Were you able to get any discount with a double or triple play?
This is the combo I'd like to move to, but currently get a decent discount with Comcast.I currently am getting a $5 per month discount for Internet and a $5 per month discount for TV. There is no bundling option available with VoiceWing AFAIK. Those discounts are with 1-year commitments to each service as I recall. My advice would be to check Verizon's website http://www22.verizon.com/ and order online if possible.

Nope. I have the Remote Control instruction paper and used it as directed. I just talked to another tech and he told me the same thing as the first: You have to go deep into the Guide every time you want to change the volume using the STB. He didn't know why they did that. He also asked me why I would not want to use the TV like everyone else. I told him I did, but I was trying to use a FiOS feature that is supposed to work and it doesn't. He agreed and said basically that is the way it works so no trouble call will be developed because there is no problem. For those of you who have an IMG STB, try it and see what I mean. I say again: UNBELIEVABLE! :eek:


i agree. what's the point?

Where does it say that? I have never had that problem and the 2 techs I talked to never mentioned it.

Doesn't the feature make sense when used like that even if you haven't had to make adjustments? Works for me. Actually, I read it in some of the information received from Verizon, possibly in the flyer sent a few weeks before the upgrade.

I currently am getting a $5 per month discount for Internet and a $5 per month discount for TV. There is no bundling option available with VoiceWing AFAIK. Those discounts are with 1-year commitments to each service as I recall. My advice would be to check Verizon's website http://www22.verizon.com/ and order online if possible.On this subject, be aware that when your one-year commitment expires (or is within a few months of expiring), Verizon will send you a letter stating that your bill will increase effective at some future date. This letter -- at least, the most recent one -- doesn't say anything about the expiration of the one year commitment. It just says your bill is going up. But your bill is only going up because your account will soon switch to month-to-month service (no commitment) from yearly service and you are losing any discounts associated with that.

If you renew your one-year contract, you maintain your existing pricing.

Your bill can increase by as much as $18 when your contract expires. You can lose the $5 discount on Internet and another $5 bundle discount on TV when you go back to month-to-month service. The month-to-month cost of Internet service is also $5-8/mo higher than the one-year commitment cost, so not only do you lose your bundle discounts when your contract expires (and you don't renew), your Internet package price can go up too.

i agree. what's the point?

The point is that the TV this particular HD STB is connected to is a new HD Sammy with a really lousy volume control feature that I didn't know about until I brought it home and was then too lazy and cheap (great price!) to take back since it is only the kitchen TV. I have to punch the FiOS-TV volume button numerous times to get it to move a significant amount since it is digitial (to move from 40 to 50 requires 10 key strokes). If the FiOS HD STB feature worked as advertised, I would simply hold down the remote button and it would continue to change until I reached the desired volume (one key stroke). The STB volume indicator ribbon moves, but the audio doesn't when using the STB feature.

Doesn't the feature make sense when used like that even if you haven't had to make adjustments? Works for me. Actually, I read it in some of the information received from Verizon, possibly in the flyer sent a few weeks before the upgrade.

FiOS-TV sent a tech out to my house this morning to checkout this problem. He messed with it for a while and agreed with my analysis. He even changed the STB and the feature didn't work in the new box either. The company will look into the issue.

One note: the problem is different in the HD box and the SD box:
HD STB: When in the menu, the visual indicator moves, but the volume doesn't change. No volume change when outside the menu.
SD STB: When in the menu, both the visual indicator and the volume change. No volume change when outside the menu.

FiOS-TV sent a tech out to my house this morning to checkout this problem. He messed with it for a while and agreed with my analysis. He even changed the STB and the feature didn't work in the new box either. The company will look into the issue.

One note: the problem is different in the HD box and the SD box:
HD STB: When in the menu, the visual indicator moves, but the volume doesn't change. No volume change when outside the menu.
SD STB: When in the menu, both the visual indicator and the volume change. No volume change when outside the menu.

Just curious, are you hooked up via digital sound on the HD box and regular Left/Right audio on the SD Box? I can confirm that my Harmony remote can change the volume indicator on the HD box from outside the menu, but audio levels do not change. This box is hooked up via optical audio. I will check upstairs on the HD box that just has left/right audio in a few mintues and report what I find.

Just curious, are you hooked up via digital sound on the HD box and regular Left/Right audio on the SD Box? I can confirm that my Harmony remote can change the volume indicator on the HD box from outside the menu, but audio levels do not change. This box is hooked up via optical audio. I will check upstairs on the HD box that just has left/right audio in a few mintues and report what I find.

HD is using HDMI and the SD (mono) is using only a RF cable.

HD is using HDMI and the SD (mono) is using only a RF cable.
On my HD-STB that is hooked up to tv via red/white audio cables, volume control does work through the box(at least with my Harmony remote). Looks like there are 2 problems w/the software -- #1) volume can't be controlled via the FiOS remote and #2) Does not control digital audio.

Hello. This is my first post in this thread, so bear with me.

After receiving at least 3 flyers a week in the mail for over a year, and becoming furious at Comcast making me pay for NFL network via the "sports package" which I don't want, I am thinking about making the move to Verizon.

I have 2 Moto 6412 DVR's in 2 rooms, and that works out just fine for me. My 3rd connection is straight into an old SD 13" in the kitchen.

My questions are:
Has anyone gotten the multi-room DVR? Does it work as advertised? How about storage? Is it about the same as 2 dvr's?

Also, are there any analog channels, like what Comcast has, for my old kitchen tv? If not, I am thinking about a 19" with a QAM tuner. Would that serve the same purpose?

Any response would be helpful.

Thanks.

Hello. This is my first post in this thread, so bear with me.

After receiving at least 3 flyers a week in the mail for over a year, and becoming furious at Comcast making me pay for NFL network via the "sports package" which I don't want, I am thinking about making the move to Verizon.

I have 2 Moto 6412 DVR's in 2 rooms, and that works out just fine for me. My 3rd connection is straight into an old SD 13" in the kitchen.

My questions are:
Has anyone gotten the multi-room DVR? Does it work as advertised? How about storage? Is it about the same as 2 dvr's?

Also, are there any analog channels, like what Comcast has, for my old kitchen tv? If not, I am thinking about a 19" with a QAM tuner. Would that serve the same purpose?

Any response would be helpful.

Thanks.

I switched from Comcast to VZ TV about a year ago and have been using the multi-room DVR since the start. Overall, I am very pleased with the switch and have not looked back.

To address your q's -

1) the multi-room DVR works similar to 2 DVRs - the differences being that you can only Rewind, Pause, FF, etc. Live TV from the TV hooked up to the multi-room DVR box. The only DVR functionality available on the satelite boxes is the ability to watch pre-recorded Non-HD DVR programs from the master box. Note the qualifier of Non-HD programs --- if you record a show in HD, you will not be able to view it on a satelite box - it is only viewable on the TV that the multi-room DVR is hooked up to. Storage on the VZ multi-room DVR is larger than a single Comcast DVR, but not as large as 2 Comcast DVRs combined ---- (I think it is 160 GB versus 120 GB with Comcast).

2) There are MINIMAL analog channels available with FiOS and those are limited to, basically, those that you would receive OTA - i.e. CBS, ABC, NBC, WB, FOX, etc. So, with you current kitchen TV, you would be limited to those channels. Upgrading to a TV with a QAM tuner wouldn't help much as the only channels un-encrypeted are the digital equivalents of the OTA channels named previously. In other words - whereas with Comcast, you are able to receive a slew of analog and digital channels with a NTSC and QAM tuner, with VZ, all non-local channels are encryped - i.e. no ESPN, CNN, etc. One possible work-around would be to get a new TV with a cable-card which would allow you to receive all of the encrypted FiOS channels.

So, there are some pros/cons associated with the switch. That said, IMO, the PQ with Vz is superior to the Comcast PQ - particularly SD programming, but, to my eyes, a slightly better HD picture. Read more of this thread for additional compare/contrast points of Vz vs. Fios.

A few weeks back, I had a call with, what seemed to be, a well-informed Vz CS technical rep who shared some info with me that I think you'll find interesting. In response to my question, "When is Vz going to make more HD channels available?" he provided a very detailed response - the jist of which was:

* The satelites that Vz currently uses to transmit their channels are actually the D* satelites - as such, as D* launches new satelites and provides more HD channels, those same channels will be available for FiOS ---- he did indicate that there would be a delay between the time that those channels become avalable for D* and the time that they are available for Fios and did not have any info on how long this delay might be.

* He was saying that the ONT has the abilty to accept a MPEG-4 signal and re-encode it into an MPEG-2 signal for the Motorola boxes to accept. This is important since the new HD channels on D* are expected to be broadcast in MPEG-4.

I'm not nearly as tech-savvy as some of you guys, but I did question him about the PQ of the Fios versus D* --- if indeed a bunch of the channels that we currently see are coming from the D* satelites, how come the Fios PQ is SO superior to the PQ of D* (I do have a D* subscription for ST and can say with absolute certaintly that the Vz PQ blows the current D* PQ away. His response was something along the lines of the Vz ONT's ability to do MPEG-4 to MPEG-2 conversion ---- this did not make much sense to me, but that is the response that I got. He seemed to be indicating that the current D* satelites are also broadcasting MPEG-4 transmissions and that those are the transmissions used by FIOS whereas the D* subscribers are receiving the compressed MPEG-2 transmissions. I am not trying to create a stir with this statement, merely doing my best to relay what I was able to understand.

I typically monitor these threads in the background and have never seen any mention of Vz getting their channel feeds from the D* satelites - has anybody else heard of this? If this is accurate, can anybody explain why the PQ of Vz is so much better than D*?

The good news is that, if we buy into what I learned from the CS rep, we should have a slew of new HD channels available in the near future once the Direct 10/11 satelites are in place and D* makes the feeds available to Vz.

Is that Dish or DirecTV sats? If they were DirectV the picture would not look as good as it does. It looks as good or better than Comcast. Both of them easily beat DirecTV. So that's why I don't think they could be getting the programming from DirecTV.

* The satelites that Vz currently uses to transmit their channels are actually the D* satelites - as such, as D* launches new satelites and provides more HD channels, those same channels will be available for FiOS ---- he did indicate that there would be a delay between the time that those channels become avalable for D* and the time that they are available for Fios and did not have any info on how long this delay might be.The rep was confused.

Content providers distribute some channels via fiber, but most channels are distributed via satellite to cable and satellite providers. These are not DirecTV's satellites. These are different satellites requiring much larger dishes, often 6' or more in diameter.

DirecTV, Dish Network, and FiOS have centralized dish farms where they have lots of 3-8' dishes pointing at different satellites. The overwhelming majority of channels on these satellites are MPEG-2. DirecTV takes these channels, re-compresses them with MPEG-2 or MPEG-4, and then uplinks them to their own high-power satellites. The FiOS SuperHeadEnd (SHE) takes the same source channels -- without applying extra compression -- and sends them to the regional video hubs (VHOs) via fiber. The regional video hubs (VHO) send those signals to the Verizon central office (CO) in every town via fiber. You get your service from those COs.

To clarify, FiOS does re-compress SD, but not HD. FiOS applies significantly less compression on SD channels than DirecTV, however.

He was saying that the ONT has the abilty to accept a MPEG-4 signal and re-encode it into an MPEG-2 signal for the Motorola boxes to accept. This is important since the new HD channels on D* are expected to be broadcast in MPEG-4.Unfortunately, this is not correct. FiOS can send MPEG-4 signals, but the ONT will not convert them to MPEG-2. In order to utilize MPEG-4, Verizon must to replace the Motorola boxes.

FiOS is now accepting bids for a contract to design and produce MPEG-4 STBs and DVRs for delivery in 2009. At the moment, only HBO (and perhaps Starz) is distributing their new channels in MPEG-4. Every other content provider uses MPEG-2. Until Verizon can deploy those MPEG-4 boxes, they will have to re-encode those new HBO and Starz MPEG-4 feeds into MPEG-2 at the SuperHeadEnd (SHE).

I'm not nearly as tech-savvy as some of you guys, but I did question him about the PQ of the Fios versus D* --- if indeed a bunch of the channels that we currently see are coming from the D* satelites, how come the Fios PQ is SO superior to the PQ of D*Hopefully the information above should clarify that.

DirecTV acquires their channels from the satellite(s) leased by content provider(s), re-compresses them with MPEG-2 or MPEG-4, and then uplinks it to their own high-power DBS satellites which their customers can receive with much smaller dishes.

The rep was confused.

Content providers distribute some channels via fiber. Most channels are distributed by content providers via satellite to cable and satellite providers. These are not DirecTV's satellites. These are other satellites requiring much larger dishes, often 6' or more in diameter.

That is one seriously confused and mis-informed CSR. I suspect he is confusing the DirecTV tie-in deal that Verizon offers with their DSL service in the areas where they have not yet rolled out the fiber. The larger dishes are, of course, the C-band dishes which is still the primary TV industry satellite distribution system, although I gather there are K-band uplink/downlinks as well.

Also, are there any analog channels, like what Comcast has, for my old kitchen tv? If not, I am thinking about a 19" with a QAM tuner. Would that serve the same purpose?
To expand on the previous answer, the only analog channels are in the 2 to 49 range which are all local stations and access channels except for the WGN super-station and a weather channel. Check the channel line-up for your area at the Verizon Fios website at http://www22.verizon.com/content/fiostv/channel+lineup/channel+lineup.htm. However, Verizon has filed a notice with the FCC that they intend to shut down ALL of their analog channels by February, 2009. Analog channels are serious bandwidth hogs and by getting rid of them, they then have a full slate of 135 QAM channels to use for SD and HD distribution.

Verizon provides the local broadcast stations (all their HD and SD sub-channels), the local government & access channels, and WGN as unscrambled QAM channels. The last time I checked, they passed through the PSIP data for the local HD stations in the Washington Metro area so the newer ATSC/QAM tuner mapped those channels to the broadcast channel #: 4-1, 5-1, 7-1, etc which made it easy to find those stations. So a small TV with a QAM tuner can get the local channels. All of the national SD and HD digital networks are channels are scrambled, so a Verizon STB/DVR or a TV/STB/DVR with a cable card is required to receive them. Cablecards work pretty well with Fios, so a number of Fios subscribers have gotten or will get (I'm in that category) the HD Tivos. [Note: we really should have a FAQ with basic answers in the first post of this thread.]

The feature is intended to let you adjust the overall volume of FIOS TV compared to your other sources (DVD, etc..) so that there is no big volume jump when you switch sources. I think it's a nice touch.


I agree. Although I don't like the shortcomings of the new guide, the stb volume control feature is one that I do like. I switch constantly between my sony dhg and the moto.

Before the volume adjustment feature the two dvrs were always at different volume levels which drove me crazy. I have since set the moto to match the sony and now both volumes are equal.

What I don't understand is why I never needed this feature when I used Comcast's moto6412 III or the D*'s HDTivo with the sony. These were all at the same level.

In any event, I'm finally happy with the volume. Now if they can fix some of the other "issues"...

I agree. Although I don't like the shortcomings of the new guide, the stb volume control feature is one that I do like. I switch constantly between my sony dhg and the moto.

Before the volume adjustment feature the two dvrs were always at different volume levels which drove me crazy. I have since set the moto to match the sony and now both volumes are equal.

What I don't understand is why I never needed this feature when I used Comcast's moto6412 III or the D*'s HDTivo with the sony. These were all at the same level.

In any event, I'm finally happy with the volume. Now if they can fix some of the other "issues"...

It would be nice if the company reps knew what this feature is used for..

Ok now my turn...
Being patient with the new IMG...
have acknoweldge the following
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r18922599-IMG-Bugs-and-missing-features-FAQ

BUT Here is one that seems really bad to me that I just noticed....sure you all already did....

Started recording Superman Returns tonight....the recording was about half way into it and we were ready to start watching it...but when I selected it from the recording menu there was no option to play from beginning...I looked...then I looked again....really bad...had to start it...put it on superfast rewind .... torqued me pretty good...please someone tell me I am just being lame etc....we often start a network show let it go about 20 minutes then start to watch it....from the beginning...guess not now...

I have had no problems playing from the start after a recording started, we were the first area to get the new IMG. I'll try it again tonight to make sure.

Ok now my turn...
Being patient with the new IMG...
have acknoweldge the following
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r18922599-IMG-Bugs-and-missing-features-FAQ

BUT Here is one that seems really bad to me that I just noticed....sure you all already did....

Started recording Superman Returns tonight....the recording was about half way into it and we were ready to start watching it...but when I selected it from the recording menu there was no option to play from beginning...I looked...then I looked again....really bad...had to start it...put it on superfast rewind .... torqued me pretty good...please someone tell me I am just being lame etc....we often start a network show let it go about 20 minutes then start to watch it....from the beginning...guess not now...

Nope. I have the Remote Control instruction paper and used it as directed. I just talked to another tech and he told me the same thing as the first: You have to go deep into the Guide every time you want to change the volume using the STB. He didn't know why they did that. He also asked me why I would not want to use the TV like everyone else. I told him I did, but I was trying to use a FiOS feature that is supposed to work and it doesn't. He agreed and said basically that is the way it works so no trouble call will be developed because there is no problem. For those of you who have an IMG STB, try it and see what I mean. I say again: UNBELIEVABLE! :eek:
I currently have the old IMG & have the new remote, currently set to adjust the STB volume, not the TV's volume, the STB audio output is fed to a Stereo receiver..
This is because my Panasonic 50x60U's volume doesn't "work" if I set the TV's small internal speakers to "OFF".. The TV's volume control then doesn't vary the TV's audio output jacks, only the built-in speakers when they are on ...
Are you telling me that the new IMG will Not continue to allow me to have a remote volume control?? This would be unacceptabe, & I would be forced to use the TV's small speakers??

Started recording Superman Returns tonight....the recording was about half way into it and we were ready to start watching it...but when I selected it from the recording menu [B]there was no option to play from beginning
When you watch a live program that is being recorded, the new IMG software puts the play position at the point you switched to the program or when you switch away. I forget which, but this is irritating. IIRC, press the info button twice. This pops up a menu with a play from the beginning option. Or go into the DVR recorded programs list menu.

I have noticed this on programs that I was recording but checked part way through to make sure that it was being recorded and that the program was what it was supposed. Later when I select the program from the recorded programs list to watch and press play, it starts from when I had flipped to the program to check it, not from the beginning even though I had never played back the program. One of the many nuisances of the new wonderful IMG. :rolleyes:

Where does it say that? I have never had that problem and the 2 techs I talked to never mentioned it.

This is not an uncommon feature on various devices. My Samsung ATSC tuner and both DVD players have a source level ANALOG volume adjustment. The reason is exactly as previously described ... to match ANALOG volumes from different sources. It is primarily so that when changing sources on the prepro/receiver, there aren't huge variations in sound levels.

Some preamps provide the ability to trim or boost the incoming analog signals for the same purpose.

I'm not surprised that the phone support people don't know as this is typically a rarely used (perhaps even "high end") feature that most people won't use, understand, or need.

I switched from Comcast to VZ TV about a year ago and have been using the multi-room DVR since the start. Overall, I am very pleased with the switch and have not looked back.

To address your q's -

1) the multi-room DVR works similar to 2 DVRs - the differences being that you can only Rewind, Pause, FF, etc. Live TV from the TV hooked up to the multi-room DVR box. The only DVR functionality available on the satelite boxes is the ability to watch pre-recorded Non-HD DVR programs from the master box. Note the qualifier of Non-HD programs --- if you record a show in HD, you will not be able to view it on a satelite box - it is only viewable on the TV that the multi-room DVR is hooked up to. Storage on the VZ multi-room DVR is larger than a single Comcast DVR, but not as large as 2 Comcast DVRs combined ---- (I think it is 160 GB versus 120 GB with Comcast).

2) There are MINIMAL analog channels available with FiOS and those are limited to, basically, those that you would receive OTA - i.e. CBS, ABC, NBC, WB, FOX, etc. So, with you current kitchen TV, you would be limited to those channels. Upgrading to a TV with a QAM tuner wouldn't help much as the only channels un-encrypeted are the digital equivalents of the OTA channels named previously. In other words - whereas with Comcast, you are able to receive a slew of analog and digital channels with a NTSC and QAM tuner, with VZ, all non-local channels are encryped - i.e. no ESPN, CNN, etc. One possible work-around would be to get a new TV with a cable-card which would allow you to receive all of the encrypted FiOS channels.

So, there are some pros/cons associated with the switch. That said, IMO, the PQ with Vz is superior to the Comcast PQ - particularly SD programming, but, to my eyes, a slightly better HD picture. Read more of this thread for additional compare/contrast points of Vz vs. Fios.


Thanks, Jhav.

On my HD-STB that is hooked up to tv via red/white audio cables, volume control does work through the box(at least with my Harmony remote). Looks like there are 2 problems w/the software -- #1) volume can't be controlled via the FiOS remote and #2) Does not control digital audio.
Source device volume controls NEVER control digital audio volumes. There is no volume in a digital audio signal (volume in audio is only in the analog domain and is carried by voltage variations). Digital is digital. 1s and 0s. You can't have LOUD 1s and 0s.

The job of controlling digital audio volume is left up to the receiver, preamp, or display device (tv).

That's always how it works.

This is not a flaw, problem, or bug with the FiOS box.

Ok now my turn...
Being patient with the new IMG...
have acknoweldge the following
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r18922599-IMG-Bugs-and-missing-features-FAQ

BUT Here is one that seems really bad to me that I just noticed....sure you all already did....

Started recording Superman Returns tonight....the recording was about half way into it and we were ready to start watching it...but when I selected it from the recording menu there was no option to play from beginning...I looked...then I looked again....really bad...had to start it...put it on superfast rewind .... torqued me pretty good...please someone tell me I am just being lame etc....we often start a network show let it go about 20 minutes then start to watch it....from the beginning...guess not now...

Yes, I had a similar problem many times which is one of the reasons why I returned my STB and got a Tivo which works great. On my STB, I would hit Play and it would sometimes go to the end instead of the beginning. I would then exit and try again and the time indicator would flip to the beginning and play. I'm not saying yours will do the same thing. IMG is unpredictable. :(

Source device volume controls NEVER control digital audio volumes. There is no volume in a digital audio signal (volume in audio is only in the analog domain and is carried by voltage variations). Digital is digital. 1s and 0s. You can't have LOUD 1s and 0s.

The job of controlling digital audio volume is left up to the receiver, preamp, or display device (tv).

That's always how it works.

This is not a flaw, problem, or bug with the FiOS box.
Ok, then scratch #2 off my list and stick with #1.

I currently have the old IMG & have the new remote, currently set to adjust the STB volume, not the TV's volume, the STB audio output is fed to a Stereo receiver..
This is because my Panasonic 50x60U's volume doesn't "work" if I set the TV's small internal speakers to "OFF".. The TV's volume control then doesn't vary the TV's audio output jacks, only the built-in speakers when they are on ...
Are you telling me that the new IMG will Not continue to allow me to have a remote volume control?? This would be unacceptabe, & I would be forced to use the TV's small speakers??

MC the discussion is about a setting in the new IMG menu where you can adjust output level from the STB(at least that's seems to be what it does). as AcuraCL posted above, this is only the gain of the STB's analog outputs. if you're not using the analog outputs this feature would have no use.

you say you have the audio from your FiOS box fed to a stereo receiver. do the remote codes for your FiOS remote work for this receiver? if so go to page 25 in the owner's manual(if you haven't done so already)-it gives you a code so that the volume control will work for the receiver or whatever device you have programmed under the AUX button. the default setting for the remote VOL control is the TV volume.

I can tell you the new IMG download has no effect on how the remote controls your devices. it DOES enable a few buttons on the remote-specifically WIDGETS & OPTIONS.

BO and Showtime do use lower bitrates, 11-12Mbps ABR with peaks of less than 14Mbps. Starz is a bit higher. On the other hand, Discovery, Hdnet, Hdnet Movies, MTV, TNT, and a few other channels use 17-19Mbps.How do you tell? :confused:You can't tell with the FiOS DVR.

A few channels are unencrypted so you can tell with a PC. If you have a TivoHD or Tivo Series3, you can press the info button to see the size of the recording. Once you know that, just divide by the minutes and seconds to find the average bitrate.

Here are some bitrates for some programs I recorded in the past few weeks:

Title Channel Minutes Size(Gb) Bitrate (Mbps)
Bronx is Burning ESPN-HD 60 7.50 17.07
College Football ESPN-HD 180 23.34 17.70
Alison Krauss & Union Station Hdnet 120 15.39 17.51
Vince Gill & Friends Hdnet 120 15.50 17.64
Black Donnelys Hdnet 60 7.67 17.45
Hunt for Red October Hdnet Movies 135 17.44 17.64
Blazing Saddles Hdnet Movies 100 12.93 17.65
Layer Cake Hdnet Movies 105 13.56 17.63
Heroes NBC-HD 60 7.30 16.61
Naked Science NGC-HD 60 7.56 17.20
The Company TNT-HD 120 15.11 17.19
The Recruit TNT-HD 150 18.96 17.26
These are the average bitrates, peaks are a bit higher.

Regarding viewing Programs in the process of being recorded...
Seems pretty clear now...
While recording...can not select to start from beginning
Once Recording has finished options available to start from beginning or resume playing...
Wow that is functionality lost...

PS... I tried hit info button many places many times.

Regarding viewing Programs in the process of being recorded...
Seems pretty clear now...
While recording...can not select to start from beginning
Once Recording has finished options available to start from beginning or resume playing...
Wow that is functionality lost...

PS... I tried hit info button many places many times.

I just started watching a currently recording program from the beginning. Go to the DVR List of Recorded Programs, highlight the program, select ok, hit play, starts from the beginning.

I just started watching a currently recording program from the beginning. Go to the DVR List of Recorded Programs, highlight the program, select ok, hit play, starts from the beginning.

Welll.....no and yes....just like my DVR....
Did the experiment again....didn't work...tried hitting OK vs Play etc...

BUT....I dork around more ...change channels etc..FF...REW...etc..then out of nowhere I press the DVR button and Whalluh suddenly the "Start From Beginning" Option is there...then I dork around some more ....rewinding...going to live...changing channels etc...and and then....OOPS...no more start from beginning...it just starts from live or wherever I watched last...I dork around some more...sometimes it starts from beginning and sometimes it doesn't .... whatever it is doing is either unreliable or a world class Rube Golberg (http://www.rube-goldberg.com/) algorithm...that coming from a SW Engineer that has written some damned confusing stuff in his life ;)

Whatever!....thats a total diss coming from me

Welll.....no and yes....just like my DVR....
Did the experiment again....didn't work...tried hitting OK vs Play etc...

BUT....I dork around more ...change channels etc....then out of nowhere I press the DVR button and Whalluh suddenly the "Start From Beginning" Option is there...then I dork around some more ....rewinding...going to live...changing channels etc...and and then....OOPS...no more start from beginning...it just starts from live or wherever I watched last...I dork around some more...sometimes it starts from beginning and sometimes it doesn't .... whatever it is doing is either unreliable or a world class Rube Golberg (http://www.rube-goldberg.com/) algorithm...that coming from a SW Engineer that has written some damned confusing stuff in his life ;)

Whatever!....thats a total diss coming from me
I never had the "Start from beginning option", only the "Play" option. I'll test it again tonight, but I have done this several times in the past w/the new IMG.

Technically it Play from Start....sorry about that

For my finished recorded programs...its appears that the attempted logic is...
If it has not been played yet just Play is available...
If it has been played and stopped in the middle Resume Play and Play From Start should be available...I am not sure that I am seeing that accurately as I have not gone tested every recorded program that I have....

Anyways...I will get over it....

Might not be the correct place but figured it would be worth a shot here since many people here HAVE FIOS. I am considering the switch over to FIOS from Directv. The idea of being able to use TIVO if I chose is a factor as well as VOD, currently more HD channels, and basically a similiar price.

So my question is about the service contracts. Commitments. Etc... Say I sign up with a contract service of 2 years. (like triple play) And say in 12 months I move. How does that work? Assuming the new place I move DOES NOT have FIOS available. (which statiscally is good odds) I just don't want to get screwed having to BUY out of a contract due to things out of my control. Any help would be appreciated. I have been told conflicting results from Verizon customer support.

I never had the "Start from beginning option", only the "Play" option. I'll test it again tonight, but I have done this several times in the past w/the new IMG.
I tried this out tonight while a program was being recorded. Yep, our new wonderful IMG does not have a start from beginning option when viewing a program being recorded. I know the old software did. Put this down on the loonnnggg list of features missing with the current release, V1.03 Build 3.40, of the IMG. :rolleyes:

Still on the old guide in my section of Northern Delaware. However, I received a mailing about the new IMG last week - anyone have an idea how soon they send out the mailing before actually pushing the guide?

Welll.....no and yes....just like my DVR....
Did the experiment again....didn't work...tried hitting OK vs Play etc...

BUT....I dork around more ...change channels etc..FF...REW...etc..then out of nowhere I press the DVR button and Whalluh suddenly the "Start From Beginning" Option is there...then I dork around some more ....rewinding...going to live...changing channels etc...and and then....OOPS...no more start from beginning...it just starts from live or wherever I watched last...I dork around some more...sometimes it starts from beginning and sometimes it doesn't .... whatever it is doing is either unreliable or a world class Rube Golberg (http://www.rube-goldberg.com/) algorithm...that coming from a SW Engineer that has written some damned confusing stuff in his life ;)

Whatever!....thats a total diss coming from me


I've also reported this mess on dslreports. I've had times where i press play and it starts from the beginning and others where it starts from where i last left it or others where it goes to the live part. This is a drag for sporting events when you don't want to know the current score. Quickest way i solve this is to press ok, quickly press pause (while I cover the score with my hands) and go back to the dvr menu where it now allows me to start from the beginning.

I tried this out tonight while a program was being recorded. Yep, our new wonderful IMG does not have a start from beginning option when viewing a program being recorded. I know the old software did. Put this down on the loonnnggg list of features missing with the current release, V1.03 Build 3.40, of the IMG. :rolleyes:

I tried this 3x last night, I have the same build and it worked all 3 times for me by simply selecting the Play option from the menu, it started from the beginning. I'm not saying you are wrong, just find it odd that the same build yields different results.

i'm about ready to schedule a fios tv install, but i have a question. i've been trying to find info on tv's that have QAM tuners and the ability to receive channels without a STB. i'm looking for a 26-32" LCD for my bedroom and would like to wall mount it and NOT have a STB. am i limited to TV's that have a CC slot or can i get channels with a QAM tuner? unfortunately, it's slim pickins trying to find a tv that meets the criteria and is <$1000. can you receive channels with fios and QAM? i don't care about HD in the bedroom, i just want to save the real estate that a STB would take up.

i'm about ready to schedule a fios tv install, but i have a question. i've been trying to find info on tv's that have QAM tuners and the ability to receive channels without a STB. i'm looking for a 26-32" LCD for my bedroom and would like to wall mount it and NOT have a STB. am i limited to TV's that have a CC slot or can i get channels with a QAM tuner? unfortunately, it's slim pickins trying to find a tv that meets the criteria and is <$1000. can you receive channels with fios and QAM? i don't care about HD in the bedroom, i just want to save the real estate that a STB would take up.
I and others answered the same basic question in this thread only 2 days ago (and many times before). Please go back check my post # 4016 in this thread as a sample.

We really need to have a FAQ and answers info area in the first posts of this thread or start a new FIOS programming thread with the first 3-4 posts reserved for basic information by someone who is willing to fill it in and maintain it.

i'm about ready to schedule a fios tv install, but i have a question. i've been trying to find info on tv's that have QAM tuners and the ability to receive channels without a STB.All digital cable channels are encrypted. The locals may be available in unencrypted QAM, but that is it.

am i limited to TV's that have a CC slot or can i get channels with a QAM tuner?Yes, if you want more than locals.

In another month or so, Verizon plans to offer subscribers the option of a Motorola DCT700 STB. This box won't support VOD with FiOS (as it uses IP rather than QAM), but it is much, much smaller (http://broadband.motorola.com/consumers/products/dct700/) and will cost about $2/mo. This doesn't replace any of the current boxes, it's just meant as a cheaper alternative to support all digital channels.

Has anyone else been told by VZ they would be charged $6.95 for the new remote?

I have the scientific atlanta remotes without the skip & playback, everyone has been mentioning they've called VZ and they send new remotes FOC, however, I've tried twice now and both times have been told it would cost $6.95 each.

Between this and the new img (the stupidest idea ever thought of) I'm ready to cancel.

All digital cable channels are encrypted. The locals may be available in unencrypted QAM, but that is it.

Yes, if you want more than locals.

In another month or so, Verizon plans to offer subscribers the option of a Motorola DCT700 STB. This box won't support VOD with FiOS (as it uses IP rather than QAM), but it is much, much smaller (http://broadband.motorola.com/consumers/products/dct700/) and will cost about $2/mo. This doesn't replace any of the current boxes, it's just meant as a cheaper alternative to support all digital channels.

that's awesome, i could probably hide it somwhere and acheive what i'm looking to do.

i know it's kind of waste to only view SD on an HDTV, but i want one in the bedroom to replace an aging CRT and regain some space. i wish that SD stb's used at least component to connect instead of composite. would there be any improvement in PQ if that was the case? that's one reason i wanted CC. no interconnects, just straight feed.

hey CHolleman!!!

the SD FiOS box has S-Video in addition to composite. should be some improvement in PQ-but I agree component outputs would be nice.

that's awesome, i could probably hide it somwhere and acheive what i'm looking to do.

i know it's kind of waste to only view SD on an HDTV, but i want one in the bedroom to replace an aging CRT and regain some space. i wish that SD stb's used at least component to connect instead of composite. would there be any improvement in PQ if that was the case? that's one reason i wanted CC. no interconnects, just straight feed.As noted above, the standard FiOS STB (Motorola QIP2500) has s-video output, but it's much larger and more expensive ($4.99 vs $1.99) than the DCT700.

i was going for the look of just the tv on the wall, but i suppose i'll find a solution for the box somewhere. though i would like to find a >32" CC tv, there comes a point where additional costs don't justify it. oh well, wishful thinking.

As noted above, the standard FiOS STB (Motorola QIP2500) has s-video output, but it's much larger and more expensive ($4.99 vs $1.99) than the DCT700.

I currently have Comcast and have one of the DCT-700 STB. It only has Composite Video, Analog Left & Right (all 3 RCA) and a coax out connection. These work great on something like a Kids room TV. I'm glad Vz will be offering these at the reduced price - will make switching a little easier.

I also have a Motorola 2500. It has S-Video as well as Digital [Audio] outs (Digital coax and Optical).

After using the new IMG for a week, here are my gripes:

1. Cannot default the guide to my "favorites" list like I could with the old software. Since I use a universal remote, I have to hit guide-->guide options-->favorites to get to them. We should be able to add/delete channels in the default listing.

2. Favorites always defaults to the top of your favorites list, not the channel that you are currently watching. Ridiculous if you are on channel 826 and your favorites start at, say, 50... you have to scroll all the way back to get to the 800s.

3. You can't scroll from the 800s back to the 1s in the guide. Once you get to the last channel (850-something), it stops. To get from that channel to channel 2, you have to go all the way back the other way.

4. After watching a recorded program, it takes you back to the first-listed program in your dvr list, not the program you just watched. Real annoying if you have several episodes recorded and you want to watch them in sequence.

5. Need an easier "delete" function for recorded shows. I understand they have to create the menus for the lowest common denominator, but at least when you press "stop", the delete option should be the first one to pop up and be already highlighted.

6. The guide seems so cluttered, it's hard to tell the different shows and channels apart. maybe an option to decrease font size or something, so more description shows up and there's some space between channels or shows.

7. Need the ability to delete a whole "folder" of recorded shows, so you dont have to go in and delete every episode individually.

As noted above, the standard FiOS STB (Motorola QIP2500) has s-video output, but it's much larger and more expensive ($4.99 vs $1.99) than the DCT700.

I currently have Comcast and have one of the DCT-700 STB. It only has Composite Video, Analog Left & Right (all 3 RCA) and a coax out connection. On-Demand also works. These work great on something like a Kids room TV. I'm glad Vz will be offering these at the reduced price - will make switching a little easier.

I also have a Motorola 2500. It has S-Video as well as Digital [Audio] outs (Digital coax and Optical).

Might not be the correct place but figured it would be worth a shot here since many people here HAVE FIOS. I am considering the switch over to FIOS from Directv. The idea of being able to use TIVO if I chose is a factor as well as VOD, currently more HD channels, and basically a similiar price.

So my question is about the service contracts. Commitments. Etc... Say I sign up with a contract service of 2 years. (like triple play) And say in 12 months I move. How does that work? Assuming the new place I move DOES NOT have FIOS available. (which statiscally is good odds) I just don't want to get screwed having to BUY out of a contract due to things out of my control. Any help would be appreciated. I have been told conflicting results from Verizon customer support.


Why switch from D* when D* is about to launch all those new HD channels?

If you do switch to fios I believe the early termination fee is $150. With the fios "triple play" you'll save that in about 6 months so no biggee.

I have fios and waiting to see if D*'s new mpeg4 HD channels will be at full resolution. If so, I'm considering switching back to D* (unless fios announces additional hd channels soon) but keeping fios internet and phone.

Might not be the correct place but figured it would be worth a shot here since many people here HAVE FIOS. I am considering the switch over to FIOS from Directv. The idea of being able to use TIVO if I chose is a factor as well as VOD, currently more HD channels, and basically a similiar price.

So my question is about the service contracts. Commitments. Etc... Say I sign up with a contract service of 2 years. (like triple play) And say in 12 months I move. How does that work? Assuming the new place I move DOES NOT have FIOS available. (which statiscally is good odds) I just don't want to get screwed having to BUY out of a contract due to things out of my control. Any help would be appreciated. I have been told conflicting results from Verizon customer support.

If you move to a location where Vz does not offer service, they cannot hold you responsible for not fulfilling the contract.

Does the DCT-700 support the multi-room DVR??

If you move to a location where Vz does not offer service, they cannot hold you responsible for not fulfilling the contract.

Of course you'd be responsible for not fulfilling. You signed up for two years. If you're thinking of moving in one year, then don't sign up for something like that. Verizon might let you out of paying an early termination fee, but they don't have to. If you move someplace where Fios isn't available, you'd still be responsible for paying the fees to cancel your account early. It's not Verizon's problem that you move in a year, you still signed a contract saying you'd pay for Verizon service for two years.

Does the DCT-700 support the multi-room DVR??No.

Of course you'd be responsible for not fulfilling. You signed up for two years. If you're thinking of moving in one year, then don't sign up for something like that. Verizon might let you out of paying an early termination fee, but they don't have to. If you move someplace where Fios isn't available, you'd still be responsible for paying the fees to cancel your account early. It's not Verizon's problem that you move in a year, you still signed a contract saying you'd pay for Verizon service for two years.As a matter of policy, Verizon doesn't charge people a penalty when service cancellation is due to a move. That could change in the future, but that's the way it is now.

We have the Tivo S3 option as well as the Moto 6412 option for a HD DVR. They both have major disadvantages. The S3 has a large recurring cost and the 6412 has that useless 160 Gbyte disk if you do a lot of HD recordings.

Seems like I spend twice as much time deleting stuff on the 6412 to get disk space rather that searching for new stuff to record.

With the finally available ATI Digital Tuner `, you can get a Vista PC with that ATI card in it and have unlimited recording capacity.
The only recurrring cost is the cable card yoiu have to rent from Verizon.

The initial outlay is more than the Tivo S3 but you will reach break even really quick due to not having to pay the Tivo's monthy fee.

I am posting this for two purposes.
The first is to let folks know that there are other options for a DVR and the other is to see if anyone who is reading this forum has tried out one of the ATI Cable card pc's and could give us their oipinions.

I am really close to buying an HP machine (this one has 1 tuner) but before i spend around $1200, I would really like to hear from othe FIOS users\

Thanks

...1. Cannot default the guide to my "favorites" list like I could with the old software. Since I use a universal remote, I have to hit guide-->guide options-->favorites to get to them. We should be able to add/delete channels in the default listing.
...
Um, why not program the "FAV" button? The original remote had it. I taught it to my MX-700 universal.
...
5. Need an easier "delete" function for recorded shows. I understand they have to create the menus for the lowest common denominator, but at least when you press "stop", the delete option should be the first one to pop up and be already highlighted....
Learn the new way. Don't hit STOP, hit INFO twice and delete from there. Really, this isn't hard.

I am really close to buying an HP machine (this one has 1 tuner) but before i spend around $1200, I would really like to hear from othe FIOS usersFor that $1200, you could buy yourself a few 1Tb drives, an eSATA RAID, and have enough left over to pay the Tivo monthly fees for the better part of the next decade. And you'd have twice as many tuners.

Have you upgraded your internal Tivo drive with 750Gb-1Tb storage yet?

For that $1200, you could buy yourself a few 1Tb drives, an eSATA RAID, and have enough left over to pay the Tivo monthly fees for the better part of the next decade. And you'd have twice as many tuners.

Have you upgraded your internal Tivo drive with 750Gb-1Tb storage yet?

I am looking for opinions so thank you.

I do NOT own a Series 3. I am trying to figure out what is the best way to get a DVR that has lots of disk space.

My Moto 6412 does have firewire and since I have a JVC D-VHS, I can record the High Def movies on the DVR since the D-VHS is full 5CF compliant.
I can record the High def locals on my PC as well as a few High def channels that FIOS has not turned on the 5C flag with .



A large disk is a MUST have.
Having been an owner of the HR 10-250, the 250 Gbyte disk was NOT enough so I upgraded it and now that I am with with Verizon FIOS, I need a LOT of disk space due to the high quaility of their picture.


With that said, I am thinking about your math.


The Series 3 is $600 from CC ($649 from Weaknees) and the Monthly fee (if commit for a year), is $15/month and I only get a 250 Gbyte disk so I have to pay extra to get a bigger disk.
Weakness's next size up Series 3 is $1049.00

The HP is $1200 with no monthly fee and since I already have a 4 TB SAN for the PC's in my house, disk capacity is free and basically limitless.

To me, it starts to look like a wash between the two options.

I am concerned about the tuner and am getting ready to call HP about that.


Do you have any idea when TIVO will make it so that I merely have tp plug in a USB disk and it will simply work 'plug and play' ?


I am not trying to argue - I am trying to decide what route to go so I welcome opinions.
That stupid 160 Gbyte disk that Verizon gives you makes no sense for a system that is sending full data rate HD,unlike my former Directv's 'HD Lite'

Joe

You can prepay 3 years for the TiVo service which works out to $8.30 a month.
You can also get the TiVo HD($300 retail) but if you have a 10% or 12% off coupon you can save some money. Then you just get the cable cards from FIOS. You can easily upgrade the TiVoHD or Series 3 drive to a Terabyte drive, 750GB, or 500GB drive to give you alot of storage capacity.

You can easily get a 500GB drive for $100, a 750GB drive for $200, or a Terabyte drive for $300(on sale). I had no problem with upgrades on my three Series 3 boxes and one TiVoHD box. I plan on connecting my TiVoHD box to FIOS TVwhen I get it installed this weekend. The Series 3 boxes will follow when I leave Comcast in December.

You can prepay 3 years for the TiVo service which works out to $8.30 a month.
You can also get the TiVo HD($300 retail) but if you have a 10% or 12% off coupon you can save some money. Then you just get the cable cards from FIOS. You can easily upgrade the TiVoHD or Series 3 drive to a Terabyte drive, 750GB, or 500GB drive to give you alot of storage capacity.

You can easily get a 500GB drive for $100, a 750GB drive for $200, or a Terabyte drive for $300(on sale). I had no problem with upgrades on my three Series 3 boxes and one TiVoHD box. I plan on connecting my TiVoHD box to FIOS TVwhen I get it installed this weekend. The Series 3 boxes will follow when I leave Comcast in December.

I have a Tivo Series 3 HD with the large Hard Drive hooked-up to my FiOS. It has occassional macro-blocking and audio drop-out. Tivo CSR's say it will be several weeks (at least) before they have the software fix out to the customers to fix the problem. The low FiOS signal strength readings from the Tivo are false readings.

With that said, I am thinking about your math.

The Series 3 is $600 from CC ($649 from Weaknees) and the Monthly fee (if commit for a year), is $15/month and I only get a 250 Gbyte disk so I have to pay extra to get a bigger disk.
Weakness's next size up Series 3 is $1049.00

The HP is $1200 with no monthly fee and since I already have a 4 TB SAN for the PC's in my house, disk capacity is free and basically limitless.

To me, it starts to look like a wash between the two options.The Tivo Series3 is the older generation box that is no longer in production. The TivoHD uses newer, more integrated components to cut costs.

$263 TivoHD from from Best Buy with 12% off coupon from **************
$199 Western Digital 750Gb drive from Newegg to replace internal drive
$199 Additional Western Digital 750Gb drive from Newegg for use with eSATA later this year
$299 Three-year subscription to Tivo service
$299 Additional three-year subscription to Tivo service (six years total)
---------------------
$960That will give you about 215 hours of high-definition storage. Stick the SATA drive in a eSATA RAID with additional drives once 1Tb drives come down in price.

Do you have any idea when TIVO will make it so that I merely have tp plug in a USB disk and it will simply work 'plug and play' ?USB? Never.

But "plug and play" eSATA expansion will be officially supported on both the Series3 and TivoHD before end of year.

The Tivo Series3 is the older generation box that is no longer in production. The TivoHD uses newer, more integrated components to cut costs.

$263 TivoHD from from Best Buy with 12% off coupon from **************
$199 Western Digital 750Gb drive from Newegg to replace internal drive
$199 Additional Western Digital 750Gb drive from Newegg for use with eSATA later this year
$299 Three-year subscription to Tivo service
$299 Additional three-year subscription to Tivo service (six years total)
---------------------
$960That will give you about 215 hours of high-definition storage. Stick the SATA drive in a eSATA RAID with additional drives once 1Tb drives come down in price.

USB? Never.

But "plug and play" eSATA expansion will be officially supported on both the Series3 and TivoHD before end of year.


The Series 3 is still in production. It is for sale at major electronics retailers. Brand new ones are for sale at the TiVo website and many retailers. The Series 3 is just the premium box. I have 3 of them and it is much better than the TiVoHD I have. But the TiVoHD costs alot less which makes it a much better value even though the Series 3 is currently the better box.

I have a Tivo Series 3 HD with the large Hard Drive hooked-up to my FiOS. It has occassional macro-blocking and audio drop-out. Tivo CSR's say it will be several weeks (at least) before they have the software fix out to the customers to fix the problem. The low FiOS signal strength readings from the Tivo are false readings.

Please keep reporting back and let us know...
But in general ... are you more satisfied with this solution over the 6416?

The Series 3 is just the premium box. I have 3 of them and it is much better than the TiVoHD I have. But the TiVoHD costs alot less which makes it a much better value even though the Series 3 is currently the better box.

So how is the Series 3 "much better" than the TivoHD? Other than the obvious , like a bigger HD and the nice front panel, and the remote, what makes it much better?

There is a thread on dslreports.com that suggests FiOS TV may be just about out of usable bandwidth (at least for the next 12-18 months) for new HD channels.

Here is the link:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r18998011-TLC-HD~days=10~start=20

If you believe FMR VZMAN, we'll be lucky to see 4-5 new HD channels in the short term. Any other new HD will only come after either equipment upgrades, elimination of the analog tier, and/or conversion to MPEG4.

Geez, a few months without an HD announcement and suddenly the sky is falling.

Maybe "FMR VZMAN" is actually "CURRNT CCAST EMPLYEE"?

Geez, a few months without an HD announcement and suddenly the sky is falling.

Maybe "FMR VZMAN" is actually "CURRNT CCAST EMPLYEE"?Quite possibly.

You've always got to consider the source.

I am leaning towards doing an HP Cablecard PC at around $1200 because being a PC, it can be used for a lot more things than just recording TV.

They also talk about using an Xbox to send High Def programming to another room.


However, the points about going the Tivo route made by aaronwt and bfdtv do make a lot of sense.

I am the type who likes my equipment hidden from view so if you were in my living room, all you would see would be the center speaker, my floor standing speakers in the front and back of the room and a TV on the wall.
My sub is hidden behind a Queen Anne's chair in the corner and With the judicous use of IR repeaters , all of my gear is hidden from view in nice looking cabinets and placed in another room.
The carpenter and Those 25 foot HDMI cables set me back a lot but I am very pleased with the fact that my place does not look like a hiifi store:)

Besides the usual HT gear, I have a LOT of stuff to hide thanks to the DVD format war and my 'obsession' with recording.

The minimalist look was my wifes idea and I like the way it turned out.

So, A simple box like a Tivo sitting in the footprint of where my Moto 6412 is now versus adding another PC with 2 large external tuners (I already have an HTPC in my equipment cabinets) can start to get really hard to manage.

On the other hand, I really like the idea of truly limitless recording space with the cable card PC route plus I 'think' it could replace my HTPC

If you don't mind, how about some clarification of some comments both of you made:


1) "The Tivo Series3 is the older generation box that is no longer in production" - Is this true?
PLus I thought it had some features that the newer HD TIVO did not have?

2) I mispoke when I said USB. I have heard about these 'end of year' dates for a promised feature yet it never shows up. Remember the firewire being disabled on the DISH 921 with a promise that it would be turned on in A FEW months only to find that it was a design flaw and could never be enabled?
Any idea how firm it is that I could simply plug in a Large eSata disk into EITHER of these 2 models?

3) I had an HR 10-250 with Directv (still do in the closet) and while I really liked it's features, it was SO slow that it drove me nuts. Add a season pass and go make dinner whiule it said 'please wait'
I know how fast a PC based HD tuner/recorder will be but how fast or slow is the Tivo?

4) Hilltopsailor seems to be having an issue with FIOS and his TIVO with a big disk. Has that been figured out yet?

5) Does the Tivo have a modular design to enable a board swap if the cable companies switch to mpeg4?

Joe

I
1) "The Tivo Series3 is the older generation box that is no longer in production" - Is this true?To clarify, the Tivo Series3 is not discontinued. It will continue to be sold well into 2008. However, I was told a few weeks ago that it was no longer being manufactured. As far as I know, there are no Series3 boxes with a build date more recent than May.

PLus I thought it had some features that the newer HD TIVO did not have?The Tivo Series3 has a piano black chassis, frontal OLED display, a larger hard drive (250Gb vs 160Gb), and currently runs a newer version of the Tivo software. It also includes a HDMI cable and slick learning remote, neither of which is included with the TivoHD.

The TivoHD has a newer processor, twice the usable system memory (3x the memory available to the underlying Linux OS), different QAM/ATSC tuners, and a newer OpenCable (CableCard) receiver. It adds a MPEG-4 transcoder which can transcode MPEG-2 HD (and MPEG-2 SD) to MPEG-4 SD in realtime. Basically, the TivoHD uses the newest, integrated components available.

2) I mispoke when I said USB. I have heard about these 'end of year' dates for a promised feature yet it never shows up. Remember the firewire being disabled on the DISH 921 with a promise that it would be turned on in A FEW months only to find that it was a design flaw and could never be enabled?I don't think that is likely. It was discovered today (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=365215) that eSATA is now functional on the TivoHD with the 8.1.7c2 software released yesterday. This is not official support, and you must use the WinMFS utility to add an eSATA drive because the current TivoHD software does not have a UI to setup drive expansion. However, it shows that Tivo is working on it, as the box now has a fully functional driver supporting the eSATA connection --- something it did not have last week.

5) Does the Tivo have a modular design to enable a board swap if the cable companies switch to mpeg4?No, but that is unnecessary. The TivoHD already uses the latest Broadcom decoder (http://www.broadcom.com/collateral/pb/7401-PB04-R.pdf) with full support for both MPEG-4 SD and HD. The upcoming DirecTV HR21 receiver is based on the same chip (http://www.broadcom.com/collateral/pb/7401-PB04-R.pdf).

The Series3 design is based on the previous generation of that chip without MPEG-4, but Tivo added a separate chip for MPEG-4 support. On the Series3, that separate MPEG-4 chip is not yet used (no driver loaded for it), but that's something Tivo can enable in the future. The MPEG-4 chip in the Tivo Series3 is the same chip you find in the first-generation HD-DVD players and some Blu-ray players, including the Samsung BD-P1200.

I had an HR 10-250 with Directv (still do in the closet) and while I really liked it's features, it was SO slow that it drove me nuts. Add a season pass and go make dinner whiule it said 'please wait'
I know how fast a PC based HD tuner/recorder will be but how fast or slow is the Tivo?Your old HR10-250 had a 160MHz CPU with 128Mb DDR266 memory, an EIDE interface, and an early-generation 7200rpm EIDE hard drive. The TivoHD has a 300MHz CPU with 256Mb DDR400, a faster system bus, a SATA interface, and a just-released 7200rpm SATA drive from Western Digital. The Tivo Series3 also has a 300MHz CPU, 128Mb DDR400 memory, SATA interface, and 7200rpm SATA hard drive; as noted above, the Tivo Series3 design uses a separate decoder for MPEG-4 (rather than a combined MPEG-2 / MPEG-4 decoder) with its own dedicated 128Mb memory bank, but that is not yet used.

The Tivo Series3 uses a newer, faster version of the Tivo software, but both the TivoHD and Series3 are expected to use the same software before year's end.

4) Hilltopsailor seems to be having an issue with FIOS and his TIVO with a big disk. Has that been figured out yet?Both the TivoHD and Series3 appear to be more sensitive to the signal levels than the Motorola STBs. Many, including myself, do not have issues with any channel. This appears to be central office-specific, and only effects channels within certain frequencies (i.e. due to a defective or misconfigured board to handle those frequencies). There's no way to verify for sure whether your local office exhibits the problem until you try the Tivo or another CableCard solution.

Does the TivoHD display VOD now or will it ever with FIOS?

Please keep reporting back and let us know...
But in general ... are you more satisfied with this solution over the 6416?

The ideal solution for the short term would be to have both boxes so you could normally use the TIVO and switch to the FiOS one in an emergency. Since that is not normally an option: Yes, I'm happy with the TIVO. Most of the time, it works just fine. It has some problems without any warning or regularity. It just happens. Luckily, I have great OTA here for the major networks and I switch over to that when I need to, but that doesn't help with the cable channels. Anything is better than the FiOS HD DVR with IMG. That thing just drove me nuts! Even after they fix its numerous problems, it is still going to have a crazy logic that I find bizarre and frustrating. But that's just me. To each his own.

Two notes:
1. As I have said before: TIVO has really changed if you haven't seen it for a while. It still is the best and easiest to use, but there are several models and they have very different capabilities. Study before buying.
2. TIVO has: 'TIVO-casts' (video shorts); has also made arrangements with Yahoo for lots of stuff you can only watch on TIVO (sort of reminds me of suped-up FiOS widgets); download (rent/buy) current DVD's from Amazon.com 'UNBOX' (fast with FiOS). All really neat stuff not available with FiOS alone.

Does the TivoHD display VOD now or will it ever with FIOS?No. Verizon's boxes are the only ones that will ever support VOD.

No. Verizon's boxes are the only ones that will ever support VOD.
"Never" is a long time. Current cablecard technology is one way. VOD requires two-way communications. Nothing can happen until 2-way communications is possible. It's in the works, but I'm not sure once it is released, if there's more work still required or not.

Also, this isn't FIOS specific. I'm not aware of any provider with VOD that cablecard Tivos work with.

"Never" is a long time. Current cablecard technology is one way. VOD requires two-way communications. Nothing can happen until 2-way communications is possible. It's in the works, but I'm not sure once it is released, if there's more work still required or not.

Also, this isn't FIOS specific. I'm not aware of any provider with VOD that cablecard Tivos work with.

There was news a couple of weeks ago about a solution for Tivo to work with systems that use SDV. Would this same tech allow for the 2 way communication needed for on demand and PPV on FIOS?

There was news a couple of weeks ago about a solution for Tivo to work with systems that use SDV. Would this same tech allow for the 2 way communication needed for on demand and PPV on FIOS?
Fios uses IPTV for VOD and PPV which is different from the common approach by cable to use a block of QAM channels for VOD & PPV. For the TivoHD to provide VOD on Fios, it would have to support the IPTV protocol and access the internet data. I don't see that happening, even if the TivoHD has the right hardware.

I'm probably going to get a TivoHD in the next month or two, but I will keep the Fios 6416 DVR for some time after wards for VOD and as a backup to the cable card(s) crapping out. If the monthly rate for the 6416 goes up too much or the 6416 fails, then replace it with the HD STB to maintain VOD capability. Unless they drop the price for the HD STB from current $10/month, this is not a cheap solution to VOD or as a backup to cable cards, but so be it.

Does FIOS use multistream or Singlestream cablecards?

It's a sad state of affairs for FiOS subscribers that with all the new HD channels coming on-line over the next month most of the recent posts are related to HD Tivo or complaints about the new IMG.

It's a sad state of affairs for FiOS subscribers that with all the new HD channels coming on-line over the next month most of the recent posts are related to HD Tivo or complaints about the new IMG.Well, like most cable providers, FiOS doesn't pre-announce new channels months -- or even weeks -- in advance like Dish and DirecTV. Verizon announces when they actually add channels, not the fact that they have an agreement to carry them. FiOS already has agreements in place for most of the new HD channels, so it is a matter of installing and configuring the equipment to make them available.

Until Verizon adds new channels, there won't be much programming news to discuss. That can be a good or bad thing, depending on your view. DirecTV has run those "100 HDTV channels" advertisements for almost ten months now, and how many channels have they added in that time? Zero. Of course that will change soon, but many members on this forum have hundreds of posts on that topic.

It's a sad state of affairs for FiOS subscribers that with all the new HD channels coming on-line over the next month most of the recent posts are related to HD Tivo or complaints about the new IMG.

I guess also you have to judge what people's tastes are. The guide, while useful is just a tool to get you to where you want to be: watching what you want. Personally, the IMG is fine for me, the more I see of it, the better it looks to me. Does it match the DirectTivos that I had? not yet - but I also am not paying the fee, the expense per DVR (I have 3) and the capacity is the same as I had with my old Tivo boxes. I also wasn't as enamored of the Tivo interface as some, finding it somewhat user friendly but extremely slow. I also had three Tivos die on me, so the luster dimmed a bit.

I'm fine with the FIOS DVR's, when wedded to Logitech remotes, they are very useable for myself, my two teenage girls and my mother in law. My wife still misses Tivo, but she is a technophobe and forgets how much she complained about Tivo.

Would I like three Tivo's if it cost me nothing? Probably not, since the monthly fee would drive me up the wall. The FIOS DVR is good enough, I am looking forward to larger eSATA drives, maybe the native pass thru, but otherwise, the VOD is good, and as long as I can reliably record and the response time is quick, I don't need to spend $2700.

:mad: Well, I have had it with this new software!

I have 2 HD DVRs and 1 SD stb. one of the DVRs and the SD stb have continued to have lockups and random reboots since this new IMG installation. My DVR has hard locked 3 times in the last week missing lots of recordings in the process. I think I am going to switch to TivoHD but maybe not until Jan. I need to call VZ Tech Support and get these boxed replaced I guess. What is the success factor with this? They have already been remotely reset. In fact the SD stb doesn't get half the channels it should since the new IMG. Weird and annoying stuff (esp to the wife!).

Question for those of you in area's that have rolled out the new IMG. Does your fios tv help channel show help tips on the new IMG?
The reason I ask is before i went on vacation about 1 1/2 weeks ago the fios tv help channel had a static message displayed. This message warned about the soon to be released IMG.
Upon my return from vacation I was expecting to have locked up boxes and lost recordings. To my suprise I was still on the old IPG. Sometime good things stay good. Now to add more confusion they have removed
the static message and returned to broadcasting help topics on the DVR with the old IPG.
Has Verizon put a long term stop on the roll out of the new IMG ?

I followed someone's hint and press info, info, delete to delete a program rather than hit stop first. it deleted the program from the list alright, but it did not recover the free space! yikes. with the new software, I'm down to 12 hrs HD as it is. anyone else seeing this? can I fix it with a reset? how do I reset it?

Has Verizon put a long term stop on the roll out of the new IMG ?
A short term stop, apparently yes. The reports are that the roll-outs to the remaining areas: PA, NJ, not sure where else have been delayed until late September or early October. But there are conflicting reports as to when the roll-outs will start up again. Hopefully when they re-start the roll-outs, it will be with a newer build or version with some bug fixes.

I'm also hoping that Verizon is going to use the delay in rolling out the IMG to add some HD channels, but that may be wishful thinking.

with the new software, I'm down to 12 hrs HD as it is. anyone else seeing this? can I fix it with a reset? how do I reset it?
No, you can't fix the reported HD hours remaining. It's a software bug that should have been caught in early beta testing. To reset, turn the DVR off, unplug it, wait 30 seconds, plug it back in.

After several weeks with the new IMG, I've come to the conclusion is that the HD hours remaining is not a fixed number, but calculated based on maximum data rate for HD. I recently recorded over 2 hours of HD programming. The IMG status HD hours remaining dropped from 6 to 5. The current IMG takes away some disk space, but not as much as you would think based on their recorder status report. I hope a future IMG release will restore display of % of recording space used (along with total MB for each program)

Would I like three Tivo's if it cost me nothing? Probably not, since the monthly fee would drive me up the wall. The FIOS DVR is good enough,Huh? The Tivo monthly fees would be about the same as for the Fios DVR: as low as $8.31 (three-year prepaid) for the first one, or $6.95 (multi-system discount) for subsequent ones, plus $5.98 for CableCards -- a total of $14.29 or $12.93 each. If you're lucky enough to get multistream cards, shave $2.99 off ($11.30 or $9.94).

I don't need to spend $2700.What costs $2700? Three Tivos? No, that would be $900 (for Tivo HDs... there's no real reason to get the original S3 now, but even if you did, that would only be $2400 list, and you can get them for much less).

I followed someone's hint and press info, info, delete to delete a program rather than hit stop first. it deleted the program from the list alright, but it did not recover the free space! yikes. with the new software, I'm down to 12 hrs HD as it is. anyone else seeing this? can I fix it with a reset? how do I reset it?
I kept using this method to delete shows also, and couldn't figure out why I had 7 hours of HD recordings and my recording status showed that I had 14 hours recorded. To make it worse, it was deleting my old shows when I recorded new ones. Then I read on DSLReports that using that method of deletion didn't recover the disk space. Rebooting will solve it, then don't use that method anymore.

Do people normally tip the Verizon tech at the initial install, or is it not expected or they aren't allowed to accept tips?
I'm in the middle of my FIOS TV and Internet install now.

Do people normally tip the Verizon tech at the initial install, or is it not expected or they aren't allowed to accept tips?
I'm in the middle of my FIOS TV and Internet nstall now.

I have never heard of that practice.

Do people normally tip the Verizon tech at the initial install, or is it not expected or they aren't allowed to accept tips?
I'm in the middle of my FIOS TV and Internet install now.

I offered. The installer said he wasn't allowed to accept tips.

I kept using this method to delete shows also, and couldn't figure out why I had 7 hours of HD recordings and my recording status showed that I had 14 hours recorded. To make it worse, it was deleting my old shows when I recorded new ones. Then I read on DSLReports that using that method of deletion didn't recover the disk space. Rebooting will solve it, then don't use that method anymore.
The space seems to come back eventually with no manual resetting. At least mine has and I've never reset the box.

A short term stop, apparently yes. The reports are that the roll-outs to the remaining areas: PA, NJ, not sure where else have been delayed until late September or early October. But there are conflicting reports as to when the roll-outs will start up again. Hopefully when they re-start the roll-outs, it will be with a newer build or version with some bug fixes.

I'm also hoping that Verizon is going to use the delay in rolling out the IMG to add some HD channels, but that may be wishful thinking.


The more I read the more I'm convinced that Verizon is holding off on adding new HD channels for the simple reason that they don't want to increase rates. Verizon is in a good position right now to draw away a lot of subscribers from cable or satellite. But if they added a bunch of new HD channels, they'd have to increase their rates and that would probably chase off a lot of potential new customers.

The new HD channels that Directv is adding will ultimately force them to jack up their rates. When that happens, Verizon will be able to add the channels, increase rates a little, and still undercut cable and satellite in many areas.

Furthermore, many of the HD channels that Directv is adding right now are not offering much in HD. Things like CNN and Cartoon network are really pointless in HD at this point. That will change over time, but right now it's just not worth it.

I hope that A&E, TBS, Discovery etc.. are on the top of Verizon's list of HD channels to add. Many of the others I can live without.

Not that anyone really cares but...

Primarily due to the lack of csn hd here in dc if D* does switch to 1920x 1080 I am switching. I am really sad, I was so happy to get Fios but they lied to me and I have waited and waited and waited but I can't risk missing the hockey season in HD this year. I just don't understand how some companies do business.:(

Not that direct tv hasn't lied to me a million times either but sill , I really thought that 19 months would be plenty to give me the channel they promised.

The more I read the more I'm convinced that Verizon is holding off on adding new HD channels for the simple reason that they don't want to increase rates. Verizon is in a good position right now to draw away a lot of subscribers from cable or satellite. But if they added a bunch of new HD channels, they'd have to increase their rates and that would probably chase off a lot of potential new customers.
Almost all of the HD channels that are starting up are HD simulcast of the SD channel. Much of the new programming such as scripted series or programs that have repeat value are now being done in HD. I have not seen any reports that the providers are asking for a rate increase for the HD channel. They may be, but I would think that would have been reported if they were aggressively doing so. Many of them are adding the HD channel because they realize that HD is the future and that the cost of upgrading to HD is part of the cost of staying in business. They may be eating the cost for now. When the contracts are up for renegotiations, I would expect that they will try to jack up the per subscriber fees to cover the HD conversion costs, but the cable net are going to try jack up fees regardless.

There is an over riding consideration in that if Verizon does not add some HD channels to keep the HD gap between them and DirecTV, Dish, and the cable systems with SDV to a modest level, Verizon will quickly begin to see fewer new subscribers added than in their business plan and lose some existing affluent HD subscribers. With the sheer amount of capital outlay that Verizon is putting into Fios, any obvious shortfall in the add rates for subscribers will have a nasty effect on the stock price. With the percentage of households with a HD TV rapidly growing, Verizon can't afford to fall far behind on HD channel capacity. The battle for market share is too intense.

If the anonymous postings on dslreports that claim Verizon Fios is currently close to maxed out for digital QAM capacity in the distribution part from the Super Head Ends to the VHO to the local offices and won't complete the upgrade until 2nd qtr, 2008 are correct, then Verizon Fios is headed for a rough patch. But these are anonymous postings which could be from disgruntled ex-employees no longer in the loop or the competition trying to spread FUD as a viral campaign. We sure as heck see this with the HD-DVD versus Blu-Ray crap.

With respect, I fail to see how Verizon is in a good position right now.

Furthermore, many of the HD channels that Directv is adding right now are not offering much in HD. Things like CNN and Cartoon network are really pointless in HD at this point. That will change over time, but right now it's just not worth it.

I hope that A&E, TBS, Discovery etc.. are on the top of Verizon's list of HD channels to add. Many of the others I can live without.

I'm sorry, but how can you say that CNN and CN are not worthy of HD but TBS is? I'd wager that TBS will have less than 200 hours of HD in its first year, and probably much less. We're talking a handful of baseball games, a couple half-hour original comedies, and a smattering of Warner movies, which are still eratic on TNT three full years since launch.

I just got my FIOS TV connected. Several more channels than I have with Comcast. It's nice to have HDNet and Universal again. Hopefully they do add more channels in the 4th quarter. DirecTV should really be putting pressure on all providers to add more channels once they light up the new HD channels. And hopefully FIOS will rise to the occasion.

sorry guys to have to ask this but I've bee gone a while any body heard if Verizon is going to get any sports pac like N>H>L> Center Ice in the near future,Or whats holding them up on aquiring them

Just got FIOS today, changing from Comcast. We got the HD Motorola DVR box, the same as we had from Comcast. Dropping these in with the same settings and cables... picture is roughly similar on HD channels and MUCH worse on SD. Anybody have any suggestions?

Displays are a BenQ DV3750 and a Panasonic AX100U... I even tried changing the two FIOS DVR boxes that we have and they both suck on SD. Hooked up to my 10 year old Panny CRT, SD looks really good.

I'm sorry, but how can you say that CNN and CN are not worthy of HD but TBS is? I'd wager that TBS will have less than 200 hours of HD in its first year, and probably much less. We're talking a handful of baseball games, a couple half-hour original comedies, and a smattering of Warner movies, which are still eratic on TNT three full years since launch.

Because CNN and CN are offering very limited HD content. TBS "should" offer movies, live sports and some sitcoms in HD. It'll be a lot more HD content than either CNN or CN.

Just got FIOS today, changing from Comcast. We got the HD Motorola DVR box, the same as we had from Comcast. Dropping these in with the same settings and cables... picture is roughly similar on HD channels and MUCH worse on SD. Anybody have any suggestions?How do you outputting your SD channels?

Turn off your box, immediately hit OK to enter the diagnostic menu, turn off the box again, and then immediately hit Menu. Use the buttons on the DVR rather than the remote.

That will get you into the setup screen where you can enable 4:3 override to output SD channels as 480i, bypassing the SD processing in the Motorola box.

I can't figure out how to access recording options on my FIOS DVR. I want to record a football game tomorrow but I want it to stop recording 30 minutes after the normally scheduled time, but I don't see any menu options on how to do that. Can anybody please HELP????

I can't figure out how to access recording options on my FIOS DVR. I want to record a football game tomorrow but I want it to stop recording 30 minutes after the normally scheduled time, but I don't see any menu options on how to do that. Can anybody please HELP????
find show in Guide, hit record, DON'T EXIT, hit INFO with show highlighted in Guide, select RECORD ONCE, a new box opens up, move cursor to the left, select STOP, move cursor down to desired new end time.

ps..i really hate the new GUI.....very non-user friendly IMO

find show in Guide, hit record, DON'T EXIT, hit INFO with show highlighted in Guide, select RECORD ONCE, a new box opens up, move cursor to the left, select STOP, move cursor down to desired new end time.

ps..i really hate the new GUI.....very non-user friendly IMO

Thanks for the tip, but this doesn't work for me.

When I hit INFO, I don't get RECORD ONCE, I get RECORD THIS EPISODE

When I select that, a new box does not open up and there is no end time stuff to select at all

Turn off your box, immediately hit OK to enter the diagnostic menu, turn off the box again, and then immediately hit Menu. Use the buttons on the DVR rather than the remote.

That will get you into the setup screen where you can enable 4:3 override to output SD channels as 480i, bypassing the SD processing in the Motorola box.
The procedure to get the setup menu is different for the 6416s with the new IMG. If it has the IMG software, turn box off, press Select/Ok on the remote, then press Menu. This gets into the HD (16:9) and SD (4:3 Override) setup and closed caption options.

Thanks, guys. this was the first thing that I tried. I have the 4:3 override set to 480i. I've tried HDMI, Component, and SVideo output, and all look pretty lousy... much worse that we had with Comcast. The issues are digital blocking. And, the display looks great on my old Panasonic CRT.

To be fair, I haven't tweaked the picture settings on the projector too much. I'm using the preset "Normal and Natural". I'll get the HDNet test patterns next Saturday AM.

Also, does Verizon rescale all broadcasts to 1080i? It seems like I get better results with 1080i output from the box -- even on channels that broadcast @ 720p (i.e., ABC, ESPN, etc). My projector is 720p.

Thanks again for the help. I want to like FIOS, and I'm puzzled by the issues as all that I've heard are good news.

Thanks again for the help. I want to like FIOS, and I'm puzzled by the issues as all that I've heard are good news.


My brother had the same issue as you and we could never figure it out. Since I have it and talked him into it, I felt responsible so I tried all the obvious things and the not so obvious.
He had a so-so HD and SD picture and I was stuck.
He has minimal patience for trying stuff out and a temper:) so he told Verizon to pull it ALL out.

The odd thing is that at my house (30 miles away so I am sure a different Data Source), I have an HD picture that rivals Blue Ray and a SD picture that is TOP notch.
The Verizon cable package is called 'Howard County and Anne Arundel County digital package" and we both reside in the 2 couties so you would think it would be the same.

Joe

Thanks, guys. this was the first thing that I tried. I have the 4:3 override set to 480i. I've tried HDMI, Component, and SVideo output, and all look pretty lousy... much worse that we had with Comcast. The issues are digital blocking. And, the display looks great on my old Panasonic CRT.
Did you try 4:3 override set to OFF? That by far looks best on my set.

Thanks, guys. this was the first thing that I tried. I have the 4:3 override set to 480i. I've tried HDMI, Component, and SVideo output, and all look pretty lousy... much worse that we had with Comcast. The issues are digital blocking.
If you are getting digital blocking or dropouts, then there is something wrong. If a cold reset of the STB does not fix it (and it probably wont'), call Verizon for tech service. They need to check the signal strength at the STB and check the ONT. Another possibility is a problem at the local central office, but then all the Fios TV subscribers in your area would likely be seeing the dropouts. But persistent blocky dropouts are not normal.

Did you try 4:3 override set to OFF? That by far looks best on my set.

Yes, I tried this also and it was worse. Ironically, this was the best setting with the Comcast Motorola DVR box.

If you are getting digital blocking or dropouts, then there is something wrong. If a cold reset of the STB does not fix it (and it probably wont'), call Verizon for tech service. They need to check the signal strength at the STB and check the ONT. Another possibility is a problem at the local central office, but then all the Fios TV subscribers in your area would likely be seeing the dropouts. But persistent blocky dropouts are not normal.

I wouldn't call it "dropouts", it's more like the picture is very noisy with digitized square blocks. That's what I meant by blocky, sorry if I'm using the wrong term.

What do you mean by ONT?

Thanks.

Ok, I'm watching the Eagles/Packers game on SD on my old Panasonic CRT. There is a ton of noise around the players, especially when they are moving fast. I'll call Verizon, this can't be right.

I wouldn't call it "dropouts", it's more like the picture is very noisy with digitized square blocks. That's what I meant by blocky, sorry if I'm using the wrong term.

What do you mean by ONT?
The digitized square blocks are dropouts or severe pixelization. You should not be seeing those, you need to get Verizon to fix it. ONT = Optical Network Terminal, which is the box Verizon put on your house.

Because CNN and CN are offering very limited HD content. TBS "should" offer movies, live sports and some sitcoms in HD. It'll be a lot more HD content than either CNN or CN.

"Should"? But the evidence is clear that it won't.

CNN has announced that everything from New York will be HD, that most of their CNN specials will be HD, and that the programs originating from Atlanta can still incorporate HD content. CNN is going to have hours worth of new HD every day.

Likewise, there was an article posted a few months ago about CN's preparation for HD, which allegedly spans all the way back to the network's first original animated offerings. Based on that article, I'd wager that CN could be one of the leaders in HD content among new cable networks (albiet animated HD), capable of offering hours of HD itself everyday too.

Then there's TBS. None of its syndicated sitcoms are available in HD except for Seinfeld, The King of Queens, Everybody Loves Raymond, and The Office (which they just picked up for this fall), there's been no announcement that TBS has acquired HD versions of any of them (and it's really only a reasonable bet that they acquired The Office in HD), and even when it does acquire them, Seinfeld is still 4:3 and Raymond and Queens only have part of their runs available in HD anyway.

TBS only runs 3 original programs of its own, and it's not clear that any of them are actually HD (though they should be). Even if they are, none of them have more than a few episodes and won't be running on anything more than a weekly basis, for a staggering 1:30 hours of HD content at most per week, and it's not like these series are set up for substantial runs.

To sum up, TBS's sister network TNT has been on the air for three years, and has a "respectable" (I use that term loosely) amount of HD solely because it drowns the schedule with Law & Order reruns, with a library of over 10 years worth of HD content. TBS has no similar source for "hours" of HD everyday. TBS has a fraction of the original programming of TNT, and most of its programs are only half-hour entries--not full hour entries like TNT. TBS also has but a fraction of the sports coverage, so it will comparatively fall short in that category as well, and in fact if any two baseball games overlap, TBS will be feeding those games away from TBS to TNT anyway. Moreover, as many threads around here have complained, TNT's movie offerings are frequently subpar and inconsistent, at times airing 4:3 stretched versions of movies that have previously aired in HD.

TBS will, for its first year, almost surely manage to outdo A&E as worst HD network available. It's HD highlight is going to be its MLB game of the week starting next season. One game. Per week.

Apologies if this is considered off-topic discussion.

You can't just look at sheer hours of HD content. Even if the only HD content on TBS is a weekly baseball game that is MUCH more compelling than anything CNN (someone sitting behind a desk talking) or CN (drawings) can offer.

You can't just look at sheer hours of HD content. Even if the only HD content on TBS is a weekly baseball game that is MUCH more compelling than anything CNN (someone sitting behind a desk talking) or CN (drawings) can offer.

I'll take CNN in HD with someone behind a desk any day over a baseball game on TBS in HD!

I've noticed today and last night that the SD channels look better than the Comcast SD channels. Obviously they are better than the Comcast analog, but the FIOS SD channels are even better than the Comcast digital ones.(I'm using two TiVo HD boxes for FIOS and three Series 3 TiVos for Comcast. All with cable cards) The HD seems pretty much the same. If FIOS looks better it would only be slightly. But they do offer more HD channels than Comcast. I might transition completely to FIOS sooner than I planned if everything works out ok for the next few weeks.

Does anyone know how to remove channels from the guide that you don't subscribe to? For example I'd like to remove all the foreign language channels.

I searched the thread and noticed a couple of people have called Verizon about this but I didn't see any follow up posts regarding it.

You can't just look at sheer hours of HD content. Even if the only HD content on TBS is a weekly baseball game that is MUCH more compelling than anything CNN (someone sitting behind a desk talking) or CN (drawings) can offer.

What he said. :-)

Look, I don't disagree with the assertion that at some level CNN and CN will have "hours" of HD programming. But someone sitting behind a desk or high def drawings just doesn't do much for me.

TBS baseball, movies, and some sitcoms is far more compelling.

I agree to some extent that baseball and movies are more compelling than news coverage and animation (particularly animation), but TBS's baseball contract is a joke (we're talking, what, 25 games per year starting next year?), and that's the only sports on the TBS schedule for the foreseeable future. Given the downturn in quantity and quality of sitcoms/comedies generally, there's not much coming down the pipe and an overwhelming majority of what's there is not and can never be HD. Plus, TNT's history of movie presentations suggests that TBS is going to be a frustratingly horrible waste of time (with the cropping, the popups, and the meager HD library) with but rare exceptions of quality material.

On balance, no matter how boring Anderson Cooper and his cohort of talking heads are, or how little most animation benefits from an HD presentation, TBS is going to be a wasteland of stretch-o-vision and no payoff anytime soon. Given the climate of "limited bandwidth" that isn't going away (and, if rumors are to be believed, may also impact Verizon periodically as well), TBS is not a channel I want sucking up resources.

Does anyone know how to remove channels from the guide that you don't subscribe to? For example I'd like to remove all the foreign language channels.

I searched the thread and noticed a couple of people have called Verizon about this but I didn't see any follow up posts regarding it.

With the FIOS 2.0 ("upgraded" IMG), there is no way to do it now. I was told VZ knows about it and will address it with an update at some point...I've heard October...I've heard by year end.

With the FIOS 2.0 ("upgraded" IMG), there is no way to do it now. I was told VZ knows about it and will address it with an update at some point...I've heard October...I've heard by year end.

Thanks

Well I'm now a FiOS sub, and i'm glad i switched. SD is soooo much improved over D*. at anyrate, maybe someone can explain something to me. some of my local HD channels are still 4:3, but look MUCH clearer than SD. is this the same thing that ESPN does with their broadcasts that aren't filmed in HD? just uprez, slap some bars on the side and send it out, or what? some programs on the same channels interestingly are full screen. can anyone explain what's going on here?

Well I'm now a FiOS sub, and i'm glad i switched. SD is soooo much improved over D*. at anyrate, maybe someone can explain something to me. some of my local HD channels are still 4:3, but look MUCH clearer than SD. is this the same thing that ESPN does with their broadcasts that aren't filmed in HD? just uprez, slap some bars on the side and send it out, or what? some programs on the same channels interestingly are full screen. can anyone explain what's going on here?For the most part, the locals only have high-definition programming during primetime (8-11pm), plus sporting events on weekends. There are also a few morning and daytime (soap) shows, but 19-20 hours of every day is still SD upconverted to HD with bars on the sides.

Get yourself a DVR and record all the HD shows.

i have the FiOS dvr, i was just wondering what i was seeing. i guess ESPN does the same thing with regard to their bars?

at anyrate, does anyone know what the program listing is for the HDNet test patterns? i tried to search for it in the guide using different keywords i thought might bring it up, but to no avail.

The next scheduled showing of the HDNet test pattern is
Tue., Sept 26 - 6:50 AM ET / 3:50 AM PT

I got the info from HDTV magazine but either the day is wrong or the date. They used to show it every Tuesday at 6:50 AM. I'm going to set up a manual recording for Tuesday the 25th and Wednesday the 26th so I'm covered for each day. One of those recordings should get it.

I noticed that I wanted to record USA network show (Monk) and I selected the show from the guide on channel 500. Set it to record and it comes up with recording analog channel 50! SCIFI channel records on 160 and not 560! Are other people seeing the same? Also noticed that when I set up Favorites, the subscription channels, although marked as favorite, do not display with favorites. I like the faster response to skip but some of the simple programming issues are crazy and I think VZ needs to do some software updates soon.

The next scheduled showing of the HDNet test pattern is
Tue., Sept 26 - 6:50 AM ET / 3:50 AM PT

I got the info from HDTV magazine but either the day is wrong or the date. They used to show it every Tuesday at 6:50 AM. I'm going to set up a manual recording for Tuesday the 25th and Wednesday the 26th so I'm covered for each day. One of those recordings should get it.

how do you know there's incorrect information and why did they stop broadcasting every tues? i guess the showing is only ten minutes long?

I noticed that I wanted to record USA network show (Monk) and I selected the show from the guide on channel 500. Set it to record and it comes up with recording analog channel 50! SCIFI channel records on 160 and not 560!There is no analog channel 50. The high- and low-numbered versions of the channels are completely identical, and entirely digital. In fact, there is only one USA channel and one SciFi channel being sent over Fios, each mapped to two numbers. The high numbers are theoretically there for the sake of the "La Connexion" Spanish-language package, which takes the place of "Fios Premiere" if you have it. But really, they're completely pointless.*

Furthermore, although channels 2-49 are (usually**) delivered in analog versions (and no other channels are), it's impossible to access any of them via Verizon STBs, DVRs, or CableCards -- the 2-49 you'll get there are the digital versions, just mapped to the low numbers.

* The way they'd potentially be useful is, you'd know that you could tune everything in a certain range -- either 50-299 if you were a Fios Premiere subscriber, or 500-599 if you were on La Connexion. Many channels are duplicated in both ranges, but they're mixed in with channels that are only on one package or the other. But with IMG 2.0, it's no longer even possible to deselect one range without deselecting the mirrored channels in the other, so the whole mirror arrangement has lost most of what little usefulness it once had.

** I say "usually" because some of the PEG channels, although in the 2-49 range, are only delivered digitally on my system.

how do you know there's incorrect information and why did they stop broadcasting every tues? i guess the showing is only ten minutes long?


Sept. 26th is a Wednesday. So it's either Tuesday the 25th or Wednesday the 26th. Hopefully the info will show up in the guide data.

Sept. 26th is a Wednesday. So it's either Tuesday the 25th or Wednesday the 26th. Hopefully the info will show up in the guide data.

yep, that would have made a lot of sense had i had a calendar in front of me. i guess the showing is only 10 minutes long? so i'd record from 6:50 to 7:00? i'm still getting used to the DVR so i'll play around with manual recordings.

Furthermore, although channels 2-49 are (usually**) delivered in analog versions (and no other channels are), it's impossible to access any of them via Verizon STBs, DVRs, or CableCards -- the 2-49 you'll get there are the digital versions, just mapped to the low numbers.

** I say "usually" because some of the PEG channels, although in the 2-49 range, are only delivered digitally on my system.

I don't know what you are trying to say here. In No. VA, channels 2-49 are all analog. I can access them with any Verizon STB. I can also access them without an STB (plug the coax from the ONT directly into my TV).

I noticed that I wanted to record USA network show (Monk) and I selected the show from the guide on channel 500. Set it to record and it comes up with recording analog channel 50! SCIFI channel records on 160 and not 560! Are other people seeing the same? Also noticed that when I set up Favorites, the subscription channels, although marked as favorite, do not display with favorites. I like the faster response to skip but some of the simple programming issues are crazy and I think VZ needs to do some software updates soon.

Yes, I've had that problem when trying to record some programs on goltv on channel 444 (the spanish version). It tries to record goltv on 313 (the english version) (even when setting up a manual recording). They thought that it was the dvr defaulting to record the english version but the fact that others have reported similar problems as you, I believe the DVR is defaulting to the lower numbered channel. Last time I spoke to them, they said it is now flagged as a known bug (which wasn't the case when i first called them).

I'm getting FIOS TV on Thursday. One of our TVs is HD and the other SD, so I had them enable the HD channels, and we're getting two DVRs. Are the channels that are available in HD also available in SD, or have a I made a mistake by enabling HD channels? I know I can record SD programming on the DVR attached to the SD TV, but I am concerned that some of the channels won't be available in an SD form if I've opted to enable the HD "package".

I don't know what you are trying to say here. In No. VA, channels 2-49 are all analog. I can access them with any Verizon STB. I can also access them without an STB (plug the coax from the ONT directly into my TV).

Not quite. There are 2 versions of channels 2-49. one set is analog, and one set is digital. When using a VZ STB, they tune into the digital stations. If you connected your Analog TV tuner you would get the analog stations.

It is referred to as a digital simulcast, lots of Cable systems are doing the same thing.

I'm getting FIOS TV on Thursday. One of our TVs is HD and the other SD, so I had them enable the HD channels, and we're getting two DVRs. Are the channels that are available in HD also available in SD, or have a I made a mistake by enabling HD channels? I know I can record SD programming on the DVR attached to the SD TV, but I am concerned that some of the channels won't be available in an SD form if I've opted to enable the HD "package".

Some of the HD channels are HD only (HDnet, Discovery HD Theater, Food HD, HGTV HD etc.) but by getting the HD channels you are not forgoing any SD channels, you will get all the channels in the premier package plus HD plus whatever subscriptions you have.

You want to have HD if one of your TVs can support it, it will offer you more channels.

Some of the HD channels are HD only (HDnet, Discovery HD Theater, Food HD, HGTV HD etc.) but by getting the HD channels you are not forgoing any SD channels, you will get all the channels in the premier package plus HD plus whatever subscriptions you have.

You want to have HD if one of your TVs can support it, it will offer you more channels.

To add to this, I noticed you (mbrodeur) mentioned you are getting 2 DVR's so you're probably already aware that FiOS DVR's are HD.

You probably are also aware that you will be able to view the HD stations on your SD TV, albeit not in HD quality.

I found this out when my 42" plasma died and until it was replaced, I had a little 15" analog TV hooked up the the DVR. Talk about a small picture because the HD channels were all letterboxed. I ended up getting the DVR for my bedroom TV (32") after finding this out.

Yes, I was aware that the DVRs are HD, but I wasn't aware that they would down-convert so that I could watch the HD channels on my SD box. That's a terrific feature, especially if we accidentally record HD content.

Thanks!

Not quite. There are 2 versions of channels 2-49. one set is analog, and one set is digital. When using a VZ STB, they tune into the digital stations. If you connected your Analog TV tuner you would get the analog stations.

It is referred to as a digital simulcast, lots of Cable systems are doing the same thing.

Wow. I didn't know that! I understand the analog version (necessary for people who choose not to have an STB), but why the digital version (unless the STB can't handle the analog one)? Isn't this a waste of bandwidth? I mean, c'mon, don't these channels all have the same source? How much better can the digital version look with the crappy analog source?

Not quite. There are 2 versions of channels 2-49. one set is analog, and one set is digital. When using a VZ STB, they tune into the digital stations. If you connected your Analog TV tuner you would get the analog stations.

It is referred to as a digital simulcast, lots of Cable systems are doing the same thing.

The TiVoHD with cable cards also defaults to the digital version of channels 2-49. Without the cable cards it shows the analog version.
Either way the picture is much better than what i have with Comcast.

Not quite. There are 2 versions of channels 2-49. one set is analog, and one set is digital. When using a VZ STB, they tune into the digital stations. If you connected your Analog TV tuner you would get the analog stations.

It is referred to as a digital simulcast, lots of Cable systems are doing the same thing.

Are you sure about this? I'm new to FIOS since being with D* for seven years, but I don't think this is true. It is a VERY clear picture for being "analog".

BTW, so far I'm loving FIOS more and more!!!!

Wow. I didn't know that! I understand the analog version (necessary for people who choose not to have an STB), but why the digital version (unless the STB can't handle the analog one)? Isn't this a waste of bandwidth? I mean, c'mon, don't these channels all have the same source? How much better can the digital version look with the crappy analog source?1. There are STBs that can't handle analog, and they're cheaper than the ones that can. But I'm not sure whether Fios' STBs are in this category.

2. It looks quite a bit better in some cases (although Fios analog is pretty good). Part of this seems to be because the channels are distributed digitally within the Fios system, and only decoded to analog near the end. (You can tell by the frequent digital artifacts on the analog channels.)

3. The bandwidth for the digitals is very low -- you could fit maybe ten of them into the space of a single analog channel. So it's the analogs they want to get rid of, ultimately.

Are you sure about this? I'm new to FIOS since being with D* for seven years, but I don't think this is true. It is a VERY clear picture for being "analog".

BTW, so far I'm loving FIOS more and more!!!!

It is true around here. I had my FIOS install on saturday. The Technician relayed this info plus the TiVo shows the info. A digital channel is recorded with the cable cards. With out the cable cards an anlalog channel is recorded.
Plus remember the analog channels are only analog from the ONT to your TV. That is part of the reason they look so clean. It is digital on the Fiber until the ONT.

An AP story on a reporters installation: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296407,00.html

- The usual bits of info plus some misinformation.

- Plus -> "If the installers hadn't almost burned my house down, I'd say Verizon's new cable television and high-speed Internet service was fantastic."

1. There are STBs that can't handle analog, and they're cheaper than the ones that can. But I'm not sure whether Fios' STBs are in this category.The FiOS STBs and DVRs are in that category.

The Motorola boxes used by FiOS lack a NTSC tuner, hence they have no means to tune analog channels. The Motorola QIP6416 DVR used by FiOS is essentially the same box as the DCT3416 used by Comcast, except it has an added chip for MoCA (networking over coax).

Every channel you see on the FiOS STBs and DVRs is digital. The only time you ever see the analog channels on FiOS is with a direct connection to a TV, DVD recorder, or other device without a CableCard. CableCards from FiOS remap the digital channels over the analog versions.

The difference between DirecTV SD and FiOS SD quality is the result of higher resolution and bitrate. All DirecTV SD channels are 480x480 with an average bitrate of 2.1-2.3Mbps ABR. All FiOS SD channels are at least 528x480 and many use ~4.0Mbps ABR. Some are even 704x480 or 720x480 @ 6+Mbps ABR. My SD recording of Damages last week on FX was 4.1 Mbps ABR, about twice the bitrate of the same program on DirecTV.

Are you sure about this? I'm new to FIOS since being with D* for seven years, but I don't think this is true. It is a VERY clear picture for being "analog".You seem to be misunderstanding something. What we just said is that any channel you tune through your STB is digital. But if you hook up the cable from the splitter directly to your analog TV, then yes, what you're seeing is analog. You can tell by the fact that it works at all.

And yeah, it looks pretty good. Part of that is that it's turned to analog at a late stage (see above); part of it is that there's very little signal degradation over fiber optics.

You seem to be misunderstanding something. What we just said is that any channel you tune through your STB is digital. But if you hook up the cable from the splitter directly to your analog TV, then yes, what you're seeing is analog. You can tell by the fact that it works at all.

And yeah, it looks pretty good. Part of that is that it's turned to analog at a late stage (see above); part of it is that there's very little signal degradation over fiber optics.

Thanks, but pardon my ignorance on this next question. I was told that the cable from the Verizon center to my house is carrying a "blue light". Is this "blue light" then converted to a digital signal through the box in my house? Meaning, it's not going from blue light to analog?

It goes from "blue light" then converted to digital (on the box on the outside of my house) then the digital signal is sent on the internal house cabling all the way to the STB...such as D*?

BTW, thanks for explaining the other stuff.

Here's a picture with colors. http://www.my-pc-help.com/Articles/Networking/VerizonFIOSExplained/tabid/109/Default.aspx. The "blue" light (1,550 nm) carries your TV data into the house. The "red" light (1,490 nm) carries your phone and internet into the house. Green (1,310 nm) is the return from your house to Verizon (phone and internet). Once it gets to your house, there's a heck of a lot of electronics going on to convert the light into the TV, data, and telephone signals. That magic occurs in the big white box called the ONT (Optical Network Terminal). The TV coax coming out of the ONT has have over 1 GHz bandwidth and contains both the analog and digital channels, which is 100% compatible with a cable TV tuner - except that Verizon encrypts and goes digital for all channels starting at 50 up. You need the STB (Set Top Box) to get anything 50 and above.

For more technical info, here's a FAQ that explains things in more detail: http://fiosfaq.com/index.php?action=cat&catnum=8. A picture of the ONT is here (Question 7): http://fiosfaq.com/content.php?contentid=1

Maybe that's why the light coming out of that van in the TV commercials is white: red + green + blue = white :D

I have Comcast(cable,internet,and phone).I had their cable for at least 7 years.I have every channel,HD,and DVR.Fios has just became available in my town this month.I hear nothing but good things about Fios,that`s why i`m about to drop Comcast and get Fios(cable,internet,and phone).
Is there anything that Comcast does better than Fios?
I`ve been using Comcast(for everything)for so long,it`s going to be hard to change.

Is there anything that Comcast does better than Fios?
I`ve been using Comcast(for everything)for so long,it`s going to be hard to change.
Comcast has a much more extensive VOD library than Fios and HD VOD. Fios does not yet have HD VOD, but is supposed to start to roll out HD VOD later this year. VOD is the one area where Verizon has major catch up to do with Comcast in the area of TV or internet services.

Verizon Fios is rolling out new IMG software for the STB and DVRs. The software is a step back in feature capability and reliability from the older Microsoft software, but I figure Verizon will eventually fix the software with updates. With Verizon, there are no concerns about them implementing Switched Digital Video (SDV) which will mess up TVs or DVRs with cable cards. The new TivoHD is popular with the Fios subscribers for that reason.

I have Comcast(cable,internet,and phone).I had their cable for at least 7 years.I have every channel,HD,and DVR.Fios has just became available in my town this month.I hear nothing but good things about Fios,that`s why i`m about to drop Comcast and get Fios(cable,internet,and phone).
Is there anything that Comcast does better than Fios?
I`ve been using Comcast(for everything)for so long,it`s going to be hard to change.

Depending on where you are, you might get better sports coverage and access with Comcast. in the DC area we get comcast sports net, but not in HD. there's not access to Center ice or NBA league pass or other things Comcast might offer.

that said, you'll be taking a huge step up in picture quality. FiOS delivers the best SD picture and doesn't touch the HD feeds it gets. I picture quality is important to you then I highly recommend FiOS.

I also find the internet to be faster and more reliable than comcast was, which I find to be a huge plus.

Is there an online TV guide for Fios TV yet? Something I can browse while bored at work?

Comcast's TVplanner.net was extremely well designed and I'm going to miss it.

zap2it.com is ok but can be a bit slow to load at times.

Yes, I was aware that the DVRs are HD, but I wasn't aware that they would down-convert so that I could watch the HD channels on my SD box. That's a terrific feature, especially if we accidentally record HD content.You might be mixing 2 different things in your one thought.

HD boxes can output SD. I have my HD DVR connected to my HD TV via HDMI and I have the same HD STB connected to my Slingbox via s-video. I can watch every channel on the Slingbox, including HD channels, though my SB doesn't support HD.

What you can't do (or at least yet), is record something in HD on the HD DVR and watch it remotely through a SD STB if you have the multi-room DVR. If you think you'll want to watch a program you recorded on the HD DVR on a SD STB, you need to record it in SD.

anyone know if there is an overscan problem with the IMG? whenever i pull up the guide, you can only see portions of the top and bottom channel listings. there was never any OS with D* guide, so i'm thinking it's not my tv.

Does anyone know about dates for the IMG rollout in N.Y.? I think we've already missed a few projected dates.

Is this "blue light" then converted to a digital signal through the box in my house? Meaning, it's not going from blue light to analog?The light is converted to an electrical signal at the ONT. Both digital and analog components are present in the signal, whether it's in optical or electrical form. These distinctions are orthogonal.

Is there an online TV guide for Fios TV yet? Something I can browse while bored at work?

Comcast's TVplanner.net was extremely well designed and I'm going to miss it.



try Titantv.com

Does anyone know about dates for the IMG rollout in N.Y.? I think we've already missed a few projected dates.

As far as I am concerned we can keep missing it until they get it right.

Does anyone know about dates for the IMG rollout in N.Y.? I think we've already missed a few projected dates.

I've read on another forum that the remaining markets are being held up while Verizon works out some of the bugs they've encountered.

I'm in Texas and we're apparently now slated to get the new program guide sometime in October - maybe even late October. That was when Verizon was supposed to have an upgrade of the IMG available for everyone.

I suspect Verizon stopped the upgrade before they got to Texas because they've gotten enough complaints about the IMG that they don't want to do anything to hurt their standing in their largest market.

Are there any updates on adding new HD Channels?

try Titantv.com

TitanTV doesn't allow me to select Verizon FiOS for the channel line-up. Just Dish, DirectTV, and Comcass.

Does anyone know about dates for the IMG rollout in N.Y.? I think we've already missed a few projected dates.

trust me, you don't WANT the new IMG, unless you're eager to lose 40-50% of your recording space.

the only improvement I've seen is the skip FF RW buttons are more responsive.

TitanTV doesn't allow me to select Verizon FiOS for the channel line-up. Just Dish, DirectTV, and Comcass.

under change providers you should be able to search based on your state or zip code. I think Verizon uses the same channel lineup everywhere, so if you were to select ma., and then select woburn, Ma. Verizon you should get your lineup.

TitanTV doesn't allow me to select Verizon FiOS for the channel line-up. Just Dish, DirectTV, and Comcass.

Try zap2it.com and tvguide.com

I use both of them and they have the Howard/Anne Arundle line ups.

The light is converted to an electrical signal at the ONT. Both digital and analog components are present in the signal, whether it's in optical or electrical form. These distinctions are orthogonal.

I guess I can't get all the channels through a "QAM" tuner can I? Only local and HD? I hate paying the $10 (STB) for my upstairs HDTV if I can get channels on my tuner.

I guess I can't get all the channels through a "QAM" tuner can I? Only local and HD? I hate paying the $10 (STB) for my upstairs HDTV if I can get channels on my tuner.Aside from the locals, almost every FiOS channel is encrypted, so you need either a Verizon STB/DVR or a TV/STB/DVR supporting CableCards.

If your TV has a CableCard slot, you can get all channels on that TV for $2.99.

I would not get the HD STB for $9.99/mo when the HDTV DVR is available for $12.99/mo. FiOS will soon offer Motorola DCT700 (http://broadband.motorola.com/consumers/products/dct700/) STBs for $1.99/mo, but these do not support HDTV or FiOS' VOD.

JOtteman, JohnGZ28, thanks for the suggestions !

trust me, you don't WANT the new IMG, unless you're eager to lose 40-50% of your recording space.

the only improvement I've seen is the skip FF RW buttons are more responsive.

Yeah, I was told by a high level tech support guy that the N.Y. rollout is now scheduled for sometime in October. He acknowledged there are just too many issues to roll it out yet.

Yeah, I was told by a high level tech support guy that the N.Y. rollout is now scheduled for sometime in October. He acknowledged there are just too many issues to roll it out yet.

I live in Brooklyn and construction started in my building last week. I cannot wait :), goodbye TW.

Yeah, I was told by a high level tech support guy that the N.Y. rollout is now scheduled for sometime in October. He acknowledged there are just too many issues to roll it out yet.

With over 10,000 posts, this lack of access to the culprit (the current IMG) in question must be torture for you. Like missing Christmas. You may never get your hands on it to see how bad it really is. You and a few others are the only ones I hope get to experience it just so you can before it is fixed. I think you could really appreciate both experiences and have fun while doing it! ;)

Here in Philly about a week and a 1/2 ago we got the flyer for the new IMG. I have been following this thread, so I know what to expect.

However, one question someone asked on the last page I read was, "How long after XX does the IMG roll out?"

So, we got the mailing a week and a 1/2 ago (maybe more) and today we got a phone message from verizon on my answering machine. However, we still have the old image? How does it happen? At midnight? In the middle of a show? At 3am?

I don't see any more comments on the new images rolling out in a while, I think because everyone was assuming they were waiting so they could fix some bugs. They did change the date for our update (I think it was August 29th was the original date for us)... and they've waited a whole two weeks, but now it's coming, and I wanted to know how it downloads to the STB.

Thx

Do you see any tech issues in terms of installation. I wish I didn't have to do this but they are dropping the ball. Thanks in advance.:)

Here in Philly about a week and a 1/2 ago we got the flyer for the new IMG. I have been following this thread, so I know what to expect.

However, one question someone asked on the last page I read was, "How long after XX does the IMG roll out?"

So, we got the mailing a week and a 1/2 ago (maybe more) and today we got a phone message from verizon on my answering machine. However, we still have the old image? How does it happen? At midnight? In the middle of a show? At 3am?

I don't see any more comments on the new images rolling out in a while, I think because everyone was assuming they were waiting so they could fix some bugs. They did change the date for our update (I think it was August 29th was the original date for us)... and they've waited a whole two weeks, but now it's coming, and I wanted to know how it downloads to the STB.

Thx

There is no warning. You just wake-up and turn your set on to see a VERY different set-up. For my area, it started in the early morning as far as I could tell and it took many hours for it to totally come online. The reception kept going on/off during this time. They may shorten the software installation time with the improved IMG that is soon to arrive. I hope so for your sake. Good luck.

How do you tell what version you have? I got Fios last weekend and have one of the HD STBs, non DVR.

Whatever my box has seems to work vey well. The only bad thing is that there is only one speed for fast frowarding the On Demand. Although without any HD ON Demand I don't plan on using it.

How do you tell what version you have? I got Fios last weekend and have one of the HD STBs, non DVR.

Whatever my box has seems to work vey well. The only bad thing is that there is only one speed for fast frowarding the On Demand. Although without any HD ON Demand I don't plan on using it.If your guide has different channel genres labeled in different colors, then you have the new guide. The old guide uses one color for all channels.

Also, does Verizon rescale all broadcasts to 1080i? It seems like I get better results with 1080i output from the box -- even on channels that broadcast @ 720p (i.e., ABC, ESPN, etc). My projector is 720p.

Does anybody know the answer to this question? I swear that I'm getting better picture at 1080i even on ABC/ESPN which are broadcast at 720p. Is Verizon broadcasting these at 1080i?

Also, Verizon tech is coming tomorrow to test signals. The installation guy didn't test signals inside the house... he just said that if the DVRs can boot up everything is fine. This didn't seem right to me, but after ~6 hrs the guy wanted to get out of here.

Verizon broadcasts the channels as they receive them. I know National Geographic, ESPN, and ESPN2 are all 720P along with our local ABC station. My picture looks much better when I output the native rate and let my VP50 do the scaling to 1080P.
I have my Verizon STB set at 1080i since it doesn't have a native rate setting since most channels are 1080i. I really won't use the box until they have HD On Demand, and if it's like Comcast it should be 1080i.

sooo...there IS going to be an update for the IMG? what's the planned launch date?

sooo...there IS going to be an update for the IMG? what's the planned launch date?
I've heard late October for bug fixes, but I don't know how accurate that is.

Do you see any tech issues in terms of installation. I wish I didn't have to do this but they are dropping the ball. Thanks in advance.:)

Shouldn't be a problem, I had the internet well before the TV.

I'm on hold with VZ right now to cancel Telephone, Internet, TV and cellular service due to so many issues with the IMG, being told I have to pay for the new remote and having to call every month because they can't seem to get the bundle discount on my account.

They've "dropped the ball" with me in so many ways I'm cancelling everything I have with them. My $300 a month may not effect them much, but it sure will make me feel good to tell them to stuff it!

My soapbox!!

How do you tell what version you have? I got Fios last weekend and have one of the HD STBs, non DVR.

Whatever my box has seems to work vey well. The only bad thing is that there is only one speed for fast frowarding the On Demand. Although without any HD ON Demand I don't plan on using it.

You're in Northern VA as I am, we have the new guide.

Is there an online TV guide for Fios TV yet? Something I can browse while bored at work?

Comcast's TVplanner.net was extremely well designed and I'm going to miss it.
AOL's TV listings asre set by your input zipcode, & allow you to select the available provider, & will give you the Fios Info.....

Also, Verizon tech is coming tomorrow to test signals. The installation guy didn't test signals inside the house... he just said that if the DVRs can boot up everything is fine. This didn't seem right to me, but after ~6 hrs the guy wanted to get out of here.

I am missing something here. What exactly is the problem that the tech needs to resolve? You said the signal is coming in. Also, signal strength at each TV location is one of the first things the installation team does when entering the home.

Does anybody know the answer to this question? I swear that I'm getting better picture at 1080i even on ABC/ESPN which are broadcast at 720p. Is Verizon broadcasting these at 1080i?

Also, Verizon tech is coming tomorrow to test signals. The installation guy didn't test signals inside the house... he just said that if the DVRs can boot up everything is fine. This didn't seem right to me, but after ~6 hrs the guy wanted to get out of here.

Assuming nothing is messing with things, ABC/ESPN at 720p should look better if you leave it at 720p and display it at 720p. If you have a 720p display, you should set your box to output 720p and all stations should look good. If you have a 1080p display (or want to use an external video processor) you're SOL because the FIOS box doesn't give you a pass through option (or a 1080p option).

Comcast has a much more extensive VOD library than Fios and HD VOD. Fios does not yet have HD VOD, but is supposed to start to roll out HD VOD later this year. VOD is the one area where Verizon has major catch up to do with Comcast in the area of TV or internet services.

Verizon Fios is rolling out new IMG software for the STB and DVRs. The software is a step back in feature capability and reliability from the older Microsoft software, but I figure Verizon will eventually fix the software with updates. With Verizon, there are no concerns about them implementing Switched Digital Video (SDV) which will mess up TVs or DVRs with cable cards. The new TivoHD is popular with the Fios subscribers for that reason.

Verizon has HD-VOD, I have seen it at my buddies house, so this isnt a difference between comcast and Verizon, be careful when answering.

Verizon does not have HD Video On Demand in my area, and from what I have seen in the other posts no one else has it, either.

Verizon does not have HD Video On Demand in my area, and from what I have seen in the other posts no one else has it, either.
That is correct, they apparently tested it at some point last year and had issues w/it killing speeds on the customer's internet speeds.

Verizon has HD-VOD, I have seen it at my buddies house, so this isnt a difference between comcast and Verizon, be careful when answering.

No, FiOS does not have HD-VOD. I even called them after I had mine installed and asked them when they were going to get it. They said they are working on it. They also said that HD downloads are hogs.

If he has HD VOD, that is a test market. There is no widely deployed HD VOD yet.

I am missing something here. What exactly is the problem that the tech needs to resolve? You said the signal is coming in. Also, signal strength at each TV location is one of the first things the installation team does when entering the home.

Signal is coming in, but I have tiling... HD is mediocre and SD is actually unwatchable. My tech didn't test signal strength, I asked him but he insisted that the boxes booting up was enough.

We'll see tomorrow. We have a few splitters in lines, I'm pretty sure that is the issue. The tech should have sniffed that out for sure.

I am in Leesburg too. I have had the most crazy billing issues with Verizon, which is no surprise since I am a small buisiness owner and they have been the worst with regard to their service there. It is sad, I was so excited to get fios but they just stopped and let everyone else pass them by. They don't even respond to some of my emails looking for information. Oh well .

Who are you switching to comcast or dbs ?

Signal is coming in, but I have tiling... HD is mediocre and SD is actually unwatchable. My tech didn't test signal strength, I asked him but he insisted that the boxes booting up was enough.

We'll see tomorrow. We have a few splitters in lines, I'm pretty sure that is the issue. The tech should have sniffed that out for sure.

OK. Now I understand. Sounds like you are on the right track. I can't believe the installer didn't check the signal strengths at the beginning of the installation.

Signal is coming in, but I have tiling... HD is mediocre and SD is actually unwatchable. My tech didn't test signal strength, I asked him but he insisted that the boxes booting up was enough.

We'll see tomorrow. We have a few splitters in lines, I'm pretty sure that is the issue. The tech should have sniffed that out for sure.
Call VA FiOS Customer Care at this number (1-877-815-8492). They will help you.

With over 10,000 posts, this lack of access to the culprit (the current IMG) in question must be torture for you. Like missing Christmas. You may never get your hands on it to see how bad it really is. You and a few others are the only ones I hope get to experience it just so you can before it is fixed. I think you could really appreciate both experiences and have fun while doing it! ;)

You're right HILLTOP! When I think back years ago to being one of the first in the N.Y. area to receive OTA HD and the many many issues I had, there is a certain amount of 'fun' in working through this stuff! I can well remember being on the phone with WCBS N.Y. engineering as they threw switches in the control room to try to get their audio to work on my 64" Zenith RP HDTV during their broadcasts. It was literally "OK, can you hear anything now"? Back then they were learning what settings were needed to get everything working on the different HDTVs that were just hitting the street.

Those were the days! :D

a question: which channels are analog? is it everything below 100? below 70?

a question: which channels are analog? is it everything below 100? below 70?

If you have a STB (SD or HD), every channel is digital. If you're not using a STB and run the cable directly to the back of your TV then all the channels you receive are analog (in NoVa it's 1-49).

If you have a STB (SD or HD), every channel is digital. If you're not using a STB and run the cable directly to the back of your TV then all the channels you receive are analog (in NoVa it's 1-49).
We have to be careful about the wording. If you hook the cable to an older SD "cable ready" with an analog NTSC tuner only, then yes, you will only get the analog channels from 2 to 49. If you connect the Fios cable to a newer digital/HD TV with a QAM tuner (without a cablecard) and do a digital QAM channel scan, it will find the local SD and HD broadcast stations and local government access channels at QAM channels starting in the 60s (last time I looked for the Washington Metro area). The HD and SD sub-channels from the local broadcast stations should get mapped to their broadcast channels such as 4-1, 5-1, 7-1, 7-2.

Yea, one drawback to this conversion to digital TV is that there is rarely a simple answer. :D

One thing that should be clearly understood is that Verizon Fios is planning to shut down all analog channels and go entirely digital prior to February 17, 2009. Verizon will be making the cheap Motorola DCT 700 boxes available for subscribers with SD TVs who are not already using digital STBs for a reported monthly charge of $2/month. Based on postings in dslreports, sounds like Verizon will be shutting down the analog channels well before Feb, 2009. I would be curious to know what the percentages are of Fios subscribers who have one or more older TVs hooked up getting only analog channels and the overall percentage of TVs connected to Fios which are getting only the analog channels. Since Fios is a new system, the percentages have to be far less than the typical Comcast or Time Warner system.

We have to be careful about the wording. If you hook the cable to an older SD "cable ready" with an analog NTSC tuner only, then yes, you will only get the analog channels from 2 to 49.
Which is my point of reference. ;) Thanks for the clarification. :D

No, FiOS does not have HD-VOD. I even called them after I had mine installed and asked them when they were going to get it. They said they are working on it. They also said that HD downloads are hogs.


If they comfigure the ONT properly it shouldn't affect any interent download speeds. My ONT iis currently configured for 30mbs download max. Unfortunately I also have the 30mbs tier so if I do an SD VOD demand download it robs me of 4 or 5 mbs of bandwidth. I'm not worried about it now but once they do start offering HD VOD they better up my ONT max bandwidth to 40mbs or higher so I won't take a hit on my internet when using VOD.

If they comfigure the ONT properly it shouldn't affect any interent download speeds. My ONT iis currently configured for 30mbs download max. Unfortunately I also have the 30mbs tier so if I do an SD VOD demand download it robs me of 4 or 5 mbs of bandwidth. I'm not worried about it now but once they do start offering HD VOD they better up my ONT max bandwidth to 40mbs or higher so I won't take a hit on my internet when using VOD.

I also have the 30mbs internet download speed. I understand that they are going to increase that to 50 next year without an increase in price. No reference, just heresay.

I also have the 30mbs internet download speed. I understand that they are going to increase that to 50 next year without an increase in price. No reference, just heresay.
My installer told me the new speeds would start about a month after my install....that was 8 months ago now :)

OK. Now I understand. Sounds like you are on the right track. I can't believe the installer didn't check the signal strengths at the beginning of the installation.

Verizon came today. The ONT was fine, but inside the house all signal levels were horrible, and now are they are good. The issue was a vast array of splitters from a previous homeowner.

Picture quality is better, but honestly, we're still seeing tiling on SD channels and some noise in high contrast areas on HD. We've played with the 4:3 override modes, none are perfect. I'll work with the picture settings to see what can be optimized, but I'm guessing we'll end up going back to Comcast.

Is it possible that we just have a bum FIOS feed in this area (Wilmington, DE)?

Or could it be compatability with our sets (BenQ DV3750, Panasonic AX100U, and old Panasonic CRT)?

Verizon came today. The ONT was fine, but inside the house all signal levels were horrible, and now are they are good. The issue was a vast array of splitters from a previous homeowner.

Picture quality is better, but honestly, we're still seeing tiling on SD channels and some noise in high contrast areas on HD. We've played with the 4:3 override modes, none are perfect. I'll work with the picture settings to see what can be optimized, but I'm guessing we'll end up going back to Comcast.

Is it possible that we just have a bum FIOS feed in this area (Wilmington, DE)?

Or could it be compatability with our sets (BenQ DV3750, Panasonic AX100U, and old Panasonic CRT)?

There is no excuse for what you are experiencing. Don't give up on FiOS. FiOS is not the problem. Your installation man is the problem I would suspect. Call the tech center and ask to speak with a supervisor. You need somebody to come to your house who knows what he is doing. The wiring compatability needs to be inspected from the back of your TV to your STB and all the way to the area center if need be. That is not as hard nor as time consuming as you would expect. You just need to know how to do it. A friend of mine required 3 visits to his house before it was right (HDMI cable problem).

Picture quality is better, but honestly, we're still seeing tiling on SD channels and some noise in high contrast areas on HD.

Just thought that I would pass on that my brother has FIOS Internet and TV put in 6 months ago.
He is in a different county from me that is a 40 minute drive from my place.

Internet was fine but He had a horrible picture on both SD and HD. He called them up and 'read them the riot act' and they spent several days out at his place ands got it fixed.
By horrible, I do not mean that it was unwatchable but in his case, it acted analog - there were 'ghosts' (shady blocky looking areas that moved around) all over the background.

I asled hime what they did and he merely said " Beats me, the darn thing works now is all I know"
He is a bit of a luddite so when it comes to all this high tech stuff, he has ZERO patience.

My message here is to not give up on them until you are happy as there should be no reason why you can not have a perfect picture.

The 'hidden splitter' may be tough to find but they do have all the right tools to find such things. In my brothers case, whataver it was took several days to find.

My installer last week had to test each coax cable that was going to be used across all frequencies that FIOS uses. Then after testing all the data had to be uploaded by connecting to the actiontec router. He said they have to do this at all the installs now and the data has to be uploaded going through the customers router before the leave the install site. I have no complaints since you know that each connection is working properly. My installer was very thorough. My TV picture is easily better than Comcast for all SD content. The only thing still keeping m,e with Comcast is the $30 a month I pay for all the digital channels and HBO and showtime. It's a great deal plus I can't leave before my year is up without incurring an early termination fee. I'm hoping I can at least drop the internet from Comcast(without incurring a fee) since that is around $43 for the 8mbs tier. While FIOS is only $55 for the 30mbs. But either way I don't need both connections unless someone cuts my fiber feed before they bury it.

i know nfl network hd was effected by the fire. i read that all networks effected were back to normal. but i havent seen a single hd program on nflhd. not a commercial a retelvised game or highlights. before the fire i would turn to nflhd and see rebrodcast games in hd. is this a fios problem or nflhd dosent show a lot of hd content?

I am in Leesburg too. I have had the most crazy billing issues with Verizon, which is no surprise since I am a small buisiness owner and they have been the worst with regard to their service there. It is sad, I was so excited to get fios but they just stopped and let everyone else pass them by. They don't even respond to some of my emails looking for information. Oh well .

Who are you switching to comcast or dbs ?

Actually, I'm not switching, I ended up with a female rep with a very sexy voice and she gave me her direct number so that I wouldn't have to go through all the prompts and explain the story every month. I'm a sucker for a nice female voice!!

They are gonna credit my acct (again) for the bundle package, and give me credits for HBO/Max for the next 6 mos.

If I did switch it would have to be with Comcast as I cannot get a sight for the DTV HD satellite nor the Dish. Comcast is such bad news that I'm glad I was able to (possibly) get this resolved with VZ and if I have to talk to this girl every month - so be it!!;):D

Verizon came today. The ONT was fine, but inside the house all signal levels were horrible, and now are they are good. The issue was a vast array of splitters from a previous homeowner.

Picture quality is better, but honestly, we're still seeing tiling on SD channels and some noise in high contrast areas on HD. We've played with the 4:3 override modes, none are perfect. I'll work with the picture settings to see what can be optimized, but I'm guessing we'll end up going back to Comcast.

Is it possible that we just have a bum FIOS feed in this area (Wilmington, DE)?

Or could it be compatability with our sets (BenQ DV3750, Panasonic AX100U, and old Panasonic CRT)?

JackStraw-
Where in Wilmington are you?? I've been seeing the same issues you are describing (noise on the HD channels) since May of this year. It's definitely the same problem. The feed to our area down here from Philly sucks. Not sure if it's our CO (Talleyville) or what....but i've had people to my house (other customers of FIOS TV in other areas) that tell me my PQ is awful compared to theirs.

The picture I have been getting, for the most part, has been good. Although I noticed some noise on ESPN2HD over the weekend. Also many DD5.1 problems during the Steelers/Bills game on CBS, but that seems like it was more of a network TV issue and not Verizon's problem.

The other problem I have: one of my 2 DVR's keeps resetting itself to output 480p - that one I can't figure out!

JackStraw-
Where in Wilmington are you?? I've been seeing the same issues you are describing (noise on the HD channels) since May of this year. It's definitely the same problem. The feed to our area down here from Philly sucks. Not sure if it's our CO (Talleyville) or what....but i've had people to my house (other customers of FIOS TV in other areas) that tell me my PQ is awful compared to theirs.

What does the noise look like? Every channel has some noise in the picture depending on what the source is. Plus with a 1080P TV that can resolve more resolution, it is more noticeable than on a 720P set that can only has half the pixels of a 1080P set. I know my old 57" RP CRT set had a great picture but it could only resolve around 1300 lines out of the 1920 of resolution. So when I went to a 1080P set I was amazed at all the detail I was missing, and since there was more detail I could also see more noise in the picture that couldn't be seen by my set that didn't have the resolution to show it all.

What does the noise look like? Every channel has some noise in the picture depending on what the source is. Plus with a 1080P TV that can resolve more resolution, it is more noticeable than on a 720P set that can only has half the pixels of a 1080P set. I know my old 57" RP CRT set had a great picture but it could only resolve around 1300 lines out of the 1920 of resolution. So when I went to a 1080P set I was amazed at all the detail I was missing, and since there was more detail I could also see more noise in the picture that couldn't be seen by my set that didn't have the resolution to show it all.The processing on some displays also introduce noise into the picture. The image enhancement 'features' on a number of displays is known for that.

For example, if you have a Samsung display with DNIe and dynamic contrast enabled, you'll see far more noise and artifacts than someone who has those two features disabled.

The "noise" I have been seeing is similar to large white blocks that flash on the screen sometimes. I saw this on ESPN2HD over the weekend, and again on ESPNHD during Monday Night Football last night. I am pretty sure it is coming from the Verizon feed, as I have seen this on both my CRT HDTV and my projector. I only started noticing this a couple of weeks ago - although I really wasn't watching much until football season started, so it may have been there longer than that.

our friend Joe Whip, posted the following in his blog:

http://www.tvpredictions.com/2007/09/verizon-should-reveal-hd-plans.html

I'll copy/paste here some information that I believe is very important/interesting:

....
We'll be adding a few more HD channels along with some special interest SD channels this quarter. Beyond that, we're planning a major expansion in our HD, sports and multicultural offerings that will track with the removal of analog content from our system. The rollout of these new offerings will begin next spring.
...

I put my comments in his blog, but is it just me or VZ is pulling a cable co on us with this "removal of analogs" B.S.??? Weren't FIOS supposed to be the undisputed King of available bandwidth?

<<While we believe that HD leadership-in both quality and quantity- is critical to the competitive marketplace, we also recognize that we have to appeal to diverse interests to achieve the targets we've set for ourselves,>>

translation; if you want the new hd channels, go drectv. this is sad.

The link referenced in this post seems to back up our friend Joe Whip...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11540527#post11540527

So, are they saying the elimination of the analog tier is going to start in Spring, 2008? That would be fantastic!! If they use all of the analog QAMs (40) for HD, that could be 80 HD channels. :)

I put my comments in his blog, but is it just me or VZ is pulling a cable co on us with this "removal of analogs" B.S.??? Weren't FIOS supposed to be the undisputed King of available bandwidth?
If the posts at dslpreorts.com are to be believed, Verizon only placed hardware to support 63 digital QAM and 40 analog channels at the VHOs and central offices as they built the system because several years ago they thought 63 QAM channels was enough. At our end, the ONT and STBs support up to at least 135 cable channels or up to 860 MHz. If the 63 QAM channel limit is correct, Verizon left a number of possible channels unpopulated as they could have 85 digital QAM channels sitting above the analog 2 to 49 block. There was a post there that claimed that Verizon was busy expanding the distribution capacity so they would get to a full 135 QAM channel set. To get there, the analog channels have to go. With 135 QAM channels, there is all the bandwidth they need for all the SD and HD channels we are likely to see in the next 4 or 5 years.

But even with less than half of the digital bandwidth used with 63 QAM channels, there should be room available for more HD channels. Unlike cable, VOD and internet are on a separate data path. I think this has come up in this thread before, but each 6 MHz QAM256 channel has a 39.4 MB/sec data rate which is enough for 2 full bandwidth HD channels or 10+ SD channels. That is 630+ SD channels if there was no HD or music channels. Many HD channels are not full bandwidth (Universal HD and HBO I think are the poster children for this), so they could squeeze 2 HD and 2+ SD sub-channels into 1 QAM channel without much problem if they wanted to.

But I don't know if I buy the 63 QAM channel limit. May be that some initial areas were built out to only 63, newer areas have more, and they just have to go back and upgrade some COs and VHOs. I did a QAM scan some months back with several ATSC/QAM tuners to see what would show up. I did not count the total number of QAM channels the scan found as there were 100s of sub-channels shown that the STB could not tune to as they were encrypted. I found some of the unencrypted locals starting at QAM 63. Has anyone done a QAM scan for Fios and added up the total number of digital QAM channels the scan shows? Not the sub-channels you can tune to, but the total number of base QAM channels? Might be interesting to find out the numbers for the different areas.

One comment I should add is that Verizon obviously made a mistake providing any analog channels at all when they started up the service only two plus years ago. By converting to all digital now, they have to be yanking almost new cards and hardware that they just put in. Not a good use of capital spending.

I put my comments in his blog, but is it just me or VZ is pulling a cable co on us with this "removal of analogs" B.S.??? Weren't FIOS supposed to be the undisputed King of available bandwidth?

What would be the use of analog channels, anyway ?

One comment I should add is that Verizon obviously made a mistake providing any analog channels at all when they started up the service only two plus years ago. By converting to all digital now, they have to be yanking almost new cards and hardware that they just put in. Not a good use of capital spending.

And they are going to piss off a lot of people who, when they signed up, did not need an STB to get channels 2-49...

Maybe they will offer those people the SD STB for free (current rate is what, $5 a month)?

I agree, not very good planning by Verizon... I really doubt that not needing an STB for channels 2-49 was a big selling factor with their current (or future) subscriber base. But you know how people are, once they have something, they don't really want to give it back...

The analog channels were provided for those who just want the local service with no cable box. That was a big mistake IMHO and one that is being rectified.

And they are going to piss off a lot of people who, when they signed up, did not need an STB to get channels 2-49...

Maybe they will offer those people the SD STB for free (current rate is what, $5 a month)?

I agree, not very good planning by Verizon... I really doubt that not needing an STB for channels 2-49 was a big selling factor with their current (or future) subscriber base. But you know how people are, once they have something, they don't really want to give it back...

All the cable companies will be removing analog in the next couple of years and the dbs providers have none. Where are the pissed off customers going to go?

For those in Braintree, MA...the Selectmen have set a date for October 9th to discuss the Verizon application for a TV license. Those who are waiting for FIOS TV should go to their meeting in support.

http://www.townonline.com/braintree/homepage/x1941733705
Last paragraph.

All the cable companies will be removing analog in the next couple of years and the dbs providers have none. Where are the pissed off customers going to go?

Well, initially, since Verizon appears to be doing it a bit sooner (starting next spring) than other cable companies, maybe they'll jump with one who still offers them.

On that subject, does Comcast/Cablevision/Cox, etc... still offer the analogs? Do we know their timeline for eliminating them? I don't know.

You have a very good point. Eventually everyone will be SOL.

Don't get me wrong, as far as I'm concerned, I hope Verizon starts today with the elimination process. I only have one TV with a direct connect (no STB) and it is in our guest room so it is hardly ever watched. I would gladly pay the extra $ for an STB if it would mean more HD channels.

And they are going to piss off a lot of people who, when they signed up, did not need an STB to get channels 2-49...

Maybe they will offer those people the SD STB for free (current rate is what, $5 a month)?

I agree, not very good planning by Verizon... I really doubt that not needing an STB for channels 2-49 was a big selling factor with their current (or future) subscriber base. But you know how people are, once they have something, they don't really want to give it back...

I thought I read that Verizon will soon be offering a smaller Digital Only STB (DCT-700) for $1.99 a month.

In my area, Vz only has 9 analog channels, 6 locals, TV Guide, Weatherscan and WGN.

On that subject, does Comcast/Cablevision/Cox, etc... still offer the analogs? Do we know their timeline for eliminating them? I don't know.


Comcast eliminated most of the analog channels in Chicago. In Baltimore they have eliminated some over the last couple of years and we are down to 71 from about 80. Recently they gave out digital boxes with no monthly fee for a year, probably to ween people off of analog (and make more money off of them later).

Verizon should not have started out with so many analog channels. How many FiOS customers sign up just for those anyway?

Woohoo! Im having my FIOS package (internet, tv and phone) installed on 10/27....cant wait!

Ill be using 4 cable cards total (Tivo series 3 and Tivo HD).

Welcome to FiOS!

Who was your previous provider?

Welcome to FiOS!

Who was your previous provider?

Time Warner Cable....I had Dish before them.

Verizon should not have started out with so many analog channels. How many FiOS customers sign up just for those anyway?
It would be interesting to learn how many basic subscribers Verizon has who have only signed up for the analog channels. Not that many I would think, given that this is a new service which will get a high percentage of technology oriented customers. However, there are probably a number of subscribers who have a old analog TV in the kitchen, bedroom, garage, bathroom hooked up directly to get the analog channels who are not paying anything extra for that connection. Some of these will balk at having to get the Motorola DCT 700 for $2/month. If I were Verizon, I would tell the CSRs that if the customer seems to be overly upset to offer the DCT 700 for 6 months for free and to deliver it or drop it off for no charge. More important to go ahead and kill the analog channels ASAP.

Checking the Washington Metro line-up, I count around 18 common analog channels and then anywhere from 3 to 10 PEG (Public/Education/Government) channels depending on the county or city.

Verizon came today. The ONT was fine, but inside the house all signal levels were horrible, and now are they are good. The issue was a vast array of splitters from a previous homeowner.

Picture quality is better, but honestly, we're still seeing tiling on SD channels and some noise in high contrast areas on HD. We've played with the 4:3 override modes, none are perfect. I'll work with the picture settings to see what can be optimized, but I'm guessing we'll end up going back to Comcast.

Is it possible that we just have a bum FIOS feed in this area (Wilmington, DE)?

Or could it be compatability with our sets (BenQ DV3750, Panasonic AX100U, and old Panasonic CRT)?

I had a similar problem when FIOS was first installed. After multiple visits and "testing" the lines (and we were told the signal was fine?), a really good tech finally came out. When he tested the signal strength at each box, he found two which were way below the others (who knows what the other techs were looking at). He had to run new cable through our attic from their hub to the boxes (one HD), and it was good from then on. He said FIOS uses a newer type of coax which works better. Running the new cable is supposed to be an extra charge, but when the reception is poor, they'll do it for free.

Yes. FiOS works best with RG6 coax. If the wiring in your house is older, it's probably RG59, which can be insufficient for higher-bandwidth services like HD, particularly if you've split it a bunch. I guess I was lucky and had a good tech who reran the wire where there was a problem for me (also free of charge).

For Philly area users, the FiOS Tutorial channel 111 just switched over to a graphic saying the new FiOS Guide is here. I assume that means we are about to get the upgrade.

Yes. FiOS works best with RG6 coax. If the wiring in your house is older, it's probably RG59, which can be insufficient for higher-bandwidth services like HD, particularly if you've split it a bunch. I guess I was lucky and had a good tech who reran the wire where there was a problem for me (also free of charge).

I brought this up with the tech during our second round... he said that all of the cable is RG6. But, I just inspected a little more carefully and I think he's wrong. The trick is that the main run coming into our house isn't labeled on the jacket. Is there a surefire way to tell? It looks skinnier than the new stuff to me, but it might be just skinny RG6 I guess (?).

Anyway, I have another Verizon tech coming this Saturday (this makes three in a row). The last one told me that he is supposed to bill for replacing cable -- this is not what I was told when I processed my order so I guess I can fight that battle.

My wife thinks I'm crazy... she wants to just convert back to Comcast.

For Philly area users, the FiOS Tutorial channel 111 just switched over to a graphic saying the new FiOS Guide is here. I assume that means we are about to get the upgrade.

Here in Bensalem (outside of philly's ne), We've had the graphic for over a week, got the mailer 3 weeks ago, and I even got a phone call on Friday from verizon that said to expect the upgraded IMG.

Yep, still waiting. I know that the box will reboot and reboot, I just wonder what TIME OF DAY this will happen.

I brought this up with the tech during our second round... he said that all of the cable is RG6. But, I just inspected a little more carefully and I think he's wrong. The trick is that the main run coming into our house isn't labeled on the jacket. Is there a surefire way to tell? It looks skinnier than the new stuff to me, but it might be just skinny RG6 I guess (?).

Anyway, I have another Verizon tech coming this Saturday (this makes three in a row). The last one told me that he is supposed to bill for replacing cable -- this is not what I was told when I processed my order so I guess I can fight that battle.
My wife thinks I'm crazy... she wants to just convert back to Comcast.

Be careful - I've learned Verizon changes their "promises" frequently and it really depends on who you talk to that determines if (and how much) you'll be charged for something. They will say whoever told you was wrong.

I was advised by the installer when I first got the service and was given the Scietifica Atlanta remotes that when the new remotes came out I could exchange them, now verizon is advising I have to pay for them. I've even been advsied three different prices by four different reps. I've tried speaking to a supervisor, however, supposedly they don't exist and if the rep transfers you to someone you mysteriously and mistakenly get cut off.

i'm trying to setup a recording for the HDNet test patterns. someone said it's scheduled to run on 9/25 or 9/26. HDNet's website isn't showing anything on it's schedule and i can't find anything by keyword search in the guide (i tried "calibrate" "test patterns" etc...) how does one find and schedule the recording?

I brought this up with the tech during our second round... he said that all of the cable is RG6. But, I just inspected a little more carefully and I think he's wrong. The trick is that the main run coming into our house isn't labeled on the jacket. Is there a surefire way to tell? It looks skinnier than the new stuff to me, but it might be just skinny RG6 I guess (?).

The main line coming into the ONT? It would have to be RG6, since it had to have been laid by Verizon.

But yes, RG6 is somewhat thicker than RG59.

i'm trying to setup a recording for the HDNet test patterns. someone said it's scheduled to run on 9/25 or 9/26. HDNet's website isn't showing anything on it's schedule and i can't find anything by keyword search in the guide (i tried "calibrate" "test patterns" etc...) how does one find and schedule the recording?

did you search for just 'test'

did you search for just 'test'


yeah, ass you type, it automatically finds the closest match to what you have typed in at the time. in the process of typing "test pattern" the matches that relate to "test" show up

I brought this up with the tech during our second round... he said that all of the cable is RG6. But, I just inspected a little more carefully and I think he's wrong. The trick is that the main run coming into our house isn't labeled on the jacket. Is there a surefire way to tell? It looks skinnier than the new stuff to me, but it might be just skinny RG6 I guess (?).

Anyway, I have another Verizon tech coming this Saturday (this makes three in a row). The last one told me that he is supposed to bill for replacing cable -- this is not what I was told when I processed my order so I guess I can fight that battle.

My wife thinks I'm crazy... she wants to just convert back to Comcast.


I am in N. Texas and the new cable is in a white jacket and it is thicker and stiffer, can't bend it very easily, than the old one we had. We still had the old A/B double black coated cable in our house from Comcast, so he replaced that with the one white cable.

If it's any consolation, it took a while to get it all working well, but was worth the effort for the better tv reception and stable internet connection we finally achieved.

Hey bronowyn, I'm in Bensalem too. Are you having any problems with the audio/video being out of sync on NBC HD (channel 810). I've been having the problem alot. It's also on TNT, but I know that's been a problem for a long time with that station.

I have FIOS TV and have been having problems with the NBC HD channel (810). The audio/video is constantly out of sync. This is very frustrating knowing that the new TV season is starting up. Is anyone else having this problem? I live in Bensalem, PA (Bucks County). I'm using the DVR and it's connected to my Pioneer 5070 HDTV via component cables. I've tried using a HDMI cable but that didn't make a difference. (I stayed with component because it takes less time for the TV to change between HD & SD channels) I've seen this problem happen on TNT HD and on the MTV HD channel as well. I know TNT has always been a problem with the station, but I was just wondering if these other stations are just as bad.

Merged topics.

Here in Bensalem (outside of philly's ne), We've had the graphic for over a week, got the mailer 3 weeks ago, and I even got a phone call on Friday from verizon that said to expect the upgraded IMG.

Yep, still waiting. I know that the box will reboot and reboot, I just wonder what TIME OF DAY this will happen.

based on my experience I'm GUESSING you'll get the download around 3-4 AM.

you'll also see the MESSAGE LED in your STB display is lit.

The main line coming into the ONT? It would have to be RG6, since it had to have been laid by Verizon.

But yes, RG6 is somewhat thicker than RG59.

No, our ONT is outside, the main cable that I was referring to runs into the house to the splitter. I suspect that is RG59, and the source of our issues.

Be careful - I've learned Verizon changes their "promises" frequently and it really depends on who you talk to that determines if (and how much) you'll be charged for something. They will say whoever told you was wrong.

I was advised by the installer when I first got the service and was given the Scietifica Atlanta remotes that when the new remotes came out I could exchange them, now verizon is advising I have to pay for them. I've even been advsied three different prices by four different reps. I've tried speaking to a supervisor, however, supposedly they don't exist and if the rep transfers you to someone you mysteriously and mistakenly get cut off.

Wow. I just called Verizon billing and they confirmed that absolutely, positively, I will not be charged for upgrading old coax cable. We'll see whether that fixes the issue on Saturday AM.

No, our ONT is outside, the main cable that I was referring to runs into the house to the splitter. I suspect that is RG59, and the source of our issues.

Verizon reused existing Cablevision wire coming into my house, and I'm also having problems, particularly with SD programming, but also some HD programming. jack_straw - I'd be interested to know if changing out the wires resolves your issues.

i'm trying to setup a recording for the HDNet test patterns. someone said it's scheduled to run on 9/25 or 9/26. HDNet's website isn't showing anything on it's schedule and i can't find anything by keyword search in the guide (i tried "calibrate" "test patterns" etc...) how does one find and schedule the recording?They're on my DVR as "Off Air" - no programming information is available at this time due to scheduled transmitter maintenance. However, I just did a guide quick search and they are nowhere to be found. Gone. Bummer. Good thing I didn't erase them.

They're on my DVR as "Off Air" - no programming information is available at this time due to scheduled transmitter maintenance. However, I just did a guide quick search and they are nowhere to be found. Gone. Bummer. Good thing I didn't erase them.

Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
The next scheduled showing of the HDNet test pattern is
Tue., Sept 26 - 6:50 AM ET / 3:50 AM PT

I got the info from HDTV magazine but either the day is wrong or the date. They used to show it every Tuesday at 6:50 AM. I'm going to set up a manual recording for Tuesday the 25th and Wednesday the 26th so I'm covered for each day. One of those recordings should get it.

another poster said this about 4 pages back, but i don't know how i can record it if it's off air. how does one setup a manual recording? anyone think they may throw it in at the beginning of the off air content? it runs for about 10 minutes, right?

Is it possible to archive unencrypted content from FiosTV to PC with a firewire connection from the Moto box, like I can do now with Comcast? I heard some of you guys comparing OTA vs. FiosTV bitrates, and I assume you do it this way.