Noob,
Then again my set was pro calibrated and the settings are at 0 with the brightness at -25...yep, -25 on a scale of -30 to +30.

yep, that explains it. How can you see anything at that setting though? it would look ugly.. dark fuzzy picture :D




Keep running full screen content and you may <<<hopefully>>>find that the burn-in/retention will continue to dissipate.
yea, the retention is slowly going away. Since playing only full screen videos(movies, mpeg4s, music player grahics, etc) it's getting a little better and better..

I have No issues with playing Doom3 or other FPS games. No ghosting crap... only the NFS:U2 speed/tach ghost image gets on my nerve :D So I play NFS:U2 with speed/tach display "taken off". Can't see what speed I'm going and exactly at what rpm i should change my gear though.. just gotta use my judgement. As long as I do that, i'm getting no problems.. no ghosting.


Thank you all for your suport... I'm still darn glad I bought the Plasma TV....no regrets... I love it. Wayyyyyyy better than my previous philips LCD HDTV.

yea, the retention is slowly going away. Since playing only full screen videos(movies, mpeg4s, music player grahics, etc) it's getting a little better and better..


Noobie, Glad your panel is doing better. Out of curiosity, how many hours do you have on your panel?

OT: Are those white pillars stable enough to hold your Plasma? Looks like a small tremmor could send your panel crashing to the floor.

yep, that explains it. How can you see anything at that setting though? it would look ugly.. dark fuzzy picture :D

I don't mean to answer for you Rich, but I was browsing through and stumbled on this comment you made a few pages back in this thread. It seemed to be a good response to Noobs question. :)

Brightness should only be reduced to the point where black detail is not lost. Similar to the way that you adjust sharpness. FWIW, when I first Avia'ed our set the brightness, per Avia, was set to -15. I have since had the plasma calibrated and it's now at -25. This correlates to a reading of ~14 fls...which is what ISF recommends. Actually I believe ISF recommends between 12 and 15 fls.

Noob, it's good to know that you're slowly getting rid of that image retention! I couldn't see it on any of the screenshots you posted (very nice btw), so it sounds like the image retention is reversing and soon it'll be completely gone. :D

-JR

I talked with Dave from sat.&sound. He told me that logo presents no problems. It basically is very light, almost see thru, and when you go to commercial break the logo goes away, or goes off and on. By the way, Dave is a Pio rep and owns the business.

Thank you.. renlopez & JuiceRocket. you guys've been great. :) I definintely feel better after all this. :)


OT: Are those white pillars stable enough to hold your Plasma? Looks like a small tremmor could send your panel crashing to the floor.
:D yea it does look like the plasma tv is about to fall forward. I need something to keep that plasma in place. The panel is is still at little bit of an angle but no way enough to be secure.

I've got a pretty new (<50 hours of viewing time) Fujitsu P50XHA40US. Due to the fact it's not going to be used much at all for a little while yet, I wanted to do some breaking-in to get it over the first hundred hours and hopefully reduce the risk of future burn in. Is it safe to run the "white screen" option from the display menu for say 24 hours straight or longer? I assume this would give me even break in for the panel since the entire screen is displaying white. I've got contrast and brightness at -5.

I've got a pretty new (<50 hours of viewing time) Fujitsu P50XHA40US. Due to the fact it's not going to be used much at all for a little while yet, I wanted to do some breaking-in to get it over the first hundred hours and hopefully reduce the risk of future burn in. Is it safe to run the "white screen" option from the display menu for say 24 hours straight or longer? I assume this would give me even break in for the panel since the entire screen is displaying white. I've got contrast and brightness at -5.

Theoretically, the white screen should be the best way break in your plasma evenly. Is it safe, theoretically yes also, but in practice, I'm not sure.

Theoretically, the white screen should be the best way break in your plasma evenly. Is it safe, theoretically yes also, but in practice, I'm not sure.

I think a white screen left up for long periods of time stresses the display unnecessarily

my advise is to just run a full screen video source during the break-in period with settings turned down from torch mode

I think a white screen left up for long periods of time stresses the display unnecessarily

my advise is to just run a full screen video source during the break-in period with settings turned down from torch mode

I absolutely agree. The white screen, IMHO, should be used sparingly. One might compare it to benchtesting audio components where "white" noise is produced at 1/3 power. It is not uncommon for amps to shut down from the load.

I think a white screen left up for long periods of time stresses the display unnecessarily


The stress of a white screen may just accelerate the break-in process since the purpose of break-in is to get past the initial steep loss of brightness in each pixel when uneven wear is most noticable. A white screen ensures equal use of Red, green, and blue.

My guess is that 10 hours of white screen is equivalent to 20-30 hours of normal full screen TV viewing.

The stress of a white screen may just accelerate the break-in process since the purpose of break-in is to get past the initial steep loss of brightness in each pixel when uneven wear is most noticable. A white screen ensures equal use of Red, green, and blue.

My guess is that 10 hours of white screen is equivalent to 20-30 hours of normal full screen TV viewing.

we already know that plasma blue phosphors wear faster than the red and green phosphors so the net result of a white screen to accelerate the break-in process evenly may not produce the desired results

I have heard that some manufacturers use their own version of a factory white screen for break-in

some components, such as the power supply, may not be rated for long duration white screen use

we already know that plasma blue phosphors wear faster than the red and green phosphors so the net result of a white screen to accelerate the break-in process evenly may not produce the desired results

I have heard that some manufacturers use their own version of a factory white screen for break-in

some components, such as the power supply, may not be rated for long duration white screen use

Good point about the power supply and long duration of white screen. Also a consideration is the amount of heat that may be produced by long duration of white screen which is all phosphors at full brightness.

How would the fact that the blue phosphor wears faster make a difference between white screen and regular TV viewing for break-in? I would think that regular TV sources have roughly equivalent RGB so you'd still have that problem.

I think a white screen left up for long periods of time stresses the display unnecessarily

my advise is to just run a full screen video source during the break-in period with settings turned down from torch mode

I keep seeing "torch mode" mentioned. What exactly is it? I get my 42PWD7UY tomorrow,

ny_latin
Check out this site for new plasma owners concerning burn-in.



If the contrast runs from -30 to 30, and the factory setting is 25, would 12 be 50? Or should I set the contrast to ZERO?

BTW: I take delivery of my 42PWD7UY tomorrow. Usually the room is shady, at night we watch movies in the dark, but sometimes i the afternoon it is in full sunlight.

Appreciate any setup suggestions.

P.S. Our viewing habits are SD, which I plan to run in just mode Disney Channel ( alot with two kids - should I enable the white bar for the break in period) and DVD's of various sizes which I'll fill the screen with .

No PC or gaming.

Should I be fine with the out of the box settings as long as I vary the shows I watch, no black bars and use the white bar? Or should I roll back the contrast from the default 25?

I don't know much about HDTV yet, but all I hear about plasma is how games cause burn in. Is this still a large problem?

Thanks

Well, it depends a bit. I've repeatedly read on these forums that some plasmas are more sensible to burn in than others. The Panasonic plasmas seem to be quite good in this area.

FWIW, Panasonic just announced their 8th generation commercial ED models and they claim:

"The panel’s Multi-facet Asymmetrical Configuration Hyper-pixel (MACH) panel features a bounded cell structure and phosphor material that assures a panel’s service life of 60,000 hours, boosts peak brightness by more than 20% (from prior models) and increases the resistance to static-image burn-in to the same level as CRT displays."

http://www2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/PressroomHome?storeId=11301&catalogId=13251&catGroupId=30531

Also some people on this forum claimed they had no burn in problems whatsoever with their (Panasonic) plasmas even after long periods of gaming.

Honestly, I'm not sure about other plasma panels, cause personally I'm mainly interested in Panys due to their superior black level compared to other panels.

Hello All,

I'm just about to buy a Samsung LN-R408d (40" LCD), but I do like the look of plasmas, particularly Panasonic. I've settled on the 40" LCD based on my fear of burn-in with my viewing habits. Before I plunge for the LCD, I'd like to make sure that the plasma won't fly.

Here are my viewing habits:

20% Xbox and PS2 video games (will be Xbox 360 and PS3 next year).
20% DVD (component progressive)
40% Standard Definition in 4x3 format. This is kid shows and my wife, who don't care for stretch modes.
20% Standard Definition stretched. When I watch TV

Next year some of the SD watching will be replaced by HDTV, once DirectTV gets the HD Locals going. But there will still be 20-30% SD 4x3 for the kids shows (Noggin, etc.)

So, should I stick with LCD or consider plasma as well?

Thanks,

Mark

I just wanted to mention that while LCDs more immune to image retention from static images, they are still susceptible to it. At work we have 4 42" LCD panels used with Miranda's Kaleido 2 (http://miranda.com/?i=multi-image&l=1) multi-image system. LCDs were chosen as the static nature of the Kaleido windows would likely cause burn in on plasmas. After about a year's use, the Kaleido's windows were visible on the LCDs when they were set for a gray or white screen. While this usage is significantly different from a HT environment, it still demonstrates that LCDs can have a similar problem to burn in on plasmas.

The only information I've stumbled upon about "burn-in" being a property of lcd displays has been the user posts in various forums. As I understand, lcd's are not susceptible to "burn in", at all.....period. This conclusion is backed by every reputable, information-driven website and knowledgable professional that I have ever seen or spoken with. The "burn-in" argument has been growing from a common misconception that is traced back to the technology of outdated crt monitors and in no way reflects the physical properties of an lcd display. Simply put: It is just not possible. The truth is: NO type of CURRENT display will pose much of a threat of "burn-in" unless it is mistreated. If you can not take the time to maintain the integrity of the product, you are wasting far too much money.

The only information I've stumbled upon about "burn-in" being a property of lcd displays has been the user posts in various forums. As I understand, lcd's are not susceptible to "burn in", at all.....period. This conclusion is backed by every reputable, information-driven website and knowledgable professional that I have ever seen or spoken with. The "burn-in" argument has been growing from a common misconception that is traced back to the technology of outdated crt monitors and in no way reflects the physical properties of an lcd display. Simply put: It is just not possible.

Interesting. So the burn-in (or long term image-retention) that I'm looking at on my HP2025 LCD as I type this post, simply isn't possible? ;)

-JR

Juice,

You are not alone. On my prior 20" Dell UltraSharp LCD monitor at work I had the same burn-in problem. It was most pronounced at the "Start" button and quick launch bar, just like yours. I only noticed it because I was screwing around one day with the auto hide feature of the task bar and had a blue background on the desktop that is usually black. I was quite surprised as I had also heard LCD's could not burn-in. The box gets used 10+ hours a day, 5 days a week and was a couple of years old. It was not a problem as you can't see it with the taskbar showing. I currently have a 24" widescreen Dell that was new in March. I'll be interested if it will suffer from the same burn-in.

One thing is for sure, I'm not going to take any chances with my new 50" 7UY. I'm zooming everything in to get rid of any static display on the screen including the station bugs and sports scoring banners or tickers. Luckily, my STB has a zoom feature so I can even zoom the 1080i and 720p broadcasts. Between zooming and the position controls I can usually get rid of them all the static displays. If I can't get rid of them I turn down the white level to -30, black level -30 and saturation -25. Not the greatest picture but hopefully I won't have to worry about burn-in at those low levels.

Is there a significant risk of burn-in with the static images that come from the networks -- the "logos" that remain constant in the bottom corner?

What I have done for my computer LCD displays is to make sure that a screen saver goes on for about 15 minutes before the display automatically powers down. I do this on both Macs and Windows boxes. With the aggresive power savings mode the OS has by default, I usually have to tweak the screen saver / energy saver settings to make sure that the screen saver comes on before the screen powers down during idle time. I haven't had any LCD burn-in problems this way and have used LCD displays for 5 years.

My understanding is that LCD displays are much less susceptivle to burn-in than Plasma displays. Even minor variation of the image on the display will prevent burn-in.

I haven't had an answer to my earlier question on this thread regarding my viewing habits and plasma displays. I assume this means I should not get a plasma.

Mark

Hi Mark,

To me it doesn't sound like you shouldn't get a plasma, rather it sounds like your viewing style may change no matter what technology you go with, since you'll be purchasing a 16.x9 and wanting to watch a good amount of it 4:3.

My wife didn't want to watch anything stretched, but now watches almost all of her SD in "just" mode on our Panny. She finds the borders distracting when in 4x3, and doesn't like heads getting cut off in "zoom" mode.

The current 8th gen Pannys are stating CRT level burn-in resistance, so you should be safe, especially after you've properly calibrated the unit. Although I rarely watch 4:3 material, my wife and I regularly watch movies that are 2:35:1.

Since we've gotten our unit, our viewing habits have changed, especially now that we have HD tv via Comcast. Here is our current viewing habits, hopefully this may help.

60% TV (HD & SD)
25% Xbox
15% DVD (all aspect ratios)

You might want to go to a store and ask them to show you 4:3 material using the "just" mode Panasonic offers, or, if you look at a different brand, whatever mode they use that stretches the edges of the screen and maintains the center. You can check out some pictures here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=424533) that show you pictures I took (admittedly terrible) of the various modes, including "just".

Enjoy!

-JR

Hi JR,

Thanks for your post. I showed your photos to my wife. They were great at making the effect of the different modes obvious. She didn't go for the full-mode stretch, but she said the Just mode looked okay.

Mark

Sure thing Mark. Just mode doesn't bother my wife and I, but Full mode is tough to watch.

Here is an image (http://www.skullface.com/all-modes.jpg) that has all 4 modes together. I never posted it, but now seems a good enough time.

I really need to retake these photos! :)

-JR

i was reading the specs and features of the new Samsung SP-R 4232 and saw the feature auto pixel shift - does this really make it burn in resistant as they claim it to be?

i was reading the specs and features of the new Samsung SP-R 4232 and saw the feature auto pixel shift - does this really make it burn in resistant as they claim it to be?

It helps burning in of defined lines and shapes by shifting the picture slightly by a few pixels. It is effective when using it with grey pillar box bars when watching 4:3 so there is no defined line between the picture and the pillar box bars on the side.

I wouldn't rely on it completely to prevent burn-in, but it helps.

I read the thread, but didn't find a mention of CRT burnin compares to Plasma burnin. I've got a 4 year old Panny 16:9 panny CRT that spends most of its time in the 4:3 mode. After 4 years there isn't any indication of burnin or image retention.

Does this mean that CRTs aren't susceptible?

Are Plasmas more sensitive than CRTs.

CRT's can burn in, but I've only seen it on ATM machines and old arcade consoles that are on all the time but don't get played very often. New panny 8th gen commercial panels claim CRT levels of burn-in, but are not out yet. I don't know of any other brand that makes that claim. Still I wouldn't trust it completely and I would still take proper precautions with plasma.

Some plasmas (at least my Panasonic) allow you to adjust the brightness of the "side bars" on 4:3 material, theory being that a brighter side bar will reduce image retention. But, there is no adustment (AFAIK) for the top/bottom bars on 2.35 material. Why are only the side bars adjustable?

But, there is no adustment (AFAIK) for the top/bottom bars on 2.35 material. Why are only the side bars adjustable?

The black top/bottom bars that you see on 2.35 DVD movies are actually come from the DVD and not the TV. The TV still thinks that the 2.35 movies are 16:9, with the black bars actually being part of the picture from the DVD.

I am looking into a plasma tv and I am just wondering how much of a problem burn-in is with plasmas these days.

Is it something I should really be worried about anymre?

How long would an still image have to be on there to get burn-in? I know there's no exact time, but are we talking minutes, hours, days?

Is there any way to correct burn-in?

Should I be particularly concerned with playing video games on a plasma?

How long should I expect a plasma to last?

Thanks,
Andrew

According to the Panny 42PWD7UY manual, static images such as news tickers, score boxes, etc. should not be displayed for an "extended" period of time. Doing so may leave a permanent after-image (burn-in) on the screen.

Just how long is "extended"? Should I be concerned about channel logos that never move, such as the TLC logo, the Golf Channel logo, etc.? My children are allowed two hours of TV per day, and they usually watch the same channel the entire time. Will this be a problem?

If so, other than periodically switching the channel, are there any other preventive measures I can take?

Thanks in advance.

This should help:

http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_electronics/pressroom/cont2.asp?Filter=12&cont_id=822

It helps to break in your plasma if you are a new owner......ratcheting down brightness is also helpful.

Right. Vary your viewing habits, especially during the first 100 hours and you should have no problems. Don't watch any programs with black bars being displayed. Watch primarily 16:9 programs or stretch / zoom 4:3 content to fill your screen.

Read the Burn in thread stickied to the top page. I would worry if you leave your display on the same channel for llllooooonnnnngggggggggg ( read days, weeks, months) periods of times, not 2 hours.

Read the stickied thread at the top of the forum page.

A wealth of info resides here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=444258

Read the Burn in thread stickied to the top page. I would worry if you leave your display on the same channel for llllooooonnnnngggggggggg ( read days, weeks, months) periods of times, not 2 hours.Take a new PDP; watch it for 2 hours per day using 4:3 aspect ratio and I'll bet in 6 months you'll notice uneven phosphor wear.

Panasonic recommends limiting the use of black bars to no more than 15% of total viewing during the first 1000 hours.

Oh sorry - I didn't notice the sticky thread. Thanks.

I see the constant recommendations about turning down brightness and contrast. How much should it be turned down though to significantly reduce the risk of burn-in?

Threads Merged!

Dave

I see the constant recommendations about turning down brightness and contrast. How much should it be turned down though to significantly reduce the risk of burn-in?Using the Panasonic 50U PDP as an example there are three default settings: Vivid --> Standard --> Cinema, each of which can be further adjusted. A new PDP should be run using nothing higher than the Standard setting with perhaps the brightness & picture settings turned down a little bit more.

After reading this thread I was confident on my purchase of seven 42" Dell W4200 High Definition Plasma Displays. We have owned them for approximately 4-5 weeks. I did the break-in procedure of varying on/off times and content for the first 100 hours, then left them on. Brightness was IMMEDIATELY lowered to 40% and Contrast was set to 50%. I was CERTAIN this would buy me atleast 3 years. I have 642 hours on them, running 24 hours a day.

ALL READY BURNED IN. I am running Dells Plasma Conditioner on 2 of them now. I am SOOOO disappointed with Plasma Technology. All I read were comments on Airports and Shopping Malls with Plasma Presentation Displays running all day everyday with no hint of Burn-in. Well after this, the reason you can't see it is because those TV's are still on. When I change the channel I see it, when I turn the TV on I see it.

Either Dell is having a problem or Plasma Technology is ONLY suitable for the Home.

I am going to call Dell and see what they will do for me. Not even CRT's will burn in this fast.

1.5 years on a Panny 6UY and ZERO burn-in.....TV(SD+HD), VCR, DVD, and monitor for my Mac Mini for about 4 months now..... very happy with my purchase.

Sam

I have 642 hours on them, running 24 hours a day.

ALL READY BURNED IN. I am running Dells Plasma Conditioner on 2 of them now. I am SOOOO disappointed with Plasma Technology. All I read were comments on Airports and Shopping Malls with Plasma Presentation Displays running all day everyday with no hint of Burn-in. Well after this, the reason you can't see it is because those TV's are still on. When I change the channel I see it, when I turn the TV on I see it.

642 hours of a static image straight? I would assume this would cause image retention or burn-in on almost any phosphor based technology. Keep us posted about Dells response. Unfortunately, I don't think they'll respond with a replacement, since there is info in your owners manual (page 17) that states the following;


NOTE: Image retention and burn-in are not covered by your Dell warranty.
Displaying an image for an extended period of time can cause an image to remain or burn-in on the screen. Burn-in is a characteristic of all plasma displays.

To help avoid image burn-in, it is best to avoid leaving stationary images on your TV for extended periods of time. Examples of stationary images that may lead to burn-in include:
• TV menus
• Black bars such as those used in 4:3 or wide screen mode
• TV channel logos
• Stock market or news tickers
• Time display
• Shopping channel pricing display
• Static computer images
• Static video game images
• Closed captioning backgrounds

I know, this particular display has a direct connection to our Weather Station for Hurricanes. The other displays 16 security cameras in our Homeland Security Office. I expected at least CRT performance this soon.

The only information I've stumbled upon about "burn-in" being a property of lcd displays has been the user posts in various forums. As I understand, lcd's are not susceptible to "burn in", at all.....period.

I thought that too, but a friend who works at the local Future Shop showed me that LCD displays can and do burn in. The LCD displays that they use in the camera dept are left on 24 hours a day for several months at a time with a static video camera image displayed. When you switch them to a smooth background, you can clearly see the burned in numbers and boxes from the static camera image.

I think that we can say that LCD's do burn in, but it takes a lot longer than plasma to burn.

Those were probably also early generation panels...
Maybe. Maybe not.

Does it matter? A static image ruined the display. It will happen to plasmas just as much it will to CRT's. New or old. Go to a video arcade and see the "Game Over" burn-in's everywhere.

Has anyone had a problem with burn-in associated w/stock tickers or news crawlers? We watch a substantial amount of CNBC and the 24 hour news stations during the day. Is it possible to "remove" the ticker/crawler on most plasmas by zooming/stretching the picture?

Thanks!

Has anyone had a problem with burn-in associated w/stock tickers or news crawlers? We watch a substantial amount of CNBC and the 24 hour news stations during the day. Is it possible to "remove" the ticker/crawler on most plasmas by zooming/stretching the picture?

Thanks!
I can only speak for my Fujitsu P50... My son watches a lot of sports channels with the sports ticker always running across the bottom. I simply asked him after we got the plasma to expand or move the screen after he's read the ticker once. On the P50 it is simply a matter of going into the menu and expanding the screen size (a row of pixels at a time) in the vertical direction until the ticker is gone, and/or moving the picture down (again, it can be done one row of pixels at a time) until it is gone. He isn't too diligent about it, but no burn in after 30 months.

I did the unthinkable and bought a....Sony KDE-50XS955. I got an unbeatable deal on it through my company.

One thing though, should I be concerned about the "ghosting" that I'm seeing on it? Namely from dish network text on the screen and text from DVD menus. I have adjusted the settings from vivid to standard and turned down the brightness. I am very pleased with it otherwise.

Is this normal or does this indicate that this particular plasma is very susceptible to burn-in? I'd like to be able to watch dvds in the future without using the zoom feature or is that going to be too risky in light of the ghosting that appears now. The last thing I'd want of course is to cause the dreaded burn-in. Thanks.

Has anyone had a problem with burn-in associated w/stock tickers or news crawlers? We watch a substantial amount of CNBC and the 24 hour news stations during the day. Is it possible to "remove" the ticker/crawler on most plasmas by zooming/stretching the picture?

Thanks!

You know, with the popularity of Plasma, I can't believe the networks do this. I really am shocked they put the logo, like Fox or the Weather Channel. I know what Channel I am on dammit. I paid $2500.00 a piece for these HD-Plasma's. I could have saved MUCHO dollars and purchased some 25" CRT's on hangers and replaced them SEVERAL times before I hit the price tag for one plasmas display.

I am sure in a Home Environment this isn't a problem. But after having this problem I would be arguing with my fiancee to turn off the TV if she was planning to listen to VH1. I am super scared of plasma now.

One thing I noticed. Even though my TV's were at 50%/50% (Contrast/Brightness), I noticed the burn in for the Weather Channel (lower right) is a darker black than the rest of the TV when playing something like a DVD. Totally weird. I cut them down to 40%/40% (Contrast/Brightness) and run the Plamas' Conditioner for 4 hours. The burn in is improving, but too much conditioning *may* burn in the entire display.

For the home, Plasma may work well. But if High Availablility is necessary, I say be prepared to light your money on fire. I *had* CRT's in my Dispatch area with the same radio console information on for 7 months and it appears to be similar to my plasmas after a few weeks.

I am just so scared of plasma now.

Fondueski...YES, you can use one of the Aspect ratio choices to remove the tickers at the bottom of the screen.

This is what I do when watching any of the News channels. Sports also.

Although I have watched for a while (hours) with the tickers showing and did not have any burn in problems.

Does it matter? A static image ruined the display. It will happen to plasmas just as much it will to CRT's. New or old. Go to a video arcade and see the "Game Over" burn-in's everywhere.

I believe the reason for this thread is that there is evidence that plasma screens will burn in not "just as much" as a CRT, but more quickly. Perhaps far more quickly.

Is this not the case with modern plasma screens?




blakespot

I believe the reason for this thread is that there is evidence that plasma screens will burn in not "just as much" as a CRT, but more quickly. Perhaps far more quickly.

Is this not the case with modern plasma screens?

blakespot

The most recent Panasonic commercial units claim their burn-in levels are the same as a CRT. I would assume their statement refers to how long a static image must be present on screen to create image-retention/burn-in.

-JR

Although I am careful not to put my new LG DU-42PY10 in situations where burn-in can occur, I have fallen victim to the "guest/kids effect" where those who don't know better left a DVD menu on screen for nearly an hour while we were out of the room. As a result, I have definite images of the title and menu selections.

What I don't know is whether a static image over such a "short" time is likely just ghosting or if I have a much more serious case of burn-in? How can I determine what level of severity I have and what actions can I take to correct (or at least minimize) the problem.

The unit is less than two months old but is out of the 30 day return period. And to add insult to injury, if it is actually burn-in, my $300 BB service plan won't cover it (although if it is just ghosting, they will send a tech out to try to fix it). Thanks for any advice as I am just sick over this very expensive lesson: Don't let anyone touch your toys!

Although I am careful not to put my new LG DU-42PY10 in situations where burn-in can occur, I have fallen victim to the "guest/kids effect" where those who don't know better left a DVD menu on screen for nearly an hour while we were out of the room. As a result, I have definite images of the title and menu selections.

What I don't know is whether a static image over such a "short" time is likely just ghosting or if I have a much more serious case of burn-in? How can I determine what level of severity I have and what actions can I take to correct (or at least minimize) the problem.

The unit is less than two months old but is out of the 30 day return period. And to add insult to injury, if it is actually burn-in, my $300 BB service plan won't cover it (although if it is just ghosting, they will send a tech out to try to fix it). Thanks for any advice as I am just sick over this very expensive lesson: Don't let anyone touch your toys!

First, relax. Don't make yourself sick about it because I personally would be shocked if an hour of a static image caused a real permanent burn-in. That said, I suppose it might happen if you the unit was in "torch" mode as it likely came from the factory and you only have a few hours on it. Do you know how many hours you have on it?

Regardless, I would do nothing in the short term except to be certain that my contrast and brightness is turned down and set appropriately, and, to watch full screen programming for a week or two. Then check it out. If there is still some image left, you can use the white screen to get rid of the rest of it (if your model has that feature), but I doubt you will need it.

So, relax. Pour yourself a nice glass of wine and put in a good movie. I personally doubt you have a real serious problem here.

David

Marketing Prof, thanks for the calm voice of reason and reassuring! I will definitely take your advice and hopefully the image will work itself out. I still can't believe that ghosting or burn-in can happen is such a short period of time. Let this be a lesson to anyone who may allow someone else to have control of the plasma without properly educating them first.

Although I am careful not to put my new LG DU-42PY10 in situations where burn-in can occur, I have fallen victim to the "guest/kids effect" where those who don't know better left a DVD menu on screen for nearly an hour while we were out of the room. As a result, I have definite images of the title and menu selections.

What I don't know is whether a static image over such a "short" time is likely just ghosting or if I have a much more serious case of burn-in? How can I determine what level of severity I have and what actions can I take to correct (or at least minimize) the problem.

The unit is less than two months old but is out of the 30 day return period. And to add insult to injury, if it is actually burn-in, my $300 BB service plan won't cover it (although if it is just ghosting, they will send a tech out to try to fix it). Thanks for any advice as I am just sick over this very expensive lesson: Don't let anyone touch your toys!
Sounds like image retention, dude. Happened to me too with a DVD menu. Went away within several minutes & hasn't come back. From what I've read in this thread, it's temporary and decreases with panel usage. Still sounds like you're worried about this. As long as you follow the basic tips in this thread, your TV should be cool. Have a beer instead :)

Have a beer instead :)

A beer would be great too. Make mine a Sam Adams! If it's wine I particularly enjoy the Bogle Petite Syrah with light movie snacks. Either way, you can't lose.

I was at a high-end dealer in Columbia, Md and they showed me an LG 50 px5d. One of the features of this set is "white wash". They were able to white wash the logo in the corner of the screen so that it could not be seen. Another feature was the ability to move the logo to a different location. Anyone seen these feature(s) before?

I desperately need a good TV for the kitchen (essentially the family room) of my weekend house. Currently have a 13" CRT! I'm a huge football fan -- both NFL and College -- and last year I didn't want to be in the country any weekend from September through January because I had to watch football on my 50" RP LCD HDTV at home! So I've finally convinced my wife that we NEED a good TV up there and I'm ready to buy in the next month.

So, I decided on a Panasonic 42" plasma, then started looking at the user guide, various FAQs, and this thread. Now I'm having second thoughts and may fall back to a Sharp 32" LCD.

The issue: I absolutely hate watching 4:3 TV in any other mode than Normal. While I watch as much HDTV as I can get, I still probably watch 80% in Normal 4:3 mode.

While I have no problem lowering brightness/contrast, watching in a 16:9 mode for first 100 hours, and using bright sidebars, the bottom line is that following break-in I'll be watching 80% in 4:3 mode.

Can someone with experience tell me if I'm wasting my money on the plasma display? Is it simply inappropriate for my viewing habits due to burn-in risk? Or will I be fine if I follow procedures noted in above paragraph?

The issue: I absolutely hate watching 4:3 TV in any other mode than Normal. While I watch as much HDTV as I can get, I still probably watch 80% in Normal 4:3 mode.

While I have no problem lowering brightness/contrast, watching in a 16:9 mode for first 100 hours, and using bright sidebars, the bottom line is that following break-in I'll be watching 80% in 4:3 mode.

Can someone with experience tell me if I'm wasting my money on the plasma display? Is it simply inappropriate for my viewing habits due to burn-in risk? Or will I be fine if I follow procedures noted in above paragraph?

I would suck it up and watch 4:3 in zoom/stretch for the first 100 hours. After that, as long as you use grey side bars you should be fine. Make sure you use the pixel shift/orbiter/wobbler when you use the grey side bars. That should reduce the risk of retention of a line between the side bars and the 4:3 image.

Also, don't set your side bars too bright, you may end up wearing out the sides faster than the middle. You'll have to guess the average brightness of the 4:3 shows you watch and set the brightness of the side bars to match it.

Every once in a while, check for burn in with a solid color image on the screen. If you see any burn in, adjust the brightness of the sidebars accordingly.

Ren

I did the unthinkable and bought a....Sony KDE-50XS955. I got an unbeatable deal on it through my company.

One thing though, should I be concerned about the "ghosting" that I'm seeing on it? Namely from dish network text on the screen and text from DVD menus. I have adjusted the settings from vivid to standard and turned down the brightness. I am very pleased with it otherwise.

Is this normal or does this indicate that this particular plasma is very susceptible to burn-in? I'd like to be able to watch dvds in the future without using the zoom feature or is that going to be too risky in light of the ghosting that appears now. The last thing I'd want of course is to cause the dreaded burn-in. Thanks.

I did the same thing when the prices dropped last weekend. First thing I noticed was the ghosting. It goes away, but very noticable when changing stations and the aspect ratio changes. I don't remember my 43" PDP-4310 Pioneer being that bad. I'm going to set it up again, next to the Sony this weekend and compare. Very disappointing.

hi, i just bought a plasma and love it!! but i'm kinda worried about all this i read about logos burning in on your screen. since 80% of the channels i watch have some dumb ass logo now, should i be concerned??

During the break-in period, I try to not watch channels with very bright (or dark) logos. I think transparent ones are reasonably OK. You can sometimes use zoom modes to get the logos off your screen. I can't believe these channels use such distracting and damaging (to plasma) logos. There ought to be an industry standard or specification for logos that ensures no damage to our property.

Failing that, you'd think these networks would realize that ugly bright logos drive viewers away, and are therefore a bad idea purely on the business case.

I desperately need a good TV for the kitchen (essentially the family room) of my weekend house. Currently have a 13" CRT! I'm a huge football fan -- both NFL and College -- and last year I didn't want to be in the country any weekend from September through January because I had to watch football on my 50" RP LCD HDTV at home! So I've finally convinced my wife that we NEED a good TV up there and I'm ready to buy in the next month.

So, I decided on a Panasonic 42" plasma, then started looking at the user guide, various FAQs, and this thread. Now I'm having second thoughts and may fall back to a Sharp 32" LCD.

The issue: I absolutely hate watching 4:3 TV in any other mode than Normal. While I watch as much HDTV as I can get, I still probably watch 80% in Normal 4:3 mode.

While I have no problem lowering brightness/contrast, watching in a 16:9 mode for first 100 hours, and using bright sidebars, the bottom line is that following break-in I'll be watching 80% in 4:3 mode.

Can someone with experience tell me if I'm wasting my money on the plasma display? Is it simply inappropriate for my viewing habits due to burn-in risk? Or will I be fine if I follow procedures noted in above paragraph?

You're really in a bit of tough spot here. On the one hand, fast moving sports is not LCD's greatest strength due to smear. The more recent high priced models are much better, but it still bothers me. On the other hand, personally, I wouldn't spend 80% of viewing time with 4:3 and sidebars. IMHO, I do think you might have a problem -- maybe not right away, but after 2000-3000 hours, something has got to give, even with gray bars. If it was in your main home, I'd say go with the plasma since it will be used to watch other shows during the week.

Since it is a summer home, why not a rear projection DLP? Not quite as thin, but thinner than that 13"CRT I bet. No smear, no burn-in (but other issues for sure that are no so important for watching football).

Just some thoughts...

Since it is a summer home, why not a rear projection DLP? Not quite as thin, but thinner than that 13"CRT I bet. No smear, no burn-in (but other issues for sure that are no so important for watching football).

Thanks for the suggestion, but that's not an option. I need something I can hang over the fireplace in my kitchen (which, conveniently, sits diagonally in one corner of the room). It's the ideal setup for a flat-screen. Non-functioning fireplace (the furnace flue runs up through that chimney). The way the kitchen is configured (and the size of the kitchen) would prevent me from having any rear-projection wide-screen format TV. It's got to be something I can hang over the fireplace.

I've pretty much decided on getting a Panasonic TH-37PWD8UK and just using appropriate precautions (including watching as much expanded 4:3 as I can stomach.) Ren and MarketingProf: Thanks for the feedback and advice.

RC

RC - You're welcome and enjoy!

If the contrast runs from -30 to 30, and the factory setting is 25, would 12 be 50? Or should I set the contrast to ZERO?



Has anyone answered this? I just got a PWD8uk and have the same question...
Thanks,
RA

Has anyone answered this? I just got a PWD8uk and have the same question...
Thanks,
RA

My understanding is that when people say set your contrast/brightness, etc to 0, what that means is at the 50% level. That depends on how your TV sets the scale for those settings. If the scale is from -30 to +30, then 0 would be the halfway point. If the scale is 0 to 100, then 50 would be the halfway point.

Just add the low end number and the high end number together and divide by 2 to get the halfway point for your settings.

My understanding is that when people say set your contrast/brightness, etc to 0, what that means is at the 50% level. That depends on how your TV sets the scale for those settings. If the scale is from -30 to +30, then 0 would be the halfway point. If the scale is 0 to 100, then 50 would be the halfway point.

Just add the low end number and the high end number together and divide by 2 to get the halfway point for your settings.

Thanks... that makes sense and as I work with my new set it is all starting to make more sense...

RA

The bright white logos/bugs used by the SciFi channel, USA, and Cartoon Network have been annoying me (even more than usual now that I have a plasma display.) Not only do these logos distract from the program content, they may damage some displays after extended viewing. So today I sent them each a polite email asking them to either eliminate the bug, or at least modify it to be transparent similar to most networks (CBS FX TBS TNT etc). I emphasized that I am reluctant to watch those channels until they eliminate or modify the bug to be more plasma-friendly, so they are affecting their own viewer base with these bright logos. I encourage anyone who reads this to also send them comments. The email address for comments at SciFi and USA Network are:

feedback@scifi.com
feedback@usanetwork.com

Cartoon Network has a web page where you can submit feedback at:

http://www.cartoonnetwork.com/help/index.html?general

I would like to get this tv and I have heard that panasonic has new technology to prevent brun-in. Does anyone has any info on this technology?

Thanks

Just had my Panasonic TH-50PX50U delivered this afternoon. Still trying to figure out how to navigate around. When I come to a blank channel the screen, in gray, show the images of the last channel visted.

I have changed the picture mode from vivid to standard to dial down, but all other settings appear to be at 0. Is this normal to be able to see burn in from last channels?

I just bought a Panny TH-50PX50U and have been reading all the posts about turning down the contrast on new plasma to 50% or less.

The set came out of box set to 'Vivid" and the current picture settings are :
Picture mode: Vivid
Picture: +30
Brightness: 0
Color: 0
Tint: 0
Sharpness: +17

What is meant by "turn down contrast to 50% or less??" Do they mean "Picture Mode" setting to standard or something else?

Just had my Panasonic TH-50PX50U delivered this afternoon. Still trying to figure out how to navigate around. When I come to a blank channel the screen, in gray, show the images of the last channel visted.

I have changed the picture mode from vivid to standard to dial down, but all other settings appear to be at 0. Is this normal to be able to see burn in from last channels?

My 3 week old Sony KDE-50XS955 has this problem BIG TIME. :( I use standard mode and power saving light level, with brightness/contrast adjusted with AVIA DVD. Any image that lasts for more than 30sec burns in. For example, the ticking clock/frame at the beginning of the CBS program "60 Minutes" burns in. Or if I watch letterboxed "ER" and then they have a commercial break, I see the letterbox burn-in bars at top and bottom of the commercial. Even the TV14 rating logo burns in on programs that display it. Very disappointing but at least it goes away.

Ironically, I was going to return it under the 30 day satisfaction guarantee and get your Panasonic, but you just convinced me that that isn't going to help. My Pioneer PDP-4300 didn't have this problem. I placed them side by side and compared them using a black screen with white credits frozen on my TIVO. The Sony burned in if I let it sit for about 30 sec or more. The Pioneer was much better. You had to strain to see it and it wouldn't be noticable in normal viewing.

Image retention (as opposed to permanent burn-in) is supposedly normal. Also, from what others have said, the frequency/severity diminishes with time. I used to freak out about it when my PDP was new, but now that I think of it, haven't seen it in over 6+ months. No permanent ill effects seen too. Can any pros confirm this?

Just had my Panasonic TH-50PX50U delivered this afternoon. Still trying to figure out how to navigate around. When I come to a blank channel the screen, in gray, show the images of the last channel visted.

I have changed the picture mode from vivid to standard to dial down, but all other settings appear to be at 0. Is this normal to be able to see burn in from last channels?

I've had my TH-50PX50U for around 2 1/2 months now and there is zero burn-in, so I wouldn't be too worried. The only advice I took from this forum was to not leave the TV on the same channel that had a logo for an extended period of time during the 'break in' period (the first 100 hours). I also always have my TV set on Standard or Vivid. Other than that, I haven't messed with any settings and the TV is still going good after probably 300+ hours of usage.

Oh, and I've wondered this for a while...should burn-in even really be an issue with static images on the screen during TV programs? These images disappear for about 2 minutes during every commercial break, so shouldn't that keep the image from being burned in?

I got my Panny 500U about six hours ago and so far, so good.
I immediately cranked the picture down, to where watching a DVD or TV is barely bright enough. But if I'm going to own this thing for 5-10 years, I don't mind erring on the side of caution for the first 2 weeks or so.
I'm looking for TV programming that will allow me to break the unit in without making a fatal mistake. That means, no logos or static menus. Right now I'm watching the Dodger game in "Zoom" mode, which eliminates the logo and the scoreboard graphic. Plus, I try to find lengthy DVDs that fill the entire screen. So I'm a little paranoid right now. But with the TV six hours old, I love it.
If anybody has break-in advice, I'd love to hear it!
Thanks,
Mark

Here is an informative white paper from IDG.

Go to the URL below & click on link to "Plasma Performance White Paper"

http://www.everythingtechnology.com/

Great radio show on KSFO.com Saturday 10:00 AM-1:00 PM PT about computers & video. Pod cast available.

Good stuff.

As a hardcore gamer, and the owner of a week-old Panny PX50U plasma, I'm happy to see that indeed the newest panels are nearing CRT levels of resistance to burn-in.

I'm still breaking her in, but so far I've played games/DVDs and SD & HD tv, and the PQ is astounding. I've also seen no ghosting, image retention, or any other such issue.....

I can't wait for the 360 and every game running 720p 16:9.... :D

I am sure this has been addressed, but I could not find it with a quick scan through the posts. Will watching a DVD in a 2.35 format on a plasma cause burn in? I thuoght I read somewhere that the source for top/bottom lines is different from that of the sidebars. That did not seem to make to much sense to me. If it is a potential cause of burn in- is there a way to eliminate the lines other than through the Zoom function? I have an Elite 810 with a Denon 1910 DVD player.

Well, I can tell you watching 2.35:1 movies will cause burn-in if you do it ALL the time. We have Lord of the Rings running all day long everyday at work on a Pioneer 50" and the black bars are burned in on that set (though really it's just uneven wear). But I will say this...the burn-in isn't that bad, especially considering it's on 12 hours a day like that. I gotta think that in normal in-home use it wouldn't be something to worry about after the first 200 hours, especially if you vary your viewing.

I am sure this has been addressed, but I could not find it with a quick scan through the posts. Will watching a DVD in a 2.35 format on a plasma cause burn in? I thuoght I read somewhere that the source for top/bottom lines is different from that of the sidebars. That did not seem to make to much sense to me. If it is a potential cause of burn in- is there a way to eliminate the lines other than through the Zoom function? I have an Elite 810 with a Denon 1910 DVD player.
Many of the movies I watch are 2.4, 2.35, etc. -- no burn in at all after 2.5 years. My experience would tell me that unless you are watching primarily 2.35 movies and not mixing it up with other programming you should have no problem whatsoever.

Thanks

We have Lord of the Rings running all day long everyday at work on a Pioneer 50" and the black bars are burned in on that set (though really it's just uneven wear).
How many hours of use would you estimate it took for this to occur? Not just image retention I'll assume?

I couldn't tell you exactly how long it took to occur but the TV has been in this situation (Lord of the Rings 12 hours a day every single day) for 2 months now and even with that the burn-in is minimal. By minimal I mean that you can only see it when the TV is on with nothing actually displayed. When you push stop on the DVD and the HK DVD player's main screen comes up (which is a primarily blue screen that fills the entire 16:9 area) and the burn-in is not noticeable one single bit.

The first day we had this setup someone left the Star Wars II DVD menu screen up for at least 8 hours straight and that image was in the screen for maybe a day or two and then went away completely.

We also have a demo disc that has our logo on the main menu that fills the screen (and it's a REALLY bright big logo with a black background surrounding it). This menu screen has been up for hours on end at times on multiple plasmas and when we play something else the logo is visible in the background for about 10-30 minutes depending on how long it was up but then it's completely gone.

My point is, even in the semi-abusive environment in the store the TV has resulted in very minimal burn-in....which to be honest, might even clear up if we'd just play a 1.85:1 movie for a while. I seriously wouldn't worry about it if you're the average person who watches DVDs, TV, and even plays games. The newer plasmas are far better than previous models in being hardy against screen burn-in

Hope this helps.

I 'm sorry to re-ask this, or if its a dumb question. I did a search and found nothing.

If I watch 90% 4:3 and 10% 16:9, will a Panny TH42PD50 be a poor choice because of burn in? Or to ask this another way, does this set have a good mode to stretch the 4:3 to cover the screen so that circles are perfectly round? I am sensitive to distorted aspect ratios and they drive me nuts.

I 'm sorry to re-ask this, or if its a dumb question. I did a search and found nothing.

Well you must not have searched very well - there are tons of threads in the past few months about burn in in addition to the Master Burn In Thread stickied at the top of this forum.

Bottom line - keep the screen filled for the first 200-300 hours then once the panel is broken in, try to limit black bars of any kind to 15% or less of your viewing time..

BURN IN THREAD - CLICK HERE (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=444258)

The TH42PD50 has zoom and panorama modes for SD content, but only has the 4:3 and "fat head" stretch mode for HD. If you have a good STB, it should have some additional, better options.

As far as burn in with the TH42PD50, it doesn't appear to be any more or less suceptible to burn-in than comparable panels from other manufacturers.

Unfortunately there is NO way to expand a 4:3 image to fit a 16:9 screen without either distorting the image or cutting off part of the picture. Panasonic's "justified" mode does a pretty good job, but some people still find its distortion to be a distraction. After considerable experimentation, I settled on zooming the picture to just fit horizontally. This cuts a couple of inches off the top and bottom of the image, but I find I very rarely miss them.

If you want to use the "normal" aspect ratio, IMO you can probably avoid burn-in indefinitely by using the dark gray, rather than black, sidebar setting.

Also, if there is any burn-in, it will show on a uniform white screen long before it becomes visible in regular TV viewing, and this enables you to correct the situation before serious harm results. I watched my Panasonic plasma for about nine months with black sidebars, and could just begin to notice some burn-in on a white screen. I then switched to the "zoom" setting which I've used for about a year and there's now no evidence of burn-in, even on a white screen.

How about a widescreen plasma with plastic covers that rotate out to cover the sides of the screen when in 4:3 mode? It could then display an image to those areas, and the plastic cover would prevent you from seeing it. The image could be taken from what you are watching so it would wear the screen exactly in all areas.

Don't laugh! A low tech solution would work perfect. Sony car stereo head decks spin around when you hit a button, so the technology is not new. ;-)

How about a widescreen plasma with plastic covers that rotate out to cover the sides of the screen when in 4:3 mode? It could then display an image to those areas, and the plastic cover would prevent you from seeing it. The image could be taken from what you are watching so it would wear the screen exactly in all areas.

Don't laugh! A low tech solution would work perfect. Sony car stereo head decks spin around when you hit a button, so the technology is not new. ;-)

I'm not laughing. Some time ago one of the reviewers for an AV magazine affixed cardboard he had painted flat black on both sides to an RPTV to increase the perceived contrast ratio, and claimed it worked well. He used velcro so it could be applied and removed easily. He was bothered by the then poor stretching algorithms and the fact that he only had 1 HD channel and DVDs to watch in widescreen mode. It got rid of the gray bars and improved the contrast, so he claimed. Can't remember who did it.

I got my Panny 500U about six hours ago and so far, so good.
I immediately cranked the picture down, to where watching a DVD or TV is barely bright enough. But if I'm going to own this thing for 5-10 years, I don't mind erring on the side of caution for the first 2 weeks or so.
I'm looking for TV programming that will allow me to break the unit in without making a fatal mistake. That means, no logos or static menus. Right now I'm watching the Dodger game in "Zoom" mode, which eliminates the logo and the scoreboard graphic. Plus, I try to find lengthy DVDs that fill the entire screen. So I'm a little paranoid right now. But with the TV six hours old, I love it.
If anybody has break-in advice, I'd love to hear it!
Thanks,
Mark
I am very interested in that model! As I research other threads here, I am finding some people play a DVD that will fill the screen in a loop while they are at work. This will allow for the screen to "age" while doing your best to ensure you are not doing anything to contribute to burn in.

Reducing contrast/brightness seems failry universal. For a cheap set up, find a DVD that has the THX optimizer and use it for the video settings. You can also use more expensive optimizers or have professional calibration but my operative word is CHEAP! After spending a few bucks on the TV, you know!

I am very interested in that model! As I research other threads here, I am finding some people play a DVD that will fill the screen in a loop while they are at work. This will allow for the screen to "age" while doing your best to ensure you are not doing anything to contribute to burn in.

Not a good idea, IMO. What if your DVD player has a problem and kicks out of the Play mode to the main menu, while you are gone? Static menu for 6 hours+ while the TV is barely a few hours old.. The break-in period should be monitored to avoid any "Aw f**k!" situations.

eh i did it for the first 1000 hours on my 37px50, and so far im up to about 200 hours on my 50px500u and dvd hasnt 'not looped' yet. I always set it to repeat title, then skip ahead to the last chapter and ff to the end, to make sure it loops the first time, sometimes it doesnt take. Once it loops the first time, it always keeps looping. I loop it with contrast/brightness down pretty far, maybe -10. At the rate i watch tv, i would have to wait a year before it hit 1000 hours, and i certainly dont want to wait a year before i can bring up contrast and stop worrying about black bars.

Not all DVD players are created equal. Nor is the reliability of everyone's power grid. Although I'm glad you never had any real problems (although you stated that your DVD player did not always loop on the first try!), others may be less fortunate and I would not feel comfortable advising anyone to do this procedure, knowing that something *could* go wrong and potentially ruin the new PDP.

Breaking-in a new plasma should be like aging good wine. It must be done with care and patience. Furthermore, you shouldn't have to worry about cranking the contrast high anyways, it will ruin the PQ. As for black bars, as long as its done very moderately durung the first 200 hrs (forget 1000 hrs!), there are no problems.

Cheers and enjoy your 37px50!

Not all DVD players are created equal. Nor is the reliability of everyone's power grid. Although I'm glad you never had any real problems (although you stated that your DVD player did not always loop on the first try!), others may be less fortunate and I would not feel comfortable advising anyone to do this procedure, knowing that something *could* go wrong and potentially ruin the new PDP.

Breaking-in a new plasma should be like aging good wine. It must be done with care and patience. Furthermore, you shouldn't have to worry about cranking the contrast high anyways, it will ruin the PQ. As for black bars, as long as its done very moderately durung the first 200 hrs (forget 1000 hrs!), there are no problems.

Cheers and enjoy your 37px50!
yea i agree to an extent, it is a chance im taking, but i think it is a very minimal chance. Also i think the worst case scenario is it would be stuck on the dvd menu for 6 hours at very low brightness in my case - i think looping a dvd for 20 or 30 hours after that would erase the uneven wear, or burn in, or image retention, or whatever you want to call it. Either way, i watch maybe 3/4 hours a night of tv, at that rate it would take a unimaginable amount of time (almost a year!) before i can watch it happily, so im wiling the take the slight risk. As far as cranking it 'high', i calibrated with dve, which sucks by the way, but it does produce a very good picture once you can figure out how to use it.

Actually, looking at it another way... Why would you want to deliberately use up good life of your plasma when you are not enjoying it? Relax. Have some fun. Watch the darn thing. Isn't that why you bought it?

yea i agree to an extent, it is a chance im taking, but i think it is a very minimal chance. Also i think the worst case scenario is it would be stuck on the dvd menu for 6 hours at very low brightness in my case - i think looping a dvd for 20 or 30 hours after that would erase the uneven wear, or burn in, or image retention, or whatever you want to call it. Either way, i watch maybe 3/4 hours a night of tv, at that rate it would take a unimaginable amount of time (almost a year!) before i can watch it happily, so im wiling the take the slight risk. As far as cranking it 'high', i calibrated with dve, which sucks by the way, but it does produce a very good picture once you can figure out how to use it.

What is it exactly that makes you unhappy about your current picture settings? If properly calibrated with DVE or Avia, as you stated, the picture settings you'll get after calbration should be not only fine for the break-in period, but also for casual viewing, no?

Are you saying that after you calibrated, you found your PQ less than adequate? Too dim? If so, you will get used to that "dimmer", less vibrant picture. Ultimately, this setting is what will produce the best quality picture. After you got acustomed to the calibrated settings, say in a few weeks, try cranking the contrast and color settings back to the factory "vivid" mode and you'll be horrified :)

With whatever settings you ended up with after calibration, you shouldn't need to tone them down further for the break-in period. They should be fine, unless you somehow ended up getting a contrast setting above the 50% mark, which normally shouldn't be the case if the calbration was done properly.

If what makes you unhappy is not being able to watch 4:3 TV or letterbox DVDs to your heart content, right away, then I understand. But remember, if done moderately (an hour or so per day is not likely to damage the PDP, if followed by hours of full screen material), you aren't likely to experience any image retention, specially on a Panny.

strip: huh? I think you misunderstood me, i am not unhappy at all with the picture post-calibration, i was unhappy with the DVE disk itself, the setup on the dvd sucks. Although on both tv's, the setting for brightness was high, i think +19.

marketingprof: lifespan is 60,000 hours, i am using up 1/60th of that. And as i stated, i may watch 1,000 hours a year, so now i will have 59 years of tv left instead of 60. Not exactly worried about that. And its hard to relax and enjoy it when you arent supposed to watch more then 15% side bars for the first 1000 hours (which would be a year in my case), and tone down the contrast so the picture looks dark for the first year. By looping the dvd 20 hours a day, i am enjoying it the other 4 hours because i can watch basically whatever i want, static image, anything, as bright as i want, since the other 20 hours cancels out the miniscule 4 hours i am watching it.

strip: huh? I think you misunderstood me, i am not unhappy at all with the picture post-calibration, i was unhappy with the DVE disk itself, the setup on the dvd sucks. Although on both tv's, the setting for brightness was high, i think +19.

marketingprof: lifespan is 60,000 hours, i am using up 1/60th of that. And as i stated, i may watch 1,000 hours a year, so now i will have 59 years of tv left instead of 60. Not exactly worried about that. And its hard to relax and enjoy it when you arent supposed to watch more then 15% side bars for the first 1000 hours (which would be a year in my case), and tone down the contrast so the picture looks dark for the first year. By looping the dvd 20 hours a day, i am enjoying it the other 4 hours because i can watch basically whatever i want, static image, anything, as bright as i want, since the other 20 hours cancels out the miniscule 4 hours i am watching it.
I hear ya, but boy I hate to see such measures taken. At least put in a good DVD (might I suggest Shrek or Shrek II?) and charge the neighborhood kids $.50 each to watch it as many times as they want. :D
On another note... Won't a white screen do the same thing, only faster?

[QUOTE=dontdothat88]strip: huh? I think you misunderstood me, i am not unhappy at all with the picture post-calibration, i was unhappy with the DVE disk itself, the setup on the dvd sucks. Although on both tv's, the setting for brightness was high, i think +19.QUOTE]

I was referring to your previous comment: "at that rate it would take a unimaginable amount of time (almost a year!) before i can watch it happily"

On a side note, I agree, +19 is quite high. Post calibration, mine turned out to be exactly 0 (50%), using Avia.

[QUOTE=dontdothat88]strip: huh? I think you misunderstood me, i am not unhappy at all with the picture post-calibration, i was unhappy with the DVE disk itself, the setup on the dvd sucks. Although on both tv's, the setting for brightness was high, i think +19.QUOTE]

I was referring to your previous comment: "at that rate it would take a unimaginable amount of time (almost a year!) before i can watch it happily"

On a side note, I agree, +19 is quite high. Post calibration, mine turned out to be exactly 0 (50%), using Avia.
yea im not sure why its so high, but it looks perfect at +19 and thats what dve says it should be anyway. I said it would take a year because i woudlnt leave it at +19 for the first 1000 hours, so i would be stuck with it at 0 which is wayyy too dark on my tv. Maybe its because of the signal/lighting in the room/cable box, but 0 would be nearly pitch black for my setup.

Not a good idea, IMO. What if your DVD player has a problem and kicks out of the Play mode to the main menu, while you are gone? Static menu for 6 hours+ while the TV is barely a few hours old.. The break-in period should be monitored to avoid any "Aw f**k!" situations.

Good point. No certainties in life! Now I'm just waiting the extra week to see if Panny drops the price before Labor Day.

I am pondering whether to get a Panasonic 42" PD50U or a Sony A10 RPTV. In addition to the HD vs. ED issue, I am also concerned with burn-in problems. The salesperson I talked to claimed that Panasonic's current plasma technology has largely made burn-in a thing of the past, but I am leery. The Panasonic TV does not have any stretch or zoom modes for 16:9 material, so I assume you would be stuck with letterboxing for 2.35 movies, and my wife like to watch some channels that use logos. I do not wish to explain to her the difference between burn-in and image retention. Oh, and I should say I'm one of those people who prefer to watch 4:3 without cropping or distorting the picture, although I can be flexible on that. I suppose my question is really:

Is Panasonic's current technology close to burn-in proof if the sidebar color is grey, the screen is filled whenever possible, and contrast/brightness is turned down?
Will I be able to watch letterboxed movies or channels with logos for two or three hours at a stretch the first couple hundred hours without fear, or do I need to be concerned with restrictions on viewing logo'd channels? That would be a major pain, I have to say.

UPDATE:

I'm back. The burned-in ghost image I had a few months ago on my TH-50PHD7UY is now gone, completely, bye bye, tah tah... adios.

I'm happy.. :)

I suppose my question is really:

Is Panasonic's current technology close to burn-in proof if the sidebar color is grey, the screen is filled whenever possible, and contrast/brightness is turned down?
Will I be able to watch letterboxed movies or channels with logos for two or three hours at a stretch the first couple hundred hours without fear, or do I need to be concerned with restrictions on viewing logo'd channels? That would be a major pain, I have to say.
Most logos i've seen are dimmed and translucent so don't worry about it. If the logo is bright and sharp, you want to avoid it.

Unfortunately, the plasma technology is *far* from burn-in-proof. The plasmas have been around what... over 15 years? still having burnin problems. Because of this, I would expect that it needs another 2 decades to get "burn-in-proof" which is..... incredibly rediculous..... it is totally unacceptable.

what I've been doing with my Plasma tv is to constantly taking cautions to help prevent any future burn-in images... I'm trying very hard and is doing me good so far. As long as I keep the images "moving" no matter how bright and sharp the images are I get no problems. The keyword here is "movement", very very important keyword hehe.

but i tell you what I will do next time when I get another plasma tv. Set the brightness/contrast settings lower and never, ever, never, ever leave static images. Especially the bright white sharp object is most deadly.

I just got the Maxent from Costco a few weeks ago, and would like to run it at AVIA calibrated settings. Can I use the screen wipe feature to "age" the phosphors to > 100 hours?

Unfortunately, the plasma technology is *far* from burn-in-proof. The plasmas have been around what... over 15 years? still having burnin problems. Because of this, I would expect that it needs another 2 decades to get "burn-in-proof" which is..... incredibly rediculous..... it is totally unacceptable.

I have the Panny PX50U for about a month now, and I've been doing plenty of gaming on it, and I have yet to see any kind of image retention - no ghosting, no temporary IR, and certainly no burn-in.

I'm going to have to say the newer panels certainly do appear to have excellent anti-burn in technology. Far more resiliant than they used to be. I've been cautious to break-in the set, plenty of varied viewing material, Avia calibration, and lowered contrast out of the box, but it's a beautiful display, and I see no evidence of poor quality or any technical issues. Just beautiful PQ for games, DVDs and Hi Def broadcasts.

Did you see the new report that was just released on the newer plasmas? They tested them by leaving the Half Life 2 menu on screen for 48 hours straight. There was image retention after that extreme amount of time (and no matter how much you game, you'll never even approach abuse like that) but after 20 minutes of watching regular TV the image was completely wiped out - gone. So, even after that abuse there was no actual burn-in, just temporary image retention that went away immediately.

I think burn-in fears are way overrated at this point. Again, I'm being cautious with my display, but I bought it to enjoy it, not fret about it. :D

I have the Panny PX50U for about a month now, and I've been doing plenty of gaming on it, and I have yet to see any kind of image retention - no ghosting, no temporary IR, and certainly no burn-in.
It makes a lot of difference depends on "how" you setup to display the gaming graphics. In this case Console gaming vs. PC game. PC gaming "can" hurt the display much easier than the console games. Here's why:

- Console games do not generate as high resolutions and the images are not as sharp. You will find most of the console game grphics are little blurry. That blurrieness REALLY helps keeping from TV getting burnin image problems.


The main factors that hurt the plasma displays are: Sharpness & Contrast/Brightness levels. but of course lowering the brightness and sharpness from the TV will certainly help... but then you defeat the purpose of the display and the anti-burnin that people claim. If it is anti burnin why lower the settings?, aight? :D If you run it at 1600 x 1200(or 1280 x 960) with 16x Anisotropic Filtering on, you will know what I mean..... If all you do is play console games, it would be harder for you to fully understand what I mean....




I know for a "fact" that todays(even the brand sparkling new models) plasmas are prone to burnin image retentions. If you go back several pages in this thread you will see my burnin image problem. It lasted me an impressive 3 months to clear out the image retention. I thought it was going to be a "Permanent" one since it was lasting "that" long, but luckily, God saved me. It's finally gone.

but the point is... it *shouldn't* get image retention period. If you continously apply the same practice the image retention can turn into permanent burned-in ghost image. I can no longer play the game Need for Speed: U2 with speedometer/tach analog display on. I have to leave it turned off forever...... now that's a problem ain't it... :D

but in BattleField2 PC game, the radar and other displays are not giving me problems. That is because they are not as sharp and bright. It all... depends on how the grahpics are displayed. Just because others are not having problems gaming doesn't mean anything, at all.... :)

LCD Burn-in

want proof that LCD's can burn-in in just 8 months?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6088261&&#post6088261

You know for a fact, eh? :D

Interesting, because there are a ton of people here who game on their plasmas with no burn-in issues at all. I would think that's pretty strong evidence to the contrary of your point of view...

Also, the games I'm playing run in 720p, so they are quite sharp and bright, and the resolution is high. I'm also running my games with relatively high contrast (not cranked, but I'm not into staring at a dim, bad looking image either) and still, not even a "ghosting" effect when I'm done playing

I saw the pics you posted a while back - to be honest - I could barely see anything that looked like burn-in.

So again, I have to disagree. I don't see anything at all - temporary image retention, or burn-in. And trust me, I'm looking for it all the time. Honestly, this thing may as well be a CRT, it appears that stable to me.

I'm glad I wasn't scared off by your doomsaying, I'd hate to have missed out on this display because of exagerrated burn-in fears. It's unfortunate that you've had issues, but to make a blanket statement saying all plasmas are terrible technology that burn at the drop of a hat - I think that's a bit misguided.

As far as that LCD burn-in, those screens are being abused to the point of displaying static images for hundreds of hours at a time. I'm not surprised that they're burnt.....

It's not supposed to happen but it did. I just noticed burn in on my zenith LCD monitor/TV that I had used for about 10 mos as a computer monitor and watched very little TV. I brought it to vacation home as an extra bedroom TV, hooked it up and turned it on; low and behold very distinct burn in on the bottom of the screen. You can clearly see the green windows start logo and a faint blue bar. Oh am I pissed!! I had hoped it would go away by leaving the TV on several hours, but it has not improved. I guess the moral of the story is nothing is completely immune from burn in.

SkyNett, sounds like you are running console games, not PC games.


Try this... Take a PC with some desent grahics card and set the game resolution to 1280x or 1600x. Set the brightness and contrast level in the plasma TV to default. Run the pc game Need for Speed:U2. Play it for an hour or two a day, that's not much isn't it btw? well, do it. Come back here and post the result. you will be suffering from severe burnin image retention...


Unfortunately most people play console games on Plasma TV. All you have said was "Most people play games on Plasma too". That's too vague. And that is part of the discussion I've been talking about. Most people play console... not PC. I would like to hear more response from people who "actually" played lots of PC games. Even with 720p on console game the grahics are still not as sharp as running it on a high-end PC system with grahphics turned way up.


I saw the pics you posted a while back - to be honest - I could barely see anything that looked like burn-in.
you probably didn't want to see it, so you probably glanced at it quickly. Take your time and look...... carefully. Stare at it hehe. Some of the guys here saw it clearly. The pic still isn't that good to show it, it's a lot more noticeable in real life.


You know for a fact, eh? :D
I was exaggerating about that part though..

I guess the moral of the story is nothing is completely immune from burn in.
that's right:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6090460&&#post6090460

many members have reported LCD burn-in

LCD doesn't suppose to burn-in images :confused:

Sharp replaced an LC-30 for me that had burn-in

it does happen

Even with 720p on console game the grahics are still not as sharp as running it on a high-end PC system with grahphics turned way up.

Ok that's cool then, I guess I won't have any problem. I'll be playing 720p and 1080i console games on my plasma with 360/PS3, and I won't be playing PC games on it. So I have nothing to worry about. You might want to mention that you're referring to a very specific instance of playing hi-res PC games on the plasma when you mention burn-in issues though.


you probably didn't want to see it, so you probably glanced at it quickly. Take your time and look...... carefully. Stare at it hehe. Some of the guys here saw it clearly. The pic still isn't that good to show it, it's a lot more noticeable in real life.

No no, I stared at it intently, for a long while, and I came back and did it several times after. Don't forget, I was still deciding between plasma and DLP at the time, so it was of great concern to me as a hardcore gamer. It really looked like nothing - as well, if I recall correctly, didn't you ignore the break-in period and run it hot and play a lot of that game immediately? And even so, it was still just temporary image retention, and not actual permanent burn-in.

I'm well past the hundred hour mark now, and I still limit my game time, keep the contrast down on broadcast TV, use the Just mode all the time (except for certain HD shows that can't be stretched), vary my viewing material and I have the Avia disc and have calibrated the set. By the time the 360 comes out in November, I should be near, or at 1,000 hours. As confident as I am now of no burn-in, I'll be more apt to go for longer gaming sessions after that. Last night I played the new Incredible Hulk game in 720p with the contrast nice and tight for sharp, bright images, and after almost 3 hours of play, I didn't even have any image retention, much less burn-in. I've been playing the demo of it for two weeks everyday, and the game has a map in the corner, plus a dayglo green lifebar, and still, nothing whatsoever. I have a different model than you do, but still, mine's only a little more recent than yours, correct?

What can I say? Clearly my experience is markedly different than yours, perhaps in large part to the difference between console and PC gaming resolutions, as you've pointed out. :cool:

this happens more than none on flat panel pc monitors and tv sets alike. I was at my parents house the other week and had to use their cpu. They had some minor burn in on the top from the internet tool bar. My guess is that you used your set heavily for pc use.

Same thing happened to me with my hp2025 LCD. I have a nice little ghost of the taskbar and icons on the lower portion of my unit...even though, god pound it! people vehemently spit that "LCDs cannot burn-in!" :p

Guess this thread should be merged into the MASTER BURN-IN Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=444258). :)

-JR

We probably need some other termonology for this problem to avoid this issue of whether "burn-in" is happening. "Burn-in" comes form the idea of phosphors in certain parts of a plasma or CRT screen being prematurely aged or "burned" through dispropotionate use. Since an LCD array is a passive filter that doesn't emit any light of its own, "burning" - in the phosphor sense - can't be happening.

It sounds like certain pixels in the LCD matrix may take on a permanent "set" from being held in a single on or off state for many many hours - as with the Windows "start" button. Maybe we should call it something like "image lock-in."

If that is the mechanism, then the questionis whether the locked part of an LCD panel could be refreshed and restored to normal function by a certain number of hours' use without the Windows logo or whatever on there. I would think it might.

Maybe we should call it something like "image lock-in."


Lock-in Vs Burn-in :rolleyes:

Image retention is the correct term.

I left this thing on overnight and to no avail, the "image retention" persists. It's as noticable with no change. It's not that big of a deal as it is not going to be used that often. However, I pitty those who plan to purchase large LCD panels because they fear plasma burn in.

Did you try leaving the power off (unplugged from the outlet as well) for a few days? That usually works on PPC/PDAs. Might work for larger screens.

Projectors aren't immune to burn in either - had the issue with a Sony LCD projector 5 years ago.

I left this thing on overnight and to no avail, the "image retention" persists. It's as noticable with no change. It's not that big of a deal as it is not going to be used that often. However, I pitty those who plan to purchase large LCD panels because they fear plasma burn in.
Image retention is rare and the factories say it is not supposed to happen. I have only seen it once and that was with Mark Rubin's set. LCD is less prone to image retention than othe techologies. Even CRT's burn in. Look at those expensive Conrac and Sony monitors at the airport sometime. Usually the way to overcome it is with a pure bright white signal applied for 6-10 hours might do it. How long was this in use as a PC monitor? *edit* I see 10 months but how many hours a day?

I left this thing on overnight and to no avail, the "image retention" persists. It's as noticable with no change. It's not that big of a deal as it is not going to be used that often. However, I pitty those who plan to purchase large LCD panels because they fear plasma burn in.

I pity those who buy a plasma and start griping because they arent able to consistently watch a channel because of the logo, then start pesting networks to remove or modify the logo because of the set they bought. That is their mistake, not the network. People have got to take responsibility for their actions. thats what i pity.

How long was this in use as a PC monitor? *edit* I see 10 months but how many hours a day?

And was it left on continuously without a screen saver?

We have 8 notebook computers in my office that are over 5 years old and are used 10 hours per day, 5 days a week. None of these screens show any signs of image retention.

If it is in fact the Windows Taskbar that caused the image retention in your case, it may be a good idea for anyone using a flat panel (TV) display as a computer monitor to configure Windows to "Hide the Taskbar". Then the Taskbar will slide down and be invisible most of the time.


Dave

it really depends on the LCD:

Dell had to replace a large number of LCD screens in its Latitude D800 widescreen series laptops because of burn-in (image retention)issues on screens supplied to Dell by by Samsung: they went to another OEM to resolve the problem

No no, I stared at it intently, for a long while, and I came back and did it several times after. Don't forget, I was still deciding between plasma and DLP at the time, so it was of great concern to me as a hardcore gamer. It really looked like nothing - as well,
maybe it's your monitor.. maybe it's your display setting.. that maybe why you can't see it with your monitor.

the bottom line is that there were clearly burned-in ghost image on the screen and has been mentioned before it wouldn't go away for around 3 months... that's not 3 hours nor 3 days.... it's, 3 "months".


if I recall correctly, didn't you ignore the break-in period and run it hot and play a lot of that game immediately? And even so, it was still just temporary image retention, and not actual permanent burn-in.
The first thing I had done was to do the breakin for first 100 hours. I was aware of the proper breakin. Played lots of moives at full screen. Never left static images in desktop. I then played the game Need for Speed: U2 and played 1 to 2 hours a day. This has been said before. Look it up..... "1 to 2 hours" each night, didn't play it every day either.


obviously the problem was the speedometer/tach analog display being static image. But even for just 1 to 2 hours a day and about 4 th day since playing the the same game I saw the ghost image of the speedometer analog display. 1 to 2 hours? we are not even talking several hours here.

SkyNett, what model panny display are you running?

Ok then - I guess you've proved your point about running hi-res PC games on a plasma.

Fortunately, that's not anything I ever plan on doing. :D

I did some PC gaming back in 96, when consoles weren't anywhere near the power of a cutting edge PC, but with the current and near future consoles, clearly that gap has narrowed considerably....

Online, HDD, much higher resolutions....similar (or even better) processing power when compared to the latest PCs. Consoles are extremely impressive these days.

BTW, how much older is your model plasma than mine? Just curious....

SkyNett, what model panny display are you running?

*Edit* - Panny 50PX50U....

mine is a 50PHD7UY. Your model came out in what.. mid 2005? Mine came out sometime late 2004 i believe..

yes console games have gotten better. The Xbox 360 sounds quite tempting.

Yea..I believe April 05...not positive, but something like that.

I believe it is caused by the LCD polarizers failing and that's why you see such a variance between models.

If you leave the LCD backlight on high it has a greater chance in warping the polarizer which causes a bit of image retention.

I pity those who buy a plasma and start griping because they arent able to consistently watch a channel because of the logo, then start pesting networks to remove or modify the logo because of the set they bought. That is their mistake, not the network. People have got to take responsibility for their actions. thats what i pity.

Whether it is LCD or Plasma, people shouldn't feel remorse for a technology they bought. They spent the time to research it, so they should be taking responsibility for the display settings not the technology. Unfortunately most don't properly calibrate a set which kills the reliability.

this thread will be merged into the Master burn-in thread

:)

I am just past the 100 hour mark at low settings.. I wanted to kick it up a little for sports and last night I was watching the Padres game in HD with the contrast at 9, Brightness at +3 It looked fantastic! when I turned the TV off, I could see the Score image on the top corner, with the TV off!.. I was a little stressed but went to sleep soon after.. this morning, I didn't notice it, on or off. Is this normal? I like my new settings for sports and don't want to go back to dim during football season, but don't want burn in either..

Delligatti

I'm not sure what PDP you have, but I run my PX50U using the Standard setting with the Picture at +15 and Brightness set to -3. There have been occasions where immediately after powering off the TV... faint outlines of images are retained on the screen which fade from view in a couple of minutes. I've observed the same behavior on my CRT HD-ready TV. I believe this is normal and nothing to be concerned about provided you vary your viewing habits and don't make excessive use of torch mode settings.

I'm not sure what PDP you have, but I run my PX50U using the Standard setting with the Picture at +15 and Brightness set to -3. There have been occasions where immediately after powering off the TV... faint outlines of images are retained on the screen which fade from view in a couple of minutes. I've observed the same behavior on my CRT HD-ready TV. I believe this is normal and nothing to be concerned about provided you vary your viewing habits and don't make excessive use of torch mode settings.


Optivity, Sorry, I have the 42PX50U Thanks for the reply! I think I(We) should be able to watch a whole game with optimal settings(+9, +3 )... without being paranoid that it will burn the screen. I do watch a lot of different material so I guess I should not be worried. When I turned the TV off last night to go to bed, when I passed the screen, I saw the image and shook my head, thinking, you
ve got to be kidding... I watched the game for maybe 1/2 and hour.. At least it is gone now. Anyway, thanks again.

Sounds like temporary image retention, not permanent burn-in, from your description. Don't sweat it. Just follow all the recommended advice and you should be fine. I had that same problem but only during the first couple months of use. Haven't seen any image retention since.

Just bought my first plasma and I think I oversold the concern of burn-in to the wife. I don't have an A/V receiver in my setup, just an SA8300HD, plasma display, and dvd player. Is there such a thing as a screen saver function on A/V receivers? My goal would be to program a screen saver image to pop up after 2 hours of viewing on SD channels that have the side bars. Unfortunately, the wife doesn't like the zooming or stretching idea to make the side bars go away.

Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance.

I have just bought my first plasma too. It is an Hi Def Panasonic, model no TH37PV500.

I too am slightly concerned re stories of burn in.

I have connected my Xbox, Sky Plus box, and my Sony 5.1 theatre system.

I very rarely watch anything in 14:9 or 4:3 and if i did i would change the aspect to stretch the picture so i dont get the grey lines, and i dont mind doing this. The two areas which do concern me slightly are TV logos and Video games.

I have turned the brightness, contrast, and sharpness down to less than 50%, as i have read that this will help in the early days.

The only screen saver option that i can find enables you to adjust the side panel for when watching something that doesn't fill the screen, and as said that doesn't concern me as i would stretch the image anyway. I cant find any more info in the instruction manual regarding any anti burn in/screensaver features etc. Does anyone know if there are any anti-burn in features built into this model?

Is it safe to play video games for say 2/3 hours uniterrupted? Are there any precautions i should take, other than turning brightness down?

If anybody is familiar with this model or can offer any general advice, it would be most appreaciated.

Thanks, and sorry for the long first post :confused:

Hey Guys,
My Pio 5050HD is coming a Saturday Sept 10th. I am going to be calibrating it using AVIA right away and then I will let it play Discover HD and some DVD's (no bars!) all night. Will I be able to watch the NFL games in HD the next day or is the plasma too young to have the score overlay up? I change games pretty often but all of the games have score overlays. I will also stretch the picture durring commercials so they take up teh full screen. Any recomendations or warnings guys? Thanks.
-Evangelo2

Hey Guys,
My Pio 5050HD is coming a Saturday Sept 10th. I am going to be calibrating it using AVIA right away and then I will let it play Discover HD and some DVD's (no bars!) all night. Will I be able to watch the NFL games in HD the next day or is the plasma too young to have the score overlay up? I change games pretty often but all of the games have score overlays. I will also stretch the picture durring commercials so they take up teh full screen. Any recomendations or warnings guys? Thanks.
-Evangelo2

Make sure there are no logos if you play discovery HD all night. I would stick with DVDs but be careful that it doesn't flip back to the DVD menu. You don't want to be on the menu for the majority of the night.

this seems to make no sense to me...are you telling me that after 100 hours, i can have an image sit there forever and itll not burn in??? are the pixels going to burn up if the brightness is too high for the first 100 hours??? i have the vizio 50 inch PD50, and ive had some images stay for a little bit, such as the gray side bars on espnHD, but they go away. it seems to me, that you should watch the set the way youre going to watch it from day one...you want to see if something is going to go wrong watching it that way while its still under warranty or can be returned. can someone please explain this to where it will make sense? or is there some FAQ thread on here that attempts to explain where this number that keep being bandied about on here came from. Thanks.

mods, please dont merge this thread...i know theres burn-in threads...im just asking specifically about this mythical 100 hour number...plus id like to know about this "phosphors havent aged yet" thing that is mentioned in the main thread but not really explained. plus the link in that thread to the FAQs for burn-in doesnt work anymore.

this seems to make no sense to me...are you telling me that after 100 hours, i can have an image sit there forever and itll not burn in???.

Of course not.

You still have to be careful not to have static images on your plasma for too long.

But after 100 hours (or 200 hours), the chance of a permanent burn-in is much less.

Put it another way, during the first 100-200 hours the risk of burn-in is higher (unacceptably high to some).

You are asking a very good question, dtrell - plasma manufacturers such as Matsushita (Panasonic) tell their customers to jump through assorted hoops during the first 100 hours of plasma usage but don't really try to quantify the risks of burn-in during the first 100 hours versus subsequent pixel lifetime.

Why are the first 100 hours so important?

Is there a phosphor efficiency dropoff during the first 100 hours which later stabilizes?

Where is the data?

exactly wojtek...i want to know the rationale behind this....autmobiles used to have break in periods...they dont anymore.

can someone please explain this to where it will make sense? or is there some FAQ thread on here that attempts to explain where this number that keep being bandied about on here came from.

Oh yee of little faith. The 100 hour break-in period came from PANASONIC themselves. They do say to still be careful for the next 900 hours of use after the initial break-in period, but they seem to be focused on the initial 100 hours.

Excerpt from Panasonic White Paper:

"Plasma Break-In"

"Like a fine new automobile, the performance of a plasma TV can be optimized by allowing a break-in period. By properly following these simple break-in instructions, you should be rewarded with long-term enjoyment of your plasma TV.

Plasma phosphors are most susceptible to image retention in the first hundred hours of use. The panel becomes considerably less sensitive to burn-in after this period.

Very often, televisions, including plasma, are shipped from the factory with the contrast control at a high setting to provide a bright picture under typical dealer showroom lighting conditions. In your home, the room light levels are usually one half or less than that in retail showrooms. The contrast control may need to be lowered in your home for comfortable contrast levels that do not induce eye strain.

When the plasma is initially installed, videophiles say it is best to do the following:

· Make sure the display is in a viewing mode (aspect ratio) that completely fills the screen (there are often three or more settings from which to choose). The panel is shipped in this condition, in what is called the “Just” mode.

· Turn down the picture control (contrast) to 50% or less.

· Briefly engage the 4:3 mode to confirm the side bars are set to mid-gray (there is usually an adjustment in the Set Up menu that takes the sidebars from black to gray) to minimize the chance of burn-in.

· Return the set to a “full screen” (Just, Zoom, Full) position during the first hundred hours of use.

· During the first hundred hours of use it is best not to view the same channel for extended periods. This should prevent channel logos and other fixed images found on some channels from being retained.

· Avoid any static images (video games, computer images, DVD title screens, etc.) during the hundred-hour break-in.



After the hundred-hour break-in period, during the next nine-hundred hours:

· Continue to retain the picture setting at 50% or less.

· Limit the use of 4:3 aspect ratio mode (traditional picture size that does not fill the entire screen) to 15% of viewing time.

· Limit the use of static images (computer, video games, etc.) to less than 10% of viewing time.


After one-thousand viewing hours, panels are much less likely to experience image burn-in."


>> Link to Panasonic White Paper << (http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_electronics/pressroom/cont2.asp?Filter=12&cont_id=822)

I first learned of the the 100 hours from an ISF calibrator when I was doing the Jersey Shore Shootout ( a side by side test of a Pioneer Pro 1000 and a Fujitsu P50): he would not come out until I had at least 100 hours on the new P50 explaining that the first 100 hours are when most of the phosphor wear takes place

Then I read where some manufacturers (Pioneer was one of the first) do a factory break-in of new plasmas and they claim this makes them much less likely to exhibit burn-in once shipped

I am a firm believer of a 100 hour break in: it is simply a procedure where you turn down the contrast/brightness from torch mode on a new plasma, and run it full screen with moving images (avoid logos or icons or static pictures) for 100 hours

exactly wojtek...i want to know the rationale behind this....autmobiles used to have break in periods...they dont anymore.

And as we all know, modern automobile engines are technologically very similar to Plasma panels :D

thats good randy..lol...but you know what i mean..the point is that they finally realized that it wasnt necessary...plus i dont have a panasonic..LOL

..autmobiles used to have break in periods...they dont anymore.

Really ? Was that some kind of technology break through or just over the top marketing ?

I had a friend who used to claim you broke in an engine the way you wanted to use it. If you were going to race it, you should jump on it hard from the get go.

I've never been a big gear head as I find all those stop signs counter productive to big engines.

OT

engine break in is not a myth either

remember when Mercury outboards went to a lower oil mixture? they stressed a break in procedure as essential to engine life

they still do, but it is down to only 2 hours (they do run in/break in as part of factory acceptance testing too):

http://www.mercurymarine.com/optimax_faqs

Make sure there are no logos if you play discovery HD all night. I would stick with DVDs but be careful that it doesn't flip back to the DVD menu. You don't want to be on the menu for the majority of the night.

Hey ren,
What if I make my own dvd on the computer that has a plain white menu and nothing else. Would this work? Then there are no logos, no menus to fear or anything else.
discovery HD does sometimes put logos up but they are only up for short periods of time and then dissapear.
More importantly, will I be able to watch the Sunday NFL games in HD or will the score overlay hurt my plasma since this will be within the first 50 hours? I will be changing channels but the score overlay may be up for 15-20 minute clips.
-Evangelo2

OT further,

Mark, I recently heard an auto expert on a talk show explain that car break in was a myth. Hard to know where the truth is on these things.

EDIT: Actually, now that I think of it the guy was talking about cars needing to be "warmed up" by idling for some time before driving (especially in winter). He said it's not needed and if anything is worse than simply driving the car immediately. But I'm also pretty sure I've heard the car break-in stuff is a myth too.

Well, I for one plan on putting my newly ordered 42" panny 8UK through the 100 hour break-in. Can I deal with altering my viewing habits for 100 hours? Sure..... Heck, if there is ANYTHING I can do to prolong the life of my investment, let alone helping to prevent burn-in, I will consider it.

1,000 miles of break in on your car, 100 hours of break in on your plasma.

This will kill whom exactly?

Well worth it.

you want best protection? do the breakin forever, not 1000 hours but forever...

next time i buy another plasma, im going to breakin forever. :D

I'll write back in 5 years if I live to regret it, but right now I refuse to alter my viewing habits to suit the TV. I bought the thing to entertain me, not the other way around.

Don't get me wrong, I admire those of you who can monitor your viewing habits, and avoid watching any 4:3 or 2.40:1 material for 100 hours (which would be about a year given the amount of TV I watch), and keep track of those hours, and do something else for the next 900 hours, etc., etc.

I'm just saying that if you're not one of those people, and you just turn the thing on and watch it, you've got at least some company.

Break it IN ~ or ~ Break IT.
Even with the suggested settings ( Picture @ 50% or less ) the display will change , and thats good ! at least you know that what your doing is right.
I plan on going thru the 1000 hr`s of total break - in on my new XS955.
I may have got a great deal , but hey , money is money , and why waste it.
The only problem is the time , how do you know when 1000 hr`s are up :confused: , SO , I`m guessing with my viewing habbits , i figure about 100~150 hr`s per month.
So by sometime next Feb. or March , I should have a fully broken-in display.
I have a feeling I`ll know when it`s ready for calibration and some fun , like I said the tv has already changed with out me changing the settings , so I think I`ll turn it on someday and say "well now your all set" !
Lets go buy a video game :D ( system , it`s been a while )
Gary

I'll write back in 5 years if I live to regret it, but right now I refuse to alter my viewing habits to suit the TV. I bought the thing to entertain me, not the other way around.

Don't get me wrong, I admire those of you who can monitor your viewing habits, and avoid watching any 4:3 or 2.40:1 material for 100 hours (which would be about a year given the amount of TV I watch), and keep track of those hours, and do something else for the next 900 hours, etc., etc.

I'm just saying that if you're not one of those people, and you just turn the thing on and watch it, you've got at least some company.

LOL. I'm doing the 100 hour break-in, but 1000 hours - forgetaboutit!! :eek: Count me in the group that "...bought the thing to entertain me, not the other way around."

Wonder why it is 100 hours and not 70 hour, 80 hours, 90 hours or even 110 hours...

100 Hours sounds arbitrary...

Loren:

Panasonic really wants you to watch what your doing for the first 1000 (see link in post #4)
Actually, Loren, 1000 sounds about right. Using that number the exponential decay would then give you about 2.3% phosphor efficiency loss. (100 hours is only about 0.03% reduction). Given that a ghost image, burn-in, or retention image's pixel's contrast compared to a 'good' pixel would be on that order - 1000 hrs makes sense.

Do many of you plasma owners use your set for alot of gaming?

I have just bought a Panny and am not using it for gaming for the first 100 hrs. The white paper says limit gaming to 10% of viewing time for the next 900hrs.

I really dont want to damage my set by burn in but on the other hand i have i have bought the set for my entertainment and dont want to waste it.

I would like to know how much gaming fellow owners do and what type of games do you play (just so i know what static images are on your display).

100 hours of break in on your plasma.

This will kill whom exactly?

Well worth it.

Can you do the burn in by just leaving the TV on with full screen content for 4 days? Would that automatically take care of it?

If that's the case, then why don't the manufacturers just do it themselves? How difficult would it be to burn the TV's in for 100 hours? Seems like it would be a great selling point if it really worked: "Buy our plasma's, already burned in!"

Can you do the burn in by just leaving the TV on with full screen content for 4 days? Would that automatically take care of it?


Yes

this is what I did: left on TV Land (before they had the logo on so much) 24/7 for 4 days

It would cost a lot of money for mfrs. to leave every single TV running on the assembly line for 4 days. It would make "break in" the "Herbie" (see: "The Goal") of the assembly line and would limit throughput.

I've been thinking about this as well: If I run my TV for 3 hours a day (much more than I usually watch), it would take almost a year to finish the break-in period. If I get a new TV in 3 years, it would have spent a third of its life in the break-in period...

At any rate, Panasonic makes the following claim of their 8-series plasmas:

"Newly developed phosphor boosts resistance to static-image burning to the same level as CRT displays"

Given that Panasonic also advocates the break-in period, what do they mean here? Their plasmas have the same burn-in resistance as CRTs, but only after 1000 hours of break-in? Or that CRTs also have a 1000-hour break-in period? Or that their new displays don't need a break-in period?

I understand that the new displays are much more resistant to bburn in than the older ones, and have a longer lifespan. This paper is dated November 2004. Which displays were current then, and how to they differ from the displays now? There is no reference to break in in the owners manual for the current 500u.

From their current website Plasma FAQ:

1. I've heard that plasma TVs can burn-in over time. What is burn-in exactly, and is it really a concern?
Burn-in, which is an uneven aging of the phosphors in a display device, can occur on any display that uses phosphors to generate an image, including tube TVs, projection TVs that use CRTs, and plasma TVs. Such uneven aging happens when bright, static images are left onscreen for an extended period of time, which can leave a permanent "shadow" that is always visible. It often occurs because the contrast and brightness settings on the TV are too high. Use common sense when it comes to your plasma TV; don't pause video games or watch TV stations with station logos onscreen for long periods of time, and use one of the many display calibration DVDs available today for properly setting brightness and contrast.


Again, no mention of break in periods, although it is hard to find a TV station without a #%&*@ logo on the screen anymore.

All this being said, I am planning on being careful for the first hundred hours, and keeping the contrast and brightness down to reasonable levels after that. I am a little worried that sometimes my ultimate TV receivers get stuck and don't go to screen saver.

-Drew

This IDC whitepaper sponsored by Pioneer is an interesting read that addresses some of the issues being discussed here:

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pio/pe/images/portal/cit_3424/273087528Pioneer%20DTV%20White%20Paper%20-%20FINAL.pdf

Before testing plasma against LCD and CRT, all displays were run continuously for 4 weeks, calibrated according to THX test patterns, which would lead me to believe that contrast (picture) was set to "normal", which may have been greater than 50%.

"The TVs were initially calibrated on brightness, contrast, and sharpness using common THX tools found on many movie DVDs prior to its 4 weeks of continuous playback (the equivalent of two hours a day for almost one year). Measurements were taken and the TVs were returned to factory settings. Image retention testing was then done by leaving the menu from the game Half-Life 2 on the screen for 48 hours, replicating what would happen if someone accidentally left a static image on their TV while they went away for the weekend."

For those who don't want to read the whole paper, here are the conclusions that IDC came to at the end of the study:

"So what’s the verdict on plasma? Our test results and other research show that, while there may be a tiny glimmer of truth in some of these statements, they are all myths. Plasma TVs are an excellent choice for consumers who are willing to pay the relatively high price for these displays and want accurate image recreation, particularly in viewing environments with controlled lighting.

First, while image retention can occur in modern plasmas, the effect is temporary. After the 48-hour torture test, all three of the plasma TVs that were tested showed clearly visible images from the game menu, whereas none of the LCD or MD rearprojection-based sets showed any image retention. However, after regular video material (a DVD movie set to continuously loop) was played through the sets for 24 hours, the image completely disappeared from all three plasmas, leaving no trace. Unlike early generation plasmas, where those type of images would not go away and could actually "burn" onto the screen, modern plasma TVs enjoy a combination of more robust screen materials and subtle image-shifting technologies that have rendered this former issue moot.

Second, the accelerated aging tests show that plasma TVs maintain consistent image quality and brightness even after extending viewing. The image quality of all televisions (and all displays, for that matter) degrade somewhat over time, but in our tests plasmas results were typically within 5% of their "out of the box" performance at the conclusion of our testing. While this is not a definitive statement on product lifetimes --- true lifetime tests are impossible without a several year test cycle --- it is a reasonable proxy of extended performance. In fact, many plasma TV vendors now claim 60,000-hour lifetimes (translated: 8 hours of daily viewing for more than 20 years before the screen reaches half of its original brightness).

Third, when measuring black levels, the plasma TVs as a group actually outperformed the reference CRT monitor as well as the TVs using the other two technologies. The tangible benefit of this is that a deeper range of colors can be displayed, which translates into a richer overall picture.

Fourth, the viewing angles for plasma TVs were the most consistent of all the TV types tested. In other words, regardless of where you are in the room, the image quality on a plasma will look very similar. Also, even if you’re seated in a fixed position, you won’t be able to see any difference when, for example, a person walks across the screen or a football flies from one end of the screen to the other.

Fifth, although the absolute brightness of plasma TVs is lower than other TV technologies, it is the most consistent from side-to-side, making "hotspots" or "deadspots" less likely, regardless of where you view the TV from within a room. The LCD TVs and microdisplay rear projection sets that were tested had brighter pictures when viewed head on, which could make them a better choice in rooms where viewing positions are limited and the lighting cannot always be controlled (such as those with lots of natural sunlight). When tested from different angles, however, both the overall brightness and the color performance varied on the sets using LCD and microdisplay rear projection technologies.

Finally, when it comes to color accuracy, the end goal for all televisions continues to be SMPTE (Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers) standards, which are red, green, and blue color frequency specifications that Hollywood producers adhere to in the mastering of their content. We found that plasma TVs generated colors that were closest to that of HD SMPTE, particularly with low brightness (e.g., movies) signals.

Of course, there’s more to the TV purchase decision than performance—price, in particular, plays a critical role. In that regard, the plasma TVs were the most expensive option tested, with an average price of $3,999, versus $3,599 for LCD and $2,266 for microdisplay rear projection."

/steve

While we are on the subject of burn-in, this is an interesting tid-bit (I believe this fellow once posted this information on this forum as well, but I've never been able to find it again...but I found it on the "other" AVSforum):

"As an aside here is a little anecdotal evidence for anyone worrying about burn-in to chew on. Where I work we currently have a few 'displays' in the lobbies of our buildings. One of them is a grid of 32 plasmas mounted on the ceiling of the lobby that all display a fixed image for 6 hours at a time switched 4 times a day. They are on 24/7 and 16 of them have been for almost 18 months now. 16 were added ~2 months ago. The 18 month old ones are series 5 Panasonics and the new ones are series 6. When we took the old ones down a month ago to clean them up and do work on the ceiling we were interested to see if there was burn-in or other problems (dead pixels, lowered brightness). I was particularly interested because at the time I was shopping for a new TV and had had 4 different displays (and 4 different technologies) in my house for the previous ~4 months. I hadn't even considered plasma because I was certain they were too 'fragile' for real world use.

The 16 displays we took down had no burn-in and were just as bright as the brand new plasmas after almost 12,000 hours of use. The 'half-brightness' time on the 5 series Panasonics is 30k hours, if I recall correctly. Since then I've taken the burn-in warnings and lifetime expectancies with a grain of salt.

From this thread here. (http://forum.**********/showthread.php?postid=52138)

First time poster, and I wanted to say thanks to everyone here for all the helpful information. I have read this ENTIRE thread, along with many other helpful threads here on AVS related to TV purchases.

After doing a lot of research -- including plenty with my own eyes -- I finally settled on a Pansonic 42PX50U. Just got the set on Saturday and absolutely love it.

I have applied the advice to my break-in -- I'm watching all full screen broadcasts, have set the picture and brightness to -7 and -1 respectively, and am avoiding any prolonged logo exposure during this initial time.

My question relates to videogames: can you play at all during the initial 100 hours? I know to avoid anything with static images like a speedometer, but what about sports games like Madden and MVP baseball? They have static images such as score overlays, but those get removed during the course of playing. For instance, Madden is about 20-30 seconds where the overlay is present, then 10-15 seconds where it isn't. Is that good enough during the initial stages? Also, if you only play for 30-60 minutes at a time, is that considered reasonable?

It sounds like there are no real problems with gaming after the break-in (if you are reasonable, which I am, usually no more than 1-2 hours at a time). Just want to see if others played games during their break-in periods. Thanks.

Trust me bro - just relax and enjoy your display. Yes, I gamed on my PX50U right away, I just made sure to limit my gaming time - say, no more than an hour or so at a pop.

Now that I'm at almost 300 hours, I play for up to 3 or 4 hours with no problems. No image retention at all. I'm playing the new Hulk game currently with bright, razor sharp textures at 720p, plus it has a map, and a bright green life bar, and I see no image retention when I turn it off - and believe me I'm looking for it. None whatsoever.

Calibrate, follow break-in guidelines, and enjoy. And it's ok to do some gaming - definitely. :cool:

Thanks, Sky Nett. I figured as much. MVP in particular seemed like it would be okay -- it doesn't really have any more static overlays than your typical baseball broadcast, and the score overlay changes positions based on left/right batters. And I just had to see it in 720p :)

I do plan to be extra careful upfront, but the occasional XBox foray is hard to resist.

hmm..sounds like from the last two posts and their anecdotal evidence, that plasma burn in periods on todays plasmas are a crock...i think my question is being answered...

threads merged!

hmm..sounds like from the last two posts and their anecdotal evidence, that plasma burn in periods on todays plasmas are a crock...i think my question is being answered...

Well, nobody said you shouldn't follow the break-in guidelines for the first few hundred hours, but yes, I can attest to the fact that my Panny has no kind of issues at this point, and I've seen absolutely NO evidence of image retention, much less burn-in. And I'm gaming, watching SD/HD broadcast, and watching tons of movies.

That said, I can only speak for my make and model. People with others may have a different experience.

New Pannys kick ass, that I can say. :D

Are LCD screens (tv and pc moniters) also capable of suffering from burn in? I notice that only plasma's are being mentioned here...

Just got a LCD pc moniter, and wondered if the web browser and taskbar could create burn ins during prolonged use...

Hey ren,
What if I make my own dvd on the computer that has a plain white menu and nothing else. Would this work? Then there are no logos, no menus to fear or anything else.
discovery HD does sometimes put logos up but they are only up for short periods of time and then dissapear.
More importantly, will I be able to watch the Sunday NFL games in HD or will the score overlay hurt my plasma since this will be within the first 50 hours? I will be changing channels but the score overlay may be up for 15-20 minute clips.
-Evangelo2

Earlier in this thread, I brought up this same idea that a total white screen would guarantee even wear of the phosphors and at the same time accelerate the break-in of the screen.

Theoretically this would work, but there was some concern that a white screen, which is 100% brightness for all the RBG phosfors, would cause some undue stress to not only the screen but to the electonics as well. I can also imagine that a white screen would create a lot of heat.

You have the right idea though. I would suggest a grey screen instead of a white screen. The grey screen would accomplish the same thing, and not put as much stress on the plasma as white for an extended period of time. Again, this is untested so be careful and do it at your own risk. Good luck.

I've noticed in a few threads, some people are talking about looping a DVD of colors, or some such thing in order to "get through the break-in period."

What means this? Is there potential damage to avoid by doing this? :confused:

I'm about to get the 42PHD8UK, and don't want to screw anything up, it being my first plasma and all...

Thanks.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=444258

I've noticed in a few threads, some people are talking about looping a DVD of colors, or some such thing in order to "get through the break-in period."

What means this? Is there potential damage to avoid by doing this? :confused:

I'm about to get the 42PHD8UK, and don't want to screw anything up, it being my first plasma and all...

Thanks.Why age the phosphors at a faster rate than necessary? This sounds like a pretty dumb idea to me.

Instead I recommend you follow the manufacturers guidelines regarding the break in procedures to use for your new PDP.

Link To --> "Plasma Facts and Myths Panasonic Presents Advice From the Video Purist Perspective" (http://www.fcw.com/vendorsolutions/panasonicplasma.pdf#search='plasma%20panasonic%20white%20pap er')

So... it just guards against burn-in?

If the break-in period is listed in that thread, just let me know... I don't want to go filter through 23 pages about burn-in to find it.

Thanks for the info.

Why age the phosphors at a faster rate than necessary? This sounds like a pretty dumb idea to me.

Instead I recommend you follow the manufacturers guidelines regarding the break in procedures to use for your new PDP.

Link To --> "Plasma Facts and Myths Panasonic Presents Advice From the Video Purist Perspective" (http://www.fcw.com/vendorsolutions/panasonicplasma.pdf#search='plasma%20panasonic%20white%20pap er')

Now THAT is helpful. Thanks, optivity!

Are LCD screens (tv and pc moniters) also capable of suffering from burn in? I notice that only plasma's are being mentioned here...

Just got a LCD pc moniter, and wondered if the web browser and taskbar could create burn ins during prolonged use...

No, this is really an issue with CRT projection sets, CRT Tvs and Plasma TVs. The worst case I ever saw was with a CRT set in an office. Someone had left the "Video 1" input on the screen and the TV stayed on all weekend with no signal. By Tuesday (a long weekend), the "Video 1" was permanently on the screen.
I am on my second plasma and I can say from experience that burn-in is much more apt to happen early in the PDP's life. I bought my first plasma three years ago and fell asleep watching a DVD. At the end, the disc went back to the menu and sat there for about two hours. I turned it off, but the image was still there. I ended up looping the white to black test on the Avia DVD setup disc over and over for an hour and it took the burn-in away.
I never had a problem again even thought the same thing with DVD menus and Tivo menus happened at least a couple more times over the three year period.

So... it just guards against burn-in?

If the break-in period is listed in that thread, just let me know... I don't want to go filter through 23 pages about burn-in to find it.

Thanks for the info.

Break in on Panasonic PDP's (and others I assume) is 100 hours. Then they suggest limiting 4x3 material and static images for the next 1000 hours to somewhere between 10 and 20% of viewing.

I for one like the scaler in the PDP and the "just" setting enought that I let my Panny handle all 480i programming in that mode- DVD's are my biggest concern- it seems 75% are now in the 2:35 aspect ratio.

Are LCD screens (tv and pc moniters) also capable of suffering from burn in? I notice that only plasma's are being mentioned here...

Just got a LCD pc moniter, and wondered if the web browser and taskbar could create burn ins during prolonged use...

Although many may say it's impossible, I have uneven ware on my LCD, and a few other forum regulars have reported the same.

Mine "uneven wear/image retention/burn-in" is present where my taskbar used to rest. You can see a faint outline of it, as well as a few icons and their colors.

-JR

Newbie here. Bought my Plasma 3 weeks ago. I love the picture, and I love the TV.
A couple of questions:
I notice plenty of image retention. My direct TV guide menu always stays even if it is only on for a short time (less then 5 minutes), and if the picture is squeezed (black bars on the top and bottom) I notice those areas are lighter then the rest of the TV. The effect is only visible on a completely black screen, and cannot be seen if there is a picture up. Logos also seem to retain quickly (usually ESPN), again it can't be seen except on a black screen and do not affect the picture at all as far as I can tell. It always goes away, but yesterday my girlfriend’s mother left the TV on all day accidentally (on a regular channel, nothing was static on the screen) and last night it seemed to happen much quicker then usual. I have the contrast, brightness and tint all down less then 50%. Is this kind of image retention normal? Is it a sign I could get burn-in? Does the fact that the TV was on all day mean that it was hotter thereby causing the image retention to happen quicker? Is this kind of image retention normal, or am I abusing my TV? I watch approx 3 hours a day, longer on weekends, and always strecth the picture so there are no black bars (sometimes I can't on letterbox which is where I got the black bars on the top and bottom last night, but this is a very small part of my viewing habits).Any help with this would be appreciated; I don't want to ruin my new TV.

Also does anyone know what generation my plasma is? I think it is last years, but I am not sure.

Any advice and/or comments would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Rich:
I know you're familiar specifically with Halo 2 - do you (or anyone else) have an idea of the plasma burn-in risk of playing a game like Halo2 with static images such as radars, etc.? We're probably talking about potential 3-5 hour sittings, but with at least equal periods of non-Halo time in between sittings. Would plasma be a poor choice?

Rich:
I know you're familiar specifically with Halo 2 - do you (or anyone else) have an idea of the plasma burn-in risk of playing a game like Halo2 with static images such as radars, etc.? We're probably talking about potential 3-5 hour sittings, but with at least equal periods of non-Halo time in between sittings. Would plasma be a poor choice?

CPanther95, I recently played Metal Gear solid 3 for about 5 hours straight (this game has a life gauge and other static images on the screen) and there is NO sign of image retention. I have a Panasonic TH-50X50U.

I recently became unsatisfied with my calibrated settings (too dark) that I have had since I purchased the PDP. I left my video game menu up for about 30 minutes and had noticeable image retention. of course, it went away quickly enough after I watched some other material for about 30 seconds. I haven't noticed any other image retention and certainly never saw it when using my calibrated settings. I will now be getting ISF calibration since my 300 hour break in period is over.

Aaron

El Jefe,

My advice would be to run a DVD loop on your plasma overnight for about a week or so to speed up the aging process a bit. Set your loop starting point somewhere near the beginning of the 1.85 (16:9) aspect ratio movie (to fill the whole sccreen), and somewhere near the end, set the end of the loop. As soon as you set the end of the loop, your player will jump to the beginning of the loop. Let your player run continuously. You can still watch TV programs because you would be using a different signal input. Meanwhile the DVD player could keep going; it's just that its signal would be not used by the plasma.

I did this with my recently purchased Panny 50PX50U. And I watched a significant amount of SD programming during this time. Absolutely no hint of any burn-in. By the way, the Panny's default "black bars" for SD programs are bright grey.

--Ernie

Rich:
I know you're familiar specifically with Halo 2 - do you (or anyone else) have an idea of the plasma burn-in risk of playing a game like Halo2 with static images such as radars, etc.? We're probably talking about potential 3-5 hour sittings, but with at least equal periods of non-Halo time in between sittings. Would plasma be a poor choice?

Plasma is a fine choice. I used to play Halo2 a ton, and still play long sessions of games with static images, such as PGR2, Ghost Recon2, Ninja Gaiden, Mercanaries, etc. I've never had a problem with image retention.

It might be interesting if we have some sort of image retention + settings + hours report. I'm not sure what it'd accomplish, but it might be fun to see what sort of image retention people are seeing in "somewhat" controlled environments.

Perhaps tonight I'll turn on my TV with all the lights out, and test out some games and movies and see what sort of image retention I get. I could post my tv, it's settings, the games/videos, how long I leave them up and what sort of image retention I see after....might be fun.

-JR

Question for the guru's. I passed my 100 hour burn in period and popped in a video game NHL 2K6. After the first day I noticed it had the side bars and I didnt know how to get rid of them? Anyways this morning I saw that the left side of the TV had the bar burned in. I am crushed. is their anyway to get rid of this, or how to get rid of the bars when playing this game. Thanks for the help!

It's just image retention. Run some SD content on your set at "FULL" mode for several hours. You'll see those black bars go away. Your set may also have a mode or function for erasing image retention.

Did you calibrate your set using Avia? I would run a cheap calibration (don't pay for one yet). This will help with image retention problems (although not the black bars on the sides.)

It's just image retention. Run some SD content on your set at "FULL" mode for several hours. You'll see those black bars go away. Your set may also have a mode or function for erasing image retention.

Did you calibrate your set using Avia? I would run a cheap calibration (don't pay for one yet). This will help with image retention problems (although not the black bars on the sides.)

Thanks for the reply. I looped a DVD while I went out to watch football and it seems to have gone away somewhat in the upper area. I now have football on in just mode in SD(do not have HD until saturday). I did calabrate using Avia. I guess I will keep running DVD's or Tv's and will read through the thread again to get some help.

I thought LCDs were supposed to be immune from burn in?

I saw a wide LCD that was showing sure burn-in like an old Pac Man screen converted to play Pole Position.

It was a touch screen in an art museum display. I assume it spends most of the day displaying the museum logo until someone comes along and touches the screen. Touching the screen and moving on to other options leaves the image of the logo stuck on the screen.

I thought this was supposedly not possible? It was definitely an LCD - approximately 15" - 17" diagonal.

-Justin

Everything can get burn in. I've seen CRT's with extreme burn in, so bad you could see it with the TV turned off.

There have been some isolated reports (such as yours) on this forum about LCD burn-in. I suppose the best we can say is that LCD is generally not susceptible to burn-in, however apparently exceptions do occur.

Its not possible.
What youre seeing isnt burn in, its a type of image retention.
The crystals in an LCD "twist", blocking or allowing light to pass through. If they remain twisted to a single position for an extended amount of time, its more difficult for them to twist to other positions and thus creating what looks like burn in of the image they where creating. The difference is that retention is reversable, burn in is not. You can return the crystals to their normal flexibility by exercising them. But ive seen cases where the LCD has been abused so badly (24/7 static images) that even after exercising the crystals you can still see an image.

Its not possible.
What youre seeing isnt burn in, its a type of image retention.
The crystals in an LCD "twist", blocking or allowing light to pass through. If they remain twisted to a single position for an extended amount of time, its more difficult for them to twist to other positions and thus creating what looks like burn in of the image they where creating. The difference is that retention is reversable, burn in is not. You can return the crystals to their normal flexibility by exercising them. But ive seen cases where the LCD has been abused so badly (24/7 static images) that even after exercising the crystals you can still see an image.

what ever you call it: it is true that LCD's can burn in to a point where the condition is irreversible

Sharp replaced an out of warranty LC-30 for me that had surveilance images clearly burned in to the screen: I could read the captions of the four scenes with the LCD turned off: and I tried everything to reverse the condition with no luck

Nearly every type of display can exhibit burn in or whatever you want to call it: an LCD is probably least susceptible but it does happen

ps: this thread will be merged into 'Master burn in thread'

Thanks for the help with my ghosting questions. From what I have read this seems to be a common thing. Another couple of questions maybe someone can help me with:

1. Uneven wear. When ever I turn my TV on (Philips 42pf9956/37) The channel # (or AV input) the audio set up (whether it is in surround/normal etc), and the picture format all show up in very bright yellow. This always ghosts, but goes away quickly. My question is, I have been checking the screen (I turn it on with no signal so I can see a lit up black screen) and that area the screen seems to be lighter then the rest of the screen. Is this possible or am I imagining things. I watch almost exclusively full screen. The direct TV menu is in that area as well so it may be contributing. The area does not look like anything and is unnoticeable when there is a signal, but it seems to be a streaky area that is lighter then rest. Think of it as a dirty section on a clean window. Anyone ever heard of this?
2. I have something called dynamic contrast. It adjusts the screen settings continuously while the picture is on. I set my brightness, contrast, and sharpness to less then 50%, but when I put on the dynamic contrast menu I can see everything adjusting, including the sharpness, brightness, and contrast. I am particularly concerned with the sharpness which hovers somewhere around 70-73. Is this messing with my settings or is it adjusting to 70-73% of my settings? The sharpness menu choice only allows me to go between 1-7 (Mine is set to 3) so I don’t know what this is actually doing. Any help would be appreciated. Hope I was clear.

Okay, okay, I know about all the brightness/contrast settings and the burn-in risks associated with them now, so please skip the sermonizing when reading this post.

I just purchased a brand new Panasonic TH-42PX50U 42" plasma TV about three weeks ago. I had been watching the TV with the brightness and contrast set to what I thought looked good (+5 for brightness, contrast at +30). This Friday, my wife and I watched the ReactNow tribute concert on VH1 classic. About 2 hours into this 4 1/2 hour-long show, I noticed that the VH1 logo at the bottom right had not moved during the entire broadcast. I then changed the channel for a couple minutes, hoping this break might avoid the risk of burn-in. I turned the channel back and watched the concert for about another hour, then turned the TV off. Yesterday when I went to watch a DVD, the TV show that my TV was on flashed up a white background, and there it was: the stupid VH1 logo. It's burned in. I can only see it when the screen is totally white or totally black, but it's there and it's noticeable. I ran some "snow" from a broadcast TV station that doesn't come in for a couple hours last night, which seemed to make the logo fade a bit, but it's still there. My question isn't "how do I fix it" or "will it go away;" I was wondering if anyone has returned a plasma TV to the store with this type of problem. I'm really not happy about the TV right now, and even if the logo does go away eventually, I don't want to have to alter my TV viewing habits and be worried about burn-in for the next however many years I keep the TV. I plan on returning it and getting an LCD instead, but I'm concerned about being able to return the TV in case they do some kind of thorough check and see the burn-in. Anyone have any experience with this?

Okay, okay, I know about all the brightness/contrast settings and the burn-in risks associated with them now, so please skip the sermonizing when reading this post.

I just purchased a brand new Panasonic TH-42PX50U 42" plasma TV about three weeks ago. I had been watching the TV with the brightness and contrast set to what I thought looked good (+5 for brightness, contrast at +30). This Friday, my wife and I watched the ReactNow tribute concert on VH1 classic. About 2 hours into this 4 1/2 hour-long show, I noticed that the VH1 logo at the bottom right had not moved during the entire broadcast. I then changed the channel for a couple minutes, hoping this break might avoid the risk of burn-in. I turned the channel back and watched the concert for about another hour, then turned the TV off. Yesterday when I went to watch a DVD, the TV show that my TV was on flashed up a white background, and there it was: the stupid VH1 logo. It's burned in. I can only see it when the screen is totally white or totally black, but it's there and it's noticeable. I ran some "snow" from a broadcast TV station that doesn't come in for a couple hours last night, which seemed to make the logo fade a bit, but it's still there. My question isn't "how do I fix it" or "will it go away;" I was wondering if anyone has returned a plasma TV to the store with this type of problem. I'm really not happy about the TV right now, and even if the logo does go away eventually, I don't want to have to alter my TV viewing habits and be worried about burn-in for the next however many years I keep the TV. I plan on returning it and getting an LCD instead, but I'm concerned about being able to return the TV in case they do some kind of thorough check and see the burn-in. Anyone have any experience with this?

Sorry to say it but you may be SOL depending on where you purchased your TV. You should have done more research before you started using your Plasma as +5 and +30 are to high. From what I have researched 0 for brightness and 0 for contrast is the place to start for the first 100 hours.

Sorry to say it but you may be SOL depending on where you purchased your TV. You should have done more research before you started using your Plasma as +5 and +30 are to high. From what I have researched 0 for brightness and 0 for contrast is the place to start for the first 100 hours.

I guess you either missed my comment about sermonizing or just ignored it. Thanks anyway for telling me what I already know.

Okay, okay, I know about all the brightness/contrast settings and the burn-in risks associated with them now, so please skip the sermonizing when reading this post.

This type of burn-in will most likely go away over time. You just have to be patient. It may take another 100 hours for the wear to even out. Watch as much full screen as possible. It will definitely fade over time. How long will it take? That I don't know.

I guess you either missed my comment about sermonizing or just ignored it. Thanks anyway for telling me what I already know.

relax

it may be image retention and not burn in

please do the 100 hour burn in process now and give it a few days: image retention is common on new plasma displays and is NOT permanent ;)

relax

it may be image retention and not burn in

please do the 100 hour burn in process now and give it a few days: image retention is common on new plasma displays and is NOT permanent ;)

Will image retention stay on the screen for a couple days? I thought it would only stay for a minute or so until another image is shown over it.

Will image retention stay on the screen for a couple days? I thought it would only stay for a minute or so until another image is shown over it.

I had image retention on a plasma for a a couple of weeks (logo of Court TV) :

I did notice it gradually diminishing day to day

bottom line is IR will dissipate

I had image retention on a plasma for a a couple of weeks (logo of Court TV) :

I did notice it gradually diminishing day to day

bottom line is IR will dissipate

It looks like you guys are right. I let my TV run for a couple hours on one of the HD channels that has constant motion a very faint translucent logo, and now the VH1 logo is completely gone.

I also set my brightness and contrast (picture) down below 0, but now the image seems awfully dark. A friend of mine at work is letting me borrow an Avia Guide to Home Theater DVD which I'll try tonight to see if calibrating it makes it better.

I purchased a Panasonic TH-42PD50U a few weeks ago and I absolutely love it. It is my first plasma purchase so I'm a newbie and very worried about screen burn-in. I have two roommates that are very excited to use an XBox on this display, but I told them no due to screen burn-in.

Last night, I hooked up my XBox through component to watch a movie that was on CD-ROM. Now that the XBox is hooked up, it's really tempting to start playing games.

I've searched these forums for a while now looking for someone that has used a video game system with this television and I can't find much. I'm wondering if I should worry so much about it? I would appreciate any advice.

Thanks in advance.

It looks like you guys are right. I let my TV run for a couple hours on one of the HD channels that has constant motion a very faint translucent logo, and now the VH1 logo is completely gone.

I also set my brightness and contrast (picture) down below 0, but now the image seems awfully dark. A friend of mine at work is letting me borrow an Avia Guide to Home Theater DVD which I'll try tonight to see if calibrating it makes it better.

It will seem dark at first, but I guarantee you will see it as way more "lifelike" once you get used to it. Just control the ambient light.

Now you are ramping up the steep section of the learning curve. Like every advanced technology, you need to know how to get the best out it, whether that means how to avoid or compensate for LCD smear and gray-blacks, a little brightness with those oh-so-detailed metal tweeters, or image retention on a plasma.

But, can you think of a better way to have some fun along with the enjoyment of the movies, games, and music?

Relax. Enjoy!

I purchased a Panasonic TH-42PD50U a few weeks ago and I absolutely love it. It is my first plasma purchase so I'm a newbie and very worried about screen burn-in. I have two roommates that are very excited to use an XBox on this display, but I told them no due to screen burn-in.

Last night, I hooked up my XBox through component to watch a movie that was on CD-ROM. Now that the XBox is hooked up, it's really tempting to start playing games.

I've searched these forums for a while now looking for someone that has used a video game system with this television and I can't find much. I'm wondering if I should worry so much about it? I would appreciate any advice.

Thanks in advance.

I'm not an expert, and I don't have (yet) hands-on experience with plasmas, but after reading what are the principles of 'breaking-in' plasmas, the golden rule is that for the first 100 hours, have the whole screen showing a picture (no black/gray bars), keeping the contrast and brightness below 0, and not letting any permanent image stay on the screen for more than a few seconds ("I" would say, no more than half a minute, probably. That's what I'm planning to do anyway). Supposedely, the first 100 hours are to be like that. After that, for the next 900 hours, people say to use the plasma in that mode for at least 85% of the time.
I don't know, I guess it would really depend on the way the games are... if there are images that won't change for a while, I'd stay away from playing games at least for the first 100 hours. Some people suggest to just run video in a loop for a few overnights. I guess that's a good option, I may consider doing that. Good luck!

It looks like you guys are right. I let my TV run for a couple hours on one of the HD channels that has constant motion a very faint translucent logo, and now the VH1 logo is completely gone.

I also set my brightness and contrast (picture) down below 0, but now the image seems awfully dark. A friend of mine at work is letting me borrow an Avia Guide to Home Theater DVD which I'll try tonight to see if calibrating it makes it better.

I actually take this back. I noticed the logo again on my TV last night. I guess I'll just wait it out and see if it goes away.

My company recently had a plasma screen installed in our lobby. I've built a flash application to display company news, customer logos, etc... (full screen)

As of now, I have about 30 customer logos fading in and out over a solid white background. It takes about 2 minutes to get through all the logos. After that, I wipe the screen with a solid color (this takes about 2 seconds) before returning to the logo loop. This runs about 12 hours a day. Should I be concerned about burn-in even though I wipe with a solid color every few minutes?

Thanks in advance

My company recently had a plasma screen installed in our lobby. I've built a flash application to display company news, customer logos, etc... (full screen)

As of now, I have about 30 customer logos fading in and out over a solid white background. It takes about 2 minutes to get through all the logos. After that, I wipe the screen with a solid color (this takes about 2 seconds) before returning to the logo loop. This runs about 12 hours a day. Should I be concerned about burn-in even though I wipe with a solid color every few minutes?

Thanks in advance

it'll probably help the experts to know how much time does every single logo stay on the screen.

from reading the break-in suggestions, if I was you I'd rearrange the icons you show so that:
1. they don't show for more than a few seconds (say 10-20. or less. The least amount of time. I'll let the experts comment on how long is too much)
2. they don't show always on the same spot of the screen (meaning, if in one iteration the 'brandX' logo is in the upper right of the screen, in the next iteration is in the lower left, or somewhere else but on the upper right).

it'll probably help the experts to know how much time does every single logo stay on the screen.

from reading the break-in suggestions, if I was you I'd rearrange the icons you show so that:
1. they don't show for more than a few seconds (say 10-20. or less. The least amount of time. I'll let the experts comment on how long is too much)
2. they don't show always on the same spot of the screen (meaning, if in one iteration the 'brandX' logo is in the upper right of the screen, in the next iteration is in the lower left, or somewhere else but on the upper right).

I agree with #2. The more variation you have the better. Then it becomes more of a screen saver type of loop and you won't have anything to worry about.

I bought a used NEC Plasmasync 4210W. I has major burn pretty much the whole
screen caused by previous commercial use. Is there any way of fixing the
burn-in? if so how would I do this?

Depending on how many hours the screen has been on, you may or may not be able to fix it. If the plasma is relatively young (< 1000 hours), the screen wear will even out over time watching full screen sources and the burn-in may fade. How long it takes to fade depends on how many hours it has been used already. If the burn in is really bad, it may fade a little but never go away completely.

Check the burn-in thread sticky.

MASTER BURN-IN THREAD --> All questions and information related to BURN-IN must go here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=444258)

I belive its about its about 3 years old and it probably has been used over 1000 hrs. I heard you if you get the screen white and let it run that might fix it is that true and if so how do get a white image on screen and how long do I keep it on for.

I bought a used NEC Plasmasync 4210W. I has major burn pretty much the whole
screen caused by previous commercial use. Is there any way of fixing the
burn-in? if so how would I do this?

And yes its does have over 1000 hrs on it

Please, go to the proper thread.

Rogo,

Don't you miss your moderator days?

Just thought I would update my experience breaking in my Panny TH-42PX50U. I've had the set since 9/3, probably using it about 5-6 hours a day. I've played a little bit of games, watched a couple movies (full screen), and last Sunday gave it a full NFL workout. I was a bit concerned about TV logos, but so far I haven't seen anything, even after watching Fox football broadcasts for about 7 hours last week. I have my contrast and brightness down a tad below 0, and that really seems to make a big difference. Even an hour of Madden didn't cause any image retention. I was especially looking for it on the white EA Sports logo page. I've probably got another week to go before I hit 100 hours.

I have been careful -- I've zoomed and moved the image on stations like CNN, and also haven't played games for more than 30-60 minutes in a sitting. But I haven't really had to alter my viewing beyond that.

Why can't you just put it on a station w/out a logo and run it day and night for, well, four days?

Hello,

I have had several clients (I'm an installer) who purchased plasmas from others and expereinced burn-in with relatively light use. One very high end Pioneer had it after less than 100 hours.

The question is, with a 1080i signal input of 4:3 content from a cable or satellite box, there is no stretching capability to fill the screen, so gray or black bars are unavoidable, so burn-in is unavoidable, no? Unless you run two cables from the source to the set, one for 1080i and one at a lower resolution (on most it would necessarily mean 480i on the S-video as most boxes won't vary output resolution on different component or DVI outputs simultaneously), and then wade through menus to switch source input and engage stretch each time what is being watched changes aspect ratios. (not an acceptable solution to my mind) And then all the 4:3 channels still look like doo because you have to use S-video. Surely I'm missing something. :rolleyes:

Is it that the first hours of usage are really critical to burn-in and because they weren't warned about it by the big dumb box guys they weren't careful? Anyone have an objecteive source to confirm that burn-in is most critical in first viewing hours?

And yes, by the time I showed-up the damage was done and the factory presets of screaming glare still remained.

Thansk much

...w/ no sidebars, I meant to say.

[QUOTE=D Alchemist]

Is it that the first hours of usage are really critical to burn-in and because they weren't warned about it by the big dumb box guys they weren't careful? Anyone have an objecteive source to confirm that burn-in is most critical in first viewing hours?[QUOTE]

OK, I've answered my own question with a good Google:

From a Panasonic White Paper, when the set is first turned on...

"Make sure the display is in a viewing mode (aspect ratio) that completely
fills the screen (there are often three or more settings from which to
choose). The panel is shipped in this condition, in what is called the
“Just” mode.
y Turn down the picture control (contrast) to 50% or less.
y Briefly engage the 4:3 mode to confirm the side bars are set to mid-gray
(there is usually an adjustment in the Set Up menu that takes the
sidebars from black to gray) to minimize the chance of burn-in.
y Return the set to a “full screen” (Just, Zoom, Full) position during the
first hundred hours of use.
y During the first hundred hours of use it is best not to view the same
channel for extended periods. This should prevent channel logos and
other fixed images found on some channels from being retained.
y Avoid any static images (video games, computer images, DVD title
screens, etc.) during the hundred-hour break-in.
After the hundred-hour break-in period, during the next nine-hundred hours:
y Continue to retain the picture setting at 50% or less.
y Limit the use of 4:3 aspect ratio mode (traditional picture size that does
not fill the entire screen) to 15% of viewing time.
y Limit the use of static images (computer, video games, etc.) to less than
10% of viewing time.
After one-thousand viewing hours, panels are much less likely to experience
image burn-in."


The absolute best part is to limit watching any 4:3 material to 15% of the time until 1000 hours. Unbelievable. I don't know how most people use these sets, but most of my clients are way too busy to watch lots of HD primetime live. They watch 4:3 stuff off their DVR. And they don't even reach 1,000 hours for a year plus.

Guess I wasn't missing anything. But it sure makes burn-in a MUCH greater problem than most on this thread make it out to be, IMHO. I will continue to recommend LCDs for most clients. :)

They can watch 4:3 content in Just, Zoom or Full modes which stretch the image to the full screen size. It's not 4:3 content iteself that poses a problem, it is the black bars on the sides.

I would think most people would want to watch their content on the full screen anyway.

-Justin

From what I understand the first 100 hours are critical (as per the Panasonic paper above), however after that I would suggest that the latest gen plasmas can tolerate normal viewing habits - as long as the source and aspect ratio is not always the same.

I've only just got my Pana HD TH-42PV500A and I'm in the process of breaking it in by watching mostly widescreen material, and any 4:3 source material zoomed, and making sure no tv logos stay on screen for long periods. 100 hours at 3 hours a day is 1 month, so I figure I can do it for that long.

After the 1 month break-in, I'm going to use the set normally and pretty much forget about burn in.

Burn-in? What's that? :D

From what I understand the first 100 hours are critical (as per the Panasonic paper above), however after that I would suggest that the latest gen plasmas can tolerate normal viewing habits - as long as the source and aspect ratio is not always the same.

I've only just got my Pana HD TH-42PV500A and I'm in the process of breaking it in by watching mostly widescreen material, and any 4:3 source material zoomed, and making sure no tv logos stay on screen for long periods. 100 hours at 3 hours a day is 1 month, so I figure I can do it for that long.

After the 1 month break-in, I'm going to use the set normally and pretty much forget about burn in.

I just received my 42" panasonic as well. My 100 hours will be followed per recommendations, but 1000 hours (that's around the clock for more than a month!) may as well be a lifetime for me. After my 100 hours, I will consider the set broken in.

-Justin

Burn-in? What's that? :D
you're joking rite? :D



For PC users,

in addition to lowering the contrast & brightness settings,



- you should make the desktop all black, with no pictures in the background

- hide ALL icons in the desktop

- hide the Taskbar, everything....

- Set all windows message boxes and dialogs to dark grey and set the texts to red or green so your eyeballs can read the texts...

- ALLWAYS TURN OFF THE PLASMA WHEN NOT USING, EVEN FOR 1 MINUTE. every minute, every second "counts"... you want to protect your tv? do it....


- TURN OFF ALL STATS that display during PC gaming such as analog/digital readouts for racing and shooting games. This is probably the most important part of all...... for the record.

- Get a computer monitor to browse internet and do other things. ONLY use Plasma when you play Movies, Videos, 3D games, and other graphics that are in constant motion~ @ Full screen.


if you do all these, not only your tv won't get damaged but also last longer.......


I thought I should mention that in case if there are any PC users anticipating to use Plasma tv to view PC stuff...... ;)

Does anyone have any knowledge about Hitachi plasmas and their history with burn-in? I've been reading some of the posts in this thread and have been reading how the pannys do a pretty good job with burn-in but is this true for other modern-day plasma sets?

My problem is that I game from time-to-time and was considering purchasing the new 42HDS52 Hitachi plasma. Does anyone have any info with Hitachi's track record with burn-in and video games?

Thanks for the help with my ghosting questions. From what I have read this seems to be a common thing. Another couple of questions maybe someone can help me with:

1. Uneven wear. When ever I turn my TV on (Philips 42pf9956/37) The channel # (or AV input) the audio set up (whether it is in surround/normal etc), and the picture format all show up in very bright yellow. This always ghosts, but goes away quickly. My question is, I have been checking the screen (I turn it on with no signal so I can see a lit up black screen) and that area the screen seems to be lighter then the rest of the screen. Is this possible or am I imagining things. I watch almost exclusively full screen. The direct TV menu is in that area as well so it may be contributing. The area does not look like anything and is unnoticeable when there is a signal, but it seems to be a streaky area that is lighter then rest. Think of it as a dirty section on a clean window. Anyone ever heard of this?
2. I have something called dynamic contrast. It adjusts the screen settings continuously while the picture is on. I set my brightness, contrast, and sharpness to less then 50%, but when I put on the dynamic contrast menu I can see everything adjusting, including the sharpness, brightness, and contrast. I am particularly concerned with the sharpness which hovers somewhere around 70-73. Is this messing with my settings or is it adjusting to 70-73% of my settings? The sharpness menu choice only allows me to go between 1-7 (Mine is set to 3) so I don’t know what this is actually doing. Any help would be appreciated. Hope I was clear.

As far as I know, the sharpness level will have no effect on the burn in succeptability.

How about if I do a 100 hour break in for a Panny TH-42PX500U (it's in the mail) and then play 3-4 hours of gaming say 5 times a week (xbox then xbox 360 both using component), putting in one or two games during the session. How much am i at risk for burn in would you say?

thanks,

cwmcln

how about if you just use the set the way youre going to use it from day one, and youll be fine.

I like that. :)

I just got a Panasonic 42PX50U, which after a simple calibration, promises to make for enjoyable viewing.

During break in, what about watching a widescreen DVD that's got a wider aspect ratio than 16:9? In that case, there are black bars at the top and bottom. This is not a good thing for the first 100 hours, right? Do I need to do pan and scan with something like that for now?

Black bars on top and bottom for 2.35:1 letterboxed DVD's should be treated the same as black bars on the side.

None for the first 100 hours
< 15% for the next 900 hours.

Thanks, renlopez.

Gotta get those first 100 hours out of the way.