I have, as you know, also just bought this PJ, and I think the picture is really nice. Very deep image because of the high contrast and nice natural-looking colors. But one thing I noticed is that subtitles can look very bright in dark scenes. You could probably say they get some kind of a white shade around them. I have the iris closed and brilliant color off.

This must be because it outputs quite much light compared to other PJ's, but I don't know if this is something I just need to get used to? Or if it will become a problem for me. Could a grey screen with 0.8 gain help this problem? Right now i'm just using some homemade white/light-greyish stuff.

But one thing I noticed is that subtitles can look very bright in dark scenes. You could probably say they get some kind of a white shade around them. I have the iris closed and brilliant color off.

This must be because it outputs quite much light compared to other PJ's, but I don't know if this is something I just need to get used to? Or if it will become a problem for me. Could a grey screen with 0.8 gain help this problem? Right now i'm just using some homemade white/light-greyish stuff.

I had the same problem and what made it even worse was that this extreme brightness (in dark scenes) gave me terrible raindow effects (yes, even on the subtitles). I have now fixed it with a filter. You can try the following to see if it would help you: Set the contrast setting very low. Try -30 (the lowest possible setting) in a darkened room. Whites should be now less bright and not bother even on dark scenes. In a darkened room the whites should still seem "white", not gray.

If the above helps, consider trying a neutral density filter, such as HOYA ND4 HMC 72mm. The filter will cut the light output, allowing you to use normal contrast setting (0) for roughtly the same level of light output for whites. Blacker blacks are a nice bonus too.

If you find the contrast setting -30 not producing enough light (obviously without the filter!) for whites, try higher settings (-20, -15 etc.) to see where you find the balance. For these kind of values a filter that cuts less light (HOYA ND2 HMC 72mm) would be a better match.

Darker gray (lower gain) screen would be better than a filter, since it also reduces the reflection of ambient light (also light reflected on bright parts of the screen back to the screen via the surfaces in the room). But since I did not dare to paint the screen THAT dark, I'm right now using a combination of gray screen and an ND4 filter, and am prepared to change to an ND2 filter when the bulb gets dimmer, and maybe removing the filter altogether when the bulb gets really dim (unless it blows before it gets there :-).

If you go with the filter, note that HC3000 does not have threads for attaching it, so you need to use some tape to make sure the filter doesn't fall off.

Jarno

Jason Turk has the AVS review and screenshots of the HC3000 up on another sticky thread.

He can also e-mail a copy of his calibration setings to those who request it.

He likes it.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=613190
Is anyone else having problems viewing this thread? I want to read his review so bad!

So what screen/screen material is best then for the HC3000?

So what screen/screen material is best then for the HC3000?

The Vutec Screen Machine recomended a Silvestar 6.0, but my sales guy told me it would perform well with a Vutec Vu-Easy BriteWhite. I didn't ask about Stewart , Draper, Dalite, etc.. Would be nice to know though. :)

I would be a little concerned about using this pj with a high gain screen in any room where you didn't have excellent ambient light control (black walls, dark-colored furniture, good distance from screen and reflective surfaces, etc...). Unless you were projecting a huge image, and really needed the extra light, I'd stick with a grey screen personally. As you can probably gather from this thread, there's already a lot of people having problems where the pj produces more ambient light in their room than they expected. There's also light spill inside of the pj, so even in a perfectly dark room, a grey screen will go a ways to help the pj achieve true black.

Does anyone know if there is any difference from the japanese version and american? Or are they identical?

Is anyone else having problems viewing this thread? I want to read his review so bad!


It appears to be posted in an AVS Club or private area.

Does anyone know if there is any difference from the japanese version and american? Or are they identical?

Murilo, as I stated earlier, they are identical. The OSD is initially set to Japenese and there is only a Japenese manual (English one is available as PDF). In short, once you change the OSD to English you have the exact same projector as the U.S. version.

A family member had recently purchased ColorVision Spyder2PRO Studio to calibrate her Apple display for Photoshop work, so I borrowed it to see if I could make it do anything useful for my HC3000.

My HC3000 is ceiling-mounted approximately 11.5' from the screen wall. My screen is an 80"x45" (92" diagonal) Da-Lite High Contrast CinemaVision on a Perm-Wall frame. It is fed 480p component signals from my Panasonic DVD player via the computer connector. It has ~100 hours on the lamp.

If you don't visit the Calibration Forum much, this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=572098) will contain plenty of backstory on the Spyder2 (in all of its variants) and its usefulness as a HT calibration tool.

I will preface this with the fact that I don't have any previous experience doing this kind of calibration, and as such I don't have high confidence in the results I obtained. Some of this also has to do with the limitations of the hardware and software I used for the readings. These are by no means certified or accurate. YMMV, etc.

However, I consider the data at least interestingly relevant in a relative sense (i.e., take a set of readings, change a parameter in the projector's menu, take another set of readings, see what changed).

The way the test and the spreadsheet I used works is simple: retrieve xyY colorimeter values from the Spyder while displaying 0-100 IRE test patterns from Avia. Plug the xyY numbers into the spreadsheet, and it displays the sampled gamma curves and other useful information.

The "target" gamma curve on the following charts is for a total gamma of 2.22.

First, I took a baseline sampling at the settings I've been using to watch program material since I received the projector.

Gamma: Cinema
Color Temp: 6500K
Color: 0
BrilliantColor: Off

http://home.austin.rr.com/hwj/ht/gamma01.gif

The spreadsheet calculated the sampled total gamma to be 2.31.

It also reported a color temp of 10500K at 40 IRE and 9750K at 80 IRE, which definitely supported my gut-feel that the HC3000's picture out of the box seemed a little chilly. This was reinforced by the graph on the spreadsheet that shows the R, G, and B levels (and their error) relative to D65:

http://home.austin.rr.com/hwj/ht/levels01.gif

Too much blue, not enough red. (IMO, ignore the readings at 10 IRE and below; the software I was using didn't allow me to set the Spyder to sample long enough to get accurate low-light data. )

Next set. All I did was turn BrilliantColor on. Hopefully this should help give some clues to the question, "What does BC actually do, anyway?"

http://home.austin.rr.com/hwj/ht/gamma02.gif

It does shift the gamma curves slightly, pulling them down to be closer in line with the target curve. The total sampled gamma was down to 2.27 from 2.31 with BC off.

So, BC may make color tracking more mathematically accurate, but I guess everyone's perception is different, as I still think prefer the overall image presentation with BC off. Perhaps this will change as the lamp ages and settles down. People's choice of screen material may also affect this.

Next I iterated this sampling process a bunch of times, switching BC back off and changing the color temp mode to User and setting individual R, G, and B brightness/contrast levels in order to adjust the curves to try and bring the color temp down towards D65.

Here's where I ended up:

Gamma: User
Baseline: Cinema
High +2
Mid 0
Low 0
Color Temp: User
Red Contrast: +5
Red Brightness: +9
Green Contrast: 0
Green Brightness: -1
Blue Contrast: -5
Blue Brightness: -8
Color: 0
BrilliantColor: Off

And the results:

http://home.austin.rr.com/hwj/ht/gamma03.gif

According to the spreadsheet, the total gamma was now 2.23, pretty close to the target. That red curve is way off, but I don't have enough calibration experience to know if this is what I should expect. Nonetheless, the relative RGB levels were much flatter now:

http://home.austin.rr.com/hwj/ht/levels03.gif

And while there still remains the issue that the low-IRE data is not quite accurate, the chart does support my real-world observation that at these settings, blacks did look much redder than I would've liked.

However, the overall color temps were much less chilly now (6550K at 40 IRE, 7200K at 80 IRE) and on program material (both DVD and HD content), I'd have to say that the added warmness really makes the image look much better to my eyes.

With regards to tweaking the gamma curve in the User gamma mode, it would appear that positive values shift the portion of the curve (low, mid, high) to the left (relative to a gamma curve graph). Negative tweaks nudge the curve to the right.

It would be interesting to re-do my testing with a CC20R filter (or similar) attached.

Feedback appreciated.

It appears to be posted in an AVS Club or private area.


Does anyone have ANY idea why this is the case? This review was originally posted here in the forum and after a number of days, it disappeared.
As I asked earlier in the discussion, why? What does this mean? Has something changed that caused them to pull the review?
Why would a review that was placed here suddenly be gone and apparently now moved to a "private" area? Some questions that I think we deserve answers to.


John

Hi!

Does anyone know how to check how many lamp hours are used with the Mitsu. I think you have to press up arrow, down arrow and some other button on the projector to get into a special menu, but don't exactly remember.

Hi!

Does anyone know how to check how many lamp hours are used with the Mitsu. I think you have to press up arrow, down arrow and some other button on the projector to get into a special menu, but don't exactly remember.

You got it. It's up, down, and enter on the projector body all at the same time.

Those buttons are squished awfully close together. I have a hard time getting my fingers on them all at the same time.

What is the best setting of the overscan option? If i try set it at 100% a weird white stripe appears in the upper left side of the picture?

What is the best setting of the overscan option? If i try set it at 100% a weird white stripe appears in the upper left side of the picture?

As close to 100% as possible, but so that the stripes disappear (e.g. 97%), if the signal is < 720p, i.e. the PJ is doing the scaling anyway.

If the input signal is 720p, you should use 100% overscan (i.e. no overscan) to avoid scaling the signal by the PJ. In this case you can use the SHUTTER (U) setting to mask the white stripe.

Okay thanks :) At 99% there's no stripe, so I'll use that.

What exactly are those shutter options?

What exactly are those shutter options?

They are located in the same menu as the OVER SCAN setting, and can be used to mask off lines from the top, bottom, or either side of the image.

I tried put overscan on 100%, and then I managed to move the stripes away with the shutter settings. Is this also a preferably setting when viewing normal DVD material? Rather than using 97-99%?

I tried put overscan on 100%, and then I managed to move the stripes away with the shutter settings. Is this also a preferably setting when viewing normal DVD material? Rather than using 97-99%?

Overscan crops picture on all 4 sides. If you're only seeing this stripe on one side, it's best to leave Overscan at 100% and apply just enough electronic blanking ("shutter") to cover the stripe.

Are you seeing this on all video sources, including DVD, or just on broadcast TV?

I have only tried watching DVD (can't watch TV where the PJ is mounted). In one movie just one white stripe appeared in the upper left corner, but in another movie a green flickering stripe also appeared in the bottom of the image. Haven't tried any more than those two movies yet :)
I can completely remove the stripes tho, with the shutter. Both stripes are quite thin.

I can completely remove the stripes tho, with the shutter. Both stripes are quite thin.

Many DVDs have couple of pixels of black on the sides as well. Also, DVD players usually can't output all 720 pixels due to some NTSC scan line timing issues. Due to these reasons I've decided to leave the overscan to 97% for all DVDs. I would not do this, if my DVD player would upconvert to 720p.´

I've been tyring to figure out if the HC3000U will be about equivalent to the Optoma HD72 and Infocus IN76 when they come out. Some of the impressions at CES 2006 sounded positive but I dont think anyone was able to do real evaluations of these projectors as they had differing setups.
Feature-wise the HC3000U has an iris, and the ability to display 1024x768. The Infocus... well it has a better warranty and my guess is it will be the brightest projector, and most likely will require less tweaking out of the box to calibrate D65. The Optoma has a 7 segment color wheel and the ability to also display 1024x768.
I'm wondering if the iris will give the Mitsubishi the best contrast / black levels? I'm guessing for a 92" screen none of them will have a problem with brightness... what about 106"? Is the Mitsu bright enough for a 106" screen (prob Highower or Graywolf) with the iris closed?
Also very interested in people's thoughts about the relative merits of these projectors. I also hope that Mitsubishi will drop the price to match these new projectors when they become available.

Can anybody tell me if the rainbow effect can be more visible when using a white screen than a gray low gain (0.8)?
I ask because I watched this PJ with a gray screen and I saw absolutely no rainbows, even though I tried to see them. But yesterday, with my homemade white screen, I noticed some slight rainbows when I looked over subtitles. This made me a bit confused if the rainbows will become a problem for me, I don't think it will, but I liked the fact that I really couldn't see them no matter how I tried.

I have yet to see a single rainbow with this projector, which has really surprised me. SethK, this projector is stunningly bright and will light up just about any size screen easily. I currently have it paired with a High Power and its like looking at a Plasma. I have actually had to add a ND2 filter to tone it down.

Brian

I agree with Brian. I have yet to see a rainbow and the same for my wife. we saw them easily with the X1 but they seem to be non existant on the HC3000.

What about subtitled material? I don't think I'm disturbed of it, but at some scenes I think I can see a bit if I try, on the subtitles that is.

I was home again this weekend so I had a bit more time to spend with the projector. The more I mess around with it the better It gets. People told me switching from the benq 8700+ to the hc3000 was to much of a lateral movement, but the picture is brighter, blacks and color are better, hdtv is definately better, and simply amazing. To be honhest I love a bright vibrant picture, I have this thing on standard lamp, brilliant color, and closed iris, guess thats what happens when you come from a plasma.

My hdmi/dvi adapter also came so i was using dvi instead of vga this week. Definately hdmi looks a bit sharper, and seems to have less noise. I would definately recommend the hdmi input, picture with it, is incredible from a htpc.

Regarding noise, I dont notice brilliant color contributing to noise at all. It definately makes the picture brighter with more punch, but with it off I still see the noise the picture is just darkened, and therefore the noise appears darker. Still definately visible. The vga input I used last time I thought had a bit to much noise, with hdmi I find it better.

I watched a fair amount of bright HD shows where noise would be aparent. The other week using vga some shows on discovery HD had way to much noise, as well as some movies. This week I noticed very little noise. It appeared any programs I did watch with noise were the fault of the channel provider, not of the projector. For instance I was watching the missing on movie central, and seen no noise, later I watched the island on HD and noticed noise, as well as in war of the worlds. Then on madagascar there was no noise, and discovery HD the shows this week displayed no sign of any noise.

I also noticed the same thing my 8700 as well, so I blame the shows themselves not brilliant color or the projector.

All in all its a great picture.

I notice more of those pesky Mosquito's now that I am watching on 88" over my old 57" HDTV. Specifically on CBS-HD (Two and 1/2 men for instance). You can see how compression is being used on some HDTV shows now that I couldn't see before. Football doesn't show it though, which is weird????

Can anybody tell me if the rainbow effect can be more visible when using a white screen than a gray low gain (0.8)?
I ask because I watched this PJ with a gray screen and I saw absolutely no rainbows, even though I tried to see them. But yesterday, with my homemade white screen, I noticed some slight rainbows when I looked over subtitles. This made me a bit confused if the rainbows will become a problem for me, I don't think it will, but I liked the fact that I really couldn't see them no matter how I tried.

You can easily test this by lowering Contrast way down (min -30) to see if reducing the white level makes the rainbows go away. If yes, suggest painting the screen gray and raising the contrast back to the level where you can't see any rainbows.

I notice my Horizontal Position is 117 and Vertical Position is 17. I'm not sure I set these, but maybe I did on accident. I don't notice anything with the picture, but want to make sure they're set correctly. What should these settings be at?

I notice my Horizontal Position is 117 and Vertical Position is 17. I'm not sure I set these, but maybe I did on accident. I don't notice anything with the picture, but want to make sure they're set correctly. What should these settings be at?

It's a setting to move the horizontal or vertical position of the projected image. Is your image on the screen ? Yes, then leave it alone. No, Then tweak it.

Mine were 182 Horz and 38 Vertical out of the box.

Can anyone direct me to the best tweeks for the 3000 on here. My one will arrive in a few days and want to be ready. any good ideas for settings, rainbow tweeks etc???
I have the denon 3910 player with HDMI and a matt white screen.

Many thanks guys ;)

You can try these settings for starters:

HDMI:

AV MEMORY 1

Gamma Mode: Cinema

Contrast: 6

Brightness: 3

Color Temp: User

R Contrast: 7

G Contrast: 0

B Contrast: -6

R Bright: -5

G Bright: 0

B Bright: 0

Color: N/A

Tint: N/A

Sharpness: -1

Brilliant Color: On

Lamp Mode: Low



COMPONENT:

AV MEMORY 1

Gamma Mode: Cinema

Contrast: 7

Brightness: 3

Color Temp: User

R Contrast: 6

G Contrast: 0

B Contrast: -7

R Bright: 0

G Bright: 0

B Bright: -1

Color: 1

Tint: N/A

Sharpness: 2

Brilliant Color: On

Lamp Mode: Low

Have you tried lower contrast settings, i.e. making the white less bright? I'm now using the PJ with a ND4 filter that cuts light output to 25% (ie cutting 75%), blacks are noticeably blacker and whites are still white. Before the filter I had to user the contrast setting -30, now can use 0. This PJ just pumps out too much light to a darkened room.

I imagine tha ND filters are pretty cheap - if you can mount it on or in front of your projector -- would using an ND filter essentially provide the same effect of a built-in projector iris?

You can try these settings for starters:

HDMI:

AV MEMORY 1

Gamma Mode: Cinema

Contrast: 6, etc...




Brian Corr,

Are these settings after some type of instrument calibration or did you use DVE or AVIA DVD ?

You can't transfer one projectors settings to another. There are too many variables at work to do this with bulb brightness, screen gain, room gain etc...each unit will be different.

Dear all HC-3000 users,

I was looking at this wonderful projector in a shop yesterday and I absolutely loved the picture. But, I feel eyestrain today, I feel some tiredness in my eyes. Does this mean that I’m sensitive to DLPs? Can this be an effect of not being used to DLP picture. I terrified to experience any pain because of the product? Please give me some advice, I really would like to buy this projector.

Many thank,
Funkybase

Maybe you just have a headache...

Brian

:)

No no headache, I was spending two hours in the shop and I felt eyestrain afterwards...

No no headache, I was spending two hours in the shop and I felt eyestrain afterwards...

Don't over-analyze it. You probably have eyestrain because you were staring intently at a video image scrutinizing it for flaws. Normal viewing conditions will be more relaxed.

Sounds great! I better rest my eyes for a couple of days and give a new shot. I love to buy this proj.

I don't think your eyestrain is caused by the PJ because it's a DLP if you didn't notice any disturbing things while watching it.

Maybe the picture was just too bright/too much light. Too much light can make you tired in your eyes (at least I can get tired of viewing a very "shining" picture), but you can adjust the PJ so it fits you. You can turn the iris off, turn BC off and use it with a low gain screen. It also depends on the size of the screen. Bigger screens can make the picture more dim than a smaller screen.

I am using it with a 90" screen, iris closed and BC off with the contrast turned down a few steps. Maybe this will change when i get a new gray 0.8 gain screen, but I absolutely like the picture best when its not too bright. Especially subtitles can get a bit "flashy" if there's too much light.

And I agree with Josh Z :) Sounds right. Some days ago i noticed slight rainbows on subtitles, and I got in doubt wether to keep the PJ or not. But after trying to watch the movies withouth analyzing everything in the picture, I am not disturbed by anything. I just enjoy how impressive the picture on this PJ is :)

We did turn both brightness and contrast down as this proj is very bright. However, I'm not used to watching such big screen... I only have 42" plasma at home. Maybe my eyes need to adjust?

I think you should go to your retailer and watch it again, being more relaxed :) The iris can also make the picture less bright. Quite big difference with it closed than opened.

And maybe you prefer a larger viewing distance, so that the picture isn't too big for you. I get very tired in my eyes if i'm in the cinema for example, and sitting close to the screen. Some ppl like to sit very close, others don't :)

I have a question concerning screensize.

I can't really decide wether to get a 76" wide screen or 77" wide screen. It maybe sounds crazy, since the two sizes are so close. But I do think the difference is quite big. Would it be stupid to buy the bigger screen, but end up using the smaller size? That would leave some unused space. It's a frame-screen with black frame. The price is the same.

I have a question concerning screensize.

I can't really decide wether to get a 76" wide screen or 77" wide screen. It maybe sounds crazy, since the two sizes are so close. But I do think the difference is quite big. Would it be stupid to buy the bigger screen, but end up using the smaller size? That would leave some unused space. It's a frame-screen with black frame. The price is the same.

Could you adjust the zoom or move the projector position to fill the extra inch?

Yes I could, but if I prefered the smaller image?

The other option is to choose the size (76" or 77" wide) before i buy the screen, but it's a bit difficult to choose :) But if it's not a good idea to have unused space I will have to decide.

It's gonna be hard for you to enjoy watching anything if your eye is so critical as to be sensitive to the difference between 76" and 77" wide ;)

hehe maybe i got the wrong numbers. Might be the difference between 74" and 78". I normally use cm's, maybe the conversion got wrong somewhere :)

Better to have more screen than you need than to need more screen than you have, is my feeling.

If you prefer the image smaller, you can add additional masking or curtains as needed.

If your only going for a 76" wide screen, check out the latest RPT's ;~)
Seriously, if I went to the trouble of a projector, I wouold be bummed if my neighbor got an RPT that was bigger - or even close for that matter.

Is your size limited by space? I can tell you I have a Dalite high power 133" (daigonal) in my master bedroom (waiting for the theater room to be built), and I love it. It fills up almost a whole wall, though we currently only project an image about 9.3 feet wide, leaving about 4 inches on either side due to throw distance issues. We never notice, and the 126" diagonal image is stunning.

Well, a 70" Rear-projection costs more than the HC3000+decent screen. With the 3000, the screen could also easily be 'upgraded' to a larger size if the conditions allowed it. :)

He is talking about a 77 inch wide or 88 inch diagonal screen.

That size is great and has more brightness than a monster sized screen.

Bigger is not always better in HT screens. Do some reading in the forums.

Err.. who are you responding to?

To HOmer...sorry if not clear

I ended up with a bit smaller screen, 86" (diagonal), since I got a nice offer of a screen of this size. It's a 0.8 gain gray screen. The next step was around 100" which I definately find too big. My viewing distance is about 11,5 feet.

It will hopefully arrive early next week :)

Hi All,

I am going to be projecting to 106" screen, Projection calculator says throw range will be 12.7 (1.21 zoom) to 15.3 feet.

I have an option to mount it in either place withing this throw range.
What will be pros and cons of using either 12.7 or 15.3 ? Besides obvious inconvenience of having projector in front of you (my sitting distance is about 14 feet) are the any other disadvantages ? Theoretically it should be brighter if PJ is mounted closer to the screen, but I am not sure if max zoom will affect brightness.

Thanks for your help, Davie.

Eclipse98

Brightness is a function of screen size (area) and is essentially not effected by distance.

Most feel that you should place the projector near its maximum distance from the screen to use the central portion of the optics (sweetspot). In practice I see very little difference with my HC3000 or the IF4805 before that.

I have a 106" diag screen also and have it mounted about 14.5' out of the range of 12.7 to 15.3.

For those of you HC3000 users that can't stop playing with your user settings, here is a spreadsheet I made up that includes screenshots (from the manual) of the user menus along with space to save your adjustments.

Preview and then print out the excel spreadsheet to fit on on an 8 1/2 by 11 page and enable gridline printing on the excel sheet setup menu.

There is space to record several sets of the Image menu's AV Memory 1, 2, 3 settings well as the User Color Temp menu settings and user 1 and 2 Gamma mode settings.

Also the word document has a summary of the image menu tree and the aspect ratio chart.

added Jan 30 06: I have added the two pages as seperate zip files. This was zipped using winzip10. if anyone still has opening them try downloading the evaluation version of winzip at www.winzip.com, or private message me with your e-mail and I will send you unzipped version via email.

Going to be upgrading from the unescapably loud Infocus 4805 (and gets louder over time too)

I have heard that this Mits HC3000 has sealed optics and/or sealed color wheel....anyone have any details?

ALSO, Whats the fan noise like on this unit?

I did a search on "sealed" in this thread, and found someone posing the same question, but could not find a response.

Thanks

Whats the fan noise like on this unit?

I had a 4805 and the noise is much less with the HC3K.

You can send the 4805 back to InFocus during the 2 year warranty and they can restore the noise back to original...still loud.

Re sealed optics I have asked the question but don't recall an answer. Pls advise if you have a reference to the answer.

For those of you HC3000 users that can't stop playing with your user settings, here is a spreadsheet I made up that includes screenshots (from the manual) of the user menus along with space to save your adjustments.

Preview and then print out the excel spreadsheet to fit on on an 8 1/2 by 11 page and enable gridline printing on the excel sheet setup menu.

There is space to record several sets of the Image menu's AV Memory 1, 2, 3 settings well as the User Color Temp menu settings and user 1 and 2 Gamma mode settings.

Also the word document has a summary of the image menu tree and the aspect ratio chart.
I cant get this att to open? Anyone else have the same problem?

YES

I tried 3 times and won't open.

Brightness is a function of screen size (area) and is essentially not effected by distance.

Most feel that you should place the projector near its maximum distance from the screen to use the central portion of the optics (sweetspot). In practice I see very little difference with my HC3000 or the IF4805 before that.

I have a 106" diag screen also and have it mounted about 14.5' out of the range of 12.7 to 15.3.

Mooney, from reading AVS forums posts I came under impression that you indeed will lose some brightness should you mount projector further away from the screen. I cannot confirm if this is true since I am shopping for my first PJ.

On the other hand I read in the book "Home theater design" by Krissy Rushing and I quote "when you put the projector farther away from the screen, you use more of the lens's center. Light going through the edges of the lens can be distorted. By using more of the lens's center, you are improving image quality and minimizing distortion."

I am just trying to find the lesser of two evils or perhaps some other issues members of this forum came across based on the mounting distance.

Thanks, Davie.

Davie,

As I said the major factor in brightness(with all else held constant) is the area of the screen.

I my opinion throw distance has little or no effect.

The reason HT design (and I) say to mount near the rear is the central area or sweetspot. I'm an experienced photographer and a lens "wide open" has less resolution (sharpness) than the same lens "stopped down" ie using the central portion.

There is no lack of brightness with the HC3000.

Get a good screen...a long term investment and more important than where you mount your PJ.

I have added seperate zip files for the two pages of my HC3000 user settings chart chart. I have downloaded it and it seems to unzip fine. It may not be a self extracting file so you may need to have winzip installed or have windows xp as you operating system.

If anyone is still having a problem unzipping it please private message me.

Can someome post post here that they had no problem downloading and unzipping it.

Unzipped the file no problem, but opening the excel file, it's doesn't open up properly.

Still can not download.
Get message : "The compressed (zipped) folder is invalid or corrupted"

Pls keep trying as this sounds like a useful tool.

It worked fine for me. Haven't printed it tho, so I don't know if it looks ok on paper :)

Can anyone recommend a screen surface for some ambient light? My HC3000 is about 12 feet back projecting 92 inches. I have white walls and ceiling and at times, would like the lights on dimmed. It looks great so far on my white linen wall! I was looking at the following:

Dalite High Contrast Da-Mat
Gain: 0.8
Viewing Angle: 45°

Dalite High Contrast Cinema Vision
Gain: 1.1
Viewing Angle: 50°

Draper:
http://www.draperinc.com/images/Screens/Screen_Images/FPSGainChart.pdf

Vutec Greydove

Stewart GrayHawk RS
Gain: .92
Half Gain @ 64º
I've seen this in action but I don't know if I'm ready to pay almost as much as the PJ just yet!

Stewart FireHawk G2
Gain: 1.25
Half Gain @ 24º

Can anyone recommend a screen surface for some ambient light? My HC3000 is about 12 feet back projecting 92 inches. I have white walls and ceiling and at times, would like the lights on dimmed.I have a 92" diagonal Da-Lite High Contrast CinemaVision paired with my HC3000, which is mounted 11.5' away.

With the room completely dark and the projector in low-lamp/closed-iris mode, it's whites are very very bright, and blacks are excellent.

I can run a significant amount of ambient light, as you can see from the picture below (lights on, blinds open at dusk) and the image quality is still quite enjoyable.

http://home.austin.rr.com/hwj/ht/htnemo.jpg

Hi can someone please repost Jason Turks settings or pm me. I can't find them on this thread, I swear there were here before.

I posted them on pg. 43 of this thread.

Now I can't download the zipped files from the avs server. :confused:

I can e-mail the files to anyone who asks, just pm me.

Can someone web host these two files , they are smallish 140K each.

I have a 92" diagonal Da-Lite High Contrast CinemaVision paired with my HC3000, which is mounted 11.5' away.

With the room completely dark and the projector in low-lamp/closed-iris mode, it's whites are very very bright, and blacks are excellent.

I can run a significant amount of ambient light, as you can see from the picture below (lights on, blinds open at dusk) and the image quality is still quite enjoyable.



hwj, that looks very nice. Bright and crisp.

I have a 92" diagonal Da-Lite High Contrast CinemaVision paired with my HC3000, which is mounted 11.5' away.

With the room completely dark and the projector in low-lamp/closed-iris mode, it's whites are very very bright, and blacks are excellent.

I can run a significant amount of ambient light, as you can see from the picture below (lights on, blinds open at dusk) and the image quality is still quite enjoyable.


hey hwj,

In that photo with ambient light, are you still running low-lamp/iris-closed? If not, what settings were being used in that picture. It does look surprisingly good for what looks like a quite bright room.

Thanks, Greg

Is the 3000 sitting on a true D65? when on HDMI.

I love the pix but would have liked to see a bit more colour like the 900, Z4 and PJ TX200 when calibrated.

The 3000 colour and tint cant be changed when on HDMI and I see the blue filture isnt quiet correct to my eyes??? :rolleyes:

I know I can change R G B seperatly but dont know how to do that?

Whats others thoughts re the colour on the 3000 please/

Out of the box, the picture isn't at D65K...more along the lines of 9000K (at least mine was). Also, the color decoder is off quite a bit through HDMI, specifically green is way to bright and red is shaded towards blue when looking at the CEI chart. I go through a Lumagen scaler, so I am able to adjust the color decoder via the scaler using a DVI out to HDMI cable. I have pre and post calibration results that I can post later tonight, but the file is on my laptop (if I remembered to save it!). But post calibration with the Lumagen, the picture is outstanding.

Out of the box, the picture isn't at D65K...more along the lines of 9000K (at least mine was). Also, the color decoder is off quite a bit through HDMI, specifically green is way to bright and red is shaded towards blue when looking at the CEI chart. I go through a Lumagen scaler, so I am able to adjust the color decoder via the scaler using a DVI out to HDMI cable. I have pre and post calibration results that I can post later tonight, but the file is on my laptop (if I remembered to save it!). But post calibration with the Lumagen, the picture is outstanding.
please please please will you send it to me!!!! :)

Here is the calibration summary.

Dave

Here is the CEI color Chart.

Here is the calibration summary.

Dave
That looks great Dave but what would I set my projector to to get the same or similar?

Without an outboard scaler, you can't change the color and tint with HDMI. If we can get a service manual, the parameters "should" be adjustable in there, but the user settings are locked out for some stupid reason.

As far as D65, you can't take someone elses settings and apply them equally because everything is different (buld life, screen gain, screen color etc...)

Dave

Without an outboard scaler, you can't change the color and tint with HDMI. If we can get a service manual, the parameters "should" be adjustable in there, but the user settings are locked out for some stupid reason.

As far as D65, you can't take someone elses settings and apply them equally because everything is different (buld life, screen gain, screen color etc...)

Dave
So does that really mean I have to live with the wrong settings on my new 3000?

That cant be correct, there has to be something we can do to adjust color on hdmi.

The controls are locked out over HDMI. Without access to the service menu, you have no control over them. The red, green, and Blue brightness and contrast are like cuts and drives in a CRT display that affect grayscale, not color decoding, which are two different processes. A lot of displays lock you out of color control over the digital connection, which is a mistake IMO, but the companies think that a digital signal is "perfect", when it isn't in reality.

The controls are locked out over HDMI. Without access to the service menu, you have no control over them. The red, green, and Blue brightness and contrast are like cuts and drives in a CRT display that affect grayscale, not color decoding, which are two different processes. A lot of displays lock you out of color control over the digital connection, which is a mistake IMO, but the companies think that a digital signal is "perfect", when it isn't in reality.
I use the Denon 3910 player on HDMI set to Y Cb Cr.
Would it be best to go into the player and try and alter Colour and Tint if they have it in there?

I think the Mitsubishi rebate has expired now, will they drop the price or will prospective purchasers have to live with a higher price now? I would think they'd extend the promotion or drop the price to compete with Optoma and Infocus' upcoming projectors....

Anyway to adjust color, I am running everything off hTPC.

You can adjust colour using avivo in ati x1800 cards.

You can adjust colour using avivo in ati x1800 cards.
sorry what does that mean?

I take it 9800 pro does not do this however?

Regardless I emailed mitsibushi about how to acess the service menu, dont know if they will respond.

I am surprised it has not been discovered, on my 8700 you pressed menu, then on, then menu again to acess it.

Oh wait problem solved, I just use powerstrip!


So Dave basically I should use powerstrip now to calibrate the projector to d65?

Is there any way to adjust the colors without a colorimeter or something like that? :)

And how would you connect a gamecube or playstation 2 to get the best picture quality?

To adjust the colors, use avia or DVE and put up the color bar pattern (DVE is easier to use IMO for this because you don't need the "flashing" boxes). This is to do the color decoder. Adjust the blue first, then red, then green. Blue needs to be correct though for red and green to get close. You need to have access to red and green hue and saturation (tint and hue). If powerstrip has that, then you are good to go.

As far as D65 goes, you HAVE to have some type of instrumentation to get this correct. It is near impossible to do it by eye unless you know what you are doing (and most likely you don't). I used Milori Colorfacts to do this, but it costs about as much as the projector, so it isn't a cost effective way to calibrate. But calibration makes a WORLD of difference in the picture quality. My display looks almost 3D like now.

I can adjust the contrast and brightness for red, green and blue. I am using a component cable.
But that test pattern is designed to calibrate the option called color? I am not sure what to look for when adjusting brightness and contrast of each color..

hey hwj,

In that photo with ambient light, are you still running low-lamp/iris-closed? If not, what settings were being used in that picture. It does look surprisingly good for what looks like a quite bright room.Yep, that picture was taken with the iris closed and low-lamp mode enabled.

To be fair though, the camera needed a decently long exposure time to get a good shot, and Nemo is of course a very bright, contrasty movie.

Here is the calibration summary.Great info, Dave. Thanks for posting it.

Your "before" graphs look pretty similar to my ghetto colorimeter experiment I detailed back in post 1260 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6939806&highlight=D65#post6939806) of this thread, which is somewhat reassuring.

The Spyder 2 uses a similar interface to the Milori since they come from the same company (Data Color).

I really like the colour of my picture since I followed Brian Corrs settings.
The image now has warmth to it!
Our setup must be very close as even his Contast/brightnes settings even matched mine when I tested them on GetGray Calibration disc!

Nice work Brian thats a GREAT HELP! :)

You can try these settings for starters:

HDMI:

AV MEMORY 1

Gamma Mode: Cinema

Contrast: 6

Brightness: 3

Color Temp: User

R Contrast: 7

G Contrast: 0

B Contrast: -6

R Bright: -5

G Bright: 0

B Bright: 0

Color: N/A

Tint: N/A

Sharpness: -1

Brilliant Color: On

Lamp Mode: Low



COMPONENT:

AV MEMORY 1

Gamma Mode: Cinema

Contrast: 7

Brightness: 3

Color Temp: User

R Contrast: 6

G Contrast: 0

B Contrast: -7

R Bright: 0

G Bright: 0

B Bright: -1

Color: 1

Tint: N/A

Sharpness: 2

Brilliant Color: On

Lamp Mode: Low

And how would you connect a gamecube or playstation 2 to get the best picture quality?

Component. For the Gamecube you'll need an older GameCube with a Digital A/V port and the Component cable available only just about only from nintendo.com.

Next time I fire up the projector, I'll check my settings and post them for reference. But screens make a difference as well. I use a Firehawk, which is a gray screen.

Just to clarify, those are the settings Jason at AVS came up with after calibration. But I found them to be pretty good as well on my setup.

Dave,

I have a 106' diag Firehawk so I too would like your settings.

I use an Oppo 971H DVD will be I be able to make the necessary adjustments? Using DVI to HDMI cable to the HC3K.

I also have a Firehawk 100" diag. and am using OPPO 971. At one time my settings did produce a real good 3D effect but you know how crazy we can get, I thought I could improve it, but somehow my best settings were lost and now I have to start over again!!

I understand those crazy electrons...
my 4805 that i was setting up to donate to my daughter seemed to go nuts. Shut it down took a 2 hour break and all those greyed out setting were now available.

I carefully had recorded my settings but lost my notes.....

Yea dave if you can post your settings it would be great, I will probably plug them in, then go into DVE and see how the color is so far, maybe your color settings will be on par.

I use carada brilliant white 1.4 gain, isnt the firehawk close in gain? But it is grey? I am just wondering how much of an affect that will be.

Hopefully I can find my glasses though that came with dve, its been awhile since I seen them, can I purchase something else like them to calibrate like some sort of paper that will act the same way.

Sorry to post again, dave I hope I dont bother you to much but I am away from home, when I get home and try to calibrate I might bug you with a few questions. Regarding powerstrip it seems to be set up so I can select a color, then adjust the brightness, contrast, and gamma of that color. (either RGB or CMY dont know what cmy is but the colors seem to be pink teal and yellow)

If you really want you can download it for free its just a small application.

http://www.entechtaiwan.net/util/ps.shtm

Im just not sure if I should be adjusting the RGB brightness, contrast, gamma, individually when I use dve.

Component. For the Gamecube you'll need an older GameCube with a Digital A/V port and the Component cable available only just about only from nintendo.com.

My gamecube doesn't have any port, but I have a RGB scart cable with extra audio and video connection. No component as far as I can see. It's this cable I have http://www.gamecubefun.de/img/hardware/brooklyn_rgb_01.jpg

Actually I have this digital AV out port, I have never seen it had that port :P But it sucks if it's a rare cable which you can't buy anywhere else than nintendo.com :(

My gamecube doesn't have any port, but I have a RGB scart cable with extra audio and video connection. No component as far as I can see. It's this cable I have

Actually I have this digital AV out port, I have never seen it had that port :P But it sucks if it's a rare cable which you can't buy anywhere else than nintendo :(

You can get it from eBay. When I went to order one from Nintendo a few months back they told me it was on backorder.

You can get it from eBay. When I went to order one from Nintendo a few months back they told me it was on backorder.

Okay thanks. But how do I then connect it to my receiver? Would it work if I used my rgb scart cable, which has an audio input?

Okay thanks. But how do I then connect it to my receiver? Would it work if I used my rgb scart cable, which has an audio input?

It's just a component cable. An audio connection will also be needed. You may be able to use that cable you have (I'm unfamiliar w/ that one) or you can use the the white/red RCA plug-cable that came w/ the GameCube.

I will post the settings tonight. I totally spaced last night and forgot to write them down. I know that my settings are different than Jason's though, mostly because he uses a Silver screen which has a very high gain on it.

Dave

<edit>

[I have a 106' diag Firehawk so I too would like your settings.
I use an Oppo 971H DVD will be I be able to make the necessary adjustments? Using DVI to HDMI cable to the HC3K.]

Dave can you comment on this question

As far as the color decoder goes, probably not...BUT, I'm not familiar with the Oppo player. Does it have color controls in the user menu? As far as the grayscale goes, you use the projector for that, so your grayscale can be correct, but you color decoder may be off a little bit.

Dave,

All I can find in the menu is:

Brightness
Contrast
Saturation

There may be controls for colors in a secret menu but am unaware where/how.

I will post that question on the Oppo "brain dump" thread.

Saturation is most likely for blue. It is supposed to work out that if blue is correct, then everything else is as well, but that just isn't the case in reality.

Yes, I use it with low lamp mode and I have totally reflective ceiling and some light coming in from the other rooms (no door yet :-). And my screen is rather dark neutral grey 113".

HOYA is the biggest manufacturer of these filters, search for "HOYA ND4 HMC" (HMC is Hoya Multi-Coated, which makes the surfaces non-reflective, ND stands for Neutral Density, meaning that there is no color shift).

Filters come in different sizes, but unfortunately HC3000 does not have threading for the filter. Right now I have a loaned 77mm taped on to the HC3000. 77mm is a bit too big to fit nicely. 72mm can be bought for about 30 euros in Finland.

Chances are that if you have any photographer friends, they might have the filter for you to try it out. You could also try ND2 and maybe ND8.

Jarno

Hi Jarno,

I am seeing the rainbow affect using the HC3000. While the HC3000 puts out a stunning picture especially in HD, the rainbows are getting troublesome and the feeling I get around my head doesn't feel that good either. I upgraded from a HS20 which was lcd, and that was comfortable and enjoyable to watch until I started noticed the poor black levels.

I thought HC3000 was the answer but now I've a different set of problems to overcome. The sharpness doesn't seem to be there with manual focus. It doesn't want to get sharp enough, at the sharpest setting, there still looks like a hazey picture.

Anyways about the rainbow effect, did using the ND filters improve that aspect for you? And would 72mm be a better choice than 77mm? I measured it area where the lens would go and 72mm looks like it would fit snuggly but as you said before there are no threads to hold it in place. I assume some sticky tape would do the job?

Thinking more about it now, the size of the picture could be the problem because I have it sitting under the HS20 mounted on a stool. It's 2.6m from the screen projecting only a 1.45m wide image at max zoom. Eventually it will be mounted around 4m from the screen with 2m wide image. So foot lambert wise it's very high with that size of screen and the HC3000 is extremely bright. Personally I think rainbows are a function of brightness and colour wheel speed. x4 should be enought colour wheel rotation to eliminate rainbows. I've seen the Sim2 HT300 elink on a 3.5m wide screen and did not see any rainbows so if the projector's light output is cut in half or more, it hopefully will have a good effect on viewing experience.

I did enough watching the spider scene in the Hi-def Return of the King , comparing that to my experience of watching DVD Return of the King on the HS20 was a revelation. The shadow detail is extremely impressive and the clarity of the overall picture in dark scenes trumps the HS20. I am not seeing details in dark areas where the HS20 could not reproduce before. Also I don't have to pump up the gamma and contrast to make the picture look bright.

And how would you connect a gamecube or playstation 2 to get the best picture quality?

Playstation 2 is the same story, but you can get Dolby Digital 5.1 out on some games if you use an optical cable to your receiver. If you want to use the RCA audio on the component cable, you'll need extenders to get to to your receiver, most likley...

Also, some games will display a progressive picture if you hold "X" and "O" or "X" and triangle while the game is starting up (only game I know of that uses the latter code is Alien Homonid). Some of the more recent games actually have progressive scan available via the options menu. Checkout the hdgames site to find out if a game supports progressive scan. All the Gamecube progressive scan games I have auto-detect the fancy nintendo component cables and ask if you'd like to play in progressive scan.

Also, I noticed a $500 price drop on another site for this projector. So, I guess the rebate wasn't such a great deal...

Also, I noticed a $500 price drop on another site for this projector. So, I guess the rebate wasn't such a great deal...

The rebate combined with AVS pricing certainly was!

Yes...I was able to get the projector for about 27% off the $2999 price in December. Do the math!

OK...here are my settings that run from a Denon 3910 via component (or HDMI depending on the DVD) through a Lumagen VisionHDP with DVI-out converted to HDMI, then a 10 meter Accell HDMI cable to the projector. I tested the grayscale with both the 480P output and the 720P output from the Denon and they matched exactly.

Contrast -4
Brightness -14
Sharpness -2

Contrast Red 9
Contrast Green 1
Contrast Blue -9
Brightness Red 0
Brightness Green 0
Brightness Blue 3

Gamma: User1
Cinema,
High 0
Mid 0
Low 0

My screen is a Stewart Firehawk and the projector is mounted about 140 inches away from an 88" diagonal screen. It should also be noted that I had to adjust the color decoder in the Lumagen in order to get the colors right using both AVIA and DVE color bars (compared the two). Blue was very close to being on, red was slightly overdriven on Saturation, and Green Saturation is way brighter than it should be. BUT, without a scaler, you don't have access to these adjustments. Hopefully someone will figure out how to get into the Service Menu, because on the Mitsubishi DLP RPTV's, there are adjustments in the Service menu to fix the color decoder. Just remember, the Color Decoder and Grayscale are two different animals. Don't try and use the user adjustments for RGB contrast and brightness to fix your color decoder, because if you do, your grayscale will be hosed. To see what effect my settings have on YOUR display, put up a gray steps pattern from a test disc and pay attention to the white area's when adjusting the RGB contrast, and the dark area for RGB Brightness. Your eyes probably won't notice anything in the bright areas, but you should see a difference when adjusting the dark area's (brightness). If anyone has any comments or questions, let me know.

Dave feeding the HC3000 my HTPC I can use powerstrip to adjust color, unfortunately with powerstrip the adjustments to RGB are RGB brightness, gamma, contrast. I can also adjust color temp.

Now you say not to mess with the brightness and contrast of the RGB but unfortunately thats the only way to alter it. I do have grayscale on my dve disc, but I forget how to use it, can you explain what to look for when I adjust the color, to make sure my grayscale doesnt change.

Also to calibrate dve for colors, I lost my glasses. SO someone suggested instead when I calibrate blue for instance, turn red and green off. And then when you do green turn red and blue off ect... Will this work?

Yes...you can turn off each color individually. As for doing grayscale by eye...don't even attempt it. Plug in my settings (or Jasons), and see how it looks. Put up a gray ramp pattern and you should see some slight changes as you change things in the user menu.

I thought HC3000 was the answer but now I've a different set of problems to overcome. The sharpness doesn't seem to be there with manual focus. It doesn't want to get sharp enough, at the sharpest setting, there still looks like a hazey picture.


I've noticed that focus is better when not fully zoomed in. However to me the difference was not that dramatic, and I have the zoom at max for the 2.5m wide image.


Anyways about the rainbow effect, did using the ND filters improve that aspect for you? And would 72mm be a better choice than 77mm? I measured it area where the lens would go and 72mm looks like it would fit snuggly but as you said before there are no threads to hold it in place. I assume some sticky tape would do the job?


The ND filters definately made the rainbows disappear for me. Right now I've moved from ND4 to ND2 and have a bit more than 100 hours on the lamp. With ND4 there were absolutely no rainbows, with ND2 only some but few and far between.

77mm felt more secure in the sense that the 72mm gets closer to the lense, but it seems it is impossible to make contact (=scratch) the lense with 72mm filter. It seems to get quite close, though. I've used normal PVC tape to keep the filters in place.


Thinking more about it now, the size of the picture could be the problem because I have it sitting under the HS20 mounted on a stool. It's 2.6m from the screen projecting only a 1.45m wide image at max zoom. Eventually it will be mounted around 4m from the screen with 2m wide image. So foot lambert wise it's very high with that size of screen and the HC3000 is extremely bright. Personally I think rainbows are a function of brightness and colour wheel speed. x4 should be enought colour wheel rotation to eliminate rainbows. I've seen the Sim2 HT300 elink on a 3.5m wide screen and did not see any rainbows so if the projector's light output is cut in half or more, it hopefully will have a good effect on viewing experience.


I've come to the conclusion that the lower wheel speed with PAL material and the high light output together make the rainbow effect. The RBE happens when there is high level of light output and your eye moves so that the components of the light (red, green and blue) hit different part of your retina. Not because of movement in the picture, but because your eye is moving. It seems that either the speed of eye movement or the treshold of light level/displacement in retina that will cause the image to disintegrate, or both are individual factors that cause the different experience for different viewers.

In our family I'm the only one ever seen the RBE, and for me the lowering of light output with the ND4 or ND2 filter made the RBE go away. The better black levels are a nice bonus :-)

Also, then I was suffering from the RBE, I noticed that the Brilliant Color made them worse, but if my theory above is right, then it should, as it increases the light output in the parts of the image that would be the sources of RBE.

Before you have the filter try to cut light output by lowering the Contrast setting as much as possible (-30). Do not touch the Brightness, as that affects the black level rather than the white level, and you do not want to cut the shadow detail off. If the picture is better RBE-wise with Contrast at -30, you will definately benefit from the ND2 or ND4 filter.

But it would be even better to get a low-gain screen, as that will deepen the black levels due to less reflection of ambient light (or reflected light from the bright parts of the image).

To summarize, fixes for RBE problems are:

1. Low gain (neutral gray) screen
2. Bigger image size to reduce the light output/unit area
3. Lamp on low, iris closed, Brillliant Color OFF, Gamma mode Cinema
4. ND (Neutral Density) filter to cut light output by 50% (ND2) or 75% (ND4), both may be needed due to lamp light output variance as the lamp ages.
5. Lowering the Contrast setting to as low as needed to get rid of RBE

I've noticed that best material for testing for RBE are any black&white movies, where the disintegration of the whites to the color components is really disturbing.

DAve whats the best way to go about doing this? You mentioned I should not fiddle with the brightness contrast of RGB, but its the only way to calibrate it. Should I do color, and then go back into dve and do brightness contrast calibration?


Also I should mention in powerstrip, brightness, gamma and contrast of each color, cant actually be turned off, but it has a slider to reduce it to -300 I dont know if this is completely off or not, I am not at home right now to calibrate, but on my notebook when I turned red and green down that far for brightness, contrast, and gamma of Green and red, i was left with a very dark blue screen, I should be asking if that will be just as good since I dont know if that slider means its off completely.

It is work a try Murilo...see what heppens to the color decoder when you play with those controls in powerstrip.

Is there a way to import an image and have it come up when you power up vs the generic mits image?

Thanks, Brad

Thanks for the reply jarno very informative. It seems like you can't have it both ways. ie have a deep contrast and bright image. The two don't mix. Which is disappointing because the HS20 was pretty dim to begin with.

And yes I did find the RBE reduced when changing the contrast to -30. The picture was a lot dimmer than 0 contrast. The black level improved but the overall brightness dropped a lot. Brightness is not without it's benefits though, when contrast is at 0 the dimmer areas of the picture jump out more, thus revealing more detail in darker areas. I guess what I'm looking for is a bright punchy image with good overall contrast and no RBE. Will report back findings when filters arrive.

Gamma: User1
Cinema,
High 0
Mid 0
Low 0Dave, what was your rationale behind selecting User 1 for gamma, but leaving the settings at zero?

If I recall from my Spyder2 testing, I didn't read any difference between Gamma::Cinema and Gamma::User1[Cinema:0:0:0].

I thought it was the default, but I may have switched it to that at somepoint and forgot. I don't think it matters either way.

Hi,

perhaps i am the only one but when I use Jasons settings on my HC3000 the picture is not satisfing for me at all on my 1.1 gain screen but have to admit that i don't use a stand alone player but connected mine via DVI/HDMI to my HTPC (Nvidia GT6800). The white is then too much in the red.
After some adjustments of brighntness and contrast via test patterns the best settings for me are contrast +5 and brightness 0 when I am in VMR9 mode and in Overlay brightness +15 and contrast 0. The rest is standard meaning 6500k and in the colours tab everything at 0.
is it possible that I have a model with different standard settings or does my eyes play tricks on me? Perhaps i have to mention that i bought mine here in Germany but use only NTSC material.

Like I said, every projector is unique because of different conditions due to the bulb and screen gain. Jason has a silver screen with avery high gain.

Hello everyone,

I'm looking to upgrade from a HC900 to a HC3000, and have a few questions for the experts in this forum ;)

- Will this upgrade be worth it (I can get the HC3000 for 2099€ @ avshop.be in Belgium). I have no idea how it compares to a HC900 and know of no place where I can compare them side by side. Has anyone seen these 2 side by side?

- At the moment I sit a bit close to the screen, and have some visible screedoor effect with my HC900 when a lot of white is displayed (I have a large screen 276x160cm view size) . Will the new HC3000 screendoor effect be less due to the smaller pixels? Or will the fact that the DLP chip size has decreased make the screendoor effect worse?

- Last question :rolleyes: How does the HC3000 compare to the Optoma H79?

I have downloaded the manual and I have a question.

Right now I have an Infocus X1 and when I watch DVD's that are wide screen NON-animorphic I put the projector in 4x3 mode and it stretches the dvd correctly.

I do the same thing with shows like Stargate and Battlestar Galactica that are broadcast letterboxed widescreen.

If I understand page EN-19 of the manual correctly the ZOOM2 is the mode I would need to use in the case of non animorphic wide screen dvd's but that zoom2 is only accessible if the input is 480p.

Currently my DVD player is connected via S-video and it would still be connected via s-video with the new projector. I am using all my available component inputs for HD-Tivo's.

Am I miss reading the manual?

Can the HC3000U stretch letter boxed wide screen content to fill a 16x9 screen if the input signal is 480i?

Anyone know if one can remove the Leaking of Gray one sees beyond the size of your Image noticed mainly when the Image goes black on a scene.

I know this is to do with the machine being 720/765 but on startup and fade outs this really does look a bit crappy! :cool:

I'm looking to upgrade from a HC900 to a HC3000, and have a few questions for the experts in this forum

- Will this upgrade be worth it (I can get the HC3000 for 2099€ @ avshop.be in Belgium). I have no idea how it compares to a HC900 and know of no place where I can compare them side by side. Has anyone seen these 2 side by side?

- At the moment I sit a bit close to the screen, and have some visible screedoor effect with my HC900 when a lot of white is displayed (I have a large screen 276x160cm view size) . Will the new HC3000 screendoor effect be less due to the smaller pixels? Or will the fact that the DLP chip size has decreased make the screendoor effect worse?

- Last question How does the HC3000 compare to the Optoma H79?I have seen the two side by side.

Upgrade from HC900 to HC3000 worth it? IMHO Absolutely YES. All the good things from the HC900 with none of it;s flaws. Color is better, no screen door visible, better PAL , better NTSC , brighter and better colors , and many options for tweaking. And its quieter with less stray light. If you liked the HC900 and could mount it you will love the HC3000.

The screen door effect is much less with the HC3000. I like to sit close also and the HC900 was an issue for me, but the HC3000 has zero impact to me. I can sit very close with no impact. Screendoor is the best IMHO even better than the H79 and H72 which I saw at CES. The DLP die chip size has no impact on screen door. The increased amount of pixels and the HC3000 optics have a great impact on the lack of any visible screendoor.

Mitsubishi has officially dropped the list price on the HC3000 by $500 to $2495.

Mitsubishi has officially dropped the list price on the HC3000 by $500 to $2495.


.....Gearing up for the battle with the HD72! The HC3000 and HD72 should now, or very soon, be streeting for about the same price. Decisions, decisions...

Am I miss reading the manual?

Can the HC3000U stretch letter boxed wide screen content to fill a 16x9 screen if the input signal is 480i?

You are reading the manual right. You can not stretch the image properly as the ZOOM modes are not available for interlaced signals. What makes this weird is the fact that the STRETCH mode (which is completely useless) is available also for interlaced signals. Computationally the zoom modes are simpler, so I can't understand why they are not available... but the fact is that they are not.

Thanks for the reply jarno very informative. It seems like you can't have it both ways. ie have a deep contrast and bright image. The two don't mix. Which is disappointing because the HS20 was pretty dim to begin with.

And yes I did find the RBE reduced when changing the contrast to -30. The picture was a lot dimmer than 0 contrast. The black level improved but the overall brightness dropped a lot. Brightness is not without it's benefits though, when contrast is at 0 the dimmer areas of the picture jump out more, thus revealing more detail in darker areas. I guess what I'm looking for is a bright punchy image with good overall contrast and no RBE. Will report back findings when filters arrive.

I think you will be positively surprised with the filters. With just the contrast setting the base level of black did not get lower even if you sensed deeper blacks (likely due to less light reflecting back from the room to the black parts of the image). The filters will also cut the brightness of the black to half or quarter.

I've also noticed that if the room is darkened my eyes will adapt to the overall/average brightness, and the sensation of brightness is about the same as without the filter.

I also found instructions from the calibration forum from professionals stating that after everything else is done, the white level ("Contrast") should be lowered as low as possible, but so that "whites" still seem white (not gray). I've noticed that doing this also removes the RBE issues (for me).

You are reading the manual right. You can not stretch the image properly as the ZOOM modes are not available for interlaced signals.

Well that stinks.

That means I will need a progressive scan dvd player and/or a new receiver that will upconvert 480i to 480p.

It also means that for letterboxed content broadcast by Sci-fi I will be unable to stretch the image to fit the 16x9 screen unless I get that new receiver that will upconvert 480i to 480p.

I wonder if that is something that could be fixed with a firmware update.

Does Mitsibushi ever release user installable firmware updates like Infocus?

It would be cheaper to buy the H78DC3 then the HC3000U and a new receiver.

I think you will be positively surprised with the filters. With just the contrast setting the base level of black did not get lower even if you sensed deeper blacks (likely due to less light reflecting back from the room to the black parts of the image). The filters will also cut the brightness of the black to half or quarter.

I've also noticed that if the room is darkened my eyes will adapt to the overall/average brightness, and the sensation of brightness is about the same as without the filter.

I also found instructions from the calibration forum from professionals stating that after everything else is done, the white level ("Contrast") should be lowered as low as possible, but so that "whites" still seem white (not gray). I've noticed that doing this also removes the RBE issues (for me).
I think I'm on the same road you travelled before you got the filters. Nice to meet a fellow traveller along the same path :)

So you're saying the contrast just dimmed the whites even though it look like the black level was improving it just meant that the dynamic range of black to white was being reduced. Eyes do adjust to the image presented so if the filters can maintain the same range as without the filters and without the rbe, then I'll be a happy camper. Can't wait for them to arrive!

Will I still be able to use Jason Turks settings with the filter on? Even though (to me) it looks like whites are being crushed using the particular settings (on a matte white wall).

I'm really close to pulling the trigger on this baby. The HD72 doesn't seem to offer any PQ advantages, the HC900/3000 platform is well-proven, and the price of the Mits is dropping. A couple of questions that have been asked on this thread, but not to my knowledge answered:

--Does the HC3000 have sealed, or at least gasketed, optics?

--Has anyone figured out how to access the service menu to adjust colors in HDMI (w/o using an HTPC, that is)?

--How does the deinterlacer handle 1080i signals? Does it do "weaving" or (not so good) "bobbing"?

Thanks!

77mm felt more secure in the sense that the 72mm gets closer to the lense, but it seems it is impossible to make contact (=scratch) the lense with 72mm filter. It seems to get quite close, though. I've used normal PVC tape to keep the filters in place.

so are you saying you think the 72mm filter is the better fit?

Does the HC3000 have sealed, or at least gasketed, optics? The cine4home.de review showed the HC3000 to have a high quality optics with a sealed path.

How does the deinterlacer handle 1080i signals? Does it do "weaving" or (not so good) "bobbing"? 1080i is very good with motion, virtually the same as 720p, even though machine is 720p native. How 1080i video looks should not be a concern.

Isn't the bobbing and weaving concern a primary issue for upconversion of 1080i signals to 1080P devices?

Whether or not the 1080i signal is converted to 1080p and then downconverted to 720p or the 1080i signal is downconverted to 540p and then upconverted to 1080i doesn't make that much difference at 720p resolution. The real issue is how the motion artifact handling is done. In this case it is very good with the new 3020 ASIC controller.

I think the real issue at this price class is how the end result as the device converts 1080i to its native 720p, which in this case is superb.

- Last question :rolleyes: How does the HC3000 compare to the Optoma H79?[/QUOTE]
I bought a few weeks ago the H79 from Avshop. Very nice guys by the way.
I compared the HC900 to the Optoma H79 (not the same day). I viewed them both for a few hours and I must say that the H79 really impressed me. Very deep colors with a lot of details. Well I haven't seen the HC3000 but it seems like it will be very close to the H79 quality.
The main advantages of the H79 are still the Motor Zoom/Focus and the very quite operation and a very good deinterlacer, 8 segment color wheel instead of 6 segment for the HC3000 should give you slightly smoother picture in dark scenes.
I have been told that next week Avshop will compare both units to see if the H79 can still top the Mutsi HC3000.

Kosty, thanks for the info. I certainly believe you when you say 1080i looks good on the Mits. The question is does it look as good is it could look. I would argue that whether a deinterlacer bobs a 1080i signal to 540p, or weaves it to 1080p, before converting it to 720p can make a significant difference in the ultimate quality of the 720p output. There has to be some loss of vertical information in the conversion to 540p.

Thus I'm curious about what approach they actually took. Since it is an all-new chipset with 10-bit processing I suspect they are weaving but haven't seen any confirmation of this.

- Last question :rolleyes: How does the HC3000 compare to the Optoma H79?
I bought a few weeks ago the H79 from Avshop. Very nice guys by the way.
I compared the HC900 to the Optoma H79 (not the same day). I viewed them both for a few hours and I must say that the H79 really impressed me. Very deep colors with a lot of details. Well I haven't seen the HC3000 but it seems like it will be very close to the H79 quality.
The main advantages of the H79 are still the Motor Zoom/Focus and the very quite operation and a very good deinterlacer, 8 segment color wheel instead of 6 segment for the HC3000 should give you slightly smoother picture in dark scenes.
I have been told that next week Avshop will compare both units to see if the H79 can still top the Mutsi HC3000.

No surprise that the H79 blows away the HC900. H79 vs. HC3000, now that will be interesting. I suspect they will be very close (as would the HD72) but the H79 will still have a slight advantage.

Does anyone know how HC3000 matches with Screen innovation theater performance screen? Thanks.

What is the correct way to view a 2.35 movie (Flight Plan) on a 16x9 screen using this projector?

The screen size on my projector menu is set at "720P (16:9)," but unsure whether the Aspect setting should be Auto, 16:9, Zoom 1, or Zoom 2.

If this movie is 2.35, then the "Setting the Aspect Ratio" table on page 19 of the owner's manual would tend to suggest Zoom 2, but, frankly, the frequent references to 4:3 in the first column of that table, combined with the Vista vs Cinema Scope reference is a bit confusing.

Thanks,

Larry

What is the correct way to view a 2.35 movie (Flight Plan) on a 16x9 screen using this projector?First, note that if your DVD source is 480i, the zoom modes won't be selectable anyway. For recent big titles like the one you mention, this isn't a problem, since not too many of them are non-anamorphic transfers. The zoom modes are usually used with letterboxed (non-anamorphic) titles.

If your source is 480p, then the zoom modes will be selectable, but purists would suggest you not use any zoom modes on anamorphic 2.35:1 DVD titles. You should leave the projector in 16:9 mode (Auto will also be 16:9... I tend to leave my projector in Auto most of the time).

If you like, with 2.35:1 material, you can use the vertical offset feature in the projector menu to move the image down so that the bottom of the film frame is flush with the bottom of your screen.

Just pulled the trigger on the HC3000u, should have it Friday! This will be a mega upgrade from an X1.... :) Thanks to all who have posted info on this thread. I was waiting to see if the HD72 offered any significant advantages and I finally decided it didn't....and the Mits chassis is a well-proven design.

What is the correct way to view a 2.35 movie (Flight Plan) on a 16x9 screen using this projector?

The screen size on my projector menu is set at "720P (16:9)," but unsure whether the Aspect setting should be Auto, 16:9, Zoom 1, or Zoom 2.

If this movie is 2.35, then the "Setting the Aspect Ratio" table on page 19 of the owner's manual would tend to suggest Zoom 2, but, frankly, the frequent references to 4:3 in the first column of that table, combined with the Vista vs Cinema Scope reference is a bit confusing.

DVDs really only come in one of two formats: 4:3 or 16:9. A 2.35:1 movie is encoded in 16:9 format, with black bars at the top and bottom as part of the video image.

The various zoom modes on the projector are for the benefit of people who prefer to slice the sides off 2.35:1 movies and blow up the middle to fill their screen.

Thanks HWJ and Josh for your responses. They helped. I also discovered the Overscan and shutter options last night. To me, their use tended to make a 2.35 film look better on a 16x9 screen, too. Don't know their exact purpose yet, but the black bars weren't nearly as noticeable. Thanks again.

Vorst
Please post your impressions after seeing the H79 and HC3000.

Regardless I emailed mitsibushi about how to acess the service menu, dont know if they will respond.

I am surprised it has not been discovered, on my 8700 you pressed menu, then on, then menu again to acess it.


Murilo, any luck getting info on how to access the service menu?

I've been reading some AVS threads about the HC900, the Matterhorn-based predecessor to the HC3000. Comparing the two, two things strike me as a bit curious. First, the HC900 has a continously variable (or at least multiple position) motorized iris, while the HC3000 iris has only fully open and fully closed settings. Anyone have an idea of a possible reason for this downgrade in adjustability? The HC3000 iris is still motorized, so it doesn't seem the change would have resulted in any significant cost reduction.

Second, the HC900 has a 4000:1 advertised CR with the iris fully closed, exactly the same as the HC3000. Isn't the HD2+ DMD supposed to achieve better contrast than Matterhorn? If so, perhaps the 900's number was inflated and the HC3000 rating is just more conservative, but it seems odd that with an all-new chip the marketing guys wouldn't have pushed for the new model to have a higher advertised CR number than the old.

Just some random musings as I anxiously await the arrival of my HC3000!

I don't believe anyones stated contrast ratio. I trust my eyes when I look at the picture. While the black levels on the Mits aren't as good as my RPTV, they look darn good, expecially at 88" compared to my 57" TV. I'll take the slightly higher black levels and 31", Thank you!

I don't believe anyones stated contrast ratio. I trust my eyes when I look at the picture. While the black levels on the Mits aren't as good as my RPTV, they look darn good, expecially at 88" compared to my 57" TV. I'll take the slightly higher black levels and 31", Thank you!

Who says size matters??!!!!

Vorst
Please post your impressions after seeing the H79 and HC3000.
I hope it will be possible by the end of next week, the webshop that I bought it from sold already a bunch of H79's but they are more Mutsi believers. The owner just bought a HC3000 for himself and told me before that the image quality of the H79 is almost equal to the much less expensive HC900. I told him NO way this is possible ( I saw both and there was a clear difference).
It will be an interesting H79/HC3000 debate when we get both units together.

Second, the HC900 has a 4000:1 advertised CR with the iris fully closed, exactly the same as the HC3000. Isn't the HD2+ DMD supposed to achieve better contrast than Matterhorn?The HC3000 contrast is absolutely better than the HC900. I have seen both side by side and have also seen the HC3000 mounted where the HC900 was. No comparison.

The picture is much better than the HC900 which isn't that shabby. true color adjustment is better, especially when varied colors are on the screen at the same time.

The range between bright white and dark black is amazing for this price group. And if you calibrate it right most people tone down the whites with plenty of room for more contrast adjustments.

And the higher pixel count makes the screendoor invisible on the HC3000, while it is noticable on the HC900 if you sit close. It is clear that the HC3000's DMD chip is newer technology or manufacturing process, no matter what the official specifications are.

TI is going away from having OEM's highlight the version branding of those chips since each new batch has incremental manufacturing changes.

Does Mitsu make a carrying case for the HC3000?
If so, does anyone have one and any comments?

Got my HC3000 up and running. I have a (52 by 94 inch) Dalite screen with a 1.3 gain. The brightness even using low bulb power is a bit overwhelming. Anyone know any settings that seem to bring down the overall starkness of the picture? I have Avida and DVE(digital video essentials) disks but not sure how well they really apply to DLP. Some of the setting stuff like sharpness etc seem non functional for their setting methods. Right now it is just that when a white image (large in size on the screen) comes up it is almost blinding. Can be a bit irritating after a few hours viewing time. I was used to my X1 and this front projector is every bit as bright as my rear projector Tosh 62 inch DLP.

@ Bill Shenefelt

If you have activated BrilliantColor you may want to turn it off until the bulb has at least 250 hours to tone done the image. Aging will dim your bulb anyway.

You may also add a ND filter to the lens until the bulb dims with age also.

k

I have decided on the Hc300 if it will work for my room. I have7'10" ceiling, 100" carada screen. Can I put the screen all the way up next to the ceiling? It needs to be up off the floor as far as possible to accomodate 2nd row seating, I believe the screen has a 3 1/2" border around the screen so that would put the top of the screen at 7'6 1/2 inches. How low do I hang the projector or should it hug the ceiling? The calculators tell how far away it should be but I can't find anything to give me this info.

it won't work for you, it would if you put it on the floor.

muncey

I have a 6.9 feet ceiling, and use a 86" screen. The bottom of the screen is about 2.3 feet above the floor. The PJ is tilted a bit, but you can't see it on the image. So I use no keystone correction.

Don't know if its any help to you, but in my opinion the installation is made more difficult than it actually is. Before I got it, I used the mitsubishi calculator, which didn't give me very promising results, but as I said, I ended up with a very nice result.

I have decided on the Hc300 if it will work for my room. I have7'10" ceiling, 100" carada screen. Can I put the screen all the way up next to the ceiling? It needs to be up off the floor as far as possible to accomodate 2nd row seating, I believe the screen has a 3 1/2" border around the screen so that would put the top of the screen at 7'6 1/2 inches. How low do I hang the projector or should it hug the ceiling? The calculators tell how far away it should be but I can't find anything to give me this info.

I would not say categorically that what you want to do is not possible, but it will be a bit tricky. The HC3000 brochure at

http://www.mitsubishi-hometheater.com/pdf/MIT_DATAHC3000U_R3.pdf

gives the offset (Hd) for various screen sizes. It's 16.9 inches for a 100 inch diagonal screen. That means that when the PJ is inverted the top of the image will be 17 inches below the centerline of the lens. If you mount the PJ so it hugs the ceiling, the lens will be 2-4 inches from the ceiling (depending on the mount details) so the top of the image will be 19-21 inches from the ceiling. That would put the bottom of the image about two feet from the floor which would be fine for a single-row setup. The internal vertical shift available on the HC3000 by raising the 720 pixel grid within the 768 available vertical pixels can raise the image about 2-3 inches higher than that.

If you really need the screen to hug the ceiling you would need to tilt the front of the PJ upwards a bit from level and then re-square the image either by using digital keystoning or by shimming out the top of the screen. The latter approach is more of a hassle but would not degrade the image.

Thanks, I'm still confused and I want a projector that will work for my situation! I have a budget of 3,000 for projector. I am finishing up my dedicated HT room and I am ready to run all cables and wires before drywall man gets here. What would be a comparable pj to the hc3000 and able to work for a 14x21 room with 7ft10in ceilings projecting on a 100" carada screen? I have 2 rows of seating and I would be able to put the pj from 16' back from screen and closer. Any advice? I do not what I would do without avsforum. Thanks again.

So far I like the 3000 mits. A little on the bright side, but I should be able to tone that down. I don't know if yours creen has gain but if it does you will have a bright picture with the 3000. I have a dalite with 1.3 gain and if I could start over I would go to a no gain screen,maybe one of the silver gray jobs. I am using a commercial grade cable that is run thru the attic. It has a very heavy rubber jacket over three belden like 75 ohm coax cables. Looks liek it shoud work fro jumping a car battery. Might be good for behind walls. Jacket should discourage any critters. I occasionally see some vertical waves of banding but they seem broadcast source not my cable. I am not into the super audiophile or videophyle kilobuck cable and this 33 ft run cost me about $125 and works. My projector is about 14 1/2 ft back from the screen and is minimized picture size wise. Could go closer a ft or two for more adjustment range on my 112 inch diagonal. . For a 100 inch diagonal you should go for about 13/ ft I would think. Might also look at the new lower priced optima. Close to the same range in price. Don't know how this new chip looks but should look good.

choate71, look at the new infocus IN76. it has less of an offset and many of the same features as the 3000. i think it's better looking also. maybe the panny 900 or sanyo z4 would work better for you, they have lens shift and are much more flexible as far as installation.
by the way, i have the 3000 with 8' ceiling and my 110" screen is 20" above the floor with the projector lens mounted about 6" from the ceiling, if the offset works for you the mitsubishi is a great little projector for the price.

muncey

Hi Muncy
My mits 3000 is a little overwhelming on brightness for my taste. I got a couple of setup programs but not sure if I am doing things correctly with them. What kind of gain or surface do you have in your screen and what contrast, brightness etc are you using on your mits?

110" Carada BW 1.3 Gain. Oppo DVD player dvi-hdmi, hc3000=contrast -5, brightness 5. low lamp mode, iris closed and brillant color off, cinema mode, 5900k.

muncey

xbox 360 looks great on it also.
PGR3 at 110" is nice.

muncey

Hi Muncey, I have pulled trigger on HC3000 this week. I have a 100 inch Screen innovations and I used the above settings you have mentioned for HDMI and I am satisfied. Earlier I felt whites are little washed away, now the picture looks much better. I will play with the picture little more and see if it gets better. Do you use the same settings for Component video?

Hi Muncey, I have pulled trigger on HC3000 this week. I have a 100 inch Screen innovations and I used the above settings you have mentioned for HDMI and I am satisfied. Earlier I felt whites are little washed away, now the picture looks much better. I will play with the picture little more and see if it gets better. Do you use the same settings for Component video?

i only have xbox 360 on component occasionally so i haven't calibrated it yet. as soon as the spydertv pro is available i'll run a complete calibration on the whole system. by then i should have enough hours on the 3000 that the bulb will be "broken in". if you have avia or dve you should run them on it, if you don't have one of them, get one of them.

muncey

I haven't had a lot of time to play with programming marcos on my URC remote but has anyone had difficulty with shutting off this projector using a macro. For some reason my second off command is not always received/recognized. Any suggestions on how many times the IR should be repeated, timing/delay of second off, etc.?

Thanks

I'm using an mx-850. I put the mits commands first, with a 1.5 second delay b/w the first and second power off command. After many attempts that is what finally worked for me.

Ben

Good tip...I have had the same problems with my MX-750. I think there are too many commands coming off the screen too close together or something. I'll give that a try Ben...thanks!

Does anyone in here own an upscaling DVD player? I am getting ready to pull the trigger on the HC3000 and was wanting to know which signal would be the best to send the Mitsu. If it makes any difference, my DVD player is a Pioneer Elite DV-79Avi. Thanks for any suggestions!!!

Does anyone in here own an upscaling DVD player? I am getting ready to pull the trigger on the HC3000 and was wanting to know which signal would be the best to send the Mitsu. If it makes any difference, my DVD player is a Pioneer Elite DV-79Avi. Thanks for any suggestions!!!


hdmi

muncey

Thanks a bunch. Did you try to increase/decrease the number of IR repeats as well or the IR intensity?

I am not sure that a huge number of repeats will do any good. I found out that I could not have any other codes b/w the 2 offs.. I had luck getting a HC 900 with .5 seconds b/w off commands, but for some reason I needed to have 1.5 b/w off commands. I tried to have my B&K ref b/w the off's but that did not help. It did'nt make it sense, but this is what worked for me. I am almost done programming my Crestron system so this mx-850 will not be used that much anymore in the media room.

In regards to the intensity I have my system setup a little differently. I have 2 mx 850's running off of one 300. I have 1 of the outputs running into a xantech connecting block for my downstairs system, which is located in a different part of the house. I do have the level on the output about 3/4's of the way up and it seems to be working good.

Let us know if this works or what your work around turn out to be.

Ben

Does the HC3000 have an aspect mode that will stretch anamorphic content vertically so you can use an anamorphic lens without an external scaler?

Looking at the manual, it looks like Zoom2 may do the trick, but it's a little vague. When you use Zoom2 with an anamorphic 2.35:1 disc, does the image stretch to the full height of the screen and the full image width is preserved (i.e. image distorts and people get tall and skinny)? Or does it just chop the sides and blow up to 16:9?

If Zoom2 doesn't do this, are there any other aspect modes that do?

Thanks!

Does the HC3000 have an aspect mode that will stretch anamorphic content vertically so you can use an anamorphic lens without an external scaler?

Yes, but it is limited.

Looking at the manual, it looks like Zoom2 may do the trick, but it's a little vague. When you use Zoom2 with an anamorphic 2.35:1 disc, does the image stretch to the full height of the screen and the full image width is preserved (i.e. image distorts and people get tall and skinny)? Or does it just chop the sides and blow up to 16:9?

Zoom 2 does do the necessary vertical stretch without cutting off the sides, but that function is only available when you are feeding the PJ a 480p or 576p signal.
It does not with 480i, 576i or any of the higher resolutions.

If Zoom2 doesn't do this, are there any other aspect modes that do?

I'm afraid not. :(

Thanks Mike. :)

Hi guys just got my HC3000 yesterday whata jump up from my 4805 infocus !
Anyone have any recomended settings for component connection:-
cinema room is magnolia walls, white celiling I think about 1.0 gain screen., with approx 100" diagonal image.
I know each person setup is different but I wuold not mind storing a few presets for comparison I find the OTB settings to be a little bright :)
I have the JAP version so OSD is in JAP is there a way to flash f/w to english or is there an english manual I can download from somewhere ?

hdmi

muncey


Sorry, I guess I should have been more specific.

480i over HDMI?
480p over HDMI?
720p over HDMI?
1080i over HDMI?

Maybe a better way to ask is should I let the Pioneer do the upscaling and de-interlacing or would it be better to let the Mitsubishi do it?

Thanks for any input!!

720p-hdmi

muncey

Well the filters arrived. And guess what I STILL SEE RAINBOWS! Argh. Even on an ND8 filter I can still see them. I guess I'm doomed with DLP. Damn my superior vision :p looks like it's back to the LCD/LCOS drawing board for me.

Hi guys just got my HC3000 yesterday whata jump up from my 4805 infocus !
Anyone have any recomended settings for component connection:-
cinema room is magnolia walls, white celiling I think about 1.0 gain screen., with approx 100" diagonal image.
I know each person setup is different but I wuold not mind storing a few presets for comparison I find the OTB settings to be a little bright :)
I have the JAP version so OSD is in JAP is there a way to flash f/w to english or is there an english manual I can download from somewhere ?

If you still need the manual I have one in pdf format... it's pretty easy to change the menus to english with it.

Hmmm, wont let me upload it, says file size it too large... I can email it to you I guess.

sorry, double post... browser timed out :o

If you don't need the whole manual just hit the menu button on the remote then push the right button twice to select the item third from the left. Now push the down button and until you reach the 2nd to the last item. This is the language option. Push the left or right button until you get to English.

That should do it.

Well the filters arrived. And guess what I STILL SEE RAINBOWS! Argh. Even on an ND8 filter I can still see them. I guess I'm doomed with DLP. Damn my superior vision :p looks like it's back to the LCD/LCOS drawing board for me.

Did you buy the projector without seeing in live before purchase? In my case I did NOT see rainbows with the demo unit, and the ND filters helped the situation with my own. If I would had seen rainbows with the demo unit, I likely would have passed this PJ to begin with.

Did you buy the projector without seeing in live before purchase? In my case I did NOT see rainbows with the demo unit, and the ND filters helped the situation with my own. If I would had seen rainbows with the demo unit, I likely would have passed this PJ to begin with.
Yes I bought it blind off the internet. I had done this before with the Sony HS20, and that was an excellent experience so I was expecting the same with the HC3000. ND filters do help reduce rbe but they don't completely eliminate the rainbows for me.

That's why it was interesting to post that poll I did a week ago, to find out how much of a problem the rainbow was. In this thread http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=640881 results of 101 people: 38% saw no rainbows and a whopping 62% did see rainbows. 25% of everyone said that it gave them a headache or migraine. Seeing rainbows doesn't annoy me but the feeling of a oncoming headache does annoy me.

I guess there's levels of rbe for different projectors. MD_HT1's review http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=641966 of the HC3000 alongside the H78DC3 said a lot less visible rainbows on the DC3 projector. Now I don't know whether it's down to the brightness of the H78 or the internal mechanics of the projector but whatever Mitsubishi is doing is causing more profilic rainbows (for me).

Well I got my HC3000 yesterday, and hooked up last night. If anyone is worried about the offset and low ceiling issue, don't be. I have a 7 foot ceiling and an offset of only 8.5 inches. The manual says I should have at least 13 inches with my screen size. I flush mounted the projector to the ceiling and tilted the back down using the feet on the projector. I am not using any keystoning and no screen tilt and the picture shows very little signs of distortion, even on 4X3. I am not a novice and am used to projectors and watching calibrated pictures, so I at least know what to look for. If you are holding off on purchasing this fine projector because of fear of mounting on a low ceiling, don't be, the projector is more flexible than I was led to believe. I see more artifacts from MPEG2 than I do from the offset issue. Hope this helps someone out with concerns. The projector is amazing for the money, hard to find a better picture than this for less than 3 grand.

Well I got my HC3000 yesterday, and hooked up last night. If anyone is worried about the offset and low ceiling issue, don't be. I have a 7 foot ceiling and an offset of only 8.5 inches. The manual says I should have at least 13 inches with my screen size. I flush mounted the projector to the ceiling and tilted the back down using the feet on the projector. I am not using any keystoning and no screen tilt and the picture shows very little signs of distortion, even on 4X3. I am not a novice and am used to projectors and watching calibrated pictures, so I at least know what to look for. If you are holding off on purchasing this fine projector because of fear of mounting on a low ceiling, don't be, the projector is more flexible than I was led to believe. I see more artifacts from MPEG2 than I do from the offset issue. Hope this helps someone out with concerns. The projector is amazing for the money, hard to find a better picture than this for less than 3 grand.

Which means not that the offset in the manual (which is calculated with the PJ strictly level) is incorrect, but that you found that tilting the PJ to compensate for the offset didn't affect PQ. It doesn't take much tilt to make a significant difference in the vertical positioning of the image. Good to hear that doing this little tilt isn't a big deal.

That is correct. The offset in the manual is accurate for (proper mounting, with no distortion) mounting. The rear of my projector is down about an inch or less, but the picture on the screen is only keystoned very slightly. I was only able to tell the distortion by measuring it. I can eliminate the distortion by moving my screen out at the top, by about a 1/4 of an inch. You can make up a lot of the offset with the screen shift and a slight bit of overscan on the sides. Most of these issues are compromises I am willing to make to achieve this level of picture quality, for this amount of money.

thanks a lot for the easy menu fix buddy the projector is awsome much better than my infocus 4805 HD is amazingly clear and using it with an xbox 360 extender is also really good.
Whats the best setup disk to buy ?
The infocus 4805 was fine OTB I think the hc3000 is too bright and colorful OTB so needs adjusting some say use the THX feature on starwars DVD is that sufficent ?

Well I got my HC3000 yesterday, and hooked up last night. If anyone is worried about the offset and low ceiling issue, don't be. I have a 7 foot ceiling and an offset of only 8.5 inches. The manual says I should have at least 13 inches with my screen size. I flush mounted the projector to the ceiling and tilted the back down using the feet on the projector. I am not using any keystoning and no screen tilt and the picture shows very little signs of distortion, even on 4X3. I am not a novice and am used to projectors and watching calibrated pictures, so I at least know what to look for. If you are holding off on purchasing this fine projector because of fear of mounting on a low ceiling, don't be, the projector is more flexible than I was led to believe. I see more artifacts from MPEG2 than I do from the offset issue. Hope this helps someone out with concerns. The projector is amazing for the money, hard to find a better picture than this for less than 3 grand.


So tilting causes distortion and artifacts? I did not know that.

By distortions I mean that the picture will not be square on the screen. It will have the sides tilted. If you add Keystone correction to fix this problem you can add artifacts to the picture. Most people would not see them unless they are looking for them. Hope this helps.

Yea for my 8700+ I had it tilted slightly, the image was not quite square, but really with black borders around your screen, it was hard to tell.

If you are experiencing rainbows try the following:

Sit further back so your eyes don't dart back an forth
use a gray screen to tone down the whites
try a lower lumen setting on the PJ

I have found that the closer one sits to a very large screen (<1.5x) the more likely the effect. The darker screens also reduce perceived RBE. Dimmer output from the PJ seemed to help too.

sorry for double post [deleted]

I saw tons of rainbows too with this HC3000 at a dealer demo showing SWIII. In fact it's much worse that my old Dreamvision DL500. I don't know if it's due a much much brighter PJ.
This Mit is one bright sucker...my eyes were burning when watching the demo for only few minutes.

Is the 1.8 Greywolf a good screen for this PJ ?

For anyone wanting to calibrate color this is ridiculious, I dont know how we all overlooked this, go to color temp, select user, and adjust color anyway you want, cant believe what you can find at 7 am fooling around with a projector after a night out.

For anyone wanting to calibrate color this is ridiculious, I dont know how we all overlooked this, go to color temp, select user, and adjust color anyway you want, cant believe what you can find at 7 am fooling around with a projector after a night out.

Those settings only affect the grayscale balance, not the color saturation or hue.

Is the 1.8 Greywolf a good screen for this PJ ?

How large an image do you plan to project? This projector is already super-bright, and 1.8 is a lot of gain. Even in low lamp mode with the iris closed, I'd think the image will be nearly blinding, and you'll expose a lot of digital artifacts that should not normally be visible.

Anybody know of a good low(negative) gain screen for th 3000U. I have a 1.3 gain Dalite and need a LOT less brightness. Screen is (52x94?) and I'm only about 13 ft back. With no lights on in the room it almost burns the eyes even onlo lite.

Re Low Gain screen

Bill,
I would suggest the Carada 0.8 gray screen.
I had a 92" with my 4805 and the increase in black levels was impressive. They have good prices, are very easy to install and David gives personal service when requested.

How large an image do you plan to project? This projector is already super-bright, and 1.8 is a lot of gain. Even in low lamp mode with the iris closed, I'd think the image will be nearly blinding, and you'll expose a lot of digital artifacts that should not normally be visible.

The Graywolf is retroreflective, and if the PJ is ceiling mounted the gain is only about 0.9 for a seated viewer.

Anybody know of a good low(negative) gain screen for th 3000U. I have a 1.3 gain Dalite and need a LOT less brightness. Screen is (52x94?) and I'm only about 13 ft back. With no lights on in the room it almost burns the eyes even onlo lite.

Have you tried a neutral density filter first? That would be a much cheaper and easier way of bringing down the brightness than installing a whole new screen.

Well josh I dont know what to say but if you read the cine4home review they used those color settings to get d65, beyond getting d65, I had no other reason to fool around with the color. Infact I dont know many projectors that affect color saturation, infact it is easy to change saturation on htpc thats no problem but I have learned in the htpc area, to leave saturation at default according to other.

Well josh I dont know what to say but if you read the cine4home review they used those color settings to get d65,

That's my point. Those settings only affect grayscale, not color.

beyond getting d65, I had no other reason to fool around with the color. Infact I dont know many projectors that affect color saturation, infact it is easy to change saturation on htpc thats no problem but I have learned in the htpc area, to leave saturation at default according to other.

I use my iScan VP30 scaler to adjust color, so it isn't an issue for me, but I'm sure you will find many people frustated that this function is locked out with HDMI input. I do not agree that the default color settings are necessarily accurate. In theory they are supposed to be, but in actual practice some adjustment may be needed.

So if I have just Avia, and no HTPC, it is not possible to adjust color saturation and hue for the HDMI input?

So if I have just Avia, and no HTPC, it is not possible to adjust color saturation and hue for the HDMI input?

Correct, those controls are locked out with HDMI. They are only active over the analog connections such as component, S-video, and composite.

Well I just returned my 4805 to Best Buy and picked up an HC3000 :) Now the 4805 had a nice pic, but it was too buggy... bad firmware, loud fan, loud high pitched color wheel and alot of SDE.

Anyways back to the 3000, all I can say is WOW!

Here are my observations so far...

1. This pj is so quiet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2. Very little SDE, which is to be expected with 720p pj.

3. HD is great!!!

4. DVDs don't seem to be as bright as my 4805?

5. Not sure if I like brilliantcolor yet. I'm still switching back and forth from it.

6. I need to become more educated about the Iris because I have no idea what its purpose is.

7. No RBE so far

8. No noticable stray light

Well thats it for now.

Josh,

Is this lockout (of color saturation and hue) unique to the HC3K or is it the same over all projectors that use digital either DVI or HDMI?

So other than buying a HTPC to replace my Oppo I can not make those adjustments?

Question for everyone that wants to add their two cents:

My HC3000U is on the way with a 110 inch Cinema Contour HC Da-Mat.
Everything will run through a Yamaha RX-V1600 receiver via HDMI to the projector.

What dvd player under $300 do you suggest with the HC3000U?????

I have heard of possible macroblocking problems with different dvd players and projector combinations, so I don't want to have that problem.

Does the Panasonic DVD-s97s or DVD-s77s work, or do you guys suggest something else???

Thanks in advance for the help.

Question for everyone that wants to add their two cents:

My HC3000U is on the way with a 110 inch Cinema Contour HC Da-Mat.
Everything will run through a Yamaha RX-V1600 receiver via HDMI to the projector.

What dvd player under $300 do you suggest with the HC3000U?????

I have heard of possible macroblocking problems with different dvd players and projector combinations, so I don't want to have that problem.

Does the Panasonic DVD-s97s or DVD-s77s work, or do you guys suggest something else???

Thanks in advance for the help.


The Oppo is a popular choice for HDMI, several on this board are using it with the Mits and have not reported problems.

Josh,

So other than buying a HTPC to replace my Oppo I can not make those adjustments?


Right now, no. We're hoping someone will figure out and report how to access the HC3000 service menu, where (one assumes) there should be color adjustments that work for HDMI.

The other option is to run component. With many DVD players, the PQ difference between component and HDMI is small, and the HC3000's internal scaler is pretty good. So, some would trade the small improvement in sharpness/artifacts over an HDMI connection for the ability to tweak the colors in component. I'm considering this myself. Unfortunately, the Oppo DVD player is not considered to be very good over the component output.

Thanks Big.

I can send the signal to the receiver from the DVD player by using component or HMDI. It will then upconvert in the receiver and transmit to the projector using HDMI. So, I can use either method.

I have heard that the Oppo is also a good player.

What does everyone else think? The Oppo or the Panny with the HC300U? Should I use component or HDMI from the DVD player to the receiver?

Thanks for the clarification I am very happy with the Oppo and their support so I will wait until someone finds out how to enter the service menu.

This is not to say that I am the least bit unhappy with my HC3K... great picture on my 106' Firehawk and the Oyympics look quite good even on Standard Def. (Direct TV with no locals in the boonies)

UFGolf

I use the Oppo with a DVI to HDMI cable for DVD and component for TV from my Direct TV receiver.

The Oppo support as mentioned is great and although I own many Panasonic items (like 5 of their digi cams) their support is about like calling the pentagon.

I just got off the phone with Benq, and had a vary enlightened conversation with a vary knowledgeable tech rep. He sent me a UPS shipping label and is having my unit pick up by UPS.

After taking my serial number he informed me that a firmware up need to be done, I ask is that a picture quality firmware update for a better color "HE SAID NO"!!!!!!! and don't believe any rumor that is does, the firmware up date is for internal bulb fixes only it WILL ONLY EFFECT THE BULB LIFE, and I will see no picture quality difference.

He added this firmware up date requires physical board changes along with firmware updates.

SO THEIR you have my conversation, and although the road has been a little bumpy with the PE7000 the service they have shown me is second to none.

Hopefully this hardware/firmware fix will do the trick............. :cool:

Can someone tell me how to send 1280x720 to VGA from a HTPC? I have a ATI 9800 pro. If I try 60hz my HC3000 just cycles through different input modes like MAC16, etc. Do I need powerstrip?

By the way, the HC3000 looks great on Dalite High Contrast Cinema Vision with DirecTV's H20 receiver! Thanks for all your help.

Can someone tell me how to send 1280x720 to VGA from a HTPC? I have a ATI 9800 pro. If I try 60hz my HC3000 just cycles through different input modes like MAC16, etc. Do I need powerstrip?

Does 1280x1024 @ 60Hz work ? If so then maybe the HC3000U does not like a standard 720p signal over VGA , DVI-D should work great with 720p however and give a better image as well . There are some displays that consider the VGA port for PC connections only and then they assume this means standard 4:3 resolutions ( VGA , SVGA , XGA , etc. ) . I am uncertain about the Mits HC3k since I do not own one but thought I would toss that out there anyway ;) .

--- Did you try 1280x768 @ 60hz ?


----------- Jason

Hi everybody,

I am buying a new PJ and HC3000 is one of the front runners. My house is on elevation 6150 and I am wondering if anybody is using PJ on such a high elevation. I am interested to find out if fan is running very loud when used on high elevation.

I searched this thread and HC3000 user manual but was unable to find the answer. It appears that PJ does not have High Elevation mode (unlike other PJ models I am considering), so how does it handle extra lamp cooling for places with thin air ? Does it automatically detect that lamp is running hot and start running fan at higher speed ?

Appreciate your advice.

Thanks, Davie.

I just got off the phone with Benq, and had a vary enlightened conversation with a vary knowledgeable tech rep. He sent me a UPS shipping label and is having my unit pick up by UPS.

After taking my serial number he informed me that a firmware up need to be done, I ask is that a picture quality firmware update for a better color "HE SAID NO"!!!!!!! and don't believe any rumor that is does, the firmware up date is for internal bulb fixes only it WILL ONLY EFFECT THE BULB LIFE, and I will see no picture quality difference.

He added this firmware up date requires physical board changes along with firmware updates.

SO THEIR you have my conversation, and although the road has been a little bumpy with the PE7000 the service they have shown me is second to none.

Hopefully this hardware/firmware fix will do the trick............. :cool:


Wrong forum??

I am having a hard time finding the HC3000U in stock for a great price , there are great prices on this unit out there but it seems to be limited availability . Does anybody have some info they can share for a great deal on this unit ? I e-mailed VA already and they will not match other online vendor pricing for this unit . I have a call into PP as well but they have not returned the call . I am trying to buy from AVS forum sponsors but not having much luck thus far and I wish to buy from a reputable dealer with good policies should I get a lemon (one that maintains the warranty is crucial) .

--- Please do not discuss pricing in this thread .

--- PM me if you can help :) .

--------- Thank You ,
------------ Jason

I am having a hard time finding the HC3000U in stock for a great price , there are great prices on this unit out there but it seems to be limited availability . Does anybody have some info they can share for a great deal on this unit ? I e-mailed VA already and they will not match other online vendor pricing for this unit . I have a call into PP as well but they have not returned the call . I am trying to buy from AVS forum sponsors but not having much luck thus far and I wish to buy from a reputable dealer with good policies should I get a lemon (one that maintains the warranty is crucial) .

--- Please do not discuss pricing in this thread .

--- PM me if you can help :) .

--------- Thank You ,
------------ Jason


call jason, dave, or daniel at avs.

muncey

call jason, dave, or daniel at avs.

muncey

I just sent Jason an e-mail . I would have tried AVS first but did not see Mitsubishi listed in the Products that they sell ... Ooops ;) .

---------Thank You ,
------------ Jason

I have HC3000 for about two weeks and I love this projector. this is my first projector and very impressed with this. The only thing that is bothering me is, it is too bright. My eyes start burning if I watch it with out any ambient light. So i usually have a dim light switched on while wathcing it at night. But I feel blacks are affected by having the light on. Does anyone have similar problem? I would like to know if others are solving this issue.

I have HC3000 for about two weeks and I love this projector. this is my first projector and very impressed with this. The only thing that is bothering me is, it is too bright. My eyes start burning if I watch it with out any ambient light. So i usually have a dim light switched on while wathcing it at night. But I feel blacks are affected by having the light on. Does anyone have similar problem? I would like to know if others are solving this issue.
Put it on the darkest setting like theatre black (cant rem its name) and close the Iris down as far as possible its ok that way.

I have closed the iris using the remote button. Not sure if there is some other setting..

Is this projector sensitive to Macroblocking Enhancement? I'm thinking about getting the Panasonic DVD-S97, but I have heard that it doesn't work well with displays that are sensitive to MB Enhancement. Any ideas???

I have closed the iris using the remote button. Not sure if there is some other setting..

Close the iris, turn the lamp to "Low" mode, and reduce your brightness and contrast settings. Many of us have also found it helpful to add a neutral density filter to the lens. A 72mm size filter will fit over the lens, but you'll need to hold it in place with some tape (the projector does not have threads to hold the filter on its own).

Does 1280x1024 @ 60Hz work ? If so then maybe the HC3000U does not like a standard 720p signal over VGA , DVI-D should work great with 720p however and give a better image as well . There are some displays that consider the VGA port for PC connections only and then they assume this means standard 4:3 resolutions ( VGA , SVGA , XGA , etc. ) . I am uncertain about the Mits HC3k since I do not own one but thought I would toss that out there anyway ;) .

--- Did you try 1280x768 @ 60hz ?


----------- Jason
Yes I'm running 1280x768 @ 60hz through VGA. I've tried a few different refresh rates for 1280x720 but nothing is stable.

On price subject (without mentioninga price) -- did Mitsubishi continue their rebate or is that all done now?

Paul_PDX

Yes, rebate discontinued but at current MSRP of 2500 and a willing authorized dealer you come close to best deal with rebate before.

Yes, rebate discontinued but at current MSRP of 2500 and a willing authorized dealer you come close to best deal with rebate before.

Thanks, that's what I hadn't figured out was that the MSRP had been lowered (thread title should get updated) :)

Well I just ordered one today (will be here friday 2/24) and now I need to find a reasonable price on a flush style ceiling mount , any suggestions ?

Thank You !
--- Jason

chief universal is what i'm using.

muncey

Jason

I ordered a Chief RPA universal mount and have it flush mounted. It works OK but difficult to adjust in the up/down direction. The individual arms (you need 3 of the 4) are OK but I would keep looking for one that is easier to adjust.