Just so folks can put your comment in context.... that' will be 27 out of hundreds right? or is it thousands?

Millions!

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g110/timsdd3/dp/drevil_finger_one_million_dollars01.jpg

I don't know if Comcast has millions of head-ends, but however many there are, 27 sure seems like a very small percentage of them! :)

TiVo Software rollout is due to start by end of April. Employees will get it first, then it will be made available to the public.

Is this for all OCAP markets?

I doubt anyone disagrees, but the question still seems to be how many are willing to pay ~$800 plus $12.95/mo for the Tivo interface. I don't know about Moto boxes, but I've had my 8300 for well over 2 years now, so I can't complain. Though I'd love more integrated features, the price is still too high and I'm not sure a stripped down version will be any solution. It's sure to attract users, but will there be enough? I won't make any changes until OCAP is fully in-play and I see what the market then brings to the table. Tivo is trying hard to capture an audience before all that happens and that is exactly what they should be doing. I beleive they plan to play in the OCAP market too, so things will really get interesting then. :)

More like $650 for the series 3 and $6.95 to $8.30 for the monthly fee. My S3 boxes cost me less than if I used the comcast box. With the new pricing structure from Comcast, they aren't charging me the extra $10 a month for connection to the S3 box. I'm paying per month my TiVo fee of $6.95 and $1.50 to Comcast for the two cable cards. This is the price I pay for each of my three S3 boxes. While if I had the Comcast DVR they would be charging me $11.95 per month and even if Comcast paid me $100 a month I wouldn't use their current DVR(Scientific Atlanta here)

More like $650 for the series 3 and $6.95 to $8.30 for the monthly fee. My S3 boxes cost me less than if I used the comcast box. With the new pricing structure from Comcast, they aren't charging me the extra $10 a month for connection to the S3 box. I'm paying per month my TiVo fee of $6.95 and $1.50 to Comcast for the two cable cards. This is the price I pay for each of my three S3 boxes. While if I had the Comcast DVR they would be charging me $11.95 per month and even if Comcast paid me $100 a month I wouldn't use their current DVR(Scientific Atlanta here)

Yes, but what sort of contract did you have to pay to get 6.95 Tivo?

And we are talking an average consumer, which would mean Comcast would charge you for the 6 cablecards you have and additional outlets. Some people are not being charged the additional 11.95 for Comcast, but only 5 for an additional box. All in all, when you take the average, the cost per month is similar.

While it may be cheaper for you to go the Tivo route per month, I can tell you that for me, it would be 1.50 per card for the first 2, then 11.95 + 3 for every additional box. With Comcast boxes, they are only charging me $5 per every DVR in the house.

They charge $11.95 for each Comcast DVR here(it used to be $9.95 but the new prices became effective March 1st.) and $1.50 for a device that uses two cables cards. Zero for a device that uses one cable card. They were charging $10 per outlet here but that dropped off with the new pricing structure just implemented here. I'm getting charged $10 once now for my connections.
For the TiVo I paid 3 years up front for the first box which averages $8.30 a month. The other two S3 boxes are $6.95 a month each with a 3 year commmitment.

(IIRC)
6.95 is the Digital Box fee
5 is the DVR fee
---
11.95

If you are being charged only 5 for the 'additional' DVR/box, that implies you are renting a non-DVR cable box too (for 6.95). With a TiVo S3, you can get red of that box too.

And I bet this 6.95 discount is a one-time thing that you likely negotiated through Comcast retentions or something ... not a valid comparison at all :) Everyone else pays 11.95 per DVR box (and in some franchises, 2nd onwards DVR boxes cost more - 17.95 IIRC!)

Yes, but what sort of contract did you have to pay to get 6.95 Tivo?

And we are talking an average consumer, which would mean Comcast would charge you for the 6 cablecards you have and additional outlets. Some people are not being charged the additional 11.95 for Comcast, but only 5 for an additional box. All in all, when you take the average, the cost per month is similar.

While it may be cheaper for you to go the Tivo route per month, I can tell you that for me, it would be 1.50 per card for the first 2, then 11.95 + 3 for every additional box. With Comcast boxes, they are only charging me $5 per every DVR in the house.


I'm on the same plan with my S3. $650 up front seems to be the going rate, as much as the anti-TiVo folk like to trot out the $800 MSRP. My TiVo service monthly fee is effectively $8.30/month, since I paid for 3 years of service for $299. Those folks with other TiVo's only have to pay $6.95/month since this would be a secondary box, not a primary one.

Comcast pricing is very regional, which makes direct out-of-region cost comparisons difficult.

Comcast pricing is very regional, which makes direct out-of-region cost comparisons difficult.

Exactly my point, I was just giving an example that in my particular area, the cost of Comcast DVR is very low, while the S3 route would be very expensive. And the feature difference is not worth the large cost discrepancy to me.

I get charged for cable package, then $5 for HD channels, $5 for the first DVR then $5 for the additional DVR I have. So grand total is package +15. Its not promotional or anything, all my neighbors get same pricing (thats how i found out i can get a second DVR for only $5, I was thinking it would be 12-17 like it was in Atlanta before we moved).

With an S3 I would pay up front 650 plus 300 for three years. Then I am locked into Tivo for 3 years, and the box is at my risk if it breaks or whatnot. So 950 up front plus whatever taxes and shipping. And add on top of it Cable price plus the 5 for Hd channels ( I am aware of OTA channels but ESPNs and Discovery and others make it worth it in my opinion) and 3 for 2 cablecards, then 11.95 for outlet fee and additional 3 for two more cablecards. So I would be at about 1900 upfront, and package + 23 and locked into it for three years with me bearing the risk of hardware to a certain extent.

The 8 dollar difference monthly lets me upgrade to the Tivo software when it rolls out and get similar functionality at a comparable cost. Except I get to invest the 1900 if I want and make some money over 3 years or take a vacation.

I'm on the same plan with my S3. $650 up front seems to be the going rate, as much as the anti-TiVo folk like to trot out the $800 MSRP.Probably because it's still $800 (plus tax) to walk into Best Buy and walk out with a TiVo S3. Online companies like WeaKnees have it for $650.

Question for you S3 owners: does Comcast charge the extra $5/month for HD service to the S3?

-- Don

Probably because it's still $800 (plus tax) to walk into Best Buy and walk out with a TiVo S3. Online companies like WeaKnees have it for $650.

Question for you S3 owners: does Comcast charge the extra $5/month for HD service to the S3?

-- Don

Here, then will charge you the 5 no matter what device you have.

And you are right as to the S3 price, it may be low with coupons or at certain sites, but on Tivo site, or at a B&M retailer its 800 plus tax. And thats where your average buyer will get it.

Here, then will charge you the 5 no matter what device you have.

And you are right as to the S3 price, it may be low with coupons or at certain sites, but on Tivo site, or at a B&M retailer its 800 plus tax. And thats where your average buyer will get it.

But I thought that the S3 was only being purchased by the lunatic fringe and/or the bleeding edge folks ? If that's the case, I would presume that they (of all people) would certainly know where to score an S3 for less than MSRP. Thus, I'd wager a large portion of S3 sales have been for less than MSRP. I know I was one of the lucky ones who got in on the Dell $550 deal, before they closed it up.

BTW, I get my Comcast HD channels based upon the analog/digital package that I have. No additional $5 fee for the privilege of watching HD.

More like $650 for the series 3 and $6.95 to $8.30 for the monthly fee. My S3 boxes cost me less than if I used the comcast box. With the new pricing structure from Comcast, they aren't charging me the extra $10 a month for connection to the S3 box. I'm paying per month my TiVo fee of $6.95 and $1.50 to Comcast for the two cable cards. This is the price I pay for each of my three S3 boxes. While if I had the Comcast DVR they would be charging me $11.95 per month and even if Comcast paid me $100 a month I wouldn't use their current DVR(Scientific Atlanta here)
I was giving semi-serious thought to replacing my main Comcast HD DVR box with an S3 - until I remembered one small little detail that is going to affect a sizable number of people:

The last time I looked, the S3 will not support Video On Demand.

(I am also under the impression that, even when (although "if" may be more appropriate) CableCARD 2.0 comes out, allowing bidirectional communication, the S3 won't be able to support it. How correct is this?)

Does anybody out there have both a Comcast box (not necessarily HD or a DVR) for PPVs/VOD as well as an S3 connected to the same outlet? How much extra is it, and how well does it work?

-- Don

I was giving semi-serious thought to replacing my main Comcast HD DVR box with an S3 - until I remembered one small little detail that is going to affect a sizable number of people:

The last time I looked, the S3 will not support Video On Demand.

(I am also under the impression that, even when (although "if" may be more appropriate) CableCARD 2.0 comes out, allowing bidirectional communication, the S3 won't be able to support it. How correct is this?)

Does anybody out there have both a Comcast box (not necessarily HD or a DVR) for PPVs/VOD as well as an S3 connected to the same outlet? How much extra is it, and how well does it work?

-- Don

I have both. Hate the 6412. Everything works fine though - Comcast's billing system is still in flux in my area (Adelphia acquisition) - but they charge me an Additional outlet fee (4.95) for the TiVo and that includes the rental for ONE cablecard, but the second costs me 1.95 extra. So under $7 extra to use the S3, as opposed to 16.95 or so for the Moto 6412 DVR. 6.95 for the DVR and 9.95 for the digital features/box (or vice versa). In theory, the digital fee should be waived since they're on the same outlet and used with the same TV (their website used to say CableCard lessees were eligible for a free digital box)

The S3 currently doesn't do PPV, and the 6412 does (but I don't use it - I have Netflix, and in a pinch, Amazon Unbox!). TiVo hasn't said anything concrete (although the general interpretation is it won't work) about the possibility of a simple software-only update allowing 2-way cards to work on existing S3 units. I could either have adopted a holding pattern and wait-and-see attitude but I couldn't tolerate the darn Moto 6412, so I bought the S3 :)

I was giving semi-serious thought to replacing my main Comcast HD DVR box with an S3 - until I remembered one small little detail that is going to affect a sizable number of people:

The last time I looked, the S3 will not support Video On Demand.

(I am also under the impression that, even when (although "if" may be more appropriate) CableCARD 2.0 comes out, allowing bidirectional communication, the S3 won't be able to support it. How correct is this?)

Does anybody out there have both a Comcast box (not necessarily HD or a DVR) for PPVs/VOD as well as an S3 connected to the same outlet? How much extra is it, and how well does it work?

-- Don

If you can hold out, wait til the Tivo software rolls out for the Moto boxes in April/May. Then you may be able to get a better feeling. From the looks of it, it will essentially be just like Tivo, with VOD support since its using the Moto box. It may not get MRV and TTG , but then again they are not available on the S3 yet either.

If you can hold out, wait til the Tivo software rolls out for the Moto boxes in April/May. Then you may be able to get a better feeling. From the looks of it, it will essentially be just like Tivo, with VOD support since its using the Moto box. It may not get MRV and TTG , but then again they are not available on the S3 yet either.

According to folks in the know and folks at Comcast, only 27 headends will support the TiVo software in the first half of the year, on a test basis, and for employees only. It may be a longer wait than you project!

According to folks in the know and folks at Comcast, only 27 headends will support the TiVo software in the first half of the year, on a test basis, and for employees only. It may be a longer wait than you project!

Well thats too bad. I though they had said by April employees will get it and then in May users. Here, Comcast techs said they are getting trained in March and use for them in April ( I assume this is the employees only rollout?). If all goes well, we may well see it in the next few months. But you are correct, we dont know anything concrete, and Comcast is not the most spry company... and it all varies by region anyway. But as soon as some people get it we will get a good idea of its capabilities. If you jump the gun on an S3 you are locked in if you pay for 1-3 years in advance.

I was giving semi-serious thought to replacing my main Comcast HD DVR box with an S3 - until I remembered one small little detail that is going to affect a sizable number of people:

The last time I looked, the S3 will not support Video On Demand.

(I am also under the impression that, even when (although "if" may be more appropriate) CableCARD 2.0 comes out, allowing bidirectional communication, the S3 won't be able to support it. How correct is this?)

Does anybody out there have both a Comcast box (not necessarily HD or a DVR) for PPVs/VOD as well as an S3 connected to the same outlet? How much extra is it, and how well does it work?

-- DonI've heard that Comcast will give you a free non-DVR box for VOD & PPV if you use cablecards. I don't understand why you ask how well it works. It works the same as any other cableco provided box does with VOD.

- Mike

Here, then will charge you the 5 no matter what device you have.

And you are right as to the S3 price, it may be low with coupons or at certain sites, but on Tivo site, or at a B&M retailer its 800 plus tax. And thats where your average buyer will get it.


Here in San Jose if the S3 is the only cable outlet you use, and if you are subscribed to a digital package, then there is no extra cost for S3 besides the $1.5/month for the second cable card. If you only have limited basic, Comcast charges $5 for HD package. If you have other cable box, they will charge you $6.95 for additional oulet.

Anybody else get a software update, or something that slightly changed the look and feel of the Comcast DVR (no it is not the TIVO software)? I now have a "my recordings" section with two other folders, whereas prevoiusly I only had two folders (one containing shows, the other scheduled recordings). The menu also changed slightly (DVR is now spelled out). Otherwise, it is pretty much the same as before.

Anybody else get a software update, or something that slightly changed the look and feel of the Comcast DVR (no it is not the TIVO software)? I now have a "my recordings" section with two other folders, whereas prevoiusly I only had two folders (one containing shows, the other scheduled recordings). The menu also changed slightly (DVR is now spelled out). Otherwise, it is pretty much the same as before.

Yes most users are getting updated iguide software and firmware updates.

Iguide: version 74.53

F/W: version 16.35

Yeah, the new guide version is great. For all the details of what's changed go here:

http://www.comcast.com/newguide

I still will be subscribing to Tivo Service the day it becomes available. Can't wait! I'm like a little kid waiting for Christmas morning :-)

Yes most users are getting updated iguide software and firmware updates.

Iguide: version 74.53

F/W: version 16.35

So does that mean that most users across the country will be getting this, or just those in Pennsylvania? I ask because here in Anne Arundel Co., MD, we're still on firmware 12.31 and the original guide. Everytime I see the new message light come on I get my hopes up... but so far no dice. :( What I'm looking forward to the most actually is just the progress meter for On-Demand content.

Thanks.

Just called Seattle Comcast call ctr and unfortunately they dont know if our market is included in the new i-guide rollout or not. it woudl be a nice interim step before the tivo interface. it seems like seattle is always low on the priority list. Aw, shucks. :(

Everytime I see the new message light come on I get my hopes up... but so far no dice. :( What I'm looking forward to the most actually is just the progress meter for On-Demand content.

Thanks.

Every time I see the new message light come on I expect a message about Comcast phone service or the addition of a new Spanish channel. :rolleyes:

Every time I see the new message light come on I expect a message about Comcast phone service or the addition of a new Spanish channel. :rolleyes:

All I see is "Comcast Now Hiring!" messages.

Any word on if this update removed the super-duper-annoying popup telling me that a scheduled recording has finished?

wow... thought everyone had this update by now.

s/w 74.53-3321
f/w 16.20

Is what I have ...

74.53 -3321
FW: 16.35

I wonder what the firmware and software versions will be for TIVO?

74.53 -3321
FW: 16.35

I wonder what the firmware and software versions will be for TIVO?
I don't expect the firmware version to change, as it's my understanding that's Motorola's code (the only reason it might change is if a firmware update is necessary to provide the tools required for the Tivo application). The software version will be completely different and show no resemblance whatsoever to the I-Guide version.

Just called Seattle Comcast call ctr and unfortunately they dont know if our market is included in the new i-guide rollout or not. it woudl be a nice interim step before the tivo interface. it seems like seattle is always low on the priority list. Aw, shucks. :(

Washington State Comcast users use the Microsoft Guide. I don't think any Comcast uses the IGuide at all in WA State.

I did see Verizon Fios is using Firmware 17.28 on the QIP-6416. I wonder if this has any issues whatsoever with HDMI? I also wonder if this build, almost an entire major version number greater than what I have on Comcast now, works on the regular 64xx/34xx. Perhaps it includes the extra vod ip / moca stuff. So what happens when Comcast expires all of the numbers within 16.xx? They gonna skip 17. (since verizon has it) and jump to 18.xx?

See they skipped all of the numbers between 12 and 16. Where was firmware 13.xx, 14.xx, or 15.xx ? Heck, I had firmware 9.19 and now I have 16.35. Talk about a huge jump in version numbers!

Hello everyone
This is my first post on AVS. I just received the new update. To mck024, I too was looking for the red message light but the update occurred without any notice.

As I checked out all the new features, I realized that I hadn't received the "Comcast Central" part in the new menu. I checked the software and firmware and it does match with the new update. Can someone please let me know if my update is working correctly?

Thanks!

Hello everyone
This is my first post on AVS. I just received the new update. To mck024, I too was looking for the red message light but the update occurred without any notice.

As I checked out all the new features, I realized that I hadn't received the "Comcast Central" part in the new menu. I checked the software and firmware and it does match with the new update. Can someone please let me know if my update is working correctly?

Thanks!
The existence of Comcast Central seems to be site-specific (some locations have it, while others don't). I have the latest software (74.53) and there is no Comcast Central here.

The existence of Comcast Central seems to be site-specific (some locations have it, while others don't). I have the latest software (74.53) and there is no Comcast Central here.

Weird.... if you hit Guide twice ... you don't have a little "home" icon on the far left?

Weird.... if you hit Guide twice ... you don't have a little "home" icon on the far left?
There is a home icon on the left side, but it is labeled "Main Menu." Hitting it just goes to the main menu, with the current channel in the upper-right box. No references to "Comcast Central" anywhere. It's functionally identical to pressing Menu twice. This is how it has always worked, even in the previous software version.

I'm not misunderstanding anything, am I?

No Comcast Central here outside of Phila either it seems.

Shame too:

"A view of multiple TV shows, each in its own window. As you highlight each window you will hear the audio from that show. Select a window to tune to that channel full screen. "

Sounds cool.

Washington State Comcast users use the Microsoft Guide. I don't think any Comcast uses the IGuide at all in WA State.

Actually in southern WA. (Clark County) we have iGuide. Only Northern WA uses the MS guide.

I apologize if this has been answered before, but I can't seem to find it in any of the posts.

I'm currently a 8+ year DTV customer, but I'm so fed up with their new DVR, that I'm thinking of switching to Comcast to get my TiVo back. I spoke with a rep at Comcast last night and he told me that later this year, TiVo will be coming out with a fully integrated Comcast-TiVo that will basically be an S3 TiVo and Comcast receiver in one box. You'll be able to get VOD without an external box.

Anyone know if this is different from wha's being talked about in this forum, or was the guy at Comcast mistaken?

Thanks =)

This is what were talking about, but who knows when it is really coming and in what areas, or how good it will really be, but expectations are high if TiVo is putting their name on it (at least they are high on my end)

If Comcast is trying to integrate the TiVo software with theirs then why would they still be updating the existing software/firmware. Even though both formats will be available, why waste time/resources in updating the existing software if it already works? I understand if they're fixing bugs but why bother to add new features at this time?

If Comcast is trying to integrate the TiVo software with theirs then why would they still be updating the existing software/firmware. Even though both formats will be available, why waste time/resources in update the existing software if it already works? I understand if they're fixing bugs but why bother to add new features at this time?

Iguide will be the basic DVR service software

TiVo will be the Deluxe DVR service software (more $$$ per month)

Both will be in place. You will have to add the TiVo Comcast DVR service to your account, and it will cost you about $5.00 more then the basic DVR service per month.

Iguide will still be the main DVR software for most subscribers. That's why it is still getting new versions of the software put out there. Not to mention it will soon be replacing all of the SA 8300 series SD & HD & HD DVR STB current Software.

Thanks scanpa!
That was my general understanding until you mentioned the SA Explorer 8300. This is the first time I've ever heard of this box.

[Iguide will still be the main DVR software for most subscribers. That's why it is still getting new versions of the software put out there. Not to mention it will soon be replacing all of the SA 8300 series SD & HD & HD DVR STB current Software.]

Are you saying that Comcast is also planning to release a new STB and if so would you know of a time frame?

Thanks scanpa!
That was my general understanding until you mentioned the SA Explorer 8300. This is the first time I've ever heard of this box.

[Iguide will still be the main DVR software for most subscribers. That's why it is still getting new versions of the software put out there. Not to mention it will soon be replacing all of the SA 8300 series SD & HD & HD DVR STB current Software.]

Are you saying that Comcast is also planning to release a new STB and if so would you know of a time frame?

The SA STB are used in some areas instead of the Motorola STB. They currently use a software called SARA, Comcast is currently porting the IGUIDE software from the Motorola STB, to the SA STB.

Comcast TiVo Software will also be ported later in the year to work on SA DVR STB.

The SA STB are used in some areas instead of the Motorola STB. They currently use a software called SARA, Comcast is currently porting the IGUIDE software from the Motorola STB, to the SA STB.

Comcast TiVo Software will also be ported later in the year to work on SA DVR STB.

Is Comcast still planning on introducing the Panny STB's?

Is Comcast still planning on introducing the Panny STB's?


Mid to late Summer 2007, there still working on the EPG for this STB.

Also Due out soon in some Comcast Markets, are the PACE SD & HD DVR's.

And Comcast will begin to deploy the Motorola DCH series of STB.

All of these have there own threads. Check them for updates.

Mid to late Summer 2007, there still working on the EPG for this STB.

Also Due out soon in some Comcast Markets, are the PACE SD & HD DVR's.

And Comcast will begin to deploy the Motorola DCH series of STB.

All of these have there own threads. Check them for updates.


Do any of these use different IR codes for the remote, so that two Comcast boxes can be deployed in the same room?

Do any of these use different IR codes for the remote, so that two Comcast boxes can be deployed in the same room?

The Motorola DCT, QIP, DCH STB series & the Pace DVR STB series all use the same single IR code set.

I have no info on the panasonic yet.

Do any of these use different IR codes for the remote, so that two Comcast boxes can be deployed in the same room?
Supposedly they don't, which REALLY SUCKS, big time.
:rolleyes:

FNA Comcast, GET ON WITH IT!!!!!

Let's not forget that Microsoft has a 6% stake in Comcast. That is one BIG reason why those of us in the WA area have the Microsoft guide instead of the I-Guide.

Forgive me for not reading through the entire (long) thread (though I did read about 10 pages of it!), but I can't figure something out: is this "ComcasTiVo" software going to be available for the Scientific Atlanta 8300HD DVR also, or just the moto boxes? My area offers only the SA8300HD DVR's, which I want anyway since I can use an external hard drive to expand its storage, but I am curious as to whether I'll be able to get this TiVo upgrade later. Thanks guys.

Yes. The first port is for Moto boxes and then there will be one for SA boxes, the only question is when the SA port will be done.

Yes. The first port is for Moto boxes and then there will be one for SA boxes, the only question is when the SA port will be done.

Great, thanks for the clarification :).

I live in the Boston area. So I went to my local Comcast office yesterday to switch out my 64xx Phase II for a Phase III (just in case Comcast 'surprised' everyone with an early release) - they swapped it out for a 3416. In the past, the women (who've worked there seemingly forever) have nailed when new "stuff" was going to be released and according to them, the Tivo/DVR functionality isn't going to be released until the end of '07 at the earliest. That's a lot different than the midQ2-end Q3 which the Comcast rep on the phone told me.

That's not good news... :(
Looks like I'll be making that call to FIOS now then. They just flyer'd our neighborhood last week and I looked at the package prices. I think I'll save about $200 a year over Comcast and that's before Comcast pile on extra charges for the Tivo software.
I couldn't wait for ever for Tivo to bring HD DVR to maarket and I'm not going to wait for ever for them to bring their software to Comcast. How long's it been now since the deal was signed..?
I don't watch masses of TV and the few shows I do want in HD are available from many places. HDTV is becoming a commodity now in my mind - I'll shop on price. FIOS can do multi room with their DVRs too...

I agree, the only problem for me is that FIOS is not available in my town. I was looking (up to about an hour ago) at buying an S3, but with the potential/probable problems with SDV on the immediate horizon, I don't want to waste (imo) my money on the S3.

FIOS is available in my town, but won't serve the less affluent neighborhoods away from the town center.

The Tivo press release from yesterday said that the service is coming "soon to a sizeable market" and even for Cox "later this year". I think its a matter of where you live, as at least here, the techs I spoke with said we should see an employee rollout in April and hopefully consumer in May if all goes well, and they had training in March already.

The Tivo press release from yesterday said that the service is coming "soon to a sizeable market" and even for Cox "later this year". I think its a matter of where you live, as at least here, the techs I spoke with said we should see an employee rollout in April and hopefully consumer in May if all goes well, and they had training in March already.


What Tivo press release? I looked all over their site and found nothing - are you sure of a PR yesterday??? Do you have a link please?

What Tivo press release? I looked all over their site and found nothing - are you sure of a PR yesterday??? Do you have a link please?

Not a PR, but an analyst conference by Tivo CEO, in conjunction with the quarterly reports.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/television/news/e3i28b18d2074be11c93583658831835aa4

Im looking for the PR part of it... I read it yesterday sometime... but Firefox does not keep my history.

That's not good news... :(
Looks like I'll be making that call to FIOS now then. They just flyer'd our neighborhood last week and I looked at the package prices. I think I'll save about $200 a year over Comcast and that's before Comcast pile on extra charges for the Tivo software.
I couldn't wait for ever for Tivo to bring HD DVR to maarket and I'm not going to wait for ever for them to bring their software to Comcast. How long's it been now since the deal was signed..?
I don't watch masses of TV and the few shows I do want in HD are available from many places. HDTV is becoming a commodity now in my mind - I'll shop on price. FIOS can do multi room with their DVRs too...

Hold on there sparky! I have FIOS TV now, had Comcast before I moved.

FIOS is not the panacea you're hoping for. Read through the FIOS Moto master topic and you'll see what I mean:

- No HD video on demand
- Multi-room DVR has many problems, including NO HD between rooms
- no 30 second skip on remotes, no tuner swapping
- can't adjust starting and ending times on recordings

I personally see all kinds of artifacting while watching, and as I recently posted in the above mentioned forum, the delayed viewing of a recording in process kicks you out when it ends, driving me bonkers!

I'll be keeping my FIOS internet, but going back to Comcast with their 'dump the dish' deal for $29.99 for a year...

Hold on there sparky! I have FIOS TV now, had Comcast before I moved.

FIOS is not the panacea you're hoping for. Read through the FIOS Moto master topic and you'll see what I mean:

- No HD video on demand
- Multi-room DVR has many problems, including NO HD between rooms
- no 30 second skip on remotes, no tuner swapping
- can't adjust starting and ending times on recordings

I personally see all kinds of artifacting while watching, and as I recently posted in the above mentioned forum, the delayed viewing of a recording in process kicks you out when it ends, driving me bonkers!

I'll be keeping my FIOS internet, but going back to Comcast with their 'dump the dish' deal for $29.99 for a year...

Does this mean that there really is no place where the grass is truly green? We all seem to operate under the delusion that the other company is better. I guess they are just different in their problems.

Thanks, I'll stick with Comcast.

Does this mean that there really is no place where the grass is truly green? We all seem to operate under the delusion that the other company is better. I guess they are just different in their problems.

Thanks, I'll stick with Comcast.
I know someone who used to work for Primestar (a now defunct satellite TV service) and for TCI/AT&T/Comcast cable. When she was at Primestar, they received one of those customer satisfaction awards and starting an advertising campaign centered around it. She said that the other cable/satellite companies must really suck at customer service, because Primestar wasn't that good at it.

You do tend to think the other guys are doing a better job than they actually are. You always seem to be "stuck" with the worst of the crop, not realizing that the competition has its own share of issues to deal with.

...and according to them, the Tivo/DVR functionality isn't going to be released until the end of '07 at the earliest. That's a lot different than the midQ2-end Q3 which the Comcast rep on the phone told me.

Good grief! This is ridiculous. I should have just bought that S3 for Christmas... :mad:

The reps I have talked to don't even know about the possibility of the service, so who knows what is accurate.

Good grief! This is ridiculous. I should have just bought that S3 for Christmas... :mad:

They're available now for $599 at the TiVo Community Store : HERE (http://store.tivocommunity.com/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=EA&Product_Code=2777&Category_Code=)

That's not good news... :(
Looks like I'll be making that call to FIOS now then. They just flyer'd our neighborhood last week and I looked at the package prices. I think I'll save about $200 a year over Comcast and that's before Comcast pile on extra charges for the Tivo software.
I couldn't wait for ever for Tivo to bring HD DVR to maarket and I'm not going to wait for ever for them to bring their software to Comcast. How long's it been now since the deal was signed..?
I don't watch masses of TV and the few shows I do want in HD are available from many places. HDTV is becoming a commodity now in my mind - I'll shop on price. FIOS can do multi room with their DVRs too...

If you have FIOS, their system seem to work with Tivo S3.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=331329

Finally got updated to 16.35 here in Anne Arundel County, MD. About time :)

I wish Comcast would just release the TiVo software to the public. I mean the beta version can't be any worse that the Comcast box is now. Hopefully the wait will be worth it.

I wish Comcast would just release the TiVo software to the public. I mean the beta version can't be any worse that the Comcast box is now. Hopefully the wait will be worth it.

+1, ad nauseum. :mad:

I just got done deleting several series recordings because this steaming pile of feces can't figure out what a repeat is. Also, I was watching a live but buffered show yesterday and when a recording came up, BAM it's toast.
NO SHOW FOR ME! Tivo keeps the buffer until it runs out but this thing just vaoporizes it. Weak.

Or how about the YOUR RECORDING IS COMPLETE tag that stays on the screen forever, as if we really NEED to know that.

In the past, the women (who've worked there seemingly forever) have nailed when new "stuff" was going to be released and according to them, the Tivo/DVR functionality isn't going to be released until the end of '07 at the earliest. Don't believe it.

Don't believe it.

Ken, do you know something we don't? :)

Ken, do you know something we don't? :)

If he does, he can't say so ;). Considering his member status, he might, though :).

CMON TiVo software!

I hope he does know something more than them because it would stink having to wait that long for the functionality!

Ken, do you know something we don't? :)

I certainly hope so. This box is driving me insane.

Ken, do you know something we don't? :)
He may just know that one should never assume that the CSRs know anything beyond what is already public knowledge. The next time a CSR tells me something about "future" plans that's accurate will be the first time.

Oh, you newbies. When Ken H. speaks, it's pretty much the word of God (at least when it comes to all things AV).

So, will this TiVo software look and function basically like a "real" TiVo S3 box, or is it going to basically be the Tivo name and not have the substance to back it up? Also, anyone have any idea on cost? $5/mo.? $10? $15? Thanks! Finally, on boxes like the SA8300HD which allow for eSATA hard drives to be attached, would that functionality be enabled still once this TiVo upgrade is done?

So, will this TiVo software look and function basically like a "real" TiVo S3 box, or is it going to basically be the Tivo name and not have the substance to back it up?Take a look for yourself:

http://www.tivolovers.com/Photos/CES2007/

Thanks! Finally, on boxes like the SA8300HD which allow for eSATA hard drives to be attached, would that functionality be enabled still once this TiVo upgrade is done?There is no Tivo software upgrade coming for Scientific Atlanta DVRs in 2007. This year, only Motorola DVRs will get the Tivo software upgrade.

Scientific Atlanta DVRs may get the upgrade in 2H 2008.

they have yet to begin the port of the TiVo Software to the SA platform, they hope to have it started by end of year.

they have yet to begin the port of the TiVo Software to the SA platform, they hope to have it started by end of year.

Is it really a port or more of building hardware support into the OCAP version they are building for the Moto boxes?

"There is no Tivo software upgrade coming for Scientific Atlanta DVRs in 2007. This year, only Motorola DVRs will get the Tivo software upgrade."

"Scientific Atlanta DVRs may get the upgrade in 2H 2008."

Based on similar info as this, I just purchased an Apricorn 500GB DVR Xpander external drive (at $199 it's a bargain compared to direct technology $349) for my SA 8300HD, which has SARA firmware and DOES have an active eSATA port unlike what they were telling me. This should tide me over until Comcast do the upgrades for SA boxes.

I swear I have got a different answer form Comcast every time I've called. I was weighing up whether to get a TIVO S3 or wait for the comcast tivo upgrade when I signed up for Comcast after moving house. I opted for the later but really miss the tivo functionality that I had with my DirectTV HR10-250 (balcony no longer faces SW so no more DirecTV).

CSR have no idea what is happening with the upgrade and told me that I will know sooner than them when Comcast make a public announcement.

"There is no Tivo software upgrade coming for Scientific Atlanta DVRs in 2007. This year, only Motorola DVRs will get the Tivo software upgrade."

"Scientific Atlanta DVRs may get the upgrade in 2H 2008."

Based on similar info as this, I just purchased an Apricorn 500GB DVR Xpander external drive (at $199 it's a bargain compared to direct technology $349) for my SA 8300HD, which has SARA firmware and DOES have an active eSATA port unlike what they were telling me. This should tide me over until Comcast do the upgrades for SA boxes.

I swear I have got a different answer form Comcast every time I've called. I was weighing up whether to get a TIVO S3 or wait for the comcast tivo upgrade when I signed up for Comcast after moving house. I opted for the later but really miss the tivo functionality that I had with my DirectTV HR10-250 (balcony no longer faces SW so no more DirecTV).

CSR have no idea what is happening with the upgrade and told me that I will no sooner than them when Comcast make a public announcement.
i just called and they stated my port is not active. since you said they told you the same thing but yours was in fact active, is there a way to find out if my port is active before buying the expander?

i just called and they stated my port is not active. since you said they told you the same thing but yours was in fact active, is there a way to find out if my port is active before buying the expander?

Not in my experience. As below, I suggest you purchase an Xpander and then return it if it doesn't work (Apricorn allow that). There's a way to confirm you have SARA firmware on it by holding down the SELECT button and waiting for a 'mail' icon to appear and then pressing INFO and then you'll see SARA referenced (if it says Passport you're out of luck but as far as I know Comcast uses SARA).

Basically, when I first called up a CSR asked a tech friend of hers that happened to be passing by and she said he was very experienced and gave me the thumbs up for both SARA firmware and an active eSATA port. When I called the other day it was just to double-check and they (different CSR and techs) said SARA firmware but said the port was not active. I'm like "HUH???". So, when it comes down to it you have to do what I did, which was buy it on spec that you can return it (in my case with Apricorn withing 14 days) for a full refund. But to my pleasant surprise it works! Good luck!

I swear I have got a different answer form Comcast every time I've called.That's probably because this isn't a public offering, yet. Once the offering is available to be purchased, in our area, that's when we can expect the CSRs to be providing consistent and accurate information about it.

That's probably because this isn't a public offering, yet. Once the offering is available to be purchased, in our area, that's when we can expect the CSRs to be providing consistent and accurate information about it.

I agree regarding when the TIVO option becomes available, but when they're talking about the current equipment they should know (even if they read of a list) what it can and cannot do. There was never a clear answer on whether the eSATA port was active, etc.

Same situation: You're not getting a consistent answer about eSATA probably because it isn't a public offering, yet. Once the offering is available to be purchased, in our area, that's when we can expect the CSRs to be providing consistent and accurate information about it.

Same situation: You're not getting a consistent answer about eSATA probably because it isn't a public offering, yet. Once the offering is available to be purchased, in our area, that's when we can expect the CSRs to be providing consistent and accurate information about it.

SA 8300HD boxes have been out for a long time with eSATA ports on the back and Comcast supply them to their customers. They should know the product they lease to us including whether the eSATA port is active or not since they say it's OK if I plug and external drive in it (they just can't support the external drive since it's not their hardware). the port itself is their hardware.

No cableco supports external drives. Therefore, they really don't care if the ports are active or not. There is little doubt the engineers know, but that doesn't translate to CSRs knowing. CSRs only know how to follow their checklists when troubleshooting supported stuff. If they did any more than that, they'd end up doubling their workload because everyone here would then be calling them for answers. Much cheaper to let us experiment and educate ourselves. Even if and when they offer external drives, support will still be limited to what they offer, so we really aren't any worse off. :)

SA 8300HD boxes have been out for a long time with eSATA ports on the back and Comcast supply them to their customers.The eSATA ports are unsupported, just like the FireWire ports on the DCT64xx/DCT34xx boxes. I do not believe it is reasonable to expect tech support to support unsupported features. That would defeat the purpose of those features being unsupported, eh?

No cableco supports external drives. Therefore, they really don't care if the ports are active or not. There is little doubt the engineers know, but that doesn't translate to CSRs knowing. CSRs only know how to follow their checklists when troubleshooting supported stuff. If they did any more than that, they'd end up doubling their workload because everyone here would then be calling them for answers. Much cheaper to let us experiment and educate ourselves. Even if and when they offer external drives, support will still be limited to what they offer, so we really aren't any worse off. :)


Well, I agree to a point especially that CSRs are unlikely to know everything. What I insisted on each time I asked that question about the eSATA port was for the CSR to ask an engineer. The first time I got a positive answer that the port is active, then when I called last week to double-check, the TECH SUPPORT CSR asked two engineers who both said the eSATA port is inactive, so go figure. I totally agree and have confirmed through this experience that we have to experiment ourselves, which is why I went ahead and purchased the Apriorn external drive, and low and behold it works.

The eSATA ports are unsupported, just like the FireWire ports on the DCT64xx/DCT34xx boxes. I do not believe it is reasonable to expect tech support to support unsupported features. That would defeat the purpose of those features being unsupported, eh?

I was directed by Comcast to speak with Scientific Atlanta, who also say on thier website that SA 8300HD boxes allow external drives via the eSATA port but that we should ask our cable company for a list of drives they support. Of course, Comcast don't have a list of drives they support. Comcast allow customers to plug in an external drive they just don't support it, and yes, in that sense they don't support the eSATA port, but it would be nice and reasonable if they could give a consistent answer. If they don't support it they should stop there and not offer an answer at all. At least Scientific Atlanta explained the technical aspect of it that it is a setting in the firmware and the the default setting is ACTIVE and Comcast would have to have deactivated it so he said the only way to try is plug one in a see because in all likelihood it would work, which is what I did and it does work.

I was directed by Comcast to speak with Scientific Atlanta, who also say on thier website that SA 8300HD boxes allow external drives via the eSATA port but that we should ask our cable company for a list of drives they support.And that should be enough information for you, IMHO. You asked the CSR, they didn't have any information for you about that, end-of-story. <shrug> You can rag on them if you wish, but it will still be unfair to do so IMHO.

And that should be enough information for you, IMHO. You asked the CSR, they didn't have any information for you about that, end-of-story. <shrug> You can rag on them if you wish, but it will still be unfair to do so IMHO.

From what you say I should just give up all hope of having a decent service from Comcast and finding a good storage solution compared to what the internal drive offers, and "not speak until spoken to". What I don't understand is why you are going out of your way to be antagonistic. Perhaps you work for Comcast. I'm done with this conversation.

From what you say I should just give up all hope of having a decent service from Comcast and finding a good storage solution compared to what the internal drive offers, and "not speak until spoken to". What I don't understand is why you are going out of your way to be antagonistic. Perhaps you work for Comcast. I'm done with this conversation.

Yeah, he goes out of his way to lend support to "poor little" Comcast...

To lead a happier life, just add him to your Ignore List like the rest of us.

Yeah, he goes out of his way to lend support to "poor little" Comcast...

To lead a happier life, just add him to your Ignore List like the rest of us.


Good idea, thanks PS, by the way, since I'm new to this forum, how do I access the ignore list?

I'll respond here, rather than PM, since it's likely more people than just yourself may want to do so... :)

Hit "User CP" up at the top of the page.
Along the left hand side of the new page, hit the link for "Buddy / Ignore Lists".
You'll be presented with a Buddy List, and an Ignore List. Enter the offending user's handle to the Ignore List, and hit "Update Ignore List".

Thanks for the info, Paul. I've also wanted to figure out a way to ignore Mr. Comcast for a while now.

From what you say I should just give up all hope of having a decent service from Comcast and finding a good storage solution compared to what the internal drive offers, and "not speak until spoken to".Not at all. Rather, you should not expect CSRs to know anything more than the services you have been actually been offered by the company.

What I don't understand is why you are going out of your way to be antagonistic. Perhaps you work for Comcast. I'm done with this conversation.I don't work for Comcast. Comcast would give you some fluffy, feel-good response. I'm giving you reality. I'm sorry you choose to interpret it as antagonistic.

Yeah, he goes out of his way to lend support to "poor little" Comcast... I go out of my way to keep some balance in these discussions, especially when people go off the deep end with wildly self-centered and unfounded expectations. People come to online forums for information that helps them better enjoy their options, not just to stew in a muddle of self-pity.

Folks, I rarely do this, but though bicker MAY be confrontational, he makes a lot of good points. You can Ignore him, that's your prerogative, but IMO you'd miss out on not just some good information, some less single-minded-TiVo-certified-nut responses (that includes my ilk, I guess!), as well as some entertaining dsicussions :)

Bicker - if you ever tell anyone I supported you, albeit backhandedly, you're in trouble :)
Carry on!

Do I even need to say his message gets totally lost in his approach? What would be useful is if he/she takes a look at themselves in the mirror! :confused:

Only for those who are pre-disposed to ignore the message anyway.

Ashu: You have my word.

Scanpa-

Any update on comcast/tivo download availability? Are we still on track for the end of the month?

Scanpa-

Any update on comcast/tivo download availability? Are we still on track for the end of the month?I know folks on several boards are anxious to know where the 13 selected head-ends getting the update will be...

It's not like Comcast doesn't have a VAST and eager beta test pool... :confused:

The trouble is the ones who provide us with internet service seem to make the least of it. If you think about it, we shouldn't even need AVS. Comcast and others ought to have their own support forum and should be active in it.

It's not like Comcast doesn't have a VAST and eager beta test pool... :confused:Uh.... You may want to read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_end

It's everyone or no one.... in a neighborhood. So while you might be willing to deal with system failures in return for getting an early look at newer functionality, your neighbors may not.

We got Comcast Central now. Is there anyway to customize the channels that are shown?

We got Comcast Central now. Is there anyway to customize the channels that are shown?
No. They are actually a form of OnDemand-like functionality. Each 'page' is a single channel with multiple audio channels. As you move the cursor, it selects the right audio, and also knows which channel to change to if you select it.

Uh.... You may want to read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_end

It's everyone or no one.... in a neighborhood. So while you might be willing to deal with system failures in return for getting an early look at newer functionality, your neighbors may not.

I did read it, and your post makes no sense...using your logic, that means when Comcast launches the Tivo software EVERYONE on a particular head end will be forced to use Tivo software, or NOBODY on the head end gets it? No, obviously it will be an option.

Somebody out there is beta testing. My point was that they might be able to pick up the pace and add more beta testers (even if just to appease their core proponents) since it is assumed that most subscribed to this thread want the damn software already, even if it is in beta mode.

I think the misunderstanding comes from thinking about the Tivo software as being different from the software Comcast uses now. Though different in features, etc., it complies with the underlying head-end operating system just like SARA or Passport or whatever Comcast uses. That should mean it can be released to individual users just like different versions of SARA are selectively released for testing, etc. This is NOT the same software that runs on Tivo hardware.

I think the misunderstanding comes from thinking about the Tivo software as being different from the software Comcast uses now. Though different in features, etc., it complies with the underlying head-end operating system just like SARA or Passport or whatever Comcast uses. That should mean it can be released to individual users just like different versions of SARA are selectively released for testing, etc. This is NOT the same software that runs on Tivo hardware.

That's assuming there will be absolutely no changes to the head end hardware and/or controller software -- the "stuff" that's common to both interfaces. I would suspect (although I have nothing to back this up) that there will be some changes/updates to the existing common hardware/software in order to deploy the new Tivo software to those customers that want it. If this is the case then it will affect all customers on the head end...even those who don't get the Tivo software.

I think the misunderstanding comes from thinking about the Tivo software as being different from the software Comcast uses now. Though different in features, etc., it complies with the underlying head-end operating system just like SARA or Passport or whatever Comcast uses. That should mean it can be released to individual users just like different versions of SARA are selectively released for testing, etc. This is NOT the same software that runs on Tivo hardware.
Perhaps my understanding is incorrect, but I was under the impression that the TiVo software would replace Passport, SARA, iGuide, or whatever else and run on the OCAP layer exposed by the lower level firmware.

That's assuming there will be absolutely no changes to the head end hardware and/or controller software -- the "stuff" that's common to both interfaces. I would suspect (although I have nothing to back this up) that there will be some changes/updates to the existing common hardware/software in order to deploy the new Tivo software to those customers that want it. If this is the case then it will affect all customers on the head end...even those who don't get the Tivo software."Affect" is not a term I'd use. While there MAY be hardware/software updates to the head-end, those already happen all the time without affecting customers. Until they convert to OCAP, I seriously doubt any major changes to the head-end will be needed to support the Tivo port and the only users who will know anything changed will be those subscribing to the ported Tivo software. This whole process is quite different from the hardware/software needed to support Moto vs SA boxes, etc. Where they convert from Moto to SA support, quite a few hardware/software changes are required at the head-end. And it isn't even close to saying that ALL subscribers will have to use the ported Tivo software, it's simply not an all or nothing deal.

Perhaps my understanding is incorrect, but I was under the impression that the TiVo software would replace Passport, SARA, iGuide, or whatever else and run on the OCAP layer exposed by the lower level firmware.Tivo will be an extra-cost option, over and above what is already being paid for the DVR/recording service. Estimates have run from $3-$10, though there is nothing to support any specific amount. There is also nothing that says the ported Tivo software will provide FULL Tivo functionality and all Tivo's features. Of course, all of this is pure speculation since there has been very little info provided by Tivo or anyone else since the initial announcements.

Tivo will be an extra-cost option, over and above what is already being paid for the DVR/recording service. Estimates have run from $3-$10, though there is nothing to support any specific amount. There is also nothing that says the ported Tivo software will provide FULL Tivo functionality and all Tivo's features. Of course, all of this is pure speculation since there has been very little info provided by Tivo or anyone else since the initial announcements.

Well it wont have full capabilities like TivoTo go and whatnot, but what really counts, stuff like a better guide, the wishlist features and the fine details will be there.

What also counts is reliability and predictable results from setting up season passes, wish lists and individual recordings.

OK so WHEN will we be getting the option to use Tivo software?

OK so WHEN will we be getting the option to use Tivo software?

Mid to late 2006... (http://www.pvrblog.com/pvr/2005/03/comcast_and_tiv.html) :rolleyes:

I've heard that Comcast has kicked back the software to TiVo for fixes.

Here in Oregon Verizon is rolling out fiber-optic based services to compete head to head with Comcast. It seems they'll provide voice, internet, and video. In other markets their prices are a bit lower than Comcast for comparable services. Comcast might be able to promote TIVO as an advantage of their service to retain customers (if they'll get off their duffs and deploy it).

I did read it, and your post makes no sense...using your logic, that means when Comcast launches the Tivo software EVERYONE on a particular head end will be forced to use Tivo software, or NOBODY on the head end gets it? No, it means that everyone on the head-end will be subject to the software updates applied to the head-end, which are needed to support the TiVo software.

I would suspect (although I have nothing to back this up) that there will be some changes/updates to the existing common hardware/software in order to deploy the new Tivo software to those customers that want it. If this is the case then it will affect all customers on the head end...even those who don't get the Tivo software.Bingo.

I've heard that Comcast has kicked back the software to TiVo for fixes.
It probably wasn't broken enough to meet Comcast standards .... :D

I stand by my prediction that the Comcast Tivo will hit the streets the day after Duke Nukem Forever appears.

YMMV

It probably wasn't broken enough to meet Comcast standards .... :D

I stand by my prediction that the Comcast Tivo will hit the streets the day after Duke Nukem Forever appears.

YMMV
:D

They're saying this year possibly for DNF to be released ;) Link (http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/774/774650p1.html)

Tivo's 10K says release by June 30th or risk deal termination:

http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1088825/000119312507081563/d10k.htm

"...development and deployment of the TiVo service software solution is targeted to occur by June 30, 2007 or such later date as the parties may agree..... In the event we fail to deliver either the TiVo service software solution and/or advertising management system to Comcast or Cox by the agreed upon deadlines, our agreements with Comcast and/or Cox could be terminated ...."

Advertising management system is targeted for Feb 2008.

Hmmm ... Advertising management system. Stop wasting your time, customers don't want to pay extra money for more ad's. It's already a pain in the ass that we have to see them in the I-Guide. An ad-less guide is one of the big reasons to get the Tivo update.

I've been seeing more ads on Tivo interface. FWWI, I don't really mind the one that's added to the options at the end of a show: delete, don't delete, advertisement. Most of the time I don't even notice it because it's completely unobtrusive to my normal remote clicking sequence. Sometime I wonder what the ad is if I skipped it, just curious. The iGuide ads on the otehr hand are really in your face and annoying, especially when they cover up one line of guide data and you can't get rid of them.

Face it, if we are going to keep getting cheap TV content, we're gonna have to deal with ads one way or another, DVR or not. I'd rather let Tivo do it than those idiots running ads on Comcast system now.

Also if you want to keep the little guy like Tivo alive, try tolerate some of the better placed ads. Otherwise Tivo go belly up. And without competition from little guys like Tivo, we end up having to eat whatever system Comcast shoves down our throat, and they will.

Hmmm ... Advertising management system. Stop wasting your time, customers don't want to pay extra money for more ad's. You've got it backwards. The question is whether customer want to pay extra money for less ads. I bet, "no, they're not." And evidently Comcast agrees.

Well the Tivo guide costs more. I am willing to pay more for an ad-less guide. Not only that, the Tivo guide looks much nicer. And I think I counted 7 lines of program information. That's slick, along with the nicer much more graphical color schemes.

There is a small glitch on my 6412p2 with 16.35 firmware. You can squish the ad just a tiny bit. If only they would give us our 6th row back! To do this

Go into the guide
Now press My DVR
Go to My Recordings
Push Last twice.

It's only a slight visual defect, but it goes to show you, they could of instituted ad's without taking away from the guide, if they would of just used a single line instead of a double line.

i don't think the tivo guide will come with any "no ad" guarantees...

jtm

Indeed. I expect ads to find their way into the stand-alone TiVo guide, as TiVo continues to struggle financially.

Tivo's 10K says release by June 30th or risk deal termination:

"...development and deployment of the TiVo service software solution is targeted to occur by June 30, 2007 or such later date as the parties may agree..... In the event we fail to deliver either the TiVo service software solution and/or advertising management system to Comcast or Cox by the agreed upon deadlines, our agreements with Comcast and/or Cox could be terminated ...."

Advertising management system is targeted for Feb 2008.

The report also says this:

"We began engineering trials with Comcast during fiscal year 2007 and expect both Comcast and Cox to begin initial deployment of their TiVo-enabled DVR solution during our fiscal year 2008."

and this:

"In addition, we expect that Comcast and Cox will begin to promote and deploy TiVo-branded DVR software to their subscribers during fiscal year 2008. "

The report also says this:

"We began engineering trials with Comcast during fiscal year 2007 and expect both Comcast and Cox to begin initial deployment of their TiVo-enabled DVR solution during our fiscal year 2008."

and this:

"In addition, we expect that Comcast and Cox will begin to promote and deploy TiVo-branded DVR software to their subscribers during fiscal year 2008. "

But do we know when the Comcast and Cox fiscal years begin? Many companies begin their fiscal year on July 1. Using that scenario, the fiscal year 2008 begins July 12, 2007 and ends June 30, 2008. The US government begins its fiscal year on October 1 and ends on September 30.

Tivo's fiscal year end was 1/31/2007

But do we know when the Comcast and Cox fiscal years begin?Doesn't really matter when Comcast / Cox fiscal years are. Tivo is reporting (and expecting) events based on their own fiscal years.

For Tivo, fiscal year 2007 was Feb 1, 2006 - Jan 31, 2007 ... which should make fiscal year 2008 Feb 1 2007 - Jan 31 2008. Then again, they also often specificy "fiscal year ending January 31, 2008" (as opposed, for example, to fiscal year beginning February 1, 2008) instead of the more generic "fiscal year 2008".

Also, OEM's usually receive payments from the distributor on a quarterly basis. So if the fees are going from the customer to Comcast and then to Tivo, Tivo may not start seeing income until after a full quarter of availability.

Actually I have complained so many times to Comcast about this tips on the guide. I noticed that my DVR locked up this morning, and now after a manual reboot, I noticed there is an option now in the guide setup to turn the message notice off!

Wrong! It came back after the full download.

Thanks for the tip. I turned mine off...now if they can turn off the moronic "Your Recording is Now Finished" or whatever it says.

The Hardware is in place, Comcast is awaiting deployment of the finalized 1st. production run of the Comcast - TiVo software, Hopefully soon, as there almost 1 year behind the initial deployment schedule.

Actually I have complained so many times to Comcast about this tips on the guide. I noticed that my DVR locked up this morning, and now after a manual reboot, I noticed there is an option now in the guide setup to turn the message notice off!

New software version is 74.53

I turned this off and I still see tips for reminders and stuff. I wish I had that last line of the guide back.

I turned this off and I still see tips for reminders and stuff. I wish I had that last line of the guide back.

I believe the option is to turn off the (nuisance) red LED light on the front panel that reminds you that there is a message to be read. MAIN MENU>MESSAGES

The Hardware is in place, Comcast is awaiting deployment of the finalized 1st. production run of the Comcast - TiVo software, Hopefully soon, as there almost 1 year behind the initial deployment schedule.

You can say that again. I can't take this pretender any longer! I had to delete SEVERAL episodes of a repeating show this morning even though the "series recording" has been set up to only keep 3. Why even bother with that option if the DVR won't do it?!

This is really strange becaue it was gone earlier and I was so happy, but it is back this afternoon after the full download I guess

I am at the point where I am getting fed up w/Comcast, and I just cant stand to look at these ads at the bottom of the guide anymore. Is anyone else considering a switch to DTV or DISH?

I hope the fact that we have the comcast central feature means we'll get Tivo as soon as it's available. Can't believe it's taken this long.

The Hardware is in place, Comcast is awaiting deployment of the finalized 1st. production run of the Comcast - TiVo software, Hopefully soon, as there almost 1 year behind the initial deployment schedule.

Hardware is in place at all headends? Or just those that are doing the 'beta' run?

I am at the point where I am getting fed up w/Comcast, and I just cant stand to look at these ads at the bottom of the guide anymore. Is anyone else considering a switch to DTV or DISH?Trading off Comcast's minor annoyances for DirecTV's or Dish Network's more serious ones? Uh, no. My mother taught me never to cut off my own nose to spite my face.

Trading off Comcast's minor annoyances for DirecTV's or Dish Network's more serious ones? Uh, no. My mother taught me never to cut off my own nose despite my face.
That ia a rather vague statement. Would you care to elaborate a bit?

Specifically, provide examples of "more serious ones."

One important consideration: Comcast here is different from Comcast there. The satellite companies are the same everywhere, except for details of the local channels they provide.

My mother taught me never to cut off my own nose despite my face.
Your mother needs to double-check her cliches, then.

I personally consider HD-Lite to be one of the most serious annoyances possible. Also, some folks might consider the fact that both DirecTV and Dish Network are closed systems (no support for customer-owned DVRs, for example) to be very serious annoyances. Check the satellite forums for more.

That ia a rather vague statement. Would you care to elaborate a bit?

Specifically, provide examples of "more serious ones."

One important consideration: Comcast here is different from Comcast there. The satellite companies are the same everywhere, except for details of the local channels they provide.
The grass is always greener. Sure, people are contemplating such a switch. But plenty of satellite people are contemplating a switch to cable.

HD on cable generally (note I said "generally") looks better. (OTA looks better still, though, and my D* DVR will record OTA; Comcast will not.) On the other hand, as bad as it is I find D* customer service to be better. Dish customer service was...odd. Not better, not worse, just...odd. At one point they wouldn't let me upgrade to a DVR because I was in the middle of a commitment. Bizarre.

D* locks you in for 2 years; Comcast doesn't lock you in at all. But if you are a multi-DVR household, D* is probably cheaper, and not just by a little. (Switching to Comcast would cost me about $40/month extra right now.)

Lots of pros and cons on both sides. YMMV.

The grass is always greener. Sure, people are contemplating such a switch. But plenty of satellite people are contemplating a switch to cable.And that demonstrates something that many consumers overlook. Just switching back and forth does nothing but pave the way for you to get poorer service, not better service. If you stick with a service provider, you can learn more quickly how to capitalize on the service they do provide. I have made contacts with the folks who fixed problems I have had and who have worked through issues I encountered, so now I go right back to those people and skip a few levels of support, saving me significant time.

HD on cable generally (note I said "generally") looks better. Isn't it a shame how we have to say things like "note I said 'generally'" due to how often people flame you as if you said "always" regardless of what you actually said? :rolleyes:

D* locks you in for 2 years; Comcast doesn't lock you in at all.Wow. That's a big one I missed.

Lots of pros and cons on both sides. YMMV.If there was a tremendously big difference between the various choices, it would mean something was horribly broken. The whole point is that the choices available may vary, but the relative values are reflected in the prices, so consumers are always faced with, overall, a decision between only marginally-different options. You can often make your decision based on peculiarities of the various offerings that make one or the other better FOR YOU, but if you "use everything equally" then you'll generally (note I said "generally":rolleyes: ) do just as well flipping a coin.

Trading off Comcast's minor annoyances for DirecTV's or Dish Network's more serious ones? Uh, no. My mother taught me never to cut off my own nose despite my face.
seriously? :eek:

it's "to spite"

Maybe the nose is the best feature of the face. :rolleyes:

it's "to spite"That's what I thought, too, and had it that way to start, but did a Google search to check and changed it to "despite" because most of the links I found had it that way. I should have paid more attention to Mom (though as likely as not she had it wrong too :)).

Mom is never wrong :D

The Hardware is in place, Comcast is awaiting deployment of the finalized 1st. production run of the Comcast - TiVo software, Hopefully soon, as there almost 1 year behind the initial deployment schedule.

Many thanks for the updates, Scanpa. It's much appreciated!

That's what I thought, too, and had it that way to start, but did a Google search to check and changed it to "despite" because most of the links I found had it that way. I should have paid more attention to Mom (though as likely as not she had it wrong too :)).That's funny. I just entered "To Spite", google recommended "To Spite Your Face", and the first page of results all contained "To Spite Your Face". I then entered "Despite Your Face" and got only one result questioning that phrase in another forum. Obviously, you had it right the first time. FWIW, I noted the gaff right after it was posted and decided to let it go since I was fairly sure everyone would know what you meant. But, being AVS, I should have known better. ;)

The grass is always greener. Sure, people are contemplating such a switch. But plenty of satellite people are contemplating a switch to cable.

HD on cable generally (note I said "generally") looks better. (OTA looks better still, though, and my D* DVR will record OTA; Comcast will not.) On the other hand, as bad as it is I find D* customer service to be better. Dish customer service was...odd. Not better, not worse, just...odd. At one point they wouldn't let me upgrade to a DVR because I was in the middle of a commitment. Bizarre.

D* locks you in for 2 years; Comcast doesn't lock you in at all. But if you are a multi-DVR household, D* is probably cheaper, and not just by a little. (Switching to Comcast would cost me about $40/month extra right now.)

Lots of pros and cons on both sides. YMMV.
One of the most important factors when considering "jumping ship" is to be sure you understand your "starting point."

As a DirecTV customer with 2 SD DirecTiVo's and 2 HD DirecTiVo's, I too am not thrilled about HD Lite and the upcoming transition of non-OTA HDTV programming from MPEG-2 to MPEG-4.

But, here is my starting point:

I watch and record mostly OTA HDTV programs on my HD TiVo's, so HD Lite is something I don't see much. When I do watch/record satellite HD programs like Planet Earth on Discovery and some concerts on HDNet, I usually end up archiving those to anamorphic widescreen DVD's, so HD Lite essentially disappears in that "down rez to 480i" process.

I have Lifetime DVR service from DirecTV, and I am not in any contract right now since I purchased all of my equipment well before the leases and 2-year commitments started. Of course I do have sunk costs here, but in each case I bought during some kind of promotion to minimize cost at the time.

I will likely ADD an HR-20 DirecTV DVR when HDTV programs I want to see appear only on MPEG-4 from DirecTV. I expect to pay little or nothing for the dish upgrade and the "replacement" DVR, which is also covered by my Lifetime DVR no-fee service. At that point I might shut off one of the SD DirecTiVo's to hold the monthly cost down.

One of my SD DirecTiVo's travels with us in our RV from time to time, when we know one or more of our destinations lacks adequate OTA or cable TV service. We really like to keep up with news, weather and sports, although we can and have used the radio for some of that. But, without satellite radio, we are often out of range of radio stations.

In comparison, for me to move to cable would require a complete changeoout from reliable and user-friendly TiVo-based equipment to the local Comcast version of the Motorola boxes, which here use the Microsoft application software (at least for now). The Comcast prospects could get much better once the TiVo version of the Motorola boxes becomes available, but there still may be issues with limited hard drive space.

It is clear to me that, for the most part, my scenario is unique to me and my current equipment and services. What makes sense for me does not apply to anyone else unless they have the same scenario and preferences as mine.

This is truly a case of your mileage WILL vary, and generalizations cannot fit all user scenarios.

One generalization that does apply is that Tivo rules, and the software on the Moto box is the suck.

I've had both DirecTV and Comcast within the past two years (and I had the services overlapping for a while). They both have their advantages and significant drawbacks. I live in an area where DTV doesn't offer locals and it's next to impossible to get many channels with an antenna (I've tried many roof mounted antennas; I live in a valley and haven't had much luck with anything but a few SD channels with any of the antennas).. This means that even if I have DirecTV, I still need Comcast with a box for any of my HD locals (approx $20/month). Because of this DTV didn't save us any money.

As to pic quality, in our area, it's not close -- DTV's HDlite is noticeably inferior to Comcast's HD channels. SD channels are about the same here. I have to agree with Bicker1 here.

Where DTV won hands down for me was the equipment -- the DTV Tivo boxes run circles around the Moto boxes. I had two SD DirecTivos and an HDDirecTivo -- never once did it miss a recording, lock up and need to be restarted, record the same episode multiple times for a series recording, and the guide data was better.

I've found the service to be different in different ways. The phone support for DTV was better (the reps were actually trained and could help you quickly with DTV); however, in my area, DTV contracts service personnel to come to your house to install new equipment, and they were a mixed bag. With Cocmast, the phone reps generally aren't very helpful (they send their magical reboot signal and that's about it); however, the techs who have come to my house have been well-trained and very helpful.

Overall, I decided to stay with Comcast waiting for the Tivo software to be released.

That's funny. I just entered "To Spite", google recommended "To Spite Your Face", and the first page of results all contained "To Spite Your Face". I then entered "Despite Your Face" and got only one result questioning that phrase in another forum. That just goes to show that AVS Forum folks know their colloquialisms better than the average poster on the web (or at least ones that Google knows about). :)

One generalization that does apply is that Tivo rules, and the software on the Moto box is the suck.No question the TiVo is better, but I've come to appreciate the Motorola boxes and the software on them. I'll surely check out the TiVo software when it is introduced, but will likely use that as an excuse to have two boxes in house for a few weeks, after which I'll return one or the other -- the TiVo software will have to overcome some of the problems with the Motorola box itself, in order for it to be worth a significant price premium, and it isn't clear to me how many of those problems can be overcome by software alone, so the TiVo software simply may not be worth it.

No question the TiVo is better, but I've come to appreciate the Motorola boxes and the software on them.

What do you appreciate about it?

That's not meant to be a smug baiting reply, but I really find there is very little to appreciate about this software. Maybe i'm missing something.

I can only think of ONE thing the Moto box does that the Tivo does not, and that is a dedicated button to skip ahead a day in the guide. The Comcast-Tivo remote will have that feature, though. Aside from that, I've found absolutely NOTHING to truly appreciate about the hardware/software combination. It's adequate. That's as good as I can describe it.

Of all the things that they both do, most of them the Tivo does many times better or faster.

I can only think of ONE thing the Moto box does that the Tivo does not, and that is a dedicated button to skip ahead a day in the guide. The Comcast-Tivo remote will have that feature, though. Aside from that, I've found absolutely NOTHING to truly appreciate about the hardware/software combination. It's adequate. That's as good as I can describe it.

Of all the things that they both do, most of them the Tivo does many times better or faster.

Yup. As someone who's had the luck (misfortune?) of using the Moto 6412, SA 8300 and TiVo S3 all within the past two years, there's a world of difference between these boxes.

The Moto also has that big-ass "On Demand" button if you're into the VOD thing. The day +/- button is also kind of nice, but by no means a deal-breaker against TiVo.

Both the Moto and SA have the picture-in-picture thing going on, which can be both nice and a curse (try to avoid seeing the score of the game while you're navigating the menus). I don't miss it on the TiVo.

That said, the Moto is far better than the SA. The recording options aren't that bad. The biggest problem I had with the box was that the menus are VERY hierarchical and force you to traverse many tree depths to get to what you want. It could be simplified and make the use of the box far easier.

The SA is such a steaming pile, it's not even funny.

I've used a Series 2 TiVo for 5 years, and recently switched to the Moto 3416 when I got my HDTV ("recently" as in last October). While I much prefer the TiVo interface, the only deal-breaker feature now missing from the Moto box (other than extra disk space) is the auto-recording wishlist. I can't think of anything else that I absolutely need that's missing. I need some way to tell this DVR to record all Mets games that are in HD, no matter which channel is showing them.

Things that would nice to have include the recording history and tick marks in the playback bar.

...and tick marks in the playback bar.
There are tick marks on there. I think you hit the right arrow to go to them.

I think what he means is the ability to FF directly to the tick marks while FF'ing.

I think what he means is the ability to FF directly to the tick marks while FF'ing.

Yes. I would like to hit one button (or two buttons) and FFWD 15 minutes ahead. On TiVo, you hit FFWD, and then skip to tick. Hit it three times and you're 45 minutes into an hour show.

There are no tick marks on my Motorola, but I'll confess that I haven't tried to skip to the invisible marks.

The Passport software does that, but there's absolutely no indication in the UI that it can be done.

There are tick marks on there. I think you hit the right arrow to go to them.

I have no tick marks, and the right arrow does the same thing as FF.

Both the Moto and SA have the picture-in-picture thing going on, which can be both nice and a curse (try to avoid seeing the score of the game while you're navigating the menus).

Do you mean to say that you have true picture-in-picture, and are able to look at both tuners at once? On a Comcast Moto? I wish I could do that with mine!

Do you mean to say that you have true picture-in-picture, and are able to look at both tuners at once? On a Comcast Moto? I wish I could do that with mine!

Nope. Poor choice of wording on my part. "Picture in Menu" is probably more accurate. You're able to watch live TV whilst navigating the menus. Not sure exactly why you'd need to be able to do so, but there it is.

What do you appreciate about it?Picture quality is absolutely excellent. The DVR has never failed to record something (unlike my TiVo, which on occasion failed to switch channels correctly). The user-interface is easy to use. The FF and REV capabilities are a great convenience. I love the fact that it can record two programs at once. The integrated VOD capability is another good feature. I also appreciate having an online program guide.

Picture quality is absolutely excellent

That's one of my problems with this box. When doing a comparison vs. using the cable card, the picture is not as good coming out of the Motoroloa box.

The integrated VOD capability is another good feature

I fully agree with this one, nice thing is with TivoComcast we won't be losing it.

The DVR has never failed to record something (unlike my TiVo, which on occasion failed to switch channels correctly). The integrated VOD capability is another good feature.

Failure to record is one of my biggest gripes with this box. We had DirecTivos for over three years without a failure to record. In the little over a year that we've had a Moto 6412 (or 6416), we have all kinds of recording issues (guide not updated to reflect programming changes, the DVR not recording a program because it erroneously reports that it is out of space, recording a show without sound). I just swapped my 6412 out with a 6416 two weeks ago based on the recommendation of a Comcast Tech who was at our house a few weeks agao. Last Thursday, the new 6416 failed to record one of the few shows I consider must watch (The Office) because it said that it was full and unable to record. When I noticed the error message, I checked to see how it coul dpossible be full since I only knew of recording about four shows on it; it turns out that it was reporting that only 29% of the drive was being used. Who in the heck knows why it thought it was full and didn't record, but I now how to wait until summer to see this episode. Recording the very few shows that I care about with a minimum of annoyances is the main reason that I care to have a DVR -- and the 641x just doesn't handle that reliably for the majority of people I know (nor does it appear to do so for the majority of folks who post here).

Regarding the VOD, I agree. That's one of the best features of the 641x.

That's one of my problems with this box. When doing a comparison vs. using the cable card, the picture is not as good coming out of the Motoroloa box. It may be where you live, but if you lived here, I'd tell you to get a different box. The PQ I get from my 3416 is every bit as good as the PQ I get OTA.

Failure to record is one of my biggest gripes with this box.And actually that was the #1 reason we returned our Series 3. Our Motorola box never let us down, but we could not get the S3 to work reliably within the time period TiVo allowed for returns. Maybe they should extent the NQA return policy to be 30 days after everything works right for a full week in a row.

(guide not updated to reflect programming changesThat happens to me even on my TiVos -- very frustrating when I was relying on the TiVos, but it got me into the habit of cross-checking the scheduled recordings every so often, especially when I know there's been a program change. I subscribe to thefutoncritic.com and get email notifications whenever there is a programming change for any of the programs I watch. It often prompts me to set up manual recordings (on both my Motorola DVR and my TiVos).

recording a show without soundI never had THAT problem on my TiVo, but did have problems where it would record a show without video.

The Passport software does that, but there's absolutely no indication in the UI that it can be done.


That's because it's not a feature. It 's more of a hack/only known to people who vist the avs site.

ajwees41

Have I already mentioned that I don't believe bicker's story about the S3 failing to record :p
The only way I can imagine an S3 failing tor ecord something is if you give it bad Guide data or specify the wrong lineup during Guided Setup.

Unheard of, except from a user with a username that reflects his propensity to be arguing ;)

But all this leads to some interesting discussions, so it is tolerable :)

Have I already mentioned that I don't believe bicker's story about the S3 failing to record :p
The only way I can imagine an S3 failing tor ecord something is if you give it bad Guide data or specify the wrong lineup during Guided Setup.

Unheard of, except from a user with a username that reflects his propensity to be arguing ;)

But all this leads to some interesting discussions, so it is tolerable :)


The only other reason is if the cable cards loose signal.

Agreed.

None of which are TiVo-blame-worthy - but the final one is a justifiable reason for an S3 return :)

I just feel bad for the few folks who live in areas where the initial CableCard implementation/rollout/setup was so awful that they had to give up on their S3s and are now forced to live with a Motorola (or - worse - an SA!). But wrong thread :)

Failure to record is one of my biggest gripes with this box. We had DirecTivos for over three years without a failure to record. In the little over a year that we've had a Moto 6412 (or 6416), we have all kinds of recording issues (guide not updated to reflect programming changes, the DVR not recording a program because it erroneously reports that it is out of space, recording a show without sound).
I had the "wouldn't record because it claimed it was full" problem as well, but when I changed all of my scheduled recordings from "Keep Until I Delete" to "Keep Until Space Needed", I have not had this problem, so I just assumed there was a software glitch involving the box trying to calculate how much space was needed for all of my "keep until I delete" recordings, figuring there wasn't enough room, and then reporting the space used as 100% until I deleted something.

Also, while I've never had recordings without sound, I have had the sound drop out on occasion (and not come back until I changed channels), so it may not be a recording software problem, in which case even a change to TiVo software may not solve it. (Then again, my problem may be unrelated - I have heard that it is an HDMI port problem, but that shouldn't affect the sound on a recorded show.)

-- Don

Have I already mentioned that I don't believe bicker's story about the S3 failing to record :p
The only way I can imagine an S3 failing tor ecord something is if you give it bad Guide data or specify the wrong lineup during Guided Setup.

Unheard of, except from a user with a username that reflects his propensity to be arguing ;)

But all this leads to some interesting discussions, so it is tolerable :)

Actually my Father-in-law returned his S3 for this reason. It was failing to record some shows or cutting off some shows. He doesn't have cable, only OTA, so no cable cards were involved. Seems there were problems with the tuners blanking out on some units whenever the mpeg stream had a glitch. Don't know if it was ever fixed by Tivo, but he returned within the 30 day window.

vegggas

Actually my Father-in-law returned his S3 for this reason...He doesn't have cable, only OTA, so no cable cards were involved.

Big buck S3 but no sat/cable provider? Why? :eek: Seems like a total waste of money.

Big buck S3 but no sat/cable provider? Why? :eek: Seems like a total waste of money.

Well some people live in areas with lots of high quality OTA channels and an unfriendly cable company who is unwilling to help out with cable cards...

Hmm, more power to 'em, but from where I'm at, it's like buying a Ferrari to get groceries.

Flat rural area with large land parcels = No cable within several miles, but plenty of OTA available (no interest in sat).
He watches many of the primetime shows, but goes to bed by 7:00PM (work related schedule) so he got an HD DVR to go with his new HDTV's. His VCR's didn't look so good on the new displays, but he still uses them now that the Tivo was returned. :confused:

vegggas

Picture quality is absolutely excellent.

HD is excellent. SD sucks.

The DVR has never failed to record something (unlike my TiVo, which on occasion failed to switch channels correctly).

Mine has.

The user-interface is easy to use.

It's non-intuitive and awkward.

The integrated VOD capability is another good feature.

I wouldn't know. Comcast keeps promising this in my area but so far, zilch.

I also appreciate having an online program guide.

which only lists 5 channels per screen plus an ad, is often wrong (new vs repeat shows), and gets dumped if the box loses power.

Hmm, more power to 'em, but from where I'm at, it's like buying a Ferrari to get groceries.

'cept those groceries are naturally grown and unadulterated (very apropos analogy - considering a lot of cable headends destroy HD quality - of course not quite to the same terrible extent as D* and E*).

There is MORE than enough HD on OTA digital channels - especially if you're in a large metro area, near another large metro area! And the S3 is easily the most elegant, cost-effective solution for this situation (too)!

Hmm, more power to 'em, but from where I'm at, it's like buying a Ferrari to get groceries.

One way to get home before the icecream melts... :D

Have I already mentioned that I don't believe bicker's story about the S3 failing to record :pSome folks love to live in fantasy, and as Stuart Smalley would say, "that's okay" Ashu. You're "special". :)

The only other reason is if the cable cards loose signal.Or if the system is not designed robust enough to be reliable.

In reality, that was the problem I encountered with the Series 3. Check out the Series 3 threads both here and on TCF and you'll see that there were a number of folks that could not get digital cable to work reliably.

Seems there were problems with the tuners blanking out on some units whenever the mpeg stream had a glitch. Don't know if it was ever fixed by Tivo, but he returned within the 30 day window.What really annoyed me is that the tech support folks at TiVo refused to acknowledge this, and even today I suspect they still refuse to .

HD is excellent. SD sucks.The SD through my Motorola 3416 is actually better than I get through my TiVo Series 2.

Isn't this thread supposed to be about news about the launch of the Comcast/Tivo DVR?

Don't most of the comments lately belong in other threads?

Throw stones at me if you like, but can we stay on topic here?

Is is Comcast TiVO software being tested in any markets??
Is there any "real" information on when it will begin to arrive to regular Comcast subscribers?

nash,

There are very few posts in this whole thread that are on topic, mostly because there is so little news on the topic. Sadly, the stone-throwers go wherever they can find an audience and this seems to be their current location. :(

It will be interesting though to see how the Tivo software ends up working on non-Tivo equipment with non-Tivo data. One of the few posts that was on-topic said the software was sent back for some more work. Unfortunately, there hasn't been any follow-up to that post, so who knows the current status. Neither Comcast nor Tivo seems to be talking, at least not anything that's been posted here.

nash,

There are very few posts in this whole thread that are on topic, mostly because there is so little news on the topic. Sadly, the stone-throwers go wherever they can find an audience and this seems to be their current location. :(

It will be interesting though to see how the Tivo software ends up working on non-Tivo equipment with non-Tivo data. One of the few posts that was on-topic said the software was sent back for some more work. Unfortunately, there hasn't been any follow-up to that post, so who knows the current status. Neither Comcast nor Tivo seems to be talking, at least not anything that's been posted here.
Nash,
Something you said in your posts concerns me... what do you mean by non-Tivo data? Will it still be getting its guide info from the same place that the 641x gets it? Will it store the guide the same way (I'm assuming it currently stores it in volatile memory like RAM so that if power is lost the box will still need a long time to re-dload all of the data)? These are two of the significant issues I have with the current 641x implementation so that's bad news for me if the Tivo software won't be changing that. Maybe this was covered previously, and I just missed it.

The SD through my Motorola 3416 is actually better than I get through my TiVo Series 2.

I agree on this, the 3416 even with RCA cables is even better than S video Series 2. And once the S2 records and downgrades quality, its over.

Nash,
Something you said in your posts concerns me... what do you mean by non-Tivo data? Will it still be getting its guide info from the same place that the 641x gets it? Will it store the guide the same way (I'm assuming it currently stores it in volatile memory like RAM so that if power is lost the box will still need a long time to re-dload all of the data)? These are two of the significant issues I have with the current 641x implementation so that's bad news for me if the Tivo software won't be changing that. Maybe this was covered previously, and I just missed it.
I don't know if we really know the answer to this, and I agree that it's really important to know before I make a decision. I think the thought here is that the 641x boxes will work the same way they do now (i.e. get guide data from the same place and store it in volatile memory) and just the topmost interface will change to Tivo. I really hope I'm wrong about this. But I'm not counting on it.

I agree on this, the 3416 even with RCA cables is even better than S video Series 2. And once the S2 records and downgrades quality, its over.

The S2 gets either the analog channels directly from cable, or an analog video signal from a cable box through its video-in. Then it uses its own MPEG2 encoder to encode and store.

The Motorola DCT-3*** boxes are digital only, so it gets the digital broadcast version of all the channels (so does the Tivo S3), which are already in MPEG2 format, encoded by the cable company's $10,000 industrial strength encoder.

Of course Tivo S2's consumer grade encoder can't compete. But its quality also depend a lot on the analog signal quality. In my area the analog is good enough that the quality I get on a Tivo S2DT directly from analog cable is almost comparable to the digital versions that I get with either the Moto DVR or Tivo S3.

BTW, the Moto 6412/16 boxes have both analog and digital tuner, so they could get the analog channels, a picture quality comparison of a 6412 vs a S2 both getting feeds from analog cable would be more apple-to-apple.

BTW, the Moto 6412/16 boxes have both analog and digital tuner, so they could get the analog channels, a picture quality comparison of a 6412 vs a S2 both getting feeds from analog cable would be more apple-to-apple.

You are entirely correct. However, it all depends on the quality of analog, which at least in our area, as well as the two places where we used to live (Atlanta and Alabama) is far below the quality of digital. This made a Comcast box far superior to the S2 even though we love the Tivo interface, and miss it, but the quality difference easily justifies the loss of some functionality.

I think Comcast can be great if you live in certain areas in terms of quality of hardware, software(firmware) and programming quality, and quite the opposite in other areas. It is hard to judge a lot of times, because a lot of the complaints or praise points of others may or may not apply to one's area...

Something you said in your posts concerns me... what do you mean by non-Tivo data? Will it still be getting its guide info from the same place that the 641x gets it?That's my understanding. Will it store the guide the same way (I'm assuming it currently stores it in volatile memory like RAM so that if power is lost the box will still need a long time to re-dload all of the data)?That's a good question.

You are entirely correct. However, it all depends on the quality of analog, which at least in our area, as well as the two places where we used to live (Atlanta and Alabama) is far below the quality of digital.It goes beyond even that: With ADS, you can rest assured that the quality doesn't degrade in transport. Effectively, if the message arrives, it has integrity. By contrast, with analog, even neighbors can have different experiences, simply due to difference in wiring within their respective homes.

Anyone have any news on the release of the tivo update? I know its a long shot, I'm just so sick of my 3416, that I'm considering getting an S3 tivo. If the comcastivo is a month or so out, I can probably wait.

Thanks,

/m/

You are entirely correct. However, it all depends on the quality of analog, which at least in our area, as well as the two places where we used to live (Atlanta and Alabama) is far below the quality of digital. This made a Comcast box far superior to the S2 even though we love the Tivo interface, and miss it, but the quality difference easily justifies the loss of some functionality.

I see where you are coming from. Yes analog quality is not always reliable. Going to digital definitely solves this problem. The trade off is more complexity in the system, and a more closed system than analog. Consumers end up having to trade in choices for hardware to get this improved quality, which could lead us on to the whole integration ban discussion, but maybe some other time.

I hope Tivo port on Comcast DVR is a step in the right direction to solve this problem.

Anyone have any news on the release of the tivo update? I know its a long shot, I'm just so sick of my 3416, that I'm considering getting an S3 tivo. If the comcastivo is a month or so out, I can probably wait.

Thanks,

/m/

If you're considering an S3 and money is an issue, I would consider waiting until the end of summer. Tivo's CEO has declared that they will be releasing a lower priced S3 (see here (http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/08/tivo-ceo-promises-lower-priced-hd-tivo-this-year/)), and the rumour mill places it with an August/September launch at around the $399 - $499 range. By that time, we should also hopefully have a better sense of where Comcast/Tivo stand with rolling out the 341x/641x software and how well it performs.

If you're considering an S3 and money is an issue, I would consider waiting until the end of summer. Tivo's CEO has declared that they will be releasing a lower priced S3 (see here (http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/08/tivo-ceo-promises-lower-priced-hd-tivo-this-year/)), and the rumour mill places it with an August/September launch at around the $399 - $499 range. By that time, we should also hopefully have a better sense of where Comcast/Tivo stand with rolling out the 341x/641x software and how well it performs.

The Series3 is available NOW for $599 at many places on the net. Why wait an indeterminate amount of time for an as-of-yet announced product, which almost certainly will be a feature-reduced subset of the existing box, when the price differential isn't that great ($200 or less) ? Doesn't make sense to me.

If you're considering an S3 and money is an issue, I would consider waiting until the end of summer. Tivo's CEO has declared that they will be releasing a lower priced S3 (see here (http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/08/tivo-ceo-promises-lower-priced-hd-tivo-this-year/)), and the rumour mill places it with an August/September launch at around the $399 - $499 range. The Series3 is available NOW for $599 at many places on the net. Why wait an indeterminate amount of time for an as-of-yet announced product, which almost certainly will be a feature-reduced subset of the existing box, when the price differential isn't that great ($200 or less) ? Doesn't make sense to me.Actually, the Series3 is available for $499 (http://www.tivo.com/0.11.welcomeback.asp) direct from Tivo, so long as you don't want it at the $6.99/mo MSD rate. The monthly fee is $8.31/mo if you prepay, plus the cost of the Comcast CableCards.

There is some talk that Tivo may reduce the price to $499 for other retailers after April 30th -- not just from the Tivo store.

That said, the pictures of the Comcast Tivo (http://www.tivolovers.com/Photos/CES2007/) look pretty good to me. The only issue I see is the limited storage capacity -- there's not a whole lot you can do with 120-160Gb. Once Motorola and Comcast finish the firmware with SATA support, that will really make the Comcast Tivo a compelling alternative.

I agree on this, the 3416 even with RCA cables is even better than S video Series 2. And once the S2 records and downgrades quality, its over.
Several thousand dollar cable company headend MPEG-2 encoders do better job than $5 part found in TiVo machines. Film at 11.

BTW, any TiVo (save the S3 with CableCARDS on digital channels and the DirecTV TiVos) always passes the incoming video through the encoder/decoder chain. If you find the Live TV quality better than the recorded quality, that's because you chose to use a quality setting other than Best.

Actually, the Series3 is available for $499 (http://www.tivo.com/0.11.welcomeback.asp) direct from Tivo, so long as you don't want it at the $6.99/mo MSD rate. The monthly fee is $8.31/mo if you prepay, plus the cost of the Comcast CableCards.

There is some talk that Tivo may reduce the price to $499 for other retailers after April 30th -- not just from the Tivo store.

That said, the pictures of the Comcast Tivo (http://www.tivolovers.com/Photos/CES2007/) look pretty good to me. The only issue I see is the limited storage capacity -- there's not a whole lot you can do with 120-160Gb. Once Motorola and Comcast finish the firmware with SATA support, that will really make the Comcast Tivo a compelling alternative.


First of all, thanks to everyone for the input. Lots of good considerations.

Is anyone concerned about Cabelcard 2.0, in the sense that it would add on demand etc? I wouldnt want to shell out the cash for service and a box (7-800 bucks) to have a S4 with CC 2.0 come out in a year. Truth be told, I like on-demand, it saves me a lot of room on the dvr. Any guesses on how long until this is actually a reality?

Thanks,

Matt

mattyx, the S3 won't not do in 2 years what it can today :)

There is a lot of active discussion about CC 2 and SDV on TiVoCommunity as well - only you can ultimately decide whetehr the pleasure of owning a robust, classy device NOW is worth the price of entry to YOU :)

Several thousand dollar cable company headend MPEG-2 encoders do better job than $5 part found in TiVo machines. Film at 11.

BTW, any TiVo (save the S3 with CableCARDS on digital channels and the DirecTV TiVos) always passes the incoming video through the encoder/decoder chain. If you find the Live TV quality better than the recorded quality, that's because you chose to use a quality setting other than Best.

Heh, I was speaking of live tv on S2 vs. live tv on the 3416. Thats where the difference was noticed. I understand losing quality when i record, but during live tv (and the buffer) its impermissible.

Live TV (on an S2 TiVo) is still re-encoded MPEG. You NEVER see anything with direct pass through.

And you 3416 is receiving 'better', remote-pre-encoded digital-only channels, and it is VERY likely the analog signal was awful (in an attempt to save bandwidth and convince more folks in the area to rent 341x boxen)

You're comparing candy and icecream. :p

You're comparing candy and icecream. :p
More like horseradish and ice cream. ;)

Actually, the Series3 is available for $499 (http://www.tivo.com/0.11.welcomeback.asp) direct from Tivo, so long as you don't want it at the $6.99/mo MSD rate. The monthly fee is $8.31/mo if you prepay, plus the cost of the Comcast CableCards.

There is some talk that Tivo may reduce the price to $499 for other retailers after April 30th -- not just from the Tivo store.

That said, the pictures of the Comcast Tivo (http://www.tivolovers.com/Photos/CES2007/) look pretty good to me. The only issue I see is the limited storage capacity -- there's not a whole lot you can do with 120-160Gb. Once Motorola and Comcast finish the firmware with SATA support, that will really make the Comcast Tivo a compelling alternative.

Why'd you have to go and post that URL? Now you're making it really hard to not pull the trigger.

mattyx, the S3 won't not do in 2 years what it can today :)

There is a lot of active discussion about CC 2 and SDV on TiVoCommunity as well - only you can ultimately decide whetehr the pleasure of owning a robust, classy device NOW is worth the price of entry to YOU :)


Thats a fair point, I just wouldnt want to trigger it if there's a major overhaul coming soon. You know how that can break your spirit. Its like a sale on day 31 after you purchase something.

I guess if I am happy with the features now, I should be good to go.

I guess the question at this point is: Should I wait to see if prices drop everywhere else after April 30, so I can get Multi discount on service. If I gamble and wait, I could lose this great price (expires 4/30).

There's the rub.

EDIT: Now that I think about it, might be good to buy one at this price from tivo, then return it if prices drop everywhere, provided they take it back within 30 days for any reason. Anyone know if they do no-questions-asked returns?

/m/

If you worry about SDV, buy it from Costco for $599.99, and don't get locked in a on a 3 year plan with Tivo, Costco have a lifetime return policy.

If you worry about SDV, buy it from Costco for $599.99, and don't get locked in a on a 3 year plan with Tivo, Costco have a lifetime return policy.
I'm pretty sure Costco eliminated that policy a few months ago.

Never mind then. That $499 deal at Tivo is looking good.

If you worry about SDV, buy it from Costco for $599.99, and don't get locked in a on a 3 year plan with Tivo, Costco have a lifetime return policy.
For some electronics it's now 90 days, but they double the manufacturer warranty. Not sure about a TiVo.

Live TV (on an S2 TiVo) is still re-encoded MPEG. You NEVER see anything with direct pass through.

And you 3416 is receiving 'better', remote-pre-encoded digital-only channels, and it is VERY likely the analog signal was awful (in an attempt to save bandwidth and convince more folks in the area to rent 341x boxen)

You're comparing candy and icecream. :p

hehe true, i am not disagreeing, as you see my above posts, it all depends on the quality of cable where you live. In my area, digital is better, or should I say analog sucks, hence a 3416 is a superior experience.

And I agree with the other poster, it was more like horseradish and icecream...

I just pulled the trigger. I am fed up with this Comcrap DVR and even when tivo ships for it, it'll have the smaller HD. So, regardless of what is coming down the pipe, my S3 should work for 3 years which is what I paid for it.

So I am paying $22/month where my comcrap was $12/month, and getting a much better box, plus internet scheduling. And maybe even the e-sata will work some day.

Thanks for the link!

I just pulled the trigger. I am fed up with this Comcrap DVR and even when tivo ships for it, it'll have the smaller HD. So, regardless of what is coming down the pipe, my S3 should work for 3 years which is what I paid for it.

So I am paying $22/month where my comcrap was $12/month, and getting a much better box, plus internet scheduling. And maybe even the e-sata will work some day.
Note you can upgrade the internal hard drive on the Series3 with a larger model, if you desire. Instructions for that are over on TivoCommunity.

The current firmware on the Motorola 341x DVR is limited to 160Gb, regardless of how much storage is actually in the box. In contrast, the Series3 supports 1Tb drives. Some have ordered the new Hitachi 1Tb drive for the Series3, which provides 115-200 hours of HDTV storage, depending on the content.

That said, Motorola is working on a firmware update to add eSATA capability to the Motorola 641x and 341x. Scanpa has said that customers should receive the firmware with eSATA support in the second half of 2007, perhaps this fall.

Thanks for the info! if this tivo works out, I won't be on the moto box.

I have a 500gb drive sitting here waiting for me to pull the trigger on a Mac Pro ($119 from Frys) Hmm. :)

I'm pretty sure Costco eliminated that policy a few months ago.

90 days returns on computers, (which formerly had 6 month return), tv's, cameras, and i-pods bought after April 1, 2007. Everything else is still open-ended returns for now.

There are very few posts in this whole thread that are on topic, mostly because there is so little news on the topic.

Scanpa, how about starting this week off with some good news for us?

Does anyone feel like this thread is becoming like driving the kids to grandma's house? "Are we there yet?" "How about now?" "How about NOW?" ;)

Indeed. I'm at the point where it's an S3 or a noose...this thing is driving me insane.

My S3 arrives today. Comcast comes out tomorrow to install the cable cards.

Last night, my Comcrap DVR decided all of my shows had no information available, so it didn't record anything.

I think the Comcrap knew I had ordered a TiVo.

I'm having a really hard time waiting. Honestly, though, the rumors of the sub $300 tivos that are out today have me thinking that I should wait.

I'm having a really hard time waiting. Honestly, though, the rumors of the sub $300 tivos that are out today have me thinking that I should wait.

The rumors are completely speculative, and nothing new (although gizmodo would like you to think they do incredible, cutting edge reporting :rolleyes: ) This has been talked about (without any numbers involved) by many, and there are numerous discussions.

A;; technology gets cheaper, the question YOU need to answer is whetehr you can tolerate/handle waiting until it does, and what price difference is instant gratification worth to you :)

My cable company--metrocast in St Mary's, south of DC--wants $150 EACH for the two cable cards. That makes the series III unreasonable to me--is anybody else in that situation?

My cable company--metrocast in St Mary's, south of DC--wants $150 EACH for the two cable cards. That makes the series III unreasonable to me--is anybody else in that situation?

Is this to purchase them? You can't rent them? Where I'm at least the first one is free to rent. Wow, that seems exorbitant.

My cable company--metrocast in St Mary's, south of DC--wants $150 EACH for the two cable cards. That makes the series III unreasonable to me--is anybody else in that situation?If you check out the Tivo forums, you'll find some (smaller) cable companies that don't support renting CableCards ... just purchasing. One of the things that the integration ban (7/07) and / or multi-stream cards may make more reasonable.

Wow $150 is really steep to purchase a little Cable Card. There sure aren't $150 worth of electronics in there. I bet most of that price goes to licensing fee's to Motorola for their MediaCipher or Scientific Atlanta for their PowerKey algorithm's. Software and licensing is where the big money is at.

True - with MultiStream, you'd only need one.

When/If you buy (1 or 2 cards)
Will they give you a warranty?
Will they still charge an additional outlet and digital gateway (or equivalent) fees?

If you intend to live there for a long time, it *may* be wrioth it, to get a superior HD DVR. Do the math -TiVo + service + Cable Cards and compare it to the cost of their HD DVR. Throw in $1.7 million to the latter for "cost due to aggravation" ;) At least that's how I justified my Lifetime purchase, transfer and $700+ S3 (it's cheaper now)

If I felt like it was Series III or bust I'd probably end up doing it--in the end I'm spending the same $800 everybody else was a few months ago. But I have to think some of this will shake out over the next year, so for now I'm using my good old lifetime Series II to drive my POS motorola HD box and when it finds something worth recording in HD then I switch over to it and tell it to record.

If I felt like it was Series III or bust I'd probably end up doing it--in the end I'm spending the same $800 everybody else was a few months ago. But I have to think some of this will shake out over the next year, so for now I'm using my good old lifetime Series II to drive my POS motorola HD box and when it finds something worth recording in HD then I switch over to it and tell it to record.

Fair 'nuff. That's how I use my Moto HD DVR as well (I can't afford a second S3)

In addition, since the TiVo normally starts the IR channel change process a second or three before it is time to start recording, the DVR can record a conflicting HD show on it's background tuner quite seamlessly! I've never had my 6412 step on my S2 unit's toes, so far ... bless its otherwise-tarnished soul :)

Does anyone feel like this thread is becoming like driving the kids to grandma's house? "Are we there yet?" "How about now?" "How about NOW?" ;)

Maybe that's because we've been stuck in this car for a year beyond the original anticipated arrival.

We'll be lucky if Grandma's not dead by the time we get there!!!

A;; technology gets cheaper, the question YOU need to answer is whetehr you can tolerate/handle waiting until it does, and what price difference is instant gratification worth to you :)

I've never been much good at waiting, but with comcast tivo coming soon ( :rolleyes: ) and the new moto boxes/platform on it's way, I think that my best option is to wait it out. We'll see if my self restraint holds out.

I've never been much good at waiting, but with comcast tivo coming soon ( :rolleyes: ) and the new moto boxes/platform on it's way, I think that my best option is to wait it out. We'll see if my self restraint holds out.

I gave up, finally. Succumbed to the $499 Tivo Series 3 deal. :rolleyes:

Does anyone feel like this thread is becoming like driving the kids to grandma's house? "Are we there yet?" "How about now?" "How about NOW?" ;)


Yes!


At work, they rushed for 2 months to get all the equipment installed and running, then we get told the rollout of the system software (for the headend) has been delayed. Were all like WTF! We have heard nothing since they told us about the delayed system software rollout. almost been a month now.

The good thing is our headend is ready to go as soon as the testing and setup of said software is installed.

Scanpa, thanks for the updates; and I appreciate your candor. I hope it happens soon, as I fear I've got little more patience than Shazza...

The problem is by the time the comcast/tivo option becomes available, the moto box on its own will probably be reliable enough that it will not be worth it for some.

I have missed my old direct tivo since switching to comcast dearly, but to be honest, I am starting to forget what would make it worth still MORE monthly cost.

Since my 16.35 firmware upgrade, it seems to be working somewhat acceptably, despite the HDMI port still being essentially unusable.

I wonder if comcast may be wondering the same. They are paying Tivo millions to port the software, but Tivo's relevance in the market is waining by the day. Comcast is definitely not in any rush to get it out the door.

I just found out yesterday that FIOS is coming to my neighborhood in the next 3 months. If the Tivo software isn't available by then, I'm going to be very tempted to switch.

The problem is by the time the comcast/tivo option becomes available, the moto box on its own will probably be reliable enough that it will not be worth it for some.
...
Since my 16.35 firmware upgrade, it seems to be working somewhat acceptably, despite the HDMI port still being essentially unusable.

Your confidence in the Moto box is overwhelming. :p