For the life of me I can not figure out what I am doing wrong. My receiver is a Yamaha 5790. I have the speakers all set to small. I have the level of ALL the speakers at -10 and sub at 0. Crossover is set at 80.

Not only is the bass output EXRTEMELY weak, the rest of the sound is very flat. Also the analog output is at least 10db lower than optical. Even when I crank it up 10db, the analog output is NOT EVEN CLOSE to the quality of the toslink output.

I have tried both cheap RCA cables and fairly good component cables and get the same results. I know that the problem is NOT with my receiver, because I had a SACD/DVD-a player hooked up to the 5.1 inputs and it sounded spectacular.

My firmware is 1.3.

Anyone have any ideas?...or do you think the 5.1 ouput of my player is defective?

For the life of me I can not figure out what I am doing wrong. My receiver is a Yamaha 5790. I have the speakers all set to small. I have the level of ALL the speakers at -10 and sub at 0. Crossover is set at 80.

Not only is the bass output EXRTEMELY weak, the rest of the sound is very flat. Also the analog output is at least 10db lower than optical. Even when I crank it up 10db, the analog output is NOT EVEN CLOSE to the quality of the toslink output.

I have tried both cheap RCA cables and fairly good component cables and get the same results. I know that the problem is NOT with my receiver, because I had a SACD/DVD-a player hooked up to the 5.1 inputs and it sounded spectacular.

My firmware is 1.3.

Anyone have any ideas?...or do you think the 5.1 ouput of my player is defective?

Why did you put the level at -10??????????????? in the toshiba you mean?. Did you calibrate you're Yamaha using the YPAIO (the meter?) because if you did, my 5890 keep the YPAIO setting even in MultiChannel IN so you must let all setting in the A1 at 0 DB and speaker at LARGE, setting them to Small will cut the Subwoofer signal quite a buch..

Are you able to change the db settings of the direct inputs on your receiver? If you can of course raise the setting for the sub. I would never have categorized the bass as extremely weak, but it certainly helped when I raised it a few notches in my HK 630. And if I were you I wouldn't use the speaker level setting in my A1. Just leave them all at 0. btw what material do you find subpar? Besides your speaker level settings, those are the exact settings I'm using and everything I've played from cd's to HD-DVDs sound excellent, the best I've ever heard on my system. For dvds I use coax out to take advantage of my recievers DLPxII.

I have Yamaha A-1.

The sound is a little lower with 5.1 analog, but it is much cleaner. I also have my speakers set to small in the HDDVD player and the Receiver. Crossover at 80, and turn the sub up a little.

All of this works great for me, and if you want a real treat upgrade to 2.0 and listen to the TrueHD soundtracks.

Traning Day is simply amazing in TrueHD. Can't wait ti watch Constatine again with better sound!

I missed where he set levels to -10.

That would be a big problem because the analog inputs are lowere than the optical anyway.

Set your levels back to 0 and crak up sub a couple of notches and enjoy!

Radioshack SPL meter plus running the test tones= your system sounds like it should.

Radioshack SPL meter plus running the test tones= your system sounds like it should.

No need for that.. he's Amp like mine have one include, that is called YPAIO (or something like that) , it does the same thing as a SPL meter but it's automatic and been great to me!

I missed where he set levels to -10.

That would be a big problem because the analog inputs are lowere than the optical anyway.

Set your levels back to 0 and crak up sub a couple of notches and enjoy!

I set the level of the speakers to -10 because there is no way to adjust the subwoofer level up on the A1 and no way to adjust ANY speaker level on the Yamaha (analog inputs).

I do not want to mess with the volume level on the sub because the A1 is not the only component in my HT (HD-DVR, X-box).

I have tried the 5.1 analog setup with everything set to zero, and it still sounds like crap.

The difference between what I am hearing between the the analog and toslink output is NOT subtle. It is on par with the sonic difference between an MP3 and an SACD.

You should calibrate levels in the unit though seeing as most will be using the decoder inside of the Toshiba instead of the one in the receiver. For most receivers those specifics only apply if you are using the optical or coax input. It is not that way on my Denon though.

Make sure Dynamic Range control in the Audio Setup is set to OFF. I've found that if you hit initialize after a firmware update, it defaults to ON-- at least my player does.

For the life of me I can not figure out what I am doing wrong. My receiver is a Yamaha 5790. I have the speakers all set to small. I have the level of ALL the speakers at -10 and sub at 0. Crossover is set at 80.

Not only is the bass output EXRTEMELY weak, the rest of the sound is very flat. Also the analog output is at least 10db lower than optical. Even when I crank it up 10db, the analog output is NOT EVEN CLOSE to the quality of the toslink output.

I have tried both cheap RCA cables and fairly good component cables and get the same results. I know that the problem is NOT with my receiver, because I had a SACD/DVD-a player hooked up to the 5.1 inputs and it sounded spectacular.

My firmware is 1.3.

Anyone have any ideas?...or do you think the 5.1 ouput of my player is defective?
You will need to set your deley/speaker levels through the Tosh as nearly all receivers won't have a separate set for the multi 5.1 inputs.
You will find more info in the sticky section: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=668781

No need for that.. he's Amp like mine have one include, that is called YPAIO (or something like that) , it does the same thing as a SPL meter but it's automatic and been great to me!

I bought my receiver "open box", so I must have missed this.

I don't believe what is going on here is a "calibration" issue. I had a SACD/DVD-a audio player hooked up and it sounded INCREDIBLY VIBRANT. Dobly Digital plus out of the A1 sounds muffled (like there is a pillow over my speakers).

Someone asked what titles I was using. I was using the intro of Serenity and the launch scene in Apollo 13. As a test I also popped in the Apollo 13 dts DVD, and (as I expected) the toslink output was 10 times better than the 5.1 analog output.

I bought my receiver "open box", so I must have missed this.

I don't believe what is going on here is a "calibration" issue. I had a SACD/DVD-a audio player hooked up and it sounded INCREDIBLY VIBRANT. Dobly Digital plus out of the A1 sounds muffled (like there is a pillow over my speakers).

Someone asked what titles I was using. I was using the intro of Serenity and the launch scene in Apollo 13. As a test I also popped in the Apollo 13 dts DVD, and (as I expected) the toslink output was 10 times better than the 5.1 analog output.

Yeah but did you put -10db on you're toshiba???? in so.. put everything to 0 since you're amp will take you're DB (Amp DB) into consideration.. I did many test and DD + sounds better than DTS (example U2 on disc DD+ vs DTS)

You need to get yourself an SPL meter and set the levels properly in the Toshiba. Dial your receiver to what usually produces good volume. Then play the Toshiba test signal. Use the SPL to make sure all levels are the same. Setting them all to -10 doesn't mean they are the same output. You should start at 0 and then set them from there. All of mine are set to different levels. I can control the sub level through my receiver. And you can change the sub level on the Toshiba also just like the other speakers.

For the life of me I can not figure out what I am doing wrong. My receiver is a Yamaha 5790. I have the speakers all set to small. I have the level of ALL the speakers at -10 and sub at 0. Crossover is set at 80.

Not only is the bass output EXRTEMELY weak, the rest of the sound is very flat. Also the analog output is at least 10db lower than optical. Even when I crank it up 10db, the analog output is NOT EVEN CLOSE to the quality of the toslink output.

I have tried both cheap RCA cables and fairly good component cables and get the same results. I know that the problem is NOT with my receiver, because I had a SACD/DVD-a player hooked up to the 5.1 inputs and it sounded spectacular.

My firmware is 1.3.

Anyone have any ideas?...or do you think the 5.1 ouput of my player is defective?

I'm having the same problem with my HD-A1, the digital optical output into my receiver sounds much better, and I have LFE again. Seems like different combinations of players/receivers yield different results. Since I'm not likely to upgrade my sound system any time in the near future, I'll stick with the toslink.

I set the level of the speakers to -10 because there is no way to adjust the subwoofer level up on the A1 and no way to adjust ANY speaker level on the Yamaha (analog inputs).

I do not want to mess with the volume level on the sub because the A1 is not the only component in my HT (HD-DVR, X-box).

I have tried the 5.1 analog setup with everything set to zero, and it still sounds like crap.

The difference between what I am hearing between the the analog and toslink output is NOT subtle. It is on par with the sonic difference between an MP3 and an SACD.

I have a Yamaha RX-V659 and due to lower subwoofer output of XA1 using analog outs, I also have set my XA1 5.1 speaker setup to -10dB on all speakers except for LFE/sub, which is set at 0dB. I set the speaker sizes to large though, and crossover at 80Hz.

I compensate in the receiver (for the attenuated output of XA1) by setting the volume trim on all other inputs to -3dB and multi-channel analog-in to +6dB (max), effectively compensating for the differences in input levels. When I toggle from toslink to analog-in's, the volume levels are comparable, including the bass level (the bass level may not be perfect - haven't taken an SPL meter to verify).

I access the volume trim by the following sequence of selections:
Menu button -> Manual Set-up -> Input Menu -> Volume Trim, then hit the input button you want to adjust.

To me, the difference between analog-in's and toslink isn't huge (but I don't listen at very loud levels either), but I would still say analog is better.

your reciever is processing the analog out into dolby prologic or something similar, thats what my receiver was doing. it sounded flat and no bass. make sure no preset EQ or sound modes are selected.

your reciever is processing the analog out into dolby prologic or something similar, thats what my receiver was doing. it sounded flat and no bass. make sure no preset EQ or sound modes are selected.

My reciever does not process the 5.1 analog inputs.

You need to get yourself an SPL meter and set the levels properly in the Toshiba. Dial your receiver to what usually produces good volume. Then play the Toshiba test signal. Use the SPL to make sure all levels are the same. Setting them all to -10 doesn't mean they are the same output. You should start at 0 and then set them from there. All of mine are set to different levels. I can control the sub level through my receiver. And you can change the sub level on the Toshiba also just like the other speakers.
The Toshiba test signals are incorrect and if used will not result in balanced levels. I have used the test signals available on the Avia disk with a SPL meter. It is definitely a bit of a hassle going back and forth between the Toshiba setup to change the levels and the Avia disk to test the levels, but the result is worth it.

web

You need to get yourself an SPL meter and set the levels properly in the Toshiba. Dial your receiver to what usually produces good volume. Then play the Toshiba test signal. Use the SPL to make sure all levels are the same. Setting them all to -10 doesn't mean they are the same output. You should start at 0 and then set them from there. All of mine are set to different levels. I can control the sub level through my receiver. And you can change the sub level on the Toshiba also just like the other speakers.

I have used an SPL meter to calibrate my system (Toslink only).

Here is the bottom line here: My sub is already turned about 2/3 of the way up. With, the speakers set to the LOWEST output (-12) and the subwoofer set to the HIGHEST output (0) (both within the A1) the LFE output is not acceptable. I am NOT going to mess with the volume knob on my sub, nor I am going to mess with the sub setting in my receiver, because these setting are already calibrated for Toslink ouput (and my HD-DVR and my X-box both run through Toslink).

That is only part of the story (LFE level). The clarity is missing from DD+ via the analog outputs (regarless of LFE level or sound level calibration). Trust me, I know what lossless DVD-a and SACD sound like through the VERY SAME 5.1 analog inputs. This sounds like my tv speakers. IT IS AWFUL!!!!!

I believe all of you that say DD+ sounds better than downconverted DTS. I am 99% sure now that there is a problem with the analog output on my player.

I have used an SPL meter to calibrate my system (Toslink only).

Here is the bottom line here: My sub is already turned about 2/3 of the way up. With, the speakers set to the LOWEST output (-12) and the subwoofer set to the HIGHEST output (0) (both within the A1) the LFE output is not acceptable. I am NOT going to mess with the volume knob on my sub, nor I am going to mess with the sub setting in my receiver, because these setting are already calibrated for Toslink ouput (and my HD-DVR and my X-box both run through Toslink).

That is only part of the story (LFE level). The clarity is missing from DD+ via the analog outputs (regarless of LFE level or sound level calibration). Trust me, I know what lossless DVD-a and SACD sound like through the VERY SAME 5.1 analog inputs. This sounds like my tv speakers. IT IS AWFUL!!!!!

I believe all of you that say DD+ sounds better than downconverted DTS. I am 99% sure now that there is a problem with the analog output on my player.

Weird.. because here on a 5890 all work great for both my Xbox360, my dvd and my HD DVD..

Anyone have any ideas?...or do you think the 5.1 ouput of my player is defective?

Could be. On my set-up analog 5.1 definitely has more clarity and is richer than digital. I am not an audiophile and can tell the difference :)

I have both analog and optical hooked up so I can switch back and forth. There is no comparison. The analog is way cleaner and more realistic, but the level is a little lower (not a big deal IMO). The only thing I notice about the LFE is that it sounds less muddled than regular Dolby Digital. I had to turn my sub down. I'm using an Onkyo TX-SR602

I believe all of you that say DD+ sounds better than downconverted DTS. I am 99% sure now that there is a problem with the analog output on my player.

Might be worth getting it looked at for repair/replacement then.

I have tried both cheap RCA cables and fairly good component cables and get the same results.

Any particular reason you were using component cables for audio connection?

I just downloaded the 2.0 firmware. I will update the A1 and report back. I doubt that this will make a difference for me.

The funny thing is that I was just fine with DD+ being converted to high bitrate DTS. But, now with all the TrueHD buzz, I want to get the analog outputs fixed.

Might be worth getting it looked at for repair/replacement then.



Any particular reason you were using component cables for audio connection?

I had a couple extra sets, and thought (a real longshot :) ) that maybe having cheap RCA cables was causing the problem.

I had a couple extra sets, and thought (a real longshot :) ) that maybe having cheap RCA cables was causing the problem.

You have probably tried this, but it could be that you have the analog outs hooked up wrong. What you're describing sounds like your sub and center are hooked up backwards.

There are also 2 sets of analog inputs on the A1. One set is for 5.1 and the other is for 2.0. make sure you're hooking up to the 5.1 set. The layout of the analog outs may not match the layout of your receiver, so make sure you look at how the inputs/outputs are labeled.

Just getting back to basics.

I just downloaded the 2.0 firmware. I will update the A1 and report back. I doubt that this will make a difference for me.

The funny thing is that I was just fine with DD+ being converted to high bitrate DTS. But, now with all the TrueHD buzz, I want to get the analog outputs fixed.

You won't be disappointed (as long as your player isn't broken). I'd say the movie experience with TrueHD is quite amazing :)

I have that same receiver and have no problems with my setup. Run the test tones from the Toshiba and it will let you know if the wiring is plugged in correctly. The sounds won't come out of the right speakers with them backwards.

I am having the same problem as jefe, except that when I play regular dvds through the analog inputs, the bass is great, when I play hd-dvds, the bass is seriously lacking. The clarity through analog though is noticeably better than toslink with HD-DVD, but the bass just isn't there. When I switch over to optical, the bass shakes the room. I have tried numerous settings in my receiver( RX-V750), and my HD-A1 speakers are set to 0db and small. If someone has any other suggestions I would appreciate it. I don't want to adjust my actual sub. I will continue to play around, even though I think I have exhausted my current options. I might either get an outlaw bass management system or wait for a new receiver with HDMI 1.3.

This may not be the most popular suggestion, but when I was having level issues with my Denon, I thought I would start with a clean slate and re-initialize the microprocessor. (Please refer to YOUR owners manual for instructions.) Write down settings that you like or start from scratch. I was surprized at what junky settings I had saved at one time or another.
Now I'm in DD+ and TrueHD 5.1 heaven!!

Cheers,

Bryan

I am having the same problem as jefe, except that when I play regular dvds through the analog inputs, the bass is great, when I play hd-dvds, the bass is seriously lacking. The clarity through analog though is noticeably better than toslink with HD-DVD, but the bass just isn't there. When I switch over to optical, the bass shakes the room. I have tried numerous settings in my receiver( RX-V750), and my HD-A1 speakers are set to 0db and small. If someone has any other suggestions I would appreciate it. I don't want to adjust my actual sub. I will continue to play around, even though I think I have exhausted my current options. I might either get an outlaw bass management system or wait for a new receiver with HDMI 1.3.

Have you tried lowering the level of all the speakers (except sub) within the A1?

edited my post because I am a dumb a$$.......TruHD works flawless once I switched the connection the pre in and not preout......told ya I am a dumb a$$.....in all the xcitment I zigged when I should have zagged....

So now 2.0 works flawlessly for me...

With the newest 2.0 firmware the built-in test tones are still wrong (type of frequency spectrum mix) for the center and the subwoofer. So the center and the subwoofer channel can not be calibrated properly with the built-in test tones. You end up having to use Avia or THX test tones off of a disc.

Bob

Have you tried lowering the level of all the speakers (except sub) within the A1?

I tried that, and it just lowered the volume on all the other speakers except the sub. Do I want that? Now the other speakers are lower than usual and the sub is still the same and lacking in bass. My sub is set to +10db (multi-channel) in my receiver so it is maxed out there.

Update: At any rate, I decided I would adjust all my input (multi-channel, toslink, etc) levels on my receiver and SPL them to match each other, I then cut down the toslink sub levels (-4.5db) in the receiver and left the multi-channel sub level at +10 (which now equals the toslink sub levels on the SPL). I then cut up the sub gain from 1/4 to almost 1/2. It sounds balanced now and I guess I'm set (even though I didn't want to cut my sub up).

Update: I now am running 2.0. I re-initialized, and, if anything, my audio is WORSE. It is outputting LESS bass now (almost none at all). I KNOW this is a problem with the A1, because I re-hooked up my DVD-a/SACD player and it sounded great. I also took my subwoofer cable and hooked it up directly to the A1 and got almost no output.

I really don't want to send my player in, as it has been flawless on the video side and the audio through the Toslink sounds damn good. I just HATE knowing that I am missing something :( .

Just so you know mate, youre not alone on this, I have the same issue.

... and no way to adjust ANY speaker level on the Yamaha (analog inputs).


You sure about that?
I have the 5930, after going from toslink to analog I noticed the center channel was a little low. Press the "level" bottom on the remote and you can adjust speaker levels(including the sub) while using the multi channel analog inputs.

Fixed it fine for me.

Update: I now am running 2.0. I re-initialized, and, if anything, my audio is WORSE. It is outputting LESS bass now (almost none at all). I KNOW this is a problem with the A1, because I re-hooked up my DVD-a/SACD player and it sounded great. I also took my subwoofer cable and hooked it up directly to the A1 and got almost no output.

I really don't want to send my player in, as it has been flawless on the video side and the audio through the Toslink sounds damn good. I just HATE knowing that I am missing something :( .

I had the same problem. I selected the DVD 5.1 which only works the analog or HDMI outs. I'm using the analog. Then I hit the Effect/Ch Select button, scrolled threw to the SW level at set it to +10dB, and kept everything else at 0dB. Sounds great now. I didn't touch anything in the A1 menu, only the AVR.

Did you try that?

Funny i have no problems with Subwoofer at all.. it's rattling my basement in Analog.. I have modified the Sub Level on my subwoofer tought

Can one get the 2.0 update from Toshiba,Will they send you a disk.BUDDA

I'm just having problems with my AV receiver just turning off. I don't know if its getting to hot or what. I can only set the sound on my reciever to -37db anything less than that and my receiver shuts off and I get a blinking power light. I'm starting to get real ticked off because I don't know what else to do. I'm already having to send my denon 2105 to the repair shop now cause it will not come back on. At least with the kenwood I can restart it.

I'm just having problems with my AV receiver just turning off. I don't know if its getting to hot or what. I can only set the sound on my reciever to -37db anything less than that and my receiver shuts off and I get a blinking power light. I'm starting to get real ticked off because I don't know what else to do. I'm already having to send my denon 2105 to the repair shop now cause it will not come back on. At least with the kenwood I can restart it.

Can be 2 thing, overheating or there's a filament of speaker cable touching the case.. check for that..

Can one get the 2.0 update from Toshiba,Will they send you a disk.BUDDAYes, either by mailing in the pink postcard that came with the player or by calling Toshiba's customer service line and requesting it. I did both, so now I end up getting two copies sent to me with every update!

You sure about that?
I have the 5930, after going from toslink to analog I noticed the center channel was a little low. Press the "level" bottom on the remote and you can adjust speaker levels(including the sub) while using the multi channel analog inputs.

Fixed it fine for me.

You are correct. Thank you.

I will try this. However, I doubt it will make any difference. There is almost NO SIGNAL at all coming out of the subwoofer output on the A1.

Same issue here.

Have HK AVR7300. Optical (DTS) rocks my subs and butt-kickers, but analog is way too weak. I tried the same adjustments on the Toshiba. IE all speakers set to -12db and sub at 0. It helped a tiny bit but not enough. I'm in the same boat as far as turning up the sub itself. Too many other input devices would be affected. I'd have to adjust the sub (and BK amp) every time I switch back to HDTV or X-Box etc...

I just picked up my first True HD discs and will see if that format works better. Maybe I'll just stick with toslink for everything but True HD.

On Edit:
I have applied the 2.0 update.

I was having the same issues as a lot of people here wrt analog sub levels, until I finally figured it out last night. First, my sub's volume was set too high. Using the Auto MCACC sound calibration on my Pioneer receiver, I kept lowering the volume on the sub until MCACC stopped telling me to do so. I went from around 10 to 4 on the volume. Next, whenever I hit Initialize on the Maintenence menu on the A1, Dynamic Range control would be set to ON. I never noticed this until a few days ago. This needs to be OFF. Third, I made no changes to the default speaker distance and level settings in the A1, except I changed crossover from 120Hz to 80Hz. (I've read that I should leave that at 120, as well.) Last, my Pioneer sub has a "bass boost" feature for the multichannel analog inputs, boosting the sub level by 10db.

Finally, I can begin to hear what others have been bragging about! To my unsophisticated ears, analog sounds "warmer" and "lusher" than optical cable, which now, in comparison, sounds more "midrange-y" and "hollow." Big difference. And I'm running f/w 2.0, as well. I'm thinking I can finally go all analog and take the optical cable out.

Do you know how long it took me to figure all of that out? Months! :eek:

With the newest 2.0 firmware the built-in test tones are still wrong (type of frequency spectrum mix) for the center and the subwoofer. So the center and the subwoofer channel can not be calibrated properly with the built-in test tones. You end up having to use Avia or THX test tones off of a disc.

Bob


I concur, the Toshiba built in test tones are not correct.

jefe,

In my signature are links which should help. Start with the analog setup link and also look at the LFE boost link. Good luck.

YES! YES! YES! YES! YES!

:D :D :D :D :D

Thank you Martin3, cpat, and everyone else who helped me. I set the subwoofer ouput on my receiver to +10db (turns out there is a way to set individual settings for 5.1 analog only). Then, it only required a slight increase on the volume knob on subwoofer to get adequate bass. I took a little "white out" and marked the calibrated settings for digital and analog. Having to adjust the subwoofer volume knob is a small price to pay for the sonic marvel I just enjoyed last night.

I watched Training Day in TrueHD, and all I can say is HOLY CRAP.... :eek: . It wasn't the "action" scenes that impressed me so much. It was the quiet scenes. The clarity of the "ambience" was ASTOUNDING.

Once again, thank you to everyone who helped me. I can now enjoy DD+ and TrueHD in all their glory. The toslink cable is officially unplugged :) .

I watched Training Day in TrueHD, and all I can say is HOLY CRAP.... :eek: . It wasn't the "action" scenes that impressed me so much. It was the quiet scenes. The clarity of the "ambience" was ASTOUNDING.



Maybe thats why I'm not noticing the better SQ of TrueHD. I've been sampling Training Day but only the action scenes.

I'll have to watch the movie all the way threw again.

Maybe thats why I'm not noticing the better SQ of TrueHD. I've been sampling Training Day but only the action scenes.

I'll have to watch the movie all the way threw again.

Your not the only one I'm not hearing much of a difference between TrueHD and Dolby Digital Plus either, I haven't figured out yet what the problem is (maybe my ears). There was a definite difference when we were stuck in 2 channel land but that may have been attributed to the dialog running off of my B&W 602's instead of my lcr60 center channel, but now that we are using all 5 channels there just doesn't seem to be a noticeable difference.

Check out this thread in the high end projector forum.


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8298865#post8298865

He has analog outs and figured out that the test patters from the Toshiba aren't up to scratch as compared with calibration DVDs inserted into player. Makes sense. Everyone should calibrate from a test DVD (hopefully HD DVD DVE or AVIA will be out).

I just downloaded 2.0 and my LFE is pretty low too. I turned the sub volume up (on the back of the sub) to help compensate, but the sub volume is too low in my opinion.

I just downloaded 2.0 and my LFE is pretty low too. I turned the sub volume up (on the back of the sub) to help compensate, but the sub volume is too low in my opinion.

How are you calibrating your sub, I was able to get good results calibrating it using avia, bumping up the sub 10db on my receiver, and turning up the volume on the sub slightly

I just downloaded 2.0 and my LFE is pretty low too. I turned the sub volume up (on the back of the sub) to help compensate, but the sub volume is too low in my opinion.

The LFE was OK using analog output, but after 2.0 update the sub volume is none existence. Toshiba did something to make LFE even worst.

Just so you know mate, youre not alone on this, I have the same issue.


This is a common issue and I am also in the same boat. Supposedly it's more common for receivers to boost sub levels by +10db that's why the Toshiba outputs the subwoofer levels at -10db. I have a B&K reference 50 that merely has 6 channel inputs, so if I use the analog inputs I get no bass!

Guys and gals,

If your receiver has 6 channel analog inputs, it most certainly has a way of adjusting the levels for the speakers when they are fed that signal. My cheapo Denon has provision for adding an across the board 0, +5, or +10dB boost for the Analog input. on top of that, you should be able to adjust the individual speaker levels. Mine only required a +8dB boost to the sub and a few dBs to the mains (because of my listening space). Make sure you are using the distance settings (for proper surround delay), set speakers to SMALL (to direct more low frequency to the sub), do not adjust speaker level settings in the player, crossover set to 120Hz and sub="ON/USE". You should be golden! If your LF output is still a little low, use the volume control on the sub until it sounds right (although, a SPL meter will help alot!)
"Now my digital input is too hot!" Yes, it will be. So, use the receiver to tone down the speaker levels for the digital signal.
I have heard good and bad about calibrating your speakers with Avia and DVE. You can get discreet pink noise test signals from any THX optimizer DVD. Works like a charm. Do yourself a flavor and pick up a SPL meter from Rat Shack. Surround sound doesn't work as well if one speaker is louder/softer than the others and an testosterone driven sub level can create room nodes that cancel out frequencies you need to hear (dialog anyone!)

Get 'er done, folks. When you get it, you'll get it!

Cheers,

Bryan

(post edited to correct speaker size selection and adjustment of speaker distances within the player.)

Guys and gals,

If your receiver has 6 channel analog inputs, it most certainly has a way of adjusting the levels for the speakers when they are fed that signal. My cheapo Denon has provision for adding an across the board 0, +5, or +10dB boost for the Analog input. on top of that, you should be able to adjust the individual speaker levels. Mine only required a +8dB boost to the sub and a few dBs to the mains (because of my listening space). Make sure you aren't using any distance settings or speaker level settings in the player, crossover set to 120Hz and sub="ON/USE". You should be golden! If your LF output is still a little low, use the volume control on the sub until it sounds right (although, a SPL meter will help alot!)
"Now my digital input is too hot!" Yes, it will be. So, use the receiver to tone down the speaker levels for the digital signal.
I have heard good and bad about calibrating your speakers with Avia and DVE. You can get discreet pink noise test signals from any THX optimizer DVD. Works like a charm. Do yourself a flavor and pick up a SPL meter from Rat Shack. Surround sound doesn't work as well if one speaker is louder/softer than the others and an testosterone driven sub level can create room nodes that cancel out frequencies you need to hear (dialog anyone!)

Get 'er done, folks. When you get it, you'll get it!

Cheers,

Bryan


Well, my cheap old Yamaha receiver has no such option in external decoder mode.

Basically, little or no LFE is coming out of the Toshiba after the 2.0 upgrade. Turning up the volume on my sub did nothing. 1000% of infinitesimal is still infinitesimal. :)

The problem is the 2.0 upgrade that made the already low LFE even worst.

Here is how I did the analog calibration on my Yamaha with a A1 & DVE (Don't use the A1 test tones):

The settings for the analog 5.1 inputs/outputs will vary based on your receiver and it's capabilities in adjusting the analog inputs. My Yamaha receiver allows separate individual speaker levels for the analog inputs which can be different from the digital (S/PDIF=dig.coax/optical) speaker levels. You should set them up so they are at the same levels with both optical & 5.1 analog so that they can be compared at the same volume level AND so the master volume is equal from both sources (ie cable/sat STB, or any other digital source). This will keep you from getting blown out when switching sources, AND make any S/PDIF to analog comparisons easier and fairer.

Start out with the HD-A1/XA1 speaker settings all set to 0db, and the proper speaker distances set. Also set the crossover in the HD-A1/XA1 to between 80hz to 100hz based on your speakers & subwoofer specs. Then set the speakers to small if your speakers are not full range speakers and rely solely on the sub for all low bass.

I would start with the analog settings first and increase the level on the subwoofer itself to get it to the proper levels with analog inputs using a SPL meter (Radio Shack has a $30.00 one that will work fine). THEN I would set up the digital coax/optical levels by setting the receiver's sub level lower to match the analog sub level, but be sure you can setup different speaker levels on the digital inputs & analog inputs.

Other than the distance, speaker size, and sub on and set to 80hz crossover, I would adjust any remaining levels in the receiver. Most receivers have separate speaker levels for the analog inputs vs. the digital inputs so you can get them all even from those separate source types. You could also try turning on dialog enhancement in the HD-A1. It seems to bring the sound level up on all speakers. I do not use the Dialog Enhancement myself because it seems to change the soundtrack mix from what it was originally.

Hope this helps!

O.K., here are my FINAL settings:

I have now balanced 5.1 analog and toslink to the identical master volume setting.
I used Avia test tones for this and began with the 5.1 analog calibration.

Analog
LF 0.0db
C -3.0db
RF +0.5db
RS -2.0db
LS -3.5db
Sub +10.0db
I then had to turn the volume on my HSU STF2 sub up to 3/4 full volume to get a +5.0db "hot" subwoofer output.

I now decided to calibrate the digital inputs on my reciever to get EXACTLY the same output on the same master volume.

Toslink

LF -4.5db
C -7.5bd
RF -4.0db
RS -6.0db
LS -7.5db
Sub -10.00db

I then had to go into the main menu of the receiver and DECREASE the LFE ouput further by -5.0db to acheive the same +5.0db "hot" output.

So, unless my math is incorrect, the overall ouput of the analog ouputs on my A1 is about 4db lower than the toslink ouput. Furthermore, the subwoofer output on my A1 is an INCREDIBLE 21db LOWER THAN THE TOSLINK OUTPUT!!!!!!

I am just glad that the madness of this calibration is over for me (at least until Toshiba does a "fix for this via a firmware update).

I have had the same issues. When I run the Tosh audio tests there would be nothing coming out of the subwoofer. I ran the THX audio tests from the star wars DVD and still nothing coming out of the sub channel. However once I start the movie the sub kicks in fine?

I used all the outputs except HDMI and the same problem. If I run the same THX tests through my Xbox360 or HME PC they work fine. So I don't know what the issue is but I'm glad the sub works when I play movies.

FYI I have a HK AVR300 amp. I tried with firmware 1.3 and 2.0. I even replaced the HDDVD to see if it was just a faulty machine but the same issue.

It seems it can't be the amp or I would have the issue with the 360 or PC wouldn't I?

I am running into a Yamaha RX-V650, this AMP has a Pure Direct Option (with the BLUE Light) Should that option be chosen or should I just stick with Multi-Analog at 5.1? And my sound is about -20db over watching regular tv at its loudest output, so so far my analog world is VERY VERY VERY quiet, SPATIAL but Q U I E T...

Any help on this issue?

I was having the same issues as a lot of people here wrt analog sub levels, until I finally figured it out last night. First, my sub's volume was set too high. Using the Auto MCACC sound calibration on my Pioneer receiver...


Guys and gals,

If your receiver has 6 channel analog inputs, it most certainly has a way of adjusting the levels for the speakers when they are fed that signal. My cheapo Denon has provision for adding an across the board 0, +5, or +10dB boost for the Analog input. ...


bferr1, Which Pioneer do you have?
Dr., Which Denon do you have?

I'm looking to upgrade from an older 3200 to a newer Pioneer.

Guys and gals,

If your receiver has 6 channel analog inputs, it most certainly has a way of adjusting the levels for the speakers when they are fed that signal. My cheapo Denon has provision for adding an across the board 0, +5, or +10dB boost for the Analog input. on top of that, you should be able to adjust the individual speaker levels. Mine only required a +8dB boost to the sub and a few dBs to the mains (because of my listening space). Make sure you aren't using any distance settings or speaker level settings in the player, crossover set to 120Hz and sub="ON/USE". You should be golden! If your LF output is still a little low, use the volume control on the sub until it sounds right (although, a SPL meter will help alot!)
"Now my digital input is too hot!" Yes, it will be. So, use the receiver to tone down the speaker levels for the digital signal.
I have heard good and bad about calibrating your speakers with Avia and DVE. You can get discreet pink noise test signals from any THX optimizer DVD. Works like a charm. Do yourself a flavor and pick up a SPL meter from Rat Shack. Surround sound doesn't work as well if one speaker is louder/softer than the others and an testosterone driven sub level can create room nodes that cancel out frequencies you need to hear (dialog anyone!)

Get 'er done, folks. When you get it, you'll get it!

Cheers,

Bryan

I've heard people talk about this LFE issue, but I haven't seen a problem. I am running 5.1 analog out from the Toshiba HD-A1 into my Anthem Statement D1 . The Toshiba is set to 0 delay, all speakers large. The Statement D1 is using large stereo mains, and small center and surrounds. I calibrated my D1 speaker levels with the pre/pro tones. I then put in an AVIA disk in the Toshiba HD-A1 . As I was applying THX Ultra 2 processing on the D1, the tones didn't match perfectly, but they were within a dB or so from my calibration. I then switched back and forth between coax S/PDIF digital output and analog output on the HD-A1. There was no difference to the balance, but only a slight difference in overall level.

But some people are saying the analog low-LFE issue is a Dolby DD+ and True-HD issue only? Then my tests wouldn't be valid by using a DVD. How can some encodings output different levels? Surely there is a standard for all this stuff. So, do I have an LFE problem or not, and how could I check? The sound certainly seems okay to me.

By the way, the analog outputs sound awesome on both DD+ and TrueHD. There is only a subtle difference between them. The TrueHD is a bit more "natural" and detailed. It's kind of like listening to a CD (or better) instead of a high-bitrate MP3 . Both are okay, but the lossless encoding has better defined soundstage and a more relaxed/real sound. I think many people with cheap receivers will not hear a difference. Those with great pre/pros will, though not instantly. The TrueHD grows on you -- in a good way ;)

Thanks,
Neil

Sorry JayMan007,

I didn't see your post before. I have the Denon 1703 AVR. It has no HDMI but does have 6 channel analog input. Plus all the requisite flavors of Dolby Digital, Pro Logic II, DTS, Neo:6 and so forth. It gets the job done wonderfully and really makes my Mirage kit (5 Omnisats and Omni S-10 sub) sound great. I paid $199 shipped from uBid.com. Can't go wrong for two Bens!!!

Cheers,

Bryan

p.s. Too all that are having low subwoofer output issues, I urge you to read your manuals to find out what you receiver is capable of doing. Many times, I have seen people go from "my sound suxOrz!!!" to "OMFG!!" just by changing the speaker size to SMALL within the player. If your receiver has 5.1 analog inputs, 99% of the time you can adjust the speaker levels independently from your other inputs. It might also have provision for an EXT. IN/ANALOG level boost.
My simple solution, for people using satellites for all 5 speakers, is as follows:
A1/X1 settings:
Speaker Size=SMALL
Distances=Adjust for distance from each speaker to your listening position
Subwoofer=USE
Crossover=(I like) 120Hz. (In my setup, my subs frequency response is 25Hz to 120Hz flat and my satellites are rated at 90Hz to 20kHz.) My SPL readings showed a notch in the response that was corrected by changing the crossover frequency. Your room and your speakers will determine this. The THX frequency sweep (sounds like the cartoony sound FX when someone/something falls off a cliff) will let you hear the peaks and dips in your room/speaker response. It should be as even and smooth as possible.
Dialog Enhancement=(I like) OFF (I prefer to subject the signal to as few modifications as possible.)
Dynamic Level Control=(I like) OFF (For the same reason as above.)

In your AVR:
Adjust analog speaker levels to read the same SPL level when playing the THX Optimizer Channel Assignment Test/Pink Noise.
Your settings for speaker size and crossover should not have any bearing on the analog output UNLESS you have a more advanced AVR that re-digitizes the signal. You will know your receiver does this if it gives you the ability to utilize bass management to your Analog input. Generally, the Analog input acts like a pass-though and has no processing added to the signal provided by the player.

Hope this is of some help.

FYI,

Same problem here and I cannot figure it out.

When I use the analog inputs, the bass is very weak but everything else seems to be fine, maybe less overall volume too.

My Buttkicker barely even moves when I use analogs!

My receiver is Yamaha RX-V1400 7.1.

Optical output from the HD-A1 has plenty of bass though and Buttkicker is rockin.


This is driving me crazy....I have an SPL meter and have upgraded to 2.0.

Bass still SUCKS when using analogs. <sigh>

I want TrueHD but not without bass.

FYI, I CANNOT adjust the different levels on the analogs. I cannot get a matrixed 7.1 either (from 5.1)

VERY frustrating.

I wish Toshiba would address this also. I have tried others advise on this but I've given up and just use the DTS over optical. Looks like I'll be in the market for a new receiver that decodes the new formats.

I wish Toshiba would address this also. I have tried others advise on this but I've given up and just use the DTS over optical. Looks like I'll be in the market for a new receiver that decodes the new formats.

I can imagine them fixing the issue with the next release and everyone's subwoofer blows up because the level is too loud now.

lol

For real, this needs to be addressed.

FYI,

Same problem here and I cannot figure it out.

When I use the analog inputs, the bass is very weak but everything else seems to be fine, maybe less overall volume too.

My Buttkicker barely even moves when I use analogs!

My receiver is Yamaha RX-V1400 7.1.

Optical output from the HD-A1 has plenty of bass though and Buttkicker is rockin.


This is driving me crazy....I have an SPL meter and have upgraded to 2.0.

Bass still SUCKS when using analogs. <sigh>

I want TrueHD but not without bass.

FYI, I CANNOT adjust the different levels on the analogs. I cannot get a matrixed 7.1 either (from 5.1)

VERY frustrating.


I have the rxv 1400 as well. Up to last week I was misinformed by Yamaha about the lack of volume control on the analog inputs. Simply switch to multichannel imput via remote and you can adjust all channels for the multichannel inputs without affecting your other device volume levels. I do not have it perfected yet as I had to have surgery soon after I found out but I started with all speakers set to small with an x-over of 80hz and all volume set to 0 in the a-1. From there, using the ovation disc I ran throught the test tones and set the volume for each channel in the Yamaha.

Oddly, It still sounds "better" via coax digital out with the Yamaha applying room correction (Which it does not do for analog ins) but that could be explained by an inferior center channel (B&W LCR60 center with 803s for mains). Don't know for certain but I'll be eyeballing this thread to see if this helps and if you have any feedback.

I've heard people talk about this LFE issue, but I haven't seen a problem. I am running 5.1 analog out from the Toshiba HD-A1 into my Anthem Statement D1 . The Toshiba is set to 0 delay, all speakers large. The Statement D1 is using large stereo mains, and small center and surrounds. Neil

In your situation, the Anthem is re-digitizing the 5.1 input allowing bass management. It is also likely applying an automatic 10db boost to the LFE channel in the digital domain. As long as the A/D and D/A conversion is high quality (which I imagine it is in the Anthem), this works fine. However, others (me included) would rather keep the signal in the analog domain and skip the redigitization. This is where the low LFE issue typically is the most noticeable.

For those having low LFE issues, see the second and last link below. :)

I've had problems in my system with the RCA player and subwoofer level matching. I have the same problem as everyone else with the low sub volume, but I also have a different problem. I discovered that the level setting in the receiver was making no audible or measurable change for the subwoofer, so I didn't have any way to compensate. The center and surround level adjusments and fade controls work fine, so it isn't a case of those controls being locked out on analog. I decided to do an experiement yesterday and hook up my old DVD player via analog. I have the same problem when measured with Avia tones. Then it got interesting. I discovered that if I measure with the player's internal tones, the receiver subwoofer level control does change the level. I was able to balance it with the other channels at around +7-8dB. Same thing with the RCA tones. I had never used those because I've read that they are inaccurate. Does anyone have an explanation for this? I compared a few clips of Batman Begins through coaxial digital (sub at normal +1) and the bass levels seem similar. Unfortunately, my receiver level controls are universal for digital and analog inputs, so I'll be doing a lot of switching back and forth unless a firmware fix emerges.

P.S. I also experienced a weird glitch (unrelated to audio) during testing that I haven't heard of before. I'll be starting a separate thread about that.

I discovered that the level setting in the receiver was making no audible or measurable change for the subwoofer, so I didn't have any way to compensate.

I experienced the same issue with the analog inputs and resolved it by changing the main speakers to small in the Toshiba. After this change The analog volume control in the receiver worked for the sub. I've read previously that there is a bass routing issue with the A-1 with mains set to large as well as if you do not have a sub it apparently does not reroute the lfe to the mains. Essentially I got full control with all speakers set to small, sub to "use" and x-over to 80 hz.

They need a +10 db boost on the A1 on the sub out. Compared to every other device hooked up the LFE is way way low coming out of the A1. Real pita to get things balanced between other device outputs.

Bumping this back up. My solution is pretty unconventional. I feed all the analog outs from the player into my Arcam AV8 EXCEPT the sub. I feed the digital out from the player into a cheap Onkyo SS receiver. From this I connect just to my subs (via a switcher). The analog from the HD players (both A1 and Panny Blu Ray) sound fantastic and the bass is now rockin'. Obviously not the easiest work around but that's how I get it done.

Anyone using this:

M&K BMC 5.1-MINI BASS MANAGEMENT SYSTEM

http://www.mksound.com/filters-bass_mgmt.php

I was having similar LFE issues to others who posted here with HD-A1 and Denon 3200 5.1 input. I'm not an audiophile by a long shot, but it really bugged me.

The Denon doesn't have separate settings for digital inputs and 5.1 analogue: they are all driven from the same master setting.

I normally have the crossover on the sub set to about halfway, but this time I cranked it up to max (I'm only sending it true LFE channel anyway).

Initially I tried setting HD-A1 levels to -10dB on all speakers except 0dB for SW, setting speakers to small and distances to 0 as recommended in some of the posts, but then had to crank the Denon way up to get decent levels and even then bass was minimal.

Next I set all levels back to 0dB and all speakers to large in the HD-A1. I correspondingly set SW level in the Denon +10dB and speakers to large too and suddenly had sizeable bass (in fact I think it was too intense). I ended up reducing the bass level on the sub itself slightly.

Whilst I don't really have speakers that will do justice to low frequency, I get acceptable results by setting everything large and using a +10dB boost on SW in the Denon. If I switch to digital inputs I just drop the SW back to 0dB in the Denon and then bass is roughly equivalent (useful to have a few buttons on the remote to adjust SW level).

Something seems definitely amiss with LFE handling in the HD-A1 and I'm not sure why a large setting seems to give acceptable results compared to small. Is it possible these have been inadvertently reversed in the HD-A1?

However, regardless of what I do, somehow 5.1 analogue doesn't sound as good as digital input: maybe it's the volume level difference between the two that makes digital sound better.

I also noticed that switching between a DD+ soundtrack and TrueHD soundtrack, the TrueHD was at least 4dB lower than the equivalent DD+. It's a bit annoying because I have to crank up the Denon for TrueHD and if I then forget to drop it back for a DD+ soundtrack, it's liable to blast my eardrums.

I have to raise volume for 5.1 analogue and raise again for TrueHD compared to the digital output and I wish I didn't as it's an annoyance.

This is what I've noticed when trying to get TrueHD from the HD-A1:

Sony STR-DE835 (DTS/Dolby Digital reveiver WITH analog 5.1 inputs)
Tosh HD-A1 HD-DVD player / Firmware 2.0
No sub connected

Tosh connected to the Sony via 5.1 analog inputs.
When using the 5.1 inputs on the Sony, the only control
I have is the front balance and rear balance. No level
adjustments possible.

I switch and TrueHD enabled HD-DVD disc to "TrueHD"
and it sounds like garbage. DTS through Optical or coax
sounds infinitely better. I can't imagine what I'm doing
wrong. I've tried setting the speakers to small, and large
in the Tosh setup, tried changing the other audio setting in the Tosh.
nothing helps. As a matter of fact, when using the 5.1 inputs,
and I change (in the DVD menu) from Dolby or whatever it is, to
Dolby TrueHD, I hear no difference at all.
The only difference I hear is when I switch from Coax DTS (sounds amazing)
to 5.1 inputs (TrueHD) it sounds absolutely terrible, flat, and barely get
any volume in the rear channels.


Any help would be appreciated.

There have been comments about the Centre and SW test tones in the HD-A1 being incorrect. I postulate that it's not necessarily the test tones but the processing Toshiba is doing on the multichannels that is faulty.

I "calibrated" my Denon AVR-3200 using the internal Denon test tones and all seemed well when using a digital input. It all seems fine too when inputting analogue 5.1 from a Panasonic S75 DVD player.

However, when I input the HD-A1 5.1 analogue channels, things seem flat and out of balance.

I noticed this in particular when playing Mummy Returns HD-DVD the other night. By adjusting SW level and overall volume I can get okay results (although not spectacular), however when audio changes from action to mainly dialogue, the Centre speaker level seems very low and flat and it is often difficult making out exactly what is being said. If I raise volume higher, it overwhelms the action pieces.

Consequently, to me it seems as though the HD-A1 is not outputting the correct Centre channel level (and LFE is also problematic), which is why I think maybe the HD-A1 internal test tones could actually be okay but are being distorted by the processing done in the HD-A1.

I'm hoping to get a HTPC setup soon to playback HD-DVD via analogue 5.1 audio and see how the results compare between software playback and HD-A1. Of course, this predicates the software solution will get it right and that is not necessarily a given.

I'm not convinced that a test DVD is the be-all of calibration either for the HD-A1 as it only includes basic DD and DTS. What it really needs is a test HD-DVD with all the multichannel audios represented in test form to fully evaluate the Toshiba players. I would hazard a guess that because we don't have such a test disc, we don't really know the extent of Toshiba's handling of analogue output for the various advanced codecs.

For the life of me I can not figure out what I am doing wrong. My receiver is a Yamaha 5790. I have the speakers all set to small. I have the level of ALL the speakers at -10 and sub at 0. Crossover is set at 80.

Not only is the bass output EXRTEMELY weak, the rest of the sound is very flat. Also the analog output is at least 10db lower than optical. Even when I crank it up 10db, the analog output is NOT EVEN CLOSE to the quality of the toslink output.

I have tried both cheap RCA cables and fairly good component cables and get the same results. I know that the problem is NOT with my receiver, because I had a SACD/DVD-a player hooked up to the 5.1 inputs and it sounded spectacular.

My firmware is 1.3.

Anyone have any ideas?...or do you think the 5.1 ouput of my player is defective?


I was in the same boat as you are when i first got my Hd-A1 .I bought pitch black and noticed that the bass was really weak.I set my bass at 10db. and that really helped plus i also think the sound on pitch black was'nt that great to begin with.The second movie i got was BBegins,oh boy was that a change in bass.Just crank up the decibals on your bass thru your reciever and that should help.

Those having issues with this. Is this your first time using 5.1 analog inputs?

The levels seem on par with every other device using the 5.1 analog connection I have made. So in my opinion there just isn't any issue here for Toshiba to solve.

Last night I hooked up my A1 using Analog, I have been using optical for the last few months. My Pre/PRO is a HK AVR 235. I hooked everything up correctly, Checked and double checked.

In the A1, I set everything to small, and the crossover to 80.

I ran the internal tones from the A1, everything good except the LFE/sub. I got nothing. I bumped up the db's in the amp to + 10. Nothing.

I ran Avia, and the same thing. Nothing outputting to the sub.

I changed cables, still the same.

After screwing around a bit with the settings in the A1, I set the center speaker to "Not Use" in the A1, which I believe creates a phantom center channel using the Mains.
Then low and behold I got LFE/Sub output from the A1 to the AVR.

So everything sounds great right now. I know this is not correct though. I am hoping for a update that will fix this issue.

I believe as it stands right now, there are some people that have low LFE/sub output, and others with NO LFE/Sub output. I hope this info I have found helps the guys with the same issues as mine. Once I got the sub channel to work, I had plenty of signal coming out of the A1, and did not need to bump up the level.

What test tones? The A1's internal test tones are screwed up, you have to use like THX Optimizer available on many SD-DVD's now.

What test tones? The A1's internal test tones are screwed up, you have to use like THX Optimizer available on many SD-DVD's now.


I was using the Tones on the AVIA disc

I set the center speaker to "Not Use" in the A1, which I believe creates a phantom center channel using the Mains.
Then low and behold I got LFE/Sub output from the A1 to the AVR.

So everything sounds great right now. I know this is not correct though. I am hoping for a update that will fix this issue. Sorry, what you say you experienced is not what a lot of other users have. I have a XA1 that I got last May and have been using the 5.1 analog outputs since last June. A normal 5.1 speaker config, all set to small, 80 Hz sub cross. Other than a "normal" extra sub channel boost (since that is what I have seen needed on all 5.1 analog outs like from SACD/DVD-A players, etc) no funny business required. I do not believe that there is an inherent design flaw like what you describe in the A1 and XA1 (same firmware for both).

I was using the Tones on the AVIA disc


I would try the Optimizer test tones still and see if it is any different. Your expeirence is just to strange for words. Weirdorama for sure.

PS: TrueHD by all reports does not support a phantom center at all.

Everything works fine now. I went ahead and tested the Truehd using the HDDVD Constantine, and everything works fine. I am not sure why the Avia test tones did not work.

Sorry, what you say you experienced is not what a lot of other users have. I have a XA1 that I got last May and have been using the 5.1 analog outputs since last June. A normal 5.1 speaker config, all set to small, 80 Hz sub cross. Other than a "normal" extra sub channel boost (since that is what I have seen needed on all 5.1 analog outs like from SACD/DVD-A players, etc) no funny business required. I do not believe that there is an inherent design flaw like what you describe in the A1 and XA1 (same firmware for both).

My experience with the XA1 was similar for the most part, BUT I could not hear my sub with the Toshiba built in test tones. In fact, I could not even feel it with my finger tips on the cone.
But when I ran an Avia test disk, I switched the analog bypass in an out of my Outlaw pre/pro while listening to the Avia test tones. I heard the typical bass warble in both analog and digital modes, and the levels were very close. So obviously the player is reproducing bass content from the loaded disk, but the internal test scheme appears to be problematic.
What is also missing is a true (as in TrueHD) test disk, (as well as video).
But I understand one is planned for release late February. Flawed internal tests tones aside, these players have certainly raised the bar for audio quality.

NEW: The only time I 'felt' the sub was during the Center Channel test. This was posted elsewhere, and changing the center to Large eliminates it. This built-in scheme will get you in the 'rough'. You really need to use a test disk to adequately adjust levels, etc.