I'll start this thread for those of us just getting our units to post thoughts.

I've just got mine set up. I can't take requests to try things out but will post what I come across.

Setup was relatively simple. I have programed three recordings to record from line 3 2 tomorrow and 1 saturday.

Bad news Divx AVI's and non standard mpegs that play on my Phillips player. Were all rejected by the 640h-s. Not a Big deal for me becuase I have my stanalone Phillips.

I will be trying out a Short recording in MN10 mode shortly to see the PQ.

Not planning on Burning any DVDs yet.

So does it have a DV input or not?

Some simple questions:

1) Has the nasty EPG ?

2) Has DV/ Firewire input ?

3) After turn it on, is operative right away or has the same 30 sec delay with the message "wait a moment" displayed as in the 633 ?

No EPG

no dv, no firwire.

did'nt notice a wait period. will say for sure next time i turn it on. Edit. : Standby to on is about 5 seconds of black screen.

very quiet no distracting hdd or fan noise.


Update on DIVX playback. A File which never played on my Phillips played on the Pioneer. I guesse that means hit and miss.

Great! So the highly anticipated 640H is finally in the hands of users! Looking forward to reading this thread! I will be buying a HDD-based recorder sometimes this year, and this one is high on my list based on specs.

For my usage patterns, the absence of DV and EPG are non-issues. The absence of EPG may even be a plus :-) Of course other people have different preferences, so for their usage it may be a showstopper....

Hopefully when Suplex gets thiers they will chime in as well.

Great! So the highly anticipated 640H is finally in the hands of users! Looking forward to reading this thread! I will be buying a HDD-based recorder sometimes this year, and this one is high on my list based on specs.

I'm also looking forward to replies to this thread, ncaahoops!

I'm most curious to see if the 'reported' recorded picture quality on the Pioneer 640 compares favorably to the '06 Panasonics. (I trust I'd have to buy one to find out.)

I'm still pleasantly surprised here with the DMR-ES15 picture quality at LP or FR at or above LP speed. :) I don't anticipate needing a harddrive DVD recorder since I rent an SA 8300HD from Cablevision LI, NY, but the editing and fast-copy-to-DVD of an HD DVDR are tempting...

Disclosure: Pioneer DV-656A player, Samsung DVD-HD950 upscaling player, and Panasonic ES20 and ES15 recorders; JVC LT-40FH96 1920x1080 pixel LCD TV.

Hopefully when Suplex gets thiers they will chime in as well.

I certainly will chime in my forum friend. It got delivered to me at 7:00pm (EST), and believe it or not, I am actually reading the manual to go over some things BEFORE I hook it up (very unusual for me to do something like that).

So far it looks like there are several things that you can do with the "-" (Minus) media, that you can't do with the "+" (Plus) media.

Here is an example...and this is just from reading the manual...you can set a DVD to anywhere from One Hour & One Minute, to 13 Hours and 22 Minutes (61 minutes to 802 minutes) with 30 incrimental steps in between for a total of 32 possible settings. They can all be used with the "Minus" media.

However with the "Plus" media, oh and by the way...to clear up any controversy...this unit DOES record to all four blank DVD types (actually 5 if you include DVD-Ram) those being: -R, +R, -RW, & +RW. But back to what I was saying about the "Plus" media...can only be set from the One Hour & One Minute mode to the 8 Hour mode (480 minutes). So you lose the 10 Hour, 12 Hour, and 13 Hour:22 Minute modes with the "Plus" media.

Also you can high speed dub from the HDD to DVD, and you can do that on ALL recording speeds with "Minus" media, but with "Plus" you can only do it with the 300 Minute (5 Hours) setting or lower, which makes for 6 settings that if used with "Plus" media, do not allow High Speed dubbing.

Now I don't know why "Minus" media is allowed to pretty much do just about anything, and "Plus" is limited...or if it would really even matter to anyone...but I thought it was unique enough to list here.

To everyone in this forum, I promise that once I start using it...will be very soon...I will be back and list any goods or bads that I discover with this unit. It might take a moment until my next post, but...I'll Be Back (no pun intended).

oh and by the way...to clear up any controversy...this unit DOES record to all four blank DVD types (actually 5 if you include DVD-Ram) those being: -R, +R, -RW, & +RW

Actually 7, if you include DVD+R DL and DVD-R DL.

Thanks for the reviews. I wish I didn't sell my 533 a few months back in anticipation for this. No DV is a deal breaker for me. Looks like I will be buying the Panny :(

Does it have the Jukebox feature? I believe you were able to upload your Mp3 songs in the Jukebox and play them.

Actually 7, if you include DVD+R DL and DVD-R DL.

I can't believe I forgot about those, thanks for the clarification.

Thanks for the reviews. I wish I didn't sell my 533 a few months back in anticipation for this. No DV is a deal breaker for me. Looks like I will be buying the Panny :(

Does it have the Jukebox feature? I believe you were able to upload your Mp3 songs in the Jukebox and play them.

The Pioneer does have the Jukebox feature. It also has a USB port so you can take one of your Memory Sticks (or even an External Hard Drive if you have many songs) connect it to the Pioneer and upload your songs into it like that.

Just on a side note, my manual says it's for the following models:

DVR-640H-S
DVR-543H-S
DVR-540H-S

I don't even know what the 543 is (first I have heard of it) but I just wanted to list it here.

Anybody want to bet the 543 is slated for Walmart? If that's the case, I'll be the first person standing in line to get one off the truck.

Can you confirm that the 640 has an RF input? I can't seem to find that information in any of the documentaion I have seen.

Chris, I'm willing to bet it's for Costco not Wal-Mart :)

Just recieved my 640 today.......any questions???........ill let ya know what i see.........this is my 1st dvd recorder.......

Can you confirm that the 640 has an RF input? I can't seem to find that information in any of the documentaion I have seen.

It must have otherwise the tuner couldn't work. Don't you mean RF OUTPUT?

"RF Outputs" on every DVD recorder I have heard of or owned only provide the same signal as presented to the RF input. In other words, there is an internal splitter that sends the RF input to the internal tuner and to the "RF Output" jack.

The "RF Output" does not deliver the signal from a DVD that is playing or a recording in progress (unless, by coincidence, you are recording from the RF input).

I have heard that some combo units (i.e., integrated with VCR) might offer DVD signals to the RF output jack, but I also know that some don't.

Could they make this any more confusing? This is one significant deviation from the VCRs we all used in the past.

Can you confirm that the 640 has an RF input? I can't seem to find that information in any of the documentaion I have seen.


Yes 75 ohm(standard cable) RF in and out.

Thanks for the RF info. I am new to this technology and just wanted to be sure, as I most likely will be ordering one online. I'm just waiting for a review of the picture quality to see if it is as good as the 533/633 models.

suplex: Review #3

I decided to do a bunch of reviews as I use the Pioneer 640, instead of waiting until I have tried/tested everything with a mile long review.

Editing Something Recorded On The HDD:

When you want to edit, lets say to remove commercials, it gives you two options on how to do your editing. What it boils down to is whether or not you are going to want to "High Speed" dub, what you edited, to a DVD.

If you know you won't be using High Speed dubbing you can select an Edit mode that will allow you to pick your Beginning and End points (of material you want to remove) with frame by frame accuracy (1 second = 30 frames). When you use this mode, you can't High Speed dub.

If you want to be able to High Speed dub, you select an Edit mode that allows you to get within 1 to 1.5 seconds from the spot you wish to start the edit, and stop the edit. Doesn't allow for a precise editing, but it may be good enough for some people who must utilize the High Speed dubbing feature. For me, I would rather have precise editing, but I give Pioneer an "A+" for allowing you to make a choice.

Another thing with High Speed Dubbing is whatever chapter marks you make, or if you edit title names, thumbnail pictures, etc..., you might lose those settings, or your chapter marks/thumbnails will wind up close to what you set, instead of exact. Yet another reason...for me...to stick with real time dubbing.

Now I will also say that I did a test taking out a commercial and when I played it back it was seemless when it got to the part that I edited out. On my Toshiba D-R1 model (no HDD) you could always tell where you took a commercial out during playback...not the end of the world...but Pioneer does it perfectly.

Another thing I found out (and I promise to test this when recording direct to a DVD) is that on the HDD you can press pause while you are recording something your watching (meaning you are not doing a timer recording) and it works just fine as an edit feature. This is a problem with many DVD recorders when trying it directly to a DVD, but the HDD works ok, so I assume the DVD will also...but I will test it.

One thing I though I wasn't going to like is when you set it to record something manually. You have to set it in 15 minute increments, meaning an 8:00pm starting time can be set for: 8:00pm, 8:15pm, 8:30pm, 8:45pm, etc..., then what you do is set your timer and you can go back into it and edit what you set...from there, you can change minute by minute for whatever you like. Meaning if you want to start it at 7:59pm...you can. I love being able to set a timer for any hour:minute to any other hour:minute without restrictions, so although I wish you could do that during the initial setting, it doesn't bother me as long as I am able to do it somehow.

That's about it for this post, I will discuss the much anticipated Picture Quality as my next post, and I have a gut feeling it will be a great review from what I have seen so far.

Oh, just one more thing. So far, there is only One thing I don't like. It's not the end of the world, and I will even explain how it kind of doesn't matter in a way, but it would be nice if the Pioneer 640 had it, but it doesn't.

What is it? An Open/Close (Eject) button on the remote...it's not there.
Why doesn't it matter? Because you have to get up anyway to load/unload the disc, so you just press the button on the unit when you get up...but...it should still be on the remote.

Until next time...

Suplex

Thanks for the info. Can you tell me if the 640 can have an alternate remote code? I already have a Pioneer 79 player and I need to use a separate RC code for the recorder. Thanks.

Sergio

Suplex

Thanks for the info. Can you tell me if the 640 can have an alternate remote code? I already have a Pioneer 79 player and I need to use a separate RC code for the recorder. Thanks.

Sergio

Sergio:

Yes, in fact, it does allow you to do that. There are three settings you can use, so one of them should certainly be different enough so it doesn't interfere with your 79 Player.

suplex.

suplex,


Good info, but the following is a little disconcerting:

If you want to be able to High Speed dub, you select an Edit mode that allows you to get within 1 to 1.5 seconds from the spot you wish to start the edit, and stop the edit. Doesn't allow for a precise editing, but it may be good enough for some people who must utilize the High Speed dubbing feature. For me, I would rather have precise editing, but I give Pioneer an "A+" for allowing you to make a choice.

Panasonics don't force you to have to make this choice, nearly "frame accurate" editing and chapter marks are available even with high speed dubs. In fact, Panasonics allow editing to be made "non-destructively" to the original recording using a "playlist" editing feature as well (same precision), which also allows you to high speed dub to DVD.

Does real time dubbing on the Pioneer result in any nocticeable degradation due to the inevitable re-encoding that takes place?

Now I don't know why "Minus" media is allowed to pretty much do just about anything, and "Plus" is limited...or if it would really even matter to anyone...but I thought it was unique enough to list here.

Thanks for giving us a first hand report on the 640!!!

I think the media differences are sort of like a religious thing. The -R camp companies (eg Panasonic, Pioneer) are more competent/supportive of the -R format, while the +R camp companies are more competent/supportive of the +R format, so they tend to favor that instead of the other. That along with the marketing, philosophical and copyright issues behind each camp I think cause this discrepancy in feature-sets and support, along with the specifications/technical-limitations of each format.

suplex,


Good info, but the following is a little disconcerting:



Panasonics don't force you to have to make this choice, nearly "frame accurate" editing and chapter marks are available even with high speed dubs. In fact, Panasonics allow editing to be made "non-destructively" to the original recording using a "playlist" editing feature as well (same precision), which also allows you to high speed dub to DVD.

Does real time dubbing on the Pioneer result in any nocticeable degradation due to the inevitable re-encoding that takes place?

The Pioneer also uses a "Playlist" for when you have the material ready on the HDD and you want to dub it to a DVD, so they're both probably very similar in that respect.

About your question on degradation, did you mean if "High Speed" dubbing causes it (as many people think doing anything quickly results in lesser quality), or did you mean "Real Time"? Because so far, I have not noticed any visible quality loss from what is on the HDD to the DVD created from it, using "High Speed". I haven't tested "Real Time" yet, but I doubt that would give a problem...I was concerned with quality loss from "High Speed", and there isn't any.

Thanks for giving us a first hand report on the 640!!!

I think the media differences are sort of like a religious thing. The -R camp companies (eg Panasonic, Pioneer) are more competent/supportive of the -R format, while the +R camp companies are more competent/supportive of the +R format, so they tend to favor that instead of the other. That along with the marketing, philosophical and copyright issues behind each camp I think cause this discrepancy in feature-sets and support, along with the specifications/technical-limitations of each format.

First off...You're Welcome.

Secondly...I agree with your theory 100%. If you think about it, DVD Recorder manufacturers COULD make thier units so that you could do anything with either -R or +R with no limitations, but they simply CHOOSE not to.

It would be like a High Def DVD Recorder (HD DVD) that could ALSO record Blu-ray. Never gonna happen! The technology exists to create such a device, but too much politics would not allow it.

If you want to be able to High Speed dub, you select an Edit mode that allows you to get within 1 to 1.5 seconds from the spot you wish to start the edit, and stop the edit. Doesn't allow for a precise editing, but it may be good enough for some people who must utilize the High Speed dubbing feature. For me, I would rather have precise editing, but I give Pioneer an "A+" for allowing you to make a choice.Unless there is something dramatically different in the encoder on the 2006 models, the accuracy should be to the nearest 0.5 second as on my 2005 Pioneer 533 and 633 models. You can tell because when you select an edit point the time value will show as "hh.mm.ss.xx", where ".xx" is either ".00" or ".15". The ".xx" represents the frame number within a second and ranges from ".00" thru ".29".

This is because the encoder inserts a new I-frame (a frame containing complete picture information, as opposed to just the differences from the previous frame) twice per second, and can only perform a "high-speed-copyable" edit that ends and begins on the I-frames.

On the 533 and 633 you can set thumbnails accurately if you use an I-frame for your thumbnail. This means choosing a frame with a time that ends in ".00" or ".15". I would be surprised if this weren't also true on the 640.

The Pioneer also uses a "Playlist" for when you have the material ready on the HDD and you want to dub it to a DVD, so they're both probably very similar in that respect.

About your question on degradation, did you mean if "High Speed" dubbing causes it (as many people think doing anything quickly results in lesser quality), or did you mean "Real Time"? Because so far, I have not noticed any visible quality loss from what is on the HDD to the DVD created from it, using "High Speed". I haven't tested "Real Time" yet, but I doubt that would give a problem...I was concerned with quality loss from "High Speed", and there isn't any.


A high speed dub is typically a direct data dump so there is never quality degradation there (its a bit for bit duplication of the source recording), that's one of the reasons its preferred besides the fact that is saves time. I was specifically asking about real time dubs (you stated in your post that was your preferred method so I just assumed you had already done one. Real time dubs will result in some quality loss because re-encoding is involved, its just a matter of how perceptible the quality loss is. So that's what I'm asking about - real time dub quality (as I explicitly stated in my original question: "Does real time dubbing on the Pioneer result in any nocticeable degradation due to the inevitable re-encoding that takes place?" [emphasis added for clarity])

Thanks.

I don't think I understand the edit thing. On my 533 I can chose which way I want to edit. Frame accurate or the video compatible mode. Yet, they both can do a high speed dub. The only difference is the thumbnail picture (if that.) Are you saying that they dropped that? That instead of being able to do editing in either mode and then high speed dub you only get one choice? That, if for some reason, I have to go into frame accurate mode to edit one small thing I am now forced to copy the whole thing over in real time?

I also would like to know about the picture quality and real time dubbing PQ difference. As I think I read that these new ones are made by a difference co. than last year's model.

Also, I hate that if I edit and then move something to DVD I only get my edit points if I high speed dub. If I do real time dub it ignores my edit points and puts it's own in every 10 minutes. On this new one, can you put in your own edit points where ever you want and have it dubbed over in real time keeping your edit points? Can you edit, in say frame accurate mode, where each cut should put in a chapter point; then dub in real time keeping those edit points or again does it ignore all of your edit points and just put in one every 10 minutes?

I'm with Sean on the Pioneers video mode editing ability...

For me, there is little reason to do real time dubbing to DVD with a Pioneer hdd Recorder.

With close to 700 DVDs burned with my Pioneer 531H only about 10 were real-time dubs. A couple of the ten were testing XP+ to SP re-encoding and the others were mainly stupidity on my part for not properly setting the optimum initial recording speed to hdd.

The Pioneer makes it very easy to trim ends of a hdd recording, and remove segments and add chapter points as desired. After high speed dubbing the edited recording to DVD, I have never felt the need or later wished that I had done frame accurate (versus video mode) editing.

When you re-encode from XP on hdd to SP on DVD, yes you can tell a difference. I have never tried re-encoding from SP on hdd to SP on the DVD...

My two gripes about the Pioneers 531H's editing ability are:
First , only ask me once per recording if I want frame accurate editing....
Second, the lack of DVD menu creation options. Toshiba is the only DVD recorder that has decent DVD menu creation options. Philips clones are going with YESDVD for menu creation. Sonys I've owned or seen had the fewest DVD menu options

my $.02 :cool:

If you use Timer Record instead of Easy Timer you can set by the minute. (rather then 15 minute segments)

OK so I played 3 Divx Files on my Phillips player, and Recorded them to HDD through the line 3 in real time. I Recorded in MN 10 which is 480x480 230 minutes record time to dvd. I chose MN10 becuase it seem to equate to the SVCD video format. ( My reasoning being the source material )

I then Retitled the HDD files , and High speed copied (Video mode) To DVD (Set to automatically Finalize) About three hours of Video took roughly 7 minutes from start to finish.

PQ seemed close to the source DIVX file that was played on the Phillips.

One thing I though I wasn't going to like is when you set it to record something manually. You have to set it in 15 minute increments, meaning an 8:00pm starting time can be set for: 8:00pm, 8:15pm, 8:30pm, 8:45pm, etc..., then what you do is set your timer and you can go back into it and edit what you set...from there, you can change minute by minute for whatever you like. Meaning if you want to start it at 7:59pm...you can. I love being able to set a timer for any hour:minute to any other hour:minute without restrictions, so although I wish you could do that during the initial setting, it doesn't bother me as long as I am able to do it somehow.

UPDATE:

There are more than one setting to use when doing a timer recording, if you use "Easy Timer Recording" then it's the 15 minute increments, if you use "Manual Timer Recording" it's minute by minute precise. So you don't have to set your Timer the "15 minute" way, and then edit that, you can set it directly how you like.

Next I recorded 2 shows from cable T.V. to Hdd (Video Mode & MN10). I then Did My First Editing Erase Section. This Was pretty simple just selecting where to start(From) and end(To) then when prompted to "Erase Section" select "yes" and its Gone. Then I High Speed copied to DVD (Video Mode & MN10 ) With it again set to Finalize when Finished Copying.

Editing points seemed where I had set them. PQ looked true to source (Cable T.V.) Quite good actually. The Only thing I wished I had done was set a Thumbnail. Otherwise I'm pretty happy with how this turned out.

Copty to Finalize of over 200 minutes of T.V. was about 11 minutes.

HP 16x DVD-R was used.

Questions for you new Pioneer 640 owners?

1) If you have the 640 attached to a cable box, does the recording pick up the shows title from the cable like my Pio 531H does from TWC digial cables STB?
This is a very nice timesaving feature.

2) Does the 640 have a setup config option for choosing default thumbnail (time)? Something like 30sec, 1 min and 3 minutes(into the recording)?
If it does then choosing the 3 minute option will give more accurate title results per question one above.

3) Does the 640 have similar input signal adjustments to the 531/533/633 series?

Since the manual has yet to surface....We interested parties have a lot of stupid questions... :rolleyes:

Questions for you new Pioneer 640 owners?

1) If you have the 640 attached to a cable box, does the recording pick up the shows title from the cable like my Pio 531H does from TWC digial cables STB?
This is a very nice timesaving feature.

2) Does the 640 have a setup config option for choosing default thumbnail (time)? Something like 30sec, 1 min and 3 minutes(into the recording)?
If it does then choosing the 3 minute option will give more accurate title results per question one above.

3) Does the 640 have similar input signal adjustments to the 531/533/633 series?

Since the manual has yet to surface....We interested parties have a lot of stupid questions... :rolleyes:


1 I have analog cable soo I can't answer that one. So Far I have Retitled everything myself. ( I just get date time source)

2 Yes

3 Have'nt gotten that far yet.

So just out of Curiosity I shoved a full CD of MP3's in the DVD Drive. It it showed all the folders, highlite a folder it shows the mp3's in that folder. Highlite an mp3 press enter and it played the song. All the while the HDD is recording a T.V. Show.

I'm not ready to load the HDD jukebox yet though.

Questions for you new Pioneer 640 owners?

1) If you have the 640 attached to a cable box, does the recording pick up the shows title from the cable like my Pio 531H does from TWC digial cables STB?
This is a very nice timesaving feature.

I saw that this situation didn't apply to "GhostInTheMachin", but I noticed that it does pick up the shows title. I was doing some testing and I recorded something from the Cartoon Network (just a clip from a cartoon called: "Billy and Mandy") and it titled it as: BILLYANDMANDY.

Then I tried something else from the Sci/Fi channel and it just titled that: SCIFI, similar to how an exterior source (like a VCR) would be automatically titled: LINE1 (or whatever A/V In you connected it to.

So I think it's fair to say that it's hit or miss, because it does with some channels and not with others. The way you can tell though is by watching TV through the Pioneer, when you change the channel it may or may not give you some info about what channel you have on...if it does, then that is what the Title will be named. If not it will Title it by the name or number of the channel you recorded it from.

With close to 700 DVDs burned with my Pioneer 531H only about 10 were real-time dubs. A couple of the ten were testing XP+ to SP re-encoding and the others were mainly stupidity on my part for not properly setting the optimum initial recording speed to hdd.

Oldemanphil:

In some further testing I have been doing I noticed that "Real Time" dubs can be done where the HDD could have been set to any recording speed setting, and the DVD can be set to a different setting, but "High Speed" dubs have to be set at the same speed (example: Both set to "SP" mode, or both set to "MN 17" etc...)

But now, looking at your post, all I have to do is set the recording speed to "Optimize", and it will allow me to dub "High Speed" without worrying about having the speed settings match?

I tested High Speed already, but it was just a half hour show (so I used XP mode), but maybe you could assist me with what to do in the following situation.

Let's say I recorded a TV Movie that is three hours long (with commercials) so I use XP mode to get it on the HDD (giving me well over three hours at the best quality setting). Then when I edit the commercials out I get it down to 2 hours and 10 minutes (I have done this on DVD-Ram discs with recorders that have no HDD, so that is how I know how long it will be without commercials) and I want to transfer it to DVD.

Well XP mode on the HDD gives me over 34 hours so the 3 hour movie has no problems fitting in that mode, but to get the 2 hour 10 minute "edited" movie on a DVD, I would need to use "MN 20" mode (130 minutes). Now the "MN" equivalent to "XP" mode is "MN 32".

So now I can't use "High Speed" because it was recorded to the HDD in "MN 32", and I would need the DVD to be "MN 20" so it fit's the disc. So this example would have to be "Real Time".

Now I know that I could have set the HDD to record using "MN 20" (which would give over 73 hours, and then the speeds would match and I could "High Speed" dub, but what could I do if I don't know what the time will be cut down too after editing out the commercials, so that I will be able to "High Speed" dub?

The more people in here are talking about High Speed dubbing, the more I think I might be changing my mind about using it, and just live with "close" edits...instead of "precise" ones.

Hi

DVD Recorder manufacturers COULD make thier units so that you could do anything with either -R or +R with no limitations, but they simply CHOOSE not to.

They could, however the likes of Pioneer, Panasonic etc will only produce DVD Recorders that comply with the licencing and specifications of each format.

+RW uses the +VR recording mode, this is different to that used on DVD-RW/R, and +VR doesn't allow the longer recording times. They could of course allowed +RW to use the VR mode or the Video mode and so get the exact same recording lengths, however then it wouldn't comply to the RW spec and would have caused licensing problems.

In the UK we have the 540HX and 440HX, these come with digital tuners and also 2 EPGs, either the GuidePlus one (that requires regular downloading) or the digital one supplied with our digtal TV that is free from ads and is available to use immediately without downloads. An internal pic is here: http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=287176&page=4

Regards

Phil

My Picture Quality Review (suplex Review #4)

Well after some more testing, I think that both Real-Time, and High-Speed dubs are as clear as the source they recorded from, making me thing that all the fuss about how good the Pioneer 640 looks on paper...is for good reason. The clarity of the picture when you would press "pause" was about as clear as a digital photograph.

My Toshiba D-R1 used to give a nice picture quality if the scene was outside in broad daylight, but a dark scene...like people talking in a dim lit bar, would show pixilation and artifacts. The Pioneer does great with Bright and Dark scenes.

I also put multiple titles on one DVD-R (removing and inserting the disc in between to make sure it would recognize it again) and it handled that just fine. I even tried two titles from the HDD (one High Speed, and one Real Time), and two titles direct to DVD (one Timer Recording, and one Manual Recording) and all four titles came out on the same DVD in great quality.

The compatibility of the disc played just fine on all the other DVD players in the house (including a portable one), so that's a big plus right there (would have been bad if it only played in the unit that recorded it, but it doesn't) and I played DVD's that I recorded in the Toshiba D-R1 and D-R2 models, in the Pioneer, and they all played just fine.

Something else I wanted to mention (as I promised in a former post I would try it and give my results here). When manually recording to a DVD I would always have problems if I pressed "pause" during the recording (using my older Toshiba's), but the Pioneer can handle it with no problem and finalizes just fine.

Little things I like about the Pioneer (compared to using two non-HDD units) is that when you do a dub (no matter what kind) you don't have to be there to "Stop" the recording...it's automatic. That's not news to anyone who has recorded using a HDD unit before, but I really like not having to worry about going back in the room to stop the recording now.

Oh and last thing...for now...is that I agree with "GhostInTheMachin" about how quiet the unit is when recording something. My Toshiba D-R1 was quiet, but the D-R2 made fan noise (only if it was on), so now I won't have to worry about which recorder to use if I want to record something late at night, just record it on the HDD and it will be whisper silent.

Until next time...

...Let's say I recorded a TV Movie that is three hours long (with commercials) so I use XP mode to get it on the HDD (giving me well over three hours at the best quality setting). Then when I edit the commercials out I get it down to 2 hours and 10 minutes (I have done this on DVD-Ram discs with recorders that have no HDD, so that is how I know how long it will be without commercials) and I want to transfer it to DVD.

Well XP mode on the HDD gives me over 34 hours so the 3 hour movie has no problems fitting in that mode, but to get the 2 hour 10 minute "edited" movie on a DVD, I would need to use "MN 20" mode (130 minutes). Now the "MN" equivalent to "XP" mode is "MN 32".

So now I can't use "High Speed" because it was recorded to the HDD in "MN 32", and I would need the DVD to be "MN 20" so it fit's the disc. So this example would have to be "Real Time".

Now I know that I could have set the HDD to record using "MN 20" (which would give over 73 hours, and then the speeds would match and I could "High Speed" dub, but what could I do if I don't know what the time will be cut down too after editing out the commercials, so that I will be able to "High Speed" dub?

The more people in here are talking about High Speed dubbing, the more I think I might be changing my mind about using it, and just live with "close" edits...instead of "precise" ones.
What I learned from other Pioneer owners on this forum:

Estimate the time/length of the program without commercials and set the MN record time to the next higher (slightly more time) setting. Then, after editing out the commercials on the HDD, you have a near-ideal MN setting for burning the DVD, allowing you to use high speed copy.

On my Pioneer 520H, this high-speed-copy method also preserves chapter markers that I set myself. I would expect the newer models to do the same.

Is it passable to copy divx files to HD and play them from hard drive only? I mean can we store 100+ divx files on HD.

Sorry if question sound stupid.

Thanks for the 640 answers and observations guys... Keep it up. :)

I'm going to have to get one to replace/backup my working horse Pioneer 531H. I have the ill fated TVGOS turned off anyway. The Pioneers work well with my TWC 's own EPG so TVGOS is a non-issue for me.

I will do almost anything to avoid the time involved with a real time dub,....So if my final DVD recording project is just over 4.4Gb, I'll start cutting out the credits and lead-ins to get it to fit.

Enjoy:D

Great stuff! Thanks for all the updates! It looks quite promising so far!

If you get a chance try a recording in around 3-4 hours. I was using MN16 on my 531. I mostly record reality shows. I don't want to have 15-30 DVD's of a season. I put about 4-5 episodes of a 1 hour show with the commercials cut out (42-43 Minutes after editing) on my Panny EH50 using LP and 3-4 episodes when I had the 531 on MN16. This is the deal breaker for me between the new Panny and Pioneer. The one that produces the best video quality at longer recording speeds is the one I am going with.

Let me first say that I beg your pardon for my ignorance as I'm new to not only this forum but also to the topic at hand. I am anxiously awaiting my Samsung 5687 TV and am trying to set up what I think I want. I have been following this thread as well as the Panasonic EH55 thread, and leaning toward the 640. But, have a couple questions.

The reason I want a DVR is not only to record movies but also to supplement my DISH VIP211 receiver I plan on getting for a TV that is HD capable. Yes I will also get the VIP622 which will be connected to the main TV (S5687). However I want to be able to record from the 211 on another set and be able to download to a disc for future viewing whenever. As well as convert some tapes to disc. Eventually getting into editing.

I understand the 640 will not playback in HD but by going back through the DISH211 will it be converted to HD? Or does/will the TV itself take care of this function if at all?

Does the fact that the 640 doesn't have an HDMI make a difference as the panny does? Not sure if this is the basis for such a price difference or the fact that it has a 200GB HD.

Is it possible to be watching a program through the 640 live, pause it or rewind without actually recording the program as in the case of the DISH 622?

While I am contemplating an AVR, is it necessary with this unit?

Again please excuse my ignorance in these matters as from what I read most if not all of you have been doing this for sometime.

Thanks

If you get a chance try a recording in around 3-4 hours. This is the deal breaker for me between the new Panny and Pioneer. The one that produces the best video quality at longer recording speeds is the one I am going with.

Ripper64:

I took it a step beyond that and I am glad that I did. I just made a disc I entitled: "Manual Speed Test", and here is how I created that disc.

There are 11 separate titles on the disc (5 minutes each) and I started at MN 10, all the way to MN 01. The reason there are 11 titles is because after the MN 01 title, is an MN 32 title (this way after judging quality I could see how it went from worst to best). I also changed the channels as I would go from MN 10, 9, 8, etc... so I would have different things to look at to judge the quality.

First one I checked was MN 09 (4 hours) and you know how Panasonic is known for having an LP (4 hour) mode that is just as good as the SP (2 hour) mode? Well now I can say that Pioneer is known for it also. Anywhere that I would "pause" the video in the 4 hour mode gave a crystal clear freeze to the picture.

Now instead of elaborating on everyone of the 11 titles I recorded, let me just say that the Video quality was still good all the way up to and including MN 05 (7 hours). When you paused it you could see slight artifacts, but you also don't watch things in pause mode, and the Video...when in motion...was still relatively clear.

Then I viewed MN 04 (8 hours) and that was finally where you could see some deterioration in the moving Video quality. Just slightly around the edges of people (like it was outlining their body) you could see minimal artifacts/pixilation, where as the sound was not anything that seemed like it had also lost quality.

I can say that I would rate the Pioneer 640's MN 04, or SLP mode (8 hours) as the same quality that older recorders (like my Toshiba D-R1 and D-R2) would give you in their 6 hour mode. However I would also say (in defense of Pioneers 8 hour mode) that if you wanted to do something like wait until TV Land shows a marathon of a show you like, and you wanted to record 8 hours of it on a DVD, it would be something you could watch without getting a headache, but if you were trying to record every episode to archive your library, you would want to go with a higher setting.

Then after viewing the 8 hour setting, I watched the 5 minutes I recorded in MN 03, 02, & 01 (10, 12, and 13hrs:22minutes respectively) and about the only thing those modes are good for would be if you recorded something on DVD and you miscalculated, and the overflow went on the HDD in one of those modes. This way you could just see what you missed, but wouldn't need to save it. Come to think of it, I don't even know if the Pioneer does that.

So what is my verdict on Pioneer's video quality? Excellent!

Here is how I would rate the Manual settings (similar to a traffic light):

MN 01 to 03 (Red, meaning Stop)
MN 04 & 05 (Yellow, meaning Caution, but with an edge using MN 05)
MN 06 to 32 (Green, meaning Go)

So out of 32 settings, to be in favor of 27 of them, be 75%/25% in favor of 1 (7 hour mode), be 50%/50% on another one (8 hour mode), and only truly dislike 3 (MN 01, 02, & 03), I would say that anything from making a DVD from one movie, to multiple episodes of a TV show, will be very easy to do with great quality using the Pioneer DVR-640H-S.

Ripper64:

I took it a step beyond that and I am glad that I did. I just made a disc I entitled: "Manual Speed Test", and here is how I created that disc.

There are 11 separate titles on the disc (5 minutes each) and I started at MN 10, all the way to MN 01. The reason there are 11 titles is because after the MN 01 title, is an MN 32 title (this way after judging quality I could see how it went from worst to best). I also changed the channels as I would go from MN 10, 9, 8, etc... so I would have different things to look at to judge the quality.

First one I checked was MN 09 (4 hours) and you know how Panasonic is known for having an LP (4 hour) mode that is just as good as the SP (2 hour) mode? Well now I can say that Pioneer is known for it also. Anywhere that I would "pause" the video in the 4 hour mode gave a crystal clear freeze to the picture.

Now instead of elaborating on everyone of the 11 titles I recorded, let me just say that the Video quality was still good all the way up to and including MN 05 (7 hours). When you paused it you could see slight artifacts, but you also don't watch things in pause mode, and the Video...when in motion...was still relatively clear.

Then I viewed MN 04 (8 hours) and that was finally where you could see some deterioration in the moving Video quality. Just slightly around the edges of people (like it was outlining their body) you could see minimal artifacts/pixilation, where as the sound was not anything that seemed like it had also lost quality.

I can say that I would rate the Pioneer 640's MN 04, or SLP mode (8 hours) as the same quality that older recorders (like my Toshiba D-R1 and D-R2) would give you in their 6 hour mode. However I would also say (in defense of Pioneers 8 hour mode) that if you wanted to do something like wait until TV Land shows a marathon of a show you like, and you wanted to record 8 hours of it on a DVD, it would be something you could watch without getting a headache, but if you were trying to record every episode to archive your library, you would want to go with a higher setting.

Then after viewing the 8 hour setting, I watched the 5 minutes I recorded in MN 03, 02, & 01 (10, 12, and 13hrs:22minutes respectively) and about the only thing those modes are good for would be if you recorded something on DVD and you miscalculated, and the overflow went on the HDD in one of those modes. This way you could just see what you missed, but wouldn't need to save it. Come to think of it, I don't even know if the Pioneer does that.

So what is my verdict on Pioneer's video quality? Excellent!

Here is how I would rate the Manual settings (similar to a traffic light):

MN 01 to 03 (Red, meaning Stop)
MN 04 & 05 (Yellow, meaning Caution, but with an edge using MN 05)
MN 06 to 32 (Green, meaning Go)

So out of 32 settings, to be in favor of 27 of them, be 75%/25% in favor of 1 (7 hour mode), be 50%/50% on another one (8 hour mode), and only truly dislike 3 (MN 01, 02, & 03), I would say that anything from making a DVD from one movie, to multiple episodes of a TV show, will be very easy to do with great quality using the Pioneer DVR-640H-S.



This is really good news and appreciate you taking it further. I actually prefered the recordings on the 531H up to around 3 hours. After that is where the Panny excelled. One thing that still bothers me with the Pioneer is that you can't high speed dub with frame accurate editing like you can on the Panny. Sometimes the program and the commercial are so tight that its like splitting a hair. I guess some people don't mind missing a second or so into the program. I have to decide about this issue and if I want the HDMI on the Panny. Otherwise the video quality on higher recording speeds sounds really good and probably better than the new Panny. I doubt Panny tried to improve in that area. That said, I hate to go over 4 hour recordings on one disc. Squeezing an extra episode or 2 without any quality loss from the 4 hour mode sounds tempting. This season of American Idol totaled 9 DVD's on LP on the Panny so it would be nice to cut shows that run longer down to less DVD's if the quality will be the same.

So out of 32 settings, to be in favor of 27 of them, be 75%/25% in favor of 1 (7 hour mode), be 50%/50% on another one (8 hour mode), and only truly dislike 3 (MN 01, 02, & 03), I would say that anything from making a DVD from one movie, to multiple episodes of a TV show, will be very easy to do with great quality using the Pioneer DVR-640H-S.suplex, thanks for reporting the results of your testing with these new models. It would probably help a lot if you could describe what kind of TV set you're viewing these on, and what distance you're viewing at.

To those who are looking for guidance on picture quality: please be aware that picture quality is very subjective and depends on the size of the image you're viewing (determined by the size of your TV and the distance you view it at), by the type of material being viewed, and by the sensitivity of you the viewer.

Also be careful about using a paused still frame to judge the overall playback quality. There are a lot of "artifacts" that can be present in the moving image that will not necessarily show in a still frame. As an example, one of the things that annoys me is what I call "differential movement", where not all of the moving parts in a dark scene move at exactly the same time.

I speak of this simply as a caveat: if you are basing your buying decision on the relative quality between different machines it will probably be worth it for you seek out an actual recorder and try it for yourself.

One thing that still bothers me with the Pioneer is that you can't high speed dub with frame accurate editing like you can on the Panny. Sometimes the program and the commercial are so tight that its like splitting a hair. I guess some people don't mind missing a second or so into the program.I'd also prefer to have frame-accurate editing on my Pioneer, but I've found that this is less of an issue than I'd feared it would be. When I'm editing out commercials my experience is that I manage to cut on black frames in about 90% of the cases even though I'm limited to cuts occuring on only every 15th frame (1/2 second). For the other 10%, the fraction of a second that I miss has rarely bothered me. In fact, since there's always a "fade-out" and a "fade-in" of the program around the commercials, the cut usually includes part of the fade and unless you're paying pretty close attention you can't even tell that anything is missing.

Suplex, or anyone... does the 640 have an S-Vid output? The only video output that the Pioneer website mentions is the component output. I've just about made up my mind to buy one, but I need an S-Vid output to be able to adjust the aspect ratio in some situations.

Suplex, or anyone... does the 640 have an S-Vid output? The only video output that the Pioneer website mentions is the component output. I've just about made up my mind to buy one, but I need an S-Vid output to be able to adjust the aspect ratio in some situations.


1 component video out (Video only no r-l audio)
2 composite video out or s video out

total of 3 outs

1 composite or s video in ( Autorecord)
2 composite or s Video in (one front panel)

total of 3 ins

coax dig audio out

2 front panel usb ports
one type b (pict bridge printer)
one type a ( dig camera , usb memory, or" other usb deivce")

Suplex, or anyone... does the 640 have an S-Vid output? The only video output that the Pioneer website mentions is the component output. I've just about made up my mind to buy one, but I need an S-Vid output to be able to adjust the aspect ratio in some situations.

Yes, it has two sets of RCA outputs (Yellow, Red, & White) and next to each one of those is an S-Video output as well. So, in fact it has two S-Video outputs.

Looks like "Ghost" and I are right on the same page. Both making a post at 7:40am too.

Looks like "Ghost" and I are right on the same page. Both making a post at 7:40am too.
Spooky.

Anyway, glad to hear it does have S-video out, because the spec sheet (http://bobkart.gt3times.com/PDF/DVR-640H-S.pdf) makes no mention of it.

Is there an unadvertised DV-in feature as well? ;)

No DV input.

Hi

I speak of this simply as a caveat: if you are basing your buying decision on the relative quality between different machines it will probably be worth it for you seek out an actual recorder and try it for yourself.

I have to agree. MN6 on the Pioneer rated "Green for Go" in suplex's thread is for me absolutely horrible. Not only subjectively, but objectively it is recorded in a resolution of 352x240, on a large screen TV it looks bad, well it looks bad on any decent TV! This isn't just Pioneer, but any DVD Recorder. I find on a single layer the maximum you can go to without losing too much is 2 hours per disc, on a computer where you can tweak the encoder and do it non-real time you can go a bit higher, but not much.

Suplex must be watching on very tiny TV!

Regards

Phil

Thanks suplex very much for taking the time to do these tests, and to list your results here. Very much appreciated by this guy who will be buying his first dvd recorder. The info is very helpful and this dvr sounds quite impressive. Thanks!
Have you had the chance to toy around with the slo motion yet? Just wondering how it appears.......

I have to agree. MN6 on the Pioneer rated "Green for Go" in suplex's thread is for me absolutely horrible.
Do you have the 640???

Hi

Do you have the 640???

Sort of, I have the UK version which is 540HX (comes with digital tuner).

Regards

Phil

Hi



Sort of, I have the UK version which is 540HX (comes with digital tuner).

Regards

Phil
So, just to be clear, your opinion on the 640's PQ is based on a "sort of" "similar" model, with a different tuner, and with a different TV system (PAL)?

I get the picture.

Hi

I get the picture.

Laugh, it also supports NTSC and contains the same encoder, internally, apart from the obvious analogue stages where Europe get SCART and US doesn't, they are exactly the same!

All I was pointing out was the lower recording rates that someone may think looks good, may look pretty horrible to others, and that the lower MN6 rate that was rated good by one person is likely less than good to another. The facts are at MN6 it is half resolution of DVD, that isn't going to look anywhere near as good as the higher recording rates. This isn't to knock the Pioneer recorder as it is the same for all DVD Recorders at that rate. Why not try yourself and see?

The 640 model does not improve on the 530/630 models in terms of encoder performance, in fact it could be considered worse as it lacks XP+ and also lacks the 2 pass VBR feature of the earlier models when re-encoding to a lower rate.

I get the picture too :)

Regards

Phil

Ghost ITM, and Suplex, thanks for the input info. I've made up my mind to order one from Amazon, since ABT wants to charge me sales tax.

I haven't used a DVD recorder before. I've been poking around on some other threads, to determine how best to do what I want to do with it. I gather the answers vary, based on the model of DVD recorder. Primarily, I will be dubbing SVHS tapes onto DVDs, and recording new cable broadcasts on DVD. I already have two other DVD players, a 400 disc Sony, and a 5 disc, region free, Philips. I have Comcast HD service, with the Motorola two tuner DVR. I plan on swapping out the 640 with one of my SVHS VCRs, using S-Vid inputs. I don't think I have another component input free on my AV receiver, as I am using three already. Any cable channels that the 640 can't decode from the raw RF cable input, it will get from the AV receiver, via S-Vid. I would like to make the highest quality recordings, and dubs, that I can, in SP, so my other DVD players will play them. So, I have a couple of questions, which I hope you can answer, so I can hit the ground running when my 640 arrives. Thanks in advance, for any info you can give me.

When doing SVHS to DVD dubs, will I get a better looking picture by doing it real-time, or by dumping the SVHS onto the HDD, and then transfering it to DVD? Or, will it make any difference in picture quality? Yes, I know that my editing, titleing, etc. options are much better with transfering to HDD first.

Same question for recording from the 640's RF cable input, and also when using its S-Vid input, with the Cable box S-Vid output coming in - better picture recording in real-time, or loading it to the 640's HDD first, or does it matter?

Thanks!

For all those lucky dogs who've got this machine...where have you bought it from (and why)?

I seriously considering getting one (first DVR) and am now looking for the best price (this is the American way is it not!) from an authorized dealer given Pioneer's warantee. I would like to get it the fast way possible as well (ex. OneCall has 2 day for $16, or Amazon prime 2 day air for free but higher machine cost).

Any thoughts?

Anyone tested the jukebox feature?

How does it work? Easy to load? Are you able to load it directly from an MP3 player (ex. ipod)? Is the menu user friendly? Ok ok...enough questions :eek: How about a review of this feature.

To control a digital cable box?

Hellooooo
Bought my 640 from ONECALL ...had it in 2 days for $384 i believe......they are also on the Pioneers authorized list!!!......Now i need to get it setup.....haha

Mike

"Laugh, it also supports NTSC and contains the same encoder, internally, apart from the obvious analogue stages where Europe get SCART and US doesn't, they are exactly the same!"

The DVR-630H which is also a multisystem is sold in USA by Pioneer, available on some professional equipment stores like B&H photo video and has the same features as your 440HX in UK and most if not all the features of the 640 and of course without the SCART connections or the EPG that cursed the 633 !!!!! (Doesn´t have HDMI out)

It cost about $ 250 more than the 640 but has also DV input, zone 0 which means it can play anything. It has the same USB ports, a 160GB, works as a jukebox etc.

In the initial setup you configure it for NTSC and the tuner set itself for USA standard cable frequency. If you set the initial setup for PAL the tuner sets to Europe frequency and you will need a PAL monitor or TV.

I downloaded the user manual and it looks quite interesting !!!!!

Anyone tested the jukebox feature?

Hi ncomly...funny seeing you here, don't I know you from another post?...LOL, ok now to get serious. I haven't tried it yet, but will post about it when I do.

How does it work? Easy to load? Are you able to load it directly from an MP3 player (ex. ipod)? Is the menu user friendly? Ok ok...enough questions :eek: How about a review of this feature.

The Pioneer has two USB ports in the front of the unit. They are different looking connections to, so it looks like one is for putting information ON the Pioneer, and the other is for taking information OFF the Pioneer. If anyone has a USB printer and the part that connects to the printer looks different than what connects to the computer, that is what I am talking about...BOTH of those connections are in the front panel of the Pioneer. So what I said earlier about putting info on, or taking it off, may or may not be right, but I don't know why you would need both connections.

Yes if you have an iPod you can put your info into the Pioneer just like how you get it from the computer to the iPod. Also if you have one of those memory sticks or a jump drive, by SanDisc, Lexar, or any of the many companys that make them, you can load your info using one of those also.

ncomly,

The 640 was my first DVR, too. I bought it from vanns.
Free shipping and no tax.

Also, I tested the Jukebox by plugging in my Shuffle into the front USB jack. It all seems easy to listen to the mp3s and/or download them...

hth, Bob

When doing SVHS to DVD dubs, will I get a better looking picture by doing it real-time, or by dumping the SVHS onto the HDD, and then transfering it to DVD? Or, will it make any difference in picture quality?If you record to HDD and then do a high-speed dub to DVD, you will end up with identical quality compared to recording direct to DVD in the first place (assuming you used the same recording speed).

The reasons to record to HDD first include: Eliminates the hassle of having to re-record a 2-hour (example) recording if you get a bad blank and the recording fails Enables you to easily make multiple copies of the DVD at high speed Gives you a lot of editing capability (as you noted).
I found it terribly convenient to dub to HDD first. I had tapes with several shows on them, and I would record the whole tape onto one HDD title and then divide it into individual titles for each show and then set chapters and titles for the shows. This saved me from having to "baby sit" the machine in order to catch the start end end of each show.

Thanks so much, Sean, saves me a lot of trial and error! One more thing, can I record short segments from several tapes onto the HDD, then do a highspeed dub of those segments onto one DVD? Back when SVHS tape was so expensive, I would never leave blank space at the end of a tape. I tended to fill them out with lots of bits of TV ephemera and oddities. I don't need to save copies of movies that are easily replaceable in a higher quality format, but some of that strange stuff, I'll never see again, except on my copies.

You can include as many titles from the HDD onto a single DVD as will fit (depends on recording speed, obviously). So if you record several titles from several tapes onto the HDD you'll have no problem putting them onto a single DVD. The only caveat is that they will be individual titles, and as such they will each have their own entry on the DVD's menu screen (which I assume is what you want). This is because there's no way to combine separate titles together into one title (this is true on the 633 and I assume it's also true on the 640).

Edit: Actually I think there is a limit to the number of titles on a DVD, I think it might be 99.

Here's a trick you can use if you want to record material from 2 or more tapes into a single title on the HDD: hit the "record" button on the Pioneer and then play the tapes one after another (without stopping the recording). Stop the recording only after you've played all the tapes, then use the "Erase Section" edit function to remove the garbage and blank bits where you switched tapes. The result is a single title with chapter marks at each edit point.

"Laugh, it also supports NTSC and contains the same encoder, internally, apart from the obvious analogue stages where Europe get SCART and US doesn't, they are exactly the same!"

The DVR-630H which is also a multisystem is sold in USA by Pioneer, available on some professional equipment stores like B&H photo video and has the same features as your 440HX in UK and most if not all the features of the 640 and of course without the SCART connections or the EPG that cursed the 633 !!!!! (Doesn´t have HDMI out)


I downloaded the user manual and it looks quite interesting !!!!!

It does look interesting. :) From where did you download the manual? The one I found on the Pioneer UK site says it has Guide Plus+ electronic program guide. Any other USA sources besides bhphotovideo?

Thanks.

Jim

Thanks again Sean! I just ordered my 640 from OneCall, since Amazon raised the price. I paid the $16.84 for the two day Fed Ex, so it should be here Thursday. I saw a local sale of DVD-R, and -RW discs, so I'm stocking up in anticipation. :D

I just ordered my 640 from OneCall... I paid the $16.84 for the two day Fed Ex, so it should be here Thursday. I saw a local sale of DVD-R, and -RW discs, so I'm stocking up in anticipation. :D

I just followed suit and ordered from OneCall with 2 day shipping! :D

I noticed that most companies offer an extended warrantee (beyond Pioneer's 1-year). Is this worth pay the extra $$ for? Do these newer DVR have die rates less than 2 or 3 years? (with average usage).

For those who use the 640 or other Pioneer DVRs, what media brand (-R type given suplex info) have you had the best success with?

I see Sony 100pk is on sale at BB this week for $30, any experience with these in particular?

Oh no... please say it ain't so. I was told that it has the EPG thing; no way am I dealing with that bullcrap... Can somebody confirm whether EPG is on this dvr? Cripes, I hope not....I hope I was given innacurate info by a friend.
Thanks!

Everything I've read here about it says NO EPG.

Ahh.. what a relief to know that! Thanks a bunch bobkart. I am very interested in this recorder. It will be my very first one, so I had to make certain about that dreaded EPG.. Thanks!

Anyone know yet what kind of menu templates it offers? Just curious if they have added or changed any of the same old 9 options they have always had?

Hey Tommy
NO EPG on the 640.....ive waited 6 months for this thing.....haha

For those who use the 640 or other Pioneer DVRs, what media brand (-R type given suplex info) have you had the best success with?

I see Sony 100pk is on sale at BB this week for $30, any experience with these in particular?

Sony should be absolutely fine as I have used those with great success in both the 520 and 531 models. The only media I have ever noticed consistent problems with in these Pioneer units have been Memorex and other ultra-cheapies.

Zenith, I was planning on picking up some Maxell -R, and -RW, 50 @ $15 for the -R, and $10 for 15 of the -RW. I've liked Maxell tape a lot. What do you, or anyone else, think of Maxell DVDs?

Have used very few of those but I would imagine they're fine as the Pio is pretty media-friendly
Again, my only problems have been with some Memorex and BeAll DVDs. Stay away from the cheap "generics" and I think you'll be fine.

Mant thanks bobkart and Diesel_73; that is great news. I panicked when my buddy told me he thought it had EPG....I am mighty relieved...

Maxell media ....... I have excellent burns with Maxell dvd +r media. I burn on my computer though, with my Plextor 716-A burner. I don't have a stand alone dvd recorder yet but I am looking very closely to this new Pioneer one. When I check the quality of my burns with the supplied software called Plextools, it shows very few errors. I also set my booktype on the +r media to dvd ROM's. I get a better compatibility with various dvd players that way.

Thanks everyone for this great thread. I've learned a wealth of helpful info here, and believe me... this newbie is mighty appreciative!

Hi everyone, I just joined this group.

Thanks for the great info on the Pio 640.
I have experience with the Philips recorders because of their sophisticated features.

Their quality and ease of use are another matter however. The Philips units have an adjustable "buffer" for the HDD which may be set from 1-6 Hrs. I have mine set at 6, this enables me to continously record many shows, up to 6 hrs in length, before I must "flush" or write the data to the HDD. If this was set to shorter than 6 hrs, their would be a gap, as the system writes the data to the HDD between recordings. Like if you had the buffer set to 2hrs and recorded a 3hr movie.
Am I explaining this right? Is this unique to the Philips?

Anyway I was wondering if the Pioneer has anything like this, or how it deals with this issue.

Thanks

I have no idea what this "Buffer" used on the Philips unit is all about - my Pioneer 633 has nothing like it. Basically, when you record to the hard drive, it writes to the hard drive directly. So, for example, if I press "Record" and then "Stop", I can go directly to the hard drive and play it back again. In fact, you can play back the same show from the hard drive as is currently being recorded (known as "Chase Play"). So there is no "buffer" or delay in writing to the hard drive on the Pioneer units that I know about.

The only restriction I'm aware of on the Pioneers is that there's a maximum title length which (I believe) is 8 hours. That means if you want to record more than 8 hours of material you'll have to break it into two individual titles.

Thanks Sean,

I think the Philips uses this buffer to enable live pausing and other manipulation of the program while it is on. It seems to constantly be recording all the time it is on. If I then want to "mark" a section to be saved, it can then be written to the HDD for later archiving to a disc.

So I guess you are saying the Pioneer just can record for 8 straight hrs before needing to be flushed to the HD. Maybe this is a buffer but isn't called that on the Pioneer. Sounds like a good unit. I can't think of anything except the DV input that's missing.

Thanks again.

Xodiac, it sounds like your Philips is working like a DVR cable box, that is constantly recording whatever you are watching, and you can adjust how much it saves, before it drops it from the HD. My Comcast/Motorola Cablebox/DVR has a buffer, but you can't adjust it. From what Sean has said, I gather that the 640 doesn't work exactly like that. You have to tell it when to start recording to the HD, and it won't
erase anything from the HD until you tell it to do so. I don't have mine yet, so I may be mistaken. I believe there was also some mention of one set of inputs that would automatically start recording, any time they receive a signal.

Ah yes, a circular constantly-recording area that acts like a Tivo would fit the description of a "buffer" very well. No, the Pioneer 633 doesn't have such a beast, and AFAIK the 640 doesn't either.

Ah yes, a circular constantly-recording area that acts like a Tivo would fit the description of a "buffer" very well. No, the Pioneer 633 doesn't have such a beast, and AFAIK the 640 doesn't either.

The 640 doesn´t have it as neither the 633, 520 or 510.

I have a very old ( in todays digital, every day changing world) JVC HDSM1 which is a 40 GB HDD-VHS recorder which once turned on, it starts to temporaly "record" to the HDD what input is selected. This "buffer" size is selectable through the initial set up menu (as I recall in 1 or 3 hour size). So it can be used just like a TIVO or a HDD equiped cable box would be.

It´s software is very primitive when compared with the latest Pioneers or Toshibas but is the prefered by my wife to watch her choosed day recordings because is very easy to use.

Anyone know yet what kind of menu templates it offers? Just curious if they have added or changed any of the same old 9 options they have always had?

Bump.

Edit: Actually I think there is a limit to the number of titles on a DVD, I think it might be 99.

Yes, 99 for -R and 49 for +R.

640 owners: Does the remote have a chapter mark key?

I have a 480, two 520s and one 531. To say I hate the lack of a chapter mark key on the 531 is an understatement, because it makes editing out commercials (for me) more time consuming. Even if I do not intend to edit something later, making chapter marks via the remote is a feature I use a lot on the 420/520s--I was recording American Idol for a neighbor who can not yank in Fox on their TV (antenna, I have satellite) and inserting a chapter mark just before their favorite contestants sang so they could easily replay these segments (with little work for me).

Let's say I'm recording a few FoodTV programs for a relative, intend to edit out the commercials, and decide I'd like to watch them myself. On the 420/520 I watch the episode and make a chapter mark at the beginning and end of a commercial, using the remote. Later I edit the segment. Since there are already marks where the commercials start and end, I can quickly remove them. This same way of watching/speeding along later editing via the remove can _not_ be done on the 531.

About the only thing I prefer the 531 for is it's ability to high speed dubb all MN speeds from a DVD-RW back to the HD. There is a range of MN settings that require real time dubbing from DVD-RW -> HD on the 420/520. For these I do use the 531.

To say I hate the lack of a chapter mark key on the 531 is an understatement, because it makes editing out commercials (for me) more time consuming.This wouldn't work so well for putting a marker into the content of the show, but on the 531 you can just hit the pause button twice while recording to put in a chapter mark.

This wouldn't work so well for putting a marker into the content of the show, but on the 531 you can just hit the pause button twice while recording to put in a chapter mark.

Thanks for this tip. I didn't realize one could do this. Before typing this reply, I hit the record button and did the double pause a few times (within a few minutes). Stopping the recording and going into edit, I saw the chapter marks were there. Trying this on something already recorded does not work though, which makes sense--someone might just want to pause, change their mind, then change it again.

*However* I guess I have gotten pretty darn spoiled with the 420/520s. My normal way of watching something I am also recording is to start recording then watch the program via the HDD so I can hit pause if the phone rings, need a soda, want to replay something, etc. Using the chapter mark button while watching this way is great. I can just hit pause and go a few frames forward or backward before using the chapter button.

For long programs with a lot of commercials to be edited out, such as the Hallmark showing of, "King Solomon's Mines," a few weeks ago, I use a 420/520. For programs with next to no editing required, like HBO or Starz/Encore, the 531 is fine. I do find myself sometimes copying something on the 531 to a DVD-RW then doing the editing on the 520.

I wonder if the 520 remote (with the chapter mark button) would work it's
magic on a 640?
Could it be that the code might be in there...just no button on the 640 remote?

I wonder if the 520 remote (with the chapter mark button) would work it's
magic on a 640?
Could it be that the code might be in there...just no button on the 640 remote?

I would definitely like to know if it works. If it does, I would order one and give the 531 to a cousin (in another state with cable stations I don't get on DirecTV). That wonderful chapter mark button does not work on the 531. I tried.

No idea why Pioneer would drop this feature. I can't imaging that it added to the cost such that dropping it would result in manufacture savings.

Hmm

My clock got whacked back to april 2004 today. I only noticed it when I went to chase play a recording that was supposed to start at 8:00.

I have reset it via manual mode this time. (By the way auto set failed, If it had TVGOS I'd be crying about losing my channels. Glad I don't have that headache)

Once the clock was reset the recording started. That seems odd to me, if the start time was missed by an hour why would it record.

OK...Just got my 640h-s.To clarify, I am tech savy but this is my 1st dvr and even after going through the users guide, I still have 2 questions:
1.Where the hell is the TVGOSD? Is VCR plus+ alll it has? (If this is true, I'm really gonna regret not getting the Panny 55h!)
2.If I'm recording from an external source(VHS) and it is 1h:30min long...how do I get it to record at the best quality so that it fits nicely/completely on a 2hr DVD-R?
THANKS!

I've read several times in this Forum that the 640 does not have EPG/TVGOS (be thankful!).

And if it's anything like the 633, the 640 has "MN" recording speeds, one is for 90 minutes (MN26).

1.Where the hell is the TVGOSD? Is VCR plus+ alll it has? (If this is true, I'm really gonna regret not getting the Panny 55h!)

Yes, it only has VCR Plus+, or the ability to manually set it as precise as you like, or a shortcut route that sets things on the hour or in 15 minute jumps. But like everyone else is saying you need to be happy about it not having a TVGOSD, the older Pioneers that have them made a serious racket (very noisy) and the 640 is very quiet. The Panasonic EH55 very well might be a good machine, but you won't regret the Pioneer 640...trust me.

2.If I'm recording from an external source (VHS) and it is 1h:30min long...how do I get it to record at the best quality so that it fits nicely/completely on a 2hr DVD-R?
THANKS!

Ok, I know that the Panasonic has an FR mode (Flexible Recording) where without having to worry about it you just set it to that and it finds the best quality setting so whatever you are recording fits the whole disc, but the Pioneer has 6 preset settings, as well as 32 manual settings for just about any time you will need...how much more "Flexible" can you get than that? Also, the Pioneer has a setting...when you are setting a Timer Recording...that says "Auto". That sounds to me like it does exactly what the Panasonic's "FR" setting does.

Give it some time, adapt to the little changes this unit has from other ones, and you will love the Pioneer 640.

OK...Just got my 640h-s.To clarify, I am tech savy but this is my 1st dvr and even after going through the users guide, I still have 2 questions:
1.Where the hell is the TVGOSD? Is VCR plus+ alll it has? (If this is true, I'm really gonna regret not getting the Panny 55h!)
2.If I'm recording from an external source(VHS) and it is 1h:30min long...how do I get it to record at the best quality so that it fits nicely/completely on a 2hr DVD-R?
THANKS!

1. bobkart is right. Be thankful you don't have it.

2. He's right on this, too--MN26 on the 640 and earlier Pioneer models.

I'd much rather have a Pioneer than a Panasonic due to the numerous, manual (MN) settings one can make. Actually, I did have a HD Panasonic over a year ago and returned it.

My 640 came on Thursday, and I've spent as much happy time playing with it as I could, but have much more to try, and learn. Still, I have a lot of thoughts on it that I'd like to share, in no particular order. This is my first DVD recorder, and so far, I like it a lot.

I've only cut two DVDs, both real time, from the DVR of my HD Motorola cable box, via S-Vid connections. They both look great! I did them in -R, video mode.

Putting titles on them by moving the cursor and clicking on letters seems a waste of time. They included two USB ports, so why not let us hook up a key board to enter all this stuff quickly? Or, did I just miss that in the manual so far? Also, I wish you could enter the title while watching/recording the program.

The displays can be confusing, since there are four or five different display buttons. Some are faint overlays, with white on grey, hard to read. The channel display is a long, thin, dark blue bar, with faint yellow, small numbers, that is on and off rather quickly, and hard to read. I can't find the numbers in the DVD rec time counter when the DVD is stopped, only while it is recording, and only to the nearest minute, no seconds, when rec is complete.

I love having two sets of S-Vid outs. One goes to the A/V receiver, and the other goes to the TV. That lets me use the PIP to monitor both source, and recording, at the same time.

My biggest confusion, so far, is some conflicting info in the manual. In the specs on page 133, it says that all +R formats can only be used in VR mode, not Video mode, my prefered mode. But, on pages 49 and 50, it indicates that after finalizing in VIDEO Mode, these discs WILL play on other players. Does anyone know which is true? They do have a tech support number, so maybe I'll call them, after I see if I have any more questions.

I haven't bought any DL discs yet, since they are expensive, and I haven't been able to find any -R DLs locally. +R DLs are easier to find, and a bit cheaper. Would those work as well, and be playable on standard DVD players?

I'm so glad it will support inputting photo j-pegs to the HD, and then copying them to disc! I didn't think it would let me do that.

P.S., I have programmed it to HDD rec various news programs, and The Daily Show. I couldn't set weekly recordings of the Daily Show on the cable DVR, because 3 or 4 showings of each ep come up as "first showing." I like the 640 NOT being linked to an outside schedule. I like the several versions of "weekly" recordings, too. Especially the Tuesday - Saturday, which lets you record a 5 day weekly program that starts after midnight.

Putting titles on them by moving the cursor and clicking on letters seems a waste of time.On the 633 you can enter titles by pressing the number buttons on the remote multiple times for the various letters (the letters are written on the remote), rather like entering letters on a touch-tone phone. I assume the 640 would have the same capability. It's not as good as a keyboard, but it's about 5 times faster than arrowing to select the letters on the screen. You can also use the "pause" key to insert a space, the "chapter skip" key to shift between upper- and lower-case letters and the "stop" key to exit the title entry process.

On the 633 you can enter titles by pressing the number buttons on the remote multiple times for the various letters (the letters are written on the remote), rather like entering letters on a touch-tone phone. I assume the 640 would have the same capability. It's not as good as a keyboard, but it's about 5 times faster than arrowing to select the letters on the screen. You can also use the "pause" key to insert a space, the "chapter skip" key to shift between upper- and lower-case letters and the "stop" key to exit the title entry process.

All this holds for the 420/520 and 531, too. Hitting, "Stop," saves the title thus far entered on my machines. I assume this is what you mean rather than stop as in not save.

Pressing, "1," toggles period, coma, apostrophy. The key to the left of, "0," toggles between something I don't know the name for and both sides of parenthesis.

Speaking of entering titles...

I've been playing around with a new 640 for about a day now. When I burn a "title" (with chapter stops inserted) from the hard drive to a DVD, I would like to enter a name for each chapter, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to do this.

The only way that I can see to do this is to make each chapter a separate "title," then assemble the titles in the chapter list, and then burn the dvd (where I'll be able to enter the names of each title during the finalization process.

What am I missing? Is there an easier way to do this, where don't have to split up my original title and can maintain its chapter marks?

They included two USB ports, so why not let us hook up a key board to enter all this stuff (program titles) quickly? Or, did I just miss that in the manual so far?

The USB ports are only for connecting a device that will allow you to put MP3 files, or Pictures on the HDD, so you can use the PhotoViewer or JukeBox features.

I have programmed it to HDD rec various news programs, and The Daily Show. I couldn't set weekly recordings of the Daily Show on the cable DVR, because 3 or 4 showings of each ep come up as "first showing." I like the 640 NOT being linked to an outside schedule. I like the several versions of "weekly" recordings, too. Especially the Tuesday - Saturday, which lets you record a 5 day weekly program that starts after midnight.

Something else the 640 allows you to do...which I think is great...is if you are going to record a show, lets say every Monday from 8:00pm to 9:00pm, it gives you an option (if you set it to record on the HDD) where you can erase each recording with the newer one the following week.

So this Monday being the 12th would record, then next week on the 19th it will erase what was recorded on the 12th, and put the new recording in it's place. Of course you can also opt to have it keep the previous recording as well, but just the fact that it gives you the choice is a great feature.

Speaking of entering titles...

I've been playing around with a new 640 for about a day now. When I burn a "title" (with chapter stops inserted) from the hard drive to a DVD, I would like to enter a name for each chapter, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to do this.

The only way that I can see to do this is to make each chapter a separate "title," then assemble the titles in the chapter list, and then burn the dvd (where I'll be able to enter the names of each title during the finalization process.

What am I missing? Is there an easier way to do this, where don't have to split up my original title and can maintain its chapter marks?

I don't think you are missing anything. Maybe this can be done with PC editing.

...I would like to enter a name for each chapter, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to do this.This implies you want to have both chapters and titles visible on the menu of the DVD you burned. I can't speak for sure for the 640, but the 633 and it's bretheren can't do this - only titles themselves show up on the menu. The "workaround" as you mentioned is to split everything into it's own title, which isn't that extreme considering that the default action is to play titles consecutively anyway.

If you're adamant about getting chapters to appear on the DVD menu then you have the option of downloading the DVD to a PC and then reauthoring it with one of the software packages that is available.

Thanks, Sean and ngohit. I kind of figured that the workaround was the was the way to get chapter titles in the menu, but wanted to make sure there wasn't some other way that I'd overlooked.

I am so inclined to spring for one of these Pioneers to replace my aging and cranky Toshiba RD-XS32, but have one reservation: Won't something like this Pioneer but with an ATSC receiver built in be available within a matter of months? (Anybody seen a product announcement?) For the Toshiba right now, I use a standalone HD set-top box in via S-video to get good content to record, but I was hoping to get a one-box solution rather than stay with a clunky two-box solution this time around.

Features sure sound good, though.

Doug

I am so inclined to spring for one of these Pioneers to replace my aging and cranky Toshiba RD-XS32, but have one reservation: Won't something like this Pioneer but with an ATSC receiver built in be available within a matter of months? (Anybody seen a product announcement?)
Here are some links to LG units that include ATSC tuners. Don't know anything about them but ran across them in looking for the same thing. Someone else might know more and can advize?

HD Receiver/DVR (LST-3410A), $419.99 at Circuit City. (http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/productDetail.do?oid=124025&com.broadvision.session.new=Yes&BV_SessionID=@@@@0843816871.1150054762@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccdkaddiddekikmcfngcfkmdffhdfgo.0)

LST-3510A HDTV Receiver/DVD Player, $176 at Price Grabber. (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=1742642/search=lg+3510a/ut=d84cefcc7aac44da)

OK...Just got my 640h-s.To clarify, I am tech savy but this is my 1st dvr and even after going through the users guide, I still have 2 questions:
1.Where the hell is the TVGOSD? Is VCR plus+ alll it has? (If this is true, I'm really gonna regret not getting the Panny 55h!)


The Pioneer 640 does not have TVGOS. Pioneer mucked up the implementation of TVGOS in their 2005 recorders to the point that they pulled all the remaining HDD DVD recorders off the market. For the 640, they decided to "downgrade" to VCR plus.

The Panasonic EH-55 does have the TVGOS, and Panasonic has down a very good job implementing it on their HDD DVD recorders. I use the TVGOS almost exclusively on my 2004 Panasonic E-500 and E-65 recorders. It is not perfect, but it has been very reliable. It makes selection of programs to record very easy, includes a description of the program, and even lets you know if the program is a repeat or not.

The TVGOS seems (at least in the Panasonic 2004 models) to work better using direct analog RF input to the recorder. Users with cable boxes report difficulty getting the TVGOS it work, and it was unavailable to satellite users. Judged by the reports here, the 2006 EH-55 and EH-75 (with a VCR) seems to work better with cable boxes and may even work with satellite receivers.

You can still return the 640 and get an EH-55...

You can still return the 640 and get an EH-55...

I took it out and set it up already and ONECALL would charge me a 15% restocking fee=$55+$30 shipping+$100 extra for the 55! Nah, I'm very happy with the 640h-s in every other regard!

1. bobkart is right. Be thankful you don't have it.

2. He's right on this, too--MN26 on the 640 and earlier Pioneer models.

I'd much rather have a Pioneer than a Panasonic due to the numerous, manual (MN) settings one can make. Actually, I did have a HD Panasonic over a year ago and returned it.

Thanks bobkark and ngohit. I'm still trying to figure it out (#2)
I'm very happy with the 640h-s and my buyers remorse lasted less than 24 hrs!
Its a great unit. :)

Hi,

First post here :)
Been reading the forum for awhile now and decided to get my first DVR a couple of weeks ago and chose the 640H-S.
I received it last wednesday and been playing around with it every since.

I confess one of the main reason I bought it was for the Divx playing capability.
Aside from recording, being pioneer and etc, of course.
The only concern I got so far is playing Divx files, and I hope I'm in the right place (forum wise) and someone can help.

Here it goes:
I have the 640 plugged in the composite-in of my TV and burn the Divx file to a CD-R. The unit recognizes the disc and the divx, so I hit play...
Here's the problem - the image is black and white and there're a bunch of lines moving horizontally through the screen.


Now I got a couple of question:
Maybe it's because it a DivX 6 encoded file? Or because the file is encoded at 25fps? or at a not-supported resolution?

Also, I burned a couple of Divx files to a DVD+RW and the 640 wouldn't even recognize it!?!?

So far I love it, great recorder, easy to use, great quality and etc.

Only feature I would really wish it had was the ability to transfer divx files from say a cd/dvd media or a flash drive or even hook it up with the usb port to a PC and have it show up as a removal drive (wow!)

Regards,
mb

rgazzara

No Thanks Pal......sticking with this beautiful 640 pioneer......haha

Good Luck with the panny

^5^5

Mike

The Pioneer 640 does not have TVGOS. Pioneer mucked up the implementation of TVGOS in their 2005 recorders to the point that their pulled all the remaining HDD DVD recorders off the market. For the 640, they decided to "downgrade" to VCR plus....

I have one of these lemons, the 531. Although I watch mostly satellite (DirecTV), I am able to get local channels off a roof antenna. That TVGOS is *totally* useless, though. It often is wrong. Also, the clock has never been able to get set automatically, even though I can receive 2 PBS stations off the air.

Since Pioneer pulled their stock of the 2005 models, I wonder if they would take my 531 and let me upgrade to a 2006 model.

I'm still under warranty.

ngohit

Wouldnt hurt to give that a try!!!
nothing to lose friend

smiles
Mike

Speaking of entering titles...

I've been playing around with a new 640 for about a day now. When I burn a "title" (with chapter stops inserted) from the hard drive to a DVD, I would like to enter a name for each chapter, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to do this.

The only way that I can see to do this is to make each chapter a separate "title," then assemble the titles in the chapter list, and then burn the dvd (where I'll be able to enter the names of each title during the finalization process.

What am I missing? Is there an easier way to do this, where don't have to split up my original title and can maintain its chapter marks?

I'm on the fence, looking at the features for the Pioneer 640, the Panasonic ES55 and the Toshiba RDXS-35. For me, one of the points of being able to create chapters is to be able to make a menu that lets you see and choose them. Sure, I often use PC DVD authoring software like TDA and especially Ulead DVD Workshop 2 to do this, but the only DVR that can do this is the Toshiba, as far as I can tell (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7798511&&#post7798511). Plus, I'd like a fairly good, functioning TVGOS, which I consider a useful feature, if it works right. I returned my Pioneer 633 because of their bad TVGOS, but instead of fixing it, they just dumped it. They also did away with DV-in on the 640. Hence, I'm really leaning toward the Toshiba RDXS-35 now, unless someone can point out some fatal flaws it may have I don't know about.

Mike: I'll dig up my receipt Wednesday then give Pioneer a call. Wednesday=rain (again) so I'll be working like a maniac scraping and painting on part of the house the next two days.

New Year's resolution for 2007: Put all warranty receipts in *one* box.

Lynn

Mike: I'll dig up my receipt Wednesday then give Pioneer a call. Wednesday=rain (again) so I'll be working like a maniac scraping and painting on part of the house the next two days.
You may have missed all the posts about Pio 53x/63x TVGOS, but you have at least two strikes against you in that area:

1. You are on OTA in a rural area and might have a weak PBS signal. You might need to have a signal amplifier/booster on the incoming coax.

2. You have TWO PBS channels which may interfere with each other since they both send the same TVGOS signal. You need to turn one OFF, esp. the "non-Host" one. (This is a Pio "thing" so don;t worry if a Panny owner or two says it doesn't make any difference.)

3. Maybe a "ball" since the umpire's view was obstructed, but you may not have your incoming coax plugged into the DVR 1st?

You may have missed all the posts about Pio 53x/63x TVGOS, but you have at least two strikes against you in that area:

1. You are on OTA in a rural area and might have a weak PBS signal. You might need to have a signal amplifier/booster on the incoming coax.

One comes in loud and clear. I do have a signal amplifier.

2. You have TWO PBS channels which may interfere with each other since they both send the same TVGOS signal. You need to turn one OFF, esp. the "non-Host" one. (This is a Pio "thing" so don;t worry if a Panny owner or two says it doesn't make any difference.)

How do I turn one off? I assumed merely selecting the station I want in the auto time setup section is enough. My 520 and 420 were able to pick up the time signal by merely selecting channel 2 (PBS out of Boston).

3. Maybe a "ball" since the umpire's view was obstructed, but you may not have your incoming coax plugged into the DVR 1st?

I do. I also unplugged the *$&@ thing and swapped it with the 520 in another room. Nope. Still have to manual set the time.

One comes in loud and clear. I do have a signal amplifier.

How do I turn one off? I assumed merely selecting the station I want in the auto time setup section is enough. My 520 and 420 were able to pick up the time signal by merely selecting channel 2 (PBS out of Boston).
Go to your TVG > SETUP > Change channel display menu. Scroll to the "WEAK" PBS channel and press the MENU button (top right around arrows).

In the white menu that opens on the left side, turn "channel" to OFF.

Wait 24-36 hours to see if this helps (some people report results within 24 hrs, others 36).

You will still be able to view the PBS channel you turned off...either by channel up/down or by direct # entry...and record from it, this just "divorces" that channel from the TVGOS system.

by any chance, did they add back that "auto start record" feature - where the unit powers up and starts recording, as soon as it sees a particular video input go "live" (like a DBS receiver powering up on a timer). that was a good older feature that they dropped off the 533/633.

by any chance, did they add back that "auto start record" feature - where the unit powers up and starts recording, as soon as it sees a particular video input go "live" (like a DBS receiver powering up on a timer). that was a good older feature that they dropped off the 533/633.


Yes Line 1

I forgot to mention the most annoying thing, to me, about this unit, in my previous post. I find that if one is more than 15 or 20 degrees off a 90 degree axis, to the right, my 640 doesn't receive remote commands! There is no such problem with being way off axis on the left. As luck would have it, my seating/equip. configuration has me trying to send commands from about 45 degrees to the right, which doesn't work. Has anyone else noticed this? I am thinking of playing around with a mirror to send commands. I guess my only other option would be a repeater.

Thank you, wabjxo. I screwed up so the guide is being completely downloaded again. In a few days I'll report back and let you know if this works.

The 531 is *so* much more cumbersome to navigate than the 420/520. Even setting a timer record seems to take more steps.

rgazzara

No Thanks Pal......sticking with this beautiful 640 pioneer......haha

Good Luck with the panny

^5^5

Mike

Not getting the EH-55...happy with my E-500 and E-65... :D

Hence, I'm really leaning toward the Toshiba RDXS-35 now, unless someone can point out some fatal flaws it may have I don't know about.

You may want to look at the threads that report that the Toshibas refuse to record to DVD-R claiming copyright protection when there really is none.

No DVD recorder is perfect...

Thank you, wabjxo. I screwed up so the guide is being completely downloaded again. In a few days I'll report back and let you know if this works.

The 531 is *so* much more cumbersome to navigate than the 420/520. Even setting a timer record seems to take more steps.
Timer Record is "cumbersome"???

1. Press TIMER REC button.

2. Set date, time, etc.

3. Press ENTER twice.

Is there a more cumbersome way???

You may want to look at the threads that report that the Toshibas refuse to record to DVD-R claiming copyright protection when there really is none.

No DVD recorder is perfect...
Isn't that just for a digital cable box (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7799356&&#post7799356)? I have analog cable.

Lynn
Thats a great N-Y's resolution....Im adopting it....haha
Enjoy the painting.....smiles

Mike

I fear I will forever be looking for another 410, 420, 510, or 520. The loss of the chapter mark button on the 633 largely impairs my use of the unit, and it sounds like the 640 doesn't have it either. But more troublesome to me is that the 633 does not play title to title. I leave my DVD to playback alot, and I have speakers throughout the rooms so I do not have to monitor the playback. On these older models, once Title 1 finishes playing, Title 2 starts. I am new to the 633, but after it finishes a title, it pauses for a bit, then defaults to the TV channel it was last on. Does the 640 do this? Do any 633 owners know how to change this? The manual says nothing (it adds the instruction that playback will stop after a title plays), and while there is a feature called 'seamless playback', this is not what it references.

wabjxo: Maybe there is something wrong with my machine because I have to push, "Menu," after the timer record button. Also, if I have thing set to record at LP via the record mode button, so hitting the record button will record in LP, the timer record menu on my machine seems to have SP as quality default. On the 420/520, what record mode I have currently set via the record mode button is what shows as the default quality in the timer menu.

The extra steps of 'Menu" then change to 'Quality' do make it slower to set a timer recording on the 531 than the 420/520.

Also, I am able to add a title for what is scheduled to record on the 420/520. There is no option in the timer menu for the 531.

Lynn
Thats a great N-Y's resolution....Im adopting it....haha
Enjoy the painting.....smiles

Mike

5:50 a.m. and I'm taking a break for another cup of coffee. Hair drier has been pointed at some damp, rotten area for just over an hour. Hopefully I shall be able to get the area real dry and fill it today.

Oh, yes, this is a lot of fun. Rain not until Wednesday is now rain tomorrow morning then, "Scattered Thunderstorms," Wed. and Thurs.

I better turn my computer off until it gets dark.


Lynn

Isn't that just for a digital cable box (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7799356&&#post7799356)? I have analog cable.

That I don't know. You would have to ask a Toshiba user. But one thing to keep in mind is that one day you may want to upgrade to digital cable with a cable box, and then the problems might start.

Just something to think about.

wabjxo: Maybe there is something wrong with my machine because I have to push, "Menu," after the timer record button. Also, if I have thing set to record at LP via the record mode button, so hitting the record button will record in LP, the timer record menu on my machine seems to have SP as quality default. On the 420/520, what record mode I have currently set via the record mode button is what shows as the default quality in the timer menu.

The extra steps of 'Menu" then change to 'Quality' do make it slower to set a timer recording on the 531 than the 420/520.

Also, I am able to add a title for what is scheduled to record on the 420/520. There is no option in the timer menu for the 531.
Pressing the Menu button is normal.

The DVR's default quality is SP, which is what you will record in unless you change that for a specific recording via TIMER REC or REC MODE button.

You can't add a title in the 531. It automatically sets program name from TVGOS (when working) or just date, time, etc. if not working.

5:50 a.m. and I'm taking a break for another cup of coffee. Hair drier has been pointed at some damp, rotten area for just over an hour. Hopefully I shall be able to get the area real dry and fill it today.

Oh, yes, this is a lot of fun. Rain not until Wednesday is now rain tomorrow morning then, "Scattered Thunderstorms," Wed. and Thurs.

I better turn my computer off until it gets dark.


Lynn
Ahhhhh, the old hair dryer to dry out the damp area trick......I like it!!!.....laffs

Looks like it gonna be sunny & in the 70's all week here......yeeehaaa....(Michigan)

Enjoy
Mike

I read this thread, and didn't see much (although some) mention regarding recording from satellite.

I have a DishNetwork DVR-522 and would like to record from its HDD to DVD. Now, the reason I don't just get a standalone DVD Recorder, and am considering the 640 is because I like keeping some items on the HDD for quick/easy viewing, and I would like to do have more capacity to do so, and the MP3 jukebox sounds very intriguing to me.

I would like to know if I will have any problem recording from the Dish HDD or from Dish directly to the Pioneer HDD then recording to DVD? (I understand this would be the best recording mode).

Sorry for the "newb" type question, but if you don't ask, you don't know.

I would like to know if I will have any problem recording from the Dish HDD or from Dish directly to the Pioneer HDD then recording to DVD? (I understand this would be the best recording mode).
I don't think the recorder type makes that much diff. Here's a thread on recording with DISH (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=685054)...it has only a few responses but they seem to provide good, specific info. and tips.

There are a few other threads that you can find with this forum's Search feature. Click "Advanced Search" then enter the Keyword DISH. Best to limit the Search to "Search Titlles Only" (under Keywords) and the "DVD Recorders" forum (bottom right "Search in Forums" menu).

I read this thread, and didn't see much (although some) mention regarding recording from satellite.

I have a DishNetwork DVR-522 and would like to record from its HDD to DVD. Now, the reason I don't just get a standalone DVD Recorder, and am considering the 640 is because I like keeping some items on the HDD for quick/easy viewing, and I would like to do have more capacity to do so, and the MP3 jukebox sounds very intriguing to me.

I would like to know if I will have any problem recording from the Dish HDD or from Dish directly to the Pioneer HDD then recording to DVD? (I understand this would be the best recording mode).

Sorry for the "newb" type question, but if you don't ask, you don't know.

If you are interested in recording directly from the satellite receiver to the HDD of a DVD recorder, you can use the TV Guide On Screen (TVGOS) in the Panasonic EH-55 to manage your recordings. Based on information from TVGOS, the TVGOS on the EH-55 works with the Dish DVR-522. For more information, follow this link. (http://www.vgi.com/support/echostar/)

The Pioneer web site is back up and has the DVR640HS manual available in PDF format under support topics. You must register to get I think.

According to the manual, the 640HS does not include an IR blaster like the X3X hdd series did. :rolleyes:

They probably didn't think it needed an IR Blaster, since they have the L1 inputs, that automatically start recording when they sense a signal. You just plug your STB into them, and program the STB. The 640 begins recording with the STB, no IR blaster needed. Of course for those of us with DVR STBs, who like to leave them on all the time, that doesn't work so well.

Not a problem for me, as the Pioneers DVD recorders repond to Pioneer VCR Record/Stop record commands and can thus be controlled by some cable systems internal EPG systems as a Pioneer VCR. Known as the VCR Commander function on TWC. Makes scheduling recordings easy and almost foolproof. Only issue is that I have to leave the DVD recorder on and preselect the desired recording quality (MN) mode..

By the way, I have tried these TWC VCR Commander functions with: Pany ES10, Sony GX300, Toshiba XS35 and the Pioneers are the only ones that responded to the provided VCR commands. :)

I have Comcast HD service, and a two tuner Motorola box, so that is not an option for me. I can program the STB to turn to the channel I want, and the 640 to rec from L3 input, but I have to trick the STB into changing the tuner it is outputting, not the other one. Or, I can just record to the STB DVR, and transfer it to the HDD on the 640 later. I haven't experimented to see how much loss that induces. I just wish I could get the Motorola to output an anamorphic (squished) signal... It seems that LB or FS cropped, are the only options.

Oh no... please say it ain't so. I was told that it has the EPG thing; no way am I dealing with that bullcrap... Can somebody confirm whether EPG is on this dvr? Cripes, I hope not....I hope I was given innacurate info by a friend.
Thanks!


chk the desc at vanns and it clearly says tvg is still on it
why is this so hard to confirm

Hello out there, yes or no on TVG on the 640 ?

OK...Just got my 640h-s.To clarify, I am tech savy but this is my 1st dvr and even after going through the users guide, I still have 2 questions:
1.Where the hell is the TVGOSD? Is VCR plus+ alll it has? (If this is true, I'm really gonna regret not getting the Panny 55h!)
2.If I'm recording from an external source(VHS) and it is 1h:30min long...how do I get it to record at the best quality so that it fits nicely/completely on a 2hr DVD-R?
THANKS!

i gotta laff at your post
the tvg is in hell where it belongs...wanna buy my 633 or we can trade

wabjxo & rgazzara - Thanks for your replies. It sounds like I can record on my Dish HDD, then dub to the Pioneer HDD & record to DVD without a problem. Otherwise, I would have to go with a Panasonic to get the TVGOS abillity to record to the DVR HDD directly.

I just discovered another quirk of the 640. Other owners, can you tell me if this happens with your machine, or is it perhaps the norm for DVD HDD recorders? (640 is my first)

When I make an entry to the program timer, whether it is for an HDD recording, or a to disc recording, I take the trouble to enter the title of the program. When I display the programming lineup, the titles are shown. However, when the recording is made, either to disc, or to HDD, and I check Disc Explorer to play back the recording, the title isn't on the list, only the date and channel of the recording. Of course, I can enter them again, and they will be there when I look for them next time. But, why aren't they there, when I have already entered them? Weird.

I just discovered another quirk of the 640. Other owners, can you tell me if this happens with your machine, or is it perhaps the norm for DVD HDD recorders? (640 is my first)

When I make an entry to the program timer, whether it is for an HDD recording, or a to disc recording, I take the trouble to enter the title of the program. When I display the programming lineup, the titles are shown. However, when the recording is made, either to disc, or to HDD, and I check Disc Explorer to play back the recording, the title isn't on the list, only the date and channel of the recording. Of course, I can enter them again, and they will be there when I look for them next time. But, why aren't they there, when I have already entered them? Weird.

I noticed that about mine as well. I figured that I would enter the Title in...during the timer setting, this way when I transferred it to DVD (if I originally recorded it to the HDD) it would already be there and I wouldn't have to do it again. But it's not.

Actually I don't think it's even for that, I think it's so that when you are searching through the area where you have Timer Recordings displayed, you have a better idea as to which setting is for what.

An example would be, that I record a pro-wrestling show Monday Night Raw every Monday night. I entered the text: "Monday Night Raw" in the timer setting so now, if I ever need to change anything (like if the show changes channels or something) I can easily find which Timer Recording it is to modify it.

But...to agree with what you said...after it has recorded, if I look for it in "Disc Navigator" it doesn't say: "Monday Night Raw" on the recording.

So again, maybe it's just for ease of finding what you have Timers set for if you set the title at that point.

Thanks, Suplex. Seems like a dumb design flaw to me, but at least I now know it is inherent in the unit, not just a problem with mine.

Another question for the more experienced Pio users, familiar with the "disc backup" function. I've been reading the 640 manual some more, and it says that disc backup only works with video mode +R and -R discs as the source. Is this true? I thought I could use this function to copy commercial discs, so long as they are single-layered, and don't have copy protection. Is that not the case?

I've used it for DVD-R, doesn't work for DVD-R DL, on the 633. No idea if it works for commercial DVD's (not copy protected of course). I should try it on the 633.

When I make an entry to the program timer, whether it is for an HDD recording, or a to disc recording, I take the trouble to enter the title of the program. When I display the programming lineup, the titles are shown. However, when the recording is made, either to disc, or to HDD, and I check Disc Explorer to play back the recording, the title isn't on the list, only the date and channel of the recording.
Try pressing the DISPLAY button on the remote (perhaps more than once).

I don't have a 640, but the 520 allows you to cycle through several different display modes in its Disc Navigator. They don't all include the title.

Thanks, Suplex. Seems like a dumb design flaw to me, but at least I now know it is inherent in the unit, not just a problem with mine.

Not merely a design flaw, but a step backwards for Pioneer.

With the 420/520, one has the option to add a title while setting a timer record. After the program is recorde d, the entered title is there. For the 531 the option to add a title while setting a timer record is gone. Now it's back with the 640, but in a very crippled way, not nearly as nice as with Pioneer's 2004 HDD models (420/520).

That makes two wonderful features on the 2004 models that are gone: 1. Chapter Mark button on the remote; and 2. Ability to give a scheduled recording a title that will still be there after it is recorded.

It makes me wonder if Pioneer has the same personnel in it's design team it did in the past _and_ if Pioneer does any kind of research on user satisfaction.

I'm a new owner of the DVR 640H-S.

I had a show on the hard drive that is 2H 15Min long. I recorded it in XP mode. I then wanted to transfer it to a DVD+R DL. I chose the "optimize" method. It is my understanding that this method will give the greatest resolution for a given DVD disk capacity.

After running about two hours the DVR 640H-S reported "disk full" leaving about fifteen minutes not transferred and a wasted dual layer DVD. Does anyone know why this failed?

I then put in another dual layer DVD, this time I chose "high-speed copy" and this worked (well sort of) I discovered by putting the disk in my Mac that only ONE layer had been written too. (My Mac correctly shows 7-8GB on other DL DVD's.) When I put the dual layer DVD in the DVR 640H-S it reported 8+GB available so apparently it recognized that it was a dual layer disk. But it only used one layer.

Also when doing a "high-speed copy" the machine displays nothing to show its progress. There is only a small arrow on the display. It does provide information during "finalize".

My preference would be to use the "optimize" if possible.

I usually prefer to use dual layer discs. As someone who remembers paying $14 for a blank VHS cassette there price doesn't seem so bad.

I am considering moving from SVHS to DVR. When I tape live ball games while watching TV, I pause through the commercials, which gives a fairly clean transition (I have gotten good at spotting/anticipating black frames), and means no post-processing. Can I do the same with the Pio 640, so I don't have to rewatch the whole thing again just to cut stuff I didn't want the first time through?

I am considering moving from SVHS to DVR. When I tape live ball games while watching TV, I pause through the commercials, which gives a fairly clean transition (I have gotten good at spotting/anticipating black frames), and means no post-processing. Can I do the same with the Pio 640, so I don't have to rewatch the whole thing again just to cut stuff I didn't want the first time through?
Yes, there is a pause button. But be sure to watch that the recording starts again in case the recorder doesn't see when you pressed the button to start again. Going back through a video to cut the commercials can be done pretty fast so you may come to like doing it that way rather than being on guard throughout the commercials for when the game comes back on.

Sean,

I am looking into purchasing my first DVR and the reviews on this unit appear pretty good. My first step will be to transfer a bunch of Hi8mm tapes from my camcorder to DVD. How should this be done with this unit? Transfer the data to the Hard Drive first?

I currently have the Pioneer 420 from Costco, I just hooked up antenna to it. scan and found all the local channels, but the picture quality looks bad, is this the same with 640?

Thanks.

I currently have the Pioneer 420 from Costco, I just hooked up antenna to it. scan and found all the local channels, but the picture quality looks bad, is this the same with 640?

Thanks.

I can't comment on the 640, but I am really surprised that your picture quality via the 420 is bad. I have a 420, too, and the picture quality is wonderful, identical to the 520s I later got.

When I first got it it was in a room with a connection to my roof antenna. The picture quality was even better than it had been either coax directly to the TV or via the VCR. Now it is in a room that also has a DirecTV receiver. Again, beautiful picture.

I currently have the Pioneer 420 from Costco, I just hooked up antenna to it. scan and found all the local channels, but the picture quality looks bad, is this the same with 640?

Thanks.How does the OTA signal look when viewed directly on the TV? You may need to rotate the antenna for optimum reception on one or more channels.

YMMV

The input from the wall is actually a combination of DISH + roof top TV, I have it diplexed, so one line goes to DISH and the other to 420, and from 420 ant out, it goes to JVC S-VHS, from JVC ant out it goes to my TV. On the TV I only scanned OTA digital channel. It looks very good. The SD not as good, but I attribute this to HP plasma's build in SD tuner.

When I view local channels via 420, they are viewed from the component input of the TV (component out from 420 into TV). I thought the picture for some reason is not as good as the SD from above.

I am looking into purchasing my first DVR and the reviews on this unit appear pretty good. My first step will be to transfer a bunch of Hi8mm tapes from my camcorder to DVD. How should this be done with this unit? Transfer the data to the Hard Drive first?My tendency would be to transfer to the hard drive first. That way if I get the start point wrong or miss turning off the recording at the right time I can easily edit the material before committing it to a DVD disc. And if you plan to do things like insert chapter marks or burn multiple titles to a DVD, then you'll pretty much want to use the HDD, I'd think.

Sean is "spot on," as they say in Vancouver.

I transferred about 100 VHS tapes to the HDD, combined them into appropriately grouped events (by Title: Xmas 2000, etc.), then high-speed copied them to DVDs (~8 min. each)....all at various times and at my leisure.

I didn't have any DVD "failures," but if I had, it would have been simple to do another 8-min. HS copy.

It was an easy, enjoyable experience!

Quick question for 640h-S owners about 16:9 flags:

I don't want this thread to get side tracked on the 16:9 debate (there are plenty of threads like that) but I wanted to know if people have been successful at recording 16:9 material using the Pioneer. I downloaded the manual and it states that it can record 16:9 to HDD, RAM and -R/RW (in VR mode). Have people tried this.

And more importantly, have you recorded to the HDD (VR mode) and then record that back to a VideoMode DVD (for better compatibility). This is the feature that I am looking for. The Panny EH55 won't do this (except to RAM which is worthless to me) I borrowed my friends Panny and was able to edit the IFO files, but I want a one stop shop.

Thanks in advance

I've been experimenting with the Pioneer DVR-640H-S for several days now, with many wasted DVD's.

I'm simply trying to divide a Home Movie into 6 parts. Have a menu with a thumbnail showing the start of each chapter with no date stamps. I am copying from the HDD to the DVD.

In my first attempt I used "divide chapter". I was never given an option to select any thumbnails. When I put the DVD in a Pioneer DVD player, and press "menu" I get 6 selections but only the first one works, and I cannot select my chapters. Apparently this is not the way to do it.

I have also tried dividing the movie into 6 titles. I have a little better luck with with this, I am able to select thumbnails but now each thumbnail has a time and date stamp that I am unable to get rid of. But why should ONE movie have 6 titles? I always thought that each selection in a DVD menu was a "chapter" and that the whole movie was a "title". I thought a title was divided into chapters, and a chapter was a selectable item in the menu.

I have done similar projects using iDVD in Mac OS X. With iDVD, in a few mouse clicks and I had a professional looking menu system with thumbnails. (And never looked at the iDVD manual.) I knew a DVD recorder would be harder, but Gee Whiz. There must be something I'm "not getting".

I would think that most people want to create a menu system.

Thanks for any advice.

Quick question for 640h-S owners about 16:9 flags:

I don't want this thread to get side tracked on the 16:9 debate (there are plenty of threads like that) but I wanted to know if people have been successful at recording 16:9 material using the Pioneer. I downloaded the manual and it states that it can record 16:9 to HDD, RAM and -R/RW (in VR mode). Have people tried this.

And more importantly, have you recorded to the HDD (VR mode) and then record that back to a VideoMode DVD (for better compatibility). This is the feature that I am looking for. The Panny EH55 won't do this (except to RAM which is worthless to me) I borrowed my friends Panny and was able to edit the IFO files, but I want a one stop shop.

Thanks in advance
I can't speak to the 640H, but my older 520H does everything you are asking about except RAM, so it would be reasonable to expect a newer version to do so. But, it cannot set the widescreen manually--it just preserves it if present on the input signal. So your source device would have to provide the widescreen flag for the Pioneer to capture and preserve it.

You are right to ask for real experience in this area, since there are no guarantees that all old features have been brought forward 2 generations to the 640H.

See here for more info on widescreen:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=687431

I'm simply trying to divide a Home Movie into 6 parts. Have a menu with a thumbnail showing the start of each chapter with no date stamps.What you're trying to do is not possible on the 633, and I strongly suspect it's not possible on the 640 either. The only items that will appear on the DVD menu will be titles, not chapters. If you want to have individual items on the DVD menu, you'll have to divide what you want to transfer up into individual titles to get it.

Some DVD recorders can put chapters into the DVD menu, but no DVD recorder is as flexible as the authoring programs for personal computers.

A suggestion - buy a DVD-RW to use for experimenting...

What you're trying to do is not possible on the 633, and I strongly suspect it's not possible on the 640 either. The only items that will appear on the DVD menu will be titles, not chapters. If you want to have individual items on the DVD menu, you'll have to divide what you want to transfer up into individual titles to get it.

That is OK, I can just use titles.

Do you know how can I get rid of the Time & Date stamp on each title? There is NEVER a Time & Date Stamp on a commercial DVD.

When you first create a title, it's name IS the Time & Date. I edit that out with a new name. But when the DVD is created it shows the name I gave it but it ALSO shows the Time and Date stamp above the title name. I do not want any Time & Date Stamp.

Thank You for helping

Recording to Dual Layer DVD ProblemsSky Cap

Please keep us advised of your dual layer experiences, many of us older Pioneer users are interested in this feature.

What brand of DVD+R DL did you try? Verbatium?

I assume your orginal hdd recording was in Video compatability mode.

It's hard to be an OLD Pioneer... ;)

Sky Cap

Please keep us advised of your dual layer experiences, many of us older Pioneer users are interested in this feature.

What brand of DVD+R DL did you try? Verbatium?

I assume your orginal hdd recording was in Video compatability mode.

It's hard to be an OLD Pioneer... ;)

Yes I used Video compatability mode.

I WAS using Verbatim DVD+R DL. (I doubt it is Verbatim,s fault) These work perfectly on my Mac. I have stopped using any DL disks because I can not get the DVR 640H-S to use both layers.

Also I have found no way get rid of the Time & Date stamp on each title.

When you first create a title, it's name IS the Time & Date. I edit that out with a new name. But when the DVD is created it shows the name I gave it but it ALSO shows the Time and Date stamp above the title name. I do not want any Time & Date Stamp.

When you first create a title, it's name IS the Time & Date. I edit that out with a new name. But when the DVD is created it shows the name I gave it but it ALSO shows the Time and Date stamp above the title name. I do not want any Time & Date Stamp.

I'm looking at a DVD-R 3-up(titles) menu from my Pioneer 531 and there is no time and date on it. Has only the shows title. Must be an "improvement on the 640H...sucks

You do have choice of menu layouts don't you.

Could you post a jpeg of said menu and or layouts if not to much trouble.. thanks :confused:

I've had the 640 for about a week and it seems like a good unit. It was easy to set up and the menu's are relative easy to follow. A couple of dissapointments are 1) I thought it would have a firewire input for digital cameras but has USB, 2) I thought the remote would also control my Toshiba tv but it only works the DVR, and 3) the biggest dissapointment is that it does not have optical output for the audio, you must use a digital coaxial cable! That is a hugh oversight on Pioneer's part.

A problem that I have found is if you start recording something with the "one touch" button and try to stop the recording it will tell you to press this same button for "more than one second" to stop recording, this does nothing. The only way to stop the unit is to unplug the power to it. I'm hoping that Pioneer does a firmware upgrade to correct this.

Other observations are that it seems relatively slow to load DVD's for playback. The best "thing" I've found with this unit is the quality of the audio is AWESOME even though it is running via digital coaxial instead of optical output. Hope this helps anyone considering this unit. It is my first DVR.

A problem that I have found is if you start recording something with the "one touch" button and try to stop the recording it will tell you to press this same button for "more than one second" to stop recording, this does nothing. The only way to stop the unit is to unplug the power to it. I'm hoping that Pioneer does a firmware upgrade to correct this.
This takes two steps. The first is to hold down the button for more than a second which cancels the timer function. The second is to press the stop recording button.

A problem that I have found is if you start recording something with the "one touch" button and try to stop the recording it will tell you to press this same button for "more than one second" to stop recording, this does nothing. The only way to stop the unit is to unplug the power to it. I'm hoping that Pioneer does a firmware upgrade to correct this.
They must have made a "drastic" change in the 640 with the "One-Touch" button. The 2005 models had a "One-Touch Copy" button that works for making copies from HDD > DVD or vice versa. It does nothing for "recording" such as from tuner to HDD or DVD. That is, it's only a "COPY" button, and it does stop copying when you hold the button down for 1 sec.

Are you saying that now the 640 has a One-Touch "RECORDING" button that starts an actual recording? If so, is there a separate One-Touch Copy button?

Cool, I'll give it a try tonight. It's a pain to unplug the unit. Thanks.

On the remote under the "slide" door it has a one touch recording button that I've used to copy a DVD to my hard drive. Manual says that even if you are watching the DVD it will start recording from the beginning and it does.

I think you could consider the fast copy button a one touch recording tool too. I'm not at home so I can't remember exactly what each button is labeled but I've used both and they work well. However I found that if you use the fast copy button to download to the HDD then if you can't add anything to this to then burn it to a DVD and you can only do one fast copy at a time to the HDD meaning you have to erase the first one before fast copying another one. Does any of this make sense?

On the remote under the "slide" door it has a one touch recording button that I've used to copy a DVD to my hard drive. Manual says that even if you are watching the DVD it will start recording from the beginning and it does.
That's the way it works on last year's model...something has to be playing on the HDD or a DVD and it will copy what's playing, from its beginning. That button "should" still work to stop the copy after a 1-sec or more hold-down?

If not, it might indicate a change (altho' the manual still says it works to stop the copy) or a "bug"?

Maybe some other 640 users can try to copy something using the One-Touch button and see if they can stop (Cancel) the copy with the same button?

There is a one touch record button. With one push it starts recording from what input you have selected, to the HDD, or a DVD, whichever mode you have it in. One push starts recording, but more pushes make it a timed recording, at 30min. per push.

There is a one touch copy button, which does a fast copy of whatever HDD recording you have highlighted, to a DVD. I don't know if it will do a highspeed copy from a DVD to the HDD, because I haven't tried that yet, but you can do a HS DVD-to-HDD copy, so I assume so.

Back to the DL disc question... I had intended to pose the question, "Has anyone recorded a highspeed copy, video mode, from HDD to a +R DL disc?," before I saw someone else already had brought up the subject. I just picked up some Maxell +R DL discs at Sam's, 30 for $60, and want to try it. The manual definitely says it is possible to record to a DL disc, high speed from the HDD. But, in one place, the specs in back, it indicates that +R discs can only be used in the VR mode. I find that hard to believe. I don't have the manual with me, but as I recall, it does say that in some circumstances, it will not recognize a DL disc as having the second layer. I think that applies to the "Optimize" function, as well as reading in HS. Well, I guess I'll just have to try it myself, as soon as there is something longer than two hours that I want to put on disc. If anyone else tries it, please let us know!

Also I have found no way get rid of the Time & Date stamp on each title.

When you first create a title, it's name IS the Time & Date. I edit that out with a new name. But when the DVD is created it shows the name I gave it but it ALSO shows the Time and Date stamp above the title name. I do not want any Time & Date Stamp.

I haven't had any problem getting rid of the time/date stamp. You have to bring up the title in the edit function, and then hold the "CLEAR" button down for a few seconds. This will erase the date stamp. If you just input a title, you will crowd the date stamp off the display, but it will still be there.

The strange thing I've found, is that it numbers all the DVDs I burn, above the title, in the DVD's menu, after it is finalized, it says "DVD (no.)". I think it is up to nine now. It seems to be keeping count of how many DVDs I burn!.

On your DL problem, have you yet tried making a high speed copy from the HDD of something recorded in SP video mode, to a disc, initialized in Video Mode, that is substantially longer than two hours? That should work, but I don't think you can do it from an XP speed HDD recording. And remember, +R discs have to be initialized, while -R discs don't.

The strange thing I've found, is that it numbers all the DVDs I burn, above the title, in the DVD's menu, after it is finalized, it says "DVD (no.)". I think it is up to nine now. It seems to be keeping count of how many DVDs I burn!.
In the earlier Pioneer's you can change the disc title from the default number to whatever you want in the Disc Setup Menu where you should find a Input Disc Name submenu.

Well, I am entering titles, in the "Disc Setup" menu, that are displayed in the finalized discs' menus, but the menus still list a number above it. If there is some way to access this line in editing, I haven't noticed it, but I'll look for it in the future.

Well, I am entering titles, in the "Disc Setup" menu, that are displayed in the finalized discs' menus, but the menus still list a number above it. If there is some way to access this line in editing, I haven't noticed it, but I'll look for it in the future.I have a Pioneer 633. When I select titles to burn to a DVD, I set the title as part of the process. The last screen I get before starting the burn has selections for "Recording Mode", "Input Disk Name", "Finalize" and "Start Copy". I always choose "Input Disk Name" to set the text at the top of the DVD menu, "Finalize" so that the disk is finalized when the burn is complete, and then "Start Copy".

"Finalize" so that the disk is finalized when the burn is complete, and then "Start Copy".

When you do that, does it allow you to go to the Menu screen setup so you can pick which menu color and pattern you want, and then Finalize automatically?

Yes. Much more convenient than having to then come back after the copy and press a bunch more buttons again. It's the only way I do it since I always fill up a disc when I copy to it.

When you do that, does it allow you to go to the Menu screen setup so you can pick which menu color and pattern you want, and then Finalize automatically?It's not very obvious, but if you select the "Finalize" option and then ask it to finalize the disk, then when you select "Start Copy" it will ask you to choose your menu style just before the copy actually starts.

One warning - don't do this if you are in the middle of recording or if you have a recording scheduled to start by the time the copy finishes. The recorder can't do the finalization at the same time that it's recording - if there's a conflict it will just skip the finalization and you'll have to do it manually later on.

This all applies to my 633, and I assume the 640 is similar.

Don't suppose the DVD-RAM can be in cart's can they? Or must they be nekkid?

I have a Pioneer 633. When I select titles to burn to a DVD, I set the title as part of the process. The last screen I get before starting the burn has selections for "Recording Mode", "Input Disk Name", "Finalize" and "Start Copy". I always choose "Input Disk Name" to set the text at the top of the DVD menu, "Finalize" so that the disk is finalized when the burn is complete, and then "Start Copy".

Yep, I found it, and edited out that pesky number. It seems that when I was editing in the HDD, I was entering the titlename, and when I copy to disc, I am entering the discname, which is where the number was. I haven't made a disc with more than one title yet, but when I do, a separate title for the disc will be nice.

I haven't had any problem getting rid of the time/date stamp. You have to bring up the title in the edit function, and then hold the "CLEAR" button down for a few seconds. This will erase the date stamp. If you just input a title, you will crowd the date stamp off the display, but it will still be there.

Something I discovered. When you get ready to copy HDD to DVD you are given a choice of menu styles. The one on the lower left shows 6 Menus, if you pick that one you will be FORCED to have the Time and Date Stamp. But if you pick the 6 Menu option in the lower center. No Time and Stamp.

Regarding dual layer discs. As someone who spent $16 for a blank VHS tape the $1.60 price of a dual layer disc is well worth it. I can definitely tell the improved quality of XP over SP.

After I make a DVD on the DVR640H-S and put it into a pioneer player the DVD does nothing until I press Menu or Play.

Does anyone know how to make the Disk automatically go to the Menu when inserted in a DVD player as commercial DVD's do.

iDVD (on a Mac) had a selection for this.

The same thing happens in my Philips, it does nothing until you tell it to. I don't know a cure. I think I will try one in my Sony 400 disc changer. That thing insists on loading whether you want it to, or not.

So, Sky Cap, are the DL discs working for you now? I thought you had a problem getting them to record on the second layer. And thanks for the info on the different menu screens I haven't tried them all yet.

Hey guys & gals
I bought the 640 a couple weeks back, and finally set it up this weekend. This is my 1st DVD recorder.....all ive really done so far is recorded to HD & used chase play for the US Open & the Heat Mavs game....as for noise, its quiet, i cant even here the fan unless i stick my ear down there....everything seems pretty easy & user friendly to me.....I have alot to learn but so far i have to say the machine is awesome.....as i use it more, i'll report.......

Diesel_73, it's my first DVDR as well. I like it much better than the best SVHS editing deck I ever had, that's for sure. I've read the manual over a few times now, but still need to consult it. It'll take a while to learn all the features well. One project I want to start, after I become quicker at editing, make a few program lists, etc, is to assemble all the Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies cartoons, up to 1948, in chronological order of their release. I have almost all of them on LD. Many are out on DVD, but in chaotic order, and with many I don't want.

After I make a DVD on the DVR640H-S and put it into a pioneer player the DVD does nothing until I press Menu or Play.

Does anyone know how to make the Disk automatically go to the Menu when inserted in a DVD player as commercial DVD's do.

Sky Cap:

So I see I'm not alone with this issue. I have a Toshiba D-R1 recorder (no HDD) where when you finalize a DVD you can set it so it starts with the menu, with the title, goes to the next title (if there were more than one) after it plays the first, or goes to the menu between titles. So you put your DVD in and it either starts playing, or gives you the menu screen, depending on how you set it.

With my Pioneer 640, using my Samsung DVD-M301 Player, I put a finalized DVD in, it shows me the word "Loading" on the TV, then it stops (I see "Stop" on the display of the player) and that's it. Just like you I have to either press "Menu" or "Play" and then it works.

I know it's not the end of the world...and at least they DO work...but I would like to find a fix where it starts with the Menu.

suplex

That's the way it works on last year's model...something has to be playing on the HDD or a DVD and it will copy what's playing, from its beginning. That button "should" still work to stop the copy after a 1-sec or more hold-down?

If not, it might indicate a change (altho' the manual still says it works to stop the copy) or a "bug"?

Maybe some other 640 users can try to copy something using the One-Touch button and see if they can stop (Cancel) the copy with the same button?

I've tried it everyway I can to stop the recording both with the remote and at the unit itself including pressing the stop or cancel button after holding down for the 1+ seconds, but it doesn't work. Guess it's a bug either in my unit or overall.

I really got into using the 640 this weekend, taking two DVD's that I download to the HDD then burned first to a -RW, finalized it and took it to a Zenith unit and it played fine. I then went back and edited out some unwanted sections on both of the recordings then burned to a -R and had it finalize immediately after the burn and it also did great and has played fine on every unit/computer I've tested it with. When you select the Menu selection right before you start burning it then automatically broke the initial 2 input DVD's into 2 chapters and selecting menu on any other player/computer lets you pick the chapter - AWESOME!

I also time recorded the Michigan race to the HDD then did a fast copy to a -RW and finalized it and it played fine on the Zenith in my bedroom. The only dissapointment was that FF did not work. I don't know if this is because of the fast copy burn or just a compatibility issue between pioneer and zenith. Any ideas out there?

Have any of you new 640 owners experienced any Copy Once issues?

Where you recorded a program to the HDD and then couldn't move it to a DVD-R.

Thanks :)

Does this unit have Firewire imput? I would like to transfer the 8m tapes into the DVR HD. If no firewire, then what is the best way to do this?

If no firewire, then what is the best way to do this?Via S-Video and stereo audio. The same way you would watch the tape(s) on your TV, assuming it has S-Video input(s).

I just received my 640 but didn't play with it yet.

I read the manual before turning it on ! I must be sick but....


One concern:

I didn't see any IR blaster to change the channel of my Echostar 4700 (BEV) to the channel I want to record......

So I will have to program the 640 to start recording with the "Auto Record Function" and program the timer on the 4700 ?


Is there another way ?

So I will have to program the 640 to start recording with the "Auto Record Function" and program the timer on the 4700 ?You could use the "Auto Record" function, although that will record any time you turn on your cable box. You could also set up a timer entry on the 640 to record from the line input at a given time. This is what I've been doing on my 633 (enter two programs: one on the 633 and another on my Cable Box) and it works just fine. More reliable than an IR blaster too, I would think.

Diesel_73, it's my first DVDR as well. I like it much better than the best SVHS editing deck I ever had, that's for sure. I've read the manual over a few times now, but still need to consult it. It'll take a while to learn all the features well. One project I want to start, after I become quicker at editing, make a few program lists, etc, is to assemble all the Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies cartoons, up to 1948, in chronological order of their release. I have almost all of them on LD. Many are out on DVD, but in chaotic order, and with many I don't want.
Hey that sounds like a good project.......It sure is a nice machine eh!......I still have alot to learn myself......BTW, im in St Clair MI......Nice to meet ya neighbor

I've tried it everyway I can to stop the recording both with the remote and at the unit itself including pressing the stop or cancel button after holding down for the 1+ seconds, but it doesn't work. Guess it's a bug either in my unit or overall.

I really got into using the 640 this weekend, taking two DVD's that I download to the HDD then burned first to a -RW, finalized it and took it to a Zenith unit and it played fine. I then went back and edited out some unwanted sections on both of the recordings then burned to a -R and had it finalize immediately after the burn and it also did great and has played fine on every unit/computer I've tested it with. When you select the Menu selection right before you start burning it then automatically broke the initial 2 input DVD's into 2 chapters and selecting menu on any other player/computer lets you pick the chapter - AWESOME!

I also time recorded the Michigan race to the HDD then did a fast copy to a -RW and finalized it and it played fine on the Zenith in my bedroom. The only dissapointment was that FF did not work. I don't know if this is because of the fast copy burn or just a compatibility issue between pioneer and zenith. Any ideas out there?


I think I read in the manual that you have to stop the fast copy function within two minutes of starting it, to be able to stop it.

As to no FF, I check all the discs I burn by FFing through them, and haven't had any trouble. I use -R discs. I've done one direct to disc burn, and a dozen or so fast copy from the HDD to disc. So, unless it's the fact that you are using -RW discs, instead of -R, I don't know what your problem is. I've had no problems on my Sony or my Philips decks. I checked my first few burns on them.

You could use the "Auto Record" function, although that will record any time you turn on your cable box. You could also set up a timer entry on the 640 to record from the line input at a given time. This is what I've been doing on my 633 (enter two programs: one on the 633 and another on my Cable Box) and it works just fine. More reliable than an IR blaster too, I would think.

If you have a two tuner cable box, like I do, you will have to trick the tuner/timer into outputing the right program. You just set any program at all, to start three (to be safe) or more minutes before the program you want to record on your DVDR. That way, the first program, that you don't want, will go on the tuner that isn't displayed. The program you DO want will be on the tuner that is displayed, and goes out to your A/V receiver and/or DVDR.

I also heared something about using the Pioneer VCR code (573 ?) on the 4700 receiver to make the IR blaster start the HDD recording.

Anybody really tested this method ?

Another DVR rookie here, so I might be asking a stupid question but here goes... How do I watch a different channel while there is a timed recording in progress. I try to change the DVR channel, but it won't let me. Is this possible? if so how?

On another note, having played with the 640 for a week, I have found it to be easy to operate with relatively user friendly menus. Disappointed with the lack of optical audio out, but audio is still good so its not a real problem. Timer recording is easy. No loss felt for the TVGO. The timer title not staying to the actual recording is a pain (as noted by others). I guess this could be fixed in a firmware update (hopefully). As others noted the 640 is quiet. So far so good. I will try to play some more and post.

Another DVR rookie here, so I might be asking a stupid question but here goes... How do I watch a different channel while there is a timed recording in progress. I try to change the DVR channel, but it won't let me. Is this possible? if so how?The DVR only has one tuner, so if you've got it tuned to a channel for recording you can't also tune the DVR to a second channel. Use the tuner in your TV if you want to watch a second channel. To do this, connect the RF Out from the DVR to the RF In of your TV, and set the TV's input to RF. Then you can change channels to watch anything you want regardless of what the DVR is doing.

This is all assuming that you're getting your signal from analogue cable or an Antenna. For digital cable or satellite, you'd generally need a second set-top box to deal with 2 channels at once.

I've also tried it within a minute and it still won't stop. Guess once I learn the machine (my 1st DVR) then it won't be such a big deal.

I think I'll try burning the same recording to a -R vs the -RW I used and see if that helps. As I'm new to all of this could it be because I don't have any chapters indicated? Not sure if that even makes sense. Thanks for the help.

Hello everyone.

I just bought the 640 and it is excellent. I have a quick question that I could not seem to find an answer to here or from the manual. It is about the USB port and the devices ability to play DivX files.

I have some TV shows on my PC in AVI/DivX format so I burned some to a DVD. The 640 could not read the disc. So I read the manul and it seems to say that you can only burn them to CD, not DVD so I did that and sure enough, it worked great.

Since you cannot fit much on a CD, I got the idea in my head that I might be able to save a bunch of the files to a compact flash card, hook up a USB reader to the 640, and then transfer the files from the CF card to the 640's HDD. Is that possible? In the manual, it only mentions MP3s and JPGs as transferable via USB.

Thanks for your time!

I think I read in the manual that you have to stop the fast copy function within two minutes of starting it, to be able to stop it.

As to no FF, I check all the discs I burn by FFing through them, and haven't had any trouble. I use -R discs. I've done one direct to disc burn, and a dozen or so fast copy from the HDD to disc. So, unless it's the fact that you are using -RW discs, instead of -R, I don't know what your problem is. I've had no problems on my Sony or my Philips decks. I checked my first few burns on them.

I've tried stopping both after about 30 seconds and after 5 minutes and neither makes a difference. This is my first DVR but I think it may just be a bug that hopefully a firmware update will fix.

As far as ff the -RW, I'll try burning to a -R and see if that makes a difference. Thanks.

Are the DL discs working for you now? I thought you had a problem getting them to record on the second layer. And thanks for the info on the different menu screens I haven't tried them all yet.


Regarding dual layer discs. As someone who spent $16 for a blank VHS tape the $1.60 price of a dual layer disc is well worth it. I can definitely tell the improved quality of XP over SP.

As long as I use "high-speed copy" everything seems to work OK. In fact the DVR640H-S appears to automatically "fine tune" the data density for maximum DVD quality when using "high-speed".

This feature is not well documented in the manual, the use of the product lead me to believe that "optimize" would give the best quality however I discovered that "optimize" does not burn to the second layer. In fact after using the DVR640H-S for several days I do not understand why it has ANY HDD to DVD copy method other than"high-speed".

Ok, one question before i order this baby. On page 127 under timer recordings, (i will be using Directv for my timer recordings), its states that the IR Blaster is only sending REC on REC off commands. I assume that everytime i need to record something, i would need to leave the Pioneer turned on ? In my case, the wife will be soaps, for me it would be the evening sport events. The line-in on L-1 would work, but sounds like it would record even standard timer events from Directv (i.e. everyday it automatically turns to channel 8, doesn;t record, just switches channels so i don't have to run downstairs each time to find remote.

Since you cannot fit much on a CD, I got the idea in my head that I might be able to save a bunch of the files to a compact flash card, hook up a USB reader to the 640, and then transfer the files from the CF card to the 640's HDD. Is that possible? In the manual, it only mentions MP3s and JPGs as transferable via USB. Thanks for your time!

Hey Claytonian:

Instead of the method you mentioned...which might still be worth it to try...why don't you do this.

Get all of the AVI files that you want, a little at a time on a CD (whatever fits). Then put your CD's in the 640...copy them to the HDD, and when you have as much as you want copied on to the HDD, then copy that to a DVD.

You might even want to try it with CD-RW's, this way you can erase them when you are done and you don't have to "waste" CD's doing this.

Even though it says in the menus that there is a way to copy DVD to HDD, I am pretty sure you can do CD to HDD also, so do that and when you have all you want, send it back to a DVD.

suplex.

You can copy AVI files from CD to HDD on the 640?

no

Didn't think so.

I also heared something about using the Pioneer VCR code (573 ?) on the 4700 receiver to make the IR blaster start the HDD recording.

Anybody really tested this method ?


Well, I did the test myself !!!

I can confirm that the Pioneer VCR codes 573 and 575 do work with the Echostar 4700.

I can now start and stop a recording with the DVR640 using the Echostar timers in the menu !

However, the DVR640 has to be already on for this to work. I tried every Pioneer code listed in the manual and no one actually turn on the DVR640.

I guess all the echostar receivers using the pioneer VCR codes 573 and 575 should work.

Hi Guys!

Maybe i'm a little bit out of topic.

But just to tell you that Pioneer Canada (Costumer Support Departement) made an arrangement with me, to exchanged my faulty Pioneer DVR-633H-S (EPG , TV Guide if you prefer, not fonctioning correctly) They will send me a brand new 2006 Model, the DVR-640
Without any charge.

I was having lots of problems with the TV Guide ( never work here in Montreal SouthShore )

I call them maybe 5 times to resolve my problems since a got this device, And now they finally admit that they were having problems with the TV Guide feature on there 2005 Models.

I'm so happy that all my problems will gone with the new one..

So all of you users of DVR-633 or DVR-533 are having troubles with it.
Give a try, Call them, you got nothing to lose, just complaint to them if its not working.

If you are lucky enough they will send you the new one like me....

Good luck everyone

Norm

Thanks for the info, Norm, and welcome to the forum!

I have a 533 and 633, and I bought them knowing full well that there were issues with the TV Guide. Here in Vancouver on Shaw Cable it works pretty much as other people have found - starts out fine and then after a few weeks starts to screw up intermittently until it eventually gives up entirely. If you do the "TVGOS Reset" then it's the same story all over again.

I think it says a lot of Pioneer that they're willing to exchange these machines (if you complain long enough and loud enough, I'm guessing). But I'm very pleased with all the other aspects of the two I have and so I'm going to hang on to mine.

I am so inclined to spring for one of these Pioneers to replace my aging and cranky Toshiba RD-XS32, but have one reservation: Won't something like this Pioneer but with an ATSC receiver built in be available within a matter of months? (Anybody seen a product announcement?) For the Toshiba right now, I use a standalone HD set-top box in via S-video to get good content to record, but I was hoping to get a one-box solution rather than stay with a clunky two-box solution this time around.

Features sure sound good, though.

Doug
Hi, new to the site, just reading up on the 640H-S since my Toshiba RD-XS32 stopped recording DVD. Was purchased 9-2004, but ran it almost 24-7 no wonder the bearings wore out (assumed). On the basis of the reviews, decided to order the 640, should be here next week.
Doug, did you get the 640, and if so what are the editing differences in it and the Toshiba? I liked the options for editing in the X32, but HATED the clunky operations to get to the editing.
Anybody, can you add titles, ect with 640 by keyboard?

Hello everyone.

I just bought the 640 and it is excellent.

Did you end up getting it from PC Connection (hope not) or an authorized Pioneer internet reseller? Pioneer won't honor its warranty unless you got it from the latter. I tried to warn you in your other thread...but never got a reply.

You also have to becareful about what you buy from an authorized Pioneer Dealer. they could only be authorized for lets say Plasma Screens only and not DVD Recorders.

The DVR only has one tuner, so if you've got it tuned to a channel for recording you can't also tune the DVR to a second channel. Use the tuner in your TV if you want to watch a second channel. To do this, connect the RF Out from the DVR to the RF In of your TV, and set the TV's input to RF. Then you can change channels to watch anything you want regardless of what the DVR is doing.

This is all assuming that you're getting your signal from analogue cable or an Antenna. For digital cable or satellite, you'd generally need a second set-top box to deal with 2 channels at once.

Thanks Sean! (yes using analogue cable for now :o )

Greetings........Just an update on my new Pioneer 640.......Ive been converting VHS & recording a few programs off of Directtv......Everything has run smooooooooothly, and i expect it to continue for many yrs to come.....dividing-cropping-burning ect....ALL a breeze with this machine & very user friendly.....all the commands are fast.....Just a great machine.....smiles

Mike

Greetings........Just an update on my new Pioneer 640.......Ive been converting VHS & recording a few programs off of Directtv......Everything has run smooooooooothly, and i expect it to continue for many yrs to come.....dividing-cropping-burning ect....ALL a breeze with this machine & very user friendly.....all the commands are fast.....Just a great machine.....smiles
Mike

I've had mine for 3 days and have put it through the paces and I'm very pleased with it. I still have additional tests, but so far it's looking like a winner. My only complaint: Pioneer still hasn't dealt with the TBC problems that plagued previous models.

Pioneer still hasn't dealt with the TBC problems that plagued previous models.

JeffWld:

Does the Pioneer 640 even have a Time Base Corrector? I was trying to look up information about that and couldn't find any. I know my Toshiba D-R1/D-R2 have them, and anything ever transferred from VHS to DVD came out really nice.

I have one thing I transferred from VHS to HDD to DVD on the Pioneer 640, and it did come out very good, but the VHS tape still played well also.

What was the TBC problem you were referring to?

suplex

bpHouston, no, you cannot enter titles with a keyboard, unfortunately, even though there is a USB port (for photos.)

I've been playing with mine for a while now, and have discovered a few more quirks, which I thought I would pass on to folks.

On one recording to HDD, from the cable coax input, for about 3-4 seconds, I got a black screen with the message: "Poor Quality Signal." The picture immediately before, and after, this black screen looked fine. Perhaps the DVDR blacked out a dropout of some kind. Comcast has lots of them, but generally on the digital band, and this was from TCM, not digital. Hope this doesn't happen often. I didn't discover this black screen until I had burnt it to disc. I do a 3ff scan, before I record to DVD, but something short can be missed. I barely caught a Tornado alert on another HDD recording.

I made a highspeed copy, from HDD to a +R DL disc, in Video Mode, of a 155m program. It worked fine. I used the "Copy" function in the menu. The recording was a single title, no chapters. I am puzzled, because the disc showed only 1hr, 25m remaining time, which would mean that the disc would hold only 3 hours, 50 minutes, even though it had a minimum amount of space used in formatting. It will fast forward at all four speeds, just fine.

In editing, I broke a two hour program in the HDD into 13 titles, not chapters, so I could title them, and have thumbnails in the menu. After I separated them into titles, then I made a "copy list," before I titled them and picked thumbnails. It's a lot easier that way, because the editing function treats it as one program, and doesn't send you back to zero in the menu everytime. After doing that, I entered a disc title, and selected "finalize," so the disc would automatically finalize, after copying. I then clicked "copy," and it brought up the screen to select a menu page. I pick the blue one with six windows for thumbnails. More thumbnails go on succeeding pages. The last menu page choice, with ten titles, doesn't display thumbnails. I made several subsequent copies using this copy list, but you have to retitle the disc, and select a menu page, every time you make a new copy. Much of this isn't made clear, or discussed at all, in the manual. It is clear that if you make a new copy list, the old one is erased. I do wish you could save several copy lists. When playing this disc, with multiple titles, it will play through to the next title, without stopping. But, when you are fast fowarding through the disc, it will return to normal speed, at the beginning of each new title.

Has anyone familiarized themselves with the picture adjustments yet? I see you can adjust upstream from copying, I.E. the inputs, and you can also adjust the picture after the copy, I.E., the output to the TV. I recorded some test signals, and checked them, the way I would using an AVIA disc, on my HD DLP Samsung. The picture looked remarkably close to how it should, with only a slight adjustment to the black level needed. I guess the best thing to do would be to play the AVIA on the 640, and adjust the output picture adjustments. Then, record some test signals from the AVIA to the HDD, and adjust the input picture adjustments to correct anything in the recording. Then, rec from the HDD to DVD, play back the DVD recording of the test signals, and see what they look like. BUt, the 640 allows for adjustment of some things that are not owner-adjustable on a TV, that AVIA doesn't discuss. Guess I should go to the calibration forum, and learn what I can about them there. ;)

Thanks for the info.
I have this sneaky feeling that I am going to miss some of the editing features of the Toshiba Xs32, even though they were a bit clumbersome to do. As a result of reading the posts here I will try the LG 4163B fix. Does anyone know if you could edit disks burned in the 640 with the Toshiba, or visa versa? Maybe copy to hard drive and re-edit?

On the 640 you should be able to copy to the HDD at highspeed, and edit in the HDD, then make a HS copy to a new disc --- IF your Toshiba-produced discs have been finalized. Otherwise, you're out of luck, at least according to the manual. But, you could always try it, if they haven't been finalized.

Check this link for Pioneer Http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/press/release/detail/0,,2076_4313_291832573,00.html

Pioneer must have had a change of heart because the release says that the new 640H will have the tv guide :eek: Somebody got smart. After all the problems with the 533 and 633 I can't believe they even considered it.

Is the high speed dub only from HDD to DVD . Will it HS dub a playlist or only the original file on the HDD. I'm tryin out an Emerson EWR100H DVR/VCR recorder with 80 gig hard drive. If you want to HS dub you have to make changes to the original file. If you make your changes to the playlist then you can only copy in a 1:1 mode. Don't understand why you can't copy anything from HDD to DVD-RW (VR mode) in high speed mode. I thinking about returning this Emerson and ordering the Pioneer. Its only $15.00 more from Amazon.com. No tax and free shipping ($369.00) Should I make the switch. I don't need the VCR in the Emerson and for the $15 diference, I would double my hard drive size.

I downloaded the 640H manual from Pioneer. One thing that was really cool was if you set up to record a movie on DVD and forget to put in a disk it will automatically record it to the hard drive as long as room exists.. Wonder if the same goes for a disk that doesn't have enough room to record to.

Well, that article is going on 6 months old, the 633/533's were pulled from the shelves because of the EPG problems since that article was posted. Several members here that actually have a 640 have stated in no uncertain terms that there is NO EPG system on the 640.

EDIT: Ah I see what you are saying now, they had a change of heart since that article was written and dropped the EPG. Yes, agreed.

How about some more input from you guys that already own a 640H. Likes & dislikes. The edit system looks cumbersome. Any comments there

Is the high speed dub only from HDD to DVD . Will it HS dub a playlist or only the original file on the HDD.
You can high speed dub from VR-mode DVDs recorded by the Pioneer back to the HDD. Playlists are supported for high-speed copying.

Do any of you new 640 owners have a Pioneer 53x or 63x model for comparisom?

Any apparent differences in editing and/or picture quality?

I've read the 640 manual and the editing appears to be the same but a direct comparisom would be comforting...

I'm happy with the 531H, but will need a replacement/backup.

Do any of you new 640 owners have a Pioneer 53x or 63x model for comparisom?

Any apparent differences in editing and/or picture quality?

I've read the 640 manual and the editing appears to be the same but a direct comparisom would be comforting...

I'm happy with the 531H, but will need a replacement/backup.

I'm comparing my 640 to the 530, and other than some minor interface changes, the editing is the same. The only thing that stands out to me as an issue is that the layout of the 640 remote (which is cheaper) is not laid out as user friendly for quick-on-trigger editors. I'm working around that by simply using my 530 remote and the 640 when editing. By doing this, I regain the rocker frame shuttle option which was removed from the 640 remote.

JeffWld:

Does the Pioneer 640 even have a Time Base Corrector?
What was the TBC problem you were referring to?
suplex

The 640 does have a TBC. In general terms, previous Pioneer models suffered from signal blackout when dubbing from tape sources that had certain types of sync disturbances. In addition, the Pioneer units suffered from jitter if the tape source had certain characteristics with strong white balance levels or playback tracking errors.

It's too bad about the changes to the remote. I really like my 533/633 remotes and find them very easy to use by feel while editing. The buttons are well laid out and I think the remote contributes quite a bit to the ease of the user interface.

I checked the Panasonic and Toshiba remotes when I was making my purchasing decision and thought the button layout was inferior - this was a factor of some importance to me in choosing the Pioneer.

I'm comparing my 640 to the 530, and other than some minor interface changes, the editing is the same.
Thanks for the input.

I did notice in the manual that the 640 remote had "hidden" buttons which I have hated on past products of various manufactors..

Guess I'll also use my 531 remote for trhe 640. :rolleyes:

Dominator2, if you will back up to 6/24, 8:09pm, EDT, you will find a long post of mine, with much of what I have learned about making highspeed copies from a "copy list", HDD>disc. I have posted likes and dislikes in most of my posts, as have others.

Also, to make a high speed copy, and there are three ways to do it, you must have recorded the program at the same speed you want it to be, i.e., you can do a hs dub of an SP HDD recording to a disc, in SP, but can't do an XP HDD recording to a disc in SP at high speed. When you change speeds, you must do a real-time dub.

Well I ordered the 640H-S from Amazon.com for $369.00 delivered. The fact that it has 2x the HD space of Emerson and reads and writes almost every type of disk made is a deal maker for me. I tried to call Funai tech support today about my EWH100F and the recording said that there was one ahead of me and then 2 min later it dumps me into a call back line. 7 hrs later I still haven't heard from them. They had a very good commercial editing setup on their Emerson DVD recorder and I figured that they would have kept that, but no they went backwards. When you cut a scene it left you at the place where you cut it, but now it defaults back to the beginning everytime you delete a section. Also you can add or delete chapter marks on the DVD recorder(EWR10D5) but they left the delete out of this (EWH100F) recorder. It seems like the engineers point of view is we can't please everybody so we won't please anybody. :mad:

Has anyone checked to see if the 640H has a battery backup to hold settings in case of a power outage. Their DVD recorders did although there was never anything in the manual about it. Guess I will find out soon enough! :)

Has anyone checked to see if the 640H has a battery backup to hold settings in case of a power outage. Their DVD recorders did although there was never anything in the manual about it. Guess I will find out soon enough! :)My 633 and 533 have gone through a power outage of a few hours with no loss of schedules or settings. My guess is that the 640 will be the same.

Bottom pf page123 in manual: "After unplugging, or a power failure, battery keeps all settings for a period of several minutes." My power has been out for just a few minutes, twice, and the set was immediately up again.

I wonder if one of the more experienced 640/540 users could post a step by step outline how to edit out commercials from a program recorded to the HDD.


I currently use the Toshiba 32, go into edit menu, set chapter points, create a playlist with segments that I want, (typically every second chapter) then high speed dub. It's very quick.

However, I am interested in the pio 540-h but I would like to compare the edit features. How easy (difficult) is it to edit out stuff.

Thanks in advance !

grocky

I use the 633, which I assume is very similar to the 640. This is how I edit out commercials: Use "Disc Navigator" to find the title I want to edit and select "Edit" and then "Erase Section" Use the skip and high-speed playback options to locate the start and end of commercials and erase each section.
That's it! It removes the commercials from the copy on the HDD and of course it leaves chapter breaks where each commercial was. All of that is preserved if you do a high-speed copy to a DVD

It takes me about 5-7 minutes to trim 5 commercial breaks and the excess parts at the beginning and end of an hour-long show. I scan forward using "Scan 4" speed and watch for the station's "bug" logo to disappear during the commecial break, then do a "2 min" backward "commercial skip" followed by a forward "Scan 2" to find the start of commercial. From there a backward "commercial skip" of 5 seconds lands you about 1-2 seconds before the start of the commercial. It sounds complex, but works pretty well for me and takes perhaps 20-30 seconds to locate the start of a commercial this way.

After marking the start of the commercial segment to be cut, I usually skip ahead 3 minutes and then "Scan 2" forward or backward to find the end of the break. For shows I record frequently, I've noticed that the length of the commercial breaks has a fairly consistent pattern. For instance, I've been recording a daily show from RAZER and the commercial breaks are always about 2, 4, 5, 2, and 3 minutes long. This means I can use the "commercial skip" button to land very near the end of the commercial break instead of having to search for it.

Thanks Sean... So no playlist ? The reason I ask is because the Tosh manual warns against not creating a playlist, since "erasing segments results in HDD fragmentation".

Is this an issue with the Pio ?