First part today, picture quality test tomorrow. No price info.

Use Babelfish to translate from German to English if required.

website is Cine4Home dot de for those who don't know about it yet.

Neko

I wonder if the D5 panels have an inorganic alignement layer...
If anyone is interested i can translate parts of the review.

I think we should have a single thread for the Sanyo Z4, rather than one for pics, another for previews, another for sightings and another for 'I got mine' - 'No s***, where did you find it?'. :D

Here is a translated link on Cine4Home's site (http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_load?lp=de_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2Ftests%2Fprojektoren%2FSa nyo-Z4-Preview%2FZ4Preview.htm) so you can see the text with all the great pictures.

Agreed, lets keep one Sanyo PLV-Z4 thread, one Panny AE900 thread, One Epson TW520/TW600 thread, one Hitachi PJTX200 thread, etc...
-Matt

great stuff... i find out about the z4 yesterday, and someone is already testing it today!!!!

i like the updated menus... looks like you can have a splash screen as well??

krlock2

http://grobi.tv/opencms/seiten/neuigkeiten/Inhalte/plvz4.html for a small film.

KUDOS...I think. I was hoping to see a 1080p solution, however. DLP 1080p rear projection sets are showing up in retailers now, so why the hold back? The wait continues, I guess. (1080p flat panels are selling now too.)

that's funny, whoever made the remote for the panny ae700 made this new one for the Z4

they're very clearly from the same mfg

as far as the new D5 panels are concerned, i'll believe it when i see it

billymac,
The Z4 will be using 720P D5 panels. Keep in mind that Epson has developed both 720P and 1080P D5 panels.

billymac,
The Z4 will be using 720P D5 panels. Keep in mind that Epson has developed both 720P and 1080P D5 panels.

i don't doubt that it has the new panels, but i'm skeptical of the boasted specs, hence, i'll believe it when i see it ;)

exhaust noise: 22 railways

That would be pretty loud wouldn't it ... :D

Anyone else think the projector looks very 1980s and square?

I wanted sleek like the Z3. :(

billymac,
I am also skeptical of Sanyo's specs. None of their HT projectors have ever come close to meeting their published CR spec. The PLV-60/70 at least had realistic lumen ratings, but the same cannot be said for the Z series of projectors.

Here is a video of the projector, highlighting the lens shift, and zoom


http://grobi.tv/opencms/system/galleries/download/downloads/grobi_tv_z4.wmv

If the Z4 has a contrast ratio of 5000:1, then what will be the contrast ratio of the PLV-80? Won't they have to match the Z4s performance?

IB

exhaust noise: 22 railways

That would be pretty loud wouldn't it ... :D


railways in themselves arent loud. perhaps unless they are still being built. otherwise it is the sound of the trains that move across them which normally provide the noise.

speaking of noise, what a speedy world we live in. first pics of z4 two days ago, first tests available yesterday, and first complaints that it won't reach published specs written today.

i really wonder sometimes.

krlock2

If the Z4 has a contrast ratio of 5000:1, then what will be the contrast ratio of the PLV-80? Won't they have to match the Z4s performance?

IB

The PLV-80 will have several times greater light output and significantly less on-off CR than the Z4. You can also expect the PLV-80 to have better optics resulting in a potentially sharper image with higher ANSI contrast. Power zoom, lens shift, and focus will also be included in the PLV-80.

I'm gettin excited! Anyone interested in a used 2HD? lol

I hoping that VB is eliminated and there is a definate improvement in contrast. I'm also hoping it will utilize the same mount as the previous two models. Also it sounds like the lens throw is simlair to the Panny. That would really be another plus for me. My 2HD sits over my head.

Can't wait to hear about its performance.

Z4 - 1000 lumens and 5K:1 CR- how is it an improvement on Sony's HS-51? If anything, I'd rather wait and see what Sony will come out with.

Although with Z4 specs like the above, Sony doesn't have to do much at all ):

Despite the specs, the HS51 has very low light output. If the Z4 can achieve similar CR at 2-3x Sony's light output, then that will be a significant benefit for many buyers.

Part 2 up.....4100:1 color corrected contrast ratio (with filter).

If my reading is correct, they said VB is still there on the D5 panel !!!
Maybe it is the time to switch to DLP.

Here is the exact quote, as translated by babelfish:

"Also with the newest D5-Generation remains vertical Banding a topic: The pilot lot equipment exhibited still another certain banding, which could be reduced however with Hiilfe of the VB menu to a very good measure."

I'm not going to get too upset about this until I see a more extensive review of a production model....in english.

Here is the exact quote, as translated by babelfish:

"Also with the newest D5-Generation remains vertical Banding a topic: The pilot lot equipment exhibited still another certain banding, which could be reduced however with Hiilfe of the VB menu to a very good measure."

I'm not going to get too upset about this until I see a more extensive review of a production model....in english.

I'm not too concerned about it. I can't see VB on my Z3 for the life of me.

Their review of the Z2 measured a contrast of 700:1

Their review of the Z3 measured a contrast of 900:1 in cinema mode.

Their review of the Z4 measured a contrast of 1100:1 in cinema mode with the adaptive iris turned off, 1600:1 with the iris turned on.

I don't know what special color filters are and how they achieved 4100:1 contrast, but it appears the D5 panels add about a 20% increase of the D4 and the rest is done with the adaptive iris 'trickery'.

By the way, the Sony HS51 measured an 1200:1 with the iris off
Infocus 4805 - 1800:1

Hey guys, I couldn't find part 2 anywhere. Can you point me in the right direction? I am very interested in the Z4 and have been waiting months for information on it.

Its added to part one... same article just longer now...

Hey guys, I couldn't find part 2 anywhere. Can you point me in the right direction? I am very interested in the Z4 and have been waiting months for information on it.
You can just use the link in post #4 above to get the translated version and it is all tacked together now. Just go about halfway down to see the new stuff (part 2).

--Darin

Hope the VB will go away with the production model, or else I have to borrow BlackRiderX's eyes.

:p :p :p


Here is the exact quote, as translated by babelfish:

"Also with the newest D5-Generation remains vertical Banding a topic: The pilot lot equipment exhibited still another certain banding, which could be reduced however with Hiilfe of the VB menu to a very good measure."

I'm not going to get too upset about this until I see a more extensive review of a production model....in english.

I am sorry but when I use that link it gives me an error message and says it cannot be translated. When I find the page using google the last third of the article is in German. So what does the page say? Can somebody link it again or paste the review into the forum?

can someone please post a babel fish translation of the second part of the review, as i dont know how to do that!!

krlock2

Part two in short

less screendoor but not a huge difference

color is good, you can tune secondaries

non tuned contrast with DI BIG let down 1800:1 . With tuning they claim 4300:1. We should remember they are in the tuning business.

I am sad to say they could see VB, less than D4 and there is a VB menu to tune it away.

Selectable overscan is a good feature

REMEMBER
Pre production unit!

I am most disappointed by the contrast with the auto iris engaged without tuning. That is why I have highe hopes for an Epson with a built in cinema filter.

Yeah, they specifically say VB is NOT solved with D5. Still no new PJ for me then, this is still the dealbreaker that stiops me from getting a new one (that and the high price of DLP :))

Neko

Their review of the Z2 measured a contrast of 700:1

Their review of the Z3 measured a contrast of 900:1 in cinema mode.

Their review of the Z4 measured a contrast of 1100:1 in cinema mode with the adaptive iris turned off, 1600:1 with the iris turned on.

I don't know what special color filters are and how they achieved 4100:1 contrast, but it appears the D5 panels add about a 20% increase of the D4 and the rest is done with the adaptive iris 'trickery'.

By the way, the Sony HS51 measured an 1200:1 with the iris off
Infocus 4805 - 1800:1

There are many factors that impact CR, with the LCD panel used being only one. At the panel level, Epson specifies a 50% increase in CR from 500:1 (D4) to 750:1 (D5). I am not sure how they got this figure given that projectors using these panels tend to have much higher contrast. BTW, there is an early report that the upcoming D5 Epson 600 has a 3000:1 CR with its DI turner off.

Maybe it's the translation but I understood it that the dynamic iris is deactived for the 1800:1 contrast reading. I think the picture mode is dynamic which deviates from the d6500k standard, probably much cooler compared to the 1100:1 cinema mode.

non tuned contrast with DI BIG let down 1800:1 . With tuning they claim 4300:1. We should remember they are in the tuning business.

Hope the VB will go away with the production model, or else I have to borrow BlackRiderX's eyes.

:p :p :p

You can have them. :D

In all honesty my eyes suck, but I have seen VB before and I havn't noticed it on my z3 yet.

The 1800:1 contrast is with DI switched off and most dynamic picture setting.
This is basically the real-world maximum contrast of the panels and optics.

This is just to see what the panels can deliver and does not relate to any real use case. With reference to other cine4home articles, the do this to see what the maximum contrast of the system is, so they know where to aim for when using filters to tune the color. This is obviously more complicated when switching the iris back on, but it does give an indication of how hard the iris has to work to get 4000:1 out of the system.


Liam

Yeah, they specifically say VB is NOT solved with D5. Still no new PJ for me then, this is still the dealbreaker that stiops me from getting a new one (that and the high price of DLP :))

Neko

I don't think the review makes that much emphasis - they say that the VB is reduced compared to the Z3, and that it can be tuned in menus. They also point out that this is a pre-production machine and so we should not read too much into it.
If it can be tuned away completely and stay that way for months, then I would say it is "solved". If not, then it still remains to be seen if "reduced" is good enough.

Besides, I think VB is like rainbows or dithering on DLP - some people don't notice it, others can see it but are not worried and others find it a major issue. All of these things have improved over time, but if you are particularly sensitive, then you may just have to live with the fact that it will never go away completely.


Liam

Liam,

The point is that the buzz around the D5 panel was that it was going to be inherently free from VB. Which is obviously not the case.

5000:1 (Specification)
4800:1 (Modes "Dynamik" and "Lebhaft") Color Temperature too high
1600:1 (Mode "Kino authentisch) can be increased to over 2000:1 after Optimization
1800:1 ((Mode "Dynamik") with auto iris deactivated
1100:1 (Mode "Pure Cinema) with auto iris deactivated

with color filters in order to correct the too high color temp. a contrast ration of 4100:1 can be achieved

Below is the translated link for the second part of the review. The interesting part is near the end.

Cliick on the review and it will be translated to English.

http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=de_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.cine4home.de%2findex.htm

According to this site, they are estimating the price of the z4 at 2290 Euros, which would be $2800!!

This sounds really high as I've read the ae900 will be $2399... I hope they are wrong...

http://www.heimkinomarkt.de/News_Einzelergebnis.asp?news_ID=1973

Think MSRP on this one. Street prices will be lower. Think HS51 minus a competitive discount...

"Still no new PJ for me then, this is still the dealbreaker that stiops me from getting a new one (that and the high price of DLP )"

Sony HS50 has no VB.

"The point is that the buzz around the D5 panel was that it was going to be inherently free from VB. Which is obviously not the case."

There was plenty of wishful thinking and hoping, but there was never anything definitive to indicate that would be the case.

IIRC the only info related to VB was a new scheme of pixel driving electronics, which *could* be related to VB if it worked on columns of pixels, but that was not stated, and it could just as well have been referring to the whole panel.

I have a Z3 that I use for back up, and it has a good 400 hours on it. Have yet to see any VB on this projector. I know the PANY 700, has this issue,to some degree, however wasn't aware the Z3 was plagued with this issue,( mine certainly isn't, so if the Z4 is even better, than I view that as positive news,not a negative one to dissuade a potential purchase.

CHEERS, T

Tom,

There's a lot of unit-to-unit variation of VB, so how much one pj has can't be generealized.

MRJAZZZ
With VB it can be an issue on a certain type of projector. A projector can get the rep of having terribel VB , but some and to some projectors and people it is not.

I have a Z2 and I have never been able to see VB on it. I plan to upgrade just to get improved CR, and hope that any VB is the same...invisible! I just hope the CR from Z2 is very noticable. What I am reading about Z4 is leading me away from more expensive DLP models (Optoma) I have been studying of late. LCD may be too close DLP to justify the higher costs. I hope there is a well done review ASAP.

from the translation:

"It was improved in almost all interests opposite its predecessor and/or again developed. Thus it offers a better Verabeitung, more Aufstellunsgkomfort and a clearer operation. Besides he works still more quietly than its predecessor, who was likewise already everything else as loud."

anyone know what Verabeitung and Aufstellunsgkomfort are?

To me nothing to be excited about - looks like Sanyo has not quite achieved with Z4 what Sony has had for a year with HS-51.

I think "Verabeitung" was misspelled and should have been "Verarbeitung" = workmanship (roughly).

I'm guessing that "Aufstellungskomfort" literally translates to "comfortable brightness", but I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean (my German is very rusty :eek: ). It could be translated to saying that the Z4 has better contrast.

Aufstellungskomfort refers to the broad lensshift, zoom and throw ranges the pj has. The Z4 is improved compared to the Z3 in this respect...

To me nothing to be excited about - looks like Sanyo has not quite achieved with Z4 what Sony has had for a year with HS-51.

There is obviously some truth in what you say, but here in the UK, the sanyos have come in cheaper, more available and the tiny problems that have happened have been sorted for me in days.

The Z series is evolution of a winning formula for a damn good price if not cutting edge.

I will be adding the Z4 to my list of ready to tweak projectors in october, and a good community of tweakers have survived the Z3. Onwards and upwards!

Liam, the text says:

"Auch bei der neuesten D5-Generation bleibt Vertical Banding ein Thema: Das Vorseriengerät wies noch eine gewisse Streifenbildung auf, die aber mit Hiilfe des VB-Menüs auf ein sehr gutes Maß reduziert werden konnte."

which means (I speak German pretty well, but feel free to correct): In the newest G5-generation Vertical banding is still an issue: the preproduction device still had some banding, that could however with the help of the VB Menu be reduced to a very good level."

That means: VB is still there, and as Grubert pointed out that was the big thing that was supposed to be fixed with G5. Very disappointing. Sure, a lot of people have PJs without VB, but there will be no guarantee just like with the G4 devices. If you happen to get one with VB and can't get it away fully, tough luck, no warranty, no return (at least where I live). While prices are fair, they're still way too high for me to take such a gamble.

Considering the announced prices though, I don't really see the big improvement that would make one choose the Z4 over the now much cheaper Z3. Or the Panny 700. Or the Hitachi tx100.

I do see VB, and it annoys the heck out of me. I still have an SVGA DLP, and will stick with it until that is solved or HD DLP comes down in price (not much chance of that, if LCD isn't offering more for less with this generation)

Noah, the Sony had a number of other flaws when I read tests about it, and added with the much higher price (at least over here, not sure of the difference in the USA) over the other PJs, I dropped it from my shortlist. Another disappointment. Seems we won't get a repeat of the impact of last generation of LCD PJs (Hidef at low cost) - no revolution this year, only evolution and not enough added value to convince me to part with my money.

The one big thing at IFA IMHO is the release of mini DLP PJs with LEDs instead of lamps. Hopefully that technology will rapidly develop and get applied to larger PJs. Stable light levels over a long lifetime and low cost. And for DLP they even eliminate the need for colorwheels.

Neko

to have no VB you need delta structured pixels. unless you do that, VB will ALWAYS be there

real contrast doubled from Z3/HITACHI 100/PANA AE700 which is good

one can buy the CINE4HOME tuned LCD projectors btw

I didn't say there were no improvements, just no real spectacular ones. We expected some serious issues to be fixed, they are not, and so the D5 generation is a bit disappointing. That's what you get when expectations have been created and are not fulfilled.

As for the Cine4home tuning version, this does not address VB, only perfect color, whitebalance, contrast, gamma etc settings. If the PJ you're having tuned has VB, there's nothing any tuning can change about that.

I asked when the Panny 700 was just out and offered at a shop in Aachen, and they sold the Cine4home version. They specifically stated VB is not under warranty, it is no reason for return.

YMMV, but for me VB is the issue that keeps me away from LCD. Give LCD superior contrast to DLP, and make it on all counts better than DLP, but leave in VB, and I still wouldn't buy LCD.

Neko

YMMV, but for me VB is the issue that keeps me away from LCD. Give LCD superior contrast to DLP, and make it on all counts better than DLP, but leave in VB, and I still wouldn't buy LCD.

Neko

Funny, but I feel the same way about single chip DLP. Make it better in every aspect than LCD, but if it keeps that stupid spinning colour wheel that gives me viewing discomfort, then forget it.

Liam, the text says:
which means (I speak German pretty well, but feel free to correct): In the newest G5-generation Vertical banding is still an issue: the preproduction device still had some banding, that could however with the help of the VB Menu be reduced to a very good level."
Neko

Neko,

I also speak fluent German, but I think the difference lies in the interpretation of what they are saying. You are emphasizing the the "VB is still somewhat visible" (wies noch eine gewisse Streifenbildung auf), where i would place more emphasis on "reduced to a very good level".

As I said previously, if it can be reduced to a level which is not noticeable and more importantly, stay that way, then it is solved.
If you have to tune it out every 30 minutes, or it cannot be tuned below a level which you find acceptable, then it is still an issue.
This remains to be seen.

The point is basically that every projection technology has it's problems, whether it be contrast and VB, or rainbows and dithering, or heat and convergence: we just have to live with them. To a certain extent, our own personal perception might make one technology or another totally unacceptable. Some people are hyper sensitive to rainbows, but with 5x color wheels, most people are happy. It is unlikely that TI will go to 7x or 9x just to make sure everyone is happy because it is diminishing returns.

I don't recall a lot of people complaining about VB on the Z3 (compared to the ae700 for instance), and the Z4 seems to be better, and tunable. So that is good. Only you can decide if that is good enough.

BTW I think I remember some people (very few) complaining about VB on the Sony HS50 too, even though virtually every body else says it's VB free. Some people are just sensitive to certain things.


Liam

Vertical Banding. If its still there in production, then that is aweful. Is this a problem with Epson LCD panels? Sony seems to be free of it? Is this not true? We'll wait and see how production units fair, but I was hoping to hear of Vertical Bandings demise. Here's hoping its less noticable overall in all the D5 projectors vs the previous models.

there is some vb on HS50 too. unless you have a delta arrangement of pixels, VB will always be there. it's even there on the Fujitsu 1080p that costs $25000 !

rainbows craziness is really academic now with 6-8 segments wheels, frankly. dithering also on 8segment wheels now.

lcd is good looking at twice the distance but even there if vb is barely noticeable, you have the color shading. dlp is also much sharper due to absence of misconvergence and 90% fill factor.

a 1024X576 dlp is sharper than a 1280x720 lcd.

I would tend to disagree with that. If the LCD has decent panel alignment and optics, then the 720P LCD will show more detail than the Matterhorn DLP.

"unless you have a delta arrangement of pixels, VB will always be there."

It might be less visible, for the same reason it gives subjectively less SD, but I don't see why it would actually be any less.

>>rainbows craziness is really academic now with 6-8 segments wheels, frankly. dithering also on 8segment wheels now.

I am happy you think so, but for those who have an issue with rainbows, they they are not gone, mereley "reduced". Just like VB us now "reduced".

I personally am not unduly bothered by rainbows, but I know someone who is, and it is NOT because they sit there shaking their head all the time.

Liam

a 1024X576 dlp is sharper than a 1280x720 lcd.

I dissagree with this as well. Having owned both, I feel 1280x720 lcd is sharper and less prone to show artifacts in the source material. For example, some poorly transferred dvds look horrible on my Matterhorn dlp due to the larger pixel structure than on my 720p lcd.

>>rainbows craziness is really academic now with 6-8 segments wheels, frankly. dithering also on 8segment wheels now.

I am happy you think so, but for those who have an issue with rainbows, they they are not gone, mereley "reduced". Just like VB us now "reduced".

I personally am not unduly bothered by rainbows, but I know someone who is, and it is NOT because they sit there shaking their head all the time.

Liam

I am one of those unfortunate ones ... I get splitting headaches from just a half hour of DLP viewing even though I cannot see the rainbows :(

Sanker,
I am the same. I get headaches from single chip DLP although I rarely see a rainbow. Having said that, I do believe that 720P single chip DLP projectors offer overall better picture quality than 720P D4 LCD projectors, albeit at a higher price point. For me, however, the spinning colour wheel makes single chip DLP an impossibility. Hopefully the D5 panel LCD projectors will mean that those of us who cannot live with single chip DLP will not be sacrificing any picture quality in order to have a relaxed viewing experience.

I didn't say there were no improvements, just no real spectacular ones. We expected some serious issues to be fixed, they are not, and so the D5 generation is a bit disappointing. That's what you get when expectations have been created and are not fulfilled.

Neko

Why not wait until you see the bloody D5 based pjs before saying they offer no real spectacular improvements or that problems werent fixed. :rolleyes:

rlindo,
Couldn't agree more. I don't know how many people have been complaining about VB with the D5 panel based solely upon a poorly translated preliminary review of a single D5 prototype projector. Talk about jumping to conclusions.

here here

Rlindo, I don't need to translate the article - I speak German fluently. And excuse me, but I have more confindence in Ekkehart's test, however preliminary, than wishfull thinking from those who neither read the full article nor have seen the PJ.

Scott, the hype around D5 was that these panels by themselves would solve VB. If the first PJ out there with D5 still has VB, that means the panels do not solve the issue, and VB is still a major problem to be taken into account with LCD. That alone will disappoint many who have been waiting with great anticipation for D5 technology.

Let's not help companies hype products, there's plenty of that around already.

Neko

Neko,
If the VB can be tweaked out using a menu option (BTW the Epson Cinema 500 had this option which I used to great effect with my Cinema 500), then that is all that matters.

rlindo,
Couldn't agree more. I don't know how many people have been complaining about VB with the D5 panel based solely upon a poorly translated preliminary review of a single D5 prototype projector. Talk about jumping to conclusions.
How are the results of a test of this panel ( prototype or not) jumping to conclusions? Sounds like first hand experiance to me.

If this is the panel that is supposed to get rid of VB and the reviewer (preliminary or not, German or not) sees VB than it seems pretty straight foward that people are "jumping" to the only logical conclusion.

Scott, as I mentioned in my other posts, tweaking is no solution. On most PJs you cannot tweak it out 100%, and if you're stuck with a PJ that has VB, it cannot be fixed and at least opver here you do not get any warranty.

Tweaking was already implemented on the D4 generation. Some got lucky others did not.

Again, it's this lottery that was supposed to get fixed. And it was supposed to be fixed by the panels, not by some patching done in the PJs menu.

What people expected was a PJ that had no VB tweaking in the menu because it was fixed out of the box.

Cine4home's Z4 after tweaking still had VB! Not very badly so, but it was still there.

I've seen a few Panasonics and an Epson, most had very little VB (but I still could see it and was bothered by it), and one had it really badly and no tuning could improve it. In all cases, no return warranty on VB issues. I don't have the money to play this kind of lottery. I want VB free PJs out of the box and a guarantee there will be no VB or I get my money back.

Such a guarantee is not given by any store, not on D4, and not on D5 considering the Cine4home test results.

Neko

Neko,
I don't disagree that VB is a distraction. My first Cinema 500 was exchanged due to VB. The second unit had less VB which I was able to significantly reduct with tweaking. Do I still notice it. Yes, I do because I know what to look for. Does it bother me. No, not really. I was hoping that this would be addressed with the D5 panels, and I am still hoping that it has. I think that you should hold off judgement on the D5 panels until production units are tested. BTW, Epson offers a swap out program which should cover VB issues. It is my understanding that the other manufacturers, i.e. Panasonic, Sanyo, Hitachi, do not.

I would also add to this discussion that the pre-production attributes still to be worked out would be outside of the LCD panels. Assembly, optics, firmware, power supply (I'm really pulling stuff of my you-know-what here). I wouldn't think that the LCD panels themselves would be pre-production panels coming from Epson. I would think that Epson reached production level status on the panes sometime ago.

So, if there is *some* VB it is inherent still in the LCD panels.

KramerTC,
I am sure that you are correct regarding the panels themselves. The manner in which the panels are addressed (voltage across the panels) may, however, be modified (I too am pulling stuff out of my you-know-what).

Neko,

"the hype around D5 was that these panels by themselves would solve VB. ...Let's not help companies hype products, there's plenty of that around already."

The companies never hyped or even mentioned that D5 would address VB.

Nor has anyone else; there have only been rumours, speculation, and wishful thinking.

Go ahead and keep complaining about your disappointment, but there's no justification for blaming anyone else, except posters here.

Epson offers a swap out program which should cover VB issues. It is my understanding that the other manufacturers, i.e. Panasonic, Sanyo, Hitachi, do not.

Unfortunately, no company here in Benelux offers such warranty, and AFAIK not in any of the other European states. I've been concentrating my attention on Germany because of low prices there, but also, no warranty on VB.

Dead pixels, yes, but even there you often have to be a bit pushy to get a unit exchanged.

Neko

VB....FPN....Thats why I stick with Sony. I've had three of em; the vw400Q, the vw10HT, and now the HS20. It's just a rock solid picture, and yes they are more expensive but well worth it imo.

Noah, if that is indeed the case it has gotten really out of hand because I didn't hear about it here first but in a HT magazine. If this is just a rumour instead of Epson press info, it's managed to spread out into the world really nicely. Not that Epson will mind...

Neko

VB....FPN....Thats why I stick with Sony. I've had three of em; the vw400Q, the vw10HT, and now the HS20. It's just a rock solid picture, and yes they are more expensive but well worth it imo.

worth it to you...but not to others who would rather not pay more and end up with a darker picture. it's all subjective.

>>Unfortunately, no company here in Benelux offers such warranty,

It is a few years ago now, but I bought a Sony VW10 here in Germany for a friend because it was significantly cheaper than in the UK.

I went to the shop and checked it out with a test DVD before paying for it - it was fine.

The VW10 was a lot more expensive than the current crop and you will probably have to pay somewhat more at a shop that an internet dealer, but you might find one that is prepared to let you check it ouy before you buy.
Worth a try at least.

Liam

Unfortunately, no company here in Benelux offers such warranty, and AFAIK not in any of the other European states. I've been concentrating my attention on Germany because of low prices there, but also, no warranty on VB.

Dead pixels, yes, but even there you often have to be a bit pushy to get a unit exchanged.

Neko

Epson Canada did and I presume still does. I cannot speak for other regions.

VB....FPN....Thats why I stick with Sony. I've had three of em; the vw400Q, the vw10HT, and now the HS20. It's just a rock solid picture, and yes they are more expensive but well worth it imo.

The HS20 that I tried in my HT did not have any VB or FPN which resulted in a smoother image than my Epson Cinema 500. The Cinema 500 badly outperformed the HS20 in other aspects. If it were not for the low light output of the HS51, I would have one of those right now. Hopefully the HS51 replacement will have significantly higher light output, but if not, then the upcoming Epson TW600 is looking pretty good.

Unfortunately, no company here in Benelux offers such warranty, and AFAIK not in any of the other European states. I've been concentrating my attention on Germany because of low prices there, but also, no warranty on VB.

Dead pixels, yes, but even there you often have to be a bit pushy to get a unit exchanged.

Neko

Not true - in Estonia i could exchange projector if it had bad VB.
And even more - in 14 days i can return almost any product back to shop for full refund if i didnt liked it :)

VB....FPN....Thats why I stick with Sony. I've had three of em; the vw400Q, the vw10HT, and now the HS20. It's just a rock solid picture, and yes they are more expensive but well worth it imo.

My 5 year old Sony VPL-W400Q is getting a little long in the tooth, but I didn't know what VB was until I read about it here. I don't have to tweak a menu or pull the plug every time I turn it off, I just don't have VB -- ever. I am baffled why Sony was able to solve this problem years ago, and some of the best minds in the business continue to flop around and come up with half fixes. Maybe I should offer to sell Epson my 400Q so they can study the secret technology in the Sony panels? (-8

Jeff

400Q has a delta pixel arrangement (there are no vertical columns of pixels) which would not make is susceptible to VB. But I do agree that Sony seems to have a better handle on VB with their LCD panels than Epson does.

I think we should wait until AV Fourm members and Projector Central test the Z4. Cine4home does post very good reviews buy as they said they tested a pre-production model. It is possible that the V4 does show VB but we should wait and see what the results of the production model bring. I have previously had a Z2 and I now own a AE700.
I had VB issues with both but they seem to have disappeared on My AE700 after 100 hours.

So the elimination of VB on the D5 panels was more wishful thinking by forum members? The fact that it is seen on the preproduction model means it was not eliminated by the D5 panel especially since they have a menu option to tweak VB. If it was really eliminated why would you need a menu option?

Does anyone know what design changes could have been made to the D5 panels to add a delta pixel arrangement ? Does this mean that the new 1080 D5 panels will have the same problem? I guess Epson thinks VB is not a serious issue and figures it won't effect sales.

Hey Mods,

Can we get a Sticky on this? I picked this because it is the "biggest" Z4 thread. Maybe it needs a name change, but if we could get it Stickied, we'd have all 4 new 720P LCD threads together at the top of the page.

Just a thought, G

Yep, meant to. Just forgot ;)

I have owned several sony pjs -- cpj series,vpl series,data series and not one ever showed vb. Sony has never had a problem with it maybe its their panels or maybe its something that is in the hardware that fixes it. But I agree if sony can make an 8 year old pj (cpj series) not have vb whats up with epson and their pjs??? jeff

Apparently you guys are not reading the other D5 panel threads. Specifically the Epson TW600 one. Frank456 is a projector technician in Canada. From his post #101 (RE: tests on D4 panels) in the “Epson TW600” thread, he observes:
Single panel 'full field' performance which we do to measure a panels total 'light spread' has never revealed a banding problem. Banding is a 'multi panel' issue as the 3 LCD components must work together to project the final picture element. Panel alignment from what I have seen in full production models is not great on massed produced projectors. Come on 'Japan' and get with the program. :D
I conclude that there is more to VB than just the panels themselves. The Z3 that I saw, had no VB. Both the AE500 and the AE700 that I saw had VB, the AE700 was much better, and the owner has reported that the VB has decreased with more hours on his PJ. I suspect that the amount of VB, that has been seen, has to do with pixel boundary uniformity in each panel, as well as, panel allignment in the PJ assembly.

Isn't that contradictory? Panel alignment nor panels themselves change with use.

Neko

Rlindo, I don't need to translate the article - I speak German fluently. And excuse me, but I have more confindence in Ekkehart's test, however preliminary, than wishfull thinking from those who neither read the full article nor have seen the PJ.

Scott, the hype around D5 was that these panels by themselves would solve VB. If the first PJ out there with D5 still has VB, that means the panels do not solve the issue, and VB is still a major problem to be taken into account with LCD. That alone will disappoint many who have been waiting with great anticipation for D5 technology.

Let's not help companies hype products, there's plenty of that around already.

Neko

For fug's sake, it is ONE TEST of a PRE PRODUCTION UNIT. Don't make conclusions based on that!!

For all you know Sanyo screwed something up and this SINGLE LONE Z4 had VB while EVERY OTHER D5 based pj from sanyo and other manus will be VB free

I have a question....if 234 thousand other reviewers say they viewed z4s and saw no VB will you change your tune? Naturally you won't because then you wont have something to harp about here.

Isn't that contradictory? Panel alignment nor panels themselves change with use.

Neko

do you even have an LCD based PJ?

I have the Epson 500 and it had minimal VB when I got it and now the VB is like basically gone. On the flip side I have had another LCD pj where the VB seemed to have become worse over time...so I think there is mroe ot VB than what mnay assume there is.

Please watch the tone.

Please watch the tone.

way to answer my questions...

@Rob: You did't ask questions, you simply spouted some insulting remarks.

If you wish to continue to ignore the test results from a reputable tester, highly respected in this forum, or simply do away with the result by assuming Sanyo has made an error, feel free.

The conclusion was simple logic: people thought VB would be fixed in the D5 panels themselves (whether this is just a rumour or info by Epson). VB shows up on a D5 PJ (preproduction maybe, but production panels, so if VB was fixed by the panels it wouldn't show up). In short: the VB issue is not fixed by the D5 panels. Maybe PJ manufacturers will be able to reduce it by menu settings, as they already di in D4 models, but we're still looking at the same situation as with D4 PJs.

The fact the Sanyo is a preproduction model does not change anything at all on the validity of this conclusion. We're still looking at a lottery to get a VB-free PJ.

Full production model test results on Panasonic, Epson, Hitachi and Sanyo will be out soon. Curious how you will react on the results...

Neko

Meanwhile, back to VB. Prior to buying my Z3 in April, I read every post on the Z3 and the AE700 I could find. VB was a big issue with many AE700 owners, and was a non-issue with all but a few Z3 owners. The one AE700 I viewed before deciding had distracting VB. I have never seen VB on my Z3 despite looking for it.

Now, I'm gonna quit reading this thread because the more you read about a particular image defect, the more likely you are to see it on your own PJ. ;-)

Ricketty

Ya, I went through TWO AE-700s, and both had annoying VB. Returned both, now I am TV-less and PJ-less. I wanted to like the Panny, as I loved my old Panny HDTV..

So based on MY experience, the AE-700 in terms of VB is pretty bad, even with all the flicker tweaking and hard power-off.

It should NOT be a lottery to be able to watch a clean screen. It is really bothersome to watch football with lines on the grass.

Other than that, the AE-700 is a fantasic PJ.

vb this, vb that....

i have the ae300 and have never noticed anything untoward. hope i nmver see it, people here treat it like the plague.

i do agree with rlindo that we should wait a bit and find out more when production models are available to be tested.

krlock2

I'm with you Rickety and Rlindo on this one, I have had a Z2 for over a year, it is supposed to be prone to VB, at least if you listen to biased comments. Has perfomed flawlessly right out of the box. Sure, there is always the chance you'll get a lemon, that is not unique to LCD projectors.

Best thing about this unit is price. Well we are not allowed to quote prices here but lets say its less than msrp in europe already and available to preorder.

"It should NOT be a lottery to be able to watch a clean screen. It is really bothersome to watch football with lines on the grass."

I could swear those lines are suppose to be there? :rolleyes:

With the eventual begining of HD-DVD or BLUE RAY, talking about a new PJ from SANYO being a 1080i max resolution sounds a little unevolved.
Why isn't a company involved in HD not presenting a 1080p capable PJ for use in future formats??
The launching of the Z4 doesn't prevail in my future interest of upgrading my PJ.

Ha ha Gearhead...not THOSE lines...

Did I read someplace that the Sanyo z4 will have 12 bit digital picture processing while most others have 10 bit? If so, what does that actually do for the picture, is it just a matter of more shades of the colors? Please enlighten.

Doe anyone know where there seems to be a big gap between EUR MSRPs and US MSRP with these new projectors? His this historically been the case? Is there any way to import these projectors while retaining the warranty?

Historically, yes, there has been a gap in the MSRP. Many people are importing them, however the warranty will often require you to send it back to the point of origin.

With the eventual begining of HD-DVD or BLUE RAY, talking about a new PJ from SANYO being a 1080i max resolution sounds a little unevolved.
Why isn't a company involved in HD not presenting a 1080p capable PJ for use in future formats??
The launching of the Z4 doesn't prevail in my future interest of upgrading my PJ.

If you are interested in 1080p in a front projector at this time you need to head over to the >$3500 forum. 1080p projectors are not <$3500 and I don't think they will be for at least a year or two.

Laters,
Jeff

http://www.akihabaranews.com/en/news_10200.html

7000:1 contrast.

Yummy.

Some z4 info:

http://www.tsnversand.de/pd52455567.htm?

Yeap, there seem to be quote a few Euro dealers taking pre-orders on the z4 for a very good price. Still waiting to see what the EUR/USD differential will be...

Sanyo has measured contrast on its first production units and upped their official contrast spec to 7000:1

Hm so in paper Z4 sounds good vs Z3. 12-bit vs 10-bit. 7000:1 vs 2000:1. 2x zoom vs 1.3x zoom. Automatic lens cover vs manual.

Hm so in paper Z4 sounds good vs Z3. 12-bit vs 10-bit. 7000:1 vs 2000:1. 2x zoom vs 1.3x zoom. Automatic lens cover vs manual.
I agree that all this does sound good. But now that the Z3 is dropping so much in price (half of its release price here in the UK), is it worth paying almost twice as much for the Z4 to get these features ?

I am still trying to find out what the differences will be between 12 bit adn10 bit digital picture. Could someone explain this parameter to me. Thanks.

12bit video processing can reproduce more colors than a 10bit... Actually, i don't know if you will see any difference...

Smoother coloration changes. YPrPb is a much more efficient way of encoding color data than 24-bit RGB. Essentially, having 8 bits for each component is similar to ~10 - 11 bits for each of red, green and blue. 12-bit processing gives you additional headroom to make a more accurate conversion. It would be an open question as to whether they carry that 12-bit processing to the panel level (4096 quantization levels for color vs. 1024 with 10-bit vs. 256 with 8 bit).

Later,
Bill

Ursa and Vidgar,

Thanks for the explanation. It sounds like it might take a very educated eye to decern the 12 from 10 bit color? Would you think this should really have much influence on overall picture and which PJ to purchase?

"My 5 year old Sony VPL-W400Q is getting a little long in the tooth, but I didn't know what VB was until I read about it here. I don't have to tweak a menu or pull the plug every time I turn it off, I just don't have VB -- ever. I am baffled why Sony was able to solve this problem years ago, and some of the best minds in the business continue to flop around and come up with half fixes. Maybe I should offer to sell Epson my 400Q so they can study the secret technology in the Sony panels? (-8"

And:

"400Q has a delta pixel arrangement (there are no vertical columns of pixels) which would not make is susceptible to VB. But I do agree that Sony seems to have a better handle on VB with their LCD panels than Epson does."

Jeff Beaver and Scott B:

FWIW, and speaking of "long in the tooth," I have a six-year old Vidikron Crystal One, which uses a delta grid at 480 X 480 (!). I've been prowling the forums here for a couple of years, hoping beyond hope that VB issues will be addressed in each successive generation (e.g. Panny 300-700, Epson Zs, etc., Hitachi TW-100) Unofrtunately for me, I'm in graduate school, and cannot afford the Sonys; unfortunately for the manufacturers above, I refuse to buy a product with even a risk of untweakable VB (I've seen it, and it bothers me worse than SDE and mediocre contrast, loss of low-level detail, etc. ). I almost pulled the trigger on the Panny 700...glad I didn't.

Looks like I'll be sticking with my venerable Vidikron for yet another season...until the "plungers" report back to the rest of us! Darnit!

[Cheers and respect to all early adopters, of course, as I have been in the past--the Vidikron, Technics DVD-A (the first DVD-A player), etc. Thanks for sharing with the rest of us...]

willdao

I have no VB in my Z3 so i have not used panel alignment menu at all :)

Can the Z4 do the necessary scaling to do a 2.35 constant height setup with an anamorphic lens like the H78DC3?

I believe there are some people that use the Z3 to perform the vertical stretch and then use Panamorph or Prismasonic to stretch it back out to 2.35 either vertically or horizontally, depending on the lens. My Z2 will only perform the stretch on 480p, but not 720p or 1080i material from my Panny S97S. I would assume the Z4 can, if the Z3 can :)

My concern re: 2.35:1 is the dust cover. Will the Z4 allow you enough room to get a Prismasonic in front.

Where did Projector Central get the 7000 to 1 contrast ratio spec? I cannot find any English language press release for this projector. The European gossip says 5000 to 1.

IB

Looks like the initial price differential between the z4 and z3 is about $720 here in the U.S. I hope there will be enough information out there to determine if its worth it!

Where did Projector Central get the 7000 to 1 contrast ratio spec? I cannot find any English language press release for this projector. The European gossip says 5000 to 1.

Propaply from japanese press release. 5000:1 some was pre-production model number earlier.

inky blacks:

I've read in other posts (or maybe it's earlier in this post!) that Sanyo itself recently has upped the on/off contrast spec. Whether that means tweaking it to boot (as opposed to merely hyping it more), I dunno, but I suspect so, as, e.g., Cine4home's review was a pre-production sample. I also read, as further support for the argument that twealing the DI can produce better on/off numbers, that Panasonic engineers were able to tweak the 900 for even better than currently spec'd contrast, but obviously at the expense of other important parameters, so they backed off a little. I think it was over on the big boy's board, someone's CEDIA experience posts.

Sorry I can't be more specific about either source...I've been jumping around all over the place for the past few days, and can't for the life of me figure out where I have and haven't been! :D

(I'm sure I'm not alone...exciting days ahead, in terms of performance AND prices!)

Maybe they had numbers posted on a dart board, drank some rice wine and let rip.

IB

I dunno I don't buy all of this pre-production stuff, why would sanyo let a sub-par unit out to a community where it would benefit hugely from the sudden increase in contrast ratio?

If someone gets an official US MSRP please let me know.

If someone gets an official US MSRP please let me know.

Ditto. I'm trying to be patient. I don't understand why they don't release the COMPLETE specs for these new PJs, especially MSRP... how hard is that?

Heh it seems sanyo wasnt at all at cedia. Hm still dont know if i should get Z4 or not.. But maybe i will wait for Rones calibration info etc ;)

Did ProjectorCentral update their Z4 spec page (http://www.projectorcentral.com/Sanyo-PLV-Z4.htm)? I don't recall seeing their spec list looking pretty complete. According to that page, the PJ is in shipping status, but MSRP is still unknown to them.

Edit: You can add the Z4 to one of the AVS sponsor's cart for the price.

Ok, that's very cool, we look to be getting a substantial increase in pj performance for no additional cost - now we just need someone to conduct, at the very least a panny, sanyo, epson head to head.

I have to say I the epson's lumens are going to keep me from ordering anything else until we see them compared.

I have been following the Z4 for a while now and the main feature that is swaying me right now is not the picture quality, as I'm certain that the Panny 900/Epson/Z4 will have relatively the same quality, but what concerns me is dust. My Panny ae500 was severely affected by dust and I attempted to take it apart, but noticed that there was some apparent "kill switch/service switch" that prevented me in tearing down the ae500 totally to get to the panels to blast them off. That crappy foam filter on the ae500 was useless and I had to clean it constantly. :mad:

Once I saw that the Z4 has two filters that appear to be HEPA-esque and then on top of that, they have made holes for easy access to blast off the panels, AND the thing has an automatic lens cover! It's like they were reading my mind! :eek:

I got an email from avi, which is excerpted below:

Hello,



Thank you for contacting xxxthe world’s leading projector supplier, for your projector needs. We have received preliminary pricing only for the Z4 and we expect to offer the new unit for around $xxxx The PLV-Z4 is expected to be available in early November with limited supply.



We encourage you to place a $50 deposit that is refundable at anytime to insure you’re unit will ship with the first delivery.


Here are the specs on the PLV-Z4.



[Key Feature]

1. High Contrast Optical System (7000:1)

2. Variable Twin IRIS system, Power Lens IRIS and Lamp IRIS

3. Wide range short zoom lens (100" at 9.8ft - 20.0ft / 1:2.0 zoom)

4. Automatic Slide Shutter and Illuminated Remote Control (All buttons)


Edited- Please read the forum rules. I understand you were trying to answer the question, but you were in fact quoting a dealer's street pricing. Thanks.

Projectorcentral updated their Z4 specs, MSRP is $2999

Well, looks like the Epson is going to be the bargain at $2500 MSRP then.

READ THE FORUM RULES

I emailed xxxx and they responded with the following information about PLV-Z4:

.....We are getting one of the first production units to arrive in the US. We have been told we will have it within two weeks. That might have been wishful thinking on Sanyo’s part however. Sometimes things get hung up in customs in the port of LA.....

wilimino, you can NOT discuss street prices in this forum! Please read the rules. There is a bargains forum here where you can post street prices if you pay to become an AVS Club Member. Please edit your post to EXCLUDE any steet pricing.
Don't mean to be a pain, just trying to help out a newb. BTW of course, WELCOME TO AVS!:)

Agreed, edit your post or madpoet will! Just looking out for you...
-Matt

Too late :D Thanks for the tip though! Looks like what we have seen in the past... the Sanyo streeting for slightly less than the Panny.

Once I saw that the Z4 has two filters that appear to be HEPA-esque and then on top of that, they have made holes for easy access to blast off the panels, AND the thing has an automatic lens cover! It's like they were reading my mind! :eek:

Blake I'm right with you. Even though I've had over two years minimal dust issues as compared to others here it seems. I still have taken the cover off twice for a blow with varying results. To know I don't have to take the cover off and to assume at this point the blow holes go right to the best spot for cleaning, this really is a real world feature for LCD's that should be considered. I have an interested buyer in my Z2 so now all I have to do is sit back and wait for some good reviews of this years crop, I may still hold off for 1080P or the "Fine" something or another feature that Epson should be coming out with. A nice kick in contrast would be nice though...

The Sanyo has 12 bit processing vs. 10 for the AE900. It also claims 7000:1 CR. If those two figures translate into a perceptible difference then it will be a great seller. They are continuing the Z3 trend that it sold for less than the AE900.

Yes, the Epson's MSRP is much less but it may only be available at MSRP. That's how the Mitsubishi previous projectors were as well.

No, you will be able to get the Epson for cheaper than MSRP....just have to find the right dealer

I am curious if the Z4 will up to its higher stated CR than the other models.

Will be exciting to see the Z4, AE900 and Epson 550 battle it out in that price range.

I wonder how quickly Sanyo's iris reacts? I remember hearing comments on the HS51 that the change in brightness (DI changing) was visible and could potentially be distracting.

So far Panasonic is the only manufacturer that I can recall which has publicly stated how fast their iris /gamma software changes... 60 times per second! I really love the new dust-proofing features of the Sanyo but if the Panny has a better iris implementation, I might have to go with that. They also seeem to be using the feature less agressively (which would make it less noticable?) as Darin said the Panny engineers were able to get higher than 5500:1 CR out of the AE900 but backed it off a bit for a more pleasing picture (brighter?).

We probably won't know anything conclusively until we can see them side by side...
-Matt

" I wonder how quickly Sanyo's iris reacts?"

Is it stated explicitly anywhere that this is a DI? A power iris may just mean remore controllable, as some pj's have had for quite some time.

Thanks

Man, I am so ready to plunk down a fiddy! My HT is well under way and s/b ready in another few months to hang a PJ. My Master Plan (mu-hahahaha!) calls for a HS51, but if I can get a Z4 for a few hunge cheaper AND get that coolio auto lense cover thingy.... Man, I am so ready to plunk down a fiddy!

- T

Sorry !!!!!!!!! I do not want to break any rules! The last time I posted something on this forum was in 2001. I Hope no one gets in trouble!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I’ll just read for now………



Wilimino

"I Hope no one gets in trouble!!!!"

Don't worry, only you will :)

Not sure if any of this info is new to you guys but I'll post it here for interest.

'Big Screen' in Germany had a visit from a Sanyo Rep to give them a first look at the Z4. They didn't get a chance to touch it themselves so they gave a genereal impression from the demo. I made a quick translation of their impressions

(I deleted the link because I realised it contains street price)

They made a remark that details are still hard to come by. Release date in Germany is 'beginning October'.

Their subjective comments were:

Sanyo paid a lot of attention to details, which will make the Z4 a lot of friends in the Home Cinema world
It is quieter than the Z3 (Z4 rated at 22dB)
First impressions of image are excellent.
Screendoor was noticeably less than Z3 with image quality similar to a 'decent' (whatever that means) DLP.
Hard to detect the 'normal' LCD image disadvantages.
Great that the Z3's cleaning function is re-used on the Z4.
Motorised lens cover (by power off) can also be triggered from remote control.
Improved zoom and lens shift over Z3

Can anyone comment on what controlling and tweaking s/b able to be performed via the "Service Port (RS-232)"?

I'm a bit surprise Sanyo opted to include a 25+ year old serial interface instead of an ethernet port. I'd really like my new PJ to send me an email whenever the bulb is starting to get long in the tooth or just needs some dust cleaned out. OK, maybe not too many home users are looking for that level of automation, but I would like to toggle settings (full-blown cinema mode, XBOX 360 mode, Superbowl Party Mode, etc) via Main Lobby and a GCD-100. IR control is nice, but it's not bidirectional.

- T

Tim, most custom control software still uses RS-232 ports and quite a lot of the top-of-the-line stuff still has them. It's pretty handy actually to have serial control.

After reading all of this, it looks like I am going to pull the trigger and pre-order a Z4 soon. :cool: :D I have been working extremely hard on my home theater the last two weeks and I just finished painting my future viewing wall a very nice flat charcol black color. :)

Any details of the lens shift. The z3 was I think 300% top to bottom. I'm guessing the z4 will be as flexible.

Madpoet,

Sure RS232 is still popular with the AMX and Crestron's of the world and it still works fine thanks to the minimal bandwidth required for control signals. But just as ISA gave way to PCI, I'd like to see RS232 give way to USB 2.0 and TCP/IP.

Those DB9 shells are just so... 1981. :rolleyes:

- T

BTW - I just plunked down my fiddy! I'll be sure to give a full report in November, assuming I figure out how to get 50+ sheets of 5/8's from the garage to the basement by then!

Madpoet,

Sure RS232 is still popular with the AMX and Crestron's of the world and it still works fine thanks to the minimal bandwidth required for control signals. But just as ISA gave way to PCI, I'd like to see RS232 give way to USB 2.0 and TCP/IP.

Those DB9 shells are just so... 1981. :rolleyes:

- T

BTW - I just plunked down my fiddy! I'll be sure to give a full report in November, assuming I figure out how to get 50+ sheets of 5/8's from the garage to the basement by then!


Score the drywall and fold it in half to carry down...re-open in the basement. Or do the same thing and slide it through the basement window.

:D :D :D I just pulled the trigger and pre-ordered a Z4 from one of the sponsers!! :cool: It's going to take forever for November to get here now!! :eek: :D :cool:

Can anyone comment on what controlling and tweaking s/b able to be performed via the "Service Port (RS-232)"?

I'm a bit surprise Sanyo opted to include a 25+ year old serial interface instead of an ethernet port. I'd really like my new PJ to send me an email whenever the bulb is starting to get long in the tooth or just needs some dust cleaned out. OK, maybe not too many home users are looking for that level of automation, but I would like to toggle settings (full-blown cinema mode, XBOX 360 mode, Superbowl Party Mode, etc) via Main Lobby and a GCD-100. IR control is nice, but it's not bidirectional.

- T
Good to know you never have any networking issues... ever.

;)

Really, TCP/IP is a great technology, but it is a far cry from the bullet-proof reliability that a properly designed serial interface offers. Serial is how many universal remotes are uploaded, it is included standard on almost all plasmas of the 50"+ variety... The codes to use it are often very simple and writing custom applications don't require Microsoft Certification. Heck, many people with some regular Windows skills could probably figure out how to get some commands to work using Hyper-Terminal with a few hours of research on their own.

More importantly, because it is so reliable it is a good way to update firmware. Yes, they may release some service codes and programs so techs can go in and confirm hours and settings and adjust color, brightness, etc. through the port as well, but mostly, it is about being able to easily field upgrade the internal software. In a year, your new projector can be just as up-to-date as the ones coming out of stores the same day.

Crestron & AMX control is just a bonus.

Any idea on if the lens shift on the z4 is the same as it was on the z3? I think it was a full screen height above and below.

I hope this isn't a stupid question but does anyone know if a Panamorph lens will fit on a Z3 / Z4? I'm really leaning towards 2.35:1! :cool: Two days until the sale is up on the lens... :(

Did Sanyo up its replacement lamp warranty by any chance, from the miserable 30 days they have on Z1, Z2 and Z3 lamps ?

IMO, *that* would be a real breakthrough .

Depending on which Panamorph you mean, yes. The P752 fits fine.

Does anyone happen to know how air flows through the Z4? It looks like the filter is on the back, but I'm not sure where the exhaust is. I want to make sure there are no venting issues associated with the ceiling mount. I'm leaning towards the Draper Universal ceiling mount - does anyone use this now and would they recommend it?

Since my ceiling doesn't have drywall yet (thx for the tip Scotty144!) I'd like to get a mount now so I can easily deal with any potential installation issues.

- T

Did Sanyo up its replacement lamp warranty by any chance, from the miserable 30 days they have on Z1, Z2 and Z3 lamps ?
Lamp was 90 days for my z2.

Any idea on if the lens shift on the z4 is the same as it was on the z3? I think it was a full screen height above and below.

Yes, I believe its 3x vertical shift, same as z2 + z3.

Does anyone happen to know how air flows through the Z4?

Courtesy of mpjohnst in This Post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6112945&&#post6112945) is the translated link for Cine4home (http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=de_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2Ftests%2Fprojektoren%2FSa nyo-Z4-Preview%2FZ4Preview.htm)

You can see the exhaust is on the right, intake is on the rear as you mentioned.

Lamp was 90 days for my z2.

That only goes for the original lamp that came with the projector. All replacement lamps only have 30 days. My post was about replacement lamp warranty.

Depending on which Panamorph you mean, yes. The P752 fits fine.
Yeah I was refering to the P752. :) I know I need to do more reading on the subject, but does anyone know if this would be a good route to go with achieving 2.35:1 with a Z4? If so, I might have to jump on this deal soon. :confused:

In a year, your new projector can be just as up-to-date as the ones coming out of stores the same day.

Crestron & AMX control is just a bonus.

It won't be long before the TVs can connect thr' internet and update the firmware ...

Yeah I was refering to the P752. :) I know I need to do more reading on the subject, but does anyone know if this would be a good route to go with achieving 2.35:1 with a Z4? If so, I might have to jump on this deal soon. :confused:


Yes and no. Do you want to do constant height? You will need some sort of scaler in the chain for anything over a 480i image. The projector's stretch modes will not affect 720 or 1080 signals (assuming it is the same as the Z3).

For you international buyers.....Z4 and Tw600 have appeared in europe (germany) and there are a couple of shops who already have it in stock and sell it.

I live in italy, but maybe someone from germany or some us buyer will buy one (then a review will be gretly appreciated ;) ).

Edited- Leave the pricing out.

So if I understand correctly the Z4's lens shift will actually allow me to ceiling mount the projector with the lens 12" above the top of the screen? I was reading about the Panny 900 and it's lens shift will aparently only allow you to mount the lens a few inches above the top of the screen. I would love to be able to just mount the projector on my current 4805 setup without having to change anything. The 4805's fixed offset actually worked pretty well for my ceiling mount situation.

So if I understand correctly the Z4's lens shift will actually allow me to ceiling mount the projector with the lens 12" above the top of the screen? I was reading about the Panny 900 and it's lens shift will aparently only allow you to mount the lens a few inches above the top of the screen. I would love to be able to just mount the projector on my current 4805 setup without having to change anything. The 4805's fixed offset actually worked pretty well for my ceiling mount situation.

The answer for Z3 would be yes. When the specs for the Z4 lens shift are published, we will know.

Don

Sorry for posting the price :( .........just read the rules,
it won't happen anymore!

The answer for Z3 would be yes. When the specs for the Z4 lens shift are published, we will know.

Don
Confirmed. They refer to it as 1 image height up/1 image down- same as z3 and z2.
http://www.sanyo.de/produkte_daten/projektoren/datasheet/SANYO_PLV_Z4_ENG.pdf

Confirmed. They refer to it as 1 image height up/1 image down- same as z3 and z2.
http://www.sanyo.de/produkte_daten/projektoren/datasheet/SANYO_PLV_Z4_ENG.pdf
The specs don't mention the minimum vertical frequency. Here's hoping it can accept 48Hz!

Yes and no. Do you want to do constant height? You will need some sort of scaler in the chain for anything over a 480i image. The projector's stretch modes will not affect 720 or 1080 signals (assuming it is the same as the Z3).
Yes, I'll probably be investing in a Samsung HD850 upscaling DVD player. :)

Which is fine, but only handles your DVD sources. Plan on watching HD? You need a scaler for that too...

Which is fine, but only handles your DVD sources. Plan on watching HD? You need a scaler for that too...

Scaler for HD, but why? On any of the new 5 panesl LCD projectors, HD should look just terrific. SD sources aren't going to see much improvement either, no?

Why waste the money?
:confused:

He wants to use a Constant Height Screen (2.35:1) with a Panamorph lens. You have to have aspect ratio control over every source you feed it or you will have distorted pictures. You need to stretch the 2.35:1 material vertically so that the lens recompresses it back to the correct AR and squeeze the 16x9 material so that the vertical compression the lens provides is compensated for.

and a scaler will do a far better job than the PJ or the dvd player at scaling, deinterlacing etc etc. with the right bit of kit it can have quite an impact with picture quality. I didnt think a scaler would be usefull, but after a good demo its now on my to get list.

Posted on AVForum too....reply here to let you know:

I've found on french site these small review of sanyo z4 against AE900 and MT400, to my knowledge the second one after the cine4home review....

Translation (by human) is welcome to understand whole meaning.....using online translation I did not understand some sentences.......a translated post here is really appreciated

http://www.hifissimo.com/store/loadpage.cgi?user_id=6871&file=text/Banc-d-essai-Panasonic-PTAE900-Sanyo-PLVZ4.html

http://www.hifissimo.com/store/loadpage.cgi?user_id=6871&file=text/Banc-d-essai-Toshiba-MT400-Sanyo-PLVZ4.html

Sanyo seems to have a winner proj in his hand, and seems easy to agree with conclusion of the AE900 vs Z4 article.....panasonic proj is good, but they would have improved much better from the AE700 if they released a whole new product including D5 panel (as Sanyo did.....)

anyway......hope to read some serious shootout soon!

It would be great to see a shootout of the two projectors with only the person doing the switching knowing which projector is which.

Sanyo seems to have a winner proj in his hand, and seems easy to agree with conclusion of the AE900 vs Z4 article.....panasonic proj is good, but they would have improved much better from the AE700 if they released a whole new product including D5 panel (as Sanyo did.....)

anyway......hope to read some serious shootout soon!


??? what is the new guy smoking? Though he does seem to be referring to the french article - they've clearly proven themselver reliable as usual :rolleyes:

The AE900 is a "brand new" D5 device, new lightpath and everything. Anyone who gets such a fundamental fact wrong cannot be trusted to make any other factual statements about the pjs discussed here.

Hey jsm88 perhaps you need some rest......

I was just reporting what's in the french article....and FYI I read the same comment on Panny improvement (not talking about Z4 here!) in some a/v italian website I cannot find now....

.....ANYWAY I'm not bashing Panasonic, and said clearly I'm waiting some SERIOUS shootout (maybe you missed it....bold now it's clearer?).

PS Re-reading what I've written on the last post maybe this is a complete misunderstanding. I was NOT saying AE900 does not have D5 panel (it's ages EVERYONE HERE knows it).....I was saying only that a whole new design product (from scratch!) by panasonic could have been better and gained more from the usage of the D5 panel.........if this was problem, hope now it's clear what I meant (anyway......english it's not my motherlanguage and speaking about proj is not that easy......)

Hi, fantasyl,

Welcome to the forums!

Perhaps I can elaborate a little on JSM88's post (without putting words in his mouth :D )...

The Panny 900 IS a totally new device. The only thing it shares with its predecessor, the 700, is a superficial resemblance--which will help consumers somewhat familiar with it, to identify it. This kind of "corporate look" is imortant for branding and consumer awareness. If you know, for example, Porshche 911s (which, of course, have looked somewhat similar for four decades!), then think of it as the model change from the 993 to the 996: superficial resemblance, totally reingineered under the shell.

Mounting points for light blocks, wiring harnesses, etc, may have been kept (along with overall dimensions), for such affords economic efficiencies. However, everything else (whole light path, including the new D5 LCD chips, etc.), lens shift, etc. has been re-engineered. I believe they've even reduced the noise level--so even the fan may have changed (e.g. larger and with lower revs to move the same air mass=quieter). Hope this helps!

willdao

Here is the original french article comparing the AE900 and Z4 translated. Following that is a comparison between the Z4 and Toshiba MT400.


My test of Panasonic PTAE900, and comparison with Sanyo PLVZ4.
Here is still a queen of silence! Sony HS50 which had opened the way was copied with much talent. It is almost total silence. The joystick to move the objective, and thus the image, in all the directions is the same one as on the PTAE700, and it makes always as toy as front. Fortunately that a serrated roller of tightening makes it possible to
block it. It is not in all cases more of the lens shift, with such a displacement, it is adjustment of objective! Ca makes me think of the rear view mirror on my car. Miss more than they do it electric.
The menu is of a great simplicity, and I adjusted the projector crushes hair in a few minutes, what leaves think that large majority of the users who do not dare too
much to play with the adjustments will have a beautiful image even if
they do not touch with nothing. I know well that for certain amateurs, this detail is rather secondary, because they will seek to obtain an optimum adjustment, maybe with a DVD of adjustment like Video DIGITAL Essential, that is to say straightforwardly with a professional calibration, but for all the others, and it is the great majority, I can ensure you that you can plunge without fear to have to put the
hands in dirty oil.
Gladiator Zone 2, on Denon DVD3910 in HDMi connection by means of a cable Oehlbach 2411.
The image made 2.30m, I sat with 4m screen 16/9 E, and Denon is in 720p, obviously!
Chapter 2, the war.
I see defects that Sanyo PLVZ4 nor Toshiba MT400 does not have, other innovations of this re-entry. In particular, halations like gray shades around the forms and objects, a well-known defect on the vidéoprojecteurs 4/5 years ago.
It is very visible on the contour of the trees against the sky. The tree trunks are duplicated of a feature and a shade of two
centimetres each with dimensions.
It is rather enormous, and yet my adjustment of sharpness, adjusted with a test card, is at least. I carried out several tests to try to reduce it, without success. This, however, and they is happy, does not destroy either the impression of details, because the objects of small size do not show this defect, and if the bottom is not very contrasted color, one sees nothing either. The detail of the images thus, is excellent, and I am agreeably surprised by the luminous details especially: they have much glare, and that made a beautiful image.
Sky, on these difficult scenes of chapter 2, swarm a little.
A little more than the PLVZ4. It is not the sorrow to seek the least grid, nothing is seen! I approached to see it, and while moving back slowly, with 2m of the image (2.30m broad), and I do not see it virtually more.
In chapter 6,
I looked at this scene much on the PLVZ4, diving in the half-light, lit slightly by the light filtered through the window, and César which crosses the part of right-hand side on the left
behind statutes and stops in front of a large bust. There, piqué is remarkable, can be even better than on the PLVZ4 (I say can be, because my PLVZ4, a model of pre series, has just fallen out of carafe!)... In spite of the effect of halation, of unfolding of the images, although the blacks are stopped a little, less detailed than on the PLVZ4, the effect 3d, depth, the detail, the smoothness, make a very beautiful image. In fact, the effect of unfolding, of shade if you prefer, is visible only if the objects are against a bottom of very different
color. On this scene, it is not the case, thus one does not see this defect there. There or it is the worst, it is for a clear object on a very dark bottom, like a face approximately plane and a dark maroon bottom behind plane.
On the traveling which goes from the cage to the slaves towards the
village, a scene that I use systematically to test the fluidity of the
projector, the result is excellent. Comparable so that I know best, quite simply. And comparable with the PLVZ4.
Piqué of image is remarkable, but can be a little hard. When the gladiators aligned against a wall receive a white powder jet
(talc?) on their bodies, the jet is so detailed that a powdery cloud is not seen, but of the tiny particles, for example.
The color is excellent, a hair cold can be, compared to Sanyo, but I do not draw any from conclusion because a thorough adjustment
(which I does not make on a model of pre series that one entrusts a
few hours to me), will undoubtedly allow to modify.
And BV now? (BV, for vertical bands, are the defect of process LCD, and when one leaves a PLVZ4 his box, and that no adjustment is made, the image is truffée by it. The BV are vertical gray traces which do not move, whatever the image). And many BV there is. They are extremely weak, they are extremely regular, and they do not make as dirtinesses at certain places of the image -
in all cases not on the specimen which I have in test - but they are
there. And not of adjustment in sight.
Piqué and the detail of the plane backs are very beautiful, what makes an exceptional depth of field, higher than that of the PLVZ4, and approaching those of a projector DLP.
With my test cards, I could locate these BV. They are seen on the greens, on blue lights and the yellow. One sees nothing on the white, and it is probably for that which they are if not very awkward with a
film, nor on the reds.
There are not either shades of lights on not dimensioned and the
corners of the image, as often on projectors LCD, and as on the PLVZ4 of my test. The light is very regular, the uniform color,
it is very right if one distinguishes a light loss of intensity on a
zone of 20 cm each with dimensions of the screen, on all the high one.
To return with my BV, they make like a subtle chalk-lining against certain images, and not on the white zones. On gray funds, it is there that they appear a little, but not like dirty traces on the screen. While looking at again with test cards, I realize indeed that on degrade of gray, they are invisible on the white, and they appear on the gray rectangles, whatever their intensity, except the very dark ones.
With more and less compared to the PLVZ4, my general impression leans towards this last for the following
reasons.
* more cordial colors,
* piqué without shades duplicating the forms located on a bottom of
color contrasted,
* total absence of BV.
I preferred, on the other hand, on the PTAE900, the total absence of zones faded in the angles (although I did not
succeed in seeing these discolourations, present on the test cards of the PLVZ4, by looking at films), piqué of the images, but especially the effect 3d, depth of field.
I liked his swarming less, but it is compared to the PLVZ4 only. In the absolute, it did not obstruct me a whole, because it is present only in the very difficult moments. I think of receiving another specimen of PLVZ4 which will enable me to
push a little more the tests, and thus to validate or not these first impressions.
Panasonic PTAE900/ Sanyo PLVZ4, second round.
Conscious that the background noise of a store of Hifi is not
especially favourable with total silence, and that the noise of a projector is a really important data for a
user who will have the machine with less than one meter of his ears, I benefitted from closing between midday and two to extinguish all the
apparatuses, and to really listen to the noise of the ventilators.
Panasonic:
not, it is not Sony HS50, as opposed to what I said earlier, and in complete silence, I hear the ventilo clearly. Who looks at a film in total silence? Let us say that in silence, it is heard, without it being awkward, and that if a film is put, one understands nothing any more the whole.
Sanyo:
Idem that Panasonic, but in acuter and a little more extremely. You will note that Sanyo is given for 22dB and that Panasonic posts
26dB. Somebody cheating, because they is false. Panasonic is quieter than Sanyo. Not much, but a little, and the noise of Sanyo is acuter. With dimensioned, Sony HS50 posts 24dB, and it is really quiet. I am not far from thinking that everyone cheating! It is nice!
The technicians will explain me. Here facts.
The PLVZ4 had broken down at the time of my preceding test (it is a
model pre series, whereas Panasonic is a final version), and it is the same one as one brings to me today. And well it took me 3 minutes to correctly calibrate it (with DVE, not with Colorfacts hein!), while the first time, you remember it, I fought during 2 hours... me that exceeds me, it is not my level. In short, it is regulated. I check that Panasonic was not put out of order, and rolls... turn over to see Gladiator!
Chapter 2.
It is necessary to keep in mind which the PLVZ4 which I test does not
have its final firmware, and that the ratio of contrast of my specimen is blocked to 5000:1. The final version pushes to 7000... what will follow is thus with
reading in the light of this remark.
PTAE900:
beautiful image, not only one BV, no the grid. "phantom" unfolding around the objects, on the other hand, jump me to the eyes as of the first image, whereas I did not seek it, it should be specified. On the scenes with a gray sky, the BV arise a little. There is nothing the whole, absolutely nothing, with Sanyo. Idem for swarming: in the difficult scenes, there is a little on Sanyo, and a little more on Panasonic, but hardly more.
The image has more light with Sanyo, while the colors seem rather close with the?il, and rather beautiful, of the two with dimensions ones. There is much more promptness on the image of Sanyo than on that of
Panasonic, and although the two machines saturate some very enlightened details
like the flames, the fume which is released from the pot cooking on fire, in bottom on the left of the image, at the beginning of the following chapter, have much more light and of matter on Sanyo that on Panasonic. Smoke blanchâtre is detached much better on the black bottom. You will say to me, a smoke, it is not a film, and it is not because it is less true on Panasonic than on Sanyo, that the film is wasted, and you will be right. It is all the difficulty of the tests in fact. Because without comparative, the image produced by Panasonic, in basic 2.30m, with a install its of quality, it is large spectacle, and worse, with a beautiful film, I would be astonished that you are able to think of the small details! Yes but here, beyond that, the idea to invest in a beautiful product forms also part of the
pleasure, and it is with this pleasure there that my test refers. In this case, the difference between the two images is unambiguous, without nuance. The difference is really important.
By tearing off me eyes in chapter 6, to seek differences in piqué of image, on the large plans, plane backs, I did not find anything. Null match. On the other hand, there still, Sanyo is much more luminous and makes an image sharper than Panasonic. Both, once again, the colors saturate with the flames of the candles. As opposed to what I said the first time, and while looking at several times the scene or César the part of
right-hand side crosses on the left behind the line of statues to stop
with the bust, the depth of field is more important on Sanyo than on Panasonic, because of this addition of light, who does not destroy the blacks. On the other hand, I lengthily looked at the dust whirling and lit by the light filtering
of the window on the left. Can be board I considering a little solarization with Panasonic, can be not...!
The second scene of chapter 8 occurs in the greyness and the fog. It is hard for the video noise, swarming, and BV. Sanyo, well. Breaded... about as well, but on the other hand, there still, what a difference of luminosity and glare of the small details between
the two!
This is immediately confirmed with the following scene, that or of the bones strew the ground in the foreground in the forest. There, Sanyo posts a superiority really crushing which carries my conviction
that these two machines are not at all of the same class. All the colors come out with much more detail and from life that on
Panasonic.
I said much last year that Panasonic PTAE700 and Sanyo PLVZ3 were two
excellent machines which made very beautiful images, with dimensioned, I do not forget it, of Hitachi PJTX100. Moreover I had fun some, because it is not frequent to see 3 machines of similar quality at
nearby prices, who are held in a handkerchief of pocket. That puts to me more at ease for affirms that it is not any more the
case. Sanyo made an ahead important jump, compared to Panasonic and compared to the PLVZ3 (I did not have a
PTAE700 to go at the bottom of this question). I wondered how that could be possible, and I wonder whether a part of the answer (or the answer entirely), does not come owing to the fact that Panasonic, like Hitachi, made of the nine with old man, by installing new matrix LCD of Epson, while Sanyo, and well it is apparently a very new projector. If my track is right, and technical projections being rather fast, the development of the PLVZ4 is thus the fact of a more recent
research, what, in other words, the place as a projector with a generation moreover than Panasonic...
I do not hide you that I will dig this track, because my curiosity is poked.
The continuation? The test of Hitachi PJTX200, the third small drainage canal of the brilliance trio of projectors
LCD to less than 2000€
Jean Patrick Grumberg,


I tested Sanyo PLVZ4 and Toshiba MT400.
The chance of the calendar and the exits of products posed between my
hands, at the same time, two machines which do not aim the same public ones. Of dimensioned, a projector DLP from Toshiba, and other, an apparatus made for those which see arcs in sky when they look at a
film coming from projectors DLP, Sanyo PLVZ4.
I had to beat to me during 2 hours and half against my nonfinal
specimen of the PLVZ4 to start to have an image which resembles
something, include time to disencumber me of the BV: won bet, I consider being arrived at 95% of the zero BV... and I think of being able to still better do! For those which are unaware of it, BV, or vertical bands, make like traces of dirtiness vertical (and very light) on the screen. They are independent of the images of film, and they are one of the defects of technology LCD, with the effect of grid, who are the grids of the matrix, the blacks which are not deeply black but gray dark, and light halations of colors on dimensioned or angles. Ca does much defect for the LCD will say to me, and I will answer you that you are right! Of another dimensioned, the DLP has other defects, with the result that none technologies is perfect, and that that benefits all the manufacturers: one buys as much a projector for his qualities as for the discretion
of the defects as I come to quote!
The PLVZ4 succeeds the PLVZ3, who one of the apparatuses was the most sold in France, with with dimensions of Panasonic PTAE700 and Hitachi PJTX100, so much so that the PLVZ3 continues its life and is not stopped. The amateur of the beautiful Sanyo quality thus finds himself with not
an apparatus in top of the Sanyo range, but two, which are found to 500€ of variation: 1500€ for the PLVZ3 and 2000€ for Z4 (they are the suggested prices, not inevitably prices charged).
Consequence of the continuation of this model, that I find completely justified considering his qualities and
considering it is not exceeded at all, my test of Z4 will have to answer two questions not envisaged with my
program: the difference in price justifies it to offer the PLVZ4 compared to
excellent Z3, and must one resell his Z3 to buy Z4?

Adjustments of the panels to get rid of these dirty BV. It seems to to me, holidays having erased my poor memory, that the menu of adjustment of the panels is the same one as on Yamaha
LPX510, or was the this PLVZ3? In all cases, it is very pleasant to use, very easy and very intuitive, and the result immediately is seen. I remember that the last time that I used this menu, the result was very frustrating: they was perfect on the test cards... and dreadful on film! And when I wanted to directly regulate the image on film, and well not, it was impossible, the menu is thus made that it cuts the source and passes in internal
test cards mode.
I had deduced from it that the video circuits by which the image of a
reader DVD passes are not taken into account in the adjustment of the
BV with test cards, and that the adjustment reached its limits there, visible. In fact, with this PLVZ4 and its new Epson matrix, I realize that my assumption was false. The menu of adjustment is the same one, but it is not any more the same history. One is in the WYSIWYG! When the test cards are disencumbered of BV, the image is also, or virtually too. On the ciels, there or it is the worst, and well I did not have the least embarrassment 4 away m with an image
of 2.20 m. And believe me, I am a maniac of the detail and BV!
Thus BV: won bet! What is not a small matter, because only Sony HS50 was, hitherto, free. It is certainly not the absolute perfection, and one can see, at rare moments, and on a few centimetres length, a breath of gray trail, but not more.
As I fixed myself like objective to compare Z4 with Z3, I delivered myself to the same work on this last, with the same one finely, and I could almost note the difference at once. Also I confirm with force, the reduction of the BV is better on Z4, even on the test cards of adjustment. Indeed, one especially sees it on the green and a little less on the red, when the alignment of the panels is finished. With Z3, there remain always gray traces, small bands on the rectangles of the test cards, whereas on Z4 there is no more only of smooth surfaces, free from any shade sinks. Knowing that the BV are worse on films than on the test card, I let to you imagine my joy!
On the other hand, shading, there is always. The shading, it is as an aureole of often rosacée or green different color, whether one distinguishes slightly on the edges or in the angles, when one looks at a test card clear gray, or a completely snow-covered scene. There, one cannot not see this zone rosacée on 50 cm on the right of the
image. On a film, it is largely less visible, and I point out it to you, one finds some alas on all projectors LCD...
Let us pass to the adjustments before test.
It should be said to you that between the optical iris and the iris of
the lamp, I fought well during two hours to make him leave a beautiful black and
a beautiful white, so that contrast is with the height of its promises and that the white
are not flarings. Frankly, I never saw projector such a difficult to regulate, and I want to believe that it is because it is a version pre series
with the software not yet final. Knowing the good quality of the PLVZ3, and knowledge to make of Sanyo, I am not done too much of concern, if I were in your place. After two hours rather hard, I arrived at something of rather beautiful, even if I am not completely satisfied. I obtained a beautiful depth of field and a remarkable detail. There or I stopped, there is still light to better gain with dimensions colorimetry and
depth of the blacks.
On paper, the projector is less noisy than Z3. In reality, there is no difference.
On paper, contrast is higher than Z3. In reality, the difference is weak, but it exists.
On paper, there is a double iris, in reality, there is no effect of pumping which comes to obstruct this choice.
On paper, the power passed from 800 to 1000 ansi lumens. I did not distinguish from differences, but I must recognize that I did not focus myself too much on top. It is like the colors. In 12 bit, one posts 64 billion colors. I all did not hope them to check if the card says true or not, please excuse me.
Let us pass to the tests and the comparison with Z3.
Denon DVD3910 in 720p and HDMi connection entrusted to a Oehlbach
cable. A PLVZ3 is on standby on the other digital display, and allows me to pass from one apparatus to the other almost to the flight.
Gladiator Zone 2. Chapter 2 the battle.
PLVZ4
No swarming in the sky, nor of solarization because of the clouds. The details are well returned, including in the plane backs, even if piqué is not as impressive as on a projector DLP having the
same resolution. The image is soft, fluid, there are no harmful jerks with the image. Z4 delivers a very beautiful image.
PLVZ3
Good moments ago in a test and I hold one of them. Often, the author of these lines must twist the eyes and the ears, and to reconsider twenty times the same beaches for finally detecting
differences. Imagine visual or auditive tiredness... There, a beautiful surprise awaits me the first second film. While I am seeking hypothetical swarmings in the blue gray ciels, one of my fixings, and one of the reasons which left me on the hunger since so a long
time with the projectors, my?il is immediately stopped by a phenomenon which I had completely
zappé of my tests, the grid of Z3. Completely invisible on Z4, the grid is well there, who comes a little to disturb the detail on the faces and in the sky.
This dimensioned, Z4 took a great step ahead, because one absolutely sees no trace which lets think that an
unspecified not lit zone can exist between the pixels. With the limit, after having seen the images of Z4, that would obstruct me almost more than the BV! It should be said that the disappearance of a defect, by comparisons from one machine to another, does not produce the same psychological effect as the examination of
an apparatus alone, without any reference mark other than the memory, and that also explains why many amateurs are very happy with systems
of bad quality, until the day or they discover another thing.
Enormous advantage for Z4 thus, by the total disappearance of the grid of the pixels, and it quasi disappearance of the BV. An image without defect, that changes a film!Dimensioned black, and as I mentioned it above to you, the specimen which is between my hands does not make it possible me to
push the adjustments to check rather far if the projector can reveal
more details in the dark zones than its excellent predecessor. At least, it makes as well! Idem for colorimetry, I do not have the impression that the widening of the pallet of the
colors results in a difference in colors to the screen but can be that
more adapted film visionnage, thing that I did not have time to make, would bring good surprises to me. Known as you, there still, that it makes as well, and it is very well, because Z3 is a success on the matter.
It seems to to me that the PLVZ4 made a little less halation around
the objects located against a contrasted bottom than the PLVZ3, but it was already weak on Z3.
Dimensioned piqué of image, it is the same thing. Optics is better, according to information which was given to me by Sanyo. I do not see that piqué is however better. It was very well with Z3, without being level of a DLP having the same resolution, it is not worse, and it still does not reach piqué of the DLP.

Comparatif Sanyo PLVZ4 counters Toshiba MT400
I went so far as to make comparative with Toshiba MT400, comparative which has direction only for people of the same race as
me: those which do not see the arcs in sky, for finally noting that the MT400 has less of piqué than Z4, because of the difference in resolution, piqué partly compensated by a better relief and blacker blacks. This comparative, considering the differences in selling price (1700€ for Toshiba, 2000€ for Sanyo, resolution of 1024x576 for Toshiba and 1280x720 for Sanyo, technology DLP counters LCD, much direction does not have inevitably, and it is more coincidence of their meeting which gave me desire for
doing it than formal logic and hard. It would be more judicious to compare the PLVZ4 with Panasonic PTAE900
or Hitachi PJTX200, for example. But good, what is fact is made, here!
Dimensioned noise initially, there or the DLP are rather late. The MT400 has a noise of ventilator acuter than that of the PLVZ4, but none of both is awkward, they are of a discretion which I consider perfect. One is very very far from the vacuum cleaners and dry the hair, and more close to a discrete breath which disappears, with habituation, after a few moments.
In term of heat of the colors, promptness of the images, and general energy which emerges from the screen, the MT400 arrives far in front of the PLVZ4. In Gladiator, each time that an object out of metal is detached from the bottom, that the light hangs a reflection on a jewel, it is a line of light, a key lives which is detached from the image of the MT400, while it is smoothed more on the PLVZ4. No moment, however, the image of the MT400 or the PLVZ4 move away from the spirit of the
cinema: it is never hard, never video, on any the machines.

In chapter 6, one sees much more details, the image is much richer on the MT400 than on the PLVZ4, while at the same time Z4 more piqué havehas and shows more details. The explanation comes from the depth of field, better on the MT400, who gives more relief to the scene, and with the blacks, who allow to see more things. It is the case, for example, folds of the clothing plunged in the half-light: with the MT400, one sees details which are blackened with the PLZ4.
Dimensioned contrast, color, light, strength and dynamics of the images, the MT400 further goes than the PLV4. Dimensioned swarmings in the ciels and with dishes, the PLVZ4 is smooth and more stable. The traveling which goes from the cage to the slaves towards the
village is a good test to check quality of the video treatment. Not surprise for the PLVZ4 which does one without fault. On the other hand, gross good surprise for the MT400: there are few projectors DLP last generation which can be left this
moment of torture with honor, and there, it is almost perfect, in all cases without any visual embarrassment when I tracking of close
each small defect. The MT400 almost as fluid and is deprived of jerks as the PLVZ4, a very good point. There still, one realizes with the details which are behind plane that the PLVZ4
has more piqué. On the other hand, and without I not being able to explain it, the MT400, in 720p (in 576 it is less true) approaches well the precision of the
details of the PLVZ4.
You me will not want any not to conclude, because it does not seem to to me that these two machines form part of
the same list, at the time of a choice. Of with dimensions technique DLP, who seems to be cut to measure for the Home Cinema, and other, the LCD, who makes progress with step of giant, and can even make better than the DLP in certain cases, but which, in the fork of the 1500/2000€, came as a solution for those which the arcs in sky inconvenience. In other words, if you are in this category, the chances that you choose a MT400 are null, because only some top-of-the-range does not make any (arcs in sky), and if you are not obstructed, it seems not very reasonable to give up the quality of the blacks of
the MT400, now that the machine is quiet and that traveling, swarmings, solarization, are controlled.
Let us pass to the comparison of the MT400 with some famous projectors
DLP this time.

The landscape is this one. In DLP, the famous one and exemplary Toshiba MT500 was my projector of
reference, and it did not have comparable successors. The manufacturers indeed moved in two directions. To go further and higher than the matrices 1080x576, the manufacturers adopted, for their projectors high definition with resolution of 1280x720, the matrix DLP Texas Instruments HD2+ which has, in my opinion, leaded the quality of all the projectors, because of defects that did not have the old and less expensive
projectors not liked. The resolution of these projectors, thanks to contrast and technique DLP, give an impression of smoothness higher than that of the of the same
LCD resolution, and the arrival of a projector with this smoothness, and delivered defects of chip HD2+ is a bath of youth and a source of
joy for the demanding amateurs, but I will speak about new Mitsubishi, who produces this turn of force, in another article. Lastly, manufacturers, to democratize the market, produced DLP low resolution, who turn in the 1000/1200€, and which best than one can say is than they are acceptable, but not exciting. It is in this context that Toshiba decides to leave a projector which
is located at semi way. Near or better than the DLP with matrices 1024x576, with a price in serious fall (1690€ with the tariff), and a silence that do not reach the concurrent machines, and more expensive.
It is in Mitsubishi HC900 that I begin my comparison. If comparison one can make, because as soon as I light the HC900, remembers to my good memory the blower now insupportable as of the
these projectors of before last generation. It is the noise factory against silence! For the remainder, not too of surprised: they make share equal to swarmings in the sky, with the fluidity of the traveling, they do not solarize, and, good surprise for the MT400, piqué of image is as good on a machine as on the other, whereas the HC900 always shone, thank you with its higher optics. There or the MT400 injury a little the pawn of the HC900, it is on colorimetry. Toshiba had indicated to me that the temperature of the colors of the
MT400, before any adjustment, is particularly right and pleasant, and it is not sweet talk of manufacturer. The heat of the colors which I like at Toshiba is present and quite
present with the MT400, what gives him an advance on the HC900. Remain the density of the blacks, who has the air a little better on the MT400, but not enough to make a deal of it. In short, the difference in noise, or rather, the existence of a projector DLP of this quality with this level of
silence makes the match cruel for the HC900: there is nothing better at his place, while its noise of ventilator gives desire for extinguishing it almost
as soon as lit. Victorious MT400!
MT400 counters his/her big brother MT700.
Here still comparative strange. Never a chip DLP of 1024x576 cannot hope to reach the smoothness of a
chip DLP of 1280x720. Thus why to measure them one with the other? And well it is because chip HD2+ of the MT700 (and alas of almost all
the others almost all other projectors equipped with this chip) is so
unpleasant to look at, that I wanted to see, more and less one and other, which leaves gaining. Is needed that you keeps in memory, while reading what will follow, that I am roughcast enough by the effects of solarization, these blocks of colors without ranges to delimited contours and which
withdraw, with my taste, any cinematographic savour with an image, and that I hate swarming (whereas, will say to me, if one wants to approach the image of a room of movies, that swarms rather much! Admittedly, but how that which did not see with its small contradictions throws me
the first stone!)
On Gladiator still, zone 2, I looked at many times chapter 2. The MT700 shines by its swarmings on the blue of the sky, the MT400 does not make any. I see already solarization on the image of the MT700, with the clouds, the MT400 does not make any. It is radical. There or the MT700 shows its superiority, it is in chapter 5.Piqué of image is much better with the MT700, but surprised, the details appear better with the MT400 and the movements are more
fluid. If it is added that the colors are softer, the MT400 exceeds the MT700 of a small head.
In chapter 6, when César crosses the part, lit by the diffuse light coming from a window which lights very
slightly on the left, and this part which seems like charged with dust. It moves behind the statutes to go towards a bust (as I make all my
tests without any sound, I do not know if the character represented by this bust is quoted or
not) With the MT700, the detail is seizing, and there is an effect 3d, an effect of impressive relief. The scene is rich of thousand details which weigh down the image, conformément, I am sure, with the v?ux of the director. The MT400 does not reach this relief, the image is more punt, more banal. On the other hand the clouds of particles of dust which fly in the air
form halations, paving stones of lights, while on the MT400, they are truths clouds, who give this milky impression, embuée, dusty with the scene, and there still, I am sure that it is what the realizer wanted! You will decide yourself what seems most important to you: the effect of relief, richness of the details, the thousand objects which furnish this room, or mystery of the atmosphere charged veils it...
I finally wanted to look at what the two machines give on the
traveling that I quoted higher, who goes from the cage c6ntenant the slaves to the village. There, the MT400 is more stable, that hops less than on the MT700 which jerks always too much with my
taste, for its price, and in the absolute. Without speaking about the swarming of the sky and pink reflections in
sand which should not be, and which is not there on the MT400.
Finally, the MT400 gives a softer image and tone hotter than the MT700, it is quieter than the MT700, and it has worse piqué of image, less small information, and it is the only point or it is in retreat compared to the MT700. On all the other points, the MT400 is higher, or equivalent, with the MT700. And it is until one waited! Well considering Toshiba.
Jean Patrick Grumberg,

All Your Base Are Belong To Us!

Anyone fluent in French care to give us a more meaningful translation?

He sure liked the MT400.

I don't see it on projectorcentral. Is it new or not available in the States?

FYI.
ProjectorReview will be posting a Z4 review in the next 2 weeks.


JSNorth

Yeah I was refering to the P752. :) I know I need to do more reading on the subject, but does anyone know if this would be a good route to go with achieving 2.35:1 with a Z4? If so, I might have to jump on this deal soon. :confused:

I have the Z2 and Prismasonic 600M Anamorphic lens, I selected the Prismasonic because the end result of the 2.35 screen gets stretched horizontally to accomplish a corrected image. Also, the throw/width ratio is based on the width of a 1.78 screen.

With the Panamorph the screen is vertically squeezed smaller to get the same results, so the end result from any given distance is that your screen will be smaller. In my research, and the shorter throw design of the Z2, which I assume the Z4 is similar, is that a horizontal design is better. Currently I have a 13ft throw, with the Z2 zoom set to close to minimum and have a 51" x 120" screen.

Also, the Z2 and Z3 can only vertically stretch (scale) 480i or 480p material over component. When using HDMI/DVI the signal is locked and you can't achieve the stretch. So for 2.35 movies I use Component at 480p coming from my Panny Z97S, and when watching smaller ratio's I put the Prismasonic in Pass Through mode and watch them in upconverted 720P modes. With the Panamorph I believe you have to slide it out of the way for other AR's.

The french review can basically be summed up by saying that the Z4 is great performing projector and a major upgrade from the Z3. He said that the Z4 that he was testing was completely free from VB (or as he says BV). He also said that the Z4 is very much superior to the AE900 to the point of being in a whole 'nother class. He said that the Z3 and AE700 were much closer in performance. He also noted a major improvement in the area of screendoor effect over the Z3.
You can't draw anything conclusive from this review alone but I can't wait until some of the other reviews start coming in.

Did he say specificallyl why he feels the z4 is superior to the AE900? Seems like a pretty daring statement to make.

Some things that he mentioned specifically are: better colors, total absence of VB, more punchy image quality, brighter, sharper, better depth of field, and does not have the ringing that he described on the AE900.

We need some reviews on this side of the Atlantic before we conclude. Still at least two weeks away. :)

I agree and I am looking foward to the inevitable comparisons between the Z4 and the AE900.
But it is a distinct possibility that Sanyo's machine might finally surpass its closest rival!
We'll just have to wait and see.

What do you mean, "finally". Of the demos that I saw, the Z3 looked better than the AE700 (IMHO).

I sure am glad I pre-ordered one of these baby's! :D I'm ready for some Z4 goodness coming my way early November!! :cool: :D :D I get giddy just thinking about it!! :eek:

I emailed projector central and they replied that there should be a review of both the Z4 and AE900 in in a week or two. The reviews are in the process now.

:D Exciting times!! :D

We need some reviews on this side of the Atlantic before we conclude. Still at least two weeks away. :)

Wanted to correct this as projectorreviews.com will have a preliminary review up by week's end due to vacation scheduling. So we will get at least a short review going into this weekend.

http://www.projectorreviews.com/

Pretty cool. :cool:

Why, he couldnt have said the Z4 had no VB because the cine home review said there was a small amount of VB and some people (one in particular) here had heart attacks over it jumping to the conclusion all Z4s would be VB infected messes because of one sample.

Why, he couldnt have said the Z4 had no VB because the cine home review said there was a small amount of VB and some people (one in particular) here had heart attacks over it jumping to the conclusion all Z4s would be VB infected messes because of one sample.

Why if it isn't my old pal rlindo :rolleyes: I assume I'm the coronary case you're referring to? :D

I'm still in perfect health thanks :p And I was more upset with the insistent hype here surrounding the new PJs rather than the fact they still have VB. As is for the Panny 900 now confirmed in a review of a production PJ. Not that those people that insulted me or insinuated goddess knows what about me now admit they were wrong...

In any case, you are right about this one: he didn't say his Z4 was VB free. If you read the comparison with the MT400, he says the Z4 had really really bad VB out of the box but he managed to tweak it away easily to almost invisible levels. He says "95% VB free".

As the test continues he spots some scenes where VB is still quite visible, but thinks it's not that much of a problem anymore. However, he still says the Sony is better in this respect.

It helps to read a review before commenting on it...

Neko

Please don't start the VB discussions over here and get this thread closed down also.

I am so close to preordering a Z4 right now. I"m going to try and hold out for a few days more until a comparison between the two is done by a few sites, but I'm heavily leaning towards the Z4. It has a slightly lower price tag and will probably perform just as well. I shouldn't even be considering the upgrade from a 4805 yet, but the lure of 720p is awfully strong!

After this weekend, we should have a much better idea about the AE900 (between Daniel's viewing party and my own evaluation of one I'll be getting tomorrow) and as soon as the Z4 hits a few reviewers, a better idea of the differences between the two. Then, just when you're about to decide between those two, the Epson 550 will hit the scene. :D

Please don't start the VB discussions over here and get this thread closed down also.

Yes, please keep the bickering out of this thread. That goes for everyone.

Thanks in advance.

Some things that he mentioned specifically are: better colors, total absence of VB, more punchy image quality, brighter, sharper, better depth of field, and does not have the ringing that he described on the AE900.

To be exact, he says the Z4 has VB, but it can be easily be tuned (using standard menus, and no obscure factory menus) to the point of becoming a non issue, and he says the AE900 has better depth of field than the Z4, not the opposite.

After this weekend, we should have a much better idea about the AE900 (between Daniel's viewing party and my own evaluation of one I'll be getting tomorrow) and as soon as the Z4 hits a few reviewers, a better idea of the differences between the two. Then, just when you're about to decide between those two, the Epson 550 will hit the scene. :D

Mike,
Let me be the first to ask to you to compare it to the Benq 7700.
Thanks in advance!

Why if it isn't my old pal rlindo :rolleyes: I assume I'm the coronary case you're referring to? :D

I'm still in perfect health thanks :p And I was more upset with the insistent hype here surrounding the new PJs rather than the fact they still have VB. As is for the Panny 900 now confirmed in a review of a production PJ. Not that those people that insulted me or insinuated goddess knows what about me now admit they were wrong...

In any case, you are right about this one: he didn't say his Z4 was VB free. If you read the comparison with the MT400, he says the Z4 had really really bad VB out of the box but he managed to tweak it away easily to almost invisible levels. He says "95% VB free".

As the test continues he spots some scenes where VB is still quite visible, but thinks it's not that much of a problem anymore. However, he still says the Sony is better in this respect.

It helps to read a review before commenting on it...

Neko

hehe dude, lighten up. Just playing with ya. :cool: chillax son! :D

Oh and I would read the review if I could read french but I cant and am not going to waste my time reading some babelfish translated deal that looks like it came from some ebonics lesson in south central L.A. I can only go by what others post and that is what I commented on.

It seems that projectorreviews did not get their Z4 for review. It is delayed for at least two weeks. I guess we will have to wait to see how it compares to the AE900.

That's too bad. Hopefully projector reviews will have a Panasonic 900 on hand again so along with reviewing the Z4 Art can provide a direct comparison.

http://www.avbuzz.com/bbs/av/av-uploads/2005/09/30/112807849402.jpg

Z4 arrives in Hong Kong today. They are ready for sale.

That's too bad. Hopefully projector reviews will have a Panasonic 900 on hand again so along with reviewing the Z4 Art can provide a direct comparison.

Oh, I can guarantee that one 900 will be available for him if he needs it. ;)

Thanks Mike! I remember that he preferred the Z3 over the 700.

I just found this link for the Z4 owners manual. It seems to have a lot of extra tweak settings.

http://www.audiogeneral.com/Sanyo/PLV-Z4_OM.pdf

CKL: Z4 review underway?

We are testing Z4 and the review has not completed yet.

CKL, if possible can you please test to see if this PJ can sync to 72Hz refresh rates?

just wanted to thank CKL for the HS60 review i hadn't read your reviews before and it was the best review i have read.

looking forward to the other D5 reviews

Can anyone experienced in 2.35 AR setups determine if this projector will allow you to stretch 2.35 movies vertically so you can use an anamorphic lens to stretch it horizontally? It looks like it can do this for low rez., but I'm not too sure on 720 or 1080 signals.

We are testing Z4 and the review has not completed yet.
Great. Your review of the hs 60 was very useful; hope you will have a chance to evaluate the full range of the new choices once they are all available and give us your considered opinion of their strengths and weaknesses.

Cheers
Peter

To be exact, he says the Z4 has VB, but it can be easily be tuned (using standard menus, and no obscure factory menus) to the point of becoming a non issue, and he says the AE900 has better depth of field than the Z4, not the opposite.

Well, I am sorry but this reviewer seems to contradict himself because he did in fact say that it was VB free and had a better depth of field but in other parts of the review he seems to contradict himself.
"(AE900) compared to the PLVZ4, my general impression leans towards this last for the following
reasons.
* more cordial colors,
* piqué without shades duplicating the forms located on a bottom of
color contrasted,
* total absence of BV."

There is a new review by Cine4home just out.

Here we go! (http://www.cine4home.de/tests/projektoren/SanyoZ4/Z4Test.htm)

"In the normal film enterprise the projector is vertical Banding free, even with football transmissions!!"

Sounds good guys!!!

Beat me by a few seconds :)

Looking good. Improvements in all areas where the Z3 had issues.

As for the notorious VB, reduced to a level where even soccer matches look good, or so he says (even on the large green field no VB visible in normal use; on test screens very very slight VB visible).

Now, all we need to know is if all of these have the same high quality or if his review unit was "checked" before delivery :)

So, who volunteers his wallet for guineapig duty? :D

Neko

We need a shootout between the Z4 & AE900 as soon as possible. I would also like to see
Cine4home review the AE900.

Ditto. I hope Ekkehart will be able to get a Panny 900 asap.

Neko

Id more like to see a 3 way shoot out, Panasonic AE900, Sanyo Z4 and Epson TW600.

I think thats what would help most potential buyers the most...

Dont worry, we will review the PT900 as soon as it is available in Germany..

Regards,
Ekekhart, www.cine4home.de

:)

Has anyone successfully gotten Babelfish to translate Cine4Home's review? I'm repeatedly getting "Error decoding translated text" errors using its "Translate a Web page" feature.

Sorry, no time to translate it today, I'm sure someone here will make one. Better than having an incorrect Babelfish translation that people start to draw false conclusions from.

Ekkehart, you reviewed the Hitachi tx100 and it looked pretty good. Any outlook on the TX200 being reviewed as well?

Neko

Would be cool if cine4home could perhaps start and english version of there reviews now that they are getting noticed by a larger audience

Hello,

Yes, we are going to review the TX200 too...

About an english version.. yes we are thinking about that for quite some time now.. The problem is that we need for a professional translation some sponsorship...


Regards,
Ekkehart, www.cine4home.de

Has anyone successfully gotten Babelfish to translate Cine4Home's review? I'm repeatedly getting "Error decoding translated text" errors using its "Translate a Web page" feature.
I got the same error. So, I grabbed different paragraphs and got Babelfish to translate them one at a time. Hopefully Ekkehart can correct me if this interpretation is wrong, but I got the impression that they weren't super impressed with the dynamic iris. I only saw contrast ratio measurements for the iris not moving and those were 1800:1 on/off CR in a dynamic picture mode and 1100:1 on/off CR in a cinema mode. But maybe I misinterpreted and that dynamic was for the iris. If so, 1800:1 would be pretty disappointing given the 7000:1 spec. I believe one of the comments indicated that the DLPs still have better CR than the Z4 in general (which I would expect for ANSI CR at the least).

It also looks like the fill factor improvement from the Z3 to Z4 (D4 panels to D5 panels) was not all that much.

Based on what I read I would expect the AE900 with its fast iris to do a better job as far as helping on/off CR, but I'm hoping to get a chance to see one soon and try some material I have in mind to see how it does.

--Darin

1800:1 is with dynamic Iris.... at 6500K / D65,

The cinema modes do not use the "full" adaptive iris modes...

We are investigating right now how much tuning is possible and will publish the results soon..


Regards,
Ekkehart, www.cine4home.de

For PC users who have the Google toolbar installed, its real easy. Just right-click the page and select translate.

It perfectly translates the page into english. No problems at all.

Ekkehart,

do you know if you are going to review the Epson TW600 as well?

Regards
Oivind

ekkenhart do you have any plans of publishing your reviews in english in the future

Rieper,

"For PC users who have the Google toolbar installed, its real easy. Just right-click the page and select translate."

That would be great!

I have the Google toolbar (or Firefox v1.0.20050803 beta), but I only see a word translator for English to other languages.

Thanks

About an english version.. yes we are thinking about that for quite some time now.. The problem is that we need for a professional translation some sponsorship...


I'd be happy to make an English translation of your AE900 review (or whatever is reviewed next) as an example of translation quality. If you're happy with it, maybe we could work something out regarding future reviews.

I tried doing a link like page 1 of this thread... the same error twice then third time lucky.
Cine4Home Translated Link (http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_load?lp=de_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2Ftests%2Fprojektoren%2FSa nyoZ4%2FZ4Test.htm)

The Babelfish translated review was coherent enough, and the Z4 looks like a fantastic projector, but two things bother me:

- perceptible function of the adaptive iris screen
- visible pixel structure

Now the reviews that are coming in for the AE900 state that the Iris' movement is not perceptable and that the pixel structure is invisible or virtually invisible.

Personally, I can stand sudden changes in contrast. My 65 inch Hitachi RPTV did this and it annoyed me, so if the Z4 really has a problem with the adaptive iris and the Panasonic does not, I'm going for the Panny.

My biggest question is how does the Z4, using the same D5 panels as the Panny, have a visible pixel structure, where reviews of the AE900 say that there is virtually no visible pixels?

Anyone know what scale is used on the Cine4home ratings at the end? The Sanyo got a 1.7 and 1.5 overall. This is out of what, a possible 2 or 3? Seems like a great projector! Still like to know if it can be used for 2.35 setups without external scaler.

My biggest question is how does the Z4, using the same D5 panels as the Panny, have a visible pixel structure, where reviews of the AE900 say that there is virtually no visible pixels?

Smoothscreen

Picked mine up in Hong Kong yesterday, Chinese Club (Mongkok). About same price, as when the Z3 came out over here. Anyway, im running it on a cream coloured wall at home now till i decide on screen (probably OS) but its pretty good.

I use a Panasonic Plasma TH-42PW6 for normal viewing and mostly feed HD from HTPC over DVI (MyHD card).

Anyways; have not changed any settings yet and as i said; coming from Plasma so not an expert on projectors but pretty happy last night :) Gonna buy the DVI to HDMI cable, decide on screen and we'll see.

I just found this link for the Z4 owners manual. It seems to have a lot of extra tweak settings.

http://www.audiogeneral.com/Sanyo/PLV-Z4_OM.pdf


Thanks Rwestley for this link. It appears the Z4 will be a great choice for someone interested in taking the plunge into the 2.35 Constant height world :)
My Z2, while using the Zoom mode will vertically stretch 2.35 movies to fill the height and make used of the 33% of panels missed, then I use my Prismasonic anamorphic lens to streth the material horizontally to fill my 10ft 2.35 screen. The problem with the Z2 and Z3 is that this can only be achieved with 480i,p material via component. It appears reading the manual on the Z4, that you can now Zoom 720p or 1080i, in addition there is now a Vertical stretching option, how cool.

Randy