I'm waiting for HD-DVD of Digital Essentials before doing my projector tweaking. Only thing i've changed is gamma mode to cinema and set of overscan to 100% instead of the default 97%.

and how does the picture look to your eyes? have you owned any previous projectors? how does the Mitsu compare to those?



I'm waiting for HD-DVD of Digital Essentials before doing my projector tweaking. Only thing i've changed is gamma mode to cinema and set of overscan to 100% instead of the default 97%.

The Panasonic, well I have a rear pro CRT from them I love but I won't buy another one of their products unless it was the be all end all and they actually supported it.

You are telling me now ! I got my AE900 from AVS a year back ;)

What would you guys think about 2500:1 native contrast and 9000:1 in Iris1 mode... both @D65 of course?

This is no joke...

Regards,
Ekkehart, Cine4Home

:)


Cine4Home,

Is there something new about this issue?

What would you guys think about 2500:1 native contrast and 9000:1 in Iris1 mode... both @D65 of course?

This is no joke...

Regards,
Ekkehart, Cine4Home

:)

Please, please do tell sir?

Thanks

What would you guys think about 2500:1 native contrast and 9000:1 in Iris1 mode... both @D65 of course?

This is no joke...

Regards,
Ekkehart, Cine4Home

:)
And at what lumen output? Sounds promising regardless!
-Matt

Have some patience please, we are working on details right now ;-)

Hopefully we will have an official announcement by the end of next week.


Regards,
Ekkehart ;-)

Have some patience please, we are working on details right now ;-)

Hopefully we will have an official announcement by the end of next week.


Regards,
Ekkehart ;-)



Thanks Cine4Home,

We'll be waiting for your news.

can more users please post their settings for this unit. thanks.

An update for DI settings: in auto2 mode the iris starts closing at higher IRE levels and closes more than in auto1 setting. I reacts faster when brightness increases again, too. Wich explains why the DI is so much more visible in auto2 than in auto1.

I largely prefer auto1, provided the black level at the source is correctly set, and minimum black consequently not too high on the Mits side. The absolute low blacks are a bit higher than on auto2, but nothing noticable in normal (living room) viewing conditions. (Even though I understand that someone with a dedicated home theater and black walls will probably prefer a dlp or d-ila solution over a DI solution anyway.)

Around two weeks a go I ordered the HC5000 from a Japanese Importer and it was shipped to me from Toykyo via DHL. A few days a go I received a "Customs Duty Invoice" from DHL in the mail indicating that I need to send DHL a payment of $25.15. I did not think we had to pay these types of customs charges here in the USA? Is this a valid bill or a mistake?

~Josh

Pay it quick before they change their mind. I think you got off lightly there.

Was this from Price japan by any chance?

Nick

and how does the picture look to your eyes? have you owned any previous projectors? how does the Mitsu compare to those?-Though

For my experience, I can only compare it to the following projectors.

Infocus X2, the HC5000 is MUCH quieter, brighter, better resolution easily, MUCH less screendoor, better contrast and color, sharper, no Rainbow

Sanyo PLV-Z2, the HC5000 is quieter, brighter, better resolution easily, less screendoor, better contrast,

Sanyo PLC-XU50A, the HC5000 is MUCH quieter, about the same brightness, better resolution, much less screendoor, much better contrast and color, sharper

Sharp XG-C430X, the HC5000 is quieter, dimmer, better contrast and color, again better resolution and much less screendoor. sharper

Compared to all of these the remote control powered focus/zoom/lens shift made installation/setup MUCH more convenient. Screendoor and resolution are the most noticeable improvements on the HC5000 over all the projectors. The only downside compared to the two data projectors is the 4:3 aspect stuff on a 4:3 screen for older format material, classic movies/anime/tv shows.

Of these only the Sanyo PLV-Z2 is a HT projector and it is nearly 3 years old and not using a fresh bulb. All of the projectors are older generation projectors.

The Mitsubishi HC5000BL is easily superior to any of the above projectors for HT.

It is better for PC/Console gaming as well. Lost Planet and Gears of War look fantastic.

Have some patience please, we are working on details right now ;-)

Hopefully we will have an official announcement by the end of next week.


Regards,
Ekkehart ;-)


Much obliged Sir

Around two weeks a go I ordered the HC5000 from a Japanese Importer and it was shipped to me from Toykyo via DHL. A few days a go I received a "Customs Duty Invoice" from DHL in the mail indicating that I need to send DHL a payment of $25.15. I did not think we had to pay these types of customs charges here in the USA? Is this a valid bill or a mistake?

~Josh

Hi, Josh,

It is a valid bill. If the seller did not specify the correct tariff item number on the invoice, then you need to pay customs duty.

To all you HC5000BL owners...

What's your throw distance and screen size? I need to throw 20ft. to a 133" diag. screen (1.3 gain) in a zero-light room and am worried about getting a picture bright enough. It'd be great hearing about your various experiences.

Here's hoping current and future HC5000 owners can benefit from whatever cine4home is cooking up with their tweaks without ripping into your projector and voiding the warranty. Also hope whatever tweaks they discover for the Mits can be ported over to other projectos :)

To all you HC5000BL owners...

What's your throw distance and screen size? I need to throw 20ft. to a 133" diag. screen (1.3 gain) in a zero-light room and am worried about getting a picture bright enough. It'd be great hearing about your various experiences.

I've got a similar setup but with a 2.8 gain screen... Can anyone answer this question?

Happy to report second unit with dustblobs. Quality control at Mits does not seem to be that serious. There goes...

I've got a similar setup but with a 2.8 gain screen... Can anyone answer this question?

I just setup today my High power screen 2.8 gain 133" screen and the Mitsubishi 5000 set back on a shelf 6 feet high and 18 feet back and it ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!

Two rows of Berkline 090's with three seats in each row. First row 12 feet from screen and the second row 17 feet. ZERO screendoor even at 12'.

Absolutely LOVIN IT!!!

I just setup today my High power screen 2.8 gain 133" screen and the Mitsubishi 5000 set back on a shelf 6 feet high and 18 feet back and it ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!

Two rows of Berkline 090's with three seats in each row. First row 12 feet from screen and the second row 17 feet. ZERO screendoor even at 12'.

Absolutely LOVIN IT!!!

Any pictures you can post? So the screen wasn't too dimm and your blacks look good?

Guys I've got a question.

Should I use the DVI or HDMI input if i manage to get my hands on this?

I was thinking of using DVI since it cuts cost, but whaddya guys think?

appreciate the help,

Farhan

you're buying a $4500 retail projector and are talkin' about "cutting costs" with a few dollars source cable? whichever is more convenient to you is the one i suggest you using. there shouldn't be any difference in picture quality...



Guys I've got a question.

Should I use the DVI or HDMI input if i manage to get my hands on this?

I was thinking of using DVI since it cuts cost, but whaddya guys think?

appreciate the help,

Farhan

Guys I've got a question.

Should I use the DVI or HDMI input if i manage to get my hands on this?

I was thinking of using DVI since it cuts cost, but whaddya guys think?

appreciate the help,

Farhan

Use the input that matches your source.

Hi,
have also bought a HC5000, should receive it soon. :) :) :)
I've 2 questions:

1. Have read, there is a FW V3.x out. How can I check what FW Version is installed in the HC5000?
2. With my old Epson EMP TW200H it's possible to adjust brigthness/contrast/color/tint/RGB's etc. by PC (over USB), using Epson's Color Editor Software. Is there any SW like this for the HC5000 available? I know, the HC5000 supports all commands via RS232C ... so I'd like to control the HC5000 also using any SW, because projector tuning is more comfortable to me as a cumbersome zapping with the IR remote control ...

Best regards
Harry

There's a patch that fixes the PAL de-interlacing problems. Is that Firmware V3.0? Is AVScience shipping out the PAL-fixed versions?

There's a patch that fixes the PAL de-interlacing problems. Is that Firmware V3.0? Is AVScience shipping out the PAL-fixed versions?

So, AVSRichard, have you checked that firmware issue?

Does the HC5000 use a standard computer style power connector like the Sony HS51 does?

yes, standard 3 pong connector like you find on the back of your pc.

yes, standard 3 pong connector like you find on the back of your pc.


Thanks.

Hi,
have also bought a HC5000, should receive it soon. :) :) :)
I've 2 questions:

1. Have read, there is a FW V3.x out. How can I check what FW Version is installed in the HC5000?
2. With my old Epson EMP TW200H it's possible to adjust brigthness/contrast/color/tint/RGB's etc. by PC (over USB), using Epson's Color Editor Software. Is there any SW like this for the HC5000 available? I know, the HC5000 supports all commands via RS232C ... so I'd like to control the HC5000 also using any SW, because projector tuning is more comfortable to me as a cumbersome zapping with the IR remote control ...

Best regards
Harry

Does anybody know how to find out the installed FW-Version of the HC5000?
And since when V3.0 is available?

In the menu, pick Feature -> Menu position. Then press auto position, enter, auto position.
You are now in the service menu which will show SW version. mine says 3.0

Hi,

Just ordered the Mits HC500BL (thanks to Richard at AVScience for a great price!) to replace my Optoma H79. I run that projector on a Stewartfilm Greyhawk 92" screen. Any thoughts on this screen for the Mits? My room is pretty well light controlled, but not a true "bat cave".

Also, curious if anyone else is using a DVDO iScan HD+ (or similar) processor with this projector. Trying to decide whether to put it on eBay along with the Optoma.

Thanks,
Mark

i believe that the chip that does the scaling , used in the HD is outdated in comparison with the one in the HC5000.

Actually, most people are running either the DVDO VP50 or Lumagen HDQ. Depends on how many sources you have but you're ready for the big leagues of 1080p!

Richard

Hi,

Just ordered the Mits HC500BL (thanks to Richard at AVScience for a great price!) to replace my Optoma H79. I run that projector on a Stewartfilm Greyhawk 92" screen. Any thoughts on this screen for the Mits? My room is pretty well light controlled, but not a true "bat cave".

Also, curious if anyone else is using a DVDO iScan HD+ (or similar) processor with this projector. Trying to decide whether to put it on eBay along with the Optoma.

Thanks,
Mark

Well, there is one way to find out. Give it a try and compare the HD+ with the internal processing of the Mitsubishi and decide for yourself :)

In the menu, pick Feature -> Menu position. Then press auto position, enter, auto position.
You are now in the service menu which will show SW version. mine says 3.0

Thx!!!
:)

Any idea about SW for controlling over RS232?
Regards,
Harry

nope. seems to work great with the remote.




Thx!!!
:)

Any idea about SW for controlling over RS232?
Regards,
Harry

I recently bought a HC5000 from avs. I was calibrating the contrast and brighness levels using both DVE and GetGray into the HDMI input. I first used my HD-A1 with firmware v2.0 which is supposed to pass btb and wtw over hdmi. I am getting NO btb. It apears to be passing wtw. My second test was to use a DVD recorder from Panasonic the DMR-ES46V. Using it as the source I also can get wtw but no btb.

I searched this thread and found almost no references to the btb or wtw capabilities of the HC5000. Has anyone confirmed that the HC 5000 can pass btb via hdmi? If so using what source equipment and what test disc?

I recently bought a HC5000 from avs. I was calibrating the contrast and brighness levels using both DVE and GetGray into the HDMI input. I first used my HD-A1 with firmware v2.0 which is supposed to pass btb and wtw over hdmi. I am getting NO btb. It apears to be passing wtw. My second test was to use a DVD recorder from Panasonic the DMR-ES46V. Using it as the source I also can get wtw but no btb.

I searched this thread and found almost no references to the btb or wtw capabilities of the HC5000. Has anyone confirmed that the HC 5000 can pass btb via hdmi? If so using what source equipment and what test disc?

Passes with XA2 HDMI 1080p.

PS3 barely passes WTW, fails BTB. (but this is a known problem with the PS3)

Passed with HD MediaBox (AVIA is in ISO rip from the HDD) HDMI 1080p

Passes with my generic/Shinco DVD player component 480p to RXV2700 AV amp, then upscaled through to 1080i HDMI

Passes with XA2 HDMI 1080p.

PS3 barely passes WTW, fails BTB. (but this is a known problem with the PS3)

Passed with HD MediaBox (AVIA is in ISO rip from the HDD) HDMI 1080p

Passes with my generic/Shinco DVD player component 480p to RXV2700 AV amp, then upscaled through to 1080i HDMI

When you say passes, what test DVD did you use? The regular Avia DVD doesn't do btb. DVE and Get gray both have btb patterns. For DVE the left most black bar should appear and for get gray levels below 16 show up as the brightness control is increased.

I am using AVIA and it does have the BTB test. It comes after the WTW test

I recently bought a HC5000 from avs. I was calibrating the contrast and brighness levels using both DVE and GetGray into the HDMI input. I first used my HD-A1 with firmware v2.0 which is supposed to pass btb and wtw over hdmi. I am getting NO btb. It apears to be passing wtw. My second test was to use a DVD recorder from Panasonic the DMR-ES46V. Using it as the source I also can get wtw but no btb.

I searched this thread and found almost no references to the btb or wtw capabilities of the HC5000. Has anyone confirmed that the HC 5000 can pass btb via hdmi? If so using what source equipment and what test disc?

I performed some further testing with a HTPC with a NVIDIA video card. Using GetGray with Media Player and Theatertek. I have a Phillips pattern generator software that can also display < 16 (btb) and > 235 (wtw).

I found the Mitsubishi clips anything below 16 in "Normal" mode. The HC5000 only enables the Normal / Enhanced option for RGB sources over HDMI. Normal means studio levels 16-235, and Enhanced means PC levels 0-255. If you select Enhanced the bars below 16 can become visible after adjusting brightness. This proves that at least for RGB that the hc5000 can receive btb but chooses to clip it for some reason.

I have tried turning off film mode, and adjusting the Setup options of auto,off,3.5,7.5. None of them have any affect on passing btb. My firmware version is 3.0.

Is it possible that Mitsubishi clips btb because of the Dynamic Iris, or the HQV processor is doing it?

For anyone getting btb via hdmi through a HC5000 please post your settings, source device and test disc.

Ultimate AV magazine has a review of the HC5000. In the review they confirm my observations on blacker than black. It passes wtw over hdmi but clips btb. It passes btb/wtw over component.

Ultimate AV HC5000 Review (http://www.ultimateavmag.com/videoprojectors/107mits5000/index4.html)

In the menu, pick Feature -> Menu position. Then press auto position, enter, auto position.
You are now in the service menu which will show SW version. mine says 3.0

Looks like I got 3.0. And 100 hours already, sheesh!

Has anyone found out how to do panel convergence adjustments?

Maybe this would have to be done over RS232?

Hi,

I am planning on buying the following combination -

DVD player - Denon 1930ci
AVR - Marantz SR7001

With this combination, will the HC5000BL take care of IP conversion, scaling (480i-> 48op, 720i -> 720p, 1080i etc)
Or do I need to buy AVR with scaler (example Yamaha RX-V2700)

Thanks for any advice.

I have an HC5000 sourced from Japan with firmware 3.0.

It seems to display both WTW and BTB (at least using DVE) with Setup = Off and Enhanced mode over HDMI and DVI on the following players:
- HTPC with NVidia 7950 and Purevideo (Forceware 93.71)
- Panasonic DVD-S97
- Oppo DV-970HD

But I did remember having problems when Setup was set to Auto.

Hi,

I am planning on buying the following combination -

DVD player - Denon 1930ci
AVR - Marantz SR7001

With this combination, will the HC5000BL take care of IP conversion, scaling (480i-> 48op, 720i -> 720p, 1080i etc)
Or do I need to buy AVR with scaler (example Yamaha RX-V2700)

Thanks for any advice.

A scaler is not necessary. You may just connect the Denon to the projector directly using a HDMI cable.

This one came out of the blue for me. I ordered it today. :)

I had seen and got to play with quite a bit the AE1000, and the Pearl. Last night I got to see the Mitsu and even got to look at some old B&W Laserdisc on it. The processing really pays off when fed good svideo NTSC. Sharpest out of those three on such material with no external scaler involved. Really looked good, felt like a very solid image.

Has anyone used the 1080p/24 capability of the HC5000?
Did you see any reduction in judder?
If so how did the 48hz refresh rate look?
Anyone use either the pioneer or Sony blu-ray players with 1080p/24 capability?

Has anyone used the 1080p/24 capability of the HC5000?
Did you see any reduction in judder?
If so how did the 48hz refresh rate look?
Anyone use either the pioneer or Sony blu-ray players with 1080p/24 capability?


Hmmm, I guess I had not caught that one. It does 24hz at 48hz aye? It seems I have read that there is a particular issue with that combo, I mean not just on this projector but virtually all 24hz displayed at 48hz displays. I don't have any 1080p/24 sources and I don't expect to for some time.

Although the Epson has started to receive reviews and feedback that the contrast and black levels are very good and potentially better than the Mitsubishi HC5000, the playing field could be leveled once cine4home releases their secret recipe of herbs and spices that they use with the Mitsubishi that they say makes a difference....unless of course the same thing can be done to another pj like the Epson. I don't even know what is improved. Iris action? Noise level? Contrast and blacks? Who knows...

First, thanks all for the great info. I've been reading this site for a couple of weeks now and have learned a great deal.
A month ago i upgraded my sanyo z3 to the hc5000-wow! Then got the idea i needed a blue ray player and got a ps3 (price and kids issues). Now i'm looking at a new scaler (from Faroudja nrs) Crystalio II or Anthem 50. I have a couple of questions:

With sd dishnetwork, can anything be done to make it look as good as Blue ray?

Is the sound quality of the Anthem avm50 that much better than my Rotel rsp1098?

Any suggestions on optimal settings for the mitsubishi hc5000? I just left the factory settings, overscanned to 100 and turned off the iris.

Everyone seems to ask so i'll let you know my set up is:
small room-used to be a sun room, with lots of furniture and carpets pretty well darkened.
70% dishnetwork
30% dvd's

hc5000 projector and plasma for daytime or news
rotel audio processor and amps 5.1
B&W nat 805's and scm1's
hd dish
faroudja nrs video processor
ps audio 600

First, thanks all for the great info. I've been reading this site for a couple of weeks now and have learned a great deal.
A month ago i upgraded my sanyo z3 to the hc5000-wow! Then got the idea i needed a blue ray player and got a ps3 (price and kids issues). Now i'm looking at a new scaler (from Faroudja nrs) Crystalio II or Anthem 50. I have a couple of questions:

With sd dishnetwork, can anything be done to make it look as good as Blue ray?

Is the sound quality of the Anthem avm50 that much better than my Rotel rsp1098?

Any suggestions on optimal settings for the mitsubishi hc5000? I just left the factory settings, overscanned to 100 and turned off the iris.

Everyone seems to ask so i'll let you know my set up is:
small room-used to be a sun room, with lots of furniture and carpets pretty well darkened.
70% dishnetwork
30% dvd's

hc5000 projector and plasma for daytime or news
rotel audio processor and amps 5.1
B&W nat 805's and scm1's
hd dish
faroudja nrs video processor
ps audio 600

On your dish net box? What box do you have? Like the HD 211 (or something like that I have) does a pretty good job with the SD channels, it scales to the HD res of my choice and handles HD channels seemlessly. I'd rank the SD quality some of the best most consistant I ever see out of Cable, Sat, Direct content services. Of course nothing makes it look like Blu-ray or HD-DVD or even the HD that Dish offers because it is NTSC and not HD to start with.

Received mine from japan and after turning the projector on i could see that towards the bottom of the picture was a small circular blob. On an all white picture it shows up as a yellow/brown blob and on an all black picture it shows up as a blue blob. Is this a famous dust blob?

Received mine from japan and after turning the projector on i could see that towards the bottom of the picture was a small circular blob. On an all white picture it shows up as a yellow/brown blob and on an all black picture it shows up as a blue blob. Is this a famous dust blob?

Yes, most likely it is.

what to do now?


Received mine from japan and after turning the projector on i could see that towards the bottom of the picture was a small circular blob. On an all white picture it shows up as a yellow/brown blob and on an all black picture it shows up as a blue blob. Is this a famous dust blob?

This question may have been addressed previously in this thread. But I'm not going to spend 2 hours searching for it. My brother just got an HC5000. The installer only had component running through the projector. A HDMI cable was also attached but had no source. Cable works 1080i and an old DVD works over component. Picture is awesome.

Here's the issue:

We wanted to hook the PS3 up to it and run 1080p for Blu Ray via HDMI. In the PS3 setup you have to enable 1080p. The PS3 would not let us finish the setup because the HC5000 wasn't accepting the 1080p signal. Only 1080i and under. We looked in the menu of the HC5000 and the video input was grayed out and inaccessable. In the user manual it only mentions 1080p through component only. The info section of the menu says its only getting 1080i.

The question is:

How do I get the HC5000 to accept a 1080p signal via HDMI? What are we doing wrong?

This question may have been addressed previously in this thread. But I'm not going to spend 2 hours searching for it. My brother just got an HC5000. The installer only had component running through the projector. A HDMI cable was also attached but had no source. Cable works 1080i and an old DVD works over component. Picture is awesome.

Here's the issue:

We wanted to hook the PS3 up to it and run 1080p for Blu Ray via HDMI. In the PS3 setup you have to enable 1080p. The PS3 would not let us finish the setup because the HC5000 wasn't accepting the 1080p signal. Only 1080i and under. We looked in the menu of the HC5000 and the video input was grayed out and inaccessable. In the user manual it only mentions 1080p through component only. The info section of the menu says its only getting 1080i.

The question is:

How do I get the HC5000 to accept a 1080p signal via HDMI? What are we doing wrong?

Not sure if I am reading you right, cos you said the installer only hooked up component...

The PS3 can only output 1080p over HDMI cables.

I have run it directly as well as switched through a Yamaha RXV2700. Both work fine in 1080p mode.

yep, works perfectly (1080p) from my ps3 to hc5000 through the denon 987 (2807).

Not sure if I am reading you right, cos you said the installer only hooked up component...

The PS3 can only output 1080p over HDMI cables.

I have run it directly as well as switched through a Yamaha RXV2700. Both work fine in 1080p mode.

Component was used just for cable and DVD. Yes we hooked up the PS3 after the fact via HDMI. But during video setup of the PS3 we checked the 1080p box in addition to the 480p, 720p and 1080i that were already checked. That is when the PS3 basically told us the HC5000 was not going to recieve the 1080p signal by not letting us complete the video setup process. The video setup worked fine with 1080i.

My brother has never has done an update on the PS3 which he has had since before Christmas. Maybe thats the issue.

How do you chang the video input signal in HDMI mode on the HC5000? That was the section that was grayed out for us. As well as the SCART section. It was there, just couldn't click on it

Weird. This is the first instance I have heard. I have plugged the PS3 into my HC5000 with no issues over HDMI whether switched or direct...

Are you using a switch? or use an AV amp?

Weird. This is the first instance I have heard. I have plugged the PS3 into my HC5000 with no issues over HDMI whether switched or direct...

Are you using a switch? or use an AV amp?

HDMI cable straight to the HC5000 with optical cable to Rotel reciever.

We did the PS3 update and it still won't do the 1080p.

what to do now?

I think you need to find a technician (maybe you can ask Mitsubishi) to remove the dust.

This question may have been addressed previously in this thread. But I'm not going to spend 2 hours searching for it. My brother just got an HC5000. The installer only had component running through the projector. A HDMI cable was also attached but had no source. Cable works 1080i and an old DVD works over component. Picture is awesome.

Here's the issue:

We wanted to hook the PS3 up to it and run 1080p for Blu Ray via HDMI. In the PS3 setup you have to enable 1080p. The PS3 would not let us finish the setup because the HC5000 wasn't accepting the 1080p signal. Only 1080i and under. We looked in the menu of the HC5000 and the video input was grayed out and inaccessable. In the user manual it only mentions 1080p through component only. The info section of the menu says its only getting 1080i.

The question is:

How do I get the HC5000 to accept a 1080p signal via HDMI? What are we doing wrong?

You may try to change the HDMI input level setting from the menu of HC5000 by the following steps:

IMAGE -> ADVANCED MENU -> INPUT LEVEL -> ENHANCED / NORMAL

Also, you may try to use another HDMI cable to see if it works.

how long is your hdmi cable? I think the cable may not be 1080p certified. I use my PS3 with the anthem avm50 going to the hc5000 without any problem.

Cine4Home Wrote

Have some patience please, we are working on details right now ;-)

Hopefully we will have an official announcement by the end of next week.


Regards,
Ekkehart ;-)




have of news of this

Thanks

Excuse me for my poor english

Looking forward to any tweaks!! :D

ya, checking thid thread daily for the tweak by cine4home

Have some patience please, we are working on details right now ;-)

Hopefully we will have an official announcement by the end of next week.


Regards,
Ekkehart ;-)

Anything yet?

Just got my HC5000 to replace my Benq 8700+. The reasons for replacing the Benq were:

Benq was noisy
HDCP to a HD-A1 HD-DVD player worked 5% of the time
1080p

A note about celing mounting: The center of gravity (cg) is right on one of the mounting holes. I use a Vogel universal mount and that mounting hole meant the arms were longer than the plate mount, so I had to manufacture something to make it work. Also, it only has three holes, most projectors I've seen have four, all around the CG of the projector. Very odd.

I'm very impressed thus far with the performance. It is pretty dang quiet. I'm happy to report it has worked 20 times in a row in the HDCP handshake with the HD-DVD player. I only had a 40' dvi cable run in the wall, but it is working just great with a HDMI adapter and switched through receiver.

The projector shipped with the sharpness setting set at +6. Cranking that down to -3/-4 made things much better. The SDE on this projector is noticable to me from the seating position (12 feet from a 100" screen). That is really my only complaint thus far in testing. Xbox 360 works great at 1080p on component cables, so I'm happy about that too.

I was flip-flopping on this and the AE1000 by Panasonic, but once I saw the Panasonic didn't have a 12v trigger for my screen, the Mitsubishi was a shoe in.

Just got my HC5000 to replace my Benq 8700+. The reasons for replacing the Benq were:

Benq was noisy
HDCP to a HD-A1 HD-DVD player worked 5% of the time
1080p

A note about celing mounting: The center of gravity (cg) is right on one of the mounting holes. I use a Vogel universal mount and that mounting hole meant the arms were longer than the plate mount, so I had to manufacture something to make it work. Also, it only has three holes, most projectors I've seen have four, all around the CG of the projector. Very odd.

I'm very impressed thus far with the performance. It is pretty dang quiet. I'm happy to report it has worked 20 times in a row in the HDCP handshake with the HD-DVD player. I only had a 40' dvi cable run in the wall, but it is working just great with a HDMI adapter and switched through receiver.

The projector shipped with the sharpness setting set at +6. Cranking that down to -3/-4 made things much better. The SDE on this projector is noticable to me from the seating position (12 feet from a 100" screen). That is really my only complaint thus far in testing. Xbox 360 works great at 1080p on component cables, so I'm happy about that too.

I was flip-flopping on this and the AE1000 by Panasonic, but once I saw the Panasonic didn't have a 12v trigger for my screen, the Mitsubishi was a shoe in.

gosh you must be ultra sensitive with screen door, I can't see it at all. I didn't think you could get 1080p from a 360 over component, only VGA will make the 360 give the option to provide 1080p?

1080p is available over component on the 360; however, you can't do HD-DVD movies that way. You do get game menus, pictures, and I believe games might be upconverted to 1080p. I need to check on that one to be sure. Coming from DLP, I can see the dang lines, especially on very bright scenes like the opening of Poseidon. On darker scenes, I can't detect it at all.

You are correct, VGA is required on the 360 in order to playback HD-DVD. There aren't many display devices that can do 1080p over component. I'm happy to report that this projector does it no problem.

A local store has both the HC 5000 and the Sharp XV-Z20000 set up in the same room.

I will be going there today for a demo and will report back on the differences between these two projectors.

Is there anything that anyone would like me to check while I am there?

The set-up is a dedicated theater room and light can apparently be controlled.

Lawguy, in what city is that local store? Would love to see that.

Thanks

It is a 6th Ave Electronics store in Long Island, NY.

1080p is available over component on the 360; however, you can't do HD-DVD movies that way. You do get game menus, pictures, and I believe games might be upconverted to 1080p. I need to check on that one to be sure. Coming from DLP, I can see the dang lines, especially on very bright scenes like the opening of Poseidon. On darker scenes, I can't detect it at all.

You are correct, VGA is required on the 360 in order to playback HD-DVD. There aren't many display devices that can do 1080p over component. I'm happy to report that this projector does it no problem.

I'm running component into my HC5000 at 1080p right now from my Xbox 360 with Hd-Dvd drive. HD-Dvd and Games at 1080p. It just won't upconvert standard Dvd's past 480p over component.

I'm running component into my HC5000 at 1080p right now from my Xbox 360 with Hd-Dvd drive. HD-Dvd and Games at 1080p. It just won't upconvert standard Dvd's past 480p over component.

HD DVD does not play at 1080p with component out from XBox360. Only for games/menus etc. Once the movie starts, it switches to 1080i.

While the HD DVD is playing.. go to the HC5000 Menu and select the last tab (Info). It shd be 1920x1080 30Hz.

It only plays 1080p for HD DVD over VGA.

HD DVD does not play at 1080p with component out from XBox360. Only for games/menus etc. Once the movie starts, it switches to 1080i.

While the HD DVD is playing.. go to the HC5000 Menu and select the last tab (Info). It shd be 1920x1080 30Hz.

It only plays 1080p for HD DVD over VGA.

You're right.

I need to not post so late at night :)

It is a 6th Ave Electronics store in Long Island, NY.

Thanks Lawguy, wrong coast for me though. What were your impressions of the differences?

I have calibrated my HC5000 using a spyder and CalMan software. Out of the box the calibration is not close to 6500k at any of the predefined color modes / gamma's.

The video gamma is closest to 2.2. Cinema is somewhat higher. Here are my settings. They track 6500k very well and have DE's less than 1 accross the full range of brightness. As noted in the reviews the Green is oversaturated and correspondingly yellow is also off. Blue and red are very close and white is dead on at D65. This calibration was done with auto iris off. With auto iris at level 1, the color temperature at 10% and 20% are somewhat off.

Contrast -2
Brightness 1
Gamma Mode User Based on Video
RHi 0
RMed 1
RLow 2
GHi 0
GMed 0
GLow 1
BHi -1
BMed -1
BLow 0
Color is User
Contrast
R 0
G 0
B -3
Brightness
R 2
G 2
B -1

Thanks Lawguy, wrong coast for me though. What were your impressions of the differences?

Unfortunately, The Sharp was in a "good" room and the HC5000 was in a "bad" room so it was hard to draw any conclusions.

I think LCD has come a long way (speaking as a former Hitachi HDPJ52 owner).

I wished the room could have been darker and the source signal better so I could have seen how the contrast was on the HC5000.

I have calibrated my HC5000 using a spyder and CalMan software. Out of the box the calibration is not close to 6500k at any of the predefined color modes / gamma's.

The video gamma is closest to 2.2. Cinema is somewhat higher. Here are my settings. They track 6500k very well and have DE's less than 1 accross the full range of brightness. As noted in the reviews the Green is oversaturated and correspondingly yellow is also off. Blue and red are very close and white is dead on at D65. This calibration was done with auto iris off. With auto iris at level 1, the color temperature at 10% and 20% are somewhat off.

Contrast -2
Brightness 1
Gamma Mode User Based on Video
RHi 0
RMed 1
RLow 2
GHi 0
GMed 0
GLow 1
BHi -1
BMed -1
BLow 0
Color is User
Contrast
R 0
G 0
B -3
Brightness
R 2
G 2
B -1

How can you adjust those Red,Green and Blue separately...haven´t found calibration for those in the menu?

How can you adjust those Red,Green and Blue separately...haven´t found calibration for those in the menu?Highlight <ALL> in gamma menu and press left or right key to scroll between individual colors.

did you use hdmi when making these adjustments? what was your source player?


I have calibrated my HC5000 using a spyder and CalMan software. Out of the box the calibration is not close to 6500k at any of the predefined color modes / gamma's.

The video gamma is closest to 2.2. Cinema is somewhat higher. Here are my settings. They track 6500k very well and have DE's less than 1 accross the full range of brightness. As noted in the reviews the Green is oversaturated and correspondingly yellow is also off. Blue and red are very close and white is dead on at D65. This calibration was done with auto iris off. With auto iris at level 1, the color temperature at 10% and 20% are somewhat off.

Contrast -2
Brightness 1
Gamma Mode User Based on Video
RHi 0
RMed 1
RLow 2
GHi 0
GMed 0
GLow 1
BHi -1
BMed -1
BLow 0
Color is User
Contrast
R 0
G 0
B -3
Brightness
R 2
G 2
B -1

is the overall consensus to turn off irus? if so, how do you do it?

did you use hdmi when making these adjustments? what was your source player?

Yes I used the HDMI input. In order to make the calibration go MUCH faster I used the internal pattern generator that CalMan offers. This comes from a DVI output from a HTPC. This means that the calibration was using RGB at video levels 16-235. I am using an Nvidia based video card and the video output levels are correct. Some Ati cards can cause the wrong video levels to be sent!

Once completed you could use the GetGray DVD from a HD-DVD player or blu-ray player and manually select/advance the patterns, just to make sure there are no differences.

is the overall consensus to turn off irus? if so, how do you do it?

No, that was not the point I was making. If the Auto Iris is on the lower level gray scale color will NOT be 6500k. Personally I am willing to sacrifice this for better blacks.

If the Cineforhome Innovate Tuning improves the contrast ratio enough I would probably turn off the auto Iris.

i am interested in settings coming from a ps3 BD machine via hdmi, as that is what i am using to feed the proj 99% of the time.



Yes I used the HDMI input. In order to make the calibration go MUCH faster I used the internal pattern generator that CalMan offers. This comes from a DVI output from a HTPC. This means that the calibration was using RGB at video levels 16-235. I am using an Nvidia based video card and the video output levels are correct. Some Ati cards can cause the wrong video levels to be sent!

Once completed you could use the GetGray DVD from a HD-DVD player or blu-ray player and manually select/advance the patterns, just to make sure there are no differences.

Highlight <ALL> in gamma menu and press left or right key to scroll between individual colors.

Heh...ehkä mä oon vähän dorka mutta en ymmärtänyt, eli tosta gamma menusta mulle tulee cinema,auto,sports ym..oonko siis väärässä menussa :) noob kato :)

Heh...ehkä mä oon vähän dorka mutta en ymmärtänyt, eli tosta gamma menusta mulle tulee cinema,auto,sports ym..oonko siis väärässä menussa :) noob kato :)

Go Heikki Kovalainen!

http://www.formula1.com/news/5757.html :)

Heh...ehkä mä oon vähän dorka mutta en ymmärtänyt, eli tosta gamma menusta mulle tulee cinema,auto,sports ym..oonko siis väärässä menussa :) noob kato :)Valitse ensin user gamma (tjsp).

Valitse ensin user gamma (tjsp).

Ok..nyt löyty,kiitoksia :)

Is there a filter on the mits HC5000 that you need to clean?

Hi,

I'm having trouble displaying a 480i signal on my Mits HC5000. I get a garbled picture that looks like an old set with a vertical hold problem. No problem with 480p or any higher resolution.

I have two sources that can output 480i. One is the Sony BDP-S1 Blu-Ray player. The other is a Directv HR20 HD DVR.

Normally, I wouldn't care about 480i, but I would like to leave my Blu-Ray player set to Direct mode which outputs 480i when playing a DVD.

I'm running these sources through a Yamaha RX-V2700 receiver. Both are connected with HDMI cables. I think the receiver is passing the signals through but not completely sure. I've tried setting Video Conversion on the receiver on and off. No difference.

Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Mark

Here's yr problem right here...

I'm running these sources through a Yamaha RX-V2700 receiver. Both are connected with HDMI cables.

2700 does not seem to like 480i over HDMI or component. I had to enable 480p for the passthrough to work.

You can isolate this problem by hooking the HDMI cable from the HC5000 directly to the BR or HD box directly and see if the HC5000 can play the 480i over HDMI. I think it should.

HD DVD does not play at 1080p with component out from XBox360. Only for games/menus etc. Once the movie starts, it switches to 1080i.

While the HD DVD is playing.. go to the HC5000 Menu and select the last tab (Info). It shd be 1920x1080 30Hz.

It only plays 1080p for HD DVD over VGA.


Would I be correct in saying that if you are connected with VGA then when watching an HD DVD it would say 1920 x 1080 @60Hz?

Would that be the way to know for sure if the XBOX is outputting 1080p with the HD DVD drive with the HC5000?

Thanks

Stewart

Here's yr problem right here...



2700 does not seem to like 480i over HDMI or component. I had to enable 480p for the passthrough to work.

You can isolate this problem by hooking the HDMI cable from the HC5000 directly to the BR or HD box directly and see if the HC5000 can play the 480i over HDMI. I think it should.

I connected the Blu-ray player directly to the HC5000 bypassing the Yamaha receiver and it still won't display 480i? Looks exactly the same. Is there any other way to test the projector to see if it is the problem?

Thanks again.

Mark

Would I be correct in saying that if you are connected with VGA then when watching an HD DVD it would say 1920 x 1080 @60Hz?

Would that be the way to know for sure if the XBOX is outputting 1080p with the HD DVD drive with the HC5000?

Thanks

Stewart

Yes, the Signal Info page says: 1920x1080 60Hz (or 59.xx Hz, can't recall the exact number)

I connected the Blu-ray player directly to the HC5000 bypassing the Yamaha receiver and it still won't display 480i? Looks exactly the same. Is there any other way to test the projector to see if it is the problem?

Thanks again.

Mark

I don't have any source that can do 480i over HDMI.

I just know abt the problem abt 480i over component cos I encountered it with my sources.

But oddly enough, my other interlaced sources passed through fine through HDMI using the 2700 to my projector. That's why I expected the HC5000 to accept 480i over HDMI.

Here's yr problem right here...
You can isolate this problem by hooking the HDMI cable from the HC5000 directly to the BR or HD box directly and see if the HC5000 can play the 480i over HDMI. I think it should.

HC5000 can accept 480i via HDMI.

I had my Oppo 970HD output HDMI 480i thru Marantz SR8001 to HC5000 with no issue.

Have some patience please, we are working on details right now ;-)

Hopefully we will have an official announcement by the end of next week.


Regards,
Ekkehart ;-)


Cine4Home,

4 weeks later there are no news.

Are there any problems?

I've given up on Cine4home... :( :( :(

Are the owners of this projector satisfied with the dynamic iris? Which setting are you all using? What are the results? (Informal poll).

Cine4Home,

4 weeks later there are no news.

Are there any problems?



Yes, "politics"....

We will definately publish infos in a couple of weeks...

Regards,
Ekkehart

Yes, "politics"....

We will definately publish infos in a couple of weeks...

Regards,
Ekkehart


Sounds like Mitsubishi doesn't want you to post results. If it is then they should be ashamed, anything that improves is always welcome.

Hopefully, you will publish and you have the public support

Regards

Stewart

Are the owners of this projector satisfied with the dynamic iris? Which setting are you all using? What are the results? (Informal poll).

Satisfied? I am happy that it has it. With it disabled, the dark scenes lose a bit of their punch. I've left it set to auto. On scenes like the intro to Cars, you can certainly see the iris in operation as McQueen goes from "focusing" in complete blackness to bright glimpses of the track. When the scene changes to inside his trailer, the initial "black" scene is really real dark grey, which then fades to super duper dark in about 1-2 seconds. I can barely detect the iris opening when we glimpse back onto the track, but I can certainly spot it when it closes down.

...crap, I hope my comment about "the Mits modification/tweak is possibly something that voids warranty" didn't jynx the situation...

is the horizontal banding still a problem for these pjs. has mits ever acknowledged this or the visible iris?

On a very bright image (tons of snow, etc) that is not a pan shot, I can just barely detect some banding at the seating location, but it's a strain for me to detect. With anything on-screen or any kind of motion, it can't be seen. Is this the best 1080p projector out there? For me, it is. For the price you can get this for on the street, there is nothing better unless you go 2x the cost. None are quieter, which was huge for me, as well as the included 12v trigger. The panasonic did not have that, nor does the RS1, which rules both of those out for me.

avdork,
thanks for your input, do you have the older firmware then? anyone know if the newer firmware addresses these problems or just the PAL disc processing?

I love the image and how quiet this pj is, but the iris and horizontal banding haunt me.

I have the newest firmware on my European Mitsu HC5000.

The banding problem does occur very slightly on some scenes just as avdork describes. So at least on my projector it's not gone totally. Of course, I wish it wasn't there. But at the time when I got my HC5000 there simply was no other 1080p solution at that price - and the other features and the performance of this projector is just ... incredible to my eyes at least. No noise, incredibly sharp, very good scaling and de-interlacer solution, easy to place in the room thanks to horisontal and vertical lens shift, motor zoom and focus, overall good black and contrast level for a LCD.

It could be that it's just mine or a few with the newest firmware that still has the slight banding on some very selected scenes, I haven't heard from others about this. But like I said, it's so rarely visible that I decided to keep it.

I just noticed that my Mits HC5000 is putting out a hot spot on the lower right hand part of the screen. The hot spot is about 3" diamater (on my 92" screen) and it looks like someone is shining a dim flashlight at the screen. It is not noticeable except when that part of the picture is very dark (or when the credits are rolling).

Has anyone else seen this? Any ideas what could be causing it?

Thanks,
Mark

Regarding the "hot spot" does it move when you move your head (or get up and walk around) or is it stationary on the screen?

If it moves its your screen.

If it doesn't move it's your projector. Probably lens related or it could be dust.

I'm running the latest firmware, 3.0 (unless somebody has something newer). The dynamic iris performance could be made such that it isn't as noticable, but it really doesn't bother me. I don't think anybody coming in to watch a movie would even notice it; and if they did notice it, they would just assume it's part of the movie since everything else is so darn good. Now that I know what a dynamic iris does, I bet I could spot it's operation on any display device that has it. Most won't notice, however, and it gives the manufacturers some bragging rights about "virtual" contrast ratios. The RS1 has great contrast ratios without the need for a dynamic iris and I think this technology will prevail. Until it does, I'm quite happy with my Mitsubishi.

Satisfied? I am happy that it has it. With it disabled, the dark scenes lose a bit of their punch. I've left it set to auto. On scenes like the intro to Cars, you can certainly see the iris in operation as McQueen goes from "focusing" in complete blackness to bright glimpses of the track. When the scene changes to inside his trailer, the initial "black" scene is really real dark grey, which then fades to super duper dark in about 1-2 seconds. I can barely detect the iris opening when we glimpse back onto the track, but I can certainly spot it when it closes down.


I don't have a Mits HC5000 (I currently have a Mits HC3000 - great projector for the price point!) but I want to upgrade so I'm curious about the dynamic iris in the HC5000. You say you have your DI set on auto mode. Aren't there several auto mode settings (3?). Which setting are you using. I've heard that setting 1 is the quickest with setting 3 the slowest.

Regarding the "hot spot" does it move when you move your head (or get up and walk around) or is it stationary on the screen?

If it moves its your screen.

If it doesn't move it's your projector. Probably lens related or it could be dust.

It is stationary. I'll check for dust.

Thanks

It is stationary. I'll check for dust.

Thanks
I have the same problem with my HC5000. Let us know if you are successfull in eliminating the "hot spot" and the method used.

I don't have a Mits HC5000 (I currently have a Mits HC3000 - great projector for the price point!) but I want to upgrade so I'm curious about the dynamic iris in the HC5000. You say you have your DI set on auto mode. Aren't there several auto mode settings (3?). Which setting are you using. I've heard that setting 1 is the quickest with setting 3 the slowest.

I'm using Auto 1. The rate at which it goes from almost black to pretty darn black is fast, but there is a delay before it starts that operation...probably to be sure that the scene isn't going to go right to bright again. You can literally watch it go from nearly black to practically black. It takes less than a second, but it's not in the millisecond range necessary to not notice.

Any chance someone has a pic of this horizontal banding? My Mits 5000 I bought about a month ago from AVS and I notice small horizontal lines about a quarter way up the screen from the bottom moving all the way across the screen. Its on every input and its mainly visible on bright backgrounds. I have version 3.0 as well. I tried to take a pic and could not get it top show up on the camera.

Its like very narrow static lines moving across the screen. Perfectly level from left to right just above the quarter mark on the screen from the bottom.

Any idea's?

Other then this I love the projector!

the banding that I was referring to is very intermittant and as previously posted on bright ie. sky or snowy backgrounds. It is only visible for a couple of seconds. If you blink you would miss it. I think that it is a lot harder to spot than the iris. But once you see it there is no mistaking it. I have never seen multiple bands or moving bands. There was only one about midway up the screen. In my case it was a darker, than the image, stripe running horizontal from left to right.

hope this helps. I also hope that mits will address this as well as the iris in a firmware update?

Can't wait to see the info. I just got this projector and must say that although it was a great deal on a unit imported to me from Japan, the PQ is a bit of a dissapointment.

Well its not that bad, but I am used to watching movies on my 60" Sony XBR SXRD RPTV, and this PJ so far does not compare.

Also I am going to switch to a hipower 2.8 gain screen, as the image is currently lacking punch.

The iris operation is noticeable if you look for it, but not that big of a deal.

I think i got lucky b/c there are zero dust blobs, and zero banding, and zero horizontal lines. So there are no major problems like that. Just not as pretty as the Sony RPTV.

Disclaimer: the HC5000 has not been professionally calibrated yet, so maybe that will help some.


I too have this HC 5000, and before I had purchased a 2.8 gain screen, I had the same Opinion as You, but now with a 2.8 gain screen, and a HD DVD , Blue Ray , and HD sat, it is Fantastic, Calibration was done on this thru Avia disc.

Three things: set to cinema mode for the color, set the overscan to 100% on EACH input, reduce the sharpness from +6 to -2. That helped a lot. Also, I noticed the screen-door-effect right away, but after 6 movies, the image is very impressive and I don't see it anymore. It could be that I've adjusted to the projector, but I wonder if there is a burn-in that helps it out. I have tons of punch. Also, use the HDMI input for best results. The component is pretty darn good, but you get an extra pop over HDMI. The standard definition move "The Wild" was so sharp, the hairs on the animals, the colours, really...everything.

What's your source material? Light-controlled room? Ceiling-mounted, or table mounted?

Though I'm not entirely sure why this is, according to page 11 of my manual, one of the bulleted items says:

"When the projector is mounted on the ceiling, images may appear darker than those projected in the case of tabletop mounting. This isn't a product malfunction."

157" screen!! Yowzers. Yes, this no light cannon, I'm not sure it's appropriate for that environment. It only has a 160w bulb in this thing.

I am currently running my HC5000 on a 165" diagonal Da-Lite High power screen.

I have the lamp in standard mode and the image is nothing short of stunning.

If you have a "bat cave" you will be thrilled with this projector on a large Da-Lite High Power screen.

I am currently running my HC5000 on a 165" diagonal Da-Lite High power screen.

I have the lamp in standard mode and the image is nothing short of stunning.

If you have a "bat cave" you will be thrilled with this projector on a large Da-Lite High Power screen.

You people have huge spaces for your home theatres! Wow. I thought my 50" x 118" screen was a little bit on the bigger side, but gee wiz, 158-165" diagonal? Man, that's absolutely huge! Get a theatre licence and a popcorn machine and go into business.

Can't wait to see the info. I just got this projector and must say that although it was a great deal on a unit imported to me from Japan, the PQ is a bit of a dissapointment.

Well its not that bad, but I am used to watching movies on my 60" Sony XBR SXRD RPTV, and this so far does not compare.

.


With our mod, the HC5000 is almost on par with the Pearl, no joke. We did some side by side comparison.

However we have to do some further technical tests right now (which I will do today). Like I said, we will publish more info soon :-)



Regards,
Ekkehart

With our mod, the HC5000 is almost on par with the Pearl, no joke. We did some side by side comparison.

However we have to do some further technical tests right now (which I will do today). Like I said, we will publish more info soon :-)



Regards,
Ekkehart

This is really good news!! :)

With our mod, the HC5000 is almost on par with the Pearl, no joke. We did some side by side comparison.

However we have to do some further technical tests right now (which I will do today). Like I said, we will publish more info soon :-)



Regards,
Ekkehart

Hi, Ekkehart,

:eek: Really eager to know what kind of mod. it is... :rolleyes:

Maybe they found a way to put in a brighter bulb, or possibly modify the motorized iris or a combination of both? And we wait....

My guess is that it's a "normal" Cine4home color filter combined with a static iris located inside the optics plus something else. Fully open light path after the panels is one of the reasons for poor native contrast.

With our mod, the HC5000 is almost on par with the Pearl, no joke. We did some side by side comparison.

However we have to do some further technical tests right now (which I will do today). Like I said, we will publish more info soon :-)



Regards,
Ekkehart

But to get the mod will we have to buy the projector through you or send it half way around the world for you to install it?

Or is it a kit we can buy from you and install ourselves?

With our mod, the HC5000 is almost on par with the Pearl, no joke. We did some side by side comparison.

However we have to do some further technical tests right now (which I will do today). Like I said, we will publish more info soon :-)



Regards,
Ekkehart



Does any of this improve shadow detail or just black levels only ?

But to get the mod will we have to buy the projector through you or send it half way around the world for you to install it?

Or is it a kit we can buy from you and install ourselves?

Great question.

But to get the mod will we have to buy the projector through you or send it half way around the world for you to install it?

Or is it a kit we can buy from you and install ourselves?


I doubt it's anything mechanical.. I'd bet it's tinkering with the firmware similar to the Ruby.

...can this mod or anything similar be used with the Epson 1080 or Panasonic 1000?

Does any of this improve shadow detail or just black levels only ?



Another great question.

This news just make me uneasy with anticipation. Hope it does not take more than a week to post the much awaited tweak.

Since it has been over a month since Cine4Home announced the existance of this mod, you might be waiting quite a bit. It must be somewhat involving, based on the delay in posting the howto. I think all of us Mitsubishi owners are interested in what the modification is and how it works.

I hope it isn't the equivalent of a 12v leaf blower DIY turbo charger for a civic.

I'm running the latest firmware, 3.0 (unless somebody has something newer). The dynamic iris performance could be made such that it isn't as noticable, but it really doesn't bother me. I don't think anybody coming in to watch a movie would even notice it; and if they did notice it, they would just assume it's part of the movie since everything else is so darn good. Now that I know what a dynamic iris does, I bet I could spot it's operation on any display device that has it. Most won't notice, however, and it gives the manufacturers some bragging rights about "virtual" contrast ratios. The RS1 has great contrast ratios without the need for a dynamic iris and I think this technology will prevail. Until it does, I'm quite happy with my Mitsubishi.

I just purchased this model. Is there a primer on how to install the firmware and where it can be downloaded?

I'm afraid you have to send it in... :-(

But I'm curious - if you just bought it, how come it doesn't have the latest firmware? :)

Don't know what it has, yet. Just checking. I just opened it and am going to check. Thanks for the reply.

Question to all HC5000 owners:

What made you choose the HC5000 over the pearl?

Is it the 'POP' of the pictures?

The sharpness of the Mitsubishi, a significantly lower street price, the higher lumen output than the Sony especially when ceiling mounted, the Mitsibishi can do 1080p over component, the Mitsibishi is quieter, and the fact that it isn't a Sony (a personal bios).

I saw nothing that made the Pearl a better choice.

Picture: Mitsubishi
Lumens: Mitsubishi
Noise: Mitsubishi
Cost: Mitsibishi

Sony has the LCoS technology, versus plain old inoraganic LCD. Pixel structure can be less evident on the Sony, but at normal seating distances, the differences could not outweigh the benefits of the Mitsubishi for me.

The only projector that looks better than the Mitsibishi is the RS1. If that projector had a 12v trigger, I would have seriously considered it. Not having that feature meant a rip apart of drywall as I only ran a 12v trigger to the projector, I didn't think that a projector would ever exist without it. If I were to do this room again, I would have added another possible trigger source at the AV rack location. My receiver can do a 12v trigger as well.

The sharpness of the Mitsubishi, a significantly lower street price, the higher lumen output than the Sony especially when ceiling mounted, the Mitsibishi can do 1080p over component, the Mitsibishi is quieter, and the fact that it isn't a Sony (a personal bios).

I saw nothing that made the Pearl a better choice.

Picture: Mitsubishi
Lumens: Mitsubishi
Noise: Mitsubishi
Cost: Mitsibishi

Sony has the LCoS technology, versus plain old inoraganic LCD. Pixel structure can be less evident on the Sony, but at normal seating distances, the differences could not outweigh the benefits of the Mitsubishi for me.

The only projector that looks better than the Mitsibishi is the RS1. If that projector had a 12v trigger, I would have seriously considered it. Not having that feature meant a rip apart of drywall as I only ran a 12v trigger to the projector, I didn't think that a projector would ever exist without it. If I were to do this room again, I would have added another possible trigger source at the AV rack location. My receiver can do a 12v trigger as well.

Add to that, 5000hrs. lamp life in low mode and smaller size and weight, which may be important to some, including me.

Add to that, 5000hrs. lamp life in low mode and smaller size and weight, which may be important to some, including me.

Hmm... I'm not so sure the lamp life of 5K hours is accurate or truthful. :rolleyes:

Hmm... I'm not so sure the lamp life of 5K hours is accurate or truthful. :rolleyes:
So why would they lie when most of the competition quotes 2-3K hours?
Remember it's a 160W lamp running in low mode to acheive this. Incidentally I find this sufficiently bright for my taste on a 92" diag matte white screen with a 1.0 gain. and a throw of appx. 11' 6". I have white walls and ceiling and the image quality is awsome on Sin City HD. The resolution is unbelievable and the blacks are plenty black enough for me. I rarely notice the adaptive iris even on auto2. At the price (in the UK) I don't see how this PJ can be beaten.
It's all subjective of course and I am sure people will say what about the Sony Pearl, only a few hundred £'s more. I must admit I haven't seen one perform,but every time I read about the apparent image softness it puts me off, because image sharpness is very high on my priority list. Every review I have read of the Mits. praises the image sharpness.

So why would they lie when most of the competition quotes 2-3K hours?
Remember it's a 160W lamp running in low mode to acheive this. Incidentally I find this sufficiently bright for my taste on a 92" diag matte white screen with a 1.0 gain. and a throw of appx. 11' 6". I have white walls and ceiling and the image quality is awsome on Sin City HD. The resolution is unbelievable and the blacks are plenty black enough for me. I rarely notice the adaptive iris even on auto2. At the price (in the UK) I don't see how this PJ can be beaten.
It's all subjective of course and I am sure people will say what about the Sony Pearl, only a few hundred £'s more. I must admit I haven't seen one perform,but every time I read about the apparent image softness it puts me off, because image sharpness is very high on my priority list. Every review I have read of the Mits. praises the image sharpness.

Apparently, you haven't heard of creative advertising... ;)

Apparently, you haven't heard of creative advertising... ;)
To be honest with you I will probably change my lamp after about 2000hours anyway to bring back that original brightness. Time will tell.

To be honest with you I will probably change my lamp after about 2000hours anyway to bring back that original brightness. Time will tell.

I own an old Mits LCD with over 5000 hour on its bulb and even though its not that bright anymore. Its still watchable to my eyes and the PJ hasn't failed me yet. Mits makes great projectors and if it wasn't for the JVC I'd be enjoying the 5000 rite now.

I own an old Mits LCD with over 5000 hour on its bulb and even though its not that bright anymore. Its still watchable to my eyes and the PJ hasn't failed me yet. Mits makes great projectors and if it wasn't for the JVC I'd be enjoying the 5000 rite now.
That's encouraging to hear about the lamp life. If I hadn't jumped for the HC5000 so quickly I would have been tempted by the RS1, but it is £1200 dearer in the UK than the Mits.
Anyway lets see what Cine4Home come up with on the mods.

Holy crap. Did anyone see how much the Mits is going for in Japan lately? PJ has it listed for $2,2xx! I hope with recent Epson announcement of a <$3K 1080p projector that we can start to enjoy some of these rock bottom prices in the states too!
-Matt

Holy crap. Did anyone see how much the Mits is going for in Japan lately? PJ has it listed for $2,2xx! I hope with recent Epson announcement of a <$3K 1080p projector that we can start to enjoy some of these rock bottom prices in the states too!
-Matt

Wow, that is quite a lot lower. Interesting. When did that change? Because... the Island Arc dudes are on vacation. Hopefully somebody hasn't hacked into the site and played a joke. I hope the price of the Mitsubishi and Epson drops at many of it's retail sources :)

HD DVD does not play at 1080p with component out from XBox360. Only for games/menus etc. Once the movie starts, it switches to 1080i.

While the HD DVD is playing.. go to the HC5000 Menu and select the last tab (Info). It shd be 1920x1080 30Hz.

It only plays 1080p for HD DVD over VGA.

Doesn't the Xbox 360 HD DVD display 1080i over component?

Doesn't the Xbox 360 HD DVD display 1080i over component?

Xbox 360 does 1080p and 1080i over component for games/dashboard/pictures; however, you can't play back HD-DVD over component, it must go out on VGA. Lame. The new version, the Xbox 360 ^2, will have HDMI to get rid of that nonsense.

Xbox 360 does 1080p and 1080i over component for games/dashboard/pictures; however, you can't play back HD-DVD over component, it must go out on VGA. Lame. The new version, the Xbox 360 ^2, will have HDMI to get rid of that nonsense.
I'm pretty sure that is incorrect. You CAN playback HD-DVD over component or VGA. The reason people use VGA is that you can't upconvert standard DVDs to 720p or 1080i using component. Upconversion not allowed over component as per the (stupid) requirements of the DVD Forum.
-Matt

Doesn't the Xbox 360 HD DVD display 1080i over component?
So the answer to your question is yes. But it won't upscale regular DVDs to that resolution.
-Matt

Wow, that is quite a lot lower. Interesting. When did that change? Because... the Island Arc dudes are on vacation. Hopefully somebody hasn't hacked into the site and played a joke.
Hmmm... price is back up to $2,5xx. I doubt they were hacked though. They automatically pull the lowest price from kakaku.com and tack on their 5%+ shipping. If you click through the link, the lowest price is 263,770 yen which seems to jive with the lower $2,2xx price from earlier.

Anyway, prices can't come down soon enough!
-Matt

Hello:

I would be interested in any screen recommendations you have for the 5000.

I will be using a wall or ceiling mounted electric screen.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Splotto

Hello,

...just a not so quick note for those who may have had, or will have, a similar problem...

after 15 hours of viewing, a 4" green blob appeared during very dark scene...
after 50 hours of viewing another 4" green blob appeared during very dark scene...

I was about to hit the panic button and spend the dreaded $350 to send it back to PJ only to find out from their site that they were on holidays... After looking at the Cine4home site I was infused with false technological bravado and was fully prepared to take the thing appart and blow some compressed air at my 2 culprits. Before I took such drastic measures I merely popped off the air filter aimed my compressed air towards the lens through one of the little grill holes and just like magic they were GONE!!! Though I've read this thing had sealed optics and LCDs I've reached 2 conclusions... either they aren't sealed, or that the "blobs" some of us have been experiencing aren't dust on the green LCD panel. Either way, before shipping the thing back for warranty work, do yourself a favor... run a quick test... pick up a $5 can of compressed air and take the 2 seconds to pop the air filter off the side of the unit and give it a shot.

well, thanks for your time... I just had to take a minute to share my joy and relief. I'm now off to experience the true wonder this light machine truely is.

Holy crap. Did anyone see how much the Mits is going for in Japan lately? PJ has it listed for $2,2xx! I hope with recent Epson announcement of a <$3K 1080p projector that we can start to enjoy some of these rock bottom prices in the states too!
-Matt

Hi, Matt,

I think you made it wrong. The price is US$2,5XX instead of US$2,2XX.

If this isn't right to post let me know, but can I assume that the LVP-HC5000 is the same as the one we get in the states?

If I have this figured out, it seems I can import one? What are the risks, can anyone PM the information.

I have the HD1000u and I would like to step up to 1080p.

Here in the Philippines, I imported one from Hong Kong. The customs duty and vat here totaled 22%. I had them declare a value lower than the actual price I paid.

Its the same unit except its white.

Hello:

I would be interested in any screen recommendations you have for the 5000.

I will be using a wall or ceiling mounted electric screen.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Splotto


What color are your walls and ceiling? Any ambient light? These two conditions are important to selecting a screen.

With our mod, the HC5000 is almost on par with the Pearl, no joke. We did some side by side comparison.

However we have to do some further technical tests right now (which I will do today). Like I said, we will publish more info soon :-)



Regards,
Ekkehart


Still no word from Ekkehart... :(

What color are your walls and ceiling? Any ambient light? These two conditions are important to selecting a screen.

I have a room which is browns and caramel, a small window. With the lights off the screen is watchable but with the lights on the screen is barely watchable but then I do have 4 uplighters on and that gives out alot of light in the room.

I have a room which is browns and caramel, a small window. With the lights off the screen is watchable but with the lights on the screen is barely watchable but then I do have 4 uplighters on and that gives out alot of light in the room.

You should contact Jason, of AVS, and ask him about a DaLite High Power screen. The manual pulldown Model C (or the less expensive Model B) are very reasonably priced.

What color are your walls and ceiling? Any ambient light? These two conditions are important to selecting a screen.

Hello:

Here are some pics of the room I am planning on using.

The walls are beige and the ceiling is white.

The screen will cover the one window (with some curtains for the windows above and I will be using curtains over the sliders.

Thanks,
Splotto

Hello:

Here are some pics of the room I am planning on using.

The walls are beige and the ceiling is white.

The screen will cover the one window (with some curtains for the windows above and I will be using curtains over the sliders.

Thanks,
Splotto

See my response #1420 - same suggestion applies.

See my response #1420 - same suggestion applies.

Thanks. I had sent him a PM last week and am waiting to hear from him.

Splotto

Man, that cine4home tweak would go really good right about now :p

..and I'd love to know if it can be applied to other pj's like the Epson :cool:

Man, that cine4home tweak would go really good right about now :p

..and I'd love to know if it can be applied to other pj's like the Epson :cool:


Hello together,

We will publish our tuning-special this week (with some luck tomorrow). Sorry for the big delay. We tried to cooperate with the projector-manufacturor to make this special mod more easily available for people around the world, but that failed unfortunately (you can guess why). Instead, we just lost all these weeks of time.

In other words, we have to start it now by ourselves as OUR goal at last is to give options of great improvement in contrast, the weak point of the HC5000. Being enthusiasts like you guys, we dont care about "politics"...

On thing: You have to open the HC5000 for this mod, so for countries outside Germany it would be helpful to find technical skilfull partners to do the mod (they need calibration software like colorfacts too). If you guys have any ideas, let me know.

:)

Regards,
Ekkehart

more details to come ;-)

On thing: You have to open the HC5000 for this mod, so for countries outside Germany it would be helpful to find technical skilfull partners to do the mod (they need calibration software like colorfacts too). If you guys have any ideas, let me know.

:)

Regards,
Ekkehart

more details to come ;-)

Not surprisingly the unit has to be opened. I doubt very much if anyone in the UK would offer this service. Since we are all EU partners could we not ship to you?

Hello together,

We will publish our tuning-special this week (with some luck tomorrow). Sorry for the big delay. We tried to cooperate with the projector-manufacturor to make this special mod more easily available for people around the world, but that failed unfortunately (you can guess why). Instead, we just lost all these weeks of time.

In other words, we have to start it now by ourselves as OUR goal at last is to give options of great improvement in contrast, the weak point of the HC5000. Being enthusiasts like you guys, we dont care about "politics"...

On thing: You have to open the HC5000 for this mod, so for countries outside Germany it would be helpful to find technical skilfull partners to do the mod (they need calibration software like colorfacts too). If you guys have any ideas, let me know.

:)

Regards,
Ekkehart

more details to come ;-)

Sounds interesting. I am curious as to what it is you do and why it is a unique mod to the Mits and/or can it be done to other projectors.

Hello together,

We will publish our tuning-special this week (with some luck tomorrow). Sorry for the big delay. We tried to cooperate with the projector-manufacturor to make this special mod more easily available for people around the world, but that failed unfortunately (you can guess why). Instead, we just lost all these weeks of time.

In other words, we have to start it now by ourselves as OUR goal at last is to give options of great improvement in contrast, the weak point of the HC5000. Being enthusiasts like you guys, we dont care about "politics"...

On thing: You have to open the HC5000 for this mod, so for countries outside Germany it would be helpful to find technical skilfull partners to do the mod (they need calibration software like colorfacts too). If you guys have any ideas, let me know.

:)

Regards,
Ekkehart

more details to come ;-)


Hi Ekkehart:

I'm wondering approximately how much time is involved performing this mod.
Thank you!

Rich

I think I can manage doing this MOD as long as there is a detailed step by step instruction. Have colorfacts 7.0 coming my way too.

http://www.hometheaterblog.com/

just posted a great review of the Mits.

http://www.hometheaterblog.com/

just posted a great review of the Mits.


Yes, the review was excellent. Just as an aside this reviewer (Greenway) gave the Mits a very good opinion of it's ability to display blacks whereas the reviewer in Ultimate A/V didn't. Also Greenway didn't make any mention of the auto iris so I'm wondering if his unit had the latest firmware which may have improved the auto iris function so it's a non-issue.

http://ultimateavmag.com/videoprojectors/107mits5000/

Not surprisingly the unit has to be opened. I doubt very much if anyone in the UK would offer this service. Since we are all EU partners could we not ship to you?


Sure, in Europe, shipping is no problem at all, as we dont have any Import / Export tax issues. No big deal. I was more referring to the US.


Regards,
Ekkehart

Yes, the review was excellent. Just as an aside this reviewer (Greenway) gave the Mits a very good opinion of it's ability to display blacks whereas the reviewer in Ultimate A/V didn't. Also Greenway didn't make any mention of the auto iris so I'm wondering if his unit had the latest firmware which may have improved the auto iris function so it's a non-issue.

http://ultimateavmag.com/videoprojectors/107mits5000/The UAV reviewer was Tech Ed Shane Buettner. I corresponded with him for a while as I was planning to get an HC5000, but his negative review put me off. In private he was quite critical, and said he would chose a Pearl in an instant. His problem seemed to be the visible operation of the AI, rather than the blacks themselves, which seem to look and measure reasonably well with AI. I asked about the firmware on his test unit, but he didn't know. He got in touch with Mitsubishi, who told him that there wasn't a firmware upgrade that would improve the problem. It seems that some people may be senstive to it, and others don't notice. I think I might be tempted to take a gamble, considering how little they are available for now.

Nick

The UAV reviewer was Tech Ed Shane Buettner. I corresponded with him for a while as I was planning to get an HC5000, but his negative review put me off. In private he was quite critical, and said he would chose a Pearl in an instant. His problem seemed to be the visible operation of the AI, rather than the blacks themselves, which seem to look and measure reasonably well with AI. I asked about the firmware on his test unit, but he didn't know. He got in touch with Mitsubishi, who told him that there wasn't a firmware upgrade that would improve the problem. It seems that some people may be senstive to it, and others don't notice. I think I might be tempted to take a gamble, considering how little they are available for now.

Nick



The operation of the AI is emphasized by the scatterd light in the lighpath of the HC5000. We observed that, as soon as you reduce scattered light in the optics, the operation of AI is far less visible and hardly noticable at all in the Auto1 mode.


Regards,
Ekkehart

The operation of the AI is emphasized by the scatterd light in the lighpath of the HC5000. We observed that, as soon as you reduce scattered light in the optics, the operation of AI is far less visible and hardly noticable at all in the Auto1 mode.


Regards,
Ekkehart


Hi Ekkehart:

So is it this mod you are proposing?

Rich

Man, that cine4home tweak would go really good right about now :p

..and I'd love to know if it can be applied to other pj's like the Epson :cool:



No, we dont think so...

Regards,
Ekkehart

Does it improve the shadow detail as well ?

The operation of the AI is emphasized by the scatterd light in the lighpath of the HC5000. We observed that, as soon as you reduce scattered light in the optics, the operation of AI is far less visible and hardly noticable at all in the Auto1 mode.

Regards,
EkkehartCan't wait to hear about this. Are you able to improve ANSI contrast with iris open or closed? That could make the MC5K irresistable, especially if the DI becomes less obvious.

Nick

Hello together,

We will publish our tuning-special this week (with some luck tomorrow). Sorry for the big delay. We tried to cooperate with the projector-manufacturor to make this special mod more easily available for people around the world, but that failed unfortunately (you can guess why). Instead, we just lost all these weeks of time.

In other words, we have to start it now by ourselves as OUR goal at last is to give options of great improvement in contrast, the weak point of the HC5000. Being enthusiasts like you guys, we dont care about "politics"...

On thing: You have to open the HC5000 for this mod, so for countries outside Germany it would be helpful to find technical skilfull partners to do the mod (they need calibration software like colorfacts too). If you guys have any ideas, let me know.

:)

Regards,
Ekkehart

more details to come ;-)


Is there something less expensive than Colorfacts that we could use to calibrate if we decide to tackle this on our own?

Cinehome's article on the 5000 mod is up. VERY IMPRESSIVE!

Cinehome's article on the 5000 mod is up. VERY IMPRESSIVE!

A link would be helpful.......

http://www.cine4home.de/

You'll need babelfish!

You'll need babelfish!


And even then it difficult to comprehend!! :confused:

Ekkehart,

I just read the c4h HC5000 tuning special. Very nice work.
Seems like a significant improvement over the stock unit and I like the new 'Ultra' name :cool:


Here's a translated link to anyone wanting to read it.

HC5000 Tuning -translated link (http://64.233.179.104/translate_c?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&langpair=de%7Cen&u=http://www.cine4home.de/Tuning/HC5000Ultra/HC5000Ultra.htm&prev=/language_tools)

Joe

Translated link does not appear in English?

This projector appears to sell new for under $3k on eBay. Is this too good to be true or is this representative of the street price?

Thanks

try the link again, comes up in english for me.

If it doesn't on your end, try clearing your browser cache and then reclick the link.

I read the tuning article(sort of) but there are things that I don't understand:

Where can you get the glass filter and how much?

Where are the internal controls of the HC5000 in relation to the bias and gain at its bright mode?

Should the PJ be sent to Germany for the MOD or can they just send the screen filter and have an illustrated step by step instruction included? Who will do the MOD and for how much?

Alvin

I read the tuning article(sort of) but there are things that I don't understand:

Where can you get the glass filter and how much?

Where are the internal controls of the HC5000 in relation to the bias and gain at its bright mode?

Should the PJ be sent to Germany for the MOD or can they just send the screen filter and have an illustrated step by step instruction included? Who will do the MOD and for how much?

Alvin



As we mentioned, this is not an easy mod everybody could do. That is why it would be very uselful, if we find international professional partners, who could do the mod.

We really do NOT recommend, that you open up your projector and especially the optics, if you have no experience with that. You can easily get scratches, finger prints etc. on the glas parts. Some might not even get the optics back together.

If there is a skilfull dealer / technician / calibrator who thinks he has enough experience to do that mod, PM me and we might do some sort of cooperation.


Regards,
Ekkehart

Can't wait to hear about this. Are you able to improve ANSI contrast with iris open or closed? That could make the MC5K irresistable, especially if the DI becomes less obvious.

Nick



We improve the Intra Scene contrast by a significant margin (dont mix that up with ANSI, not the same).

The DI becomes less obvious, reason is simple: When the DI closes, it reduces scattered light in the lightpath. However, as we already reduce scattered light to a minimum with our Iris in the optics, the DI does not provoke such a big brightness difference anymore = far less obvious.

By the way: The "HC5000 Ultra Edition" with a turned off DI (Off) still looks better than a normal HC5000 in Auto Iris2-Mode. No joke...


Regards,
Ekkehart

Great work Ekkehart! :eek:
It seems the Mitsu Ultra now is better than Pearl!
What about Mitsu Ultra - JVC HD1? still great difference?

Great work Ekkehart! :eek:
It seems the Mitsu Ultra now is better than Pearl!
What about Mitsu Ultra - JVC HD1? still great difference?


The HD1 with its native contrast is still leading yes ;-)

I hope the Mitsubishi engineers will take up your optimizations for their next gen processor(s)?

I love people who are never content with the way things are and actually put their minds and skills to improving them.

Great work.

Dammit I am in Singapore :(

I just saw the HD1 last week and somehow my HC5000 has lost a tad of its lustre :P Wish there was someone who could do this in my part of the world :(

As we mentioned, this is not an easy mod everybody could do. That is why it would be very uselful, if we find international professional partners, who could do the mod.

We really do NOT recommend, that you open up your projector and especially the optics, if you have no experience with that. You can easily get scratches, finger prints etc. on the glas parts. Some might not even get the optics back together.

If there is a skilfull dealer / technician / calibrator who thinks he has enough experience to do that mod, PM me and we might do some sort of cooperation.


Regards,
Ekkehart


I hope you'll provide an English translation in the near future.

I hope you'll provide an English translation in the near future.

Doh, it looks like I can't post a link yet, but try the google translator. I copied the link and it translated the entire page in fairly readable english.

nice job cine4home!!!

So, I'm very intereste and I'm in Europe (Spain, Mallorca). How's the process? Can anyone (erupoean) ship the proj. to you to "buy" the mod? How much is it?

If you don't want to say this in public. Who can we e-mail to ask this questions, at least in english?

Thanks

nice job cine4home!!!

So, I'm very intereste and I'm in Europe (Spain, Mallorca). How's the process? Can anyone (erupoean) ship the proj. to you to "buy" the mod? How much is it?

If you don't want to say this in public. Who can we e-mail to ask this questions, at least in english?

Thanks


Hi there,

You can email questions to my colleague Karsten Becker, info@dvdplayer.de

He speaks english, dont worry.

Regards,
Ekkehart

Translated Link (bablefish) (http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=de_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cine4home.de%2FTuning%2FHC5000Ultra%2FH C5000Ultra.htm)

Quick summary
1. Stock HC5000: 720:1 native contrast, ~3,000:1 w/auto iris
Iris changes are visible.

2. HC5000 with glass filter and tuning: 1,300:1 native
Better but still has a very 'LCD' look (a little washed out).

3. HC5000, internal mod + glass filter and tuning: 2,000:1 native, 9,500:1 auto
Iris almost totally invisible now. Compared side by side with Sony VW50 (Pearl) and it looks very close. For comparison, the Pearl measured 2,200:1 native, 10,500:1 with the iris. The Pearl still has a slightly better iris implementation but the HC5000 has HQV processing and is sharper.

Side by side shot with a stock HC5000 on the left, and a modified one on the right, no auto irises used on either... WOW!

http://www.cine4home.de/Tuning/HC5000Ultra/Bild14.jpg

Enjoy!
-Matt

P.S. I really hope someone in the US takes Ekkehart up on his offer so this mod can be made available here!

I have to add the information that this picture was taken without any DI-tricks (Auto Iris: Off) - on both machines...

;)

And please consider that the appearence of the screenshots varies depending on the settings of your Computer monitor...


And: The native D65-contrast of the HC5000 Ultra is 2000:1;
2200:1 was the Pearl

Regards,
Ekkehart

I have to add the information that this picture was taken without any DI-tricks (Auto Iris: Off) - on both machines...

;)

And please consider that the appearence of the screenshots varies depending on the settings of your Computer monitor...


And: The native D65-contrast of the HC5000 Ultra is 2000:1;
2200:1 was the Pearl

Regards,
Ekkehart

Thanks. Fixed above...

Ekkehart-
How about changes in brightness during this tuning/mod process? These were your original results from the first HC5000 test...

http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/7639/mitswq4.jpg

With the tuning and mods, is it brighter or darker? Also, what the CR measurements in the more aggressive iris mode 'Auto 2'? If 'Auto 1' went from 3,000:1 to 9,500:1... I can't wait to hear what 'Auto 2' is up to, even if it is more visible.

Thanks again!
-Matt

I have to add the information that this picture was taken without any DI-tricks (Auto Iris: Off) - on both machines...

;)

And please consider that the appearence of the screenshots varies depending on the settings of your Computer monitor...


And: The native D65-contrast of the HC5000 Ultra is 2000:1;
2200:1 was the Pearl

Regards,
Ekkehart

I suppose I'm not the first person who said previously "Why isn't there a manual iris on these projectors like in the Hitachi, Sony and Sanyo etc"... and now we know it is definitely a desirable feature.

Ok, just to clarify:

The HC5000 Ultra is 2000:1 native with no auto-iris and 9500:1 with auto iris? ...and the auto iris is no longer as noticeable as before? I would also be interested in the lumens. EDIT - Also very curious about more detailed observations of black level and shadow details etc. Perhaps the original chart can be revised too :cool:

If the above is correct, the native value of 2000:1 seems quite incredible and unbelievable. I'm not doubting so much as expressing my surprise at such extreme results. From 720:1 to 2000:1. That's like two different universes when it comes to an lcd projector. This makes the Ultra the best lcd projector yet in terms of native contrast.

If somebody would perform this mod for HC5000 owners for a reasonable fee, I'm sure there would be interest. Still, warranty issues would be a concern.

I hope the Mitsubishi engineers will take up your optimizations for their next gen processor(s)?

So do I. It shouldn't be difficult for Mitsubishi to modify the Mits HC5000 to come up with the same results for the subsequent production run. May be Mitsubishi ought to give Cine4Home a percentage of the sales for the idea... :)

Ekkehart,
Can you share exactly what lens filter you are using?
Excellent mod!

So do I. It shouldn't be difficult for Mitsubishi to modify the Mits HC5000 to come up with the same results for the subsequent production run. May be Mitsubishi ought to give Cine4Home a percentage of the sales for the idea... :)



Well we showed them the HC 5000 Ultra and they were quite amazed. They were stunned you could say...

:D


Regards,
Ekkehart

This is depressing knowing our HC5000's are capable of so much more and having no real way to mod them ourselves barring expertise and/or a trip to Germany... :(

Same here also in the Philippines. I know there are only a handful of HC5000 owners here. It won't be practical to make a MOD for this PJ and earn something from the effort.

I would be willing to do it myself with the help of my friend who repair camcorders. I think we can do the MOD but for personal pleasure only.

I imagine the HC5000 would look better than the Epson TW1000 now. I wonder how they would compare in the real world?

I imagine the HC5000 would look better than the Epson TW1000 now. I wonder how they would compare in the real world?



Compared to the TW1000 I saw so far, the HC5000 Ultra is brighter @D65 for example.


Regards,
Ekkehart

This is depressing knowing our HC5000's are capable of so much more and having no real way to mod them ourselves barring expertise and/or a trip to Germany... :(


I understand your frustration. But at least in the US it should be possible to find someone, who is able to mod the projector and do the calibration via colorfacts?

Come on guys... there are so many competent people in this forum...

:o

Ekkehart

Compared to the TW1000 I saw so far, the HC5000 Ultra is brighter @D65 for example.


Regards,
Ekkehart

Ok, and with those contrast numbers, does the Mits Ultra's picture also visibley look like it has much better black levels and contrast compared to the image thrown by the Epson?

Compared to the TW1000 I saw so far, the HC5000 Ultra is brighter @D65 for example.

Regards,
Ekkehart
Hmmm.... I'm still trying to figure out what that might mean for stock HC5000 vs. HC5000 Ultra comparison in terms of brightness? Here is what you had measured for the TW1000:

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/5117/epsonrf0.jpg

Even if the Ultra is calibrated to D65 and is brighter than the TW1000, it might still be dimmer than a stock HC5000... no? Sorry to press you on this, but brightness is very important to me. I want to make sure it is still close!

Thanks again for all your hard work.

And someone PLEASE take Ekkehart up on his offer already!!! Darin, Mark H, Tom H, William P... anyone?

-Matt

Hmmm.... I'm still trying to figure out what that might mean for stock HC5000 vs. HC5000 Ultra comparison in terms of brightness? Here is what you had measured for the TW1000:



Even if the Ultra is calibrated to D65 and is brighter than the TW1000, it might still be dimmer than a stock HC5000... no? Sorry to press you on this, but brightness is very important to me. I want to make sure it is still close!

Thanks again for all your hard work.

And someone PLEASE take Ekkehart up on his offer already!!! Darin, Mark H, Tom H, William P... anyone?

-Matt


Written in the text, ok you might have overseen it due to the bablefish translation :-)

Brightness loss is about 20% in the same lampmode.

Regards,
Ekkehart

Written in the text, ok you might have overseen it due to the bablefish translation :-)

Brightness loss is about 20% in the same lampmode.

Regards,
Ekkehart
Sorry, I did miss it.

So calibrated lumens would roughly 350 in low bulb mode, or 480 in high mode. Got it. Thanks again.
-Matt

Ok, I re-read it and caught the 20% deally. Seems ok compared to the lumens of the Epson TW1000.

I just took a look at the projektor-tuning.de website, and saw pretty much the same page as on C4H. There's a shipping address and conditions for doing the work, and a price - 399 Euros. That's about GBP270 or USD530 at the moment, or about 20% of the value of the projector. Does that sound like a reasonable charge to people?

I still find it scarcely credible that such an enormous improvement can be found from what I imagined to be a very thoroughly developed piece of equipment. I know this isn't never-never land, and products have to get to market before the competition and all that, but since contrast is such a marketing driver, I had expected manaufacturers to squeeze every drop out of their products.

What Ekkehart was describing sounded like a three-fold improvement in contrast. Sounded like the improvements were both inter-scene AND intra-scene contrast. Going by his clear and comprehensive contrast measurements in his original test, this improvement should take the Mits to the top of the class. Hell of a step.

Nick

The price converted from Euos to CDN $ is, $6,140 CDN. can you get the RS1 for less than this in Canada? The Euro price in £GBP is £2,714 which is about £40 more than I paid for my HC5000 online. It seems to be the standard MRSP. there isn't any competition on price for this model in the UK, at least not when I bought mine about 2 months ago.

I just took a look at the projektor-tuning.de website, and saw pretty much the same page as on C4H. There's a shipping address and conditions for doing the work, and a price - 399 Euros. That's about GBP270 or USD530 at the moment, or about 20% of the value of the projector. Does that sound like a reasonable charge to people?

Nick
Then there is shipping and insurance cost to and from Germany and the unknown effect on warranty. I think I would like an assurance from Mitsubishi that the warranty would not be voided, or alternatively the price to include a replacement warranty otherwise it's too much of a risk. I would rather keep it as it is for a couple of years then trade up to the latest and greatest PJ in my price bracket.
I am very pleased with my HC5000. I have white walls and ceiling so I don't get the best contrast when there is the worst case scenario of 50/50 bright and dark mixed scenes. I don't notice the dynamic iris much and it certainly doesn't bother me and I use Auto Iris2 mostly. The image quality still wows me in HD even after getting used to it for 2 months.

The price converted from Euos to CDN $ is, $6,140 CDN. can you get the RS1 for less than this in Canada? The Euro price in £GBP is £2,714 which is about £40 more than I paid for my HC5000 online. It seems to be the standard MRSP. there isn't any competition on price for this model in the UK, at least not when I bought mine about 2 months ago.
This post was in response to a post from a Canadian member Which I can no longer see

I think there would be no question that the Mits warranty would be voided. It's not an easy decision, but when you see how excited everbody gets about the JVC, which only has double the contrast to set it apart in performance and price, that puts an interesting perspective on it.

Ekkehart - I wonder if you could explain the relationship betwen Cine4Home and projektor-tuning?

Nick

sounds very interesting indeed. It would be really useful to see a fully working ultra model reviewed on cine4home or even better another expert to put it through its paces,

any downsides to this other than the 20% drop in brightness. How much of a factor is this loss bearing in mind its not exactly a light cannon to start off with

so is this effectively a dual iris type system, one fixed one variable?

This post was in response to a post from a Canadian member Which I can no longer see

Yeah, I had gone to their main sales website and saw their price for the pre-tuned projectors for sale and mis-understood. The tuning website shows the price for the mod alone as 399.00 Euro's. They also sell pre-modded HC5000's for around 10 times the the cost of the mod. That's where my mistake came in.

sounds very interesting indeed. It would be really useful to see a fully working ultra model reviewed on cine4home or even better another expert to put it through its paces,

any downsides to this other than the 20% drop in brightness. How much of a factor is this loss bearing in mind its not exactly a light cannon to start off with

so is this effectively a dual iris type system, one fixed one variable?

I don't think you can adjust the additional iris, can you?

I wouldn't look at the 20% drop in brightness as a concern. The Mitsubishi with mods and higher contrast has higher lumens in each bulb mode vs the Epson 1000.

My concern is with risk. The Mitsubishi already has some issues with the weird banding. To get the mod done, and then use the projector and have issues, then you'd have to send it in to have it repaired and you'd have warranty nightmares. Either you'd have to return the projector back to normal to send it in, and/or just pay for the repairs. Maybe this mod makes more sense for after warranty to extend the life of the projector? Unless....unless the places that do the mod take over the warranty service for whatever warranty remains on the projector?

All in all, this is a crazy mod that just teases me because while it sounds amazing, giving contrast performance I didn't think was possible at the moment, and it doesn't seem like something I can do or have done in a very practical way without losing warranty. Let's hope all the projector manufacturers see this and it affects their projector design and manufacture.

It sounds like the mod might be quite robust. The hard work was probably done in finding which pair of lens elements to fit the fixed iris between - that would correspond to the focal plane of the lens - where the iris would be fitted on a camera, for example. My take is that the new iris is fixed, but it stil allows the dynamic iris to be used normally.

I think my only concern would be whether that plane moved backwards and forwards during focusing and zooming, so C4H's results were only valid for one throw distance or for one zoom setting. They did find, remember, that the DLA-RS1 had a strong correlation and compromise between brightness and contrast and the zoom setting.

A 20% drop in brightness can't be a bad price to pay for 200% better contrast - I imagine pictures would pop off the screen at lower light levels. If it as good as it sounds, even ANSI contrast should go up from mediocre to amazing.

I'd really like to see a FULL set of contrast (and brightness) measurements with all the different combinations of lamp setting, zoom setting, Auto Iris setting, and colour temperature. Like they did with the excellent original test. Sorry for asking so much.

I just want to know who is going to be the first to get this done.

Me???

Nick

It sounds like the mod might be quite robust. The hard work was probably done in finding which pair of lens elements to fit the fixed iris between - that would correspond to the focal plane of the lens - where the iris would be fitted on a camera, for example. My take is that the new iris is fixed, but it stil allows the dynamic iris to be used normally.

I think my only concern would be whether that plane moved backwards and forwards during focusing and zooming, so C4H's results were only valid for one throw distance or for one zoom setting. They did find, remember, that the DLA-RS1 had a strong correlation and compromise between brightness and contrast and the zoom setting.

A 20% drop in brightness can't be a bad price to pay for 200% better contrast - I imagine pictures would pop off the screen at lower light levels. If it as good as it sounds, even ANSI contrast should go up from mediocre to amazing.

I'd really like to see a FULL set of contrast (and brightness) measurements with all the different combinations of lamp setting, zoom setting, Auto Iris setting, and colour temperature. Like they did with the excellent original test. Sorry for asking so much.

I just want to know who is going to be the first to get this done.

Me???

Nick

Right. Testing the contrast and lumens for all settings and modes and zoom/throw combinations is a great idea. This seems like an unreal mod. What is the highest native contrast of an lcd projector so far? Was it the Sony HS-60 and what was it at it's best?

EDIT - I think the Sony reached 2000:1 native AND it's iris wasn't very noticable.

Right. Testing the contrast and lumens for all settings and modes and zoom/throw combinations is a great idea. This seems like an unreal mod. What is the highest native contrast of an lcd projector so far? Was it the Sony HS-60 and what was it at it's best?

EDIT - I think the Sony reached 2000:1 native AND it's iris wasn't very noticable.


Sure, we can do that for you :) And dont worry, the mod is real.

And you are right, a tuned HS60 reached 2000:1 native contrast too. We have the AW15 from Sony now in our hands, lets see what this machine can do ;) It looks like an improved HS60 actually.

LCD is not so far behind anymore regarding contrast, well at least if you optimize the lightpath accordingly ;)


Regards,
Ekkehart

Could you supply the mod in kit form complete with instructions on how to disassemble the pj and lens assembly etc? It would allow those that felt they could do it themselves to benefit without having to wait for a dealer to become available.

Do you use coated filters similar to the Hoya HMC range, and did you deliberately tilt the filter in its holder to reduce reflections? Your filters look like an FL-D with perhaps more blue filtration. Is this a standard filter or a special you have had made? ;)

Gary

Could you supply the mod in kit form complete with instructions on how to disassemble the pj and lens assembly etc? It would allow those that felt they could do it themselves to benefit without having to wait for a dealer to become available.

Do you use coated filters similar to the Hoya HMC range, and did you deliberately tilt the filter in its holder to reduce reflections? Your filters look like an FL-D with perhaps more blue filtration. Is this a standard filter or a special you have had made? ;)

Gary


This is kinda problematic. It is really not that easy to disassemble the projector and especially the optics. You have to be very careful in order not to get the lenses soiled with fingerprints or dust. In addition the mechanics of the optics have some grease and it happens easily that this gets on one of the lenses. Clearing a lens is really a pain then,

About the filter, these are custom made by us yes. They are coated and very light resistant, normal camera filters fade out too fast. It also depends on the lamp spectrum what filter you need. Some HC5000 need a more reddish filter than others.

And finally there is the calibration part which you can only do, if you have access to the service manual. And obviously, we can not provide this to anybody :(

So you can see, it makes more sense to arrange something with an experienced calibrator. We surely dont want people to damage their machines, that would not help the project.


Regards,
Ekkehart

Hi Ekkehart,

Thanks for the concise reply. I wish I had the ability to get custom filters - I only have access to off-the-shelf ones so choice is limited to a 'best fit' filter depending on how much the RGBs vary. I use a swatch of Lees filters to try and find a close match, then get a good glass filter of the equivalent colour, but even they can vary from manufacturer to manufacturer.

I take it that if you change the lamp, you'll have to change the filter if you want to have optimum contrast, since the variability you mention must be down to the lamp spectrum being different from lamp to lamp. How much variation is there? Is it enough to make a filter change necessary or would a simple recalibration to D65 be good enough in most cases?

How much are your filters for the HD1/RS1? Do they give a much bigger improvement to CR compared to a Hoya FL-D or a CCR for instance?

Thanks

Gary.

How much are your filters for the HD1/RS1? Do they give a much bigger improvement to CR compared to a Hoya FL-D or a CCR for instance?


And will it be possible to buy the filters separately ?

Indeed. I think a lot of people with calibration equipment like Colorfatcs or similar would be interested in your filters if they offer better performance over Hoya type filters.

Gary

Hi Ekkehart,

I'd like to know if the mods restrict the use of any of the HC5000's following flexible functions and capabilities:

Zoom range
Focus range
Horizontal lens shift
Vertical lens shift
Auto iris control
Colour control
Gamma control

Many thanks and best regards, Nick

Also, what difference will screen material make? Do you need to know the particular screen material and/or gain that is planned to be used with the projector?

Sure, we can do that for you :) And dont worry, the mod is real.

And you are right, a tuned HS60 reached 2000:1 native contrast too. We have the AW15 from Sony now in our hands, lets see what this machine can do ;) It looks like an improved HS60 actually.

LCD is not so far behind anymore regarding contrast, well at least if you optimize the lightpath accordingly ;)


Regards,
Ekkehart


well done sir, i look very much forward to hearing about these results

Sure, we can do that for you :) And dont worry, the mod is real.

And you are right, a tuned HS60 reached 2000:1 native contrast too. We have the AW15 from Sony now in our hands, lets see what this machine can do ;) It looks like an improved HS60 actually.

LCD is not so far behind anymore regarding contrast, well at least if you optimize the lightpath accordingly ;)


Regards,
Ekkehart

It seems like it's probably best to purchase the Mits HC5000 in Germany and have Ekkehart do his magic then ship it to the USA... :rolleyes:

Can the adjustments in the "Rear Bright mode" be accessible via the remote's service mode?

Hi Ekkehart,

I'd like to know if the mods restrict the use of any of the HC5000's following flexible functions and capabilities:

Zoom range
Focus range
Horizontal lens shift
Vertical lens shift
Auto iris control
Colour control
Gamma control

Many thanks and best regards, Nick



Nope, all these functions stay the same without any restrictions...

Regards,
Ekkehart

The projector must be taken apart to install the iris, but what about the colour filter? Can't a colour filter be applied externally like with most colour calibrations?

Also, it would be nice to see the HC5000 "Ultra" and it's black level and contrast compared to a colour calibrated Epson 1000, Panasonic AE1000, Pearl and RS1. Context! :cool:

The filter is no different to using a Hoya FL-Day or CCR filter, except theirs may be more optimal for a UHP lamp, so it can easily be fitted and removed without any warranty concerns. Only recalibration will be needed and not everyone can do that themselves since you need the necessary hardware and software.

It's a shame manufacturers don't take up on stuff like this to give their products an edge, but I guess not many of their customers are from avs...

Gary

I've heard of a few other PJs using an iris to control contast, but I didn't have any idea about how it would be implemented. In this case, if there is already a dynamic iris, where would the new, fixed one go?

I did a bit of reading, and though I'd share a bit of what I'd learned (which many of you will already know). In the HC5000 the DI is right at the start of the optical chain, after the lamp and before the splitters and LCDs. What Projektor Tuing do is add the second iris in the middle of the lens itself. This has to be fitted in the lens plane, where there is no focus at all, so the iris only restricts the amount of light, and doesn't affect lens zoom or picture vignetting. The iris could be any shape here, without affecting the projected image, but I understand it's a round hole. I understand it helps to control unwanted stray light that does get past the LCDs, either as part of the picture, or unwanted light that is not absorbed anywhere else.

Hell of benefit for one little hole. If this was being promoted by anyone other than C4H, I would be very sceptical, but you know I think I trust them.

Gary, good to have you around to sanitise things - if you had an HC5000, would you go for this mod?

Nick

Hi Nick,

Darinp2 did a very similar mod to his Optoma H79 which increased the on/off CR to 9000:1 (one iris in the lens assembly, and one just after the DMD IIRC) and I was tempted to try it myself, but I had similar concerns as yourself regarding taking the optics apart! Darin himself broke a color wheel IIRC so even the most capable can have a bad day. :)

Darin went a little further with his mod but I can't remember if that was made public. I think the only drawback with his mod was that it reduced the lumens more than the Mits mod does, so he used a Hi Power screen to get back the brightness. He started a thread on it and it made very interesting reading (probably in the archives now). He approached some pj manufacturers with his ideas but none were interested in signing a non disclosure agreement.

I think if the pj was out of its warranty and I was going to upgrade, I might be tempted to try it, knowing that I had little to lose. If things went well, I'd have a little more experience and knowledge, plus some confidence to try it on something new(er). :)

The benefits of this kind of mod are so large it can make you feel your missing out on a huge performance improvement if you don't do it.

Gary