Is the offset the same as the HC3000u? Because if it is the Mitsubishi site as a Projector Calculator that includes distance offset and screen size it is really nice.

I hate to sound retarded but I can't figure out how the offest is going to work for me. (I've been trying but have given up)

How does the offset compare to the H27? I have the H27 and it works great mounted on a shelf on the rear wall. Is the offset of the H72 greater?

If the H72 offset will work for me it's going to be my next projector.

I'll admit I tried to calculate it but my math ain't so great.

Here is a simple way to calculate your offset:

Go to this link: http://www.projects.ex.ac.uk/trol/scol/calrtri.htm

Enter 6.52 in "Angle A" and your planned distance from your screen to the lens of the projector in "Edge B". Hit "Calculate" and "Edge A" will be the amount of drop from the center of the lens to the top of your screen.

BTW, 6.52 is from the HD72 manual.

For whatever reason, the normal way of referring to offset is as a % of the screen height. It seems easier to me to figure it as the actual drop as compared to the throw distance...

Here is a simple way to calculate your offset:

Go to this link: http://www.projects.ex.ac.uk/trol/scol/calrtri.htm

Enter 6.52 in "Angle A" and your planned distance from your screen to the lens of the projector in "Edge B". Hit "Calculate" and "Edge A" will be the amount of drop from the center of the lens to the top of your screen.

BTW, 6.52 is from the HD72 manual.

For whatever reason, the normal way of referring to offset is as a % of the screen height. It seems easier to me to figure it as the actual drop as compared to the throw distance...

Great. Exactly what I needed :D

So - if I understand this correctly - from the owners manaul the offset is actually greater on the H27 which I currently own. Having the projector mounted upsideown on a bookshelf behind me I'll have to either raise the screen or lower the projector to make it work. Is that correct???

H72 Owners manual - A is 6.52

http://www.optomausa.com/PDFs/usermanuals/Optoma_HD72_en_v1.pdf

H27 Owners manual - A is 9.23

http://www.optomausa.com/PDFs/usermanuals/H27_En_r9.pdf

The Offset is the distance between the center of the lens and the top (or bottom) of the screen. It is influenced by the angle of the projected beam and the distance between the projector and the screen. These parameters vary depending on the design of the projector.

The distance between the projector and the screen is calculated using the calculator at http://www.optomausa.com/distancecalculator.asp

According to the HD72 manual, the angle of the projected beam is 6.52 degree for a 16x10 screen. So the Offset is equal to the distance between the projector and the screen times the tangent of angle 6.52. For a 16x9 screen, the offset increases accordingly to the reduced height of the projected image.

Considering all of the above, the dimensions of some common size screens, etc are show in the table below.

Ok, I'm almost scared to admit this, but after owning the HD72 for almost two months, I think the best HD material I've seen is a Soap Opera! Yes, scary.

My wife watches "The Young and the Restless" on CBS, and I record it via DirecTV HD-DVR, off-air from the local affiliate. Every evening when she watches it (via Tivo), I end up sitting through it most of the time, and don't even mind because the PQ is incredible. (Plus, as soap's go it's not THAT bad)

I'm not sure what cameras and setup they use for the soap, but it has zero noise, super sharp, is not too bright, has tons of contrast, and isn't overly processed - it just looks so natural. In addition, there are many closeup scenes of faces which are incredible for skin tones and texture. Also, the show overall is fairly dark, with many scenes in darker rooms with oak-wood trim, walls, dark-cherry furniture, etc. which really shows the incredible details the HD72 is capable of in dark, natural-looking scenes. I can usually barely pay attention to the story line because I am constantly marveling at the PQ, and how stunning the female actress' eyes look when they do a closeup.

I hate to even suggest watching a soap opera, but this one is incredible PQ wise. I wish prime-time shows were up to this standard. Most (The OC on fox, for example) have noisy pictures, with areas of blown-out white, etc. This soap really shows what the format is capable of.

Ok, I'm almost scared to admit this, but after owning the HD72 for almost two months, I think the best HD material I've seen is a Soap Opera! Yes, scary.

My wife watches "The Young and the Restless" on CBS, and I record it via DirecTV HD-DVR, off-air from the local affiliate. Every evening when she watches it (via Tivo), I end up sitting through it most of the time, and don't even mind because the PQ is incredible. (Plus, as soap's go it's not THAT bad)

I'm not sure what cameras and setup they use for the soap, but it has zero noise, super sharp, is not too bright, has tons of contrast, and isn't overly processed - it just looks so natural. In addition, there are many closeup scenes of faces which are incredible for skin tones and texture. Also, the show overall is fairly dark, with many scenes in darker rooms with oak-wood trim, walls, dark-cherry furniture, etc. which really shows the incredible details the HD72 is capable of in dark, natural-looking scenes. I can usually barely pay attention to the story line because I am constantly marveling at the PQ, and how stunning the female actress' eyes look when they do a closeup.

I hate to even suggest watching a soap opera, but this one is incredible PQ wise. I wish prime-time shows were up to this standard. Most (The OC on fox, for example) have noisy pictures, with areas of blown-out white, etc. This soap really shows what the format is capable of.


yeah, I wish Univision would broadcast in HD along with SAP...I would be in heaven. :D

I wanted to thank everyone here for all their help -- ordered the projector today after talking to Projector People. We're going to set it up and see if the minor keystoning/angling we need to do to get it up off the floor more is noticeable (we need < 2 degrees, according to my calculations -- I knew all that trig in school would be useful!).

Phouka, I have my HD72 ceiling mounted, and tilted up a few degrees to get the image exactly where I want it (110"). I then mounted my (DIY) screen to the wall with hinges on the bottom, and tilted the top out a couple inches, resulting in zero keystone error.

Note, an added benefit is the screen angles down toward the viewer a little, giving you a more direct view. It's a great setup this way, and negates the issue of the HD72's high offset.

Just curious are there any Canadian Suppliers of this product yet?

Just curious are there any Canadian Suppliers of this product yet?
Sure, CompleteIT, Quebec Acoustic, Spectre Audio, Projectors Plus. Get the google going.

I see prices are starting to drop slightly,for the 72. :) Does anyone know what the replacement bulb costs are, aproximately ?

I see prices are starting to drop slightly,for the 72. :) Does anyone know what the replacement bulb costs are, aproximately ?

$400

One of the AVS Forum Alliance Members dropped the price by 100.00 in the last 24 hours. Placed my order today :)

Wow, even at $2k the Hd72 is a fabulous PJ. Price dropping makes it even more desireable!

Has anyone figured out what the firmware revision number is that corrects the "settings loss" problem?

And how you check firmware number to begin with..... :-)

Besides losing the lamp hours, what else gets lost when the HD72 does its amnesia thing? Mine does not lose the hours or color control settings, but the vertical offset keeps going back to zero every time the PJ powers up. I need this to fine tune the throw to my screen and having to set it each time is a drag. Anyone else having this problem? Thanks in advance!

PS - I've now got 30+ hours on it and I am so pleased with the PJ! Definitely the right one for me, my budget and my current living space. When I move to a new place later this year, a dedicated room for a 2.35 constant-height setup will be one of my top priorities! :)

Just fired mine up and the Digital Vertical Shift was remembered -36 for me. This feature knocks a ton off the offset. Another thing now after 75hrs the projector has gotten better, allot better. Blacks are deeper and I can dial in excellent tunings for dark content movies like Harry Potter Goblet and AVP. Checked them out today and these movies looked way better than day one.

My advise break in your projector and re-tune.

Tom are you using the Graywolf with the HD72.

Graywolf yes, Graywolf is extended to the max point. Puts the image very close to the 1/3 up from the botton viewing rule.

Some of you MAY remember that I had the Toshiba MT8 (Screenplay 7200) a few years back. We sold it to lighten up our room and replaced it with a Panasonic plasma which looks great.

THEN, a few weeks back we decided that we missed the big screen experience so we purchased an H72 and the Greywolf 92" screen. I've been calibrating projectors for years (back into the CRT front projector days), and I performed an AVIA calibration for my room on the new H72 as well.

I'm very disturbed by the performance (even after calibration). Flesh tones posterize into an orange muck and you can't get rid of it. The resolution looks very VHS on DVD using component out on the Sony 7700 player. It's sharp--- but what is sharp is not acute. Then, watching Hi-DEF programming yields a BETTER picture but not nearly the resolute performance I was expecting. Vivid color is OFF, Brilliant color is set to (2) with FILM gamma running cinema mode.

Was the Toshiba MT-8 (Screenplay 7200) an order of magnitude much better than the H72 in terms of depth, imaging and resolve? Or do I have a problem with my projector? DVD's just look cloudy without articulation that I was use to. Or is it that the Plasma spoiled me?

I need to decide whether I am going to keep this or upgrade it... but for now I'm at a loss as to why I find this projector so unsatisfying...

Thoughts?

Thanks-- Clint Thayer

May have found a bug. Source Lock, under the Options menu, will not stay “On”.

Try the following. Set the Source Lock to “On”. Switch to an input port without any signal and you’ll see the projector still cycle through the other ports looking for a signal. Now check the Source Lock condition; it should have reverted back to “Off”.

My HD72 did the "amnesia" thing last night. It seemed to loose everything starting with all setup items, it came on in default which was upside down with my ceiling mount. Could it be a power induced thing? I have the pj on surge protection.

Does this projector work on a back wall book shelf ? Or must it be ceiling or table mounted?

Thanks Tom/Guitarman and DrJRapp for the feedback. Mine is also ceiling mounted but has not reverted back to the default table-top mode. That would be a major clue as to whether mine has the reset problem or not. So far the only setting that changes between power-ups is the vertical offset. So last night I tweaked with the mount a little more to aim the throw better so I don't have to use any digital offset. Probably should have done that in the first place.

I did a "first pass" calibration when I first got the PJ using the Avia DVD along with another odd-ball test DVD I had. The Avia was the reference and the odd-ball was for a check. Just for fun I also pulled out my good ol' trusty copy of A Video Standard to see how my Pioneer Elite CLD-97 looked in comparison. Definitely some differences but color and grey-scales where not that far off from the DVDs. Overall brightness was a bit of an issue though as the LD had some blooms that needed taming. I'm planning on recalibrating from scratch once I get a 100 hours or so on the PJ. Otherwise, I'm lovin' it!!!! :)

My HD72 did the "amnesia" thing last night. It seemed to loose everything starting with all setup items, it came on in default which was upside down with my ceiling mount. Could it be a power induced thing? I have the pj on surge protection.


You'll need to send it in for the firmware. But last time I talked to Wing he said he would try to get the approval from Ti to send out their software. Then you could do the firmware at home. I'll call him today to see how it went. There is only a 1 in 4 chance out of the first 100 PJ's that came in from Taiwan which might have the reset problem.

Alex, due to the offset of this projector (32 - 37%) if mounted on a shelf at the back of the room it would need to be mounted to the bottom of the shelf, not sitting on it. Sitting on a shelf the projected image will be between 32-37% of the screen height higher than the center of the lens.

So with a shelf at the back of the room (I am assuming this shelf is above the heads of the folks in the room-- at least when seated) you would most likely be projecting on the ceiling unless as I mentioned you use some bolts and mount the projector to the bottom of the shelf... then it would all depend on the height of the shelf and the size of the image you are trying to project.

In most applications this projector will work best in a room with ceilings that are at least 8' or higher. There are some work-arounds for folks with lower ceilings, that involve tilting the projector and then tilting the screen or using a small amount of digital keystone to correct the image.

May have found a bug. Source Lock, under the Options menu, will not stay “On”.

Try the following. Set the Source Lock to “On”. Switch to an input port without any signal and you’ll see the projector still cycle through the other ports looking for a signal. Now check the Source Lock condition; it should have reverted back to “Off”.

It's the same with my HD72. I don't think this is something I would want to send a PJ in for a firmware though. You probably noticed the projector syncs up extremely fast to the signal input button you choose. Like an automatic sync lock, the pj doesn't look for other signals when you hit the particular signal button. Unless that signal has nothing on, like HDMI/DVD and your DVD players off.

You'll need to send it in for the firmware. But last time I talked to Wing he said he would try to get the approval from Ti to send out their software. Then you could do the firmware at home. I'll call him today to see how it went. There is only a 1 in 4 chance out of the first 100 PJ's that came in from Taiwan which might have the reset problem.

Tom.............

Do you know what the shipping version of the firmware was that had the "issue?"

Do you know the firmware number of the "revised" version...?

I would imagine that 2/3 (or more) of the first 100 projectors went to folks here on AVS...

When you talk to Wing, ask him if you can do the firmware upgrade on a projector that is sent in to you for calibration...??

Alex2, if the bookshelf is deep enough you should be able to place the PJ on one and use it in table-top mode. I don't know how high your shelves go, but the lower the better if you're going to throw the picture upwards.

Some of you MAY remember that I had the Toshiba MT8 (Screenplay 7200) a few years back. We sold it to lighten up our room and replaced it with a Panasonic plasma which looks great.

THEN, a few weeks back we decided that we missed the big screen experience so we purchased an H72 and the Greywolf 92" screen. I've been calibrating projectors for years (back into the CRT front projector days), and I performed an AVIA calibration for my room on the new H72 as well.

I'm very disturbed by the performance (even after calibration). Flesh tones posterize into an orange muck and you can't get rid of it. The resolution looks very VHS on DVD using component out on the Sony 7700 player. It's sharp--- but what is sharp is not acute. Then, watching Hi-DEF programming yields a BETTER picture but not nearly the resolute performance I was expecting. Vivid color is OFF, Brilliant color is set to (2) with FILM gamma running cinema mode.

Was the Toshiba MT-8 (Screenplay 7200) an order of magnitude much better than the H72 in terms of depth, imaging and resolve? Or do I have a problem with my projector? DVD's just look cloudy without articulation that I was use to. Or is it that the Plasma spoiled me?

I need to decide whether I am going to keep this or upgrade it... but for now I'm at a loss as to why I find this projector so unsatisfying...

Thoughts?

Thanks-- Clint Thayer

I would suggest getting a new DVD player... Oppo, for instance. This way you can let the Sony connected to the plasma and connect the Oppo to the HD72.

Tom.............

Do you know what the shipping version of the firmware was that had the "issue?"

Do you know the firmware number of the "revised" version...?

I would imagine that 2/3 (or more) of the first 100 projectors went to folks here on AVS...

When you talk to Wing, ask him if you can do the firmware upgrade on a projector that is sent in to you for calibration...??

Reading around someone said C17. Firmware number would be in the service menu but I won't be getting the codes anymore. Too many people stepped on their toes when walking around other service menu's. Luckily everything that's needed to calibrate the HD72 is in the user menu's. I would like to be able to tune up the HD72's and install any firmwares, maybe.

Tom my HD72 is on the UPS Truck for delivery today :) Do you have any suggested settings to get me by until the lamp settles down enough for a more complete Calibration?

I use the stock Cinema and Film gamma, brilliant color at 3, True vivid at 1, color temp at stock 1. Tune up with Avia/DVE/Sound & Vision from there.

They haven't heard back from Ti about their software. Tried to tell them to make up a scaled down version that could be sent out. This way Ti wouldn't out source all the software capabilities. It would be work to Ti they're busy but I hope they go this way, this way all future firmwares could be done at home.

Thanks Tom!

Another thing Wing gave me a tip on source settings.

In the Image/advance area there's an item called (Input Sources). Here you can uncheck any signals you don't use to cut down on traffic jams. They're all with X's which mean on, just click them to blank to delete.

Can anyone tell me the big differences between this and the Infocus N76?

Optoma uses Ti's new brilliant color. Brilliant color makes for high brightness and keeps color saturation strong at the same time. See Projector Centrals review of the HD72, they talk about a new level of color which closes the gap on DLP vs LCD color saturation.

May have found a bug. Source Lock, under the Options menu, will not stay “On”.

Try the following. Set the Source Lock to “On”. Switch to an input port without any signal and you’ll see the projector still cycle through the other ports looking for a signal. Now check the Source Lock condition; it should have reverted back to “Off”.
It's the same with my HD72. I don't think this is something I would want to send a PJ in for a firmware though. You probably noticed the projector syncs up extremely fast to the signal input button you choose. Like an automatic sync lock, the pj doesn't look for other signals when you hit the particular signal button. Unless that signal has nothing on, like HDMI/DVD and your DVD players off.

I agree it is not a bug that I would ship to Optoma to fix. Never the less, it is a bug to be fixed in future updates.

Has anyone else seen this problem?

Any input would be appreciated about this. I ordered a HD72 and did an advance replacement for the original that was sent, and recieved the replacement yesterday. This new projector makes a high pitched whining sound that I believe I have read is due to the colorwheel, and the 1st one I had did not make this noise. This is not the sound that you hear on start up of the projector, when the wheel first starts, but is more or a "ringing in the ear" that continues while it is running.
My question is if this is normal for a new DLP and it just needs to break in or if this is a symptom of a problem that could develop. I only fired it up 1x last night (since receiving it) but let it run for about 2 hours while I calibrated and watched some, so I don't even know if it will still do this when I get home and turn it on, but I thought I would get some input.
I am hoping that this is just a breaking in issue as I really don't want to have to ship off another projector, but I don't want to ignore something that may develop a problem later. I read through some of the 4805 threads looking for info on colorwheel noise but it didn't seem like this was the same issue.

Thanks-
Darren

My hd72 also loses the source lock option . I talked about this 10 pages back.

I'm not sure if this is a firmware bug or not, but the source lock option always goes back to "off" when I power off the projector.

It's kind of a hassle since it auto sources to my ReplayTV on the composite input instead of my 6412 moto on the hdmi one. It skips right past an active hdmi or dvi source and goes to the composite ReplayTV, even though it is off.

I keep adding 5 second delays to the startup activity on my harmony remote and now have to point the remote at the HD72 for 25 seconds.

Any input would be appreciated about this. I ordered a HD72 and did an advance replacement for the original that was sent, and recieved the replacement yesterday. This new projector makes a high pitched whining sound that I believe I have read is due to the colorwheel, and the 1st one I had did not make this noise. This is not the sound that you hear on start up of the projector, when the wheel first starts, but is more or a "ringing in the ear" that continues while it is running.
My question is if this is normal for a new DLP and it just needs to break in or if this is a symptom of a problem that could develop. I only fired it up 1x last night (since receiving it) but let it run for about 2 hours while I calibrated and watched some, so I don't even know if it will still do this when I get home and turn it on, but I thought I would get some input.
I am hoping that this is just a breaking in issue as I really don't want to have to ship off another projector, but I don't want to ignore something that may develop a problem later. I read through some of the 4805 threads looking for info on colorwheel noise but it didn't seem like this was the same issue.

Thanks-
Darren


Both of my HD72 made no unusual noise. Suggest you call Optoma and have them listen to your projector.

I would suggest getting a new DVD player... Oppo, for instance. This way you can let the Sony connected to the plasma and connect the Oppo to the HD72.


Howdy Again--

Well, I took you advice and picked up the Oppo DVD today and ran DVI to both projector and player and AVIA calibrated about an hour ago.

As I suspected, changing DVD players didn't accomplish anything except that the Oppo loses audio sync constantly which is a deal breaker for me. Videowise, it performs about as good as my 5 year old Sony 7700.

Shadow detail on faces continue to crush into a deep dark orange. When a shadow is suppose to be darker (like the shade on a baseball cap against the forehead), instead it turns dark and ruddy orange. And-- as the movie plays, you cannot help but notice the unnatural skin tones that look more like orange clay. Greens are nice-- whites and blues are nice- but fleshtones are ruddy.

I have a call into my dealer regarding this-- but this may well be a characteristic of this projector. Night scenes are revealed with nice contrast and depth with plenty of color. DVD resolution appears ordinary-- but the fleshtones so far are a deal breaker.

I'm still left wondering what is going on.

Having colorfacts and the Accupel HDG-3000 would help. If you want the best out of a projector have it calibrated with these tools. :)

I was encouraged to provide a few samples of what I mean about the "orange crush" shadows in fleshtones. This is an OPPO DVD player using DVI with projector calibrated with AVIA. (I tried other DVD players as well--- they do the same thing).

Here again, a few scenes from Brokeback Mountain. Look at the shadows on the faces-- and particularly Jack's forehead in the bar. My plasma display renders the facial shadows almost perfectly without the orange push.

What do you think?

Clint

Howdy Again--

Well, I took you advice and picked up the Oppo DVD today and ran DVI to both projector and player and AVIA calibrated about an hour ago.

As I suspected, changing DVD players didn't accomplish anything except that the Oppo loses audio sync constantly which is a deal breaker for me. Videowise, it performs about as good as my 5 year old Sony 7700.

Shadow detail on faces continue to crush into a deep dark orange. When a shadow is suppose to be darker (like the shade on a baseball cap against the forehead), instead it turns dark and ruddy orange. And-- as the movie plays, you cannot help but notice the unnatural skin tones that look more like orange clay. Greens are nice-- whites and blues are nice- but fleshtones are ruddy.

I have a call into my dealer regarding this-- but this may well be a characteristic of this projector. Night scenes are revealed with nice contrast and depth with plenty of color. DVD resolution appears ordinary-- but the fleshtones so far are a deal breaker.

I'm still left wondering what is going on.


My first HD72 has an orange, clay-like flesh tone also. It improved with time. I don’t have it any more because it was replaced by Optoma due to the reset problem. The second projector is perfect.

Give your projector a little more time to break-in. If the flesh tone does not improve within 10 hours, get it replaced.

I've never had orange clay flesh tones, loss of vertical shift settings, or color wheel noise on either of my HD72's (1st replaced for reset issue after 100+ hours of usage).

When the reset issue came up on my first HD72 everything went to default, like new. You would know right away when ceiling mounted because 'Optoma' logo would be upside down.

Everything is great now for me since the latest FW release.

Mike

Well I just finished watching my first movie on my HD72 great picture so much better than my L300u and its even quieter than the panny :eek: Ok here it comes I have what must be a stuck pixel its always white never moves and becomes focused or blurry when I change the focus. My graywolf screen has a dark blotch on it. When you look at it with the lights on the texture of the beads on this spot is lighter. I have had the screen for some time and was using it with the panny ceiling mounted the HD72 is table mounted due to the offset when you stand up the dark blotch goes away :( Just to add insult to injury it seems I have the reset bug also when I turned it on for the second time my menu returned to the default location and my lamp has zero hours on it :rolleyes:

I have a question about offset with the hd72... Is the amount of offset constant for a certain screen size? Meaning if I have the pj at one distance from the screen, then move it back a bit and zoom in so it is the same size, will the picture be at the same height? I'm probalby going to be mounting this thing to my ceiling in the next 3 days and knowing that bit of info seems like it would make this a bit easier :)

I have a question about offset with the hd72... Is the amount of offset constant for a certain screen size? Meaning if I have the pj at one distance from the screen, then move it back a bit and zoom in so it is the same size, will the picture be at the same height?
No.

For minimum zoom, the offset has been reported as 32% of screen height.

For maximum zoom, the offset is 37%.

I have a question about offset with the hd72... Is the amount of offset constant for a certain screen size? Meaning if I have the pj at one distance from the screen, then move it back a bit and zoom in so it is the same size, will the picture be at the same height? I'm probalby going to be mounting this thing to my ceiling in the next 3 days and knowing that bit of info seems like it would make this a bit easier :)

The offset will vary within the zoom range.

For a 16x9, 100” screen, the offset varies from 17.37 to 20.51" within the zoom range.

Details on how to determine the offset according to the screen and distance are in message #1504, "Offset calculation"
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7459902&&#post7459902

Talked to the nice people at VA they think the white spot is dust in the light engine and are swapping out the HD72 for free even paying to ship the 1st one back :) The Graywolf will be cut up and trashed the blotch is to far in from the edge to save the screen. Will be watching and playing with the 1st HD72 before sending it back monday they, VA were fine with this nice people great service.

Guitarman,

I think you mentioned you would be doing a comparison between the IN76 and the HD72. Do you have any thoughts between these two?

Also, it would seem the IN76 has a great feature missing in the HD72 which is how it converts 1080i signals to 720p (upconverting to 1080p then 720p). How important do you think this is?

I really like the HD72 and brilliant color but have concerns over the 1080i -> 540p -> 720p converting process.
Thanks!

Howdy Again--

Well, I took you advice and picked up the Oppo DVD today and ran DVI to both projector and player and AVIA calibrated about an hour ago.

As I suspected, changing DVD players didn't accomplish anything except that the Oppo loses audio sync constantly which is a deal breaker for me. Videowise, it performs about as good as my 5 year old Sony 7700.

Shadow detail on faces continue to crush into a deep dark orange. When a shadow is suppose to be darker (like the shade on a baseball cap against the forehead), instead it turns dark and ruddy orange. And-- as the movie plays, you cannot help but notice the unnatural skin tones that look more like orange clay. Greens are nice-- whites and blues are nice- but fleshtones are ruddy.

I have a call into my dealer regarding this-- but this may well be a characteristic of this projector. Night scenes are revealed with nice contrast and depth with plenty of color. DVD resolution appears ordinary-- but the fleshtones so far are a deal breaker.

I'm still left wondering what is going on.

The reviewer on this site has posted his calibrated color settings , and by chance he has used the Oppo and the HD72 - Im using them myself and have no orange push ! Worth a try ?

http://www.projectorreviews.com/Manufacturers/optoma/HD72/performance.asp

Just curious can someone explain to me what it means by max resolution 1080p? That mean it can handle a 1080p signal or output a 1080p signal?

That means it can handle and scale a 1080p signal, to its native resolution of 1280x768, or 1280x720 depending on which mode you are using. The output resolution is limited to a maximum 768p because that is the native resolution of the projectors DLP chip.
-Darren

Sorry to ask another question like this and if someone can point me to a FAQ that would be great if this question is annoying. So if Blu Ray puts out a 1080p signal that technically this could take a higher quality signal than say this current HD-DVD 1080i and produce a better image? Or is it either way the image is still get converted to 768p and will look the same? (Of course when I ask this I mean having the same source material just different resoution of output)
Thank you

Guitarman,

I think you mentioned you would be doing a comparison between the IN76 and the HD72. Do you have any thoughts between these two?

Also, it would seem the IN76 has a great feature missing in the HD72 which is how it converts 1080i signals to 720p (upconverting to 1080p then 720p). How important do you think this is?

I really like the HD72 and brilliant color but have concerns over the 1080i -> 540p -> 720p converting process.
Thanks!EEBuckeye, I actually believe that the latest TI scaler in the HD72 is capable of weaved 1080i -> 1080p ->720p. It was initially thought that HD72 used DCDi for deinterlacing and scaling, hence the assumption of 'bobbed' 1080i -> 1080p (1080i -> 540p is not technically correct, to be fair).

Perhaps TzungILin can confirm?

Well, my wife gave me the OK to switch to a front projection setup from our current rear projection CRT. While I love the picture on my RPTV, the big black box in our livingroom has overstayed it's welcome.

So, the current setup I'm considering goes like this:

106" screen, 8' ceilings. Dalite designer electrol screen. Some questions I have:

1) I will most likely use the Chief RPA-U mount. What is the absolute minimum distance from the ceiling to the center of the lens using this setup (you can see where this is going).

2) Dalite offers 4 different screen materials in this screen. Those 4 are the Matte White (g1.0), HC Matte White (g1.1), Video Spectra (g1.5) and High Power (g2.8). I am currently considering the Video Spectra because I think the extra gain will help out in my room when I am not able to completely blacken the room out. Anyone that has seen all of these that could chime in I would appreciate it.

3) Offset. Why oh why is this so hard. I'm an engineer. This should be a simple calculation. But I've seen two different theories, and with the install of a 106" screen with an 8' ceiling, where inches matter, I'd just as soon get this one right.

Theory A: Use the manual. The offset is a ratio of the throw distance. That suggests mounting the projector as close as possible and using the zoom to get the desired screen size. Since a 52"x92" screen requires 145.3" to 174.8", that's a 16.6" offset at the closest throw with 16.6" offset, to 20.0" with the longest throw.

Theory B: People have stated that at 1.0 zoom the offset is 32%, whereas at 1.2 zoom, the offset is 37%. This suggests that at the closest mounting point using 1.2x zoom the offset is 19.24", and at the furthest mounting point (1.0x zoom) the offset is 16.6".

So which one is it? In either case it looks like the minimum offset is 16.6". Add 4" lens to ceiling, that makes 20.6"

The screens come in a 4.6" case, and a 2" border. Add an extra 12" black drop, and we're at 18.6". Not enough. The next size is 24" (has to be in foot increments) which should be plenty, and I don't mind spending the extra money for the black drop, but obviously shorter is better.

Am I missing anything? How bad does digital keystoning look? Anyone run their projector with a couple of degrees of keystone correction?

-Mike

Well, my wife gave me the OK to switch to a front projection setup from our current rear projection CRT. While I love the picture on my RPTV, the big black box in our livingroom has overstayed it's welcome.

So, the current setup I'm considering goes like this:

106" screen, 8' ceilings. Dalite designer electrol screen. Some questions I have:

1) I will most likely use the Chief RPA-U mount. What is the absolute minimum distance from the ceiling to the center of the lens using this setup (you can see where this is going).

2) Dalite offers 4 different screen materials in this screen. Those 4 are the Matte White (g1.0), HC Matte White (g1.1), Video Spectra (g1.5) and High Power (g2.8). I am currently considering the Video Spectra because I think the extra gain will help out in my room when I am not able to completely blacken the room out. Anyone that has seen all of these that could chime in I would appreciate it.

3) Offset. Why oh why is this so hard. I'm an engineer. This should be a simple calculation. But I've seen two different theories, and with the install of a 106" screen with an 8' ceiling, where inches matter, I'd just as soon get this one right.

Theory A: Use the manual. The offset is a ratio of the throw distance. That suggests mounting the projector as close as possible and using the zoom to get the desired screen size. Since a 52"x92" screen requires 145.3" to 174.8", that's a 16.6" offset at the closest throw with 16.6" offset, to 20.0" with the longest throw.

Theory B: People have stated that at 1.0 zoom the offset is 32%, whereas at 1.2 zoom, the offset is 37%. This suggests that at the closest mounting point using 1.2x zoom the offset is 19.24", and at the furthest mounting point (1.0x zoom) the offset is 16.6".

So which one is it? In either case it looks like the minimum offset is 16.6". Add 4" lens to ceiling, that makes 20.6"

The screens come in a 4.6" case, and a 2" border. Add an extra 12" black drop, and we're at 18.6". Not enough. The next size is 24" (has to be in foot increments) which should be plenty, and I don't mind spending the extra money for the black drop, but obviously shorter is better.

Am I missing anything? How bad does digital keystoning look? Anyone run their projector with a couple of degrees of keystone correction?

-Mike
When inches matter ...

1. Don't forget that the PJ has a digital "offset", so that for a 720P source and 1:1 mapping, you'll be able to shift your image approximately 1.6" up (24 pixels).

2. Also, you could tilt your PJ upwards slightly to gain another inch or so. Although you wouldn't have a perfectly square image, the 2" screen border would mask this. But, this may bother you if you plan to use the screen as a computer monitor.

3. And, if you could tilt the top of the screen forward slightly, you'd be able to tilt your PJ up even more.

Of course, you could always keystone, but I would try methods 1 & 2 first, because they are quite simple and it will gain you a few inches.

And, if you can mount the PJ to project at 1.0 zoom, that is your best option (16.6" offset).

Good luck, and let us know how it goes. :)

Maybe I don't need to worry about this. With a 106" screen, using the shortest throw distance of 146", tilting the projector 1 degree, gives me 2.6" less offset, and at the bottom of the screen, about 1" of focal length error and .28" of keystone error on each side. Since the screen has a 2" black border, would I even notice a .28" keystone error? The focal length error is negligable. Averaging over the entire screen is only +- .5"

(Yes I cheated and used a 3D CAD package to do the math).

I've used my HD72 only a few times so far, and have noticed a vertical band of light a few feet off to the right of the image (visible during darker scenes). The projector sits right side up, as I haven't ceiling mounted it yet. It seems to be coming from a gap between the focus ring and the projector itself, where I can see light coming through. Since I haven't found any comments about similar light leakage from the HD72, I'm curious if anyone else sees this? Otherwise, the projector is great so far (coming from an Infocus 4805).

Thanks!

Just curious has any of you purchased the new hd-dvd player yet? I have read that hddvd looks awesome using this projector. If not I guess we will see in a few weeks.

I've been using my HD72 for a few weeks now and have noticed a consistent lack of detail in bright/white scenes. Clouds have no shadow detail at all and most outdoor scenes lack detail in the bright areas. Most bothersome. Darker scenes are fine with great shadow detail.

I've set the levels to guitarman's in his posts with little improvement in the bright scenes.

HD sources really have this problem. DVD's seem to display much better. I'm using component input for both.

Anybody have any ideas? Is this projector bad?

Well, I ordered a Toshiba HD-1 today from Wal-Mart. I'm going to use it with my Optoma HD72 which I FINALLY got calibrated! It took at least a week of fussing (and with emails to VisualApex)-- I finally discovered the secret to unlocking the correct color balance potential of this PJ. I use a greywolf 93" screen.

The player is suppose to arrive on Friday. I'll keep you posted on how it looks with the HD72. If you want my adjustments for the PJ, drop me an email.

Thanks!

Anybody have any ideas? Is this projector bad?

Not your projector, this is user error (I've been there...). Sounds like your contrast is set to high. I'd advise purchasing AVIA or DVE essentials to calibrate these settings for your screen.

Until then choose a bright scene (clouds) and turn down your contrast untill you see all the white detail but your still happy with the brightness of pure white. Same with black level. Go to a dark scene - like the Star Wars intro with black background and white stars. Tune the brightness setting up or down until you find the happy medium of number of stars and pure black level (black is not too gray or too dark where stars disappear).

The problem with using other's settings is they usually aren't right for your projector/screen combo. This is especially true for contrast (white levels) and brightness (black levels).

Good luck and enjoy!

The projector sits right side up, as I haven't ceiling mounted it yet. It seems to be coming from a gap between the focus ring and the projector itself, where I can see light coming through. Since I haven't found any comments about similar light leakage from the HD72, I'm curious if anyone else sees this?

I had the same thing with mine only on the right side if you are facing it, as well as something causing a white spot on the screen in dark areas and the reset bug it happed 3 times in less than 10 hours :(Sent he PJ back for a replacement and changed my mind and had them ship me a plasma instead of another HD72. Have fun guys, will be back when the next round of PJs hits the streets.

Well, I ordered a Toshiba HD-1 today from Wal-Mart. I'm going to use it with my Optoma HD72 which I FINALLY got calibrated! It took at least a week of fussing (and with emails to VisualApex)-- I finally discovered the secret to unlocking the correct color balance potential of this PJ. I use a greywolf 93" screen.

The player is suppose to arrive on Friday. I'll keep you posted on how it looks with the HD72. If you want my adjustments for the PJ, drop me an email.

Thanks!


Where did you get it calibrated? How much did calibration cost? Results; before/after?

Where did you get it calibrated? How much did calibration cost? Results; before/after?


What I meant was that I used AVIA to calibrate it BUT had to take the TINT down (-16) to properly balance the entire color. I'll look at the adjustments next time and I'll post them here.

Well, I ordered a Toshiba HD-1 today from Wal-Mart. I'm going to use it with my Optoma HD72 which I FINALLY got calibrated! It took at least a week of fussing (and with emails to VisualApex)-- I finally discovered the secret to unlocking the correct color balance potential of this PJ. I use a greywolf 93" screen.

The player is suppose to arrive on Friday. I'll keep you posted on how it looks with the HD72. If you want my adjustments for the PJ, drop me an email.

Thanks!

Please give us details once you get the Hd-1.

I picked up the new Toshiba HD-DVD from Best Buy last night. Purchased Serenity and Last Samurai. It makes me laugh how the resolution of the two movies is 1080p, but the player is only able to do 1080i and 720p. I assume later models will be able to do the 1080p...but then again, the Optoma can't do 1080p so it doesn't really matter to me. It comes with a 2m HDMI cable which is nice if your player is really close to the projector. I don't look forward to purchasing a 20' HDMI cable for permanent installation.

The picture looks incredible to me. 1080i seems to look a bit better than 720p, although they both look great. It helps with initial testing of this player if you turn off all the inputs on the projector except the HDMI. Getting it to display what you want is a bit more tricky than I would have expected. Maybe I just haven't stumbled upon a setup menu that allows you to change things that matter, such as default resolution and default video out. There are two buttons on the remote that you need to use to get the projector to get the correct signal. The projector says that it's getting a signal from HDMI, but won't display anything. VOUT I think it was called, needs to be pressed before the projector actually shows something(VOUT, OK button, then the player resets). I'm guessing analog is the default video out of this player. Then the Resolution button will change it from 480p/720p/1080i.

I'm happy to see that there is a firmware upgrade option through the LAN port which is a feature we lack entirely with the HD72. Sending something back to the factory for a firmware update isn't very convenient. I haven't looked to see if there is already an update to the firmware, but I'll probably check tonight after some more testing. The player has been inconsistent for me. Sometimes it will boot up and play the movie without me having to do anything and other times I'll have to press the video out or resolution buttons. Besides the 1 minute bootup time, "HDMI ERROR" message once in a while, lacking setup menu features, and not so obvious video mode switching, it's not a bad player for being first on the market. Picture is incredible, audio was great through optical, menu overlay from the DVD during the movie is a really nice feature(it's like multitasking on a DVD!), and I didn't see any problems once the DVD started playing.

-Derrin

Derrin, how does hddvd look on you hd72 compared to D* or cable hd? Any better? Thanks for the info.

Hi guys,

First time post here, i have been reading for a while and my HD72 should be delivered today. :) My questions was actually about mounting the projector. When I read on the online manual it calls for 4 M3 screws. Does it come with those screws for the mount, or where can i get some? I have checked the normal hardware places and they only carry M4 screws. I am building my own mount and will probubly need about an inch long screw. Any thoughts? Thanks for the help.

Chris

Chris, it definitly doesn't come with M3 screws. I purchased the Chief RPA-U, and it did come with M3's, but the PJ itself doesn't.

You might have to go to a specific fastener or bolt store. Have you checked Home Depot?

Congrats on the HD72 as well, I love the PJ.

In case anyone looking for a projector wants to know how well this PJ functions during the day, in my experience the HD72 functions damn good not only as a home-theater projector in the dark, but also puts put a bright enough picture to use as a television, with quite a bit if ambient light in the room.

I've been using mine now for sometimes 15 hours a day. All day watching TV on my "work from home" days, then at night watching movies, or whatever once I'm off the PC. I've got the "bright" mode setup with Brilliant-Color maxed out, AI "on", and other settings adjusted to give as bright a picture as possible during the day, without looking blown out or unnatural.

Obviously you lose blacks and contrast when the screen has quite a bit of light on it, but it's entirely watchable for TV. Of course if the sun hits the screen you're SOL, but quite a bit of ambient light it can punch through, no problem. Brilliant-Color is the key, that feature is Da Bomb!

At night I switch over to my "TV" setting, which backs off Brilliant-Color quite a bit, bulb in "econo" mode (or AI if the program looks better with it), and TV and HDTV looks awesome. When viewing a movie, I switch to Cinema mode which I have setup with "film" gamma, lower BC yet again, etc. Just by switching modes now I can go from day TV, to night TV, to movies.

Right now this is on a 110" diagonal DIY screen with blackout cloth, in an all-white room! You'd get even better day results with a higher-gain screen, or smaller screen, and a darker painted room.

I'm using it almost 100% of the time now as my TV, and theater. The PJ is extremely versatile. I have a regular 32" TV that I thought I would need during the day, but I never turn it on.

I'm guessing I've got around 4-500 hours on the bulb already, but am not 100% sure since mine was an early model with the reset issue. I've got it's replacement sitting on my couch though, ready to go up over the next day or two when I get time. I've tested it, and it appears identical to my first one in PQ. Aside from the reset issue, the first one was rock solid in every way.

Anyway, just wanted to post this out of the blue. The PJ won't compete with a nice Plasma for TV during the day, but it's definitely watchable. I love it...

Derrin, how does hddvd look on you hd72 compared to D* or cable hd? Any better? Thanks for the info.

Wish I could answer that. I still have about a month to wait for my current contract to end so I can switch from a standard def receiver to HD programming and HD receiver. Speaking of which, anyone have suggestions on what provider to go with and/or certain receiver to use with this projector? Gonna see how good the DVD upconverting on the HD-1 works tonight.

-Derrin

ZBoomer, How loud is the fan? I plan on mounting it 9' high around 3 feet in front of me. Will I hear it?

Yeah, you can hear it...that is, if there are no other noises in the room and you hold your breath! ;) The thing really is quiet. If you have any audio at all playing, you won't be able to hear the projector. If you turn bright mode on it does increase the fan speed which will make it a bit louder. I'm in a basement with controlled lighting, so I always run it with bright mode off.

-Derrin

Thanks Derrin, That is good to hear.

Hi guys,

First time post here, i have been reading for a while and my HD72 should be delivered today. :) My questions was actually about mounting the projector. When I read on the online manual it calls for 4 M3 screws. Does it come with those screws for the mount, or where can i get some? I have checked the normal hardware places and they only carry M4 screws. I am building my own mount and will probubly need about an inch long screw. Any thoughts? Thanks for the help.

Chris

Check your local Ace Hardware. They have a great selection of bolts, screws, etc and include a large metric selection as well.

ZBoomer, How loud is the fan? I plan on mounting it 9' high around 3 feet in front of me. Will I hear it?

Agree with Derrin.

My PJ is mounted on my 8' ceiling, directly above where I sit in my recliner, so I'm about 3-4' from it during viewing.

In normal mode, ie. without AI or bright mode activated, it's very quiet. I can hear it if I turn off my receiver completely and everything else is quiet, but barely. It's a whisper.

If you turn AI on, or bright mode, it gets significantly louder, but still isn't audible if you have any sound on at all from your receiver. During periods of silence you can hear it, but to be honest I usually run with AI on, and very rarely notice the PJ's noise.

Now if you put it into high-altitude mode, the fan sounds like a jet engine. It runs this way for approximately 30 seconds during shut-down, to cool the bulb. I can't imagine running normally in that mode unless you took measures to quiet it down somehow.

On a relative rating sound wise, I'd rate:

Normal mode, AI off, 1.
AI or bright mode on, 2.
High Altitude mode, 10.

-Boomer

*sigh* Well, my HD72 which I've now had for three weeks definitely has the reset issue. I fired her up last night and the picture was upside down (mine is ceiling mounted). Checked through the menus and everything was back to the default and the lamp hours was zero. So I'll be giving a call to ProjectorPeople.com today. Fortunately they have a hot-swap program.

My HD-72 is being swapped out by Optoma next week. Frankly, this shouldn't have been our problem. Taking it down from the ceiling and then having to re-mount, along with the re-calibrations is a real pain in the butt for the end user.

Perhaps a coupon for a discount on a new bulb at some future date or some other incentive to alleviate the **** (you know what) caused by a new projector that shouldn't have been sold until the bugs had been resolved would be appropriate.

Of course, Optoma didn't want to lose any market share after the CES and they sold them anyway as soon as they arrived. I would be very surprised if the problem hadn't shown up with the company's QC testing at the factory, based on the flood of complaints showing up here.

Frankly, if I had known about the problem, I would have gone with the new Mitsubishi projector that uses the same chip or the new Infocus model.

I got mine swapped out a couple weeks ago for the reset issue. They were really nice about it at Optoma, and overnighted the replacement once it was available. Personally I'm not complaining because I had almost 400 hours on the bulb and now I got a brand new one again! It took me about 2 hours to swap out the projectors, re-align, re-calibrate, and pack the old one up so it wasn't too time consuming. I hope those who are reading this forum understand that all new Optoma HD72 units being shipping are already updated and free from the reset issue.

I've been using my HD72 for a few weeks now and have noticed a consistent lack of detail in bright/white scenes. Clouds have no shadow detail at all and most outdoor scenes lack detail in the bright areas. Most bothersome. Darker scenes are fine with great shadow detail.

I've set the levels to guitarman's in his posts with little improvement in the bright scenes.

HD sources really have this problem. DVD's seem to display much better. I'm using component input for both.

Anybody have any ideas? Is this projector bad?
Daniel,
I was using Guitarman's settings at first and the whites were also a little overblown on my Carada Brilliant White (basically a 1.4 gain white screen). After 3 months of owning this projector I have settled on contrast set at 5 or 6 and brightness set at -4. The advice uatatoka gave you was spot on, I just wanted to let you know I had the same issue but now that I got the calibrations right for my setup, I'm perfectly happy with the HD72's image on all material.

Does anyone know a store in the Atlanta area that has this projector on display? I still have issues with buying something without seeing it first. Thanks.

Jeremy

DanielD

Also just wanted to point out Guitarman has a grey screen and as such his contrast setting may be higher due to this. If you are using the a white screen this may be the issue. This is one reason why using the posting settings won't always yield the best results.

-Darren

DAT, that would be true but there is a huge difference between the DVD player and the Dish VIP622. I am using the component input on both. The DVD looks pretty good but the HD on the 622 is almost unwatchable it's so bright. I swapped the 622 out with a 411 and it was the same so it is not the satellite receiver's output.

I calibrated the projector with AVIA the day I got it. It's a gain issue I'm sure I just don't know where yet.

DAT, that would be true but there is a huge difference between the DVD player and the Dish VIP622. I am using the component input on both. The DVD looks pretty good but the HD on the 622 is almost unwatchable it's so bright. I swapped the 622 out with a 411 and it was the same so it is not the satellite receiver's output.

I calibrated the projector with AVIA the day I got it. It's a gain issue I'm sure I just don't know where yet.

Hey Daniel,

Did you calibrate at each resolution on the component input? Different video settings can be set for each resolution (480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i, etc.) on the component input. Perhaps the AVIA cal settings you used for the DVD resolution did not transfer to the Dish HD resolutions...worth a double check at least.

Mike

Quick question, now that the projector is sitting on my kitchen table, beside the speakers and waiting for the finish in the basement!

I'm running a Denon 2807. This does HDMI switching (which I'll admit I know little about except that I can run ONE cable to the projector). I have the Oppo upconverting DVD (from the package with projectorpeople.com).

I assume that HDMI is the best connection? I should be running dvi-HDMI from the dvd player to receiver, then HDMI out from the receiver to the projector? Or have people found a better result with using the DVI cable directly from dvd to projector?

We really only have the dvd player and satellite tv. I'll run two or more cables to the projector if it's important, but I guess I don't understand the implications of picking one over the other. Any guidance?

Hey Daniel,

Did you calibrate at each resolution on the component input? Different video settings can be set for each resolution (480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i, etc.) on the component input. Perhaps the AVIA cal settings you used for the DVD resolution did not transfer to the Dish HD resolutions...worth a double check at least.

Mike
I also run both HD cable and DVD through the component input and I didn't realize that each resolution on each input could have different settings until about a month into owning the HD72!

I haven't noticed that each resolution has different settings either. You got me there. Maybe there's hope yet...

I haven't noticed that each resolution has different settings either. You got me there. Maybe there's hope yet...

Yes, I use this to my advantage too. The 480i output of my DirecTV HD-TIVO is dramatically different than 720p or 1080i. Once I learned this feature I was able to calibrate each with unique settings. I do this because I go back and forth between 480i, 720p, and 1080i depending on the source. The internal deinterlacing of the HD72 is top notch and far superior to my tuner's deinterlacing and upscaling of standard def material.

This doesn't work for different resolutions on the digital inputs though. Those you have to save off to the 5 setting holders - cinema, TV, bright, srgb, and user. This is also another option you can use for DVD and Dish tuner if they are the same resolution. Calibrate DVD and save it to cinema, then calibrate Dish tuner and save it to TV for example. It won't be automatic like saving per resolution, but solves the different 'gain' per source issue.

Mike

Anyone see this yet?

http://www.projectorcentral.com/hd-dvd.htm

"Finally, the HD72, which is one of the hottest 720p home theater projectors on the market at the moment, was unable to facilitate a connection to the HD-A1 via the HDMI port. In every attempt to get them to lock, the HD-A1 reported an HDMI error.

Optoma engineering in Taiwan is aware of the situation and is working on a solution. All three of our Optoma models are very early units and the fix may just be a matter of a firmware update. "

Does this mean projector owners again will have to send in the model for another firmware update in the future? I can't imagine they will continue to do hot swaps for these updates.

Yes, I just read that too. Not cool...I wonder if the DVI port works OK though. I currently don't use any digital w/ HDCP connections, just HTPC and Oppo DVD w/o HDCP.
Has anyone else seen any issues with the HD72 and HDCP on either the DVI or HDMI inputs? Is this isolated to the Toshiba HD-A1?

Mike

I was able to get the HD-A1 to work with my HD72 via HDMI. It took some effort though. This is only an issue when playing HD DVDs back at 1080i. 720p works fine, as does SD DVD at all resolutions.

First, make sure the projector's on before the player. Then, turn on the player, and set it to 1080i. When the projector finds the signal, go into the projector's menu and turn on the signal lock. Then insert the disc, and it should be all good. But if you switch to another source, it loses the signal and you have to start the process all over again.

I should also note that my HD72 was one of the first to be shipped.

I was able to get the HD-A1 to work with my HD72 via HDMI. It took some effort though. This is only an issue when playing HD DVDs back at 1080i. 720p works fine, as does SD DVD at all resolutions.

First, make sure the projector's on before the player. Then, turn on the player, and set it to 1080i. When the projector finds the signal, go into the projector's menu and turn on the signal lock. Then insert the disc, and it should be all good. But if you switch to another source, it loses the signal and you have to start the process all over again.

I should also note that my HD72 was one of the first to be shipped.

Took the words right out of my mouth! Yeah, this thing is a bit difficult to initially set up. Once you get the needed settings changed you won't have a problem. Have to have the projector on and turn off all signals but HDMI, turn on the player, press the VOUT + OK button on the HD-A1 player to switch it to digital out mode, press the Resolution button to switch to the correct resolution, and you're done. I haven't had an actual problem since the initial setup. The HDMI ERROR seems to show up when you either don't have the projector on when powering up the HD-A1, don't have the projector actively looking for HDMI, or shut the projector down while playing a movie. The reason it was an inconsistent error for me during initial testing was because the projector was scanning all the inputs for a signal. It's around a 50/50 chance that the projector will look on the HDMI port before the player times out and gives the error. Then again these are just assumptions I've made, so I could just be crazy, but I seem to have the sync down to a science now either way. :D

BTW, what an awesome picture these two items can make. Been showing HD-DVD movies to friends since I've had it working...and the new King Kong movie looks amazing even though it's just being upconverted from standard DVD.

Just a heads up that German site Cine4home are in the process of putting the HD72 through its paces via. their uber thorough tests. Nothing to report on the performance side yet, but here's a translated link to part one (http://www.online-translator.com/url/tran_url.asp?lang=en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2Ftests%2Fprojektoren%2FOp tomaHD72i%2FHD72Test.htm&direction=ge&template=General&cp1=NO&cp2=NO&autotranslate=on&transliterate=on&psubmit2.x=39&psubmit2.y=7) covering the physical aspects.

The German report was very interesting. It is quite fasinating to see how everything is laid out. I can not figure out for the life of me what happens once the light gets by the color wheel. There does not seem to be any light "Tunnel" at all. Is the light just shinning through the case to the DLP chip? I guess I thought that the Bulb to lens light path would all be sealed.

Tom

I'm having a problem with my HD72. Three times in the past week when I powered down, the bulb turned off but fan speed did not increase. It also didn't turn off. It just kept on spinning as if the projector was still on. In order to get it to stop, I had to flip the on/off switch.

The only thing I can think of which I'm doing differently than before is using the HDMI input. If I'm not mistaken, all 3 times this has happened, it was locked to an HDMI signal which had been turned off first.

I did a search of this thread and couldn't find anyone with a similar problem, but has anyone encountered this?

Thanks,
Mike

Keep an eye on it. If it continues it will have to go back for repair.

The only thing I'm worried about is the bulb. But if I leave it on long enough for the bulb to cool down, shouldn't it be okay, since it's spinning at the speed it normally is while the bulb is on?

On cool down you should be hearing the high altitude fan sound which is really loud. Cool down on the HD72 is very fast, fastest cool down in the west. :)
I'll time it sometime.

I got my replacement for my early resetting HD72, and notice a few changes.

First as someone mentioned, the remote distance seems better. The IR receiver on front is black, and it will even work bouncing off the screen now a good percent of the time.

2nd, the unit has more light leakage directly above it on the ceiling. Not enough to bother, but I don't remember any before.

3rd, it has less SDE than my previous one. I am wondering if my previous model had perfect optics which focused the pixels better. Whatever the reason, on the right half of my screen now there is almost zero SDE even up close. The left side has a little but not as much as my first HD72.

I'm now wondering if my PJ isn't EXACTLY centered on the screen, as I don't know why one side of the image would have more SDE than the other. The image overall looks just as sharp, but less black between pixels. Wierd, but very obvious to me. This is a GOOD change, SDE drove me nuts on my first HD72.

I can see a very dim optical defect when the image goes all black, about 6" down, 3.5' from the left. Sort of a brighter-than-black spot about 1" diameter, with a dimmer smaller spot offset from it. Appears to be some kind of optical reflection or something inside.

It's invisible with anything on the screen, but visible on a black scene. I watched "Saw" last night, and kept noticing it.

My PJ now seems to remember vertical and horizontal offset, which it didn't before. It still goes back to zero when I change resolutions input, but as long as I stay in the same mode (native, for example) it seems to remember my offsets.

Noticed another small bug fixed. On the menu where you select PJ orientation, mine used to show the wrong icon when I had ceiling, front projection selected. It instead showed an icon for ceiling, rear-projection. The new one shows the correct icon. (don't ask how I noticed this the first time)

Overall I like the new PJ, no resets and < SDE, but I wish it didn't have the small optical issue on black screen. I will live with it a week or two and see if it bugs me.

-Boomer

I just ordered an HD72 for myself.

Is there a place in the menu that shows what firmware the projector has? Also, how good is visualapex at shipping projectors with the latest firmware in them?

I'm now wondering if my PJ isn't EXACTLY centered on the screen, as I don't know why one side of the image would have more SDE than the other. The image overall looks just as sharp, but less black between pixels. Wierd, but very obvious to me. This is a GOOD change, SDE drove me nuts on my first HD72.

-Boomer

I've noticed the same thing with mine. Actually, I've noticed it with both HD72s that I've used so far. Everything is zero'd out on the image adjustment screens(s), but one edge has slightly sharper pixels than the other. I'm using a 102" DIY screen, but it's not the problem. You can see the difference at about 6" away. Once you get to about 18" from the screen you can't see the difference in sharpness any more. At about 3' the SDE goes away. I usually sit at about 8' back and don't notice and difference at all.

-Derrin

I can see a very dim optical defect when the image goes all black, about 6" down, 3.5' from the left. Sort of a brighter-than-black spot about 1" diameter, with a dimmer smaller spot offset from it. Appears to be some kind of optical reflection or something inside.

It's invisible with anything on the screen, but visible on a black scene. I watched "Saw" last night, and kept noticing it.

-Boomer

It sounds like you might be describing a dust blob. I hope not...

Yeah, isn't the optical path sealed? If it's dust "blob" no way to get it off? Maybe I'm being too picky.

Yeah, isn't the optical path sealed? If it's dust "blob" no way to get it off? Maybe I'm being too picky.

No, I'm pretty sure it is not completely sealed. You're not being too picky, I'd be pissed if I just got a supposedly "new" unit back and it had a dust blob...

On cool down you should be hearing the high altitude fan sound which is really loud. Cool down on the HD72 is very fast, fastest cool down in the west. :)
I'll time it sometime.

With only 3 exceptions in the past 2 months, this is what it has done. But what I'm asking is, is there any reason to think that having the fan operate at the lower speed for a longer period of time would be any less effective at cooling down the bulb? I'm thinking it would be fine.

is there any reason to think that having the fan operate at the lower speed for a longer period of time would be any less effective at cooling down the bulb? I'm thinking it would be fine.


From an engineering standpoint, it should be just as effective. In facty it may be easier on the bulb to cool it slower.

Thanks, Dr. J.

With only 3 exceptions in the past 2 months, this is what it has done. But what I'm asking is, is there any reason to think that having the fan operate at the lower speed for a longer period of time would be any less effective at cooling down the bulb? I'm thinking it would be fine.


Cool down tips are 1 don't restart a projector until the bulb has fully cooled down, probably at least a half an hour. It's re-striking a bulb that hasn't fully settled down that quickly wears the bulb down. So any kind of fan speeds or even no fan can be fine, just don't restart up too quickly.

For you I'd be more worried about the fan not working or getting fan errors and you try to re-fire up. You have a two year warranty so keep an eye on the fan errors, if it gets worse send it in.

ZBoomer, I just hung my replacement HD72 and yeah, I noticed the light-spill pattern on the ceiling is now a little different from the original unit. I also did notice that the icon for the display mode has been fixed in the menu like you stated. Now that I think about it, I don't know why I blew that off with the original as I'm usually more critical. The H/V offsets are now remembered for the individual resolution (which led me to think the original had the reset bug; once I turned it on and the picture was upside-down I knew for sure that it did). With the re-install, I really took my time and very carefully lined up the throw to the screen so now I don't have to use the offsets at all. Even my LD players line up much better than before. Now if I could only get the studios to frame their DVDs correctly and consistently... ;)

However, I don't notice any change in the SDE or perceived clarity. The throw/focus mechanisms seemed to have the same ranges and I was able to dial the picture in as good as before. I used a resolution test pattern (among numerous others) and pretty much came to the same results with the replacement.

As for the internal construction, check a few messages back for the link to the first part of the German review of the HD72. Many good photos including several showing the internal construction, light path, DMD chip, color wheel, etc..

Thanks, Guitarman.

I thought the new colorwheel looked interesting. Some extra red, a little extra green and a nice sized white. You like bright and we like the white :) Wing tells me the white is what helped them get 10 steps with brilliant color.

HD72 got 20.50ftc in bright mode, that's 815lumens and tuned down to D65k on a 92"X52" 106" diag 1.0 gain screen.

I thought the new colorwheel looked interesting. Some extra red, a little extra green and a nice sized white. You like bright and we like the white :) Wing tells me the white is what helped them get 10 steps with brilliant color.

HD72 got 20.50ftc in bright mode, that's 815lumens and tuned down to D65k on a 92"X52" 106" diag 1.0 gain screen.

Tom, when you took these measurements was the lamp in high mode and brilliant color = 10?

TI whitepapers say the billiant color can increase lumen output by up to 50% regardless of lamp setting. Just curious if this 815 lumens is from high lamp setting, high brilliant color setting (full white segment usage), or a combination of both...

Brilliant color was at 3 it was bright mode and tuned to D65k.

This is likely an elementary question, but what is the procedure to "tune the HD72 to 65k?"

I feel like a loser because I like the HD72 a LOT pretty much right out of the box, lol.

This is likely an elementary question, but what is the procedure to "tune the HD72 to 65k?"

I feel like a loser because I like the HD72 a LOT pretty much right out of the box, lol.

Send it to Tom/Guitarman! Seriously, he'll do it. It takes some pricey equipment to do it exactly but Tom offers this as a mail in service I believe. (feel free to chime in here Tom if I'm off base...)

If that's not too your liking the next best thing is Avia or DVE calibration SW on DVD. It'll get you 90% there.

Mike

Pricey is an understatement, cost price on the items are $5200. You should hv seen my face when the Accupel HDG-3000 arrived. I thought from the picture it would be sized and heavy like a good DVD player. It's feather weight and can fit in the palm of your hand, msrp $1400 w/remote, ouch. But I needed it for HDTV tunings.

You can only get a basic tuning with Avia or DVE. For reference black/white and colors at D65k across the shades of gray you need the analyzing equipment. Mainly for fanatics on knowing and having things excact. I'm a fanatic. :) and a tuning fool I went thru doing all my displays RPTV/CRT DLP/RPTV and any projector they throw at me.

The Accupel is a race car of a tool. Actually I spent allot of time tracking down the gamma choice on the HD72 that would get me closest to 2.2. To do that you have to run grayscale checks for any gamma choice. Cinema didn't get me there.

I'll take a look today but I think I had to use PC-gamma to get to 2.2. I also set brilliant color at 4 this time. I'll post some numbers if you like but the underlying service color numbers are most likely very different from machine to machine.

I can recommend sending the PJ to Tom.

I like to experiment so I farted around with DVE and spent tons of time trying to get the grayscale to look right and get that perfect picture. My picture was good and to anybody else it looked great.

Next time I'm not going to waste time on it and just send it to Tom instead. It was money well spent and a great service. The picture is very good and I'm completely happy with it now. Flesh tones look very natural. Lost and CSI on HDTV never looked so good.

Thanks Rod, it is HDTV that gets the best advantage.

Here's some HD72 numbers

HDMI DVD 720p,

Image
Cinema
Contrast 50
Brightness -6
Color 9
Tint -1
Sharpness -2

Advanced
Degamma PC
Brilliant Color 4
TrueVivid 0
Color temp 1
AI off

Write down where you were before incase these numbers butcher your image. :)

How do you like that 50 on contrast and no white crush. So says the Accupel and I got a final gamma of 2.2.

Just for reference the way gamma goes is as you go up in gamma numbers the picture gets Darker with more saturation. When I first ran the Cinema grayscale the gamma was 2.52, Video sent it to 1.98 and PC sent gamma to 2.2.

Tom,

Does this not also depend on the source and screen as well? I believe you run a different DVD player, HDTV tuner, and screen than I. If I sent my proj to you how would that work?

Mike

I got my replacement for my early resetting HD72, and notice a few changes.

3rd, it has less SDE than my previous one. I am wondering if my previous model had perfect optics which focused the pixels better. Whatever the reason, on the right half of my screen now there is almost zero SDE even up close. The left side has a little but not as much as my first HD72.

I'm now wondering if my PJ isn't EXACTLY centered on the screen, as I don't know why one side of the image would have more SDE than the other. The image overall looks just as sharp, but less black between pixels. Wierd, but very obvious to me. This is a GOOD change, SDE drove me nuts on my first HD72.

I can see a very dim optical defect when the image goes all black, about 6" down, 3.5' from the left. Sort of a brighter-than-black spot about 1" diameter, with a dimmer smaller spot offset from it. Appears to be some kind of optical reflection or something inside.

It's invisible with anything on the screen, but visible on a black scene. I watched "Saw" last night, and kept noticing it.

-Boomer

Yes, you have a dust blob, or at least you described what a dust blob manifests itself as, exactly to the letter. But, Dust blobs are usually much larger than 1". The smallest I've seen was about 10" dia. BTW, I got a H30 back from Optoma service with a dust blob present, free of charge. Sent it back and they fixed it (along with other issues they didn't address the 1st time around).

SDE> That is an indicator of QC with the Optics (alignment and quality of Optics). My H30 (went through 3 of them) never had perfect focused pixels across the whole screen. Ther were patches of sharp pixels and patches of defocused pixels all randomly around the screen. My H31 is slightly better, but pretty much the same deal. Optics (quality of lenses and alignment tolerances) suffer more in budget PJ's. You can get lucky with a very well aligned PJ or get one that isn't as well aligned. Whether Optoma considers your SDE issue a warranty issue or within 'specs' is another matter (they didn't consider my randomly focused SDE on my H30, H31 PJ's to be a warranty issue).

In perspective, on my H30/H31's, I couldn't notice any degrading or difference in the Picture quality between the areas of focused and unfocused pixels.

Fleaman

I just got my H72 today, along with my oppo DVD player and a Draper Salara High Contrast Gray screen. :) :) :) I am expecting the surround sound reciever and all the speakers tomorrow. I can't wait to start installing. I did a quick setup in my garage with the screen and projector just to do some playing and testing. The picture quality seems to be very good. Anyone with suggestions for settings for movies with light controled room and TV with some ambient light in the room?? Also I searched and found nothing, what is the RS232 cable for, I know it is used for computer control, but what exactly can you do with it and is it usefull?

Tom,

Does this not also depend on the source and screen as well? I believe you run a different DVD player, HDTV tuner, and screen than I. If I sent my proj to you how would that work?

Mike

The key thing is getting the grayscale in some kind of reference color balance. Actually I tune to the projector itself with the Accupel reference generator. Tuning the signal resolution and type, like RGB/DVI-HDMI or Component. Last time Greg Rodgers chimed on about his Accupel machine he said the deviant is extremely low like .003 of a percent vs using a device as a source. You could tune up after to your player and the time of day or darkness you view in with your screen. Just adjusting brightness mainly. You would leave color tint and most important RGB advanced adjustments alone.

I'm looking at Harry Potter 1 right now and it looks excellent after the tuning. Very colorful but natural. Black level looks excellent, black within the video looks very black and shadow detail is opened nicely.

Here's some shots of what I'm looking at. Tuff in the day to get good screen shots but they're not too bad.

http://www.cigarbest.com/sales/hd72potter1.jpg
http://www.cigarbest.com/sales/hd72potter2.jpg
http://www.cigarbest.com/sales/hd72potter3.jpg
http://www.cigarbest.com/sales/hd72potter4.jpg
http://www.cigarbest.com/sales/hd72potter5.jpg

Damn duckcmmndr you went all out! PJ, screen, receiver, speakers, all at once? I'm envious. ;)

Nice pics Tom, as usual...

Fleaman, so I might have the smallest dust blob ever? heh. If I knew how to "blow it out" I would!

"Nice pics Tom"

Almost like watching the movie in succession, makes you want to watch the movie doesn't it?

Howdy,

Well, I finally got the image correctly centered for the 92" Greywolf screen. I also upgraded the component cable (already in the ceiling) with an HDMI to DVI cable that is 25' long. (Calrad cable 25' heavy duty type $119.99).

Previous problems with flesh tones crushing into shadows and causing "tomatoe heads" are now gone. The Sony 7700 player (bless its heart) has been replaced by the Oppo DVD player at 720p progressive output.

The projector syncs perfectly with the Oppo. Next up was HDMI calibration using AVIA. Both the color and tint control are absent (not available) using an HDMI connection with this player. Contrast is calibrated at +10, Brightness is -15, Sharpness at 3, Mode is CINEMA, Degamma is RGB, Brilliant Color is 4, All RGB/BIAS controls are FLAT (0), Color Temperature is 1. With these settings, all color and grey scale ramps are about as perfect as it can get outside of a test scope calibration.

This room is 14' wide by 23' long with 7'6" ceilings completely darkened for evening viewing.

Next up: Photos from "The Fifth Element" after calibration.

These pictures were taken about 19' from the screen. In my theater room, the results were truly impressive. Space scenes were inky black-- plenty of stars. Bold and bright colors while still holding on to natural skin tones.

The resolution from this super bit version was far better than can be captured from these photographs- but it gives you an idea. So far, I'm really delighted. I especially like the dramatic improvement of HDMI over component. I was able to A/B the results with both inputs calibrated and the HDMI provides a more natural tint to the image without so much "red push" as the component inputs had in my situation at least.

Clint

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/01.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/02.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/03.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/04.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/05.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/06.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/07.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/08.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/09.jpg

http://www.stereografx.com/elements/11.jpg

How do you like that 50 on contrast and no white crush. So says the Accupel and I got a final gamma of 2.2.

Just for reference the way gamma goes is as you go up in gamma numbers the picture gets Darker with more saturation. When I first ran the Cinema grayscale the gamma was 2.52, Video sent it to 1.98 and PC sent gamma to 2.2.
Thanks for the gamma numbers, Tom. Was wondering what the degamma modes equalled in numbers. I'm running mine in PC degamma too, as it definitely results in better shadow detail than film degamma without sacrificing absolute black level.

What are your current RGB gain/bias tunings if you don't mind listing them out again? Noticed mine was already tweaked by Optoma OTB, and I only needed to notch the red up a touch and the green down a bit from there. Are they tuned fairly close to 65k OTB when properly measured? All reviews seem to say they're not, so I wonder if that's based on when all the RGB values are set to zero's...

Heck, those pictures have come out stunningly, Clint! Some of the best I've ever seen. Tried taking some shots of mine the other day, but couldn't produce anything other than a blurred mess. Take it I need a tripod?

Re. the tint/colour controls being disabled - they're only unavailable when feeding in a DVI signal (whether that's via. DVI -> DVI or DVI -> HDMI). Direct HDMI -> HDMI will allow for tint/colour to be adjusted as it uses YUV colour space as opposed to DVI's RGB.

I just revcieved the hd72 yesterday and love everything except I'm seeing alot of video noise. I'm changing from my trusted guitarman approved ht1000. I have 3hrs on the bulb and can only put 1 more hour if I need to return for a credit. I hope to the gods that this is fixable problem. I'm playing from dvd sony mega changer over componet in progressive scan mode. Everything looks so nice except for this problem I'm experiencing. I did not have this issue on the ht1000. I will stay that my xbox360 looks freaking awesome with no noise just a bright sharp colorful picture. Has anyone else experience this??Help guys. Clock is ticking.

Regarding noise, press pause on your DVD player. If the noise freezes, it's not the PJ. :)

I've seen noise also at times, but every time I pause the DVD or Tivo, it quickly becomes clear the noise is in the source, and the PJ is just faithfully reproducing it.

Wow Clint, nice photos!

Speaking of gamma, what is the spec on the "graphics" setting? That seems to look best to my eyes lots of the time with TV. "Video" usually looks too washed out. It seems to push "up" the dark areas a lot for more detail, but just loses dynamics it seems like.

Damn duckcmmndr you went all out! PJ, screen, receiver, speakers, all at once? I'm envious. ;)

Well I have a theater setup in my living room with a 50" Sony HDTV and speakers in the walls and ceiling. I did not want to tear any of that stuff out for a detected theater room, so I got all new stuff.

I think I did really well, I bought some very high quality equiptment and did not spend near as much as I thought that I would have to. I feel like a 6 year old on Christmas morning :)

Still open to anyone with suggestions for the H72 settings that provide a good picture in a light controlled room for movies and TV and also settings that will allow for ambient light.

In helping KevinL set up his HD72 I quickly realized I need to start saving up to buy one. I was toying with the idea of upgrading my H31 to the Panny back in November...but I wasn't sure I'd be happy with it. Now seein the 72 in live action I got bitten by the bug. I just wanted to post what a wonderful picture I saw with my short visit, colors are amazing and the blacks...WOW. Also, I am amazed at how quiet the projector is.

I just revcieved the hd72 yesterday and love everything except I'm seeing alot of video noise. I'm changing from my trusted guitarman approved ht1000. I have 3hrs on the bulb and can only put 1 more hour if I need to return for a credit. I hope to the gods that this is fixable problem. I'm playing from dvd sony mega changer over componet in progressive scan mode. Everything looks so nice except for this problem I'm experiencing. I did not have this issue on the ht1000. I will stay that my xbox360 looks freaking awesome with no noise just a bright sharp colorful picture. Has anyone else experience this??Help guys. Clock is ticking.


Noise can be the DVD or contrast/brightness and sharpness is higher than it should be. Give it a shot, mainly look at brightness with the pluge pattern in DVE and make sure the darker bar disappears and you see no mirror dithering. Sound & Vision tuneup disc you use the same way. The Avia DVD nose up to the screen and get the darker bar to the point where it's gone than bring it back till you can barely notice a faint dithering in it.

One thing the NEC has a very low noise image, it's what we all were talking about. But it's not very bright and the color red is washed out, plus it's not in the HD category. So try tuning down the HD72 and compare, then decide.

good morning everyone...great forum, not sure if this is correct spot for this question?

Besides cost, what differences are there in pq and features for the opt. h31 and h72?

will the average viewer notice the diff? Is the diff great enough to warrant the cost?

Any input is always welcomed

Steve

The highly detailed image high res can bring first off. Plus the HD72 has high brightness more than twice the H31 has. Twice the price though. High res is high end, if you want to feel secure in that you have the best you can get, then yes it's worth it.

I bought and hooked up the hdmi cable and still having issues with video noise. The best way to describe what I'm seeing is to compare to a vcr tape. When I think back to crossing over from the vcr to dvd the picture seemed so clean. I don't think their is anything wrong with the projector or my hook up because of the awesome xbox360 picture. What do I do now? I love the brightness and color but the noise is driving me crazy. Do you think I should try the 7100 or something else? Naturally I tried playing with the settings with no luck and I'm on my 4th hour which I can't exceed for a return.

Xbox 360 is a component feed. I still think you need to lower brightness with the HMDI input. DVI/HDMI usually reguires a lower brightness level. You're probably seeing dither noise.

good morning everyone...great forum, not sure if this is correct spot for this question?

Besides cost, what differences are there in pq and features for the opt. h31 and h72?

will the average viewer notice the diff? Is the diff great enough to warrant the cost?

Any input is always welcomed

SteveSteve, as someone who upgraded from a H31 to the HD72, I'd say the difference in cost is most certainly worth it...but only under specific circumstances.

If you're only planning on using it for DVD's and SDTV, the H31 very much holds its own IMO. The biggest upgrade the HD72 offers is higher resolution, which only really comes into its own when the projector is fed a Hi Def signal of sorts. Yes, the HD72 also has less screen door, darker blacks, better reds, better overall colour saturation with BC, is brighter, has 10bit video processing when coupled with a direct HDMI signal (a big plus for me - I no longer see the false contouring/banding which was present on the H31 and previously viewed DLP's), looks prettier and operates even quieter. But...IMHO, these are marginal improvements when placed in a viewing context, and have only just really become apparent to me anyway. The 2 major benefits of the HD72 are that it can be used with a much bigger screen and the resolution increase - when paired with a good HD feed the HD72 is without doubt twice as good as a H31 or any other low res PJ. The resolution bump does improve DVD viewing too, but not by even approaching a twice as good ratio. DVD's looks smoother and more defined, particularly in distance shots, but only from the right distance. From 2x the screen width distance away, the H31 looks almost the same with DVD's. But, the HD72 allows you to sit sat 1.5x distance away without the pixel structure becoming apparent, and hence revealing more detail to the eye and providing a much more involving viewing experience. So...the questions you need to ask yourself is: am I going to be watching HDTV on whichever PJ I buy? Am I planning on picking up a HD media player (HD-DVD, Blu Ray, next gen console etc.) within the near future? Am I wanting to use it with a screen larger than 100" diagonal? If it's no to those 3 questions, then I honestly don't think it's worth shelling out twice the dough for a HD72 and you'd be perfectly happy with a H31. But if it's a yes to any of them, I'd say the HD72 is more than worth the extra outlay...

Xbox 360 is a component feed. I still think you need to lower brightness with the HMDI input. DVI/HDMI usually reguires a lower brightness level. You're probably seeing dither noise.


I tried this, besides didn't you recommend 50contrast through hdmi just a couple of posts back? Opps that was brightness. Anyhow I tried those settings you recommended. I don't think I was being overly picky because my wife even thought the ht1000 looked better on dvd's ( no tv yet to compare). I looked at screen shots a couple of posts back and I noticed the same kind of noise. Maybe its to be expected picking up going to a higher res. panel. To me I find it very distracting, it defeats the purpose of upgrading. Yes the sharpness, color, and brightness have improved to a large degree but this problem is not worth the gain. The part that confuses me is why isn't a lot of other people complaining? Could it still be a hook up issue, sitting to close to screen, defective model? I hate to lose this awesome valued projector if I could solve my problem.

While the image is highly competitive, it is not flawless. Nobody should expect or demand perfection at such a low price. The most noticeable image flaw in the HD72 is that manifests more image noise than its LCD competition in scene
s that are prone to noise. From Projector central




I guess it's not just me.

FWIW, settings make a HUGE difference in noise. Most people can't run "50" on contrast, not even close. I think I lose the 2nd white bar from AVIA around 9-10 on my OPPO. I usually run lower that that just because I like the way it looks.

Last night after I turned off my DirecTV HD receiver, and the PJ was sending just black to the screen, I walked up close. I haven't yet determined why, but when I have the gamma in "Graphics" you can see NO noise in the black, just a smooth "black" field. "Video" gamma had a lot of "black noise" while "film" and "PC" had medium amounts.

Note, none were noticeable from my seating position, but up close there was very noticable noise with some gamma settings, and NONE on the "Graphics" gamma setting.

Interesting. I need to experiment more to see if the gamma is the differentiator, or something else.

Anyway, I've never noticed any noise at all that were a result of the PJ. It WILL show noise in your source, for sure, but on a good HD or DVD source, I see zero noise from my seating position.

You can always get no noise on a black screen by turning the brightness down. Actually, on a black screen (or black bars), there should be no dithering (noise), lower your brightness if there is.

The dithering/noise will show up in the shadow details though. How much depends on the PJ. You can turn down the brightness to have less dithering in shadow details, but you will lose shadow detail highlights. Or you can turn up brightness for more shadow details at the expense of more dithering. It's best to adjust from your normal sitting distance to get the trade off best for you.

Budget PJ's usually have more noise/dithering that high end projectors...which usually have extra color wheel segments (dark green segments) to deal with dark shadow details better.

LCD's may not dither like DLP's, but they don't have the shadow detail contrast that DLP's naturally have either.

Fleaman

Does anyone have some tips on adjusting the RGB gain and bias settings on the HD72 using Avia's DVD test patterns? The guide on the disk itself seems lacking. I've had the best luck just adjusting based on skin tones.

I tried this, besides didn't you recommend 50contrast through hdmi just a couple of posts back? Opps that was brightness. Anyhow I tried those settings you recommended. I don't think I was being overly picky because my wife even thought the ht1000 looked better on dvd's ( no tv yet to compare). I looked at screen shots a couple of posts back and I noticed the same kind of noise. Maybe its to be expected picking up going to a higher res. panel. To me I find it very distracting, it defeats the purpose of upgrading. Yes the sharpness, color, and brightness have improved to a large degree but this problem is not worth the gain. The part that confuses me is why isn't a lot of other people complaining? Could it still be a hook up issue, sitting to close to screen, defective model? I hate to lose this awesome valued projector if I could solve my problem.


Those numbers probably won't work for other machines, it's a crap shoot. Best you can do is use your own calibration disc with the dvd player you're using.

If you can see a smooth image with the Xbox 360 you should be able to smooth out a DVD player. It's troublesome because you're running out of hour time on the bulb/ return deal. If you can't fix it, cut it loose and re-group.

Does anyone have some tips on adjusting the RGB gain and bias settings on the HD72 using Avia's DVD test patterns? The guide on the disk itself seems lacking. I've had the best luck just adjusting based on skin tones.

Yes, bring up an Avia graybars pattern, the pluge pattern or even needle pulse has steps of gray. The idea is to remove color bias in the shades of gray. You use RGB-contrast to take color out of the lighter graybars. You use RGB-brightness to take color out of the darker gray bars.

Example, if you see red tint in the lighter gray bars, bring back the red-contrast until the red disapears. Lets says it take 8 clicks, stop and make it 4 clicks and inturn increase the green and blue by 4 clicks each for balance. It works the same way for the darker gray. If you see green in the dark gray back off the Green-brightness till it's gone, cut that number by half and increase the red and blue brightness by the same number for balance.

For future users of this projector:

The 12v trigger plug is a "Type C DC Coaxial power plug"

Radio Shack part number 274-1532.

Tom, when you say RGB-brightness and RGB-contrast, how does that translate to the gain/bias controls on the HD72 ?

I´ve just got this projector yesterday, and it´s awesome, but I can´t seem to find the deinterlacing menu. Is it only active when using the VIDEO input ?

Regards
Kim

For future users of this projector:

The 12v trigger plug is a "Type C DC Coaxial power plug"

Radio Shack part number 274-1532.

Thanks! I was wondering what plug was required. Saves me a bit of hassle.

Heck, those pictures have come out stunningly, Clint! Some of the best I've ever seen. Tried taking some shots of mine the other day, but couldn't produce anything other than a blurred mess. Take it I need a tripod?
I was ready to agree, but I took a second look and...
There is a strong blue cast visible in some of the pictures (I would assume in all of them, actually). For example, Lilu should be wearing white - not white-blue - bandages (check the picture on the DVD's box). I am pretty sure her T-shirt is white too. I believe, Chris Tucker's hairdo is white. You get the picture...
Btw, it's not my monitor: it's set to a warm color temperature.
Aside from the color, the pictures do look great.

Mike

Can someone explain this chroma bug in English for me? :-)

http://www.online-translator.com/url/tran_url.asp?lang=en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2Ftests%2Fprojektoren%2FOp tomaHD72i%2FHD72Test.htm&direction=ge&template=General&cp1=NO&cp2=NO&autotranslate=on&transliterate=on&psubmit2.x=39&psubmit2.y=7

Still open to anyone with suggestions for the H72 settings that provide a good picture in a light controlled room for movies and TV and also settings that will allow for ambient light.

You can try the settings on this page from when I did a basic calibration with Avia Pro and their Optic one meter: These are dark room settings, not for ambient light.

http://www.projectorreviews.com/Manufacturers/optoma/HD72/performance.asp

Scoll down to near the bottom to the Calibration area. These settings were for DVD (I use an oppo), though the digital input. I didn't try component.)

All the related settings used (besides bias and gain) should be listed there as well.

Let me know if that works for you. Also, when looking at the settings, some are - numbers, the text displays small on some monitors, so don't overlook the minus's where they appear. -art

Can someone explain this chroma bug in English for me? :-)

http://www.online-translator.com/url/tran_url.asp?lang=en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2Ftests%2Fprojektoren%2FOp tomaHD72i%2FHD72Test.htm&direction=ge&template=General&cp1=NO&cp2=NO&autotranslate=on&transliterate=on&psubmit2.x=39&psubmit2.y=7
Please read this (I am not an expert): The Chroma Upsampling Error article (http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_8_2/dvd-benchmark-special-report-chroma-bug-4-2001.html)

My understanding of the HD72i problem (my German is very, very weak) is that it only occurred with HDMI set to Component-Video type. The problem did not occur with HDMI-RGB setting.

Mike

I was ready to agree, but I took a second look and...
There is a strong blue cast visible in some of the pictures (I would assume in all of them, actually). For example, Lilu should be wearing white...

Mike

Agreed, but I suspect that it's your camera making the images lean toward blue. Most digital cameras have auto white balance, and that could be your problem.

Theoretically, you could take a nice outdoor screen, bright with lots of color and change the termp setting of the projector, in increments from 6500K to 9500K, and a digital camera could theoretically readjust the images so they all look the same. I turn off the auto white on my camera for my shoots.

Here's a link to a bunch of images (but smaller ones). BTW, her "bandages" are white... You can see a big difference in the color balance between the two shots of Leeloo, yours definitely has more blue content... That's the only image we have roughly in common. -art

Oops. the link: http://www.projectorreviews.com/Manufacturers/optoma/HD72/imagequality.asp -art

I popped in the The Fifth Element DVD in for a few minutes and I verified that all the things I thought were white - were
indeed white: various shades of off-white color and definitely on a warm (color-wise) side. This includes the hostesses' hair.
Btw., Leeloo is wearing white bandages - "thermal bandages" to be exact.

Thanks for the link to the interesting review.

In these two pictures from that review, there is too much red in the HD72's pic:
http://www.projectorreviews.com/images-articles/PE7700_vs_HD72_brightness_LiLu.jpg
Even the stone behind her looks reddish.

Same in these two pics:
http://www.projectorreviews.com/images-articles/PE7700_vs_HD72_bright_adjust.jpg
In the HD72's picture (on the right, of course) even the interstellar dust has a red or purple cast.

On the other hand, I wish I could check these images on a film medium...

Mike

I concur Mike,

As I said, I take turn the auto white balance off, but sometimes I have trouble getting it right, regardless. The image on the screen was much more neutral. For those side by side shots, I was taling about brightness differences, and less concerned about color. -art

Cine4home have completed their HD72 test (Translated link here (http://www.online-translator.com/url/tran_url.asp?lang=en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2Ftests%2Fprojektoren%2FOp tomaHD72i%2FHD72Test.htm&direction=ge&template=General&cp1=NO&cp2=NO&autotranslate=on&transliterate=on&psubmit2.x=54&psubmit2.y=9) . Hopefully they'll translate properly themselves, and add to their international/English site. Does quite well all said. Doesn't fair as well as the Mits HC3000, but they achieved 1800:1 CR with proper colours which is slightly better than the 1500:1 Jason Turk got with the IN76. So much for certain manfacturers 'only quoting calibrated specs', eh ;) They're very strict and accurate, so often point out even the most anal details. However, a couple of things of concern for us HD72 owners me thinks...

From what I gather, they used 2 different pieces of testing equipment to analyse colours. The first showed that colour temp 0 was much preferred to the default 1, yet the second test showed that 1 was actually accurate enough to D65k afterall. Think that seems to be what they found, anyway. So...should we setting to colour temp 0 and calibrating from there?

Another thing they mentioned was that focus on the HD72 needs to be adjusted by the half-millimeter to get optimum sharpness and clean focus. Yet, the lack of sensitiveness of the HD72 focus ring makes it difficult... Something I've spotted myself is that it's best to give it approx 15 mins warm-up time before focusing. Then, bring up the PJ's menu and carefully focus until the interpixel gaps are as noticeable as possible, and there's no bleeding whatsoever to any side of the pixels. Then move the HD72's menu around each corner and make sure it's as uniform as possible. Once it's done right once, at least it doesnt need doing again unless you mess with the focus ring anyway.

Most concerning point they brought up is the 'horizontal chroma bug' via. HDMI :eek: From what I can make out from the translation, if you feed the HD72 HDMI YPbPr colour space it "exchanges color information in columns, so that small colored details show clear stairway steps" and then use the infamous Toy Story menu screen as an example. So, basically, does that mean we should all be making sure we are only sending our HD72's DVI or HDMI RGB colour space signals or else? However, they don't mention which DVD player they found this with, and if they tested with more than one player. And...I'd always thought that the display had no bearing on the chroma bug if the player was deinterlacing/post-processing at source and the display wasn't performaing any deinterlacing/processing itself :confused: I know my S97 doesn't suffer from the bug, so am unsure whether I'm safe here even though I use 4:2:2 YPbPr colour space? One thing I have noticed is that if I change the S97's HDMI output to RGB, and leave the HD72's at YPbPr, nothing seems to change whatsoever. However, if I change the HD72 to RGB I just get a green picture no matter what colour space the S97 is set to. Am I buggared here? :confused: Anyone else care to chime in?

Well, I got my projector hung yesterday. I'm using a Dalite motorized screen and all is well.

Started up the projector today and the picture was upside down and the projector was reset.

DAMMIT!

Anyway, has Optoma released a firmware upgrade that can be done by the user yet? I really do NOT want to send this projector in since I've already removed my old tv from the living room.

If that is the only option, anyone know if VisualApex does hot swaps?

-Mike

[QUOTE=omenII]
From what I gather, they used 2 different pieces of testing equipment to analyse colours. The first showed that colour temp 0 was much preferred to the default 1, yet the second test showed that 1 was actually accurate enough to D65k afterall. Think that seems to be what they found, anyway. So...should we setting to colour temp 0 and calibrating from there?
[QUOTE]

I understood it mean that they had two HD72s to test, each with a different colour balance out of the box.

Damian,

the cine4home review did not use two test instruments.
They say that Optoma's projectors usually have a significant variance in out of the box calibration settings from projector to projector. This is why they measured the out of the box settings for two different HD72's.
The first one showed a significant lack of red in the "Cinema" mode but did alright when they set the "Color Temp" in the picture menu to "0".
The second one showed an acceptable grayscale out of the box for the "Cinema" mode without changing any of the settings. (It did have a little to much blue and not enough red - whowever, they called it acceptable).

Regards,

Horst

I concur Mike,

As I said, I take turn the auto white balance off, but sometimes I have trouble getting it right, regardless. The image on the screen was much more neutral. For those side by side shots, I was taling about brightness differences, and less concerned about color. -art
Art,

I have not realized (until now) that you wrote the "Projector Reviews" HD72 review.
You did an excellent job.

Mike

Well, I got my projector hung yesterday. I'm using a Dalite motorized screen and all is well.

Started up the projector today and the picture was upside down and the projector was reset.

DAMMIT!

Anyway, has Optoma released a firmware upgrade that can be done by the user yet? I really do NOT want to send this projector in since I've already removed my old tv from the living room.

If that is the only option, anyone know if VisualApex does hot swaps?

-Mike

Hang on to it for a while you never know. ;)

Art,

I have not realized (until now) that you wrote the "Projector Reviews" HD72 review.
You did an excellent job.

Mike

Thanks, It sure beats working, love doing the stuff. My biggest frustration, is that its hard to get into the real details that it takes a user, fooling around for weeks to find.

It oft drives me crazy weeks after posting a review, to find someone has detected a flaw in this or that, and its something that I never even thought of looking for.

For example, I now no longer do any testing using component video (except for my D-VHS deck and I don't calibrate for that, etc....) When my Toshiba HD-DVD arrives, I may even retire the D-VHS deck except that I use a couple of good images on a number of reviews.

Anyway having fun. Glad you like my site. -art

Art,

I haven't read every word, but does look like an excellent job. Just wanted to mention that the Toshiba HD-A1 does remove the pause up in the corner pretty quickly, so might be a good option for you for screenshots and the like.

--Darin

Art,

I haven't read every word, but does look like an excellent job. Just wanted to mention that the Toshiba HD-A1 does remove the pause up in the corner pretty quickly, so might be a good option for you for screenshots and the like.

--Darin

Loosing the pause icon sure would be nice.

I was vacationing when the Toshiba's first hit. Been trying to buy one for a week+ no luck at best buy, circuit city, tweeter, not even their online sites, etc.... Searching the interent tomorrow again. Got the Optoma HD7100 (darkchip3) here, review mostly done, but want to try to do HD-DVD before publishing, later this week. If not, I'll just have to post an addendum. One reason (besides image quality, is that I'm hearing that the Toshiba deck seems to work fine with projectors with HDMI inputs, but not all projectors with DVI... We shall see.

Funny thing about the pause icon. Seems to actually affect some projectors with AI.. if the seen is relatively dark - no bright spots, the pause icon seems to be enough to cause the projector to adjust brightness. Ahhh, the trials...

Thanks -art

Most concerning point they brought up is the 'horizontal chroma bug' via. HDMI :eek: From what I can make out from the translation, if you feed the HD72 HDMI YPbPr colour space it "exchanges color information in columns, so that small colored details show clear stairway steps" and then use the infamous Toy Story menu screen as an example. So, basically, does that mean we should all be making sure we are only sending our HD72's DVI or HDMI RGB colour space signals or else? However, they don't mention which DVD player they found this with, and if they tested with more than one player. And...I'd always thought that the display had no bearing on the chroma bug if the player was deinterlacing/post-processing at source and the display wasn't performaing any deinterlacing/processing itself :confused:



Hey there,

Yes we will release an englisch version soon, so you dont have to babelfish anymore :)

About your question: We tested with several players, which are defintaly chroma bug free. The bug has nothing to do with de-interlacing and it looks different than the infamous DVD-Chromabug.

As far as we know, the reason for the Chroma-problem are the scaling filters in the HDMi-receiver. At least that is what a japanese engineer told us once.

We saw that bug quite often lately with pre-production samples, luckily most manufacturors fixed it before realease. The Hitachi TX200 still has it unfortunately just like the HD72 (our testsamples were normal sale machines, NO preproduction).


Regards,
Ekkehart, www.cine4home.de.

I have been running my HD72 for a month now. I find an odd odor in the theater room when the projector has run for awhile. It appears for come from the exhaust vent on the PJ. I thought it was dust or something that would burn off, but after a month, I'm still smelling it. Anyone else notice anything like this? :confused:

After reading this thread, and several others, I decided on the HD 72. The projector came on Friday. I love the picture, but my wife see the dreaded rainbow effect in dark images. I don't want to return the projector. Is there anything I can do to lessen the rainbow effect? Thanks.

Is there anything I can do to lessen the rainbow effect?

Return the wife! :p

Rainbows do lessen over time, if not go away after awhile. I for one saw rainbows for months (very bad and distracting) and can still see them if I want to. But thankfully if I'm just normally viewing my DLP projector I rarely see them. It takes time, hang in there. If you can live with a little light in the room that helped me.

Hey there,

Yes we will release an englisch version soon, so you dont have to babelfish anymore :)

About your question: We tested with several players, which are defintaly chroma bug free. The bug has nothing to do with de-interlacing and it looks different than the infamous DVD-Chromabug.

As far as we know, the reason for the Chroma-problem are the scaling filters in the HDMi-receiver. At least that is what a japanese engineer told us once.

We saw that bug quite often lately with pre-production samples, luckily most manufacturors fixed it before realease. The Hitachi TX200 still has it unfortunately just like the HD72 (our testsamples were normal sale machines, NO preproduction).


Regards,
Ekkehart, www.cine4home.de.Hi Ekkehart, thanks for dropping by and clarifying the situation. Is it possible for Optoma to fix this issue with a firmware/software update then, or is there nothing that can be done now the hardware's been finalised?

Also, (I think, anyway...babel fish translations throws up all kind of abstract weirdness ;) ) you mention that a work around is to send the HD72 RGB colour space. However, I can't seem to do this properly with my Panasonic S97. If I select RGB in the S97's menus, the picture just seems to increase in brightness but the HD72 stays in YPbPr mode. If I then change to RGB on the HD72, the image just goes completely green. I'm going HDMI to HDMI, so wondered if I went from HDMI into the HD72's DVI input with RGB colour space, would that solve it? I don't suppose you have an S97 handy to test it with, have you? Thanks Ekkehart.

Looking forward to reading 'proper' English version of the review :)

I'm having a problem with my Toshiba HD-A1 connected to the HD72. HD-DVDs play perfectly, as do original SD-DVDs. Every "backup" SD-DVD I've tried playing has problems. They play all the way through, but the image has problems. It looks like watching SATV when it's raining outside. Blocky in some places and pauses for about a half second every 10 seconds. I've tried like 10 different movies now. They play fine on other DVD players. Uhg...I guess the workaround is to use 2 DVD players. One strictly for SD-DVD backups, the HD-A1 for everything else. And yeah, I tried upgrading the firmware. :(

My install (http://www.fast351.com/ht/ProjectorInstall/)

Sorry the pictures are kind of crappy, I'm having some issues with the autofocus/white levels on the camera, bit you get the idea.

I'm glad I spent the money on the Chief mount. It's a nice piece that made setting up the projector MUCH easier.

As for the offset, with the RPA-U mount, the center of the lens is EXACTLY 5 inches below the ceiling. The top of the screen is 17" below the ceiling. That's a total of 12" of offset for a 106" screen. Yes, the projector is tilted back slightly to make that happen. I am not using any digital keystoning, and the optical keystoning is not noticable at all. If I look at the screen up close you can't even tell the image is not square by looking at the last row of pixels on the screen. I'm dropping roughly 4 rows of pixels into the border of the screen on all sides.

I decided on the Dalite Video Spectra 1.5 screen material. It's great in the dark, with no visual hotspotting or sparklies, and the screen performs pretty well with ambient light. My blinds haven't showed up yet, and while it was overcast outside, the image was completely watchable in all but the darkest scenes.

I need to go through and set up my color using my DVE disk, because it's a little red in certain scenes right now, but the color looked pretty good out of the box.

I am using the DVI in for my HTPC, and component in (currently) for my HD OTA tuner because I forgot to order a second DVI-HDMI adapter. I'm using 30' long HDMI cables from bluejeanscable and they work just great. I'm also using a composite cable to feed the setup screen for my receiver to the projector. I considered feeding it into the capture card on my HTPC, but decided that was a little too much screwing around.

I'm still working on using the RS-232 in to feed in remote control commands from my HTPC. It's got a better IR receiver and then I won't have to point the remote at the projector (bouncing off the screen doesn't work).

My only complaints on the projector so far:

1) The zoom ring on the lens is pretty loose. You can tap it and it moves. A little thicker grease would be helpful here to keep it from moving, although once it's set I guess it doesn't need to go anywhere.

2) The 4 mounting screws on the bottom are not centered on the center of gravity, which makes the projector tilt under it's own weight. The mount allowed me to dial that out, but it would have been nice to have the mount level.

3) My reset to 0 firmware bug may be something else. The wife finally fessed up that after I went to bed she was watching TV, and when she tried to shut the projector off using the "press power twice" method, the lamp shut off, but the power light stayed on solid and the 12v trigger stayed on. It was basically frozen after that and wouldn't respond to remote control commands. She unplugged it to get it to turn off. The next day it was reset when I turned it back on. I guess I'll keep an eye on it and if it doesn't happen again I'll write it off as an anomoly.

Would I get the same projector again? Absolutely.

-Mike

This may be a stupid question, but here goes ...

If I have the PJ plugged into a power bar, and the power bar was switched off, are the PJ's settings resetted?

The reason why I ask is because I'd like to plug the PJ and audio-video components into a semi-hidden power bar so that my 2 year old can't turn on things himself.

On a similar note, does turning off the power switch on the back of the PJ reset its settings?

Thanks.

Edited... not allowed.

Hi.

I´m making a mount for my HD72 tomorrow, and need to know if there is any horizontal offset on the projector.

When I have it standing on my desk, it doesn´t seem that the lens is right in the middle of the screen. It is off to the right.

Is this just cause I haven´t set it up correctly or what ?

I've also noticed that rainbows seem to lessen over time. I think part of it is you stop visually scanning the screen for quality and you just watch the movie (something that is difficult for many of us :) ).

Rainbows do lessen over time, if not go away after awhile. I for one saw rainbows for months (very bad and distracting) and can still see them if I want to. But thankfully if I'm just normally viewing my DLP projector I rarely see them. It takes time, hang in there. If you can live with a little light in the room that helped me.

Hi Ekkehart, thanks for dropping by and clarifying the situation. Is it possible for Optoma to fix this issue with a firmware/software update then, or is there nothing that can be done now the hardware's been finalised?

Also, (I think, anyway...babel fish translations throws up all kind of abstract weirdness ;) ) you mention that a work around is to send the HD72 RGB colour space. However, I can't seem to do this properly with my Panasonic S97. If I select RGB in the S97's menus, the picture just seems to increase in brightness but the HD72 stays in YPbPr mode. If I then change to RGB on the HD72, the image just goes completely green. I'm going HDMI to HDMI, so wondered if I went from HDMI into the HD72's DVI input with RGB colour space, would that solve it? I don't suppose you have an S97 handy to test it with, have you? Thanks Ekkehart.

Looking forward to reading 'proper' English version of the review :)



Well, my guess that it is possible to solve the bug with a firmware update. I know about at least one other model, where the manufacturer fixed exactly the same problem by a simple software fix.

About the S97, yes i do have one handy here, but unfortunately not the projector right now :-( How you describe it the HDMI-RGB connection does not work for some reason. Maybe i get to check that next week.


Regards,
Ekkehart, www.cine4home.de

Damn, this colorspace talk is confusing...

I have a DTV HD-DVR connected via HDMI to DVI cable to the HD72, it uses YCbCr colorspace. My Oppo DVD player connects via the same cable, but flipped around - DVI to HDMI on the HD72, and it uses RGB colorspace. Both work perfect. If there's a color bug, I can't see it during normal operation. (What's an easy way to see it?)

You may ask why I used two DVI-HDMI crossover cables instead of an HDMI-HDMI and DVI-DVI? Because Monoprice was out of everything except the HDMI-DVI cables in the length I needed. At this point, it's working perfectly.

I'm looking to buy this projector, only worry I have is how annoying is it when people are walking in front of the light and creating a shadow on the picture?

I'm looking to buy this projector, only worry I have is how annoying is it when people are walking in front of the light and creating a shadow on the picture?

Very annoying!

Tell them "To go to the bathroom before the movie starts and no walking in front of the projector under the severe pain of being drawn and quartered!"

I've also noticed that rainbows seem to lessen over time. I think part of it is you stop visually scanning the screen for quality and you just watch the movie (something that is difficult for many of us :) ).

Thanks for the input. My wife even agrees to point, but she can't help noticing it in her peripheral vision. I think she is just extremely sensitive to RBE. We went to a local high end shop to look at some other options. They suggested a Vidikron and touted how they had zero complaints about RBE with this machine. To the salesman's amazement, she immediately notice RBE in Batman Returns.

Any good suggestions for a bright LCD projector?

...

2) The 4 mounting screws on the bottom are not centered on the center of gravity, which makes the projector tilt under it's own weight. The mount allowed me to dial that out, but it would have been nice to have the mount level.
...



I have been wondering about this point also. I was told that it is best to get the
center of the bracket "rectangle" centered on the mount holes. It's something not
mentioned in the Chief mount instructions and almost impossible to fully achieve
with the RPA-U legs. The lateral offset from the lens center
(also the center line of the mount holes from front to back)
to the mount rectangle on mine is about 2 1/4" - looks very similar to your picture.

Orginally I had this much farther to the center of the pj which cause a
"torque" on the chassis - that could be bad over time.

I think you've done the best you can do.

(Second look at picture..)
Actually, you did a lot "better" than I did. I kept the leg end holes as the
M3 screw mount points. It looks to me that you used the slotted area of the
leg for both the rectanglar plate and M3 screw mount points.

Am I correct?

Thanks for the input. My wife even agrees to point, but she can't help noticing it in her peripheral vision. I think she is just extremely sensitive to RBE. We went to a local high end shop to look at some other options. They suggested a Vidikron and touted how they had zero complaints about RBE with this machine. To the salesman's amazement, she immediately notice RBE in Batman Returns.

Any good suggestions for a bright LCD projector?

The Panny PT-AE900u is very bright. I love mine. Plus it's about $200 cheaper through Visual Apex if you ask for AVS pricing and it has a 2 yr warranty. Also you get $400 mail in rebate and 40 free Blockbuster rentals. I promise I do not work for Panny or VA :D I'm just very happy with my PJ. You will not see the typical LCD screendoor effect with the Panny due to it's "smoothscreen" but you will probably find the image softer than the Optoma's.

Tom, when you say RGB-brightness and RGB-contrast, how does that translate to the gain/bias controls on the HD72 ?

I´ve just got this projector yesterday, and it´s awesome, but I can´t seem to find the deinterlacing menu. Is it only active when using the VIDEO input ?

Regards
Kim

That's right deinterlacing is just for SD 480i. Gains is contrast bias is brightness.

I'm looking to buy this projector, only worry I have is how annoying is it when people are walking in front of the light and creating a shadow on the picture?
This only happens when you implement the concept of a "theater" too literally, i.e., have people walking, talking, plus those annoying exit signs.

Just kidding of course...
No offense.

3) My reset to 0 firmware bug may be something else. The wife finally fessed up that after I went to bed she was watching TV, and when she tried to shut the projector off using the "press power twice" method, the lamp shut off, but the power light stayed on solid and the 12v trigger stayed on. It was basically frozen after that and wouldn't respond to remote control commands. She unplugged it to get it to turn off. The next day it was reset when I turned it back on. I guess I'll keep an eye on it and if it doesn't happen again I'll write it off as an anomoly.

Mine just did this, though without the reset of settings. I turned it off this evening after CSI: Miami, and noticed after a few moments the fan didn't go into fullspeed like it should for 30 seconds. Power light was on, lamp was off, fan was as usual almost idle speed (could barely hear it). It didn't respond to the remote (eg, the power button). Did not try pressing buttons on the unit itself - it's mounted on a very high ceiling!

Unplugged the power cord, gave it 10 seconds, plugged it back in. The PJ powered up okay, so I ran it for five more minutes or so, and then it turned off normally when I asked it to.

Would I get the same projector again? Absolutely.

-Mike

Me too! I love this projector. If it does this funky power off thing again, though, I guess Optoma will get another call. Two issues before I've owned it two months!

Chris.

hey, looking for some help, i have this projector and love it. Im looking at continuing with my system, and am looking at recievers. I was looking at the yamaha rxv2600. my question is do i want this reciever for its upscaling abilities, or am i better off leaving the projector to do the scaling??? Also the guy at the shop reckons i dont want to use the HDMI upconversion. as this will limit the tunability of the colours and im better off using component... is this right??? Im using just a regular sony dvd player with no up scaling with component out. I also want to run my ps2, vcr and digital tv through the reciever. Thanks to anyone who can point me in the best direction

Very annoying!

Tell them "To go to the bathroom before the movie starts and no walking in front of the projector under the severe pain of being drawn and quartered!"

Man...that sucks. I guess it's the same as someone walking in front of the TV though.

Thanks for the input. My wife even agrees to point, but she can't help noticing it in her peripheral vision. I think she is just extremely sensitive to RBE. We went to a local high end shop to look at some other options. They suggested a Vidikron and touted how they had zero complaints about RBE with this machine. To the salesman's amazement, she immediately notice RBE in Batman Returns.

Any good suggestions for a bright LCD projector?


Here are two LCD projectors worth looking at with the Epson being the brighter of the two:

EPSON PowerLite Cinema 550
Sanyo PLV-Z4 Projector

(Second look at picture..)
Actually, you did a lot "better" than I did. I kept the leg end holes as the
M3 screw mount points. It looks to me that you used the slotted area of the
leg for both the rectanglar plate and M3 screw mount points.

Am I correct?

Yeah, that allowed me quite a bit more lateral movement towards the lens.

As long as there are washers under the M3 screws, the reversing of the feet shouldn't make any difference in stability.

-Mike

bump

This may be a stupid question, but here goes ...

If I have the PJ plugged into a power bar, and the power bar was switched off, are the PJ's settings resetted?

The reason why I ask is because I'd like to plug the PJ and audio-video components into a semi-hidden power bar so that my 2 year old can't turn on things himself.

On a similar note, does turning off the power switch on the back of the PJ reset its settings?

Thanks.

No, it doesn't. Or at least it shouldn't ;)

I created a remote control app that speaks serial to the Optoma HD72 to issue remote codes based on keypresses or button pushes.

You can download it here:

http://www.fast351.com/htpc/HD72.exe

So basically the IR receiver in my HTPC receives a remote command (not necessarily that of the Optoma remote, as a matter of fact I'm going to reuse the old remote that came with my TV to prevent double remote code presses due to the IR on the projector and the IR on the HTPC receiving the same codes).

Then the IR receiver software generates a keyboard event to this app for the appropriate key.

This app sends the correct serial command to the projector.

Should help improve WAF factor :) :)

Given that it looks like the HD72 does 1080i->540p->720p (bob instead of weave?) and indeed my Oppo when outputing 1080i is picked up as 540p on the HD72, does that mean a 576p PAL source is going to look higher def than 1080i ? Just wondering.

(edit - it says "540p x 1920" when fed an 1080i signal, so I guess I'm asking will a PAL DVD at 576p give a higher vertical resolution ? Horizontally it certainly won't).

576 - 540
----------- = 6.7% (meaningless)
540

And the resolution of your projector is still 1280x720, that's 6.7% loss of source resolution being upscaled to 720p. The more source detail relative to the native resolution there is, the more accurate the interpolation of the upscaling will be, and hence harder to notice.

I don't notice a 25% loss of vertical detail going from a 720p source to 1080i source on the HD72 so 6.7% is most likely impossible to notice (well, unless you're the type that believes uber expensive monster cables are vastly superior to everything else ;) )

I see Optoma is offering a free lamp now with the HD72, that's certainly enough of a bonus to cause me to take the plunge.

Will Visual Apex discount more if you ask for "AVS pricing" on this unit too?

:)

Thank you for checking this post out. I have an HD-72 Optoma and a 133" Da-Lite HC-Cinema Vision screen. I was told it has 1.1 gain and it is slightly grey. There were some specs about the rbg and all those settings at projectorreviews.com but that 'starting point' just isnt good enough. Can someone in a similar situation please take a few moments of their time to make my viewing experience better for years to come? I was considering isf calibration, but the 350 - 450 price tag seems a bit much for a 2000 dollar projector that might need calibration after the lamp dims at some point. Why are there no isf calibration specs posted anywhere online? I realize they do something to the hidden menus but there arent any guides for noobies like me anywhere!? Thinking of dropping 65 or so on that digital video essentials dvd, but someone as inexperienced as myself might just mess up the colors even more. Any advice you can offer on what I should do or settings to use will be more than appreciated. Thank you all so much for your time. Spencer

In addition, what is the best upconverter for an HD-72? oppo something? Denon? I have the computer hooked up via the dvi slot in the projector, so should I skip the stand alone and get a much better video card? Will that do the trick? Anybody have any experience with that? does it upconvert by itself? or do I have to up the res on the computer and it will upconvert by itself? Thank you for your time :) Spencer

Thank you for checking this post out. I have one more that I was hoping people would use to share calibration settings for the optoma hd-72. What is the best upconverter for an HD-72? oppo something? Denon? I have the computer hooked up via the dvi slot in the projector, so should I skip the stand alone and get a much better video card? Will that do the trick? Anybody have any experience with that? does it upconvert by itself? or do I have to up the res on the computer and it will upconvert by itself? Thank you for your time :) Spencer

I read on many sites that the new Toshiba HD-DVD player is the best up converting SD-DVD player out there bar none. On top of that you get an HD-DVD player! This is the player I plan to get when my local Wal-Mart starts stocking them. I was told next week.

I own an IN76. Seeing a free lamp with the HD72 now makes the HD72 a very good value. What a difference a month makes ... at this rate I'll be buying a DC3 720p projector in July for <$2200 and perhaps a 1080p this fall for <$4000.

k

I'm interested in this projector, and am curiuos if any owners of the U.S. version have noticed or been able to recreate the horizontal chroma bug via. HDMI that the cine4home review found?

Thank you for checking this post out. I have an HD-72 Optoma and a 133" Da-Lite HC-Cinema Vision screen. I was told it has 1.1 gain and it is slightly grey. There were some specs about the rbg and all those settings at projectorreviews.com but that 'starting point' just isnt good enough. Can someone in a similar situation please take a few moments of their time to make my viewing experience better for years to come? I was considering isf calibration, but the 350 - 450 price tag seems a bit much for a 2000 dollar projector that might need calibration after the lamp dims at some point. Why are there no isf calibration specs posted anywhere online? I realize they do something to the hidden menus but there arent any guides for noobies like me anywhere!? Thinking of dropping 65 or so on that digital video essentials dvd, but someone as inexperienced as myself might just mess up the colors even more. Any advice you can offer on what I should do or settings to use will be more than appreciated. Thank you all so much for your time. Spencer

I am in a light controlled room
I have a matte white screen, no gain.
The settings that work for me are the following. Set all of the RGB controls to 0.
Set the contrast, brightness and color controls to 0.
Turn the AI function off. Set the lamp in low power mode.
Set the Brilliant color to 4, the Truevivid to 2 and the color temp to 1.
Set the sharpness between 6-10
This should give you a good place to start.

Thank you for your time Richard. Im still hoping to get a tad further in settings but i appreciate your effort. Not sure about that hd-dvd player yet -going to see if blu-ray storms the castles of hd-dvd or if they marry off one of their children for peace (2nd - 3rd gen multi player). But as the McClain McCloud of the Clan McClain said, THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE! Thank you again and please keep the settings coming! 1.1 screen gain on high contrast cinema vision anyone?

spencerfine,

Your best starting point would be to get a copy of AVIA and use that to adjust the basics: brightness, contrast, sharpness and color. You can try other owner's settings, but they most likely won't be correct for your projector. If you want perfect color temp and grayscale there's a few members here that offer a mail-in Colorfacts calibration for much less than an on-site ISF tech.

-Mike

I'm considering "Digital Video Essentials" because it seems newer and covers dvi and hdmi as well as hdtv. I will go for avia today though if its that much better. Colorfacts calibration? Do you happen to know any guys here who are good at that? Never heard of that but it might be comparable to an ISF calibration if im lucky. Do they access the hidden menus though like ISF? How good are they? Guess Im most concerned about results but if this would do it, Im in. Thanx again. Spencer

I have DVE and it's fine but it's hard to navigate at first. Once you do it a few times it's easy to get where you want to go. I hear Avia is much easier to navigate but I don't know if it has any other benefits then that.

Guitarman has a mail in PJ tune up service that I have used and highly recommend. The thread looks like it's been archived but just pm him for the details.

Rod

Given that it looks like the HD72 does 1080i->540p->720p (bob instead of weave?) and indeed my Oppo when outputing 1080i is picked up as 540p on the HD72, does that mean a 576p PAL source is going to look higher def than 1080i ? Just wondering.

(edit - it says "540p x 1920" when fed an 1080i signal, so I guess I'm asking will a PAL DVD at 576p give a higher vertical resolution ? Horizontally it certainly won't).

What it "says" on the screen is what the input signal reports, not the actual resolution it would appear.

When I send it a signal from my OPPO for example, the HD72 "reports" a full resolution, like "1280 x 720." I notice it also says "1920 x 540" regardless of if the OPPO is set to 540p or 1080i.

However, for my DirecTV HD Tivo, it reports only the vertical resolution, "480i, 480p, 720p, or 1080i"

Yes, the HD72 reports "1080i" not 540 when recieving a 1080 signal from the DTV box. So it would appear the resolution it shows on the screen is merely what is being "reported" from the input device, not the actual resolution it is seeing.

AGAIN, go WATCH an HD72 with a 1080i input signal from HDTV, and compare to 720p input signal. I'd venture to guess that unless someone told you what setting it was on, you couldn't tell the difference. I was messing with it last night and left my DTV on 1080i accidentally all evening, and never even knew it (while watching an NBA game in HD.)

If it does this funky power off thing again, though, I guess Optoma will get another call. Two issues before I've owned it two months!

Chris.


Now that is brand loyalty!

k

I'm considering "Digital Video Essentials" because it seems newer and covers dvi and hdmi as well as hdtv. I will go for avia today though if its that much better. Colorfacts calibration? Do you happen to know any guys here who are good at that? Never heard of that but it might be comparable to an ISF calibration if im lucky. Do they access the hidden menus though like ISF? How good are they? Guess Im most concerned about results but if this would do it, Im in. Thanx again. Spencer


I have both but always tend to go with AVIA for useability. As mentioned, Tom (Guitarman) has a mail-in service for a reasonable price. He did my H31 and I'm happy enough that I'm not even considering the 72 for the time being. I thought I had read that Krasmuzik was doing mail-in's as well, but I'm not 100% sure.

-Mike

Now that is brand loyalty!

k

Mine's going back. 2 resets in the first week. I thought they got all the units in inventory updated. Apparently they felt that this was unnecessary.

They need to get a field firmware update procedure in place. There is no excuse for it. I work for an embedded controls company, and the field firmware update is one of the first problems we solve.

-Mike

AGAIN, go WATCH an HD72 with a 1080i input signal from HDTV, and compare to 720p input signal. I'd venture to guess that unless someone told you what setting it was on, you couldn't tell the difference. I was messing with it last night and left my DTV on 1080i accidentally all evening, and never even knew it (while watching an NBA game in HD.)

You should not see a difference.. The HD72 is converting the 1080i signal to 720 so you would not see any more detail. The difference would be looking at this projector at 720p (from 1080i) with its conversion and looking at another at 720p (from 1080i) usnig a different conversion to look for details.

You should not see a difference.. The HD72 is converting the 1080i signal to 720 so you would not see any more detail. The difference would be looking at this projector at 720p (from 1080i) with its conversion and looking at another at 720p (from 1080i) usnig a different conversion to look for details.

I know you shouldn't see a difference, that is my point. My response really was in regards to the "bob" or "weave" issue that keeps popping up in every thread the HD72 is part of. Somehow many people are dismissing the unit because they feel it"bobs" 1080 to 540p, then upscales to 720p for display.

What I'm saying is that when VIEWING a 1080 input, it appears as good as 720p input, regardless of what method of scaling it uses. On the contrary, when viewing a 480p input (very close to 540p) it's obviously much lower resolution and very visibly different than HD. If it's merely cutting 1080 down to 540, it does a damn good job at it.

Too many people on this forum overall get caught up in specs, and what a device does on paper, instead of what it does for your EYES.

Mine's going back. 2 resets in the first week. I thought they got all the units in inventory updated. Apparently they felt that this was unnecessary.

They need to get a field firmware update procedure in place. There is no excuse for it. I work for an embedded controls company, and the field firmware update is one of the first problems we solve.

-Mike


Come to the dark side ... you won't be dissapointed.

HD72 = white
IN76 = black

k

Thank you for your time Richard. Im still hoping to get a tad further in settings but i appreciate your effort. Not sure about that hd-dvd player yet -going to see if blu-ray storms the castles of hd-dvd or if they marry off one of their children for peace (2nd - 3rd gen multi player). But as the McClain McCloud of the Clan McClain said, THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE! Thank you again and please keep the settings coming! 1.1 screen gain on high contrast cinema vision anyone?

Be sure to break in the projector before doing any critical alignment. I have close
to 100 hours on my lamp and the factory settings which I thought looked like
crap (when the projector was new), now look pretty good.
For me, the Cinema setting is best Factory preset for most of my DVD's.
Note: There is a reset setting (in the menu) you can use to restore the factory
default settings.

A new one is supposedly en route already, supposed to be here today.

It is encouraging that they're making a firmware update procedure. Maybe they can fix the 12v trigger turning on and off briefly when shutting down right before going into standby. It makes my screen roll down about 6" and go back up right before shutting off.

Now that is brand loyalty!

k

Nah, while I do really like the projector, not jumping at every defect is more out of laziness than anything else. It has to cross the threshold of bugging me too much - ie, the second time it does it.

Chris.

Anyone have this projector and using it at ~5500' (Denver)? If so, have you had to use the high-altitude mode? Or is that mode for even higher altitudes?

I am at 5000 feet in Utah and the projector works great without having to use the vacuum cleaner level, "high altitude" setting. Having to send my unit back for a firmware update and then the free bulb offer now offered for new buyers (that I missed out on ) really has me in a funk... but the projector looks GREAT!!!

I bought a 35' DVI cable from Monoprice.com to run the video signal from a computer in the first floor of my house to the home theater in the basement. Well, it doesn't work. I am able to hook an LCD panel up to the cable and it works fine, but won't work with the HD72. The HD72 just fills the screen with a solid color and eventually locks up. I have to hard power off the projector. I'm wondering if I need to get a DVI repeater. Tonight I'll try running a ground wire from my computer's chassis to the HD72's chassis. Anyone have some ideas or have run into this type of problem before?

I am running my projector off my HTPC with a 30' HDMI -> DVI cable from Blue Jeans Cable, with an HDMI to DVI adapter at the HTPC end, and it's been flawless in the 20 or so hours I've had my projector.

I also ran my Samsung HD-850 DVD player through a 30' Blue Jeans Cable HDMI->HDMI cable without any issues. (Although the projector does throw up a warning every chapter change that Audio over HDMI is not supported, which is very annoying).

Blue Jeans Cable does suggest keeping the cable length to 30' or less for 1080P signals, but suggest that 50' is doable with lesser signals.

Have you tried any other DVI sources?

I've got the projector to work by plugging in a ~8' DVI cable from the computer to projector. It worked great.

That would be your DVD player telling you about the HDMI audio...you should be able to change that in the player settings I would think.

After looking at that website, I noticed they have several grades of DVI cables there. Which one did you end up using?

They should only have 1 35' DVI cable. I wasn't sure whether to get DVD-D dual link or just single link, but they only offered the dual link. Honestly, I'm not quite sure what dual link is for.

I bought a 35' DVI cable from Monoprice.com to run the video signal from a computer in the first floor of my house to the home theater in the basement. Well, it doesn't work. I am able to hook an LCD panel up to the cable and it works fine, but won't work with the HD72. The HD72 just fills the screen with a solid color and eventually locks up. I have to hard power off the projector. I'm wondering if I need to get a DVI repeater. Tonight I'll try running a ground wire from my computer's chassis to the HD72's chassis. Anyone have some ideas or have run into this type of problem before?


Interesting that it works for your LCD but not the 72. I was thinking initially you may have just gotten a bad cable. I run a 35' monoprice DVI/HDMI from the PJ to a monoprice switcher then 3 footers to the HDTV cable box and the Oppo.

I've tested it via DVE looking for sparkles and it performs flawlessy.

Looks like Monoprice only has 24AWG on the 35 footer so maybe the 72 can't pick up a weaker signal?

Some displays just want a stronger signal than others... you may need a repeater.

OK, I am officially f*cking pissed at Optoma's handling of this firmware issue.

For one, this shouldn't even be a problem for me. This problem was identified and fixed over three months ago, and still I received a brand new unit without this update, something that's obviously a huge problem.

Second, this should be a FIELD FIXABLE problem!! Anyone that has firmware in a piece of electronics owes it to their customers to make this a painless procedure. I shouldn't have to give my credit card information to them for cross shipping for something that was both a serious flaw in their beta testing (this should never have gotten out the door seeing as how prevalent this issue is) and a serious deficiency because of the lack of field upgradability.

Third, their customer service BLOWS ASS:

I called Monday morning with this problem. They assured me after I faxed back their credit card form that a new projector was being overnighted.

I called Tuesday after not receiving it, and they said they needed my old units serial number (despite being told the day before to just drop the original receipt in the box of the returned unit). Fine, I go home from work specifically to send them the serial number.

Wednesday comes and goes, and the unit doesn't show up. I call Optoma, and they can't even find a record of my unit. So after sitting on hold for 30 minutes, I am ASSURED a new unit will ship out.

Thursday comes, and no new unit. So I call, and they said the employee missed the shipping deadline, despite the assurances the previous day that the unit would go out today. I ask for the RMA number, which I was not provided previously so I don't have to do the stupid "find my record dance" the next call.

Friday comes, STILL no unit. I call, and give them the RMA number. They pull my record, and my name is on it, but the address and everything else is incorrect. GRRR what a bunch of incompetent )(*#$%@%@_)(*^@ They just ASSURED me that they now have everything fixed and the unit will be here MONDAY?!?!

At this point my guess is the odds are low the unit is going to show up on Monday, at which point I am reversing my credit card charges for the projector, boxing the thing up and shipping it back to Visual Apex and letting them fight it out for me. I'm tired of this. I've wasted over 4 hours on the phone trying to get resolution on this issue, and I still am stuck without a new projector.

I haven't checked with my credit card company yet, but I bet they charged me for a new projector the second they got that fax on Monday.

Sorry, I just had to vent.

If you buy one of these projectors (and aside from their completely ****** customer service, I love the projector) make sure you get a unit with upgraded firmware in it. Not sure how you go about doing that, but it's worth the effort.

-Mike

I bought a 35' DVI cable from Monoprice.com to run the video signal from a computer in the first floor of my house to the home theater in the basement. Well, it doesn't work. I am able to hook an LCD panel up to the cable and it works fine, but won't work with the HD72. The HD72 just fills the screen with a solid color and eventually locks up. I have to hard power off the projector. I'm wondering if I need to get a DVI repeater. Tonight I'll try running a ground wire from my computer's chassis to the HD72's chassis. Anyone have some ideas or have run into this type of problem before?

One of the cables I use is a 15 meter Ultralink DVI-Pro. I had no problem with it, when reviewing the HD72, either from my DVD or Cox HD cable box, whether going directly to the projector, or through my Marantz receiver which has DVI switching.

In other words, I've had reallly good luck with Ultralink, so far. Not all expensive cables are created equal. (And their's ain't cheap!)

Well, I guess I just can't see it being a bad, or lesser quality, cable when it works great on my LCD. No sparklies or anything. The D shell on the DVI cable should carry the ground I would think, but I'm still going to give that a shot when I get home. The 15' HDMI cable works great, and the 50' RCA S/PDIF audio cable also shows no problems.(or can't hear any problems at least) :rolleyes:

On the DVI cable, some DVI receiver hardware is more sensitive than other DVI receiver hardware. I guess the only way that I can explain it is that one HDTV OTA tuner may pull in a marginal signal because it's using a 5th generation tuner chip with good multipath rejection, whereas another HDTV OTA tuner box gets nothing because the tuner chip is old and much less sensitive.

On the SPDIF cable, you can't compare the two. SPDIF data is MUCH slower than DVI data. Most SPDIF data moves between 100 and 900 k/sec. Video data can move up to 45 gig/sec. Obviously very different requirements.

-Mike

Well, I guess I just can't see it being a bad, or lesser quality, cable when it works great on my LCD. No sparklies or anything. The D shell on the DVI cable should carry the ground I would think, but I'm still going to give that a shot when I get home. The 15' HDMI cable works great, and the 50' RCA S/PDIF audio cable also shows no problems.(or can't hear any problems at least) :rolleyes:

It was just a thought.

My experience is that there is significant variation from device to device (in this case projectors) as to how long a run of particular cable can be before problems show up.

If I recall correctly, the official spec originally for DVI was only 5 or 6 meter length (for 1080 bandwidth. So, it is possible that for your HD72 a different brand cable that length might work better.

Interesting that it works for your LCD but not the 72. I was thinking initially you may have just gotten a bad cable. I run a 35' monoprice DVI/HDMI from the PJ to a monoprice switcher then 3 footers to the HDTV cable box and the Oppo.

I've tested it via DVE looking for sparkles and it performs flawlessy.

Looks like Monoprice only has 24AWG on the 35 footer so maybe the 72 can't pick up a weaker signal?


You have the h72 hooked to one end what is your source at the other?

The informal test of the monoprice 50' 24awg dvi cable passed for 1080p so I'm wondering about the source or that particular cable you've got.

I'm using a graphics card that's about a year or so old. It's an nVidia BFG FX6800 OC 128MB. My main purpose is to use the computer for gaming. The intention was indead of buying a new computer for the HT or unhooking and taking it from room to room each time, I thought I would try some long cables and an RF keyboard. There will also be that much less noise/heat in the room.

Art, I liked your review of the HD72. It helped me in my decision of finally pulling the trigger. IN76 and it were really close.

I appreciate the help so far guys...I'll try a few things when I get home. I wonder if there is anything in the video card settings that will affect this besides resolution and refresh rate? I guess I'll take a look.

-Derrin

I popped in the The Fifth Element DVD in for a few minutes and I verified that all the things I thought were white - were
indeed white: various shades of off-white color and definitely on a warm (color-wise) side. This includes the hostesses' hair.
Btw., Leeloo is wearing white bandages - "thermal bandages" to be exact.

Thanks for the link to the interesting review.

In these two pictures from that review, there is too much red in the HD72's pic:
http://www.projectorreviews.com/images-articles/PE7700_vs_HD72_brightness_LiLu.jpg
Even the stone behind her looks reddish.

Same in these two pics:
http://www.projectorreviews.com/images-articles/PE7700_vs_HD72_bright_adjust.jpg
In the HD72's picture (on the right, of course) even the interstellar dust has a red or purple cast.

On the other hand, I wish I could check these images on a film medium...

Mike

This is an interesting comparison... have you since tried a Tweaking DVD?
Just Curious

I narrowed my purchase to a H72 but a box store in canada has the Optoma H78DC3 on for a good price what is the difference in quality, features, pq etc? Is it worth the extra $
Thanks Steve

At this point my guess is the odds are low the unit is going to show up on Monday, at which point I am reversing my credit card charges for the projector, boxing the thing up and shipping it back to Visual Apex and letting them fight it out for me. I'm tired of this. I've wasted over 4 hours on the phone trying to get resolution on this issue, and I still am stuck without a new projector.

Well well well. They were supposed to email me the tracking number today, and guess what, no tracking number. I call back, and mysteriously there's a problem with my credit card (sha right). I really need to start trusting my instincts more.

I'm getting the original vendor involved. Fortunately Visual Apex seems to be stepping up to the plate. They have been MUCH more forthcoming so far.

I guess all I can tell you people is do NOT buy an Optoma projector at this time. If you do not want a resetting projector, and do not want to wrestle with Optoma on the phone for hours, I'd wait for them to fix this problem, by either making these unit field upgradable or upgrading all their existing inventory at their dealers. Who knows how long that will be. Obviously Optoma doesn't give a **** about customer service, which is too bad because their product is solid (give for this firmware problem). :( :( :(

I can't get my Harmony to power on or control my Optoma HD72 projector. I have it set up properly, and I've even verified the remote codes using the original remote, and it said everything was correct. I've even tried learning the power button from my original remote. For some reason, even though the codes it's using seem to be correct, it just won't work. Any ideas? Thanks.

The HD72 just fills the screen with a solid color and eventually locks up. I have to hard power off the projector. I'm wondering if I need to get a DVI repeater. Tonight I'll try running a ground wire from my computer's chassis to the HD72's chassis. Anyone have some ideas or have run into this type of problem before?

Does it work with a short run (if you move your PC close to your PJ) ? My Oppo works for DVI to HDMI fine but DVI to DVI worked for a minute then the picture broke up and eventually lost the signal. Tried it with a shorter lead (1m) and the same thing, but this time the PJ locked up. So I think DVI to DVI is a no go for me so far. Will contact Optoma on Monday. So are you able to try the HDMI port ?

This is an interesting comparison... have you since tried a Tweaking DVD?
Just CuriousTicotva, the screenshots are from this review: HD72 Review (http://www.projectorreviews.com/Manufacturers/optoma/HD72/index.asp) by Art Feierman ("Presenter").

http://www.projectorreviews.com/images-articles/PE7700_vs_HD72_bright_adjust.jpg

The caption above the spaceship images states:
"In this last image below, I used Photoshop to reduce the brightness of the Optoma (right side) so that brightness would be similar to the BenQ PE7700 on the left. This effort isn't perfect, but does show some differences in the star field and also that the two projectors are a bit different in color balance."

The difference in color on those two images is very large - not "a bit different" - unless they were magnified by the camera used.
Assuming the SuperBit "The Fifth Element" DVD has an accurate color (I believe it does and I never heard anything to the contrary), the Optoma projector shows a strong "red push."

Look at these images; the color difference is huge (before calibration of the Optoma H78).
H78 on the left; Maranz VP-12S4 on the right:
http://www.projectorreviews.com/images-articles/Optoma_H78DC3_projector_vs_Marantz_VP12S4_projector_colors_o ff.jpg

I am sure the color from my "lowly" Optoma H31 isn't perfect, but it does not exhibit any "color push"
(after adjustements that do not qualify for a word "calibration").
If I understand this correctly, an accurate gray-scale calibration is no guarantee for an accurate color.

Btw. what is Tweaking DVD?
Thanks.

Mike

Gotta read everything...

Ticotva, the screenshots are from this review: HD72 Review (http://www.projectorreviews.com/Manufacturers/optoma/HD72/index.asp) by Art Feierman ("Presenter").

http://www.projectorreviews.com/images-articles/PE7700_vs_HD72_bright_adjust.jpg

The caption above the spaceship images states:
"In this last image below, I used Photoshop to reduce the brightness of the Optoma (right side) so that brightness would be similar to the BenQ PE7700 on the left. This effort isn't perfect, but does show some differences in the star field and also that the two projectors are a bit different in color balance."


I concur Mike,

As I said, I take turn the auto white balance off, but sometimes I have trouble getting it right, regardless. The image on the screen was much more neutral. For those side by side shots, I was taling about brightness differences, and less concerned about color. -art

I don't think, the digital camera used is soly responsible for the "off color."
It's no accident that the TV standard is called "Never The Same Color."
I am joking - but just a little...

I'd like to see side-by-side comparison with the Samsung H710AE as well as comparison with the actual movie (film medium) in a good movie theater.
The Optoma H78 was very expensive when Art reviewed it, yet it had a strong greenish cast.
This is a really bad attitude by the manufacturer unless a voucher for free calibration were included with the projector...

Mike

Given that it looks like the HD72 does 1080i->540p->720p (bob instead of weave?)

Before the IN76 vs. HD72 thread was closed down I posted that I thought that the HD72 did not do Bob. The evidence that that is does only Bob is:

A remark to that effect from Bob Williams of InFocus
The HD72 on screen report of 540p


Why I think that that this is unlikely. In order to display 1080i the signal must be deiterlaced. Bobing is the most primitive kind of deinterlacing. This is also called line doubling. It results a halfing of screen resolution which is noticeable.

Many reviewers reported on the new Toshiba HD-DVD player while in the mode in that results in line doubling. This is what probably accounts for the many early reports that the image was soft and no better than a regular DVD. When the machine was set to a more appropriate deinterlacing mode reviewers found the image to be stunning in its clarity. In other words line doubling or bobbing is quite visible.
No body has reported that the HD72 yeilds a soft fuzzy image. When compared with the IN76 which all admit uses an advanced Pixelworks deinterlacer, no one has commented that the HD72 image is vastly less sharp as it would be if it were deinterlaced by simple line doubling.
There is a version of the HD72 sold in England called the HD72i. This machine contains the Faroudja chipset for deinterlacing. The ads for this machine prominently mention Faroudja. It is well known that certain Samsung rear projection DLP sets use the Faroudja chips but this is not mentioned because of licensing restrictions. It may very well be that the American version of the HD72 is identical to the HD72i but cannot advertise the presence of the Faroudja chips. This is a speculation of course but I have seen no testimony that the British version looks superior to our US version.


People seem concerned about bob deinterlacing, a technique that yields well known image defects. Yet in spite of the fact that this defects are not seen or reported, they persist in their concerns.

I think the truth of the matter has yet to be revealed.

Optoma has long made projectors with Pixelworks scaling and deinterlacing chips. For example:

H77 - Pixelworks 465
H76 - Pixelworks 465
H53 - Pixelworks 463
EP737 - Pixelworks 164
H31 - Pixelworks 1231

All these chips scale and deinterlace. The 164 is also used in the InFocus X1. As is well known InFocus used the Faroudja chips for deinterlacing of 480i signals but now believes that the Pixelworks chips do a better job on 1080i. We don't know which if any of these chips is in the HD72. It might be the 465 which is in more expensive products but maybe not.

The projectorcentral review of the IN76 specifically compared the deinterlacing of the Pixelworks IN76 with the unknown deinterlacing chipset of the HD71.
http://www.projectorcentral.com/infocus_play_big_in76.htm
In terms of deinterlacing capabilities, the IN76 outperforms the HD72 with film-sourced materials while the HD72 has an edge with video-sourced material. This testimony is not consistent with the notion that the HD72 has a simple line doubler deinterlacing strategy.

:) I'm about to order my 72, but I'm concerned about the offset/screen size. The projector will be mounted from the ceiling, and 14 ft 8 inches from wall that will hold screen. I'm thinking about a 106 inch 16X9 screen.
I'm terrible at math - does it work out ???

Thanks,

Rabid

It will work, my setup was the same with 8' ceilings and a cheif flush mount. Plenty of playing room. The digital offset takes the edge off, you can move the image quite a bit between the 768 vertical pixel area.