Not everybody is doing this but I will tell you I do expect to get what I paid for maybe it is time for Manufactures to stop using the consumers as testers and put out what they advertise.Then they would not get the returns they do and the sales people will tell the consumers anything to make the sell this is where the retailers need to stand up and do whats right but they do not cause most are as crooked as the customers who bring these sets back.


They are NOT using consumers has lab rabbits. What they produce is what you get with that particular brand/model for that model year, it's called proprietary technology, if you don't like it, move onto the next set. Is as simple as that.

How wonderful will it be to find a HDTV with the picture quality of Matsushita, Pioneer and NEC all in one and the convenience of Philips' Ambilight and the sophisticated design of Sony or Samsung.

That will be a dream come true, but it won't happen at least not yet. So you got to get what you think looks best from all stand points. And what better way to find what you really need than your eyes and ears during pre-purchase time.

Nonsense. There are plenty of legitimate reasons to return a TV, even after taking the time to evaluate it in the store. One obvious problem is that the settings for store display are entirely different than those you'll want to use at home.


Yeah whatever, buddy. The so-called "legitimate reasons" are simply LAME EXCUSES to bring it back and get another one from another brand and keeping the temporary rental game.

, if you don't like it, move onto the next set. Is as simple as that.

Therein lies the rub. How can one know if one likes it until one tries it at home.
Never been in a store with my home lighting , equipment set-up,and signal source.
Wothout a return policy I may as well buy on the internet and save money to boot.

Sorry, but you can patronize strict return-policy stores if you want, but my money goes to the Costcos of the world!(and their liberal policy)

BTW, as more TV's are sold right before Superbowl than most other times, how do you know that the return rate is any higher than usual, and not just a function of higher sales?

Therein lies the rub. How can one know if one likes it until one tries it at home.
Never been in a store with my home lighting , equipment set-up,and signal source.
Wothout a return policy I may as well buy on the internet and save money to boot.

Sorry, but you can patronize strict return-policy stores if you want, but my money goes to the Costcos of the world!(and their liberal policy)

BTW, as more TV's are sold right before Superbowl than most other times, how do you know that the return rate is any higher than usual, and not just a function of higher sales?


And that's fine, you shop where ever you wish, we are not debating where you shop. We are discussing the returns and this will continue until they put a stop to the abuse, like they did with personal computers.

Don't ask me that. Refer to the OP for that, he/she was the one who question if these returned TVs are from Super Bowl renters. I just confirmed the obvious.

They are NOT using consumers has lab rabbits. What they produce is what you get with that particular brand/model for that model year, it's called proprietary technology, if you don't like it, move onto the next set. Is as simple as that.

How wonderful will it be to find a HDTV with the picture quality of Matsushita, Pioneer and NEC all in one and the convenience of Philips' Ambilight and the sophisticated design of Sony or Samsung.

That will be a dream come true, but it won't happen at least not yet. So you got to get what you think looks best from all stand points. And what better way to find what you really need than your eyes and ears during pre-purchase time.

Sorry to bust your bubble but yes they do

Sorry to bust your bubble but yes they do


Well, if you think they are then every manufacturer for every single product or service out there is using consumer as lab rabbits. I presume you won't get into a car because according to you, the manufacturer will use you as a lab rabbit and will hope you have an accident to see how well the airbags work on a coalition with an object or another vehicle. If you survive, good for them., if you don't, bad.

I think you and everyone else who thinks like you is expecting more than what you paid. I'm sorry to disappoint you, but you know how the old saying goes; You get what you paid for. There are establishments dedicated to display video and audio products in the closest home ambiance as possible, but you know there's a price for this convenience and is always charge at MSRP.

P.S. don't worry, you're not bursting any bubble. A little OT to make the point here.

Well, if you think they are then every manufacturer for every single product or service out there is using consumer as lab rabbits. I presume you won't get into a car because according to you, the manufacturer will use you as a lab rabbit and will hope you have an accident to see how well the airbags work on a coalition with an object or another vehicle. If you survive, good for them., if you don't, bad.
As a matter of fact yes they would and did

I think you and everyone else who thinks like you is expecting more than what you paid. I'm sorry to disappoint you, but you know how the old saying goes; You get what you paid for. There are establishments dedicated to display video and audio products in the closest home ambiance as possible, but you know there's a price for this convenience and is always charge at MSRP.

As for this statement no I just want it to work like they say it will and yes I did get what I paid for TH-50PX600U and show far is amazing

P.S. don't worry, you're not bursting any bubble. A little OT to make the point here.
Thank you

So you got to get what you think looks best from all stand points. And what better way to find what you really need than your eyes and ears during pre-purchase time.

That's like not listening to speakers in your home first. They're going to sound different depending on the environment. Very similar to current TV's.

Your train of thought worked well in the old CRT days, when TV's just worked and worked well for 10 or more years. Sadly not the case any longer.

Lelekid you have got to be kidding me. I'm suppose to buy a $2k+ item, only judging it in store conditions and not have a chane to return it when I decide I don't like the way it looks/sounds/etc. in my environment? That is absolutely ludicrous! I will return until I am COMPLETELY satisfied that my hard earned dollars have gotten me EXACTLY what makes me happy!

And that's fine, you shop where ever you wish, we are not debating where you shop. We are discussing the returns and this will continue until they put a stop to the abuse, like they did with personal computers.

Don't ask me that. Refer to the OP for that, he/she was the one who question if these returned TVs are from Super Bowl renters. I just confirmed the obvious.

Man, it's about time you get off your high horse. The fact of the matter is current consumer level HD display technologies are just not up to the level of what was mainstream in CRT technology. Yet these sets cost many times more. There are also many more and varied aspect to using a modern digital TV set these days.

Since you seem to know how one should shop for TVs these days please enlighten us on the following issues:

How you can judge dark levels at a brightly lit store?
How you can evaluate weather there is audio sync issues from an ATSC feed?
How you can hear if there are audio drop outs on an ATSC feed that is NOT caused by the source in a noisy warehouse?
How can you test weather the TV will work properly with your HTPC system?
How can you test weather the NTSC, ATSC or QAM tuners in a set output drastically different volume levels that makes channel surfing a painful affair?
How can you test how sensitive is a set's QAM tuner and weather it can REALLY pick up the unencrypted channels over coax as it is advertised by the manufacturer?
How can you find out in the store that the "dynamic contrast" the manufacturer advertises as a feature can not be turned off when you play games on the set and that it in fact makes the games unvatchable?

And these are just some of the issues I've encountered with the 4 name brand sets I've tried over the last year (nothing to do with the Super Bowl mind you). You can add to this whole model line of buzzing sets, sets with banding or green faces, clouding etc.

Go ahead and give consumers the magic formula to how they can evaluate a set and avoid all these issues from a 1 hr store visit alone... you're the smart one.

Man, it's about time you get off your high horse. The fact of the matter is current consumer level HD display technologies are just not up to the level of what was mainstream in CRT technology. Yet these sets cost many times more. There are also many more and varied aspect to using a modern digital TV set these days.

Since you seem to know how one should shop for TVs these days please enlighten us on the following issues:

How you can judge dark levels at a brightly lit store?
How you can evaluate weather there is audio sync issues from an ATSC feed?
How you can hear if there are audio drop outs on an ATSC feed that is NOT caused by the source in a noisy warehouse?
How can you test weather the TV will work properly with your HTPC system?
How can you test weather the NTSC, ATSC or QAM tuners in a set output drastically different volume levels that makes channel surfing a painful affair?
How can you test how sensitive is a set's QAM tuner and weather it can REALLY pick up the unencrypted channels over coax as it is advertised by the manufacturer?
How can you find out in the store that the "dynamic contrast" the manufacturer advertises as a feature can not be turned off when you play games on the set and that it in fact makes the games unvatchable?

And these are just some of the issues I've encountered with the 4 name brand sets I've tried over the last year (nothing to do with the Super Bowl mind you). You can add to this whole model line of buzzing sets, sets with banding or green faces, clouding etc.

Go ahead and give consumers the magic formula to how they can evaluate a set and avoid all these issues from a 1 hr store visit alone... you're the smart one.

Actually, for same-size displays, the new micro-displays are quite a bit LESS expensive than their CRT predecessors. My 10-year old CRT-based XBR RPTV cost over $4,500 (well over that in todays' dollars).

As for evaluating the characteristics of these sets in the stores ... you can research online the technical details (control features; known issues; physical dimensions; etc.); read reviews from both technical reviewers and other owners; and can evaluate the "cosmetics" in the store [shape/colors of the cabinet, etc.]. Remember ... it's just a TV !! ... frequent returners (you've done this FOUR times in a year !!??) just add to the cost of these sets and cause stores to become even more restrictive in their policies (e.g. restocking fees and/or shorter "return windows") => creating hassles for those who might return their sets for more legitimate reasons.

As I noted above, it's just a TV. Do your research; choose your set; and live with it.

By the way, the WEATHER outside may be good or bad; but WHETHER it matters or not depends on your perspective. Notice the two DIFFERENT words with very different meanings.

Man, it's about time you get off your high horse. The fact of the matter is current consumer level HD display technologies are just not up to the level of what was mainstream in CRT technology. Yet these sets cost many times more. There are also many more and varied aspect to using a modern digital TV set these days.

Since you seem to know how one should shop for TVs these days please enlighten us on the following issues:

How you can judge dark levels at a brightly lit store?
How you can evaluate weather there is audio sync issues from an ATSC feed?
How you can hear if there are audio drop outs on an ATSC feed that is NOT caused by the source in a noisy warehouse?
How can you test weather the TV will work properly with your HTPC system?
How can you test weather the NTSC, ATSC or QAM tuners in a set output drastically different volume levels that makes channel surfing a painful affair?
How can you test how sensitive is a set's QAM tuner and weather it can REALLY pick up the unencrypted channels over coax as it is advertised by the manufacturer?
How can you find out in the store that the "dynamic contrast" the manufacturer advertises as a feature can not be turned off when you play games on the set and that it in fact makes the games unvatchable?

And these are just some of the issues I've encountered with the 4 name brand sets I've tried over the last year (nothing to do with the Super Bowl mind you). You can add to this whole model line of buzzing sets, sets with banding or green faces, clouding etc.

Go ahead and give consumers the magic formula to how they can evaluate a set and avoid all these issues from a 1 hr store visit alone... you're the smart one.



OK you know what you need to blow some steam BEFORE you direct to me in that tone, buddy. You seem to be in the horse of temporary rentals, that's why your acting up. Take 5 a chill pill, along with a cool brusky, OK. :mad:

Lelekid you have got to be kidding me. I'm suppose to buy a $2k+ item, only judging it in store conditions and not have a chane to return it when I decide I don't like the way it looks/sounds/etc. in my environment? That is absolutely ludicrous! I will return until I am COMPLETELY satisfied that my hard earned dollars have gotten me EXACTLY what makes me happy!


What is it with you people, are you NOT reading it right or are you cutting up my replies and taking it apart the ones you don't like and discussing the ones you do.

When Did I say you cannot return it? WHEN!?

You can return it, if the establishment allows it! until they caught up with you and the rental games. and the manager will put a stop to it. Which is what Costco is planning to do and they will if the return abuse continues.

I NEVER SAID DON'T RETURN IT! MY OPINION IS CLEARLY STATED. NOT YOURS, OR ANYONE ELSES, MINE!

Good and bad technology will perform at it's best regardless of the location and feed; dark, bright, store, home {or zoo}, cable, ATSC, Satellite feed, etc. It will perform, period! some stores have bad settings, but not every single one has a poor signal and default factory settings hopping the consumers bite it the way it is displayed.

There are audio and video showrooms with dedicated personnel who do take the time to properly adjust the sets to a more natural feel, and will spend hours with a customer to make sure they make a educated purchase. But like I said, you have to paid the MSRP for that luxury and convenience.

This will be my last post reply to anyone judging my personal opinion. I will not continue with this childish conversation with anyone else. If you're NOT addressing to me in a educated and mature level don't even bother. The majority of you who are arguing seem to take for granted that each individual has an opinion and **forget** to respect those opinions and put a limit to themselves before typing.

That's like not listening to speakers in your home first. They're going to sound different depending on the environment. Very similar to current TV's.

Your train of thought worked well in the old CRT days, when TV's just worked and worked well for 10 or more years. Sadly not the case any longer.


That's right., my thoughts as in my own opinion. which I will appreciate if you and everyone else respect them even if you and those who reply don't agree. But I do take my stand and side on this discussion. Return abusers/ temporary rentals hurt the rest of us.

Once a product as been open IT CANNOT BE RE-SOLD AS NEW, and you all know that, it has to be resold as an open box for a lesser value, the stores are not in business to loose money, they are in business TO MAKE money, their lost for returns will be passed to the end consumers.

By the way, the WEATHER outside may be good or bad; but WHETHER it matters or not depends on your perspective. Notice the two DIFFERENT words with very different meanings.

Well, thanks for the English lesson. One of the few useful bit's of information showing up on this thread in a while... :)

I just bought a Sony 32" KDL-32S20L1 FROM Costco and when I opened it at home, it's used. :(

So disappointed about Costco for this...

So who's gonna be the first to order the "new" Sharp 46 from Costco.com and check for banding?!

That's right., my thoughts as in my own opinion. which I will appreciate if you and everyone else respect them even if you and those who reply don't agree. But I do take my stand and side on this discussion. Return abusers/ temporary rentals hurt the rest of us.

Once a product as been open IT CANNOT BE RE-SOLD AS NEW, and you all know that, it has to be resold as an open box for a lesser value, the stores are not in business to loose money, they are in business TO MAKE money, their lost for returns will be passed to the end consumers.

WAR! Bandwidth wasters on soapbox...we don't care...get back on topic...

This will be my last post reply to anyone judging my personal opinion.

Thank Goodness!

No kidding! What a goofball.

Anyway, I've never understood defending the big guy against the little guy when the little guy is not abusing the system and the big guy can easily put into place restrictions to stop abuse.

Some people just have no clue.

Anyway, I've never understood defending the big guy against the little guy when the little guy is not abusing the system and the big guy can easily put into place restrictions to stop abuse.


Except for the fact, that there a lot of the "little guys" that are now indeed starting to abuse the system. And there are even people here, that promote doing such things. And because of all that, the "big guy" has also been considering making changes in the system, due to a lot of those "little guys" that are abusing it.

Except for the fact, that there a lot of the "little guys" that are now indeed starting to abuse the system. And there are even people here, that promote doing such things. And because of all that, the "big guy" has also been considering making changes in the system, due to a lot of those "little guys" that are abusing it.

I see that alot of people have to much free time on their hands everyone should stop worrying about what others do and keep tabs on how they handle their own lives...

Well when the "renters" actions of abusing returns, are starting to create a negative influence on the return policy for the honest people like they are starting to do now. Then it is indeed keeping tabs on something that involves me and my life!

Except for the fact, that there a lot of the "little guys" that are now indeed starting to abuse the system. And there are even people here, that promote doing such things. And because of all that, the "big guy" has also been considering making changes in the system, due to a lot of those "little guys" that are abusing it.
here goes johnla on his costco return policy soapbox again...why not just cut and paste some of your 50 earlier posts on this subject? the fact is that costco even touts that an extended warranty or them being an authorized dealer is not necessary on some products BECAUSE of their 100% satisfaction guaranatee....and again, the "big guy" is NOT considering changing their policy...many people have posted on here with emails they ahve received back from COSTCO CORPORATE and they have confirmed there will be NO CHANGE in the policy for TVs. ANY comments to the contrary are IDIOT LOCAL MANAGERS MAKING UP THEIR OWN RULES, AND THEY SHOULD BE REPORTED TO CORPORATE IMMEDIATELY. ALL COSTCO STORES ARE CORPORATE OWNED, WHICH MEANS THAT THE MANAGERS OPINION DOES NOT TRUMP CORPORATE POLICY.

Guys:

Just wanted post as I know many are interested. Pioneer 5070 is now on costco's website. Im not buying it at that price. I shall be happy with my Panny at $1k cheaper.

Except for the fact, that there a lot of the "little guys" that are now indeed starting to abuse the system. And there are even people here, that promote doing such things. And because of all that, the "big guy" has also been considering making changes in the system, due to a lot of those "little guys" that are abusing it.

Give me a break. I'm talking about the people that return the TVs because they don't work like or provide picture quality like what they expect in their own homes. I think it's an undisputed fact that signal quality, source, lighting, etc. all play an important part in evaluating the true experience of an HDTV. Looking at it briefly in the warehouse-like conditions of a Costco or reading the specs/numbers on a forum hardly counts as a true evaluation.

You and your type are nuts. If I can't use their guarantee, then why pay the extra money to buy from there? Costco usually does not have the cheapest prices, but they certainly have the best policies.

Costco will do what it needs to do in order to survive and please its shareholders. You and I don't know what their business model looks like relative to televisions and we don't know what calculations go into their determining whether TV returns are hurting their business.

Now go take a 'lude and calm your crap down.

Guys:

Just wanted post as I know many are interested. Pioneer 5070 is now on costco's website. Im not buying it at that price. I shall be happy with my Panny at $1k cheaper.

The Pioneer is a great set, but I can't justify in my mind the extra cost. I was helping a relative purchase a plasma over Christmas and the Pio was definitely a nice set. But over the LG that was well over $1000.00 cheaper, neither of us could justify the price point. Granted, neither of us are videophiles either.

The Pioneer is a great set, but I can't justify in my mind the extra cost. I was helping a relative purchase a plasma over Christmas and the Pio was definitely a nice set. But over the LG that was well over $1000.00 cheaper, neither of us could justify the price point. Granted, neither of us are videophiles either.

Well, I love buying the best but in this case this is my 3rd TV. My main is my Sony XBR 60'' in the basement. This is just my family room TV where I watch nothing but DVR or HDTV (soon). Don't plan to put a DVD player there. Therefore for the usage I cannot justify another $1K.

Now go take a 'lude and calm your crap down.

And you should take you own advice!

here goes johnla on his costco return policy soapbox again...why not just cut and paste some of your 50 earlier posts on this subject?

Here goes dtrell again, standing on his bar of soap and yelling about how everyone can return anything at anytime to Costco.... why not just cut and paste some of your other numerous earlier post on this subject? But be careful, that bar of soap you are standing on could become wet and you might slip and fall.


And yes "the big guy" Costco has looked into changes to the return policy, a few various interviews by sources such as the Wall Street Journal with Costco CEO Jim Sinegal has even said this much. But so far Jim Sinegal is standing by his guns, as saying nothing has changed in the return policy for now or for the very near future. Even though they are hoping the high returns on large TV's will stabilize with the just addition of things like their installation service that they now offer.

Here goes dtrell again, standing on his bar of soap and yelling about how everyone can return anything at anytime to Costco.... why not just cut and paste some of your other numerous earlier post on this subject? But be careful, that bar of soap you are standing on could become wet and you might slip and fall.


And yes "the big guy" Costco has looked into changes to the return policy, a few various interviews by sources such as the Wall Street Journal with Costco CEO Jim Sinegal has even said this much. But so far Jim Sinegal is standing by his guns, as saying nothing has changed in the return policy for now or for the very near future. Even though they are hoping the high returns on large TV's will stabilize with the just addition of things like their installation service that they now offer.

Why don't you boys PM each other beating this dead horse privately instead of cluttering this thread...no one cares...it's just wasted crap to wade through...

Well when the "renters" actions of abusing returns, are starting to create a negative influence on the return policy for the honest people like they are starting to do now. Then it is indeed keeping tabs on something that involves me and my life!

How do you know masses of people are abusing returns? The only figures we have come from the stores themselves or their retail associations, hardly unbiased sources. They have every incentive to hype this story as an excuse to restrict their return policies.

Has anyone had experience with BB or CC price matching FRY's prices? I live in NYC, so if you have any experiences in and around the city I would greatlly appreciate it.

Thanks in advance

Here goes dtrell again, standing on his bar of soap and yelling about how everyone can return anything at anytime to Costco.... why not just cut and paste some of your other numerous earlier post on this subject? But be careful, that bar of soap you are standing on could become wet and you might slip and fall.



and if i do, i will return the used bar of soap to costco for a fresh new one! ha!!

Once a product as been open IT CANNOT BE RE-SOLD AS NEW, and you all know that, it has to be resold as an open box for a lesser value, the stores are not in business to loose money, they are in business TO MAKE money, their lost for returns will be passed to the end consumers.
Re: TVs, tell that to Radio Shack and apparently Costco, as well. ;)
My advice is one should still shop at any of these stores, providing one likes their return policy.
No matter what store one chooses, one should always check the box at the store for signs that it was opened and re-sealed.
When one gets home, check the accessories and the TV itself.
Also, see if the TV has a 'first time setup menu', if it does, it should appear.

How do you know masses of people are abusing returns?


Just why do you think they changed the policy for computers? Because a lot of people were abusing the policy to use it as a free PC rental/upgrade source. And the same thing is also going on with TV's and other consumer electronics. Hell, you only need to just look at how many people there are that even promote doing such things to see that it has the potential to become a very big problem! Sooner or later it will reach a point where if it does not stabilize, there is more than just a very good chance that there will be some further changes made about returns. Now you can try and ignore it and try to turn your head and look away to what's going on. But I'd bet that a lot of people that used to return PC's left and right did the same thing, and thought it would never be changed. If it was not for the CEO of Costco standing so steadfast about not changing it, the policy probably would have had some more changes added to it like the one for PC's sometime in the last year.

It's already costing us in higher prices for electronics. There was a time when Costco was the cheapest. No more!

Just why do you think they changed the policy for computers? Because a lot of people were abusing the policy to use it as a free PC rental/upgrade source. And the same thing is also going on with TV's and other consumer electronics. Hell, you only need to just look at how many people there are that even promote doing such things to see that it has the potential to become a very big problem! Sooner or later it will reach a point where if it does not stabilize, there is more than just a very good chance that there will be some further changes made about returns. Now you can try and ignore it and try to turn your head and look away to what's going on. But I'd bet that a lot of people that used to return PC's left and right did the same thing, and thought it would never be changed. If it was not for the CEO of Costco standing so steadfast about not changing it, the policy probably would have had some more changes added to it like the one for PC's sometime in the last year.

This should tell you something about the country we now live in Cheat on taxs,Cheat in school,Cheat at work,Cheat on each other,All these giant Corps cheating us,All the Politicians cheating and lying to us,All the little white lies that are ok.
Makes you feel good to be American don't it.

It's already costing us in higher prices for electronics. There was a time when Costco was the cheapest. No more!

And those price increases have nothing to do with CEO making hundreds of millions of dollars for setting in those glass monuments.YA RIGHT

Actually the CEO of Costco is not making as much as many other CEO's do, and who run some other companies that are the size of Costco. Of course, it's not like he is even remotely going broke running the company. But he is not one of the ones that's making uber mega millions doing it either.

Just why do you think they changed the policy for computers? Because a lot of people were abusing the policy to use it as a free PC rental/upgrade source.

Or they changed the policy because they could.

Actually the CEO of Costco is not making as much as many other CEO's do, and who run some other companies that are the size of Costco. Of course, it's not like he is even remotely going broke running the company. But he is not one of the ones that's making uber mega millions doing it either.

Thats my point they do not did a CEO that makes that kind of money to have a company that thrives and still takes care of the Customers,Shareholders,Employees and CEO

Or they changed the policy because they could.

Dream on, that's not the real reason. Even now there are still some people buying laptops, and then returning them for another newer one just days short of the 6 month time limit.

Not everybody is doing this but I will tell you I do expect to get what I paid for maybe it is time for Manufactures to stop using the consumers as testers and put out what they advertise.Then they would not get the returns they do and the sales people will tell the consumers anything to make the sell this is where the retailers need to stand up and do whats right but they do not cause most are as crooked as the customers who bring these sets back.

You have a period of time with which to evaluate any product prior to purchase. Buying off of specs alone is a rookie mistake, and a reason why the term caveat emptor is still in circulation today.

How do you know masses of people are abusing returns? The only figures we have come from the stores themselves or their retail associations, hardly unbiased sources. They have every incentive to hype this story as an excuse to restrict their return policies.

Not that they need a reason. Stores can do whatever they like within the law, and frankly should given whatever metrics and demographics of the area dictate. In fact, it would be a good idea for every individual store to have different policies based on that, but that would never fly.

You have a period of time with which to evaluate any product prior to purchase. Buying off of specs alone is a rookie mistake, and a reason why the term caveat emptor is still in circulation today.

I did do my research for a couple months so get off your high horse.

I asked this question twice in the other Costco thread and never got a response, so here goes again.

For the record, I would not use Costco's return policy for a "rental" or abuse the policy. I would, however, use it if my TV failed within a few years. A $4k set should not die that quickly, and of course I would not be satisfied with my purchase. I would essentially buy a TV from Costco and pay my yearly membership instead of buying a set and extended warranty from some other store such as Best Buy.

What I'm wondering about is this: can Costco change their return policy after you have already made the purchase and have the new policy affect your existing purchase? For example, you buy a set and 8 months later they change the return policy to mirror their policy on computers. (6 month return policy, if I recall) Since you purchased your set 8 months earlier, you can no longer return your set and are left without the old Costco guarantee acting as your extended warranty.

Anyone?

My understanding is that the new clause is in effect and retroactive, from talking with a customer service person at my local store, a couple days ago.

Of course that doesn't mean that you can't go in there and throw a temper tantrum and hope that some panicky supervisor won't help you out to keep from making a scene.

In years gone by those temper tantrums were always effective with a neighbor's 6 year old. I'm told that the customer service people would accept about anything to get the noisy kid out of the store faster.

You have a period of time with which to evaluate any product prior to purchase. Buying off of specs alone is a rookie mistake, and a reason why the term caveat emptor is still in circulation today.

It might still be in circulation, but few have heard about it.... or what it means.

And of course, policies like Costco's tend to take the teeth out of the statement.

Maybe it should be

caveat emptor sans Costco (i don't know if sans is the right word, but sounds good, never took latin)

"Let the buyer beware except at costco"

My understanding is that the new clause is in effect and retroactive, from talking with a customer service person at my local store, a couple days ago.

What new clause is in effect and retroactive?

My understanding is that the new clause is in effect and retroactive, from talking with a customer service person at my local store, a couple days ago.

There is no official "new clause" for returns that has even been implemented so far by Costco, so there is also no such thing to be in effect yet either. Let alone being retroactive. Whatever that customer service person told you about some "new clause" is more than likely not even remotely any sort of a official company policy, it probably only was just something that this person or the stores manager made up to tell people.

My understanding is that the new clause is in effect and retroactive, from talking with a customer service person at my local store, a couple days ago.

Nonsense, unless their WRITTEN policy changes.

for costco online purchases they should send u revised policy with packages . as it does not say anything online warranty wise

Nonsense, unless their WRITTEN policy changes.

Written, corporate approved, policy changes.

Written, corporate approved, policy changes.

I was in the Northridge Ca. Costco today at 10 AM returning a 30-day 23 inch Samsung LCD....When I overheard the manager say to the employee behind the return desk ...Finally Corporate is changing the return policy to 90 days for TV's...Sarting Feb. 26th or 28th....

I questioned him a little...He said their has been so much abuse.....I said Costco does not offer E/W.......he said their working closely with the manufacturers to offer better warranties.......He said nobody wants to use the Free Concierge Service they offer....Just keep bringing in & trading up.....

The employee behind the return desk said the if you purchased the TV prior to the change...then it would fall under the old policy 100% satisfaction......

So I came home & called Corporate Customer Service in Washington....He said he has not seen any written policy changes coming in the next 2 weeks......He said "JUST RUMORS"...

So I guess by the end of the month we will see What's "True Or False"......

I will keep you guys updated.......

Please do. This is turning into an interesting little soap opera.

This received from Costco.com's customer service - too vague of course. I had asked specfically what the return policy was for a PT-AE1000U, that "I considered buying".

their response:
We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund, subject to certain product-specific limitations on electronics, alcohol and tobacco."

Now, I note that it says "electronics" - I think it used to say (a while back) computers, not electronics, but I can't be sure.

I emailed them back asking for clarification - specifically on the Panasonic projector, this morning, but have not yet received a reply. -art

if you went to the costco site today this is under the panny projector you were "considering buying", seems simple to read and understand.

"This item is covered by Costco's guarantee to refund your purchase price if you are not completely satisfied. Costco's guarantee applies, even though this item may not be covered by the manufacturer's warranty, because Costco is not an "authorized" dealer of the merchandise."

if you went to the costco site today this is under the panny projector you were "considering buying", seems simple to read and understand.

"This item is covered by Costco's guarantee to refund your purchase price if you are not completely satisfied. Costco's guarantee applies, even though this item may not be covered by the manufacturer's warranty, because Costco is not an "authorized" dealer of the merchandise."

Good point - I missed that - it was under shipping and terms. Clear enough. And hopefully I'll get a further confirmation from my previous email to costco customer service.

Art - I have several somewhat off-topic questions for you - although Costco related for sure! A week ago, I took delivery of a Sharp DT-500 from Costco.com partially based on your recommendation (and those of others on it's threads) knowing that it was a bit noisy. Although I love the picture from HD sources (DVD viewing not as good as my old 4805 without Faroudja), it is almost as loud as my old 4805 - not unexpected. BTW - my ceiling is only 68" (the DT-500 low offset works perfectly). Now I see that Panasonic has increased their rebate on the PT-AX100 to $400, therefore, it's only $100 net more than the Sharp projector at this website.

Seeings that it is possible that Costco might change their return policy, what would you do if you were me? Would I be giving up much by going with the quieter AX100? Black level/shadow detail are important to me. Also, if I bought the AX100, what do you think would be the optimum zoom distance? Presently, I have the DT-500 set on minimum zoom for maximum sharpness, based on your advice.

Finally, I love your website and reviews. Obviously, the most thorough available! Do you have an engineering background?

Art - I have several somewhat off-topic questions for you - although Costco related for sure! A week ago, I took delivery of a Sharp DT-500 from Costco.com partially based on your recommendation (and those of others on it's threads) knowing that it was a bit noisy. Although I love the picture from HD sources (DVD viewing not as good as my old 4805 without Faroudja), it is almost as loud as my old 4805 - not unexpected. BTW - my ceiling is only 68" (the DT-500 low offset works perfectly). Now I see that Panasonic has increased their rebate on the PT-AX100 to $400, therefore, it's only $100 net more than the Sharp projector at this website.

Seeings that it is possible that Costco might change their return policy, what would you do if you were me? Would I be giving up much by going with the quieter AX100? Black level/shadow detail are important to me. Also, if I bought the AX100, what do you think would be the optimum zoom distance? Presently, I have the DT-500 set on minimum zoom for maximum sharpness, based on your advice.

Finally, I love your website and reviews. Obviously, the most thorough available! Do you have an engineering background?

Greetings,

Last first, no - not an engineering background - science/tech oriented, was briefly a physics major in college (before switching to business), sold high end and exotic level audio gear in the 70's, Started my AV company (presenting solutions) in the late 80's and portable projectors when they hit the market in '94. Sold it in 2001, and started the site about 2 years later. Just a hard core person, who discovered it was more fun to write about this stuff than sell it. (I have been doing assorted writing/publishing since '95.

OK back to your delimma.

The Panny should be able to do at least as good a black level on dark scenes without bright areas, but on scenes with some very bright - the iris can't do its thing. Now, there is a tradeoff there - if you have a scene with mostly dark, but a decent sized very bright area, you eye will automatically be drawn to it, your eye will adjust for the brightness, and darks will seem darker anyway... In other words, the scenes where the iris is most useless, the eye brain, compensates a bit.

It really comes down to stuff like "film-like". The Panny is very film-like for an LCD, mostly thanks to the smooth screen. Sharpness, however, - the Sharp, probably has the advantage there.

You might as well buy a PT-AX100U from costco, plug it in and compare the two, and return the one that doesn't work for you.

Personally, I'm a big fan of the traditional, "knowledgeable" online dealers (having been one for almost 10 years), but if ever there was a valid argument for making use of Costco's policy, this would be it. You just aren't sure, and the only way to find out is to compare...

As to distance - mid range or a bit closer, is probably the best - long throw kills all your lumens. Of course if you have a HC gray screen or a high gain (over 1.4) too close will cause your screen to not provide as even illumination as if the projector was further back.

Have a blast. PS. email and let me know the end result. -art

Thanks, Art for the quick responses. BTW, I almost bought 2 projectors from Costco.com when I got the DT-500. Only then, I was considering the Optoma 6800 (it seems only Canadians think it's a good deal?) My wife nixed that idea, although I think you're right, a side-by-side comparison would be best. Also, I kept my original projector, a Costco purchased Infocus 4805 for a week or so after receiving the Sharp projector to ensure it wouldn't be any noisier and it wasn't. However, with my seating distance at 11' to an 81" screen, the DT-500 is now between me and the screen (mounted with min. zoom or about 9' to the screen), as opposed to the 4805 mounted slightly behind me (mounted about 12' to the screen), and I think this adds to the apparent loudness.

I asked about the zoom distance because I know closer is better for sharpness (and I could mount it 8' away with my screen). However I want to ensure as quiet setup as possible, therefore, further back is better (up to 16' from screen). With it's built-in flexibility (the antithesist of the DT-500!), it would sure be fun to play with. My screen is a light gray DIY project, a variation of the Mississippi Mud mixture which worked great with the 4805 and also seems to as well with the DT-500.

Finally, if I do order the AX-100, what is your e-mail address for end results? (or would you prefer a PM?)

I just brought back my 67" DLP to costco after over 3 months and had "ZERO" problems (RBE was killing me).

RICKSRIBS , go by what CORPORATE SAYS ... not desk jockeys.

I called Canada Corportate DIRECT and asked and was told no change was coming.

Yes, I guess time will tell, but I will put my marbles with the big office types, not floor walkers. If it is indeed changed, I will take my business elsewhere. I do not abuse, but I do like to coverd for my TV's. A $4000 plus purchase with only 90 days backing it is BS to me !!

I just brought back my 67" DLP to costco after over 3 months and had "ZERO" problems (RBE was killing me).

RICKSRIBS , go by what CORPORATE SAYS ... not desk jockeys.

I called Canada Corportate DIRECT and asked and was told no change was coming.

Yes, I guess time will tell, but I will put my marbles with the big office types, not floor walkers. If it is indeed changed, I will take my business elsewhere. I do not abuse, but I do like to coverd for my TV's. A $4000 plus purchase with only 90 days backing it is BS to me !!

Mikey....I am ONLY reporting only what I heard.... But He gave me a specific DATE Feb 26-28....

The next day I went to another Coscto & manager said the Date was Feb. 26th.

What they are trying to do is push this Concierge Service.....Where they will repair your TV for FREE.... AFTER the manufacturer warranty is up....

They said if they cant fix it then it would be subject to a replacement....

But in my opinion...If they change this to 90 day Satifisfaction......
They still will get a lot of members returning every 90 days.....
AND.... if they grandfather the 100% satisfaction prior to the change in policy...They will get a hell of a lot of members bring their TVs back to upgrade for the last time!!!

RICKSRIBS - If, indeed a new electronics return policy is in put in place at the "warehouse", I strongly believe my brand new Sharp DT-500 projector will be returned immediately (with immense b*&%hing if needed to obtain a refund) as it is largely their great policy that caused me to spend about $600 more for it compared to what I probably would have purchased if it wasn't in place (a Mitsubishi HD-1000). I sincerely hope that I never need to use the policy again, but I believe the manufacturer's warranty is too short for the product type and it's apparent history of problems, regardless of manufacturer.

In fact, if it wasn't for their great return policy, I can honestly say I wouldn't even be a member of said warehouse. My first warehouse purchase was an Infocus 4805 and, although loved for it's performance/price, it had to be returned due to a light tube defect - It was happily accepted back, I might add after 2 years and 10 days! (just beyond what Infocus's warranty period would've been).

In Closing: Long Live the "Warehouse" (and don't screw up a great thing!)

I am looking to purchase an LCD TV from CompUSA but wasn't sure if it was returnable if opened. Taken from ComUSA return policy:

"If you are not satisfied with a product you purchased from us and you return the product with the original receipt or invoice within 21 days from the original purchase or invoice date, you may exchange the product or receive a refund, except as explained below. Computers, monitors, printers, projectors, camcorders, cameras, and GPS/Navigation systems may be returned within 14 days from the original purchase or invoice date and may be subject to a 15% restocking fee if opened (unless defective). Opened software, games, and videos may only be exchanged for the same title. Opened service parts, motherboards, and processors may not be returned for refund, but may be exchanged, if defective. Labor, installation services, and shipping charges are non-refundable. All items must be in new condition, with the original box, packaging, manuals, accessories, and UPC code... "

It is the last line that is questioning me.

Will CompUSA accept a LCD TV return within 21 days if opened?

It is the last line that is questioning me.

Will CompUSA accept a LCD TV return within 21 days if opened?

It looks like it, but I would call them just to make certain.

Mikey....I am ONLY reporting only what I heard.... But He gave me a specific DATE Feb 26-28....

The next day I went to another Coscto & manager said the Date was Feb. 26th.

What they are trying to do is push this Concierge Service.....Where they will repair your TV for FREE.... AFTER the manufacturer warranty is up....

They said if they cant fix it then it would be subject to a replacement....

But in my opinion...If they change this to 90 day Satifisfaction......
They still will get a lot of members returning every 90 days.....
AND.... if they grandfather the 100% satisfaction prior to the change in policy...They will get a hell of a lot of members bring their TVs back to upgrade for the last time!!!

If Costco were changing their return policy next week, I think that information would be coming from more than just a couple people you've talked to. The net would be flooded with the rumor and a news agency would have probably broken the story weeks ago.

If Costco were changing their return policy next week, I think that information would be coming from more than just a couple people you've talked to. The net would be flooded with the rumor and a news agency would have probably broken the story weeks ago.

As I have stated in previous posts....Those stores gave me a SPECIFIC Date....For months & months people just reported a " Change coming soon" or "the First of month of 2007"......

I was at the La Quinta Ca. store yesterday & they said the same thing Feb. 26th..

Manager said signs would be posted at the Return desk ...like the 6 month Computer Return....

I personally DON'T believe it ......

As I have stated in previous posts....Those stores gave me a SPECIFIC Date....For months & months people just reported a " Change coming soon" or "the First of month of 2007"......

I was at the La Quinta Ca. store yesterday & they said the same thing Feb. 26th..

Manager said signs would be posted at the Return desk ...like the 6 month Computer Return....

I personally DON'T believe it ......

I don't blame you for not believing it.

I am looking to purchase an LCD TV from CompUSA but wasn't sure if it was returnable if opened. Taken from ComUSA return policy:

"If you are not satisfied with a product you purchased from us and you return the product with the original receipt or invoice within 21 days from the original purchase or invoice date, you may exchange the product or receive a refund, except as explained below. Computers, monitors, printers, projectors, camcorders, cameras, and GPS/Navigation systems may be returned within 14 days from the original purchase or invoice date and may be subject to a 15% restocking fee if opened (unless defective). Opened software, games, and videos may only be exchanged for the same title. Opened service parts, motherboards, and processors may not be returned for refund, but may be exchanged, if defective. Labor, installation services, and shipping charges are non-refundable. All items must be in new condition, with the original box, packaging, manuals, accessories, and UPC code... "

It is the last line that is questioning me.

Will CompUSA accept a LCD TV return within 21 days if opened?

A couple of things....the last line doesn't say anything about being "unopened"..they just want everything, including the box back. Also, in the first line "if you are not satisfied"....how can you be expected to know if you're satisfied or not with the tv unless you open the box and try the set out? Just keep everything for the possibility of return. As already mentioned, a call to them would probably be the best bet.

Just got back from a Costco in PA and the guys in electronics department confirmed the change is coming the end of this month. Apparently they have been told to keep it hush-hush. While I was looking through the displays I started speaking with this older guy who was buying an LCD. He brought the issue up himself and said that he was speaking with his son- in -law yesterday, who happens to work at Costco corporate office, and his son-in-law confirmed the policy change and suggested he act now.

Now I've been looking at flat screens for more than a year and have held off- just waiting for the right deal. But I'm considering pulling the trigger if I see more confirmation. Rumors are Rumors. That said I've now heard this from alot of different sources...

I don't know if policies for Costco are consistent across the border, but my local Costco in Canada has told me that no policy change is coming for TV's. His reason was that less than 2% of the TV's sold are returned/exchanged and even the ones that are get sent back to the manufacturer for a full credit. He gave the impression that talk of a change is ridiculous.

Who knows if he would have told me even if it was about to change, and it's just one store so take it for what it's worth.....

I Emailed Costco About Their Return Policy To See If I Could Get Some Clarification As I Wanted To Buy An Ipod.
The First Answer Was That There Is "no Public Information" Available About A Change To Their Policy.
The Answer To A Subsequent Email Stated That "as Of Right Now The Policy Remains The Same". (exact Words)
So It Seems That A Change May Be Coming.....



It's Me Missy Quick

Several people mentioned , in this forum, a "Concierge" service that Costco has mentioned as a replacement for their current policy. Something about repairing the televisions after the warranty period. Perhaps they were just joking, but if not, can anyone shed some light on this? Thank You.

The new 90 policy goes in effect for all California warehouses on 2/26/07. Remaining West coast warehouses ( NW, LA, SD) 3/12/07.MW and TX warehouses 3/19/07. NE warehouses 3/26/07.SE and PE warehouses 4/2/07. Costco will also be extending the manufacturers warranty on televisions and computers to 2 years from the date of purchase .

The new 90 policy goes in effect for all California warehouses on 2/26/07. Remaining West coast warehouses ( NW, LA, SD) 3/12/07.MW and TX warehouses 3/19/07. NE warehouses 3/26/07.SE and PE warehouses 4/2/07. Costco will also be extending the manufacturers warranty on televisions and computers to 2 years from the date of purchase .

Well very interesting post...I assume this follows what I was was told...(Unofficially that is)

Well very interesting post...I assume this follows what I was was told...(Unofficially that is)

So, if you bought your set prior to this dead line?

So, if you bought your set prior to this dead line?

In the last 5 years.....I have bought 10 TV's from Costco for my 4 houses I own.....

The new 90 policy goes in effect for all California warehouses on 2/26/07. Remaining West coast warehouses ( NW, LA, SD) 3/12/07.MW and TX warehouses 3/19/07. NE warehouses 3/26/07.SE and PE warehouses 4/2/07. Costco will also be extending the manufacturers warranty on televisions and computers to 2 years from the date of purchase .

If it even turns out to be true...... Other than the 90 day thing, that would be no real great deal, unless they also really lower quite a few of their prices on some of the TV's as well. You can get the extra year of warranty coverage with buying anywhere by just using a credit card that offers such a thing. So that in itself would offer no big reason at all to buy a TV anymore at Costco.

There really wont be any advantage now to buy from Costco, but most people except of few even know about there return policy, most times i go there and talk with people looking at there tv's didnt even know, so really they weren't losing that much.
Unless they lower the price i will buy from the lowest price competitor.

There are rarely any "good" deals there anyway....Sams doesnt offer that return poicy either, just extended warranties, and who cares about a factory warranty?, which means weeks or months of waiting for a repair, needless phone call's....etc....just return it same day WAS the best!!

I was in Costco last night in Lake Elsinore CA. all the POP was up regarding the new policy and stickers were put on product box's appartently they ahead of the deadline. 90 day return 2 year warranty plastered all over the electronics area. :(

In a certain sense, it's fine if it's true. I was always conflicted about paying Costco's higher prices. This way, I rely on my CC for the extra year and pay a lower price from other vendors. No real loss unless you're a "renter".

I was in Costco last night in Lake Elsinore CA. all the POP was up regarding the new policy and stickers were put on product box's appartently they ahead of the deadline. 90 day return 2 year warranty plastered all over the electronics area. :(

This sounds like a good thing. As I understand it after 90 days you have the rest of the 2 years to bring back if something goes wrong. Do they give you store credit or exchange for comparable item?

This sounds like a good thing. As I understand it after 90 days you have the rest of the 2 years to bring back if something goes wrong. Do they give you store credit or exchange for comparable item?

No I think you have to have it repaired just like thru the manufacturers.

I was in Costco last night in Lake Elsinore CA. all the POP was up regarding the new policy and stickers were put on product box's appartently they ahead of the deadline. 90 day return 2 year warranty plastered all over the electronics area. :(

Sorry... but what's a "POP" ?

My thing with costco was that their prices for tv's were kind of high when I was looking.Like the Toshiba couple bills more than BB for the lwer model also the Panasonic they had the TH-50PX6U was a couple of bills more thans BB TH-50PX600U that I bought.

I ordered a Sharp 52" D62 from Costco.com. They told me I'd be grandfathered in if there is a change, but I want that in writing, so I've emailed them to confirm.

They would face legal troubles by retroactively applying the policy.

So I would be able to return a TV purchased sometime last year?

Here's the reply I got from Costo.com. Looks like a boilerplate response. I'm going to try again. What does "product specific limitations on electronics" mean?

"Thank you for your email to Costco Wholesale.

We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund, subject to certain product-specific limitations on electronics, alcohol and tobacco. We offer two convenient return methods. Costco.com refunds include shipping and handling fees.

For an immediate refund simply return your purchase to any Costco location..."

I got that exact same reply last week when I emailed about returning my 10 month old plasma because the bezel paint was peeling. That was the last straw because I have had problems with this crappy 50" dell that I should never have bought. It has dropouts on the HDMI to my Comcast box (but not to my HDMI dvd player), and strange affects on dark scenes. I would have kept the TV until the paint started peeling. For $3500 I was not going to keep a TV with paint chips flaking off.

So I would be able to return a TV purchased sometime last year?

Legally you should be able to, regardless of what the policy eventually reads. On the downside, they may say no to gradfathering in people and then you'd have to fight them. Unless there's a class-action, who would have the time/money to call them on it?

So, legally yes. In reality, you'll have to wait and see.

Legally you should be able to, regardless of what the policy eventually reads. On the downside, they may say no to gradfathering in people and then you'd have to fight them. Unless there's a class-action, who would have the time/money to call them on it?

So, legally yes. In reality, you'll have to wait and see.

It's not too complicated to file a case in your local small claims court.

The fee is minimal and it's "sort of" casual in the courtroom.

All you would have to do is bring your receipt with the date on it, and a copy of the "Satisfaction Guarantee" that was in force at the time you made your purchase.

I can't see how you could lose.

So I would be able to return a TV purchased sometime last year?

Yes, with the discretion of the manager

It's not too complicated to file a case in your local small claims court.

The fee is minimal and it's "sort of" casual in the courtroom.

All you would have to do is bring your receipt with the date on it, and a copy of the "Satisfaction Guarantee" that was in force at the time you made your purchase.

I can't see how you could lose.

For smaller items, that's true. You'd have to see what the dollar limit for small claims court is.

Yes, with the discretion of the manager

Where is the discretion of the manager written into their T&C's?

For smaller items, that's true. You'd have to see what the dollar limit for small claims court is.

I'm pretty sure that almost every State has a at least a $5,000 maximum for a claim, and I think some have gone to $10,000 for small claims court.

$5,000 ought to cover most Television purchases.

That's good. Seems like plenty of headroom for most TV purchases.

I do mostly federal court work where the amount in controversy is $75K+ or is patent/trademark/copyright, which is under fed jurusdiction anyway, hence my cluelessness about small claims.

So I would be able to return a TV purchased sometime last year?Hey...just got back from Costco after returning my plasma that cost $3800 after taxes and shipping. I had the TV over 10 months and they didn't ask a single question. I *HIGHLY* recommend bringing in the automated Costco reply because once the manager looked at that, he signed off the return without even looking at the TV or the contents of the box.

I have to admit...I feel pretty guilty. I mean it wasn't my fault there was such shoddy workmanship on the paint job that it started peeling, but the TV had to have dropped in price by 50%. Got to love Costco for buying expensive TV's.

I was in the Northridge Ca. Costco today at 10 AM returning a 30-day 23 inch Samsung LCD....When I overheard the manager say to the employee behind the return desk ...Finally Corporate is changing the return policy to 90 days for TV's...Sarting Feb. 26th or 28th....

I questioned him a little...He said their has been so much abuse.....I said Costco does not offer E/W.......he said their working closely with the manufacturers to offer better warranties.......He said nobody wants to use the Free Concierge Service they offer....Just keep bringing in & trading up.....

The employee behind the return desk said the if you purchased the TV prior to the change...then it would fall under the old policy 100% satisfaction......

So I came home & called Corporate Customer Service in Washington....He said he has not seen any written policy changes coming in the next 2 weeks......He said "JUST RUMORS"...

So I guess by the end of the month we will see What's "True Or False"......

I will keep you guys updated.......

I was at the Van Nuys. Ca. today & TV & Computer Boxes have the new return/warranty stickers on the boxes.....

90 days return/2 year warranty.....I talked again to another manager and said officially the written sign will be posted on Feb. 28th....

He said purchases prior will be subject to the discrection of the manager.....
He said not to panic about walking in with a tv bought 1 or 2 years ago....

But 5-6 years.....probably would be denied.......

I talked to several warehouse staffers today at their Overland Park, Kansas location. None of them said that they had heard of any policy change - instead they asked me what I had heard! Anyway, the guy apparently in charge said that if a change is made, purchases made prior would be "grandfathered" i.e. the lifetime return policy would still be in effect.

Later during the same visit I saw the manger who accepted my defective Infocus 4805 projector 10 days ago. He said the same (no news of policy change/grandfathered on prior buys). He went on to give several examples of past abusers (including one guy who apparently brought back 4 laptops, each just under 6 months apart, for refunds in the nick of time!) Finally, he agreed with my assertion that their existing policy was great and that a small percentage of abusers should be continued to be tolerated as the policy has undoubtably boosted their overall electronics sales by a significant amount.

Therefore, it looks like I'm going to keep my new Sharp projector after all!

If any prior purchases are denied, it's clearly a breach of contract by Costco and they will lose. I'd love to get into that situation and see where I could go with it.

Unfortunately the 3 month policy is true. If any one can pm me on how to post an image, I will post the internal memo

My thing with costco was that their prices for tv's were kind of high when I was looking.

Costco's prices on electronics have never been anything special...

I sent an email to Costco last night informing them of my disappointment with the change in their return policy.

I told them I thought it was a shame that the "Good" customers had to be punished for the few abusers of their return policy.

I have not received any response.

I'm not certain if this has been discussed in this thread, but, for some of us who shop at Costco, the appeal of shopping there transcends pricing and long-term warranty issues.

The fact that we can find a reasonably priced and supported product in a no-hassle environment where employees are treated and compensated equitably counts a great deal towards a satisfactory experience. Sometimes it's forgotten that there are hidden costs of a "bargain" at the other big box entities...

Personally, if I have to pay more, I'll just go to a mom and pop type of dealer and get personal service where they truly bend over backwards to help the customer.

I helped an in-law purchase a TV from a local retailer. The service was second to none and pricing was surprisingly competitive. From my perspective, Costco can screw off with their higher priced electronics. I don't care about well paid employees if there's no benefit to me.

Personally, if I have to pay more, I'll just go to a mom and pop type of dealer and get personal service where they truly bend over backwards to help the customer.

I helped an in-law purchase a TV from a local retailer. The service was second to none and pricing was surprisingly competitive. From my perspective, Costco can screw off with their higher priced electronics. I don't care about well paid employees if there's no benefit to me.

I agree. The price of the TV's at Costco was not the best price around. I think the biggest reason for purchasing there WAS the return policy.

Since that is gone... you might as well look for a better price, and more importantly, have the product knowledge that is non-existant at a place like Costco.

A smaller Mom&Pop store are usually really good with knowledge and support.

You guys on the mainland are lucky. Here in Hawaii, Costco is the lowest price. That's why I bought from them, not for their return policy. BB, CC and local retailers are all a few hundred to almost a thou over Costco. The First plasma I bought I returned in 2 weeks (Toshiba had a loud buzzing noise). The next, a panny, I bought I still have and love, no problems. If we did not have to pay the crazy shipping prices to Hawaii I would have bought online to save money. Even if they change their policy we here in Hawaii will still buy from them, they are the cheapest here.

Here's some nfo from a Barron's article:

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/Extra/CostcoTheAntiWalMart.aspx

The formula works. Costco sold 1.5 million TVs last year and has successfully built what it calls ancillary businesses such as prescription drugs and eyeglasses, filling 26 million prescriptions in 2006. Hungry Costco members bought 63 million hot-dog-and-soda combinations last year at in-store snack bars -- priced at only $1.50 and with free soda refills. The dogs are even kosher.

Costco's customer-focused strategy is apparent in its 87% membership-renewal rate.

The retailer allows returns on nearly all items at any time, with no questions asked; computers are the lone exception. It doesn't even need to see receipts. This liberal policy has proved costly in the past year because the company is seeing returns of an unusually large number of big-screen TVs. Analysts suspect that many members are taking advantage of the sharp drop in TV prices to return models bought in the past 12 months so they can buy new ones at lower cost. Costco said it is evaluating its TV-return policy but emphasizes that no change will be retroactive and that it still plans to maintain the industry's most generous return policy on electronics.

This liberal policy has proved costly in the past year because the company is seeing returns of an unusually large number of big-screen TVs. Analysts suspect that many members are taking advantage of the sharp drop in TV prices to return models bought in the past 12 months so they can buy new ones at lower cost. .

While unfortunately I do think the policy has been abused, I also think the high number of returns is due in large part to sets like the new Vizio which has a lot of defects.

Dear Valued Customer,

Thank you for your email to Costco Wholesale.

All purchase made prior to the change will still be honored for a full refund. The new policy for electronics will be 90 days.


Thank you,

Costco Wholesale Corporation
memberservice@costco.com

:(

Well, that's it then.

Well, that's it then.

Well I guess my original post about the Feb 26th change in return policy is now factual....

Well I have 10 TV's...I have purchased from Costco!!

It sounds also like the laptop/PC returns are affected as well. All electronics . . . stinks.

It sounds also like the laptop/PC returns are affected as well. All electronics . . . stinks.

Yes...all electronics.....

Now I wonder what Corp. Sam's Club is thinking......Maybe their TV sales will increase......

Dear Valued Customer,

Thank you for your email to Costco Wholesale.

All purchase made prior to the change will still be honored for a full refund. The new policy for electronics will be 90 days.


Thank you,

Costco Wholesale Corporation
memberservice@costco.com

:(

when is the new policy begin?
Feb/26?
I live in NYC, i saw the policy on the wall that saying helpful to return within 30 days, but 90 days.
I am going to buy a HDTV tomorrow.
Thanks

Yes...all electronics.....

Now I wonder what Corp. Sam's Club is thinking......Maybe their TV sales will increase......

Interesting thought. Would the increase in sales offset the cost of the returns? Obviously for Costco it didn't work. But, that's not to say that for Sam's it wouldn't.

The increased draw into their stores and the other purchases by these prospective TV purchasers may be what Sam's wants. Their gross margins are higher than Costco's and they may be able to better absorb the returns costs through the somewhat higher margins on the non-electronics sales.

this f'ing blows....im going to think long and hard about keeping my exec membership....

Any idea of when the change will take effect in North Carolina?

went back today and asked if US policies will apply to Canadian Costcos and he said yes. So if there is indeed a policy change on Monday, we can expect to see it up here too.

This really complicates my decision .... get the panny 50px60U for 180 cheaper than the 6U at Costco? For the difference...I was looking forward to price matching and a "flexible" return policy......

this f'ing blows....im going to think long and hard about keeping my exec membership....


Mmmmm.....

From what their corporate office told me, different areas of the country have different "rollout" dates. For the midwest she told me 3/19/07 is the rollout date. I believe it's already active on the west coast. If you are thinking of purchasing, I would check with the individual store just to be sure.

this f'ing blows....im going to think long and hard about keeping my exec membership....

I have been a member of Costco/Price Club for **22 Years**....Costco has been like a second Home.....I live 5 minutes away......I am a Costco Addict :eek:

For Personal/Business...I spend an average of $3000/month(Estimate)=$792,000.

Do you think they owe me at least 1 TV return???

I shop at Costco weekly and spend lots of $$ there but most of what I spend is for things other than major electronics. In the past I have returned a broken computer, a camera hat proved to be too small for my hands, some small appliances that stopped working, a weedeater that kept clogging, most within the first 3 months. And most of the other items they sell will still have the unlimited return priviledge.

I believe that they are just leveling the playing field with their major electronics. Of course the old policy was better for us, but the new one is still as good/better than any other store. Now prices will have a lot to do with our decisions.

We will have to ask ourselves if paying a little more than some other box stores is worth having the extra 60 days (most box stores only offer 30 day returns) to return something. Hums, green blobs, convergence errors, color uniformity et al often don't show themselves the first 30 days. Or we watch only hd for the first month, and then return to some regular programming, things might start looking different and we might want to try a different model. 90 days return is still a good deal.

Of course it would be nice to be able to bring back a set that breaks down after a year, rather than dealing with manufacturer's warranty technicians, where delays and lack of real knowledge can be frustrating. Even with an extended warranty from Costco or some other store, it's only as good as where you live and who comes out to repair your poroblem. Often a nightmare.

Shelly

I shop at Costco weekly and spend lots of $$ there but most of what I spend is for things other than major electronics. In the past I have returned a broken computer, a camera hat proved to be too small for my hands, some small appliances that stopped working, a weedeater that kept clogging, most within the first 3 months. And most of the other items they sell will still have the unlimited return priviledge.

I believe that they are just leveling the playing field with their major electronics. Of course the old policy was better for us, but the new one is still as good/better than any other store. Now prices will have a lot to do with our decisions.

We will have to ask ourselves if paying a little more than some other box stores is worth having the extra 60 days (most box stores only offer 30 day returns) to return something. Hums, green blobs, convergence errors, color uniformity et al often don't show themselves the first 30 days. Or we watch only hd for the first month, and then return to some regular programming, things might start looking different and we might want to try a different model. 90 days return is still a good deal.

Of course it would be nice to be able to bring back a set that breaks down after a year, rather than dealing with manufacturer's warranty technicians, where delays and lack of real knowledge can be frustrating. Even with an extended warranty from Costco or some other store, it's only as good as where you live and who comes out to repair your poroblem. Often a nightmare.

Shelly

I think the problem is that in other big box retailers you can buy an extended warranty for extra $ that will take you out to 4+ years usually. For example, Ultimate Electronics offers a 4 year warranty for approx $400 on a 2k TV. They also say that if you have not used that warranty after 4 years they will give you a store credit for half of it. So now, if Ultimate Electronics is $200 cheaper than Costco, you can get the same TV for the same price with twice the warranty, and that's through the store, not the manufacturer.

Rollout Schedule For The New Return Policy.

All California Warehouses--2/26/07

Remaining West Coast Warehouses (nw, La, Sd)--3/12/07

Mw And Texas Warehouses--3/19/07

North East Warehouses--3/26/07

Se And Pr Warehouses--4/2/07

I Was At Costco Yesterday And Asked For And Was Given A Copy Of The Memo.

Rollout Schedule For The New Return Policy.

All California Warehouses--2/26/07

Remaining West Coast Warehouses (nw, La, Sd)--3/12/07

Mw And Texas Warehouses--3/19/07

North East Warehouses--3/26/07

Se And Pr Warehouses--4/2/07

I Was At Costco Yesterday And Asked For And Was Given A Copy Of The Memo.


Does it have a statement regarding any "grandfathering" of previously purchased sets?

Also, considering Wall Street's love of Costco, I'm surprised a news outlet hasn't pick up ths story yet??

Quote " The 90 Day Refund Policy Is Effective For Purchases Made On Or After The Regional Rollout Date. All Previous Purchases Are "not" Subject To The New 90-day Policy".

The Only Items Affected By This New Policy:

Televisions
Computers
Cameras
Camcorders
Ipod/mp3 Players
Cellular Phones


It's Me Missy Quick

Costco Is Extending The Manufacturer's Warranty On Televisions And Computers To 2 Years From Date Of Purchase. ( Part Of The New Policy)
Interesting That It Doesn't Include Anything Else On The List.

Most Credit Cards Will Do The Same. We Need To Find Out If The Credit Card Companys Will Extend The Warranty After The Costco Warranty Ends. If They Will, We Will Have 3 Years. Worth A Call....


It's Me Missy Quick

Costco Will Only Accept The American Express Card.
If American Express Will Not Allow The One Year Extension Beyond The Two Years That Costco Is Allowing Then The Extra Year That Costco Is Offering Is Not Worth Anything.

It's Me Missy Quick

Rollout Schedule For The New Return Policy.

All California Warehouses--2/26/07

Remaining West Coast Warehouses (nw, La, Sd)--3/12/07

Mw And Texas Warehouses--3/19/07

North East Warehouses--3/26/07

Se And Pr Warehouses--4/2/07

I Was At Costco Yesterday And Asked For And Was Given A Copy Of The Memo.

I wonder what date they are using for Costco.com?

Mmmmm.....
wtf does that mean? johnla, get over it. it has nothing to do with your opinion of morality. it has to do with economics. now that costco has made their economic decision, i will now make mine...as will others on this forum.

Costco 90-Day Electronics Return Policy Memo (http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s133/vandit_photo/costco.jpg)

does it mean shopping craze today and tomorrow in California - people crazily buying millions of tvs/

does it mean shopping craze today and tomorrow in California - people crazily buying millions of tvs/


Crazy Buying & or Returning Millions??????

Costco Will Only Accept The American Express Card.
If American Express Will Not Allow The One Year Extension Beyond The Two Years That Costco Is Allowing Then The Extra Year That Costco Is Offering Is Not Worth Anything.

It's Me Missy Quick

Copied from my Costco A/E Website......

"Buyer's Assurance Plan8 — extend warranties up to one additional year
When you purchase covered items and pay for them entirely with your TrueEarnings Business Card, the Buyer's Assurance Plan extends the terms of the original manufacturer's warranty on eligible items for a period of time equal to the original manufacturer's warranty up to one additional year on warranties of five years or less that are eligible in the United States. To file a claim, call 1-800-225-3750."

Costco Will Only Accept The American Express Card.
If American Express Will Not Allow The One Year Extension Beyond The Two Years That Costco Is Allowing Then The Extra Year That Costco Is Offering Is Not Worth Anything.

My Amex card specifically states that it only extends a manufacturers warranty that is a warranty period of 1 year or less. So I would assume that if Costco gives a 2 year warranty, the Amex one would be null and void.

I shop at Costco weekly and spend lots of $$ there but most of what I spend is for things other than major electronics. In the past I have returned a broken computer, a camera hat proved to be too small for my hands, some small appliances that stopped working, a weedeater that kept clogging, most within the first 3 months. And most of the other items they sell will still have the unlimited return priviledge.

I believe that they are just leveling the playing field with their major electronics. Of course the old policy was better for us, but the new one is still as good/better than any other store. Now prices will have a lot to do with our decisions.

We will have to ask ourselves if paying a little more than some other box stores is worth having the extra 60 days (most box stores only offer 30 day returns) to return something. Hums, green blobs, convergence errors, color uniformity et al often don't show themselves the first 30 days. Or we watch only hd for the first month, and then return to some regular programming, things might start looking different and we might want to try a different model. 90 days return is still a good deal.

Of course it would be nice to be able to bring back a set that breaks down after a year, rather than dealing with manufacturer's warranty technicians, where delays and lack of real knowledge can be frustrating. Even with an extended warranty from Costco or some other store, it's only as good as where you live and who comes out to repair your poroblem. Often a nightmare.

Shelly

I understand leveling the field... but in order to be competitive, Costco will have to offer extended warranties too.

So, people who have purchased before this deadline? would still be covered by their old, policy??

I understand leveling the field... but in order to be competitive, Costco will have to offer extended warranties too.

Also lower prices and offer the higher end products.

Costco Is Extending The Manufacturer's Warranty On Televisions And Computers To 2 Years From Date Of Purchase. ( Part Of The New Policy)
Interesting That It Doesn't Include Anything Else On The List.

Most Credit Cards Will Do The Same. We Need To Find Out If The Credit Card Companys Will Extend The Warranty After The Costco Warranty Ends. If They Will, We Will Have 3 Years. Worth A Call....


It's Me Missy Quick

Costco.COM accepts all major credit cartds.

But be aware, that most credit cards that offer that "extended" warranty, is an extension of the MANUFACTURER'S warranty. So, if the Mfg waranty is over in one year, that is when the CC will take over.

4-5 year extended warranties can still be purchased for any tv we buy at Costco.

Companies like Mack and Warrantech will only be too happy to sell you one for any tv purchased from Costco.

There's even a group buy on the avscience forum for Mack warranties. So although /costco doesn't offer more than their two years now, it can be extended with the additional purchase form the warranty company itself.

Shelly

Costco Will Only Accept The American Express Card.
If American Express Will Not Allow The One Year Extension Beyond The Two Years That Costco Is Allowing Then The Extra Year That Costco Is Offering Is Not Worth Anything.

It's Me Missy Quick

Yes true, the B&M Costco's only accept American Express, but Costco.com will accept any major credit card.

wtf does that mean? johnla, get over it. it has nothing to do with your opinion of morality. it has to do with economics. now that costco has made their economic decision, i will now make mine...as will others on this forum.

Well lets see, you said and in fact even shouted, that the corporate "big guy" would not do this. And I said that they would indeed do it sooner or later, and it turned out that they did do it and also a lot sooner..... So it looks like you slipped on that bar of soap you were standing on before while shouting, and fell down!

BTW;

It was nothing to do with my opinion of "morality", abuse is abuse. And it was costing them a bunch of money because of the abuse.

Well lets see, you said and in fact even shouted, that the corporate "big guy" would not do this. And I said that they would indeed do it sooner or later, and it turned out that they did do it and also a lot sooner..... So it looks like you slipped on that bar of soap you were standing on before while shouting, and fell down!

BTW;

It was nothing to do with my opinion of "morality", abuse is abuse. And it was costing them a bunch of money because of the abuse.

I guess we will see how much this move cost them in the electronics department.I personally think Corp America SXCKS.

I purchased the 60" 3LCD Sony 720p set in mid-July 06. Never been that happy with it and I ordered the Samsung HL-S6767W on 1/31 from costco online. The Sammy arrived on Thursday morning, after which I loaded up the the Sony TV, stand, remote and manual and headed to CC for the return. For the first time EVER, I was hassled and the lady called the store manager. The store manager came down and, without saying a word to me, reviewed my return and purchase history. He then came to me and explained the new 30 day return policy that would soon be changing to 90 days. I simply acknowledged this statement with an "okay", and he grabbed my Exec. membership card and AMEX and asked the lady at the return counter to do the return.

With the exception of a few, you people need to stop crying. You complain so much yet know so little. You can not even BEGIN to grasp the situation Costco faced with rampant Abuse of their Return Policy. I really could care less about what you think is morally right and exceptable. Returning a 10 year old TV for a full refund FOR ANY REASON is abuse. And it happens EVERY DAY. The abuse has gone from a slight nuisance to people literally coming in with a 5 year old tv and admitting that the reason they want to return is so they can "Buy something better". And you guys #itch because Costco changes it's policy. Even though the new policy is still THREE TIMES BETTER than any other retailer PLUS THEy are extending the manufactures warranty for FREE and providing FREE (english speaking) technical support for the LIFE OF THE PRODUCT. How about being a litle grateful that costco kept that return policy as long as they did.

If you want to #itch and complain, don't do it to Costco...DO it to those who abused the policy so badly it ruined it for everybody else. Complain to the people who think Costco's return policy means they can "rent" or "borrow" whatever the hell they want and return it when ever they are done with it for a full refund.

And I don't remember who said it, but whoever the hell said "corporate America sucks" (refering to Costco) better take a step back and think about learning what Costco stands for. They pay better than any other retailer, offer better benifits, all the while keeping their prices competitive and keeping an EXTREMELY liberal return policy for over 2 decades. Costco was defending that policy for years as investors pressured them to change it. THEY REFUSED TO CHANGE THE POLICY. But ungrateful and rude people with absolutely no conscience have backed them up into a corner and they have no choice. Costco is NOT corporate America. Why don't you go have a look at your local walmart.

Ever since the rumor of this change began I have said "those who complain the most, will be the ones who abused the most" Apparently my prediction was true....

/Rant

No I said all (Corporate America SXCKS) let me take that step back (still feel that way)But it does make me feel better knowing that we have the only moral person left on the planet judging everyone.
May I thank you again.

No I said all (Corporate America SXCKS) let me take that step back (still feel that way)But it does make me feel better knowing that we have the only moral person left on the planet judging everyone.
May I thank you again.

Well how about being a little bit more specific instead of speaking in generalities??? Why do you feel Costco is Corporate America? Do you feel as if the Big Company is stepping on the little man? I would like to know why and how you have come to this conclusion.....

I purchased the 60" 3LCD Sony 720p set in mid-July 06. Never been that happy with it and I ordered the Samsung HL-S6767W on 1/31 from costco online. The Sammy arrived on Thursday morning, after which I loaded up the the Sony TV, stand, remote and manual and headed to CC for the return. For the first time EVER, I was hassled and the lady called the store manager. The store manager came down and, without saying a word to me, reviewed my return and purchase history. He then came to me and explained the new 30 day return policy that would soon be changing to 90 days. I simply acknowledged this statement with an "okay", and he grabbed my Exec. membership card and AMEX and asked the lady at the return counter to do the return.

So if you were never that happy with the Sony, why didn't you return it back in July of 2006? Was the set defective, or was it that you just wanted something newer or better? Costco's policy was never meant for people to use as their lending library, and unfortunately people who abused the policy ruined it for others like myself, who would use the return policy if my set was defective or stopped working. On the other hand, I think a lot of returns to Costco was due to selling defective sets like the Vizio for example.

So if you were never that happy with the Sony, why didn't you return it back in July of 2006? Was the set defective, or was it that you just wanted something newer or better? Costco's policy was never meant for people to use as their lending library, and unfortunately people who abused the policy ruined it for others like myself, who would use the return policy if my set was defective or stopped working. On the other hand, I think a lot of returns to Costco was due to selling defective sets like the Vizio for example.

Apparently I am not "the only moral person left on the planet"

It is nice to see others saw the situation as ABUSE

I don't know if this is the right place to ask this question but has anyone ever ordered through a company called electricnetmarket.com? They are based out of Spain. They had a ridiculously low price on the display I want to buy. The price seems to good to be true. Are there any problems with ordering with an overseas company? How can you check their seller's rating? I found them through yahoo's search engine but they weren't rated.

No Tool..... you are not alone........

It is one of life's truisms that the many will always suffer from the abuse's of the few.

I personally have enjoyed my Costco membership for the past 12 years. The majority of everything in my home (including my clothes) comes from Costco... so I am not the snappiest dresser.... except when Costco has Tommy Bahama's.. yoo hoo.

The price on TV's at Costco is not always the lowest, but their return policy has made it the place to buy. From what I have noticed above it sounds like if you use the Costco AmExp card to purchase the TV then you will double the warranty....? I guess I need to re-read that section.

After reading on this forum for the last year what some folks felt was "acceptable" return policy I was sure that this could not last.

Pity, but that does seem to be the way of things...........

Apparently I am not "the only moral person left on the planet"

It is nice to see others saw the situation as ABUSE


I need to know if you think this is moral, because I'm worried that you might think me immoral:

I have a defective Vizio. I was holding on to it because I was waiting for them [Vizio] to fix the manufacturing problems, then I was going to return my set to Costco and get a non defective Vizio. Now, when I do that, I'll be under the new return policy for the subsequent set. Darn!

So now my plan is to just hold on to my Vizio until there's a TV out that I consider reliable enough that I will purchase from Best Buy or Circuit City (with their superior financing options and extended warranty programs). Also, when I return my Vizio set, I will cancel my Executive Membership because the store no longer offers anything of value for me to pay $100/year for. In case you need to know in order to pass judgment: I'm not sure how long I'll put up with my defective Vizio before returning to Costco and canceling my membership. It could be 3 months, or maybe up to 2 years.

But, I wanted to get YOUR input before I take this action. If you don't think it's moral, then I guess I'll just keep my defective set and continue shopping at Costco. I might also SEEK out to purchase defective merchandise from Costco because I really want to make you happy....

Also, if your morality judgment changes with the duration that I hold onto my defective Vizio prior to my return, please including a schedule of acceptable return dates with your reply. I understand this is a tall order, so a schedule with my depreciating morality is acceptable.

/end request for the morality police to pass judgment.

I need to know if you think this is moral, because I'm worried that you might think me immoral:

I have a defective Vizio. I was holding on to it because I was waiting for them [Vizio] to fix the manufacturing problems, then I was going to return my set to Costco and get a non defective Vizio. Now, when I do that, I'll be under the new return policy for the subsequent set. Darn!

So now my plan is to just hold on to my Vizio until there's a TV out that I consider reliable enough that I will purchase from Best Buy or Circuit City (with their superior financing options and extended warranty programs). Also, when I return my Vizio set, I will cancel my Executive Membership because the store no longer offers anything of value for me to pay $100/year for. In case you need to know in order to pass judgment: I'm not sure how long I'll put up with my defective Vizio before returning to Costco and canceling my membership. It could be 3 months, or maybe up to 2 years.

But, I wanted to get YOUR input before I take this action. If you don't think it's moral, then I guess I'll just keep my defective set and continue shopping at Costco. I might also SEEK out to purchase defective merchandise from Costco because it's the right thing to do....

Also, if your morality judgment changes with the duration that I hold onto my defective Vizio prior to my return, please including a schedule of acceptable return dates with your reply.

/end request for the morality police to pass judgment.


PG13,

Let me answer this question as though it was an honest inquiry and not just baiting.

First the temerity to even ask such a question is a sad commentary on our current society. If I had asked this question of my father I would have found myself laying on the floor about 10 feet away... after which I would have been taken by the scruff of my neck out back for "further education and illumination."

If you purchase a product which is broken, not functioning, or not functioning up to your personal standards then return the merchandise and purchase something that does meet your needs or requirements.

If there is nothing currently available that meets your needs the fact that your current product does not meet your standards is not license to hold onto this product for two years so that you can return it for a full refund and then purchase something you feel is better and probably less expensive to boot.

Do do so is precisely the type of abuse that has caused Costco to change their very liberal and customer-oriented policies.

Ask yourself how you would feel if you were on the other side of the transaction. If you ran a business selling a product would you like your customers to do as you have suggested?

If your only reason for having a membership at Costco is to be able to purchase TV's use them for a couple of years and then return them for newer, better, and cheaper models..., then please do turn in your membership and move on.

I need to know if you think this is moral, because I'm worried that you might think me immoral:

I have a defective Vizio. I was holding on to it because I was waiting for them [Vizio] to fix the manufacturing problems, then I was going to return my set to Costco and get a non defective Vizio. Now, when I do that, I'll be under the new return policy for the subsequent set. Darn!

So now my plan is to just hold on to my Vizio until there's a TV out that I consider reliable enough that I will purchase from Best Buy or Circuit City (with their superior financing options and extended warranty programs). Also, when I return my Vizio set, I will cancel my Executive Membership because the store no longer offers anything of value for me to pay $100/year for. In case you need to know in order to pass judgment: I'm not sure how long I'll put up with my defective Vizio before returning to Costco and canceling my membership. It could be 3 months, or maybe up to 2 years.

But, I wanted to get YOUR input before I take this action. If you don't think it's moral, then I guess I'll just keep my defective set and continue shopping at Costco. I might also SEEK out to purchase defective merchandise from Costco because it's the right thing to do....

Also, if your morality judgment changes with the duration that I hold onto my defective Vizio prior to my return, please including a schedule of acceptable return dates with your reply.

/end request for the morality police to pass judgment.


Ohh no, what a threat. Please cancel your membership! Tell them tool shed told you to. What is Costco going to do without you? We should throw in the towel right now. How are we going to stay in business when people can go to circuit city, or best buy, who has higher prices, high pressure sales due to commissioned sales agents, a 14-30 day refund policy, and they charge you for an extended refund policy which you would get for free at Costco.

Hey, if you want to throw away your money, go for it. If you need cheesy financing to buy a TV, go for it. And we are shaking in our boots how? Just stop whining about it here. Go down to your local store and cancel your membership. Quite frankly we will be even more profitable and the store will be more pleasant without people like you. I say good riddance, and please don't come back.

I can say with certainty that Costco is not hurting for members. Now all we need is to eliminate the bad members, and more good ones, and I can tell you that the good ones are happy about our refund policy change, because it is generous, reasonable, and still by far the BEST.

BTW, VERY rarely does Circuit City or Best Buy have lower prices on electronics that we do. I hear all day long from my members "this TV is XXX amount of dollars more expensive at CC or BB, your prices are so good" If they do have a lower price, it is rare, and it usually involves a rebate that you will be lucky to get. And you think that their extended warranty is so good that they sell.. haha!! It is highway robbery, and as soon as your TV fails, your warranty is void, and you have to buy a new one for further protection. You are better off buying an extended warranty from the manufacturer which you still can even from Costco.

Interesting thought. Would the increase in sales offset the cost of the returns? Obviously for Costco it didn't work. But, that's not to say that for Sam's it wouldn't.

The increased draw into their stores and the other purchases by these prospective TV purchasers may be what Sam's wants. Their gross margins are higher than Costco's and they may be able to better absorb the returns costs through the somewhat higher margins on the non-electronics sales.

Guys, don't think for a second, that Costco has made this decision in a vacuum.

I suspect that as long as the cost to costco for unlimited returns was minimal, and it has been, because, it isn't costco that eats the cost of returns, it's the manufacturers that got stuck with all the units coming back. Probably costco's only out of pocket was customer service personnel time, paperwork processing and probably some shipping.

I has been my understanding for years that costco has always demanded that manufacturers take back anything, anytime, if they wanted to do business with Costco. As it has always been said, costco and walmart put lots of companies out of business - their suppliers. Often a company gets in to costco, (or walmart and all of a sudden this big box house is 30 or 50% of total business. Then they wake up one day and Costco (or walmart) has changed to another vendor, and the company can't cut back its operations fast enough, to make up for a 30 or 50% drop is revenues, and ends up in big financial trouble.

However, I digress. Rumor had it a couple months ago, Panasonic - who sells lots of projectors to costco, through one of its distributors, was going to clamp down on returns from that distributor, because they were absurdly high, due almost certainly to costco.

Obviously, if the distributor can't ship all those open projectors back to Panasonic for a refund, then they can't afford to take them back from Costco.

As an end result, most likely a number of key suppliers finally said "enough" we won't take back product indefinitely - and if you insist - bye bye.

Costo, remember has the huge advantage of carrying only a couple products in most catagories, so normally, they can say - fine - Panasonic, - you're out, who's next... But the problem now, for costco, is that in the TV arena, all the manufacturers know, and would demand return rate information, and they probably just can't find alternate lines. The exception - of course- Visio (for plasmas's etc.) Costco probably sells more than half of Visio's production, so they are "trapped" they probably can't quit costco, and survive... So even they would be lobbying for a more restrictive return policy.

As to all of you complaining and threatening to return your exec cards... Costco will probably appreciate that.... If the new 90 day full refund program (still 3-6 times better than most places) isn't enough to keep you happy, you are probably more trouble to costco, than the potential loss to them of a fraction of 1% of members...

And to those who now plan to go back to mom and pop shops, for advice, and support... My guess is many of you probably used to go to the mom and pops before, got all the advice and then went to costco to save 5% or for the return privilege. As such, maybe its time the mom and pop got to recoup some of that free knowledge that many of us have taken advantage of.

Who knows? with the new policy in effect from costco, and if walmart ops do the same, then we may be dawning on a new age - one where you can actually walk into smaller shops and get demos of things like $1000 and $2000 projectors, etc, something that - in large part, due to Costco, etc., just hasn't been possible for years.

Most small businesses - at least on the projector side, won't demo any projectors available from costco, walmart or major online discounters.... wonder why?

My old company had a really nice demo room, could do 3 home theater projectors side by side on a super wide custom screen that was big enough for 3 98" diagonal images. We used to have people come from all over to see the latest HT projectors side by side to figure out the best for them. We finally closed the room after about 2 years, after failing to figure out how to get a decent close ratio. People would come in and spend hours watching, asking questions, and then ask us why we didn't have an unlimited return policy, or why we had to charge sales tax, and leave for costco, or out of state online dealers.

I will admit, everyone who came by was appreciative, they just expected all that time and advice for free, no obligation on their part. When we decided to close the room, we even offered "by appointment - 2 hours - $150 consulting charge, but 100% applicable to purchase of any projector within 60 days... Most people were offended that we would charge for our time... So that lasted about a month. We were probably the last dealer in So. Cal, to have demos of panasonic AE900u, Sanyo Z4's Optomas, BenQ's Sony's, Mitsubishi's and JVC projectors, all available for demo, in a side by side environment....

BTW, a last thought - stop complaining - you can still buy a new whatever from Costo, and return it in 89 days, and then buy another and return it in 89 days... OK, its less convenient having to buy 8 in two years instead of 1 or two... but, if like many of you, you're just returning them for latest model or better price... Nothing lost but some inconvenience.

Gotta run, need to return 10 pounds of Rib Eye steaks I bought last November that I forgot to cook, they're starting to be seriously green... I probably should have refrigerated them... From what you guys say, its only electronics they won't take back, right?

Ohh no, what a threat. Please cancel your membership! Tell them tool shed told you to. What is Costco going to do without you? We should throw in the towel right now. How are we going to stay in business when people can go to circuit city, or best buy, who has higher prices, high pressure sales due to commissioned sales agents, a 14-30 day refund policy, and they charge you for an extended refund policy which you would get for free at Costco.

Hey, if you want to throw away your money, go for it. If you need cheesy financing to buy a TV, go for it. And we are shaking in our boots how? Just stop whining about it here. Go down to your local store and cancel your membership. Quite frankly we will be even more profitable and the store will be more pleasant without people like you. I say good riddance, and please don't come back.

I can say with certainty that Costco is not hurting for members. Now all we need is to eliminate the bad members, and more good ones, and I can tell you that the good ones are happy about our refund policy change, because it is generous, reasonable, and still by far the BEST.

BTW, VERY rarely does Circuit City or Best Buy have lower prices on electronics that we do. I hear all day long from my members "this TV is XXX amount of dollars more expensive at CC or BB, your prices are so good" If they do have a lower price, it is rare, and it usually involves a rebate that you will be lucky to get. And you think that their extended warranty is so good that they sell.. haha!! It is highway robbery, and as soon as your TV fails, your warranty is void, and you have to buy a new one for further protection. You are better off buying an extended warranty from the manufacturer which you still can even from Costco.

I did go to BB after purchasing two TV's from Costco one died 3 days after purchase the other 1 week after.Which they did give me a hard time about returning the second one even though I could prove it was bad and did.Did get TH-50PX600U for a couple of bills less than what they wanted for the TH-50PX6U at costco.I agree with the part of buying just to return a couple of years for something better is wrong but I would not feel bad if it went out within a year and I returned it.
As a member it would be nice to receive notice from them that they are changing their return policy instead of when ask they give me the run around and this was Corporate.
The other thing is the people who judge others are usually the the ones who are also cheating on their income tax or see its ok to tell that little white lie.

Ask yourself how you would feel if you were on the other side of the transaction. If you ran a business selling a product would you like your customers to do as you have suggested?



If I ran a business, I wouldn't have been so foolish to offer a 100% satisfaction policy forever, like Costco. I would offer something like every other retailer in America?

If I did offer a 100% satisfaction policy, then I guess it's because my bean counters told me that to do so I'd sell more product and end up ahead... Ooops, my bean counters were wrong?


BTW, I didn't see you schedule of morality posted....

Ohh no, what a threat. Please cancel your membership! Tell them tool shed told you to. What is Costco going to do without you? We should throw in the towel right now. How are we going to stay in business when people can go to circuit city, or best buy, who has higher prices, high pressure sales due to commissioned sales agents, a 14-30 day refund policy, and they charge you for an extended refund policy which you would get for free at Costco.

It wasn't really a threat. A threat is telling you I'm going to buy a 30 pack of unsalted butter, let in melt in my car, then return it telling them I wanted salted butter and they sold me unsalted butter. THEN cancel my membership.

Hey, if you want to throw away your money, go for it.

Yeah, I like to throw my money away with lower prices, more creative financing, nationally supported extended warranties, better selection, and price matching/guarantees.[/QUOTE]

and I can tell you that the good ones are happy about our refund policy change,

I agree with you. Customers will appreciate a more restrictive return policy. Customers LOVE that. They LOVE that because they rejoice when any company gives them more restrictive policies. Sometimes I've heard they break out in song? Good customers, as I define them, are customers that rejoice when a company changes a policy which benefits the company, and is more restrictive of consumers. Costco loves good customers, and they want all other customers to leave. Good riddance!

If I ran a business, I wouldn't have been so foolish to offer a 100% satisfaction policy forever, like Costco. I would offer something like every other retailer in America?

If I did offer a 100% satisfaction policy, then I guess it's because my bean counters told me that to do so I'd sell more product and end up ahead... Ooops, my bean counters were wrong?


BTW, I didn't see you schedule of morality posted....

Same old same old...

Markets are fluid - times change. The unlimited return privilege was nice while it lasted, and it quite apparently made sense for years.... But for electronics, notably TV's until the last couple of years, we saw the usual 10-20+% price drops from year to year. It might have made a few people decide to use the return privilege, for the purpose of upgrading, but for most, buying a $600 TV and returning it a year later because the replacement was down to $500, probably isn't worth the time and hassles...

But when the cheapest plasma drops from $5000 to $2995 in 10 months, it's going to bring a lot of people out of the woodwork, and bascially that's what we are seeing, with the rapidly falling Plasma, LCDTV and RPTV products - this past year, between the entry of 1080p models, and general falling prices, it becomes tempting for who knows - 5% or 10% instead of 1% of the people to "upgrade" by returning.

At some point, the manufacturers say - enough - and costco finds that it has to eat the losses instead of the manufacturers.

And that brings us to the present.

I think the probable reason why computers have had limited return policy at costco for 5 years now, is the same thing. They basically couldn't find any brand name PC manufacturers who would take back old PC's, they became price/performance obsolete in less than a year.

Ahh well, Costco's changed their policy, so it's water under the bridge.... What can we bitch about next? -art

Ahh well, Costco's changed their policy, so it's water under the bridge.... What can we bitch about next? -art


I think this should sum it up!

Thx presenter.

[seriously]

So if you were never that happy with the Sony, why didn't you return it back in July of 2006? Was the set defective, or was it that you just wanted something newer or better? Costco's policy was never meant for people to use as their lending library, and unfortunately people who abused the policy ruined it for others like myself, who would use the return policy if my set was defective or stopped working. On the other hand, I think a lot of returns to Costco was due to selling defective sets like the Vizio for example.
Yep. Apparent cooling fan issues. Two lamps replaced prematurely before Sony didn't want anything more to do with me.

Personally, and I conveyed this to the manager on Thursday, I'm quite pleased they're drawing the line somewhere. I've been a CC stockholder for 7+ years and spend a lot of money there.

Costco's policy was never meant for people to use as their lending library, and unfortunately people who abused the policy ruined it for others like myself, who would use the return policy if my set was defective or stopped working. On the other hand, I think a lot of returns to Costco was due to selling defective sets like the Vizio for example.

Even though there was probably a lot of Vizio sets returned with genuine problems, as they very well should have. I'd bet that there was even more non-defective laptops that were returned just a few days shy of the six month limit for returns on computers. And when you add all those in with all the non-defective TV returns, I'm sure it was a lot more returns for non-defective products that were done just in order to try a get a free upgrade, than many people think. And I would guess that something like iPods, were also ripe targets for abuse by the "renting" crowd.

I don't know if this is the right place to ask this question but has anyone ever ordered through a company called electricnetmarket.com? They are based out of Spain. They had a ridiculously low price on the display I want to buy. The price seems to good to be true. Are there any problems with ordering with an overseas company? How can you check their seller's rating? I found them through yahoo's search engine but they weren't rated.


How do you plan on getting any warranty work done if needed in the US, for a product you bought from retailer located in Spain?

Even though there was probably a lot of Vizio sets returned with genuine problems, as they very well should have. I'd bet that there was even more non-defective laptops that were returned just a few days shy of the six month limit for returns on computers. And when you add all those in with all the non-defective TV returns, I'm sure it was a lot more returns for non-defective products that were done just in order to try a get a free upgrade, than many people think. And I would guess that something like iPods, were also ripe targets for abuse by the "renting" crowd.

Just a quick question do you always look for the worst in people there was probably a lot of returns that were legit I agree some people take advantage of every loop hole they can find.You know like many do on their taxes and Companys do on theirs,our Government Officials and we wonder were the youth of today get it from.

I have a defective Vizio. I was holding on to it because I was waiting for them [Vizio] to fix the manufacturing problems, then I was going to return my set to Costco and get a non defective Vizio. Now, when I do that, I'll be under the new return policy for the subsequent set. Darn!

So now my plan is to just hold on to my Vizio until there's a TV out that I consider reliable enough that I will purchase from Best Buy or Circuit City (with their superior financing options and extended warranty programs). Also, when I return my Vizio set, I will cancel my Executive Membership because the store no longer offers anything of value for me to pay $100/year for. In case you need to know in order to pass judgment: I'm not sure how long I'll put up with my defective Vizio before returning to Costco and canceling my membership. It could be 3 months, or maybe up to 2 years.


Hmmm, it must not be that defective! In that you already put up with it for even any amount of time. And now even say that you may still do so, for anywhere from 3 more months or even up to 2 more years from now.

Just a quick question do you always look for the worst in people there was probably a lot of returns that were legit I agree some people take advantage of every loop hole they can find.You know like many do on their taxes and Companys do on theirs,our Government Officials and we wonder were the youth of today get it from.

Yeah so, and your point is?

On one hand it looks like you are trying to say that something like cheating on your taxes is OK, and on the other hand it looks like you are trying to say it is bad, and that it is also a bad influence on youth today. So which one is it? You can't have it both ways.

Obviously the amount of non-legit returns got to a point where something needed to be done about it. The legit returns for actual defective products probably did very little in contributing to this happening.

Yeah so, and your point is?

On one hand it looks like you are trying to say that something like cheating on your taxes is OK, and on the other hand it looks like you are trying to say it is bad, and that it is also a bad influence on youth today. So which one is it? You can't have it both ways.

Obviously the amount of non-legit returns got to a point where something needed to be done about it. The legit returns for actual defective products probably did very little in contributing to this happening.

Trying to see where you see me saying its ok and I do agree with you on the statement of Johnla thats ridiculous to just hold on to a TV if its defective then take it back when they have something better take back now get your money back if Costco doesn't have another Vizio

We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell, with a full refund. Exceptions: Televisions, computers, cameras, camcorders, iPOD/MP3 players and cellular phones must be returned within 90 days of purchase for a refund.

That is from the US Costco website - but it hasn't been posted on the Canadian site yet. I got my fingers crossed that the change doesn't happen up here - or at least until after I buy a TV :D

I agree with you. Customers will appreciate a more restrictive return policy. Customers LOVE that. They LOVE that because they rejoice when any company gives them more restrictive policies. Sometimes I've heard they break out in song? Good customers, as I define them, are customers that rejoice when a company changes a policy which benefits the company, and is more restrictive of consumers. Costco loves good customers, and they want all other customers to leave. Good riddance!

67% of all returns at costco are/were made in the first 90 days. That is why they changed the policy to 90 days. so many members were APPALLED when they saw 10 year old tvs coming back. Why? Cause they knew the cost of that return (which after 10 years costco eats every penny) was passed onto them.

I agree with tool shed, stop by my building and I will happily refund your membership and say good riddance.

Even though there was probably a lot of Vizio sets returned with genuine problems, as they very well should have. I'd bet that there was even more non-defective laptops that were returned just a few days shy of the six month limit for returns on computers. And when you add all those in with all the non-defective TV returns, I'm sure it was a lot more returns for non-defective products that were done just in order to try a get a free upgrade, than many people think. And I would guess that something like iPods, were also ripe targets for abuse by the "renting" crowd.
I can honestly say from first hand experience. When it came to returns on electronics that were over 6 months old or longer.... the abuse FAR OUT WEIGHED the legit.

After working for costco as long as I have you can easily get a sense for those who are legit and those who think they can rent whatever the hell they want. It is also easier to come to that conclusion when we research their returns and spending habits.

No Tool..... you are not alone........

It is one of life's truisms that the many will always suffer from the abuse's of the few.

I personally have enjoyed my Costco membership for the past 12 years. The majority of everything in my home (including my clothes) comes from Costco... so I am not the snappiest dresser.... except when Costco has Tommy Bahama's.. yoo hoo.

The price on TV's at Costco is not always the lowest, but their return policy has made it the place to buy. From what I have noticed above it sounds like if you use the Costco AmExp card to purchase the TV then you will double the warranty....? I guess I need to re-read that section.

After reading on this forum for the last year what some folks felt was "acceptable" return policy I was sure that this could not last.

Pity, but that does seem to be the way of things...........

Well it is nice to find you on this side of the discussion. Personally I would have liked to see costco just ask the worst offenders to take their "borrowing" elsewhere, but that would have been an endless process. Unfortunately so many must suffer for the wrong doings of the few. 90 days is still the best you can find, and a free extension of the warranty is un heard of (except credit cards) Just the same, EW are easily purchased through 3rd parties.

Costco will lose my yearly membership money. I've never returned a thing at Costco but they took away the peace of mind buying there . Now there's only the high price,long drive left.

I think Costco did this 'smart' move too late,its now a stupid move. HDTV is maturing. current 1080p is likely the reigning standard for the next 10 years. Bandwidth limitations,DVD format, vastly improved contrast and reliability over years past means we will see far fewer and smaller improvement down the road. Where people paid $5000 for 42" EP in years past had more motivation to turn in. A customer buying 47" 1080p for $1700 today has fewer incentive to turn in in a few years.

Damage to Costco balance sheet is done history . They will lose, not gain from this move.

Costco will lose my yearly membership money. I've never returned a thing at Costco but they took away the peace of mind buying there . Now there's only the high price,long drive left.

I think Costco did this 'smart' move too late,its now a stupid move. HDTV is maturing. current 1080p is likely the reigning standard for the next 10 years. Bandwidth limitations,DVD format, vastly improved contrast and reliability over years past means we will see far fewer and smaller improvement down the road. Where people paid $5000 for 42" EP in years past had more motivation to turn in. A customer buying 47" 1080p for $1700 today has fewer incentive to turn in in a few years.

Damage to Costco balance sheet is done history . They will lose, not gain from this move.

How could you not be satisfied with a return policy 3x's that of any other big box retailer? And I can assure you, as the abusive returns slow, you WILL see a drop in price on consumer electronics. I don't care what people say, on abusive returns Costco eats most of, if not all of that money.

Also this return policy ONLY is for Computers (90 day computer is still AMAZING) Tv's, MP3's, Cameras/Camcorders, and cell phones. Everything else is still 100% satisfaction, the most generous and liberal policy EVER.

How could you not be satisfied with a return policy 3x's that of any other big box retailer?

Not trying to add fuel to the fire, but just wanted to point out that Walmart has a 90 day policy that applies to televisions also..

Personally I would have liked to see costco just ask the worst offenders to take their "borrowing" elsewhere, but that would have been an endless process.

Yes that would have been nice if they could have done something like that instead. But even though they are a membership club that has some certain rules you need to abide by, unfortunately in todays age of lawsuits at the drop of a hat, even if they added a new set of rules aimed at punishing such offenders/abusers. There is probably no legal way they could do that and not be sued by someone saying that they are unfair and that they are profiling/discriminating against certain types of customers.

Trying to see where you see me saying its ok

I think it may have something to do with the way you phrased your question to me, and also the way it seemed to run into the entire post in general.

HDTV is maturing. current 1080p is likely the reigning standard for the next 10 years. Bandwidth limitations,DVD format, vastly improved contrast and reliability over years past means we will see far fewer and smaller improvement down the road. Where people paid $5000 for 42" EP in years past had more motivation to turn in. A customer buying 47" 1080p for $1700 today has fewer incentive to turn in in a few years.

Not really, you still have the people that would try to use it to move from a 42" set to a 47" set or a 47" set to a 50", and the 50" set people at some time would maybe use it to move up to a 60"-65" set. And someday those with the 60"-65" sets maybe would want to move up to even a 100"+ set, if such sizes ever become common. Always wanting to upgrade to something bigger or better in consumer electronics is a never ending process for a lot of people. So there is still a lot of room left in ways that it could be abused, even if every set made was a 1080p set.

Damage to Costco balance sheet is done history . They will lose, not gain from this move.

I doubt that they will lose in the long run. In the short term maybe some at first, they will likely lose some members because of it through cancellations, and maybe take in a bunch of returns from those that cancel their membership also. But in the long run, it's probably going to be a lot better for them.

I wonder if this applies to projectors as well. They don't specifically call out projectors in their statement, but I'm wondering if they consider it to fall under televisions.

Costco's new Concierge Program:

Costco Concierge (http://www.costco.com/Images/Content/Misc/PDF/concierge.PDF)

wonder if this applies to Xbox 360

How could you not be satisfied with a return policy 3x's that of any other big box retailer?

No problem with the return policy, but Costco's selection sucks, their prices are high, and it's a long drive for many folks. So the change in policy is clearly gonna cost them business. Whether one will offset the other remains to be seen...

No problem with the return policy, but Costco's selection sucks, their prices are high, and it's a long drive for many folks. So the change in policy is clearly gonna cost them business. Whether one will offset the other remains to be seen...

u can always buy a higher end product with 3 years warranty from any authorized dealer, with no sales tax for costco $$$$$

serious question.

Is a projector a TV? Maybe I need to ask costco for clarification.

Not trying to add fuel to the fire, but just wanted to point out that Walmart has a 90 day policy that applies to televisions also..
Walmarts Electronics Return Policy...

ELECTRONICS

* Computer hardware: Must be returned with any included software within 15 days of receipt.
* Computer components and computer accessories: Must be returned within 45 days of receipt.
* Computer software: Must be returned unopened.
* Camcorders and digital cameras: Must be returned within 30 days of receipt.
* GPS Units, Digital Music Players, and Portable Video Players: May be returned for refund or exchange with receipt WITHIN 15 DAYS.

I wonder if this applies to projectors as well. They don't specifically call out projectors in their statement, but I'm wondering if they consider it to fall under televisions.
It does not specificaly say....I woudl assume that it will be left open to interpretation. Meaning....It all depends on where you buy/return it and the manager that is on duty that day.

wonder if this applies to Xbox 360
No it does not. However I can guarunty returning EXTREMELY old (2-3yrs+)360's will not be easy, so if you attempt to do so...expect a hassle.

No problem with the return policy, but Costco's selection sucks, their prices are high, and it's a long drive for many folks. So the change in policy is clearly gonna cost them business. Whether one will offset the other remains to be seen...

I am guessing the pricing is significantly different in your area, for the most part our electronics are WAY cheaper than the CC 2 blocks away. And I know in some areas Costco's are spread out pretty far. We have some members in my building that drive an hour to get there. and they happily do so once some times twice a week. However in the next 5-10yrs costco is planning on nearly DOUBLING the amount of US locations.... you never know, there could be a Costco in your back yard soon.

It does not specificaly say....I woudl assume that it will be left open to interpretation. Meaning....It all depends on where you buy/return it and the manager that is on duty that day.

The return policy applies to only the items listed. If it is not listed, then it is not offered under the concierge program. The concierge program was created to offer members a efficient way to get help with their purchases. Some stores might try and group projectors with TVs, but corporate has said specifically that they are not covered under concierge and therefore not covered under new 90 day policy.

One of the hidden downsides to the old policy, was Costco's leverage with vendors. So much stuff was getting returned, that in many cases, the vendors were making Costco salvage product, rather than return it for credit. Costco was also losing out on selection and choices because of their reputations with the vendors. At some point Costco was being forced into crappier and crappier choices in their selections because of the rampant abuse of the return policy.
At very least, this should do some to help with the vendors and get Costco back up to the treasure hunt atmosphere we used to see in the electronics department.

No problem with the return policy, but Costco's selection sucks, their prices are high, and it's a long drive for many folks. So the change in policy is clearly gonna cost them business. Whether one will offset the other remains to be seen...

For me..it is a 5 minute drive....But remember I am a Costco Addict :D

it does not affect projectors ?

ToolBox13,

I know that the change is being phased in in different regions. But how about Costco.Com ?

Is the change effective "Now" as of Feb.26th if I order on-line ?

I am in Maryland and they don't carry the high end Panasonics in the store.

Thanks, Tim

ToolBox13,

I know that the change is being phased in in different regions. But how about Costco.Com ?

Is the change effective "Now" as of Feb.26th if I order on-line ?

I am in Maryland and they don't carry the high end Panasonics in the store.

Thanks, Tim

Yes ...it has already changed on Costco.com

Uh guys this is a non-issue. Costco's limiting RETURNS to 90 days but upping manufacturer warranty coverage to 2 years.

Fair trade in my book. Also (mostly) avoids catering to the abuser crowd.

ToolBox13,

I know that the change is being phased in in different regions. But how about Costco.Com ?

Is the change effective "Now" as of Feb.26th if I order on-line ?

I am in Maryland and they don't carry the high end Panasonics in the store.

Thanks, Tim
Ricksribs is correct, this was posted some time last night....

How do I return an item?
Costco.com offers convenient returns at any one of our Costco warehouses worldwide. To expedite the return process, please have your order confirmation email with you.

Simply return your purchase at any one of our Costco warehouses worldwide for a refund (including shipping and handling). If you are unable to return your order at one of our warehouses, please email customerservice@costco.com or call our customer service center at 1-800-955-2292 for assistance. To expedite the processing of your return, please reference your order number.

We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell, with a full refund. Exceptions: Televisions, computers, cameras, camcorders, iPOD/MP3 players and cellular phones must be returned within 90 days of purchase for a refund.

If I bought a TV under the old return policy (legit defect less than a month old) and exchanged for a new TV (different brand) from Costco, would the new TV fall under the new return policy or the old one?

Costco does not do "exchanges", even a 1 for 1 even exchange. You have to return the old one then buy the new one.

Uh guys this is a non-issue. Costco's limiting RETURNS to 90 days but upping manufacturer warranty coverage to 2 years.

Fair trade in my book. Also (mostly) avoids catering to the abuser crowd.

Agreed. I've returned two TVs in past years, one that wasn't satisfactory and one HDTV that had problems with its HDMI inputs. Both returns were easily decided on within 30 days. In the former situation, 90 days is more than enough time to decide whether a TV is one that you are either thrilled with or that you can or can't live with. Your decisional process will usually not take that long even with all of the variables that can affect the quality of an HDTV's picture. If the set is defective or goes bad, that is usually obvious pretty quickly as well. I can't blame any retailer for deciding to no longer take back any merchandise after several years, especially one that is as liberal in its policies as Costco is and, reportedly, treats it employees rather well.

Costco does not do "exchanges", even a 1 for 1 even exchange. You have to return the old one then buy the new one.

They don't do exchanges in the pure sense but they can do an equivalent. My neighbor got an LCD TV from our local Costco and it had a some problems. He still liked the set so he brought it back to swap for another of the same model. What they did was to give him a store credit that they input onto a Costco Gift Card. All he had to was to load the new set onto a cart, take it to a register and present the card for swiping. That sure beat giving him a fistful of cash like they used to do.

They don't do exchanges in the pure sense but they can do an equivalent. My neighbor got an LCD TV from our local Costco and it had a some problems. He still liked the set so he brought it back to swap for another of the same model. What they did was to give him a store credit that they input onto a Costco Gift Card. All he had to was to load the new set onto a cart, take it to a register and present the card for swiping. That sure beat giving him a fistful of cash like they used to do.

Hmmm I see...so no exchanges. Then I guess the store credit will be used to buy a new TV and the new TV would then fall under the new return policy. Correct? It would stink if that was the case because I bought the TV because of the great return policy and would hate to give up it up.

What about this 2 year extended warranty on the new policy? Is there an extra cost? Is the warranty extended automatically 2 years by Costco? What’s the difference then between this policy and the old policy? Seems like a pretty good deal to me if it is included in cost.

They don't do exchanges in the pure sense but they can do an equivalent. My neighbor got an LCD TV from our local Costco and it had a some problems. He still liked the set so he brought it back to swap for another of the same model. What they did was to give him a store credit that they input onto a Costco Gift Card. All he had to was to load the new set onto a cart, take it to a register and present the card for swiping. That sure beat giving him a fistful of cash like they used to do.

There are OCCASIONAL exceptions to this rule. If a defective item is purchased and borought back with in a day or two...sometimes we will just swap it out. The main reason this is not done regularily is for inventory reasons. you have to remember at the busier stores more than 300 refund transactions are made in a day,l often times with 5+ items in those transactions. I would say it is not uncommon to see 600-700+ items come back on a really busy day. So inventory on that crap is important.

Hmmm I see...so no exchanges. Then I guess the store credit will be used to buy a new TV and the new TV would then fall under the new return policy. Correct? It would stink if that was the case because I bought the TV because of the great return policy and would hate to give up it up.

What about this 2 year extended warranty on the new policy? Is there an extra cost? Is the warranty extended automatically 2 years by Costco? What’s the difference then between this policy and the old policy? Seems like a pretty good deal to me if it is included in cost.

No extra cost for the warranty. That is free with purchase. I have yet to see fine print (if any) on this part of the policy. However as soon as the information comes forward I will share it here. I expect to find plenty of new info today when I go in.

I don't know if this is the right place to ask this question but has anyone ever ordered through a company called electricnetmarket.com? They are based out of Spain. They had a ridiculously low price on the display I want to buy. The price seems to good to be true. Are there any problems with ordering with an overseas company? How can you check their seller's rating? I found them through yahoo's search engine but they weren't rated.The general rule of thumb is to avoid overseas vendors like the plague - it's almost always a scam to get your credit card number or to get you to wire transfer the money to them and you'll never get your product.

There is no good reason to buy a TV from an overseas vendor - the price is too good to be true for a reason. Avoid.

was this link already posted. Sorry if it was.

http://consumerist.com/consumer/costco/costco-leak-electronic-returns-limited-to-90days-starting-today-239610.php

do you think they have a grandfather clause, meaning if you purchased a set a month ago, does it fall under the old satisfaction guarantee?

do you think they have a grandfather clause, meaning if you purchased a set a month ago, does it fall under the old satisfaction guarantee?

The answer is Yes....as I was told by a manager...BUT....depending on the length of time would be up to the discrection of each individual store......

I was told 1-2 years...No problem.....5-6 years probably not....

do you think they have a grandfather clause, meaning if you purchased a set a month ago, does it fall under the old satisfaction guarantee?

All previous purchases are not subject to the new policy.

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s133/vandit_photo/costco.jpg

Well for those of you shopping at Costco in Canada (starting to think I'm the only Canadian on this thread) the policy has not been implemented north of the border. According to the manager at my local store, the abuse is far more prevelent in the US (which obviously have 10 times the population) than it is up here (around 2% give or take). Therefore, same return policy - at least for now.

However, this is in contradiction to what I was told last week which was basically Costco is a worldwide company and if policies change in the US it will change everywhere. That does not appear to be the case - thankfully for those of us who enjoy 50 inch plasmaz ice-mounted in our igloos. ;)

What about this 2 year extended warranty on the new policy? Is there an extra cost? Is the warranty extended automatically 2 years by Costco? What’s the difference then between this policy and the old policy? Seems like a pretty good deal to me if it is included in cost.

It's a 2 year total warranty, it's not another 2 years added onto the original warranty. For most sets, it's really only a extended warranty of 1 year. Because most sets already have a 1 year warranty and Costco is adding on a additional 1 year to that. So it's pretty much the same deal you would also get with using just about any credit card to purchase a set other than a Discover card. As almost all credit cards now automatically will add a additional year of extended warranty. But Discover cards offer no such thing.

What about DVD players, DVD/VCR combos, VCRs, cable boxes, and TiVo boxes? Are they now 90 days return?

All you pious high and mighty people on here that think you know how long is good for me to evaulate a product, how about this as something you geniuses havent thought of...in my case, i am away from home 3 of 4 weeks a month usually, and sometimes home on the weekends in between. so that means i get about 10-11 days a month where i can watch a tv in my own home. so going by you geniuses "90 days is plenty" policy, i should actually get 9 months to evaluate, because thats an equivalent 90 days for me. In fact, my first vizio plasma i bought from costco, which I had from July to November 2005, actually had maybe one to two months of use on it when i returned it...even though by the genius time period and costco time period, i now wouldnt be able to return it, even though it also developed a bad pixel. try using some brains sometimes and think that maybe not everyone out there can go home each day and stare at a TV every day for two years then decide they want to trade up at costco. one of the reasons i BOUGHT this UNKNOWN at the time brand is because i knew no matter how much i traveled, i could return it at any time at my leisure....not anymore.

dtrell.......

i am cutting you no extra slack... I spend 1/2 of my life on the road away from home... and if you cannot decide if you like a TV after watching it for 11 days times 3 months... for 33 days then you have some other issues to deal with.

ok great...now we have another high and mighty pious moral arbitrator deciding that i now should be able to decide within 33 days....gee at that rate i should just forget costco and go to best buy and circuit city with their 30 day policies...because stevo says its GOOD ENOUGH...thank you for being my moral compass and for letting me know what i think is a good evaluation time...look out johnla..youve got competition...he says youre a fool for allowing me 90 whole days....

Please do us all a favor and go to Best Buy.........

do i hear 15 days?? i think 15 days is plenty to evaluate any new TV...i think ALL stores should go to 15 days max...all you idiots that need 30 days, youre ruining it for the rest of us and making best buy and circuit city have to raise their prices because of you. all you 29 day rent-a-center people...how dare you...

Please do us all a favor and go to Best Buy.........

I think everyone should stop the judging and worry about their own morals.

All you pious high and mighty people on here that think you know how long is good for me to evaulate a product, how about this as something you geniuses havent thought of...in my case, i am away from home 3 of 4 weeks a month usually, and sometimes home on the weekends in between. so that means i get about 10-11 days a month where i can watch a tv in my own home. so going by you geniuses "90 days is plenty" policy, i should actually get 9 months to evaluate, because thats an equivalent 90 days for me. In fact, my first vizio plasma i bought from costco, which I had from July to November 2005, actually had maybe one to two months of use on it when i returned it...even though by the genius time period and costco time period, i now wouldnt be able to return it, even though it also developed a bad pixel. try using some brains sometimes and think that maybe not everyone out there can go home each day and stare at a TV every day for two years then decide they want to trade up at costco. one of the reasons i BOUGHT this UNKNOWN at the time brand is because i knew no matter how much i traveled, i could return it at any time at my leisure....not anymore.

Your schedule is your problem, not Costcos. I'm glad they are stopping the abuse

Your schedule is your problem, not Costcos. I'm glad they are stopping the abuse

OK point made now go chill

Even if the 90 days return policy for televisions goes into effect today for Costco, they still keep track on your history of returns, and can restrict. Wal-Mart also has a 90 days return policy for televisions, and they do not keep track on your returns. That said, we can now say that buying TVs at Wal-Mart is more liberal than Costco. And Wal-Mart has no membership fee.

Your schedule is your problem, not Costcos. I'm glad they are stopping the abuse

I agree. If a store wants to provide a service to customers where they can buy something, use it for months and months, and then decide to return it, they're more than welcome, but I prefer not to shop there as I don't like paying extra for this service. I do my research, take it home, and 99% of the time, it's satisfactory. I'd prefer that Costco go to a 30-day return policy and lower their prices to reflect this policy.

REI is another good company that is having to raise prices unnecessarily to cover clear return abuse. A see tens of posts on other forums where someone will buy a bicycle, use it for a year, and then return it, saying that they've decided it doesn't fit them anymore. What a crock.

- Mark

id prefer costco goes to a NO RETURN policy...then we can all get plasmas for one dollar each from all the money they will be saving. i can handle a 58 inch panasonic for one dollar..that would be sweet. there, i just solved the problem of the 89 day abuse...

That's a ridiculous statement. What's sad is that the policy made it possible for guys like me to take a chance on off brands like Vizio, Sceptre, and MaxEnt. I own a couple of Sceptres and a Vizio and I'm happy with them. I don't know that I would have taken a chance on these sets without the security of the former Costco return policy. I know that the sets are warrantied and that Costco is extending the warranty, but in today's world we don't know if the company will honor the warranty. It's tough enough to get the established firms to honor their obligations.

I understand and respect Costco's decision. It was the right thing for the company to do.

I do want to express my disgust with those of you who abused the policy. You got what you deserved. Unfortunately, you have ended up stealing from the rest of us. But, you probably don't even see that.

I'm not a Costco member, never bought an electronics item from them and obviously never returned one.
However, I was considering purchasing a 50" plasma from them once I've decided on which one. I was even prepared to pay $300-500 more than the same plasma at another retailer.
The reason? Certainly NOT to return it in 2 or 3 years and 'upgrade' to a better one.
The reason for me was very simple, PEACE OF MIND!
We all read the horror stories of people who, even having an extended warranty, have to jump through all these hoops to get their sets repaired, having to part with their sets for weeks at a time, only to discover the same problems as before when they get their sets back, etc.
Costco was different, and I'm quite disappointed that those who abused Costco's customer friendly policy, have forced the rest of us to lose this great and unique feature in big item purchasing... peace of mind. :mad:

I'm not a Costco member, never bought an electronics item from them and obviously never returned one.
However, I was considering purchasing a 50" plasma from them once I've decided on which one. I was even prepared to pay $300-500 more than the same plasma at another retailer.
The reason? Certainly NOT to return it in 2 or 3 years and 'upgrade' to a better one.
The reason for me was very simple, PEACE OF MIND!
We all read the horror stories of people who, even having an extended warranty, have to jump through all these hoops to get their sets repaired, having to part with their sets for weeks at a time, only to discover the same problems as before when they get their sets back, etc.
Costco was different, and I'm quite disappointed that those who abused Costco's customer friendly policy, have forced the rest of us to lose this great and unique feature in big item purchasing... peace of mind. :mad:

You still get a two year warranty I bought my Panasonic TH-50PX600U from Best Buy for less than what Costco wants for the Panasonic TH-50PX60U online plus shipping I think in the store they have the Panasonic TH-50PX6U but its a couple bills more than the TH-50PX60U.
I then turned and bought the Mack Extended Warranty for 3 times less than Best Buy

You still get a two year warranty I bought my Panasonic TH-50PX600U from Best Buy for less than what Costco wants for the Panasonic TH-50PX60U online plus shipping I think in the store they have the Panasonic TH-50PX6U but its a couple bills more than the TH-50PX60U.
I then turned and bought the Mack Extended Warranty for 3 times less than Best Buy
That is my whole point! EVEN with an extended warranty one has to go through the hustle of giving up their TV for days if not weeks and often having to deal with the same problem again and again.
With Costco, that extra $200-500 was buying you 'peace of mind'. Return what's broken and pick up another set.
Mind you, for smaller purchases of $100-$600 their policy was nice but not an absolute necessity for me, that's why I never became a member. But when you drop $3000, it's nice to have that extra reassurance... too bad it's history now.

For me..it is a 5 minute drive....But remember I am a Costco Addict :D

How fast do you drive?

Link from Costco's site with formal document:

http://www.costco.com/Images/Content/Misc/PDF/concierge.PDF

That is my whole point! EVEN with an extended warranty one has to go through the hustle of giving up their TV for days if not weeks and often having to deal with the same problem again and again.
With Costco, that extra $200-500 was buying you 'peace of mind'. Return what's broken and pick up another set.
Mind you, for smaller purchases of $100-$600 their policy was nice but not an absolute necessity for me, that's why I never became a member. But when you drop $3000, it's nice to have that extra reassurance... too bad it's history now.

Have not had to have a tv repaired in a long time but I would think most of them are done in home on the big ones.

No more liberal return policy means no sale! Sorry, the prices are higher than other on line retailers, and the warranty was all they had going for them. Goodby Costco, welcome back V.A., P.P., etc.!

All you pious high and mighty people on here that think you know how long is good for me to evaulate a product, how about this as something you geniuses havent thought of...in my case, i am away from home 3 of 4 weeks a month usually, and sometimes home on the weekends in between. so that means i get about 10-11 days a month where i can watch a tv in my own home. so going by you geniuses "90 days is plenty" policy, i should actually get 9 months to evaluate, because thats an equivalent 90 days for me. In fact, my first vizio plasma i bought from costco, which I had from July to November 2005, actually had maybe one to two months of use on it when i returned it...even though by the genius time period and costco time period, i now wouldnt be able to return it, even though it also developed a bad pixel. try using some brains sometimes and think that maybe not everyone out there can go home each day and stare at a TV every day for two years then decide they want to trade up at costco. one of the reasons i BOUGHT this UNKNOWN at the time brand is because i knew no matter how much i traveled, i could return it at any time at my leisure....not anymore.

I am sure every retailer in the world will jump at the opportunity to write a return policy that suits your specific needs. After all you are a far more important consumer than all the rest of us..... Seriously man, just because you dont live a 9-5 life doesn't mean every body should bend over backwards to appease you. simmer down.

I am sure every retailer in the world will jump at the opportunity to write a return policy that suits your specific needs. After all you are a far more important consumer than all the rest of us..... Seriously man, just because you dont live a 9-5 life doesn't mean every body should bend over backwards to appease you. simmer down.

PLEASE take some of your own advice.

How fast do you drive?

To live & die in LA....a 5 minute drive could be a 1/2 hour!!! :cool:

look out johnla..youve got competition...he says youre a fool for allowing me 90 whole days....

dtrell, I feel no sympathy for you at all for what people are saying to you now, because you have brought it on all by yourself! For some reason you seem to think that you are someone special and above everyone else and should have more than 90 days to judge and return a TV, you seem to think you should instead have 9 months to equal anyone elses 90 days.. I don't care what your travel schedule is and if even you only get 10 days per month of actual use, 90 days is still more than enough time for you to decide if the TV is the right one for you or not. And it's still also 60 days more than you will get at most any other place. But if you think it's not good enough for you, then I suggest that you should do all your shopping HERE (http://www6.rentacenter.com/site/page/pg4285.html) from now on.

dtrell, I feel no sympathy for you at all for what people are saying to you now, because you have brought it on all by yourself! For some reason you seem to think that you are someone special and above everyone else and should have more than 90 days to judge and return a TV, you seem to think you should instead have 9 months to equal anyone elses 90 days.. I don't care what your travel schedule is and if even you only get 10 days per month of actual use, 90 days is still more than enough time for you to decide if the TV is the right one for you or not. And it's still also 60 days more than you will get at most any other place. But if you think it's not good enough for you, then I suggest that you should do all your shopping HERE (http://www6.rentacenter.com/site/page/pg4285.html) from now on.

I don't have a horse in this race, so to speak, but I must say as a third party observer in all fairness dtrell never said that he deserved more time than anybody else, just that when people make statements that 90 days is more than enough time they may not be considering everybody's living habits.

My opinion on the whole matter is that it's a free market capitalistic economy (Thank Goodness!) and that if the retailer wants to make the return policy 90 days, 30 days, or that you must do a cartwheel if returning on Tuesdays, they have every right to do that; as long as they make it known ahead of time what the terms of sale are, as Costco has certainly done in this case. You, in turn, have every right to buy from whoever you choose....it's really that simple. I think there are other ways that I would have changed the policy if I was in charge, but I am not, and so therefore my decision is only whether I buy from them or not knowing their new policy.

Interestingly enough I just bought a Philips TV from them before the warranty changed....If this TV fails I will probably buy a Mitsubishi at a big box store, but that's just me in my particular situation.

And it's still also 60 days more than you will get at most any other place. But if you think it's not good enough for you, then I suggest that you should do all your shopping HERE (http://www6.rentacenter.com/site/page/pg4285.html) from now on.

Score 1 for Johnla. Kudos to you!

I don't have a horse in this race, so to speak, but I must say as a third party observer in all fairness dtrell never said that he deserved more time than anybody else,


Actually, he did. When he said this in post # 3464.

"i should actually get 9 months to evaluate, because thats an equivalent 90 days for me."

Moderator

this thread is for

Technical support issues only please

several posts deleted

No more liberal return policy means no sale! Sorry, the prices are higher than other on line retailers, and the warranty was all they had going for them. Goodby Costco, welcome back V.A., P.P., etc.!
(thanks mark rubin, ill now stay on topic [edited by mod]
exactly. this is good news for the big box guys and the online retailers like roman at invision...this means that almost noone at least on this forum is going to pay the premium that costco charges and not get the unlimited returns. ill save the 500 to 1000 dollars that invision will save over costco, buy a couple hundred dollar extended warranty and still be way ahead AND have more time over their new 2 year "concierge" service...blech!..what a stupid name from a now stupid store. roman, when im ready for my 1080p 65 inch panny, ill be calling you.

this is also bad news for startups like vizio that wanted to use costco as a launching pad..the only reason i bought the vizio a year and a half ago was because of the peace of mind of the unlimited return time. now there is NO WAY id take a chance on a no name brand like that, and im sure many others on here wouldnt either. (and it turns out it was a good thing as a pixel went bad after 5 months, OR 2 MONTHS OF ACTUAL NORMAL USE)

Also, it looks like sams has not jumped on the "concierge" bandwagon as yet:
SAM'S CLUB Return/Refund Policy

At SAM’S CLUB, Member Satisfaction is 100% guaranteed both on merchandise and Memberships. Our policy is to refund our Member’s purchases in full with a receipt and without a receipt we will refund in full with a SAM’S CLUB Shopping Card.

The following exceptions apply:
Computers, which can be returned within 6 months of the original purchase date, except Dell computers which can be returned within 30 days of the invoice (ship) date.
All Dell products can be returned within 30 days of the invoice (ship) date.

but, since they seem to just follow everything costco does, im sure this will change shortly. moral is, if youre shut out at costco from the unlimited returns, theres still time to head to sams and get in under the wire.

While I can see why Costco had to do this. It's just sad. Im sure Costco is going a take a hit in its sales. Its no longer going to be THE place to buy stuff. All stores are fair game now.

I wonder how many of costco's customers were aware of the old policy?
They may lose some sales, but if 1/3 of the lost sales are from folks that would never dream of abusing the policy and 2/3s of the lost sales are from abusers, their profits will still go up.

I find it hard to believe that if my projector were covered by this policy, I'd STILL have two weeks to return it!

While I can see why Costco had to do this. It's just sad. Im sure Costco is going a take a hit in its sales. Its no longer going to be THE place to buy stuff. All stores are fair game now.

Why is it sad that they stopped people from abusing the policy? Best Buy started a trend 2 years ago to look at their customer base and see where the profit lies. The abusers generate no profit so why would they want them as customers. These customers are being fired. For those that say that Costco has lost your business, Costco would answer "good".

This new policy seems to cover most of the items of abuse however they dont specifically mention projectors as one of the items, they say tvs. you think projectors are a oversight in all this or would they lump it under tvs? cause it is debatable whether they fall into computers or tv.... difference between 3 or 6 months evaluation.

This could signal trouble for Costco. Economic theory shows that this could be a large hit to Costco, and possibly, mark a downward spiral.

This could signal trouble for Costco. Economic theory shows that this could be a large hit to Costco, and possibly, mark a downward spiral.

I doubt it but time will tell.

So far from member comments and comments in other forums as well as this I would say it is about 70-30 in favor of the change.

But the real results will not be known until at least 3 months from now when the first 90+ day returns begin to show up....

There was an article in wall street journal claiming, that purchases made prior to this change will enjoy the old policy re return/refund /exchanges :confused:

any documentation from costco?

I doubt it but time will tell.

So far from member comments and comments in other forums as well as this I would say it is about 70-30 in favor of the change.

But the real results will not be known until at least 3 months from now when the first 90+ day returns begin to show up....

True, if my prediction on what may occur in 3 months is true, then I feel it could be a hit to Costco's status.

This could signal trouble for Costco. Economic theory shows that this could be a large hit to Costco, and possibly, mark a downward spiral.

What economic theory is that?

Regarding your downward spiral comment: when you fire bad customers you become more profiable not less.