NEC new plasma thread!!! - 42xr4, 50xr5, 61xr4 [Text View] - Page 17

ACUMEN

09-19-06, 03:54 PM

CorrysD

09-19-06, 04:02 PM

Try turning on the White screen, one of the Long Life settings, for a half hour. This is how I remove IR from my 50XM4.

bvader

09-19-06, 04:33 PM

Hi,

Hope someone out there has some advice or help they can offer. I recently purchased an NEC 50XR5 from an internet seller, DirectDial out of London, Ontario, Canada. Right out of the box, the centre portion of the screen or "normal" portion was light than the two bars on either side. When you go to wide screen, the sides are darker than the centre. The seller, Directdial, wanted no part of the problem, their supplier, Stampede, wanted nothing to do with it. NEC said it was not possible this would happen right out of the box and refuse to do anything. Basically, I have a very expensive unit that I cannot enjoy the way I expected when I went to a leading name brand.

I would certainly never recommend NEC even though the TV is excellent in its limited functinality. If anything does happen, I know now NEC will do nothing to support their product.

I welcome any advice on how to deal with the suppliers involved or to remedy the problem.

Thanks,

Rob

This set sounds like it was used...and possibly abused... was it advertised as new?
You can check the usage hours, by going into the setup menu using these instructions.
http://www.bruzzi.ws/plasma-faq/showthread.php?t=148

If they sold it to you as new... and it already has many hours registered, you may have grounds for a civil action.

Also did you buy it with a credit card with buyers protection? You should investigate that, and have you credit card company get involved.

With respect to NEC, by most accounts they are helpful, was this a dealer an authorized dealer?

I personally would not turn on the wiper screen, I would first do you investigation and put minimal time on the panel. If you cannot get it adressed, I would watch varied content on a full screen mode to get rid of the IR.

Let us know what you find out.

bwolivedun

09-19-06, 05:48 PM

Back on the topic of image retention...I have 525 hours on my XR5a now (about 1/4 of which is from the plasma break-in VCD), and I'm still seeing significant IR on my 50XR5a :confused:

For instance, when watching a 16:9 HD program and a 4:3 commercial sequence appears for ~3 minutes, by the time the program returns one can clearly see that the middle (4:3) section of the panel is brighter than the sides ... this typically resolves itself after 3-4 minutes, but can go on for a while longer if the scenes in the 16:9 content are not bright!

Similarly, when displaying a 2.35:1 aspect ratio DVD movie for any length of time, upon stopping the movie (or switching to a 16:9 HD program), the top & bottom of the screen are significantly less bright than the center ... this can take upwards of 10+ minutes to resolve! For this reason I've taken to watching said movies in "2.35" mode, which I find annoying.

Too, this unit is already "dialed in" ... that is, brightness & contrast are set to moderate levels (25 and 40, respectively, out of 72), and gamma is at the default of 2.2.

Are other folks seeing similar symptoms with your NEC panels? I had thought that the display would be much less sensitive to IR after several hundred hours, but I can't really see any significant improvement over when it was new.

I have had the 50xr5 since about March and I have the exact same issue. I don't worry about it since it always goes away eventally, but I had expected that this would not be the situation at tis point. It is very noticable for those few minutes. I have not considered trading in the set cause everything else is so good.

booyaa

09-20-06, 10:45 PM

I am in no way an expert like some of the people on here, but I know home theater enough to build a pretty bomb system..

What I can say about this set as far as the IR goes, is yes, IR is apparent.

I just left HBO on Inside the NFL for an hour, left, and came back. When turning the channel, the side bars could clearly be seen on the sides as well as an on screen graphic.

I turned the channel to Discovery HD, and in probably 10 to 15 minutes it was gone.

I am not sure how I feel about this yet. I know I would be more pissed if I wasnt prepared for IR as far as plasmas go before buying this monitor.

The jury is still out on my personal preference - I am just stating a fact as far as my set goes

BGA

09-21-06, 04:04 PM

I have just around 100 hrs on my set and obviously I get IR when black bars or logos are displayed. I read every post in this thread and knew what I was getting. Incredible picture with some IR. As I brush my teeth and get ready for bed I turn it to a full screen picture and might turn on the wiper for fun. Everything clears up and life is good.

If I ever get burn in after a couple hour movie, than I will be pissed, but I don't think it will happen if you take care.

big_marcelo

09-21-06, 07:58 PM

I've done about 500 hours now... IR definitely reduces.... but is still present ..... no burn in either... .and I've watched 4 hour long movies with black bars and all ..... watching normal full screen tv the IR goes away in 30 mins or so ....

fireballz

09-22-06, 04:09 PM

found this link on the new NECs I think ... It doesn't say much, but does mention a 42xr5:

Here (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.frankenfoto.de/kurier/view.php%3Fshownews%3D874&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=9&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3DNEC%2B42xr5%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26sa%3DG)

Basically they are going to show them off in November in Germany... :)

Cleveland Plasma

09-22-06, 06:08 PM

Showcase Series 60XR5 Specifications

Specifications
Model Number 60XR5
Order Code PX-60XR5A
Diagonal Screen Size 60"
Screen Aspect Ratio 16 to 9
Active Screen Area 1319 mm x 742 mm, 51.9 in x 29.2 in
Native Pixel Resolution 1365 x 768
Pixel Pitch 0.97 mm x 0.97 mm
Crystal Clear Panel/Drive Yes
Accucrimson Yes
Enhanced Split Screen Yes
PIP Yes
Front Filter Type AR - Anti reflection
Output color 1024 levels, 1.07 billion colors
Viewing Angle 160 degrees
Horizontal Frequency Range 15.5 to 110.0 kHz auto, step scan
Vertical Frequency Range 50 to120 Hz auto, step scan
PC Signal Compatiblity
VGA 640x480 @ 60,72,75,85,100, 120 Hz
SVGA 800x600 @ 56, 60, 72,75,85,100,120 Hz
XGA 1024x768 @ 60,70,75, 85, 100 Hz
SXGA 1280x1024 @ 60, 75, 85, 100 Hz
UXGA 1600x1200 @ 60, 65, 70, 75, 85 Hz
WideVGA 848x480, 852 x 480 @ 60 Hz
WideXGA 1360 x 765 @60 Hz, 1280 x 768 @ 60Hz
Macintosh Compatibility 640x480, 832x624, 1024x768, 1152x870
Video Signal Compatibility PAL, SECAM, 3.58/4.43 NTSC
HD Video Signal Compatibility 480p 480i, 525p, 525i, 540p, 625p, 625i, 720p,1035i, 1080i
Input/Output Terminals
RGB 1 (analog) 15-pin mini D-sub
RGB 2 (digital) 24-pin DVI-D HDCP (EIA/CEA-861-A) compatible
Video 1 Composite RCA x 1
Video 2 S-Video 4-Pin DIN
HD Video 1 1 set RCA Component (Y,Pb,Pr/Y,Cb,Cr)
HD Video 2 1 set RCA Component (Y,Pb,Pr/Y,Cb,Cr)
HD Video 3 HDMI w/HDCP (ver. 1.1)
HD Video 4 HDMI w/HDCP (ver. 1.1)
Audio 3 sets RCA stereo + external speaker jacks
Audio Internal amplifier, 9W x 2 output power
External Control 9-pin mini D-Sub, RS232
User Controls
Direct Access Power on/off, input selection, volume up/down, OSM access
Remote Control Power on/off, input select, volume, mute, wide, display, off-timer, OSM control, cursor, pointer, zoom, auto, select
OSM Picture - Contrast, brightness, sharpness, color, tint, color temperature, white balance, picture mode, noise reduction, gamma, low tone and color tune
Audio - bass, treble, balance and audio input
Image Adjust - aspect ratio mode, vertical position, horizontal position, vertical height, horizontal width, fine picture, picture adjust, auto picture
Option 1 - OSM on/off, BNC Input, D-sub Input, RGB select, HD select, Input Skip, All Reset
Option 2 - Pwr. Management, Cinema Mode, Long Life Mode
Option 3 - Timer, Pwr. On mode, Control Lock, IR Remote, Loop Out, ID Number, Video Wall
Advanced OSM, Language, Color System, Source Information
Plug & Play DDC1, DDC2B (RGB3 is DDC2B only)
Power Requirements 120V 50/60 Hz
Power Consumption 440W Typical, 7.0 Amp Maximum
Standby Power 0.75W
Dimensions (WxHxD) - without base 1476 x 880 x 126mm, 58.1 x 34.7 x 5.0 inches
Weight 61.5 kg, 135.6 lbs. (without tabletop stand)
Environmental Considerations
Operating Temperature 32 - 104 degrees F (0 - 40 degrees C)
Operating Humidity 20 - 80%
Operating Altitude 0 - 6160 feet (0 - 1880m)
Storage Temperature 14 - 122 degrees F (-10 - 50 degrees C)
Storage Humidity 10 - 90%
Storage Altitude 0 to 9510 feet (0 - 2900m)
Warranty 3 Year Parts & Labor, 1 year PDP Standard
Regulatory FCC Classs A, UL1950, CSA950
Included Accessories AC Power Cord, User Manual, Remote Control, Batteries, Cable Clamps
Optional Accessories
Tabletop Stand PX-ST2U
Attachable Speakers PX-SP4U/S
Attachable Speakers PX-SP4U/B
Wall Mount 61WMK
Ceiling Mount 61CMK

JS-44SDS

09-22-06, 07:35 PM

OK boys-I tried to find what I was looking for but couldn't. What are the dimesions with the speakers on and the nice swivel stand AND what are the dimensions with the nice stand and no speakers? I just cant read 134 pages.

Thanks in advance,
Scott

Cleveland Plasma

09-22-06, 09:48 PM

What size are we talking about?

caribbeansun

09-23-06, 07:22 AM

Everything you need should be here http://www.necvisualsystems.com/Products/Class/?class=00bf5088-38a0-4b56-aa1b-d05ffd2ff324

Look under resources/installation guide for the model you are interested in - it has all the dimensions with various configs.

OK boys-I tried to find what I was looking for but couldn't. What are the dimesions with the speakers on and the nice swivel stand AND what are the dimensions with the nice stand and no speakers? I just cant read 134 pages.

Thanks in advance,
Scott

JS-44SDS

09-23-06, 08:31 AM

booyaa

09-23-06, 03:34 PM

As promised here are pics of my rig.. my camera sux.. but for those of you doing research if this helps.. cool

mjosef

09-23-06, 04:07 PM

As promised here are pics of my rig.. my camera sux.. but for those of you doing research if this helps.. cool

Appreciate the effort...maybe its not the camera, could be the technique.
A couple suggestions. Use a tripod, or even a chair, to seat the camera. Try to minimize the wide constrast of the scene by moving as close to the monitor as possible. You will get better results.
Oh yeah, and turn off the flash.
Nice set up you got there.

booyaa

09-23-06, 04:13 PM

Thanks I will give that a shot..

fyi on the pics that are here.. the armageddon shots are standard definition..

the one from afar is HD

like it would matter with the quality of the pics hahaha

70runner

09-24-06, 03:42 AM

50XR5 1750hr update:

Feeds: DigCable - SA8300HD; OTA HD- Tosh DST3000; Panny RP82 DVD.

Settings: pretty much mirror cpcat's settings on this thread, with some slight tweaking for ambient light and eyeball preference

Pros: HD PQ remains remarkable: HD sports, HBOHD, MAXHD, HDNET, Discovery astounding. SD PQ remains excellent as well. Blacks remain, well, black. Shuttle launch in HD - WOW.

Cons: IR still present, in my opinion neither better nor worse. Black sidebar IR will persist for awhile, usually 3-5min. Stadium solves most of this. Football and other sports tickers common IR triggers.

For those wondering about NEC vs Pio vs Panny vs Fuji. I addressed some of these comparisons much earlier in this thread (about 1700 PD hrs ago...). Prior to purchase, I was only able to find a 2005 model 42in NEC PD at local home theater installer, so unable to do side by side. For the others, my visual research indicated Fuji had the PQ "natural" edge, with Pio a very close second. 50XR5 PQ is in this top echelon. You won't go wrong with any of these plasmas.

booyaa

09-24-06, 09:35 AM

I hate to ask this, but didnt cpcat have 2 sets of settings?

What are your settings?

blackout187

09-24-06, 12:10 PM

I know this is a NEC thread but I just received my Panasonic 42PH9UK from Chris at Cleveland Plasma yesterday and if you are in the market for a new plasma, I would definitely recommend purchasing from Chris. He was very professional throughout the entire process and it was much easier than I had imagined. He gave me great deal(better than any of the other forum sponsors) and it arrived the same day he had promised me. I am in no way tied to ClevelandPlasma but just a very satisfied customer!

JS-44SDS

09-24-06, 03:01 PM

Cleveland Plasma

09-24-06, 05:38 PM

You will notice a little more IR, however keep in mind all panels show IR to some degree. There is no question in my mind which is the better choice above as far as overall proformance, NEC.

LisaM

09-24-06, 07:14 PM

Chris, I gather that NEC did not show their new 50 inch panel at CEDIA. Any idea when we might get a look at one?

JS-44SDS

09-24-06, 07:47 PM

You will notice a little more IR, however keep in mind all panels show IR to some degree. There is no question in my mind which is the better choice above as far as overall proformance, NEC.
Just so I am clear on the terminology....IR is a temporary situation where an image stays on the panel and then fades away....Burn in is a more permanant situation and requires more steps/care to remove. So I should not be concerned with the IR on a NEC panel?

silentbob1974

09-25-06, 12:58 PM

Does anyone have the new Tivo Series 3 and successfully programmed the remote to match up with the 50XR5? I tried all the 4-digit codes listed, but none of them appeared to work.

bri1270

09-25-06, 01:04 PM

maccin

09-26-06, 06:20 AM

maccin

09-26-06, 06:24 AM

I have noticed that there are some that complain of IR with the 50XR5A. Are NEC plasmas more susceptible/prone to IR than a Panasonic 50PX600U or Pioneer 5070HD? Im going to be buying soon and I'd like to get as much info. as possible. Right now my choices would be:

1. NEC 50XR5A
2. Pioneer PDP-5070HD
3. Panasonic TH-50PX600U

Thanks in advance,
Scott

I had two of your three on my final list. If you don't need tuners or speakers, I would suggest you take a look at the Panny 50" 9UK instead of the 600U. The NEC is really, really nice. I ended up going with the Pio only because I did have a need for the tuners and speakers. Pricing at the time was just about even, slight edge to NEC.

BOSS10L

09-26-06, 08:45 AM

Just so I am clear on the terminology....IR is a temporary situation where an image stays on the panel and then fades away....Burn in is a more permanant situation and requires more steps/care to remove. So I should not be concerned with the IR on a NEC panel?

Yes, that is pretty much a textbook definition of IR.

I've had my 50XR5A since April and while there has been IR, it really is no big deal. It is only visible on completely static screens of solid color (ie - all black or all white screen), and the IR goes away within minutes. I've played some Xbox 360 games that are puzzlers (think major static image) for hours 3-4+, and the IR has been minimal and gone away quickly.

If a little IR is going to keep you from purchasing a fine display at a reasonable price, then maybe you should consider a different technology other than plasma.

Steve L

09-26-06, 10:40 AM

If a little IR is going to keep you from purchasing a fine display at a reasonable price, then maybe you should consider a different technology other than plasma.

Agree that a little IR is not the end of the world, but in fairness, it should be pointed out that NEC may now be one of the exceptions regarding plasma IR, rather than the general rule.

I know from personal ownership that certain model Panasonic, Fujitsu and Hitachi plasma display models have been IR-free for a couple of years now.

That being said, the NEC displays are one of the better values out there in terms of PQ vs. price point.

/steve

BOSS10L

09-26-06, 11:57 AM

Agree that a little IR is not the end of the world, but in fairness, it should be pointed out that NEC may now be one of the exceptions regarding plasma IR, rather than the general rule.

I know from personal ownership that certain model Panasonic, Fujitsu and Hitachi plasma display models have been IR-free for a couple of years now.

That being said, the NEC displays are one of the better values out there in terms of PQ vs. price point.

/steve

Steve,

Yes, the NEC seems more prone to IR than some models, but nothing that should be obsessed over. I don't have personal experience with any Panny PDPs, but I have seen a few Hitachi ones in action, and the PQ wasn't on par with the NECs. The Fujitsu displays are beautiful, but someone looking at similarly priced NEC/Panny/Hitachi PDPs probably won't want to spend nearly double the price on a Fujitsu.

And that point is probably the most relevant. Even if I didn't own a NEC, I'd still say that for the money, it is one of, if not the best PDPs on the market.

DigitalOBX

09-26-06, 02:21 PM

Steve,

Yes, the NEC seems more prone to IR than some models, but nothing that should be obsessed over. I don't have personal experience with any Panny PDPs, but I have seen a few Hitachi ones in action, and the PQ wasn't on par with the NECs. The Fujitsu displays are beautiful, but someone looking at similarly priced NEC/Panny/Hitachi PDPs probably won't want to spend nearly double the price on a Fujitsu.

And that point is probably the most relevant. Even if I didn't own a NEC, I'd still say that for the money, it is one of, if not the best PDPs on the market.
Agreed.....I have a 50XR5 and it is slightly worse than my Pio 4350 with regard to IR...but neither model retains any IR after 5 to 10 min. after switching sources...no sweat :)

Steve L

09-26-06, 02:25 PM

[...] The Fujitsu displays are beautiful, but someone looking at similarly priced NEC/Panny/Hitachi PDPs probably won't want to spend nearly double the price on a Fujitsu.

And that point is probably the most relevant. Even if I didn't own a NEC, I'd still say that for the money, it is one of, if not the best PDPs on the market.

Arguably, yes. I don't disagree the NEC's have a beautiful picture for the money with user calibration capability on a par with the Fujitsu AVMII processor for less money!

I currently own a Fujitsu and Panny, however, and calibration capability aside, after careful setup, I see very little difference in PQ between the two... the Fujitsu is only subtly better, IMO, and only if you look at them side by side.

I follow this thread because a friend wants Fujitsu picture quality for Panasonic $$$. I'm hopeful the new NEC models coming out won't suffer as badly from IR, because I've advised him against the current models because of IR. I know it will drive him nuts.

/steve

JS-44SDS

09-26-06, 06:41 PM

I had two of your three on my final list. If you don't need tuners or speakers, I would suggest you take a look at the Panny 50" 9UK instead of the 600U. The NEC is really, really nice. I ended up going with the Pio only because I did have a need for the tuners and speakers. Pricing at the time was just about even, slight edge to NEC.
I have a cable box and I can plug speakers directly into the 50XR5A if I have to (that is what I was told). The prices I was quoted on the NEC and the Pio were a couple of hundred apart (NEC was more)...but I would still have to buy the stand for the NEC.

JS-44SDS

09-26-06, 06:48 PM

Yes, that is pretty much a textbook definition of IR.

I've had my 50XR5A since April and while there has been IR, it really is no big deal. It is only visible on completely static screens of solid color (ie - all black or all white screen), and the IR goes away within minutes. I've played some Xbox 360 games that are puzzlers (think major static image) for hours 3-4+, and the IR has been minimal and gone away quickly.

If a little IR is going to keep you from purchasing a fine display at a reasonable price, then maybe you should consider a different technology other than plasma.
Never said it would keep me from purchasing...just asking a question. Furthermore,if it did bother me enough I would buy a Panny or Pionner which does not exhibit IR as much as the NEC from what I read. NEC is till on top of my list because I read the scaler is awesome (for SD viewing) and its ability to stretch the picture without messing up the proportions are very important to me. Bye the way-how many hours do you have on the panel?

JS-44SDS

09-26-06, 06:52 PM

I'm hopeful the new NEC models coming out won't suffer as badly from IR, because I've advised him against the current models because of IR. I know it will drive him nuts.

/steve
When are the new NEC panels coming out?

Steve L

09-26-06, 07:15 PM

When are the new NEC panels coming out?

I believe I read they'll be out next month, could be mistaken tho. /s

caribbeansun

09-28-06, 07:44 AM

Finally got my new 50XR5 hooked up - all I can say is WOW! What an amazing panel! WAF is off the charts too :)

BOSS10L

09-28-06, 08:09 AM

Finally got my new 50XR5 hooked up - all I can say is WOW! What an amazing panel! WAF is off the charts too :)

Congrats, it really is one helluva display. My wife was pissed too when I first bought it, but now, it's her favorite "accent" in the living room. :D

big_marcelo

09-28-06, 08:48 AM

I've got nearly 600 hours on it now..... IR keeps on getting less noticeable and PQ 1:1 via the VP30 is fantastic!!!

DAB

09-28-06, 12:19 PM

I still get very little IR ( I still haven't figured out how to find the clock) Purchased date 12-27-05. But when i did get IR in the beginiing i just Screen Swiped for 5 min. and i have not had the IR issues, i see here on this thread. ( i do not state the the screen swipe is the answer if just what i did). and yes i too would love to upgrade to the 60"....
db
50XR5

Cleveland Plasma

09-28-06, 01:31 PM

Chris, I gather that NEC did not show their new 50 inch panel at CEDIA. Any idea when we might get a look at one?
NEC did not have a booth but there was a new NEC PX-60XR5A on display.

http://www.clevelandplasma.com/cms_files/Image/Hosting/60XR5A.JPG

I was told sometime in November/December the new models would be out.

Marky_Mark896

09-28-06, 01:38 PM

Thought I'd show you guys a pic of my setup since moving into our house. It's still temporary, but it looks better than my last setup.

http://www.axcessmypics.com/photos/a6/05/fbebaa4a4519.jpg

edited to put in a better pic

Mark

maybe this is too good a pic...now I see fingerprints...wonder who did that???
(I'm betting some 2 year old)

booyaa

09-28-06, 02:42 PM

I hate to ask this again - but what is the 1:1? I know... im a retard

rhoffman

09-28-06, 04:50 PM

bvader

09-28-06, 06:19 PM

I was playing around with my cable box (SA8300HD) and 50xr5 last night and realized that the settings were not as I had originally set them. I'm curious how other people have configured these two together. First off, I've enabled all the outputs on the 8300 (480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i). Then, I tell the cable box that I've got a widescreen TV (I'm using the HDMI connection). This is where I get confused. For HD, I want the format out of the cable box to be 'normal' and I want the NEC on 'anamorphic.' For non-HD (480i) channels, I want the NEC on stadium stretch, but I think the cable box also needs to be set to strech or else the picture doesn't fill the entire screen. My gut tells me that I need to have the cable box always output 16:9 without any stretching, and then I let the TV stretch (my impression is that the TV remembered to be on anamorphic for true HD and stadium for non HD). But for some reason either the TV or the cable box wasn't keeping the different settings between the HD & non-HD channels.

I also wasn't toally sober when I was doing this last night (and then the HDMI handshake issue kept popping up, which was really annoying), so maybe this will all make sense when I get home tonight....but could someone please tell me how they have it set up? Thanks.

These are my setting for SA8300 with Passport FW... work as expected...the SA8300 words/description do not always make sense...
SA8300
Output Format: 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i
Aspect Ratio: Widescreen (16:9), Stretch 4:3 picture
Digital Audio Out : HDMI expect for when watching good Dolby Digital 5.1 (long discussion later), then set to Dolby Digital. Leaving on Dobly Digital will cause many HDMI handshake issues when changing channels etc. Change back to HDMI when done with good 5.1 show/content.

NEC:
when on SD set Wide to Stadium
when on HD set to Anamorphic (or what ever you please) Also keep in mind you can use Stadium on HD channels that are not in 16:9 but remeber to change back when watching 16:9 content.

When you change channels betwee SD and HD the NEC will automatically change between the current wide settings for SD and HD

Unclejeff

09-28-06, 08:55 PM

I see where I can control my 50XM5 from a 15-pin computer connection, but I am curious if I can get the unit to turn of using the 'remote in' plug. I doubt it but I thought I would ask anyway.

tdavis21484

09-28-06, 10:48 PM

When are the new NEC panels coming out?
Someone said that they'd be introduced at CEDIA, but I was there, and NEC wasn't even exhibiting.

I bet they'll be introduced before the end of the year, and it'll probably be out of the blue - NEC is a pretty low-key company.

Cleveland - was that the 60XR5A? Because I saw that display and it looked exactly like the current model. Didn't look to hard though.

Cleveland Plasma

09-29-06, 12:56 AM

^^^^ Yes the pic above is the 60XR5A. NEC was not there but some of there displays were out from there distribution networks. I was told sometime in November/December the new models would be out.

BillW

09-29-06, 08:07 AM

Have they released MSRP's yet?

Cleveland Plasma

09-29-06, 08:40 AM

^^^^No Pricing and no info yet.

rhoffman

09-29-06, 05:06 PM

These are my setting for SA8300 with Passport FW... work as expected...the SA8300 words/description do not always make sense...
SA8300
Output Format: 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i
Aspect Ratio: Widescreen (16:9), Stretch 4:3 picture
Digital Audio Out : HDMI expect for when watching good Dolby Digital 5.1 (long discussion later), then set to Dolby Digital. Leaving on Dobly Digital will cause many HDMI handshake issues when changing channels etc. Change back to HDMI when done with good 5.1 show/content.

NEC:
when on SD set Wide to Stadium
when on HD set to Anamorphic (or what ever you please) Also keep in mind you can use Stadium on HD channels that are not in 16:9 but remeber to change back when watching 16:9 content.

When you change channels betwee SD and HD the NEC will automatically change between the current wide settings for SD and HD

I went back and played with it last night and came up with these settings as well, so thanks for the confirmation. What's strange is that the SA8300 will say that it is in stretch mode on the HD channels, even though it actually isn't in stretch mode. However, if you cycle through the settings...normal, then something else, then back to stretch the strech will actually stretch...where as originally even though it says stretch, it will actually correctly displacy the HD in 'normal.' I was also running into numerous handshake issues when changing channels (primarily when one of those channels involved a 720p broadcast). I don't remember having that issue before, but I also don't know how long my 720p setting had been disabled. I run all of my audio via coax out of the cable box and into my receiver, so I don't think it would be the audio via HDMI causing the handshake issues. I'll have to see if this problem persists.

One thing that bugs me is that the 8300 has to be set to stretch for the 4:3 channels to display correctly. Shouldn't we be able to have the cable box show the normal 4:3 picture, and then have the NEC stadium mode stretch the picture? If you choose 4:3 with grey sidebars, the NEC seems to perceive the grey as part of the picture so it won't stretch correctly. I'll need to play around a little more, but I wonder if I should also be using anamorphic mode on non-HD 4:3 channels. I fear that using stadium, after the cable box is already stretching, is unecessary.

Marky_Mark896

09-29-06, 05:11 PM

One thing that bugs me is that the 8300 has to be set to stretch for the 4:3 channels to display correctly. Shouldn't we be able to have the cable box show the normal 4:3 picture, and then have the NEC stadium mode stretch the picture? If you choose 4:3 with grey sidebars, the NEC seems to perceive the grey as part of the picture so it won't stretch correctly. I'll need to play around a little more, but I wonder if I should also be using anamorphic mode on non-HD 4:3 channels. I fear that using stadium, after the cable box is already stretching, is unecessary.

My NEC stretches the 4:3 from the cable box without it being stretched by the cable box. I have my box displaying 4:3 with side boxes, but I use stadium mode in the NEC to stretch it. I don't have a 8300 anymore, I moved to an area that uses Motorola boxes, but I don't think the output of the boxes should be any different, as far as having information being sent that is outside the 4:3 area of an SD broadcast. I'm not sure exactly what this ramble of mine is telling you though...

Mark

bvader

09-29-06, 06:28 PM

I went back and played with it last night and came up with these settings as well, so thanks for the confirmation. What's strange is that the SA8300 will say that it is in stretch mode on the HD channels, even though it actually isn't in stretch mode. However, if you cycle through the settings...normal, then something else, then back to stretch the strech will actually stretch...where as originally even though it says stretch, it will actually correctly displacy the HD in 'normal.' I was also running into numerous handshake issues when changing channels (primarily when one of those channels involved a 720p broadcast). I don't remember having that issue before, but I also don't know how long my 720p setting had been disabled. I run all of my audio via coax out of the cable box and into my receiver, so I don't think it would be the audio via HDMI causing the handshake issues. I'll have to see if this problem persists.

One thing that bugs me is that the 8300 has to be set to stretch for the 4:3 channels to display correctly. Shouldn't we be able to have the cable box show the normal 4:3 picture, and then have the NEC stadium mode stretch the picture? If you choose 4:3 with grey sidebars, the NEC seems to perceive the grey as part of the picture so it won't stretch correctly. I'll need to play around a little more, but I wonder if I should also be using anamorphic mode on non-HD 4:3 channels. I fear that using stadium, after the cable box is already stretching, is unecessary.

You did not list your FW version, Passport or SARA?

Keep in mind...
Aspect Ratio: Widescreen (16:9), Stretch 4:3 picture
Translated into english...You have a wide screen tv, the STB should send 16:9 as is, also send 4:3 as is, i.e. fill the screen (strech is a misnomer). Its the NEC that understands that it is a 4:3 picture, and thus either provides the side bars in Normal aspect or stretches in Stadium. If you have SA8300HD with Passport FW I assure you these are the correct settings for a SA8300 running Passport connected via HDMI to NEC XR5 with all resolutions passed thru and Digital Audio Out to AVR ...The SA8300 has the other setting to be compliant with other/older monitors/tvs etc. Also, other DVR/STB handle and name these setting different, i.e. SA is different then Motorola...

Also don't confuse stretch with anamorphic, one thing is that you CAN use Stadium with the NEC for HD content... comes in handy when the HD chanell is showing 4:3 content. There is no "Normal" mode when in HD...just Anamorphic, Stadium and 2.35:1 ... of course you can always manually zoom.

With that in mind...I don't quite understand this sentence....
However, if you cycle through the settings...normal, then something else, then back to stretch the strech will actually stretch...where as originally even though it says stretch, it will actually correctly displacy the HD in 'normal.'

With regards to the HDMI handshaking issue... I have a quite a bit of experience with this....
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7763149&&#post7763149
among others...
I also have my audio hooked up via Optical Digital and indeed there is a relation between HDMI handshaking issues and the Optical Digital out and its settings... and you can look this up in the SA8300 thread in the HDTV recorders forum... yes seems odd, but true... I have some theories but they are just that...Exactly what is meant by HDMI on the SA8300 seems to be a mistery to me (I assume it means send the DD audio stream via HDMI), and thus the audio is passed out the Optical out is Dolby PLII. You should experiment with this... I have repeated this expirement many times...

Digital Audio Out : HDMI expect for when watching good Dolby Digital 5.1 (long discussion later), then set to Dolby Digital. Leaving on Dobly Digital will cause many
HDMI handshake issues when changing channels etc. Change back to HDMI when done with good 5.1 show/content.

Try it, see if I am right, also as always I reserve the right to be wrong ... and to learn something new ;)

rhoffman

09-29-06, 06:28 PM

My NEC stretches the 4:3 from the cable box without it being stretched by the cable box. I have my box displaying 4:3 with side boxes, but I use stadium mode in the NEC to stretch it. I don't have a 8300 anymore, I moved to an area that uses Motorola boxes, but I don't think the output of the boxes should be any different, as far as having information being sent that is outside the 4:3 area of an SD broadcast. I'm not sure exactly what this ramble of mine is telling you though...

Mark

I'm more confused on the 4:3 channels. If I put the SA8300 into 16:9 mode, tell it to use grey sidebars for 4:3 material, and put the NEC on 'normal,' the 4:3 image is scrunched (people are too thin in the image). If I leave the NEC on normal, but change the 8300 to stretch, the image looks correct proportionally, but there are other grey bars (possibly put there by the NEC, not the 8300) on the side. The only way for me to get the picture to fill the screen is to leave the 8300 on stretch and then set the NEC to either anamorphic or stadium. Seems like there is some degree of double stretching, but maybe it all makes sense.

I just saw that you posted something above (I haven't read it yet). I've got the passport firmware.

bvader

09-29-06, 06:35 PM

I'm more confused on the 4:3 channels. If I put the SA8300 into 16:9 mode, tell it to use grey sidebars for 4:3 material, and put the NEC on 'normal,' the 4:3 image is scrunched (people are too thin in the image). If I leave the NEC on normal, but change the 8300 to stretch, the image looks correct proportionally, but there are other grey bars (possibly put there by the NEC, not the 8300) on the side. The only way for me to get the picture to fill the screen is to leave the 8300 on stretch and then set the NEC to either anamorphic or stadium. Seems like there is some degree of double stretching, but maybe it all makes sense.

I just saw that you posted something above (I haven't read it yet). I've got the passport firmware.
No double stretching going on I assure you... the reason the STB has a side bar mode is some older / other HDtvs would autmatically stretch a 4:3 to fill the screen... without this setting people with these types of TV's would be unable to watch 4:3 in OAR....
The SA83000 4:3 stretch should be more aptly named "4:3 Full" it just a poor choice of words...put it 4:3 stretch put th eNEC on Normal... you get properly sized 4:3 content

Welcome to the consistent & clearly defined world of HDTV...and connectivity.... :)

EDIT : One other thought.... yes sometimes you need to cycle through NEC aspect ratios after you change resolutions and aspect ratio on the STB , before everything is correct...but it should not change after that.

rhoffman

09-29-06, 07:02 PM

Bvader, thanks for the long response. That all makes sense to me.

In regards to what you didn't understand in my post. My remote control (Time Warner Cable in NYC) has a '#' key that allows you to switch the different display formats of the 8300 (ie, stretch, zoom, normal). If I go to an HD channel and hit the button once just to display the current setting, it will say 16:9, stretch. If I hit the button again to change the setting, it will change to 16:9, normal. At that point there is no change in the picture. If I hit it again, it goes into a zoom mode. And if I hit it one more time it goes back to stretch. The thing is, when it gets to stretch the second time around, it actually stretches. Whereas when you go from a non-HD channel (where as you established before, 16:9, stretch is the correct mode) to an HD channel, it will display that it is in stretch mode, but won't actually stretch.

bvader

09-29-06, 07:24 PM

Ahhhh .... hey I learn something new every day... I never use the # sign...I always set through the setting / more settings...
Yes it appears that there is some funny behavior...I cycled though that and saw what you saw...but that seems to be a bug in that portion of the the FW...yeah the stretch the second time is screwed up... double strecthing cool...not!... but that is not correct and not what you will get if you set the proper settings...

Convice your self.... record something and then watch it... that "bad" stretch " mode will only exist if you do what you have been doing and untill you turn to SD and back to HD or turn off/on the STB or NEC...replay the same HD content...it will be correct.

If you set the STB to Aspect Ratio: Widescreen (16:9), Stretch 4:3 picture and the Stadium on SD and Anamorphic on HD channels you will get the correct aspect on HD...you can check it by recording the HDNet test pattern... on early monday or so ~3:50AM PDT you can search for it....you should / will see a round circle in the 3rd pattern... not an oval...

rhoffman

09-29-06, 09:10 PM

Don't worry, I'm convinced that your settings are right. Thanks again.

bvader

09-29-06, 10:25 PM

dup post...

bvader

09-29-06, 10:26 PM

Don't worry, I'm convinced that your settings are right. Thanks again.
Ohh... didn't mean it as bad thing or that you didn't believe me...just meant... if your like me...I need to be conviced/see it with my owne eyes so I can move on to the next thing to obssess over ;)
Having a DVR'dcopy of the HDNet Test Pattern is not a bad thing to have around...

gcp

09-30-06, 04:31 AM

IR

I am extremely happy with my 42XR4 with over 500 hours on it now. I just thought I would share an observation I have made with regard to IR.

I have found the plasma sensitive to IR within the first half our after switch on. Probably due to the phosphor's warming up.

Once the panel is warm no IR issues.

This panel is 1st class. I recently demoed a Samsung DVD HD950 and did a realtime comparison between the de-interlacer in the Samsung and the de-interlacer in the NEC.

The NEC is far superior. I used Aeon Flux and the dve disk to test. The samsung showed false edging and lots of combing and the picture was not as sharp. The NEC on the other hand showed no visible artifacts when fed an interlaced signal.

I have now ordered an Oppo 970 so that I can feed 576i straight into the NEC via hdmi and let the NEC do the scaling and de-interlacing.

Has anybody else on this forum tried this combo? If so how is the pq?

sakaike

09-30-06, 08:03 PM

I have now ordered an Oppo 970 so that I can feed 576i straight into the NEC via hdmi and let the NEC do the scaling and de-interlacing.

Has anybody else on this forum tried this combo? If so how is the pq?
Here are my test results:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7962776&&#post7962776

Note that this was done with a 50XR5A, not a 42XR4, so your mileage may vary...

tafkap96

10-02-06, 10:31 AM

bvader

10-02-06, 10:59 AM

what size?....
NEC 42XR4 (new model) for 3k not a good deal...if you are talking 50Xr4 (old model)...I think that set it nearly 2 years old...the 50XR5(current model)... you could get legit for little more than 3K...

tafkap96

10-02-06, 11:05 AM

Sorry, i talk about a 50XR4, so 50". And i'm a european, french, and this model cost approximately 6000$.

Ok 50XR4 is an old model, but is it good ?

Cheers

Marky_Mark896

10-02-06, 11:19 AM

Hi all,

i can buy a NEC XR4 for about 3000$ with new 2 years guarantee. This is a good deal ? I don't know this plasma but compared to Panasonic TH-50PX600E or Pioneer PDP-506XDE, it is better, equal, less good ?

Thanks for your help.

Just my opinion, I have a 50XM5, and my brother-in-law just got the pioneer pdp-5060hd, and I like his much better. So much in fact that I just ordered a pdp-6070hd. My NEC 50XM5 has such a bad IR that I can't stand it, so I ordered my Pio 60" from a company that gives you 30 days guarantee to try it, or you can ship it back with no restocking fee. If the Pioneer has any IR to it after a week or so, it's going back to the store.

Again, just my opinion,
Mark

tafkap96

10-02-06, 11:34 AM

What is an IR ? sorry, i'm a newbie in plasma technology...

Marky_Mark896

10-02-06, 11:38 AM

Image retention tafkap. It is where, when you have a static image, such as the logo of a channel at the bottom right corner or paused DVD, you see the image on the screen for a period of time after the real image has disappeared, either by changing the channel, or unpausing the DVD. My NEC has quite a bit of it, and it takes a few minutes before the retained image fades away. I was disappointed, because I wanted to use this as a computer monitor for my HTPC (home theater PC), but I can't because of the IR.

Mark

tafkap96

10-02-06, 11:40 AM

Thanks so much Marky ;)

So, for watching DVD 50XR4 is good or not ?

Marky_Mark896

10-02-06, 11:50 AM

I don't know about the XR4 50". That's the model year prior to mine, and I wouldn't pay 3 grand for it. You can get a new one XR5 for that now. The XM5 that a I have is the exact same technology as the XR5, just a different bezel, and some different menu features. As far as watching DVD's, It's beautiful, but if you watch a DVD or TV with the black lines on top or on the side OAR (original aspect ratio), by the time you're finished, you can see the residual of the black lines for a few minutes until it fades due to the IR. Maybe IR is normal with many plasmas, but I was spoiled with a Hitachi 55" that I had before the NEC. It never had any amount of IR, and it worked great as a computer display. I could leave the desktop up on it for hours and never had any IR or burn in. I'd get another Hitachi, except they don't make anything over 55" and I wanted a 60"+. If the Pioneer doesn't work out for me, I may go back to Hitachi 55".

Mark

GeorgeHolland

10-03-06, 11:02 PM

I am having a Pronto NG TSU7500 customized and the programmer wants me to ship him the remote so he can "shoot" the codes. He specifically needs the DVD HD4 (HDMI) input code and while NEC emailed me the hex codes, he feels it is more reliable to learn the code.

Does anyone have a PCF file available? I'd prefer not to have to ship the remote back and forth if there is a reliable PCF.

Thanks.

Marky_Mark896

10-04-06, 12:06 AM

I can learn it and ship it to him if you want George.

GeorgeHolland

10-04-06, 10:25 PM

I can learn it and ship it to him if you want George.

Thanks for the offer. I left you a PM

Dufusyte

10-10-06, 02:24 PM

NEC owners, a question for you about 4:3 stretch modes:

Let's say you have it set up to use Stadium on 4:3 content, and Anamorphic on 16:9 content. As you change channels, I imagine the panel automatically switches between Stadium and Anamorphic depending on the content.

However, I noticed in the Pio thread that this works on the Pio only if you use an hdmi connection. Meanwhile, if you use Component connections from STB to panel, the Pio will not automatically switch stretch modes.

So my question for NEC owners is whether the NEC panel will automatically switch stretch modes only if you use hdmi, or whether it will successfully (automatically) switch stretch modes also if you use Component connections (STB->Component->NEC).

TIA!

Marky_Mark896

10-10-06, 04:37 PM

Dufusyte, the NEC works like you describe on component inputs. I am troubled to hear that about the component inputs on the Pioneer. I have a 6070 on order.

Gruntenstein

10-10-06, 08:06 PM

I have the 5070 and I don't see any difference between HDMI and Component.
The display remembers the screen size for the different formats no matter what input you use.

Hans

gcp

10-11-06, 03:38 AM

Uniformity. 42xr4

I have noticed on football games what looks like light grey blotches on the screen as the camera pans across the green field. Almost as if the panel glass has a layer of dust on it. The techies seem to refer to it as uniformity.

I am unable to determine if it is the panel or the broadcast. It is not consistent and the extent thereof can vary.

It is only noticeable on green and when the camera is panning across the field?

I have 500 hours on the panel and have never noticed this before.

Can anyone help?

windwaves

10-11-06, 02:08 PM

It's interesting to come back to this thread, which I now only rarely do, and still see so much discussion about IR.

As some may remember, I have owned my XM2 (!) for now nearly 4 years. It still works as if I had bought it yesterday. And I still love it.

Yes, IR is there, and has to be dealt with I believe, even though I have had accidents where a couple of times I have left the plasma on all night with a static image and did not have any permanent damage.

However, this IR thing is at this point and in my opinion a serioius weakness. I knew exactly about it when I purchased the panel but the fact of the matter is that 4 years later it would be fair to expect this to no longer be an issue. After all, as someone else, pointed out, other manufacturers have resolved it. Why not Nec ?

Has anyone ever asked NEC directly this very question ? (I suspect someone has...)

Dufusyte

10-11-06, 02:36 PM

other manufacturers have resolved it. Why not Nec?
The 42xr4a which uses the new glass seems to have very little reports of IR. Most of the reports are from 50XR5A owners. Hopefully the upcoming models will all have the new glass, so then the issue will be laid to rest. The current Pioneers (5070,4270,507cmx) also use the same new glass, and they also have almost no issues with IR.

Someone posted that the IR is caused by the active pixels being warm, while the inactive (black) pixels are cold; in this case, having one less pane of glass in the new glass may be what helps the temperatures to more rapidly even out, as the warm pixels can dissipate their heat faster, and the glass is less bulky so it stores less heat.

scutfargas

10-12-06, 12:16 PM

Let's say you have it set up to use Stadium on 4:3 content, and Anamorphic on 16:9 content. As you change channels, I imagine the panel automatically switches between Stadium and Anamorphic depending on the content.

How can you set the TV up to do this? Can this be done from the TV or does it have to be done from the cable/sat source? I have DISH network and can't seem to make it do this.

DigitalOBX

10-12-06, 12:33 PM

How can you set the TV up to do this? Can this be done from the TV or does it have to be done from the cable/sat source? I have DISH network and can't seem to make it do this.
My 50XR5 does not automatically switch modes....I can switch manually through the memory settings though.

silentbob1974

10-12-06, 03:31 PM

Does anyone have the new Tivo Series 3 and successfully programmed the remote to match up with the 50XR5? I tried all the 4-digit codes listed, but none of them appeared to work.
Asking again on the off-chance that someone here has bought a Tivo Series 3 in the past few weeks.

bvader

10-13-06, 01:36 PM

My 50XR5 does not automatically switch modes....I can switch manually through the memory settings though.
The 50XR5 does automatically switch modes based on the input resolution. if the input resolution is SD i.e. 480i you can select NEC wide to Stadium and for every 480i channel you will get Stadium, then for and HD channel (720p or 1080i) you can set wide to Anamorphic and as you switch between SD and HD channels you will get Stadium and Anamorphic automatically.....

The issue/behaviour is different if your STB box does not allow you to pass native resolutions to the panel, or you must pick only one resolution... i.e. the STB upconverts the SD channel to 720p or 1080i.. then the content appears to be HD to the NEC and will be handled just like an HD channel an thus if you want to use different wide modes you must do it mannualy...

In short...Ideally use your STB as a passthrough and send native signals to the NEC... e.g. when using the SA 8300... select 480i, 720p, 1080i as resolutions...and you should get the best results..

DigitalOBX

10-13-06, 04:36 PM

The 50XR5 does automatically switch modes based on the input resolution. if the input resolution is SD i.e. 480i you can select NEC wide to Stadium and for every 480i channel you will get Stadium, then for and HD channel (720p or 1080i) you can set wide to Anamorphic and as you switch between SD and HD channels you will get Stadium and Anamorphic automatically.....

The issue/behaviour is different if your STB box does not allow you to pass native resolutions to the panel, or you must pick only one resolution... i.e. the STB upconverts the SD channel to 720p or 1080i.. then the content appears to be HD to the NEC and will be handled just like an HD channel an thus if you want to use different wide modes you must do it mannualy...

In short...Ideally use your STB as a passthrough and send native signals to the NEC... e.g. when using the SA 8300... select 480i, 720p, 1080i as resolutions...and you should get the best results..
Bvader - you are 100% correct :o My STB had been set to 1080I and the automatic switch was not occurring, I have moved it to pass a native signal and it switches automatically from stadium to anamorphic when going from SD to HD.....Very cool.....Thanks :)...and you might be right that some STBs can not pass a native signal - My STB is a D* Samsung HD TS 360 and it does allow...

bvader

10-13-06, 07:13 PM

Bvader - you are 100% correct :o My STB had been set to 1080I and the automatic switch was not occurring, I have moved it to pass a native signal and it switches automatically from stadium to anamorphic when going from SD to HD.....Very cool.....Thanks :)...and you might be right that some STBs can not pass a native signal - My STB is a D* Samsung HD TS 360 and it does allow...
glad I could help...
I am not Captain Dunsel after all...

Ohh... and the NEC scalar/electronics will most likely will produce a better result than scaling/deinterlacing with the STB

yrneh

10-13-06, 10:07 PM

bvader

10-14-06, 11:35 AM

hi everybody,

i just got my new NEC PX-XR50RW - australian model 2 days ago and i just want to ask you guys on:

1. initial settings (contrast, brightness, etc)
2. breaking in ... how do you do it?
3. calibration
4. any other tips/tricks?

your help is greatly appreciated. thanks :)

Contgratualation ..... wait that should be....
Good On Ya Mate!

but Yikes!!! you just cover the content of this entire thread ;)
So I will give you the super abreviated version...

1) Here is the setting thread...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7360508#post7360508
For breakin... lower contrast bright ness by 25% or... simply go to PDP Saver setting and put max at 75%, that should do it

2) Just try to avoid static content and make sure you fill the screen, i.e. try to avoid watching 4:3. 2.35:1 OAR for a while... also if you want to use the breakin disc
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=608677
I did... not sure I would necc do it again...but it was a good way to rack up worry free hours..
ALSO veryy important........!!!!!!! do not be over critical and stand 2 feet away looking for every slight hint of IR...just enjoy your set... IMHO don't bother with the wiper just watch lots of varied content... try to avoid 2.35/4:3 content for a while (more thatn 100 hours)..... just use the 2.35 and Stadium Wide settings to fill the screen..
To check hours you can do this... please read the disclaimer...following the links to NEC
http://www.bruzzi.ws/forum/showthread.php?t=62

3) Calibration.... lots of info out there...your choice...DIY or Pro... if so inclined start with Do It Yourself...

4) Come back with specific questions...

yrneh

10-14-06, 10:05 PM

thanks mate for your help.

tdavis21484

10-15-06, 10:27 PM

Hi folks.

I'm enjoying my NEC, continuing to tweak it at times and generally grousing about the lack of HD content available overall...

I would like to know this: Have any of you had problems with black level shifting, or the "floating blacks" effect when the average picture level changes on your display?

I have the 42XR4, and I see this relatively often, but haven't seen it discussed in this thread. Please let me know if any of you have experienced this problem, or know of a way to prevent it - it annoys me pretty badly at times.

Trent

LisaM

10-16-06, 09:10 AM

I just received an email from NEC Sales. The target ship dates for the new 50xr6 are in mid-November.

BillW

10-16-06, 11:47 AM

Lisa, Thats funny because my dist. just told me on Friday not til next year,so I started looking at the Pioneer 507cmx. I think it depends on how many 5's are still in the warehouses. They did just drop the price again a week and a half ago, maybe that has helped move out most of them. Did they give you a msrp?

LisaM

10-16-06, 12:19 PM

Nope...the entire email is below:

Thank you for your inquiry,
Target ship dates are in mid-November.

Best regards,

NEC Customer Service

NEC VSD

www. Necvisualsystems.com

800-836-0655

BillW

10-16-06, 01:14 PM

OK I called NEC and was told, just like Lisa said Mid Nov for the 50 and 60, mid Jan for the 42. Pricing will be available the 1st of Nov.(we'll see)! I guess you really have to wait til the last minute to set your msrp with the way prices are falling.

LisaM

10-16-06, 02:13 PM

I will be very curious to see if the new 50 incorporates the advances which are in the current 42 inch panel. I have the 42xr4 and have never seen any IR.

BillW

10-16-06, 02:29 PM

I was told that the new 50 inch would have the new glass, so much less IR. The IR is the only reason I don't pick up a 5 gen now, althouth I think the less reflections is a plus too.

scutfargas

10-17-06, 11:30 AM

Ripper99

10-18-06, 03:10 AM

I have read many of the posts but unfortunately it would take me 2-3 weeks to probably go through all 137 pages to find these answers. :rolleyes:

Many links for the 50xr5 I click go to a page showing the 50xm5..is this the newer model and if so how does it differ from the 50xr5? Under the specs for input 3 and 4 it is blank where the 50xr5 manual has HDMI inputs designated.

Can someone confirm the height of the 50xr5 with the PX-ST2U stand..I'm not positive the "mechanical" dimensions they list are with the stand?

I read one comment that this panel cannot do 1080P yet the manual says 1080P..can somebody clarify that this panel can do 1080P...I'm not really sure this will make much of a difference viewing from 10-12' in the room I plan to put it.

Thanks for any answers you can provide

Dufusyte

10-18-06, 10:21 AM

is the 50xm5 the newer model and if so how does it differ from the 50xr5?
xr is the comsumer model, and xm is the same generation industrial model; the connections are slightly different; the xm models have a DVI connector. You can find the complete specs on the nec website. The new models will be 50xr6 and 50xm6.

Can someone confirm the height of the 50xr5 with the PX-ST2U stand
The PX-ST2U adds 3.25 to the height of the panel. I believe the 50XR5 is 28.5 tall with just the panel, so on the stand it would be 28.5 plus 3.25 = approximately 33 inches tall.

can somebody clarify that this panel can do 1080P
50xr5 can accept a 1080p signal via Component. 50xm5 can accept a 1080p signal via Component or DVI. Since both panels have a physical pixel structure of 1365x768, they will both down-scale a 1080p signal to 768p for display.

Ripper99

10-18-06, 01:17 PM

Thank you Dufusyte for the answers I needed, appreciated.

xboy360

10-24-06, 03:10 PM

Attached a screen shot of my timings from the nvidia control panel... this should help!

Here's the important note:
Horizontal pixels:
Front-end active is 1368 pixels
back-end active: 1365 pixels

Is this normal behavior? I set my NVIDIA 7800GT to those settings, my NEC 50XR5 syncs to the signal on the DVI->HDMI cable and it shows it as 1365 x 768 @ memory location 18.

All seems well, but looking at the PDP closely, the image isn't displaying completely full screen! There's at least a 5 pixel border on the sides, and a 2 pixel border on the top and bottom?? This is nasty condition for bad burn in!

Are there more pixels on the panel than 1365x768?

jvincent

10-24-06, 04:18 PM

Is this normal behavior? I set my NVIDIA 7800GT to those settings, my NEC 50XR5 syncs to the signal on the DVI->HDMI cable and it shows it as 1365 x 768 @ memory location 18.

I believe it is. My 6600GT does the same thing, at least as far as the horizontal is concerned. I can't say as I noticed the vertical.

I'm pretty sure it's a "quirk" of the way the Nvidia cards do the flat panel scaling.

From a timing perspective it is sending 1365x768 which allows the NEC to lock and show memory 18. However, I'm pretty sure that internally the GPU is only using 1360x768 active pixels so that's all you ever see lit up.

I only noticed this a little while ago and have just chalked it up as one of those things. As far as burn in is concerned I've just shifted the image so that I have two rows unlit on one side and three on the other. Since I never noticed it from my sitting position before, I'm sure I'll never notice any burn-in that might happen down the road.

BGA

10-24-06, 04:38 PM

xboy360

10-24-06, 04:49 PM

I can't remember the exact settings as I haven't connected to my PC to my display yet but someone mentioned that you need to make one change in the service menu to allow PC's to sync properly and also need to adjust the vertical/horizontal position in the setup menu.

Hope this helps.

Anyone know what's this change? I really want to use native resolution, but I don't want to end up burning a border in. I can move the position around, but the visible image is slightly smaller than the screen!

And aside from that, I have my plasma as my secondary display so when I play videos it will automatically go full screen to the plasma. But the annoying problem with this is that it puts it to the closest resolution! So if I play a 640x480 video, it automatically puts it into 640x480 display mode (and I get overscan which is what I wanted to solve in the first place!) How do you stop this behavior and have it use the native resolution??

I just switched from an ATI card, and I can say the ATI card was a much better card in this aspect (it even let you create new resolutions easily by resizing a box).

xboy360

10-24-06, 04:55 PM

I believe it is. My 6600GT does the same thing, at least as far as the horizontal is concerned. I can't say as I noticed the vertical.

I'm pretty sure it's a "quirk" of the way the Nvidia cards do the flat panel scaling.

From a timing perspective it is sending 1365x768 which allows the NEC to lock and show memory 18. However, I'm pretty sure that internally the GPU is only using 1360x768 active pixels so that's all you ever see lit up.

I only noticed this a little while ago and have just chalked it up as one of those things. As far as burn in is concerned I've just shifted the image so that I have two rows unlit on one side and three on the other. Since I never noticed it from my sitting position before, I'm sure I'll never notice any burn-in that might happen down the road.

Is there no way to resize this? Like in powerstrip, you can make a resolution in a resolution (for overscan/underscan)
I don't understand the timing numbers completely, so I'm not sure.

In the latest NVIDIA drivers, the custom resolution editor lets you specify a few different parameters. Anyone know what are the equivalent settings for that when using the "new control panel'?

jvincent

10-24-06, 04:58 PM

Anyone know what's this change? I really want to use native resolution, but I don't want to end up burning a border in. I can move the position around, but the visible image is slightly smaller than the screen!

There's no change to make for connecting a PC to allow it to sync. There is a switch that limits the contrast but that's it.

I wouldn't worry about the 2 pixel wide border. In practice you will never notice it since it blends into the bezel area.

jvincent

10-24-06, 05:01 PM

Is there no way to resize this? Like in powerstrip, you can make a resolution in a resolution (for overscan/underscan)
I don't understand the timing numbers completely, so I'm not sure.

In the latest NVIDIA drivers, the custom resolution editor lets you specify a few different parameters. Anyone know what are the equivalent settings for that when using the "new control panel'?

I don't think there is any way around this.

I suspect that even if you do the resolution within a resolution, which is really what the flat panel scaling is doing, you're ultimately going to end up with the same thing.

I replace an ATI card (9700) which wouldn't drive native resolution at all, so living with a 2 pixel border at native resolution isn't a big deal for me.

xboy360

10-24-06, 07:29 PM

I don't think there is any way around this.

I suspect that even if you do the resolution within a resolution, which is really what the flat panel scaling is doing, you're ultimately going to end up with the same thing.

I replace an ATI card (9700) which wouldn't drive native resolution at all, so living with a 2 pixel border at native resolution isn't a big deal for me.

I had an ATI card (9800) that let me create a custom resolution of 1236x684 (which fills it full screen, but isn't native rate).

But what's the point of native rate when I play videos it just puts it to the resolution closest to the source video???

jvincent

10-24-06, 07:37 PM

But what's the point of native rate when I play videos it just puts it to the resolution closest to the source video???

If you are sending native rate then you shouldn't be changing resolution on media playback.

The point of native rate is to allow the PC/Video card to do all the scaling and sending it 1:1 to the panel.

My media player, TheaterTek, plays back my DVDs scaled to 1360x768, to match the active region of the native rate display.

jvincent

10-24-06, 08:03 PM

Actually, I just realized that I noticed this behaviour when I started using the 90 series drivers.

I rolled back to the 81.98 and now everything works just fine, i.e. I get 1365 active pixels horizontally. Not sure if the 7800GT is supported in the 81.98 but it's worth a shot.

xboy360

10-24-06, 09:48 PM

If you are sending native rate then you shouldn't be changing resolution on media playback.

The point of native rate is to allow the PC/Video card to do all the scaling and sending it 1:1 to the panel.

My media player, TheaterTek, plays back my DVDs scaled to 1360x768, to match the active region of the native rate display.

This is my configuration: The XR5 is plugged into my secondary DVI port, I have windows set up to extend the desktop. Monitor0: 1280x1024 Monitor1: 1365x768.

When I use media player classic or windows media player 10, when I play an AVI file that is 640x480, it displays the video full screen on the 2nd display. However, it doesn't resive the video to native rate (like ATI does), it just puts the resolution to 640x480!!

That's what I meant what is the point of native rate if NVIDIA cards don't resize the video output to native rate! Is there some registry tweak to set it?

jvincent

10-24-06, 09:51 PM

Sorry, can't help you with that.

I've never used dual displays for my HTPC. There are simply too many quirks in the interactions with the S/W and H/W.

xboy360

10-24-06, 10:00 PM

Sorry, can't help you with that.

I've never used dual displays for my HTPC. There are simply too many quirks in the interactions with the S/W and H/W.

So previous driver version should not change resolutions like that?

jvincent

10-24-06, 10:05 PM

I've never had a problem with changing resolutions since I use a single display.

The older driver got rid of the five "blank" pixel columns so that I've got the full 1365x768 now.

xboy360

10-25-06, 01:48 PM

I've never had a problem with changing resolutions since I use a single display.

The older driver got rid of the five "blank" pixel columns so that I've got the full 1365x768 now.

Ohh, which revision so I'll know I'm using the right one?

I guess NVIDIA's "dual view" is always problematic..

jvincent

10-25-06, 01:58 PM

I'm using the 81.98 drivers.

ziv_r

10-28-06, 04:27 AM

Can some one please help and tell me what is the use of the "cinema mode" found on 42XR4?
The manual doesnt say much :-(

big_marcelo

10-28-06, 08:38 AM

Can some one please help and tell me what is the use of the "cinema mode" found on 42XR4?
The manual doesnt say much :-(
I think it changes the deinterlacing mode to expect film and not video ..... that's just a guess.

msd20

10-28-06, 10:04 AM

Hi,
I have been using my 42xr4 with a SA-8300HD cable box Comcast New Jersey since January and love it! Th only issue that crops up from time to time is when I am watching a HD channel it may start to flicker or go out completely and the only way to get it back is to change the channel to a standard station and then punch the HD channel back in. I have the box connected with an HDMI cable. Any thouights?
Thanks

optivity

10-28-06, 10:09 AM

What is NEC up to these days? Will they ever use B&Ms as a distribution outlet? I might buy a PDP from NEC if I could ACTUALLY SEE IT FIRST!

jvincent

10-28-06, 10:44 AM

Hi,
IAny thouights?

The HDMI interface on the 8300HD is very buggy, often dropping connections. I stopped using mine after a couple of weeks and went back to component. There's a very small difference in picture quality, but you have to look for it.

Several HDMI issues are supposed to be "fixed" in the next F/W update for the 8300HD. When that actually occurs will depend on your cable provider.

Cleveland Plasma

10-28-06, 11:09 AM

What is NEC up to these days? Will they ever use B&Ms as a distribution outlet? I might buy a PDP from NEC if I could ACTUALLY SEE IT FIRST!
Odds are NEC will never be in most B & M'S. NEC markets there plasma's as high end displays. There displays are meant to be in the class of Pioneer Elite, Runco, and Fujitsu. Might be able to find them in a few high end electronic stores. There new line up is due in Novemeber, I am looking forward to this as I am hoping to land a 60XR5A !!

msd20

10-28-06, 11:23 AM

The HDMI interface on the 8300HD is very buggy, often dropping connections. I stopped using mine after a couple of weeks and went back to component. There's a very small difference in picture quality, but you have to look for it.

Several HDMI issues are supposed to be "fixed" in the next F/W update for the 8300HD. When that actually occurs will depend on your cable provider.

Thanks!
I never thought to try that. I could probably live without the HDMI. I will check also with Comcast on any upgrades.

Steve L

10-28-06, 11:26 AM

There displays are meant to be in the class of Pioneer Elite, Runco, and Fujitsu.

All of which are carried and displayed in B&M stores, at least in the NY Tri-state area.

/steve

optivity

10-28-06, 05:17 PM

Odds are NEC will never be in most B & M'S. NEC markets there plasma's as high end displays. There displays are meant to be in the class of Pioneer Elite, Runco, and Fujitsu. Might be able to find them in a few high end electronic stores. There new line up is due in Novemeber, I am looking forward to this as I am hoping to land a 60XR5A !!Most likely my next PDP will be a Pioneer.

DAB

10-31-06, 12:40 PM

Who has the NEC 50xr5 and the OPPO 970 DVD Player??
I have both.
Q? have you done any tweak or special setting. I have set the Oppo970 to what the manaul suggests and have it set usually at 480i or 720p{some times the PQ is better on one of these two setting}. and use tony17 and my AVAI setting.
Anything you found for better PQ or even sound?
I am also trying to figure out if the NEC has a better scaler than the OPPO.
Oppo is coming out with the new 871/981, which is stated will create a better PQ-the 971 on certain TV models might have MB issues, the current 970 does not. However the 971 is suppose to have better video PQ.
db

tterral

10-31-06, 02:21 PM

Chris -

Granted, NEC markets their panels as high end displays, but what reason could they possibly have for not being in more stores? I understand they may not want to be in Circuit City, etc., if they want to maintain and "upper end" presence, but what about a Magnolia or the like? I have to wonder if they have the production capacity to be able to market themselves more aggressively. I think many here, and elsewhere (myself included), would really like to see what the NEC buzz is all about, but are leary on spending that kind of dough on something sight unseen. Their whole marketing strategy is just rather bizarre, almost like they do not care if they sell as many panels as they could if people actually had an opportunity to view one.

All that being said, I too am anxious to hear how the next generation NEC panels stack up, because Lord knows they certainly have a loyal following. Personally, I have not checked them off my list, but I sure would like to see one!

Tim Terral

tdavis21484

10-31-06, 03:04 PM

What is NEC up to these days? Will they ever use B&Ms as a distribution outlet? I might buy a PDP from NEC if I could ACTUALLY SEE IT FIRST!
It is quite the paradox. It makes me wonder if maybe they simply don't have the capacity to produce for their core B2B market and also handle a large number of consumer displays as well.

As for seeing one, perhaps you should just mention on the thread the area you're in - there's a lot of owners here, and perhaps one close to you will be willing show you their display!

bvader

10-31-06, 03:23 PM

Who has the NEC 50xr5 and the OPPO 970 DVD Player??
I have both.
Q? have you done any tweak or special setting. I have set the Oppo970 to what the manaul suggests and have it set usually at 480i or 720p{some times the PQ is better on one of these two setting}. and use tony17 and my AVAI setting.
Anything you found for better PQ or even sound?
I am also trying to figure out if the NEC has a better scaler than the OPPO.
Oppo is coming out with the new 871, which is stated will create a been PQ-different chip but might have MB issues.
db
Re MBE Issues... I have the Oppo 971 with Faroudja chip no MBE with the 50XR5A, the new 871 will be using a Faroudja so there should be no MBE issues.

bvader

10-31-06, 03:26 PM

Chris -
....

All that being said, I too am anxious to hear how the next generation NEC panels stack up, because Lord knows they certainly have a loyal following. Personally, I have not checked them off my list, but I sure would like to see one!

Tim Terral

I, as well as many folks, have happily bought from Chris...

There are vendors that have a 30 day no muss no fuss return policy...they bank on the fact that you will be happy with your purchase...thats how you can see one... in your very own home...

tterral

10-31-06, 04:41 PM

True enough, but paying for the return shipping ($250-300), if I decide not to keep the panel, is a pretty expensive "try it before you buy it" program. In fact, I would probably be out shipping BOTH ways ($500-600) since I doubt the vendor I would buy it from would eat the shipping to me. I buy at a B & M and I get a full refund, I am out nothing for the trouble. This is not to say that I will not take the gamble when the time comes, but I really do not like the idea of having to do it this way. To me, it is a very screwy way to do business, especially for a very large corporation who makes, arguably, one of the best panels out there.

Tim Terral

Cleveland Plasma

10-31-06, 05:04 PM

I am sure NEC could meet the demand, not sure why they market the way they do.

DAB

10-31-06, 05:38 PM

tterral, I purchase my xr5 unseen and un-reviewed 12.23.05. I think it was the first one sold or I was the first here on AVS to get it. I love the xr5 and no -no - any issue here on PQ and it has more inputs than I would ever use... And I would not hesitate to purchase again from either Chris or Plasma Concepts. Good AVS sponsors... and look at all the great reviews of both the xr5 and these online merchants get.
db

DAB

11-02-06, 01:26 PM

Re MBE Issues... I have the Oppo 971 with Faroudja chip no MBE with the 50XR5A, the new 871 will be using a Faroudja so there should be no MBE issues.
Why does one Plasma have MBE issue and not another? Better scaler or XXXX
in the NEC? I do not think i have seen MB. I have not seen many other plasma,
other than watching sports.. Over one the OPPO threads thay state the 971 has better PQ than the 970(mine). But the new 871 will have all the feature that i want and the PQ should be better. MY PQ is great now. just curious on how "much" is much better...
db

CruelInventions

11-02-06, 02:29 PM

Re: NEC's marketing

I wonder if their lack of high end B&M presence has something to do with the fact that they supply some?/most? of the parts to a couple other high-end panel makers. I forget the specifics of which brands and what parts they supply to whom, but I want to say that Marantz and Runco are a couple of these brands.

There's a local high end retailer in my area that, with the exception of LG as their "value" brand, carry only high end plasmas (Hitachi Director Series, Marantz, Runco, etc.). Perhaps to get the business, NEC has some sort of a "no compete" clause with the high end brands they supply to, at least when it comes to B&M presence. So what's left? Gearing their marketing to industrial & commercial markets, with a smattering of on-line general consumer sales.

jvincent

11-02-06, 02:44 PM

I suspect it's strictly a market focus issue.

Speculating, I suspect that NEC focusses most of its marketing on the Japanese/European markets for consumers. Their presence in NA seems to be mostly in the business side.

They've simply decided to not try and go toe to toe with the big consumer plasma guys in NA (i.e. Panasonic, Pioneer, etc).

groschuni

11-02-06, 05:50 PM

Anyone notice that NEC has come out with the new 60xr5? It looks like it has the new glass like the 42xr4. Should help solve the IR problem. Specs are on their website. They claim that the contrast ratio is 350% better than the older model. Should look good. Available now for immediate delivery. Give me a dozen.

Marky_Mark896

11-02-06, 05:56 PM

Looks good, wonder if Chris has his on order yet??? He said that's what he was waiting on. Pretty pricey though compared to the Pio 6070. Wonder what they can be had for really?

DigitalOBX

11-02-06, 06:06 PM

I wish that NEC would label their sets better....confusing :confused:
42XR4 - better glass than 50XR5
60XR5 - better glass than 50XR5

Dufusyte

11-02-06, 06:42 PM

Actually the new glass (single pane, bonded color filter) which the 42xr4 had is not available on the new 60 inch panel; it is on the new 50" and 42" though.

specs (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=67258)

that's just the way it is

CruelInventions

11-07-06, 12:47 PM

As I veer ever closer to making a final decision on which 42" plasma to purchase for myself, I am in the continual process of assessing and re-assessing several brand/model options. Today, I am circling back to revisit the NEC 42XR4. Doing a review search, I am a bit surprised to find just how very lukewarm the reviews are for this particular model.

While I know PC Magazine gave an absolutely glowing review to the NEC 42XR4, seemingly everywhere else I go to seek information, the gist of opinions are much less stellar for this panel. Particularly when it comes to the subject of "value", this NEC model doesn't garner very much respect. Generally, the opinions seem to come down to this: The NEC has some very good aspects, but like most every other panel, it still has it's own unique set of flaws, and when you then factor in it's premium price, it is difficult to justify recommending this panel over several other panels, many of which can be gotten for much lower prices. Given the tumbling panel prices of late (of course, the most glaring example is the Panasonic 42" 9UK, which now can be had for almost half the price), this critique has only become increasingly valid.

Have all the following reviews been seen and subsequently discussed in this forum already? If not, care to critique some of the conclusions offered in these reviews? And if you were buying today, could you still justify spending a much greater amount for this panel than what's now available from the competition?

www.hdtvsolutions.com (http://www.hdtvsolutions.com/NEC_PX-42XR4A_Plasma_HDTV_review.htm) "Value: 3 out of 5"

www.pocket-lint.co.uk review (http://www.pocket-lint.co.uk/reviews/review.phtml/1766/2790/nec-42xr2-silver-plasma-hdtv.phtml) "Our score: 6/10"

Cnet UK Review (http://reviews.cnet.co.uk/televisions/0,39030218,49264356,00.htm) "a decent performer"

NOTE: I realize that a new 42" panel is on the relatively near horizon, and perhaps this new model will have both a msrp reduction and panel upgrades which could increase it's perceived competitiveness in the marketplace. Nevertheless, the question remains.. today, is a 42XR4 still "worth it"?

tterral

11-07-06, 01:20 PM

So, according to the spec sheet, the new 42" and 50" models will be coming out in early 2007, any idea on a more definitive time frame? Any idea on MSRPs for these babys or what they might street at (if this is allowable), obviously this would be speculation at this point?

Tim Terral

wblynch

11-07-06, 02:27 PM

The NEC plasmas have never gotten much respect from the "press".

But NEC always gets amazingly wonderful reviews by owners.

We have had our NEC 42XM2 over 3 years now and it gets 10 hours of use per day.

This NEC is still as outstanding and amazing as it was on day one. To this day, when I visit showrooms I have not seen another plasma brand that is as crisp and clean as the NEC. The color representation is gorgeous.

Technology marches along and prices drop but NEC plasma still has the most beautiful PQ out there.

Trust your eyes, not some magazine dork.

If your eyes love it today they will love it for years to come.

Marky_Mark896

11-07-06, 02:34 PM

Personally, I am suggesting a Pioneer over the NEC. I have a 50XM5 NEC, and a Pioneer 6070, and the pioneer blows the NEC away for color and blacks, and no IR. But that's just my opinion. You may like the NEC better...who knows. If you're close to Ohio, stop by and I'll show you the 2 I have.

CruelInventions

11-07-06, 03:07 PM

If I'm going to be spending that much for an NEC, I may as well get (in the case of 42" models) a Pioneer 4070/4071. Seemingly, less negative review "baggage", and more built-in features for a similar price. Add the fact that the NEC can be extremely challenging to find & view in person, which makes it much more of a "leap in faith", despite the common refrain here of "only 3 people in the history of this thread were disappointed upon receiving their NEC panel".

Marky_Mark896

11-07-06, 03:16 PM

Go for it Greg, I don't think you'll be disappointed with the Pio. Whatever you do, do give Chris at ClevelandPlasma.com a chance to sell it to you. He's great to deal with.

Mark

Cleveland Plasma

11-07-06, 03:31 PM

CruelInventions

11-07-06, 03:45 PM

Yep, no doubt, Chris will be on a short list of two I will first call upon when ready to make a purchase. However, I don't think he carries the consumer Pioneers, only the commercial. And in the 42", Pio's current 425CMX model has the double-glass design, unlike their more recently released 50" and larger commercial models. I would prefer to minimize reflection as much as possible (though I am unsure as to how much difference this actually makes).

If it doesn't make any significant difference (at least 10% improvement or more), then this current 42" CMX commercial will still be a real possibility, though nobody on the forum seems to talk about it. Which makes me doubt that one too. :confused: :D

Marky_Mark896

11-07-06, 03:49 PM

Actually he does carry consumer pio. Not elite's, but the 4270's, 5070's, 6070s. That's where I got my 6070 that I'm lovin' right now, and typing to you on right now.

Cleveland Plasma

11-07-06, 04:17 PM

And in the 42", Pio's current 425CMX model has the double-glass design, unlike their more recently released 50" and larger commercial models. I would prefer to minimize reflection as much as possible (though I am unsure as to how much difference this actually makes).

If it doesn't make any significant difference (at least 10% improvement or more), then this current 42" CMX commercial will still be a real possibility, though nobody on the forum seems to talk about it. Which makes me doubt that one too. :confused: :D
I will say one thing, the PDP-505CMX and PDP-425CMX just got a price drop. (Big one at that)

CruelInventions

11-07-06, 04:36 PM

Things keep getting more and more interesting.. Combined with the Key Digital (sic) card, the one which supposedly approaches an Elite quality picture, the prices may be approaching "doable" for me. I can do a Panny 9UK now, but I'm holding out a while longer to see what shakes out for NEC and Pioneer in the next 2-3 months, if need be.

Chris, in another thread, I've noticed people having some issues with the Key Digital card at higher resolutions.. is that an issue only for 50" or larger panels? Is it safe to say that it is irrelevant for a 42" panel?

bvader

11-07-06, 08:00 PM

One item of note...
You can not adjust color and tint when an RGB source is input via HDMI board on the 9UK... i.e. can't tweak the color/tint.. why is this important? (it may not be for you) but some STB (example SA8300) pass RGB colorspace via HDMI... thus you won't be able to adjust the color/tint...this is not a limitation on the NEC.... small but true... you can check it out in the 9UK threads...

LisaM

11-09-06, 08:29 AM

Do we know if a firmware update is possible for the NEC 42xr4? My cable company upgraded their software 1 month ago and ever since, I have been having issues with the box via HDMI. I have been in contact with the company's head of HD operations and his IT people said that many HDMI issues have been solved by a firmware update to the panel, if available.

Update: I spoke with NEC and there has been no firmware update to the 42xr4.

Dufusyte

11-09-06, 09:59 AM

Does Component look as good as HDMI?

old_man

11-09-06, 10:43 AM

jvincent

11-09-06, 11:13 AM

Random update to this thread regarding 1080p support.

I updated my Xbox 360 to enable 1080p over component and sure enough my 61XR4 handles it just fine.

When I go to the "Signal Info" screen it tells me that it's receiving 1080p at 67.5kHz horizontal and 60Hz vertical. Can't remember which memory shows up.

bvader

11-09-06, 12:57 PM

^^^^ Uhhhh Welll How does it look!!!

jvincent

11-09-06, 02:54 PM

^^^^ Uhhhh Welll How does it look!!!

Looks just fine. :)

No noticeable difference from when the 360 was sending 1080i over component but I figured what the hell.

LisaM

11-09-06, 06:02 PM

If it's COMCAST and a Motorola box and the firmware went up to 16.20 then that is your problem, see all the COMCAST and Motorola threads. :)

It is a notorious upgrade for HDMI :)

Nope...it is a TWC 8300HD box, which was working fine prior to the recent software upgrade. Now I get full-screen snow when changing channels - also a known result.

bvader

11-09-06, 06:36 PM

Nope...it is a TWC 8300HD box, which was working fine prior to the recent software upgrade. Now I get full-screen snow when changing channels - also a known result.
Lisa, check to see if you have audio digital out set to Dolby Digital on the SA8300... if you do set it to HDMI and see what happens (assuming you are using digital audio out to your AVR)... I remember you saying that you didn't have any trouble before..TWC, SA8300, Passport Right? Out here we have had trouble for a while... let me know...we set audio digital out to HDMI...except when we watch something with really good DD5.1 we set it to Dolby Digitla ... then switch back to HDMI... it appears if you leave the setting on Dolby Digital... it messes up the HDMI/HDCP when you switch channels...nice huh?

rhoffman

11-09-06, 11:35 PM

LisaM

11-10-06, 12:13 AM

Lisa, I periodically get the same problem. I tried playing around with the audio settings, but for the brief time that I did it didn't seem to consistently prevent the problem. That being said, I should maybe revisit the issue to see if that works.

The best way to get your picture back is just hit another input button on the NEC remote and then go back to the cable input. It's annoying, yes, but at least you'll get a picture without having to shut everything down.

After struggling with this problem since the latest upgrade (and having to turn off the box and panel over and over again), I finally searched through the 8300HD Passport thread and found that suggestion. Tonight I left the cable box on continuously (I usually had shut it off with the panel and receiver) and simply first hit a different input button on the NEC and then back to the proper HDMI input. It works! (I have the audio setting set at DD and didn't mess with it because this fix worked.) This snow problem was driving me nuts, particularly because it can't be good for the NEC to be turned on and off so many times in a short period. I had even tried component but found that the picture wasn't quite as good as with HDMI. Many thanks for the assistance.

LisaM

11-10-06, 12:17 AM

Bvader, thanks for your suggestion too. I was going to try that next if the "Switch input" fix didn't work. Yes, 8300HD, TWC, Passport - the irony is that my system was working perfectly until the software upgrade of 1 month ago. I have had 2 techs here - both of whom had no clue - other than to try a different HDMI cable or to swap the box. Unfortunately, these HDMI handshake problems seem to be prevalent all around the country and aren't being solved via software upgrades.

bvader

11-10-06, 01:03 AM

LisaM....try the HDMI setting for the audio digital out just for fun.... it will (ok should) work...plus the vast majority of TV is PLII, so your not missing out in fact it will probably sound better and you won't get the snow...the switch input trick will work but so should the audio setting...and you can flip to your hearts content...then jsut setting to DD for those special shows/movies that are actual DD... give it a try...you might like it :D

LisaM

11-10-06, 08:28 AM

BVader, you are correct. When I switch the setting to HDMI, I only get momentary snow when changing channels. The correct picture then pops up. It seems that there are now two temporary fixes, which should work until they figure out the software problems. Thanks again!

Audio Authority

11-11-06, 12:01 PM

Have all the following reviews been seen and subsequently discussed in this forum already? If not, care to critique some of the conclusions offered in these reviews? And if you were buying today, could you still justify spending a much greater amount for this panel than what's now available from the competition?
...
NOTE: I realize that a new 42" panel is on the relatively near horizon, and perhaps this new model will have both a msrp reduction and panel upgrades which could increase it's perceived competitiveness in the marketplace. Nevertheless, the question remains.. today, is a 42XR4 still "worth it"?
Most reviews have given excellent performance and features ratings, but have been low on "Value". Consider that the MSRP of the 42" is, I think, $3500. That's the number they're considering - retail price. I paid about two thirds of that price for my NEC, five months ago. I bet if they reevaluated the sets for the price I (and many others here) paid, the value would be four or five out of five.

I wanted a Pioneer, but bought the NEC because I bought the best display for my money. I simply couldn't find a set that was better with a range of signals. Now, there's still not a 42" I've seen that can beat the XR4.

Buy from someone with a good return policy, and decide on value yourself!

BOSS10L

11-14-06, 02:31 PM

Looks just fine. :)

No noticeable difference from when the 360 was sending 1080i over component but I figured what the hell.

Same here, if for nothing else than to say I did it. :D

Dufusyte

11-14-06, 03:14 PM

I see Target is selling NEC plasmas online, as well as Pio industrial models.

Who would have thought?

CruelInventions

11-14-06, 03:20 PM

they've been doing that for quite some time, though whenever I've checked, I've never seem them being anywhere near competitive on price.

Unclejeff

11-14-06, 10:26 PM

Speaking of component, I had been using a HDMI/DVI adaptor at the back of my Dish 622 Satellite receiver but the weight of the adaptor finally destroyed my HDMI output so I switched to component. I used the component cables that came with the 622 and then I dug out my VERASTARR HD components and...wow; what a great improvement.

booyaa

12-01-06, 09:59 PM

OK quick question guys....

I have an NEC 50XR5

It says in the manual it supports HD DVD 1080p

Is this true or will my tv downcovert it to 1080i?

In other words is it worth me buying an HD DVD player for my XBOX 360?

jvincent

12-01-06, 10:09 PM

The 50XR5 is a native 768p display.

It will accept 1080p over component and the internal scaler will down-convert it to 768p.

For 1080i material it will de-interlace it to 1080p first and then down-convert it.

booyaa

12-01-06, 10:11 PM

so in essence its not really worth me doing HD DVD on it cause im gonna be seeing it in 768p anyway...

so the bottom line is my tv aint as good as 1080p native sets.....

that sucks..lol

jvincent

12-01-06, 10:16 PM

Not really. 50" 1080p sets only make a difference if you are sitting 6 feet away. HD-DVD will look A LOT better on your XR5 than regular DVD.

booyaa

12-01-06, 10:19 PM

Intertesting. Let me ask you this.. I have a Samsung Home theater system.. HTDS1000

I have a 420p or 720p select button on the back of the dvd player.. so I would get better resolution through an HD DVD than the regular dvd?

i almost pulled the trigger tonight on an xbox 360 hd dvd player but i wanted to ask u guys first..

Unclejeff

12-01-06, 10:37 PM

Hmmmm, shortly after Toshiba introduced the 1080p HD Player, a friend of mine brought it over for a try as he knew that my NEC 50XM5 will receive 1080p via my DVI input. I fed it the pure 1080p and....wow, it was fantastic. This, even though my screen's 'native' resolution is 720p.

There is some magic hereabouts...I can't explain it.

jvincent

12-01-06, 10:47 PM

No magic, HD-DVD has more than twice the resolution of regular DVD.

booyaa

12-01-06, 11:08 PM

again.. you guys are the reason i check here first before making decisions..

thanks again

tdavis21484

12-01-06, 11:25 PM

Is it just me, or do the new NECs (42XR5, 50XR6, 60XR5) look exactly the same as the old sets, and their stats read the same too?

booyaa

12-02-06, 11:58 AM

Guys, OK a little more help please.....

OK I have the NEC 50XR5 and an XBOX 360. Gaming is incredible, HDTV incredible. I love my TV.

BUT

HD DVD playback on the movie that came with my XBOX 360 HD DVD (King Kong) has the black bars above and below...

Normally I wouldnt care - but with IR issues I am just afraid that it will fuk my TV up...

Should I be worried? I am WAYYYYY past the break-in period...

slim

Cleveland Plasma

12-02-06, 12:07 PM

^^^^ IR is just that. Image Retention. This is not a permanent condition or it would be burn in. As long as you are mixing up the viewing material on your NEC, or any other display for that matter, every thing will be just fine.

booyaa

12-02-06, 12:19 PM

OK thanks. So - viewing a 3 hour movie with black bars on the top and the bottom will leave IR - but I dont have to worry about burn in?

Marky_Mark896

12-02-06, 12:27 PM

Chris, isn't it true that IR is the first stages of burn-in though? How long is too long, before you cross the line between IR and permanent?

rhoffman

12-02-06, 12:43 PM

scutfargas

12-04-06, 03:54 PM

I watch letterboxed movies all the time and don't give burn-in a second thought. After a few minutes of full screen viewing, all is well. Enjoy your movie!

andersbk

12-04-06, 06:39 PM

bri1270

12-05-06, 07:20 AM

any news on the next gen. NEC panels release date?

Cleveland Plasma

12-05-06, 07:24 AM

NEC PX-60XR5A ans PX-60XM5A are out. The 50" and 42" will be out late December to early January.

bricknothitback

12-05-06, 08:44 AM

Steve L

12-05-06, 09:08 AM

NEC PX-60XR5A ans PX-60XM5A are out. The 50" and 42" will be out late December to early January.

MSRP and street pricing on these models to be a bit high and out of sync with the competition, or am I mistaken? /steve

Cleveland Plasma

12-05-06, 09:15 AM

As of right now you are right :(

bvader

12-05-06, 10:53 AM

I came across this bit of information in an article I found about the new NEC models being released this winter. Anyone have a better understanding of what this means than I?

"Weight has been considerably reduced, especially in the NEC 50XR6, which weighs nine kilograms less than the predecessor model. This is due to the use of a bonded colour filter instead of a glass filter."

Somewhere back in this thread, I think you can find info on this, but I think the basic jist is there is one less layer of glass, the filter is bonded to the PDP instead of being on/in its own seperate piece of glass. In addition this technology reduces glare/reflections and reduces to zero the extreme off-axis reflections (which is never a problem except if you are view you panel for say ~170deg off axis), since there is one less layer of glass. The NEC 42XR4A uses this technology as well

bri1270

12-05-06, 11:09 AM

MSRP and street pricing on these models to be a bit high and out of sync with the competition, or am I mistaken? /steve

As of right now you are right

Well that sucks!! Hard to spend a substantial amount more than what one can get the Panasonic 50" for nowadays. Depends on the price difference though. I'd consider $300 to $400 more, maybe $500 but beyond that I'd have a hard time justifying the cost vs the benefit.

Cleveland Plasma

12-05-06, 11:19 AM

We were talking about the 60" model.

bri1270

12-05-06, 02:17 PM

okay, then...I take it the 50" isn't quite as distant.

BillW

12-05-06, 05:56 PM

I love NEC but with the Panasonic's so cheap now I bet the difference with the 50 inch is going to be more like 900.00 :( .

JS-44SDS

12-05-06, 09:01 PM

I love NEC but with the Panasonic's so cheap now I bet the difference with the 50 inch is going to be more like 900.00 :( .
Isn't that the difference between the panny and the current 50XR5A right now?

JS-44SDS

12-05-06, 09:02 PM

We were talking about the 60" model.
Is the pricing out yet on the new 50 inch NEC?

Unclejeff

12-05-06, 09:10 PM

andersbk; I have been trying to get the remote in/out ports to work on my NEC with no luck. The manual all but ignores it and nobody hereabouts has responded to my questions.

andersbk

12-05-06, 09:43 PM

Anyone use the 3.5mm Remote In/Out ports on their NEC panel?

I'm looking to use the Remote out to an IR (infra red) connecting block to send IR signals to remote equipment. Something like the Xantech 789-44, which has an IR-RCVR input would maybe work?

any comments? anyone doing this?

TIA,
-anders.

Here's what Xantech tech support has given me so far. This relates to the "IR RCVR" port on their IR expanding connecting blocks. I am going to try NEC tech support...who knows what I'll get there?@!?

The stereo mini jack spec: tip=IR, ring = ground, and sleeve = 12v.

So, no-one who has this panel, 42 or 50, uses the "Remote Out" port then?

No-one? Anyone...anyone? Bueller?

-anders.

Unclejeff

12-08-06, 11:34 PM

Anders;

I asked that question a month ago....still no response. You might send an Email to NEC; I understand customer support is realy good. If you learn anything, please let me know.

Dufusyte

12-12-06, 04:26 PM

Is it just me, or do the new NECs (42XR5, 50XR6, 60XR5) look exactly the same as the old sets, and their stats read the same too?
The new 50" uses the bonded filter, so that is a difference from the current 50".

The new 60" uses some new "high contrast" technology that is supposed to produce great blacks. I think this is kind of a guinnea pig this year. Still no bonded filter (fwiw).

The new 42" probably has the least changes from the previous year, since the 42xr4a already had the bonded filter; just slightly better power consumption.

My theory is that since Pioneer owns the glass factory, Pioneer calls the shots to a large extent (mind you, NEC is still an independent company, but they are kind of at Pioneer's mercy, since Pioneer is making the glass). My conspiracy theory is that Pioneer likes to use NEC as a guinnea pig by piloting a new technology on one NEC model (and apparently NEC agrees to this). Last time it was the NEC 42xr4a that was the experimental bonded filter, which worked out really great, so Pioneer proceeded to implement the bonded filter on all the Pioneer models afterward. This time the new technology is the "high contrast" thing-a-mabob, which is appearing first on the NEC 60". If it works out, you can bet Pioneer will use all the high contrast glass on their next models.

techjunky2

12-20-06, 04:46 PM

Hello friends! Still loving my Xr5! I was wondering if anyone here knows if the NFL network in HD is broadcast in 1080i or 720p? I'm having company over for the game and want to make sure the XR5 performs flawless. Thanks!

rhoffman

12-20-06, 05:15 PM

I don't get it so I don't know if it's 720p or 1080i. What I do know is that any HD channel looks awesome regardless of the broadcast so I don't know why you would be worried.

itigap

12-20-06, 06:02 PM

The new 50" uses the bonded filter, so that is a difference from the current 50".

The new 60" uses some new "high contrast" technology that is supposed to produce great blacks. I think this is kind of a guinnea pig this year. Still no bonded filter (fwiw).

The new 42" probably has the least changes from the previous year, since the 42xr4a already had the bonded filter; just slightly better power consumption.

My theory is that since Pioneer owns the glass factory, Pioneer calls the shots to a large extent (mind you, NEC is still an independent company, but they are kind of at Pioneer's mercy, since Pioneer is making the glass). My conspiracy theory is that Pioneer likes to use NEC as a guinnea pig by piloting a new technology on one NEC model (and apparently NEC agrees to this). Last time it was the NEC 42xr4a that was the experimental bonded filter, which worked out really great, so Pioneer proceeded to implement the bonded filter on all the Pioneer models afterward. This time the new technology is the "high contrast" thing-a-mabob, which is appearing first on the NEC 60". If it works out, you can bet Pioneer will use all the high contrast glass on their next models.

Actually it is the other way around. Pioneer has had a bonded filter for all of their displays for a couple of generations now. When Pioneer bought the NEC Plasma Division in 2004, some of their glass specifications such as their first surface bonded filter began to be incorporated into their newly acquired glass making facilities. NEC purchases their glass from Pioneer and as lines are converted NEC models are acquiring this technology. Last year it made it into the small size (42"). 2007 sees it migrating to the 50". The 60" still has the older glass. Its only the marketing literature that makes everything sound "new" and the latest even if its a carry over from years ago. Aha the power of marketing!

IMO the first surface filter of Pioneer was always a good thing and should make the NECs even better.

Pioneer actually has two grades of filter one used on their standard and commercial series and another more advanced use on their Elite series. I don't know for sure which is used on the NEC and don't know how we would ever find out except from a covert operator on the inside. Sorry, I have been living too close to the CIA for too long. ;)

Cheers, :)

Gary

JS-44SDS

12-20-06, 06:40 PM

Is it just me, or do the new NECs (42XR5, 50XR6, 60XR5) look exactly the same as the old sets, and their stats read the same too?
When are they coming out for gods sake...they missed Christmas. How do you know what they look like since they aren't on the NEC site yet. Is their info. on the net about the 50XR6a...I cant find any.

caeguy

12-20-06, 07:14 PM

When are they coming out for gods sake...they missed Christmas. How do you know what they look like since they aren't on the NEC site yet. Is their info. on the net about the 50XR6a...I cant find any.

Spec Sheet here (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/cms/documents/ColorBrochures/NEC100606.pdf)

CruelInventions

12-20-06, 07:41 PM

Actually it is the other way around. Pioneer has had a bonded filter for all of their displays for a couple of generations now.

umm, wait a darn second. Their 42" commercial 425cmx panel which came out in early 2006 doesn't have the bonded glass. It's their latest generation commercial/industrial model.

Dufusyte

12-20-06, 09:04 PM

Pioneer has had a bonded filter for all of their displays for a couple of generations now.

Pioneer actually has two grades of filter one used on their standard and commercial series and another more advanced use on their Elite series.
Gary, can you point to any documents/brochures supporting these statements?

The Pio 425cmx (with 5th gen glass) shows on their brochure an illustration with two panes of glass and no mention of a first surface filter (NEC calls the same tech a "bonded filter").

And alot of industry professionals on this board state that the panel glass is the same in the Pio 50" consumer (5070) industrial (507cmx) and Elite (1140) - only the video processing is different.

Kindly link to some support for your affirmations. Thanks!

itigap

12-20-06, 10:29 PM

Gary, can you point to any documents/brochures supporting these statements?

The Pio 425cmx (with 5th gen glass) shows on their brochure an illustration with two panes of glass and no mention of a first surface filter (NEC calls the same tech a "bonded filter").

And alot of industry professionals on this board state that the panel glass is the same in the Pio 50" consumer (5070) industrial (507cmx) and Elite (1140) - only the video processing is different.

Kindly link to some support for your affirmations. Thanks!

Dufusyte,

No problem happy to oblige.

Pioneer is now in their 7th generation (the "7" in 5070 and 507cmx). I said that they have been using the single pane first surface bonded filter for a "couple of generations now". That would be their 6th and 7th generations. I made no assertions about their 5th generation glass but I know that they did not use the single pane for that or earlier generations.

If and only if you consider the bonded filter layer, and that is all I have discussed, as part of "the glass" then these industry professionals no matter who they are are mistaken and mis-speaking. However, the guts of the glass are indeed the same and that is what I am sure these people are trying to generally convey.

Pioneer in order to differentiate their Elite series does indeed use a different bonded filter layer on that series. I have the literature in front of me and you can simply go to their web site and pull up their brochure. (Sorry I don't know how to embed a link) They designate their Elite filter with the term "pro" in its name.

I believe that Pioneer, at least, uses the term "bonded" to convey that their filter is adhered directly to the plasma glass rather than as part of a separate glass filter pane. If I am mistaken here someone can correct me.

Hope this helps. Sorry that I was not clearer about the specific generations for which Pioneer has used their single pane glass technology.

BTW this really is a superior approach. Just watch credits rolling at the end of a movie from an oblique angle on a normal display and on a Pioneer. The difference is startling. ;)

Cheers, :)

Gary

KLee

12-21-06, 08:43 AM

Dufusyte,

No problem happy to oblige.

Pioneer is now in their 7th generation (the "7" in 5070 and 507cmx). I said that they have been using the single pane first surface bonded filter for a "couple of generations now". That would be their 6th and 7th generations. I made no assertions about their 5th generation glass but I know that they did not use the single pane for that or earlier generations.

If and only if you consider the bonded filter layer, and that is all I have discussed, as part of "the glass" then these industry professionals no matter who they are are mistaken and mis-speaking. However, the guts of the glass are indeed the same and that is what I am sure these people are trying to generally convey.

Pioneer in order to differentiate their Elite series does indeed use a different bonded filter layer on that series. I have the literature in front of me and you can simply go to their web site and pull up their brochure. (Sorry I don't know how to embed a link) They designate their Elite filter with the term "pro" in its name.

I believe that Pioneer, at least, uses the term "bonded" to convey that their filter is adhered directly to the plasma glass rather than as part of a separate glass filter pane. If I am mistaken here someone can correct me.

Hope this helps. Sorry that I was not clearer about the specific generations for which Pioneer has used their single pane glass technology.

BTW this really is a superior approach. Just watch credits rolling at the end of a movie from an oblique angle on a normal display and on a Pioneer. The difference is startling. ;)

Cheers, :)

Gary

So would a Pioneer 507CMX use the "Pro" filter of an Elite PRO 1140HD, or the "regular" filter of a PDP 5070HD?

itigap

12-21-06, 10:25 AM

So would a Pioneer 507CMX use the "Pro" filter of an Elite PRO 1140HD, or the "regular" filter of a PDP 5070HD?
From the printed Pioneer literature I have sitting in front of me, available from their web site, the 7th gen commercial Pioneer panels (x07cmx) use Pioneer's normal filter not the "pro" version reserved apparently for their Elite series.

The normal filter supposedly yields a 10% improvement while the pro version on the Elite yields a 20% improvement.

Warning rant ahead ................................................

Don't you just love how marketing never makes clear just what the improvement is relative to? Could be a first gen display!

Just like when the brochure refers to a feature as "New........". Ever notice the New is capitalized and often trademarked as part of the official name of the feature. That way it becomes part of the noun and is not an adjective. They then carry over that named feature for many generations and each generation it reads the same "New......" or "Improved........" giving the impression that each year there is something new or improved when in reality it is the same feature that came out many years ago without change since. Just gotta love all this marketing!

Where I live, you would never hear this type of deceptive, deceitful, disingenuous language. :D :D :D :D

Rant over ............................................................ ................

Cheers, :)

Gary

Dufusyte

12-21-06, 11:00 AM

they have been using the single pane first surface bonded filter for a "couple of generations now". That would be their 6th and 7th generations.
From the Pio 5060 brochure (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pio/pe/images/portal/cit_3424/279204123Pioneer-PDP-5060HD.pdf):
1st Surface Pure Color Filter for enhanced contrast and accurate color reproduction. The non-glass filter is bonded directly to the plasma panel reducing light reflection and refraction for a more accurate image.
From the Pio 5070 brochure (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pio/pe/images/portal/cit_3424/318514630PDP-5070.pdf):
New First-Surface Pure Color Filter for enhanced contrast, color and reduction in light reflection on screen
There you have it, folks!

CruelInventions

12-21-06, 11:14 AM

Pioneer is now in their 7th generation (the "7" in 5070 and 507cmx). I said that they have been using the single pane first surface bonded filter for a "couple of generations now". That would be their 6th and 7th generations. I made no assertions about their 5th generation glass but I know that they did not use the single pane for that or earlier generations.

Re: Pio 425cmx - I find it utterly amazing that a panel released in THIS YEAR, 2006, can somehow manage to be a 5th generation panel, 2 WHOLE GENERATIONS OLD. How is this possible?!?! :eek:

anyway, back to our regularly scheduled NEC talk. or not.

Cleveland Plasma

12-21-06, 11:41 AM

^^^^ Or not for a second. Last years 434CMX was last years model, as the 4360HD was too. This year the 425CMX was born and cannot be based on a older model as Pioneer did not make a 42" prior. So I think they are calling it 5th generation but would have to be based on something else for sure, but what?? Maybe it should be named 427cmx.

Back too NEC:
Nec 50XM6A are out but not the 50XR6A. Both 60" models are out. No new 42" models as of yet.

CruelInventions

12-21-06, 12:15 PM

itigap

12-21-06, 01:15 PM

So maybe the 425cmx was Pioneers mutant bastard panel child, with brand-spanking new 7th generation "guts" (or near equivalent), but with older hand-me-down glass? Afterall, everyone seems to be in agreement that this panel doesn't use the bonded glass.

And if the above is all true, perhaps Pio's panel naming scheme opts to define model generation primarily based upon glass age, regardless of the age of internal components. :confused:

EDIT: ok, I see now. because their last 42/43 commercial panel was only fourth generation, even if this 425cmx model used brand new glass and new electronics, and exactly the same as what is being used in the 506cmx or 507cmx models, it would still be considered 5th generation because only 4 generations of a 43"(now 42") commercial panel had come before it.

The larger size 50" consumer and commercial/industrial versions evidently had a couple more model generations, for whatever reason (I would think the 43/42 inch models would have had a longer generational run, given that the 50" models probably got off to a slower start, being much more expensive and difficult to make intially). *scampers away in perplexity*

I think you have part of it. Pioneer skipped a generation, in naming at least, with their commercial display. The 505cmx was superceeded recently by their 507cmx. There was no 506cmx, no 6th generation. I do think you are correct and at least for a while Pioneer keyed off of their glass to make model numbers; or maybe someone in marketing just flips a coin. It has seemed the past couple of years that there has been some mix and match between glass and guts; all I am sure to keep us sorts crazy.

Can't argue with the results, pictures are better and prices are certainly better.

All is good.

Cheers, :)

Gary

itigap

12-21-06, 01:18 PM

From the Pio 5060 brochure (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pio/pe/images/portal/cit_3424/279204123Pioneer-PDP-5060HD.pdf):

From the Pio 5070 brochure (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pio/pe/images/portal/cit_3424/318514630PDP-5070.pdf):

There you have it, folks!
Dufusyte,

Thanks for the quotes.

How do you place the quoted boxes into a post? I still have a lot to learn about posting.

Cheers, :)

Gary

tt18cabrio

12-22-06, 10:24 PM

Where can you find an 50" NEC to view. Was looking at the Fujitsu (too expensive...for me) then one of the Pioneers until someone started singing the praises of the NEC. The more I read and search the more I realize I have no clue which plasma to buy. I am looking to purchase in FEB/March '07. tia

Cleveland Plasma

12-22-06, 10:27 PM

Do you live near a NEC dealer? <<<CLICK HERE>>> (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/LocateDealer/)

markrubin

12-23-06, 05:29 PM

sticky

DAB

12-29-06, 01:02 PM

HAPPY BIRTHDAY- to my 50 NEC XR5, Still going strong & PQ is stuninng.
* purchased from AVS sponsor-still very happy
db

Cleveland Plasma

12-29-06, 03:56 PM

NEC even received the honor of a *Sticky*.

lipcrkr

12-31-06, 04:36 AM

I think somewhere back in this thread someone left a frozen image on their screen overnight. After several hours of continuous motion the image retention went away. I wouldn't be too worried about some IR.

So, during those several hours of watching a football game or 4 star movie you are stuck with the previous IR until it goes away. IR may not be permanent but if you are watching something while trying to get rid of the previous IR what kind of enjoyment is that?

rhoffman

12-31-06, 11:29 AM

Well, I wouldn't recommend leaving a static image on your screen, but if you did I like the comfort of knowing that it won't cause burn-in. In the normal course of viewing, image retention is not a problem with this TV.

JS-44SDS

12-31-06, 05:05 PM

Well.....so much for the new 50 NEC to come out by the end of December...Does anyone have a hard date or is it just conjecture when we will see/buy it?

Cleveland Plasma

01-02-07, 12:29 PM

Late January for the 50XR6A.

Also the IR on the NEC is not that bad. Yes there is some as there is on any screen. If I am on a channel with a logo in the corner for a few hours and flip to a black screen yes you may be able to see it, however if a person moves to another channel the IR is not that devastating that it can be seen.

jiboomba

01-03-07, 05:36 PM

I already see it on the website....

tterral

01-03-07, 07:08 PM

jiboomba

01-04-07, 03:24 AM

jvincent

01-04-07, 09:04 AM

Also, is it a drawback that built-in tuners are absent in NEC plasmas?

For some people yes, for others no. If you have cable or satellite then having a built-in tuner really doesn't add any value.

itigap

01-04-07, 10:25 AM

Has anyone seen the 50XR6? It has been introduced and is already on the website.

What is the difference between the 50XR5 and 50XR6? What other brands does the 50XR6 compare with? Also, is it a drawback that built-in tuners are absent in NEC plasmas?

Thanks.
I have been looking over and comparing the brochures for both for a few weeks. As I see it, there are two differences. One is major, the glass. Last year (2006 models) the 42" acquired the Pioneer single rather than double glass design with the filter layer bonded as film to a single pane of glass. This year, the 50" gets the same glass but not the 60" which keeps a double pane design. This single pane eliminates 19lbs in the 50" display and eliminates the extra internal reflection which could clearly be seen when viewed from an oblique angle on high contrast material such as movie credits and other text. I am expecting this to be a visible improvement. NEC also claims extra brightness from this filter design.

The second could be either good or bad and there is probably no way to tell until and unless someone with a 50xr5 gets a 50xr6 and does a close comparison. NEC is, according to the brochures, abandoning their Gamma 12 processing that represented color (calculations) in 12 bits yielding around 68 billion colors. The extra bits help preserve accuracy through rounding and truncation operations in transformation calculations in the color processing and decoding. This year (2007) NEC is regressing to 10 bit processing. This is obviously significant since it indicates new processor silicon e.g. a new processor.

The reason this processor change concerns me so much is that the entire reason for me to get a NEC is its superior processing as evidenced in the 2006 displays. I do want the benefit of the new glass but the processing is the main thing. I am concerned that NEC may have taken a step backward in its processor perhaps for cost reasons or even, along with the glass, OEMing it from Pioneer which also uses 10 bits. Who knows and I doubt they would tell. On the surface at least, it does not appear to be an improvement but rather a step back in the display's most important sub-component.

Like always, the brochure is not clear as to which input(s) support which input resolutions so there may be a change in 1080p support but you cannot tell by the brochure.

The manual is virtually the same. The Low Tone control has lost a setting (Mode3) for a special dithering algorithm. The excellent set of other adjustments remains the same as do the six adjustment memory positions. The manual still sucks for detail and clarity but what manual doesn't.

Hope this goes a way toward answering your question.

Cheers, :)

Gary

Trackman

01-04-07, 11:49 AM

For some people yes, for others no. If you have cable or satellite then having a built-in tuner really doesn't add any value.

Not necessarily - the OTA tuners in many sets are much better than those in Sat STBs, both in terms of signal sensitivity and picture quality. I much prefer getting locals with my tvs tuner versus the Sat tuner.

Also, having 2 tuners allows for PIP or split screen with local channels.

jvincent

01-04-07, 12:15 PM

I was thinking of folks like me in the Great White North where OTA service is pretty much non-existant / worthless unless you live in the southernmost part of Ontario.

Cleveland Plasma

01-04-07, 01:20 PM

Chris,

Since the 50XR6A uses the same glass/filter that the current 42" model uses, would you expect the IR to be significantly less than the current 50" NEC. It is my understanding that this glass/filter combo puts the NECs int the same class as Pioneer/Paany/etc. in terms of IR. This should be the case, keep in mind I feel the IR is not that bad. Every panel has IR.

How do you feel the detail/sharpness level of the current (and new if you have seen one) 50" NEC compares to the Samsung 5053/5073 models? To me, the Sammys have some of the best detail of any plasma close to it's price range. While the Pioneers are great, the picture is a little too soft for me. The NEC is in a diferent class then the Samsung. The Samsung is a great unit, but a far cry from NEC overall.Tim Terral

Just a note: The NEC 50XR5A had a nice price drop too.:)

CruelInventions

01-05-07, 04:28 AM

I am concerned that NEC may have taken a step backward in its processor perhaps for cost reasons or even, along with the glass, OEMing it from Pioneer which also uses 10 bits. Who knows and I doubt they would tell. On the surface at least, it does not appear to be an improvement but rather a step back in the display's most important sub-component.

For whatever it's worth, while the consumer Pios have the 10 bit, their current commercials, such as the 507cmx Pio, feature 12 bit processing (according to that panels pdf literature anyway).

Dufusyte

01-05-07, 11:35 AM

NEC's TheaterSync (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/cms/documents/ColorBrochures/NEC060605.pdf) (external video processor) is also 10 bit.

The 42XR4 (http://necvisualsystems.com/cms/documents/ColorBrochures/NEC100519.pdf) may have been the spiffiest panel as it has the 12 bit processing and the single pane bonded filter.

and I got one :)

rubinjm

01-06-07, 11:26 AM

I have a 50XM5. Is it preferable to set the output of my STB (DirecTV HR20-700) to Native?

rubinjm

01-06-07, 02:38 PM

I currently have an NEC 50XM5 that has an HDCP-compliant DVI input that is 1080p capable. It's connected to a DirecTV HD-DVR via HDMI-DVI cable. In the future I will be adding either BR or HD DVD & Apple's forthcoming component that will use HDMI. So--I will need to buy a new receiver that can do HDMI switching.

Do I need to look for anything in particular relative to HDMI switching given that the PDP has a DVI connector?

IncraTL

01-06-07, 06:22 PM

123654789[QUOTE=Cleveland Plasma]Here it is in a nut shell! When my NEC is on and fierd up I have an ear to ear smile and it just will not go away, kinda like buying a new Formula One Boat. Take a look below. They are smiling !

Hi, Chris:
I'm new to this forum so please bear with me. Anyway, I'm in the process of building a two zone, (zone 1, 2 subs, 5.1), (zone 2, stero, 1sub) and would like to use the NEC 50" plasma NEC-PX50XR6, NEC's TheaterSync & OTA reception.
My questions are -

What 1 would I need to do to the OTA signal so I could send it through the TheaterSync, (for video processing & scaling), then to the plasma, (for PIP)?
Is this even possible?

Is the TheaterSync only for non-OTA installations?

Does the audio output on the XR6 support 5.1 audio?

Thanks for your time with this,

George

Cleveland Plasma

01-07-07, 09:33 PM

123654789[QUOTE=Cleveland Plasma]Here it is in a nut shell! When my NEC is on and fierd up I have an ear to ear smile and it just will not go away, kinda like buying a new Formula One Boat. Take a look below. They are smiling ! That is an old post, but a good one. I think the thought is lost unless you.... <<<CLICK HERE>>> (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8308188&&#post8308188)

What 1 would I need to do to the OTA signal so I could send it through the TheaterSync, (for video processing & scaling), then to the plasma, (for PIP)?
Is this even possible? Anything is possible. Your best bet would be to buy a seperate HD tuner.
Is the TheaterSync only for non-OTA installations? Nope, with the right setup the NEC TheaterSync (<<CLICK HERE>>>) (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/Products/Product/?product=342410a9-72e8-4e9f-b0bb-60cb62ada326) can be used. By the way nice choice is scalers!! One of the best!!
Does the audio output on the XR6 support 5.1 audio? This should not even be an issue as audio will be ran sraight to your audio devises. Audio is Audio/Video is Video
Thanks for your time with this,

George

:)

netarc

01-08-07, 02:59 AM

I think you'll find that 1360 x 768 will work on VGA but that's as close as you'll get. 1:1 will require that you leave a few unused horizontal pixels black.

NEC and Fuji have both done this for some time, not sure why. A few generations back, NEC created the 1365 x 768 timing but it will only work over DVI/HDMI according to NEC.
I've been using 1360x768 over VGA w/my XR5a (from a Vista MCE/HP z558 with nVidia 6600GT vid card) for a month now with success - the only issue, as others have reported is the black (or in my case, gray since I jacked up the background color on the XR5) bars on the side.

Today I tried using the 6600GT's DVI out (DVI-to-HDMI cable) into the XR5 ... although 720p (1280x720) worked, it resulted in the desktop being completely overscanned, and I couldn't resolve this using the NEC's size/centering controls. The 1360x768 option was available, but when enabling this the display would suddenly act as if it was seeing a 1080i input, and the desktop image would go to hell (very blurry, broken up text).

I then installed Powerstrip, and entered the following custom timing:
1365x768=1365,51,50,60,768,4,4,12,72149,33
to try to achieve the fabled 1:1 native rate. Upon reboot, the 1365x768 option appeared in the Windows resolution list, but upon selecting this the image was still very overscanned, and just looked crappy overall. When I checked the XR5's "signal info" function, it showed the input as Hfreq 33.8Khz / Vfreq 60Hz / mem 94 / res 1920x1080. For some reason I can't fathom, the above Powerstrip setting is causing 1080i mode?!?

Weirder still .... even selecting a non-Powerstrip 1360x768 vid mode (via HDMI) causes the NEC to go into the above "mem 94" 1080i mode!!

I've tried multiple reboots, killing the custom entry and recreating it (both by hand, as well as the "paste" function), using the predefined entries (that are close to this custom res) ... but any resolution I try ends up causing a 1080i input! That is, other than 1280x720 ... if I select this, then the input is a 720p input.

Does anyone have any ideas what could be going on, or run into this? Major difference here is that I'm running Vista - though I've tried this with the two most recent nVidia drivers - 9.6.8.5 (10/9/2006) and 7.15.10.9746 (12/7/2006).

netarc

01-08-07, 03:46 AM

for the time being I've gone back to using VGA, which allows me to run 1360x768 w/o issues ... but if anyone has any thoughts re: the "can't get 1:1 via HDMI/DVI" issue above, please shout out!

jvincent

01-08-07, 08:41 AM

netarc,

To get 1:1 mapping you need to use the Nvidia custom timing panel. There are instructions buried somewhere in this thread.

Essentially what you need to do is define a 1368x768 resolution with custom timing. In the custom timing panel select flat panel scaling and use 1365 as the back end active number.

Note that the new Nvidia control panel bites. You will save yourself a lot of frustration by using the classic control panel.

netarc

01-08-07, 12:26 PM

To get 1:1 mapping you need to use the Nvidia custom timing panel. There are instructions buried somewhere in this thread.

Essentially what you need to do is define a 1368x768 resolution with custom timing. In the custom timing panel select flat panel scaling and use 1365 as the back end active number.

Note that the new Nvidia control panel bites. You will save yourself a lot of frustration by using the classic control panel.
I had read that some folks are using the nvidia driver itself to create the custom timing profile, but also thought I'd read that other folks had success using powerstrip.

Unfortunately, the current nvidia for Vista drivers don't have (at least, that I could find) a custom timing option i nthe control panel ... truly, their current "control panel" does bite, but I don;t think they've retained the "classic" control panel in the Vista driver (again, not that I could find).