I know some of you have started receiving your new NEC plasmas and many more have them on order (myself included). Please share any reviews, knowledge, experiences, pics, or comparisons that you may have. Many of us are looking forward to what you have to say!

Here's some pics of the new NEC's...

http://www.nec.se/upload/bilder/produkter/Plasma/Nya%20modeller%2020051114/Plasma%20Display%20_2.jpg

http://www.nec.se/upload/bilder/produkter/Plasma/Nya%20modeller%2020051114/Plasma%20Display%20_1.jpg

http://www.nec.se/upload/bilder/produkter/Plasma/Nya%20modeller%2020051114/Plasma%20Display%20_3.jpg

Here's an early review from Tony17 to get us going...

Okay, I have tried to do as comprehensive of a review I could on my new NEC 50XR5. I've tried to hit all of the topics that interested me, or those that have been posed as an interest by others. However, please let me know if I've left out anything that someone would like a review on.

Overview - As a quick overview, here is a list of my equipment for a reference point to what I am reviewing;

-NEC 50XR5
-Harman Kardon AVR 235
-HR10-250 hooked up via HDMI (DirecTV HDTIVO for those that don't know the model number)
-VERY CHEAP Toshiba SD-3890 DVD player hooked up direct with component cables. (I tried all the upconverting ones with my old TV and found the NEC scaler to be superior so I stuck with the old 480i). Plus that was an EDTV and any difference may not have been able to be seen (that's another debate). Maybe someone else can do a test of upconverting players with this panel, but I'm gonna put my money on the NEC scaler for now.
-Gamecube hooked up through my AVR via component cables

Asthetics- I am going to start with the aesthetics of the panel, because this is the first thing that caught my eye when removing this thing from the box. I must say that this is one sexy looking panel, even the wife was impressed. It has a mostly a matte black finish, however it is set off nicely with a subtle silver trim around the entire outside and very nice chrome/silver across the bottom. In my opinion, the best looking commercial plasma out there right now - I'm very pleased with the look in my living room. P.S. - anyone with the space for a 50" and is considering getting a 42"...DON'T, the extra real estate is well worth it!

Calibration - Before I go into my review of different sources, the only calibrations I have done so far are to adjust the contrast and brightness on the HDTIVO using the HDNET test pattern and on the DVD using the AVIA calibration disk. The colors were right on out of the box according to those tests.

Standard Definition - Well, I'm starting the review with the SD pic quality, but this is by far the weakest link of this panel. I am coming from a 42VR5 for which the SD pic quality was very good. That was a 42" EDTV, so I was expecting the SD picture on the 50" HDTV to be much less desirable. So, I powered up the panel and put on FX (usually pretty decent quality for SD) and was pleasantly surprised - just as good as my VR5. "Let me turn to one of my local DirecTV channels I thought to myself" (as these are usually the most compressed channels DTV sends), but wow this looked decent as well - and this time it may have edged my VR5. NEC definitely uses a good scaler in these new panels, as I must say SD on this TV is VERY good for a 50" HD plasma. Of course, I have no reference point to other 50" panels, but I can tell you when I was searching in March for my 42VR5, the only panel I had found with a better scaler was the Fujitsu (and that was a marginal difference at best). Definitely have to give kudos to the panel on this one! I'm gonna put it on par if not better than the Fujitsu here. Stretch modes: This is another one of the advantages I give NEC over any other panel. Stadium stretch on 4:3 material is great. I don't know how they do it, but you really do forget your watching stretched material when using Stadium. Zoom mode on a letterboxed 4:3 channel fills the screen perfectly as well. Lastly, the ability to stretch HD (720p and 1080i) is priceless. There are many shows that I record on HD channels that are broadcast in SD because the picture quality on them is better then the SD channels. Being able to stretch these is priceless to me, I don't think I could have a panel which I couldn't do that on.

Gaming - I'll have to admit I don't have much to add in this area. I don't have XBOX or PS2, just a measly Gamecube that was given to my son for xmas last year. I have it hooked up with component cables through my Harman Kardon AVR. I popped in Frogger and MarioKart. Not to my surprise, it did very well with the 480i signal here as well. I'm sure feeding this panel 720p or higher games would look exceptional, but again I don't have these systems.

DVD - Again, all that I have is a measly $50 Toshiba player. I've found the best results were feeding the TV a 480i signal. Again, the NEC has a great scaler so I am not surprised it was better then the Toshiba's. Color reproduction and details were exceptional. When viewing animated movies like Incredibles or Madagascar on this panel I was amazed. These movies looked GREAT on my VR5, but that was no surprise at it was the native resolution of the TV, but I think they look just as good if not better on the XR5 (a little more 3 dimensional maybe). Un-animated (probably not even a real word, but what the heck) movies look great as well. Popped in War of the Worlds and Collateral and was impressed by the details in most scenes of Collateral. This is a very dark movie, but the NEC handled it very well, no macroblocking or any other noticeable noise. War of the Worlds looked great too. Scenes like the robots coming out of the ground were awesome and it handled the dark scenes very well in this movie as well. Unfortunately that is all the time I had to review for the DVD's but will try to test some others out when I get more time. Most of my viewing is HD, so I'll move onto that;

HD - Well, unlike the SD not being the weakest part of the panel as the first part of my review, I definitely saved the best for last here. I am just taken back by how well this panel displays details in images on HD material. The only channel I have from DirecTV in HD is HBO (their HD offering is not worth $10.95 in my opinion), so most of my analysis is done from OTA material. There is just something about this panel (and other NEC's for that matter) that seem to just give it an edge in my opinion. When I am watching shows on friends Panasonic's and even Pioneer's sometimes I find myself saying "wow...that is just an awesome picture from a television". However, many times when watching shows on my NEC I find myself so involved in the show and simply lifelike colors/skin tones that I forget I'm even watching a television. I guess with the Panny I can always just see that I am looking at glass with an image behind it, whereas here I just feel like I'm looking at the people. Hard to explain, hopefully that made some sense.

Image Retention - I've not noticed anything significant in this area to be worried about. If something is on the screen for a few minutes and you change to a black screen you see a faint outline of it....but as soon as you change the channel and come back it is gone. I remember my VR5 was like this for the first couple of weeks and now I never get any retention. I think this is been exaggerated as well....I don't think it is really an issue if it goes away with the next screen. Now, if previous models had problems where you could see it over top of new images, then that would be a problem, and I can confirm this has never happened to me.

Overall Pic Quality (Black Level, and Color) - I think most who've seen an NEC can agree that there is nothing left to be desired when it comes to colors and color reproduction. I think that NEC's produce the most lifelike colors and skin tones compared to the Panasonic and Pioneer. Some say Pioneer isn't really lifelike and some say Panny can be a bit too soft, but I really feel that NEC strikes the perfect balance. If possible, I think this panel does even better than the previous models with the color reproduction. When talking to one of the NEC customer service reps a while back I think I recall him saying that they have done some enhancement to the color filter on the glass, and I think it shows, not only with the colors, but with the black level as well. I have tried to evaluate the black levels on this panel as much as possible over the past day, as I know this is a topic that many would like to hear about (a bit overrated in my opinion) but nonetheless very relevant. The absolute black level is definitely improved (at least over my VR5, as I've never seen an XR4). I would definitely put it in the same league as the Panasonic and new Pioneer. I really think you would need to put them side by side to see an absolute black level difference in the panels (but my gut is the Panny would still barely edge it out). However, where I see the advantage, and I see this as a huge advantage, is in the shadow details. To me the Panasonic may have the ability to show an absolute black level that is closer to true black, but you lose many of the details in the picture. To me, I'd rather have a panel with a black level that is 98% as black as the Panasonic, while showing 10% more of the details. I watch a lot of OTA HD, which may be one of the reasons I didn't hinge my whole plasma purchase on an absolute black level, as most of the primetime shows don't have that many dark scenes. However, even with shows like "Lost" (which I had previously recorded) where almost entire episodes are shot in the dark, I did not feel that there were any inadequacies.

Overall I am going to put this panel at the top of the list for those I've seen in person. I think the picture quality/scaling is up to par (if not better) with the Fujitsu and I think the aesthetics are second to none (NEC did a great job here). Two HDMI's, PIP, direct input settings, stretch modes and various other features make this an exceptional panel. They say it is designed for ISF calibration too, but after watching this thing for a day now I can't see it getting much better .....WELL DONE NEC!

Issues – I have to say that I don’t have many issues yet. One thing that did annoy me was the fact you need to have an ISF calibration done in order to “activate” the night and day picture settings. That was really lame on NEC’s part in my opinion. They trust the consumer a lot by allowing the myriad of picture setting changes available on the this tv, and then they take that away. Hopefully someone will figure it out in the future.

Disclaimer - Please remember this is only one man's opinion. Please don't base your decision on my eyes, trust your own...I know this is something that is hard to do with the NEC's because there so hard to find in person, but maybe after more people have had a chance to review these new panels, they can confirm what I see. Also, I was basing all of my comparisons off of viewing I have done in peoples homes and in A/V shops, I was not able to do “side by side” comparisons.

Pictures – will post some when I get a chance to borrow a friend’s camera. Chris at Clevelandplasma offered to host them for me…so hopefully I can get them to him soon.

I had the Panny 50phd8uk on order, but I ultimately decided to cancel it and placed an order for the NEC 50xr5 instead. I don't know how likely it would be for somebody to do a side by side comparison of the two, but I'd love to see a review like that.

Both plasmas turned out to be very close in price (NEC seems to have a thing about their resellers only showing the msrp for their plasmas so I had to "add the item to cart" in order to see the actual price at the websites I went to).

I made my decision mostly on the notions that NEC is often regarded as having better video processing than Panasonic and the NEC comes with better connections for sure. Also, the NEC comes with a better warranty. The NEC bezel looks more attractive to me as well, but isn't something that matters a great deal to me. My biggest concern is if the NEC glass is on par with the Panasonic glass though? I'd love to know how the side by side PQ is between the two (sd, hd, dvd, and computer).

NEC 50xr5 specs
http://www.necvisualsystems.com/Products/Product/?product=8aac5582-4062-4352-9be4-61e01e59df43
Panasonic 50phd8uk
http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ModelDetail?storeId=11201&catalogId=13051&itemId=94540&catGroupId=14624&surfModel=TH-50PHD8UK&displayTab=O

My 50XR5 was supposed to be here tomorrow but I guess the holiday has delayed it. :mad: It should be here on Thursday and I hope to have it up that night (mount and wiring is already in place). I hope to have a rather comprehensive review done by the weekend.

Mine should be here with in this week. Holidays delayed the delivery date.
Many of us purchased it with out seeing one, or even reading a review the specifications are impressive.

.Price wise it is only couple of hundreds dollars more than other brands in circuit city .My neighbor got a Panasonic Plasma that is the only one I can compare with. I do hope I made a good decision.

My primary interest is SD TV.
Every day I am looking for a review.

In my opinion the 50xr5 may end up being the best 50" plasma bar none. The minimalistic looks are understated. Matte black frame with silver surround. No tuner, no speakers, who cares. Most Home Theater buffs don't need or want that stuff. Put the money in the processing and display. This plasma has HD aspect control, 2 HDMI and 1 PC inputs, PIP, native resolution support, direct input select, designed for ISF, advanced color adjustment, 3 year standard warranty, WOW! I was told from NEC that the contrast was increased to 3000:1 and they are a very conservative company, you won't even see this spec published. They are also considered one of the best in video processing, on par or better than Fujitsu, but this panel lists for thousands less and can be bought over the internet.

This could end up being one on the most popular threads on the forum. Bring on the reviews... :D

http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/502/50XR5_QuarterView-2_Small_.jpg

I agree. NEC is on the move!!

I was told from NEC that the contrast was increased to 3000:1 and they are a very conservative company, you won't even see this spec published. This plasma has HD scaling, 2 HDMI and PC inputs, PIP, native resolution support, direct input select, designed for ISF, advanced color adjustment, 2 year standard warranty, WOW!


I think they actually have a 3yr parts/labor warranty for everything but panel replacement which is 1 yr. This is according to their website.

My 50XR5 should be here soon. :)

I have a Panny TH-50PX50U currently so I should be able to give a good comparison.

This thing is going to be hot product. People are busy with panasonic and pioneer and don't know what they are missing.
I like the minimalistic design.
Mine should be here within a week or so .

Wow cpcat, thats one comparison I'll be anxiously waiting for. Mike

Does it have Cable Card & TV Guide?

Does it have Cable Card & TV Guide?

These do not have cable card or TV Guide. They are monitors, no tuners QAM or otherwise.

What a great set of inputs. When you early buyers get your sets, please give us the reviews.

I received the 50XR5 on Friday, the 23rd, and got it mounted late Christmas Eve. While I am not a techie, I have been researching and analyzing displays for the last three years. Since I decided to go plasma in early '05, my intensity in finding the right plasma increased several times over. NEC's 50XR5 just seemed right, so I went for it.

Watching it now for 2-3 days, I can say that this display delivers!!! It is a spectacular display. But, to be honest, I was concerned about two potential issues: image retention and black levels.

Rendition of both color and gray scale is so beautifully accomplished. I was afraid though that the Panasonic blacks were not available. However, when black is in the source, true deep black, this display produces it, and very well I would add. And it is very dynamic in contrast to the full spectrum of color and grays that it does so well.

Everything good that I had heard about SD and HD is accurate. Connections, pricing, visual design of display, processing, warranty, colors/gray scale. It's all there.

If you are like me, waiting for the right one to come along, this display is it!!! (Unless you want to wait further for 1080P.) Also, I wouldn't hesitate to refer anyone to Chris at Cleveland Plasma to discuss a possible purchase. The service was as it is supposed to be.

cpcat - You are correct on the 3 year warranty.

NTO - Congrats on your new NEC. I think you will get over your 2 concerns. ENJOY! Consider running the full white screen for a half hour or so in the middle of the night a few times a week. You can find this in the advanced OSD under Long life. This also helps get your first 100 hours under your belt faster.

My 50XM3S has over a thousand hours on it now and umr ISFed it and it looks fantastic! Now that Pany is into their 8th gen glass did the go with the 12 bit 4096 shades of gray? NEC has been there for 3 years.

I received the 50XR5 on Friday, the 23rd, and got it mounted late Christmas Eve. While I am not a techie, I have been researching and analyzing displays for the last three years. Since I decided to go plasma in early '05, my intensity in finding the right plasma increased several times over. NEC's 50XR5 just seemed right, so I went for it.

Watching it now for 2-3 days, I can say that this display delivers!!! It is a spectacular display. But, to be honest, I was concerned about two potential issues: image retention and black levels.

Rendition of both color and gray scale is so beautifully accomplished. I was afraid though that the Panasonic blacks were not available. However, when black is in the source, true deep black, this display produces it, and very well I would add. And it is very dynamic in contrast to the full spectrum of color and grays that it does so well.

Everything good that I had heard about SD and HD is accurate. Connections, pricing, visual design of display, processing, warranty, colors/gray scale. It's all there.

If you are like me, waiting for the right one to come along, this display is it!!! (Unless you want to wait further for 1080P.) Also, I wouldn't hesitate to refer anyone to Chris at Cleveland Plasma to discuss a possible purchase. The service was as it is supposed to be.

My drool "pool" just got larger. :p I'll probably make my decision after the January CES report.

Keep those reviews/reports coming. Thanks.

Ken

cpcat - You are correct on the 3 year warranty.

NTO - Congrats on your new NEC. I think you will get over your 2 concerns. ENJOY! Consider running the full white screen for a half hour or so in the middle of the night a few times a week. You can find this in the advanced OSD under Long life. This also helps get your first 100 hours under your belt faster.

My 50XM3S has over a thousand hours on it now and umr ISFed it and it looks fantastic! Now that Pany is into their 8th gen glass did the go with the 12 bit 4096 shades of gray? NEC has been there for 3 years.


Sorry for the misstatement. I didn't mean to imply that these two concerns were worthy to be concerned about. No concern about the blacks whatsoever. Watching two DVD's last night convinced me that when the picture is intended to show deep black, the XR5 will display every bit of it! Arizona State and Rutgers was also a phenomenal picture on Dish HD.

I didn't expound on the image retention subject in my last post because I no longer think it is an issue, contrary to my concerns. I saw a couple of seconds on one occasion so far. That won't be any problem for me. And you're right, the white screen technique is there if I need it.

By the way, I have yet to change any color settings. Operating it as it came out of the box as I read another poster to have done. I am almost afraid I might muck it up when it already looks phenomenal.

Consider running the full white screen for a half hour or so in the middle of the night a few times a week. You can find this in the advanced OSD under Long life. This also helps get your first 100 hours under your belt faster.

I'm expecting my 50xr5 to arrive a few days before me and my gf go on our Caribbean cruise :D . Based on what I've read, I am planning to do the following to break the plasma in...

1. Turn down the contrast and brightness to 50%.
2. Turn on MTV (recommended channel for lack of static images).
3. Stretch the image to fill the entire screen.
4. Go on vacation and come back 9 days later (around 216 hours).
5. Have friend periodically check to see that everything is running smoothly.

Do you think it's really important to run the full white screen? If so, I can also have my friend do that when he comes by to check on things.

I'm expecting my 50xr5 to arrive a few days before me and my gf go on our Caribbean cruise :D . Based on what I've read, I am planning to do the following to break the plasma in...

1. Turn down the contrast and brightness to 50%.
2. Turn on MTV (recommended channel for lack of static images).
3. Stretch the image to fill the entire screen.
4. Go on vacation and come back 9 days later (around 216 hours).
5. Have friend periodically check to see that everything is running smoothly.

Do you think it's really important to run the full white screen? If so, I can also have my friend do that when he comes by to check on things.

I don't know what Barrybud will say, but I wouldn't leave it on unattended for that long. I'm planning to set it to optimum settings for my taste right away and then simply keep any static images to a minimum for the first couple of months. Discovery HD is good for break-in if you have it as there aren't any logos. I'll probably run Discovery HD overnight for a few nights after I get it.

Last night I put Discovery HD on (via DishNetwork) and let it run all night. When I looked at it this morning, a DishNetwork "standby" logo was on the screen. Luckily, it was moving. I don't know what happened, but I'll go back to my looped DVD I created for the break-in period. I would be careful putting any OTA/Satellite/Cable source on overnight, unattended. You really don't know what is going to happen during that time. I've played looped DVDs for weeks, months, with no problems (corporate environments).

Rod W.

(I'm breaking in my 5060...watching this NEC thread because I actually had one on order, and decided I couldnt' wait any longer. BTW, the aforementioned ASU/Rutgers game looked fabulous on the Pio...ESPN had a particularly good "look" going in that game. Today's HD bowl games don't look quite as good.)


I don't know what Barrybud will say, but I wouldn't leave it on unattended for that long. I'm planning to set it to optimum settings for my taste right away and then simply keep any static images to a minimum for the first couple of months. Discovery HD is good for break-in if you have it as there aren't any logos. I'll probably run Discovery HD overnight for a few nights after I get it.

Where'd you guys snare the 50XR5's?...check on internet dealers didn't find any in stock. Closest was Cleveland Plasma...he said he had several "spoken for" - enroute to his shipping locations arriving within a couple days. Everybody else said midJan. Guess I'll see what CES has to offer.

This thread is becoming exciting .
Mine will be delivered next week .
What 's a good DVD player for XR5 ? I ordered OPPO .

How long have these been out?

How long have these been out?

The 50xr5 became available ealier this month. I placed my order for the xr5 on the 9th and they were already sold out at all the places I looked at then. Projector Point told me that mine should arrive and ship out by the end of the month (soon theoretically).

Why does the 42" has some extra features that the 50" doesn't?
Also, what does it mean when it says it accepts 1080p?

hey, i have a question. i was almost ready to get the pioneer 5060, but wanted to wait and see about the 50xr5. but, i am new to this HT stuff, so my question, is does the 50xr5 come with any tuner or speakers. i dont have any external speakers or receiver or tuner or anything (right now i just have an old crt tv). so, if i get the 50xr5, would i also need to buy a sound system and ota tuner? thanks for the replies. also if anyone can post pics of their new nec, that would be cool.

Generally a good review with some issues:
http://www.ecoustics.com/avrev/NECPlasmaSync/

I'm expecting my 50xr5 to arrive a few days before me and my gf go on our Caribbean cruise :D . Based on what I've read, I am planning to do the following to break the plasma in...

1. Turn down the contrast and brightness to 50%.
2. Turn on MTV (recommended channel for lack of static images).
3. Stretch the image to fill the entire screen.
4. Go on vacation and come back 9 days later (around 216 hours).
5. Have friend periodically check to see that everything is running smoothly.

Do you think it's really important to run the full white screen? If so, I can also have my friend do that when he comes by to check on things.

Man ! what a bad idea ... leave on for so long. What are you achieving exactly ??
I think you are a bit too worried man. Just be reasonably careful with burn in at the beginning (which really is not a big deal).

Now that I think about it, you must have been kidding right ?????

This thread is becoming exciting .
Mine will be delivered next week .
What 's a good DVD player for XR5 ? I ordered OPPO .

Oppo works great with my projector and worked great with my NEC (but did not use it as much with the latter). In general I love the player, really.

Man ! what a bad idea ... leave on for so long. What are you achieving exactly ??
I think you are a bit too worried man. Just be reasonably careful with burn in at the beginning (which really is not a big deal).

Now that I think about it, you must have been kidding right ?????

Actually, I was serious :p . Do you think initially leaving it on so long will hurt it or something?

I thought the sooner I get past the 100-->1000 hours, the sooner I won't have to worry about image retention when I use it with my pc and whatnot? I would rather not have to be mindful of such a thing for a long period of time if I can get past that break-in period quickly and not need to be concerned with it again.

hey, i have a question. i was almost ready to get the pioneer 5060, but wanted to wait and see about the 50xr5. but, i am new to this HT stuff, so my question, is does the 50xr5 come with any tuner or speakers. i dont have any external speakers or receiver or tuner or anything (right now i just have an old crt tv). so, if i get the 50xr5, would i also need to buy a sound system and ota tuner? thanks for the replies. also if anyone can post pics of their new nec, that would be cool.

The 50xr5 has an internal amplifier (9wx2), but no speakers come with it. NEC offers speakers seperately (px-sp2u/s) if you wanted to go that route. It has no tuner so you would definitely need another device that you can use to change channels (cable box, dvd-recorder, VCR, etc.)

Generally a good review with some issues:
http://www.ecoustics.com/avrev/NECPlasmaSync/

Ummm.... That's a review of the 50XR4. We are talking about the next generation, XR5. One hopes it will be even better.

Ummm.... That's a review of the 50XR4. We are talking about the next generation, XR5. One hopes it will be even better.

OOps, my bad, these numbers are all confusing.

Why does the 42" has some extra features that the 50" doesn't?
Also, what does it mean when it says it accepts 1080p?

Don't know the answer to the first question.

The second question I'll answer soon. I assume the specs mean what they say, though.
I have a processor that will output 1080p so I guess we'll see soon...

It's close according to the tracking info. :D

Well, I have had my 50xr5 for a week now. Being my first plasma, I have taken a slow approach. Watched a copy of DVD, and the PQ is great. SD, I will get Comcast in next week w/ HD package, I just finishing reading the manual. Now I have to read it again to understand what I am doing. I am changing contrast/. Brightness Just for break in. However, I am not sure why I would want to change the picture all that much, currently it's great. Also not -one dead pixzel-
I want calibrate for two setting. Bright daylight watching and night Movie experience.
A neighbor came over on Christmas day and we watched a little of LOR- he asked "what are we watching" because it was better than the movie house.
I am haveing trouble programing my Harmony remote- it has take a very long time to sync. I sent an email to harmony to see if the xr5 is supported in thier system{new at this}
db

It sounds like the 50XR5 does not ship with a stand but they do offer optional PX-ST2U swivel pedestal stand. Did anyone order this stand with there 42XR5 or 50XR5? I'd be interesting knowing the color (I believe it is silver) and how many degrees or inches from the edge, it swivels back from when centered. I also thought it was a little pricey at ~$300 list but I guess it is because it swivels.

It sounds like there were two major issues with last year's 50XR4, black level and image retention. It would be interesting to hear if these areas have been improved on the 50XR5. I would also like to know how the detail and noise looks in dark areas. Another excellent test if you have AVIA or DVE disk, is to look at the linear gray scale ramp test pattern. It should be smooth from dark to light with no bands or color variation.

Well, I have had my 50xr5 for a week now. Being my first plasma, I have taken a slow approach. Watched a copy of DVD, and the PQ is great. SD, I will get Comcast in next week w/ HD package, I just finishing reading the manual. Now I have to read it again to understand what I am doing. I am changing contrast/. Brightness Just for break in. However, I am not sure why I would want to change the picture all that much, currently it's great. Also not -one dead pixzel-
I want calibrate for two setting. Bright daylight watching and night Movie experience.
A neighbor came over on Christmas day and we watched a little of LOR- he asked "what are we watching" because it was better than the movie house.
I am haveing trouble programing my Harmony remote- it has take a very long time to sync. I set an email to harmony to see if the xr5 is in thier system{new at this}
db

Hey congrats on your panel.
In nearly three years I have not at all made any changes to the settings, eventually for curiosity played around a bit with them, but nothing major. I had set up the white screen to stay on for a few minutes in early morning a few times a week, alternating with the other screen with the white bar going side to side. Actually this has not been on for a while now, but I think it is a simple cautious thing to do, not sure at all necessary though.

As the the Harmony, my guess would be that they don't yet have it in their DB, but there is a good chance the prior models codes will work just as well. I suggest look at their db and pick the latest model you find (XR4 ? whatever) and give it a try. In my case to tell you the truth I don't recall what I did, but never had any trouble with 659-->XM2 and I only use the remote when I need to zoom to eliminate bars.

Enjoy and good luck with the remote !

Actually, I was serious :p . Do you think initially leaving it on so long will hurt it or something?

I thought the sooner I get past the 100-->1000 hours, the sooner I won't have to worry about image retention when I use it with my pc and whatnot? I would rather not have to be mindful of such a thing for a long period of time if I can get past that break-in period quickly and not need to be concerned with it again.


Ok, I would think it is not necessary in general, however since you mention PC usage then some extra caution might be a good idea. In general I certainly would not even use a PC very much at all for the first 100 hours or so (note however that my experience is limited to my model, the XM2, which is pretty old).

I just would not though leave such a large electronic component on for so long w/o being around. This is no expert advice, just letting you know, I would not feel confortable.

It sounds like the 50XR5 does not ship with a stand but they do offer optional PX-ST2U swivel pedestal stand. Did anyone order this stand with there 42XR5 or 50XR5? I'd be interesting knowing the color (I believe it is silver) and how many degrees or inches from the edge, it swivels back from when centered. I also thought it was a little pricey at ~$300 list but I guess it is because it swivels.

No stand Included. (ClickHere) for more info on stand. (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/corpus/9/6/50XR5_IGv12.pdf) The stand info in on page 6 of 10. This is the installation guide for the NEC 50XR5. The stand is silver. Aluminum construction. Yes it is pricy but better than a plastic stand for a hundred less.

http://www.clevelandplasma.com/cms_files/Image/NEC with stand 2.jpg

No stand Included. (ClickHere) for more info on stand. (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/corpus/9/6/50XR5_IGv12.pdf) The stand info in on page 6 of 10. This is the installation guide for the NEC 50XR5. The stand is silver. Aluminum construction. Yes it is pricy but better than a plastic stand for a hundred less.


Thanks Chris, for the information and pictures. Wow this thing is gorgeous on the stand with speakers! The info on the stand doesn't tell you how many degrees it swivels, any idea?

Just confirmed my XR5 will be here tomorrow...good thing I took the day off :D I plan on playing with this thing all day and trying to put together a review on all the big topics (SD,HD,DVD, Image Retention, Blacks, Stretch Modes, etc.). Please let me know if you would like me to hit on something else specifically.

So is the # at the end indicative of its generation? 50" being the 5th, 42" and 61" are 4th generation?

Just confirmed my XR5 will be here tomorrow...good thing I took the day off :D I plan on playing with this thing all day and trying to put together a review on all the big topics (SD,HD,DVD, Image Retention, Blacks, Stretch Modes, etc.). Please let me know if you would like me to hit on something else specifically.


Pics.... buddy, pics .
An extended review would be very helpful, as there are none so far. This is the time for you to earn a name in this arena :D :D
Seems like every one is stingy as far as pics are concerned.

Is this display an internet only purchase or are there B&M stores carryinging it?

Pics.... buddy, pics .
An extended review would be very helpful, as there are none so far. This is the time for you to earn a name in this arena :D :D
Seems like every one is stingy as far as pics are concerned.


You know what, I would love to provide pics, but I hate the way you have to reduce them in order to post them here (althought I certainly understand why they have the restrictions). If someone would be kind enough to let me post pics on their site that I can create a link to, or even just send them the pics and have them post links to them for me...I'm all for it. I think I can borrow my neighbors camera too, as mine is an old 3.2mp which probably won't do it any justice.

Please PM me if you would be willing to host the pics for me.

Done....

My stand arrived today. The panel should be here tomorrow.
Are you ready for some football? ;) :D

Just wanted to chime in and add my name to the list of soon-to-be 50XR5 owners. Chris at Cleveland Plasmas informed me that mine will ship the 2nd - just 2 business days after the order was finalized!

I've been enjoying a 42" commercial ED for nearly 3 years now, but wanted to move up to a 50" display for a while. After playing the waiting game with the Panny 8UK and the Pio Elite (just removed myself from the waiting list), I decided to give the NEC a try. I'm especially interested in the ability to do native rate over HDMI, since I run 2 HTPC's in the house now. More on that, along with my overall opinions (and pics, of course) after I receive the display.

Meanwhile, looking forward to hearing/seeing more from others as they receive their displays. As mhfnet said, this could end up being one on the most popular threads on the forum. Exciting times!

Dave

http://www.necvisualsystems.com/registration/applicationFiles/Forms/Registration.cfm?errmsg=%20Invalid%20serial%20number%20forma t%20(5Y00001).
You can register your new plasma 50XR5A at the NEC and get your warranty activated.

The picture improves few hours after use.May be by warm up or by electronic break in.

The NEC product literature gives adequate information about first 100 hours of use.

The stand which comes with the Plasma TV is worth the cost of 250 dollars. It is well made.
Connections to the 50 inches are more easier on the rear as they are one side of the rear panel and there is no need to get in to the back of the T>V>

Compared my neighbourers Panasonic my NEC 50 XR5 is better. Only comapred with the standard def Dish network T.V.
Will get Dish HDTV receiver when the new 642 receiver MPEG 4 will be available- Probably FEB 06.

Anyone know if they're putting out a new ED model? I can't find one on their website...

Anyone know if they're putting out a new ED model? I can't find one on their website...

NEC has no plans to change the ED model.

There are few stickers on the box(package card bord) with the product serial number and one on the rear of the T.V.
There is a also a long life mode in the menu.
So far in the sd
there is no clay face.Good gradation of colors that are natural Not shiny or glaring
Will try few DVDs this weekend
No fan noise.

what are the stretch modes for SD programming?

Just confirmed my XR5 will be here tomorrow...good thing I took the day off :D I plan on playing with this thing all day and trying to put together a review on all the big topics (SD,HD,DVD, Image Retention, Blacks, Stretch Modes, etc.). Please let me know if you would like me to hit on something else specifically.

One less than obvious thing which I'm interested in is the effectiveness of the anti-glare coating. Thanks!

Count me in as someone who is eagerly awaiting a comparison to the Panasonic commercial plasma. I was about to pull the trigger on a 42PHD8UK but, since they are out of stock anyway, I may hold off and see how people fare with the NEC.

The XR5 is the new model right? And the XR4 is the previous model right? So, is there a 42" XR5 coming out?

Depends on the size of the unit. New models are as follows:

Home models:

42" PX-42XR4
50" PX-50XR5
61" PX-61XR4

Consumer models:

42" PX-42XM4
50" PX-50XM5
61" PX-61XM4

The main difference between the Home and Commercial units are the price, warranty time, Bezel color, and inputs. (XM serious has a lower cost, plain black bezel, 1 year warranty overall, and 1 DVI input, all the other inputs are the same.)

How about a review from somone who owns the 50XR5?

How about a review from somone who owns the 50XR5?

I just spoke to the delivery folks. It should be here around 1 o'clock today.
I have my stand all ready to go so I should have it up and running fairly quickly. I'll try to provide an initial impression as soon as I can today.

For someone who asked before, the pedestal stand will rotate 10 degrees each way. It's all aluminum construction and very sturdy. That's the extent of my review so far. :)

For someone who asked before, the pedestal stand will rotate 10 degrees each way. It's all aluminum construction and very sturdy. That's the extent of my review so far. :)
Good start! :D

Ummm.... That's a review of the 50XR4. We are talking about the next generation, XR5. One hopes it will be even better.

So is the 42XR4 the same as the 50XR5 or is it a previous gen? Just wondering why the 50 is the only XR5?

Also, does anyone with a new XR5 (or 42XR4 if it is the same) notice any excessive noise. Any buzzing or fan noise? I know someone said they didn't notice any fan noise but I am wondering if anyone else does. Thanks!

From the things I've read about the Panasonic and NEC plasmas on this forum, I figure it would be a good idea to list the negatives that seem to be associated with both products for comparison. Here is my list so far...

NEC:

1. Image retention (more-so than Panasonic)
2. Lesser black levels than Panasonic

Panasonic:

1. Green push
2. More reflective panels than NEC (bad for rooms with significant light)
3. Duller whites than NEC
4. Floats blacks
5. Crappy tuners (although not a concern if not getting one with a tuner)

Anyone have other problems to add to the lists?
It will be good to find out how these problems have been addressed on the new NEC's. I suspect image retention would be even less of an issue, but I'm still curious to know exactly how the black levels compare to Panasonic?

NEC:

1. Image retention (more-so than Panasonic)
2. Lesser black levels than Panasonic

I have not gotten any feedback suggesting this! Image retention was a concern of the older models. Black levels are equal if not better than the Panasonic. Of course this is all subject to opinion.

I have not gotten any feedback suggesting this! Image retention was a concern of the older models. Black levels are equal if not better than the Panasonic. Of course this is all subject to opinion.

Ya, none of the issues I mentioned seem to be major complaints. I was just listing the issues that some people have noted (they could've just been overly anal or biased though).

I would also be curious if any of the new buyers received NEC plasmas with any dead pixels.

No dead pixels
good black levels, better or equal to P.
No image retention
No clay faces
Natural skin tones without any adjustments (factory settings.)

I'll try my question again.....

Dos anyone know if the 50xr5 (or any NEC) is sold strictly online or are there B&M stores that carry the line. I don't have a problem with buying online, but would like to see some side by side comparisons if I could.

Thanks,

I couldn't find a list of authorized dealers on NEC's website. I also did a search using a shopping bot and couldn't find any B&M stores listed.

If you call NEC visual systems, probably they may tell you about some dealer who got in display.It is a possibility.
I jumped without seeing one and I do no regret it.

Have had my NEC 50XR5 up and running for the past couple days and here are some initial comments. My neighbor also has a Panasonic 50PXP500U so I was able to make some level of comparison, even though they weren't side by side.

First off, the build detail and silver/black bezel are first rate. I much prefer the NEC over either the consumer or commercial 50" Panny. Even my wife popped in a "wow" when she saw the NEC on the wall (compared to a silver LG and black Vidikron that I had previously). I also did notice the anti-glare feature over my other plasma's too.

Documentation & remote are average. Information about the stand and wall mount are not included with the manuals. I would be hyping that stand as much as possible. Also, a bit strange to see a remote without a number pad as well as a digital zoom button symmetrically across from the volume button. I would give the edge to Panasonic here.

Aspect modes and scaling options are very consistent with other plasmas and especially compared to the Panasonic. Basic four settings with Normal, Zoom, Full, Just with NEC calling Full = Anamorphic and Just = Stadium.

The NEC ships with picture settings set at ~50%. A welcome change from most manufacturer's. A nice feature is the ability to store different picture settings and input's so that you can easily alter the panel to a sporting event versus a movie. An accompanying feature is the ability to boost the black levels a couple times for darker, finer picture.

In terms of picture quality, I am finding the panel to be exceptionally strong. After watching a couple of the football games in HD, I believe that the NEC does outshine the Panasonic in this area. Much closer to what you would see on a Fujitsu. I also noticed this on some outdoor and oceanic shows on the Discovery channel.

On the movie side, I was able to compare Star Wars Episode III and GoodFellas to the Panny 500U. In the opening Star Wars attack scene with Dooku, I do believe that the Panny blacks are still better. A bit more depth in the various space scenes. However, on the NEC, to my earlier point above, colour details from various objects definitely stood out, more so than the Panasonic. Watching the HBO HD broadcast of GoodFellas confirmed some similar experiences. Darker, black, or grey scenes would show more detail on the Panny. This isn't overly obvious but if you do look, I believe you can tell.

Overall, I believe the NEC does live up expectations and is an oustanding value. PQ excels in many areas compared to the competition available now.

I will definitely post some pictures as well as additional details shortly, but wanted to provide some immediate feedback.

Also, special thanks to Chris at Cleveland Plasma for all his work to get this unit over to me during the holiday craziness.

Have had my NEC 50XR5 up and running for the past couple days and here are some initial comments. My neighbor also has a Panasonic 50PXP500U so I was able to make some level of comparison, even though they weren't side by side.

First off, the build detail and silver/black bezel are first rate. I much prefer the NEC over either the consumer or commercial 50" Panny. Even my wife popped in a "wow" when she saw the NEC on the wall (compared to a silver LG and black Vidikron that I had previously). I also did notice the anti-glare feature over my other plasma's too.

Documentation & remote are average. Information about the stand and wall mount are not included with the manuals. I would be hyping that stand as much as possible. Also, a bit strange to see a remote without a number pad as well as a digital zoom button symmetrically across from the volume button. I would give the edge to Panasonic here.

Aspect modes and scaling options are very consistent with other plasmas and especially compared to the Panasonic. Basic four settings with Normal, Zoom, Full, Just with NEC calling Full = Anamorphic and Just = Stadium.

The NEC ships with picture settings set at ~50%. A welcome change from most manufacturer's. A nice feature is the ability to store different picture settings and input's so that you can easily alter the panel to a sporting event versus a movie. An accompanying feature is the ability to boost the black levels a couple times for darker, finer picture.

In terms of picture quality, I am finding the panel to be exceptionally strong. After watching a couple of the football games in HD, I believe that the NEC does outshine the Panasonic in this area. Much closer to what you would see on a Fujitsu. I also noticed this on some outdoor and oceanic shows on the Discovery channel.

On the movie side, I was able to compare Star Wars Episode III and GoodFellas to the Panny 500U. In the opening Star Wars attack scene with Dooku, I do believe that the Panny blacks are still better. A bit more depth in the various space scenes. However, on the NEC, to my earlier point above, colour details from various objects definitely stood out, more so than the Panasonic. Watching the HBO HD broadcast of GoodFellas confirmed some similar experiences. Darker, black, or grey scenes would show more detail on the Panny. This isn't overly obvious but if you do look, I believe you can tell.

Overall, I believe the NEC does live up expectations and is an oustanding value. PQ excels in many areas compared to the competition available now.

I will definitely post some pictures as well as additional details shortly, but wanted to provide some immediate feedback.

Also, special thanks to Chris at Cleveland Plasma for all his work to get this unit over to me during the holiday craziness.


If aspect ratio settings are similar to Panny does that mean the NEC doesn't stretch 720p/1080i sources?
Also, do you plan on connecting a PC?

Anyone recommed a swivel stand for this 50 inch?
Thanks.
PS anyone know of other forums where they post prices? PM please.

Favorable.

First, the overall buying experience with Chris at Cleveland Plasma was first rate. The panel arrived via freight in perfect condition yesterday (Fri) after being shipped on Tues.

I can confirm the panel will accept native (1365x768) via HDMI from my Lumagen HDP. I'm not sure if I have 1:1 yet, still working on it. It won't accept 1080p so far via HDMI. Could be this will only work through VGA. I'll email NEC about it.

My PQ experience has been HD football so far. In this regard, the NEC seems noticeably superior in providing the "you are there" feel and the 3D window effect compared with my TH-50PX50U. Everything is just so smooth and silky compared to the Panasonic. There is *zero* visible dithering noise from my seating position at 15 ft, whereas I could always see at least some before. Part of this could be the fact I'm feeding native via the HDP, I'll need some time before I can say for sure.
My neighbor commented "it's the best I've ever seen" and he's seen HD rendered on both my Panny and the older Sony LCD RP. For HD football, I'd say this *is* the best I've had it. Color with the default settings seems fine for now. I'm using the mid-low temp setting. I'm going to try to go through AVIA some today. Incidentally, color and tint controls are *disabled* on the 50XR5 when feeding the panel native rate so color and tint will need to be adjusted via the HDP. Cinema mode is also fixed to "On" and can't be adjusted and the only available picture settings are "normal" and "default".

The jury is still out on black levels. I'm still working on how to set things up. I'd give the edge to Panasonic at this point. Black looks black in the picture on the NEC (like the black background around the small ESPNHD scoreboard) but the ESPNHD sidebars are not as black as they were with the Panny. Shadow detail may be another thing altogether though, as the lack of noise/dithering may give the NEC an edge. This always bothered me some with the Panny. In fact, I returned the first 50PX50U I had due to this (I got another one, which I still have). My wife complained that it looked "fuzzy" especially with dark or red backgrounds. This is *not* a problem with the NEC.

Oh yeah, the look/feel etc. is just superb. The NEC definitely *seems* more expensive than the Panny (it is, a little). I can hear the fans with the volume down but it's about the same as the Panny's slight buzz. I'd rather hear fans, actually. It's less objectionable.

I'll try to post more later as I have time to sort through everything a little more. I'll also try to get some pics up as well.

Thanks everyone for posting your reviews .
Keep em comin.

Thanks capcat. Sounds very promising.

When you finish your AVIA calibration, I suggest looking at the Horizontal Gray Ramp test pattern at Title 1, Chapter 103 (also can be found by menu selecting Chapter 7 - Audio & Video Calibration, Video Test Patterns, Gray Scale & Levels, Grey Steps & Ramps, Horizontal Gray Ramp). It should be smooth with no banding or color shifts across the ramp and linear with no compression at either end. It is also a very useful pattern to set the brightness and contrast to maximize dynamic range for best detail. I use the contrast control to get the white end linear and the brightness control to get the black end linear. This is an easy and very revealing test. I have been noticing many of the recent display reviews in Home Theater Magazine include the results of this test.

You are probably are probably familiar with this test but I thought it would be worth mentioning for those not familiar with it's benefits. Let us know how it turns out.

Thanks for posting your reviews so quickly. Much appreciated.

From the spec sheet, it appears that you can set individual color controls as well. I was told that you cannot do this with the consumer Panasonic. Can any of the reviewers confirm this? Also - did you see any red or green push?

Also - do we think that the results for the 42xr4 will be similar to those for the 50xr5?

Thanks for posting your reviews so quickly. Much appreciated.

From the spec sheet, it appears that you can set individual color controls as well. I was told that you cannot do this with the consumer Panasonic. Can any of the reviewers confirm this? Also - did you see any red or green push?

Also - do we think that the results for the 42xr4 will be similar to those for the 50xr5?

You do not have individual color controls on the Panasonic consumer models (next model year?) but you do on the industrial models like the 50PHD8K.

It is hard to say whether the results will be the same between the 42xr4 and 50xr5 unless the two are compared side by side. Do they use the same glass technology and electronics processing? It is a little suspicious that they both don't end in XR5 if they are the same technology and the brochure states a few technical differences between the units. However since NEC makes all there own glass and electronics they probably pretty similar. I guess the best people to answer this question is NEC tech support.

Okay, I have tried to do as comprehensive of a review I could on my new NEC 50XR5. I've tried to hit all of the topics that interested me, or those that have been posed as an interest by others. However, please let me know if I've left out anything that someone would like a review on.

Overview - As a quick overview, here is a list of my equipment for a reference point to what I am reviewing;

-NEC 50XR5
-Harman Kardon AVR 235
-HR10-250 hooked up via HDMI (DirecTV HDTIVO for those that don't know the model number)
-VERY CHEAP Toshiba SD-3890 DVD player hooked up direct with component cables. (I tried all the upconverting ones with my old TV and found the NEC scaler to be superior so I stuck with the old 480i). Plus that was an EDTV and any difference may not have been able to be seen (that's another debate). Maybe someone else can do a test of upconverting players with this panel, but I'm gonna put my money on the NEC scaler for now.
-Gamecube hooked up through my AVR via component cables

Asthetics- I am going to start with the aesthetics of the panel, because this is the first thing that caught my eye when removing this thing from the box. I must say that this is one sexy looking panel, even the wife was impressed. It has a mostly a matte black finish, however it is set off nicely with a subtle silver trim around the entire outside and very nice chrome/silver across the bottom. In my opinion, the best looking commercial plasma out there right now - I'm very pleased with the look in my living room. P.S. - anyone with the space for a 50" and is considering getting a 42"...DON'T, the extra real estate is well worth it!

Calibration - Before I go into my review of different sources, the only calibrations I have done so far are to adjust the contrast and brightness on the HDTIVO using the HDNET test pattern and on the DVD using the AVIA calibration disk. The colors were right on out of the box according to those tests.

Standard Definition - Well, I'm starting the review with the SD pic quality, but this is by far the weakest link of this panel. I am coming from a 42VR5 for which the SD pic quality was very good. That was a 42" EDTV, so I was expecting the SD picture on the 50" HDTV to be much less desirable. So, I powered up the panel and put on FX (usually pretty decent quality for SD) and was pleasantly surprised - just as good as my VR5. "Let me turn to one of my local DirecTV channels I thought to myself" (as these are usually the most compressed channels DTV sends), but wow this looked decent as well - and this time it may have edged my VR5. NEC definitely uses a good scaler in these new panels, as I must say SD on this TV is VERY good for a 50" HD plasma. Of course, I have no reference point to other 50" panels, but I can tell you when I was searching in March for my 42VR5, the only panel I had found with a better scaler was the Fujitsu (and that was a marginal difference at best). Definitely have to give kudos to the panel on this one! I'm gonna put it on par if not better than the Fujitsu here. Stretch modes: This is another one of the advantages I give NEC over any other panel. Stadium stretch on 4:3 material is great. I don't know how they do it, but you really do forget your watching stretched material when using Stadium. Zoom mode on a letterboxed 4:3 channel fills the screen perfectly as well. Lastly, the ability to stretch HD (720p and 1080i) is priceless. There are many shows that I record on HD channels that are broadcast in SD because the picture quality on them is better then the SD channels. Being able to stretch these is priceless to me, I don't think I could have a panel which I couldn't do that on.

Gaming - I'll have to admit I don't have much to add in this area. I don't have XBOX or PS2, just a measly Gamecube that was given to my son for xmas last year. I have it hooked up with component cables through my Harman Kardon AVR. I popped in Frogger and MarioKart. Not to my surprise, it did very well with the 480i signal here as well. I'm sure feeding this panel 720p or higher games would look exceptional, but again I don't have these systems.

DVD - Again, all that I have is a measly $50 Toshiba player. I've found the best results were feeding the TV a 480i signal. Again, the NEC has a great scaler so I am not surprised it was better then the Toshiba's. Color reproduction and details were exceptional. When viewing animated movies like Incredibles or Madagascar on this panel I was amazed. These movies looked GREAT on my VR5, but that was no surprise at it was the native resolution of the TV, but I think they look just as good if not better on the XR5 (a little more 3 dimensional maybe). Un-animated (probably not even a real word, but what the heck) movies look great as well. Popped in War of the Worlds and Collateral and was impressed by the details in most scenes of Collateral. This is a very dark movie, but the NEC handled it very well, no macroblocking or any other noticeable noise. War of the Worlds looked great too. Scenes like the robots coming out of the ground were awesome and it handled the dark scenes very well in this movie as well. Unfortunately that is all the time I had to review for the DVD's but will try to test some others out when I get more time. Most of my viewing is HD, so I'll move onto that;

HD - Well, unlike the SD not being the weakest part of the panel as the first part of my review, I definitely saved the best for last here. I am just taken back by how well this panel displays details in images on HD material. The only channel I have from DirecTV in HD is HBO (their HD offering is not worth $10.95 in my opinion), so most of my analysis is done from OTA material. There is just something about this panel (and other NEC's for that matter) that seem to just give it an edge in my opinion. When I am watching shows on friends Panasonic's and even Pioneer's sometimes I find myself saying "wow...that is just an awesome picture from a television". However, many times when watching shows on my NEC I find myself so involved in the show and simply lifelike colors/skin tones that I forget I'm even watching a television. I guess with the Panny I can always just see that I am looking at glass with an image behind it, whereas here I just feel like I'm looking at the people. Hard to explain, hopefully that made some sense.

Image Retention - I've not noticed anything significant in this area to be worried about. If something is on the screen for a few minutes and you change to a black screen you see a faint outline of it....but as soon as you change the channel and come back it is gone. I remember my VR5 was like this for the first couple of weeks and now I never get any retention. I think this is been exaggerated as well....I don't think it is really an issue if it goes away with the next screen. Now, if previous models had problems where you could see it over top of new images, then that would be a problem, and I can confirm this has never happened to me.

Overall Pic Quality (Black Level, and Color) - I think most who've seen an NEC can agree that there is nothing left to be desired when it comes to colors and color reproduction. I think that NEC's produce the most lifelike colors and skin tones compared to the Panasonic and Pioneer. Some say Pioneer isn't really lifelike and some say Panny can be a bit too soft, but I really feel that NEC strikes the perfect balance. If possible, I think this panel does even better than the previous models with the color reproduction. When talking to one of the NEC customer service reps a while back I think I recall him saying that they have done some enhancement to the color filter on the glass, and I think it shows, not only with the colors, but with the black level as well. I have tried to evaluate the black levels on this panel as much as possible over the past day, as I know this is a topic that many would like to hear about (a bit overrated in my opinion) but nonetheless very relevant. The absolute black level is definitely improved (at least over my VR5, as I've never seen an XR4). I would definitely put it in the same league as the Panasonic and new Pioneer. I really think you would need to put them side by side to see an absolute black level difference in the panels (but my gut is the Panny would still barely edge it out). However, where I see the advantage, and I see this as a huge advantage, is in the shadow details. To me the Panasonic may have the ability to show an absolute black level that is closer to true black, but you lose many of the details in the picture. To me, I'd rather have a panel with a black level that is 98% as black as the Panasonic, while showing 10% more of the details. I watch a lot of OTA HD, which may be one of the reasons I didn't hinge my whole plasma purchase on an absolute black level, as most of the primetime shows don't have that many dark scenes. However, even with shows like "Lost" (which I had previously recorded) where almost entire episodes are shot in the dark, I did not feel that there were any inadequacies.

Overall I am going to put this panel at the top of the list for those I've seen in person. I think the picture quality/scaling is up to par (if not better) with the Fujitsu and I think the aesthetics are second to none (NEC did a great job here). Two HDMI's, PIP, direct input settings, stretch modes and various other features make this an exceptional panel. They say it is designed for ISF calibration too, but after watching this thing for a day now I can't see it getting much better .....WELL DONE NEC!

Issues – I have to say that I don’t have many issues yet. One thing that did annoy me was the fact you need to have an ISF calibration done in order to “activate” the night and day picture settings. That was really lame on NEC’s part in my opinion. They trust the consumer a lot by allowing the myriad of picture setting changes available on the this tv, and then they take that away. Hopefully someone will figure it out in the future.

Disclaimer - Please remember this is only one man's opinion. Please don't base your decision on my eyes, trust your own...I know this is something that is hard to do with the NEC's because there so hard to find in person, but maybe after more people have had a chance to review these new panels, they can confirm what I see. Also, I was basing all of my comparisons off of viewing I have done in peoples homes and in A/V shops, I was not able to do “side by side” comparisons.

Pictures – will post some when I get a chance to borrow a friend’s camera. Chris at Clevelandplasma offered to host them for me…so hopefully I can get them to him soon.

Thank you for taking the time for that indepth review. I have narrowed my search b/t the NEC 50xr5 and Panny 508uk. Sounds like you would give the edge to the NEC. I will be interested in the others with NEC have to say in their reviews. Thanks again for taking to time to review this set, especially since NEC's are almost impossible to find in stores.

Anyone have the 42" yet? I'm limited to that size due to a small house and budget. The reviews of the 50" sound great so far, curious to see if the 42" compares.

It is also good to hear you can stretch 720p and 1080i.

You obviously spent a lot of time evaluating and documenting your panel. It sounds like a keeper.

Happy New Year everyone! :)

Tony17... you da man!

Thanks for:
Being a true pioneer and getting this panel early... before major reviews were written.
Doing a great write-up!

Cheers and a great New Year to you and your new PDP! :D

shane

PS... and a happy, healthy, and safe New Year to everyone else too.

Quick Reference of Forum Rules
1) Do Not post pricing you found on-line or at a local dealer.
2) Do Not ask for, or offer, a receipt so people can price match.
3) Do Not say to "Call John Smith at ..." (you know what I mean)
4) Do Not put down someone else's choice in their purchase.
5) Do Not start a thread asking for the best TV for $XXXX or I have a $XXXXX to spend
6) Do Not discus where to buy a TV

Then what the hell is this forum good for?!?!?!?
Excitement?!?!?!?
How elated one feels over a TV?!?!?!

This place is ridiculous!

ok, I know I'm missing the point of this forum. let me guess...
it's so that when I purchase a TV at a high price(like that guy from cleveland quoted me) I would learn HOW TO CALIBRATE IT! is that it? am I right?

Yay! yippy! I feel sooooo lucky.

riiiiiight...

Happy new year....

Great job, tony!! Can you comment on the glare/reflectivity or lack thereof?

Thanks!

Quick Reference of Forum Rules
1) Do Not post pricing you found on-line or at a local dealer.
2) Do Not ask for, or offer, a receipt so people can price match.
3) Do Not say to "Call John Smith at ..." (you know what I mean)
4) Do Not put down someone else's choice in their purchase.
5) Do Not start a thread asking for the best TV for $XXXX or I have a $XXXXX to spend
6) Do Not discus where to buy a TV

Then what the hell is this forum good for?!?!?!?
Excitement?!?!?!?
How elated one feels over a TV?!?!?!

This place is ridiculous!

ok, I know I'm missing the point of this forum. let me guess...
it's so that when I purchase a TV at a high price(like that guy from cleveland quoted me) I would learn HOW TO CALIBRATE IT! is that it? am I right?

Yay! yippy! I feel sooooo lucky.

riiiiiight...

Happy new year....

wow...having a bad holiday season?

Obviously, this forum is a good place to find a wealth of information. This forum has been very valuable to my research and I have gone from being totally ignorant about many things to being only mildy ignorant about many things ;)

Your gripes seem to revolve around "pricing" and "where to buy." Although you can't post such info, there's nothing stopping you from sending private messages to people to inquire about such things.

There really isn't much in life that surprises me, but it's hard to believe that someone who's in the market for a TV can't appreciate all of the information that can be found on forums like this.

Also - do we think that the results for the 42xr4 will be similar to those for the 50xr5?

The electronics for the 42" should be the same as the 50" but the glass is different. The 42" uses an improved color filter over the other NEC models as well as other panel technologies to increase brightness and contrast. It looks like the 42XR4 is borrowing technology from Pioneer (ie Bonded filter). Here is a comparison of the specs from the different NEC models.

...............Contrast Ratio..........Brightness (cd/m2)
42XR4..........2100:1.....................1000
50XR5..........1000:1.......................700
61XR4..........1000:1.......................700

http://www.de.nec.de/press.php/id/650/lang/RUS

From the spec sheet, I also noticed that the fan noise for the 42 and 61 is listed at 22db while the 50 is listed at 20 db. The native resolution for the 42 is XGA 1024x768 while the native resolution for both the 50 and 61 is WXGA 1365x768.

I am not savvy enough to know if the latter will make a big difference in picture quality. Does the improved color filter that Hoodlum pointed out mean that the picture on the 42 will at least be as good as the 50 or worse?

wow...having a bad holiday season?

Obviously, this forum is a good place to find a wealth of information. This forum has been very valuable to my research and I have gone from being totally ignorant about many things to being only mildy ignorant about many things

Your gripes seem to revolve around "pricing" and "where to buy." Although you can't post such info, there's nothing stopping you from sending private messages to people to inquire about such things.

There really isn't much in life that surprises me, but it's hard to believe that someone who's in the market for a TV can't appreciate all of the information that can be found on forums like this.

Hi GamerGuy,
of course theres information here, and of course I didn't explain myself thoroughly...I was ranting.
Can you believe that? :)

Sorry guys, for a moment this place did not make sense to me - the no pricing policy.
Tried earlier to find out why the no posting prices policy but couldn't find anything.
No pricing on a forum may make sense to all of you...but to me, well... sorry, but I'm ignorant on that topic.

Does anyone know of a forum that does?
Thanks.
And happy new year.

Please quit asking for forums that allow for price talk, and use yahoo/google. There is no expectation that AVS will allow for other forum advertising. Which is what listing sites would be.

Also, I don't expect you to understand, or relate to AVS rules quite yet. It took me awhile too. If you'll spend some real, quality time here, I think you'll come around to understanding why things are the way they are.

Welcome to AVS, and Happy New Year to you as well.:)

1000:1 contrast ratio doesn't seem very good to me, at all...at least on paper. For a plasma, I expect at least 2000:1 or 3000:1. What gives here?

Well, I've been "working" hard all day. :)

I found that 1:1 mapping was a snap. I was making it too hard. Here are the timings (obtained from NEC secondhand) via Lumagen VisionHDP through HDMI:

VTOT 788 HTOT 1526
VACT 768 HACT 1365
VSYN 4 HSYN 50
VFRN 4 HFRN 51

V freq. 60.00 Hz
H freq. 47.20 Hz

Make sure RGB select in setup menu is set to "auto"
Disable orbiting in PDP saver menu
Set image adjust values all to zero.
That's it. Double check signal info in the menu and it should read 1365 x 768 and memory 18.

V-line and H-line patterns via the Lumagen test patterns are perfect one-pixel rows.

I went through AVIA as well as well as THX optimizer and ended up with the following (best for now) for black and white:

HDMI high
Gamma 2.2
Pedestal 0.00
Pic mode normal
Contrast 50
Brt 34

I set up everything for Video 7.5 IRE and it kept crushing black and forced me to range brightness all the way up. I ended up putting pedestal back to zero as it allows the adjustment of brightness to be in the middle of the range which I feel is probably more linear. All inputs are via DVI at 7.5 IRE.

Right now I'm saying the black level is on par with my TH-50PX50U set to "cinema" which turns off the floating black level. If you float the black on the Panny, the absolute levels are still better.

For color, I ended up leaving everything at default for hue and just above default for saturation through the Lumagen HDP. Going by AVIA color bars strictly, it seemed to end up over-saturated. Mid-low temperature seems to look the best to me.

I've not dared to adjust individual red, green, blue values. I left them at default for now.

The 50XR5's a keeper for sure.

1000:1 contrast ratio doesn't seem very good to me, at all...at least on paper. For a plasma, I expect at least 2000:1 or 3000:1. What gives here?

1000:1 is an excellent contrast ratio if it's accurately measured. Most here would agree than even the highly-respected 8th gen Pannys do not come close to the advertised 3000:1 contrast ratio. My guess (and hope) is that NEC is conservative in its numbers similar to how H/K is with their wattage figures on receivers.

For anyone that might be interested, this is an email I recieved today from an NEC PR specialist regarding their plasma business and relationship to Pioneer...

____________________________________________________________ ____
To set the record straight: NEC has no plans to stop making plasmas and our warranties are rock solid.

Here is some background on our relationship with Pioneer:

Pioneer Corporation took over NEC’s plasma manufacturing facility and research and development resources in Kagoshima, Japan in March 2004 to become one of the largest plasma display suppliers in the world. This acquisition didn’t affect NEC’s global branded plasma business. NEC has retained dedicated resources in Japan to continue the growth and future development of NEC-branded displays.

NEC customers and partners in the Americas continue to have access to the same superior plasma display technology, reliable service and responsive support for which NEC is renowned. NEC continues to focus on offering industry-leading plasma displays for both professional and home applications.


That is a good suggestion to have an NEC rep. visit the forum regularly. I’ll talk to my bosses here and see what we can figure out.

Please let me know if you have any other questions.

Thanks,
Amanda

Amanda M. Dvorchak
Public Relations Specialist
NEC Solutions (America), Inc.
Visual Systems Division

Office: 630-467-4149
Cell: 312-485-4513
Fax: 630-467-4750

amanda.dvorchak@necsam.com
www.necvisualsystems.com
____________________________________________________________ ____

1000:1 is an excellent contrast ratio if it's accurately measured. Most here would agree than even the highly-respected 8th gen Pannys do not come close to the advertised 3000:1 contrast ratio. My guess (and hope) is that NEC is conservative in its numbers similar to how H/K is with their wattage figures on receivers.

I totally agree with Trackman. In two recent Home Theater Magazines they reviewed the Panasonic 42PX500 and Pioneer 5060 plasmas and they measured an ANSI contrast, which is more indicative of what you'll actual see on the screen, for the Panasonic of 364:1 and the Pioneer of 1135:1. This is a far cry from the published specs of either plasma. Now that doesn't mean the Pioneer has a better black level, as the Panasonic measure 0.027 ft-L vs. the Pioneer measured 0.033 ft-L, but it does mean mean it will have a wider dynamic range image.

For anyone that might be interested, this is an email I recieved today from an NEC PR specialist regarding their plasma business and relationship to Pioneer...

I have only one worry here, as noted Pioneer took over NEC. Therefor they have control over NEC plasma division and at any given time companies make changes. That is great news now, but what does the future for hold ????

My biggest consern is what if one day all NEC's are rebaged Pioneers as the 50" and 42" are "NOT" as of yet ???? Hopefully it will be like the Hitachi/Fujitsu deal were they are in a joint venture but there is a HUGE difference in units.

What do you think GamerGuy? Companies make changes everyday especially when they are losing money.

My biggest consern is what if one day all NEC's are rebaged Pioneers as the 50" and 42" are "NOT" as of yet ????

I've not seen the PQ of the 5060, but I know it does *not* do native and 1:1 over HDMI. That to me would mean at least the electronics are dissimilar.

Right as noted the 50" and 42" are different right now. Conserned about the future....

This shouldn't matter with respect to the current NEC models, right? Based upon the specs, can anyone comment whether there should be a real difference between the picture quality of 42 and the 50? I know that there are a few differences but I don't know if these differences actually matter to the PQ.

That was an awesome review of the 50XR5, just about ready to jump on it, however, this really freaks me out:

"Image Retention - I've not noticed anything significant in this area to be worried about. If something is on the screen for a few minutes and you change to a black screen you see a faint outline of it....but as soon as you change the channel and come back it is gone. I remember my VR5 was like this for the first couple of weeks and now I never get any retention. I think this is been exaggerated as well....I don't think it is really an issue if it goes away with the next screen. Now, if previous models had problems where you could see it over top of new images, then that would be a problem, and I can confirm this has never happened to me."

You are saying that after something is on the screen for a few minutes you do get some retention? Well, this is unfrigginbelievable. Every god damn 'something" is on for a few minutes! A football game has a score on top of the screen for more than a few minutes, are we supposed to change the channel during a crucial play so that we don't get image retention? I was going to hook up a PC to this thing, this would seem like suicide. Maybe i'm overreacting, but "things" are going to be on the screen for a few minutes or more, and i don't care that it apparently dissapears, this to me is no way to enjoy a $4000 investment.

I see absolutely no image retention at all.
Checked and re chechecked again.
The contrast nd brightness were turned down 25% and then I checked again with the normal 50% absolutely none.
The image on SD sounds fabu;ous if one sits 10 feet away.
regards

That was an awesome review of the 50XR5, just about ready to jump on it, however, this really freaks me out:


You are saying that after something is on the screen for a few minutes you do get some retention? Well, this is unfrigginbelievable. .

What he's referring to is better termed afterimaging or ghosting IMO.

You only see it with an intervening blank screen like when changing inputs. It's there for a few seconds at most and consists of a faint outline of a previous image. This occurred with my Panny TH-50PX50U as well and it seemed to get much less noticeable after the first 100 hours or so on the panel.

This may be somewhat related to image retention/burn-in but the true susceptibility (or lack thereof) in this new NEC panel will take time to evaluate.

I'm planning to run a PC with mine as well.

What he's referring to is better termed afterimaging or ghosting IMO.

You only see it with an intervening blank screen like when changing inputs. It's there for a few seconds at most and consists of a faint outline of a previous image. This occurred with my Panny TH-50PX50U as well and it seemed to get much less noticeable after the first 100 hours or so on the panel.

This may be somewhat related to image retention/burn-in but the true susceptibility (or lack thereof) in this new NEC panel will take time to evaluate.

I'm planning to run a PC with mine as well.

But what's freaking me out is i have only been considering plasmas because i hate the projected look of a RPTV or DLP. I have been chastising newbies for refusing to buy plasmas because of the burn-in issue even though they preferred the PQ of the plasma. I've been telling them that Panasonic says that it is equal to CRT levels as far as the possibility of burn in. I've been telling myself, after much research, that unless someone did something really stupid like leave a menu on all night there was no need to worry as long as the contrast was turned down etc. Just simple common sense. Now i hear that a brand new NEC plasma, a reference panel from one of the oldest and most respected companies in the world( of plasma TV's) did show a little image retention after just a few minutes of normal TV watching. I can't live with that, i watch primarilly premium cable, cable news, some DVD's, and some PC usage with an occasional PC game, obviously upgrading to Comcast HD. Once again, what is freaking me out is not that a plasma did show some retention, what is freaking me out is it happened after a few minutes which is way below the threshold of normal viewing. When i would read the various owners manuals they all would say something like " try not to leave still images, logos, etc on screen for certain length of time".....but a few minutes? How can someone enjoy watching one half hour show in its entirety without this baggage hanging over your head? Perhaps that 48 hour torture test was a misprint and meant 48 minutes? I do understand that image retention can be reversed, but that's not the point, the point being that it affects your viewing habits which i didn't want. If there's breaking news on CNN, i don't want to have to hesitate on the remote.

I've been telling myself, after much research, that unless someone did something really stupid like leave a menu on all night there was no need to worry as long as the contrast was turned down etc. Just simple common sense. Now i hear that a brand new NEC plasma, a reference panel from one of the oldest and most respected companies in the world( of plasma TV's) did show a little image retention after just a few minutes of normal TV watching. .

I believe you are correct. Common sense and a little caution in the first 100 hours or so is all that's necessary.

I still think you are confusing image retention with afterimaging. Image retention is relatively permanent but can be somewhat reversible over time with running a dvd loop or inverse/white screen image. No new NEC owner at this forum has described any image retention yet. Afterimaging also occurs in the human eye. Does that worry you? ;) Almost any display device will afterimage to some extent, but I guess it could be hard to tell sometimes whether it's the display or your eye.

You know the old saying, "nothing ventured, nothing gained".

Here are a few. Thanks to Chris at Cleveland Plasma for hosting.

http://www.clevelandplasma.com/cms_files/Image/Hosting/NEC pic 1.1.jpg

http://www.clevelandplasma.com/cms_files/Image/Hosting/NEC Pic 2.2.jpg

Nice!
Thanks for posting.
Any more evaluations, any issues?
Still 'wow'?

Thanks

shane

I just received a new NEC 61 and I am looking for any suggestions regarding the installation of the plasma. I will be wall mounting it.

I am looking for suggestions and/or recommendations in the areas of:

wiring
speakers
HD connections (Comcast provided)
additional equipment

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Nice!
Thanks for posting.
Any more evaluations, any issues?
Still 'wow'?

Thanks

shane

Still playing around with everything. Right now I'm looking at the black/contrast performance with my setup (Sat/STB/DVD->scaler->panel) at both video black level settings vs. PC settings. I'll post back when I decide which is better. This may or may not apply unless you use a scaler or HTPC though.


I just finished being blown away (pun here) by part of the Doobie Bros. concert on HDNET. I'm getting a 3D, shimmering, almost liquid look to the picture which I don't remember getting with my Panny.

Awesome , cpcat .
Thanks for posting the pics and review.
2 More days and i will be messing with this badboy...
I am so proud of my decision.

I just received a new NEC 61 and I am looking for any suggestions regarding the installation of the plasma. I will be wall mounting it.

I am looking for suggestions and/or recommendations in the areas of:

wiring
speakers
HD connections (Comcast provided)
additional equipment

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

I don't have Comcast, but HDMI/DVI would be the preferred way to go in most cases. If you are planning to use the internal amplifier in the TV you'll need to bring analog audio out into one of the analog audio inputs on the TV then set the audio accordingly in the audio menu.

Any speakers will do, it just depends on what you want from them. I'm planning to hook up some small bookshelf Bose that I've had for years just for those times then I don't want to have to turn the HT system on. I'll probably hide them behind the panel and sort of fire around the sides. If these will be your only speakers, you might spend more for those provided by NEC or other similar "plasma speakers" available aftermarket.

The speaker-level output jacks are on the back/bottom of the panel and are the clip variety I think designed for bare wire connection.

Still playing around with everything. Right now I'm looking at the black/contrast performance with my setup (Sat/STB/DVD->scaler->panel) at both video black level settings vs. PC settings. I'll post back when I decide which is better. This may or may not apply unless you use a scaler or HTPC though.


I just finished being blown away (pun here) by part of the Doobie Bros. concert on HDNET. I'm getting a 3D, shimmering, almost liquid look to the picture which I don't remember getting with my Panny.

So at this point, is it safe to say that if you could only choose one to keep between the NEC and Panasonic, it would be the NEC? For full disclosure I am probably going to be making a similar decision soon, except in a 42" version.

Thanks for all the reviews and impressions posted.

Cpcat: I see that you have your NEC on the tabletop stand. Was it at all difficult to attach the plasma to the stand? I plan to have the 42 inch sitting on the stand.

Thanks for posting the pictures.

Very easy to attach to stand. Installation Guide Here (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/corpus/9/6/50XR5_IGv12.pdf)

I found a picture of this display with the "clown feet" stand typical of other NEC's (see below). What is the model # for the nicer looking one in cpcat's photos? Thanks.

http://www.plasmaplanet.com/PLASMA_DISPLAYS/NEC/IMAGES/NEW/NEC50XR5-FRONT-POPUP.jpg

It took for me 5 minutes to attach the stands.Four screws to tighten the stand and four scres to attach it to the monitor.Hex thread wrench provided.(2 on each stand)
I am a senior citizen and have no skills.But to place the monitor it needs 2 people to slide it to the vertical bars on the stand.
It is firm, heavy and no wobbling.
regards

Thanks, Johnson...much appreciated.

So at this point, is it safe to say that if you could only choose one to keep between the NEC and Panasonic, it would be the NEC? Thanks for all the reviews and impressions posted.

Yes. So far, the NEC seems to have significantly better resolution, less dithering noise and artifacting, more natural rendition of colors, and comparable black level (without floating blacks). The black levels have continued to improve with run-in of the panel and with further tweaking that I've done. Shadow detail is at least equal, I think, but I've only watched a few clips of movies with dark scenes (HDNet movies and UHD) so that's still up in the air a bit. What have I been watching? Football, what else! :)

One caveat, though. I'm using a scaler with native rate and 1:1 mapping out to the panel. This bypasses the PDP's internal scaler so don't rely solely on my observations . We need a few more owners here to chime in. Black levels/shadow detail and color performance should still be to the credit of the NEC though. I also used the scaler with the Panny but the consumer models don't accept their native rate over HDMI. The best I could ever do was 1366 x 742.

I'll try to set up a pass-thru mode on my scaler so I can see if my observations still hold when I get a chance.

I found a picture of this display with the "clown feet" stand typical of other NEC's (see below). What is the model # for the nicer looking one in cpcat's photos? Thanks.



PX-ST2U

It works for both 50 and 42 inch models. It's all aluminum construction and swivels 10 degrees each way. Follow Chris' link above and I think you'll see dimensions for it.

I have had my 50XR5 up and running only since yesterday afternoon. I am using KEF ACE9000 speakers and a Yamaha AVR for audio. Right now my only signal is SD from my old DirecTV STB. (I am switching to DISH network with all HD bells and whistles, but that won't be installed for about 10 more days.) This is my first plasma, but I looked at enough HDTVs of all kinds during the shopping process to feel that I know something about one should expect. All that is fair to say at this point is that I am very impressed with the manner in which the NEC is handling an SD signal delivered via an S-Video connection using a $13-Radio Shack S-video cable. This afternoon, I watched Redskins v Eagles, and in many ways the PQ was believable for HD. Watched "The Aviator" tonight and was similarly impressed. The color balance in that film varies from scene to scene, so it is a good test of the plasma itself. I have done virtually no adjusting of color balance, etc, except to cut back on the brightness a bit, because even though the default setting is 50% of max, the pic was a bit too bright. Sometimes there is a "green push", sometimes not, so I infer that this phenomenon could be related to the broadcast. I've still got to buy an upscaling DVD player and cannot decide which one to buy, between a Pio 59avi or Oppo 971H. The swivel stand is a work of industrial art in its own rite. Anyway, I am pleased with the 50XR5 and pleased also to be done with the decison making process. Thanks go to Chris at Cleveland Plasma.

If you are planing on getting Dishnetwork HDTV receiver
you can buy the new MPEG 4 receiver now (no PVR)or if you wait for a month new MPEG 4 receiver with a 350 MB hard drive PVR.
You will find all the information in satellite guys form.
regards

Yes. So far, the NEC seems to have significantly better resolution, less dithering noise and artifacting, more natural rendition of colors, and comparable black level (without floating blacks). The black levels have continued to improve with run-in of the panel and with further tweaking that I've done. Shadow detail is at least equal, I think, but I've only watched a few clips of movies with dark scenes (HDNet movies and UHD) so that's still up in the air a bit. What have I been watching? Football, what else! :)

One caveat, though. I'm using a scaler with native rate and 1:1 mapping out to the panel. This bypasses the PDP's internal scaler so don't rely solely on my observations . We need a few more owners here to chime in. Black levels/shadow detail and color performance should still be to the credit of the NEC though. I also used the scaler with the Panny but the consumer models don't accept their native rate over HDMI. The best I could ever do was 1366 x 742.

I'll try to set up a pass-thru mode on my scaler so I can see if my observations still hold when I get a chance.

cpcat, how is the light output compared to your Panasonic? Does the NEC have a dynamic contrast setting that floats the blacks like the Panasonic? Have you compared the blacks with your Panasonic in a dark room? The reason I ask this is because it is best way I have found to test the absolute black level by eye is by viewing a dark scene in a dark room. Thanks for your review and any feedback you can provide.

I have had my 50XR5 up and running only since yesterday afternoon. I am using KEF ACE9000 speakers and a Yamaha AVR for audio. Right now my only signal is SD from my old DirecTV STB. (I am switching to DISH network with all HD bells and whistles, but that won't be installed for about 10 more days.) This is my first plasma, but I looked at enough HDTVs of all kinds during the shopping process to feel that I know something about one should expect. All that is fair to say at this point is that I am very impressed with the manner in which the NEC is handling an SD signal delivered via an S-Video connection using a $13-Radio Shack S-video cable. This afternoon, I watched Redskins v Eagles, and in many ways the PQ was believable for HD. Watched "The Aviator" tonight and was similarly impressed. The color balance in that film varies from scene to scene, so it is a good test of the plasma itself. I have done virtually no adjusting of color balance, etc, except to cut back on the brightness a bit, because even though the default setting is 50% of max, the pic was a bit too bright. Sometimes there is a "green push", sometimes not, so I infer that this phenomenon could be related to the broadcast. I've still got to buy an upscaling DVD player and cannot decide which one to buy, between a Pio 59avi or Oppo 971H. The swivel stand is a work of industrial art in its own rite. Anyway, I am pleased with the 50XR5 and pleased also to be done with the decison making process. Thanks go to Chris at Cleveland Plasma.

Imarkoff, thanks for your initial thoughts. Looking to buy my first HDTV as well and the 50XR5 has captured my imagination. I notice your setup is going straight to your AVR with the sound. Have you experienced any lip sync issues from either your STB or your DVD?

cpcat, how is the light output compared to your Panasonic? Does the NEC have a dynamic contrast setting that floats the blacks like the Panasonic? Have you compared the blacks with your Panasonic in a dark room? The reason I ask this is because it is best way I have found to test the absolute black level by eye is by viewing a dark scene in a dark room. Thanks for your review and any feedback you can provide.

The NEC seems to have significantly more light output. It would probably do better in poorly controlled lighting conditions (room with alot of windows for ex.)
than the Panasonic would.

The NEC doesn't have a setting which floats blacks or I haven't found it at least. Not that I'd use it necessarily. The only pic modes available to me while feeding native rate are "default" and "normal". I don't know if the other modes float the black. I'll play with setting a pass-thru mode on my scaler so I can further investigate.

I hardly ever watch in a completely darkened room and my visual memory of this for the Panny would be absent, so there's no use in trying it. I can tell you that the blacks in the picture on the NEC look *ink black* and seem to have gotten better each day with run-in on the panel so far. The sidebars for ESPNHD are very dark grey in the in-between areas behind the logo. I can, of course, adjust the set so that these areas are nearer-black but then I lose too much shadow detail. This is comparable to the way the Panasonic behaved as well. If you take into account the floating black level on the Panny, I'd say they're about equivalent. The sidebars (Panny) were on average very dark grey with low brightness scenes versus looking more ink black when a light scene was on the screen.

when you look at picture quality (ie, with it being so close btwn the 2 panels), does the price difference still give the advantage to the Panny?

are there any audio (lip sync) issues that you notice when going through AVR?

also, have you tried out all the inputs? can you use all the inputs individually or are some tied together?

have you tried out the PIP and can you have 2 HD inputs in PIP/split screen? what is your review of the PIP feature?

thanks

The NEC seems to have significantly more light output. It would probably do better in poorly controlled lighting conditions (room with alot of windows for ex.)
than the Panasonic would.

The NEC doesn't have a setting which floats blacks or I haven't found it at least. Not that I'd use it necessarily. The only pic modes available to me while feeding native rate are "default" and "normal". I don't know if the other modes float the black. I'll play with setting a pass-thru mode on my scaler so I can further investigate.

I hardly ever watch in a completely darkened room and my visual memory of this for the Panny would be absent, so there's no use in trying it. I can tell you that the blacks in the picture on the NEC look *ink black* and seem to have gotten better each day with run-in on the panel so far. The sidebars for ESPNHD are very dark grey in the in-between areas behind the logo. I can, of course, adjust the set so that these areas are nearer-black but then I lose too much shadow detail. This is comparable to the way the Panasonic behaved as well. If you take into account the floating black level on the Panny, I'd say they're about equivalent. The sidebars (Panny) were on average very dark grey with low brightness scenes versus looking more ink black when a light scene was on the screen.

Great feedback cpcat, thanks!

I agree not many people watch a plasma in a completely dark room but it is the only way I found to visually determine black level as lighting, i.e. like using a backlight, can fool your eye and make the apparent black level look better. However since you already own a Panasonic and say the NEC black level is comparable, is already a real testament to the quality of the blacks on the NEC.

Another question, does the NEC have an image size and position adjustments in the user menu?

One last request, a while back I asked if you had looked at the Horizontal Gray Ramp test pattern on your AVIA DVD located at Title 1, Chapter 103 (also can be found by menu selecting Chapter 7 - Audio & Video Calibration, Video Test Patterns, Gray Scale & Levels, Grey Steps & Ramps, Horizontal Gray Ramp). It should be smooth with no banding or color shifts across the ramp. The eye is especially sensitive on the dark end. I think it is an easy and one of the most revealing tests for checking a display's quality. It will check the gray scale tracking, color temp variation, contrast and if there is any banding issues (also called false contouring, posterization). I have been noticing many of the recent display reviews in Home Theater Magazine include the results of this test. When you get a chance, I would much appreciate having you check this out. I think you would also find this test very interesting.

If this test looks positive my NEC is going on order! :D

Please, can anyone confirm that the 50xr5 is PAL N compatible? I saw on the specs that is "PAL compatible", but I don´t know if it is only PAL "B", PAL "M" or PAL "N" or the three of them.

Thanks in advance!

If you are planing on getting Dishnetwork HDTV receiver
you can buy the new MPEG 4 receiver now (no PVR)or if you wait for a month new MPEG 4 receiver with a 350 MB hard drive PVR.
You will find all the information in satellite guys form.
regards

Thanks for that information. I placed my order for DISH only a few days ago. I asked for the STB with two tuners and built-in DVR, and what I was sold is the 942, which I now gather has been superceded by the new box you are describing. I will get on the phone with them and try to change the order. Installation is not until the 10th of this month, so it should be possible to make a change at this point. I count their failure to inform me about the new STB as a bit of deception on the part of DISH, but in this business such practices are not novel, sad to say.

Follow-up: In the last two hours I called DISH to ask about their next generation HD STB. Both their customer rep and their tech rep denied the existence of any plans to replace the 942. They are either being deliberately deceptive or their staff is so ill-informed that they don't even know what new products are on the horizon. I believe from a perusal of :rolleyes: the DISH forum that the new product will be called the 962. Now I have to figure out how to get DISH to admit it exists and to sell it to me.

are there any audio (lip sync) issues that you notice when going through AVR?

also, have you tried out all the inputs? can you use all the inputs individually or are some tied together?

have you tried out the PIP and can you have 2 HD inputs in PIP/split screen? what is your review of the PIP feature?

thanks


I am running my sound through my AVR and have had no lip sync issues to date. mhf I will try and run the grey scale and take a pic for you as soon as I can...(I have two little ones so the time to play is a bit scarce :) )

Please, can anyone confirm that the 50xr5 is PAL N compatible? I saw on the specs that is "PAL compatible", but I don´t know if it is only PAL "B", PAL "M" or PAL "N" or the three of them.

Thanks in advance!

Checking my owner's manual, it states that the 50XR5 will support PAL-M, PAL-N, PAL 60

Imarkoff, thanks for your initial thoughts. Looking to buy my first HDTV as well and the 50XR5 has captured my imagination. I notice your setup is going straight to your AVR with the sound. Have you experienced any lip sync issues from either your STB or your DVD?

Surprised to find no problem with lipsynch using the SD feed from my DTV STB. As noted, I have no DVD player at this time. One of the reasons for purchase of the Yamaha is that it can impose delay on the audio portion, if lipsynch does become a problem.

I know we have all been doing alot of research...NEC wanted a new look for the new year it appears ...They launched a new web site...probably as sweet as there new panels........

WWW.NEC.COM (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/)

Great website .
NEC is busy making great TV's .They need to work on their models . :D :D

I saw that BIGMAC were you thinking you would get flamed....

Well ... I was expressing my opinion. Hope no one else takes this seriously.

BTW ........ NEC XR4 seems to have a higher MSRP compared with NECXR5 per the NEC website .

Why would that be ?

Yeah... and I noticed that the XM5 has a higher MSRP than the XR5 (by $1500).

Oh, and did you notice that the MSRP for the 50XR5 is $5495, but all the sites I've looked at are quoting the MSRP as $7995. Hmmm... :rolleyes:

shane

I sent an e-mail to nec about that and other glitches. The input panel shown for the new Home models "XR" are showing the wrong picture....

http://www.satelliteguys.us/forumdisplay.php?f=43

You will find product specifications discussions of the upcoming dish receivers one without PVR and the 622 with 350 megabytes of storage with dual dual and MPEG 4 over here.
You can see the product specifications over there.
The anouncement will be made in another month or less.
Apparently there is a overstock , abundance of the receivers HD with MPEG 2.If any oneone gets one they canot change it for one year period.

The customers service representatives are simply saying we do not know.
Please do read in the above forum.
regards

The specs shown on the new NEC website do not indicate that the 42xr4 has 2 HDMI inputs. Rather, it says 2 component, svideo and composite. Hopefully, this is a mistake. However, the spec sheet listed under Color Brochures seems to indicate that all 3 models have 2 HDMI inputs. Since I am interested in the 42, this is something that I would definitely like to have clarified.

As noted gliches on the new site..and quite a few.

NEC XR PDF Here (http://www.clevelandplasma.com/cms_files/File/NEC_XR5_Series.pdf)

Anybody have a link to the 50XR5 owner's manual yet?

are there any audio (lip sync) issues that you notice when going through AVR?

also, have you tried out all the inputs? can you use all the inputs individually or are some tied together?

have you tried out the PIP and can you have 2 HD inputs in PIP/split screen? what is your review of the PIP feature?

thanks

No lipsync problems. I'm only using one HDMI input via the Lumagen VisionHDP.

However, if anything, using a scaler should introduce lipsync because of the delay in the extra processing. My scaler has no audio through-put for adding extra audio delay to compensate for this. If I'm not having any problems I can't imagine anyone not adding any extra processing would.

I don't do PIP, sorry.

Can someone please speak about the screen reflectance of this set? How much refectance is there? Try the pencil test:

Take the eraser end of a pencil and hold it aginst the screen. You then will be able to judge the distance between the image on the screen and the actual glass surface the pencil is touching. The greater the distance, the more reflectance the set has, which is a bad thing. This is just another reason why Pioneer Plasmas are so good. The distance between the image and the glass in their latest panels is less than a 1/4"

Can someone please speak about the screen reflectance of this set? How much refectance is there? Try the pencil test:

Take the eraser end of a pencil and hold it aginst the screen. You then will be able to judge the distance between the image on the screen and the actual glass surface the pencil is touching. The greater the distance, the more reflectance the set has, which is a bad thing. This is just another reason why Pioneer Plasmas are so good. The distance between the image and the glass in their latest panels is less than a 1/4"


And if this fails your pencil test . You will not consider this TV? :rolleyes:

Bottomline for everyone is the picture quality.
So far there is enough to suggest that this is an excellent unit. Eqully good if not better than Panasonic .

There's no failure. It's just a reference point. I know my viewing environment will be in bright daylight interiors. I need the least amount of reflectance possible. What I like about this set is that it appears to be better than the Panny's (which I never thought were that great, anyway) and I'm only paying for a display and not a tuner or speakers.

Does this set have a seperate processing box for all the wiring like the Pioneers?

No...the wires are either on the back or on the bottom of the set, depending upon the model.

Great feedback cpcat, thanks!



Another question, does the NEC have an image size and position adjustments in the user menu?

One last request, a while back I asked if you had looked at the Horizontal Gray Ramp test pattern on your AVIA DVD located at Title 1, Chapter 103 (also can be found by menu selecting Chapter 7 - Audio & Video Calibration, Video Test Patterns, Gray Scale & Levels, Grey Steps & Ramps, Horizontal Gray Ramp). It should be smooth with no banding or color shifts across the ramp. The eye is especially sensitive on the dark end.

If this test looks positive my NEC is going on order! :D

Yes, there are image size/position adjustments. There are also individual color adjustments for red, green, blue, cyan, magenta, etc. as well as grey scale adjustment via individual RGB gain and bias.

The horizontal grey ramp looks relatively smooth without banding via my scaler. I can still see steps in the pattern though. It's not analog afterall. With the scaler bypassed, there are two thin yellowish bands on the right (darker) side of the ramp but overall it's still fairly smooth. This seems to be fairly similar whether feeding 1080i, 720p, or 480p to the panel via my LG upconverting DVD player.

Yes, there are image size/position adjustments. There are also individual color adjustments for red, green, blue, cyan, magenta, etc. as well as grey scale adjustment via individual RGB gain and bias.

The horizontal grey ramp looks relatively smooth without banding via my scaler. I can still see steps in the pattern though. It's not analog afterall. With the scaler bypassed, there are two thin yellowish bands on the right (darker) side of the ramp but overall it's still fairly smooth. This seems to be fairly similar whether feeding 1080i, 720p, or 480p to the panel via my LG upconverting DVD player.

cpcat, thanks for checking this out!

Interesting though that you say that the gray scale ramp pattern has steps as the "ramp" patterns in the AVIA Gray Scale Steps & Ramps menu should be continous however the "step" patterns will have definite steps. Here is a link to a picture I took of the horizontal grey ramp from my Hitachi plasma. Is this the pattern you tested?

http://gallery.avsforum.com/showphoto.php/photo/17374/size/big/ppuser/12035

Notice the banding and color shift in the gray scale ramp. This is not good as it results my Hitachi having banding issues as shown in these pictures.

http://gallery.avsforum.com/showphoto.php/photo/17373/size/big/ppuser/12035
http://gallery.avsforum.com/showphoto.php/photo/17372/size/big/ppuser/12035

There's no failure. It's just a reference point. I know my viewing environment will be in bright daylight interiors. I need the least amount of reflectance possible. What I like about this set is that it appears to be better than the Panny's (which I never thought were that great, anyway) and I'm only paying for a display and not a tuner or speakers.

Does this set have a seperate processing box for all the wiring like the Pioneers?

Glare/reflection reduction seem to be strong points for NEC from opinions I've read. I recall reading many negative pdp reflection issues related to other brands though. However, I also recall reading that all plasmas tend to be more reflective than other display technologies. I suspect that NEC would probably be your best option for reduced reflection in the realm of plasmas, but if it's a huge concern then maybe you'd be better off with LCD instead?

On a sidenote, here's some more pics I found for the xr5...

http://www.nec.se/upload/bilder/produkter/Plasma/Nya%20modeller%2020051114/Plasma%20Display%20_2.jpg

http://www.nec.se/upload/bilder/produkter/Plasma/Nya%20modeller%2020051114/Plasma%20Display%20_1.jpg

http://www.nec.se/upload/bilder/produkter/Plasma/Nya%20modeller%2020051114/Plasma%20Display%20_3.jpg

Before I forget again....To all the new NEC owners or anyone who wants to take a chance don't forget to register to win your Home Theater Makeover with NEC. That would be sweet if a forum member won this.

INFO HERE (http://www.necvisualsystems.com/FamilyRoomContest/entry.cfm)

TahoeJR, thank you very much for the info. Greatly appreciated!

Notice the banding and color shift in the gray scale ramp. This is not good as it results my Hitachi having banding issues as shown in these pictures.



I don't see those artifacts with normal viewing.

The problem with this test is that you are relying on a DVD source. My DVD player fulfills my needs for now, but there are much better players out there.
Even then, the resolution is still limited.

HDNet test patterns would be better. I'd still be surprised if it was perfectly smooth if both the source and display are digital. I'll bet it would be pretty smooth on a CRT.

I don't see those artifacts with normal viewing.

The problem with this test is that you are relying on a DVD source. My DVD player fulfills my needs for now, but there are much better players out there.
Even then, the resolution is still limited.

HDNet test patterns would be better. I'd still be surprised if it was perfectly smooth if both the source and display are digital. I'll bet it would be pretty smooth on a CRT.

I have seen the gray scale ramp test pattern on a Pioneer 5060 and it is very smooth and it shows in actual video material, any shadow or onscreen transistion from light to dark is smooth and natural and this would be the case with any display that shows this test pattern smoothly. That's what is nice about running the pattern as it tells a lot about the PQ without searching for a scene that does something similar.

If a display showed the gray scale ramp pattern with banding and color variation it would definitely need the gray scale tracking adjusted. However if it is very severe it might be almost impossible to adjust it out, like on my Hitachi. If you have ever seen the gray scale plots in the Home Theater Magazine display reviews, a smooth plot results in a smooth gray scale ramp pattern, a jagged plot will result in banding and color variation in the gray scale ramp pattern.

I would be interesting to see a photo of the gray scale ramp from the NEC.

screen reflectance of this set
I purchased the xr5 because it stated great anti-reflectance, but i haven't had a chance to test it out. It has been raining here for 10 days straight. I have glass brick windows that created beautiful defused light in the after noon. _very bright_
but not glaring so no curtains. I 'll post on a sunny day.
db

^^^It does not need to be sunny. If you are not seeing much glare on a rainy day you won't see any more ona sunny day. Thanks for the investigation.

I have seen the gray scale ramp test pattern on a Pioneer 5060 and it is very smooth and it shows in actual video material, any shadow or onscreen transistion from light to dark is smooth and natural and this would be the case with any display that shows this test pattern smoothly. That's what is nice about running the pattern as it tells a lot about the PQ without searching for a scene that does something similar.

If a display showed the gray scale ramp pattern with banding and color variation it would definitely need the gray scale tracking adjusted. I would be interesting to see a photo of the gray scale ramp from the NEC.

I'll play with it some more and see if I can get it looking smoother. I'm no expert though, but the good thing is that the grey scale adjustment can be set back to factory defaults throught the menu so it can't hurt to try. I'm going to play with the color temp adjustments first, then saturation, then the grey scale adustments last. I'll try to post a photo.

I'll play with it some more and see if I can get it looking smoother. I'm no expert though, but the good thing is that the grey scale adjustment can be set back to factory defaults throught the menu so it can't hurt to try. I'm going to play with the color temp adjustments first, then saturation, then the grey scale adustments last. I'll try to post a photo.

Wow, a quick scan of the owners manual I got email to me from NEC and this looks like the swiss army knife of plasmas, with just about every control and adjustment feature imaginable! A link to the manual should be posted shortly.

No...the wires are either on the back or on the bottom of the set, depending upon the model.

Sorry to contradict you, but all the inputs and outputs on my new 50XR5 are on the right hand side (not rear) of the panel, as you face the screen, an extremely convenient location, I might add.

I stand corrected...you are exactly right.

Sorry to contradict you, but all the inputs and outputs on my new 50XR5 are on the right hand side (not rear) of the panel, as you face the screen, an extremely convenient location, I might add.

Does this pose a problem with cables sticking out of the side or is there enough room to bend them down and still be hidden from view behind the panel?

definitely enough room to tuck them down unseen...unless you have a clear view of the side of the PDP like me. I was able to use the cover from my VR5 though to hide (they sell it for like $60).

Does this pose a problem with cables sticking out of the side or is there enough room to bend them down and still be hidden from view behind the panel?

Yes, indeed, if that side of the panel is viewable (which depends on your set up) it is not pretty. But there is a solution.

For my model (XM2) NEC offered a cover for the cable side of the panel. I have it and works great. See if they still do with the current models - I'd be surprised they didn't.

ww

I stand corrected...you are exactly right.

The inputs are on the back/bottom-center of the 42 inch model according to the owner's manual. They are on the back right (as you look from the front) on the 50 and 61 inch and inset around 3 inches from the side.

Does this pose a problem with cables sticking out of the side or is there enough room to bend them down and still be hidden from view behind the panel?

It's not directly on the side. It's in-set about 3 inches so it's still hidden behind the panel as you look from the front.

mhfnet: can you give us any tidbits from the owner's manual in terms of any user adjustments we didn't know about?

mhfnet, here is a quick pick of the grayscale from AVIA. Again, crappy dvd player via component, but it looks pretty good to me...will try again tomorrow with a good camera

http://www.satelliteguys.us/forumdisplay.php?f=43

You will find product specifications discussions of the upcoming dish receivers one without PVR and the 622 with 350 megabytes of storage with dual dual and MPEG 4 over here.
You can see the product specifications over there.
The anouncement will be made in another month or less.
Apparently there is a overstock , abundance of the receivers HD with MPEG 2.If any oneone gets one they canot change it for one year period.

The customers service representatives are simply saying we do not know.
Please do read in the above forum.
regards

Just to say thanks to Johnson5 for this informative response, better and more to the point than the responses I got on the DISH thread in DBStalk. I guess I will delay my installation date by about a month and see what happens in the interim. And now, back to the NEC plasma thread. (This whole discussion of satellite is spurred by my burning desire to secure a high quality HD-via-HDMI source so I can really see what my 50XR5 can do. I am already growing tired of the limitations of all-SD via S-video viewing.) Gotta buy an upsampling DVD player too, I guess.

I also noticed tonight that you can use the Stadium stretch mode with 720p adn 1080i material as well. Last years models you could only stretch with 2.35:1 or anamorphic, but being able to stretch HD material with the Stadium is pretty nice.....

If you are looking at the TV, what side do the cables get plugged into!?

My 50xr5 will be arrriving on the 9th :D

Unfortunately, I will be leaving for vacation on the 7th :(

I'm gonna have to have someone here to receive it. I won't get back until the 16th so I'm gonna have to miss out on all that quality time we could've had together before then :(

I noticed something on the screen last night. I played Blade runner, to view black levels. I 'm in wide screen, so black bands top/bottem. I could see vary faintly upper right conner __ DVD VIDEO__ Then on upper left corner other faint letters -words. going down from the black band into the screeen, they were present in the picture too.. when darker images were produced. very faint but i saw it at 12' away.
{ these images _words_are the lettering from my DVD Panrp82 setup screen}
I did not leave the setup screen on at all- even the last time i used the xr5 or dvd player. It had been off for 24 hr. what am i seeing and Why?
db

Good news people: mhfnet sent me the manual this morning and it's now up and available for your viewing pleasure at http://www.calim.org/xr5_manual.pdf . Please let me know if you have any issues accessing the file.

Cheerio.

I noticed something on the screen last night. I played Blade runner, to view black levels. I 'm in wide screen, so black bands top/bottem. I could see vary faintly upper right conner __ DVD VIDEO__ Then on upper left corner other faint letters -words. going down from the black band into the screeen, they were present in the picture too.. when darker images were produced. very faint but i saw it at 12' away.
{ these images _words_are the lettering from my DVD Panrp82 setup screen}
I did not leave the setup screen on at all- even the last time i used the xr5 or dvd player. It had been off for 24 hr. what am i seeing and Why?
db

It sounds like you have image retention. I'd run a DVD loop to see if that gets rid of it. Make sure it's a 1.85:1 or 1:78:1 DVD with no black bars.
You need to limit any static images to a minimum for the first 100 hours and be sure to fill the screen. Also, consider turning pdp orbiting on in the function menu if it's not already.

Finally, in the function menu, there is a screen wiper, white screen, inverse white screen. These can help, too, but the DVD loop is probably the best option as that also will run-in the panel some which will make it less susceptible to image retention. The inverse white screen in theory should be used with the same offending screen image which caused the image retention.

See http://www.fcw.com/vendorsolutions/panasonicplasma.pdf for other tips on break-in.

Thanks, i thought i had been carefull. Change the picture quite often when watching, using full piture and only using letterbox a few time. Turned the xr5 on this morning and on the blank screen i could see -upper left- the word- PANASONIC-!!! went to menu- screen wiper,white and inverse. it's clean now. i'll be even more carefull....
db

If you are looking at the TV, what side do the cables get plugged into!?

Video connections are on the right hand side of the TV when you look at it. Power plugs into the bottom of the set, as well as onboard audio.

Good news people: mhfnet sent me the manual this morning and it's now up and available for your viewing pleasure at http://www.calim.org/xr5_manual.pdf . Please let me know if you have any issues accessing the file.

Cheerio.

Thanks calim!

The manual covers the 42XR4, 50XR5 and 61XR4 models. Should help answer many questions.

Thanks, i thought i had been carefull. Change the picture quite often when watching, using full piture and only using letterbox a few time. Turned the xr5 on this morning and on the blank screen i could see -upper left- the word- PANASONIC-!!! went to menu- screen wiper,white and inverse. it's clean now. i'll be even more carefull....
db

Since this was a issue with the last model year models, it would interesting to hear from those owners if the retention issue went away or significantly reduced after the break-in period.

I noticed something on the screen last night. I played Blade runner, to view black levels. I 'm in wide screen, so black bands top/bottem. I could see vary faintly upper right conner __ DVD VIDEO__ Then on upper left corner other faint letters -words. going down from the black band into the screeen, they were present in the picture too.. when darker images were produced. very faint but i saw it at 12' away.
{ these images _words_are the lettering from my DVD Panrp82 setup screen}
I did not leave the setup screen on at all- even the last time i used the xr5 or dvd player. It had been off for 24 hr. what am i seeing and Why?
db

not to worry DAB, even though sort of scarey at first, I know, been there :)

My guess is that if you turn the thing off with last shown some static image prone to cause retention, then it will simply stay there for you to find the next time you turn it on.

How old is your panel ? As it is commonly said around here, I am pretty sure it depends a lot on age. My panel, now 2+ year old, has not shown any signigicant image retention in a long time if at all.

You did the right thing with a bit of wiper and white screen ....

good luck !

Video connections are on the right hand side of the TV when you look at it. Power plugs into the bottom of the set, as well as onboard audio.

This holds for the 50 and 61 inch models. The 42 inch model has the video inputs on the bottom. I like the inputs on the side, actually. They are easier to access but yet still inset from the edge enough to hide the connections.

On a side note, I've made a big change with my 50XR5. I took the external scaler out of the loop entirely. Guess what? The picture is better overall!!
Better blacks, color, contrast. Overall, a richer, more natural image but with no loss in perceived resolution and I think even *less* noise/artifacting. This is one nice set. Thanks to mnfnet for spurring me on to look at the AVIA grey ramps. :) Once I started playing around with the grey scale adjustments, I found I could actually get a nice smooth ramp with the scaler in bypass mode while I still had a few bands with the scaler in the loop.

Here are the results of my adjustments so far. I'm using HDMI/DVI inputs:

Contrast 48
Brt 36
Color 28
Tint 31
Color temp Mid-low with below adjustments
* GR 34
* GG 27
* GB 30
* BR 40
* BG 40
* BB 40
Gamma 2.2
Pedestal 0
Picture mode Theater 1
Low tone auto

Be sure HDMI is set to High in Set Up assuming you aren't using a PC level source.

This has produced the smoothest grey ramp via AVIA so far. It's without banding whatsoever and bright white to near black. It seems to be neutral grey to my eye. The bias adjustments don't seem to affect the banding as much, but change the overall tint of grey. I ended up leaving them at defaults as that seemed to look the best.

*Edit 1/10: I've gone back to default color temperature setting at "mid". In spite of the fact that the AVIA grey ramp doesn't look quite as smooth, it provides much more accurate colors. I was back to "wow" again last night with CSI Miami.

Also, "low tone" set to 1 at first seemed to improve the blacks a little, but it's stealing too much shadow detail. Went back to "auto".

I guess I'll stick to my day job afterall. :)

I'll leave grey scale adjustment to someone who knows what they're doing.

have any owners tried out the PIP? can you have 2 HD inputs in PIP/split screen? what is your review of the PIP feature?

have any owners tried out the PIP? can you have 2 HD inputs in PIP/split screen? what is your review of the PIP feature?

I'll give it a try and get back to you.

My big news: I ordered a 42xr4 tonight from Chris at Cleveland Plasma...am eager for it to arrive so that I can experience the great picture that many of you have found from the NEC plasma.

Thanks to everyone who posted their reviews here. They were tremendously helpful in my decision-making process.

My big news: I ordered a 42xr4 tonight from Chris at Cleveland Plasma...am eager for it to arrive so that I can experience the great picture that many of you have found from the NEC plasma.

Thanks to everyone who posted their reviews here. They were tremendously helpful in my decision-making process.

Congratulations Lisa! Let us know if it performs as well as everyone else's 50XR5 when you get it. I'm guessing it should, but it seems there are a few electronic differences when viewing the specs.

I am trying to decide between the Panny 42PX50U and the 42XR4 so I am very interested in your review. ;)

Has anyone compared these new NEC's to a Pioneer 5050 or 5060 plasma. What I like most about the pioneers are the rich "punchy" vibrate colors. I also like the "bright" output of the pioneers. Can anyone who has seen both brands do a comparison?

From what I understand, the NEC's and the Pioneers share some technology.

Paul

Hi all

Just received my 50SRX5. Chris ( Cleveland plasma) great job in shipping it safe from such a long distance .
Beautifully designed unit .
Opened the box , opened my brand new oppo . Hooked it up using HDMI.
I am watching bug's life with my 2 yr old .
Simply one word fantastic .............
At times you do get the 3D feeling . Great colors, excellent contrast . No tweaking just default out of box .
I am no expert reviewer, but hunting for a plasma , i have seen it all , so far the best unit definitely above panasonic in my 15 minutes ,initial limited review . Will discuss some more reviews and issues as i go along .
Happy with my decision .

you got it Big Mac ! congrats and many many hours of great fun with your new panel on your little one !
..btw, so much better for those little children anyway

cpcat....thanks for the settings you posted. I tried them out and the picture looks fantastic. I did a couple of little tweaks, but probably due to the difference in setups. I find it amazing that you found the NEC's scaler to be superior to your external one. That really says alot about what the NEC provides.

I took some pics tonight and will be sending them to Chris at Cleveland Plasma tomorrow so that he can host them for me. They look pretty good, but nothing like what the experience is like in person. It seems like the PQ really does get better as the panel breaks in...anyone else agree?

Back to watching USC finally go down!

Has anyone compared these new NEC's to a Pioneer 5050 or 5060 plasma.

From what I understand, the NEC's and the Pioneers share some technology.

Paul

From some earlier spec's, there isn't as much shared components as expected, even though they come out of the same manufacturing plant.

I do believe though they both Pioneer and NEC are comparable in their level of vibrant colours and imagery.

have any owners tried out the PIP? can you have 2 HD inputs in PIP/split screen? what is your review of the PIP feature?

I was viewing the side by side PIP with HD & DVD and was very impressed with the level of detail. I found this to stand out more so than the traditional large/small windows.

cpcat....thanks for the settings you posted. I tried them out and the picture looks fantastic. I did a couple of little tweaks, but probably due to the difference in setups. I find it amazing that you found the NEC's scaler to be superior to your external one. That really says alot about what the NEC provides.

I took some pics tonight and will be sending them to Chris at Cleveland Plasma tomorrow so that he can host them for me. They look pretty good, but nothing like what the experience is like in person. It seems like the PQ really does get better as the panel breaks in...anyone else agree?

Back to watching USC finally go down!

I do agree it seems to get better with time. Hard to say whether it's break-in or whether the adjustments you make are the difference.

I also have tweaked those original settings just a bit. I put the color/tint back at default values and upped the GR and GB by one notch in the white balance adjustment. The earlier post was revised to reflect this. It seemed to look more natural with the game last night.

What a game, eh?

I was reading through the "model information" packet for the 50XR5 which is sent as a separate supplement to the owners manual this morning and ran across in the specs under "other features" that the 50XR5 employs a "Motion Compensated 3D Scan Converter". It lists all available interlaced signals for this including 1080i. The color brochure on the website says "Motion Adaptive 3D Scan Converter" however.

For those who don't know, motion compensated deinterlacing for 1080i signals is only available in the newest and most expensive external scalers and is just now becoming available. I'm unaware of any other pdp that employs it. Up to now, motion adaptive was the best. The new NEC TheaterSync scaler employs the new Realta chip with the motion compensation and does it as well. This scaler goes for several grand.

If this holds true, it's *great* news for new 50XR5 owners and probably means the 50XR5 has the new Realta chip. It could also explain why I'm no longer using my external scaler. :)

I'd be very interested in what is says in the model info supplement for the 42XR4 and 61XR4 as well.

CPCAT,
On a side note, I've made a big change with my 50XR5. I took the external scaler out of the loop entirely. Guess what? The picture is better overall!!CAT,

1. How do you remove external scaler out? Is this sperate box. or inside a dvd player ?

2. I get a small pip { same picture} on my screen when i hit the zoom mode. and then click _single pic_ on remote. not understanding what is happening here.

3. i have turn all the menus items down and haven't calibrated until i get the 100hr. mark. It has been mention that calib. a SD feed _comcast_ wasn't of value because each station comes in differently. Any univeral setting here.

4. i want 5 memory setting. a. bright afternoon tv-HD, b. grey afternoon tv- HD c. night dark movie experience- dvd d. night tv movie HD. e. day SD setting.
Any issues i should address ?
db

1. How do you remove external scaler out? Is this sperate box. or inside a dvd player ?

I have an external scaler (Lumagen VisionHDP). I simply unhooked it and attached the source (STB, DVD) directly to the TV via the HDMI inputs.

2. I get a small pip { same picture} on my screen when i hit the zoom mode. and then click _single pic_ on remote. not understanding what is happening here.

Not sure. You have to have two separate sources hooked up for PIP to function properly though. I've not used PIP much yet.

3. i have turn all the menus items down and haven't calibrated until i get the 100hr. mark. It has been mention that calib. a SD feed _comcast_ wasn't of value because each station comes in differently. Any univeral setting here.

No. SD will probably require separate settings for best picture. I just set it up for HD as that's mostly what I watch.

4. i want 5 memory setting. a. bright afternoon tv-HD, b. grey afternoon tv- HD c. night dark movie experience- dvd d. night tv movie HD. e. day SD setting.
Any issues i should address ?
db
You just need to set 5 different picture memories. You can then access them by the picture memory button on the remote.

http://www.necvisualsystems.com/Products/Product/?product=8aac5582-4062-4352-9be4-61e01e59df43

from NEC.com , the image of the video/HDMI inputs -- side pannel is not the one i have. Europe/Japan model ???

from NEC.com , the image of the video/HDMI inputs -- side pannel is not the one i have. Europe/Japan model ???

I think some of those pictures may be recycled from previous generations. It shows the same picture for the 42XR4 when it has bottom inputs, and the picture of the swivel stand is obviously not the correct pic either. They stand they show doesn't even appear to swivel.

Hi all

Just received my 50SRX5. Chris ( Cleveland plasma) great job in shipping it safe from such a long distance .
Beautifully designed unit .
Opened the box , opened my brand new oppo . Hooked it up using HDMI.
I am watching bug's life with my 2 yr old .
Simply one word fantastic .............
At times you do get the 3D feeling . Great colors, excellent contrast . No tweaking just default out of box .
.

Big Mac, I am very interested to learn that you are using a new Oppo with your 50XR5. I was going to buy the Oppo also to go with my 50XR5, but I have hesitated to make a purchase, because of other posts (on the DVD player thread) which indicate that players using the Faroudja chip, like the Oppo, are prone to a phenomenon called "Macroblock Enhancement" (usually abbreviated MB or MBE), especially when used with plasma displays, which is said to be quite noticeable and annoying. Apparently the Oppo works better with some plasmas than with others in this regard. Please let me (us) know how it goes with the Oppo in the next few days of viewing. I was just about to bite the bullet and buy a Pioneer 59avi instead.

By the way, I had a good buying experience with Chris too, but in fairness he does not ship the panels; they come from his warehouse in Seattle directly to your doorstep, if you hadn't noticed, or at least mine did. This is in no way intended as a criticism of Chris or Cleveland Plasma. Chris was patient and helpful throughout the buying process, from ordering to delivery and afterwards.

Has anyone compared these new NEC's to a Pioneer 5050 or 5060 plasma. What I like most about the pioneers are the rich "punchy" vibrate colors. I also like the "bright" output of the pioneers. Can anyone who has seen both brands do a comparison?

From what I understand, the NEC's and the Pioneers share some technology.

Paul

I am also considering the Pio 5060 vs. the new 50" NEC. It appears that the costs for the components you get (ie stand, speakers, etc.) is comparable, if not higher for the NEC. I would therefore likely opt for the set with the best PQ with a variety of source material. Can anyone directly compare the Pio and the NEC in HD, digital SD, analog SD and/or DVD quality?

BTW: TVAuthority will soon have these for sale. They will be "Picture Perfect" but not "5 Star."

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/7607/nec25kl.jpg

TVAuthority will soon have these for sale. They will be "Picture Perfect" but not "5 Star."

'squze my ignorance, but what is '5 Star'? :o

Thanks

shane

Edit... oops! Just saw the link on their site. Sorry. Nevermind.

mhfnet, here is a quick pick of the grayscale from AVIA. Again, crappy dvd player via component, but it looks pretty good to me...will try again tomorrow with a good camera

Tony, any luck with the taking a photo of the AVIA Horizontal Gray Ramp pattern? You can upload the photo to the AVSforum photo gallery or send it to me at the email address I PM you. Thanks again. ;)

BTW: TVAuthority will soon have these for sale. They will be "Picture Perfect" but not "5 Star."

Their "5 star" program meaning the following...
____________________________________________________________ ___

TVAuthority’s team of industry experts certify a select number of 5-Star Products based on Price, Performance, Availability, service and support. We are so certain that you will like these products, we guarantee it!

1. 30-day risk free guarantee
2. No restocking fee
3. Product Availability - All 5-star products will be in stock within 3 days of your order or you get free ground shipping*
4. Lifetime Technical Support
5. Authorized Dealer Commitment - Your warranty will always be honored, and that you will receive any advertized rebates.
____________________________________________________________ ____

I was reading through the "model information" packet for the 50XR5 which is sent as a separate supplement to the owners manual this morning and ran across in the specs under "other features" that the 50XR5 employs a "Motion Compensated 3D Scan Converter". It lists all available interlaced signals for this including 1080i. The color brochure on the website says "Motion Adaptive 3D Scan Converter" however.

For those who don't know, motion compensated deinterlacing for 1080i signals is only available in the newest and most expensive external scalers and is just now becoming available. I'm unaware of any other pdp that employs it. Up to now, motion adaptive was the best. The new NEC TheaterSync scaler employs the new Realta chip with the motion compensation and does it as well. This scaler goes for several grand.

If this holds true, it's *great* news for new 50XR5 owners and probably means the 50XR5 has the new Realta chip. It could also explain why I'm no longer using my external scaler. :)

I'd be very interested in what is says in the model info supplement for the 42XR4 and 61XR4 as well.

Here is a good question then: Who would agree that a progressive scan DVD player would look just as good as an upscaling DVD player seeing the NEC has an excellent scaler built in.

Could this be another reason NEC is one of the leaders in plasma technology and even thought they are a little more at first glance compared to some, the value is higher???

I was reading through the "model information" packet for the 50XR5 which is sent as a separate supplement to the owners manual this morning and ran across in the specs under "other features" that the 50XR5 employs a "Motion Compensated 3D Scan Converter". It lists all available interlaced signals for this including 1080i. The color brochure on the website says "Motion Adaptive 3D Scan Converter" however.

For those who don't know, motion compensated deinterlacing for 1080i signals is only available in the newest and most expensive external scalers and is just now becoming available. I'm unaware of any other pdp that employs it. Up to now, motion adaptive was the best. The new NEC TheaterSync scaler employs the new Realta chip with the motion compensation and does it as well. This scaler goes for several grand.

If this holds true, it's *great* news for new 50XR5 owners and probably means the 50XR5 has the new Realta chip. It could also explain why I'm no longer using my external scaler.

I would love to believe that my new 50XR5 has incorporated the Realta chip, but do you really think that NEC would do such a thing and not be trumpeting it from the rooftops? It would give them a tremendous marketing edge over the other 50-inch competition. If anyone can confirm or deny cpcat's analysis, I would like to know too. I can tell from watching SD that it has a darn good de-interlacer/upscaler, but it would be truly remarkable if they are using the Realta.

Big Mac, I am very interested to learn that you are using a new Oppo with your 50XR5. I was going to buy the Oppo also to go with my 50XR5, but I have hesitated to make a purchase, because of other posts (on the DVD player thread) which indicate that players using the Faroudja chip, like the Oppo, are prone to a phenomenon called "Macroblock Enhancement" (usually abbreviated MB or MBE), especially when used with plasma displays, which is said to be quite noticeable and annoying. Apparently the Oppo works better with some plasmas than with others in this regard. Please let me (us) know how it goes with the Oppo in the next few days of viewing. I was just about to bite the bullet and buy a Pioneer 59avi instead.

By the way, I had a good buying experience with Chris too, but in fairness he does not ship the panels; they come from his warehouse in Seattle directly to your doorstep, if you hadn't noticed, or at least mine did. This is in no way intended as a criticism of Chris or Cleveland Plasma. Chris was patient and helpful throughout the buying process, from ordering to delivery and afterwards.


Hi,

I have watched 2 movies, bug's life and Batman begins . I did not see any macroblocking . I was focusing mostly on fast moving scenes. So far none , if i come across any over next several days . I will definitely report here .
Chris did a good job . I know he does not ship them directly from Cleveland .Mine was shipped from pennsylvania . He used a good freight company to ship . Overall i had good buying experience from him .

I would love to believe that my new 50XR5 has incorporated the Realta chip, but do you really think that NEC would do such a thing and not be trumpeting it from the rooftops?


NEC is a very reputable company . I won't be surprised if they have used this chip and are not bragging . That is so NEC.

Big Mac, I am very interested to learn that you are using a new Oppo with your 50XR5. I was going to buy the Oppo also to go with my 50XR5, but I have hesitated to make a purchase, because of other posts (on the DVD player thread) which indicate that players using the Faroudja chip, like the Oppo, are prone to a phenomenon called "Macroblock Enhancement" (usually abbreviated MB or MBE), especially when used with plasma displays, which is said to be quite noticeable and annoying. Apparently the Oppo works better with some plasmas than with others in this regard. Please let me (us) know how it goes with the Oppo in the next few days of viewing. I was just about to bite the bullet and buy a Pioneer 59avi instead.

By the way, I had a good buying experience with Chris too, but in fairness he does not ship the panels; they come from his warehouse in Seattle directly to your doorstep, if you hadn't noticed, or at least mine did. This is in no way intended as a criticism of Chris or Cleveland Plasma. Chris was patient and helpful throughout the buying process, from ordering to delivery and afterwards.

I have the DVI Oppo player (purchased new last summer) which I use with both a pj and a NEC XM2 - no macorblocking whatsoever.

Are any of you ordering thru online vendors? Can you recommend any? I have found projectorpoint_dot_com to have the lowest price I could find, but I have no idea on their reputability or shipping charge. I would consider buying from a local vendor, but none of the vendors NEC told me were in Indianapolis replied to email. One was no longer in business, most others were business-to-business installation contractors, and the final one has a reputation for being a high-brow, esoteric store and is far more expensive than big-box stores.

This group's enthusiasm for the 50XR5 is contagious, but I have seen no professional published reviews yet. Thought briefly about getting the Visio for about 30% less than the prevailing plasma prices. It has two HDMI's, and is well-reviewed as best bang-for-the-buck. It didn't have screen saving options, nor did it have any extensive calibration, so I've held off.

Let me know about the internet vendors, as I'd love to get one on order quickly. What have lead times been like?

Thank you, this is my first post!

EDIT>>

no price other than MSRP, please. Thanks

f.

Let me know about the internet vendors, as I'd love to get one on order quickly. What have lead times been like?

Thank you, this is my first post![/QUOTE]

Most vendors sponsoring the forum would be reliable .
Most people in this thread bought from Cleveland Plasma and have had good experience .
Cleveland plasma link is at the bottom of the page .

Welcome, Quinocampa. I think that lead times have been short. I ordered a 42 inch NEC on Wednesday evening and it is due to be delivered on Tuesday. It would have been here sooner but I wanted to wait for the stand to arrive.

I agree with Big Mac. Check out the forum sponsors at the top and bottom of the page. Chris from Cleveland Plasma has been good to deal with thus far and I have had good experience with Visual Apex.

Be careful about posting prices other than MSRP. The mods will usually delete the prices.

Are any of you ordering thru online vendors? Can you recommend any? I have found projectorpoint_dot_com to have the lowest price . . .

Quinocampa, welcome to the forum. First thing you need to do is edit your post to remove the pricing information. Forum policy is to adhere to MSRP's only.

I believe that almost all of us who provided the user input above have orders from Chris at Cleveland Plasma. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them.

My advice would be to follow those who have had successful buying experiences for the product you are looking for.

Sorry about the late catch, and thanks.:)

Quinocampa, welcome to the forum. First thing you need to do is edit your post to remove the pricing information. Forum policy is to adhere to MSRP's only.

.

Okay, thanks for the heads up. I did read the obligatory agreement when registering, but must have missed this point. If you don't mind, could you briefly expound on the philosophy of this policy? We are all consumers, and I thought finding the "best" vendor from service/price/support standpoints would be a hot topic. I am here first to get the best PQ and performance from my future plasma, so I'm not going to cry about not being able to talk price. Am just curious.

This group's enthusiasm for the 50XR5 is contagious, but I have seen no professional published reviews yet.

Read enough of these posts and you will see members here are nothin but

Professional

Are any of you ordering thru online vendors? Can you recommend any? I have found projectorpoint_dot_com to have the lowest price I could find, but I have no idea on their reputability or shipping charge.

Let me know about the internet vendors, as I'd love to get one on order quickly. What have lead times been like?

I placed my order with projectorpoint for the 50xr5 on 12-10-05 (they were backordered of course) and it is scheduled to arrive on 1-9-06. 50" plasmas always seem to be much less available compared to other sizes from what I've noticed. People speak highly of cleveland plasma so I'm sure you would be happy ordering from him too.

Here's the current status on my order from projectorpoint...

1. 1Z 567 093 42 4771 528 9
In Transit -
On Time

Sched. Delivery: 01/09/2006
Shipped to: RENO, NV, US
Service Type: GROUND

Your package is in the UPS system and is on time with a scheduled delivery date of 01/09/2006.

Tracking results provided by UPS: 01/06/2006 1:55 A.M. Eastern Time (USA)

My 50xr5 will be arrriving on the 9th :D

Unfortunately, I will be leaving for vacation on the 7th :(

I'm gonna have to have someone here to receive it. I won't get back until the 16th so I'm gonna have to miss out on all that quality time we could've had together before then :(

Just a note: Who ever signes may want to unbox your panel as almost all venders have a 48 hour window to report consealed shipping damage. Be careful if you wait to inspect your panel it may be to late. Might even want to delay it for your own inspection.

I would love to believe that my new 50XR5 has incorporated the Realta chip, but do you really think that NEC would do such a thing and not be trumpeting it from the rooftops? It would give them a tremendous marketing edge over the other 50-inch competition. If anyone can confirm or deny cpcat's analysis, I would like to know too. I can tell from watching SD that it has a darn good de-interlacer/upscaler, but it would be truly remarkable if they are using the Realta.

I spoke to NEC tech support about this yesterday and the question was referred to an engineer, but I've not heard back yet.

I went back and read some in the video processor forum and I found that motion compensated deinterlacing is even too much for Realta. The best currently available seems to be motion adaptive. The Realta HQV (Hollywood Quality Video) is certainly touted as being on of the best new chips, though.

I guess the model supplement pamphlet has a typo. :(

It's still possible they use Realta. I would also be surprised as they don't use it in marketing. Also, I think the HQV logo is usually applied if the chip is there. See http://www.necvisualsystems.com/Products/Product/?product=3b6e2bff-afbb-4306-97a6-0244061f690a and use the magnifying glass.

Anyone know how to post pics that are not HUGE. I just linked some that Chris was hosting for me and they showed up HUGE!

This group's enthusiasm for the 50XR5 is contagious, but I have seen no professional published reviews yet. Thought briefly about getting the Visio for about 30% less than the prevailing plasma prices. It has two HDMI's, and is well-reviewed as best bang-for-the-buck. It didn't have screen saving options, nor did it have any extensive calibration, so I've held off.

Thank you, this is my first post!

EDIT>>

no price other than MSRP, please. Thanks

Welcome to the forum.
Contagious is good only to the extent that it adds "information". Now, as to what is good info and bad info I am afraid it is something that we have to decide on our own.

Read through the lines, note who's posting what and in most cases you'll be able to tell when the info is genuine, b/s, marketing .... Ultimately use your own judgement. And if you are seeking professional opinions, this is not in my view the first place to search even though you will find references to reviews.

As to online NEC vendors, I have used TVA, a sponsor here at AVS, for my NEC 2 years ago and was very happy (but in this business 2 years might be a long time). I used very recently Visual Apex for the purchase of a pj and was also very happy.

Good luck !

Tony, go to imageshack.com, they will resize them for you and host as well.

http://www.imageshack.us/

Okay, thanks to calim who was kind enough to resize and host these for me, below are a couple picks of the game the other night. I was a little hesitant to post these because this was before I had done any picture setting tweaks and the picture quality has definitely improved since these. Nonetheless, they do show some of the potential this panel is capable of.

The first one is of the national anthem singer and the second is off the guys holding the flags during it. I posted the flag one cause it has alot of smoke in the background. I have seen alot of panels struggle with this type of scene and wanted to show how flawlessly the NEC handled it. It also shows that the blacks are BLACK.

I have a couple more pics showing the whole panel with the lights on and the side of it with the cable cover over it (in case those who would need the cover wanted to see it with it on). As soon as I can I will post those as well.


http://www.calim.org/hosting/leanne.jpg

http://www.calim.org/hosting/smoke.jpg

Wow, nice pics Tony! It would be interesting to see a full resolution picture although it would be better to provide a link to the picture rather than put it in-line. I think the downsized pics are showing artifacting that is probably not in the full size pics i.e. false contouring.

Microsoft has an handy "image resizer" powertoy if you have PC with Windows XP. Just right click your mouse over the picture you want to resize and select resize pictures. It gives you several options but even the large size (1024 x768), results in a good size for posting with a reasonable size. Download it here.

http://download.microsoft.com/download/whistler/Install/2/WXP/EN-US/ImageResizerPowertoySetup.exe

Thanks for posting the pictures (hopefully a grayscale pic is coming soon ;)).

Okay, thanks to calim who was kind enough to resize and host these for me, below are a couple picks of the game the other night. I was a little hesitant to post these because this was before I had done any picture setting tweaks and the picture quality has definitely improved since these. Nonetheless, they do show some of the potential this panel is capable of.

The first one is of the national anthem singer and the second is off the guys holding the flags during it. I posted the flag one cause it has alot of smoke in the background. I have seen alot of panels struggle with this type of scene and wanted to show how flawlessly the NEC handled it. It also shows that the blacks are BLACK.

I have a couple more pics showing the whole panel with the lights on and the side of it with the cable cover over it (in case those who would need the cover wanted to see it with it on). As soon as I can I will post those as well.


Thanks for posting the pics! The blacks do look very impressive in the smoke/flag shot.

However, I do see some gradient banding and the dreaded clayface on Ms. Rimes. Is this due the pic resizing and processing or have you noticed some of this on the screen? If it was on the screen, have you're tweaks taken care of it?

You are exactly right N8G ... this clayface issue is the reason I still don't have a plasma TV. My early reading lead me to believe that the 42" XR4 was the only one of the "new" NEC's that had all of the state-of-the-art features...am I wrong in thinking this?

However, I do see some gradient banding and the dreaded clayface on Ms. Rimes.
I see it too. But what was the input? That could explain everything, even with the best tweaking.

It would be interesting- after we get a couple of hours under the xr5's belt and some of us/you who are very good at calibrating.
post - for let's say night/dark Movie DVD setting. We all have different EQ. so some some seting would be different. But it would also be interesting to see how close all our setting are too.

Tony17 (my friend) I haven't got a HD feed yet. %&#@%(% comast), I hope my PQ is that good.

* aslo those of you how have Blade Runner (I have the newer one) opening sceen. Black clouds on Black back ground viewing the city or oil fields.- very interesting...
db

mhfnet...I forgot to take a grayscale when I had the camera...maybe cpcat can take one for you. N8G....the camera did add some unwanted effects in the picture which is why I really didn't want to post them...but I wanted to at least show you guys something. I can assure you there is NO clayface whatsoever on this panel. I think the pausing of the image with the tivo adds some unwanted noise as well. If I can I will try to take some pics with my measly 3.2mp camera after the tweaks I did and see how they come out.

I've loaded some others onto image shack. I had to reduce the size from over 1MB each to like 98KB, so they got a little blurred compared to the originals, but look decent. One is of the football game, which I took to show the level of black and details in the background. The other is a quick pic of the overall plasma and the last is of the side panel with the cover in case those who are going to use the cover wanted to see what it would look like.

http://www.logmonster.com/images/full/?pic=football%20Large_1136532881-236-4677.jpg

http://www.logmonster.com/images/full/?pic=Overall%20Large_1136509301-236-4679.jpg

http://www.logmonster.com/images/full/?pic=side%20Large_1136529412-236-4680.jpg

I see it too. But what was the input? That could explain everything, even with the best tweaking.

yobob, that was ota with my hdtivo. however, before any tweaks and using the hdmi cable that came with the box. I've since gotten a cable from RAM (forum sponsor) and done pretty many tweaks. Anything noise in the above picture is now gone. I hope to post better pics soon.

yobob, that was ota with my hdtivo. however, before any tweaks and using the hdmi cable that came with the box. I've since gotten a cable from RAM (forum sponsor) and done pretty many tweaks. Anything noise in the above picture is now gone. I hope to post better pics soon.
I thought as much. And your quote from post #223, pretty much says it all:

"NO clayface whatsoever on this panel"

Thanks Tony! And congrats! :)

mhfnet...I forgot to take a grayscale when I had the camera...maybe cpcat can take one for you.

I've tried taking pics of the greyscale pattern. It just looks horrible and it's not even worth posting. My digital camera is old (Canon ps100) and I don't have a tripod.

Your pics look spectacular, though, compared to mine. I'm sure the clayface is an artifact of either the camera or the computer. I see absolutely no clayface artifacting with my panel. I know you said your settings were "out of the box", but can you post them anyway? Whatever they were, I'd like to try them out.

Just a note: Who ever signes may want to unbox your panel as almost all venders have a 48 hour window to report consealed shipping damage. Be careful if you wait to inspect your panel it may be to late. Might even want to delay it for your own inspection.

I will make sure this gets done. Thanks :)

mhfnet...I forgot to take a grayscale when I had the camera...maybe cpcat can take one for you.

If you or cpcat ever get some good quality pics of the grayscale I would love to have one. I would also love to see any full resolution pictures. You can email them to me at the address I sent you in the last PM.

I am very interest in the grayscale pic because I got burn on my last Hitachi plasma because it had a banding problems that would have been easily determined using the AVIA grayscale ramp pattern. Unfortunately I bought if from a store with a poor return policy and ended up getting "stuck" with it. Luckily I was able to convince Hitachi that it was unacceptable (using photos) and they are in the process of giving me a refund, however it was a very painful process getting to this point and I want to make the right decision this time.

Since I there are no stores in my area that carry the 50XR5, I am buying it on risk and I thought if someone could send me a picture of the AVIA Horizontal Grayscale Ramp it would ease my mind. I guess since you guys have looked at the pattern and you say it is smooth, it sounds like banding is not an issue on the NEC. Thanks for at least checking it out.

I have also been waiting to see if there is a plasma announced at CES that would top the NEC. Sounds like there is not much new in 50" plasmas. Panasonic announced the 50PX600 which basically has some cosmetic changes and 1 more HDMI connection. Also I have no interest in getting a 50" 1080P plasma as I don't plan to sit 6 feet in front of it in order to resolve 1080 lines of resolution. So at this point the NEC is still the top contender.

now that I have seen some pictures, I must say, purely aesthetically, I prefer the XM2/3... look.
The frame around the panel just seems so big ! On the XM2 and similar models, I love the minimalistic hedge .....

Okay, mhfnet, I know you REALLY wanted these. I had taken them before, but just wasn't that happy with them as they don't look exactly like what I am seeing, but a pretty good indication. The camera seemed to add some extra effect that is weird (mostly noticable in the second one), but I know you were dying for these so here they are. This is with an old toshiba with component cables and 480i.

http://www.logmonster.com/images/full/?pic=Grayscale%20Large_1136461871-236-4688.jpg

http://www.logmonster.com/images/full/?pic=Crossed%20Gray%20Scale%20Large_1136468620-236-4689.jpg

Okay, mhfnet, I know you REALLY wanted these. I had taken them before, but just wasn't that happy with them as they don't look exactly like what I am seeing, but a pretty good indication. The camera seemed to add some extra effect that is weird (mostly noticable in the second one), but I know you were dying for these so here they are. This is with an old toshiba with component cables and 480i.

http://www.logmonster.com/images/full/?pic=Grayscale%20Large_1136461871-236-4688.jpg

http://www.logmonster.com/images/full/?pic=Crossed%20Gray%20Scale%20Large_1136468620-236-4689.jpg

Thanks, Tony!

I focused on the first one as your are right that the second one has some moire effects due to the camera. It does look like there is some vertical bands especially on the dark end of the pattern which eye is most sensitive to. Many people complain about "clayface" effects on peoples faces in dark scenes and this is why.

Was this before you applied the video adjustments provided by cpcat? If so did it improve afterwards? It sounds like from cpcat comments, that his adjustments really did improved the gray scale smoothness and color variation on his plamsa.

Also on the picture you took of singer above, several people commented about the "clayface" (also called banding, posterization or false contouring) they saw on her face. Is this the same in the full resolution picture or is it a artifact of resizing the picture? Is it possible to post the full resolution picture or email it to me?

Okay, thanks to calim who was kind enough to resize and host these for me, below are a couple picks of the game the other night. I was a little hesitant to post these because this was before I had done any picture setting tweaks and the picture quality has definitely improved since these. Nonetheless, they do show some of the potential this panel is capable of.


Great photos! But Tony, what is the feed? Are you using satellite or cable, SD or HD? I would really like to know, because it would enable me to compare your PQ to mine.

Thanks, Tony!

It sounds like from cpcat comments, that his adjustments really did improved the gray scale smoothness and color variation on his plamsa.



I have continued to work on this. I've used both horizontal and vertical grey ramps and found settings which make both fairly smooth ( much better than defaults). The settings I posted earlier produced banding in the vertical ramp. I still can't get the vertical ramp to look perfectly smooth, but almost.

Here are my latest settings. I set two picture memories up for comparison to the prior settings and I definitely like this one better with actual programming. This is via HDMI with HDMI set to high in setup menu. I made bias adjustments this time as it seemed to help smooth the vertical ramp. The color saturation can be set to taste. I prefer it slightly undersaturated. It doesn't seem to effect the grey ramps much at least +/- 5 from the default of 32.

Contrast 48
Brt 36
Color 28
Tint 31
Theater 1
Gamma 2.2
Pedestal 0
Low tone auto
Mid-low temp
*GR46
*GG34
*GB36
*BR39
*BG30
*BB30

Edit 1/10: I've gone back to default color temperature setting at "mid". In spite of the fact that the AVIA grey ramp doesn't look quite as smooth, it provides much more accurate colors. I was back to "wow" again last night with CSI Miami.

Also, "low tone" set to 1 at first seemed to improve the blacks a little, but it's stealing too much shadow detail. Went back to "auto".

I guess I'll stick to my day job afterall. :)

I'll leave grey scale adjustment to someone who knows what they're doing.

There a NEC 50xr5 on my porch!
Finally took delivery today after being on the waiting list for 3 weeks. Just peeked in the box to make sure the screen was OK The only problem is the table stand is another 3 days out.
Just about ordered the Panny until I dug into this forum a little deeper. I want to thank all the contributors to this thread for their expertise. I will continue to monitor and add what I can. This is my first HD experience so I am still climbing the learning curve. Thanks again!

There a NEC 50xr5 on my porch!
Finally took delivery today after being on the waiting list for 3 weeks. Just peeked in the box to make sure the screen was OK The only problem is the table stand is another 3 days out.
Just about ordered the Panny until I dug into this forum a little deeper. I want to thank all the contributors to this thread for their expertise. I will continue to monitor and add what I can. This is my first HD experience so I am still climbing the learning curve. Thanks again!

Congratulations !!
Dining chairs came to my rescue. My XR5 is resting on 3 chairs in my bedroom .
I promise ,you will not regret your decision about Panasonic .

Hey you guys.... Very new here and I am impressed with all the info.. Perhaps you can help me with a decision. I have a brandy new Panny th-42px50u in a box in my basement. I got it so cheep through a friend that buying it was a no brainer. I have not opened it because although it is a great plasma I have been told that I should sell it and buy a NEC 42xr4a. I also have the opportunity to trade it for a Panny 500u. I don't need a tuner or speakers so its all about the picture quality and inputs. AHAHAHAH...What to do???

Watched Star Wars 3 , to nite .
No macroblocking with my OPPO. I think this was the best stress test .
Picture Quality is outstanding just with Default Settings .No Clayface issues.
Very happy so far.
I have no issues with blacks either . They seem to be great .

Hey you guys.... Very new here and I am impressed with all the info.. Perhaps you can help me with a decision. I have a brandy new Panny th-42px50u in a box in my basement. I got it so cheep through a friend that buying it was a no brainer. I have not opened it because although it is a great plasma I have been told that I should sell it and buy a NEC 42xr4a. I also have the opportunity to trade it for a Panny 500u. I don't need a tuner or speakers so its all about the picture quality and inputs. AHAHAHAH...What to do???

I have both the 50XR5 and TH-50PX50U. The NEC is the better plasma IMO. Better processing (clearer, especially noticeable with sports) as well as better colors and I'm beginning to think even better blacks/shadow detail. It's a winner from the standpoint of inputs hands-down (2 HDMI, 2 component, VGA, s-video, composite). It's infinitely adjustable through the user menu and supports native rate. The 3 year warranty's nice as well.

It's likely the comparison is similar for the 42 inch models, but I couldn't say for sure.

I have no issues with blacks either . They seem to be great .

My blacks and shadow detail performance just seem to get better and better. The PQ on Ghost Whisperer tonight was stellar. The very last scene when JLH was saying goodbye to the guy on the street, the black jackets they were wearing as well as JLH's hair looked blacker than I ever remember seeing on my Panny.

JLH + NEC 50XR5 = :)

Thank you cpcat. Read your other posts and was hoping you would get back to me. That clinches it! NEC is on its way!!

I would like for the group to gage the range of recommended calibration of a plasma, and specifically, the 50XR5. What is the bare minimum calibration effort, below which no one would be happy. What is the maximum calibration effort that most would agree is too costly overkill. I have no idea of the cost of hiring a professional, but once my money is on the line, I'd be sick to think he did a lousy job. On the other hand, if I were to buy 1-3 do-it-yourself DVD's and guides, spending an equivalent amount of money, and still mucking up the job, I'd be the fool. Some of you feel you are personally "good" at calibrating. Some of you pray that the screen makes you happy out of the box, so you don't need to have an answer. I believe something is necessary, because otherwise why are we buying the display? Yeah, I'm freeing up floor space, but it's still about the picture!

Plasma appears to be behind on adapting true 1080p. For current plasma purchasers, this isn't a showstopper -- why? A basic answer will suffice. These NEC panels claim 20 years 'til half-brightness, but 1080p will likely be reality much sooner, and we're then partly obsolete. The 50XR5 claims to be able to accept the 1080p, but from what I've read, it won't display it purely. So, how do you sleep at night? Personally, at this price point, I hope to get at least 10 years out of my panel!

42" PX-42XR4
50" PX-50XR5
61" PX-61XR4

So, has anyone confirmed that the only "new" plasma from this group is the 50" PX-50XR5. Are the 42" and 61" plasma's using older technology different from the 50"? Why does the 50" model end with 5 and the other two 4? What is the diffrence?

I would like for the group to gage the range of recommended calibration of a plasma, and specifically, the 50XR5. What is the bare minimum calibration effort, below which no one would be happy. What is the maximum calibration effort that most would agree is too costly overkill. I have no idea of the cost of hiring a professional, but once my money is on the line, I'd be sick to think he did a lousy job. On the other hand, if I were to buy 1-3 do-it-yourself DVD's and guides, spending an equivalent amount of money, and still mucking up the job, I'd be the fool. Some of you feel you are personally "good" at calibrating. Some of you pray that the screen makes you happy out of the box, so you don't need to have an answer. I believe something is necessary, because otherwise why are we buying the display? Yeah, I'm freeing up floor space, but it's still about the picture!

Both AVIA and DVE discs can be had for less than 20 bucks. THX optimizer is free as most have at least one or more DVD's that have it. I'd say that's the minimum. It definitely makes a difference. A good ISF calibration would be a nice birthday/father's day/X-mas gift at some point. I plan to hint fairly loudly about it. This assumes I could get someone good obviously. I'd definitely get someone recommended on this forum if possible. Many ISF'ers will travel.

Plasma appears to be behind on adapting true 1080p. For current plasma purchasers, this isn't a showstopper -- why? A basic answer will suffice. These NEC panels claim 20 years 'til half-brightness, but 1080p will likely be reality much sooner, and we're then partly obsolete. The 50XR5 claims to be able to accept the 1080p, but from what I've read, it won't display it purely. So, how do you sleep at night? Personally, at this price point, I hope to get at least 10 years out of my panel!

By the time 1080p plasma is as affordable as current models are, SED will be around the corner. After that, I'm sure something else will be waiting to trump SED. XGA and WXGA panels are mature technology and are the best value now.

I'd say 5 years of use is more realistic for HT enthusiasts. My new panel likely will end up upstairs by then replaced by something else or maybe sold.

1080p is accepted on the analog inputs. I've confirmed this with my scaler. The picture is fine but the overscan was a little excessive at around 5-7 percent. This could have been my scaler's fault, though.

I have both the 50XR5 and TH-50PX50U. The NEC is the better plasma IMO. Better processing (clearer, especially noticeable with sports) as well as better colors and I'm beginning to think even better blacks/shadow detail. It's a winner from the standpoint of inputs hands-down (2 HDMI, 2 component, VGA, s-video, composite). It's infinitely adjustable through the user menu and supports native rate. The 3 year warranty's nice as well.

It's likely the comparison is similar for the 42 inch models, but I couldn't say for sure.

You can clearly say that the nec is better than the consumer model panny but my belief was that the commercial panny was better then the consumer because once you tweaked all the settings you get true blackas and better image reproduction. Can anyone compare the TH 508uk to the nec. I know they are the same glass but the tweaking of the settings like you were able to do on the nec makes all the difference.
Also the pics I have seen of the508uk compare directly in quality to the nec pics.

Can anyone compare the TH 508uk to the nec. I know they are the same glass but the tweaking of the settings like you were able to do on the nec makes all the difference.
Also the pics I have seen of the508uk compare directly in quality to the nec pics.

I assume you mean the consumer and commercial panny's use the same glass.
NEC uses NEC glass. There's a possibility the 42 inch model shares glass with Pioneer but that's speculative.

If you can get an 8UK, I'd say you'd probably be happy with either. My concern with the 8UK was availability, lack of in-home warranty, as well as concerns I had for loss of resolution over the NEC. The consumer model panasonics have inferior resolution, especially for 720p. It is not hard to see the difference either. Whether the commercial panny's do better with resolution I don't know. The floating blacks on the panny don't bother me but I do see them. I see nothing of this with the NEC.

Plasma appears to be behind on adapting true 1080p. For current plasma purchasers, this isn't a showstopper -- why? A basic answer will suffice. These NEC panels claim 20 years 'til half-brightness, but 1080p will likely be reality much sooner, and we're then partly obsolete. The 50XR5 claims to be able to accept the 1080p, but from what I've read, it won't display it purely. So, how do you sleep at night? Personally, at this price point, I hope to get at least 10 years out of my panel!

Man,
You seem to be a worry bird . Buy the TV and enjoy.
A great picture quality is what it boils down ot in the end . 1080 or 90 .
This TV has excellent PQ out of the box ,and that is what matters, after you spend all that money. Specs won't make you happy in the end .

Watched Star Wars 3 , to nite .
No macroblocking with my OPPO. I think this was the best stress test .
Picture Quality is outstanding just with Default Settings .No Clayface issues.
Very happy so far.
I have no issues with blacks either . They seem to be great .

Big Mac:

With the quality of the scaler on the NEC, is there any PQ advantage to getting an upconverting DVD player like the Oppo? Have you tested your NEC with a "regular" DVD player to compare?

Good question, Viventis. I'm looking at snagging an upconverting DVD player, and wonder if I really need to, even though it only costs two digits, but if it's not needed, I can pick one up really, really cheap, and leave it all up to my NEC XR5 (the sweet thing).