reboot the box and it should populate.

I rebooted the box and it did not populate :( wednesday is still blank...and now thursday and friday...:eek:

And if it does not do that, you could have Navigator sooner rather than later. Actually, about 2-3 weeks before we got Navigator, I do remember the box advancing only one or two days with repeated regularity. If the box is not generating Passport/SARA data after a certain day, following a reboot, you could be hit with Navigator at any time. Even if seven days of program advancing comes back after the reboot, you could still be hit with Navigator soon. Watch for things like:

Being able to only browse only one or two days ahead repeatedly.

Unexpected pixiation in the picture, especially on digital stations.

Your box rebooting several times a day.

Info in the mail about Navigator, Phone calls, E-mails, or a combination of these things.

Large traffic about Navigator on the Navigator boards and cities where a roll-out is expected.

If you have 3 or more of those things happening, you could almost expect Navigator within days to two weeks maximum.

Jack

Just that one thing has happened so far...no mail, phone calls, just the regular monthly E-Mail :confused:

God...Who said anything about getting rid of the traditional DVRs? As far as I'm concerned, it would be REAL difficult to get completely rid of them because it would result in MANY more VOD slots being opened up for everyone to be able to watch their recordings at once. They would either have to go IPTV or some other wild idea to accomplish that. Other than that, a network DVR service would only be an 'option' and nothing more.

Fact being, if you are that worried and they DID decide to kill off traditional DVRs altogether, you still have the option of a Tivo at your disposal. Yeah, it is more expensive, but you get what you pay for. :p

I assumed if they went with a network DVR they'd use it as a cost cutting way to deliver DVR service without needing to buy DVR boxes and maintain the hard drives on returned boxes. And knowing TWC, the most reasonable solution is the one they never choose. So bye bye DVRs! ;)

Plus TWC doesn't seem to have a problem with VOD now. They ferociously advertise their VOD offerings on their cable channels plus the VOD-like SDV system i sued on almost every cable HD channel and the pay sports tiers.

See Chat, you're giving TWC too much credit. Why are we assuming they would consider whether or not something would work? Afterall this is the company that gave us SDV and Navigator :p. If it's cheap and they can PR it good, they'll use it. Of course it's all speculation, so I'll sit back and see how it goes with whatever Cablevision chooses to use.

Tivo, surely you jest! :p:p The only things keeping me with TWC(after my newfound love of OTA) is the cable channels like USA, F/X, MSNBC, CNN and the DVR. If I dumped cable, I would no longer have a DVR. So if TWC no longer had a "traditional" DVR, that would eliminate the advantage they have there. I'd just go to OTA and watch whatever is on TV. And for recording in an emergency, that's why you have a VCR with a converter box connected. ;)

Yeah. It's been a big issue going on legally.

Cablevision Network DVR This Summer? -- Company hints at compromises (http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/102516)
Cable operators have long dreamed of remote storage DVRs (RS-DVRs) that store video content at the network head end, eliminating the need for a consumer-side set top box entirely. Cablevision conducted a 1,000 person trial of a network DVR service in 2006 that worked essentially the same way as a traditional DVR -- except that 80 hours of video content were stored on Cablevision servers.

But then Cablevision was sued by the entertainment industry, who claimed the system violated broadcast and copyright laws -- but was largely just fearful of a loss of ad revenue and control. In 2007, a Federal judge ruled against Cablevision, preventing Cablevision from broader deployment. Cablevision won subsequent rounds, though the case is now potentially heading all the way to the Supreme Court.

Light Reading (http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=176881&site=cdn&) quotes Cablevision COO Tom Rutledge, who hints that an agreement may be in the works with copyright holders, and that users may see the service as soon as this summer:
"We'll be rolling out our first product based on [the RS-DVR] later this summer. We'll move to centralized storage. I think ultimately we'll end up in some commercial arrangement with programmers. We're having discussions with the copyright holders that can make the network DVR model work in their best interests."

Such language usually means compromises that make the product less interesting to users, including the possibility of unskippable advertisements. Cablevision has previously stated their implementation of the service would provide customers with about 160GB of network-side storage to start, and, given the functionality will be the same as their existing DVR, a price tag somewhere around $9.95 a month.

DOJ Urges Supremes Not To Hear Network DVR Case -- Which could prove to be a big win for Cablevision, TV lovers... (http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/102676)
In a filing (http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1434130~739f94d8803518f4f64875250fa6faac/09-05-29osg%20brief.pdf), (pdf) the DOJ Solicitor General on Friday urged the Supreme Court not to hear a case in which the entertainment industry has sued Cablevision for use of a network DVR (or RS-DVR). The network DVR stores video content at the network head end, eliminating the need for a consumer-side set top box entirely. Cablevision tested the idea in 2006 storing 80GB of data for 1,000 trial users on their network. But the company was sued by the entertainment industry, who feared a loss of ad revenue and content control.

The entertainment industry (GE, NBC, CBS, Walt Disney, ABC; and others) saw legal success early on, but Cablevision won a key ruling from a federal appeals court in Philadelphia last summer. The case now heads to the Supreme Court, and a refusal to hear the case would in essence be a victory for Cablevision, who has previously stated their implementation of the service would provide customers with about 160GB of network-side storage for about the same price as current DVR service (around $10 per month).

Traditionally the Supreme Court doesn't always listen to the DOJ's Solicitor General, though they have been swayed by input in the past. Consumer advocates were please by the news, Public Knowledge's Gigi Sohn "wholeheartedly agreeing" with the DOJ. "Common sense would dictate that a recording is a recording, whether made on a set-top box or in a cable head-end," says Sohn "We hope the U.S. Supreme Court follows this advice and removes any legal obstacles from the Cablevision service going forward."

Should the Supreme Court hear the case and side with the entertainment industry, network functionality could be significantly less interesting for consumers, as any compromises with copyright holders could result in annoying changes such as unskippable advertisements.

The Network DVR Lives -- Supremes won't hear case, Cablevision prevails... (http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/103166)
Back in 2006, we discussed (http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/75172) how Cablevision had to suspend their efforts to create a network DVR (content is stored on the ISP head end instead of a set top box) after being sued by broadcasters and the entertainment industry, who were afraid of losing control of their content and ad revenue. The entertainment industry won the first round of that fight, but the ruling was overturned last August by the 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals. This morning the case landed in the lap of the Supreme Court, who refused to hear it (http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssTechMediaTelecomNews/idUSWAT01157320090629), essentially giving Cablevision the green light to finally deploy the service later this year.

Update: Cablevision issued the following statement:
This is a tremendous victory, and it opens up the possibility of offering a DVR experience to all of our digital cable customers. At the same time, we are mindful of the potential implications for ad skipping and the concerns this has raised in the programming community. We believe there are ways to take this victory and work with programmers to give our customers what they want - full DVR functionality through existing digital set-top boxes - and at the same time deliver real benefits to advertisers. This landmark case gives the cable industry, and Cablevision in particular, the opportunity to do something that our satellite competitors cannot do. We expect to begin deploying the first application of this new technology, the ability to pause live television when the phone rings, as a value-added benefit to our customers later this summer."

Navigator came very unexpected for me. The transition had started in March and by the beginning of May my 8300 still hadn't seen it. Until a Sunday night/early Monday morning when the box shut off and rebooted. Felt like I had just been kicked in the nuts. That was a bad, bad day. :(:(:( I don't want to think about it...

Lol...that's what I am afraid of too!! :eek:

Huh. I didn't realize that Cablevision was doing network DVR. TWC tried some years back and the content providers came after them, as recording something and giving it to other people constitutes illegal distribution of copyrighted material. US copyright law allows for the recording of television in your own home for your personal use.

TWC implemented their initial network DVR by making one copy of anything anyone wanted to record and giving those people access to the same copy. hey came up with a scheme to get around the legal problems with that, by essentially allocating private storage at a central facility to each subscriber to the service and making multiple recordings into those private rented disk spaces. Essentially, it was like leasing a DVR that would physically live at some TWC site, with remote access to the DVR to set up recordings and play them back. I don't know whether that actually satisfied legal objections to network DVR or not. It would be interesting to know how Cablevision is doing it.

I think there was a Supreme Court ruling on it recently. I remember seeing something about it...

Here it is:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/29/supreme-court-wont-block-_n_222570.html

nickdawg...how does the navigator work on the SA8300HD compared to the other cableboxes that you have?? Is it about the same or worse??:confused:

nickdawg...how does the navigator work on the SA8300HD compared to the other cableboxes that you have?? Is it about the same or worse??:confused:

What guide do you currently have, Passport or SARA? If you need help, see this post by Vchat:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16173908&postcount=18162

Every box gets navigator when they switch, it takes a few weeks because one box model is done at a time. Performance depends on a few things. Since you have a 8300HD, you should be OK. The Software seems to perform well on 8300s. If you have an external hard drive eSATA, you may be in for some problems with Navigator, as eSATA support is a bit flaky. Also if you have SDV-switched digital video(a buttload of HD channels) You may have some recording issues with those channels.

Navigator is tolerable, much improved over where it was two years ago. But it is still far behind established, professional developed software like SARA or Passport.

I rebooted the box and it did not populate :( Wednesday is still blank...and now Thursday and Friday...:eek:

Sounds like you could have Navigator next week! I don't know if it is going to be :mad:, :confused:, or:D.

The 8300HD box for my division works well with Navigator. Outside of the new Samsungs, the 8300 box is the best. If wiring and signal strength are good as well, you should be just fine.

Jack

What guide do you currently have, Passport or SARA? If you need help, see this post by Vchat:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16173908&postcount=18162

Every box gets navigator when they switch, it takes a few weeks because one box model is done at a time. Performance depends on a few things. Since you have a 8300HD, you should be OK. The Software seems to perform well on 8300s. If you have an external hard drive eSATA, you may be in for some problems with Navigator, as eSATA support is a bit flaky. Also if you have SDV-switched digital video(a buttload of HD channels) You may have some recording issues with those channels.

Navigator is tolerable, much improved over where it was two years ago. But it is still far behind established, professional developed software like SARA or Passport.

I have SARA right now. I don't like when you have questions with TW...they always assume that it is your fault...like your cablebox...never checking with the headend to see if there are problems there first. The last problem I had was with some HD channels and right away they set up an appointment. Luckily before the tech came out he called and asked if my problems were solved...to my surprise they were...and he actually apologized saying that it was one of the nodes on there system...

Sounds like you could have Navigator next week! I don't know if it is going to be :mad:, :confused:, or:D.

The 8300HD box for my division works well with Navigator. Outside of the new Samsungs, the 8300 box is the best. If wiring and signal strength are good as well, you should be just fine.

Jack

My fingers are crossed...

Holy $**t! I hope they don't feel "rushed!" Hahahaha

Actually Jack, don't think we can lay this one on TWC... there was a huge hue and cry and I think a lawsuit over the Start Over thing. Content owners pretty much universally hated the idea... but I think the suit got settled or adjudicated, whatever. Now they are fully going ahead with the concept.

Personally I think this is very much a part of TWC making sure we had very limited ability to record stuff by going with such small HDDs in their DVRs; Start Over seems to be their idea of some panacea... an idea I find 100% bogus.

I didn't realize that Cablevision was doing network DVR. TWC tried some years back and the content providers came after them, as recording something and giving it to other people constitutes illegal distribution of copyrighted material. US copyright law allows for the recording of television in your own home for your personal use.

I think some may be lumping Start Over and Network DVR into the same boat (I'm sure you know the distinction!) and while they are vaguely similar, are very different concepts (and huge expense differences). Both concepts the content guys hated. Pretty sure there was some legal action recently that gave the MSOs the green light on Start Over.

I assumed if they went with a network DVR they'd use it as a cost cutting way to deliver DVR service without needing to buy DVR boxes and maintain the hard drives on returned boxes. And knowing TWC, the most reasonable solution is the one they never choose. So bye bye DVRs! ;)

I have no inside knowledge, but I'd strongly suspect that networked DVR will cost them a lot MORE than the current DVR box at the customers location scenario.

Both concepts the content guys hated. Pretty sure there was some legal action recently that gave the MSOs the green light on Start Over.Start Over is by content provider agreement, which is why it's only on a limited number of channels as yet. The content providers agree to it because, by design, you can't zap the ads. There's no such motivation with networked DVR service.

Navigator is tolerable, much improved over where it was two years ago. But it is still far behind established, professional developed software like SARA or Passport.SARA has the advantage of being rock solid, but as far as usability goes, it's a travesty. I used it for 3 weeks and nearly went insane--I cheerfully paid $900 for a TiVo+3 year's service to escape using it. I'd never have bought an HD TiVo if I'd continued to use Passport.

Also, it's ugly and its mother dresses it funny. It's very evident that no kind of professional design effort went into it's presentation. I'm certain that the bitmaps for the fonts were whipped up by some programmer and even its blocky line art is jagged.

I'd much rather use Navigator, slowness and all.

I think there was a Supreme Court ruling on it recently. I remember seeing something about it...

Here it is:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/29/supreme-court-wont-block-_n_222570.htmlThanks for the link, Nick. It's interesting that there doesn't seem to be any prohibition against the operators making a single copy and giving multiple subscribers access to it. As long as they don't record stuff that nobody's asked for or give people access to existing recordings which they didn't program their "DVR" to record, it not "on demand".

Time Warner has describe a more VOD-like service called "Look Back", with which you can watch some programs from the past 24 hours on a channel where it's enabled. Again, it's provided by agreement with various networks and lacks any fast forward capability. I'm not sure whether they've rolled that out anywhere.

Thanks for the link, Nick. It's interesting that there doesn't seem to be any prohibition against the operators making a single copy and giving multiple subscribers access to it. As long as they don't record stuff that nobody's asked for or give people access to existing recordings which they didn't program their "DVR" to record, it not "on demand".

Time Warner has describe a more VOD-like service called "Look Back", with which you can watch some programs from the past 24 hours on a channel where it's enabled. Again, it's provided by agreement with various networks and lacks any fast forward capability. I'm not sure whether they've rolled that out anywhere.

I belive the VOD Channel Primetime on Demand has taken a bit of the steam out of look back. It's probably cheaper for TWC also. WOODY

SARA has the advantage of being rock solid, but as far as usability goes, it's a travesty. I used it for 3 weeks and nearly went insane--I cheerfully paid $900 for a TiVo+3 year's service to escape using it. I'd never have bought an HD TiVo if I'd continued to use Passport.

Also, it's ugly and its mother dresses it funny. It's very evident that no kind of professional design effort went into it's presentation. I'm certain that the bitmaps for the fonts were whipped up by some programmer and even its blocky line art is jagged.

I'd much rather use Navigator, slowness and all.

I agree!

I looked at those screen-shots of the side by side comparisons of the guides:


Moxi

An In-House IPG on Motorola Systems. (I think Buckeye Cable uses this.)

Old Passport (Non-DVR)

Old Passport Echo (DVR)

Navigator (New and Old Versions)

SARA

SARA was by-far the WORST looking guide I have ever seen! Even the older version of Navigator's blue on blue graphics looked light-years better than SARA. SARA looks like some DOS based system from about 1985 with C-64 color graphics added! (Yes, it may be rock solid for reliability of recordings, but its appearance really is THAT bad!)

In contrast the new Navigator color scheme looks strikingly similar to Passport! So SARA users, it's almost going to be like looking at an HD guide when you get changed over. I'm serious!

Jack

(Yes, it may be rock solid for reliability of recordings, but its appearance really is THAT bad!)


I don't get all the talk about the stability of recordings with SARA. Mine (on an 8300HDC) regularly skips recordings, cuts off anywhere from 1 to 30 minutes from the end, starts recording halfway into the show, has things randomly disappear from the scheduled recording list, etc. And for the last few days the guide as been ridiculously sllllowwww...I'm talking literally 10-15 seconds to move forward two hours in the guide. Not to mention its ugliness. I honestly don't see how Navigator could be any worse than this, and if it is, then they must be TRYING to see how bad they can make their products.

I don't get all the talk about the stability of recordings with SARA. Mine (on an 8300HDC) regularly skips recordings, cuts off anywhere from 1 to 30 minutes from the end, starts recording halfway into the show, has things randomly disappear from the scheduled recording list, etc. And for the last few days the guide as been ridiculously sllllowwww...I'm talking literally 10-15 seconds to move forward two hours in the guide. Not to mention its ugliness. I honestly don't see how Navigator could be any worse than this, and if it is, then they must be TRYING to see how bad they can make their products.

Hey Ryan,

In what TWC division are you located? If your guide has been really slow you should have your wiring and signal strength checked out through a service call. These may be issues. How long have you had your box? The 8300HDC? The newer versions of the 8300HDC released within a year or so are faster than the older versions of the 8300HDC. If you get your wiring and signals checked out, maybe a new box will help. Does your division have the new Samsung DVR's? I heard they are the fastest boxes out there and they are really fast! (Better than the 8300HDC!)

Jack

I agree!

I looked at those screen-shots of the side by side comparisons of the guides:


Moxi

An In-House IPG on Motorola Systems. (I think Buckeye Cable uses this.)

Old Passport (Non-DVR)

Old Passport Echo (DVR)

Navigator (New and Old Versions)

SARA

SARA was by-far the WORST looking guide I have ever seen! Even the older version of Navigator's blue on blue graphics looked light-years better than SARA. SARA looks like some DOS based system from about 1985 with C-64 color graphics added! (Yes, it may be rock solid for reliability of recordings, but its appearance really is THAT bad!)

In contrast the new Navigator color scheme looks strikingly similar to Passport! So SARA users, it's almost going to be like looking at an HD guide when you get changed over. I'm serious!

Jack

Now you see why us SARA users are waiting with bated breath for Navigator. We are tired of liveing in the sixties. WOODY

To be quite honest, I am hoping Navigator fails epically somewhere along the line and TWC goes crawling back to Aptiv to license Passport again. Then maybe we can get the OCAP Passport IPG with the nice 16:9 guide. :D WHY TWC got the crazy idea to spend MORE on developing their own rather than continuing to license a guide from an experienced company is beyond me comprehension.

You're hoping it fails? I think that ship has already sailed. Navigator is far from success. And now that TWC is starting to change SARA to Navigator, I think we're stuck. The future is Navigator.

Just remember, the option that makes the most sense is the option TWC rarely chooses. ;)

By fail, I mean some massive catastrophe. ie: A whopper of a bug that bricks every box in a single region, some crackhead developer permanently wipes every copy and backup of the source code, etc.. Something to get TW cheeseheads to say '**** this, scrap it.'

By fail, I mean some massive catastrophe. ie: A whopper of a bug that bricks every box in a single region, some crackhead developer permanently wipes every copy and backup of the source code, etc.. Something to get TW cheeseheads to say '**** this, scrap it.'

That just might happen. We still haven't heard what happens when a SARA box is converted to Navigator. We can only hope that the SARA to Navigator transition goes horribly wrong and a majority of the boxes in the area are permanently damaged.

Hey Ryan,

In what TWC division are you located? If your guide has been really slow you should have your wiring and signal strength checked out through a service call. These may be issues. How long have you had your box? The 8300HDC? The newer versions of the 8300HDC released within a year or so are faster than the older versions of the 8300HDC. If you get your wiring and signals checked out, maybe a new box will help. Does your division have the new Samsung DVR's? I heard they are the fastest boxes out there and they are really fast! (Better than the 8300HDC!)

Jack

I'm in the Central NY division. I've had the box for three years now, and the slow guide is a very recent development. It seems odd that it could be a wiring/signal problem...it just seems sluggish like a really slow PC, but I'll put in a call if it's still acting up after the weekend. I have no idea about us having the new Samsung DVRs, but I doubt it since we're usually pretty late getting other updates.

That just might happen. We still haven't heard what happens when a SARA box is converted to Navigator. We can only hope that the SARA to Navigator transition goes horribly wrong and a majority of the boxes in the area are permanently damaged.

Still wouldn't make a difference at this stage. It's spread too far.

If they didn't reverse policy back when Lincoln got massacred there is no chance they will now.

I mean look how bad the official report summary was back then. It couldn't get much worse and they still continued.


The CAB [Lincoln Cable Advisory Board] finds that TWC did unacceptably degrade television service provided to the citizens of Lincoln. The Board finds that TWC did conduct a software "beta test" without following common industry practice of customer notification and compensation. Further, the CAB finds that customer service interactions with citizens could be improved.

...

Based on public testimony and the number of written and telephoned complaints received, the Board believes all digital customers must have been affected. The Board believes the degree of degraded service was significant.

...

The CAB finds that because of the high volume of complaints and requests for information, TWC customer service was substandard during the Navigator beta test period. Further, we find that the lack of complaint tracking could lead to inadequate customer support

...


Time Warner Cable has wronged Lincoln customers through degraded cable television service and by employing them Involuntarily as uncompensated beta test participants. Further, TWC has misled customers about Navigator initial capabilities, minimized the software's initial shortcomings and by not answering legitimate questions, failed to cooperate fully with the evaluation process.

The CAB notes that meeting the Board's recommendations may entail negotiation of changes to the franchise agreement.

http://lancaster.ne.gov/City/mayor/pdf/twc/cab_report.pdf

I'm in the Central NY division. I've had the box for three years now, and the slow guide is a very recent development. It seems odd that it could be a wiring/signal problem...it just seems sluggish like a really slow PC, but I'll put in a call if it's still acting up after the weekend. I have no idea about us having the new Samsung DVRs, but I doubt it since we're usually pretty late getting other updates.

Good luck! Sounds like you have the right plan.

Jack

Hey Ryan,

In what TWC division are you located? If your guide has been really slow you should have your wiring and signal strength checked out through a service call. These may be issues. How long have you had your box? The 8300HDC? The newer versions of the 8300HDC released within a year or so are faster than the older versions of the 8300HDC. If you get your wiring and signals checked out, maybe a new box will help. Does your division have the new Samsung DVR's? I heard they are the fastest boxes out there and they are really fast! (Better than the 8300HDC!)

Jack

I think you're really blowing sunshine on those Samsung boxes. Last I heard from the dude here who had one was it was freezing up and not loading the Navigator software. Basically it sounds like the 8300HDC two years ago. I know I wouldn't want one of those Samsung boxes, at least not now. It'll be at least two years before they can figure out how to make the software work with the hardware. At least now the 8240/8300HDCs work decently. Right now any SA box that ends with HDC is the best box TWC has to offer.

That just might happen. We still haven't heard what happens when a SARA box is converted to Navigator. We can only hope that the SARA to Navigator transition goes horribly wrong and a majority of the boxes in the area are permanently damaged.

The thing is, I don't think you can compare Navigator's Titanic shipwreck in Nebraska three years ago to now. The difference (for most divisions) has been in terms of light-years of speed, improvement, and reliability. As much as some Passport users may want that software back, Navigator has been too-far developed going on four years now for it to be abandoned.

I wonder if Nick's division can be blamed totally on Navigator, or just circus clowns in his Ohio unit that haven't a clue as to how to deploy SDV content? The reason is because in most divisions, SDV works well, and in the past three years, provided that you have a box with enough memory and good signal strength at the head-end, Navigator also works well. Don't forget, we in Milwaukee Wisconsin were one of those test markets back in January 2007, and by April 2007, our management aborted Navigator for about nine months because it was so bad.

In late 2007 to early 2008 they started the downloads to the MDN boxes, and the difference, (again provided that you had a box with strong enough RAM was like night and day.) However, those early releases of Navigator pushed out in late Fall 2006-Spring 2007 were actually NOT SUPPOSED TO BE RELEASED TILL A YEAR LATER, (or at least six months later, somewhere between that.) The FCC mandated the integrated cable boxes (C-boxes) as of July 1, 2007 for all new units. (OCAP.) New Navigator Guide+ FCC mandate for integrated cable cards in all new boxes+ divisions caught off guard all contributed to these problems. I don't think it was just early releases of Navigator. There were other factors that unfortunately for TWC, early releases of Navigator happened to be a part of at that time. (Fall 2006-Late Spring 2007.)

Once the C-boxes got through their first 6-8 months mainstreaming, and once Navigator got into the Spring of 2008 on boxes that had the memory to support it, things were very good, and Navigator has been improving ever since. I don't know about wishing doom on it? LOL! What would suffering customers do in the meantime? It would take at least a year for a new system to develop?

However, I do agree with Nick that TWC should have stuck with the Passport system, by paying Aptiv TV for SDV updates. There are things that I like about Navigator that I think are better than Passport, and there are a few things that I like about Passport better than Navigator. My belief is if TWC would have paid the Aptiv TV/Passport guys for SDV updates, that the IPG would be better than Navigator is now. But TWC didn't do that. So we can only compare the old Passport to a continuing to be developed Navigator. I think that if Navigator gets Keyword Search and Manual Recording, it will be just as good as Passport was.

I also agree that Nick's SDV problem is serious and should be addressed. Nick, have you tried to contact your local city council (i.e City Hall) to file a grievance complaint for the poor levels of TWC service in your area? You may also wish to file a complaint to the Better Business Bureau by calling your local BBB division or on-line. I wish there were other options for you such as Dish or U-Verse instead of TWC. I have heard so much bad stuff about your inept Ohio division. If only you didn't have to commit to a long term contract for Dish! I can't remember, do you have a lot of trees in your area?

I think Nick should file a complaint about his cable service to some higher authority. It seems that things just aren't working out for him and it has been that way for a very long time.

Jack

Considering other areas in Ohio, I don't have it as bad. Some areas are still waiting for SDV to be turned on, as in it hasn't even begun in their area yet. Plus the persistent picture breakup was fixed back in May. Now all I get on certain channels(and the problem moves based on frequency) is picture breakup for about a minute at the top and bottom of every hour. I've learned to live with that rather than go through the stress of complaining about it.

The other problem I've had is the DVR giving partial recordings on SDV channels when I record two show back to back. But I've seen this in an independent thread as a problem that takes place in various systems with SDV and Navigator. I don't dare tell TWC as they will probably take my box away and I don't want that since it is not the box's fault. I finally have a new box and I won't take the risk of getting a used 8300HDC or even worse a box that runs MDN:eek:. I guess that is just a problem that will be fixed in time.

Other than that, Navigator is not as severely problematic as you made it sound. It works fairly well and is stable(compared to the past). But is it as good as Passport or SARA? Nope. And it never will be because it doesn't have the benefit of professional software developers and a research and development department like one Scientific Atlanta/Cisco or Aptiv Digital has. Navigator showed up to football practice with a baseball bat.

Satellite would be an option as I have no huge trees in the line of sight(I've had D* before). I didn't like satellite and I won't go back to it, especially now that they have those two year commitments. Uverse is supposed to be available in my area, not sure about my exact location. And since that is IPTV technology again we get into the new territory where I'm unsure. If anything, I'd stop pay TV altogether and go OTA. I've had the best luck with OTA HD. I've even been able to get two almost impossible VHF HD channels with an indoor antenna. And the PQ is better.

If you are worried about picture quality, nick, I would stay far, FAR away from uverse. LAst I heard it had noticably worse compression than cable. Which is not surprising when they are trying to feed something like 2 1080i and 2 480i mpeg4 streams and a standard HSI tier on around a ~20mbit VDSL line (it may not be 2HDx2SD, but I forget the exact count).

It really comes down to what is worth it more to you: Quality or price. Uverse with their current triple play package seems to be about the cheapest option below Dish and then TWC. I'd jump to Uverse in a heartbeat for the price concerns alone, but we have Sprint/Embarq here (Ewwwwwwww.)

If you are worried about picture quality, nick, I would stay far, FAR away from uverse. LAst I heard it had noticably worse compression than cable. Which is not surprising when they are trying to feed something like 2 1080i and 2 480i mpeg4 streams and a standard HSI tier on around a ~20mbit VDSL line (it may not be 2HDx2SD, but I forget the exact count).

It really comes down to what is worth it more to you: Quality or price. Uverse with their current triple play package seems to be about the cheapest option below Dish and then TWC. I'd jump to Uverse in a heartbeat for the price concerns alone, but we have Sprint/Embarq here (Ewwwwwwww.)

How much worse is it than TWC? Would you say it is worse than TWC HD(let's use Palladia or USA HD as an example) or is it slightly better? I've always found those channels to look horrible based on what programming they have. But after watching OTA HD, the picture on Palladia is vomit inducing. I was watching a DVRed Green Day show the other day and between the censored lyrics and awful PQ of the live performance, it went to the delete bin after a few minutes. After watching sitcoms earlier that night on WEWS and WKYC, the PQ was painful to watch.

To be quite honest, I am hoping Navigator fails epically somewhere along the line and TWC goes crawling back to Aptiv to license Passport again. Then maybe we can get the OCAP Passport IPG with the nice 16:9 guide. :D WHY TWC got the crazy idea to spend MORE on developing their own rather than continuing to license a guide from an experienced company is beyond me comprehension.

I think this is 100% due to TWC's total ineptness. From a conceptual standpoint, it actually is far better to completely control the services you are selling... but that assumes a fairly high degree of competence... which TWC has ably demonstrated over the past few years they completely lack.

I think this is 100% due to TWC's total ineptness. From a conceptual standpoint, it actually is far better to completely control the services you are selling... but that assumes a fairly high degree of competence... which TWC has ably demonstrated over the past few years they completely lack.

I agree with Riverside Guy,

What we don't know was how much it cost TWC to pay AptivTV/Passport each year for updates? Maybe AptivTV demanded a big raise in fees and TWC said, "Maybe it would be better for us economically if we had one guide that we could control across divisions for features and updates." Remember, at the time of Navigator's 2006-late 2007 roll out catastrophes there was Passport, SARA, and there were also those Motorola boxes guides left over when TWC bought Adelphia. Weren't those guides developed "in-house" by Adelphia?

I have no problem with TWC developing their own guide to save money and get more features universal across systems. The problem was as both Riverside Guy and Nick said, TWC did not have the engineering and program development experience in IPG design to compare with developers from Passport who have been doing this for ten years. No one from within an organization that wants control of software is going to think, "You know what? Maybe these guys need some training and help in developing this thing?" That's what clearly was shown did not happen. In the interim you had:

1.) The FCC mandating "new" integrated cable card boxes (with problems of their own.)

2.) Incredibly extreme diverse divisions with regard to levels of training, technology, updating. A few were great, most were OK, several were deplorably bad.

3.) Unclear communication from those in charge in those early years as to what was needed to make Navigator a positive experience. TWC saw the "Save money, develop an in-house IPG" dancing in front of them without looking at "Are our engineers trained to really do this?" And very few are going to bash or question their own organization's lack of experience or ineptness about doing something when they themselves are part of that organization. That's the problem.

4.) In the last two years, the engineers have finally gotten the training and experience to develop an adequate IPG. but I don't think customers would have had to put up with those first two years of hell, if TWC would have had more experienced people working in programing Navigator. Since there have been massive improvements to Navigator, TWC may have gotten outside help to make it work well, but it is doubtful that customers would ever be able to find out that information. In addition, the boxes are working better, and the inter-structure has improved with regards to Navigator, a lot. However, TWC can't go back and erase those first two years of Navigator hell. I am sure that they will work with outside vendors from now on, rather than go through that experience again!

Jack

seems no one has mentioned the financial stability of Passport. It has been sold and then resold, maybe more. Would you want to do business with them, no matter how good they are?

seems no one has mentioned the financial stability of Passport. It has been sold and then resold, maybe more. Would you want to do business with them, no matter how good they are?Not actually--Passports development group Aptiv Digital was acquired by Gemstar-TV Guide International, a transition which made imminent sense, since Gemstar was already IPGs-R-US. Then Gemstar was assimilated by Macrovision--Aptiv and Passport just came with the deal, as did i-Guide, TV Guide On Screen, TV Guide Online and TV Guide Magazine (Macrovision fairly quickly sold the magazine, presumably because it was too unrelated to their business).

In essence, the product has become the property of increasingly financially stable companies.

I agree with Riverside Guy,

What we don't know was how much it cost TWC to pay AptivTV/Passport each year for updates? Maybe AptivTV demanded a big raise in fees and TWC said, "Maybe it would be better for us economically if we had one guide that we could control across divisions for features and updates." Remember, at the time of Navigator's 2006-late 2007 roll out catastrophes there was Passport, SARA, and there were also those Motorola boxes guides left over when TWC bought Adelphia. Weren't those guides developed "in-house" by Adelphia?

Could be. Maybe it's like the case of NFL Network. TWC only wants to raise your bill when all the money from the price increase goes into THEIR pockets. If the bill is increased and the money goes to another company, then they pretend they "care about not raising your bill". Just like how they felt the need to save us from a bill increase by dropping HD Net. The bill went up anyway, for their own reasons. I wouldn't mind paying more each month just to have Passport and a cable system that works.

I have no problem with TWC developing their own guide to save money and get more features universal across systems. The problem was as both Riverside Guy and Nick said, TWC did not have the engineering and program development experience in IPG design to compare with developers from Passport who have been doing this for ten years. No one from within an organization that wants control of software is going to think, "You know what? Maybe these guys need some training and help in developing this thing?" That's what clearly was shown did not happen. In the interim you had:

1.) The FCC mandating "new" integrated cable card boxes (with problems of their own.)

2.) Incredibly extreme diverse divisions with regard to levels of training, technology, updating. A few were great, most were OK, several were deplorably bad.

3.) Unclear communication from those in charge in those early years as to what was needed to make Navigator a positive experience. TWC saw the "Save money, develop an in-house IPG" dancing in front of them without looking at "Are our engineers trained to really do this?" And very few are going to bash or question their own organization's lack of experience or ineptness about doing something when they themselves are part of that organization. That's the problem.

4.) In the last two years, the engineers have finally gotten the training and experience to develop an adequate IPG. but I don't think customers would have had to put up with those first two years of hell, if TWC would have had more experienced people working in programing Navigator. Since there have been massive improvements to Navigator, TWC may have gotten outside help to make it work well, but it is doubtful that customers would ever be able to find out that information. In addition, the boxes are working better, and the inter-structure has improved with regards to Navigator, a lot. However, TWC can't go back and erase those first two years of Navigator hell. I am sure that they will work with outside vendors from now on, rather than go through that experience again!

Jack

The 7/1/07 cable card thing helped create a reason to use Navigator. Before that there was no real need for it. Other than punishing some customers in Nebraska. :rolleyes: It was perfect, start putting Navigator on those new boxes we're FORCED to buy then roll out Navigator on the existing TVs, you know for "consistency". ;)

Of course Navigator wasn't even needed for this reason. They could have easily started using SARA on HDC boxes on every system. Then when they wanted to go SDV, again SARA would cover that problem. Plus the licensing fees have to be better, as it is from SA/Cisco and they buy so many boxes from them.

I'm all done with the new box and the new Navigator. Latest issues I've had are:

- Breaking up of recordings. On more than one occasion, I'll tape a 1 or 2 hour show with no competing recordings and find out that the recording has been separated into 2-5 different chunks. Sometimes it splits evenly at the hour mark, sometimes it splits at completely random spots, leaving pieces as little as 4 minutes long. My older 8300HD Passport box is set to record the same shows and has no trouble whatsoever.

- Screen goes gray. Guessing this has to do with the output resolution since the box was most recently hooked up to a 2004 vintage EDTV. Tried setting the box to 480i, 480p, and 108oi first, and then just to 1080i. No dice. Sometimes the screen would just blank out with sound still coming through. My attached Slingbox would be the only way to see the picture. Again, the 8300HD was connected to that TV for 4 years without once showing the same problem.

- Random repeat recordings. I have Daily Show and Colbert set to tape new episodes only. Every once in while, it goes on to tape the repeat episodes that air throughout the next day (sometimes 4 identical episodes in a day). Ironically, I actually think this is a new "feature" gone awry. I think the box is supposed to tape the next airing if there's a recording conflict but this can't be how it's supposed to work. Probably doesn't need to be said but the 8300HD handles the same recording schedule with no problems.

- Occasional freezing up. Screen sometimes glitches when the guide or menu goes up and leaves the TV picture in the top right of the screen. The other 3/4s of the screen stays black. Channel up and down works fine but no other buttons. Just standard bug fare, I guess.

I'm always curious if anyone else is either seeing this problems but in 6 days, I'm pulling the rip cord. Just ordered FiOS to be installed next weekend. If there have been any fixes or workarounds anyone wants me to test out before then, give a shout.

I'm all done with the new box and the new Navigator. Latest issues I've had are:

- Breaking up of recordings. On more than one occasion, I'll tape a 1 or 2 hour show with no competing recordings and find out that the recording has been separated into 2-5 different chunks. Sometimes it splits evenly at the hour mark, sometimes it splits at completely random spots, leaving pieces as little as 4 minutes long. My older 8300HD Passport box is set to record the same shows and has no trouble whatsoever.

- Screen goes gray. Guessing this has to do with the output resolution since the box was most recently hooked up to a 2004 vintage EDTV. Tried setting the box to 480i, 480p, and 108oi first, and then just to 1080i. No dice. Sometimes the screen would just blank out with sound still coming through. My attached Slingbox would be the only way to see the picture. Again, the 8300HD was connected to that TV for 4 years without once showing the same problem.

- Random repeat recordings. I have Daily Show and Colbert set to tape new episodes only. Every once in while, it goes on to tape the repeat episodes that air throughout the next day (sometimes 4 identical episodes in a day). Ironically, I actually think this is a new "feature" gone awry. I think the box is supposed to tape the next airing if there's a recording conflict but this can't be how it's supposed to work. Probably doesn't need to be said but the 8300HD handles the same recording schedule with no problems.

- Occasional freezing up. Screen sometimes glitches when the guide or menu goes up and leaves the TV picture in the top right of the screen. The other 3/4s of the screen stays black. Channel up and down works fine but no other buttons. Just standard bug fare, I guess.

I'm always curious if anyone else is either seeing this problems but in 6 days, I'm pulling the rip cord. Just ordered FiOS to be installed next weekend. If there have been any fixes or workarounds anyone wants me to test out before then, give a shout.

Just for the record, this was a Samusng box, I assume? Or an SA-8300 HDC? When did the problems first start? Maybe you got a defective box from the start?

Jack

Not actually--Passports development group Aptiv Digital was acquired by Gemstar-TV Guide International, a transition which made imminent sense, since Gemstar was already IPGs-R-US. Then Gemstar was assimilated by Macrovision--Aptiv and Passport just came with the deal, as did i-Guide, TV Guide On Screen, TV Guide Online and TV Guide Magazine (Macrovision fairly quickly sold the magazine, presumably because it was too unrelated to their business).

In essence, the product has become the property of increasingly financially stable companies.

what you say may be true but: quite often, when a small group with good technology is absorbed, that is exactly what happens - ABSORBED. when the group doesn't generate the expected profits, it is quietly put out to pasture, never to be heard from again. They are financially stable because they are willing to cut their loses.

Just for the record, this was a Samusng box, I assume? Or an SA-8300 HDC? When did the problems first start? Maybe you got a defective box from the start?

Jack

Whatever box he has, it sounds like it is running ODN version 2.xx or an earlier MDN version. That sounds alot like my experience with ODN 2 in 2007.

my 8300hd decided it wont boot anymore, it wont go past box #4 out of the 6 boxes at the initializing screen. Im using time warner cable west valley, ca. any tips?

my 8300hd decided it wont boot anymore, it wont go past box #4 out of the 6 boxes at the initializing screen. Im using time warner cable west valley, ca. any tips?

That box is toast. If that box is not booting and you have no problems with other TVs in the house, the box is bad. I'd try waiting, rebooting again. If that doesn't work, replace it.

my 8300hd decided it wont boot anymore, it wont go past box #4 out of the 6 boxes at the initializing screen. Im using time warner cable west valley, ca. any tips?

The box is very likely going bad. You may want to do one last effort to save it. Unplug the cable box for the night on the TV in question when no one else will be watching TV for several hours. In the morning, plug the box back in and wait for up to 30 minutes. (This actually worked for a few guys who thought their box was going bad.) It was stuck in some kind of warm boot error with the problem that you described, and needed to be cold booted with a cool down by letting it unplugged overnight. If it does not boot within 30 minutes, it is definitely bad and will need to be swapped out.

Let us know what happens. Call TWC if the above does not solve the issue.

Jack

I agree with Riverside Guy,

The FCC mandating "new" integrated cable card boxes (with problems of their own.)

Jack

Thanks!

I think that mandate was for STBs that did NOT integrate security. Which means they HAD to use an external security device, i.e. a cable card. Which was part of the whole push to make sure various CE guys had access to developing STBs for cable systems that could be sold directly to the consumers.

AND I believe said mandate came about in large part because the MSOs tried everything in their power to give such short shrift to cable cards that consumers would continue to rent the cable co. equipment (contrary to some who say that is a break even business, no way, they wouldn't essentially defy the FCC unless there were significant bucks involved they'd lose!).

We have pretty clear evidence that they can "get away" with things even with a governmental agency supposedly "watching out for consumers" in that it seems they can get said agency to look the other way.

Just for the record, this was a Samusng box, I assume? Or an SA-8300 HDC? When did the problems first start? Maybe you got a defective box from the start?

Jack

Whatever box he has, it sounds like it is running ODN version 2.xx or an earlier MDN version. That sounds alot like my experience with ODN 2 in 2007.

Possible it was a bad box. Samsung 3090. Problems started within days of having the new box. It's running ODN 3.1.0_11 though so it sounds like they never fixed what was wrong with ODN 2.xx.

ODN 3.1.0_11 is the version i hope central ny deploys when they do the update...i have studied many of its features and it seems to be very fast ...i love the way movies on demand is set up looks just the way ppv is supposed to look ! I know its me again window shopping!:rolleyes:i believe Indianapolis is running this version as well ... unless they have updated since march of this year!

ODN 3.1.0_11 is the version i hope central ny deploys when they do the update...i have studied many of its features and it seems to be very fast ...i love the way movies on demand is set up looks just the way ppv is supposed to look ! I know its me again window shopping!:rolleyes:i believe Indianapolis is running this version as well ... unless they have updated since march of this year!

I can't imagine TW rolling out 3.1.0_11 in a new ODN system.

3.1.0_11 is old... at the momemt it seems that only Charlotte and NYC are running it and those are the two systems having the most issues (especially with Samsung boxes). 3.1.1_3 is newer with bug fixes vs. 3.1.0_11 but otherwise the feature set appears to be the same. I am not sure if one is better than the other in regard to e-SATA... but I believe its broken in both of them.

Just spoke to my local TWC office. They said flyers were going out today and Navigator was in their system ready for launch. It is going to be launched by area and box over the next 3 to 4 weeks. As soon as I receive it I will lpost my opinion. WOODY

Just spoke to my local TWC office. They said flyers were going out today and Navigator was in their system ready for launch. It is going to be launched by area and box over the next 3 to 4 weeks. As soon as I receive it I will post my opinion. WOODY

Cool!

CW and Abyss are gonna be like kids waiting for Christmas morning!!! or New Years Eve!! :D You guys will be setting your alarm clocks waiting for the countdown on your boxes--(Which general happens around 2-4 am the night of the conversion.) They'll be watching the countdown together! hahaha (Usually from F-100 down to 1, or C-100 or something like that) like New Years Eve!

"Counting together with baited breathe and dramatic suspense."

"F-100.....ten minutes later down to "F-10.....9......8......7.....6....5....4...3..2...1....LOAD".............box boot, NAVIGATOR!!!!"

(Auld Lang Syne-The New Years Theme Song Plays in the background as they drink champagne and celebrate!!!) :D:D:D:D

Jack

Possible it was a bad box. Samsung 3090. Problems started within days of having the new box. It's running ODN 3.1.0_11 though so it sounds like they never fixed what was wrong with ODN 2.xx.

I would try to get a SA box. Avoid the Samsung like the plague. 3.1.0_11 is an older version, compared to my 3.1.1_3. I'm not sure if that runs better on the Samsung boxes, but I'd assume the newer ODN version fixes bugs on the SA boxes, as the Samsungs are new.

Does anyone here have a Samsung box with 3.1.1_3?

Cool!

CW and Abyss are gonna be like kids waiting for Christmas morning!!! or New Years Eve!! :D You guys will be setting your alarm clocks waiting for the countdown on your boxes--(Which general happens around 2-4 am the night of the conversion.) They'll be watching the countdown together! hahaha (Usually from F-100 down to 1, or C-100 or something like that) like New Years Eve!

"Counting together with baited breathe and dramatic suspense."

"F-100.....ten minutes later down to "F-10.....9......8......7.....6....5....4...3..2...1....LOAD".............box boot, NAVIGATOR!!!!"

(Auld Lang Syne-The New Years Theme Song Plays in the background as they drink champagne and celebrate!!!) :D:D:D:D

Jack

Very inaccurate depiction. For me it felt like counting down to the end of the world. Or launching a nuclear bomb that was going to land on me. Do I dare say that I almost cried when I saw Passport going away? ;)

When the box boots, watch the L-# countdown. L-13, L-12, L-11, L-10, L-9, L-8, L-7, L-6, L-5, L-4, L-3, L-2, L-1...
http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2005/04/20/mushroom_cloud_wideweb__430x269.jpg

Bye bye working DVR!!!

Does anyone here have a Samsung box with 3.1.1_3?

Everybody with Samsungs EXCEPT Charlotte and NYC have 3.1.1_3, and it apparently does address several of the bugs... worst of which is the "Channel Not Available" missed recordings that have been reported nowhere other than Charlotte and NYC.

I think woody's division will get it first though .....just a gut feeling.Central NY time warner division i'm surprised there field installers have van's and not horse and buggy!:)

I would try to get a SA box. Avoid the Samsung like the plague. 3.1.0_11 is an older version, compared to my 3.1.1_3. I'm not sure if that runs better on the Samsung boxes, but I'd assume the newer ODN version fixes bugs on the SA boxes, as the Samsungs are new.

Does anyone here have a Samsung box with 3.1.1_3?

I have a Samsung SMT-H3260 non DVR running ODN v3.1.1_3 in San Diego.

Just for the record, this was a Samusng box, I assume? Or an SA-8300 HDC? When did the problems first start? Maybe you got a defective box from the start?

Jack

My 8300HDC gets the grey screen issue.

I would try to get a SA box. Avoid the Samsung like the plague. 3.1.0_11 is an older version, compared to my 3.1.1_3. I'm not sure if that runs better on the Samsung boxes, but I'd assume the newer ODN version fixes bugs on the SA boxes, as the Samsungs are new.

Does anyone here have a Samsung box with 3.1.1_3?

No my 3090 has 3.1.0.11. I have no problems with it :cool:It works well For my 3090 Samsung box I see no bugs so far:) I have this box for about 1 Month now i got it at 23st in New york city when they first got them.All i can say its working great.:cool:I hope it stays like that.:)

http://itvt.com/story/5126/time-warner-cable-samsung-agreement-tru2way-set-top-development-purchase-and-deployment

An article related to TWC, tru2way, and Samsung boxes. TWC might start trials of new tru2way TV's. TWC will also be deploying the Samsung 3090 and the Samsung 3270 DVR boxes which both have their problems. The 3270 has some issues that need to be fixed but TWC San Diego TWC wants to make sure that it works and not deploy buggy equipment that aggrivates the customer. However the 3260 works fine and it uses the same software as the 3270 but it's got some bugs.

Hopefully , this means good things based on the article....TRU2WAY is awesome
now if we can get our hands on the moxi guide... to me that significantly blows navigator away.:)

http://itvt.com/story/5126/time-warner-cable-samsung-agreement-tru2way-set-top-development-purchase-and-deployment

An article related to TWC, tru2way, and Samsung boxes. TWC might start trials of new tru2way TV's. TWC will also be deploying the Samsung 3090 and the Samsung 3270 DVR boxes which both have their problems. The 3270 has some issues that need to be fixed but TWC San Diego TWC wants to make sure that it works and not deploy buggy equipment that aggrivates the customer. However the 3260 works fine and it uses the same software as the 3270 but it's got some bugs.

Actually, the really significant thing is that that all the top MSOs signed a memo of understanding last year saying tru2way would be deployed system-wide by 7/1/2009.

Oooops... uh, it is not.

AND have any CE companies announced ANY third party tru2way compatible equipment that can be bought directly by end users? I think given how the MSOs treated cable cards, nobody is willing to expend a ton of money only to have angry customers pissed at the CE guys when it's pretty much a given the issue is the MSOs.

my 8300hd decided it wont boot anymore, it wont go past box #4 out of the 6 boxes at the initializing screen. Im using time warner cable west valley, ca. any tips?

If you have eSATA drive connected, disconnect it and then reboot SA8300HD.

Hopefully , this means good things based on the article....TRU2WAY is awesome
now if we can get our hands on the moxi guide... to me that significantly blows navigator away.:)

Unless I wrong, I don't think there's a requirement to supply a different IPG... my impression is that tru2way pointed to equipment you can buy that doesn't belong to the MSO AND works with the software the MSO deploys for it's IPG.

Even so, I'd anticipate the MSO will drop the rental fee out, BUT add in a fee to "supply the IPG" or something like that.

I think they'll use some BS fee to cover the difference.

HDTV do you have any pics of your program guide i noticed you have version 3.1.1_3 on all your boxes....was hoping to notice the differences between 3.1.0_11 & 3.1.1_3. which would work better on SA 8300HDC ????

I think woody's division will get it first though .....just a gut feeling.Central NY time warner division i'm surprised there field installers have van's and not horse and buggy!:)

Never count my Division as a first. If it can go wrong they will jump on that bandwagon. WOODY

I have gone to the local offices here no one knows anything on it's impending launch ...Although just this past week in rome ny a csr at the office told my wife that the techs usually hold monthly meetings ... but as of late they have now become weekly.... i think that's a great sign .

HDTV do you have any pics of your program guide i noticed you have version 3.1.1_3 on all your boxes....was hoping to notice the differences between 3.1.0_11 & 3.1.1_3. which would work better on SA 8300HDC ????

Here are some pictures of 3.1.0_7. All of the guide/UI screens look identical to my 3.1.1_3. The version difference must be an internal software thing. Most likely a bug fix.

If you have a SA 8300HDC either version of ODN 3 should work fine. Beats the pants off of ODN 2. ;)


Like user ttweed mentioned in the thread above, Time Warner San Diego got a new version of Navigator last night for ODN boxes. Here is what I found on my SA8300HDC with the new version in Time Warner Desert Cities.

The version is listed as 3.1.0_7 dated 10/27/2008.

I poked around and found some new features, plus took some screenshots for you. Here goes.


http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/7079/diagverwe6.jpg

This is a shot of the diagnostic page showing the version number.


http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/9743/guidesamplewr0.jpg

Here is a shot of the new colors in the guide.


http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/2181/nearesttunejs9.jpg

Here is a shot of what I believe is a new feature called "Nearest Tune." If enabled, this feature selects the next highest channel if a nonexistent channel is entered from the remote. I don't recall seeing this feature before.


http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/3247/seriespriorityud9.jpg

Saving the best for last, ODN now has the ability to prioritize series recordings!

I don't see any other changes. The speed seems better to me also.

thanks nick for those i appreciate it!:)

Ok I know this is may not be the place to post (I hope it is) but...

I am switching from DishNetwork to TWC as I am really frustrated with Dish's service thus far and have had a tech out to my house 4 times for a "bad switch" which causes me to NEVER be able to watch tv on my 2nd receiver and only intermittently on my main DVR ViP 612. So...TWC said they would buy out my contract and set me up....great guys I know, However...

I had TWC before Dish and the reason I wanted to try Dish was because the Scientific Atlanta series DVR I had was the slowest, most terrible interface I have ever had to deal with, I dont know what software it had, but it looked used and it made me cry inside to try and use it.

I told the gent. that came to my house to sign me up for service that I wanted a good DVR and he advised that he would send the installation guys with a couple DVR's to try out and see if they are to my liking. That being said, what do you guys recommend?

What should I look for? How can I not get boned with a crap-tastic DVR again, I liked their service just couldnt stand the OS.

Thanks again, I hope this wasnt in the wrong spot, and if it was feel free to KINDLY point me in the right direction.

http://itvt.com/story/5126/time-warner-cable-samsung-agreement-tru2way-set-top-development-purchase-and-deployment

An article related to TWC, tru2way, and Samsung boxes. TWC might start trials of new tru2way TV's.

Do you remember those OCAP TVs that Samsung/TWC revealed in 2006? Or that Samsung announced the Tru2Way STB agreement with TWC in May 2008?

Not many do, and there's a reason for that.

As far as timeframes are concerned, the laws of physics fall apart when related to TWC development. Time moves slower for them than in the rest of the universe, and what seems like an imminent sign of progress could be just something else that will take years to make a dent anywhere.

As far as timeframes are concerned, the laws of physics fall apart when related to TWC development. Time moves slower for them than in the rest of the universe, and what seems like an imminent sign of progress could be just something else that will take years to make a dent anywhere.Third party OCAP equipment roll-out is not strictly dependent on TWC development. As I recall, Panasonic rolled out some retail OCAP stuff in a couple of test markets with Comcast systems set up for it (with who knows what IPG).

It might not make any sense to sell the equipment until local cable systems area ready to support it (chicken, egg, first?)--that's got to be significant part of the hold-up. Of course, the OEMs could assume that OCAP is coming, and start rolling out the retail equipment, but it would be difficult to use the expensive feature as attraction in their marketing, when people won't be able to take the equipment home and immediately use it.

If ODN works on those Samsung boxes that TWC is buying, it should work on Samsung retail products with the same OCAP firmware. But how will TWC enable download of their IPG into subscriber-owned OCAP equipment, and how much will they charge for it? As I see it, those are the TWC development issues that might be pending.

I'm all done with the new box and the new Navigator. Latest issues I've had are:

- Breaking up of recordings. On more than one occasion, I'll tape a 1 or 2 hour show with no competing recordings and find out that the recording has been separated into 2-5 different chunks. Sometimes it splits evenly at the hour mark, sometimes it splits at completely random spots, leaving pieces as little as 4 minutes long. My older 8300HD Passport box is set to record the same shows and has no trouble whatsoever.

- Screen goes gray. Guessing this has to do with the output resolution since the box was most recently hooked up to a 2004 vintage EDTV. Tried setting the box to 480i, 480p, and 108oi first, and then just to 1080i. No dice. Sometimes the screen would just blank out with sound still coming through. My attached Slingbox would be the only way to see the picture. Again, the 8300HD was connected to that TV for 4 years without once showing the same problem.

- Random repeat recordings. I have Daily Show and Colbert set to tape new episodes only. Every once in while, it goes on to tape the repeat episodes that air throughout the next day (sometimes 4 identical episodes in a day). Ironically, I actually think this is a new "feature" gone awry. I think the box is supposed to tape the next airing if there's a recording conflict but this can't be how it's supposed to work. Probably doesn't need to be said but the 8300HD handles the same recording schedule with no problems.

- Occasional freezing up. Screen sometimes glitches when the guide or menu goes up and leaves the TV picture in the top right of the screen. The other 3/4s of the screen stays black. Channel up and down works fine but no other buttons. Just standard bug fare, I guess.

I'm always curious if anyone else is either seeing this problems but in 6 days, I'm pulling the rip cord. Just ordered FiOS to be installed next weekend. If there have been any fixes or workarounds anyone wants me to test out before then, give a shout.

I have the same problem with sometimes getting split recordings for no reason. It used to be that would happen during a reboot and I would miss several minutes of shows but now it just splits it without losing any minutes, weird.
I used to have the problem of the shows recording multiple times and I even had to go in and check all recordings for the week to come and delete all the ones I didn't need and low and behold the next day they would be back again for deletion again which I figured was due to the box rebooting or something. The good news is that since the newest upgrade to 3.1.1_3 on my 8300HDC I don't really have that problem with the recordings coming back anymore and the guide is about 5 times faster when doing things like deleting un-needed recordings which is great since with 3.1.1_11 and before it could take me about 60 seconds to cancel just one recording and I usually had at least 20 to do each time. I'd say Navigator is getting better now I just wish I could get a 320gb DVR :(

Yea maybe our divisions are in one of the same.You never know . I am in the same division as ben so you know what were up against here in central ny! Hopefully they pick up there act in your division as well. Fingers crossed ! Last night i was talking to a technical support telemarketer and she told me that the receivers that are testing right now have 320 gb hard drives. Wondering what model that would be ? Personally she had seen navigator herself and said there were some things she liked about navigator and some things she liked about sara better . Me i would like to form my own opinion because to me sara's day's are numbered !

I would say either the Samsung SMT-H3270 or the SMT-H3090. More likely hte 3090 though the 3270 could debut in CNY. San Diego is testing the heck out of it and making sure it's stable. I have a 3260 HD-STB in my posession. The 3270 has a 320 GB HDD and is newer than the 3090.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/14086328@N00/sets/72157620982937663/

Pics of the Samsung SMT-H3260. I find it pretty stable but it has it's issues.

Was wondering if woody got his navigator flyer yet ? Let us know woody.

I am getting mixed reports on the new Samsungs,

What is the general consensus of the forum? If your box goes out, do you try to get a Samsung or knowing that some of the divisions that have them have some bugs, do you go with the SA-8300HDC?

What we should do is ask the following:

What divisions have had the best and worst success with the Samsung? Is it true that the general consensus is that the Samsung 3070 DVR is better than the Samsung 3090 because the 3090 is still buggy? What's the difference between these models?

I think that in about six months, the Samsung will be the way to go. But right now, if I had a division with a good track record with the Samsung, I would probably ask for that box. But than again, some divisions are actually reporting better performance with the SA-8300HDC because of Samsung's bugs. I think the Samsung DVR's are out in Milwaukee, but I have not contacted TWC about their performance, or a need for a new box as my old SA-8300HD (MDN) works just fine.

Oh is it true that the Samsung 3070 DVR has 160GB/RAM and the 3090 has 360GB/RAM? If not, what determines the amount of memory in these new boxes?

Jack

I am getting mixed reports on the new Samsungs,

What is the general consensus of the forum? If your box goes out, do you try to get a Samsung or knowing that some of the divisions that have them have some bugs, do you go with the SA-8300HDC?

What we should do is ask the following:

What divisions have had the best and worst success with the Samsung? Is it true that the general consensus is that the Samsung 3070 DVR is better than the Samsung 3090 because the 3090 is still buggy? What's the difference between these models?

I think that in about six months, the Samsung will be the way to go. But right now, if I had a division with a good track record with the Samsung, I would probably ask for that box. But than again, some divisions are actually reporting better performance with the SA-8300HDC because of Samsung's bugs. I think the Samsung DVR's are out in Milwaukee, but I have not contacted TWC about their performance, or a need for a new box as my old SA-8300HD (MDN) works just fine.

Oh is it true that the Samsung 3070 DVR has 160GB/RAM and the 3090 has 360GB/RAM? If not, what determines the amount of memory in these new boxes?

Jack

What version of ODN are they running in your system? It really does appears that the bulk of 3090 issues are limited to Charlotte and NYC, which are running 3.1.0_11. Reports of issues from systems running 3.1.1_3 are extremely sparse.

I also believe that the 3270 has not yet been deployed in customer homes anywhere yet. It is likely that you will not have a choice between the 3090 and 3270.

The 3090 has the 160 GB HDD while the 3270 has the 320 GB HDD. There are a few 3090's that have been deployed that have the 320 GB HDD. My Samsung 3260 HD-STB is doing pretty well but there are some bugs but mostly in the VOD app. Some of the bugs are actually ODN bugs. I'm having good success with a box that's not even out yet. The 3260 is a good box but the 3270 is a different story. The 3260 uses similar components yet the 3270 is having problems. The 32xx boxes are newer than the 30xx boxes and they have similar characteristics as the 30xx ones.

TWC San Diego is running 3.1.1_3 which is why my Samsung 3260 runs so well. TWC San Diego will deploy a new ODN version some time soon.

What version of ODN are they running in your system? It really does appears that the bulk of 3090 issues are limited to Charlotte and NYC, which are running 3.1.0_11. Reports of issues from systems running 3.1.1_3 are extremely sparse.

I also believe that the 3270 has not yet been deployed in customer homes anywhere yet. It is likely that you will not have a choice between the 3090 and 3270.

I think at last check the ODN's are up to 3.1.1_3, or whatever the latest version is.

Jack

On another forum a TWC NYC subscriber got a Navigator flyer and he has a 3250HD. So it looks like NYC will be getting MDN eventually.

The 3090 has the 160 GB HDD while the 3270 has the 320 GB HDD. There are a few 3090's that have been deployed that have the 320 GB HDD. My Samsung 3260 HD-STB is doing pretty well but there are some bugs but mostly in the VOD app. Some of the bugs are actually ODN bugs. I'm having good success with a box that's not even out yet. The 3260 is a good box but the 3270 is a different story. The 3260 uses similar components yet the 3270 is having problems. The 32xx boxes are newer than the 30xx boxes and they have similar characteristics as the 30xx ones.

HDTV Fan,

Just curious, how did you manage to get a box that isn't out yet? Do you work for TWC, or volunteer to be a Beta tester or something? Sounds good!

Jack

HDTV Fan,

Just curious, how did you manage to get a box that isn't out yet? Do you work for TWC, or volunteer to be a Beta tester or something? Sounds good!

Jack

Thats my secret :).

Was wondering if woody got his navigator flyer yet ? Let us know woody.

Not yet but I undertand they were starting the mailing on Tuesday according to my local TWC office. Will post when I get it. WOODY

Not yet but I understand they were starting the mailing on Tuesday according to my local TWC office. Will post when I get it. WOODY

I wonder if they will start next week for NYC and what boxes will get it first? When the poster said above they found it it was going to be done by division and box type, that's how they did it for us as well. And like I said, we got a flier about Navigator coming about three days after it had already been put on our box! LOL!

That is cool that you guys are getting info from the CSR's and techs about the roll-out. It sounds like it could be any day now!

Jack

http://www.cablerant.com/index.php?topic=1581.0

Another post on the Samsung cable boxes.

Maybe it wouldn't hurt to call my local TWC office and ask them if they know when the roll-out will begin.

This is a bad sign for us as far as us getting navigator anytime soon the division added a couple of worthless hd channels... very bad sign ....i have been told adding hd comes first over navigator from different people on here and other sites...add some worthwhile hd channels(added TCM HD & HLN HD) i will be glad to hold out a little longer for navigator but this is ridiculous ! Like i have said they have been toying with the boxes in some degree about every wednesday !

Oh is it true that the Samsung 3070 DVR has 160GB/RAM and the 3090 has 360GB/RAM? If not, what determines the amount of memory in these new boxes?

Jack

Jack, judging by what is said on the Samsung site, I believe the 320G drive is kind of the standard, along with the fact that it can come with whatever the MSO wants. Again, judging by what I read on AVS, it appears the very first boxes deployed had 320G drives. It seems that after a few 320G drive Sammies got out, the rest have all been equipped with 160G drives.

I'd bet that 160 is going to be it. This is a decision (i.e. to go with a 160G drive) that they SHOULD know has serious implications... in that if they decide to go with the 320s at some point, there could be a lot of folks who want to switch. I doubt they'd want to go that way... then again this IS TWC we're talking about.

What I'm MOST curious about is a swap of the internal drive for a larger one. One issue there is it may be that one can do that in some divisions, but not in others.

BTW, I recall the model number of the "other" DVR is 3270. One poster says that will be the model deployed in San Diego... yet I have not heard anything specific about ANY differences between the 3090 and the 3270.

HDTV Fan,

Just curious, how did you manage to get a box that isn't out yet? Do you work for TWC, or volunteer to be a Beta tester or something? Sounds good!

Jack

The 3260 is not a DVR. Those have been in deployment for a while now I remember seeing one at my aunt's a good 6 months ago. It had a nasty bug (anything that triggered a banner would KEEP the banner on screen unless one hit 2 buttons on the remote... she complained and they swapped it for a SA non DVR box).

I wonder if they will start next week for NYC and what boxes will get it first? When the poster said above they found it it was going to be done by division and box type, that's how they did it for us as well. And like I said, we got a flier about Navigator coming about three days after it had already been put on our box! LOL!

That is cool that you guys are getting info from the CSR's and techs about the roll-out. It sounds like it could be any day now!

Jack

I'm on pins & needles at this point. I got a fairly vague flyer in last months bill, but the current one says nothing about any transition. I DO note some divisions seem to get mailed notices outside of a pack-in with the monthly bill.

The next six months should have a big confluence of things... my 8300HD getting MDNed, liking with that before deciding whether I want to swap it for a 3090, or wait for the 3270. AND it looks like FiOS may actually happen in my nabe this fall.

Wow riverside!!! ... i love the boat you are in ...love your options!!!!:cool:

The 3260 hasn't been deployed afaik. Brooklyn is going to be the first borough of NYC to get Navigator. Brooklyn users should be seeing it pretty quickly.

The 3260 hasn't been deployed afaik. Brooklyn is going to be the first borough of NYC to get Navigator. Brooklyn users should be seeing it pretty quickly.

Ah, so it IS going to go by head ends... I kept hearing it was by the box model (as in Passport non-DVRs followed by Passport DVRs...). Surprised it isn't starting in SI, they typically are always the first to get in this market.

Jack, judging by what is said on the Samsung site, I believe the 320G drive is kind of the standard, along with the fact that it can come with whatever the MSO wants. Again, judging by what I read on AVS, it appears the very first boxes deployed had 320G drives. It seems that after a few 320G drive Sammies got out, the rest have all been equipped with 160G drives.

I'd bet that 160 is going to be it. This is a decision (i.e. to go with a 160G drive) that they SHOULD know has serious implications... in that if they decide to go with the 320s at some point, there could be a lot of folks who want to switch. I doubt they'd want to go that way... then again this IS TWC we're talking about.

What I'm MOST curious about is a swap of the internal drive for a larger one. One issue there is it may be that one can do that in some divisions, but not in others.

BTW, I recall the model number of the "other" DVR is 3270. One poster says that will be the model deployed in San Diego... yet I have not heard anything specific about ANY differences between the 3090 and the 3270.

The 3090 doesn't behave well if you swap the internal HDD to a new one. It just doesn't work with something that's over its internal size. I have posted pics of my 3260 and it's black. It doesn't look like the 3050. The 3270 is black, a little bit lighter, matches all Samsung products, and has a 320 GB HDD.

Queens has finally replaced Passport with MDN on the 3250HD's. The DVR's and other boxes will be replaced later.

Hi All,

I am helping someone out on another thread with their signal issues. Can someone please tell me how to get to the diag page reporting the SNR on both the HD and HDC with Navigator?

Thanks,
xnappo

http://www.cablerant.com/index.php?topic=1581.0



and this looks like tivo is getting into bed with insignia TV's.

Quote""The companies do say that Best Buy will finance an effort to bring TiVo’s software and search tools to other Best Buy products, like its Insignia HDTVs.''''

http://www.electronichouse.com/article/best_buy_uses_tivo_twitter_to_take_on_walmart/

This is a bad sign for us as far as us getting navigator anytime soon the division added a couple of worthless hd channels... very bad sign ....i have been told adding hd comes first over navigator from different people on here and other sites...add some worthwhile hd channels(added TCM HD & HLN HD) i will be glad to hold out a little longer for navigator but this is ridiculous ! Like i have said they have been toying with the boxes in some degree about every Wednesday !

Yea Abyss,

That does seem strange that your division would add new channels before Navigator's roll-out, if it were soon. I have been following about 5 New York people about the roll-out, I forget, what was it that you have received from your division, or that people have said? I know some offices have said nothing, some have given a two-four week notice after July 1st, and I can't remember what the third instance was. What HD stuff did you get? TCM is coming to several systems.

However, this waiting game b.s does SUCK! I mean what are they doing out in your area? Are they delaying Navigator for............THE KNITTING CHANNEL!!! ???LOL!

Jack

Charlotte, NC is beta testing a new MDN version. That version is 2.4.4-19. It has some bug fixes and maybe some new features. I suspect it's more like bug fixes.

Looks like TWC NYC is getting MDN version 2.4.4-16 (Pyramid Peak). That means they have the latest stable version even though there is a newer version just around the corner.

However, this waiting game b.s does SUCK! I mean what are they doing out in your area? Are they delaying Navigator for............THE KNITTING CHANNEL!!! ???LOL!

Jack

If it means delaying Navigator, I wouldn't mind getting the "Country Western Opera Singers Walking Barefoot Over Hot Coals" channel! :D:D:D:D

If it means delaying Navigator, I wouldn't mind getting the "Country Western Opera Singers Walking Barefoot Over Hot Coals" channel! :D:D:D:D


LMAO@ Nick!!!! Very funny post!!!!

Jack

Satch man , it's more like what time warner does not say is what bothers me .They have been testing since april... there should be some kind of assurance that it is indeed on it's way.Other then the article that i posted with our division head going public about samsung deployment and navigator . That has been about the only positive i have heard since it was posted on June 8th. I called today and a techie says still no date yet. My way of thinking is that it's done and ready awaiting it's closet deadline a so to speak surprise to the central ny division subs. But with the recent addition of hd content it really has me baffled.You know time warner they don't want to much on there collective plates. I check the mail everyday nothing for that god like flyer .....DISCOURAGING !!!

If it means delaying Navigator, I wouldn't mind getting the "Country Western Opera Singers Walking Barefoot Over Hot Coals" channel! :D:D:D:D
You forgot the "Blindfolded" and "Hands Tied Behind Their Backs" parts. :D

Was hopeing for something in the mail today about Navigator. To my dismay it was one of those days that I got no mail at all. THE WAITING GAME CONTINUES. WOODY

GRRR. Just got off the phone to my TWC Division. The CSR I spoke to was very nice and helpful but had bad news. Navigator was susposed to begin rolling out late Friday night. However a new version was sent down to them last night. It contained some new features and updates she said. ( could not find out what) However the new version caused some glitches and several employee boxs failed.The engineers I was told do not think it is anything major but have put off the launch a couple weeks to sort things out. Grrr got so close to have it pulled away. However when we get it I feel it will be the latest version talking to the CSR The reason I could not find out about any new featues was the CSR I was speaking to had one of the failed boxes a 8300hdc if that gives us a clue.. WOODY

Looks like TWC NYC is getting MDN version 2.4.4-16 (Pyramid Peak). That means they have the latest stable version even though there is a newer version just around the corner.

Any insight into HDC or Samsung eSATA support (from a software point of view, not customer service).

xnappo

GRRR. Just got off the phone to my TWC Division. The CSR I spoke to was very nice and helpful but had bad news. Navigator was supposed to begin rolling out late Friday night. However a new version was sent down to them last night. It contained some new features and updates she said. ( could not find out what) However the new version caused some glitches and several employee boxs failed.The engineers I was told do not think it is anything major but have put off the launch a couple weeks to sort things out. Grrr got so close to have it pulled away. However when we get it I feel it will be the latest version talking to the CSR The reason I could not find out about any new features was the CSR I was speaking to had one of the failed boxes a 8300hdc if that gives us a clue.. WOODY

Well, the good news is that you should have a really stable and good version when it comes out. I wonder if this is just for the Carolina's division, or if NYC will be doing the same thing? It sounds like NYC is getting the version that everyone has now for MDN. It appears that the Carolina's will be testing out the next higher version for two weeks and than (finally) roll it out.

Damn! They really have been doing a good job of testing. I think that is good! This is light-years better than when this product was rushed three years ago!

Jack

Greensboro might be testing the new MDN and ODN versions. I think San Diego will get the latest MDN version since they're still on v2.4.4-14. I still think they'll upgrade the ODN version since it fixes some crucial 3270 bugs.

Greensboro might be testing the new MDN and ODN versions. I think San Diego will get the latest MDN version since they're still on v2.4.4-14. I still think they'll upgrade the ODN version since it fixes some crucial 3270 bugs.

I wonder if Keyword Search is coming in this update! I'm not holding my breath. However, that would be cool! We in Milwaukee are on v.2.4.4-16 here. (MDN)

Jack

Well, the good news is that you should have a really stable and good version when it comes out. I wonder if this is just for the Carolina's division, or if NYC will be doing the same thing? It sounds like NYC is getting the version that everyone has now for MDN. It appears that the Carolina's will be testing out the next higher version for two weeks and than (finally) roll it out.

Damn! They really have been doing a good job of testing. I think that is good! This is light-years better than when this product was rushed three years ago!

Jack

Jack i'mcrossing my fingers no new bugs show up in the engineers testing to delay it any more. I guess after the Lincoln disaster Time Warner wants to be extra careful with their SARA subs which is their largest base. I'm willing to wait a bit longer if we get a very stable feature rich NAVIGATOR, WOODY

I wonder if Keyword Search is coming in this update! I'm not holding my breath. However, that would be cool! We in Milwaukee are on v.2.4.4-16 here. (MDN)

Jack

The new MDN version may not get keyword search for all I know. It might just catch up on ODN, fix the troublesome bugs, and call it a day.

The 3090 doesn't behave well if you swap the internal HDD to a new one. It just doesn't work with something that's over its internal size.

According to Samsung, the box can come with more than one size of internal drive, so there should be no barrier.

From a technology standpoint, they COULD do what Compaq used to do... have something in it's BIOS that only recognizes a drive that has some special boot block ID. THAT method created a HUGE outcry years ago and Compaq stopped the practice.

The other thing that might be more likely is that I have long thought swapping an internal drive may be disabled because TWC puts a unique driver on the disk that can NOT be downloaded as the box with a new drive was setting itself up. Something that the Canadian MOSes do NOT prevent as I've read numerous stories about Canadians swapping internal drives on the same kind of SA boxes most of us have. Yes one of two claim to have swapped a drive in the US, but I am very skeptical... I would be less so if I saw a post from someone I recognize over time as being a consistent AVS contributor...

...Time Warner wants to be extra careful with their SARA subs which is their largest base.

I'm very curious where one might find any breakdown of all TWC subs as to what number have each of the various software on their STBs.

I'm very curious where one might find any breakdown of all TWC subs as to what number have each of the various software on their STBs.

That would be good to know. AFAIK, for TWC this initial SARA to Navigator transition will be the first, so they have to make extra certain that bugs and compatibility issues are worked out.

Passport to Navigator they are used to doing by now, so I'll bet that Passport systems will be done BEFORE SARA.

Jack

Yea i by no means what a troublesome navigator ....i do think too they are trying there best to make a secure upgrade.... i guess i'll just have to be more patient. It's just when you see the same old thing day in day out you like a little spice every now an then .The csr i talked to yesterday said our division has quite a bit of things going on with the new samsungs,navigator, adding more hd channels all speculated to be done by the end of the summer and the rest before XMAS !!!! they will be very busy up until the end of fiscal 2009 ! If it were me in charge of our division i say focus on navigator .Then early next year focus on the samsung's and more hd here and there a little at a time.I think currently there having to many fish in a barrel and not enough fishermen.:rolleyes:

By CNY Television News Editor on June 8, 2009
Time Warner to Launch Navigator, Deploy new box

CENTRAL NEW YORK – In a recent email, Time Warner Cable regional spokesperson Jeff Unaitis, has told a tipster that Time Warner plans on launching Navigator (the new software for use on the cable boxes) within the coming year.

Navigator has been rolled around in markets across the country. The first rollouts were met with loads of complaints by customers. However, through approxametly 4 years of developement it has gotten to be a lot better.

Also, Time Warner plans on rolling out new Samsung set-top-boxes. This will be the first new cable box since 2004 with the rollout of the Explorer 8300 by Scientific Atlanta.

Unaitis went on to say that himself, along with other Time Warner employees are currently testing all the mentioned changes.


what do you guys read from this article sound like soon to you for both "navigator" and the "sammies" ?????

The other thing that might be more likely is that I have long thought swapping an internal drive may be disabled because TWC puts a unique driver on the disk that can NOT be downloaded as the box with a new drive was setting itself up.

Some of the raw copying software people are using in the eSATA thread to move data to a new drive may help there...

xnappo

jeez !!! xnappo you would think the size of austin and the state of texas you would have had navigator awhile ago.

I'm very curious where one might find any breakdown of all TWC subs as to what number have each of the various software on their STBs.

It was 25% Passport 75% SARA. This was in a Time Warner posting couple years ago. Now you see why they are being extra careful. Think about the stink the Passport people caused. Triple that if the SARA people are unhappy. WOODY

jeez !!! xnappo you would think the size of austin and the state of texas you would have had navigator awhile ago.

We are SARA.

BTW can someone please help with the diags question I asked about 12 posts ago? Want to help the guy out... Even if you can only answer 1/2 of it.

xnappo

Hi All,

I am helping someone out on another thread with their signal issues. Can someone please tell me how to get to the diag page reporting the SNR on both the HD and HDC with Navigator?

Thanks,
xnappo

To get to the diag on the 8300hd hold the select button on the remote till the envelope lites up on the box display and hit down arrow than you can page thru with right arrow

vol+ and info can access the SA diag menu which shows SnR on the HDC boxes.

Some of the raw copying software people are using in the eSATA thread to move data to a new drive may help there...

xnappo

Hmmm, I do understand bit copiers... I wonder if they can also transfer the format.... somehow I'm skeptical about that part.

Hmmm, I do understand bit copiers... I wonder if they can also transfer the format.... somehow I'm skeptical about that part.

How could it not? It it copies the bits, it copies the format.

xnappo

How could it not? It it copies the bits, it copies the format.

xnappo

Not sure that it may do blind bit copying of just the data, not the format. PLUS, in all cases this would be to move from a smaller to a larger drive. Maybe the bit copiers only deal with data, so they MAY not copy the "formatting" for areas where no data resides.

Then again, this is just my concern, I can't say for sure exactly how it does or doesn't work.

I'm not going to fool with it now as I'm about the get MDNed... I'll live with that for a while then decide if I want to swap for the Samsung 3090.

HDTV Fan,

Just curious, how did you manage to get a box that isn't out yet? Do you work for TWC, or volunteer to be a Beta tester or something? Sounds good!

Jack

What if I was not a TWC employee. I'm also planning on trying out the SMT-H3270 HD-DVR.

While I was browsing the San Diego TWC site I found a getting started guide for Passport. It's kind of interesting to see it and it looked pretty up to date. Aptiv is now using the Echo interface for regular Passport now.

What if I was not a TWC employee. I'm also planning on trying out the SMT-H3270 HD-DVR.

Very cool!

We should nominate HDTVfan as our official TWC Beta Tester! LOL! What you're doing is good--very good!

Jack

NYC customers who've gotten MDN'ed now get the HD VOD channels.

While I was browsing the San Diego TWC site I found a getting started guide for Passport. It's kind of interesting to see it and it looked pretty up to date. Aptiv is now using the Echo interface for regular Passport now.

Linkage?

Aptiv is actually keeping pretty on the ball. Though I dunno what cableco's are still using Passport (TWC is, but I think they stopped all updates now that Navigator is starting to gain more ground across the country.).

But they have shown they even have an OCAP release of Passport that has a 16:9 guide to boot and all ready to go for not only current OCAP equipment like the SA HDC boxes, but the Samsungs and future tru2way equipment.:
http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/7822/passporttru2waygrid.th.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/passporttru2waygrid.jpg/)
Those of you who have never had Passport before, ever, have certainly missed out.

(In other news, why can't TWC let us have nice things? :()

Very cool!

We should nominate HDTVfan as our official TWC Beta Tester! LOL! What you're doing is good--very good!

Jack

I wont beta test every single thing they'll deploy. It might not be for a while before I get a 3270. It's not up to their standards. I'm just trying it out to see if I can find a few bugs that aren't really noticeable. They might be noticeable for us but not the general population. They can however be troublesome.

Aptiv is actually keeping pretty on the ball. Though I dunno what cableco's are still using Passport (TWC is, but I think they stopped all updates now that Navigator is starting to gain more ground across the country.).

But they have shown they even have an OCAP release of Passport that has a 16:9 guide to boot and all ready to go for not only current OCAP equipment like the SA HDC boxes, but the Samsungs and future tru2way equipment.:
http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/7822/passporttru2waygrid.th.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/passporttru2waygrid.jpg/)
Those of you who have never had Passport before, ever, have certainly missed out.

(In other news, why can't TWC let us have nice things? :()

Is it bad that I don't like that? ;) I don't want, need, or like that new thing, I'd rather have the Passport we used to have back. That guide was already good enough the way it was. I really wish they would have options. Like a choice between Passport Classic: the IPG we knew and loved before Navigator and Passport New: that overcluttered monstrosity pictured above.

Is it bad that I don't like that? ;) I don't want, need, or like that new thing, I'd rather have the Passport we used to have back. That guide was already good enough the way it was. I really wish they would have options. Like a choice between Passport Classic: the IPG we knew and loved before Navigator and Passport New: that overcluttered monstrosity pictured above.

It kind of looks Tivoish, Yea it may look a little overwhelming, but I can't judge something that I will never be able to use. Original Passport was reliable, easy to use, and easy to understand. I could not find the new Passport IPG on San Diego's site, but I did see a video demo and Jpg images on-line. There is an option where you can click on Guide Views, so maybe one of those views takes you back to classic search screens. The IPG time grid. (not shown in the above image) looked great and it seemed to be in true 16:9 Aspect Ratio as well.

Jack

The passport guide was a PDF file.

MDN version question?

Hey Navigator researchers,

What was the last know version of Navigator in ANY division (i.e version number) that had that old all blue on blue GUI that so many people hated?

Than coinciding with that, does anyone know what was the first MDN version of Navigator to employ the new color scheme that we have today on all versions?

The reason that I am asking is because if we can compare these two numbers, it MIGHT, (who knows for sure?, just a guess) give MDN users a clue as to whether people running 2.4.4-11 to 2.4.4-16. whether the new MDN 2.4.4-19 will have bug fixes and new features or just bug fixes? (Wonder what happened to that last number in the build for 17 and 18?) If they were going to like an MDN 2.5, than I would expect something big with this update. If it was an MDN 3.0 it would be something HUGE. Going from a version where only the last number changes a few times, could be like maybe one thing changed, and a few bug fixes. But if it was a big change, don't you think the first or middle number at least would be different instead of just the end one?

In my Milwaukee Wisconsin area, 2.4.4-16 is very stable.

Jack

Is it bad that I don't like that? ;) I don't want, need, or like that new thing, I'd rather have the Passport we used to have back. That guide was already good enough the way it was. I really wish they would have options. Like a choice between Passport Classic: the IPG we knew and loved before Navigator and Passport New: that overcluttered monstrosity pictured above.

The thing you are forgetting is that this brand new guide is an OCAP guide which is capable of running on all these new boxes we are being forced into. SHOULD TWC ever give up on Navigator or, at the very least, offer up the option of different IPG's at varied subscription costs, we'd still be given the possibility of Passport with the new OCAP guide considering it is something they are familiar with.
And secondly, I doubt Aptiv would change things around THAT much. In fact the keyword/theme search system shown there in that screenshot it really no different than the one in the old Passport system, just more spread out since there is more screen real estate. I'm sure the natural channel by channel guide is the same and goes out like 2-3 hours rather than 1:30 with the extra room available.

LOL!

On a funny but unrelated matter, before this post HDTVFan and I had the same post count.........777! Shhhhh.... It's our secret Navigator updates code.........LOL!

Jack

By CNY Television News Editor on June 8, 2009
Time Warner to Launch Navigator, Deploy new box

CENTRAL NEW YORK – In a recent email, Time Warner Cable regional spokesperson Jeff Unaitis, has told a tipster that Time Warner plans on launching Navigator (the new software for use on the cable boxes) within the coming year.

Navigator has been rolled around in markets across the country. The first rollouts were met with loads of complaints by customers. However, through approxametly 4 years of developement it has gotten to be a lot better.

Also, Time Warner plans on rolling out new Samsung set-top-boxes. This will be the first new cable box since 2004 with the rollout of the Explorer 8300 by Scientific Atlanta.

Unaitis went on to say that himself, along with other Time Warner employees are currently testing all the mentioned changes.


what do you guys read from this article sound like soon to you for both "navigator" and the "sammies" ?????


I can confirm that new hardware and software is being tested by employees in our division. There is no word of any release date, but I don't mind the extensive testing to ensure a smooth transition. I have been very pleased with the 100+ HD channel additions. My only wish for whatever they drop on us is that it have eSATA support.

Where you been ben ? wow haven't see you on this thread in awhile....At least you have been keeping busy through this transition to navigator stage it's been nerve racking for me....wouldn't you say ben this is great news coming from Jeff Unaitis ? I know you have had great correspondence with him in the past, right ? I keep calling just to see how testing is going ....Have you found anything out ? you are better at getting info out of them then me.:) What version would we need for a smooth transition to esata support ?... (In other words what would be best for us cny subs with scientific atlanta boxes ?)

Actually I've been extremely busy with work, installs, and I've also joined up with Star Trek Phase II production team. I don't know what happened here, but I just stopped getting email updates from AVS and I just thought the servers were dead. I pooped in and had ALOT of catching up to do.

Yes, good news so far, but I still might go the Tivo route if they deliver a two way box. The other big news for us (as I posted in the Syracuse/Utica HDTV thread) is that Rome is talking with Verizon to bring FiOS to the area.

I am fully willing to give Nav a shot when we get it, but I'm seriously thinking a next gen Tivo is going to be my choice.

Rome getting fios is huge news for me the next good size town over heading north is Lowville ...you think they may approach lowville ? i think if this were to happen it might be like 60/40 fios even when time warner adds navigator ....i love the fios guide its awesome!:)

I don't want to hi-jack this thread. Take the FiOS discussion over to the Syracuse HDTV thread and we can pick it up there.

Yea, your right it is ways off base .....sorry everyone.

On topic: I look forward to trying Navigator and giving a full review here once we get it. That said, I don't blame TWC for the delay in order to rollout the massive HD lineup they did.

How long you think it will be ben with navigator in your opinion ? When deployed what version ? I'm thinking near the latest if not the latest because i have been told about it having keyword search.... just don't know if it's the last version ....not familiar with what has keyword search that csr's were refering to! :confused:

Well, this year means before Q1 of 2010. However, they said at one time they were deploying Q1 of 2008. Thing is, this time they are actually testing it, so I'm guessing the big thing is that they want it to be stable with SDV since virtually all our HD channels are switched.

The tech's i have been talking to have said great thing's about its stability... so hopefully soon ! So we are truly and fully SDV video now huh ? I had my doubt's :)

We've been SDV since the second wave of HD channels were deployed. SDV is the main reason we saw the massive rollout of channels. It has been working perfectly for me. My gripe about getting Nav will be if we lose eSATA support. I added a 1TB drive to my SA8300 and record strictly in HD for the most part. If I lose that capacity, it will make the DVR worthless to me.

Yea i can see if that's what you like where that might be a huge problem!:mad:

Personally, i don't think we will get a mailer talking about navigator ...i think we will get up and there it is....What do you think ben ? If we do it will be like satch man's navigator pack ...after the fact !

Personally, i don't think we will get a mailer talking about navigator ...i think we will get up and there it is....What do you think ben ? If we do it will be like satch man's navigator pack ...after the fact !

I got the Navigator mailer, some time back. TWC NY (Poughkeepsie). However, nothing much changed until my 8300HD self-destructed (said it had a bad hard disk). Now, with the replacement 8300HDC, I see ODN Version 3.1.1_sp1 2009/03/10 13:51, which I reckon is somewhat current. So at least in Poughkeepsie, they hadn't pushed it. Judging from the new box, I can kind of see why. Mostly works, but clunky, and so far at least, I cannot get the external hard disk to work.

I went through the TWC web site, SA 8300HDC, and it said on playback to fast foward 15 minutes, press and hold the ff button for two seconds. When I do that, it seems to do it to 10 minute intervals, not 15. The old unit did the 15 minute boundary thing with the right or left arrow around the sel button, which worked much better. Anyone work out if there's a way to do that with Navigator?

Are you going for the Sammies in Poughkeepsie if or when there available or are they already available ?

Older pre-SA 8300HDC unit, I was able to select a program, and if it had started already, get a menu to search for it, to find a later play time/date. Is there a way of doing that on an 8300HDC (ODN 3.1.1_sp1), other than a manual search having to retype the program name?

Recieved a prerecorded call yesterday that TWC Desert Cities will have an update on Mon. nite/Tues. morning and service might not be avalible during update.

Older pre-SA 8300HDC unit, I was able to select a program, and if it had started already, get a menu to search for it, to find a later play time/date. Is there a way of doing that on an 8300HDC (ODN 3.1.1_sp1), other than a manual search having to retype the program name?

Nope.

MDN version question?

Hey Navigator researchers,

What was the last know version of Navigator in ANY division (i.e version number) that had that old all blue on blue GUI that so many people hated?

Than coinciding with that, does anyone know what was the first MDN version of Navigator to employ the new color scheme that we have today on all versions?

The reason that I am asking is because if we can compare these two numbers, it MIGHT, (who knows for sure?, just a guess) give MDN users a clue as to whether people running 2.4.4-11 to 2.4.4-16. whether the new MDN 2.4.4-19 will have bug fixes and new features or just bug fixes? (Wonder what happened to that last number in the build for 17 and 18?) If they were going to like an MDN 2.5, than I would expect something big with this update. If it was an MDN 3.0 it would be something HUGE. Going from a version where only the last number changes a few times, could be like maybe one thing changed, and a few bug fixes. But if it was a big change, don't you think the first or middle number at least would be different instead of just the end one?

In my Milwaukee Wisconsin area, 2.4.4-16 is very stable.

Jack

2.4.4-17 and 18 are probably engineering prototypes or twc likes to skip around. I've also heard that 2.4.4-19 is a beta/test market version which means 20 and 21 would be the stable versions. I do know that 2.4.4-19 fixes a few good MDN bugs. I think 2.4.4-14 introduced the new colors while 2.4.4-1 might have been the original one. I'm not sure which version introduced it but 14 is the one that San Diego deployed which had the new colors. Interestingly enough, we're still on that version. I think San Diego didn't think the newer versions were good enough for them so they might be testing 2.4.4-19. I don't know if they are but it seems good enough. I no longer have my 3250HD so I don't know. I think MDN 2.4.4-19 could have keyword search and it would catch up with ODN when it comes to features like nearest tune, and enhanced program tags to name a few.

BTW,

TWC NYC is using MDN 2.4.4-16 which is the latest stable version.

Hope this helps.

Recieved a prerecorded call yesterday that TWC Desert Cities will have an update on Mon. nite/Tues. morning and service might not be avalible during update.

It looks like the new MDN version is going to be deployed. Our division operates your division and they never notify us over the phone on new updates.

It looks like the new MDN version is going to be deployed. Our division operates your division and they never notify us over the phone on new updates.

Not that this means anything for my division, but what I remember is that when San Diego got the new version of Navigator with the different color scheme, we got it about two months later. I am not sure, but I think that TWC San Diego, TWC North/South Carolina and TWC Hawaii (a.k.a Oceananic) are often test version areas and the first cities to get updates. What's interesting is that three years ago, our city, Milwaukee, Wisconsin was cursed with those first releases of Navigator just like Lincoln Nebraska was....UGGHHH! I could be wrong, but I don't think Milwaukee Wisconsin or Lincoln Nebraska are official test cites, (after what we went through with Navigator three years ago, why would we want to be again?!) When I got MDN in Mid April 2008, it worked great and I have had no major problems since.

I think this progressive but cautious roll-out is good for everyone. These later MDN downloads seem to indicate that TWC finally got it right. Actually, on that MDN version that we have now, (2.4.4-16) I can't recall having any issues. About a year ago, there would be that partial recording bug where the DVR would sometimes stop recording like 10 minutes into something on certain SDV channels. (I recall that Food Network was one, and I'm not sure, but I think TV Land might have been the other.) But that bug has long since been fixed for our division.

Jack

Kansas City, MO was the first to get ODN v2.4.10_11. San Diego got it a month or two later. So MDN v2.4.4-19 could be a test market version. Charlotte, NC is testing it right now and I think San Diego might have wrapped up testing it and is ready to be deployed. I can't see them deploying MDN v2.4.4-16 right now.

I've had ODN since 2007 on a SA 4250HDC. I think it's gotten much better since then. Now I have a fairly stable SMT-H3260 running ODN v3.1.1_3 and it seems to be doing just fine but there might be some hidden bug that's very troublesome.

I've had ODN since 2007 on a SA 4250HDC. I think it's gotten much better since then. Now I have a fairly stable SMT-H3260 running ODN v3.1.1_3 and it seems to be doing just fine but there might be some hidden bug that's very troublesome.

What are some of the main bugs that still exist with the Samsung ODN Navigator boxes? I heard that there are like 2-3 main things.

Jack

I haven't really found any. The VOD takes about 2 times to start it. The VOD app will sometimes go back to where you've started when browsing it. Other than that there isn't any bugs that I've found. I'm sure TWC San Diego knows about them more than I do.

Edit: This is only a 3260 which seems to be better than the 30xx boxes. The 3270 on the other hand is got some issues. The 3090 bugs are well documented here but those bugs could be eliminated with a new ODN version. The 3260 and 3270 use the same software and mobo though the 3260 lacks eSATA. The 3260 does have a SATA port on the mobo. I don't think you can turn the 3260 into a DVR though.

Last versions of Navigator with the blue colors are MDN v2.4.1-108 and ODN v2.4.10_11.

My SNR on the downstream via the diag channel is 39 dbmv and -3. That seems to be why my 3260 is fast. Maybe it's because the 3260 is a much better box than the current boxes.

The SoCal Passport areas are likely going to get Navigator pretty soon on all the boxes including those cranky, old, pioneers. A TWC employee on another forum said that it could be done starting this week.

Nope.

Bummer, kind of hate losing that function.

Is there an errata list or something that lists off the new functions in ODN 3.1.1 variants? Mine seems to show 3.1.1_sp1 (NYC/Poughkeepsie), but I see there are others at 3.1.1_3, etc.

And I'm also kind of wondering what to do about external hard disk not working on the 8300HDC, as looking at:

http://www.baseportal.com/baseportal/xnappo/navigator

I don't see any successful 3.1.1_sp1 variants. If TWC ends up pushing ODN at later levels, does it push 3.1 something, or 2.4 something (2.4 looking from the database as much more likely to work with external hard drives, as I used a spare hard drive to reproduce exactly a working 2.4 config, and on my 3.1.1_sp1 variant, it did not work). Granted, I would guess the bug is in the format part, it may be if your external hard drive is already formatted, it will be fine, but if it's not that, and they push 3.1 something, could break a lot of users.

My gripe about getting Nav will be if we lose eSATA support. I added a 1TB drive to my SA8300 and record strictly in HD for the most part. If I lose that capacity, it will make the DVR worthless to me.

I'm in the same boat.
What's the likelihood of it being disabled for those of us currently on SARA with 8300HD boxes?

Thanks

I'm in the same boat.
What's the likelihood of it being disabled for those of us currently on SARA with 8300HD boxes?

Thanks

So FAR only the HDC boxes have been broken (off and on, depending on the release).

My opinion is that they are NOT doing it on purpose.

There is a possibility they will break it - we will just have to wait and see.

xnappo

I have a feeling that the next MDN version will break eSATA.

The SoCal Passport areas are likely going to get Navigator pretty soon on all the boxes including those cranky, old, pioneers. A TWC employee on another forum said that it could be done starting this week.

And the thing that sucks is TWC does not tell you above the low memory in those older boxes. People have to come to forums like these instead of TWC doing a truck roll to swap out those old Pioneer boxes and any SA models below 3000 because of box memory limitations. Everyone should tell family and friends who don't come to these forums that these old boxes do not have enough memory to run Navigator well at all. TWC did do an upgrade to these old boxes to supposedly make them run better. However, the performance on boxes this old is night and day compared to the newer boxes. Users should have any of the first five boxes listed below with proper wiring and good signal strength for quality Navigator performance:

NEWER MODEL BOXES THAT RUN NAVIGATOR WELL

SA-8300 HD. (DVR)
SA-8300 (DVR)
SA-8300 HDC (DVR)
All SA 4000 boxes (Non-DVR)
All New Samsung Boxes (DVR and non-DVR)

BOXES THAT DO NOT RUN NAVIGATOR WELL

Any Pioneer boxes
Any SA box below model 3000
The old SA-8000 SD (DVR) or the SA-8000HD (DVR)

Users, if you are still running the old Pioneer or any SA boxes below version 3000, or the SA-8000, feel free to post if you have noticed any improvement when the Navigator change over happens. If the boxes are still OK after the conversion, you can probably keep them. But based on overall AVS forum users, the boxes I recommended above seem to do the best job with Navigator.


Jack

The 3250HD can be added to the good boxes that run Navigator well.

I should check out the SA compatible Pace boxes. Those seem to be fine.

The Pace box model numbers are DC-510 (SD) and DC-550HD.

The Pace box model numbers are DC-510 (SD) and DC-550HD.

Thanks! I forgot about the Pace boxes. And the Pace's work good with Navigator? It will be interesting to see for any Pioneer boxes that are still out there, if they do run better, as well as the SA 1000-2000 boxes? AFAIK, all of my Milwaukee Wisconsin division is now SA and Samsung.

Jack

I have a feeling that the next MDN version will break eSATA.

It is a 'catch up with ODN' release, so definitely a risk.

xnappo

Thanks! I forgot about the Pace boxes. And the Pace's work good with Navigator? It will be interesting to see for any Pioneer boxes that are still out there, if they do run better, as well as the SA 1000-2000 boxes? AFAIK, all of my Milwaukee Wisconsin division is now SA and Samsung.

Jack

The DC-550 have a 260 DMIPS CPU and 64 MB of total Memory. 32 MB is allocated for system ram. They are are definitely above a SA 3000 in performance. The SA 3250HD has a better CPU though.

Mind you when comparing boxes to keep in mind that the only boxes running ODN currently are the HDC moniker SA boxes and the new Samsungs. The rest are MDN. ODN requires substantially more ram than MDN to run as it is all Java based rather than being specifically built for that particular hardware like MDN.

The SoCal Passport areas are likely going to get Navigator pretty soon on all the boxes including those cranky, old, pioneers. A TWC employee on another forum said that it could be done starting this week. The SoCal (not San Diego) got started a while back. I got Navigator on non-DVR SA-3250 about 3 weeks ago (works fine). The 8300HD has not been changed yet. /Dan

I think they'll do the DVR's soon.

Enjoy the little time you have left with you modern, functioning DVR. Soon the Navigator fairies will come and take it away. :D

Bummer, kind of hate losing that function.


Yep, it's one of the reasons I don't use the search function.

The same reason I don't use BD-Live either. Onscreen keyboards controlled by remote suck on any platform.

Let us know if the update happens if you've gotten the latest MDN version.

It is a 'catch up with ODN' release, so definitely a risk.

xnappo

Ha, making the breaking of eSATA support a feature, not a bug<g>!

I'm in NYC and was upgraded to Navigator on my 8300HD at 10AM this morning. I just happened to be home for a prior appt. and watched the whole process; it took approx 30 minutes.

All of my program settings were retained. I have an eSATA hookup with a 750GB hardrive, and all of my recorded programs were reformatted and retained. Good news is that I can finally rewind and ff live television with my eSATA drive. I also finally have a progress bar indicating remaining hard drive recording space. The Start Over enhanced TV feature is limited to only a few channels, CNN, Food Network etc., and has limited functionality, no pause, FF, or REW. Probably one feature that will be seldom used.

I will read more of this thread before commenting any further, but so far there are a few things I really like and several I don't. The picture is slightly better and less granulated, but channel changes also seem slower, functionality has increased in some areas and decreased in others etc..

All of my program settings were retained. I have an eSATA hookup with a 750GB hardrive, and all of my recorded programs were reformatted and retained. Good news is that I can finally rewind and ff live television with my eSATA drive. I also finally have a progress bar indicating remaining hard drive recording space. The Start Over enhanced TV feature is limited to only a few channels, CNN, Food Network etc., and has limited functionality, no pause, FF, or REW. Probably one feature that will be seldom used.Esata warnings:

- make sure that new recordings are retained.

- make sure that old recordings don't disappear when you reboot the DVR.

These are problems that I (and others) reported after the last ODN update.

Also, it would be helpful if you could tell us which ODN release you received.

Also, it would be helpful if you could tell us which ODN release you received.

That would be MDN on his 8300HD... but we still would like to know the version loaded.

OCAP boxes in NYC already have ODN... its the Passport non-OCAPs that are being "updated" to MDN.

10 am... wow is that a first ? seems kind of an odd time huh lol! Maybe its because nyc is so gigantic!!!!!

That would be MDN on his 8300HD.Ah, I didn't catch that. Standby to disregard.

10 am... wow is that a first ? seems kind of an odd time huh lol! Maybe its because nyc is so gigantic!!!!!

WOW!

I agree that is a strange time! In the course of Navigator updates I can maybe recall reading two other cases where they did it during the day. A question that I want to ask this user is, did you get a filer notice or call the day to a few days before the download, or did they just load it to your box without warning?

Most of the time, TWC does box updates in the late-night to early morning hours. (Between 2am-5am) That's great that your external drive recordings appeared to be saved!!! You may want to play them back just to test and make sure.

Jack

One guy in the NYC thread is having major problems with MDN. He lost all his recordings :(.

*sigh* Navigator has destroyed my box.

My last two posts from the TWCNYC thread:

I'm currently being MDN'd as well.

Strange that it's happening in the late-morning/early afternoon, isn't it?

I just woke up at 1:40 PM, went to the bathroom, and when I came back, noticed that the time display on my cable box was just a bunch of lines. Sometimes bouncing up and down. OH ****, I thought to myself.

I turned my TV on, and was greeted by a blue screen with white lettering telling me that my settings and recordings were being transfered to a new format, and that if this screen remains for more than 30 minutes, to call Customer Service.

So the blue screen says Converting recordings and Converting settings, with the time displayed, then it goes to boot, I get the Mystro screen, it says it's loading, then after a few bars, it goes dark, the time goes away, I get the bouncing lines again, and I get the blue screen telling me it's transfering my recordings and settings. This has happened over and over again at least five times since I turned the TV on.

I'll let you know if it ever finishes.

---------------------------------------

Well, my box has failed me. It keeps cycling between the Mystro loading screen and the transferring settings and recordings. I just got off the phone with Customer Service. They tried sending a signal to my box to do...something, but didn't help. Their only response was to schedule an appointment to send a technician to my apartment....on SATURDAY.

On a whim, I asked the rep if it would hurt to unplug the box now and try a cold boot. She said sure, told me to unplug it, then she sent some more signals, told me to plug it back in, but got the same Mystro loading screen dancing with the transferring settings screen. It's on an endless loop.

I doubt they're going to be able to fix this on my box. They're probably just going to bring me another box. So now I lose Passport, my 8300HD, AND my recordings. Just wonderful.

---------------------------------------

So anyway, that's where I stand now. Unless my box somehow gets itself started up, I'm without TV in my bedroom for the next few days.

In the event that they do bring a new cable box, what's the best one out there now? The Samsung? I'm gonna get ODN regardless. :(

You could have canceled the appointment and just gotten a box at Queens Mall. I'd say the 3090 is pretty good. It's much faster than the 8300HDC. It's also nicer looking. The Samsung however, has it's own set of issues.

*sigh* Navigator has destroyed my box.

My last two posts from the TWCNYC thread:

I'm currently being MDN'd as well.

Strange that it's happening in the late-morning/early afternoon, isn't it?

I just woke up at 1:40 PM, went to the bathroom, and when I came back, noticed that the time display on my cable box was just a bunch of lines. Sometimes bouncing up and down. OH ****, I thought to myself.

I turned my TV on, and was greeted by a blue screen with white lettering telling me that my settings and recordings were being transfered to a new format, and that if this screen remains for more than 30 minutes, to call Customer Service.

So the blue screen says Converting recordings and Converting settings, with the time displayed, then it goes to boot, I get the Mystro screen, it says it's loading, then after a few bars, it goes dark, the time goes away, I get the bouncing lines again, and I get the blue screen telling me it's transferring my recordings and settings. This has happened over and over again at least five times since I turned the TV on.

I'll let you know if it ever finishes.

---------------------------------------

Well, my box has failed me. It keeps cycling between the Mystro loading screen and the transferring settings and recordings. I just got off the phone with Customer Service. They tried sending a signal to my box to do...something, but didn't help. Their only response was to schedule an appointment to send a technician to my apartment....on SATURDAY.

On a whim, I asked the rep if it would hurt to unplug the box now and try a cold boot. She said sure, told me to unplug it, then she sent some more signals, told me to plug it back in, but got the same Mystro loading screen dancing with the transferring settings screen. It's on an endless loop.

I doubt they're going to be able to fix this on my box. They're probably just going to bring me another box. So now I lose Passport, my 8300HD, AND my recordings. Just wonderful.

---------------------------------------

So anyway, that's where I stand now. Unless my box somehow gets itself started up, I'm without TV in my bedroom for the next few days.

In the event that they do bring a new cable box, what's the best one out there now? The Samsung? I'm gonna get ODN regardless. :(

Hey GI,

Sorry about your box! That sucks!

GI one last thing you could do to save your box, (or at least try to save your box.) When you go to bed tonight, turn off the TV and unplug the box leaving it unplugged overnight. (In an effort to save this, unplug any ESATA drives that you have connected.) Leave the box unplugged for all night.

In the morning, turn your TV back on and your box, leaving the ESATA unplugged if you have one. Wait one final 30 minutes for the box to boot and Navigator to appear. This happened to a few people that I know who got their box stuck in a "boot up loop" and it fixed it. There could be some strange issue where:

1.) Because of the ESATA drive models being different for different people, some may be having problems with the conversion with ESATA drives connected while others may not. The first task is to try to get Navigator to boot up without an ESATA connection to see if that works. Sucks, I know, but if you get a new ODN (C-box) it's likely that ESATA may not work anyway. The new boxes are ODN. The Navigator downloads are the MDN versions.

2.) Tomorrow if you have plugged the box back in with any optional external drive disconnected and Navigator comes on within 30 minutes and works good, you can cancel that appointment. You'll have to than decide whether or not you want to reconnect the ESATA drive. I'd lean towards not doing it because if the box booted without it, maybe the ESATA drive was the problem.

3.) Tomorrow if you plug the box back in and after turning on your TV, it is still stuck in the loop, you can either keep your service appointment or go to a service center and trade in your box for a new one. This will be an ODN model with Navigator already on it so the MDN download will not apply to you.

4.) At the service center, ask for a new Samsung box I would say. They will either give you that or a new SA-HDC model.

Let us know what happens.

Jack

I don't have an external hard drive.

Could be you don't have a good REVERSE path back to the headend....or a box problem....
Try removing any RF Splitters to improve the signal levels....

Could be you don't have a good REVERSE path back to the headend....or a box problem....
Try removing any RF Splitters to improve the signal levels....

+1

(I hate +1s, but oh well)

xnappo

I was about to say that I didn't have any splitters, but then I realized I might.

I live in an apartment building. The cable wires from the building's hallway run into my apartment, along the walls and into my bedroom. There's a device above my door which I guess is a splitter, because one wire from it runs around my room to my cable box, and a separate wire from it runs back across my apartment to the living room cable box.

All of my apartment's wires are only a year old, because I just moved in a year ago, and the apartment didn't have cable previously.

My box was working perfectly with Passport, and I even followed Satch Man's recommendations that I do an unplug reboot before the upgrade, which I did about two weeks ago.

I'm in NYC and was upgraded to Navigator on my 8300HD at 10AM this morning. I just happened to be home for a prior appt. and watched the whole process; it took approx 30 minutes.

All of my program settings were retained. I have an eSATA hookup with a 750GB hardrive, and all of my recorded programs were reformatted and retained. Good news is that I can finally rewind and ff live television with my eSATA drive. I also finally have a progress bar indicating remaining hard drive recording space. The Start Over enhanced TV feature is limited to only a few channels, CNN, Food Network etc., and has limited functionality, no pause, FF, or REW. Probably one feature that will be seldom used.

I will read more of this thread before commenting any further, but so far there are a few things I really like and several I don't. The picture is slightly better and less granulated, but channel changes also seem slower, functionality has increased in some areas and decreased in others etc..

Brooklyn? How many series recordings were kept? Word (from TWC) has it that ones not actively scheduled would be deleted.

*sigh* Navigator has destroyed my box.So anyway, that's where I stand now. Unless my box somehow gets itself started up, I'm without TV in my bedroom for the next few days.

In the event that they do bring a new cable box, what's the best one out there now? The Samsung? I'm gonna get ODN regardless. :(

Wow, looks like they hit Brooklyn AND Queens today, someone from Brooklyn posted about this this morning.

Ha, I only have ONE TV... so if I get bricked it's... down top 23rd street.

C'mon, the PQ improved just because navigator was downloaded:rolleyes:. I think some here have an unhealthy obsession and "crush" on Navigator. :rolleyes: :p

Yes, they just hit Queens today, I got it on my 8300HD box (and if anyone remember MDN is the reason I returned my previous 8300HDC box). I am stuck with god damn MDN Explorer junk, I am getting rid of cable as soon as I can find something with reasonable price. FIOS, where are you? It is the perfect time to bring it here.
All of the features that kept me with Cable DVR are gone... Time Warner is like cable nazis forcing their customers to use less functional hardware. With all the money they make, you would think they would pay to get better software/hardware.

I posted this on my local thread but it’s too good not to share.

Irony of all ironies, this morning, while TW was crapagating :mad::rolleyes: my perfectly fine Passport box, a Verizon bucket truck, :eek::) with a crew of two and a big spool of heart health fiber ;), were wiring my street, from telephone pole to telephone pole. ;):cool::p

I was about to say that I didn't have any splitters, but then I realized I might.

I live in an apartment building. The cable wires from the building's hallway run into my apartment, along the walls and into my bedroom. There's a device above my door which I guess is a splitter, because one wire from it runs around my room to my cable box, and a separate wire from it runs back across my apartment to the living room cable box.

All of my apartment's wires are only a year old, because I just moved in a year ago, and the apartment didn't have cable previously.

My box was working perfectly with Passport, and I even followed Satch Man's recommendations that I do an unplug reboot before the upgrade, which I did about two weeks ago.

I was also going to suggest GI, that if the cold boot tomorrow that I recommended doesn't work after unplugging the box all night, and you keep that service appointment, be sure to show the tech the wiring issue that you described above.

Jack

G1Ravage,

Sorry to see that your box got bricked by a stable version of Navigator. You'd think they got it right. I guess it happens or maybe you do have an OOB issue.

Charlotte, NC got MDN v2.4.6-19 last night or is it v2.4.4-19.

anyone know when manhattan gets upgraded?

Yes, they just hit Queens today, I got it on my 8300HD box (and if anyone remember MDN is the reason I returned my previous 8300HDC box). I am stuck with god damn MDN Explorer junk, I am getting rid of cable as soon as I can find something with reasonable price. FIOS, where are you? It is the perfect time to bring it here.
All of the features that kept me with Cable DVR are gone... Time Warner is like cable nazis forcing their customers to use less functional hardware. With all the money they make, you would think they would pay to get better software/hardware.

I posted this on my local thread but it’s too good not to share.

Irony of all ironies, this morning, while TW was crapagating :mad::rolleyes: my perfectly fine Passport box, a Verizon bucket truck, :eek::) with a crew of two and a big spool of heart health fiber ;), were wiring my street, from telephone pole to telephone pole. ;):cool::p

I like your posts. Welcome to the Navigator forum!! Enjoy your stay. Finally, someone else who thinks like I do! :cool::cool::cool:

Actually, I just realized that the "split" in my room goes three ways...source comes in from the building's wires, one goes down in my room to my cable modem, one goes down the other way in my room to my cable box, and the other returns to the hallway and goes to the living room cable box.

I left the box plugged in while I was out today. When I came home, it was still doing its thing, constantly going back and forth between the Mystro loading screen and the transferring settings/recordings screen.

I unplugged it around 1:00 AM. I'll keep it unplugged until around 5:00 or 6:00 PM tomorrow, when I return home from some afternoon errands. I'm praying that it somehow boots up. I don't care if it deleted all my recordings in the process; I just want to see how MDN looks on my box. I've been waiting a long time for this just to have it blow up in my face. :(

C'mon, the PQ improved just because navigator was downloaded:rolleyes:. I think some here have an unhealthy obsession and "crush" on Navigator. :rolleyes: :p

LOL@Nick,

Yea, I know that Navigator does still have some dents in its armor! But I can say that when we got converted last year there was a SLIGHT difference in PQ and it did look better. Maybe our family was one of the lucky ones, who knows?

But I can say that when we were on Passport, we did have this Public Access channel that nothing would ever be on it. All there would be was a black screen and the box when we had Passport would freeze for about 3-4 seconds when we would tune this channel for about two years. But when we got Navigator before it was downloaded, I thought, "OH $**T! It's probably gonna blow up if I go to channel 14 now." But when I got Navigator it scrolled through that blank screen channel like it was nothing, so I was shocked to find that this was a Passport problem!

That was back in April 2008, and I really have not had major problems. We did have for a month or so channels not recording after about 10 minutes that were SDV. This was most noticed on Food Network and TV Land. However, they fixed that issue a while back. MDN speed is pretty fast on my box. It does reboot about once a week, which I think would be nice if it was a little less and sometimes in scrolling, you only get like 4 days out instead of 7. (I don't know what happened to 14 days.)

I do like the DVR storage indicator and the different search options. (Searching by Theme is I think the easiest way to find information.)

Some of the issues with Navigator for me were more along the lines of features lost than IPG bugs. Not having Keyword Search is very stupid and I think that the sports category listings could be more detailed. The Select tree tier option seems to work better for finding stuff like Movies, but Sports listings are too generic.

For example if The Godfather is on, I can find that easily. (Keyboard Search B to Find Shows start with "G." As you know if a show begins with the letter "A" or the word "The," the second word's first letter begins the search.) or press B again to search by Theme, Select Movies, Select Drama. Easy.

But for Sports, this is where Navigator gets me PO! If you want to watch a specific football game and if you do a theme search. "B" Find Shows, Press "B" again, go to Sports, go to Football, I mean WTF? You have to select each game by pressing select and seeing it on the screen what team is playing. You could be doing this like 15 times. THIS IS WHERE KEYWORD SEARCH IS NEEDED SO BADLY! You type in a team name, "Packers" and the Football games related to them should come up much faster than scrolling through the list.

A Tip is that in Theme Searching, the most recent times for stuff is ALWAYS at the top of the list, so maybe that might help some of you out. Keyboard Search only goes by title. But the problem is that for Football, titles could be:


NFL Football
College Football
Talking Football

People who don't know that Keyboard Search on Navigator just searches for titles by the letters of first words, (currently) will just start typing "F" and go "WTF? There's no football games shown!" For title search, you have to type starting with "N" for NFL Football to show in the list or "C" for College Football to show in the list. The average person I think believes that Navigator's current Keyboard Search can find anything on the system, but currently, you can only browse by letters of titles.

However, Keyword Search will solve so many of these issues and make it even easier to find stuff. Why this was not included in Navigator's original development was insane!

Trying to find out if LA and the Carolinas got the new MDN update with new features. Seriously, if Keyword Search comes out, I will be happy with Navigator!

Maybe this will help.

Jack

Well, here's what my box has been bouncing between non-stop:

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/3479/0714091403.jpg

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/6747/0714091359.jpg

I was upconverted (downconverted?) from Passport to Navigator, when my old box died and was replaced by an 8300HDC with ODN 3.1.1_sp1. Life goes on, mostly I've figured out where stuff moved to (although I just cannot seem to get the eSATA drive to work, and vacation is coming, sigh...). But this leads me to a question, hopefully a simple one for forum followers:

How do I save a TV show that's been recorded?

On Passport, I remember having 2 options:


I could reoder the program list, moving something higher resulted in it being saved longer
I could mark a program as "Save Forever", meaning it would be kept indefinitely (for the life of the box;-)


I don't seem to be able to find anything equivalent under ODN, but I figure I'm just too much of a newbie on the platform, must be somewhere.

Hints and Tips?

I posted this on my local thread but it’s too good not to share.

Irony of all ironies, this morning, while TW was crapagating :mad::rolleyes: my perfectly fine Passport box, a Verizon bucket truck, :eek::) with a crew of two and a big spool of heart health fiber ;), were wiring my street, from telephone pole to telephone pole. ;):cool::p

Must be a sign from God (Gods?). You are among the lucky, the chosen few. I've been praying, but the Verizon FIOS trunk is still 500 yards from my house.:( No signs of movement.

Anyway, when FIOS is up and you switch, let us know if the Cable guy looks like the one on the FIOS TV commercials. The Cable execs must really hate those things. I keep getting offers from TWC to lock in my rates, phone, mail, e-mail, they really really want me to take a 2 year deal (I keep asking, are my rates going up? Answer is no, so I pretty much say goodbye at that point). Maybe that's a sign that FIOS is close. I see the latest TWC/Comcast thing is to block internet streaming of TV unless I'm a "paying" cable TV customer. Until all the Navigator problems, I haven't really had much to complain about, but with the potential blocking/capping on my internet access, I'd move on the second there was a viable alternative. Cable better figure out how to make money when it's no longer a monopoly.

If this helps any g1 you have a pretty sweet looking tv ! Is it possible tv type could be the reason ? ....i don't know just speculating...there ARE MANY UNIQUE BRANDS OUT THERE! Hell i have a konka 37 " yes it's konka not tonka ...lol ! ;)

If this helps any g1 you have a pretty sweet looking tv ! Is it possible tv type could be the reason ? ....i don't know just speculating...there ARE MANY UNIQUE BRANDS OUT THERE! Hell i have a konka 37 " yes it's konka not tonka ...lol ! ;)

Don't laugh too hard... my Sammie refuses to boot into ODN when it is is connected to my Onkyo receiver via HDMI. I have to either power down the receiver or unplug the HDMI cable for it to boot ODN. I even traded in a 320GB for a 160GB before I realized what the issue really was.:o:(

G1... have you tried unplugging the HDMI output of the box? It's at least worth a shot.

Not saying it's a laughing matter, i feel for him, it was just a little light humor ...same thing could happen to me when i get the upgrade ..then nick can tell me i told you so (j/k) . It must stink pay all that money for an hd.. all that money for cable ...then you have to wait for a field installer to come to fix it ...it truly is a bad time in his household.:eek:

Not saying it's a laughing matter, i feel for him, it was just a little light humor ...same thing could happen to me when i get the upgrade ..then nick can tell me i told you so (j/k) . It must stink pay all that money for an hd.. all that money for cable ...then you have to wait for a field installer to come to fix it ...it truly is a bad time in his household.:eek:

Wasn't accusing you of making light of his situation... just pointing out that what is downstream of the box just may be having an effect.

Oh i read it wrong sorry...just wanted to clear that it wasn't funny and more like more or less to tell him there is light at the end of the tunnel. He will get it fixed and i'm sure it will all work out in the end. I was being truthful about his tv ...it is a very nice tv !!!

G1... have you tried unplugging the HDMI output of the box? It's at least worth a shot.

I am indeed hooked up to the TV via HDMI...I'm gonna plug it back in later this evening. If it's still not working, I'll try without the HDMI.

I am indeed hooked up to the TV via HDMI...I'm gonna plug it back in later this evening. If it's still not working, I'll try without the HDMI.

GI,

When this gets fixed, make sure you call and get a credit for all the days your box was hosed because of Navigator's failed download. You should get AT MINIMUM a week off your bill and I would push for a free month of service for all the b.s that the failed download has caused.

Jack

I was told the other day from a csr she said she didn't think our division would release navigator only when " sammies " were issued here (with navigator being already existent on samsung) . She said that she didn't see time warner trying to get cisco's permission for software upgrades for SA boxes . Obviously that's not true if based on g1's circumstance he has an 8300 series cable box...... all this miss information from up above :rolleyes:.

On Passport, I remember having 2 options:


I could reoder the program list, moving something higher resulted in it being saved longer
I could mark a program as "Save Forever", meaning it would be kept indefinitely (for the life of the box;-)



1. That feature's gone.

2. That's still there. Go to the record list > select show > record options > keep until > do not delete.

I was told the other day from a csr she said she didn't think our division would release navigator only when " sammies " were issued here (with navigator being already existent on samsung) . She said that she didn't see time warner trying to get cisco's permission for software upgrades for SA boxes . Obviously that's not true if based on g1's circumstance he has an 8300 series cable box...... all this miss information from up above :rolleyes:.This shows what information from most CSRs is worth :rolleyes:. TWC doesn't need "Cisco's permission" to change the software on boxes, since they own the equipment. In San Diego, after 1 July 2007 (when the FCC required all the cable providers to start buying equipment which used CableCARDs for conditional access), all new boxes had Navigator installed, which they ran on the same system while the legacy boxes were running Passport. I can't remember exactly when, but they started loading MDN into legacy boxes in waves, defined by area and model (I think--many people had one or more boxes with MDN and others with Passport for a whle). Of course, other divisions are free to do it their own way.

I get the idea that areas with SARA have to switch everything at once, since Navigator won't run on systems whose headends support SARA. That could be wrong.

By everything do you mean in order to get navigator we must have the samsung's ... there will no updates to the software.:confused:

By everything do you mean in order to get navigator we must have the samsung's ... there will no updates to the software.:confused:By everything I mean that they have to switch all of the software which communicates with the boxes in the headends to something which works with Navigator and all of the boxes to either MDN or ODN--there can be no Samsung boxes until they have a network which will work with ODN.

It's possible that they've developed headend software which is compatible with both SARA and Navigator. That would allow them to switch in a more leisurely fashion.

Do we know of any systems with SARA which have switched to Navigator? If so, how did it happen?

Actually, I just realized that the "split" in my room goes three ways...source comes in from the building's wires, one goes down in my room to my cable modem, one goes down the other way in my room to my cable box, and the other returns to the hallway and goes to the living room cable box.
( And that would be the test for signal strength if you take out the splitter and find a threaded barrel (splice) the in to the cable box line. This leaves the modem and 2nd room out of the loop, but the signal would be probably 4 times stronger. If you cannot do that, some splitters are actually not split 3 ways, but one out is half of original split and the the other two 1/4 each (will be marked 3db, 6db, 6db with 3db being 1/2 signal). Can at least put your cable box on the least split up port (3db) if available. /Dan

charlotte, nc got mdn v2.4.6-19 last night or is it v2.4.4-19.

2.4.6-19

And that would be the test for signal strength if you take out the splitter and find a threaded barrel (splice) the in to the cable box line. This leaves the modem and 2nd room out of the loop, but the signal would be probably 4 times stronger. If you cannot do that, some splitters are actually not split 3 ways, but one out is half of original split and the the other two 1/4 each (will be marked 3db, 6db, 6db with 3db being 1/2 signal). Can at least put your cable box on the least split up port (3db) if available. /Dan

Here is a picture of the splitter above my bedroom door:

http://img102.imageshack.us/img102/6040/0715091943.jpg

The bottom left is the source in, which comes from my building's hallway, into my apartment, and across the wall into my bedroom. The top left feeds down my bedroom wall into my cable modem. The top right feeds across my other wall to my cable box. The bottom right returns out my door, and across the other walls of my apartment to the living room cable box.

The living room cable box, if anyone is interested, is a Samsung SMT-H3050, which of course has ODN.

Trying to find out if LA and the Carolinas got the new MDN update with new features. Seriously, if Keyword Search comes out, I will be happy with Navigator!

charlotte got MDN 2.4.6-19 -- no keyword search

OH MY GOD SOMETHING JUST HAPPENED!!!!!

My display, which had been showing 480i during this whole ridiculous process, is now showing 1080i!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Could it be....could it be loaded?

I'm gonna put my HDMI cable back in and turn it on....Oh god here we go....

IT'S WORKING!!!!!!!!!! IT'S WORKING!!! I HAVE PICTURE!!!!!!!!!! MY RECORDINGS ARE THERE!!!!!!!!

More to come after full exploration.

IT'S WORKING!!!!!!!!!! IT'S WORKING!!! I HAVE PICTURE!!!!!!!!!! MY RECORDINGS ARE THERE!!!!!!!!

More to come after full exploration.

WOOOOO!!!!! WOOOOOO!!!!!! Happy New Year GI!!!!!!

That's great!!!

Jack

Good to hear your working fine.....i knew it would work itself out.... i have a splitter to does this mean the same thing could happen to me as well ? G1 lets see some guide pics i want to see that latest version !!!!!! Your problem had been on my mind for awhile now thinking is that going to happen to me or others in the centraL NY area ?

IT'S WORKING!!!!!!!!!! IT'S WORKING!!! I HAVE PICTURE!!!!!!!!!! MY RECORDINGS ARE THERE!!!!!!!!

More to come after full exploration.

G1 - The exact same thing happened to my box - you explained it to a T, except that I don't have a splitter inline, just the cable from the wall to the box. I didn't consider, however, that perhaps the line was split outside my house. I should have checked that before bringing the box in for a swap. I didn't have an external drive, but I did have some recordings on the box that I would have like to have kept. SIGH!

Anyway, they swapped it for a Samsung 3090 which I'm not sure if it's better than the old 8300HD. Maybe it's me, but the 8300HD seemed smoother. I think it's my imagination. (My bedroom 8300HD took the firmware update fine.)

Comparing both boxes, I noticed one thing - that the 8300HD doesn't stretch the menus/guides/popups across the whole 16x9 screen while the Samsung does - when they are both set to output Normal, 16x9, and whatever resolution the program is at.

One thing that struck me is setting the Samsung to produce 5.1 audio over HDMI. If it wasn't for one of these threads in this forum - I would be pulling my hair out on how to set that! How would one know that they had to go into the diagnostics to do this?

Pictures to come later tonight/tomorrow morning.

I've noticed another change...the cable box display shows the display output and HDTV marker even when the box is off.

Just think 24 hours ago you were cursing the update ....lol ! No hurry on pics ...glad you put that baby to bed !!!!!!!!

I just did a warm reboot to take care of the audio drop-outs. Audio is fine now.

I did the reboot by holding in the Power button. I thought this wouldn't work anymore?

BTW, my MDN version is:

Atlas v2.4.4-16-ptv (Pyramid

This site it is so addictive i find more interesting things in here then whats on the hdtv! :cool:

I just did a warm reboot to take care of the audio drop-outs. Audio is fine now.

I did the reboot by holding in the Power button. I thought this wouldn't work anymore?

BTW, my MDN version is:

Atlas v2.4.4-16-ptv (Pyramid

That is so cool!

G1 (or anyone) what do you think it was that finally pushed the download through? I mean most people aren't going to have the patience to wait all day and all night for something to load like this! I am really happy for you, but I was thinking, "Oh $hite, his box is fried!" G1 did you change anything in your room's setup to get Navigator to load?"

Now, all we can do is hope the rest of the conversions, you just have that 20-20 minute wait and that's it! That was quite an amazing recovery! I think poor G1 came within minutes of throwing his box at his TV!"

Yea, the power button thing to do a reboot never used to work so maybe they added this in an update.

WOW!!! From a "dead box" to Navigator working and G1 said all his recordings were there!!! That's great!

Jack

Oh wow, I assumed that G1 took the splitter out but it looks like it just worked for him? I had that box recycle the boot sequence for over 24-36 hours before I gave up and swapped it. Maybe I should have waited longer. : /

I never touched the splitter.

I just left my box unplugged for like 16 hours, and before plugging it back in, I removed the HDMI cable.

It took an hour exactly, but it booted up.

I never touched the splitter.

I just left my box unplugged for like 16 hours, and before plugging it back in, I removed the HDMI cable.

It took an hour exactly, but it booted up.

and what are the odds this was never an issue with your setup and was in fact a TWC problem?

Usually if you don't change anything and something starts working it was never your problem to begin with.

I just did a warm reboot to take care of the audio drop-outs. Audio is fine now.

I did the reboot by holding in the Power button. I thought this wouldn't work anymore?

BTW, my MDN version is:

Atlas v2.4.4-16-ptv (Pyramid

I'm glad you got it working just fine. I assume you lost your recordings. The branch name is Pyramid peak. There is a new version which I think is 2.4.4-19 but one person labeled it as 2.4.6-19. This was in Charlotte, NC. San Diego and Desert Cities will probably get the new update soon as were still on MDN v2.4.4-14. We'll probably get the new ODN version to fix the 3270 HD-DVR while the 3260 is still fine. It does have a few minor issues.

Edit: No recordings are lost. I can now confirm that the new MDN version is 2.4.6-19.

I like this definition of Time Warner. And it mentions the DVR. Must've been someone who used to have SARA or Passport switched to Navigator. :D

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Time%20Warner%20Cable

Navigator Update on the Closed Captioning Issue: (MDN SA-8300 HD box)

I just want to extend the heads-up that on my SA-8300 HD box, since we got a new Samsung HD TV connected to HDMI cable the Closed Captioning works fine about 97% of the time.

A bug that seems to occur is that every once in a blue moon, actually this has occurred twice in the last two weeks, I will be watching TV with the Navigator CC turned on, and the captions will suddenly change color and freeze on the screen. The only way to restore CC to an unfreeze status is to reboot the box. Note that so far, this has only happened when I play back a DVR recording. Simply turning off CC on the box does not unfreeze the CC image on the screen. I hope that TWC will work to correct this bug in future software updates.

Jack