Verizon FiOS HDTV [Text View] - Page 37

michelliot

01-08-09, 12:28 PM

HNY People,

I recently joined Fios and purchased a 32" XBR6. Stunning picture in Hi Def, soft standard def picture, but that seems to be a known issue with fios these days.

My issue is that when viewing hi def channels, there is a spit second pause, hesitation or jitter about every 30 seconds or so. It's only visible sometimes while watching a show, because most of the time there is motion on the screen already. It's when watching the credits of a movie that it really becomes apparent due to the steady vertical panning of the names etc. I've changed the wires and plugged the TV directly into the wall to no avail.

Some interesting points though. The hesitations occur when watching live shows. While watching a recorded show and playing it over and over again, the pauses do not occur at the same moment on the recording every time I view it. So it's not the signal into the dvr or the playing of the recorded material. This led me to believe it might be the monitor. HOWEVER,

If I set the DVR to output at 920 or 480 instead of 1080, I don't see any of these pauses. Also, if I play a Hi Def DVD at 1080 (directly to the TV), I don't see them as well. If I watch the same movie at the same time on live Hi and standard definition channels, I only see the pauses on the Hi def channel.

If any of you are still with me, I realize this is a toughy. It's more of an annoyance than a major issue, but I'm fanatical about these things and it does bother me. Ever heard of this issue or if you have any suggestions, I'd appreciate them.

Many thanks and have a healthy new year,

elliot

bull3964

01-08-09, 01:04 PM

Going forward, Verizon will not support tru2way devices, which will also use CableCARD's.

They do plan on using VueKey to support IPTV, which is also compatable with CableCARD.

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=166756&site=cdn

EchoStar just showed off a brand new tru2way DVR at CES today.

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/marketwire/0464494.htm

1TB, integrated slingbox, all kinds of goodies powered by the same software that powers their much loved Dish HD-DVRs.

I wonder if they would consider making a VueKey version. I also wonder if Verizon would consider opening up talks with EchoStar to be a new equipment provider to Verizon, getting rid of the nasty moto boxes.

I'm starting to get worried that we may end up seeing a ton of cool tru2way products and by having Verizon snub the platform, we may be locked out of a lot of nice hardware.

ksoza

01-08-09, 01:06 PM

Just had FIOS triple installed - very happy so far. Install went good (6 hours), technician very professional and un-Comcast like (ex. showed up when he said he would).

Was given 6416's and Tech said too many issues with 72XX right now. Have one 6400 not seeming to output through SPDIF, but will swap out another box from upstairs to see if it is the box or my A/V connection somehow happened to fail when removing the old Comcast STB.

Internet was flawless and getting 20/5 as advertised, double what I got from Comcast. Home Media DVR remote access seems pretty cool and overall beats the Comcast SA boxes i had.

I noticed that the latest local FIOS offer now is for a free DVR for six months and first months free. Anyone have any luck getting that if install came after that offer start but actual order date was a week or so before offer?

JayMan007

01-08-09, 01:50 PM

URFloorMatt was being sarcastic.

As for the +500 rule, Verizon is breaking it for the formerly(?) extra cost sports package channels and HBO. Don't know why Verizon didn't stick with their structure and stick Tennis Channel at 803, Outdoor 2 HD at 807, and so on. With the Extreme HD package, Verizon has moved away from the Sports package pricing, but it is still not that hard to find the HD sports channels if they are in 2 groupings.

Don't forget Disney HD (780) & Toon Disney HD (781), with the +500 Rule, they should have been at 750 & 751.

HBO-HD isn't at 900 because thats where ONDemand is. Many people had fliers showing VOD at 999. I thought that Vz would have moved it after everyone received the last realignment/additions.

I actually like the HD sports being grouped together... maybe they will ... nah.

Ron2

01-08-09, 02:21 PM

URFloorMatt was being sarcastic.

As for the +500 rule, Verizon is breaking it for the formerly(?) extra cost sports package channels and HBO. Don't know why Verizon didn't stick with their structure and stick Tennis Channel at 803, Outdoor 2 HD at 807, and so on. With the Extreme HD package, Verizon has moved away from the Sports package pricing, but it is still not that hard to find the HD sports channels if they are in 2 groupings.

OH, Floormat was just funning. I'm going to use my pull ( I am the 3rd shift mensroom attendent at Vzs. HQ, and I know people.) They have promised that His VHO will be the last to receive any and all channel updates. Mess with me, will ya?

Jim Hef

01-08-09, 02:44 PM

...If I set the DVR to output at 720 or 480 instead of 1080, I don't see any of these pauses. Also, if I play a Hi Def DVD at 1080 (directly to the TV), I don't see them as well....
I would suspect the DVR box. Call Verizon and tell them this is happening, and that you are getting a soft SD picture. That shouldn't be the case, but it really depends on how you are expecting to view those channels. On a smaller LCD such as yours, you should be getting a decent picture, even on SD channels. Do you have the 4:3 set to Off?

bfdtv

01-08-09, 03:06 PM

EchoStar just showed off a brand new tru2way DVR at CES today.

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/marketwire/0464494.htm

1TB, integrated slingbox, all kinds of goodies powered by the same software that powers their much loved Dish HD-DVRs.The ViP922 is a satellite only DVR.

Dish Network said today that they would announce a True2Way version of the ViP922 DVR hardware next spring. In simplest terms, True2Way extends current CableCard functionality through the use of a bidirectional receiver and JavaVM to run a Java version of the cable company's own STB and DVR software. This allows True2Way boxes to offer the cable company's interface with direct support for their specific implementations of [QAM] SDV, VOD, PPV, and guide data.

It's not clear what software the True2Way version of the hardware would use. All True2Way boxes demonstrated before today use the cable company's own STB/DVR software. Echostar could do what TiVo plans to do, which is to run the cable company's True2Way software in the background, and run their own UI on top. In theory, the user might only see the cable company's interface for VOD.

Verizon doesn't use QAM to deliver any of those services, so True2Way isn't really applicable to them. Verizon wants to use the same CableCard platform, but with hooks to deliver services like VOD, PPV, and guide information using IP rather than QAM. They refer to this as VueKey.

michelliot

01-08-09, 03:50 PM

I would suspect the DVR box. Call Verizon and tell them this is happening, and that you are getting a soft SD picture. That shouldn't be the case, but it really depends on how you are expecting to view those channels. On a smaller LCD such as yours, you should be getting a decent picture, even on SD channels. Do you have the 4:3 set to Off?

Hi Jim,

Actually, I had a tech come by for the softness problem a few weeks back. He said it looked fine but I should call Sony to see if there's a setting to change and make it better. Why even say to call Sony.

It doesn't look fine. I'll have to recall and have this skip/pausing problem analyzed physically.

Thanks for your response,
elliot

ridgefamus

01-08-09, 06:50 PM

The Motorola HD-DVR is $15.99/mo.

The same Motorola HD-DVR with multi-room functionality enabled is $19.99/mo. Multi-room allows you to access SD recordings on SD STBs and HD recordings on HD STBs anywhere in your home.

There's no upfront cost to pay for the box, and if it goes bad, Verizon replaces it at no charge.

You can also watch recorded SD programs on an HD (QIP6200-2) STB. Control over the DVR from a remote box is something Verizon needs to improve.

coyoteaz

01-08-09, 07:31 PM

I noticed that the latest local FIOS offer now is for a free DVR for six months and first months free. Anyone have any luck getting that if install came after that offer start but actual order date was a week or so before offer?
If it's not on the install order, you're out of luck. They can't go back and put something in after the install is done. You might be able to get some sort of credit, but they can't give you the deal since it can only be applied to new accounts (or so I was told by a sales supervisor).

sansri88

01-08-09, 08:10 PM

I just had to mention this here...anybody that lives in Woodbridge Township, in NJ, do check the availability status at your address. Verizon announced that it was finally offering service in our town last month, so it's only a matter of time till they wire us all!

bull3964

01-08-09, 08:35 PM

The ViP922 is a satellite only DVR.

Dish Network said today that they would announce a True2Way version of the ViP922 DVR hardware next spring. In simplest terms, True2Way extends current CableCard functionality through the use of a bidirectional receiver and JavaVM to run a Java version of the cable company's own STB and DVR software. This allows True2Way boxes to offer the cable company's interface with direct support for their specific implementations of [QAM] SDV, VOD, PPV, and guide data.

It's not clear what software the True2Way version of the hardware would use. All True2Way boxes demonstrated before today use the cable company's own STB/DVR software. Echostar could do what TiVo plans to do, which is to run the cable company's True2Way software in the background, and run their own UI on top. In theory, the user might only see the cable company's interface for VOD.

Verizon doesn't use QAM to deliver any of those services, so True2Way isn't really applicable to them. Verizon wants to use the same CableCard platform, but with hooks to deliver services like VOD, PPV, and guide information using IP rather than QAM. They refer to this as VueKey.

All that goes without saying.

My point is, Verizon could very well contract EchoStar to build a version of this box that's fully compatible with FIOS tv service, VOD and all using VueKey. Honestly, I don't see why they couldn't build both platforms into the same device if they thought there was demand for it. If not, it seems both Dish Network and tru2way supporting cable companies are going to have a vastly superior hardware and software platform to run their services off of. If we are all still staring at the Fisher Price looking Motorola QIP 7xxx boxes with a 4:3 low resolution guide in 2 years time (without even mentioning the atrocious FYI guide data), FIOS isn't going to look quite as good as the alternatives out there.

Verizon was able to get a nice lead over the cable companies in content offering. But if they don't keep up in the hardware department, that lead is going to get whittled away bit by bit as cable cos upgrade their infrastructure and expand their offerings.

I swore I would never go back to comcast, but if they are able to match Verizon content-wise and I would be able to use a piece of hardware as sweet as the tru2way 922, I would seriously consider backtracking on my promise.

I guess the other real question is, would you be able to turn off the tru2way aspect of this box and just use it as a cablecard DVR like the current TiVos? I'm betting not since I'm assuming that all the guide data is coming through on the tru2way platform from the provider and being reformatted for display in their custom UI. We'll just have to see. All I know is I want that damn thing under my TV like yesterday. It's about time we get hardware that fully takes advantage of the technology we have available to us today.

URFloorMatt

01-08-09, 08:42 PM

ksoza

01-08-09, 08:51 PM

Are there any issues with the SPDIF output on a 6200 or 6416? When I swapped out the comast box (Pace) and put in the Moto, no digital audio from SPDIF or optical usinmg the exact same connection. analog audio out is okay - tried two boxes. Connection is to a B&K AV 507 and the only thing changed was the STB boxes.

riffjim4069

01-08-09, 09:19 PM

How much is that true2way ViP 922 DVR going to cost? My guess is a small fortune.

Think of it this way. If Verizon is transitioning the 72xx into its default STB, it's just a matter of time before there's an upgraded option for heavy/power users. Cable won't be offering an HD DVR as the default STB for a decade or more. Most Comcast users are still stuck with that POS Scientific Atlanta behemoth that looks like it was designed in 1985 and utilizes a UI that makes Windows 3.1 seem forward looking.I think EchoStar is only going to market their tru2way 922 (assuming they can crack the Cable Cartel) to Cable MSOs. Personally, I hope they release a digital cable ready version of the DTVPal DVR for direct-to-consumer sales. To be honest, EchoStar probably has a better shot of breaking into the cable set-top-market by sucking up their bottom line and making a version to run on FiOS. While they may indeed make the best HD DVR in the business, they still need to get a foot in the door of the cable/telco market.

Additionally, they should probably place their cable products under the Sling brand because I doubt anyone in the cable industry is wanting to deploy a set-top-box with thename EchoStar or Dish Network on it.

bull3964

01-08-09, 09:41 PM

Most Comcast users are still stuck with that POS Scientific Atlanta behemoth that looks like it was designed in 1985 and utilizes a UI that makes Windows 3.1 seem forward looking.

The box that Verizon put in pace of my Comcast HD-DVR is exactly the same externally. I know the hardware is a bit different inside due to the all digital nature and the IP capabilities, but it's still an eyesore. I don't know why Moto didn't use the newer shell that they have on the DCH boxes rather than the REALLY outdated looking DCT boxes since I've heard that they are more like DCH boxes internally.

The verizon UI is much better, but it still barely outpaces what my ReplayTV could do over 6 years ago now.

Also, if you add up what that Echostar box can do, it's easily worth as much as what it would cost to build a HTPC.

We are all being held prisoner by Motorola and I really would like to see more competition in this space.

Also, on a "upgraded" version from Verizon. How much is THAT one going to cost a month? They already charge $19.95 for their top version. I can't imagine paying more than that per month for a DVR. In fact, that $20 price is a prime reason why I'm thinking of moving to TiVo when my freebe expires. Sure I'll be spending just about that much a month for a TiVo and be out the upfront cost, but it's a much nicer device all the way around.

URFloorMatt

01-08-09, 10:56 PM

Not what I meant. Originally, a lot of people said all the HD channels appeared at SD Channel + 500.

Turns out that's not true for a few HD channels: Disney HD, Toon Disney HD, Tennis HD, Mav TV HD, World Fishing Network HD, Outdoor Channel HD, and maybe one other. And given that Golf SD appears at 308 or something, probably not going to apply to Golf HD when it's finally added.

jeepmatt

01-09-09, 06:26 AM

And given that Golf SD appears at 308 or something, probably not going to apply to Golf HD when it's finally added.

You're correct Matt - Golf HD will be at 593.

Jim Hef

01-09-09, 10:58 AM

Are there any issues with the SPDIF output on a 6200 or 6416?....
I run optical out to my receiver, and have no problems with that. You may have a bad box, or your receiver isn't configured correctly.

ksoza

01-09-09, 11:24 AM

I run optical out to my receiver, and have no problems with that. You may have a bad box, or your receiver isn't configured correctly.

Jim,

Thanks for the reply - what throws me off is that nothing on the receiver was changed - the old Comcast box was simply unplugged (including the SPDIF connection) and the new Verizon Moto box installed and same existing cables plugged in (same SPDIF cable, unmoved from receiver end). When selecting that same input, great HD picture, no sound. Selecting an input which uses the analog audio out of STB, sound is okay. Stumped as to what would have changed in the digital stream sent out from Moto box from the Comcast Pace box- tried two boxes of the three Moto's I have, so assume not a bad box.

Jim Hef

01-09-09, 12:15 PM

I forget the setup menus, but is there one that you need to activate to have the optical output such as a Dolby Digital setting? With all the equipment, I forget which is which for each one. Does sound strange though that the same configuration doesn't work now.

ksoza

01-09-09, 12:56 PM

Does sound strange though that the same configuration doesn't work now.

I get no sound at all. I did not find any setup menus aside from the FIOS one on the unit that only shows selecting mono, stereo or surround. Tried all three.

Is there a way to hook up a DVR without the cable connection? One thought is to re-hook up one of the Comcast DVR's (SA8300HD) before I return it and try and play something through the SPIDF or Optical, but do not know Comcast or the unit it requires a working cable connection before allowing DVR play back?

GeekGirl

01-09-09, 08:34 PM

All 3 outputs should be active simultaneously (analog, optical, coaxial digital).

Do you have a PC? Maybe you have an audio card with an S/PDIF output, like the Sounblaster X-Fi. Run a cable from there to your receiver.

Try another cable. It's phono to phono, so just about anything will work. Like one of the component video cables - pick R, G, or B. I use RG-59 with soldered phono plugs, but that's me. Overkill whenever you can.

(Running optical now, but I used the RG-59 when I was on coaxial digital).

ksoza

01-09-09, 09:31 PM

Geekgirl,

I hooked up my DVD player from its S/PDIF out into the same input as the cable box on the receiver and it worked. I then hooked up the cable SPDIF out to the DVD input and it did not have audio (after selecting the DVD input). The cable box is obviously not outputting S/PDIF from either coaxial or optical (both of my new boxes).

I brought up the diagnostic menu and under d10 (audio/video) the first listing says S/PDIF and it is set to N/A. I assume this is not normal and is there a way to access the diagnostics to change this to what it should be (can someone with a 6200 check if theirs says something else).

URFloorMatt

01-09-09, 11:29 PM

I noticed they've put up some new graphics in the IMG today. TNT and it appears they've added a new one for Lifetime HD. Was Lifetime one of the old HD channels? I wonder why it gets a graphic and no others from the new additions do.

I thought we had maxed out the memory in the Moto box for more IMG graphics.

SQUIDWARD360

01-10-09, 08:24 AM

markjrenna

01-10-09, 10:42 AM

There are options. One such is statistical multiplexing. While I'm sure Verizon wants to keep the selling point that the signal is straight from the provider, they could manage to crank back the datarate using STM and not have things look horrible like the satellite providers used to before mpeg4. There's a lot of bandwidth between what Verizon provides now and terrible video quality.

PLEASE NO!!! Once they "crank back the datarate", it's Comcraptic!

markjrenna

01-10-09, 10:50 AM

It wasn't contractually necessary for VZ to have MLB HD up on Day 1. No worries - it'll be added before the season starts.

I did watch the channel last night - thought the SD pic quality was actually amazing.

The MLB studio, in NJ, is HD only. So, "they" must be manipulating the HD to emulate SD while keeping the quality stellar.

afiggatt

01-10-09, 11:09 AM

ridgefamus

01-10-09, 01:54 PM

Found a message in the DVR this morning that Verizon is running a free preview week from Jan 10 to 17 for the 1010 to 1015 ESPN Game Plan/Full Court channels. Checked and the channels are available for those interested.

Thanks for the heads up. But then why can't/won't they turn on the Golf ChannelHD? A flier received with our newspapers this week had the Verizon channels listings and Golf Channel HD was noted as "coming soon". "Soon" has been a long time coming. :(

Britinvirg

01-10-09, 04:16 PM

afiggatt

01-10-09, 04:48 PM

Thanks for the heads up. But then why can't/won't they turn on the Golf ChannelHD? A flier received with our newspapers this week had the Verizon channels listings and Golf Channel HD was noted as "coming soon". "Soon" has been a long time coming. :(
Verizon's definition of "coming soon" is obviously up to several months. Just depends on your point of view, I guess. :D

My detailed QAM review - which I plan to post sometime real soon - shows at least 5 QAM channels with only 2 sub-channels where I can find an active HD channel for only 1 of the sub-channels. Don't know what the 2nd sub is and I have located the QAM freq for ALL of the active HD channels here. My guess is that these are either live HD channels that have not been turned on yet or placeholder HD signals to be activated soon. The reports/rumors are that some new HD channels will be added in the 3rd week of January. Which could be this week, depending on how one defines the 3rd week of January.

I'm hoping we get MLB HD, Comedy Central HD (perhaps too much to expect as I'm not sure when it will launch), AMC HD soon.

URFloorMatt

01-10-09, 05:21 PM

I'm guessing we'll get announced channels before unannounced or not-yet-launched channels. I'm guessing those five slots go to: NBA TV, MLB Network, CBS College Sports, Golf Channel, and Crime & Investigation.

Presumably others that don't have them will get Encore and HSN too.

coyoteaz

01-10-09, 05:21 PM

Hello,

I notice that Universal Sports is available in some Fios areas.

http://www.universalsports.tv/Universal_Sports_on_TV.html

Anyone have any info on if / when it may be coming to any other areas?

Thanks
It's available in the NYC market because it's a subchannel on WNBC and apparently they have an agreement with Verizon to carry it, probably as a holdover from the old days when that subchannel carried a news feed. Once Verizon's retransmission agreement with NBC comes up for renewal, expect that other O&Os like KNBC in LA, KXAS in Dallas, WCAU in Philly, and WRC in DC will have their Universal Sports subchannels added. Outside of NBC O&O markets, it's up to one of the local stations to add it and come to an agreement with Verizon for it to be carried.

markjrenna

01-10-09, 05:54 PM

Hello,

I notice that Universal Sports is available in some Fios areas.

http://www.universalsports.tv/Universal_Sports_on_TV.html

Anyone have any info on if / when it may be coming to any other areas?

Thanks

I watched a couple of Euro Hockey games... Metallurg Magnitogorsk was one of the teams.

Looks like they are showing sports from around the world that we would generally never see. Looks like a nice unique addition.

maxman

01-10-09, 08:21 PM

You're correct Matt - Golf HD will be at 593.

Any idea when? (VHO8)

maxman

01-10-09, 08:25 PM

Question: What is 'DNS' and why does mine fail?

afiggatt

01-10-09, 09:28 PM

For those with QAM tuners hooked up, the six 1010 to 1015 ESPN Game Plan PPV channels are in the clear all on QAM channel 83.

seamus21514

01-10-09, 11:23 PM

I read that BBC World News will be switching to 16:9 on the 13th. I wonder if FiOS would pick it up in 16:9, or upconverted...there's no reason not too.

yudaman33

01-11-09, 02:28 AM

SeijiSensei

01-11-09, 09:27 AM

Question: What is 'DNS' and why does mine fail?

I can answer the first question, but not the second.

The "Domain Name Service" is the Internet's directory assistance service. It manages the mappings between textual "domain names" like www.avsforum.com and their associated IP addresses, like 72.9.159.100. Without a working DNS you can't use textual names to refer to sites on the Internet.

When your router boots up, it obtains a IP address from Verizon and should also load the addresses of the DNS servers the router uses to resolve names. Apparently that part of the handshake between the router and Verizon isn't working correctly. If you can find the black wireless router box, you can try power-cycling it to force a new handshake. Otherwise you probably need to call Verizon.

seamus21514

01-11-09, 04:11 PM

Until BBC America officially gets an HD channel of their own, probably not. BTW, since you mentioned BBC World News going in 16:9, perhaps you're tallking about the possibility of your local PBS affiliate in HD to air it. One other thing: is it in 16:9 HD or SD?

No, I'm talking about the BBC World News, a 24/7 TV channel, channel 107. BBC World News is not run by BBC America, so it wouldn't be dependent on BBC America in HD. BBC WN is launching in 16:9 PAL within a week or so, on FTA satellite. I was just wondering if FiOS would get the 16:9 feed, and upconvert it or something.

maxman

01-11-09, 07:18 PM

If you can find the black wireless router box, you can try power-cycling it to force a new handshake. Otherwise you probably need to call Verizon.

I gave it a try but it still says "failed". Will give Verizon a call. Thanks!

markjrenna

01-11-09, 07:38 PM

I gave it a try but it still says "failed". Will give Verizon a call. Thanks!

I thought I was told or read that it should fail for us here in NJ. If they tell you otherwise, please let us know what they say.

Thanks!

icemannyr

01-11-09, 08:19 PM

The MLB studio, in NJ, is HD only. So, "they" must be manipulating the HD to emulate SD while keeping the quality stellar.

I was watching the replay of Don Larson's Perfect Game on a monitor in underscan and you could see the edges of the Pillarbars from the 16:9 feed on the SD feed.

Derko

01-12-09, 12:22 AM

markjrenna

01-12-09, 01:12 AM

I currently have Comcast and the HD package. I wanted to know, for those who have had both. Which would be considered better, between the two?

I'm tired of hearing about all these HD channels that are on Verizon, but only have like 5 channels that are worth anything on Comcast... I'm in north Jersey BTW.

You get more for less $$$. It's a no brainer. :D

I have HD Extreme and Movies + Sports.

Here is the NNJ line up:
http://www22.verizon.com/NROneRetail/NR/rdonlyres/831511D8-1CF4-4843-8437-9C00FD336389/0/NNJ_CLU.pdf

coyoteaz

01-12-09, 01:13 AM

FiOS has more HD channels, better quality on those channels, and faster Internet service with fewer restrictions than Comcast. The only real downside to FiOS in the NYC area is that the MSG channels are only available in SD, so no Rangers, Knicks, Devils, or Islanders in HD. If you don't care about those games (or don't get them on Comcast to begin with), then FiOS is clearly a superior choice.

BeachComber

01-12-09, 02:32 AM

This might be interesting reading for some, especially in the NY/NJ market.

I stumbled across it on the web tonight. It's 9 Meg so it cannot be attached here and I doubt Verizon will keep it up long once it become known its posted here.

http://www.verizonnj.com/fttp/NJ/pdfs/active/Exhibit_K_Queens_Signal_Survey.pdf

http://www.verizonnj.com/fttp/NJ/pdfs/active/Exhibit_O_NewYork_DMA_Lineup.pdf

Derko

01-12-09, 08:10 AM

Well I signed up for their Tripple play package and will be paying $60 less. I actually had taken off all the premium channels from Comcast. So all I had was Encore, now with Verizon I have ALL the premium channels. Included in that price too. My service activation date is on the 21st!

siersema

01-12-09, 10:23 PM

Wryker

01-13-09, 02:14 PM

Last I remember, Tennessee is not part of Verizon's service area, so the answer currently is never, unless Verizon gobbles up a part of BellSouth's(now at&t) area.

EDIT: After doing some research, at&t has already strung fiber for their u-verse service in Tennessee. Which just provides evidence for my answer.

When you say "service area" what does that mean? They do offer wireless here in Nashville. I ask since I REALLY want FIOS and searching Verizon's site is useless to find out information.

rodimus79

01-13-09, 03:29 PM

Anyone happen to know if Verizon has plans to add Comedy Central HD & Cartoon Network HD in the near future?

yudaman33

01-13-09, 03:45 PM

Anyone happen to know if Verizon has plans to add Comedy Central HD & Cartoon Network HD in the near future?

I haven't heard of either one of them being added in the near future. The ones I keep hearing that will be added are the 6 .tv channels by some guy named Byron Allen, NBA TV in HD, Team HD (out of the market NBA games in HD), MLB TV HD, Encore HD, Crime & Investigation HD, Golf Channel HD, and HSN HD.
Comedy Central would be great even though (based on what I read), it's a mixed bag. Shows like South Park, Sarah Silverman, the new season of Reno 911, and various movies and specials will be in HD. However, their signature shows, The Daily Show w/ Jon Stewart and The Colbert Report will use upconverted HD instead of the real deal for the time being.
The Cartoon Network has been,to say the least, a huge disappointment. Other than Clone Wars, and maybe one or two other shows, everything else is stretched. Until that network comes to its senses and produces most of their programming in true high definition, that channel is useless.

URFloorMatt

01-13-09, 04:35 PM

DaveFi

01-14-09, 04:38 PM

What's the deal with Cartoon Network HD? They are offering more and more programming, you'd think Verizon would want to pick them up.

I'm especially eager to see the new Batman series in HD.

cat6man

01-14-09, 05:22 PM

Now that Comedy Central HD is real, I suspect Verizon is going to be getting a lot of questions about when it's coming. It is by far the most widely viewed network that Verizon does not carry in HD.

Get that Viacom deal done already.

recent mail with complete updated channel list (dated december i think) from vz showed it as 'coming soon'

Walter L.

01-14-09, 05:40 PM

SQUIDWARD360

01-14-09, 09:57 PM

I'm considering FIOS TV here in Portland, OR. I have 2 questions:
1) When will NBATV-HD added?
2) Any Portlander know what's the deal about CSN NW only available in SD (HD feed is avaiable on Comcast cable)?

1. Supposedly by the end of the month. It's been in the guide as coming soon for 2 months.

kes601

01-15-09, 08:49 AM

recent mail with complete updated channel list (dated december i think) from vz showed it as 'coming soon'

It is actually Comedy.TV (HD channel) that is coming soon, that is different from Comedy Central HD.

As far as I know, Vz does not have an agreement w/Viacom for their HD channels.

123HDTV

01-15-09, 04:37 PM

I'm considering FIOS TV here in Portland, OR. I have 2 questions:
1) When will NBATV-HD added?

As someone else stated, the betting rumor is by end of month.

2) Any Portlander know what's the deal about CSN NW only available in SD (HD feed is avaiable on Comcast cable)?

There's a Portland Verizon thread here where several people keep emailing the pertinant people with Verizon. They have yet to have success. Here's the link for your use:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vbshowthread.php?p=15329984

cat6man

01-15-09, 10:05 PM

It is actually Comedy.TV (HD channel) that is coming soon, that is different from Comedy Central HD.

As far as I know, Vz does not have an agreement w/Viacom for their HD channels.

thanks for the clarification! (but it's bad news..............)

afiggatt

01-15-09, 11:08 PM

QAM Channel Usage as of January 15, 2009 Warning - Long Post!

Below is a complete list of the QAM channels currently in used for the Sterling CO in the Northern VA part of the Washington Metro market VHO 4. This list shows how many QAM channels are being used and where all the HD channels are. I used the diagnostics menu to locate the QAM channel location for most of the HD channels (except for those that were in the clear at times). The typical pattern is to have two HD channels per QAM-256 channel which allows the HD channel to have the full nominal 19.4 Mbps bandwidth (unlike some cable companies).

What the list shows is that after the big expansion of 2008, there are currently 30 unused QAM channels. Some of the QAMs have only 1 active HD sub-channel, so an additional HD channel can be added there. There are also 5 QAM channels with two sub-channels, but I was not able to determine what the 2nd one is. My guess is that some of these are either placeholders or active feeds for the coming soon HD channels, but they have not been turned on yet.

Some of the QAM channels that are not in use here are in use elsewhere for HD locals, HD RSNs, and other digital locals. Figure that Verizon has to reserve at least 6, maybe 8? of the open QAM channels shown here for local in other markets and future local adds. For example, in the DC market, WFDC-DT Univision 14 is not part of the digital locals. DC also has 5 low power stations that may want carriage of a full 19.4 Mbps bandwidth when they do go digital and perhaps make use of their digital broadcast bandwidth. Have to reserve QAM space for all this. So my guess is that maybe 22? QAM channels are left besides the 1/2 used ones are available for more HD and SD national channels. Enough room for around 40 to 50+ national HD channels before they get close to maxing out and have to move live channels to IPTV.

The public channels were moved to QAM 127, 128 here in early December. This matches the PEG (Public/Educational/Government) locations in other VHOs. My guess is that Verizon is consolidating the public channels and revising how they are fed to the different parts of the VHOs - Northern VA has different PEGs than MD suburbs, Baltimore another set of PEGs for example - to free up QAM channels.

How to read each row:
QAM # (center frequency in MHz): # of subchannels – HD or SD channel carried if known (-xxx QAM sub-channel in some cases).
The non-encrypted in the clear sub-channels are in boldface.

Northern VA/Washington Metro QAM channels – as of Jan 12, 2009
2-6: not in use
7 (177 MHz): 8 -
8 (183): 2 – 866 Showtime West HD, 869 Showtime 2 HD
9 (189): 2 – 842 Starz Edge HD, 847 Starz Comedy HD
10 (195): 2 – 845 Starz Kids & Family HD, ?
11 (201): 2 - 573 ESPNU-HD, 651 HSN-HD
12 (207): 14 – 1475 to 1488 NHL Center Ice (In-Demand)
13 (213): 5
14 (123 MHz): 2- 628 History Channel HD, 639 TLC HD
15 (129): 2 - 1009 Setanta Sports SD, ?
16 (135): 2 - 550 USA-HD, 685 Bravo-HD
17 (141): 2 - 602 CNBC-HD+, 680 Sci-Fi HD
18 (147): 1 - 619 Weather Channel HD
19 (153): 1 - 640 Lifetime HD
20 (159): 2 - 591 Outdoor Channel 2 HD, ?
21 (165): 0 – not in use
22 (171): 2 -901 HBO West HD (-672), 921 Cinemax West HD (-673)
23 (219 MHz): 4
24 (225): 1 – 850 Encore HD
25 (231): 1 - 600 CNN HD
26 (237): 2 - 552 TBS-HD, 590 Versus HD
27 (243): 14 -?
28 (249): 0 – not in use
29 (255): 2 - 908 HBO Comedy East HD (-685), 909 HBO Comedy West HD (-686)
30 (261): 2 - 910 HBO Zone East (-687), 911 HBO Zone West (-688)
31 (267): 2 – 929 At Max East(-689), 930 Cinemax 5 Star East(-690)
32 (273): 2 – 931 Outermax HD (-691), 926 ThillerMax East HD (-692)
33 (279): 2 – 903 HBO2 West HD (-693), 907 HBO Family West HD (-694)
34 (285): 2 – 927 ThillerMax West HD (-695), 913 HBO Latino West HD (-696)
35 (291): 2 – 928 WMax HD(-697), 905 HBO Signature West HD (-698)
36 (297): 2 – 925 ActionMax West HD (-699), 923 MoreMax West (-700)
37 (303): 2 – 902 HBO2 East HD (-701), 906 HBO Family East HD (-702)
38 (309): 2 – 912 HBO Latino East HD (-703), 904 HBO Signature East HD (-704)
39 (315): 2 – 924 Actionmax East HD (-705), 922 MoreMax East HD (-706)
40 (321): 2 – 592 Tennis Channel HD, 597 World Fishing Network HD
41 (327): 2 - 699 ABC Family HD, 780 Disney HD
42 (333): 2 – 744 MGM Channel HD, 781 Toon Disney HD
43 (339): 2 - 598 MavTV HD, 740 Hallmark Movie Channel HD
44 (345): 2 – 568 WGN America HD, ?
45 (351): 2 – 870 Showtime 2 West HD, 886 TMC West HD
46 (357): 2 – 868 Showtime Showcase West HD, 874 Showtime Extreme West HD
47 (363): 2 – 867 Showtime Showcase HD, 888 TMC Xtra West HD
48 (369): 2 – 873 Showtime Extreme HD, 887 TMC Xtra HD
49 (375): 1 – 618 Fox News Channel HD
50 (381): 2 – 583 Speed Channel HD, ?
51 (387): 2 – 617 Fox Business HD, 670 Travel Network HD
52 (393): 2 – 668 Planet Green HD, ?
53 (399): 0 - Not in use
54 (405): 2 – 587 NHL Network HD, 1474 NHL Center Ice HD (In-Demand)
55 (411): 8 – WGN SD (55-100)
56 (417): 9
57 (423): 7
58 (429): 6
59 (435): 8
60 (441): 8
61 (447): 8
62 (453): 8
63 (459): 7 - SD locals (in the clear)
64 (465): 0 - not in use
65 (471): 8 - SD locals (in the clear)
66 (477): 50 - TV Guide (-101), Weather Channel SD (-103), Weatherscan (-117),
47 Music Choice channels (-408 to -454).
67 (483): 0 - not in use
68 (489): 0 - not in use
69 (495): 0 - not in use
70 (501): 0 - not in use
71 (507): 2 local HD (WUSA CBS 9, WRC NBC 4 with SD subs)
72 (513): 2 local HD (WTTG Fox 5, WDCA MNT 20)
73 (519): 2 local HD (MPT PBS 22, WJLA ABC 7 with SD subs)
74 (525): 2 local HD (503 WDCW-DT CW 50, 526 WETA- DT PBS 26 with SD subs)
75 (531): 2 local stations: WNVC-DT 56 and WNVT-DT 30 MHz (8 SD subs) (-911 to -918)
76 (537): 0 - not in use
77 (543): 0 - not in use
78 (549): 1 - WHUT-DT PBS 32 SD (78-860)
79 (555): 0 - not in use
80 (561): 0 - not in use
81 (567): 0 - not in use
82 (573): 3 - Ion Qubo, Life, Worship – WPXW-DT 66
83 (579): 6
84 (585): 55 - Urge music channels (-750 to – 799)
85 (591): 2- 641 LifeTime Movie HD, 681 A&E-HD
86 (597): 2- 664 Food HD, 665 HGTV HD
87 (603): 13 – On-Demand (-512), C|Net (-513)
88 (609): 9
89 (615): 9
90 (621): 7
91 (627): 11
92 (633): 11
93 (639): 2 - 576 CSN MA HD, ?
94 (645): 7 - 899 HBO-HD, 6 other sub-channels
95 (93 MHz): 0 - not in use
96 (99): 0 - not in use
97 (105): 0 - not in use
98 (111): 2 - 622 Science Channel HD, 630 Animal Planet HD
99 (117): 2 - 625 Smithsonian HD, 585 Big Ten HD
100 (651 MHz): 0 - not in use
101 (657): 0 - not in use
102 (663): 1 - ?
103 (669): 2 - 620 Discovery HD, 621 Nat Geo HD
104 (675): 10
105 (681): 8
106 (687): 11
107 (693): 8 – Univision? (-246)
108 (699): 11
109 (705): 10
110 (711): 2 - 920 Cinemax HD (-614), 840 Starz HD
111 (717): 2 - 551 TNT-HD, 588 NFL HD
112 (723): 2 -570 EPSN-HD, 569 HDNet
113 (729): 11
114 (735): 2 - 574 ESPN2-HD, 746 HDNet Movies
115 (741): 7 – 1005 Hot Choice SD
116 (747): 2 - 557 Universal HD, 631 Discovery HD Theater
117 (753): 6 - 669 Wealth, 5 other SD sub-channels
118 (759): 2 - 865 Showtime HD, 885 TMC HD
119 (765): 9
120 (771): 6
121 (777): 11
122 (783): 10 – Fios 1 (122-1)
123 (789): 8 – Bridges TV (-469)
124 (795): 8
125 (801): 9
126 (807): 5- 711 Palladia HD, 4 other SD sub-channels
127 (813): 10 – Public/Educational/Government – in the clear
128 (820): 10 - Public/Educational/Government– in the clear
129-135: not in use

DC PSIP Mapped channels:
4-1, 4-2 = WRC-DT NBC 4 (4-3 not yet made available)
5-1 = WTTG-DT Fox 5
7-1, 7-2, 7-3 = WJLA-DT ABC 7
9-1, 9-2 = WUSA-DT CBS 9
20-1 = WDCA-DT MyNetwork 20
26-1, 26-2, 26-3, 26-4 = WETA-DT PBS 26
50-1 = WDCW-DT CW 50
66-2, 66-3, 66-4 = WPXW-DT Ion 66 (-1 main Ion channel buried at QAM 63)
67-1, 67-2, 67-3 = WMPB-DT MPT 67

BeachComber

01-15-09, 11:16 PM

coyoteaz

01-16-09, 12:04 AM

ESPN, ESPN2, ESPN U, TNT, TBS, HDNet, HDNet Movies, HD Theatre, WGN America, NFL Network, Palladia, USA, and SciFi all regularly put out at least 16Mb/s on video, which is probably the best place to draw a line since it's within 10% of the max usable bitrate and since most channels are either above 16 or less than 15. Of those channels, many are moving to encoders that are capable of VBR and won't just stuff extra bits into the video stream when not needed, but they will still hit 16+ during high motion. TBS is one example of this; their normal scripted programming usually runs around 14Mb/s, but they'll do 16-17 during MLB games.

hernanu

01-16-09, 11:54 AM

Really interesting work, thanks afiggatt.

URFloorMatt

01-16-09, 05:02 PM

Well, today AT&T announced a deal with Viacom to carry all seven Viacom HD networks (Comedy Central, Spike, Nickelodeon, MTV, VH1, CMT, and BET). Where's your announcement, Verizon?

bfdtv

01-16-09, 07:34 PM

ESPN
ESPN2
ESPN U
TNT
TBS
HDNet
HDNet Movies
HD Theatre
WGN America
NFL Network
Palladia
USA,
SciFi

all regularly put out at least 16Mb/s on videowhich is probably the best place to draw a line since it's within 10% of the max usable bitrate and since most channels are either above 16 or less than 15. Of those channels, many are moving to encoders that are capable of VBR and won't just stuff extra bits into the video stream when not needed, but they will still hit 16+ during high motion. TBS is one example of this; their normal scripted programming usually runs around 14Mb/s, but they'll do 16-17 during MLB games.CNBC, A&E, and various HD RSNs do 16-18 as well.

Derko

01-17-09, 09:58 AM

jeepmatt

01-17-09, 10:38 AM

Hey kids..

Latest word i've heard is that now NBA TV has been removed from the "next rollout" list.

Not sure if this is contract related or not, as I know some VHO's have had the equipment installed for this channel since October.

I really can't think of any other reason not for this to be live already.

Golf HD and League Pass are still on target...

fmsjr

01-17-09, 11:11 AM

I just recently ordered FIOS TV. I will have my install this Wednesday. What I was worried about, is what type of cables do they include with the install for connections to my TV and receiver? I did not get a DVR box, just got the regular HD box. Also what type of audio does the box that they will provide use. I currently have my comcast box connected with a DVI-HDMI cable and it only takes coaxial for the audio. If they are simply going to give me a component cable and nothing for audio, and have the box be optical only... I want to buy the cables in advanced. Thank you!

(This probably fits better in the FiOS Installation thread.)
In the past, some FiOS installers have provided Component cables (with analog audio) but no digital cables. You should be able to use the same cables that you're using for the Comcast box.... unless Comcast wants them back. (I don't remember having to return cables with my cable box but it could be different in your area.) Our FiOS boxes have 2 HDMI connectors (why 2??) and both coax and optical SPDIF audio out.

C*Tedesco

01-17-09, 12:27 PM

So for the past few weeks I've noticed my FIOS HD quality decrease and it's concerning me. It's noticeable mostly during pans (during football, action flicks), and it's becoming quite annoying.

I had the same issue with DirecTV when I had it. I recall switching to FIOS and being happy that the issue went away.....now for some reason or another it's back.

I'm trying to figure out if adding additional movie packages would possibly cause the decrease in quality. I doubt it, but I'm not sure what's going on. I read through some pages on this thread but didn't see anyone else complaining or bringing this issue up. I'll be calling FIOS today to see if anything with the switch over could be causing this. I know they are going to be testing, I'm hoping this is it.

I currently have a 36 inch Sony XBR 1080i CRT connected via HDMI/DVI , it's always put out a good picture. I was thinking it was maybe my TV so I checked my sister's Panasonic 42 inch Viera Plasma and she was having the same issue, but on a larger scale (larger TV)

I just wanted to ask if anyone else has noticed this...again usually on a Pan, but Jumper last night was almost unwatchable.

dougotte

01-17-09, 01:14 PM

riffjim4069

01-17-09, 01:20 PM

ridgefamus

01-17-09, 03:32 PM

Golf HD and League Pass are still on target...

What would that target be? I don't recall anyone mentioning rollout dates or VHOs with respect to these.

afiggatt

01-17-09, 04:07 PM

Well, today AT&T announced a deal with Viacom to carry all seven Viacom HD networks (Comedy Central, Spike, Nickelodeon, MTV, VH1, CMT, and BET). Where's your announcement, Verizon?
Good question. Can anyone provide some info as to why Verizon is not carrying any of the Viacom HD channels? Viacom asking for too much money? I gather there is little HD on the MTV, VH-1, CMT set, but still Verizon should get going on adding Comedy Central, Spike, and Nickelodeon.

coyoteaz

01-17-09, 04:26 PM

I just recently ordered FIOS TV. I will have my install this Wednesday. What I was worried about, is what type of cables do they include with the install for connections to my TV and receiver? I did not get a DVR box, just got the regular HD box. Also what type of audio does the box that they will provide use. I currently have my comcast box connected with a DVI-HDMI cable and it only takes coaxial for the audio. If they are simply going to give me a component cable and nothing for audio, and have the box be optical only... I want to buy the cables in advanced. Thank you!
Current installs provide a single HDMI cable. The box also has optical and coaxial outputs for digital audio should you want a separate connection, but you'll have to provide your own cable. The audio on HDMI has always been PCM for me, but my receiver doesn't do HDMI so I have it plugged directly into the TV. It might do DD if plugged into an HDMI-capable receiver. The optical/coax outputs send DD.

cat6man

01-17-09, 04:42 PM

Good question. Can anyone provide some info as to why Verizon is not carrying any of the Viacom HD channels? Viacom asking for too much money? I gather there is little HD on the MTV, VH-1, CMT set, but still Verizon should get going on adding Comedy Central, Spike, and Nickelodeon.

it's about money.................there was a huge PR battle in the new york area for a cable provider that was in a fight with viacom over the price of renewing those channels............viacom took out full page ads in the new york times with spongebob and others crying (!) and lamenting that they were going to be taken off the cable system..........it went right down to the wire but on the last day they reached some sort of settlement so coverage was continuous......i assume cost of carrying the HD channels is in the same boat

URFloorMatt

01-17-09, 05:05 PM

Actually, TWC had already announced carriage of the HD channels prior to that dispute with Viacom over renewing the SD channels. So I'm guessing those are separate issues/discussions.

SQUIDWARD360

01-17-09, 05:18 PM

So for the past few weeks I've noticed my FIOS HD quality decrease and it's concerning me. It's noticeable mostly during pans (during football, action flicks), and it's becoming quite annoying.

I just wanted to ask if anyone else has noticed this...again usually on a Pan, but Jumper last night was almost unwatchable.

Everything still looks great here.

bfdtv

01-17-09, 07:37 PM

So for the past few weeks I've noticed my FIOS HD quality decrease and it's concerning me. It's noticeable mostly during pans (during football, action flicks), and it's becoming quite annoying.
When it comes to football, you are at the mercy of your local broadcasters and whatever they do to their signal.

Recording from FiOS and OTA are still identical (within 0.01Gb in size for 1-hour).

cat6man

01-17-09, 07:52 PM

Everything still looks great here.

well, i've only had fios for 1 day now and most channels look fine.
i did think (my daughter pointed this out right away) that USA HD seemed very
grainy when watching 'psych'.....anyone else notice this? almost like it was shot it SD (maybe it was?) and broadcast in HD

cat6man

01-17-09, 08:16 PM

i'm setting up my BTV recording system on my pc and have to select a channel lineup from a list of options for my zip code in Montclair, NJ

Basking Ridge
Basking Ridge (nonrebuild)
Freehold
Freehold (nonrebuild)
one that says Freehold and Jersey City (i think)

which system would i be on?
what is the difference between channel lineups for nonrebuild versus the other?

coyoteaz

01-17-09, 08:26 PM

well, i've only had fios for 1 day now and most channels look fine.
i did think (my daughter pointed this out right away) that USA HD seemed very
grainy when watching 'psych'.....anyone else notice this? almost like it was shot it SD (maybe it was?) and broadcast in HD
Psych is just a grainy show, and always has been. Before USA had an HD channel, NBC aired a couple episodes in HD and they were just as bad. Not to say that USA does a stellar job with their HD (way too much blocking for the bitrate they're putting out IMO), but this particular problem originates upstream of the USA HD feed.

ZenithPete

01-19-09, 06:53 PM

Im so sick of waiting for fios..expansion in rhode island is going at a snail's pace. 100 mil for this? I'm also not really sure some of the towns in this recent press release actually have them. What happened to the south country expansion that was supposed to be done by the end of last year. Will cox's strangelhold ever end?

PROVIDENCE, R.I. - Consumers and businesses in Rhode Island are reaping the benefits of Verizon's $100 million network expansion and enhancement program in the state in 2008, as the company completes the program's wireline and wireless projects.

Verizon announced Tuesday (Jan. 13) that the following Ocean State initiatives have been completed:

Expanding the company's revolutionary FiOS TV service to 12 more Rhode Island communities, bringing competition and choice for cable TV service. In 2008, FiOS TV arrived in Central Falls, Cranston, Foster, Glocester, Johnston, Lincoln, Narragansett, North Providence, Pawtucket, Providence, Smithfield and South Kingstown. Verizon is continuing to build its FiOS network in more Rhode Island communities in 2009.

Bringing Verizon's High Speed Internet service at 7 Mbps (megabits per second) to seven Rhode Island communities: Cranston, Hope Valley, Jamestown, Narragansett, Pawtucket, Providence and Tiverton. The faster service now rivals traditional broadband service offered by cable companies, bringing more competition and lower prices.

Investing in wireless networks across Rhode Island and New England. Verizon Wireless has invested more than $2.2 billion in its New England wireless network since 2000, including more than $100 million during the first six months of 2008. Every New England cell site of Verizon Wireless, the wireless carrier with America's largest 3G network, provides wireless broadband connectivity.

Significantly enhancing FiOS TV offerings, adding more than 90 new channels - including 71 more high-definition (HD) channels - to the company's FiOS TV lineup in Rhode Island. As a result, FiOS TV now offers more than 500 total channels - featuring more than 100 HD channels, more HD than any local cable TV company, including Cox.

Built and opened the new Verizon stores in Pawtucket and Smithfield, creating a number of new sales and customer service jobs.

dtv757

01-19-09, 08:30 PM

^^it takes time to build and test all the equipment required for FiOS.

Heck i have been waiting for 5 years to get rid if my current broadband provider, but i still have to wait for FTTH. its available about 1 mile up the street from me, but my c/o has not been turned on... there for i have to wait..

thats what happens with new technology. :confused::confused:

BeachComber

01-20-09, 06:43 AM

hernanu

01-20-09, 09:02 AM

Does Rhode Island have a State Franchise bill or is it all local? If not, then that is where your hold up is.

Verizon FiOS (Rated #1 for the WORST Customer Service) will not list towns in their Press Releases that they are not in as it would open them to investor lawsuits.

I believe they have a state franchise; massachusetts has local franchises (I was part of the fight to get it into my town).

As to the customer service, just based on my own experience, I'd have to say you probably need to split it up into field service and central (billing, customer contact, etc.). I haven't had anything but good experiences with field installation and service people. The same with trouble shooting problems: they have been committed to helping me out.

As an example, one of my HD DVRs just died about three weeks ago. Suddenly no sound, through my HDMI port to the TV or through an optical cable to my receiver. I went through a lot (a couple of hours) of debugging, and at the end I just asked for a new DVR. A service rep was there the next day at 11 a.m., installed it and left it in good shape. He called me up at work during the installation to get the receiver settings right, but everything was done well by the time I got home.

This was maybe the fourth problem I've run into in 2.5 years and each time it was pretty much the same - about a couple of hours to nail down the problem, then prompt response. It's about what I expect when anything significant (car, etc) breaks down, and actually I consider it very good service to have a service rep there the next day.

URFloorMatt

01-20-09, 11:39 AM

As to the customer service, just based on my own experience, I'd have to say you probably need to split it up into field service and central (billing, customer contact, etc.). I haven't had anything but good experiences with field installation and service people. The same with trouble shooting problems: they have been committed to helping me out.Agreed. I think Verizon's CSR problem is the fact that they seem to have four separate entities all operating independently (billing, which is local, FiOS, which may or may not be local, online DSL, which has been shipped overseas, and POTS), and none of them know who has responsibility for what.

Every time I need to call Verizon, I get sent on a carousel around the world until they finally get me to the right CSR.

BeachComber

01-20-09, 05:00 PM

Agreed. I think Verizon's CSR problem is the fact that they seem to have four separate entities all operating independently (billing, which is local, FiOS, which may or may not be local, online DSL, which has been shipped overseas, and POTS), and none of them know who has responsibility for what.

Every time I need to call Verizon, I get sent on a carousel around the world until they finally get me to the right CSR.

OK.... I'll agree that the techs that come to the house are good.

The first tier techs on the phone are typical idiots...if you can get to them through their queue without being disconnected.

The billing is the worst of any service, regardless of product, known to mankind.

I believe they have a state franchise; massachusetts has local franchises (I was part of the fight to get it into my town).

fwiw...

4 States with laws prior to 2005: Alaska, Hawaii, Rhode Island, Vermont

19 States that enacted laws in 2005, 2006, 2007 or 2008:
California, Connecticut, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas,
Michigan, Missouri, Nevada, New Jersey, North Carolina, Ohio, South
Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Virginia, Wisconsin

4 States with laws pending (as of June 2008):
Louisiana, Massachusetts, New York, Pennsylvania,

23 States that have not enacted laws (as of June 2008):
Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, Colorado, Delaware, Idaho, Kentucky,
Maine, Maryland, Minnesota, Mississippi, Montana, Nebraska, New
Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Dakota,
Utah, Washington, West Virginia, Wyoming

http://www.apwa.net/Documents/Meetings/Congress/2008/Handouts/4271.pdf

dtv757

01-20-09, 05:20 PM

Agreed. I think Verizon's CSR problem is the fact that they seem to have four separate entities all operating independently (billing, which is local, FiOS, which may or may not be local, online DSL, which has been shipped overseas, and POTS), and none of them know who has responsibility for what.

Every time I need to call Verizon, I get sent on a carousel around the world until they finally get me to the right CSR.

yes you are correct that is a big issue. even with having direct numbers to CS i sometimes get transfered a few times because, one dept cant see my info etc.. but with FIOS being still NEW there are way too many system that a VZ csr has to go through to process you request. for example when processing a COPPER tripple play all the 3 parts are done in different systems. 1 for data, 1 for voice, and then they bundling and the Dtv portion is finalised on a buldling system. it can be a mess and a long call, in time it may be easier to get all these things accomplished.

as a VZ vendor we just now got everything put into 1 system. but it took a long time time to finally get that, but we now encounter many bugs and many errors.

diskman8004

01-21-09, 09:52 AM

My mom's address is FIOS eligible and she lives in Providence. She could get FIOS before I could get it here in Pasadena, MD. Go figure? :)

hernanu

01-21-09, 11:42 AM

My mom's address is FIOS eligible and she lives in Providence. She could get FIOS before I could get it here in Pasadena, MD. Go figure? :)

Bummer to get out-high teched by your Mom. My condolences.. and welcome.

hernanu

01-22-09, 09:05 AM

fwiw...

4 States with laws prior to 2005: Alaska, Hawaii, Rhode Island, Vermont

19 States that enacted laws in 2005, 2006, 2007 or 2008:
California, Connecticut, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas,
Michigan, Missouri, Nevada, New Jersey, North Carolina, Ohio, South
Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Virginia, Wisconsin

4 States with laws pending (as of June 2008):
Louisiana, Massachusetts, New York, Pennsylvania,

23 States that have not enacted laws (as of June 2008):
Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, Colorado, Delaware, Idaho, Kentucky,
Maine, Maryland, Minnesota, Mississippi, Montana, Nebraska, New
Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Dakota,
Utah, Washington, West Virginia, Wyoming

http://www.apwa.net/Documents/Meetings/Congress/2008/Handouts/4271.pdf

Thanks for the info, I was wondering how it was around the country. I am especially interested in Connecticut (Enfield), since my parents are suffering with Cox right now and I'd love to get them on FIOS.

riffjim4069

01-22-09, 09:52 AM

Does anyone have an update as to when the 6 new Entertainment Studios HD channels are supposed to launch? Although no specific date was set, back in September ES was "planning" to launch them by the end of the 2008.

"Studios says the channels will also be available online and via mobile phones. The company did not offer a specific launch date, but said the six channels are "currently planned" for later this year. All six channels will be launched the same day, the company added."

Not related to HD...but does anyone know when Verizon will be rolling out their new FiOS VOIP service? To be honest, the only reason we have their phone is because it was a bundle requirement some months ago. Although we appreciate the reliability of Verizon POTS, it is overpriced when compared to VOIP (ViaTalk)...and the voicemail and web-interface are simply horrible! Prior to FiOS, we had VOIP service for years while we were on an Comcast network. The VOIP service had outstanding features at a low-cost...however, there were always "mysterious" problems with the phone service. When we moved, I connected the VOIP gizmo to our FiOS broadband and it worked perfectly for 4-months until our VOIP contract expired. Thanks Comcast!

Marcus Carr

01-22-09, 10:43 AM

Verizon's FiOS Franchise Moves Closer to Approval in Philly

City, Activists Expect Telco to Help Close Digital Divide

Linda Haugsted -- Multichannel News, 1/21/2009 11:01:55 AM MT

Verizon's Philadelphia FiOS franchise should pass its second-to-last hurdle Thursday, as the agreement is scheduled to be vetted by the Public Property and Public Works Committee.

But as it goes through its final stages, the fiber-optic video franchise agreement is still the subject of criticism by public access activists who say they weren't part of the negotiating process, and the local Digital Justice Coalition which, according to press reports, wants assurance in the agreement that Verizon's infrastructure and grants will be used to close the digital divide in the city.

Public access advocates are closely following the process because Philadelphia may be the largest city without public access programming. The franchise of the incumbent, Comcast Corp., was amended in 2007 to create $6.7 million over the next eight years for public access and an access corporation has been formed, but no studio has been set up to date.

The contract before the city council committee would require Verizon to pay into the public access coffers, but not until the fifth year of its franchise. After that date, Verizon should pay grants of $1 million for educational access, $1.5 million for government access and $2.7 million for public access. The contract also calls for Verizon to wire City Hall, the city's Board of Education building, its community college and three colleges and universities: Drexel, LaSalle and Temple. PEG operating funds of $500,000 a year should be paid after the fifth anniversary, also.

If the committee approves the pact, it still faces a vote of the full council, scheduled for Jan. 29.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/162485-Verizon_s_FiOS_Franchise_Moves_Closer_to_Approval_in_Philly. php

Rutgar

01-22-09, 12:00 PM

happyhr247

01-22-09, 12:43 PM

:mad: Why won't these STBs hold the setting for displaying the Clock! At least once a week I have to go through all of my STBs reset them to display the Time. And this has been going on ever since they added the capability. Really getting annoying. These Motorola boxes are far more glitchy than my old DirecTV boxes ever were.

Thank you! I have my STB set to Always display the clock. "Always" must mean something different to Motorola than it does to me. I use the STB as the clock in my living room and when viewing info or switching channels, the channel number appears instead of the clock...and for more than just a couple of seconds.

Very annoying.

mbyrnes

01-22-09, 12:55 PM

^^^^
I noticed that the clock thing happens after they send an update. I agree that it is the most annoying thing I have ever had to deal with. I had to do it this morning on my two boxes and I just get frustrated.

I watch a lot of channels in the 600's and I wake up at 6:30 and many times, half asleep, I think the channel number is the actual time and end up getting up late.

They need to fix this problem. It can't be that hard.

POWERFUL

01-22-09, 01:29 PM

Heard of an alarm clock?

Rutgar

01-22-09, 01:30 PM

What's also annoying is, that when I verify the settings, they still show that it's set to "Show Clock". So I have to manually select, "Show Channel", and then go back and select "Show Clock" again, just to actually get it to show the time.

And yes, the channel number has got me a few times as well, thinking it was displaying the time!

hernanu

01-22-09, 01:51 PM

Jim Hef

01-22-09, 02:47 PM

My wife likes her alarm clock to be about 1/2 hour ahead...don't ask, but I refer to the STB clock to see what time it really is. It does the same thing in my area, and I think it does have to do with either an update or receiving a message. Yes, it's annoying, both of the issues!!:o

afiggatt

01-22-09, 05:22 PM

Does anyone have an update as to when the 6 new Entertainment Studios HD channels are supposed to launch? Although no specific date was set, back in September ES was "planning" to launch them by the end of the 2008.
There has been a lack of news or even rumors lately on when Verizon might add the HD channels that have been listed as "coming soon" since November. They added NHL HD and I think most? markets have HSN (not)HD. But where are NBA HD, Golf HD, C&I Network HD? Those were shown as Coming Soon in the November PDF channel line-ups. Personally, I hope the 6 *.tv HD channels don't get added. That is 3 QAM channels of wasted bandwidth (IMHO), unless ES pre-packages the channels for cable systems and squeezes 3 of them into 1 QAM channel - which becomes 2 wasted QAM channels.

The reports were the 3rd week of January. Well, the 3rd full week of January is almost over and no sign of the "coming soon" channels. Besides the coming soon channels, what about MLB HD, AMC HD, Comedy Central HD (even if there is little real HD on so far, the HD picture quality has to be better for the SD upconverts or so one would think), Spike HD, and why not a widescreen upconverted 16:9 BBC World News on channel 607?

As of today, there have been no notable changes in the past several weeks in the QAM channel review for the Washington Metro market. Only change in the past week here is that a scan today found the main Ion channel at PSIP mapped WPXW-DT 66-1 which means that they can pass Ion HD through whenever Ion goes HD.

bull3964

01-22-09, 06:39 PM

Comedy Central HD (even if there is little real HD on so far, the HD picture quality has to be better for the SD upconverts or so one would think)

Check out the comedy central HD thread. There are posted screenshots of Colbert on SD and on the HD channel upconverted from SD. The difference is nothing short of jaw dropping.

It actually makes me a little bit mad to know that these channels are putting out such sub-par SD channels when you even have a provider like verizon that doesn't re-compress and you still can't get everything the old technology could offer.

jeepmatt

01-23-09, 08:48 AM

Afigg-
News has dried up on my end. I have no idea what VZ is doing at the moment in regards to new channels.

crankerchick

01-23-09, 10:27 AM

Weird. I have no problem with the clock display, it always shows the time. If I select a channel it will set it and stay on for a bit, but not overly long. Maybe an improvement would be to allow the user to select a timeout for the channel display?
I've noticed that the clock problem only exists on my HD DVR. MY SD boxes all display the time just fine, but the hd-dvr box always loses its mind after a day or so of telling it to display the clock. This started a few months ago after the last update we got here in Howard County (MD). Before, the clock option worked fine, and now it always forgets. Very annoying indeed.

ridgefamus

01-23-09, 12:03 PM

I've noticed that the clock problem only exists on my HD DVR. MY SD boxes all display the time just fine, but the hd-dvr box always loses its mind after a day or so of telling it to display the clock. This started a few months ago after the last update we got here in Howard County (MD). Before, the clock option worked fine, and now it always forgets. Very annoying indeed.

My HD non-DVR box (QIP6200-2) seems to remember to give me the time. It's the HD DVR box that keeps forgetting. I just had to reset it this morning. My experience is that it happens because I leave it "on" all the time. Recycling it to off then back on corrects the clock display, albeit temporarily. I do have the 6200-2 turn off each time I turn off the TV - my remote does both with one button press. So maybe the clock thing is connected to how we have the STB configured to be turned "off"? Or not?:rolleyes:

Amadeus93

01-23-09, 01:28 PM

My HD non-DVR box (QIP6200-2) seems to remember to give me the time. It's the HD DVR box that keeps forgetting. I just had to reset it this morning. My experience is that it happens because I leave it "on" all the time. Recycling it to off then back on corrects the clock display, albeit temporarily. I do have the 6200-2 turn off each time I turn off the TV - my remote does both with one button press. So maybe the clock thing is connected to how we have the STB configured to be turned "off"? Or not?:rolleyes:I had this problem come up a few times over the course of a couple of months. It happened to both my HD DVR and my two SD STBs. For each one, I would turn the box off, wait until the clock appeared, and then turn it back on. It wasn't connected to updates, it just seemed to happen. But it hasn't happened in months.

BeachComber

01-23-09, 07:45 PM

Check out the comedy central HD thread. There are posted screenshots of Colbert on SD and on the HD channel upconverted from SD. The difference is nothing short of jaw dropping.

It actually makes me a little bit mad to know that these channels are putting out such sub-par SD channels when you even have a provider like verizon that doesn't re-compress and you still can't get everything the old technology could offer.

Considering the SD is of D* SD-LITE at 480x480, something FiOS does not do, the different is not nearly as pronounced as inferred in your post or that thread.

zEli173

01-24-09, 08:46 AM

+1 on the clock problem, HD DVR.

crankerchick

01-24-09, 09:16 AM

My HD non-DVR box (QIP6200-2) seems to remember to give me the time. It's the HD DVR box that keeps forgetting. I just had to reset it this morning. My experience is that it happens because I leave it "on" all the time. Recycling it to off then back on corrects the clock display, albeit temporarily. I do have the 6200-2 turn off each time I turn off the TV - my remote does both with one button press. So maybe the clock thing is connected to how we have the STB configured to be turned "off"? Or not?
We do not "turn off" the hd dvr either. I hadn't tried power cycling it to get the clock back. I've just stopped bothering with it since it always reverts back to the channel anyway.

Rutgar

01-24-09, 10:29 AM

The clock problem happens on all 4 of my STB's. Both of the HD-DVR's that I have, and my 2 regular STB's. So when it happens to one, it happens to all. Which would coincide with the notion that it occurs when there is some sort of update.

arnoldevns

01-24-09, 11:36 AM

I woke up this morning and found no guide data on any of my boxes. I checked the dslreports forum and several people reported the same problem around the country - despite rebooting, etc.

Jim Hef

01-24-09, 04:29 PM

No Guide in my location at mid day. Funny thing was channel surfing with the Up button, seeing the info, and then none on the next channel. Went back to the last channel, and the info was still there, but as I went further, no info. Guide was just a deep gray color across all channels. Not sure when it came back on.

riffjim4069

01-25-09, 10:06 AM

I woke up this morning and found no guide data on any of my boxes. I checked the dslreports forum and several people reported the same problem around the country - despite rebooting, etc.We have Guide data on both of our Verizon HD DVRs here in Rowlett. However, I noticed we no longer have TV Guide On Screen (TVGOS) data for our Sony HD DVR. Although we have Cablecard, the Sony has been pulling TVGOS data from the local over-the-air PBS analog station since we moved here last year. Different problem...just hope the Sony starts pulling in digital TVGOS soon.

bonzy

01-25-09, 11:25 AM

riffjim4069

01-25-09, 12:01 PM

Not to drag this into a Tivo discussion, but the Tivo HD is much faster than the Verizon DVR's. Not sure what speed issues you saw (or if you were just using a very old software version, or if you didn't register it and give it a couple days to download everything), but for doing anything you want to do with a DVR, it's super fast, and much faster than a Verizon (or Comcast) DVR.

(The only slowness is when rearranging alot of season passes, or adding new season passes if you have 50+ already, which is more than any other DVR can handle anyway.)The New-in-Box Tivo HD has been working pretty well so far...I am certainly not having any of the problems like I did with the two refurbs boxes I received from Tivo. Not to turn this into Tivo discussion, but I am warming up to the box...a few annoying things I don't like, but Wishlist, Season Pass, and a few other features are top-notch.

bull3964

01-25-09, 01:36 PM

Considering the SD is of D* SD-LITE at 480x480, something FiOS does not do, the different is not nearly as pronounced as inferred in your post or that thread.

I'm sorry, but comedy central DOES indeed look that bad on FIOS. I can barely read the comedy central bug. I also cannot see the pinstriping in Colbert's suit on FIOS.

And no, I'm not affected by the SD picture softening issues of the moto boxes.

Comedy central has got to be one of the worst looking SD channels out there. I would be suprised if the source material was good enough that a 480x480 resize would even matter.

Verizon needs to get on the ball and start offering the Viacom HD stations on their service.

bonzy

01-25-09, 02:08 PM

I'm sorry, but comedy central DOES indeed look that bad on FIOS. I can barely read the comedy central bug. I also cannot see the pinstriping in Colbert's suit on FIOS.

And no, I'm not affected by the SD picture softening issues of the moto boxes.

Comedy central has got to be one of the worst looking SD channels out there. I would be suprised if the source material was good enough that a 480x480 resize would even matter.

Verizon needs to get on the ball and start offering the Viacom HD stations on their service.

Not to mention the piss-poor sound.

Jim Hef

01-25-09, 02:28 PM

...Comedy central has got to be one of the worst looking SD channels out there....
Look at Fox Soccer to see what can really be termed as really poor SD!

VARTV

01-25-09, 04:25 PM

Look at Fox Soccer to see what can really be termed as really poor SD!It's bad on FiOS as it is on DirecTV?

Hormoz

01-25-09, 05:49 PM

Look at Fox Soccer to see what can really be termed as really poor SD!

Actually, I vote for GOLTV. Far worse pixelation than FSC, at least on our FIOS system!:(

HZ

FAZ8218

01-25-09, 08:57 PM

Actually, I vote for GOLTV. Far worse pixelation than FSC, at least on our FIOS system!:(

HZ
Absolutely. And I don't know about the other International channels, but nothing on the whole system is worse than RAI, switching from a Serie A game on RAI to FSC makes FSC look like an HD channel.

BeachComber

01-26-09, 01:56 AM

I'm sorry, but comedy central DOES indeed look that bad on FIOS.

Comedy Central looks the same on FiOS as it does on the distribution feed from 95W and 131W. D*'s SD version looks worse.

Your problem is with Viacom, not FiOS.

bull3964

01-26-09, 10:19 AM

Comedy Central looks the same on FiOS as it does on the distribution feed from 95W and 131W. D*'s SD version looks worse.

Your problem is with Viacom, not FiOS.

I never said it was a problem with Fios. In fact I even said that the source material was the problem. However, if FIOS would join the rest of the providers and started offering the Viacom stations in HD, we wouldn't have this problem at all.

What you stated is that it wasn't a valid comparison, but I think it is. That screenshot posted of Colbert in that thread is pretty much representative what I see every night when I watch the show. I think you are overplaying the difference in FIOS image quality of Comedy Central SD compared to D*. The source material isn't good enough to suffer that badly at the hands of the higher compression of satellite companies.

In fact, TDS and Colbert Report look and sound better off Hulu (480p stream) than they do directly off of cable TV.

The point still remains that even the SD shows on CC show an order of magnitude improvement in image quality over their SD channel counterparts.

However, what is a FIOS problem is the audio quality of comedy central. Despite several attempts to get this resolved by elevating though different tech support channels, it remains a blown out, boomy, mess. This issue doesn't exist on any other provider.

cmeinck

01-26-09, 12:17 PM

hernanu

01-26-09, 12:35 PM

I currently have FIOS, was installed around this time last year. At that time, they ran a number of lines. I just put DirecTV on vacation and wanted to add FIOS in another room. There is a switch my basement. Do I have to have them rollout a truck to have it installed in the new room or simply run a coaxial from the switch to the new room (roughly 15 feet or so) and order a box for home installation.

I currently have the HD-DVR. I noticed they have the Home Media DVR. What's the most cost effective set up? Can I use a standard HD box with the Home Media DVR? Confused as to what's the most cost effective solution that will allow me to DVR programs and watch them on either set.

TIA

On the first, I'd have them roll a truck, since there are issues with how hot the signal is to the second area that they could handle right then and there. Just to avoid further issues.

On the HD DVR - I have a Home Media DVR and several HD DVr's as well as a set top box that is the target for the HM DVR. Several things to consider if you want to use it instead of another HD DVR.

1. Will it be enough for you and yours to have one DVR with the limitation in storage (~20 hrs of HD)? If so, then the Home Media DVR makes sense.

2. Will you be ok with recording only from one location? I don't think you can ask for recordings from the client STB. If so, then this would work.

3. Do you want the extra features: Display media from a PC, etc. that the Home Media DVR gives you? If yes, then that may be a good way to go.

The cost difference is close to a wash: 2 DVR's ~ $16 X 2 = $32. Home Media DVR ($20) + HD STB ($10) = $30.

cmeinck

01-26-09, 12:44 PM

Thanks for the quick reply. I'll have them roll a truck. I'll mull over the differences between (2) HD-DVR's vs the (1) Home Media DVR + (1) HD box.

BeachComber

01-27-09, 12:47 AM

What you stated is that it wasn't a valid comparison, but I think it is. That screenshot posted of Colbert in that thread is pretty much representative what I see every night when I watch the show. I think you are overplaying the difference in FIOS image quality of Comedy Central SD compared to D*. The source material isn't good enough to suffer that badly at the hands of the higher compression of satellite companies.

Interesting.... so you believe that Comedy Central and first segment of Colbert tonight on FiOS at 528x480 17.62KB/Frame (0.57Bits/Pixel) is as bad as Directv at 480x480 almost 10KB/Frame lower at 7.94KB/Frame (.28 Bits/Pixel) and half the amount of data?

Too bad the evidence does not support you.

If the blue looks as deep to you, if the hair looks the same to you, if the suit looks the same to you, if the skin tones look the same to you, if the alternating red/black lines in the graphic look the same to you, if the green on the back wall looks the same to you, if the stripes in the tie you commented on look the same to you....I don't know what to tell you besides a TV Calibration and possibly an eye exam.

FIOS
File Size Processed: 360.80 MB, Play Time: 00h:10m:58s
528 x 480, 29.97 fps, 4.64 Mbps (4.32 Mbps Average).
Average Video Quality: 17.62 KB/Frame, 0.57 Bits/Pixel.
AC3 Audio: 2/0 Channels (L, R), 48.0 kHz, 96 kbps.
Dialog Normalization: -31.0 dB
0 of 19704 video frames found with errors.
0 of 20578 audio frames found with errors.
0 corrupted video bytes in file.
0.000000 seconds of video timestamp gaps.
4.928000 seconds of audio timestamp gaps.

D*
File Size Processed: 181.51 MB, Play Time: 00h:10m:57s
480 x 480, 29.97 fps, 15.00 Mbps (1.95 Mbps Average).
Average Video Quality: 7.94 KB/Frame, 0.28 Bits/Pixel.
MPEG Audio.
2 of 19724 video frames found with errors.
0 of 0 audio frames found with errors.
1336 corrupted video bytes in file.
0.000000 seconds of video timestamp gaps.
0.000000 seconds of audio timestamp gaps.

DTV 480x480
http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/7531/cdtvwx8.png (http://imageshack.us)
FiOS 528x480
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/9134/cfiostk4.png (http://imageshack.us)
DTV Resized 528x480
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1356/cdtvrswp6.png (http://imageshack.us)

bull3964

01-27-09, 12:56 AM

BeachComber

01-27-09, 01:35 AM

Someone is too caught up in the numbers.

The two shots do not look significantly different. They are both junk. The HD upconverted shot looks better than both of those by an order of magnitude. If you can't see that, I don't know what to tell you.

Equalize the levels on both of those screenshots and I bet most people on this forum won't be able to tell the difference in a double blind test.

I also notice a lot more aliasing (especially around the mouth and eyeglasses) in the FIOS screenshots. They could possibly be interlacing artifacts though.

LOL....I'm into numbers and your arguments are running all over the place.

You stated that D* SD v HDTV comparison was valid and said "That screenshot posted of Colbert in that thread is pretty much representative what I see every night when I watch the show. I think you are overplaying the difference in FIOS image quality of Comedy Central SD compared to D*. The source material isn't good enough to suffer that badly at the hands of the higher compression of satellite companies."

That has now been proven false.

The images are both off the stream - they do not need to be equalized because that is how they look in reality.

You state that most could not tell the difference (even though I do resize the D* image to 528x480 in image 3, however, anyone that cannot see the difference here is simply in denial (as if the deeper colors were not enough).

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/4658/cfioslogowd9.png (http://imageshack.us)
http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/9153/cdtvrslogosq9.png (http://imageshack.us)

bull3964

01-27-09, 02:40 AM

I did not say there was no difference. I did say the difference was slight. And it sure seems to be slight to me. I said it wouldn't "suffer that badly" and all your screenshots have done is reinforce that claim as far as I'm concerned. Also, you appear to have the ability to pull transport streams from DirecTV, how about an honest to goodness SD to SD to HD upconvert comparison? You have clearly implied that the difference between FIOS SD and DirecTV upconvert will be nothing to write home about, so I would be interested in seeing those facts in the same manner.

Your original argument is that we shouldn't even bother looking at comparison shots between SD and HD upconvert sourced from direcTV because the direcTV image quality is vastly inferior. I still do not believe that's true. The FIOS has a slight edge, but it's not all that significant. The difference between the SD and HD upconvert were far greater than the difference you have shown between DirecTV SD and FIOS SD

I also do not agree on the idea that there's no need to match the levels. The directv stream has gone though a recompression and the levels have been altered. Anyone using the service would calibrate for the levels that they expect to get from directv as would someone using FIOS. Where you see deeper colors, I just see a difference in contrast. If the FIOS stream were able to keep the same deep levels and not crush shadow detail, I would agree with you. However, the left lapel becomes indistinct on the FIOS screenshot, Colbert's upper row of teeth all but disappear, and you lose the outline of the butt of the gun on the wall far sooner. Yes, the directv shot is more blown out and washed out, but you can see more detail in the darker areas. The fact of the matter is, the SD Comedy Central feed from Viacom has very limited dynamic range and the comparison between the two shots highlight that fact.

Despite all of this, I don't get anywhere near the level of detail outputted to my display that even the directv shot shows. For one thing, "THE" in The Colbert Report logo is an indistinct blob of white where only the 'T' is vaguely identifiable as a letter. The fine line gradations in the logo are also completely absent.

I also know it's not my display at fault. Other SD channels on fios are downright pleasing to the eye. Cartoon Network, in particular, looks nearly DVD quality at times.

In the end though, it's all moot. People on DirecTV can just watch the HD version of the channel and get the highest image quality possible for the channel. What we should be doing is asking Verizon where the Viacom HD stations are instead of arguing over small details.

BeachComber

01-27-09, 03:06 AM

I did not say there was no difference. I did say the difference was slight. And it sure seems to be slight to me. I said it wouldn't "suffer that badly" and all your screenshots have done is reinforce that claim as far as I'm concerned. Also, you appear to have the ability to pull transport streams from DirecTV, how about an honest to goodness SD to SD to HD upconvert comparison? You have clearly implied that the difference between FIOS SD and DirecTV upconvert will be nothing to write home about, so I would be interested in seeing those facts in the same manner.

Your original argument is that we shouldn't even bother looking at comparison shots between SD and HD upconvert sourced from direcTV because the direcTV image quality is vastly inferior. I still do not believe that's true. The FIOS has a slight edge, but it's not all that significant. The difference between the SD and HD upconvert were far greater than the difference you have shown between DirecTV SD and FIOS SD

I do not have the ability to pull HD Images from D*.

Some people see lines in the graphic above. Apparently you do not. An eye examine is in order.

I also do not agree on the idea that there's no need to match the levels. The directv stream has gone though a recompression and the levels have been altered. Anyone using the service would calibrate for the levels that they expect to get from directv as would someone using FIOS. Where you see deeper colors, I just see a difference in contrast. If the FIOS stream were able to keep the same deep levels and not crush shadow detail, I would agree with you. However, the left lapel becomes indistinct on the FIOS screenshot, Colbert's upper row of teeth all but disappear, and you lose the outline of the butt of the gun on the wall far sooner. Yes, the directv shot is more blown out and washed out, but you can see more detail in the darker areas. The fact of the matter is, the SD Comedy Central feed from Viacom has very limited dynamic range and the comparison between the two shots highlight that fact.

The are both from the raw stream and to Calibrated to REC 601. You cannot get the picture back from D* when something is not there.

Despite all of this, I don't get anywhere near the level of detail outputted to my display that even the directv shot shows. For one thing, "THE" in The Colbert Report logo is an indistinct blob of white where only the 'T' is vaguely identifiable as a letter. The fine line gradations in the logo are also completely absent.

I also know it's not my display at fault. Other SD channels on fios are downright pleasing to the eye. Cartoon Network, in particular, looks nearly DVD quality at times.

Eye examine and Calibration....I was correct several posts ago. It is your TV's fault, not FiOS. The proof is above - your set just cannot reproduce it.

In the end though, it's all moot. People on DirecTV can just watch the HD version of the channel and get the highest image quality possible for the channel. What we should be doing is asking Verizon where the Viacom HD stations are instead of arguing over small details.

Verizon would most likely add the Viacom stations at a price point, but clearly Viacom believes there cable offerings of Non-HD Material at this point is not worth it. Quite frankly, considering the large amount of Non-HD on MTV, VH1, CMT, Nick, Comedy Central etc, I tend to agree with FiOS that I surely would not spend much extra for their HD Channels at this point.

BeachComber

01-27-09, 03:15 AM

HeadShot from D* HD Comedy Central image in the other thread and Fios SD Comedy Central. Here the images are not as dramatically different at all, unlike your earlier statements. Some could argue the FiOS image is very very very close, if not better.

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/503/dcchddk8.jpghttp://img177.imageshack.us/img177/2553/fioshead41at1.png (http://imageshack.us)

bull3964

01-27-09, 08:59 AM

I do not have the ability to pull HD Images from D*.

Some people see lines in the graphic above. Apparently you do not. An eye examine is in order.

Stop putting words in my mouth. I stated many times that there is a difference. I just do not believe the difference is all that great. This "get your eyes examined" shtick is getting old seeing as how I never said they were identical to begin with.

Eye examine and Calibration....I was correct several posts ago. It is your TV's fault, not FiOS. The proof is above - your set just cannot reproduce it.

That really doesn't make sense to me seeing as how there are other SD channels that do look amazing. If my TV was at fault, SD should look like crap across the board, but it doesn't. I do not have an explanation why your individual frames show more detail than what I see on my TV, but I stand by my earlier statement that the direcTV shots are more representative of what I see when I watch the show than the FIOS shots.

If you want to write it off as my TV, so be it. But that just illustrates the point even further as to why we need the HD versions of these stations when available (providing they aren't doing stretchovision) since if my TV is having issues reproducing SD material with the amount of time I've spent calibrating it, there are a whole lot of people that have it a lot worse.

Verizon would most likely add the Viacom stations at a price point, but clearly Viacom believes there cable offerings of Non-HD Material at this point is not worth it. Quite frankly, considering the large amount of Non-HD on MTV, VH1, CMT, Nick, Comedy Central etc, I tend to agree with FiOS that I surely would not spend much extra for their HD Channels at this point.

But they find value in adding HSN HD and all those various .tv networks? My opinion is, if a network offers even a single show in HD, it's worth it to add to a lineup because at that point you are no longer the quality leader. Not to mention I would much rather have these channels early while more HD content is going online than wait until the majority of the content is HD. The later case puts me in a position where I end up missing out on a lot of HD content while I sit around waiting.

HeadShot from D* HD Comedy Central image in the other thread and Fios SD Comedy Central. Here the images are not as dramatically different at all, unlike your earlier statements. Some could argue the FiOS image is very very very close, if not better.

There's significant haloing around Colbert's head in the SD shot. The blue background is riddled with artifacts that are either due to the resizing process, or are present in the source to begin with.

On top of all that though, a 1080i image was reduced in resolution to match the capture frame of the SD shot and then blown up again by you. Even you have to admit that's not really an ideal comparison. What we really need is the full 1080i frame from the HD station and then upscale the SD frame (using the best algorithm available) and then compare the results.

We're really not going to end up agreeing and I have no interest in this conversation devolving in into a snipe attack back and forth for pages and pages so I'll just drop it. I think we can all agree though that more HD stations is never a bad thing and hopefully we'll be seeing an announcement soon.

One thing I have to ask though. Do you have the audio quality problem on Comedy Central that myself and others have reported? This would tell us whether or not you are watching the exact same broadcast that I am. If the audio on your comedy central doesn't sound like a busted clock radio, then it's not too far of a stretch to say I'm not getting the same quality video you are either.

URFloorMatt

01-27-09, 10:06 AM

Verizon would most likely add the Viacom stations at a price point, but clearly Viacom believes there cable offerings of Non-HD Material at this point is not worth it. Quite frankly, considering the large amount of Non-HD on MTV, VH1, CMT, Nick, Comedy Central etc, I tend to agree with FiOS that I surely would not spend much extra for their HD Channels at this point.There is zero chance that this (lack of actual HD) is the reason Verizon does not yet have an agreement with Viacom.

tractng

01-27-09, 02:20 PM

Hello,

Anybody know how I can unprogram this feature where I press the power button, both my tv and cable goes on or off?

The verizon guy showed us really quick. He pressed something like "input" or A/V".

The feature somehow confuses my tv so I like to undo it.

Btw, do anybody here actually turn off the cable box when not in used?

Thanks,
Tony

Jim Hef

01-27-09, 05:06 PM

I think I have figured out the problem with Fox Soccer, and has been reported with GOLTV, regarding the amazingly poor quality of the picture on these channels. Today, I turned on Comcast Sports Net, a high def channel that is very good quality. They had an English soccer match on, and it was unwatchable. Europe, and I assume Australia/New Zealand, use PAL which has 576 lines, and broadcast at 50Hz. My conjecture is that these matches, being broadcast on European equipment, need so much processing that by the time they reach us, they are totally scrambled in appearance. Make sense???

ieko

01-27-09, 07:05 PM

I also think they bit starve the uplinks to North America, there's almost always swimming grass on these feeds. Setanta does a pretty decent job with picture quality (all things considered) but there audio has noticble artifacts, it wouldn't be so bad if I wasn't paying $15/mo for the channel.

GeekGirl

01-27-09, 07:41 PM

Anybody know how I can unprogram this feature where I press the power button, both my tv and cable goes on or off?

The verizon guy showed us really quick. He pressed something like "input" or A/V". The feature somehow confuses my tv so I like to undo it.

Btw, do anybody here actually turn off the cable box when not in used?
Thanks, Tony1. Yes, you can unprogram your remote. It's in the manual called "Power Key", or something like that. OFF by default, the tech enabled it to turn your TV ON/OFF together with the STB. I like mine on, but you can disable it. Just check the remote manual (there are several versions, all manuals available on Verizon's web site if you lost yours).

The manual might not be clear on how to "undo". I'd just reprogram the remote for one device (STB). That should do it.

2. As long as the front panel light is off, that's about all you need to do. It's actually on 24/7, but at a much lower power draw. Been discussed many times. No need to unplug it (or put it on a switched outlet). Besides, if it breaks, just call up Verizon for a replacement.

tractng

01-27-09, 07:44 PM

1. Yes, you can unprogram your remote. It's in the manual called "Power Key", or something like that. OFF by default, the tech enabled it to turn your TV ON/OFF together with the STB. I like mine on, but you can disable it. Just check the remote manual (there are several versions, all manuals available on Verizon's web site if you lost yours).

The manual might not be clear on how to "undo". I'd just reprogram the remote for one device (STB). That should do it.

2. As long as the front panel light is off, that's about all you need to do. It's actually on 24/7, but at a much lower power draw. Been discussed many times. No need to unplug it (or put it on a switched outlet). Besides, if it breaks, just call up Verizon for a replacement.

Thanks geekgirl. It is nice to see a different gender on this board :).

Tony

BeachComber

01-27-09, 11:21 PM

There is zero chance that this (lack of actual HD) is the reason Verizon does not yet have an agreement with Viacom.

I believe you failed to grasp the context of my statement.

Viacom maintains that they are the #2 most watched group of cable channels. Because of this, they believe that they should get revenue in relation to everyone else in this context.

When CBS and Viacom was one (during the last negotiations) it was easier to justify the cost with major MSOs.

Now that CBS is out of Viacom, the head of Viacom fired (Tom Freston) for a falling stock price and a weak economy, the newer head of Viacom knows to get revenue up he needs to make dramatic deals upward for higher rates.

Thus, they are going to Verizon wanting to be paid like the #2 viewed cable group if Verizon wants to renegotiate its contract to include HD Channels.

Now, if Viacom actually had several hours of HD on any of their channels besides Palladium each day, perhaps the demand would be high and Verizon would be forced to bite the bullet and pay it.

However, as there is little HD and over 90% of the programming in SD on this group of channels, it makes no real sense for Verizon to run up the cost (and a HD Extreme Plus Package) just to include them, especially when you have the true HD Content Channels that they offer (Showtime family/Palladium/TMC).

As noted, I don't disagree with their thinking on that.

BeachComber

01-27-09, 11:23 PM

But they find value in adding HSN HD .

Yes, that kept your cable bill lower. HSN pays THEM to be added.

If Viacom will do the same, I am sure Verizon would add them tomorrow.

jeepmatt

01-28-09, 06:13 AM

Reports out of Oregon are that as of yesterday, Golf HD is live on 593.

At least its a start.

gdeep

01-28-09, 08:33 AM

Reports out of Oregon are that as of yesterday, Golf HD is live on 593.

At least its a start.

Here in WA following channels are airing now:

Golf HD
HSN HD
Encore HD

I don't see any other channels yet.

bull3964

01-28-09, 08:40 AM

Confirmed those 3 for Pittsburgh as well.

Jim Hef

01-28-09, 10:38 AM

We don't even have a "coming soon" banner for 593!

jtrain

01-28-09, 12:03 PM

Can confirm that we received:

CBS College Sports (SD) ch. 94
Chiller (SD) ch. 193
BlueHwys (SD) ch. 246
QUBO ch. 491
ION Life ch. 492
Worship ch. 494
MyNetwork TV (HD) ch. 513
Golf HD ch. 593

among others, but those are the ones that stood out to me...there were one or two up in the 1700's somewhere of which I don't venture.

glad to see it.

rlind50688

01-28-09, 01:23 PM

Can confirm the following adds in Buffalo, NY

CBS College Sports (SD) on Ch. 94
Chiller (SD) on Ch. 193
Blue Highway TV (SD) on Ch. 246
CCTV-9 (SD) on Ch. 277
Starz Indie (SD) on Ch. 348
Starz Retro (SD) on Ch. 349
Golf HD (HD) on Ch. 593
HSN HD (HD) on Ch. 651
Encore HD (HD) on Ch. 850
Zee TV (SD) on Ch. 1753
SETAsia (SD) on Ch. 1754
Jus Punjabi (SD) on Ch. 1757
Deutsche Welle (SD) on Ch. 1787
ProSeinbenSat.1Welt (SD) on Ch. 1788

Those are the adds as of 1 p.m.

URFloorMatt

01-28-09, 01:24 PM

For those interested, Verizon's fourth quarter report indicates that there are now 1.9 million FiOS TV subscribers out of 9 million available subscribers. Verizon had a substantial uptick of 303,000 new subscribers in Q4, compared to prior quarters where the numbers were usually in the low 200,000 range.

Verizon remains the ninth largest provider of television service in the United States, behind the two satellite operators and the six largest cable providers. Verizon will likely pass Bright House, which has 2.3 million subscribers, in the first half of this year, and if it keeps up its pace of 300,000 additions per quarter, could pass Cablevision, which has 3.1 million subscribers, by the end of the year.

http://www.tvweek.com/news/2009/01/verizon_accelerates_fios_tv_se.php
http://www.ncta.com/Statistic/Statistic/Top25MSOs.aspx

gdeep

01-28-09, 03:28 PM

chitchatjf

01-28-09, 03:30 PM

NOTHING in Boston in the case of channel ads.

Even tried rebooting the box and nope!

gdeep

01-28-09, 04:27 PM

NOTHING in Boston in the case of channel ads.

Even tried rebooting the box and nope!

Have you tried looking at the verizon's online channel list? The list got updated today for us with new channels. If you see the new channels for your area in the online channel list then I'm sure you will get the new channels soon.

afiggatt

01-28-09, 05:10 PM

NOTHING in Boston in the case of channel ads.

Even tried rebooting the box and nope!
Patience. No sign of Golf HD here in VHO 4 either. It may get added tomorrow or next week. I guess the other HD channels listed as "coming soon" for over 2 months such as NBA Network HD and Crime & Investigation HD are still "coming soon". If we are lucky the Entertainment Studios *.tv channels will never move pass coming soon.

Ok, even if Verizon doesn't have a deal for the Viacom HD channels - and it looks like only Comedy Central and Spike HD are the only missing ones of much interest to avsforum Fios subscribers, it would be nice to get MLB HD and AMC HD sooner, rather than later. Oh, adding MSNBC HD the day it starts up would be nice too.

cat6man

01-28-09, 05:27 PM

i assume mlb-hd will be there for opening day

coyoteaz

01-28-09, 05:28 PM

Nothing in North Texas yet.

BeachComber

01-28-09, 09:48 PM

I suspect thats why my cable boxes updated at 11:35 AM this morning.

coyoteaz

01-29-09, 05:06 AM

afiggatt

01-29-09, 10:46 AM

Anyone else have their clear QAM get shaken up?
Not as of yesterday when I did a channel scan. I'll check later today. Don't you get the digital broadcast locals that are in the QAM 71 to 74 range mapped to their broadcast channel numbers? Interesting that they are moving the SD locals around, but why put a SD version of the HD local two per QAM? The center-cut of the digital HD channels is what they have to do as there will soon be no analog SD feed to use. But shouldn't Verizon be making use of the AFD codes to switch the SD versions between center-cut and letterboxing?

In the Washington DC market, we have 4 local digital stations with no HD sub-channels that were added some time ago to the QAM line-up at QAM 75, 78, 82. Verizon passes the PSIP channel mapping through for only the WPXW-DT Ion 66 station, but WPXW-DT should be switching to a 720p HD sub-channel on or after February 16. I figure Verizon will eventually add the local Univision station and the digital LP stations as they go live to the 2 locals per QAM set.

coyoteaz

01-29-09, 05:03 PM

No PSIP information is on anything 67-75 as of right now. Verizon used to provide it for 71-75, but it went away sometime between Tuesday night and primetime yesterday when they reshuffled. The ones that are 2 per QAM are the lesser stations that are 480i only on their OTA broadcast (Spanish networks and whatnot). SD versions of the HD locals are right now running 3 per QAM with a bunch of nullpackets, but who knows what will happen with those since they could just as easily put all 9 on the same QAM with no real hit in quality since they're only 528x480i to begin with.

BeachComber

01-29-09, 07:20 PM

Not as of yesterday when I did a channel scan. I'll check later today. Don't you get the digital broadcast locals that are in the QAM 71 to 74 range mapped to their broadcast channel numbers? Interesting that they are moving the SD locals around, but why put a SD version of the HD local two per QAM? The center-cut of the digital HD channels is what they have to do as there will soon be no analog SD feed to use. But shouldn't Verizon be making use of the AFD codes to switch the SD versions between center-cut and letterboxing?

In the Washington DC market, we have 4 local digital stations with no HD sub-channels that were added some time ago to the QAM line-up at QAM 75, 78, 82. Verizon passes the PSIP channel mapping through for only the WPXW-DT Ion 66 station, but WPXW-DT should be switching to a 720p HD sub-channel on or after February 16. I figure Verizon will eventually add the local Univision station and the digital LP stations as they go live to the 2 locals per QAM set.

Who do you think is using AFD codes at this point?

Chris Rein

01-29-09, 11:50 PM

Anyone else have their clear QAM get shaken up? Had some big changes today here in North TX: all the local HD channels went from minor channel of the ATSC broadcast channel (for example, KTVT 11.1/DTV19 was on 72.19) to 1 followed by the 500-series number for the HD channel (KTVT is now 72.1511). Also, most of the SD locals that were muxed onto 63-65 have now been moved to 67-70 and 75, and paired 2 per QAM like the rest of the local DTV broadcasts. The only channels remaining on 63-65 are an LP station with no DTV and SD versions of the HD channels, most of which appear to be centercuts of the HD channel rather than the separate SD feed we used to get.

Whew. Glad I wasn't the only one seeing this. All my HDHomeRun Channels were borked in Media Center (recording blank channels). Did a rescan and all were moved. Drove me crazy as I thought I had 2 bad HDHomeRuns or a Media Center on the fritz. Call me crazy, but after the move, the PQ was a tad better (which is awesomerrrr...) :)

And I am in North Texas as well.

coyoteaz

01-30-09, 01:01 AM

The PQ on the SD channels should be somewhat better since they're running at higher bitrate than before when they were 9/QAM. The centercuts are comically bad with how much gets cut off from the sides. Shows that aren't shot 4:3-safe like ER and Smallville are practically unwatchable in SD since 1/3 of the action is off-screen. I happened to catch a Progressive insurance commercial (hard to avoid that psycho chick) and half the phone number was cut off. TV stations are going to be forced to implement AFD whether they want to or not, because advertisers won't stand for that nonsense for very long.

BeachComber

01-30-09, 03:35 AM

hernanu

01-30-09, 12:32 PM

The material is coded for AFD and most of the plants do not have the ability to pass AFD data.

The only thing that will happen is commercials will be shot 4:3 safe.

When you say plants, where in the pipeline is that? I'm assuming the FIOS STB's handle AFD well.

For those unacquainted with AFD, here is a concise but good explanation (thanks to pjdaniel):

http://www.pjdaniel.org.uk/afd/index.asp

bull3964

01-30-09, 03:12 PM

hernanu

01-30-09, 07:10 PM

I don't think aspect ratio adjustment is going to be done on the STB level when it comes to cable systems for SD material. It is Verizon that would use the ADF data to decide how to convert the HD 16:9 stream to an SD 4:3 stream for their SD channels (either converting to letterboxed 16:9 or center cutting.) The problem is, your local broadcaster may have the capability to pass that ADF data from the network to Verizon so they don't know to do anything but center cut the material. I'm pretty sure the SD boxes from Verzion are devoid of any aspect ratio controls.

I thought the whole point of the ADF system was to process the signal as far down the line as possible. The STB's are the ones that know the aspect ratio of the TV they are connected to, so they would be able to feed the correct signal, I would think.

bull3964

01-31-09, 02:28 AM

I thought the whole point of the ADF system was to process the signal as far down the line as possible. The STB's are the ones that know the aspect ratio of the TV they are connected to, so they would be able to feed the correct signal, I would think.

I believe the main point of AFD is having a way to deal with mixed aspect ratio content on 4:3 displays when the signal is 16:9 so that networks only have to provide a single feed. In that respect, yes, it is moving it down the line.

However, pushing it down to the STB level isn't really necessary nor really desired. You don't need to know what the aspect ratio of the TV is in this case. It is 4:3, otherwise you'll be watching the HD feed.

The problem that AFD overcomes is the dilemma that comes with creating 4:3 stream from a 16:9 stream. You need to have a way of displaying both 16:9 content letterboxed and full screen 4:3 content that was pillarboxed in the 16:9 frame.

If you just flat downconvert the 16:9 content as letterboxed in a 4:3 frame, any 4:3 content would end up windowboxed on a 4:3 display. If you just flat centercut the material, then you say goodbye to any widescreen content on the 4:3 display. So, that's the purpose of AFD, to give the provider who is making the SD signal a clue as to whether they should downconvert or centercut which allows show creators the abillity to control how their content is to be displayed on 4:3 displays and also provides the ability to present 4:3 material fullscreen on a 4:3 display.

Bringing it down to the STB level doesn't make much sense because you still have the problem of how to create the SD stream. AFD is important at the point of downconversion only and that downconversion is going to happen before it hits the STB.

The real way around this mess is to put an HD-STB in every house, eliminate the SD channels entirelly, and let the downconverting heppen at the box level. At that point, AFD isn't required since the individual can choose how they see their content.

BeachComber

01-31-09, 05:32 AM

When you say plants, where in the pipeline is that? I'm assuming the FIOS STB's handle AFD well.

The only network that *MAY* have AFD in place in their plant is NBC - Quite frankly, I am not sure if they even have implemented it.

That does not mean that the local NBC Stations have the ability in their plant to use it (and I suspect most do not).

I could easily be wrong, but I suspect none of the current generation of STBs have any provisions for AFD (as far as I am aware).

EDIT: Bull3964 sums it up very nicely in his post above (#9179)

redskins4life

01-31-09, 12:16 PM

Thanks in advance for your answers to the following questions:

1. Is the pq on SD and HD still significantly better than D* mpeg 4?

2. what is the amount for the top tier package that you are paying, the real price after taxes etc.?

3. Are the Nats available in HD on MASN-HD yet, if not has it been confirmed that this will happen by opening day, I want to watch 100 losses in the best PQ:)

4. Has Vz corrected all the annoying media guide update lose your dvr stuff that was happening when I switched?

Thanks !!

DCFan

01-31-09, 04:16 PM

Thanks in advance for your answers to the following questions:

3. Are the Nats available in HD on MASN-HD yet, if not has it been confirmed that this will happen by opening day, I want to watch 100 losses in the best PQ:)

I'll help you with this one. FiOS did not have an HD channel for the 40-some Nats HD games last year so the only games we saw in HD were those on channel 20 or the 2 (?) times they were on national TV (ESPN and Fox).

As of today's date, FiOS does not have a channel set aside for MASN-HD when it becomes a 24/7/365 network some time in March. Will it pop up magically in time for opening day? It's anyones guess at this point. I suspect they will. :D

afiggatt

01-31-09, 04:28 PM

1. Is the pq on SD and HD still significantly better than D* mpeg 4?
2. what is the amount for the top tier package that you are paying, the real price after taxes etc.?
3. Are the Nats available in HD on MASN-HD yet, if not has it been confirmed that this will happen by opening day, I want to watch 100 losses in the best PQ:)
4. Has Vz corrected all the annoying media guide update lose your dvr stuff that was happening when I switched?
1. HD quality probably not that much better than D* mpeg 4 (but as D* adds more HD channels, that might change). The Fios SD picture quality should be better, but Verizon put some lousy SD image processing software in the 1.6 release that is *supposed* to be fixed in the next IMG release. But with 100+ HD channels, the SD channels are becoming less important to me.
2. Real price depends on the bundle. Verizon has very aggressive bundle discounts if you go with the 10/5 or 20/5 net and phone. My bill went down when I switched to the HD Extreme package with 20/5 net.
3. The full time MASN-HD channel won't launch until March. Verizon takes their time in adding HD channels, so can't say for sure that they will have MASN-HD by opening day.
4. I have never lost my DVR recordings through all the IMG upgrades. Except, IIRC, for one or two corrupted program recordings. But YMMV.

redskins4life

02-01-09, 03:56 PM

Thanks for the input. I am surprised to hear you don't think the HD on VZ is alot better thanD*.

Given the fact that I switched to D* to get comcast HD ( wasn't there at the time) I will wait to make sure that they are adding the MASN

BeachComber

02-01-09, 04:02 PM

Thanks for the input. I am surprised to hear you don't think the HD on VZ is alot better thanD*.

Notice he said "probably". That means he does not know, has not compared and is speculating.

The HD Channels that are supplied in MPEG2 from the provider (most HD Non-Premium Channels and Primary Premium Movie Channel), FiOS has an advantage. With the MPEG4 from provider (usually the secondary Premium Movie Channels such as HBO2-HD or MoreMaxHD) its more of a toss up.

URFloorMatt

02-01-09, 04:49 PM

BeachComber

02-02-09, 04:21 AM

It's actually not more of a toss up, since DirecTV doesn't carry any of those HBO/Cinemax secondary premium channels in HD (and barely any of them even in SD). They do carry some of the secondary Showtime and Starz channels, so if those are MPEG4 then those might be more of a toss up.

Correct....(remind me not to post when drinking Pre-Superbowl). I also saw a Boston Legal rerun a few minutes ago where Alan made the same objection to a witness on the stand when he used the word "probably"......strange timing.....

Anyway, the Movies are stored MPEG2 on Servers at the Premium Networks. HBO feeds it out of the Servers, sending out a MPEG2 feed on 127W/Transponder 10 and converts the MPEG2 feed out to MPEG4 as well on the MPEG4 feed for HBO-HD on 133W/Transponder 19. FiOS has the advantage with the MPEG2 feed as the MPEG4 feed goes through an extra MPEG2>MPEG4 conversion. HBO also uses 125W/Transponder 8 for additional MPEG4 channels.

All the Starz and Sho secondary channels are feed out MPEG2 > MPEG4 encoders for distribution. StarzHD feeds the main HD MPEG2 Channel on 127W/Transponder 9 and the Main and SubChannels via MPEG4 on 127W/Transponder 15. Directv and Dish pass them on in MPEG4, while FiOS reconverts the subchannels to MPEG2 at the SHO (Super Head End, not SHOwtime). However, even though it was reported early on that HBO for example was requiring 9Mbps minimum for the MPEG4 channels, Directv and Dish are still not passing the fullbandwidth of the MPEG4 feed for Starz and SHO, so its more of a toss up as to what is better, FiOS or Directv.

On the other hand, this might be exactly why HBO and Cinemax HD secondary channels are NOT on Directv as they are not passing 9Mbps.

hernanu

02-02-09, 09:41 AM

The only network that *MAY* have AFD in place in their plant is NBC - Quite frankly, I am not sure if they even have implemented it.

That does not mean that the local NBC Stations have the ability in their plant to use it (and I suspect most do not).

I could easily be wrong, but I suspect none of the current generation of STBs have any provisions for AFD (as far as I am aware).

EDIT: Bull3964 sums it up very nicely in his post above (#9179)

Thanks to both of you - nice to see where it fits in.

bull3964

02-02-09, 11:08 AM

You want to know the biggest reason why I want them to implement AFD? So the networks can move their stupid bug back to the corner of the frame rather than the 4:3 safe area. They know it's getting centercut 99% of the time now, so they just HAVE to put the bug in the 4:3 safe area lest everyone forget what network they are watching.

jeepmatt

02-02-09, 01:13 PM

MASN HD is in VZ's plans - I can confirm, that things are in place to launch this when it goes full-time.

Golf HD
- For VHO8 only (DE/PA/South NJ) - this will go live on 2/11

jtrain

02-02-09, 01:49 PM

any word on NBA TV? I see the Blazers/Hornets on are on tonight, will be a nice addition when they actually get it rolled out.

123HDTV

02-02-09, 06:02 PM

any word on NBA TV? I see the Blazers/Hornets on are on tonight, will be a nice addition when they actually get it rolled out.

I don't think we'd get to see it anyway. NBA TV blocks in the local market. When I had DirecTv I couldn't watch the Blazer games on NBA TV.

Walter L.

02-02-09, 06:05 PM

I don't think we'd get to see it anyway. NBA TV blocks in the local market. When I had DirecTv I couldn't watch the Blazer games on NBA TV.
It is not blocked here in Portland @ DishNetwork. In fact that's the case everytime that the Blazer are on NBATV

123HDTV

02-02-09, 10:06 PM

Excellent... Dish isn't adhering to the rules. That helps folks in PDX.

DCFan

02-02-09, 10:26 PM

MASN HD is in VZ's plans - I can confirm, that things are in place to launch this when it goes full-time.

Excellent news. Thanks! :D

bull3964

02-03-09, 01:18 AM

They finally fixed the audio on Comedy Central. Yay!

Lets see if it sticks.

Marcus Carr

02-05-09, 03:40 PM

Philly Council OKs Verizon FiOS TV

Mayor Nutter Must Sign 15-Year Franchise Agreement Into Law Before Telco Can Compete In Comcast's Backyard

Todd Spangler -- Multichannel News, 2/5/2009 11:36:08 AM MT

Verizon Communications got some brotherly love in Comcast's home town of Philadelphia, with the city council Thursday unanimously approving the 15-year franchise agreement that will allow the telco to sell FiOS TV to residents.

The telco, under the terms of the cable franchise, will make FiOS TV available throughout the city over the next seven years. The ordinance still requires Mayor Michael Nutter to sign the legislation into law.

"We urge Mayor Nutter to sign the ordinance expeditiously so that Verizon can start bringing the many benefits of cable TV choice to Philadelphia residents in 2009," Verizon Pennsylvania president Gale Given said in a statement.

Like Comcast, Verizon would pay the city a 5% franchise fee. According to the franchise, Verizon's performance may be reviewed annually and it is required to have a local service manager and offices, among other local customer service obligations.

In addition, the agreement requires Verizon to pay into the public access coffers, but not until the fifth year of its franchise pact. After that date, Verizon would pay grants of $1 million for educational access, $1.5 million for government access and $2.7 million for public access.

Verizon claims it will offer "twice as many high-definition channels" as Comcast in Philadelphia. The telco delivers at least 100 HD channels in all its markets. Comcast in Philadelphia offers 34 HDs, according to the MSO's Web site.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/173677-Philly_Council_OKs_Verizon_FiOS_TV.php

Ken Ross

02-05-09, 09:54 PM

Is it me or have all the 'coming soon' channels disappeared?

coyoteaz

02-05-09, 10:03 PM

Encore and HSN HD are now live here in North TX. No Golf HD "coming soon" or otherwise yet.

HDntheCity

02-06-09, 04:41 AM

Is it me or have all the 'coming soon' channels disappeared?

yep they've gone missing here too.

plus Golf-HD is in the guide, full info, you can tune to it. BUT!!!.......

you're told "You Are Not Subscribed!!!"-even tho I SHOULD be(got Extreme HD & all the other Sports pkg. chs[Tennis-HD, Outdoor-HD et. al.])

anyone else in Richmond or Hampton Roads, VA?

Rutgar

02-06-09, 07:52 AM

Last night, I was watching Lost off of my DVR. About 2/3rds of the way through the thing locked up and the picture froze. I reset the unit several times and it still would lock up. I called Verizon Technical support and all they did was have me reset it again and delete the recorded program. When I complained about how 'glitchy' both of my DVR's are from them, all I got was silence. I then asked if there was newer unit that maybe had fewer issues, he said there was a newer DVR, but I would have to call CS and deal with them to get one.

Anyone here know anything about the new DVRs, Verizon has? Are the more stable, larger HD space? I'm also guessing that Verizon wouldn't just swap me out without wanting more money. Even though I already pay them an outragous amount every month.

kes601

02-06-09, 08:14 AM

Anyone here know anything about the new DVRs, Verizon has? Are the more stable, larger HD space? I'm also guessing that Verizon wouldn't just swap me out without wanting more money. Even though I already pay them an outragous amount every month.

They have a model 7216, same amount of space. I would avoid it for now. The current IMG causes a channel problem on them -- unable to view the channel until you reboot the box.

You probably hit a bad spot in the hard drive. It happens. Not saying you don't have a right to be upset, I would be too. But, unfortunately that's the way it goes sometimes.

kes601

02-06-09, 08:14 AM

yep they've gone missing here too.

plus Golf-HD is in the guide, full info, you can tune to it. BUT!!!.......

you're told "You Are Not Subscribed!!!"-even tho I SHOULD be(got Extreme HD & all the other Sports pkg. chs[Tennis-HD, Outdoor-HD et. al.])

anyone else in Richmond or Hampton Roads, VA?

As you know from our local thread, I am having the same issue too. I have a trouble ticket open over on DSLReports, but have not heard back yet. Hopefully today.

aaronwt

02-06-09, 08:30 AM

Rutgar

02-06-09, 09:09 AM

Time to get a TiVo. I don't have any problems like that with the four TiVos I use with FIOS. Plus I can record over 550 hours of HD programming with them since all the drives are upgraded.

And then I can also transfer any of the recordings from FIOS to a PC for permanent storage or to burn to a DVD or BD(if i ever buy a BD burner)

I used to have TIVO years ago with DirecTV. I loved TIVO! Lot's more HD space than these POS Motorolas! And they simply WORKED! I don't recall any of the glitchy crap that have to put up with, with the Motos.

I didn't know you could use TIVO with FIOS. Who did you have to go through to get the Tivo unit? And what's Verizon's policy on this?

Funny, when I was talking to the technical support guy last night, I mentioned to him that I never had these sorts of issues when I had a Tivo. He didn't say anything about being able to use Tivo with Fios. But then again, while I was talking to this guy, I got the impression that he was just going through the motions and wasn't going to say or do anything that he didn't have to.

AbMagFab

02-06-09, 10:53 AM

I used to have TIVO years ago with DirecTV. I loved TIVO! Lot's more HD space than these POS Motorolas! And they simply WORKED! I don't recall any of the glitchy crap that have to put up with, with the Motos.

I didn't know you could use TIVO with FIOS. Who did you have to go through to get the Tivo unit? And what's Verizon's policy on this?

Funny, when I was talking to the technical support guy last night, I mentioned to him that I never had these sorts of issues when I had a Tivo. He didn't say anything about being able to use Tivo with Fios. But then again, while I was talking to this guy, I got the impression that he was just going through the motions and wasn't going to say or do anything that he didn't have to.

You can buy a Tivo from Best Buy, WalMart, whatever. Then just have FIOS Install a couple of cable cards. Easy as pie!

Rutgar

02-06-09, 11:25 AM

You can buy a Tivo from Best Buy, WalMart, whatever. Then just have FIOS Install a couple of cable cards. Easy as pie!

Ah. Okay, I see. Pretty much the same as when TIVO was DirecTV. Yeah, I would love to be able to call up Verizon and tell them they can have thier MOTO back.

Does anyone know what Verizons policy is on this. Do they have any sort of monthly service charge for the drop using the TIVO? Right now, I'm paying $9.00/month for the HD-DVR. So TIVOs fee would be just a little more expensive.

HDntheCity

02-06-09, 01:21 PM

Ah. Okay, I see. Pretty much the same as when TIVO was DirecTV. Yeah, I would love to be able to call up Verizon and tell them they can have thier MOTO back.

Does anyone know what Verizons policy is on this. Do they have any sort of monthly service charge for the drop using the TIVO? Right now, I'm paying $9.00/month for the HD-DVR. So TIVOs fee would be just a little more expensive.

$9/Mo. for an HD DVR? how'd you get that deal? seems everyone else is paying about $13.

as for switching to a Tivo AFAIK you just have to rent 2 CableCards($4 ea.?) per Tivo unit.
and give Vz their box(es) back. is there a Vz service center in your area? if so I'd just bring it in. otherwise ring customer service & arrange to ship them back.

if Vz sends anyone to pick the boxes up you'll probably be charged for a truck roll($80!!).

MeatChicken

02-06-09, 02:26 PM

Rutgar

02-06-09, 02:36 PM

Also remember , if you go with Tivo, pay the monthy fee AND rent 2 cable cards as well, you still won't have access to OnDemand or PPV w/ the Tivo, nor the VZ IMG/Guide, unless you also keep renting a VZ box on top of all that..

Okay, I'm a little confused then. I can live without the OnDemand and PPV. I don't use them anyway. But I'm not sure what you mean by IMG/Guide.

shadowcaster

02-06-09, 02:43 PM

Also remember , if you go with Tivo, pay the monthy fee AND rent 2 cable cards as well, you still won't have access to OnDemand or PPV w/ the Tivo, nor the VZ IMG/Guide, unless you also keep renting a VZ box on top of all that..
I think one of his points was that he liked the Tivo guide better than Vzn's.

So you have to buy the Tivo HD ($300.00) and then pay Tivo
$12.95/mo for their guide plus the cable card. So $20/mo for Tivo
vs. $15.9/mo for Moto DVR.

I still don't understand why Tivo charges so much for their guide info.

If it dropped to $8.95/mo they would get a ton of Vzn customers to go their route and more than make up for the price drop, IMO.

shadowcaster

02-06-09, 02:46 PM

But I'm not sure what you mean by IMG/Guide.
That's the Interactive Media Guide.

URFloorMatt

02-06-09, 02:49 PM

Media, not Menu.

markjrenna

02-06-09, 02:50 PM

Interactive Media Guide

Rutgar

02-06-09, 02:53 PM

Ah. Okay, thanks.

Yeah the pricing does add up. Especially when you consider that you have to purchase the unit, and then also if you have more than one HD set.

The suck thing is I already have an older HD TIVO unit that cost me $600.00 from back in my DirecT days. It's been collecting dust in a closet for several years now.

Rutgar

02-06-09, 02:57 PM

I think one of his points was that he liked the Tivo guide better than Vzn's.

So you have to buy the Tivo HD ($300.00) and then pay Tivo
$12.95/mo for their guide plus the cable card. So $20/mo for Tivo
vs. $15.9/mo for Moto DVR.

I still don't understand wy Tivo charges so much for their guide info.

If it dropped to $8.95/mo they would get a ton of Vzn customers to go their route and more than make up for the price drop, IMO.

Yeah. Someone should tell those guys we're in a recession! ;)

bfdtv

02-06-09, 03:10 PM

I didn't know you could use TIVO with FIOS. Who did you have to go through to get the Tivo unit? And what's Verizon's policy on this?The TivoHD sells for $200-$250. Apparently, most Sears locations now have them for $199 new. Figure in another $100 for a 1TB internal drive upgrade (or $130 for the 500GB Western Digital My DVR Expander eSATA drive).

TiVo does not sell their DVRs for a profit; they sell them at a small loss and make their money on the subscription. One of the following subscriptions is required: $12.99/mo, $129/yr, $299/3yrs, or a one-time payment of $399; this subscription includes nightly guide downloads, software and feature updates, and remote scheduling.

If Sears can sell the TivoHD for $199 and make a profit, then imagine what they must pay their distributer. Subtract the distributor's profit and you get the amount that TiVo recoups from the sale.

Further, you need one M-CARD from Verizon for $3.99/mo. The M-CARD supports both tuners on the TivoHD. If you've had FiOS TV service for more than 30 days, then Verizon will charge you $79 for a "truck roll" to install a CableCard (up from ~$20 a year ago). If you don't yet have FiOS TV, or you've had FiOS TV for less than 30 days, then you can avoid that fee. For some reason, Verizon is unwilling to ship CableCards like they do their STBs and DVRs.

If you pay $129/yr, plus $3.99/mo for one Verizon M-CARD, the average monthly cost works out to about $15/mo after taxes. The Verizon DVR is $15.99 and works out to about $17/mo after taxes. Both DVRs cost basically the same thing to use, so the real difference is in the upfront cost of the box, the cost of a 1TB drive upgrade or external drive, plus Verizon's fee to install a CableCard.

So you have to buy the Tivo HD ($300.00) and then pay Tivo
$12.95/mo for their guide plus the cable card. So $20/mo for Tivo
vs. $15.9/mo for Moto DVR.Verizon's DVR is closer to $17/mo after you account for taxes. In some states, it may be closer to $18/mo. Even then, programming fees subsidize the cost of the Verizon DVR.

As noted above, TiVo doesn't make money on the sale of the DVR. TiVo doesn't make money off programming fees. They make their money on the DVR subscription. Prepaid $129/yr works out to $10.75/mo and prepaid $299/3yrs works out to $8.30/mo, if you ignore TVM. You don't pay taxes on TiVo service unless you live in CA.