I think I may not have been clear about what I was trying to accomplish, so let me try again...

How should I do the HDD -> DVD transfer so that the 47-minute title is downgraded to MN14 and the other four keep their present recording modes? And once the copy is done, is there any way to verify the properties of the five segments?

Thanks!

I had wanted to send you this via PM, but your settings do not permit me to do this.

My suggestion is to start a new thread specifically for this question and make the thread title worded so that all Pioneer HDD owners, from the 420/520H to the present, read it. The person with the answer might own a pre-2006 model.

any1 here figure out what kinda hard drive is this 640 using? and any success upgrading the hard drive to a bigger one?

I think I may not have been clear about what I was trying to accomplish, so let me try again.

I have five titles originally recorded to HDD. I want to save them on a DVD-R because I'm not ready to edit them yet, and I want a backup in case of HDD failure.

One is 47 minutes in MN21. It will eventually be part of an MN14 disc, so I may as well downgrade it during the backup.

The other four are just a few minutes each, recorded in SP or MN23 or MN19 or MN15.

How should I do the HDD -> DVD transfer so that the 47-minute title is downgraded to MN14 and the other four keep their present recording modes? And once the copy is done, is there any way to verify the properties of the five segments?

Thanks!
My recommendation is to use VR-mode DVD-RW for this. You can real-time copy the one video at the lower bit-rate and then high-speed copy the others when using VR-mode DVD-RW. Also, that format allows high-speed copying back to the HDD. As for verifying, the MN rate is inccluded in the title information. There is no need to finalize a VR-mode disc, by the way.

I can do this with my Pioneer DVR-510H. I don't know if things are different with the 640H because of its option to set HDD recordings in either video or VR mode.

How should I do the HDD -> DVD transfer so that the 47-minute title is downgraded to MN14 and the other four keep their present recording modes? And once the copy is done, is there any way to verify the properties of the five segments?Well I don't see another thread, so I'll reply here...

I don't know of any way to verify the properties of the segments once they're recorded other than to look at the bit rate. But if this shouldn't be an issue as long as you're careful to select the mode you want when you do the copy.

I agree that copying to a VR-mode DVD-RW disc should allow you to high-speed copy the material back to the HDD later. That works on my Pioneer 633 and I'm sure the 640 would be the same. It's easy enough for you to try with a short title to confirm that it works before jumping in all the way.

As for getting the right recording speed on the DVD copy, here's how: When you go into the copy screens, the first thing you see is a list of all of the titles on your hard drive - this is where you select which titles you want to copy. Once you've selected what you want, you hit "next" and this brings you to a second screen that shows you only the selected titles.

That second screen is what's known as the "Copy List". Now here's a big secret of DVD copying - you can edit the titles in this "Copy List" and the edits will apply to the DVD copy but they won't affect the original title on the hard drive. For example, you can change the thumbnails, change the recording speed, even erase sections from any of the titles in the copy list, and even though these changes will be made to the copy that gets put on the DVD the original title on the hard drive will stay intact.

The default copy speed for each item in the copy list is "high speed" (unless you selected too much stuff to fit on a DVD). If you want to change the speed of any one title, just highlight in that second "copy list" screen, press enter, and then scroll through the editing choices until you get to "Recording Mode" (it may not appear on the list as you first see it, you may have to scroll down past the last item shown to see an additional group of options). Hit enter again and choose the recording mode you want. You can do this for one title that's being copied or as many as you want, and they can be any combination of speeds as long as the result fits on the DVD.

One thing to be aware of - if you choose anything other than "High speed" copy mode the recorder will do a "real time" copy, which means it will actually "play" the title (you'll see it playing on the TV) as it copies and re-encodes.

Here's an undocumented tidbit about my Pioneer recorder that may still apply to the 640:

In the Disc Navigator window, select a HDD title thumbnail. Now press the Display button on the remote. This cycles the title information through three different displays of information. It also works when selecting thumbnails in chapter edit and probably other modes. How this helps me is I can still see the recording date and time for a title I have renamed.

Baltimore Stan, I second what Healy Guy and Sean said. I'll just add one thing. With your unfinalized disc in, switch to DVD mode, so the blue light goes out. Hit the "Disc Navigator" button. That will bring up a menu of what is on your disc, and rec speeds, as the titles are highlighted. This works even when the "menu" button won't.

Here's an undocumented tidbit about my Pioneer recorder that may still apply to the 640:

In the Disc Navigator window, select a HDD title thumbnail. Now press the Display button on the remote. This cycles the title information through three different displays of information. It also works when selecting thumbnails in chapter edit and probably other modes. How this helps me is I can still see the recording date and time for a title I have renamed.

Thanks for posting -- it was worth a try, and I got my hopes up, but unfortunately that feature is gone from the 640.

In Disc Navigator, with a title highlighted, I press Display and there's a two-step cycle. Normally each title shows record date/time and mode on one line, then title on the next line. (If I haven't set a title, the second line shows record date and time and I think channel.) Press Display and the first line of informationis suppressed; press Display again and it's restored. That's it.

What's weird is that in Disc Navigator for my burned DVD-R, there are record date and times but no record mode.

I don't know of any way to verify the properties of the segments once they're recorded other than to look at the bit rate. But if this shouldn't be an issue as long as you're careful to select the mode you want when you do the copy.

Well, I was careful to do that, so I guess basically I just have to have faith. :)

A couple of people suggested recording in VR mode. I agree, and that's what I did; I meant to mention it in fact. My motive was, as Sean suggests, to let me do a high-speed copy back to hard disk eventually.

Following advice from ACPewty earlier in this thread on a one-title disk burn, I've verified that that works. Surprisingly, chapter marks are retained through both stages of the process, even though I'm pretty sure the manual says they are not retained on a real-time burn from HDD to DVD.

As for getting the right recording speed on the DVD copy, here's how: ... The default copy speed for each item in the copy list is "high speed" (unless you selected too much stuff to fit on a DVD). If you want to change the speed of any one title, just highlight in that second "copy list" screen, press enter, and then scroll through the editing choices until you get to "Recording Mode" (it may not appear on the list as you first see it, you may have to scroll down past the last item shown to see an additional group of options). Hit enter again and choose the recording mode you want. You can do this for one title that's being copied or as many as you want, and they can be any combination of speeds as long as the result fits on the DVD.

Yup, that's what I did. My 47-minute segment must be right because it's 1.0 GB on DVD and was nearly 2 GB on HDD (recorded at SP, and I deliberately doengraded it to MN14 on the DVD). The other segments are all too short to be sure, but since I didn't set their record mode in the copy list they must have been done at high speed and retained their original speeds.

I still wonder why the record modes don't show up on he Disc Navigator screen when I bring it up on the DVD. As for the HDD, every other title does show a record mode in Disc Navigator, but after a HS copy from DVD back to HDD these five titles don't show a record mode in Disc Navigator on the HDD.

Hi Everyone,

I've been lurking for quite some time and after reading this, and several other informative threads, I chose the Pioneer 640 as my first DVR. I spent about an hour running through the basics last night and so far so good. :D

One piece of functionality I'm concerned it might not have though is a loop function. I use this function a great deal when listening to CDs and watching concert DVDs while trying to decipher complicated bass solos. Does anyone know if it is possible to repeat a user selected portion just be setting up a simple A/B in/out point. On my old Toshiba DVD player this takes only a second to set up, but I fear it may not be possible (or as simple) on this machine.

I'm sure to have a few other oddball questions soon, but for now that is my main concern. Thanks to all who contribute to this thread. I spent about 2 hours reading it last Saturday, and your contributions helped me choose the Pioneer.

Thanks!

I don't know if there was a notice sticker of about 4"X1" on my 640H when I originally got it, but I spotted it yesterday after I unpacked it (when it came back from getting the firmware update from Pioneer). I am wondering if 640Hs have always come with the notice sticker or if this is something new Pioneer is adding, either on machines that have been to their service centers or during production.

Just typing the beginning:

"Notice: This product has only an 'analog' tuner so it will require..."

My 640H was manufactured in October 2006. It is possible the notice was on it when I got it new in December. I already knew about the analog tuner, so I did not learn anything new. Others could, though.

One piece of functionality I'm concerned it might not have though is a loop function. I use this function a great deal when listening to CDs and watching concert DVDs while trying to decipher complicated bass solos. Does anyone know if it is possible to repeat a user selected portion just be setting up a simple A/B in/out point. On my old Toshiba DVD player this takes only a second to set up, but I fear it may not be possible (or as simple) on this machine.
On my previous-model Pioneer the A-B Repeat function is in the Play Mode Menu accessible from the Home Menu. It is described in the Playback chapter of the manual.

On my previous-model Pioneer the A-B Repeat function is in the Play Mode Menu accessible from the Home Menu. It is described in the Playback chapter of the manual.

It's accessible this way on the 640H, too.

I just checked and one can select A-B Repeat, Repeat, or Program. Program is to, "Program the playback order of DVD titles/chapters. or CD/Video CD tracks." There's also a Search Mode here for Title or Chapter Search.

I asked this the last page and I realized I wasn't real clear.

Is there a way to stop the 640 remote from controlling my Phillips 7000 Directv DVR? It's very annoying when trying to do things on the DVDR.

Surely somebody else has ran into this.

I asked this the last page and I realized I wasn't real clear.

Is there a way to stop the 640 remote from controlling my Phillips 7000 Directv DVR? It's very annoying when trying to do things on the DVDR.

Surely somebody else has ran into this.

I'm surprised the 640 remote in it's default setting controls your DirecTV DVR, but you can fix this by changing the 640H and it's remote to another signal setting.

Push the Home Menu button then select:

Initial setup -> Options (last choice, only shows if you keep going down).

You will see, "Remote Control Mode," to the right. Go there and you will see the default option set, "Recorder1."

Select either Record2 or 3 there.

Next, set the remote:

Hold down the, "ENTER," button and the recorder number you have selected in the above step (2 or 3). Keep holding both down until the indicator lights up on the remote.

Give it a try. I have a 520H connected to the same TV. One remote has the default, Recorder1, settings and the other, for the 640H, I set to Recorder2.

Maybe this information is in the 640H manual, but I could not easily locate it so I grabbed my 420/520H manual and quickly found it.

On my previous-model Pioneer the A-B Repeat function is in the Play Mode Menu accessible from the Home Menu. It is described in the Playback chapter of the manual.

There's also the Play Mode button under the slider.

"Notice: This product has only an 'analog' tuner so it will require..."

Also on the two I've seen, both September 2006. Plus twice on the outside of each Pio box. Printed, not a sticker, but looks like the sticker.

I don't know if there was a notice sticker of about 4"X1" on my 640H when I originally got it, but I spotted it yesterday after I unpacked it (when it came back from getting the firmware update from Pioneer). I am wondering if 640Hs have always come with the notice sticker or if this is something new Pioneer is adding, either on machines that have been to their service centers or during production.

Just typing the beginning:

"Notice: This product has only an 'analog' tuner so it will require..."

My 640H was manufactured in October 2006. It is possible the notice was on it when I got it new in December. I already knew about the analog tuner, so I did not learn anything new. Others could, though.
Mine was manufactured in August 2006, and it does have the sticker on it.

Theron

I'm surprised the 640 remote in it's default setting controls your DirecTV DVR, but you can fix this by changing the 640H and it's remote to another signal setting.

Push the Home Menu button then select:

Initial setup -> Options (last choice, only shows if you keep going down).

You will see, "Remote Control Mode," to the right. Go there and you will see the default option set, "Recorder1."

Select either Record2 or 3 there.

Next, set the remote:

Hold down the, "ENTER," button and the recorder number you have selected in the above step (2 or 3). Keep holding both down until the indicator lights up on the remote.

Give it a try. I have a 520H connected to the same TV. One remote has the default, Recorder1, settings and the other, for the 640H, I set to Recorder2.

Maybe this information is in the 640H manual, but I could not easily locate it so I grabbed my 420/520H manual and quickly found it.


Thanks so much...that did the trick.

Now I just have to figure out how to use this thing with my harmony 880. :)

I have been burning discs and finalizing all in one step. The very last step is choosing one of the menu templates. You must choose from thumbnails which don't show the details of what the menu will actually look like. I suppose, if you burn enough discs, you could eventually remember what each template looks like. My brain doesn't work that way. I wanna see it. Here's how: do not finalize the disc when you make the copy. After the copy is complete go to 'Home Menu'/'Disc Setup'/'Finalize'. When you finalize manually you still choose a menu template from the thumbnails. Afterward, your menu choice is displayed full screen, complete with your title thumbnails. Now you can see how it will really look. You are then prompted to accept the image and begin finalizing. It's an extra step in the burn process but I like to see what my menu will look like.

I have been reading your forum and am greatly impressed with all the helpful and generous tech wizards here whose generosity I am about to prevail upon. I am on the verge of purchasing the Pioneer 640hs to use in conjunction, unfortunately, with a Dish satellite receiver.
This is my question for which I’m asking assistance:
I realize the Pioneer dvd recorder has one analog tuner with up to 125 channels. I also know that one can manually program the recorder to set up to 125 Dish channels. My question is can I say choose one of the upper channels on the Dish - say channel 205 and make it channel 10 for example on the Pioneer tuner? Or must the Dish and Pioneer tuner channels align in number order?
It is my thinking, and I could be wrong, that the channels that I set up on the Pioneer tuner will make it possible for me to record one of those channels while watching another. Otherwise, if I can’t make Dish channel 205 into Pioneer channel 10 then I assume that the only way to record channel 205 (since the Pioneer has an analog limit that only goes to channel 125) is to record and watch channel 205 at the same time provided I’m connected to input Line 1 on the Pioneer.
So can I set up the 125 tuner channels on my Pioneer recorder in any way I want manually? Or am I resigned to having to having to record and watch any Dish channel above number 125? I hope I am stating my problem so that it makes sense. I could also be quite wrong on some of my assumptions.

Also if I can squeeze in one more question. If I opt for the Dish receiver recorder model 622, I believe it is, instead of the Pioneer – is there any way to download the recorded programs on its hard drive and transfer them to a dvd disk? Has anyone had experience with the Pocket Dish onto which programs can be downloaded via USB? Would that be the only way to transfer programs onto dvd disks – download to the Pocket Dish and from there upload to a computer hard drive and from there copy to a dvd disk? Complicated isn’t it? When will dvr digital tuner recorders arrive and would they resolve this problem of limited tuner channel numbers?

Thank you so much in advance to those so kind as to help and assist me with this dilemma of mine.
P.S. I don’t subscribe to any Premium, Sport, or Pay channels. I assume I couldn’t record those channels anyway.

I inadvertently did an "experiment" with my 640, which might be of interest to some. I meant to record a program from my DVR to the HDD of my 640, in real time, of course. I did not notice that it was in disc mode, not HDD mode, when I started to record. So, I started a SP recording to disc, using the One Touch recording feature, set for 2.5 hours. When I checked later, the recording had stopped at 2:07:08, on a Verbatim -R SL disc. It did insert chapter stops at every ten minutes, automatically. I was afraid that since the disc was full, It would not finalize. But, it finalized and played with no problem. So, if space is needed to finalize, it is saved automatically. And, 2 hours 7 minutes is the limit on a Verb -R SL.

My question is can I say choose one of the upper channels on the Dish - say channel 205 and make it channel 10 for example on the Pioneer tuner? Or must the Dish and Pioneer tuner channels align in number order?...So can I set up the 125 tuner channels on my Pioneer recorder in any way I want manually? Or am I resigned to having to having to record and watch any Dish channel above number 125?...P.S. I don’t subscribe to any Premium, Sport, or Pay channels. I assume I couldn’t record those channels anyway.The tuner on the 640 does not work for satellite. You must use a line in (like L1) for recording. The 640's tuner would only be useful for cable or OTA, so you don't have to worry about assigning channels at all if you only use satellite.

I use mine exclusively with satellite and it works great, but you can't watch a live program while recording another different live program unless your satellite box has dual tuners (with dedicated outputs) or you have more than one tuner. You can however record a program while watching any program previously recorded, and you can chase-play the currently recording program. This works out to be almost as good since with this functionality plus commercial skip etc you rarely end up watching live tv.

Sorry, I don't know much about the Dish DVR, but most any DVR will allow you to "record to VCR" which outputs programs in 480i via a line out for recording with a DVDR.

BTW, I regularly record from from premium channels like movie networks etc with no problem at all.

...So, if space is needed to finalize, it is saved automatically.I think that's why you only get a maximum of 4.4Gb for recording from a 4.7Gb disc.

I think that's why you only get a maximum of 4.4Gb for recording from a 4.7Gb disc.
Actually 4.4 versus 4.7 is the difference between disc-capacity "GB" ("billion bytes") and "computer" "GiB" (2^30 bytes).

4,700,000,000B ~= 4.377GiB

(GiB) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibibyte)

From my experience you don't need 300MB for Finalization, ~50MB is plenty.

Actually 4.4 versus 4.7 is the difference between disc-capacity "GB" ("billion bytes") and "computer" "GiB" (2^30 bytes).

4,700,000,000B ~= 4.377GiB

(GiB) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibibyte)

From my experience you don't need 300MB for Finalization, ~50MB is plenty.Thanks again bobkart. You'd think I would have remembered that from the last time you pointed it out. :o

And, 2 hours 7 minutes is the limit on a Verb -R SL.

Yes, I have found that to be true too.

It would be nice to start a thread of "Hints & Tips for PIO640 users".

My tip would be to put your blank disc in & WAIT for the word LOAD to disappear B4 you start your copy process with a DVD+R DL.

And if we post an incorrect tip, we should be sent a PM so we can delete it.
That way the thread won't get cluttered with questions & answers.

Urlee :)

... It would be nice to start a thread of "Hints & Tips for PIO640 users".

My tip would be to put your blank disc in & WAIT for the word LOAD to disappear B4 you start your copy process with a DVD+R DL.

And if we post an incorrect tip, we should be sent a PM so we can delete it.
That way the thread won't get cluttered with questions & answers.

Urlee :)

Good idea. This thread has gotten so long that one specifically for hints and tips could be quite useful. Besides deleting incorrect information postings, I suggest deleting duplicate information postings. As an example, using one I deleted here this morning:

blurij posted a question about the 640H and DISH just after 9 p.m. last night. At 10:52 p.m. ACPewty, a DirecTV-type (as am I) posted a reply. At this time I was either still typing or previewing my own reply, which got posted 5 minutes after ACPewty's--and was almost identical, down to the, "BTW." When I noticed the duplication this morning, I deleted it.

My tip would be in terms of the, "Auto Start Recording," feature: The Disk Navigator and Home Menu cannot be accessed while something is being recorded via this feature. Basically, one can neither watch, via chase play, what is being recorded nor watch something previously recorded during this time.

... And, 2 hours 7 minutes is the limit on a Verb -R SL.
Don't forget that the hard limit defining how much you can record to a DVD is based on data capacity, which is not solely a funciton of time. The compression ratio for the picture encoding varies depending on the nature of the images that are being encoded. For any particular picture quality setting, the total length that will "fit" will vary from title to title, so it doesn't make sense to define this capacity in terms of a particular time.

For anyone with a digital camera, the corresponding analogy is the differing size of the picture files you take. If you pay attention to your files, you will notice that even though all your pictures may be the same dimensions (pixel wise) and you have each one set to the same JPG compression quality, each picture file will be slightly different in size. So even though your memory card is fixed in size, sometimes you may be able to fit a different number of pictures on the card, depending on the type of pictures you are taking and how well they lend themselves to JPG compression.

Theron

i have a question.

i record stuffs in LP mode in the past...and the pq wasn't that bad..but recently it looks like craps...so i have to record it in SP mode.

maybe my eyes is playing trick on me? any1 know what's going on?

i have a question.

i record stuffs in LP mode in the past...and the pq wasn't that bad..but recently it looks like craps...so i have to record it in SP mode.

maybe my eyes is playing trick on me? any1 know what's going on?


If none of your hardware has changed, then perhaps it is a slight degradation in the cable signal that is only noticeable when you record on LP mode, but not when you watch live TV. Just a guess.

I also use the commercial skip to add chapter marks, but prefer the 5 min (6 times on the button), but being un-coordinated I sometimes add 3 min or have to go around again to get the setting. a one push button would be timesaver. that would save about 120 keystrokes per movie, not counting miscues. ( could I wear out the button?)

I also like the REW button, instead of (on 640) play, then REW. However, the button arrangement on the 633 seems a little awkward. (IMHO) Maybe just not used to using it.

Seems like I recall Levitron having a remote IR changing system for home distribution systems. Will report if I find something interesting.

Well, I tried customizing a button on the Harmony remote by repeatedly pressing the 640's chapter skip button. The Harmony remote does not like long infra-red signals and stopped accepting after the 5th time I hit the chapter skip button. So with my new customized button, I can advance by 3 min with the touch of one button. I asked Harmony tech support if I could create a macro to allow a 5 min skip with one touch of a button and they said No! Too bad. I too would like to insert chapters with one touch of a button while editting.

If none of your hardware has changed, then perhaps it is a slight degradation in the cable signal that is only noticeable when you record on LP mode, but not when you watch live TV. Just a guess.

thx...i may swap out the cable.

Don't forget that the hard limit defining how much you can record to a DVD is based on data capacity, which is not solely a funciton of time. The compression ratio for the picture encoding varies depending on the nature of the images that are being encoded. For any particular picture quality setting, the total length that will "fit" will vary from title to title, so it doesn't make sense to define this capacity in terms of a particular time.

For anyone with a digital camera, the corresponding analogy is the differing size of the picture files you take. If you pay attention to your files, you will notice that even though all your pictures may be the same dimensions (pixel wise) and you have each one set to the same JPG compression quality, each picture file will be slightly different in size. So even though your memory card is fixed in size, sometimes you may be able to fit a different number of pictures on the card, depending on the type of pictures you are taking and how well they lend themselves to JPG compression.

Theron

Yes, I was aware of that as Sean had pointed out many pages back and if I am not mistaken, it depends on motion movement of the movies?

But, I use the 127 minutes as a guide.

Urlee

Well, I tried customizing a button on the Harmony remote by repeatedly pressing the 640's chapter skip button. The Harmony remote does not like long infra-red signals and stopped accepting after the 5th time I hit the chapter skip button. So with my new customized button, I can advance by 3 min with the touch of one button. I asked Harmony tech support if I could create a macro to allow a 5 min skip with one touch of a button and they said No! Too bad. I too would like to insert chapters with one touch of a button while editting.

Thanks Dvdiva
I had a suspicion that it would not since I purchased an 880 and a week later have not been able to program it properly (part my fault, part confusing set ups and wrong input on programming.) However, it will be really neat once it is set up for my wife to watch her recorded programs without having to explain all the steps each time. As a side note I like the options on the VXX2967 remote over the one supplied, however, the VXX3095 (one supplied) has a better (crisper) feel (to me) on the arrow buttons to insert chapter marks.

( Now I wonder if that old Sony remote commander will….?)

Urlee,
I “second” the tips for users thread.
Tip: instead of cycling thru to get the numbers, hit the 0 (zero) button and then “clear” to get to numbers. And by now, most everyone knows to press “stop” to enter the title.

Urlee,
I “second” the tips for users thread.
Tip: instead of cycling thru to get the numbers, hit the 0 (zero) button and then “clear” to get to numbers. And by now, most everyone knows to press “stop” to enter the title.

Mission accomplished:)

But------bphouston,
Please state what operation, task, you are doing in this tip?
Like is this during your typing out a name for your Title?

Urlee

Mission accomplished:)

But------bphouston,
Please state what operation, task, you are doing in this tip?
Like is this during your typing out a name for your Title?

Urlee

Sorry 'bout that.... Not everyone is thinking like I am (good thing, maybe), yes, in entering text for titles, disk name using the keypad on the remote-
Example: to enter a number (instead of cycling thru all the choices) press "0" (zero) and then "clear" key will put you at the number list and pick from arrow keys. Since the 0 is a direct entry and not cycled like the other numbers.

Urlee, how about a link to that thread on tips?

Urlee, how about a link to that thread on tips?It's in the same forum (DVD Recorders (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=106)) as this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=793772

Theron

Example: to enter a number (instead of cycling thru all the choices) press "0" (zero) and then "clear" key will put you at the number list and pick from arrow keys. Since the 0 is a direct entry and not cycled like the other numbers.If I'm getting you right, this might work OK for entering a "1" or maybe a "2" because on the title entry screen they're very close to the zero. But for everything else, doesn't it take fewer keystrokes to just hit the appropriate key repeatedly? For example, press the "3" key 4 times to enter a "3" instead of "0", "Clear", "Right", "Right", "Right", "Enter"?

Thanks Dvdiva
I had a suspicion that it would not since I purchased an 880 and a week later have not been able to program it properly (part my fault, part confusing set ups and wrong input on programming.) However, it will be really neat once it is set up for my wife to watch her recorded programs without having to explain all the steps each time.

Your welcome bphouston!
I spent a full day programming my first Harmony 628 and finally called the tech support to help me tweek a few things. They are, in general, very helpful. The 640 was one of the most finicky components during this process and I found that if you choose More Options on the 640 on your Harmony home page, select adjust delays/response times, and use the following settngs Power On Delay 14000, Inter-key delay 100, Input Delay 300, Inter-device delay 100; then the Harmony should work well with the 640. Make sure that your repeats are set at 3 if you encounter any further problems controlling the 640.

Here is a question that may be worth adding to the Tips thread.

Way back before I knew what I was doing :) I recorded a 96 minute movie to the HDD in XP mode, which yielded a 6.6G file. So to copy it to a "normal" DVD, I had to do a real time copy. But after reading about the good deal on the Verbatum DL discs, I went out and got a pack... so my XP program should now fit on one of those.

I've already edited the recording to trim the front and back, etc, and made a nice title and thumbnail from the front of the movie.

Is there anything different I need to do in order to HS copy this movie to a DL disc? Does it handle the layer split automatically?

Obviously, I want to get it right the first time, since these DL disks are considerably more expensive!

Thanks,

Theron

You should be good to go.

Should take around 20 minutes.

You should be good to go.

Should take around 20 minutes.Well it worked fine! But it took 37 minutes to copy and 9 to finalize (6.6G file).

These Verbatims are rated at 2.4x, I don't know if that had anything to do with it or not.

Thanks!

Theron

You're Welcome.

Yeah I guess I was thinking 4x. I recall my DL burns on the 633 taking ~26 minutes for a relatively full disc. And those Verbatim discs are rated 2x-4x.

How can I get the Pio640 to show time remaining? Maybe it's a personality trait, but when I watch something I prefer to see how much is left rather than how much I've watched.

I too prefer to see time remaining. I already know how much time has elapsed since I was there for it.

Well it worked fine! But it took 37 minutes to copy and 9 to finalize (6.6G file).

These Verbatims are rated at 2.4x, I don't know if that had anything to do with it or not.

Thanks!

Theron

Mine, same Verbatim disks as yours, took 34 minutes for 6.5G but I did not finalize it.
I added to it the next day. Worked great!

Urlee

Yeah I guess I was thinking 4x. I recall my DL burns on the 633 taking ~26 minutes for a relatively full disc. And those Verbatim discs are rated 2x-4x.

I've bought the Verb DL's in 3-packs (least economical, not recommended), in 10-pack cartons, and in 20-disc spindles. They are all made in Singapore, and I presume they all share the same disc ID code (?). Still, some of them say 2.4x or 4x on the box / label, others say "Burns at up to 6x in compatible DVD drives", and some even change that statement to 8x. I think the difference must be because these packs or spindles were purchased at different times over the past year or so.

Now, this raises a couple of interesting questions. I had thought that the 640 used an 8x speed burner, whereas previous models -- at least up through the 520 -- used a 4x burner. Be that as it may, the max burning speed would not get used unless the write strategy of the 640 firmware and of the burner calls for that with a particular type of blank media. And we don't really know this missing info.

Yes, I was aware of that as Sean had pointed out many pages back and if I am not mistaken, it depends on motion movement of the movies?

Among other things. The black bars of letterboxing yields less file space than a full frame image. (And I've seen black bars that were thinner, or much thicker.) Sometimes I've been surprised at the results -- like going with a MN27, and it still worked out, even though I thought MN25 might be pushing it, in terms of fitting the movie onto a SL disc. Other times, I've gone "into the Red zone" by just a minute or two, but a miss is still as good (bad) as a mile, or ten. If you don't want to have to re-encode, though, it is better to be a bit conservative.

Among other things. The black bars of letterboxing yields less file space than a full frame image. (And I've seen black bars that were thinner, or much thicker.) Sometimes I've been surprised at the results -- like going with a MN27, and it still worked out, even though I thought MN25 might be pushing it, in terms of fitting the movie onto a SL disc. Other times, I've gone "into the Red zone" by just a minute or two, but a miss is still as good (bad) as a mile, or ten. If you don't want to have to re-encode, though, it is better to be a bit conservative.
I've done lots of tests that involved watching the Mbps counter and I found that movement is not a difficult task for MPEG2, but scene changes are.

One example: A car race, with fast-moving cars while the camera also pans quickly around the track, keeps the counter around the normal SP rate of 5 Mbps. Changing scenes, however, from outside the car to inside raises the rate thru the scene change to 9-10 Mbps. Some scene changes w/o a drastic change in lighting or content don't raise the rate, but I guess "major" scene changes create more work for MPEG2 to start a new GOP sequence?

I think an MTV video would be more difficult for MPEG2 than even a car race?

I've bought the Verb DL's in 3-packs (least economical, not recommended), in 10-pack cartons, and in 20-disc spindles. They are all made in Singapore, and I presume they all share the same disc ID code (?). Still, some of them say 2.4x or 4x on the box / label, others say "Burns at up to 6x in compatible DVD drives", and some even change that statement to 8x. I think the difference must be because these packs or spindles were purchased at different times over the past year or so.

I also bought one box of Verb's DL's in a box of 3 in cases which says Up to 8X Speed and a 20-disc spindle which says Up to 6X Speed. Both made in Singapore.

Quite a difference from $4.00 a piece to $1.50 by spindle.

Urle

Is there anything different I need to do in order to HS copy this movie to a DL disc? Does it handle the layer split automatically?
,

Theron

The only thing you need to know is that you can only choose a thumbnail from what will wind up on the first layer of the disc. If you select something past that, the final frame on the first layer will be your thumbnail.

i have a question.

i record stuffs in LP mode in the past...and the pq wasn't that bad..but recently it looks like craps...so i have to record it in SP mode.

maybe my eyes is playing trick on me? any1 know what's going on?


just notice something..i recorded SNL (saturday night live) on NBC last sat. in LP mode...and it didnt look that bad. but when i record a basketball or a football game or something else in LP mode...it doesn't look as good as SNL.

so it isn't the cables here...wtf is going on?

just notice something..i recorded SNL (saturday night live) on NBC last sat. in LP mode...and it didnt look that bad. but when i record a basketball or a football game or something else in LP mode...it doesn't look as good as SNL.

so it isn't the cables here...wtf is going on?

Short answer. People's heads are bigger on SNL than they are on sporting events.

More complex answer. Much more action with a sporting event than with something like SNL. Smaller and fast moving objects are very difficult to record.

If I'm getting you right, this might work OK for entering a "1" or maybe a "2" because on the title entry screen they're very close to the zero. But for everything else, doesn't it take fewer keystrokes to just hit the appropriate key repeatedly? For example, press the "3" key 4 times to enter a "3" instead of "0", "Clear", "Right", "Right", "Right", "Enter"?

Sean, you’re right, if you use the direct entry keypad, less strokes. However, if you use direct entry with arrow keys, it is more. And that comes from adding the date to disk name which is 1 or 2 first number. I know you prefer the key pad entry. But don’t tell me to enter the 4 after the three you would press 4 key four times. And of course, it would take many more strokes to get to the 9 with arrow keys.

At one time you mentioned your “ ole tiered eyes”, unless that picture of you was taken 20 years ago, you don’t have Old tired eyes! I do, and that’s why I prefer a combination of the arrow key and keypad, cause by the time I locate the small lettering (and my eyeglasses) on the keypad I could have arrowed over and entered it, not to mention passed it up and go thru all the connotations again.

Too bad we don’t have keyboard entry, then we wouldn’t have to look at the keys. (quicker, too!)
Then all we would have to worry about is 11 finger typing. (typos by the 11th finger)
Anybody know how to attach a keyboard?

Short answer. People's heads are bigger on SNL than they are on sporting events.

More complex answer. Much more action with a sporting event than with something like SNL. Smaller and fast moving objects are very difficult to record.

Good way to put it. I record talking head shows at lower speeds, like MN19, and basketball as close to XP as possible. For premium games, I record at XP and put each half on its own DVD, otherwise record at MN26 (1:30) and pack it on 1 DVD.

Short answer. People's heads are bigger on SNL than they are on sporting events.

More complex answer. Much more action with a sporting event than with something like SNL. Smaller and fast moving objects are very difficult to record.
I have seen many instances where the picture quality on most live sports is far worse than programs recorded in a TV studio environment. This is true for HDTV versions and SD/analog versions.

The artifacts seen in the original program are then re-encoded into the DVD recording, with at least two noticable effects:
1. The artifacts themselves appear worse on the recording and stand out more (at least in my experience); and,
2. The encoder wasted some resource dealing with the artifacts which left less resource to support the real picture, reducing the recorded picture quality accordingly.

These are my simplified views of what I have seen. Again, I have seen many analog/NTSC, SD digital and HD digital examples with these picture quality impairments occuring in varying degrees for each.

something funny has happen to this machine. i have it for about 3 months.

when i start a manual recording last nite for 30 minutes around 11:40 pm. i click on record buttom on my remote and on my tv screen i saw it was set to LP mode and "30 min". it should stop around 1:10 am...but it was still recording this morning when i had to stop it manually around 7:30 am. it happens a few time before but i didnt give it any thoughts. but now it is getting annoying.

any1 here knows what is going on? im at work now..im gonna try to do this again when i get home tonite.

I enable one-touch recording by pressing the REC button in a series of continuous key presses. A single key press is record "to infinity". A second key press calls up the one-touch in increments of 30 minutes.

YMMV

Sean, you’re right, if you use the direct entry keypad, less strokes. However, if you use direct entry with arrow keys, it is more. And that comes from adding the date to disk name which is 1 or 2 first number. I know you prefer the key pad entry. But don’t tell me to enter the 4 after the three you would press 4 key four times. And of course, it would take many more strokes to get to the 9 with arrow keys.

At one time you mentioned your “ ole tiered eyes”, unless that picture of you was taken 20 years ago, you don’t have Old tired eyes! I do, and that’s why I prefer a combination of the arrow key and keypad, cause by the time I locate the small lettering (and my eyeglasses) on the keypad I could have arrowed over and entered it, not to mention passed it up and go thru all the connotations again...


I can not easily locate the original posting, so I am replying to the one you made, bphouston.

Personally, I found the tip to push '0' then 'CLEAR' *very* helpful. Despite having Pioneer recorders for a few years, numbers were always a pain in the neck for me until I read that posting. Why? Well, I never used the '0' before because it takes eight (8) pushes of the 1 before one actually gets a 1--the first 7 pushes are punctuation--so I made incorrect assumptions about the '0.'. Recognize the 1 and 0 are the only numeric buttons that are not asociated with letters. SO, for me the tip was much appreciated.

For some reason I find it faster to use the 0/CLEAR tip then the arrow, *especially* on the 640H. If you know someone who owns a 420/520H, ask to see the page where one enters a title-- W-A-Y larger letters, numbers, punctuation, symbols than on the 640H (or previous year's 531/533/633H). I do not experience eye strain entering a title on a 520H using a 20" TV; the title name page looks great. The 640H though? No need for things to be so small.

BTW, as a baby boomer, I am old enough to say it's my tired old eyes, but my vision is better now than it was in high school. Heck, the only time I wear glasses now is to drive the car and only then, so I can see w-a-y into the distance. That said, the arrows are often my first choice; for me it seems a bit faster.

Maybe arrows vs. letter keys is somehow related to whether one is comfortable text messaging on one's cell phone (or enters numbers on a calculator without watching one's fingers)??? Finger watchers might prefer the arrows for some things.

I enable one-touch recording by pressing the REC button in a series of continuous key presses. A single key press is record "to infinity". A second key press calls up the one-touch in increments of 30 minutes.

YMMV


yes that is what i did...i press the REC button twice until i see 30 min on the tv screen. but it seems it is recording to infinity...y is that?

something funny has happen to this machine. i have it for about 3 months.

when i start a manual recording last nite for 30 minutes around 11:40 pm. i click on record buttom on my remote and on my tv screen i saw it was set to LP mode and "30 min". it should stop around 1:10 am...but it was still recording this morning when i had to stop it manually around 7:30 am. it happens a few time before but i didnt give it any thoughts. but now it is getting annoying.


Something very silmilar happened to me, too, last week. Like you, I was using LP, but I pushed the record button to record for one hour rather than 30 minutes. Then I went to bed. Like you, the 640H was still recording when I got up.

Something very silmilar happened to me, too, last week. Like you, I was using LP, but I pushed the record button to record for one hour rather than 30 minutes. Then I went to bed. Like you, the 640H was still recording when I got up.

i wonder is it this machine or the recording mode? im gonna do some more tests when i get home tonite like set it to different mode instead of using LP to SP etc etc.

Hi everyone,

I've been reading for awhile, and really appreciate all your help and advice. Here's a problem I have, which maybe someone can answer. I love this machine, but one thing annoys me.

I have a power splitter coming out of my coax cable, one goes to my vcr, one goes to my TV, and one goes to my 640H. Now, when I switch the TV input to either my TV or vcr, the picture is fine. But when I switch to my 640H, the pq is slightly degraded, and in the channel range 38 to 41, it's even worse, where I see some fine wavy lines.

I've tried swapping cables all around, I've moved the different devices to different outputs on the splitter. I've even spent the extra money to get a Monster cable, going from the splitter to the 640H. That seemed to help a little, but it also seemed to affect the other channels a little - somehow they seem a little "flatter". I also put the coax directly to the 640H, (no splitter) but it was only a slight improvement. I suppose I should try a different power splitter next, but I thought some of you guys might have another idea.

Could it be that the 640H tuner is not as good as the vcr or TV tuners? Or maybe that channel range has some interference or something? But then why the TV and vcr pq is ok - it's only the 640H that shows the poor quality.

Thanks for any ideas!

I have a power splitter coming out of my coax cable, one goes to my vcr, one goes to my TV, and one goes to my 640H. Now, when I switch the TV input to either my TV or vcr, the picture is fine. But when I switch to my 640H, the pq is slightly degraded, and in the channel range 38 to 41, it's even worse, where I see some fine wavy lines.

I've tried swapping cables all around, I've moved the different devices to different outputs on the splitter. I've even spent the extra money to get a Monster cable, going from the splitter to the 640H. That seemed to help a little, but it also seemed to affect the other channels a little - somehow they seem a little "flatter". I also put the coax directly to the 640H, (no splitter) but it was only a slight improvement. I suppose I should try a different power splitter next, but I thought some of you guys might have another idea.
I have the 640 and had a similar problem awhile back, and I found that my coax was not quite tight on the RF In of the 640...I mean "just barely not tight." As soon as I tightened the fitting with a small wrench, my problem went away.

Also, I wouldn't use a std 3-way splitter 'cause one output usually reduces the signal by twice as much as the other two outputs (3.7dB vs 7.4 dB). I'd use at most a 2-way splitter with equal dB reduction (3.7dB) on each output. Since the 640's RF out is just another splitter, could you hang the VCR on the end of the coax from the 640 and record the signal passed thru the 640 on the VCR? I run my system that way...works fine.

Sean, you’re right, if you use the direct entry keypad, less strokes. However, if you use direct entry with arrow keys, it is more.OK, thanks - now I understand where you're coming from.

I know you prefer the key pad entry. But don’t tell me to enter the 4 after the three you would press 4 key four times.You'd probably be surprised when I tell you that I actually would press "4" four times... When I realized that keypad entry was possible I decided it would save me a lot of time, so I laboured through using it for the first few days of entering titles.

It didn't take my fingers very long to learn most the letter and number combinations. For example I can tell you right now with the remote nowhere in sight that pressing the "1" key six times gives you the "-" symbol. I know because I use that symbol quite a lot. So for me, it's quite a lot faster to stay in "key pad" mode than to mentally shift gears between "key pad" and "arrow to the letter" mode.

The only exception I sometimes make is for the "1" and the "-" symbols because they take so many darn keystrokes and I often enter them together as season-dash-episode numbers. (Whoever designed the remote should really, really have made the "1" symbol the first press of that button, FOLLOWED by all the punctuation marks. :()

BTW, my picture is only a couple of months old, but I recently "graduated" to prescription glasses (weak though they may be), hence my "tired old eyes" comment. I can certainly appreciate the difficulty of seeing those tiny letters on the remote, but if you do a lot of titling I really think it's worth struggling through a few days of using it to get your fingers trained. Once you get past that, your eyes are out of the loop.

Since the 640's RF out is just another splitter, could you hang the VCR on the end of the coax from the 640 and record the signal passed thru the 640 on the VCR? I run my system that way...works fine.Yeah, I was thinking that would be the better way to do it as well. In fact you could probably daisy-chain all three devices (DVD-R, VCR and TV) all together and eliminate the splitter altogether.

I have the 640 and had a similar problem awhile back, and I found that my coax was not quite tight on the RF In of the 640...I mean "just barely not tight." As soon as I tightened the fitting with a small wrench, my problem went away.

Also, I wouldn't use a std 3-way splitter 'cause one output usually reduces the signal by twice as much as the other two outputs (3.7dB vs 7.4 dB). I'd use at most a 2-way splitter with equal dB reduction (3.7dB) on each output. Since the 640's RF out is just another splitter, could you hang the VCR on the end of the coax from the 640 and record the signal passed thru the 640 on the VCR? I run my system that way...works fine.

Thanks wabjxo and sean,

Although the power splitter is supposed to boost the output, do you think it's not really enough of a boost?

I'm going to check to make sure everything is nice and tight, altho with all the swapping you'd think I would have noticed something.

About daisy chaining, would I be able to record one show on the 640H while recording another on the vcr while watching something else on TV? That's the whole reason I thought I needed a splitter. If I could get rid of that, it would be great!

The puzzling thing though is when I attached only the 640H to the coax (no splitter) it didn't really help that much.

Thanks wabjxo and sean,

Although the power splitter is supposed to boost the output, do you think it's not really enough of a boost?
You probably won't need an amplified splitter with a dasiy chain setup?

I'm going to check to make sure everything is nice and tight, altho with all the swapping you'd think I would have noticed something.
In swapping cables, you might not have noticed a loose input end on the 640? Use a small wrench and tighten that connector snugly?

About daisy chaining, would I be able to record one show on the 640H while recording another on the vcr while watching something else on TV? That's the whole reason I thought I needed a splitter. If I could get rid of that, it would be great!
With the VCR on, you can see its ouput if you set the "TV/VCR" selection of the VCR remote to "VCR" with the TV on Channel 3 or 4, then switch to the TV tuner with the "TV" selection on the VCR remote. When both the 640 and the VCR are off, you should be able to watch normal TV w/o any selection on your TV's "ANT/CATV" input/connection. With just the 640 on, you have to select one of the TV's A/V inputs anyway to see programs thru the 640's tuner or on the HDD or DVD.

The puzzling thing though is when I attached only the 640H to the coax (no splitter) it didn't really help that much.
This could be explained if the 640's RF In connector were slightly loose...or even if the center wire is "short" (make sure it sticks out at least to the end of the nut, or longer). If it's very tight and has a long center wire, don't know what else to do except maybe "Tune" those bad channels on the 640? If the PQ is good thru everything except the 640, ....???

One thing I just thought of...it could be on the output end of the 640. That would explain things in your setup. How are you connected from the 640 to the TV. If composite, check/replace those wires...I just got some "Digital" composite cables from Wal-Mart and they made a noticeable diff. in my PQ compared to the "normal" kind...they seem to be higher-quality construction than the normal composite cables.

Hopefully, you'll find some mechanical explanation...in my setup, the 640's tuner is actually slightly better than my TV's tuner.

I'd say it's the Tuner in your Pioneer if your running your cable directly into it & your still having a problem.

If your not happy with the Pioneer's Tuner & your happy with your VCR's Tuner when your not recording on the VCR just use the VCR's Tuner instead of the Pioneer's.

In my set up (No Cable Box) I feed the main RF Cable into my DVD Recorder then Out to my VCR & then Out of the VCR into my TV.

For A/V Connections I feed my VCR's A/V Out to the DVD Recorder's A/V IN & the DVD Recorders A/V Out to my TV.

With this set up I can do exactly what you want to do, Record 2 different programs, one on the DVD Recorder & one on the VCR while I watch another channel on the TV all at the same time.

With this set up I'm also able to use my VCR as a Tuner for my DVD Recorder when I'm not using the VCR.

I can also Timer Record programs on the DVD Recorder using the VCR's Tuner by programming "Input" instead of a CH Number on the Recorder & then I set up the same ON/OFF Timer Program on the VCR. I've also found this useful because if for some reason the DVD Recorder has missed recording a program at least I know that I have it on the VCR.

Also Tuner's can be funny because years back I had 3 JVC VCR's which were all the same model number & on every one of them the Tuner's were a little different.

I hate to say it but I find the newer Tuners from China STINK compared to the older Tuners from Japan. Let's hope China's new HD ATSC Tuners that they will be using in the new DVD Recorders will be good ones & not Junk.

TAbout daisy chaining, would I be able to record one show on the 640H while recording another on the vcr while watching something else on TV? That's the whole reason I thought I needed a splitter. If I could get rid of that, it would be great!The 640 will pass the coax signal straight through from it's input to it's output no matter what it's doing. Most VCR's have a "TV/VCR" switch that passes the coax straight through on the "TV" setting or outputs only the VCR signal on the "VCR" setting. If your VCR is like this, then you could connect the coax like this:

Wall outlet -> Pioneer 640 -> VCR -> TV

You'll be able to tune any analogue channel on your TV no matter what the Pioneer and the VCR are doing as long as you set the VCR to the "TV" setting.

As wabjxo mentioned, you'll need an additional set of composite or S-Video cables from the Pioneer to the TV in order to view stuff recorded on the Pioneer.

I'm not sure if this is any better than using the powered splitter, but it's an option you could try if you like.

I am having problem re-programming the remote address.
I can change the address on the machine but when I change it on the remote; it will not work.
Is there a trick to do this.

I am having problem re-programming the remote address.
I can change the address on the machine but when I change it on the remote; it will not work.
Is there a trick to do this.

It has been a number of months since I owned the Pioneer 640. But as far as it relates to setting the remote I believe it is covered towards the end of the manual. My recollection is that it is beyond page 100 in the manual. I was struggling with a Panasonic with the same problem at the time - thus my recollection. Start at page 100 and move forward. I think you will find your answer.

ok just did a quick test with manual recording...set it with LP, EP, 30 min, 1 hour...and it autotmatically turns off and turn off at 30 min or 1 hours. but i was watching a dvd movie with the 640. i wonder if that has any effect on it. im gonna run the test tonite while i go to sleep.

we'll let u guys know the result tomorrow morning.

I am having problem re-programming the remote address.
I can change the address on the machine but when I change it on the remote; it will not work.
Is there a trick to do this.
The "trick" is to hold the RETURN button and the number button down for about 5 sec, or until you see the display change on the DVR...same number as you set the DVR for, of course.

Turns out it's page 117 of the manual.

"Press and hold return and then press 1, 2 or 3 to set."

Thanks guys, I will try it out on the weekend.

My first thought was, I'll always need to watch the TV-VCR switch on the vcr remote, and make sure it's set right - one more thing to keep in mind...

I'm also wondering, the RF signal going through 2 devices before it gets to the TV, does it get any degradation before the TV sees it? I'm guessing not, or you wouldn't be mentioning this approach :)

It's a brilliant idea to use the vcr tuner that way, but I also know I'm going to find it a pain to have to program the vcr as well as the 640 whenever I want something from these couple of channels, but if I get a better picture it will be worth it - this channel is probably my favorite (hence my frustration).

Thanks again, and I'll let you know how it went after I try it out.

Oh btw wabjxo, I have component cables from the 640 to the TV, so I don't think it's the output. And just curious, how would you "tune" those channels?

Here's another question. Is it just my imagination, or have I noticed that when I record to my HDD, and then make a HS copy to a DVD (SP mode), the PQ coming from the DVD is not quite as good as the PQ coming from the HDD?

Why would that happen, considering everything is digitally recorded and should be exactly the same?

Or is that just imagination? :)

Oh btw wabjxo, I have component cables from the 640 to the TV, so I don't think it's the output. And just curious, how would you "tune" those channels?
Go to channel you want to tune. Go to Initial Setup > Tuner > Manual CH Setting > Next Screen. Turn AFT off, then tune manually.

Here's another question. Is it just my imagination, or have I noticed that when I record to my HDD, and then make a HS copy to a DVD (SP mode), the PQ coming from the DVD is not quite as good as the PQ coming from the HDD?

Why would that happen, considering everything is digitally recorded and should be exactly the same?

Or is that just imagination? :)If you are doing a high-speed copy to the DVD there should be no difference in pq between the DVD and the HDD.

If however you do a real-time copy, there will be pq loss because you are re-encoding to the DVD.

You have to be careful because if you start out with too much content in the copy list to fit on a DVD, the 640 offers to adjust the recording mode to fit the DVD which will re-encode if you accept. Before starting your copy, always check the recording mode on the final copy screen to be sure you are getting a high-speed copy if possible. (It should be fairly obvious if you are re-encoding because it must copy in real-time which is much slower than the 7 or 8 minutes of a high-speed copy, and you can see the program(s) playing.)

Go to channel you want to tune. Go to Initial Setup > Tuner > Manual CH Setting > Next Screen. Turn AFT off, then tune manually.

Wow... I must try that, hopefully I won't mess anything up.

But I presume I can go back by setting it to automatic again. :)

Thanks!

If you are doing a high-speed copy to the DVD there should be no difference in pq between the DVD and the HDD.

If however you do a real-time copy, there will be pq loss because you are re-encoding to the DVD.

You have to be careful because if you start out with too much content in the copy list to fit on a DVD, the 640 offers to adjust the recording mode to fit the DVD which will re-encode if you accept. Before starting your copy, always check the recording mode on the final copy screen to be sure you are getting a high-speed copy if possible. (It should be fairly obvious if you are re-encoding because it must copy in real-time which is much slower than the 7 or 8 minutes of a high-speed copy, and you can see the program(s) playing.)

I'm sure it's a HS copy, but, I'm not sure if I'm just imagining or not, so I'm just wondering if it's even possible to lose some quality, since they *should* be identical. But I thought, maybe the DVD has some flaws that the HDD doesn't.

It has been a number of months since I owned the Pioneer 640. But as far as it relates to setting the remote I believe it is covered towards the end of the manual. My recollection is that it is beyond page 100 in the manual. I was struggling with a Panasonic with the same problem at the time - thus my recollection. Start at page 100 and move forward. I think you will find your answer.
Yes; doing it by the book.
The problem is: the remote will not take the changes.
No matter what.

I too had problems reprogramming the remote at first.

Take your time...and wait between steps.

Yes; doing it by the book.
The problem is: the remote will not take the changes.
No matter what.
Are you HOLDING the Return and number bottons down for at least 5 sec., or until the display changes on the DVR?

You have to HOLD the buttons down for awhile...after you've already changed the number in the DVR itself. Once the display changes, you've reset the remote to match the DVR.

I'm sure it's a HS copy, but, I'm not sure if I'm just imagining or not, so I'm just wondering if it's even possible to lose some quality, since they *should* be identical. But I thought, maybe the DVD has some flaws that the HDD doesn't.Flaws on the DVD might cause read problems that would make the DVD unplayable, but won't effect the pq. High-speed copies are identical to the original. Either they play or they don't. The only other possibility I can think of is if there was some flaw in the circuitry that caused distortion in playback only from the DVD drive, but I think more users would have noticed that by now, and it would affect store-bought DVDs as well.

Hey all, here I go beating a dead horse again...

Has anyone solved the mystery of why some Divx movies play and some will not? For the most part, all the divx movies that I have tried to play work fine, but some (about 10-20%) will not play. All I get is a black screen and the audio plays fine.

The only guess I have is some sort of copy protection bug/flag.

Anyone else have these problems?

RF


Well, I am coming closer to solving the mystery of certain Divx files not playing.... :eek:

The Divx files that were not playing appear to be PAL encodes...GSpot (http://www.headbands.com/gspot/) reports the frame rate in the problem files at 25 FPS (which I believe is a PAL ecode).

All the videos that play fine in the Pioneer report frame rates of 23.97 which I think is a frame rate that plays well with the Pioneer DVR (and other set top boxes).

Any thoughts?

Richard

You have to HOLD the buttons down for awhile...
Thank you; that did the trick and everything is working!

Well, I am coming closer to solving the mystery of certain Divx files not playing.... :eek:

The Divx files that were not playing appear to be PAL encodes...GSpot reports the frame rate in the problem files at 25 FPS (which I believe is a PAL ecode).

All the videos that play fine in the Pioneer report frame rates of 23.97 which I think is a frame rate that plays well with the Pioneer DVR (and other set top boxes).

Any thoughts?

Richard

Here's a thought -- you need to register a complaint with Pioneer to fix this thing. According to DivX support (I actually opened a case with them), ALL certified players MUST play ANY DivX file, including the 25FPS ones. Reference number is 070113-000484

When I called Pioneer regarding this, they aparently knew of the issue, but have no immediate plans on fixing it. Their only suggestion was to register a complaint to address it in future firmware update.

We need to call Pioneer and register a complaint to have it fixed. The more calls they get, the quicker they fix it. Please, take a few minutes and give them a buzz. 800-421-1404

I will definately give them a call...for some reason I seem to remember a blurb in the manual that was a disclaimer saying that some Divx files may not play (but I can't find it right now).

I may be getting myself confused with the DVR that I tried before the Pioneer...

I guess my next step is to try and re-encode the Divx at 25 fps to 24 fps and see what happens...

RF

I hooked up my new Tivo 3 last week and without any intention to, the remote control for the Pio 640h-S recorder has some limited capacity for controlling the Tivo 3. Specifically, the 3 "P's": Pause, Play and Power (off) commands from the Pioneer remote performs the same functions on the Tivo 3, at the same time as they are being performed upon the Pio recorder. Not sure why/how this happened, but I certainly did not intend for this to happen!

Any ideas what's going on here, or more importantly, how to permanently disengage the Pioneer remote from acting upon the Tivo?

Any ideas what's going on here, or more importantly, how to permanently disengage the Pioneer remote from acting upon the Tivo?Check the Pioneer tips and tricks thread which describes how to assign a different device number to the remote.

Check the Pioneer tips and tricks thread which describes how to assign a different device number to the remote.

For others who may have had trouble finding it, the thread is called "Hints & Tips for PIO640 users" and it's at
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=793772

I hooked up my new Tivo 3 last week and without any intention to, the remote control for the Pio 640h-S recorder has some limited capacity for controlling the Tivo 3. Specifically, the 3 "P's": Pause, Play and Power (off) commands from the Pioneer remote performs the same functions on the Tivo 3, at the same time as they are being performed upon the Pio recorder. Not sure why/how this happened, but I certainly did not intend for this to happen!

Any ideas what's going on here, or more importantly, how to permanently disengage the Pioneer remote from acting upon the Tivo?
I had this same problem and fixed it.

I actually have 2 Pioneer DVD recorders and several TiVo (DirecTV versions) units.

I had to set my Pioneer DVD recorders to the second and third choice remote code settings since the first/default setting interfered with one of my TiVo's. Everything has been working fine since I made those changes many months ago.

The Pioneer remote code setting instructions are near the end of the manual, maybe in an appendix section (can't rememeber off hand and don't have the manual handy).

Here is an earlier post in this thread that addresses your question: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9655179&&#post9655179

Let us know how you make out.

I've been doing disc backups of many discs, from many sources. Almost all have been -R discs. Finally, I came across four +R discs. I couldn't copy any of them! When I put them in, and tried to load them to the HDD, I got a "cannot copy" message. Has anyone successfully done a disc backup of a +R disc? The manual clearly says that the 640 will do a disc backup of +R discs. The 640 had no problem playing the discs.

Also, just as I was about to leave for work, I encountered three discs in a row that produced a "no disc loaded" message, when I put them in, and tried to do a disc backup. The tray opened, and it said "load a disc!" I did try one disc I had already copied, and that one was recognized. But, the three undetected discs were from three different sources, and I had never encountered this message before. So, three in a row seemed very strange. I have played the discs in another player. Does anyone have any ideas what may cause this? I will do some more experimentation, when I get home.

Another question... If I can't do a disc backup with +R discs, and I have to copy them to the HDD in real time, will I get a better picture if I play the disc back in the 640, vs playing it on another DVD player, and connecting it to the 640 with S-Vid and line audio?

I've been doing disc backups of many discs, from many sources. Almost all have been -R discs. Finally, I came across four +R discs. I couldn't copy any of them! When I put them in, and tried to load them to the HDD, I got a "cannot copy" message. Has anyone successfully done a disc backup of a +R disc? The manual clearly says that the 640 will do a disc backup of +R discs. The 640 had no problem playing the discs.



Not exactly the same scenario, but I get the "No Disc" error when I switch discs in the DVR. It usually occurs when the machine is powered on with a disc already in there, and then when I switch discs and try to go to the disc navigator, I get the "no disc" message.

This only happens with a disc that Divx files that I have burned on a +R or -R with my PC.

The solution for me, turn the DVR off, and then back on, and then it will recognize the disc...

Where oh where is that 'magic' firmware update? I don't think we'll ever see one for d/l...

RF

i know that every time i push down the buttom to "skip commercial", it skips in interval of 30 seconds...but is there a way it set it up just with ONLY 1 push to assign it to skip 1 min, 2 min or 3 min of interval? remember i know u can accomplish it with MULTIPLE of pushing the skip commercial...but i just want to do it once...preferably every 3 minutes (avg. time between commercial and shows).

does this device have this feature or am i dreaming?

i have some vcr tapes that i will transfer to the hd...while i do this is it possible to still watch another program on the hd while iam recording from vcr to the hd?

i know that every time i push down the buttom to "skip commercial", it skips in interval of 30 seconds...but is there a way it set it up just with ONLY 1 push to assign it to skip 1 min, 2 min or 3 min of interval?

I'm afraid the Pioneer remote is not programmable.

People here have mentioned the programmable Harmony remove, with which I'm not familiar. If you can program it to have one button press generate a sequence of codes, you can do what you want. (Try a thread search or look here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=710275).)

Otherwise, I haven't found it that hard to hit the button five time for a 3-minute skip; in time you may get used to it also. :)

i have some vcr tapes that i will transfer to the hd...while i do this is it possible to still watch another program on the hd while iam recording from vcr to the hd?
Yes.

I am one happy camper!!

I connected everything the way you guys suggested, (RF through 640 through vcr to TV)and the pq cleared up great!! Wow!!
For some strange reason a different channel now has a bit of snow, but I don't really care about that one, since I seldom watch it. Funny why that happens though.

One odd thing, when I have the vcr on, I expected that the vcr/tv button would control things, but apparently it doesn't. The only thing that happens when I toggle the button is that the channel gets all fuzzed out, until I toggle it back. What's going on there?

Thanks a lot you guys, for being so ready to help, esp wabjxo, Sean, Bill1313, ACPewty. You're really a great resource!

Two more questions... I can't figure out how to put in a chapter mark... where is that done?
Also, is there any way to combine two titles?

Thanks!

I am one happy camper!!

I connected everything the way you guys suggested, (RF through 640 through vcr to TV)and the pq cleared up great!! Wow!!
For some strange reason a different channel now has a bit of snow, but I don't really care about that one, since I seldom watch it. Funny why that happens though.

One odd thing, when I have the vcr on, I expected that the vcr/tv button would control things, but apparently it doesn't. The only thing that happens when I toggle the button is that the channel gets all fuzzed out, until I toggle it back. What's going on there?

Thanks a lot you guys, for being so ready to help, esp wabjxo, Sean, Bill1313, ACPewty. You're really a great resource!

Two more questions... I can't figure out how to put in a chapter mark... where is that done?
Also, is there any way to combine two titles?

Thanks!
When you press the TV/VCR button, one position gives you the picture from the VCR, for which you have to turn your TV to channel 3 or 4.

Chapter marks can be put in real-time if you watch a program and use the PAUSE button at the beginning and end of each commercial. Another way is, after recording, select the title in Disc Nav, arrow right to Edit > Chapter Edit.

Just remember, if you edit a title from Disc Nav, you're changing the original recording. I always edit in a Copylist, which is a virtual copy of the original. Any edits make there don't affect the original.

You can only combine two titles in a Copylist...once your ready to copy, select the first title in an assembled Copylist, arrow right, arrow up to 2nd page of menu, select Combine. You then select the 2nd title to add to the first into one, etc.

One odd thing, when I have the vcr on, I expected that the vcr/tv button would control things, but apparently it doesn't. The only thing that happens when I toggle the button is that the channel gets all fuzzed out, until I toggle it back. What's going on there?

The TV/VCR setting on your VCR controls the source of the program that goes on the RF Out connector of the VCR:

** TV: The VCR's RF Out is a passthrough of RF In, and you do your tuning on the TV

** VCR: The VCR's RF Out is the channel that the VCR is tuned to (or the tape it's playing), but translated to channel 3 or 4. Your TV must be on channel 3 or 4.

Someone else can explain this next bit better, but briefly:

If you have VCR on channel 44 and TV tuned to channel 63, with VCR/TV on TV, the TV is taking the channel 63 frequency from the cable which runs from the VCR's RF Out connector. When you switch the VCR to VCR, there's still *some* of that signal at the channel 63 frequency but the main or good signal is now on channel 3 or 4 on that connector and is channel 44.

If you now switch your TV to channel 3 or 4, you'll see a good signal of channel 44.

Two more questions... I can't figure out how to put in a chapter mark... where is that done?

Disc Navigator.
Highlight the title you want to edit, press right cursor.
Select Edit, then Chapter Edit.

The remote on older Pioneer models had a button you could use to put in a chapter mark during play, but the remotes for the newer models don't. Even though the older remotes work with the newer models to some extent, that particular button doesn't.

Also, is there any way to combine two titles?

Only when copying from HDD to DVD. Set up your copy list, and then you can combine titles during recording to DVD though they stay separate on HDD.

(I don't know about the other way, DVD->HDD, whether you can combine titles during transfer. If you can, it would again be in the copy list.)

Thanks guys.. everything makes sense except for one thing.

When I go to Chapter Edit, I only see options Divide, Erase and Combine (and Exit). No Chapter mark. Am I missing something?

Thanks guys.. everything makes sense except for one thing.

When I go to Chapter Edit, I only see options Divide, Erase and Combine (and Exit). No Chapter mark. Am I missing something?Yep, there are 2 screens of menu options there.

it happens again...i set my 640 to record manually for 1 hours last nite...and this morning it is still recording. any1 here is having the same problem? this is getting annoying as hell. do i have a defective unit?

you may want to initialize your unit. However, there is a good chance that you have a defective unit. I ocassionally encounter that problem when I used to use the 633.

you may want to initialize your unit. However, there is a good chance that you have a defective unit. I ocassionally encounter that problem when I used to use the 633.

how do i initialize the unit? im gonna run a test again...what happen if it doesnt happen again? if it doesn't happen again...this problem seems intermittent...so what does that mean?

how do i initialize the unit? im gonna run a test again...what happen if it doesnt happen again? if it doesn't happen again...this problem seems intermittent...so what does that mean?
Just a VWAG!

I think you're using the REC button to set a rec time in 30-min. increments. If so, I'd change to a TIMED program using the Easy Timer.

This is the WAG: maybe the 640 uses a "countdown timer" in the REC-button-add-time method, and you get sags or blips in your power that interfere with a proper and continuous countdown...the timer gets "confused" and, rather than just shutdown, it keeps recording...or it loses the value it started with...or...?

Anyway, setting an Easy Timer program...very simple...should keep your program time intact since the 640 has an awesome battery backup that should keep the start and end times intact thru power sags and blips.

Just a VWAG!

I think you're using the REC button to set a rec time in 30-min. increments. If so, I'd change to a TIMED program using the Easy Timer.

This is the WAG: maybe the 640 uses a "countdown timer" in the REC-button-add-time method, and you get sags or blips in your power that interfere with a proper and continuous countdown...the timer gets "confused" and, rather than just shutdown, it keeps recording...or it loses the value it started with...or...?

Anyway, setting an Easy Timer program...very simple...should keep your program time intact since the 640 has an awesome battery backup that should keep the start and end times intact thru power sags and blips.

what is VWAG and WAG? yes my apartment loses power a couple of time in the past when i have too many appliance running at the same time. and i dont believe it has "countdown timer" or count down...it counts UP when i set it manually.

and no i dont want to use a easy timer....what happen when i see a show i want to record right away? for example...a show i want to record and it is 9:02 pm....how would i set that in easy timer? 9:00pm, 9:15pm, 9:30pm? what cause the easy timer has a 15 minutes interval.

i like that other advice of initializing it...maybe that would fix my problem? can any1 let me know? thx in advance.

ps: right now 11:26am on my watch and it is also showing 11:26 am on the 640.

just press the rec. button again and the countdown timer goes incrementally from 30 min, 60 min, 90 min etc from the moment you record the video.

just press the rec. button again and the countdown timer goes incrementally from 30 min, 60 min, 90 min etc from the moment you record the video.

david: im sorry...but did u even read my thread carefully? yes, i already set to MANUALLY record for 1 HR last nite. obviously i press the REC button until i saw 1 hour on the tv screen....how else would i know it records for 1 hr.?

i was messing with the 640 to initialize again...i went to the menu "initialize setup" and timer...it has 2 options: manual or auto. when i select auto...it bought up the time for each channel...or should i set it for manual again?

im confused as to this settings...can someone help me out?

Just a VWAG!

...
This is the WAG: ....


^^^ i hate ppl that use acroynm no one can understand...can any know wtf is this guy talking about VWAG or WAG? what does that stands for?

^^^ i hate ppl that use acroynm no one can understand...can any know wtf is this guy talking about VWAG or WAG? what does that stands for?

WAG = wild-ass guess
V = very

In the engineering community we also had the SWAG where S = scientific

david: im sorry...but did u even read my thread carefully?

my bad :) . People have been telling me that reading carefully is a good thing, I foolishly ignored them thus far. ;)

ok which bring to my original question...like i said...this happens inconsistently...somone suggested to re-initialize it. when i go to the "initialize setup" screen...i see an option for basic>clock settings. u can set it for "manual" or "auto".

what am i suppose to do over here?

damn, I really need to learn to read.

I usually choose "auto".

damn, I really need to learn to read.

I usually choose "auto".

it said it was unable to set it "auto"

ok here is the current updates. just set it clock to "manual" in clock settings.

set a 30 minutes MANUAL recording....as i keep checking on the 640 sporadically...the time clocks went from 1 min, 5 minutes, 15 minutes, 29 minutes, then 34 minutes. it didnt know to stop when it was at 30 minutes.

what now? can any1 shred some light? is my unit defective after all?

it said it was unable to set it "auto"
I realize that but I don't mean to give an advice, just mentioning that I usually choose "auto" instead of manual.

Regardless, if you still have that sporadic problem, you may want to ask Pioneer to reflash the firmware and that may solve the problem. however, if you have the option to ask for a replacement, then it's better for you to do so. IMHO.

I realize that but I don't mean to give an advice, just mentioning that I usually choose "auto" instead of manual.

..... .

it shouldnt matter if it is "auto" or "manual...cuz this problem never happens before when it was set to "manual". im gonna give pioneer a call tomorrow to find out wtf is gong on.

set a 30 minutes MANUAL recording....as i keep checking on the 640 sporadically...the time clocks went from 1 min, 5 minutes, 15 minutes, 29 minutes, then 34 minutes. it didnt know to stop when it was at 30 minutes.I have a Pioneer 633 (last year's model) which is very similar in most respects to the 640. When I do a timed recording, it counts in the opposite direction. In other words, if I press "Rec" ONCE, it will record with no time limit and count UP, but if I press "Rec" a SECOND time, it shows "0:30" on the display and will then start counting down with each minute: "0:29", "0:28", etc., until it reaches "0:00" at which point it shuts off.

Can anyone else with a Pioneer 640 confirm that a timed recording counts down rather than up?

mine counts down just like the 633.

I have a Pioneer 633 (last year's model) which is very similar in most respects to the 640. When I do a timed recording, it counts in the opposite direction. In other words, if I press "Rec" ONCE, it will record with no time limit and count UP, but if I press "Rec" a SECOND time, it shows "0:30" on the display and will then start counting down with each minute: "0:29", "0:28", etc., until it reaches "0:00" at which point it shuts off.

Can anyone else with a Pioneer 640 confirm that a timed recording counts down rather than up?Mine works like that as well but I rarely use the feature vs. setting a timer recording if there is doubt I might want to time-shift or save.

YMMV

Ok I think my 640 is messed up. Can any1 just press REC button ONCE? Does the timer goes up or down? I think is mine is set for infinite recording no matter what I set my time to...

when I click mine ONCE the timer goes UP.

Check the Pioneer tips and tricks thread which describes how to assign a different device number to the remote.

For others who may have had trouble finding it, the thread is called "Hints & Tips for PIO640 users" and it's at
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=793772

I had this same problem and fixed it.

I actually have 2 Pioneer DVD recorders and several TiVo (DirecTV versions) units.

I had to set my Pioneer DVD recorders to the second and third choice remote code settings since the first/default setting interfered with one of my TiVo's. Everything has been working fine since I made those changes many months ago.

The Pioneer remote code setting instructions are near the end of the manual, maybe in an appendix section (can't rememeber off hand and don't have the manual handy).

Here is an earlier post in this thread that addresses your question: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9655179&&#post9655179

Let us know how you make out.

Thanks, gentlemen. :)

Once I found and read about the procedure on the instruction page, I couldn't get it to work for me, even after making several attempts, not realizing that I had to change the numerical assignment in the setup menu FIRST, before attempting to implement the "hold RETURN and press 1, 2, or 3" procedure. I thought I could just do that, not needing to make the change from the setup menu first. The instruction is on page 117 of the manual, for those who may stumble upon this question again.

Thanks, gentlemen. :)

Once I found the correct instruction page, it wasn't working for me, after making several attempts, not realizing that I had to change it in the setup menu FIRST, before attempting to implement the "hold RETURN and press 1, 2, or 3" procedure. The instruction is on page 117 of the manual, for those who may stumble upon this question again.
The "undocumented" trick in the last step with the remote, not stated on pg 117, is you have to "press and hold RETURN then press AND HOLD 1, 2 or 3 ABOUT 5 SEC, OR UNTIL THE DIPLAY CHANGES ON THE 640.

Yep, there are 2 screens of menu options there.


Sorry to be so dense, but I only see "Divide, Erase and Combine", and at the bottom it says PlayMode, HomeMenu, and Help.

How do I get to the second screen? :confused:

You're mixing two things: Combining Titles and Editing Chapters.

You can only Divide/Erase/Combine CHAPTERS in the Chapter Edit menu AFTER you've set some Chapters by erasing a section, like a commercial. Once the title has been edited by erasing sections, then you can use the Chapter Edit menu to Divide/Erase/Combine.

You can set automatically spaced Chapters by Copying a Title in real-time to a DVD. That will set Chapters at the interval you entered in the Initial Setup menu (but you'll lose any Chapters you set by manually editing).

You're probably looking for a way to simply "set" a chapter mark at a particular point in a title, like pressing a "Chapter Set" button. The Pio 520 had such a button, but the 640 does not (unfortunately).

The other "Combine" is for TITLES in a Copylist, where you can put two or more Titles together into one Title. That Combine menu is on a 2nd page, which was mentioned in an earlier post. The Chapter Edit menu doesn't have a 2nd page.

Yes, exactly, I was hoping I could set a chapter mark somehow, without having to delete a section. If the show has no commercial, it seems a shame to have to delete something. I'm surprised they didn't include that in the edit section. :(

Thanks for clarifying that.

ok this is really weird...

just ran some test again...this time it is counting DOWN from 30 minutes, 29 min, 28 min. etc. then after "00" it shuts itself down.

all the tests i ran this morning..even though i set it to "30 min", it counts UP...so it didnt stop after 30 mins.

this is fubar...any1 know wtf is going on?

just ran some test again...this time it is counting DOWN from 30 minutes, 29 min, 28 min. etc. then after "00" it shuts itself down. all the tests i ran this morning..even though i set it to "30 min", it counts UP...so it didnt stop after 30 mins.I can't explain what's happening, but my advice would be that if you set a time and then see it counting up instead of down then it's not going to stop automatically. In that event you should re-initialize the time by pressing the "Rec" button repeatedly until the time you want appears again, then verify that it starts counting down from there. You should be able to do this without interrupting the recording.

I can't explain what's happening, but my advice would be that if you set a time and then see it counting up instead of down then it's not going to stop automatically. In that event you should re-initialize the time by pressing the "Rec" button repeatedly until the time you want appears again, then verify that it starts counting down from there. You should be able to do this without interrupting the recording.


YUP...sean...that's what i just did...i just set it to "1 hr. 30 min" the first time and it was counting UP. stop the recording and set it up again...it counts DOWN the 2nd tried.

thx to everyone who was helpful...i guess i figure what the problem is and fix it myself.

YUP...sean...that's what i just did...i just set it to "1 hr. 30 min" the first time and it was counting UP. stop the recording and set it up again...it counts DOWN the 2nd tried.You shouldn't have to stop the recording - just press the "Rec" button while the recording is still in progress as many times as you need to in order to get the right time displayed again. You can do this on the 633 without interrupting the recording already in progress, and I'm pretty sure the 640 would work the same way. You can even cancel the time remaining by pressing "Rec" until "00:00" is displayed, in which case it will no longer stop automatically.

^^^ i hate ppl that use acroynm no one can understand...can any know wtf is this guy talking about VWAG or WAG? what does that stands for?


And------what is wtf ????????
Don't answer that!
I couldn't resist. Sorry!

And------what is wtf ????????
Don't answer that!
I couldn't resist. Sorry!

sorry i have to answer...most ppl on the net know wtf, lol, lmao mean. but i highly doubt most ppl knows WAG or VWAG mean.

VWAG = Volkswagen Aktiengesellschaft ?

You shouldn't have to stop the recording - just press the "Rec" button while the recording is still in progress as many times as you need to in order to get the right time displayed again. You can do this on the 633 without interrupting the recording already in progress, and I'm pretty sure the 640 would work the same way. You can even cancel the time remaining by pressing "Rec" until "00:00" is displayed, in which case it will no longer stop automatically.

ok im gonna give this a try tonite. thx.

here is the final update...follow sean's instructions...1st tried..it counts UP even though i set it to "1 hrs"...then press REC again...it counts DOWN.

so why is that my machine doesn't recognize the 1st tried anymore? i dont think this happen in the past. any1 here also having the same problem on 1st tried?

here is the final update...follow sean's instructions...1st tried..it counts UP even though i set it to "1 hrs"...then press REC again...it counts DOWN.

so why is that my machine doesn't recognize the 1st tried anymore? i dont think this happen in the past. any1 here also having the same problem on 1st tried?

I'm going to go out on a limb here. I believe your experience is user error. The Pioneer is too well designed to be having the problems you report. My advice is to read the manual.

What you report is unique. And never reported previously in a very long and well documented thread. I believe the uniqueness resides with you. Not with the machine. Spend a bit more time with the manual and you should be fine.

I'm going to go out on a limb here. I believe your experience is user error. The Pioneer is too well designed to be having the problems you report. My advice is to read the manual.

What you report is unique. And never reported previously in a very long and well documented thread. I believe the uniqueness resides with you. Not with the machine. Spend a bit more time with the manual and you should be fine.

sorry...when i hit REC button for MANUAL recording and see "30 min", "1 hr", etc. (with my 2 own eyes) on the tv screen..and it doesn't work properly (not counting DOWN...i.e. infinite recording) the 1st tried...who fault is that?

u think by reading the manual will help me with this "unique" problem?

nextoo: y dont u tell us who u really r? u working for pioneer or something?

sorry...when i hit REC button for MANUAL recording and see "30 min", "1 hr", etc. (with my 2 own eyes) on the tv screen..and it doesn't work properly (not counting DOWN...i.e. infinite recording) the 1st tried...who fault is that?

u think by reading the manual will help me with this "unique" problem?

nextoo: y dont u tell us who u really r? u working for pioneer or something?

Yes I work for Pioneeeeerrrr. By the way what is Pioneeeeerrrr?

Everybody around here has suspected this (?) but now that you have accused me of it I have to come clean.

And I also wrote the manual. Maybe that was the nerve. :eek:

Again. Read the manual and you will be fine.

I dunno, what vincentnyc seems to be experiencing sounds pretty straightforward. He hits the "Rec" button on the remote to start a manual recording. He hits it a second time so that the display shows "0:30". From that point it should start counting down, but he's saying it's counting up instead. Right Vincent? It's pretty simple, I don't see where there's much room for user error in two pushes of the same button...

Does anyone know of any "modes" or setup configuration that could cause this behaviour?

I dunno, what vincentnyc seems to be experiencing sounds pretty straightforward. He hits the "Rec" button on the remote to start a manual recording. He hits it a second time so that the display shows "0:30". From that point it should start counting down, but he's saying it's counting up instead. Right Vincent? It's pretty simple, I don't see where there's much room for user error in two pushes of the same button...

Does anyone know of any "modes" or setup configuration that could cause this behaviour?

yes sean...there must be some mess up configs or something. gotta investigate some more.

ps - nextroo...welcome to my ignore list.

For everyone except vincentnyc...cause he hate me for "WAG"...don't read this vincentnyc!

When using the REC button to set a time to record, each press within 3 sec will increase the time by 30 min., but if you wait 4 sec...OR ANYTIME AFTER 4 SEC... that next button press will reset the time to record to 00 (ZERO) and the recording will continue, with no end time and the record clock COUNTING UP...so, it will record to infinity.

Waiting 4 sec OR LONGER and pressing the button (on purpose or accidentally) will deactivate the countdown clock and the record clock will appear instead, continuing the recording until you wake up in the morning and say,
WTFH, ITISARTSA1:30, BHITISR, OMG, WMID, IBPTP, HELP!

Thanks guys.. everything makes sense except for one thing.

When I go to Chapter Edit, I only see options Divide, Erase and Combine (and Exit). No Chapter mark. Am I missing something?

Divide = insert chapter mark

Combine = remove chapter mark

Erase = delete chapter. (This can't be undone, so you get a confirming prompt when you select Erase.)

^^^ i hate ppl that use acroynm no one can understand...can any know wtf is this guy talking about VWAG or WAG? what does that stands for?

Tell us what ppl and wtf mean and we'll tell you what WAG means. LOL :)

Yes, exactly, I was hoping I could set a chapter mark somehow, without having to delete a section. If the show has no commercial, it seems a shame to have to delete something. I'm surprised they didn't include that in the edit section. :(

Thanks for clarifying that.

You absolutely *can* add chapter marks without erasing anything. I'm surprised a long-time poster said otherwise.

Disc Navigator
Edit
Chapter Edit
Video compatible (my recommendation) or Frame Accurate
Then just use the various motion keys (play, FF, REV, etc) to get to where you want your mark, and press the Enter button.

To be accurate down to the half-second, go into Pause. Then use the frame advance/frame reverse buttons.

By the way, in chapter editing, Stop acts like Pause. To get out of chapter editing, select Exit on screen.

Tell us what ppl and wtf mean and we'll tell you what WAG means. LOL :)

Come on now "BS" :D

Altho I was puzzled on ppl.

yes sean...there must be some mess up configs or something. gotta investigate some more.

ps - nextroo...welcome to my ignore list.

I just put nextroo on my ignore list too.

ps - nextroo...welcome to my ignore list.
Please put me...wabjxroo... on your ignore list too!

you guys are troo funny!

....
When using the REC button to set a time to record, each press within 3 sec will increase the time by 30 min., but if you wait 4 sec...OR ANYTIME AFTER 4 SEC... that next button press will reset the time to record to 00 (ZERO) and the recording will continue, with no end time and the record clock COUNTING UP...so, it will record to infinity.

Waiting 4 sec OR LONGER and pressing the button (on purpose or accidentally) will deactivate the countdown clock and the record clock will appear instead...

ah....how would u explain that i see "30 min", "1 hr" , "1:30" etc etc. on my tv screen when i press the REC button continually and then see the 640 counting UP instead of DOWN?

if i were to wait 4 secs or longer..obviously i would see "00" on my tv screen...but i didnt. so please enlighten us enstein.

it is funny some of these dudes cough cough nextool and wabjxo try to belittle u when they provide no useful help and when u say that they are using an acroynm that an avg. person dont undestand..they try to attack back.

i bet if i ask them what does fubar mean...they probably wont know it...and have to look it up on wikipedia or something.

WTFH, ITISARTSA1:30, BHITISR, OMG, WMID, IBPTP, HELP!

I know the meaning of exactly one of those, if "HELP" is also an acronym. I didn't know the meanings of "VWAG," or "WAG," either.
I do know the meaning of what is probably the best known engineers' acronym, RCH.

One of my favourite acronyms is "RTFM". When asked what it means, the irate engineer explains that it means "Read the Manual", in a tone that discourages asking what the "F" is for... ;)

Why no HDMI in the Pioneer?

I've been searching for the right DVR for a while now and feel as if I'm asking too much. Essentially, I'm looking for a system with the following features:

*HDD recording of SD and HD material
*Editing and Recording of SD material to DVD
*Good scaling output of SD material to 720P via HDMI
*VHS support is optional
*Some kind of program search (TV Guide?)

Am I asking too much? Does this exist? If not... is there a reason? If so... who makes it?

Repeating a question I posted a couple of pages back, has anyone successfully made a "Disc Backup" copy of a +R disc? I have tried 5 times now, with 5 different discs, from different sources, without success. The manual clearly says you can backup a +R disc, but it refuses to load to the HDD.

Why no HDMI in the Pioneer?

I've been searching for the right DVR for a while now and feel as if I'm asking too much. Essentially, I'm looking for a system with the following features:

*HDD recording of SD and HD material
*Editing and Recording of SD material to DVD
*Good scaling output of SD material to 720P via HDMI
*VHS support is optional
*Some kind of program search (TV Guide?)

Am I asking too much? Does this exist? If not... is there a reason? If so... who makes it?
Like many other folks in this forum, I tend to use my DVD recorder only for recording and do my everyday DVD playback on a separate machine.

Two of the reasons for this include,
1) these recorders lack many of the desirable features that are common in most DVD players, and,
2) minimize wear and tear on the DVD burner/reader since on some machines those cannot be replaceed by the user.

Of course, I do both recording and playback to/from the hard drive. But since I use several DirecTV with TiVo units for timeshifting, I do very little scheduled/timed recording on my DVD recorder. I use the DVD recorder primarily for archiving programs.

As always, YMMV.

Mine works like that as well but I rarely use the feature vs. setting a timer recording if there is doubt I might want to time-shift or save.
YMMV

Same here. The only time I've used that feature is when I've stumbled across something I wanted to record, it's starting RIGHT NOW, and I think I don't have time to make it to either the Easy Timer or Full Details Timer screen without missing something or possibly messing up the recording altogether.

I must also agree with Nextoo: With most hardware or software, User Error is far more common than a product defect in accounting for problems. (Which is not to say that there aren't plenty of product defects out there.) [Or, there could be a design issue that makes it much easier for the user to take a wrong turn.] See CruelInventions' post #2376 for one example, and the following post #2377 for an example of one of those missing details that might have made a big difference, had we known about it previously.

Why no HDMI in the Pioneer?

I've been searching for the right DVR for a while now and feel as if I'm asking too much. Essentially, I'm looking for a system with the following features:

*HDD recording of SD and HD material
*Editing and Recording of SD material to DVD
*Good scaling output of SD material to 720P via HDMI
*VHS support is optional
*Some kind of program search (TV Guide?)

Am I asking too much? Does this exist? If not... is there a reason? If so... who makes it?

I think it will be tough to find all of that in one unit. Why ? Because the consumer segment of the market (almost any market, but electronics is a very good example) seems to always be chasing the bottom these days. Items have to be made to sell at a certain price point -- ranging from "affordable" down to as low as possible -- so that they will sell at places like Walmart or Target. Unfortunately, this often translates to inferior quality, and goods that are not made to last. And, on top of that, some product categories like DVDRs have turned out to be a bust (in terms of sales figures and company expectations), not justifying the $$ companies like Pioneer plowed into their development. It seems a very far cry from the days of over $600. VCRs that some of us can remember.

Nevertheless, there remains some pro-level gear that most of us never even hear about. Someone on VideoHelp recently mentioned a JVC pro model recorder that sells for around $1,500., with a surprising (to me) lineup of features. I seem to recall features such as the ability to record in PAL or NTSC format ? Which makes me think such models were largely intended for an international market, less sensitive to this cost structure than is the N. American market. And I think there might have been another one mentioned also, that expensive or even more so, from another major manufacturer. It was all news to me. So, if that price level does not deter you, it may be worth your spending some time browsing through their DVD recorder forum, and trying some keyword searches. (I may have bookmarked something at the time, and would be willing to look through my bookmark files for these, if you like.)

Recording HD content is really the joker in this pack. I'm not aware of anything -- other than a couple of pricey recorders now involved in the HD vs. BlueRay wars -- that can record HD content.

ah....how would u explain that i see "30 min", "1 hr" , "1:30" etc etc. on my tv screen when i press the REC button continually and then see the 640 counting UP instead of DOWN?

if i were to wait 4 secs or longer..obviously i would see "00" on my tv screen...but i didnt. so please enlighten us enstein.

I felt compelled to make a couple of general comments here . . . but will probably wind up regretting it. :eek:

We come to forums like these looking for help, or to share help if we think we might have it to share. No one has to provide such help: if it is offered (even wrong advice that was well-intentioned !), we should view it as a gift. The tone and attitude of one's posts do matter, and people may judge us by them. It is possible to disagree -- even emphatically -- without being disagreeable.

That said, if someone directs a completely unwarranted personal attack against you, I think it is reasonable to return fire, though probably not by doing likewise. (In some tightly run forums, the Mods may pull the trapdoor on either party for this. I've seen that happen more than a few times over on VH, to name just one.) Well, enough on that.

On the whole acronym thing: most of those mentioned in the past few pages of this thread are not particularly obscure. I'm certainly no engineer, but I've seen WAG and even SWAG used many years ago. I guess it all depends on where you've traveled on the Net, and for how long. A lot of this stuff even predates the internet by a couple decades, going back to the days of scattered BBS's (Bulletin Board Systems, the precursors of today's dedicated forum sites, which were dialed into by dial-up modems -- if anyone remembers those), or usage in early email systems.

Repeating a question I posted a couple of pages back, has anyone successfully made a "Disc Backup" copy of a +R disc? I have tried 5 times now, with 5 different discs, from different sources, without success. The manual clearly says you can backup a +R disc, but it refuses to load to the HDD.

Yes, I have copied a +R disc using the disc backup feature. The 1st time I tried it, I struggled a bit because although I loaded the original +R disc to the hard drive fine, it refused to copy to the blank disc that I inserted when prompted to. I realised that I was trying to copy it to a -R disc and that is a No-No! You must use the same type of disc for a backup. So when I finally switched to a +R blank DVD, it copied fine. I am not sure if that helps with your situation. I know that the Pioneer DVR's can be picky with some media, so if you are have problems actually loading the disc to the hard drive, it may be a brand that it doesn't like. Just a guess. :)

Thanks for the reply, dvdiva. But, I did know that one must use a +R disc to make the copy. My situation is that the 640 will not read the original +R disc into the HDD, even though it will play it with no problems. It has been this way with five different +R discs, from five different sources. Perhaps there could be something it doesn't like about all 5 discs, eventhough it will play them all, but that seems far fetched. Perhaps I should call Pioneer. I was hoping there was some trick to getting it to accept the +R disc.

It has been this way with five different +R discs, from five different sources. Perhaps there could be something it doesn't like about all 5 discs, eventhough it will play them all, but that seems far fetched.Were the discs you tried finalized? The Pioneer can play unfinalized disks but it might not be able to copy them...

Were the discs you tried finalized? The Pioneer can play unfinalized disks but it might not be able to copy them...

Good question. I'll put some in, and see if the display says finalized. I guess if they aren't finalized, my chances of finalizing them on my 640 are rather slim...

Good question. I'll put some in, and see if the display says finalized. I guess if they aren't finalized, my chances of finalizing them on my 640 are rather slim...Can the discs be finalized in a PC with +R drive?

Divide = insert chapter mark

Combine = remove chapter mark

Erase = delete chapter. (This can't be undone, so you get a confirming prompt when you select Erase.)

Wow. Just what I wanted. Too bad they didn't label it very clearly.


Thanks! :)

On another topic... is there a way to record the SAP of only some programs?

For those interested, I visited Pioneer Canada in Markham today to have the title name firmware update installed on a 640 and while there the service technician told me he was confident there will indeed be 2007 Pioneer DVDR model(s) available.

Pheww!!! I'm relieved. Hopefully they'll reinstate iLink connection (and how about HDV playback :p )

For those interested, I visited Pioneer Canada in Markham today to have the title name firmware update installed on a 640 and while there the service technician told me he was confident there will indeed be 2007 Pioneer DVDR model(s) available.

But with HDDs...?

For those interested, I visited Pioneer Canada in Markham today to have the title name firmware update installed on a 640 and while there the service technician told me he was confident there will indeed be 2007 Pioneer DVDR model(s) available.Well, I bet we're all sitting up and paying attention now!! ;)

Theron

Here's a bit of Pioneer news. Some old. Some new.

This link contains the infamous smoking gun that eludes to the fact that Pioneer may be getting out of the DVD recorder business. To me it reads rather ambiguous. But one can perhaps see a JVC strategy - meaning JVC has new product but it is a rebadged LG product (combo unit). The press release is from October 31, 2006. Here's the link - page 7.

http://pioneer.jp/corp/ir/pdf/finance/announce/fr_2007/2nd/release_2q07e.pdf

This link is the most recent Pioneer business results. The press release is from January 31, 2007. Page 2 speaks to DVD recorder sales.

http://pioneer.jp/corp/ir/pdf/finance/announce/fr_2007/3rd/release_3q07e.pdf

Pardon me if this has been discussed before but after reading about 30 of the 81 pages I haven't seen this addressed.

I have a digital cable box and have set up my 640 per the manual but when I set up my channels, the 640 only recognizes the 100 or so analog channels on my system. There's no mention of setup with digital cable boxes in the manual so I thought I'd ask the question of you guys.

Thanks

I know what you mean as I have the same situation. Here's how I handled it. Go from the wall RF to the Pioneer to the cable box. From the cable box I return to the Pioneer via composite cables (I'd use better if my cable box had them).

Anyway, when I want to record one of the 126 or higher channels I have to change the channel on the cable box using its remote and then record via L1 on the DVR.

If there's a more elegant solution I'll be looking forward to hearing it. Like you, I was disappointed that the unit stopped at 125.

Has anyone else had their machine turn off when putting in a blank DVD-R (or another other blank DVD, + or -RW)?

I just tried to copy a few unedited programs recorded in LP to a DVD-R. This is the first time I have done this since getting my 640H back from getting the firmware update. Before I got the update, I had only had the 640H a few weeks (and only made a few DVDs).

Putting a blank DVD-R in, the machine reads, "LOAD," then after a short time, the machine turns off!!!

Turning the machine back on, I can make a copy list and record to a DVD.

Before the successful copy (on a Sony), I had tried a Nexxtech DVD purchased at Office Depot (I think) during a Black Friday sale. I had never used these DVD-Rs before. What I had wanted to copy was not important and is going to be given to a neighbor after I watch it (old episodes of Coach at 6 a.m.). The 640H would not copy to it. Getting a new one, I was able to copy a title to another Nexxtreh DVD-R from my 520H.

Suggestions other than to give Pioneer a call? This happen to anyone else?

BTW, those junky DVD-Rs are not going to be used again.

No sir. I've not had that happen. Doesn't sound good, does it? I can sure tell you that I used to have that problem all the time with my old Samsung recorder. It got to the point that about every other DVD-R disk I'd put in would be rejected. BTW, I've had good success, so far, with the Sony -R disks. Good luck and let's hope it's just the disks and not the firmware update.

As reported in the firmware update thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9770202&&#post9770202) I tested in and out of the copy list and have no problems when using Verbatim -R. Try some better media?

agreed. Just a reminder to everybody. Cheap media will in fact be "expensive" in the long run due to high coaster rate, induced frustration which may or may not enflame suicidal tendencies thus in return may result in pain, suffering, and/or death.

All the above from trying to save about 5 cents a disc :D

Sony is in the highest ranking group of media. In the 3 years I have had DVD recorders, I have had 100% success rate with Sony DVD-Rs.

I know what you mean as I have the same situation. Here's how I handled it. Go from the wall RF to the Pioneer to the cable box. From the cable box I return to the Pioneer via composite cables (I'd use better if my cable box had them).

Anyway, when I want to record one of the 126 or higher channels I have to change the channel on the cable box using its remote and then record via L1 on the DVR.

If there's a more elegant solution I'll be looking forward to hearing it. Like you, I was disappointed that the unit stopped at 125.


That is exactly the way to handle it. If you have S-Vid, use that instead of RCA line video, from the STB to the DVDR. With my Comcast Moto 6412, I can only get up into the 70s, or 80s. Channel 97 is digital, and can't be tuned. If your STB is a DVR, just program it to record what you want from the digital channels, and later dub them to your DVDR. I set up to transfer them when I am going to bed, or to work.

agreed. Just a reminder to everybody. Cheap media will in fact be "expensive" in the long run. :D

I agree totally!!!!!

I value my electronic devices and projects so much that I (even tho of low income) will buy high quality media etc.
Just like with my VCR and cassette players----Cheap tapes clog heads. I always bought high grade.

I can't see buying any ole media just cause they are on sale. I find a high quality good brand and stick with it.

"Buy cheap" "Pay More"

Sony is in the highest ranking group of media. In the 3 years I have had DVD recorders, I have had 100% success rate with Sony DVD-Rs.

I've had good luck too. (The Pioneer 633 made about one coaster in six, but the 640 has had a 100% success rate.)

However...

My latest pack of Sonys (two or three months ago) was the last one at Office Depot that was made in Japan. The rest were made in Taiwan or Mexico, I can't remember which. So today's Sony DVD-Rs may not be the equal of the ones you bought six months ago. Always check the label for the country of origin.

Myself, I'm going to order Taiyo Yudens next time. I saw a price of $33 for 100 (16x).

I hate to ask this, it makes me feel like such a NOOB!

I have been unable to get my 640 to display the broadcast program titles at all.

I know all about the titles not being carried over from the timer recordings to the HDD recordings, but according to several reports, if you manually start recording with the REC button, the broadcast title is retained.

But... I have never seen the broadcast title displayed anywhere in my 640. When I am watching TV (through the 640's RF tuner, with direct analog cable input) no titles ever show up on the display pages. Interestingly, when I am watching a recorded show from the HDD, the TV set DOES show the broadcast title when I look at it's display page, so the data is obviously embedded in the signal. But not displayed on the 640 at all.

What am I missing?

Thanks,

Theron

I hate to ask this, it makes me feel like such a NOOB!

I have been unable to get my 640 to display the broadcast program titles at all.

I know all about the titles not being carried over from the timer recordings to the HDD recordings, but according to several reports, if you manually start recording with the REC button, the broadcast title is retained.

But... I have never seen the broadcast title displayed anywhere in my 640. When I am watching TV (through the 640's RF tuner, with direct analog cable input) no titles ever show up on the display pages. Interestingly, when I am watching a recorded show from the HDD, the TV set DOES show the broadcast title when I look at it's display page, so the data is obviously embedded in the signal. But not displayed on the 640 at all.

What am I missing?

Thanks,

Theron
Not all programs include a broadcast title. You can test this by pressing the Display button twice on one channel to get the blue banner. Change channels and wait 3-4 seconds. If there is a broadcast title, it should appear...very briefly...right under the "SP ..." text in the blue banner, then it disappears. Keep changing channels and wait for the large banner until you find one that blips on a title under the standard text. When you see one of those, press REC on that channel and you should get that title in the recording.

I think most daytime programs don't have a title but most primetime ones do (hit and miss).

Not all programs include a broadcast title. You can test this by pressing the Display button twice on one channel to get the blue banner. Change channels and wait 3-4 seconds. If there is a broadcast title, it should appear...very briefly...right under the "SP ..." text in the blue banner, then it disappears. Keep changing channels and wait for the large banner until you find one that blips on a title under the standard text. When you see one of those, press REC on that channel and you should get that title in the recording.

I think most daytime programs don't have a title but most primetime ones do (hit and miss).Thanks. I got home tonight and gave this a try. I can only conclude that there are two different kinds of data encoding.

I put the blue display bar on my set, and ran up the channels. Only ONE channel, a CBS affiliate out of Richmond, VA briefly showed the title "Shark". No other channels showed a title, but a few of the PBS stations displayed their call letters in the upper right corner of the box, instead of the standard channel number which was displayed for most.

However, on my TV, probably more than half of the stations display the name of the broadcaster (either station letters or network) or the title of the show, or both.

It certainly seems like the data being decoded by the 640 is different than that being decoded by the TV itself.

Theron

For what it's worth, my Pioneer 420 would often show the SciFi Channel as "Ersatz Braodcasting" and yes, that's the way it's spelled.

I've had good luck too. (The Pioneer 633 made about one coaster in six, but the 640 has had a 100% success rate.)

However...

My latest pack of Sonys (two or three months ago) was the last one at Office Depot that was made in Japan. The rest were made in Taiwan or Mexico, I can't remember which. So today's Sony DVD-Rs may not be the equal of the ones you bought six months ago. Always check the label for the country of origin.

Myself, I'm going to order Taiyo Yudens next time. I saw a price of $33 for 100 (16x).


Simply put, Taiyo Yuden is the only manufacturer based in Japan.

I used to run a CD/DVD duplication business for a few years (on my own) and I burned alot of discs, and the simple fact is Taiyo yuden is the only company you can completely trust.

There was a time 2004-2005 when blank Taiyos were 2x the price. now they are the same.

IF you are in the store and the pack says made in japan, and you live in america, than 95% chance its taiyo yuden. The companies that rebadge taiyo most is fuji and sony.
you can also order OEM TY discs with great prices from rima and other stores

but again, NGOHIT, remember, NONE of the store brands make discs. the discs are made by 6 other manufacturers, all based in Taiwan, Japan, and some in in india.

Let me tell you guys my situation.

My parents are greek imigrants (been here 25 years) and have recently really gotten into their greek satelite broadcasts from Dish (we get american tv seperate through comcast).

I had bought them a Liteon recorder when the first dvd recorders dropped to 150$

While working for Panasonic as a marketing rep, they got me really pumped on their DVD recorders. For a while I also read shady things about them, like their discs didnt play in other players, but last fall, with the release of the e21s, the first recoreder to do all formats I took the plunge.

The reason i took the plunge was because of the "pause live TV feature" the recorder could do with a dvd ram disc.
Panasonic corporate reps rambled on an on about this at a corporate training conference.
I took them at their word and bought it without trying it out.

Basically there are two problems with the panny recorders:
A: They are really complex and cumbersome for someone who has the electronics proficiency of a 6 year old (Dad) and 3 year old (mom)
Unlike the liteon, the panasonic would not auto format a blank dvd, to format you have to go through 2 menu layers!
and when you are done formating you got to hit the "functions" button twice.
B: The "DVR" function, which really just lets you do 'live' tv (pause, rewind) on DVDram discs really just works on sessions. the way you do it is pop in the RAM disc, hit record, then at some point hit the play button, this puts it into live mode and bumps it back to the beginning of the 'session'

This all works for me, and a little for my father, but even i will get frustrated.

So for a while now i have been looking for a HDD option.

Dish has DVR boxes of course BUT if they are anything like Comcast's then that will be problematic.
Many times Dish's scheduler will be wrong, shows will change time, seasons will end, and the box doesnt reflect that in its Menu system. And even comcast isnt perfect, one of my sports watching friends told me he lost the last 3 minutes of a basketball game, because it went past the Comcast schedule. so now he makes sure to schedule recording of the next show.

What I want most is this, a simple "Un-Panasonic" menu, panasonic tried to hard to make these video editing machines for making home movies.
A device where my mom can just hit record, and then stop when she's done (just like a vhs) on the HDD.
all the stuff with transfering is not a big deal, I know it can do it.

I appreciate your help, because as of now, they dont sell this retail, so it wouldnt be so easy to return. plus i would like to get it insured.

thanks again.

I put the blue display bar on my set, and ran up the channels. Only ONE channel, a CBS affiliate out of Richmond, VA briefly showed the title "Shark". No other channels showed a title, but a few of the PBS stations displayed their call letters in the upper right corner of the box, instead of the standard channel number which was displayed for most.
Just to be sure, once the blue bar appears, it will take 2-3 sec more for a title to pop up under the text in the 1st blue bar...if there is one being broadcast. Generally, during primetime, most programs seem to have a broadcast title. I know, in the past and in my area, tonight (Friday) on CBS, Ghost Whisperer does, then Close to Home may not, but then Numbers will also have a title.

Let me tell you guys my situation.

My parents are greek imigrants (been here 25 years) and have recently really gotten into their greek satelite broadcasts from Dish (we get american tv seperate through comcast).

I had bought them a Liteon recorder when the first dvd recorders dropped to 150$

While working for Panasonic as a marketing rep, they got me really pumped on their DVD recorders. For a while I also read shady things about them, like their discs didnt play in other players, but last fall, with the release of the e21s, the first recoreder to do all formats I took the plunge.

The reason i took the plunge was because of the "pause live TV feature" the recorder could do with a dvd ram disc.
Panasonic corporate reps rambled on an on about this at a corporate training conference.
I took them at their word and bought it without trying it out.

Basically there are two problems with the panny recorders:
A: They are really complex and cumbersome for someone who has the electronics proficiency of a 6 year old (Dad) and 3 year old (mom)
Unlike the liteon, the panasonic would not auto format a blank dvd, to format you have to go through 2 menu layers!
and when you are done formating you got to hit the "functions" button twice.
B: The "DVR" function, which really just lets you do 'live' tv (pause, rewind) on DVDram discs really just works on sessions. the way you do it is pop in the RAM disc, hit record, then at some point hit the play button, this puts it into live mode and bumps it back to the beginning of the 'session'

This all works for me, and a little for my father, but even i will get frustrated.

So for a while now i have been looking for a HDD option.

Dish has DVR boxes of course BUT if they are anything like Comcast's then that will be problematic.
Many times Dish's scheduler will be wrong, shows will change time, seasons will end, and the box doesnt reflect that in its Menu system. And even comcast isnt perfect, one of my sports watching friends told me he lost the last 3 minutes of a basketball game, because it went past the Comcast schedule. so now he makes sure to schedule recording of the next show.

What I want most is this, a simple "Un-Panasonic" menu, panasonic tried to hard to make these video editing machines for making home movies.
A device where my mom can just hit record, and then stop when she's done (just like a vhs) on the HDD.
all the stuff with transfering is not a big deal, I know it can do it.

I appreciate your help, because as of now, they dont sell this retail, so it wouldnt be so easy to return. plus i would like to get it insured.

thanks again.

charm922, I recently bought this pio model for my wife as a replacement for a VCR which she used a lot. I got really tired of replacing the VCRs as she would really work them into the ground.

We have had this unit for about 3 months, and my wife is not that technology literate. She like things simple and easy to use, otherwise I hear about it if you know what I mean.

Anyhow I unpacked it set it up, and showed her a few basic commands, walked her through the timer record and then promptly hid the user manual. This may sound strange but I wanted to find out if it was really easy for her to use and if she could figure it out for herself.

I heard nothing for about 3 weeks and so one day I asked her about it. Are you using it? Is it easy to use etc? Basically she had no compliants except she was finding it difficult to find her programs. I eventually tracked this down to a title name issue on the firmware version, and I'm in the process of getting this fixed on warrantly. Otherwise I can't get her off the TV anymore. She has more programs to watch than available time, and we are the converted. I'll never go back to tape or VCR.

BTW, I looked at lots of units, actually made the sales guy set them up for me in the store to try them out. Most of them did not want to do this so I passed them buy, until I found the right guy, and bought a whole buch of equipment from him. He was really happy. Good luck with your purchase...

They are really complex and cumbersome for someone who has the electronics proficiency of a 6 year old (Dad) and 3 year old (mom)
Unlike the liteon, the panasonic would not auto format a blank dvd, to format you have to go through 2 menu layers!I had similar problems with my 90-year-old mother and her satellite service (she lived in a remote community that had no cable or local reception). My solution was to buy her a programmable remote control and then program every button on the remote so she couldn't get herself into trouble. You need to find one that has enough memory to record IR codes into every button, and if you can find one that can record "poor man's macros" (ie, record the IR signals of 2-3 button presses of another remote so they play back when you push one of the buttons) it makes the job a lot easier.

As an example, I had the remote programmed so that the "On" button would send "On" signals to the satellite receiver and the TV, and set the TV to the line input that the satellite was connected to. And although the remote was designed to control 5 devices, I made sure that every button was programmed to do the same thing no matter what device was selected, so that if she hit the "DVD" button by mistake (she had no DVD player) the remote would continue to work anyway.

New question. If I select AUTO for the recording speed instead of the exact MN number, will I get the best quality I can get or should I take the time to manually set the correct MN speed? I assume someone has played around with this to compare. Thanks.

I have last year's model but I think it should work the same. I think auto will try to get you the best quality setting for the time that you put in. For example, I think a two hour 8 p.m until 10 p.m. show on auto will automatically set up the recording speed of MN21. Now, if you set a show for an hour and a half on auto (8 p.m. until 9:30 p.m.) the auto setting will pick the MN setting of like MN 26 or something like that. If you set a show for one hour on auto (8 p.m. until 9 p.m.) it will pick MN 32.

Now the time has to be exactly set up like that to get those kind of numbers. If you set a time up that goes either shorter or longer then those then it picks MN numbers that are either higher or lower. For example, if you set up a show for one hour and one minute on auto (8 p.m. until 9:01 p.m.) the auto setting will record the show at MN31 because MN32 is the "1 hour" setting since you set just one minute more then it records at the setting that is less than that. In this case, since it is one minute longer than exactly one hour the auto setting records it at MN31.

New question. If I select AUTO for the recording speed instead of the exact MN number, will I get the best quality I can get or should I take the time to manually set the correct MN speed? I assume someone has played around with this to compare. Thanks.The question is: Will you be removing commercials?

As Justin Time says, you'll get the same results from Auto as a properly set MN setting (2hrs = MN21) but if you want to remove commercials, the big advantage of MN settings is you can set an MN bitrate that will give you the best pq that will fit on a DVD AFTER removing commercials.

If your 2 hour recording has commercials and you plan to remove them, assuming at least 10 minutes per hour of commercials you can set the bitrate at MN24 (100 minutes) which will resullt in a pretty full DVD after editing out the commercials and provide better pq than MN21 which would have left a considerable amount of wasted space on the DVD after editing out the commercials.

New question. If I select AUTO for the recording speed instead of the exact MN number, will I get the best quality I can get or should I take the time to manually set the correct MN speed? I assume someone has played around with this to compare. Thanks.

As others have mentioned, one big factor is whether you'll be removing commercials. A two-hour networlk time slot, for instance, can be set at MN23 because it will contain 20-25 minutes of commercials, probably more. The AUTO setting would give you MN21.

It's not just commercials. Some channels like TCM (and thank goodness for them!) may show a 1:36 movie uncut in a 2-hour time slot, but you don't know exactly when within that time slot it will begin. So. again, AUTO will give a lower bit rate and leave empty space if you burn to DVD.

But...

Depending on the program, the cable transmission, your viewing equipment, and your eyes, there might well be no discernible PQ difference between MN21 and MN23. For example, I was recording /Homefront/ until American Life Network unaccountably stopped showing it in the middle of season 2. I recorded it at MN14 and it looked quite good to me, just as good as my initial MN21 recordings.

Also...

If you record in AUTO, and it picks MN21 but it could have been MN23, if you can't see the difference then really all that's happened is that you'll burn your DVD a little faster and have an unburned ring around the outside.

The hints thread is at http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=793772

Can someone post there about the alternative remote controls for the Pioneer 640? I know there was extensive discussion here around the time of the exchanges, and I think it would be good to have one single article summaizing that:

1. Can use remote from 633 (and other models, if known) with 640. Has eject button, easier access to keypad, other advantages?

2. Can buy remote fom Pioneer. (Model #, price, where to order)

3. Harmony remote (model #, price, where to order, programming tips)

I'd prepare the article, but I don't have enogh knowledge.

Anybody know how I can eliminate a problem I'm having with Pioneer dvr640 remote interfering with HD tivo remote functions. I tried doing the thing they said on page 117 of manual by pushing return and 1-2-3 to change remote code. this was mentioned if you had more than one pioneer device. when I press any funtions on the pioneer remote it changes the channel on tivo and initiates play, ect.. thanks Scott

I am in the market for a DVD recorder and hearing good things about the 640. My question is how long has 640 been on market and can I expect for new generation of player coming out soon?
Thanks,
tennispro

Anybody know how I can eliminate a problem I'm having with Pioneer dvr640 remote interfering with HD tivo remote functions. I tried doing the thing they said on page 117 of manual by pushing return and 1-2-3 to change remote code. this was mentioned if you had more than one pioneer device. when I press any funtions on the pioneer remote it changes the channel on tivo and initiates play, ect.. thanks Scott
See this post. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9656363&&#post9656363)

The hints thread is at http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=793772

Can someone post there about the alternative remote controls for the Pioneer 640? I know there was extensive discussion here around the time of the exchanges, and I think it would be good to have one single article summaizing that:

1. Can use remote from 633 (and other models, if known) with 640. Has eject button, easier access to keypad, other advantages?

2. Can buy remote fom Pioneer. (Model #, price, where to order)

3. Harmony remote (model #, price, where to order, programming tips)

I'd prepare the article, but I don't have enogh knowledge.I don't know about the harmony remote, but I already posted about the Pioneer remotes here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9572864&&#post9572864) (See #6)

I am in the market for a DVD recorder and hearing good things about the 640. My question is how long has 640 been on market and can I expect for new generation of player coming out soon?

The 640 is a 2006 model recorder, and has been out for nearly a year. In the past, that would mean to expect a new model within a few months. However, if you read back over this thread you'll see that there are fairly strong rumors Pioneer is getting out of the HDD-DVDR business. If those are true, then the 640 is the last model.

Frankly, in your osition I would not wat. The 640 is much more reliable than the 2005 models. In addition, the trend over the past couple of years has been to *remove* features in the new year's model. So even if there is a 2007 model, it may have fewer bells and whistles than the 640 has.

I am in the market for a DVD recorder and hearing good things about the 640. My question is how long has 640 been on market and can I expect for new generation of player coming out soon?
Thanks,
tennispro
The very first post in this thread talks about the user just having set up their brand new recorder. A couple posts after that, ncaahoops says: "Great! So the highly anticipated 640H is finally in the hands of users!"

These posts were made on June 1st, 2006.

Theron

Anybody know how I can eliminate a problem I'm having with Pioneer dvr640 remote interfering with HD tivo remote functions. I tried doing the thing they said on page 117 of manual by pushing return and 1-2-3 to change remote code. this was mentioned if you had more than one pioneer device. when I press any funtions on the pioneer remote it changes the channel on tivo and initiates play, ect.. thanks Scott


When I hold the return button plus either 2 or 3 it changes the remote code and then does not operate the pioneer at all, I have to put it back to default 1 to get it to accept any remote functions again. Also I never see any indicator light on the display (i think that's where I should see it).

Thanks for trying guys .
When I hold the return button for at least 5 seconds and 1, 2, or 3 it will change the code from default#1 ,but it still changes the channel on the directv reciever.
I am at a loss and do not know what to do, this simply is a royal Pain.....
Are you FIRST going to the INITIAL SETUP > OPTIONS > REMOTE CONTROL CODE menu on the machine and changing that code to #2 or 3? Don't use #1 since that's the default code.

AFTER that, you press the RETURN and same # button on the remote and HOLD both buttons for at least 5 sec., or until the diplay changes on the machine.

(Just in case, make sure your DTV receiver is off when you do this.)

No! thanks That should work...what an idiot I am...

That did work! Thanks!

How do I initialize -R to a VR mode?

I have converted some old VHS tapes HDD. I can make video mode -r dvd. I also would like to make VR mode dvd for backup/ fast copy to HDD/ future edits. I have been unable to do so. Could someone do a step-by-step for me? I can't seem to be able to initiaize -r to a VR mode dvd.

How do I initialize -R to a VR mode?

I have converted some old VHS tapes HDD. I can make video mode -r dvd. I also would like to make VR mode dvd for backup/ fast copy to HDD/ future edits. I have been unable to do so. Could someone do a step-by-step for me? I can't seem to be able to initiaize -r to a VR mode dvd.
With the -R disc in the tray, press Home Menu button, then go to DISC SETUP > Initialize > VR Mode.

I tried a search but there were to many hits to go through with none pointing me in the right direction. My manual is in French, is there an English online manual someplace?

I tried a search but there were to many hits to go through with none pointing me in the right direction. My manual is in French, is there an English online manual someplace?

Manual Link for 640 (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/v3/pg/support/details/0,,2076_310070392_303089277,00.html)
If you register (it is free) on the PioneerElectronics official web site after you click on the the link on the page posted above, you can see and download the manual in a pdf format.

I tried a search but there were to many hits to go through with none pointing me in the right direction. My manual is in French, is there an English online manual someplace?

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/vgn/images/portal/cit_11221/310077353DVR640HSOperatingInstructions.pdf

Right-click o the above link and select "Save link target as..." or similar

ok my cable box went dead today...repairman wont come until next week.

anyway...since 640 has a built-in tuner and is connected to my tv thru component...i tried to watch tv with the 640 then. so i went into setting on the 640 and tried to detect channel over the air...it went from channel 1 - 68 and detected no channel. wtf? i though 640 has a built in tuner/antenna? so can any1 help me

ps i have a westy 37" hdtv...that has no built in antenna..i wonder if that is it.

ok my cable box went dead today...repairman wont come until next week.

anyway...since 640 has a built-in tuner and is connected to my tv thru component...i tried to watch tv with the 640 then. so i went into setting on the 640 and tried to detect channel over the air...it went from channel 1 - 68 and detected no channel. wtf? i though 640 has a built in tuner/antenna? so can any1 help me

ps i have a westy 37" hdtv...that has no built in antenna..i wonder if that is it.
The channel range of 1-68 tells me that your 640 is likely set for antenna instead of cable reception.

Do you know if just your cable box is bad, or could the cable signal be bad (or missing) coming into youtr home?

another stupid troubleshooting question and by no means to offend: did you plug the RF cable to the 640?

ok my cable box went dead today...repairman wont come until next week.

anyway...since 640 has a built-in tuner and is connected to my tv thru component...i tried to watch tv with the 640 then. so i went into setting on the 640 and tried to detect channel over the air...it went from channel 1 - 68 and detected no channel. wtf? i though 640 has a built in tuner/antenna? so can any1 help me

ps i have a westy 37" hdtv...that has no built in antenna..i wonder if that is it.

You have to hook up an antenna (rabbit ears?) to receive any OTA channels. The 640 does not have an internal antenna.

If your cable company carries any analog channels, you should be able to pick them up connecting the 640 directly to the RF cable using the RF input. Remember to select cable no cable box from the setup menu

yes...my current setup is rf from my cable box to the 640...and originally set from channel 1 - 125...then when my cable when down..i try to do over the air detection...so set channel from 1 - 68.

both of my cable box went down last nite. so i dont think it is our cable box. we live in the 2nd floor of an apt. building...and i noticed when i came home last nite...on the 1st floor..there was a white box and the pipe was broken in half. and i think that is related to the cable box outside our apt. some a$$hole must broken into that cable box.

but in the mean time..i can get some cheap rabbit ear from radio shack and hook it to the 640 RF...and then i can watch regular tv? yes or no?

remember my tv doesnt have a tv tuner.

how about this antenna?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?parentPage=search&pg=1&summary=summary&cp=&accessories=accessories&productId=2062079&kw=tv+antenna&techSpecs=techSpecs&currentTab=features&custRatings=custRatings&searchSort=TRUE&features=features&sr=1&y=9&origkw=tv+antenna&s=A-StorePrice-RSK&x=19&support=support&tab=summary

or better yet...maybe i should get a hd antenna instead? would that work? remember my tv doesnt have a tv tuner...can an hd antenna plug into the 640 and then it plug into my hdtv for hd broadcast tv station?

or better yet...maybe i should get a hd antenna instead? would that work? remember my tv doesnt have a tv tuner...can an hd antenna plug into the 640 and then it plug into my hdtv for hd broadcast tv station?

the 640 doesn't have ATSC tuner, so it wouldn't work.

the 640 doesn't have ATSC tuner, so it wouldn't work.

i remember a poster when i got the 640 that it stated this 640 can be upgraded to a ATSC tuner? true or false? if so..where can i get a ATSC tuner and do i need to open up the 640 to upgrade it?

the 640 doesn't have ATSC tuner, so it wouldn't work.

how about at least regular antenna i posted from radio shack? will i at least able to watch regular tv until the cable guy come and fix my cable next week?

Yes, that antenna from Radio Shack should work. Judging by your ID you live in New York, so you should be able to pick up all the OTA channels.

The 640 cannot be upgraded to an ATSC tuner. In order to get the digital OTA channels you would have to purchase a separate ATSC tuner and connect it to 1 of the inputs of the 640. There is a thread here discussing such a tuner.

Yes, that antenna from Radio Shack should work. Judging by your ID you live in New York, so you should be able to pick up all the OTA channels.

The 640 cannot be upgraded to an ATSC tuner. In order to get the digital OTA channels you would have to purchase a separate ATSC tuner and connect it to 1 of the inputs of the 640. There is a thread here discussing such a tuner.

if i get a ATSC tuner...how much would that cost? and if i connect to one of the inputs of the 640..would i get 720p for those hd tv station? but i though..640 can only do up to 480p? if it cant 720p...i dont think it will be worth it.

which thread in this post discuss about the ATSC tuner? can u tell me what post # discuss about it? thx.

For the discussion thread on the ATSC tuner click here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=798636) I believe that you can get one for $80-100.

It converts ATSC signals into SD analog signals, so you would not get HD output for your TV, but it would allow you to record digital OTA on your 640.

If you are interested in an ATSC tuner that can output HD signals (up to 1080i) for your HD monitor, then you might want to look into the Samsung HD Tuner (DTB-H260F), which will run about $180.

...It converts ATSC signals into SD analog signals, so you would not get HD output for your TV, but it would allow you to record digital OTA on your 640.

If you are interested in an ATSC tuner that can output HD signals (up to 1080i) for your HD monitor, then you might want to look into the Samsung HD Tuner (DTB-H260F), which will run about $180.

ok...when u said "it will record digital OTA on your 640"...what do u mean by that? will the picture quality be better digitally than analog? will it be more than 480p..like 720p then? but i though 480p is the max that a 640 can do?

and if i were to get the samsung ATSC HD tuner that can do 1080i...how it be display on my tv? remember my tv doesnt have a tuner..so won't i have to use the 640 as a tuner also? i dont know..im confused..lol

...Samsung HD Tuner (DTB-H260F), which will run about $180.

and where can i get this for $180...the cheapest i was able to find was for $199.

Since the RJ tuner outputs SD (480i) then the 640 can record it. As for picture quality you will have to ask piturra on the thread that I linked.

The Samsung is a tuner, so assuming that your TV will accept a HD signal (I don't know this!), it should be able to display the HD signal from the Samsung.

ok i just look at the specs of the samsung hd tuner:

http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/h260f.html

it said it is a terrestial dtv set-top reciever...it isnt an antenna. plus the back of the pix...there are rf in and out. i assume u need to connect rf of the samsung to a rf on the tv? but my westinghhouse 37" tv doesnt have a rf input or output. my westy tv only has hdmi, dvi, component, svideo, and composite input. so what now? and my tv doesnt have a tuner.

so if i get this samsung hd set top reciever..will it still work? will i be able to pick up regular ota hd tv station?

Since the RJ tuner outputs SD (480i) then the 640 can record it. As for picture quality you will have to ask piturra on the thread that I linked.

The Samsung is a tuner, so assuming that your TV will accept a HD signal (I don't know this!), it should be able to display the HD signal from the Samsung.



the link u provided said this unit is a " RJTech RJ-1000ATSC HDTV Tuner Box - ATSC / QAM HD Tuner - Output to Component Video or S-VHS."

so this unit also act as a HD tuner? then i wont need to get the samsung hd tuner would i?

it seems that the samsung hd tuner..u would still need some type of antenna? true or false?

The Samsung 260 will work from cable (when yours works again) to receive QAM channels (digital). Cable companies are required (by law) to provide free-and-clear (non-encrypted) digital versions of the channels that you could otherwise receive OTA with an antenna.

The Samsung 260 can also be used with an antenna to receive OTA digital HDTV and SDTV channels broadcasting within your reception area.

The antenna RF connection would go into the Samsung 260 and you would use HDMI or component video plus left and right analog audio to connect from the Samsung 260 to your HDTV.

New Question. When timer recording back-to-back shows from the same TV channel, will all of the first show be recorded or will the machine pause or shut down for a minute or two while it "gets ready" to record the next show?

In other words, if I have the manual timer set to record something from 8-10 and 10-12 is it possible that the end of the 8-10 movie will get cut off? Thanks.

New Question. When timer recording back-to-back shows from the same TV channel, will all of the first show be recorded or will the machine pause or shut down for a minute or two while it "gets ready" to record the next show?
In other words, if I have the manual timer set to record something from 8-10 and 10-12 is it possible that the end of the 8-10 movie will get cut off? Thanks.

What I do in a case like that is to simply set the timer from 8-12. When the recording is complete, you can divide the two titles at a break point of your choosing. That way, you avoid the possibility of missing anything.

I thought about that but I want the best possible quality so if I set it to record for 4 hours won't be that be worse quality than if I had them each set for 2 hours?

The other thing is I've not yet learned how to do that divide and conquer thing. Do you mean that if there are two movies all on one recording, that I can divide them into two? The end result is that I want to put each on a separate DVD disk. Am I reading you right? Thanks.

As long as you are recording to the HDD, you can record at SP mode for both. If you are recording directly to DVD, that is a different matter. But since you are scheduling recordings back-to-back I assume that you are recording to the HDD.

I thought about that but I want the best possible quality so if I set it to record for 4 hours won't be that be worse quality than if I had them each set for 2 hours?

The other thing is I've not yet learned how to do that divide and conquer thing. Do you mean that if there are two movies all on one recording, that I can divide them into two? The end result is that I want to put each on a separate DVD disk. Am I reading you right? Thanks.Just to plainly say it, yes, if you record 4 hours at SP, then that recording will not fit on a single DVD, but you can easily (after only a couple tries) divide it up for burning to two different DVDs.

There is a thread here with "hints and tips", which covers some of this:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=793772

One thing to add, if you do the dividing with the copy list (rather than actually dividing the recording on the HDD) you may get to a point where it thinks you are trying to record the whole thing to a DVD, which it will know you can't do. But they give you the option to ignore that error, and continue with your editing, which when correctly completed, will result in a recording that will fit on the DVD.

Theron

Dvdiva and BaltimoreStan, thanks for the links. I emailed Pioneer today and they're sending me a free English manual.

ok, just now getting back into transferring some old vhs tapes (my own OTA tapings.. not talking about any commercially released video), the first of which is maybe a 4 or 5 on a 1-10 quality scale. Not a "5" as it pertains to the physical condition of the tape itself, but as it relates to the quality of my original video recording.

Looking at both recordings, going back 'n forth from what was recorded to the Pio 640H-s HDD and what is on the source VHS tape, I see that the Pio is clearly softer (some might say smoother, but it's clearly a little less detailed) and duller or flatter in contrast. The VHS tape looks clearly superior to me.

Is this what I should expect to be seeing, under such recording conditions?

If not, what adjustments, if any, might I make to improve the results I am seeing, bringing the recording closer to the original?

Btw, I also see these same results when I am watching both live at the same time (i.e., the taped program and the same program viewed from the 640H-s L1 passthrough, toggling back and forth). In other words, I don't even have to wait to see the differences by viewing the resulting recording on the 640H-s HDD. They are obvious before the recording process even begins. Am I missing something obvious here?

I am trying help my friend get his 640H to work, it is brand new out of the box, I cannot get any audio out of the unit when simply playing a DVD, I have not even ventured to the recorder yet. When playing a DVD I have tried the analog outputs, the digital output, as well as the RF for a normal TV, no audio what so ever, get picture ever which way. I have gone through the setup several times and cannopt find anything that has been missed, eihter there is something I have missed or is hidden in a very strange place or the unit is faulty. I apoligize if this type of problem has been addressed somewhere in theis thread.

Is it possible to do a high speed copy from the hardrive of a Dish DVR to a DVD recording on the 640? Think I already know the answer, just hoping. Thanks in advance for any replys. Gramppy

Is it possible to do a high speed copy from the hardrive of a Dish DVR to a DVD recording on the 640? Think I already know the answer, just hoping. Thanks in advance for any replys. Gramppy
Can't control external device in Copying like the One-Touch feature, which controls both 640 drives. You'll have to start playing the DVR and press REC to record what's playing.

Btw, I also see these same results when I am watching both live at the same time (i.e., the taped program and the same program viewed from the 640H-s L1 passthrough, toggling back and forth). In other words, I don't even have to wait to see the differences by viewing the resulting recording on the 640H-s HDD. They are obvious before the recording process even begins. Am I missing something obvious here?
Not sure what you're "toggling." If you're seeing the VCR directly thru a diff. TV input from the 640's input, then your connecting cables to the TV may be the source...either diff. cable types or bad cable in the 640 set? If this is your setup, switch cables to eliminate those.

There are adjustments you can make/select in the Video Adjust menu for VHS tapes, but check all other stuff first before resorting to that.

I am trying help my friend get his 640H to work, it is brand new out of the box, I cannot get any audio out of the unit when simply playing a DVD, I have not even ventured to the recorder yet. When playing a DVD I have tried the analog outputs, the digital output, as well as the RF for a normal TV, no audio what so ever, get picture ever which way. I have gone through the setup several times and cannopt find anything that has been missed, eihter there is something I have missed or is hidden in a very strange place or the unit is faulty. I apoligize if this type of problem has been addressed somewhere in theis thread.
Just a bunch of WAGs.

Have to ask: is your TV on Mute?

Not sure if your audio is routed thru a receiver or not, but try turning "Digital Out" off in the Initial Setup > Audio menu? or if your have it off, turn it on?

Check cables to make sure they're tight and in the right place? or try other cable set

I bought the 640H-S just recently and while I'm still getting the hang of it, I've read a good portion of this thread and have picked up a lot of good tips. I've been recording some shows off my digital cable feed (mainly manual but a couple on timer recording as well - both have worked fine) but I haven't tried burning any discs yet. This is my first DVR, so I'm still getting a handle on all the terminology and media types, etc.

Now that I've confirmed the basic hookup and basic functions are fine, I'm wondering what people's recommendations are on the best way for me to do my recordings. I think I've got a much better idea based on the information I've read so far in this thread what many of the options are and what they do. Perhaps folks can both help confirm if my understanding is correct and provide opinions on what the best method is for my to do recordings. Let me explain below what type of recordings I want to make to provide the context here:

- a large percentage of my recordings (or at least a distinct subset, which are the ones I'm concerned with right now) are documentaries and other similar shows off Discovery and National Geographic, etc. Most of these I'll want to burn onto DVD and keep, but highest picture/sound quality is not a necessity. Up until now, I have generally recorded these on VHS tapes on SLP (6 hour) record mode. I actually end up watching them more often on the bedroom TV, which is fairly small, and even the TV in my living room is only 27", so SLP has been adequate. I've kind of gotten used to being able to get several 1 hour episodes on a single tape/media. So I trying to determine what recording mode/format/technique to use to more easily satisfy the following constraints:

- I want to be able to get multiple shows on a single media
- I will want to be able to play the discs I burn on my other DVD player, so whatever mode/format I burn I need to ensure it remains compatible with the other player
- on playback, I want the entire disc to be able to play without intervention (pauses as it goes from one title to another are okay)
- I gather you generally want to try to preserve the ability to burn in high speed dubbing mode if at all possible

Right now I've just been recording a few shows onto the HDD with the standard SP resolution. Since I gather this would only allow me to get maybe 2 shows on a standard DVD-R or DVD+R after removing commercials, I was initially thinking I should burn to DVD in a lower recording mode to get more on each disc. From what I gather:

- to do high speed dubbing from the HDD to DVD you need to plan in advance to record to the HDD in the right recording mode to match what I'm planning to burn.
- any recordings I am making in SP mode would have to be dubbed to DVD in real time mode if I wanted to use something laround MN09 to get an equivalent amount on a single layer disc.

I'm wondering now though whether I should just record and dub with SP resolution and just use DL discs exclusively for these shows. The other DVD player I have claims to be able to play DVD+R DL (although not DVD-R DL I don't think) so it ought to also handle them. Assuming most 1 hour shows get trimmed down to approx 44-45min once commercials are removed, with a DL disc giving approx 1.8 times the capacity of the 120min recording time of SP, that should allow at least 4, perhaps 5 shows to fit on the disc. I think I'd be plenty satisfied with that, especially if I ended up with shows with SP quality instead of LP/SLP. If I stick with SP I should be able to take advantage of high speed dubbing too, both with the recordings I already have and future ones. Are there any gotchas or issues with this that I've missed?

A couple of other misc. questions I had based on some of the other comments:

- somebody mentioned that that you're limited to high speed dubbing only if you choose to edit in video mode compatible instead of frame-accurate, because the high speed dubbing requires the cut points to be on I-frames. It was also mentioned that you should be able to get accurate thumbnails if you ensure you set it on an I-frame. Would that also work for editing? That is to say, if you edited in frame accurate mode but made sure you always stopped on an I-frame, would you still be able to use high speed dubbing? Or conversely is there a way to ensure in video mode editing that you always mark on an I-frame so your edits remain exactly where they were even when you high speed dub?

- is there any reason not to just do your editing of commercials on the HDD (so that they are physically removed and space is freed up) instead of virtually on a copy list? The former seems more logical to me but it wasn't entirely clear whether there were any real disadvantages to doing it that way.

- both the manual and here it's been mentioned that VR mode is more flexible that video mode for editing, but doesn't really spell out what the differences are. What extra does VR mode actually give you? Since I want to burn in a mode that is compatible with other players I want to use video mode anyway right? The HDD also has a "video mode on" setting (which I'm using) - I'm not sure if this refers to the same thing or not.

No the TV is not on mute, hooked up another DVD player to the TV compsite inputs just to make sure it wasn't his TV. I tried the audio outs through receiver with the digital out, and through the TV with the analog outs. Tried different cables, no luck, have been trhough that setup and tried everything possible regarding the audio out, I am really staring to think the unit is bad, but just checking to see if something is hidden or just can't seem to see it.

Hello what brand of DVD works best with the Pioneer DVR 640H-S?I am using TDK-R with my 640H-S and the quality is just ok I think.Can I use a double side disc for more space on one DVD? Thanks :) :D

Hello what brand of DVD works best with the Pioneer DVR 640H-S?I am using TDK-R with my 640H-S and the quality is just ok I think.Can I use a double side disc for more space on one DVD? Thanks :) :D

I use only single-layer Taiyo Yuden exclusively. So far (more than 2,000 discs burned on the 640, 633, Panasonic DMR-E30, several more Sony and Pioneer PC burners) not a single failure (well, one, but that was my own fault for accidentally unplugging the power-cable mid burn :p )

Any DL disk brands that are particularly recommended?

Any DL disk brands that are particularly recommended?

Verbatim makes an excellent DL disk. Since you are in TO, Futureshop frequently has sales on the 20-packs. Sony DL disks are rebranded Verbatims so I've also used them without any problem.

I second Verbatim. But I'm not a fan of DL recordable media in general.