Let me preface my questions with a little backround:

I have a 125" MDF screen with a Sanyo Z-3. With a 3/8 nap roller I rolled two coats of primer and two coats of UPW High Gloss enamel with the board flat on the ground. Between each coat of primer and UPW I used a wet sanding sponge over the entire surface to smooth out any roller marks and bumps, but I didn't completely sand it smooth to the touch. I now have the board permanently mounted on the wall (long story) but have not yet applied the two coats of RS-MMMaxx or sanded the final coat of UPW. I plan on renting a sprayer, practicing with it and spraying it in place on the wall. I plan on renting a HD sprayer, and I hope it's up to the task.

Now to the questions...

I notice that the final coats of UPW has left somewhat of a "texture" on the board. When projected upon, there is a sheen of hotspotting over the entire surface of the board, but it's only noticeable from looking at the board straight ahead from your sitting position. I assume this is caused by the small "bumps" that have not yet been sanded and the UPW gloss. Am I correct in assuming this or is my paint job pure crap?

Should I sand this final layer until is is smooth to the touch? Should I just even everything up with the sponge or should I get out the palm sander and work it?

Should I still use two coats of RS-MMMaxx with the sprayer or more? Should I add 4 more oz of Distilled Water for spraying or more? My current mix is:

1qt Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
12 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
3 (8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
1 (8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
12 oz. Distilled Water

Should I sand in any way the RS-MMMaxx final coat or use as is?

Thanks guys!

Thanks bro, I really do appreciate the help.

One other thing. I know this was in a thread somewhere, but I can't find it.

What does my sprayer need in order to lay the mix on correctly and what nozzle should I use?

Would the $60 HD sprayer do the trick?

This is an amazing formula, anyone who wants to do a DIY screen, by rolling or spraying the screen this could not be any easier, and you are assured that it will compete with expensive screen materials.

HIGHLY recommended!!!

I'll post up some pics when it's done, but I'm going to wait the full week after completion to give it the benefit of the doubt.


Any requests for a particular screenshot?

wow have you got a lot of patience... 'ya mind sharin' some of that with the rest of us?! ;)

I didn't say I wouldn't be watching for a week, just posting screenshots :)

Finished the last coat on the RS-MMMaxx screen last night. It comes out as a light grey that is "almost-but-not-quite" shiny. I wouldn't realize that the RS-MMMaxx is grey if it were not for the UPW coat to compare it to.

The RS-MMMaxx screen was sprayed on in 3 coats over a well sanded base of primer and two coats of UPW High Gloss enamel.

Even without the proper cure time I'm liking what I see. I would put the gain closer to 0.8 rather than 1.2 or so, but I have yet to hit it with a sanding sponge (not sure if I will as the sprayed on RS-MMMaxx is pretty smooth). The ambient light qualities are clearly there. There is no viewing cone whatsoever.

I did have to adjust gamma and brightness very slightly to get the punch that I like, but the colors are vibrant and the shadow detail seems quite good. Granted alot of this has to do with the projector, but so far this beats any of the previous matte white screens (and the cheapy one that comes with the 4805). To clarify, I am using a Sanyo Z-3.

Cheers

good feedback on all accounts and certainly what folks need to hear from a nuetral member. but couldn't you have given me .9 instead of a .8 gain?! ;)


Since I have nothing to measure the actual gain, I could give you .9 easily :) The truth of it is, the gain is somewhat less than matte white.... soo, it's < 1.

I'm not sure why either, as the mix is BARELY grey. Perhaps the lack of a viewing cone... ie, the light is dispersing in all directions due to the SM instead of directly at the viewer. Either way, it's MORE than bright enough with my 800 ANSI lumens rated projector.

I'm still fiddling with the colors and such, but I'll report back when I get it where I like it and post some screenshots. I can tell you already that what I am seeing has been represented in the numerous "other" screenshots on this forum about the mix. I have no complaints.

thanks pb_maxxx and MM

(by the way, I don't know them, nor am I on their payroll :P )

I wouldn't mind getting ahold of Benven's "Super Grey" formula to do my own testing and comparing with... I would definately give them both a fair shake.

PWRDrill, I am putting the fianl touches on the mix. Keep an eye out on the dark gray thread for more info.

So now I'll have to feather in less than 8 oz, accounting for what I've already used out of the original mix in the can. Nah, I'll just dump the whole thing in there. If doubling the amount is good, an extra ounce won't kill.

So now I'll have to feather in less than 8 oz, accounting for what I've already used out of the original mix in the can. Nah, I'll just dump the whole thing in there. If doubling the amount is good, an extra ounce won't kill.

I wouldn't bother. PB forgot to mention that you'll probably be losing a bit of the good black quality of the screen by whitening it up.

The mix is pretty damn good where it is imho...

till they kill PB, or something better comes along... (what movie?)

Is it preferred to give the final coat a light sand?

Maybe I missed something. Is this formula a good choice for light controlled rooms? I won't have any significant ambiant light.

If not, than any other suggestions?

As always, thanks.

Laz

Maybe I missed something. Is this formula a good choice for light controlled rooms? I won't have any significant ambiant light.

If not, than any other suggestions?

As always, thanks.

Laz

The other part of light control is the color of the surfaces in the room. If one has light-colored walls and ceiling (like I do), then, even with no external light spillage, the projected image itself may light up the room to such as extent as to start washing out the blacks in the image. Silver- and gray-screen solutions help in preventing this.

There may be other benefits in the mix, even for completely light controlled rooms, but not having tried it, I can't say for sure.

Oh no, another formula: LL?

Right now I have very bright yellowy walls but will be paiting the ceilings and walls some very dark colour. I'm thinking chestnut or burgundy. Who knows.

I have a 1100 lumen projector (ae900) in low mode, but still quite bright for my small room.

I think I'll stick with the RS. But of course, that's a bit of a guess.

Thanks again,

Laz

Does the soooooper-secret coming involve a mirror?

Certainly MY version does. And speaking for pb_Maxxx I feel safe in saying that his personal efforts will follow suit. But for the "Mirror" challenged, the revelation will still perform well in it's own right on a wall or baord.

"When" it's released, that is, and that is still under advisement, consideration, and will happen when there is no more "tinkerin' " to be done.

In my mind and seculative thinking, that is still two/three weeks off. But don't hold me to that timetable, just use it as a jolt of 'hopefullness'.

Thanksgiving is a wonderful time to be "thankful", and comes in plenty of time to still allow one to herald in Christmas & the New Year with a new Toy.

Freddy Kruger ain't got nuthin' on me.

Iiiii'mm dreeaminggg of a blackscreen christmaaaas, just like the one I've never knooownn...:)

Anyone know where I can get the Delta Ceramcoat paints here in Toronto? Or, are there alternatives, particularly Behr alternatives?

Thanks

Laz

Next question: OKay, never mind the above post. I couldn't find Michael's in Toronto. However, my wife is familiar with the place and I found it!

Now, do I get all the paints on the list (the 2 behr paints, the 2 delta paints, the minwax stuff and the water) and mix it all together? Will they mix it for me at Home Depot?

Thanks,

Laz

(getting closer)

From previous posts, I'll answer your question, Laz.

Whether Home Depot will mix or not depends on how good a relationship you have with them. For a couple of bucks, you can just get a paint mixer that you put on an electric drill and mix it yourself. The advantage in mixing yourself is that you don't have to rush home and do the painting. You can mix it at your leisure.

Don't forget, if you don't have an empty and clean paint can or some other container to mix it in, you'll need one of those. Any sort of clean container will work, if you can seal it up (I'm thinking of gallon jars or equivalent.)

LazMan

Just buy the paint then buy the empty gallon can sold at the same store, then get them to shake it, it is is better especially when mixing a few different paints. Some clerks might have problems with it but if you are persistent and have already paid for the items it should be no big deal

Mixing different paints requires a lot of mixing with those little drill attachments .
I am not sure why you would need to rush home after you mixed it

Bruce

If you buy one of those "squirrel cage" mixers, it's really quite efficient. And if you run it in a bucket of water afterwards, it cleans itself.

This RS-MMMaxx mix will striate after 24 hours in the can, so that's why I made the suggestion. pbMaxx says to shake the heck out of it, but I went ahead and bought the $5 mixer attachment and I'm glad I did with the subsequent adjustments to the Pearl proportion.

Yep. It's the best mixer out there.

Bar none.

I recently got the 5 gallon size and MAN!!!!! You shoud see how that sucker 'whrilpools' even a large amount of paint in the Three Gallon Buckets I use to ship MMud overseas.

Just recently I beat my old record on getting a LF screen completely done from scratch, and ready to transport.

2 Hrs 30 Min.

Each coat went onto a 140" diagonal Mirror in under 5 minutes.

30 Minutes of Forced air Heating for the Primer coat (Two "QUICK" passes each row.)
30 minutes of Forced air heating for the 1st coat.
1 Hour INTENSE Forced air heating of the 2nd thicker coat ( Applied until there was no reflection )


Heres a revelation.

With 1:1:1 MMud alone, if the coating isn't thick enough to prevent any trace of being able to see the reflection of the PJ's lamp when viewed up colse to the surface and at the right angle, you have 'fuzzienes' issues.

With RS-MaxxMudd or the newest BSLF mixture especially, that become so very less of an issue because the increase in SM and the darker hue that itself is very reflective, in a positive way, seems to negate the blurring effect so that instead, the addtional illumination from behind just seems to give the whole equation a boost.

Of course, I had a 2600 Lumen -LCD PJ at the location the BSLF screen was being "Beta'ed" so today I'm taking over a measely 1000 lumen DLP (SE-50HD) to see how the screen will respond.

Hi. After reading, and reading, and reading, and before I go out and buy all the stuff for the RS-MMMaxx formula, I would like your opinions on it's advantages over UPW flat or egshell.

I will be putting it in a light controlled room on a 100' screen with a ae900u (1100 lumens, but using low mode).

Initally I'll just paint the screen and will have a lot of ambiant light from the light yellow walls. After the screen is done, I'll paint the walls and maybe also the ceiling in some dark light-sucking colour.

I'm not sure I need too much help controlling for ambiant light and the new Panasonic seems to have a ton of contrast.

I'm wondering if I'll get a result nearly as good as RS-MMMaxx with 2 coats of glossy base and 2 or 3 coats of plain white flat or egshell.

Is flat better than eggshell?

Expert opinions please!

As always, thanks!

Laz

Laz,

In actuallity, you cannot do wrong by yourself by getting some UPW Eggshell and painting a "Flat" white primed surface. It's cheap, easy, and if you want to upgrade later after having done some large test surfaces with another special paint mix you acquire from "who knows where?", it will not hinder you to do so, with your having expended so little money and effort on the first go-round.

If you find yourself happy with your initial effirts, then so much the better for that.

MMan

Thanks,

To clarify: should I start with a glossy base, then paint a coat or two of eggshell?

And, before I wimp out, what are the dissadvantages of this of RS-MMMaxx? Is there less contrast enhancement or poorer blacks?

Thanks,

Laz

Thanks,

To clarify: should I start with a glossy base, then paint a coat or two of eggshell?

The glossy base is not required. The use of Eggshell is based on it's being somewhat semi-glossy. A Bright White Flat base of Kilz will do just fine

And, before I wimp out, what are the dissadvantages of this over RS-MMMaxx? Is there less contrast enhancement or poorer blacks?

Exactly. To hedge your bet, you could be the first to try a more user friendly version of a SM/MM screen.

Go to Michaels and pick up the Delta CeramCoat "Gleems" Silver Metallic #02603
4 Bottles at $3.99 ea, and mix it with 16 Oz of the Kilz or some UPW Flat, then spray, or roll iffin' ya gotta, using a 3/8" nap roller. This SM does not give one the Red Ass like dealing with the Behr variety, and as a basecoat under as thin and even coating of the EggShell as you can put up, you should get substancially better blacks and contrast. apply the Top Coat only as thick as is needed to just barely cover the SM enhanced basecoat until it no longer looks noticably grey.

If you do this, and it works out for you, we'll call it; LazKEgg_SM V.1

Thanks,

Laz

Thank you! I hope it blows you away!

Just wanted to update my progress with the RS-MMMaxx mix...

Looking for more gain, I decided to sand the sprayed on RS-MMMaxx. With a palm sander using fine grit sand paper I carefully sanded 1/2 of the screen and left the other "as-is". The resulting image was far improved and I doubt I'll be looking for much else in terms of a paint on solution. I got more gain, and my colors improved noticably.

Sanding off a fine layer of the RS-MMMaxx mix revealed much more of the metallics in the paint. So much so that at about 6" - 1' viewing distance you can see tiny sparkles of hotspotting. (this could not be seen on the unsanded surface) Not your standard hotspotting, but just tiny little bits from the metallics in the paint. Standing back around 3ft from the screen you cannot see this effect.

Let me tell ya, doing this has changed an already great mix into one that is even better. Blacks are still black, and the gain is at least 1. It still retained the ambient light qualities and no viewing cone. I have subsequently sanded the entire screen.

I highly recommend doing this.

Just wanted to update my progress with the RS-MMMaxx mix...

Looking for more gain, I decided to sand the sprayed on RS-MMMaxx. With a palm sander using fine grit sand paper I carefully sanded 1/2 of the screen and left the other "as-is". The resulting image was far improved and I doubt I'll be looking for much else in terms of a paint on solution. I got more gain, and my colors improved noticably.

Sanding off a fine layer of the RS-MMMaxx mix revealed much more of the metallics in the paint. So much so that at about 6" - 1' viewing distance you can see tiny sparkles of hotspotting. (this could not be seen on the unsanded surface) Not your standard hotspotting, but just tiny little bits from the metallics in the paint. Standing back around 3ft from the screen you cannot see this effect.

Let me tell ya, doing this has changed an already great mix into one that is even better. Blacks are still black, and the gain is at least 1. It still retained the ambient light qualities and no viewing cone. I have subsequently sanded the entire screen.

I highly recommend doing this.

Drill,
Was that the original RS-MMMaxx mix, or did you add the additional 8oz of Pearl?

Also, how long had this paintjob cured before you did the sanding?

Drill,
Was that the original RS-MMMaxx mix, or did you add the additional 8oz of Pearl?

Also, how long had this paintjob cured before you did the sanding?

This was the original mix, although I added a little more distilled water than I should have as I was having trouble with my sprayer, so it was probably a bit thinner than suggested. I used the formula that I had posted previously in this thread + some extra distilled.

The paint had cured for 8 days before the sanding.

The trick is to sand untill you start seeing a healthy amount of "sparklies", which is basically stripping a very fine layer of the paint off and exposing some of the metallics in the mix. My Rs-MMMaxx was sprayed on and fairly thin so not much sanding was required. I did NOT sand through to the basecoat.

I'd like to add that the "sparklies" that I had mentioned previously were seen when being illuminated by the projector displaying a static image.

PWRDrill's described effect from sanding matches the effect I have with my unsanded, not too smoothly rolled fancied up silverscreen ( clear gloss, metallics and pearlescents within ). Up within a foot of the screen I see one or two sparklies per pixel in the white, bright or light colors and no sparklies in the dark colors. The results are what they are, but its curious why the unsanded rs-mmmaxx painted to perfection muffles the sparklies. Could it be just curing time?

PWRDrill's described effect from sanding matches the effect I have with my unsanded, not too smoothly rolled fancied up silverscreen ( clear gloss, metallics and pearlescents within ). Up within a foot of the screen I see one or two sparklies per pixel in the white, bright or light colors and no sparklies in the dark colors. The results are what they are, but its curious why the unsanded rs-mmmaxx painted to perfection muffles the sparklies. Could it be just curing time?

It's my belief that the sparkles are muffled in the rs-mmmaxx mix due to a fine layer of paint over them.

The sparkles I am talking about are quite a bit more than 1 or 2 per pixel; too numerous to count with some being brighter and some dimmer. They completely disappear at 3ft.

It think there is something to this SM, and perhaps even MORE would be beneficial depending upon screen size and viewing distance.


There would be a point where adding too much SM and sanding the mix to expose the SM would probably ruin the picture, but I bet this ratio could be tailored for screen size and viewing distance to give an absolute knockout screen.

Having said all that, I'm more than happy with the results I've had. Maybe when my other projects die down I'll tweak my remaining RS-MMMaxx and do some comparisons...

edit: the sparklies here are in both light and dark colors, although the darker colors do not reflect back as brightly.. in pure white the sparkles look like a mirror, in dark blue or black they are toned down and barely noticable

It's my belief that the sparkles are muffled in the rs-mmmaxx mix due to a fine layer of paint over them.

The sparkles I am talking about are quite a bit more than 1 or 2 per pixel; too numerous to count with some being brighter and some dimmer. They completely disappear at 3ft.

It think there is something to this SM, and perhaps even MORE would be beneficial depending upon screen size and viewing distance.


There would be a point where adding too much SM and sanding the mix to expose the SM would probably ruin the picture, but I bet this ratio could be tailored for screen size and viewing distance to give an absolute knockout screen.

Having said all that, I'm more than happy with the results I've had. Maybe when my other projects die down I'll tweak my remaining RS-MMMaxx and do some comparisons...

edit: the sparklies here are in both light and dark colors, although the darker colors do not reflect back as brightly.. in pure white the sparkles look like a mirror, in dark blue or black they are toned down and barely noticable

I sanded mine with 180 on my little sander, and don't notice the sparklies. The possibilities are two, one that I didn't sand enough or two I sanded too much. I did burn the edges down to the base board. Probably too much.

I made two quick and light passes, on half my board. I'll look again later - the football game on now doesn't really give me much to look at.

I'll try again after I repaint my test board with the new "pearlier" RS-MMMaxx.

I used 150 grit that was already worn due the use of heavy sanding on the base coat. I had cleaned the sandpaper before use on the mix surface.

Keep in mind you'll see the sparkles only with the projector throwing an image, and they should be extrememly noticable up close. I tried to get a pic of them, but no luck so far as they won't show up on in the pic.

After nearly whimping out and going with a plain white screen, I went by Michaels today and bought the silver metalic and the pearl paints. I'll try and get a chance to go to Home Depot and get the rest.

I am a complete painting newbie (if fingerpainting is excluded) and will likely have a lot more questions.

Laz

My suggestion is either buy/rent a sprayer and practice with it, or roll a thick coat of the mix and sand it down to a VERY thin smooth coat. (this way you get all the bumps and uneveness out)

The latter could be hours of work depending upon your screen size.

HI. I now have all the paints for the RS-MMMaxx mix and have started rolling on the primer. Here are my questions:

1) Why does the mix call for exterior paints? What would be wrong with interior paints?

2) When should a sand? I'm planning on sanding after the primer, then after two coats of glossy UPW and then what? Should I sand after each coat of the mix?

3) I'll be rolling, so how many coats of the mix, 2 or 3?

4) What does RS-MMMaxx stand for?

I can't wait to see my black hole blacks, supernova whites and everthing else in between.

Thanks

Laz

"Radiant" Silver, you Gnome! :rolleyes:

Regal sounds too pretencious. :p

RS-MMMaxxMud

"Radiant Silver MississippiManMaxxMud"

So easy.

Shouldn't that be "RagMann' or "RagMudd" or "Miss RagMudd"

Iffin you go gold you could call it "RauMudd"

Just having a little fun.

BTW, in 25 words or less, can you describe the difference between RS and SM?

To all mudd dudes. :D

I read somewhere that using clear urethane may be a good alternative to water for thinning. Something about the urethane not dissipating like the water and adding some depth. I am on track and if so how much urethane should I use? Thanx in advance.

Deckert99

It's not so much a "Thinner" as it is a component that allows the suspension of the "Mettalic appearing" Mica Flakes within the various DIY mixes without hiding them. It also adds some degree of depth to what would otherwise be a "flatter" image. That it effectually thins a goopy thick comination of paints is certainly an added benefit, but it is used in conjunction WITH Distilled water, not in exclusion thereof. The Water evaporates out eventually, Water based Acrylic Polyurethane does not.

I'm ready to start. Do I shake (with my hands or a paint store shaker) the ingredients or mix with that fancy $10 mixer that makes a whirlpool in the paint.

You may all laugh at my ignorance. :p

Use the "Squirrel Cage" Mixer. It's a real Wonder, and does not create as many bubbles, or if they are there, turning it down, speed wise, gets 'em gone. NOTHING works better.

Ignorance is bliss.

It's not so much a "Thinner" as it is a component that allows the suspension of the "Mettalic appearing" Mica Flakes within the various DIY mixes without hiding them. It also adds some degree of depth to what would otherwise be a "flatter" image. That it effectually thins a goopy thick comination of paints is certainly an added benefit, but it is used in conjunction WITH Distilled water, not in exclusion thereof. The Water evaporates out eventually, Water based Acrylic Polyurethane does not.

MM,

Thanks for the info. I will stick to the original formula as I am sure you have played around with various urethane/water mixes to achieve the best results. My next screen I am spraying is for a buddy and I definately don't want to experiment on his sheet. I'm itchin to spray up a bunch of smaller sample mirrors with various combinations of the mix and other paints that I have found. Have you had any luck removing the paint from an acrylic mirror surface without ruining it? My efforts resulted in damaging the surface to the point that it was no longer functional. :( Good thing it was small. :p

Using a large, porous Sponge, saturated w/Denatured Alcohol, you coat the mirror and let steep for 5 - 7 Minutes. Then you take a "Rubber Edged" Car Windsheild squeegee and wipe of the majority of paint. Then take the sponge and soak it in the Alcohol, lightly wring it, and wip awat as much as you can, rinse the sponge, soak with Alcohol, repeat until your mirror is clean.

Plastic Scrapers will mar the surface. A sponge will never do so, and if you use that rubber squeegee just the one time, you should do fine.

A Cotton T-Shirt works well as a sponge substitue, but is harder to rinse out each time, and to use as effectively.

Wow! Such detail.....you must have cleaned a lot of mirrors. :D Thanks again for the info. You just saved me a fortune in sample mirrors. Back to the bat cave! :p

Hi. I've just finished my screen as well as a black felt border.

I rolled 2 coats of primer, then 2 coats of UPW gloss. I tried the projector on the gloss and sure could see a lot of light reflection. I guess that's hotspotting.

Then I rolled on 2 coats of the unmodified RS-MMaxxx mix. It was very easy to roll on, there were no roller marks and it came out very smoothe. However, its consistency was much thinner than the UPW or the primer.

After 2 coats I was still getting too much glare from the UPW in the background. Now after a 3rd coat, I can only detect the very faintest hotspotting.

Maybe I should put on a 4th coat? What does everyone think?

The final surface is very smooth and there are no detectable roller marks. The colours and blacks are very good, much better than the yellow wall I was projecting onto before.

Laz

And just what is the nature of alcohol that is removed in denatured alcohol?? :D It's just one of those things that I've always wondered but never asked.

From the wikipedia:

Denatured alcohol is ethanol with added adulterants that make it useless for consumption as an intoxicating beverage by rendering it toxic or extremely distasteful to drink, but still useful for industrial processes or as a household chemical. This is done in order to make it exempt from taxes that apply to potable alcohol.

There are diverse industrial uses for ethanol, and therefore literally hundreds of recipes for denaturing ethanol. Typical additives are methanol, isopropanol, methyl ethyl ketone, methyl isobutyl ketone, denatonium, and even aviation gasoline.

In this sense of the word, denatured means "a specific property of ethanol, its usefulness as a beverage, is removed". The ethanol molecule is not denatured in the sense that its chemical structure is altered.

1qt Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
12 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
3 (8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
1 (8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
12 oz. Distilled Water

RS-MaxxMudd LL
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 QT - Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
1/2 QT - Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
1 QT oz. Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
1/2 QT - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
20 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
12 oz. Distilled Water

PB, just double checking. The quantities of the ceramcoats for the lighter version

Pearl increases by 24 oz ( thats a big jump )
Silver decreases by 8 oz ( guess that would lighten it )

you didn't mean add 8 oz to each and accidently change the order, right.

up the minwax 4 oz and the deep base 4 oz....no questions there.

If I were to paint this on a BO cloth, would it help with ambient light viewing vs a regular DA-Lite high power, or do will it strictly only benefit a mirror substrate?

PB_Maxx, when you quote those lumen level is that number actual lumen showing or what is quoted by manufacturer??

Sanding BO Cloth is tricky. And only needed if you do a poor job of spraying. Better to spray apply your UPW-Gloss in 3 to 4 VERY LIGHT coats, hitting the BOC with a 6-8" wide swath from 8-10" away in a moderately slow, sweepingi horizontal direction. Overlap each row by 50%. ONLY apply just enough paint to be able to see that you put some down. LET IT DRY! Then reapply coats until the surface seems smoothly and evenly covered.

If you do this correctly, on a wall or BOC, you never get any texture.

Oh yeah, thin the paint according to the listed directions until it pours like thin soup. Then test how much is being delivered to the nozzle, and how wide your pattern is from the specified distance. Determine how fast you must move horizontially with the gun held at 8- 10" from the surface to avoid runs. Do this testing on a scrap of material. PRACTICE! Problems? Write First! Spray your BOC last!

Thanks MM and Pb_Maxx for all the tips. Will try this out and see if I can get a better ambient light screen.

pb_maxx

I'm want to use the thin acrylic panel to paint a screen on. I am buying a panasonic ae900, and putting it a light controlled basement. Would like to be able to turn lights on to watch football...etc. Which formulation of the RX_MMaxx would be best for me?

I just got my 1st projector(Benq 7800) and a 92 in. screen earlier this year. My screen is a Da-Lite accoustically transparent one. I don't like the screen and keep coming back to these LF threads. I sit 9 ft. from the screen and can see the perferations. It reminds me of one of Sony's "great" TV's with a black mask.

Does anyone have a side by side comparison picture of this screen and a LF type screen? The room has total light control.

I like having the center channel behind the screen but keep thinking that I am sacrificing a lot in the way of brightness and picture quality to get it.

Hey PB since I am sure you have a good suply of the Ceramacoat silver and pearl around have you tried mixing it with Just deep base flat in like a 1:1:2 ratio over a grey base? I can't do any experimenting right now as I am in the middle of a move. Just an Idea. I did a similar test with sm with interesting results other than the SM is just crap.


313

Just did a test with Killzit2 rolled on a mirror and melamine. I compared it to my Dalite acoustically transparent screen. The painted mirror and melamine looked the same. They were not as bright as the Dalite and seemed have less sharpness to the picture. Has anyone compared Killzit2 with the formulas described on this thread?

James,

Rolling on a Mirror is fraught will potential error. It's been done (attempted) but has never been reccomended so I cannot really offer you any comment on your Mirror test except 'sorry'.

It seems your focused on "gain" and any "perf" screen will have to by nature have a higher gain makeup on the cloth to offset the dampening that occurs from the "holes".

To really help you out, we need to know what PJ your sporting with. Your eventual goals, and your expectations.

Also, ask questions first, paint last. It's "Mo Bedder" that way.

Using the most recent "official" RS-MaxxMudd formula/ratios (11/13) for moderate ambient light, I just finished up an application directly over drywall for use with a new Panny PT-AE900U, and the results are impressive!

(The biggest issue is with the poorly painted drywall. Given the we are only here for the next four months before we move into our new house, I can deal with the wall defects.)

I used two coats of UPW Gloss for a base, and ended up with 3 coats of the RS-MaxxMudd. (Two coats did not provide sufficient coverage, as I neglected to initially sand the first coat of MaxxMudd for proper adhesion with the 1/4" nap.)

The screen is 120" diagonal, with a 16.5' throw and seating is about 14' feet. I watched football throughout the day in a semi-controlled light setting (cloudy day and crappy pull down vertical blinds :D ) and the picture was still excellent! By shifting the lens over to the original wall color (off white) you can really see the difference this mix makes. More impressive was the night performance with a moderate amount of light in the room (easily enough to read by.) Only when you would go to total light control ( lights off) could you see the difference.

I guess what I mean to say is that if you are watching the PJ with the lights on, you don't say to yourself...."oh, the picture doesn't look that good." It's only when you go to a total light controlled situation that you say "the picture looks better".

My biggest concern with a projector was it's usefulness as a "daily driver" (watching any time of day) and I must say the with this mix I can watch any source at any time of day and still be blown away by what the Panny has to offer in terms of PQ!

I can't wait to try the BFLF when we move to the "permanent" HT in the new house.

Thanks pb-maxxx for sharing this!

ok pb got another question for you.
through work i can get my mdf for free but can get 1/8 mirrored acrylic for 96.20 for a 4x8 sheet. If I went with the acrylic w/ the mirror base instead of the gloss upw for base. In your opinion would it make $100 dollars worth of difference in picture quality.
You know in a perfect word of mixxes and aplication.
thanks, vandy

Pb,
I'm sure it's been said before, but with the plethora of new threads lately and with sooo many posts...
where would I be able to get an acrylic sheet from? I would need aproximately 5'x10' (actual screen size is 117.5"x50"). I live in NE Ohio.

im gonna be using the optoma h31. specs are 850 lumens but i have heard that this is under rated.
I know that 100 dollars isnt that much in home audio/video. I run a automotive stereo shop and there is a nice price difference between the 2.
is there a general rule of thumb about how thick to spray the mix on the mirror. I think i might try it and see. since it will be the best results.
As long as I dont screw it up.lol
thanks, vandy

Smarty-pants,

i found a local distributor here in chicago by using google. a search for 'acrylic sheet extruded plastic ohio' should do the trick.

Smarty-pants,

i found a local distributor here in chicago by using google. a search for 'acrylic sheet extruded plastic ohio' should do the trick.


Thanks, I'll try that.

Hey, Wise Britches

To get the size you want you will have to special order. NOBODY stocks the 123" x 73" Mirror stock required to give you the size you'd like.

In fact, to my knowledge (...which is specialized in this field...) only Bunker Plastics will / can even produce that size. About $240.00 + shipping.

To really afford the thing, you either need to let me find if there is a Dealer somewhere close by that deals with Bunker, and then let the VP @ Bunker twist thier arm to allow your Mirror to ride Piggyback on another order, thereby reducing your Frieght cost. Since the Frieght cost for a single Mirror delivered to your local FedEx Frieght terminal for YOUR pick-up would be approx. $225.00, the Dealer would have to really charge you a premium as far as his profit goes to match the Frieght cost should you "go it alone".

Another option is to get another 2-3 AVS'ers or Local chaps to go for LF screens, knowing that you all would split the frieght costs, making that expenditure amount to much less per person. Even 2 people can make a difference, and 3 is pretty darn reasonable.

5' x 9' costs $165.00 and 4' x 8' costs $118.00 All of the above are Top Drawer quality Acrylic Mirrors, the price includes a pre-applied Self Adheasive Coating on the rear, and having it "Laser" cut to order, (true & squared, corner to corner) cost nothing extra.

Let me know if this is of interest to you. BTW, if you get a LF Clinic arrainged, I'll be doing the Honors. Or perhaps my Dealer in Fort Wayne might consider it as his first opportunity to try either RS-MMMaxxMud or Black Flame Light Fusion.

Can't hurt to ask.

smarty pants
try HP manufacturing (also called house of plastics) They are downtown Cleveland. I just bought a .090 inch thick 4x8 sheet of acrylic for about $50. They're in to phone book. hope that helps.
brian

Thanks for the reply and consideration MM. I'm still a couple months away from having the HT completed and am trying to size up my options. I was thinking of just an acrylic sheet and painting the back silver. The numbers you quote will probably be too much for my budget now, so maybe I'll do something more simple for right now till I can possibly afford to do it up right next summer. When I delve further into the LF possibilities, I'll be sure to give you a holler. Thanks again.

Thanks also Brian.

I picked up a cheapie from HD, just a framed mirror like you would hang on a wall or door, for $7. It's about 60" long.

I sprayed it with my current mix of RS-MaxxMudd or whatever it's called today. I think it's the updated "non-LL" mix, as far as I can interpret the original and changes. I told you, I have ADD.

My impressions, after letting it rest overnight? My spraying technique sucks. Need more practice. Lots o' stripes, uneven coverage. Hotspots on the mal-covered parts.

The well-covered parts are quite comparable to the non-mirror 2' x 4' board that I have RSMM'd, with three coats (dusting, two attempted covers.) I'll go back at it and try to fill in the gaps.

I think I'll stick to spraying big boards and small mirrors until I get better at it.

Thanks to pb_maxxx to pointing in the right direction, I was able to get my wall painted. I used the LL version using Roll on.

I must say, I'm impressed. I'm really glad that I did this. The picture quality is awsome on my 6X8.

Next time, would it be ok to cut the quantaties in half and keep the ratio? I still have over 3 qts. left. This way I can save a few bucks or save the rest for later for the regular formula (when I save up for a new projector)? Also, I should have just purchased 1 qt. of UPW high gloss primer.

When I first looked at your "recipe" It seemed to me that it was alot of paint, but, who am I to ask Questions when it was someone else's "baby"
You had mentioned that it was a thin mixture, and because of that, will it go a long way for coverage?
Well, Pb_maxx, You've got my interest in trying this, but, with half the recipe.
I already have a Goo screen, so it would be interesting to try to compare. One thing you should know is I still have my pt-l300, and it's not exactly a "light cannon"

PB-Maxxx

Also just completed a RS_MMMax screen and I have to say I love it. I actually finnished the screen Wed night and then got a call thurs morning that my proj was in. :)

This is my first proj (Panny 900) and I have nothing to compare it with (proj or screen wise) but the picture is amazing. Even when I was setting it up (with alot of ambient light, I had all my lights on and cranked) the picture was still awesome. I'm not sure what people are complaining about with black levels and lcd, becuase the black levels are great, almost equal to my old CRT RPTV.

Oh ya, and I also have a fair amount left over. Any idea how long it will last in a sealed container? I have a friend thinking about getting into the projection field but he doesn't move into his new house until next month and it will be a while till he makes up his mind. Just wondering if it will still be good in a month or so.

Another happy DIY'er.
Fred

First off, Congrats on your new Screen.

2nd..., RS-MMMax screens are designed to enhance contrast, so whatever the Panny was producing just became "Mo Bedder".

3rdly..., except for a restir, if you keep the container closed, and preven any freezing, the mix should last as long as any paint under similar conditions.

It will tend to seperate, and present you with a dark, speckely mess on top, but a quick whip up and your ready to go.

PB-Maxxx

Oh ya, and I also have a fair amount left over. Any idea how long it will last in a sealed container? I have a friend thinking about getting into the projection field but he doesn't move into his new house until next month and it will be a while till he makes up his mind. Just wondering if it will still be good in a month or so.

Another happy DIY'er.
Fred

RCN,

an old painters trick. Before sealing the can breathe deeply and exhale directly into the can several times, quickly cover the paint can opening with plastic food wrap such as Saran Wrap and pound the lid on tightly. Invert the can so the lid is now the bottom. What you have done is placed a pad of mostly inert gas, CO2 over the paint which will bubble up to the top through the paint increasing shelf life dramatically. I have stored half cans of paint for a year using this method.

Rich

Thanks guys. Here's a quick question for ya. I'm trying to take some pics to post, but for some reason the pictures end up being very noisy. IE. there is ALOT of sparkles and such in the photo. These are not visable when just watching the screen, only in any pics I take of it. The flash is off. Any ideas?

hey RCN_Moose,

did you get your camera figured out? been waitin' on a couple of pics from you.

i've also gotten an influx of rs-maxxmudd requests recently... with questions
about rollin' due to mm's recently revelation that black flame can be rolled quite
smoothly without roller marks...

... so i went to menard's the other day to scope out the 'fine finish' 1/4 inch and
3/16 inch rollers... designed specifically for 'stains and urethanes'... i have to
admit... i liked what i say. some quality stuff indeed. so i'm gonna give it shot this
week and post some pics if i can.

-maxxI will have plenty of pics next week...my brand new 4805 is being shipped tomorrow...my refurb was lost in shipping...and now out of stock...my RS-MaxxMudd LL on drywall is almost done. :) :p :)

PBM-
I have some pics in the AVS gallery, but they're not the best and I still haven't finnished setting everything up in a neat and final way yet. I've also been tweaking the Panny some more so those pictures aren't the best examples. I'll see about getting some more up and hopefully they'll turn out better

Couple of quick questions that I haven't seen answered: What purpose does the deep base serve? Could you eliminate it entirely from the mix and split the difference between the UPW and the Urethane?

Similarly, if rolling, could one leave out the water without adversely affecting the mix?

Finally, if starting from scratch over bare wood, is a gloss coat required or will a primed surface be sufficient. If using a flat primed surface, why not use an eggshell finish UPW rather than flat in the mix?

great thread and thanks for any replies

have i got this right ?:

---rsmmmaxx has updated the mm/light fusion formula where the silver metallic is applied as separate coat so that the silver metallic is now incorporated into the mix and thus eliminates the need for a separate coat...if i am correct...does the rsmmmaxx formula produce a similar screen as the mm/lf formula?

---so all i do is mix the rsmmmaxx formula and roll it on to a primed surface?

---can this be painted on either a wooden surface or a mirror and how would i choose which surface and how the heck much does a 4x8 mirror cost?

the medieval alchemists have nothing on you guys :p

great thread and thanks for any replies
---can this be painted on either a wooden surface or a mirror and how would i choose which surface and how the heck much does a 4x8 mirror cost?

the medieval alchemists have nothing on you guys :p


Using a Mirror results in The Light Fusion effect, something highly desirable when combined with darker Top Coats designed to enhance Contrast and Ambient light Veiwing. A Mirror application will deliver the best overall results, but RS-MMMaxxMud on a board or wall over UPW-Gloss comes in a pretty close second performance wise, and of course will cost less in the short run as well.

Mirrors (Plastic & Glass) can vary widely in cost. Sliding Closet Door Mirrors (Glass) can be very affordable, especially when purchased at a Discount Building Supplier or Habitat For Humanity Public Sales stores. But the largest they come in is 88" x 44".

GE Polmershapes Outlets usually stock 4' x 8' x 1/8" Acrylic Mirrors in the price range pb_Maxxx stated. You must look up a Suppiler/s and get some prices.

Good luck.

Okay so I read up there somewhere about the thinness of the paint mixture and gravity resulting in a smooth finish when done. Would this only work for painting on a board when it's laying down flat? I'm going to be painting directly onto the wall in an area I have taped off. Right now it's just got the flat beige paint that the builder put on the walls, which has a slight roller texture to it. Should I sand that first? I also have a 4805 projector.

MMan did you get my e-mail?

it is nice to see certain people back participating on this site-- it has been a rough couple days :o

Okay so I read up there somewhere about the thinness of the paint mixture and gravity resulting in a smooth finish when done. Would this only work for painting on a board when it's laying down flat? I'm going to be painting directly onto the wall in an area I have taped off. Right now it's just got the flat beige paint that the builder put on the walls, which has a slight roller texture to it. Should I sand that first? I also have a 4805 projector.

MMan did you get my e-mail?

I got it.

You have mail.

Dry sand, then Wet sand, then wipe clean.


But lets hear no more crappeola about rolling if I can show up with a squirt gun and do that postage stamp screen in about 1 hours time. Sheesh...., I'm 20 minutes away!

Just call, and "Keep 'em Cold".

I got it.

You have mail.

Dry sand, then Wet sand, then wipe clean.


But lets hear no more crappeola about rolling if I can show up with a squirt gun and do that postage stamp screen in about 1 hours time. Sheesh...., I'm 20 minutes away!

Just call, and "Keep 'em Cold".

I didn't get any e-mail from you... did you send to the right addy? will PM you the addy.

I was also considering renting a sprayer from HD or Lowe's... would the cost justify itself just for this ~15 s.f. area of wall?

I didn't get any e-mail from you... did you send to the right addy? will PM you the addy.

I was also considering renting a sprayer from HD or Lowe's... would the cost justify itself just for this ~15 s.f. area of wall?

I have a spray outfit.

I'll resend my email later today when I'm on a "PC" not my Trio

I have a spray outfit.

I'll resend my email later today when I'm on a "PC" not my Trio


Looks like all you "need" to rent is a Keg Machine :)

Here's the latest version of the RS-MMMaxx-LL that I copied from PB's post in another thread:

16 oz. - Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD) $10
8 oz. - Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD) $9
16 oz. - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels) $8
8 oz. - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels) $4
10 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD) $14
6 oz. Distilled or Tap Water

I'd like to come up with a test panel of this for comparison with my others, but I have questions I'd like answered before attempting this (again).

My questions:
1. Can this version be rolled?
2. If not, what is the version that can be rolled?
3. When rolling, how many coats should be rolled if using an UPW gloss base?
4. And when rolling, how much of a difference should one expect to see between it rolled over UPW gloss versus rolling additional coats of it over a flat white base?
5. One more, how much of a difference should one expect to see between the sprayed mix versus it rolled over an UPW gloss base?

Thanks

maxx- How can I roll it right on my WALL, paint cannot be wet it will roll down? Thanks

when it's rolled on... it looks 'wet and shiny' which is much different from 'wet and runny' which is what you are referring to.
if it's 'runny' than you've overloaded your roller and not spread the paint evenly using your roller pan board.

this mix will work just fine on a wall. just make sure your wall is sanded smooth and primed with UPW gloss as your basecoat.

the same way (techniques) that you use to roll a standard drywall... are the same steps you'll employ here.

maxx- Thank you, I will use your updated RS-MaxxMudd regular version, it will be in my living room.

Has anyone tried rolling the BF mix on a mirror? Does it need to be primed first or sanded?

mawst95,

mm posted that he rolled the BF mix on a mirror in indianapolis using a 3/16inch foam roller and it worked out very well.

you shouldn't prime it first. and you also shouldn't sand it either.

the first coat should be fairly thin and a little bit drier... although not a straight dry roll. this coat is similiar to a 'frost' coat. the mirror can still be seen after this coat.

for the 2nd coat should be similiar to the 1st but use a little more paint this time. the mirror should be virtually gone.

the 3rd coat you should roll like a standard drywall... a medium 'wet & shiney' coat. the mirror is completely covered.

-maxx

-maxx

I've got all my supplies now to spray a screen, plexi, paint, gun. I was planning on painting the back side with the silver metallic. How many coats do you think I'll need, and how far does that paint go? Will one 8oz bottle be enough for a 100" screen. Also, will I need to thin it? Thanks
Brian

Brain,

I'd take one 8oz bottle of Delta SM and one 8oz bottle of Pearl and mix it with 8oz of Polycrylic.
that'll give about 24oz of mix for your backside basecoat... which should be enough for 2 solid coats.

I've recently finished my 120" maxxmuddLL screen directly on the wall...I haven't had a chance to test it as I'm waiting for my ae900 to arrive. I hve a completely light controlled basement so I went LL even though I have enough lumnes with the 900. The only Issue I had was I was following one of your previous posts on the whole process and in it you said to wetsand the second coat of UPW gloss before applying the first coat of mix. I have since found where you have said not to wetsand the second base coat. Will I lose much from having sanded my gloss coat? I just gave it a light sanding except a couple paces where I found a little roller debris and had to sand a little harder to smooth it out...hopefully I won't get a dull spot where I did this. By the way, thanks for all the great posts...you helped me out greatly with deciding which route to go for my screen.

subyguy,

you should be fine... and it definitely won't be noticeable. so enjoy your new screen with any reservations.

but to clarify for others sake. i'm not big on wet sanding latex. however, if you choose to sand after your 2nd coat of UPW because the finish is not as smooth as you'd like it to be... then i personally would litely hand sand it. mm on the other hand... would likely tell you to wetsand it. it's merely a preference in technique and likely won't have any difference if a smooth screen is the end result.

glad to help.

-maxx

Hey PB, a quick question. I have a Panny 700u mounted 19' from the screen in a 12' X 20' room, screen size is 106" diag. The room is light controlled with 4 pot lights on a dimmer. I would like to have the lights partially on sometimes for sports viewing. Would you recommend the regular formi\ula or the low light ?

RodK,

you definitely want to use the regular formula.
this mix should give you something you'll be happy with for both situations...

-maxx

PB,

As I'm watching you tailor these RS-MMMaxx mixes according to the presence and/or absence of ambient light, I'm wondering how much you facter in the brightness of the projector? For example, my Optoma H57 projector is considerably brighter than my Optoma H31 and so I would think the LL version would be best for my H31 with controlled lighting. However, would you recommend the same LL version for use with my H57 in the same controlled lighting or would you recommend a more ambient light resistant version?

Thanks

So what would you suggest for a Pany 900 in a small (12.5' by 13.5') mostly light controlled room with dark red walls (and a white celling for now). I should probably say that I think the projector is very bright and would like to tone it down a bit.

jynx,

...with such a small room and a much smaller throw distance... since you're looking to tone things down a bit...
for you, i'd definitely recommend the regular rs-mmmaxx mix that i posted on this thread early today...
the same one i recommended to RodK.

-maxx

pb_maxxx
first, thanks again for your patient replies to all these questions

second, do i have this right ?

your formula over a UPW gloss basecoat provides a fair amount of reflection (from the gloss) whereas mm's formula gives even greater reflection as it is over a mirror

your formula eliminates the need for a mirror because of a) the reflection of the high gloss basecoat and b) the incorporation of silver metallic into your formula

would it make sense to apply your formula over a basecoat of silver metallic to achieve the best of both...or is the combination of silver metallic and high gloss base enough to come so close to mm's that it's not really necessary?

so what about my 4805 with a throw distance of only about 9 feet? Regular mix or LL mix? Right now I'm using the lower lumen setting on the projector with just a white sheet of paper taped on the wall and it doesn't look all that bad to me (although I know a real screen will be better).

now with respect to what i'd do if i didn't have a mirror or a spray gun to work with...

best option...
use an 1/8" acrylic sheet... roll the backside with 2 coats of a 2:1 mix of Delta SM & Minwax Polycrylic...
and the front side with 3 coats of maxxmudd.

2nd best option (if i had no acrylic sheet)...
use a durotherm or doable board... 2 coats of the basecoat i proposed above... followed by 3 coats of maxxmudd.

otherwise, the easiest option of all, which requires no basecoat of any kind...
use a durotherm, doable, or white MDF board... followed by 3 coats maxxmudd. very clear explanation...i am tempted to try all three !...i think i will look at the price of 1/8 acrylic (i.e plexiglass..correct?) though i kind of feel that if i am going to go for the acrylic, i might as well try to just get an acrylic mirror and try mm...i guess i was really struck by the punchiness of his images....there is a local place here on the island called industrial paint and plastics and i think they will have most of the stuff i need....thanks again

... i might as well try to just get an acrylic mirror and try mm...i guess i was really struck by the punchiness of his images....

MM (MMud or Mississippi Mud) is no longer recommended as being superior to the use of MaxxMudd in any like application.

This is an example of why one's interpretation of screen shots should not be used solely to determine what DIY screen solution to use. Screen shots are valuable in showing some differences between screen applications, but they certainly do not show every aspect of what one sees in person. Too often it seems screen shots are very good at showing one's ability to take and post quality photos. In some ways screen shots can be valuable and helpful to the DIY'er in determining differences in various DIY screen applications. I'd like to write more on this some day to elaborate.

Merry Christmas to all...

MM (MMud or Mississippi Mud) is no longer recommended as being superior to the use of MaxxMudd in any like application.

This is an example of why one's interpretation of screen shots should not be used solely to determine what DIY screen solution to use. Screen shots are valuable in showing some differences between screen applications, but they certainly do not show every aspect of what one sees in person. Too often it seems screen shots are very good at showing one's ability to take and post quality photos. In some ways screen shots can be valuable and helpful to the DIY'er in determining differences in various DIY screen applications. I'd like to write more on this some day to elaborate. 1Time...very helpful post

you are certainly correct, there is nothing even close to a baseline or reference point for screen shots, i think we see what we want to see often

it seemed to me the mm first set of screen shots were exceptionally rich in color and bright (which my old eyes appreciate more and more)

on the other hand i live in a condo and have no real tools to do this stuff so simple and cheap is fine with me

are you saying that plain old UPW Gloss on a melamine board or something is your favorite?

also, my original plan was to buy a couple of sheets of foamcore (used in framing) and try a different mix on each side...will foamcore work as a surface??

Although UPW eggshell was my favorite when I used my Optoma H31, it no longer is my favorite since I'm now using an Optoma H57. I hope to update and add photos and info in my gallery soon. I'm now in the process of determining a favorite of these new gray paints for use with my Optoma H57, which is too bright for use with a white screen (without use of a neutral density filter). That is not to say what I would choose for my H57 and lighting conditions would be best for your projector and lighting conditions. I don't know how well foamcore would work. I primarily roll paint on DoAble boards. I will leave it up to pb_maxxx to answer your questions about his mix from here on. Hope you find a DIY paint solution you will like.

-----------------------------

A correction to my previous post:

MM (MMud or Mississippi Mud) is no longer recommended as being superior to the use of MaxxMudd in any like application.



I should have said "is not recommended" since MM never was recommended as being superior to the use of MaxxMudd in any like application.

ii have an optoma h31 which i will return this week (non-stop rainbows but in other respects a great projector) and i will be buying a panny 900

i was told at the art supply store that foamcore was definitely paintable...i like the idea that they are very light

i will start with the regular version of maxx over UPW on either foamcore or doable board

let us know how your gray paint experiments go

I am currently waiting for my 2nd coat of RS-.. ect to dry and I thought I would post some initial thoughts about painting this up while its all fresh in my head. Let me preface this by saying I am a bit of a perfectionist about this kind of thing so some of this might seam a bit anal.

So far this has been my application process.

2 coats Pittsburgh white latex primer/sealer
wet sand with fine/medium sanding sponge.

I used pittsburgh because I feel its a superior product to behr and I just happened to have some laying around. A downside, however, is that this stuff dries hard, rock hard. It laughed at my sanding sponge for about 30 minutes but I finally got it very smooth. An upside is that there's no way you're going to gouge this stuff with a sponge.

2 coats behr upw high gloss
wet sanding with the same sponge. Even though this was pretty smooth to start with my roller started to shed on the 2nd coat so I had to sand all the fibers out.

1 more coat upw high gloss.

I mixed the RS-M... This stuff is thin. pb and mm have both mentioned it but I want to tell all the people that might thing they messed up that its VERY thin. I followed the instructions to the t using a measuring bucket and a squirrel cage mixer. I would say its a little thicker then tomato soup.

I layed on a coat with a 1/4th mohair "non-shedding" roller. I used a rolling pan and a piece of drywall that was already coated in white primer to make sure that I hadn't over loaded the roller and it was evenly distributed. I used full slow stokes. The first thing I noticed was it didn't seem to want to stick to the gloss. What I realised after a few minutes of inspection was that it just wasn't getting into all the very small valleys in the surface. Even though my surface was pretty smooth at this point there was still some texture. I also noticed that it streaks pretty easily or so it seamed wet. What I ended up doing was rolling until my roller was out of paint and then going over the area I just rolled very lightly to even it all out. My paint also had a lot of air in it. I just couldn't get it out with the mixer so there were quite a few bubbles on my wall as I painted. This was not a problem. This mix is so thin that 95% of the bubbles popped on their own and when I went over the wet paint a 2nd time all the bubbles were taken care of.

Pb has said this numerous times but the paint WILL even out as it dries. I was using a 500w painters light and after the first coat I could still see some streaking but after 60 minutes of drying (fan assisted) the paint looked very even.

I will report back with more information in a while. Its time to get some food :)

Blake,

are you painting this on some kind of board laying flat? Or are you painting directly onto a wall?

My main concern is if the mmmaxx formula is as thin as you describe, I might have a problem with runs when painting on a vertical surface.

I am painting on the wall. Runs are not a problem when rolling only when spraying. Just make sure you get the paint on the roller evenly by either using 2 paint trays or a spare piece of drywall.

After two coats and a few hours of fan drying everything looks great. The only thing I have to compare it to is the flat primer I was looking at before but IMHO I couldn't have asked for anything better.

One of my biggest concerns was streaking and color inconstancy. After watching a few hours I have not been able to pick out any streaks. Even where I know there is a blemish in the wall (I noticed a few divots when painting one of which should have been filled) I can not see them during viewing even when I am looking right at them.

This project was well worth the time, effort, and money. Thanks to PB, MM and any other that have helped contribute to the DIY effort. If you're ever in Des Moines Iowa I owe you both a beer and a cigar.

awesome... yeah I'm using a white sheet of paper out of our plotter at work, taped up on the wall so I'm sure a real painted screen will look awesome.

MM (MMud or Mississippi Mud) is no longer recommended as being superior to the use of MaxxMudd in any like application.


MMud is still far more accurate overall than RS-MaxxMudd as far as delivering an accurate showing of the PJs "exact" abilities. RS-Maxx Mudd DOES help a PJ perform better than it otherwise would under specific, or broader situations where blacker blacks are the singular most important aspect of a DIY'ers desires. Mixes like RS-MaxxMudd and BFLF, as well as any "non-White" variety will ALWAYS require some color adjustment.....either through the PJ's Color Menu, or the end user's perception of what looks best (good to him) The use of MMud on a prepared Board or Mirror has been compared not just favorably, but at the least equal to the performance of a StudioTek 130, a industry reference standard. MMud isn't highly sought after these days because so many now want mucho contrast enhancement, and/or ambient light capabilities. (thanks to the initial previous "efforts" that predate anything current...)

This is an example of why one's interpretation of screen shots should not be used solely to determine what DIY screen solution to use.


That's mostly baloney. Repeated over and over, and it still holds no wieght. You were wrong with your first statement, because you too broadly worded it. Now, all you are doing 1Time is using a single statement to try to redredge up an old battle or make a wholly unfounded point unchallenged. So I'll oblige by pointing out how narrow minded your arguement really is.

Even without constantly using "controls" and "other examples" beside a particular screen, there still remains a constant. The images don't just happen to look different, or better. In virtually ALL the recent screenshots posted on this forum, none that are not from a MMud/Mirror application can be seen to consistantly excell over shots taken from many different sized MMud/LF screens, from many different types of PJs, and in many varied lighted conditions short of "High Ambient Light". It's a fact. Much controversy is always generated by those who themselves DO NOT even try to attempt taking screenies, and if they do, and do so without the benefit of a similar application to MMud w/wo LF to do so with, the end result is another tirade about how screenies are irrelevent. And that is of course fodder for the others who love to argue and disrupt the flow of info and advice.

Screen shots are valuable in showing some differences between screen applications, but they certainly do not show every aspect of what one sees in person. Too often it seems screen shots are very good at showing one's ability to take and post quality photos.

Primaily more Oscar Mayer discards. Unless you are talking about using a $5 Point & Shoot. Or someone who is manipulating images. Few on this Forum who have gone so far as to make any type of screen, then bother to take and post shots, can be considered so enept at understanding how to use a Camera. Their results reflect what their cameras can "See" so if it looks bad when "shot" , it might only be becuase the eye can blend it all together and accept the overall image, but the Camera picks up all the crap as well as the good, showing hotspotting the eye fails to see, or showing how dim the image is so that the Camera cannot expose itself correctly. If lighting tricks or special devices were in play, then yes, that would be reason for doubt or dismissal, but they are not. Post processing? :mad: I don't think anybody I can remeber has ever tried such in a long time, and when they did, it was either very obvious, or was mentioned that such occured for a specific purpose.

I'm no professional Photog. I seldom use a tripod. I use a 4 year old dinosaur of a Digicam with a permanantly spotted lens. I point and shoot from every angle, every distance. All on Auto. I take shots that come from a very wide variety of PJs, and they all show consistantly the same qualites, differing only in some small degree in Color, Brightness, or Resolution, characteristics prevalent to the PJ being used, not to the screen or the camera, which remains the same. Location after location. That they all look so good has led me to beleive that the screen is the deciding factor.

If the light AND color are being shown in balance and with uniformity across the entire screen, results are always far better than those of other examples where something is lost, or too much or not enough is/has been added to the equation. We have various levels of RS-MaxxxMud, BFLF, even MMud. SilverScreen can come adultrated with any number of End User tweaks. A poorly rolled UPW Flat or Eggshell finish can affect the end results. But nothing you can do with a simple camera set on auto can take a lousy looking image and make it magically into something that stirs someone's imagination and DIY desires. If it isn't good, it won't stand up to the "Screenie" test.

This I have seen countless times myself, in my own work, and is exactly how I do in fact judge on how well a particualr application is doing it's job. I throw this back at you. The Eyes can play tricks on you. Cameras are consistant in as much as if you take even a little bit of care, they will return to you something that you can remeber as being damnable close to what you saw on screen.

It is a fact, when a really good DIY screen app is shown, the comments by the Poster runs almost to: "The pics don't do my screen justice!" not, "The pics look better than my screen does in real life."

Can ANYBODY show me otherwise? I think not.

But this almost always gets twisted around backwards by those who seem to be unable or unwilling to take screenies. Or who have an agenda of trying to discredit others' efforts to get the word out they have something worthwhile to consider.

No, instead, to be valid and relevant, EVERYBODY must post a screenie that has a control element in it, or several different test boards. EVERYONE must adhere to the whims of a few who state that without such a individulized effort, , no screenie is to be considered accurate enough to judge anything essential thereby.

It is a telling fact that the increase in the quality of images being produced of DIY screens has improved so very much, that many are getting great photo results easily. Yes, some do still have to figure out a few basic methods, avoid a few common mistakes, but if they fail to do so, their own poor results do no negate the overall value of all the other screenshots that are taken with more care as to correct proceedure. Too bad that a thread that addresses such an instructional always draws people to come on and decry the whole idea as worthless, or in the least, good only for only very basic assumptions. Why? They say it is to prevent people from getting carried away or misled by screenies, and go a particular route for that reason alone.

That's so lame. I can relate that no one has ever told me they were going to spend upwards of $200.00+ on one of my DIY applications solely on the basis of my posted screenies. And when it did occur, I always consul for prudence and info, not a "kneeJerk." Did those screenies grab thier attention? Did they play a strong role in the decision making process? Certainly. Why? Because 'virtually' no one else's screenies they could find could compare, and there was more visual quality being shown via those screenies than they had ever seen. Obviously more. That bothers some people greatly, to here such commitment and purpose be stated by someone who heretofore had no experience in such matters.

Sadly, nothing can be done for the few who do in fact read, veiw, then jump without posting or emailing for advice. They must face the trials, rigors, and potential failures/vioctories alone. Some do in fact prefer it that way. But usually, if they fail, it's not their fault.

That has always been an issue with all things DIY, not just DIY Screens

So now, instead, some feel the Newbee must be protected from such unwise "hasty and misguided" thinking and assumptions, unless the "protectors" themselves are recomending without hesitation their own favorite alternative. Then suddenly, they can make all sort of deffinative claims and statements, and their word is to be then taken for granted, of course. Imagine that?

I've taken my screen shots in the company of other forum Members, and those members have vouchsafed for their accuracy and how they were taken. I take screenshots because it is a pleasurable thing to capture and go back to to reveiw one's work when it resides in a Home not their own.

And even more pleasuable to get some outside plaudits for such work. But most of all, to inspire others to go out and attempt the same.

That is why I, and CMRA and a few others before us started taking the time to post up such examples. To generate excitement and enthusiasium. To get fence sitting people to "Jump in and swim". If UPW-Eggshell, or so very many other paints or materials had that ability to accomplish the same amount of excitement via a photo, it would already be up on the Board. Parkland or Doable can make some commit simply because they are cheap and easy. But they are most certainly both inferior 'by themselves' in almost any/every way to any number of properly done, more complex DIY Paint applications placed on a wood board. "One Can Paint" solutions are good primarily for not discouraging the lazy or poor, or enept. If I/we all have any responsibility to newcomers, it's to steer them toward the BEST POSSIBLE application we can, and that thier own ability or budget can accomodate, not just an easy "make do". But when an Author has a dedicated thread, or asks for specific advice, they should not be subjected to all the crap that those with no other interest but to dissuade and / or dismiss the suggestions or advice of those who created the thread, or responded by posting such requested info.

All to often, threads on DIY Screens become nothing but an opportunity for some to disrupt or decry. No courtesy is given an Author to remain on topic. Some feel free to post up contrary statements to what was asked for, or provided, simply because they can do so, not because it's proper or right. Much the same can be said of the constant harping about promotion, when it cannot be said that anywhere, or that anyone on AVS has been approached in such a manner that the effort was nothing if not a "helping Hand", instead of a grab for profit. No, they use rules that are obviously disreguarded on every other Forum with impunity to weild as a bludgeon against the popular efforts by those who must attempt to now straddle the fence between providing help and assistance to others, and maintain some simbalence of security and future for themselves.

Opinions, unsolicitated, are on this particualr Forum, all too often really just someone baiting others for a response. Also a violation of Forum rules.
Also grossly and conveinly ignored by both members and the Mods.

All it really amounts to is another weapon in the arsenal of the disaffected. That the Forum Mods choose to look so closely so often in this direction instead of throughout the entirety of AVS only shows that those people involved in bringing complaints to the DIY Screen Mods work harder at thier own efforts to disrupt than the majority of AVS members do to demand that the Mods be more even handed and less quick to make judgements based on a few specific reoccuring individual complaintants. They seem to be enjoying what influance they wield, but it cannot last if more members complain about what has been lost

Of course, we/I might have given their arguements more weight by deciding to keep one Application in the Private domain, but the actions and motives, as well as the attitues behind the grabbing for both info and credit for other's work has shown that their's is a desperate and selfish trend toward thinking, a trend that will eventually drive more people away than attract to stay.



In some ways screen shots can be valuable and helpful to the DIY'er in determining differences in various DIY screen applications. I'd like to write more on this some day to elaborate.

I'm sure you would. By that thinking, a statement could be constructed like:

"Screen shots are themselves pretty much useless as a criteria to judge anything by, unless it's a comparison between two or more surfaces simultaniously. Only then, can a difference to consider be accurately adjudged. Never mind that it all is still inaccurate, and does not reflect what the eye sees in person."

That too is just silly Crap, but no more so than the first stated Crap above, something that only serves these purposes; to denigrate and dismiss the work of others, and try to prevent others from getting both excited, and dissuade others' their motivation they obtain from veiwing actual photo renditions by people who take the time to publish such.

Nothing is said at all about how relevent the claims are that are made by those recent participants in the search for ambient light performance who have posted screen shots, comparison based or otherwise. Oh No! Those pics are valid and permissable. Only the "censorship" of the efforts of those who got everyone else started, on the pretext that their posts are nothing but 'promotion' for a application not evenon the market are considered a fair target for thier potshots.

The vast majority of people cannot go view several different screens. Nor can they themselves' strive to produce 3-5 different samples. Instead, they post and PM for specific advice, and if it is given by somebody, that's ok, as long as the "Provider" of such advice isn't too popular or influential.

It's time that everyone on this Forum realize that those who try to consistantly help others do so with the right motives in mind. Those who consistantly argue and disrupt threads, or cause them to be closed by intentionally creating strife do so because that seems to be the ONLY skill they posses, not actually offering up something concrete for a rebuttle by putting their own work up for reveiw. Then, they themselves' might garner some critisium.

1Time, until you do some real shooting of such material yourself, your comments will have to be delegated to those of one who just has an opinion to espousse. Those who read such "opinions" should take them for what they really are. Opinions only.

Merry Christmas to all...

Merry Christmas to you and everyone else as well.


There is a lot of new and neat stuff coming all ya alls' way soon. I haven't died, nor become discouraged in the least. But I have slowed down considerably. Anybody who was promised something by/from me, or that has requested specific help or advice over the last few weeks, please EMAIL me again with a stern reminder. Between being ill, and then playing catch-up with work and with traveling, many of you might of been consigned to the oblivion of being buried under the last 400-600 emails.

I've always tried to be diligent in answering PMs and emails asap, so being so far behind is both troubling and inexcusable to me.

I now have a incoming Email Filter installed that will grab any email addressed to MMan- Mississippiman - or any that come from the AVS "Email" setting, and deposit it into a separate folder for immediate review and attention. I'll also be going back 45 days or so to find what I can, but if your in a hurry, or just don't want to take the chance you'll get overlooked, them "Email" me

MMan <Nvisible@midsouth.rr.com>


PLEASE NOTE:
I have virtually no space in my AVS PM box left, and many of the incoming PMs must remain during the review process. Many replies are kept to re-issue to those who ask previously addressed questions. Email, or risk being overlooked or your PM being refused due to no PM Box space left. :(

Now then, who want's to be the first to complain abouth the length of my reply?

PB_Maxx, MM or anyone who's done the Acrylic Mirror scenario:

First off, I'd gladly take a link to a page that has this info.

Does the mirror need any prep before spraying?

Does the mirror have to be at an angle or straight up when spraying?

And to confirm, I spray down my first coat of UPW and let that dry, then two or three coats of the mix?

Seems like someone on here suggested sanding at the end(?)

-Thanks Oh! Merry Christmas People!

PB_Maxx, MM or anyone who's done the Acrylic Mirror scenario:

First off, I'd gladly take a link to a page that has this info.

Does the mirror need any prep before spraying?

Just have it be clean & Dry.

Does the mirror have to be at an angle or straight up when spraying?

My Mirrors are either at a slight angle if sat upon an "easel", or Flat if pre-applied to a wall (peferred)

And to confirm, I spray down my first coat of UPW and let that dry, then two or three coats of the mix?

That would be UPW-Gloss (Latex enamel) Try to limit yoyrself to two coats, or at most, a third VERY LIGHT finish coat.

Seems like someone on here suggested sanding at the end(?)


Only if needed to reduce texture, or stifle too much reflectivity, OR to reduce the thickness of your final coat. If you select the right MMix and do it all right the first time around, sanding is a thing to be dismissed as unnessecery. The key to getting a good sprayed coat is how thin you can get your mix without it becoming "watery'.

-Thanks Oh! Merry Christmas People!

So very many happy returns to you and yours.

Merry Christmas, MMan.

Thank you, and let Peace and Goodwill reign over the Earth, for it is the Reason for the Season.

Sorry to hear about you being ill MM... and I know everybody is busy these days. I'll try to e-mail you again today.

As for doing screen shots (without reading MM's entire mile-long post above :p ), it seems like it would be helpful to have some sort of agreed-upon reference. Something like a piece of 8.5x11 paper at some agreed-upon brightness number, and possibly even a certain brand of paper (for instance, HP inkjet paper at 104 brightness). Then if every screen shot had that same piece of paper visible in part of the image, people could start to see how images compare.

I say this because camera images are so variable, the only way to get a definite comparison of anything light related in a photograph is to have different surfaces in the same photo, so a direct comparison can be seen.

Doable would be perfect. This would server a dual purpose. 1. A set frame of reference and 2. All the doable people could see what they are missing :). IMHO a variable without a constant is pointless. Screenshots work great when all things but the screen is constant. It would be very hard to get everything consistent but if people just got a nice sized piece of doable and set it in some of their shots at least it would be a good point of reference.

Other things to standardize

1) Set standard test frames from popular movies. Like Sin City 1:10:32 (only an example don't go look at that one because I am at work and just making it up). Pick out say 5 movies with 3 scenes each. These need to be scenes that are difficult for pjs to replicate not super vivid jaw droppers.

2) Set a standard for light exposure to simulate ambient light rejection. Example
Philips 30/70/100 Watt Soft White at different room positions.


These are just a few thoughts. What we really need is a government grant to pay for a large scale DIY screen project. If we act fast we might be able to get it tacked onto the defense budget.

BlakeN,

I like the idea of standardizing the comparisons. The problem with using a DoAble is it's not widely available. Perhaps using any flat surface painted with a few coats of Kilz2 white primer paint would work, or any white primer for that matter.

BlakeN,

I like the idea of standardizing the comparisons. The problem with using a DoAble is it's not widely available. Perhaps using any flat surface painted with a few coats of Kilz2 white primer paint would work, or any white primer for that matter.

Paint or primer itself is going to be a variable, depending on how many coats are applied, the surface underneath, the smoothness or roughness of the final coat, etc.

I was thinking the same thing as patrick. It could still be a painted surface but it wouldn't be as exact as using a completed product. Like masonite with 2 coats of killz2 and 2 coats of UPW eggshell. I think if we want to set a standard of measurement we have to have a complete product that is cheap and accessible.

BO cloth could the standard instead but it would have to be the same brand of BO cloth.

This is kind of highjacking. I think this warrants its own topic.

BlakeN,

I like the idea of standardizing the comparisons. The problem with using a DoAble is it's not widely available. Perhaps using any flat surface painted with a few coats of Kilz2 white primer paint would work, or any white primer for that matter.

Yeah, but how many times!

Don't do it, and you stand accused of deciet.

Do it, and later on, no one remembers. So they say, "Why don't you.....?"

I and others have done many comparisions. Just not ALL THE TIME because in my case, I feel I have proved my points quite adaquately. I have fun out there. I ebjoy taking pics of completed screens. I've seen it ALL already. Except other's work. I enjoy the comparisons. Gives me validation as to what I've accomplished. :p ;) :D

Of course, now, I cannot show comparative examples anymore anyway for that might be considered "promoting" oneself or one's application/s. I really don't need to anyway. Right now, most everybody else is still playing catch-up...., but they ARE breathing down "our" necks. And that is considered by me a good thing, not a thing to be lamented.

Even so, until there comes a time where every posted screen shot of any/all other DIY applications excell in every way, I'll go on believing as I do. That the screen, not the camera is the real difference. PJ notwithstanding.

This is kind of highjacking. I think this warrants its own topic.

Oh God NO! It's a whipped, dead horse, already half eaten by Buzzards, and only the Scavengers are lurking about to dart in a grab a chunk of Post time, then vomit up more nasty opinions.

Just get a piece of White Poster board from Wally World. EVERYBODY can do that. No painting.

I'll show you mine if you ALL show me yours? :eek:

MM you really should think about joining a theater production instead of building screens. Your flare for the dramatic is quite impressive. When I read your posts I can just imagine you on a stage projecting to the audience.

So what it all boils down to IMHO is what I tell people is wrong with this forum, uninvolved moderators. If there were 2 moderators actively involved in the DIY screen area that actually read the posts think of how much less crap there would be to wade through? How productive would we be if everyone was civil and working toward the same goal? For those of you that can't even comprehend the notion take a look at the DIY forum at htguide.com Free flowing information, intelligent rhetoric, and no flaming its downright amazing.


Now I am waay of topic so I will just drop the whole idea until I can come up with a plan that might help instead of all the what ifs and what fors.

MM you really should think about joining a theater production instead of building screens. Your flare for the dramatic is quite impressive. When I read your posts I can just imagine you on a stage projecting to the audience.

Been there. Done that. Thespian in HS. Indianapolis Repitory Theater in my 20s. I was introverted as a youngster, and was hauled off to a Civic Club to learn to emote through writing, speaking, singing and acting. (Blame my 8 Sisters! It was a good way to get me, the favored "Son" out of the house!) With my good looks, wit, and sterling personality, why...., I could have been a Star!!!! But I have a lisp so it just wasn't meant to be. At least all ya all can't get hit with spittle through the monitor. I'm pretty hard on Keyboards though. Between the drool, and the single finger punching from my "Hunt & Peckin" they have to take, I replace one every 3-4 months. This one has almost all the lettering worn off! (best excuse I have for my typos, BTW)


So what it all boils down to IMHO is what I tell people is wrong with this forum, uninvolved moderators. If there were 2 moderators actively involved in the DIY screen area that actually read the posts think of how much less crap there would be to wade through? How productive would we be if everyone was civil and working toward the same goal? For those of you that can't even comprehend the notion take a look at the DIY forum at htguide.com Free flowing information, intelligent rhetoric, and no flaming its downright amazing.

I've tried to wake up a few to those facts. Mostly, I get, "You mean to say that others bother to read us here on AVS?"


Well yes. Sometimes because they like to go back to where I hailed from. Other times, they've found AVS themselves. But a universal condemnation of how this Forum had degenerated, and how unfair and biased Moderation has become is a cold hard fact validated by many posts on various forums across the US AND abroad. Few can imagine how wierd it is to vist or be asked to contribute to such various forums, only to waltz into such recriminatory comments. And worse still, to realize that it's all primarily caused by only a select few.

This forum receives both special attention and no attention at the same time. Special attention by some because it represents a real threat to paying Advertisers.
No attention unless someone with an Axe to grind uses the Mods as thier War Club. And that Club is wielded without there being any effort to really investigate.
A few have learned all they need to do to throttle back a popular thread is start a ruckus on it, or just send in a complaint. When you read a Mod's comment about how he has no time or desire to read through a long thread in question, even a page or two backwards so as to determine the validity of a complaint, that speaks loudly enough for itself, and needs no further elaboration.

Except the Forum owners should consider making someone who HAS THE TIME the DIY Screen Forum Mod. It's freely done on so many other Forums on AVS. But not here, despite the "No time" reason given. Passing strange, that.

A Mod doesn't have to read through every thread, just the one in question.

I nominate: Bruce Can! :D Really though, it would be great to have an involved Moderator. Over on LumenLab, things are so civil, in three months, as Moderator, I have not received a single solitary complaint or reported post, nor read anything remotely deserving of even a stern comment. But the singular most important AND rancorus topic here on this forum came from LumenLab roots, and over there, cooperation and civility is always apparent.

If people really wanted a change around here, THATS what they would complain about to the Mods.




Now I am waay of topic so I will just drop the whole idea until I can come up with a plan that might help instead of all the what ifs and what fors.


TOO LATE! 1Time already has posted a new Thread on it all.
...and it's all YOUR fault! :p ;) :D

Ok one more off topic reply and then I am gone.

MM you need one of these
http://store.yahoo.com/pckeyboards/cu104ps2.html

You wont break it EVER. These are built by unicomp, the company that bought the model m design from IBM. I have a model m that came with a 386 that still works like new. They have other designs but make sure you get one with buckling spring.

I think I am going to have to do a 3rd coat of pbmaxxmudLLtk421 whatever. I just was re-reading some of the past posts and pb reccomends 3 coats. My whites seem a bit hot I think the 3rd coat will pull it all together. Does that sound accurate?

I have at least a quart left if I rember correctly. Its so thin and covers pretty well on the 2nd coat I didn't use very much at all. I still have my roller in the refridgerator so it should be ok to use still. I am going to pick up another one on the way home just in case. If I dont have to reload a new roller I doubt I will use very much paint at all.

FYI I did do the gloss base coat and I dont think its exactly like a hotspot its just where ever there is some bright whites its VERY bright about to the point that detail is being lost. I didn't notice it until I was watching return of the king and gandalf was in Minas Tirith. Thats a whole lotta white.

Thanks I will let everyone know what the results are. ;)

Here is what I am going to try

1 4x8 Piece of the Thrifty White Tileboard from Home Depot cut to 100 inch screen size. Lightly sand with Scotchbright pad then wipe down with Isopropyl alcohol.

2 coats of Krylon Bright Silver Metallic #1401 (If you have never used this it almost shines like chrome) "2 cans should do a 100" screen"

2 Coats of Krylon Krystal clear "2 cans should do a 100" screen"

Then 2 or 3 coats of the RS-MMMaxx formula


What yas think ?

rm-rf,

sounds good to me. but you might want to lightly hand sand after the 2nd coat has completely drying for a couple of hours (unless your finish is already smooth).
then definitely add a 3rd coat.

then come back and let us know it turned out.

What is this about putting the roller in the refrigerator? Some kind of painter's trick?

What is this about putting the roller in the refrigerator? Some kind of painter's trick?
Just to keep it from drying out. I wrap mine in aluminum foil and keep it in the freezer if I'm going to restart painting in the near future (within a week or so, otherwise I wash it and start over.)

a used roller provides a smoother, less splatter, more uniform surface. i use a synthetic 3/16" roller,
the same roller, over and over again for my screens. and while i don't keep mine in the refrigerator,
i do take a plastic grocery bag and wrap it inside of that to keep it from drying out.
putting it in the refrigerator is supposed to help you keep it 'wet' longer.
i rarely go more than 2 weeks without building a screen so i don't keep mine there.

Wow so much reading and catching up to do.

Anything new here ? besides catching on to using used rollers for better results :)

Thanks for the recomendation MM :)


Bruce

ROLLER ?

I thought we was spraying ???

we are spraying!

it's been frigid cold here in chicagoland this past month. i don't have a warehouse
so my garage has become that. unfortunately i don't want to fumigate the entire house...
so the only coat i'm spraying is the final coat. this cuts down 80% of the airborn fumes entering my house.

i could preach spraying till i'm blue... but 90% of the people here only want to know... 'can this be rolled?'

Welp I have my first coat of mix on my screen so far so good.

Here is what I have used so far

2 cans of the krylon bright silver metallic sprayed onto a 49x87 pice of 9.95 thrifty tile board.

After that dried I sprayed on 2 cans of Kylon Krystal clear waited till dry then scotchbrighted the whole thing till i had a uniform finish on whole screen.

The mix I am using
1 qt Behr flat white
1 qt Behr flat base
1 qt Behr Pearl
2 of the smallest cans of Minwax satin polycrylic I think they were 5 oz each.
16 oz of distilled water. Found the mix to be pretty darn thick added this after I got home.

Went to Home Depot early set everything on the paint counter they mixed it on there shaker for me. I took all the empty cans up to the cash register and after checking out they even threw away the empties for me.

Cost for complete screen around $70.00

Only 2 more coats of paint to go :)

Welp 2 more coats turned into another day and like 6 more coats :)
Now I have it so none of the silver is showing through. Once I feel its dry enough time to sand smooth and hang it. Then off to buy 5 gals of flat black. The whole room is getting the flat black treatment woohooo Joy more painting :( .

I put the 3rd and what is now final coat of RS LL up and it looks great. After a few days of curing the whites have been toned down and I am no longer blinded by Gandalf. Now the rest of the HT needs to be completed.

Has anyone used any of the new teflon coated rollers? They look awsome but you have to buy them in a 3 pack and I only needed 1 when I noticed them.

If you are going to be doing multiple coats over a few days of the same paint save the plastic the roller comes in then just slip it back over the roller and throw it in the fridge and your roller will be good as new. It saves your roller and you dont have to reload a new one. Its amazing how much paint you can squeeze out of a roller when you are done with it.

sounds great. somehow i knew that would do it. ;) actually, when you said you had only done 2 coats over the UPW gloss... i pretty much knew.

i'm a big advocate of too white isn't always right. however, i do appreciate the entire 'greyscale of whites'.

I've read waaaay too many threads on this subject ;) .

My PJ is 1600 lumens (eco mode) room is total light control, 120' diag. wall. I have this formula from another thread:
--------------------------------------------------------
1qt Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
12 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
3 (8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
1 (8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
16 oz. Distilled Water (12oz. if you are rolling it)
------------------------------------------------------------

I have seen recommendations for using both SM and UPW as basecoats.

Questions:
1) given that I have light control and +1k lumens is this the right formula
2) From what I read here I don't need the UPW or the SM as basecoats cuz I don't need the extra gain, correct?
3) depending on answer to #2, how about using the Behr Silver Screen for a few basecoats?

Thanks in advance....

Spharticus,

1) absolutely, you have enough lumens to make use of the components of this mix.
2) i'd still use UPW or SM... however, the silverscreen you proposed is fine.

just make sure if you use something else as your basecoat to do 4 or 5 coats so that it does not effect the semi-transparent topcoat. note, the silverscreen is a darker color than the maxxmudd mix so you might be wise to add a little bit of UPW to it to lighten it up first.

that should do it for ya.

-maxx

I've read waaaay too many threads on this subject ;) .

My PJ is 1600 lumens (eco mode) room is total light control, 120' diag. wall. I have this formula from another thread:



Ahhhhh...., but what is the Mfg make, model, and contrast ratio of your PJ?
And how big of a screen are you aspiring to?


--------------------------------------------------------
1qt Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
12 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
3 (8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
1 (8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
16 oz. Distilled Water (12oz. if you are rolling it)
------------------------------------------------------------

I have seen recommendations for using both SM and UPW as basecoats.

Questions:
1) given that I have light control and +1k lumens is this the right formula

IMO, Yes.

2) From what I read here I don't need the UPW or the SM as basecoats cuz I don't need the extra gain, correct?


Kinda, but no. UPW does help maintain, not "increase" gain. The use of the SM as a base Coat is more specifically designed to increase your Contrast WITHOUT sacrificing any gain. And that is what you want anyway.

3) depending on answer to #2, how about using the Behr Silver Screen for a few basecoats?


Don't. I of course respect Pb-'s opinion, but SilverScreen is too dull a paint, and has no "Real" silver in it to act towards producing the same results a true "Silver' would. I reccomend a pure coating of Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 , applied with either a spray gun, or as large a Hard Foam Roller for Ultra Smooth Finishes as you can obtain. (Usually 7" )

Thanks in advance....

Retroactively...........your welcome.

Ahhhhh...., but what is the Mfg make, model, and contrast ratio of your PJ?
And how big of a screen are you aspiring to?

NEC L240k, contrast listed at 2000:1 full on. I have marked off a 120 inch diag 16:9 format area for the screen. My wall is of course bigger than 120.. :rolleyes:

Don't. I of course respect Pb-'s opinion, but SilverScreen is too dull a paint, and has no "Real" silver in it to act towards producing the same results a true "Silver' would. I reccomend a pure coating of Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 , applied with either a spray gun, or as large a Hard Foam Roller for Ultra Smooth Finishes as you can obtain. (Usually 7" )

Got it. Back to Michael's for more metallic silver.......

you figured correctly... I do have a can of SS, which is now parked in the corner of the garage with other abandoned items....

I put down two coats of UPW, now the second coat of the Delta SM is on and ready to be sanded.....

DO NOT sand the SM unless absolutely necessary because you have developed considerable texture.

I haven't read if your spraying or rolling, but I'll assume your rolling, or you would not be considering sanding.

Sanding SM dulls its reflectivity. You may not be looking for extra gain, but the loss of reflectivity equates to a less emphatic "Contrast enhancing" effect. No texture to be concerned about should be apparent if your using a Trim Roller, and applying the SM with a light touch and in modest amounts as far as loading the roller goes.

Only the second Top Coat should ever be considered as likely to need any sanding, and then, only just enough to create a slick, smooth, featureless appearence.

Between the RS-MaxxxMud Top Coat and the SM Base Coat, you should get some spectacular Black levels out of that 240K. Move the PJ as close as the focal length will allow and still give you the image size you desire. Also, reduce the Zoom to the same effect. Don't worry about Brightness, but if you do get a touch of sheen (hotspotting, then that's when you want to lightly sand the Top Coat.

With ANY coating, be sure that you have allowed it to dry "THROUGHLY" before you attempt any sanding, lest you gouge or "ball up" the finish instead of smooth it out.

Maybe Bcortez will swap ya that can of SS for some Homebrew? :P

But instead, if you can find something smooth yet tossable to paint some of the SS onto, you can do a comparison shot or two.

BTW, when you apply the Top Coat, you should do so knowing the following.....,

A. The first coat will not, should not cover the SM completely.

B. Each additional coat (hopefully only one more...) should be applied lightly, with emphasis on going over any roller marks.

C. If the Top Coat is as thin as the recipe calls for, it should offer you very little in the way of either Texture or roller marks.

D. The final objective is to just barely cover the SM to the point where your Top Coat looks evenly hued. You do not want it to be very thick at all.

ok- good tips- thanks.

I did lightly sand the SM after two coats, but I do have enough for a third. So you are saying that I may only need two thin coats of the MM top coat.... Will get those on sometime today.

If after the 2nd coat, you must strain hard to be able to see any vestige of the SM underneath, your most likely already there. The Lumens you posses can punch through the top coat under such circumstances. Ideally, the Top Coat will have enough reflectivity to return an excellent image, but the light that does absorb into the Top Coat should be darkened, or rather, the entire image across the surface is darkened by the undercoat. The nice thing is, if you err by having too little of the Top Coat on, you can always apply another coat. Too much, and you might as well of just painted it on top of something white.

It is the same with a Mirror, only a little tougher. But the best thing is that the RS_MaxxxMud does cover much better than the old white MMud, and it's silvery hue lends to matching up with the SM underneath more quickly.

Let us all know how it turns out.

Just to see, I turned on the PJ after the Delta SM was on- man, was that ugly.

True to other posts, the first top coat of RS-MM didn't look too hot. after about 1.5 hours of dry time I put on the second and it looks exponentially better. I'll let it cure tonight and check it out tomorrow.

OK- first impression was ESPN HD- the Peach Bowl. The line markers seemed to have a "MM" tint to them. Looked at some other HD programming that I was familiar with. Overall programming seemed a bit darker. Will probably have to redo AVIA.

Then I looked at a few movies. I had just watched the Untouchables last week so that was fresh in my mind. That looked better, with better blacks and overall better skin tones.

During one of the anti-piracy screens, and also with the default screen of my DVD player, I expanded the aspect to force the picture off the painted area onto the wall, which I was projecting on before. In this case I noticed the white level on the MM screen was clearly "whiter" (truer would probably be a beter word) than the eggshell wall.

I was afraid that I had too much top coat on, but I may not if the whites on the football game were showing up darker. I have good viewing area, no change from side to side or up/down. No hotspotting.

From what I read elsewhere, it takes a good week or more to cure and let that Poylcrylic stuff work it's way out, so we'll see. My son has our dig camera right now, so I won't have shots until next week.

Thanks- will try another thin coat tomorrow.

Oh fer Geesus Sayke!

From what was written, I can find nothing that needs fixin' at present.

If there is no hot spotting, you like your Whites, and you have increased Black levels, WAIT FOR A COUPLE OF WEEKS!!!!

A thicker Top Coat will only work to reduce or even erase what benefit the SM is lending. Your blacks will only be as good as the RRS_MaxxxMud alone can deliver.

Ya gotta 'mermember, Ya can awllways add, butcha gets too much up dere 'n yer stuck wit whatcha gots frum dat time furward.

Happy New Year!

Hey MM,

Is this the Behr paint used in the mix?

http://www.picshelf.com/images/projector_pics/Behr_Paint.jpg

Should the can say Deep Base on it somewhere? I need product numbers big time. :confused:
And do I thin the Ultra Pure White Gloss for the initial coat... with water?

The acrylic mirror is begging to be sprayed.

Thanks PB. So I spray the Ultra Pure White No. 1050 on first, and that gets diluted with the distilled water right? If yes, how much water to paint?

Kridian,

if i understand you correctly... you will be spraying an acrylic mirror.
if this is the case, then you must be confusing yourself with another application technique.
because with a mirror... you will not be spraying the upw. instead, it is an ingredient within the mix.

Where can I find instructions for a mirror application then?

The only paint I've purchased so far is the Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver & Pearl.

Thanks

Where can I find instructions for a mirror application then?

The only paint I've purchased so far is the Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver & Pearl.

Thanks

Ya could'a gone a lookin' in da Bottoms.

Sit's awl ways a gud thin when a body takes a step back 'n asks afore squirtin'. Ya reallys wanna get the mix down partikularly currekly, and thens coat the mirror jus rightly so.

I's seen ya's post last night, an wanna responded, but ah's was dirt dog tired afta havin' been fightin' witta cantankrus Cieling mount PJ applikayshun fer 12 hours runnin', 'n den drivin' da 'pick me up' home fer 1-1/2 hours. I feels mytee puny purty easalee dese days.

I's wer mytee glads ta see PB_ step up 'n halts yer missdyrectid entenshuns.
He's gooder'n ary Angel. (quote: Loweezy Smith :Unquote)

Step aside, you illiterate Ghost Writer!

Below is a 2.75 quart formula. Plenty to allow a few practice passes on a test board as your getting used to the thinness of the RS_MaxxxMud.

Your ingredients;

16 oz. Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
16 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
2 (8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
2 (8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
8 oz. Distilled Water

For a furst, er...first coat, you want to just dust the mirror lightly, passing across the mirror at about 2 feet per second and at 10" away. Overlap the top edge by 1/2, and likewise each subsequent row. At the bottom, you then go back to the top and repeat, just as quickly and as thinly, then STOP and let that coating dry. You should still see what appears to be a heavy application of window frosting that still allows the mirror to be plainly obvious. This then is your "primer" coat.

Returning to the mirror, you now repeat the previous application method, only reduce your speed to 1 foot per second. DO NOT go over this coat until dry.

You should only need 2 coats at 1 foot per second.

Should you need clarification, please post for such before you continue.

MMan

Copy that.

will... proceed... with.... caution.

rm-rf,

...Here is what I have used so far
2 cans of the krylon bright silver metallic sprayed onto a 49x87 pice of 9.95 thrifty tile board.You said earlier that krylon bright silver metallic shines like chrome. Thus, it is more reflective (mirror-like) than the thrifty white tile board and may provide more of a light-fusion effect, right? And where can I find the krylon bright silver metallic?After that dried I sprayed on 2 cans of Kylon Krystal clear waited till dry then scotchbrighted the whole thing till i had a uniform finish on whole screen.And the Kylon Krystal clear, where can I find this?

The mix I am using
1 qt Behr flat white
1 qt Behr flat base
1 qt Behr Pearl
2 of the smallest cans of Minwax satin polycrylic I think they were 5 oz each.
16 oz of distilled water. Found the mix to be pretty darn thick added this after I got home.

Only 2 more coats of paint to go :)
[With my arms tightly folded, watching the clock...tick..tock..tick..tock]...how did it come out?
TH

The Krylon paints can be found at most craft stores as well as Kmarts.

The Mixx went on well it took a few more coats than 3 till I was happy with the coverage over the silver. This may have been due to the minwax I added to the mix. After it cured for 3 days I wet sanded the whole screen till i could just start to see the smallest hint of the silver through the mix. I did not recoat after wetsanding.

My projector should be back in working order by this friday or monday. Im waiting for the big brown truck to show up :) If the screen works as nice as it looks I'll be a happy camper

wow... all that work and no PJ to give it a go...

admit it... you're bitin' your nails waitin' for the brown truck to show up! :D

i see you went with a MMudd topcoat/SM basecoat.

we'll be waiting to hear from ya.

I've started painting my screen finally. Put the coats of pearl/sm mix on back of the plexiglass. I've put two coats of the regular formula of RS_MMMaxx on the front so far. What I'm wondering is if there is a way to tell if I need another coat of paint or not without putting the projector on it. I'm painting in my garage, and my pj is in the basement, and i'm too lazy :o to cart the screen all the way down if I don't have to. Thanks for the help

brian

i'm not sure how to explain making that visual judment...

however, i definitely recommend you putting a third coat of pearl/sm on the backside before completing the screen with a thin third coat of maxxmudd on the frontside.

it's important that the backside be as opaque as possible.

we want the PJ light to penetrate the topcoat... but as little as possible (or not at all) of the basecoat.

Thanks maxxx

Got three coats on the backside now, but it still allowed light to pass through. I'll put another coat or two on the back to be sure. I do think it needs a third coat on the front as well, just wasn't sure if a fourth was ever necessary.

brian

OK-

Painted the rest of the theater Wilmington Tan after taping up the screen. This gave me the opportunity to let the screen cure so I wasn't watching it several times a day to see if it was changing.

To recap I had a base of 2 UPW coats, then 3 Delta SM coats, then two thin coats of RS/MM (see post #184). No sanding needed, no touchups, no nothing.

The day after the RS/MM went on the screen had a silver tint, not much noticeable improvement. After a week of curing, what an improvement! Bright whites, good black levels...

If you are thinking about doing this, I recommend going forward! I really enjoy the improvement without paying for a mfg screen.

Thanks to PB and MM for the help.

Maxxx-a-mum enjoyment to you & yours!

A 5 coater eh?

Shoot us some shots asap.

Please, that is.

Welp watched my first movie on my screen. Freaking Awsome. Blacks are black whites are white, colors are vivid looks as good as or even better than some high end bigscreen TVs I've seen. I even have my projector in light saving Econo mode 940 Lumens. Its only a sharp xr-1s, nothing high end. Look back at my previous posts in this thread for the mix I used and details. With the mix I made it took a lot of coats, I think due to addition of the minwax but all the work was well worth it. Thanks to everyone who posted the info on the forums that I drew from for my mix and screen.

HAH Comcast has The 5th Element in HD in the On Demand section for free. Hah I had to watch it in HD just due to all the screenshots from it in all the projector forums :)

Well, did it measure up to our efforts? ;) :D

Wow! Congrats rm-rf!

I might have to go HD soon!

Hey MM, what solvent do you use to clean out your spray gun (Ingersoll Rand)?

Wow! Congrats rm-rf!

I might have to go HD soon!

Hey MM, what solvent do you use to clean out your spray gun (Ingersoll Rand)?

One of the most caustic and dangerous substances known to man.

Warm Tap Water at the greatest pressure I can get without taking a bath.

I disassemble it entirely, (Fluid Knob-Spring- Air Atomizer Cap - Nozzle & Needle) and rinse backwards through the threaded opening for the nozzle. AFTER a good rinsing, I use the little brush provided to scrub out the throat of threaded Cup receptical.

Of course, I rinse through the Nozzle and use the brush to clean out the inside, a toothpick in necessary to route out any paint that hangs up in the needle opening on the nozzle, rinse through and scrub off the Air Atomizer, wipe off the needle.

I let it all dry throughly before I re-assemble everything.

In a perfect world, all of the above should be done, and just as soon as possible after your done sending paint through the gun. Between coats as well. It all water based paint, but any untoward delay can effectively clog up the little air ports on the Atomizer, reduce the flow around the needle, and help develop a "skin" of paint inside the needle chamber that later can flake off during painting and clog up your flow.

Now I've often had to clean up outside, using a garden hose, or even the spigot only. I've jammed the end of a High pressure Hose nozzle against the front threaded hole and let it purge the gun like crazy. Also I've done likewise with the Atomizer and nozzle, watching the little streams that shoot out. Usually I get quite a soaking during such cleaning, but the pressure I get to use make getting the gun throughly clean well worth it.

NEVER depress the trigger while rinsing water through the gun or you can get water down inside the Regulator and it will then surge and sputter all the time, requiring a new Regulator.

Solvents are NOT required with water based paints, and can actually shorten the needle's air gasket's life. Also, re-assembling the gun before it is dry can lead to the build up of a waxy coating inside the paint chamber around the needle. Ya gotta dig that out laboriously with a toothpick then.

A little story.

The first time I ever tried a HVLP, I was quirting Goo on a SM undercoat. I then used paint solvent in the "cleaned Paint Cup" and ran some through it firing down into a bucket. What a mess, and it labeled me a pretty silly guy to my associate, who somehow had bothered to read the instructions that stated to rinse water based paint out with water..

That was almost 4 years ago, and still I'm catching flack from him.

Just treat the HVLP like a tool that will perform best if everytime you use it, it is "as new', and clean accordingly. Judge you time factor well, and don't procrastinate at all as far as cleaning it out after use. NEVER set it close to a heat source before cleaning or the paint outside and inside will dry out quicker that you can imagine due to the conductivity of heat through the Gun's metal construction.

I've had my particular 270 for two years, and it's seen it's way through approx (censored) LF screens for (censored) Customers. I've replaced a broken Regulator, but other than that, by keeping it clean, it has always performed exactly as I needed it to.

I'll close by saying that when spraying with the HVLP method, any paint intended for use as a screen surface, thinning the paint until it flows freely is paramount as to if you will get good results, and a smooth finish. You have to move quicker, and apply less each time, but the evenness of coverage, the ability of the paint to flow together at transition point overlaps, and the ease of clean up afterwards all contribute to a pleasurable and nowadays, quite simple and trouble-free experience.

Keep it Clean.
Thin is In.

Thanks for the detailed cleaning info! Warm tap water--of course!

So I take it you use the regulator that came with the gun? Didn't your compressor come with a regulator?

Do you have your water/air filter installed close to the gun? Sorry if this is off-topic.

I didn't have the most steady hand and we don't have a tripod. As a side note, I was in Best Buy and they had the superbit 5th element for 9.99, the regular version was 14.99, so I picked one up for grins.

These are shots that I have seen elsewhere.

Ruby Rod, the Diva and Leeloo

Here's Darla....

This may be hard to tell, from left to right.. Left is the wall color, middle stripe is bare wall (where I taped to do the screen outline) and right is the RS/MM

Great Stuff!

But don't post any more "Screen Shot" images as attachments.

A rule was laid down (...it's also posted at the head of the DIY Forum...) to "PLEASE DO NOT POST SCREENSHOTS".

Bandwidth and Storage issues are the root supposedly, because of course, we all get excited about good results and want to share.

But you have to do it via a Web Server or Photo Site via hot links.

I'm sure we'll have no repurcussion here as you about the only person in decades that has done the "Dirty Deed".

Post all the shots of your Screen, or as many shots that are "Comparisons" like your last attachment, but as for Eye Candy, get it uploaded via links from someone else's server's storage bin.

We'as po people herin',

Just for everyone's information: I used white tileboard, and I liked it with my AE900U (in a controlled light room) but it did hotspot like crazy. I used the RS-MMMaxx-LL mix, and am very pleased!! It is awesome on tileboard. 3 coats, did not sand. Great, true colors, blacks and whites very good. Just wanted to pass along my thanks and to let everyone else know this is a killer combination in my opinion.

Thanks for the detailed cleaning info! Warm tap water--of course!

So I take it you use the regulator that came with the gun? Didn't your compressor come with a regulator?

Do you have your water/air filter installed close to the gun? Sorry if this is off-topic.


Yes it did, but I have since replaced it when it's glass facing got cracked.

I place my Water/Rust filter at the outlet of the compressor, opting to put as dry a air supply into the hose as possible to prevent condensation. One could "Two stage" it by putting it between a longer hose from a compressor and a shorter one to the Gun, but I don't see the need.

But the use of a GOOD water filter is vital. No little 4" tall x 1- 1/2" diameter job will suffice. It has to be a decent one to remove any real amount of water.

Just for everyone's information: I used white tileboard, and I liked it with my AE900U (in a controlled light room) but it did hotspot like crazy. I used the RS-MMMaxx-LL mix, and am very pleased!! It is awesome on tileboard. 3 coats, did not sand. Great, true colors, blacks and whites very good. Just wanted to pass along my thanks and to let everyone else know this is a killer combination in my opinion.

Thanks Thomas!

And your also Welcome!

But if you want to be really apprecitive, take some shots of your screen w/& without an image, and post then up under a new thread. That way, more can read and appreciate what you yourself have discovered.

Not a requirement, or even an expectation, but something we like to see happen as a consideration whenever possible. Certainly, posting your findings, if not any images, in a new thread at least can help others make a decision that they too can benifit from..

How's Cincy? I have to pass through there twice next week in route to NY and then back across to LA. Being a Indy native, Cincy seems like my side yard.

As this is the questions thread, I figure I may as well ask a question :rolleyes: . I have a spare mirror sitting around the house and I was thinking of trying a LF screen. My main problem at the moment is I live knowhere near a Michaels and I'm having a hard time finding the Metalic Silver and Pearl paints. Are there any alternatives? I live in Southern Ontarion (Niagara Region) if there's anybody that could help it would be great. I hope to get the screen started as soon as I could get the right mix together.

Just for everyone's information: I used white tileboard, and I liked it with my AE900U (in a controlled light room) but it did hotspot like crazy. I used the RS-MMMaxx-LL mix, and am very pleased!! It is awesome on tileboard. 3 coats, did not sand. Great, true colors, blacks and whites very good. Just wanted to pass along my thanks and to let everyone else know this is a killer combination in my opinion.

Dude wetsand it a lil :)

Hmm a lil observation.
A friend and I both got sharp XR-1s projectors at the same time.
He purchased a used commercial roll down screen.
I of course did my own Mixx screen.

We were talking on the phone last night and he commented about the rainbow effect he was seeing from his projector. I told him I have not seen any hint of rainbow effect on mine. I told him to bring his projector over to my house and I would see if it was his projector settings or something. We plugged it in and could not see any rainbow effect on my screen at all. So then we took my projector over to his house and sure enough I could see hints of the rainbow effect on his commercial screen.

His screen is larger than mine and it also looks like a high gain screen I could not find a brand name on it. It has that real fine graining to it that looks like itty bitty particles of glass like the screens did back when I was in high school. (I can almost remember those days :) )

I am wondering if screen gain or something else related to screens has a bearing on the dlp rainbow effect or is it just the larger screen size, my screen is a 16:9 100" diagonal his has to be at least 140" diagonal.

To sum things up I gave him the 1/2 gallon of my screen mix I had left over and he is going to duplicate my screen. I told him I will bring popcorn over to sit and watch him wetsand it HAH.

I'm getting ready to start a RS-MMMax on MDF, was going to use UPW glossy as base until I read about results using Delta MS. We'll I only picked up enough Delta for the prescribed RS-MMMax, but I've got plenty of Behr MS. Is the Behr MS considered inferior to the Delta at this point for base coat?

Here's current plan. All sprayed.

1/2 inch or 3/4 inch MDF.
2 coats UPW glossy
2 coats Behr SM
2 thin coats RS-MMMax.

Thanks!

winxxniw,

what projector are you working with? and what are your viewing conditions?

also, shoot me a PM. i'll give you a couple of suggestions that might save you some time and headache. basically, it has to do with the behr sm and the upw glossy. i got a couple thoughts/pointers you might consider for those two. then follow that up with a couple coats of rs-maxxmudd and hopefully you'll be beaming with pride at your new screen.

-maxx

EzRush, the Delta paints can be found at about any craft store, as well as Wal Mart. There are also plenty of online vendors, just search on "delta paint".

I just recieved and setup my Dell 2300MP PJ Last night. Again no noticable DLP rainbow effect on my screen. Going to take it over and try it on the commercial screen as well.

I just finished painting a test mirror with the regular mix and put it up on my BOC screen and well it blends right in and looks the exact same.
Couple quick questions
Could I have put to much paint on?
I rolled it onto the mirror instead of sprayed
Is it strange that it looks the exact same, also could it be because it's very small about 1'x1'.

Projector used is an AE700. I would just like to get some questions answered before I go on to Paint the big mirror.

Thnx

unfortunately a 1x1 test screen won't give you much to look at especially in a controlled environment. with a ae700 your gonna get a gain of about .09-1.0 gain which is nearly the same as the BO. the white levels of the two will be near identical. however, the black levels should be slightly increased. this is more noticeable on a larger scale test screen and also with a full screen in front of you.

also with a mirror two things tend to happen. too thick and the mirror plays too little of a role. too thin and the mirror plays too much of role. in the second scenerio... because of the transparency of the mix, the mirror wants to be the 'lead actor' instead of the topcoat. as it cures and bonds tighter, the topcoat pushes the mirror into a more 'supporting role' :) it's better to have it too thin at first... because you can always add much easier than to sand down and start over...

Hey MM, why am I getting this spattering from the mix? I had the pressure up to 40lbs, then turned it up more but didn't really help. Here's some pics.

http://www.picshelf.com/images/projector_pics/spattering_results.jpg

Materials
http://www.picshelf.com/images/projector_pics/Equipment.jpg

The Paint up close
http://www.picshelf.com/images/projector_pics/LF_Paint.jpg

I used your suggested dosage:
16 oz. Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
16 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
2-(8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
2-(8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
8 oz. Distilled Water

Oh, and do you use that little filter that fits in between the cup and the top of the gun?

Hey MM, why am I getting this spattering from the mix?
I used your suggested dosage:
16 oz. Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
16 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
2-(8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
2-(8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
8 oz. Distilled Water


Hey MMan, why have you recommended biglyle's formula? Is it because it's better than the proportions you or pb_maxxx previously espoused? It appears this would explain why you've recommended it to Kridian by PM instead of in the public forum.

Hey MMan, why have you recommended biglyle's formula? Is it because it's better than the proportions you or pb_maxxx previously espoused? It appears this would explain why you've recommended it to Kridian by PM instead of in the public forum.
That's not any formula that BigLyle ever posted. That's another iteration of RS_MMaxxxMudd.

That's not any formula that BigLyle ever posted. That's another iteration of RS_MMaxxxMudd.

Sorry all. I thought I got it from one of biglye's posts, and I don't recall pb_maxxx or MMan ever posting it. Sure would be helpful to have these formulas all posted in one thread. I used this mix with Kilz2 white primer instead of UPW and it looks good rolled over my 2 mil mylar test panel. Thanks psennett.

Gun spitting paint.

Check valve not operating properly. Clean or replace valve assembly.


1. Material too thick
2. Wrong needle/nozzle assembly
3. Cup seal leaking
4. Loose packing
5. Material not properly mixed or improperly filtered

Hope this helps.

I hope that I just need to add more water.

Waiting for the MM confirmation.

Splattering can occur because of the use of too small a nozzle tip with too thick a paint mix, or because you do not have the male threadded interior nozzle tightened to the body of the Gun's face.

Check the latter, then the former. Thinning will alleviate the former.

Hey MM, why am I getting this spattering from the mix? I had the pressure up to 40lbs, then turned it up more but didn't really help. Here's some pics.

Oh, and do you use that little filter that fits in between the cup and the top of the gun?


NO.

Lose it, and strain your paint with a $.99 1 gallon sock Strainer.
I did not read this post first, so that little ditty goes up to number one on the list of probable causes.

Hi MississippiMan. Sorry for the late response. After completing my screen, I cut way back on reading this forum--no need anymore. Not sure if that's good or bad!

Cincy is good! Hope you have a safe trip through.

I will do my best to post screen shots-have tried twice unsuccessfully to post several shots in the screen shot forum. Not sure what I am doing wrong.

Thanks again, Tom

MM,

Today I watered down the mix a lot more and finally sprayed the last coat of the mirror with RS-MMMaxx.

Tonight I tested it with my 4805 and the first thing I noticed was that all text against a colored background was hazey. Actually you can see this effect in any high contrast image, but I guess it's the light 'blooming' underneath the paint layer.

I realize that I still need to give the screen some time to cure but if I see the same results after a couple of days, should I spray on another coat?

Thanks.

MM,

Today I watered down the mix a lot more and finally sprayed the last coat of the mirror with RS-MMMaxx.

Tonight I tested it with my 4805 and the first thing I noticed was that all text against a colored background was hazey. Actually you can see this effect in any high contrast image, but I guess it's the light 'blooming' underneath the paint layer.

I realize that I still need to give the screen some time to cure but if I see the same results after a couple of days, should I spray on another coat?

Thanks.

That would be the conventional wisdom. Hazy text means there is too much infused light behind the painted surface. Since your paint is now thinned, applu another coating. Don't be worried about applying too much, just go at it in a manner you do not have any drips or runs. One coat, then get away and wait until it's dry, then test again.

The MinWax adultrated paint takes more than a few short hours to cure to somethin akin to hardness however, and if your not applying heat like I often do, or waiting a full 24 hours+ before testing, you might be getting a result that is not indicative of what it will look like in 2-3 days.

If your patience is well practiced, waiting for that amount of time and doing another test mught just result in a pefectly done Light Fusion, for it is the balance between thickness, and light returned that produces the "Glow" without haze. If on the other hand, after such a wait, a haze on text is still apparent, you cannot do wrong by applying another even coating.

always good a hear another success story...
and another N2 filter is no longer needed resulting in a sharper picture...
good stuff.

Thought I would finish this thread that I started with my decision to go with the RS-MaxxMudd LL mix for my screen on the existing drywall surface. I only went with 2 coats of RS-MaxxMudd LL mix and the results were excellent I finished my screen with a 2" screen flok tape from Goo systems for my border, it was real easy to applied and looks great. I also removed the N2 filter from my 4805 as I feel it looks sharper without it.

above quote was from the Best DIY Screen for the Infocus 4805 used in a Very Dark Room thread.

Originally Posted by jwv651
Thought I would finish this thread that I started with my decision to go with the RS-MaxxMudd LL mix for my screen on the existing drywall surface. I only went with 2 coats of RS-MaxxMudd LL mix and the results were excellent ]I also removed the N2 filter from my 4805 as I feel it looks sharper without it.[/FONT]


Now the last part of that quote, THAT's something.

Originally Posted by jwv651
Thought I would finish this thread that I started with my decision to go with the RS-MaxxMudd LL mix for my screen on the existing drywall surface. I only went with 2 coats of RS-MaxxMudd LL mix and the results were excellent I also removed the N2 filter from my 4805 as I feel it looks sharper without it.


Now the last part of that quote, THAT's something. ;)

Back in December '05 I read a thread that I can no longer find where it was stated by MississippiMan that silver metallic paint can darken an image whether it's in the base coat or in the top coat. I don't recall whether it was stated that it is best to have the darkening in the base coat or in the top coat.

Does anyone remember such recommendations. However, it seems to me that if a darker coat is the topcoat, the screen will appear darker in ambient light indicating it will have better ambient light rejecting properties and more visible black levels. Thus, while the screen appears dark, the lighter basecoat below will amplify the whites only by the projector's beam.

Was this actually said, or am I totally irrelevant.

TH

Back in December '05 I read a thread that I can no longer find where it was stated by MississippiMan that silver metallic paint can darken an image whether it's in the base coat or in the top coat. I don't recall whether it was stated that it is best to have the darkening in the base coat or in the top coat.

The accepted rule is a Lighter Base coat, and a Darker Top coat for best CR enhancement. But Darker Base Coats under Lighter Top Coats can work too, but usually have the effect of reducing overall screen luminance.

Usually.



Does anyone remember such recommendations. However, it seems to me that if a darker coat is the topcoat, the screen will appear darker in ambient light indicating it will have better ambient light rejecting properties and more visible black levels. Thus, while the screen appears dark, the lighter basecoat below will amplify the whites only by the projector's beam.

Was this actually said, or am I totally irrelevant.

TH

Not at all. It is the darker Top Coat concept that 'overlays' the entire Ambient Light idea. But what happens when that Top Coat accepts the PJ's light is the real story. Dark Grays can certainly assist viewing a projected image in moderate ambient light (if you have enough lumens) but the resulting loss of color vibrancy and 'pure' whites makes it unacceptable to most current enthusiasts.

But innovation and desire has several different folks on this Forum attacking the problem of achieving Ambient Light performance without adversely affecting other aspects of the image. And quite varied are the different approaches being taken. Soon, a few will shake out to be the best course for one to follow, and that would be the most likely time for you to make your decision.

Who knows though....., by then, the Voodoo practicioneers of the Black Flame sect might have some other bizarre magic in store for the unsuspecting AVS'er to consider.

Who knows indeed???!!!!!

bringing this back up, can't let it fall down!

Anyway I'm about to paint my screen. I have both 3/16" nap rollers, and 1/4" dense foam rollers. Which one would you guys recommend I use for both the UPW base coats and the RS top coats? I'm painting directly on flat-painted drywall.

Okay tell me if I'm doing right. I just mixed up a batch of basecoat and RS-MMMaxx. This will be for a ~75" screen in a 10' x 10.5 ft. room. Projector is a 4805.

as suggested by PB I made a base mix of:

1 qt. UPW gloss
1/2 qt. Minwax polycrylic gloss
1/4 qt. water

Then in post #133 PB listed a 2-qt. version of the regular mix, which is what I made:

16 oz. Behr Ultra Pure White Flat (HD)
08 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
16 oz. Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
12 oz. Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
12 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
06 oz. Distilled or Tap Water

Sound good? Just wanting to make sure I get this right (I sure hope so, I've already mixed it! :p ) since this thread gets pretty confusing with all the different types and sizes of mixes that have been listed so far.

Also with respect to sanding, how long should I wait between coats? It seems like in order to sand, I would need to wait several hours or overnight between the coats that I intend to sand. Or maybe if I use those foam rollers I might not have to sand. Thoughts?

Okay tell me if I'm doing right. I just mixed up a batch of basecoat and RS-MMMaxx. This will be for a ~75" screen in a 10' x 10.5 ft. room. Projector is a 4805.

as suggested by PB I made a base mix of:

1 qt. UPW gloss
1/2 qt. Minwax polycrylic gloss
1/4 qt. water

Then in post #133 PB listed a 2-qt. version of the regular mix, which is what I made:

16 oz. Behr Ultra Pure White Flat (HD)
08 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
16 oz. Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
12 oz. Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
12 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
06 oz. Distilled or Tap Water

Sound good? Just wanting to make sure I get this right (I sure hope so, I've already mixed it! :p ) since this thread gets pretty confusing with all the different types and sizes of mixes that have been listed so far.

Also with respect to sanding, how long should I wait between coats? It seems like in order to sand, I would need to wait several hours or overnight between the coats that I intend to sand. Or maybe if I use those foam rollers I might not have to sand. Thoughts?
Check out the "Rolling with Foam" thread for tips on rolling.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=632417&highlight=foam+roller

PatrickGSR94,

that sounds good to me. however, given that you are using a 4805... if you have it... i'd consider adding another 4oz of the white pearl to the mix. this will insure that you won't be losing anything with respect to white levels... especially if you intend to do most of your viewing in a controlled setting.

also, don't be afraid of the water. my recommendation of 6oz is definitely on the low end... so don't be afraid to use as much as 8oz-10oz... just remember that thin is in.

with respect to sanding...

sand after the 2nd coat of basecoat (before your first topcoat of maxxmudd)

if and only after your 2nd coat of maxxmudd you want a very smooth final finish then lightly hand sand your 2nd coat with a 3M fine finish sanding sponge. if you lightly hand sand... you only need to wait a couple of hours to do so.

best of luck.

thanks for the suggestions, I'll just drop the rest of the bottle of pearl in there, maybe add a bit more water and get it shaken again.

I was hoping to get started on this tonight, but there just aren't enough hours in the day. :( I have GOT to get it going tomorrow night, though. I'm trying to have everything ready for my Super Bowl party on Sunday.

It's better to actively stir the thinner mixes than shake.

The "squirrell cage" mixing introduces less air bubbles and that's a good thing if your rolling. Otherwise, straining the paint after shaking will also serve to eliminate bubbles.

well I took it to Lowe's last night and I don't know what kind of machine they have, but it looked like it might actually spin the can around, with the can situated at an angle, rather than actually shaking it. I'm not sure, though.

When I got home I looked in the RS mix and it looked like there was dark flecks floating on top. Normal?

I don't know what the squirell cage thing is, is that a mixing technique, or a machine?

Should I just dump in the rest of the pearl and mix (stir) it by hand?

RS_MaxxMud will seperate a bit after sitting for a while, but re-mixes easily with the suggested mixing tool.

I don't know what the squirell cage thing is, is that a mixing technique, or a machine?



I thought everybody knew about that.

It's a small "Drill powered" Mixing tool available at Home Depot that looks like a Squirrell / Hamster exercise wheel.

hmm i haven't seen one like that.

My dad has one that's like 2 rectangular hoops coming off of a shaft, and another one, which is what professionals use when mixing mortar and grout and stuff, that looks like a big mixer beater like you use in the kitchen.

So this squirell cage thing will mix paint in a 1-gallon gan w/o splattering and slinging it out everywhere?

hmm i haven't seen one like that.

My dad has one that's like 2 rectangular hoops coming off of a shaft, and another one, which is what professionals use when mixing mortar and grout and stuff, that looks like a big mixer beater like you use in the kitchen.

So this squirell cage thing will mix paint in a 1-gallon gan w/o splattering and slinging it out everywhere?
Here is a link to one. (http://www.goodelltools.com/product_info.php/products_id/176) . You can get this or something like it at all major home stores.

Okay I just picked up that exact one in the link from HD, the one that separates for use in quart-size cans. It definitely looks like a winner, I'll never have to take paint to a store to get it mixed again. :D

However when I use it, it looks like it's putting a ton of tiny air bubbles in the paint. Am I doing something wrong? I'm pretty sure I followed the directions on the package....

Anyway I just re-mixed and rolled on the first coat of the UPW basecoat... we'll see how it comes out. :)

Okay I got the 2nd coat of RS-MMMaxx on a little over an hour ago, and just got done lightly sanding with a 320-grit sponge and then wiping it down. The roller marks look pretty bad right now. Do you all think the 3rd coat will clear that up?

I rolled on the 3rd Top Coat around 10:30 last night, and it looked like it was pretty even at the time. However this morning around 7 I could still see faint roller marks. Will it even out over the next few days, or should I roll on a 4th coat? Suggestions?

you're almost there. this mix is certainly thin and transparent enough that in your case, a 4th coat sounds like it's needed to get the desired finish.

alright I'll do that tonight. I just hope I can get it to look decent before people come over Sunday.

I'm having a bit of a difficult time knowing how much paint to load on the roller, and how much to roll out on my scrap hardboard so that I can roll on the wall without having to press too hard so it won't leave roller marks. :confused:

PatrickGSR94,

load a fair amount of paint on the roller and make sure it's even spread by using the paint pan's roller board.

once i've determined the roller is loaded evenly... i go straight from the roller pan to the screen or wall... i don't roll it on the extra hardboard first. don't worry about getting a really thin coat... because simply, unless you have a very good rolling technique... a very thin coat is much harder to keep from getting roller marks then an evenly covered medium coat. i work evenly from left to right... and once you've finished on the right side... do not dryroll back over the what you just completed on the left. the extra drying time afforded by the medium coat and by not dry rolling... will allow the wetness of the mix, time, and gravity to help elminate roller marks.

So you roll up and down, going from right to left? That is how I've done all the coats so far.

Would it make any difference if I rolled from side to side, starting at the top and going to the bottom?

Yeah, the screen is far wider than tall so you'll be fading out and in paint more often. Give yourself a break and go vertical for the first coat, and slightly cross wise when needed to blend in vertical roller marks

PatrickGSR94 once your screen fully dries you will really appreciate this mix...if you are using a N2 filter on your 4805...remove it, as I found it is no longer needed...your PQ will really POP with a sharper image and screaming colors...I only have 2 coats on mine.

Question: I have a some paint left over, how long does this mix last in a covered plastic container?

Yeah I ended up putting a 4th coat on mine, but my mix is pretty thin. It looks really great now. I just got done making a frame (border) for the screen using 1x4 strips wrapped in black fleece.

For your leftover mix I would get an actual paint can from the hardware store to keep it in. It will separate, but just get one of those squirrel cage mixers for about $6. I got one and it is awesome for reconstituting liquids that have separated or just need to be stirred up.

Yeah I ended up putting a 4th coat on mine, but my mix is pretty thin. It looks really great now. I just got done making a frame (border) for the screen using 1x4 strips wrapped in black fleece.

For your leftover mix I would get an actual paint can from the hardware store to keep it in. It will separate, but just get one of those squirrel cage mixers for about $6. I got one and it is awesome for reconstituting liquids that have separated or just need to be stirred up.I was thinking about diluting the leftover mix with some distilled water and giving my screen a very light 3rd coat, problem is the mix is about 2-3 months old...and yes I have a squirrel cage mixer, it is a great tool. Maybe I should just keep it at 2 coats...I hate to ruin a good thing. ;)

Well, I had people over at my house last night, and we watched a little of the Incredibles as a demonstration of the theater room. On bright scenes I could still see some faint roller marks on one side of the screen :(

I guess a thin 5th coat is the only answer, short of sanding everything off and starting over from scratch? :eek:

if the marks are faint... they may well fade as the paint cures and with time. give us an update in about week or so...

hmmm okay will do... when I noticed the roller marks I was sitting on the floor over towards the right side, looking up at the screen, and the roller marks were on the right side of the screen. Last night I had Back to the Future on as I was adjusting my projector's aim and position, and then watched it for a bit at normal seating position, a little more towards the left of the screen actually, and didn't notice any roller marks really... but then again I wasn't paying that close attention.

Also I think some of the scenes in the Incredibles have brighter whites than most of the scenes in BTTF so I'm sure that makes a difference.

PM and MM

I am ready to make the plunge. in some of the latest posts you both seem to have a slight variance of the mixture

PM Version
16 oz. Behr Ultra Pure White Flat (HD)
08 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
16 oz. Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
12 oz. Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
12 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
06 oz. Distilled or Tap Water

MM Verison
16 oz. Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
16 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
16oz Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
16oz Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
8 oz. Distilled Water

Which do I use?

I will be using about a 1000 lumens DLP projector in a light controlled room (no windows dark floor dark walls, etc.) I have the do-able board that I will be painting.

So what mix do I use?

Thanks!

dpdixon,

mm and i have made several different suggestions to folks depending on their PJ and room conditions with respect to ambient light.

the version you'll want to use the LL version which uses a little bit more of the pearl and slightly less of the silver metallic. i've also very recently begun to cut down my use of the deep base as well...which has too much of flattening effect. the result is an ever so slight amount of gain.

I concur.

One of the main differences in our mixing ratios lie in the fact that I also make bigger mixes, and do larger screens. Inasmuch, I usually mix in a little extra Silver to keep things poppin' around the edges. However, I learn from doing, watching, and reading, and no small amount of hobbknobbing with the PB_'ster

PB_'s stated ratios are indeed best for a lower lumen PJ, especially a DLP, whose image never shines as bright "per lumen expended" as LCDs.

There has been a rush toward the use of LCDs now that many, if not most all of the issues that have plagued such PJs have been addressed.

In just 1 more week, I'll have a Sony Ruby shooting onto a 110" Black Flame "Super Lite" in San Diego for a recent "off Forum" aquaintence. A recent conversation with another AVS Ruby owner who tried his PJ out on a BFLF "Lite" in Cally-forn-Ia last month clued me into what would be necessary to adjust a mix for that great PJ, that unfortunately has only 800 lumens.

That owner mentioned above now is using a Silver Star to get his desired "Kick" and "Whiter whites" than he saw occur on a screen made up for a Sony HS-51. His results are something I'm shooting for to match up against his current screen, in a good natured way akin to the old "CMRA vs MMan" rivalry. His evenhanded way of viewing the differences means I/we all can count on a honest evaluationas to how far toward matching screen output via 800 lumens, compared against a Silver Star's performance, a DIY application can go.

Stay tuned.

I got everything for the RS_MAXX mix and noticed that I should wait 40 to 45 min between coats. Would I be any worse off doing one coat tonight, one tomorrow and one the next night??

no problem at all. do not wash out your roller. use a plastic grocery bag to wrap your roller in for storage overnight. use the same roller.

Has anyone else tried the sanding technique that Pwrdrill mentions earlier with any success?? My projector is only 700 Lumens but the contrast is hight so I'm looking for any extra gain I can get out of this mix.
Thanks

@largeshow

have you completed your screen and now you want some more gain? or are you looking at what pwrdrll did as an added option?

PB,
I have one more coat of the mix to put on tonight but was reading more on this forum this morning and noticed his post when he mentioned lightly sanding the screen about a week after he was done and he said it seemed to brighten things up a bit. I think that the brighter I can get my picture to look the better because of the low lumen output of my projector and the fact that I have it zoomed almost to the max to get the picture size I wanted. I tried the UPW only but the colors were washed out so if the sanding will help with gain, I would be up to try it. I will likely have enough of the mix left over that if I screw up the sanding or don't like the results, I can paint over it. Have you tried the sanding technique that he has mentioned??

i tried a light hand sanding and did not like the results.

Alrighty, Scrap that, I'll take your word on that one. I'm sure you or MM have another trick or two to sqeeze a little more gain after I get the third coat on if I need it. I really appreciate your help.
Thanks

I sanded mine with a dual action sander with 180 grit. After sanding with the paper I didn't see much improvement. Then after that I put a scotch bright pad on the sander and did the whole screen with that. Major improvement as far as my screen goes. Killed the few hot spots in the screen I was noticing and made the screen very even from corner to corner. As far as improving lumens I think the sanding and the scothbright just makes the screen produce a more even picture. Which in turn could give the illusion of a brighter screen.

Alrighty, Scrap that, I'll take your word on that one. I'm sure you or MM have another trick or two to sqeeze a little more gain after I get the third coat on if I need it. I really appreciate your help.
Thanks

I doubled the amount of the pearl in my mix when I still had a low lumen projector.
That seemed to help more than anything else.
Just watch that you put that coat on very very even or it'll hot spot easily if you don't get it even and then upgrade to a high lumen projector in the future.

When I mention hot spots I may be stating it wrong not sure what term to use but if you get a spot where you get the high pearl mix thicker than another area of the screen after awhile you will start to notice it.

I'm on my second Mixx painted screen now and thinking about trying a third. I have some things I would like to try. One involving some very very fine glass powder I came across.

no problem at all. do not wash out your roller. use a plastic grocery bag to wrap your roller in for storage overnight. use the same roller.

An old trick I use to use was keeping that plastic bag in the freezer if you were not going to get back to work for a few days. Of course, you'd need to "defrost it" for about 8 hours before using again. Maybe just the fridge for 48 hours, but past 24 hours it might start to "dry up" depending on conditions/climate etc.

Of course, don't use your primary food fridge, use the spare in the basement or your kegirator.

Thoughts?

The information we've learned with respect to black flame has been applied to enhance the overall performance of both versions of RS-MMMaxx mixes.