Review - Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switch (no sparkles @ 1080p 60Hz & 50ft HDMI cable) [Text View] - Page 2

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sfhub

07-24-06, 03:47 AM

uberanalyst

07-24-06, 02:29 PM

Equalization cleans up the signal. A cleaner signal can transmit further. I don't think it is purely amplification in the analog sense.

Equalization is separate from whether the switch is passthrough or repeater design.

The difference between passthrough and repeater is the latter must decrypt the signal, then reencrypt to each output. To support repeaters, sources need to use a more invovled key negotiation phase. Many STBs do not implement this properly thus they fail with repeater-style switches (which includes home theatre receivers)

We haven't determined with Uber is seeing different results than me so I cannot say for sure what is going on.

sfhub:
I agree with most of your statements about the difference between HDMI repeaters vs. pass-through switches, except for what you said about equalization.

An equalizer doesn't "clean up the signal" -- it can't do anything to restore the digital waveform of distorted or noisy signals entering the switch. Instead, it modifies the frequency and/or phase response and/or boosts the signal amplitude to compensate for the characteristics of the downstream cabling. It modifies the signal so that an appropriate analog "eye" pattern can be properly decoded by the downstream decoder -- to generate fewer bit errors, especially over longer cabling runs.

I think we've determined:

1. The Monoprice 5X1 HDMI switch is pass-through.
2. The Gefen 2X1 HDMI switch (at least the EXT-HDMI-241 that I have) is a repeater.

HDMI repeaters provide considerably more functionality than pass-through switches, since they terminate the bitstream, encrypt/decrypt, and have separate protocol handshakes with upstream sources and downstream displays.

This means that repeaters are more difficult to engineer, more expensive to produce, and may account for some of the substantial cost difference between the Gefen and Monoprice switches.

But you're leaving out some of the advantages of a repeater:

- Repeaters continue to "talk" to an upstream source device even when that device has been de-selected by the switch. This makes it possible for the switch to continue communications with a source device so that it don't drop its signal -- a repeater switch is always in contact with each source. In contrast, a pass-through switch can't do this, because it's completely invisible/transparent to upstream/downstream devices and incapable of generating its own protocol sequences. New AV receivers with HDMI switch ports implement repeater functionality (and as you noted -- some early set-top boxes with HDMI won't work with them without a set-top box firmware upgrade).

- Repeaters (unlike amplifers/pass-thru devices) regenerate and thus really do "clean-up" digital bitstreams. That allows them to extend the distance of digital transmission, with or without the use of additional equalization.

I still don't know why you and I experience different results with our similar Sharp panel/AVC configurations. All I know is that both of the Monoprice switches I've tried failed to continue passing the video signal, whereas the Gefen switch works just fine.

- Dave

audvid

07-24-06, 02:40 PM

dave: Thanks for the detailed info. For someone like myself, such information is most useful. You sound pretty knowledgeable in your comments. Hopefully, one of these days, monoprice too will come out with a repeater switch. I heard so much about their excellent customer service; unfortunately, too many problems. By the way, how does a 4X2 work in a passthru version. For example, would the magnitude of available signal decrease that longer cable runs become even a bigger problem in a X2 situation?

sfhub

07-24-06, 03:50 PM

sfhub:
I agree with most of your statements about the difference between HDMI repeaters vs. pass-through switches, except for what you said about equalization.

An equalizer doesn't "clean up the signal" -- it can't do anything to restore the digital waveform of distorted or noisy signals entering the switch. Instead, it modifies the frequency and/or phase response and/or boosts the signal amplitude to compensate for the characteristics of the downstream cabling. It modifies the signal so that an appropriate analog "eye" pattern can be properly decoded by the downstream A/D converter -- to generate fewer bit errors, especially over longer cabling runs.

I think we've determined:

1. The Monoprice 5X1 HDMI switch is pass-through.
2. The Gefen 2X1 HDMI switch (at least the EXT-HDMI-241 that I have) is a repeater.

HDMI repeaters provide considerably more functionality than pass-through switches, since they terminate the bitstream, encrypt/decrypt, and have separate protocol handshakes with upstream sources and downstream displays.

That is "cleaning up the signal" in my book. Admittedly we are using imprecise terms. The general idea is illustrated in the eye diagrams on the octava website:
http://www.octavainc.com/Clear%20Eye%20difference.htm
Monoprice and Octava use the same chipset AFAICT. Most of the time this is called "eye-opening" but people will interchangeably use equalization and amplification. IMO eye-opening is the most accurate of the terms.

The older Gefen HDMI switchers used to have the following disclaimer:
This device is HDCP Pass-Through Compliant.
Like they still do on some of the DVI switchers:
http://www.gefen.com/kvm/product.jsp?prod_id=1208

so it does look like they have changed the design of the 2x1 HDMI switcher because the disclaimers are now gone.

I don't necessarily believe the repeater is so much more difficult or expensive to build. I'm sure it adds costs to get the keys and licensing but even with the older passthrough-design Gefen versions, the same price difference existed (and still exists) Most folks these days don't custom design ICs rather they take chipsets from TI and others and improve on the reference design. The PCB is not really that much different and the casing, remote, etc. stay the same. The main difference is to add the licensed key information. The rest is just handled by a different IC for the switching.

I wouldn't necessarily say repeater-style switches offer considerably more functionality than passthrough. I would say repeater-style switches can potentially do a lot more than passthrough switches. They are what they are. If you decrypt the signal, you can do lots more with it like scaling, deinterlacing, etc. and I think video processors like iScan and Lumagen do a good job of value add for their repeater-style design.

As a pure switch though, I don't agree there is necessarily an advantage to repeater-style switches. In some cases there will be an advantage and in other cases there will be a disadvantage. Given most peoples' configuration IMO the disadvantage and likelihood of encountering STB problems (Scientific Atlanta, Motorola, et al) outweighs the advantages for the average user.

The problem with the STBs is the enduser doesn't control the firmware update process. The posts on the forums indicate that even though fixes are in the works or have already been released by the STB vendor, the MSOs are on an entirely difference schedule and can take several months to half a year to qualify and deploy the fixes. Many times they won't just send out a firmware that fixes the repeater-style switching but will wait until other issues more important to them are fixed.

I think once the STB problem really is fixed and deployed to the vast majority of users, then the real advantage/disadvantage can be reevaluated.

What most end-users care about is problem free operation. Unfortunately no switch can really promise problem free operation right now because the problem could be outside the switch's control.

You'll see in this example that the Denon 3910 and Panasonic AE900 combo caused trouble for both the Gefen and Monoprice switchers.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=701083

IMO the most problem free switcher that was ever sold was the DTronic switchers which stripped HDCP as an undocumented feature. Now that is a partial repeater-style design where I can wholeheartedly agree is a design which will result in the least amount of problems.

rob316

07-25-06, 06:26 PM

Just called MonoPrice about the switch I have heard of issues with this switch with the Tosh A1 and Moto 6412 box. Someone on this forum ( I forget his name but thank you) suggested I speak to Sean about the issues with these 2 items. Sean told me that there is a revision to the box rev 2.0 which fixes issues with the Moto and Tosh. I was only going to buy the 2x switch but Sean told me he only has rev 1.0 for this switch BUT OFFERED ME THE 5X1 SWITCH for $95.00 and just say when I order on line to request in comments the 2.0 rev and say that I want the $95.00 as per Sean. I guess he offered this to me when I said I am a AVS member and I have placed 3 orders with him for cables (AVS has some Juice). I would like to thank everyone who has helped me in this forum and say GREAT JOB AVS.

Rob

Ken Ross

07-25-06, 06:35 PM

I still don't know why you and I experience different results with our similar Sharp panel/AVC configurations. All I know is that both of the Monoprice switches I've tried failed to continue passing the video signal, whereas the Gefen switch works just fine.

- Dave

It shows you how many variables there are in this equation. In the two setups where I use HDMI switchers, the Monoprice works better with my Fujitsu plasmas than the Gefens I've used.

Ronald Epstein

07-28-06, 10:06 AM

Need assistance....

I am setting up my Harmony remote to incorporate the monoprice HDX-501
switcher.

I am a little confused about DELAYS.

What should go on first? The switcher input followed by device putting
delay on starting the device....or, the device followed by the switcher input
putting a delay on the switcher?

moxie1617

07-28-06, 12:19 PM

My switcher goes last, the default setup when I configured my Harmony. I don't have any handshake issues but the unit that is switched is a STB, so it may not have HDCP. When the STB is off, the Monoprice automatically goes back to Input 1 where the DVD player is connected. To avoid HDCP handshake issues you would probably want to have the target device power up 1st, followed by the switch, followed by the source device.

ashutoshsm

07-28-06, 01:03 PM

My Harmony setup didn't ask me for the order in which this is to be done, but I can tell it seems to do it after both source and display are set to the appropriate input/settings and powered on.

Switching the HDMI switch's input before there's a valid source, would only lead it to switch to the (seqeuentially) next avaialble, powered up source.

And I think the HDMI switch is (set up as) one of the A/V devices. Add it, and then include it (as appropriate) with every activity you need to.

Ronald Epstein

07-28-06, 01:17 PM

I programmed my Harmony adding the Monoprice switcher, but it doesn't
seem to get everything working correctly. I had to go and manually do some
switching here and there.

These damn HDMI handshakes are really messing things up.

ashutoshsm

07-28-06, 01:46 PM

These damn HDMI handshakes are really messing things up.

Only if your devices are non-compliant, or barely-loosely-accurately-compliant with the standards, 'twould seem.

I had the following devices working, with 28 Gauge 6 foot cables, largely, and one 24 gauge 15 footer, simultaneously with my Sceptre HDTV via the monoprice HDMI switch ... Dish 811 HD, Motorola 6412 HD DVR, HTPC with awful ATI Radeon X300 card, PC with ancient nVidia 4200, Tohib SDK-850 HD upconverting DVD player ... all in perfect Harmony, pun intended.

moxie1617

07-28-06, 04:25 PM

.....
Switching the HDMI switch's input before there's a valid source, would only lead it to switch to the (seqeuentially) next avaialble, powered up source.
....

You're right. The monoprice won't switch to an input until the connected source is powered on.

TTgowings

07-29-06, 08:53 AM

Well this looks to be exactly what I've been waiting and watching for but as with any purchase whether it be a $20 or a $20,000 purchase you should always do your research and ask questions before not after. Since I've went hi-def I've been waiting and watching for switchers to come down in price and this Monoprice seems to be the one, though there are many other fine switchers out on the market it seems to me for the money and defintely for the customer support this is the one to go with. I'll probably be ordering mine this weekend but a couple of quick questions on compatibility issues, my current system consits of TV-Sony Wega KD-30XS955, DVR-Motorolla DCT6412 ver III (firmware 12.27) w/Comcast, DVD-Sylvania DVL1000F Upscale (similar to Denon DV-9210) Ziotek 13.5' 28AWG HDMI Cable from DVR to TV, RGB from DVD to TV currently.. Also running HTPC w/Nvidia Gf6200OC to TV via Svid, as I'm currently running 2 monitors, one LCD on DVI, one CRT on VGA but with that switcher I'll be changing that up.. Also am a gamer and have all the game consoles and will be adding the HDdvd drive for the 360 when avail and is the reason went for the less exp. upscale DVD currently.. So I guess my main question is that I've heard some ppl having some issues with the Motorolla boxes, has this issue been solved with a firmware update from the cable companies, and if so with what firmware number? Also have read about some ppl having minor issues with their Denon players though my DVD player is a Sylvania (mfg by Funai I understand but is a clone of the Denon) is this still anything to be concerned about or is this or will this already be taken care of on Mono's side with their updated hardware 2.0 fix.. Any suggestions and comments would be most helpful..

And after reading all 9 of these pages: If some ppl would take the time to just do a little more reading and research and realize that with any tech there are complications and if we as consumers like new and emerging tech well sometimes we live on what most call the bleading edge and if we all waited for any tech to complete standards before they came to market we still wouldn't have a few things called, DVD, USB, IEEE1394 or Bluetooth just to name a few.. So welcome to the bleading edge, while you're out buying your umpteen thousand dollar HT's stop and buy some band-aids and maybe a box of tissues.... :rolleyes:

TTgowings

08-01-06, 11:43 AM

Has anyone yet to receive their 2.0 version of the switch yet ?

sfhub

08-01-06, 12:27 PM

So I guess my main question is that I've heard some ppl having some issues with the Motorolla boxes, has this issue been solved with a firmware update from the cable companies, and if so with what firmware number? Also have read about some ppl having minor issues with their Denon players though my DVD player is a Sylvania (mfg by Funai I understand but is a clone of the Denon) is this still anything to be concerned about or is this or will this already be taken care of on Mono's side with their updated hardware 2.0 fix.. Any suggestions and comments would be most helpful..

Motorola should be no problem. I don't think there are many reports of problems with Motorola STB but I haven't read every post. I'm using Motorola DCT-5100 right now with no issues. Just turn on the Motorola and leave it on. It uses the same power either way.

Your DVD player is not very often mentioned. I would guess it would work. The Denon's that had problems were the high-end Denons which I don't believe are manufactured by Funai (but I could be wrong)

Your HTPC should be fine.

You might want to get a few short 28AWG HDMI or HDMI->DVI cables because it is good to have them around for testing different equipment and also for process of elimination. That's just my opinion.

Alex solomon

08-02-06, 09:02 PM

moxie1617

08-02-06, 09:19 PM

Just ordered the Toshiba HD A1. I will be connecting it to Infocus 4805. Any suggestion for DVI to HDMI adaptor? Can I use this (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=104&cp_id=10419&cs_id=1041902&p_id=2080&seq=1&format=2&style=) one from monoprice? This is the right adator, correct? I now run a 35 ft bluejeans DVI cable from PJ to my Bravo D1 DVD player now.

I avoided the plugs with the male HDMI end for fear it will flop out or stress the HDMI port. I used the AR pigtail type that is about eight inches long to keep the stress off the HDMI port. Here is link to the product at Amazon. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006ADJZ2/sr=1-6/qid=1154568131/ref=sr_1_6/002-8688113-2407226?ie=UTF8&s=electronics

Alex solomon

08-02-06, 09:22 PM

I avoided the plugs with the male HDMI end for fear it will flop out or stress the HDMI port. I used the AR pigtrail type that is about a eight inches long to keep the stress off the HDMI port.

Make sense. Good point.

VideoGrabber

08-04-06, 02:23 PM

sfhub explained:
> The reason is many cable boxes do not renegotiate properly when the cable is disconnected. They only do the negotiation when they are first powered up and if they aren't the active device when first powered up, they revert to basic 480p mode. <

This is incredibly stupid, if not plain defective behavior. And it's going to give HDMI a bad rap as a poor interface mechanism.

- Tim

Paul Arnette

08-15-06, 01:04 PM

Thanks to everyone in this thread, as you have provided extremely useful information that will assist me in choosing the right HDMI switcher. I spoke to someone at Monoprice today because I was interested in purchasing Revision 2.0 of this switch, but based on what she told me they would not have any in-stock until Sept./Nov.

So, to echo TTgowins question from two weeks ago...

Has anyone yet to receive their 2.0 version of the switch yet ?

Edited to add:

I really want to get up and running with an HDMI switch as quickly as possible, would you recommend I try the Revision 1.0 first with my equipment (Oppo OPDV971H, Toshiba HD-A1, Zenith HD-SAT520, and Mitsubishi WD-65731) and then exchange it for a Revision 2.0 if it doesn't work or wait.

Thanks.

sfhub

08-15-06, 02:21 PM

I really want to get up and running with an HDMI switch as quickly as possible, would you recommend I try the Revision 1.0 first with my equipment (Oppo OPDV971H, Toshiba HD-A1, Zenith HD-SAT520, and Mitsubishi WD-65731) and then exchange it for a Revision 2.0 if it doesn't work or wait.
That's what I would do. Rev1.0 works fine for the vast majority of setups. If you had a Denon player I might suggest you wait. Other than the Zenith, the other source equipment you listed have been tested by others. Monoprice has an excellent return policy.

Paul Arnette

08-15-06, 02:38 PM

sfhub,

Thanks. OK, bullet bit. I guess I will be the guinea pig for the Zenith HD-SAT520. I realize that it is a fairly outdated HD receiver. If it doesn't work perhaps my wife will relent on the new DirecTV HD DVR. Has anyone tested this switch with that satellite receiver?

sfhub

08-15-06, 04:34 PM

DaveC56

08-23-06, 08:19 AM

Which Denon DVD player was having trouble with the Monoprice 5x1 HMDI switch? I have the Denon DVD-5910 and I'm very interested in purchasing the Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher?

Dave

sfhub

08-23-06, 12:07 PM

If you have a 5910, you are probably better off waiting for the rev2 switcher, going with the manual 2x1 switch, or going with a different solution.

Ken Ross

08-23-06, 04:01 PM

Anyone know what the rev2 switcher does as opposed to the initial offering?

chasw98

08-23-06, 04:32 PM

Which Denon DVD player was having trouble with the Monoprice 5x1 HMDI switch? I have the Denon DVD-5910 and I'm very interested in purchasing the Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher?

Dave

My Denon 1920 will not work with the switcher.

Chuck

plissken99

08-27-06, 05:42 PM

sfhub

08-28-06, 11:13 AM

I'd like to get the 5x1 switch to use with my Toshiba HD-A1, HD-Tivo and oppo DVD player. Should be fine right? Haven't read this whole thread, but what changes will revision 2 bring? And when is it coming out? Would I be better off waiting?
There are examples of people using all of those devices successfully with 5x1 on this thread. Toshiba is constantly updating the HDMI to address compatibility so make sure you read the HD-DVD forums to see what people say about the latest firmware.

ed1

08-29-06, 02:10 PM

I am new to the AVS forums and stumbled onto this thread while trying to find ideas on my new HD TV setup. I am a complete novice to the world of HD TV but have already learned a lot from this thread.

I have a new Sony KDL-46S2000 TV, which has only 1 HDMI input, unfortunately. A DVI to HDMI cable is now connected from my Comcast Motorola cable box (non-dvr) to the TV. I will need a new DVD player which most likely will be one of the upconverting to 1080i models with an HDMI output. With only 1 HDMI input to the TV, I naturally started researching how to use an HDMI switch to accommodate the cable box and the DVD player, as well as perhaps other devices in the future. The Monoprice 5 to 1 model seems like a possibility.

Right now, I believe that the TV's HDMI input #6 is receiving both a DVI to HDMI video cable from the cable box, as well as RCA audio cables from the cable box to the same TV input #6. I'm assuming that HDMI carries only the video signal and the sound is coming through those audio cables to the same #6 TV input.

Here's my question, with apologies from a newbie if it is ridiculous. If I use an HDMI switch to control both the cable box and DVD player video outputs to the TV input, how does the TV receive sound from both devices to the same TV input. As far as I can tell, the HDMI switches do not accommodate sound cables.

What am I missing? Thanks in advance.

sfhub

08-29-06, 02:54 PM

HDMI transmits video and audio over the same cable.

If you use a DVI source, then since DVI is only capable of transferring video over the cable, when it gets converted to HDMI it is still bound by this limitation.

If all your sources are HDMI, then all you do is connect each source to the switch, and one HDMI cable from switch to TV. Video and audio will be passed to the TV for all your sources.

If you have a mixed environment, most folks will send video to their TV and audio to their receiver. So basically the 5x1 does the video switching and the receiver does the audio switching (whether that be TOSLINK/SPDIF or analog audio)

You basically get a Harmony remote (or other advanced programmable remote) and it does all the work for you.

When you press DVD on your remote, it turns on the TV, changes to HDMI input on the TV, changes to input 1 on the 5x1, turns on your receiver, changes to DVD input on the receiver.

When you press SAT on your remote, it turns on the TV, changes to HDMI input on the TV, changes to input 2 on the 5x1, turns on your receiver, changes to CBL input on the receiver.

Since you only press one button to enable everything it is pretty transparent.

If all your TVs are DVI-based and you must send the analog audio to the display (rather than receiver), then this is not the switch for you.

ashutoshsm

08-29-06, 02:57 PM

sfhub explained it thoroughly, and this will make it even clearer ...

HDMI = DVI + Audio

Most devices will happily ALSO send audio via their other outputs (TOSLink/Coaxial digital as well as RCA analog) for alternate amplificationd evices (eg HT Receiver). If you don't already use one, I strongly recommend you consider it ... I've disconnected my TV speakers and put them in storage because my receiver is ALWAYS used for audio!

Alex solomon

08-29-06, 03:16 PM

sfhub, I am considering buying the Mono 2x1 manual switcher. Any issues with the Toshiba HD-A1 you know about when using with a combination of HDMI/DVI cable and adaptors? I will be using this with my Infocus 4805, Bravo D1 and HD-A1 and HDMI/DVI cable and adaptors.

sfhub

08-29-06, 03:33 PM

I have not seen many comments from 4805 users but I might have missed them. It should work fine but I cannot personally make any stronger statement without data to support it. Monoprice has a no restocking fee return policy and excellent customer service so the risk is low. If you plan on embedding stuff in hard to remove places, as general advice for any HDMI/DVI equipment/cables) I suggest you test it out prior to permanent installation.

Alex solomon

08-29-06, 03:36 PM

sfhub, thanks. I will call Monoprice.

ed1

08-29-06, 04:08 PM

sfhub

08-29-06, 05:12 PM

Thank you, sfhub and ashutoshsm, for your replies. I see that I was under a misapprehension about HDMI. So now it seems that I need to pursuade Comcast to give me a cable box with HDMI output and then use an HDMI switch. I don't know if Comcast will provide that type of box as I haven't subscribed to their DVR service - at least not yet.

Another novice question, is there an advantage (other than the availability of the remote and the additional ports, of course) of using the powered 5x1 HDMI switch versus the manual 2x1 switch? Is there still the "handshake" when using the manual switch? Does the manual switch avoid the issue/concern of having the active device powered on first to avoid a handshake problem?

I have a pre-amp + 2 big amps setup (Sony TA-E2000ESD pre-amp - Dolby pro-logic surround - I know its old technology!) which I hope to use from time to time but, since the rest of the family hasn't been inclined to learn how to turn it on, the TV speakers will be used for most normal TV viewing.
In most Comcast areas, the only HDMI boxes they have are the DCT-3412 (digital-only PVR) and DCT-6412 phase3 (analog and digital PVR)

HDMI always has a configuration step to figure out what video format to use and negotiate the HDCP encryption. Often you will need the TV turned on before the source device, but some source devices are more flexible and will work the other way around (working either way is the way it should be if they are properly designed)

Seriously you should look into getting a Harmony remote. It will make your home theatre system much easier to use for the rest of the family.

ashutoshsm

08-29-06, 05:29 PM

The Comcast 6412 P3 that Adelphia provides ehreabouts detects the presence of an HDMI device when I power up my TV, and renegotiates 1080i within half a second ... through the monoprice switch! If anything, it's more robust in the HDMI/DVI implementation than my Toshiba HD-upconverting DVD player (other sources are DVI-only - my PCs). It's certainly vastly more robust than the DVI-out on my old Dish 811 HD receiver used to be (I've since dumped Dish)

sharpmibo

08-29-06, 05:37 PM

I'd like to get the 5x1 switch to use with my Toshiba HD-A1, HD-Tivo and oppo DVD player. Should be fine right? Haven't read this whole thread, but what changes will revision 2 bring? And when is it coming out? Would I be better off waiting?

I am using the Toshiba XA1 and the HD-Tivo 10-250 and both work just fine with the monoprice connected to Sharp 45" LCD.

Dundas

09-01-06, 10:47 AM

5X1 Rev. 2.0 now showing as available on the Monoprice site.

Alex solomon

09-01-06, 10:58 AM

What is revised in Rev 2.0?

BasementBob

09-02-06, 10:48 PM

What is revised in Rev 2.0? I'm curious too.

I'm considering this for a {DCT6412, Oppo971H, Toshiba HD-XA1, Sony BDP-S1 --> Pioneer Pro1140HD with Yamaha RXV2400} setup.

BTW, I see there are several kinds of Harmony Remotes. Which one do you use that would work well with that combination?

Harmony 880 Advanced Universal Remote (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1347758&CatId=0)
Harmony 550 Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2155680&CatId=0)
Harmony 680 Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1112205&CatId=0)
Harmony 676 / Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1112207&CatId=0)
Harmony 659 USB Programmable Internet-Connected Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1090227&CatId=0)

MacGyver929

09-03-06, 08:55 PM

sfhub

09-04-06, 04:48 PM

BTW, I see there are several kinds of Harmony Remotes. Which one do you use that would work well with that combination?

Harmony 880 Advanced Universal Remote (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1347758&CatId=0)
Harmony 550 Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2155680&CatId=0)
Harmony 680 Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1112205&CatId=0)
Harmony 676 / Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1112207&CatId=0)
Harmony 659 USB Programmable Internet-Connected Remote Control (http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1090227&CatId=0)
All those remotes will work very similarly w/r/t the devices they control. Just pick the one that fits your usage the best, look&feel, buttons, etc.

sfhub

09-04-06, 04:51 PM

Hello,

I have an all Sony setup

Sony Cineza projector HS60
Sony DVP-NC85H DVD player
Sony 6.1 Surround Receiver
Sony VCR

I need to run 25 feet of HDMI cable to the projector. Will the Monoprice 5x1 work with my projector / dvd player?
It should work fine. There are people using the 5x1 with Sony Ruby projectors w/o issues, but I don't recall anybody mentioning they tried the HS60 (which doesn't mean they haven't posted, just that I don't recall any)

If you are planning on running anything in the wall, as general advice for any setup, regardless of cable or manufacturer, I suggest you test everything prior to running it in the wall.

Q of BanditZ

09-04-06, 05:32 PM

Great thread! :)

What's Rev 2 got over Rev 1?

I hear good things about these switchers and I may be needing to get something like this pretty soon. My equipment is listed in my profile.

I notice there's even a newer Harmony 890 that has a handful of features over the 880, but that's a bridge I'll cross later.

BasementBob

09-04-06, 05:51 PM

Q of BanditZ

09-04-06, 06:16 PM

Q of BanditZ:
Harmony® 890 Advanced Universal Remote (http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/products/detailsharmony/US/EN,CRID=2084,CONTENTID=10930,AD=emea_hppr_h895_april06)

Nice. May even be a bit of overkill for me but I'll definitely keep it in mind. :)

sfhub

09-04-06, 06:41 PM

sfhub:
Thanks. I was thinking about the multi-device switchover and timing issues -- I didn't think they all did that.

Q of BanditZ:
Harmony® 890 Advanced Universal Remote (http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/products/detailsharmony/US/EN,CRID=2084,CONTENTID=10930,AD=emea_hppr_h895_april06)
AFAICT the programming on the harmony website allows you to have the switcher be the last IR sent after all the devices are turned on.

As long as that ordering is respected in the Harmony remotes everything will work fine.

Q of BanditZ

09-04-06, 06:56 PM

AFAICT the programming on the harmony website allows you to have the switcher be the last IR sent after all the devices are turned on.

As long as that ordering is respected in the Harmony remotes everything will work fine.

Nice!

Do you know what Rev 2 has over Rev 1 on the Monoprice switcher, by any chance?

Other than that, I see nothing but good feedback and the price is unbelievable, so I'll probably be making a move before long.

Thanks for all your helpful posts! Great thread! :)

Q of BanditZ

09-06-06, 09:51 AM

Do you know what Rev 2 has over Rev 1 on the Monoprice switcher, by any chance?

Anyone?

Whatever it is, I'm sure it's an improvement and a good thing.

Unless someone really surprises me here, I can't see any reason not to take a shot on one of these in the near future.

Look forward to anyone's thoughts and input. :)

mystery

09-06-06, 10:11 AM

I don't have an answer for you Q.

But I can say that I absolutely love this switcher. I'm using it to connect my HTPC, Oppo player, and Scientific Atlanta 8300HD PVR to my Optoma H78DC3 projector. Prior to getting the Monoprice switcher, I was unable to receive an HD signal from my PVR. The resolution was very strange and there was no image at all. The built in equalizer must have done the trick because I haven't had a problem receiving anything from any of my devices through this switcher.

The price is right and the company is top notch. My first switcher stopped receiving the remote signals after a couple of days and Monoprice shipped me out another one to compare the two. Turned out both switcher remotes would work with the second switcher they sent but neither one would work with the first one so the problem was in the first unit and not it's remote.

Great customer service! They didn't even charge my credit card a second time while both units were in my home. Just a friendly reminder email to return one of the units was all they did.

I'm running a 50' DVI cable from a HDMI/DVI adapter plugged into the switcher. Not a sparklie to be found. Great pictures, no dropouts.

Go for it! You've got nothing to lose. They have a guarantee.

You still using your LG/Zenith upconverting player these days? :)

Wayne

Q of BanditZ

09-06-06, 11:55 AM

I don't have an answer for you Q.

But I can say that I absolutely love this switcher. I'm using it to connect my HTPC, Oppo player, and Scientific Atlanta 8300HD PVR to my Optoma H78DC3 projector. Prior to getting the Monoprice switcher, I was unable to receive an HD signal from my PVR. The resolution was very strange and there was no image at all. The built in equalizer must have done the trick because I haven't had a problem receiving anything from any of my devices through this switcher.

Interesting. I'm not 100 percent sure what they mean by equalizer or what it actually does.

Can you tell me real quick or at least link me to that info, since I'm sure it's been repeated a million times by now? ;)

The price is right and the company is top notch. My first switcher stopped receiving the remote signals after a couple of days and Monoprice shipped me out another one to compare the two. Turned out both switcher remotes would work with the second switcher they sent but neither one would work with the first one so the problem was in the first unit and not it's remote.

Great customer service! They didn't even charge my credit card a second time while both units were in my home. Just a friendly reminder email to return one of the units was all they did.

I'm running a 50' DVI cable from a HDMI/DVI adapter plugged into the switcher. Not a sparklie to be found. Great pictures, no dropouts.

Go for it! You've got nothing to lose. They have a guarantee.

Good deal.

You still using your LG/Zenith upconverting player these days? :)

Wayne

Oh no. Two Novembers ago I bought the Onkyo DV-SP1000 Universal Player.

The LG Zenith 318 got relegated down to the home gym and died almost a year to the day I bought it with moderate useage. Oh well...

BasementBob

09-06-06, 01:57 PM

I ordered one of these the other day (Sunday?). So when it arrives I'll read the manual and see what it says about 'equalizer'.

The purchase is a bit of a risk for me -- because I won't have a plasma for a month (i.e. an HDMI device) and the monoprice return warantee is 21 days or something. But I want the plasma last, so that the day the plasma arrives everything else is in place.

Q of BanditZ

09-06-06, 02:25 PM

sfhub

09-06-06, 02:53 PM

Anyone?

Whatever it is, I'm sure it's an improvement and a good thing.

Unless someone really surprises me here, I can't see any reason not to take a shot on one of these in the near future.

Look forward to anyone's thoughts and input. :)
I think only rev2 is available on the website now.

Rev2 had minor changes to address isolated compatibility reported here. They also changed to 2-color LEDs, green for selected and orange for signal detected. Finally they disabled active signal detect so you can select an input even if signal is not present. Previously with some equipment, you had to make sure the source device was turned on before sending IR to the monoprice. Now any order will work.

sfhub

09-06-06, 02:55 PM

Interesting. I'm not 100 percent sure what they mean by equalizer or what it actually does.
As far as I can tell, the equalizer performs an eye opening function for the TMDS signal. The net effect is the signal can be sent over further distances without issues.

mystery

09-06-06, 07:12 PM

Here's a link to the Octava switch which utilizes an equalizer which I believe does basically the same thing as the Monoprice. Only thing is, they've coined a snazzy name to theirs.

http://www.octavainc.com/Clear%20Eye%20difference.htm

Wayne

Simon2150

09-07-06, 04:02 PM

mystery

09-07-06, 04:15 PM

Simon,

The answer to your equalizer question can be found two posts back by sfhub.

I wouldn't go with a manual switcher. The cost of the 5 x 1 Monoprice switcher is very reasonable when you look at the competition's prices. The remote with it works very well and you don't need a universal remote in the mix. I have a Harmony remote but I've chosen not to bother going online and through the process to incorporate the Monoprice remote into the system.

Wayne

Simon2150

09-07-06, 04:22 PM

Thanks Wayne! So the equalizer helps boost the signal? I would say that in my set up the switcher would be no more than 6 feet away from the hdmi outlet on the tv. Is it still worth it to get the equalizer? Being that the price is good, I may just do so anyways...

mystery

09-07-06, 06:18 PM

Simon,

HDMI is so finicky I think we need all the help we can get to stave off any unforseen problems. I say go for it. Even if it's overkill, just think of it as insurance. After all, someday sure shootin', you'll have a longer cable run between your switcher and a display device and you'll be glad you have an equalizer.

Wayne

sfhub

09-07-06, 07:18 PM

Okay, I've read many pages in this thread, but it seems many of your "issues" are with the switcher working with a harmony 880 remote. For those that don't have this remote issue, how is this unit working for you?

I am very interested in an HDMI switcher, but am wondering which one to buy. Buy the manual switcher where you have to press a button or buy the 2in1 or 5in1 with the built in equalizer. What does the equalizer do? Would I get better quality of signal with an equalizer. I would be hooking this up to my Mitsubishi 62525 with only 1 hdmi input. I want to hook up my hdmi dvd player (not a HD-DVD player) to my 62525 via HDMI; however, currently occupying the HDMI outlet is my HD receiver box from time warner.

Actually there isn't an issue with harmony 880 remote. Many people use this remote with the 5x1. It is just the person who had particular source equipment where the 5x1 needed to get the command to switch inputs after the source equipment was turned on. The ensuing long discussion was just pertaining to how to accomplish that with Harmony 880.

With rev2 that ordering should never be an issue because it allows you to select an input whether a signal is present or not rather than trying to be too smart and only allowing an input to be selected if signal is detected.

The equalizer you pretty much get for free. It allows the signal to go longer distances without issues. Your decision should not hinge on the equalizer, especially since you are only going short distance. You should decide whether you want the switch to be controlled by IR or are ok with manual switching via push button.

Q of BanditZ

09-07-06, 07:19 PM

Thanks for all the info yet again, gang. :)

kucharsk

09-08-06, 10:28 AM

BTW, the "manual" for the switcher is pretty much useless. Essentially it's "these are the connectors, and here's how you switch inputs."

It also has some strange quirks. The manual mentions the LEDs light up to indicate the selected input, but in fact the active input is green, and active unselected inputs are red. Then, if I shut off the device, the selected input's LED stays green until I shut the display off, at which time it will go out, and remain out, even if I turn the display back on. Strange.

I also wish it was a bit heavier; the weight of the DVI cables makes the switcher back-heavy and rather unstable if you're going to rest it on its feet in your rack.

However, it does work perfectly, which is the important part.

Simon2150

09-08-06, 10:50 AM

Actually there isn't an issue with harmony 880 remote. Many people use this remote with the 5x1. It is just the person who had particular source equipment where the 5x1 needed to get the command to switch inputs after the source equipment was turned on. The ensuing long discussion was just pertaining to how to accomplish that with Harmony 880.

With rev2 that ordering should never be an issue because it allows you to select an input whether a signal is present or not rather than trying to be too smart and only allowing an input to be selected if signal is detected.

The equalizer you pretty much get for free. It allows the signal to go longer distances without issues. Your decision should not hinge on the equalizer, especially since you are only going short distance. You should decide whether you want the switch to be controlled by IR or are ok with manual switching via push button.
Thanks for the advice sfhub!!!

kucharsk

09-08-06, 03:48 PM

With rev2 that ordering should never be an issue because it allows you to select an input whether a signal is present or not rather than trying to be too smart and only allowing an input to be selected if signal is detected.
That is not true.

You cannot select a non-active input on the Rev 2.0 switch, either via the remote or the "Input Select" button on the front panel. You can only select an input connected to a powered on HDMI device.

My "quirks" post above describes a Rev 2.0 5x1 I received Sept. 7.

sfhub

09-08-06, 04:47 PM

That is not true.

You cannot select a non-active input on the Rev 2.0 switch, either via the remote or the "Input Select" button on the front panel. You can only select an input connected to a powered on HDMI device.

My "quirks" post above describes a Rev 2.0 5x1 I received Sept. 7.
Then something must be different because on my rev2 I can cycle through input 1-5 with nothing connected except power. It also works the same with source and display connected. The discrete input selects work the same as well.

TPeterson

09-08-06, 05:37 PM

Evidently there was a production change, as my Rev. 2 also has all LEDs dark except POWER when the inputs and output are not connected to powered devices. And neither front-panel switch nor remote has any effect on them.

sfhub

09-08-06, 06:31 PM

It's possible, mine was a very early batch. I sent mail to monoprice to see what's up.

tedberg

09-09-06, 02:13 PM

I received a rev 2.0 5x1 switch on 9/6. I am trying to use it with a Sharp LC-45GX6U, much like the original post in this thread.

I had a Directv HD Tivo going into the AVC, going into the panel. When I add the monoprice switch between the AVC and panel, the panel only flashes between black and grey when I turn it on.

I have a 3' dvi to hdmi monoprice cable connecting the AVC dvi out to input 1 of the switch. I first tried a dvi - hdmi adapter on the hydra cable to the hdmi out of the switch. After that didn't work, I tried another 3' monoprice dvi to hdmi cable between the panel and the switch's hdmi out. In either case I had the same result.

Previously I had a gefen 4x1 dvi switch that did work with this setup. Unfortunately after 6 months, the ir input on the gefen stopped responding and I had no way to switch inputs.

One question about the hydra cable. It has all of the dvi pins populated, while the dvi to hdmi cables are missing the middle pins. Since the first post described using the dvi to hdmi cable on the panel, why the difference?

sfhub

09-10-06, 03:33 AM

I received a rev 2.0 5x1 switch on 9/6. I am trying to use it with a Sharp LC-45GX6U, much like the original post in this thread.
...
One question about the hydra cable. It has all of the dvi pins populated, while the dvi to hdmi cables are missing the middle pins. Since the first post described using the dvi to hdmi cable on the panel, why the difference?
I suggest you ask monoprice if they have a rev1 switcher.

The Hydra cable is dual-link cable, but the AVC and display only use single link. The extra pins are not uses. The HDMI connector that is ubiquitous does not support dual-link, hence you for existing HDMI->DVI cables you will not see dual-link supported. I cannot say for the future, but it looks like HDMI is going with higher bandwidth single-link vs dual-link to increase the data transferred.

tedberg

09-10-06, 10:37 AM

I suggest you ask monoprice if they have a rev1 switcher.

Have you tried the 2.0 switch you received recently with your 45GX6U?

I also have a Denon 2910 DVD player going through the AVC. Hopefully that would work with a rev 1, as others in the thread have had problems with Denons.

I was thinking the pins were probably Dual link, but only the 30" monitors from Apple/Dell need that. I was worried that Sharp was doing something propritary between the panel and avc.

sfhub

09-10-06, 11:30 AM

rev2 doesn't work with GX.

If you have your Denon connected to the AVC, the Denon is essentially interacting with the AVC. From the standpoint of the switch, the AVC is what it sees. If the AVC works, anything you connect to the AVC (regardless of whether it would work independently with the switch alone) should work. The AVC is decrypting and restransmitting the signal from the Denon. That is my experience.

Valid concern on the dual-link, but in this case not a concern because they aren't being used. I use single link cables all the time from AVC to display and the bandwidth from the EDID of the panel is in single link range.

kucharsk

09-12-06, 03:37 PM

It's possible, mine was a very early batch. I sent mail to monoprice to see what's up.Given it's now been a few work days, I trust you didn't receive a reply. :(

Ken Ross

09-12-06, 08:20 PM

.

However, it does work perfectly, which is the important part.

Considering that you can't say that about most switchers, that IS saying something! :)

sfhub

09-12-06, 09:16 PM

Given it's now been a few work days, I trust you didn't receive a reply. :(
They are looking into it, but I suspect there was a production change, so you can disregard the behavior change of the IR in rev2 that I mentioned. Rev2 behaves the same as rev1 in that respect.

tedberg

09-13-06, 02:01 PM

rev2 doesn't work with GX.

If you have your Denon connected to the AVC, the Denon is essentially interacting with the AVC. From the standpoint of the switch, the AVC is what it sees. If the AVC works, anything you connect to the AVC (regardless of whether it would work independently with the switch alone) should work. The AVC is decrypting and restransmitting the signal from the Denon. That is my experience.

I got a rev 1.0 switch and that did work with the LC-45GX6U talking to either the AVC, or a PowerBook G4. It is a little troubling that the 2.0 does not work, because I will get a PS3 in the future and possibly an Apple iTV (Announced 9/12). If I find out that those devices only work with a rev 2.0 or maybe 3.0, which doesn't work with my TV, I'll be SOL.

sfhub

09-13-06, 08:55 PM

I got a rev 1.0 switch and that did work with the LC-45GX6U talking to either the AVC, or a PowerBook G4. It is a little troubling that the 2.0 does not work, because I will get a PS3 in the future and possibly an Apple iTV (Announced 9/12). If I find out that those devices only work with a rev 2.0 or maybe 3.0, which doesn't work with my TV, I'll be SOL.
I wouldn't be overly concerned. Rev1 has been tested with Samsung BluRay and Toshiba HD-DVD, pretty leading edge devices.

I would be more worried that the devices you mentioned will not work direct to Sharp panel, regardless of whether the switch is in the loop or not.

For instance, Samsung BDP-1000 doesn't work when connected direct to panel.

rev2 has been tested at 1080p with Samsung BDP-1000 to Sony Ruby.

wwyjoe

09-13-06, 09:49 PM

has the rev2.0 fixed the issue of long cable run compatibility issues with denon dvd players?

sfhub

09-13-06, 10:14 PM

has the rev2.0 fixed the issue of long cable run compatibility issues with denon dvd players?
I don't know specifically about denon, but the issue I reported in the first post with long cable and Panasonic S77 was fixed. I imagine there is a good chance the Denon problem was addressed by the same fix.

ShagnWagon

09-21-06, 10:24 AM

Is the 2x1 switcher just as good as its big brother?

Simon2150

09-21-06, 11:30 AM

I have another question as I am about to pull the trigger on purchasing 1 of these units. Before I ask, let me list the components I have:

1. Mits 62525 DLP with 1 HDMI
2. Digital cable box with DVI (currently I have a DVI to HDMI cable and that is what's occupying the HDMI on the TV). Since DVI doesn't carry audio, I have 1 set of rca cables that go to the audio out of the digiital cable box going into the rca plugs located right next HDMI. I have it connected just like this:
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/9296/connectionin7.jpg
3. Sony HDMI DVD player (but have it connected with component cables for now).

So my question is, I want to connect the DVD player with HDMI and buy the HDMI Switcher. Does anyone know what will happen if I leave the audio cables from digital cable box plugged into the RCA jacks next to the HDMI. Currently, to select the HDMI on the TV, you have to be on "Monlink" which is the input on the TV.

So the new setup I imagine would be something like this:
1. Monoprice HDMI switcher plugged into the back of TV.
2. DVI to HDMI cord from cable box plugged into Monoprice switch. RCA cables left plugged into the back of TV.
3. DVD player plugged into HDMI switcher (will probably keep the optical cable on back of dvd player plugged directly into receiver).

Should that still work. When I watch digital cable, unless I am watching a sports game or movie, I like to use the TV speakers for regular programs such as watching Sportscenter or the news.

Advice appreciated.

sfhub

09-21-06, 11:31 AM

From reports it should function the same, just with fewer ports.

sfhub

09-21-06, 11:37 AM

So my question is, I want to connect the DVD player with HDMI and buy the HDMI Switcher. Does anyone know what will happen if I leave the audio cables from digital cable box plugged into the RCA jacks next to the HDMI. Currently, to select the HDMI on the TV, you have to be on "Monlink" which is the input on the TV.
...
Should that still work. When I watch digital cable, unless I am watching a sports game or movie, I like to use the TV speakers for regular programs such as watching Sportscenter or the news.

Advice appreciated.
This sounds more like a question on the Mitsubishi than the 5x1. How Mitsubishi handles multiple audio inputs on the HDMI port is what you should be asking.

In the case of STB being selected, you want audio from RCA and video from HDMI.

In the case of DVD being selected, you want audio/video from HDMI and RCA ignored.

It is possible Mitsubishi designed it this way, where audio on HDMI overrides RCA audio, but it is also possible they didn't design it this way.

If Mitsubishi doesn't work the way you want, you might be better off getting an HDMI STB from your provider.

Simon2150

09-21-06, 01:32 PM

Yeah, that makes sense sfhub. I want the HDMI audio to override RCA when an HDMI to HDMI connection is made via the switch. I guess the only way is to try it, but I figured others may have had similar set-ups.

I also called about getting a STB with HDMI from my provider, but none is available :( That'd be the easiest thing for me, but not possible right now.

Fettastic

09-21-06, 03:32 PM

I just got my monoprice 2X1 pushbutton HDMI switcher today. For $30 you can't go wrong. I just wish they had a 3x1 because that's what I would prefer to have.

ShagnWagon

09-21-06, 05:45 PM

The push button one works ok? I was actually looking at the nicer 2x1, but if the pushbutton works...

sfhub

09-21-06, 06:15 PM

The pushbutton works fine. If you don't need remote control just get the pushbutton.

Simon2150

09-29-06, 12:15 AM

Okay, I just wanted to report that I received my 5x1 Monoprice HDMI switcher and Monoprice HDMI cables (the ones with ferrite cores and are 28 awg). Everything is top notch and top quality. I was surprised at how well the HDMI plugs fit into the back of my Mits 62525 as it was tight. Previously I had a 50 dollar RCA HDMI to DVI cable plugged in and it was loose. The Monoprice cable fit more snug.

Anyhow, I got everything hooked up and HDMI switching is such a breeze and what I love is that I still have 3 empty ports for future expansion! Just for reference sake, here's my equipment:
1. Monoprice switcher 5x1 and Monoprice HDMI cables
2. Mits 62525
3. Digital cable box 8300 from time warner
4. Sony DVP NC85H

I hooked everything up via HDMI cables and it works perfect. Thanks to the contributors of this thread for providing such valuable information!

ashutoshsm

09-29-06, 10:50 AM

Good For You, Simon! Now get yourself a (HT)PC to hook up to your TV, and a REAL HD DVR (like the S3 TiVo) (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=722696&page=1&pp=60) instead of that abhorrent piece of Scientific Atlanta plastic gunk! (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=319217)

And to stay on topic ... anyone using their monoprice rev 1 switch with a TiVo Series 3 yet? I probably will be, by Christmas, and was curious to know if I should expect any problems (highly unlikely, of course)

kucharsk

09-30-06, 07:11 AM

Here's something annoying I encountered with my 5x1 v2.0:

I have my display, a 5-series Panasonic plasma, connected to the HDMI out via a HDMI->DVI cable.

I have a HD DVR connected to port 1 via a DVI->HDMI cable.
I have a Pioneer DV-79AVi connected to port 2 via a HDMI cable.

If I have the Monoprice set to port 1, then turn on the DVD player, I get a green LED for port 1 and a red light for port 2, indicating it sees port 2 as active but port 1 is selected.

If I shut off the HD DVR with the DVD player on, port 1 remains selected (green) and the port 2 LED remains red.

If I then shut off the display before shutting off the DVD player, the Monoprice automatically switches to port 2. (The port 2 LED goes green at that point and stays green with the display off. Port 2 is selected from that point on.)

If I instead shut the DVD player off first, then the display, no selection LEDs remain lit (just the power LED.) Port 1 remains selected, but no port LEDs turn back on until I power up either the HD DVR or the DVD player.

If I do the inverse (switch to port 2, and see the port 1 LED glowing red) shut off the DVD player, shut off the display, and then the HD DVR) port 2 remains selected (and the port 2 LED stays green.)

Anyone know the reason(s) for the fluky behavior? Is it because the DVD player is the only true HDMI device connected?

It's not a big deal, but the HD DVR is most of my DVI viewing, and it's annoying to have to switch the selector back to port 1 every time I use my DVD player and shut the display off first.

sfhub

09-30-06, 07:35 AM

The switch has an autoscan feature. It is the same as the SmartScan feature for Octava switches. The switch will switch to the next active input if the signal is lost on the current input. If only one input ever has active signal at a time, then it will switch to that input automatically and not require the remote at all.

I think it has more to do with how the HD DVR and DVD player react to detecting the HDMI sink has shutdown. They probably behave differently when you power them off as opposed to powering off the display first. In the latter case, they may shutdown the HDMI port differently, causing the HDMI signal to be stopped. In that case the signal detection for the switch will change to the next input with signal.

What happens when you only have one device turned on at a time? Instead of both turned on?

If I were you I would just have a macro that turned on all the correct components and switched to the correct inputs on the TV, switch, and home theatre receiver.

This will make everything transparent.

Logitech Harmony remotes behave in this way. They call it activity based control. Selecting DVD turns on the TV, DVD, receiver, switch TV to HDMI, and switch to input 2.

audvid

10-01-06, 05:56 PM

sfhub

10-01-06, 07:11 PM

I realize hdmi 1.3 products might not yet be widely available/used. Is there any reason that the current monoprice rev 2.0 switch will not work with hdmi 1.3. I don't know what 1.3 means and whether it really will interact any differently with the monoprice 5X1 rev 2.0 switch.
If HDMI 1.3 has modes that are within current 165MHz HDMI/DVI spec then it will probably work in those modes.

Higher bandwidth modes, I don't think you'll get real confirmation until 1.3 products come out. I wouldn't expect it to work but would be happily surprised if it did. I would imagine almost all repeater-style switch designs will require an HDMI 1.3 upgrade or replacement. Since the 5x1 is a passthrough design, there's a slight chance it might work, but again, I wouldn't expect it to.

kucharsk

10-02-06, 02:59 AM

The switch has an autoscan feature. It is the same as the SmartScan feature for Octava switches. The switch will switch to the next active input if the signal is lost on the current input. If only one input ever has active signal at a time, then it will switch to that input automatically and not require the remote at all.
If the switcher is set to port 2 (DVD) and the DVD player is off, I can turn the HD DVR on and off all day and the Monoprice will never switch to it.

Also, if I turn the DVD player on while the display is on, the Monoprice will not switch.

The Monoprice only automatically switches if I turn the DVD player on or off while the display and HD DVR are off.

I think this likely has something to do with the fact that both the HD DVR and display are DVI devices connected via conversion cables; the DVD player is the only true HDMI device involved other than the Monoprice. Perhaps auto-conversion works properly in an all-HDMI setup, but it certainly doesn't in mine.

Macro-ized remotes would never work with my setup; it's far too complex.

sfhub

10-02-06, 07:13 AM

I think this likely has something to do with the fact that both the HD DVR and display are DVI devices connected via conversion cables; the DVD player is the only true HDMI device involved other than the Monoprice. Perhaps auto-conversion works properly in an all-HDMI setup, but it certainly doesn't in mine.

Macro-ized remotes would never work with my setup; it's far too complex.
I think the rev2 is behaving differently either with your devices or in general as compared to rev1 regarding the autoswitching. It is unlikely to have anything to do with conversion cables. Either it is designed different or behaves different with your specific equipment.

You would be surprised how advanced remotes have become. I have a very complex setup and my remote works fine. What activity do you feel is too complex for a macro remote?

The UI is very simple. If I want to select the DVD, TV, VCR, etc. "activity" I press and hold DVD, TV, VCR, etc. button. If I just want the remote to control the device but not turn on devices or select inputs, I press the DVD, TV, VCR, etc. button. If I'm finished with the system, I press and hold Power and the whole system shuts down. If I just want to turn off a specific device, I press the Power button.

When I select DVD activity the remote performs the following:
1) Turn on TV (discrete on)
2) Turn on Receiver (discrete on)
3) Turn on DVD player (discrete on)
4) Switch Receiver to DVD input (discrete input select)
5) Switch Monoprice 5x1 to input 2 (discrete input select)
6) *If* TV going from off to on, wait 5 seconds
*If* TV is already on, skip the 5 second pause
7) Switch TV to HDMI input (discrete input select)
8) Set Volume buttons on remote to control Receiver

If I later switch to the cable box the remote knows to skip the 5 second delay which is needed because my TV will not accept IR for the first 5 seconds when first being turned on.

Usually when I watch TV using the internal tuner, I don't want the receiver turned on, so when I switch to TV from DVD, my remote knows to turn off the Receiver and to change the Volume buttons to control the TV. However sometimes I want to use the receiver, so I have a button that tells the remote to enable a mode where the Receiver is used. In that case it will turn on the Receiver and set the Volume buttons to control the receiver. It will keep track of this "Receiver" mode until I turn it off (or turn off my entire system)

My remote needs to keep track of the power on/off state of my cable box and VCR because they do not support discrete on/off IR.

For example if I later switch to VCR activity the remote performs the following:
1) Turn on TV (discrete on)
2) *If* Receiver mode is off, Turn off Receiver (discrete off)
3) *If* VCR is off, Send Power toggle IR (simulated discrete on)
*If* VCR is on, do nothing
4) Switch Sima composite/svideo switcher to input 3
5) Switch TV to composite/svideo input
6) Set Volume buttons on remote to control TV

Throughout all these activities none of the devices ever toggle power (unless desired) because either they support discrete on/off or the remote keeps track of the power state of the device and simulates discrete on/off.

I do have an advanced remote that I program from my PC, but you can get 90% of the advanced functions with very simple web based programming with Harmony remotes from Logitech.

BasementBob

10-02-06, 10:47 AM

sfhub

10-02-06, 12:32 PM

sfhub:

I recently got the Harmony 890.
I didn't see on the web interface the ability to conditionally wait 5 seconds.
I didn't see anywhere the ability to program the remote from software on the PC (or more accurately, the software that runs looks like it's a sort of browser).
(Of course this doesn't mean it's not there, just that I haven't found it).
Where is the 'conditionally wait 5 seconds' bit ?
...
One of my programming errors was that my television uses the 'next video' button to select between inputs, and when I typed the list of possible values into Harmony I got the order wrong. As a result it would never successfully move between Cable and DVD (always ended up with the TV in the wrong in-video). When I saw your "(discrete input select)" I was a little jelous.
That is why I said you can get 90% of what I mentioned with a Harmony remote. :) I actually use a $20 Radio Shack (one for all) remote that I program using JP1 cable ($15) and PC programming tools available for free.

Harmony can pretty much do everything except the conditionals (the hardware may be capable of doing that but you'd have to get the Harmony programmers implement it) That's what I meant by 90%. I recall it does have the ability to pause in your macros, but not conditionally. It's under the advanced programming options.

Regarding discretes, many devices actually do have them, but often they are not available on the original remote or are unpublished. There is a whole remote control forum devoted to discrete on/off and discrete input select.

http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/mboard/rc-discrete/list.cgi

Also there is some help on the JP1 forums too:

http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1744

Having discretes does make programming macros much easier.

If you are not sure whether your TV may have unpublished discrete support, post the TV, manufacturer and model #, and I can try to look it up.

Many times though, Harmony has already found the discretes for most devices, because it simplifies their "activity" based approach to home theater setup.

BasementBob

10-02-06, 03:59 PM

sfhub

If you are not sure whether your TV may have unpublished discrete support, post the TV, manufacturer and model #, and I can try to look it up.
Thank you for the offer, but it's my plan to replace that TV soon. It's a 10 year old Samsung Compaq Theatre that's given good service, but there's a horizontal line about 10% down from the top that won't go away, and the picture jumps up and down especially after it's first turned on, and its top resolution input is s-video.

I actually use a $20 Radio Shack (one for all) remote that I program using JP1 cable ($15) and PC programming tools available for free. Now you tell me. :)

I'll check out those other forums.

rocko1290

10-09-06, 12:18 AM

I know some of you folks have been eagerly awaiting the 5x1 HDMI switch from Monoprice. I had a chance to test a pre-production version and it has performed very nicely. My review follows. I hope you find it useful.

Review of Monoprice 5x1 Enhanced HDMI switch with Equalizer
http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10110&style=

Executive Summary
=================
This is an excellent HDMI switcher which provides tremendous value and excellent performance.
The 5x1 switcher passed testing at 720p/hdcp, 1080i/hdcp, 1080p/60/hdcp using 50ft 24AWG HDMI
cables without using any additional repeaters. In addition the 5x1 switch worked well as a
mixed HDMI/DVI switcher and had no problems with audio over HDMI.

Switching times were quite good, in the range of 1-2 seconds for non-HDCP devices and 3-5 seconds
for HDCP devices. HDCP switch times include time to renegotiate encryption and varies between
different devices.

Dimensions(WxDxH): 7.1"x3"x1"
Power Usage: 2 Watts (full load, 5 ports active) (@ $0.21/kilowatt-hr $0.31/month)
Remote Control: discrete input select 1-5, input up/down (uses 2xAAA batteries)

WARNING: Please do not take the results of this review as a guarantee the switch will work with all
equipment and cables equally. Testing represents best effort to perform a range of tests on a diverse
set of equipment and cable lengths but is not broad enough to be considered exhaustive. During testing
it was found that some TMDS transmitters are more sensitive than others. In addition if different cables
from those tested are used, results can vary. It was also discovered some HDMI->DVI adapters can pass
1080p successfully while others can not. The same would apply to other types of adapters.

Full Review
===========

Initial impressions
-------------------
Unit was very compact for a 5x1 switcher. The width is just enough to comfortably fit 6 (5x1)
HDMI ports and about 1" high (includes rubber feet) Included AC adapter was the smallest "wall wart"
ever seen by this reviewer. Build quality was excellent overall. Unit felt very solid. Given
this was pre-production model, there were some slight cosmetic issues but these should be cleaned
up by production time.

Remote control was of good quality and included real vs membrane buttons. Functions include
discrete input 1-5 select and input up/down. Infrared functionality was easily integrated into
universal programming remote either through learning or device upgrades. For JP1 capable remotes,
I've provided a device upgrade file here (for other remotes, decoded IR/protocol provided in appendix):

http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=2762

Switch has an "autoscan" feature which automatically selects an active input. In practice this
works nice when you are only using 2 devices. For 5 devices it may be simpler to have this feature
disabled (which is not currently an option)

Functional testing summary
--------------------------
Testing was done on this unit at 1080p/60 (148.5MHz) both with and without HDCP. Extensive testing
was also done at 720p/1080i with/without HDCP with a variety of equipment. Test display was the
Sharp LC-45GX6U 1920x1080 display. 1080p testing was done by connecting 5x1 switch directly to the
Sharp display panel DVI port. 720p/1080i testing was done through the HDMI port of the Sharp AVC
(external video processor)

Source devices tested include:
Panasonic S77 upconverting DVD player HDMI (720p/hdcp)
Samsung HD841 upconverting DVD player DVI (1080i/hdcp)
PNY Verto 6600GT PC grapics card DVI (1080i)
MyHD MDP-130 PC HDTV tuner card DVI (1080i)
Radio Shack Accurian ATSC HDTV tuner HDMI (1080i)
Motorola DCT-5100 HD cable set top box DVI (1080i)

PNY Verto 6600GT PC grapics card DVI (1080p/60)
Sharp AVC TU-GD10U-T DVI (1080p/60/hdcp)

Display device:
Sharp LC-45GX6U HDMI (720p/1080i)
Sharp LC-45GX6U DVI (1080p/60/hdcp 1080p/60)

Cables tested
[all Monoprice cables, in the interest of reducing the test matrix some tests were skipped as indicated]
[Monoprice HDMI->DVI adapters were used where appropriate]
28AWG HDMI Cables - 3ft, 6ft, 10ft, 15ft
24AWG HDMI Cables - 3ft, 6ft, 10ft, 15ft, 25ft, 33ft, 50ft
22AWG HDMI Cables - 50ft

Sparkles were not present for any of the test configurations.

1080p testing
-------------
In particular 1080p/60/hdcp (148.5MHz) was sent from Sharp AVC to Sharp display panel through the 5x1
switcher and 50ft 24AWG HDMI cable. This configuration was observed for 2+ hours with no sparkles while
viewing both black picture and using internal QAM tuner to view 1080i content converted to 1080p/hdcp by
Sharp AVC. Testing was repeated at 1080p/60 (no HDCP) using PNY Verto 6600GT viewing WMV-HD 1080p clips
for 15 minutes. No sparkles were observed.

Switch times were excellent in this configuration, often 1 second or less.

720p/1080i testing
------------------
Various devices were tested at 720p/1080i with and without HDCP. No sparkles were observed for any of
the configurations. See raw testing data for extended testing results.

Initial basic test scenario:
1) Panasonic S77 HDMI upconverting DVD player (uses HDMI/HDCP)
connected to input 1 of HDMI switcher using Panasonic suppied 6ft HDMI cable, configured for 720p
source content: The Incredibles
2) Samsung HD841 DVI upconverting DVD player (used DVI/HDCP)
connected to input 2 of HDMI switcher using Monoprice 28AWG 6ft DVI->HDMI cable, configured for 1080i
source content: Star Wars Ep3: Revenge of the Sith

HDMI out was connected to Sharp LC-45GX6U "AVC" (Sharp's external video processing box) using
Radio Shack Gold Series 6ft HDMI->HDMI cable.

No picture degradation at all through the switcher. No sparkles, no strange lines, etc.
Testing was purposely done with one source at 720p and the other at 1080i to force renegotiations.

Switch time was pretty fast for HDMI switcher with HDCP sources. 3-5 seconds (including
HDMI/HDCP renegotiation time between source and display)

Tested turning off the Sharp TV while input 1 was selected and also while input 2 was selected.
Upon turning the TV back on, everything negotiated properly and a picture showed up within 4-5 seconds.

Tested turning off Panasonic S77 while playing, then turning back on, works ok. HDMI/HDCP
renegotiates and picture shows in up 4-5 seconds.

Tested turning off Samsung HD841 while playing, then turning back on, works ok. DVI/HDCP
renegotiates and picture shows in up 4-5 seconds.

Basically there were no sparkles and switch worked as expected.

Extended testing data
---------------------
Test cables (FC=FerriteCore N=Netjacket):
a) 02029 HDMI->DVI F-M converter
b) 02404 DVI->HDMI M-M 28AWG FC 6ft

1) 02526 HDMI M-M 28AWG FC 3ft
2) 02412 HDMI M-M 28AWG FC 6ft
3) 02504 HDMI M-M 28AWG FC 10ft
4) 02529 HDMI M-M 28AWG FC 15ft

5) 02283 HDMI M-M 24AWG FC/N 3ft
6) 02219 HDMI M-M 24AWG FC/N 6ft
7) 02281 HDMI M-M 24AWG FC/N 10ft
8) 02282 HDMI M-M 24AWG FC/N 15ft

9) 02109 HDMI M-M 24AWG 25ft
10) 02742 HDMI M-M 24AWG 33ft (actual 35ft)
11) 02110 HDMI M-M 24AWG FC 50ft

12) 02678 HDMI M-M 22AWG 50ft

====

Scenario 1
Input1 - Sharp AVC 1080p/HDCP == DVI->HDMI 28AWG 6ft (b) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input2 - PNY Verto 6600GT 1080p == DVI->HDMI 28AWG 6ft (b) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher

Output - Monoprice HDMI cable == HDMI->DVI 28AWG 6ft (b) == Sharp LC-45GX6U Panel

Scenario 2
Input1 - Panasonic S77 DVD HDMI/HDCP 720p == HDMI->HDMI cable 6ft (Panasonic bundled) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input2 - Samsung HD841 DVD DVI/HDCP 1080i == DVI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input3 - PNY Verto 6600GT DVI 1080i == DVI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input4 - MyHD MDP-130 DVI 1080i == HDMI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input5a- RS Accurian HDTV tuner HDMI/HDCP 1080i == HDMI->HDMI cable 6ft (Radio Shack 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input5b- Motorola DCT-5100 DVI/HDCP 1080i == DVI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher

Output - Monoprice HDMI cable == Sharp LC-45GX6U AVC HDMI Input

====

Scenario *1*
Input1 - Sharp AVC 1080p/HDCP == DVI->HDMI 28AWG 6ft (b) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input2 - PNY Verto 6600GT 1080p == DVI->HDMI 28AWG 6ft (b) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher

Output - Monoprice HDMI cable == HDMI->DVI 28AWG 6ft (b) == Sharp LC-45GX6U Panel

Input1 selected
1) 3ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
2) 6ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
3) 10ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

5) 3ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
6) 6ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
7) 10ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

9) 25ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
10) 35ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
11) 50ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

12) 50ft 22AWG no sparkle, passed visual picture inspection

Input2 selected
1) 3ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
2) 6ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
3) 10ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

5) 3ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
6) 6ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
7) 10ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

9) 25ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
10) 35ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
11) 50ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

12) 50ft 22AWG no sparkle, passed visual picture inspection

====

Scenario *2*
Input1 - Panasonic S77 DVD HDMI/HDCP 720p == HDMI->HDMI cable 6ft (Panasonic bundled) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input2 - Samsung HD841 DVD DVI/HDCP 1080i == DVI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input3 - PNY Verto 6600GT DVI 1080i == DVI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input4 - MyHD MDP-130 DVI 1080i == HDMI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input5a- RS Accurian HDTV tuner HDMI/HDCP 1080i == HDMI->HDMI cable 6ft (Radio Shack 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher
Input5b- Motorola DCT-5100 DVI/HDCP 1080i == DVI->HDMI cable 6ft (Monoprice 28AWG) == Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher

Output - Monoprice HDMI cable == Sharp LC-45GX6U AVC HDMI Input

Input1 Selected
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

9) 25ft 24AWG (see Caveat #1)
10) 35ft 24AWG (see Caveat #1)
11) 50ft 24AWG (see Caveat #1)

12) 50ft 22AWG (see Caveat #1)

Input2 Selected
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

9) 25ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
10) 35ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
11) 50ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

12) 50ft 22AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

Input3 Selected
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

9) 25ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
10) 35ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #2)
11) 50ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #2)

12) 50ft 22AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #2)

Input4 Selected
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #3)

8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #3)

9) 25ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #3)
10) 35ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #3)
11) 50ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #3)

12) 50ft 22AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection (see Caveat #3)

Input5a Selected
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

9) 25ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
10) 35ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
11) 50ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

12) 50ft 22AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

Input5b Selected
4) 15ft 28AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

8) 15ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

9) 25ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
10) 35ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection
11) 50ft 24AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

12) 50ft 22AWG no sparkle, passed visual inspection

Caveats:
--------
1) when testing Panasonic S77 DVD player, I found that the player performs a form of cable length
detection during the startup procedure. When used with 5x1 switch and HDMI output cable lengths
25ft and longer, the DVD player displays a "U 70-2" error. According to the manual this error
is for HDMI cable too long. I tested a 50ft 24AWG cable directly from Panasonic S77 DVD player
to Sharp AVC HDMI port and this error did not occur. It appears using the 5x1 switch introduces
enough delay that the S77 DVD player thinks the cable is too long. This should not be an issue
if you intend to use output cable lengths up to 15ft, which did not exhibit this behavior. This
behavior could also be related to the Sharp AVC HDMI port, so you may not see this issue at all
if you use a different display.

2) when testing PNY Verto 6600GT PC graphics card and Sharp AVC HDMI port, there were no sparkles
or issues at any resolution. However for cable lengths 35ft-50ft the observed behavior was the
BIOS boot screen would display with no issues, but once the nVidia Windows drivers loaded, the
screen turned blank. Using a remote desktop, I determined this was occuring because the Windows
drivers failed to detect a digital display because the EDID information was not being returned
quick enough. It is not an issue with the DVI/HDMI video signal because I was able to trick the
graphics card by using a 25ft cable to boot into Windows desktop, then switch to 50ft cable. In
this scenario displaying WMV-HD 1080p videos had no sparkles and windows desktop had no artifacts
with the 50ft cable. Further, I was able to insert a Gefen DVI Detective to return EDID information
to the 6600GT card much quicker. With the DVI Detective in place, the 6600GT had no problems
booting into Windows desktop, even with 50ft 24AWG HDMI cable. Interestingly this issue might
also depend on the display. When testing 6600GT through 5x1 switch and 50ft cable direct to
Sharp display panel DVI (as opposed to going through AVC), the same issue did not occur.

3) this particular switcher has a feature that detects whether a signal is active by testing for
some signals on the HDMI input. The MyHD MDP-130 PC HDTV tuner passes this signal only if connected
to a DVI graphics card using the loopback cable. If the MDP-130 DVI port is used without the loopback
cable connected to the graphics card, the signal will not be present on the DVI cable and the switch
will think there is no active signal and thus will not allow the port to be selected. The workaround
is to use the DVI loopback cable. Ideally the feature of detecting signal could be disabled and that
might be a consideration for a future release.

4) when switching from a device which has negotiated YCbCr to nVidia 6600GT, colorspace might
not be reset properly to RGB. This is *not* an issue with the 5x1 switch, rather the hotplug
negotiation between nVidia 6600GT and the Sharp display. Workaround is to switch to different
video resolution and switch back to original. Alternate workarounds include switching to an RGB
device that is properly negotiating like Samsung HD841 prior to switching to PNY Verto 6600GT,
or going in the config menu to force Sharp display to use RGB, or to configure all devices on
the switch to use RGB. Potentially the workaround could be as simple as switching to unused
HDMI port before switching to nVidia 6600GT display, assuming the active signal detection can
be disabled.

Appendix
========

IR protocol decode
------------------
Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switch
Protocol: NECx1
Main Device #: 8
Sub Device #: 8

EFC
058 Input 1
119 Input 2
249 Input 3
250 Input 4
244 Input 5
052 Input Up
056 Input DownWhat is the equalizer and what does it do?

sfhub

10-09-06, 01:15 AM

What is the equalizer and what does it do?
It allows the signal to go longer distances without degrading.

maxleung

10-10-06, 11:02 AM

That's one heck of a copy-and-past job rocko! Do you think you could trim it just a tiny bit? ;)

sfhub: Any word on the differences between units that were supposed to be revision 2 but ended up missing features?

sfhub

10-10-06, 12:32 PM

sfhub: Any word on the differences between units that were supposed to be revision 2 but ended up missing features?
The only difference was the disabling of the active signal detection and autoscan. It is my understanding this will show up in the next revision. If it is important to you I suggest you ask monoprice about it.

rocko1290

10-10-06, 12:56 PM

The only difference was the disabling of the active signal detection and autoscan. It is my understanding this will show up in the next revision. If it is important to you I suggest you ask monoprice about it.What is the autoscan? I would like to have the auto signal detection. Do you know when the revision 3 is due? Will it be the same high quality that the rev 1 and 2 are?

sfhub

10-10-06, 01:39 PM

What is the autoscan? I would like to have the auto signal detection. Do you know when the revision 3 is due? Will it be the same high quality that the rev 1 and 2 are?
You misunderstand, the current revision (and rev1) *has* active signal detection and autoscan. Active signal detect allows you to cycle through (and discretely select) only inputs with an active signal. Autoscan will choose the next active input automatically if the current one loses signal.

Most people use these switches with programmable remotes so they have no need for signal detection and autoscan.

In some cases due to the design of the source equipment the signal detection and autoscan do not always work as expected so those features will be disabled.

Calling it rev3 is going a bit overboard. It is more like rev2.1. Other than disabling signal detection and autoscan it should be the same as rev2.

I wouldn't worry about it too much unless it directly affects you. I think for most people it will be no big deal either way.

maxleung

10-10-06, 03:41 PM

Thanks sfhub for the clarification! The way you described it, I don't need to worry about autoscan et al.

rocko1290

10-10-06, 07:25 PM

You misunderstand, the current revision (and rev1) *has* active signal detection and autoscan. Active signal detect allows you to cycle through (and discretely select) only inputs with an active signal. Autoscan will choose the next active input automatically if the current one loses signal.

Most people use these switches with programmable remotes so they have no need for signal detection and autoscan.

In some cases due to the design of the source equipment the signal detection and autoscan do not always work as expected so those features will be disabled.

Calling it rev3 is going a bit overboard. It is more like rev2.1. Other than disabling signal detection and autoscan it should be the same as rev2.

I wouldn't worry about it too much unless it directly affects you. I think for most people it will be no big deal either way.Does your review of the rev 1 apply to the rev 2 also?

Was there not a HDMI switch from monoprice which when detected an active signal it switched to that HDMI source?

sfhub

10-10-06, 08:09 PM

Does your review of the rev 1 apply to the rev 2 also?

Was there not a HDMI switch from monoprice which when detected an active signal it switched to that HDMI source?
Yes, the rev1 and rev2 switches both switch to active signal. As I mentioned, depending on the source equipment it sometimes may not work as expected. I'm not sure if you are expecting different behavior, but it only switches if the current input doesn't have signal. Like I said, I wouldn't really worry about it too much. It really is very easy to just program your remote or use the supplied one.

The bulk of the review for rev1 is applicable to rev2. They fixed some of the problems reported in rev1 in rev2. Sharp Aquos LC-45GX6U AVC to display bypass only works with rev1, but that affects very few people.

Rev2 was tested with Samsung BD-P1000 at 1080p/60 with Sony Ruby.

Monoprice has an excellent no restocking fee return policy so there isn't a lot of risk.

rocko1290

10-10-06, 08:19 PM

Yes, the rev1 and rev2 switches both switch to active signal. As I mentioned, depending on the source equipment it sometimes may not work as expected. I'm not sure if you are expecting different behavior, but it only switches if the current input doesn't have signal. Like I said, I wouldn't really worry about it too much. It really is very easy to just program your remote or use the supplied one.

The bulk of the review for rev1 is applicable to rev2. They fixed some of the problems reported in rev1 in rev2. Sharp Aquos LC-45GX6U AVC to display bypass only works with rev1, but that affects very few people.

Rev2 was tested with Samsung BD-P1000 at 1080p/60 with Sony Ruby.

Monoprice has an excellent no restocking fee return policy so there isn't a lot of risk.So the codes for the monoprice HDMI switcher can actually be programmed into your universal? Do you know if they are in the Harmony database?

sfhub

10-10-06, 11:32 PM

So the codes for the monoprice HDMI switcher can actually be programmed into your universal? Do you know if they are in the Harmony database?
It is quite easy to program. The codes are already in the Harmony database. I've created a JP1 upgrade for JP1 remotes. Finally you could always just learn the IR.

Based on postings on this thread, there are plenty of folks using Harmony with the monoprice 5x1.

kucharsk

10-11-06, 06:54 AM

For what it's worth, I've figured out what my weird display/device interaction is.

If I power off my HD receiver, the input select LED for its input will stay lit until I also power off the display, at which time it will go dark.

Any time the selector LEDs are dark, the Monoprice will automatically select the active source - either the HD receiver in input 1 or the DVD player in input 2.

So there's something up where the Panasonic display must be feeding some type of reverse current somehow to keep the input selected after the HD receiver is shut off. What's weird is if the panel is turned back on, the HD receiver input is not reselected; the Monoprice stays dark until I power up a connected device which is autoselected.

As I said before, I think it's because the HD receiver and display are both DVI devices and there was probably some addition made to the HDMI spec to address auto-selection of devices.

sfhub

10-11-06, 09:39 AM

As I said before, I think it's because the HD receiver and display are both DVI devices and there was probably some addition made to the HDMI spec to address auto-selection of devices.
Thanks for the update. It may be what you said, but I don't recall seeing that behavior with the DVI port on my display when tested with nVidia and Samsung DVI sources.

HDMI/DVI have some areas that are not always implemented the same way by all manufacturers. For example, sources are free to provide 5v power for the purposes of eliciting EDID info from the display while the display is powered off. It is possible due to the interaction of particular devices, the source-provided power is what is inconsistent and could be leading to wrong conclusions. It could be a peculiarity with the display device also. I don't think it is a generic problem with DVI and HDMI specs being out of sync or everyone using DVI would be seeing the problem. HDMI specs did not add anything to address autoswitching by passthrough switches, at least not in HDMI 1.1.

orlando85

10-11-06, 01:20 PM

I got my monoprice 2x1 HDMI switch yesterday and I connected my Brighthouse SA8300 HD-HVR and Panasonic TC-32LX60 HDTV with Sony DVP-NS75H player so far everything working ok...
this is a manual switch but in my bed room not a big deal...
I purchased my HDMI cables from cablesforless on line store...
thank you very much everyone in this forum, I learn alot of things...

speck2001

10-13-06, 08:12 PM

Just hooked up a Monoprice 5:1 HDMI switch to a Panasonic Blu-Ray player, a Samsung Blu-Ray player, and a Pioneer Plasma and Sony LCD (that both do 1080p). With direct connections (player to monitor) I get 1080p. When going through the switcher, I get 1080i only. When I access the setup menus on the monitors (and players), the 1080p option is disabled, but 1080i can be selected. With zero configuration needed for the switcher, why would this happen? I'm using Radio Shack 6'ft and 12'ft HDMI cables that have no problems with anyother setups.

sfhub

10-13-06, 09:12 PM

When going through the switcher, I get 1080i only. When I access the setup menus on the monitors (and players), the 1080p option is disabled, but 1080i can be selected.
Do you have rev1 or rev2 switcher? rev2 has green/orange LEDs.

speck2001

10-14-06, 05:25 PM

Do you have rev1 or rev2 switcher? rev2 has green/orange LEDs.

I have rev2.

sfhub

10-14-06, 10:37 PM

I have rev2.
rev2 was tested successfully with Sony Ruby and Samsung BluRay at 1080p.

I don't know specifically what is causing your problem but it sounds like some kind of negotiation issue. It is kind of annoying the new players do not provide an override to force 1080p.

Simon2150

10-18-06, 02:59 PM

What color are the leds in rev1? rev2 has orange and green? Mine are red and green, so which one do I have?

kim77512

10-18-06, 10:03 PM

sfhub

10-18-06, 10:24 PM

What color are the leds in rev1? rev2 has orange and green? Mine are red and green, so which one do I have?
Rev1 are green only. You have Rev2.

catnip911

10-19-06, 09:44 AM

Got reply from this user:

"I finally solved the problem, it wasn't your hardware at all. Sorry for
the panic emails. Turns out that our "new" receivers are HDMI 1.1 only,
and are the cause of the 1080i output."

Kim77512,

can you please clarify this post? No sure what the "new" receivers refers to. Are you saying the Rev 2 switcher receivers are HDMI 1.1 and thus can only receive and pass 1080i?

sfhub

10-19-06, 10:14 AM

Kim77512,

can you please clarify this post? No sure what the "new" receivers refers to. Are you saying the Rev 2 switcher receivers are HDMI 1.1 and thus can only receive and pass 1080i?
The Rev2 does support 1080p. The switcher has been tested at 1080p with Samsung BD-P1000 and Sony Ruby.

In general HDMI 1.1 support, by itself, says nothing about 1080p support (or lack thereof) because 1080p is an optional feature of HDMI 1.1.

In this particular case, Monoprice 5x1 Rev1 and Rev2 both support 1080p and have been tested with equipment successfully at 1080p.

I assume the original user meant that he had the monoprice 5x1 connected to a Home Theatre Receiver's HDMI input (to siphon off the audio) with the HDMI output of the receiver connected to the display.

The receiver didn't support 1080p so that caused the connection to fallback to 1080i.

In this configuration, the "display" is essentially the Home Theatre Receiver because it decrypts the HDCP from the player, then performs audio and video processing (if any), before re-encrypting for HDCP and sending to the actual display.

Basically if anything in the chain doesn't support 1080p, the connection will fall back to 720p/1080i.

kim77512

10-19-06, 07:57 PM

Kim77512,

can you please clarify this post? No sure what the "new" receivers refers to. Are you saying the Rev 2 switcher receivers are HDMI 1.1 and thus can only receive and pass 1080i?

Sorry, I was not so clear. The receiver doesn't refer to Monoprice HDMI 5X1 Rev.2.0 Switcher but to his audio/video receiver. He was able to conclude that the issue was due to his receiver, not Monoprice HDMI switcher.

audvid

10-19-06, 08:16 PM

Any guesses about what would happen with next generation HDMI 1.3? Would current switches be upgradable - do they even need to be upgraded?

sfhub

10-19-06, 09:58 PM

Any guesses about what would happen with next generation HDMI 1.3? Would current switches be upgradable - do they even need to be upgraded?
It is unlikely any current HDMI switch from *any manufacturer* will work with HDMI 1.3 modes which require > 165MHz. I won't say none because I obviously haven't used every single switch out there, but I would be comfortable saying very very few, if any.

As to the HDMI 1.3 modes which require < 165MHz they will likely work, but nobody can say for sure until HDMI 1.3 equipment is out and can be tested.

audvid

10-19-06, 10:26 PM

I don't know what the timeline might be for hdmi 1.3. I have not been following it. Is it impending within months or a year?

sfhub

10-19-06, 11:05 PM

I don't know what the timeline might be for hdmi 1.3. I have not been following it. Is it impending within months or a year?
Depends who you talk to. Some folks say the chips are still being tested. Others say Sony says HDMI 1.3 will be in PS3 so they must be available. Those are the HDMI 1.3 transmitters in the PS3. Some people say the transmitters will be available earlier than the HDMI 1.3 receiver chips (used in displays, AV receivers, and switches). They think it could be early part of next year before HDMI 1.3 receivers are available.

If you really care about HDMI 1.3, I suggest you wait 6-9 months while things get worked out or you will be a guinea pig.

GamersCloset

11-03-06, 12:36 PM

sfhub

11-03-06, 02:21 PM

None of my inputs are green, they're all red. Should I have a green light when the source is connected and on?

Also, anyone have a nVidia FX 5200 connected to the switch? Maybe that's my problem? If I connect it directly to my projector it works but when I go throught the switch I get nothing.
What happens if you have no HDMI cables connected, is it still all red? If so your unit is defective.

The proper behavior is to have green lights when a port has active signal and only the active input has orange light.

GamersCloset

11-03-06, 02:38 PM

With nothing connected there are no lights. With my cable and HTPC connected there are 2 red lights. Both devices, if connected directly to my projector, work.

sfhub

11-03-06, 04:40 PM

With nothing connected there are no lights. With my cable and HTPC connected there are 2 red lights. Both devices, if connected directly to my projector, work.
What happens when you connect the source devices but don't connect the projector?

Something is not right. Don't know where the problem is yet.

GamersCloset

11-03-06, 04:48 PM

Same thing. 2 red lights. I think I've tried every combo.. restarting devices while connected.. unplugging the switch while connected.. reconnecting cables.. moving around connections between 1 & 5 to try them all.. u name it.. nothing but red lights.

sfhub

11-03-06, 05:31 PM

What model is your other source device? I think you mentioned cable box.

Does your cable box or PC work through the switch if you only have 1 source device connected?

GamersCloset

11-03-06, 06:09 PM

It's a Motorola DVR box for Comcast. It works perfectly when connected directly to my projector.

I've also tried connecting just 1 input and 1 output, I tried both the PC and box, with no success.

Keep the ideas coming.. :) I have yet to hear back from MonoPrice on this.

sfhub

11-03-06, 09:40 PM

It does sound like your 5x1 unit is defective but the behavior you describe is very strange so I'm kind of unsure if I should ask you to do more testing or just suggest you return it. Other situations I can usually tell from the description where the problem lies and can make the appropriate suggestion. I would hate to suggest you get a replacement unit only to find the same problem.

Various Motorola boxes have been tested before. I personally use a DCT-5100 STB with DVI out to my 5x1. There is a peculiarity with some versions of Motorola firmware where the STB must be the active connection when the *power plug* is first plugged in because that is when it does the full HDCP negotiation. Once that is complete you can select a different input as active and go back to the Motorola and everything will work, but if the Motorola is not the active input when first plugged in, the HDCP negotiation fails and Motorola thinks the port is not usable.

What is supposed to happen is the Motorola box is supposed to do the full HDCP handshake whenever it gets hot plug signal, but in some firmwares it doesn't appear that is happening.

My suggestion I think is to post what model Motorola STB you have, 5100, 6200, 6412, 3412, 700, etc., and whether it has HDMI or DVI output.

Next I suggest you pull the power plug on the Motorola box (ie don't turn it off using the remote, pull the power plug)

BTW do you have a different display to test with other than your projector. I know sometimes it is not the best setup to test with a projector because of the bulb.

Connect the Motorola to the 5x1 HDMI port, connect the 5x1 HDMI out to the projector. Turn the display on first. Make sure the DVI/HDMI port is the active input on the display. Make sure the Motorola is the active input on the 5x1 (ie the light is orange) Plug the power into the Motorola.

If it doesn't work, see if you have another small display to use to get to the diagnostic/config screens of the Motorola box. I think you can connect the composite/svideo out from the Motorola box to another TV and get access to the screens even if the DVI/HDMI port is not actively working. There are 2 screens, one is a config screen, the other is a status screen. When you press Power button to turn of the Motorola box and immediately follow by pressing "menu" on the remote, it will go to config screen. Make sure the output is setup for 480p/720p/1080i. Press power to turn on the Motorola box. Now press power to turn of Motorola box and immediately press select/ok on the remote. This will get you into the diagnostic screen. Go to option D11 Interface Status. Press select/ok to choose that option. Press down arrow to get the second page. It should tell you about the DVI port, EDID, and HDCP status.

Post the information you find in the status window.

quickfire

11-04-06, 07:15 PM

Quick question........I have the 5x1 HDMI Monoprice switcher.....I have it connected to the back of my 525 H/K receiver's power supply!

That way the HDMI switcher only has power when the a/v receiver is turned on...is this the best way to use the switcher?

Or do I need to leave it on all the time?

Basically what i'm asking is...does leaving it on all the time eventually weaken the internal parts over the years?Or will powering it on atleast twice a day cause worser harm than the above mentioned?

sfhub

11-04-06, 07:19 PM

Quick question........I have the 5x1 HDMI Monoprice switcher.....I have it connected to the back of my 525 H/K a/v receiver power supply!

That way the HDMI switcher only has power when the a/v reciver is turned on...is this the best way to use the swithcer?

Or do I need to leave it on all the time?

Basically waht i'm asking is...does leaving it on all the time eventually weaken the internal parts over the years?Or will turning it on atleast twice a day cause worser harm than the above mentioned?
I would just leave it plugged in all the time. It is probably more stressful to turn it on and off all the time than to just leave it on. It only uses 2watts as measured with kill-a-watt so even if your area has very high electricity, it will be less than 40 cents a month.

quickfire

11-04-06, 07:24 PM

sfhub

11-04-06, 07:30 PM

Im leaning toward leaving it on 24/7....but those red lights are very distracting at nightime!

For some reason My H20 D* receiver's HDMI red light on the 5x1 switcher continues to stay on at all times regardless if it is on or off....
That is probably because it is sending out signal whether it is on or off. If you pull the power on the H20 it probably will go away (not realistic for every day use, just to test a theory)

If it really bothers you just place it somewhere where it isn't as visible or put some material to block the light, postit, masking tape, black paper, etc. Just don't cover the IR receiver.

wwyjoe

11-05-06, 06:30 AM

I don't know specifically about denon, but the issue I reported in the first post with long cable and Panasonic S77 was fixed. I imagine there is a good chance the Denon problem was addressed by the same fix.

just got myself the rev 2.0 - no more problems with long cable runs with denon players. Fast switching between my denon A1XVA and toshiba HD-XA1...and most importantly, picture is flawless!

great switcher!!!

quickfire

11-05-06, 11:44 AM

Sean Lee at Monoprice e-mailed me and told me it would not damage the HDMI switcher if I leave it connected to my a/v receiver!As a matter of fact he told me it may prolong the life with it NOT being on 24/7!!!!Go Figure.

TPeterson

11-05-06, 12:28 PM

The switcher doesn't have any bearings to wear out or motors with big stop/start surges, so the limits to its lifetime are mainly longterm thermally driven "wear" in its ckts and power-line surges, either from line noise or on/off transients. It's a crapshoot as to which one does the little guy in, just as with ourselves--we all gottta go from something. I opt for depowering anything that's not in use, arguing that whatever little benefit I may be doing for the planet tips the balance in that direction.

quickfire

11-05-06, 02:31 PM

Well there is one upside to not having it on 24/7......i won't have to be annoyed by the red and green light indicators(there very bright)...lol

sfhub

11-05-06, 11:42 PM

Well there is one upside to not having it on 24/7......i won't have to be annoyed by the red and green light indicators(there very bright)...lol
Whatever works for you is best.

One downside though is if you have times when you use the switch but not the receiver, you still need to turn on the receiver. That is significantly more power usage than the 2watts the switch uses.

speck2001

11-09-06, 08:43 PM

Sorry, I was not so clear. The receiver doesn't refer to Monoprice HDMI 5X1 Rev.2.0 Switcher but to his audio/video receiver. He was able to conclude that the issue was due to his receiver, not Monoprice HDMI switcher.

I'm the one that had the switcher/receiver 1080p problem which is now solved. The hard lesson I learned is that in 2006, when you see the big HDMI logo on components, you have to be very careful and look for the fine print that says what version of HDMI it is- the equipment with 1.1 never mentions 1080p at all (meaning it doesn't say that it won't pass 1080p), but the 1.2 hardware often includes a specific 1080p capable note in the description. I had to return a Pioneer HDMI receiver and then buy a newer one that had 1.2 HDMI (and said 1080p capable). WHo knows what will happen next year when 1.3 starts making the rounds. :eek:

htwaits

11-09-06, 08:49 PM

Oops- double post.If you use the "edit" button associated with each of your posts you can delete the whole message. :p

Look in the "Delete this Message" box.

shaque786

11-25-06, 07:17 PM

I would like to confirm:

The PS3 supports HDMI 1.3, but my Pioneer plasma likely does not. Therefore, I could care less about HDMI 1.3 functionality. I just want to make sure that I can use this switch box with a PS3, which would be outputting at HMDI 1.2.

(I assume I can set the PS3 to output at only HDMI 1.2 and not 1.3.)

What do you think?

sfhub

11-25-06, 09:49 PM

You don't really "configure" the PS3 for HDMI 1.2 or 1.3. It is all autonegotiated.

The 5x1 is a passthrough design, so it exposes whatever display is connected to the source device. If your TV is HDMI 1.2, that is what the PS3 will see. The only other thing is 1080p support. Since many of us have tested 5x1 with 1080p @ 60Hz and it works (for example Samsung BluRay player and Sony Ruby projector) there is enough bandwidth to support 1080p.

Based on past experience and the specs that are supported, it should work.

However I don't want to guarantee it will work because PS3 is new hardware using a new HDMI 1.3 transmitter so there could be bugs or unforseen problems. Also I don't remember if anyone has posted about the 5x1 and PS3 so there isn't past experience to fall back on.

The good news is Monoprice has an excellent no restocking fee return policy so there isn't much to lose.

pclausen

11-27-06, 11:36 PM

sfhub

11-27-06, 11:53 PM

I just got a REV 2.1 5x1 switch from Monoprice. It has a "built-in equalizer". Does that mean this newest model is a repeater that amplifies the output and is no longer a passthrough design.

I ask because my DirecTV H20 receiver does not want to do the HDCP handshake unless I connect it directly to my Sony Pearl. Interestingly enough, my HD-A1 and HTPC both work through the 5x1 switcher with no issues at all.
It is still pass-through design. The equalizer is an eye opener. Something else is going on.

Are the exact same cables being used in both cases or did you need to use dongles when going through 5x1?

pclausen

11-28-06, 08:00 AM

I'm using a 25' Monoprice 22 awg HDMI-HDMI cable between the 5x1 switch and the projector. My 3 source devices are all connected to the 5x1 switch using 3' Monoprice 24 awg HDMI-HDMI cables. No dongles of any kind anywhere in the signal path.

The specs for the HDX-501 state the Video Amplifier Bandwidth is 1.65GBps and that the Input Video Signal Specification is v 1.2.

sfhub

11-28-06, 09:53 AM

These are some experiments you can try. These are just temporary experiments to figure out what is going on, so please don't feel like they are permanent arrangements because as diagnostic routines the setups could be less than ideal for permanent setups.

0) if your DTV tuner has some diagnostic menu it would be useful to see what it is saying about the HDMI/HDCP connection.
1) try verifying all cables are plugged in snug
2) make sure the DTV tuner is selected. Turn off the DTV tuner and the TV. Turn on the TV first, then turn on the DTV tuner. Sometimes some devices really want the TV to be turned on first or the HDCP negotiation won't work. Similarly they could have problems if you "switch" to them because their hot plug detect is not working right.
3) try switching the DTV tuner to port #4 on the 5x1. The 5x1 has 2 3x1 switching chips cascaded. Port 4&5 go through a single switching chip.
4) temporarily move the 5x1 and DTV tuner closer to the projector and use a shorter output HDMI cable, let's say 3-6ft and see if that make a difference. You will likely need longer coax cable for this experiment. Keep in mind this is just temporary diagnostic and I'm not suggesting this for permanent setup.

ashutoshsm

11-28-06, 11:07 AM

That DirecTV H20 HAS, in the past, been listed as one of the more notorious devices (that isn't Sony TV) at negotiating HDMI handshakes.

Guess they shoulda stuck to TiVo, eh? The new S3 is flawless with my monoprice switch :)

Gruson

11-29-06, 12:44 PM

I may be interested in this switch.

When my new PJ arrives, I will need an HDMI switch to replace by Zektor DVI one.

Can anyone recommend an HDMI switch that also has optical inputs in it?

I was looking at this one:

http://www.octavainc.com/HDMI%20switch%204port_toslink.htm

ashutoshsm

11-29-06, 12:51 PM

The Octava is the one I would have suggested. Seems like the slightly upmarket version of the Monoprice unit with the audio switching convenience. Pricier (and so are the cables), but monoprice lacks something equivalent.

Folks on TiVoCommunity.com rave about this switch as well.

audvid

12-05-06, 12:22 PM

I have just purchased the monoprice 5X1. It seems to be a good value for the money - their cables are an excellent deal.

At a first glance, I 'thought' I saw a bit of picture degradation thru the switch as compared to Direct connection (directivo and zenith 1080i dvd player). I did not want to spend too much time on comparision but my quick check without the switch did not reveal any picture degradation thru the switch. It must have just been my imagination. My cable length is very short - less than 6'.

Anyway, I just came across another switch - in a magazine article. I thought I would mention it: Acell's UltraAV HDMI 2-1 switch - no power supply and a matchbox sized switch with remote for $99. I checked out their website and they did not have any other variations. I don't know if this is any good but I thought I would just bring it to the attention of fellow members - in case anyone wants to give it a comparision study.

trigs

12-06-06, 01:44 PM

This has been a good thread, but at 14 pages it has gotten too long. Some questions have been asked and answered three times. Perhaps it is time for a FAQ?

Thanks to sfhub for his (her?) thorough support.

sfhub

12-06-06, 03:32 PM

If you submit the questions I'll try and put together the answers.

ashutoshsm

12-06-06, 03:49 PM

ORRRR, you could switch to the less wimpy 60-threads-per-page view. This is still only page 7 for me ;)

witchdoc205

12-14-06, 12:28 PM

Sony 51 " Rear Projection HDTV

Connected my HD-DVR to input one works fine
Connected my Samy DVD-VR345 can get a readable menu screen when i have an audio cd playing(tv detects 1080i) i am able to navigate through through the menu hear audio etc.

When I put a commercial dvd in the unit i get a flickering blue screen and no audio.

I have plugged the Samy directly into the tv via hdmi and get a picture with no problem, once I introduce the commercial dvd and the monoprice switch the problem with the blue screen flickering arises.

Any thoughts? Is this an example of the hdcp copy protection scheme?

sfhub

12-14-06, 02:34 PM

I have plugged the Samy directly into the tv via hdmi and get a picture with no problem, once I introduce the commercial dvd and the monoprice switch the problem with the blue screen flickering arises.

Any thoughts? Is this an example of the hdcp copy protection scheme?
It sounds like an example of something going wrong with the HDCP copy protection when the 5x1 switch is in the loop.

I suggest:
1) swapping different cables to make sure they aren't the problem
2) turn on TV before turning on DVD player
3) trying port 4 on the switch to see if that helps
4) getting rid of any HDMI->DVI adapters if any are in use

Do you have a long cable run from switch to display?

witchdoc205

12-18-06, 07:48 AM

It sounds like an example of something going wrong with the HDCP copy protection when the 5x1 switch is in the loop.

I suggest:
1) swapping different cables to make sure they aren't the problem
2) turn on TV before turning on DVD player
3) trying port 4 on the switch to see if that helps
4) getting rid of any HDMI->DVI adapters if any are in use

Do you have a long cable run from switch to display?

1. Swapped the cables same issue.
2. Turned on TV before DVD same issue.
3. Port 4 Shows Same issue.
4. No DVI adapters are in use.

Cable length to TV is 10 ft.

I finally just unhooked it, too bad though the picture processing actually made my HD DVR look a bit better! If you have any other ideas would like to hear them.

Would like to get some type of switch that is more friendly to the HDCP copy scheme if anyone has any suggestions..

sfhub

12-18-06, 02:11 PM

1. Swapped the cables same issue.
2. Turned on TV before DVD same issue.
3. Port 4 Shows Same issue.
4. No DVI adapters are in use.

Cable length to TV is 10 ft.

I finally just unhooked it, too bad though the picture processing actually made my HD DVR look a bit better! If you have any other ideas would like to hear them.

Would like to get some type of switch that is more friendly to the HDCP copy scheme if anyone has any suggestions..
You can try Octava or Sima or Gefen. Those are just names that have been suggested by others. I believe Octava and Monoprice have similar or the same switching chipset. I don't know about Sima and Gefen chipsets.

If you want to perform one last test, try playing a DVD that you "backed up" onto your own DVD-R media. That should confirm for sure whether HDCP is the area going wrong. Backup DVDs have the CSS stripped, which should disabled HDCP in the player.

skramsay

12-19-06, 07:19 AM

I just got the monoprice 5x1 HDMI switch and am having the same problem as witchdoc205.

Here is my setup:
RCA DLP tv with a single DVI input
ExpressVu 9200 PVR with HDMI.
Samsung DVDR135 dvd player/recorder with HDMI.

Both the 9200 and dvd connect to switch with a 6' HDMI cable, and the switch is connected to the RCA with a 4' HDMI-DVI cable. The 9200 is also connected to the DVDR with composite.

The 9200 works flawlessly through the switch
If I play a commercial DVD, I get a blue flickering screen . If I remove the dvd, the blue screen goes away and I can see the 9200 signal (going through the DVDR)

This seems to backup sfhub's theory that it is a HDCP problem introduced with the switch, although, I thought the 5x1 was suppose to just pass the signal through, meaning HDCP shouldn't be an issue.

Steve

sfhub

12-19-06, 12:48 PM

Based on the pattern, the conclusion I would draw is Samsung DVDRxx's do not work well with this switch.

My Samsung HD-841 DVI upconverting player works fine at 1080i with HDCP.

The 9200 you are using sends out HDCP-encrypted signal also.

I don't know what is up with the combo of Samsung DVDRxx and this switch.

Gradius2

01-09-07, 11:20 AM

I got my HDX-501 today, how do I know if my box is rev 2.0 or rev 2.1 ?

Which differences between them ?

Thanks,
Gradius

sfhub

01-09-07, 03:34 PM

Belcherwm

01-09-07, 05:14 PM

I got my HDX-501 today, how do I know if my box is rev 2.0 or rev 2.1 ?

Which differences between them ?

Thanks,
Gradius

Mine had a sticker on the unit.

Paul_PDX

01-09-07, 05:15 PM

I got one yesterday -- there was a sticker on one of the plastic wrappers that mentioned it.

Gradius2

01-09-07, 05:54 PM

I only have access to the older revisions.

I imagine there were some minor tweaks hence the small version # change.

One thing that might have been planned for 2.1 was the ability to select an input even if no signal was present. That feature was causing more trouble than it was worth in some configurations.

Try switching to input 2, 3, 4, 5 with nothing connected.

I was able to select with devices in stand-by (power off), connected, with nothing connected I just got a green led from switcher power.

I also see only green leds getting ON from switcher, no red or orange light at all, however I'm unable to test the unit fully atm, I'm waiting my plasma to arrieve to be able to do so.

Gradius2

01-09-07, 05:58 PM

Mine had a sticker on the unit.

Thanks Belcherwm and Paul_PDX for reports, my unit was w/o any sticker around, now I dunno if I got rev 2.0 or 2.1, no other way to check it ?

I buyed on eBay from here:
http://cgi.*********/5-PORT-HDMI-SWITCH-W-CABLE-FREE-SHIPPING-BUY-IT-NOW_W0QQitemZ250069721215QQihZ015QQcategoryZ73390QQcmdZViewI tem?hash=item250069721215

Gradius2

01-09-07, 07:12 PM

I opened my unit, I don't care about the warranty, I can fix my own stuff. :cool:

The chips are with description scratched, very scratched I must say, but I have a special light so I was able to see what is on it (they cannot hide the stuff from me). ;)

The chips are from Texas Instruments:
http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tmds341a.html

Here's the DS in pdf:
http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tmds341a.pdf

Note they're HDMI v1.3 capable, of course, the unit have 2 them, each chips does until 3 inputs and 1 output each.

For IR control/switcher between ports, it uses a Sonix SN8P2604SB (8-bit controller):
http://www.sonix.com.tw/sonix/product.do?p=SN8P2604

Datasheet:
http://www.sonix.com.tw/sonix/download.do?d=1367,1

So the unit is v1.3 compliant/compatible? I guess so, Monoprice should be unable to test it fully (v1.3) or something, so they used "v1.2a compatible" (IMHO).

If I'm in mood I'll take a photo.

sfhub

01-09-07, 07:31 PM

So the unit is v1.3 compliant/compatible? I guess so, Monoprice should be unable to test it fully (v1.3) or something, so they used "v1.2a compatible" (IMHO).
The TI spec sheet is ambiguous IMO.

It says HDMI 1.3 compatible, but then it also says 1.65Gbps.

HDMI 1.3 has modes that require more than 1.65Gbps as they support > 24-bit color data so those 2 first lines don't completely jive.

It could be the spec was not updated properly or it could be they are supporting a subset of HDMI 1.3 that falls under 1.65Gbps.

Keep in mind much of HDMI 1.3 is optional so it isn't clear what compatible with HDMI 1.3 really means, whereas it is clear to me what 1.65Gbps means (if that is an accurate spec)

Gradius2

01-09-07, 07:59 PM

Yeah, I'm apart of 1.65Gbps, I'll check the HDMI v1.3a specs just in case.

Anyway, here's the photos:

Front in angle:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_01.jpg

Front again:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_02.jpg

Back from PCB:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_03.jpg

Front zoom part1:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_04.jpg

Front zoom part2:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_05.jpg

My PCB says "HDMI SWITCH 5 TO 1 V: A2 (date: 2005/10/25)".

Gradius2

01-09-07, 08:42 PM

sfhub

01-09-07, 08:54 PM

Ok, TI's specs are correct:
http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tmds341a.html

"- Compatible with HDMI 1.3
- Designed for Signaling Rates up to 1.65 Gbps
- Covers All Color Depths for Resolution up to 720p/1080i and 8-Bit Color for 1080p Resolution "

See? :)

8-bit per R, G, B = 24-bit

The "equalizer" things does:
8dB Receiver Equalization to Compensate for 5m DVI Cable Losses
Maybe it is a language barrier thing, HDMI 1.3 supports *more* than 24-bit for color data and the bandwidth was bumped up accordingly to support this:
http://www.hdmi.org/resourcecenter/index.asp

Deep Color™: HDMI 1.3 supports 30-bit, 36-bit and 48-bit (RGB or YCbCr) color depths, up from the 24-bit depths in previous versions of the HDMI specification.

Higher speed: HDMI 1.3 increases its single-link bandwidth from 165MHz (4.95 gigabits per second) to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbps) to support the demands of future high definition display devices, such as higher resolutions, Deep Color™ and high frame rates. In addition, built into the HDMI 1.3 specification is the technical foundation that will let future versions of HDMI reach significantly higher speeds.

I am still of the opinion the TI specs are ambiguous.

Gradius2

01-09-07, 11:30 PM

Maybe it is a language barrier thing, HDMI 1.3 supports *more* than 24-bit for color data and the bandwidth was bumped up accordingly to support this:
http://www.hdmi.org/resourcecenter/index.asp

Deep Color™: HDMI 1.3 supports 30-bit, 36-bit and 48-bit (RGB or YCbCr) color depths, up from the 24-bit depths in previous versions of the HDMI specification.

I am still of the opinion the TI specs are ambiguous.

I know v1.3a is 30, 36 and 48-bit color (aka deep color), but those all are useless since no display can do that yet (not at reasonable prices). TI's says is v1.3 limited to 24-bit @ 1080p, so lets say they're "cheating". :D

At least the unit is v1.2a compatible for sure, and will works with v1.3, but limited to 24-bit @ 1080p.

charliemike

01-10-07, 01:11 AM

BasementBob

01-10-07, 01:51 AM

FYI

I bought the Monoprice 5:1 hdmi switch a few months ago, but the past hour is the first time I've tried it.

I've got the Toshiba HD-XA1 and Pioneer BDP-HD1 blu-ray player, both feeding 2m hdmi cables into a Monoprice 5:1 hdmi switch (revision 2.0), which in turn goes through a 15' 24guage monoprice hdmi-to-hdmi cable to the Pioneer FHD1 Input 2.
It's feeding a 1080/24p signal between the Pioneers, and a 1080i signal from the Toshiba to the Pioneer.
I didn't notice any obvious degridation in signal quality with Stealth (blu-ray) vs the direct cable (direct meaning: Pioneer BDP-HD1 blu-ray player to 15' 24guage monoprice hdmi-to-hdmi cable to the Pioneer FHD1 Input 2, without a 5:1 switch).

sfhub

01-10-07, 02:21 AM

I know v1.3a is 30, 36 and 48-bit color (aka deep color), but those all are useless since no display can do that yet (not at reasonable prices). TI's says is v1.3 limited to 24-bit @ 1080p, so lets say they're "cheating". :D

At least the unit is v1.2a compatible for sure, and will works with v1.3, but limited to 24-bit @ 1080p.
Ok I'll let it go after this and just chalk it up to language differences, but when someone says a switch is "1.3 compatible" most consumers are going to think it will support the features of 1.3 like Deep Color, not that it will support 1.3 devices by forcing them to be limited to 1.0 video modes.

That displays don't yet exist is really not the point because if you buy a switch expecting 1.3 feature compatibility, then when you buy your new display in the future which does support Deep Color then you are going to be disappointed when the switch doesn't allow those modes but instead forces your expensive new display to operate in the same mode as a much less expensive display.

In that sense I think monoprice is doing the appropriate thing by listing HDMI 1.2 instead of claiming HDMI 1.3 as the TI specs are doing.

BTW the Epson PowerLite Pro Cinema 1080 projector is supposed to support Deep Color and at around $5K is not in the realm of unreasonable pricing, at least for this forum. There are a slew of devices slated for this year that are planning on touting Deep Color and xvYCC. Some outrageously priced Sony devices are in that list.

How about we just say HDMI 1.3 devices will work with the switch as long as the features they use are limited to 1.2 bandwidth modes of 165MHz. I think that is the most accurate description of what is happening. It is basically the flipside of saying HDMI 1.3 is backward compatible with 1.2 devices.

BTW we already know "1.3" devices will work in this mode with the 5x1 because PS3 users have tested 5x1 successfully.

sfhub

01-10-07, 03:21 PM

Anyone know if the Moto 6412 is going to give that asinine HDCP repeater message with this? I wish I could use my Denon 2307CI for upconverting over HDMI but the Moto cable box doesn't allow it. All I'm trying to do is video switching for effin' sakes.
I'm using DCT-5100 with 5x1 and it works fine.

The Motorola issue with repeaters is due to Motorola's firmware not properly handling the added negotiation when a true repeater is in between the STB and the display. Added negotiation is necessary in that case because the repeater-style switch/processor is decrypting and reencrypting. It is supposed to be fixed in later Motorola firmware but it is up to each cable company to test and decide when to release to their customers.

Pass-through style switches like the 5x1 shouldn't be affected by the same problem because they pass-through the signal to the display rather than decrypt and reencrypt. Not saying one approach is better than the other, just explaining what is happening.

Jbagger7

01-15-07, 07:36 PM

sfhub

01-15-07, 08:09 PM

I noticed that monoprice has the 2x1 switch for much less than the 5x1. Since this does not have an equalizer, will I experience any signal issues? The maximum length I have between any component is only 6 ft.
I think it should be fine for you.

I tested the manual push button 2x1 at 1080p 60Hz up to and including 35ft output cables and it worked fine. At 50ft I was getting sparkles, but those went away if I used the 5x1 with equalizer.

DooMer_MP3

01-16-07, 10:55 AM

Can anyone here give me any suggestions? Slightly lengthy story, but I'll do my best to keep it short:

I have:
- Syntax Olevia 37" (LT37HVS) with one HDMI port
- Samsung Upconverting HDMI DVD player
- PC with Radeon 9800Pro and DVI out / DVI->HDMI cable
- SA8300HD DVR Box from Time Warner
- All HDMI cables are 6ft monoprice cables

I purchased the Rev 2.0 version of this switch back in October. I hooked everything up to it, and had problems from the beginning.
- Samsung DVD worked the best, at first.
- PC with DVI->HDMI cable was a bit flaky, but would run after flipping the inputs on the switch a few times.
- SA8300HD DVR would not work AT ALL through the switch

All components worked perfectly when directly hooked up to the TV. I switched cables, tried different cables, all to the same effect. After awhile, the Samsung DVD even stopped working through the switch. I then decided to return the switch for a Rev 2.1 unit after talking to customer support, and trying a different SA8300HD DVR.

I received my Rev 2.1 unit a few days ago after a few customer service issues (confused on whether I wanted a replacement or not... oh well). Basically, I'm in the same boat. I cannot for the life of me get my SA8300HD DVR box to work with the switch. Here is what I try:

1) Unplug DVR power and Component cables, turn off TV, hook up HDMI cables through switch.
2) Turn on TV, plug DVR power in.
3) I see the DVR loading screen.
4) I turn on the DVR after it has successfully booted. I see the channel guide info, but no actual TV picture. If I hit any button on the DVR remote, it tells me my TV doesn't support HDCP (which it does).

If I hook up the DVR directly to my TV, it works fine. I've tried hooking the DVR into port 5 of both the old and new switch to no avail.

Anyone? All I really want is for my HDMI-capable equipment to all be in HDMI!

sfhub

01-16-07, 12:54 PM

Try port 4 input and see if it makes a difference for any of the devices.

I'm a little surprised about the ATI card not working well because it has both a decent TMDS transmitter and isn't using HDCP.

Usually the problem with the ATI cards is the DVI dropout bug in their drivers where it works when you boot up, but after you switch to another input and back, the picture is gone. That behavior is a bug in the ATI drivers that they supposed to have fixed but some have mentioned there are still cases where it shows up.

So are you saying currently only the SA box is not working and the others are working again?

DooMer_MP3

01-16-07, 01:05 PM

Thanks for the reply. I will have to give port 4 a shot later tonight. As far as ATI goes, it used to drop out occasionally when the XP bootup screen would popup. I could see the POST screen, but not that low res XP portion. But that seems to be working now with the new unit.

As of now, the SA box is the only thing that is not working. It works when directly hooked up to my TV, but not through the switch. This was the case with the older Rev 2.0 unit I returned as well.

mystery

01-16-07, 07:54 PM

sfhub,

You may recall that earlier in this thread I posted that I was having problems with the switcher (green lights only model) and it's sync with my Toshiba HD A2.

I contacted Monoprice and Sean offered to send me out the new version 2.1 and swap it for the older one, a very generous offer indeed which I accepted.

I just received the newer version yesterday and it's even worse than the older one. Both will get an image from the player to my Optoma H78 projector but both lose the image after selecting a different input on the switcher and it takes a full 2 minutes to get the image back every single time. However, I can live with that because at least I do get the image back. :)

What I can't live with with this newer version is the lost signal that occurs every 2 minutes like clockwork. I can't keep signal from the HD DVD player over HDMI/DVI to my projector for longer than 2 minutes because the signal goes and then it reappears within about 3 to 5 seconds and I have 2 more minutes of uninterrupted video and then boom, the picture goes and the whole cycle starts up again.

So I don't know what's going on for this to happen. I like the newer switcher otherwise because I believe that it is an improvement on the old one.

Any ideas or have you come across this before?

Thanks,

Wayne

sfhub

01-16-07, 11:16 PM

Both will get an image from the player to my Optoma H78 projector but both lose the image after selecting a different input on the switcher and it takes a full 2 minutes to get the image back every single time. However, I can live with that because at least I do get the image back. :)

What I can't live with with this newer version is the lost signal that occurs every 2 minutes like clockwork. I can't keep signal from the HD DVD player over HDMI/DVI to my projector for longer than 2 minutes because the signal goes and then it reappears within about 3 to 5 seconds and I have 2 more minutes of uninterrupted video and then boom, the picture goes and the whole cycle starts up again.

Sorry I don't remember the exact details of your situation.

I remember with HD-A1 when it loses HDCP connection (ie you switch to another input and back) it is supposed to stop playback and the workaround is to press Play. Somehow the hot plug detect was not working properly and restarting the HDCP negotiation. I don't know if the same thing is happening on the A2 or not.

The loss of video every 2 minutes sounds like some periodic signal problem. Are you using long cables, have HDMI/DVI adapters, or have anything in between other than the switch and the cables?

DooMer_MP3

01-17-07, 01:11 AM

So I tried Input 4 with my SA8300HD DVR. Still no dice. I don't understand it. I've tried both the Rev 2.0 and 2.1 HDX-501, and a couple SA8300HD DVRs. The SA works fine when hooked up directly to my TV, but not through either revision of the switches. When hooked up to the switch, I see the SA bootup screen on my TV, through HDMI, as it downloads the channel guide etc. As soon as that's done, and I power it on to where I should see TV content, I see the info bar with the channel, but no actual TV picture. If I try to change channels, it begins telling me my TV doesn't support HDCP and I should use the component input. UGH! I can't even tell what this would be? TV? SA? Switch? Cable? I've mixed and matched so many cables!

DarkKnight2k4

01-17-07, 01:55 PM

Man I am so worried about this one.

I have an XA1, PS3 and Oppo that I want to run to my AE900 Panny FP... and want to wait to get a new receiver to use as a switch, but all these issues make me worried about even getting a switch. my run to the projector is not even 25 ft, and between piece will be 3' maybe 6' max.

Are there other options ?

mystery

01-17-07, 06:10 PM

sfhub,

Here is an email which I sent Monoprice this afternoon:

"Hi Sean,

I've answered your questions below.

Both the old switcher which I bought from you last year and the new one which you just sent me allow me to get any signal I wish from any source to my projector. Switching away from and back to the Toshiba HD A2 player causes a 2 minute delay in getting the image back. Although I don't care too much for this delay, I am happy at least that it eventually comes back and is dependably consistent at 2 minutes every time.

This is the problem that caused me to call you in the first place. It turns out that the second switcher you sent me reacts no differently than the original one. So either way, I have a 2 minute wait to regain the image when I switch away from it. This is only with the Toshiba player. The other two devices work almost immediately when switching back and forth.

The big problem now is that the second switcher you sent me doesn't hold the image from the Toshiba once it gets it. So, just like the older version, it takes me 2 minutes to see a picture on the projector from the Toshiba when plugged into the switcher. Then the image stays on for another 2 minutes and then the screen goes blank for about 3 to 5 seconds and then the image returns for another 2 minutes and the screen goes blank again for another 3 to 5 seconds and this cycle repeats itself over and over.

The image stays on rock solid when I use the older version switcher.

The problem is that I'd like the newer version to work and hold the image as solid as the older version. The reason is because with the older version I have my Scientific Atlanta 8300PVR set to show images through HDMI to the switcher and into my projector but I also have this PVR connected to my TV via component cables. If I turn off the Toshiba player and the Oppo player, I lose the signal on my TV because the switcher reverts back to the only 'live' HDMI input and since the PVR won't show both the HDMI and component images at the same time, the screen on the television goes blank until I turn on the Oppo or the Toshiba player and switch the input to one of those devices. Then the television image reappears.

It's my understanding that with the newer version switcher this problem won't happen because it doesn't automatically search for a 'live' HDMI feed.

So this is why I'd like to get the newer version switcher to work properly and hold the signal for longer than 2 minutes from the Toshiba if possible. Otherwise, I'm going to have to just put up with the older version I guess unless you have another solution or option.

Thanks Sean,

Wayne

p.s. There is another thing I've noticed with the new switcher. During the time that the signal is on for 2 minutes before I lose it, the image seems to very quickly on occasion disappear for a split second. Sort of like a flash and then it reappears. Very unusual. This doesn't happen on the old switcher at all."

sfhub

01-17-07, 06:11 PM

Earlier in this thread there are others using SA 8300 who have it working but not with the display you are using.

In general it is hard to diagnose these HDCP issues because it is a negotiated connection. The video is getting through, it seems something is causing the HDCP negotiation to fail. The HDCP seems to work for your DVD player though.

I think you have done enough on your side to determine the SA 8300 won't get any better with stuff you can control. That's not ruling out some newer firmware from SA, TV-side, or new version of 5x1 couldn't improve things, but those are out of your control.

leftheaded

01-18-07, 01:44 AM

my 5x1 just arrived today.

cable box works fine (1080i or 720p)
PC works fine (1080p/60)
PS3 did not work on inputs 1-3. so, its in input 4. other than that it looks fine (1080p)

caddy-shak`

01-25-07, 04:02 PM

I plan on buying the Onkyo 604 receiver. it only has 2 HDMI inputs and 1 HDMI output. My plan was to purchase a 5 x 1 HDMI switch from monoprice. I was planning on having all of my device feed into the switch then out of the switch into the 604 then from the 604 to my projector. This should allow me to keep the 604 on the same video/audio input and switch the different sources from the monoprice device. Does anyone have experience in doing this and will it work?

ashutoshsm

01-25-07, 04:10 PM

If you set your Onkyo to pass through, and it implements thatw ell - it SHOULD work. This is precisely what I planned to do if I bought the Yamaha HTR-6090 - but decided against doing because my harmony manages all the inputs I need & the HDMI switch anyway - so why upgrade my (arguably superior audio) 5790? :)

Gradius2

01-27-07, 12:13 AM

my 5x1 just arrived today.

cable box works fine (1080i or 720p)
PC works fine (1080p/60)
PS3 did not work on inputs 1-3. so, its in input 4. other than that it looks fine (1080p)

You can also try input 5.

Scott Gammans

01-28-07, 12:19 PM

TPeterson

01-28-07, 01:21 PM

Seems likely to be a bum unit, as many have posted good results and I personally have seen it work very well up to 1920x1200 @60 Hz with no sparkles.

mystery

01-28-07, 03:35 PM

I currently have the older version in use. I tried the newer one but it wouldn't hold an image any longer than 2 to 4 minutes without losing it and then re-syncing all over again. The older version works fine in my setup with an Oppo player, Scientific Atlanta 8300HD PVR, and the A2 and RCA HDV5000.

Scott, ask for Sean at Monoprice. He always takes very good care of me when I need to order anything or have a problem. Monoprice has as good customer service as the legendary Oppo people in my estimation. They'll get this matter straightened out for you. :)

Wayne

aaronwt

01-28-07, 04:08 PM

I just got my Monoprice HDMI 5x1 switcher--what a piece of junk! Input 1 is completely unusable because of heavy horizontal noise, and inputs 4 and 5 show lots of sparklies. I'm sending the unit back to get a replacement, and if the new unit is just as buggy I'm getting a refund.

Mine works flawlessly. I use inputs 1 to 4 on a regular basis with no problems and have used input 5 for a few hours with no problems. One connection is from a DVI device and the others are from HDMI devices. All connections also carry audio, except of course the connection from a DVI cable box. The longest HDMI cable I'm using is 15 feet and the output cable is only 6 feet going into a VP50. I'm going to add a FLEA to the output of the monoprice switcher next week so hopefully that won't have any adverse effects.

sfhub

01-28-07, 04:51 PM

It could be a bum switch, but it can also be the cables or DVI/HDMI adapters that might be in use. It is best to isolate each component to make sure they aren't the source of the problem.

This is the first I've ever heard of a complete failure on all ports for all devices, so it is quite possible the switch is just defective or a shared component like the output cable is causing the problem.

Scott Gammans

01-29-07, 02:03 PM

No, it's the switch. When I directly connect the source devices to the display device using the same cables, there is no noise.

ZNY Guy

02-07-07, 07:05 AM

Back in stock. Just picked one up with a couple of cables.

dtron30

02-08-07, 05:24 PM

zoro

02-08-07, 05:51 PM

Does one from monoprice have optical hook up too?

ashutoshsm

02-08-07, 06:35 PM

Does anyone have any experience with this 4x1 switch? It looks like a pretty good deal with 4 cables included...

You can look at it at veeo(dot)com

It has both hdmi and optical ins/out, and I'm wondering specifically if anyone knows if it will output audio from hdmi in through the optical out?

Never heard of the store or product.

Potential unsolicited advertising/scam alert :)

Shoddy webpage raises red flags.

(Not necessarily accusing you, I did say 'potential')

For folks looking for switches with audio switching capability, I know Geffen and Octava make a few, also at relatively reasonable prices. And this veeo place, if it turns out it ISN'T a scam :)

dtron30

02-08-07, 10:07 PM

ashutoshsm-

I haven't heard of it either, and I don't blame you for being suspicious considering their website. I have the same concerns. I really just wanted to know if anyone had experience with it, as it looks like it could be an option.

I've checked out the gefen and the octava as well, and am currently leaning toward the latter, although it appears from their site that it won't route audio from the hdmi in(s) to the optical out.
Does anyone know if it does or not?

The reason I ask is I'd rather not run hdmi and optical cable$ from every component if I don't have to.

ashutoshsm

02-09-07, 12:30 AM

The reason I ask is I'd rather not run hdmi and optical cable$ from every component if I don't have to.

ESPECIALLY considering optical can't carry TrueHD (from HDDVD & BluRay players that actually decode or pass it through - like the PS3!) I'd be amazed, though, if at that sub-200 pricepoint, anything (including the Octava) would matrix-pass-through ALL sources of audio (HDMI or Optical) to the receiver/TV vie the HDMI AND Optical outs.

SteveCaron

02-12-07, 12:07 PM

I just picked up the 3X1 Monoprice HDMI switch and at first I thought I wasn't going to have any issues but, alas it seems not. I have my Philips 5960 and LG RC199H hooked into the switcher going to a Philips LCD. When I first connected I had no problems everything came up rather quickly but, when I tried to connect my cable box this caused some issues eventually rendering all inputs useless. Now I am familiar with the fact you can reboot by unplugging the TV (I have done this successfully) and the signals come back up but, eventually (especially if I'm doing a lot of toggling back and forth between DVD players) it seems that the Display or the switcher gets confused and and I loose signal or it goes all green. Unplugging most always corrects this.... should I be concerned or is this something normal?

sfhub

02-12-07, 12:23 PM

SteveCaron

02-12-07, 01:38 PM

That is not normal, at least not in my experience.

Which cable box are you using and does it happen on all input ports of the 3x1?

I guess the question is whether the problem is the TV side getting confused with negotiating HDCP over and over as you switch or something is going wrong in the switcher.

I'm inclined to think that the problem resides on the TV side. Reason why I think this is Philips has done a couple of firmware upgrades on Handshake issues and though they did seem to correct the issue when I had a machine connected directly into the HDMI port its difficult to say that they ever anticipated a switcher in the equation. I've taken the cable box out of the mix and connected it back up through the component. I'm just wanting to make certain that the box is not twitchy..... any other suggestions on ruling out the box?

sfhub

02-12-07, 02:09 PM

SteveCaron

02-13-07, 03:37 PM

I would just try isolating the components until you can find 2 that you can switch between and reliably reproduce the problem. Then try swapping ports on the switch and see if it improves. There should be 6 combinations of 2 devices into 3 ports.

Thanks! I ran all the variables and the problem is most definately the Display. In one respect I guess I'm lucky because, for some these switchers don't work at all in their config where as mine is only an issue when surfing too quickly between all the sources connected through the switcher; Philips has been successfully improving the set with firmware upgrades but, now they need to work on the speed in which this set locks on to the HDMI. I want to compare what happens to the display when surfing too quickly and often to a computer locking up when you are in the process of uploading data and jumping to upload something else too quickly. Using the switcher in a realistic manner (like switching to an input that I'm actually watching and not surfing through all 3 10 times in a minute) the switch works flawlessly. Picture is perfect if not even better.

twelvepbrs

02-15-07, 02:29 PM

does anyone know if i can use a 2x1 switch as a 1x2 switch? i'd like to hook my STB up to two different tv's and an HDMI splitter doesn't seem to work (at least not yet but i'll keep tinkering, the STB is complaining about HDCP, but both displays have it, so....)
thanks,
-j

aaronwt

02-15-07, 05:14 PM

No you can't. You need an HDMI splitter. Monoprice has a 1x2 HDMI splitter that is HDCP compliant.

twelvepbrs

02-15-07, 05:23 PM

No you can't. You need an HDMI splitter. Monoprice has a 1x2 HDMI splitter that is HDCP compliant.
Are you positive? the tech support at monoprice said i could use the manual 2x1 as a 1x2 (just not the powered 2x1) i guess for 25 bux i'll try the 2x1, it's not hard for me to return it (they're located right next to my inlaws, except that means an unavoidable trip to my inlaws :rolleyes: )

Paul_PDX

02-15-07, 05:43 PM

Are you positive? the tech support at monoprice said i could use the manual 2x1 as a 1x2 (just not the powered 2x1) i guess for 25 bux i'll try the 2x1, it's not hard for me to return it (they're located right next to my inlaws, except that means an unavoidable trip to my inlaws :rolleyes: )

You can use the manual 2x1 as a 1x2 with the limitation of only if you always shut off one of the screens before switching it. That is not what a normal 1x2 does -- it normally allows both displays to be on at the same time showing the same thing.

twelvepbrs

02-15-07, 06:15 PM

You can use the manual 2x1 as a 1x2 with the limitation of only if you always shut off one of the screens before switching it. That is not what a normal 1x2 does -- it normally allows both displays to be on at the same time showing the same thing.If i use it as a 1x2, id think i need to turn off the STB not the displays...it looks like a proper 1x2 is upwards of $100, while a manual 2x1 is $20'ish, i think i'll take my chances with the backwards 2x1 and see how it works, i don't plan on having to switch that often, i'm hooking up my STB/DVR to tv in living room and bedroom, but the tv in the living room also has a cablecard, antenna, and firewire HD for recording

TPeterson

02-15-07, 06:57 PM

Paul--

I would call what you describe a "splitter" rather than a "switch."

Paul_PDX

02-15-07, 07:04 PM

Paul--

I would call what you describe a "splitter" rather than a "switch."

That is what he is describing but he is trying to do it with a cheaper mechanical 2 in 1 out switch used in reverse instead of buying the splitter (1 in 2 out). He is talking about two displays in two rooms.

TPeterson

02-15-07, 08:20 PM

But it's unclear whether or not he intends simultaneous use of them. Since he asked about using a "switch" I assumed that he does not.

Soybean

02-16-07, 12:19 AM

twelvepbrs

02-16-07, 01:26 AM

I wish I had seen this thread before I bought my Monoprice switch. Like the poster above, it's not working with my cable box (SA 8000HD). I thought it was because my DVR is ancient (damn you South Jersey Comcast!), but the 8300HD suffers from it too I guess.
What kind of switch and what do you mean by "not working" (HDCP screen)? i plan to try to use the 2x1 manual HDMI switch backwards as a 1x2 switch, i don't plan on outputing to both tv's simultaneously, if the 2x1 manual switch is truly mechanical that just connects/disconnects one HDMI to another i think this should work

Soybean

02-16-07, 01:42 AM

It's the Monoprice 5x1, Rev 2.1. The DVR reports that my HDTV does not support HDCP. Direct connection works OK.

I guess I may have to go with a manual switch. Bleh.

sfhub

02-16-07, 01:41 PM

twelvepbrs

02-16-07, 01:47 PM

Have you tried turning on the TV first, then plugging in the SA STB to the power outlet? Some STB firmwares need to have this done the first time they are powered on or they think the HDCP connection is invalid. After that, as long as they stay connected to the power outlet everything is fine.

The other thing you can try is port #4 or port #5.
I'vd had the HDCP flip/flop sometimes just depending on if i turn the TV or STB on first, it seems to work best if the TV is on first

aaronwt

02-16-07, 01:54 PM

aaronwt

02-16-07, 01:56 PM

Have you tried turning on the TV first, then plugging in the SA STB to the power outlet? Some STB firmwares need to have this done the first time they are powered on or they think the HDCP connection is invalid. After that, as long as they stay connected to the power outlet everything is fine.

The other thing you can try is port #4 or port #5.

Ports 1,2, and 3 are cascaded to the other chip that has 4 and 5. Try 4 and 5 since that goes straight to the output. With my HDMI Flea it won't work with the cascaded ports but it works with ports 4 and 5.

Soybean

02-16-07, 05:19 PM

Thanks for the tips! I'll have to try that once I escape the dungeons of work.

mystery

02-16-07, 05:25 PM

You work?? :eek:

How are you supposed to play with your toys if you're spending your time that way. ;)

I know, I know, just like me, work is needed in order to play. :(

Too bad we weren't born rich instead of so good looking! :D

Wayne

mrtbig

02-16-07, 09:40 PM

Considering Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher. Need input if will work for me?

Have CRT Rear Projection with DVI input. Want to input to switcher a Sony DVD Changer and DirecTV and also DVD player with DVI.

Concerned about going from DVI to HDMI to DVI, will this be OK? HDMI to DVI on TV, will this be OK?

I want to take advantage of the upscaling features of the DVD Changer and DVD player.

Thanks in advance for your input.

sfhub

02-17-07, 01:13 AM

I use the 5x1 going HDMI to DVI all the time. It works fine for me.

I would double check your CRT has DVI that supports HDCP though. Some of the early ones did not and won't work that well with devices that require HDCP.

mrtbig

02-17-07, 12:22 PM

I just noticed someone in the Sony DVP-CX995V thread saying that he has this switcher and it is not working with his DVD changer. This is the same model I have. Can anyone else confirm this because this would be a deal breaker.

twelvepbrs

02-18-07, 03:12 PM

so i hooked up the 2x1 manual switch backwards as a 1x2 and it "kinda" works, if i turn my STB off when i switch it outputs properly, but one of the legs i have is a 10 ft HDMI to DVI cable which doesn't work through the switch (the HDCP seems to be happy though because i still get audio out of the STB) i have about 6ft of HDMI from the STB to the switch and then the 10 ft of HDMI-DVI to the display that doesnt work (if i hook the display up directly with the HDMI-DVI cable it works fine) anyone have any idea what limits there are on signal loss over a distance of DV cable? is 6 ft, then a switch, then 10 ft pushing the limits?

sfhub

02-18-07, 07:27 PM

The distances are fine.

Try pulling the plug on the STB, then turning on the display, then plugging the STB back in. That is just to debug what is happening, not a permanent suggestion.

twelvepbrs

02-18-07, 07:52 PM

The distances are fine.

Try pulling the plug on the STB, then turning on the display, then plugging the STB back in. That is just to debug what is happening, not a permanent suggestion.
The monitor works fine when it's plugged in directly to the STB, and my other display (mits 62627) works fine if the STB is routed through the HDMI switch, i may have to borrow a monitor from someone else that can handle 720p and see if it works, right now if i try to use the monitor through the switch the monitor just says "No Signal"

sfhub

02-18-07, 10:51 PM

twelvepbrs

02-19-07, 12:59 AM

When you switch from the Mitsu to the monitor, the HDCP keys are completely different and the STB needs to negotiate again. Just because it works fine when directly connected doesn't mean the same process will happen automatically when using the 2x1 switch in a fashion it was designed to do. STBs are also notorious for having HDCP negotiation problems.

My suggestion is to run some experiments to isolate whether this is a negotiation problem or not.
cracked the 2x1 open to verify that it's a simple mechanical switch that just connect the proper pins through, turns out there was a diode on one of the pins for each port on the 2X side (other than that there are no electrical components in the box), i shorted out the diode and now it works fine as a 1x2 for both displays...

sfhub

02-19-07, 03:15 AM

That is probably pin #18 +5V.

HDMI sources are required to assert +5V so they can power up the DDC and EDID info even if the sink device is not on.

The behavior you saw would make sense with the diode in place restricting current to your monitor. Some sinks require the +5V to make the DDC work and others don't.

Without any response on the DDC line it would appear to the source as if there is nothing connected.

Sounds like the diode is there as a safety measure.

twelvepbrs

02-19-07, 03:21 AM

sfhub

02-19-07, 03:26 AM

then for "safety" should i put the diode back on backwards? if i wanna use the 2x1 as a 1x2
I think if you never connect source device to input and source device to output by accident, everything should be fine.

Even if you do it will probably be fine.

The +5V is supposed to send current from source to sink only. It is unclear what would happen if 2 source devices got connected together. I would guess since they are both +5V there would be no current flow.

My guess is you will be fine, but don't take my word for it.

You should also verify that it is actually pin #18 that the diode is on. It might be on some other pin for some other purpose and then all the above theory is moot.

cyberbri

02-23-07, 01:03 PM

Do/will this work with HDMI 1.3? Can they be upgraded or updated?
Or is the 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 version just apply to the equipment on either end?

I don't want to buy one now and have it be outdated in 6 months or whenever 1.3 is out.

rgathright

02-23-07, 07:23 PM

I bought this and it would not work with my Sony HDTV and the Panny Blu-ray. Monoprice sent me another one, but it would not work either. There are some problems with the Sony HDTV's is what the Tech Support is telling me.

JamesY

02-24-07, 04:01 PM

I've been reading all the posts since the beginning, waiting patiently, but now decided to maybe try this Rev 2.1 out.

Main question that I couldn't find an answer to is: I've been using an all DVI switching config with my different devices, but the HDMI ports on the back of the monoprice look awfully close - if I get female DVI->male HDMI adapters, will I block the ports next to them? I'd hate to have to replace ALL of my DVI cables, but no matter what I can't replace the 50ft. DVI cable to my projector, it's in-wall. My current setup is below:

Display: Studio Experience 2HD (Sanyo Z2 clone) DVI->DVI

OPPO OPDV971H: DVI->DVI
Denon DVD-3910: DVI->DVI (worried about this one's compatibility...)
Playstation 3: HDMI->DVI
Dish VIP-211: HDMI->DVI
HTPC (w/ Matrox P650): DVI->DVI (EDID issues?)
Mac Mini: DVI->DVI (EDID issues?)

(all cables used are BJC 6ft, 50ft for the projector)

I've always been setup for DVI, but I'm sick of manually switch the devices (using a DVI coupler), but most of all I get MANY sparkles:mad: with dark scenes and black graphics. I'm hoping the equalizer can fix that. Otherwise, I can go with a DVI switcher, but can't find a good one for the right price, and most HDMI switchers seem to have ports too close together (except the gefen - too $$ for me).

Any adapters recommended to make this work? (I planned on picking up BJC ones). At the very least I guess I'd block port #5 with the display adapter, but early posters have said 4 and 5 have worked better with HDCP issues. I'd consider dongles, but I worry about the signal quality (sparkles). Any advice as to how hook this up successfully would be greatly appreciated!

suprmallet

02-25-07, 04:22 AM

I just purchased a 5x1 HDMI switcher with remote from monoprice. I've plugged my HD-A1 and PS3 into it, and then fed it into the TV. The HD-A1 gives me an HDMI Error on any input except the 5th, and the PS3 won't give me any picture at all (but the TV is recognizing that it's getting fed a 1080p signal). Anyone have any idea what's going on with this? I'm using a Sony KDL-40V2500.

Coming back to it later, it turns out even the 5th input won't give me a stable connection, as it cuts out after a few minutes. I went to Monoprice's website, and it specified that slot 5 will work with the PS3, except that it isn't working, and it won't help me if slot 5 is the only one that will work with the HD-A1.

ravenous

03-03-07, 03:27 AM

Can you please upload the pictures. They are gone.

Thanks.

Yeah, I'm apart of 1.65Gbps, I'll check the HDMI v1.3a specs just in case.

Anyway, here's the photos:

Front in angle:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_01.jpg

Front again:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_02.jpg

Back from PCB:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_03.jpg

Front zoom part1:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_04.jpg

Front zoom part2:
http://www.hdvision.com.br/images/HDX-501_05.jpg

My PCB says "HDMI SWITCH 5 TO 1 V: A2 (date: 2005/10/25)".

Bill Broderick

04-06-07, 09:11 PM

I just received my 5x1 HDMI switcher from Monoprice. I want to use is to connect my DirecTV HD Tivo, Toshiba HD-A2 HD DVD player and Sony BDP-S1 Blu-ray player to my Toshiba 65HX83, which has DVI in.

I'm having no problem with the Tivo or HD DVD player. But I can't get a picture from the Sony Blu-ray player. It works fine when I connect the Sony directly to the TV. But once I try to run the Sony through the switcher, I don't get a picture.

When I switch to the correct input on the switcher, the HDMI light on the Blu-ray player turns on and the switcher is detecting a signal from the player. I've tried swapping the cables between the HD DVD player & the Blu-ray player with no change and I've tried using different inputs for the Blu-ray player, also with no change.

I haven't seen any posts here indicating that anyone else has had a problem with this switch and the BDP-S1, just the PS3 (I tried using input 5 anyway just to see if it worked...it didn't).

Does anyone have any suggestions for me?

chasw98

04-06-07, 10:03 PM

Does anyone have any suggestions for me?

I had the same problem, only different. I had an OTA HD Tuner, DirecTV receiver, HTPC, and a Denon 3910 DVD player. Everything ran through the 5X1 switcher to an Infocus 4805 Projector using the DVI input. They all worked fine........ except the 3910 DVD player. The player worked perfectly when going direct, the HDMI light lit up when plugged into the 5X1 but no picture. I ended buying a Radiient Select 4 switch and the problem was cured. I believe the 5X1 has its limits.

http://www.radiient.com/s.nl/sc.2/category.41/.f

It is $199 for the switch without the serial port and a very good guarantee and great customer service. Almost as good as Monoprice!

Chuck

Bill Broderick

04-07-07, 06:36 PM

Thanks. After giving up on trying to get the Blu-ray player to work with the Monoprice, I started watching an HD DVD. After about 15 minutes, the screen went black. After changing inputs back & forth, the picture came back, only to go black after another 5 minutes. After switching inputs back & forth again, the DVD player gave a message that it could only display 480p (I assume because it didn't detect HDCP). At that point, I disconnected the Monoprice from everything.

For now, I'm assuming that I have a defective unit. I've contacted Monoprice about the problem and I expect that they will be offering an exchange. If so, I will give another unit a shot. If that one doesn't work, I'll try the Radiient.