.

Mike

Thanks Mike,

I got it. Under Input Adjust->HDMI config, I had Auto Aspect Ratio set to ON. I turned it off and it works now.

Tom

Can you elaborate on this a bit more? Why is the "correct" setting Bitstream? What if you want to pass 5.1 channel PCM from the HD-DVD player to an HDMI receiver? Does this still not work?

Bitstream is the correct setting if you would like the iScan VP30 to output 5.1 compressed audio (standard DD/dts) over the optical or coaxial outputs.

Auto is the correct setting if you would like the iScan VP30 to output 5.1 audio over the HDMI output.

I should have been more clear in my recommendation.

Josh I have had some folks tell me that it is impossible for the VP30 to accept the 6 channel 96k hz PCM from the HDMI input(from the Toshiba) and output that via optical/coaxial(I would say the VP30 would have no problems sending that back out HDMI output)

the Toshiba decodes the new audio formats internally and outputs them via 6 channel PCM from the HDMI port or the analog outputs of course

if I understand correctly, we cannot get that out the VP30 optical/coaxial, we only get the LR channels of the 6 channel 96k hz PCM?

-Gary

Bitstream is the correct setting if you would like the iScan VP30 to output 5.1 audio over the optical or coaxial outputs.

Auto is the correct setting if you would like the iScan VP30 to output 5.1 audio over the HDMI output.

I should have been more clear in my recommendation.

Josh - how was 1.0 firmware able to output 5.1 over optical/coax when the A1 was PCM? And why did receivers see it as DD?

Joe - The VP30 has no audio decoder so the only reason that the v1.00 could have output DD5.1 from an HD-DVD player connected over HDMI is if there was something in our EDID which made the player output DD5.1 over HDMI, not PCM5.1. The correct behavior for the Toshiba HD-DVD players is for them to output DD as dts5.1 from their own optical/coaxial digital audio outputs, given an HD-DVD source.

I have not tried v1.00 with the HD-DVD player myself to see what is happening with the audio. I will find out tomorrow.

Josh I have had some folks tell me that it is impossible for the VP30 to accept the 6 channel 96k hz PCM from the HDMI input(from the Toshiba) and output that via optical/coaxial(I would say the VP30 would have no problems sending that back out HDMI output)

This is a bandwidth limitation of consumer optical/coaxial connections and why Firewire/DenonLink came into use for transport of DSD/MLP. Eventually we got HDMI which combined high-resolution audio and video into one fantastic connection.

OK, there may be issues with 1.08 with PAL.

How is it working with NTSC?
Video improvements over 1.07?

There are no enhancements in v1.08 that pertain to improving the picture quality.

There are no enhancements in v1.08 that pertain to improving the picture quality.

Hi Josh

There may be nothing targetted at picture quality, but there's definately something broken with 1.08 for PAL sources. I tried it again this morning, and the PQ with 1.07 is better than 1.08. 1.08 seems to introduce more artifacts. The image looks as if the source is lower bandwidth, but switching back to 1.07 and the image is as before. It's not a huge difference, but the picture just looks a little wrong with 1.08.

I've reported this to beta already.

pete S

Hi. I'm new here so excuse me for going off the latest topic in this thread.
I just recieved my VP30 today!! Basically i need to know what i should do?

I have to wait a few days for the ABT102 card to arrive. Should i go ahead and upgrade the latest firmware and instal the unit in my setup, or hang on until i get the card? If i upgrade the firmware now, will i have problems when i put the ABT card in? Or will i have problems with the latest firmware without the ABT card installed?
Also reading about the 1.08beta, should i use the 1.07 firmware? I'm in the UK so PAL is priority.
Thanks. :)

I have to wait a few days for the ABT102 card to arrive. Should i go ahead and upgrade the latest firmware and instal the unit in my setup, or hang on until i get the card? If i upgrade the firmware now, will i have problems when i put the ABT card in? Or will i have problems with the latest firmware without the ABT card installed?
Also reading about the 1.08beta, should i use the 1.07 firmware? I'm in the UK so PAL is priority.
Thanks. :)

You should go ahead and update to firmware 1.07, because without firmware 1.07 (or newer), the VP30 will not recognise the ABT102 card.

Plus, every time after you have updated the firmware, you will need to reset all your settings, so it's better that you update right away so that you won't have to reset your settings again before you put in the ABT102 card.

The unit will work OK with firmware 1.07 even without the ABT102 card being installed; there are just a few menu settings that will be unavailable until you put in the card.

Firmware 1.08 is beta, which means it may not be 100% stable, and/or it will most likely need fixes still (as can be seen from the feedback here).

So I would go for 1.07 if I were you, for now, until 1.08 is out of beta.

1.08 does address a few issues that may be important to you, like HDMI sound, but I would rather hook it up through coaxial digital for now, and use firmware 1.07.

You should go ahead and update to firmware 1.07, because without firmware 1.07 (or newer), the VP30 will not recognise the ABT102 card.

Plus, every time after you have updated the firmware, you will need to reset all your settings, so it's better that you update right away so that you won't have to reset your settings again before you put in the ABT102 card.

The unit will work OK with firmware 1.07 even without the ABT102 card being installed; there are just a few menu settings that will be unavailable until you put in the card.

Firmware 1.08 is beta, which means it may not be 100% stable, and/or it will most likely need fixes still (as can be seen from the feedback here).

So I would go for 1.07 if I were you, for now, until 1.08 is out of beta.

1.08 does address a few issues that may be important to you, like HDMI sound, but I would rather hook it up through coaxial digital for now, and use firmware 1.07.




Thanks very much mate. Thats cleared allot of things up for me. Much appreciated. Will i not get any sound from my HD-D1 through HDMI to VP30 with 1.07? Cos i don't have enough coaxial cables at the moment.

Thanks very much mate. Thats cleared allot of things up for me. Much appreciated. Will i not get any sound from my HD-D1 through HDMI to VP30 with 1.07? Cos i don't have enough coaxial cables at the moment.

I haven't actually tried to hook up sound through HDMI - I use coax from my DVD-player and my digital cable TV decoder to my receiver (which does not have HDMI switching).

So I'm only going by what I read here.

I think you should try it though, and see what happens. I think that although there are several people posting various problems here, chances are there are a lot more people out there not experiencing the same problems. If you get problems with HDMI sound, it seems it will most likely be drop outs, 'motor boating' (which I assume is a humming sound), or won't get 5.1 when you're supposed to.

But I would test it for myself if I were you, because maybe it doesn't affect you and your equipment.

Well i've just tried to update the firmware useing a serial - serial cable and the tera term program. It began downloading the file, then an "error loading" message came up on the vp30. I've tried a few times and it does the same thing. So i turned off the vp30 and now when i turn it back on again it says, "load .abt file". and won't do anything else. I've tried a hard reset, but still does it. What have i done wrong??
I've been so scared of haveing problems with it, wasn't expecting them so soon :confused:

Well i've just tried to update the firmware useing a serial - serial cable and the tera term program. It began downloading the file, then an "error loading" message came up on the vp30. I've tried a few times and it does the same thing. So i turned off the vp30 and now when i turn it back on again it says, "load .abt file". and won't do anything else. I've tried a hard reset, but still does it. What have i done wrong??
I've been so scared of haveing problems with it, wasn't expecting them so soon :confused:
Are you using a USB to serial adapter? Those have a lot of problems with the Tera Term software. I had the same thing happen to me. What has happened is you've corrupted your firmware with a partial load and you'll probably need to find a computer with an old built-in serial connection or maybe try the USB to serial fix on the DVDO site (although that didn't work for me). When updating this thing, it seems the safest way to do it is with an "old" computer that has a serial port built in. Most update problems stem from the fact that the Tera Term software doesn't "behave" properly with USB to serial adapters. Fortunately, if you can find a "native" serial connection, you'll be able to load the file and fix it.

Mike

1.08

For some time I have had my audio for inputs I am using via HDMI running through the audio connectors. LAst night I put the audio for those inouts back to HDMI. It took about 2 hours for the audio to fail. It failed when I fast forwarded on a DVR'd program. No matter what I did (short of cycling power on the VP30) was I able to regain audio. I finally put it back through the Audio paths and it came right up. I guess I will leave it on the audio inputs for a while longer.

1.08

For some time I have had my audio for inputs I am using via HDMI running through the audio connectors. LAst night I put the audio for those inouts back to HDMI. It took about 2 hours for the audio to fail. It failed when I fast forwarded on a DVR'd program. No matter what I did (short of cycling power on the VP30) was I able to regain audio. I finally put it back through the Audio paths and it came right up. I guess I will leave it on the audio inputs for a while longer.
I'm also still having problems passing audio via HDMI. I had been running optical due to the problems but last night I figured I'd switch back to HDMI to see if 1.08 fixed the problems. The problems are actually worse for me. Last night I actually got some audio motorboating when watching my HR10-250 DVR. I've never heard that before even on 1.07. My problem on 1.07 was a complete drop of the audio where I needed to "reboot" everything to get it back. I went back and viewed the same section again and it had problems only about 1/5 times so it wasn't the DVR. I went back to optical audio and played it 20 times without a problem.

Also, 1.08 seems to have more trouble "locking in" on an HDMI stream or negotiating with my plasma. It's always flickered, scrolled, and displayed snow for a few seconds when switching HDMI inputs on the VP30 but now sometimes it fails to get a lock at all: just displaying snow, black, snow, black forever until I toggle th inputs on the VP30 again. 1.07 never did that once and 1.08 has done it several times in one night. I've sent this report to beta@dvdo.com. I wish the VP30 would output a valid HDMI signal constantly so this renegotiation doesn't occur! If you set your output to 1080i/60 then it should be outputting a 1080i/60 signal all the time and not dropping the line when inputs are switched. I'm not sure all the flickering, rolling, and snow are good for the display either and I was hoping that a "smart box" like this would eliminate that problem since it technically ought to be able to hold the HDMI signal when you are switching inputs and just start transmitting the picture once the negotiation witn the new device is complete. In between, it could just display a DVDO/ABT logo at your selected output format until all the new input is ready.

Mike

Well i've just tried to update the firmware useing a serial - serial cable and the tera term program. It began downloading the file, then an "error loading" message came up on the vp30. I've tried a few times and it does the same thing. So i turned off the vp30 and now when i turn it back on again it says, "load .abt file". and won't do anything else. I've tried a hard reset, but still does it. What have i done wrong??
I've been so scared of haveing problems with it, wasn't expecting them so soon :confused:

I had the same problem myself, using a proper serial to serial cable from a proper serial port on my PC to the serial port on the VP30 (just so there's no confusion as to if I was using a USB to serial thingy!).

I just had to try several times to load the file (from the Tera Term program). Finally the VP30 OKed the transfer. Unfortunately I'm not sure what it was I did that finally fixed it. I tried several things though; I turned off the screen saver, I turned off the virus scanner, I re-downloaded the file to Desktop and loaded it from there... Maybe a couple of more things.

Anyway - I never turned the VP30 off; I just kept trying pushing the correct buttons on it (can't remember now which they are, but the software will tell you) and to send using 'Send file' from Tera Term. Finally it 'clicked' and worked all the way through.

This happened even though I had double checked all the settings as per the instructions on DVDO's site, and checking that the baud rate was the same on both the VP30 and Tera Term first.

Good luck, is all I can say unfortunately. I'm a little hesitant of upgrading to 1.08 when it comes out of beta because of this. :(

Do remember to follow the instructions on DVDOs site to the letter though, as to how the settings in Tera Term should be. I got the problem even after having done that as I said, but you should be sure you're doing it 'by the book' anyway.

I re-downloaded the file to Desktop and loaded it from there...
That could have been the problem. Where was the file initially? When I used my old laptop with serial connection, I first tried sending the file directly off the CD that I burned. It failed every time because apparently the seek times on the CD were too slow and the VP30 expects a steady stream of data. The flow control seems pretty flaky and I don't know if it's due to Tera Term, the VP30, or some other Windoze issue. I had the CR+LF for transmit and had the flow control set to hardware per the DVDO instructions and tried it 3 times from the CD: no go. As soon as I copied the file from the CD to the local hard drive, it loaded without a hitch the first time for 1.07 and the first time for 1.08.

Mike

1.08 seems to have fixed my flickering dots problem, but it still strugless with i/p output switching. Meaning, when I set a display profile for 1080i and try to switch, say to a 720p output profile, scaler outputs 720i. And vice versa, going from 720p profile to 1080i profile output 1080p. I'll report this also to DVDO's beta email address. I would really need this to be fixed before I get my HD-DVD player. See the following pictures, look at the output resolution:

http://people.cc.jyu.fi/~jajuhyvo/VP30/576i.JPG http://people.cc.jyu.fi/~jajuhyvo/VP30/720i.JPG

Ok, when i start the transer it says "loading. Sten come up with error on VP30, in tera term it says, "loading failure..... data overflow, check flow control"

So if anyone knows that that means please let me know.
Thanks guys.

Ok, when i start the transer it says "loading. Sten come up with error on VP30, in tera term it says, "loading failure..... data overflow, check flow control"

So if anyone knows that that means please let me know.
Thanks guys.
It means the computer is trying to shove data down the VP30's throat faster than it can eat it. Do you have transmit set to CR+LF and have you changed flow control from Xon/Xoff to "hardware"? You have to do that every time you open Tera Term because it won't remember it.

Mike

Ok, when i start the transer it says "loading. Sten come up with error on VP30, in tera term it says, "loading failure..... data overflow, check flow control"

So if anyone knows that that means please let me know.
Thanks guys.

Did you set flow control to hardware in Tera Term Pro. It is Xon/Xoff by default in Tera Term Pro and Tera Term Pro does not remember settings. When I updated my VP-30 yesterday I had to change the settings in Tera Term Pro even though I had set them up the last time I updated my firmware. It seems like Tera Term Pro opens with its default settings even if you have changed the settings before on a previous firmware update.

Yeah i realised tera term didnt save any settings, dumb program.... So i went through them again and set them up correctly then tried to send file, and still get the loading error.
This is most upsetting now :(
I am useing serial to serial, not usb. I tried putting the file on my desktop also.

A couple of things:

1.08 I have been pushing for the VP30 to CONSTANTLY output to its input devices, selected as the input or not, a valid HDCP/HDMI handshake, and now that I think of it, a valid EDID table so that the input devices will be happy all the time, and enable all output resolutions they are capable of unless limited by the user through setup.

Firmware loading. (Techy, but I will try and be tutorial)

I have spent the last two weeks writing my own loader (to replace TeraTerm). It has been an enligtening experience, and I am a qualified programmer with a lot of RS232 experience. I have finished the program and will probably make it available once I have done some more testing.

In addition to the loading where it will either use its own code or TeraTerm as a sub application, it has the ability to save and restore all settings (almost, but I will get into that later). I am a strange programmer in that I enjoy writing documentation, so the program is fully documented. It runs only under windows. All of the following comments are for windows based machines but RS232 is RS232 so many apply to the MAC.

First the strangeness or why does the load suddenly fail? First of all the VP30 loader uses hardware handshaking (RTS/CTS) so the minimum number of wires in the cable between the PC and the firmware is five. (2,3,5,7,8 all run pin to corresponding pin.). A three wire (2,3,5) cable may work but then I do not see how. There is a set of 5 special parameters that are only available to be set or read using the windows API (Application programming Interface). They are called the communications Timeouts. One of them, the "Total write Communication Timeout" specifies how long the PC's RS232 driver will wait for a CTS (Clear to send) to become active again after it is dropped to hold up communications. The default setting is 5 seconds. If this timeout occurs, then the PC RS232 driver will immediately drop whatever was left to send in the current block and proceed to start sending the next block. The timer can be turned off. If this timer trips during a Firmware load to the VP30, there will be a data loss and the VP30 will come up with "ERR: File corrupted, please start the reload again (or something similar). The VP30 will generally drop the CTS line for milliseconds, BUT there is a time about 915,800 bytes into the file when the CTS line is dropped for between 10 and 15 seconds. I suspect TeraTerm turns the timer off, or sets it pretty high. It may use some other technique, but I do not have the code to find out. I had never run into these timers before, so I now have a little less hair (something I can ill afford), but I am a lot smarter.

With regard to saving and restoring settings. The program reads all the settings it can, and writes them to an editable file. It does this for each of the 12 inputs and the two outputs. The save and restore operations are independent so they can be used without loading firmware and asynchronously with respect to each other, with the obvious limitation that you need to do a save before a restore. Restore uses the file Save writes, but does not know if you changed it. Now for the issue. There is no simple way of saving the presets. In essence each preset would have to be selected (can do) and then all the input parameters recorded as to what they are. There are parameters saved by resolution, by input, and then there are the Presets and Display Profiles. I can do it, but it would be a very time consuming process and with a lot of the data about what is saved and when being unavailable, it might not be foolproof.

In my world I do not use presets or display profiles so I just programmed the 'Save' based upon input and output. The PC that controls the HT is always talking to the VP30 and performs all necessary adjustments of settings and setup when ever it boots up the control application.

I have put a request into DVDO to provide a command that would just save all of the setting memories (even if it was as a non editable binary stream, no such thing in reality just no knowledge generally how), and the inverse to restore such a binary stream.

If you are interested in the program drop me a PM. Naturally al disclaimers and lack of warranties apply. I generally do not release source code, but supply an installable package. The program makes no registry entries. It has a full simulation mode so you can actually play with it on a machine not connected to the VP30. With all my testing and playing around, I have never gotten my VP30 into a state where I could not reload it.

Well I got it updated in the end. I hooked it up to my other pc and it worked without any problems. Very weird?? No idea what could be wrong with my pc to cause it not to do a simple transfer over a serial cable. All i can think is it might be service pack 2, cos it's not on my other pc.
Anyways, thanks for all your help. Now i've got to figure out how the hell i work the thing! :p
Cheers.

Its not service pack two. I have Windows XP with service pack 2 and updated the firmware yesterday without any problems.

Did you set flow control to hardware in Tera Term Pro. It is Xon/Xoff by default in Tera Term Pro and Tera Term Pro does not remember settings. When I updated my VP-30 yesterday I had to change the settings in Tera Term Pro even though I had set them up the last time I updated my firmware. It seems like Tera Term Pro opens with its default settings even if you have changed the settings before on a previous firmware update.

If you do a Save Setup over the TERATERM.ini, the next time it will be correct.

Good to know. I will save it when I update the firmware with the final version of 1.8 so I don't have to adjust settings every time. Thanks for the tip.

If you use this .ini file, all of the settings on TeraTerm will be correct.

Josh - did you forget the attachment

The shift still won't save to a profile. I guess its just too complicated for this $2000 retail box to do a basic save to memory and hold it. The software that shipped did, unless I'm crazy, but nothing since then will hold.

I sent that bug in to them on the first upgrade and its been posted in here, but it still don't work. If its suppose too then someone tell me how. I've kind of ignored the fact they don't have a way to save both a profile and preset together, but this not holding the shift memory in a profile has really started bothering me.

So, whats the problem?

Josh - did you forget the attachment

No, .ini files can not be attached. I will work on getting this on our web site. If anyone would like it in the interim, just send me an emal (Josh@dvdo.com) with 'TeraTerm .ini' in the title.

Sorry being a pain. But can anyone help me with my setup. I'm a total novice with scalers. I can't find how to get the VP30 to match my plasma's resolution, which i think is 1024x768 panasonic 42PV500. that is not on the list of resolutions to select.
The test pattern that shows a white line round the outside of the boxes is way off the screen. so i guess thats overscan? and do i only ever have to set this once and it will remember my resolution, even when i change from 720p to 1080i or whatever.
Also why does my screen freak out when i put it to 1080i @ 50hz?
Again sorry for all the noobie questions, i learn it all eventually.
Thanks

Bitstream is the correct setting if you would like the iScan VP30 to output 5.1 compressed audio (standard DD/dts) over the optical or coaxial outputs.

Auto is the correct setting if you would like the iScan VP30 to output 5.1 audio over the HDMI output.

I should have been more clear in my recommendation.
OK, thanks for the clarification. If I have some time this weekend I will try 1.08 to see if it works passing 5.1 channel PCM from my HD-A1 to my Yamaha receiver using an all HDMI path. I've had no success with previous firmware versions. As someone noted version 1.0 would cause the Toshiba HD DVD players to output Dolby Digital no matter what setting was used on the player (Auto, PCM, Bitstream). Subsequent firmware versions passed 5.1 channel PCM to the HDMI output, but with my receiver I get a high pitched tone overlayed on top of the audio.

Sorry being a pain. But can anyone help me with my setup. I'm a total novice with scalers. I can't find how to get the VP30 to match my plasma's resolution, which i think is 1024x768 panasonic 42PV500. that is not on the list of resolutions to select.
The test pattern that shows a white line round the outside of the boxes is way off the screen. so i guess thats overscan? and do i only ever have to set this once and it will remember my resolution, even when i change from 720p to 1080i or whatever.
Also why does my screen freak out when i put it to 1080i @ 50hz?
Again sorry for all the noobie questions, i learn it all eventually.
Thanks

Updating your firmware to the 1.08 version might help but I am kind of a newbie myself. It is a beta release so it might be buggy but I've been running it for a day with no problems yet. This is a cut and paste from the new features of 1.08 from dvdo's website.

Six Additional Output Format presets:

848x480, 1:1 timing for NEC 42” plasmas
1024x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 42” plasmas
(In addition to the existing 1024x768 VESA format)
1360x768, 1:1 timing for Fujitsu 50” plasmas
1360x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 50” plasmas
1366x768, 1:1 timing for Panasonic 50” plasmas
(In addition to the existing 1366x768 format)
1365x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 50” and 61” plasmas

Updating your firmware to the 1.08 version might help but I am kind of a newbie myself. It is a beta release so it might be buggy but I've been running it for a day with no problems yet. This is a cut and paste from the new features of 1.08 from dvdo's website.

Six Additional Output Format presets:

848x480, 1:1 timing for NEC 42” plasmas
1024x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 42” plasmas
(In addition to the existing 1024x768 VESA format)
1360x768, 1:1 timing for Fujitsu 50” plasmas
1360x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 50” plasmas
1366x768, 1:1 timing for Panasonic 50” plasmas
(In addition to the existing 1366x768 format)
1365x768, 1:1 timing for NEC 50” and 61” plasmas


Thanks mate, but think i'll give the 1.08 a miss until it's out of beta.
SO in output-format-720p@50, when i watch a dvd or something, is it overscaned until i manage to get the correct resolution sorted out in the test patterns?

Jay182:

The thing is that 1) you need to send either 480i (NTSC) or 576i (PAL) from the DVD player to the VP30, especially when you get the ABT102 card, otherwise the DVD player will have done the deinterlacing already when the signal reaches the VP30, and you won't benefit from the VP30s deinterlacing.

And you should 2) not upscale in the DVD player either, because then you miss out on the good upscaling engine in the VP30.

Out from the VP30 you shold try to match the panel's highest (native) resolution, as you mentioned. In your case 1024x768 as you said.

The problem there is that your Panasonic is a consumer model, which will most likely not allow its native rate in over a digital connection - or if it will, most likely only at 60Hz, which is not so good for you since you live in the UK (which is 50Hz PAL). 60Hz will work (if it's possible with your panel at all) but will introduce a slight judder as all 50Hz material (the majority of your material) will then have to be converted to 60Hz by the VP30 in order to fit the panel.

But you could try the analog PC input and see if you can get native rate that way (usually easier on consumer plasmas), or you may find that you'll just have to send 720P from the VP30 and unfortunately let the panel do some scaling of its own.

But even when/if you achieve native pixel rate, you will have to go into the menues of the VP30 afterwards and use Overscan, Zoom and Pan (and maybe even Underscan) in order to place the image correctly on the screen (so that it's centered and not too big).

A small but annoying bug with 1.08: entering or existing test patterns mode will change display profile to user.

Guys,

I've worked out a simple way for Mac (or Linux) users to download ABT binary files to the unit.

Teraterm is just sending the file RAW using no protocol such as XMODEM/YMODEM/ZMODEM etc.

So what I did (using my Keyspan USB to Serial adapter) and my Mac Powerbook G4 is create a serial printer called "Keyspan" with RAW profile, the right serial port (Keyspan1) and 57600 N-8-1 with CTS/RTS handshaking.

You might find the following website handy for getting the setup right :

http://webpages.charter.net/mbroughtn/serial_printing.html

Get the ABT to the Software Update option and when it says "Load file now"

You go to Terminal ( or Unix shell) and type ' lpr -P Keyspan vp30_1.07.abt '

The VP30 starts downloading the binary file and a few minutes later it reboots nicely. Just ensure the activity character keeps spinning. The Keyspan USB dongle will blink as data is sent to the VP30.

Doesn't let you save your profile because it's one way.. but it works.

Andrew is quite correct. The only tricky part is that you do not want the transmitter, in this case the serial port process, to timeout transmissions thinking that something happened. Tera Term does nothing with what it gets from the VP30 other than display it. The VP30 send some text at the start of the download, what you see in the VP30 LED is the end of that text. It also sends some at the end of the transmission or on an error, the last parts of which are visible in the LED display.

In essence the VP30 firmware loader is very simple (Elegant to some, stupid to others). It just expects a binary stream paced by the CTS control line. It does not care about block size, checksums, etc. All of that if it exists is built into the firmware file.

My VP30 doesn't receive the 1280x1024 (SXGA) from my computer via its RGBHV input, although the VP30 manual says it shoud be able to. The info screen says the video source is "Component 3" (which it is) but that the signal type is "unknown".

If I change the computer resolution to 1024x768 (XGA), the VP30 picks it up o.k.

Am I failing to set some parameter in the VP30 or is my unit defective? Does anyone else have this problem?

Thanks!

Well, I just got my first audio dropouts today with 1.08. The connection was optical Dolby Digital 5.1 from the DVD player and optical out to the receiver. Boy I'd love to see these dropouts fixed. The same setup was flawless on the HD+.

BTW - I'd be happy to run some debugging firmware and get you guys some data on this. I can leave a dedicated PC capturing logs out the serial port or whatever you need.

- Collin

I have moire (and a bit of flickering) on my VP30/ABT102 with Comcast SDTV that I need to get rid of...
Any suggestions?

I have moire (and a bit of flickering) on my VP30/ABT102 with Comcast SDTV that I need to get rid of...
Any suggestions?

Have you tried setting it to 'video mode' deinterlacing?

How do you connect the SD Box to the VP30? composite? Svideo? Component?

is the box doing any upscaling or deinterlacing itself? ie: are you outputting 480i or 480p? 480i is obviously the best so you can use the ABT102 ...

Jay182:

The thing is that 1) you need to send either 480i (NTSC) or 576i (PAL) from the DVD player to the VP30, especially when you get the ABT102 card, otherwise the DVD player will have done the deinterlacing already when the signal reaches the VP30, and you won't benefit from the VP30s deinterlacing.

And you should 2) not upscale in the DVD player either, because then you miss out on the good upscaling engine in the VP30.

Out from the VP30 you shold try to match the panel's highest (native) resolution, as you mentioned. In your case 1024x768 as you said.

The problem there is that your Panasonic is a consumer model, which will most likely not allow its native rate in over a digital connection - or if it will, most likely only at 60Hz, which is not so good for you since you live in the UK (which is 50Hz PAL). 60Hz will work (if it's possible with your panel at all) but will introduce a slight judder as all 50Hz material (the majority of your material) will then have to be converted to 60Hz by the VP30 in order to fit the panel.

But you could try the analog PC input and see if you can get native rate that way (usually easier on consumer plasmas), or you may find that you'll just have to send 720P from the VP30 and unfortunately let the panel do some scaling of its own.

But even when/if you achieve native pixel rate, you will have to go into the menues of the VP30 afterwards and use Overscan, Zoom and Pan (and maybe even Underscan) in order to place the image correctly on the screen (so that it's centered and not too big).



Hi thanks for all that info. Most of it makes sense, i'm really trying to get my head round all this, far to much maths involved for me!
I'm connecting via HDMI, dvd player is HDMI outputting 576i, sky is scart to RGBs 576i and HD-DVD - HDMI 1080i.
So i just set it in VP30 output-format- 720p. Source pictures look ok, don't seem to be massively overscanned, but i don't really know how to tell if they are anyways? but the test patterns are way wrong. The boxes with the 1 pixel wide line around the outside is way off the screen, i've tried adjusting Hsize etc but can't get it anywhere near correct. I know i'm doing something wrong, just need to know what that is.. anyways, i'm begining to realise all this scaler stuff is way out of my league, maybe shouldn't have got it?

Josh,

My VP30 seems to no longer stops audio completely with the DirecTV H20. My denon will still get confused and refuse to output audio after a channel change. If I change channels and then come back to the same station the audio works. There is a Dolby Digital indicator light on my Denon AVR-1905, when the audio does not happen it will not go steady it will flicker. Sometimes it will flicker for a short period of time 1-2 seconds and then recover, but other times (rare now) it just keep flickering.

I have the Oppo 970HD, which is wonderful for watching movies. The oppo does not allow for automatic aspect ratio output. I want it to send a 4:3 aspect ratio w/o the black bars and not to stretch it. Someone my need to explain what I am not understanding. The VP30 clearly is getting some aspect ratio information over HDMI, why can't the 970 do something similar like my DirecTV H20 is?

Well, I just got my first audio dropouts today with 1.08. The connection was optical Dolby Digital 5.1 from the DVD player and optical out to the receiver. Boy I'd love to see these dropouts fixed. The same setup was flawless on the HD+.

BTW - I'd be happy to run some debugging firmware and get you guys some data on this. I can leave a dedicated PC capturing logs out the serial port or whatever you need.

- Collin
Running an HR10-250 and Yamaha receiver, I too noticed my first dropouts using optical for the audio. I backed up the DVR and each time the dropouts disappeared on the second round watching the same section so they almost seem random. To me, 1.08 seems worse than 1.07 in this respect. Curious, do you have your video hooked up via HDMI? I haven't had any video dropouts but sometimes when the HDMI data stream has some "bit loss" it seems to affect the audio. I wonder if something about the HDMI actually causes loss of audio even when you aren't running the audio via HDMI.

Mike

OK, thanks for the clarification. If I have some time this weekend I will try 1.08 to see if it works passing 5.1 channel PCM from my HD-A1 to my Yamaha receiver using an all HDMI path. I've had no success with previous firmware versions. As someone noted version 1.0 would cause the Toshiba HD DVD players to output Dolby Digital no matter what setting was used on the player (Auto, PCM, Bitstream). Subsequent firmware versions passed 5.1 channel PCM to the HDMI output, but with my receiver I get a high pitched tone overlayed on top of the audio.
Installed 1.08 and still get the same behavior sending 5.1 channel PCM through the VP30 to a Yamaha HTR-5990 HDMI receiver. It passes 5.1 channel PCM to the receiver, but there is a loud continuous high pitched tone overlayed on the audio. Works fine if I go directly from the HD-A1 to the receiver.

Just wondering, has anyone successfully passed 5.1 channel PCM via HDMI through the VP30? I'm wondering if it related to my receiver or a general problem with the VP30.

The good news is that I can now send DD and DTS over HDMI from my Sony DVP-NS975V DVD player. This worked in version 1.0, but in every version since I could only get 2 channel PCM over HDMI and had to send the audio over SPDIF. In 1.08 it seems to be fixed.

Sorry being a pain. But can anyone help me with my setup. I'm a total novice with scalers. I can't find how to get the VP30 to match my plasma's resolution, which i think is 1024x768 panasonic 42PV500. that is not on the list of resolutions to select.
The test pattern that shows a white line round the outside of the boxes is way off the screen. so i guess thats overscan? and do i only ever have to set this once and it will remember my resolution, even when i change from 720p to 1080i or whatever.
Also why does my screen freak out when i put it to 1080i @ 50hz?
Again sorry for all the noobie questions, i learn it all eventually.
Thanks
Hi

Yeah I'm pretty sure the 42PV500 is 1024x768 - which isn't listed on the output formats as that res, but actually is "XGA" (and then you can tweak it to match if needed)

The only quesiton is whether your pv500 can accept 1024x768 @ 50Hz over HDMI, I think there's a good chance it won't I'm afraid. My Panny PHD8 can't and it's generally friendlier with scalers than the pv500. So I have to use analog connections instead

So when the pv500 receives a (non-native) 720p signal, it always overscans it, as far as I know which is why you're seeing your test pattern go off the screen. Bloody annoying and to be honest, it could be that a scaler & a pv500 aren't a good combination but if I were you I'd try out XGA @ both 50 & 60 Hz outputs (just to see what happens, if you get lumbered with only getting a picture if you use 60Hz output on a 50Hz source, it's not a workable solution but at least you'll know what's going on).

As for why it goes mad when it gets 1080i@50 - that's really odd. What actually happens?

Guys,

I've worked out a simple way for Mac (or Linux) users to download ABT binary files to the unit.......



Andrew,

Would it be possible for you to provide more complete instructions on how to set this up and possibly make available the printer file you used? It would be much appreciated. Thanks.

Hi

Yeah I'm pretty sure the 42PV500 is 1024x768 - which isn't listed on the output formats as that res, but actually is "XGA" (and then you can tweak it to match if needed)

The only quesiton is whether your pv500 can accept 1024x768 @ 50Hz over HDMI, I think there's a good chance it won't I'm afraid. My Panny PHD8 can't and it's generally friendlier with scalers than the pv500. So I have to use analog connections instead

So when the pv500 receives a (non-native) 720p signal, it always overscans it, as far as I know which is why you're seeing your test pattern go off the screen. Bloody annoying and to be honest, it could be that a scaler & a pv500 aren't a good combination but if I were you I'd try out XGA @ both 50 & 60 Hz outputs (just to see what happens, if you get lumbered with only getting a picture if you use 60Hz output on a 50Hz source, it's not a workable solution but at least you'll know what's going on).

As for why it goes mad when it gets 1080i@50 - that's really odd. What actually happens?


Thanks really helpful stuff. I think it will only display XGA @60hz. I have my pc connected to VGA and it won't display @50hz.
I've managed to get the screen to fit now using the underscan, shift and zoom option, things are looking much better now!!
Sorry did i say 1080i? Sorry i meant 1080p. I've no idea if it will display this or not? If it does, i can't get it to work.... Any idea about that??
One other question, when i instal my ABT102 card, will i have to reinstall the firmware. im on 1.07 now, i don't want to use 1.08 until it's out of beta.
Thanks again for your help

Have you tried setting it to 'video mode' deinterlacing?

How do you connect the SD Box to the VP30? composite? Svideo? Component?

is the box doing any upscaling or deinterlacing itself? ie: are you outputting 480i or 480p? 480i is obviously the best so you can use the ABT102 ...


Sorry for the incomplete info.

I have the de-interlacing in auto.
This Comcast Motorola 6208 STB passes 480i (for SD channels) and 1080i (for HD) thru component to the VP.
From there via HDMI to a Sammie HLP5685w RP.
Very few jaggies on SD.

Running an HR10-250 and Yamaha receiver, I too noticed my first dropouts using optical for the audio. I backed up the DVR and each time the dropouts disappeared on the second round watching the same section so they almost seem random. To me, 1.08 seems worse than 1.07 in this respect. Curious, do you have your video hooked up via HDMI? I haven't had any video dropouts but sometimes when the HDMI data stream has some "bit loss" it seems to affect the audio. I wonder if something about the HDMI actually causes loss of audio even when you aren't running the audio via HDMI.

Mike

Yup same thing here.

My setup is : VP30 video out connected to the display via an HDMI->DVI cable. I've also tried the display's HDMI input with no difference in the dropouts. VP30 connected via optical (also tried coax) to the receiver. My main sources are an HD DirecTivo connected via HDMI (also tried optical for audio) and a DVD player connected via SDI and optical (also tried coax). Since 1.0 I have had dropouts on both the HD Tivo and the DVD player. With 1.08 I have only heard dropouts from the DVD player, but I'm sure its a matter of time before the Tivo does the same thing. Note that the exact same configuration worked perfectly via the HD+ and of course i get no dropouts if I bypass the VP30 for audio.

- Collin