Infocus IN72-IN74-IN76 [Text View] - Page 13

cosgrovea

09-05-06, 04:39 PM

Martin Butler

09-05-06, 04:58 PM

It may sound silly, but have you tried actually taking the main plug out, waiting a minute and then putting it back in? That worked once for me on my 4805 and often is necessary for my cable box.

cosgrovea

09-05-06, 05:29 PM

Yeah, I tried that. I had to unplug the projector to get it to turn off. So I pluged it back in after awhile, and the same thing. It sucks to turn it on though, since I hate having to unplug it to turn it off. I just hope it does not ruin the bulb completely.

brycov

09-05-06, 10:01 PM

Cosgrovea, I bought my M1/USB cable at:

http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=10361502&loc=101&sp=1

Kris Soete

09-06-06, 05:29 PM

Help ... I've been using my IN76 with an oppo player for about six months now without any problems.
But now, suddenly I cannot get the DVI/HDMI connection to work. All other sources work but not HDMI.
There was a power failure this afternoon ... could that have caused the problem ?
I don't think there is a way to switch on or off the dvi signal from the oppo player, so I guess the problem has to be situated in the pj.
I tried resetting the player and the pj to factory settings but that didn't help. Any ideas ?

Thanx

daveyhatton

09-06-06, 09:47 PM

I've had my projector installed for about a month now and the image looks great for the most part, but i can't help but notice a definate softness to the image.

The projector is at 12ft from the screen ... so i'm zoomed in about 80-90%. I've read that its possible that being zoomed in that much might reveal weak/cheap optics in a "budget" projector. But I don't buy it. Why would Infocus let me zoom that much if it resulted in a soft image?

If I go into the service menu and go to Sharpness and set it to "Sharper" (the first setting above standard). It gets better and things definately clear up, but it's TOO sharp. I noticed some dust on the surface of the lens and plan on cleaning it, but I can't imagine this causing much of a problem either.

Any ideas? Help? :(

The only thing I can think is that you may have a bad (dim) bulb. My 4805 has a bad bulb out of the box, and everyone on these forums thought I was nuts by stating the picture was soft and a bit dim. Unfortunately, the overall PQ was much better than my old-school rear projection set, so I just though it was a limitation or "flaw" of the 4805. Well, after 1300 hours, the bulb finally popped, and the replacement bulb made all my previous complaints invalid. There was a certain XBOX game (TimeSplitters:Future Perfect) where a mini-game was very difficult to see on the "bad" bulb, but it was almost too bright with the new one! I was going crazy adjusting the sharpeness (as you said, it was too sharp and obviously didn't help my dim problem), and finally worked the gamma to an acceptable level before it blew.

sonichart

09-07-06, 12:52 AM

The only thing I can think is that you may have a bad (dim) bulb. My 4805 has a bad bulb out of the box, and everyone on these forums thought I was nuts by stating the picture was soft and a bit dim. Unfortunately, the overall PQ was much better than my old-school rear projection set, so I just though it was a limitation or "flaw" of the 4805. Well, after 1300 hours, the bulb finally popped, and the replacement bulb made all my previous complaints invalid. There was a certain XBOX game (TimeSplitters:Future Perfect) where a mini-game was very difficult to see on the "bad" bulb, but it was almost too bright with the new one! I was going crazy adjusting the sharpeness (as you said, it was too sharp and obviously didn't help my dim problem), and finally worked the gamma to an acceptable level before it blew.

So, you're saying that a bad bulb is causing the picture to be slightly soft? My projector is within the 3-month warranty period, so, I suppose I could try to get a bulb replacement from Infocus. However that seems unlikely.

JeffKB

09-07-06, 10:08 AM

I've had my projector installed for about a month now and the image looks great for the most part, but i can't help but notice a definate softness to the image.

The projector is at 12ft from the screen ... so i'm zoomed in about 80-90%. I've read that its possible that being zoomed in that much might reveal weak/cheap optics in a "budget" projector. But I don't buy it. Why would Infocus let me zoom that much if it resulted in a soft image?

If I go into the service menu and go to Sharpness and set it to "Sharper" (the first setting above standard). It gets better and things definately clear up, but it's TOO sharp. I noticed some dust on the surface of the lens and plan on cleaning it, but I can't imagine this causing much of a problem either.

Any ideas? Help? :(
What type of material are you watching, how big is your screen, and how close do you sit?

DVD and SDTV can definitely appear soft on any projector when you blow it up to the screen sizes people typically use for FP. The closer you sit, the more pronounced it is. It's just unavoidable due to the low resolution of the source.

HD sources are a different story however. Those should look sharp, clear, and detailed. These are a true test of the IN76's optics and I find the image to be plenty sharp with HD-DVD. :)

daveyhatton

09-07-06, 12:26 PM

So, you're saying that a bad bulb is causing the picture to be slightly soft? My projector is within the 3-month warranty period, so, I suppose I could try to get a bulb replacement from Infocus. However that seems unlikely.

I'm saying that a bad bulb in my PJ (4805) produced a slightly soft, dim picture, but have no idea of what the issue could be with your PJ. This was just a suggestion as to what the problem COULD be, because our frustrations/concerns sounded similiar.

Believe me, if I had suspected that my bulb was bad from the get-go, then I would've definitely returned it within the warranty period. However, like you, I didn't even think to associate my soft/dim issue to the bulb, since the colors and overall PQ blew my old rear-projection set away.

Once I installed a replacement after my original blew @ 1300 hours, I no longer doubted the greatness that is the 4805, because the picture was now crisp and bright. Again though, this may not be your problem but wanted to share mine just in case. :)

z500

09-07-06, 06:32 PM

I connected my Oppo DV721H tonight, and boy am I happy with it.

First reactions: Wow. Oh vey. Yowza. Magificent colours, excellent detail, and a very non-fatiguing image. Sound is excellent as well, though I'll have to hold back on commenting on CD audio playback, as the sound is radically different from what my old (and now retired) Pioneer DV747 produced. FIrst impressions are very positive though.

It's basically knocked my DV747 into a cocked hat with regards to DVD movies, and I suspect the same will apply to CD audio playback, once I'm ised to the radically different sound. Thanks for the tip, Paul, it's a great machine!

Walter Zed

cosgrovea

09-07-06, 06:57 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok, I have had my IN76 for a few months now. I have loved it.
I came back from work yesterday morning, and powered on the projector (with the remote) to play a little Xbox360. The blue screen came up, and nothing else. I figured someone had switched the source. So i hit the source button and waited for the xbox video to display. It did not happen. So it tried to go to the menu. The menu would not come up! So i tried the menu button on the projector... nothing. None of the buttons respond (that I can see) after I power the projector on. I can't even get it to shut off. Both power buttons do not work after it initially comes on. The light stays solid green after start up.

I emailed Infocus tech support, and they said to try upgrading the firmware. (I still have the original firmware) They said if that does not work, it will probably need serviced.
So the question... is there anything else I could try?

After looking for the right cable to do the firmware upgrade, I see there are a couple on ebay, other than that it is the Infocus store. I could not find the M1 cable with usb on Monoprice. Anywhere else sell them?

Thanks for any ideas.

Thanks for that link brycov. I got the cable in today, and tried to upgrade the firmware. It sounded like a really simple thing to do. So I followed all the instructions, and it did not work. My computer reads the connection through the USB cable, and then I select the Firmware file, and hit the "Flash Mode" button on the utility. Nothing happens after that except the solid green power light on the projector goes off.

So I called Infocus Tech Support, and the guy went through the steps, making sure I was doing everything right, (I was) and after that he could not figure out what was wrong. So he talked to some of his people. He said about the only thing it could be was a corrupted driver. I kind of doubted that.... but I tried the upgrade through a different computer... same exact thing.

I think I am out of luck, and might have to send the projector in. It sure sucks going from a 100" screen to a 27" tv. :(

Dark-007

09-07-06, 07:58 PM

I recently purchased an IN72 and the only thing that irks me is that the picture doesn't fill the entire 16:9 area, and has "side bars" on either side of the picture, regardless of the resolution.

Do I have a defective unit, is there any fix for this?

krasmuzik

09-07-06, 11:55 PM

I just answered this James - isn't this a double post or did I lose my answer?

cavu

09-08-06, 02:19 AM

How do you remove?Go into "EDIT" and then select "DELETE".

Casino Kaz

09-08-06, 09:38 AM

avam

09-08-06, 05:54 PM

Dark-007,
Do you have your projector in ceiling mount mode and using keystone? If so, the image will not end up 16:9. There was a SW release to fix this.

Dark-007

09-09-06, 01:08 AM

Dark-007,
Do you have your projector in ceiling mount mode and using keystone? If so, the image will not end up 16:9. There was a SW release to fix this.

No, it's table mounted. About 2% total of the picture on each side of the image is black. No information. No part of the image is cropped, but when viewing anything widescreen, it can be annoying to see the lighter background on both sides of the image.

JeffKB

09-09-06, 02:25 PM

Just curious, does anyone Enable the Noise Reduction on their IN76 ? If so, what level do you set it at? Supposedly it's for adjusting signal noise (whatever that means), but I don't see any change to the image when moving the levels up and down.......Thanks.
I haven't had a need to use it with the IN76, but I used to use some noise reduction on my old 4805 once in a while. It helps eliminate compression artifacts you see on some DVDs. The artifacts look like mosquito noise (i.e. swirling) in image areas that should be solid (sky shots for example).

The noise reduction does work, but it comes at a price. If you set it too high it can cause noticeable ghosting in moving images.

Tolstoi

09-12-06, 09:43 AM

Casino Kaz

09-12-06, 12:10 PM

It is preferable not to use the Noise Reduction.
Ok, thanks...JeffKB mentions that he used it with the 4805 to eliminate DVD compression artifacts. Any chance that noise reduction would help reduce the motion artifacts that have been so prevalent in some of the recent HD football telecasts? Are there any other circumstances where enabling the Noise Reduction might improve the image....
Thanks again.

Tolstoi

09-12-06, 02:29 PM

Ok, thanks...JeffKB mentions that he used it with the 4805 to eliminate DVD compression artifacts. Any chance that noise reduction would help reduce the motion artifacts that have been so prevalent in some of the recent HD football telecasts? Are there any other circumstances where enabling the Noise Reduction might improve the image....
Thanks again.

My call on this is that the noise reduction in most time creates more issue than it solves and therefore should be only used for specific occasion. If a specific TV show is really bad than for that show I would turn it on to put it back off after I am done watching that show. But by default, I recommend to set it to off.

JeffKB

09-12-06, 04:25 PM

Ok, thanks...JeffKB mentions that he used it with the 4805 to eliminate DVD compression artifacts. Any chance that noise reduction would help reduce the motion artifacts that have been so prevalent in some of the recent HD football telecasts?
I doubt it, because noise reduction creates motion artifacts of its own. If anything, it will probably make it worse. What the heck though, you can always try it out and see what happens.

I agree with Tolstoi - I would never leave it on by default. The only time I used it on the 4805 was when I was watching specific DVDs that showed obvious and annoying noise. These were very few and far between.

For example, the superbit version of Lawrence of Arabia had massive amounts of mosquito noise in some of the desert shots (surprising for superbit). For that disc I would use noise reduction and it did a very good job of eliminating those artifacts. The downside was that ghosting was very obvious in some motion scenes however. The trick was playing with the NR setting so that the right balance was found between reducing the noise and inducing the ghosting.

billymac

09-12-06, 06:46 PM

hey quick question, does the input sensitvity do anything to the hdmi or m1 inputs?

i lose my hdmi htpc connection sometimes after reboot and have to unplug and then replug my hdmi cable in to get it work. i just was thinking of this while at work and am wanting to go home and fiddle, but didn't want to waste too much time.

anybody else losing sync over hdmi or m1 inuts on with their htpc? it's probably just the 30' run i've got, but thought i'd ask. i've heard from other htpc users having similar issues with other projectors as well.

reedyj

09-12-06, 10:40 PM

Does anyone have a clue why our IN72 that has been working flawlesy until we tried to turn it on tonight stopped working. No LED whatsoever. disconnected the power cord for 15 min. no avail. outlet and cord ok. Does this unit have a replaceable fuse? Any ideas?

Thanks

Same thing just happened to me, but I was watching it. No LED, rest of equipment works (DTV box/ receiver). Tried different power outlet and different cord. No power surge. Cooled down for an hour, still no change...... Service request in, only had it for 2 months. Bummed out. Any ideas? Thanjks.

yubakram

09-13-06, 09:25 AM

VABills

09-13-06, 10:08 AM

Tolstoi

09-13-06, 10:42 AM

Same thing just happened to me, but I was watching it. No LED, rest of equipment works (DTV box/ receiver). Tried different power outlet and different cord. No power surge. Cooled down for an hour, still no change...... Service request in, only had it for 2 months. Bummed out. Any ideas? Thanjks.

After a software upgrade? If so you need to go back to the previous version that was working. The projector look dead but you could still load the previous version for this you need to force the projector to go in flash mode with the following sequence:

1. Unplug the PJ.
2. Connect the PJ to PC via USB.
3. Run Flash USB -> "Flash Mode" disabled. Status: "waiting for connection..."
4. Load the .dld -> "Flash Mode" still disabled. Status: "waiting for connection..."
5. While holding down both "<" and ">" keys on the PJ, plug in the PJ.
6. Status: "connected". "Download" button enabled. "Flash Mode" still disabled.
7. Update with the version that was working before,
8. Power light should go back to green.

Try this and let me know.

reedyj

09-13-06, 11:54 AM

Tolsloi,

No software upgrade done, still has original 2.2? version that came with it. Don't have the usb cable. No fan noise or LED lighting up. May get the cable and give it a try if don't get any response back from Infocus.

Thanks for the response.

R

Tolstoi

09-13-06, 12:57 PM

castaño

09-14-06, 07:35 PM

caesar1

09-14-06, 07:53 PM

Infocus new projetor:

Play Big IN78EX for 4499 US$

DarkChip3™ 720p 12° LVDS, DLP™ by Texas Instruments

Full NTSC, PAL, SECAM, 480i, 480p, 576i, 576p, 720p, 1035i, 1080i, 1080p/24, 1080p/30, 1080p/50, 1080p/60

http://www.infocus.com/Products/Projectors/IN78EX.aspx

Okay, so this new projector uses darkchip3 DLP technology. Which is the only significant difference I can see over the IN76 (which uses darkChip2 DLP technology).

What exactly is $2,000 better about darkchip3 over darkchip2? What are the real world differences?

Someone please explain.

Mupi

09-14-06, 08:55 PM

why would anyone even buy IN76 when you can get HD70 for <1k
Sure it is not optimized out of the box and it is not
a great unit. But in 4-5 months COSTCO will sell it for $800

Infocus do some market research. What is the need for another
5k unit when there is 7205 already. or may be they will pull 7205
off but still there is no market for 5k pj's especially if it is going to
be loud like a jet engine. May be Infocus should concentrate on
ball players instead of middle class.

Martin Butler

09-14-06, 10:24 PM

Thanks Castano. Man, you guys are all over this thing, which might discourage people from posting anything about anything new from InFocus. This is counter-productive. It seems the new model has the same basic specs as an $11,000. Marantz PJ (don't know about the optics) so perhaps InFocus simply wants to offer an alternative to the higher priced, higher end pj's. Once it gets into circulation the price will come down, so who knows, it could be a good thing. I'd like to hear bit more, not shut discussion down.

smithfarmer

09-14-06, 10:58 PM

Okay, so this new projector uses darkchip3 DLP technology. Which is the only significant difference I can see over the IN76 (which uses darkChip2 DLP technology).

What exactly is $2,000 better about darkchip3 over darkchip2? What are the real world differences?

Someone please explain. This model carries the EX designation which means that it will only be available through your local authorized Infocus dealer. No online sales. MSRP difference is $1500. This gives you the DC3 chip with a higher contrast of 3500:1 compared to 3000:1 on the IN76 and you get a 2 year warranty.

Looks like every other aspect is the same as the IN76. Same lamp, lumens, inputs and lense with the same throw ratio, which is a bit disappointing for me as I was looking for a slightly longer throw ratio.

What remains to be seen is the performance of the newer DC3 chip.

spyder696969

09-15-06, 12:43 AM

On the IN72 model, do you have to use the base that comes with it in order to ceiling mount the unit, or are there mounting holes like on previous models? Thanks in advance.

James A. McGahee

09-15-06, 03:19 AM

I viewed a couple of DC2s and a DC3 projector recently in an appropriately lighted controlled store's theater and was surprised to find the SDE was much more pronounced on the DC3 than on the DC2s. I think the DC3 was on a white screen and the DC2s were on either gray or silver screens but I'm not sure of each screen's gain or other settings/lens factors.

They were not InFocus projectors so I am wondering if the SDE is likely to be more visible on the IN78EX than the IN76, all other conditions being the same. If so I am still going with the 76.

I need some of you guys who can put all those specs. together in your head and visualize the image from the 78 to give my your best estimate as to what the improved image will look and why?

Wouldn't you think the 78 SDE would be less visible than the 76 under same conditions/settings? I am trying to go for a 120" dia. w/ 18' throw with the hopes of going to a CIH 2:35 139" width eventually. I am excited that the DC3 has been added and looking forward to the possibilities.
Thanks--

caesar1

09-15-06, 07:26 AM

What remains to be seen is the performance of the newer DC3 chip.

Yes, because otherwise 500 lumens doesn't seem like its worth the cost difference.

Opus33

09-15-06, 08:30 AM

spyder696969 On the IN72 model, do you have to use the base that comes with it in order to ceiling mount the unit, or are there mounting holes like on previous models? Thanks in advance.

The base just unscrews, revealing additional mounting holes underneath for ceilng mounting.

tradewinds

09-15-06, 09:06 AM

Tolstoi

09-15-06, 10:07 AM

Really no need for an interim IN78EX, they should have waited to bring out a 1080p that all classes can afford. Another 720p has no rational purpose at this time and at that price point.

BTW - cavu we need an update to this thread's name. Maybe not, since it falls outside the forum price point (<$3500)

I don’t feel the need to upgrade the IN76 to the IN78X neither. I will wait for a 1080p version. Meanwhile, I am not surprise by this announcement; there is a need to replace the 7205 and 7210 with an High End 720p

cavu

09-15-06, 10:27 AM

BTW - cavu we need an update to this thread's name. Maybe not, since it falls outside the forum price point (<$3500)I was half-way through changing the thread name when I realized the same thing. ;)

rollercoaster

09-15-06, 11:57 AM

I don’t feel the need to upgrade the IN76 to the IN78X neither. I will wait for a 1080p version. Meanwhile, I am not surprise by this announcement; there is a need to replace the 7205 and 7210 with an High End 720p
What are these guys smoking? Mitsu is introducing their DC3 projector at $2K and sony is introducing their 1080P projector at $5K. It seems all of the other projector manufacturers understand the current market much better than INFS. Who is going to buy the IN78 at this price? I feel sorry for all of the INFS dealers.

James A. McGahee

09-15-06, 07:50 PM

If anyone knows of a dealer/location in the Dallas-Fort Worth area where I can see a good set-up of the IN76 please let me know.

I emailed InFocus a week ago asking for their dealer locations in the DFW area and have not received a reply. That makes me a little concerned about customer support. (If you're wondering, I couldn't get the Zip Code dealer-locator to work.)

The only dealers I have been able to find are Best Buy/Magnolia and Circuit City. Neither carry the IN74 or IN76. They do carry the IN72, a great projector, but guys-since you brought it up- I do feel, from what I have seen, that there is a need for the higher end IN78EX in their stores-if the MSRP doesn't kill it.

Jason T., if you see this I sure would like to see you review the IN78EX (when it becomes available). If possible, please compare it (esp. image quality) to the Samsung SP-H710AE. I would love to go with either of them if the street prices fall closer to the IN76 street price. Wonder how long that wait would be? Keep bringing on those new projectors-lots of projectors-everybody including InFocus.

spyder696969

09-15-06, 08:15 PM

Is anyone interested in this 44-pound, alien behemoth?

http://www.infocus.com/Products/Projectors/SP777.aspx

Is it worth it? (Not that I can see any price anywhere)

James A. McGahee

09-15-06, 08:36 PM

Mupi

09-15-06, 09:20 PM

Is anyone interested in this 44-pound, alien behemoth?

http://www.infocus.com/Products/Projectors/SP777.aspx

Is it worth it? (Not that I can see any price anywhere)

why are you wasting your time posting such things here.
It is a 3-chip DLP and would cost a fortune!
No one here really cares about a 3-chip DLP.
Hope people dont start a thread asking when will 3 chip
DLP hit <1k.

spyder696969

09-15-06, 10:13 PM

Mostly, I was wondering what the big advantage was in it and what causes the massive weight. :confused:

Sorry to have "wasted time when no one cares". My search for knowledge is such a waste. :o

Martin Butler

09-15-06, 11:04 PM

3 chip DLP eliminates the color wheel and all the associated artifacts like rainbows and fatigue, producing a smoother brighter picture. Mupi, no reason not to offer spyder an answer or the common courtesy and benefit of the doubt any member with over 2500 posts has earned. Sure it may be a bit off topic, but when you say no one here cares about 3 chip DLP, I think you should speak for yourself. I care, and it could be of interest to many InFocus projector owners.

tradewinds

09-15-06, 11:46 PM

Yes, I agree with Martin, we do care very much about 3-chip DLP as it is something each one of us would at least like to have someday, and yes, even with the long stretch when it will hit <1K.

Spyder has been a great forum member offering lots of support and do not need to be treated like that. You need to apologize to him.

spyder696969

09-16-06, 02:56 AM

Thanks for the support! :)

I had a basic idea of the advantages of 3-chip DLP, but the 4X weight still baffles me. :confused:

R Johnson

09-16-06, 11:50 AM

The 777 is heavy mostly because of the complex optical system with multiple prisms and the need the keep everything in alignment. That's also one reason it's priced at $15,000 as I recall.

Mupi

09-16-06, 09:16 PM

It makes absolutely no sense to talk about $15000 PJ in a <$3500 forum
If you guys are interested, why not post it in the >$3500 forum. I am sure
you will get a lot more posts and I guess someone with 2500 posts
ought to know that.

spyder696969

09-16-06, 09:51 PM

Mupi,

You're absolutely right. No one should ever talk about anything that isn't directly listed in the title of the thread, regardless of whether or not its made by the same company, is a distant relative of the disussed model(s), or if AVS members might know about it from using similar products or through research. Never, ever, ever.

I will make an impassioned plea to the moderators to immediately delete each and every post that compares different models, all posts in which anyone mentions going from a SD-DVD player to one that is HD-DVD, any reference to looking forward to upgrading, or any remarks about going from one brand to another, whether made in jest or in all seriousness.

I realize the extreme degree of difficulty in ignoring or skipping over a post. Please accept my humble apologies for this grievous error in judgement on my part, in committing the most heinous of crimes against yourself and my fellow members.

Tnedator

09-17-06, 12:27 AM

I have a question concerning the new firmware and the fan speed. I have had my IN76 for about 3 months now and the fan noise doesn't bother me at all. I know the latest firmware reduces fan noise... but does it do so at the expense of cooling? If so, I can certainly live with my current level of fan noise if the cooling is superior. If, on the other hand, the cooling is just as good with the quiter fan noise I would certainly welcome the projector being even quieter.

Doug

This is probably a coincidence, but...

I upgraded the firmware last weekend, and there was a very noticable difference in the noise level when in low power mode. Since I have 1000 hours on the bulb and the picture has now dimmed, I decided to switch to high power mode for some extra umph, and because now the high power fan noise is similar to the low power noise before the upgrade.

Tonight, while watching TV, it just shut off and there is no signs of life. Appears to be completely dead.

Martin Butler

09-17-06, 10:11 AM

Mupi, it's time for you to stop scolding people. In a very long thread that lasts for months and sometimes years it becomes something more than a thread devoted exclusively to the topic. What members with thousands of posts know is where to draw the line between mentioning something related to the topic but not exactly the topic for a few posts and hijacking a thread. Old posts often die a slow death from lack of interest and this kind of activity can help keep them alive until the next wave of interesting, informative, helpful and 100% ON TOPIC posts bring posters back for more. If something is out of line the MODERATORS will fix it.

In all technologies, the costly investment in product developement that leads to a company's flagship model will trickle down to the next generations. Many aspects of the >15k 3 chip InFocus pj have been incorporated into the newer 72, 74, 76 and therfore ARE of relevance to this thread as long as we don't dwell too long on a sidebar topic.

Back to our regularly scheduled thread now...

smithfarmer

09-17-06, 02:25 PM

Hey guys,

Don't waste your time in replying to Mupi's posts. All he ever does in complain. 99% of his posts in any Infocus thread consist of nothing but endless whining and complaining. His name describes him:

Miserable Unsatisfied Projectorless Individual.

krasmuzik

09-17-06, 06:06 PM

James

part of the way that DC3 is a contrast improvement over DC2 is shinier mirrors on a blacker substrate. So all else being equal - SDE appears to be a sharper line - when really it is a more contrasted line. It is also a thinner line though - so it depends on your vision.

Not having seen IN76 side by side with IN78EX - not sure - so the above statement is a generality about equality.

Lens optics quality also accounts for sharpness. For example the SDE on IN76 is more noticeable than that of the MitsuHC3000U - the lens is much better.

I think the dealer lookup is a popup - does your browser enable that? Do you have Java loaded? If you can't get it to work - PM me your zip and I will look it up for you - no recommendations though just a list. The reason is simple - I have done recommendations in the past after much effort on my part and distributors part. If you expect to see the projector in a dedicated theater that cost a lot of money - you should go in there with the expectation that you will pay more than online for places that are indeed service based biz.

The Infocus SP7210 DarkChip3 was $7K just six months ago.

jyv1214

09-17-06, 06:11 PM

This is probably a coincidence, but...

I upgraded the firmware last weekend, and there was a very noticable difference in the noise level when in low power mode. Since I have 1000 hours on the bulb and the picture has now dimmed, I decided to switch to high power mode for some extra umph, and because now the high power fan noise is similar to the low power noise before the upgrade.

Tonight, while watching TV, it just shut off and there is no signs of life. Appears to be completely dead.

I've had two in76s die on me in the last six months(it simply shut off while i was viewing something)
coincidentally, maybe not, i was runinng them in high power from the very beginning
if you try to get the unit repaired through infocus, i would love to know what the cause was

krasmuzik

09-17-06, 06:18 PM

In all technologies, the costly investment in product developement that leads to a company's flagship model will trickle down to the next generations. Many aspects of the >15k 3 chip InFocus pj have been incorporated into the newer 72, 74, 76 and therfore ARE of relevance to this thread as long as we don't dwell too long on a sidebar topic.

Anyone remember Bob asking what you all wanted to see last summer? Look at the list -

quieter mini-me version of the SP777 case. Done.

DarkChip3 cheaper version of SP7210 in new case. Now Done. ($7K->$4.5K)

KRAS Muzik logo on the box - not done.

They would not give me the IN78EX remote but there where claims of some other scientific imaging certification program that licenses their logo for calibration menus...wait and see.....

Mupi buys any $1K projector and raves about it rather than return it ....yeah right....

krasmuzik

09-17-06, 06:29 PM

The new high end Toshiba HD-XA2 HD DVD player is designed to output 1920 x 1080p via HDMI version 1.3, adding support for Deep Color technology.

Since the HD-XA2 will be one of the first next generation players to support the "Deep Color" or 36-bit RGB/YCbCr portion of HDMI 1.3:

Will all this good stuff be lost on the IN76 if we connect with a regular HDMI cable?

Will a regular HDMI cable work or do we need an adapter?

Are all HDMI cables physically the same and the different versions are simply different signals sent through them?

I thought the idea behind HDMI was to make all our connections uniform, simple, and universal. Will we be able to take advantage of the Deep Color technology with a regular HDMI cable into the IN76?

I don't think any company has announced a display that supports deep color with an expanded color gamut, more importantly there has not been any media standard that has said they will support it - and I am not aware that this will ever be in the HDDVD releases.

Only Sony PSX3 has said they will allow games to trigger Deep Color - but having the proper cable is not the issue - having the display that can show Deep Color is.

It is very unlikely that a projection display can even support deep color without being very very dim - look how many do not go all the way to even the HD colors because of the cost to brightness.

parisi2274

09-17-06, 06:58 PM

Hey all I have a quick question...

My friend and I are building a nice simple home theater in his basement... The equipment he purchased was:

Infocus IN76
Panaview 106" Fixed Screen
Onkyo HT-S790
Direct Tv HD box
Sony Progressive Scan DVD player...

My question pertains to the Infocus IN76 projector and the screen. We mounted the screen and then mounted the projector 11ft from the screen. Hooked up the sat box to do a test, so we could calibrate the picture... ANyway, when we set it up and turned on the projector, we adjusted the zoom and the focus and the picture was coming up short on all side of the screen. Basically we want the picture, obviously, to stretch the entire 106" screen. However, even after setting the ratio to 16:9, and centering the picture, we are still short about 2" on each side... My question to you guys is this, do we have the projector to close to the screen at 11ft? When we were pricing out this projector, I went on infocus's website and used their projector distance calculator... I entered that I had a 106" screen, and it told me to put the projector at a min of 11.8' and a max of 14.3'. I have a feeling that I am going to have to pull the screen back about a ft, but I was just looking to get some confirmation...

Thanks so much....

HDTVChallenged

09-17-06, 07:08 PM

My question to you guys is this, do we have the projector to close to the screen at 11ft? ... I entered that I had a 106" screen, and it told me to put the projector at a min of 11.8' and a max of 14.3'.

I think you just answered your own question. :)

parisi2274

09-17-06, 07:15 PM

I think you just answered your own question. :)

Thanks... I think I knew that when I was hitting the submit button... I guess when you finish working on a HT at 2am, this stuff gets to you....

Razkal

09-18-06, 10:29 AM

Tnedator

09-18-06, 11:12 AM

I've had two in76s die on me in the last six months(it simply shut off while i was viewing something)
coincidentally, maybe not, i was runinng them in high power from the very beginning
if you try to get the unit repaired through infocus, i would love to know what the cause was

After sitting on hold for 1 hour, I didn't think to ask what the support agent thought was the problem. He did say they would be replacing it with a new unit as soon as it arrived at Infocus.

Does anyone know if they return it with a new bulb?

Tnedator

09-18-06, 11:14 AM

Tolstoi

09-18-06, 11:53 AM

The new high end Toshiba HD-XA2 HD DVD player is designed to output 1920 x 1080p via HDMI version 1.3, adding support for Deep Color technology.

Since the HD-XA2 will be one of the first next generation players to support the "Deep Color" or 36-bit RGB/YCbCr portion of HDMI 1.3:

Will all this good stuff be lost on the IN76 if we connect with a regular HDMI cable?

Will a regular HDMI cable work or do we need an adapter?

Are all HDMI cables physically the same and the different versions are simply different signals sent through them?

I thought the idea behind HDMI was to make all our connections uniform, simple, and universal. Will we be able to take advantage of the Deep Color technology with a regular HDMI cable into the IN76?

DeepColor is a bit marketing buzz. There are no disks encoded with 36-bit RGB/YCbCr and I am not aware of anything soon. So I am not worried about that. The real benefit of HDMI 1.3 is the ability to transport native TrueHD and DTS MA sound track to receiver and/ audio processor. But for this you will need a receiver and/ audio processor with HDMI 1.3 support and they will only be available mid next year.

I am currently using the HDA1 with my IN76 where I am feeding the IN76 directly with the HDA1 1080i output. The image quality is just amazing. To improve the image a bit further I have ordered a DVDO VP50 that will take care of the 1080i -- 720p processing.

James A. McGahee

09-18-06, 07:09 PM

To improve the image a bit further I have ordered a DVDO VP50 that will take care of the 1080i -- 720p processing.

Be sure and let us know the outcome of adding the DVDO VP50! Sounds like fun.

bmrr

09-18-06, 08:44 PM

Sorry if this has been asked before... I'm feeding an IN72 SD and HD cable with a Motorola 6200 through component input. I notice that the "Natural Wide" does not stretch 4:3 content to fill the screen. Is this right?

Thanks!

letmely

09-19-06, 09:01 AM

After sitting on hold for 1 hour, I didn't think to ask what the support agent thought was the problem. He did say they would be replacing it with a new unit as soon as it arrived at Infocus.

Does anyone know if they return it with a new bulb?

I live in Sweden (and therefor paid through the nose for my IN76) so it might be a different story. Anyway, my replacement IN76 had 0 hours on both bulb and proj. Also came with latest FW and delivered to the door (and they picked up the old one at the same time). Zero hours downtime - extremely content customer!

Tolstoi

09-19-06, 10:29 AM

Be sure and let us know the outcome of adding the DVDO VP50! Sounds like fun.

Yes I should get in 2-3 weeks from now. I will post the outcome.

James A. McGahee

09-19-06, 10:35 AM

The real benefit of HDMI 1.3 is the ability to transport native TrueHD and DTS MA sound track to receiver and/ audio processor.

I know what DTS ES is but I am not familiar with DTS MA? Can anybody help me out here?

Also is there a difference in the physical cable/connection itself, between HDMI and HDMI 1.3? I assume there is since one will transport native True HD and DTS MA sound and the other won't??

Are the cables interchangeable even though you only get native True HD and DTS MA with 1.3?

Outflying

09-19-06, 12:28 PM

Hello:

Assuming everyone is running several items (dvd, tv, xbox, etc.) and you are using some sort of switch/receiver:

How many cables are you actually running to the pj?

I might need to run HDMI and Component side by side. Is anyone else doing this sort of thing?

Is anyone having trouble with 25' of HDMI cable?

Thanks!

Martin Butler

09-19-06, 02:07 PM

I run 6 meter component from my cable box and DVI from my DVD player while leaving the S-video input ready in case I need to pop my computer on to the big screen. No problems here.

Tolstoi

09-19-06, 03:59 PM

I know what DTS ES is but I am not familiar with DTS MA? Can anybody help me out here?

Also is there a difference in the physical cable/connection itself, between HDMI and HDMI 1.3? I assume there is since one will transport native True HD and DTS MA sound and the other won't??

Are the cables interchangeable even though you only get native True HD and DTS MA with 1.3?

TrueHD amd DTS MA are the new 7.1 high resolution audio standard defined fro HD DVD and Blu Ray. Here is a review from Audioholics on TrueHD

http://www.audioholics.com/cedia/cedia2004/DolbyTrueHD.php

I am not sure about the cable requirements for HDMI 1.3

Tolstoi

09-19-06, 04:04 PM

I run 6 meter component from my cable box and DVI from my DVD player while leaving the S-video input ready in case I need to pop my computer on to the big screen. No problems here.

When I first installed my 4805 I ran the following cables:

HDMI
Component
S-Video (because it was provided one with the projector)

HDMI is so good and convenient that I never used any of the other cable types. When I upgraded to the IN76, I pushed the S-video and the component cables in the ceiling it make the installation a lot nicer. To select the multiple source I started by using a gefen HDMI switch followed by DVDO VP30 that I am about to replace by a VP50.

Martin Butler

09-19-06, 04:40 PM

Sweet, Tolstoi.

NoThru22

09-20-06, 10:04 AM

nbpc

09-20-06, 02:06 PM

I've been going back and forth on the Panny AX100/AE900 vs the IN76 for awhile now and the only thing that bothers me (like most newbies) is the RBE factor for DLP. I've read where scanning back and forth exacerbates the RBE issue.

I went into Circuit City and saw an Optoma EP719 (2x Color Wheel) displaying a football game. My main intent for a PJ is for HD sports and some TV. DVDs a distance third...

Sure enough, after watching 10 to 15 minutes of football, a major headache kicks in.

I should also note that we borrowed an X1 (another 2x wheel) for a weekend of movies and wasn't bothered a bit.

Should I still consider the IN76 or just go to LCD...

Martin Butler

09-20-06, 02:44 PM

Tolstoi

09-20-06, 03:06 PM

TheLidlessEye

09-20-06, 03:22 PM

nbpc

09-20-06, 03:51 PM

nbpc, you can't judge correctly from the 2X color wheel. The rainbow effect is basically non-existent with the newer DLP's like the IN76. Sure, there are a few rare exceptions, but overall I don't think you should worry too much about it. Buy from somewhere with a 30 day return policy if you can. Good luck. LCD has it's own issues and is far from perfect as a display anyway.

The big battle for me is RBE vs PQ (so is offset, but @ 15% the IN76 is the only DLP I can consider). And it's not RBE, but RBE that causes headaches, etc.

Another question I've been wanting to ask is this:
For guests, will they develop headaches from RBE (if they're susceptible) after just few hours of viewing like a movie or a ball game?

Also, can you tell if you're RBE prone from watching a rear projector that are so much more available in CC and BestBuy, etc?

Thanks!

Martin Butler

09-20-06, 04:06 PM

nbpc, you're still new to the forum. The IN76 is the product developed from their previous model, InFocus' 4805, which I own.Two years ago people voiced the same concern as you are now. Possibly one or two people mentioned being affected out of more than a million posts, if that many. I've never had a guest experience anything but exhilaration upon seeing such a clear big screen picture and no one ever got a headache. You're worrying too much. At this price range I'd say stick with InFocus.

Anthony-Howard

09-21-06, 06:15 AM

I currently have an IN76 and would like to control it wirelessly using 802.11g via the RS232 port. The deivces that I am planning to use are capable of being powered from the host device - ie the IN76. However to do this they need the device to provide at least +5vdc over the serial cable.

Does anyone know if the IN76 provides power on pin 9 of the RS232 port ?.

Many thanks,

Tony.

nbpc

09-21-06, 07:31 AM

Any advice on paint colors for a light controlled room until I decide on a screen (have Behr Flat White now)?

Flush mount recommendations?

Upconverting DVD (Oppo is my leading choice)?

Thanks again!

nbpc, you're still new to the forum. The IN76 is the product developed from their previous model, InFocus' 4805, which I own.Two years ago people voiced the same concern as you are now. Possibly one or two people mentioned being affected out of more than a million posts, if that many. I've never had a guest experience anything but exhilaration upon seeing such a clear big screen picture and no one ever got a headache. You're worrying too much. At this price range I'd say stick with InFocus.

Tolstoi

09-21-06, 09:22 AM

Any advice on paint colors for a light controlled room until I decide on a screen (have Behr Flat White now)?

Flush mount recommendations?

Upconverting DVD (Oppo is my leading choice)?

Thanks again!

I am using the Oppo 970HD but through a really good external scaler for SD-DVD playback. I am also using the Toshiba HD DVD HDA1 with output set to 1080i connected directly through HDMI to IN76. The IN76 do a good job converting the 1080i to 720p (a signicant better job that the Toshiba). HD DVD movies projected with the IN76. The image quality is just stunning. I don't know it this is in your budget but you should try the HD DVD.

The IN76 is a really good 720p projector and deserve a proper screen.

nbpc

09-21-06, 09:37 AM

The IN76 is a really good 720p projector and deserve a proper screen.

Yes it does, but I need something to get started until I get some screen samples and learn more about it (ok, and save up a little bit).

Any guesses on when the price will be driven down by the new offerrings from Mitsu, Optoma, etc? Does IF even react to "price wars" like other PJ manufactuerers?

yourlilbro

09-21-06, 10:28 AM

saw the website an it stated the IN76 supports 1080p60 input.Is this confirmed?

Martin Butler

09-21-06, 11:00 AM

nbpc, look at Benjamin Moore's "Grey" paint color. I know, they usually give their paints a cool name like "November Rain" or something like that, but their grey is not oppressive or offensive, yet quite dark. It somehow seems like a rich classic color and doesn't affect your color perception as much as with green or red, etc. Even if you only paint the area surrounding the screen it's a great help with perceived black level.

Tolstoi

09-21-06, 11:17 AM

Yes it does, but I need something to get started until I get some screen samples and learn more about it (ok, and save up a little bit).

Any guesses on when the price will be driven down by the new offerrings from Mitsu, Optoma, etc? Does IF even react to "price wars" like other PJ manufactuerers?

Sadly lot buyers are choosing their projector solely based on spec and price. Image quality is not just driven by the manufacturer claimed spec but by a sum of factors that also include optic quality, focus uniformity, calibration to D65. Optoma to achieve aggressive pricing, are cutting on some aspect of the projector quality (lens and calibration to D65). The Mits is a good projector with a good lens but requires calibration to be optimized to D65. The infocus IN76 is good out of the box projector it is not essential to calibrate it (except normal contrast and brightness setting that anybody with calibration DVD could achieve) but one of its best quality is its optics that provide really sharp image. In that price range this is the first projector I see that focus well in all 4 corners with minimal chromatic aberration, focus uniformity is really good.

NoThru22

09-21-06, 12:30 PM

So does anyone know what 1080p60 sub-sampled means over component?

nbpc

09-21-06, 01:09 PM

Sadly lot buyers are choosing their projector solely based on spec and price. Image quality is not just driven by the manufacturer claimed spec but by a sum of factors that also include optic quality, focus uniformity, calibration to D65. Optoma to achieve aggressive pricing, are cutting on some aspect of the projector quality (lens and calibration to D65). The Mits is a good projector with a good lens but requires calibration to be optimized to D65. The infocus IN76 is good out of the box projector it is not essential to calibrate it (except normal contrast and brightness setting that anybody with calibration DVD could achieve) but one of its best quality is its optics that provide really sharp image. In that price range this is the first projector I see that focus well in all 4 corners with minimal chromatic aberration, focus uniformity is really good.

First, thank you everybody for all your suggestions. I might wait until Xmas on the upconverting DVD and see what HD-DVD options are available. I think the new Toshibas are running in the $500 range so it might be wise to get one. I know that some threads in other forums suggest that the Toshiba HD-DVD do okay for upconverting SD-DVDs.

Tolstoi, I didn't mean to suggest that the IN76 should be going heading for the $1k range. If anything, I do appreciate the IN76's value over the other sub $3500 MSRP PJs. But like anything else in the technology field, competition does force older technologies lower on the pricing change. For example, the new Optoma HD73 is a DC3 chip for a street where the IN76 is today and from what I understand, the its predecessor, the HD72, was well received. I'm just asking if IF does react to the market the way that Panny, Sanyo, etc, do. I know that they've had rebates in the past (IN72, SP7205, SP7210). Again, I appreciate all your points which is why the IN76 is number one on my list!

Besides calibration and higher quality optics, the other big thing that attracts me to the IN76 is the internal scaler as SDTV and SD-DVDs will be a relatively large source for the PJ.

Tolstoi

09-21-06, 02:26 PM

First, thank you everybody for all your suggestions. I might wait until Xmas on the upconverting DVD and see what HD-DVD options are available. I think the new Toshibas are running in the $500 range so it might be wise to get one. I know that some threads in other forums suggest that the Toshiba HD-DVD do okay for upconverting SD-DVDs.

Tolstoi, I didn't mean to suggest that the IN76 should be going heading for the $1k range. If anything, I do appreciate the IN76's value over the other sub $3500 MSRP PJs. But like anything else in the technology field, competition does force older technologies lower on the pricing change. For example, the new Optoma HD73 is a DC3 chip for a street where the IN76 is today and from what I understand, the its predecessor, the HD72, was well received. I'm just asking if IF does react to the market the way that Panny, Sanyo, etc, do. I know that they've had rebates in the past (IN72, SP7205, SP7210). Again, I appreciate all your points which is why the IN76 is number one on my list!

Besides calibration and higher quality optics, the other big thing that attracts me to the IN76 is the internal scaler as SDTV and SD-DVDs will be a relatively large source for the PJ.

I understand that. I am only talking about what I saw in action. The new low priced DC3 projectors will need to be evaluated when they will show up on the market. The question that will need to be answer is an DC3 projector with a cheap optic better than a DC2 projector with a better optics. And again I am speculating I don't know what will be the optic quality of the HD73. All price go down eventually and the IN76 will at some point follow.

Alimentall

09-21-06, 02:48 PM

I understand that. I am only talking about what I saw in action. The new low priced DC3 projectors will need to be evaluated when they will show up on the market. The question that will need to be answer is an DC3 projector with a cheap optic better than a DC2 projector with a better optics. And again I am speculating I don't know what will be the optic quality of the HD73. All price go down eventually and the IN76 will at some point follow.

IMO, the IN76 is better than the 7205 overall, especially in color, despite the latter's better optics. I didn't see the IN78, but my partner did and was pretty blown away by it. He doesn't usually get that animated. I wouldn't be surprised if it isn't better than the 7210. Of course, then we saw the Sim2 1080p demo. Me gusta!

Tolstoi

09-21-06, 05:40 PM

IMO, the IN76 is better than the 7205 overall, especially in color, despite the latter's better optics. I didn't see the IN78, but my partner did and was pretty blown away by it. He doesn't usually get that animated. I wouldn't be surprised if it isn't better than the 7210. Of course, then we saw the Sim2 1080p demo. Me gusta!

Thanks for the comment. This sound like nice projector, I will sure take a look at it. Meanwhile, I doubt I will upgrade my IN76 for anything less than a 1080p projector. I am ready to wait 12-18 months to get proper pricing.

nbpc question was more about a comparison between the Optoma HD73 or the IN76 which will be both in the same street price range. What is your opinion on this?

evilution

09-24-06, 04:43 PM

After sitting on hold for 1 hour, I didn't think to ask what the support agent thought was the problem. He did say they would be replacing it with a new unit as soon as it arrived at Infocus.

Does anyone know if they return it with a new bulb?

My IN76 just died today while watching football.

Sent a message to their support team, hope ot hear back soon.

No warning the projector acted like it was unplugged from the wall (tried different outlets etc to no avail).

:(

-Mike

jllphan

09-24-06, 05:46 PM

My IN76 just died today while watching football.

Sent a message to their support team, hope ot hear back soon.

No warning the projector acted like it was unplugged from the wall (tried different outlets etc to no avail).

:(

-Mike
Wow, your kidding? My IN72 did the same thing. One minute I'm watching the Seahawks kill the Giants and now I can't even get the LED around the source button to light? It's like it's unplugged. Anyone?

reedyj

09-24-06, 08:00 PM

Greetings everyone, I purchased a IN76 a few months back, since then nothing but troubles. First one had a bad pixel, yes thats right. The second, third, and fourth all just went dead. Even after installing a new Pure AV line conditioner it still died. I spoke to a Infocus sales rep and was informed it is a fuse problem. The projector has a 1 am fuse soldered into it. On some electrical grids the projector is fooled into thinking it needs to blow this fuse. Something about subtle sine waves or something. So the repair option is to have it sent in and a 2 amp fuse soldered into it. All new units being shipped already have this upgrade.

Infucus has not given me anything for all my troubles, but I am at least happy to know what the problem is!!

Cant wait to get back to watching some 115 inch HDTV again :)

Happy viewing all.

Mine did the same, e-mailed service request at web site, got RMA# and sent it back. Turn around time was one week. Back on Friday with updated Firmware (2.7). No information about the cause, but perhaps that is the answer (fuse) since you have the same symptoms as my unit did. Died while watching it. I kept my box to send it back in case of repeat fuse problems. Get your RMA# now if under warranty.

I feel your pain, Good Luck! On a positive note, I was worried about getting service since others noted problems, but got e-mail updates when the unit was received and sent out via UPS with tracking number. The repair took one day. Received on Tue and sent out on Wed.

spyder696969

09-24-06, 09:11 PM

The repair took one day. Received on Tue and sent out on Wed.

Since you kept the box, would you mind doing a quick check to see if the serials match up? There was speculation that IF just sends out other replacements, rather than do immediate repairs, at least on the 4805 units. (Of course, it's possible that they just slap the casing onto a different unit as well, I guess.)

reedyj

09-24-06, 10:01 PM

Yes, the serial number matched. I used my original box to sent the unit back. I tore off one of the tags and kept it. The box that was returned was a plain one with foam for padding. The label on the plain box has the original serial number, as well as the unit itself.

bradylee

09-24-06, 11:27 PM

Hey all,

I recently bought the In72 and am pretty happy with it. the only issue that I am having is trying to tweak the colors on it. I am using the color control menu item to adjust. Can anyone tell me the settings that they have their in72 set to. This would really help speed up the whole process.

Pm me or reply back if you can

Thanks in advance

Brady

MrBeelzebub

09-25-06, 11:27 AM

OK I just got done reading the H70 thread, and well I think Infocus might be in trouble. I have to say I'm disappointed with Infocus. The IN72 is really just a fancy SP4805. Thank god for Optoma they just skipped the 2k barrier all together and made a sub 1K 720p DLP.

Heck the H70 is closer to their IN76 and the H70 has better specs for 1/3 of the price.

IN76
3000:1
4x 6seg colorwheel

H70
4000:1
4x 7seg colorwheel.

I'm sure the IN76 must have 10bit color processing so that might be a selling point. Not much of one though. Slightly better fleshtones at best which NTSC kills anyway.

The H70 is going to be big really big

Gotta love it for this price you could gotten one hell of screen, couple of bulbs, one of the Lumenlab $30 7000hr bulb PJ's for Normal TV and still take your women out to a fancy restaurant.

tradewinds

09-25-06, 11:36 AM

MrBeelzebub

09-25-06, 12:08 PM

I too am fed up with IF, but really would like to see a good 1080p at around 2-2.5k by BF, fingers crossed. If not, I may just do the HD70 until a good 1080p is at a bang for the buck price of 1.5-2k

BTW - I am planning on going with a 2.35 Constant Height screen in my new place and from what I understand so far, the HD70 supports it. Not sure how the setup looks with the external lenses.

Don't get suckered into the 1080p hype. I saw a demostration of a high end CRT PJ that showed some true 1080p along with true 720p. I really wasn't that impressed. There where only 2 1080p clips that show a noticable improovment. One was a crazy computer generated clip the other was a blimp shot of a Socker game. For movies and normal viewing stuff I really didn't see much of a improvement. I tell you this much It was nothing like the jump from Standard Def to Hi Def.

1080p is also in trouble because there isn't going to be much content and it will not be broadcasted. Well maybe in 10 or 20 years. Oh and for the next gen game consoles all of the games are going to be 720p. Of course there will be 20 people that will say otherwise.

I think the focus for 2 -3k PJ's should be improovements in color and contrast. Maybe a 3 DLP with a 6000:1 CR. I tell you the color and contrast on the CRT was simply amazing. It was hard to go home and watch my Z3.

Though 1080p would rule If I had a 300" screen, I just don't think my GF would go for a drive in in the backyard. Of course our second date was watching movies on my PJ so you never know.

caesar1

09-25-06, 12:45 PM

tradewinds

09-25-06, 12:51 PM

supposedly, I thought it was a white segment that makes the image perceive brighter.

krasmuzik

09-25-06, 03:15 PM

Somebody buy one of these HD70's and send it to me for calibration review. I'll give it the same justice I gave the NECHT510 which was the last sub $K closeout POS ......if you want to buy based on specs per dollar - then use the calibrated numbers!

That 7th segment is white - which is responsible for a massive ON/OFF contrast increase - costing a majorly annoying blowout of whites and gamma and desaturated colors - as well as a reduction in ANSI contrast. From the presence of that alone I can guarantee you calibrated results will be at least 60% off. Colorwheel is deceptive marketing considering that a 7th segment for video quality wold be a neutral density green - like on the SP7210.

I tried to get someone to take a bet that the HD72 was not calibrated out of the box - and they would not take it. And I was proven right now that there are more DIY calibrators out there trying to fix their boxes. Some people just cannot handle the truth.

Believe me if Optoma thought the HD70 was going to kill off higher priced 720P - they would themselves no longer be making higher priced 720P. But they most assuredly are - even they themselves know that all they did was make something as cheaply as possible. So they want to compete with the cheaper 720P LCD at the warehouse - great - but that never stopped anyone buying a higher priced higher performing product before. But nobody needs to be deluded into thinking they bought a better product!

BobL

09-25-06, 08:24 PM

Kras,

We will be getting one in a couple of days. I'll compare it and take measurements and compare it to the IN76. The HD72 definitely needed work out of the box and the IN72 IMHO was better than HD72. I probably won't get to testing it until next week. I'm in class all this week.

Bob

billymac

09-25-06, 10:22 PM

But nobody needs to be deluded into thinking they bought a better product!

agree, but i think it's too late. :)

they've all drank the kook-aid! ;)

cavu

09-25-06, 10:27 PM

From the presence of [the white segment] alone I can guarantee you calibrated results will be at least 60% off. I get the impression that they may switch off the clear segment in their "cinema" mode.

"Guitarman" (who I don't know) says the HD70 calibration is accurate. Do you know him?

Martin Butler

09-25-06, 10:38 PM

I remember Guitarman as being a knowledgeable and helpful fellow. Not sure if he was associated with a projector company or not.

presenter

09-26-06, 01:50 AM

The HD70 almost certainly has to be a good value by virtue of its sub $1000 price tag. Optoma is going to have to work hard to convince people that the HD73 is worth the difference, although, slated for $1999 (I believe), I hear it will have some profit margin in it for dealers, so prices should almost certainly be below the $1999. The HD70, is supposedly a lower margin product, so don't look for significant discounting.

That said, the HD72/73 are bright. The HD70 probably won't match their brightness. Optoma has never been particularly good at black levels, or rather they are good, but others better - Mitsubishi's HC3000, IN76, and even possibly the Sony HS51A (LCD).

I don't yet know when I'll be getting an HD70 for review, but I'd have to agree with those that it say should be a better choice for most people than a 480p projector - unless you like sitting far back. The HD72 has always been a good value, combining a good picture with more brightness than any other DLP, in its price range. I doubt the HD70 will be as bright, Optoma will need those lumens to help sell the HD73.

There may be another excellent low cost DLP choice. Mitsubishi has their new HD1000, with a $1495 price and no doubt it will be discounted - I expect maybe a $350 spread between the HD70 and the Mits. Mitsubishi's HC3000 is very similar to the HD72, in brightness, lens offset, etc., It aways cost close to $500 more but did definitely (IMO) deliver better blacks and shadow detail for the extra money). I also think (not sure) that at least some of its processing is 10 bit. I suspect that it will, like the HC3000 do better blacks than the less expensive Optoma.

The good news of course: everything's getting cheaper and better.

presenter

09-26-06, 01:52 AM

I remember Guitarman as being a knowledgeable and helpful fellow. Not sure if he was associated with a projector company or not.

I agree. He's not associated with any manufacturer, but if I recall correctly, he is an Optoma owner, and fan, and has developed good contacts there.

cavu

09-26-06, 03:33 AM

I agree.Hey Art!

When will your HD70 review be available?

presenter

09-26-06, 06:02 AM

Hey Art!

When will your HD70 review be available?

Good question. I've been waiting to hear from Optoma. I'm definitely not "at the top of their list" for review units.

It could be a month or two?

I'd love to get one in asap, but will have to console myself with all the other projectors I have coming in to review in the next two months, including the Sony Pearl (W50), finally the Samsung 710e, the new low cost Mitsubishi HD1000U, which is probably the step up product from the HD70 ($1495), and so on. I have 9 confirmed review units arriving between now and mid-December.

I hope I survive.

But anyway the HD70, and the HD81, are certainly 2 I want to review, as soon as I can.

Ahzroe

09-26-06, 06:32 AM

In the manual for the IN76, it lists that it accepts 1080p/60 over component, but that it is sub-sampled. What does that mean? I want to Xbox 360 HD DVD into the projector at 1080p and let the projector's scaler change it down to 720p.

Did you get any information on this NoThru? I am interested in doing the same. Before I go and buy $100 in connectors and cables, I want to make sure to know what sub-sampled means.

Anyone running their Xbox 360 as a DVD player via VGA/VESA on the IN76? Is it worth the additional costs?

zoki.rb

09-26-06, 08:09 AM

JeffKB

09-26-06, 11:02 AM

I get the impression that they may switch off the clear segment in their "cinema" mode.

The X1 also turned off the white segment but that didn't prevent black levels and color saturation from being affected. I think the problem is the fact that the DMD still lets a certain amount of light through even with all the mirrors fully off. When the clear segment is "on the lamp", and the naked light is shining on the DMD, more light leaks thru than you'd get with a 6 segment wheel, compromising black levels and saturation.

I haven't read too many complaints on the H72 black levels and saturation however, so maybe the segment is so small that it's affect is minimal. At any rate, a white segment compromises PQ for brightness, at least to some degree, and is not something I would want on my PJ.

Dean Prestholt

09-26-06, 11:59 AM

Hi

I searched this forum but I really couldnt find similar problem and solution to mine.

Recently I bought Infocus IN76. Connection is Radeon 9600Pro DVI-out (single link, i think) to HDMI-in. Cable is Bandridge HDMI-DVI 5m. I use Power DVD 7 Deluxe for DVDs. Resolution is 1024x768@85Hz.

Problem is that picture sometimes cracks horizontally. It's not bad and often, but it's annoying. Sample of cracking is downwards (notice third line, half of picture gets shifted to the right for a bit).

vvvvvv
vvvvvv
-vvvvvv
-vvvvvv
-vvvvvv

Interesting is that picture doesnt crack when I watch TV from my tuner card. Actually up to now I noticed that image cracks only on DVDs.

what could be the problem??

1. high bitrate dvd (too slow cable or connection)
2. wrong resolution or refresh rate
3. dvd software
4. wrong setup in radeon driver settings
5. ????

drivers are up to date and firmware for Infocus is newest (2.5)

please help

p.s.: can radeon 9600pro handle vga and dvi connection at the same time so i don't need to plug in or out cable every time i want to switch between monitor and projector?

I believe what you are describing as "cracking" is actually called tearing. It is almost certainly being caused by number 2. Primarily the 85Hz refresh rate. You should be running 60Hz for video based DVD's and 48Hz or 72Hz for film based DVD's. Also your resolution should be set for your projectors native resolution of 1280x720.

I've been using Power DVD for years. It's a very good software player. Are there better? Some would say so but it's always worked well enough for me.

And yes you can have both DVI and VGA plugged in at the same time. You can even use both at the same time but it may decrease your video performance slightly. You may not even notice. Give it a try.

krasmuzik

09-26-06, 01:53 PM

presenter -
guitarman was outed as receiving free demos from Optoma (when he gave the impression he had so many he loved them so much) - and last february opened a dealership account (was tagged as a Optoma seller on videogon)

Of course nothing is wrong with either - you get free demos as a reviewer - and I am an Infocus dealer. The problem is or was one of disclosure - and I doubt any newbs that are falling for his reviews even know any of this - they presume he is just an enthusiastic buyer. I would have thought a longer term member like yourself knew this already.

I have yet to see any projector with a clear segment hold up to brightness or contrast numbers in home theater mode that does not use it - the loss is significant - 60% easily. So my bringing it up in this thread was because of newbs who think based on the brightness/contrast numbers the HD70 is a better deal. I guarantee the numbers are much much worse - and would not look as such a great deal.

The Mitsu HC3000 is better than the HD72 as you noted - despite both being DC2. The reason is the colorwheel design. The HC3100 should be even more like the IN76 since it adds extra red segments and is now precalibrated optically and digitally. People seem to have been brainwashed that only the TI chipset matters - there is a lot more to a projector than that!

We need truth in advertisting by the FCC to stop such spec charades (and they do act - they have new rules for subwoofer specs now!). Of course I cannot get a free Optoma to review - neither an Optoma dealer or a softie reviewer be I - if the specs don't hold up I tell the truth. Cost me an NEC dealership account - they did have a two week loaner program I "abused", but irrelevant since they got out of the HT biz anyways.

I think it is really sad that AVSers are buying projectors based on screenshot threads and marketed specs. S stands for science - but apparently not in the cheaper projector forum! Maybe I should tell Infocus they should start giving me free demos - they should double their marketing specs, then they can hire my buddy DaGamePimp to take screenshots. I bet we could move a lot of IN76 that way!

Tolstoi

09-26-06, 02:02 PM

I remember Guitarman as being a knowledgeable and helpful fellow. Not sure if he was associated with a projector company or not.

He is an Optoma reseller. He also claimed that the HD72 were calibrated out of the box. Which was false on the units I saw (two of them).

tradewinds

09-26-06, 02:04 PM

thanks Kras for pointing that out so the rest don't blindly follow. The funny thing is if those guys on the other thread will view this before they reach for the CC. Hopefully they have no regrets.

krasmuzik

09-26-06, 02:09 PM

Dean

Good call. That is exact symptom of frame rate issues.

There are two kinds of issues there - color wheel sync refresh rate - what the optical system matches up to. The other is what refresh rates the digital ports accept before they start dropping/merging frames. Not sure if 85Hz is on the list or not.

What is happening above the tear line is you see one frame, below the tear line a different frame! Very very annoying - even trying to get perfect 48Hz/60Hz/72Hz HTPC is tricky - not all drivers will do the divide by 1.001 math to account for it being slightly less!

Tolstoi

09-26-06, 02:10 PM

krasmuzik

09-26-06, 02:18 PM

Did you get any information on this NoThru? I am interested in doing the same. Before I go and buy $100 in connectors and cables, I want to make sure to know what sub-sampled means.

Anyone running their Xbox 360 as a DVD player via VGA/VESA on the IN76? Is it worth the additional costs?

I do know on the SP4805 - and I presume IN76 is same - that the VGA port was limited to standard computer resolutions. Which is fine if that is what the XBOX natively generates - but I thought it was natively 720P widescreen. So component or HDMI running 720P is your best XBOX360 output. I think it does 1080i/1080p in fact by upsampling the 720P!

Downsampling 1080P just means you lose resolution - fact is IN76 is a 720P display. If indeed I am correct about XBOX being native 720P - then that is stupid to upsample only to downsample! There are no 1080P displays in the cheaper projector forum!

The PS3 is supposed to be native 1080p though as well as deep color - something which no display are supporting yet - they all do 1080i with HD color. (IN76 can sync to 1080P HD - but few others do!)

cavu

09-26-06, 02:27 PM

guitarman was outed as receiving free demos from Optoma (when he gave the impression he had so many he loved them so much) - and last february opened a dealership account (was tagged as a Optoma seller on videogon)Trusting you guys are right. Pinching my nose and jumping (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8518731&&#post8518731).....

krasmuzik

09-26-06, 02:39 PM

unless the outing threads got deleted - they can be found on the forum archives. I am not telling tales here. He will always refuse to confirm or deny though and say it does not matter even if true and AVS bans dealer "advertising" anyways....

Some months ago he said he was leaving AVS for a friendlier forum after all the outing bashing - I guess the larger AVS market was too hard to ignore.

I simply do not bother anymore. If anyone wants to know the truth - I offer to calibrate their HD70 - the downside is I will publicly post the results.

presenter

09-26-06, 04:25 PM

presenter -

Of course nothing is wrong with either - you get free demos as a reviewer - and I am an Infocus dealer. The problem is or was one of disclosure - and I doubt any newbs that are falling for his reviews even know any of this - they presume he is just an enthusiastic buyer. I would have thought a longer term member like yourself knew this already.

We need truth in advertisting by the FCC to stop such spec charades (and they do act - they have new rules for subwoofer specs now!). Of course I cannot get a free Optoma to review - neither an Optoma dealer or a softie reviewer be I

Greetings Kraz,

Long time, I've been busy, and have barely been stopping by the forum for a couple of days every couple of months it seems. Didn't know Optoma was giving guitarman units to keep, they sure never gave me one to keep! I took a lot of heat a couple years ago, when I started Projector Reviews, because I also worked part time at a dealership (that I previously owned). The solution was simple. I posted all that info in my profile, and basically told people, that the bottom line was the credibility of my reviews, not my family history.

Regarding free demos. ahhh - it really would be nice. The manufacturers all want them back. Typically I return a projector about 10 days after it arrives for a review. There have been some exceptions. My BenQ 8720 was a review unit, and I bought it, exchanging advertising for gear. (That's still buying it). Manufacturers will usually offer me gear at about dealer cost. There are exceptions, Optoma let me keep an HD72 here, for comparison purposes, (to get more exposure) which I'm just returning now, with the HD73 coming out... And also an HD7100, but that was only until they came up with fix for the DVI/HDMI problem, which apparently they haven't, since I still can't get a straight answer out of them. I gave up on the HD7100 and sent it back a while ago. However both projectors just sat around, in my testing room, probably less than 30 hours total between them over several months.

The one exception seems to be screens. Mostly, except for the very expensive SI Virage, no one wants them back. I have a half dozen inexpensive pulldowns, motorized, and fixed wall screens cluttering up my testing room.

I'd love to find someone like Optoma or Sony, or better yet, SIM2, that would just GIVE me a projector, for my home theater, just to keep mentioning it in my articles, but , it sure hasn't happened yet. (I'm already gathering prices for 1080 projectors to replace my BenQ, and no one has offered me a freebie (not that I don't hint). If Sim2 gave me a nice 3 chip 1080, I would shout from the rooftops that they gave it to me. Who cares. Anyway, this isn't the place for such discussions.

Anyway, back to projectors I concur, the clear (white) filter does affect blacks, etc. And no doubt that's why Mitsubishi's and InFocus's are typically, better than Optoma's at blacks.
Interestingly I had the Optoma HD72 against the Panasonic PT-AX100U last night, and low and behold, the Panny definitely had the advantage in blacks, even being brighter. (The Optoma had AI engaged, the Panny, had the dynamic iris on, but even on the kind of brighter scenes where the iris can't close down significantly the Panny advantage held.) I've been a staunch DLP over LCD person for years, but I'll tell you, this new Panny looks damn good. The LCD panels must be much improved, the image was much sharper than the 900u, yet pixel structure was GET THIS -less visible than the Optoma!
Couldn't find any visible banding, and it is seriously bright, a real plus for sports fans like myself (go Penn State!). Anyway the review posts tomorrow, for those interested.

Sorry for getting off track! -a

tradewinds

09-26-06, 04:41 PM

presenter....if you are looking to offload a fixed screen, PM me what you have and the price. Thanks.

gprro1

09-26-06, 05:21 PM

I simply do not bother anymore. If anyone wants to know the truth - I offer to calibrate their HD70 - the downside is I will publicly post the results.

I can't wait. I'm still impartial, but I asked directly if the contrast and lumen numbers he posted were d65 calibrated, and the answer was yes... we shall see. I can't recall exactly, but contrast was around 2700 and lumens in high were over 800 and 6xx in low.

rrhomes

09-26-06, 06:25 PM

I simply do not bother anymore. If anyone wants to know the truth - I offer to calibrate their HD70 - the downside is I will publicly post the results.

Why is this a downside if you don't know the results yet, it may turn out to be a huge upside if the machine performs worthy of $999 MSRP, unless going into the review you already know it wont.

zoki.rb

09-26-06, 07:06 PM

thanks for help.

1024x768 resolution + leeterbox mode was a major problem. i switched to 1280x720 and picture is really amazingly sharp. it's almost like monitor even when watched from a 0,5 meter distance. i also removed keystone correction which adds muddiness to picture.

i watched master&commanned and didnt notice single tearing case. if i notice it, i'll have in mind refresh rate change.

another question:
picture is great and i project it on ligth blue wall, but darker blacks would be nice. i'm looking for a DIY projector screen to get darker blacks.
important thing to mention is that i live in croatia so i cant buy almost none of spefic products for diy screens you metion here.

what would you recommend for screen if you have access only to materials commonly used everywhere (that excludes specific models or products)??
i was thinking of blackcloth and painting with some kind of gray paint.
i can get laminates but if understood right, only specific laminates are good for projection so that option is probably out...
target diagonal size is 145"

krasmuzik

09-26-06, 07:07 PM

rrhomes

I can guarantee from past experience that clear segment projectors do not hold up to their specs in home theater mode that turns it off.

The Infocus X1 - did not. 60% drop.
The NEC HT510 - did not. 80% drop.

And those are HT projectors - biz projectors can be even worse. This is a fundamental of colorwheel technology - it has nothing to do with brand and their dealers.

If you bother to read this thread rather than interloping - this discussion started because someone said based on the marketed contrast and brightness per dollar - which is a ludicrous reason to be buying a projector.

How would I know that - if I didn't have Optoma customers before - that trusted that I am giving them unbiased information when I cailbrate them to PAY me for it. The HD70 is not at all the first clear segment based colorwheel projector that will have their specs obliterated - but I am happy to calibrate whoever wants to send me one in return for the honest review of how far off those specs are. And if they want to PAY me for it just to keep me honest - they certainly can.

Then when the specs are 2/3 off the marketed number - the numbers will correlate with the MSRP and people can make an informed decision.

I suggest you revisit your suggestion that a professional calibrator would let brand influence his measurements. I can assure you nobody would PAY me for calibration if that was the case.

gppro1
guitarman does not calibrate flatline to D65 - this is always evident in his posts - above 80-90% IRE the Optoma's tend to go south on Red. This makes their 100% whites brighter but bluer - which increases the contrast/brightness spec. When I calibrate I get it flatlined all the way across - because people PAY me for that - even if it harms the brightness/contrast spec. When I do calibration review - I cover all of the configuration modes of the projector just so you can see the tradeoffs.

flyingbig

09-26-06, 09:22 PM

rrhomes

09-27-06, 01:10 AM

rrhomes

I can guarantee from past experience that clear segment projectors do not hold up to their specs in home theater mode that turns it off.

you don't need to sell me on that as I understand that PJs with a clear segment are not trying to win the Home Theater Calibration Award an unfortunately the clear segment is not pointed out as a strength but its pointed out as a weakness, for pure HT batcaves it is a weakness but against its direct dollar competitors it has its strengths in other areas and are designed to be a more of a better fit for the potential costumer that may be in that price range. It wouldn't be unfair to say that the HD70 may be more of a bullseye hit for whos buying it then its competitors at the very same price.

How do you calibrate a color wheel that has no clear segment to Games mode anyway. How would some of the HT projectors do when they owner needs some brightness for games or daylight viewing or even just some brightness because they have white painted walls and just turn off the lights.

The Infocus X1 - did not. 60% drop.
The NEC HT510 - did not. 80% drop.

And those are HT projectors - biz projectors can be even worse. This is a fundamental of colorwheel technology - it has nothing to do with brand and their dealers.

really? I never thought the X1 was an HT machine I always thought it was a combination machine as in does pretty good at both in lieu of being better at one. The X1 really nailed it for a dual purpose machine and although the HT specs were well below other pure HT units, for the money the X1 w/DCDi really slamdunked its price point. HT Rocked on it and I remember Quake 3 in my front room with the lights off just looked awesome plenty bright and the blacks looked great too.

If you bother to read this thread rather than interloping - this discussion started because someone said based on the marketed contrast and brightness per dollar - which is a ludicrous reason to be buying a projector.

I didn't have to read to far up to see that one who sells the pjs they review or speak on behalf of has to be looked at with in that lighting. From the looks of everyones comments when dollars are involved NO ONE is above a little sceptical eyeballing no matter how professional they truly are, anyone saying well "I'm so professional that it doesn't apply to me", just doesn't hold water if their conclusions benefit the brand and units they sell. Buyers should at least get another opinion as to how good a PJ is within the full purposes they are using the machine, and not fall prey to a dealer pointing out the sole specs that his machine is superior at, and omitting the other very relitive specs.

The HD70 is not at all the first clear segment based colorwheel projector that will have their specs obliterated - but I am happy to calibrate whoever wants to send me one in return for the honest review of how far off those specs are.

Then when the specs are 2/3 off the marketed number - the numbers will correlate with the MSRP and people can make an informed decision.

As long as it pointed out to them that HT mode is not the end all be all of calibration, except for HT batcave setups, it could be confusing and a disservice to a Dad or any $999 buyer who in a few months is in BestBuy to get him/his kid a PJ for use for HT, Xbox 360 and some HDTV. I'm not sure HT calibration specs would serve this buyer well, but light output for the Xbox 360 and and resolution benefits for HDTV should really be brought to his attention for his uses and compared to what he can get for the same amount of money in other machines, especially the resolution its something he could get his brain around and it would show up on HDTV were other - batcave - calibrated higher contrast machines would really have failed him for the free HDTV he can get from OTA or HD-DVD or PC for that matter.

I suggest you revisit your suggestion that a professional calibrator would let brand influence his measurements. I can assure you nobody would PAY me for calibration if that was the case.

I don't need to revisit its stated clearly, if there is money to be made by brand/spec superiority with a conflict of interest then its been stated over and over in the recent threads to look out for that. A seller/rep telling me, thats not the case with ME is well obviously not thought through very well. Its not that they are not telling the truth but "How would you know" is the question and the solution according to postings is do they havea 'Financial Interest" that their units do better according to them, thats the golden measuring stick so I guess it should be use,d and one brand of PJ coming out on top in one area would be of benefit to a Dealer/rep of that brand/units - others here have suggested. Others like me have said "thats bullshi* Postkings on these boards can be objective enough for us to benefit from what they say about PJs they are selling, but others here say they can't and that you got to look at their motive. I think they all can but some suggest No Way theres a few who can't because they I guess don't have the morals of the ones who can, is the only way to kind of take that, some are above money and some aren't I guess, I'm being TOLD.

krasmuzik

09-27-06, 02:54 AM

rrhomes

I don't disagree that a gaming projector for ambient rooms need not be held to a high HT dark room standard - but also don't think movies are not going to be watched at nite once people get one of these. So it is very important to know what you lose - and if there is a better way to solve the problems of light control so you do not lose so much. When DaGamePimp and I did a joint compare of the NEC HT510 - we both said the NEC would make a great day gamers machine - but it did not even qualify to be labeled an HT projector. If people don't care just because they saved thousands - great for them. But it is ludicrous for them to say it is a better performing unit as far as videophile specs when they are not a calibrator - and are going off marketing specs. Marketing specs is an unregulated lie in the projector industry. It may amaze you that people strive to find out the video engineering performance behind the specs - and pay a premium to reward companies that focus on video engineering.

I guess you have not seen my comprehensive calibration review format. I objectively grade greyscale deviation, gamma deviation, color gamut and color decoding - using standard CIE science. No calibration charts that are incomparable and incomprehensible. No possibility of leaving out the bad parts and only highlite the good. To even remotely hint that I would let dealer bias into a calibration session - is nothing more than a personal attack on me and my biz - and most importantly on my customers who have paid me to calibrate boxes I don't and never will sell!

I do all user modes of a projector to find out what mode marketing had it at - and what mode the HT setting is. That is what people pay calibrators for - knowing the good and the bad. They already know the ugly - that is why they called the calibrator. As long as this is AV Science - these measures are very relevant to be discussed - and many consider those measure more important than the price.

Ask yourself why as I dealer I cannot get an Optoma demo - especially when they sell it at one of my authorized distributors - and I could sell it if I wanted to. It does not meet my standards for picture quality - which is what people come to me for - performance home theaters. I am not in the commodity box biz selling whatever vendors make - did you ever see my presence in the Infocus SP5000 threads? No because it was not up to the standards of the rest of the line. Ditto for that POS TV they tried to sell - every see me over in the TV forums shilling it? NO!

I would have reviewed them and indeed covered shortcomings- but even as an Infocus dealer - I could not get a freebie loaner for even a review!!! The distributor would not even unpack one for me to play with at their warehouse - because it would cost them money. I actually have to buy my demos - and they always cost me money. I am not about to buy something that I am not a dealer for and not authorized to resell - just to get a review. I have better things to do with my money!

Thus my calibration offer stands for first HD70er that wants to know the truth. That is an even better source for a guaranteed objective review. No marketing people telling you how to position it - no phrases I need to use, no threats of withholding future demos, blah blah blah. I am still waiting for the HD72er to step up to that offer - so not like I am holding my breath. So there will likely not be a calibration review forthcoming. But if you want to know how they perform - there are DIY calibrators trying to get theirs tuned in the calibration forums.

Tolstoi

09-27-06, 09:22 AM

Why is this a downside if you don't know the results yet, it may turn out to be a huge upside if the machine performs worthy of $999 MSRP, unless going into the review you already know it wont.

We know from past experience. I changing projector every year and I would like to pay my projector 1000$ but the reality is that it cost something to design, build and support good projectors.

Tolstoi

09-27-06, 09:27 AM

Greetings Kraz,

Long time, I've been busy, and have barely been stopping by the forum for a couple of days every couple of months it seems. Didn't know Optoma was giving guitarman units to keep, they sure never gave me one to keep! I took a lot of heat a couple years ago, when I started Projector Reviews, because I also worked part time at a dealership (that I previously owned). The solution was simple. I posted all that info in my profile, and basically told people, that the bottom line was the credibility of my reviews, not my family history.

Presenter I have exchanged a few emails with you in the past and read a few of post here at AVS and there was no doubt about the two hats you were wearing. Which is not the case for guitarman.

For me the fact that you are getting a long term demo unit from a projector manufacturer is not far from being identical to get a free projector. How can someone post a bad review of an Optoma if in exchange it could loose is long demo unit.

Tolstoi

09-27-06, 09:32 AM

This thread is HUGE so i'll ask a simple question here in hope that someone in the know can help me make a decision. Atm i can get my hands on an IN72 for £500 which is a great price considering i have been eyeing a secondhand 4805 for a while but should i just go for the IN72 as it should be better than the 4805 in every area right?

My PJ will be plugged into a PC for the most part as well as an Xbox/GC and SkyTV and i would like to view HD as well as i was happy watching HD using the PC via my Optoma H30 so i would at least like it to match the great job my H30 did with downscaling 720p HD material.

The IN72 is a better projector in all senses. Not enough better to justify upgrading form the 4805 to the IN72 I someone is already owning a 4805. Considering the price difference I would go for the IN72.

krasmuzik

09-27-06, 03:04 PM

This thread is HUGE so i'll ask a simple question here in hope that someone in the know can help me make a decision. Atm i can get my hands on an IN72 for £500 which is a great price considering i have been eyeing a secondhand 4805 for a while but should i just go for the IN72 as it should be better than the 4805 in every area right?

My PJ will be plugged into a PC for the most part as well as an Xbox/GC and SkyTV and i would like to view HD as well as i was happy watching HD using the PC via my Optoma H30 so i would at least like it to match the great job my H30 did with downscaling 720p HD material.

Given the choice go for the IN72. Quieter and nice case. Slightly improved contrast. More reliable mechanical design. Real HDMI port. The only real image difference is SP4805 is Faroudja DCDi which is arguably better at 480i vs. PW which is sharper at 480i at occasional jaggie cost - and properly does 1080i.

Either one is better than the H30 - it is the H31 that was the SP4805's contempary.

Ahzroe

09-27-06, 07:15 PM

I do know on the SP4805 - and I presume IN76 is same - that the VGA port was limited to standard computer resolutions. Which is fine if that is what the XBOX natively generates - but I thought it was natively 720P widescreen. So component or HDMI running 720P is your best XBOX360 output. I think it does 1080i/1080p in fact by upsampling the 720P!

Downsampling 1080P just means you lose resolution - fact is IN76 is a 720P display. If indeed I am correct about XBOX being native 720P - then that is stupid to upsample only to downsample! There are no 1080P displays in the cheaper projector forum!

The PS3 is supposed to be native 1080p though as well as deep color - something which no display are supporting yet - they all do 1080i with HD color. (IN76 can sync to 1080P HD - but few others do!)

I am not sure about the VGA port on the IN76 being limited to standardard computer resolutions. I thought it would do the 720p widescreen. Anyone else?

The reason I am asking about the VGA is not for the 1080p ability, but for the upconversion the 360 may be able to provide me on SD DVD through the VGA connection.

What does sync to 1080p HD mean in layman terms?

Thanks for the patience!

krasmuzik

09-27-06, 07:40 PM

Ahzroe

Generally video is run at 30 fields per second - with each field half of the picture frame. Put them together and you want to run at 60 frames per second. A 1920x1080 image sent 60 times a second is a massive amount of digital data which will overwhelm most input ports as well as signal wires. Since HD broadcasts top out at sending out half of the data at a time - most TV's support the 1080i but not the 1080p.

I have not tested the VGA port - so if someone else has...

It is a pretty safe bet that the IN76 is better at DVD upconversion to 720P than your XBOX is - not sure why you would want to bother other than to say you did.

flyingbig

09-27-06, 09:14 PM

Tolstoi & krasmuzik, thanks for taking the time to reply. I'll take what you said onboard and go for IN72 if i decide to lean towards Infocus as i have recently discovered the HD70 from Optoma which at £750 is extremely tempting considering it will bring me right upto HD specification. No easy decisions in life when you're a little short on cash! :confused:

BobL

09-28-06, 12:33 AM

We just got the HD70 in today and I brought it home to do some testing. I'm in class all this week and have relatives visiting through next week so I probably won't get it calibrated for another 2 weeks and do actual measurements on it. Anyway, here are my first impressions.

The box arrived and I was surprised it was the projector box, it was smaller than my old Piano 3100 box. Packaging OK, definitely not stellar. The unit itself is heavier than expected and seems of good build quality. The white will appeal to people with white ceilings but I just prefer black. My ceilings are dark but that is not an issue for testing. My room is the very darkest green you can get, almost black. I also have total light control. 92" Matte white screen at the moment but as with other equipment in my house anything is available to test at anytime.

I didn't bring home an IN76 because I figured I'd just watch the HD70. But as I started playing I wanted some comparisons. I had an IN74 kicking around so I used that. I did a quick calibration of just the contrast, brightness, color, tint and sharpness. I played with a few other settings with various test patterns from AVIA Pro and here is what they were set at.

Bright mode: Off
Image AI: Off. I turned it on briefly and the fan became annoyingly louder and cycled at times. I knew I'd never use it like this so I kept it off.
Degamma: Film
Brilliant color: 0 I liked the deeper blacks with 0. As you go higher the picture was more washed and at the high end it appeared to bleeding some colors.
True Vivid: 1
Mode: cinema

I fired it up and was impressed with the quietness of it. Shouldn't be a problem for most installations. I first connected to the JVC ProHD DVD player. We have had it a while and it was a good HD demo machine before the new HD/BR players. I have a lot of HD clips on it to use as a reference.

With regular DVD I felt the image was soft, not as crisp as the IN74. With HD it looked decent and pretty close to the IN74 but I still thought the IN74 was better. With SD cable my wife said "This is "terrible". So we did some comparisons.

Black level:
HD70 winner

Brightness
IN74

SDE:
Tie, I know it doesn't make sense but as we walked the room we noticed the SDE at the same point with both PJs. BTW, the IN72 I can see at 19' back on my 92"diag screen and both these we were seeing at about 10'.

Shadow detail:
IN74

Colors:
IN74 granted the brilliant color setting helps, but hurts the blacks and everything appeared more washed to my eyes when turning this setting up.

Processing for SD and 1080i:
IN74 by a wide margin, I think this is the biggest weakness of the HD70. I didn't try the HQV disc but I will when I do some more testing and I'll use an RP91 for the 480i signal.

Lens:
IN74 I don't know what lens each PJ uses but the IN74 was more crisp.

Quietness:
HD70

OK, final recommendations:
For $1000 and you watch mostly HD and have a good upconverting DVD player the HD70 would be a great choice. SD the IN72 is a huge step up, also with the IN72 I'd recommend less than a 92" screen unless you sit pretty far back. The SDE just bothers me on the IN72 more so than other 480P projectors, probably because its brighter than most other 480P PJs.

Compared to the IN74: I'd take the IN74 hands down but its MSRP is twice the price, so not necessarily a fair comparison. Or at minimum get a good video processor for the HD70.

I have no doubt the IN76 will beat it but is significantly more expensive.

When I do the calibrations I'll report back.

Bob

Tolstoi

09-28-06, 09:26 AM

Compared to the IN74: I'd take the IN74 hands down but its MSRP is twice the price, so not necessarily a fair comparison. Or at minimum get a good video processor for the HD70.

I have no doubt the IN76 will beat it but is significantly more expensive.

When I do the calibrations I'll report back.

Bob

If you have to add a good VP processor to the HD70 than you endup as expensive or more expensive than the IN74 or even street price of IN76 depending on which VP you get and if you have also to pay for the calibaration of the HD70, you add an other 300$ to the HD70 bill.

One of the issues with low cost projector is the lens quality. A good lens is costly, look at SLR camera lens and some of them are the price of an HD70. How is the lens of the HD70? Is the focus uniform on all corners? Is there any chromatic aberration?

DanC-P

09-28-06, 03:05 PM

If you have to add a good VP processor to the HD70 than you endup as expensive or more expensive than the IN74 or even street price of IN76
Am I the only one who thinks the MSRP and street price of the IN76 is about to head a bit south given the arrival of the HD70? They should at the very least end the MAP restrictions...

tradewinds

09-28-06, 03:16 PM

I think regardless of the H70 differences, a new price point for 720p has been set. I too would not be surprised to see more manufacturers droping towards the <1.5k mark for 720p

spyder696969

09-28-06, 09:46 PM

It's a great time to be looking at buying a PJ. :)

yyuksel

09-29-06, 02:29 PM

Is there anyone out here that went from 4805 to the IN76 and tested out the difference with the use of a Xbox 360? Just wondering if the upgrade is worth it. I know not exactly a easy question. Also, if someone has pics that would be great.

One other question, is it out of line to ask if the IN76 will be in the $1400-1700 in say 6 months or so?

I did exactly this. Went from the SP4805 to the IN76. Let me tell you, as far as image quality goes for the Xbox 360. WELL WORTH THE UPGRADE.

The contrast and the sharpness of the images are breath taking. :)

krasmuzik

10-06-06, 03:54 PM

moving day...

gprro1

10-06-06, 04:47 PM

Anyone (kras maybe) have an acurate lumen rating for a calibrated in76.

I was reading the reviews at projector reviews for the in 76 and new mitsu 1000, they reported the in76 around 385 lumens in low power. Seems a little low. They did say the unit or bulb may have been off. The mitsu was really bright, around 800-1000 calibrated. I like being able to use an nd and pop it off for extra brightness when needed.

spyder696969

10-06-06, 08:20 PM

...they reported the in76 around 385 lumens in low power. Seems a little low. They did say the unit or bulb may have been off.

Lol. For a second there, I thought they meant the unit was set to off, not off spec or whatever they were implying. I'm sitting here thinking, "Well, DUH! If it were off, it would be 0 lumens!" Silly me. :o

I doubt the in76 is that low though, when a calibrated 4805 meets or exceeds that number.

JeffKB

10-07-06, 01:56 AM

I was reading the reviews at projector reviews for the in 76 and new mitsu 1000, they reported the in76 around 385 lumens in low power. Seems a little low. They did say the unit or bulb may have been off. The mitsu was really bright, around 800-1000 calibrated. I like being able to use an nd and pop it off for extra brightness when needed.
I trust cine4home much more than projectorreviews, and after calibration they had the IN76 at 500 - 580 lumens (depending on zoom) vs 650 for the HD1000. That's a pretty impressive number for the Mits, but then again it has a white segment for brightness (and the PQ tradeoffs that come with that) while the IN76 does not.

DaGamePimp

10-07-06, 03:09 AM

As I recall I think kras's ISF'd IN76 is even higher lumens than what cine4home stated (with a new lamp of course) .

-------- Jason

Cine4Home

10-07-06, 04:09 AM

As I recall I think kras's ISF'd IN76 is even higher lumens than what cine4home stated (with a new lamp of course) .

-------- Jason

We measured around 580Lumens in Normal (Eco-) Mode and nearly 800Lumens in Hi-Power Mode (@D65).

Definately, the IN76 is one of the brightest projectors @D65 you can get in that price range.

Regards,
Ekkehart

Jonathan DA

10-07-06, 02:10 PM

Hey all, I can't get my IN76 to sync with my computer over the m1 input. I'm using a VGA to M1 cable from Monoprice. I've tried two different notebooks (1024x768 and 1400x1050) as well as my MyHD mdp-120 card set for 720p output. No sync on any of the three. Is there some trick I'm missing?

Also, has anyone tried an ND or ND2 filter? After a couple of months I'm still seing rainbows in dark scenes when I blink. I was hoping my brain would tune them out after a while, but it doesn't seem to be happening. I was wondering if an ND filter might help by reducing the brightness.

MASidoc

10-09-06, 02:34 PM

Hi all,

Long time reader of this thread, I purchased an IN76 about 6 weeks ago. Everything perfect, updated firmware, until yesterday. Sudden death with no LED/no power etc. as experienced by others here. Install is temporary table-top, but power was via power conditioner. Only other install notes I can think of: I just included Yamaha RX-V2700 in system feeding HDMI to IN76 within the past few days. Projector was plugged directly into power conditioner, though.

So I've got an email in to InFocus support, but haven't heard anything yet. While I'm waiting, I'd like to inquire about the cause/experience to those who've been through this. Quick review of the thread yielded the following screen names as those having similar problems with IN76 or IN72:
jkim5453, jyv1214, yubakram, reedyj, Razkal, Tnedator, evilution, jllphan

If you guys are still around here, please chip in:
Was it a fuse problem? How quickly did you get response/return of your projector? Was the problem resolved completely? Recurrence? Your proj was repaired or replaced? Any way to prevent this from happening?

Also, if Mr. Williams is still around, I'm wondering if he has any insight.

Thanks--and thanks to all who've contributed to this thread in the past as I've benefited from the info/discussion.

Mark

BrandonJF

10-09-06, 02:58 PM

I had missed that other people had experience that power issue with the IN76.

It just happened to me about a week and a half ago. I was watching it, then it just died. All my other equipment continued to run without interruption, so I do not believe there was any kind of power fluctuation.

It usually takes a couple of business days if you submit a warranty repair/replace request via the website for them to respond. If you just submitted a request to Tech Support, you might as well go ahead and submit the repair/replace request (or call-in the request - not sure if that's quicker or not).

This is the 2nd time I've sent the IN76 back to Infocus. It originally came out of the box with a dust blob and they replaced that one.

While I'm not thrilled with the fact that I've sent it back to them twice within 6 months, the turnaround time has been impressive. For the dust blob, they shipped a replacement to me within hours of receiving my defective unit. For this power issue, they shipped it back to me a day after receiving it. I'll have it back tomorrow and it will hopefully be working again.

I ordered the Pearl anyway - the IN76 has been great, but this latest issue was the sign I was looking for to get something new. I'll either use the IN76 as a backup to the Pearl so my wife and I never have to share her Sony A2000 again or I'll just sell it. I need to find out if warranties are transferrable...

reedyj

10-09-06, 05:18 PM

If you guys are still around here, please chip in:
Was it a fuse problem? How quickly did you get response/return of your projector? Was the problem resolved completely? Recurrence? Your proj was repaired or replaced? Any way to prevent this from happening?

Mark

Sorry to hear that it happened to you. No information about what the problem was. Turn around time was a week. I kept the original box that the pj came in and it cost $16.00 with $1000.00 insurance to sent in to Kentucky. It was repaired, same serial number. They updated the firmware. No idea how to prevent it. Like a past post said, maybe the fuse was replaced/updated to avoid this from occurring again.

Good luck!

evilution

10-09-06, 07:16 PM

So I've got an email in to InFocus support, but haven't heard anything yet. While I'm waiting, I'd like to inquire about the cause/experience to those who've been through this. Quick review of the thread yielded the following screen names as those having similar problems with IN76 or IN72:
jkim5453, jyv1214, yubakram, reedyj, Razkal, Tnedator, evilution, jllphan

If you guys are still around here, please chip in:
Was it a fuse problem? How quickly did you get response/return of your projector? Was the problem resolved completely? Recurrence? Your proj was repaired or replaced? Any way to prevent this from happening?

Also, if Mr. Williams is still around, I'm wondering if he has any insight.

Thanks--and thanks to all who've contributed to this thread in the past as I've benefited from the info/discussion.

Mark

Call up the support number that is quicker than using their tech support email. It took a week using the tech support email to get an RMA number.

I sent my projector in and they received it on 10/04. I have not received notice that it has been fixed yet. Over 2 weeks without a projector for my HT room has sucked. I'll be "upgrading" as soon as there is a 1080p DLP with enough light to use it on my 136" 2.35x1 screen (and costs less than 5k :) ).

JeffKB

10-09-06, 11:46 PM

Hmmm... I see the new forum dividing line is MSRP $2500. I wouldn't mind seeing this thread kick over to the higher priced forum. Most of the discussion here centers on the IN76, whose MSRP qualifies, and the thread (and projector) may generate greater interest in the higher priced forum.

It just seems to me that most of the people posting in the cheaper forum who are interested in DLP, are interested in the new cheapie 720p models. The IN76 may appeal more to those considering the higher priced, higher performance models. Then again, the more expensive forum is quickly becoming the 1080p or bust forum.

Anybody else have any thoughts here?

krasmuzik

10-10-06, 12:11 AM

I already tried to report post to the mods to get their attention it should be moved. Lets face it their are a couple of IN72 in here - no IN74 - the rest is all IN76 discussion.

Maybe cavu has to do it as the O/P

James A. McGahee

10-10-06, 09:53 PM

...as soon as there is a 1080p DLP with enough light to use it on my 136" 2.35x1 screen (and costs less than 5k... :) ).

I was thinking I would get an IN76 around Thanksgiving and go with a 120" dia. screen for now. Eventually I want to do the 2.35 CIH which, if I remember correctly, is about 139" (can't remember if that is dia. or horizonal").

Are you saying the IN76 doesn't do a sufficient job with light on your 136" 2.35 screen?

Do you know what brightness would be needed for that 136" "WOW" image?

Maybe I should wait and get the IN78EX as I understand it is about 500 lumens brighter. What do you think? Anybody/Everyone??
Thanks--

Mike N Ike

10-10-06, 10:22 PM

Maybe I should wait and get the IN78EX as I understand it is about 500 lumens brighter. What do you think? Anybody/Everyone??
Thanks--

I was thinking the same thing until I saw that InFocus is up for sale. :(

Mike

smithfarmer

10-11-06, 12:05 AM

krasmuzik

10-11-06, 01:28 AM

Here is my vote for a buyer....with HQ not twenty minutes away!

http://www.planar.com/hometheater/

tradewinds

10-11-06, 09:27 AM

maybe some of us can pool together and buy at least a piece of them out.

Yes, Planar does make some good monitors. I have two. Very solid.

billymac

10-11-06, 09:36 AM

god that is depressing.

hey on a another note. is there any correlation beteen firmare upgrades and the bad fuse issue? i'm hesitant to upgrade the firmware on my in76 and in72.

billymac

10-11-06, 09:37 AM

maybe some of us can pool together and buy at least a piece of them out.

i already tried that and it didn't work out so well for me. ;)

jyv1214

10-11-06, 10:54 AM

billymac,
i never had the chance to upgrade the firmaware before my in 76 died on me...two times
so i don't think that's the cause, if that is what you are asking

swithey

10-11-06, 10:55 AM

Are you saying the IN76 doesn't do a sufficient job with light on your 136" 2.35 screen?

Do you know what brightness would be needed for that 136" "WOW" image?
I'm projecting a 130" diag (10' wide) 2:35 image from my IN76 in "low power" mode on my Acoustically Transparent SMX DIY screen using the Panamorph U85 anamorphic lens. The picture is very bright and looks great in my 100% light controlled room. The projector lens is about 16.5' from the front of the screen.

JeffKB

10-11-06, 12:45 PM

Sad day for sure.

http://www.bizjournals.com/portland/stories/2006/10/09/daily14.html

Hopefully they will be bought by a company that will be able to bring them back to profitability without diminishing the quality of their HT division.
Sad perhaps, but probably the best (and maybe only) move considering financial performance over the last several years. It will be interesting to see if an investment company buys them or a competitor. I think the first scenario is the much more likely one, and probably the one that provides the greatest chance of seeing IF continue as the entity we're used to.

Here's an interesting quote from another article (http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/061010/infocus_outlook.html?.v=1):
"It (InFocus) also said it expects gross margins to decline quarter-over-quarter, due in part to an inventory charge for its entry-level projector, the INC72 (sic), which has been selling below expectations."

If that doesn't sound like we've seen the end of 480p projectors being released (from anybody), I don't know what does.

krasmuzik

10-11-06, 02:07 PM

Infocus devalued the IN72 by selling SP4805 refurbs themselves on ebay. While it was tweaked in many ways compared to the SP4805 and a better buy at MSRP - it cannot compete with essentially the same picture at closeout refurb prices. That is the problem with a commodity market - buyers expect new models to have the same price as last years closeout refurb prices. Why buy this years TV at 2x the price - that is 10% better than last years TV the store wants to move out?

Unlike the days of SP4800 vs. SP4805 - which had a clear value improvement - the market has changed. But the IN72 would have to have something revolutionary like a LED lamp for that clear value improvement.

Of course there are those that bought the IN72 simply because it was bit brighter/contraster in a shiny new case - but those in the know knew they did not give up much in the picture dept to buy a refurb SP4805 - and the mechanical QA improvements are not something you notice is missing when you only have a 90d warranty for a much cheaper price!

spyder696969

10-11-06, 02:17 PM

Not to mention that if you own a 4805, you're essentially guaranteed a known fix for anything under the sun. Even though the IN72 isn't that different overall, there are still many small differences that may not have been addressed yet. Hell, we even have a known fix (with images for viewing) for the 4805 light tunnel now, which was always my biggest fear. :)

krasmuzik

10-11-06, 02:19 PM

I see - the difference between tweakers needing to tweak - and selling a tweaked package. Much like any idiot selling a Bravo for $199 I guess there is no market!

spyder696969

10-11-06, 02:25 PM

If that doesn't sound like we've seen the end of 480p projectors being released (from anybody), I don't know what does.

I think the 480s will still be made for a while, if only by the guys at LumenLabs and maybe a few others. However, if those are to be successful in any way, they will certainly have to break the $300 barrier with their low specs. The draw for those is as a cheap second PJ for the kid's room with $30 bulbs. If you can get your children a PJ that costs less than a bulb and keeps your hours down on your primary unit, it's probably worth it. :)

smithfarmer

10-11-06, 09:35 PM

Here is my vote for a buyer....with HQ not twenty minutes away!

http://www.planar.com/hometheater/

Kras,

Doesn't this company already have a strong business relationship with Infocus? A few of their pj's look pretty similar to the IN series (rebadged?) and I could swear I remember reading a while back about Infocus having something to do with the Xscreens.

billymac

10-11-06, 10:32 PM

spyder696969

10-11-06, 11:30 PM

spydy is there a fix for the light tunnel now? what does it require? does it require a spare/parts 4805 unit?

No spare unit required, unless yours is truly toast. Required items are patience, a bit of common sense, time, a few household tools, glue. That's it.

http://www.willswebdesign.com/sp4805/sp4805.htm

krasmuzik

10-12-06, 12:21 AM

Kras,

Doesn't this company already have a strong business relationship with Infocus? A few of their pj's look pretty similar to the IN series (rebadged?) and I could swear I remember reading a while back about Infocus having something to do with the Xscreens.

I will say the Planar rep fullfilled that same role back in the early ScreenPlay days...and they no doubt hired many recent Infocus layoffs. They just grinned when I remarked on the fact that the local designers tend to redo what they know (imaging is hot in this area). I think it was rumoured that Infocus would pick up the XScreen - but that rumour obviously followed along with recent Infocus->Planar hires.

But there is a lot of in-breeding in the local image centric companies that all fell out of TexTronix - but I think you are thinking of PixelWorks which was founded by ex-Infocus last decade.

I remember hearing about Planar when I worked at a military display contractor in the late 80's. Not sure if we ever used their EL screens then or not. They go back to 83 according to this.

http://www.planar.com/company/leadership/index.html

I only came back to this area in 2000 after growing up here - so maybe someone more with local work history knows details. Even when I had a real job - I worked out of the home office - so I am not up on office politics!

krasmuzik

10-12-06, 12:28 AM

No spare unit required, unless yours is truly toast. Required items are patience, a bit of common sense, time, a few household tools, glue. That's it.

http://www.willswebdesign.com/sp4805/sp4805.htm

Amazing - no wonder Space Station Freedom is still hanging in there despite no Space Shuttle for years - Russians can keep anything going given a few spare parts!

spyder696969

10-12-06, 12:27 PM

Amazing - no wonder Space Station Freedom is still hanging in there despite no Space Shuttle for years - Russians can keep anything going given a few spare parts!

I thought that myself, kras. Armageddon came to mind..."American, Russian, parts all made in Taiwan!" :D

smithfarmer

10-12-06, 10:35 PM

But there is a lot of in-breeding in the local image centric companies that all fell out of TexTronix

http://www.planar.com/company/leadership/index.html

Wow! You weren't kidding. Talk about cross pollination. They've got quite a few ex Infocus people in the fold. I definitely can see why you would like them to be the buyer. The questions raised are do they have the financial muscle and the desire to pull something like this off? I guess time will tell.

They just grinned when I remarked on the fact that the local designers tend to redo what they know (imaging is hot in this area).
Was this comment in reference to the fact that their pj's look eeriely similar to the IN series? Are these in fact rebadged Infocus pj's?

http://www.planar.com/hometheater/pd7060/

If not, do you have any opinions on the quality of their pj's? I've never read any posts about them.

krasmuzik

10-12-06, 11:27 PM

I don't think they are rebadges - the lens is always the dead giveaway on a rebadge - and this is different place and different lens. I just think it was ex-Infocus designers that liked the look and tweaked it more.

They are new on the market - at CEDIA looking for dealers.

I bet you would like their XScreen as a SilverStar fan. They glass front them though - so doubt they go up to your size! More meant as the fireplace plasma look.

evilution

10-13-06, 07:48 AM

Call up the support number that is quicker than using their tech support email. It took a week using the tech support email to get an RMA number.

I sent my projector in and they received it on 10/04. I have not received notice that it has been fixed yet. Over 2 weeks without a projector for my HT room has sucked. I'll be "upgrading" as soon as there is a 1080p DLP with enough light to use it on my 136" 2.35x1 screen (and costs less than 5k :) ).

Received the projector back from infocus today. Boy i missed the big screen (other TV is a 28"!)

They gave no indication as to what the problem was.

Only complaint is the time it took... Reported the issue on 9/25 and didnt receive my projector back until 10/12 (and i took every step i could take as soon as i could take it ie: shipped the morning i received the RMA).

MASidoc

10-13-06, 09:04 AM

Martin Butler

10-13-06, 09:46 AM

They usually take around two weeks for repairs.

Wazzey

10-14-06, 10:27 AM

I've had the in72 for about a month now and use it through my comp using the m1da to dvi cable. I run a 6200 nvidia card and have the latest video drivers for the comp. My minor problem is that I can't the the 854x480 resolution to work. I really don't want to go with powerstrip and I know you can set the resolutions in the nvidia control panel but when I try and add that resolution in the control panel it just says the custom resolution isn't valid. Just wanted to try the native resolution on the screen.

Any ideas?

microbiologist

10-15-06, 10:32 PM

I have been out of the loop for a few months and noticed recently the introduction of the IF IN 78 PJ. Can anyone comment on performance and pic quality? Also, does IF have any plans for other new models such as new 3 chippers?

Regards.

Jeff in Palmetto, FL

Dan Hitchman

10-16-06, 11:00 PM

Damn, Damn, Damn! I seem to have a dust blob that just showed up last night somewhere in the optical path and not on the lens of my new IN72. Is there any way to safely blow it out? Or am I screwed and have to send it back to Infocus?

I thought this thing was sealed.

Dan

Martin Butler

10-16-06, 11:19 PM

Hi Dan, never heard of "filtered" 1080i, what's that?

cosgrovea

10-17-06, 12:50 AM

It tood about 10 or 11 days from when my projector went bad, to when I recieved it back from infocus. I still have not found out what was worng with it. I emailed them asking for an explanation, but never got an answer.

Dan Hitchman

10-17-06, 01:30 AM

Filtered as in pre-filtered to reduce interlace artifacts. A practice by which picture detail is lost during said filtering. A 20-30% hit that you can't get back. DVD's, for instance, are 480i and are usually filtered somewhere in the chain. This can happen to any interlaced video feed.

Anyone have suggestions about a dust blob that's on the inside of the unit? Does it have to go back to Infocus?

It's quite noticeable on the lower right hand corner of the picture.

Martin Butler

10-17-06, 09:48 AM

It's difficult to find out what InFocus does to your projector. I've had mine sent in a few times and only once was I able to find out what happened. It would be nice if they included a simple service report when they send it back. Aftre all, it's our right to know what's been done to our property, isn't it?

swithey

10-17-06, 03:08 PM

Anyone have suggestions about a dust blob that's on the inside of the unit? Does it have to go back to Infocus?

It's quite noticeable on the lower right hand corner of the picture.
I had one show up on my IN76 just after I opened it up. I called Infocus and they quickly said they would swap it out. There is no fix since the optics are sealed -- how it got in there I will never know. And I cannot remember if it was there from the beginning or appeared later.

Since I had only had it a week, my supplier swapped me out for a new unit and they handled the warranty replacement with Infocus. The new unit has been in production for about 2 weeks and is working great.

tradewinds

10-17-06, 04:57 PM

dust blob in sealed optics. That gets me really nervous.

swithey

10-17-06, 05:11 PM

dust blob in sealed optics. That gets me really nervous.
Yea -- the Infocus guy seemed a bit surprised himself. Maybe their "clean room" isn't that clean :rolleyes:

tradewinds

10-17-06, 06:34 PM

Must be the last production batch before the "For Sale" sign went up and they were partying to the music in the fabrication plant or whereever these parts are made/assembled.

Clams Canino

10-17-06, 07:28 PM

hightechredneck

10-17-06, 07:34 PM

So, 17 days total? Hmm, maybe I should stop checking my status at infocus/status every 20 minutes....

My timeline so far: Reported problem Sunday 10/8 @ 4PM, RMA Monday 10/9 @ 6PM, Shipped proj Tues 10/10 @ 10AM, Proj at Infocus Wed 10/11 @ 8AM (in retrospect, probably shouldn't have spent $ for overnight shipping), email update from Infocus Wed 10/11 11AM, Status updated to 'in repair' Thurs 10/12 @ 11AM.....but if my timeline follows yours, I won't get it back until the 25th, give or take. *sigh*

I do plan to try to follow up with tech support by email or phone to try to figure out what the problem was/is. Anything I can do to prevent this from happening AGAIN, I'll do....plus I'll report in to try to save others from this problem.

MASidoc,
My fuse blew on 9.15.06, I emailed them on 9.17 for an RMA and didn't get a response for four days (In spite of being promised a response in two business days). The e mail resonse indicated I would get another e mail within two days containing return instructions and an RMA. On 9.20 ( before the first email response) I found info on another forum indicating that there was a fuse problem and IF was aware of it. A one amp fuse had been soldered to a PCB (What good is a fuse that can't be easily replaced) and IF was now replacing that fuse with a 2 amp model. Being the impatient bugger that I am (and someone who has worked in the electronics business for 20 years) I opened my unit, voided my warranty (What good is a warranty with no customer suppport was my thinking at the time), found the blown fuse and installed a two amp work around. Put it back together and everything works fine. After I informed IF about what I did and their shoddy support in an email response, they did send me the cable assembly (gratis) necessary to upgrade the firmware. I think the IN76 is a great value provided that it works, but IF should have had a recall or priority exchange for this fuse issue. Considering the current status of IF with regards to profit/loss and sale of the company, I should be grateful I got any response at all. Always remember, when you buy a product you're also buying customer service and support, too. Some bargains aren't what they seem. I still think the IN76 is a good product but I can't say the same about tech support. I hope you get your unit back soon.

Cheers,
Hightechredneck

billymac

10-18-06, 10:23 AM

i know this might seem like a lot to ask, but can you somehow document how you did it? that would be most helpful. especially to those who may run into this issue down the road post warranty.

MASidoc

10-18-06, 11:08 AM

Thanks for your response, h-t-r. Here's my timeline for others who may also encounter this problem:

Sunday, 10/8, 3PM sudden death
Sunday, 10/8, 3:05PM email/web response to Infocus for Warranty Service
Monday, 10/9, 5:30PM received RMA from Infocus via email
Tuesday, 10/10, 10AM UPS proj to InFocus
Wed, 10/11, 8:30AM InFocus receives proj
Wed, 10/11, 11:30AM email from InFocus advising receipt of proj
Thurs, 10/12, 11:00AM status updated to "in repair"
Tues, 10/16, 11:30AM email from InFocus with shipping/tracking for return
Thurs, 10/18 proj should arrive at my office
10 days total time incl weekends.

Can't say I'm pleased that the problem happened in the first place--especially if it's a "known issue" it seems that I should have had the opportunity to get this resolved before I got addicted to it. (or, at least, not during football season) ;)
I would describe the service I got from Infocus as "adequate to good." I'm just going to assume it was the fuse problem at this juncture. Do you have any recommendations on preventing recurrance? --or is that just highly unlikely with the new fuse?

[QUOTE=hightechredneck]MASidoc,
My fuse blew on 9.15.06, I emailed them on 9.17 for an RMA and didn't get a response for four days (In spite of being promised a response in two business days). The e mail resonse indicated I would get another e mail within two days containing return instructions and an RMA. On 9.20 ( before the first email response) I found info on another forum indicating that there was a fuse problem and IF was aware of it. A one amp fuse had been soldered to a PCB (What good is a fuse that can't be easily replaced) and IF was now replacing that fuse with a
(clipped)

hightechredneck

10-18-06, 06:51 PM

i know this might seem like a lot to ask, but can you somehow document how you did it? that would be most helpful. especially to those who may run into this issue down the road post warranty.

billymac,

The fuse runs between F501 and F508 on the PCB. I used 2 - 15" runs of 24 AWG solid copper (1 pair of cat 5e !) and a 2 amp GMA fast blow fuse. Solder the leads to the fuse and insulate electrically (Tape or heat shrink), check continuity through the fuse after soldering. Remove the PCB with the blown fuse from the projector, turn it over and solder the leads to the underside of the PCB at sockets for F501 and F508. Re-install the PCB, reassemble the projector and route the fuse/leads up into the area accessable for bulb replacement. (That way if the fuse blows you can replace it without another disassembly) The old blown fuse stays right where it is. If you aren't handy with a soldering pencil, disassembling consumer electronics, safety practices with regard to handling integrated circuits (CMOS safety and static discharge) or comfortable tracing paths on a PCB you should not even attempt this. Remember, I rolled the dice with regard to warranty, knowing what the stakes were/are. Once you open the case you have no warranty, and may do more damage trying to fix the original problem. That said, I've done this sort of thing before and was suffering from HD withdrawal on 20" SD CRT's, so my judgement was seriously clouded.

Cheers,
Hightechredneck

runner

10-22-06, 12:31 AM

My IN72 just went up...Only 75 hours on it. It won't power on at all. Was watching it and it just went out. Anyone else have this same problem. Not to happy seeing it has only had limited use. No lights will come on at all

V.X.Donique

10-22-06, 08:29 AM

oh chit! you have gots to be kidding me right!?

we might have a slight fuse issue with the IN7xx line now?

krasmuzik

10-22-06, 04:23 PM

If you have a warranty and it fails send it in for service - there is a fix - and it only gets hit with certain regional power systems. No problems here.

There is no reason to be fixing your projectors yourself when you have a warranty - if you need your big screen fix while it is in service - go trial a chain stores projector with a return guarantee - I guarantee you will want to return it when you get your projector back.

spyder696969

10-22-06, 05:56 PM

/\ Like, maybe, the HD70? ;)

MASidoc

10-22-06, 06:51 PM

Well, my IN76 went up AGAIN less than a day after I received it back from service. Bad solder job, maybe? I've got it connected through Monster Power 3500--both times it failed on power up. Any chance the power surge could be related to the HDMI cable? To HDMI-only setting? I doubt it. I'll be calling for a new one tomorrow.

(very sad)
It is a good projector. When it works. One more chance....
My wife says, "you should just get a TV...." *sigh*

krasmuzik

10-22-06, 07:51 PM

billymac

10-22-06, 10:07 PM

/\ Like, maybe, the HD70? ;)

lol! too funny.

MASidoc

10-23-06, 11:29 AM

Check the plug you have that on your Monster - you maybe have it on a filtered output that is causing an in-rush of current on boot. Use the unfiltered ports - you only need surge supression for a projector. Call them and ask if you should have a projector with a lamp and fan and motor plugged into specific ports.

Thanks, Kras, I'll check. Heck, I don't have anything else to do for the next two weeks. (they're paying shipping back, but they wouldn't hear of an exchange at this juncture. Plus, they want $99 for exchange to another remanufactured unit even if it does fail a third time. Perhaps I'll contact my seller if it happens again.)

I have had it connected to the "TV/Monitor" outlet, which isn't a 'switched' or 'delayed' outlet like the amp or preamp ones. I don't unplug the Monster, so, in effect, the projector outlet is 'always on.' But still, I don't know the level of filtering involved, so I'll check.

Both times it happened, I switched the projector on manually. Static? Perhaps I'll try using the remote more often. Both events happened since the projector was connected to YamahaRXV-2700 receiver via HDMI. However, it seems unlikely that the HDMI has anything to do with it. Can't be surge from the receiver because I turned on the projector first, it failed, and I never touched the receiver. They told me on the phone that they replaced the entire power supply, including the board with the questionable fuse, during the last RMA repair. We'll see what happens this time....

~Mark

alfa

10-24-06, 09:19 AM

i dont know if you guys have this in the US. But here in Asia Far East we have a servo type auto voltage regulator. The idea is the voltage is locked at the output level be it 220V or 110V. When the power surge comes in, especially in areas near factories the power can surge from 110V to higher volts the AVR locks in the voltage. You can actually here the small motor/servo adjusting the wiper to compensate for voltage loss/ drop.
I've hooked up my AV/system and other sensitive electronics to this AVR and they havent failed yet.

lynzoid

10-24-06, 08:11 PM

Hello, i am that Russian who can fix 4805 without parts. =)

Ok, i got IN72 today, and it have 3 BIG bugs:
1. Sharpness on middle position is too soft, but on sharper it jokingly oversharped, not speaking about highest setting. CORRECT IT PLS !!!!!
2. Screen door is just unbearable, dear Infocus.
3. When keystoning even a little bit, menu font gets fecked up. I wonder if picture does too.

Overall, DNX is like 10 times worse than Faroudja.
I really pity i sold 4805........
INFOCUS ! CORRECT IT !!!!
Oh, and color temp is too bluey, also pj doesnt remember settings for different kinds of signal format (eg 576i and 720p both on component)...

FLOP.......

krasmuzik

10-24-06, 08:40 PM

1. sharpness is just about right on default. You are correct that they do not have finer addition of edge enhancement - but the default is not wrong in not having any edge enhancement.

2. It is called sharper optics....

3. Yes - don't use keystoning.

4. All of the IN7x has had a firmware update correcting blue dithering on dark greys on component. But most reviews said it was too red - because Infocus is accounting for initial lamp burn-in red fade.

5. nobody has reported mechanical QA problems (light tubes, fans, filters, colorwheel etc.)on the IN7x yet - so I don't think you will need any fixit skills :D

6. Yep you have to consume a calibration memory for SD vs. HD on the same input - it forgets.

lynzoid

10-24-06, 09:04 PM

1. yea, but next to middle is overly sharp, i hope Bob can make it more mild. Thanx =)

2. have to turn down brigtness alot to get rid of it. np.

3. have to - only 45. on 4805 i used 44 and was happy for a year...

4. i dunno i have 2.7 firmware, 3 hrs on lamp and bright places are bluish and now that u say it's a bit reddish sometimes too..

5. hope so =))) but always ready =)))

6. bad thing is it doesn't store advanced options in preset mem =( Hmmm, Bob ? =) same system as in 4805 pls =) thanx

Cheers
PS. where i can find older f/w's for in72 ? i have cable and thought give some experiments ? Is it worth it ?

krasmuzik

10-25-06, 02:22 AM

preset memories are for everything in the picture menu - no problem with advanced menus. Otherwise I would never be able to save greyscale changes... The preset menus are global and not per input though if same as SP4805 (manual is misleading - you can save any of the inputs to any preset - and it will overwrite any other input saved in that preset)

If brights are too blue then you have white peaking cranked up? Check out my calibration review on my website for what it does to brights.

lynzoid

10-25-06, 11:47 AM

Well, i used DVE PAL to calibrate my satellite box input. I get a decent dynamic range at Video gamma with 42brightess and 44contrast.
But when it comes to color calibration with filters, blue seem ok, red too is not very far off, but green is way off... I know it's possibly a compromise...
Still, that not very good sharpness adj. steps is a concern for upcoming (hopefully) f/w.

Also, i cannot get picture as good as 4805 while inputting 720p via component (x360). It waaay soft at Standart sharpness and overly sharp at next step......
Lamp (6hrs now) is flickering at lowpower still a bit (not on high).
Also tryed HDMI input in native 480p - that's where i got best picture yet. Very good 'cinematic' picture.

Any help on adjusting 720p will be appreciated... I really miss 4805 at gaming at 720p now.... I always used next step to Standart sharpness on 4805 and was happy. Faroudja gave very good looking edges and almost no 'data, which is not signal but a extralow/extrahigh information' (accordind to DVE). Please =) Pretty please ! =)

Thanx

Martin Butler

10-25-06, 01:02 PM

lynzoid, run your pj for a couple of hours in high mode, it should fix the flickering in low mode. Something to do with the lamp arc..

lynzoid

10-25-06, 01:46 PM

Just tryed to adjust b/w balance on 720p xbox360.
Got pretty decent at 44contrast/42br. BUT screen door is just annoying at that setting =( And sharpness issue still makes picture not as good as it could be. Also 2 steps below Standart are just equal - Infocus ! Bug !
And what the hell is Film mode ? IN72. Dont tell me it have white sector ???

kevivoe

10-25-06, 01:53 PM

I have an IN76 with over 800 hours on it. I noticed when my impatient daughter turns ON the PJ and then hits the power button again (since the screen doesn't go blue) the IN76 stays in a lock off state. You have to unplug the device, wait 30 seconds and then re-apply AC power.

When powering ON you must push the power button only once then wait 20-30 seconds for the beast to fire up. If you hit the power button too many times you get into a lock out mode.

It has happened more than once but now that I have explained the power on sequence to all in the household all is well.

Still a fantastic PJ by the way. I'll have to see if there is new firmware. I upgraded once already and am satisfied with the performance. Got it (IN76) the 1st week they were out.

K

MASidoc

10-25-06, 02:44 PM

Martin Butler

10-25-06, 02:47 PM

"And what the hell is Film mode ? IN72. Dont tell me it have white sector ???"

Lynzoid, chill out a bit dude, On my Infocus 4805 Film mode is simply a different gamma setting and I believe the more accurate of the choices given. I'm sure it's the same for your pj. At first I liked the "CRT" setting but realized it was a falsely dark picture after a few weeks. It might be good for new, overly bright pj's, but the Film mode is the calibration for watching movies made on film.

krasmuzik

10-25-06, 03:11 PM

Thanks, Kev, but that wasn't it with mine...either time.
I certainly tried re-plugging in at later times and in different locations over the weekend(s) before I got my RMA(s).

BTW, continuing from above, all the outlets on my Monster Power 3500 MkII have some type of "filtering" it seems. Should I just plug it into the wall next time? Use a cheap surge protector?

I certainly would do that rather than shooting for three strikes and you are out.

With HDMI there is no benefit with filtering - the panel is digital so is the port. Only with component do you need to worry about powerline filtering.

hconwell

10-25-06, 04:54 PM

I certainly would do that rather than shooting for three strikes and you are out.

With HDMI there is no benefit with filtering - the panel is digital so is the port. Only with component do you need to worry about powerline filtering.Hey Kras -

My IN76 shipped today. I'm looking forward to getting into it.

But since we're all talking about power, let me ask this. Is it a good idea to use an APC SmartUPS 700 with these projectors. It is a switching UPS ... supposed to be real fast. But the current it produces is also supposed to be very good. I'm not up on the specs of UPS's ... but this unit does not produce a "square" wave. Rather, it produces a sine wave. I ran my 4805 on it with no apparant problems. Although my light tube did fail, I seriously doubt that had anything to do with my using a UPS.

So before I go ahead a do something with my new IN76 that I shouldn't do, I thought I'd ask.

lynzoid

10-25-06, 06:40 PM

krasmuzik

10-25-06, 08:55 PM

Hey Kras -

My IN76 shipped today. I'm looking forward to getting into it.

But since we're all talking about power, let me ask this. Is it a good idea to use an APC SmartUPS 700 with these projectors. It is a switching UPS ... supposed to be real fast. But the current it produces is also supposed to be very good. I'm not up on the specs of UPS's ... but this unit does not produce a "square" wave. Rather, it produces a sine wave. I ran my 4805 on it with no apparant problems. Although my light tube did fail, I seriously doubt that had anything to do with my using a UPS.

So before I go ahead a do something with my new IN76 that I shouldn't do, I thought I'd ask.

I would ask your UPS vendor - if they are not familiar with your projector - then ask them if a motor load (colorwheel, fan) and lamp load is a good thing to have on their UPS. Some are - some are not. Obviously a good thing to have if the power hit happens. Ask them if their insurance policy covers the projector connected the way you have it to further back up their technical answer.

jjsaustin

10-26-06, 12:51 PM

I read the IN72 review on another website and it gave this projector a good review and said it was better than the outgoing 4805. They said that for DVD and SDTV the picture was better, however, for HD signals it was not as good as the 4805.

Can someone explain why? Has anyone seen both setups?

I watch a lot of HDTV and just got a Bravo D1. Would it be better to buy an used 4805 with low hours (~100) or a new IN72?

Thanks

krasmuzik

10-26-06, 01:37 PM

It is the other way around - 1080i on SP4805 used the Faroudja which does simple scaling reducing vertical resolution by half. The PW on IN7x does 1080i properly bobbing and weaving.

Of course one might think on a 480P you would never notice - but color resolution is half B&W resolution so you can notice.

Your wallet is your wallet - nobody elses.

But HD is in the IN7x favor. You don't use BravoD1 for HD - you pixel map to SD with it.

billymac

10-26-06, 01:53 PM

the in72 rocks. i love mine.

yubakram

10-26-06, 02:06 PM

I watch a lot of HDTV and just got a Bravo D1. Would it be better to buy an used 4805 with low hours (~100) or a new IN72?

Thanks

I have had both and I feel the IN72 is a better machine. HDTV looks stellar at 15'. My neighbor states he likes the color punch and blacks on the IN72 more than the Panasonic AE900 he has set up, and I tend to agree.

jjsaustin

10-26-06, 02:08 PM

Kras,

Having never seen the IN72, all I have to go on feedback from experts such as yourself and reviews. A couple quotes from a review a p********central, seemed to indicate that HD material does not look any better than reguldl SD material. The 4805 does a great job with HD material, and below they down play the ability of the IN72 to handle HD material.

As for the Bravo D1, I was planning on using it in the 1:1 pixel mapping mode. I imagine all the rave reviews of the 4805-D1 via DVI matchup would apply with the IN72 as well?

"Scaling of high definition material was clean, however it looks almost exactly like standard definition on this projector. On other 480p projectors, 1080i and 720p sources look quite a bit better than native 480-line material, due to increased information in the signal. On the IN72, it merely looks as good, but not better than standard definition content."

"...[IN72] is a major step beyond the SP-4805 and it does not disappoint. It produces a beautiful, bright picture with well saturated color, suitable for DVD movies, video games, and other 480-line content. While its performance with High-Definition content isn't as impressive as other 480p units, it is also brighter than those other models."
THanks

krasmuzik

10-26-06, 02:23 PM

PJC has been discredited as a credible review source many times. Who knows what they are going on about - since technically it will be the other way around - the PW is sharper at 1080i than Faroudja - it is the main reason they made the move. Also Faroudja disguises CUE bug by downsampling chroma even further - so even 480P looked better. Faroudja is better at 480i and will pass more deinterlacing tests - so it is a tradeoff for better HD.

I have the Accupel reference HD generator - the same one Infocus uses to design their products with. I have never heard that PJC even knows what one of those boxes are for....

I think the only gotcha on the Bravo is the SP4805 did both 72Hz and 48Hz - the IN72 only did 48Hz - took a bit to figure it out - no real diff in the end.

Even reviewers in high-end magazines have bouts of incompetence - recently one used the Toshiba HDVD player set for 720P for pixel match - even though it was well known on AVS that it downscaled HD to 480P to upscale to 720P - newest firmware does it right (1080i->720P) They had to publish a retraction and update the PJ review because of it. I doubt PJC has ever published a technical retraction for any of their reviews.

Shiny new with warranty and 10% better image in a much better case vs. used without warranty but a million view SP4805 thread for support if anything goes wrong. That is what you should be considering. Do you want to fix it or let Infocus fix it?

spyder696969

10-26-06, 04:40 PM

PJC is pretty much good for getting a general feel for whether or not a specific PJ might be for you or not, mostly by viewing specs, throw angles, overall statements, etc. For technical info, you always want to come to AVS, as opposed to any review site, since you'll be talking to actual owners, rather than reading one person's impression under a quickie review. Even the "user ratings" can be deceiving, since many will post the first week they own a unit, giddy with their purchase and perhaps not as completely objective as they might be later on. That said, if there are hundreds of positives, it's probably safe to say it's a good unit...under 50, maybe not such a safe bet.

lynzoid

10-26-06, 07:15 PM

Fact: i cannot get picture as good inputting 720p/1080i from xbox360 as i had on 4805. Otherwise its quiet, mean looking and have blue in dark spots =)
I took my 4805 back for a while =)

James A. McGahee

10-26-06, 10:25 PM

...consume a calibration memory for SD vs. HD on the same input - it forgets.

What exactly does "consume a calibration memory" mean and does it apply to the IN76 (which is still at top of my projector purchase list)?

Thanks...

Fadam

10-27-06, 01:49 PM

Got my IN76 yesterday after 2 months of out-of-stock with one vendor and ended up going with a different vendor. I fire it up and it looks beautiful, except for the large dust blob in the upper left quadrant. :( There were two more blobs off the left edge of the screen, and by looking into the lens (not directly at the illuminated area) I could see the actual particles glowing like stars, trapped forever on one of the interior lens surfaces.
I must have some bad pj karma, so I'll send it back and be denied my glorious home theater experience for another week. The vendor says they should be able to clean it, but with the talk of Infocus' sealed optics for this line, I'm not sure I want them digging in there.
But dust blob aside, I know that this pj is a winner and can't wait to watch an actual movie with it! Wish me luck.

arango1

10-27-06, 02:41 PM

Hey guys,
I need advice.
I have of 21 in individual $50.00 gift cards from Crutchfield ($1050.00) I want to get either the Sony HS60 or the IN76 from them. I also will get a 100" to 110" Carada BW.

I am leaning toward the IN76 because I think it will support a larger screen and it will be better for football/ambient light. But the dust blob thing I keep reading about really bothers me. Both get great reviews though and I am sure I would be happy with both.

Do you think the Carada BW will look good with the IN76 at 110" (at 12' and 19' distances)? Should I worry about dust blobs? Is the Sony less prone to issues?

Thanks!
Vic

krasmuzik

10-27-06, 05:53 PM

I think there have been two posts about it - with most people expressing surprise - including the support guy at Infocus - who is in a position to know what he is seeing for failures coming back.

If you make your purchase decision based on reading one bad thing or another - then you will never buy anything. That is why people buy projectors with warranties - someone will always get an oops that needs fixed. The reason you pay more at the mail-order catalog company is you are paying for service to make sure you are happy with your purchase.

Nobody posts every day saying their projector is great nothing happened - so take that into account when you read the forums.

BrandonJF

10-27-06, 06:59 PM

I think there have been two posts about it - with most people expressing surprise - including the support guy at Infocus - who is in a position to know what he is seeing for failures coming back.

I'm on my 3rd IN76 in 6-7 months. I've had a dust blob and a power supply board failure. While I think it is a great projector when working, I can't say I'm overly thrilled with those issues in such a short time span. And I've seen a few posts mentioning the power issue...

I wouldn't necessarily dissuade anyone from an IN76, but an extended warranty might need to be factored into the cost of the PJ.

Thinker

10-28-06, 06:12 PM

The fuse runs between F501 and F508 on the PCB.

Is this on the 76? My fuse runs between FH601 and FH602. I wonder if I have a newer version of the power supply or whether all 76's use the FH version power supply PCB?

Trying to find a way to replace it now....stupid design. The fuse should be externally accessible and it would save InFocus tons of bad press.

OK, so this ceramic T5AH205V fuse tests out fine. Ah, there it is! On the secondary board between F501 and F508 just as you said. Yes, I think I will do exactly as you did. I will be replcing these fuses quite often by the sound of it...

So, while everyone was elated that the PJ broke the $2000 barrier, now we know why. Liquidation of a product line with too many defects :)

Thinker

10-28-06, 09:17 PM

SUCCESS!!!!! Thank you hightechredneck

I should have some pictures soon. So, with all the "I've returned four projectors so far," I figured I would keep blowing fuses so I went for the hightechredneck modification. I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND THIS FOR ANYONE WITHIN WARRANTY, but as for those of you like me who like the adventure and who know what they are doing....it works great, and it only takes a couple hours.

So, as for parts (all from Radio Shack), I used a 5A fuse holder, the 2A fuses suggested by hightechredneck, some 22 gauge wire and shrink wrap. The only difference is that I soldered the leads right to the top ends of the old fuse and not on the back at the PCB. Now, the fuse holder is accessible behind the bulb change door (with enough slack tucked in to have room to pull it out for the swap). If it blows again (when it blows again) I will have an easy change.

Thanks hightechredneck. Would have never found that fuse without your post. InFocus would be wise to make this a factory mod :)

POST SCRIPT 2007-03-26. Today, for some reason, my PJ keeps blowing the 2A fuses. When I tried to change one yesterday for the first time since this mod, my connector was so brittle it broke and had to redo the mod. Make sure you position this on the air intake (or cooler) side of the PJ behind the door--otherwise yours too will get brittle--gonna try 3A fuses.