BenQ 8720 Hints & Tips [Text View]

takisot

01-15-06, 11:29 AM

Having almost 200 hours in my 8720, I thought it would be a good idea to provide some tips for this pj (since some of you might consider buying it after the price-drop ;) )

1) During the first 10 hours you might experience some image noise. It is related to the lamp and it will go away after that time.
2) If you want to enter the service menu, all I have to say that the procedure is the same with the BenQ 7700 (I am not sure if it is ok to disclose the key combination)
3) In any case, it is ESSENTIAL to enter the secret menu in order to fully enjoy this pj in its full glory, because for a strange reason the Benq technicians have set the overscan rate at 93% instead of 100%! This is even worse with this pj because if the 8720 is not at 100% then you do NOT have 1:1 pixel maping! So, you just have to enter service menu, then select:video signal, overscan rate where you have to set it to 100.
4) If you want to calibrate it by using the user menu gamma settings, first of all you have to select normal preset, because user1 and user2 preset do not allow to save any changes made to gamma settings!
5) If you want to playback PAL material and you own an OPPO dvd player, bad luck! They don’t like each other!
6) Through HDMI, this projector only operates at 7,5 IRE. So if you want not to have crushed blacks and whites, you have to set your DVD player at 7,5 as well.
No problems connecting with HTPC’s.
7) In my setup I prefer to have the lamp at full (250W) and the iris set at 24/38. This way I can have a very punchy imaqe with great blacks and more than enough light.Of course I had it D65 calibrated.
As you can see, most of the above issues are firmware related (my unit has the first firmware edition). As long as it may take for BenQ to release a new firmware with this problems solved, I suspect that the 8720 might find my tips helpful!
I just hope that someone from BenQ is reading.. :rolleyes:

PS This PJ is the best single-chip 720p I have ever experienced!

wilbur

01-16-06, 05:19 AM

What was the key combination for the 7700??

benthx

01-16-06, 05:28 AM

Thanks Takisot

Thankyou very much for the info.

Ben

takisot

01-16-06, 06:08 AM

Ben, you are welcome! ;)

Willbur, as I said I am not confortable disclosing such info, but I am sure you will find it easily in this forum.

Digital2004

01-17-06, 07:19 AM

Hi!
what ansi lumens did you measure or is it bright ? i like this machine a lot (dont have one yet). i find the 7700 punchy in brigthness, is the 8720 also ?

the motorized lens zoom focus is also a real ++

takisot

01-17-06, 07:33 AM

It is very bright (as 7700) but it has the iris to "control the beast"!

benthx

01-17-06, 07:35 AM

Hello Takisot

Is there a way to check what firmware version a pj will have (8720)

Ben

takisot

01-17-06, 07:38 AM

I believe it is noted somewhere in the service menu. I will try to find mine as well..

awtryau89

01-17-06, 04:21 PM

My demo PE8720 will be here tomorrow. I ordered it directly from BenQ to get the latest and greatest firmware. I have spoken to my rep and a technician and the new firmware is supposed to fix any and all oddities, color balance and gamma issues with the PJ. They stated they have tried to make the 8720 as close to perfect as they can get right out of the box. As with any PJ, manufacturing variances will prevent perfection on each unit so I will calibrate the PJ fully and report back. I will check on all the things takisot mentions and see if the firmware update has repaired them. If you have an older unit, I would contact BenQ to get the update. From my conversations, it sounds as if it can be loaded in the field by the end user but I did not ask or verify this. Also, the update review is up on projector reviews.

presenter

01-18-06, 12:21 AM

Greetings all,

I'm surprised this is such a quiet thread (less than 300 posts).

I see Eric (awtryau89) has one coming in. He should be impressed. I reviewed an almost production 8720 just about the time they started shipping and found the projector to be exceptionally sharp, but having serious gamma problems. (You can find the review and images on my site).

I had the opportunity to work with BenQ engineers in the US (they are 15 miles from me) and by conference call, with Taiwan, especially relating to the high gamma numbers and some minor things. A couple of days before new years, they invited me up to pick up the latest firmware, and met with them just last week at BenQ's US HQ.

I am pleased to report that the newest version, is awesome. The gamma is now very good, and some other changes, less critical are also visible. I find this now to be a finished product, with performance in many ways comparable to the highly regarded Marantz VP12S4, which sells for $14.5K.

In fact the BenQ does better on shadow detail (the marantz better on highlight detail).

But the bottom line, they got it right.

Check out the review on my site. It consists of a new update page, the original pages (overview, image quality, performance, warranty), and an updated Summary Pros Cons page.

A slightly strange way to do it, but I just didn't have the time to rewrite the whole thing.

PS. I bought the sucker! It's being installed tomorrow. I was going to (go with Optoma's H78DC3, but the BenQ is significantly sharper, and I sit close to my 128" screen.

Good luck.

PS. There is no gamma adjust to my knowledge on the US version user menus. I saw a thread indicating there was on Takisot's comments above. -art

lungan71

01-18-06, 03:02 AM

The 8720 is on my short list but as I'll be using it in both a light controlled room (for movies) and with ambient light (everything else), actual D65-calibrated light output is important to me.

Has anyone measured light output and on/off contrast with the iris in its most closed position? How about lumens and contrast with iris open?

It is very bright (as 7700) but it has the iris to "control the beast"!

You mention that the 8720 is as bright as the 7700 but I only find one measurement of the 7700 which is 350 lumens @ D65 in low power lamp mode. Is this what the 8720 puts out with iris fully open?

takisot

01-18-06, 04:25 AM

PS. There is no gamma adjust to my knowledge on the US version user menus. I saw a thread indicating there was on Takisot's comments above. -art

Hi Art!
In all 8720's I have seen in Greece (4 in total) , there is a Gamma & Color Temp section in the service menu. Can you tell me your firmware version?
Even with the first firmware version, we were able to obtain an almost perfect gamma response in all IRE during calibration and by using the Home theater mode as a starting point.

takisot

01-18-06, 04:28 AM

The 8720 is on my short list but as I'll be using it in both a light controlled room (for movies) and with ambient light (everything else), actual D65-calibrated light output is important to me.

Has anyone measured light output and on/off contrast with the iris in its most closed position? How about lumens and contrast with iris open?

You mention that the 8720 is as bright as the 7700 but I only find one measurement of the 7700 which is 350 lumens @ D65 in low power lamp mode. Is this what the 8720 puts out with iris fully open?

Lungan, I do not have any measurments numbers, but I can assure you that it has PLENTY of brightness even when it is D65 calibrated! That's why I choose to have the IRIS at 24/38 to maintain a very good black level.

awtryau89

01-18-06, 05:05 PM

Got the 8720 in today and just finished getting it hung. Unfortunately BenQ shipped me a unit with the August firmware. I am already working on obtaining new firmware but after speaking with my rep, most all issues corrected in the new firmware can be solved with a good calibration in the service menu as takisot mentions. I still plan on trying to update it though.

Initial impressions are this thing is bright. Much brighter and sharper than the Panasonic AE900, Sony Ruby and JVC HX-1 which I have all had in my room lately. I even have the iris closed down to about 26/38 and lamp on low (200watt). I am using a 110" diag Da-Lite HCCV screen and was thinking of a High Power but that is out of the question with this PJ. I value my retinas and think I would burn them. Color balance looks decent in Cinema Mode and Normal color temp. I will let everything settle in and calibrate this thing over the weekend. I am expecting some great results.

benthx

01-18-06, 07:51 PM

Initial impressions are this thing is bright. Much brighter and sharper than the Panasonic AE900, Sony Ruby and JVC HX-1 which I have all had in my room lately. .

Oh my god!

God help us if TRYG sees this. You know how he feels about the Ruby/sxrd.

I havent seen the Ruby yet and dont plan too. There is no point going goo goo ga ga over something that is not suitable for your set up. But I do agree that the Benq is quite bright and sharp image. This will help offset the slightly softening on my Prismasonic H1200r lens.

Ben

TomHuffman

01-18-06, 09:25 PM

How does one know if they have the latest firmware?

lungan71

01-19-06, 03:03 AM

Lungan, I do not have any measurments numbers, but I can assure you that it has PLENTY of brightness even when it is D65 calibrated! That's why I choose to have the IRIS at 24/38 to maintain a very good black level.

Thanks takisot!

I'm not really concerned that it won't be bright enough if I open up the iris, I just want to know if it's bright enough to use with the iris closed. Since I'm quite happy with my current black level it would also be nice to know the actual contrast with the iris closed.

Is motion blur/panning artifacts visibly reduced if you switch to Whisper Mode and 4x colour wheel speed?

takisot

01-19-06, 04:17 AM

Lungan, I do not use whisper mode, as this pj is already vey quiet, and also it only operates in 200W when in whisper mode. I prefer 250W with the iris semi-closed.This way the picture is punchier and the blacks are great!

takisot

01-19-06, 04:19 AM

How does one know if they have the latest firmware?

You have to enter the service menu.
BTW, mine is:
TWN RM 103 1.04
Aug 12, 2005
MCU version 0.4

takisot

01-19-06, 04:22 AM

lungan71

01-19-06, 05:24 AM

takisot

01-19-06, 05:40 AM

I use a ScreenLine Othello 110' at 1,2 gain.

awtryau89

01-19-06, 09:34 AM

Well I spent most of my day with the 8720 yesterday and I get more impressed the more time I have with it.

First of all, I am very impressed with BenQ customer service. I made a phone call once receiving my unit to them about the firmware issue. Before days end, I had 2 return phone calls with apologies and trying to work out solutions. Unfortunately I was locked up with the PJ so I missed them and was not able to resolve the issue. I will call them back today and see what we can do. I know one call had a RMA for me to return this PJ and another with the new firmware would be overnighted to me. I am still not sure I will do this though. After talking to a few individuals, most of what I glean the firmware fixes are settings in the service menu which can be adjusted with a good calibration. I do know the firmware does not fix the overscan issue or user mode gamma issues takisot mentions in his first post. After talking to presenter and how the firmware was developed, I am pretty sure it is just a recalibration of the PJ for "out of the box" users. My recommendation would for most to get the new firmware if possible but I certainly would not let it stop me from acquiring one of these PJs.

Next, as far as the PQ goes, I am really settling in that this is one of the best 720p DLPs out there. Granted I have not even calibrated it yet but it is truly impressive with everything I throw at it. I have not encountered any of the issues that I thought I would. Dithering and video noise in dark scenes is not there. I have been able to induce some with some wild settings but under normal use in Cinema Mode, its just not there. I have not seen any panning artifacts with normal viewing. The color wheel is fully adjustable in the service menu and the default is 5X. Moving to 4X does not help with anything I could see but that was with limited testing. I did not try 6X with anything. I will be glad to try anyone's torture tests and reply back if they like. Gamma is fully adjustable in the service menu along with the other controls for RGB. You also have completely different settings for each input which allows the calibrator free range for all inputs. I will try to post some good measurements once I get this thing calibrated. Again I am impressed. If you are looking at a 720p DLP you need to take a look at the 8720. IMO it is considerably ahead of any of the new LCDs and a good step beyond the current low priced DLPs to include the Mits HC-3000 which I sell and have had in my room. It is worth the price difference.

takisot

01-19-06, 10:03 AM

I do know the firmware does not fix the overscan issue or user mode gamma issues takisot mentions in his first post. After talking to presenter and how the firmware was developed, I am pretty sure it is just a recalibration of the PJ for "out of the box" users. .

Thanks for your report!
Can anyone (Art?) confirm the above? Does the new firmware only fix the out-of-the-box gamma?

takisot

01-19-06, 10:06 AM

An other idea: if indeed the only change with the new firmware is "new values" to the pj controls, then it would be helpful if someone with the new firmware could post here the new values and see what happens!

TomHuffman

01-19-06, 06:08 PM

You have to enter the service menu.
BTW, mine is:
TWN RM 103 1.04
Aug 12, 2005
MCU version 0.4
OK, but a previous post indicated that the August firmware is not the latest. One must know what the the latest firmware is before knowing whether one has it or not.

takisot

01-19-06, 06:11 PM

OK, but a previous post indicated that the August firmware is not the latest. One must know what the the latest firmware is before knowing whether one has it or not.

Actually my firmware might be the first, as I was one of the first to buy this pj.
I just mentioned it for reference.

awtryau89

01-19-06, 06:19 PM

OK, but a previous post indicated that the August firmware is not the latest. One must know what the the latest firmware is before knowing whether one has it or not.

Tom,
The latest firmware is 1.12 I believe. August is definitely not the latest. As for my earlier comments, I did verify that the latest firmware only changes settings in the service menu to make the PJ more "calibrated" right out of the box. There are no great advancements here and if you have already had your 8720 professionally calibrated I would think twice about loading the new firmware. It will wipe any work that was done in the service menu and replace it with the new settings.

benthx

01-19-06, 08:38 PM

Well I spent most of my day with the 8720 yesterday and I get more impressed the more time I have with it.

The color wheel is fully adjustable in the service menu and the default is 5X. Moving to 4X does not help with anything I could see but that was with limited testing. I did not try 6X with anything. .

Hey Mate (awtryau89)

I noticed your post about chaging colour wheel speed in service menu. I wasnt aware that it did go to 6x. Could you confirm this. I checked the specs from Benq and it states 5x

Takisot could you also confirm this please.

Ben

wohlstad

01-19-06, 09:01 PM

PJ Central just posted a "review" of the 8720. Calibrated lumen output of 260 - 340 is pretty low for a reasonably sized screen. Hmm...

awtryau89

01-19-06, 11:12 PM

PJ Central just posted a "review" of the 8720. Calibrated lumen output of 260 - 340 is pretty low for a reasonably sized screen. Hmm...

Interesting. PJ Centrals reviews are normally trash and not worth the time it takes to read them. This one was half way decent. I would concur with most of what is said. I am also running my iris at 26-28 and find that is the best balance. What you have to realize is if you need brighter, you can open it up. I will give some calibrated numbers with the iris set to maximize contrast, best balance and then maximize brightness. With the iris open, this is by far the brightest I have run across and it still betters most in CR with the iris open.

awtryau89

01-19-06, 11:17 PM

Hey Mate (awtryau89)

I noticed your post about chaging colour wheel speed in service menu. I wasnt aware that it did go to 6x. Could you confirm this. I checked the specs from Benq and it states 5x

Takisot could you also confirm this please.

Ben

Benthx,
There is a color wheel adjustment and it does have a 6x setting. I do not think it is applicable though. I did try some torture tests tonight on contouring. I can get horrible contouring on Family Room mode. It has to be the gamma setting is just so far off. The same scenes on Cinema and Home Theater do not show contouring at all. It was just barely vsisble in some areas and I had to get closer to the screen to see it. When changing to Whisper Mode (which reduces the color wheel to 4x) it had no effect that I could see. I will have to do more testing but I can see no advantage to running the PJ at 4x to try and reduce artifacts.

presenter

01-20-06, 01:00 AM

Thanks takisot!

I'm not really concerned that it won't be bright enough if I open up the iris, I just want to know if it's bright enough to use with the iris closed. Since I'm quite happy with my current black level it would also be nice to know the actual contrast with the iris closed.

Is motion blur/panning artifacts visibly reduced if you switch to Whisper Mode and 4x colour wheel speed?

I'm running it on a 128" diag Firehawk, I find the cinema mode's iris setting just a tiny bit lacking in brightness. The Home Theater mode (I'm not looking at it right now), I think has the iris opened up just a little compared to Cinema, and that's enough difference.

You should be able to enjoy excellent shadow detail and still have sufficient brightness. -art

lungan71

01-20-06, 02:30 AM

Thanks all for your help.

Eric/awtryau89, looking forward to your numbers.

takisot

01-20-06, 05:06 AM

Digital2004

01-20-06, 05:39 AM

hi
i find this pj needs a source that has video noise reducers.
it's way brighter than what PJ says. besides PJC is extremely pro LCD (...).

cinema mode gives better results than ht mode. i just set the iris at 1/2.

how to adjust the overscaning ? and to get a 2.2 gamma ?

thanks

takisot

01-20-06, 06:10 AM

Please read my previous post. The answers are there!

kevivoe

01-20-06, 10:56 AM

I am curious why the contrast rating raised from 6200:1 to 10000:1 and the street price also increased by $500 USD in the last 2 weeks.

Just wait until the new crop of 720p competition hits the field ...

awtryau89

01-24-06, 09:42 AM

Okay, I received the firware update and got it installed for my 8720. I then was able to do a full calibration and take a few measurements. First of all, the firmware made some noticeable changes to gamma but did not alter any settings in the service menu. It also enabled the 0-7.5 IRE setting in the menu. There may have been other settings it altered as well but I could not find them.

As far as measurements go, I measured a pre-cal gamma of 2.4 and a post cal gamma of 2.6. This was actually a bit worse after cal but the color balance was dialed in better. Pre-cal color balance was slightly red in the lower IREs and too blue in the high IREs with an average deltaE of 1.6 and an average color temp of 6686 from 30-100IRE. I was able to even this out a bit better and got nearly perfect tracking for all colors across the range and a deltaE of 1.2 and an avergae color temp of 6488 for 30-100IRE. All in all, the new firmware improves the Cinema mode to the preferred setting for me.

Home Theater mode was a bit different. I did not have time to calibrate it but I did take some measurements. This mode gave a pre-cal gamma of 2.3 and an average color temp of 6637 from 30-100IRE. Even though this did measure fairly well on average, color balance was off a good bit more with a max deltaE of over 5. The blue and green look very good across the range but red is way to high on the low end and way too low on the high end. This mode could easily be calibrated for a bit brighter image and many people would like that.

Well that is all I have for now. I have the charts from the calibration if anyone is interested but I prefer not to post them. I also have a demo unit for sale from my distributor. Contact me if anyone is interested.

awtryau89

01-24-06, 09:50 AM

thirdkind

01-24-06, 10:35 AM

There is one more thing I forgot to mention and that is the color gamut. I used the 3D color adjustments in the Advanced menu and was able to dial the primary and secondary targets to nearly perfect with only green being outside its range. This is very normal for most of the PJs I have run across and most have a few issues with green. The 8720 was so close though, I would have to say it is as close as one will find to proper green. This adjustment is very nice. I wish that all projectors gave you this ability.

Sounds similar to the advanced color adjustments available on the Sharp 12K and Yamaha 1300. Both of these also have very accurate primary and secondary coordinates after calibration. I'm pleased to see another manufacturer making these adjustments available to end users.

takisot

01-24-06, 11:39 AM

takisot

01-24-06, 12:05 PM

In this older thread you can find our initial findings & measurments of the 8720 with the previous firmware:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6490454&&#post6490454

Scott B

01-24-06, 12:06 PM

Eric,
Do you have post-calibration lumen and on-off contrast values for the Cinema and Home Theater modes?
Thanks.

awtryau89

01-25-06, 10:10 AM

Eric,
Do you have post-calibration lumen and on-off contrast values for the Cinema and Home Theater modes?
Thanks.

Scott,
I measured 3988:1 On/Off contrast after calibration. I did not measure pre-cal contrast. I also measured 262 lumens post calibration which seems to jive with projector central. This is in low lamp with the iris at 26/38. I did not take any high lamp measurements in this mode as I would only use it for dark movie viewing to maximize contrast. I was suprised as the PJ still looks a good bit brighter than my JVC HX-1. I did not calibrate Home Theater mode but I got a on/off contrast of 4862:1 with lumens clocking in at 453. This is with the iris at 20/38 and low lamp. High lamp bumps this to 502 lumens. Contrast actually measures higher here but things are too blue for my eyes.

Scott B

01-25-06, 10:31 AM

lungan71

01-25-06, 10:43 AM

Eric, thanks a lot for the numbers. 260 lumens @ 3988:1 is very respectable and IIRC significantly brighter than most other 1DLPs at that contrast.

Scott, I think from the demo I attended that 38/38 is iris set to "minimum" and 0/38 is fully open.

If I may add to Scotts question I'm also interested in lumens and contrast for the most closed iris setting.

awtryau89

01-25-06, 10:45 AM

Eric,
Thanks for the numbers. How flexible is the projector if one needed/desired higher light output? I understand that there are numerous iris settings. Is the 26/38 setting with the iris set to minimum (i.e. maximum contrast and minimum light output)? How much brighter can the image be if one were to open the iris to the maximum setting?

Scott,
This PJ is very flexible. The iris ranges from 0 (fully open) to 38 fully closed. My 26/38 number is with the iris closed approximate 3/4 of the way and more on the dim side. If you open the iris fully I would guess your would be looking at over 500 lumens even calibrated. Of course your contrast will suffer but it will still be fairly repectable. If you were to use the Family Room mode and the iris fully open, you would be looking at numbers in the 700 lumen range. This PJ is overly bright in that mode. I am taking educated guesses on these numbers but I feel confident I am in the ballpark. Let me know if you are interested in one. I can probably help you out.

GeonX

01-26-06, 05:33 PM

…wooa with the numbers mention in this post you make my day… ;) I have just order the 8720 and I am expecting to get it by Feb 15th (I want to get one with the new software so I have to wait until they arrive out here mid Feb…) I have already see it at Takisot house with the old version firmware and it looks GREAT… so now I am getting anxious to have it home…

DaveMoi

02-26-06, 05:52 AM

takisot

02-26-06, 05:04 PM

Hi Dave,
I am still waiting to be upgraded but I heard that a new firmware is out (1.14).
I believe that Willbur has a new unit with it.
I suggest to send it for a firmware upgrade and then to have it calibrated by an ISF pro.
I dont believe that you will gain anything if I give you my calibrated numbers.

drsimnal

02-26-06, 06:46 PM

I'm somewhat interested in this pj, but have some Australian DVDs; for that reason I bought an Oppo 971. What issues does this pj have with the Oppo (mentioned first by takisot) and are they fixed by the newer firmware? Thanks

agrsiv95

03-07-06, 05:16 PM

Can someone PM me the code for the service menu and what to look for? I received my 8720 yesterday along with a DVDO VP30 and I hoped someone could help me out.

Thanks,

Jeremy

jonvan

03-07-06, 08:27 PM

Does lens shift effect picture quality? Any down sides to using lens shift? How does it actually work? Mine is set to the extreme down position (projector is ceiling mounted)

takisot

03-08-06, 01:44 AM

Does lens shift effect picture quality? Any down sides to using lens shift? How does it actually work? Mine is set to the extreme down position (projector is ceiling mounted)
No, it does not! In any position, the image is crystal clear.

johnny_marin

03-10-06, 01:12 PM

DaveMoi

03-10-06, 03:45 PM

How much offset does the lens shift provide? Is there zero offset at lens shift equal to zero? The reason I am asking is I would like to ceiling mount the FP and need to know if it will work in my setup.

Thahks, John

You can go + or - 120% in other words, you'll be able to mount the projector with the lens 10% higher than the visual heigth of the screen. Good luck ;)

neiltvauthority

03-11-06, 11:56 AM

Just a reminder, it's not too late to attend a special BENQ PE8720 event hosted in Santa Monica, CA today! This is your opportunity to meet BENQ executives and engineers and ask any questions you've got. The event is at 408 Broadway, Santa Monica, CA 90401 from 12:00-6:00pm PST.

murphy4040

03-19-06, 07:52 PM

You can go + or - 120% in other words, you'll be able to mount the projector with the lens 10% higher than the visual heigth of the screen. Good luck ;)

Just to make sure I understand: are you saying that I can mount the projector 10% above the TOP of the screen? The top of my screen is 23 inches from the ceiling and the lens will be about 22 inches from the ceiling. The screen is 103in diag and the projector is about 16 ft from the screen. Is this a setup that will work with the BenQ?

I could raise the screen (fixed on the wall) about 5-6 inches but it would be a real pain in the ass.

thx

DaViD Boulet

05-16-06, 12:32 PM

wondering what the latest scoop is on the firmware update (and what the latest firmware fixes in the original list of things to tweak...such as overscan not being set to 100%).

Joe Przybylski

05-23-06, 04:04 PM

Just curious -- is there anyway to recall lens-shift and zoom/focus settings -- the same way you can recall color/picture settings? Have a constant-height setup, this would help alot if I had to remove the lends to play xbox or surf the net...

DaViD Boulet

05-23-06, 04:12 PM

that *would* be cool.

Joe, you use HTPC for all your scaling on the 8700+ (or should I say "used")?

dave

Joe Przybylski

05-23-06, 09:32 PM

that *would* be cool.

Joe, you use HTPC for all your scaling on the 8700+ (or should I say "used")?

dave

Yep... and I will do so with the 8720 as well.

I've read lots of reviews about the ISCAN scalers, and people with HTPCS and Ffdshow say (mostly) that the results are somewhat better using their HTPC's...

The only reason I would upgrade to a DVD player/external scaler would be to play xbox 360 or PC games scaled to a custom aspect ratio with my constant height setup -- but with the 8720 -- the throw is so much longer I can zoom in/out and move the anamorphic lens out of place, and customize the picture with remote controlled focus, zoom, and lens shift... I love this projector already and it's not even here. Also love the fact that it will be BEHIND my seating area now, whereas with the 8700 it was right over my head. Literally.

Joe Przybylski

05-23-06, 09:33 PM

Oh, and I forgot, I have a Fusion HDTV card as well, so almost all of my video needs are processed through my HTPC...

DaViD Boulet

05-24-06, 08:13 AM

Yes...that longer throw of the 8720 is marvelous. I *hate* haveing my 8700+ right over the sofa.

Plus with the adjustable vertical offset...the PJ could be set lower than the top of the screen which would be great for me with the hipower (angular reflective).

Joe Przybylski

05-26-06, 09:53 AM

takisot

05-26-06, 10:02 AM

Joe, the 8720 uses a different cable. I could make it my self but I know others successfuly managed to make the cable and the upgrade.

Joe Przybylski

05-26-06, 02:29 PM

Can anyone who succesfully upgraded their 8720 please send me a PM? I'd like to ask you a few questions on how I could tackle this upgrade myself and where to get started.. Thank you very much...

timps

05-26-06, 09:20 PM

I just received my 8720 and it does have the newest version on it. Should the color wheel be set on 5X, 5X with SLR or 6? What would the difference be between the settings (between 5X with SLR or 5X without SLR)? Would it hurt to change it to 6?

Joe Przybylski

05-26-06, 09:48 PM

timps

05-26-06, 09:57 PM

Can you tell us what the version is? Is it 1.14, or the rumored 1.15?

I was told by the person I purchased the projector from that it is the latest version. I can not confirm that it is. I have the following:

TWN RM103 1.14
Jan 20, 2006
MCU Version 0.6

Joe Przybylski

05-27-06, 09:48 AM

1.14 does seem to be the latest version... while i'm very happy with my 8720, i would like to take advantage of the newest firmware changes. i've read several reviews that the 1.14 firmware not only incorporates basic changes to colors and gamma, but also picture enhancements beyond the scope of what can be done through the casual user.

So again, if anyone has updated their 8720 themselves, please drop me a line. I've contacted BenQ about this to see if they'll be willing to help out. For the life of me, I can't imagine why they don't make firmware upgrades available to the public.

DaViD Boulet

05-27-06, 09:53 AM

Joe,

care to share any pre-firmware-upgrade impressions of the PQ?

would love to hear the scoop!

dave :)

Joe Przybylski

05-27-06, 10:24 AM

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7729468&&#post7729468

Just finished!

awtryau89

05-27-06, 02:19 PM

timps

05-30-06, 11:39 AM

Should the color wheel be set on 5X, 5X with SLR or 6? What would the difference be between the settings (between 5X with SLR or 5X without SLR)? Would it hurt to change it to 6?

Hyrax

05-30-06, 11:43 PM

If you were in the market for a new PJ today, would you buy the 8270? I need to replace a Sharp 9000 and am seriously considering the 8270. I'm just not sure that it makes sense to buy a single chip 720P that costs so much with the 1080P's so soon to arrive.

I don't change projectors very quickly - I've had my Sharp almost since the day it was introduced in the US. Does the Benq have the potential to keep me happy for nearly as long?

MikLoyD

05-30-06, 11:55 PM

I hope so ... I just bought a 8720 last week ... same concerns as you, but for what the 8720 streets for, there won't be any 1080p DLP at that pricepoint for a good year or two ... if you don't mind LCoS you might see something in a few months ... but for those addicted to DLP ... absolutely nothing wrong with paying well for an excellent performer even if its resolution class is in its final days.

Others considered: HD72 (offset was a killer for me), H7100 (throw too short, cw too slow), 710 (banding issue, startup issue, plus I really wanted a DC3) ... that left the BenQ or roll the dice on an H78DC3 ...

At 23 dB, I am thinking this will make a killer bedroom pj (shelf mounted at headboard) in 2-4 yrs ... or however long it takes for 3 chip 1080p DLP to arrive at this price point.

Hyrax

05-31-06, 12:38 AM

Others considered: HD72 (offset was a killer for me), H7100 (throw too short, cw too slow), 710 (banding issue, startup issue, plus I really wanted a DC3) ... that left the BenQ or roll the dice on an H78DC3 ...

At 23 dB, I am thinking this will make a killer bedroom pj (shelf mounted at headboard) in 2-4 yrs ... or however long it takes for 3 chip 1080p DLP to arrive at this price point.
LOL, we've both spent too much time on this forum. You went through the same progression of PJs I did, except I'm also thinking of the Sim2 C3X Lite (if it only had the same street price as the Ruby). I don't mind spending money on a good projector, but I hate wasting money.

I'm lined up to get a 710, but the startup issue really has me worried. I really want something that I can enjoy for the next few years without worrying. I almost went for the Panasonic 900 because it is such a deal, but I know I'd want to replace it within a year.

The 8720 looks like it will be a good match for me. I particularily like the thought of the 'Whisper' mode. Do you loose any PQ because of the 4x color wheel? More rainbows? There must be a down side...

Milt99

05-31-06, 12:41 AM

1080P's so soon to arrive Define "soon". If soon is December, then yeah.a 720P that costs so much Then buy a cheaper one, there are lots available.Pure speculation but I think 1080p anything will be $8k msrp. I don't change projectors very quickly Then December is likely not too long for you but if that were true then you wouldn't be asking these questions would you? ;)
I'm not trying to be a smartass. Buying a pj now is diffcult, I know it was for me.
I sold my previous pj in March.
I weighed the cost of going cheaper, like 3k with the intent of buying 1080p in the future. I looked at the 3k options, HS-51a. Nice pj but pretty dim for my screen.
AE-900 also nice and cheaper yet.
The 710 was a contenda. I'm thinking that's a nice projector but not without an issue for some.
Optoma, no way. Not every owner has issues with theirs but every one of their projectors has issues. And some of the setup limitations are retarded imo.
Short throw, big offset. Why? This is America, rooms are big.
What pursuaded me, sadly enough was other people's opinions and the complete package. Flexible throw, power lens shift,zoom, focus, great warranty, optics and Eric's rep.
YMMV

wilbur

05-31-06, 03:46 AM

I was told by the person I purchased the projector from that it is the latest version. I can not confirm that it is. I have the following:

TWN RM103 1.14
Jan 20, 2006
MCU Version 0.6

The 1.14 firmware is great but it increases the fan speed a lot!!!

I now have the new 1.15 version dated march 1 2006 and this version is perfect! ;)

Hyrax

05-31-06, 09:50 AM

Define "soon". If soon is December, then yeah. Then buy a cheaper one, there are lots available.Pure speculation but I think 1080p anything will be $8k msrp. Then December is likely not too long for you but if that were true then you wouldn't be asking these questions would you? ;)
I'm not trying to be a smartass. Buying a pj now is diffcult, I know it was for me.
What pursuaded me, sadly enough was other people's opinions and the complete package. Flexible throw, power lens shift,zoom, focus, great warranty, optics and Eric's rep.
YMMV
Doug-
I wasn't clear - I need to buy now. Also, I don't want to buy a first generation 1080P. I bought a first generation 720P, paid a premium for it, and was surprised how quickly it became old technology.

The reason I'm asking these questions here is I want to get a feel for current owners 'upgrade itch'. I'm hoping that those who bought a 8720 3 months ago don't already have a new projector in mind.

My trepidation on the price is that a $5000 projector now could sell for $2000 by year's end if the 1080P's are good and arrive in any numbers. The inevitable price drop will be a lot easier to take if I'm really happy with whatever projector I do buy.

timps

05-31-06, 09:58 AM

The 1.14 firmware is great but it increases the fan speed a lot!!!

I know have the new 1.15 version dated march 1 2006 and this version is perfect! ;)

Do you think it is worth the efforts to upgrade from the 1.14 to the 1.15? Does anyone know what the improvements were?

I am a little annoyed that there is a newer version available (since I was assured I would have the most recent version) and it was not on the projector that I just received last week! Is this something I can do on my own?

TomsHT

05-31-06, 02:51 PM

I know have the new 1.15 version dated march 1 2006 and this version is perfect! ;)

How do you check the firmware version?

Milt99

05-31-06, 10:09 PM

Timps,
I doubt the firmware was available when your pj was built.
Plus Wilbur is in Australia, i.e., the Far East.
BENQ US probably doesn't have it yet.
AFAIK the firmware is user loadable but you need a copy of it and
special cable.
If you bought locally, your dealer should be able load it when it's available.

TomsHT

06-01-06, 07:36 AM

Do you think it is worth the efforts to upgrade from the 1.14 to the 1.15? Does anyone know what the improvements were?

I am a little annoyed that there is a newer version available (since I was assured I would have the most recent version) and it was not on the projector that I just received last week! Is this something I can do on my own?

Timps, mine is on order now and I was assured the same thing, that it will have the most recent version and I ordered it from the same place as you. I'll tell you what, if it comes and is not the latest version I will not be happy, they better either update or send me a new one. I ordered from there with the understanding it would be the newest version specifically. :cool:

PM jay07059, he ordered from the same place as us and I believe when he had a problem he got to hold the projector till the new one arrived but Im not positive. I do know that the tech problem he had was solved and he was happy with the customer service for the problem.

timps

06-01-06, 08:32 AM

TomsHT

06-01-06, 08:41 AM

When the upgrades become available are they easy to do yourself of do you need to have someone do it for you? I bought the projector from a place in Washington and I live in NY. I don't want to ship the projector out for something like this. It makes sense that the newer version may not be available yet in the US - I will sit tight and see what developes. As long as the version I have doesn't harm the projector in anyway I am fine with it. What is the newer version supposed to fix anyway??

I know you need some type of interface cable to connect to the projector for the firmware but not sure if this is a hard to get item or not, other then that it sounds pretty easy.

I'm not sure what this version of the firmware fixes except what is said by Wilbur in this thread who sounds like it fixes the fan speed from the 1.115 version.

Wilbur, what type of cable is needed and where can we get it?

awtryau89

06-01-06, 09:32 AM

Timps, mine is on order now and I was assured the same thing, that it will have the most recent version and I ordered it from the same place as you. I'll tell you what, if it comes and is not the latest version I will not be happy, they better either update or send me a new one. I ordered from there with the understanding it would be the newest version specifically. :cool:

PM jay07059, he ordered from the same place as us and I believe when he had a problem he got to hold the projector till the new one arrived but Im not positive. I do know that the tech problem he had was solved and he was happy with the customer service for the problem.

Guys,
I can just about promise you will not get the latest firmware on your units. I am still waiting on it to upgrade my units. You will either have to get a new unit or figure out a way to do the firmware yourself.... ;)

I know BenQ AUS had 1.14 a couple of weeks before the US had it so it stands to reason Wilbur is a bit ahead of us.

timps

06-01-06, 10:22 AM

Hyrax

06-01-06, 12:01 PM

Guys,
I can just about promise you will not get the latest firmware on your units. I am still waiting on it to upgrade my units. You will either have to get a new unit or figure out a way to do the firmware yourself.... ;)

I know BenQ AUS had 1.14 a couple of weeks before the US had it so it stands to reason Wilbur is a bit ahead of us.
Eric -
If I buy a PJ today, will it have 1.15 on it? Does flashing a new firmware version require you to recalibrate afterwords? Do you loose any of the service menus settings or the user settings?

Also, I wonder how/why, in these days of instant, global communication, do dealers in AUS get a software update a few weeks before the US dealers? Are the projectors different? I'm just curious.

Thanks,
Tim

Stephanie M

06-01-06, 02:04 PM

The new 1.15 is not available anywhere in the U.S. as of now, the newest firmware we have here is the 1.14.

awtryau89

06-01-06, 02:20 PM

Eric -
If I buy a PJ today, will it have 1.15 on it? Does flashing a new firmware version require you to recalibrate afterwords? Do you loose any of the service menus settings or the user settings?

Also, I wonder how/why, in these days of instant, global communication, do dealers in AUS get a software update a few weeks before the US dealers? Are the projectors different? I'm just curious.

Thanks,
Tim

Steph hit the mail on the head. If you purchase a PJ today from most it may not even have 1.14. The differences between 1.14 and 1.13 are minor. 1.14 only fixes a component video memory issue. But it added the fan bug. I personally was running 1.13 because I never use component. When 1.15 comes out, all should be fixed and ready to go. Please remember most, if not all, the gamma and color temp tweaks were done in 1.13.

To answer your other questions, if you save your settings in the service menu properly, it does not erase them. I would recalibrate though as changes under the surface have taken place and will effect the PJs overall output.

TomsHT

06-01-06, 02:47 PM

Thanks Steph & Eric

Toe

06-02-06, 01:49 AM

So how does one update the firmware? Send it in to Benq?

wilbur

06-02-06, 04:52 AM

Guys, Benq Australia are first rate. They send someone around with a laptop computer to upgrade the projector so I dont have a copy I can supply anyone :(

The only real difference berween 1.14 and 1.15 is the much improved fan noise and the great news is with this upgrade it changes NONE of your saved settings!

Hope you guys in the US get it soon as I am sure you will be impressed.

MikLoyD

06-02-06, 08:56 AM

That's IT!

Honey, pack your crap ... we moving to Oz

:)

timps

06-02-06, 09:00 AM

That's IT!

Honey, pack your crap ... we moving to Oz

:)

Are you bringing the tinman, lion, scarecrow and Toto too?

Hyrax

06-02-06, 09:29 AM

Steph hit the mail on the head. If you purchase a PJ today from most it may not even have 1.14. The differences between 1.14 and 1.13 are minor. 1.14 only fixes a component video memory issue. But it added the fan bug. I personally was running 1.13 because I never use component. When 1.15 comes out, all should be fixed and ready to go. Please remember most, if not all, the gamma and color temp tweaks were done in 1.13.

Eric-
It sounds like I should request 1.13 or 1.15 when I order the PJ. I'll be using component, so can you tell me what the memory issue was?

I would recalibrate though as changes under the surface have taken place and will effect the PJs overall output.
Also, if I am 'lucky' and get 1.14, this seems to say that it would be a waste of money to get it professionally calibrated until after I get it flashed to 1.15.

Thanks,
Tim

MikLoyD

06-02-06, 09:34 AM

Hyrax.

Wilbur claims the 1.14->1.15 upgrade process leaves all your settings in tact ... so indeed you could have a 1.14 machine calibrated (it seems).

MikLoyD

06-02-06, 09:37 AM

Are you bringing the tinman, lion, scarecrow and Toto too?

With all the somewhere over the rainbow(s) racket, I had Dorothy's cohorts down as SXRD folk (or a least 3-chip fans).

TomsHT

06-02-06, 01:13 PM

Stephanie M

06-02-06, 01:34 PM

So we need to order from australia... :D

:( :eek: :(

TomsHT

06-02-06, 01:38 PM

hahaha

The Sterwart Firehawk screen was just delivered, 8720 supposed to be coming on Monday...

MikLoyD

06-02-06, 07:33 PM

rlemesle

06-03-06, 06:09 AM

Hi,

Mine arrived yesterday. How can I see the firmware version ?

I'm a bit disapointed by some dithering artifacts...

Richard.

Bing

06-03-06, 11:01 AM

I just joined the party as I picked up my 8720 yesterday. My dealer had to order direct from BENQ cuz our Canadian distribution network is messed. Anyway it's my first PJ and I'm throwing the image onto a 119" Dalite Cosmo VS1.5. Could someone help me get started by showing me how to get into the service mode? I ran a search but came up empty. I don't know why this info is so hush-hush. PM me if its against forum policy.

Hyrax

06-03-06, 12:19 PM

Hi,
Mine arrived yesterday.I'm a bit disapointed by some dithering artifacts...
Richard.

Richard -
I'm interested in your impression on dithering artifacts. Where do you see them and how do you know if they were caused by the BenQ? My impression is that dithering can be a major problem with MPEG2 because it creates larger files than other techniques - thus one needs to use more compression to fit a movie on a DVD, which creates artifacts. And HDTV streams with their severly limited bit rates have the same problem. DVD players and cable boxes insert artifacts when they decode the MPEG2 data. I stopped getting DirecTV because their broadcasts were compressed so severly as to be almost unwatchable.

Supposedly the BenQ has superior optics. This has the benefit of creating a sharp image when there is a high quality source material, but perhaps is more revealing of any flaws in the source material.

I'm not disputing you are seeing artifacts that were created by the BenQ, I'm just wondering how (when I get mine) I will be able to evaluate its PQ and say it is the source of artifacts. How will I be able to say "nice, but too many artifacts"? If I do find it is creating a lot of artifacts, I may buy a video processor - but I don't want to spend the money if I no not need to.

I suppose the best way to determine the source of the artifacts is to watch HD DVD movies. If we still see artifacts, we'll know they originate in the 8720's video processing.

ddan01

06-03-06, 12:40 PM

Hello,

My new home audio/visual guys were kind enough to mount my 8720 for me, but all they did was plug in the RBG and power, turn it on and left. Zero modifications, zero support.

I am a complete newbie and don't even know where to start on getting this thing in tip top viewing condition. I don't know anything about calibration, firmware or the service menu.

I've read lots of posts, but most are for the advanced.

Thanks if anyone can help me.

PM me if necessary! Thanks

Hyrax

06-03-06, 01:09 PM

Hello,
I am a complete newbie and don't even know where to start on getting this thing in tip top viewing condition. I don't know anything about calibration, firmware or the service menu.Thanks if anyone can help me.

Check with these guys...
http://www.imagingscience.com/

Or...

Buy a DVD that helps you setup the PJ. There are two that I know of (Avia or Video Essentials), plus some DVDs include a primative setup THX setup. These help you fine tune your PJ using user controls, but don't go into the service menus for fixing major problems. You should consider having one even if you get a pro calibration.

isamu

06-03-06, 05:24 PM

Bing

06-04-06, 08:25 PM

Hyrax

06-04-06, 11:02 PM

I could be mistaken, but isn't IRE supposed to be 7.5 for North America DVDs? This always confuses me, but if I'm right that means that your DVD player and projector have different black levels and you're black level is going to be in trouble. I hope there is a way to set the IRE on the PJ. I know the Toshiba HD DVD player has a setting 'Enhanced Blacks' which toggles between IRE of 0 and 7.5 - if you feel you need a reason to buy one.

DaViD Boulet

06-05-06, 09:52 AM

Just got a new bulb for my 8700+. Wow... at 1100 hours the old bulb was basically too dim to produce a watchable picture.

The new bulb as resurrected my projector.

I'll hold on to it until I can upgrade to 1080P and resist the urge to upgrade to the 8720...

:D

Stephanie M

06-05-06, 01:26 PM

wynams

06-06-06, 02:15 AM

I just got a 8720 and am having a heck of a time with the colors.

I wonder if you could suggest a good starting point for red, blue, green gammas.

Also, do you have a suggestion on the gains?

Reds are too intense, green is a bit too with the default. I saw Eric Awtry suggested tweaking color gammas as opposed to gains, and that does help.

I was just curious as to any suggestions for a starting point to base your calibrations on.

TomsHT

06-06-06, 07:35 AM

My BenQ 8720 arrived today (from TVA) ...

oddly enough, it has 1.15 (I was scared because the fan was so low when I turned it on) ...

I still havent watched anything, just wanted to let you guys ponder this one ... I am in the US btw.

Uhoh mine better have 1.,15 on it too then... ;)

The projector came yesterday as promised but still remains in the box. Hopefully I'll have everything else I need to at least hook it up for a test run by the end of this week.

Unfortunatly after that I'll have to pack everything back up to the basement is actually finished...

Hey the screen I got may be way to big. I got the 110" which it said I could but the damn soffit I have on the ceiling has the bottom of the screen like 20" from the floor. What is normal clearance from the floor to the bottom of the screen?

Hyrax

06-06-06, 09:43 AM

Hey the screen I got may be way to big... has the bottom of the screen like 20" from the floor.

20" is a little low, but not too bad. With a screen at your height, I think you need to consider your seating a little more carefully. The main problem you'll face is that your feet could be in the way if you get recliners. More importantly, you could end up with neck pain if you're going to spend hours at a time with your head bent slightly forward, so consider seats that support your head.

sparky7

06-06-06, 11:26 PM

1)How do you check to see how many hours you have ran on the 8720?

2)I don't or did not ever own a 7700. So can you just come out and tell me how to get into the service menu?

Service Menu:

menu
up-down
up-down
up-down
menu

For PE7700

Mark

Couj

06-07-06, 12:58 AM

TomsHT

06-07-06, 07:22 AM

Service Menu:

menu
up-down
up-down
up-down
menu

For PE7700

Mark

I've seen this posted previously and each time the post gets deleted. Is entering the service menu some type of secret / board violation?

TomsHT

06-07-06, 07:26 AM

Does anyone have a working link to the English instruction manual for the Benq 8720? I have tried downloading it from the Benq download center but the link to the relevant pdf document is not working.

I've downloaded like 4-5 pdf's about the 8720 from BenQ. None of them seem to be more then a few pages and are just the projector specs/brochures

Can you tell me the exact file name and I'll tell you if it is the same or not? Also your welcome to have them but as I said its not a full manual of anything even though it does say Projector Product Guide, its only 2 pages.

PM me with your email address if you want it.

hellcat

06-07-06, 07:28 AM

Any recommendation for the screen?

How about High Power from DaLite?

I'm looking at somewhere around 120'' and want some bright pic.

awtryau89

06-07-06, 08:41 AM

I've seen this posted previously and each time the post gets deleted. Is entering the service menu some type of secret / board violation?

Probably not a board violation but I do know BenQ has received a few PJs back under the hotswap warranty program that they could tell someone had been in the service menu and screwed things up. If this can be determined to be the reason for the PJs failure, it will void your warranty. So all I can say is, please be careful out there.

Couj

06-07-06, 09:27 AM

I've downloaded like 4-5 pdf's about the 8720 from BenQ. None of them seem to be more then a few pages and are just the projector specs/brochures

Can you tell me the exact file name and I'll tell you if it is the same or not? Also your welcome to have them but as I said its not a full manual of anything even though it does say Projector Product Guide, its only 2 pages.

PM me with your email address if you want it.

Many thanks for the offer. When I visited the Benq download centre again to check the name of the pdf file (so that I could email it to you) I noticed that the file name for the English manual ended in pd (whereas the file name extension for all the other languages ended in pdf). Anyway, after I copied the link and changed the extension to pdf I was able to download the manual. Hopefully Benq will fix this soon so other people wanting to download the English manual don't have the same problem.

sparky7

06-07-06, 10:58 AM

I've seen this posted previously and each time the post gets deleted. Is entering the service menu some type of secret / board violation?

It was posted several times on PE7700 thread. I haven't seen it deleted there.

Mark

TomsHT

06-07-06, 11:44 AM

Many thanks for the offer. When I visited the Benq download centre again to check the name of the pdf file (so that I could email it to you) I noticed that the file name for the English manual ended in pd (whereas the file name extension for all the other languages ended in pdf). Anyway, after I copied the link and changed the extension to pdf I was able to download the manual. Hopefully Benq will fix this soon so other people wanting to download the English manual don't have the same problem.

Whats the link to it?

wynams

06-07-06, 12:55 PM

hellcat

06-07-06, 02:31 PM

Can BenQ PE8720 take 480i via HDMI?

I'm thinking about pairing this with Denon 3806 and I don't want to go with more than 1 hdmi cable (fiber-optic) as it gets pretty long (40').

According to 3806 review, it outputs 480i over hdmi (ver 1.1) for OSD/setup and possibly analog input source (my guess).

Thanks in advance.

jay07059

06-07-06, 05:10 PM

hellcat

06-08-06, 12:26 AM

480i over HDMI is not supported on the 8720. I get a message saying unsupported format.

Jay

That's real shame :(

As this 8720 has one of the better scaler, it would have been perfect match for those new HDMI switching w/ transcoding analog to hdmi with pass-thru mode bypassing inferior scalers or not-upscaling (pass-thru) receivers like Yamaha 2600, Denon 3806 and 4306 and so forth, especially those use 480i for OSD from receiver.

If I go with Yamaha 2600 or Denon 4306+, I can probably set the hdmi out from the receiver to BenQ PE8720 as 720P so that all the sources, however I would prefer BenQ's DCDi does the necessary deinterlacing & scaling.

DirectViewer

06-08-06, 06:42 AM

I want to keep this thread alive to see if anyone has made progress obtaining a version of the 1.14 firmware for their 8720? I'd like to update my recently purcahsed 8720 to the most recent firmware. Since upgrading the 8700+ firmware was such a snap, and since I already have the cable, I'd like to do this myself...

Has anyone managed to update their firmware using their own PC and interface cable?

Joe, this may be old news by now, but someone (I think Barry Gordon) persuaded Benq to provide a downloadable firmware update for the 8700. The link is:

http://www.benq.us/ServiceAndSupport/Drivers/drivers.cfm?product=467#dl

So there is a precedent, which might be helpful in your efforts to persuade Benq about the 8720 firmware.

Couj

06-08-06, 09:09 AM

Whats the link to it?

The English manual for the 8720 can be found here

http://support.benq.com/files/projector/user_manual/current/pe8720/pe8720-en.pdf

TomsHT

06-08-06, 09:37 AM

The English manual for the 8720 can be found here

http://support.benq.com/files/projector/user_manual/current/pe8720/pe8720-en.pdf

thanks

DirectViewer

06-08-06, 01:43 PM

The English manual for the 8720 can be found here

http://support.benq.com/files/projector/user_manual/current/pe8720/pe8720-en.pdf

Thanks so much!

For some reason (I won't speculate :rolleyes: ), the U.S. Benq site doesn't list any downloads for the 8720. The site that Couj found also has the manual for the 8720 ceiling mount. If anyone needs it, the link is

http://support.benq.com/front/BenqMain.asp?MenuHead=128&ShowType=program&FileURL=service/driverlist.asp&Dataid=20907&downloadclass=Manual&product=2562&langu=null&ops=null&GenMenu=&RootId=undefined

MikLoyD

06-08-06, 04:30 PM

Can someone with video calibration savvy share with me what their settings are for Brightness, Contrast, Iris, and Lamp setting. I've have AVIA but it leaves me with a picture that is too dark with little shadow detail. I've spent about 2h fine tuning by eye. So far, I'm at:

Brightness 3
Contrast 4
lamp 250W
Iris approx 20-23

I'm just looking for more shadow detail without a gray/slightly washed out look. I'm just curious as to what you guys are using. Armaggedon (Crit) and Pearl Harbor looks a smidge over-saturated and loses shadow detail with AVIA settings. Seven, Fifth Element, LOTR TTT has good shadow detail but blacks are not as deep. I don't know who to follow.

Also, I can't change IRE. It's at "0". My Denon has no blacker than black setting, so could that be the reason?

If you calibrated with CINEMA as your base, try calibrating using HOME THEATER instread ... I observed similar conditions to what you described. When I calibrated a second time (HT) I was pretty pleased except for ...

Just when I think I have Red dialed in, I will see a shade of red at a higher or lower IRE and realize I am in over my head calibrating this beast.

I re-read this tweaks thread and my unit seems to be performing consistently with Eric Awtry's observations ... w/ 1.14 or higher (I have 1.15), ootb is pretty good. But ...
The blue and green look very good across the range but red is way to high on the low end and way too low on the high end.

I just lack Eric's technical expertise (and measurement tools/software) ... oh and
training lol ... to get the most out of this machine.

Needless to say, I will be opting for a professional calibration.

awtryau89

06-08-06, 08:09 PM

Guys, with this machine, red and green are outside the CIE triangle. Green a good bit more so than red though. Blue is dead on if set properly with the regular color sat in the user menu. In my calibration using the advanced color menus, I dial red hue back -4 red sat back -2. Green back a bit more on each but you cannot pull green back onto the triangle properly. I have my red dead on the CIE triangle coordinates perfectly with those numbers. Red looks unbelievable on the 8720. Its not orangey or yellowish. It just looks real rich to me. I honestly believe if it looks over the top to many of you, you may just have gotten used to a more washed out red.

awtryau89

06-08-06, 08:12 PM

I need to clarify myself here. When I say calibrating in the advanced menu, I mean in the user menu. I do not get into the service menu for the color calibrations. I am also not talking about gamma or white balance here. I am using the Advanced Favorite Color menu where you can adjust the primaries and secondaries individually.

jay07059

06-08-06, 09:55 PM

That's real shame :(

As this 8720 has one of the better scaler, it would have been perfect match for those new HDMI switching w/ transcoding analog to hdmi with pass-thru mode bypassing inferior scalers or not-upscaling (pass-thru) receivers like Yamaha 2600, Denon 3806 and 4306 and so forth, especially those use 480i for OSD from receiver.

If I go with Yamaha 2600 or Denon 4306+, I can probably set the hdmi out from the receiver to BenQ PE8720 as 720P so that all the sources, however I would prefer BenQ's DCDi does the necessary deinterlacing & scaling.

I will tell you one thing that I have purchased in the last year, that I have absolutely love, and have no regrets.... A video scaler. I bought a DVDO VP30 from a member on this forum, and it makes things so much better. I understand wanting to have a great receiver, but if I had your setup, I would keep the rec. I have and by a video processor. Once HDMI 1.3 gets all worked out, then try and get a receiver that supports HDMI 1.3, and will accept all the newer audio codecs. Just my opinion.

Jay

hellcat

06-08-06, 10:40 PM

I will tell you one thing that I have purchased in the last year, that I have absolutely love, and have no regrets.... A video scaler. I bought a DVDO VP30 from a member on this forum, and it makes things so much better. I understand wanting to have a great receiver, but if I had your setup, I would keep the rec. I have and by a video processor. Once HDMI 1.3 gets all worked out, then try and get a receiver that supports HDMI 1.3, and will accept all the newer audio codecs. Just my opinion.

Jay

Thnka!

As matter of fact, I was checking out VP20+deinterlacing cardoes ber which has pk=\.

Milt99

06-08-06, 10:49 PM

Hellcat,
Jay is correct on this one. Not accepting 480i is meaningless.
You want to feed the 8720 a 720p signal for 1:1 pixel mapping.
I was checking out VP20+deinterlacing cardoes ber which has pk=\. Awesome! If I could read Plutonian I'd be really excited :D

hellcat

06-09-06, 06:56 AM

Hellcat,
Jay is correct on this one. Not accepting 480i is meaningless.
You want to feed the 8720 a 720p signal for 1:1 pixel mapping.
Awesome! If I could read Plutonian I'd be really excited :D

Something screwed up while I was posting this :)

Anyway, 480i actually means a lot for those receivers like Denon 3807 since the manual says it uses 480i for 'setup' or OSD for the receiver.

I don't think I can configure my receiver in the dark w/o reading the menu on the screen :)

MikLoyD

06-09-06, 10:28 AM

Red looks unbelievable on the 8720. Its not orangey or yellowish. It just looks real rich to me. I honestly believe if it looks over the top to many of you, you may just have gotten used to a more washed out red.

Eric, that may be some of it ... my previous DLP was a DDR/12 with a RGBW cw ... I was pretty used to orange reds.

Reds are terrific, but every now and then I will see a flesh tone that has too much red ... as if the person has a sunburn lol.

This is usually on SD (commercial), but I have seen it manifest itself to a lesser degree on DVDs and HD.

The Mavs game looked incredible last night. I was particularly enjoying the ABC graphic of a deep red and black ... which the 8720 was rendering flawlessly.

I will try your numbers in the user menu as I wait for my D65 :).

Hyrax

06-09-06, 11:31 AM

Reds are terrific, but every now and then I will see a flesh tone that has too much red ... as if the person has a sunburn lol.
It is possible you're seeing a color space issue. SD TV has a different colorimetry standard (ITU Rec. 601) than HD TV (ITU Rec. 709 ). I'm in way over my head here (I've just read this stuff and not ever calibrated anything), but it seems to me that if you calibrate one input for HDTV, then you'll be slightly off if it gets a SDTV signal, and I've read that it is mainly noticable in slightly pink flesh tones.

I don't have my 8720 yet, so I don't know how to do it, but I believe you can have a memory settings for an input that will allow you to switch between calibrations. This way you could calibrate for both SD & HD.

Or you can just live with it :)

jay07059

06-09-06, 10:30 PM

Something screwed up while I was posting this :)

Anyway, 480i actually means a lot for those receivers like Denon 3807 since the manual says it uses 480i for 'setup' or OSD for the receiver.

I don't think I can configure my receiver in the dark w/o reading the menu on the screen :)

With a video processor, you can feed the 480i denon requires out to the VP, which in turn converts it to 720p to the projector. Win win.

Jay

hellcat

06-10-06, 02:06 AM

With a video processor, you can feed the 480i denon requires out to the VP, which in turn converts it to 720p to the projector. Win win.

Jay

Of course I will do that if I have no choice.

But to deinterlace/scale reciever OSD to BenQ 8720 via HDMI, it gets quite expensive to view Denon 3807 OSD via BenQ HDMI.

The reason I 'm falling for BenQ 8720 purchase is due to its DC3 and Faroudja. And my goal is to have ONE hdmi connection from the Video source to BenQ.

Now if I have to settle with external scaler, then suddenly having Faroudja DCDi is not attaractive anymore.

On the top of that, I was going to feed 480i HDMI from the new 480i hdmi capable Oppo 970 (already ordered and waiting for it :) to make the most out of this BenQ DCDi. Again, the DCDi in BenQ becomes pretty much useless investment if I have to buy VP20 or something equivalent.

Now, I'm asking myself. Should I just buy the cheapest DC3 chip based projector instead of BenQ 8720 and then buy the external video processor? What do I get from added cost of DCDi from BenQ 8720?

The other day, I called TVA to get firm answer about interlaced HDMI on BenQ 8720. I got return call from TV Authority. And he said he got his answer from BenQ. And according to him, BenQ told him BenQ 8720 supports 480i via HDMI. Now, I'm really confused.

agrsiv95

06-10-06, 09:55 AM

Hey, did anyone notice the driver/firmware upgrade for the 8700 is missing on Benq's website?

I hope this is a good sign. I really would like to use my 12v trigger and fix gamma/black level issues.

Jeremy

Hyrax

06-10-06, 02:09 PM

Of course I will do that if I have no choice.

But to deinterlace/scale reciever OSD to BenQ 8720 via HDMI, it gets quite expensive to view Denon 3807 OSD via BenQ HDMI.

You could buy a real cheap, small analog TV to use when you need to setup your receiver. You should be able to buy a 13" TV for around $50 if you look. If you get something small enough you could store it in the corner. You don't really need to use the OSD very often, so you could use the small TV somewhere else in the house.

Or you could get something big enough so you can watch SD material on it. For example, I watch a lot of old TV shows and even though they're on DVD they look terrible on a 100" screen. So I have a 40" RPTV on the floor and my 100" screen above it. Recent TV shows look fine on the big screen, but many of those old black and white shows from the 60's and 70's are too fuzzy even for a 40" screen.

Anyway, a 13" TV into your room would cost a bit less than a video processor.

isamu

06-10-06, 07:57 PM

does anyone know if it's possible to mod the 8720 to accept a raw SDI signal? I want to pick up a sony 777ES player but the best video connection signal it delivers is SDI.

TomsHT

06-12-06, 02:06 PM

Well my room is not done yet, just studded walls and insulation for decor but I put the projector up for a test and ran it over the weekend.

I was thrilled with the picture. How much does it change with being professionally calibrated? The wife loved the picture too but thought the colors were slightly off when watching Finding Nemo. She said the fish was a bit more red then orange and the other fish too blue. This normal or the wife as crazy as I already think she is?

Alan Gouger

06-12-06, 02:15 PM

BEN Q DUDE

Please ck your PMs, trying to make contact. Please call me. Left several voice mails. Thank you :)

Joe Przybylski

06-12-06, 03:47 PM

isamu

06-12-06, 04:49 PM

Oppo 971 upconverting DVD player

Slightly off-topic, but I wanted to let everyone here know that the Oppo 971 upconverting DVD player is a perfect match with the 8720.

I just got mine in the mail today, plugged it in, and within 4 minutes I was watching hd-scaled dvd's.

Having previously used a HTPC, I was amazed that the picture is on-par (if not better) with details, and much better with deinterlacing.

For $200, it's a wonderful companion to the 8720.

Hi Joe. Interesting....no doubt the Oppo is a satisfactory stand alone player, but I respectfully disagree that it matches the clarity of a good HTPC/Zoom Player/FFDShow setup. I'm going to copy and paste my comments from a couple months ago when I first got configured my laptop with Zoom Player/FFDShow:

O.K. here's the deal. After receiving my first HD front projector, the BenQ 8720, I needed a new dvd player fast. Wasn't gonna settle for watching movies on my Xbox or PS2 lol. So after reading over these forums for a while, I decided to give the Oppo dvd player a try. Got it in the mail a couple weeks ago and fired it up. Initially I was somewhat content with the PQ because I was still relatively new to watching dvds in progressive scan(let alone upscaled to 720p). First three movies I watched were T2, Kill Bill and Spider-Man. I don't know what it was, but although I thought the picture was nice and smooth, it still did not have the clarity I was expecting from watching dvds upscaled to 720p. There was something about the picture that just made me keep wanting to fiddle with the sharpness on both the player and my front pj.

Aaaaaanyway, I decided to bite the bullet and hookup my laptop to my PC via its DVI port.

Specs:

P4 3.6GHZ w/2MB L2 Cache EM64T (660)
ATI Radeon X800 Mobility
2GB 533DDR2 (2 DIMMS)
60GB 7200rpm

I then decided it was time to see what all the hype was about regarding HTPCs and software players. Thus, I headed on over to *THIS* (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=469093&page=1&pp=30) thread and decided to grab Zoomplayer, FFDshow, and DScaler......all three needed to play dvds on my notebook with exceptional image quality.

After a few hours of reading and tweaking Zoomplayer and FFDshow, I can officially go on record and say that I am absolutely blown away by the PQ that is sitting in front of me on my 110" screen! It literally looks like film(at least to me)! I am absolutely amazed by what these software dvd players coupled with FFDshow can do! These dvd software players and codecs are a tweaker's DREAM!!! There are soo many ways to tweak and adjust the picture to your liking it's not even funny!

I'm sorry but my Oppo player doesn't even come close to the image clarity that Zoomplayer+FFDshow+Dscaler provides. I watched Akira then Cowboy Bebop: The Movie. After fiddling with the different settings and finding one I'm satisfied with, my jaw is on the floor!

I'll continue to fiddle with all these different sliders and get more familiar with them, but for now here are my resize settings:

Resize box checked
Specify size -> 1280x720(don't think there's a valid reason to go higher than this, since my projector is native 1280x720p).
Process whole image box = checked(not sure what this does exactly)

Under "Settings" -> Resize settings: Bicubic. I tried using Lancsos but picture studders badly. Can't figure out why as I've got a powerful CPU/GPU. Bicubic and Bilinear look really good though. Can't tell which one is better but Lancsos is noticeably more clearer.

Anyway I just wanted to say I am in love with the whole HTPC solution. I am officially joining the club. Quite frankly I am a bit suprised so many people are praising the Oppo player. I really was not that impressed by it. Image is simply too much on the soft side. My Sager laptop was a great investment when I bought it last year. Internet, games, and now home to fantastic dvd player.

Anyone on the fence between a stand alone player and an HTPC needs to give Zoomplayer+FFDshow+Dscaler and try....now!

From *THIS* (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7818692#post7818692) thread.

You are the second person who's stated they're more satisfied with their Oppo than they are with their HTPC setup. I'm gonna re-connect my Oppo and see if I initially miss-tweaked something that others have found in their player. I seriously doubt no matter what tweaks you peform on the Oppo, it'll match the sharpness of a good tweaked FFDS/DScaler/Zoom Player setup.

Joe Przybylski

06-12-06, 05:47 PM

Hi Joe. Interesting....no doubt the Oppo is a satisfactory stand alone player, but I respectfully disagree that it matches the clarity of a good HTPC/Zoom Player/FFDShow setup. I'm going to copy and paste my comments from a couple months ago when I first got configured my laptop with Zoom Player/FFDShow:

From *THIS* (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7818692#post7818692) thread.

You are the second person who's stated they're more satisfied with their Oppo than they are with their HTPC setup. I'm gonna re-connect my Oppo and see if I initially miss-tweaked something that others have found in their player. I seriously doubt no matter what tweaks you peform on the Oppo, it'll match the sharpness of a good tweaked FFDS/DScaler/Zoom Player setup.

I'm expecting that lots of people will disagree with me.

My setup was a P4 3.2 Ghz 1GIG ram, 6600GT PCI-E video card, M-Audio revo 7.1 audio, TheaterTek 2.3 and FFdshow. I've spent the last 3 years tweaking it to what I thought was "perfection" and the Oppo outperforms it.

Part of the bliss of this is the EASE of use the oppo provides me. The HTPC was too confusing for my family to operate, and, way too loud.

But make no mistake, if the picture wasn't equal to, or, better than my current HTPC it would've went right back.

Right now, I'm typing this in my office with a now dissasembled HTPC in back of me that probably will be sold off for spare parts once the Oppo has proved that it will last without falling apart.

MikLoyD

06-12-06, 08:18 PM

Alan Gouger

06-12-06, 09:12 PM

BEN Q DUDE

Trying to make contact. Please call me. Left several voice mails. You have all but dissapeared :)

Joe Przybylski

06-12-06, 09:39 PM

Joe,

How is the Oppo hooked in to the BenQ?
Directly (HDMI) w/ 720p output?

Also, the most beneficial aspect of HTPC DVD playback is noise removal (I use denoise3D HQ). Are you saying that the Oppo can approach an HTPC in this regard as well or have you just been watching wonderfully mastered transfers?

Mike

Yes. It can surpass my HTPC's quality. And yes, I do watch well-transferred movies as much as I can. But I have seen the occasional bad transfer. I'm commenting mostly on transfers that will benefit from a high quality display. No matter how great the HTPC is, it won't turn a bad transfer into one worthy of a 720p upconversion.

There is a noise removal function built directly into the Faroujida chip that you can set at various levels. I keep it on low and it makes the picture look smoother to me.

I am connecting via the DVI output on the oppo to the HDMI input on the BenQ.

Milt99

06-12-06, 09:46 PM

Joe,
Just curious as to why you didn't go with the new Oppo 970.

J-dubb16

06-12-06, 10:29 PM

Probably because the chipset in teh new Oppo is not as good and is definately not as proven as the older version.

TomsHT

06-13-06, 07:00 PM

I just checked my 8720 that was delivered on 6/2 and it has version 1.15 for the firmware.

Joe Przybylski

06-13-06, 09:41 PM

Joe,
Just curious as to why you didn't go with the new Oppo 970.

The scaler in it isn't as good as the one in the 971. Oppo has a nice, "unbiased" comparison sheet on their site that basically says, if you want to use the DVD player iwth a large display, go with the 971.

isamu

06-13-06, 11:48 PM

Guys how do you get into the service menu on the 8720, and how do you check the amount of hours the fron projector has?

agrsiv95

06-14-06, 12:31 AM

Service Menu:

menu
up-down
up-down
up-down
menu

For PE7700

Mark

I thought someone posted it in this thread.

isamu

06-14-06, 05:24 AM

I thought someone posted it in this thread.

LOL now I can't get out the menu....how do you get out?

TomsHT

06-14-06, 07:34 AM

LOL now I can't get out the menu....how do you get out?

unplug it... haha

I'm assuming by this point you got out of it

TomsHT

06-14-06, 07:35 AM

I checked the lamp hours and it's at 12 hours (still practically brand new) anyway I only watched maybe 3 movies so far so it should be closer to 6 hours rather then 12.

Overall its not a big deal or anything unless its miscalculating the hours totally but I was wondering if its like a new car where they actually used and tested it a bit before the sell them?

agrsiv95

06-14-06, 07:51 AM

LOL now I can't get out the menu....how do you get out?

In the first selection of the service menu there is an option to return to user osd (on screen display) or when you turn the projector off it will return to the standard menu.

As Eric said, be carefull with the stuff in that menu as Benq is finding out that people are messing with it and you will be out a projector.

Jeremy

TomsHT

06-14-06, 08:20 AM

In the first selection of the service menu there is an option to return to user osd (on screen display) or when you turn the projector off it will return to the standard menu.

As Eric said, be carefull with the stuff in that menu as Benq is finding out that people are messing with it and you will be out a projector.

Jeremy

Would there be anything as far as calibrating the projector that NEEDS to be done in the service menu?

I used it to check the firmware only and as suggested wouldnt think it a good idea to change anything in it but I am curious to know if you pro's out there use it to calibrate the machine?

J-dubb16

06-14-06, 09:07 AM

Tom,

Eric did a full calibration of mine and did not need to go into the Service menu and the picture looks amazing.

jay07059

06-14-06, 11:58 AM

Would there be anything as far as calibrating the projector that NEEDS to be done in the service menu?

I used it to check the firmware only and as suggested wouldnt think it a good idea to change anything in it but I am curious to know if you pro's out there use it to calibrate the machine?

I did not have an ISF calibration, I used AVIA. With minor tweaks to the contrast, sharpness, and color I was able to get a really great picture. None of these require going into the service menu. Could you get a better result with and ISF cal? Probably. But the picture looks great to me right now. I will see how it goes.

Jay

agrsiv95

06-14-06, 04:42 PM

Would there be anything as far as calibrating the projector that NEEDS to be done in the service menu?

I used it to check the firmware only and as suggested wouldnt think it a good idea to change anything in it but I am curious to know if you pro's out there use it to calibrate the machine?

AFAIK, the gamma could be tweaked a little bit and that is only available in the service menu. Also as pointed out earlier, be sure to set the overscan to 100%. Other then that, everything else should stay the same.

Any other thoughts?

Jeremy

P.S. I am not a pro by any means but I am a sponge for info!

Hyrax

06-14-06, 07:14 PM

What happens when you have overscan set to 100% and you watch analog TV? Do you see the noise at the top/bottom?

isamu

06-14-06, 10:27 PM

be sure to set the overscan to 100%. Other then that, everything else should stay the same.

I tried setting it to 100% and all it seems to do is shrink the picture when ising my Oppo player. Then I have to Zoom in further with the remote. Are you sure settingthe scan to 100% is recommended? Why would I want an even further shrunk picture? What exactly is the benefit of having 1:1 pixel mapping?

DaViD Boulet

06-14-06, 10:35 PM

it's possible that the oppo is masking (putting a black border) around the image or not scaling the DVD to the full 1280 x 720 matrix and leaving the edges blank.

In either case, 1:1 is still the best... just zoom in the lens on the PJ to overscan the unused black area beyond the screen edge.

What's the benefit of 1:1?

That the pixels that your scaling DVD player just did lots of math to calculate will stay the same way all the way to your screen without getting recalculated (replotted). Scaling is actually most destructive when you're scaling between two very close resolutions (why typically digital keystone correction is so bad). So once your DVD player has done the hard work of taking your 720 x 480 DVD pixles are remapping them to (more or less) 1280 x 720... your best image will be to leave those pixels in place and not have the BenQ re-scale them all over again adding additional digital "noise" into the picture via scaling artifacts.

It's kind of like having a "bypass" button on your reciever to leave the high-res lossless audio data alone so it hits the dac in native form.

Hyrax

06-14-06, 11:16 PM

I tried setting it to 100% and all it seems to do is shrink the picture when ising my Oppo player.... What exactly is the benefit of having 1:1 pixel mapping?

I don't have my BenQ yet, so I am guessing, but if you set the overscan to 100% and want to have 1:1 mapping, I think you also have to tell the BenQ not to scale anything. I recall that you used an aspect ratio setting called 'real'. My question with 1:1 mapping, is how do you deal with anamorphic video.

Milt99

06-14-06, 11:22 PM

isamu,
Actually I think it may be a setting on your pj that's doing this.
I know on my previous pj unless I had it set for a "full through", Sony's terminology for not using the scaler, it would do the same thing when I fed it 720p
I'm such a loser even though I have an 8720, I haven't used it yet so I'm not sure of the menu options.
David is absolutely right about the 1:1 thing.

DaViD Boulet

06-15-06, 09:46 AM

hyrax,

1:1 works fine for anamorphic video because it's already formatted to display properly in the 16x9 screen area (1280 x 720).

It's when you have to "zoom" *non anamorphic* DVDs that you can't do 1:1 if you get stuck having to use the zoom on your projector (if your DVD player can't convert the lbxed DVD to 16x9 by itself... a few can).

In any case, an "anamorphic" DVD is already the exact 16x9 frame-shape as the projector 1280 x 720 image... so consider it already the native shape of your PJ and 1:1 will work perfectly if you have a scaling DVD player that's upscaled the DVD to 1280 x 720. (p.s. you can only do 1:1 with 1.33:1 DVDs if your DVD player can "pillarbox" them inside the 1280 x 720 16x9 area so the PJ can just leave it alone...otherwise you'll have to go into 4x3 mode on your PJ which rescales... but at least this is only downscaling horizontally and usually doesn't look bad)

BTW, the term "anamorphic" on DVD just means "16x9". An anamrophic DVD is the same "shape" as a 16x9 HDTV signal. The word "anamorphic" is very misleading. There's nothing stretched on a DVD. DVD allows for two "frame shapes" to represent the pixels: eithier 4x3 or 16x9. Neither is "native" and neither is "stretched"... but 4x3 is the conventaional default (with downconversion for 16x9 to convert) since there are so many 4x3 TVs out there. But they're simply two choices. HDTV allows for only one: 16x9.

Hyrax

06-15-06, 10:11 AM

Thanks, DaViD. It makes sense.

Bing

06-18-06, 06:11 PM

okay.....so typically, the aspect ratio used is "anamorphic" when watching a "16x9 enhanced" DVD and the dvd player is setup to widescreen, right? And 1:1 mapping will work in this mode? I've tried "Wide" but the image is too skinny, "real" makes the image too small, and the rest doesn't look right.

Now for the big question: if i send a 480P signal, the BENQ will upscale it to 720P for display, right? So then what's the point of getting an upscaling dvd player? Does it become a question of which machine is a better scaler, a dvd player or the 8720?

Bing

06-18-06, 06:13 PM

What color wheel speed are you guys using? 4x, 5x w SLR (what is SLR?), 5x w/o SLR, 6x) I know you can't use whisper mode above 4x.

agrsiv95

06-18-06, 06:47 PM

From my understanding, real is an unaltered image. I have tried anamorphic but the image doesn't change with my setup.

The 8720 is a fixed pixel projector which is that the DLP chip is 1280x720 so the projector needs a onboard scaler to correct all of the formats out there. If it didn't have a scaler, I would think it would not be able to show an image unless it was in it's native (1280x720) format.

The benefit to having an outboard scaler is that it can do the "heavy lifting" for the image and let the projector concentrate on showing it. Don't get me wrong, the scaler is very good in the 8720 but it's like using an "all in one" dvd/receiver/speaker combo for $149 at Wal-mart, sure it does the job, but probably not the best.

As for the color wheel speed, I would leave it at the setting Benq sent it out with.

Hope this helps,

Jeremy

timps

06-19-06, 09:37 AM

What would the benefit/detriment be to change the color wheel speed? If they provided the ability to change the speed of the color wheel, I would think that there would be different settings under various situations. Can anyone shed light on the whole color wheel speed situation and the proscons of going faster vs. slower etc...

Hyrax

06-19-06, 10:23 AM

Slower = quieter.
Slower = more likely to create rainbows.
Whisper mode sets it to 4X automatically, I believe. You might see more rainbows in that mode.

TomsHT

06-19-06, 10:57 AM

Does whisper mode dull or change the picture at all?

timps

06-19-06, 12:04 PM

whisper I believe will go to 4X. I was just curious why the projector would have so many settings. What is SLR and is it better to run the color wheel with SLR or without?

Hyrax

06-19-06, 01:34 PM

I wonder if SLR has anything to do with the Iris... It is probably just a coincidence, but SLR cameras keep the iris all the way open until you snap a picture.

arutha

06-19-06, 04:12 PM

I am having issues with my HDMI connection from my cablebox. The correct image appears for about 5 seconds and then it goes green. The 8720 says it is hdpc compliant so it shouldn't care if the cablebox isn't correct? Is there anything I can try to resolve this or is it going to be a problem with the cablebox?

Thanks

aoshiken

06-20-06, 04:38 AM

By the way... What about 1080p compatiblity issues? :confused:

RickE

06-20-06, 06:53 AM

By the way... What about 1080p compatiblity issues? :confused:

I don't think that there are any issues with the 8720 accepting 1080p. It won't do it.

Are there any 'non 1080p" native projectors out there that will?

Rick

aoshiken

06-20-06, 01:02 PM

I don't think that there are any issues with the 8720 accepting 1080p. It won't do it.

Are there any 'non 1080p" native projectors out there that will?

Rick
Taken from the Infocus IN76 specifications at http://www.infocus.com/upload/datasheets/english/IN76_DS_eng.pdf, page 4:

INFOCUS TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS*
COMPATIBILITY
Video: Component and RGB HDTV (720p, 1035i, 1080i, 1080p-24Hz), 24p.

And from the Projection Design Action! model Two specifications at http://www.projectiondesign.com/Default.asp?CatID=1434:

video compatibility
HDTV:1080@24p, 30p, 50p, 60p; 1080@50i, 60i, 720@50p, 60p

Both projectors with a native 1280x720 resolution, well, the Infocus 1280x768 strictly speaking.

bairda

06-21-06, 05:16 PM

Just got a 8720 in. This thing is much larger then the 8700+ it is replacing! Is it mainly the air flow and muffler that is taking up so much room?
-Alex-

presenter

06-21-06, 05:36 PM

Just got a 8720 in. This thing is much larger then the 8700+ it is replacing! Is it mainly the air flow and muffler that is taking up so much room?
-Alex-

That, and the large lens too, with lens shift, is probably the biggest reason. -art

drbobt

06-22-06, 04:36 PM

art,

i was wondering if after the review you did on the 7100, you're still happy with the
decision to put the 8720 in your own theater?

presenter

06-22-06, 05:08 PM

art,

i was wondering if after the review you did on the 7100, you're still happy with the
decision to put the 8720 in your own theater?

Definitely, primarily for the sharper image (better glass?). Beyond that, there are tradeoffs, but my only objection to the 8720 was the high price - I was able to get it for about wholesale, back at the end of 2005, but that was still a chunk more than they sell for now... Of course that's true of any 6 month old projector.

I still thoroughly enjoy watching it. It will probably hold me until there's a killer 3 chip 1080p projector for $4K-$5K. (Unless of course I get an offer on a single chip 1080p sooner, that "I can't refuse!" -a

TomsHT

06-23-06, 01:21 PM

So who's gonna post there projector settings?

agrsiv95

06-23-06, 05:14 PM

I'm waiting for mine to get back from Benq with the latest firmware and hopefully the 12v trigger working :) .

Jeremy

Couj

06-26-06, 03:15 AM

Lately, I have been watching quite a few episodes of Enterpise (latest star trek series for the unitiated) and I've been noticing quite a bit of solarisation (banding of colors) in the picture. This is something that has really surprised me. Is this something anyone else has come across? Can I get rid of it by playing with the settings (contrast, brightness etc), or could it have more to do with the quality of the DVDs themselves. I don't remember seeing any solaristation on my panasonic AE700 and it's not something I like very much. Anyone have any ideas?

Hyrax

06-26-06, 11:36 AM

Lately, I've been noticing quite a bit of solarisation (banding of colors) in the picture. I don't remember seeing any solaristation on my panasonic AE700 and it's not something I like very much. Anyone have any ideas?
It could be in the source, and the optics in the BenQ make it easier to see than with the Panasonic. I've also heard tell that using HDMI or DVI input can make the banding more obvious. If you're using a digital input to the Benq, try using the component input to see if the probelm goes away...

Here's a discussion of the banding problem on the Samsung H710. Does this discussion seem to apply?
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=658941

DirectViewer

06-26-06, 09:28 PM

Milt99

06-26-06, 11:04 PM

AFAIR, your dvd player and the 8720 should be set to IRE 7.5.

TomsHT

06-27-06, 07:38 AM

The 8720 with 1.15 ships with Black set to 0 IRE. The Benq manual says that for NTSC it should be 7.5 IRE. Is that correct and should I therefore change the setting?

What effect will it have?

Thanks for helping a newbie!

You might want to direct that question to awtryau89. I know he's familar with the benq & latest firmware and professionally calibrates them.

DirectViewer

06-27-06, 06:20 PM

Thank you both. I'll do as you suggest.

TomsHT

06-29-06, 03:24 PM

Big price drop on the 8720 just hit... Not sure if its against the rules by mentioning where and how much.

Mark

06-29-06, 03:44 PM

Hi can you send me a PM ?

Thanks

DaViD Boulet

06-29-06, 04:14 PM

PM me too...

:D

Stephanie M

06-29-06, 04:17 PM

Big price drop on the 8720 just hit... Not sure if its against the rules by mentioning where and how much.

:D :D :D

J-dubb16

06-29-06, 04:17 PM

Just check out TVA's website, it is on the front page.

Adam Gutierrez

06-29-06, 04:32 PM

Suprised it took someone this long to see it, it's be up for almost a week...

Don't forget to call AVS (Jason is handling the BenQ line exculsively I believe) as they are getting in a shipment of 8720's since the price drop!!! Mines one of the ones on the way from BenQ to AVS... Can't wait!

awtryau89

06-29-06, 05:04 PM

Looks like the Optoma coming in under $3k has put the pressure on BenQ. At this price point, there is nothing around that can touch it.

DaViD Boulet

06-29-06, 05:27 PM

so, what is this mystery no price point? PM me!

drbobt

06-30-06, 08:29 AM

Just when I think I finally decided to get this projector, I started reading the thread on the Mits 2000. Sure sounds like people are excited about this one to.
Does anyone in the 8720 camp have any thoughts or experience with this pj?
Please convince me to stop reading and enjoy the Benq.
Thanks for your help

TomsHT

06-30-06, 08:33 AM

I've seen them both and in my opinion the 8720 blows the Mits away... In fact when I first planned on using an installer and went to see his demo, he kept pushing the Mits even though I told him I didnt like the picture, I just wasnt happy with it for its price. I went around and compared different projectors and think the 8720 is unbeatable under 10k

If your concerned look around and see if you can go view them both before choosing. In order to find an 8720 to view I asked on the board here and someone local was nice enough to allow me to come to his house and see it run.

bairda

06-30-06, 09:05 AM

I thought the best success with the Mits 2000 was through an external processor? Also the 2000 seems to be better suited to environments with more ambient and incidental light (higher lumens).

In a dedicated HT with light control the 8720 is a fantastic looking projector.
-Alex-

drbobt

06-30-06, 03:38 PM

Thanks for your input guys.
I reread the Mits thread where there was a comparison of the Mits to the 8720.
I realized that he was shooting on a 156" screen which is why the Mits with its high lumen output looked much better. The 8720 was never designed to light up a screen that big.
I'll be ordering the Benq next week.
Thanks again.

Paulidan

07-01-06, 11:23 PM

Big price drop on the 8720 just hit... Not sure if its against the rules by mentioning where and how much.

I think I might have just lost my footing... This was it- this was the price point I was waiting for- and from a reputable dealer besides

...just when I was getting acclimated to the thought of dropping $400 on a new bulb for my HT1K :D

aoshiken

07-02-06, 08:09 AM

To all the ppl that have the Benq ceiling mounted...
What ceiling mount are you using?

Thanks in advance.

bairda

07-02-06, 11:05 AM

To all the ppl that have the Benq ceiling mounted...
What ceiling mount are you using?

Thanks in advance.

Chief Manufacturing RPA Series LCD/DLP Ceiling Mount: Part Number RPA142
SLB -142 Hanger Bracket for Benq PE8720: Part Number BenqMP610

The RPA can be hung several ways:

1.5" NPT Threaded Pipe to CMA ceiling plate (not included in above parts)
Standard Fastners secured with lag bolts to ceiling
Threaded rod to unistrut or channel at structural members

If you purchase your 8720 from TVAuthority, they include the above mount (or at least they were!).

Hope this helps!
-Alex-

Paulidan

07-03-06, 12:36 AM

TomsHT

07-03-06, 07:05 AM

The HDA1 works fine with my 8720 and very quiet.

Stephanie M

07-03-06, 01:37 PM

OK I've got some questions before I actually pull the trigger

- This pj is supposed to be around 16" deep. Assuming i want/need to get this as close to the back wall as possible, how far will it be sticking out with the cabling?
- I know the lenses are supposed to be first rate, but should I have any pause about needing to use the zoom in all applications? If I'm reading the throw charts right, I can probably maintain close to the size screen I have now (in a CH set up) by using the zoom a bit for 1.85 and almost full on for 2.35. Eventually down the road I might consider a scaler and an anamorphic lens, but for now should I be ok?
-I need to build a shelf, rack system for it, since I can't ceiling mount it. I want to enclose it as much as possible, save for venitlation in the appropriate areas- so where would these be? both intake and exhaust.
- any issues with the HD A1 players and the 8720s? I was actually starting to consider the Optoma 7100 until I heard about the issues with the Tosh player. Kinda glad, as I wasn't eager to replace what I have now with as loud, if not louder pj. Especially not after dropping several grand.

anything else I should keep in mind?

- Depending on the cabling you can account for an extra inch to inch and a half without having to worry about putting stress on the wiring.
- I wouldn't worry about using the zoom in on all applications. With the BenQ having such an odd throw distance (Especially compared to the 7700) they have accounted that there are quite a few people who will have to utilize this feature
- You would need ventilation on the bottom (ceiling mounted) and on the sides to safely ventilate.
- Only issue with the 8720 and the HD-A1 is turning it off, somehow a lot of people who have this paired...seem to have difficulty making their finger hit the off button.... ;)

Hope this helps, feel free to ask if you have any further questions....always happy to help a potential 8720 owner!

Jim Story

07-03-06, 03:10 PM

TomsHT,

Could you please give more details on how the "8720 blows the Mits away"?

Was the Mits set up properly?

Did you see them side-by-side?

Thank you

TomsHT

07-03-06, 03:19 PM

;) TomsHT,

Could you please give more details on how the "8720 blows the Mits away"?

Was the Mits set up properly?

Did you see them side-by-side?

Thank you

Hi Jim:

I'll clarify but keep in mind this is my opinion and I'm not trying to get in any p$ssing contests with any mits owners... ;)

I did not see them side by side.

The mits was set up by an HT installer at his demo room and I assume he had it set as good as it gets for his potential customers but I could be wrong. Anyway I thought it had bad SDE which could be seen almost up to the seats. And although someone else wrote that this pj was very bright, I thought it had a rather dull picture but this may be just how the installer set it.

I wasnt thrilled with it for its price and decided to keep looking till I did find one. In my case I was thrilled with the BenQ and thought it had an outstanding picture.

Comparing stats and reviews plus getting to personally see both projectors in action completly sold me on the BenQ.

Paulidan

07-03-06, 06:45 PM

-
Hope this helps, feel free to ask if you have any further questions....always happy to help a potential 8720 owner!

thanks Stephanie, it does- although I may have to modify my thinking about the rack solution. In any case, I'll probably have to wait till I actuall see it before I can design a rack for it.

I'll probably be giving you a call after the holiday to talk about this a little more :)

TomsHT

07-05-06, 08:32 AM

I havent heard much in the way of hints and tips as far as tweaking this projector mentioned in awhile. Has anyone done anything as far as expermenting with the settings that hasnt already been mentioned?

sidiyman

07-05-06, 11:09 AM

I share with Tom.
I am expecting some experts here would give some hints and tips on how to improve my 8720 which is just running for 100 hrs.

agrsiv95

07-05-06, 05:10 PM

It seems that this forum is heavily Ruby based, I didn't see the point of spending that kind of cash on something that didn't impress me. From what I gather, the ones (3 to be exact) I saw were not calibrated which kills me as to how they can sell this type of display and have such a poor showing of it.

Back on topic, from what I've been told if you have of get upgraded to 1.15. Then the adjustments are minimal at best. The factory settings are supposed to be that good out of the box. I am still waiting for mine to be upgraded to know for sure. I was using 1.04 so I am curious to see the changes.

Jeremy

TomsHT

07-05-06, 05:33 PM

1.15 came with mine and it does have a good picture but Im sure someone with expierence has calibrated and adjusted further and I'd be curious to see if those that made adjustments were similar in comparison

funlvr1965

07-05-06, 05:35 PM

It seems that this forum is heavily Ruby based, I didn't see the point of spending that kind of cash on something that didn't impress me. From what I gather, the ones (3 to be exact) I saw were not calibrated which kills me as to how they can sell this type of display and have such a poor showing of it.

Jeremy
:eek: sniffle- sniffle (blows nose) I cant believe you said that@## and I called you FRIEND LOL!! but seriously I have to agree with you on he poor showing of the Ruby,not everyone does this projector justice when they set it up, for the longest time I myself wondered what the big deal was with the Ruby it wasnt till I saw it in a darkened room that it started to make some sense.

Stephanie M

07-05-06, 06:37 PM

Just to clarify on the firmware upgrades

1.14 was created to fix bulb issues, this version has a higher sound level as the fan works more, this was always intended to be temporary as the projector is supposed to be one of the quietest on the market.

1.15 was created to fix the fan sound and also uphold the lack of bulb issues. This version brings the projector back to standard 23 to 25 decibels in whisper mode (sound level of rustling leaves)

Neither of these firmware upgrades influenced the picture or the settings.

Just wanted to clarify.

Also, 1.15 is not available yet to calibrators or for in home upgrades. Once again, it is a possibility that with some adjustments, one could make the 1.14 the same decibel level as the 1.15, but because of the fact that you would have to alter the service menu, this is very risky and may void your warranty. Also, because you are lowering the sound level of the fan which, in this version, is supposed to be running at a certain speed, there is a heightened chance that you may cause damage to your projector.

If you have 1.14 and you want an upgrade (not mandatory to make the pj work its full life span) but you want the upgrade, highly recommend you call BenQ and have them do it.

agrsiv95

07-05-06, 06:49 PM

So what your saying is the picture adjustments have been made to firmware earlier then 1.14?

Like I said above, I have 1.04 and the red and green are off enough (according to Avia) that it would take a fair amount of time adjusting gamma, saturation, hue etc... to get it "right". Gamma is only in the service menu and I don't feel comfortable making those changes let alone have the equipment to do so. I have been told that the latest firmware lets you adjust black level over hdmi (which is my only connection) so I am not at 7.5 and the gamma is so close that a few adjustments to hue, saturation and intensity are all that is needed.

Jeremy

Expletive

07-08-06, 02:30 AM

Are there discreet on/off codes for the 8720? A quick perusal through the online manual doesnt seem to show any....

aoshiken

07-08-06, 08:43 AM

Any news about the issues with the Oppo player with PAL sources being solved?

J-dubb16

07-08-06, 11:47 PM

Version 1.15 is available to one instaler/calibrator that I know of, Eric Awtry. He received it last week and is usually one of the earliest installers to get the firmware files. He is loading it on my PJ before he ships it to me.

This firmware also allows the component setting to be saved unlike version 1.13.

Mark

07-09-06, 05:57 AM

Which was the problem with the Oppo player and the 8720 going through PAL ?

aoshiken

07-09-06, 03:29 PM

Hi Mark,

Which was the problem with the Oppo player and the 8720 going through PAL ?Andrea Manuti noticed problems with that combination making impossible to see PAL discs from his Oppo.

Take a look to all the posts from Andrea Manuti starting at #210:

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=448717&page=7&pp=30

I'm very excited about this projector, the MSRP in France is unbeliveable! :eek:

Although i'm spanish i'm pretty confident that i will obtain the BenQ at France, here in Spain the PE8720 model is not comercialized, can you believe it??? :mad:

Mark

07-10-06, 03:18 AM

Hi aoshiken,
yes I read the review from Andrea. As I understood he had problems going through HDMI with nearly all devices outputting PAL. (not only oppo)

I'm trying to understand if Benq has fixed/identified this issue as I ordered an 8720 to.

The strange thing is that many other "PAL users" of the 8720 did not have any of the problems encounterd by Andrea. (and he tested 2 units with same result)

It woul be really hard to believe that the 8720 has such problems with PAL signals...

takisot

07-10-06, 05:09 AM

The only relevant problem I encountered with 8720 was the match with the Oppo. But then, I was running the first edition of firmware (1,04) and now that I have the latest (1.15) I do not have an Oppo to test with!
No other problems with all other Pal players tested including the Iscan HD and the Crystalio scalers.

Reeltrooper

07-10-06, 06:31 AM

Could someone PM me with a link to the newer purchase price?
Also can someone post some info with their experience with this pj and and anamorphic/ constant height set up?

Adam Gutierrez

07-10-06, 08:35 AM

Reeltrooper, just contact Jason right here at AVS. I think you will find AVS will give you one of the best prices out there...

aoshiken

07-10-06, 10:40 AM

Nice to read from you, takisot... :)
The only relevant problem I encountered with 8720 was the match with the Oppo. But then, I was running the first edition of firmware (1,04) and now that I have the latest (1.15) I do not have an Oppo to test with!
No other problems with all other Pal players tested including the Iscan HD and the Crystalio scalers.
I think that the latest firmware updates are not related to the HDMI signal handling so probably the problem is still there (i don't hope so) :(

Can anyone confirm that?? :(

aoshiken

07-10-06, 01:30 PM

The Customer Service from Oppo has answered to my mail about the PAL issues between the Oppo and the BenQ...
We had problems with PAL support on some displays prior to the F-0302
firmware, but most errors have been corrected due to a change in the
pixel clocking and timings of the DVI output.

Unfortunately we have not received feedback from other BenQ PE8720
users, so we do not know if the errors which were previously a problem
are still there, or if they have been corrected.
So i'll reformulate the question:

Has anyone tested PAL discs with the Oppo updated with the latest firmware and the BenQ updated to the latest firmware (v1.15)?

By the way, impressive response time from the Oppo Customer Service. :)

Alfredo.

Mark

07-10-06, 06:52 PM

As takisot already told me, I'm happy to hear that he (and many others) do not have problems with Iscan and other HDMI players....but i just found a recent thread on another forum from a user that has a Pe8720 not locking HDMI 720p@50 from a DVDO VPS.

Last week I made some tests on a dealer's unit and at the beginning (for about 30 minutes) the unit did not lock up the Iscan 720p@50 pal but then suddenly it began working and displayed flawless the signal for more than 2 hours.

Mistery ? .. or what?

Let you know when I'll be able to make other tests on the definitive unit.

daggerNC

07-10-06, 10:54 PM

OK, I'm being sucked into this PJ like a number of others have.........

I still have a number of reservations and concerns and I haven't seen all answered here yet. One of my biggest concerns is that I am moderately sensitive to rainbows - the first PJ in my house was the Infocus 7200 and both my wife and I saw rainbows (though not popping off the screen all over the place - just when I quickly turn to my wife or kids to say did you see that or a quick dart to one side of the screen when some action scenes appear, etc). We then tried the Sony HS-10 and it was good - no rainbows and no strain whatsoever while watching.

But, with that came no blacks, just dark grays, slight panel misconvergence, low light level (110" Stewart Firehawk screen in a 90% light controlled room with light colored walls/carpter) and SDE (minimal) and noise from fan (PJ is ceiling attached <4' behind and above my head). Sold the HS-10 and got the HS-20 - but still have all the above with only a very little better dark grays. I need another PJ that I can afford - trying to hold out for an affordable 1080p PJ but seeing the comments from those with/seen the Ruby and 3-chip DLP's still prefer this PJ has got me very interested.

And finally, if I do go with DLP it is between this unit and the Mitsu WD2000U, so I will cross post this in the 2000U thread for any real comparisons/feedback.

Thanks,
daggerNC

aoshiken

07-11-06, 02:59 AM

Just in case searching for a Oppo replacement...

Has anyone tried the Marantz DV-6600 with PAL sources? :p

TomsHT

07-11-06, 07:18 AM