ODN already has this feature for quite some time.

Actually, If you are talking about blocking Parental Control Titles in the Recording Log:

MDN may have it too, I don't use a Parental Control Blocking pin. Maybe the person whom I remember reading complaining about it did not set it up right.

Jack

I was talking about the favorites. I don't use Parental controls.

Why does the buffer empty out if you FF or REW live tv. It's supposed to last 1 hour but it erases itself after 55 minutes.

It never does that for me unless there's a recording quirk.

The buffer should be longer than an hour since the capacity was increased over Passport. The buffer for CBS and HBO HD that I've had on this evening is even longer than that. It's buffered 2 hours each on those.

A long shot. But is it possible the buffer time is being based on a set amount of data used on the drive like 5GB or thereabouts?

That's possible. When the buffer was increased earlier (Passport-era) I remember it used more drive space, which obviously put a squeeze on recording capacity.

With Navigator I can't say or remember, if it has the same effect, or if Nav uses a more efficient storage method to buffer more in the same amount of space that Passport used.

Only way I could see that being the case is if SD channels have a MUCH larger buffer like a couple hours plus. Sadly I don't stay on SD channels long enough to check. >.>

I will love it if the version of Navigator we get has an option to only show the channels I want to see. I'm more concerned with blocking out duplicates and SD versions. That and eSATA support would keep me from going with a Tivo and I might even add a second box to my bedroom.

A quick question: Does any current version of Navigator show the time when FF or REW a recorded show? I believe Passport did and I know Tivo does. That or does it just show the bar with the icon?

Erm...My memory is a little sketchy but I know on ODN 3.1.1_3 here when playing back a recorded program it'll display it in the little tab in the top left corner of the info bar after a few seconds ('Playback' will change to the runtime of the show). Can't recall for live stuff though.

Maybe someone could do a screen shot?

A quick question: Does any current version of Navigator show the time when FF or REW a recorded show? I believe Passport did and I know Tivo does. That or does it just show the bar with the icon?

Nope. A glaring example of the poor design of the interface that's been there since day one.

During live TV there's no timecode only a clock and during recorded playback there's a timecode but no clock.

Plus as I've complained about before it's in an idiotic place that's disconnected from the actual indicator on the progress bar. Something which every video progression bar, almost everywhere else, gets right.

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii286/bankerjohn/8300HDCimageII.jpg

Previous more detailed rant/comparison here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15832057#post15832057

That's possible. When the buffer was increased earlier (Passport-era) I remember it used more drive space, which obviously put a squeeze on recording capacity.Passport went from two 3.5 GB buffers of variable duration depending on bit rate to two 8 GB buffers of fixed 1 hour duration, regardless of content bit rate (so any bit rate less than 19 Mbps could be buffered for longer than an hour, but isn't). That's an increase of 9 GB, an additional 6% of the 151 GB total (the 16 GB for both buffers is 10.6% of the available space). You could store more than an hour's worth of any channel in that 9 GB, so the loss was significant.

(Those numbers are in 2-to-the-30th "computing" gigabytes, not 10-to-the-9th as used for marketing--151 GB is 162 billion bytes. Some standards org wants people to call power-of-2 units "kibi", "mebi" and "gibi" instead of "kilo", "mega" and "giga"--I ain't doing it :rolleyes:).With Navigator I can't say or remember, if it has the same effect, or if Nav uses a more efficient storage method to buffer more in the same amount of space that Passport used.No such "more efficient storage method" is possible. It is inconceivable that either IPG adds enough extra information to be more than miniscule on the scale of the video data size, particularly HD video data.

Your cable box will still work the same way....I gave it a try....like before you find the show you want to record in the guide....when you push "select" choose the "timer reminder" option with the show that you want to record... it will be highlighted in purple with a little clock on the guide...I did this on my non-dvr cable box...the box changed channels....then I did it for multiple recordings...it changed every time...so it is just called something different but it still works...

Thank you for this. I had tried the reminder timers manually along with the on/off timers and it did not work. I tried your suggestion and it worked and then I tried the reminder timer manually without using the on/off timer and the reminder timer worked manually (without the guide). This is a good solution. The downside is that I must leave the cable box powered on whenever I am going to tape, but it is a solution that I can live with and costs less than $20 a month for DVR from the cable company and I can take tapes or dvd's from room to room and the discs to the car. Thank you so much for taking the time and effort to reply. You really saved me here.

Thank you for this. I had tried the reminder timers manually along with the on/off timers and it did not work. I tried your suggestion and it worked and then I tried the reminder timer manually without using the on/off timer and the reminder timer worked manually (without the guide). This is a good solution. The downside is that I must leave the cable box powered on whenever I am going to tape, but it is a solution that I can live with and costs less than $20 a month for DVR from the cable company and I can take tapes or dvd's from room to room and the discs to the car. Thank you so much for taking the time and effort to reply. You really saved me here.

Your very welcome I am so glad I helped...

Nope. A glaring example of the poor design of the interface that's been there since day one.

During live TV there's no timecode only a clock and during recorded playback there's a timecode but no clock.

Plus as I've complained about before it's in an idiotic place that's disconnected from the actual indicator on the progress bar. Something which every video progression bar, almost everywhere else, gets right.

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii286/bankerjohn/8300HDCimageII.jpg

Previous more detailed rant/comparison here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15832057#post15832057

Navigator should style its DVR interface like SARA where the bottom bar is dedicated to DVR control information with the timecode on the progress bar and put the current time/channel number in a box on the upper right corner.

I could have swore that at last glance, MDN did have the Passport-style timecode-on-marker piece like shown in the above screenshots. May just be my imagination though. My aunt's the only one I know with an MDN box and haven't been over there long enough to stare in a while.

I could have swore that at last glance, MDN did have the Passport-style timecode-on-marker piece like shown in the above screenshots. May just be my imagination though. My aunt's the only one I know with an MDN box and haven't been over there long enough to stare in a while.

It doesn't. The current versions of MDN and ODN are almost identical, with the exception of a few minor things. None of the ODN or MDN to date have had the timecode thingy.

So I didn't realize this and I dunno if anyone has mentioned it yet. When Navi comes up with the 'The DVR is entering sleep mode' banner, it doesn't actually shut off the box completely but just shuts off the hard disk (I assume it only does this when you are already live and not rewound to a non-live position. And it will cut off your live buffer until you wake up the hard disk again). Very neat feature.

Up to now both my mom and myself have thought it was gonna shut off the box altogether but I let it go and all it did was the screen went blank for a split second and came back up and I heard the disk spin down.

Navigator should style its DVR interface like SARA where the bottom bar is dedicated to DVR control information with the timecode on the progress bar and put the current time/channel number in a box on the upper right corner.

SARA never had a timecode to the best of my knowledge. Thing is you have a 16x9 screen you can use on the HD DVR's. That's alot of real estate that they are wasting. Navigator looks to be a massive improvement over SARA, but I still think I may end up with a Tivo Series 4 (if they ever release it). I can't see Tivo releasing a box that doesn't have SDV, PPV, and VOD support.

Actually if it were me, and the way it sounds it is going to get to soon, is spend the extra cash and build a Windows 7 based HTPC with a couple ATI cablecard tuners and a few ATSC tuners to boot. Last I read ATI had a firmware update in the works to relax their DRM (so content that is not copy protected on the cable plant won't be copy protected as it's recorded.) and add SDV/tuning adapter support. Got a 16x9 guide, better recording options, AWESOME UI. Just better all around. And once SDV support is here, it pretty much has all chances of competing with SARA/Navi/Passport except for the VOD part (which for a lot of people on this forum is a minor annoyance and a simple non-DVR HD box would suffice).

I swear to $deity that once I have enough money to build/buy a decent machine that can handle it and get even just two ATI cablecard tuners, it's happening. Then I can tell TWC to take their Navigator box and shove it.

I guess I'll post here, as this is working out to be more a Navigator problem, than anything else. I have a newish 8300HDC, given to me after the 8300HD died, TWC NY (Poughkeepsie), Navigator ODN 3.1.1_sp1. Unfortunately, I have not been able to get an external hard drive to work with it, I've tried various ones, mostly it seems to recognize the eSATA attached drive, but when I tell the 8300HDC to format the drive [A], nothing much seems to happen after that. Reading through the thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=516559&page=256

it seems like later levels of Navigator, 3.1.x, nobody has much had luck formatting and successfully using the drive. Some that had formatted before, are OK in some cases, but not anyone that has to format new. Reference also:

http://www.baseportal.com/baseportal/xnappo/navigator

Seems a shame that Navigator has these problems. Reading through this thread, I see that Navigator is kind of inevitable, and kind of flawed, both, but on TWC, we're kind of stuck with it. Which brings me to a follow up question or two:


Anyone have a list of alternatives to TWC Navigator boxes?
Anyway to get a SA box without Navigator on it?
Pointers to PC or Moxi or other viable alternatives?


I'm not really eager to spend a lot more on the DVR, but I tend to watch TV in clumps, and the base box just has too little capacity, for when I get busy at work or take a summer vacation, so I need something that stores more HD hours, or supports an external HD.

SARA never had a timecode to the best of my knowledge. Thing is you have a 16x9 screen you can use on the HD DVR's. That's alot of real estate that they are wasting. Navigator looks to be a massive improvement over SARA, but I still think I may end up with a Tivo Series 4 (if they ever release it). I can't see Tivo releasing a box that doesn't have SDV, PPV, and VOD support.

Strangley enought SARA does have a time code. It's not in the right place for easy use but it's there. When playing back a recording press stop and you will see the time code. It will tell you the time recording was stoped and how much time is left to end of recording and how much time you have recorded. The information and code are there just in a fracked up place. Sadly their is no time code during recording. WOODY

Anyone have a list of alternatives to TWC Navigator boxes?
Anyway to get a SA box without Navigator on it?
Pointers to PC or Moxi or other viable alternatives?


I'm not really eager to spend a lot more on the DVR, but I tend to watch TV in clumps, and the base box just has too little capacity, for when I get busy at work or take a summer vacation, so I need something that stores more HD hours, or supports an external HD.

Might take a look at the Samsung DVRs (3090 is the one being deployed although one person keeps talking about a slightly newer 3270, but that one hasn't hit the field). We do have one report I've caught that someone in the US has swapped the internal drive for a 320 (Brighthouse in FLA).

A SA box w/o ODN/MDN being handed out simply isn't happening, at least not in any kind of way (very few somehow have managed to get 8300HD's w/Passport in my market, but we only have one, maybe two reports that happened).

There's always the TiVo option. BUT that has it's issues, more so in some markets, less so in others. The seems to be almost an implied promise that once tru2way is implemented in it's boxes and at the head ends of the MSOs, everything will be great. BUT these kinds of promises tend to be ones they can just as easily opt out of.

Slight correction regarding SARA time code.When playing back a recording press stop and you have all the time code information you will need. When you are recording you do not have a time code or at least any I have found. But it is available on playback. Hope this makes things a bit clearer. WOODY

...

Anyone have a list of alternatives to TWC Navigator boxes?
Anyway to get a SA box without Navigator on it?
Pointers to PC or Moxi or other viable alternatives?


I'm not really eager to spend a lot more on the DVR, but I tend to watch TV in clumps, and the base box just has too little capacity, for when I get busy at work or take a summer vacation, so I need something that stores more HD hours, or supports an external HD.

AFAIK, alternatives are Tivo HD, Moxi, and PC-bases solutions.
You can get info on Tivo and Moxi on their web sites, but the first post of this Tivo thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=879469
is a much more detailed and less biased source, and includes a Tivo vs Moxi comparison. There is also a Moxi thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1095015
Don't know much about PC alternatives, but cursory look would indicate that they are likely to be expensive.

I don't think you can get a SA box from TWC without Navigator on it, unless your area still hasn't switched; but even if that's the case, that may be short-lived (TWC will force the Navigator to you eventually), especially if it is a Passport box. I don't think that you can buy your own SA box with your choice of software on it anywhere.

So I didn't realize this and I dunno if anyone has mentioned it yet. When Navi comes up with the 'The DVR is entering sleep mode' banner, it doesn't actually shut off the box completely but just shuts off the hard disk (I assume it only does this when you are already live and not rewound to a non-live position. And it will cut off your live buffer until you wake up the hard disk again). Very neat feature.

When I use the sleep timer the box goes off but the box still makes a noise...I have 3 DVR's and they all have a noise when the box is off whether it is manually turned off or by sleep timer. This tells me the hard drive is still active...the box used to be silent at night...Passport gave you the option of manually turning off the hard drive when the box was off...this no longer exists...granted it is not a loud noise but it is a hum....2 of the DVR's are in my bedroom so it has twice the noise...I fixed the problem by plugging both DVR's into a dedicated power strip...one click and they are dark and silent...the next morning I turn them on to boot up and go about my business...I am worried that this will effect the boxes in the long run but so far so good...this works for me...

When I use the sleep timer the box goes off but the box still makes a noise...I have 3 DVR's and they all have a noise when the box is off whether it is manually turned off or by sleep timer. This tells me the hard drive is still active...the box used to be silent at night...Passport gave you the option of manually turning off the hard drive when the box was off...this no longer exists...granted it is not a loud noise but it is a hum....2 of the DVR's are in my bedroom so it has twice the noise...I fixed the problem by plugging both DVR's into a dedicated power strip...one click and they are dark and silent...the next morning I turn them on to boot up and go about my business...I am worried that this will effect the boxes in the long run but so far so good...this works for me...

What exact box model are you using? Mine's the 8240HDC ODN. I dunno if it still puts itself into sleep when in standby mode, but when on it does it just fine. Though it does take like an hour or more before it comes to realize that, yeah, it has no immediate scheduled recordings and the current show is live and it can kick the disk into sleep mode.

Though it would be really nice if there were extra options for this. It isn't as annoying in our house being in the living room and far enough away to really be heard even when someone is sleeping on the couch. (Though usually if that is the case it's me or my brother when he's home and neither of us can sleep WITHOUT any kind of computer churning away nearby. ;) I have like 3 computers running 24/7 in my 10 sq.ft. room, one with 4 hard disks in it, and sleep like a baby.) But it'd be nice to have an option so some of us could be extra agressive about the sleep mode activity.

I am using SA8300's so they are different than what you have...I am the type of person that needs dark and quiet to go to sleep so the option of the power strip is working for me because I rarely record anything past
llpm...waiting an hour for things to quiet down is not an option for me...I tried turning off the box in the living room and after 2 hours it was still humming away even after it was put on a non-buffer station so the SA8300 stay active...other than that my other wish on my list is an option I used all the time on Passport....highlight something in the guide..push search and you saw when that program would be on ....you can still do that but now you are forced to type out the name of the program which is not as user friendly...Navigator is nice...it is working for me...it's a shade slower but not significantly so....I think if you have an HDC box it is problematic but since I don't I am liking it...hopefully the powers that be will listen to actual users and upgrade to some of the things that made Passport work...

One of the good things about the Samsung 3090 DVR is that the drive is virtually dead silent, so its a moot point whether the drive is shut down or not.

TWC San Diego hopes to deploy the Samsung SMT-H3270 HD-DVR late next week. This is a maybe but it might be delayed yet again. They fixed 2 worrying bugs so it's gotten better. There still is a few bugs that are quite minor though.

Anybody know what areas are next to get Navigator on more Passport or SARA boxes?

Jack

Honestly, I don't know. I think Greensboro will be the first SARA to Navigator area.

Anybody know what areas are next to get Navigator on more Passport or SARA boxes?

Jack

Manhattan seems to be the one area in NYC that the "forced MDN for Passport" hasn't happened yet. Other boroughs got it a few weeks ago. It's been "any day now" for a few weeks already and I'm getting tired of waiting!

I know how you feel riverside .....it's been an eternity...it had been testing since april here ...it's like make a decision already.:( in those 2 months since our regional spokesperson stated later this year another two months has passed. Who knows what's going on here and in the big apple !

I know how you feel riverside .....it's been an eternity...it had been testing since april here ...it's like make a decision already.:( in those 2 months since our regional spokesperson stated later this year another two months has passed. Who knows what's going on here and in the big apple !

Abyss,

You're gonna be going back to your "Gatored" cabin....to live! hahahaha. Oh wait, that's not you that's Crazy Woody, right? LOL! Well, hopefully the Gators will be in all of New York soon!

Jack

I'm waiting to see what the SMT-H3270 has in store. It's said to have a 320 GB HDD. It runs the same software as the 3260. The major bugs have been fixed but there are a few minor ones that wont cause TWC San Diego to delay deployment. TWC San Diego and Desert Cities will be the first division to deploy the Samsung 3260 and 3270 boxes.

I'm waiting to see what the SMT-H3270 has in store. It's said to have a 320 GB HDD. It runs the same software as the 3260. The major bugs have been fixed but there are a few minor ones that wont cause TWC San Diego to delay deployment. TWC San Diego and Desert Cities will be the first division to deploy the Samsung 3260 and 3270 boxes.

I heard the bugs in the ODN boxes are very minor now. But TWC might be waiting to fix those little bugs before the next ODN update.

However, non of this should be affecting MDN's roll-out to the legacy boxes.

As an MDN box owner, I would still like something definitive from TWC about what that latest version 2.4.6-19 fixes. I think once Nearest Tune comes out for MDN, we should be just about equal in features to ODN. Of course, our big jump ahead for users with MDN that have it (I don't) is ESATA Drive support.

Is ESATA getting ANY better on ODN boxes? I don't have ESATA, but a relative of mine does on his MDN box and it has worked great for three years.

Jack

This box actually has minor bugs that aren't of any major concern. Those bugs for all I know could be ODN quirks. The 2 crucial bugs that worried them are now fixed.

2.4.6-19 has no Nearest tune. You can hide unwanted channels using your favorites. It's an ODN feature. You can press FAV and it only shows your favorites. eSATA is working just fine on this release. Frame control I find annoying. That was added in this release but it's another ODN feature. You press pause and play and then you can control it frame by frame. I personally don't like it but there are some would like it.

I don't use eSATA but it's still terrible. It was fine in ODN v2.4.9_3 but then ODN3 came out and it destroyed it. Not to mention the Samsungs not playing nice with it.

I just want a version of it already. It seems like we will be waiting another year or so before Tivo or Moxi delivers on a PPV/VOD capable box. I'd like to see what Navigator does because SARA is brutal.

I just want a version of it already. It seems like we will be waiting another year or so before Tivo or Moxi delivers on a PPV/VOD capable box.Why exactly do you feel a need for access to cable VOD? TiVo gives you Amazon on demand, with a selection of thousands of SD movies that cable will never equal and a growing selection of HD ones, of better PQ than any cable HD VOD that I've seen (there are also rental downloads from Disney Studios and Jaman). I recently watched HD versions of Benjamin Button and Quantum of Solace on my TiVo as downloaded from Amazon and both transfers were quite decent. You do have to wait for the download to partially complete before playing, but you can start movies downloading from any web browser that you have access to, like your PC at work or on your iPhone.

If you're a Netflix sub, TiVo also offers "instant on" streaming movies from Netflix, with a current library of 15,000+ titles, with a few hundred HD ones. Not a huge amount of recent release stuff, but it's offered at no additional charge to your disc rental plan.

Why exactly do you feel a need for access to cable VOD? TiVo gives you Amazon on demand, with a selection of thousands of SD movies that cable will never equal and a growing selection of HD ones, of better PQ than any cable HD VOD that I've seen. I recently watched HD versions of Benjamin Button and Quantum of Solace on my TiVo as downloaded from Amazon and both transfers were quite decent.

If you're a Netflix sub, TiVo also offers "instant on" streaming movies from Netflix, with a current library of 15,000+ titles, with a few hundred HD ones. Not a huge amount of recent release stuff, but it's offered at no additional charge to your disc rental plan.

Mainly to keep up with HBO VOD stuff, but I could live without it. My main thing is the PPV aspect of it. We generally have Wrestlemania Parties and PPV parties, so that would be a big downside. What's the cost for Amazon streaming video? I would certainly look into Netflix.

Mainly to keep up with HBO VOD stuff, but I could live without it. My main thing is the PPV aspect of it. We generally have Wrestlemania Parties and PPV parties, so that would be a big downside. What's the cost for Amazon streaming video? I would certainly look into Netflix.You can check out Amazon rentals here (http://www.amazon.com/b/?&node=16261631) and Netflix streaming here (http://www.netflix.com/NetflixReadyDevices).

I hadn't thought about live PPV sports events. If you're into those, then the current model TiVo may not be for you. Of course, you could lease a non-DVR box for that and use TiVo for everything else :D.

You can still get PPV with a Tivo but you have to call TWC to order it.

Staten Island customers should be seeing a Navigator pamphlet in this months bill which means it's coming soon.

You can check out Amazon rentals here (http://www.amazon.com/b/?&node=16261631) and Netflix streaming here (http://www.netflix.com/NetflixReadyDevices).

I hadn't thought about live PPV sports events. If you're into those, then the current model TiVo may not be for you. Of course, you could lease a non-DVR box for that and use TiVo for everything else :D.

There's another reason to find cable VOD useful. In my area there are some free HD on demand shows (the name of the channel is HD Showcase On Demand), and some of those shows are actually interesting to me, for example some Sundance uncut uninterrupted movies, as well as some recent TV shows that I may have missed (used to happen either due to a recording conflict, or due to Navigator update rendering all stuff recorded on eSATA useless :mad: ). The picture quality seem to be on par with live HD channels (the transport controls and responsiveness are real bad, but most of the stuff I am interested in is either commercial free or with very limited commercial breaks, so I can live with it). This can be used almost like a third tuner to watch, say, Numb3rs, in HD with a lot less need to skip commercials than the aired version, and for free.

This can be used almost like a third tuner to watch, say, Numb3rs, in HD with a lot less need to skip commercials than the aired version, and for free.To a certain extent, for some shows, Netflix streaming serves the same purpose. Most of the CBS dramas were available in HD on the day after they aired (very handy, since I watch all of the CSI series, NCIS and Numb3rs. I think that there might have been a couple of NBC shows (Heroes was one) that were available that way. I'm not sure that anything on ABC was.

Of course, there are many other TV series available, including ones from ABC, HBO and Showtime (stuff like Dexter, Weeds and Dead Like Me), but not current season, available next day.

You can still get PPV with a Tivo but you have to call TWC to order it.

Staten Island customers should be seeing a Navigator pamphlet in this months bill which means it's coming soon.

Not quite, in some divisions (including here) TWC uses a VOD screen to order some PPV's. Right now, I'll probably hold out and hope we get Navigator by years end. I really want to try it and it will buy time until Tivo releases a Tru2Way capable box.

You might be talking about the Single movie VOD PPV's Ben. Those would be impossible because it is VOD based and relies on some form of return path for playback control.

But live PPV should be possible by just calling time warner and purchasing the event over the phone. After it's purchased and the box/customer is authorized, no more interaction nor a return path are needed.

Though, FWIW, there isn't much PPV stuff on these days aside from actual live events. Movies are now mostly handled by the VOD system (and is actually more economic from a bandwidth point of view when movies don't really need to be live).

Honestly, I don't know. I think Greensboro will be the first SARA to Navigator area.
we were SUPPOSE to get Navigator 2 weeks ago, have'nt heard anything from TWC about it yet. My box did something crazy yesterday where it just restarted on its own around 3:30 in the afternoon and went on a 30 minute booting cycle. I was thinking that it was updating then, but to no avail. Started back up with SARA still on it, dunno what that was all about

Still haven't figured what they "fixed" in MDN version (2.4.6_19 Mt. Sherman),
other than Frame Advance now works and Slow-Motion is REALLY slow....

However, I have found the following NEW bugs:

1. CALLER ID controls were moved from the top MENU list to the next lower SETTINGS list.
However, the programmer forgot to delete the CALLER ID entry from the MENU list, which
now leads to a blank screen. [No big deal, but oh so STUUUPID!!!]

2. Pressing SEARCH ("B" key) resulted in cursor landing conveniently in the A-N entry area.
Now, it still lands in the A-N entry area but a fraction of a second later it will always jump
to the TOP of the Program List (beginning with a dollar sign). The user now has to press
an arrow key to get BACK to the A-N entry area. [Maybe it's insider sabotage....]

I find it astounding that these obvious problems weren't found and corrected as part of
the associated software "fixes".....

IF THIS IS TYPICAL TWC PRACTICE THEY'LL NEVER GET IT ALL WORKING!!!!!

PS: At least my eSATA HDD still works.....

we were SUPPOSE to get Navigator 2 weeks ago, have'nt heard anything from TWC about it yet. My box did something crazy yesterday where it just restarted on its own around 3:30 in the afternoon and went on a 30 minute booting cycle. I was thinking that it was updating then, but to no avail. Started back up with SARA still on it, dunno what that was all about

Last I heard was Navigator was on hold for us for further testing. TWC sent down a new version of Navigator that bricked a bunch of employee boxes. Engineers put launch on hold until they are 100% sure the glitch in the new version of Navigator is fixed.Greensboro is also waiting to receive their supply of the new Samsung boxes. So as usual they tease us then delay delay delay. But if it results in a more stable Navigator guess I can wait a bit longer. WOODY

My box did something crazy yesterday where it just restarted on its own around 3:30 in the afternoon and went on a 30 minute booting cycle. I was thinking that it was updating then, but to no avail. Started back up with SARA still on it, dunno what that was all about

Just a guess, but possibly an update to the lower level firmware/middleware needed to support Navigator.

Still haven't figured what they "fixed" in MDN version (2.4.6_19 Mt. Sherman),
other than Frame Advance now works and Slow-Motion is REALLY slow....

However, I have found the following NEW bugs:

1. CALLER ID controls were moved from the top MENU list to the next lower SETTINGS list.
However, the programmer forgot to delete the CALLER ID entry from the MENU list, which
now leads to a blank screen. [No big deal, but oh so STUUUPID!!!]

2. Pressing SEARCH ("B" key) resulted in cursor landing conveniently in the A-N entry area.
Now, it still lands in the A-N entry area but a fraction of a second later it will always jump
to the TOP of the Program List (beginning with a dollar sign). The user now has to press
an arrow key to get BACK to the A-N entry area. [Maybe it's insider sabotage....]

I find it astounding that these obvious problems weren't found and corrected as part of
the associated software "fixes".....

IF THIS IS TYPICAL TWC PRACTICE THEY'LL NEVER GET IT ALL WORKING!!!!!

PS: At least my eSATA HDD still works.....

If they fixed EVERYTHING in one shot, the MDN programmers would be out of work.:rolleyes:

Abyss,

You're gonna be going back to your "Gatored" cabin....to live! hahahaha. Oh wait, that's not you that's Crazy Woody, right? LOL! Well, hopefully the Gators will be in all of New York soon!

Jack


LOL...Yea you know if my kids were not home on summer vacation i do believe i would lose my sanity waiting for the navigator roll out. I think i have one hair left on my head and i'm saving that for the first day navigator is unleashed in central ny in case the deployment turns into a nightmare ! :rolleyes: ....i want to be one with the gators !!!!

Question does the progression bar come with all the versions of navigator ? I like that if this is the case. To actually know on screen about how far a movie or show has progressed is very helpful.

Still haven't figured what they "fixed" in MDN version (2.4.6_19 Mt. Sherman),
other than Frame Advance now works and Slow-Motion is REALLY slow....

However, I have found the following NEW bugs:

1. CALLER ID controls were moved from the top MENU list to the next lower SETTINGS list.
However, the programmer forgot to delete the CALLER ID entry from the MENU list, which
now leads to a blank screen. [No big deal, but oh so STUUUPID!!!]

2. Pressing SEARCH ("B" key) resulted in cursor landing conveniently in the A-N entry area.
Now, it still lands in the A-N entry area but a fraction of a second later it will always jump
to the TOP of the Program List (beginning with a dollar sign). The user now has to press
an arrow key to get BACK to the A-N entry area. [Maybe it's insider sabotage....]

I find it astounding that these obvious problems weren't found and corrected as part of
the associated software "fixes".....

IF THIS IS TYPICAL TWC PRACTICE THEY'LL NEVER GET IT ALL WORKING!!!!!

PS: At least my eSATA HDD still works.....

A duplicate Caller ID prompt, leading to a blank screen? LOL! Maybe they better fix that with an update of the update before rolling out MDN 2.4.6-19 to more divisions. Do other areas get this Caller ID bug? Let's hope it is just the local engineers smoking something that is not a system-wide thing. I'd currently happy with MDN 2.4.4-15. Maybe we can see why NYC is going with MDN 2.4.4-16.

Newer isn't always better. There doesn't seem to be enough change in the MDN 2.4.6-19 update to justify its release. Sounds like they fixed some bugs, but created new ones as well.

Jack

A duplicate Caller ID prompt, leading to a blank screen? LOL! Maybe they better fix that with an update of the update before rolling out MDN 2.4.6-19 to more divisions. Do other areas get this Caller ID bug? Let's hope it is just the local engineers smoking something that is not a system-wide thing. I'd currently happy with MDN 2.4.4-15. Maybe we can see why NYC is going with MDN 2.4.4-16.

Newer isn't always better. There doesn't seem to be enough change in the MDN 2.4.6-19 update to justify its release. Sounds like they fixed some bugs, but created new ones as well.

Jack

According to my source, the Caller ID menu bug is scheduled to be fixed in MDN 3.0(!). Caller ID in the Access Menu will be a fully supported 3.0 feature. Apparently the menu entry being added to 2.4.6_19 was "unintentional". Caller ID itself is fully functional, but only through the settings menu as in other MDN releases.

August 10th is the scheduled meeting date to decide if 2.4.6_19 will go into general release.

According to my source, the Caller ID menu bug is scheduled to be fixed in MDN 3.0(!). Caller ID in the Access Menu will be a fully supported 3.0 feature. Apparently the menu entry being added to 2.4.6_19 was "unintentional". Caller ID itself is fully functional, but only through the settings menu as in other MDN releases.

August 10th is the scheduled meeting date to decide if 2.4.6_19 will go into general release.

MDN 3.0!!!!!! Can you um.....bribe your source, LOL! and find out how far in the future is that future?!!!

Jack

MDN 3.0!!!!!! Can you um.....bribe your source, LOL! and find out how far in the future is that future?!!!

Jack

Probably not, lol... but I might try.:p

I wonder if the two different versions circulating is the reason for the hold up on us getting the navigator update...central ny division might be shell-shocked by which version they will end up with as far as stability. :confused:

This is the version that could potentially break eSATA. San Diego might get it first but they might just linger on with v2.4.6-19 until the v3.1. ODN might be at a much higher version. Is Charlotte going to get a better ODN version.

Is Charlotte going to get a better ODN version.

I have been told "Yes", but no specifics on version, features, fixes, or date.

San Diego might get the new ODN version but were at v3.1.1_3. Maybe they'll release it alongside the Samsung 3270 DVR's. Supposedly they've fixed the bugs while retaining ODN v3.1.1_3. There are still some minor bugs though. San Diego will probably join Charlotte in regards to deploying this new version.

I wonder if the two different versions circulating is the reason for the hold up on us getting the navigator update...central ny division might be shell-shocked by which version they will end up with as far as stability. :confused:

Let's discuss for the forum,

What do you think TWC should do here?

1.) Release the new MDN 2.4.6-19 with the Caller ID Menu bug thing nationwide?

2.) Release the most stable version available to the divisions for MDN, currently 2.4.4-16 nationwide?

3.) Wait for the release of MDN 3.0 and after the conventional testing, release it, nationwide?

4.) Let the divisions keep their current version of MDN and let them make their own call on future updates?

I'm torn between #2 and #3. for best choices.

Choice #1: Appears that this is not much of an update, and who wants an overt bug with the Caller ID thing?

Choice #4: Is sort of the, "If it's not broken, don't fix it." However, corporate TWC needs to be competitive with updates so a division by division thing may not be possible.

Choice#2: MDN 2.4.4-16 seems to be doing well. I'd nationwide update to that version.

Choice #3 would be great! BUT, we would want to make sure as this will be a big jump in features (When the first number changes, it always is) that it works well.

My recommendation: Deploy MDN 2.4.4-16 nationwide, and leave it at that until MDN 3.0 has had a three month grace period, with little to no problems, than release MDN 3.0.

Jack

___THIS IS TYPICAL TWC PRACTICE, THEY'LL NEVER GET IT ALL WORKING!!!!!


There, I fixed that sentence for you.

I thought you'd been reading this thread from the beginning! :D

Question does the progression bar come with all the versions of navigator ? I like that if this is the case. To actually know on screen about how far a movie or show has progressed is very helpful.

The bar does but that's all. There's no indication where you are within that time apart from a line.

Which is fine if the show is an hour since you can make a best guess at the quarter mark, but if the show is an odd duration or very long than you have no chance since the bar shows the entire duration of the program. Which means on something that's say, 2 hours 41 minutes, then even the half way point on the bar would require math. :D

San Diego might be converting a few analogs to digital. CMT, HSN, C-Span 2, and ShopNBC might go digital to give them a few more SDV channels.

What will probably happen for MDN users is one of the following:

1.) You will get MDN 2.4.6-19. (It would be nice if they would fix the Caller ID Access Menu bug.)

OR

2.) You will get MDN 2.4.4-16 within the next few months

AND

Regardless, of whether you get MDN 2.4.4-16 or MDN 2.4.6-19, this will most likely be the final 2+ version of Navigator until MDN 3.0 comes out.

ODN users can also use my above prediction chart to form similar questions for the new ODN (C-boxes.) However, since I do not have an ODN box, I cannot judge issues for new features or updates.

Jack

With my wife and I watching two separate TVs for 6-10 hours/day,
earlier versions would crash every 1-2 weeks....

MDN 2.4.6-19 is too new to know if they truly improved the reliability...

Last I heard was Navigator was on hold for us for further testing. TWC sent down a new version of Navigator that bricked a bunch of employee boxes. Engineers put launch on hold until they are 100% sure the glitch in the new version of Navigator is fixed.Greensboro is also waiting to receive their supply of the new Samsung boxes. So as usual they tease us then delay delay delay. But if it results in a more stable Navigator guess I can wait a bit longer. WOODY

Yea I'm with you, I'll gladly wait as long as it means a more stable version. I still havent see my bill for this month yet


Just a guess, but possibly an update to the lower level firmware/middleware needed to support Navigator.

oh ok, thanks

My recommendation: Deploy MDN 2.4.4-16 nationwide, and leave it at that until MDN 3.0 has had a three month grace period, with little to no problems, than release MDN 3.0.

Jack

Abso-frakking-lootly.

They did a firmware update quite awhile ago here in central ny ...nothing came of it though ....was hoping it meant navigator was coming soon ....all has been quiet since ! That was at the end of june. I have about given up on time warner with the navigator rollout. Nothing like dangling a perverbial carrot above our heads!:mad:

You can still get PPV with a Tivo but you have to call TWC to order it.

Staten Island customers should be seeing a Navigator pamphlet in this months bill which means it's coming soon.

I'm in upper manhattan and I just my pamphlet today in the mail. I still have a 8300HD, I'm guessing I won't get the update? I dread getting the slow crappy java app in the 8300hdc.

I'm in upper manhattan and I just my pamphlet today in the mail. I still have a 8300HD, I'm guessing I won't get the update? I dread getting the slow crappy java app in the 8300hdc.

The 8300HD doesn't run Java. It runs MDN which is written in C. You'll eventually get it. The Samsung 3090 runs ODN much better.

I'm in upper Manhattan and I just my pamphlet today in the mail. I still have a 8300HD, I'm guessing I won't get the update? I dread getting the slow crappy java app in the 8300hdc.

No,

The pamphlet in the mail applies to all non-C boxes. These run MDN Navigator, and are the boxes associated with the update. If you have MDN, you should begin to write down and/or watch your saved shows if you have a DVR. Make note of your channel settings, Favorite Channels, and so on. You could be "Gatored" at any time.

The 8300HDC boxes are a lot better than in the past. The new Samsung boxes have some minor bugs, but do seem to be faster in a lot of divisions than the MDN boxes. However, the difference varies from division to division and is subtle.

The C-boxes and the new Samsungs run ODN Navigator and are not affected by the MDN download in any way. They are two different operating systems. The ONLY way you will get a Java/ODN box is to have your current MDN/Mystro box exchanged.

Hope this helps!

Jack

They did a firmware update quite awhile ago here in central ny ...nothing came of it though ....was hoping it meant navigator was coming soon ....all has been quiet since ! That was at the end of june. I have about given up on time warner with the navigator rollout. Nothing like dangling a perverbial carrot above our heads!:mad:

Looks like Abyss will be going up to Crazy Woody's cabin and see the Gators there!

You know Abyss, if your sick of waiting, maybe you could get your box swapped for an ODN model. That should have a Gator! Than, you'll have a "Gator" of your own!!!


Jack

You know Abyss, if your sick of waiting, maybe you could get your box swapped for an ODN model. That should have a Gator! Than, you'll have a "Gator" of your own!!!I'm assuming that abyssrules lives in a market where they're using SARA (if he lives somewhere where they're still using Passport, his longing for Navigator is insane--having Navigator shoved down our throats was a woeful day for those of us who had Passport). If so, if he gets an 8300HDC it will likely be running SARA.

Is there any SARA market where they've switched to Navigator yet?

I'm assuming that abyssrules lives in a market where they're using SARA (if he lives somewhere where they're still using Passport, his longing for Navigator is insane--having Navigator shoved down our throats was a woeful day for those of us who had Passport). If so, if he gets an 8300HDC it will likely be running SARA.

Is there any SARA market where they've switched to Navigator yet?

Not yet here Mike. They teased us twice tellng us a rollout was comeing but pulled back twice due to problems the engineers found. Still waiting in Greensboro. WOODY

Still SARA in South Carolina. :(

Let's discuss for the forum, What do you think TWC should do here?
Jack

5) S**t can the entire Navigator infrastructure and start over! They've been working on this POS for over six years and still can't get it close to being right.

I just got back from a few weeks in Comcastic country; the program guide running on the newer non-DVR Moto STBs is lightning fast compared to ODN and *never* crashed on me.

Oh, well, we can always dream :rolleyes: ....

Looks like Abyss will be going up to Crazy Woody's cabin and see the Gators there!

You know Abyss, if your sick of waiting, maybe you could get your box swapped for an ODN model. That should have a Gator! Than, you'll have a "Gator" of your own!!!


Jack

I wish i could do that at my division(the swap thing) ....everytime i ask about the samsung boxes i feel like charlie & grandpa when they stole fizzy lifting drinks and csr's act like willie wonka . They put me on hold ...i'm surprised they don't blow that little horn and then break out in a song and when finished ask me if i'm having fun?:rolleyes:

I wish i could do that at my division(the swap thing) ....everytime i ask about the samsung boxes i feel like Charlie & grandpa when they stole fizzy lifting drinks and csr's act like Willie Wonka . They put me on hold ...I'm surprised they don't blow that little horn and then break out in a song and when finished ask me if i'm having fun?

Hahahahahaha!!!! Willy Wonka!!! I LOVE THAT MOVIE SO MUCH!!!!! Here, let me paraphrase a scene from it with Abyss and the CSR's about Navigator!

CSR head: "I'm extraordinarily busy sir."

Abyss: "But I just wanted to ask about Navigator, you know the program guide being downloaded to all the boxes? Um-mm, when do I get it?"

CSR head: "You don't."

Abyss: "Why not?"

CSR head: "Because you broke the rules."

Abyss: "What rules? I didn't see any rules!"

CSR Head: "WRONG SIR!!! WRONG!!!! UNDER SECTION 13 OF YOUR SUBSCRIPTION CONTRACT SIGNED BY YOU, IT STATES QUITE CLEARLY THAT ALL OFFERS SHALL BECOME NULL AND VOID AND YOU CAN READ IT YOURSELF IN THIS PHOTOSTATIC COPY, I THE UNDERSIGNED AGREE TO FORFEIT ALL PRIVILEGES, LICENSES, ETC. ETC. IMMUNITIES, LIABILITIES, ETC. ETC. SPARADOUS, VERMONDEE, DIS BATAL META COPUM!!!"

"IT'S ALL THERE, BLACK AND WHITE CLEAR AS CRYSTAL.. YOU CALLED OUR CUSTOMER SERVICE CENTER 100 TIMES!, YOU'VE HARASSED OUR TECH SUPPORT PEOPLE WHO NOW HAVE TO BE RETRAINED AND RE-EVALUATED SO YOU GET NOTHING!!! YOU LOSE!!! GOOD DAY!!!!"

Abyss: "Your a crock! You're a a thief and a swindler, HOW CAN YOU DO A THING LIKE THIS??? ADVERTISE NAVIGATOR WITH PROMISED RELEASE DATES, BUILDING UP MY HOPES AND THAN SMASHING ALL MY DREAMS TO PIECES! YOUR AN INHUMAN MONSTER!!!"

CSR head: "I SAID GOOD DAY!!!!!"

(LOL!! Now if only Abyss could give that CSR head an Everlasting Gobstopper!!!! Abyss decides to do that, giving the CSR the candy.)

CSR Head: "Abyss?....... (pause)......My Boy! YOU WON!!!!!"

Abyss: "Navigator?!!!"

CSR head: "Oh yes Navigator, but that's just the beginning!!! Come we have so much time and so little to see, wait, strike that, revere it!"

(Abyss and the CSR head take the Wonkavater! It can go up and down, and back-ways and sideways and square ways and longways and any other ways that you can think of!")

CSR Head: "So what did you think of TWC's factory?"

Abyss: "I think it's the most wonderful place in the whole world!!!!"

CSR Head: "I'm very pleased to hear you say that, because I'm giving it to you!"

Abyss: "Your giving me the........!"

CSR Head: "I can't go on forever, and I really don't want to try, so who can I trust to run the factory, and take care of Navigator, Digital Phone, and Road Runner for me?" Not a grown up, a grown up would want to do things his way not mine, so that's why I decided a long time ago that I had to find a child, a very honest, loving child, one whom I can tell all our cable company secrets!"

Abyss: "So that's why you sent out the Navigator filers?"

CSR Head: "That's right, Abyss! So the cable company's yours! You can move in immediately!"

Abyss: "And my family?"

CSR Head:" Absolutely, the whole family! I want you to bring them all!" (The CSR head and Abyss hug each other)

CSR: "But Abyss, don't forget about the man who suddenly got everything he always wanted."

Abyss: "What happened to him?"

CSR Head: "He lived happily ever after!!!"

Jack

PS. I don't know some of the German phrases above, but I did the best I could, hahaha

LOL.... that's some good stuff ....FUNNY!

I think San Diego will indeed be the very first division to deploy the Samsung 3270 DVR. The 3260 HD non dvr box has been deployed a few weeks ago. The 3270 could be delayed again though.

Hahahahahaha!!!! Willy Wonka!!! I LOVE THAT MOVIE SO MUCH!!!!! Here, let me paraphrase a scene from it with Abyss and the CSR's about Navigator!

CSR head: "I'm extraordinarily busy sir."

Abyss: "But I just wanted to ask about Navigator, you know the program guide being downloaded to all the boxes? Um-mm, when do I get it?"

CSR head: "You don't."

Abyss: "Why not?"

CSR head: "Because you broke the rules."

Abyss: "What rules? I didn't see any rules!"

CSR Head: "WRONG SIR!!! WRONG!!!! UNDER SECTION 13 OF YOUR SUBSCRIPTION CONTRACT SIGNED BY YOU, IT STATES QUITE CLEARLY THAT ALL OFFERS SHALL BECOME NULL AND VOID AND YOU CAN READ IT YOURSELF IN THIS PHOTOSTATIC COPY, I THE UNDERSIGNED AGREE TO FORFEIT ALL PRIVILEGES, LICENSES, ETC. ETC. IMMUNITIES, LIABILITIES, ETC. ETC. SPARADOUS, VERMONDEE, DIS BATAL META COPUM!!!"

"IT'S ALL THERE, BLACK AND WHITE CLEAR AS CRYSTAL.. YOU CALLED OUR CUSTOMER SERVICE CENTER 100 TIMES!, YOU'VE HARASSED OUR TECH SUPPORT PEOPLE WHO NOW HAVE TO BE RETRAINED AND RE-EVALUATED SO YOU GET NOTHING!!! YOU LOSE!!! GOOD DAY!!!!"

Abyss: "Your a crock! You're a a thief and a swindler, HOW CAN YOU DO A THING LIKE THIS??? ADVERTISE NAVIGATOR WITH PROMISED RELEASE DATES, BUILDING UP MY HOPES AND THAN SMASHING ALL MY DREAMS TO PIECES! YOUR AN INHUMAN MONSTER!!!"

CSR head: "I SAID GOOD DAY!!!!!"

(LOL!! Now if only Abyss could give that CSR head an Everlasting Gobstopper!!!! Abyss decides to do that, giving the CSR the candy.)

CSR Head: "Abyss?....... (pause)......My Boy! YOU WON!!!!!"

Abyss: "Navigator?!!!"

CSR head: "Oh yes Navigator, but that's just the beginning!!! Come we have so much time and so little to see, wait, strike that, revere it!"

(Abyss and the CSR head take the Wonkavater! It can go up and down, and back-ways and sideways and square ways and longways and any other ways that you can think of!")

CSR Head: "So what did you think of TWC's factory?"

Abyss: "I think it's the most wonderful place in the whole world!!!!"

CSR Head: "I'm very pleased to hear you say that, because I'm giving it to you!"

Abyss: "Your giving me the........!"

CSR Head: "I can't go on forever, and I really don't want to try, so who can I trust to run the factory, and take care of Navigator, Digital Phone, and Road Runner for me?" Not a grown up, a grown up would want to do things his way not mine, so that's why I decided a long time ago that I had to find a child, a very honest, loving child, one whom I can tell all our cable company secrets!"

Abyss: "So that's why you sent out the Navigator filers?"

CSR Head: "That's right, Abyss! So the cable company's yours! You can move in immediately!"

Abyss: "And my family?"

CSR Head:" Absolutely, the whole family! I want you to bring them all!" (The CSR head and Abyss hug each other)

CSR: "But Abyss, don't forget about the man who suddenly got everything he always wanted."

Abyss: "What happened to him?"

CSR Head: "He lived happily ever after!!!"

Jack

PS. I don't know some of the German phrases above, but I did the best I could, hahaha
LMAO!!!

Hilarious..

The 32xx boxes are newer since they have better specs. The CPU in the 3260/3270 is a BCM7405 instead of the BCM7400 used in the 3090. The 3050 uses an ARM chip by Conexant.

I've noticed something good is back with MDN 2.4.6_19.

I'm on the TWC San Diego system. My power on channel is 1, which used to be a static page of text on what's available. Now, it's a video of what's available on TWC (San Diego) in terms of on demand channels, previews, etc.

But the channel does not buffer... Therefore, when the box is turned off, after a while, the hard disk stops spinning. That's what I used to have with Passport. And that's a good thing - less wear and tear on the disk! :D

I can tell because when I turn the box on, I hear the drive spinning up.

I'll keep you guys updated on the 3270. It might not deploy this week though there is a possibility of it coming out later this week. I think the 3270 should be better than the 3090's running ODN v3.1.0_11. I think they're going to deploy the 3270 with ODN v3.1.1_3.

My CC stopped working about 15 minutes ago and in the diags screen there was an error message about CC and the time it was recorded. They might be updating to a new version of Navigator because earlier today I was getting Guide Data Not Available when I would look for VOD programs in the guide. (I could play the VOD programing through.) I currently have MDN 2.4.4-15.

Jack

I'll keep you guys updated on the 3270. It might not deploy this week though there is a possibility of it coming out later this week. I think the 3270 should be better than the 3090's running ODN v3.1.0_11. I think they're going to deploy the 3270 with ODN v3.1.1_3.
Will the (Federally Mandated) IEEE-1394 (Firewire) port be active.....and WORKING????

I've noticed something good is back with MDN 2.4.6_19.

I'm on the TWC San Diego system. My power on channel is 1, which used to be a static page of text on what's available. Now, it's a video of what's available on TWC (San Diego) in terms of on demand channels, previews, etc.

But the channel does not buffer... Therefore, when the box is turned off, after a while, the hard disk stops spinning. That's what I used to have with Passport. And that's a good thing - less wear and tear on the disk! :D

I can tell because when I turn the box on, I hear the drive spinning up.

I've read that HDs w/MDN do not buffer either tuner when "off" so it seems the drive SHOULD be spinning down without having to do the Passport "trick" of setting both tuners to a non-buffering channel??

I've read that HDs w/MDN do not buffer either tuner when "off" so it seems the drive SHOULD be spinning down without having to do the Passport "trick" of setting both tuners to a non-buffering channel??

I can try it by changing the power on channel back to my old one (a normal local channel). I switched it to channel 1 when I got cut over to Navigator several months ago.

I'll let you know.

Will the (Federally Mandated) IEEE-1394 (Firewire) port be active.....and WORKING????

Firewire is broken. I plugged it into my PC and it detects the 3260 as a smtH3270 but it doesn't have the AV/C front panel driver. If it detected it then it would be ok but I'm not sure if firewire works on this box. Someone else who gets a 3260 should try it and see if it works on a D-VHS player or sth like that.

I can try it by changing the power on channel back to my old one (a normal local channel). I switched it to channel 1 when I got cut over to Navigator several months ago.

I'll let you know.

Cool.. although I should have asked you what box; that COULD mean a big difference.

The real way to see if an MDN box stops buffering channels as I've read is to tune each tuner to a normally buffered channel, then turn it off and try and hear if the drive is still running. And it's also important to know what market this is going on in... got into a long discussion (of the it does, it doesn't variety) about a preference to always spin the drive down when off seemed to be available to 8300HD/Passport users in markets other than mine, but definitely not here.

Since I went from Passport to MDN, obviously I have a legacy box.

Cool.. although I should have asked you what box; that COULD mean a big difference.

The real way to see if an MDN box stops buffering channels as I've read is to tune each tuner to a normally buffered channel, then turn it off and try and hear if the drive is still running. And it's also important to know what market this is going on in... got into a long discussion (of the it does, it doesn't variety) about a preference to always spin the drive down when off seemed to be available to 8300HD/Passport users in markets other than mine, but definitely not here.

I'm in the San Diego,CA area. I had the version of Passport (2.6.002) that you still have, although months earlier as we are a 'test' market for software upgrades. The box I have is the SA8300HD.

My TV, FYI, is a (now) 8 1/2 year old Mitsubishi WS-55807 CRT based widescreen RP unit (a behemoth by today's standards).

My CC stopped working about 15 minutes ago and in the diags screen there was an error message about CC and the time it was recorded. They might be updating to a new version of Navigator because earlier today I was getting Guide Data Not Available when I would look for VOD programs in the guide. (I could play the VOD programing through.) I currently have MDN 2.4.4-15.

Jack

CC came back with an automatic box reboot about 15 hours later.

Jack

I can try it by changing the power on channel back to my old one (a normal local channel). I switched it to channel 1 when I got cut over to Navigator several months ago.

I'll let you know.

Update: I switched my power on channel to my local NBC affiliate (KNSD, on TWC San Diego HD channel 707) and it (hard disk spin down after some time powered off) still works. I've heard it spinning down and when I press the power button, I hear it spinning up.

So, a nice function in Passport to save wear and tear on the hard drive mechanics is once again back for legacy SA8300HD users with this new version (2.4.6_19) of MDN. :cool:

So, a nice function in Passport to save wear and tear on the hard drive mechanics is once again back for legacy SA8300HD users with this new version (2.4.6_19) of MDN. :cool:

Ah, so it was SD where 8300HD+Passport could spin down the drives! Same hard & software in my market, BUT no such option... I have to set both tuners to a non-buffering channel to get the drive to spin down.

Now I think I'm going to be the very last NYC TWC customer to get MDNed...

Ah, so it was SD where 8300HD+Passport could spin down the drives! ...PASSPORT used to spin down the HHD after some 2-3 hour time-out in Kansas City as well. Never bothered to measure accurately (and left before the NAVIGATOR roll-out).

v/r,
C-F

I have a question. On SARA you have a option that lets you record off the dvr to a vcr or a dvr recorder. I use this feature quite a bit. Does Navigator have this feature or some sort of work around. WOODY

PASSPORT used to spin down the HHD after some 2-3 hour time-out in Kansas City as well. Never bothered to measure accurately (and left before the NAVIGATOR roll-out).

v/r,
C-F

Just goers to show that even with the same hardware/software, different divisions can have "their" boxes do different things. Nothing like that here, if I leave both tuners set to buffering channels, in the morning, the drive is still ticking, by the next evening I'd have an hour's worth (last hour buffered) of buffer still on both tuners.

I have a question. On SARA you have a option that lets you record off the dvr to a vcr or a dvr recorder. I use this feature quite a bit. Does Navigator have this feature or some sort of work around. WOODY

I have the S-Video out of the box connected to my Panasonic DVR and can dump recordings from the box HDD to the DVR HDD for subsequent burning to DVD. If that's what you are asking, then yes, this has worked on both my 8300HDC and the Samsung running ODN. But there is no "feature" in the box for this... I just hit play on the box and record on the DVR and I get a recording. I have also recorded live programming in this manner as well.

If you are asking if the box can be programmed to automatically change channels for unnattended recording on an external device... not on the DVR models. All the reminder function does is pop up a reminder... it does not change the channel. Non-DVR versions may be different... if I remembr correctly my Pioneer/MDN box could do that, but I never actually used it.

So, both myself and a friend of mine were Navigatored yesterday in Manhattan on SA8300HD's. We both have the same a/v receiver also and the same connections (component for video and digital for audio, both to the receiver). We also both have the same external drives and enclosures. His upgrade went fine.

Mine, on the other hand didn't. It went into the loop of boot, converting settings/recordings, boot, converting settings/recordings, boot, converting settings/recordings, and so on. I let it go all day while I was at work.

After calling TWC and them telling me there's nothing I can do but get a new box I first powered down, unplugged the eSata drive and tried again. No luck, it got stuck in the same loop.

Reading here, on a whim, I also unplugged the audio and video outputs. Low and behold I noticed on the box front it went from 480i to 1080i and when I plugged it back in I had picture and sound. Feeling cocky I powered down, plugged the eSata back in. It came back up, asked about the external drive and all my recordings were there and playable. yipeeee!!!! The only problem was that a couple of the recording were titled as "Unknown" although they play fine.

I have no idea why this worked but I'm not complaining. I guess the moral of the story is to have patience and play around with some different scenarios.

It's slower than passport for sure. I miss the extra level of FF speed but not all that much and the series recording is a bit of a pain for shows that seem to have multiple airings marked NEW. But, I don't hate it so far.

...the series recording is a bit of a pain for shows that seem to have multiple airings marked NEW.

What did you find to be a problem? If it behaves similarly to ODN, I find this to be one of the better features of Navigator. It will not record multiple copies of the same episode even if they are all marked as NEW, but it will use the secondary showings as backup if the premiere showing is in conflict with another show. Just make sure that you set a lower priority for shows known to repeat (cable) than those that don't (broadcast) and all should be taken care of quite nicely.

What did you find to be a problem? If it behaves similarly to ODN, I find this to be one of the better features of Navigator. It will not record multiple copies of the same episode even if they are all marked as NEW, but it will use the secondary showings as backup if the premiere showing is in conflict with another show. Just make sure that you set a lower priority for shows known to repeat (cable) than those that don't (broadcast) and all should be taken care of quite nicely.

Thanks for the reply. It made me think perhaps it is a holdover from the conversion process. For instance, I had recorded Entourage last Sunday pre-conversion and it was still on the DVR. But, it picked up the Series recording and had the same episode set to record again Thursday night. I set the series recording to New Only and only at 10:30pm but both Sunday's and Thursday's shows were 10:30pm. I guess I should try it as just New only, any showing and see what happens with only episodes recorded after the conversion.

I have the S-Video out of the box connected to my Panasonic DVR and can dump recordings from the box HDD to the DVR HDD for subsequent burning to DVD. If that's what you are asking, then yes, this has worked on both my 8300HDC and the Samsung running ODN. But there is no "feature" in the box for this... I just hit play on the box and record on the DVR and I get a recording. I have also recorded live programming in this manner as well.

If you are asking if the box can be programmed to automatically change channels for unnattended recording on an external device... not on the DVR models. All the reminder function does is pop up a reminder... it does not change the channel. Non-DVR versions may be different... if I remembr correctly my Pioneer/MDN box could do that, but I never actually used it.
Thanks, On SARA you only have to press the record in the options box to VCR or DVD recorder button if you have one, and the recordings will auto off load as long as your dvr or vcr recorder is set to record. I belive Tivo has this feature also not sure about Passport. It is a very useful feature.
WOODY

Thanks, On SARA you only have to press the record in the options box to VCR or DVD recorder button if you have one, and the recordings will auto off load as long as your dvr or vcr recorder is set to record. I belive Tivo has this feature also not sure about Passport. It is a very useful feature.
WOODYPassport didn't have it back when I was using it. TiVo will add a little title page to the beginning of the recording.

Thanks for the reply. It made me think perhaps it is a holdover from the conversion process. For instance, I had recorded Entourage last Sunday pre-conversion and it was still on the DVR. But, it picked up the Series recording and had the same episode set to record again Thursday night. I set the series recording to New Only and only at 10:30pm but both Sunday's and Thursday's shows were 10:30pm. I guess I should try it as just New only, any showing and see what happens with only episodes recorded after the conversion.

It may very well be part of the conversion process. Correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding is that currently scheduled shows are carried over, but series recording setup is not. If one of your recordings was a carryover single show recording, and you added the show to the series as well, I believe it WILL attempt to record both.

I would suggest you cancel anything that carried over and just set up the series recording from scratch and see how it behaves.

Using the series recording features, I have never had to resort to using the specific time slot setting. Setting the priorities correctly is the key to getting what you want... and keep in mind that every new series you define is initially set to priority 1... you will need to set the priority as a separate step.

It may very well be part of the conversion process. Correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding is that currently scheduled shows are carried over, but series recording setup is not. If one of your recordings was a carryover single show recording, and you added the show to the series as well, I believe it WILL attempt to record both.

I would suggest you cancel anything that carried over and just set up the series recording from scratch and see how it behaves.

Using the series recording features, I have never had to resort to using the specific time slot setting. Setting the priorities correctly is the key to getting what you want... and keep in mind that every new series you define is initially set to priority 1... you will need to set the priority as a separate step.

My series recordings definitely moved over but I think you're right. It's probably worth it to delete them all and add them all again from scratch and get the priorities right.

It may very well be part of the conversion process. Correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding is that currently scheduled shows are carried over, but series recording setup is not. If one of your recordings was a carryover single show recording, and you added the show to the series as well, I believe it WILL attempt to record both.

I would suggest you cancel anything that carried over and just set up the series recording from scratch and see how it behaves.

Using the series recording features, I have never had to resort to using the specific time slot setting. Setting the priorities correctly is the key to getting what you want... and keep in mind that every new series you define is initially set to priority 1... you will need to set the priority as a separate step.

The GENERAL GUIDELINE on the Navigator transfer is:

INDIVIDUAL RECORDINGS-Should carry over.

SERIES RECORDINGS-Should carry over IF, and this is a big IF. The new Navigator guide system is able to find AT LEAST ONE instance of the series recording after the transition process. (Exactly how far ahead it looks, I do not know.)

If Navigator does NOT find an instance of a series recording, the old series recordings WILL NOT TRANSFER. This is not a bug, but the way the current system is set up.

To be on the safe side, after the Navigator transition is complete you should delete your old series recordings in Series Manager and reprogram them using the new software. I understand that Series Priority is now available on BOTH MDN/ODN boxes so you should be able to follow the prompts in the Series Manager accordingly. However, keep in mind, that I don't use Series Manager, recording everything individually.

Unless you change Series Priority in Series Manager, it is my understanding that the newest shows entered get first priority. Nice that Navigator is now smart to look for instances of a repeated series episode and automatically set a new time, if there is a time conflict when the series was first scheduled.

Jack

I tried searching but couldn't find anything. Did they ever fix slumpey826's problem with the box always defaulting to hdmi for audio. I know he got a different samsung box, but is there a fix for the scientific atlanta?

I take it that's a no...

Ah, so it was SD where 8300HD+Passport could spin down the drives! Same hard & software in my market, BUT no such option... I have to set both tuners to a non-buffering channel to get the drive to spin down.

Now I think I'm going to be the very last NYC TWC customer to get MDNed...

Did you get a current flier or phone call Riverside? If it was like me, you'll probably get a Navigator brochure saying it's coming three days after it's been installed! hahaha.

Jack

What did you find to be a problem? If it behaves similarly to ODN, I find this to be one of the better features of Navigator. It will not record multiple copies of the same episode even if they are all marked as NEW, but it will use the secondary showings as backup if the premiere showing is in conflict with another show. Just make sure that you set a lower priority for shows known to repeat (cable) than those that don't (broadcast) and all should be taken care of quite nicely.

BUT, all shows listed as "to be recorded" tend too get factored into whether or not the box needs to delete recorded shows to make room for the new recording. So it is POSSIBLE you may have some stuff deleted to make room for those multiple "to be recorded" shows.

Which makes me think of another question... Passport has always been very good at noting what is going on without indicating space percentages. It will put up very obvious notations that recorded shows will get deleted in 2 days... that seems to be the threshold. Does MDN do the same?

Correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding is that currently scheduled shows are carried over, but series recording setup is not.

My understanding is that IF a series recording has an actual show to record, the series recording will transfer. If no show is scheduled, the series recording gets dropped. Thus, series recordings for network shows (that run in the Sept.-May time framed) will trend too all get dropped.

Did you get a current flier or phone call Riverside? If it was like me, you'll probably get a Navigator brochure saying it's coming three days after it's been installed! hahaha.

Jack

Got the brochure last week. Far as I can tell, I'm just about the only AVS participant in NYC who has NOT yet gotten MDNed. So it's been
"any day now" for the past 2 weeks, which is turning out to be a pain in my toucus.

Even worse, someone in NYC has just this week gotten a 3090 with a 320G drive in it. Of COURSE I'd swap my 8300HD for such a box... but I can also foresee a lot of hassle to be able to get a 320G box. I mean, where is it written that it's OK to randomly hand out far more capable hardware? I smell a DOITT complaint coming on... I (and most others) will be paying the same price for less capable equipment...

BUT, all shows listed as "to be recorded" tend too get factored into whether or not the box needs to delete recorded shows to make room for the new recording. So it is POSSIBLE you may have some stuff deleted to make room for those multiple "to be recorded" shows.

Which makes me think of another question... Passport has always been very good at noting what is going on without indicating space percentages. It will put up very obvious notations that recorded shows will get deleted in 2 days... that seems to be the threshold. Does MDN do the same?

The Scheduled Recordings List only shows the first occurrence of a "New" program... it doesn't get clogged up with multiple showings. It may be disconcerting at first (until you see it actually work), but if you have three scheduled shows in the same time slot, it WILL list it as a conflict and show the lowest priority show as a broken recording. DON'T TRY TO FIX THE CONFLICT! If you set your priorities correctly AND the lowest priority show has additional showings, once the initial conflict is over it will automatically add the next showing of the bumped show onto the schedule. Of course, if you have a conflict between three non-repeating major network shows, it can't do much for those and you will lose one.

I try to keep up with my watching of recorded shows, so I have never run into a bumped recording. However, my friend with MDN does run near 100% full all the time and it does show what is in danger of being bumped.

...where is it written that it's OK to randomly hand out far more capable hardware? I smell a DOITT complaint coming on... I (and most others) will be paying the same price for less capable equipment...

I understand the sentiment, but if newer more capable equipment could not be slipstreamed into the mix, everybody would still have one of the original mid-'90's vintage digital STBs.

Still waiting for Navigator. Spoke to my local TWC office today. They admitted that a minor bug caught before the launch that bricked a few boxes turned into a medium bug that has not been resolved yet.The Division President has put Navigator on hold until the enginneers are sure the bug has been fixed.Only a few more weeks delay I was told. Ummm here we go again. WOODY

Still waiting for Navigator. Spoke to my local TWC office today. They admitted that a minor bug caught before the launch that bricked a few boxes turned into a medium bug that has not been resolved yet.The Division President has put Navigator on hold until the engineers are sure the bug has been fixed.Only a few more weeks delay I was told. Ummm here we go again. WOODY

Back to the cabin for CW! LOL! And this time he's leaving with a note to family and friends:

"Dear Family and Friends,

I'm sick of waiting for Navigator here and will be at the cabin until it is installed to our box at home! Don't call me till that happens."

Woody

Well, I succesfully transplanted a Seagate Pipeline 320GB drive into my 3090. Could not have been easier... and all is well so far.

Well, I transplanted a Seagate Pipeline 320GB drive into my Sammy. All is well so far.

Wow, things are looking up. Someone in my market got a 320G Sammie and someone else had one of the CSRs at the TWC center actually say they would be getting boxes with the bigger HDD next week.

Seems one can read the label on the HDD without opening the box, so you can visually tell what it is. Of course, it sure looks like it may be 100% dumb luck if you get a 320!

What I'm curious about is exactly what sort of security thing did you encounter. I've seen some pretty dumb ones in the past, things like a sticker one can get off and re-attached without too much trouble. Then I read about Apple filing patents on things that are clearly meant to allow them to refuse warranty coverage (like the moisture strip they now use so they can refuse saying you "dropped it in water") because they have a record in an electronic sensor in the unit saying it was dropped/shaken.

Wow, things are looking up. Someone in my market got a 320G Sammie and someone else had one of the CSRs at the TWC center actually say they would be getting boxes with the bigger HDD next week.

Seems one can read the label on the HDD without opening the box, so you can visually tell what it is. Of course, it sure looks like it may be 100% dumb luck if you get a 320!

What I'm curious about is exactly what sort of security thing did you encounter. I've seen some pretty dumb ones in the past, things like a sticker one can get off and re-attached without too much trouble. Then I read about Apple filing patents on things that are clearly meant to allow them to refuse warranty coverage (like the moisture strip they now use so they can refuse saying you "dropped it in water") because they have a record in an electronic sensor in the unit saying it was dropped/shaken.

All I ran across was the T10 security Torx screws (http://www.amazon.com/pc-Torx-Driver-Security-Bit/dp/B0002SPLQ8)on the case (with the pin in the center). Those are so readily available that they don't even qualify as security screws anymore. Nothing else.

The whole drive swap process took no more than three minutes. The box booted right back up, automatically formatted the drive and was 100% normal. Way less hassles than farting around with eSATA. BTW... the drive was $55 shipped (http://www.nowdirect.com/exec/partInfo/part_detail.tsb?prcpart=SGDST3320310CS&categoryid=59) and is same drive that Samsung uses as OEM..

Impressive. Now I'm waiting to see if someone is brave enough to try an even bigger drive.

Impressive. Now I'm waiting to see if someone is brave enough to try an even bigger drive.

The 500GB drive was only a few bucks more, too!

The 500GB drive was only a few bucks more, too!

There have been posts claiming that because Samsung will only supply a 3090 with "up to 320G HDD" that may be the limit for 3090s. What I'm noticing is that except for one or two reports, most folks in the US have no luck at an internal drive swap, while MANY Canadians have done internal drive swaps.

One guy from SD is talking about a 3270, but nobody has one and you can NOT find anything about it from Samsung. He says it'as "newer and better" with no idea of what is new or better. He seems to have some info that SD may be deploying this box at some future date. IF there really is a upper drive size limitation, maybe that box can take a larger than 320G drive?

I recall one other poster who said he did the swap in a 3090, but he hasn't posted anything since. As we KNOW many things can be market specific, it would not surprise me a whole lot if this couldn't happen in NYC.

Complicating things further, someone DID get a 320G from the factory 3090 in NYC last week. Somone also posted a supervisor at one of the TWC storefronts actually said they expect top get more "larger hard drive" models in next week.

There have been posts claiming that because Samsung will only supply a 3090 with "up to 320G HDD" that may be the limit for 3090s. What I'm noticing is that except for one or two reports, most folks in the US have no luck at an internal drive swap, while MANY Canadians have done internal drive swaps.

One guy from SD is talking about a 3270, but nobody has one and you can NOT find anything about it from Samsung. He says it'as "newer and better" with no idea of what is new or better. He seems to have some info that SD may be deploying this box at some future date. IF there really is a upper drive size limitation, maybe that box can take a larger than 320G drive?

I recall one other poster who said he did the swap in a 3090, but he hasn't posted anything since. As we KNOW many things can be market specific, it would not surprise me a whole lot if this couldn't happen in NYC.

Complicating things further, someone DID get a 320G from the factory 3090 in NYC last week. Somone also posted a supervisor at one of the TWC storefronts actually said they expect top get more "larger hard drive" models in next week.

I stuck with the OEM model 320GB drive specifically because of it being a completely supported drive and capacity for internal use. eSATA seems to be a complete waste of time and money on ODN boxes, and the 320GB Seagate Pipeline was cheap and easy to swap.

That said... it might be interesting to try the Seagate Pipeline drive on the eSATA port, being thet it is a supported drive for internal use, and other brands/models/capacities have failed on internal swaps just as often as they fail on eSATA. I don't believe that I have seen any reports of anybody trying the Seagate Pipeline drives on the 3090's eSATA port. The drive controllers for internal and external drives are probably the same.

Still waiting for Navigator. Spoke to my local TWC office today. They admitted that a minor bug caught before the launch that bricked a few boxes turned into a medium bug that has not been resolved yet.The Division President has put Navigator on hold until the enginneers are sure the bug has been fixed.Only a few more weeks delay I was told. Ummm here we go again. WOODY
Dear lord.....are they trying to give us a brand new version that has not been tested and no one else has??

And I still havent seen my bill yet...have you??

since it's all quiet on the news front ... I encountered another Nav flaw.

The box will not recognize Psych as a series so I have to manually record it each week. Since there's still no user record option I can't even set it to a recurring event.

Even my VCR will let me set up a recurring record timer. :rolleyes:

Sounds like the guide data is borked in your area or some other non-Navi flaw. I've never had a problem setting up Psych as a series here in NEO.

Which makes me think of another question... Passport has always been very good at noting what is going on without indicating space percentages. It will put up very obvious notations that recorded shows will get deleted in 2 days... that seems to be the threshold. Does MDN do the same?

It will tell you, but it isn't obvious. You have to press info when the warning icon appears and it will list time to deletion in the lower right of the screen.

Being that it's Navigator we are talking about - which can't do anything in straightforward way - it displays it in hours instead of days and hours. Which means math gets involved when you start seeing things like "will delete in about 74 hours."

Anything that involves mental calculation from the user is a design flaw in my book.

Especially when I'm the user. :D

Sounds like the guide data is borked in your area or some other non-Navi flaw. I've never had a problem setting up Psych as a series here in NEO.

It's definitely a Nav flaw. Not the fact the guide info is screwed (that's TWC for you), but the fact I can't compensate for the fact the guide data is screwed with a basic user option.

since it's all quiet on the news front ... I encountered another Nav flaw.

The box will not recognize Psych as a series so I have to manually record it each week. Since there's still no user record option I can't even set it to a recurring event.

Even my VCR will let me set up a recurring record timer. :rolleyes:

I just checked, and I CAN record the series for Psych, but for the last 2 years, I haven't been able to record a series for the Royals games (don't ask why I want to...)

Prior to Navigator, I could record a series, and it would record every game, but since the conversion, I have had to manually record all games, which is a major pain since there are about 5 games a week on TV.

I don't know if this is a guide data issue or a Navigator data issue, or both, but it's very frustrating!

I see nyc continues to get gatored ...they get you yet riverside ? I feel for you . I think we might be right around the corner. I don't know what's more sickening the wait for navigator or all of this heat here in central ny.

Riverside got gatored !!!! Now he's going to be a twc customer with a pretty new pet !

As part of the NYC 'gatoring', I am a happy camper. I think that the conversion, largely, went well. There were a few spectacular failures, but most of us got transferred from Passport to Navigator without incident. For me, all my previously recorded shows were transferred, including the external HD, and all my series recording setups were transferred, including those with no immediate shows to record.

There was one systemic gotcha. The Navigator default for the number of episodes to keep is 7, so for example, if you had 10 episodes saved under Passport, when you got converted 3 of those 10 got deleted.

Also, with the new MDN Navigator, external drives work fine.

Hurray.

-barry

Good to hear Margoba, should make things that much easier for our division when we get deployed here then....i know several of the csr's have said testing to there best of knowledge is going rather smooth. When deployment does happen i shouldn't lose any recordings if based on your findings about having more then 7 default recordings because i have like 3 on there now.... couple of 2 guilty pleasure titles...SASQUATCH GANG....REAL GENIUS...AT THE MOVIES !!!!!

There have been posts claiming that because Samsung will only supply a 3090 with "up to 320G HDD" that may be the limit for 3090s. What I'm noticing is that except for one or two reports, most folks in the US have no luck at an internal drive swap, while MANY Canadians have done internal drive swaps.

One guy from SD is talking about a 3270, but nobody has one and you can NOT find anything about it from Samsung. He says it'as "newer and better" with no idea of what is new or better. He seems to have some info that SD may be deploying this box at some future date. IF there really is a upper drive size limitation, maybe that box can take a larger than 320G drive?

I recall one other poster who said he did the swap in a 3090, but he hasn't posted anything since. As we KNOW many things can be market specific, it would not surprise me a whole lot if this couldn't happen in NYC.

Complicating things further, someone DID get a 320G from the factory 3090 in NYC last week. Somone also posted a supervisor at one of the TWC storefronts actually said they expect top get more "larger hard drive" models in next week.

The 3090 has a BCM7400 while the 3270 has a BCM7405. The 3270 is just an enhanced 3090 while the 3260 is a non DVR version of the 3270.

Good to hear Margoba, should make things that much easier for our division when we get deployed here then....i know several of the csr's have said testing to there best of knowledge is going rather smooth. When deployment does happen i shouldn't lose any recordings if based on your findings about having more then 7 default recordings because i have like 3 on there now.... couple of 2 guilty pleasure titles...SASQUATCH GANG....REAL GENIUS...AT THE MOVIES !!!!!

If you really are worried about it, just unplug the coax each night when (if) the notice is sent out. You can check in here in the morning to see if anyone else had a major malfunction before plugging in again.

At least that way you'll be able to watch the most essential recordings before the update occurs.

Sounds good vision !!! Have to try it !!!! ;)

Sounds good vision !!! Have to try it !!!! ;)

It definitely works because I did it. I held back for three days after N-Day before plugging it back in.

Of course if you need to record something new or rely just on the DVR for live viewing, then the idea has some major drawbacks.

Everyone!

If you are having Navigator problems, Digital Phone problems, Road Runner problems. Navigator box is rebooting too much, picture freezes or blips out from time to time, you keep losing your Internet connection. If any of these things are happening to you, or a combination of them, CALL TIME WARNER AND REQUEST THAT AN IN-HOUSE TECHNICIAN (NOT AN INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR) be sent to your home to check the signal strength line and replace the line if necessary. Have them check inside wiring too!

Our TWC Digital Phone was dropping calls and our Navigator box was rebooting several times a week, and our Internet Connection would sometimes drop off. We called specifically for the phone drop off problem, and a great tech found out that the fiber-optic cable from our drop-pole was sending out a signal coming into our house that was too strong! He replaced the fiber optic cable and also had another tech come out to adjust the proper voltage on the line and...........WOW!

EVERYTHING is better!!!! My Internet is much more reliable, my Navigator box seems to be faster, (no reboots for several days!) and the Digital Phone is clearer than before! So before they just come out clueless and replace your box, like that's gonna solve the world's problems, or have them do stuff to your computer or phone, or whatever, do what I did. Say you want your fiber optic line and signals checked by an in-house tech, and if necessarily the lines replaced.

Signal strength is critical to system performance. I just had to share that with all of you! If you are living in dwellings with lines that are 10, 20, 30 years old and are having problems, get TWC to check out the signal strength on them. (Inside the home and on the drop-pole.) Good lines and signals mean the potential for a better signal with everything you have!

Jack

how do i get my SA8300HD DVR to shut down the hard drives when the box is off? I have the box in my room and while it's a good 10 feet from my head, i can still hear it when i try to sleep.

This is good advice. Both times I had signal issues an actual tech was dispatched. I actually had the same tech twice and he was very helpful and had the issue fixed properly. I have not had any significant Internet, Phone or Video issues since.

Now compared to the dope contractor that they sent to do my Digital Phone install (it was before they allowed for self installs), the difference was night and day. I had to end up repairing the contractors work!

how do i get my SA8300HD DVR to shut down the hard drives when the box is off? I have the box in my room and while it's a good 10 feet from my head, i can still hear it when i try to sleep.

I just got MDNed yesterday and so far it seems to follow what I have read. MDN "does away with" most of the functionality in the 2 buffers we had with Passport. When one shuts the box down, no buffering goes on, so the drive should be silent.

I can easily hear the telltale ticking of the drive, but just for fun I just went and checked... the box is off and dead silent.

Hi guys I am still alive. Due to the constant delays in my division I have been lurking more than takeing part in active discussion. Just got back from our beach cabin where I enjoyed Navigator., Now I am back with my faithful but dull SARA. Hope soon I will gatored and can discuss Navigator.I'm still arround just parked in neutral and waiting. WOODY

That's the mode i have pretty well been into woody as of late...It's all you really can due at this point. I do believe your division is more on the ball then ours so don't fret there's always " the cabin " aka the mystro shack ...lol ! Hell if i had to i would summon the dead just to get navigator here !!!! :D

Also note that the drive will spin up and start if the internal drive software determines it needs to defrag the unit. That is out of your control. You can tell it's doing the defrag operation by the constant chattering of the drive head.

Hi guys I am still alive. Due to the constant delays in my division I have been lurking more than takeing part in active discussion. Just got back from our beach cabin where I enjoyed Navigator., Now I am back with my faithful but dull SARA. Hope soon I will gatored and can discuss Navigator.I'm still arround just parked in neutral and waiting. WOODY

Uh Woody could you PRETTY PLEASE take back the weather you are streaming up north?

Also note that the drive will spin up and start if the internal drive software determines it needs to defrag the unit. That is out of your control. You can tell it's doing the defrag operation by the constant chattering of the drive head.

Must be something that comes from Cisco in firmware, given the state of the TWC software I'd seriously doubt if any of their 3 "programmers" have any clue what "defragging" actually is.

Yes I understand that the Mystro I just got may bne light years better than 2 years ago, but as a previously software development professional, what I see I would never deliver to market, in terms of features but especially in terms of execution.

Yes I understand that the Mystro I just got may bne light years better than 2 years ago, but as a previously software development professional, what I see I would never deliver to market, in terms of features but especially in terms of execution.Sounds like you're just as bitter after "being 'gatored" as most former Passport Echo users are :D.

Sounds like you're just as bitter after "being 'gatored" as most former Passport Echo users are :D.

Yeah, I really tried to go into it with an open mind, even though it sounds like I didn't. I tried to indicate the more serious stuff... notice I never get into the whole "I don't like the colors" thing?

It's not like we don't pay pretty dearly for this stuff. Nor is it after 3 years we should expect a whole lot better. The thing that really get to me is the actually hard stuff, like recording 2 streams and decoding another seem to work pretty well (and I bet ya none were created by anyone actually associated with TWC) but the most simple of things, one a pretty swift high school student could accomplish, are so wrong.

I'm getting the "but it's the data" (the whole marking every instance as NEW is the most egregious issue) as if that's not TWC fault. Bloody hell, it sure as **** is. I have done the data thing professionally... we had data coming from an internal system that needed to feed a large web-based catalog. I spent a week or two carefully analyzing the raw data, and came up with a series of corrections, all of which I "programmed" into of all things a freeware application. Once set, I had them first deliver the data to me (we did this weekly), then I ran my application to clean and then sent it on to a drop box at our web farm. Bingo, much better data on the web exposed catalog all from a 5 minute process I ran every week (a funny aside... I was running OS 9 on a Mac and I asked my programmer to whip up a Perl script to do all the steps I had established... then we ran my utility against his Perl script running on a honking Sun box... AND my little app beat it... not by much, but it did finish first in three runs). That kept me going for a good 6-9 months before the IT guys could get the same corrections performed before they sent data to us.

I'm getting the "but it's the data" (the whole marking every instance as NEW is the most egregious issue) as if that's not TWC fault. Bloody hell, it sure as **** is. I have done the data thing professionally... we had data coming from an internal system that needed to feed a large web-based catalog. I spent a week or two carefully analyzing the raw data, and came up with a series of corrections, all of which I "programmed" into of all things a freeware application. Once set, I had them first deliver the data to me (we did this weekly), then I ran my application to clean and then sent it on to a drop box at our web farm. Bingo, much better data on the web exposed catalog all from a 5 minute process I ran every week (a funny aside... I was running OS 9 on a Mac and I asked my programmer to whip up a Perl script to do all the steps I had established... then we ran my utility against his Perl script running on a honking Sun box... AND my little app beat it... not by much, but it did finish first in three runs). That kept me going for a good 6-9 months before the IT guys could get the same corrections performed before they sent data to us.

I would bet that the marking of secondary showings within the premiere week as NEW was a completeley conscious decision, as it actually adds functionality to Navigator - one of its BEST features, actually. It will NOT record (or even schedule) the program twice, but it allows the box to pick up a secondary showing automatically in the case of conflicts, preemptions, etc. This is a good... GREAT, actually, feature of Navigator once you understand how it works.

Some features are, no doubt, missing from Navigator - manual scheduling would seem to be the biggest ommission to me - but just because something is different than what you are used to doesn't mean its bad. Don't think that I am calling you out, because that is a natural thing for folks to do... but some things may take a bit of time to get used to and you may be surprised that they can actually be improvements.

I would bet that the marking of secondary showings within the premiere week as NEW was a completeley conscious decision, as it actually adds functionality to Navigator - one of its BEST features, actually. It will NOT record (or even schedule) the program twice, but it allows the box to pick up a secondary showing automatically in the case of conflicts, preemptions, etc. This is a good... GREAT, actually, feature of Navigator once you understand how it works.

This feature you describe seems to take a few days (probably a week) to "settle in" and start working properly. It doesn't seem to work right on newly converted boxes.

Another point: The designation of "NEW" for multiple copies of a new show is also useful for people without DVR's; people who make manual decisions as to what to watch and what to skip.

Probably the best solution is to have a three-way system of identifying shows: say "Premiere Episode", "NEW", and "Repeat" (or just no designation). Some marketing type could probably come up with better words than I did, but the normalization would allow software (and people) to better deal with how to schedule shows.

-barry

Now that more people have Gators, I want to rephrase this question and comment as well:

1.) In Navigator, as far as scheduling is concerned, do we have more recent research as to what defines a program as "NEW" and how long does it stay "NEW?" No one from TWC seems to have straight answers for this question. A hypothesis that was generated by a consensus of the board six months ago was that "NEW" episodes stay "NEW" for approximately 24-48 hours on the guide after appearing. Now has this changed, and how?

2.) Passport offered a LIVE Sports Category, which was one of its best features. After Keyword Search and Manual Recording are added, Navigator needs a LIVE Sports Search. Maybe in the future a LIVE anything program search, but at this point, we are putting the cart before the horse. Navigator needs to have a way to clearly differentiate what and how long "NEW" lasts before they add something called a "LIVE" feature.

3.) I am certain that TV Guide Data is still being used by Navigator, indicated by the TV Guide logo. Often times series recordings are wrong, and this was often the case I found with Passport as well. Who controls TV Guide Listings and how often are they updated? Passport did have more advanced program descriptions. Navigator's program descriptions often look truncated as if they were done through an IM Program or Twitter! If TWC wanted an in-house guide that they could control so as not to pay outside licensing residuals, why are they still using TV Guide data?

Jack

I have checked closely (at least on the cable programs that I regularly record such as Burn Notice, Dexter, The Closer and In Plain Sight) and the NEW designation stays with the episode for either a full week or until the next NEW episode premieres (whichever comes first).

In Navigator, as far as scheduling is concerned, do we have more recent research as to what defines a program as "NEW" and how long does it stay "NEW?" No one from TWC seems to have straight answers for this question. A hypothesis that was generated by a consensus of the board six months ago was that "NEW" episodes stay "NEW" for approximately 24-48 hours on the guide after appearing. Now has this changed, and how?

This feature you describe seems to take a few days (probably a week) to "settle in" and start working properly. It doesn't seem to work right on newly converted boxes.

I have not experienced a DVR conversion (I had a non-DVR box when we transitioned from Passport to Navigator), but I believe that this is correct. I have reformatted my drive once and more recently swapped it for a 320GB drive. In both cases the series manager itself remained intact but the recording log was lost (apparently stored on the hard drive). I believe that this feature greatly depends on the recording log and if it is lost or does not yet exist does not function 100% correctly.

I can see how this would certainly effect the initial impressions that newly converted folks might have... but once it settles down it works wonderfully well.

I just got MDNed yesterday and so far it seems to follow what I have read. MDN "does away with" most of the functionality in the 2 buffers we had with Passport. When one shuts the box down, no buffering goes on, so the drive should be silent.

I can easily hear the telltale ticking of the drive, but just for fun I just went and checked... the box is off and dead silent.

what do you mean by "got MDNed"? All this started happening after my interface was switched from the older version to this new "Mystro" crap

what do you mean by "got MDNed"? All this started happening after my interface was switched from the older version to this new "Mystro" crap

MDN is an acronym for "Mystro Digital Navigator." This is what is downloaded to older boxes. The newer boxes that you get run a different version called ODN, which stands for "OCAP Digital Navigator."

Jack

MDN is an acronym for "Mystro Digital Navigator." This is what is downloaded to older boxes. The newer boxes that you get run a different version called ODN, which stands for "OCAP Digital Navigator."

Jack
On the subject of 'older' versus 'newer' boxes: I started a couple years ago with TWC and received an 8300HDC box. I recently (3 months ago) upgraded a second box to HD and they gave me an 8240HDC box. Normal model numbers would dictate that I got an older box, but I haven't seen much anywhere about this model. Can someone tell me whether I got handed an old junker they had lying around or is this in fact the new stuff? And do I want it if it is actually newer?
Thanks!

On the subject of 'older' versus 'newer' boxes: I started a couple years ago with TWC and received an 8300HDC box. I recently (3 months ago) upgraded a second box to HD and they gave me an 8240HDC box. Normal model numbers would dictate that I got an older box, but I haven't seen much anywhere about this model. Can someone tell me whether I got handed an old junker they had lying around or is this in fact the new stuff? And do I want it if it is actually newer?
Thanks!

The 8240HDC and 8300HDC are of equal vintage and are identical except that the 8240 does not have an analog tuner. It just means that your system has 100% digital simulcast in place and no longer needs the analog tuner. Since the 8300 is probably channel-mapped to display the digital simulcasts as well, there is no difference between the two in practical terms.

The only newer vintage DVR boxes in the TWC stable are the Samsung 3090 (widely deployed) and 3270 (not yet deployed beyond test sites, AFAIK). The Samsungs run ODN faster than the 8240/8300, have 320GB drive option (sporadically deployed by TWC) and have 16:9 internal graphics capabilities (not yet used by TWC other than to stretch the same guide used in the SA boxes), but they are still a little buggy with the currently available ODN versions being used.

jcalabria: Thanks for the info! On a related note, I tried to add an eSata drive to my 8240 without success. It recognized the drive, asked me to format it, and then the used % dropped way down. It appeared to work fine. However, when I hit the record button nothing happens. I check the Recording Log and see "not recorded because the channel is not available (2)". If I disconnect the external drive and reboot everything works fine again.
I haven't tried moving the external drive to the 8300 so it's possible that there's a problem with the hard drive itself.
Any thoughts?

jcalabria: Thanks for the info! On a related note, I tried to add an eSata drive to my 8240 without success. It recognized the drive, asked me to format it, and then the used % dropped way down. It appeared to work fine. However, when I hit the record button nothing happens. I check the Recording Log and see "not recorded because the channel is not available (2)". If I disconnect the external drive and reboot everything works fine again.
I haven't tried moving the external drive to the 8300 so it's possible that there's a problem with the hard drive itself.
Any thoughts?

Unfortunately, your experience is typical of virtually all attempts to use eSATA on ODN boxes.

Unfortunately, your experience is typical of virtually all attempts to use eSATA on ODN boxes.
Well that's disappointing. So it's likely I wouldn't see any different result on the 8300, assuming they are both running ODN?

Well that's disappointing. So it's likely I wouldn't see any different result on the 8300, assuming they are both running ODN?

8300 would be the same.

So far, eSATA on the Samsung has not been successful, either. However, you might luck out and end up with a 320GB version, and a few of us have succesfully upgraded the internal drive from 160 to 320 using the same model drive that would have been factory installed.

Thank you for the info, you have been very informative!

I would bet that the marking of secondary showings within the premiere week as NEW was a completeley conscious decision, as it actually adds functionality to Navigator - one of its BEST features, actually. It will NOT record (or even schedule) the program twice, but it allows the box to pick up a secondary showing automatically in the case of conflicts, preemptions, etc. This is a good... GREAT, actually, feature of Navigator once you understand how it works.

Some features are, no doubt, missing from Navigator - manual scheduling would seem to be the biggest ommission to me - but just because something is different than what you are used to doesn't mean its bad. Don't think that I am calling you out, because that is a natural thing for folks to do... but some things may take a bit of time to get used to and you may be surprised that they can actually be improvements.

Spent a ton of time last night trying to sort it out better. Looks like it's only 4 shows this happens with, Entourage, Hung, Weeds and Nurse Jackie. Sorry but I do not buy that this is some "feature."

We have very limited HD recording ability with the puny drives they give us, plus the whole "supporting external drives" lack of support. It's almost like they do not want us having the ability to time-shift as much as we'd like (aside from the fact that many folks view it as an archiving method, which is COULD be if we all had the choice of using what size drive we want). We also know that deleting recorded shows happens when the next few days potential recordings will put one way over the limit. So there's a great potential that this "feature" could cause the loss of recorded shows without much actual warning.

Here's one very likely scenario... I have to be somewhere on a Sunday, so I want to record both the Giants and the Jets games. Allowing for overtime as is sometimes needed, that's over half the capacity of the drive. Ooops, there's a lot of duplicate shows also scheduled for the next 2 days, so it deletes x number of current recordings.

And if this "feature" as some think ever extends to more cable shows with multiple listings, imagine what could happen?

As for the whole issue of conflicts, it used to be easy, straightforward and most importantly QUICK for me to solve the occasional issue. I see a conflict, boom I go to the guide, get to the show, hit search, boom I se al instances, boom I schedule a later one. 2 minutes or less. It looks like I now have to spend a ton of time (it took about 40 minutes to sort out the issues with those 4 shows, part of it was going day by day is a TON slower than it used to be, part of it was deleting old series that had sub show times listed, part of it was general screw ups, like I try and re-do the series recording, it adds 2, one for HBO and for HBOLat, delete HBOLat, it deleted HBO as well, redo AGAIN, crap like that).

Things that cause me to have to spend a LOT more time managing things to me is a bug, not a feature. AND part to it is that I am very heavily invested in series recordings... so to someone who is not, they don't get it. Of course, another solution is to cancel all series recordings and schedule everything manually.

I hope you understand... and it also could very well be a host of somewhat minor things we lost when we went from real even if flawed software like Passport to this pathetic excuse for software they've already had 2-3 years to get functioning that is annoying me. And YES, I do know and understand that many have had a far worse time then I am now having!

Oh, one more thing... NONE of the multiple recordings happened because of any conflicts with the REAL first broadcast.

This feature you describe seems to take a few days (probably a week) to "settle in" and start working properly. It doesn't seem to work right on newly converted boxes.

-barry

Oh boy, I sure hope this is the case!

I have checked closely (at least on the cable programs that I regularly record such as Burn Notice, Dexter, The Closer and In Plain Sight) and the NEW designation stays with the episode for either a full week or until the next NEW episode premieres (whichever comes first).

Now that IS odd as I see NO issues with those shows having multiple recordings scheduled. I'm now hoping Barry comment turns out to be true!

I can see how this would certainly effect the initial impressions that newly converted folks might have... but once it settles down it works wonderfully well.

All I can say is I sure HOPE that's the case. Even so, there still remain a host of smallish things where we have had for years certain features that are now probably lost forever.

On the subject of 'older' versus 'newer' boxes: I started a couple years ago with TWC and received an 8300HDC box. I recently (3 months ago) upgraded a second box to HD and they gave me an 8240HDC box. Normal model numbers would dictate that I got an older box, but I haven't seen much anywhere about this model. Can someone tell me whether I got handed an old junker they had lying around or is this in fact the new stuff? And do I want it if it is actually newer?
Thanks!The Explorer 8240HDC is the 8300HDC without an analog tuner or the analog-to-digital video encoding chips necessary for recording analog on a DVR; omitting these components reduces the cost of the box a bit. Once a cable provider has a full digital simulcast of its analog tiers up, they can use these less expensive boxes and the corresponding non-DVR STBs.

I totally fail to understand the correlation you are trying to make between marking multiple showings as NEW and drive capacity. Navigator DOES NOT schedule and record multiple showings. It has absolutely no effect on scheduling upcoming deletions. Once again... it will only schedule and record the first NEW listing it finds. If it records that successfully, it never schedules or records another. ONLY if it does not record a show due to conflict will it schedule and record the next showing.

What difference does the guide listing having the word "NEW" in it have to do with using your drive capacity? Is it just that you do believe that it will not schedule or record multiple instances of "NEW" shows... or is there some other concern you have that I have not been able to discern from your posts?

Spent a ton of time last night trying to sort it out better. Looks like it's only 4 shows this happens with, Entourage, Hung, Weeds and Nurse Jackie. Sorry but I do not buy that this is some "feature."

We have very limited HD recording ability with the puny drives they give us, plus the whole "supporting external drives" lack of support. It's almost like they do not want us having the ability to time-shift as much as we'd like (aside from the fact that many folks view it as an archiving method, which is COULD be if we all had the choice of using what size drive we want). We also know that deleting recorded shows happens when the next few days potential recordings will put one way over the limit. So there's a great potential that this "feature" could cause the loss of recorded shows without much actual warning.

Here's one very likely scenario... I have to be somewhere on a Sunday, so I want to record both the Giants and the Jets games. Allowing for overtime as is sometimes needed, that's over half the capacity of the drive. Ooops, there's a lot of duplicate shows also scheduled for the next 2 days, so it deletes x number of current recordings.

And if this "feature" as some think ever extends to more cable shows with multiple listings, imagine what could happen?

I can only conclude that the Navigator lightbulb has not yet illuminated for you. What you describe doing for resoving conflicts in Passport is EXACTLY what Navigator does TOTALLY AUTOMATICALLY for you. You should not need to spend a single second resolving that type of conflict with Navigator.

It seems that you are trying to make it harder than it is. The series manager works exceptionally well once you understand it and allow it to do its job. I believe if I was experiencing the reverse transition... Navigator > Passport... I would be quite pissed if I had to do what you described doing in Passport to resolve conflicts.


As for the whole issue of conflicts, it used to be easy, straightforward and most importantly QUICK for me to solve the occasional issue. I see a conflict, boom I go to the guide, get to the show, hit search, boom I se al instances, boom I schedule a later one. 2 minutes or less. It looks like I now have to spend a ton of time (it took about 40 minutes to sort out the issues with those 4 shows, part of it was going day by day is a TON slower than it used to be, part of it was deleting old series that had sub show times listed, part of it was general screw ups, like I try and re-do the series recording, it adds 2, one for HBO and for HBOLat, delete HBOLat, it deleted HBO as well, redo AGAIN, crap like that).

Things that cause me to have to spend a LOT more time managing things to me is a bug, not a feature. AND part to it is that I am very heavily invested in series recordings... so to someone who is not, they don't get it. Of course, another solution is to cancel all series recordings and schedule everything manually.

Navigator DOES NOT schedule and record multiple showings. It has absolutely no effect on scheduling upcoming deletions. Once again... it will only schedule and record the first NEW listing it finds. If it records that successfully, it never schedules or records another. ONLY if it does not record a show due to conflict will it schedule and record the next showing.

What difference does the guide listing having the word "NEW" in it have to do with using your drive capacity? Is it just that you do believe that it will not schedule or record multiple instances of "NEW" shows... or is there some other concern you have that I have not been able to discern from your posts?

Uh, the point I was making is that that this exactly what it did... I had to delete 18 instances (of those 4 shows) of the same episode being repeated in the scheduled recordings list. That amounts to half the capacity of the drive. I had cleaned out the drive so I only had 12% occupied, but if it had been 3/4 full, previously recorded stuff would be deleted (obviously unless I had all of them designated "do not erase"). More explanation I can't give.

Uh, the point I was making is that that this exactly what it did... I had to delete 18 instances (of those 4 shows) of the same episode being repeated in the scheduled recordings list. That amounts to half the capacity of the drive. I had cleaned out the drive so I only had 12% occupied, but if it had been 3/4 full, previously recorded stuff would be deleted (obviously unless I had all of them designated "do not erase"). More explanation I can't give.

That should NOT happen and almost certainly is a post conversion artifact. You can rightfully be upset that these conversion anomalies have not been ironed out, but don't be so quick to assume that it is normal for Navigator to behave this way. I have only seen multiple recordings scheduled on rare occasion... and it was always immediately after a drive swap or reformat or, even more rarely, during the first week after a new series is added. It just does not work that way normally in Navigator.


Two things I would suggest:

Most importantly... let it run at least a week so that the recording log is populated with Navigator sourced info.
If that doesn't work... delete and recreate your series from scratch - no telling what might have been screwed up in the conversion.

Uh, the point I was making is that that this exactly what it did... I had to delete 18 instances (of those 4 shows) of the same episode being repeated in the scheduled recordings list. That amounts to half the capacity of the drive. I had cleaned out the drive so I only had 12% occupied, but if it had been 3/4 full, previously recorded stuff would be deleted (obviously unless I had all of them designated "do not erase"). More explanation I can't give.

Use the series priority feature in the series manager, Set the cable shows to a lower priority that should solve the problem. WOODY

Use the series priority feature in the series manager, Set the cable shows to a lower priority that should solve the problem. WOODY

He definitely needs to do that, but that should have no bearing on his multiple scheduled recordings. That is a conversion artifact that should straighten out within a week or so. The priority setting only effects which shows are bumped when a conflict arises... obviously you want the lowest priority given to those shows that have multiple NEW showings, so that they can be rescheduled post-conflict rather than bumping a one-time airing network show.

I had the same problem the first week after conversion to Navigator. It totally cleared itself up day by day. As each day passed I wouldn't have the problem with shows on that day anymore. Its definitely a conversion issue.

Once the first week has now passed and I've set single run shows to a higher priority than multiple run shows Navigator has correctly resolved all conflicts without me having to do anything.

yep, the way it works for me is if i have a series conflict. in the scheduled list it will show a broken recording symbol indication that its at conflict. but it may not have actually scheduled the next "new" rerun yet. if i just leave it alone it will eventually schedule it and record it. happens a lot for me on discovery channel, a&e and such. never had an instance where it didnt fix itself.
sometimes in the scheduled list it will show the first run and also the rerun as scheduled. if i leave that alone eventually the first run will change to a conflict.
i can only recall once where it recorded multiple instances of the same show.

Exactly my experience, guys. Gotta get past the conversion, learning curve & trust issues... once you do the series manager works quite well with little-to-no manual conflict resolution required.

I had the same problem the first week after conversion to Navigator. It totally cleared itself up day by day. As each day passed I wouldn't have the problem with shows on that day anymore. Its definitely a conversion issue.

Once the first week has now passed and I've set single run shows to a higher priority than multiple run shows Navigator has correctly resolved all conflicts without me having to do anything.

yep, the way it works for me is if i have a series conflict. in the scheduled list it will show a broken recording symbol indication that its at conflict. but it may not have actually scheduled the next "new" rerun yet. if i just leave it alone it will eventually schedule it and record it. happens a lot for me on discovery channel, a&e and such. never had an instance where it didnt fix itself.
sometimes in the scheduled list it will show the first run and also the rerun as scheduled. if i leave that alone eventually the first run will change to a conflict.
i can only recall once where it recorded multiple instances of the same show.

There is one annoying problem with the MDN 2.4.6_19 now on my box, has to do with the frame-by-frame function. More than once I pause something, than press the fast-forward button to get to where I want.

With the older MDN version(s), the FF would resume. With this new version, pressing FF after pause engages the frame-by-frame function (I wonder why nothing is moving).

I find I have to first press the play button, and only then will the FF resume when I press it.

It's not a major problem (or is it?), but I do find it annoying.

On the subject of 'older' versus 'newer' boxes: I started a couple years ago with TWC and received an 8300HDC box. I recently (3 months ago) upgraded a second box to HD and they gave me an 8240HDC box. Normal model numbers would dictate that I got an older box, but I haven't seen much anywhere about this model. Can someone tell me whether I got handed an old junker they had lying around or is this in fact the new stuff? And do I want it if it is actually newer?
Thanks!

And "older" usually means 8300HD (gets MDN) versus 8300HDC (cable card version gets ODN and generally loses external HD support). /Dan

Uh, the point I was making is that that this exactly what it did... I had to delete 18 instances (of those 4 shows) of the same episode being repeated in the scheduled recordings list. That amounts to half the capacity of the drive. I had cleaned out the drive so I only had 12% occupied, but if it had been 3/4 full, previously recorded stuff would be deleted (obviously unless I had all of them designated "do not erase"). More explanation I can't give.

Did it list all 18 at once or did it just keep adding it to the schedule each time you deleted an instance for a total of 18 times?

That should NOT happen and almost certainly is a post conversion artifact. You can rightfully be upset that these conversion anomalies have not been ironed out, but don't be so quick to assume that it is normal for Navigator to behave this way. I have only seen multiple recordings scheduled on rare occasion... and it was always immediately after a drive swap or reformat or, even more rarely, during the first week after a new series is added. It just does not work that way normally in Navigator.


Two things I would suggest:

Most importantly... let it run at least a week so that the recording log is populated with Navigator sourced info.
If that doesn't work... delete and recreate your series from scratch - no telling what might have been screwed up in the conversion.


Ah, makes a kinda sense... indeed I could be (probably was) jumping the gun too much!

Yup I know one thing that did get screwed up in the conversion. When you set up a series recording, it's usually when the first show is really NEW. So the time choice always was the time for the initial showing. When I was running around trying to set series to that time to avoid the dupes, I noticed al of them had times that were for the re-broadcast. Which meant I had to delete that series, go back, find the real in initial episode, then re-do the series and set for that time only.

And this is also part of what's behind my "pathetic" comments about the software in general. In a series recording we should be able to change the the time, the day AND the channel, all to anything value we may want, even incorrect ones!. None of this is rocket science, we're not talking about a tricky bit of programming needed...

He definitely needs to do that, but that should have no bearing on his multiple scheduled recordings. That is a conversion artifact that should straighten out within a week or so. The priority setting only effects which shows are bumped when a conflict arises... obviously you want the lowest priority given to those shows that have multiple NEW showings, so that they can be rescheduled post-conflict rather than bumping a one-time airing network show.

Except I have never had any real issue with the very few instances of a conflict with multiple series recordings. My pattern was always to see a conflict and decide what to do... 99 times out of 100 it entailed moving the recording of a series show on cable before one on a broadcast network (that typically did not re-air). I also will always record a show with commercials before a show without.

Even so, with the ton of time I spent on Sunday nights, I did set possible broadcast shows to higher priority than cable shows.

There is one annoying problem with the MDN 2.4.6_19 now on my box, has to do with the frame-by-frame function. More than once I pause something, than press the fast-forward button to get to where I want.

With the older MDN version(s), the FF would resume. With this new version, pressing FF after pause engages the frame-by-frame function (I wonder why nothing is moving).

I find I have to first press the play button, and only then will the FF resume when I press it.

It's not a major problem (or is it?), but I do find it annoying.

Actually, one thing MDN does better than Passport is the ability to simply hit the play button to go into slo-mo. It was a double tap in Passport BUT it only worked with one very specific timing, so it always took me two or three cracks to get it going.

Along those lines, I can't seem to find the right key for the supposed 10 minute skip ahead in MDN???

Did it list all 18 at once or did it just keep adding it to the schedule each time you deleted an instance for a total of 18 times?

No... most stayed deleted, but I think a few extra ones did seem to crop up. The smart move was getting the amount of recorded shows down to almost nothing before the conversion. I'm pretty convinced this is why some folks lost a lot of previously recorded stuff, they got stuck with a lot of multiple recordings, had a fairly full HDD so things got deleted to make way for new recordings.

And stuff I saw last night is 100% inline with what jcalabria has advised... doesn't seem to be quite so active listing multiple recordings. I even did a box reboot and things seemed normal (normal for TWC/MDN which is still 10,000 miles away from what SHOULD be normal!).

Along those lines, I can't seem to find the right key for the supposed 10 minute skip ahead in MDN???

Press and hold the FF key for ~5 seconds... it will jump to the next 15 minute multiple in the program (not 15 minutes from where you are). Soooo, in an hour show you can use this to jump to the 0:15, 0:30 & 0:45 minute points in the show. Also, (at least on ODN), you cannot continue to hold it for multiple jumps... you have to release the FF button and do it again.

There is one annoying problem with the MDN 2.4.6_19 now on my box, has to do with the frame-by-frame function. More than once I pause something, than press the fast-forward button to get to where I want.

With the older MDN version(s), the FF would resume. With this new version, pressing FF after pause engages the frame-by-frame function (I wonder why nothing is moving).

I find I have to first press the play button, and only then will the FF resume when I press it.

It's not a major problem (or is it?), but I do find it annoying.

That's a "feature", not a bug, lol.

I was playing with MDN 2.4.6_19 at my friend's home in Charlotte last night. They were (finally) updated night before last (no more garrish blue on blue - although they claim they hate the new colors - go figure). The frame advance actually works multiple times, unlike my version of ODN. In the ODN version that I have (3.1.0_11 on a Sammy 3090), the FF key will only advance one frame and that's it... multiple presses beyond that have no effect/action whatsoever.

That reminds me... does anyone have issues with the channel change buttons when you have a PIP window open? Used to be that press and hold would eventually go into speed mode, but on MDN it's one at a time, so you have to press and hold to get to the next channel, release, then press and hold again. AND each press and hold seems to need 1-3 full seconds to actually change the channel...

Press and hold the FF key for ~5 seconds... it will jump to the next 15 minute multiple in the program (not 15 minutes from where you are). Soooo, in an hour show you can use this to jump to the 0:15, 0:30 & 0:45 minute points in the show. Also, (at least on ODN), you cannot continue to hold it for multiple jumps... you have to release the FF button and do it again.
MDN you can keep jumping without releasing the button. But (I need to check this fully), at least for live buffer, mine jumps 15 minutes in time and not to 15 minute "marks". I need to verify recordings. /Dan
MDN 2.4.4-16

One thing I just found out and don't think has been covered here is that if you press select on the box or the remote during the mystro 'countdown' boot sequence, it will change to display more verbose boot messages on screen.

One thing I just found out and don't think has been covered here is that if you press select on the box or the remote during the mystro 'countdown' boot sequence, it will change to display more verbose boot messages on screen.

Hadn't heard that one, thanks!

However, since my Sammy will not boot with HDMI connected to my Onkyo receiver (I either have to disconnect cable or turn the AVR off), I'd have to recable to view them.:(

Dear All:

I have had the 8300HD for 2-3 years roughly, and the new software was forced on it/me around a week ago. Thus far, i don't like it at all. Very few pluses and i lost the ability to channel surf on the front tuner while the back tuner continues to buffer: SO SO SO very convenient, it's like two "eyes" constantly going and you can go back to whichever of the two programs without "penalty" and not lose any part as you can rewind.

May I ask how i find out what new software i have? people have talked about this software and that software - i have no idea what i have other than i know that i have a DIFFERENT and NEWER software "pushed" and "forced" upon me. I'd appreciate knowing how to go about finding out so i can be more in sync with you all. Thx in advance!

Folks have been mentioning the availability of some new Samsung DVR at Time Warner 23rd Street. May i know what model of if there's a link to what is actually available so i can read up on it first? is it really "better" than my current 8300HD? I've had this 8300HD for quite some time, maybe over 2 or 3 years even!

Thx in advance.

PS: any other models at 23rd street Time Warner besides the Samsung that's worth getting? How does one go about finding out what is available at 23rd street? unplugging everything and lugging my 8300HD to 23rd street, only to find out that they don't have whatever it is that i want "in stock", i.e. the Samsung, should it be the "better" and superior model, would be a major bummer as i'd have to come back to plug everything back in and then go through this process to 23rd street again "blindly" (as in not knowing what they have in stock at any particular time). How many times would one have to go to get a newer model/brand dvr?

If you have an 8300HD you were just sent the MDN version of TWC's own Navigator software.

It's one more step, but... you can continue to buffer the back channel if you merely hit the record button before you send it to the back. The elimination of auto buffering was most likely done to accomodate systems using SDV (which yours is not, but the software is common across many TWC systems). Eliminating buffering of likely to be unwatched channels frees up bandwidth in the pool of channels available for switched video services.

The Samsung SMT-H3090 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1152474) runs the ODN version of Navigator, which operates very much like your new MDN software except it was designed for newer OCAP/tru2way boxes such as the 8300HDC and the Samsung. The Samsung runs ODN a bit faster than an HDC does and you might be lucky and pick up one of the rare 320GB drive versions... but for the most part it will not operate much differently than your 8300HD. Just my opinion but... the few quirks unique to the Samsing box are worth putting up with just so that I don't have to look at a fugly SA box sitting on my equipment shelves.

If you have an external drive connected to your 8300, then you need to hold on to it... the ODN boxes so far have not supported eSATA.

Dear All:

I have had the 8300HD for 2-3 years roughly, and the new software was forced on it/me around a week ago. Thus far, i don't like it at all. Very few pluses and i lost the ability to channel surf on the front tuner while the back tuner continues to buffer: SO SO SO very convenient, it's like two "eyes" constantly going and you can go back to whichever of the two programs without "penalty" and not lose any part as you can rewind.

May I ask how i find out what new software i have? people have talked about this software and that software - i have no idea what i have other than i know that i have a DIFFERENT and NEWER software "pushed" and "forced" upon me. I'd appreciate knowing how to go about finding out so i can be more in sync with you all. Thx in advance!

Folks have been mentioning the availability of some new Samsung DVR at Time Warner 23rd Street. May i know what model of if there's a link to what is actually available so i can read up on it first? is it really "better" than my current 8300HD? I've had this 8300HD for quite some time, maybe over 2 or 3 years even!

Thx in advance.

PS: any other models at 23rd street Time Warner besides the Samsung that's worth getting? How does one go about finding out what is available at 23rd street? unplugging everything and lugging my 8300HD to 23rd street, only to find out that they don't have whatever it is that i want "in stock", i.e. the Samsung, should it be the "better" and superior model, would be a major bummer as i'd have to come back to plug everything back in and then go through this process to 23rd street again "blindly" (as in not knowing what they have in stock at any particular time). How many times would one have to go to get a newer model/brand dvr?

If you have an 8300HD you were just sent the MDN version of TWC's own Navigator software.

It's one more step, but... you can continue to buffer the back channel if you merely hit the record button before you send it to the back. The elimination of auto buffering was most likely done to accomodate systems using SDV (which yours is not, but the software is common across many TWC systems). Eliminating buffering of likely to be unwatched channels frees up bandwidth in the pool of channels available for switched video services.

The Samsung SMT-H3090 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1152474) runs the ODN version of Navigator, which operates very much like your new MDN software except it was designed for newer OCAP/tru2way boxes such as the 8300HDC and the Samsung. The Samsung runs ODN a bit faster than an HDC does and you might be lucky and pick up one of the rare 320GB drive versions... but for the most part it will not operate much differently than your 8300HD. Just my opinion but... the few quirks unique to the Samsing box are worth putting up with just so that I don't have to look at a fugly SA box sitting on my equipment shelves.

If you have an external drive connected to your 8300, then you need to hold on to it... the ODN boxes so far have not supported eSATA.

thx for the great info.

may i ask what MDN means and what it is?

what is "systems using SDV"?

what is: OCAP/tru2way boxes?

so sorry to ask newbie questions. thx for putting up with so many questions in advance.

when i go to 23rd street time warner, what do i do? do i ask for and hope for a Samsung box? is there a way to find out if they have them or not? even if they do not have the 320GB models, are you implying that they may then have smaller GB models of Samsung? so they are otherwise the same other than their hard drive sizes?

what DOWNSIDES would i feel like i'm getting if i were to go from my 8300HD to a Samsung? my concern is instability or other strange things that i'm not aware of, and having to run to 23rd street Time Warner on numerous occasions only to see if they have the Samsung. Each time i go, i'd have to unplug everything in my 8300HD and lug it up to 23rd street! is that what all of the good folks here have been doing? i wonder how often they have the Samsung dvr's in stock?

i recall that for a while in the past, whenever a new dvr came out, SO many people were so unhappy with the poor stability problems that it was almost way better to keep the older boxes!!

again, thx in advance for answering my newbie questions.

No... most stayed deleted, but I think a few extra ones did seem to crop up. The smart move was getting the amount of recorded shows down to almost nothing before the conversion. I'm pretty convinced this is why some folks lost a lot of previously recorded stuff, they got stuck with a lot of multiple recordings, had a fairly full HDD so things got deleted to make way for new recordings.


If you delete an instance of a scheduled series recording before the box records it (say you choose to watch it live that week instead) then Nav goes into an endless cycle where it will then schedule the next "new" instance. Delete that and it will schedule the next one etc. etc.

It will keep going until it either runs out of "new" episodes to schedule or it has some evidence that it was recorded on the hard drive. Even if its just a few seconds.

thx for the great info.

may i ask what MDN means and what it is?

what is "systems using SDV"?

what is: OCAP/tru2way boxes?

so sorry to ask newbie questions. thx for putting up with so many questions in advance.

Use the search thread tool up there. ^^^

may i ask what MDN means and what it is?

what is "systems using SDV"?

what is: OCAP/tru2way boxes?

Use the search thread tool up there. ^^^It has been discussed many times and in many threads. Here are two quick search results ;)

Originally Posted by xnappo
MDN stands for Mystro Digital Navigator. It is the C++ version of Navigator. It runs on non-cable card versions of SA boxes (8xxxHD). ODN is OCAP Digital Navigator. It is the Java version of Navigator and runs on the HDC (cable card) boxes.

Originally posted by UnnDunn
Tru2way is the brand for a standardized stack of technologies companies can implement to provide full access to all Digital Cable TV services in the US. QAM for tuning, TCP/IP for data, MPEG2 or MPEG4 for video, CableCARD for conditional access and OCAP (OpenCable Application Platform) powering the software that sits on top and controls it all.

OCAP is the application layer which forms part of the Tru2way stack. So stuff like the EPG, On-Demand browser, DVR management interface and so on will utilize OCAP to communicate with all the lower-level stuff that actually does the work.

The newest "traditional" cable boxes (eg. from Samsung, Motorola, Cisco, Pace, et al.) all support OCAP, and Navigator is an OCAP application suite. So Navigator can run on any OCAP box on any OCAP headend, no matter who supplied the headend or the box. In fact, all of the newest cable boxes support the entire Tru2way stack, and if they wanted to, the box manufacturers could put Tru2way branding on them and sell them at retail.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17012795#post17012795

MDN=Mystro Digital Navigator, software developed by TWC (et. al.) to run on older boxes.
ODN=OCAP Digital Navigator, software developed to run on newer (2007), CableCARD boxes.

OCAP is a software architecture being deployed by nearly all cable systems which will
allow essentially ANY "tru2way" (e.g. OCAP) device to be interactive with the cable headend,
so that they can download the tru2way Interactive Program Guide, GRAPHIC Guide Data,
and interact with various new features (e.g. Blu-Ray quality movie download, on-line
contest & opinion voting, order a pizza, request news/weather/traffic updates, ad nauseum).
The JAVA software architecture in the IPG permits third party software development,
so by next year expect to hear "I've got an app for that......"

The cable companies are REQUIRED to support a certain percentage of OCAP type boxes
in order to "share the pain" of software development/debug....which will be followed by
the next generation of tru2way devices at your local retailer, including simple cable boxes,
iDVRs, iPCs and iHDTVs (some with DVR built-in). For most people who keep a device
more than a couple years, it will be cheaper to own than pay monthly box rentals.
For owners of expensive iPCs and iHDTVs, it will be easy to move from one cable
system to another and retain the simplicity of ONE REMOTE DOES IT ALL.

Panasonic and Samsung are already selling iHDTVs in a couple test markets.
More markets MAY see new tru2way equipment at BestBuy for Xmas,
although next year may be when it finally comes to fruition....
BTW: The next generation HD-DVR's with MPEG4 IPTV and Multi-Room (MoCA)
are still behind schedule within the cable companies....retailers won't jump until
the bugs are worked out on these new boxes (e.g. Samsung, Panasonic, ADB, et al.)

===========================================
SDV=Switched Digital Video, a fairly new technology that (for selected channels), only places
it on the local cable loop to your home when YOU request it. Means a LOT more HD & SD channels
can be carried, since groups of digital QAM channel positions only carry what users want.
Many channels are NOT carried via SDV, either due to likely being "always requested"
(e.g. ESPN) so why bother, or as a favor to users with CableCARD (DCR) DTVs....

SDV is NOT compatible with DCR (Digital Cable Ready) DTVs, as indicated in TWC's legal notices.
Cable companies developed an external "SDV Tuning Adapter" for use with TiVo HD-DVRs.
MDN, ODN and a very small number of older (prototype) software versions support SDV.
Unfortunately, most Motorola cable boxes (and/or headend software) don't support SDV....yet...

Q: Do all of the new Samsung cable boxes still require (undocumented) access to
Diagnostics pages to enable Dolby 5.1 (AC3) on the HDMI interface???
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16360153

Q: Do all of the new Samsung cable boxes still require (undocumented) access to
Diagnostics pages to enable Dolby 5.1 (AC3) on the HDMI interface???
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16360153

The 3090 does. Not sure about the 3260/3270... maybe hdtvfan2005 can let us know about his 3260.

I believe it does have AC3 over HDMI. The 3260 isn't hooked up to an HDTV so I can't figure that out. It's very similar to the 3090 in the diag menus. The 3260 and the 3270 both use the same software and components so it should be there. Maybe I should buy a new TV in that room.

Still waiting on the 3270. Of course there will be some minor bugs so it won't be bug free. It might have those stupid little bugs but the major ones which usually cause problems have been eliminated.

There is a new 3260 quirk. If you leave it off for several hours it might show a blank screen. If you go up a channel then back to that channel the video works fine. It's been a pretty bug free experience. It does do some weird things but it's stable enough. If was a buggy POS then TWC San Diego wouldn't have deployed it.

The 3090 does. Not sure about the 3260/3270... maybe hdtvfan2005 can let us know about his 3260.

The 3260 and 3270 boxes have much more ram and better CPU than the 3090. not much faster CPU wise than the 3090.

I'm not sure if the 3260 has working Firewire though. Windows detected it as a smtH3270 which is likely since it shares components with that model. However, I don't have a driver for the AV/C front panel. This is in Windows. As far as D-VHS goes, well someone is going to have to test that for me.

There is no Coax audio output for Dolby 5.1. Just Toslink if you want AC-3. A coax to toslink converter might be needed if you need coaxial support. It's bigger than the 4250HDC. It's slightly bigger than my former 3250HD but it's much lighter though.

Just got mdn'd on my 8300 last night. Immediate reaction is hatred.

An archive for posterity of things that passport did better...


In Guide you can no longer scroll through favorites. Now it changes the channel when you press the Fav button. Instead, you have to set Guide to show Favs, but you have to be on a Fav to see it! SUCKS.

In Guide if you came across a show in progress on passport you could hit the C button to find all other showings and easily record it. No more! Now you have use the crappy B button to find shows one letter at a time. BLOWS.

When recording on the fly you used to be able to change the channel then come back to it at the moment you wanted to start recording. So if, for example, you want to record the musical guest on Letterman you could change the channel during the commercial and come back and it would record just from there. Now you need to change the channel twice to "erase" the last hour to do the same thing. MINOR PAIN IN THE BUTT

PIP used to have small and large sizes and was closer to the corners. Now it's one oversized size that sits too far from the edges and gets in the way of what you are watching. You think I'll be able to watch the game in PIP now while the kids are watching Gossip Girl? NOT A CHANCE.

It used to be if you PIP'd something it was there and "recording" even if you didn't have the window open. You could swap back and forth between the PIP show and the active show. The PIP show would always stay there as you surfed around the active channels. This was a simple way to watch 2 shows at once without recording them. (The only way you would mess up was if you forgot that something was scheduled to record.) Now, if you don't have the show open in the PIP window, the channel changes to the last channel viewed. GRRRRRR.

Used to be able to have channel display always while watching TV and time display when you turned the box off. Made sense. Know what channel you're on at a glance while watching, know what time it is (and if the box is on or off) when it's off. Now it's either one or the other all the time. STUPID.

When fast forwarding or reversing you used to be able to land right on the frame if you were doing it in the slowest speed. Now it always misses by several seconds. ANNOYING


Okay, it's not 10 things, but it just downloaded last night- I'm sure I'll find more. I have found very little that's an improvement. Recording options may well be more powerful- we'll see. Right now, I'm waiting to see if it will learn not to record 42 "new" episodes of The Daily Show per week...

#6 works that way for me. I have the options set to "always show channel" but, even so, it shows the time when the box is off.

This is better than my new Tivo which has no display on the box itself, so it NEVER shows the time or the channel. :-(

-barry

#6 works that way for me. I have the options set to "always show channel" but, even so, it shows the time when the box is off.

This is better than my new Tivo which has no display on the box itself, so it NEVER shows the time or the channel. :-(

-barry

I have mine set to "Show Time of Day, always."

Jack

#6 works that way for me. I have the options set to "always show channel" but, even so, it shows the time when the box is off.

This is better than my new Tivo which has no display on the box itself, so it NEVER shows the time or the channel. :-(

-barry
I stand corrected. You're right. Thanks!

Have to take it back- It's as Rivierside_Guy says below....

Navigator bug MDN: 2.4.4-15

TWC: Metro-Milwaukee Wisconsin Vicinity

When recording two shows in the same time slots, it is known you cannot change channels. It gave me a choice of pressing "A" or "SEL" to stop one recording, but it would not let me stop the recording indicated by the "A" button. I had to Exit out of the screen, go under List, and Cancel the recording that way.

Jack

Just got mdn'd on my 8300 last night. Immediate reaction is hatred.

I'm guessing you may not be that heavy into series recordings? Oh boy, if you are, be ready for major disappointment!

Used to be able to have channel display always while watching TV and time display when you turned the box off. Made sense. Know what channel you're on at a glance while watching, know what time it is (and if the box is on or off) when it's off. Now it's either one or the other all the time. STUPID.

Hmm, like you, I had it set so it displayed the channel when the box was on, the time when off. I set it to be that way, but what happens is that at some point, the display will show a channel, even though it's "off." Not only that, but I set a power on channel... and sometimes it shows that channel and sometimes it shows the last channel I had tuned.

Totally frakked up.

I have mine set to "Show Time of Day, always."

Jack

Uh, then how do you know what channel it's tuned to? You don't... unless you bring up the guide.

Uh, then how do you know what channel it's tuned to? You don't... unless you bring up the guide.

...or the less obtrusive "Info" banner.

Like Jack, I prefer to have the clock displayed at all times. 80% of what I watch is off the DVR, meaning that the channel display (which continues to show the last live channel during DVR playback) is both incorrect and meaningless, anyway. Plus... the ubiquitous network "bugs" usually make the channel display superfluous as well.

That said, the four clock options given by Navigator...

No Display
Clock Always
Channel Always (which still displays the clock when off)
Channel on Tune
...should be sufficient to satisfy any personal preference.

Uh, then how do you know what channel it's tuned to? You don't... unless you bring up the guide.

Now that statement makes no sense. Have you watched TV lately? You can barely see the actual programming behind all the network logos and flashy promos. :D

The only channel I can remember that doesn't do that is HBO. And the fact it doesn't means I must be watching HBO.

I'm guessing you may not be that heavy into series recordings? Oh boy, if you are, be ready for major disappointment!

I'm still kinda puzzled by this statement. Navigator's glaring weaknesses all center around its weak search and non-existent manual recording capabilities. Even though I really don't care about either of those issues, I readily concede that they are problems.


However, its series recording and conflict resolution capabilities (which I rely on greatly) leave little, if anything, to be desired. I currently have 27 series scheduled on mine and it just plain works with virtually no hassles, headaches or user intervention. Series currently scheduled (in their priority order in series manager):

NCIS
Smallville
Chuck
House
Bones
CSI: NY
CSI: Miami
Lie to Me
Fringe
Big Bang Theory
Sons of Anarchy
Burn Notice
In Plain Sight
Royal Pains
Dark Blue
The Closer
Leverage
Dexter
Nurse Jackie
Hung
Deadliest Catch
Ice Road Truckers
American Chopper
Twist the Throttle
Hard Knocks
Gene Simmons Family Jewels
NFL Live
All are set to "Keep All Episodes", "New Episodes only", "Original Start/End Time" and "All Showings". With these settings and virtually no manual conflict resolution I get exactly what I want... the first airing of a new episode or the next available showing in the event of a conflict.

BTW, I do get repeat airings of NFL Live... the 4:00pm showing is usually the new live airing... later showings in the day can be repeats or have new content added depending on the day's NFL happenings. Can't fault Navigator for that.

Also, some network conflicts (like last season's Monday House/Chuck/Big Bang conflict) are unresolvable, which is why the Panny DVR is still around for backup. But with only two tuners, no software is going to resolve those.

I'm guessing you may not be that heavy into series recordings? Oh boy, if you are, be ready for major disappointment!
Actually I am. I'm intrigued by the just setting it for "new" and letting Navigator figure it out. See what happens in a week or two...

Just got mdn'd on my 8300 last night. Immediate reaction is hatred.

An archive for posterity of things that passport did better...

[LIST=1]
In Guide you can no longer scroll through favorites. Now it changes the channel when you press the Fav button.

a recent update on my 3250hd non dvr that eliminated the old blue on blue on blue guide resolved that issue. i can now search with the faves button in the guide without the channel changing.
havent had a chance to check the 8300hd to see if it got a similarly functioning update
my samsung will scroll faves in the guide but thats with a harmony remote. i assume it behaves the same with the original remote but not sure.

a recent update on my 3250hd non dvr that eliminated the old blue on blue on blue guide resolved that issue. i can now search with the faves button in the guide without the channel changing.
havent had a chance to check the 8300hd to see if it got a similarly functioning update
my samsung will scroll faves in the guide but thats with a harmony remote. i assume it behaves the same with the original remote but not sure.

Yep...ODN scrolls faves in guide. Also can sort guide by favorites so they all appear in one block.

I'm still kinda puzzled by this statement. Navigator's glaring weaknesses all center around its weak search and non-existent manual recording capabilities.
...
...
BTW, I do get repeat airings of NFL Live... the 4:00pm showing is usually the new live airing... later showings in the day can be repeats or have new content added depending on the day's NFL happenings. Can't fault Navigator for that.
...


What is a glaring weakness has a lot to do with personal preference (unless the thing is unreliable, i.e. does not really work). In my book, the glaring ODN omissions are (in order of importance):
1. broken eSATA support (combined with a puny hard drive); Samsungs with larger drive are both scarce and buggy, AFAIK, and the larger drive is not large enough, either.
2. no 30 second skip (probably not going to see this ever as it may irritate content providers; never mind that both satelite companies and all stand-alone DVRs do that)
3. no way to remove the channels you don't want to see from the guide and search results (at least the channels you don't subscribe to and the SD equivalents of HD channels should be removable); probably not there for political reasons - if you see something you'd like on a channel you don't subscribe to, maybe you'll subscribe
4. no equivalent of Tivo wishlists, only can schedule stuff that is already in the guide; granted, for this to be effective 3. is required, as well as better search that is #1 issue with you.
I could not care less about live buffer and PIP issues; I rarely watch live TV, and PIP I haven't used once, it is not even mapped on my universal remote.

I'm trying to hold on until either Tivo or Moxi comes up with a 2-way box (I'd rather not give up the free VOD stuff) but the storage size issue will make it very hard to wait once the fall season starts.

By the way, my way around NFL Live issue is to restrict it to 4:00 showing only; that feature was added in 3* ODNs and was on MDNs for a long time. But you probably do this already.

What is a glaring weakness has a lot to do with personal preference (unless the thing is unreliable, i.e. does not really work). In my book, the glaring ODN omissions are (in order of importance):
1. broken eSATA support (combined with a puny hard drive); Samsungs with larger drive are both scarce and buggy, AFAIK, and the larger drive is not large enough, either.
2. no 30 second skip (probably not going to see this ever as it may irritate content providers; never mind that both satelite companies and all stand-alone DVRs do that)
3. no way to remove the channels you don't want to see from the guide and search results (at least the channels you don't subscribe to and the SD equivalents of HD channels should be removable); probably not there for political reasons - if you see something you'd like on a channel you don't subscribe to, maybe you'll subscribe
4. no equivalent of Tivo wishlists, only can schedule stuff that is already in the guide; granted, for this to be effective 3. is required, as well as better search that is #1 issue with you.
I could not care less about live buffer and PIP issues; I rarely watch live TV, and PIP I haven't used once, it is not even mapped on my universal remote.

I'm trying to hold on until either Tivo or Moxi comes up with a 2-way box (I'd rather not give up the free VOD stuff) but the storage size issue will make it very hard to wait once the fall season starts.

By the way, my way around NFL Live issue is to restrict it to 4:00 showing only; that feature was added in 3* ODNs and was on MDNs for a long time. But you probably do this already.

I agree with "your" issues (especially the lack of of a 30/60 second skip, that I agree we likely will never see)... I was primarily addressing the negative comment made about series recording, which I have found Navigator to be quite adept at. I'm not a Navigator fanboy and will join in on the criticism when justified. I'm just hoping to help folks understand and get the most out of what DOES work well.

I've done that with NFL Live as well, but sometimes the other showings have new segments, so now I just record them all and briefly look at the intro to see if they are new or not.

I'm still kinda puzzled by this statement. Navigator's glaring weaknesses all center around its weak search and non-existent manual recording capabilities. Even though I really don't care about either of those issues, I readily concede that they are problems.

However, its series recording and conflict resolution capabilities (which I rely on greatly) leave little, if anything, to be desired. I currently have 27 series scheduled on mine and it just plain works with virtually no hassles, headaches or user intervention. Series currently scheduled (in their priority order in series manager):

NCIS
Smallville
Chuck
House
Bones (Fox)
CSI: NY
CSI: Miami
Lie to Me
Fringe
Big Bang Theory
Burn Notice
In Plain Sight
Royal Pains
Dark Blue
The Closer
Leverage
Dexter
Nurse Jackie
Hung
Deadliest Catch
Ice Road Truckers
American Chopper
Twist the Throttle
Hard Knocks
Gene Simmons Family Jewels
Bones (TNT)
NFL Live
All are set to "Keep All Episodes", "New Episodes only" (except the TNT reruns of Bones, which I am catching up on previous seasons), "Original Start/End Time" and "All Showings". With these settings and virtually no manual conflict resolution I get exactly what I want... the first airing of a new episode or the next available showing in the event of a conflict.

BTW, I do get repeat airings of NFL Live... the 4:00pm showing is usually the new live airing... later showings in the day can be repeats or have new content added depending on the day's NFL happenings. Can't fault Navigator for that.

Also, some network conflicts (like last season's Monday House/Chuck/Big Bang conflict) are unresolvable, which is why the Panny DVR is still around for backup. But with only two tuners, no software is going to resolve those.

I'll add my +1 to your comments. I also have more than 20 series recordings set up, and I basically just let the box do it's thing. By and large it handles all my recordings.

-barry

I agree with "your" issues (especially the lack of of a 30/60 second skip, that I agree we likely will never see)... I was primarily addressing the negative comment made about series recording, which I have found Navigator to be quite adept at. I'm not a Navigator fanboy and will join in on the criticism when justified. I'm just hoping to help folks understand and get the most out of what DOES work well.

I've done that with NFL Live as well, but sometimes the other showings have new segments, so now I just record them all and briefly look at the intro to see if they are new or not.

You are absolutely right that while there are (many, I might add) things to complain about Navigator, series recordings is definitely not one of them; it works quite well for me, and I have ~20 series, some of which have notoriously bad "New" data (Jon Stewart/NFL Live). I just vented a bit on what I see as most glaring omissions that I think are not mentioned enough and are likely nowhere close to being on the front burner for the TWC.

...or the less obtrusive "Info" banner.

Like Jack, I prefer to have the clock displayed at all times. 80% of what I watch is off the DVR, meaning that the channel display (which continues to show the last live channel during DVR playback) is both incorrect and meaningless, anyway. Plus... the ubiquitous network "bugs" usually make the channel display superfluous as well.

That said, the four clock options given by Navigator...

No Display
Clock Always
Channel Always (which still displays the clock when off)
Channel on Tune
...should be sufficient to satisfy any personal preference.

I have always used the "channel always" option. Which used to mean when the box is "off" one had the time displayed. Except, it does not work now. When off, it initially displays the time as it should. At some point later, it either displays my power on channel or sometimes the last channel I tuned to. But NOT the time as it should.

Can't be a hardware issue because it worked 100% correctly in Passport.

I've rebooted the box a few times, so it's clearly a bug. Earth shattering... not really. But add it in with dozen of other "not earth shattering" and what do you get?

However, its series recording and conflict resolution capabilities (which I rely on greatly) leave little, if anything, to be desired. I currently have 27 series scheduled on mine and it just plain works with virtually no hassles, headaches or user intervention.

I'm now seeing new issues. Many times I will actually watch something that has a series recording set up. So I turn off the recording. Now what it's doing is going and finding the next episode and scheduling it for recording (yesterday I caught that it had just scheduled a repeat of last Monday's The Closer... which I had already seen). So now I have to each day devote x amount of time to canceling 4 or 5 scheduled recordings of the same show AND cancel ones scheduled that I had already watched.

Nothing but hassles, headaches, and a ton of user intervention necessary. None of which I had with Passport.

I'll add my +1 to your comments. I also have more than 20 series recordings set up, and I basically just let the box do it's thing. By and large it handles all my recordings.

-barry

Well, so far if I "let the box do it's thing" I'd have hours and hours of recorded stuff I have already seen with the possibility of stuff I haven't yet watched maybe getting deleted.

Ah a new one... I just looked and see it is completely ignoring one of my series recordings.. Hung. Today's really new version and any of the repeats are not on the schedule.

I'm now seeing new issues. Many times I will actually watch something that has a series recording set up. So I turn off the recording. Now what it's doing is going and finding the next episode and scheduling it for recording (yesterday I caught that it had just scheduled a repeat of last Monday's The Closer... which I had already seen). So now I have to each day devote x amount of time to canceling 4 or 5 scheduled recordings of the same show AND cancel ones scheduled that I had already watched.

Nothing but hassles, headaches, and a ton of user intervention necessary. None of which I had with Passport.

Why do you bother cancelling it? It would never occur to me to waste the time to cancel one of those recordings. I just let it continue to record even if I'm watching live and then just delete it the next time I'm in the DVR Show List. It does not record it again.

Well, so far if I "let the box do it's thing" I'd have hours and hours of recorded stuff I have already seen with the possibility of stuff I haven't yet watched maybe getting deleted.

Ah a new one... I just looked and see it is completely ignoring one of my series recordings.. Hung. Today's really new version and any of the repeats are not on the schedule.

I think you have a combination of conversion artifacts (which will go away) and a case of micro-managing the box. By trying to "outsmart" the box you are creating alot of what you are seeing as problems. You need to spend less time managing the box, not more. ;)

I think you have a combination of conversion artifacts (which will go away) and a case of micro-managing the box. By trying to "outsmart" the box you are creating alot of what you are seeing as problems. You need to spend less time managing the box, not more. ;)

Riverside, I concur, normally, just leave the box alone and it will do its job. I have not yet (in more than 2 years of use) have a new episode fail to record or record twice, except for NFL Live/Daily Show/Colbert Report where data is not to be trusted completely and software would go "safe" and record extra episodes; for those, limiting to one time slot does the trick. Since you have MDN, not ODN, your eSATA port should work, so you can have enough storage to not worry too much about deleting stuff you watched so promptly. Let the box completely record the episode, and then it will know not to do it another time.

But, if you are getting skipped recordings for no apparent reason, maybe it is time to swap the box. Navigator is very sensitive to box/signal flakiness, so you may have issues with it even though Passport may have been able to overcome that to the point that you saw nothing wrong. I know it sounds weird to say your box is bad since it gave you no trouble with Passport, but it is very possible that it is not good enough for Navigator. The fact that Navigator tolerates no flakiness at all is, of course, Navigator deficiency, but there's nothing you can do about it other than to go for another box. Also, from what I heard, conversion sometimes damages your box. The problem with asking for another box is that you may have to get ODN, and then you can kiss eSATA goodbye.

Why do you bother cancelling it? It would never occur to me to waste the time to cancel one of those recordings.

If drive space is tight I'll cancel scheduled episodes and watch them live without recording. The drive space is too limited to allow pointless recordings every time.

I'm now seeing new issues. Many times I will actually watch something that has a series recording set up. So I turn off the recording. Now what it's doing is going and finding the next episode and scheduling it for recording (yesterday I caught that it had just scheduled a repeat of last Monday's The Closer... which I had already seen). So now I have to each day devote x amount of time to canceling 4 or 5 scheduled recordings of the same show AND cancel ones scheduled that I had already watched.

Nothing but hassles, headaches, and a ton of user intervention necessary. None of which I had with Passport.

Aha! That's your problem. You should not cancel the scheduled recording. Let it record it, even if it's a dupe, and then delete the recording.

***WARNING: The following is completely conjecture on my part.***
I think Navigator keeps some kind of table as to whether it's recorded a particular episode or not. This table probably gets populated AFTER the show has been recorded. If your table is screwed up, it will never get straight unless you allow the dupes to be recorded. Then you can delete them.

-barry

I think you have a combination of conversion artifacts (which will go away) and a case of micro-managing the box. By trying to "outsmart" the box you are creating alot of what you are seeing as problems. You need to spend less time managing the box, not more. ;)

You may be right... actually I was thinking about what you said about "conflict resolution." It may very well be that they have chosen a bad method... as in marking an entire weeks worth of episodes as NEW. One specific issue is when one wants to actually watch live the first broadcast. It never gets recorded, so each "NEW" is going to be scheduled for recording. I think I could write a logic flow of how to handle this FAR better.

I "discovered" the recording log. Have had MDN for 6 days now... I have 52 shows listed as being deleted by the user in that log. I'd say maybe 8 or 9 were of the "I'm going to watch live the first showing." Oh, some of those (2 maybe) are from last night when I tried to cancel a recording for a series show because I was going to watch it. I'd delete it, boom, it came back. Took 3 tries to get it really deleted.

Of course we are heading into the network new show season; those shows air once and only once, so no issues like I've been having are possible. Plus a lot of the cable series are ending their seasons now.

Of course, part of my issue is if I left this totally unchecked, I'd be getting stuff deleted... unless I kept micro managing and deleting unwanted stuff! Which kinda makes me think of getting the 3090 and swapping out the drive! But if I do that, you'd have to support me because I mentioned it as an option in another thread and someone told me I was vandalizing the box and would be subject to criminal prosecution (although he also said I'd probably get away with this heinous crime)!

If drive space is tight I'll cancel scheduled episodes and watch them live without recording. The drive space is too limited to allow pointless recordings every time.

Yes, I think it's that factor... at one point I mentioned we are just about into football season and it's not unusual for me to need to record up to 9 + hours on a Sunday (Jets/Giants plus taking into account overtime). I normally do have to manage what is already recorded to deal with that so adding in a ton of stuff I've already seen poses quite a risk.

And before any of youse tell me, yeahg it's frakking TV and who gives a trollop that I miss this or that TV show! So chill the frak out RG!

Aha! That's your problem. You should not cancel the scheduled recording. Let it record it, even if it's a dupe, and then delete the recording.

***WARNING: The following is completely conjecture on my part.***
I think Navigator keeps some kind of table as to whether it's recorded a particular episode or not. This table probably gets populated AFTER the show has been recorded. If your table is screwed up, it will never get straight unless you allow the dupes to be recorded. Then you can delete them.

-barry

Oh that has occurred to me... and may be the final straw to push me to get a 3090 and swap out the HD (a better option IMO than getting an external drive.. if I'm ever forced to replace my very aging 8300HD, I'm frakked I lose the recordings AND can't use it with any other box I'd have to get).

But I still really want to hear someone in NYC do this successfully. I don't doubt the drive swap was successful for the 2 who have done it, but I also know each division can do things that are simply different from other divisions.

Oh that has occurred to me... and may be the final straw to push me to get a 3090 and swap out the HD (a better option IMO than getting an external drive.. if I'm ever forced to replace my very aging 8300HD, I'm frakked I lose the recordings AND can't use it with any other box I'd have to get).

But I still really want to hear someone in NYC do this successfully. I don't doubt the drive swap was successful for the 2 who have done it, but I also know each division can do things that are simply different from other divisions.

I agree that a bigger internal drive is a better solution, but the external drive is awfully easy. You can pick up an external WD MyDVR 500GB drive for less than $100 at Amazon, and 15 minutes later you'll be up and running.

You're right about the losing recordings if you have to replace your box, but that's pretty much true with any box/disk combo - in fact, it's true of the 3090 with a user replaced 360GB drive. My attitude is to hope that an upcoming version of Navigator (ODN and MDN) will support external drives. Then if I have to change boxes, I'll lose my shows but not my drive-investment.

-barry

PS: I'm actually considering upgrading my external drive to a 1TB drive. :-)

I hear ya... at this point, I'm leaning more and more to the 3090, so doing an external isn't really in those cards.

MANY folks have complained about the breaking of SATA support in all 3.x versions of ODN. Yet all we hear from TWC is that keyword search may come in the next six months (of course, it's that PLUS and ability to save searches that will equate what we have been able to do for the past 3 years in Passport).

You may be right... actually I was thinking about what you said about "conflict resolution." It may very well be that they have chosen a bad method... as in marking an entire weeks worth of episodes as NEW. One specific issue is when one wants to actually watch live the first broadcast. It never gets recorded, so each "NEW" is going to be scheduled for recording. I think I could write a logic flow of how to handle this FAR better.

I "discovered" the recording log. Have had MDN for 6 days now... I have 52 shows listed as being deleted by the user in that log. I'd say maybe 8 or 9 were of the "I'm going to watch live the first showing." Oh, some of those (2 maybe) are from last night when I tried to cancel a recording for a series show because I was going to watch it. I'd delete it, boom, it came back. Took 3 tries to get it really deleted.

Of course we are heading into the network new show season; those shows air once and only once, so no issues like I've been having are possible. Plus a lot of the cable series are ending their seasons now.

Of course, part of my issue is if I left this totally unchecked, I'd be getting stuff deleted... unless I kept micro managing and deleting unwanted stuff! Which kinda makes me think of getting the 3090 and swapping out the drive! But if I do that, you'd have to support me because I mentioned it as an option in another thread and someone told me I was vandalizing the box and would be subject to criminal prosecution (although he also said I'd probably get away with this heinous crime)!

The lightbulb still hasn't gone off for me as to how marking the entire premiere week of a new episode as "New" is bad. How else would the box know that those were perfectly good replacement showings in the event of a conflict? Forget the recording part... I like the New designation being there for the shows I only watch occasionally as "filler" at odd hours, to be able to know if it's the current episode or not.

As I mentioned earlier, I personally never cancel a recording just because I'm watching it live. Most often, even if I am watching it live I let it record for 15 or 20 minutes and then watch the recording so that I can skip the commercials. But... I do see the need for the software to recognize a deliberate user cancellation as being different than a cancellation due to conflict resolution. Adding a second cancellation category in the recording log is what is needed... not removing "New" designation for the week.

In any case... if your box continues to record multiple showings, something is wrong. This is NOT what Navigator does as normal matter of course.

I hear ya... at this point, I'm leaning more and more to the 3090, so doing an external isn't really in those cards.

MANY folks have complained about the breaking of SATA support in all 3.x versions of ODN. Yet all we hear from TWC is that keyword search may come in the next six months (of course, it's that PLUS and ability to save searches that will equate what we have been able to do for the past 3 years in Passport).

A couple of points. First, don't expect the 3090 to be any different than the 8300HD. I have them both, and yes the 3090 is a tiny bit quicker, but basically it is the same box (except for the external SATA support).

You can replace the drive in the 3090, but you probably could do that in the 8300HD too. You have a chance of getting an "off the shelf" 3090 with a 320GB drive - I guess that's the major plus of the 3090.

Secondly, yes TWC is not talking about fixing SATA support, but don't forget, officially no TWC DVR has ever supported external drives. It's not like SATA drives don't work at all with Navigator, they just don't work "right" with ODN. My gut feel is that TWC probably has a low priority effort in place to get external drives working on all versions of Navigator.

-barry

Well, their methodology using the NEW markings has made me delete 40 something unwanted recordings in the space of 6 days. Don't remember exact details, but many of them have nothing to do with conflict... oh wait, on Thursday a repeat of the previous Monday's The Closer showed up on the schedule...

I think the issue is they have taken a huge shortcut for "conflict resolution" that could have been done far better. Like I said, upping a 3090 to 320 makes the "let it record" be not near as problematic as having only the 160. Even so, saying I have to make sure I actually record and keep for a week all first run serials so I don't have to delete tons of duplicate recordings is just wrong.

I also have to wonder if the fact you are using ODN and me MDN might also be a factor?

Well, their methodology using the NEW markings has made me delete 40 something unwanted recordings in the space of 6 days. Don't remember exact details, but many of them have nothing to do with conflict... oh wait, on Thursday a repeat of the previous Monday's The Closer showed up on the schedule...

I think the issue is they have taken a huge shortcut for "conflict resolution" that could have been done far better. Like I said, upping a 3090 to 320 makes the "let it record" be not near as problematic as having only the 160. Even so, saying I have to make sure I actually record and keep for a week all first run serials so I don't have to delete tons of duplicate recordings is just wrong.

I also have to wonder if the fact you are using ODN and me MDN might also be a factor?

...but the "new" designation in and of itself has nothing to do with your issues. What would you suggest instead? Episode numbers? Why would finding two of the same episode number be any different than finding two with a "new" flag? As I mentioned above, there may be a flaw in the log reporting logic for folks who purposely cancel series recordings before they occur... but I cannot find any logical tie to the "New" designation whatsoever.

I hate to keep repeating myself, but Navigator does not record multiple showings when left to its own devices. If yours is doing that, there is an issue elsewhere. I believe that reports from myself, Pedja, strutter and margoba can confirm this to be true... and at least strutter and margoba, and my experience with my friend's 8300/MDN box, indicate that series recording behaves exactly the same, and equally as well, between Navigator versions.

From what I am reading from you and from others, I believe that I would boiling mad if TW forced Passport on me now... it seems to me that its series recording logic is totally frigged up and couldn't fathom having to deal with the bullcrap it makes you do that Navigator handles so effortlessly. Sound familiar? I don't think either of us would be wrong... just forced to adapt to a logic that is different than what we are used to. I can't say with certainty that either one is better of worse... just that they are different and habits/procedures learned on one don't apply to the other.

But I still really want to hear someone in NYC do this successfully. I don't doubt the drive swap was successful for the 2 who have done it, but I also know each division can do things that are simply different from other divisions.

Guinea pig here. Hopefully by the end of the week I'll be able to confirm if it works for NYC or not. The drive should be here on Wednesday. I'll try to drag my box into the shop and do the swap on Thursday or Friday. Worse thing that can happen is that I have to put the old drive back in the 3090 and send the new drive back to Amazon for a refund.

Guinea pig here. Hopefully by the end of the week I'll be able to confirm if it works for NYC or not. The drive should be here on Wednesday. I'll try to drag my box into the shop and do the swap on Thursday or Friday. Worse thing that can happen is that I have to put the old drive back in the 3090 and send the new drive back to Amazon for a refund.

Make sure you have a Torx T10 security screwdriver handy!


http://www.aaronssecurityscrews.com/images/SecurityScrewTorxPinHeadButtonSTS156x156.gifhttp://www.wihatools.com/images/Bits/701endpix150.jpg

Make sure you have a Torx T10 security screwdriver handy!

Thanks. That's why I'm taking the box in to the shop at my studio. Any tool I'll need (not to mention proper lighting and a workbench) will be there.

Guinea pig here. Hopefully by the end of the week I'll be able to confirm if it works for NYC or not. The drive should be here on Wednesday. I'll try to drag my box into the shop and do the swap on Thursday or Friday. Worse thing that can happen is that I have to put the old drive back in the 3090 and send the new drive back to Amazon for a refund.

Thanks. That's why I'm taking the box in to the shop at my studio. Any tool I'll need (not to mention proper lighting and a workbench) will be there.

Also, you cannot remove the drive directly from the unit... it sits in a carrier tray that has 4 phillips screws that must be removed from the chassis first... then you can remove the 4 screws that hold the drive to the tray (2 on each side of the drive... they have rubber vibration isolators on the screws). Other than that its just the two SATA connections (power and data).

It will take awhile to boot with the new drive... the display will say "HDD" for several minutes as it formats the drive. There are, however, no manual steps necessary. After the lengthy but fully automatic boot process, it comes up in a completely normal state. All settings and series recordings were left intact... however, the recording log will be gone and you will experience some issues similar to a conversion for a few days, but they will settle out.

Also, you cannot remove the drive directly from the unit... it sits in a carrier tray that has 4 phillips screws that must be removed from the chassis first... then you can remove the 4 screws that hold the drive to the tray (2 on each side of the drive... they have rubber vibration isolators on the screws). Other than that its just the two SATA connections (power and data).

It will take awhile to boot with the new drive... the display will say "HDD" for several minutes as it formats the drive. There are, however, no manual steps necessary. After the lengthy but fully automatic boot process, it comes up in a completely normal state. All settings and series recordings were left intact... however, the recording log will be gone and you will experience some issues similar to a conversion for a few days, but they will settle out.

Thanks for the tips. I figured the first boot would take some time. That's good that settings and series records are maintained. I only have one show saved on the current drive, so I'll have viewed that by Thursday.

usually if i am watching a set up series recording live, i'll let it record in the background then just delete it when its over. no different than if i was watching it as a recording.

my MDN 8300 and ODN samsung handles conflict resolution exactly the same.

i agree the boxes need bigger drives. the 320 in my samsung seems enough for me right now. 320 should be the minimum for all new boxes

sure hope TWC charlotte updates ODN before the new season starts. i dont relish the idea of dealing with missed recordings on CBS and FOX.

...
Even so, saying I have to make sure I actually record and keep for a week all first run serials so I don't have to delete tons of duplicate recordings is just wrong.
...


You don't have to keep recordings for a week. Just record them and then delete them one second after they are finished recording, if you want.

...Even so, saying I have to make sure I actually record and keep for a week all first run serials so I don't have to delete tons of duplicate recordings is just wrong.

Somehow I missed that line when reading your post the first time... NO! NO! NO! You Don't!!!:eek:

It only has to appear in the log as recorded or deleted by user. If you thought you needed to keep the recording until the premiere week was over, I can see why you were concerned over drive capacity, but that is NOT how it works.

You don't have to keep recordings for a week. Just record them and then delete them one second after they are finished recording, if you want.

Correct, but I don't believe you have to wait even that long... I'm pretty sure you can cancel and delete a recording immediately AFTER it starts the scheduled recording and it will be "credited" as a valid recording and Navigator will not re-schedule any further showings.

Correct, but I don't believe you have to wait even that long... I'm pretty sure you can cancel and delete a recording immediately AFTER it starts the scheduled recording and it will be "credited" as a valid recording and Navigator will not re-schedule any further showings.

That it does. The box needs to haves some evidence the scheduled recording was activated. If you choose to stop and delete that recording a second after it begins the box doesn't care. All it knows is that it carried out the recording on time and that's all that matters to it.

However if the channel was out due to SDV issues or whatever, the box will still consider it carried out the task and not schedule a further episode. Then you get the "channel not available" message. So the fact that it only cares it was ready to make the recording at the specified time is a limiting factor in that case. Nav was ready, the fact the content wasn't there isn't it's problem and it will not reschedule.

That it does. The box needs to haves some evidence the scheduled recording was activated. If you choose to stop and delete that recording a second after it begins the box doesn't care. All it knows is that it carried out the recording on time and that's all that matters to it.

However if the channel was out due to SDV issues or whatever, the box will still consider it carried out the task and not schedule a further episode. Then you get the "channel not available" message. So the fact that it only cares it was ready to make the recording at the specified time is a limiting factor in that case. Nav was ready, the fact the content wasn't there isn't it's problem and it will not reschedule.


Good to know, I was not sure whether it had to record the whole thing to remember it properly, so I erred on the safe side.