Just heard that TWC San Diego will push a new ODN version named ODN v3.2.0_15. They'll be doing other updates like Cable Card, Middleware, and possibly the RTOS. I think it might have new features.

llabine1:

Up the road here in Hawthorne, CA TWC updated my box to ODN 3.1.3_3 on the same night. Check channel 199 or the usual SEL-down arrow button press for diagnostics to compare...

IIRC I haven't seen TWC reboot my box to add/change the channel lineup....

Thanks everyone for clearing things up....my version of MDN stayed the same...I was hoping for an upgrade but it did not happen....I went through every page and saw virtually no difference just the boxes being turned off...I am one of those geeks who check at least once a month...the one change I would love is a difference in the search ....I used to be able to highlight something on the guide ...click select and see all the other times it would come on...now I have to spell it out which takes forever and is NOT fun....also of course the option of powering down the hard drive so that the box is silent...I have two DVR's in my bedroom so hearing the constant hum prevented me from sleeping...I did solve that by buying a kill switch with a remote control...now when I am in bed all cozy all I do is click and the boxes go off...the next morning I click the remote on the kill switch and they reboot...its now a perfect set up....to make it really perfect I would like BBCAmericaHD and TMCHD...I will be in a walker before that happens.... :D

llabine1:

Up the road here in Hawthorne, CA TWC updated my box to ODN 3.1.3_3 on the same night. Check channel 199 or the usual SEL-down arrow button press for diagnostics to compare...

IIRC I haven't seen TWC reboot my box to add/change the channel lineup....

SoCal has a weird update schedule. They upgrade to the previous version right before a new version comes out like ODN v3.2.0_15 which will be coming out in a couple of weeks.

Just heard that TWC San Diego will push a new ODN version named ODN v3.2.0_15. They'll be doing other updates like Cable Card, Middleware, and possibly the RTOS. I think it might have new features.

Any idea about eSATA support in 3.2.0_15?
We got ODN 3.1.3_3 yesterday, has anyone tried eSATA with that version?

Nope, no information about that. We'll just have to wait and see.

Nope, no information about that. We'll just have to wait and see.

The problem is that even when I get the new version I am afraid to try to hook up eSATA drive, because with the last two 3* versions, each attempt deleted one existing recording from the internal drive. So, I am hoping somebody not having recordings to lose would try and confirm it works.

ODN v3.1.3_3 definitely doesn't have working eSATA.

I think for MDN, most divisions might skip 2.5, which is in Beta now and go to 3.0. So when this happens, both MDN and ODN boxes will probably be Navigator 3. They are trying to make the features the same or as close to the same in both ODN/MDN versions.

Jack

I'll see what my engineering contact says. I've mentioned if MDN users will get a new update since I no longer have my 3250HD.

I'll see what my engineering contact says. I've mentioned if MDN users will get a new update since I no longer have my 3250HD.

Thanks in advance for helping to get this information!

Jack

....also of course the option of powering down the hard drive so that the box is silent...

Uh, MDN completely powers the internal drive down, so the box is dead silent when "off." Previous software did not... then again the bad comes with the good, there is now NO buffering while the box is "off." I used to set it to my fave local news channel, so if I was 5-10-15 minutes late, I could power everything up, rack the DVR back up to 60 minutes and proceed.

I think my local division is doing an ODN update tonight or tomorrow. (Milwaukee Wisconsin.) However, I only have an MDN box. No word on new features yet, but I will keep watching the forum.

Jack

I think my local division is doing an ODN update tonight or tomorrow. (Milwaukee Wisconsin.) However, I only have an MDN box. No word on new features yet, but I will keep watching the forum.

Jack

Yeah not a good idea to upgrade to v3.1.3_3 when v3.2.0_15 is just around the corner.

A newsletter for TWC San Diego mentioned remote DVR scheduling.

I can confirm that it is at least being looked into. Our division VP said he was testing Navigator (since about last summer) and that remote DVR scheduling is on the horizon. One can take that for what it's worth...

I have 2 SA8300HDs with MDN and as much as I dislike the fact that Navigator's search engine is awful, the fact that it does not have a widescreen guide and the fact that it has a puny 160GB hard drive at least it reliably recorded scheduled shows.

Well that has changed. In the last week, I went to watch a different program on each DVR, but when I when to the list to watch them they weren't there. When I went into the recording log, the message beside each program was "Not recorded because the episode was not available".

It's not a box issue because this occurred on two different boxes. I don't think that it is an SDV issue because one program was on ABC and the other was on CNBC.

Any ideas why I would get the "Not recorded because the episode was not available" message?

I guess it's something we'll never know. I did ask that question to my engineering contact but never got a response. I guess they keep it a secret.

I have 2 SA8300HDs with MDN and as much as I dislike the fact that Navigator's search engine is awful, the fact that it does not have a widescreen guide and the fact that it has a puny 160GB hard drive at least it reliably recorded scheduled shows.

Well that has changed. In the last week, I went to watch a different program on each DVR, but when I when to the list to watch them they weren't there. When I went into the recording log, the message beside each program was "Not recorded because the episode was not available".

It's not a box issue because this occurred on two different boxes. I don't think that it is an SDV issue because one program was on ABC and the other was on CNBC.

Any ideas why I would get the "Not recorded because the episode was not available" message?

While, I don't seem to be bitten (actually, it was a month or two ago I had several TCM scheduled recordings not happen... and it happened to some folks who tried to record the same movies I had tried), a good friend is steaming because for 2 weeks in a row, a football game he scheduled also did not record... I think at least one HAD an entry in the list of recorded shows, but was 0 length, so you hit play and it comes back to the list screen. The big irony is he's ODN and I'm MDN.

Anyway, there is only one explanation... the software SUX!

MDN might not get any new updates for awhile. ODN is their main focus right now and probably will be in the near future.

I hear a new version of Navigator might be released next Thursday in San Diego and prehaps Charlotte. It might contain new features. WOODY

Uh, MDN completely powers the internal drive down, so the box is dead silent when "off." Previous software did not... then again the bad comes with the good, there is now NO buffering while the box is "off." I used to set it to my fave local news channel, so if I was 5-10-15 minutes late, I could power everything up, rack the DVR back up to 60 minutes and proceed.

And in the newest version of MDN, actually from 2.4.6_19 to 2.4.6_21 Sort by Favorites is gone. BUT the ability to actually scroll favorite by favorite in the IPG has been restored. Everything below 2.4.6_19 just tuned to the channel when FAV was pressed.

Don't know how this works in the new versions of ODN.

Jack

I hear a new version of Navigator might be released next Thursday in San Deigo and prehaps Charlotte. It might contain new features. WOODY

My engineering guy said ODN would get updated to v3.2.0_15 next Thursday.

And in the newest version of MDN, actually from 2.4.6_19 to 2.4.6_21 Sort by Favorites is gone. BUT the ability to actually scroll favorite by favorite in the IPG has been restored. Everything below 2.4.6_19 just tuned to the channel when FAV was pressed.

Don't know how this works in the new versions of ODN.

Jack

Hmmm, did -21 get rolled out in any places other than Manhattan North? I only have one favorite, so I can't confirm this... next time I should add some more and check it out!

And in the newest version of MDN, actually from 2.4.6_19 to 2.4.6_21 Sort by Favorites is gone. BUT the ability to actually scroll favorite by favorite in the IPG has been restored. Everything below 2.4.6_19 just tuned to the channel when FAV was pressed.

Don't know how this works in the new versions of ODN.

Jack

ODN 3.1.3_2 jumps from FAV to FAV in the guide. The previous version I had did as well.

News from my local Wisconsin website that TWC is rolling out Navigator to the Northern Division, which we call here "Up North." They have been Passport forever. What this probably means is that they will get the latest MDN version, and perhaps some new features. Don't know when this is happening. Here is the link to the kind of tutorials that they used to have and information when Navigator first came out:

http://www.timewarnercable.com/Wisconsin/learn/cable/navigator/default.html

Jack

They must took their time in testing Navigator.

News from my local Wisconsin website that TWC is rolling out Navigator to the Northern Division, which we call here "Up North." They have been Passport forever. What this probably means is that they will get the latest MDN version, and perhaps some new features. Don't know when this is happening. Here is the link to the kind of tutorials that they used to have and information when Navigator first came out:

http://www.timewarnercable.com/Wisconsin/learn/cable/navigator/default.html

Jack

Correction:

Just found out they are SARA up there, not Passport! So this will be a good change for most people.

Jack

With SARA they can still deploy HDC boxes. It takes about 45 minutes to update a SARA HDC to ODN. It's a long update but possible. Looking forward to the new ODN update.

ODN can be updated by box type as was the case in Greensboro, NC.

ODN can be updated by box type as was the case in Greensboro, NC.

And I might add it went very smooth and trouble free here in Greensboro WOODY.

I to my delight have discovered that Navigator has a 28 day rule simular to TIVo. This helps greatly in not recording reruns. WOODY

Do not hold my feet to the fire over this but I heard from a source that TWC might start testing the 8642HDC with a 500gb drive and full 16.9 guide ( not streatched) in certain markets next quarter. San Diego and Charlotte were mentioned. This is from a secondary source but it seems soild info. WOODY

Cisco 8642HDC spec sheet for the NEXT GEN HD-DVR, hopefully running NEXT GEN Navigator (II?):
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/video/ps8611/ps8612/ps8613/7015625A.pdf
The box itself (not necessarily Navigator-II?) has eSATA for external HDD, Firewire to Recorder,
DTCP-IP on MoCA for Multi-Room viewing (including from your PC or Media Hub), 1 GHz Cable Tuning
and 1080p/MPEG4 for IPTV delivery of (Blu-Ray sourced) Movies....& (eventually) Premium channels.

Does anyone know what divisions are still doing those "Rate Navigator surveys?" on the websites? Is there a way that you can fill out a form and send it to corporate so that they can gage customers' interests? I used to like those feedback forms. But what I am looking for is some sort of information on feature requests for power users like us who can by-pass the know-nothing CSR clowns on the phone.

If any of you guys find such a communication connection process, please post! And if you fill out any forms, make sure that you mention whether you have an MDN or ODN box, (or both.)

Jack

Do not hold my feet to the fire over this but I heard from a source that TWC might start testing the 8642HDC with a 500gb drive and full 16.9 guide ( not streatched) in certain markets next quarter. San Diego and Charlotte were mentioned. This is from a secondary source but it seems soild info. WOODY

I'll take two please. :)

I'll take two please. :)

I hope they send a load to Greensboro. No Samsung sightings here yet. Heard our local TWC engineering dept does not like them.The Samsungs. WOODY

I hope they send a load to Greensboro. No Samsung sightings here yet. Heard our local TWC engineering dept does not like them.The Samsungs. WOODY

Same here Woody,

I don't know if I posted this before, but my Wisconsin divison has for now stopped giving out the Samsung boxes. Only SA/Cisco units. Some might just go with the bigger hard drive SA/Cisco DVR's when released.

Jack

Do not hold my feet to the fire over this but I heard from a source that TWC might start testing the 8642HDC with a 500gb drive and full 16.9 guide ( not streatched) in certain markets next quarter. San Diego and Charlotte were mentioned. This is from a secondary source but it seems soild info. WOODY

TWC San Diego just started deploying the Samsung boxes in September but if they do get the Cisco DVR then it will take a while.

The 3260 was deployed in July or August while the 3270 was deployed in September.

TWC San Diego just started deploying the Samsung boxes in September but if they do get the Cisco DVR then it will take a while.

looks like SUMSUNG is on its way to the door maybe. :D:D:D

I think this good as it lets TWC go with a better box(es).:D:D:D

The SAMSUNG 3260 and 3270 dont go over well with form factor size heck try putting those on bedroom dresser cable box that has little room to begin with my DCX3200 is smaller than the DCT2000.

http://www.motorola.com/staticfiles/Business/Products/TV%20Video%20Distribution/Customer%20Premises%20Equipment/All%20Digital%20QAM%20Set-tops/DCX3200/_Documents/staticfile/Updated%20DCX3200.pdf?localeId=33

these boxes support docsis 3.0 DSG.

TWC is now deploying 1GHz nodes(in north texas) from a company called Aurora networks the nodes supposedly support spectrum overlays for future bandwidth needs

aurora node 1

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=Lewisville,+Denton,+Texas&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=47.569986,78.662109&ie=UTF8&cd=1&geocode=Fdk--AEdgvw3-g&split=0&hq=&hnear=Lewisville,+Denton,+Texas&layer=c&cbll=33.003888,-96.989731&panoid=COo10s9S4rp6hjYBgGUFRg&cbp=12,221.47,,2,-21.16&ll=33.003888,-96.989731&spn=0.100773,0.191231&z=12


http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=Lewisville,+Denton,+Texas&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=47.569986,78.662109&ie=UTF8&cd=1&geocode=Fdk--AEdgvw3-g&split=0&hq=&hnear=Lewisville,+Denton,+Texas&layer=c&cbll=33.003777,-96.989729&panoid=DP8Ff7fHJzsuGp6VJZI2JA&cbp=12,326.66,,2,-16.6&ll=33.003777,-96.989729&spn=0.100773,0.191231&z=12

aurora node 2

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=Brown+Blvd,+Arlington,+Tarrant,+Texas&sll=33.003592,-96.988705&sspn=0.192044,0.307274&ie=UTF8&cd=1&geocode=FVkT9AEd0Zo2-g&split=0&hq=&hnear=Brown+Blvd,+Arlington,+Tarrant,+Texas&layer=c&cbll=32.774465,-97.069128&panoid=o7Sm_gPm5bZRQ1jV2QoEhw&cbp=12,321,,2,-28.5&ll=32.774502,-97.069273&spn=0.025258,0.047808&z=14

aurora node 3(note brush in view)

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=S+Carrier+Pkwy+&sll=32.701601,-97.072041&sspn=0.012044,0.019205&ie=UTF8&cd=1&geocode=FYbX8gEdhqg3-g&split=0&hq=&hnear=S+Carrier+Pkwy,+Grand+Prairie,+Dallas,+Texas&layer=c&cbll=32.705456,-97.015395&panoid=L4RV7-CJnLSR-2l8s5TsPA&cbp=12,125.68,,2,-23.86&ll=32.705357,-97.015522&spn=0.00632,0.011952&z=16

aurora node 4

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=Green+Oaks+Blvd,+Arlington,+Tarrant,+Texas+76006&sll=33.003777,-96.989729&sspn=0.101925,0.322037&ie=UTF8&cd=3&geocode=FZFB9AEdqfA2-g&split=0&hq=&hnear=Green+Oaks+Blvd,+Arlington,+Tarrant,+Texas+76006&layer=c&cbll=32.750373,-96.994627&panoid=Uil6vwQkKiRWW-_ZQxazkA&cbp=12,111.98,,2,-25.09&ll=32.753445,-96.986554&spn=0.006316,0.011952&z=16

aurora node 5

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=arkansas+lane+at+center+st&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=47.569986,78.662109&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Arkansas+Ln,+Arlington,+Tarrant,+Texas&layer=c&cbll=32.706107,-97.041189&panoid=5EvYKWmMiKAKnaBTJu7Tiw&cbp=12,7.25,,1,-2.3&ll=32.706115,-97.032816&spn=0.006319,0.011952&z=16

aurora node 6

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=NW+19th+St+&sll=32.709781,-97.022508&sspn=0.001508,0.003422&ie=UTF8&cd=1&geocode=FX3V8wEdyXY3-g&split=0&hq=&hnear=NW+19th+St,+Grand+Prairie,+Dallas,+Texas+75050&layer=c&cbll=32.757096,-97.034803&panoid=7eteSQ_wv9YoqCmpTOiN4w&cbp=12,353.41,,2,-5.26&ll=32.75709,-97.034941&spn=0.006316,0.011952&z=16

the nodes have the feel of the motorola ones but they are not motorola:D

The 3260 is about the same size as my former SA 3250HD. I used to have one but it's slightly bigger than the 4250HDC. The 3270 is slightly smaller than the 8300 DVR's. San Diego will probably start testing it later this year. They want to make the Samsungs work and are working with corporate to get them working. They might deploy them for the employees to test but once they get the ok from engineering and probably corporate to deploy them.

The DCX's support DOCSIS 2.0 not 3.0. No cablebox right now has DOCSIS 3.0 with DSG. It's up to TWC to deploy DSG. They have to make changes to the CMTS to get it.

The 3260 is about the same size as my former SA 3250HD. I used to have one but it's slightly bigger than the 4250HDC. The 3270 is slightly smaller than the 8300 DVR's. San Diego will probably start testing it later this year. They want to make the Samsungs work and are working with corporate to get them working. They might deploy them for the employees to test but once they get the ok from engineering and probably corporate to deploy them.

The DCX's support DOCSIS 2.0 not 3.0. No cablebox right now has DOCSIS 3.0 with DSG. It's up to TWC to deploy DSG. They have to make changes to the CMTS to get it.

the DCX boxes support DOCSIS 2.0+ which means channel bonding.

What do you mean by testing do you mean the newer cisco boxes?

Thursday is just around the corner for Palm Desert and San Diego subscribers.

Woke up to an updated ODN version - 3.2.0_15.


Two differences I've found so far:

As many have requested, Search functions now start from the currently watched show. I presume this is to assist in finding additional showings of the current program. I never use search so this is no big deal to me, but...
Sort by Favorites for the guide is GONE. :eek: That SUCKS so F'n bad...... :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
The Samsung firmware was also updated to 4.3.5. Let's hope there are some positives in the way of reliability (missed FOX/CBS recordings?) from this. The diagnostics password was changed... it's no longer the model number.

As many have requested, Search functions now start from the currently watched show. I presume this is to assist in finding additional showings of the current program. I never use search so this is no big deal to me

For me, this is a little help in a big way. Now when you browse or go to a show in the guide, you're on the show being watched, not back at the letter "A." That's how Passport did it. Well for them it was press (C) to Search and than you would be on the show being watched. I hope the MDN boxes get this too. It's very helpful.

Jack

Sort by Favorites for the guide is GONE.This makes no sense. Why would they take a working feature away? Seriously, what was the thought process? It's not like it cost them anything to keep it. With all the things they ought to be working on, why spend any effort removing perfectly useful features?

This makes no sense. Why would they take a working feature away? Seriously, what was the thought process? It's not like it cost them anything to keep it. With all the things they ought to be working on, why spend any effort removing perfectly useful features?

It makes no sense whatsoever... but it was the first thing that I checked for because it recently disappeared from MDN as well. It had only recently been added to MDN and I think a lot of MDN users weren't even aware of it, but ODN has had it for some time and was, to me, a basic part of the feature set. It was an extremely useful feature and I see no logic in its removal... the code was written and it worked perfectly. About the only reason I can possibly see for its removal would be that the code needed to be cut to make room for some other feature, like the change in search behavior. Just supposition... and NOT a good trade-off IMO.

This makes no sense. Why would they take a working feature away? Seriously, what was the thought process? It's not like it cost them anything to keep it. With all the things they ought to be working on, why spend any effort removing perfectly useful features?

The only reason I can think of i removeing the fav first feature might be in prepration of keyword search. Keyword search works across all channels. Maybe the fav first feature messed that up somehow. This is not knowledge but just my guess. WOODY

Looks like Charlotte beat San Diego to be the first to get the new Navigator .. Guess TWC wanted the folks on the east coast to be disappointed first. Unless San Diego gets some features Charlotte didn't get the update was a washout. We gained one feature and loss one feature. THATS IMPROVEMENT?. Give me a break, WOODY

This makes no sense. Why would they take a working feature away? Seriously, what was the thought process? It's not like it cost them anything to keep it. With all the things they ought to be working on, why spend any effort removing perfectly useful features?

When I first saw that "feature" when I got MDNed, I "thought" it may mean I could set a bunch of favorites and only see them. What I saw was that all it did was move the favorites to the top of the list... thus the list was no longer sorted by channel. I envisioned needing to do a LOT of scrolling... but in truth I did NOT think at the time I could skip the scroll by hitting the fave button when in the guide.

BUT I just did not like the idea of simply moving stuff around. So I did NOT cry when I saw it slip-streamed out of MDN.

I am VERY happy about the "search by the currently selected show" thing. Now I wait to see when it comes to NYC. It gets me a lot closer to swapping out my HD (I see many around these parts and many personal friends who do NOT post here have all sorts of issues with HDC and 3090s in my market, so I seem not to be as affected kept me holding onto my box).

The other changes include new middleware, possibly RTOS updates, and the CableCARD firmware is now updated.

OK... one more time...

It finally dawned on me that that what you describe means that either MDN did this differently than ODN does/did (or at least your perception was different).

In ODN, using Sort by Favorites did not MOVE the favorites to the top of the list... it placed an additional COPY of the favorite at the beginning of the list. The favorites did not disappear from the full listing.

If MDN made the favorites disappear from the full listing, I can understand more of why you disliked the way it worked... but that is NOT how it worked in ODN. It will be greatly missed... way more than ANY search function could ever make up for.


When I first saw that "feature" when I got MDNed, I "thought" it may mean I could set a bunch of favorites and only see them. What I saw was that all it did was move the favorites to the top of the list... thus the list was no longer sorted by channel. I envisioned needing to do a LOT of scrolling... but in truth I did NOT think at the time I could skip the scroll by hitting the fave button when in the guide.

BUT I just did not like the idea of simply moving stuff around. So I did NOT cry when I saw it slip-streamed out of MDN.

I am VERY happy about the "search by the currently selected show" thing. Now I wait to see when it comes to NYC. It gets me a lot closer to swapping out my HD (I see many around these parts and many personal friends who do NOT post here have all sorts of issues with HDC and 3090s in my market, so I seem not to be as affected kept me holding onto my box).

My 8300HDC now mentions ODN v3.2.0_15 but it hasn't been deployed yet.

If MDN made the favorites disappear from the full listing, I can understand more of why you disliked the way it worked... but that is NOT how it worked in ODN. It will be greatly missed... way more than ANY search function could ever make up for.

That's how it worked in MDN. It literally moved the channel positions in the guide.

Woke up to an updated ODN version - 3.2.0_15.

One other difference I have noticed is that I guess the cable box alternates tuners now. If I flip back and forth between ESPN and ABC, it uses separate tuners for the two channels so that I can rewind the channel that I wasn't watching.

It also makes flipping back and forth between two channels almost instantaneous and it happens very quickly now since it already has the second tuner active and is buffering the channel that isn't currently being watched.

I think this feature possibly used to exist pre-navigator, but I cannot remember.

One other difference I have noticed is that I guess the cable box alternates tuners now. If I flip back and forth between ESPN and ABC, it uses separate tuners for the two channels so that I can rewind the channel that I wasn't watching.

It also makes flipping back and forth between two channels almost instantaneous and it happens very quickly now since it already has the second tuner active and is buffering the channel that isn't currently being watched.

I think this feature possibly used to exist pre-navigator, but I cannot remember.

I'll take a look... I probably would not have noticed that because I rarely play buffer games or even use PiP (I have a second display for PoP).

If both tuners are running continuously, that has SERIOUS implications for SDV... would be the same as doubling the number of customers in an SDV group fighting for those channels in the pool... There must be some sort of timeout on the second tuner if you don't access it.

OK... one more time...

It finally dawned on me that that what you describe means that either MDN did this differently than ODN does/did (or at least your perception was different).

In ODN, using Sort by Favorites did not MOVE the favorites to the top of the list... it placed an additional COPY of the favorite at the beginning of the list. The favorites did not disappear from the full listing.

If MDN made the favorites disappear from the full listing, I can understand more of why you disliked the way it worked... but that is NOT how it worked in ODN. It will be greatly missed... way more than ANY search function could ever make up for.

It's not happening any longer, but I'm pretty sure MDN worked the way I described... it simply moved those channels to the top of the list. If I was watching a favorite and hit Guide, I'd have a LONG scroll if I wanted to see some SD channels, so I turned it off. Didn't notice when it got deprecated, but I'd guess during the obvious slip stream that did fix some of the duplicate recordings.

Keep in mind I still seem to have a MDN version that seems to have NOT been rolled out anywhere else... not even the southern end of Manhattan!

One other difference I have noticed is that I guess the cable box alternates tuners now. If I flip back and forth between ESPN and ABC, it uses separate tuners for the two channels so that I can rewind the channel that I wasn't watching.

It also makes flipping back and forth between two channels almost instantaneous and it happens very quickly now since it already has the second tuner active and is buffering the channel that isn't currently being watched.

I think this feature possibly used to exist pre-navigator, but I cannot remember.

Pretty sure that's exactly how my -21 MDN works... as long as you do NOT do ANYTHING (other than swap), it will buffer both channels.

FWIW, it also shows another annoying habit. If I switch the TV input to another source, then go back to the DVR, BOTH tuners are wiped! If I turn the TV off, boom, all tuners are wiped. I used to very frequently pause a source, **** the TV off, go do some chores, come back 45 minutes later, turn the TV on and boom, no buffer at all.

Pretty sure that's exactly how my -21 MDN works... as long as you do NOT do ANYTHING (other than swap), it will buffer both channels.Does it respond to the PIP swap remote command or do you have to re-enter channel numbers to get it to swap? I recall that it has some funky behavior: if you enter a new channel, it always uses the tuner you're not watching and swaps to it, right? So, if you want to channel-surf on one tuner while leaving the other in place, you have to first switch to viewing the tuner you want to stay the same and tune a new channel there.
FWIW, it also shows another annoying habit. If I switch the TV input to another source, then go back to the DVR, BOTH tuners are wiped! If I turn the TV off, boom, all tuners are wiped. I used to very frequently pause a source, **** the TV off, go do some chores, come back 45 minutes later, turn the TV on and boom, no buffer at all.Do you have it connected via HDMI? It might be dumping the tuner when the HDMI connection goes down. If you were using component or some other analog connection there shouldn't be any way for it to tell that you've switched sources or turned the television off.

Keep in mind I still seem to have a MDN version that seems to have NOT been rolled out anywhere else... not even the southern end of Manhattan!

LOL!!!! Watch! Riverside is gonna get something in his diagnostics that says, Navigator 4 that no one else will get! And it will have Keyword Search, remote viewing, Manual Recording, and speech recognition!!! LOL! hahahaha!

That's hilarious Riverside that you are the ONLY one with that MDN -21 build!

If that happens, we can count on those bad Oompa Loompas that kept changing your Scheduled Records as a thing of the past!

Think what you would have if you actually LIKED or WORKED for TWC!!! Hehehehe!!!

Jack

I hope the new update fixes some bugs as it's ready to be deployed soon.

Do you have it connected via HDMI? It might be dumping the tuner when the HDMI connection goes down.

That's exactly what happens. When it loses the handshake it assumes the TV is off and wipes both buffers.

I assume that's to save power/drive but I could be wrong.

I confirmed that the background tuner now continues to buffer.

Also, when coming out of FF or REW, ODN now responds to the press of the Play button... previously it responded to the release of the Play button. Makes more sense, but after a year of it working the other way it's gonna take some time to re-adapt to it.

TWC employees are testing ODN v3.2.0_15 here for about 2 months but they could delay it or release a new version as there could be bugs that could cause problems. It might be delayed about 1 or 2 weeks but who knows. Maybe yet another version will be developed for San Diego. I'm sure we'll see some more updates from TWC to make sure Navigator surpasses Passport.

Since ODN gets their updates first, TWC might alternate. Put out an ODN feature and than if it is really liked. add it to MDN. They are trying to make the boxes as similar as possible. It seems if you want to be the first with new features, you get an ODN box. But if keeping E-SATA support is a big deal to you, you almost have to stick with MDN.

Some are complaining that the ODN boxes are slower than MDN boxes.

Jack

Does it respond to the PIP swap remote command or do you have to re-enter channel numbers to get it to swap? I recall that it has some funky behavior: if you enter a new channel, it always uses the tuner you're not watching and swaps to it, right? So, if you want to channel-surf on one tuner while leaving the other in place, you have to first switch to viewing the tuner you want to stay the same and tune a new channel there.Do you have it connected via HDMI? It might be dumping the tuner when the HDMI connection goes down. If you were using component or some other analog connection there shouldn't be any way for it to tell that you've switched sources or turned the television off.

PIP swap button does work... it pretty much goes to the last channel tuned. Go to a new channel and the one you HAD been watching is available via PIP swap. No one can NOT channel surf on one tuner while the other stays on the channel it had been set to... i.e. another thing Passport did that 'gator does not.

Yes HDMI... I knew HDMI was a 2 way protocol, but it MAY be that now it rigidly adheres to some spec. Swap inputs on the TV, lose the buffer... pause a live program, turn the TV on and off, boom all buffers wiped. Power the TV off, lose the buffer, switch inputs on the TV, lose all buffers. No matter, I do not like it. It does not HAVE to work like this... on the same hardware it did NOT on the late lamented, real DVR software we USED to have.

I know I could go component, but I'm a bit of a night owl, so I turn off my receiver and use the TV speakers. Without HDMI I'd need at least 5 cables run AND swapping one fore the other would take m,any more button presses I think.

Some are complaining that the ODN boxes are slower than MDN boxes.

Jack

From what I read, the Samsung 3090 is "snappier" in the UI than other ODN boxes.

Does the new 3.2.0.15 version of Navigator have the new improved program discriptions that includes origional air date? I have be told that Greensboro and Raleigh engineers are now testing the new version. Do not have any information about South Carolina sorry. WOODY

ODN v3.2.0_15 was just loaded today on TWC San Diego.

Does the new 3.2.0.15 version of Navigator have the new improved program discriptions that includes origional air date? I have be told that Greensboro and Raleigh engineers are now testing the new version. Do not have any information about South Carolina sorry. WOODY

We are still stuck with the greatly reduced set of data... BUT I have seen one "new" thing. Most serial shows now seem to carry a year, which is useful but not as much a original air date. At least for -21 MDN/NYC!! STILL no Director (movies) and in many cases, no actors either.

Does the new 3.2.0.15 version of Navigator have the new improved program discriptions that includes origional air date? I have be told that Greensboro and Raleigh engineers are now testing the new version. Do not have any information about South Carolina sorry. WOODY

We've had the expanded descriptions for some time now with the prior version of ODN... they appear unchanged with 3.2.0_15. The ODN version is not the only determining factor as to whether you get the expanded guide info... the headend has to be pushing the info out as well.

Some are complaining that the ODN boxes are slower than MDN boxes.

From what I read, the Samsung 3090 is "snappier" in the UI than other ODN boxes.

My previous 8300HDC (10/08 build date) and current 4250HDC (12/09 build date) were never as slow as some folks have described (and never annoyingly so) but my Samsung 3090 (3/09 build) is still noticeably faster in certain operations. I've not had an MDN box of any type, but from what I have seen of them, the are slightly faster than the HDCs but not as fast as the Samsungs. I would suspect that the latest generation of Cisco boxes are at least comparable to the Sammie.

ODN v3.2.0_15 added this interesting feature called Remote DVR. I think it's a part of the new myServices page and will allow you to remotely access your DVR online through the myservices account.

My division has released a better than average FAQ for Navigator. Go to this site, and scroll down to about 3/4th's down the page to two PDF files. (These require Adobe Reader or Equivalent to view.) One is troubleshooting tips and the other is FAQ.

Note that there is also a Quick Start Guide, but that's the same junk that most of us have known about for three years. Tips can be used in all divisions and apply to both MDN/ODN boxes.

http://www.timewarnercable.com/Wisconsin/learn/cable/navigator/default.html

Jack

ODN v3.2.0_15 added this interesting feature called Remote DVR. I think it's a part of the new myServices page and will allow you to remotely access your DVR online through the myservices account.

Has anybody tried ODN v3.2.0_15 with eSATA?

Apparenly San Diego is having issues with the 4250HDC's not booting with ODN v3.2.0_15. They acknowledge the issue and are working to fix it. If you're affected then go to the payment center and swap for a Samsung 3260 if at all possible.

4x REW and FF are also coming to ODN in a future update.

Apparenly San Diego is having issues with the 4250HDC's not booting with ODN v3.2.0_15. They acknowledge the issue and are working to fix it. If you're affected then go to the payment center and swap for a Samsung 3260 if at all possible.

So far, I haven't had a problem with my bedroom 4250HDC since the update (it must have rebooted at least once after the update). It is a brand new unit (12/09 build date)... I wonder if vintage has any bearing on the issue.

Is Enhanced search available to everyone....I don't have it here in the O.C..

Has anybody tried ODN v3.2.0_15 with eSATA?

Ah, hope springs eternal!

Ah, hope springs eternal!

I know it's along shot, but I had to ask.

Re: ODN v3.2.0_15

Bring back sort by favorites!! This was a big step backwards.

ODN v3.2.0_15 is great if you have an HDC DVR or a Samsung box as it did make the 4250HDC's freak out. They were constantly rebooting. Almost all of them had that issue. They still haven't fixed it yet. The Service and Payment centers were swamped with people trying to swap out their 4250HDC's with a 4240HDC. The Samsungs were out of stock so people were having to get their boxes swapped ASAP. The 4250HDC is bad yet the 4240HDC is great. This update caused a huge problem but it seems to be a San Diego thing. People in Charlotte have no problems. Something must be wrong in San Diego causing this issue.

One person reported that 1/3 of the line at the local payment center were people affected by the 4250HDC fiasco.

Does anyone have a source in engineering for their divisions that can explain why the Sort By Favorites is gone from both MDN/ODN boxes?

Will this feature come back?

Thanks in advance.

Jack

Rebooting my box seemed to fix my 3270's broken DVR function. Now it works. I emailed my engineering contact about sort by favorites.

Rebooting my box seemed to fix my 3270's broken DVR function. Now it works. I emailed my engineering contact about sort by favorites.

Thanks!

Jack

What are the good and bad features of the Samsung 3270 box?

What are the good and bad features of the Samsung 3270 box?

No PIP on the 3270 totally scotches it for me... it all depends on whether or how much one uses it.

Not to mention it seems to only be available in SD at this point...

I think they stopped deploying it. The Live TV buffer is useless. Can't pause, REW or FF the buffer. Has to be rebooted daily in order to temporarily fix it. They need to deploy a new SW release soon. All they carry are SA 4240 and 8240HDC's.

Does any one know when or if New york city (TWC) will be getting the updates any time soon 3.2 .0.15 ???

Navigator Tip: How to Keep Shows From Cutting off Beginning and End Times

I used to have that problem from time to time. Passport always seemed to start about a minute early without doing anything so that users would not miss programs as the default setting. However, sometimes the guide data from the head-end or the station management will run things by starting them early or ending them later. In that instance, it's not a Navigator issue but a station issue. The industry is seeing more and more shows with start times that are not on the direct time listed in many IPG's.

For example, if there is a good episode of Malcolm in the Middle, whether I record it off of my local Fox station syndicated, or FX, or Teen Nick the show always starts about 2-3 minutes BEFORE the actual time of the scheduled start. And to combat this, there's no way around it other than to add additional time by starting the show before it begins. In Navigator for "Malcolm" I will always do:

Record Show With Options

Change Start Time/Start two minutes early than usually
Change End Time/End two minutes later.

I pad the start and stop times for just about everything, not so much because of Navigator, but the tons of stations that no longer in this day and age start a show "Directly on the hour or half-hour as scheduled."

Any movie planned to record I give two extra minutes before start time and five minutes after the end time.

***TIP: NAVIGATOR USERS*******

If you have two shows that are back to back in the grid and you want to record both, DON'T just select record this show twice in the grid, sometimes that will cause cut-off. What you need to do is just extend the end time of the first program. Here is an example.

Suppose The Simpsons is on your local Fox syndicate from 6-6:30 and Family Guy is on from 6:30-7, but you want to record both of them. They are back to back on the same channel.

1.) Find The Simpson's in the IPG.

2.) Select "Record This Show" WITH OPTIONS.

3.) Select "Adjust Start Time" to "2 minutes early"

4.) Select "Adjust End Time" to "30 minutes later."

5.) Enter the Recording.

You have now selected BOTH shows to record. Navigator THINKS that it's just one show block, so when that 6:30 start time for Family Guy begins there will be no break in the recording. I do this all the time and it works great!

As long as both tuners are not busy you should have no problem recording two shows at once. Use the overlap method described above and remember to add a few minutes of early start time and early end time for shows that are important to you. This helped me a lot!

Jack

Now This is Funny!!!!

Sometimes late Saturday night as a fan of old classic B-grade horror movies, I watch Wolfman Mac's Chiller Drive Inn. And what I am about to say only happens on Retro TV, when watching that program and it has happened twice in a row each week.

About twenty minutes into the movie, the picture just starts fast-forwarding by itself!!!! I have to go back and rewind to see what I missed. The thing is, I fast forward through commercials and am known to fall asleep and wake up and last week when I woke up the movie had ended and the Save, Delete, and Exit options were on the screen! I was thinking, "Wow! That was fast!" I don't know if I am FFing in my sleep or Navigator just hates Wolfman Mac's Chiller Drive Inn and wants to Fast Forward through it on its own!!!

Riverside, I think I inherited your Oompa Loopas!!!! Maybe next week we can find a show that they, Navigator, and me, all like!!! LOL!!!

I don't think the info banner was on the screen so maybe this is something at the station. There production values are very low and last week they even had an "Audio Problem At Source" message through the whole movie. But it's still funny!

Jack

Ha.... Jack, someone told me Ooompas do NOT like cheese!

I got a question! I had read about but haven't had to deal with it until now... setting up a series recording for episodes that do NOT carry the NEW designation (i.e. Southland, which is now technically not running NEW as they are the episodes already aired). I had set it up with "New or Repeats" and so far it SEEMS to pick the first broadcast and not schedule subsequent airings. I THINK that one of them had gotten moved to a subsequent timeslot as I always pout repeating series shows (cable channels) in a lower priority slot.

So I've been thinking about "New Only" and "New and Repeats." Seems to me, MDN changes that equation given the "resolution" schema... to the point where it SEEMS there may be no practical difference between the two. "New and Repeats" seems to be the default, so why would one ever use "New Only?"

Also, I see a frequent mention of a "28 days" feature that I think has to do with it NOT scheduling a specific episode already carrying a "deleted" entry in the log... but my log does NOT carry 28 days of data, it's more like 14 days (not "like", it is, the earliest entry is 1/13). Maybe this is a ODN/MDN thing? Or maybe a -19 vs -21 MDn thikng?

...so why would one ever use "New Only?



At least two reasons:

To prevent recording of off-season repeats
To prevent recording of old episodes for shows that regularly show both premiere episodes and repeat episodes on the same channel, such as The Closer on TNT
I only use "New and Repeats" in two cases:

The show doesn't carry "New" designations (somewhat common - but not universal - for non-episodic programs such as news series)
It is a syndicated or off-season series that I missed in premiere season and I'm "catching up" on old episodes
Also, mine (ODN) seems to always carry 12-14 days in the recording log. I don't know where the 28 day reference would come from.

I got a question! I had read about but haven't had to deal with it until now... setting up a series recording for episodes that do NOT carry the NEW designation (i.e. Southland, which is now technically not running NEW as they are the episodes already aired). I had set it up with "New or Repeats" and so far it SEEMS to pick the first broadcast and not schedule subsequent airings. I THINK that one of them had gotten moved to a subsequent timeslot as I always pout repeating series shows (cable channels) in a lower priority slot.

So I've been thinking about "New Only" and "New and Repeats." Seems to me, MDN changes that equation given the "resolution" schema... to the point where it SEEMS there may be no practical difference between the two. "New and Repeats" seems to be the default, so why would one ever use "New Only?"

Also, I see a frequent mention of a "28 days" feature that I think has to do with it NOT scheduling a specific episode already carrying a "deleted" entry in the log... but my log does NOT carry 28 days of data, it's more like 14 days (not "like", it is, the earliest entry is 1/13). Maybe this is a ODN/MDN thing? Or maybe a -19 vs -21 MDn thikng?

On ODN the recording log does not delete for 30 days. Thus giveing Navigator a version of the TIVO 28 day rule. Check your MDN they may have changed that to 30 days. ODN is 30 days. A tech at time warner told me even if you did not see it in the guide it is on th drive for 30 days. WOODY

On ODN the recording log does not delete for 30 days.

Haven't check since the latest 3.2.0_15 update, but it has never been more than 14 days on any of my ODN boxes.

Haven't check since the latest 3.2.0_15 update, but it has never been more than 14 days on any of my ODN boxes.

The early literature provided said Navigator scans up to 14 days in the future. I don't know if that was changed, was a B.S PR thing, or whatever. I know that the IPG only advances 7 days. (At least on my division's MDN boxes.) The Recording Log for MDN in my area is 14 days. So if they changed this to 30 days, it might be an ODN only thing. (For now.)

Jack

The early literature provided said Navigator scans up to 14 days in the future. I don't know if that was changed, was a B.S PR thing, or whatever. I know that the IPG only advances 7 days. (At least on my division's MDN boxes.) The Recording Log for MDN in my area is 14 days. So if they changed this to 30 days, it might be an ODN only thing. (For now.)

Jack

I will recheck the new version tonight, but ODN 3.x has always been 7 days out on the guide and 14 days history in the log (consistent with your MDN experience).

And... the 7 days out on the guide is really 6 days in practice, because it will not typically allow programs 7 days out to be selected for recording.

The early literature provided said Navigator scans up to 14 days in the future. I don't know if that was changed, was a B.S PR thing, or whatever. I know that the IPG only advances 7 days. (At least on my division's MDN boxes.) The Recording Log for MDN in my area is 14 days. So if they changed this to 30 days, it might be an ODN only thing. (For now.)

Jack

If you will go to the Brighthose website and look under Navigator guide. They use Navigator also. It confirms what the TWC tech told me that information in the recording log stays available for 30 days. I think it is on page 2 of their Navigator questions about midway down the page. Has a lot of other cool Navigator info also. WOODY

If you will go to the Brighthose website and look under Navigator guide. They use Navigator also. It confirms what the TWC tech told me that information in the recording log stays available for 30 days. I think it is on page 2 of their Navigator questions about midway down the page. Has a lot of other cool Navigator info also. WOODY

Thanks CW,

Will check it out!

Jack

Checked out my recording log last night and had two shows that were deleated on Jan. 11 and 3 shows deleted on Jan. 13. But I have a lot of shows over 12 to 15 days old still in my recording log. Just checked it again as I was typeing and I am correct on this. WOODY

At least two reasons:

Ah, thanks so much, makes perfect sense...

On ODN the recording log does not delete for 30 days. Thus giveing Navigator a version of the TIVO 28 day rule. Check your MDN they may have changed that to 30 days. ODN is 30 days. A tech at time warner told me even if you did not see it in the guide it is on th drive for 30 days. WOODY

Ah, no, it's still 2 weeks on my MDN.

Has anybody tried ODN v3.2.0_15 with eSATA?

I would very much like to know this as well, and don't want to be the guinea pig to find out it will erase some of my existing recordings on the internal drive or something. Anyone brave enough to try?

Thx,
TT

Ah, no, it's still 2 weeks on my MDN.

What I was told that even if you do not see it in the log it stays registered on the drive 30 days. The Brighthouse website Navigator page 2 or 3 confirms this. Brighthouse folk get a lot more information than us Time Warner folk do. It has 8 or 9 pages of information on Navigator on their site. WOODY

SatchMan,

You have posted on multiple occasions that you think TWC will improve Navigator. I have disagreed and said that TWC will only improve Navigator when they start losing large numbers of cable subscribers and/or road runner / digital phone growth slows.

Well TWC announced their quarterly earnings today and they lost 105,000 cable customers during the quarter and road runner / digital phone growth slowed.

They also announced that they would begin rolling out a multi-room DVR year.

Coincidence? I think not.

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=187230&site=cdn&

Based on recent history with both Navigator(software) and Samsung(hardware) I think there is a 0% chance that we will see a multi-room DVR this year.

TWC just isn't very good, or fast, at rolling out new technology.

SatchMan,

You have posted on multiple occasions that you think TWC will improve Navigator. I have disagreed and said that TWC will only improve Navigator when they start losing large numbers of cable subscribers and/or road runner / digital phone growth slows.

Well TWC announced their quarterly earnings today and they lost 105,000 cable customers during the quarter and road runner / digital phone growth slowed.

They also announced that they would begin rolling out a multi-room DVR year.

Coincidence? I think not.

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=187230&site=cdn&

Based on recent history with both Navigator(software) and Samsung(hardware) I think there is a 0% chance that we will see a multi-room DVR this year.

TWC just isn't very good, or fast, at rolling out new technology.

I think they will improve Navigator, but it won't be big deal things. For example, the rumored Keyword Search addition will just expand the use of the existing keyboard. And they might add some manual recording functions. I put in a request for our engineering department to add those features. That's the thing to do. If you contact TWC about IPG bugs or updates be sure to tell them:

1.) The box you have ODN or MDN.

2.) And be sure to say, "send my request to engineering." If enough customers do this, they can get responses at the corporate level for new features and bug fixes. BUT, if no one says, "send my inquiry to engineering," they often don't hear about the issues and think that everything is OK.

Customers have to call, write, or E-mail and request that the new service inquiries be forwarded to the engineering department for a new feature or bug fix consideration. Otherwise, little of anything will be done.

Jack

yea i miss manuel recording and also day by day recording...this sofware sux..

8300hdc

The SARA WI systems are getting Navigator. They're doing it by box type. The DVR's haven't been updated as of this post.

Have noticed another oddity. For the past few months, I see this once or twice per week. Looking through the log, I see a series recording notation that says it failed to record because the channel wasn't available. But in every case so far, there's an entry for one minute PAST the hour where it DOES record and carries the "deleted by the user" designation (after I watch and delete it).

Does anyone see this (mention ODN or MDN if you have)? Makes me nervous because I'd bet at some point it simply won't record at all...

I just picked up a new remote from TW. It's a new model for me - Synergy V RT-U64CP. It's nice, but I'm having trouble programming it to change the channels on my TV. The channel up-down and individual channel buttons only control the channels on the DVR. On my old remote you could easily change this. Has anyone figured out how to control the TV channels with this remote?

Ah, no, it's still 2 weeks on my MDN.

Same here... same old 12 days I have always seen, even with the update to 3.2.0_15... not that it really matters much. The only practical difference is a 14 day vs 28 day window of not re-recording a repeated episode. Thats really the only function the log serves, anyway, other than informational.

I just picked up a new remote from TW. It's a new model for me - Synergy V RT-U64CP. It's nice, but I'm having trouble programming it to change the channels on my TV. The channel up-down and individual channel buttons only control the channels on the DVR. On my old remote you could easily change this. Has anyone figured out how to control the TV channels with this remote?

Here is the guide for your model of remote (I hope.) It's in PDF file format, requires Abobe Reader or compatible viewer to open. You will need to increase the % size when you open the viewer

http://www.brctv.com/customer_care/userguides/pdf/RT-U64CP-CD%20Instruction%20Manual%20%2802.02.09%29.pdf

What version DVR do you have? You would want the remote to change the channels on your DVR and leave your TV set to Channel 3. The DVR is what the cable remote is programed to control as the default.

Jack

Here is the guide for your model of remote (I hope.) It's in PDF file format, requires Abobe Reader or compatible viewer to open. You will need to increase the % size when you open the viewer

http://www.brctv.com/customer_care/userguides/pdf/RT-U64CP-CD%20Instruction%20Manual%20%2802.02.09%29.pdf

What version DVR do you have? You would want the remote to change the channels on your DVR and leave your TV set to Channel 3. The DVR is what the cable remote is programed to control as the default.

Jack

Thanks, but they gave me that guide with it. It doesn't say anything about changing the TV channels. I have the SA8300 HD. But I also use the remote to watch the TV only. I could do this with the old remote, but no this one. Is that progress?

Thanks, but they gave me that guide with it. It doesn't say anything about changing the TV channels. I have the SA8300 HD. But I also use the remote to watch the TV only. I could do this with the old remote, but no this one. Is that progress?

Have you tried all the equipment codes to program the remote? If none of the codes give you that function then the remote doesn't hold the full codeset.

There is also the possibility that the code you want is listed under a different manufacturer. Sometimes hardware that shares the same technology but is sold under different names also has the code you need.

Have you tried all the equipment codes to program the remote? If none of the codes give you that function then the remote doesn't hold the full codeset.

There is also the possibility that the code you want is listed under a different manufacturer. Sometimes hardware that shares the same technology but is sold under different names also has the code you need.

Tried it with 3 tv's. I've searched all the codes. The old remote had a feature where you just enter 3 #'s and then each device can use it's own channel control. This new one must have that too, but I can't find the codes to change it. Looks like its back to Time Warner to get an older remote........

Tried it with 3 tv's. I've searched all the codes. The old remote had a feature where you just enter 3 #'s and then each device can use it's own channel control. This new one must have that too, but I can't find the codes to change it. Looks like its back to Time Warner to get an older remote........

You could start randomly stabbing away using codes from their other remotes

http://remotes.gocontec.com/products.aspx

or if you're feeling lucky, try the code finder by selecting TWC as service provider on this page.

http://remotes.gocontec.com/default.aspx

Thanks, but they gave me that guide with it. It doesn't say anything about changing the TV channels. I have the SA8300 HD. But I also use the remote to watch the TV only. I could do this with the old remote, but no this one. Is that progress?

What I am confused about is why do you want to change the channels separately? Or why do you not want to be able to use the DVR to change the channels exclusively? Is there a station on your OTA that cable doesn't get that you want to watch?

For everyone that I know their DVR boxes are their TV tuner channel changers. Now I DO know people that HATE the TWC DVR and it's ugly Navigator interface and they have TIVO's or MOXI boxes in their places with cable cards and tuning adapters for cable. But even in that case, AFAIK, they are still using the cable box to change channels.

There is a setting in Navigator under Settings called By-Pass (not sure where it is, but if you activate that, you can tune to cable channels when the box is off.) But I have never used that. I wonder if you would need a splitter of some kind to do what you want to do? But I know that splitting signals can interfere with picture quality.

Jack

What I am confused about is why do you want to change the channels separately? Or why do you not want to be able to use the DVR to change the channels exclusively? Is there a station on your OTA that cable doesn't get that you want to watch?

It's a universal remote. You are supposed to be able to operate other equipment with it. I used to use it to control TV while watching over direct coax when both tuners of the DVR were busy.

It's a universal remote. You are supposed to be able to operate other equipment with it. I used to use it to control TV while watching over direct coax when both tuners of the DVR were busy.

You're exactly right. That's why I want to change the TV channels with it. The previous remote I got from them last year allowed you to make the change easily for all your devices. This one has no such option that i can see.

Moving to Charlotte NC and getting TWC. Had DirecTV for last 6 years so no current experience with current cable equipment.

What HD DVR am I likely to get from TW in this area, and is there a particular one to ask for or to avoid?

Browsed a lot of threads and searched, but didn't find much...

Many thanks!

-Jeff

Re: ODN v3.2.0_15

Bring back sort by favorites!! This was a big step backwards.Lost features are the least of my worries at this point. :(

This new ODN version has some serious functional bugs. So far, I have had 4 instances of the DVR "Rewind" malfunctioning. The first time, I pressed rewind shortly after changing channels to replay a segment of live buffer I missed and the DVR froze. Nothing I could do would make it play again. Oddly, shutting the power off did not kill the display on the TV--it had a black block in the middle, but the borders still displayed the frozen picture. The DVR would not respond to any other inputs, so I finally rebooted it.

The second time, I was recording one program and watching another, and had maybe 45 minutes in the live buffer when I hit "rewind" on the live show. When I got to the portion of the program I wanted to watch again, I hit "play" but the DVR continued rewinding and would not stop no matter what I did. It would not respond to any input again (changing channels, pushing "play" or "pause" or "fast forward" had no effect. Turning the power off to the DVR resulted in the same thing--a black square in the middle of the screen with the rewinding program continuing in the borders! I didn't want to wait to see if it would end when the buffer ran out (I had only pressed the rewind key once, so it was backing up slowly) so I rebooted again and all functions were restored. I did notice in these reboots that the blue Mystro screen was missing in the process--I saw the Scientific Atlanta screen at the beginning, but it went black while the box counted down from L13 to L1 on its digital display. Previously, there was always a blue screen with "Mystro" on the TV with a yellow progress bar (or rectangles) during this stage of the boot process. Anyone else notice this? When the reboot sequence ends, the DVR comes on to channel 0 now, too, instead of remaining off, as it used to do. I always had to push the "power" button after a reboot before.

My wife experienced another freeze when pressing the rewind button yesterday, and today I was recording the Daytona 24 hour race and watching it at the same time. I tried to rewind to watch an on-track incident again, and it would not stop rewinding. This time I let it reverse through the entire buffer to see what would happen. At the point where I tuned to the show live, it simply froze, and still would not respond to any keystroke input.

I'm not sure if this is an HDMI quirk, but it is extremely annoying because the reboot process takes soooo long and I lose that portion of any program I am recording while the reboot takes place. Maybe I should switch to component cables to see if it makes a difference. It is totally unreliable as is.

On the plus side, I do like it that they have restored the search function to find the show you are tuned to in the listings as a default, rather than bringing up the "Find Shows" screen at the beginning of the alphabet. This is the way it used to work and is handy for finding other instances of the show you are watching for future recording without typing in the name on the keyboard. I missed that feature in all the interim revisions of Navigator. I still don't know if the eSATA will work as I haven't bothered to hook it up yet for fear of losing existing recordings on the internal drive. I'm waiting for others to experiment first.

TT

Have noticed another oddity. For the past few months, I see this once or twice per week. Looking through the log, I see a series recording notation that says it failed to record because the channel wasn't available. But in every case so far, there's an entry for one minute PAST the hour where it DOES record and carries the "deleted by the user" designation (after I watch and delete it).

Does anyone see this (mention ODN or MDN if you have)? Makes me nervous because I'd bet at some point it simply won't record at all...

Hi Riverside .... I have an 8300HD using MDN and I have noticed the same thing. I thought it was curious but so far it has not not recorded something that was programmed. I don't know if it may be related to SDV, since you do get a message that "the channel is not available (CNA), try again later" when the node you are assigned to is maxed out. I was getting a lot of CNAs recently and the engineer I spoke with said they were going to have to add a node in the hub which serves me to alleviate the problem. I am going to watch if this "oddity" continues to occur or if it goes away since they installed the new node last week.

Lost features are the least of my worries at this point. :(

This new ODN version has some serious functional bugs. So far, I have had 4 instances of the DVR "Rewind" malfunctioning. The first time, I pressed rewind shortly after changing channels to replay a segment of live buffer I missed and the DVR froze. Nothing I could do would make it play again. Oddly, shutting the power off did not kill the display on the TV--it had a black block in the middle, but the borders still displayed the frozen picture. The DVR would not respond to any other inputs, so I finally rebooted it.

The second time, I was recording one program and watching another, and had maybe 45 minutes in the live buffer when I hit "rewind" on the live show. When I got to the portion of the program I wanted to watch again, I hit "play" but the DVR continued rewinding and would not stop no matter what I did. It would not respond to any input again (changing channels, pushing "play" or "pause" or "fast forward" had no effect. Turning the power off to the DVR resulted in the same thing--a black square in the middle of the screen with the rewinding program continuing in the borders! I didn't want to wait to see if it would end when the buffer ran out (I had only pressed the rewind key once, so it was backing up slowly) so I rebooted again and all functions were restored. I did notice in these reboots that the blue Mystro screen was missing in the process--I saw the Scientific Atlanta screen at the beginning, but it went black while the box counted down from L13 to L1 on its digital display. Previously, there was always a blue screen with "Mystro" on the TV with a yellow progress bar (or rectangles) during this stage of the boot process. Anyone else notice this? When the reboot sequence ends, the DVR comes on to channel 0 now, too, instead of remaining off, as it used to do. I always had to push the "power" button after a reboot before.

My wife experienced another freeze when pressing the rewind button yesterday, and today I was recording the Daytona 24 hour race and watching it at the same time. I tried to rewind to watch an on-track incident again, and it would not stop rewinding. This time I let it reverse through the entire buffer to see what would happen. At the point where I tuned to the show live, it simply froze, and still would not respond to any keystroke input.

I'm not sure if this is an HDMI quirk, but it is extremely annoying because the reboot process takes soooo long and I lose that portion of any program I am recording while the reboot takes place. Maybe I should switch to component cables to see if it makes a difference. It is totally unreliable as is.

On the plus side, I do like it that they have restored the search function to find the show you are tuned to in the listings as a default, rather than bringing up the "Find Shows" screen at the beginning of the alphabet. This is the way it used to work and is handy for finding other instances of the show you are watching for future recording without typing in the name on the keyboard. I missed that feature in all the interim revisions of Navigator. I still don't know if the eSATA will work as I haven't bothered to hook it up yet for fear of losing existing recordings on the internal drive. I'm waiting for others to experiment first.

TT

It's just as bad, if not worse on the Samsung DVR. This update is as stable as a buggy Alpha release. Hopefully they can get it fixed ASAP.

Hi Riverside .... I have an 8300HD using MDN and I have noticed the same thing. I thought it was curious but so far it has not not recorded something that was programmed. I don't know if it may be related to SDV, since you do get a message that "the channel is not available (CNA), try again later" when the node you are assigned to is maxed out. I was getting a lot of CNAs recently and the engineer I spoke with said they were going to have to add a node in the hub which serves me to alleviate the problem. I am going to watch if this "oddity" continues to occur or if it goes away since they installed the new node last week.

Not an SDV issue, while they seem ready at the server end, no SDV channel is happening. I think my system still has the ability to add up to 26 more HD channels without HAVING to go to SDV. We have something like 123, so based on need, I don't see it happening this year.

Of course, the smart thing for them to do is have one or two SDV channels... mostly so they can troubleshoot deliver to the end user. It's my impression that each system seems to have nasty issues with SDV until they get some experience under their belts.

Then again, has ANYONE EVER thought anything TWC does can be called "smart?"

Hasn't been a big issue so far because every time, it seems to start the recording one minute later.

The 3270 still doesn't have PIP but it now gains dual buffers. You can swap tuners but you can't get PIP.

The 3270 has gotten noisier due to the dual buffers but thats ok, unless you have one as a bedroom unit and are very sensitive to noise while you sleep.

Not an SDV issue, while they seem ready at the server end, no SDV channel is happening. I think my system still has the ability to add up to 26 more HD channels without HAVING to go to SDV. We have something like 123, so based on need, I don't see it happening this year.
...
.

How is your system configured to have such excess capacity? Have they eliminated all analog channels in your area? We still have analog chans 2 thru 77 which consume a lot of bandwidth. The local engineers would like nothing more than to ditch SDV and convert the analogs to digital but that would create a real PR issue with those customers who are still using cable ready sets w/o a STB. They are learning SDV on the job, when it works it's fine but when it's not working it is a nightmare. I subscribe to the Center Ice package and I get really PO'd when I switch to a game I want to watch and I get a "Channel Not Available, Try Again Later" message. Just curious ... thanks

Did some more testing/investigating this weekend. Many of you already know that I have generally liked the Samsung 3090 and, despite a few quirks, still prefer it over over any 8300 (HD or HDC). Here is how the most recent ODN/Samsung updates have affected the quirks/problems I have experienced and previously reported.

Refusal to record FOX/CBS w/ "Channel not Available" message in the record log - It's still early, but I have hopes that the latest updates may have resolved this issue. I ran the box all of last week without doing a preventative reboot. I had no recording issues whatsoever last week, so I am cautiously optimistic. (This was primarily a Charlotte and NYC issue).
Inability to Boot Succesfully into ODN with HDMI connected to my Onkyo 876 AVR - Previously, two different 3090s I've had have refused to load Navigator (hung at OCAP display, then booted into native Samsung GUI) with an active HDMI connection to my AVR. Retested this last night for first time since updates... Box will now load Navigator with HDMI connection to 876, BUT, there are still issues:

Mystro countdown screen is not present on HDMI connection (it does still show with component connections). Not a big deal in and of itself, but...
Once it boots into Navigator, the clock is incorrect (always starts up at 7:01) and there is no guide or program info (all other Navigator menus/screens are present). With HDMI connection severed, the box will still boot normally into ODN with correct time and guide. Repeated this test 3 times each way... always same results (no clock or guide with HDMI connection to 876, good guide and clock with component connection).

Inconsistent FF/REW operation - As I have previously reported, they screwed this up worse than it already was. Still very inconsistent, but over a wider range. Gross changes in sample size and speed can occur within the same FF operation, and the jumpback is now way too long.
Search Changes - I have found no changes other than the previously reported "homing" to the current show when activating search functions.
Buffer Changes - Nothing new to report other than the box seems to consistently buffer the background tuner now, even after long stretches of no swapping and even on SDV channels.
Corrupted display of EDID data of TV/AVR - In previous Samsung versions (2.4.9.x), the hardware diagnostics would display a corrupted mess of over 20 non-existent supported video modes in its HDMI diagnostics pages. That appears to be corrected, with correct video mode EDID information displayed when HDMI is connected to either my Onko 876 or Samsung A550 TV.
Sort by Favorites - Still gone. :( This one really kills me. Despite the fact that I have been willing to put up with the box's quirks, THIS would be something that would compell me to swap to a different box... IF an alternative existed. Alas, there are no TW boxes in this market that still have sort by favorites.
Fortunately, I have not experienced any of the instability issues others have reported with this update... other than as noted above, the updates seem to run well on both my SA/Cisco 4250HDC and Samsung 3090.

How is your system configured to have such excess capacity? Have they eliminated all analog channels in your area? We still have analog chans 2 thru 77 which consume a lot of bandwidth. The local engineers would like nothing more than to ditch SDV and convert the analogs to digital but that would create a real PR issue with those customers who are still using cable ready sets w/o a STB. They are learning SDV on the job, when it works it's fine but when it's not working it is a nightmare. I subscribe to the Center Ice package and I get really PO'd when I switch to a game I want to watch and I get a "Channel Not Available, Try Again Later" message. Just curious ... thanks

NYC did reduce their analog channel count significantly a while back... I think they may be running 860MHz plant as well, where most systems are probably still 750MHz.

I'm surprised that you still have SDV issues... other than an occasional obvious failure where a whole group of channels are out for an extended period of time (which has happened only 2-3 times since we went SDV here), I can say that I never see the "Channel Not Available" message and, without checking the diagnostics pages in the box or some other reference, would be unable to differentiate the switched shannels from the "broadcast" channels.

NYC did reduce their analog channel count significantly a while back... I think they may be running 860MHz plant as well, where most systems are probably still 750MHz.

I'm surprised that you still have SDV issues... other than an occasional obvious failure where a whole group of channels are out for an extended period of time (which has happened only 2-3 times since we went SDV here), I can say that I never see the "Channel Not Available" message and, without checking the diagnostics pages in the box or some other reference, would be unable to differentiate the switched shannels from the "broadcast" channels.

The problem with SDV is that the engineers/operations folks have to periodically monitor the number of folks assigned to a node. The demand for channels "in the SDV pool" changes over time due to such things as: the customer procuring new HDTVs and upgrading their service to the digital tiers, the number of new HDTV channels added to the system causing increased demand/interest in watching channels in the pool etc. In other words it is a dynamic not a static, set it up and forget it, variable. It sounds like a great technology for maximizing the use of limited bandwidth but if it is not monitored and tweaked over time problems will arise. In the Triad-NC area they tend to set it (the SDV config) up and walk away from it until someone complains.

In discussions with the local engineers they have assigned all HDTV channels to the SDV pool (excluding the OTA local channels) and have also assigned most of the digital non-HD channels to the pool as well. So depending on the time of day or the node demand at a given point in time you may or may not get the dreaded CNA message.

I have escalated this to the local Customer Service executives and they, in turn, have put me in touch with the engineers responsible for configuring the hub and node to which I am assigned. It seems when I complain they do something to fix the problem for a few weeks or so but then, eventually the problem comes back and I have to scream again.

As I said earlier I think the long term solution is to do away with SDV altogether and free up the bandwidth so that channels can have a dedicated frequency assignment, rather than sharing bandwidth.

As I said earlier I think the long term solution is to do away with SDV altogether and free up the bandwidth so that channels can have a dedicated frequency assignment, rather than sharing bandwidth.I strongly doubt that that wil happen. They'll find other profitable things to do with the freed up bandwidth.

I strongly doubt that that wil happen. They'll find other profitable things to do with the freed up bandwidth.
For example, much higher cable modem data rates when they deploy DOCSIS 3.0 with channel
bonding technology, combining FOUR (or EIGHT) QAM channels into a single data stream:
http://arstechnica.com/telecom/news/2009/01/cable-modems-to-hit-300mbps-with-8-channel-bonding.ars
PS: TWC-SD is already employing at least two freq assignments for cable modems.

And then LAN Parties won't have to take over someone's garage:
http://www.thealmightyguru.com/Games/Games-LAN.html
And heavily viewed UTube (et. al.) will jump to Hi-Def....

And Hi-Def Video Phones will be ubiquitous in DTV's (and cable boxes???):
http://about.skype.com/press/2010/01/panasonic.html
http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/05/skype-hd-720p-videocalling-from-pcs-or-directly-through-lg-and-pa/

Which means two-way high data rate usage will skyrocket...requiring
increasingly larger cable modem bandwidth allocations to keep up....

And as they finally deploy the Next Gen Navigator that can actually find
OnDemand, PPV and IPTV (via Internet) programs, video data rate usage
will also go up as viewers watch their favorite shows when THEY want to,
rather than if they happen to have some free time when the show comes on.
PS: 1080p@24fps is coming soon....and then 3D....requiring more bandwidth....

The key to making SDV/OnDemand/PPV work is to have enough channels
in the switched channel pool(s)....which means transitioning more and more
Expanded Analog channels to Digital. With only 750 MHz, TWC-SD could improve.

PS: From time to time we lose blocks of SDV channels for short periods of
time as they are upgrading the system....but most of the time I NEVER see
the dreaded "Channel Not Available, Try Again" menu....

The problem with SDV is that the engineers/operations folks have to periodically monitor the number of folks assigned to a node. The demand for channels "in the SDV pool" changes over time due to such things as: the customer procuring new HDTVs and upgrading their service to the digital tiers, the number of new HDTV channels added to the system causing increased demand/interest in watching channels in the pool etc. In other words it is a dynamic not a static, set it up and forget it, variable. It sounds like a great technology for maximizing the use of limited bandwidth but if it is not monitored and tweaked over time problems will arise. In the Triad-NC area they tend to set it (the SDV config) up and walk away from it until someone complains.

In discussions with the local engineers they have assigned all HDTV channels to the SDV pool (excluding the OTA local channels) and have also assigned most of the digital non-HD channels to the pool as well. So depending on the time of day or the node demand at a given point in time you may or may not get the dreaded CNA message.

I have escalated this to the local Customer Service executives and they, in turn, have put me in touch with the engineers responsible for configuring the hub and node to which I am assigned. It seems when I complain they do something to fix the problem for a few weeks or so but then, eventually the problem comes back and I have to scream again.

As I said earlier I think the long term solution is to do away with SDV altogether and free up the bandwidth so that channels can have a dedicated frequency assignment, rather than sharing bandwidth.

I understand what is necessary... just surprised that they haven't "got it" yet when their sister division to the south seems to have it figured out. Even with all these DVRs that have been upgraded to the latest ODN software that buffers both channels, I havn't seen a single SDV error message.

SDV isn't going anywhere... as the others have noted, freed bandwidth will likely be allocated to new revenue producing services.

How is your system configured to have such excess capacity? Have they eliminated all analog channels in your area? We still have analog chans 2 thru 77 which consume a lot of bandwidth. The local engineers would like nothing more than to ditch SDV and convert the analogs to digital but that would create a real PR issue with those customers who are still using cable ready sets w/o a STB. They are learning SDV on the job, when it works it's fine but when it's not working it is a nightmare. I subscribe to the Center Ice package and I get really PO'd when I switch to a game I want to watch and I get a "Channel Not Available, Try Again Later" message. Just curious ... thanks

To start, I think NYC and LA have the largest overall bandwidth for cable... in point of fact, my system is fiber to a "node" located about 100 feet from my building. Second, we had close to 80 analogs... many were dropped with something like ~30 still remaining. I read we have room for 26 HD right now, so if they dropped the 30, we'd have well over 100, or COULD have something like 250 HD channels...

BUT we still seem to mostly run 3 HD per QAM... my understanding is they COULD reduce that number and not rate shape as much as they do now. Most of us who have lived for years with TWC know they could care less about the quality of their stuff, it's really pretty atrocious and with Verizon seemingly abandoning our market just as they got their franchise agreement, just what TWC wants!

Inconsistent FF/REW operation - As I have previously reported, they screwed this up worse than it already was. Still very inconsistent, but over a wider range. Gross changes in sample size and speed can occur within the same FF operation, and the jumpback is now way too long.

Somehow I got the impression that the jumpback was way too short. Are you saying the "amount" of jumpback varies a lot, with the "too long" being much longer than before, while at times there's not much of it at all?

FWIW, I did see the jumpback increase in size when I got 'gatored. Wasn;'t terribly difficult to get used to because it was vaguely consistent.

NYC did reduce their analog channel count significantly a while back... I think they may be running 860MHz plant as well, where most systems are probably still 750MHz.

I'm surprised that you still have SDV issues... other than an occasional obvious failure where a whole group of channels are out for an extended period of time (which has happened only 2-3 times since we went SDV here), I can say that I never see the "Channel Not Available" message and, without checking the diagnostics pages in the box or some other reference, would be unable to differentiate the switched shannels from the "broadcast" channels.

I have seen the "channel not available" message, having nothing to do with SDV. It takes a very odd turn... it happens with series recording scheduled shows. I'd never know it existed because the ONLY way I know is looking at the log. AND what happens is the show is scheduled to start on the hour, but gets a CNA message, then it starts the recording at one minute past the hour.

Put on my tin foil hat to investigate... could they have added that TiVO function that automatically deals with the one minute over schedule thing? Nah, not a factor in any of the half dozen or so messages I've seen over the past few months.

So far (knock wood) it has not refused to record a show that it SHOULD have recorded (well, I have seen maybe two times a show that SHOULD be scheduled not being scheduled... I manually select it to record and everything else functions as documented).

Somehow I got the impression that the jumpback was way too short. Are you saying the "amount" of jumpback varies a lot, with the "too long" being much longer than before, while at times there's not much of it at all?

FWIW, I did see the jumpback increase in size when I got 'gatored. Wasn;'t terribly difficult to get used to because it was vaguely consistent.

Jumpback was never too short... IMO it was just fine in the "old" 3090 versions. However, the jumpback is now way too long... hitting the play button on the 1st or second frame of the program will send you back (inconsistently) anywhere from 20 seconds back into the previous commercial to somewhere around 10 seconds from the end of the SECOND commercial back.

Also inconsistent (and this was also inconsistent, but to a lesser extent, in the prior software versions) is the length of the freeze-frame samples. In a 3x FF, they can vary from as little as a single frame sample in a 30 second spot, to maybe five frames during that 30 second spot... and it can change with a single FF operation in the same spot!

It wasn't great before, but it was usable once you adapted. Now, it's just a mess.

I have seen the "channel not available" message, having nothing to do with SDV. It takes a very odd turn... it happens with series recording scheduled shows. I'd never know it existed because the ONLY way I know is looking at the log. AND what happens is the show is scheduled to start on the hour, but gets a CNA message, then it starts the recording at one minute past the hour.

Put on my tin foil hat to investigate... could they have added that TiVO function that automatically deals with the one minute over schedule thing? Nah, not a factor in any of the half dozen or so messages I've seen over the past few months.

So far (knock wood) it has not refused to record a show that it SHOULD have recorded (well, I have seen maybe two times a show that SHOULD be scheduled not being scheduled... I manually select it to record and everything else functions as documented).

There are two different "Channel Not Available" messages. The one you have seen is what shows in the recording log, and it has nothing to do with SDV. It will show up on failed recordings of non-SDV channels, and is the message seen in the infamous Charlotte FOX/CBS recording issue. Since it will be logged that way even when you are actually viewing the channel the channel that is supposedly "not available", we really do not know what the true meaning of this message is or what triggers its appearance.

The SDV message we were referring to is the full-screen message (This Channel is Not Availavale, Try Again) you get when you tune an SDV channel and there is no SDV pool channel available to route that channel to you... essentially, it is the equivalent of a fast busy signal on your phone - "All circuits are busy". If it is seen on more than a rare occasion, it would indicate that there is problem with:

Insufficient SDV pool channels allocated
Too large of a group / node size for the allocated SDV pool
Headend hardware/software that controls/switches the SDV resources
Return plant (your request for a channel is not reaching the headend)
Despite the similar wording, the context and meaning of the SDV and recording log messages are completely different.

There are two different "Channel Not Available" messages.
....
Despite the similar wording, the context and meaning of the SDV and recording log messages are completely different.

Ah, now I see.

NYC did reduce their analog channel count significantly a while back... I think they may be running 860MHz plant as well, where most systems are probably still 750MHz.

I'm surprised that you still have SDV issues... other than an occasional obvious failure where a whole group of channels are out for an extended period of time (which has happened only 2-3 times since we went SDV here), I can say that I never see the "Channel Not Available" message and, without checking the diagnostics pages in the box or some other reference, would be unable to differentiate the switched shannels from the "broadcast" channels.


They say everything is bigger in texas well there right about TWC's bandwidth mostly except for austin and and san antonio.

dallas 860MHz(greenville/commerce outlying area 750MHz or 860MHz)
beaumont 860MHz
corpus christi 860MHz
rio grande valley 860MHz
uvalde 860MHz
kerrville 860MHz
austin 750MHz
waco 750MHz
el paso 750MHz
wichita falls 750MHz
san antonio 780MHz(overdriven 750MHz)

The Cleveland SARA areas are going Navigator according to the local TWC thread.

With ODN v3.2.0_15 you don't need to use the PIP function to swap the tuners. Just pressing swap on the remote, swaps them. Even the 3270 can do this since it now has dual buffers.

How many TWC-SARA systems still have to be converted to Navigator? Does anyone think they will have to release an upgrade for all the boxes (MDN/ODN) to use Remote DVR Manager? This feature is planned for future release. This could perhaps be the MDN 3.0 version that has been in development for some time.

Remote DVD viewing would be great! I heard that regardless of box type, users will need to establish a TWC "My Services Account" at their local division's website for DVR Remote Scheduling. No divisions have this activated yet. This will REALLY be cool, because it will finally give Navigator some great positives that SARA/Passport never had. TWC needs something positive about the software and Remote DVR programing (if it works well) is a great positive for TWC-Navigator.

Just speculation, but I think that if MDN 2.5 is released it will have the search feature of beginning on the show you are currently watching. San Diego and North Carolina have this now for ODN.

Does anyone know what version of MDN Navigator, Ohio is getting in March?

Jack

I got loaded with v3.1.3_3 last night. I didn't notice any major changes and I'm not sure why we they would even bother spending the time and money updating from _2 since the newest DVR boxes we have available in Kansas City are the crappy 8300 HDC.

I got loaded with v3.1.3_3 last night. I didn't notice any major changes and I'm not sure why we they would even bother spending the time and money updating from _2 since the newest DVR boxes we have available in Kansas City are the crappy 8300 HDC.

ODN v3.1.3_3 does fix a few bugs in the HDC boxes. ODN non DVR boxes have less Please wait messages. The 8300HDC has a new middleware that fixes the buffer.

I'm having an odd problem with my SA8300HD w/ 750 GB expansion drive. Lately, when I get to about the last quarter of an hour program, I start to get glitches - freezes and dropped frames. It's happening on multiple channels, broadcast and cable. Been going on for a couple of weeks now and I've missed the endings of several shows, causing my wife great distress and myself great aggravation. Wondering if this is a local issue, or maybe signal based...? Doesn't feel like a hardware problem. Anybody else seeing this?

As I said, I have an HD box, but I can never keep straight in my head which Navigator version - MDN or ODN - is in which box. At any rate, this has been going on for a couple of weeks now. My wife has a friend who called TWC and actually got a CSR who understood the problem! Crazy!! She said it was due to a recent Navigator update download - some bug therein. I have not been able to find a similarly clued-in CSR, just the usual "replace the box" "advice". Does anybody know anything about this or experienced a similar problem? Is a fix coming?

How many TWC-SARA systems still have to be converted to Navigator? Does anyone think they will have to release an upgrade for all the boxes (MDN/ODN) to use Remote DVR Manager? This feature is planned for future release. This could perhaps be the MDN 3.0 version that has been in development for some time.


San Antonio TX is one of TWC's largest markets. They are on SARA and there has been no indication of any pending changes. AT&T is constantly advertising multi-room and remote management, I know this has their attention. I would expect you will see many changes. They are losing too many customers in large markets.

I'm sure they'll go Navigator later this year or early next year.

"It takes a lot of pushing for TWC to do anything, as shown by their lack of progression with their own Navigator software. Despite massive flaws and entire areas complaining about it, five years into release it's still buggy and broken and the latest hardware is still only available in a few areas. It will probably take years before TWC do anything to push a new TA. There's just no profit in it for them."

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: AVS Forum <avs--support@avsforum.com>
Date: Feb 5, 2010 2:04 AM
Subject: "Moxi HD DVR" update

That was me incidentally. :D

That was me incidentally. :D

Duing Navigator's first horror years, I wonder who the bastard children were who thought, "Oh, we don't need Passport, let's make an in-house guide to save money." Do you think this was a large group decision, or only one or two people who designed and implemented Navigator?

That was back when Lincoln Nebraska got "punished" in late 2006. That seems so long ago now.

Jack

Duing Navigator's first horror years, I wonder who the bastard children were who thought, "Oh, we don't need Passport, let's make an in-house guide to save money." Do you think this was a large group decision, or only one or two people who designed and implemented Navigator?

That was back when Lincoln Nebraska got "punished" in late 2006. That seems so long ago now.

So long ago and still so easy to remember.

Glenn Britt. It was most likely his decision. He is responsible for everything that's currently happening (or not as the case usually is) at TWC so there's no reason to doubt he was the one who made the decision to turn a failed network DVR idea into an IPG back then. Jim Chiddix oversaw that project but left before it became Navigator.

Jumpback was never too short... IMO it was just fine in the "old" 3090 versions. However, the jumpback is now way too long... hitting the play button on the 1st or second frame of the program will send you back (inconsistently) anywhere from 20 seconds back into the previous commercial to somewhere around 10 seconds from the end of the SECOND commercial back.

Also inconsistent (and this was also inconsistent, but to a lesser extent, in the prior software versions) is the length of the freeze-frame samples. In a 3x FF, they can vary from as little as a single frame sample in a 30 second spot, to maybe five frames during that 30 second spot... and it can change with a single FF operation in the same spot!

It wasn't great before, but it was usable once you adapted. Now, it's just a mess.

Is there a difference in the amount of TWC-Navigator "jump back" time compared to Cisco/Samsung boxes? Compared to MDN/ODN?

As all I have is an MDN DVR box, for me it was getting used to the timing. For my division I go forward by about 2 seconds from where I would stop and than I can get it to playback between the last commercial and the beginning of the next part of the program. However, sometimes if you FF too much you could see a spoiler unintentionally.

There is a trick, at least for MDN. If you want to stop on a dime, hit the Pause button INSTEAD of RR or FF when you want to stop. When you hit Play again, it picks up right where you left off.

Jack

Is there a difference in the amount of TWC-Navigator "jump back" time compared to Cisco/Samsung boxes? Compared to MDN/ODN?

As all I have is an MDN DVR box, for me it was getting used to the timing. For my division I go forward by about 2 seconds from where I would stop and than I can get it to playback between the last commercial and the beginning of the next part of the program. However, sometimes if you FF too much you could see a spoiler unintentionally.

There is a trick, at least for MDN. If you want to stop on a dime, hit the Pause button INSTEAD of RR or FF when you want to stop. When you hit Play again, it picks up right where you left off.

Jack

I've never had an MDN box, so I really can't compare MDN vs ODN on 8300HD/HDC boxes.

I am quite familiar w/ several ODN version across 8300HDC and SMT-3090H platforms. The FF/REW on the HDC was always very smooth and consistent on any ODN version I've had (similar to what I've observed at friend's house on MDN 8300HD box). On the 3090, I've had three different versions of ODN... all have operated in a much different way from how the FF/REW work on the 8300 series boxes.

The 8300 series boxes always felt to me just like you were fast forwarding a DVD (speed limited, of course), with a very high "sample rate" that accelerated linearly as you went through 1x, 2x and 3x FF rates. It looked like fast-forwarded video. The jumpback amounts were consistent and appropriate (at least for my reaction time) at all three FF speeds.

The 3090, on the other hand, has a very slow FF sample rate... a series of still frames that are held for awhile, more like watching a slide show than video fast forwarding. When you go from 1x to 2x to 3x, they all appear to be going about the same speed because the sample rate does not change much, if at all... just the time span between samples (relative to the normal video) changes. Worse, the sample intervals and the hold times for each frame have never been consistent in any ODN version... every time you use the FF function it seems to work a little differently from the last time. Even with that, in previous versions of ODN, if you stuck with 3x FF only, you could kinda/sorta get the hang of it and consistently hit a window that was between 5 seconds prior to the show restarting and the black "kiss" just as the commercial ended. Not as good as the HDC's, but usable.

Now, with the latest upgrades to the 3090 (more likely to do with the FW upgrade than the ODN upgrade), the FF function is all but worthless. The sample times are even longer and more inconsistent, and the jumpback times are way too long and also very inconsistent. Even with the Pause trick, hitting any spot in the 3090 is still nearly impossible because of the long and inconsistent sample and hold intervals... the first freeze frame you see of the show could be anywhere between 1 and 20 seconds into the program.

I'm not easily frustrated, and it frustrates me. I've gotten to the point that I don't even bother with FFing commecials... I just check AVS while the commercials are running!;)

More divisions are moving away from the Samsungs and going to the new Cisco boxes.

I have seen screen shots of the latest Passport Guide and it beats Navigator to death in every way! By the time Navigator gets to that point, even IF it ever does, Passport and TIVO might be talking guides!

I remember the OCRAP acronym very well! (The name given to ODN Navigator boxes when first released due to all of their hideous bugs!)

Jack

I have seen screen shots of the latest Passport Guide and it beats Navigator to death in every way! By the time Navigator gets to that point, even IF it ever does, Passport and TIVO might be talking guides!

Jack

Jack, any links? I'd be interested in seeing what Aptiv has done with Passport.

Jack, any links? I'd be interested in seeing what Aptiv has done with Passport.You can see a couple of shots of Passport Tru2way on Rovi's site here (http://www.rovicorp.com/products/service_providers/guide_sp/passport_tru2way.htm?link_id=rightnav). (Rovi Corporation is the former Macrovision, which bought Gemstar after they bought Aptiv). It's 16x9 and very different from the resident version. You can see a shot of the latest Passport Echo guide here (http://www.rovicorp.com/products/service_providers/guide_sp/passport_echo.htm?link_id=rightnav); it hasn't changed much in appearance, though there are a few notable differences.

Jack, any links? I'd be interested in seeing what Aptiv has done with Passport.

The Passport Echo screen shots are nice but not that much better than Navigator in my opinion. What Passport has over Navigator is features.. TWC I WANT MORE FEATURES. Give us keyword search , manual recording and copy to vcr/dvd burner and I will be happy with Navigator. WOODY

The Passport Echo screen shots are nice but not that much better than Navigator in my opinion. What Passport has over Navigator is features.. TWC I WANT MORE FEATURES. Give us keyword search , manual recording and copy to vcr/dvd burner and I will be happy with Navigator. WOODY

The IPG look of new Passport is leagues above Navigator. Graphically and typographically it's far more slick. Properly aliased type, full 16:9 image, higher resolution graphics, better icon designs, better use of type weight (Navigator has one weight - for everything), timecode placed logically on the progress bar ...

The only thing I don't like about Tru2Way Passport is the crowded info panel in the upper left and the condensed font they are using which makes it too busy.

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadgethd.com/media/2009/03/passport-tru2way_grid.jpg

The IPG look of new Passport is leagues above Navigator. Graphically and typographically it's far more slick. Properly aliased type, full 16:9 image, higher resolution graphics, better icon designs, better use of type weight (Navigator has one weight - for everything), timecode placed logically on the progress bar ...

The only thing I don't like about Tru2Way Passport is the crowded info panel in the upper left and the condensed font they are using which makes it too busy.

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadgethd.com/media/2009/03/passport-tru2way_grid.jpg

I was speaking of Passport Echo the guide that is the most used version. Doubt if many of us will ever see the truway version of Passport besides screen shots online. Passport Echo and Navigator are similar in looks. I agree the trueway version is heads above both. Was compareing looks to apples to apples. WOODY

Wow, that Tru2Way version is awesome. Nice layout and good use of available space. Makes me cringe when I look at the SARA guide we still have! While the info panel looks crowded, it seems as if it's prompting you to hit the "INFO" button for a full description. Why TWC got away from using programmer developed guides is beyond me. Navigator has proved to be a disaster for development to implementation and 5 years after initial development, it STILL has issues. It would have made more sense to just eat the licensing fee and hide the few cents per sub in the access fees. I'd rather pay a bit more and get a fully functional product that works than be a guinea pig for years while they try to get a guide the functions on the most basic level. Hell, our division reps were talking about Online Scheduling here and I firmly believe that is WAY off for TWC.

Wow, that Tru2Way version is awesome. Nice layout and good use of available space. Makes me cringe when I look at the SARA guide we still have! While the info panel looks crowded, it seems as if it's prompting you to hit the "INFO" button for a full description. Why TWC got away from using programmer developed guides is beyond me. Navigator has proved to be a disaster for development to implementation and 5 years after initial development, it STILL has issues. It would have made more sense to just eat the licensing fee and hide the few cents per sub in the access fees. I'd rather pay a bit more and get a fully functional product that works than be a guinea pig for years while they try to get a guide the functions on the most basic level. Hell, our division reps were talking about Online Scheduling here and I firmly believe that is WAY off for TWC.

Ben,

I agree! WOW!!!! Awesome IPG! It looks like you can select different Guide Views, so maybe if users think there is too much info at once they can try a different view. But Hey TWC, this is a good guideline of what a 2010 IPG SHOULD be!!!!

What cable systems are using this Passport version? Holy crap! it looks better than TIVO!!!!

Jack

Ben,

I agree! WOW!!!! Awesome IPG! It looks like you can select different Guide Views, so maybe if users think there is too much info at once they can try a different view. But Hey TWC, this is a good guideline of what a 2010 IPG SHOULD be!!!!

What cable systems are using this Passport version? Holy crap! it looks better than TIVO!!!!

Jack

Before everyone gets to excited remember Passport Echo is still their main guide. It will likely remain that way for at least a few more years until a major cable company embrasses trueway. WOODY

You can see a couple of shots of Passport Tru2way on Rovi's site here (http://www.rovicorp.com/products/service_providers/guide_sp/passport_tru2way.htm?link_id=rightnav).

Not to mention am awful lot of us would be more content with the ancient version of Passport we last used over the current version of ODN/MDN. THAT "ancient version" was most likely a 4 year old version at this point. A shame...

Hell, I know we will NEVER see that guide (Passport Tru2Way) with Time Warner. I was merely pointing out that I believe that's the guide we should have!

The Passport Echo screen shots are nice but not that much better than Navigator in my opinion. What Passport has over Navigator is features.. TWC I WANT MORE FEATURES. Give us keyword search , manual recording and copy to vcr/dvd burner and I will be happy with Navigator. WOODY

Fix all the bugs in ODN v3.2.0_15 and the Samsung bugs. v4.3.5 and ODN v4.3.5 is still too buggy for me.

Fix all the bugs in ODN v3.2.0_15 and the Samsung bugs. v4.3.5 and ODN v4.3.5 is still too buggy for me.

I have two 8240hdc units no Samsung. Our division will not deploy them. Have 3.3.32 odn version. Both these work great. Sorry for your problems. WOODY

Fix all the bugs in ODN v3.2.0_15 and the Samsung bugs. v4.3.5 and ODN v4.3.5 is still too buggy for me.

I have two 8240hdc units no Samsung. Our division will not deploy them. Have 3.3.32 odn version. Both these work great. Sorry for your problems. WOODY

Relative to ODN... I'm several weeks into 3.2.0_15 and other than still being mad as hell about the loss of Sort by Favorites, it has been very stable and problem-free for me.

I also noticed something over the weekend that I had not seen before - I'm assuming its a new feature in 3.2.0_15, but I do very little scheduling of individual shows (as opposed to series recording) so I may just have not noticed it before. When you hit Select while on a program in the guide, I noticed a new option labeled "other showings" or something to that effect. If you select that option it will list all other scheduled showings of that program, which you can then schedule if you wish. I noticed that it also lists showings on other channels as well... so if a movie on HBO is also showing on HBO2, HBO West, etc., you will see all of them.

On the Samsung side, the 3090's FF/REW functions were screwed up by (I'm assuming) 4.3.5, but...

...the GREAT news is that I have gone three weeks now without any missed FOX/CBS recordings (with no preventative reboots). Hopefully, this problem that has plagued Charlotte since day one of the Samsungs is behind us.

4.3.5 STILL doesn't like to boot properly when HDMI is connected to my Onkyo 876... but it gets further along than it did with earlier versions.

Relative to ODN... I'm several weeks into 3.2.0_15 and other than still being mad as hell about the loss of Sort by Favorites, it has been very stable and problem-free for me.

I also noticed something over the weekend that I had not seen before - I'm assuming its a new feature in 3.2.0_15, but I do very little scheduling of individual shows (as opposed to series recording) so I may just have not noticed it before. When you hit Select while on a program in the guide, I noticed a new option labeled "other showings" or something to that effect. If you select that option it will list all other scheduled showings of that program, which you can then schedule if you wish. I noticed that it also lists showings on other channels as well... so if a movie on HBO is also showing on HBO2, HBO West, etc., you will see all of them.

On the Samsung side, the 3090's FF/REW functions were screwed up by (I'm assuming) 4.3.5, but...

...the GREAT news is that I have gone three weeks now without any missed FOX/CBS recordings (with no preventative reboots). Hopefully, this problem that has plagued Charlotte since day one of the Samsungs is behind us.

4.3.5 STILL doesn't like to boot properly when HDMI is connected to my Onkyo 876... but it gets further along than it did with earlier versions.

Glad your 3090 works fine as I'm still waiting for the next update.

When you hit Select while on a program in the guide, I noticed a new option labeled "other showings" or something to that effect. If you select that option it will list all other scheduled showings of that program, which you can then schedule if you wish

Indeed, the return of a sorely missed Passport feature! Wonder if/when it may make it's way into MDN???

Indeed, the return of a sorely missed Passport feature! Wonder if/when it may make it's way into MDN???

It is my feeling that TWC now is shapeing Navigator for the launch of keyword search in the not to distant future WOODY.

And I believe that they will be adding remote programming soon. I have no sources, but I do see that Direct TV is heavily pushing this feature in the NY area. If not having it becomes a marketing drawback, that will raise the priority dramatically.

Of course, this whole theory might just be because I want that feature quite a bit. :-)

-barry

It'd be nice to get it, but as long as we have the SARA guide, I don't see that happening. If they do it, I hope they do it with an iPhone app.

And I believe that they will be adding remote programming soon. I have no sources, but I do see that Direct TV is heavily pushing this feature in the NY area. If not having it becomes a marketing drawback, that will raise the priority dramatically.

Of course, this whole theory might just be because I want that feature quite a bit. :-)

-barry

Since remote DVR management is coming to all Navigator boxes, they are most likely going to have to do a software update to the menus to add the service. I have no sources for when this will happen. But I know that MDN 2.5 is in Beta, and MDN 3.0 is in development. So I would suspect that a big update will have to come before that feature can be used.

This COULD mean one of two things: (Not the emphasis on "Could," not "Would."

MDN 2.5 comes out adding all of the ODN features to the existing boxes.

OR.

An ODN 3.5 or something comes out with the Remote DVR viewing and Keyword Search added and within 2-4 months, we get MDN 3.0 with those features added.

The only reasonable certainty will be ODN will get new updates first. They are trying over time to make the boxes as alike as possible.

Jack

Remote DVR is already in ODN v3.2.0_15 according to the diagnostic menu. Legacy might not get them for another year or so. Legacy is supported but only on an as needed basis.

Remote DVR is already in ODN v3.2.0_15 according to the diagnostic menu. Legacy might not get them for another year or so. Legacy is supported but only on an as needed basis.

I hope it's not THAT LONG! It seems like the information that is coming out is on very opposite and polarized ends of the spectrum. One end is that all of this new stuff is coming in a matter of months. The other is that it could be about a year like you said for everyone to get new features.

There are still so many areas that don't have Gators yet! But I know your assessments are for San Diego, which is a main test market. I did find out the Hawaii-Oceanic, which is another test market for TWC was the first to get PhotoShow. Than within a month, we got it in Wisconsin for both ODN/MDN boxes.

But what is really strange is that Hawaii, which is a test market I don't even think has ANY versions of Navigator yet.

And of course back in 2006 we in Milwaukee Wisconsin were one of the six cities to get the early releases of Navigaator before San Diego. It was us and Lincoln Nebraska. Our President killed the roll out for about a year when there were so many complaints. Lincoln Nebraska rolled out buggy Gators to the whole city on different boxes at the same time.

I heard that the MDN upgrades are going great now!

We would almost have to have an assessment of all test cities and than each division's President could gage public responses for new features for both platforms.

We were also supposed to get the rest of the Viacom HD channels late last month. But the rumor is this has been put on hold for a bit, while Northern Wisconsin gets the SARA to MDN Navigator conversion.

Than in March, it's Ohio. (SARA to Navigator MDN update.)

And meanwhile, Riverside Guy in New York still has that mysterious MDN version 2.4.6_21 that no one else has!

Jack

Since remote DVR management is coming to all Navigator boxes, they are most likely going to have to do a software update to the menus to add the service.

They shouldn't have to make any changes to the UI of Navigator for that. It should be totally invisible to the user that remote scheduling occurs on the DVR. There's just no need to see it.

It's their web/mobile device software that will need to be built. That will be interesting ...

They've mentioned that RemoteDVR will be used in conjunction with MyServices which requires you to register using your account. I believe you only need TV service and not TV+Internet.

That makes sense. No need for TV+Internet.

They've mentioned that RemoteDVR will be used in conjunction with MyServices which requires you to register using your account. I believe you only need TV service and not TV+Internet.

As I understand it, you will need any Internet connection to sign up for a My Services Account. (It does not have to be Roadrunner.) Once you get a My Services account through Registration, remote DVR will be part of "My Services" when it becomes available.

Jack

As I understand it, you will need any Internet connection to sign up for a My Services Account. (It does not have to be Roadrunner.) Once you get a My Services account through Registration, remote DVR will be part of "My Services" when it becomes available.

Jack

You shouldn't need a home based ISP. If they are smart, they will make a functional iPhone (Smartphone) App thus you would have control from your data plan. However, the majority of people who have this service will likely have internet service to the home as well.

And meanwhile, Riverside Guy in New York still has that mysterious MDN version 2.4.6_21 that no one else has!

Jack

Makes me a COO (club of one)!

I have zero interest in remote scheduling... keyword search and support external HDDs is way higher on my list, I'd even say it's more important for TWC to implement those 2 pronto.

The reality is that whatever we get in whatever order will be spread over a length of time that extends to star date 2605.4.

The reality is that whatever we get in whatever order will be spread over a length of time that extends to star date 2605.4.

Captain's log 2605.4:

Unable to complete diplomatic courier assignment due to malfunction in the new Starfleet Navigator Software. Despite Chekov's best efforts he couldn't find the planet we were looking for. Multiple search results for systems appeared and none of them were useful.

Spock attempted to access the backup star system database but it kept losing connection. He kept repeating "This is highly illogical captain." over and over. I think he may have lost his brain again.

Hopefully if we fly around long enough, we might stumble upon the planet we need by accident.

Of all the computer systems I have known. This has been. The most. Inhuman.

[I]Captain's log 2605.4:

On the MONEY my friend!

Captain's log 2605.4:

Unable to complete diplomatic courier assignment due to malfunction in the new Starfleet Navigator Software. Despite Chekov's best efforts he couldn't find the planet we were looking for. Multiple search results for systems appeared and none of them were useful.

Spock attempted to access the backup star system database but it kept losing connection. He kept repeating "This is highly illogical captain." over and over. I think he may have lost his brain again.

Hopefully if we fly around long enough, we might stumble upon the planet we need by accident.

Of all the computer systems I have known. This has been. The most. Inhuman.

CLASSIC!!!!!!!! LOL!!!

Jack

They've mentioned that RemoteDVR will be used in conjunction with MyServices which requires you to register using your account. I believe you only need TV service and not TV+Internet.

http://imgur.com/ZgSrj.png

Desert Cities TW recently changed their page and added the My Services area. Here is a screen cap of the TV section of that. Currently it just lists a TV guide, but I can see where they could easily add a "click to record" feature to this online guide.

I have zero interest in remote scheduling... keyword search and support external HDDs is way higher on my list, I'd even say it's more important for TWC to implement those 2 pronto.

The reality is that whatever we get in whatever order will be spread over a length of time that extends to star date 2605.4.

I'd like to have keyword search, but I cannot imagine that it's viewed as "important" by the powers that be at TWC. It's primarily important to heavy users of DVR technology - a small subset of the population. [Hopefully a growing subset.]

Not many potential customers of TWC evaluate keyword search before they sign up, and not many unhappy customers actually leave TWC because of keyword search. At least that's what I think.

Also, I'm predicting that we get it by star date 2605.3 at the very latest. :-)

-barry

I'd like to have keyword search, but I cannot imagine that it's viewed as "important" by the powers that be at TWC. It's primarily important to heavy users of DVR technology - a small subset of the population. [Hopefully a growing subset.]

Not many potential customers of TWC evaluate keyword search before they sign up, and not many unhappy customers actually leave TWC because of keyword search. At least that's what I think.

Also, I'm predicting that we get it by star date 2605.3 at the very latest. :-)

-barry

Didn't I just read DVRs were in something like 60% of cable homes?

They heavily advertise the ability to search and find what you want... yet they forced the software change that completely broke that function and in 2 years they have NOT seen fit to actually provide it. Of course, it's RUMORED that we should get it, wanna put some money on how much longer we'll have to wait? Or that it will hit one market and take 2 years for all the rest of the markets to get it?

Now the leaving part is very interesting. Because of where I live, my choice is TWC or... watch DVDs only on my TV. So even if I stop the TV service, I'll pa proportionally a LOT higher to keep my phone and Internet connection (all the bundle deals require a triple play package). PLUS, there is a pretty long history of too many people seeing decrease in functionality with no mass cancellations. I could virtually guarantee you that always is a big factor when they decide to do what they do... raise rates over and over and over again, while losing functionality by virtue of reducing expenses by going with bad in-house software rather than pay for properly developed software.

It's kind of like the sheep heard mentality. People mostly want to keep their lives operating in familiar ways... so to many it's probably more important they see their reality show crap so who cares if you can't find, say, a Stanley Kubrick film to watch.

This all very much plays into TWC game plan. They KNOW they can keep increasing prices and decreasing services and still keep most subs. So they can keep increasing prices and decreasing service... how do you think Britt gets those multi-million dollar bonuses?

If we users COULD actually band together and in unison cancel service, believe me, TWC would sit up and take notice. So while we like to rant about TWC, it is WELL deserved, but only if we put some action into play would anything actually change.

Didn't I just read DVRs were in something like 60% of cable homes?

They heavily advertise the ability to search and find what you want... yet they forced the software change that completely broke that function and in 2 years they have NOT seen fit to actually provide it. Of course, it's RUMORED that we should get it, wanna put some money on how much longer we'll have to wait? Or that it will hit one market and take 2 years for all the rest of the markets to get it?

Now the leaving part is very interesting. Because of where I live, my choice is TWC or... watch DVDs only on my TV. So even if I stop the TV service, I'll pa proportionally a LOT higher to keep my phone and Internet connection (all the bundle deals require a triple play package). PLUS, there is a pretty long history of too many people seeing decrease in functionality with no mass cancellations. I could virtually guarantee you that always is a big factor when they decide to do what they do... raise rates over and over and over again, while losing functionality by virtue of reducing expenses by going with bad in-house software rather than pay for properly developed software.

It's kind of like the sheep heard mentality. People mostly want to keep their lives operating in familiar ways... so to many it's probably more important they see their reality show crap so who cares if you can't find, say, a Stanley Kubrick film to watch.

This all very much plays into TWC game plan. They KNOW they can keep increasing prices and decreasing services and still keep most subs. So they can keep increasing prices and decreasing service... how do you think Britt gets those multi-million dollar bonuses?

If we users COULD actually band together and in unison cancel service, believe me, TWC would sit up and take notice. So while we like to rant about TWC, it is WELL deserved, but only if we put some action into play would anything actually change.

You are probably right in what you say. However you have more chance of winning the powerball lottery than TWC customers riseing up in mass. Just ain't gonna happen. WOODY

On Keyword Search:

They heavily advertise the ability to search and find what you want... yet they forced the software change that completely broke that function and in 2 years they have NOT seen fit to actually provide it. Of course, it's RUMORED that we should get it, wanna put some money on how much longer we'll have to wait? Or that it will hit one market and take 2 years for all the rest of the markets to get it?

Perfect post by Riverside! It's totally retarded that TWC in 2010 does not offer a feature that is a taken for granted as a feature on ANY IPG in this day and age. This isn't 1995 anymore, TWC.

While I don't expect a mass uprising for that feature, it is something that should realistically be included. AND it should be something available regardless of the box you have. Keyword Search is not a problem for any of the other competing IPG's from cable, dish, or U-Verse so it should be something that should be added to all TWC boxes.

Our group is smaller than general customer populations. But I still think that there is safety in numbers. TWC may not care that much about adding new features to the guide because mainstream public just accepts what is given to them.

However, we customers are paying good money and should expect an above average quality IPG in both features and performance. I would just call and bug the hell out of your division and have them send requests to engineering for the IPG features that you want to see or should be included. Right now, I don't think TWC is getting enough customer responses for new guide features and that is part of the problem.

I have to agree with Riverside Guy that unless there are huge requests for a guide feature TWC will drag its feet on this. Test market ODN boxes will get feature updates, but if general populations don't let the software developers know what they want to see, it could be 1-3 years before TWC starts adding new features to all the boxes.

We have to get more people aware of this and even more people aware of the forums!

Jack

Search sez it only looks for a (single) keyword in the TITLE....not the description....
Guess they never heard of search engines that work with multiple keywords,
which is essential to narrow down all the hits you are gonna get when/if
they provide ability to search on actor names, et. al. And since they
didn't even provide the same category sub-divisions as the On-Screen IPG,
there are going to be way too many hits returned when you search for
say "baseball"....

Unfortunately there is so much "wasted space", on my 17" WS laptop I can
only see THREE channels at a time vice FIVE in On-Screen IPG.....
and TEN with www.titantv.com....yet another failed TWC prototype....

Nielsen DVR Report reported stats re DVR penetration for ADS (SAT) vs Cable
for 19 major DMAs, as of Nov 2008. It's no doubt higher now:
http://blog.nielsen.com/nielsenwire/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/dvr_tvlandscape_043009.pdf
DVR penetration for SAT users was far behind Cable users, although there were wide variations.
Here in San Diego, Cable DVR penetration was nearly 80% way back in Nov 2008.

PS: Nationally, Digital Cable is reportedly now at 67%:
http://www.ncta.com/Statistics.aspx

Search sez it only looks for a (single) keyword in the TITLE....not the description....

Unfortunately there is so much "wasted space", on my 17" WS laptop I can
only see THREE channels at a time vice FIVE in On-Screen IPG.....
and TEN with www.titantv.com....yet another failed TWC prototype....

Great point! That makes the Title Search even worse than it is! Oh yea, TWC, show me how easy it is to find Shawshank Redemption doing a Title Search! Ridiculous! Or how about going through a Tilte list for College Football and having to open 15-20 different tiers of the same title "College Football" to find the game you want to see! Total BS!

You know, I wish the other cable and dish companies would throw up side by side comparisons of for example a Tivo IPG and TWC Navigator on a TV commercial. (Sort of like the old George Plimpton 1980's ads with Atari vs. Intellivision. George was a spokesperson for Intellivision back than. I had an Atari 2600 and loved it back than. But you get the point.) Such advertising would show all of the things that a competition's guide can do, which Navigator currently cannot. That might be the whip needed to be cracked over TWC's corporate head to see why the new Navigator features in the way of easier searches are important to improve the customer's guide experience. TWC can and needs to do better with the Navigator program guide.

Jack

I've seen as high as 11 channels x 2.5 hours in a (COMCAST) tru2way demo.
As you can see, the display options are tailorable by the USER:
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008//P1020645%20tru2way%20Panasonic%20iDCR%2011ch%20x%202.5hr.JPG
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008//P1020640a%20tru2way%20Panasonic%20iDCR%208ch%20x%202.5hrs.JP G
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008//P1020646%20tru2way%20Panasonic%20WS%204ch%20x%202.5ch.JPG

Here are some more photos:
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2009

What REALLY REALLY sucks is that SARA the guide we all love to hate is getting ready to add keyword and title search as well as folders. TWC get off your corporate asses and give us keyword search. WOODY

I've seen as high as 11 channels x 2.5 hours in a (COMCAST) tru2way demo.
As you can see, the display options are tailorable by the USER:
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008//P1020645%20tru2way%20Panasonic%20iDCR%2011ch%20x%202.5hr.JPG
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008//P1020640a%20tru2way%20Panasonic%20iDCR%208ch%20x%202.5hrs.JP G
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008//P1020646%20tru2way%20Panasonic%20WS%204ch%20x%202.5ch.JPG

Here are some more photos:
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2008
http://photos.imageevent.com/holl_ands/ces2009

The last two didn't connect for me, but I still like what I saw!

Jack

Your argument is perfectly logical, but it is somewhat meaningless to TWC. They have two questions about any new functionality (and keyword search is indeed "new" functionality for Navigator):

1. Will this feature get us more customers?
2. Will this feature make our existing customers happier?

The answer to #1 seems to me to be "No". The answer to #2 is probably "Yes", but I suspect that question #1 is a much more important question than #2.

The result of this analysis tells me that keyword search is not a high priority feature. I do suspect that we will get it sooner or later, but I doubt that anybody at TWC is burning the midnight oil to get it done.

-barry

Didn't I just read DVRs were in something like 60% of cable homes?

They heavily advertise the ability to search and find what you want... yet they forced the software change that completely broke that function and in 2 years they have NOT seen fit to actually provide it. Of course, it's RUMORED that we should get it, wanna put some money on how much longer we'll have to wait? Or that it will hit one market and take 2 years for all the rest of the markets to get it?

Now the leaving part is very interesting. Because of where I live, my choice is TWC or... watch DVDs only on my TV. So even if I stop the TV service, I'll pa proportionally a LOT higher to keep my phone and Internet connection (all the bundle deals require a triple play package). PLUS, there is a pretty long history of too many people seeing decrease in functionality with no mass cancellations. I could virtually guarantee you that always is a big factor when they decide to do what they do... raise rates over and over and over again, while losing functionality by virtue of reducing expenses by going with bad in-house software rather than pay for properly developed software.

It's kind of like the sheep heard mentality. People mostly want to keep their lives operating in familiar ways... so to many it's probably more important they see their reality show crap so who cares if you can't find, say, a Stanley Kubrick film to watch.

This all very much plays into TWC game plan. They KNOW they can keep increasing prices and decreasing services and still keep most subs. So they can keep increasing prices and decreasing service... how do you think Britt gets those multi-million dollar bonuses?

If we users COULD actually band together and in unison cancel service, believe me, TWC would sit up and take notice. So while we like to rant about TWC, it is WELL deserved, but only if we put some action into play would anything actually change.

Your argument is perfectly logical, but it is somewhat meaningless to TWC. They have two questions about any new functionality (and keyword search is indeed "new" functionality for Navigator):

1. Will this feature get us more customers?
2. Will this feature make our existing customers happier?

I think what you meant to say was:

1. Will this feature imply that we are advancing technologically during a shareholder meeting?
2. Can we make it into a bullet point in a marketing and PR push?

I think what you meant to say was:

1. Will this feature imply that we are advancing technologically during a shareholder meeting?
2. Can we make it into a bullet point in a marketing and PR push?

I'm not a software developer. But what would be one good reason that the majority of customers would not want easier Keyboard functions in Navigator? Even a simple keyword search would make the system better than it is now. How hard can that be to program? It's not even new. The competition has had it for ten years. Does TWC want to move DOWN the ladder of success?

What I don't understand is if so many competitors have better search options and a better IPG in general and even HAD the things that TWC Navigator lacks about 10 years ago, why is that not important for TWC to be competitive in the marketplace concerning a quality program guide?

How can they explain or justify that Comcast, Tivo, Direct TV, and so forth have these features but TWC doesn't? Obviously a quality IPG guide was important to the competition and the competitions shareholders. If a quality guide was not important to the competition, than every IPG from the competition would look like SARA's IPG's or lack the advanced search options that still are lacking in Navigator.

Even Passport cared and continues to care about a quality IPG that has enhanced and developed through technological change. But I find it ridiculous that the number two cable company can't or won't develop an IPG consistent with 2010 features and technology. Or is it that they don't know how to do it? What's missing from the equation here?

Jack

How can they explain or justify that Comcast, Tivo, Direct TV, and so forth have these features but TWC doesn't? Obviously a quality IPG guide was important to the competition and the competitions shareholders. If a quality guide was not important to the competition, than every IPG from the competition would look like SARA's IPG's or lack the advanced search options that still are lacking in Navigator.

They don't need to justify the lack of it. On their business road map they will list goals they want to achieve and something like "Reduce licensing costs designing an in-house IPG and deploy in 70% of TWC markets to achieve software control and autonomy" will be one such bullet point. After that is achieved they can take a nice round of applause and move on.

As they discussed in a link I previously posted they did that, and now it's on to buzzword features like Start Over, Look Back and more digital phone. Minor enhancements to Navigator are probably not even worth attention or a focal point in their financial meetings. They don't care about small achievements or features, they want big sounding things that you can put on TV commercials and in year-end summaries.

Do Comcast and Satellite have a program guide? Does TWC? Mission accomplished. Now all they need to do is just make sure that they keep a team working on it so that it doesn't break, so they can reduce customer service calls and save them money in the long run.

TWC don't care about making the best product available. They only care about how much profit it will make.

They only care about how much profit it will make.

I believe that is the primary concern of a for-profit enterprise.

I'm not a software developer. But what would be one good reason that the majority of customers would not want easier Keyboard functions in Navigator? Even a simple keyword search would make the system better than it is now. How hard can that be to program? It's not even new. The competition has had it for ten years. Does TWC want to move DOWN the ladder of success?

What I don't understand is if so many competitors have better search options and a better IPG in general and even HAD the things that TWC Navigator lacks about 10 years ago, why is that not important for TWC to be competitive in the marketplace concerning a quality program guide?

How can they explain or justify that Comcast, Tivo, Direct TV, and so forth have these features but TWC doesn't? Obviously a quality IPG guide was important to the competition and the competitions shareholders. If a quality guide was not important to the competition, than every IPG from the competition would look like SARA's IPG's or lack the advanced search options that still are lacking in Navigator.

Even Passport cared and continues to care about a quality IPG that has enhanced and developed through technological change. But I find it ridiculous that the number two cable company can't or won't develop an IPG consistent with 2010 features and technology. Or is it that they don't know how to do it? What's missing from the equation here?

Jack

Jack from what I hear SARA is getting ready to soon have title and keyword search as well as remote programming. Now thats a kick in the butt to us ex sara customers. What we left behind will soon be bettr than what we got feature wise. WOODY

I believe that is the primary concern of a for-profit enterprise.

Not all of them. Some actually care about the quality of the product they distribute and some of them are skilled enough to be able to balance high quality with financial achievement.

It starts at the top. If the leadership has no interest in the quality of what a company produces then the rest of the company will follow.

We have to get more people aware of this and even more people aware of the forums!

Jack

Oh wait till you hear this one Jack! I see an ad (for Direct I think) touting the ability to see a show in the guide and press one button and see every instance of that show for the next week! EXACTLY like the feature in Passport that I did heavily use for what, the past 2-3 years before I got 'gatored?

Of course, the re4ally cool thing would be for all of us upset to pay a buck each to run and ad about how the wonderful NEW feature we had for a long time before TWC decided to take it away from us!

Of course, that could never actually happen, just like my "uprising."

I DO note that very feature has seemingly shown up in ODN (question there, is it a one button press type of thing?)... but a version that seems not to have made it's way around the system... and given past practices, those who have ODN "may" be waiting the rest of the year.

Of course, the re4ally cool thing would be for all of us upset to pay a buck each to run and ad about how the wonderful NEW feature we had for a long time before TWC decided to take it away from us!

That will cost a fortune in the long run! You would have to run one for other stuff too, like removing features like sort by favorites and PiP or just challenging this PR spiel:

"The Navigator is a superior on-screen program guide and menu system that makes it easier than ever to find great TV programs."

Search sez it only looks for a (single) keyword in the TITLE....not the description...

Couldn't swear to it, but I THINK it only looks left to right... so if the term you are using is the third word in the title, it won't be found.

Not to mention we now have even LESS data to search on anyway... if we had a proper search function (title & description), we could NOT find movies by particular directors...

Your argument is perfectly logical, but it is somewhat meaningless to TWC. They have two questions about any new functionality (and keyword search is indeed "new" functionality for Navigator):

1. Will this feature get us more customers?
2. Will this feature make our existing customers happier?

The answer to #1 seems to me to be "No". The answer to #2 is probably "Yes", but I suspect that question #1 is a much more important question than #2.

The result of this analysis tells me that keyword search is not a high priority feature. I do suspect that we will get it sooner or later, but I doubt that anybody at TWC is burning the midnight oil to get it done.

-barry

Well, I'm now seeing ads touting specific search functions we used to have in Passport, but were eliminated in ODN/MDN... so one COULD say it's a customer retention issue. OTOH, that also implies a customer CAN switch, there are folks (like I) who can not switch to anything, not even OTA, and TWC takes EVERY advantage they have!

They don't need to justify the lack of it. On their business road map they will list goals they want to achieve and something like "Reduce licensing costs designing an in-house IPG and deploy in 70% of TWC markets to achieve software control and autonomy" will be one such bullet point. After that is achieved they can take a nice round of applause and move on.

As they discussed in a link I previously posted they did that, and now it's on to buzzword features like Start Over, Look Back and more digital phone. Minor enhancements to Navigator are probably not even worth attention or a focal point in their financial meetings. They don't care about small achievements or features, they want big sounding things that you can put on TV commercials and in year-end summaries.

Do Comcast and Satellite have a program guide? Does TWC? Mission accomplished. Now all they need to do is just make sure that they keep a team working on it so that it doesn't break, so they can reduce customer service calls and save them money in the long run.

TWC don't care about making the best product available. They only care about how much profit it will make.

Couldn't agree more... BUT losing subs is a HUGE black mark. If Verizon had come even vaguely close to it's promises of coverage (in my market), I dare-say there were be a TON of canceled subs. Annoys the hell out of me that an external company has left TWC with 95% of it's grip in my market when the promise was all about significantly loosening that death grip.

What REALLY REALLY sucks is that SARA the guide we all love to hate is getting ready to add keyword and title search as well as folders.

I, for one, am not included in that 'all.' If I had the option of choosing my software, I'd switch back to SARA instantly, if only for the 'copy to VCR' and 'skip to end' functions.

I still never cease to be amazed at how other people here use their boxes differently that I do. I do all my searching online and have zero use for any kind of searching within the STB. To me, my way only makes sense, but the posts here remind me that, while I might be on the unique end of things with my habits and wants, other people's minds are just as set in in terms of what they want and need for a pleasant and usable TV experience.

I, as many here are very unhappy with the Navigator upgrade.. pardon, DOWNGRADE.

One of the features I used to use a lot to save time was the "Skip to End" feature.

Well this is now gone, along with many other good things we had.

Is there a workaround, shortcut, hack, you name it that will get this feature back?

Hold down FF for 15 minute increments.

I DO note that very feature has seemingly shown up in ODN (question there, is it a one button press type of thing?)

Pretty much, yes.

If you hit "Select" on a show in the guide, you get the following menu:

Record This Show
Record Show with Options
Record Series
Record Series with Options
All Showings
If you select All Showings, then you get the list of future showings. Once you select one of the showings, you get the same menu as above once again.

I, for one, am not included in that 'all.' If I had the option of choosing my software, I'd switch back to SARA instantly, if only for the 'copy to VCR' and 'skip to end' functions.

I still never cease to be amazed at how other people here use their boxes differently that I do. I do all my searching online and have zero use for any kind of searching within the STB. To me, my way only makes sense, but the posts here remind me that, while I might be on the unique end of things with my habits and wants, other people's minds are just as set in in terms of what they want and need for a pleasant and usable TV experience.

Very true. I think it mostly has to do with what IPG you had first and how its feature set AND shortcomings (they all have them) shaped how you use the them... any changes are almost always seen as negative, even if they represent an improvement in some way but force you to change your habits or workarounds developed around the shortcomings of your earlier experience.

I "grew up" on ODN 3 and find very little to bitch about... and yes, I have seen/used both SARA and Passport and would NEVER want either of them over ODN. To me, their shortcomings are more offensive then Navigator's.. and what they add is of no interest to me whatsoever. I am a very heavy user of series recording (over 35 series are set up in mine) but have virtually no use for search or expanded descriptions (even though I have them available). What matters to me is reliable recording of my series with no user attention... it records them, I watch them and delete them. ODN is vastly superior to the others in this regard... once a series is set up, I don't check or monitor or babysit ANYTHING. The 320GB internal storage has been more than sufficient for my needs and accordingly have no need for external storage, either.

The one thing I really want to bitch about for ODN is something it has had for a long time, worked perfectly and I used to great satisfaction... but was inexplicably removed with the latest ODN release... Sort by Favorites. What a major loss that is... one that I now curse every time I open the guide and no longer have my customized channel lineup available. However, just as I say "pffft" to keyword search, others may wonder why they hell you would want or need to Sort by Favorites.

One feature I truly miss from my other DVR experience (Panasonic DMR-E85H) is one that I have never seen as a wishlist item from any poster here... the ability to playback at 1.3x speed with near perfect video and audio. Between 1.3x playback and instant 1 minute commercial skip increments, you could knock off an hour show in about a half hour. THAT was a GREAT and eminently useful DVR feature.

They don't need to justify the lack of it. On their business road map they will list goals they want to achieve and something like "Reduce licensing costs designing an in-house IPG and deploy in 70% of TWC markets to achieve software control and autonomy" will be one such bullet point. After that is achieved they can take a nice round of applause and move on.

As they discussed in a link I previously posted they did that, and now it's on to buzzword features like Start Over, Look Back and more digital phone. Minor enhancements to Navigator are probably not even worth attention or a focal point in their financial meetings. They don't care about small achievements or features, they want big sounding things that you can put on TV commercials and in year-end summaries.

Do Comcast and Satellite have a program guide? Does TWC? Mission accomplished. Now all they need to do is just make sure that they keep a team working on it so that it doesn't break, so they can reduce customer service calls and save them money in the long run.

TWC don't care about making the best product available. They only care about how much profit it will make.

But is this a good business model that the number 2 cable system in the country should be taking? It's a roadmap that TWC may follow. But Passport, TIVO, Direct TV and Dish are not taking that type of attitude with their program guides. To quote what Emeril says, "This ain't rocket science." They could hire five little guys from Pakistan or something to work on adding as little as one new feature to the guide every three months. I am sure that's not overwhelming work. There are techno-geeks that would probably like to program the guide and they would have fun with it.

Each month put out a newsletter about new services. Get customers and community INVOLVED. We don't want the IPG to talk or anything like that. All that customers want is to have a guide that has the features of the system it replaced. I believe customers have a right to be able to find their cable programs as quickly and easily as possible. A Keyword Search option is really the only big thing that I think is missing from Navigator. Manual recording would be nice as well. But one thing at a time.

Add Keyword Search to ODN/MDN boxes and you can move on to other things.

Jack

Is there a version history of the Navigator (ODN) versions and what features, etc. were changed? I have 3.1.3_3. What features are there to look forward too?

Is there a version history of the Navigator (ODN) versions and what features, etc. were changed? I have 3.1.3_3. What features are there to look forward too?


The next release (so far in Charlotte and San Diego only) is 3.2.0_15, and it...

Adds "All Showings" selection in the guide menu
Starts searches on the current show
Loses Sort by Favorites:mad:
Adds support for DVR Manager (set recordings from anywhere via web browser)
It's been stable here in Charlotte (I have a Samsung 3090 and an SA 4250HDC), but San Diego seems to have had some issues with it, particularly with 4250HDC boxes. There was also a Samsung firmware/middleware update that went along with the ODN update. The combined updates seems to have fixed a Samsung recording issue that was primarily a Charlotte issue (some reports of similar problems issues in NYC as well). The updates also further screwed up the already screwy FF/REW functions in the 3090.

I've said this before ODN v3.1.3_3 is a bug fix. It's mainly for non DVR boxes that run ODN. However, the HDC boxes get a new middleware that fixes a livetv buffer issue. This update reduces the please wait issue on non DVR boxes. It doesn't eliminate it as thats how it's designed. If the OOB tuner is full then it must use the INB tuner and thats why you get that message.

The one thing I really want to bitch about for ODN is something it has had for a long time, worked perfectly and I used to great satisfaction... but was inexplicably removed with the latest ODN release... Sort by Favorites.

Still no clue why that was taken out. MDN lost it first. Although the ability to scroll from Favorite Channel to Favorite Channel in the IPG without changing channels was restored, it is a mystery why Sort By Favorites was removed. Personally, I did not use it, but I know tons of people who did. Sort By Favorites was a very important feature for them. With MDN 2.5 in Beta, and MDN 3.0 in development, maybe this feature, if enough complain about its loss, could be restored. It makes no sense why they took it out.

Jack

Still no clue why that was taken out. MDN lost it first. Although the ability to scroll from Favorite Channel to Favorite Channel in the IPG without changing channels was restored, it is a mystery why Sort By Favorites was removed. Personally, I did not use it, but I know tons of people who did. Sort By Favorites was a very important feature for them. With MDN 2.5 in Beta, and MDN 3.0 in development, maybe this feature, if enough complain about its loss, could be restored. It makes no sense why they took it out.

Jack

The only technical explanation I can think of is that limited memory space in the boxes was required for newer features such as the upcoming remote DVR Manager (support for which came concurrently with the loss of Sort by Favs in the 3.2.0_15 release). If that happens to be true, they can keep the DVR Manager that I might use occasionally, if ever, and give me back something that was integral to how I used the box every day.

That said, the real answer is that being able to tout that their DVRs were now net-enabled at the next shareholder meeting takes precedence over something that is not as flashy but much more useable by the customers.

We got updated to 3.1.33 from 3.1.32 here in Greensboro last night. I see no feature changes whatever. Must have been a bug fix. WHOOPEE! WOODY

The next release (so far in Charlotte and San Diego only) is 3.2.0_15, and it...

Adds "All Showings" selection in the guide menu
Starts searches on the current show
Loses Sort by Favorites:mad:
Adds support for DVR Manager (set recordings from anywhere via web browser)
It's been stable here in Charlotte (I have a Samsung 3090 and an SA 4250HDC), but San Diego seems to have had some issues with it, particularly with 4250HDC boxes. There was also a Samsung firmware/middleware update that went along with the ODN update. The combined updates seems to have fixed a Samsung recording issue that was primarily a Charlotte issue (some reports of similar problems issues in NYC as well). The updates also further screwed up the already screwy FF/REW functions in the 3090.

I understand both buffers are buffered in the new version also. Hope we in Greensboro get it sooner rather than later. WOODY

It also screwed up the 3270's REW and FF as well. The change log for v3.1.3_3 has already been posted a few times. I think they'll fix ODN v3.2 sooner or later. Maybe the next major branch is going to get the 3.2 bugs fixed. ODN v3.2.0_15 is terrible on a 3270. Too many bugs to be fixed. It's at an alpha or even pre alpha level in terms of stability. On the plus side we gain dual buffers.

I understand both buffers are buffered in the new version also. Hope we in Greensboro get it sooner rather than later. WOODY

Yep... forgot that one... another "different strokes" feature that some are dying for that I have no use for.

I am in the Time Warner Desert Cities area, and we had an update applied a few weeks ago. I also lost the sort by favorites feature and am missing it a lot! I also noticed another feature has been lost. I had my 8240HDC options set so that when I would mute the dvr box volume, captions would be displayed (useful when my wife wants to sleep and I don't) Since the update, I can no longer mute the DVR Box (I am using an HDMI cable connected to a Yamaha amp, passing through HDMI to my display). I can activate captions manually through the DVR box preferences, but I am wondering if anyone else has noticed this. I had my remote configured so that I could mute the yamaha amp, then also mute the DVR box too to display the captions. I am thinking maybe the update has disabled the volume settings when it detects HDMI out?

I think you got ODN v3.2.0_15 which changed some parts of the audio output. Try playing with the settings. HDMI requires the device to do the captions not the TV.

I understand both buffers are buffered in the new version

Pardon my ignorance, but would 'activation' of this feature cause the channel you're watching to remain buffering when playing a recorded program? I have a vague memory that it worked that way at one time, but that may be attributable to wishful thinking. But, I've found times when it would have been very helpful to have something I'm watching continue to be buffered in the background when I switch to watching something that I've recorded.

Pardon my ignorance, but would 'activation' of this feature cause the channel you're watching to remain buffering when playing a recorded program? I have a vague memory that it worked that way at one time, but that may be attributable to wishful thinking. But, I've found times when it would have been very helpful to have something I'm watching continue to be buffered in the background when I switch to watching something that I've recorded.

Yes, it now continues to buffer while you watch a recorded program.

What I don't get is, if you actually want that, why is hitting the record button to manually start the buffering such a hardship when "automatic" background buffering isn't available? Until now, no version of ODN that I've had has automatically buffered the tuners, but when I wanted it to do that it was available with just a single button press. As I mentioned earlier, I suppose it mostly has to do with what behavior you've become "trained" to expect. As an engineer, it just seems silly to waste SDV resources automatically buffering channels that 99.9% of the time will never be used (athough I must add that there has been no degradation of the good SDV performance here since 3.2.0_15 has been rolled out).

Yes, it now continues to buffer while you watch a recorded program.

What I don't get is, if you actually want that, why is hitting the record button to manually start the buffering such a hardship when "automatic" background buffering isn't available? Until now, no version of ODN that I've had has automatically buffered the tuners, but when I wanted it to do that it was available with just a single button press. As I mentioned earlier, I suppose it mostly has to do with what behavior you've become "trained" to expect. As an engineer, it just seems silly to waste SDV resources automatically buffering channels that 99.9% of the time will never be used (athough I must add that there has been no degradation of the good SDV performance here since 3.2.0_15 has been rolled out).
Wish they would send 3.2.0.15 up the road to Greensboro. We just got 3.1.33 Sunday. WOODY
:)

Yes, it now continues to buffer while you watch a recorded program.

What I don't get is, if you actually want that, why is hitting the record button to manually start the buffering such a hardship when "automatic" background buffering isn't available? Until now, no version of ODN that I've had has automatically buffered the tuners, but when I wanted it to do that it was available with just a single button press. As I mentioned earlier, I suppose it mostly has to do with what behavior you've become "trained" to expect. As an engineer, it just seems silly to waste SDV resources automatically buffering channels that 99.9% of the time will never be used (athough I must add that there has been no degradation of the good SDV performance here since 3.2.0_15 has been rolled out).

jcalabria, I will give you a reason why dual buffers are important and why the example above is important.

Earlier this week my DVR was 90% full because my 8300HD only has a 160GB hard drive. If I had recorded a basketball game that I wanted to watch, then at least one of my recordings would have been deleted.

So, I tuned the game, hit pause and walked away for awhile. When I came back, I resumed the game. I got to watch it time shifted and none of my recordings were deleted. Alternatively, in reference to your example above I could have watched a 30 min recorded program while the game was buffering.

Now, imagine that you are one of TWCs millions of NYC customers and the Giants and the Jets are both playing at the same time. Assuming that users would set each game to add 30 minutes then it means recording those 2 games would take up nearly 1/3 of the total space available in the DVR! Enabling dual buffers allows users to switch back and forth as if the games were recorded, but with no loss of recording space!

I understand both buffers are buffered in the new version also. Hope we in Greensboro get it sooner rather than later. WOODY

That restores one of the two downgrades related to the tuners... oddly, the one I used even more was the ability to pop around multiple channels on one tuner while the other stayed and buffered.

It's at an alpha or even pre alpha level in terms of stability. On the plus side we gain dual buffers.

We used to refer to those as dev versions.

I can understand that... guess I'm spoiled by the 320GB drive... another example of how you use the DVR being shaped by the equpment you have.

Several weeks this year the Giants, Jets and Panthers were all on TV here and I routinely record all of them, so I'm no stranger to recording multiple games. Right now I have the full season of Fringe, the last two Jets games (don't ask me why I haven't erased them), the first three Caprica episodes and last week's 24 still on mine and it's just at 50%. I never even think about drive space.

jcalabria, I will give you a reason why dual buffers are important and why the example above is important.

Earlier this week my DVR was 90% full because my 8300HD only has a 160GB hard drive. If I had recorded a basketball game that I wanted to watch, then at least one of my recordings would have been deleted.

So, I tuned the game, hit pause and walked away for awhile. When I came back, I resumed the game. I got to watch it time shifted and none of my recordings were deleted. Alternatively, in reference to your example above I could have watched a 30 min recorded program while the game was buffering.

Now, imagine that you are one of TWCs millions of NYC customers and the Giants and the Jets are both playing at the same time. Assuming that users would set each game to add 30 minutes then it means recording those 2 games would take up nearly 1/3 of the total space available in the DVR! Enabling dual buffers allows users to switch back and forth as if the games were recorded, but with no loss of recording space!

I never even think about drive space.

At one point last week, I had exactly one, hour long recorded show on the DVR... it sported the exclamation mark and said it would be deleted in 51 hours.

I think you got ODN v3.2.0_15 which changed some parts of the audio output. Try playing with the settings. HDMI requires the device to do the captions not the TV.

I'd like to have a one-button caption on/off (I tried remote macro flashing all the required menus, but it was too much hassle). Currently, I have a very usable workaround: set the caption to "On With Mute" and then use DVR mute button to turn captions on/off. It does not actually affect the sound at all. DVR sound controls do nothing at all (except the above workaround). I have HDMI from DVR to TV and optical from DVR to receiver.
Please don't tell me they ruined this in 3.2.0_15.

Is there a contact number or email address for the developers that I could get? The TWC support is terrible and will not help me with my problem.

I still cannot get my cable box to disable 480p and 720p. I only want to leave 1080i enabled because my TV takes 6+ seconds to switch resolutions. If I wire the HDMI directly to my TV, I can disable everything perfectly. But, if I send the HDMI through my receiver, the resolutions are reset every time I turn off the cable box or receiver.

It is driving my family and myself absolutely insane and their support won't help me anymore. They tell me "if you get any picture then the box is working fine by our standards". Unacceptable!

Is there a contact number or email address for the developers that I could get? The TWC support is terrible and will not help me with my problem.

I still cannot get my cable box to disable 480p and 720p. I only want to leave 1080i enabled because my TV takes 6+ seconds to switch resolutions. If I wire the HDMI directly to my TV, I can disable everything perfectly. But, if I send the HDMI through my receiver, the resolutions are reset every time I turn off the cable box or receiver.

The best place for Navigator support is right here!

The solution is - don't go through the AVR. The handshake process has always been problematic. Jack it in to the TV via HDMI and run optical or coax to the receiver.

I still cannot get my cable box to disable 480p and 720p. I only want to leave 1080i enabled because my TV takes 6+ seconds to switch resolutions. If I wire the HDMI directly to my TV, I can disable everything perfectly. But, if I send the HDMI through my receiver, the resolutions are reset every time I turn off the cable box or receiver.

It is not the TW box, it is the AVR telling the box (via HDMI) what to do. /Dan

Edit: I stand corrected in next message.

It is not the TW box, it is the AVR telling the box (via HDMI) what to do. /DanI don't think so--other than by passing CEC commands, downstream HDMI devices (the AVR) don't tell upstream devices (the DVR) what to do. What they do tell upstream devices is what they're capable of, by passing them an Enhanced Extended Display Identification Data (E-EDID) structure; the upstream device may not send it requests which exceed the capabilities indicated in the E-EDID.

Sounds as though something in ithe DVR's exchange with the AVR makes it want to reset its resolution setting, which is just strange. The AVR would copy the television's video capabilities--he can set the DVR up to do what he wants with HDMI running through the receiver, so it's not that the DVR thinks that the AVR can't handle the setting. Goofy.

I'm not in a TWC system right now, but there's an 8300HD in this house running SARA with the equivalent resolution setting run through a Sony AVR into a Samsung LCD panel and it works perfectly.

The obvious work-around is to run cables like they said, inelegant though it may be--HDMI into the TV, S/PDIF into the receiver. The DVR can't send any sound formats that can't be sent over S/PDIF.

Is there a contact number or email address for the developers that I could get? The TWC support is terrible and will not help me with my problem.

I still cannot get my cable box to disable 480p and 720p. I only want to leave 1080i enabled because my TV takes 6+ seconds to switch resolutions. If I wire the HDMI directly to my TV, I can disable everything perfectly. But, if I send the HDMI through my receiver, the resolutions are reset every time I turn off the cable box or receiver.

It is driving my family and myself absolutely insane and their support won't help me anymore. They tell me "if you get any picture then the box is working fine by our standards". Unacceptable!

this problem pops up every now and then when there is a newer version of the software downloaded to the DVR. It has happented to my system at least 1 time with the older Passport software and 1 time with Navigator.

When the next version was download, the problem was corrected. It is a TW problem. When the HDMI handshake occurs , the box sees new capabilites and updates it's settings, ignoring the fact that you have told it to ignore them

Wish they would send 3.2.0.15 up the road to Greensboro. We just got 3.1.33 Sunday. WOODY
:)

Be careful what you wish for Woody. You might get it! And the "it" is a lot of bugs in this new ODN 3.2.0.15 release. Meanwhile my old MDN box keeps working just fine! LOL! Your division might be waiting for a newer ODN build, something like a 3.2.0.16 ODN release, or maybe a 3.3 version being developed.

There's been all kinds of problems with ODN 3.2.0.15 ranging from picture freezing, pixiation, and HDMI handshake issues. It broke a bunch of Samsung boxes! I have a feeling a new version will be deployed as an "emergency" update bug fix sometime next month.

Jack

When the next version was download, the problem was corrected. It is a TW problem. When the HDMI handshake occurs , the box sees new capabilites and updates it's settings, ignoring the fact that you have told it to ignore them

Could a bad cable cause this? I have a cable that has issues with my PS3's signal, but works fine with the cable box. I believe it's going from the cable box to the receiver. Well, it may be going from the receiver to the tv. I'll get under there and check. The receiver is an Onkyo HT-RC160, if that matters. Are there any other reasons to cause handshaking issues?

I really don't want to have to run the dvr to a separate HDMI input on the TV again. I've been working to simplify the entire setup for my family.

Edit: I checked the cables, and it's not the cables. :(

Could a bad cable cause this? I have a cable that has issues with my PS3's signal, but works fine with the cable box. I believe it's going from the cable box to the receiver. Well, it may be going from the receiver to the tv. I'll get under there and check. The receiver is an Onkyo HT-RC160, if that matters. Are there any other reasons to cause handshaking issues?

I really don't want to have to run the dvr to a separate HDMI input on the TV again. I've been working to simplify the entire setup for my family.

Edit: I checked the cables, and it's not the cables. :(

I had the same problem with my 8300HDC, the box sucks. I did the optical cable to the AVR workaround. If you want to simplify make sure you get a Harmony remote, they are outstanding.

Could a bad cable cause this? I have a cable that has issues with my PS3's signal, but works fine with the cable box. I believe it's going from the cable box to the receiver. Well, it may be going from the receiver to the tv. I'll get under there and check. The receiver is an Onkyo HT-RC160, if that matters. Are there any other reasons to cause handshaking issues?


It's the hardware at both ends. I never had a good time with HDMI passthrough on my Onkyo - especially with the GUI onscreen display switched on - which is why I moved on to Denon.

Just switch to the workaround and invest in an easy remote that switches the inputs automatically to pass the WAF.

It's the hardware at both ends. I never had a good time with HDMI passthrough on my Onkyo - especially with the GUI onscreen display switched on - which is why I moved on to Denon.On the other hand, I've been running four HDMI devices through my Onkyo receiver for 3 years without any problems, though none of them are a Cisco/SA cable STB (TiVo, Xbox, PS3 and an old DVD recorder, with 3 of them connected via a switch, since the AVR only has two HDMI inputs).

Just signed up for a My Services Account through my local website,

Damn! If only Navigator Search was as good as what you get on My Services! You can go to "My TV" and Search by Title, Person, Phrases. And it goes 14 days ahead! This is EXACTLY how Navigator should do it!

If I could say ONE thing about Navigator to TWC Management, it would be make Navigator Searching like "My TV" My Services Searching and no one would complain.

I think Remote DVR Management is gonna be pretty cool! If we ever get it.

Jack

Just signed up for a My Services Account through my local website,

Damn! If only Navigator Search was as good as what you get on My Services! You can go to "My TV" and Search by Title, Person, Phrases. And it goes 14 days ahead! This is EXACTLY how Navigator should do it!

If I could say ONE thing about Navigator to TWC Management, it would be make Navigator Searching like "My TV" My Services Searching and no one would complain.

I think Remote DVR Management is gonna be pretty cool! If we ever get it.

JackYeah, I've been using TVGuide's search capability for months. That's why I can't get excited over Navigator's lack of search. Even if they implemented it in Navigator, I can't imagine it being as easy to use as TVGuide or MY TV.

Now, if they implemented something like ReplayTV, that would be a different story. ReplayTV allowed you to automatically record anything that matched your search. E.g., record all Missouri football games or all movies with Matt Damon.