At this point in time I'm not too happy either and I agree with the majority of the comments made above.

Maybe what we're looking for is the VP200. It won't work or have the features as advertised, but it should hopefully be the equal of a fully functional VP50. :)

I strongly suspect that if another VP manufacturer were to now offer a reasonable trade-in program taking in competitors products, then they may well gain a great many new customers who previously bought ABT products...

I hope the noise reduction makes it way down to the VP50 .... I will be sorely dissapointed if it doesn't ......

I too went through the HD, HD+, VP30, ABT102 board and now the VP50 ..... I don't want to pay $1k for NR ..... if the VP50 has enough processing power, why not let it do NR? ARGGHHHHH Frustrated .....

same as above really .... if NR is not included in the VP50, I will be looking elsewhere for my next VP...... or maybe not bother with one at all ... just get a high end amp and live with the shortcomings of it....

Unfortunately Jim specifically said in the VP50 PRO thread that the VP50 will NEVER support NR or EE, nor will DVDO offer an upgrade program to swap out hardware to allow the VP50 to support these features. You'll have to get the PRO for that stuff.

it seems since the new thread for the Pro we see what DVDO thinks about VP50 users.

josh is just talking in the new thread and not answered questions to the old users.

i think he knows how angry we are !
i think also an upgrade for the new features are ok but 1000 USD more for the upgrade itself is a way to much for promissed features !!!!


VP50 3000 USD to VP50PRO 3500 USD makes 500 USD more + and upgrade charge to handle and refurnish the old units is ok too but not 1000 USD !!!!! :mad:

Yes $1k is a little high but I'm going to be stuck paying it. At least I can justify my purchase since I decided not to upgrade my audio receiver this year. Although I am perfectly happy with my VP50 but you get the best deal with the AVS discount and trade in with the initial offering.

Alo there is a VP50pro thread? I guess I need to find it.,

@Pharados: please note that the upgrade price isn't $1000, but $1500 and with you not being in the USA you will not only receive any special pricing, but you'll have to add the additional $250 international processing fee. So, all in all, "our" update price is $1750.

it seems since the new thread for the Pro we see what DVDO thinks about VP50 users.

josh is just talking in the new thread and not answered questions to the old users.



oh - don't feel bad. check the thread now - now that people are asking tough questions, Josh isn't answering there either. ;)

(questions that should be easy, like what is fixed, and are all the features implemented. :D)

Ouch! I thought $1K was high, but $1750 would be too much. or me the $1k won't be too bad since I can probably sell my HDMI Flea to offset part of the upgrade cost. That's also assuming the NR and enhancement features of the VP50pro are comparable to the HDMI Flea.

Yes $1k is a little high but I'm going to be stuck paying it. At least I can justify my purchase since I decided not to upgrade my audio receiver this year. Although I am perfectly happy with my VP50 but you get the best deal with the AVS discount and trade in with the initial offering.

Alo there is a VP50pro thread? I guess I need to find it.,

are you sure, aaron? the AVS deal will be there next time also - for the VP70 next spring. I'd rather miss out on one upgrade, than partake of a less than stellar offer.

Last time, even tho the new feature set wasn't that compelling, the upgrade price was. This time, I really don't see 1K of improvement, let alone 1500 bucks after August, or 2K for guys like Danielo and aileen. :eek:

Most telling is the fact that they won't let anyone who has one talk about it - if no beta users talk before the cutoff (see Gary and his NDA) - then there is nwih I'm dumping a G. If its out, let's let someone who has it tell us what works, what doesn't. Rather than buying straight off a retailer's feature list.

to josh and all Anchor Bay,

you know the political applied from Sony with the PS3? that with the PS3 it lets out a modernization to the month in order to render the machine in compliance with the detailed lists with which is be sold, and for which is be payed. from the moment of the launch (single 5 months) 10 update have come out very fw, and others of it coming soon. we imagine if the thing had been managed from Anchor Bay? in 5 6 months at least we will have changed consul to the "little" price of 4/500K? at one? I have buyed it for having the flood compatibility with the new format full hd , and the flood compatibility with the new devices, sintoampli and vpj that manage such signal.
with the last modernizations they have Worked in order to resolve the problem of 24p, problem resolved and without to ask an ulterior expenditure in money from part for its buyers or being obligated them to take a PS4 or 5, the machine is be sold with those detailed lists and those go respected
hour will have to end of fixup other functions, but we will be calm why sure that to the fine ones they will give to the machine in the full load of its functions of plate indeed with many others features in plus without to come to beat money this what is politics/science fiction? why Sony, I as craftsman and others reality we apply such political? perhaps why to contact with the reality, composed persons in meat and boneses from students, laborers, it employs and entrepreneurs, what to you that Anchor Bay situated being itself in an atmosphere of "niche" does not know.
however to the end, what that remains to we is one machine that put in one chain full hd between one PS3 600K (5 times less of the VP-50) and the others devices instead making its job create obstacle.

beautiful job, always continued like this

Ouch! I thought $1K was high, but $1750 would be too much. or me the $1k won't be too bad since I can probably sell my HDMI Flea to offset part of the upgrade cost. That's also assuming the NR and enhancement features of the VP50pro are comparable to the HDMI Flea.

and again - will they tell us before the cutoff date? We have two weeks, inwhich time they can turn off the NDAs and let us AVS'rs know how well it works in end-user's systems.

@Pharados: please note that the upgrade price isn't $1000, but $1500 and with you not being in the USA you will not only receive any special pricing, but you'll have to add the additional $250 international processing fee. So, all in all, "our" update price is $1750.

your correct, but i consider the $500 USD as a feature update i did had before, HDMI 1.3 and so on !!
for this i will get more for my money, but the rest is for features they should build in. so if i don't want 1.3 i could stay with the VP50 if i want the promised feature i MUST go to the VP50PRO !!! and this is not ok to charge for this :mad: .

I initially thought that I would pony up the extra $1000.00, but it isn't just that.

A person actually has to pay $3500.00 first and then get the $2500.00 credit (if that is the way it is going to be). I can't come up with the $3500.00 right now. I may possibly be able to scrape together the $1000.00. But not $3500.00.

Guess I'll just have to be happy with what I have for a while (or wait six months for the VP60 and hope that there will be a trade up AVS offer on the VP50)

Besides, I will be losing the sdi I have with my VP50 since it won't work on the new improved VP50Pro.

Maybe not so much pissed as disappointed.

Last time, even tho the new feature set wasn't that compelling, the upgrade price was. This time, I really don't see 1K of improvement, let alone 1500 bucks after August, or 2K for guys like Danielo and aileen. :eek:


So, $1000 plus tradein, meaning the credit card gets charged $3500 until you get the VP50 turned in, and you have to do this in the next 17 days or it goes to $1500 plus tradein? and we don't get to see/hear how well it works? I don't think so, I'll undoubtedly be passing on this one...

Now, does that $3500 even include the SDI card? If not, then it's without question a no sale for me.

I think you summed it up pretty well keenan

I think the only way I could go for it AGAIN (my sixth DVDO upgrade) is if I could send my VP50 with sdi in, pay $500.00 (the dif. between the MSRP of the VP50 and the VP50Pro) and receive my VP50Pro with an sdi input like the VP50 has.

Think thats going to happen?

That would be fair, I guess.

I think the only way I could go for it AGAIN (my sixth DVDO upgrade) is if I could send my VP50 with sdi in, pay $500.00 (the dif. between the MSRP of the VP50 and the VP50Pro) and receive my VP50Pro with an sdi input like the VP50 has.

Think thats going to happen?

sure - the day after I can trade my VP50 in on a Radiance, and get 2k credit.....

They've already stated that your sdi card won't even fit in the Pro, and they have yet to work out either a trade-in value on your sdi card, or a price for the new, not yet released HD-SDI card.

and yes, you have to have 3500 (plus shipping) available on your cc; also, note, both times I've had that charge put on my cc by DVDO, once they were slow getting it removed, once they let it get into the next billing cycle, so I got to pay the intereste on it. (even tho I'd returned my faulty VP50 3 weeks earlier.)

Last time it was a no brainer -- looks like it is this time also, just the other way. :(

I hope the noise reduction makes it way down to the VP50 .... I will be sorely dissapointed if it doesn't ......

I too went through the HD, HD+, VP30, ABT102 board and now the VP50 ..... I don't want to pay $1k for NR ..... if the VP50 has enough processing power, why not let it do NR? ARGGHHHHH Frustrated .....

same as above really .... if NR is not included in the VP50, I will be looking elsewhere for my next VP...... or maybe not bother with one at all ... just get a high end amp and live with the shortcomings of it....

I'm in exactly the same spot right now, having gone through the same upgrades you have.

Plus, even with the VP50pro, we still have the issue of how to route HDMI audio, do you trust a passthrough somewhere in the chain or buy a splitter, etc.

I need to see very objective reviews of the pros and cons of the VP50pro, and even then, it's a pretty hard sell for me.

your correct, but i consider the $500 USD as a feature update i did had before, HDMI 1.3 and so on !!
for this i will get more for my money, but the rest is for features they should build in. so if i don't want 1.3 i could stay with the VP50 if i want the promised feature i MUST go to the VP50PRO !!! and this is not ok to charge for this :mad: .

I believe is hour to begin to make to move the FTC (Fedral Trade Commision USA)
for False Claim Act

you guys need to take the pro talk to the pro thread ;)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=889884

this thread is for the vp50 :)

-Gary

I'm in exactly the same spot right now, having gone through the same upgrades you have.

Plus, even with the VP50pro, we still have the issue of how to route HDMI audio, do you trust a passthrough somewhere in the chain or buy a splitter, etc.

I need to see very objective reviews of the pros and cons of the VP50pro, and even then, it's a pretty hard sell for me.

A second HDMI output would of sold me on a VP50 Pro.

So, $1000 plus tradein, meaning the credit card gets charged $3500 until you get the VP50 turned in, and you have to do this in the next 17 days or it goes to $1500 plus tradein? and we don't get to see/hear how well it works? I don't think so, I'll undoubtedly be passing on this one...

Now, does that $3500 even include the SDI card? If not, then it's without question a no sale for me.
I'll just use a creditcard that just ended it's billing cycle. that way I will have around 2 months before I need to pay for teh VP50 pro and by then hopefully I will have the credit for trade in.

are you sure, aaron? the AVS deal will be there next time also - for the VP70 next spring. I'd rather miss out on one upgrade, than partake of a less than stellar offer.

Last time, even tho the new feature set wasn't that compelling, the upgrade price was. This time, I really don't see 1K of improvement, let alone 1500 bucks after August, or 2K for guys like Danielo and aileen. :eek:

Most telling is the fact that they won't let anyone who has one talk about it - if no beta users talk before the cutoff (see Gary and his NDA) - then there is nwih I'm dumping a G. If its out, let's let someone who has it tell us what works, what doesn't. Rather than buying straight off a retailer's feature list.

There might be a deal again but I don't know what the trade in for the VP50 will be then. With the current deal i can just about get a trade in value of what the VP50 cost me. The same thing was true when I traded the VP30 for the VP50.

you guys need to take the pro talk to the pro thread ;)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=889884

this thread is for the vp50 :)

-Gary

So this means we don't need to get a VP50pro to get all our VP50 issues resolved? :)

So this means we don't need to get a VP50pro to get all our VP50 issues resolved? :)

get over it dude

-Gary

There might be a deal again but I don't know what the trade in for the VP50 will be then. With the current deal i can just about get a trade in value of what the VP50 cost me. The same thing was true when I traded the VP30 for the VP50.

you may be right; hard telling; no way of even knowing if there will even be a VP70 to be trading for. But since you posted, I went and tried to discern a pattern in trade-in/upgrade values on the ABT site. As all can see, the value of any particular unit can vary a couple hundred bucks, depending on what it is traded on.

And then I went to the bay - must admit, even tho I don't like the upgrade deal, otoh, they are offering more for the 50 then they are asking on the bay. So in a way, this is like the loyalty bonus the FordMoCo offers to the poor slobs who trade in their Lincoln Town Cars on new ones - Ford gives them an extra 2k rebate, to lessen the pain of depreciation.

But, bottom line, unless the NDA expires and I hear some screaming news, I reckon I can safely wait for the next go round. After all, most of my bugs are fixed - not waiting for or expecting much else, so don't plan on being disappointed.

I am in the process of upgrading my utility program for the VP50Pro. No issue with the loader still works without a problem. It will be available at the time of the release of the Pro.

thanks Barry ;)

-Gary

I'll just use a creditcard that just ended it's billing cycle. that way I will have around 2 months before I need to pay for teh VP50 pro and by then hopefully I will have the credit for trade in.
It's not the $3500 hit on the CC that's bothering me, it's the fact that they are only offering the deal for the next 17 days or so, hardly enough time to get an idea of how well the product works. Plus, as far as I know, we still don't know how the SDI card is being handled costwise.

OTOH, the 30 day return policy has always been good, and when the tradein unit reaches DVDO I've always had my CC credited back the day they receive it.

IIRC, this offer time period seems to be about 2/3rds shorter than those in the past.

get over it dude

-Gary

What are you requesting that he "get over"? The fact that DVDO has promised 1080p24 in and 1080p24 out and, after a year, still has not delivered? Or the fact that, while this has been pointed out as a major issue for months now, they've left us dangling while they work on a newer product?

I own a VP50 and am joining the myriads of other pissed off owners who feel left out in the cold with a $3000 video processor that hasn't delivered on a major advertised feature since day 1. You can talk about NDAs all you want and claim to have information that will make everyone feel all better. All the NDAs and all the non-public information doesn't change the public perception that DVDO has given its loyal customers the cold shoulder - the same customers who supported them by buying VP50s despite lingering issues with the VP30.

Everything has an opportunity cost. Working on the firmware to fix the major 24Hz issue in the VP50 would have cost them work on the VP50 PRO and the subsequent revenue from its sales; working on the PRO has cost them work on the VP50 24Hz fix and customer satisfaction. They traded quicker revenue from a new product for 1) the value of the positive feedback that would be generated here from a VP50 fix, and 2) the willingness of current VP50 customers to upgrade to a PRO. Maybe they felt that the increase in revenue now was worth the drop in customer satisfaction and the loss of repeat business - I don't work for DVDO, so I don't know. Couple all this with virtually no news from DVDO for months regarding a VP50 fix, and you can't expect VP50 owners to be happy.

VP50 owners are asking two relevant questions - when are we going to get what was promised us, and what does the lack of delivery on that promise say about possible issues with the VP50 PRO? Until those questions are answered, don't expect the tone here to change, regardless of your efforts to downplay the validity of these issues.

What are you requesting that he "get over"? The fact that DVDO has promised 1080p24 in and 1080p24 out and, after a year, still has not delivered? Or the fact that, while this has been pointed out as a major issue for months now, they've left us dangling while they work on a newer product?

I own a VP50 and am joining the myriads of other pissed off owners who feel left out in the cold with a $3000 video processor that hasn't delivered on a major advertised feature since day 1. You can talk about NDAs all you want and claim to have information that will make everyone feel all better. All the NDAs and all the non-public information doesn't change the public perception that DVDO has given its loyal customers the cold shoulder - the same customers who supported them by buying VP50s despite lingering issues with the VP30.

Everything has an opportunity cost. Working on the firmware to fix the major 24Hz issue in the VP50 would have cost them work on the VP50 PRO and the subsequent revenue from its sales; working on the PRO has cost them work on the VP50 24Hz fix and customer satisfaction. They traded quicker revenue from a new product for 1) the value of the positive feedback that would be generated here from a VP50 fix, and 2) the willingness of current VP50 customers to upgrade to a PRO. Maybe they felt that the increase in revenue now was worth the drop in customer satisfaction and the loss of repeat business - I don't work for DVDO, so I don't know. Couple all this with virtually no news from DVDO for months regarding a VP50 fix, and you can't expect VP50 owners to be happy.

VP50 owners are asking two relevant questions - when are we going to get what was promised us, and what does the lack of delivery on that promise say about possible issues with the VP50 PRO? Until those questions are answered, don't expect the tone here to change, regardless of your efforts to downplay the validity of these issues.

HogPilot.............well done and my sentiments exactly. Toshiba continues to make improvements via firmware for my $300 HD-DVD player yet DVDO says "trust me" the marketing features will surely be there if you pay us at least $1000 more with no independent verification the features work as advertised.

The failure by DVDO to provide a fix for ADVERTISED specifications for the VP50 is a huge mistake. Gary, maybe in Kentucky they don't know the old saying "Fool me once......." I once asked Gary to give me some pointers as a new VP50 owner, by pm in fact, with no reply. I will put no faith in his observations of the VP50 PRO as it is obvious he must receive some REWARD from DVDO to not recognize the insult of "promises made, promises broken! :rolleyes:

So Gary in your own words, "get over it". :p

Gary, maybe in Kentucky they don't know the old saying "Fool me once......." I once asked Gary to give me some pointers as a new VP50 owner, by pm in fact, with no reply. I will put no faith in his observations of the VP50 PRO as it is obvious he must receive some REWARD from DVDO to not recognize the insult of "promises made, promises broken! :rolleyes:

So Gary in your own words, "get over it". :p

I love to put a egg timer on my PC desk and set it to go off when my location, Kentucky, is brought into the mix on these forums :cool:

you want to call me out on not answering your PM for free advice? :rolleyes: lets rock!

do you have any idea how many PM's I receive and answer everyday from people who do just that? so many in fact that I have to miss a few here and there because of the sheer amount of them, sorry but you were one of these that sifted thru the cracks

who is dumber?, someone in Kentucky or someone who PM's someone in Kentucky to ask for their advice? :p answer me that big boy ;)

-Gary

Not sure what that was all about.

Anyway, I've been an iScan (DVDO) customer since the the 'plus' unit. Had a Pro, Ultra, HD, HD+ and now VP50. Had one is EACH of my home theaters. Loved each upgrade, until the VP50. Haven't really had any major issues with the VP50, just annoyed they didn't deliver on any of the promised items. Don't promise them if you're not gonna follow through. It's rude. Having said that, my favorite feature of the VP50 is the VRS (ABT102). It rocks on SD material. My main complaint is I feel abandoned after the sale. I really feel for the VP30 people. I never owned one but it sure seemed like they got shafted. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't, appearances count for a lot. The iScan is no longer the value it used to be, in my opinion. But I'll still upgrade to the VP50Pro. But it may be my last if I feel slighted. Just my 2 cents.

I have to agree with Keenan and almost everyone else here.
DVDO has not delivered on what THEY promised the VP50 would do.

Therefore, NO sale from me.

I think consumers have to protect themselves and NOT reward unethical marketing by handing over more cash to companies that engage in these practices.

I love to put a egg timer on my PC desk and set it to go off when my location, Kentucky, is brought into the mix on these forums :cool:

you want to call me out on not answering your PM for free advice? :rolleyes: lets rock!

do you have any idea how many PM's I receive and answer everyday from people who do just that? so many in fact that I have to miss a few here and there because of the sheer amount of them, sorry but you were one of these that sifted thru the cracks

who is dumber?, someone in Kentucky or someone who PM's someone in Kentucky to ask for their advice? :p answer me that big boy ;)

-Gary

Gary,

Never said you were dumb, just over the top in defense of DVDO and their failure to make good on the VP50 which was marketed as the cure-all for VP30 owners. It really saddens me to think your position in regards to the apparent frustration of providing "free advice"!! Thank god the majority of forum members don't feel that way.

The current upgrade offer from DVDO appears generous, but to pay$1000 for more of the same is a sham. Lets just agree to disagree and leave it at that. :D

Gary,

Never said you were dumb, just over the top in defense of DVDO and their failure to make good on the VP50 which was marketed as the cure-all for VP30 owners. It really saddens me to think your position in regards to the apparent frustration of providing "free advice"!! Thank god the majority of forum members don't feel that way.

The current upgrade offer from DVDO appears generous, but to pay$1000 for more of the same is a sham. Lets just agree to disagree and leave it at that. :D

I think you missed the point dude, I enjoy replying to PM's just sometimes a few get missed

you mentioned Kentucky and you know why, just forget it though as you said, this is the VP50 thread, don't want to bog it down with a bunch of BS

-Gary

I really think this is a business decision made by DVDO, i.e. it's better to have revenue from the new product, and work on old pdts later, than continuing work on a sold product. The Pro doesn't happen overnight. It must have been planned for a long time. So all this while the resources had been allocated to the new development and less on bug fixes therefore many are left undone (for example, saving image shift in a profile, this can't be difficult. this doesn't involve any image processing/handshake/etc, purely an internal config save feature. I'm sure it's just no resources). Remember DVDO had a management shift earlier this year ? I see their focus is to move like Gennum, i.e. selling chips to other major players. It's mandatory to have the NR/EE chip available so to compete with otuers. The Pro I'd imagine is like a by-product of this development (of the new chip). Even after the PRO is shipped, I'd imagine more efforts will still be spent to sell these new chips to Yamaha/Arcam/the like rather than making a solid/ground breaking standalone VP for the hobbyist. There is no profit to be made catering to hobbyist This is the reality I'm afraid.

Gary, maybe in Kentucky they don't know the old saying "Fool me once......." I once asked Gary to give me some pointers as a new VP50 owner, by pm in fact, with no reply. I will put no faith in his observations of the VP50 PRO as it is obvious he must receive some REWARD from DVDO to not recognize the insult of "promises made, promises broken! :rolleyes:

So Gary in your own words, "get over it". :p
\\

I'm not fully up to speed on this thread but I've got to say that

Yep, thems fightin words :eek:

From what I've known of him Gary is a good dude.

I'm not thrilled with the way the upgrade is announced and all. I will pass on this upgrade but I still like what the VP50 does for my picture. Combined with the signal I get from my HTPC its hard to see how it can get any better.

I throw in my support for Gary on this one.

ed

For 480p material, I can access DNR and vertical & horizontal enhancer from my Denon3910.

For 1080i material I can access the Ruby's NR and DRC for perceived reality, clarity or go into the service menu to eliminate ringing. For 1080p or upscaled material I can go to my Samsung BD-P1200 an access the Reon NR.

So is the The Mosquito NR, Fine Detail Enhancement and Edge Enhancement on the VP50pro that much better? Seems like overkill features for $1000 more to upgrade again.

So firmware upgrades of the VP50 takes a back seat now? That sucks man!

fellas, take it elsewhere.

If you want to talk about PMs or who's smarter - there are plenty of forums for that, but it is not appropriate talk for this thread or forum for that matter.

I just bought a VP50, I have a couple of questions ...#1 is it worth keeping, I paid $1800 for it? #2 I see that there is some de-interlacing card available for it, why do I need to add this card? Doesnt the VP50 already have this card as compared to the VP30.

Doesnt the VP50 already have this card as compared to the VP30.

Yes, that's already in the VP50's board.

Unless you're talking about the SDI expansion board. But you aren't, are you?

I just bought a VP50, I have a couple of questions ...#1 is it worth keeping, I paid $1800 for it? #2 I see that there is some de-interlacing card available for it, why do I need to add this card? Doesnt the VP50 already have this card as compared to the VP30.

Yes,no,yes

VP50 is quite good; 1800 is a great price - many of us paid 3k for it. If you don't like it, you can always trade it in on the new improved model and get 2k credit. :D

and as has been answered, yes it does include the amazing ABT102 dl board. -you just got it; plug it in, try it. You already got a good deal - if you like what it does, you've got it made. ;)

Thanks so much for the response guys!!!! You guys here all rock! I am gonna set it up tonight. Can anyone comment on the most optimal setup, I have a SONY STA-DA7100ES HDMI A/V receiver, a SONY 5 disc changer NC-555ES and a HD Directv receiver which all feed a SONY VPL-VW50 thru HDMI. Currently I route everything through the A/V receiver, is there anythign wrong with the following setup:

Feed all audio/video input sources directly to the DVDO VP50 and have the output of the DVDO VP50 go to the projector thru HDMI cable. Then take optical output from the DVDO VP50 and run it into my Reveiver?

OR

Just leave everything as it is (Currently feeding my A/V reveiver) and have the HDMI output of the receiver go into the VP50 then to the projector?

I hope this makes sense...any advice would be appreciated I am leaning towards option #1 because all processing is done in the VP50 but the only thing that confuses me is the audio if it will cause a sync delay

I would try experimenting with both setups to see what works best for you. I currently run everything through my VP50 and then to my 3806, mostly because I need 4 HDMI inputs - the VP50 has 4, the 3806 has 2.

If your reciever does not have an audio delay feature you'll want to put the VP50 before it so you can use the AV lipsync feature to sync up the audio and video due to the video processing and other delays. Your reciever may have that feature but may not have enough delay available to compensate - hence I refer you back to my 1st statement, that I'd experiment with both and see what works best for you :) Hope you enjoy your new toy, I remember how excited I was with mine when I finally got my hands on one.

Thanks hogpilot ...love your avitar!!!! ...I am pretty excited, but I must admit after reading this thread I began to wonder about my purchase because so many people in this thread had/have issues with the VP50 it seems. Hopefully I can see some improvement in standard definition quality, once you watch something in HD on a 110 inch stewart screen SD looks like garbage i just hope it adds a bit of sharpness.

You should be fine, guy... with a good SD feed (say, the primetime Monday Night ESPN game) I get a great picture on my 11' screen - the ABT102 card still ranks as the best purchase I've made, in terms of picture quality improvement. It took my VP30 to a whole new level with SD decoding. Having it built into the VP50 doesn't hurt a bit. :D

otoh, my FX feed is horrid, and watching Rescue Me or the Shield is downright painful, no matter what I do. So if you try something and it is bad, just keep trying until you find a good signal to work with. It isn't the fault of the VP50, but rather the quality of the incoming signal stream that the VP has to work with.

NR would be nice but I went ahead and purchased an HDMI Flea for my broadcast sources.

In the HDMI Flea-guide (page 6) I read:
"People owning a Video Scaler should always install the Flea after the Video Sources and before the Video Scaler."

The Flea have only 2 inputs (HDMI) but the VP50 have 4 HDMI-inputs and also many other inputs. I have more than 2 sources/devices so I see Problems with the connections-introduction in the Flea-guide …

So I think it will be better to install the Flea after the VP50 – so I can use all the VP50-inputs anymore. But works the Flea then with all his functions/achievement so I get the best picture-quality?
How is your connections?

Other question:
Needs the Flea the stand or can the Flea also stand alone without the stand? Can the Flea also use reclined or then will be come thermal-problems?

Where have you bought your Flea, which price?

@Leghorn: Pharados asked the same question yesterday in the 50pro thread. You can put the Flea behind a scaler, but it won't work as good as the other way around. Has something to do with the original (unscaled) MPEG2 blocksize.

In the HDMI Flea-guide (page 6) I read:
"People owning a Video Scaler should always install the Flea after the Video Sources and before the Video Scaler."

The Flea have only 2 inputs (HDMI) but the VP50 have 4 HDMI-inputs and also many other inputs. I have more than 2 sources/devices so I see Problems with the connections-introduction in the Flea-guide …

So I think it will be better to install the Flea after the VP50 – so I can use all the VP50-inputs anymore. But works the Flea then with all his functions/achievement so I get the best picture-quality?
How is your connections?

Other question:
Needs the Flea the stand or can the Flea also stand alone without the stand? Can the Flea also use reclined or then will be come thermal-problems?

Where have you bought your Flea, which price?

I bought the FLea from here, AVS, they will give you a good price. I use it with two HDTiVos so my sources are the same and it's easy to use on the one input of my VP50.
I talked with the ALgolith people and they are specific that the FLEA has to be installed BEFORE the scaler. If I remember right it has to do with the block size. It won't work properly if in the chain after the scaler. It's expecting the block size to be a specific size and I guess when it goes through a scaler it changes.
Bottom line, I tried it just to see and there is big difference. It is noticeably better when the HDMI Flea is before the scaler.

Fudoh, aaronwt, thanks for your answers.

What is HDTiVos, a HDMI-switch?

.

What is HDTiVos, a HDMI-switch?


HDTiVo is Hi-Def TiVo, a PVR... not available outside the US.

The UK did have original v1 TiVo (SD) years back but since then TiVo pulled out of UK\Europe around 2001 to concentrate on the US market.

I still use my v1 TiVo and it is superb! Had it about 7 years


-Steve

Thanks Steve, for the fast explanation.

Maybe if I will use the Flea with my VP50, the right connections are:

Sources --> Switcher --> Flea --> VP50 --> Display

That's all with HDMI. And what is with analog-sources, I must connect direct with the VP50 and can't use the Flea?

I think this is not my play ... :(

Is it common to hook up the VP50 and not see drastic changes in the picture in SD from directv? The HD picture looks almost 3D, but I am kind of disappointed in the SD.

You can't make chicken salad out of chicken feathers.

Is it common to hook up the VP50 and not see drastic changes in the picture in SD from directv? The HD picture looks almost 3D, but I am kind of disappointed in the SD.

I told you I saw a big improvement - however, how much or little improvement you see will depend on how much, and how good, the processing is in your display device. I'm feeding a CRT projector - absolutely no internal processing, so I see a small to huge improvement on the SD signals, depending upon how good the originating signal is.

otoh, if you panel, or new gen pj already has a decent dl and scaling chip in it, you aren't going to see a lot of improvement. If I mislead by not stating this, I apologize. not my intent; that said, when viewing MNight Baseball, I can even see a pretty large difference between having the correct mode of the DL selected - if I forget, and leave it on FILM, the display is noticeably worse, until I wonder what's wrong, and finally check my settings.

But the VP50 is the only signal processor in my signal chain - so I always see what it does and does not do.

Is it common to hook up the VP50 and not see drastic changes in the picture in SD from directv? The HD picture looks almost 3D, but I am kind of disappointed in the SD.

Make sure your DirecTV box is putting out SD at 480i into the VP50, so that it is doing all the scaling/deinterlacing.

It will also vary by channel/show, if its something DirecTV compresses alot (the news/financial channels, for instance), there isn't going to be much there for the VP50 to work with.

Make sure your DirecTV box is putting out SD at 480i into the VP50, so that it is doing all the scaling/deinterlacing.

It will also vary by channel/show, if its something DirecTV compresses alot (the news/financial channels, for instance), there isn't going to be much there for the VP50 to work with.

EXACTLY! - just what I've seen. Most of the sd cable I watch is sports; there is a world of difference between the prime time games on ESPN (the ones that are also broadcast in HD - so all of the best gear is there) and the regional football games they do during college season - at least in my market, most of those games are barely watchable on a 36" crt. By the time they are blown up on my screen, its a lot like taking a VGA display (640x480) and trying to expand that. Hideous. Nothing is going to help that.

Ok thanks for the responses, 1 other question, i noticed that the VP50 gives me the option to do 1080i or 1080p when watching programs from my directv box. When i select the 1080i the VP50's menu is big and readable and when i got to 1080p setting the menu becomes little. I am assuming the if i am receiving a 1080i signal i should leave it and not convert it to 1080p and that converting a i signal to p is just needless processing.

Is the Crystalio 3800 II in a totally different class than the VP50? Is it like trying to compare a Yugo to a Porsche? I am new to this video processing realm and was just wondering how a $5000+ signal processor is justified as the Crystalio 3800 II is.

Probably best just to start reading thru Joerod's thread. (on the Crystallio) Not Yugo to Porsche. Maybe Corvette to Ferrari? :D Or Chevy Cobalt to Corvette? The Crystallio does things I wish a DVDO did (PIP/POP for one)

I do not believe it comes with a USB to serial adapter. That is your contribution. I personally use the edgeport line of products but many others will owrk. If your PC has a serial port all the better. The cable between the VP50 and the serial adapter or serial port must have all wires (actually it needs 5 specific ones), and almost all commercial cables will have that.

Many displays although they have a stated native resolution still perform some scaling of the picture which is what you are trying to avoid. There may be some option on the display to do that. Perhaps if you stated the display mfg and model some one is using the same one and can help you.

The key test patterns to start with are the frame geometry, and then the checkerboard, vertical lines and horizontal lines patterns. If they look as specified in the manual then the VP50 is aligned to the display (VP50 at same resolution as display)

XGA is just a particular resolution from a p PC like VGA, SVGA, etc. it is generally taken to be 1024x768. This would indicate that your display is not a 16:9 aspect ratio unit but rather has a 4:3 aspect ratio; ergo probably not a HD display. So why are you using a VP50 which is really aimed at the Hi Def market although it should work with a standard definintion display, but why? The VP50 shines when scaling SD material to HD formats, or when converting HD material in one format to a different one to match the display.

It is very difficult to damage the VP50, but you can get it into a state where it is very uncooperative (no firmware loaded) and must have its firmware reloaded before it will work in its normal sense. In effect it has had a lobotomy. That is also very hard to do unless you are loading firmware and I would not do that until you have the basic alignment completed. Concentrate on the output section only.

I suspect your unit has a NR of 1360x768. Try setting up the VP50 for that resolution and check the three test patterns I mentioned. You may need the latest firmware for that resolution to be available.

toby10
XGA is the computer standard for 1024x768. XGA is the resolution you want to use. If there is problems, check the spesifications for use with computers or search the native rate treads here at avsforums. You may change some of the timings a bit.

XGA is the most used standard for 42" plasmas. Just set the vp to be 16:9 output. Your display will handle HD sources.

The VP can handle 4:3 signal in many different ways. Pick your choice.

is it only me or doesn'T dvdo answer in the moment questions regarding sales and support of VP50 ?

i ask several time just got an read mail but no answer, also a reask where my answer is and i received nothing ?:mad::mad:

You aren't the only one DVDO doesn't answer.
They usually give the silent treatment when their answer might put them in a negative light.
This has been an established pattern...:rolleyes:

is it only me or doesn'T dvdo answer in the moment questions regarding sales and support of VP50 ?

i ask several time just got an read mail but no answer, also a reask where my answer is and i received nothing ?:mad::mad:

Do you mind sending me the question or reposting here?

I am afraid I can do nothing to answer your question unless you (re)ask it. Yes you may have asked it before, but to expect someone to go through all posts and answer all questions that were asked is an unrealistic expectation.

Do you mind sending me the question or reposting here?

I am afraid I can do nothing to answer your question unless you (re)ask it. Yes you may have asked it before, but to expect someone to go through all posts and answer all questions that were asked is an unrealistic expectation.

hi josh, nice to here from
you are correct it i do not expect that in forums alle post where answered, i send all my questions to dvdo direkt (support, sales and info) and these questions where not answered. i will send you an email tomorrow (since i have to wake up in 5 hours:eek:) to go to work.

i suspect your dvdo email is your forum name ? if not i will send you a PM.

Yes, my email address is the same as my user name: Josh@dvdo.com, but Josh@anchorbaytech.com also works.

Do you mind sending me the question or reposting here?

I am afraid I can do nothing to answer your question unless you (re)ask it. Yes you may have asked it before, but to expect someone to go through all posts and answer all questions that were asked is an unrealistic expectation.

I think you can expect a company to go through *all* E-mails and answer *all* questions when they advertise a support E-mail function.

You're not the only one who has experienced this Pharados. Sadly.

Quote:
PReP™ (Progressive Re-Processing)
PReP is a video processing technology, which is exclusive to Anchor Bay, that converts a progressive signal to its original interlaced format so that it can be subsequently deinterlaced by Anchor Bay's Precision Deinterlacing. With PReP, in addition to performing an outstanding job deinterlacing interlaced formats, an iScan VP50 can now improve a previously poorly deinterlaced progressive format. PReP works with 480p, 576p, 1080p/50 and 1080p/60.


I read that the Reon does not touch the 24p signal in the Samsung BDP1200 when set to 1080p24 it is getting it right off the disc. When I engage PRep to on, I see in the info screen as PRep on. What is the
VP50 doing if Prep only works with 1080p/60 as the DVDO info says above? :confused: I cannot tell the difference with bluray source Prep on or off.

Thanks.

ayla,

I know DVDO has had some spam filter issues (as many other companies have been having recently), which means that the email might not have even reached the company.

ayla,

I know DVDO has had some spam filter issues (as many other companies have been having recently), which means that the email might not have even reached the company.

from me sent mails i got read confirmation ! so they have arrived !!!

Ofer,

Do you have some news from DVDO about Noise Reduction and Detail Enhancement ?

What did they say concerning the wrong brochure ?


Richard.

I just placed my order.:D
When can we expect the VP50pro to start shipping?

Sorry Wrong thread!

SDI upgrade is online

We have just added to our web site a bundle offer including the new
iScan VP50 PRO processor and our upcoming HD-SDI input module at a
special price of $3,798. This bundle price of $3,798 represents a $300
savings over the total cost of both items if purchased separately:
$3,499 (VP50 PRO) + $599 (HD-SDI input module) = $4,098.

This bundle package is part of our upgrade program and can be ordered by
international customers on our web site directly at
www.anchorbaytech.com/support/upgrades/international.php. Note that you
will receive an additional 10% Early Order Discount if you place your
order before the end of the month.

Your net price on the bundle package will then be:
$3,418 iScan VP50 PRO upgrade unit + HD-SDI input module bundle with
10% EOD
+$250 International shipping & handling fees
-$150 Additional discount as part of AVS Forum coupon offer
-$2,100 After trading in your iScan VP50 with SDI
= $1,418

If that works for you, please call up AV Science at +1.585.454.1460 to
get the name of the coupon, and order your iScan VP50 PRO upgrade unit
from our web site using the coupon.

Ok thanks for the responses, 1 other question, i noticed that the VP50 gives me the option to do 1080i or 1080p when watching programs from my directv box. When i select the 1080i the VP50's menu is big and readable and when i got to 1080p setting the menu becomes little. I am assuming the if i am receiving a 1080i signal i should leave it and not convert it to 1080p and that converting a i signal to p is just needless processing.

NOt sure if anyone has responded to your post yet or not -

to clarify - STB native output is 1080i correct?

what panel/display do you have? what is the native resolution of the display?

you should let the DVDO do all the deinterlacing (p) and scaling you need.

ie: if you have a native 1080p panel/projector, set the VP50 for 1080p
if you have a 720p panel set the DVDO to output 720p

if you have a display/projector which is 1365x 768 AND accepts native resolution, try one of the settings on the VP50 which outputs the resolution above and matches your display native resolution '1:1' or Native.

if your display is 1024 x 1024, or 1365 x 768, etc.. and does not accept native resolution, your options are 1080p (best if it accepts 1080p) or depending on the display you should try between 720p and 1080i ... however outputting 1080i from the DVDO you are just using its scaling ability and not its deinterlacing to the full extent....

in the end... try and see what looks best for you... but its recommended you compare the actual PQ with real life TV/DVD,etc... not necessarily the size of the letter on the menu ...

Hope this helps,

Cheers,

Marcelo

Ok... not fun. I go down to watch a movie last night and my VP50 is dead. No power light, no nothing. The power brick is actually slightly warm so I know it's doing something, but I'm getting nada on the VP50. No power surges lately or anything, and it's plugged into a very nice power center anyway. Is there a fuse in this thing that I could have blown?

Ok... not fun. I go down to watch a movie last night and my VP50 is dead. No power light, no nothing. The power brick is actually slightly warm so I know it's doing something, but I'm getting nada on the VP50. No power surges lately or anything, and it's plugged into a very nice power center anyway. Is there a fuse in this thing that I could have blown?

No power light on the power supply? Hopefully, the power supply is defective.

Hmm... the power supply has a light on it? I never noticed that, I will check again. But I think I would have seen if there was a light on.

Hmm... the power supply has a light on it? I never noticed that, I will check again. But I think I would have seen if there was a light on.

Well, I'm pretty sure my VP30's power supply has one of those.

Well, I'm pretty sure my VP30's power supply has one of those.

The VP30 has a different power supply to the VP50, and it has a light whereas the 50 doesn't.

The VP30 has a different power supply to the VP50, and it has a light whereas the 50 doesn't.

Oh, I didn't know that.

The VP30 has a different power supply to the VP50, and it has a light whereas the 50 doesn't.

My VP-50 arrived DOA. I bought it through AVS when they first offered it. Sent the whole package back, they shipped it back to me and has worked every since. My power supply does have a small green LED.

So some have it, some don't. That's just how life is... ;)

Weird :) Anyway, something is definately dead. Not sure which piece it is. Guess it's time to try and get ahold of DVDO support!

Man, talking about feeling like an idiot... I must have knocked the power cord slightly lose from the power brick. I tightened it all up and I'm good to go again :)

Man, talking about feeling like an idiot... I must have knocked the power cord slightly lose from the power brick. I tightened it all up and I'm good to go again :)

So did it, or didn't it, have a light?

It does NOT have a light :)

It does NOT have a light :)

Just as I said...yours must be the same as mine

Hi all

Is there any news on an update yet that will allow us to switch off cadence detection for progscan sources? Now that I can get a decent 1080p signal out of the xbox Elite, having to use 1080i/game mode1 to avoid several frames of lag seems really very silly.

Ta...

Sorry if I've missed something - I did look.

Hi

Hope someone can help me.

Can the VP50 do EDID edit?

I have an iMac hooked up to the VP50 with DVI -> HDMI.

The only available output I have is 1920x1080 @ 60Hz and 50Hz.

I guess to watch HD DVD/Blu-ray the best output is 1920x1080 @ 72Hz, right?

If the VP50 has EDID edit, how do I use it, and will it make 72Hz available on the iMac you think?

Thanks
Martin

Hi

Hope someone can help me.

Can the VP50 do EDID edit?

I have an iMac hooked up to the VP50 with DVI -> HDMI.

The only available output I have is 1920x1080 @ 60Hz and 50Hz.

I guess to watch HD DVD/Blu-ray the best output is 1920x1080 @ 72Hz, right?

If the VP50 has EDID edit, how do I use it, and will it make 72Hz available on the iMac you think?

Thanks
Martin
No it doesn't. But if you use 1080p/60 then it can rebuild and output 24,48 or 72 from that.

No it doesn't. But if you use 1080p/60 then it can rebuild and output 24,48 or 72 from that.

Thanks for the reply!

How do I rebuild and output (should I use 24, 48 or 72hz on my upcoming Pioneer 8G)?

Is rebuilding just as good as 24hz in 24hz out does it introduce problems?

My current system includes a DVDO VP-50 feeding 1080p to a Sony "Pearl" projector (VPL-VW50) onto a 9' Stewart Firehawk screen. Although I primarily watch DVD (SD and Blu-Ray) and HD TV via HDMI, I still have several Laserdiscs (not currently available as DVDs) which are played at 480i from a Pioneer LD/DVD player through an S-video input on the DVDO. The image is horrendously soft and lacking color saturation, despite a supposedly certified ISF set-up. My prior system used the same LD/DVD player with a DWIN line doubler and a Zenith Pro-900 CRT projector (at 1080i) onto a similar sized screen and had a far more watchable image. Can anyone help me tweak the settings to optimize the LD image, or am I going to have to bite the bullet for the VP50-Pro upgrade, which supposedly better handles (sharpens?) SD content? Ofer?? Stacey?? Gary?? Josh?? ANYONE????

Thanks for the reply!

How do I rebuild and output (should I use 24, 48 or 72hz on my upcoming Pioneer 8G)?

Is rebuilding just as good as 24hz in 24hz out does it introduce problems?

I don't see why it wouldn't be - the 3:2 cadence out of a HD player is perfect, so it should be able to convert it to a true 24. You just choose 24, 48 or 72 as the output frame rate for a 60Hz input. You can do that with both interlaced or progressive sources. It's actually funnily enough what causes the problem that I posted about just before your question. You can't turn off the cadence detection that it uses to do this, so all progscan sources are delayed.

I don't see why it wouldn't be - the 3:2 cadence out of a HD player is perfect

Some HD DVD players, like the Toshiba XA-2, have an intermediate interlace/deinterlace step.

Some HD DVD players, like the Toshiba XA-2, have an intermediate interlace/deinterlace step.

True, I forgot that. Does it ever trip up?

Yes, the staircase scene in Mission Impossible III being the most infamous.

I recently purchased the new Pioneer G8 6010 plasma. While I don't mind spending another 3k for the VP50 to improve the video quality of SD broadcast as well as my 400+ DVD collection. Would I really see significant improvement for these "legacy" sources, as well as HD and BluRay sources.
Also, does anyone know where I can go see what this product can produce (i.e. side by side comparison a display with and without the scaler). I don't want to spend the 3k, just to see minor improvement from the scaler.

Thanks.

Hi all

Is there any news on an update yet that will allow us to switch off cadence detection for progscan sources? Now that I can get a decent 1080p signal out of the xbox Elite, having to use game 1080i/game mode1 to avoid several frames of lag seems really very silly.

Ta...

Sorry if I've missed something - I did look.


Choddo

No news as such, other than Josh said in the Pro thread that a) the Pro supports 1080p/24 passthru and b) they are going to "look into" providing the ability to turn off cadence detection after the initial shipments of the Pro. So, if you're holding your breath, you'll be blue in the face fairly soon

pete S

will it be possible or is it already at the vp50 ?

i want to connect yuv to the rgbHV conenction, does it accept it ?

VP30 w/ ABT102 vs VP50.

Hate to request a history lesson, but perhaps things have come up with the use of these two over the last year or so and their firmware changes that differentiates them further.

Could somebody do a quick review of the differences between the VP30+ABT102 and the VP50? Including any relevant performance experience.

thanks,

:)

VP30 w/ ABT102 vs VP50.

Hate to request a history lesson, but perhaps things have come up with the use of these two over the last year or so and their firmware changes that differentiates them further.

Could somebody do a quick review of the differences between the VP30+ABT102 and the VP50? Including any relevant performance experience.

thanks,

:)

Check out this link:

http://www.anchorbaytech.com/support/comparison_chart/

VP30 w/ ABT102 vs VP50.

Hate to request a history lesson, but perhaps things have come up with the use of these two over the last year or so and their firmware changes that differentiates them further.

Could somebody do a quick review of the differences between the VP30+ABT102 and the VP50? Including any relevant performance experience.

thanks,

:)

I know for one the VP30 can't process a 1080P signal. That is the main reason I got a VP50.

Having a new problem with my VP50. I'm now running my computer audio via coaxial digital and video via DVI->HDMI adaptor through my VP50 into my AVR using HDMI. It works fine normally. But if my computer isn't sending video, the VP50 just sits there and does nothing, even when I need it to be passing audio through the HDMI link.

What you are seeing does not surprise me. If you were running the video into the VP50 on anything other than HDMI I bet it would be fine. Since it is on HDMI the VP50 rightly or wrongly assumes that when there is no video there is nothing to do. I would call it a "flaw". If the audio is not on the HDMI cable and you have told the VP50 that, then the VP50 should not care about the audio. perhaps they need to care because of the Lip Sync issues. Then again perhaps the VP50 is really a video processor and without the video it gets cranky. Josh is the one to answer this.

Having a new problem with my VP50. I'm now running my computer audio via coaxial digital and video via DVI->HDMI adaptor through my VP50 into my AVR using HDMI. It works fine normally. But if my computer isn't sending video, the VP50 just sits there and does nothing, even when I need it to be passing audio through the HDMI link.

FWIW,
I have several components that are connected as you have but my VP50 goes directly out to my TV via HDMI where I don't use the audio portion. The components feed audio into the VP50 then out from the VP50's digital coax to my SSP. I would avoid sending the VP50 HDMI out to your AVR and expecting to just use the audio only with no video. The VP50 should normally be the last video component before your TV. I've had no problems with this type of configuration.
In your case I would probably connect the audio from the computer directly to your AVR, unless you require audio/video timing sync which isn't available with your AVR. HDMI in general has issues and was primarily developed for Video transmission. If the VP50 is flashing it's blue led you have an HDCP issue and the VP50 is blocking the transmission of your audio.
Note: Many new AVRs will allow you to adjust audio delays for sync. Also I haven't had to insert any audio delays and I have yet to notice any sync issues.
my 2 cents

My VP50 is my HDMI switch and I need HDMI audio for my DVD player for DVD-A and stuff. The only other way I can do it is to split the HDMI coming from the VP50, send it to my projector and my receiver, and then switch the receiver when I need to. Because otherwise, all of the video is HDMI but my audio would vary on the receiver and I can't figure out how to make that work. My receiver is an Elite 91.

There is no reason the VP50 shouldn't send an HDMI signal with just audio when it only has audio to work with. Unless there is a way to make this happen, it is indeed a flaw.

HDMI has video and audio intertwined by design.

You can have an HDMI signal with just video, is that not true the other way? If an HDMI signal has to have video, then there should be an option for the box to generate dummy video (just blackness) when it only has audio to work with.

You can have an HDMI signal with just video, is that not true the other way? If an HDMI signal has to have video, then there should be an option for the box to generate dummy video (just blackness) when it only has audio to work with.

The iScan Video Processors are video processors that have audio delay. If there is no video present, then there is no audio that needs to be delayed. It was not designed to be a SPDIF to HDMI audio converter. Is there a reason that you can't keep an active video signal running to the VP50 with your display turned off?

You can just use an HDMI splitter on the output of the VP50. I have one output go to my TV and one goes to my reeceiver. I can get HDMI audio from my receiver without having my TV on. You can get an HDMI splitter for under $95.
I'm not sure how it would work from a strictly audio device. But for a video/audio device it works for me. Any audio only devices I have go straight to my receiver.

I don't want to use an HDMI splitter as I would then have to select sources on both the receiver and the VP50. And no, I don't care if your Harmony/similar remotes make it easy. Also, I paid a lot of money for a VP50 and I think it should be able to keep an output with just audio.

Josh, it's my computer that's the problem. I seem to have a hard time getting nVidia's drivers to remember to output to the VP50. If I turn the VP50 off at all, the drivers are turning off DVI output and I have to specifically renable it. I get no sound until I do that. Very annoying!

I have just hooked up my VP50 to my RS1 and I was not able to get the hdmi inputs of the RS1 to work, although I do have analog out working. I spoke with Jason at AVS and he is trying to get me a replacement. In the mean time I have been playing around with the VP50 and the RS1. Right now I am running 1080i60 out of the VP50. I currently have the Toshiba HDA1, Motorola 6412, and and sdi modded Denon 3910 connected to the VP50 and I have been trying to get 1080p60 out of the VP50 into the RS1 with no luck. Is it not possible to do this over analog?

Hello all - I am hoping you can provide me some brief insight. I currently have the following equipment:

Panasonic plasmaTH-50PX75U (1366 x 768 native)
Toshiba HD-DVD
DirecTV HD

With my basic setup, would a VP50 be appropriate? I do enjoy pristine video, but am most curious if a VP50 would mesh well with my Panasonic to justify the added expense.

Thanks in advance for your help!

I'd go with the VP50 pro, stixx, because it has the noise reduction. Both D* and E* are in severe need of some good noise reduction.

If I turn the VP50 off at all, the drivers are turning off DVI output and I have to specifically renable it.You can use a Gefen DVI Detective to trick your computer into thinking that what it's connected to is always turned on. You can also make it think it's connected directly to your display if that's beneficial to you. I use one with my computer and VP50.

Hi to ALL,
I'm new to this forum.
Josh,I'd like to know how much I have to keep aside to upgrade my VP50 to the VP50PRO(keep in mind that I live in Australia)


And to anyone that can accommidate me and post some pictures of the menu's because I've seen some pictures in this forum that don't look the same as what I see on my display.
Does the onscreen menu change depending on output resolution(might be a stupid Question but had to ask) Anyway its great to read all of your posts, I've had no problems as of yet (just a wonder of the onscreen menu)

Help??? Early on in this forum it was suggested that I set the output from my PS3 at 1080i because it was recommended that the VP50 would do a better job of scaling, processing, etc. than if I output the PS3 at 1080p to the DVDO. The VP50's output is currently 1080p@60 to my Sony "Pearl". Today I tried to change the PS3 display output to 1080p in advance of opting to send BD content at 1080p@24 to the VP50 (then 1080p@48 from the VP50 to the Pearl), but the PS3 failed to synch with the VP50 and defaulted to 1080i. Can anyone provide a clue as to why the PS3 fails to recognize the ability of the VP50 to accept a 1080p signal when that's what the VP50 is sending via HDMI to the projector? I am running the most current PS3 update (v1.93). Thanks!

Help??? Early on in this forum it was suggested that I set the output from my PS3 at 1080i because it was recommended that the VP50 would do a better job of scaling, processing, etc. than if I output the PS3 at 1080p to the DVDO. The VP50's output is currently 1080p@60 to my Sony "Pearl". Today I tried to change the PS3 display output to 1080p in advance of opting to send BD content at 1080p@24 to the VP50 (then 1080p@48 from the VP50 to the Pearl), but the PS3 failed to synch with the VP50 and defaulted to 1080i. Can anyone provide a clue as to why the PS3 fails to recognize the ability of the VP50 to accept a 1080p signal when that's what the VP50 is sending via HDMI to the projector? I am running the most current PS3 update (v1.93). Thanks!

Try changing to a different input on the VP50, then switch back to the PS3 input.

Try changing to a different input on the VP50, then switch back to the PS3 input.

Thanks for your input, cal87, but that didn't solve the synch problem, either. Unfortunately, after a few garbled screens I just get bounced back to the manual selection screen of the PS3, indicating that it doesn't recognize 1080p in the VP50. Any other thoughts???

Thanks for your input, cal87, but that didn't solve the synch problem, either. Unfortunately, after a few garbled screens I just get bounced back to the manual selection screen of the PS3, indicating that it doesn't recognize 1080p in the VP50. Any other thoughts???

I originally had this problem. Can't remember how I solved it. How about trying to hook the PS3 directly to your display (1080p I hope), and set it up this way. Once you have 1080p as an allowed resolution, try hooking it back to the VP50.

Help??? Early on in this forum it was suggested that I set the output from my PS3 at 1080i because it was recommended that the VP50 would do a better job of scaling, processing, etc. than if I output the PS3 at 1080p to the DVDO. The VP50's output is currently 1080p@60 to my Sony "Pearl". Today I tried to change the PS3 display output to 1080p in advance of opting to send BD content at 1080p@24 to the VP50 (then 1080p@48 from the VP50 to the Pearl), but the PS3 failed to synch with the VP50 and defaulted to 1080i. Can anyone provide a clue as to why the PS3 fails to recognize the ability of the VP50 to accept a 1080p signal when that's what the VP50 is sending via HDMI to the projector? I am running the most current PS3 update (v1.93). Thanks!

If I remember correctly, when you touch the unit to turn it on, continue to hold your finger down on the unit and it will reset the resolution and it will take you through the video setup again.

Do you have the PS3 set up to 1080P/24 - manual??

If so, out of curiosity, what disk are you trying?? I can not get the POTC disks to play with forced 1080/24. All others work just fine (around 100 now).

Seems like all other models get the premium support... We want a new firmware as well!!

Seems like all other models get the premium support... We want a new firmware as well!!

You are not paying attention.

What is the recommended color space output from the VP50? I'm getting my Toshiba 2007 1080P DLP set calibrated this week. When I had my Samsung calibrated it was set on RGB output and has been there since. Should I leave it on RGB or change the color space. Plus I'll be switching to the VP50 pro soon so I want to make sure I have the set calibrated with the best colorspace output.

More on colorspace,

Does anyone know how to access the colorspace option in the "input adjust"menu.

Or does anyone know why I cannot access it?(dvd player via component connection)
Any help would be appreciated

What is the recommended color space output from the VP50? I'm getting my Toshiba 2007 1080P DLP set calibrated this week. When I had my Samsung calibrated it was set on RGB output and has been there since. Should I leave it on RGB or change the color space. Plus I'll be switching to the VP50 pro soon so I want to make sure I have the set calibrated with the best colorspace output.

It was established somewhere here that the VP50 is internally a 10 bit YUV 4:2:2 processor. I'd bet good money that the VP50 Pro is the same.

The best signal to send from the processor however depends more on your set than the processor. I don't know anything about the Toshiba set so I can't say. If it is a 10 bit 4:2:2 set internally then that is probably the best signal to send. The fewer colorspace conversions in the chain the better.

In my case I'm running a Samsung DLP which internally uses an 8 bit RGB bus. Any other formats are transformed to RGB by the HDMI receiver chip. I therefore trust DVDOs YUV -> RGB conversion more and send an RGB signal to the set. Can I see a difference? Not really. I can convince myself I see a difference, but it's probably self delusion. The set almost certainly does several conversions from RGB to YUV and back, any gain from having the DVDO do the conversion is probably insignificant.

- Collin

More on colorspace,

Does anyone know how to access the colorspace option in the "input adjust"menu.

Or does anyone know why I cannot access it?(dvd player via component connection)
Any help would be appreciated

Its really to pick HDMI colorspace formats. It doesn't apply to analog signals. Your DVD player's component connection is always analog YUV.

- Collin

You are not paying attention.

He's absolutely right. The VP50 needs fixes and the last update was in may. At least they should fix a passtrough, so it would be possible to put game console and computer signals through it in a decent way. It should also be upgraded with NR, as "promised". A lot of VP50 owners feels left out and refuses to (again) upgrade to get "promised" functionality.

Thanks Collinp,

I'm still learning

Can anyone enlighten me with a suggestion....my Question is

I have a samsung HD set top box that has a switch for resolution (its set to output at 1080i)and going into my VP50 and the picture is suffering from a "halo" effect.
Since the STB cannot output a native resolution,the signal has to be upconverted to the specified output and then processed by the VP50(with the flaws passed on by the STB)It doesn't matter which way I go (if I set the switch on the STB to output 576p it has to downconvert the signal and pass it on, thus still processing in the STB)
should I buy a STB that can output the signal natively?????
My display is Sony KDS60R2000
DVDO VP50
Samsung HD set top box

not just halo effect around pictures but also on the pictures (noise of some sought)
Im just wondering if its because the VP50 is proccessing a signal thats not good?
Today I watched "Ice age"and the picture was unreal(on par from what ive seen from HD formats, very much 3D indeed)from my DVDplayer output at 576i to the VP50 and that output 1080p to my sony 60" tv(I couldnt beleive it,nor could my Mum & Dad)
SO back to the HD set top box,

Does anyone know if buying a HD set top box with the ability to output native resolution over HDMI would help this problem

It was established somewhere here that the VP50 is internally a 10 bit YUV 4:2:2 processor. I'd bet good money that the VP50 Pro is the same.

The best signal to send from the processor however depends more on your set than the processor. I don't know anything about the Toshiba set so I can't say. If it is a 10 bit 4:2:2 set internally then that is probably the best signal to send. The fewer colorspace conversions in the chain the better.

In my case I'm running a Samsung DLP which internally uses an 8 bit RGB bus. Any other formats are transformed to RGB by the HDMI receiver chip. I therefore trust DVDOs YUV -> RGB conversion more and send an RGB signal to the set. Can I see a difference? Not really. I can convince myself I see a difference, but it's probably self delusion. The set almost certainly does several conversions from RGB to YUV and back, any gain from having the DVDO do the conversion is probably insignificant.

- Collin


I know the Toshiba sets have 14 bit internal processing that outputs 12 bit. So maybe I should go ahead and input the 10bit 4:2:2 signal from the VP50.
I don't know what the bit depth of the DMD is but it should be at least 10 bit. I know my old Samsung was 8 bit but I thought the newer DLP sets were 10 or 12 bit which allowed more gradiations in the colors and grayscale.

I'd probably run 10 bit 4:2:2 then. If the set keeps the resolution 10 bit or greater through the whole pipeline it may make a visible difference over 8 bit RGB.

- Collin

He's absolutely right. The VP50 needs fixes and the last update was in may. At least they should fix a passtrough, so it would be possible to put game console and computer signals through it in a decent way. It should also be upgraded with NR, as "promised". A lot of VP50 owners feels left out and refuses to (again) upgrade to get "promised" functionality.

Although I agree, Josh made it very clear early on in the VP50PRO thread that 1) no 1080p24 passthrough fixes would be made available until after they got the VP50PRO out the door, and 2) neither NR nor detail enhancement would ever be offered on the VP50 because it doesn't have the internal processing support for either feature.

DVDO knew within days of releasing v1.04 that the 1080p24 passthrough - one of the main features the firmware was supposed to fix - didn't work. They chose to shelf the issue and work on something else. Long story short - I wouldn't hold my breath for v1.05.

DVDO knew within days of releasing v1.04 that the 1080p24 passthrough - one of the main features the firmware was supposed to fix - didn't work. They chose to shelf the issue and work on something else. Long story short - I wouldn't hold my breath for v1.05.

Don't hold your breath, but with any luck, we'll get one more firmware upgrade, if the VP30 is any indication. Probably about the same time as the bug fix that makes the VP50 Pro work as promised, they'll also roll the applicable changes into the 50. And at that point, I'll agree - that will be the end of the road for upgrades. :rolleyes:

Course, by then DVDO will expect us all to have traded in for the VP70+, so support for the 50 would be the last thing on their minds.

Don't hold your breath, but with any luck, we'll get one more firmware upgrade, if the VP30 is any indication. Probably about the same time as the bug fix that makes the VP50 Pro work as promised, they'll also roll the applicable changes into the 50. And at that point, I'll agree - that will be the end of the road for upgrades. :rolleyes:

Course, by then DVDO will expect us all to have traded in for the VP70+, so support for the 50 would be the last thing on their minds.

DVDO better fix the 1080p24 passthrough issue - the product is spec'ed to be able to accept and output that resolution/framerate!

I understand no product is perfect leaving the gates, and that bugs will pop up that need addressing. My ire results from the fact that, while Josh is busy pushing DVDO's newest product here on the forums - a product that has come to fruition because they shelved the VP50 issue - he religiously ignores any questions in this thread having to do with fixing the VP50's major issue.

The longer DVDO delays discussing this issue and the time frame for a possible fix, the more alienated I feel as a customer. At this point I can almost guarantee I will not buy another DVDO product - I just don't know whether I will replace my VP50 with a Radience sooner rather than later.

With so much judder inherent in the film camera I don't think overrated 24p is the VP50's major issue.

With so much judder inherent in the film camera I don't think overrated 24p is the VP50's major issue.

I'm speaking purely from the standpoint that 1) 1080p24 passthrough is something that's been on the spec sheet since day one, and 2) a lot of people who bought the VP50 now want to use that feature, and it still hasn't been delivered.

We're not talking something like NR or edge enhancement that was discussed as an add-on after the product was released. This is something that was supposed to be inherent to the VP50 from day one and still doesn't work, and hasn't been addressed by the company when asked about it.

As far as PQ goes, I've read (I have no solid sources to confirm this) that the PS3 decodes full progressive frames when in 1080p24 mode, but only decodes and processes 1080i60 before converting it to 1080p60 in 3:2 pulldown - I'd like to see if there's a discernible difference between the two modes but have been unable as of yet because of the VP50 issues. I certainly don't view it as a "cure all" for judder issues, but I can definitely tell a difference between 1080p60 3:2 pulldown from a 24 fps source vs 1080p24 native on my RS1 - the latter looks a lot smoother during pans and action sequences. Since I'm watching all my HD discs at 24fps anyways, it would be nice to have a straight 24fps path with no conversion at any point.

I'm speaking purely from the standpoint that 1) 1080p24 passthrough is something that's been on the spec sheet since day one, and 2) a lot of people who bought the VP50 now want to use that feature, and it still hasn't been delivered.

We're not talking something like NR or edge enhancement that was discussed as an add-on after the product was released. This is something that was supposed to be inherent to the VP50 from day one and still doesn't work, and hasn't been addressed by the company when asked about it.



Actually 1080p-24 was not supported, or advertised , as an accepted input resolution when the VP50 was announced and began shipping. At the time there were no 1080p-24 sources so it was imposssible for us to verify that this worked. We do have every intention of addressing this issue on the VP50, but as I have stated previously this will be after the VP50PRO starts shipping. When there is schedule set for this release I will be happy to let everyone know about it.

Actually 1080p-24 was not supported, or advertised , as an accepted input resolution when the VP50 was announced and began shipping. At the time there were no 1080p-24 sources so it was imposssible for us to verify that this worked. We do have every intention of addressing this issue on the VP50, but as I have stated previously this will be after the VP50PRO starts shipping. When there is schedule set for this release I will be happy to let everyone know about it.

Thanks for replying. I don't have a brochure, manual, etc from "day one" but I do have one from right now, and 1080p24 processing is advertised. In addition, 1080p24 sources have been available for all of 2007 and a good portion of 2006. I'm not privy to decisions made inside the company nor am I privy to the reasoning behind them; irregardless of either, I do know that this issue was identified quite some time ago, and it still has yet to be corrected, hence my frustration.

In addition, 1080p24 sources have been available for all of 2007 and a good portion of 2006.

I know this is semantics but the first CE device that supported 1080p24 was the Sony BDP-S1 that came out in early December.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/11/28/sonys-bdp-s1-has-landed-finally/

Hi Josh

can you help with this issue?

It looks like my VP50 is combing horribly (on lettering and anything else on the screen)when fed signals from my set top box(could this be a source issue)
My set top box can only output the resolution that its set to (switch on the back,so it is not possible for the STB to bypass proccessing eg.up/down conversion of the signal before output)Thus probably causing the problem.
Its not the same for all channels(program material)some are good, some are terrible but I must say though, that the VP50 is flawless when fed signals(576i)from my dvd player, I couldn't beleive my eyes(not long got my 1080p display ,so for a little while I was unable to reek the benifits of having the VP50,but well worth the very short wait.

would it help if I buy a DVR that outputs native signals??

I hope to read your reply

Thanks

I know this is semantics but the first CE device that supported 1080p24 was the Sony BDP-S1 that came out in early December.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/11/28/sonys-bdp-s1-has-landed-finally/


Only thing I can say to this statement is that the VP50 was (and is) markeded as a "top of the line" product with a range of features. So why risk getting a bad relationship with your buyers and potential buyers by not fixing such a trivial (should be when you work in a niche segment with only a few other competitors) problem.

Also.. When I did buy this product I read this brochure from you guys that did state a lot of features I still haven't seen... A few have already asked about this before... So I'm extremely disappointed in you guys for not delivering on your word (written sales material) - ref: PDF document DVDO_VP50_bro_HiRes_PP.pdf . This brochure makes you want to buy the VP50 because of the features: VRS Precision Deinterlacing (available), Noise Reduction (where is it?), Detail Enhancement (where is it?), 1080p Input Processing (Lacking... 1080p24?!?), All Video processing algorithms are upgradable (yeah.. upgradable, but where is the support..)

All in all I just want the features that I looked for when I bought this product... (ref: printed sales material) At the moment I really are looking for yet another box $1000+++ to do NR... And with a bad track record from previous products I really don't dare spending money on a DVDO if you guys really don't care about what you promise and what you deliver...

I know it's harsh words, but spending a lot of money on a product such as a VP50.. You expect great things, support, beeing given features promised etc etc. Even sometimes getting new features not origially in the specification. And if the hardware in the VP50 isn't powerful enough to do some of the features then what about a cheap (or free) upgrade of core components or an implementation of a limited set of features (NR+++).

Hey, Josh, I'm sure you remember our former President's concept of "it depends what the meaning of the word is, is"?? Well, how about "any rez in, any rez out"??? Sound familiar?? I think that longstanding DVDO mantra is what many of us VP50 owners are distressed about when it comes to 1080p/24; those of us who bought the unit (in the first place) once the PS3 and BD were known to have that capability for DVDs have been anxiously awaiting the meshing of that rez with state of the art display systems. You, and Anchor Bay, can parse your terminology (of what was promised when or what was available when) any way you choose, but the flat out bottom line is that the ball has been dropped here. We have an industry gold standard rez "in", but where is that same rez "out"??

If the VP50Pro (with the 1080p/24 fix presumably inherent) is only moments away from hitting the streets, why couldn't that fix be transposed NOW to the VP50 via a Beta patch??? It's hard to imaging that "all hands on deck" in your programming division remain fully occupied as the VP50Pro comes on line. Is it a question of processing power, or are the "engines" similar enough between the 2 units to accomomplish a firmware upgrade? Thanks, as always, for your honest participation.

....1080p Input Processing (Lacking... 1080p24?!?)....

My VP50 handles 1080P24. I feed it 1080P24 from my PS3 BD player and my XA2 HD DVD player.

My VP50 handles 1080P24. I feed it 1080P24 from my PS3 BD player and my XA2 HD DVD player.

He is referring to 1080p24 in -> 1080p24 out, i.e. passthrough - the VP50 is currently incapable of doing this. I would certainly consider that to be a major aspect of "1080p24 processing."

If, perish the thought, we NEVER get 1080p/24 rez "out" (pass through??) in the VP50, I'll be forced to split my HDMI out from the PS3: 1080/60 SD DVD and gaming through the VP50, AND a 2nd direct line to my projector for 1080p/24 BD (in addition to having to use the optical audio from the PS3 to my A/V receiver). Can anyone provide me with a reliable HDMI splitter for this application? I'm not looking forward to the $$$ needed to obtain another 30' HDMI cable because the VP50 can't perform as had been advertised. Thanks!

He is referring to 1080p24 in -> 1080p24 out, i.e. passthrough - the VP50 is currently incapable of doing this. I would certainly consider that to be a major aspect of "1080p24 processing."

Well actually, that would not be "processing". It would be "switching". And if that’s all you want, why have a VP in the loop in first place??

The VP 50 Processes 1080P/24 just fine - it processes 24 Hz up to 48 or 60 Hz. And it does this beautifully.

I've had my VP50 since before anything was outputting 1080P/24 and can remember when the PS3 was first enabled to do so. At first, the VP50 wouldn't accept that data stream from the PS3. If you look back in this string, Josh stepped up and took action. DVDO quickly released version 1.04 to address that, but it still wouldn't work. Then someone on this very string figured out that you have to change the output resolution to either 48 Hz or 60 Hz for it to work. Then all the RS-1 owners started confusing things because the RS-1 will not accept a 48 Hz signal. They then all started this rant that the VP50 will not, as you say "process" a 1080P/24 signal.

So while I’m not real happy with DVDO right now, and agree that they could have done much better supporting their customers, I think you need to do your homework before you start making blanket, and unsupported claims. You are not helping the situation by doing so.

Well actually, that would not be "processing". It would be "switching". And if that’s all you want, why have a VP in the loop in first place??

For many of us, the VP50 is in the loop BOTH as a processor AND switcher, as was prominently trumpetted in DVDO's advertising of the product. I, for one, have multiple (both legacy SD and HD) inputs into my VP50, having always expected to run a single ouput to my A/V receiver and display. To bypass the VP50 (because of a known shortcoming) for ANY input sort of defeats the switcher's function. No??? :(

The talk of passthrough and VP50 as a switcher made me think of something: since the VP50 is 4:2:2 YUV internally, if a full chroma-resolution RGB signal goes into it, say from a computer (is 4:4:4 still correct terminology when talking about RGB?), does it come back out with reduced chroma resolution? Would a passthrough mode prevent such reduction?

It will 'process' 1080P/24, but you have to tell it to do that. It will not 'pass' it. Try changing output format, you may be pleasently surprised. I have try routing direct to my projector off the PS3 at 1080P/24 and MUCH prefer the output from the VP50 at 1080P/48. It's smoother, no dropped frames, etc.... If your display will not take 48, then try 60. It looks great too!

I'm not a DVDO fan boy... I just don't think it's right to use wrong terminology to cut a product to shreads.

hey all,
I upgraded my old Denon receiver to a new Onkyo TX-SR805 which supports all the new fancy audio formats. But I seem to be having a problem with sync issues when watching sources from any of my satellite receivers (Bell Expressvu 6100, DirecTV HR-20 and HD Tivo HR10-250). The problem is that the video is far ahead of the audio for some reason, and I have to crank the VP50's a/v sync as far negative as it can go and the Onkyo doesn't have a reverse sync, only one that makes it worse. With this setting it is close but still off enough to be annoying. If the VP50 could go do a slight more delay it would be fine. But I am wondering why I have this issue all of a sudden. I am always outputting 1080p60 from the VP50 so theoretically the Onkyo should not be doing any video processing. My PS3 and DVD player do not have this issue. All sources are using HDMI for audio and video (except the Bell 6100 which uses toslink for audio output via HDMI with the VP50). The HR-20 is using Native output so the VP50 does all the work to 1080p60.
Any suggestions?
thanks!

I've always though about getting a scaler like the DVDO VP50 or VP50pro.

Right now i use my denon 4308 faroudja to do everything.

I know the VP50 would be a better option.

My quesiton is, how does the VP50 compare to Reon / Realta,

and how does it compare to say the new pioneer elite kuro's own processing.

does anyone have a screen comparison of different sources and how they look?

I'm never sure where the best processing is done.

Ideally, i'd like to have my denon reciever be the switcher for every as passthorugh and have something like the VP50, or realta, or even the new pioneer elites do the scaling / NR.

anyone have any feedback?

hey TallCoolOne,

are you conneceted to your onkyo thorugh component, and then HDMI out to the VP50?

there can be delay converting the signal from analog to digital I believe, even if it's passing through the same resolution

schwock5 - no I am using HDMI out from the sources into the VP50, and HDMI out of the VP50 into the Onkyo.

there can be delay converting the signal from analog to digital I believe, even if it's passing through the same resolutionAnalog to digital conversion is practically instantaneous.

Looking for help with using the internal test patterns of the VP50:

The brightness/contrast pattern, I assume you adjust until both black bars are visible , with the lighter black bar clearly visible and the next level of black just barely. Same logic with the contrast control with one bar clearly visible and next white bar barely visible. Similar to using the Avia test disk.

Color Saturation...not really clear on this. Not as easy as the "flashing color squares" on the Avia disk.

I know these questions may be "mundane" to the DVDO experts out there but the owners manual is very crude in some areas like how to easily and comfortably use these test patterns.

Your help and knowledge would be greatly appreciated.

Display is JVC RS1.

Thanks,

Glenn

Hi Josh

can you help with this issue?

It looks like my VP50 is combing horribly (on lettering and anything else on the screen)when fed signals from my set top box(could this be a source issue)
My set top box can only output the resolution that its set to (switch on the back,so it is not possible for the STB to bypass proccessing eg.up/down conversion of the signal before output)Thus probably causing the problem.
Its not the same for all channels(program material)some are good, some are terrible but I must say though, that the VP50 is flawless when fed signals(576i)from my dvd player, I couldn't beleive my eyes(not long got my 1080p display ,so for a little while I was unable to reek the benifits of having the VP50,but well worth the very short wait.

would it help if I buy a DVR that outputs native signals??

I hope to read your reply

Thanks
Can anyone help in regards to this problem,it would be of great help and most appreciated.

Looks like combing on lettering and people, halos and noise(very disturbing)
equipment are as following,
sony KDS60R2000
samsung HD set top box
VP50

I keep thinking that its a source problem? any suggestions
many thanks

Can anyone help in regards to this problem,it would be of great help and most appreciated.

Looks like combing on lettering and people, halos and noise(very disturbing)
equipment are as following,
sony KDS60R2000
samsung HD set top box
VP50

I keep thinking that its a source problem? any suggestions
many thanks

You are absolutely right that this is a source problem. What you are seeing is the deinterlacing by the STB, or even the broadcast network if they are upconverting, fail on some content and hence the combing.

Thanks Josh,

Getting a new STB(PVR)and yes the broadcasters do upconvert alot of their material(BADLY)

Do you think it would help much if I buy a PVR that can output a native signal?
thanks for your reply to this (my head can rest easy)
Cant wait to get the PRO

Do you think it would help much if I buy a PVR that can output a native signal?

Absolutely. The PVR that I have, the HR10-250 (DirecTV HD-TiVO), requires that you change the output to the native resolution of the content and I do find myself in the wrong output mode from time to time and the resulting image scares me.:eek:

Well its always good to add another component to the family

Looking for help with using the internal test patterns of the VP50:

The brightness/contrast pattern, I assume you adjust until both black bars are visible , with the lighter black bar clearly visible and the next level of black just barely. Same logic with the contrast control with one bar clearly visible and next white bar barely visible. Similar to using the Avia test disk.

Color Saturation...not really clear on this. Not as easy as the "flashing color squares" on the Avia disk.

I know these questions may be "mundane" to the DVDO experts out there but the owners manual is very crude in some areas like how to easily and comfortably use these test patterns.

Your help and knowledge would be greatly appreciated.

Display is JVC RS1.

Thanks,

Glenn

You want to calibrate your display’s brightness and contrast using this test pattern, and adjust them both in steps. Use the two top boxes for adjustment, and use the bottom two boxes for reference. The bottom two boxes have whiter than white and blacker than black bars that are darker/brighter than the ones in the top boxes. You want to see those disappear first.

First, adjust contrast to the point where the “whiter than white” bar is no longer visible and you can only see the two other white bars.

Next, adjust brightness to where the “blacker than black” bar is no longer visible and you can only see the other two black bars. While doing this adjustment, also keep an eye on the two remaining white bars in the white box. As you increase brightness, you will have to adjust contrast to keep those two bars showing. –it’s a juggling act of sorts. Give a little over hear, take a little over there…..

Keep playing with the two controls until you find the happy medium of contrast / brightness. Depending on your preference of shadow detail, you may want to bump up brightness a tad, but if you can see the below IRE (blacker than black) bar, you’ve gone too far. Same with your whites. You want to see those bright scene highlights and white scenes look white and not blue. But you don’t want to push contrast too far or you will blow out the mid range color tracking and gamma.

So in summery, your goal is to get as much of a separation between contrast and brightness as possible, but at the same time, don't go too far.

If you have a wave form monitor, this test pattern is great to use with it.

You want to calibrate your display’s brightness and contrast using this test pattern, and adjust them both in steps. Use the two top boxes for adjustment, and use the bottom two boxes for reference. The bottom two boxes have whiter than white and blacker than black bars that are darker/brighter than the ones in the top boxes. You want to see those disappear first.

First, adjust contrast to the point where the “whiter than white” bar is no longer visible and you can only see the two other white bars.

Next, adjust brightness to where the “blacker than black” bar is no longer visible and you can only see the other two black bars. While doing this adjustment, also keep an eye on the two remaining white bars in the white box. As you increase brightness, you will have to adjust contrast to keep those two bars showing. –it’s a juggling act of sorts. Give a little over hear, take a little over there…..

Keep playing with the two controls until you find the happy medium of contrast / brightness. Depending on your preference of shadow detail, you may want to bump up brightness a tad, but if you can see the below IRE (blacker than black) bar, you’ve gone too far. Same with your whites. You want to see those bright scene highlights and white scenes look white and not blue. But you don’t want to push contrast too far or you will blow out the mid range color tracking and gamma.

So in summery, your goal is to get as much of a separation between contrast and brightness as possible, but at the same time, don't go too far.

If you have a wave form monitor, this test pattern is great to use with it.

mdew,

Thank you so much for such a clear and concise method for adjusting brightness and contrast, very much like the AVIA calibration disk with a different and built in pattern from DVDO.

I am very pleased with the b & c settings on the RS1, still looking for help using DVDO's internal test pattern for setting COLOR SATURATION! Maybe Josh would be so kind????

Thanks,

Glenn

I'd be interested in hearing how to use those too. Their instructions say to adjust color to match the 'white' and 'blue' bars, but hell....they're on oposite sides of the screen! I can't make out squat trying to match them with that little blue filter in front of my nose.....

You may want to consider investing in one of CalMAN's calibration packages. I've been playing with that for a past few days, and while there is a steep learning curve, so far the results have been nothing short of impressive. Plus, it's kinda fun....

Any idea's as to when we'll hear about a potential improvement for 24 fps with the VP50?

I am very pleased with the b & c settings on the RS1, still looking for help using DVDO's internal test pattern for setting COLOR SATURATION! Maybe Josh would be so kind????


The proper test pattern in the iScan VPx0 to adjust your display's saturation and hue is the test pattern titled "Color8 Bars75". This test pattern is based upon the SMPTE Color Bars test pattern, with the addition of a black bar. The proper way to use this test pattern, in conjunction with a blue filter, is to adjust your display's saturation up until the far left bar (white) and the second bar from the right (blue) have the same brightness. You use the same method to adjust the hue/tint on the display, although you want to adjust the hue/tint until the third bar from the left (cyan) and the fourth bar from the right (magenta) have the same brightness.

Here's a question for the experts: If my display is a Pioneer Elite (110/150) that is native 1080P 76hz, should the VP50 be set to 1080P/24 always? (assuming we get it), or should it vary depending on input or be something else. I thought we want the display to do as little as possible, but the VP50 and VP50Pro do not output 1080P/72hz. Thanks.

Here's a question for the experts: If my display is a Pioneer Elite (110/150) that is native 1080P 76hz, should the VP50 be set to 1080P/24 always? (assuming we get it), or should it vary depending on input or be something else. I thought we want the display to do as little as possible, but the VP50 and VP50Pro do not output 1080P/72hz. Thanks.

If the source is a movie or was shot on film @24fps then you want to output 1080p/24 (unless it's a 1080p/24 HD source then 1080p/48 until that bug is fixed ;) ).

If it's something like sports or studio TV then you want 1080p/60.

For PAL (european etc) DVDs then you want 1080p/50.

If somebody wants to PM me with a review of exactly what the bug is, that would be great ;) I am buying a VP50 and I have an Epson 1080, SDI standard def DVD player and a Toshiba A2 HD-DVD player. I'm in the NTSC world :)

If somebody wants to PM me with a review of exactly what the bug is, that would be great ;)Discussion of bugs should absolutely be public. Otherwise, we might as well all be using censored manufacturer forums where anything negative gets deleted.

If somebody wants to PM me with a review of exactly what the bug is, that would be great ;) I am buying a VP50 and I have an Epson 1080, SDI standard def DVD player and a Toshiba A2 HD-DVD player. I'm in the NTSC world :)

Here is the deal. Since the 1.04 firmware, 24p was working pretty well. You could take a 60i or 60p source and output as 24p. It is pretty stable. You might get an occasional stutter here and there - never clear whether it was the processing or the source. You could also take a 24p source and output as 60p. This is very stable. However, if you take a 24p source and try to output 24p (as 24Hz locked), it does not work. You do not get any picture. You can output it as 23.98 unlocked, but this is not as stable.

I got my VP50 last week, and almost immediatly ran into a serious problem. When i tried to use the best possible 1080p60 timing/settings for my Barco 1209s, which are pretty weird as you might know (Hfp=44, Hbp=344, Hsync=44, f=60Hz) i noticed that as soon as the backporch exceeded 200, the VP50 started decreasing the framerate. Once i reached my much needed backporch of 344, the VP50 lost the 60Hz lock and was limited to 57Hz... this was all still within HDMI's 165Mhz limit...

I've emailed with DVDO, and i got a quick reply from Aaron, he said the VP50's bandwidth was software limited to 150Mhz... That explains my problem, my Barco timing is about 158Mhz... He passed this issue to the engineering team, i hope they come up with a fix.

So my workaround for the time being is... downscaling the 1920x1080p60 to 1815x1080p60... that way my Barco can show a decent picture, and the vp50 can just keep it's 60Hz lock... not exactly what i had i mind when i bought a scaler...

In the meantime, i can't find any other topics or threads about this. Surely i'm not the only Barco 1209s cowboy out there with a vp50? I was hoping more people would have the need for increasing the VP50's bandwidth!

Thanks for the info. I didn't mean to keep discussion out of the public, I just thought it was well known. Since I was asking for a "review", I meant that I didn't want to bore everybody with a post of what most everybody here already knows.

Anyhow, I for one will be inputting the VP50 with a 1080i signal from an HD-DVD player, a Toshiba A2. I don't know what my Epson 1080 can display. May upgrade my projector soon, so I'm not sure what situation I'll be in afterwards. I assume in order to get a good 24 fps using an lcd projector I will need refresh or scan rates of 24/48 or 72 hz in order for 24 fps to work well.

Don't know if this is the appropriate place for this. If not, tell me and I'll post it properly. :)

I received a VP50 a couple months ago as a gift. But it's a bit beyond my technical abilities to set it up properly (I'm not the brightest with A/V stuff).

So if anyone is interested, drop me a note and I'll gladly answer any questions. I'll ship for free anywhere in the continental US (UPS Ground). I'm open to any reasonable offer.

- VP50
- Upgraded firmware 1.04
- Original box & all packaging materials
- All included std. accessories (ps, remote, manual)
- Std. included CD software CD
- Std. included VRS optimization DVD

Thanks :)

I'd like to know who gave you a VP50 as a gift so I can become friends with them and receive some sweet gifts, or at least have them give tips to my girlfriend as to what would make a good gift for my birthday/Christmas. :D

In all seriousness, the Marketplace would probably be a better place to post something like this.

Please see the VP50Pro thread. Josh@DVDO has mentioned a VP50 beta v1.05 but has not given any detail.

Please see the VP50Pro thread. Josh@DVDO has mentioned a VP50 beta v1.05 but has not given any detail.

Yep, I saw this as well. Very interesting!
I could not find it on their website yet.
____
Axel

I could not find it on their website yet.

I would look later on in the week, you might have better luck.

The forthcoming Beta version for the VP50, v1.05, includes the following bug fixes:

1080p-24 Input to 1080p-24 Output - There should be no tearing or judder
Improved 1080i-50 Deinterlacing - In "Auto" mode 1080i-50 deinterlacing is improved
Flashing 48 Pixels - The flashing 48 pixels at the top of the screen, that appeared sporatically, are no longer...
Removed Limit on Scaler - Previously the scaler was limited to 150MHz. In Advanced User mode, the new limit is 165MHz.

This version could be available as early as tomorrow.

Removed Limit on Scaler - Previously the scaler was limited to 150MHz. The new limit is 165MHz.
Josh, this is fantastic news! Can't wait to get my hands on this update!

Removed Limit on Scaler - Previously the scaler was limited to 150MHz. The new limit is 165MHz.

Josh, this is fantastic news! Can't wait to get my hands on this update!

What does the above improvement enable?

What does the above improvement enable?
See http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=11830399&postcount=5434 :)

The forthcoming Beta version for the VP50, v1.05, includes the following bug fixes:

1080p-24 Input to 1080p-24 Output - There should be no tearing or judder
Improved 1080i-50 Deinterlacing - In "Auto" mode 1080i-50 deinterlacing is improved
Flashing 48 Pixels - The flashing 48 pixels at the top of the screen, that appeared sporatically, are no longer...
Removed Limit on Scaler - Previously the scaler was limited to 150MHz. In Advanced User mode, the new limit is 165MHz.

This version could be available as early as tomorrow.

No passthrough??

No passthrough??

That's what 1080p24 Input to 1080p24 Output is.

The forthcoming Beta version for the VP50, v1.05, includes the following bug fixes:

Removed Limit on Scaler - Previously the scaler was limited to 150MHz. In Advanced User mode, the new limit is 165MHz.



Awesome - can't wait to play with that. ;)

The forthcoming Beta version for the VP50, v1.05, includes the following bug fixes:

1080p-24 Input to 1080p-24 Output - There should be no tearing or judder
Improved 1080i-50 Deinterlacing - In "Auto" mode 1080i-50 deinterlacing is improved
Flashing 48 Pixels - The flashing 48 pixels at the top of the screen, that appeared sporatically, are no longer...
Removed Limit on Scaler - Previously the scaler was limited to 150MHz. In Advanced User mode, the new limit is 165MHz.

This version could be available as early as tomorrow.

flashing line and 1080i 50hz deinterlacing.... fantastic stuff for me....

That's what 1080p24 Input to 1080p24 Output is.

Main reason, is not 1080p, but all monitors that has a different native resolution than standard video. Where you want to avoid the processing for gaming or use of computer. Also to get HD audio through it.

The largest amount of monitors have 1366x768. Try sending that to the VP from a computer. Scaling computer signals looks like crap.

Should also differ sound and video prosessing and passtrough. Meaning process the video, but pass trough MPCM. As with the VP30 now, you have to choose between video processing or MPCM. If you set it to process video, you only get DD/DTS. If you set it to passthrough, you'll have MPCM, but not video processing.

Main reason, is not 1080p, but all monitors that has a different native resolution than standard video. Where you want to avoid the processing for gaming or use of computer. Also to get HD audio through it.

The largest amount of monitors have 1366x768. Try sending that to the VP from a computer. Scaling computer signals looks like crap.

Should also differ sound and video prosessing and passtrough. Meaning process the video, but pass trough MPCM. As with the VP30 now, you have to choose between video processing or MPCM. If you set it to process video, you only get DD/DTS. If you set it to passthrough, you'll have MPCM, but not video processing.

I'm not clear on everything you alluded to in your post, but if you set the output resolution to the input resolution, what processing is the VP50 doing? The VP50 is fully capable of outputting 1366x768 if that's what you pipe in.

As to the audio portion, I'm not aware of any such restrictions on the VP50 - I process video and can still pass MPCM without any problems. Maybe I'm missing something, your post was a little unclear.

I'm not clear on everything you alluded to in your post, but if you set the output resolution to the input resolution, what processing is the VP50 doing? The VP50 is fully capable of outputting 1366x768 if that's what you pipe in.

As to the audio portion, I'm not aware of any such restrictions on the VP50 - I process video and can still pass MPCM without any problems. Maybe I'm missing something, your post was a little unclear.

As an example if you use a PS3 you want 1080p24 input for BD but for games you want 1080p60 or 720p60. Currently the VP50 will not 'passthru' the game modes as it will at least add a delay because of the forced progressive cadence detection (which you can't switch off).

For these type of multifunction device being able to switch off all processing via a simple menu options would be very handy but you can switch it back on when needed for watching a movie at native res input.

Anyway 'passthru' has been promised in the VP line since before the VP50 was released although it does seem to have made it to the VP30 at last. Looking forward to the other fixes thou! ;)

I'm not clear on everything you alluded to in your post, but if you set the output resolution to the input resolution, what processing is the VP50 doing? The VP50 is fully capable of outputting 1366x768 if that's what you pipe in.

As to the audio portion, I'm not aware of any such restrictions on the VP50 - I process video and can still pass MPCM without any problems. Maybe I'm missing something, your post was a little unclear.

Ailean describes some of the problem. The VP sends out 1366x768 just fine, that's why we use it. But it will not axcept 1366x768 in. Game consoles are only affected because of lag, they send out standard video signals. The REAL gaming is done with computers, not the "kid stuff" like xbox and PS :cool:

Also pure computer use is more and more important in livingrooms too.

Do you get 1080i/p with Multich PCM to work with the VP50? Through HDMI?Sure the HD-DVD/BD is not converting to DTS?

Josh,

very nice!!

A But it will not axcept 1366x768 in. Game consoles are only affected because of lag, they send out standard video signals. The REAL gaming is done with computers, not the "kid stuff" like xbox and PS :cool:



just being curious - have you tried feeding it 1366x768 via dvi-d? Into the hdmi inputs? I know it won't take it via the RGB inputs, which is very counter-intuitive, but I thought the hdmi inputs would work...haven't tried it myself, since my ATI rig is strictly RGB out - would have to start over to use DVI. (new DVI splitters, etc - it works now, I just have to bypass the VP50 altogether, which I agree, isn't why I bought the VP50.)

Do you get 1080i/p with Multich PCM to work with the VP50? Through HDMI?Sure the HD-DVD/BD is not converting to DTS?

Yes, I am positive that when my AVR-3806 says "MULTI CH PCM" that it's recieving MPCM, vs when it says "DOLBY DIGITAL" or "DTS" for an unencoded DD or DTS bitstream, respectively.

Just uploaded the 1.05 firmware, and my major issue, the 165Mhz boundary problem, seems to be solved! Great work! Me and my Barco 1209s are very happy :)

Did not test/try the other features yet. Did found a problem with 60Hz lock mode in my custom 1080p resolution, which doesn't seem to work, screen goes black when selected. 48Hz lock still works. I can select manual 60Hz. Reported this issue to Josh.

Anyway, i'm very happy with this so far!

Has 1.05 been posted yet?

Removed Limit on Scaler - Previously the scaler was limited to 150MHz. In Advanced User mode, the new limit is 165MHz.Wahoo! My display needs that for its native format. If this works, I can get a better PQ on everything instantly AND remove an extra HDMI switch. I can't wait to try it.

(Allow disabling of progressive cadence detection too, and I'll stop being tempted to jump ship to a different VP soon.)

Anything on disabling cadence/processing for us gaming users, please?

Currently i have to disconnect my 360 from the VP50 and re-connect direct to my display as the processing delay is too big to use for on-line gaming.:(

When i want to play a HD-DVD using the 360, i then have to reconnect the 360 back up to the VP50, which is prooving a real pain at the moment.

game mode isn't good enough?

Just uploaded the 1.05 firmware, and my major issue, the 165Mhz boundary problem, seems to be solved! Great work! Me and my Barco 1209s are very happy :)

Did not test/try the other features yet. Did found a problem with 60Hz lock mode in my custom 1080p resolution, which doesn't seem to work, screen goes black when selected. 48Hz lock still works. I can select manual 60Hz. Reported this issue to Josh.

Anyway, i'm very happy with this so far!

Then share this firmware with the rest of us ;-)

game mode isn't good enough?Description: Game mode is a great competitive feature of the iScans, but it's only for interlaced sources. Since progressive cadence detection was introduced with the release of the VP50, progressive-scan lag is always as slow as the slowest deinterlacing mode instead of as fast as the fastest, like with the VP30 and before. The fix is reportedly a trivial matter (literally flipping 1 bit in the firmware if you just want to hard-code it, according to Dale) plus an extra menu item and some code to control it. This has been discussed in this thread and others a lot already if you search back -- no need for a full rehash here. It has been quite a bummer for VP50 gamers.

Speculation: The ability to use the full 165 MHz bandwidth, assuming it works, is a fantastic bonus for me that came out of nowhere, though -- I don't even remember any prior discussion of it. So they DO fix things. And someone, Josh maybe, said the progressive cadence thing would get fixed soon after the VP50 Pro came out. I wonder if he was referring to 1.05 or 1.06?

Then share this firmware with the rest of us ;-)

In fact on DVDO's site now I cannot see the older versions of the firmware (nor the beta versions). Only the latest "Production" versions show up ...

The fix is reportedly a trivial matter (literally flipping 1 bit in the firmware if you just want to hard-code it, according to Dale) plus an extra menu item and some code to control it.I think that was speculation on my part. Informed speculation, but still speculation. I'd still offer the same opinion, though. . . . ;)

- Dale Adams

just being curious - have you tried feeding it 1366x768 via dvi-d? Into the hdmi inputs? I know it won't take it via the RGB inputs, which is very counter-intuitive, but I thought the hdmi inputs would work...haven't tried it myself, since my ATI rig is strictly RGB out - would have to start over to use DVI. (new DVI splitters, etc - it works now, I just have to bypass the VP50 altogether, which I agree, isn't why I bought the VP50.)
Yes, I used dvi-d from the computer. I have to bypass VP50 and use a switch to get a decent picture. The rest of the family is not very impressed with the fidling. For MCE use, it works ok to send 1080i out of the computer and use game mode. But regular computer use looks fussy, because the VP scales it to 1366x768

Just uploaded the 1.05 firmware, and my major issue, the 165Mhz boundary problem, seems to be solved! Great work! Me and my Barco 1209s are very happy :)

Did not test/try the other features yet. Did found a problem with 60Hz lock mode in my custom 1080p resolution, which doesn't seem to work, screen goes black when selected. 48Hz lock still works. I can select manual 60Hz. Reported this issue to Josh.

Anyway, i'm very happy with this so far!


Where on earth or cyberspace did you get this from?

^I don't see 1.05 on the DVDO website.....:confused:

I bet it was e-mailed to him... But still... Share share ;-)

Or... Publish publish ;-) (that's for the dvdo guys of course)

I bet it was e-mailed to him... But still... Share share ;-) Or... Publish publish ;-) (that's for the dvdo guys of course)
Yep, Josh emailed it to me yesterday, for evaluation purposes. I'm not sure if he or DVDO appreciates it if i distribute this without their permission... so don't be angry with me, but i will leave it up to DVDO to decide when they release this, ok? Fact is, 1.05 is definitly coming, and it will be good! Just have a little patience ;)

Yep, Josh emailed it to me yesterday, for evaluation purposes. I'm not sure if he or DVDO appreciates it if i distribute this without their permission... so don't be angry with me, but i will leave it up to DVDO to decide when they release this, ok? Fact is, 1.05 is definitly coming, and it will be good! Just have a little patience ;)

i don't think that josh like to see this is share through out customers, wait the softwre is coming. it'S running fine :-)

Some screenshots. Projector is a Barco 1209s, screen is a 96" wide Carada screen:

http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/4112/img6599ig3.jpg

http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8356/img6598fr5.jpg

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/9698/img6600bc7.jpg

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/2585/img6601ma1.jpg

(pics resized to 800x600)

And for you curious people, a not so very recent pic of my hometheater (with my good 'ole Barco 808 still in place):

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/671/htjowi2gj8.jpg

nice setup there dude, long live CRT ;)

I can tell from your screenshots that you have a nice greyscale and setup on that 1209s :)

-Gary

The 1209s has colored C elements and is ISF calibrated. Must say that the pictures, taken with my rather old and worn out and not so very sharp Canon Powershot, don't actually represent the stunning reality. But it gives a nice idea about the setup.

O no, we opened the door to the old crt lovers *grin*, Very nice Jowi good to see that the 165Mhz problem is solved. On a sidenote i just got a call that the first batch of vp50pro's (so i guess still 1.0 and not 1.0.1) has reached the Netherlands ill pick mine up on friday and see whats up.

Daniel.

Looks like v1.05 Beta firmware is up on the DVDO site for download. Sweet!

So with this new firmware, will the scaler output 1080P/72hz?

Cliff

Looks like v1.05 Beta firmware is up on the DVDO site for download. Sweet!

Yep, here (http://www.anchorbaytech.com/support/software_downloads/update/vp50.beta_agreement.1.05.php) the link.

(downloading right now...)
_____
Axel

So with this new firmware, will the scaler output 1080P/72hz?The pixel clock rate required for 1080p at 72 Hz is beyond the 165 MHz limit of HDMI, so probably not.

- Dale Adams

The 1209s has colored C elements and is ISF calibrated. Must say that the pictures, taken with my rather old and worn out and not so very sharp Canon Powershot, don't actually represent the stunning reality. But it gives a nice idea about the setup.

Great looking pictures and setup.
Am I mistaken or is that an image of last year's F1 Renault?
If so, it looks HD sourced.
Where did you get it?

Great looking pictures and setup.
Am I mistaken or is that an image of last year's F1 Renault?
If so, it looks HD sourced.
Where did you get it?
Taken from a 1080i50 HD demo loop from German's HD Forum, about 3 minutes of F1 stuff, from a couple of years ago. If you know your newsgroups, there's a 3 hour treat for you, this years Japanese grandprix in HD...

<>

The pixel clock rate required for 1080p at 72 Hz is beyond the 165 MHz limit of HDMI, so probably not.

- Dale Adams

I'm guessing this probably won't enable 1920x1200@60Hz for a computer monitor either. :rolleyes:

I'm guessing this probably won't enable 1920x1200@60Hz for a computer monitor either. :rolleyes:
Why would you wanna do that anyway? 1920x1080@60 will fit nicely on a screen like that. On a screen with this weird aspect ratio blackbars are inevitable and a much better option then vertical stretching IMHO.

Some initial feedback on the Beta 1.05 firmware.

My setup is Pioneer Blu Ray player output set to 1080p/24 into VP50 and out to JVC RS-1. I have a constant image height setup with an anamorphic lens and 2.35:1 screen. So the VP50 plays a central role in aspect ratio management.

Finally this works! This is the main fix that I was waiting for. I will post again in a week or so after a lot more viewing time.

With 1.04 firmware, I was able to output a 23.98 (locked) signal but only using framerate conversion from a 1080p/60 signal. This was for the most part OK, but approximately 3-4 times in a movie there were "microstutters" and less frequently a narrow band (approx 2% only) of image tearing at the bottom of the screen. These problems were markedly better than 1.03 firmware.

So far after about one hour with 3 different Blu Rays (1080p/24 into and out of the VP50), all is well. Time will tell if this is the final fix.

Also, I have had excellent feedback by email and personal messages from Josh and Chee at DVDO.

I'm guessing this probably won't enable 1920x1200@60Hz for a computer monitor either. :rolleyes:I would expect that one to work. That resolution works fine with standard DVI which also has a 165 MHz pixel clock limit.

- Dale Adams

Why would you wanna do that anyway? 1920x1080@60 will fit nicely on a screen like that. On a screen with this weird aspect ratio blackbars are inevitable and a much better option then vertical stretching IMHO.There are a number of 1920x1200 computer monitors which must be fed a true 1920x1200 signal since they won't accept a standard 1080p signal. If you want to use such a monitor with the VP50, even if you just want a 1080p image to be letterboxed, you have to send it 1920x1200. This wasn't possible with the previous limit of 150 MHz clock.

- Dale Adams

With 1.04 firmware, I was able to output a 23.98 (locked) signal but only using framerate conversion from a 1080p/60 signal. This was for the most part OK, but approximately 3-4 times in a movie there were "microstutters" and less frequently a narrow band (approx 2% only) of image tearing at the bottom of the screen.You saw those problems because that configuration was actually running in unlocked mode, even though the VP50 told you it was running in locked mode. That's one of the bugs that got fixed.

- Dale Adams

Found some issues with 1.05:

- switching to 60Hz lock mode in 1080p custom timing (at approx. 158Mhz) doesn't seem to work and gives black screen

- using grayscale pattern in 1080p custom timing has a white bar at right hand side of the screen, approx. 5% of image width

- switching from 1080p50 custom timing to 576p with a 1080i50 source gives extreme magnified image which seems to be upper left part of source

- version info on lcd display gives '1.92x' in stead of 1.05 (my actual version
is 1.05.1.92x)

You would want to run your 1920x1200 monitor at native resolution (even if it accepts and displays 1080p at 1:1) because not all content is 16:9. With 4:3 content in a 1080p signal on a 1920x1200 display, you get black bars on all four sides, instead of using the full 1200 pixel height.

Found some issues with 1.05:

- switching to 60Hz lock mode in 1080p custom timing (at approx. 158Mhz) doesn't seem to work and gives black screenCould you post the exact timings you're using (including input format)? Also, what output frame rate are you switching from when you go to 60 Hz locked? If I can replicate the problem on my system I should be able to determine what's causing it.

- using grayscale pattern in 1080p custom timing has a white bar at right hand side of the screen, approx. 5% of image widthIs this the same 1080p custom timing as in the first problem? If not, then could you post the specific timings used? (Along with input format and output frame rate setting.) Also, what's the source of the grayscale pattern?

- switching from 1080p50 custom timing to 576p with a 1080i50 source gives extreme magnified image which seems to be upper left part of sourceSame question here with respect to the 1080p50 custom timing - is it the same as in the previous problems, and if not what are the timings used?

- Dale Adams

Taken from a 1080i50 HD demo loop from German's HD Forum, about 3 minutes of F1 stuff, from a couple of years ago. If you know your newsgroups, there's a 3 hour treat for you, this years Japanese grandprix in HD...

Very cool, thank you.:)

I can confirm that the VP50 can now drive a standard WUXGA 1920x1200 display, for example a normal 24" widescreen computer LCD. The proper VESA CVT-R timings for this (which are not pre-programmed into the VP50 like 1080p is) are, in the format required by the output setup menu:
H Front: 48 px
H Sync: 32 px
H Active: 1920 px
H Back: 80 px
V Front: 3 lines
V Sync: 6 lines
V Active: 1200 lines
V Back: 26 lines
(The H and V shift parameters will be automatically set to match the Back Porch settings. You can skip entering them.)
H sync +, V sync - (to conform to the standard, although most displays are flexible about this).
In addition, to meet the standard exactly, V frequency should be set Unlocked at 59.950 Hz.

If all this is set correctly, the VP50's Info display popup will display the following information which is calculated from what you entered:
H freq: 74.038 KHz
Pixel Clock: 154.000 MHz
which is exactly the WUXGA standard that computer monitors expect (and higher than the previous 150MHz pixel clock limit)

There are two problems, though.

First, none of my SD source devices work with 60Hz Locked output mode, even though they did in 1080p. I think my display is just strictly adhering to the WUXGA standard and not allowing the slightly different NTSC vertical frequency. I have to leave it set to 59.950Hz Unlocked. I did a quick check of some moving material and couldn't see judder -- I imagine it's very slight and infrequent since the timings are so close -- but that doesn't mean it isn't there at all.

Second, the VP50 still can't accept the exact same WUXGA format as an HDMI input. It thinks it's an "Unknown Format". That means I still have to route my computer's output through a separate HDMI/DVI switch instead of unifying my switching in the VP50. That's disappointing. Any chance that could be fixed? Is it as easy as just lifting the input MHz limit to match the higher output limit?

First, none of my SD source devices work with 60Hz Locked output mode, even though they did in 1080p. I think my display is just strictly adhering to the WUXGA standard and not allowing the slightly different NTSC vertical frequency. I have to leave it set to 59.950Hz Unlocked. I did a quick check of some moving material and couldn't see judder -- I imagine it's very slight and infrequent since the timings are so close -- but that doesn't mean it isn't there at all.There is definitely a problem with running in locked modes when the pixel clock needs to be over 151 MHz. The clock in unlocked mode can go up to 165 MHz, but there appears to be an artificial limit in one of the FPGAs which hard-limits the locked mode clock to 151 MHz. The lower pixel clock causes an internal handshake in the FPGA to be missed, with the result that the output frame rate ends up being half of what it should be (i.e., ~30 Hz instead of ~60 Hz). I've made ABT aware of this and hopefully they should have a revised 1.05 version soon which moves the locked-mode limit to 165 MHz.

- Dale Adams

There is definitely a problem with running in locked modes when the pixel clock needs to be over 151 MHz.... I've made ABT aware of this and hopefully they should have a revised 1.05 version soonThat would be great. Until locked mode works, the new feature is of questionable utility. I guess that's why 1.05 is a beta. Thank you.

I hope they can remove the input pixel clock limitation while they're at it (assuming it's that easy). With passthrough, it should (otherwise) be able to take a 154 MHz signal as an input and spit it back out, right?

Could you post the exact timings you're using (including input format)? Also, what output frame rate are you switching from when you go to 60 Hz locked? If I can replicate the problem on my system I should be able to determine what's causing it.

HSize=1920, Hback=344, Hfront=44, Hsync=44, Vsize=1080, Vback=36, Vfront=4, Vsync=5, output framerate manually set to 60.00Hz. Input format is 1080p60 from a HTPC, timings are the same.


Is this the same 1080p custom timing as in the first problem? If not, then could you post the specific timings used? (Along with input format and output frame rate setting.) Also, what's the source of the grayscale pattern?

Yep, same timing. The grayscale pattern is the internal one from the vp50. I use the timing above, go to configmenu, select grayscale pattern, and it shows up with a bar to the right side.


Same question here with respect to the 1080p50 custom timing - is it the same as in the previous problems, and if not what are the timings used?

Timings are the same, apart from the 50Hz offcourse.

Hope this helps!

none of my (SD) source devices work with 60Hz Locked output mode, even though they did in 1080p (...) I have to leave it set to 59.950Hz Unlocked
Indeed, sounds a lot like the 60Hz lock mode problem i described earlier.

HSize=1920, Hback=344, Hfront=44, Hsync=44, Vsize=1080, Vback=36, Vfront=4, Vsync=5, output framerate manually set to 60.00Hz. Input format is 1080p60 from a HTPC, timings are the same.I can duplicate the problem you're seeing. I believe it's the same one I described in a previous post where the output pixel clock in locked mode is artificially limited to too low of a value.

Yep, same timing. The grayscale pattern is the internal one from the vp50. I use the timing above, go to configmenu, select grayscale pattern, and it shows up with a bar to the right side.I assume you mean the 'gray ramp' pattern. If so, there is supposed to be a bar along the right side of the test pattern. That bar is at the nominal white level. The ramp itself goes from below black to above white, so the bar on the right should appear a bit darker than the portion of the gray ramp immediately to its left. There's a similar bar on the left edge of the test pattern which is the nominal black level. This bar should appear to be a bit brighter then the portion of the ramp immediately to the right of the bar. Is this what you're seeing or is it something different?

- Dale Adams

I assume you mean the 'gray ramp' pattern. If so, there is supposed to be a bar along the right side of the test pattern. That bar is at the nominal white level. The ramp itself goes from below black to above white, so the bar on the right should appear a bit darker than the portion of the gray ramp immediately to its left. There's a similar bar on the left edge of the test pattern which is the nominal black level. This bar should appear to be a bit brighter then the portion of the ramp immediately to the right of the bar. Is this what you're seeing or is it something different?

Sorry, i meant the gray ramp pattern offcourse. I'm not sure if there's a similar bar on the left side, so i think best thing is to make a picture of it tonight.

Cool! 1920x1200@60 now works! :eek: (mostly)

I don't actually need this at the moment but when I was forced to use my 24" computer monitor as main display for a month or so it would have been very handy.

Hi Dale, you seem to be being even more incredibly helpful then normal (if that's possible ;) ), have your circumstanced in regard to DVDO changed again?

Should have a chance to test 1.05 tonight, mostly the 1080p24 and 1080i50 issues that I've had.

Hi Dale, you seem to be being even more incredibly helpful then normal (if that's possible ;) ), have your circumstanced in regard to DVDO changed again? I'm currently consulting to them, partly to resolve some of the lingering video processor issues.

Should have a chance to test 1.05 tonight, mostly the 1080p24 and 1080i50 issues that I've had.You should find that 1080i50 deinterlacing is much better. Prior to this recent beta release cadence detection was effectively broken for 1080i50 and 1080p50 sources. That includes auto, film bias, and the forced 2:2 mode (although the 2:2 even and 2:2 odd worked correctly). There's no change to the 'video' mode, as that was working correctly.

- Dale Adams

Hi jowicrt,

using grayscale pattern in 1080p custom timing has a white bar at right hand side of the screen, approx. 5% of image width

I had the same problem. Try to switch the output level setting from PC to Video or vice versa.

Axel.

There is definitely a problem with running in locked modes when the pixel clock needs to be over 151 MHz. The clock in unlocked mode can go up to 165 MHz, but there appears to be an artificial limit in one of the FPGAs which hard-limits the locked mode clock to 151 MHz. The lower pixel clock causes an internal handshake in the FPGA to be missed, with the result that the output frame rate ends up being half of what it should be (i.e., ~30 Hz instead of ~60 Hz). I've made ABT aware of this and hopefully they should have a revised 1.05 version soon which moves the locked-mode limit to 165 MHz.I now have a development-only version of one of the VP50 FPGAs which fixes this problem -- i.e., locked modes now work up to 165 MHz. I don't know how soon this will make it's way into an update of beta 1.05, as ABT would like to do some testing first to be sure that this new FPGA version doesn't break anything else. But I thought those of you who are having problems might want to know that the problem is understood and being addressed.

- Dale Adams

Dale, I hope you're making twice your old pay as a consultant now. Thanks.

Might i say this is the most helpfull and direct customer feedback related topic/forum i've ever been on. Dale and DVDO, you both rock!!! :cool:

I am afraid I know the answer to this, but I want to make sure.

I have a 5.1 setup and I need a new AVR, though I am looking at separates.

I would like to be able to support TrueHD and DTSMA and use the VP50 as the audio switch. If I have the HDDVD and BR players decode in the player and then output 5.1 LPCM over HDMI, then feed it into the VP50, can I output this via Coax into my AVR or Processor?

I want to use my 7.1 inputs for my 2900 for DVD-A and SACD. In addition, my 2900 is SDI modified and provides an excellent picture and I don't want to get rid of it. I can find some really good deals on high end Processors/amp combos, but these do not have HDMI support.

I was hoping I could use my VP50 to provide the capability to support the HD Audio formats, if decoded in the DVD player.

Hopefully, I am being clear on what I want to do, but I don't know if the VP50 will be able to support it.

Please let me know any suggestions

Coax does not have the bandwidth to support those formats.

Since the subject was raised: can HD players typically still put out multichannel audio on S/PDIF? Do the discs still include those old DD / DTS tracks, or can the players re-encode the newer formats back down to a multichannel format that S/PDIF can handle? I ask because when I use the VP50's new 1920x1200 output ability, my audio receiver decides it can't handle the HDMI signal at all, not even to extract multichannel PCM.

God, putting audio and video on one cable was such a bad idea. Nothing but problems, again and again.