Who the heck has a Japan PS3? How 'bout some info on future American PS3 firmware updates... That would be cool.

I do! It's actually the easiest one to get through importers such as Play-Asia, or even local mom&pop importers.

Even though the U.S. and Japanese units shipped with different firmware, the updates are multilingual, so anyone running 1.10 will not have the ability to output Blu-Ray at 720p.

I just posted that as a warning to anyone who can't be without this functionality, they might want to hold off on updating their firmware on a Japanese unit until 720p is added again in a future update.

topaz420,
what about the other problem? I mean the fact that 720p games like Resistance can't be scaled to 1080i or 1080p.
Is it the same for all firmware versions?

I have my PS3 hooked up using the component video, since my projector won't take the handshake with the PS3. Since my receiver does not have a HDMI I am using the optical jack. I cannot get Taladega Nights to show Dolby Digital on the receiver only Pro Logic 2. Any idea why this is happening? On games DD works fine. I have it switched to optical and setup for PCM. HELP PLEASE.

I have my PS3 hooked up using the component video, since my projector won't take the handshake with the PS3. Since my receiver does not have a HDMI I am using the optical jack. I cannot get Taladega Nights to show Dolby Digital on the receiver only Pro Logic 2. Any idea why this is happening? On games DD works fine. I have it switched to optical and setup for PCM. HELP PLEASE.

You have to set it to "bitstream". Optical cable supports PCM with only 2 channels, so the receiver uses DPLII.

By the way, to fix the handshake problem, have you tried selecting the HDMI input on the projector BEFORE turning the PS3 on?
Some displays do the handshake correctly only when the HDMI input is selected.

Thanks 9158. That took care of the DD issue. I will play around with the HDMI more tommorow. Right now the Component looks good though, and I don't have to worry about the handshake issue.

don't know if this came up already, but has anybody tryed linking the 360 HD-DVD drive to the PS3?
and do u think this could work out well?

Wow , that would be HILARIOUS if that worked somehow, can't see how though. Sony would be smart to make this functional to trump ms at the add on game but would be shooting themselves in the foot for BD promotion, so I can't see it. Would likely get them sued by thier bd partners. A linux implimentation could get this to happen but Sony would likely prevent it in firmware so dont count on it unless bd fails totally.
On the subject of hdmi pq, on my hitachi 57s500 hdcrt I was amazed how much better the ps3 looked on all media through hdmi compared with component. Other sources I've tried a/b hdmi vs component (2 mot hd pvr models) had component looking sharper and more detailed but the ps3 has a much better hdmi output than component (from the multi av port). It is a bit brighter on hdmi than component but nothing that cant be easily corrected. Off to dl some demos now. Will be returning the component cables later.

I found that "game mode" on the Sony SXRD RxxXBR2, people should stay away from game mode. i think it puts the tv on torch mode and a lot of details are lost.

Game mode on the SXRD is independent of color temperature, brightness, picture/contrast, etc. It merely bypasses some of the advanced settings (DRC, cinemotion, etc.) in order to minimize video processing lag.

I have it all hooked up finally, rewired somethings.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/NeoOiler/DSC01344.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/NeoOiler/DSC01346.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/NeoOiler/DSC01345.jpg

I have a pioneer 1016 so only HDMI video switching, is there any way to get better sound (7.1) other then the hdmi, if not, anyone interested in buying a one month old 1016 receiver??

AndyHDTV: Hmmm good question? I haven't thought about it but I own both. Right now I would have to say the Blu-Ray in the Sony does a much better job that the seperate HD-DVD drive I have for the Xbox... Sony just needs to fix the scaling issues with there unit, I have a FP coming that is 1080p, but not for a few weeks, but my HS51 does 720p/1080i so it will be interesting to see how it looks on the FP. Now on the Sharp LCD 37" in my office BR disc play back in 1080i, and you can't set them to 720p, I hope they change this.

I want to see someone hook up the 360 HD-DVD player to the PS3, boot up Linux and use a HD-DVD player on it.

BAM - the first dual-format player for under $700?

I have an audio question regarding the PS3...

Using HDMI, can one select any of the available audio tracks on a disc without changing anything in the setup of the player?

What I am referring to is the way the Samsung player is setup for audio output. There is a selection in the setup menu for either PCM or bitstream. Selecting bitstream is how one accesses the Dolby Digital or DTS tracks. To play the uncompressed PCM tracks on the Sony discs in 5.1, the setup has to be changed to "PCM".

Tell me how this works in the PS3.

BTW, it seems I bought a PS3 on Ebay today. $750 for a 20 GB player. The only reason I paid the $250 premium is I can return my Samsung player before the 4th of December and I didn't think I'd be able to find a PS3 at retail by then. Still came out ahead as the Samsung was $800 plus tax.

Robert,

Audio works on the PS3 same way it does on the Samsung - only the picture is better!

Peter

I have an audio question regarding the PS3...

Using HDMI, can one select any of the available audio tracks on a disc without changing anything in the setup of the player?



If you select PCM, you can listen to any audio track without changing anything in the XMB.

Audio works on the PS3 same way it does on the Samsung - only the picture is better!

I am really hoping so. I feel like I'm taking a chance on this thing.

If you select PCM, you can listen to any audio track without changing anything in the XMB.

I'm assuming that if PCM is selected, any Dolby Digital or DTS track is decoded to PCM and output? If that is correct, are these tracks output as 5.1 PCM or 2-channel?

I'm assuming that if PCM is selected, any Dolby Digital or DTS track is decoded to PCM and output?

Correct.

If that is correct, are these tracks output as 5.1 PCM or 2-channel?

5.1 PCM.

5.1 PCM. Actually, up to 7.1 if the TrueHD bitstream has that many channels. :D

By the way, those with HDMI audio setups, let us know a) if it works flawlessly and b) if your ears can tell the difference between the original LPCM tracks and the decoded Dolby Digital 5.1 tracks, and c) how does the SACD playback sounds like. Should be interesting to see.


fuad

I have a number of SACD's in my collection and was not aware the PS3 would output SACD audio through HDMI until reading up on the console yesterday. I will be curious about the performance in this area as well.

My Pioneer DV-59AVi seems to becoming more superfluous by the minute. If the PS3 does good SACD playback, and the new Toshiba HD-XA2 does DVD-A playback (?), the Pioneer will be only used for playing PAL discs.

Since I'm living in 720p land for the forseeable future can anyone comment on the Blu Ray to 720p output of the PS3? Basically how is the downscaling?

ted

Since I'm living in 720p land for the forseeable future can anyone comment on the Blu Ray to 720p output of the PS3? Basically how is the downscaling?

ted

Hey Ted,

Only the Japanese ps3 was downscaling to 720p, until the latest firmware updates (1.10), now none of them do. :(

This is such a simple feature we hope it will be added again in a future update

Hey Ted,

Only the Japanese ps3 was downscaling to 720p, until the latest firmware updates (1.10), now none of them do. :(

This is such a simple feature we hope it will be added again in a future update

Oh darn, and I was trying so hard to convince my family we needed a vid game box. ;)

Downer!
Guess I'll be waiting longer than I wished.

Thanks,
ted

Sorry to ask - I'm sure it has been asked before.

How loud is the PS3? I have heard the Xbox 360 is plenty loud - how does the PS3 compare?

Thanks

Sorry to ask - I'm sure it has been asked before.

How loud is the PS3? I have heard the Xbox 360 is plenty loud - how does the PS3 compare?

Thanks

Mucho, it is virtually silent.

I've had it for a week and accidentally left it on all night 5 of those 7 days because I forgot it was on

Does anyone know if the ps3 will recognize an external hard drive connected via the usb port? Thanks!

Does anyone know if the ps3 will recognize an external hard drive connected via the usb port? Thanks!

Check here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8985979&&#post8985979

You have to preformat the drive to the way PS3 likes to read it. Once it's done, it should be fine. I think eventually you'll need to use Linux to copy the stuff off your PC to this external drive - like your latest album ripped to AAC on the PC for example - then switch back to the XMB mode.


fuad

Check here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8985979&&#post8985979

You have to preformat the drive to the way PS3 likes to read it. Once it's done, it should be fine. I think eventually you'll need to use Linux to copy the stuff off your PC to this external drive - like your latest album ripped to AAC on the PC for example - then switch back to the XMB mode.


fuad

Thanks for the reply - I understand the link, but I don't fully understand your response - are you saying once I connect the drive to the ps3, I will have to reformat it if I then want to conneect it to my pc and vice versa?

1) Can the ps3 play any losslessly-encoded music?

2) Can it rip a CD encoding the music with a lossless codec?

I just posted that as a warning to anyone who can't be without this functionality, they might want to hold off on updating their firmware on a Japanese unit until 720p is added again in a future update.

Don't count on it. I think progressive quality is too good and too computer compatible to be allowed to carry BD movies that could be captured. Forcing progressive to only be 1080p removes all but the most current DISPLAYS from capturing a progressive steam.

There are several computer cards that can capture 720p.

I think Sony plugged a leak.

Thanks for the reply - I understand the link, but I don't fully understand your response - are you saying once I connect the drive to the ps3, I will have to reformat it if I then want to conneect it to my pc and vice versa?
I don't know how exactly the file lookup works on PS3s - even if I did own one. :p

But basically it's like this. You have a working formatted drive. Create three folders: Music, Video and Pictures. These are the folders that the PS3 will be looking at. If you have other pix, music or video files in other folders, the PS3 won't be looking at those folders automatically.

If you unplug the drive and connect it back to a PC, it would still work. That's how you transfer your files originally.

Best to PM the OP on the thread I mentioned for more details. :D


fuad

1) Can the ps3 play any losslessly-encoded music?

2) Can it rip a CD encoding the music with a lossless codec?
I think a yes on both accounts as it has MP3 and AAC encoders built-in if you want to rip to your 20GB/60GB or external drive.

I think Sony plugged a leak. Interesting perspective, since its output is RGB via HDMI. To capture such data, even at 720p is a monumental task.

Is Sony covering its ass? And more importantly, is Microsoft exposing theirs? :D

Maybe a firmware is needed where the PS3 outputs in YPbPr/YCbCr with BD movies.


fuad

Possible ways to get the audio from SACD out of the PS3:

(note: i highlighted in red the things i'm not sure of. Can somebody clarify those?)

1) As PCM (24 bit, 192 KHz) on HDMI:
Pros: you "only" need an HDMI 1.1 receiver
Cons: converting DSD to PCM may cause you to lose the advantages of DSD (I'm not sure about this. Also, it seems to be a controversial subject so don't flame me! ;) )

2) As DSD on HDMI:
Pros: DSD is converted directly to analogue by the receiver (turning off room equalization, etc.), without going through PCM
Cons: you need an HDMI 1.2 receiver (I'm not sure if there are any out yet)

3) As analogue on RCA-cinch (only for stereo SACDs):
Pros: DSD is converted directly to analogue by the PS3, without going through PCM, and you don't need an HDMI receiver
Cons: You would be using the PS3's DSD-to-analogue converter, and i'm not sure about the quality of it. Is it like a D/A converter or is it a totally different thing?

The PS3 includes a graphics chip from nVidia, which is more than capable of quality DVD playback and upscaling -- just see the HTPC forum. Decoding and upscaling probably wouldn't equal a solution based on a Genuum or Silicon Optix Realta, but it could come pretty close.

I was using an upscaling DVD player to play standard DVDs and just got a ps3 60 gig - not super impressed by blu-ray DVDs yet but I suppose this is because the only ones I have seen so far are mpeg-2 not mpeg-4...I am impressed however by how much better standard definition DVDs look in comparison to the upscaling DVD player I used until now...they look pretty close to if not almost exactly like the blu-ray DVDs...

Ok halfpipe, you've got to speak up as to what equipment you are watching these Blu-ray movies on, and what movies exactly you've watched.

(Not just Talladega I hope!)

Also the PS3 doesn't upscale DVD movies, so your being 'pleasantly surprised' by it's DVD performance doesn't seem to jive either. I mean, you're playing these on an HDTV, yeah?

Ok halfpipe, you've got to speak up as to what equipment you are watching these Blu-ray movies on, and what movies exactly you've watched.

(Not just Talladega I hope!)

Also the PS3 doesn't upscale DVD movies, so your being 'pleasantly surprised' by it's DVD performance doesn't seem to jive either. I mean, you're playing these on an HDTV, yeah?

Okay, I may have commented too soon - some DVDs look almost as good as BDs...ironically the DVD that looked the best so far is an obscure early 80s horror flick - THE ATTIC...superbit DVDs are looking good so far too - just put in the SHINING and FINAL DESTINATION - not so good...however all titles look better than on the upconverting DVD player I was using albeit an inexpensive LG combo unit (owned a sony standard DVD progressive player previously - so I know the difference - the LG served as a temporary unit). My PDP is a Fujitsu P50XTA51UB - my guess is that the PS3 connected via HDMI is allowing my Fujtsu to upscale better than the LG was...by far.

Okay, I may have commented too soon - some DVDs look almost as good as BDs... Just humor me. What BDs have you seen on your PS3?


fuad

Since I'm living in 720p land for the forseeable future can anyone comment on the Blu Ray to 720p output of the PS3? Basically how is the downscaling?

ted

Ted:

I'm running my PS3 through component into a Samsung 720P DLP. I haven't really noticed any problems with downscaled Blu-ray from 1080P. From my perspective and at this point, 720P Blu-ray on PS3 is looking better than films broadcast at 720P by ABC.

No doubt that there will be better Blu-ray players released in the next year, but for $500 (20gig version) to get both a game machine and a Blu-ray player, it's really hard to complain.

My biggest complaint at this point is really that to take advantage of HDMI 1.3, I have to upgrade my equipment with stuff that doesn't even exist yet.

Hope that helps.

sjyang

Well, I have thrown everything at this player this week, DVD-R/CD-R/CD-RW etc. etc.. It hasn't had a problem playing anything yet. Tried a couple of SACDs, use the SD card reader etc.. What would be cool if they had it recognize a iPod or MP3 when you plug it into the USB port, the Xbox 360 currently does this... I concur with topaz420, the unit itself is plenty quite compared to my Xbox 360 which is way too loud...

WriteSimple: The DVDs that are mastered well, look very damn good. DVDs that are so so, look ok on the PS3. Now Blu-Ray is a different story, so far not liking that my TV is 720p but it is saying 1080i when I put a movie into watch, they need to fix that. Still would be cool if they could upscale DVDs... to let's say 720p.. Still, not a bad all around player, if you look all the stuff this thing can do, it is much better value then any console out on the market.

I'm running my PS3 through component into a Samsung 720P DLP. I haven't really noticed any problems with downscaled Blu-ray from 1080P. From my perspective and at this point, 720P Blu-ray on PS3 is looking better than films broadcast at 720P by ABC

Are you saying that the PS3 downscaled 1080p software to 720p for your projector? I'm confused, I thought that the PS3 didn't downscale? Or is that only via HDMI?

Someone help me out...

dave :)

Apparently it does with firmware 1.00.

**CONFIRMED**

With Japanese PS3, Firmware 1.0, Blu-Ray can be output in 720p

With Japanese PS3, Firmware 1.10 Blu-Ray can only be output in 1080p or 1080i

WHY WOULD THEY REMOVE THIS GREAT FEATURE?

Dumbfounded

Can someone post/link to a list of all 1080p games for the PS3?

Ted:

I'm running my PS3 through component into a Samsung 720P DLP. I haven't really noticed any problems with downscaled Blu-ray from 1080P. From my perspective and at this point, 720P Blu-ray on PS3 is looking better than films broadcast at 720P by ABC.

Hope that helps.

sjyang

Well actually it confuses slightly. :)
To emphasize David's question above (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9001343&&#post900 1343), is this indeed downscaling to 720p or is it dropping to 480 and then your pj is rescaling to panel rez?

I'm not that fond of the scaling in my pj.

ted

Are you saying that the PS3 downscaled 1080p software to 720p for your projector? I'm confused, I thought that the PS3 didn't downscale? Or is that only via HDMI?

Someone help me out...

dave :)

Hi Dave,

Yeah on my japanese 1.00 firmware, it used to output at perfect 720p.

Now i have to set the ps3 to 1080p and let my projector scale to 720p.

So it's confirmed that Sony removed the option to downscale BDs to 720p with firmware 1.10.

Any ideas on why they did this and whether they're gonna put this option back in the next fimware?

So it's confirmed that Sony removed the option to downscale BDs to 720p with firmware 1.10.

Any ideas on why they did this and whether they're gonna put this option back in the next fimware? They did it to prevent you from recording 720p hd over component (analog) connection. The specs for the ps3 always said you have to use hdmi for hd, so no surprises there.

They did it to prevent you from recording 720p hd over component (analog) connection. The specs for the ps3 always said you have to use hdmi for hd, so no surprises there.

So HDMI still outputs 720p, 1080i, 1080p for BR playback? Is it safe to assume output is user selectable or is EDID negotiated?

ted

The specs for the ps3 always said you have to use hdmi for hd, so no surprises there.

The specs never said HDMI was required to watch Blu-Ray movies. Up until little over a month ago, the core version didn't even have HDMI. HDMI would only be required if the ICT is turned on.

WriteSimple: The DVDs that are mastered well, look very damn good. DVDs that are so so, look ok on the PS3. Now Blu-Ray is a different story, so far not liking that my TV is 720p but it is saying 1080i when I put a movie into watch, they need to fix that. Still would be cool if they could upscale DVDs... to let's say 720p.. Still, not a bad all around player, if you look all the stuff this thing can do, it is much better value then any console out on the market. Oh I have every confidence the PS3 plays DVDs and BDs fine. It was more towards that particular user that said BDs are not that much better than DVDs. Just needed a clarification from him. :D


fuad

Can anyone comment on calibrating the PS3 for VIDEO vs PC levels, i.e. (16-235 vs. 0-255)?

What does it default to and is it user selectable?

Whack me if necessary, but I do not own any HD optical currently - do HD discs come with even the THX brightness setup as part of the 'experience'?

ted

As strange as it sounds I have not seen any but I don't have many discs either.

So HDMI still outputs 720p, 1080i, 1080p for BR playback? Is it safe to assume output is user selectable or is EDID negotiated?

ted

Hey Ted,

I am using HDMI. No more 720p through HDMI, either.

Here's my settings, and what the ps3 outputs blu-ray movies at:

PS3 Setting / Blu-Ray Output
720p / 1080i
1080p / 1080p

I Haven't tried any lower settings

my color looks oversaturated with hdmi and my display panel disables color settings when using hdmi. does the ps3 have color controls on the game function or bluray playback function?? hope so. if not does anyone know which hd/brd players do?

Hey Ted,

I am using HDMI. No more 720p through HDMI, either.

Here's my settings, and what the ps3 outputs blu-ray movies at:

PS3 Setting / Blu-Ray Output
720p / 1080i
1080p / 1080p

I Haven't tried any lower settings

This is not correct. As I posted here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9008403&&#post9008403), if you have the PS3 set at 720p, it will display BD's at 480p. I can not confirm the 1080p setting as my TV doesn't take a 1080p input. But if I want to watch a BD in HD, I must set the PS3 at 1080i resolution.

This is not correct. As I posted here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9008403&&#post9008403), if you have the PS3 set at 720p, it will display BD's at 480p. I can not confirm the 1080p setting as my TV doesn't take a 1080p input. But if I want to watch a BD in HD, I must set the PS3 at 1080i resolution.

Again, for the 4th time, I must emphasize that I'm using a Japanese unit.

But these are the results I obtained using two separate blu-ray discs (X-men3 and Ice Age 2).

They have a new firware out, not sure what it addresses. But if I am watching a Blu-Ray movie on my 720p set it should be able to show it in that, but it is currently going over to 1080i no matter what I set it at..

Thanks,

G

Is there anybody with the new firmware (1.11) who can check if it fixes the "720p BD playback" and/or the "1080i/1080p upscaling of 720p games" problems?

Not sure if this has been asked before, but I am on the fence between the 360 and a PS3 (if I can get my hands on one).

The question is, can the PS3 be used as a media center to stream music (via Media Player) and pictures from a home networked PC?

This is a feature I really like about the 360, but for other reasons I prefere the PS3. If it could, I think I would be sold. Also, is it true that the PS3 DOES NOT upscale SD DVDs?

Thanks,

The PS3 does not currently upscale SD DVD's, it will output at 480p.

9158: No, it doesn't fix it yet. I have the 1.11 firmware as of last night, and not sure what it fixed or corrected. Haven't had any issues with the unit yet, except, when I want to play a movie it always goes to 1080i, I would love for it to be set to 720p on my 720p Sharp set. That being said this unit will be used with my new Pearl FP soon which is 1080p...

HeadRusch: It would be nice to see that feature on the PS3.

1. Anyone have their PS3 hooked up to a CRT Rear Projection TV via component video at 1080i? I am interested in the quality of the Blueray movies at 1080i.

2. If you put in a standard dvd that has been ripped with DVD shrink, will it be upscaled to 1080i output via the component video?

Thanks, Derek

Sony's PlayStation 3 squares off with players from Panasonic and Samsung in a three-way true-Blu showdown.
(http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/hd-dvd-bluray/1927/shootout-3-blu-ray-disc-players.html)

The PS3 basically comes out as a killer bargain, great performance, and the most futureproofed BD product on the market right now. See what you think. Good read!

I read through the Sound and Vision Magazine online shootout. I was glad to see the PS3 ranked so highly. I watched my first blu-ray title on the PS3 last evening: Worked like a charm but I have to agree with the reviewer.

"The only thing that rubbed me wrong was the PS3's fan noise, which made it much louder than any other gear in my system, including a DVR and Sony front projector. It was even noisier than my Toshiba HD DVD player, and that thing is LOUD!"


I have the A1, Hitachi HDJ 52 and a Motorola 6412. The PS3 is definitely the loudest and warmest thing in the rack. Granted, no where as loud as the X-Box 360 when playing a game but I do not keep 360 in the theater room.

John

I read through the Sound and Vision Magazine online shootout. I was glad to see the PS3 ranked so highly. I watched my first blu-ray title on the PS3 last evening: Worked like a charm but I have to agree with the reviewer.

"The only thing that rubbed me wrong was the PS3's fan noise, which made it much louder than any other gear in my system, including a DVR and Sony front projector. It was even noisier than my Toshiba HD DVD player, and that thing is LOUD!"


I have the A1, Hitachi HDJ 52 and a Motorola 6412. The PS3 is definitely the loudest and warmest thing in the rack. Granted, no where as loud as the X-Box 360 when playing a game but I do not keep 360 in the theater room.

John


That's strange, I can barely hear the Ps3 with nothing else on..My hearing is near perfect as well. Are you hearing the fan while the movie is playing? If so, how close are you sitting to the Ps3?

Sound is not an issue with me as well. I only hear it if my ear is about a feet away from the system. But it is warm as hell if i put my hand near the fan. I hope this thing doesn't over heat.

That's strange, I can barely hear the Ps3 with nothing else on..My hearing is near perfect as well. Are you hearing the fan while the movie is playing? If so, how close are you sitting to the Ps3?

I have two rows of theater seating, the closest is about 11ft away from the eqipment rack. I did not hear the PS3 during movie playback so it did not interfere with the movie experience. I also played Resistance: Fall of Man for about 20 minutes before I got nauseated from motion sickness (I am not a gamer, my 14 y.o. son is) and again the fan noise was not intrusive. The fact remains though, in its high fan mode the PS3 is the loudest item in my rack.

John

Thanks for the reply on the upconverting question. Does anyone know if the PS3 can be used to stream music and pictures from your networked PC?

As I posted in another thread, the actual sound level of my PS3 at the unit while idle and playing a BD movie is 54 dB. Each person can decide for themselves whether they consider that loud or not, but at least there is a specific frame of reference.

As I posted in another thread, the actual sound level of my PS3 at the unit while idle and playing a BD movie is 54 dB. Each person can decide for themselves whether they consider that loud or not, but at least there is a specific frame of reference.

what is your length reference for this measurement?

Ie, is it a 1m, 3m measurement ?

Or is it from the top of the PS3?

As I posted in another thread, the actual sound level of my PS3 at the unit while idle and playing a BD movie is 54 dB. Each person can decide for themselves whether they consider that loud or not, but at least there is a specific frame of reference.

You must have the loudest PS3 manufactured then. Mine is slightly quieter than my PC that maxes out at 34db. My hearing is extremely sensitive to any noise and it's only even noticeable about 15% of the time.

Brandon

Yikes.... the PS3 is one of the more quite console gaming systems I have heard in awhile.... My Xbox 360 sounds like it just took off from a aircraft carrier in the China Sea when I play Gears of War. ;) LOL DB differences are huge between the 2. Plus, the PS3 is doing double duty as a Blu-Ray, add the Xbox add on HD-DVD Drive and you ad a tad more noise.... I can not hear my PS3 in my rack at all when playing a game or a movie.

My Findings using a Realistic "Radio Shack" Digital Sound Level Meter.

PS3: 40-50
Xbox360: 68 - 70
Wii: Not tested yet.

The meter was pointed directly at the front of the units and they where all laying on there sides. Tested with games and movies this varied of course..

I'm still confused on the PS3 downscaling of BR DVD's. I currently own a SAM HP-S4253 plasma, its supports 480p,720p,1080i. I have the ps3 set to accept 1080i, 720p, and 480p. During playback of the DVDs when I press the info button on the tv it says resolution is 1280x720. With my plasma am I a victim of having to view the BR in 480p until sony has a fix for this?

I'm still confused on the PS3 downscaling of BR DVD's. I currently own a SAM HP-S4253 plasma, its supports 480p,720p,1080i. I have the ps3 set to accept 1080i, 720p, and 480p. During playback of the DVDs when I press the info button on the tv it says resolution is 1280x720. With my plasma am I a victim of having to view the BR in 480p until sony has a fix for this?

If your tv says the resolution is at 1280x720 I'm curious as to why you think it is downscaling to 480p. I'm also curious as to why your tv says the resolution is at 1280x720 (720p) because it is my understanding (and experience) that it doesn't support that resolution on BR-ROM playback as of right now.

On my personal experience on a 32xbr1 LCD tv with HDMI cable, the PS3 will downscale during BR-ROM playback if 720p is your tv's maximum supported resolution. However if your tv supports 1080i it doesn't downscale to 480p, it downscales to 1080i. The reason for this is because the PS3's resolution hierarchy is as follows: 1080p > 720p > 1080i > 480p.

Therefore, when you use an hdmi or component cable, you have to have both 1080i and 720p resolutions supported on a 720p native tv to prevent the ps3 from downscaling to 480p. If it recognizes that 1080i is supported, it will downscale it to that resolution first. If you're using an HDMI cable, the PS3 has an "automatic" detection feature that will list all supported resolutions for your tv in the above hierarchy so you don't have to wonder. If you have component cables, I believe you have to check all available resolutions for your TV.

I have no idea if Sony plans to fix this downscaling issue, but I should hope so, because i fear that the downscaling and rescaling up to 720p from my tv's scaler is preventing the best possible picture right now.

Hope that helped to answer your question(s).

Brandon

As I posted in another thread, the actual sound level of my PS3 at the unit while idle and playing a BD movie is 54 dB. Each person can decide for themselves whether they consider that loud or not, but at least there is a specific frame of reference.
How did you measure the sound level? I assume you used a sound level meter. The normal convention is to measure the sound level at a distance of 1 meter (39.37 inches) from the sound source. If you measured closer than this then the measured values cannot be directly compared to the typical published measurements. For example it the level measures 40 dB at 1 meter then it would measure 52 dB at 0.25 meters (about 10 inches).

Ron Jones

How did you measure the sound level? I assume you used a sound level meter. The normal convention is to measure the sound level at a distance of 1 meter (39.37 inches) from the sound source. If you measured closer than this then the measured values cannot be directly compared to the typical published measurements. For example it the level measures 40 dB at 1 meter then it would measure 52 dB at 0.25 meters (about 10 inches).

Ron Jones

I didn't realize there was a standardized measuring distance. I took my measurement at about 3 inches from the console. If I take the measurement at 1 meter I likely will not get a reading. My dB meter only goes as low as 50 dB.

If your tv says the resolution is at 1280x720 I'm curious as to why you think it is downscaling to 480p. I'm also curious as to why your tv says the resolution is at 1280x720 (720p) because it is my understanding (and experience) that it doesn't support that resolution on BR-ROM playback as of right now.

On my personal experience on a 32xbr1 LCD tv with HDMI cable, the PS3 will downscale during BR-ROM playback if 720p is your tv's maximum supported resolution. However if your tv supports 1080i it doesn't downscale to 480p, it downscales to 1080i. The reason for this is because the PS3's resolution hierarchy is as follows: 1080p > 720p > 1080i > 480p.

Therefore, when you use an hdmi or component cable, you have to have both 1080i and 720p resolutions supported on a 720p native tv to prevent the ps3 from downscaling to 480p. If it recognizes that 1080i is supported, it will downscale it to that resolution first. If you're using an HDMI cable, the PS3 has an "automatic" detection feature that will list all supported resolutions for your tv in the above hierarchy so you don't have to wonder. If you have component cables, I believe you have to check all available resolutions for your TV.

I have no idea if Sony plans to fix this downscaling issue, but I should hope so, because i fear that the downscaling and rescaling up to 720p from my tv's scaler is preventing the best possible picture right now.

Hope that helped to answer your question(s).

Brandon
In the PS3 display setup all resolutions of 480p,720p and 1080i are all detected. I am also running through HDMI not component

does anyone here have a 1080p native lcd monitor that they have hooked up to the PS3 via HDMI and set the output to 1080p w/stereo sound and tried to play a the bundled movie (Talladega Nights)? When I switch to 1080p I get green colored snow across the display.

I have already tried different cables, with no change.

I didn't realize there was a standardized measuring distance. I took my measurement at about 3 inches from the console. If I take the measurement at 1 meter I likely will not get a reading. My dB meter only goes as low as 50 dB. I think you need to re-measure. :D :D :D Good to know someone here knows his dB measuring standards. (not me)


fuad

does anyone here have a 1080p native lcd monitor that they have hooked up to the PS3 via HDMI and set the output to 1080p w/stereo sound and tried to play a the bundled movie (Talladega Nights)? When I switch to 1080p I get green colored snow across the display.

I have already tried different cables, with no change.

What cables have you tried?

PS3 is a little picky in this regard.

does anyone here have a 1080p native lcd monitor that they have hooked up to the PS3 via HDMI and set the output to 1080p w/stereo sound and tried to play a the bundled movie (Talladega Nights)? When I switch to 1080p I get green colored snow across the display.

I have already tried different cables, with no change.
I've not tried it but it sounds like there's handshake issue.

1) Try plugging the cable BEFORE both units are on. Then turn on the LCD and use its HDMI input.

2) Turn on the PS3, then switch the input of the LCD from whatever to HDMI.

3) The five second method. Connect the cable, and set the LCD to HDMI. Press and hold the Power button on the PS3 for five or more seconds to enable auto sync.


fuad

does anyone here have a 1080p native lcd monitor that they have hooked up to the PS3 via HDMI and set the output to 1080p w/stereo sound and tried to play a the bundled movie (Talladega Nights)? When I switch to 1080p I get green colored snow across the display.

I have already tried different cables, with no change.

When you say "monitor" as opposed to TV I assume you mean a computer monitor via HDMI-DVI adaptor and not an lcd television with native 1080p resolution. If so, you need to realize that the monitor has to be HDCP compliant in order for 1080p to be accepted from the PS3. All 1080p TVs with HDMI inputs are HDCP compliant so there should be no problem. But if you're trying to hook it up to a lcd monitor this issue will come up as I'm under the impression that a very small percentage of lcd monitors are HDCP compliant.

Brandon

What's Loud?
The loudness of sound is measured in decibels. Earplugs are recommended for sounds of 85 dB and above. But what does 85 dB mean? The following chart shows common sounds and their associated sound level.

20 dB Ticking watch
30 dB Quiet whisper
40 dB Refrigerator hum
50 dB Rainfall
60 dB Sewing machine
70 dB Washing machine
80 dB Alarm clock at two feet
85 dB Average traffic
95 dB MRI
100 dB Blow dryer, subway train
105 dB Power mower, chainsaw
110 dB Screaming child
120 dB Rock Concert, thunderclap
130 dB Jackhammer, jet engine plane (100 ft. away)
140 dB Shotgun blast, airbag deployment, firecracker

When you say "monitor" as opposed to TV I assume you mean a computer monitor via HDMI-DVI adaptor and not an lcd television with native 1080p resolution. If so, you need to realize that the monitor has to be HDCP compliant in order for 1080p to be accepted from the PS3. All 1080p TVs with HDMI inputs are HDCP compliant so there should be no problem. But if you're trying to hook it up to a lcd monitor this issue will come up as I'm under the impression that a very small percentage of lcd monitors are HDCP compliant.

Brandon

I have a Sceptre 42" LCD TV Monitor, it is hooked up HDMI/HDMI. I do have a HDMI/DVI cord that i use for my PC. On the TV remote I can switch between HDMI/HDCP/DVI.

When in 1080p mode on the PS3 and connected via HDMI port....

...I switch TV input to HDMI and get green colored snow across the image and I get sound, which is just stereo coz that's all I have for audio.

...I switch TV input to HDCP and get green colored snow across the image and no sound.

...I switch TV input to DVI and get 1920x1080 clear, very clear picture! but no sound, which is understood because the TV is looking for the sound via the PC Audio input.

So if this BR-ROM (Talladega Nights) is HDCP protected, why can I view a clear picture on DVI and snowy picture on HDCP....something doesn't look right here.

Also for me anyways, this test kinda rules out the HDMI cable, because I can get a clear picture out of the TV setting for DVI. But just to make sure, I have cables coming in today, to see if they make a difference. And then if they are the same results, I will go to a best buy and purchase the unnecessarily "expensive" cable to test again.

It sounds like the others are correct and there is some sort of a handshake issue that I probably don't have the knowledge to help you with.

How old is the TV? It's possible there is a compatibility issue with the PS3 and that tv's hdmi/hdcp. I know that several people with Westinghouse TVs with HDMI inputs have had handshake problems when using the HDMI output on the PS3.

Brandon

I just updated my PS3 firmware to 1.11 but still when playing blu-ray disc my Pioneer Elite 1130 plasma still displaying 1080i eventhough I set the PS3 to output 720p.

My Pioneer displays correctly in 720p when just browsing through the PS3 menu....

I just updated my PS3 firmware to 1.11 but still when playing blu-ray disc my Pioneer Elite 1130 plasma still displaying 1080i eventhough I set the PS3 to output 720p.

My Pioneer displays correctly in 720p when just browsing through the PS3 menu....

Firmware 1.11 doesn't address the upscaling/downscaling issues. It adds some features into the online friends account management and some other minor things. It details it on the playstation website. I would post the link but I'm still not allowed.

Brandon

Firmware 1.11 doesn't address the upscaling/downscaling issues. It adds some features into the online friends account management and some other minor things. It details it on the playstation website. I would post the link but I'm still not allowed.

BrandonSo for US PS3 owners, for now just wait until Sony address this issue in the upcoming firmware release?

If your tv says the resolution is at 1280x720 I'm curious as to why you think it is downscaling to 480p. I'm also curious as to why your tv says the resolution is at 1280x720 (720p) because it is my understanding (and experience) that it doesn't support that resolution on BR-ROM playback as of right now.

and to the guy asking about 1080p and BLU-ray movie.

i have the samsung 40" 1080p and the PS3 connected via HDMI. i set the PS3 to 1080p and all blu-ray movies play at 1080p (1920x1080 when you hit "display")
all 1080p games play 1080p (duh) and 720p games scale to 1280x720.

this BLU-RAY player is in some ways better then my Samsung BLU-RAY p1000. better because
a) it supports digital audio via HDMI (samsung requires you to use optical/coax, i'm still fighting with them on this as that makes their HDMI out, not HDMI)
b) it's MUCH faster then the P1000, load times are min's on the p1000 and seconds on the PS3.

but all the "good" of the blu-ray player on the PS3 on a 1080p HDTV is all erased by the fact it does not upconvert. untill the blu-ray is as big as the DVD, most movies i have are still in nearly ancient 480i DVD and i really enjoy the upconvert to 1080p on the p1000.

Originally Posted by bplewis24
Firmware 1.11 doesn't address the upscaling/downscaling issues. It adds some features into the online friends account management and some other minor things. It details it on the playstation website. I would post the link but I'm still not allowed.

Brandon

So for US PS3 owners, for now just wait until Sony address this issue in the upcoming firmware release?

If they ever address it. i think what everyone is missing is that 1080p upscale on PS/PS2 games may be impossible.

if you dont own a 1080p HDTV and have a PS3, you really need to think if you even want a 1080p HDTV.
I have one, and at 1080p the screen is soooo small, you cant read anything unless you are right on top of the screen... my chair is 11' away from the 40" samsung 1080p HDTV and you just plain cannot play games at 1080p that require any text reading or if any attention is paid to small graphics. i have to sit about 5' away from the TV to view this.

with that said on games designed for 1080p, what could this do to games that are not? it may render them useless.

still, i really, really really really really really hope Sony does alow upconvert, at least on DVD's or at least to 720p on PS/PS2 games.

In the PS3 display setup all resolutions of 480p,720p and 1080i are all detected. I am also running through HDMI not component


As of now my TV is saying resolution is 1920x1080i durning BD playback through HDMI. b4 i recall it playing at 1280x720p. Is is better to be at 1920x1080i or 1280x720p? Also, on Tallagada Nights the colors dont appear to be really brite and vivid is it my set or just how the DVD is?

Talledega Nights video is fairly washed out on the colors. Read the reviews out now. It was a very poor choice to include with the player to show off the potential of Blue Ray. In fact Xmen 3 is the first BD disc I have seen that has even come close to HD DVD. I guess it is because they used VC1 instead of mpeg2. I can't believe Sony hasn't responded to upgrade the quality of the BD conversions being done so far. The 25 gig mpeg2 movies look pathetic and barely better than DVD. The 50 gig mpeg2's look OK, but not that great. The best video I have seen to date on the PS3 are the trailers you can download from the store which are in VC1. For all Sony's talk they are not really delivering right now. My HD-DVD add on on the X360 via component still looks much better than most of the movies on BD. I just received ICE AGE 2 in BD at home from Netflix and Superman Returns in HD-DVD tonight, so I will see how they compare. Not sure if it is fair to compare all CG to film with CG special effect though.

agree... i was not impressed with BD untill Click was released. still mpge2 but at least 50GB. Xmen looks awsome in VC1 (finally). regular HDTV @ 720p/1080i on Dish network looked better then the mpeg2 25GB stuff...
still, if you own a 1080p HDTV all BD look better then HD-DVD only because of their lack of of 1080p player. i know the xbox can do it, but that via VGA, so it's compressed and dosent give the full effect.

Talledega Nights was one of the worst things iv even seen. i'm not talking about video quality, i'm talking content. no wonder they gave it away, who would buy that lol.

Xmen is NOT vc-1. It is AVC. Looks great. :)

@Cherokee: Black Hawk Down in MPEG-2 and Kingdom of Heaven in AVC are two of the best looking movies there are out on either format right now. I think you've been drinking too much of the VC-1 kool-aid if you think that the initial Sony MPEG releases are indicative of the state of all things non-VC1. That's not a knock on VC-1 at all, just saying there's a whole set of movies out there that look incredible without it.

agree... i was not impressed with BD untill Click was released. still mpge2 but at least 50GB. Xmen looks awsome in VC1 (finally). regular HDTV @ 720p/1080i on Dish network looked better then the mpeg2 25GB stuff...
still, if you own a 1080p HDTV all BD look better then HD-DVD only because of their lack of of 1080p player. i know the xbox can do it, but that via VGA, so it's compressed and dosent give the full effect.

Talledega Nights was one of the worst things iv even seen. i'm not talking about video quality, i'm talking content. no wonder they gave it away, who would buy that lol.

How many time do we have to repeat ourselves? 1080i does not look any different than 1080p on a 1080p display. Do your research.

VGA is not compressed...where do you come up with this stuff? And there has never been a BD disk that was released on both formats that looks any better than it's HD DVD counterpart. Actually some PQ has been given to HD DVD in some cases...but only slightly.

I like both formats, but I can't stand when anyone spouts the same old "Best Buy" sales pitch on a science forum.

Please try to contribute more than "1080i bad"..."HDMI good"..."1080p good"..."BD Good."

It got old over seven months ago.

@Cherokee: Black Hawk Down in MPEG-2 and Kingdom of Heaven in AVC are two of the best looking movies there are out on either format right now.

That sounds like good news to me. I just got home from work and I received my first two blu ray movies from Netflix today. My first two choices were Black Hawk Down (mostly because of some overlay technology I had heard about) and Kingdom of Heaven. I hope you're right!

Brandon

Well, let us know your thoughts after you've finished viewing them. :)

(What's your setup by the way?)

@Cherokee: Black Hawk Down in MPEG-2 and Kingdom of Heaven in AVC are two of the best looking movies there are out on either format right now.

Kingdom of Heaven is MPEG-2.

Kingdom of Heaven is MPEG-2.

You're right you're right... my bad.

Wasn't it supposed to be in MPEG-4 when it was announced? For some reason I had that stuck in my head.

Anyway well, another win for MPEG-2 then. I should be receiving it in the mail tomorrow from Amazon myself.

I didn't realize there was a standardized measuring distance. I took my measurement at about 3 inches from the console. If I take the measurement at 1 meter I likely will not get a reading. My dB meter only goes as low as 50 dB.
Correct. At 1m it shouldn't be any louder than about 35db.

54db is pretty loud. However, I'm sure if you stuck the microphone inside the dang thing you could make it reach 70db with the HDD spinning and whatnot... The point is to measure it at 1m minimum (who would sit closer than 3 feet to the thing?) The level will drop off very quickly given some distance.

For contrast, I have a Comcast DVR which is pretty "loud" I'd say, and you have to stick the Ratshack meter right up to the exhaust fan to get any kind of reading (50db min). Anything farther away and it doesn't register.

awesome thread, keep it going guys.

I think the fact that PS3 is the best BD player on the market shows how long term Sony was thinking. I cant wait to get mine.

For me, as I am in Europe, BD movies are not main draw, although it might be in the future.
However, the fact that it is pretty good console, with great multimedia features such as ability to play AVC MPEG from my SR1, has great photo show features is what makes it an obvious choice.

Sony went extra cost to give us HDMI, BD, great sound, and many other things (xbox would cost $800 with "similar" features but still without HDMI). Hopefully gamble will pay off for them...

Maybe some of you audio/videophiles could use this tehcnical information.

pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2006/1130/mobile358.htm


Since the standards for BD-ROM such as BDMV and BD-J were delayed, particular player functions were developed later while 2 years has already passed for the development of software decoding function for codecs such as H.264.

H.264 decoding itself was not very difficult for Cell with moderate optimization and they could play a movie in realtime at the first try unlike very difficult SACD optimization. However, because they began the development without knowing the final Blu-ray standard, they set the goal very high for decoding 2 full HD H.264 streams at 40Mbps simultaneously. Besides the clockspeed of the devkit was lower than the final product which made the development difficult. The current decoder can decode full HD H.264 with 3 SPEs.

The current BD/DVD player for the PS3 does internal pixel processing at 16-bit per RGB. (The output depends on the display color depth.) Though the 1.0 firmware was 8-bit per RGB, Kutaragi ordered the change of the design at the final product review and it was upgraded to 16-bit in the 1.1 firmware.

It's still not enough for TV and theater projectors that can display the original YCrCb stored in BD and DVD. For example the current PS3 player lacks gradation in brighter and darker parts of pictures when compared to Panasonic DMP-BD10. The reason why the internal processing is done in RGB is because RSX can't have 2 color spaces at the same time. Honda suspects they used RGB for the player because in the prototype design they planned to overlay XMB in RGB onto the picture of BD/DVD. In the final design XMB is not overlayed onto the player.

Actually Kutaragi also ordered the development of the version with YCrCb internal processing at the final review. In the firmware version released in December it becomes possible for a user to choose RGB or YCrCb.

The current player converts interlace to progressive only for SD movies. Right now SCE developers are working to improve DVD picture quality after they implemented YCrCb. After that it's planned to do something for 1080i to 1080p conversion. Though the RAM size can be an obstacle for it, SCE developers say they can do it by splitting the load between Cell and RSX.

Currently there are complaints from users about non-existent DVD upscaling in the PS3. As for the interlace-to-progressive before upscaling, the current player has it already. There was a team at the division for broadcast equipments at Sony that does research for improving image quality by using the NVIDIA shader language. They ported it onto RSX. After Cell does noise reduction and other filters, RSX does interlace-to-progressive conversion. Though the current algorithm has bugs for some video sources, SCE says the conversion precision will be upgraded by future updates. Also the noise reduction filter is currently optimized for video sources with relatively many MPEG noises recorded with a video recorder. SCE knows lack of picture details because of it and will provide new default values for noise reduction by checking recording formats and media IDs for DVD discs. As for upscaling, they are doing the research to develop a high-quality multi-tap upscaling filter that balances the load between Cell and RSX. They also plan to use the non-original luminance information generated in upscaling for HDMI 1.3 deep color.

Currently it's known that the audio quality of DTS is especially good compared to other audio codecs as heard in playing 480p DVD via HDMI with more bandwidth for the audio. SCE don't know the definitive reason. They just ported the reference source code provided by DTS with as high precision as possible.

An SCE developer recommends trying 1.5x fast-forward playback in the PS3 BD player to see the power of Cell. When it's connected to a display via 1080/60p, it becomes very smooth as Cell has an enough margin for video decoding. In 1.5x fast-forward playback it decodes all frames then inserts them into 60fps with sped up audio.

SCE declared that they'd support 1080/24p in the PS3.

Awesomeness! Did you grab this off B3D Mike? Which is of course the first place I went to after seeing it was a Watch Impress article...

'One' is the man for translations! ;)

(and after checking B3D, I notice this is One's exact translation you're using - which makes perfect sense...)

To add my own commentary, I knew - and have been saying - that the software decoding running via Cell would make the PS3 a versatile and powerful BD player throughout it's entire life. Here already we have indications that SCE is planning:

1) DVD upscaling

2) Color space choice

3) Improved algorithm decode performance

4) and 1080/24 playback support

I'm sure the algorithm improvements/releases will be standard fare at regular intervals as well throughout PS3's life, which is great news and to be expected with a piece of readily firmware upgradeable kit such as the PS3.

still, if you own a 1080p HDTV all BD look better then HD-DVD only because of their lack of of 1080p player. i know the xbox can do it, but that via VGA, so it's compressed and dosent give the full effect.

Oh. My. God.

I don't think I've ever seen so much factually incorrect information in one place before.

I don't know who or what your source of facts is, but..... FIND SOMEONE ELSE.

Egads... the FUDForce(TM) is out tonight...

@Cherokee: Black Hawk Down in MPEG-2 and Kingdom of Heaven in AVC are two of the best looking movies there are out on either format right now. I think you've been drinking too much of the VC-1 kool-aid if you think that the initial Sony MPEG releases are indicative of the state of all things non-VC1. That's not a knock on VC-1 at all, just saying there's a whole set of movies out there that look incredible without it.

Xbdestroya,

I am just calling it as I see it, as I have both systems and could care less about one vs. the other. Someone else pointed out that I rushed my post and that Xmen 3 was in AVC, which is correct. HD DVD is fully 1080p compliant and as somebody also pointed out it makes no difference for film at 24fps.

All I can tell you is not one of the movies I have seen yet, with the exception of Xmen 3 looks anywhere close to the downloaded trailers off of Sony's own playstation store which are encoded in AVC. It is pretty sad when a large part of the future of your company rides on the success of your new video format and your own downloaded trailers off the internet look better than your touted next gen video format that you expect people to spend $1000 on for a stand alone player. From what I have seen so far of BD it is not worth a $200 premium over an upconverting DVD player. Hopefully the next batch of 50 gig movie discs hopefully encoded at a very high bandwidth with a codec like VC1 or AVC will show the true potential of the system. I would never have even bought the PS3 if I didn't know that it would eventually deliver a worthwhile entertainment experience, but Sony is really screwing up the BD launch about as much as they could possibly do. I have not seen Black Hawk Down, so I will give it a look.

Oh. My. God.

I don't think I've ever seen so much factually incorrect information in one place before.

I don't know who or what your source of facts is, but..... FIND SOMEONE ELSE.

Egads... the FUDForce(TM) is out tonight...

Agreed. Format neutrality is the way to go but this nonsense blind baiting loyalty hopefully can run its course soon.

Mike,

Thanks for a great post that gives a lot of hope for improvements to the PS3 BD player capability. I was very impressed with the fast forward performance of the player when compared to the X360. It is much smoother and able to go much faster as well.

@Cherokee: Whatever 'primary' Sony is doing, I think SCE is going to go out of their way to make sure PS3 makes BD look the best it can. Seriously, do check out Black Hawk Down and Kingdom of Heaven before giving your last word on MPEG-2 though.

Mike Jones,

thanks for the most informative post on AVS in about a year.

I picked the right day to visit the board.

pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2006/1130/mobile358.htm

H.264 decoding itself was not very difficult for Cell with moderate optimization and they could play a movie in realtime at the first try

they set the goal very high for decoding 2 full HD H.264 streams at 40Mbps simultaneously.

The current decoder can decode full HD H.264 with 3 SPEs.
(there are 7 or 8 SPEs, plus the RSX with another 256MB of ram)

Currently there are complaints from users about non-existent DVD upscaling in the PS3. As for the interlace-to-progressive before upscaling, the current player has it already.

The current player converts interlace to progressive only for SD movies.

As for upscaling, they are doing the research to develop a high-quality multi-tap upscaling filter that balances the load between Cell and RSX.

Though the RAM size can be an obstacle for it, SCE developers say they can do it by splitting the load between Cell and RSX.

Best 1st post ever. Thanks Mike.

Hey guys, remember to thank this guy as well (if only from a distance) - because it's he that does all of these these translations from Japanese for us, and did so in this case as well:

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36188

They also plan to use the non-original luminance information generated in upscaling for HDMI 1.3 deep color.

Lots of excellent info in there. Good stuff. (Hope it all is true!) Does the above quoted info say that we might see smoother gradiations etc. when a Deep Color display is being used? That would be Uber Cool!

Indeed! Now we just need to see a display that supports HDMI 1.3 and Deep Color...

1. Does the player output 1080i through component for a Standard DVD?

2. Does the player output 1080i through component for a Standard DVD that has been ripped with decrypter or shrink?

Well, let us know your thoughts after you've finished viewing them. :)

(What's your setup by the way?)

My setup is a 32xbr1 720p lcd bravia TV. PS3 is set to 720p output via hdmi cable and audio output via optical to a receiver. I plan on buying a 1080p tv late 2007 or 2008 when the HDMI 1.3 spec is solid in the market. When playing blu ray discs the PS3 "downscales" output to 1080i which my tv is receiving.

As far as the movies are concerned, there is significant improvement over the blu ray version of Talladega Nights. I'm not a videophile by any means, but to my untrained eye Talladega Nights looks drab and grainy compared to Kingdom of Heaven (which is the only one I've watched so far in full). Two scenes really showed me a difference. An early scene where one of the members in the caravan of crusaders (?) picks up a small purple flower off of the ground just before combat, and the combat scene shows the depth of the detail and picture quality in the movie. And also the scene when the actors are heading towards Jerusalem for the first time with the sea and boats in the background and the contrasting colors of the travelers in the foreground really shows off the vibrant colors compared to Talladega Nights.

So after a brief look, it seems like there is significant improvement over the one movie (Talladega Nights) that I had to look at before. However, I still can't get the movies to fill the entire screen and I would ask any expert here to explain to me if that is because this is film-based content or is it because the PS3 is downscaling the image and forcing my tv to re-scale it? Oh, and while on that subject, does anybody with a stand-alone blu ray or hd-dvd player have the issue of horizontal bars at the top and bottom of the screen during playback?

Lastly, all of the over-the-air tv shows broadcast in HD (whether 1080i or 720p) still look better than these blu ray discs and are on par with the downloaded movie trailers from the PS3 store like Click and Black Hawk Down. I think my last order of business will be to watch Black Hawk Down and then compare it to the same scenes in the trailer of the movie and compare still frames for picture quality (the issue of aspect ratio aside).

p.s. If I ever post something that is factually incorrect (whether it's prefaced with qualifiers like "I've read" or "I'm under the impression" etc or not) please feel free to correct me and set me on the right path. I'm still pretty new to all this stuff and I'm no expert :)

Brandon

Good post Brandon. I agree as well about the OTA HD, especially from live football or a high quality site like Discovery HD. I think though that we are really starting to see the difference between the film conversion process to HD vs. native HD content. I believe some of the content on Discovery HD is also film conversion as well. It also probably does not help that most of us are displaying 24fps content at 60 fps. Hopefully one of the next firmware revisions will output 1080i/p at 24fps. It will be real interesting to see how films that are shot with HD cameras will actually look once they get onto BD. The only film I know of is the last Star Wars, but maybe others can point out movies that were shot with HD cameras instead of film.

What we need is UPnP support (DLNA) for the PS3 natively. This is very important to compete in the Living Room against the XBox 360 which has this, and with Vista natively supporting streaming - this becomes even more important in 2007.

Good post Brandon. I agree as well about the OTA HD, especially from live football or a high quality site like Discovery HD. I think though that we are really starting to see the difference between the film conversion process to HD vs. native HD content. I believe some of the content on Discovery HD is also film conversion as well. It also probably does not help that most of us are displaying 24fps content at 60 fps. Hopefully one of the next firmware revisions will output 1080i/p at 24fps. It will be real interesting to see how films that are shot with HD cameras will actually look once they get onto BD. The only film I know of is the last Star Wars, but maybe others can point out movies that were shot with HD cameras instead of film.

Superman Returns was shot with HD cameras.

So after a brief look, it seems like there is significant improvement over the one movie (Talladega Nights) that I had to look at before. However, I still can't get the movies to fill the entire screen and I would ask any expert here to explain to me if that is because this is film-based content or is it because the PS3 is downscaling the image and forcing my tv to re-scale it? Oh, and while on that subject, does anybody with a stand-alone blu ray or hd-dvd player have the issue of horizontal bars at the top and bottom of the screen during playback? First of all, you have to start at least RENTING other BD movies and just watch 'em. X3, Eight Below, Stealth...

Secondly about movies filling up your screen, first read the anamorphic widescreen guide here at TheDigitalbits.com (http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/anamorphic/index.html). READ ALL OF IT and click on the pictures.

Once you've understand that, then you'll understand why your DVDs can be ZOOMED IN but with BDs you can't. That's because the HD video is not stored on BD anamorphically. It is shown as a square pixel. So no unsqueezing and no zooming in like you can do with DVDs.

By "the issue of horizontal bars" I think you mean the letterboxing of films with aspect ratio higher than 16:9. That is normal for BDs and HD-DVDs. You can't escape it. Zooming in, not that it is possible right now, will give you inferior picture. Just like when you zoomed in too far in with DVDs.

Lastly, all of the over-the-air tv shows broadcast in HD (whether 1080i or 720p) still look better than these blu ray discs and are on par with the downloaded movie trailers from the PS3 store like Click and Black Hawk Down. I think my last order of business will be to watch Black Hawk Down and then compare it to the same scenes in the trailer of the movie and compare still frames for picture quality (the issue of aspect ratio aside). You have to watch these movies carefully. Broadcast HD are limited in their video and audio bandwith. BD movies all have variable bitrate instead of constant bitrate of broadcast HD either off-the-air, satellite or cable. Just comparing the audio options alone blows away broadcast HD.

I think though that we are really starting to see the difference between the film conversion process to HD vs. native HD content. I believe some of the content on Discovery HD is also film conversion as well. It also probably does not help that most of us are displaying 24fps content at 60 fps. Hopefully one of the next firmware revisions will output 1080i/p at 24fps. It will be real interesting to see how films that are shot with HD cameras will actually look once they get onto BD. The only film I know of is the last Star Wars, but maybe others can point out movies that were shot with HD cameras instead of film. Click is shot using HD cameras and so was Superman Returns. If you're a fan of Jazz, you can rent Legends of Jazz, shot in 1080i using HD cameras for broadcast. In December and January, you can get Discovery Atlas series by Discovery Channel HD.


fuad

The current BD/DVD player for the PS3 does internal pixel processing at 16-bit per RGB. (The output depends on the display color depth.) Though the 1.0 firmware was 8-bit per RGB, Kutaragi ordered the change of the design at the final product review and it was upgraded to 16-bit in the 1.1 firmware.

It's still not enough for TV and theater projectors that can display the original YCrCb stored in BD and DVD. For example the current PS3 player lacks gradation in brighter and darker parts of pictures when compared to Panasonic DMP-BD10. The reason why the internal processing is done in RGB is because RSX can't have 2 color spaces at the same time. Honda suspects they used RGB for the player because in the prototype design they planned to overlay XMB in RGB onto the picture of BD/DVD. In the final design XMB is not overlayed onto the player.

Actually Kutaragi also ordered the development of the version with YCrCb internal processing at the final review. In the firmware version released in December it becomes possible for a user to choose RGB or YCrCb.

I asked this question in another thread, but what improvement will the choice of YCrCb yield over the current PS3 use of RGB? Will this be an available option if you are connected through HDMI? Does this have anything to do with the PS3 supposedly not passing BTB or WTW currently?

In a decently ventilated area, does the PS3 (after a few hours) bake the discs, or does it stay at a pretty safe temperature? I'd hate to be damaging my Blu-Ray discs in an oven, er... I mean player.

Is the slot loading mechanism easy on the discs as well? No scratches, scuffs, etc.?

With these promised updates for the PS3 I may try to find one now.

Dan

The discs don't overheat - if you look at the internals of the Playstation 3 you'll note that all of the 'hot' items are located on the reverse of a backplate that goes down the center of the system. As for scratches and scuffs and such, I haven't noticed any whatsoever (it's a great slot drive), but then again BD discs are hard to scratch or scuff to begin with due to their hard coating.

Superman Returns was shot with HD cameras.

Dam, I have Superman Returns on my entertainment center right now from Netflix, but I specifically wanted the HD DVD version because the other BD movies I rented looked so poor. Now I really want to see how that looks in BD, so I may have to rent it again.

I just booted up Ice Age 2 in BD for a few minutes to look at the PQ and it looks absolutely amazing and probably the best picture I have seen yet. Maybe that is because it is all CG, but it looks FANTASTIC non the less. I did not even have time to look what codec it uses, but it is every bit as good as any of the Sony trailers on the PS3 store site! Anyone know if it is a BD50 or BD25?

I've posted this in the Yamaha RX-V2600 section of the forum, but should I be using the standard linear PCM audio out on the PS3 via HDMI or switch it to Bitstream?

Ice Age 2 is BD25 on MPEG2. I think the fact that it's all digital to begin with is definitely the reason you can have a perfect transfer with those specs, but a perfect transfer it certainly is.

Linear PCM is probably th eway to go for you on most BD releases, as I know I myself always prefer lossless to non. Plus the PS3's internal decoder should work well for most other encodes unless you really just have to have your receiver do the job - in which case Bitstream on a case by case basis.

Anyone have the hot scoop as to when full 8 channel DTS Master Audio will be implemented in the PS3?

And a fix for BTB and WTW...

Dan

I have to wonder if Sony would (or could) update the entire BD decoding software in the PS3 so that it improved the video quality output just like when you swap out HTPC decoding as they improve the codecs.

Let's say the Pioneer Elite blew the doors off the PS3. Could Sony potentially tweek the software so it meet or beat what the Pioneer (or other competitor) did? It seems like (from the future updates presented here) it is more than capable of doing some very advanced stuff.

Dan

I have to wonder if Sony would (or could) update the entire BD decoding software in the PS3 so that it improved the video quality output just like when you swap out HTPC decoding as they improve the codecs.

Let's say the Pioneer Elite blew the doors off the PS3. Could Sony potentially tweek the software so it meet or beat what the Pioneer (or other competitor) did? It seems like (from the future updates presented here) it is more than capable of doing some very advanced stuff.

Dan

Of course it can (and I say that in all seriousness).

Granted it's hard to say how much of SCE's efforts will be focused around achieving the absolute *best* PQ after these upgrades take place - they've got other things to think about afterall - but I expect semi-regular updates to the decode algorithms throughout PS3's life, that should positively impact PQ as well. So I don't think they'll try to beat the Pioneer or anything, they'll just throw out these upgrades when it's easy enough for them to do so.

Let's say the Pioneer Elite blew the doors off the PS3.

You could say that as a hypothetical, but I can tell you that NOTHING is going to blow the doors off the PS3 as a BD player. I had the Pioneer Elite at my house in my system for two weekends. I now have a PS3 hooked up. Pioneer can keep their $1500 player.

You could say that as a hypothetical, but I can tell you that NOTHING is going to blow the doors off the PS3 as a BD player. I had the Pioneer Elite at my house in my system for two weekends. I now have a PS3 hooked up. Pioneer can keep their $1500 player.

Digital electronics are the ultimate 'equalizer'. Cheaper equipment can be manufactured to obtain the same quality for less money as time goes by............. a fact of life beginning with the first microprocessors.

First of all, you have to start at least RENTING other BD movies and just watch 'em. X3, Eight Below, Stealth...

Secondly about movies filling up your screen, first read the anamorphic widescreen guide here at TheDigitalbits.com (http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/anamorphic/index.html). READ ALL OF IT and click on the pictures.

Once you've understand that, then you'll understand why your DVDs can be ZOOMED IN but with BDs you can't. That's because the HD video is not stored on BD anamorphically. It is shown as a square pixel. So no unsqueezing and no zooming in like you can do with DVDs.

By "the issue of horizontal bars" I think you mean the letterboxing of films with aspect ratio higher than 16:9. That is normal for BDs and HD-DVDs. You can't escape it. Zooming in, not that it is possible right now, will give you inferior picture. Just like when you zoomed in too far in with DVDs.

You have to watch these movies carefully. Broadcast HD are limited in their video and audio bandwith. BD movies all have variable bitrate instead of constant bitrate of broadcast HD either off-the-air, satellite or cable. Just comparing the audio options alone blows away broadcast HD.

Click is shot using HD cameras and so was Superman Returns. If you're a fan of Jazz, you can rent Legends of Jazz, shot in 1080i using HD cameras for broadcast. In December and January, you can get Discovery Atlas series by Discovery Channel HD.


fuad

Thanks for the input and references. And I am renting movies as we speak, that's what I was pointing out earlier. But I just signed up for Netflix 3 days ago so it takes time ;)

Brandon

All I can tell you is not one of the movies I have seen yet, with the exception of Xmen 3 looks anywhere close to the downloaded trailers off of Sony's own playstation store which are encoded in AVC.

This is a fallacy, as the trailers on the Playstation Store aren't even 1080p. Go into the playback menu while a video plays and select "original" screen size instead of "normal". On my 1080p display, the video goes smaller, showing a 1280x720 image inside of the full 1920x1080. The video also becomes sharper because it's no longer zooming to fill the screen. On my 110" screen the resolution loss is apparent and undeniable. These trailers are nowhere near as good as what I've seen so far on BD since purchasing the PS3, which for good measure consists of the following:

Kingdom of Heaven
Blackhawk Down
Ice Age 2
Corpse Bride
Monster House
Unforgiven
Superman Returns
Xmen 3

I asked this question in another thread, but what improvement will the choice of YCrCb yield over the current PS3 use of RGB? Will this be an available option if you are connected through HDMI? Does this have anything to do with the PS3 supposedly not passing BTB or WTW currently?
The color space of RGB is different than that of YCrCb, so some colors coming from YCrCb may not be valid in the RGB color space, at least that is my current understanding. Therefore, when converting you have to pick a close color, not an exact one. I can't tell you how noticeable it would be.

The color space of RGB is different than that of YCrCb, so some colors coming from YCrCb may not be valid in the RGB color space, at least that is my current understanding. Therefore, when converting you have to pick a close color, not an exact one. I can't tell you how noticeable it would be.Currently, the PS3 only offers RGB output. Since most displays expect YCrCb over HDMI, blacker-than-black (BTB) and peak white values are crushed, and some loss of shadow detail results. The updated software with YCrCb output should address this issue.

Here's the link: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=760612

Its kind of like a predictive market, inspired by Inkling

In a decently ventilated area, does the PS3 (after a few hours) bake the discs, or does it stay at a pretty safe temperature? I'd hate to be damaging my Blu-Ray discs in an oven, er... I mean player.


I don't have any games for mine yet so I can't answer from that point of view. I have watched a few movies though and when finished the discs are not even mildly warm to the touch. I was a little surprised by this. I've also got a Toshiba HD-A1 HD DVD player and the discs come out quite warm from that, though I've never had overheating problems there either. I have my PS3 in my A/V stand with about 2 inches clearance above and 5 inches to either side.



Is the slot loading mechanism easy on the discs as well? No scratches, scuffs, etc.?



I haven't had any problems yet. I don't particularly like slot loading mechanisms, but I guess if it doesn't cause a problem then I shouldn't worry about it.

Currently, the PS3 only offers RGB output. Since most displays expect YCrCb over HDMI, blacker-than-black (BTB) and peak white values are crushed, and some loss of shadow detail results. The updated software with YCrCb output should address this issue.

That's what I was looking for. Thanks, bfdtv. Should be a great update this December.

Do you happen to know if the DTS-HD MA update you mention frequently will be included with the December update or is that still early next year?

Question from a brand new PS3 user:

OK--I got my PS3 this week and my audio receiver does not have an HDMI input, so I am using the digital optical connection. When I went to watch my brand new Blu-ray copy of "Monster House," the audio being output by the PS3 is only 2 channel. I tried both the regular and uncompressed 5.1 English audio tracks, but they both hit the receiver as 2.0 channels. Will my PS3 only give me surround sound when I buy a new receiver that has an HDMI input? I also have the HD drive for the 360, and it remixes/downconverts TrueHD audio to a 5.1 that my receiver will play via the optical connection. It might not sound as good as TrueHD but it's a lot better than a mere 2.0 mix. I assumed that the PS3 would do the same with BR lossless audio, but either I am wrong or I'm not doing something correctly.

I did go into the audio setup menu on the PS3 and check the DD and DTS 5.1 output options, but it is still only sending 2.0 to the receiver. And I have the 1.11 system update as well, if that matters.

Will the PS3 really not give you 5.1 surround via digital optical? I would really appreciate any advice you might have. Thanks for helping an ignoramus!

Question from a brand new PS3 user:

I did go into the audio setup menu on the PS3 and check the DD and DTS 5.1 output options, but it is still only sending 2.0 to the receiver. And I have the 1.11 system update as well, if that matters.

Will the PS3 really not give you 5.1 surround via digital optical? I would really appreciate any advice you might have. Thanks for helping an ignoramus!

I suspect the problem may be your choice optical output protocol. The PS3 gives you two options, Bitstream and LPCM. Try changing that protocol to "Bitstream".

Hope that helps.

SJYANG

I suspect the problem may be your choice optical output protocol. The PS3 gives you two options, Bitstream and LPCM. Try changing that protocol to "Bitstream".

Hope that helps.

SJYANG

Awesome! It worked! I had to look around to find where that option was available, but when I found it and switched over to bitstream it worked immediately. Thanks for the advice!! I wish the guide/manual went into a little more detail--I have no idea what any of the buttons on the controller do during movie playback. But at least the sound works now! After my kids finish "Monster House" I am going to watch "Kingdom of Heaven." Thanks again for you help!

This is a fallacy, as the trailers on the Playstation Store aren't even 1080p. Go into the playback menu while a video plays and select "original" screen size instead of "normal". On my 1080p display, the video goes smaller, showing a 1280x720 image inside of the full 1920x1080. The video also becomes sharper because it's no longer zooming to fill the screen. On my 110" screen the resolution loss is apparent and undeniable. These trailers are nowhere near as good as what I've seen so far on BD since purchasing the PS3, which for good measure consists of the following:

Kingdom of Heaven
Blackhawk Down
Ice Age 2
Corpse Bride
Monster House
Unforgiven
Superman Returns
Xmen 3

Don't say this is a fallacy just because your experience doesn't match others. I have a totally different TV setup, which is an Hitachi rear projection 480p, 720p and 1080i set. Also the PS3 and my HDMI switching receiver are set for 720p for games and I believe it stays at that setting for the trailer content if the source is 720p. It auto switches down to 480p for PS2 games.

Experts on this site (of which I am not) and other sites have confirmend that a bunch of the early BD releases looked very poor compared to HD DVD. You can say whatever you want, but the trailer for Ultraviolet and Underworld blew away the first BD movies I watched. I rented Syriana, Lake House and 16 blocks in BD and of course Talledega nights and all looked pretty poor compared to the trailers and HD DVD titles I watched. I just watched a few minutes of Ice Age 2 and it looked fantastic even though it was BD25 in MPEG2, so obviously other factors matter. I was also happy with Xmen3 and I hope to rent most of the others on your list and hope they look much better. I am simply stating the PQ quality on the BD movies has been highly variable to date. In fact I saw somebody on this site break the movies into different quality classes based on the PQ, so obviously I am not the only one to notice this.

Question: I just brought in my PS3 to work, work for a techie Health Care company and everyone wanted to see it. Games looked great, although SuperMan looked horrible, I think the HDMI cable I had is very old and not good at all, because at home it looked very good on my Sharp 720p set, this was a Samsung runing 1080p. Parts of the picture looked very graining with a ton of digital artifacting, I have heard nothing but good things about the transfer on this movie but this wasn't good, and I think it was a connection problem.

Experts on this site (of which I am not) and other sites have confirmend that a bunch of the early BD releases looked very poor compared to HD DVD. You can say whatever you want, but the trailer for Ultraviolet and Underworld blew away the first BD movies I watched.

But your previous statement was a blanket criticism of BD as a whole. I have not seen the early releases, so I can't comment, but Blu-Ray has been putting out stellar HD content since. Every bit as good as HD DVD (of which I have experience also) and definitely better than those trailers. As with HD DVD, there are some duds. But for the most part, it's all good and I'm sure will get even better. I suspect that soon, the botched launch will be a distant memory for most --- then, what will people criticize?

Well, I'm sure they'll find something. :)

JustBKatz: Well I am hoping it was a setting our a crappy cable, but Superman looked liked complete crap..... Ironically it didn't at home using my componet cables, something tells me these cheapo HDMI that came with my Denon player are for crap.... I hope...

Sony will release new fimware 12/7
This fimware include deep color( 48bit) and YCbCr out function.
You can select RGB or YCbCr.

Sony will release new fimware 12/7
This fimware include deep color( 48bit) and YCbCr out function.
You can select RGB or YCbCr.

I'm assuming by the "firmness" of your statement with any "I heard" qualifiers you are someone that would actually know this. If that is correct, would you be willing to comment on when we might expect an update to allow for 1080/24p playback of BD?

I'm assuming by the "firmness" of your statement with any "I heard" qualifiers you are someone that would actually know this. If that is correct, would you be willing to comment on when we might expect an update to allow for 1080/24p playback of BD?


new feature is following:
1. SACD play (now 24bit/192Khz S/N 140dn -> 24bit/192Khz S/N 170db)
2. CD Quality incress (16bit/48Khz)
3. YCbCr HDMI output
4.1080P/24 support(but i am not sure)

In future, PS3 have 1080i to 1080P de-interlace(for Japan BS highvision play)
and DVD upscaling

You could say that as a hypothetical, but I can tell you that NOTHING is going to blow the doors off the PS3 as a BD player. I had the Pioneer Elite at my house in my system for two weekends. I now have a PS3 hooked up. Pioneer can keep their $1500 player.
the ps3 is a better blu ray player? the picture quality is that good?

new feature is following:
1. SACD play (now 24bit/192Khz S/N 140dn -> 24bit/192Khz S/N 170db)
2. CD Quality incress (16bit/48Khz)
3. YCbCr HDMI output
4.1080P/24 support(but i am not sure)

In future, PS3 have 1080i to 1080P de-interlace(for Japan BS highvision play)
and DVD upscaling

What about DTS-HD MA decoding?

I am going HDMI out of the PS3 to a DVI input in a projector. Will I still be able to take advantage of the new firmware upgrade to choose YCbCr and see the expanded color range? Or, does DVI limit me in any way?

DVI won't do Deep Color if Sony enhances the PS3 with that ability. Most people will need new TV's for that anyway.

The PQ to me on a 61" Samsung 1080p DLP RPTV looked almost (if not) identical to the Panasonic and not far behind the Pioneer. Of course, the Pioneer was outputting 24 fps on their new plasma.

I can't get Legends of Jazz to play on my PS3 (it's the only title out now with Dolby TrueHD)! Everything else seems to.

Dan

Here is some news.
Sony's PlayStation 3 may be getting an update to fix the currently problematic 1080p at 24fps, component out, and the ability to upscale DVDs to 1080p.

HDMI 1.3 still needs some work
According to a translated Impress interview of Sony PS3 A/V developers, the PS3 is on target for an update to add better software SACD support (better sound quality and wider dynamic range), user-selectable internal YCrCb image processing, 1080p/24 support for films (for crisper, more realistic Blu-ray film playback), and perhaps most importantly, the ability to play back standard-definition DVDs at 1080p HD resolution.

Although the PS3 includes HDMI 1.3, which supposedly supports 1080p/24, the technology is still unstable. This upcoming update should address these problems.

the ps3 is a better blu ray player? the picture quality is that good?

I'm not sure I could say the PS3 is "better" than the Pioneer. More specific testing would be necessary for that. However, I am very comfortable saying the PS3 is good enough to be on par with the Pioneer right now for picture quality alone. Can't compare audio support between the two right now as the Pioneer that is out there is preproduction and audio is not finalized.

Also, the PS3 is apparently going to be updated very soon to allow YCbCr colorspace, which would be more desirable for BD playback, as well as allowing 1080/24p playback. With these updates alone, I could easily speculate the PS3 will match or exceed the Pioneer as far as basic Blu-ray playback. Video parameters aside, the PS3 is blazingly fast compared to every other HD player I have seen, and I happen to be growing very fond of the user interface. Hell, I'm even learning to like using the game controller as a remote.

For simple operation, the PS3 seems to be just about bulletproof. With a number of hours of loading/unloading discs for evaluation, skipping around discs and menus, as well as watching a couple of movies uninterrupted, the PS3 has yet to freeze, pause, skip, dropout, or anything else it shouldn't do.

Yes, I'm liking this machine as a Blu-ray player very much.

Tcpipkim - where have you been?

That 'news' is the very thing we're discussing here now! ;)

Also, the PS3 is apparently going to be updated very soon to allow YCbCr colorspace, which would be more desirable for BD playback, as well as allowing 1080/24p playback.

Quick question. Will the YCbCr colorspace update impact component and hdmi output, or is it only HDMI output?

Brandon

I am planning on buying a PS3 and I have a question regarding audio connections. I tried to find the answer in this thread, but I found posts which seemed to me to give conflicting opinions! So, here is my question.

I have a 5.1 Dolby Digital only (no DTS decoder) amplifier with no HDMI input, just optical and standard analog inputs. It seems that I will not be able to listen to uncompressed audio. But will I be able, with a PS3, to listen to the compressed audio in 5.1?

Thanks for the help!

But will I be able, with a PS3, to listen to the compressed audio in 5.1?Yes.

Every Blu-ray disk also includes a compressed track with Dolby Digital @ 640Kbps or DTS @ 1.5Mbps. This is still an improvement over DVD, which used Dolby Digital @ 448Kbps.

Thank you very much! And what should I then choose on the PS3, linear PCM or Bitstream?

Ok, my question: does the uncompressed 5.1 PCM audio only output only via HDMI? The PS3 doesn't have a 5.1 analog breakout cable or similar does it? I have no HDMI connectors on my prepro so when I get a PS3 it will have to be connected via the optical out.

... PS3 ...
Yes, I'm liking this machine as a Blu-ray player very much.

When it comes to strictly using a PS3 as a Blu-ray player, with no game use intended, is there any difference between the two PS3 models that would affect their use as a player?

Would a Harmony 880 remote work with the PS3 for playing B-R discs?

TIA

Ok, my question: does the uncompressed 5.1 PCM audio only output only via HDMI?That is correct.

The PS3 doesn't have a 5.1 analog breakout cable or similar does it?Nope, and it never will. As a cost-cutting measure, Sony did not include the DACs necessary to support 5.1 analog output.

I have no HDMI connectors on my prepro so when I get a PS3 it will have to be connected via the optical out.It sounds like you need to start planning for an upgrade.

Based on my tests, the uncompressed audio track output via HDMI to a $275 receiver will substantially outperform a $2500 receiver connected via optical/coax, assuming you have speakers without extraordinary power requirements.

Just found a ps3 today. Hooked it up and popped in Ice Age, Rickky Bobby, and RR7. All three seem to have washed out blacks. Hooked my hd dvd player up to the same input and the blacks are rock solid. The ps3 is hooked up HDMI to HDMI. Anybody else seem to have this problem .

Based on my tests, the uncompressed audio track output via HDMI to a $275 receiver will substantially outperform a $2500 receiver connected via optical/coax, assuming you have speakers without extraordinary power requirements.

Very interesting. But does the optical output stereo, or 5.1 sound?

Just found a ps3 today. Hooked it up and popped in Ice Age, Rickky Bobby, and RR7. All three seem to have washed out blacks. Hooked my hd dvd player up to the same input and the blacks are rock solid. The ps3 is hooked up HDMI to HDMI. Anybody else seem to have this problem .As noted in the PS3 Objective Measurements (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=757137) thread, the current output colorspace is RGB, and won't pass blacker than black or peak white values. The next software update for the PS3 will reportedly address that issue.

Just found a ps3 today. Hooked it up and popped in Ice Age, Rickky Bobby, and RR7. All three seem to have washed out blacks. Hooked my hd dvd player up to the same input and the blacks are rock solid. The ps3 is hooked up HDMI to HDMI. Anybody else seem to have this problem .

While bfdtv pointed you to the objective measurments thread about the clipping that should be fixed soon, I'm guessing since you mentioned Ridge Racer you mean your blacks are a washed-out gray, not that your blacks are crushed. Is this correct?

When it comes to strictly using a PS3 as a Blu-ray player, with no game use intended, is there any difference between the two PS3 models that would affect their use as a player?

No, none that I can find. From my research, the differences the extra $100 (or whatever you pay on Ebay) buys are the larger harddrive, built-in wi-fi, and a media card reader. None of these are related to BD-ROM playback. All other features/specs appear to be identical.

BTW, I am already looking for a larger HDD for the 20 GB unit I bought. I didn't realize the thing would rip CDs to the HDD and is actually a pretty damn good audio player. Not that the 60 GB model would have satisfied me either. I'm looking for at least 80 GB.

No, none that I can find. From my research, the differences the extra $100 (or whatever you pay on Ebay) buys are the larger harddrive, built-in wi-fi, and a media card reader. None of these are related to BD-ROM playback. All other features/specs appear to be identical.

BTW, I am already looking for a larger HDD for the 20 GB unit I bought. I didn't realize the thing would rip CDs to the HDD and is actually a pretty damn good audio player. Not that the 60 GB model would have satisfied me either. I'm looking for at least 80 GB.

A friend of mine already upgraded to a 160GB hard drive. He says it's the same drive as the one in the PS3 (seagate manufactured) just the bigger size. I'll try and see where he got it and what the prices are, because I'm assuming that a 160GB 2.5" hard drive costs quite a pretty penny.

Anyway, he said it was about a 5 minute process and worked seamlessly, save for stripping the screw that keeps the hard drive in place.

Brandon

I found a 100 GB Toshiba with a 16 MB cache (8 MB seems to be the average) SATA drive at newegg.com for under a hundred bucks. Unless someone tells me Toshiba makes a crappy drive, I think I'll order that one.

I upgraded my drive last week from the 20GB inclusion to a 120GB Toshiba. (8MB, 5400RPM)

By the way, the 20GB drive is a 2MB cache drive, whereas the 60GB is 8MB; this makes a big difference in performance, so those with 20's, although you/we were probably more likely to upgrade in the first place, the reasons go beyond size alone...

Anyway Robert the one you're looking at and the one I got are the same price (got it from Newegg as well), and you might as well go for it. 8-->16 in cache won't have as dramatic an effect a 2-->8, but in certain tasks it will run faster. If you ever install Linux, let me know and we can do a benchmark test your drive vs mine; that should give us a sense of exactly what the speed-up is from 8 to 16.

I have my PS3 hooked up to my VPL-VW50 and I have been experiencing HDMI video drops as I use optical for my audio. I posted in the PS3 gaming forums, but I thought I may have better luck here. Anyone else experience these HDMI video drops? I have had this happen on two different PS3's so im think the cable or the projector?

I have my PS3 hooked up to my VPL-VW50 and I have been experiencing HDMI video drops as I use optical for my audio. I posted in the PS3 gaming forums, but I thought I may have better luck here. Anyone else experience these HDMI video drops? I have had this happen on two different PS3's so im think the cable or the projector?

I also use this projector with a 50' HDMI cable from an AV receiver with HDMI switching. My experience is quite the opposite. Not only am I not getting any sort of dropouts, but I also do not get dropouts using another 50' HDMI cable I was previously using that did have dropouts using the Samsung player.

When I added the Samsung player to my system several weeks ago, switching to 1080/60p caused what I call "nits", which appear to be single horizontal rows of pixels dropping out randomly throughout the screen. I bought a new, amplified cable and my problem disappeared. Last night, when trying to update the firmware on ther PS3, I had to move the player into my study where my PC and router are to get a hardwired connection. To monitor what I was doing, I pulled out the older cable and conected the PS3 to the projector. With the PS3 in 1080p, no dropouts.

So, I suspect your problem is the cable, unless something else is not right. If the console and projector are working properly, I don't think they are the problem.

I upgraded my drive last week from the 20GB inclusion to a 120GB Toshiba. (8MB, 5400RPM)

How much difference in performance, or possible noise, between a 2.5" drive that is 5400 rpm and one that is 7200 rpm?

Very interesting. But does the optical output stereo, or 5.1 sound?
obviously it outputs 5.1, but compressed, while HDMI outputs uncompressed source, hence much better sound...

Thanks spwolf for your answer. It seems I have no choice but to use the optical output, because my amplifier does not have HMDI input. As for the video, I was planning on using HDMI but I have read in another thread that the PS3 apparently does not want (for whatever reason) to deliver 5.1 sound through another output than the HDMI once the HDMI is in use. I may therefore have to use components for video!

Running HDMI for Video.
Running Optical for Audio.

Multichannel works fine for legacy codecs.

How much difference in performance, or possible noise, between a 2.5" drive that is 5400 rpm and one that is 7200 rpm?

Everything I have read so far indicates you do not want the 7200 rpm due to heat issues and the fact you will not notice much difference between the two in performance. Stay with a 5400rpm drive. :cool:

I upgraded my drive last week from the 20GB inclusion to a 120GB Toshiba. (8MB, 5400RPM)

By the way, the 20GB drive is a 2MB cache drive, whereas the 60GB is 8MB; this makes a big difference in performance, so those with 20's, although you/we were probably more likely to upgrade in the first place, the reasons go beyond size alone...

Anyway Robert the one you're looking at and the one I got are the same price (got it from Newegg as well), and you might as well go for it. 8-->16 in cache won't have as dramatic an effect a 2-->8, but in certain tasks it will run faster. If you ever install Linux, let me know and we can do a benchmark test your drive vs mine; that should give us a sense of exactly what the speed-up is from 8 to 16.

Where did you buy your drive? Newegg.com has it for $89.99 plus shipping. Buy.com has it for $88.00 or so shipped after the $20 off $50.00.

I also use this projector with a 50' HDMI cable from an AV receiver with HDMI switching. My experience is quite the opposite. Not only am I not getting any sort of dropouts, but I also do not get dropouts using another 50' HDMI cable I was previously using that did have dropouts using the Samsung player.

When I added the Samsung player to my system several weeks ago, switching to 1080/60p caused what I call "nits", which appear to be single horizontal rows of pixels dropping out randomly throughout the screen. I bought a new, amplified cable and my problem disappeared. Last night, when trying to update the firmware on ther PS3, I had to move the player into my study where my PC and router are to get a hardwired connection. To monitor what I was doing, I pulled out the older cable and conected the PS3 to the projector. With the PS3 in 1080p, no dropouts.

So, I suspect your problem is the cable, unless something else is not right. If the console and projector are working properly, I don't think they are the problem.

I am trying a new HDMI cable right now. So far so good, but we will see. I figure it has to be the cable (hopefully not the projector) because what are the odds that two PS3's would exhibit this problem?

Would a Harmony 880 remote work with the PS3 for playing B-R discs?

No it will not. The 880 is an IR remote which is the standard for most electronics, but the PS3 uses bluetooth.

Where did you buy your drive? Newegg.com has it for $89.99 plus shipping. Buy.com has it for $88.00 or so shipped after the $20 off $50.00.

Well, I actually mentioned in my post I got it from Newegg, so... I got it from Newegg. ;)

Anyway I'm not down with the Google Checkout just yet via Buy.com as my girlfriend recentlly ran into issues with it, but truthfully I didn't check it either. I used to shop the price a little more than I do now... I guess I've just become too Newegg complacent. But that's definitely a good price though after Google discount.

wow

How much difference in performance, or possible noise, between a 2.5" drive that is 5400 rpm and one that is 7200 rpm?
Robert, I've used laptops recently with 3 different 7200rpm hard drives upgrades: two different new Seagate drives and a new Hitachi, all 8MB.

One of the machines was upgraded from a 8MB, 4200 rpm drive, the other two were from 8MB, 5400 rpm machines.

The speed difference is very noticeable on the laptops in all three devices. Sorry, I didn't benchmark the machine. The 4200rpm upgraded device feels like a new computer.

However, the point of my post: all three 7200rpm drives are much more audible than the drives they replaced. The spinning of the platters at 7200rpm is actually very noticeable. I don't know how loud the PS3 is, but from what I've heard, I'd image most 7200rpm drives will make it a tad bit louder.

The head mechanisms on all these drives are very quiet (like most modern HDs), but the constant rotation is very noticeable on a laptop. It sounds like a dull fan. I don't know if this will affect your decision.

I'm buying a 20GB PS3 in January hopefully, and will probably put a larger 5400rpm, 16MB drive in it. There is the Serial ATA Toshiba MK1032GSX at Newegg for $95 shipped right now, but no user reviews yet.

No it will not. The 880 is an IR remote which is the standard for most electronics, but the PS3 uses bluetooth.
Well, the good news is that the PS3 controller can function normally through the front USB ports.

So, Pelican or Mad Catz will probably have an IR remote control + USB IR receiver module shortly that mimics the main buttons of the PS3 controller. They had them for the PS2. So, when those come out, use the IR receiver in any open USB spot, steal the codes from the remote and use them with your Harmony or other programmable remote.

Still what a pain.

There is the Serial ATA Toshiba MK1032GSX at Newegg for $95 shipped right now, but no user reviews yet.

Yep, that's the one I ordered. The PS3 is already hot enough and loud enough. I don't need a hotter, louder HDD to make it any worse.

All I really plan to use the HDD for is storing and playing music. I'm confident a 5400 rpm drive with 16 MG of cache will be able to handle that. :)

well after reading about how good the ps3 is in terms of blu-ray playback i finally broke down and ordered one. Wish i would have had time to camp out for one but oh well, ebay prices are much more reasonable now.

should have it here by thurs...got some movies already queued up with netflix...oh the excitement.

HD neutrality is mine...

Well, I actually mentioned in my post I got it from Newegg, so... I got it from Newegg. ;)

Anyway I'm not down with the Google Checkout just yet via Buy.com as my girlfriend recentlly ran into issues with it, but truthfully I didn't check it either. I used to shop the price a little more than I do now... I guess I've just become too Newegg complacent. But that's definitely a good price though after Google discount.

LOL...too much internet yesterday. Eyes were worn out!!! :)

Yep, that's the one I ordered. The PS3 is already hot enough and loud enough. I don't need a hotter, louder HDD to make it any worse.

All I really plan to use the HDD for is storing and playing music. I'm confident a 5400 rpm drive with 16 MG of cache will be able to handle that. :)

There must be issues with some of the PS3's on the market. Some people indicate their machine is loud while others say they can hardly hear it. My machine purrs like a kitten so to speak so I am not sure what is going on with some of the players where the reports are coming back they are running loud. :cool:

I think some people just have different definitions of what 'loud' is. For some of the A/V set, if it's audible at all, it's loud. For the videogaming/PC set, it's silent. I think we're all hearing the same level of noise from the PS3, we're just perceiving it differently.

There must be issues with some of the PS3's on the market. Some people indicate their machine is loud while others say they can hardly hear it. My machine purrs like a kitten so to speak so I am not sure what is going on with some of the players where the reports are coming back they are running loud.There will always be some variation in heat dissipation due to differences between Cell and GPU parts, but I think ventilation and distance are probably the main factors for those that report higher PS3 noise.

With inadequate ventilation, the PS3's fan switches into high mode (with a corresponding level of noise) on a much more frequent basis. Most non-gamers have probably never heard the PS3 with its fan on high.

Some HT systems have other noise sources that "drown out" the noise from the PS3; in my case, I have the PS3 in a well-ventilated spot and can't hear it over the drone from my Samsung DLP (color wheel) and Motorola DVR; if I turn the DLP off, I can hear the PS3, even from 8 feet away. I imagine some have the PS3 in an equipment rack just 2-3 feet from their ears.

New news.
PS3 can extend max 720GB HDD.
but now, there is no 720GB HDD with 2.5 inch

Hmm. I wonder if Sony is ever going to fix the no BD playback @ 720p issue?

Hmm. I wonder if Sony is ever going to fix the no BD playback @ 720p issue?

Wait a minute. I just ordered one to use with my 720p projector. You mean it won't downscale BD playback to 720p? Sorry, I'm just in a little shock.

so now we need some crazy person to buy a 32gb or 64gb Solid-State Disk that is SATA and plug it into their PS3

http://www.dvnation.com/nand-flash-ssd.html

Wait a minute. I just ordered one to use with my 720p projector. You mean it won't downscale BD playback to 720p? Sorry, I'm just in a little shock.

Correct. You need to tell the PS3 that your maximum resolution is 1080i and then let your projector do the scaling down to 720p. Hopefully your particular projector does a nice job of this.

Correct. You need to tell the PS3 that your maximum resolution is 1080i and then let your projector do the scaling down to 720p. Hopefully your particular projector does a nice job of this.Actually, you don't need to tell your PS3 anything. As long as you have your top resolution set at 720p it will automatically output BD @ 1080i.

Apparently the Japanese 1.0 revision output @ 720p, but was removed afterwards, so there is hope they'll fix this. We just have to keep complaining.

By the way, the 20GB drive is a 2MB cache drive, whereas the 60GB is 8MB; this makes a big difference in performance, so those with 20's, although you/we were probably more likely to upgrade in the first place, the reasons go beyond size alone...


Where did you find this out? Sony makes no mention of this.

Correct. You need to tell the PS3 that your maximum resolution is 1080i and then let your projector do the scaling down to 720p. Hopefully your particular projector does a nice job of this.


That's terrible. In any case even if they did implement downscaling to 720p who knows if it would be better than what my projector does? However I would expect that with all the processing power of the PS3 they could implement something better than what my projector (Mits HD1000u) can do.

It seems that in some sense the PS3 launched quite unfinished. There are so many things we are expecting with firmware revisions. The good thing it seems is that as much as I hate Kutaragi and his utter arrogance, it seems that he is keen on pushing for uncompromised Blu-Ray playback on the PS3. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

I guess someone will buy my 20GB model for $450 even next March just in case.

Where did you find this out? Sony makes no mention of this.

It's crazy how you can find things out even without official releases, isn't it? :rolleyes:

Anyway don't act so surprised; what drive manufacturer in their right mind would waste 8MB of cache on an outmoded drive capacity?

This is the drive model of the 20GB HDD... which of course I can verify personally, since it's right here in front of me after swapping it out.

http://www.span.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=56&products_id=8162&osCsid=05eb30ddd2450d1c61044fcbffb7f238

Like I said though, the 60GB unit is 8MB. I'm not the first mention of this either - Impress Watch has already determined and published this fact as of several weeks ago.

Are there any visual differences between 720p from component vs 720p from HDMI? I mean HDMI is a full digital signal, and component converts to analog, but 720p is 720p, right?

I'm asking because when I hook my PS3 up to my HDTV with an HDMI cable, I get this red colored fog (or red bloom) all over the place. Does this seem like an PS3, HDTV, or HDMI cable issue? Has anyone seen or heard of a similar issue? Suggestions?

In the meantime I've got it hooked up via component, which displays 720p and looks just fine. But I have this nagging feeling that without the color issue HDMI would look slightly crisper...am i wrong?

BD supporters, here's a petition to benefit us all.

Let's ask neutral studios to re-encode separately for 50 GB BD titles instead of using the HD encode. The PQ improvement should be noticable.

Make your way to http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=763004 and sign up (or pan it, as you wish)

Are there any visual differences between 720p from component vs 720p from HDMI? I mean HDMI is a full digital signal, and component converts to analog, but 720p is 720p, right?

I'm asking because when I hook my PS3 up to my HDTV with an HDMI cable, I get this red colored fog (or red bloom) all over the place. Does this seem like an PS3, HDTV, or HDMI cable issue? Has anyone seen or heard of a similar issue? Suggestions?

In the meantime I've got it hooked up via component, which displays 720p and looks just fine. But I have this nagging feeling that without the color issue HDMI would look slightly crisper...am i wrong?There is no 720p BD output, just 1080i, from both HDMI and component.

Let's ask neutral studios to re-encode separately for 50 GB BD titles instead of using the HD encode. The PQ improvement should be noticable.Over in the Insiders thread, individuals working at the post-production studios (to create transfers for HD-DVD and BD) have already said there would be no such improvement. They've said if there were any differences, they wouldn't exist for more than a few seconds during the course of a feature length film.

I think your effort would be better spent on pushing all studios to use 24/48 TrueHD or DTS-HD MA tracks like FOX, rather than lower fidelity 16/48 LPCM. There's also no reason that a BD50 release should have 16/48 audio, yet many do.

I'm asking because when I hook my PS3 up to my HDTV with an HDMI cable, I get this red colored fog (or red bloom) all over the place. Does this seem like an PS3, HDTV, or HDMI cable issue? Has anyone seen or heard of a similar issue? Suggestions?


The red colored fog that you are getting is a HDMI compatibility issue. I use to get that with my older LCD TV and some sources. Can you change the color sampling on your TV? That is how I resolved my issues.

Yes, I'm liking this machine as a Blu-ray player very much.

Well in no small part due to your comments I just picked up a 60GB PS3 from ebay for only a 1/2 pound of flesh and not the full pound. :D I was determined to wait for the Pioneer but after the raves on the PS3 playback ability I can't hold back.

Count me in among those that purchased for BD playback and not for gaming. Time to research and find out what titles are worth owning.

Over in the Insiders thread, individuals working at the post-production studios (to create transfers for HD-DVD and BD) have already said there would be no such improvement. They've said if there were any differences, they wouldn't exist for more than a few seconds during the course of a feature length film.Couldn't hurt though. No reason to leave 10Mbps on the table.

As far as picture quality is concerned, we have seen new VC-1 encodes to have better quality than the earlier ones (going by what I have read) -- more visually transparent than earlier ones according to some, if that is possible. This goes against what some insiders were saying.

My logic tells me that extra 10Mbps should be better. It is always good to use the bandwidth if it is available, IMO, especially since capacity is there on 50GB.

I am not against Audio petition either, but less interested! :)

The red colored fog that you are getting is a HDMI compatibility issue. I use to get that with my older LCD TV and some sources. Can you change the color sampling on your TV? That is how I resolved my issues.

Not sure. I'm in Taiwan with a Toshiba 32HL86, and I can't find any english reviews or advanced info. Currently I only have control over the minimal settings from the TV menu, and that doesn't help much.

Any ideas on how I could access color sampling controls?

I just have ONE question. Will PS3 Decode DD TruHD 5.1 7.1, and DTS-HD 5.1 7.1 into PCM ?

If not will it be able to output the signal Via HDMI for a receiver to decode?

hi voters and readers,

Based on feedback and suggestions, the poll has been re-written to provide better choices for the voters.

Please make your way to http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=763476 and vote.

cheers,
WHD

I just have ONE question. Will PS3 Decode DD TruHD 5.1 7.1 It does. Though there is only one title that uses TrueHD on BD and the PS3 doesn't seem to want to read it (Legends of Jazz Showcase).

, and DTS-HD 5.1 7.1 into PCM ? Not yet. Maybe next firmware.

If not will it be able to output the signal Via HDMI for a receiver to decode? Yes to both. TrueHD for HDMI 1.2. DTS HDMA for HDMI 1.3. Currently there are no receivers that can decode either TrueHD or HDMA.


fuad

I have my PS3 hooked up to my VPL-VW50 and I have been experiencing HDMI video drops as I use optical for my audio. I posted in the PS3 gaming forums, but I thought I may have better luck here. Anyone else experience these HDMI video drops? I have had this happen on two different PS3's so im think the cable or the projector?

I just got my PS3 (20G) yesterday. first thing I did was hook it up via HDMI to my VPL-VW50. I got tired of staring at a black screen, so I decided to read the PS3's manual. I connected the composite to the projector and went thru the initialization steps. I figured the two SONY components must work together, so I blamed the HDMI cables. 3 diferent HDMI cables of various lengths later. I was convinced the PS3 is at fault.

I also have an iMac and so I used those same 3 HDMI interconnects. iMac showed a most beautiful image when I connected to the VPL-VW50. No preferences, no nothing, it just worked!

You have video drops but I have no video at all when I use HDMI. I do get surround out of the PS3's toslink.

I wish someone would tell me I did something wrong and point me in the right direction. So I can watch all those Blue-Ray movies Netflix has just shipped out to me.

-=cisco=-

I had same problem. You need to specify HDMI output. The PS3 defaults to composite out of the box. Using the composite cable, just use the menu go to display settings and then video output settings and set to HDMI, it should work.

There's a new firmware update out - v1.3. With regard to Blu-ray, the most significant addition is that you can now select what colour format to output with - RGB or Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. Previously they'd been doing processing with 16-bit per component RGB, but that still has short comings versus the discs' native Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. So now you can output with the latter if your display supports it.

There's also some changes to the resolution options. It lets you check and uncheck the resolutions you want the system to output in, and prioritises them as follows:

1080p>1080i>720p>480p


Which means the XMB itself will default to 1080i etc. if both 1080i and 720p are checked, for example. If you don't select 1080i as an allowable resolution, it will downscale BD to 480p. Games that are 720p native will still display at 720p even if you have 1080i checked, but games at 1080p will scale to 1080i now instead of 720p (if you have 1080i checked)..which may or may not look better depending on your TV.

When you flip power switch to turn on the PS3, hold the front power button for a few sec until you hear the short beep. The PS3 should auto-select the active display for you (make sure the TV is already active).

Does the PS3 support "native" video output, so it will not do any scaling, and will output, via HDMI, the native rate of the source (i.e. it will output 480i for standard-def DVDs and 1080p if a 1080p Blu-Ray DVD is played, etc.)? The reason I ask is because I have an Anthem D2 preamp, which has a built-in Gennum scaler, and I prefer that any scaling be done by my Anthem and not the PS3 or my display.

There's a new firmware update out - v1.3. With regard to Blu-ray, the most significant addition is that you can now select what colour format to output with - RGB or Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. Previously they'd been doing processing with 16-bit per component RGB, but that still has short comings versus the discs' native Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. So now you can output with the latter if your display supports it.

There's also some changes to the resolution options. It lets you check and uncheck the resolutions you want the system to output in, and prioritises them as follows:

1080p>1080i>720p>480p


Which means the XMB itself will default to 1080i etc. if both 1080i and 720p are checked, for example. If you don't select 1080i as an allowable resolution, it will downscale BD to 480p. Games that are 720p native will still display at 720p even if you have 1080i checked, but games at 1080p will scale to 1080i now instead of 720p (if you have 1080i checked)..which may or may not look better depending on your TV.

It's out?? Version 1.3???

Edit: Yes, it is. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=763668

Where is the colour format option, didn't see it under display soooo? There is certainly an improvement for me with how resolutions are now handled with the new hierarchy . I no longer need to switch settings when playing a 720p game, my display supports 1080i (native) and upscales 720p . Good so far.

Where is the colour format option, didn't see it under display soooo?

It's under BD/DVD settings.

Has anyone played with the "Image Quality Adjustements" yet??? I see virtually no changes, and was wondering if anybody has done the homework and found the "optimal" settings.

per the manual:
Image Quality Adjustment
The Image Quality Adjustment button allows you to adjust the noise reduction level of content played under (Video) while watching a BD/DVD. You may select from among four levels, the higher the level the higher the image filtering. This means the higher the level the clearer the picture quality.

NOTE

Image noise corresponds to visible grain or particles present in the image. In the context of digital image processing, the term noise usually refers to the high frequency random perturbations of color values of size close to 1 pixel, which are generally caused by the electronic noise in the input device sensor and circuitry (e.g. scanner, digital camera).

Ok,

so the newest firmware still won't allow 720P output of 1080P BD movie discs?

Grrr.

Just bought the PS3 (20 gig) and LOVE IT... but I can tell that going to my 1280 x 720 projector in its native resolution would probably look better than the bob/weave deinterlacing it does to incoming 1080i.

Any news on this?

Ok,

so the newest firmware still won't allow 720P output of 1080P BD movie discs?

Grrr.

Just bought the PS3 (20 gig) and LOVE IT... but I can tell that going to my 1280 x 720 projector in its native resolution would probably look better than the bob/weave deinterlacing it does to incoming 1080i.

Any news on this?Yep. 1080i max on 720p displays. If you pick 720p as your maximum resolution it will default to 480p, therefore you have to pick 1080i even though you have a 720p display. Frustrating as hell.:mad: They'll get around to fixing it one of these years.

Anyone know who to complain to about this?

Ok,

so the newest firmware still won't allow 720P output of 1080P BD movie discs?

Grrr.

Just bought the PS3 (20 gig) and LOVE IT... but I can tell that going to my 1280 x 720 projector in its native resolution would probably look better than the bob/weave deinterlacing it does to incoming 1080i.

Any news on this?

I've looked in a lot of places and I still can't find any news on this specific issue. I would really really love to be able to be able to have the ps3 send my tv sources at native 720p. At some point in late 2007 or early 2008 I plan on buying a 1080p tv, but for now I'd rather have 720p than 1080i deinterlacing and upscaling.

A question about your ps3. My friend just bought a 20gb model and he is having issues with the hdmi output to his tv. When I got my 60gb model on launch day I brought it over to his house and hooked it up to his plasma with my hdmi cable. So his tv definitely isn't the problem, it's either his ps3 or his hdmi cable.

I've heard from all over this forum that even the cheap cables should work fine for hdmi, so I'm wondering if it's his ps3. However, I also remember that a receiver he bought that had hdmi inputs and outputs wouldn't work on his tv via hdmi. The common thread there is that he was using the same hdmi cable that his ps3 is currently hooked up to. So what about you? Are you using hdmi fine on your tv and ps3?

Brandon

Hi all,

I'm having problem with my PS3 playing the Dual Layer DVD+R discs. Anyone experiencing this?

BaN,

Define "problem"... i.e. it plays but skips/freezes at the layer change, or just flat out won't read the disc at all?

-John

It simply doesn't play. It just shows a black screen. I tried different discs that play perfectly on my Sony upconversion player. I even tried to shut down and turn on the player with the disc inside. DVD-R's, single and dual layer, seem to play fine.

...

A question about your ps3. My friend just bought a 20gb model and he is having issues with the hdmi output to his tv. When I got my 60gb model on launch day I brought it over to his house and hooked it up to his plasma with my hdmi cable. So his tv definitely isn't the problem, it's either his ps3 or his hdmi cable.

...
Brandon

So why don't you try your cable with his PS3?

So why don't you try your cable with his PS3?

Well, I will of course. However he lives on the other side of town so doing it during the week really isn't an option. For now I recommended him to buy a cable on monoprice.com and then take it from there. He needs a 2nd hdmi anyway.

Brandon

Yep. 1080i max on 720p displays. If you pick 720p as your maximum resolution it will default to 480p, therefore you have to pick 1080i even though you have a 720p display. Frustrating as hell.:mad: They'll get around to fixing it one of these years.

Anyone know who to complain to about this?


I WANNA KNOW WHO TO COMPLAIN TO AS WELL !!!!

From this morning's CED...

Selection of video output resolution changed, letting PS3 users choose all resolutions supported by TVs when playing a Blu-ray movie, Sony said: “The video will automatically be displayed at the maximum resolution possible, according to the following order”: 1080p, 1080i, 720p, 480p, standard (NTSC). The 1.30 update gives PS3 users “the ability to select the output format for Blu-ray/DVD video through an HDMI cable,” SCEA said. Users can a pick video output format from among automatic, RGB or Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr “to suit your TV’s specification,” it said.

But Sony didn’t fix a resolution problem affecting gaming. “A small number of older” HDTVs in the U.S. only have 1080i inputs for HD signals and those sets “will currently only play some PS3 titles at 480p resolution,” an SCEA spokeswoman said: “PS3 games render images at either 720p or 1080p for high definition, and you need 720p input on the TV to play select games that do not support 1080p.” As a result “when a game outputs an HD signal only at 720p... select TVs have to display the game at 480p instead.” The company indicated this isn’t something that can be addressed via a firmware upgrade.

But Sony didn’t fix a resolution problem affecting gaming. “A small number of older” HDTVs in the U.S. only have 1080i inputs for HD signals and those sets “will currently only play some PS3 titles at 480p resolution,” The company indicated this isn’t something that can be addressed via a firmware upgrade.

LOL...a "Small Number"..........so much for Sony supporting CRT RP's. A lot of TV's from 2003 and earlier are now useless with the PS3. Good Job, Sony!

If there's no firmware fix, Sony better figure out a way to help their developers (1st and 3rd party) get all games running smoothly in 1080p really soon.

Ok,

so the newest firmware still won't allow 720P output of 1080P BD movie discs?

Grrr.

well i hope this lessens the demand for the PS3! :D
allowing me & others to get it sooner...

let me get this straight... for blu-ray movies, it can output 720p/1080i/1080p. but for ps3 games, it can only output the native resolution of the game, either 720p/1080p? for me, i'm primarily interested for blu-ray playback and will be using it in my home theater which currently uses a 1080i CRT RPTV that cannot accept a 720p input. does this mean all ps3 games in my setup will be in 480p?

I just got my 20 GB PS3 and put in Talladega Nights.

I don't know if it's me or my TV (LG 37LC2D) or my PS3 but the colors look awfully dark. I watched the trailers enclosed with the blu ray disc and they look spectacular. I downloaded some HD trailers off the Playstation store and they looked great too.

But I can't help but wonder why Talladega Nights the movie itself on blu ray look so dark on my screen. Comparing it to my XBOX 360 HD DVD player, the 360 trumphs it. The colors just don't jump out at me or are as vibrant as HD content or the XBOX 360 HD DVD player.

Anyone else also noticing this? (I'm using component, btw)

Well, if the other BD content and downloaded trailers look fine and it's just this one BD title that looks too dark... doesn't that answer your own question?

well i hope this lessens the demand for the PS3! :D
allowing me & others to get it sooner...

let me get this straight... for blu-ray movies, it can output 720p/1080i/1080p. but for ps3 games, it can only output the native resolution of the game, either 720p/1080p? for me, i'm primarily interested for blu-ray playback and will be using it in my home theater which currently uses a 1080i CRT RPTV that cannot accept a 720p input. does this mean all ps3 games in my setup will be in 480p?


It does NOT output 720P on the HDMI if you play a blue ray movie. I've tried to do a custom setting that removes 1080i & 1080p from the selection and then just have the 720p selected as the highest. When I play a BR movie it defaults to 480p!!!!! If I leave it on auto it dumps out 1080i!!! The ONLY time it gives me 720p is on the games & trailers.

Why don't they allow 720p???????????

I guess I'll have to just wait for my JVC RS1 with 1080p resolution.

I will not be upgrading to 720p any time soon. Sony will have no choice but to enable 720p output for BD playback or they'll be losing a large part of the BD market.

It does NOT output 720P on the HDMI if you play a blue ray movie. I've tried to do a custom setting that removes 1080i & 1080p from the selection and then just have the 720p selected as the highest. When I play a BR movie it defaults to 480p!!!!! If I leave it on auto it dumps out 1080i!!! The ONLY time it gives me 720p is on the games & trailers.

Why don't they allow 720p???????????

I guess I'll have to just wait for my JVC RS1 with 1080p resolution.
because it is nativly 1080p and it would have to downscale to 720p to play it? :-).

But you wont be convinced whatever I say... and even more people complained that it didnt show movies in 1080i before when it showed them in 720p in this case.

and even more people complained that it didnt show movies in 1080i before when it showed them in 720p in this case.

Wait what?

The movies have always been in 1080p, 1080i, or 480p... since the system shipped in the US. There's a lot of confusion on this resolution thing going around.

because it is nativly 1080p and it would have to downscale to 720p to play it?

It should be obvious that the context of this downscaling-to-720p discussion has to do with native 1280 x 720 displays which have to downscale from 1080 anyway. The point to having the PS3 do the downscaling is that it would likely produce a better picture than feeding the 720p display 1080i and relying on its bob/weave deinterlacing and downscaling.

Confused here-- HDMI audio question here: Do I set the HDMI to PCM and not bistream to get uncompressed pcm and TrueHD/DTSMA (even though its not possible to decode it yet I realize).. Thanks

LOL...a "Small Number"..........so much for Sony supporting CRT RP's. A lot of TV's from 2003 and earlier are now useless with the PS3. Good Job, Sony!

How do I know if my Rear Projection is in this group? I have the Hitachi 57swx20b. I had understood that my TV will upconvert a 720p input to 1080i, but is that correct and how do I know that?

Confused here-- HDMI audio question here: Do I set the HDMI to PCM and not bistream to get uncompressed pcm and TrueHD/DTSMA (even though its not possible to decode it yet I realize).. Thanks
Yes, you set HDMI to PCM to get TrueHD. No BD players support DTS-HD MA yet, but that capability is coming with an upgrade in 2007.

How do I know if my Rear Projection is in this group? I have the Hitachi 57swx20b. I had understood that my TV will upconvert a 720p input to 1080i, but is that correct and how do I know that?You set the PS3 to 1080i.

HDMI vs. Optical for Audio, or 1080i vs. 1080p for video

I am sure others may run into this, looking for opinions.
So I have a recevicer that can only pass 1080i via HDMI, the XBR2 accepts 1080p. If I plug in the PS3 directly to the XBR2 via HDMI I get 1080p, the audio from HDMI is only two channel if using the XBR2's optical output back to the receiver.

So if I select the optical audio and send it directly to the receiver in this scenario what do I get from the PS3 if sending "bitstream"?

DTS 5.1 @ what bitrate 1.5 mbps or 640 kbps?

DD 5.1 @ what bitrate?

DD plus and TrueHD decoded as DD core only at what bitrate?

DTS HD or DTS HD MA (DTS core only at 1.5 mbps)?

If I select Optical "PCM" output what do I get:

DD decoded as 24/96?

DD plus decode as 24/96 ?

TrueHD decoded as ??

DTS decoded as ??

DTS HD and DTS HD MA decoded as ??

The other option is the Video sacrifice, send the HDMI directly to the receiver and set the video output to 1080i and audio to HDMI PCM output. In this scenario all the advanced codecs should be decoded by the PS3 correct and sent via HDMI in PCM format (24/96?)

What is everyone doing here for this dort of setup? Are you doing anything different for BD movies vs. games, changing setups, etc..?

The easiest solution is to get an HDMI receiver that can pass 1080p and be done with it, but I'm not permitted to do that (although the Pioneer Elites look very similar, I could sneak it in!)

John ,
I would suggest you use the full HDMI from PS3 to receiver to screen and try the automatic video setup . What does it say max 1080i or 1080p? If it is 1080i program the audio to HDMI LPCM. I think your TV will probably deinterlace it to 1080p without loosing anything in the process and you will gain all the audio lossless possibilities of mos of the BD movies.

I have a similar setup PS3, Denon AVR4306 and Panny TH-50PHD8UK (1366x768 native 1080/60i, 24p) with HDMI only cables between the 3.

For BD movies my PS3 can go all the way to 1080i as detected automatically by the software using HDMI 1.3 because of the monitor. Of course the PS3 does not upscale (yet) as of firmware rev. 1.3.

The AVR 4306 has 3 HDMI 1.1 compatible inputs (1 output) and will let LPCM from the PS3 get internally to the 5/7 amplifiers. But it is dsigned so it could pass up to 1080p signals in the HDMI 3 to 1 switching matrix to the plasma monitor. It does upscale any video input signal but only up to 1080i. I asked DENON if a software patch could bring the HDMI up to 1.3 rev. but they say it would need a hardware mod. In fact I will only miss the new Deep Color function not having a full 1.3 HDMI receiver.

The monitor will accept any signal up to 1080i before mapping to the native resolution. I use the HDMI blade input (1.1). If I had a true 1920x1080p monitor, I could probably go thru the receiver for full 1080p programming .

That means that any video signal from the PS3 will always finish in all cases to 1080i at the HDMI input of the monitor so no problem .

As for audio I always prefer LPCM (48 kHz/24 bits) or lossless compression (internal True-HD to PCM decoding in the PS3) if available and most movies have it (gone in 60 seconds,into the blue, black hawk down,...) So I always use (prefer) the PCM thru HDMI option in the audio menu of the PS3 instead of the bitstream option which would limit everything to DD or DTS 5.1
As for The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen it is an DTS HD 5.1 master lossless source but I seem to have only a regular DTS feed thru PCM to the receiver so that probably means that contray to True-HD, PS3 does not have the DTS HD 5.1 master lossless codec conversion internally (yet).

John ,
I would suggest you use the full HDMI from PS3 to receiver to screen and try the automatic video setup . What does it say max 1080i or 1080p? If it is 1080i program the audio to HDMI LPCM. I think your TV will probably deinterlace it to 1080p without loosing anything in the process and you will gain all the audio lossless possibilities of mos of the BD movies.

I have a similar setup PS3, Denon AVR4306 and Panny TH-50PHD8UK (1366x768 native 1080/60i, 24p) with HDMI only cables between the 3.

For BD movies my PS3 can go all the way to 1080i as detected automatically by the software using HDMI 1.3 because of the monitor. Of course the PS3 does not upscale (yet) as of firmware rev. 1.3.

The AVR 4306 has 3 HDMI 1.1 compatible inputs (1 output) and will let LPCM from the PS3 get internally to the 5/7 amplifiers. But it is dsigned so it could pass up to 1080p signals in the HDMI 3 to 1 switching matrix to the plasma monitor. It does upscale any video input signal but only up to 1080i. I asked DENON if a software patch could bring the HDMI up to 1.3 rev. but they say it would need a hardware mod. In fact I will only miss the new Deep Color function not having a full 1.3 HDMI receiver.

The monitor will accept any signal up to 1080i before mapping to the native resolution. I use the HDMI blade input (1.1). If I had a true 1920x1080p monitor, I could probably go thru the receiver for full 1080p programming .

That means that any video signal from the PS3 will always finish in all cases to 1080i at the HDMI input of the monitor so no problem .

As for audio I always prefer LPCM (48 kHz/24 bits) or lossless compression (internal True-HD to PCM decoding in the PS3) if available and most movies have it (gone in 60 seconds,into the blue, black hawk down,...) So I always use (prefer) the PCM thru HDMI option in the audio menu of the PS3 instead of the bitstream option which would limit everything to DD or DTS 5.1
As for The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen it is an DTS HD 5.1 master lossless source but I seem to have only a regular DTS feed thru PCM to the receiver so that probably means that contray to True-HD, PS3 does not have the DTS HD 5.1 master lossless codec conversion internally (yet).

My Pioneer receiver is limited to 1080i, so while I can decode and pass all audio through HDMI, I can't send out 1080p.

What I am curious about is will the PS3 take the 16/48 audio track and convert it to 24/96 LPCM like the Toshiba HD DVD player does or does it remain in native format of the audio track?

DTS 5.1 @ what bitrate 1.5 mbps or 640 kbps? 1.5Mbps for BDs. 756kbps on most DVDs.

DD 5.1 @ what bitrate?640kpbs for BDs, and 348kbps and 448kbps for DVDs.

DD plus and TrueHD decoded as DD core only at what bitrate? Not sure if DD can handle anything higher than 640kpbs over optical or coax.

DTS HD or DTS HD MA (DTS core only at 1.5 mbps)? Core only. See above.

If I select Optical "PCM" output what do I get: Everything will be in stereo.

The other option is the Video sacrifice, send the HDMI directly to the receiver and set the video output to 1080i and audio to HDMI PCM output. In this scenario all the advanced codecs should be decoded by the PS3 correct and sent via HDMI in PCM format (24/96?) This sounds like a good option but you might wanna test it out first to see if the PS3 likes the 1080p-to-1080i conversion. You may not get video via the PS3-receiver-plasma.

Here is a post on a successful 1080p passthrough and full PCM and bitstream via HDMI on AVSF. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9107902&&#post9107902) Don't fee bad because you're envious. :cool:


fuad

Are you guys leaving on your PS3 on most of the time? I mean the master power switch and letting it go to sleep on its own?

Or just turn it off and then start from cold start because that way, when you put in a movie, it auto plays?

After reading through the pages here I have a question:
I have a 720p projector that will accept a 1080p signal. Does this mean I can get the PS3 to send a 1080p signal for BD movies and 1080p for games that are encoded that way? Will 720p games be sent over in 720p without problem?

Are you guys leaving on your PS3 on most of the time? I mean the master power switch and letting it go to sleep on its own?

Or just turn it off and then start from cold start because that way, when you put in a movie, it auto plays?

The master switch is in the back....I leave that on but power my sytem down once finished using the system. The red light is on indicating stand-by mode. :cool:

I've always turned off the master switch on the back of my PS2 and it's worked flawlessly for me for 6 years.

Of course, I have it on the coffee table, close to the couch but the PS3, I would probably put it on the TV stand since it has wireless controllers and my component and HDMI-to-DVI cables are probably too short to come out to the coffee table.

But there is no way to power off or put in standby from the Sixaxis?

I've always turned off the master switch on the back of my PS2 and it's worked flawlessly for me for 6 years.

Of course, I have it on the coffee table, close to the couch but the PS3, I would probably put it on the TV stand since it has wireless controllers and my component and HDMI-to-DVI cables are probably too short to come out to the coffee table.

But there is no way to power off or put in standby from the Sixaxis?

If you keep the PS button pressed for a few seconds on the sixaxis controller you get an option to turn off the controller or the system.