Thanks Guys, at moment the acoustic panels are shown as 2 - 3' wide but I think I'll go with 3 - 2' panels.

For ceiling/Soffits going for a Red (like Behr Ruby Ring - S-G-150)......need to decide on panel fabric and whether to paint or wallpaper above the panelling.

And got my bonus thru today so going to be on a spending spree today :D :D :D

Well the money didn't stay in bank for long.

I've ordered
- Ascend 340 SE Front Left, Center and Right
- HSU STF-2 Subwoofer
- Axiom QS8 Surrounds
- Oppo OPD971H
- Cables

Still to purchase Denon AVR2807 (going to see if local BB will do a deal) and APC J10BLK (looking for someone who has the Black version).

Its dry now in VA so will be off to HD later to get the lumber to finish stage and start on proscenium but off to beach on Saturday so don't expect toooo much progress.

Here is view showing 3 panels in the HT area......I think this looks better that the 2 panels (in post #247)

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/BritInVAHTModel4.jpg

Thanks Guys, at moment the acoustic panels are shown as 2 - 3' wide but I think I'll go with 3 - 2" panels.

For ceiling/Soffits going for a Red (like Behr Ruby Ring - S-G-150)......need to decide on panel fabric and whether to paint or wallpaper above the panelling.

And got my bonus thru today so going to be on a spending spree today :D :D :D

Congrats!!

We went red for the soffits too Behr Chianti... just finshed the last of the painting last night!

Oh, and HD has BEHR paint w/ a $6 rebate going right now.

(And Lowes has carpet/flooring at 20% off).

Man those 2-inch panels are gonna be skiiiiny! :D

Steve - thanks for pointing out my typo :o

I saw that HD paint offer so will be getting some over weekend - will look at what Lowes has on offer for carpet for was thinking of stearing clear of HD & Lowes as they seem to mess up a bit.

Just ordered my APC J10BLK (http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=J10BLK&tab=models) :D

Just the Denon AVR2807 to sort now

- Oppo OPD571H
.


You did mean the OPDV971H? Did you buy it direct from Oppo Digital? I was going to order mine in a week or so after my vacation.

Drew

You did mean the OPDV971H? Did you buy it direct from Oppo Digital? I was going to order mine in a week or so after my vacation.

Drew

Yeah, just a typo.....ordered direct from Opp....everywhere semed to be same price + shipping so thought may as well go direct to Oppo

I finished the stage and started building the proscenium framing on Sunday. However I need to bevel the sides and a standard circular saw was proving a challenge so things have come to a halt while I invest in a table saw.....hopefully pick one up from Lowes or HD later today.

You can't go wrong with a table saw. I would recommend Rigid as their warranty cannot be beat.

Drew

I ended up buying a B&D Firestorm 10" Table saw.......was $159 plus get a $25 rebate.

Cheers,
Mark

Final piece of equipment ordered - Denon AVR 2807 - I got Best Buy/Magnolia to do a competitor match (well not a full match) but enough not to have to buy via a non-Denon authorised Dealer.

Just got to finish the room now to install it all in :eek:

I saw that HD paint offer so will be getting some over weekend - will look at what Lowes has on offer for carpet for was thinking of stearing clear of HD & Lowes as they seem to mess up a bit.

I was pretty happy with the purchase and install of my carpet from HD ordered at the Fair Lakes store here. Though they were the only ones who had anything close to the color/design I wanted for my theater carpet.

I was pretty happy with the purchase and install of my carpet from HD ordered at the Fair Lakes store here. Though they were the only ones who had anything close to the color/design I wanted for my theater carpet.

Its probably hit or miss depending on who measures the carpet and the local installers. My HD install went fine (good installers), WHEN they brought the carpet. It took 8 weeks for one room and some stairs to get it right.

Bud

Been slow (or more accuratly no progress)......a word of caution to others doing their own taping/mudding/sanding. I think I've done some serious damage to my neck/shoulders. Been in a fair bit of pain that hasn't been getting better.....thought resting would help but NO! So looks like I need to go and see a back specialist. Will try to get some more done this weekend but not going to push my luck.

My APC J10 arived today along with my 703 from Bryan. Stupid FedEx put all the boxes directly outside the garage and didn't knock! My wife nearly ran over them. Thankfully we have the rear sensors!

My Ascends are on back order for 3 weeks, which wouldn't be too bad if the Axioms were not shipped same day as ordering......my concern is not being able to try them together within 30 days return policy!

Mark

Mark -

I'm with you on the back pain. I'm still sanding the walls and have been putting off the ceiling for just that reason. The walls are kicking my butt as it is. I'm able to finish sand one wall a day...I can only imagine how long the ceiling will take when I have to start working over my head again.

I'm also going with QS8's for surrounds in all 4 spots (7.1) Let us know what you think of them once you fire them up!

Kevin -

Kevin - I think my problem was because I had 6 solid days (I took weeks vacation) of taping/mudding/sanding....it was good to get out of the way but paying for it now. I used a sanding pole and think its was probably a combination of preasure required and the back & forth motion.

For now I'm going with a 5.1 but wired for 7.2. My problem is no wall directly behind so only option is in-ceiling or I could use ceiling mounted QS4's.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark, Mega doses of Ibuprofin or Alieve. Steam room, Do some stretching and Get a chair massage at Dulles town center. Not the one where you sit in the chair but the one where you get a back massage by a young lady.

It might not help but it will take your mine off the problem for 40 minutes.

Been slow (or more accuratly no progress)......a word of caution to others doing their own taping/mudding/sanding. I think I've done some serious damage to my neck/shoulders. Been in a fair bit of pain that hasn't been getting better.....thought resting would help but NO! So looks like I need to go and see a back specialist. Will try to get some more done this weekend but not going to push my luck.

Man, I know this one well. That is hard work, and when you are not use to do that type of thing, it can dang near kill ya. I did it about a decade ago on a basement project I had in a former house (actually in Leesburg, VA -- just down the road from you). Turned out great, but man it is a ton of work.

Mark, Mega doses of Ibuprofin or Alieve. Steam room, Do some stretching and Get a chair massage at Dulles town center. Not the one where you sit in the chair but the one where you get a back massage by a young lady.

It might not help but it will take your mine off the problem for 40 minutes.

Knowing my luck I'd get some old geezer :(

I'll have to keep a look out for a 'tottie' (British slang for a hot chick) - got prime excuse to have a young thing giving me a massage :eek:

Cheers,
Mark

Or go over to that day spa in the Cascades Shopping Center. My wife gave me a Gift Certificate for a massage there and it was great! Or go out to Berkely Springs, WV to the State Park and get a massage there. It's cheaper than the new spas, old and not very attractive, but 20 minutes in a spring-fed hot tub and a massage will make you forget all about the surroundings and make you feel like a million bucks! And take along a few containers to pick up some free spring water!

Tom

I've just today finished sanding the walls. Only the ceiling remains. I've been at this for three weeks straight. I left one job and my other doesnt start for a bit so losts of free time to punish myself with spackle and a pole sander. I'm going to do the inside and outside corners before I sand the ceiling (more procrastination).

Kevin -

Some progress over the weekend - got the proscenium framing done. Was a little challenging as the max width of the side enclosures was dictated by the width of the soffits - 17"

Problem with this is my subwoofer will be 14" wide add 2" of 703 and leaves me with 1" for the frame :( . So as you can see from pic below I decided not to build a frame at bottom - will just create 1/2" width full height panels for the dazian fabric.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/stage4.jpg

I've also primed/sealed the drywall which will be painted. Hopefully this week will get HT ceiling/walls painted and the front screen treatments in place and next weekend start on the wood paneling.

Cheers,
Mark

Lookin' good Mark. Keep the pics coming. Let me know if you have any questions when you get around to doing the bottom of the bar.

Bryan

Mark,

Front proscenium looks great. There is something about once that black paint goes on that makes it look just right :)

I still need to get my front screen area painted too. I've kind of neglected it because I'm still trying to figure out what screen size I want. It's currently designed for an 8' wide 1.78:1 now but am contemplating a 9' 1:78 or 9.5'wide 2.35:1. Once I get the projector installed (still down the road), I will be able to make a decision and get that area completed.

Steve - I'm just under 8', but thats one of reasons (along with funds) I'm waiting on screen purchase - want to be sure on the size/seating distance before purchasing. Just used Behr Silverscreen for now.

Wife told me 4 more packages arived today, 2 of them being my acoustic cotton so will get on with the stage acoustic treatments tonight.

Steve - I'm just under 8', but thats one of reasons (along with funds) I'm waiting on screen purchase - want to be sure on the size/seating distance before purchasing. Just used Behr Silverscreen for now.
You can get bulk DaLite material from Jason at AVS very inexpensively. A 8' DIY screen would cost you about $200. Definitely something to consider.

You can get bulk DaLite material from Jason at AVS very inexpensively. A 8' DIY screen would cost you about $200. Definitely something to consider.

Thanks for the tip.

Cheers,
Mark

The other 2 boxes were my Axiom QS8's - man they really look nice :D

Also my Oppo came as well.

BritinVA, do you plan on applying anything inside the wall cavity where your LRs are going to sit?

BritinVA, do you plan on applying anything inside the wall cavity where your LRs are going to sit?

Yes, will be using 5.5" cotton in each side corner and 2" 703 for remainder of the 'framed in' screen wall area.......once I decide on a screen I'll put 703 behind that also.

Won't get to that tonight (got a HOA meeting :( ) but should get that done tomorrow.

Cheers,
Mark

the reason i asked is because i am in a similar situtation regarding front LR placement inside a cavity.......so the reason for 703 is to reduce reflectoin? if so, could 2" acoustic foam also be used?

Sunny - sorry, not really an area I can comment on.....I just do what I'm told :D

But my understanding is the 703 is for the higher frequencys and cotton for the lower frequencies (but I'm probably wrong :o . I know a lot of people use Linacoustic duct liner instead of 703.

Cheers,
Mark

no worries... :cool:

Well, both the cotton and the 703 will do full range absorbtion. The cotton being thicker and in the corners will do a better job in the bottom end. The 703 is primarily to reduce some SBIR and to assure that there are no reflecitons off the front wall from the side/rear surrounds.

Bryan

Se - ya better of asking one of the experts :D

I'm trying to plan out my equipment connections and what cables are required.

Sorry for so many Q's in one post

Initial Equipment List (purchased)
- Denon AVR 2807
- Panasonic AE900U
- Oppo OPDV971H
- Adelphia DVR

I've already purchased HMDI & Component cables cables to connect the AVR to the PJ.

For DVR to AVR I already have component/audio run.

For DVD to AVR the Oppo has a DVI to HDMI cable included

So in main I think I have most of cables required.......my uncertainty is about the DVD audio to AVR. Should I use the 'Audio Cord' that comes with the Oppo or should I use Coaxial or Optical audio cable?

Also when it comes down to speakers, I ran 12G cable and I think all connections will be hidden so at most I'll just use keystone wall plates (or similar) and connect cables straight to AVR & Speakers. I understand Banana plugs are the way to go - but are these (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=090-465) sufficient or should I be looking at something better?

For the Subwoofer is standard RG-6 OK (I have this) or do I need RG-6 Quad. Any recomendation on what RCA connectors I should use on this?

I also have some Aura seat shakers so need to get a separate Amp (any cheap recommendations) and I believe a Y cable to split the sub feed (EDIT is this the correct splitter (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=181-692)).

Is there anything I missed?

I use the Dayton plugs also listed on partsexpress. They are pretty much the cheapest gold plated plugs I could find at $4 per pair. I wasn't sure what the effect of using nickle plugs would have on sound quality, but given the relative low cost of the Dayton plugs I wasn't worried about the extra expense.

Cathan - Thanks. Saw those and was think maybe worth going one level up.

Cheers,
Mark

Got the screen wall acoustic treatments done. Used acoustic cotton in corners and 2" 703 for remainder of area (from sensiblesoundsolutions.com). The cotton was a challenge to cut - used skill saw (on Bryans advice) which worked out quite well (except I'll be sweeping up blue cotton dust for days :eek: ). The 703 cut very easily with a sharp steak knife.

Anyway heres a pic.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/stage6.jpg

For now not treated the actual screen wall area as will be projecting on drywall initially. Will have some 1" 703 left over for that.

One concern I have is behind that cotton are electric sockets for the sub(s). Should I be concerned that this is potential fire risk. Should I create some narrow MDF partition to separate?

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

Really coming together nicely!

Bud

Looks nice! For your sub cable question - I used QS, figuring it can't hurt, but regular RG6 would probably be fine unless your running near power wires. I used Canare crimp RCA connectors from Markertek for the ends.

On the cables / connectors - unless anyone thinks there are mistakes (please speak up) I'll be ordering.

Dayton Banana Plugs (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=091-1260) for speakers
http://www.partsexpress.com/images/091-1260m.jpg

Dayton Digital Coaxial (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=181-624&scqty=1) for DVD to AVR Audio
http://www.partsexpress.com/images/181-628m.jpg

RCA RG6 Compression connectors (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=092-497) for sub (I'll use RG6 as I have it and not running near electrical - easy to change out as in conduit)
http://www.partsexpress.com/images/092-497m.jpg

Dayton RCA Y Cable (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=181-692) (to split sub feed for bass shakers) - this is something I'm not sure on :confused:
http://www.partsexpress.com/images/181-692m.jpg

On the cables / connectors - unless anyone thinks there are mistakes (please speak up) I'll be ordering.

Dayton Banana Plugs (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=091-1260) for speakers
http://www.partsexpress.com/images/091-1260m.jpg

I have not used these myself (I have not bought anything yet) but Bud used these and said they work great. I prefer these because the wire comes in from the back vs. from the side. Their pricing is about half that of PE. They have an ebay store but since AVS does not allow ebay links, I used links to their main WWW site:

Normal Bananas (http://www.speakerrepair.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=BS28&Category_Code=AHH_Banana) - Qty 28 for $41.75
http://www.speakerrepair.com/ebaypics/banana-s-pair-med.jpg

Locking Bananas (http://www.speakerrepair.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=BL28&Category_Code=AHH_Banana) - Qty 28 for $78.99
http://www.speakerrepair.com/ebaypics/banana-l-side.jpg

Steve - Thanks.....just ordered them.....worked out cheaper than those on PartsExpress too

Cheer,
Mark

It's the shipping costs that usually kills you with Parts Express. Can't tell you how many times I needed a $10 part only to have to pay $8 for shipping.

Looking good Mark.

Do you already have a compression tool to use with those RCA RG6 connectors?

Dayton RCA Y Cable (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=181-692) (to split sub feed for bass shakers) - this is something I'm not sure on :confused:
http://www.partsexpress.com/images/181-692m.jpg

This will work. Splits the signal out of your AVR, then you run cables to your subwoofer and to the input of your shaker amp. Do you know how to wire the shakers?

Bill - Thanks.....didn't want to order something that would effect the quality of the sub(s). Only ones found that metioned LFE were long cables.

Got wiring diagrams for the shakers but still to select an amp to drive them.....so if anyone has recomendations appreciate it.

Cheers,
Mark

Alot of people have used PartsExpress subwoofer amps (http://www.partsexpress.com/webpage.cfm?&Webpage_ID=3&DID=7&CAT_ID=43&ObjectGroup_ID=505&SO=2) or I just used an old prologic receiver I had laying around. Ran the sub signal into the phone jack then out through the speaker outs.

Bill - Thanks.....didn't want to order something that would effect the quality of the sub(s). Only ones found that metioned LFE were long cables.

Got wiring diagrams for the shakers but still to select an amp to drive them.....so if anyone has recomendations appreciate it.

Cheers,
Mark
Yes, just as Belcherwm stated --- find an old Stereo receiver and use it. If you want something that fits better on a shelf (compared to the PE plate amp), I've read people buying this one:

Circuit City - Sherwood RX-4105 (http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Sherwood-Stereo-Receiver-RX-4105-/sem/rpsm/oid/121266/catOid/-12851/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do) Stereo Receiver 100WPCx2: $75

Also, just watch the sales at Frys (Friday's ad is the the most extensive). They usually have a "cheap" receiver deal every few weeks.

Bought my Kenwood for the shakers on ebay. I'm sure you can find deals out there.

Bud

Thanks Steve - we don't have Fry's here in NoVA but will keep a lookout for cheap stereo amplifiers in CC and BB.

Do you need to split the feed from the receiver at the amp again to get a L & R input?

Cheers,
Mark

Thanks Steve - we don't have Fry's here in NoVA but will keep a lookout for cheap stereo amplifiers in CC and BB.

Do you need to split the feed from the receiver at the amp again to get a L & R input?

Cheers,
Mark
It all depends on how many shakers you have.

If you have (2) shakers, you can plug your single LFE output from your AVR to the CD right channel input and use the "right" speaker out. If you have (4) shakers, you will need another "Y" splitter to split the mono LFE output from your AVR into the left and right CD channels. This will allow you to use the right channel speaker out for (2) of the shakers and the left channel speaker out for the other (2) shakers.

NOTE: Some receivers have a mono-option which will take the mono-signal coming in from any input and send it out to both speakers simultaneously. If this is the case, you have no need to get an additional "Y" splitter.

NOTE2: Some people commented if they were not getting enough "rumble" from the CD input, they used the phono input and the shakers shook like crazy.

Steve - Thanks.....I have 4 shakers so I'll order the extra splitter just in case.

Cheers,
Mark

Steve - Thanks.....I have 4 shakers so I'll order the extra splitter just in case.

Cheers,
Mark
Great. Make sure you get the "other" (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=181-690) splitter since the genders will be reversed.

Steve- Yep, I realised that :D I assume I can just use a standard RCA audio cable to couple the 2 together.

Cheers,
Mark

Steve- Yep, I realised that :D I assume I can just use a standard RCA audio cable to couple the 2 together.

Cheers,
Mark
You could probably go with a cheap "Y" splitter (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103861&cp=&pg=4&origkw=rca+y&kw=rca+y&parentPage=search) as well as a cheap RCA cable (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103847&cp=&pg=1&y=8&origkw=rca+cable&x=13&kw=rca+cable&numProdsPerPage=20&parentPage=search) for the shaker side. Any type of noise or distortion a cheap cable might produce should not be an issue with the shakers IMO -- but I'm no expert. You might spend $10 more and get a little better cable.

Final piece of equipment ordered - Denon AVR 2807 - I got Best Buy/Magnolia to do a competitor match (well not a full match) but enough not to have to buy via a non-Denon authorised Dealer.

Just got to finish the room now to install it all in :eek:

Hey Mark,
Just wondering, what specifically made you decide to get the 2807 vs the 3806?
Great receiver, btw, (although I hope the remote is not anywhere close to being as unusable as the 3806's that I have).

Asem - it pretty much came down to price, the specs were very similar. The 2807 appeared to have everything I need. So as most of everything has gone over budget its good to go under every one in a while.

Not planning on using the denon remote long term - will use a programable remote that operates everything.....just not decided which one yet.

Cheers,
Mark

After 1 coat drywall sealer, 1 coat tinted undercoat and 2 coats Red it still looks very patchy and can see over strokes. I knew in advance Red was a tricky colour so hoping 3rd will look better but expecting to need to use a 4th.

Mark

Are you rolling it on or brushing?

You wanna borrow my sprayer?

Power Sprayer (http://caesare.homeip.net:32171/basement/slides/IMG_1748.htm)

Cathan - I'm Rolling

Steve - I had considered hiring a sprayer but never used one so thought I'd botch it up. The 2nd coat looks much better, I'll try a 3rd coat tonight and if its still not covering well I may well take you up on you offer. Thanks

You wanna borrow my sprayer?

Power Sprayer (http://caesare.homeip.net:32171/basement/slides/IMG_1748.htm)
Steve,

Is THIS (http://www.gleempaint.com/paint-crew-770.html) the paint sprayer you have? Have you ever applied stain and clear coat on cabinets with this unit? It looks to do well on fences and painting large areas.

Mark- Sure thing, let me know.., or you know where I live, I'll be in the basement all evening ;-)

swithey - That's the one. I bought it specifically for this project, and thus far I've only sprayed interior latex. It handles it unthinned with the included tip just fine. For thinner subtances, I'm sure it would do a good job with an even finer tip if you were so inclined.

It made short work of priming almost 4000 sq. ft. of drywall, that's for sure. It also applied all my color coats as well.

I'd just keep rolling on the coats. The closest to red I've ever painted is a rust like shade. It went on with two coats, no problems. The one time I used Ralph Lauren paint (a sage shade) I had to put on 3+ coats. But apparently that was because RL paint is meant to be brushed on and NOT rolled.

Since we moved into the new house in June, I've been making steady progress painting all of the ceiling, walls and trim. To make my life a bit easier I tried using one of those Wagner power rollers. They actually work very well. Paint goes on pretty thick so I have only needed a very thin second coat to finish a surface. And while clean up can be a pain, I have it down to a science now that I installed a hose attachement to my utility sink. I just let hot water run through the machine for 20 minutes and it's clean.

I think I've discovered my problem - my primer was tinited with same color as my main so ended up being 'Rose' - looks like I should have used a dark gray :-(

That sucks.

The one time I used tinted primer was with the rust-red color. It screwed up my ability to do touch up. I had carpet installed a couple of weeks after painting the room. The installers scratch the walls in a few places. When I did touch up and the paint dried, it was a slightly different shade from the rest of the room. I ended up having to repaint the room for everything to match. My only explanation was that the primer somehow effected the first two coats' color somehow. I'll never use tinted primer again.

my red/rust color in the HT went on in two coats. It wasn't perfect even after the two coats, but since I was doing a brown/gold galze on top of it it (faux painting) I figured the slight shade impefections would just blend in...and it worked like a charm.

OT...we finished painting our bedroom last night. My wife wanted to do something different on the wall..so we bought Granite paint...from Lowes signature collection. Dude...its the last time I'm ever using that paint.
Its a coarse paint, with *tiny* granules in it, to create a rough almost stucco like texture. So when it rolls on to the wall, its not a smooth roll at all. After two coats with the rollor, we had to use a hand brush to do the final coat to even it out a bit, and it sucked cause its a very slow and tiring process.
For a relatively large room with vaulted ceiling, it was definitely not fun. After 4 days of painting, it actually looks quite decent. Wife loves it..

Sorry...just had to share. good luck painting your room. Hope you get done soon!

That sucks.

The one time I used tinted primer was with the rust-red color. It screwed up my ability to do touch up. I had carpet installed a couple of weeks after painting the room. The installers scratch the walls in a few places. When I did touch up and the paint dried, it was a slightly different shade from the rest of the room. I ended up having to repaint the room for everything to match. My only explanation was that the primer somehow effected the first two coats' color somehow. I'll never use tinted primer again.

My understanding is that unless you are redoing flat, you have to do the whole wall to get it to match.

I hate carpet guys. :(

My understanding is that unless you are redoing flat, you have to do the whole wall to get it to match.

I hate carpet guys. :(

That depends on how old the paint is. Luster can change over time for eggshell paints so trying to get that to match can be a pain. But this was just a week or so afterwards and the issue was the shade didn't match.

And yes, carpet installers suck.

BTW - Just came back from your neck of the woods. Wife and I were diving at the quarry off of RT 55 near Sheetz. Sure is rural out there. ;)

BTW - Just came back from your neck of the woods. Wife and I were diving at the quarry off of RT 55 near Sheetz. Sure is rural out there. ;)

Should have been here 12 years ago when we moved in!

Well I loaned Steves sprayer - covered better but I'm still not 100% happy with the finish nor my drywall mudding :(

I may give it one more coat with a roller - not sure yet :confused:

Going to be slow progress (if at all) for about a couple of months. Were on vacation (Florida with the rodent and Myrtle Beach) for 2 weeks in early August and immediately afterwards got visitors styaying. So my priorities is to finish the basement bath plus got to do a number of Honey Do's (install new wall oven, mulch beds, make/install a window pelmet).

Cheers.
Mark

pelmet?

pelmet?

Its a window treatment - basically got to build a box to cover the curtain rods.

So that's what you call it. I have three of those to build on my near term project list as well.

Think I may take tomorrow off to get a chunk of stuff done. At the present rate I won't even be able to begin working on the basement until a year from now... :(

Back from vacation -went to see the Rodent in Florida and then on to Myrtle Beach. Boy needed that break!

Concentration at moment is on the Bathroom as we have Guest coming next Friday. Spent today finishing tiling and installing the door. I did do some drywall blemish touch ups and hoping that the Rec eventually blends :(

One bit of good news is my Ascends and HSU subs come today :)

Now to catch up on what you guys have been up to.

Mark

And I hope your vacation was a very restful and relaxing one. :)

Welcome back. Now you can get back to work ;) BTW good luck on the bathroom they are a killer.

Drew

BTW good luck on the bathroom they are a killer.


No kidding - the tiling was easy - the grouting is slow a tedious and my finger tips are now sore from smoothing the gout lines.

Unfortunately looks like I was not meticulous enough in getting excess grout of a few tiles - anyone got recommendations for removing dryed on grout - the tiles have a rough face.

Cheers,
Mark

One bit of HT news. Got my fabric for the wall panels over the weekend. From Hancock Fabrics "Diamonds Decorator Fabric in Gold" (item 756676N) - they had a Sale on Saturday got 40$ off :)

http://www.hancockfabrics.com/images/us/local/products/viewlarger/756676N_lg.jpg

Anyone got recommendations on a spray Fire Retardant?

Cheers,
Mark

No kidding - the tiling was easy - the grouting is slow a tedious and my finger tips are now sore from smoothing the gout lines.

Unfortunately looks like I was not meticulous enough in getting excess grout of a few tiles - anyone got recommendations for removing dryed on grout - the tiles have a rough face.

Cheers,
Mark

A moist sponge work's great for smoothing out the grout lines.

As for removing dry grout, I got this tool from the tile shop that is basically a circular
piece of brillo, works great on removing group from stone tile. I think it was called a scuff pad or something like that.

No kidding - the tiling was easy - the grouting is slow a tedious and my finger tips are now sore from smoothing the gout lines.

Unfortunately looks like I was not meticulous enough in getting excess grout of a few tiles - anyone got recommendations for removing dryed on grout - the tiles have a rough face.

Cheers,
Mark

I've never heard of anybody using their finger tips for smoothing out grout lines. No wonder it was so tedious. Smoothing grout is the easiest part of tiling for me. Why is it better then just using a wet sponge?

Thanks 'mastiff34 ' & 'new_to_this'

I am using a damp sponge on the grout but I find a damp finger gets a neater more even finish.

My biggest problem right now is drilling thru these stone tiles to fix the shower to the wall. If I use a standard masonary bit in a non-hammer action drill it barely dents the tile. If I use hammer action it breaks the tile :(

I'll see if I can get a carbide-tipped masonry bit tomorrow - or should I be using something else like a diamond tipped bit?

Mark, I tried all the damn carbide bits at HD, with no success. I managed to work it just right where I cut use a tile saw to mark an arc for the pipe and use a separate piece of tile to fill the hole on the side of the tile. What I mean "managed to work it just right" is the flange or the shower pipe or the spout covered the imperfections. You'd never know I pieced it. Granted I lucked out doing it this way since I used 6 inch tile. Hopefully you can find a decent bit to solve your problem.

Good luck.

Bud

Bud - yeah know that trick, most of my pipe holes were near tile edges so were pretty easy. I had tried a tile cutting bit in my rotarzip but was useless and went to method you suggested.

My problem is I need to drill 5/16" holes to screw the shower surrond to the wall. Plus will have other fixtures for toilet paper / towls etc.

Cheers,
Mark

You need these.
http://www.hardwarestore.com/media/product/604816_front500.jpg

I bought them at Walmart and they are the best for drilling into tile.

You need these.
http://www.hardwarestore.com/media/product/604816_front500.jpg

I bought them at Walmart and they are the best for drilling into tile.


I was burning through bits trying to make 2 holes for a closet sliding door guide in a peice of tile, until I bought one of these. Went through the ceramic tile like butter.

You could always try a colbalt or titanium drill bit. Something like you would use to drill metal. Might work as long as you don't apply too much pressure. You might have to chip or scratch the tile to keep the bit from walking and of course try it on a practice piece first.

If you want to use something like a carbide tip masonry bit, I find that sharpening them first will do wonders. Sparpen them on a grinder of some kind until you get a nice sharp bevel and point. Then use it do drill and it will work so much better than it did out of the package. That might help you drill the tiles. I use my table grinder on my masonry bits before I drill anything with them in the hammer drill.

Guys - Thanks for the advice.

Went into Wallmart on way into work this morning and picked up a set of those bits for a few cents under $10 so hopefully will have better luck tonight. I also had to pop into Lowes for a few other items - the same set was a few cents under $16 :eek:

I never really thought of using Wallmart for stuff like this - think I'll pay a bit more attention to what they stock.

Cheers,
Mark

Those bits worked :D

Was quite slow but worked and got my holes drilled - Thanks again for suggestion.

Cheers,
Mark

Good to here Mark.

Well visitors have gone up to Boston (they are back on Thursday) so was able to get some work done in the HT.

I got another coat of red up - still not 100% happy as my drywall finish isn't as good as it could have been. I may end up papering over it. Here is a pic.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/RedPaint.jpg

I also got all the electrics wired and on :) and I mounted the PJ. I hooked up a portable DVD player and picture looked great :D

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/Screen1.jpg

Going to hook up all the equipment tomorrow to ensure its all working. Won't be a great deal more progress until labor day.....when I hope to start on the panelling in the HT area.

Cheers,
Mark

Got the HT Equipment all wired up and tested.

Reminder on Equipment.

- Denon AVR 2807
- Panny AE900U
- Oppo 971H
- Ascend CMT SE L,C,R
- Axiom QS-8 surrounds
- HSU STF-2 Sub
- ADC J10 Power Conditioner

A few small gripes :(

The way the terminals are arranged on the back of the Axiom QS-8's mean you cannot use banana plugs - which would have been useful given the weight and awkwardness of wiring.

I had heard the Denon 2807 manual was useless - and can confirm. Talk about badly written and no seemingly obvious logical order.

But enough griping.

After all was set up the picture (on painted temp screen) and sound (in untreated room) was outstanding :D .......so I know it can only get better. We watched Shrek 2 and was noticing all sorts of detail we never saw before.

Need to put a IR repeater and 'all in one' remote high up on things to buy. :cool:

Cheers,
Mark

Things are coming together nicely Mark. Isn't is great to finally get a picture coming out of that projector? And hearing sound from your speakers? And just sitting in there knowing you built it? Gotta love it!

Jerrod - Yeah does feel great. Just got to stop watching movies and finish now :D

Going to be doing some honey do's until labor day and then hopefully back in full swing aftfrom then on.

Need to put a IR repeater and 'all in one' remote high up on things to buy. :cool:


Which ones are you looking at? I am in this situation as well, but am considering going with RF/IR.

Dave - I had in the past bookmarked the Hot Link Pro (http://www.smarthome.com/8225p.html) but I still need to research what others have recommended. This one seems very flexible.

For the remote I'm considering the Universal Remote Control MX-3000 (http://www.universalremote.com/products/index.php?item=mx3000) - its a bit expensive (Retails around $1,000) but deals can be found for nearly half that.

Cheers,
Mark

Hey Mark....I've been lurking and following your thread for some time now and it looks great!! Almost done. I imagine you were just floored when you finally saw that huge image on your screen. I personally needed a cigarette after first seeing the 900u's image on my bare wall and that was without audio. Enjoy it....you've earned it.

I'm going to be building my own rack that will be on wheels in a closet disguised as a ticket booth. I've been looking around for a cheap cable management solution and came across these.

Intellinet Rack Mounting Cable Management Ring Pack (http://sewelldirect.com/Intellinet-Cable-Management-Rings.asp)
http://sewelldirect.com/images/SW-5112_lg.jpg

Cost for a Pk of 20 is $37.95 + Postage $4.95

Other places seen to charge $5 - $10 each

I tend to just ziptie my cables once i know I'm finally done. It's cheap and easy.

My problem is all my cables enter the closet above the door so I wanted something to manage the cables around the door frame....I'll be using zip ties too.

I made good use of the screw mount cable ties. I think you can pick em up at the big box stores. They are wire ties with an eyelet at the end to put a screw through.

I also remember seeing someone use simple wire shelving for the horizontal runs.

Mark,

DO NOT buy your MX-3000 from an unauthorized dealer. Buy from "proremotes.com" or the like. Universal has cut off support for remotes purchased from "gray market" sources. You wont be able to update your software. See remotecentral.com for info (the universal forum).

I bought mine from an Ebay dealer yr ago and now i'm fudged. No more software support!

As for the cable management - I use these cool little anchors that screw in and then have little slots for the zip-ties to thread through. They come in several sizes and are in-valuable when trying to organize a non-metal rack.

I dont know the name of them - perhaps someone else has used them and can help us out...

Kevin -

I just read an earlier post where you mentioned the QS8's not leaving room for banana plugs. How does your wiring come out of the wall? Did you run your wires through a box? I am planning on using the same speakers and the same kind of plugs so this concerns me....


Kevin -

Kevin - Yes I used Carlon Adjustable back boxes - symmetrical on each side.

Its possible that you could align the speaker such that the plugs project into the outlet box. But that would have meant the speakers not being symmetrical on each side due the the connection design.

Kevin - a little more info:

This is the back view of the QS8 and the mount

http://www.axiomaudio.com/global/images/products/gallery/qs8_back.jpg http://www.axiomaudio.com/global/images/products/main/epic_includes07.jpg

The connections are not quite central and the mounting bar is in a shape of a 'T' so you cannot center over the outlet box (unless you cut the mounting bar).

Cheers,
Mark

I used the spade styled connectors the second time I mounted my QS8s. My first attempt I tried to use plugs and ran into the same issue. Now I just connect the cable directly to the binding post. Given that I never remove the speakers from the wall, not having the quick disconnect feature isn't a major loss. If ido need to take them down I can rest them on a ladder while i loosen the posts.

For now I've just used the wire directly into the bindiing post. Like Cathan says no big deal as normally once they are up thats it - but while I'm mid-build they will be down at times.

Its really not a big deal - just wish I hadn't bothered preparing with bannana plugs - that 10mins could have been put to good use on something else :D

Sorry. I should have thought about mentioning this "feature" of the speakers to you when you asked about where to get banana plugs. It's been so long that I had completely spaced that I had that same issue. Call it a senior moment... ;)

Mark,

Thanks for the additional info and the pics also! I'm probably gonna use the bananas and just dremel off the bottom of the "T" on the bracket (or a portion of it). I have locking bananas that I'm keen to put into service...

Kevin -

Kevin - a little more info:

This is the back view of the QS8 and the mount


The connections are not quite central and the mounting bar is in a shape of a 'T' so you cannot center over the outlet box (unless you cut the mounting bar).

Cheers,
Mark

it's hard to tell from the picture but could you unscrew the terminal cup from the back of the speaker and rotate it 180 degrees to give you enough room to sneak the banana plugs by the mounting bracket?

I'm sure with a bit of tweaking banana plugs can be used - not sure I'll bother. Just surprised that the flaw exists.......or maybe my banana plugs are a bit long.

My locking GLS's are about as long as they get. I don't think they vary too much Mark. JMFox poses an interesting question. Next time you have yours off the wall maybe you could peek at that for us......


Kevin -

I sent an email to the main tech guy at Axiom. I'll report back what he says.

Cool....

I used the spade styled connectors the second time I mounted my QS8s. My first attempt I tried to use plugs and ran into the same issue. Now I just connect the cable directly to the binding post. Given that I never remove the speakers from the wall, not having the quick disconnect feature isn't a major loss. If ido need to take them down I can rest them on a ladder while i loosen the posts.


I second that notion!

crimp-on spade connectors are the way to go. Also the simple wire in binding post is good enough too.

The Axiom guy got back to me. They acknowledge that spades or direct wire are the only way to go. They also recommend against trying to rotate the "cup".

Thanks Cathan -

I'll have to see how this works in my own application before I decide how to go....


Kevin -

Bill - Thanks.....didn't want to order something that would effect the quality of the sub(s). Only ones found that metioned LFE were long cables.

Got wiring diagrams for the shakers but still to select an amp to drive them.....so if anyone has recomendations appreciate it.


Not sure if you ever figured out what to purchase or already have......

Alot of people have used PartsExpress subwoofer amps or I just used an old prologic receiver I had laying around. Ran the sub signal into the phone jack then out through the speaker outs.


Agreed. I used the part #300-796 from Parts Express. It's a plate amp. Around Christmas I think they have this "deal of the day" for a week. Got it for like ~$75 or something (normal $130). Also makes it nice that Parts Express is like 10min from my house! It's overkill for what's needed, but works great.

I have 4 of the Aura shakers wired to it. One in each of my risers, and two in my Berkline 090s. I split the sub pre-out on my main a/v receiver with a male RCA to dual female RCA splitter. I just got a cheap one @ Radio Shack.

Used #100-040 flat speaker wire for running under the carpet to the risers and chairs, and can barely even notice it's under there.

They're cool for movies with explosions and stuff, but for normal tv/music I keep them off.

Just my .02 cents.... :)

Keep up the good work on the theater!!

For now I've just used the wire directly into the bindiing post. Like Cathan says no big deal as normally once they are up thats it - but while I'm mid-build they will be down at times.

Its really not a big deal - just wish I hadn't bothered preparing with bannana plugs - that 10mins could have been put to good use on something else :D

I purchased the GLS Audio banana (referenced earlier in this thread) plugs to use with my Ascends. However, I ended up hard-wiring all my speaker wiring (Carol 12 guage) straight into the binding posts. All my speakers are either hidden in columns or behind the front-wall GOM, so it's not like they're going to be swapped out often. I even ditched the banana plugs on the receiver end and just hard-wired straight into the binding posts on the back. So, now I have a collection of paperweight banana plugs! :eek:

Robert - I have considered one on the Parts Express plate amps but wanted something that slots into the rack.......so I'm just keeping an eye out for a cheap stereo receiver - no rush at the moment.

Going to continue to use the bannana plugs - does keep the equipment looking neat at the back (not that it will be seen).

Cheers,
Mark

Some progress over the last couple of days. Got the side treatment framing done. This is a pic of what it looks like at the moment.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/HT-Side1.jpg

And here is a mock-up with the fabric added (if only could build it in a picture editor :eek: )

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/HT-Side2.jpg

Will be continuing at a slow pace.....got the inlaw's coming over this week and off to Scottsdale next week - taking wife away (no kids) for 20th Anniversary.

Got a lot more woodwork to do!

Cheers,
Mark

Looking good Mark!

Enjoy your trip, and Congrats!

Yes, Enjoy your trip. Hubby and I just celebrated our 38th on Sept 7. This theater we are working on was suppose to be the anniversary present this year, to each other. unfortunately it is taking longer then thought and screen framing etc. has not arrived yet, lost in transit etc. You know typical stuff.

It is looking good.

Mark,

Did you use the jig on those frames?

Bud

Bud,

Yes, I used the Kreg Jig. Worked really well got the joints tight and flush. Some of the gorrilla glue did ooze out as it expanded so hoping that will sand off and not leave any blemish.

Cheers,
Mark

Bud,

Yes, I used the Kreg Jig. Worked really well got the joints tight and flush. Some of the gorrilla glue did ooze out as it expanded so hoping that will sand off and not leave any blemish.

Cheers,
Mark

I went ahead and used typical wood glue, seemed to be fine, no expansion.

Bud

Mark,

Any updates? Or has work ground to a halt?

Bud,

Yes, I used the Kreg Jig. Worked really well got the joints tight and flush. Some of the gorrilla glue did ooze out as it expanded so hoping that will sand off and not leave any blemish.

Cheers,
Mark
Mark,

The GG will sand easily so no worries there. Those panels will look great. It would be nice if you could just draw it on the computer and click on the "EASY" button to make it happen in real life :)
http://swithey.gotdns.org/swithey/ht/avs/easybutton.jpg

Why didn't anybody tell me you could just use the easy button! Doh!


Kevin -

You must not have read page 2,135 of the Acoustical Treatments Master Thread carefully. It clearly states "or hit the easy button for a perfect theater experience." :rolleyes: :D

Crap! When I think of all the months I've wasted......


Kevin -

Mark,

Any updates? Or has work ground to a halt?

Cathan,

Things have definitely slowed as I had a lot of exterior maintenance to do before the weather gets too bad plus I had to build the kids playset.

Also had a mishap last week. Slipped with a drill and ended up drilling into the palm of my hand.....went in a fair way and lost ability to grip for a few days. Had me worried that I drilled into a tendon or something. But all OK now.

I've installed the door to the theatre and I'm making progress building the framework for all the panelling going in the rear of the theatre. Just got back from HD with more Oak.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

The GG will sand easily so no worries there. Those panels will look great. It would be nice if you could just draw it on the computer and click on the "EASY" button to make it happen in real life :)

Now that would be a worth while purchase :)

Things have definitely slowed as I had a lot of exterior maintenance to do before the weather gets too bad plus I had to build the kids playset.

How about some pics of the kids playset? I need to build one of these pretty soon myself :)

Just so you know I'm not totally slacking here are some pics of progress today.

This is the panel been working on to today......see I'm making good use of the Kreg Jig :D

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/Panel1.jpg

Closer image of the joints

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/Panel2.jpg

And here it is up on the wall.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/Panel3.jpg

Hoping to get another panel done tomorrow but kids want me to put the Halloween decorations up also.

Sorry to hear about your hand. That one sounds like it must have hurt. And I do know what it's like to be gimped. I've picked up a nasty case of tennis elbow myself. No clue how I got either. It's more than hampered my ability to tinker around the house. Matter of fact I'm icing it right now after having spent the day building wood valances for the bedroom. Injuries just suck.

Anywho, glad to know you made a bit more progress. Every little bit does get you just that small smidge to being done.

How about some pics of the kids playset? I need to build one of these pretty soon myself :)

As requested.......still need to put canopy up but will leave that till spring.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/Playset.jpg

Cheers,
Mark

Mark, the panel looks great! I'm sure you're happy you got the Kreg. Are you plan on staining it on the wall itself or off the wall? If you can possiblely do it off the wall, do it. What kind of wood are you using? What did you plan on doing with the inside sections (the panels themselves)?

Bud

Hi Bud,

The panel frames are already glued & nailed to the walls. I used Red Oak......bit pricy but liked the grain. .....will be using a cherry stain.

I'll be filling the centres with Oak ply.....now easiest way would have been to put the ply up first but due to lack of foresight when I made the acoustic treatment frames I built the at 49"x25" (inside measurement) so I can add a 0.5" frame to the 703......but that made for too much waste of 8'x4' ply.....so will cut each square out......no biggy as I will be using a 1/4" quadrant molding to frame them......just hoping a local wood yard holds 1/4" Oak quadrant as can't find it in HD or Lowes.

Got another section of the panelling done today.....got 2 small sections left to do and the front of the bar - but that needs some work as its going to double as a Bass Trap.

I'm hoping to have all woodwork finished by end of next weekend so I can get on with staining as the carpet goes down w/c 6th Nov :eek:

BTW - Your Hush Box turned out great . I may end up building a Hush Box for my PJ as you do hear the fan but not enough to be overly worried about.

Cheers,
MaRK

Mark -

So where's the picture of your hand with the drill bit in it? I took the time to put out the picture of the nail in my shoe. I just can't image what else you were thinking of at the time. I know my FIRST thought was "I gotta get a picture of this!" So what were YOU thinking?

Glad it's better! You put me to shame. I gotta get back to my build.

Tom

Ha, Ha - Sorry no picture.

My main concern was to stop the blood squirting all over my Oak. :) Was a bit of a gusher at the time.

Whats amazed me is how quickly this wound has healed.

Where are you up to on your build? No Drywall in sight yet?

Cheers,
Mark

I thought you wanted to stain it a reddish color anyway? Sounds like free stain to me!

I only have a little framing around the stairs to do. If I can do the one little section to support the plumbing for the wet bar, I could actually do the plumbing pretty quickly and install the exhaust vent for the bathroom, then I'd be ready for the HVAC and plumbing inspections, then finish up the little bit of framing and start electric. At that point I think it would go much faster.

No drywall in sight yet, but if the lift is in your way and you're definitely through with it, I'd be glad to come pick it up.

On another note, where is your electric panel relative to your room? Mine has to be IN the room and a guy up the street with the same model says the county told him that you CANNOT cover the gray panel in any way. Says they told him the firemen have to be able to see the panel. Have you run into this?

Tom

My panel is at the rear in the bar area......I'm planning on putting a more attractive door to blend with the rest of the HT. If Thats against code I'll remove it and put it back on after inspections.

the drywall lift is OK for now - I might be able to get my star ceiling done before you need it. If it gets in the way I'll lett you know.

Cheers,
Mark

That's what I was thinking...Ill frame for a cover and just leave it off fo rinspections.

Just let me know when you're done with it and I'll come get it. Can't wait to see your star ceiling. I had thought about that originally but decided it was enough just to do the room. I guess this falls into that old wives tale for me...something along the lines of when the house is finished you die. I guess I'll never be finished if I'm always thinking about doing the star ceiling.

Tom

Thought I'd post my latest sound measurements.....

The measurement in the furnice room itself is about 75dB, before I started the project from within the HT with no drywall it was 72dB, with single layer (plus R13 insulation) it was 64dB with 2nd layer of drywall and green glue (no door) was 56dB...........with door I get no reading at all :D If I really listen I can just about tell the funice is on but think that is the air movement through the HVAC register.

So I'm really pleased with my results! :D :D :D

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

Just a thought about your electrical panel, is it connected from the main panel in anyway? If so having it covered should not be a problem since the firemen would use the main panel in the garage in case they needed to. I have my sub-panel tied to my primary panel in the garage and can turn off the entire sub-panel with the flick of a 100A breaker. Just a my thoughts on the matter.

John

John,

The electric panel is the main panel.....like Tom says if code says you can hide it behind a door I'll leave door off untill after I've passed :D

Cheers,
Mark

Damn Mark.. be careful!

You need to get your scheduling straight... you built a playset for the onset of winter, and took time off the build of your warm comfy HT? ;)

I'm in "small details" mode now(well except for that pesky bathroom)... the equipment has been in for a couple of weeks and we are really enjoying it. Let me know if you want to swing by some time...

Steve,

Actually there was another motive. I had the father in-law visting and he likes to help, which is great, but he can sometimes be a little sloppy. So while he was here we did the outside maintenance and the playset (actually weather was great while doing it).......plus I needed to get some brownie points with the wife.

I sure will swing by one evening - will call you in advance.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

Did you happen to do a sound measurement with one layer of drywall, R-13 insulation..and the door on? I would think that would give a true expression of the benefits of GG and the second layer of drywall.

Did you happen to do a sound measurement with one layer of drywall, R-13 insulation..and the door on? I would think that would give a true expression of the benefits of GG and the second layer of drywall.

Meddy, No - door was only just installed.

Cheers,
Mark

Thanks Mark for the reply. I think this is the one thing that is the source of most of my confusion over the past year on these boards. I'm sure double drywall and GG does, as you've stated, render a nearly perfectly quiet solution. What I haven't seen in lurking on these boards for over a year is details showing what the DB level would have been with just one layer of drywall over an insulated wall, in an actual home circumstance. In your situation for instance, what level of furnace noise would you have heard with the one layer with the door on, compared to two layers with GG. Is it a night and day difference or is it a difference that most really wouldn't appreciate :( Guess I'll just have to keep looking.

Meddy,

One of my reasons for posting my results was because I had not seen others results at various stages of the build. Unfortunately my doors moved during construction hence why the went up after drywall complete. I have no real science other than using the furnace as common a reference point.

Maybe this plan will bring things into a little perspective to see where the furnace is in relation to the HT area.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/Unnfinished_Basement.jpg

In the Rec area room at the back I still measure 62dB. The moment I walk into the room and close door I get no measurement so it drops to under 50dB. If I really listen I can hear the furnace faintly.

Also, when I'm in the HT room with door closed I barely hear anything from rest of the house (except kids in Rec area as door is still a weak spot). Similarly they don't hear me - an exception is when I turn on the compressor or have the sub up real load.

It took me a while to take the plunge with GG but after listening to those on forum who have used it and the professionals that use it I thought why take risk.....once the structure is built there is no turning back.

Now maybe I'm just trying to justify me spending nearly $500 on GG but I don't think so.

Cheers,
Mark

Interesting to note that as I was writing my previous response I received my monthly Axiom newsletter ( you probably got yours too as I see you have the QS8's) where they are talking about "soundproofing" a home theatre and interestingly enough they suggest using a bead of Silicone caulk on studs as you are putting up drywall sheets and again silicone caulk between the two layers of 5/8 drywall. That advice should spark another interesting round of debate on this and other forums. GG vs. Silicone Caulk. Let's get ready to rumble :)
P.S. Thanks for taking the time in explaining your situation. I am just finishing my electrical work and soon have to make decisions on the drywall.

Yes. I saw that and was going to mention as I'm sure there will be some that will dispute that. But lets hope not in my thread .......all though the hit count and response would look good :D

Good luck on the rest of your build.

Cheers,
Mark

they suggest using a bead of Silicone caulk on studs as you are putting up drywall sheets and again silicone caulk between the two layers of 5/8 drywall. That advice should spark another interesting round of debate on this and other forums. GG vs. Silicone Caulk. Let's get ready to rumble :)
Rumble-- rumble...

My guess from my very limited use of the GG is that the GG stays "gooey" almost forever where silicone gets hard (but still not as hard as say liquid nail). I think its the gooey nature of GG that helps it do the job it does. Just my .02 :D

Oh no :eek: I fear a GG vs Silicon hijack is about to commence :eek:

Mark

Don't want to hijack your thread so I think I'll ask the question on the accoustics master thread if I get a bit of time later in the day. I did a quick search on this thread and the accoustic thread and could find virtually nothing about the silicone caulk theory. Not sure how far back the search engine goes but it seems this hasn't been a hot topic for awhile :cool:

I'm about to start work on transforming my bar (at the rear of the HT) into a resonant absorber to help control frequencies around 100Hz. The suggestion came from Bryan (bpape) but the science can be found in this thread (http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=568891).

First I want to say there were a number of aesthetic contraints (i.e. needed to look like the rest of my panelling) but hopefully a happy medium was found.

This is the current plan.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/bar-lf-treatment.jpg

Using the Membrane trap formula: d = 28900 / (M * f^2)
d = depth of airspace in inches
M = surface density of panel, lb / ft^2
f = peak absorbing frequency

M for 1/4" plywood is about 0.6866 lb / ft^2

So f = 109Hz

I'll be starting work tonight rerouting the electric wiring and revising framing and will post some pics as I go along.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

That is very cool. I am planning to build a tuned bass trap in the rear of my room as well as a curved sound diffusor above it. Bryan suggested this idea to me as well. Your trap should prove to be attractive and beneficial to your room.

I managed to dismantle the orginal bar frame & wiring, re-frame, re-wire and get the 2 layers of MDF up tonight. Need to get some extra supplies to finish.

BritInVA:

For a 'grain of salt' remember that I've never built one of these. I just surf.

The "d = 28900 / (M * f^2)" formula is 1DOF (one degree of freedom). It assumes that whatever's on the back is infinitely solid. The closer you get to that (like 6" of solid concete slab floor) the closer to the predicted results you'll get. Perhaps 2 more layers of 3/4" MDF. A flexable back gives two resonant frequencies, one of which is probably lower than the predicted.

It also assumes there's the structure stiffness is negligable. For wood that tends to be true for larger panels, and less true for smaller ones. A 4x8 sheet is certainly large enough. A 12"x12" sheet is too small (too stiff due to the frame). In between it's not obvious to me. Yours is 32"x31". Stiffer should be a higher frequency.

You've added insulation, which should lower the frequency according to between 1.2 to 1.4 times for the depth of the insulation. So, you have a 2x4, that's 3.5" depth. But 1" of that is 703 and 2.5" of that is air. So I'll pick a middle point and suggest that we multiply that 1" by 1.3, giving a new depth of 3.8".
d = 28900 / (M * f^2)
becomes
f = sqrt(28900 / ( d * m) )
e.g
f = sqrt (28900 / 3.5 * 0.6866 ) = 109hz
f = sqrt (28900 / 3.8 * 0.6866 ) = 105hz

Have you weighed your 1/4" sheet - is 0.6866 the actual surface density ?

A lot of designs try to be tunable. By
a) Allowing for the addition/removal of mass (adding mass by adding some decorative trim, removal of mass by drilling some holes and covering with something lighter).
b) Changing the depth
c) Changing the mechanical stiffness
d) Changing the air stiffness (sealing the edges to increase the air spring, or opening the edges to weaken the air spring. In yours you could weaken the air spring by drilling holes through the 1.5" of MDF)

There's also a ringing problem that may come up, although the insulation will likely take care of that. Sometimes insulation damps the resonance so much the panel doesn't absorb any more.

I assume that 100hz is an axial mode, that means your room is about 22.5 feet long, and 8 feet tall. Further assuming it's about 14' wide gives a room surface area of 1214 ft^2. Your absorber is 6.8 ft^2, or 0.5% of the surface. That room would have an optimal RT60 if it had about 552 sabins of absorption at all frequencies.

Assuming your absorber gives a peak resonant absorption of 0.2 (wild guess -- not based on anything), then at 6.8 ft^2 that's 1.3 sabins. That's 0.2% of the required absorption at that frequency.

Resonant absorbers work best at high pressure areas, such as at the wall. If this is at a modal pressure null, then it will do nothing to absorb that mode.

The good news is that even worst case, there's so little surface area here that even if the target frequency is different than your resonant peak frequency, well I don't think its going to hurt much.

Will you be doing an ETF5/RplusD/etc waterfall chart to look for modal ringing before/after differences?

For a 'grain of salt' remember that I've never built one of these. I just surf.

Your knowledge, detailed posts and willingness to help those that lack the knowledge (read complete novices like me) is appreciated . People like you and Bryan (bpape) are a great help to us all.

The "d = 28900 / (M * f^2)" formula is 1DOF (one degree of freedom). It assumes that whatever's on the back is infinitely solid. The closer you get to that (like 6" of solid concete slab floor) the closer to the predicted results you'll get. Perhaps 2 more layers of 3/4" MDF. A flexable back gives two resonant frequencies, one of which is probably lower than the predicted.


I don't really have the room to add another 1.5". There will be cabinets with granite top along that side. I may be able to add sections of MDF between the cabinet frames to make the back more solid.

It also assumes there's the structure stiffness is negligable. For wood that tends to be true for larger panels, and less true for smaller ones. A 4x8 sheet is certainly large enough. A 12"x12" sheet is too small (too stiff due to the frame). In between it's not obvious to me. Yours is 32"x31". Stiffer should be a higher frequency.


My sheet (between studs) will be 34" x 31"

You've added insulation, which should lower the frequency according to between 1.2 to 1.4 times for the depth of the insulation. So, you have a 2x4, that's 3.5" depth. But 1" of that is 703 and 2.5" of that is air. So I'll pick a middle point and suggest that we multiply that 1" by 1.3, giving a new depth of 3.8".
d = 28900 / (M * f^2)
becomes
f = sqrt(28900 / ( d * m) )
e.g
f = sqrt (28900 / 3.5 * 0.6866 ) = 109hz
f = sqrt (28900 / 3.8 * 0.6866 ) = 105hz

Have you weighed your 1/4" sheet - is 0.6866 the actual surface density ?


No not weighed yet (still to purchase). I used the weights in your archive thread as initial reference points.

A lot of designs try to be tunable. By
a) Allowing for the addition/removal of mass (adding mass by adding some decorative trim, removal of mass by drilling some holes and covering with something lighter).
b) Changing the depth
c) Changing the mechanical stiffness
d) Changing the air stiffness (sealing the edges to increase the air spring, or opening the edges to weaken the air spring. In yours you could weaken the air spring by drilling holes through the 1.5" of MDF)


And there was me using sealer to make the interior air tight :o

There's also a ringing problem that may come up, although the insulation will likely take care of that. Sometimes insulation damps the resonance so much the panel doesn't absorb any more.

I assume that 100hz is an axial mode, that means your room is about 22.5 feet long, and 8 feet tall. Further assuming it's about 14' wide gives a room surface area of 1214 ft^2. Your absorber is 6.8 ft^2, or 0.5% of the surface. That room would have an optimal RT60 if it had about 552 sabins of absorption at all frequencies.


The room is 24'10" long, 11'1" wide at the front/screen, 8'10" at the rear with 7'8" ceiling (some of the area is soffetted). At the moment I've treated the front and 3' of sides with 2" 703 with cotton in the side corners. At moment the screen area is not covered as I'm using painted wall. Will change that once I get my screen.

Along the sides of the main HT area there will be (still to add) 1" 703 extending 8' along the wall between 7" & 55" in height. They will be panels in the region of 48"x20" framed with 2.5" Oak. The remaining wall surfaces will be wood panels(in the rear) to 57" then drywall.

Assuming your absorber gives a peak resonant absorption of 0.2 (wild guess -- not based on anything), then at 6.8 ft^2 that's 1.3 sabins. That's 0.2% of the required absorption at that frequency.

Resonant absorbers work best at high pressure areas, such as at the wall. If this is at a modal pressure null, then it will do nothing to absorb that mode.


I'm not able, mainly for aesthetic constraints, to place against the wall. The bar was not specifically placed using any science.


The good news is that even worst case, there's so little surface area here that even if the target frequency is different than your resonant peak frequency, well I don't think its going to hurt much.

Will you be doing an ETF5/RplusD/etc waterfall chart to look for modal ringing before/after differences?

I don't have any software to perform detailed tests. I was thinking of using the test tones from Ethans site and my SPL meter to plot a graph. Is this a worth while thing to do?

Or are there any NoVA folks that know how to do this?

Again appreciate your comments.

Cheers,
Mark

Here is a layout showing where the treatment will be.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/HTLayout2.jpg

Cheers,
Mark

BritInVa:

I don't have any software to perform detailed tests. I was thinking of using the test tones from Ethans site and my SPL meter to plot a graph.

Yes.
a) Disconnect all speakers except the subwoofer
b) put the subwoofer in one tri-corner (probably a front floor corner) - 1/4" spacing between the two walls and subwoofer. As close as you can get without touching. (Optional/Silly/Humor: you can glue and screw the subwoofer to the wall if you want it closer than 1/4". You can cut a hole in the wall so that the subwoofer is flush with the surface of the wall)
c) put the SPL meter in the opposite tri-corner (a ceiling rear corner)
d) Test from 20 to 80 hz.
e) Disconnect all speakers except a front speaker
f) put the front speaker in one tri-corner (probably a front floor corner) - 1/4" spacing between the two walls and speaker.
g) put the SPL meter in the opposite tri-corner (a ceiling rear corner)
h) test from 80 to 200 hz.

Is this a worth while thing to do?If you find modes, you can compare the frequencies against a modal calculator like http://www.bobgolds.com/Mode/RoomModes.htm , and then do some grade-4 math to figure out where the pressure peaks and nulls would be.
This might help
http://www.hunecke.de/english/calculators/room-eigenmodes.html

Knowing your most powerful mode(s), you can use that information to position your subwoofer to not-energize that mode.
http://www.harman.com/wp/pdf/Loudspeakers&RoomsPt3.pdf

This is a fair bit of work. Do it only if you're really keen/curious/ExperimentallyEntertained.
(alternatively there are people who can do this for you, and do it better and faster, for a couple hundred bucks.)
Personally I went the ETF5/RplusD route within a year of buying my Radio Shack SPL meter.

Hmmm.....I'm wondering now if 'I want to know'.

My speaker/sub-woofer placement options are hard set now - as are my treatments. If I did do measurements and find issues I'm not sure what I could really do without a complete resdesign.

Starting to think what I don't know won't concern me - and am 'I' really likely to tell the difference. So far without a treated room it sounds great to me already.

Thanks again for your response.

Cheers,
Mark

BritInVA:

So far without a treated room it sounds great to me already.

I always remember what my mother said once.
"I don't know why you spend so much time thinking about acoustics. My television sounds just fine through a single 3" speaker. BTW, thank you for the DVD player. When I can't understand the dialog I just rewind a bit, turn on subtitles, and I can read what they said!"

Recently I moved my subwoofers upstairs (from the concrete basement into the living room). I'm hearing LFE effects I've never heard before.

BritInVA:

Membrane traps work on pressure areas.

In this graph (from the Harmon website), the top of the curves are pressure areas, and the bottom of the curves are not. I've drawn green lines where I think your absorber is in your room. So any spot in a green area, that's also high on the curve, is a mode that may be affected by your absorber, assuming it resonantes at that curve's frequency.

This assumes your walls are 100% reflective.

Looking at the 91hz yellow curve, I'd guess BINGO. :)

http://www.bobgolds.com/BritInVA/axial_modes.gif

Putting the bar 5'9" to 6'2" (ish -- you could work it out better) away from the rear wall (yellow, blue, red; mostly yellow since yellow is 90ish hz and your absorber is 100ish hz), and the subwoofer 6' away from the front wall (non-energize the black mode), might be an option.

Tangental and Oblique modes may be affected as well if there are pressure nodes there. But I'll leave calculating those to you.
http://www.bobgolds.com/Tangental/KuttruffModes67.jpg

Bob,

My front of the Bar is at 4'11" (fixed position) at the moment my subwoofer is currently in the front-right corner. My only other subwoofer option is in the front-left corner.

Also the height of my room is 7'8" (the 8'10" is the width of the room at the rear of the room due to a bumb-out of the bath).

Cheers,
Mark

Bob - was looking for that tool on the harmankardon.com site and not found it.

Hmmm.....I'm wondering now if 'I want to know'.

Yeah, I haven't even started yet, and Bob's scaring the hell out of me :eek:

Plus, I'm starting off with acoustically bad dimensions 15' x 15' x 7.5' avg height. I'm trying to figure away around this, but I may be stuck. Could be sound absorbtion everywhere and hope for the best.

Your paneling is going to look great, I look forward to seeing your completed room.

Thanks for letting me tag along!
Chip

Chip - glad to have another local(ish) on board. Where in WV are you?

Hopefully make a big dent this weekend. Got Friday off :D and my moulding is due to arrive Friday also :D Now if only my wife would stop arranging social engagements :(

Cheers,
Mark

Hi Mark, I'm afraid I'm more "ish" than local. I'm all the way on the western side of WV, in a little burg called Ravenswood. It's about a 5-1/2 hr drive to the DC metro area.

I feel your pain. I've been stuck finishing outdoor projects, as we've already seen some flurrys flying around here. Of course nothing like CO and the Fly-In Theater...Santa maybe the only one flying out there :D

Good luck getting back to the paneling!
Chip

Some good progress today (took a day off).

Got all the plywood cut.....barely any splintering and any that there is gets covered with the moulding. Moulding also came today so got a few panels trimmed.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/Panel4.jpg

I also got most of the the bar membrane absorber done as well.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/bar-1.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/bar-2.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/HT/bar-3.jpg

Just need to get the styles on.

Hope to get rest of the moulding done tomorrow and start staining on Sunday......countdown to carpet 8 days.

Cheers,
Mark

Looks great Mark!

Once you get to the carpet install, watch the guys like a hawk. Last time I had carpet put in they scraped the hell out of my walls unrolling and trimming the carpets. I'd hate to see all of your woodwork somehow get scratched. Perhaps think about taping some construction paper or something at floor level.

Cathan - I've decided 'not' to install the base moulding until after the carpet is laid. Will instruct them the leave 1.25" clearance between grip bar and wall sd Base moulding can go down without covering the grip. Was thinking about covering the woodwork where carpet is to be laid.

Really coming together today.....got majority of quarter round in place, just got 1 section left and the bar styles then I can start staining. Got to stop now for a social engagement :(

Till tomorrow.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark - what did you decide or find out about the electrical outlets behind the acoustic cotton? I am about to build my screen wall and have a couple of sockets that are on the rear wall but behind the screen wall. They will be hidden by GOM about 14" in front, on the screen wall but I am wondering if I need to have a visible outlet by code somewhere along the front. I am also a "Brit in VA" in Loudoun but sadly don't posses your DIY skills!! Next time there is a NoVA get together I owe you a pint as your thread has been my reference thread thoughout my build.

Cheers

Piers

Hi Mark, I'm afraid I'm more "ish" than local. I'm all the way on the western side of WV, in a little burg called Ravenswood. It's about a 5-1/2 hr drive to the DC metro area.

I feel your pain. I've been stuck finishing outdoor projects, as we've already seen some flurrys flying around here. Of course nothing like CO and the Fly-In Theater...Santa maybe the only one flying out there :D

Good luck getting back to the paneling!
Chip


It's not that bad if you don't mind shoveling 2 feet of snow;) Besides it gives me an excuse to stay in the basement and get some work done. Here is a pic of the back yard the day after our 6 hour blizzard:
http://home.comcast.net/~d.fahey/Boyd_loving_the_snow.JPG

Hey Mark your panels rock! I need you to fly out to Denver to build mine for the bar...

Drew

I think I will qoute Chico and the Man, "Loooking GOOD!!!"

Mark - what did you decide or find out about the electrical outlets behind the acoustic cotton? I am about to build my screen wall and have a couple of sockets that are on the rear wall but behind the screen wall. They will be hidden by GOM about 14" in front, on the screen wall but I am wondering if I need to have a visible outlet by code somewhere along the front. I am also a "Brit in VA" in Loudoun but sadly don't posses your DIY skills!! Next time there is a NoVA get together I owe you a pint as your thread has been my reference thread thoughout my build.

Cheers

Piers

Piers - welcome to the growing merry band of HT'ers in NoVA. So you over near the British Pantry.....small piece of the UK close to you. Will let you know when I halod a opening but the last piece is the seating which may need to wait till the tax rebates.

I'm not sure about code but what I've done is insert the 'baby' covers in the recepticle not used and I built a box out of 1/2" MDF around the recepticle in use. Also these recepticles are only live when the HT is in used as they route via my power center.

Cheers,
Mark

Hey Mark your panels rock! I need you to fly out to Denver to build mine for the bar... Drew

Drew Thanks - I must admit I'm pretty pleased with how they are coming out. Majority of my woodworking in the past has been painted so you can hide your errors easy. So was a bit concerned about the level of woodworking in these panels but so far does look great :D


Hopefully we have a few more months here in NoVA before we need to strt the shovelling.

Cheers,
Mark

I think I will qoute Chico and the Man, "Loooking GOOD!!!"

Thanks Don.

Hey Mark... was that you on Waxpool in the blue Neon at about 7:20 this morning?

Tried to get your attention....

Mark:

You must have missed the alert I posted over on the good deals thread when I spotted some snowblowers at a really low price for sale at Sams Club the week of the 4th of July.

In my experience on my street when ever some one gets a new snowblower we have real light year.

Hey Mark... was that you on Waxpool in the blue Neon at about 7:20 this morning?

Tried to get your attention....

Yep - that was probably me......especially if I was weaving and cutting in :D

Mark:

You must have missed the alert I posted over on the good deals thread when I spotted some snowblowers at a really low price for sale at Sams Club the week of the 4th of July.

I my experience on my street when ever some one gets a new snowblower we have real light year.

Big - didn't see that.....barely have time to keep up with this forum. As it happens we have a snow blower that we share amongst a few of us. Definitly helped with the shovelling last year :D

I my experience on my street when ever some one gets a new snowblower we have real light year.

The year I bought mine we actually had those three big storms, and the one was about 18". Last year I used it once and that was just to get it running. And once I DO get it running, I do the entire cul de sac! Even so I figure that at what it would cost me to pay someone to do it (if I can even FIND someone to do it), I come out WAY ahead. If the blower only lasts 10 year, that's about $60 a year.

I've seen a couple of early predictions that say we are in for another white winter. Glad I got mine!

Tom

I'm like you, I bought mine 5 years ago and always do the entire culd de sac. the rest of the neighbors would come out and put gas in it. last year two more neighbors bought blowers so we knock it out real quick. usually build a huge snow fort out of blown snow for the kids..

Collectively, my neighbors and I bought a used snowblower. It's on my list to see if the thing actually works or not. Even if it doesn't we'll only be out $20.

When living in New England I just shovel everything the old fashion way as our driveway was pretty short. Having a blower will be a treat. Although a necessary one given we live on a private pipe stem.

Took today off and stained the panelling.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/Panel5.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/Panel6.jpg

Still got some work to do on the bar. Ran out of 1/4" quarter round (more on order) and need to install the bar top rail (Michael [cathan] coming round over weekend with his 12" Mitre).

Will be applying 3 coats of polycrylic satin finish over the weekend. So all on schedule for carpet on Monday :D

Cheers,
Mark

BritInVA:

polycrylic satin
I bought some of that this week to go over some oak I'd stained with Red Mahogany Stain. I read the package, and it said 'for use on all surfaces, including metal, wood, plastic. For use with all coverings, including all stains, paints, oil and water based products. Except our Minwax Red Mahogany stain. Polycrylic is not compatable with Minwax Red Mahogany' (paraphrased)

So I did some searching for clear strong stains.
The best product out there seems to be "General Finishes High Performance".
However the best that Home Depot sells is "Varathane Diamond Polyurethane"
Best defined as clearest, non ambering, strongest.
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/uploadedImages/Fine_Woodworking_Network/Image_Resources/Web_Only/Waterborne_Test_Results.pdf

If for some reason you want to look, scroll down to the bottom of this page. (http://www.bobgolds.com/LivingRoomPlasma/Construction/home.htm)

So I took back my can of polycrylic, and bought Varathane Diamond Polyurethane. And while I was there I accidentally bought a table saw.

I really like the Craftsmen paneling. You did an excellent job. :D

Bob - Reason I went with polycrylic finish was quick drying. I need to get 3 coats on this weekend. I've not used a Cherry stain so hopefully should be fine.

Brian - Thanks. The panelling is coming out better than expected :D

BritInVA:

So I took back my can of polycrylic, and bought Varathane Diamond Polyurethane. And while I was there I accidentally bought a table saw.

:eek: I hate when those accidents happen! ;) :D

Which one did you get? Table saw is next on my list of major tool purchases.

So I took back my can of polycrylic, and bought Varathane Diamond Polyurethane. And while I was there I accidentally bought a table saw.

Reminds me of time I went to BB for a camcorder tape and cam back with a camcorder as well :eek:

Cathan:

I grew up with a 220 volt cast iron table saw. Big Heavy Wonderful. But after my father died and my mother moved around (now on a farm, shepardess) and I moved around (university, apartments, small multi-storey-house now), somewhere in that we gave it to my uncle. For more than a decade I've been wandering around saying "I miss my table saw."

I need to be able to work in the garage and the basement.

So I considered the Ryobi BTS20 (http://209.235.210.201/images/tools/BTS20R.jpg) but I didn't like the miter -- specifically it wobbled around in the track too much. But it was light enough to move up and down the stairs.
I liked the fence on the Ridgid TS2400 (http://www.ridgid.com/CatalogDocs/TS2400LS.jpg) better than the occasionally better reviewed (http://www.consumersearch.com/www/house_and_home/table-saw-reviews/index.html) Bosch 4000, but both the Bosch 4000 and the TS2400 were too heavy to lift up and down the stairs. So I started planing a garage ceiling pully system to lift it up, and then a 4x8 shelf over the hood of my SUV with ramps (using 2x8 @ 10' with a metal end as ramps) again in the garage (i.e. the 4x8 shelf is attached the garage, and I park with the nose of my SUV under the shelf). I've made a few trips to home depot and looked at table saws. And I've been to real professional equipment stores and looked at real table saws (not a chance in hell I'd be able to get those up and down the stairs).

This trip to home depot I brought a tape measure to measure how tall the TS2400 was when in it's lowered to the floor state (17.5" to table surface, 22" to the top of the safety guard) -- so I could plan on how high to make the shelf in the garage for it. Just planning. No purchasing intended.

But the day I went to get the Varathane Dimond Polyurethane I removed the wingnuts from the TS2400 saw from the TS2400 wheeled-stand, and the saw itself was less than 45 pounds. Most of it is plastic. No problem -- I can carry the saw up and down the circular basement stairs in one trip, and the 80 pound stand up and down the stairs in another trip. Heavy is not a problem, I bench press 220 pounds. Big is not a problem. Heavy and Big is awkward to the point of impossibility. Separated they are small and light.
So, TS2400
- accurate miter (not as good as the one I grew up with, but pretty good)
- accurate fence
- light enough to move
- reasonable 15amp power
- SOLD

Hmmm...Looks so good it makes me rethink my decor...damn you Mark, I thought I had a final decision :D

PS: What are the acoustic implications with this paneling style? I was looking at 703 floor to ceiling between columns, but have also read scrim on the bottom, but also reflective at the top. I'm not expecting acoustic perfection, I doubt I could tell the difference anyway. But I don't want it to sound bad either. Anybody have some quick advice?

Looking Great!

Chip

PS: What are the acoustic implications with this paneling style? I was looking at 703 floor to ceiling between columns, but have also read scrim on the bottom, but also reflective at the top. I'm not expecting acoustic perfection, I doubt I could tell the difference anyway. But I don't want it to sound bad either. Anybody have some quick advice?
Chip

Chip,

The panelling is behind the HT seating area. Along the walls between the front speakers and the seating area I will be treating the walls from 8" to 54" with 1" 703. There is just 2.5" of wood in between the panels so I think the primary reflections are taken care of.

I'm sure the purists out there will be looking in horror at the panelling but each to their own. I had one area to fit in the HT & the bar so compromises were needed.

Cheers,
Mark

I can now personally assure everyone that Mark's room will be smoking once it's done. The paneling looks amazing in person. The photos really don't do it any justice.

And your house and family get a big thumbs up as well.

Thanks for the tour. I think my wife is now a lot more fired up about the project. She was talking about designing the space so that it would have a wetbar with a beer tap in it. :D

Michael - Glad it worked out well for both of us. I got my bar rail cut and looks like your gonna get a kegerator.

Got 2 coats done......got to sand before next coat goes on but all on schedule for carpet.

Cheers,
Mark

The panelling now has 3 coats......just waiting on the extra quarter round to come then I'll finish the bar. Gave the walls one more coat of Red (think thats 6 coats now) and gave everything a good dusting/sweeping. All ready for carpet.

Moved the table & mitre saws to the garage and started on some frames for the fabric side panelling.

I'll post some pics tomorrow with carpet down and hopefully some of the fabric panels up.

Cheers,
Mark

I'm sure that once the carpet is down, the room will look 95% done. Good luck with today's install!

Carpet layers are here.......please say a prayer for my woodwork :eek:

I had carpet put down with woodwork and I wound up taping cardbaord to the woodwork prior to carpet...

Well the carpet is installed and looking sweet :D

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/carpet-1.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/carpet-2.jpg

The installers did a great job and no damage :D

Going to get on with the acoustic panels now :D

Cheers,
Mark

Looks great. Let's get a close up of the stage. I really like the berber!

Here are a couple of closer shots of the stage.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/carpet-3.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/carpet-4.jpg

Cheers,
Mark

BritInVA:
Coming along nicely.
I seem to recall some musicians saying that wood walls make the room sound warmer.
Are the wood panels glued to the drywall, or is there an air gap behind them.
(If air-gap, what's the surface mass of the panel and the space behind them?)

Nice job on the carpet on the curves of the stage. I wouldn't have thought that was possible. (Clearly, don't hire me to do your carpet!)

Bob - the ply is up against the drywall (no airgap) but not glued. The quarter round holds them in place.

Cheers,
Mark

Looking good Mark!

You'll have to drop by for a look a my place when you get a chance... it's finally done.

BritInVA:
Please consider doing a LF sweep for rattles ASAP.

Bob - Those things are in solid. The quarter round grips them good plus the polyacrylic finish adds additional grip. But will be running a LF sweep......I think my biggest LF issue will be any bottles/glasses rattling in the bar area :eek:

Steve - now the carpet deadline has been met I should have more time so will come by in the very near future.

I quickly made up one of the acoustic panels - need to put more tension but the combination of the carpet, fabric, paint & wood seems to lend together very nice :D

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/AcousticPanel1.jpg

Cheers,
Mark

The panel looks great Mark. I had been thinking of something similar for when I start a build early next year. Nicely done.

Tom

A few shots of the acoustic panels.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/AcousticPanel2.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/AcousticPanel3.jpg

Still got to do the other side but need to rip some more framing. I can't at moment as need to use table saw outside and its raining :(

Good news is that the extra quarter round came today so can get on with the bar. Anyone looking for mouldings and can't get a good source locally should definitely look at Baird Bros (http://www.bairdbrothers.com/default.htm). Great inventory, great price, quick delivery and great quality.

Cheers,
Mark

BritInVA:

Your acoustical panels have a little cut out for your receptical. How'd you do that?
(I have to do something similar this month, perhaps more like your cut out for the stage step)

The frames were a bit tricky and the fabric is not perfect but unless you look 'real' close looks great.

I made the frames from 3/4" MDF cut into 1" strips and 1/4" ply also cut into 1" strips. Butt joined the MDF with gorilla glue then overlapped with the ply which was glued and nailed. The 1" 703 was cut to snugly fit inside the frames and covered with fabric. Exterior corners were then pleated and internal corners cut (these are the ones that are not perfect). They then friction fit it the Oak styles......not sure if you can tell from pictures but there is a bevel around the edges.

When I make the panels on the other side I'll take a few pics.

Cheers,
Mark

Just completed to read your thread - your room is coming along very nice!
I don't know how others feel, but once the carpet is installed the room starts to look right and the fun part of the building is starting. Before that, all that framing work and basic construction has to been done - a lot of work, no question - but it doesn't do justice for your great work until you add some fabric to the picture. ;)

Great work!

I don't know how others feel, but once the carpet is installed the room starts to look right and the fun part of the building is starting. Before that, all that framing work and basic construction has to been done - a lot of work, no question - but it doesn't do justice for your great work until you add some fabric to the picture. ;)

Mike,

Thanks - The carpet definitely changes the look from construction site to 'nearly' complete HT. The pictures don't really do the room justice. Still lots to do. Problem now is any messy work has to be done outside or in the garage.

But man what a difference it makes to how the room sounds. Can't wait to get the other acoustic panels up and get a movie on - hopefully that will be Saturday night. Hope to get Cars via Netflix. :D

Cheers,
Mark

Nice avatar by the way. I just spotted it. Too much time on your hands now that it's raining? ;)

Mark -

VERY NICE! I am humbled. Friday is a Holiday...maybe Ill finish that little bit of framing to be able to get to the plumbing and start the inspections.

Tom

Too much time on your hands now that it's raining? ;)

Rain is easing now - hoping to get out at lunchtime and rip the framing.

Friday is a Holiday

I wished it was for me. Sounds like your still a way off before you need the drywall lift. Might start the star-ceiling over Thanksgiving week.

Cheers,
Mark

Here is how I made my panels with the cut outs around the receptacles.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/MakingPanels.jpg

1) Cut 3/4" MDF in strips 1" wide with a 60deg chamfer edge. Cut 1/4" ply also in 1" strips.

2) Assembled to pieces

3) Butt glued the MDF and applied glue to the back.

4) Over layed MDF with the ply strips and secured with 3/4" Finish nails

5) All strips applied

6) inserted into the panel styes to dry in shape

7) Inserted the 1" 703 and wrapped in Fabric

And here is a panoramic of the panels all in place.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/Panoramic-1.jpg

Done a little more on the bar today but held of staining until tomorrow as were watching "Garfield - A Tail of Two Kitties" in the HT tonight.

Cheers,
Mark

Wow, Mark -- that's looking GREAT!!

Thanks Keith.

Just finished watching "Garfield - A Tail of Two Kitties" and the acoustic panels have made a tremendous improvement on the clarity of sound.

Should get the bar stained tomorrow and hoping to pay a last visit to the local Berkline stockist to choose the fabric colour then be ordering from Roman on Monday :D Hopefully get the before Christmas - think we may use the HT to unwrap pressies and watch the Disney Christmas Parade.


Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

Awesome job. Thanks for the reply on my sconces. I have a question on venting your projector heat, what did you do? I'm just wondering if I don't have a vent close to the projector will it get to hot in the room. I will have 2 returns I in the room one close to the floor in the middle of the room and one on top of my equipment closet.

Thanks,
James

James,

I didn't do a vent directly to the PJ. So far I've not had an issue with cooling/heating in the room (actually not needed to have either on yet). I have an 8" supply that splits to 2 x 8" registers and 1 x 8" return in the room.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

again another good explanation for making those panels! Your room is looking better and better - keep the pictures coming. :cool:

I am looking forward to the phase I can do my 34 panels... :eek:

Mike - Glad i only had 8 to do :D One thing to avoid if at all possible is those internal corners. was very difficult to get a neat corner (especially with the chamfered edges).

Cheers,
Mark

This is latest picture of the bar, still needs a few coats of polycrylic.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/bar-4.jpg

What I want to do is put a frosted glass panel above the bar similar to this.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/FrostedGlass.jpg

But with the name of the pub me & my wife frequented when courting 'The Headley Arms'.

I could possible cut out the lettering, stick on a piece of glass with stencil glue and use an etching spray but wondering if anyone knows of an affordable source that can do this.....I'll phone around local glass places.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark -
They make a "spray paint" that sprays on glass and makes it "frosted" It looks good and would be easy to use in the application you mention. Go to a quick sign shop or the like and have them cut the vinyl lettering on the computer and maybe even have them add fancy scrollwork or embellishments and them apply it to the back side of your glass and spray away. Make sure they know its for the back side of the glass so they can cut it the right way. Tell them what your doing and they can help you figure it out.


Kevin -

Kevin - Thanks. Will look into that.

Cheers,
Mark

The bar looks really good. I like the craftmen paneling.

Anyone looking for mouldings and can't get a good source locally should definitely look at Baird Bros (http://www.bairdbrothers.com/default.htm). Great inventory, great price, quick delivery and great quality.


Wow, excellent tip. They do seem to be very reasonably priced. I did not drill far enough into the checkout to "check out" what the shipping would be, but the oak baseboard was at least 25% less than the local big boxes.

The bar looks awesome, and don't worry about what the purists think regarding acoustics. Art and science can coexist!

Shipping was quite resonable for the weight - my order value was $350 and was charged $60 in shipping. So factor in the cheaper price and no tax (plus no gas and waiting or sifting at lumber yard) think still got a great deal. Only issue is max length for UPS Shipping is 8'

Mark

Just ordered my Berkline 088's via Roman at Ultimate Home Entertainment (http://www.rtheaters.com/). Got great advice and price. :D

Were going with following configuration

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/seating-opt5.jpg

And decided on the following fabric.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k242/BritInVA/p3162c85.gif

Just got to keep fingers crossed they make it here for Christmas :D

Cheers,
Mark

We really enjoy our 088s. Did you get the power recline option? I put some bass shakers in mine pretty easily. I've enjoyed your thread, thanks for sharing so much. I'd love to come by if you have a get together when you are finished.

Bill - Yes got the power recline option. I have already got some Aura Bass Shakers too.

The HT is unlikly to be fully finished until next March so will have and open day then but anytime your in the area and want to stop by let me know.

Cheers,
Mark

Bill - Yes got the power recline option. I have already got some Aura Bass Shakers too.

Mark

Mark, here is where I stuck my Auras with the power recline. Don't ask me how it works, getting it wired up hasn't been high on my to do's.
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b393/bigmouthindc/DSCN3798.jpg

There were already 4 holes on the frame that I used to mount the plywood.

Big - Thanks - I still need to by a cheap receiver to drive them. Hoping to find something in the sales. Failing that I can use the Yard HTIB temporarily.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

Question on your stiles and rails for your paneling. It looks like there is some detail on the edges. Did you route the edges or did you use a small molding (like a qtr round) to give you that detail?

Everything is coming together nicely!

Bud

OH, and I forgot. Did you plan on using on-wall speakers? It doesn't look like you're planning on columns. Just curious. I thought you bought them already, didn't think you were planning on making them or anything...

Bud

Bud - I used 3/4" Styles, with a 1/4" ply insert and a 3/8" quarter round that left me with an 1/8" set back.

Looks much better in person......and the sound is coming along great as well. Your steer on the Ascend fronts (and Panny) was spot on for my needs. Still need to decide if I need the rear in ceilings.

I'm usiing on-wall Axiom QS8's

Thanks for all your help during the build.

Cheers,
Mark

Mark,

Always looks better in person, but looks great now. No problem on the recommendations. Next time you want to swing by for a few cold ones when you're in town, let me know.

Bud

Bud - will do. Same goes to you if you find yourself in the NoVA area. There are a few HT's in the area just complete. I still need to get over to Bills & Steves......then theres Bigs - thats worth travelling too on it own.....I'm waiting for his bar to be finished so I can swing another visit :D

Cheers,
Mark

I went with the other axis on my shakers. I moved the recline controller to the other side for more room:

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/339/200604berk088bassshakers0010ei4.th.jpg (http://img296.imageshack.us/my.php?image=200604berk088bassshakers0010ei4.jpg) http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/9532/200604berk088bassshakers0001fi2.th.jpg (http://img296.imageshack.us/my.php?image=200604berk088bassshakers0001fi2.jpg)

Bill - wahat Aura dis you get and how do you like them.....I got 4 x 25w (not the Pros). What are you doing for the Amp?

Cheers,
Mark

I have the little Aura's too. If you click on the picture it will give you a larger view so you can see them better. I started with two on the loveseat. Now that I like them I'm going to get a couple more. One per seat works fine for me. I tried mounting them in between the two recliners of the loveseat, but they rubbed.

I have an old Sony reciever that was stashed away. I use the phono input and have them run in series. I have a subwoofer cable pulled to the middle of the room. I split it to the receiver set up next to my chairs and to my second sub in the back of the room.

I have trouble throwing things out. I have several pairs of old speakers that I want to refurbish, but really have no place to use them. Just started to sell some stuff on craigslist.