Im curious about the 12 inch martin logan abyss sub. Are their any user comments and seatings sugestions.

Im curious about the 12 inch martin logan abyss sub. Are their any user comments and seatings sugestions.


Ive been wondering the same thing. Ive been looking for two smaller cube subs and I came across this sub the other day. I ordered two to see how they sound, should have them next week

I thought about going with the Dynamo but it was just too small for me. I currently have an Infinity 15" which I like but I want to see how two smaller quicker subs sound


If I dont like these I am going to try the ACI force XL's

t-smith, please let us know your impressions. I have heard one, but it was set up in a very large open space. Of course the sales guy was swearing up and down that it would clobber the velo spl1200r that I told him I really liked--that is pretty high praise. I didn't leave with the impression that it would best the mighty velo--about on par though. Let's face it martin logan makes some real high quality stuff, and this is no exception. However, is it the best value for a small sub? Is it even on par with other small sealed subs? I don't know. It definately has some versatility advantages. Again let us know your impressions as it looks like it should be a pretty good perfromer, but without hearing it in a know space side by side with a known quantity, it is tough to speculate.

I purchased the Abyss to compliment the Artison PLCR's. They will be here next week, lets see how they sound. I listened to this setup quite extensively at Sound Advice a Tweeter type store and the sound was very tight, not to boomy and I was able to feel the low end quite a bit on the medium level. I am looking foward to testing in my living room. (wish ne luck, lets hope it works the same).

t-smith, please let us know your impressions. I have heard one, but it was set up in a very large open space. Of course the sales guy was swearing up and down that it would clobber the velo spl1200r that I told him I really liked--that is pretty high praise. I didn't leave with the impression that it would best the mighty velo--about on par though. Let's face it martin logan makes some real high quality stuff, and this is no exception. However, is it the best value for a small sub? Is it even on par with other small sealed subs? I don't know. It definately has some versatility advantages. Again let us know your impressions as it looks like it should be a pretty good perfromer, but without hearing it in a know space side by side with a known quantity, it is tough to speculate.


same deal, Tweeter had one on display in a large room which wasnt going to tell me anything. They have a full return policy so whats the harm. Friend of mine has the ML Depth ( or Descent ) sounds great and he loves it. The Abyss is obviously not that but Im hoping the same quality is there which i cant imagine it wont be.

From what i understand these are relatively new which is why I havent been able to find that much info on them

hopefully these will work out, should be in next week and I'll connect them immediately....the opening scene in Star Wars III will be the first test then it will be the Depth Charges in U571

Thats sounds like two great movies to try them out on. Another great scene is xmen 2 the church scene with the character that disappears. I will do the same on wednesday when it is delivered and installed. (new pio 6070 with artison and abyss and marantz 7500)

I'll be running mine on an Anthem AVM 50 with Paradigm Studio 40's and Marantz MA700's

also 007 Die Another Day has a lot of nice scenes for a sub

Nice amp and nice setup. Your right 007 has scenes that low up right.

thanks, I just got the AVM 50 and it has 2 sub outs which is what started all this

picked up the two ML Abyss subs today and so far I like what I am hearing. I havent calibrated them yet, just hooked them up, moved the level half way up and put a couple movies in and the bass is noticably faster then the 15" Infinity Ive been using

I'll give more details as I go along but so far I am happy with them. The auto on / off is nice also

I just bought one for my son. It should also be here next week. I am wondering the improvement over the Dynamo. He is more of a two channel guy then home theater. I think in that application it should really excel. We shall see.

Well I installed the Abyss, it sound real tight and very quick to respond. i also have not calibrated yet. So far much better than my previous jbl pb12.

So you abyss owners....Still have em? still enjoy it?
hard to demo one. I've heard the dynamo but not the abyss.
looking at the ML and a entry REL.

Curious how the owners feel?

I demoed the Martinlogan Abyss here in Vancouver with a few movies and a bit of music.

This sub is incredible for its size. Before I knew what I was listening I asked the guy if they had shakers installed into the chair, I was actually convinced they had some tactile device in the chair, he assured me there was no such thing. This was during the King kong scene with the trex type of dino, choping and chasing the girl.to It had so much LF output my jaw was on the floor when he showed me what was playing. I though it was easily a sub 2-3 times as large and ported. Note this was in a smallish room,however the impressions were very favorable. If i have time I will revisit and audition again, and listen more carefully to its music performance. This looks like a brute of a small sealed sub, While the overall Spl wasn't insanely high in a small room it delivered forcefull tactile bass like no sub ive heard to date.
....maybe their sofa was made out of paper mashe.... :eek:

Edit: should add that the sub was corner loaded in a downfireing configuration. If I read the website right, apparently it can be converted to front firing as well which seems like a nice flexibility option it comes with.

^^ thanks for the comments swerve-e!

I agree with swerveddy. The Abyss is incredible. And the Dynamo is not far behind. I have long searched for a very musical sub that also had very high output for dynamics in music and for HT as well. I have listened to many of the commercial subs out there, with little concern for price. I actually found that price does not necessarily correlate to sound quality with subs.

My criteria for a sub is solid response in the lowest octave, ability to blend seamlessly with mains, low distortion, accuracy, articulation, and power.

The Abyss is my current reference standard for meeting or exceeding all my criteria while also representing great value. It is the most musical sub I have heard, and adds a transparent, almost ethereal presence to the music. The articulation is wonderful, and it effortlessly tracked the most complex bass material I could throw at it. I played a variety of music of all genres and the Abyss was equally adept with all. It was never boomy at all. But what really surprised me was when the depth charge scene was played on HT, how visceral the impacts were, and how they were felt in my chest. It was truly remarkable how at ease the sub was with such a variety of material. The room I listened in was about 16 by 20, with a 10' ceiling and a double door opening leading to the main showroom. This sub just made me smile. The salesman told me they had just recently got the Abyss in and he hadn't had a chance to stress it like I did, and he agreed that the Abyss seemed to handle every type of material exceptionally well.

Nearly as surprising was the Dynamo. The sound character is essentially the same as the Abyss, with the output being the only diffence I could discern. I heard the Dynamo in a room even longer than the room with the Abyss, but with a ceiling about a foot lower. I compared the ML to many known and reputable subs, but the salesman noted that hands down it was the most musical in the room. The only sub that I thought came close in sound quality was a Velodyne, but I was always aware of the Velodynes position, where with the ML Dynamo is sounded as though the sound was coming only from the mains. For smaller rooms if you want the most musical and seamless sub for around the mid-$1k price point, I haven't found anything close to this subs performance. Similarly, I think you will find the Abyss an exceptional value among its peers at around the $1k price point. And both have a high WAF since they are remarkably small for their output, and also immacualtely finished. Further, both had a design where you could swap the mount and the grille and this allows you to use the sub in a front-firing or down firing configuration according to what works best in your room.

The only subs that I have found that have a similar musical purity are the JL Audio F112 and F113 which I auditioned the same day. They have a similar seamless, transparent purity, and musicality, but with substantially more output. However, the F112 is about three times the Dynamo's price, and the F113 is roughly three times the Abyss' price. So the JL's are a reference standard at this point to me from what I have heard, irrespective of price, and would be a great no-compromise choice for those who need extreme SPL or have large rooms. But I think most people would find the ML's would give up nothing, in all but the extreme applications, in sound quality and represent what I think is clearly the best value out there right now for the music lover.

Hope this helps with your decision.

WOW SE-Raider! That is some post. Thanks for taking the time. I hope others find it useful.
I also went with the Abyss. I've only had it set up for a few days, and it is not calibrated. I am just adjusting it by ear and it is very compatible with my bookshelves. I plan to calibrate it and tune it to the room after I completely move into my place. And will comment further after I do that.

any more feedback on these subs after a little more use/calibration?

I'm seriously considering this sub along with a couple of others...

I agree with swerveddy. The Abyss is incredible. And the Dynamo is not far behind. I have long searched for a very musical sub that also had very high output for dynamics in music and for HT as well. I have listened to many of the commercial subs out there, with little concern for price. I actually found that price does not necessarily correlate to sound quality with subs.

My criteria for a sub is solid response in the lowest octave, ability to blend seamlessly with mains, low distortion, accuracy, articulation, and power.

The Abyss is my current reference standard for meeting or exceeding all my criteria while also representing great value. It is the most musical sub I have heard, and adds a transparent, almost ethereal presence to the music. The articulation is wonderful, and it effortlessly tracked the most complex bass material I could throw at it. I played a variety of music of all genres and the Abyss was equally adept with all. It was never boomy at all. But what really surprised me was when the depth charge scene was played on HT, how visceral the impacts were, and how they were felt in my chest. It was truly remarkable how at ease the sub was with such a variety of material. The room I listened in was about 16 by 20, with a 10' ceiling and a double door opening leading to the main showroom. This sub just made me smile. The salesman told me they had just recently got the Abyss in and he hadn't had a chance to stress it like I did, and he agreed that the Abyss seemed to handle every type of material exceptionally well.

Nearly as surprising was the Dynamo. The sound character is essentially the same as the Abyss, with the output being the only diffence I could discern. I heard the Dynamo in a room even longer than the room with the Abyss, but with a ceiling about a foot lower. I compared the ML to many known and reputable subs, but the salesman noted that hands down it was the most musical in the room. The only sub that I thought came close in sound quality was a Velodyne, but I was always aware of the Velodynes position, where with the ML Dynamo is sounded as though the sound was coming only from the mains. For smaller rooms if you want the most musical and seamless sub for around the mid-$1k price point, I haven't found anything close to this subs performance. Similarly, I think you will find the Abyss an exceptional value among its peers at around the $1k price point. And both have a high WAF since they are remarkably small for their output, and also immacualtely finished. Further, both had a design where you could swap the mount and the grille and this allows you to use the sub in a front-firing or down firing configuration according to what works best in your room.

The only subs that I have found that have a similar musical purity are the JL Audio F112 and F113 which I auditioned the same day. They have a similar seamless, transparent purity, and musicality, but with substantially more output. However, the F112 is about three times the Dynamo's price, and the F113 is roughly three times the Abyss' price. So the JL's are a reference standard at this point to me from what I have heard, irrespective of price, and would be a great no-compromise choice for those who need extreme SPL or have large rooms. But I think most people would find the ML's would give up nothing, in all but the extreme applications, in sound quality and represent what I think is clearly the best value out there right now for the music lover.

Hope this helps with your decision.

Score another for the Abyss...I'm also in complete agreement here. I actually just posted here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9091402#post9091402) on the Abyss and the Dynamo and found this thread from "strangerazn's" post. Like SE-Raider, I too was blown away with the quality from the Abyss at $900.00 but was even more impressed with the Dynamo. At under $600.00 this has to be one of the best subs period...internet-direct or not. We've actually got both a sample Dynamo and an Abyss in our sound room and the second Dynamo is on the way. What I'm VERY intersted to find out is how dual Dynamos (at under $1200.00 retail) co-located in a single corner compare to the Abyss in a 3000+ cu.ft. room.

Having worked in the internet-direct industry for some time and having owned many of the subs offered by the companies in that market, I am always interested in seeing how traditional brick-and-mortar companies like Martin Logan respond...hoepfully (for their sake) this is a sign of things to come.

With respect to the actual sub quality, I came to the same conclusions as just about everyone else in this thread. In fact (as I mentioned in my other post) we were so impressed with the Abyss and Dynamo that we actually made them our exclusive subwoofer offering in the under $2K price class. Ironically - our choice for $2K and above are the incredible new JL subs...which are downright scary. For DD and DTS the Abyss and Dynamo are no-brainers. However...what impressed me the most was the performance on both stereo and high-rez music material. I listen to about 60% music in my home system and have thus always preferred sealed subs as I find them to offer a bit more accuracy and detail in demanding material. The long overhang from high-teen tuned ported enclosures drives me crazy. From Diana Krall's Live in Paris DVD to the DSOTM SACD...I couldn't find a disc on which the sub didn't make me smile. In fact...I may just go have a listen now :).

I really don't think you can go wrong with either sub. If budget isn't the first thing on your list I'd go with the Abyss any day of the week simply because of it's additional output below 23Hz. You won't lose any of the Dynamo's musical quality or accuracy but will pick up a bit of usable output into the teens that will help with the demo scenes that you'll use to show off to your neighbors. Once we get our 2nd Dynamo and have a chance to compare to the single Abyss I'll post my findings here as well. If the dual Dynamo's do even half of what I'm expecting, they'll be worth every penny of the $300.00 upcharge over a single Abyss (given you have the space).

Hope that helps!

Has anyone compared the abyss to the grotto.I'd be interested in hearing the opinions.I have the grotto and like it but it seems it's in the same price bracket as the abyss.Since there are comparisons being made between the abyss and 2 dynamo's,it would be interesting what everyone thinks.Besides i'm still trying to get this grotto setup properly with all these controls that it has.

I'm definitely interested in learning of your test results with a dual dynamo setup. I'd also like to hear your impressions of an abyss in a larger, 3500+ cu. ft. room.

Steve O,
Great comments. I was wondering if you have experience with front fireing vs down firing with the abyss and have any observations. I might consider changing to front firing since my abyss is on old hardwood floors which buzz a bit (though only on occassion) . Overall it sounds great so far a little more tweeking on phase and placement and I'll be all set. .ed

Has anyone compared the abyss to the grotto.I'd be interested in hearing the opinions.I have the grotto and like it but it seems it's in the same price bracket as the abyss.Since there are comparisons being made between the abyss and 2 dynamo's,it would be interesting what everyone thinks.Besides i'm still trying to get this grotto setup properly with all these controls that it has.

seriously? Anyone compared the two? Rocky, how do you like your Grotto? I love mine but I think I could do with a bit more power. The bass I get is so damn clean that I find myself listening to more music than movies nowadays. I think I need another sub to get back into movies (hopefully stereo sub tracks will come out.....7.2 TrueHD would be AWESOME).

to be honest it does fine plenty of power for movies.My room is approx 22x19 x8 and it doesnt skip a beat.I have a rotel rsx1056 and have made my adjustments in the receiver and am very happy with the performance of the grotto.Could i use 2 hell yes but wife would kill me.I also liked it because of size and looks.Now if i could only figure out the 25hz control.

to be honest it does fine plenty of power for movies.My room is approx 22x19 x8 and it doesnt skip a beat.I have a rotel rsx1056 and have made my adjustments in the receiver and am very happy with the performance of the grotto.Could i use 2 hell yes but wife would kill me.I also liked it because of size and looks.Now if i could only figure out the 25hz control.

I dialed my 25Hz up by +3dB, rarely up to +6dB (some tunes). The bass gets a bit muddier with this adjustment so I try to keep it at normal or slightly above.

How does the Abyss compare to the HSU VTF 3.3? I didn't see ML anywhere on Craig's list.

I used to work at Sound Advice.

I got extensive experience with the Abyss.

I would never recommend it to anyone.

Buy an HSU or SVS

I used to work at Sound Advice.

I got extensive experience with the Abyss.

I would never recommend it to anyone.

Buy an HSU or SVS


Yea Ok... Great advice hot shot. :rolleyes:

Maybe go into a bit more detail.

I just ordered an SVS pb12 NSD here in canada. Unfortunately the price of the abyss here is quite high or a pair would have been my first choice after the JL F113.

I can tell you right now that I highly doubt the SVS I have on the way will be able to match this thing for music. For a small sealed cube that abyss has more Low end output than many larger ported /sealed subs I auditioned (energy 12.3, Totem Thunder(PR), REL 305 etc) I would say that it had more extension than the RSW10D and even the Velo spl 1000R.)

There is more to a sub than belting out 20hz tones at 100db. The Abyss had the power of the SPL1000R/RSW10d but the extension of the larger energy sub, and the musical finesse of the Totem and REL. Quite a feat imo.

For a large listening room, no It wouldnt be top on my list. But come on, saying you would never recommend it to anyone leads believe you have a different agenda. :confused:

Yea Ok... Great advice hot shot. :rolleyes:

Maybe go into a bit more detail.


The abyss sounds ok, but for the price you pay it has almost no low frequency <30hz extension.

At BB it costs $899.99.

I'd recommend spending less and getting the SVS SB12 plus (http://www.svsound.com/products-sub-box-sb12plus.cfm) for $699.

This will give you better low end extension with higher output.

Or the SVS PB12-NSD/2 (http://www.svsound.com/products-sub-box-sb12plus.cfm) or the HSU VTF-3 HO (http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3-ho.html)

These options will all destroy the Abyss in both SQ and SPL

Just found this thread while seaching for abyss information. I recently but a ML Abyss for $530 plus tax. Im happy with my purchase especially after hearing the comments here. Prior to this i had never heard of Martin Logan but i am happy with the woofer and the Script I i bought.

Just found this thread while seaching for abyss information. I recently but a ML Abyss for $530 plus tax. Im happy with my purchase especially after hearing the comments here. Prior to this i had never heard of Martin Logan but i am happy with the woofer and the Script I i bought.


If anyone knows where/how to get the ML Abyss below the $899 list price (i.e. $530), please post!! I tried Magnolia at BB but they wont budge on their price... Thanks!!

went to the magnolia and got it for 730

I was able to get it at 530 because one of my local sound advice stores was closing. Maybe try to find a local tweeter or sound advice store thats closing. Or maybe online auctions.

bump! does anyone know what the going rate is on these subs atm? I'd consider driving down to seattle to pick one up, as the prices up here are quite marked up by about 2x (1000$ more):eek:

bump! does anyone know what the going rate is on these subs atm? I'd consider driving down to seattle to pick one up, as the prices up here are quite marked up by about 2x (1000$ more):eek:

I purchased one today @ Sound Advice for $ 599.99 brand new in the box. Awesome Sub to go with my Denon 5308CI. Bass is tight and quick.

M-L has always been a well respected name in hi-end audio. It's another company "eaten up" within the past several years, by a holding company.

NOT trying to stir the pot............where's their subwoofer made it? I assume it's all Chinese with the M-L logo put on it.

Not an issue for most people who just want the good bass, but if that's the case, I think it simply needs to be compared - with price and quality - with all the other subwoofer companies using a China made plate amp. So would I buy one instead of AV123, Hsu or SVS? Maybe, if the deal was sweet.

Go sealed go!!! I couldn't help laughing at the comment how some ported subs will destroy the Abyss in SQ. This sub, however, has been around for a few years now. As good as it is, the standard has been raised. I wouldn't pay retail for this sub.

There really isn't anything the Abyss will do that the SVS SB12+ can't do. Although I haven't heard both side by side (I heard the Abyss only at a Magnolia), I'd rather get the SVS. The SVS does an honest -3dB around 22Hz in my room which is very good for the size and as a sealed sub

If the Abyss could be had for under $600, then I'd say that is good value, but if you start getting into the $700+ price range, the SVS SB12 is just a better sub for the money.

I'm looking at the abyss vs the Carver true sunrise sub. Any comments? My room is 1440 cubic ft and the small footprint of the sunrise makes it attractive

There really isn't anything the Abyss will do that the SVS SB12+ can't do. Although I haven't heard both side by side (I heard the Abyss only at a Magnolia), I'd rather get the SVS. The SVS does an honest -3dB around 22Hz in my room which is very good for the size and as a sealed sub

If the Abyss could be had for under $600, then I'd say that is good value, but if you start getting into the $700+ price range, the SVS SB12 is just a better sub for the money.

That's a good number. I think this reviewer did worse.

http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/speakers/2316/shootout-five-mid-price-subwoofers-svs-sb12-plus-page8.html

Sorry Abyss people, I am done hijacking your thread.

Sorry Abyss people, I am done hijacking your thread.

Well Davidt1, you've taken the thread right to the edge of the abyss, stood
and looked down, and went back. Good job!

I've had my ML Abyss for about 6 months. I second all the positive reviews in this thread. It is one fine, FINE sub. It performs as mentioned. I paid near full retail for mine and any zero regrets. If you can get them now at discounted prices, the abyss is a no-brainer.

To the guy at sound advice that dissedi it....well, consider the source. I've never met a sound advice clerk that knew too much anyways.

Where's the bass? Just purchased the Abyss. Very disappointed in output level. Hooked up via the lfe .1 input.

I have the output level on sub set to 7 out of 10. I'm assuming break in will make a difference but I can't see it making that much of a difference.

My old JBL 15" had a lot more output even if it was a one note wonder.
It is also corner loaded like my JBL.

The sub level on my pre pro is also turned up to 7.5 out of 10. Some one help. What am I doing wrong here? It's got to have more output then this.

To Ken54321

Maybe you need to hook it up using the 2-channel mode and multi channel mode (page 8 of manual) to get bass on both stereo and 5.1. I hooked it up using just the LFE input at first and didn't get any sound from the Sub when listening in stereo but works perfect when watching movies in 5.1. The 2-channel/multi-channel hook up fixed it for me. I'm happy with the Abyss so far.

Had actually purchased a floor-model Dynamo from Tweeter for 330$ and was impressed with it but then they had the Abyss on sale for 550.40$ (brand new, too!!!) so I upgraded and I think the 220$ difference is well worth it. They will try to give you the floor-model Abyss to at that price but you should just insist on a brand new one if they have any left.

It's probably a set up issue. Check you AVR. Do you have both the 2 channel and LFE set up as recommended in the manual?

Be sure you are plugged in correctly. I only have my Abyss turned up to 1/2 way in a fairly large room (actually, 2 rooms back to back in open air environment).

Where are your crossovers set and do you have Bass set to LFE or LFE+Mains???

Where's the bass? Just purchased the Abyss. Very disappointed in output level. Hooked up via the lfe .1 input.

I have the output level on sub set to 7 out of 10. I'm assuming break in will make a difference but I can't see it making that much of a difference.

My old JBL 15" had a lot more output even if it was a one note wonder.
It is also corner loaded like my JBL.

The sub level on my pre pro is also turned up to 7.5 out of 10. Some one help. What am I doing wrong here? It's got to have more output then this.

It's probably a set up issue. Check you AVR. Do you have both the 2 channel and LFE set up as recommended in the manual?

Be sure you are plugged in correctly. I only have my Abyss turned up to 1/2 way in a fairly large room (actually, 2 rooms back to back in open air environment).

Where are your crossovers set and do you have Bass set to LFE or LFE+Mains???

Unfortunately no real way for me to hook up the sub using 2 channel and LFE. I have one LFE line running from the front of the room (where the pre/pro is) all the way to the back of the room where the sub is. No way for me to run another 2 cables all the way back. Really hardly any output on just the lfe input. My old JBL had a lot more compared to it. If I can't use the lfe by itself, I might have to return. Also, seems to be awfully light the me. I was expecting something a lot more substantial in weight.

I was so looking forward to this as I had an MSW 15 on order but now they tell me June to be delivery date. Was hoping this ML would work out as a replacement. Guess not. Any additional ideas before I give up and return?




UPDATE: This is going from bad to worse. One of the L shaped rca adaptors that comes with the sub fell apart in my hands. This shouldn't be happening. Arggggghhh!

What about splitting that single line to 3? Would that work? Any possiblity of damage? Going to wait for feedback before I do so. I have to go get new right angle adaptor tomorrow any ways!

ive had this sub for 2 years with no problem at all. Its tied in with velo hgs10x EQd. Ran the sub solo for a while for impressions, which were well, not quite as nice as the velo but adequte. Ken im not sure about your misfortunes, sounds phishy to me, good luck

ive had this sub for 2 years with no problem at all. Its tied in with velo hgs10x EQd. Ran the sub solo for a while for impressions, which were well, not quite as nice as the velo but adequte. Ken im not sure about your misfortunes, sounds phishy to me, good luck

About to give up on the ML here. What makes the Velo nicer? What do you like about the Velo better? Need to search for replacement.

To Ken54321

Maybe you need to hook it up using the 2-channel mode and multi channel mode (page 8 of manual) to get bass on both stereo and 5.1. I hooked it up using just the LFE input at first and didn't get any sound from the Sub when listening in stereo but works perfect when watching movies in 5.1. The 2-channel/multi-channel hook up fixed it for me. I'm happy with the Abyss so far.

Had actually purchased a floor-model Dynamo from Tweeter for 330$ and was impressed with it but then they had the Abyss on sale for 550.40$ (brand new, too!!!) so I upgraded and I think the 220$ difference is well worth it. They will try to give you the floor-model Abyss to at that price but you should just insist on a brand new one if they have any left.


Night and day difference between just using the LFE vs. the 2 Channel mode. I have my single LFE out from pre/pro and hooked up to the L & R inputs via a Y cable.

I tested with Matrix after the lobby scene where Neo and Trinity are in the elevator. When the elevator crashes down and explodes there was absolutely nothing with my JBL 15" and I always wondered if I had a defective version of the DVD. This time with the Abyss, I was finally able to hear and feel the low end frequencies from the explosion.

I'm very happy over all with the sub, but still couple outstanding issues for me; minor gripes.

1. Seems too lightweight. I guess that's good since easy to move around, but doesn't give me a feeling of quality (not that weight necessarily has anything to do with that).

2. The power cable is suprisingly chintzy. Not even as thick as my dvd player cable. (Would thicker power cable do anything?)

3. The listed magazine review of the Abyss said that it has better low end extension with the LFE input. Don't know how the reviewer got any output out of just the single lfe input. Really, how does anyone get enough output with just the LFE connected. (Is the lfe connection on my sub faulty?)

4. The broken 90* rca adaptor.

How would a second Abyss sound?
Really like the sound of the Abyss so far.

How would a second Abyss sound?


Probably a lot like the one you have now :p.

All joking aside, adding a second sub can help smooth your in-room bass response, while lowering distortion and dynamic compression, which should give better dynamics and cleaner, more accurate bass. If you can afford to go for a second and have the space, I'd do it with no hesitation. I experienced a significant improvement moving from one PB10-NSD to two, and your experience with dual Abyss's would probably be pretty similar to mine.

Check out Tweeter. They are clearancing them out for $550. Check out the clearance section of their website and you can search inventory by store location. Great way to find good deals in general.

If anyone knows where/how to get the ML Abyss below the $899 list price (i.e. $530), please post!! I tried Magnolia at BB but they wont budge on their price... Thanks!!

Check out Tweeter. They are clearancing them out for $550. Check out the clearance section of their website and you can search inventory by store location. Great way to find good deals in general.

I got one like this. Its a pretty good sub for 550.

About to give up on the ML here. What makes the Velo nicer? What do you like about the Velo better? Need to search for replacement.

overall its a higher class sub, more power and extension, equal to a dd10 now. The logan works well, but id say a descent or depth would be more inline with velo, later better. The grotto is nice also. I listen to music more than movies, so smooth tight bass and a flat mid is what i look for.

Ended up picking up a second Abyss. Wow, it sounds great. They are in opposing corners (diagnol) of the room - 25' x 15' x 9'. Both subs are front firing. Haven't tried downward firing. I have 2 rows of seating and no matter where you sit, the bass response is very good.

At first I didn't think the size of the sub would matter from an aesthetic stand point, but after taking that huge 15" JBL out of there and putting in the MLs there just seems to be a lot more space and a cleaner set up. It does make the home theater look nicer.

On my quest for subs, I was originally going to get a Ultra PC-13 last year, but the timing wasn't right when it finally came in stock. Held out till this year and the MFW-15s looked to be great and I had 2 on order. I was going to do the same set up in opposing corners. I ordered in February and was expecting an April delivery, then they told me June.

With the larger size of the MFW-15, I would had to move my speakers in front of the equipment credenzas and jam the MFW-15 in lne with the credenzas. The speakers would have to have been set up in front of all of that and would have given it an appearance of being in the middle of the front stage area where people walk to the front row of seating. I had planned on having a fairly open front area for a third row of seating via video chairs for kids. With the MFW-15 set up, the placement of the front speakers would have intruded into that space.


My local dealer had the Abyss for $550 so decided to try it out. While I still have some issues with the Abyss: chintzy power cord; less than substantial weight; quality control of the supplied rca 90* adaptor; and the lfe input level, I'm overall fairly happy with the 2 units and am extremely happy with the sound quality.

So 2 Abyss for a little less than 2 MFW-15s delivered seems to be a good trade off. Again, didn't think the small size form factor was that important before, but I have to say the look is much cleaner in my home theater room and the equipment credenzas (28" height) with screen right above, bass unit in right corner and L&R speakers on the sides are in in line with nothing jutting too far out.

Looking for confirmation now, as I tend not to make upgrades very often this set up has to last me for a while. Did I do the right thing with the 2 Abyss subs, is there another sub set up for about the same price $1200 that would be better for both music and home theater, am I just being impatient for not waiting for the MFW-15s? Would 2 svs sb-12 plus be better? I still have a 30 day trial period so the clock is ticking.

Funny thing is that I don't think I would have these uncertainties with the MFW-15 and mostly because it is based on Craigsub's subwoofer ranking list, and those few outstanding issues I had with the Abyss. I know the Craigsub list is only 1 guy making quantitative assessments, but absent anything else that truly is indeed the most helpful tool. (Thank you Craigsub.) I just wish the Abyss would have been reviewed by him as well to see where it is on the list relative to the other options out there. The problem is that I'm so use to the low end subs I don't have an ear - yet - for the higher end subs. I just don't want to be regretting this purchase down the line. Opinions out there?

Ended up picking up a second sub. Wow, it sounds great. They are in opposing corners (diagnol) of the room - 25' x 15' x 9'. Both subs are front firing. Haven't tried downward firing. I have 2 rows of seating and no matter where you sit, the bass response is very good.

At first I didn't think the size of the sub would matter from an aethetic stand point, but after taking that huge 15" JBL out of there and putting in the MLs there just seems to be a lot more space and a cleaner set up. It does make it look nicer.

On my quest for subs, I was originally going to get a Ultra PC-13 last year, but the timing wasn't right when it finally came in stock. Held out till this year and the MFW-15s looked to be great and I had 2 on order. I was going to do the same set up in opposing corners. I ordered in February and was expecting an April delivery, then they told me June.

With the larger size of the MFW-15, I would had to move my speakers in front of the equipment credenzas and jam the MFW-15 in lne with the credenza. The speakers would have to have been set up in front of all of that and would have given it an appearance of being in the middle of the front stage area where people can walk to the front row of seating. I had planned on having a fairly open front area for a third row of seating via video chairs for kids. With the MFW-15 set up, the placement of the front speakers would have intruded into that space.


My local dealer had the Abyss for $550 so decided to try it out. While I still have some issues with the unit: chintzy power cord; less than substantial weight; quality control of the supplied rca 90* adaptor; and the lfe input level, I'm overall fairly happy with the 2 units and am extremely happy with the sound quality.

So 2 Abyss for a little less than 2 MFW-15s delivered seems to be a good trade off. Again, didn't think the small size form factor was that important before, but I have to say the look is much cleaner in my home theater room and the equipment credenzas (28" height) with screen right above, bass unit in right corner and L&R speakers on the sides are in in line with nothing jutting too far out.

Looking for confirmation now, as I tend not to make upgrades very often this set up has to last me for a while. Did I do the right thing with the 2 Abyss subs, is there another sub set up for about the same price $1200 that would be better for both music and home theater, am I just being impatient for not waiting for the MFW-15s? Would 2 svs sb-12 plus be better? I still have a 30 day trial period so the clock is ticking.

Funny thing is that I don't think I would have these uncertainties with the MFW-15 and mostly because it is based on Craigsub's subwoofer ranking list, and those few outstanding issues I had with the Abyss. I know the Craigsub list is only 1 guy making quantitative assessments, but absent anything else that truly is indeed the most helpful tool. (Thank you Craigsub.) I just wish the Abyss would have been reviewed by him as well to see where it is on the list relative to the other options out there. The problem is that I'm so use to the low end subs I don't have an ear - yet - for the higher end subs. I just don't want to be regretting this purchase down the line. Opinions out there?

I purchased an Abyss over an SB12+ mainly due to my own inpatients. SVS was out of stock and I didn't want to wait. I do not regret my purchase at all. Things I like about the Abyss is you can set it do front or down firing and it has an LFE input. It is in the same class as the SB12+ from what I understand.

You have a problem with the bass management setup on your pre/pro or...you have a problem with the LFE on the Abyss.

I have mine connected only to the LFE and all is good.

For such as small box, I feel the weight is adequate. Hard to believe such a big sound comes out of that size of box.

I don't use my L connectors as I have mine in down firing mode.

You really need to look at your bass management.


QUOTE=Ken54321;13584608]Night and day difference between just using the LFE vs. the 2 Channel mode. I have my single LFE out from pre/pro and hooked up to the L & R inputs via a Y cable.

I tested with Matrix after the lobby scene where Neo and Trinity are in the elevator. When the elevator crashes down and explodes there was absolutely nothing with my JBL 15" and I always wondered if I had a defective version of the DVD. This time with the Abyss, I was finally able to hear and feel the low end frequencies from the explosion.

I'm very happy over all with the sub, but still couple outstanding issues for me; minor gripes.

1. Seems too lightweight. I guess that's good since easy to move around, but doesn't give me a feeling of quality (not that weight necessarily has anything to do with that).

2. The power cable is suprisingly chintzy. Not even as thick as my dvd player cable. (Would thicker power cable do anything?)

3. The listed magazine review of the Abyss said that it has better low end extension with the LFE input. Don't know how the reviewer got any output out of just the single lfe input. Really, how does anyone get enough output with just the LFE connected. (Is the lfe connection on my sub faulty?)

4. The broken 90* rca adaptor.

How would a second Abyss sound?
Really like the sound of the Abyss so far.[/QUOTE]

Now that I have a second Abyss in my system, I'll try to hook it up with just the lfe on the second one. If I have the same result, it must be the Abyss, or could it be the long run of cable all the way to the back of the room? I figure the cable run is around 60ft using a coax cable: 6 ft from pre/pro to wall; 8 ft up the wall; 25 ft to the back of the room; 8 ft down the wall again and 12 ft to the corner of the room.

If its the pre/pro - Aragon, I'm going to struggle with that one as the original remote on it died a long time ago. Using Harmony now and it just doesn't have all the functions of original remote.

@ Ken. Glad you got it to work.

I do use my abyss connected to LFE out from a Denon 4306 AVR with absolutely no problems. In a medium sized 19ft x 13ft x 8ft room I can't set the sub's gain past #4 because it would get too loud and it is usually set at #3. Corner location: 1ft from wall / 3 ft from the other wall. My Denon crossover is set to 60hz. I wonder if your AV receiver LFE crossover is set properly?

Very satisfied with the abyss....Tight and deep bass. The size, fit and finish are perfect for me. I paid near retail about 2 years ago.

cheers, ed

Very satisfied with the abyss....Tight and deep bass. The size, fit and finish are perfect for me. I paid near retail about 2 years ago.


Just picked up this sub today, price matched from Tweeter at the local Best Buy for nearly $700. I'd have to agree with you completely, the bass is very clear and deep. Especially when compared to my last sub, KEF psw2150 (included in the 2001.2 set). I couldn't pay the full retail for it, just can't justify that price on a sub, but at discount I'd say this is a must buy. :)

Crossover set at 80hz (KEF 2005.2 satellites) on LFE connected to an Onkyo 705s.

I've been in the industry for quite some time and have worked for a few of the companies listed above (bad, poorman) and I myself have just purchased a ML ABYSS. This thing is rocking my house! I purchase a lot of equipment due to my great discounts and accomodations, BUT the ABYSS is the first sub that I intend on keeping and not every re-selling. ML has produced one of its best products in this sub. I highly recommend this to anyone looking for tight, clean and jaw-dropping bass.

Martin Logan subs are the best. I have heard SVS/HSU and they are good but ML subs are distinctly better at least to my ears. I had the dynamo a baby ML sub and the base effects were very impressive. It sounded so good with music.
I sold it and now have the Depth i coming in. I would have loved to get the Descent i but space was an issue. Its difficult to go with a different brand of sub after having experienced a ML sub.

There may not be anyone who has heard both of these, but I am wondering how the ML Abyss compares to the JBL 8400 solely for HT. There were some posts a while back with some favorable reviews of the L8400. The list price and size of both are about the same, although the JBL is discounted more.

Hello All, was reading this thread while narrowing my choices for a new sub and thought I'd pitch in my 2 cents while I've got the subs at home. I'm in the market for a sub that is very musical, fast, reaches down low, and is useable up to around 100hz to match with my Def. Tech. Pro Monitor 1000's and Procenter 2000. Listened to a couple Velodyne subs (better one was the SPL12) in the store, wasn't impressed. Typical Velodyne sound (IMHO), lots of air movement but not very transparent sounding. Spent some time with the Monitor Audio SR-W12 in the store, and while it sounded pretty good it also sounded like it's frequency response curve looks; much higher output on the top end. While I was there I heard a Paradigm Ultracube 12 who's bottom end output was crazy, but not well suited to my needs. Then went to Magnolia AV in Lynnwood to listen to the Definitive Technology Supercube II, the Martin Logan Abyss, and something comparable from REL's T-series. I was highly impressed with both the ML Abyss and the Supercube, not that I had anything against the RELs, they just weren't really available like the other two. Couldn't decide in the store, so I took them both home to audition, and here I sit now. Been spending as much time as I can with both of them over the past week and a half, and I am still torn. Both are very musical, very flat frequency response curves, both reach plenty deep (the Abyss more so) and both are very transparent. I am in a condo so I haven't been able to open the taps entirely, but from what I've found the Supercube will run out of headroom on very demanding tracks such as track 4 on Pomp & Pipes where there is deep powerfull organ pedaling happening and the big powerfull bass drum kicks in; the abyss will hit that drum and you feel the room drop whereas the drum gets lost with the Supercube. At lower volumes this isn't an issue. I'm looking forward to taking both subs to a friend's house where I can really find their volume limits. The other big difference I'm finding is that the Abyss tends to sound a little fuller where the Supercube has a little crisper sound to it and blends with my satellites a touch better. Lastly, I feel that the Abyss does a better job pulling information out of tricky bass lines, very quick bass hits and quick plucking of bass guitar strings. I suspect that all these differences have to do with the Subs' designs; the Abyss having a 12" driver powered by a 300w amp in a sealed enclosure with the Supercube having an 8" driver and 2 passive radiators (also 8" ea.) powered by a 1200w amp. I've been throwing everything at these subs; Yo-Yo Ma and Orchestral music and big pipe organ stuff like Pomp & Pipes and the opening to the Phantom of the Opera, Santana, rock like Metallica, Slipknot, Disturbed etc. As it stands, I am undecided but leaning slightly toward the Abyss with the idea that as my system continues to be upgraded I will eventually have a set of main speakers that reach a little lower and will tighten up the upper base, and one day I'll have a basement where I'll really be able to open the taps on the Abyss! I wish I had a chance to compare these two to the ML Grotto i, so if anyone has done this comparison I'd love to hear about it. On a side note, I would call my room rather large as it's approx. 12' x 24' with 13' ceiling, and is open to the hall and kitchen. One last comment, the Abyss handled the scene in Hellboy II where the stone giant awakens from the earth more cleanly than the Supercube, and gave a greater portrayal of sub-bass in the LFE track. Hope this review helps somebody!

Homey, I'll save you the time, get the Abyss's. I have dual SCII's, and while they are fantastic, I would rather have dual Abyss's, or even Dynamos for that matter.

The ML's dig deeper, and do not flutter when they are pushed. My SC's are great, don't get me wrong, and considering what I paid for them, it is a better overall value for me. I also noticed that the ML can give you more output in an open area when used a downward firing sub without being boomy at all. The SC's are going to perform very well in a smaller area. In a larger area, you would have to place them in a corner to get similar output, but they can be very boomy, which is a minus.

Someone please provide me some info on where to get this sub from? links? number? bb asking for 1k and from what im reading, it should be alot cheaper.

thanks guys!

Someone please provide me some info on where to get this sub from? links? number? bb asking for 1k and from what im reading, it should be alot cheaper.

thanks guys!

Dont expect much below 899 for new;)

Dont expect much below 899 for new;)

even that is better than what im offered :D where?

I got my Abyss from Magnolia AV in Lynwood WA for $1100 US, and they wouldn't move on that price (Martin Logan). The Def. Tech. SC II that I'm comparing it too had a list price of $900 but they have some wiggle room with that brand, so I didn't pay list on that one. I wish I coulda picked up an Abyss for $600 but I don't consider myself ripped off in the least at $1100. It looks like a bunch of these people got their stuff from Tweeter which is in the closeout process, and unless you live by one of their stores you're out of luck on that one.

The selection was made, I kept the Abyss. I had a fellow from work join me to check out these two excellent subs; he has many many years of experience in professional audio and live music and was able to provide some insight. Long story short, the SC II did a superb job of blending with my ProMonitor 1000s, pulled out excellent detail from the upper bass region, catching great detail with recordings of upright bass etc. Very musical, didn't do anything badly at all. Moving to music like Pink Floyd, the Abyss was excellent, pulled lots of detail out of the bass guitar. Again, the Abyss did nothing wrong, but it was not able to reproduce that upper bass detail like the SCII did. What it did do was excellent though; tough decision.The clincher for me was a two part deal. The Abyss could handle the very lowest LFE info with movies very cleanly (moreso than the SCII), and on big organ recordings the Abyss did for the bottom end of the recording what the SCII did for the upright bass; while the SCII would play the deepest tones very nicely, it just couldn't reproduce the detail and the harmonics in the very bottom of the range that really put you in the seat at the church where it was recorded. The abyss gives you that somewhat intangable sense of realism that the SCII just couldn't match. Add that to a bit more headroom in terms of dynamics and I can live with a slight mismatch in my current system until I upgrade my mains to a set of floor-standers (or even larger monitors) that will reach low enough to blend properly with the Abyss. On a side note, if you're shopping for these subs, go see the guys at Magnolia AV. I can only speak from my experience in my few visits to the store in Lynnwood WA but the staff there has always been very patient and very helpfull. I will definetly go see them again when it's time for the next component to be upgraded.