I don't understand why there are all these questions about offsets and screen heights and such. That's why screen calculators are for - they give you the answer as long as you input the correct numbers. So what is it? Do you not trust what it is saying? or are you hoping there is some trick that can defeat the optics built into the projector?

Other than the few mentioned here (tilt the pj and tilt the screen, use a joist to get max height), there really aren't.

I don't understand why there are all these questions about offsets and screen heights and such. That's why screen calculators are for - they give you the answer as long as you input the correct numbers. So what is it? Do you not trust what it is saying? or are you hoping there is some trick that can defeat the optics built into the projector?

Other than the few mentioned here (tilt the pj and tilt the screen, use a joist to get max height), there really aren't.

Well, for me anyway, alot depends on the size of the mount or how its mounted to the ceiling. I can do the calculation, but the spreadsheet assumes you are using a certain mount, meaning you are "x" inches from the ceiling to the center of the lens. My question went to are there mounts out there that would allow you to get closer to the ceiling -- if so, what is the closest I can get, and how high will the screen be from the floor with that mount.

jvox, my issues are that I already have a projector and screen and I can't change the screen location (equipment rack is right under the screen) and I can't raise the sheetrock in my room without re-engineering the trusses and such.

I am not questioning the fact that there is an offset or what the amount of offset is, what I am wondering is if the keystone correction will allow you to mount the screen and projector without worrying about the offset. If I can't get around the offset issue, I will not be able to use this projector and I assume I am not the first in this boat.

I finally took the proverbial leap of faith and got myself a brand new spanking sealed in a box Infocus 72.

Some ramblings:

1. I was choosing between a Panasonic AE900, SP4805 and the IN72. I didn't get the SP4805 because the dealer had no more stock and its being sold locally for about$10.00 less than an In72.
2. It was a close fight between the Panny AE900 and i almost got it had i nor demoed the In72. I decided to get the In72 because of three reasons. First them showed me aa demoof a HDTV D-VHS movie and i noticed that the detail of foggy forest was so much detailed in the In72. Next i found the In72 a tad sharper than the Panny. What tipped the scale over was the fact that the In 72 was a lot cheaper than the Panny.
3. I know the Panny is 720p and the In72 is only 480P but let's just say i ccouldn'tnotice the difference and whatever difference there was visually (if there was actually any) it wawasn'torth the price difference.
4. As i'mI amill deciding on my screen i got the In72 projecting on our wall. Its a flat beige wall to be exact. The image i saw blew me away. We started with a VCD of Thomas the train whiwhichs colorful but hey its mpeg quality. The colors were okay but the picture wawasn'ts good. I promised my son we'd have thomas on the wall that evening.
5. When i was all alone i popped in the fantastic 4. Right there and then whatever buyer's remorse (for spending a little fortune on a hobby) was siped out. The details were quite clear and the colors were very crcrispI had to dial the color saturation a little higher by 5 or six notches and i was good to go.
6. I then popped Moulin Rouge in and as i was watching the very colorful Bordello dance sequence i ccouldn'thelp but ask myself why i had to wait this long to get this PJ.
7. The blues, yellows and greens of the dancing women in the scene seemed to jump off the screen. The contrast of the light sscenesand the ccloudsand whiffs of smoke were never washed out. Please remember that i saw all this on a 80x45 image on a beige wall!

INfocus per se:
1. The remote control was small but didn't feel cheap. It was light granted but was not flimsy.
2. The menu option was quite intuitive and i was flipping through the menus in no time.
3. All in all it took me 5 to ten mins to fire up the PJ. I was so excited i just got a spare DVD player and piped the S-video cable to the PJ instead of getting tea comp[onent video capable player. I the hooked up the audio vial toslink and sent out a 2 channel phantom Pro-logic sound. In ten mins tops i was watching Thomas the train with my boy.
4. The PJ looks sleek and expensive. It doesn't look like an office appliance that you brought home for the weekend. As to the noise, there was none. I was sitting beside the PJ and the fan was just whispering, heck i think its even quieter than my Sony Vaio laptop.
Kudos INfocus !
5. I'm still shopping around for a screen as i want it to blend into the room. Looks like i'll settle for a 100" diagonal screen and sit back 12 to 14 feet away.
6. That's all folks thanks to all who have contributed to this forum. While there was no substitute for the actual demo and comparison the info i got here and other AV forums gave me the proper tool to be a critic of what i was demoing. It gave me a heads up on what i should be looking out for and avoiding.

jvox, my issues are that I already have a projector and screen and I can't change the screen location (equipment rack is right under the screen) and I can't raise the sheetrock in my room without re-engineering the trusses and such.

I am not questioning the fact that there is an offset or what the amount of offset is, what I am wondering is if the keystone correction will allow you to mount the screen and projector without worrying about the offset. If I can't get around the offset issue, I will not be able to use this projector and I assume I am not the first in this boat.

Several have explained here on this forum that if you have a dedicated room and framed screen that you can adjust the tilt of the projector up and adjust the screen by moving it up the wall to match the change and then eliminate the keystone by slightly tilting the screen towards the projector. You maintain the same geometry as if you were shooting onto the screen with a level projector.

As in a previous post i said i just got an In72 i just have some questiosn.

I understand that the built in scaler of the PJ scales it up to 480p.

Question 1.
Do i need to flick a swithc in the menu to turn the scaler on or off?

Question 2
Now i have a Neo-neu 1080i/1080p DVD player. Is there a way for me to bypass the In72's scaler and pipe a 1080i, 1080p, 720i or 720p signal and have the projector display the 1080i, 1080p, 720i or 720p without passing through the internal scaler so that the PJ wont downscae the signal to 480p?

Question 3
Assuming that i can pipe a 1080i or 1080p will this not damage the PJ and through what signal do i pass it through? HDMI, DVI, VBGA or Component?

I don't have a IN72, but based on the 4805



Question 1.
Do i need to flick a swithc in the menu to turn the scaler on or off?

I think the answer is no. The DVI port (and HDMI port I guess on the IN72) supposedly does not go through the scaler, however I don't believe this has anything to do with the PJ outputting its native resolution. I'm sure a better explanation will follow.


Question 2
Now i have a Neo-neu 1080i/1080p DVD player. Is there a way for me to bypass the In72's scaler and pipe a 1080i, 1080p, 720i or 720p signal and have the projector display the 1080i, 1080p, 720i or 720p without passing through the internal scaler so that the PJ wont downscae the signal to 480p?

No

alfa

Suppose you could turn the In72 scaler off - and indeed you can with the native aspect ratio....what good would it do to NOT downscale the 1080P HD signals? You would be looking at the tiniest portion of the image in the center! The IN72 has a 480P chipset that is compatible with HD signals - but the only way to display 1080P IS to downscale!

There is no advantage (and many disadvantages) to downscaling an upscaled DVD - just send out 480P and bypass the extra processing guaranteed to soften your image.

The projector and screen is 16:9, which translates to 1.78:1. This is not an aspect ratio used for movies. "Happy Gilmore", like many films, has an aspect ratio of 1.85:1. If you do the math you'll see that it means that you're going to have small black bars at the top, bottom, or both - depending on the transfer.

In some cases 1.85:1 films are cropped to fill the full 16:9 panel, but often not.

OTA HD has a native AR of 16:9, so that's why it fills your screen completely.

:)

Thanks!

I just received my IN72 last Friday. I am very impressed by this projector. And of course, I have a few questions on the installation. I apologize if these questions have been asked before but I did do a search on this thread and was unable to find good answers.

1) I have an old Toshiba DVD player(480i) that does not have a progressive output. Do I need to go and buy myself a player that has progressive and 3:2 pulldown?

2) What is the optimal image size for the IN72? I have been able to project a 100" diagonal image and it looks great. I know that reviews for 4805 said that 92" was the best size.

Thank you.

3. All in all it took me 5 to ten mins to fire up the PJ. I was so excited i just got a spare DVD player and piped the S-video cable to the PJ instead of getting tea comp[onent video capable player.

Wait, you are this happy with the colors and contrast and everything on a S-video Cable???

Just wait to see the difference when you hook it up with component or even better with HDMI. It will blow you away to put it mildly. :D

So there I was. It was late Friday night and I was watching the HD-DVD of "Enter the Dragon" with anticipation. Bruce was prowling around in the dark, grabbing some snake that was conveniently lying around, and slipping down an airshaft getting ready to whoop 87 guys. He was gonna whoop with a stick. He was gonna whoop with those nunchuk things. He was gonna whoop with his fists and feet. And I was going to thoroughly enjoy myself watching it in glorious HD. A nice Australian Cab/Shiraz was hitting the spot, life was good.

And then, just as the whopping was about to commence..........pitch blackness. The screen was dark. The room was dark. What the %#$)*!!...... WHAT THE $%^(*&!....... How could this be? My lamp must be dead!

I sat there in the blackness, dazed and depressed that the fickle finger of lamp fate had picked me. Thoughts like "where the heck did I put my receipt for the projector", and "will I need to send only the lamp or the entire projector to InFocus" filled my mind. I looked up - the IN76 was showing a blinking green light. That evil machine, it's mocking me. It's not even giving me a red light. That's strange I thought. Oh well, nothing to do but shut it off and try again a little later.

So I went upstairs and watched my beloved Red Sox polish off the Mariners on my puny 35" TV that barely seems to qualify as a display device anymore. 25 minutes later I was back downstairs, anxiously approaching the projector's power button. I held my breath and pushed. And..........it came right on. Yep, the lamp struck, went thru the normal warmup, and all was good again - like nothing ever happened!

I sat down and watched the rest of the movie, but the magic was gone. The fight scenes weren't as entertaining as before. The wine wasn't as good. I was a man distracted by the possibility of a lamp failure at any moment. I thought, "Was it a brown out?". Could be - it was very hot and energy usage was super high. Maybe good-ole National Grid had just let me down. Ya, that's gotta be it I decided. Damn though. One more thing to worry about.

Lets flash forward to this morning. I wake up and before I even get a chance to lift my head off the pillow, it hits me:

First thought: "Man am I relieved".
Second thought: "I'm an idiot".

You see, about two weeks ago I had turned on the sleep timer on the projector. My 4 year old son was going thru a spell where he was waking up late at night and wanted someone to lay with him until he got back to sleep. Since I do most of my movie watching after everyone has gone to bed (including my wife), there were several occasions where I had to break off watching a movie so I could lay down with him. The sleep timer was a precaution against me falling asleep myself, and as it turned out a good one, since on two occasions I actually did!

Yep, that was it. Mystery solved. That night I had watched another movie with my older son right before "Enter the Dragon". When the lamp cutout, the projector had been on for about 4 hours - the exact time interval when the sleep timer kicks in. Silly me.

So, to Bob Williams and company, my humble suggestion for a future firmware release: please display a warning message prior to a sleep timer shutdown, and allow the user the option of aborting it. :D

So you want it to be idiot proof? :D

JeffKB

How about a better idea - when I am watching a crapola movie and have fallen asleep - let the sleep timer put up a dialog saying - you wanna keep watching this crapola or are you gonna keep sleeping! :p

Then your wife does not need to do it :D

They have the technology - afterall - who else can put a flashlite in the remote and have the projector know when it is upside down! :D :D

I just got the IN76 a week ago, flashed it and absolutely love it (I used to have Benq 6150). Now I can finally see the difference between DVD and HD source material clearly :)

I've had no problem with running the unit via VGA (yes, going to move to DVI soon) from my HTPC at native 1280x720 @ 60hz but I've had no luck making it sync at 1280x720 @ 50hz using both windows and Powerstrip. I read through this long thread and it seems I *should* be able to. Anyone managed to do this via VGA or DVI and if so how?

Thanks!

ha ha jeffkb.... :)

hey you happy with that hd-dvd player? would you buy it again?

They have the technology - afterall - who else can put a flashlite in the remote... :D :D
Did they ever actually add that feature? My remote doesn't have a flashlight built in. Too bad, I could have used it when the sleep timer kicked in and left me in a pitch black basement littered with kid's toys on the floor! :eek:

hey you happy with that hd-dvd player? would you buy it again?
Hey billmac - I would most definitely buy it again. :) The thing of it is, it's a good enough DVD player that you can use if for regular DVDs. That makes the $500 price tag easier to justify. Instead of buying, say, an Oppo for $200, you spend an extra $300 and have a DVD player just as good, but with the capability to play HD DVDs.

The one minor complaint I have with the Toshiba is that it does appear to add a touch of EE with SD DVDs (none with HD DVDs). I never really noticed it until someone on the forum pointed it out. (BTW, THANK YOU for that AVS forum! I should have stopped reading threads as soon as I bought the player :D) I threw up the AVIA sharpness test pattern, and sure enough - there was mild ringing that could not be eliminated. The Oppo had a touch of this as well however. It's not really noticeable during actually viewing unless you're staring obsessively at every hard edge between light and dark colored objects. And even then it's barely there. Even still, depending on the SD DVD, I sometimes select the "Softer" sharpness setting on the IN76.

HD-DVDs themselves will really spoil you. Like everything else, the quality varies from release to release, but the best looking discs are truly jaw dropping. Of course the problem is that the content is rather limited, but hopefully that will change during the holiday season.

Did they ever actually add that feature? My remote doesn't have a flashlight built in. Too bad, I could have used it when the sleep timer kicked in and left me in a pitch black basement littered with kid's toys on the floor! :eek:

They did not say it was an idiot proof feature :p - you have to push and hold to get the flashlight - otherwise you just get the button lights.

They did not say it was an idiot proof feature :p - you have to push and hold to get the flashlight - otherwise you just get the button lights.
Doh! Just tried it and you're right. I use a universal remote and only used the projector remote for a few days. I never held the button long enough for the flashlight to kick in!

Geez, between the sleep timer and the flashlight, I guess InFocus is just bringing a little bit too much technology for my simple mind to handle! :D

hi,

i'll be buying this 25ft dvi to hdmi cable from monoprice to connect to my D1/IN72. anyone have experience if long dvi cables degrade picture quality? will i see any difference compared to say a 3ft version?

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10240&cs_id=1024001&p_id=2806&seq=1&format=2&style=

thanks,
trent

will i see any difference compared to say a 3ft version?No.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trentR
will i see any difference compared to say a 3ft version?
------------------------------
Quoting cavu: "no".
----------------------------
True, but not entirely. There should be no difference in quality, except in certain instances , some people have experienced "noise" with very long digital cables. Some have 50' with no problem, some 30' feet and noise/hash. It's not subtle though, there's either no noise and the length makes no difference or there is. Trent, you just have to try it, but don't worry too much, this issue is rare. Buy from a company with a return policy though. Usually, I'm a slightly high end cable kind of guy, but my reasonably priced 6 meter DVI cable is from Blue Jeans Cable and it's well made and works perfectly, perhaps you should check them out.

thanks for the info, looks like i will go with the 20ft blue jeans cable, which is long enough. the difference in price between the 25ft monoprice is only around $2, so blue jeans it is.

I just received my IN72 last Friday. I am very impressed by this projector. And of course, I have a few questions on the installation. I apologize if these questions have been asked before but I did do a search on this thread and was unable to find good answers.

1) I have an old Toshiba DVD player(480i) that does not have a progressive output. Do I need to go and buy myself a player that has progressive and 3:2 pulldown?

2) What is the optimal image size for the IN72? I have been able to project a 100" diagonal image and it looks great. I know that reviews for 4805 said that 92" was the best size.

Thank you.

Can someone here please help me wih these questions? I appreciate your input. Thank you.

I have an old Toshiba DVD player(480i) that does not have a progressive output. Do I need to go and buy myself a player that has progressive and 3:2 pulldown?No. The projector will provide all the necessary conversions internally.What is the optimal image size for the IN72?The IN72 is almost identical to the SP4805 and, as such, probably the same (92") advice would apply. But, the IN72 is slightly brighter than the SP4805 which means that it can do a 100" image with the same brightness that the SP4805 does at 92".

So I would suggest that, if you are happy with the 100" image you have, go for it!

No. The projector will provide all the necessary conversions internally.The IN72 is almost identical to the SP4805 and, as such, probably the same (92") advice would apply. But, the IN72 is slightly brighter than the SP4805 which means that it can do a 100" image with the same brightness that the SP4805 does at 92".

So I would suggest that, if you are happy with the 100" image you have, go for it!

Thanks much. I will keep the 100" image just as you suggested. It does look bright and clear.

No. The projector will provide all the necessary conversions internally.The IN72 is almost identical to the SP4805 and, as such, probably the same (92") advice would apply. But, the IN72 is slightly brighter than the SP4805 which means that it can do a 100" image with the same brightness that the SP4805 does at 92".

So I would suggest that, if you are happy with the 100" image you have, go for it!

Thanks much. I will keep the 100" image just as you suggested. It does look bright and clear. And about the input, do I need to make any adjustments in the projector to get the best conversion or is it all automatic?

And about the input, do I need to make any adjustments in the projector to get the best conversion or is it all automatic?It is completely automatic and is the natural mode of the projector.

It is completely automatic and is the natural mode of the projector.
Great! Thank you.

A while back i posted a question on this board asking if there was a way i could pipe a 1080i or 720p signal to the projector in such a way that such signal would not be scaled down by the IN72's internal scaler to its native res 480p. Many said it could not be done. That whatever signal you pipe in the PJ the IN72 would scale it down to its native 480p. I also sent the same query to Infocus.

here's their answer...

Hello xxxxx,

Higher resolutions would not be effected. The de-interlacing would only take effect on 480i. You may use HDMI, DVI, Component or VGA to send a high definition signal to the projector.

If you have any questions, please let me know.

Thank you for choosing InFocus,

Louis Technical Support Representative...

So now i'm more confused :(

what are the recommended settings for the infocus in76 and the oppo OPDV971H . i haven't been able to find any calibration settings for this hardware combo (looking for information specifics like the one posted from AndrewS99 for the oppo and 4805 combo below).

Thanks in advance! keep up the good work :)

hash06



Originally Posted by AndrewS99
I picked up my 4805 as an X1 upgrade from woot(dot)com several weeks ago. I also just ordered an Oppo DV971H.

In the past month, I have combed through both the 4805 and Oppo threads here to glean the advice of those who have blazed the trail to get a 4805 set up correctly with a DVI source - specifically the Oppo.

For all those that wanted a concise tome of info for settings for these two awesome devices, here is what I collected from the two above mentioned MONSTER threads. Please fill in any gaps that I might have missed or errors that I have made if you feel so inclined....

Interesting Info...
1) 4805 is not prone to Macroblocking with Faroudja chipset
2) RGB Gains = Contrast
3) RGB Offset = Brightness
4) RGB settings above work with equal "bit depth" (10 bits) to the brightness/contrast controls

On Oppo
1) Set Brightness to +5
2) Set Sharpness to Off (Eliminates "shimmering"
3) Set TrueLife On (Motion adaptive deinterlacing - what Faroudja is known for)
4) Set CCS Off (May reduce flicker between bright colors)
5) Keep Contrast at 0

On 4805
1) Set RGB Gains = 58
2) Set RGB Offsets = 28 bordering on 29
3) Set White Peaking to 0
4) Set Gamma to Film
5) Check a 480i source (Oppo component) and make sure Sharpness is set for Softest (per krasmuzik) - Softest may reduce ringing. This will affect DVI even though you can't reset sharpness once DVI is hooked up. This becomes a problem if Sharpness was increased past Standard since it will introduce artifacts on the DVI connection. It is currently unclear if the 1.13 firmware has fixed this issue.
6) Make sure Brightness and Contrast are always set to 50 - use RGB Gain/Offset to adjust brightness and contrast. Move RGB Controls in tandem ALWAYS
7) 1080i is not as popular as 480p or 720p. Some current impressions are that 480p is sharper than the upconverted 720p. 720p is the preferred current mode. 480p over DVI has some line compression which is apparently an Oppo issue. Use 720p for now.
8) Set Color Space to REC601 - REC601 is for SDTV and REC709 is for HDTV. If you're never going to watch HDTV on the 4805, there's no need for REC709. REC709 will kick on if a DVD is upconverted to 720p or 1080i causing "green push".
9) Tracking and Phase adjustment are available with an HTDV component source. If these are adjusted with a component source and then a DVI source is hooked up, the previous settings will negatively impact the DVI source. It is best to set the Tracking and Phase back to default over a component source before switching to a DVI source.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last edited by AndrewS99 : 08-31-05 at 08:59 PM. "

A while back i posted a question on this board asking if there was a way i could pipe a 1080i or 720p signal to the projector in such a way that such signal would not be scaled down by the IN72's internal scaler to its native res 480p.You are asking a very odd question which makes me seriously wonder whether or not you understand the basics involved.

Let us assume for the moment that we could defeat any/all scaling in the IN72 and you fed it a 720p signal. What would you have the projector do?? Display the top left 854x480 corner of the 1280x720 incoming image, dropping the right hand 426 columns and the bottom 240 lines? Or perhaps display only the middle section, cropping off 213 columns from each side and 120 lines off each of the top and bottom?.What exactly are you trying to accomplish??!! :confused:

... And then, just as the whopping was about to commence..........pitch blackness. The screen was dark. The room was dark. What the %#$)*!!...... WHAT THE $%^(*&!....... How could this be? My lamp must be dead!

...

Yep, that was it. Mystery solved. That night I had watched another movie with my older son right before "Enter the Dragon". When the lamp cutout, the projector had been on for about 4 hours - the exact time interval when the sleep timer kicks in. Silly me...

:)

Well, here's a real horror story for ya.

Yesterday, my niece was watching some show on the Disney channel. I was actually enjoying, too. Just before the show ended, about 1.5 hrs. after I had turned on the PJ, the PJ shut itself off.

Sadly, there was no power save mode or sleep timer techno-marvel in my case. I can't power on the PJ any more. There's no green LED, steady or blinking. There's no blinking red LED diagnostic patterns. Dead, as in dead.

I had a quick email exchange with InFocus tech support. Dead lamp? Took it out and checked for visible flaws, but none I can see. Shake the lamp assembly gently (what the hey :eek: - but that's what was suggested) and reinstall - no go. Check the blinking red LED pattern? Well, as I said, there's no lit LED, period, to look at. Check the power cord? I tried 2 different power cords (as this was a standard warranty exchange unit that came with a full set of accessories, I also had the power cord from the original unit) on 3 different functioning power outlets. Still dead.

Dead, dead, dead, dead, dead - really really dead.

And I'm sad, sad, sad, sad, sad - really really sad. :(

Just requested an RMA. As much as I've been enjoying the PJ, I'm not having much luck with it: first unit, dead M1-DVI-D after 4.5 hrs., second unit, just plain dead after around 350 hrs.

hash

On the IN7x looks like Sharpness Standard is the best - unless your source is ringing then go softer.

Your oppo settings depends on firmware (the latest production one I did was good with brightness+1) - the IN72 should recognize it as a video DVI/HDMI source - so no need to hack the RGB as before. There is a setting for RGB Video vs. RGB PC (or maybe that was just IN76) if it seems off.

In other words even more so now - set brightness/contrast to match the source and forget it! (The advice not to use them on SP4805 was old and wrong - it also had 10bit brightness/contrast controls like the IN72) However if you can find the proper Oppo setting for your firmware to do proper Video levels that is better.

You are asking a very odd question which makes me seriously wonder whether or not you understand the basics involved.

Let us assume for the moment that we could defeat any/all scaling in the IN72 and you fed it a 720p signal. What would you have the projector do?? Display the top left 854x480 corner of the 1280x720 incoming image, dropping the right hand 426 columns and the bottom 240 lines? Or perhaps display only the middle section, cropping off 213 columns from each side and 120 lines off each of the top and bottom?.What exactly are you trying to accomplish??!! :confused:

Have blue monkeys fly in and swap the IN72 for a IN76 whenever HD is sourced?

Is there a way for me to bypass the In72's scaler and pipe a 1080i, 1080p, 720i or 720p signal and have the projector display the 1080i, 1080p, 720i or 720p without passing through the internal scaler so that the PJ wont downscae the signal to 480p?

Simply put, no. Those numbers you see are lines of resolution. The IN72 only has 480 lines of resolution, so if you send it more lines it has to do *something* to handle all the extra lines. As someone else said, the projector could do something stupid like only show you the top 480 lines, or the bottom or the center... it can't show you all 1080 or 720 lines you send it because it doesn't have that many lines to offer. Instead, it does something sensible and creates 480 brand new lines from the much larger number of lines you gave it.

To use a somewhat crude analogy, if I told you to fit an entire book onto a single sheet of paper, the best you could do would be to write a summary of the book that would fit on one page and capture the basic plot. For many years Reader's Digest made money doing exactly that--selling condensed books that got the author's basic point across in much less space.

That's what the scaler is doing. It makes something big fit into a smaller space while trying to preserve as much information as it can. It takes a really sharp but really big picture, and makes it less sharp overall and much smaller, so it will fit into the number of lines that your projector actually has.

Whatever InFocus was trying to tell you, it doesn't affect how scalers work and why you need one in order to show a 720/1080 line picture on a projector that has fewer lines.

~ Kiran <entropy@io.com>

Simply put, no. Those numbers you see are lines of resolution. The IN72 only has 480 lines of resolution, so if you send it more lines it has to do *something* to handle all the extra lines. As someone else said, the projector could do something stupid like only show you the top 480 lines, or the bottom or the center... it can't show you all 1080 or 720 lines you send it because it doesn't have that many lines to offer. Instead, it does something sensible and creates 480 brand new lines from the much larger number of lines you gave it....
~ Kiran <entropy@io.com>

Thanks Kiran, your answer clarified the matters i wanted to clarify. i.e. whether the 480p spec/ native reslution of my projector was a limit of the scaler or its DLP itself.
I had the mistaken notion that the 480p spec of my projector was a limit set by the scaler and not the PJ itself.

Which is why i entertained the idea (which is why i asked in the 1st place) that if i piped in a 1080i signal and bypassed the internal scaler the PJ would show the whole program in a 1080i format.

As a follow up to your answer

The In72 would automatically scale any signal i send to it to 480p right? i dont need to turn on activate anything?
So if i pipe in a 1080i signal from my DVD player to my In72 via HDMI the picture would be better, worse or similar if i piped in a 480i signal? IN theory it would be the same right as the PJ would scale the signals to 480p anyway.

So if i pipe in a 1080i signal from my DVD player to my In72 via HDMI the picture would be better, worse or similar if i piped in a 480i signal?It would likely be worse as the DVD is 480i to begin with. The simple "rule" is to minimize the number of times a signal is manipulated; each time it is altered, undesireable visual artifacts are created and picture data lost.

Because the IN72 has a "native" 480 resolution, DVDs and SD/ED TV are best fed to it "raw", without "up-conversion". The only real improvement that can be obtained with DVDs would be to bypass the IN72 processing completely and feed DVD material digitally at 854x480 1:1 pixel-mapped from a capable DVD player (Bravo/Momitsu/SnaZio); this signal essentially goes directly to the DMD and would provide the best PQ available. You would also have the option of changing the refresh rate to 48Hz to eliminate the jitter and motion artifacts created thought 3:2 pulldown when reproducing film-based content like movies at the 60Hz rate that all projectors default to.

The majority of HDTV is 1080i (ABC, FOX and ESPN broadcast in 720p) which will be automatically downconverted to 480 and will look much better than SDTV! Your HDTV box can generally be set to 1080i but will benefit by being set to 720p for "critically" viewing those three mentioned networks (ie. live sports, American Idol ;), etc.).

It would likely be worse as the DVD is 480i to begin with. The simple "rule" is to minimize the number of times a signal is manipulated; each time it is altered, undesireable visual artifacts are created and picture data lost.

Because the IN72 has a "native" 480 resolution, DVDs and SD/ED TV are best fed to it "raw", without "up-conversion". The only real improvement that can be obtained with DVDs would be to bypass the IN72 processing completely and feed DVD material digitally at 854x480 1:1 pixel-mapped from a capable DVD player (Bravo/Momitsu/SnaZio); this signal essentially goes directly to the DMD and would provide the best PQ available. You would also have the option of changing the refresh rate to 48Hz to eliminate the jitter and motion artifacts created thought 3:2 pulldown when reproducing film-based content like movies at the 60Hz rate that all projectors default to.

The majority of HDTV is 1080i (ABC, FOX and ESPN broadcast in 720p) which will be automatically downconverted to 480 and will look much better than SDTV! Your HDTV box can generally be set to 1080i but will benefit by being set to 720p for "critically" viewing those three mentioned networks (ie. live sports, American Idol ;), etc.).

This forum never fails to amaze me as how much info one can get. Thanks Cavu for the info. Now to try that pixel map on my Neu-Neo DVD layer he he he

hash

On the IN7x looks like Sharpness Standard is the best - unless your source is ringing then go softer.

Your oppo settings depends on firmware (the latest production one I did was good with brightness+1) - the IN72 should recognize it as a video DVI/HDMI source - so no need to hack the RGB as before. There is a setting for RGB Video vs. RGB PC (or maybe that was just IN76) if it seems off.

In other words even more so now - set brightness/contrast to match the source and forget it! (The advice not to use them on SP4805 was old and wrong - it also had 10bit brightness/contrast controls like the IN72) However if you can find the proper Oppo setting for your firmware to do proper Video levels that is better.
thanks krasmuzik.

the in76 and the oppo 971h have the latest respective firmware loaded. which video levels are you refering to - the projector or the dvd player?

:) Just requested an RMA. As much as I've been enjoying the PJ, I'm not having much luck with it: first unit, dead M1-DVI-D after 4.5 hrs., second unit, just plain dead after around 350 hrs.
Joe,

Sorry to hear about your troubles, that sucks. I hope everything works out and your next unit has a little more longevity.

Look on the bright side, you just got 350 hours of free lamp usage. :)

:)

Well, here's a real horror story for ya.

Yesterday, my niece was watching some show on the Disney channel. I was actually enjoying, too. Just before the show ended, about 1.5 hrs. after I had turned on the PJ, the PJ shut itself off.

Sadly, there was no power save mode or sleep timer techno-marvel in my case. I can't power on the PJ any more. There's no green LED, steady or blinking. There's no blinking red LED diagnostic patterns. Dead, as in dead.

I had a quick email exchange with InFocus tech support. Dead lamp? Took it out and checked for visible flaws, but none I can see. Shake the lamp assembly gently (what the hey :eek: - but that's what was suggested) and reinstall - no go. Check the blinking red LED pattern? Well, as I said, there's no lit LED, period, to look at. Check the power cord? I tried 2 different power cords (as this was a standard warranty exchange unit that came with a full set of accessories, I also had the power cord from the original unit) on 3 different functioning power outlets. Still dead.

Dead, dead, dead, dead, dead - really really dead.

And I'm sad, sad, sad, sad, sad - really really sad. :(

Just requested an RMA. As much as I've been enjoying the PJ, I'm not having much luck with it: first unit, dead M1-DVI-D after 4.5 hrs., second unit, just plain dead after around 350 hrs.

that's a bummer bud. sorry to hear. hang in there.

thanks krasmuzik.

the in76 and the oppo 971h have the latest respective firmware loaded. which video levels are you refering to - the projector or the dvd player?

The player - then it did proper video levels. This was the latest production (not beta) firmware according to the owner. I don't keep up on proper settings for each rev like some do - but with digital - assume the projector is correct and adjust the player using your test DVD.

that's a bummer bud. sorry to hear. hang in there.


Sorry to hear about your troubles, that sucks. I hope everything works out and your next unit has a little more longevity.

Look on the bright side, you just got 350 hours of free lamp usage.

Thanks for the moral support, gents. :) As I told the tech support, this PJ-withdrawal can be brutual. :D

I know experiences with InFocus service can be a mixed bag of good and bad, but my dealings with them so far have been very positive. They should get back to me with the evaluation of my RMA request tomorrow.

Thanks Kiran, your answer clarified the matters i wanted to clarify. i.e. whether the 480p spec/ native reslution of my projector was a limit of the scaler or its DLP itself.

Exactly. It's a limit of the projector's DLP chip.

The In72 would automatically scale any signal i send to it to 480p right? i dont need to turn on activate anything?

Right. The only real choice you have is whether to send it 480i or 480p. Anything else gets scaled.

If your DVD player does a good job of deinterlacing, send the projector a 480p signal, if the DVD player is not so good, then sending the projector a 480i signal and letting it convert to 480p might be better. ProjectorCentral's review said that the IN72 looked better when you sent it a 480i signal, but your eyes can tell you the answer.

So if i pipe in a 1080i signal from my DVD player to my In72 via HDMI the picture would be better, worse or similar if i piped in a 480i signal? IN theory it would be the same right as the PJ would scale the signals to 480p anyway.

Once again that depends on the quality of your source's decoding. The projector has to have a scaler because it only has 480 lines. Your source box might have a scaler too, and that scaler might be better or worse than the projector's scaler.

If your source box (HD tuner, for example) does a really good job of scaling, use that. If it does a crappy job, let the projector do the scaling. Experiment with different settings on the source box and see what looks best on the projector.

~ Kiran <entropy@io.com>

on the rebate it says online purchases from best buy and bestbuy,com arent valid, but i can still buy it in store and use the rebate right?

I presume you mean the BestBuy's Magnolia HT? Do they show up on your local dealers list?

its just a regular best buy store.

I got the IN72 from Best Buy, the projector was on sale, $300.00 off. The "fine print" says the rebate is not for Best Buy or Best Buy.com. Rats! You can try....

I have a brand new IN72 that I'am trying to setup. I would like to connect the VGA from a computer and a DVD with DVI output(like Bravo). According to Infocus, for both the VGA and DVI signals, I need to use the M1-DA connector. I know that monoprice has both DVI-D to M1-D and VGA to M1-D cables. But I obviously can't use both of them simultaneously since there is only one M1 connector on the IN72. I see that monoprice also has a DVI to HDMI cable. Since IN72 has an HDMI input, will I be able to connect the DVI side to the DVD player and the HDMI side to the projector and make it work? Thank you for your input.

will I be able to connect the DVI side to the DVD player and the HDMI side to the projector and make it work?Yes.

on the rebate it says online purchases from best buy and bestbuy,com arent validBest Buy is eliminating "mail-in rebates" from their business model!

I expect they are buying the hardware at a better price on the basis that the manufacturer will not have to honour a mail-in rebate. Basically, Best Buy is building the "rebate" into their pricing as an "instant rebate".

I LIKE that idea. I HATE mail-in rebates, as do most people I know!

To quote from the trades:"Best Buy began eliminating mail-in rebates on a category by category basis in April 2005, with the goal of dropping them entirely by 2007. Some 65 percent of all mail-in rebate offers had been eliminated by last April, Best Buy said, which most recently added PCs and accessories to the no mail-in list.

The action followed a 2005 order from the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) for CompUSA to make good on hundreds of thousands of dollars in unpaid rebate claims. The FTC also warned all retailers that they will be held accountable for rebates they advertise, including those sponsored by vendors."

PS. OfficeMax and Dell, amongst others, have also announced similar programs to eliminate mail-in rebates.

Best Buy is eliminating "mail-in rebates" from their business model!

I expect they are buying the hardware at a better price on the basis that the manufacturer will not have to honour a mail-in rebate. Basically, Best Buy is building the "rebate" into their pricing as an "instant rebate".

I LIKE that idea. I HATE mail-in rebates, as do most people I know!

To quote from the trades:"Best Buy began eliminating mail-in rebates on a category by category basis in April 2005, with the goal of dropping them entirely by 2007. Some 65 percent of all mail-in rebate offers had been eliminated by last April, Best Buy said, which most recently added PCs and accessories to the no mail-in list.

The action followed a 2005 order from the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) for CompUSA to make good on hundreds of thousands of dollars in unpaid rebate claims. The FTC also warned all retailers that they will be held accountable for rebates they advertise, including those sponsored by vendors.

Interesting - of course they will say they are doing it in the best interest of the customer (and I agree as I recently got screwed out of $600 cellphone rebates).

That last sentence really says why they are doing this - what that really says is rather than just the third party rebate company or the manufacturer - now the unhappy rebate customer can sue the store and sic the FTC on them!

Certainly a lot cheaper for them then to negotiate a deal with their supplier saying give us the rebate and we will pass it on as a sale. Most likely that will mean a lowering of "instant rebate" values since the whole reason they use them - is not everyone submits them. The store promoted a "sale*" without worrying about sales inventory - and the manufacturer got off with unfullfilled rebates. Of course a big dollar purchase most people will not forget - but how many of us bought a spool of "free" DVD-R because of that trick?



*with mail in rebate

Most likely that will mean a lowering of "instant rebate" values since the whole reason they use them - is not everyone submits them.That's true; I have found MIR forms in my wallet long past their due dates.

But even if you do file properly, its very difficult to get the fulfillment house to actually send you the rebate!

I am currently waiting for about $150 on an Epson printer and a Sandisk SD card. A recent call to the rebate centre stated that I cannot even talk to them about my rebate status until EIGHT WEEKS have passed since filing the claim forms.

Yeah .... I'll remember to do that alright.

can i price match at circuit city and then still use the rebate?

can i price match at circuit city and then still use the rebate?That would be up to CC to agree to the price match but I'm sure their "matching" policies have been adjusted to account for the "instant rebate" phenomena.

InFocus don't care what you paid at retail so long as it was a legitimate dealer.

That would be up to CC to agree to the price match but I'm sure their "matching" policies have been adjusted to account for the "instant rebate" phenomena.

InFocus don't care what you paid at retail so long as it was a legitimate dealer.

I recently shopped and bought and IN72. One thing that I did find out was that infocus may not accept rebate requests when the projector is purchased from unauthorized dealers. I called up many online merchants and talked to them about the rebate and they said that the rebate was not going to be honored by infocus since they were not infocus authorized dealers. I finally did buy mine from an authorized dealer who mentioned the rebate on their site and the customer service person actually knew about the rebate and sent me the rebate form. I also cross checked the Infocus site to make sure that this merchant was listed as an authorized dealer.

If you go to the rebate page - you can get the list of authorized dealers by state and name.

https://www.infocusrebates.com/start/news.php?s_id=&news_id=535

Just another reason Infocus does the rebate - it tends to weed out unauthorized sellers - because the customer even knowing this will often try to submit the rebate with the dealers name listed.

I called Infocus today to ask if a certain (reputable) company is an authorized dealer. I was told that they were 'NOT on the UNAUTHORIZED list, so we can only assume they are authorized'. I asked if they could tell me for sure, and I was told no. What's up with that? I noticed they are not on the AUTHORIZED list either so they must be in some grey area in between...hooray for me :rolleyes:

I might try calling back and talking to someone different...I better hurry before they ship CS to India ;)

They should know to look at that list I just linked when it concerns the rebate - the rebate company has instructions to verify the selling dealer. They should be the same dealers that come up when you enter your zip code into where to buy link. Make sure you state the model when you ask that question - as Infocus serves different markets.

The unauthorized list is for those sleazy sites that Infocus does not even want their name mentioned on - they often are those NY/NJ sites that do not even actually sell it and have very poor reseller ratings. They got listed because they ignored Infocus cease and desist demands. That list is a bit different from the sellers who got the boxes from a distributor despite not being authorized dealers by Infocus (also the chain stores that provide their own warranty and instant rebates) Only those authorized dealers will have customers rebates honoured. Play Big authorized dealers were required to go to mandatory tech sales training before the new models rolled out - that is where the rebate list comes from.

I would certainly pose the question to any seller claiming to be authorized that is not specifically listed as local, online, or deauthorized. At least annamayas found some do indeed tell you they are not! (which goes to the FTC ruling cavu posted - the seller is reponsible for rebate claims)

Sounds like the rebate is working though - a lot more IN72 interest in the thread lately!

What about J&R Music World ? Authorized or not?

Guys you are not supposed to mention specific dealers on this board.....

My apologies...I started out keeping the name under wraps, but I guess I couldn't keep a secret :)

Can't you mention the dealers as long as you don't mention the prices? Seems kinda silly.

Which part of "Do Not Post Deals, Dealers, Or Street Pricing" posted as a sticky at the top of this forum don't you understand? He who owns the sandbox makes the rules.

It's AVS board - if they want to have protectionist policies to prevent dealers from pretending to be satisified customers - it's their board.

Not accusing nick of anything - the point is how do you know he does not work for that seller? As a newbie - there is no way for you to know. Thus the rules.

The only one we should recommend is AVS - because AVS sells the projector. They don't even want you mentioning the alliance members - because they pay for advertising. They won't pay if they are getting free advertising.

Read the rules and discuss it in forum feedback section.

Just for reference, I'm an engineer that works for an automotive supplier in Indiana (not an electronics store in New York;) ) I know I don't have many posts, but you can see that I have been around here for a while. I've always been more of an observer as opposed to a participator.

Cavu...the reason I didn't originally delete my two posts was because I've noticed that it can get rather confusing reading through a thread where pieces are missing here and there. For instance, since you deleted your 'silliness' post directed towards me for editing my posts rather than just deleting them, my reply asking you to chill out (which I in turn had to delete) looked like it was directed towards Kras, which it most definitely was not.

I was originally just trying to help a guy out by answering his question, which I later did through PM as I should have done in the first place.

So, getting back on topic...I love how much quieter my new IN72 is compared to my old 4805 :)

So what do else you think of the sidegrade from SP4805 to IN72? Not many have done that - they are all planning for the HD upgrade!

I haven't had the 4805 since Feb., so it's a little difficult to accurately say. This is only my second day with the IN72, and I don't have a screen anymore so I'm having to use my gold colored wall (which actually isn't all that bad). As I mentioned, it is much quieter. I ran it with v2.2 firmware for a few minutes and it was pretty loud, but as soon as I installed v2.7 it was much better. I did notice that after a couple of hours of operation the fan sped up a bit, but it was about 78-79 in the room...and probably a little hotter than that on the ceiling. I watched some PBS HD (I don't have cable or satellite...weird, huh?) and it looked excellent. I watched a dvd that must have been pretty low budget because it looked only so-so. I'll have to get a new screen and pop in some better films to see if it's much better than my 4805 was in picture quality. So far I'm definitely pleased with it for the price I paid. My biggest complaint with the 4805 was with the noise since I have very sensitive ears, and the IN72 is MUCH better....and I paid less money for it :) I was going to wait around for better technology and preferably 1080, but I couldn't pass up the price.

I've noticed at most retailers that the prices have been jacked back up on these things!!!! On sites where you could click on the shopping cart and get their real price, they're now back to at or just under MSRP.

Has Infocus put another smack down on retailers??

And I was about to purchase an IN72!!! Does anyone have a clue as to an authorized retailer that still wants to make a sale?

Have you tried using the phone? Infocus enforcing click-to-buy pricing is them enforcing their Minimum Advertised Price - it does not take long for folks to figure out the whole click-to-buy MAP "workaround". You might have good luck with sites such as AVS without any click-to-buy ads in fact - and make your deal with Jason/Daniel over the email/phone. So you have to work to get a deal - big deal....AVS might actually even talk to you and help you figure out if your setup has everything it needs and is right for you. And you might even figure out that is worth a fair price compared to the guy that would not even answer your phone or emails!

You also have a pretty good local/internet dealer right there in CO who used to support AVS with shootout reviews and is very knowledgable about Infocus products. No names - I leave you to your own resources - as he does not appear to be an AVS affiliated seller anymore.

We have a deals forum for club members - so don't bother asking here - as the mods will come rushing in if you start talking about who has the deal. But at $1K MSRP after rebate how much more of a deal do you really need - when the projector can easily take on HD projectors that cost twice as much (long as you are sitting 2x away that is!)

out in the gulf of Mexico with my dad. I had hooked a small fish (can't remember what it was) but excitedly reeled it in. I got it to the side of the boat, and dad said hold it there while he got the net to scoop it in. It took him a little while, as it was tangled on a piece of equipment. Meanwhile, my fish sat on the hook in the water, splashing about a little.

Just as dad was about to reach down and scoop it up, I felt e tremendous tug on the line! We looked over, an there was a 5 or 6 foot sand shark, chomping on my fish! He ended up biting off eveything but the head. I asked my dad how that could have happened, and he said -

"Sharks a ill tempered, aggressive fish. They prowl these waters ceaselessly, looking for somthing to bite into. They have this "radar" see, that can sense even from far away when a fish gives off certain signals. Your fish, in splashing about, gave off the right (or wrong, as it were) signal, and in swoops the shark to take a bite out of it. Happens all the time."

I felt bad for not getting my fish in the boat for measuring (we did catch and release).

But not as bad as the fish did, I guess...

Hi all,
Thanks for all info, I watched this thread for the 4 months it took me to decide the samsung 710 I had on order would never appear! So now I've had my in76 up for a week and could use some advice on connection options. I am feeding an oppo 971h, a DTV h20 and a media center pc. I am currently running the oppo on dvi and using component for the DTV box. I am considering;
(1) leaving the oppo dvi, getting a hdmi for the DTV and running either rgb or svideo for the pc.
(2) Getting a dvi switch and connecting everything dvi. The pc has dvi, but the DTV box would need a hdmi to dvi converter.

So, my questions are;

(1) How do I determine the best way to hook up the pc? Will the dvi provide a noticibly superior picture? I use it as a dvr, but that is really about it. If I don't use dvi for it, am I better to go with svideo or rgb??

(2) Are there any issues with dvi switches?? Any preferred brands or units? If I go this way, I want atleast a 4 input switch.

Thanks again,

Dan

Thanks for the moral support, gents. :) As I told the tech support, this PJ-withdrawal can be brutual. :D

I know experiences with InFocus service can be a mixed bag of good and bad, but my dealings with them so far have been very positive. They should get back to me with the evaluation of my RMA request tomorrow.

Almost a week since I got an automated email back confirming my service request, but still no response with RMA... Time to push a little. :mad:

Almost a week since I got an automated email back confirming my service request, but still no response with RMA... Time to push a little. :mad:

if it were mine, i would call everyday and bug until you had resolution. but i'm not, so handle it as you like. just what i would do.

if it were mine, i would call everyday and bug until you had resolution. but i'm not, so handle it as you like. just what i would do.

Been too busy. I'll follow up tomorrow. They'd been very prompt before, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. A little system glitch here and there isn't all that uncommon (sadly.)

jkim, did you look at all the pages of their response, as well as the attachments? My RMA wasn't in the email, it was in an attached file.

Ok really dumb question here, but I searched the thread and couldn't find any mention of it. What is the length of the power cord included with the projector? This could be an issue for me as I have a 10' ceiling in the room where the projector is going.

Thanks,
Steve

I think it's 5 or 6 feet. Doesn't matter though, any decent power cord can be used. I use a 2 meter Acoustic Zen cord and a 25' Monster extension cord which I had kicking around in my closet from another set up. No problem whatsoever.

jkim, did you look at all the pages of their response, as well as the attachments? My RMA wasn't in the email, it was in an attached file.

Hello, Martin.

I'm familiar with the process since I had to get the first one serviced, which they just opted to replace with a new one.

This time, all I got was the automated response saying they received my request, here's the confirmation number for my request, someone will be assigned to my case and will contact me within 48 hrs. I.e. I have not yet received any subsequent response saying my RMA was approved or not, let alone the RMA itself.

Before, within 48 hrs of receiving the automated confirmation email, a rep sent me an email stating my RMA was approved and they decided to do a warranty exchange, and that I should receive the RMA within another 48 hrs. 2 days later, I received the RMA.

I thought this would be perfect time to play around with with some serial port commands, but I'm not getting any response back. I guess it won't work without being powered on, and since I can't power it on, that's that. I figured it was worth the try since it can detect USB connection from "off" state for firware upgrades. I don't see any useful diagnostic commands any way.

BTW: has anyone tried the serial port commands through a terminal emulation software?

What is the length of the power cord included with the projector? This could be an issue for me as I have a 10' ceiling in the room where the projector is going.It is an ordinary IEC computer power cord, probably 6ft.

What you really ought to do is have an have an electrician install an "isolated ground" AC outlet in the ceiling at the mounting location and then get a 1ft computer IEC power cord (http://www.westlake-electronic.com/cgi-bin/store.php?search=yes&detail=yes&rfr=froogle&item_no=CAL-55-782-1&category=POW&SUBCAT=CAL-&rd=1) for the projector.

Ideally, get a second similar isolated ground outlet for your equipment rack; the combination will virtually eliminate potential ground loops.

firmware v2.5 is online
whats new?

firmware v2.5 is online
whats new?
Appears to be nothing new. The only description on the change is:

"For manufacturing reasons only".

It sounds to me like something has changed in the manufacturing process (new vendor for a part perhaps?) and the firmware needed to be changed to accomodate that.

If I have a 110 inch diagonol screen (which is 96 inches wide) -- is 10.5 feet to close to sit with the IN76?

I'll be watching DVDs and High Definition TV primarily. The back of the chairs will be at 11 feet, 2 inches, but with the cushion, my eyes will be more like 10.5 feet from the screen.

I realize this is just over 1.3 times the screen width - -and the typical recommendation is 1.5.

Anyone sit this close with a 110 inch (or larger) screen -- and the IN76?

If I have a 110 inch diagonol screen (which is 96 inches wide) -- is 10.5 feet to close to sit with the IN76?

I'll be watching DVDs and High Definition TV primarily. The back of the chairs will be at 11 feet, 2 inches, but with the cushion, my eyes will be more like 10.5 feet from the screen.

I realize this is just over 1.3 times the screen width - -and the typical recommendation is 1.5.

Anyone sit this close with a 110 inch (or larger) screen -- and the IN76?

I have a 123" screen and am sitting at 13.5 feet. Is it too big? HEEEELLLLLLLL NOOOOOO :) Enjoy it :) Consider yourself lucky when you change to 1080p!

I have a 123" screen and am sitting at 13.5 feet. Is it too big? HEEEELLLLLLLL NOOOOOO :) Enjoy it :) Consider yourself lucky when you change to 1080p!

Well you are at about 1.5 times your screen width. Your screen width is about 108 inches. 108 x 1.5 = 162 (13.5 feet = 162 inches). So of course you should be fine with your setup.

And let me be more specific. I'm not concerned that the image is too "big" -- I'm concerned about quality of that image. In other words, that one might see artificats and pixelation when watching DVDs at that distance.

Do you see pixels or artifacts?

Well you are at about 1.5 times your screen width. Your screen width is about 108 inches. 108 x 1.5 = 162 (13.5 feet = 162 inches). So of course you should be fine with your setup.

And let me be more specific. I'm not concerned that the image is too "big" -- I'm concerned about quality of that image. In other words, that one might see artificats and pixelation when watching DVDs at that distance.

Do you see pixels or artifacts?

my screen is actually 118" wide by 73" tall. I can see some pixelation with white backgrounds, but that's about it. In fact, most people can't even tell.

I looked at it this way, I was preparing for my future upgrade to 1080p and I shouldn't have any worries then. Of course, most of the material I watch is HD so I should state that also.

When I do watch a DVD through my upscaling (and not so good Sammy HD841) I don't notice many artifacts. Then again, I don't go looking for them either :)

Hello, long time reader, don't usually post.

I'm having a hard time deciding if its worth the extra $ to go with the in76 over the 72. Are you really getting that much more for the extra $.

If they were side by side do you think someone could really tell the difference?

Thanks!

from what I have understood, it is not worth it. Wait for a good 1080p.

Hello, long time reader, don't usually post.

I'm having a hard time deciding if its worth the extra $ to go with the in76 over the 72. Are you really getting that much more for the extra $.

If they were side by side do you think someone could really tell the difference?

Do you want to be able to sit closer to the screen, or have a larger image, allowing for a more immersive experience?

Do you want to see more details in HD signals (broadcast and HD-DVD)?

Do you want a smoother image?

I've owned both the 4805 and the IN76, and IMO those are the clearly noticeable advantages that higher resolution brings. Are they worth the extra $$? As is always the case with that question, the answer is "That depends on you." No one can answer that question but you - it's a personal decision. To me it was, that's all I can tell you. :)

Some may say save your money, buy 480p and wait for an affordable 1080p projector. That's one approach, and if your budget is tight that may make sense. I'm sure the IN72 throws a great image, especially with DVD. You just need to adhere to the viewing distance limitation.

But if you can afford the IN76 now, my advice is go for it. It will still be a couple of years before 1080p DLP hits the < $2500 price point, and while you're waiting for that to happen you can enjoy the advantages of the IN76. HD-DVD looks so good on the IN76 you may even decide you can wait for a 1080p projector. :)

... But if you can afford the IN76 now, my advice is go for it. It will still be a couple of years before 1080p DLP hits the < $2500 price point, and while you're waiting for that to happen you can enjoy the advantages of the IN76. HD-DVD looks so good on the IN76 you may even decide you can wait for a 1080p projector. :)

We occasionally enjoy viewing slideshows of family photos from the computer. High res pictures look much sharper with IN76 than the 4805. I have a nephew and a niece who both turned 2 just recently, so there's plenty of new pictures to view together, and it's great fun! :D Of course, I need to send in the 76 to get it fixed, first. :( Finally got around last night to send an email enquiry as to why they hadn't responded to my service request - a rep responded today, and they sent me the RMA a couple of hours later.

1080p is something to drool over, but tops on my wish list for the next PJ upgrade would be features that can drastically help reliability - like cooler running units - via LED lamps or whatever. In the mean time, the 720p resolution is more than good enough for me.

Hi guys.

Do any of you know if a firmware update resets my calibrated IN74?

Hi guys.

Do any of you know if a firmware update resets my calibrated IN74?
Firmware updates revert settings back to their defaults.

Thanks.

Do you want to be able to sit closer to the screen, or have a larger image, allowing for a more immersive experience?

Do you want to see more details in HD signals (broadcast and HD-DVD)?

Do you want a smoother image?

I've owned both the 4805 and the IN76, and IMO those are the clearly noticeable advantages that higher resolution brings. Are they worth the extra $$? As is always the case with that question, the answer is "That depends on you." No one can answer that question but you - it's a personal decision. To me it was, that's all I can tell you. :)

Some may say save your money, buy 480p and wait for an affordable 1080p projector. That's one approach, and if your budget is tight that may make sense. I'm sure the IN72 throws a great image, especially with DVD. You just need to adhere to the viewing distance limitation.

But if you can afford the IN76 now, my advice is go for it. It will still be a couple of years before 1080p DLP hits the < $2500 price point, and while you're waiting for that to happen you can enjoy the advantages of the IN76. HD-DVD looks so good on the IN76 you may even decide you can wait for a 1080p projector. :)


Thanks for the response JeffKB!

I recently got my new IN72 and I have been watching some DVD's using component video inputs on the IN72 and Bravo D1 while waiting for the M1-DVI cable. I got my DVI cable yesterday and I hooked it up to my PJ. And I was surprised to see that the picture coming out of the DVI had dull colors and it was too bright. My component output actually looked much better. Interestingly, someone had posted similar findings on the "Infocus 4805 and Bravo D1" thread. They found that the solution to this problem was to change the Color Scan setting from Auto to RGB-VIDEO. I was unable to do this because the RGB-VIDEO option is unavailable in the ver 2.2 of the firmware on IN72. I will be updating the firmware once I buy a cable. This looks like a DVI output issue with the older firmware on the IN72 but I am still not sure. If anyone can explain this behaviour, please do so here. I am also planning to open an Infocus tech support issue on this.

I just became the proud owner of an IN72, Oppo 970, and an el cheapo Elite 100" pull up screen! My first projector, HDMI direct-digital DVD player, and screen ever! Should be all here next week. I bit the bullet on a floor pull up screen as I'm always moving around from apartment to apartment, and didn't want to deal with trying to hang a fixed screen or wall pull down model. I'll just place the screen right in front of my old TV.

I read some good things about the Oppo, especially if you have a better de-interlacer and output 480i over HDMI. For $150 and the price of an HDMI cable I guess I can chance it (one would think that a Pixelworks processor that can even handle 1080i signals properly would be better than a cheap MediaTek de-interlacer). I hope there isn't a compatibility issue with the IN72 and 480i over HDMI.

It was a tough call between that and waiting for this year's 720p projectors to come down in price, but then I decided I might as well hop over 720p and go straight for a 1080p projector when they're reasonable. The $300 rebate sure was an incentive too! I convinced myself that if I had a 720p projector and a 1080p Blu-Ray or HD-DVD player (or we might wind up with having to get both-- who knows at this point) then I'd always be itching to see the resolution I was missing.

Also, as I'm waiting for the battle of the blue laser media to die down I really don't have HD content at the moment. Cable and satellite HD packages are way too expensive for what you get currently (content and PQ-wise), and the Colorado front range still doesn't have its full power HDTV tower up, and may never at this point!

At least I'll have a 100" screen with vivid colors... almost double the size of the analog RPTV I have now.

Any quickie tweak advice for this combo for when they finally arrive? Thanks!

At least I'll have a 100" screen with vivid colors... almost double the size of the analog RPTV I have now!Actually (assuming you had a 50" 16:9 RPTV) YOUR NEW 100" IS OVER FOUR TIMES LARGER!

You can almost fit FIVE 42" plasma screens in the area of a 92" screen!!

Gives new meaning to PIP!

Anyone have any experience dealing with Infocus service (or should I say lack of)? Wow, I have submitted a request to get a projector return because it stopped working after 45 days. Less then 30 hours on it. It took two days to respond and I have no clue what the status it. It was basically an email asking me to extend my warranty as it runs out in March 2007. Oh by the way that's wrong because I purchased at the end of June. Yet I do not have an RMA, I do not have a projector headed my way for a hot return and football preseason starts this weekend. I am now officially PO'ed and trying to get anyone on the phone is not happening???? Ughhhhh. First and last time I buy from Infocus.

Hurry, Bravo D1 at NewEgg, cheap.

George -bub

I want to use the RS-232 connection on the IN76 for remote control by my HTPC and set Hyperterminal to 19200,8,N,1 no flow control but it won't respond to any commands. Anyone got this working and if so, any tricks I should know about?

Update: Simple solution, you need a null-modem adapter or cable.

Bravo D1 WENT UP BY 30$, I guess i am getting a HTPC from costco now...

VABills, did you try calling InFocus? I've had a number of repairs and an exchange. All my dealings with them were reasonably quick, professional and courteous. Recently, I called with the grinding noise problem. I had an RMA email withing an hour, sent it to them, received it back in less than 10 days total. I couldn't ask for better service.

Will I be able to hook a PS 3 up through an Infocus in72?

VABills, did you try calling InFocus? I've had a number of repairs and an exchange. All my dealings with them were reasonably quick, professional and courteous. Recently, I called with the grinding noise problem. I had an RMA email withing an hour, sent it to them, received it back in less than 10 days total. I couldn't ask for better service.

Yes several times. We'll see how it works out. I expected an email last night with shipping info of one they are sending, and RMA info to return mine. No email yet this morning, so who knows. The last person was friendly enough but seemed to struggle with their internal support systems. The person prior to that was really not interested in helping me fix my projector, just in getting me to buy an extended warranty. I'll play the game until Monday at which point I had better have a projector in hand, or I may have to deal with CC company to get a refund for a defective product in first 90 days.

sorry to hear that VABills, good luck.

Just got a 76 to replace my 4805 that I used with ND2 Filter (62). It does not fit the 76- what size does?
Will it press-fit?

TIA

Have any of the other IN72 owners come across this issue with D1? Please let me know. I have yet to hear from Infocus support on this.

I recently got my new IN72 and I have been watching some DVD's using component video inputs on the IN72 and Bravo D1 while waiting for the M1-DVI cable. I got my DVI cable yesterday and I hooked it up to my PJ. And I was surprised to see that the picture coming out of the DVI had dull colors and it was too bright. My component output actually looked much better. Interestingly, someone had posted similar findings on the "Infocus 4805 and Bravo D1" thread. They found that the solution to this problem was to change the Color Scan setting from Auto to RGB-VIDEO. I was unable to do this because the RGB-VIDEO option is unavailable in the ver 2.2 of the firmware on IN72. I will be updating the firmware once I buy a cable. This looks like a DVI output issue with the older firmware on the IN72 but I am still not sure. If anyone can explain this behaviour, please do so here. I am also planning to open an Infocus tech support issue on this.

The 4805 requires an adjustment to the Gains/Offsets of 58 and 28.5 respectivelywhe using DVI. I wonder if it's the same issue with the IN72?

That is what the RGB-Video is supposed to do - BobWilliams never posted the settings for manual since they had the firmware updates in place. Of course with proper test DVDs one could adjust themselves- if they trusted their source to be reference. If the source is not reference - you have to adjust it anyways!

That is what the RGB-Video is supposed to do - BobWilliams never posted the settings for manual since they had the firmware updates in place. Of course with proper test DVDs one could adjust themselves- if they trusted their source to be reference. If the source is not reference - you have to adjust it anyways!

Thank you. I am guessing by test DVDs, u mean something like AVIA. BTW, where do I adjust the Gain/Offset tabs in the menus? I guess I'll go hunting for these tonight.

Hey guys, i just got my first projector in my life!!! it's just IN72

but now i need to pick up a screen, i want a either 92" or 106" screen and around 250$, can anyone please help!?

+ a Ceiling Mount that can extend 0 to 1 ft!

thanks
Steve

or just tell me what you use!

savage, for my IN 4805 I got the DaLite High Contrast Cinema Vision in a 92" (diagonal) size. I suspect the IN72 would work well with it. On a tight budget, try contacting Jason here at AVS. I'd suggest buying the screen material (which is incredibly well priced) and mounting it on a ready-made frame from an art supply store. You'd have the frame together in two minutes and all you'd have to do is staple the frame to the back. There are many decent alternatives requiring goo, paint, blackout cloth, etc. but I'd go for a real good quality screen material first, and then save even more by mounting it yourself. I recently gave my wife a birthday present of blowing up a photo to a 48" X 36" size. I went to an art supply store and purchased the frame for less than $15. It was perfectly designed to fit together and worked like a charm. No reason a larger frame shouldn't be just as easy, good luck.

Does anyone know why infocus has removed the in72 from their web site? Are they going to dis-continue this model?

Thanks.

Does anyone know why infocus has removed the in72 from their web site? Are they going to dis-continue this model?

Thanks.
It's still there:
http://www.infocus.com/Segments/Entertainment.aspx

The "Home Theater" section only shows the IN74 and IN76. You have to look under the "Home Entertainment" section to see the IN72.

Hello everyone,

I've been reading the CH chat and an curious about the IN76. I've been told by professional's that the IN76 can't handle a CH setup and therefore you need a outboard scaler and lens to get CH. However, when reviewing all the chat on this projector, I've read several posts saying that the IN76 can do the appropriate CH conversation without a outboard scaler - all you need is the lens.

Could someone please explain exactly what they are talking about and how you're doing this. If possible, I'd like to save the $1500 i'd end up spending for a scaler.

I've PM'd the posters who've talked about the IN76 doing the vertical stretch, but I've been redirected back here. Anyone willing to comment? Please fill in the blanks and clear up the clouds.

thanks

thanks,

i am very new to this, is the 106" screen too big for the IN72 projector? i am planning to ceiling mount it around 14-15'

92" or 106" can't decide...

i see the brightness decreases very quickly between 13-15' when i move it back.

any suggestion?

I'd go with the 92" personally. It can certainly project a bigger image but your seating distance should be further away to reduce seeing the pixels. Also, as you notice it starts to lose some punch as you go bigger. Remeber bulbs dim as they age and many people make the mistake of basing their screen size when they are playing with a brand new PJ which has a new bulb. If you want bigger a gain screen is recommended. But for that particular PJ I wouldn't recommend it. And we install a lot of them. So we do see a lot of PJs.

Bob

Hello everyone,

I've been reading the CH chat and an curious about the IN76. I've been told by professional's that the IN76 can't handle a CH setup and therefore you need a outboard scaler and lens to get CH. However, when reviewing all the chat on this projector, I've read several posts saying that the IN76 can do the appropriate CH conversation without a outboard scaler - all you need is the lens.

Could someone please explain exactly what they are talking about and how you're doing this. If possible, I'd like to save the $1500 i'd end up spending for a scaler.

I've PM'd the posters who've talked about the IN76 doing the vertical stretch, but I've been redirected back here. Anyone willing to comment? Please fill in the blanks and clear up the clouds.

thanks

The IN76 does handle the virtical stretch needed in CH setups (I have the IN76 and an ISCOIII projecting onto a 136" Cadara BW screen).

I found this projector to be overly bright when projecting a smaller image. I was happy once I got it back to 101".

I too just got my 1st projector.
I just purchased the IN72 yesterday for $560 and I really like it.

I am moving soon to a family member house until the house I'm buying is fixed up. I sold my 48 inch HDTV so I don't have to move it from location to location. I am also planning on building a movie theather in my basement in the new house.

Anything I should know about the projector. I know the basics, but is there anything that I should really know (problems, calibrations, etc.)?

Right now I will not be buying a screen or mount until I move into the house me and my soon to be wife are buying. So for now I have it in a room that can be really dark when I want it to and a nice clean wall. Only thing is that the wall is light yellow but it still looked good.


Right now I have it on an Audio tower on the top while the DVD player, PS2, Receiver and HD Cable Box is on the glass racks. (Looks nice)
http://www.nextag.com/Bush-Industries-Bush-R-64250483/prices-html
(not for that price)


My only problem is getting the picture to not look slanted. I got it almost perfect but the top left hand side seems like it was a little slanted. The little stand on the bottom gets on my nerves but besides that it's a really good projector.

Any tips on a basic setup and getting that screen perfect.

Zappdap -

It your picture is slanted it means you projector is not square to the screen. Use a tape measure and piece of string to make sure it is absolutely square.

Zappdap, you have a PM.

Well I'm very excited now that I've finally ordered my IN76. Should arrive Monday. :) :)

How many of you have constructed your own screen? Looks like you can make a pretty nice one.

I want to build 2 rows of chairs in my theater and was curious: How high should the back row be above the front row? Obviously enough so the first row isn't blocking the second's view. Is there a suggested number of inches?

Thanks!

Outflying -

Try the Theater Building forum.

Well I'm very excited now that I've finally ordered my IN76. Should arrive Monday. :) :)

How many of you have constructed your own screen? Looks like you can make a pretty nice one.

I want to build 2 rows of chairs in my theater and was curious: How high should the back row be above the front row? Obviously enough so the first row isn't blocking the second's view. Is there a suggested number of inches?

Thanks!

This is what everyone uses for back row height:

http://www.cinegi.com/cgi-bin/riser.cgi

In my case it didn't matter, since code restricted the height of my riser to a max of 10 inches. I wanted 12 inches. But my ceiling height is 7' 8" -- so I couldn't have a 12 inch platform per local code.

How well does the IN76 handle SDTV? I know that FP don't handle it well as group but some are worse (Z4) than others.

Thanks,

N

Don't know about the 76, but my IN4805 does quite well with SDTV, depending on the variables of the broadcast. Since the 76 is a newer higher def pj, I think you'll be quite happy with the 76's SDTV pq, but I'm only guessing.

Great, thank you Evilution.

One more question......That vertical stretch, is that for only true 2.35:1 formats, or will it stretch all formats (2.40:1, 1.78:1, 2.30:1, 2.50:1, etc.....) to fit a 2.35:1 screen?

Just bought my in72. First projector ever, gonna pick it up from circuit city tonight. Thanks for all of the advice everyone!

Has anyone updated their IN76 to firmware version 2.5? Looks like no new functionality was added so I'm thinking it would be best to just stay at 2.4? Bob, any comment?

Thanks,

Tom

Does anyone have any idea if -- apart from the higher resolution -- the IN76's larger DLP-chip differs from the IN74 in any real world regards concerning black level, contrast or luma?

I know the specs of the machines look the same, but since the chip is actually physically larger on the IN76, that might make an impact.

Great, thank you Evilution.

One more question......That vertical stretch, is that for only true 2.35:1 formats, or will it stretch all formats (2.40:1, 1.78:1, 2.30:1, 2.50:1, etc.....) to fit a 2.35:1 screen?
Hi uncle,

Just to clarify how you would do a 2.35:1 setup without a scaler, you would need to get a HE (horizontal expansion) lens with either a passthru mode or the ability to slide it out of the projector's beam. For anamorphic 2.35:1 content, you would engage the lens and set the IN76 to letterbox mode. That will stretch the image vertically by 33%, allowing the lens to horizontally expand it by the same amount and give you a proper 2.35:1 AR.

For 16:9 or 4:3 content, you would slide the lens out of the beam or put it in passthru mode. For 16:9 content you would also have the option of leaving the lens engaged and using 4:3 mode on the IN76, which would vertically stretch the 16:9 image 33% so that it fills the 4:3 frame, once again allowing the lens to expand it to proper 16:9 AR. This is less desirable than moving the lens or putting it in passthru mode however, since you're using less source pixels than native 16:9.

You could use a vertical compression lens for a CIH setup with the IN76 (using letterbox mode for 2.35:1 material, and 4:3 mode for 16:9 material), but the issue here is that there's no real way to display 4:3 material. You'd have to remove the lens and then you'd have to tilt and zoom the projector. As long as you plan to watch only 16:9 or 2.35:1 material you'd be OK.

As for your question on different ARs, the letterbox mode is a fixed stretch ratio - it is not variable. Very mild cropping or very small letterboxing may result if the AR of the film is slightly less than, or slightly greater than 2.35:1. Getting a scaler would allow you to have a slightly more exacting CH setup, but keep in mind that if you have a 2.35:1 screen, only a true 2.35 image will have no letterboxing or pillarboxing.

I should also mention that non-anamorphic 2.35:1 discs will not stretch properly, so those would be an issue. Luckily those discs are pretty rare these days. This is another area where a scaler would have an advantage.

Just bought my in72. First projector ever, gonna pick it up from circuit city tonight. Thanks for all of the advice everyone!

you'll be stoked! it throws an incredible picture and is a terrific value.

Does anyone think the price of the IN76 will drop near or shortly thereafter for CEDIA? Even a couple hundred bucks?

Not supposed to talk pricing, but I bet if you called AVS you might be surprised.

I think what nbagadio is asking about is well within the rules (he's not really asking for prices or anything), the only problem is, none of us really have any idea of what's going to happen to the MSRP on the current crop of projecters when CEDIA hits us here next month. I'm sure we'll probably see a price drop, but how much, and when...we'll just have to wait and see.

So, Are all the issues with the IN76 gone with later firmaware updates or were the issues only with the IN72?

So, Are all the issues with the IN76 gone with later firmaware updates or were the issues only with the IN72?
There were only two initial issues that I'm aware of with the IN76 - there was a lockup issue if you disabled all sources except one, and the fan noise was a little higher than it needed to be in low-power ceiling mode. Both have since been fixed with firmware updates.

ok, great. So the IN76 will have no problems working with a D1 source. How about other SD sources?

I'm oh so very excited because I placed an order for the IN76 yesterday and an order for a 118-inch 16:9 Carada Criterion Screen this morning. I went for the standard classic white screen material which has a gain of 1.0. Thanks to everyone who has helped me out along the way as I made the journey from my old 4805 to the new IN76! :)

I'm looking forward to your observations David, since I hope to work my way over to the IN76 from my 4805 at some point. Good luck.

I'm looking forward to your observations David, since I hope to work my way over to the IN76 from my 4805 at some point. Good luck.
Thanks Martin! I will indeed report back my findings. I'm hoping that going from a 4805 with a 102-inch screen to the IN76 with a 118-inch screen will really take me to the next level, so to speak. I'm also into HD DVD right now so am looking forward to seeing what that technology looks like on a true HD projector.

With a IN76, what is the max screen size one should consider if sitting 16 feet from the screen?

Thank you.

I have an IN72 and i'd like to get a high gain screen for it for daytime viewing for the kids. However i read that a glass bead screen would only work if i floor mount the PJ because the gain is realized only at this angle. However i want to ceiling mount my PJ. Any suggestions?
Mods if this is a mispost just move it to the right forum

With a IN76, what is the max screen size one should consider if sitting 16 feet from the screen?

Thank you.
According to the following link which I've used to figure out my own setup, THX recommends a 143-inch diagonal screen from 16 feet away. Take a look at the calculator as that should help you figure out both SMPTE and THX recommendations for your particular room. Hope this helps!

http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html

yes, you are correct based on that calculator. So that means that to ideally view HD on an IN76 at 16 feet away I will need to increase my screen size to 143 inchs? How would the IN76 handle a screen of that size?

I think they call it GAIN......

After living with the IN72 for a few days, the only real complaint I can say is that YES you really can see the pixels at even 2x the screen width. I couldn't really view the Infocus projectors in my neck of the woods, so I went on blind faith. I guess I can live with it until the big 1080p push. If I'm going to go HD I might as well go all the way! If I make my own screen (I'm using a portable 100" right now) I might shrink the size a bit so the SDE isn't as noticeable.

There is still a brief flashing "noise" when changing aspect ratios, though I updated to firmware version 2.7 from 2.2. That was supposed to be taken care of in the updates, but I guess not. Small nit to pick.

The projector in low power mode is VERY quiet and hardly noticeable even sitting almost on top of it on a temp. table right behind the couch.

I still think Infocus made a few design mistakes by going with the non-standard inset lens, and shrinking the throw ratio on their IN74 and IN76 (a bugger for 2.35:1 screen people). Not being able to put on a threaded neutral density filter is a PITA!!!

Another thing Infocus may want to consider is using the higher end Konica-Minolta lenses on their projectors, even if it means adding a couple hundred on to the price (even if they only break even on the inclusion of it). The newer, better K-M lens is used on Marantz's 1080p projector and it seems to be razor sharp with few issues. You need quality, pro-grade optics so the resolution isn't diminished in that last critical pathway. That seems to be missing in many manufacturers' thinking.

Dan

I'm going to make a comment on SDE, we have been doing some testing with it. There are many recommendations for projector x screeen width i.e. 2x, 1.5x. What we have found when testing is our eyes are not linear like these guidelines suggest. Once the pixels are blown up so big they become easier to see further away then the linear guideline.

For example an IN72 on a 77"diagonal screen with a width of 67" I just start seeing the pixels at about 11 feet. So the 2x is a good guideline but with a 92" screen and width of 80" I can still see the pixels at 18 feet away much further than the 2x recommendation. Also as you go smaller you can't see them at 1.5x the distance. This is with just solid bright colors being displayed and not video material. Brighter projectors also make it easier to see SDE, with the same screen sizes above I don't see Pixels on the Plus Piano (samer resolution PJ in 16x9 mode) at 12 feet on the 92" Diag. screen but it is ~half as bright as the IN72 with a worse contrast ratio.

Also, it varies on the individual, we have had quite a few testers and it can range a few feet between testers. Another side note is we have found it easier to notice SDE on gray screens. I theorize they darken the gap beteen the pixels making it easier to see the SDE.

Bob

After living with the IN72 for a few days, the only real complaint I can say is that YES you really can see the pixels at even 2x the screen width.

Hi Dan,
I've been slowly reading through this vast thread (as I'm about to pull the trigger on an IN72) and if memory serves me correct you owned an X1 or 4805?

Questions;
1/ Are the above pixel issues better or worse than the X1/4805 and/or would you suggest just jumping into a IN76 instead.

2/ Is the IN72 that much advanced over the X!/4805 or should I wait in your opinion?




Thats it, I've been reading to much, Mind,,,, Turning,,,,,,, To,,,,,,, Mush,,,,,,,,, Must,,,,, Stop. :p




Thanks for your time; Jessica :)

This may sounds silly, but the best way to not see the pixels is to not look for them. I have a 4805 and sit around 1.8x the width. I can see the pixels if I try, especially on a plain-white scene. If I just ignore them, they go away. My eyes are 20/20, btw.

Another way is to slightly defocus the picture, but I would rather just try to ignore the pixels.

Another thing Infocus may want to consider is using the higher end Konica-Minolta lenses on their projectors, even if it means adding a couple hundred on to the price (even if they only break even on the inclusion of it). The newer, better K-M lens is used on Marantz's 1080p projector and it seems to be razor sharp with few issues. You need quality, pro-grade optics so the resolution isn't diminished in that last critical pathway. That seems to be missing in many manufacturers' thinking.

Evidently the IN72 uses a different lens than the IN74 and IN76 (per Bob Williams (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6958430&&#post6958430)). The optics on the IN74/76 have a tighter focus tolerance and produce a sharper image. I think this is just a case of the budget model having some compromises in an attempt to keep the selling price as cheap as possible and competetive with other manufacturer's offerings. FWIW I find the optics on the IN76 to be excellent (much better than the 4805's). Focus is sharp and uniform.

K-M lenses would be great, but from what I've read about the custom optics used on the Marantz, it sounds like a comparable lens would be more likely to add a couple thousand to the price tag and not a couple hundred! :eek: Top grade optics are expensive. :)

Hello all,
Since most people here are quite up to speed with the industry, what timeframe in your estimation will 1080p PJ and sources become mainstream? What I am struggling with is if I get the IN76 (still trying to figure out screen size and PJ position from screen), how long do I have before I may want to move to 1080p and would that affect the screen size and PJ position. I am building a new HT room in my new place and am trying to determine where everything (outlets, mount, etc.) will get positioned.

Based on the link David posted, I am looking at a 143 inch screen for seating 16 feet back. Is this beyond the sweet spot of the In76? At what distance would the PJ be ceiling mounted from the screen (i.e. is there a spreadsheet available like the 4805 has?)

Thank you.

16 feet back would be fine for that PJ for that size screen to reduce SDE. You would also need at least a 2.0 gain screen for the brightness. I'd consider a Silverstar.

Throw distance would be ~ 15' 3/4" to 20'
Center of the projector's Lens would need to be ~10 7/8" above the top of the screen.

There is a spreadsheet on Infocus site somewhere.

Bob

Thanks Bob for the info. I really did not realize that I would need to move from a 1.0 HCCV with my 4805 to a 2.0. Would this not be bright and give headaches after hours of viewing?

According to the following link which I've used to figure out my own setup, THX recommends a 143-inch diagonal screen from 16 feet away. Take a look at the calculator as that should help you figure out both SMPTE and THX recommendations for your particular room. Hope this helps!

http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html

For the WORST seat in the house - THX has the recommended viewing angle and the minimum to be certified. It says nothing about the middle seats or the front seats. It is good to know if your home setup will be worse than a THX theaters worst seat - but it is not a rule to be used for placing the seat.

Choose your screen size based on your SDE sensitivity, available gain to achieve desired brightness, and height/width limitations with speakers&walls. Generally Infocus recommends no worse than 4/3 screen width for seating with 720P - your SDE sensitivity may be better or worse.

Since brightness is an inverse function of screen area - there is indeed such a thing as too damn large! If you cannot see the screen because the picture is too dim, and you cannot hear the speakers because they are covered with the screen - it is not an enjoyable movie! (Of course you can spend money on gain perf screens - but they don't exist much!)

Here is the link for the IN7x calculator.
http://www.infocus.com/service/IN72/downloads/in72-74-76%20calculator%20-%20english.xls

A quick guideline for figuring out if the image will be bright enough is to take the lumens rating for the projector and cut it in half. For the IN76 that is 800 for whisper mode. So use 400 lumens for your calculation. Because ANSI lumens is never calibrated lumens. If you read some of the reviews for this PJ they are getting 490-615 lumens calibrated. But that is still with a fresh bulb. The MINIMUM SMPTE standard is 12 ft/l (foot lamberts), I'd shoot for 18+ ft/l to account for aging of the bulb. This is really a rough guideline.

Other factors come into play. Like viewing conditions such as ambient light and color of your walls, ceiling, floor etc. Basically if you can make your room a cave your ft/l requirements will be less than if you watch with lights on and your room is all white. This will increase the ft/l needed. Use the calculator and try the different settings.

As a side note. Kras brought up a good point and is often overlooked in systems. Audio! Don't sacrifice your audio for the largrest screen possible. If you are going to have to put your speakers in the corner or your center is going to sit on the floor or near the ceiling. It is not a good tradeoff. I'ver seen many DIY installations that had absolutely terrible audio because of this. An acoustically transperent screen is a good option but you are probably at least tripling your costs to do it right.

Bob

Here is the link for the IN7x calculator.
http://www.infocus.com/service/IN72/downloads/in72-74-76%20calculator%20-%20english.xls

A quick guideline for figuring out if the image will be bright enough is to take the lumens rating for the projector and cut it in half. For the IN76 that is 800 for whisper mode. So use 400 lumens for your calculation. Because ANSI lumens is never calibrated lumens. If you read some of the reviews for this PJ they are getting 490-615 lumens calibrated. But that is still with a fresh bulb. The MINIMUM SMPTE standard is 12 ft/l (foot lamberts), I'd shoot for 18+ ft/l to account for aging of the bulb. This is really a rough guideline.

Other factors come into play. Like viewing conditions such as ambient light and color of your walls, ceiling, floor etc. Basically if you can make your room a cave your ft/l requirements will be less than if you watch with lights on and your room is all white. This will increase the ft/l needed. Use the calculator and try the different settings.

As a side note. Kras brought up a good point and is often overlooked in systems. Audio! Don't sacrifice your audio for the largrest screen possible. If you are going to have to put your speakers in the corner or your center is going to sit on the floor or near the ceiling. It is not a good tradeoff. I'ver seen many DIY installations that had absolutely terrible audio because of this. An acoustically transperent screen is a good option but you are probably at least tripling your costs to do it right.

Bob

My HT room will be totaly light controled with dark color walls and ceiling. I am thinking using the spreadsheet that a 110" diagonal with a 1.0 gain screen will a good option, however the brightness works out to 22.2 ft/l

Hello; My new in72 seems to be a little more bright in the left side, expecially in the left side bottom corner, but only when display a dark inage (it's more greyish than the rest of the screen, but not a lot).

It's table mounted and this is only appreciable under totally black screen;

I can return it if it's a malfunction.

Please, I'll apreciate your help.

Thanks.

Sorry for my english.

I edit to say that my screen it's only 72 inchs diagonal.

Actually, a 110" with a 2.0 gain screen if using 400 lumens for the calc. So, I would need to get or use my existing ND2...right? Even with that it is 22.2 ft/l, which may be too bright for constant viewing?

a 110" 1.0 gain screen will be fine with the IN76 in a totally light controlled dark theater. If you drop to 10 ft/l near the end of the bulbs life it won't be a big deal. But, in an ambient situation it wouldn't be acceptable.

If you go with a 2.0 gain 22ft/l is not considered too bright for most people. Anf if it is you can always use the filter.

Bob

what is the difference between long and short throw and which one (or combination of both, or closer to one) should be used for optimal placement?

Long throw better contrast, short throw brighter. It is not a huge difference with a 1.3x zoom, so use the one that best fits your installation.

Bob

I thought I had previously read posts of IN76 owners using the Chief RPA Inverted Ceiling mounts with their projector. I checked the compatibility list on mountsandmore.com but did not see an adapter for the IN7x series. I emailed them and they said they currently do not offer a compatible adapter plate.

What gives? Doesn't anyone use the Chief mount with their IN7x? I'm very surprised they wouldn't offer an adapter...

With the more cost effective universal mounts - many mount companies are cutting back on the custom adaptor plates.

I'm using the universal Chief RPA mount on my IN76 and it works great. I like this option so that when the inevitable projector upgrade occurs I'll be able to use the same mount.

Which adapter plate do you have on it? I have that mount too, but was considering upgrading to the IN76. I originally got my Chief mount with the RPA-064 plate for the Infocus SP5000 and wondered what I'd need to get the IN76 to work with it.

New guy and new to Projectors.
I have had my IN72 for about two weeks and love it.
There is the issue of seeing pixels, but it seems I only notice it.

I am also projecting on an off white wall and with s-video connection.

Screen upgrades and source upgrades will make a difference I hope, but overall I wish I had bought a pj a long time ago.

ps. 8.31.06 is the end of the $300 InFocus rebate.

The MINIMUM SMPTE standard is 12 ft/l It doesn't invalidate your advice BUT this statement is incorrect.

The SMPTE standard states that the brightness level be 16fL with no film in the gate.

Period.

The spec never mentions 12fL or any other brightness. But 12fL might be a good guess of the brightness with a piece of transparent film in the gate.

are there any other owners of in76 who has had their projector die on them?
within the last six months ive had two simply shut off in the middle of a movie.
at first, i thought it may have overheated.
after getting a replacement, it died again.
this time, i made sure the room was plenty cool enough before starting up the projector
just today, while watching the Pink Floyd Pulse DVD, it died again
no blinking light, nothing
i am very leery of dealing with infocus service(unpleasant past experience)
fortunately, i purchased from costco, so returning it is no problem
except, i noticed that they are no longer selling the IN76 :mad:

cavu

Digital Cinema upholds the 12ftL - codifying the derating of the 16ftL to account for no film (since there is none in Digital Cinema). They also allow for headroom/footroom in digital signal for DSP overshoot just like with HDMI - thus peak whites are 14ftL while reference whites are 12ftL. Digital Cinema projectors have the bit and contrast depth to afford calibrating to leave the headroom open - which is not a good idea with home projectors as that drastically lowers contrast.

It is a good idea to design for 16ftL assuming a new lamp so that the old lamp is 8ftL (averageing 12ftL) - even better to design for 24ftL (worst 12ftL) allowing some ambient lite or underperforming lamp margin.

It is even better if people would stop relying on ProjectorCentral for lumens numbers who has proven themselves more than useless in that regard - often rating obviously dim projectors the same lumens as obviously brite projectors. Ask instead of your reviewers how much % drop it was from maximal achievable - that is more useful setup info as marketers do not lie about their max lumens (they may get tricky but they don't lie!) - but consumer grade sensors and unaware calibrators are not helping matters.

My sensor agrees with marketing about max (lucky me - even NIST lightmeters have been found not to be calibrated) - and I confirmed the 20% drop in low lamp and <10% drop from Native to 6500K. I use 720 lumens on the IN76 for new lamp.

jv1224

nobody is so unlucky - either it is something in the install - or you have engaged the sleep timer. The club warehouse has never been an authorized dealer - but it does not matter since they take anything back they ever sold anytime. Although you would be doing the rest of us a favor if you hire someone to look your install over rather than adding to the refurb pile.

12-13ft/l is with film in the gate. It is mentioned on SMPTE in the notes and D-cinema is 12 ft/l. For an open gate the range is 12-22ft/l with less than 10 ft/l considered not acceptable.

Bob

kras

thanks for the reply
i don't think it could be the sleep timer since ive never turned it on
i'm not sure what you mean when you say it might be something in the install
the projector's been sitting on a coffe table connected via the DVI cable to the pc/hdmi to the hd dvd player.
as far as hiring someone, as i'm pretty new at this, i would not know where to look
any suggestions? someone in the s. cal area?
and how much would it cost?
the wife has been pretty tolerant of my home theater expentiture so far but i could only push so far
again, thanks for the reply

Hi All,

Went from a 4805 to an IN72 and had one small issue that I seemed to have worked through.

I am using an HD OTA tuner which is outputting a 720p image.

In the 4805 this was rendered brilliantly and there was a huge step up in image quality over DVD.

On the IN72 the projector would occasionally drop a "strong signal" and then reacquire it. But the real problem was that about every 5 seconds the top 10% of the entire image would shift leftward in a quick movement. (So the upper left corner of the screen had a "shark fin" shape to it, and so did the entire image accross the screen).

After flashing to firmware 2.7, which made no change, I went into the settings and lowered the "sync threshold adjust" from the default 67 to the next step down "58". And VOILA, problem gone.

My question is, what is the most favorable "sync threshold adjust" setting. Should it be as high as possible without the problem occurring or do I need to investigate more?

Hi All,

Went from a 4805 to an IN72 and had one small issue that I seemed to have worked through.

I am using an HD OTA tuner which is outputting a 720p image.

In the 4805 this was rendered brilliantly and there was a huge step up in image quality over DVD.

On the IN72 the projector would occasionally drop a "strong signal" and then reacquire it. But the real problem was that about every 5 seconds the top 10% of the entire image would shift leftward in a quick movement. (So the upper left corner of the screen had a "shark fin" shape to it, and so did the entire image accross the screen).

After flashing to firmware 2.7, which made no change, I went into the settings and lowered the "sync threshold adjust" from the default 67 to the next step down "58". And VOILA, problem gone.

My question is, what is the most favorable "sync threshold adjust" setting. Should it be as high as possible without the problem occurring or do I need to investigate more?

i don't know the answer to that, but ould also be curious to hear it as well. i have mine around 40'ish as high 40's and low 50's would ocasionally wack out with HD.

i freaked hen i first got my in76 and it was doing that! i thought i had a lemon!!! thank goodness for avs. someone answered my post in like 5 minutes. :)

Is there anyone out here that went from 4805 to the IN76 and tested out the difference with the use of a Xbox 360? Just wondering if the upgrade is worth it. I know not exactly a easy question. Also, if someone has pics that would be great.

One other question, is it out of line to ask if the IN76 will be in the $1400-1700 in say 6 months or so?

One other question, is it out of line to ask if the IN76 will be in the $1400-1700 in say 6 months or so?

Well, I hope not because I am hoping to see it there around BF. But then again, we are talking prices here and that is not allowed, or is it just actual prices from merchants and not speculation :confused:

[QUOTE=Mako PJ]Is there anyone out here that went from 4805 to the IN76 and tested out the difference with the use of a Xbox 360? Just wondering if the upgrade is worth it. I know not exactly a easy question. Also, if someone has pics that would be great.

i had a 4805 for about a year when the 360 came out
bought the 360 and wasn't too impressed with the image
mind you, it was better than anything i'd seen before but i felt something was missing.
about a month later, purchased the in76 and was blown away by the improvement
sorry i can't be more technical but to my eyes the upgrade is definately worth it

" or is it just actual prices from merchants and not speculation "

I don't thing speculating on a price is against the rules, correct me if I'm wrong anyone..

Not sure where the price will be, but with the new Mitsu 3100 being DarkChip 3 and MSRP around $2k, my only guess is that prices will be driven down until the reach a steady state (which seems to be around the $1500 - 1800 range for this class). Think of DVD players which eventually hit a steady state pricing of $99.

Thank you and the others for the reply. Hopefully, the IN76 is in the 1500-1800 price range by spring, I will probably get it.

[QUOTE=Mako PJ]Is there anyone out here that went from 4805 to the IN76 and tested out the difference with the use of a Xbox 360? Just wondering if the upgrade is worth it. I know not exactly a easy question. Also, if someone has pics that would be great.

i had a 4805 for about a year when the 360 came out
bought the 360 and wasn't too impressed with the image
mind you, it was better than anything i'd seen before but i felt something was missing.
about a month later, purchased the in76 and was blown away by the improvement
sorry i can't be more technical but to my eyes the upgrade is definately worth it

There will always be something better just above your price point as last years products get cheaper to make way for next years products.

One also has to figure in the lost opportunity costs of continuing to watch their POS TV when they could have been watching a 9' widescreen.....

One has to decide if they are an early adopter who takes pleasure in having what nobody else has - or a late to market who gloats how much money they saved on closeout specials.

I was wondering when IF would have a DC3 offering. ... not until next product cycle?

What's the best way to get the best use out of the IN72. I just recieved my M1 to USB/VGA cable. I haven't hooked it up yet to do the firmware update.

I tweeked with some settings once I got it but not many. Is there any settings I should set to get the best performance out of this great projector?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Also what does the firmware update do for the projector. I checked last night and it says I have firmware 2.2.

Kras,

You're absolutely right about waiting until the price comes down. I bought my IN76 a few months ago and the price will probably drop by a good $300 to $400 or more in the next few months. Do I wish I had waited... ABSOLUTELY NOT! Heck, I've probably saved that much by not going out to the movies since I bought the projector.

I say look for the best deal you can get on the one you like now and BUY IT! There will always be something better or cheaper right around the corner.

Doug

A little offbeat, but does anyone own a IN76 and use it with the DirecTV especially the NFL Sunday Ticket? What's the PQ like?

Thanks!

What's the best way to get the best use out of the IN72. I just recieved my M1 to USB/VGA cable. I haven't hooked it up yet to do the firmware update.

I tweeked with some settings once I got it but not many. Is there any settings I should set to get the best performance out of this great projector?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Also what does the firmware update do for the projector. I checked last night and it says I have firmware 2.2.

v2.7 18-Jul-2006 For manufacturing reasons only

v2.6 23-June-2006 Improved fan control and audible noise
Keystoning improved in ceiling mode
Resolved image shift with 480i/576i signals
Resolved compatiblity issues with Panasonic DVD-297 DVD player with HDMI.
Splash screen expanded to fill 16:9 space.
Fixed issue where the projector would stop sub-source searching on the M1-DA connector if all sources except M1-DA are disabled.
Fixed a hue shift issue with some 1080p component sources.
Computer does not go into Power Save mode while upgrading software.


v2.5 14-April-2006 Improvements to video syncing table
HDMI video codes corrected (1-34)
Fixed interlaced computer sources image shift.
Fixed no image issue after 4 hour sleep mode was initialized.
Added M1 and HDMI in HDMI DDC option.
Fixed lockup issues when disabling all "source enables" except for one, then power cycling unit.
Corrected hue shift in the black levels for component video inputs.
Removed fan speed increase during power down.
Fixed vertical position jump, when aspect ratio is set to crop top and bottom of the image.

Thanks alot BLuto!

After I posted this I went on their site at work and found the info. I will be running the update when I get back in the house from picking my daughter up.

Once again thanks

I just bought the IN74 (576x1024 pixels) at a discount. Now, I live in Sweden but own mostly NTSC dvd:s and passed on the IN72 'cause I wanted to avoid SDE (at my screensize and viewing distance) and also to get the extra contrast. I couldn't afford the IN76 but figured I wouldn't watch any HD-material for at least two years anyway. I've just ordered the Pioneer 79AVi dvd-player which I will use to scale and deinterlace. In regards to all this, I just have one question:

Is there any theoretical difference in PQ between -- on the one hand -- scaling from 480p to 576p for delivery to the IN74 and -- on the other hand -- scaling from 480p to 720p for delivery to a IN76?

The reason I'm asking is that -- from what I know -- some scalers/deinterlacers give better PQ at certain upscaled resolutions and not nessecarily the best PQ at standard def (unscaled). Could there by any truth to this, especially in regards to the Pioneer 79AVi and the new Infocus models?

Hello; My new in72 seems to be a little more bright in the left side, expecially in the left side bottom corner, but only when display a dark inage (it's more greyish than the rest of the screen, but not a lot).

It's table mounted and this is only appreciable under totally black screen;

I can return it if it's a malfunction.

Please, I'll apreciate your help.

Thanks.

Sorry for my english.

I edit to say that my screen it's only 72 inchs diagonal.


That is exactly the problem I had with my X1. I saw the same issue
even with the second X1 and then reliazed it is a flaw. Thanks to the
geniuses at Infocus.

No one here believed. For some reason Infocus owners cant stand
if any Infocus product is criticized. After all it is a piece of electronics.
So I dont understand their emotional attachment to a box of
poorly/cheaply made circuitry.

I feared the same issue with 4805 but it was fine.

I didnt expect it with In72. There is no quality control on these
cheap projectors which are mass produced off-shore.

Two questions: I ordered the IN76 from one of the forum alliance members on 7/24, at which point it immediately went out out of stock. Called AVS a few days ago and they were also out of stock and had no firm date on when more would be available... Has anyone who ordered recently been actually able to get the product? Why the dearth of IN76's?

My other question is can anyone explain CNET's somewhat negative review (05/03/06) which said the following:
We would have preferred more accurate color, however, especially in the primaries (see the geek box). Color decoding was quite good, which also gives the IN76 excellent color saturation when set up properly. Grayscale in the 6,500K setting, unfortunately, was extremely minus blue, which tinged darker areas a bit too reddish. Calibration fixed this problem and improved color accuracy, especially the look of skin tones.
Love the thread and can't wait to get the IN76, thanks!

If you have perfect HD accurate colors - you have a much dimmer projector (at least 2x dimmer - likely 3x dimmer)

Instead Infocus goes with what most calibrators want to do anyways - and use the DVD colors (even for HD just like the mastering engineers CRT). Infocus does lighten up the green a bit - it is brighter that way and you don't notice except for direct comparisons - some calibrators just don't use charts that represent what you see. We (local AVS meet) tested it against the Mitsu HC3000 - which has perfect HD color after calibration - once I put the ND3 filter (to equalize brightness) on the IN76 there was a subtle difference noticed with deeper greens on the Mitsu. What was more important was they both had correct color decoders so that real life was not like watching a cartoon - which is a hack that marketing types like to do!

There is nothing wrong with the blue and red colors - other than some calibrators insist on measuring colors on screen where their sensor is least accurate because it is dim already - then they try to measure dim colors (no matter how expensive the sensor is they are not ranged for dark HT screens). I measure colors using a 2' wide image so that colors are bright and my sensor is still accurate.

The first thing your lamp will do is lose red brightness. The red pushed greyscale calibration is by design that Infocus is going with some excess red - then it drifts into calibration as you lose red. This does not take long - already at fifty hours it has burned off on my demo - but how many calibrators have that long of time with a demo? How many reviewers track greyscale changes over time?

Eventually you lose more the Red brightness and your lamp drifts very Cyan - most people would just buy a new lamp rather than pay for calibration by then as it is too dim anyways!. Compare this to projectors with poor red spectrum - with a native color temp of 11000K so calibration requires losing tremendous amounts of blue/green to make up for lacking red and thus brightness is lost at calibration- even with the initial lamp which gets even worse after burn-in!

Calibrators measuring Kelvin difference are not telling you what you can see - but what their sensor measured - the same Kelvin difference pushed red is less noticeable than that pushed blue (and this ignores the fact that Kelvin indicates nothing about green/magenta pushed) Calibrators should be using the delta E measure which accounts for these things - in fact reporting Kelvin as calibration results is an ISF test disqualification!

I guess I will just start having to put my own reviews out and make all other reviewers obsolete! It truly is a shame that ISF does not teach the color science and updated their measurement standards - all this was sorted out in 1976 - we can indeed measure what your eyes perceive and objectively grade the results.. :D

Not sure what is up with AVS out of stock - but the other vendor did have some problems. Keep in mind that these are made in China - everyone has to wait on those container ships! I would not worry about it - before too long thread trolls that worry about chinese made goods will have to be working in china if they want to have a job anymore!

I have scanned through the thread, but I haven't seemed to find a "definitive" answer (maybe I missed it). I am wondering if the newest firmware update actually reduces the fan noise in the low power setting. At this point, that is pretty much my only gripe (and it is a small one). Would I be able to do the upgrade while the projector is still ceiling mounted?

Heboil, yes it does and yes you can

Is it just me, or is the Standard Sharpness level with the IN76 just too darn soft ??
I love this projector in every (other) way and I don't have HD service or HD DVD but was wondering if the IN76 Sharpness levels are comparable to similar 720p projectors? I now use the Sharper level and tolerate the additional graininess because the Standard looks out of focus.

No - standard is correct - get a test pattern DVD that has a resolution sweep and single scan line patterns. You will see the damage Sharper does to high frequencies - aliasing them to the point they are a jaggy ringing mess. The grain you note is exactly the side issue with it - by overemphasizing soft lines to be sharp lines. If you look more closely at your now sharp lines - you will see they have shadows around them now.

Thanks Kras for your quick reply. Would you say that the Standard Sharpness level for the IN76 is a bit soft compared to similar projectors with the same setting? Is there any way to improve the Sharpness level while using the Standard setting? I mostly view SD via S-video.

Is it just me, or is the Standard Sharpness level with the IN76 just too darn soft ??
I love this projector in every (other) way and I don't have HD service or HD DVD but was wondering if the IN76 Sharpness levels are comparable to similar 720p projectors? I now use the Sharper level and tolerate the additional graininess because the Standard looks out of focus.

I also noticed this with my IN72. I find the sharpness soft so i up it a notch.

I would say that DVD players and display marketing departments do everything to fool you into thinking you have a sharper display beyond actually spending money on a sharper display. When you actually see one that is correct - you think something must be wrong.

Okay guys, here's an interesting troubleshooting problem. I have an IN76 with ca. 100 hours connected to a Pioneer DV747A DVD player with a component cable, and a Digital TV decoder using composite. Last sunday I spent happily moving my electronics about, only to find out that suddenly some DVD's that were just fine earlier, absolutely refuse to play through the component port - the IN76 seems to be unable to lock on. TV programs show ok via the composite port, and all DVD's are fine using the <shudder> S-Video connection (which actually doesn't look al that bad, but component is definitely better, boys and girls). Of course, putting back everything as it was didn't help.

As far as I can tell the IN76 did not get jerked about by the component connector, if only because 1) there's enough slack in the cable to take up the tension even if I do manage to stumble over it (note to self: start thinking about ceiling mounting ;-)) and 2) the projector is mounted on foam which easily slides about on the table surface.

My problem: if some DVD's show fine using component, the projector hardware must be ok; on the other hand, so must the DVD player, for the same reason! Does anyone here have a clue as to what's going on here?

Walter Zed, Netherlands

z500, first, welcome to the forum. Anytime you move gear around it's possible that you may lose your settings. If the pj works well with TV and not with DVD, it's more than likely the DVD player. First, make sure you component settings are at neutral. DVD's can be different depending upon their original siource, (film, video, etc.) which might account for the differences you're noticing. You have to check all you settings on the DVD player. Is it set for 480i or p, 720p or another resolution? Make sure the setting on the DVD player is a match for the projector input. Keep us posted. Good luck.

Hi Martin, thanks for the quick reaction. Unfortunately, my DVD player is such a dinosaur (5+ years old I think) that it doesn't have those settings.

A more detailed description: when watching a "problem" DVD (or rather, trying to), all I get is the blue splash screen with an occasional flicker. When I have the projector menu on screen, the settings flicker between the preset and "greyed out", with the latter showing most of the time.

I will go and compare DVD's though, to see if the problem ones have something in common - Saving Private Ryan, Excalibur and Strets Of Fire won't work, Lord of the Rings and We Were Soldiers Once are fine. I haven't found the courage to try any other discs yet... ;-)

Walter Zed

PS feel free to call me Walter, Z500 is just a login name. Zed or Zedman is ok too. Do NOT feel free to call me Walt, dat is schtricktly Verboten ;-).

Hah! Problem solved. An old trick I learned in 8 years of (network-) printer tech support popped up in what's laughingly referred to by some as my brain: "When you can't think of anything, try a cold reset."

I assume you can fill in the missing bits ;-).

Walter Zed

Good news Walter! Unless you're waiting for Blu-Ray, you might want to consider a new DVD player anyway. The OPPO 971 and 970 are two excellent choices that won't break the bank and will give you just about all that can be had from a standard def DVD. There's a site called Secrets of Home Theater that rates the OPPO at the top or near the top of all DVD players as far as pq is concerned.

I'm not sure that brand is available here in the Netherlands. Not to mention that by the time I have enough cash, Blu-Ray will have gone the way of VHS anyway ;-) (Edit: after checking the website you mentioned, I might end up with a new DVD player a bit earlier than the year 2525... Them Oppo's is cheap!)

Of course, now that one problem has been solved, an older one is back - the flickering image. I thought I had it licked earlier by keeping the signal cables away from the power leads (great for improving sound as well) but even that doesn't help now.

Damnation! (Full marks to those who can identify the character and the film.)

Walter Zed

And now I have 222 pages of Oppo discussion on AVS to wade through, plus a Dutch discussion site. AND I found a Dutch reseller (http://www.livingcinema.nl/ for my fellow Hollanders). And looking at the EUR 225 pricetag, my idea to spend the next available 250 EUR on a high quality power cord extension box (or whatever the hell it's called in English) has just been ever so slightly modified.

Thank you Martin. If the credit collection agency come by I'll give them your address ;-).

Walter Zed

PS what's the Oppo's sound quality with normal CD material?

I also noticed this with my IN72. I find the sharpness soft so i up it a notch.

I second that. I notice the problem with my IN72 too. When I reported that I had the turn up the sharpness a little higher than standard, I was yelled at here. :-)

I was finally able to take some pictures of my RGB and RGB-Video issue with IN72. I hope this information is helpful to new owners of IN72. I have uploaded pictures of both a scene from The Fifth Element with both the Color Scan modes for comparision. As you can see, the difference is pretty significant.

http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/in72_rgb.jpg
http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/in72_rgbvideo.jpg


I recently got my new IN72 and I have been watching some DVD's using component video inputs on the IN72 and Bravo D1 while waiting for the M1-DVI cable. I got my DVI cable yesterday and I hooked it up to my PJ. And I was surprised to see that the picture coming out of the DVI had dull colors and it was too bright. My component output actually looked much better. Interestingly, someone had posted similar findings on the "Infocus 4805 and Bravo D1" thread. They found that the solution to this problem was to change the Color Scan setting from Auto to RGB-VIDEO. I was unable to do this because the RGB-VIDEO option is unavailable in the ver 2.2 of the firmware on IN72. I will be updating the firmware once I buy a cable. This looks like a DVI output issue with the older firmware on the IN72 but I am still not sure. If anyone can explain this behaviour, please do so here. I am also planning to open an Infocus tech support issue on this.

Walter, the OPPO sounds fine. Nothing to be excited about, nothing special, but movie dialogue is more intelligible than my $1000 Denon 3910 was, so it can't be too bad.

Hi,
i own an InFocus IN76 but i wanted to know if anybody else that had one could help me.
My Projector is working fine and it looks great but there is something that i have noticed in the image that i dont know if it can be fixed.
When i play a dvd or videogames with my xbox 360.....the image shows these barely noticable lines that move up. I can notice it when the image is still or when its all black. I have been trying to get rid of those lines....
I dont believe it is the projector becuase when it has no signal, it shows the InFocus image without the lines so i think it has something to do with the signal but im not sure.
I currently have it connected with a component cable to my receiver.

If anyone has any idea what might be causing these lines or has had the same problem please let me know.

thanks

What kind of cable? Patch, cheap ones or quality shielded ones?

Found a new review of the IN76:

http://www.hometheaterblog.com/hometheater/2006/08/infocus_in76_vi.html#more

It mentions that HD material looks best when the projector is fed a 1080i signal (as opposed to 720p):

"I watched a wide range of programming via Comcast, both HD and standard definition and I found that the IN76 fed 1080i gave the best results. Once again straying from the feed your display its native resolution mantra. The whole 'send your display its native rate' argument is diminished by how many displays are including high quality video processors of late.

Simply put if the display has a superior video processor you’re often better off feeding it a interlaced signal and letting the internal processor work it’s magic versus the source component. Of course there are obvious exceptions to this rule and quite frankly too many to mention here. Suffice to say that I take a lets see approach to any such example these days but I’ve actually gotten to the point where I can predict the results with reasonable accuracy."


Do others find this to be the case? Do you feed 1080i or 720p HD to this projector? I know with the comcast box, you can set it to output either 1080i or 720p.

Hi All,

I've been reading the threads a few weeks ago before buying my pj. I got my IN72 for a few weeks now and I have barely used it cause I need to finish my HT setup. Anyway, I just received my cable from infocus and decided to perform the firmware upgrade.
I downloaded the file and started the thing, I decided to leave the pc alone and went away to do a few things for a minute or so, when I came back I saw a verification error on the screen and now the pj would not start at all, no lights or anything? Is there a cold reset instruction?
I had firmware 2.2 and was upgrading straight to 2.7? Any help you can provide will be really appreciated.
Thanks,
Martin

What kind of cable? Patch, cheap ones or quality shielded ones?

Im using a pretty good cable actually. I bought it on ebay and it says its a Hi-grade component video cable.

It says it has double metal shielding and has 24k Gold-Plating so it not a bad cable at all so im not sur ewhat could be causing the lines.

Fixed!

I've used the "Camelot_One"'s method from jkim5453's post.

1. Unplug the PJ.
2. Connect the PJ to PC via USB.
3. Run Flash USB -> "Flash Mode" disabled. Status: "waiting for connection..."
4. Load the .dld -> "Flash Mode" still disabled. Status: "waiting for connection..."
5. While holding down both "<" and ">" keys on the PJ, plug in the PJ.
6. Status: "connected". "Download" button enabled. "Flash Mode" still disabled.
7. Update, confirm through service menu that new firmware is in place.

Found a new review of the IN76:

http://www.hometheaterblog.com/hometheater/2006/08/infocus_in76_vi.html#more

It mentions that HD material looks best when the projector is fed a 1080i signal (as opposed to 720p):

"I watched a wide range of programming via Comcast, both HD and standard definition and I found that the IN76 fed 1080i gave the best results. Once again straying from the feed your display its native resolution mantra. The whole 'send your display its native rate' argument is diminished by how many displays are including high quality video processors of late.

Simply put if the display has a superior video processor you’re often better off feeding it a interlaced signal and letting the internal processor work it’s magic versus the source component. Of course there are obvious exceptions to this rule and quite frankly too many to mention here. Suffice to say that I take a lets see approach to any such example these days but I’ve actually gotten to the point where I can predict the results with reasonable accuracy."


Do others find this to be the case? Do you feed 1080i or 720p HD to this projector? I know with the comcast box, you can set it to output either 1080i or 720p.

Anyone got an answer on this: feeding 720p or 1080i to the projector (which is better)?

Anyone got an answer on this: feeding 720p or 1080i to the projector (which is better)?

With image scaling it will always depend on the devices in question. If you have a signal that is anything other than the displays native resolution (1280x720 in the case of the IN76) then scaling must take place. The question is which scaler does a better job. In the case of that review he found the scaling in the IN76 to be better than the sources scaler and recommended feeding it the 1080 signal. Will this always be the case? No. You may run into a situation where the source does a better job than the display in scaling the image. If the signal is natively 720p then you certainly wouldn't want to scale it to 1080 as any scaling will effect the picture quality.

What the reviewer is likely seeing is the IN76 excellent scaler at work on 1080 signals, which is one it's advantages vs. the competition in it's price segment. It weaves the 1080i signal rather than bobs it which means it is taking the 1280x720 image from a full 1920x1080 frame rather than the 1920x540 field the majority of the competition uses (data can't be created from nothing so the information lost in horizontal resolution from bobbing the image can not be recreated).

So the answer is, there is no absolute answer. A fixed panel device, like the IN76, can only display it's native resolution. Any non native signal must be scaled. Either the source or display could potentially have a better scaling method, experimentation is the only way you'll know which is better.

Is there a way to switch between video levels 16-235 and pc levels 0-255 on the in76? I intend on using my pc for home theatre using vmr9 with video levels, but also play a game sometimes.

Thank you,
Martin

With image scaling it will always depend on the devices in question. If you have a signal that is anything other than the displays native resolution (1280x720 in the case of the IN76) then scaling must take place. The question is which scaler does a better job. In the case of that review he found the scaling in the IN76 to be better than the sources scaler and recommended feeding it the 1080 signal. Will this always be the case? No. You may run into a situation where the source does a better job than the display in scaling the image. If the signal is natively 720p then you certainly wouldn't want to scale it to 1080 as any scaling will effect the picture quality.

What the reviewer is likely seeing is the IN76 excellent scaler at work on 1080 signals, which is one it's advantages vs. the competition in it's price segment. It weaves the 1080i signal rather than bobs it which means it is taking the 1280x720 image from a full 1920x1080 frame rather than the 1920x540 field the majority of the competition uses (data can't be created from nothing so the information lost in horizontal resolution from bobbing the image can not be recreated).

So the answer is, there is no absolute answer. A fixed panel device, like the IN76, can only display it's native resolution. Any non native signal must be scaled. Either the source or display could potentially have a better scaling method, experimentation is the only way you'll know which is better.

Well for HDTV, since most channels are 1080i, then it probably makes sense to set the box at 1080i (the cable box) and forget it.

Well for HDTV, since most channels are 1080i, then it probably makes sense to set the box at 1080i (the cable box) and forget it.
I disagree. That's assuming the projector has a better scaler than the cable box, which is a good assumption, but there are two major networks that broadcast 720p (Fox and ABC) and I believe that ESPN is also 720p (correct me if I'm wrong.) I leave my HD Tivo set to 720p.

I disagree. That's assuming the projector has a better scaler than the cable box, which is a good assumption, but there are two major networks that broadcast 720p (Fox and ABC) and I believe that ESPN is also 720p (correct me if I'm wrong.) I leave my HD Tivo set to 720p.


Right, but that's only 3 channels. Since the majority of HD material is broadcast in 1080i, and the reviewer and you imply that IN76 does a great job with scaling 1080i material, why set it to 720p for a minority of hdtv stations.

Do you guys want to get this thread deleted - read the sticky - you are not supposed to promote vendors.

There is a deals forum on this board if you are a paid club member.

Right, but that's only 3 channels. Since the majority of HD material is broadcast in 1080i, and the reviewer and you imply that IN76 does a great job with scaling 1080i material, why set it to 720p for a minority of hdtv stations.
I'm too lazy to flip it to 1080i on 1080i shows, but I'd rather watch all them scaled by the HD Tivo if I can watch my 24 and Lost in native 720p! Keep it at 720p!!!

I have a dumb question. How do you change the cable box to 1080i? I have a motorola hd box from comcast and I have yet to find an advanced menue.

I have a dumb question. How do you change the cable box to 1080i? I have a motorola hd box from comcast and I have yet to find an advanced menue.


Turn OFF your set top box (leave your TV on). Then press the menu key on the set top box.

See pages 9 and 10 here:

http://broadband.motorola.com/noflash/customer_docs/user_guides/512659-001-a.pdf

I believe it defaults to 1080i -- so you are probably there already.

I've cleaned up this thread. No deals or pricing in this forum! Repeat offenders will be suspended from here on out...

Kyser

Atwater, *just a footnote, sometimes you have to push the button a few times before the menu screen pops up. Sometimes it comes up with a quick tap and sometimes with a long press, keep trying.

Fixed!

I've used the "Camelot_One"'s method from jkim5453's post.

1. Unplug the PJ.
2. Connect the PJ to PC via USB.
3. Run Flash USB -> "Flash Mode" disabled. Status: "waiting for connection..."
4. Load the .dld -> "Flash Mode" still disabled. Status: "waiting for connection..."
5. While holding down both "<" and ">" keys on the PJ, plug in the PJ.
6. Status: "connected". "Download" button enabled. "Flash Mode" still disabled.
7. Update, confirm through service menu that new firmware is in place.

FYI: InFocus firmware download page for IN7x now mentions that you can hold down "any button (except the Power button)" while plugging it in.

are there any other owners of in76 who has had their projector die on them?
within the last six months ive had two simply shut off in the middle of a movie.
at first, i thought it may have overheated.
after getting a replacement, it died again.
this time, i made sure the room was plenty cool enough before starting up the projector
just today, while watching the Pink Floyd Pulse DVD, it died again
no blinking light, nothing
i am very leery of dealing with infocus service(unpleasant past experience)
fortunately, i purchased from costco, so returning it is no problem
except, i noticed that they are no longer selling the IN76 :mad:

Sorry about your troubles. Mine died the same way and had the same symptoms afterwards (no green or red indicator LED - blinking or steady.) Lamp looked fine to me - and I figured if it's just the lamp, I'd see some blinking diagnostic LED patterns. I just shipped mine off to InFocus service to get it diagnosed and repaired. I hope I don't get a repeat experience like you did - but who knows.

Hi,
I received my IN72 yesterday. After firing it up connecting to DVD 480p source (component), I noticed a "round/spot" light on the top right corner - beyond the normal 16:9 view area. Is this normal on the IN 72.

I know this is coming from the lens because if I cover the left edge (if I am facing the lens, left side) of the lens (with a piece of paper), the light spot dissappears (since the light is blocked).

The firmware version is 2.7.

Please see attached image - it may seems washed out - that was done on purpose (over expose) to capture the light spill.

Any other IN72 owners notice this bright spot on the top right? (The projector was set on top a table.)

Hi,
I hooked up in72 with my xbox 360 (1080i) I found that the screen flickered, is it because of
my xbox or the projector?
Thanks.

I just tried it with my original xbox, it's got the same problem,
and even the projector doesn't not have any signal, it flickers still.

Is it normal? This is my first projector, I don't know much about projectors.

Hi,
I received my IN72 yesterday. After firing it up connecting to DVD 480p source (component), I noticed a "round/spot" light on the top right corner - beyond the normal 16:9 view area. Is this normal on the IN 72.

I know this is coming from the lens because if I cover the left edge (if I am facing the lens, left side) of the lens (with a piece of paper), the light spot dissappears (since the light is blocked).

The firmware version is 2.7.

Please see attached image - it may seems washed out - that was done on purpose (over expose) to capture the light spill.

Any other IN72 owners notice this bright spot on the top right? (The projector was set on top a table.)

I have the IN72 and have not seen that.

I have the IN72 and have not seen that.

Thanks bluto2000gs. I'll contact Infocus support about this.

Hi,

I have had the IN76 for a couple of months and I love it. I had Jason from AVS come out and run my connections and do the install. He calibrated the projector and everything looks great.

I want to upgrade the firmware to see if the fan noise really does get better but I am concerned that it will blow away all the callibration settings. I do not want it to go back to factory defaults. Does this happen after the upgrade?

Thanks.

David

The menu settings are all set back to default after an update. Either write them down or snap a digital pic and restore them after updating (a pain, but not that bad). And yes the fan noise is decreased with the latest firmware.

Thank you for the quick response. Looks like I know what I am doing tonight.

Hi,

I have had the IN76 for a couple of months and I love it. I had Jason from AVS come out and run my connections and do the install. He calibrated the projector and everything looks great.

I want to upgrade the firmware to see if the fan noise really does get better but I am concerned that it will blow away all the callibration settings. I do not want it to go back to factory defaults. Does this happen after the upgrade?

Thanks.

David

What does that entail when you had him do the install? And is that a set rate -- or by the hour and do they go to anywhere in the country?

Can't you simply copy the settings and then reset them after the firmware is installed?

Hey All,

Thanks for all the discussion! I've noticed that the settings for the IN72 combined with the Oppo 971H have not been posted. For the 4805...

SP4805:
Gains: 58
Offsets: 29
Contrast: 50
Brightness: 50

Oppo 971H:
Brightness: +3
Contrast: 0
Saturation: +1

were the "accepted" settings. What's the consensus on the IN72??? Are people using the 480p DVI out from the player to the pj or are you using the internal scaler of the IN72? Also, what are the opinions on feeding SD vs HD signals for pic quality?

What does that entail when you had him do the install? And is that a set rate -- or by the hour and do they go to anywhere in the country?

It is an hourly rate plus lodging. He came as far as Maryland from NY. He did a great job and left a very professional setup.

Give him a call, it is well worth it.

David

I upgraded the firmware last night and now the HDMI is not funtioning.

I have the IN76 and sony's DVP-CX995V connected via HDMI. Until the upgrade everything was working great, now the HDMI light does not come on the Sony does not come on and the projector does not see it.

Any suggestions?

Thanks.

David

All,
Does the IN76 require a high contrast grey screen (0.8 gain) or does a brilliant white (1.4 gain) show dark enough blacks? This is for a totally light controlled room sitting 9'3" to 15' from screen.

Thanks.

I just purchased my first projector, the IN72, and I am trying to run a bunch of different things through it the most efficient way. I'm a newbie so any help would be appreciated. I have a PS2 im going to connect through S-video to a high def cable box. I will run the high-def box through component to the projector.

This is where I run into a problem... I have a Dell Latitude D505 (http://reviews.cnet.com/Dell_Latitude_D505/4507-3121_7-30671383.html) which I run Creative Lab Inspire 7800 Surround Sound speakers (http://www.creative.com/products/product.asp?category=4&subcategory=113&product=10594) through. I am pretty sure there is no way I can run the labtop through the In72 other than DVI meaning I will have to purchase a new video card.

My main question is if I buy a new video card that is DVI compatible and connect an M1 from the new notebook video card to the high def box will the labtop monitor/sound work with the rest of the system? Or will that just be a waste of money because the speakers won't work with the rest of the system being the cable and PS 2. Thanks for the help.

b

What's the consensus on the IN72??? Are people using the 480p DVI out from the player to the pj or are you using the internal scaler of the IN72? Also, what are the opinions on feeding SD vs HD signals for pic quality?

I would also like to know how the IN72 is performing with HD material via the PC. My old Optoma H30 was superb at downscaling 720p material and for me was amazingg compared to SD material (light and day) but i am just after reading that HD material on IN72 looks just the same as SD material?? :confused:

Does anyone have a clue why our IN72 that has been working flawlesy until we tried to turn it on tonight stopped working. No LED whatsoever. disconnected the power cord for 15 min. no avail. outlet and cord ok. Does this unit have a replaceable fuse? Any ideas?

Thanks