I have a h710 that has started having color distortion on startup. The colors will flicker in and out for about 15 seconds until it warms up and then all is normal. Tried unhooking all input cables etc., but no change. It has about 40 hrs on it and since I have not owned a projector before I am wondering if this is normal, I assume it is not.
Thanks

I've only done a few trials of 2-3 hours of viewing each as our theater construction begins. This involved ~4 startups, and I saw nothing like what you described, just an expected ramp up in light intensity upon powering the projector on.

never had that prob ? but when I first start up I let it run a few minutes and usually have the lights on getting snacks or whatever ready ;)

is it after the warmup bars have gone away you see this or durring ?

curious if it does it when connected to any source or is it on just a certain source ?

also are you running any power conditioner ?

bummer to hear hope you get it worked out and its something simple

It is during warmup. Did not do it for the first 35-40 hours. I have unhooked all sources and still have the problem. I do have a power conditioner and I have tried bypassing it also with no luck. I am starting to wonder if it is a bulb issue.
Anyways thanks for the replys will keep after it.

Tried it again tonight. Has to be a color wheel problem. When it started up it flickered between red and blue for the background color, locked in on red for 5 or so seconds and then finally went to blue like it should be. Once it is warmed up the picture seems perfectly normal.
I just hope samsung will replace it or get it fixed right away, because I can't live without it to long.

Please let us know how Samsung handles the repair. Good luck.

I bought the projector from Jason Turk. He said he would replace it. Nice to do business with someone like Jason. I highly recommend Jason and av science.

I am experiencing the same problem as nitro347. Nitro347, has your projector been replaced yet?

FWIW, I have witnessed this problem myself. Started happening after about 40 hrs. I was talking to a dealer today who claimed that Samsung had identified the problem and implementing the fix was the reason for the production delays. I really don't know if this is true or not but it would seem to make some sense. It is also not inconsistent with what another AVS'r reported being told (eg: in this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7589940&&#post7589940)). It does not seem the problem is too wide-spread however

Has anyone with this issue had it resolved yet and, if so, how ? A repair or a swap ?

Brent

Count me in on this as well. But I don't think it's much of a problem because the color flickering goes on for only a few seconds after startup. Beyond that the image stabilizes and everything is fine. In fact I thought that this was a normal startup transient until I saw this thread.

If there is a "fix" someone please post it.

Mine just started doing this too, about the same number of hours also. This sure looks like a trend. Another problem started at the same time, two out the last four times I powered up, the lamp lit for a few seconds and then shut off with the blinking red status LED. I had to hard power off and on to reset it. :mad:

There is no fix for this. This is part of the reason Samsung has them on hold. A connection issue. They have fixed the problem and are aware of it. Any customers with this issue that bought from AVS, please contact me (or your salesperson) for an exchange.

There is no fix for this. This is part of the reason Samsung has them on hold. A connection issue. They have fixed the problem and are aware of it.

Jason, do you mean the projector can't be repaired, must be replaced with a new unit?

If you have a choice, you would probably be better off getting a replacement through your dealer rather than trying to have it repaired.

The Samsung support page for the SPH710AEMX/XAA shows it coming under the "Computers and Related" : "Monitor" category. What is up with that ? The trick to even finding the H710 on Samsung's support pages is to first type in SP-H700AE for the model number and then select SP-H710AE from the pop-up menu.

Samsung's service center has never heard of the H710. It does not show up in their data base. Therefore, they can't tell you with any certainty even where to send it for repair. This does not exactly inspire confidence that the information that presumably exists somewhere within Samsung about this problem and its solution is spread widely enough through the service organisation to allow for timely and effective repair ...

Brent

WEll it can be repaired, but I would talk to your dealer for a faster turnaround (unless of course it is older).

Is there a build date corresponding to the 'fixed' units?

I had a strartup problem where you would hear the pj click to startup the lamp. The lamp would come on for a sec then go off again, almost as if it failed to start. It did that on and off while all the leds on the pj blinked. I returned it to Jason and got a new one.

Now after 50 hours or so I have a similar problem with the new unit but this time the lamp does come on after the pj tries 3 or so times. When it does come on the screen looks jittery and miscolored. After a few moments the picture clears up and all is normal.

I hate the feeling it gives me about the purchase but if it is a known problem then I guess it can be corrected. I held off about bringing it up till I saw this thread with other people having the same problem. I was going to experiment tonight on it thinking it was my own power problems or connections.

I guess I am cursed. Tonight I started up the pj and it went from bad to worse. Now the exact same problems are happening on my new replaced pj. The pj lamp comes on for 1/2 sec then goes off, then 2 seconds later it comes on for 1/2 a sec then goes off, then 2 seconds later it comes on and off again, but this time all the leds on the pj blink including the red one. Sitting there for 5 minutes nothing. I press the power button on the remote and the pj lights go off then on as normally it should, the lamp comes on.

The screen is jittery and out of color, and jittery and jittery, really bad. Then it all comes into clarity with correct color etc and works normal.

This is bad, very bad. This is my second pj with the same problem. I have to call Jason on Monday and deal with this. I was excited about the money saved with the price point but now I cannot recommend this thing due to these problems.

I have the unit on a ups and high end surge suppressor. Now I am thinking that old Benq was worth it after all. At least I would not have these problems. By the way I have 58 hours on the unit.

No wonder this is no longer a "$10K" pj.

yep, the 710 is off my list

Now the exact same problems are happening on my new replaced pj.

Is this newest pj part of the freshly shipped "fixed" batch?

If yes, then I really mean my previous post ... if not, jury still out :p

No I don't think this is the "fixed" batch because I have not been following this thread for a while. I got my replacement over a month and a half ago. If the new batch is indeed a fix then this will just be a big annoyance. Let's just hope this is the case.

No I don't think this is the "fixed" batch because I have not been following this thread for a while. I got my replacement over a month and a half ago. If the new batch is indeed a fix then this will just be a big annoyance. Let's just hope this is the case.

whew!

While it is still no fun watching new toys crash and burn, at least there is hope that Samsung has addressed this.

Good luck with machine #3 (and keep us posted)!

I hate the feeling it gives me about the purchase but if it is a known problem then I guess it can be corrected. I held off about bringing it up till I saw this thread with other people having the same problem.Great post. That exactly mirrors my feelings. My unit has identical issues (lamp failing to strike plus bad colours on start-up). I think they are probably separate issues though since the bad colours on start-up didn't show up till after about 40 hrs.

If you (cautiously) peer into the lens you can see the lamp come on dimly for a few seconds then extinguish, followed by some clicking and another attempt. After 4 attempts or so (about 1 minute) it gives up and the red warning light starts flashing. Need to completely power down to "re-boot". It has only completely fail like this 4 times though. Generally it starts on 2nd or 3rd attemp and occasionally on the first.

Tried the lamp in a 2nd projector and it works just fine. Tried the lamp from the 2nd projector in the 1st projector and it won't start properly. So the problem seems to be with the projector itself.

I am still confident that, in the big scheme of things, this is just a minor hiccup and these particular issues can and will be fixed. It is kind of ironic though that while I think the Optoma H78 is in many aspects a better projector than the Samsung (DC3, better on/off contrast, quieter, power zoom/focus, etc), I finally chose the H710 over it due to the expectation of better usability & reliability and significantly less $$ (at least on the early stock). Looks like I am batting 2 for 3 !

I decided to put my unit in for repair rather than exchange. I may well regret that decision (but not as much as getting an exchange unit with a dead pixel). So think of me as the AVS guinea pig for Samsung H710 service :eek: . I will update progress to this thread.

Brent

I actually saw this happen once on my unit recently- strange color at startup, then came on full.

But the big issue I am having, is that I can't get a perfect focus on the right side of the screen.

The left side I can focus perfectly until I see the sharp grid pattern of the space between the mirrors, but the right side is slightly out of focus. (meaning the grid pattern of fine black lines is softer than the left side)

Can anyone check thiers and see if this is an issue? You have to be right up against the screen to see the focus issue.

thanks.

I decided to put my unit in for repair rather than exchange. I may well regret that decision (but not as much as getting an exchange unit with a dead pixel). So think of me as the AVS guinea pig for Samsung H710 service :eek: . I will update progress to this thread.

Brent

Please let us know how the repair goes. I am assuming that you are pursuing this directly with Samsung.

I now have both of the problems with the H710 mentioned here.

(1) Unstable colors at startup.
(2) Failure of lamp to light up at startup.

The first is a non-problem for me. No big deal, just wait 10-15 seconds and the picture sharpens up very nicely.

The second problem is somewhat annoying as it requires turning the power off, then unplugging and replugging the powercord on the back of the Projector. This is very incovenient and it happened twice to me in the last week. I have 53 hours on the unit. Last night I had friends over and it was a little embarrasing when I had to get behind the unit and re-seat the powercord.

I got a great deal on this PJ (even better than most) but in the end we all find out that we got what we paid for. There is no free meal. Still, when this PJ is working it throws a spectacular image on the screen.

John

So is this issue pretty much happening to evryone?
I was actually thinking of getting on of these, but i guess now i have to wait untill a fix is confirmed to be working. Even then i'm still on the fence, while i'm sure it's a huge bang for the buck like evryone says, it's still a lot of cash.

This failure of the lamp to fire sounds eerily familiar to the Sony HS20's "lamp bug" problem.

So is this issue pretty much happening to evryone?
I was actually thinking of getting on of these, but i guess now i have to wait untill a fix is confirmed to be working. Even then i'm still on the fence, while i'm sure it's a huge bang for the buck like evryone says, it's still a lot of cash.
I think this thread would be a lot longer if everyone was having the problem.

Don't spend too long sitting up there on the fence, it is a lot more fun watching movies on a big screen. ;)

I have yet to have a prob ?

maybe a bit worried ;) hehehe but if I do have one should show up soon I imagine

since I think I got one before the big rush ? not sure if mine will have a prob or ??

but I wonder what serial numbers are effected and if there is a way to trace down the ones that might have a prob ?

just got done watching a movie ;) loving this PJ and the quality so so much if I do have a hiccup OH well things happen anymore seems nothing is without probs sadly

I have not had a problem yet either. Current hours on it are 135. Hopefully they will have a fix for you guys soon. One thing I do every time after it finishes the cool down cycle is turn main power off on back connector panel. Maybe that is preventing me having this problem.

Dale

Nope, when I got the second unit I took every step possible to prevent problems including turning the unit off and unplugging after every use upon cool down. Still happened. Must be a problem batch if only some of us are experiencing it, but then again what do I know.

Still produces a great picture though.

Didn't Jason post somewhere that is was a connector issue on a batch of projectors and that it has been corrected with the latest shipment due in this week?

Honu-
You're right. Everything we buy has problems these days. I have top of the line windows in my house and they leak during rainstorms whenever the wind is from the north east. How hard can it be to make a weather-tight window? It must be hard, because I had two replaced 3 times last winter.

We HT enthusiasts have gotten to be very demanding.

I suppose I should start a My Windows Leak! thread :)

I have not had a problem yet either. Current hours on it are 135. Hopefully they will have a fix for you guys soon. One thing I do every time after it finishes the cool down cycle is turn main power off on back connector panel. Maybe that is preventing me having this problem.

Dale

Hi Dale,

Like you I was turning off power to the unit by flipping the power switch on the back panel but I still had this issue. To put it in prespective, the failure of the lamp to turn on at startup only occurs about 10%-20% of the time in my case. (This problem does not occur every time as some might think.)

Yesterday I tried doing a couple of things differently. I started leaving the power on without touching the power switch on the back panel after powering down with the remote. So the PJ is off but the power is not cut-off. I am not worried because I have the unit on a Belkin UPS plus surge protector. The other thing I did was to staple down the power cord on my back shelf so that the cord dosn't put tension on the back panel plug of the projector. So far so good, batting 3 for 3 on lamp starts.

I hope this problem doesn't come back but if it does it would be nice to know whether the fix is by firmware upgrade through the RS232 port on the back of the PJ or whether we have to send it in to a Samsung authorized shop for hardware repairs.

Regards,

John

John -
It seems you are implying that the weight of the power cord could be causing a connection problem - or have I misread you?

John -
It seems you are implying that the weight of the power cord could be causing a connection problem - or have I misread you?

Yes the power cable issue has been mentioned before on other posts and also in a review of the H700 unit. Don't know if removing the tension will help with the lamp starting but so far I am 4 for 4 and keeping my fingers crossed. (I am shelf mounted and the power cable is coming from below the shelf and up the back wall.)

John

This line of thinking eludes me. If the unit has power it has power. My unit powers on for 20 seconds now then goes off. All the lights blink and then I press the power button on the remote to reset. When it does come on eventually it stays one for hours. If this was a loose power connection it would not occur only at startup right? As I write this my unit is dead. It tries to startup but after 20 seconds the bulb goes out and all lights blink. I cannot jump start it. Time to return this thing.

Mine started doing weird things tonight!!!!!! Started up with strange colors and upside down image!!! I restarted and it's now okay, but obviously starting and restarting is gonna take serious toll on bulb life. Anyone know which depatment in Samsung to contact about this unit?

The Toshiba MT700 I just returned has issues as well. I love front projection, but what is happening with build quality lately?

(typed from a brand new Macbook with 3 dead pixels - dealing with Apple to try and get replaced - however it runs OSX and WinXP side by side with parallels- so that is pretty amazing)

This line of thinking eludes me. If the unit has power it has power. My unit powers on for 20 seconds now then goes off. All the lights blink and then I press the power button on the remote to reset. When it does come on eventually it stays one for hours. If this was a loose power connection it would not occur only at startup right? As I write this my unit is dead. It tries to startup but after 20 seconds the bulb goes out and all lights blink. I cannot jump start it. Time to return this thing.

romy,

I bet your unit is not dead, you just have to keep trying and it will eventually start.

Anyway, my streak of 4 straight successful starts ended tonight. The H710 started on the 3rd attempt which is obviously not very good news and pissed me off too. However, I did uncover a new piece of information. When the bulb is warm it has no problem firing right up and here is how I found this. Tonight after we finished watching I turned the unit off. Five minutes later I turn the unit back on and NO PROBLEM! It starts right up. I turn it back off, wait a few minutes and tried starting it again. It starts up without a hitch (I ignore the few seconds of color wheel convergence of course). I turned it off and on a 3rd time again without a problem. The unit kept starting without a hitch from a "warm" state.

Conclusion: the unit has problems firing up from a "cold" start. Of course this shouldn't happen and it isn't much consolation to those who have this problem but I suspect that the success or failure to get the lamp started depends on the operating temperature inside the unit. For whatever this is worth I thought I would mention it here.

Let us know who you guys get in touch with over at Samsung for the fix. I am very interested as well. Thanks,

John

One more thing. Went to the Samsung website to register this projector in anticipation of this repair and guess what. The registration website

http://product.samsung.com/cgi-bin/nabc/product_reg/b2c_product_reg.jsp?eUser=

does not even list the SPH-710AE so you can't really register it. The only unit it lists is the SPH-700AE which is the predecessor of our projector. This doesn't look good :(

I am wondering if Samsung even knows how to fix this problem. It appears that they don't even know that they are selling the 710.

Last night I started it up 12 times. The last time it stayed on but the image was green and stayed green, and the image was upside down too. I hit the setup button a couple times and it flipped back to how it was supposed to be. I turned it off and then on, the picture came on fine and all was well.

I cannot deal with this hit or miss drama. We are in need of a fix or replacement. This is obviously a common problem and getting worse as time goes on (inverted image/ green screen / flickers)

Didn't Jason post somewhere that is was a connector issue on a batch of projectors and that it has been corrected with the latest shipment due in this week?

Yes, he did and I have mentioned it on several occassions also.

They are now in stock and shipping, in case anyone's interested and you missed the "sticky post" at the top of the forum:D!?!?!?!

Yes, he did and I have mentioned it on several occassions also.

They are now in stock and shipping, in case anyone's interested and you missed the "sticky post" at the top of the forum:D!?!?!?!

May I ask how you have determined this problem is fixed in the new batch? Is there any information on what "fix" was actually applied?

Last night I started it up 12 times. The last time it stayed on but the image was green and stayed green, and the image was upside down too. I hit the setup button a couple times and it flipped back to how it was supposed to be. I turned it off and then on, the picture came on fine and all was well.

I cannot deal with this hit or miss drama. We are in need of a fix or replacement. This is obviously a common problem and getting worse as time goes on (inverted image/ green screen / flickers)

I contacted Samsung this AM. The unit is considered a "monitor", they don't have a projector category. After giving them your serial number and other personal data they send you a UPS shipping label and you ship it out for repair. He said it takes 2-3 weeks plus shipping time to get back to you. Also, the service guy said there is nothing he can see (no internal memo or document) showing that there is a known problem with this PJ and that this is the first time he has heard about the startup problem.

This is why I think the new batch maybe the same as the old batch. If there was a fix applied by Samsung, there should be some documentation available to their tech support people and there doesn't appear to be any.

As for this problem being tied to the "connector board" I think there is some truth there. My cables used to be in "tension", then I changed the mounting no tension and today I decided to put them in "compression". In other words the cables are now "pushed" into the back connector. Tried to start it with cable compression this AM and it started right up on the first try. Go figure ...

John

Ready2buy-

Thanks for this info. 2-3 weeks plus shipping for repair is completely unaceptable. When my Toshiba MT700 developed problems, they could fix the units and get them back to customers within a few days!! Plus it sounds like they totally not set up to deal with projectors and up do date with info about revisions, etc.

At this point, I will advise friends who are considering this unit to stay away from this product.
I fully understand that complicated products sometimes develop bugs, etc, but when a company is not set up to respond quickly when such instances arise, that is a major problem.

I will contact my dealer and see what he can do, if anythng.

Ready2buy-
I fully understand that complicated products sometimes develop bugs, etc, but when a company is not set up to respond quickly when such instances arise, that is a major problem.

The Samsung people don't sound like they are setup to handle these problems yet but I believe they are in process. In my case I have to have this projector at home next month due to the upcoming World Cup soccer and don't want it in service when the tournament starts on June 9 due to several people coming to the house to watch on the big screen. I am also waiting for another AVS member (kiwishred) to report back on his repair experience.

Now here is the best review on the H700 projector which precisely describes our problem. It was done by Scott Wilkinson of ultimateAV in May 2005 and you can view it in its entirety here:

http://www.guidetohometheater.com/videoprojectors/505samsung/index.html

I quote:

"When we first turned the projector on and tried to display an image, the colors were totally messed up, with serious flickering and false contouring. A call to Kane's office revealed that this has been known to happen on occasion, and that a hard reset (power off, disconnect power cord, wait a minute, reconnect power cord, power on) usually solves the problem. They also mentioned that the wiring harness inside the projector can become dislodged during shipping, and that once the harness is secured and the hard reset is accomplished, the problem doesn't recur. For us, the hard reset did the trick.

Just before the review was complete, we wanted to perform some final tests, but the projector started acting weird. It powered up normally, but after about 30 seconds, the screen went blank. The first time this happened, a hard reset cleared the problem, just like the initial difficulties we had. When we tried to use the projector a few days later, however, it happened again. This time, after five futile attempts, we had to conclude that it was no longer flight-worthy. Oddly, on two of these tries, the image that came up was not the source, but an inverted, flickering green screen; the inverted condition was apparent because the menu that controls the image orientation came up at the same time—upside down. The problem occurred on both the component and DVI inputs.

I took the projector over to Kane's studio, where it powered up fine (of course!). He determined that the internal software was not the latest version, and he informed me that units with earlier versions of the software were prone to strange behavior in response to IR commands from the remotes of other equipment. TJN certainly has a lot of IR commands flying about his studio, so this made some sense. After updating the software to version 2021, we left the projector on for one and a half hours with no problems."

End of Quote.

There you have it. This is a REAL PROBLEM, we are not imagining it. They blame the wiring harness being disloged during shipping. They also blame the software and how it handles the IR signals of other remotes.

Meanwhile there is no record to indicate any problems at all at Samsung with this product. It is amazing to me.

John

Well regardless of the source of the problem we are no better off. I am right now on my 8th reboot of the unit trying to get it to turn on so I can watch lost tonight. This blows and with no acknowledgement of the problem it is a hit or miss whether a swap will fix it.

Well regardless of the source of the problem we are no better off. I am right now on my 8th reboot of the unit trying to get it to turn on so I can watch lost tonight. This blows and with no acknowledgement of the problem it is a hit or miss whether a swap will fix it.

romy,

the wiring harness cause is real and you maybe able to change the behavior of your unit if you do something to change the contact between the cables in the back and the PJ connector. I would start by making the cables come into their connectors with some force. You definitely don't want tension or pulling. I think a slight amount of compression might work better. Give it a shot, who knows the thing might fix itself.

I unplugged the power cable and rammed it into the back as hard as it would go. Is that what you mean? I changed the cable and still same result. Power to the unit was never a problem. The lights never went off as though it lost power or power was intermittent.

Right now I am on startup #34. I have tried all combinations of cables, taking it down from the ceiling and plugging into a different outlet with different cables, etc.

What an aggravating POS. I was this close to purchasing this thing. All that time spent developing a great picture they forgot one thing,.........getting it to power up. :rolleyes:

EDIT: after typing the below post I went in to try and watch something, and had to start it up 5 times before getting an image. Clearly the problem is getting worse. I'm calling Joe Kane's company tomorrow.

------------------------------
This is great information from the review, and clearly shows that the problem existed in the 700 and still exists in our 710's.

What I suggest is this. One of us (any volunteers?) should contact Joe Kane's production company, since he can clearly get the attention of top Samsung brass. (I'll have to dig back through the thread and see who has already spoken with Joe Kane's company)

They should relay the fact that AVS forum is responsible for the recent sell out run (which I'm sure they are aware of) on the 710, based on Jason's and other user comments. (That's certainly what made me buy it, and I have been recommending it to friends and video post houses here in New York.)

Just as quickly as this forum can create a demand for the product, we can even more quickly KILL the demand for a product. (Honestly I know if I were ready to buy a PJ right now I would steer clear of the 710 based on this thread)

What we expect from Samsung is the following:

1) A quick response service center address set up to deal with any issues that arise with the 710 (and 800) AFter all this is my main tv - and being down for 3 weeks on a brand new product is unnaceptable - If Toshiba can turn around projector repairs quickly, so can Samsung.

2) A vow to discover whatever firmware issues are creating the startup problems, (This may take them some time, which is understandble) and an agreementt to fix current models in the field (or swap out with new or refurb'd units with the firmware fix) hopefully even if the unit is out of warranteee (after all - this is a known bug- a buyer should be reassured that if it develops it will be taken care of)

3) that when the startup bug issue is fixed, that any user who had to do multiple shutdowns ad startups just to get their unit fired up- be given some sort of extension on the bulb warranteee (or better yet a fresh bulb) since we know that these multiple startups compromise bulb life!!!

I realize this is a lot to ask, but If a manufacturer wants the endorsement and recommendation of AVS users, they have to respond in a appropriate manner. After all, we are ultimately their greatest marketing tool, and actually much more valuable than even advertisting. Glowing unsolicited user forum posts are an endorsement that can't be bought for any price, and here clearly Samsung has reaped the benefits of our comments and reviews. If they want them to stay positive, even in the midst of a VERY series product line meltdown, they had better step up to the plate, or risk a boatload of newly manufactured 710's sitting on the shelf.

Rant mode "off"

Any comments? Is what I'm asking too much?

emaillists, you are not asking too much, Samsung is out to lunch. My projector won't start any more. Samsung says they will issue a call tag and replace my unit, but I haven't received anything yet. I think the loose wiring harness excuse is a red herring, I popped the cover on mine and there were no loose connections. My guess is it's firmware bugs and/or poor solder connections. I have communicated with Joe Kane by e-mail before, I'll try sending him a link to this thread and see if he will help.

In desperation I did the same and took off the cover. Everything was as tightly connected as it possibly could be. Nothing changed upon power up. I did it all night like insanity (one who does the same thing over and over expecting a different result).

It is not something loose in the machine. My machine has been on my ceiling since day one and certainly if something was loose it would have showed its symptoms from day one, not 50 bulb hours later.

Let's band together on this one as a collaborative effort to get their attention. My contact number is 954-857-8384 and email is rwilliams@etw.net . If we need to call back to back to back so be it. I too refuse to be down for 3 weeks on a brand new machine. If I could send this back and pay the $1000 extra for the benq I would in a heartbeat because I know what that unit looked like and it was great. The only reason I bought this one was the reviews on this forum combined with the price point. That price savings has quickly eaten itself up.

Ironically I have to power up my old crt now to watch HD.

I have had this PJ in a box for most of the last several weeks pending completion of our dedicated HT. Following completion this week, I can restate that the picture is simply amazing. That said, I would certainly not have purchased this projector without this forum, Jason's impressions and the PowerBuy. I am very nervous after reading the increasing number of posts, and I completely agree that this appears to be a more serious issue than a loose connector, which makes no sense as a primary cause of this behavior.

I believe Ken Whitcomb had a close contact at JKP, and has posted more than one communication relayed from JKP regarding forum posts. I actually steered toward this PJ over Optoma models (in part) due to their issues with lamps on the H78 series and the reset issues on the H72, and Optoma's occasionally erratic responses. I see now that they quickly implemented a firmware fix for their reset issues with the recent projector and hot-swapped projectors that were behaving erratically. I do feel that purchasing directly from AVS was a great decision for me, and would hope that AVS reps would also take an active role, in addition to individuals from JKP. After all, I assume it's not a badge of honor for JKP to put their seal of approval on a projector with great image quality that gets potentially killed by a technical glitch like this one.

Good luck to those of you who are dealing with this actively--I will continue to watch this thread closely and hope that I won't have to join you on your crusade.

Good luck to those of you who are dealing with this actively--I will continue to watch this thread closely and hope that I won't have to join you on your crusade.

A suggestion, if I may...

Though you are not personally experiencing any issues, perhaps you could have your voice heard on behalf of those who are affected? After all, there's power in numbers. And, who knows, your PJ might develop the problem as well, although we sincerely hope not.

A suggestion, if I may...

Though you are not personally experiencing any issues, perhaps you could have your voice heard on behalf of those who are affected? After all, there's power in numbers. And, who knows, your PJ might develop the problem as well, although we sincerely hope not.

Agreed--I will do as you suggest (encourage reaction) and would hope others will do the same.

Guys, at this point I think we need to summarize this thing. My situation is not yet as bad as some of you (my problem is intermittent, sometimes I have it sometimes I don't) but I agree that it's important for all of us to come together on this now because even those who don't have this problem might one day get it.

Please indicate whether you agree with the following summary:

(1) Some owners of the SPH710AE have already experienced startup problems with their new unit while others have not yet

(2) The problem appears around 50 hours on the lamp with the unit requiring multiple attempts to successfully fire the lamp

(3) When the lamp eventually fires there is a period of several seconds where the colors on the screen appear totally messed up with serious flickering; the picture then stabilizes and the image sharpens up.

(4) As time passes the startup problem continues to get worse in that it takes more and more attempts to fire the lamp until eventually the projector fails completely.

(5) Public records indicate that the same problem existed in the older SPH700AE projector and its existence has been acknowledged by Joe Kane's office in May of 2005.

(6) Joe Kane's office has blamed a dislodged wiring harness inside the projector for this problem but we have no independent verification of this claim.

(7) Phone calls to Samsung customer service regarding this problem indicate that Samsung personel are completely unaware of it and require that the unit be shipped for service over a period of 2-3 weeks leaving the owner without a substitute.

Is this it? Did I miss anything?

John

John,

Great summary. I could not find a phone number at Joe Kane's site but I instead emailed davidabrams@videoessentials.com

might I assume joe's email is joekane@videoessentials.com ?

does it make sense to start a poll to see how many people's H710 have experienced issues?

My dealer has offered to replace the unit with a new one when he has stock next week, (since mine also has an focus issue) but it seems the likelyhood of another experiencing problems is high. I love the image quality of this unit and the ability to use it as a professional color correction HD monitor (which I planned on doing) but I am thinking at this point if my dealer will let me buy another projector, I might just bail on the 710, which would be sad indeed.
(especially since it looked so amazing on my grey Goo screen- which took care of the one possible objection to the unit- high black levels)

For my customers:
Please drop me an email at jason@avscience.com if you are experiencing this issue. I'm going to get this taken care of.

Thanks!

I'm considering this projector. Has Samsung refused to fix or replace any projectors with this problem? Has anybody with a new "fixed" version experienced these problems?

might I assume joe's email is joekane@videoessentials.com ?

My dealer has offered to replace the unit with a new one when he has stock next week, (since mine also has an focus issue) but it seems the likelyhood of another experiencing problems is high. I love the image quality of this unit

I would definitely try that email address for Joe, it makes sense. If it's not a real email address the message should bounce back and you will know it.

I agree with you on the new units, there is nothing we know about them that they had anything "fixed". For all we know this problem maybe a design flaw deep inside the electronic boards. The fact that it's not experienced by everyone or that it happens intermittently may make it even harder to troubleshoot (boy I sure hope I am wrong on this). But if this is really a design flaw even if we sent it to Samsung for repair chances are the authorized repairmen wouldn't know how to fix them. (I am still waiting for kiwishred to tell us about his repair experience.)

I'm considering this projector. Has Samsung refused to fix or replace any projectors with this problem? Has anybody with a new "fixed" version experienced these problems?

Yes, I have contacted Samsung and they refused to replace this projector since it was the first problem. But replacing one unit with another not knowing it's fixed maynot be a good thing to do either. They did accept to repair it at a time cost of 2-3 weeks but then they would not guarantee return by a specific future date.

Do not assume that anything is "fixed". There is no real evidence of a fix of any kind. What we have is just more supply of units on the market. We are still awaiting an acknoweldgement by the company that "there is a problem" here.

Well i have had another problem than what is listed in tread, mine is powering up but goes dark in 90 seconds. all fans are still on when it happens and can power down . Just no lamp output.
I have been in contact with samsung to get a return # for the last two week ( these people are clueless :mad: ) with no luck they keep telling me they will email me a return # but nothing yet!
This week i have called Jason three times :( but he hasn't returned my call? What has somebody got to do to have this repaired or replaced???

Thanks,

Blake

My apologies Blake for the delay in getting back to you. We did just talk via phone a short bit ago. I will send you a new unit in a bit.

For my customers:
Please drop me an email at jason@avscience.com if you are experiencing this issue. I'm going to get this taken care of.

Thanks!

Blake, you could try emailing Jason.

Already did that :(

Well i have had another problem than what is listed in tread, mine is powering up but goes dark in 90 seconds. all fans are still on when it happens and can power down . Just no lamp output. Blake

Blake,

I am afraid you have the exact same problem as the rest of us. Your lamp may come on temporarily for a few seconds before it goes out. The fan will still be running when the lamp is out and the front 3 lights on the casing will be flashing. This is typical behavior for those experiencing this problem and I have experienced this variation of the problem myself.

I know it's sad but you are now one of us.

I wish I could watch basketball tonight. Maybe if I start now by the time 8pm comes around I would have turned it on and off enough times to get lucky :)

Look at what I am reduced to.

I wish I could watch basketball tonight. Maybe if I start now by the time 8pm comes around I would have turned it on and off enough times to get lucky :)

Look at what I am reduced to.

romy,

Pull yourself together, help is bound to come some time, hopefully soon.

I am actually looking forward to going home tonight and see how many tries it will take to get the lamp started. In a perverted sorta way, I feel a tremendous sense of accomplishment if I get it on the first try. :o

Yes i have all that except my three lights show normal op, just two steady lights and when its starting mine looks right(color timing)just wont stay on past 90 seconds

How many people in total have the start-up issue? My projector has been in its original box for about 2 months now, and I have only played with it for about 10 hours until my home theater room is finished, I have another month to go before the room is done.

I am worried to say the least. :(

For my customers:
Please drop me an email at jason@avscience.com if you are experiencing this issue. I'm going to get this taken care of.

Thanks!


Jason--I'm now at 33 hours with no problems and with fantastic picture quality. I'm hoping I will not have to contact you about my projector, but please know that I appreciate your proactive stance on intervening on behalf of your customers. I'll say it again--I feel very secure having purchased my projector from you over another internet dealer.

KK

One benefit to owning this projector I must say, is it affords one the time to work on that unfinsihed screenplay, spend quality time with family members, or just catch up with chores around the house.

With the Samsung H710-AE - you'll be participating in all life has to offer... except watching TV and movies...... Mine won't start at all anymore. And it was symptom free 3 days ago at about 120 hours on the bulb.

wait.... wait... an update... hello projector fans. As I sat here typing this rediculous post and starting the unit over and over again it seems on about the 12 or 15th try I actually got the bulb to ignite. But the ability to get this started is rapidly deteriorating. I wonder If I should just leave it on for a week or so until I can get a replacement? I don't pay for power here (included in outrageous rent).

Once started though, you can turn it off and get the bulb started again immediately. Maybe that will mean something to an engineer if they ever address what is wrong with this model.

I wonder if its a bad batch of bulbs? Or maybe the bulb startup logic has a bug?

-chasfs

The bulb startup logic?

The bulb startup logic?
Many projectors do not allow you to turn off and then immediately turn back on. They have some sort of timer/sensor and code in their firmware preventing you from doing so. So, there is some 'bulb startup logic' on a PJ.

Well i have had another problem than what is listed in tread, mine is powering up but goes dark in 90 seconds. all fans are still on when it happens and can power down . Just no lamp output.
I have been in contact with samsung to get a return # for the last two week ( these people are clueless :mad: ) with no luck they keep telling me they will email me a return # but nothing yet!
This week i have called Jason three times :( but he hasn't returned my call? What has somebody got to do to have this repaired or replaced???

Thanks,

Blake

Blake,

I think we have talked in the past? Feel free to email or call me also and I'll see what I can do.

All I know is, I was told that these new ones were supposed to have some sort of "fix" implemented, so all we can do is wait until some of those people that are getting the "new ones" to try them out for a while and see what gives:rolleyes:

For those having bulb startup issues, not color wheel problems. Has anyone that has experienced the problem tried pulling the bulb and reseating it? I'm just troubleshooting in my head and since it takes more power to start up the bulb then maintain it I thought it's possible this is a issue. I'd check the contacts for any sort of corrosion or tarnishing that could effect contact as well. A shot in the dark (wow that's a bad pun) but certainly worth the effort for someone to try and report back.

I don't (yet) have the problem so I can't test myself.

Jeff

For whatever it's worth, I am 2 for 2 in successful startups (one attempt only fires the bulb) since I put my cables in slight compression with the connector board. I had the most startup problems when the cables were in tension, some when I removed the tension and none so far with some compression on them. Of course 2 for 2 isn't much of a sample and will update you as I get more starts.

(By compression I mean the cables are being pushed into the connector board by being trapped between the PJ and the back wall. I am shelf-mounted on the backwall.)

I called Samsung's customer service line again yesterday and they said that the first time I called I was talking to the wrong department and that they would not replace the unit, but would have it serviced. I agreed to that and by this morning a local tv repair shop had sent a tech to my house. Right away he let me know that he would have to take the projector into their shop for service, so I took it down and handed it over. He stated that they just had one of these in for repair and replaced the bulb and ballast with no success. Finally they replaced the main controller board with the DLP processor chip (not the DMD) and that fixed the problem. So I get to take advantage of their experience and hopefully they get it right the first time. The only caveat is that I don't have much confidence that the replacement board will not develop the same problem. I'm sticking to my belief that this is probably a solder issue. Now that manufacturers are having to go to a lead free process, there are many issues they face in changing over. Solderability is one issue, tin whiskers growing and shorting IC pins is another. We could be seeing the growing pains of this new process. An interesting comment the tech made was that Samsung has had this same problem with some of their RPTV's and have fixed them. Apparently they didn't bother to fix the SP-H710AE, or maybe they are using up supply of old boards before they switch to a new batch. I should have the projector back in a week or two, I'll let you all know how it goes.

Great post Tim. What you've said makes sense. I make a computer over 20 years ago and out of several thousand solder points on a memory card, I screwed one up. That bad solder point acted much like the problems described here.

Way to go Tim, keep us posted. Nice to know you found somebody in Southern CA that can fix these.

Way to go for me is Samsung replacing ALL their brand new product that does not work, not sending it to a local tv repairman. It is not broken like an old car gets broken. It was a faulty product from day 1 just waiting to show its colors.

When I bought my mercedes two weeks later the check engine light came on. They said to drop it off and wanted to give me an old saturn as a rental for 1 week. I said keep the benz cuz I am going to get me another lexus. You don't dare insult a businessman like me that just spent $75k on a brand new car that breaks with crap like that.

This is the same. We wait, research and part with our hard earned money just to sit on the sideline with a paperweight. I think in our desperate desire for a cure we think some hope is hope at all no matter how indirect it is. True hope is the source recalling all their pjs and give everyone their money back or a cured working replacement with a sincere apology. At least that will calm my nerves from future problems. Anything less than that will guarantee that I will NEVER buy another Samsung.

I hope Jason and the great guys at AVS can talk sense into Samsung.

My 0.02 cent rant.

Rest assured I am on your side. We will do what it takes to make sure our customers are happy. Another bonus from buying at AVS. :)

Man. If this is the way Samsung is going to deal with this then my projector hunt is back on. I put my order on hold in hopes that something good will come of this real soon, but I dont want to role the dice with my hard earned cash only to have Samsung tell me in a month to have a repair man come out and look at a problem that was there from day 1. That is BS.

I just got a Samsung SP-H710-AE. Turned on perfectly the first time. Operated for 2 hours until I was satisfied I had my settings all set. Powered down the unit. Next morning after setting up the screen, the pj didn't light up. After about 4 attempts the lamp turned on and we ran it for a couple hours with various movies. Powered it off. Was concerned about the startup. This evening I powered it back up. After 10 attempts I quit trying. The lamp will no longer ignite. I didn't have any color problems. I've contacted my dealer for advise and then later I found this site. I'm certainly disheartened to find there's not a solution. :(

Thank you jason :D Just one of the reasons i love avs
Hi dave yes we have talked in the past in fact i bought the sammy from you
Thank you both,
Blake

The Samsung H710AE was at the top of my list, but this thread has officially scared me into reconsidering the Optoma 7100. I have dealt with Optoma customer service in the past, and it is far better than what is being said in these posts about the Samsung customer service.

I am sure that Samsung will take care of everybody on this issue. They have had problems with a couple of RPTVs in the past and always come through on them. I cannot see them jeopardizing there sales on this issue. Point blank they are not as small as a company as Optoma so they will not let this one slip.

I have yet to have any problems with my 710 except problem listed below. The manufacture date is Oct 2005 if that makes any difference and has 140 hours on it now.

The only problem I had with mine is in the beginning, when I had some flaky startup issues when my AC plug did not seat very well and I had to shave the sides off of it about 2 mm. I also had to take my robogrips and smash the connectors in a little on the female end of AC cord to make good contact. So I question full contact between either neutral or ground on the AC receptacle on the projector end itself with other units.

Anyone experienced with electronics will know what I am getting at, especially if there is any CMOS components in this projector. In which is highly dependent on the ground circuit.

What would be a good test is someone who has a problem with their unit, is solder the AC wires directly to the AC lugs on the projector end. It would be interesting see if the problem continues to exist.

Dale

from what I understand Samsung has come up with a loaner program for any repaired 710's , which consists of a focusable bulb and an illustrated guide to shadow puppets. Depending on your hand position there are no visible pixel structure and a contrast ratio of 200:1

I tried that last night in an attempt to entertain my family while the basketball game audio was on through my surrounds. The problem was that it was very difficult to keep pace because my hads were getting tired all the time and my 5 year old kept moving the flashlight out of position. I hope they come up with a fix for that one too.

And to think I was going to buy the up-coming blu-ray player from SAMSUNG....I don't think so. Imagine the nightmares we could encounter with a new technology, and their lack of commitment.

Has anyone tried using a different power cord vs the one that came with the projector?

I posted a thread about a month and a half ago, which by the way nobody cared to answer, where I mentioned having problems with the unit, where it would turn on and off by just touching the unit or moving it slightly to the side, Making sure that the power cord was well inserted took care of that problem, but the issues that the forum members are talking about now seem to be much more serious.

How quickly love fades. I have seen no evidence that Samsung has abandoned us. It appears to me that AVS has stepped up to the plate for us, and will do well by us. Any of you who didn't buy from AVS should talk to your dealer. They are the ones who are actually Samsung’s customers and usually are able to get better answers than we are.

Those who are jumping ship and thinking Optoma deals with customers better than Samsung, go read the threads about their bulbs lasting 250 hours. I'm not saying don't switch to Optoma – fine company and fine projectors. I'm just saying there are people who are extremely upset with them because of a technical problem with bulbs. Whatever you do, just make sure you go into the deal with your eyes open. And buy from someone you trust.

Those who are jumping ship and thinking Optoma deals with customers better than Samsung, go read the threads about their bulbs lasting 250 hours.

or buy the BenQ 8720 :D

or buy the BenQ 8720 :D
I had the impression that the 8720 cost a lot more than the 710. Am I wrong?

For MSRPs, the Benq 8720 is $7,200 and the Samsung $4,000. I'm not sure what street prices are.

AVS is great and I feel totally safe buying from them, but Samsung needs to step up and figure out what the deal is with this issue. I am on the list to get one of these from AVS, but only if this issue can be resolved and Samsung deals with the current customers correctly which so far, atleast according to this thread, is not the case. :(

Oh, and I am all about hand puppets :)

AVS is great and I feel totally safe buying from them, but Samsung needs to step up and figure out what the deal is with this issue. I am on the list to get one of these from AVS, but only if this issue can be resolved and Samsung deals with the current customers correctly which so far, atleast according to this thread, is not the case. :(


Amen to that. :rolleyes:

I had the impression that the 8720 cost a lot more than the 710. Am I wrong?

I am not sure what subjective price difference makes 2 projectors within the same price range for you, the $3k MSRP difference is somewhat less on the street.

DC3, sealed optics, variable iris, 3 year warranty, HDMI input, RELIABILITY ... how much is this worth?

I was considering the 710 at one time, but the banding and start up issues steered me clear of the Samsung. It *may* have color accuracy and shadow detail over the 8720, but I would wager once calibrated, the difference (if any) would be mnimal.

I hope Jason does a 8720 review soon.

Status Report:

(1) Good news: Continuing to have success with starting up the bulb on the first try. I am now 5 for 5 on successful attempts since re-arranging my cables and reconnecting.

(2) Bad news: However my fifth and most recent attempt was only successful in that the bulb started on the first try. This time the projector image showed up-side down on the screen and the color of the image was dominated almost entirely by the green color. It was as if the software went into a new operational mode. This problem was fixed by shutting down and then powering up the unit. This is obviously not the bulb problem but something else which has already been reported by others.

John

My 710 is officially dead. It wont start no matter how many times I try. (I tried for almost an hour thinking if I could get it on once- I'd just leave it on)

I have tried different angles of the wires, making sure there is no starin on them - compressing, etc. No luck. Can't even do the shadow puppets with it! I'm leaving it unplugged for a day to see if that helps reset anything.

David Abrams from Joe Kanes's company replied to my email- thanking me for bringing this thread to their attention. Joe has contacted Samsung product management, and will follow up with them after the holiday weekend.

ADDED: My dealer told me last week he'd give me another 710 when he gets the new shipment, but I also think he'd let me move to another manufacturer, or possibly even a refund. I'm just not sure what to do. The new low cost DC3 chips dont sound very appealing. Jason noted with the 7100 that he did see pixels from his viewing distance, otherwide I think I'd take that unit. Anyone compare this to the 710?

I am rejoining this thread after a week's forced absence (I was marooned at the Radison hotel, Norfolk, VA which in theory has wireless internet access but in practice connections dropped so frequently that it was unusable :mad: )

Update on my repair is that, a week later, it is under "parts research". Apparently parts are not listed on-line, so the repair shop contacted Samsung directly to order new lamp and color wheel. Beyond that details are vague. The guy I was talking to seemed to be just reading from notes. No indication so far that there is a service bulletin from Samsung indentifying problem and fix. I fear I may be in typical service cycle where in the absence of definitive information on root cause they substitute various parts until the problem is fixed.

My reactions to specific posts in this thread:

Ready2Buy #47 Great find and great review. It aggrevating to say the least to find out that these problems were identified in May 2005 on the H700 and not addressed in the H710. Samsung had to have been aware of this issue in 2005 but chose to release defective products "into the wild" regardless. My unit was manufactured February 2006. Ready2Buy I am glad you are on our team in this. I sense the tenacity of a bulldog !

emailists #52 Agree wholehartedly. You have precisely outlined the type of response that Samsung could and should take to turn what is currently shaping up to be a public relations & marketing fiasco into something positive. They must know by now that there is a problem. Not acknowledging it amounts to contempt for the customer in my book. If Samsung itself doesn't step up to the plate by themselves then I hope that JKP would at least assert some influence. While they are probably not directly responsible for the circuit design & manufacture, their reputation is still on the line here as well.

Ready2Buy #58 Do not totally agree with your list as it seems 4 separate problems have been reported.
1) Lamp failing to fire. On my unit this happened straight out of the box.
2) Colours initially messed up, predominantly green, but come right, and stay right after a minute or so. On my unit this happened after about 40 hrs on lamp.
3) Image initially inverted comes right after a minute or so. I have not seen this on my unit.
4) Lamp goes off after a few minutes. I have not seen this on my unit.
My point is that I don't think we have enough information to know that the first 2 problems are necessarily related. 2) & 3) could be related. 1) & 4) could be related. However, my unit has 1) & 2) but they started at different times. It does not have 3) & 4).

chasfs #74 I already tried lamp swap and problem stays with projector, not lamp.

timf98 #80 Very interesting. For starters, interesting that they had someone come out. I had to take mine in. So, do they think the controller board replacement fixes both the lamp and colour issues ? Could you post or pm me the name of the repair shop ? I think I need to get pro-active in getting "my guys" talking to "your guys". I agree that it is not the back panel or the wiring harness. The problem seems too repeatable and consistent for that. Once past the start-up hiccups my unit has been totally stable.

luismanrara #94 Could you point me to the exact post (thread & post #) ?

emailists #104 You posted while I was composing. Great news. Hopefully there will now be some progress and communications at last on these issues :) Thanks for taking the initiative on this.

I will update progress on my repair when/if it occurs.

Brent

Hmmm You start to make me a little nervous. I am on the back order list of AVS for the 710...

Is it a problem which arrives on all the projectors or only on some?

If it is on all the projectors, I will have to turn to another product in spite of the quality of image of the Samsung... especially which I am in Canada and which I should send my projector to the USA for the guarantee :confused: :(

... especially which I am in Canada and which I should send my projector to the USA for the guarantee :confused: :(
As I have posted in the main H710 thread, documentation ships with the projector confirming that Samsung Canada will honor the warranty.

Hmmm You start to make me a little vervous. I am on the back order list of AVS for the 710...

Is it a problem which arrives on all the projectors or only on some?

If it is on all the projectors, I will have to turn to another product in spite of the quality of image of the Samsung... especially which I am in Canada and which I should send my projector to the USA for the guarantee :confused: :(


Same thing for me ! :confused:

luismanrara #94 Could you point me to the exact post (thread & post #) ?


It is post # 393 of the Samsung 710 main thread. I got so mad that nobody responded that I deleted it and the angry face speaks for itself. :)

I reread this thread and counted 11 people including myself have problems.

11 AVS Forum members alone!!!!

I would venture to say this is more than AVS MEMBERS that have the unit with no problems.

Mine is still dead- even after keeping it unplugged for a day.

UPDATE: I decided to open the unit and see if anything was loose. SOmetimes when starting up I did get a read LED overheat light, but not every time.

Inside nothing looked loose, and I did make sure each ribbon connector was seated properly. The bulb seems a much simpler affair then the bulbs for the Toshiba Mt700/Benq 7700. That bulb had a reflector and a complete housing, which the Samsung bulb (made by Phillips) doesn't have.

The curious thing is that the multi pin connector from the power supply to the circuit board had some type of tape over it, which clearly looked like an afterthought to "stop" the power connector from coming loose.

Is this Samsung's idea of fixing the whole reliability issue with the 700 in order to bring the 710 to market? I can see the engineering staff now. "We'll just have the labor camp slap some tape on it so it doesn't come loose.... Anyone up for a pint?"


I have tried close to 75 times over 2 nights to get this running but no luck. I was hoping to get it to ignite just once more then leave it running for the time it would take to get me a replacement.

It is post # 393 of the Samsung 710 main thread. I got so mad that nobody responded that I deleted it and the angry face speaks for itself. :)Well that would explain why I couldn't find it.

Brent

Remember that I was one of the original guinea pigs on this unit and was so excited about purchasing it. I watched it almost every day. When I had the problem I called Jason and he kindly replaced the unit. Not wanting to scare others away I did not report my problem here on the board, which was the exact problem happening again on my new replacement unit. At the time I thought maybe my problem was isolated and since I was still one of the early adopters not many of you had your units yet and if you did you were still a little early on your bulb life to start seeing the problem.

Now that I am back I am seeing how many of you bought the unit and now we are all in the same boat. I agree that from a statistical point of view the 11 with the problem on AVS reflects a much much broader problem on Samsungs hands when you take that sample to the marketplace.

The build date on my unit says February of 2006. Does anyone have a unit with a problem that has a later date on the label on back of the unit?

Romy I know you had the 8720 before would you go back to that unit? I had the 710 and after seeing the artifacts with my setup I returned the unit and I was going to pick up the 8720 when I ran into an incredible deal on a slightly used ruby for less than dealer cost and Im very happy with the ruby, nothing is perfect not even the ruby but the samsung seems to be showing some QC issues that are making more and more people wonder if the want to take a chance on it, its a pity because the image is outstanding for the money.

How many 710's has AVS sold? I have a Feb 2006 Samsung on 138 hours and no problems thus far. I wonder if we are talking about a 5% failure rate, a 10%, or a 40%? I don't think there's been a set amount a time when the problem shows up, just seems random from what I can gather?

Jeff

Romy I know you had the 8720 before would you go back to that unit? I had the 710 and after seeing the artifacts with my setup

Wich artifact were you talking about ?

Wich artifact were you talking about ?

This (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=658941&page=1&pp=30&highlight=banding+710)

I had a problem with my 700 and went through a couple of lamps until I found the real problem. I am using an HDMI cable with an HDMI to DVI connector on the display it self. I have been using ths for about two years.

The image would go black and I could no longer bring up the 700s menu. I had to use the power switch to turn off. When I would turn it back on, it would run for a few minutes and then do the same thing. For some reason I decided to remove the cable when this occured and the image returned but was invertsed. At this point I could turn it off. I left the cable out, turned it back on and let it run for a couple of hours. No problem. Next I purchased a new connector (HDMI to DVI) and plugged it in. I have watched a few movies since w/o problem.

If anyone having problems is getting similar behavior, I would try removing the cable from the display and powering on, display an internal pattern and let it run for a while.

This (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=658941&page=1&pp=30&highlight=banding+710)

Thanks ;)

The new low cost DC3 chips dont sound very appealing. Jason noted with the 7100 that he did see pixels from his viewing distance, otherwide I think I'd take that unit. Anyone compare this to the 710?

My understanding was that the DC3 chip in the 7100 is the same as the one in the H79, is this not the case? If they are the same then why is screendoor an issue with the 7100 and not with the H79? Is the issue with SD caused by the better optics of the 7100 as Guitarman seems to imply?

It would be interesting to find out what percentage is affected. I am at 150 hours now and still ok. But with all the rest of you having these issues is makes me wonder when I will have the issue. :( Hopefully Samsung will have better info on this issue very soon, so we can all go back tp enjoying our units and not wonder when there will be a fix.

Dale

Sounds like a poll of all owners with 100 hours+ would be usefull. It may give an indication of how widespread the problem is.

I sure hope Samsung figures out this issue soon because this is the #1 projector on my list right now by far and I am ready to buy once this issue is resolved.

I sure hope Samsung figures out this issue soon because this is the #1 projector on my list right now by far and I am ready to buy once this issue is resolved.


This projector is also high on my list and I'm waiting for the startup issue to be resolved before purchasing one... :confused:

The question was asked if I would go back to the BenQ 8720. The answer is yes. The only reason I went with the Samsung was the great deal AVS had going for a similar picture more or less, and with 1080p in my sights I could upgrade later on this year. Right now I think if I could I would go right back to the BenQ because it was a really classy machine and build quality was better in my opinion.

Since I started the thread I think I should give a update to everyone. I did not know that this many people were having problems, I was just curios in the beginning to see if someone could help me out. I hope I didn't cause any problems for Jason, as that was not my intent. I am also still waiting for a replacement and I am hoping that they (Samsung) have identified the problem. I have tried everything and I have had no luck, even unhooking the dvi cable and trying a different power cord. My 710 has had almost all of the mentioned problems, from the lamp not lighting to color problems and inverted picture. The good news is that I usually only have to restart it once. I am certain that it is a Samsung issue I just hope the new patch is fixed, because if not they will need to do more than just trying to find the problem. I will want my 710 bought back so I can get something that works. I can not go 2 to 3 weeks without a projector.

No matter which pj we all end up with right now I think in the long run Jason and AVscience has our business both now and in the future. This forum has its loyalists with certain brands etc but I appreciate unbiased opinions and the overall benefit of being able to talk about things in a way that you cannot get elsewhere. So whether I am a CRT user, a low end lcd/dlp or a high end dlp we all benefit from each others opinions and base of experience in all these different classes.

Problems are to be expected at times but the stepping up to the plate coupled with our ability to connect with one another via this board assures Jason and AVscience that they have loyal videophile buyers for life. So in a nutshell I don't think we are causing Jason too much trouble. On the contrary I think we gave him an opportunity to show us and other lurkers how much of a world class operation they run.

Thank you jason :D Just one of the reasons i love avs
Hi dave yes we have talked in the past in fact i bought the sammy from you
Thank you both,
Blake

No problem Blake:)!!! I thought you sounded familiar. I hope there's a light at the end of this tunnel (and it's the light from your newly fixed 710's;)!!!) for you all.

Let me know if there's anything more myself, Jason or AVS can do and we'll do our best.

I may have an "in" with Joe Kane and/or JKP if we need to pursue that route?

I hope everyone had an enjoyable Memorial Day weekend and you at least took a second out to thank our military heroes, both past and present!!!

I had a problem with my 700 and went through a couple of lamps until I found the real problem. I am using an HDMI cable with an HDMI to DVI connector on the display it self. I have been using ths for about two years.

The image would go black and I could no longer bring up the 700s menu. I had to use the power switch to turn off. When I would turn it back on, it would run for a few minutes and then do the same thing. For some reason I decided to remove the cable when this occured and the image returned but was invertsed. At this point I could turn it off. I left the cable out, turned it back on and let it run for a couple of hours. No problem. Next I purchased a new connector (HDMI to DVI) and plugged it in. I have watched a few movies since w/o problem.

If anyone having problems is getting similar behavior, I would try removing the cable from the display and powering on, display an internal pattern and let it run for a while.

Stacey,

I think the Optoma H7X line also had some similar issues with DVI connections. I think it has something to do with the 5V power and grounding. One thing that worked with that issue was using something like the Gefen "DVI Detective" to isolate the two DVI devices.

Maybe this will work in this instance also?

I think you're on to something and others here need to look into it on their machines.

For all you "uninitiated" members here, I think it's safe to say Stacey Spears knows what he's talking about and it's worth heeding what you're reading when he writes it:D!!!

With the exception of the inverted image, the "black-out" problem that Stacey has described sounds different from the typical startup problems. It sounds more like a run-time problem.

My startup problems have occurred with no inputs connected at all.

Brent

True, but if there's issues with stray voltages and bad grounds, any number of issues can present themselves in many different ways. You could have an issue with your ground connection in your AC cord, and when coupled with stray voltage coming in on the DVI connector and ground it could potentially wreak some havoc:eek:.

Dave - Point taken.

Brent

I had a problem with my 700 and went through a couple of lamps until I found the real problem. I am using an HDMI cable with an HDMI to DVI connector on the display it self. I have been using ths for about two years.

The image would go black and I could no longer bring up the 700s menu. I had to use the power switch to turn off. When I would turn it back on, it would run for a few minutes and then do the same thing. For some reason I decided to remove the cable when this occured and the image returned but was invertsed. At this point I could turn it off. I left the cable out, turned it back on and let it run for a couple of hours. No problem. Next I purchased a new connector (HDMI to DVI) and plugged it in. I have watched a few movies since w/o problem.

If anyone having problems is getting similar behavior, I would try removing the cable from the display and powering on, display an internal pattern and let it run for a while.

Stacey-
Did I understand you correctly when you said that you (afer powering off and on for a while w/o a cable) changed HDMI to DVI connectors and the problem 'healed' itself? Was it the same brand of connector? If you have the 'Black Screen O' Death' and are using a HDMI to DVI connecotor, would switching to a component cable be a useful test?

Thanks,
Tim

I recieved my Samsung projector about a month ago and suspected a problem by the third start-up. I have logged about 15 hours and already my projector only starts up one out of every three times. Last night, for the first time, I had to pull the cord from the projector and start over, but the problem is definitely worsening. I guess I am number 12.

I have heard a few people who talked about not turning the 710 off at all, and just let it continue to run. To my knmowledge, no one has actually done that yet. What would be the downside to doing this aside from additional electric bill. Does it burn out the bulb very much if nothing is playing through it? I tried a few times this morning to start up w/ no luck, but finally got it going. I watched it for a few hours and decided not to turn it off. I may just keep it on until I can get a replacement. What are your thoughts?

Hi all,

I am back to square one as each of my last two attempts to start the H710 over the weekend required three tries and about 15 minutes of time each. I had a feeling the good times wouldn't last very long and they didn't.

emailists: nice work regarding the successful contact at Joe Kane's. Let us know what David Abrams comes up with when you hear from him again. Regarding what to buy in replacement of the H710 I too am hesitant at this time hoping that Samsung will come through with the solution before my unit dies completely (call me an optimist).

kiwishred: welcome back! Based on the report of your repair it sounds like they still don't know what the problem is. Regarding your post #105 in this thread I now agree that there are 4 different problems described and I have experienced 3 of them: (1) Lamp failure to start, (2) Colours messed up for the first minute, (3) Inverted image dominated by green color. The first problem happens intermittently but when it does its always from a cold start (PJ was off for at least 10 hours before attempt to start). The second problem actually started occurring almost immediately after 8 hours on the lamp and it has been occuring everytime I start it. I have not been bothered by this one as it goes away by itself after about a minute. The third problem I have experienced only one time and it doesn't appear to be serious -at least not yet for me. I have never experienced the 4th problem mentioned which is the lamp going off after a few minutes. I have exerienced the lamp coming on and going off after several seconds but I attributed this to problem #1, "lamp failed to start". The really BIG problem in my opinion is #1, the failure of the lamp to start on the first try. If Samsung manages to fix this problem I would be very happy with this projector.

sspears: On post #117 are you saying that replacing the DVI cable with an HDMI cable fitted with a HDMI-DVI adaptor at its end SOLVES this problem??? Please elaborate. (If this fixes the startup problem, then you have made a huge contribution to this board!)

John

Count me in as one of the ones that was going to buy this..... now I'm certainly going to look at some other PJ's. I have a Samsung RPTV and something happened to it after about 5 minutes of use. The screen would just stay black, although the bulb was on. A technician came out and replaced the main board, light unit and some other stuff..... Fixed it and haven't had an issue since.... knock on wood!

I have heard a few people who talked about not turning the 710 off at all, and just let it continue to run. To my knmowledge, no one has actually done that yet. What would be the downside to doing this aside from additional electric bill. Does it burn out the bulb very much if nothing is playing through it? I tried a few times this morning to start up w/ no luck, but finally got it going. I watched it for a few hours and decided not to turn it off. I may just keep it on until I can get a replacement. What are your thoughts?

Bulb life should be longer if left on as the power up and down stress is not there, but lack of a signal has nothing to do with bulb life. I have heard that if left on, bulb life can easily reach 5000 hours. Because of the repetitive start/stop cycles this problem has caused to my bulb, I have asked for it to be replaced also.

My update:

I'm thinking of having a local welder make my 710 into a hood ornament. The sleek case design and titanium color certainly gives it "bling" factor.

Seriously - I have been trying to get the unit started with no video input at all, (I took off the DVI cable after reading a post here) but no luck in many nights of trying.

Spoke with Samsung today. Had to fax them a sales reciept, wait for them to okay it, at which point they will mail me a UPS label, so I can have it UPS'ed to secaucus NJ, which Ironically is just a few miles away from Manhattan. No, they won't let me drop it off - which would have saved several days of delay. They said it will take about 2 weeks to fix- so with waiting for ups lables, etc I will be down in total for at least 3 weeks, which sucks. I bought a 14" CRT professional High def sony monitor (PVM14L5) for use as an on set monitor for my HD camera, and I am reduced to watching HD on a tiny screen - It does look great though and what blacks! It's also so easy to see color balance is off so often when tv shows shoot (or somewhere else in the delivery chain)

My dealer said that if they in fact get a replacement 710 in before mine comes in from repair - he will send it to me and take my repair unit back when (and if fixed) That is a great offer- I just hope they get them soon.

If there was another compelling product at a smiliar price, I would buy it in a minute. The 8720 seems great but would cost me an additional $1700, and I just don't want to invest so much money when there are so many inticing technologies just on the horizon - In 2 years we could have 1080P LED driven projectors, that have much better and purer color rendition than we have currently.

The 710's image quality is so good I could wait for these advancements without needing to upgrade just for higher resolution, and the price point is low enough to be able to replace it in 2-3 years. I just wished the damn thing worked!!!

I would like to have a short update for the backorder 710 shipping recently by samsung. It's possible ? You don't know approximatly when you will receive your command ?

Thanks and sorry for my english

emailists

1) Are you being directed to an actual central Samsung repair facility or just a general electronics repair shop that is authorised to work on Samsung equipment ? I think your odds of a successful and speedy repair increase if the former is the case.

2) Any word back from David Abrams/Joe Kane yet ?

Brent

Kiwi,

No word back from David Abrams.

Mine is being sent to a central repair facility in Secaucus, NJ. Since I also have a critical lack of focus on the right side of the screen, I really lack confidence in them that they will be able to align the DLP or optics assembly critically to fix this. I asked the tier 2 service person how many projectors Samsung has in the marketplace. He sais in the US there are only 2 - the 710 and 800. My point is, how many projectors can this service center have worked on? If they don't have the real experience and critical alignment jigs, etc, I dont believe I will get a satisfactory outcome. Toshiba on the other hand sends the units to TOPS in Mass, who I know is set up to deal with projectors (since they were able to get them fixed within 1-2 days)

I'm thinking of having a local welder make my 710 into a hood ornament. The sleek case design and titanium color certainly gives it "bling" factor.

Emailists, that's funny but I wouldn't do it. This projector is still worth quite a bit of money as you can see from the ebay link below :o

/Samsung-SP-H710AE-DLP-HD-Projector-1280-X-720_W0QQitemZ7419388897QQcategoryZ37979QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrd Z1QQcmdZViewItem

Samsung SP-H710AE DLP HD Projector & 1280 X 720

Starting bid $55

Sorry, I couldn't resist ...

''Yuppers! They are shipping now. We are fulfilling backorders as we had them so I ask that everyone please continue their patience. We will forward tracking shortly.

Jason Turk
Sales/Installation Manager
A/V Science, Inc.
315-538-9806
''


After 7 days, I would like to know other information

My update:
Seriously - I have been trying to get the unit started with no video input at all, (I took off the DVI cable after reading a post here) but no luck in many nights of trying....

Unfortunately the damage may have already been done if it's what Stacey and I think may be the issue:(

''Yuppers! They are shipping now. We are fulfilling backorders as we had them so I ask that everyone please continue their patience. We will forward tracking shortly.

Jason Turk
Sales/Installation Manager
A/V Science, Inc.
315-538-9806
''


After 7 days, I would like to know other information

I heard they did get in another shipment last Friday and they filled a few more orders.

I think we all just have to wait to see some reports about performance from the owners of these newer units:rolleyes:

Unfortunately the damage may have already been done if it's what Stacey and I think may be the issue:(

And, what is that?

This................

True, but if there's issues with stray voltages and bad grounds, any number of issues can present themselves in many different ways. You could have an issue with your ground connection in your AC cord, and when coupled with stray voltage coming in on the DVI connector and ground it could potentially wreak some havoc:eek:.

Count Me among the startup problem folks. I have approx 350 hrs on it. It started flaking out around 150 or so. It takes approx 5 minutes to start. At first it took 30 sec, then one min, then two , three, four, now five-6 minutes. I don't have problems with flickering or colors but I hear the clicking sound of the lamp trying to fire and nothing, repeating over and over. I also notice it starts up right away if I power down and the lamp is warm and then re-start. I keep my projector in standbye all the time instead of switching the back switch off. I tried samsung customer service and gave up after spending 10 minutes with the CSR just trying to find the department that handles this thing. I bought it from a dealer off ebay...I think I'll try calling them.

-Denny

I heard they did get in another shipment last Friday and they filled a few more orders.

I think we all just have to wait to see some reports about performance from the owners of these newer units:rolleyes:

Thanks :)

Count Me among the startup problem folks. I have approx 350 hrs on it. It started flaking out around 150 or so. It takes approx 5 minutes to start. At first it took 30 sec, then one min, then two , three, four, now five-6 minutes. I don't have problems with flickering or colors but I hear the clicking sound of the lamp trying to fire and nothing, repeating over and over. I also notice it starts up right away if I power down and the lamp is warm and then re-start. I keep my projector in standbye all the time instead of switching the back switch off. I tried samsung customer service and gave up after spending 10 minutes with the CSR just trying to find the department that handles this thing. I bought it from a dealer off ebay...I think I'll try calling them.

-Denny

You are #13. You must have gotten a really good unit since it took 350 hours on the lamp to really show this.

The trick with Samsung is to get to speak to someone from Tier I. This requires some effort and patience on your part but once there, getting to speak to someone from Tier II should be your objective. That's because Tier II customer support representatives can approve repairs. I believe 2-3 of us have managed to penetrate Tier II already. Nobody however has yet to report a 100% successful outcome from their repair and we are all patiently awaiting their future reports.

This is becoming an issue of major proportions.

Does Samsung care?

I agree that this is seemingly a big issue with this projector. Though the numbers are too small for any reasonable estimate of how prevalent this issue is, the unscientific sampling would suggest that this is something that will need to be addressed across the board (if not already--comments from Jason and others seem to indicate the latter is at least possible).

Why would anyone assume Samsung wouldn't care? Whether they're so big that the right people haven't noticed yet is another matter, but there's clearly someone responsible for sales of this particular model and line who would be losing sleep if aware. I'm guessing that word is only now leaking back (probably via JKP and through service centers) to the people who might actually be able to do something about this.

Like everydody else here I hope they find a solution for this growing problem. I do not have it, but it could show up at any time like it has happened so many users of the projector.

so far I have 230 hours on it and no probs ? so now hoping I am going to be OK ? but its a bit unnerving to wonder if it will fail ??????

but got to say the pic is so so so nice

those with probs hope it all gets sorted out :)

Why would anyone assume Samsung wouldn't care? Whether they're so big that the right people haven't noticed yet is another matter, but there's clearly someone responsible for sales of this particular model and line who would be losing sleep if aware. I'm guessing that word is only now leaking back (probably via JKP and through service centers) to the people who might actually be able to do something about this.I think you are cutting Samsung more slack that they are entitled to in this particular case. The GuideToHomeTheater (http://www.guidetohometheater.com/videoprojectors/505samsung/index.html) article makes it clear that JKP was aware of these issues over a year ago. It is unfathomable to me that Samsung is just learning about this now.

But even worse than that in my book is that there has been no acknowledgement of and response to these issues from Samsung. Snippets of information from AVS (Jason) and other dealers are appreciated but no substitute for Samsung stepping up to the plate.

Brent

I agree. This does not look good on Samsung with the way they are handling (I mean not handling) the situation. Atleast admit the problem and make some sort of public anouncement that they are working on it. This is the least they could do IMO.

I think you are cutting Samsung more slack that they are entitled to in this particular case. The GuideToHomeTheater (http://www.guidetohometheater.com/videoprojectors/505samsung/index.html) article makes it clear that JKP was aware of these issues over a year ago. It is unfathomable to me that Samsung is just learning about this now.

Brent

As someone who is thrilled with this projector and desperately hoping mine doesn't fail, I would certainly agree that an official response from Samsung is overdue. To say that JKP was aware of these issues with this model prior to its release is not supported by that article alone. In it, it seems that Kane was aware only of issues with earlier firmware of that projector--when updated, it seemed to work fine according to the reviewer. I would think it would be a form of consulting firm suicide to so clearly brand a projector (to the point of having your logo on the projector's test patterns!) and then knowingly look the other way as a defective product is released, if that's what your asserting.

Perhaps I'm naive, or have more faith in human nature, but I'd have to assume that JK is only recently aware that this is not an isolated problem, given the limited number of units out there, and the time for information like that contained in this thread to feed back. After all, there were no real reports of problems with this projector when I ordered (around a month ago), and they seem to be much more common now that more units are in circulation.

I think we agree in principle--we should know soon enough if you're correct if much more time passes without more statements from either Samsung or JKP.

KK

Update on repair progress:

I sent in the information from timf98 about the controller board swap to my repair shop and just got a call back from the tech who is working on my unit. He is certain that the problem is the colour wheel assembly. Apparently, as part of the start up procedure, the colour wheel has to be spinning before the lamp will (fully) fire up. (I am adding the “fully” part because I have seen low intensity initial strikes but not transitions to full brightness on failed start-up attempts).

So, at least this explanation provides a plausible link between cause and effect. If the wheel is totally stuck then the lamp fails to come on fully. The interlock between wheel and lamp might be to prevent light blasting through the same spot on the wheel and heating it excessively. On the other hand, if the wheel is spinning but is "sluggish" then the lamp will fire but the colours will be messed up until wheel breaks free and gets up to full speed. Also since this is a mechanical problem it is easy to imagine how we might get different behaviour on each power-up depending on just how "sticky" the wheel happens to be at the time.

One worry is that this explanation seems to contradict what timf98 was told. It is also hard to see how it could be related to inverted images. However, "my" tech said he instrumented the system with a scope to see what was going on and then, when he tried a spare colour wheel, everything started working properly. So this gives me much more confidence that the repair will be successful.

Whereas previously I suspected the thought process for ordering a replacement wheel was more along the line “Oh, the colours are messed up, must be the colour wheel, let’s order a new one and see if that fixes it” this tech seemed to be quite familiar with Samsung DLPs (and it sounds like the RPTV versions have similar issues). Perhaps a visit to the RPTV forum in in order....

Unfortunately, the spare colour wheel that the tech had is too noisy to be used as a permanent repair and replacement colour wheels are not immediately available. In fact, he had a lot of trouble even identifying the right part to order it.

But, overall, I am much happier now that I have some solid information about the status of the repair. It is easier to be patient when there are signs of real progress.

Brent

To say that JKP was aware of these issues with this model prior to its release is not supported by that article alone. In it, it seems that Kane was aware only of issues with earlier firmware of that projector--when updated, it seemed to work fine according to the reviewer. Agreed but the problem with intermittent failures such as these is that it is never clear whether a particular remedial action (eg: hard power-off, wiring harness adjustment, updated firmware, etc) really has provided a fix or is merely co-incidental. IMHO, all this power-cord/wiring harness/firmware voodoo pointed to an underlying issue with the 700/710 chassis which Samsung should have picked up on and addressed but clearly hasn't.

BTW, the 710s surely have the latest firmware but the problems remain.

I agree with you that JKP are not culpable in this and I certainly didn't mean to imply that JKP was "knowingly looking the other way as a defective product was released". Hopefully that was clear from my previous post

If Samsung itself doesn't step up to the plate by themselves then I hope that JKP would at least assert some influence. While they are probably not directly responsible for the circuit design & manufacture, their reputation is still on the line here as well.
Brent

Ok. Just got my 710. Plugged it in and turned it on with the idea I would make sure it works. Maybe I am missing something. But when I turn the unit on, all I get is the blinking red light (temp) and blinking blue light (bulb). I've read the instructions over 10 times more, but if I am missing something, it is alluding me. I've unplugged the unit a few times. I've turned it on and off a bunch of times, but nothing. Any suggestions?

Ralph -

Does the flashing red light come on a) immediately or b) after a minute or so of the lamp repeatedly momentarily coming on dimly (only visible by looking through lens) followed by some clicking noises ?

If a) then you really might have a bad bulb. You might want to try removing it and re-seating it....

If b) then welcome to the "Samsung h710 lamp startup issues club" :eek:

What is your manufacture date ?

Brent

Samsung is very SLOOOOWWW to respond it seems.

I contacted them on Tuesday about the problem. They were supposed to email me a printable UPS label so I could send the unit in for repair. It's early friday morning and I still haven't gotten the email from them. In my book that is pathetic customer service. They wouldn't let me bring the unit into their service center, which is close by.

Samsung really doesn't deserve my hard earned cash, and this experience will definitley make me think twice before buying anything from them again.

Ralph -

Does the flashing red light come on a) immediately or b) after a minute or so of the lamp repeatedly momentarily coming on dimly (only visible by looking through lens) followed by some clicking noises ?

If a) then you really might have a bad bulb. You might want to try removing it and re-seating it....

If b) then welcome to the "Samsung h710 lamp startup issues club" :eek:

What is your manufacture date ?

Brent


The answer is "a."

Not sure the manufacturer date. I reboxed the projector and don't have it handy. But I will try to get today and will post.

Thanks.

... the problem is the colour wheel assembly. Apparently, as part of the start up procedure, the colour wheel has to be spinning before the lamp will (fully) fire up. The interlock between wheel and lamp might be to prevent light blasting through the same spot on the wheel and heating it excessively. On the other hand, if the wheel is spinning but is "sluggish" then the lamp will fire but the colours will be messed up until wheel breaks free and gets up to full speed. Also since this is a mechanical problem it is easy to imagine how we might get different behaviour on each power-up depending on just how "sticky" the wheel happens to be at the time.
Brent

So you are saying the problem is due to a "sticky" wheel? And the lamp firing logic is tied to the wheel spin rate sensor? Does that mean that when the lamp finally fires (after multiple attempts) the color wheel is no longer "sticky"? It feels like we are reaching a little here.

Even if that's the case I still can't explain the following. I have had at least 3 occasions when the lamp actually came on (you could see it lit by carefully looking into the lens from the side) but there was no image on the screen, nothing at all. Meanwhile the steady blue lights on the front indicated that the PJ was operating normally when in fact it was not. How do you attribute this to the "sticky" wheel? Another question that also deserves an answer is for the units that are actually working well. Are their wheels not "sticky"? Finally how do you explain the fact that we don't have problems starting the unit from a "warm" state? I mean once started, we can turn it off and on multiple times without a hint of any problems. Can this be explained by the mere fact the unit is now warmer and the friction in the wheel spin mechanism has been reduced due to the higher temperature? Questions, questions, ...

To me this smells like a problem that requires professional engineers to review and fix. A technician can only replace parts that are already available to him, he cannot redesign or re-engineer the unit or its software. This is why it's important to hear from the Samsung Team on this.

Ready2Buy

I am not saying the problem is due to a "sticky" wheel. I am just relaying what the technician told me and proposing that the sticky wheel theory at least seems plausible (albeit with the nagging concerns that you raise). Time will tell if this really is the problem.

Also if the root cause is the spec on the wheel then substituting one part for another in the field does not guarantee a fix. You have to hope that the new wheel came from the 85% side of the distribution not the problematic 15% side. Clearly a factory fix would have to be more substantial - tightened spec on the wheel, changes to the drive firmware or electrical circuitry or whatever. (pure speculation: wrestling with how to adequately and cost-effectively address the problem in older units is likely the cause of the silence on Samsung's part on this issue).

I agree about the lamp partially coming on. That is why I proposed a 2-stage start-up sequence. Regardless of whether the wheel is moving or not the lamp is initially struck but at low intensity (only visible by looking through the lens). The system then checks to see if wheel is moving before bringing lamp up to full power. If it is not moving at all (or below the threshold) then the entire startup process repeats a given number of times before aborting. If you get lucky then the wheel gets moving sufficiently fast on a subsequent attempt.

Successful hot restarts can be attributed to reduced viscosity or some other temperature related effect as you suggest

Again, all this is pure speculation but at least we have something to speculate about :)

Perhaps we could determine if a firmware fix is involved by comparing firmware levels of the "old" (Feb '06) and "fixed" (May '06) units. Is there some way to determine this ?

Brent

(pure speculation: wrestling with how to adequately and cost-effectively address the problem in older units is likely the cause of the silence on Samsung's part on this issue)

kiwi, I think you are right on here. This is probably what's happening right now. That's why the Samsung Customer Service hasn't been told anything about this yet. They need to get the right strategy to handle this and the cost is probably a very important consideration.

The answer is "a."

Not sure the manufacturer date. I reboxed the projector and don't have it handy. But I will try to get today and will post.

Thanks.


Build date is May 2006.

That's why the Samsung Customer Service hasn't been told anything about this yet. They need to get the right strategy to handle this and the cost is probably a very important consideration

Sounds like this is going to cost Samsung some serious money to get this problem fixed. Or, they may just see how far they can get by just ignoring the problem.

Well, I just received my Samsung about a week ago from AVS after waiting over a month. This was supposedly one of the "fixed" units. I have a build date of May 2006. I haven't really used it too much yet as I was waiting for other equipment.

However, after flawless (and impressive) performance for 8-10 hours, I now cannot seem to start my lamp. I believe this is the same issue others have reported in this thread:

I power-on the unit, the 'lamp' light blinks on and off for a few minutes and I also hear some 'clicking' sounds. I do not see the lamp even attempt to light. Finally, the unit gives up and all three lights (standby, lamp and temp) begin to flash.

I have tried unplugging/re-seating the power cable, unplugging the DVI connection, and even re-seated the lamp. But after a dozen or so attempts, I still cannot use my Samsung.

This is unfortunate as it is Friday and I'll have to wait until Monday to talk to Dave Harper for a return....although at this point I really wonder if Samsung knows how to fix this problem....

Any thoughts/suggestions?

Rich

Rich that is not very good news. :( It looks like you are the 2nd one with a May 06 build date with a problem. Hopefully someone will hear something from Samsung soon. Hey maybe they will upgrade us to the 800. :eek: But than again are they going to be bug free?

Dale

This was supposedly one of the "fixed" units. I have a build date of May 2006. However, after flawless (and impressive) performance for 8-10 hours, I now cannot seem to start my lamp.

Rich

Rich,

Wow, sorry to hear this. Your experience shows that the new May 2006 units have not really been "fixed" as I suspected. It's unfortunate that it only took you 8-10 hours on the lamp before this problem occured.

Exchanging it may help because you might get lucky with the second unit so you certainly want to go for it. The alternative is to try to get it repaired but this is even less desirable given what we know so far.

Good luck with the next one and let us know how that one turns out.

John

I hate to say it, but this thread scared me. The error rate is much too high, so I canceled my order for a 710. Even though the Benq 8720 costs more it may be the better choice.

I had my 710 in the repair shop and they called to say Samsung says it can't be repaired and to pick it up. Samsung tells me to return the PJ and they will replace it. Every time I call Samsung customer service I wait 20 minutes on hold and then they don't know if it's a TV or a computer monitor or what department it should be under. Samsung doesn't know their a$$ from their elbow. I am going to ask for a refund. If I can get it I'm going to buy the Mitsubishi WD2000U, it has an overnight replacement warranty for 3 years.

Boy, from the sounds of this, I'm glad I decided to stick with my z4 for now and wait a little longer for a "better" projector. (actually my wife nixed the idea :) )I have not had any issues with my z4 and even got a free spare bulb for about 1/2 the price. I know it's not quite in the same class as the Samsung, but it produces a very satisifing image to me...esp. in HD. I hope Samsung takes care of you all...

I hate to say it, but this thread scared me. The error rate is much too high, so I canceled my order for a 710. Even though the Benq 8720 costs more it may be the better choice.

At this point it IS the better choice.

timf98: Wow, I'm almost speachless on that. Basically it sound like right now all the defective 710's which appears to be ~30-40% of them are paper wieghts. A replacment would be great IF they had truely addressed the problem but so far that doesn't seem to be the case.

I can't believe this projector has turned out to be the FIAT of the display industry.

I haven't browsed the forums in a while since I've received my 710 so I didn't see this thread. I'm sorry to hear that a lot of you are having problems with your 710. I'll have to cross my fingers, but so far I have 325 hours and no problems. I'll keep an eye out though.

I hope all of your problems are finally resolved, and quickly.

I had my 710 in the repair shop and they called to say Samsung says it can't be repaired and to pick it up. Samsung tells me to return the PJ and they will replace it.Well, this certainly is a shocker. But without knowing more details on why it can't be repaired it is really hard to interpret what this development means in the broad scheme of things. Here are some possibilities:

- Samsung service is disorganised. (Wait, we already knew that !) Whoever sent out the "can't be repaired message" simply got it wrong.

- Samsung is finally organised. They really have implemented a fix in the May 06 units and their strategy for properly fixing defective Feb '06 units is total replacement. There are some hints that changes were made to the May '06 units and delays due to implementing these changes caused lack of availability. However, in post #169 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7763640&&#post7763640) rhenschel reports problems with his May '06 unit. I don't think ralpjb has "classic" startup problems because his red light starts flashing straight away.

Brent

Hey maybe they will upgrade us to the 800. :eek: B
Dale


Dale, has this PJ make its debut yet? Also what is your unit's build date?

Mine is deteriorating quickly. Took six times to get it started last night. I thought I would last another month but now I doubt it. It's the last time I'll buy the first batch of any new projector. I certainly wouldn't be in the waiting list like many are until Samsung says something.

John

UPDATE: SAMSUNG declared mentally incompetent!

After waiting three days for an email with a UPS shipping label attached to show up (which never did) I called Samsung again, and this time was told the email would show up by the end of the day. (come one, Samsung can't get an email out in 3 days!!!)

I was also told I could have dropped the unit of personally at the Secaucus repair center, which the level 2 tech I spoke earlier in the week clearly said I could not drop it off because they weren't set up for it.

Before the end of the day, the Samsung tech calls back to say they can't in fact email me a label because the item is too expensive to send that way. They have to call UPS themselves, and It will take till monday or tues to even pick the unit up. 1 FULL WEEK between informing them of my dead unit, and them even picking it up!!!!

In that time frame, Toshiba had my unit repaired and back to me.

The kicker is they say for anything other than a bulb repair (my unit has a critical focus issue) that they are replacing the units, not repairing them.

So I will get a replacement direct from Samsung, which I thought was great untill I read here that 2 of the "new updated" units have failed as well.

I think it's obvious Samsung is not serious about the projector business. I think anyone seriously considering this product or the 800 should look elsewhere. Joe Kane did a great job desiging the unit, but it obviously was implemented by a much less talented team, backed up by an even less talented techincal and support department.

I can't even imagine someone paying $10,000 for the 700 and getting this kind of product and service. If I gave my clients this level of treatment, I wouldn't be able to afford a projector.

It is shameful treatment of customers at any price. But when you consider...

emailists,

Sorry to hear about your woes in trying to get support from Samsung. I can relate! :(

I don't know if it will make you feel any better, but I ran in to the same type of "You can't get there from here" mentality with another PJ company. To return a defective PJ, the Tech Support Rep said that they would issue a Call Tag and have it picked up at my house. Then, a few days later in the mail, I received some stick-on UPS labels. Had to drive 10 miles to the nearest UPS store to ship it out. With the next return (another defective unit) I received an e-mail from the Rep that gave me an RMA number, but no other info. A few days later, the UPS driver rang the doorbell looking for the package to pick up. I had no idea he was scheduled! The PJ was still hooked up in my HT.

There's more -- I could literally go on and on, but I don't think that Samsung is the only confused PJ provider out there.

By the way, I've had a 710 on order for >5 weeks now, but not even sure if I still want the thing after the ordeal I went through with the previous (different manufacturer) defective DLP PJ's. This thread is triggering the "fight or flight" reaction in me. ;)

Oh well, back to reading the Mits WD2000U thread...

Dale, has this PJ make its debut yet? Also what is your unit's build date?

Mine is deteriorating quickly. Took six times to get it started last night. I thought I would last another month but now I doubt it. It's the last time I'll buy the first batch of any new projector. I certainly wouldn't be in the waiting list like many are until Samsung says something.

John

I have not seen it sold anywhere yet. My build date is oct 05. I am waiting on a DVI detective to isolate the 5 vdc from the soarce and the projector until I fire mine up again. Hopefully that will keep me from having the startup issues.

I would have to agree with waiting on this projector. Unless Samsung has some kind of reason for it very quickly, I would be looking at something else also. I am sorry to even recomend to you and Brent to where to buy one at. :(

Out of all the projectors I have owned the Infocus X1, Infocus 4800, NEC 1100 and the Pano 300 ant 500 were the only projectors I had good luck with. Yes I don't have any problems with my 710 yet. But I do not like the fact that I am hesitant every time I fire it up if will fire up or not. :confused: Problem childs so far is Sanyo Z1, Infocus 7105, Sony HS10, Sharp 10000, Benq 8700+, and the Optoma H77.

The HS10, Benq 8700+ and the Optoma H77 all had to be sent in at least 4 times. Now that sucks. :mad: God you would think I would write off front projectors all together.

Dale

Dale,

I don't believe anybody knew that there was a startup problem with this PJ until it was too late. (If they knew it and were still trying to push these units on unsuspecting buyers then they are crooks and should be treated as such.) The review by Jason right here at AVS and also the one at Projector Central were glowing for this model. In fact I agree completely with their assessment that this projector throws an awesome picture assuming it starts. Unfortunately the older more authoritative review on the H700 which really pin-pointed this problem was not discovered until well after I had already bought the unit. In retrospect the only lesson I learn from this experience is to never buy another brand new model until some time has passed and the bugs are out in the open.

As for what to do now, it appears that we will have to put up with the huge inconvienience of dealing with Samsung in replacing our units and hope that the replacements don't suffer from the same problem. What a predicament!

I didn't realize the sorry state that front projector technology is in until now. This technology looks like it needs another 10 years or so to reach the reliability of TV sets.

John
PS: What's a "DVI detective"?

Dale,

I don't believe anybody knew that there was a startup problem with this PJ until it was too late. (If they knew it and were still trying to push these units on unsuspecting buyers then they are crooks and should be treated as such.) The review by Jason right here at AVS and also the one at Projector Central were glowing for this model. In fact I agree completely with their assessment that this projector throws an awesome picture assuming it starts. Unfortunately the older more authoritative review on the H700 which really pin-pointed this problem was not discovered until well after I had already bought the unit. In retrospect the only lesson I learn from this experience is to never buy another brand new model until some time has passed and the bugs are out in the open.

As for what to do now, it appears that we will have to put up with the huge inconvienience of dealing with Samsung in replacing our units and hope that the replacements don't suffer from the same problem. What a predicament!

I didn't realize the sorry state that front projector technology is in until now. This technology looks like it needs another 10 years or so to reach the reliability of TV sets.

John


Seems like the FP manufacturers are using the same tactics as the software companies - push it out the door and let the users be the beta testers. :mad:


I wonder how long it will take before the bugs are eliminated? I'm waiting to purchase this projector but I don't want to put up with the hassle of getting mine repaired so I guess I'll just have to wait. :confused:

John on what's a DVI detective see Dave's 128 & 130 posts on this thread. It should help you a better understand what it is. It should also be on the Gefen website. I am currently at 11 meters on my cable and from the website says it will help on longer distances. Anyway at a cost of around 60 to 70 bucks it's worth testing.

It would be interesting to find out if anybody that only uses component has any startup issues. Mine is half DVI and half component usage.

Dale

I am not giving up on this projector yet. I was on the back-order list with AVS and I received my tracking number yesterday. I should have the unit in next week! :)

From what Jason stated earlier, he is seeing a 10 - 15% defect rate which is indeed way to high. However, I look at it from the bright side - 9 out of 10 people are enjoying their machines! Of course this is no help for those who have an expensive paper weight. I will just cross my fingers that I am one of those lucky 9 people. Maybe I will hang a rabbit's foot and horse shoe on the projector. :D

For those folks having problems, I am curious to hear what type of power-protection you are using? Maybe the units are sensitive to power surges/spikes?

The 710 is a great performer. If you get a defective unit, you can still get a replacement unit. Yes, it's a hassle, but in the long run of using it for a couple of years, I think the positives far outweigh the hassle. I really think it'll be interesting what the failure rate will be when the newer line infiltrates the market.

I admire your courage Robert! I am wanting to do the same thing since there is nothing else I want as much as the 710. I was on the backorder list at AVS, but took myself off last week because of these issues. I might reorder my unit since there is nothing else in this price range that is appealing to me. Good Luck!

My 710 was plugged into the filtered (not regenerated) port of a PS Audio Powerplant 500. The DVI was via a Monoprice HDMI switcher w/EQ.

I don't think it would be power surges, as that would mean that 10-15 percent of people have had power surges. That's a lot of bad power. This week, I had a period of brownouts but other than having to reset my DVD player (i.e., unplug and replug), I had no other problems. I do have a whole house surge suppressor, though.

Rich that is not very good news. :( It looks like you are the 2nd one with a May 06 build date with a problem. Hopefully someone will hear something from Samsung soon. Hey maybe they will upgrade us to the 800. :eek: But than again are they going to be bug free?

Dale

Count me as the third with the 'fixed' projectors that has startup issues. I received my h710ae this friday and after about 10 hours of use the lamp no longer fires. The lamp light blinks for a minute or two and then all three lights just blink. I couldn't be more disgusted. I had invited two of my brothers over and their families to watch movies today. It worked this morning and not in the evening. Really pissed off since I had to wait almost a month for this projector.
I guess the question is a. Give this projector another try or b. try another ?

Is there any projector in the this price class with similar quality that anyone would recommend? Thanks

I am sorry to even recomend to you and Brent to where to buy one at. :(Hey the decision was made based on the best information available at the time!

It would be interesting to find out if anybody that only uses component has any startup issues. Mine is half DVI and half component usage.I have seen sorts of startup issues (lamp failing to come on & bad colours) without any inputs connected at all.

For those folks having problems, I am curious to hear what type of power-protection you are using? Maybe the units are sensitive to power surges/spikes?The lamp failed to come on the very first time I turned it on straight out of the box. I doubt it had time to be hit by a power surge/spike.

Count me as the third with the 'fixed' projectors that has startup issues. Bummer for you personally ! Did you try multiple times or just one power cycle ? Mine always started eventually. Only once did it require more than one power cycle. You could look at the Optoma line (H78DC3 or H7100) but that might be a case of out of the frying pan into the fire reliability-wise.

Also a bummer for H710 owners in general as it seems the May 06 units are not providing the hoped-for fix :(

Brent

moshmothma, this is truly amazing. You and I both have almost the same exact number of hours (10) with the "fixed" units.

I'm in the same boat as you...I'm wondering if I really want a replacement...but as others have said, projectors such as the Benq 8720 are quite a bit more expensive.

I really wish Samsung could figure this out....

Rich

Allright folks, its official. As of tonight my unit has gone to heaven. Won't start no matter what, I just gave up after 45 minutes. Will be calling Samsung tomorrow early in the morning.

Dale,
My unit has the same built date as yours. The fact that yours has no problem and mine does indicates that the problem is not due to a bad batch of units (i.e., drunken Samsung assembly workers on some week-night last fall). The three new incidents with the May-06 built dates confirms this is a serious problem with a lot more failures to be reported. Getting a good unit is definitely a random hit-and-miss situation. Because of this I don't believe for a minute that the failure rate is only 10%. By the time everybody has 500 hours on their units we could easily reach 50% failure rate (the magic flip-a-coin level) and this thread maybe 100 pages long. -I hope I am wrong but I don't like the replacement idea with yet another un-fixed unit.

John

God the news just keeps getting worst.

Brent what I was getting at is if anyone that has only used component and never DVI has had the startup issue yet.

John I could not agree with you more. What bothers me is no word from Samsung at all on this issue. But with this many failed units they need to say something or recall the whole 710 line.

Dale

Bummer for you personally ! Did you try multiple times or just one power cycle ? Mine always started eventually. Only once did it require more than one power cycle. You could look at the Optoma line (H78DC3 or H7100) but that might be a case of out of the frying pan into the fire reliability-wise.


I tried for an hour to get it to startup just so I could show movies while my family was over. I got nothing. Despite my research, I think getting a Front Projector at this time might not have been the best idea...



moshmothma, this is truly amazing. You and I both have almost the same exact number of hours (10) with the "fixed" units.

I'm in the same boat as you...I'm wondering if I really want a replacement...but as others have said, projectors such as the Benq 8720 are quite a bit more expensive.



Yeah, I would guess anywhere from 8-14 hours of use and then nothing. Very dissapointing to say the least. I am waiting to hear something back from AVS on a replacement. Hopefully it won't take as long.
I looked at the 8720 but the throw distances don't work for me. I may be stuck wit the Yamaha if I need a good pic. :(

I tried for an hour to get it to startup just so I could show movies while my family was over. I got nothing. Despite my research, I think getting a Front Projector at this time might not have been the best idea...





Don't sour on all front projection just yet. I know this initial experience isn't any fun, but having a front projection set-up really makes wathing movies in your HT a lot better. My lamp went on my prior projector just before I upgraded to the 710 and I was watching on a 31" tv for a month. It was quite an agonizing month for my girl and I. Once you go to the "BIG" screen, you won't go back.

Hopefully, Samsung figures out this start-up problem so everyone can enjoy this great machine.

After initially wanting this projector, I couldn't order it with all these issues. I'm getting a Panny 900 and an anamorphic lens for less than the Sammy. I certainly hope all these issues get resolved for all of you!

After much study, the Joe Kane Samsung H710AE is the projector that I wanted to buy so I placed an order with AVS on May 9. Since then, I have been following the startup issues thread with great interest waiting for Samsung to show that these issues have been fixed. Unfortunately, the first three people who received May 2006 projectors all had the same startup issues within 0 to 10 hours of use. Therefore, I have cancelled my order effective yesterday and I am now considering other projectors. A superb picture is great but worthless if the projector won't start up.

Samsung is making a big mistake by not acknowledging their problem, by not determining the root cause, by not promptly implementing a successful fix, by not having their website readily show the H710 as their new product, by not having their service people properly informed and trained and by their shoddy treatment of their customers who have the startup issues and have asked for assistance. I have no confidence in Samsung at this point in time and I will not purchase any of their products in the future. I am also amazed that Joe Kane or someone from his organization has not posted a response to the startup issues since his reputation is also at stake here.

The Samsung customers who have this startup issue deserve to be treated significantly better than they have been to date. Good luck to all in resolving these issues.

Remember that I was one of the original guinea pigs on this unit and was so excited about purchasing it. I watched it almost every day. When I had the problem I called Jason and he kindly replaced the unit. Not wanting to scare others away I did not report my problem here on the board, which was the exact problem happening again on my new replacement unit. At the time I thought maybe my problem was isolated and since I was still one of the early adopters not many of you had your units yet and if you did you were still a little early on your bulb life to start seeing the problem.

Now that I am back I am seeing how many of you bought the unit and now we are all in the same boat. I agree that from a statistical point of view the 11 with the problem on AVS reflects a much much broader problem on Samsungs hands when you take that sample to the marketplace.

The build date on my unit says February of 2006. Does anyone have a unit with a problem that has a later date on the label on back of the unit?

I too have a Feb 2006 unit purchased from AVS. I have put 17 hours on the bulb from thoroughly testing for my yet to be finished home theater. I recently packed it up for storage until the theater is done. I did not see any problems during my 17 hours of testing, but now I'm really worried that I just haven't reached the critical time threshold yet (40-50 hrs)? Nothing like working on finishing the HT with that gnawing question in the back of your mind as to whether the main player of the whole set up is just waiting to go belly up after the first few weeks of real use.

Anyone have a Feb 06 (or later) unit with high hours that has NOT had a problem? From several posts in this thread it appears that AVS has acknowledged a problem, but it is still not clear what the cause of the problem is and whether it affects/will affect all units of a given production run. I guess all I can do now is watch this thing play out and hope I'm not stuck with a high-tech paper weight when the dust settles. Not a good feeling...

EDIT: I see in post #114 that ToneDefJeff has a Feb 06 unit with 138 hours and still no problem - so there is yet hope...

Randy,

I know I have a few customers that haven't contacted me with any issues. Their's are probably FEB 06 or earlier based on when they ordered them.

EDIT: I see in post #114 that ToneDefJeff has a Feb 06 unit with 138 hours and still no problem - so there is yet hope...

On 195 hours and working great. Of course like you, I fear at any time my luck could change for the worse. I love the projector and can't think of anything else I'd rather have for the money. I may have been luckly, or it could just decide to wait another 500 hours to kick the bucket.

Until the issue is diagnosed and resolved we don't really know. It very well could be 100% of the units are going to die, just some are quicker then others.

........It very well could be 100% of the units are going to die, just some are quicker then others.

Man, I certainly hope not :eek:!!!!!!

Yes, the problems reported in this thread have certainly taken the "shine off the apple."

I went through this with the BenQ PE7700 and its propensity for popping bulbs. BenQ finally made a recall that seems to have fixed the problem, but I got tired of the "sick feeling" I had each time I turned on the projector. I went with the Samsung because I have one of their RP DLPs that is over 3 years old and just keeps going.

Unfortunately, the joy of watching this projector has now been substantially diminished with the anxiety of premature failure -- especially when there does not yet seem to be a permanent fix.

I'm intrigued by the "sticky" color wheel theory. It sounds plausible. I've read several posts on other threads where owners mentioned hearing a high-pitched whine from the projector - presumably from the color wheel. I definitely have noticed the whine on my projector -- faint but very distinct, like a micro buzzsaw for lack of better description. Perhaps grasping at straws, but I wonder if the whine could be related to an immenent failure of the color wheel?

Or - if the whine is normal for this projector - then it would be easy to tell by the absence of the whine that the color wheel failed to spin up during startup. I know that on my machine I hear the whine kick in shortly after startup but before the picture displays.

I was also going to order the 710 but have since put it on hold. I think brycov has hit the nail on the head.

After much study, the Joe Kane Samsung H710AE is the projector that I wanted to buy so I placed an order with AVS on May 9. Since then, I have been following the startup issues thread with great interest waiting for Samsung to show that these issues have been fixed. Unfortunately, the first three people who received May 2006 projectors all had the same startup issues within 0 to 10 hours of use. Therefore, I have cancelled my order effective yesterday and I am now considering other projectors. A superb picture is great but worthless if the projector won't start up.

I am very disappointed that Samsung has not acknowledged a problem even exists, the most basic first step. If they had done that consumers would be much better served. No one likes getting the runaround.

In my experience, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. I would suggest that all unsatisfied customers lodge a complaint with the consumer affairs division of the state they reside in and the state of Samsung's US corporate headquarters. Also, a letter (email) to the AV magazines, eZines, CNET, etc. detailing the problems and Samsung's ridiculous (non)attempt to deal with the issue could be very helpful. Make sure to cc Samsung on any of the communications. As long as you stick to the facts for you own individual situation there is nothing Samsung can do to deter you.

Good luck

...Or - if the whine is normal for this projector - then it would be easy to tell by the absence of the whine that the color wheel failed to spin up during startup. I know that on my machine I hear the whine kick in shortly after startup but before the picture displays.

Yeah, and if you don't hear that "whine", then you'll be hearing a lot more "whines" here on the forum;)!!!

They need to get to the bottom of this ASAP.

February 2006 - 350+ hours and running fine. So far so good.

Feb 2006, 135hrs, no problems yet! Wait, let me go start it up right now. Yep it started okay. We will see.

Symneter

I have an idea, I'll add a heater coil to keep it warm, should help it start. ;)

But seriously, I have a request for a refund under review by Samsung. It takes at least 5 business days for them to review. :eek: Hopefully I'll have an answer by Friday. One thing is sure, I will never by a Samsung product again.

...One thing is sure, I will never by a Samsung product again.

With so much OEM'ing going on these days, you'll never know for sure if you do, unfortunately. I feel your pain though:(

But seriously, I have a request for a refund under review by Samsung. It takes at least 5 business days for them to review. :eek: Hopefully I'll have an answer by Friday. One thing is sure, I will never by a Samsung product again.

Hi Tim,

Did you try a replacement? I can understand asking for a refund if you had two units failed with the same problem. Did you take a chance with a second unit?

John

Talked to a product supervisor at Samsung. Unfortunately, he knew little about the problem. I have no idea how that is even possible, but it is what it is. Anyways, I am getting him some defective units to take a look at. Hopefully something will now get taken care of with this problem.

Jason - that is excellent news!

I was just about to ask if somehow, somebody could talk directly to the H710 product team or indirectly through Joe Kane's organization.

Was the supervisor you talked to directly involved with the H710 product or is he/she an all-around general Samsung product person?

Talked to a product supervisor at Samsung. Unfortunately, he knew little about the problem. I have no idea how that is even possible, but it is what it is. Anyways, I am getting him some defective units to take a look at. Hopefully something will now get taken care of with this problem.

That's my boss, you da' man Jason;):D!!!

Hi Tim,

Did you try a replacement? I can understand asking for a refund if you had two units failed with the same problem. Did you take a chance with a second unit?

JohnThere is no reason to try a replacement. There is now ample evidence that the replacement could also have the same startup issues. This is not a risk/hassle that the consumer should have to take on.

FWIW, both H710's I have tried were defective. One with the startup issues, one with optical issues.

Brent

Talked to a product supervisor at Samsung. Unfortunately, he knew little about the problem. I have no idea how that is even possible, but it is what it is.All this tells us is that this particular contact is not on the ball. According to emailist's post #104 back on 28 May "David Abrams from Joe Kanes's company replied to my email- thanking me for bringing this thread to their attention. Joe has contacted Samsung product management, and will follow up with them after the holiday weekend." someone in Samsung knows (and we would have to assume that Joe would have directed his input into the appropriate part of the organisation).

I think most people here are reasonable. While we don't expect an immediate fix we do expect an acknowledgement of these issues from Samsung and that they are being worked on. brycov's post #199 stated this very eloquently.

FWIW, I emailed the following to Mark Pickard of Samsung Electronics America last weekend:

Hi Mark,

I am wondering if you are aware of the widespread problems with the Samsung SP-H710AE ? If not, you might want to check out the posts on this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=669765&page=1&pp=30

Just as bad as the startup issues themselves is the wall of silence from Samsung. No acknowledgment of the problem at all. No indication of how this is going to be resolved.

This is compounded by the total ineptitude of the service division. Try calling them yourself and see if they even know that the projector exists let alone tell you how to get it fixed. I was told to take mine to local repair shop. Others have been told to ship theirs to Samsung for repair. Others have been told to have theirs replaced.

Frankly this situation is pissing off a lot of people, myself included. And it must be losing Samsung a lot of sales.

Hopefully you can light a fire underneath the manufacturing and service organizations to get these issued addressed promptly.

Personally I just want to enjoy my projector. Picture is wonderful when it is going. But I ordered it in Mid April and have hardly had a chance to use it what with shipping delays and going through one replacement already. Currently my H710 is sitting in a repair shop, waiting for parts, with no indication when they will arrive or whether they will really fix the problem.

Thanks for any help you can provide,Needless to say, I havn't heard anything back. I do know that the mail would have bounced by now if the email address was not legitimate. While I will refrain from posting Mark's email address in a public forum, anybody who wants to can find his address on the jkp website (http://www.videoessentials.com/noteworthy_SamSungProj.php)

BTW: Jason & Dave, thanks for all the efforts by AVS on our behalf on this matter !

Brent

BTW: Jason & Dave, thanks for all the efforts by AVS on our behalf on this matter !

Brent

It's always a pleasure Brent. I'm sure Jason will report anything pertinent that he hears regarding these issues, as will I.

We just thank all of you for being so patient, understanding and most of all...great customers of A/V Science:)!!!

Hmmm bad news !

AVScience will don't sell the 710 anymore until Samsung fix this bug :eek:

Mine is on delivery (One in the last batch that avs will deliver). My body was in back order crew too and he was advised by AVS that they not sell it anymore and that they cancelled his order.

I was not anxious but now I start to be :(

Yes, unfortunately that's true. We are not selling any more of these until we are assured that the issues are resolved:(

Yes, unfortunately that's true. We are not selling any more of these until we are assured that the issues are resolved:(


Considering the premature lamp failures with the BenQ PE7700 took six months to resolve I wonder how quickly Samsung will act.... :confused: sooner than six months, I hope... :(

Yes, unfortunately that's true. We are not selling any more of these until we are assured that the issues are resolved:(


I really hope that Samsung notices this and gets that ball rolling. Thanks for having our backs, AVS.

There is no reason to try a replacement. There is now ample evidence that the replacement could also have the same startup issues. This is not a risk/hassle that the consumer should have to take on.

FWIW, both H710's I have tried were defective. One with the startup issues, one with optical issues.

Brent

Sorry to hear that Brent. That makes 2 of you (including romy) that have had two different units fail on you.

As for me, I accepted the replacement unit from Samsung and I am waiting for it to arrive, hopefully soon. I figure that either (1) I get lucky and they send me a good unit free of startup problems, or (2) by the time my replacement unit dies Samsung will have come forward with the right solution.

I know Samsung is still in the dark on this issue but hopefully through the efforts of the good people here at AVS and others they will be forced to deal with this. I am also hoping that they will eventually get the message as a large number of their customers who bought this unit begin to ask for replacements and refunds.

It's still the best PJ out there for the money when it starts.

John

I have a Feb. 2006 built unit with about 125 hours on it. No startup issues yet, I always check how long it takes to fire the bulb and start the color wheel and it seems consitent to me. Always just a few seconds. I hope I will be one of the lucky ones.

Steve

PS I hope Samsung steps up to the plate on this one. This projector is really terrific!

I guess I was one of the last ones to get a H710 shipment from AVS. Mine just arrived today. I have not set it up yet, but I will report back as soon as I do.

Robert

I guess I was one of the last ones to get a H710 shipment from AVS. Mine just arrived today. I have not set it up yet, but I will report back as soon as I do.

Robert

We are on the same boat !

Mine will arrive today or tomorow.

Yes, unfortunately that's true. We are not selling any more of these until we are assured that the issues are resolved:(

I ordered mine from Daniel at AVS about a month ago.
Does that mean I won't be getting it?

You'll have to contact Daniel about that. He should know which of his customers had a unit ship out and which ones need to decide whether they want to wait for the fix, switch to another projector, or just cancel their order.

He can be reached here via PM or email at daniel@avscience.com

I have a Feb. 2006 built unit with about 125 hours on it. No startup issues yet, I always check how long it takes to fire the bulb and start the color wheel and it seems consitent to me. Always just a few seconds. I hope I will be one of the lucky ones.

Steve

PS I hope Samsung steps up to the plate on this one. This projector is really terrific!

Dang Steve, you're right near me in E-town!!! If you ever have an issue with startup, etc. (I certainly hope not:eek:!!!), would you mind shooting me a PM or email and maybe I can shoot over there to witness what's going on?

UPDATE:
I have been in conversations with upper end management from Samsung. Units with a manufacture date of 5/22/06 have the fix in them. For those who got replacements, and are still having the issues, please double check those dates to confirm. Samsung is QCing all in house units right now and so with any luck, this will be put behind us. I have a unit with the proper date on it that just arrived. I am testing it out now and will report back any issues if I come across.

I found a few minutes last night to open the box and fire up my new H710. This was the first time in my life where I crossed my fingers and hoped all was well when I hit the power button for the first time on a new product! :eek:

The first thing I heard is somewhat hard to describe. Imagine back in the days when kids attached a playing card to their bike so the spokes could hit the card when the wheel rolled - sort of the cool motorcycle sound. Well, that was sort of the sound I was hearing and it was not so cool coming from a projector! :mad:

I left the unit on for several minutes and the sound seemed to go away but came back a little bit later on. Since I was testing the projector on a table-top, I decided to turn the projector upside down (like it would be for a ceiling mount) and try again. When I turned it back on, the sound was completely gone - and so far has never come back. So I am in a pickle right now - I can keep the projector and hope that sound was just something flaky that seated/corrected itself when I flipped the projector over or I can return it. The hard part is since AVS said they are not selling any more units until the issues are resolved, I probably can't get an exchange. I guess I will run it for a few days to see what happens.

Now, on the positive side - the image ROCKS! I am coming from a PLV-60 w/custom SMART calibration using a CCR30 filter. Boy, I really did not know what I was missing until I had the 710 up and running. The image was absolutely fantastic. Since I only had a few minutes, I hooked up my new Oppo 971 and did a quick calibration with GetGray, and then ran through the HQV tests. Popped in 5th Element and was absolutely delighted with what I saw. I switched to HD over cable and that also was excellent.

On another note - I purchased the Oppo 971 for the H710 to upconvert to native res of 720p. I was debating the 970 vs 971 and ended up going with the 971. However, I did not realize the H710 has a Faroudja DCDi deinterlacer (same as Oppo). I am not sure what scaler the 710 has, by I will be running some informal test to see how well the projector can deinterlace and scale 480i material versus the DVD player. I need to do some more testing with the Oppo and my current Panny RP-96.

Man, if Samsung could just get their act together around the quality issues then they could have a real winner here.

"Hello..... Samsung.... is this thing on??" ;)

Robert

Jason - Thanks for the update! I did not see your note until after I posted. Do we need to look for a specific date like "5/22/06"? All I saw on mine was "May 2006".

Robert

Confirming that Robert but I am 99% sure that if it says 5/06, it is the most recent run. They didn't have an early month run I believe.
Also likely with the original startup it may have been vibration. Please do keep me posted via phone or email since we both have recent units. I want to make sure this indeed is the fix and I need additional feedback.
By the way if it did die we would exchange it...I am merely holding on shipping new ones until the problem is resolved. :)

Jason,

First, thanks for your hard work and your willingness to go the extra distance. I said (even before you posted recently) that I felt safe having purchased from you, and you've now shown us why my statement was true.

Since I have an earlier unit that has been spared to date, I'm wondering if you could ask your Samsung contacts how Samsung will address any potentially late failures (e.g., beyond the original warranty period) related to this specific issue. When car manufacturers face a similar problem, they are usually good about recalling their products and issuing a warranty exception to cover known issues. I don't really want to exchange my apparently normal unit, but would hate to have a late failure and then have to depend on the generosity of a Samsung technical service rep who may not be aware of the history of this specific problem.

Thanks in advance for your response to this question, which I hope will be interesting to others in the same position that I am in.

KK

Jason, please confirm the method for identifying the 5/22/06 build date. Both I and 'moshmota' have "May 2006" units and cannot start the lamp after 10 hours. See posts #169 and #191.

BTW, my unit was shipped from Las Vegas on 5/23/06, so it seems unlikely it was built on 5/22/06...

Thanks!

Rich

Jason - I would like to follow up on KK's question to ask if you can ask your Samsung contacts how Samsung wants to handle pre-May H710's that already have the startup problem, eg:

- Send in for repair.
- Get a replacement through original dealer.
- Get a replacement directly through Samsung.

Also, it would be great if we could learn some more details on the root cause and fix for the problem. As I have posted previously, my H710 is waiting for a new "colour wheel". Presumably that is the complete colour wheel assemly. It would be comforting to know that, when this part arrives, it will bring me up to the equivalent of a "fixed" 5/22/06 unit.

Thanks,
Brent

kktx: We will take care of you and all our customers. We are working closely with Samsung on this so rest assured you will not be hung out to dry. :)
rhenschel: Thanks for the heads up. I already dropped a note to my contact to verify. It is a part of the serial number that determines when in May. I will know that part shortly. By the way, please email me your serial number so I can cross reference.
kiwishred: Who is your dealer? I cannot speak for other dealers policies unfortunately and I don't know what Samsung plans to do with older units. I do know that I am taking care of my customers regardless of when they bought it.

MORE INFORMATION:
Problem is officially known. It is a trigger harness for the lamp cover. What is happening is that in shipping, often times the relatively snug harness comes slightly loose and is causing the trigger to open. What this means is that the projector thinks the lamp door is open and thus it will not fire up. The fix, ultimately the newest batch as mentioned above having slightly longer cables such that the movement and bumping around of shipping doesn't cause them to come loose. In addition, the connectors are being tightened. So there is the cause for you techies who care. :) Now we have calculated on the order of about 20ish% failure with this problem. Does this mean that if you have had a unit for 2 months and it isn't failing it will start? Not likely. What it doesn't mean is that with this new fix, the problem will be gone. We have units in stock for replacements that currently missed the fixed batch (thus the reason some newly shipped units have the issue). However, a head Samsung engineer is personally going to come and QC all the stocked units. At that point, we are going to send our customers replacements and we should be good to go. Pending that does indeed take care of it (crossing my fingers), we will then resume shipping of the units for new orders.
NOTE: Please do NOT attempt to open your projectors. You will void the warranty and you will be on your own. It is NOT a simple fix despite how simple the problem sounds.

My test unit....13 hours and still running. I turn it on an off about every 1-2 hours.

kiwishred: Who is your dealer? I cannot speak for other dealers policies unfortunately and I don't know what Samsung plans to do with older units. I do know that I am taking care of my customers regardless of when they bought it.Well my problem is, unfortunately, it was not AVS. And, while I will not name them on an open forum, let's just say that I choose to go the repair rather than the return route partly to avoid having to deal with them again :eek:

FWIW, I will not make that mistake again when I finally get the projector situation sorted out and it comes time to upgrade my screen.

Brent

Excellent update Jason - thank you so much for all your hard work. I am really glad I bought through you guys. I will e-mail you my serial number for you to cross-reference to see if my unit is after 5/22 or not.

Good point on the vibration comment - I did have the projector on a simple card table with the a very padded top. :) I will be ceiling mounting tonight

Robert

Ah. I cannot say how Samsung is going to deal with them, but I would guess that it will be through repair most likely unfortunately. I'm actually exchanging my customers out of my stock to take care of them.

Jason, a follow-up question to KKTX's with regard to earlier units - are we looking at proactive replacement or replacement on failure?

Excellent work, Jason. Thank you very much for pushing Samsung to get to the bottom of the problem. I hope the guys who've had problem units (or two) can have a working unit to enjoy now. The 710 really is an excellent device.

MORE INFORMATION:
Problem is officially known. It is a trigger harness for the lamp cover. What is happening is that in shipping, often times the relatively snug harness comes slightly loose and is causing the trigger to open. What this means is that the projector thinks the lamp door is open and thus it will not fire up. Thanks for the update. I really hope that this is the fix and while, I hate to throw cold water on this, I have to say that I am a little perplexed that the problem can be this simple. Does it explain both the failure of the lamp to fully light and the bad colours problems ? Why sometimes one problem but not the other ? If the projector thinks that the door is open, why does the lamp come on (albeit weakly) at all ?

It would be great if someone can open their lamp cover, fire up their projector, and report what the symptoms are. Unless the lamp attempts to come on four times or so in about one minute before the red light starts flashing then I don’t think that this is the fix for the problems my unit has. But then perhaps there is more going on with this wiring harness than just the lamp cover interlock ?

It is great that AVS is taking great care of its paying customers (and even hangers on like me). However, it still seems that the onus is on Samsung to take care of customers who do not frequent this forum to take advantage of Jason’s extraordinary efforts. Like how about being proactive and contacting registered owners or, heaven forbid, following up on open repair tickets ? Hey, on the off chance that someone from Samsung service is reading this, how about starting with ticket #4000906247 :D

Brent

Well my problem is, unfortunately, it was not AVS. And, while I will not name them on an open forum, let's just say that I choose to go the repair rather than the return route partly to avoid having to deal with them again :eek:

Brent

I also didn't buy from AVS (and perhaps I should have). But I didn't have a problem getting my first projector replaced by Samsung after making a few calls and spending a total of about 2 hours on the phone with 5 different customer service reps.

I was somewhat surprised to see the replacement unit arrive today. It is a "May 2006" unit but don't know how to determine the exact date of the month. Here is something interesting though. Looking at the tag in the back of the unit (the same tag that shows the serial number) the first line says:

Model SP-H710AE [R]

By comparison my older unit that failed said:

Model SP-H710AE

The difference in the new unit is the appearance of the letter [R] in brackets. I don't know if that stands for "Repaired" or "Replacement" or maybe something else but I thought I would mention it in this forum.

Is there anybody else with a May 2006 built date that has the same [R] designation in his unit?

Most manufacturers use the "R" desigation for "refurbished". I hope you didn't recieve a refub for a defective new unit, but that wouldn't really fit with the May 2006 date of manufacture. Strange...

Maybe the R is "revised"

Hopefully it means revised.

John have you hit the info button on the remote to see if the lamp hours are at 0? Also how many day's did it take to get your new unit from Samsung?

Brent I have called my dealer Tuesday and in turn they called Samsung. What Samsung told them is to have me call Samsung directly and get it swapped through them.

I have still have not had any problems with mine but figured since a lot of others are. I would see what recourse I would have just in case I do have an issue. I have not got around to calling them yet, but if Jason and everybody are happy on the new batch I will be. I am sure they will come through for all of us.

Thanks Jason and everybody at AVS for your efforts on this issue. I agree it is in our own best interest to buy from you, if you have the product that we are wanting to buy. That way at least we have the comfort knowing we will be took care of. :)

Dale

Jason, a follow-up question to KKTX's with regard to earlier units - are we looking at proactive replacement or replacement on failure?
On failure. Remember that more than 65% of units are aokay.

Thanks for the update. I really hope that this is the fix and while, I hate to throw cold water on this, I have to say that I am a little perplexed that the problem can be this simple. Does it explain both the failure of the lamp to fully light and the bad colours problems ? Why sometimes one problem but not the other ? If the projector thinks that the door is open, why does the lamp come on (albeit weakly) at all ?

It would be great if someone can open their lamp cover, fire up their projector, and report what the symptoms are. Unless the lamp attempts to come on four times or so in about one minute before the red light starts flashing then I don’t think that this is the fix for the problems my unit has. But then perhaps there is more going on with this wiring harness than just the lamp cover interlock ?

It is great that AVS is taking great care of its paying customers (and even hangers on like me). However, it still seems that the onus is on Samsung to take care of customers who do not frequent this forum to take advantage of Jason’s extraordinary efforts. Like how about being proactive and contacting registered owners or, heaven forbid, following up on open repair tickets ? Hey, on the off chance that someone from Samsung service is reading this, how about starting with ticket #4000906247 :D

Brent
I by no means think this was handled well. But I do know that I'm not suprised, as with this high a failure rate, it would be overwhelming for any company. It is possible that there are other problems people are having that aren't as common. The trigger harness is the problem of the startup issue. I am by no means an engineer, so I don't know if this could also cause the color issues. I doubt it would be directly related, but it could be a side effect.