Fingers Crossed that you get a significant update. Of course, I can only hope if you do, we don't have to wait almost a year to get it like our last update!

LOL!!!! Yea!!! But why me first in little rinky dinky Wisconsin? I mean San Diego and Charlotte are always first with this stuff. My guess it's just gonna be the firmware thing.

Yea, watch, I'll get some talking, super fast Gator and be like Abyss when he got his Gator the first day, Remember, how he moved all his stuff in into the kitchen and set his alarm so he wouldn't miss the download? LOL! I wonder what happened to him? He was cool!

Yea, I can see it now............."Welcome to Navigator 5.0" hahahahaha!!!

No, seriously I think this is just the typical PR thing. Notice how they say "new features" but all they mention is Look Back, which we have had on some channels for awhile. It would be cool if this is the missing features that are now on MDN.

It might be more than that, because why would they say Parental Controls may have to be reset, just to add Look Back?

Jack

PS Maybe after tonight, I'll be a Gator Fan like Steve Mehs!!!! LOL!! We shall see!!!

I'm wondering if it's possible they are adding a guide filter which could affect your parental controls? I tried using the Parental Controls as a guide filter by blocking only SD channels, but the guide took it upon itself to also block the HD's as well. Who knows what is coming down the pike? Just keep us updated, because I'm desperately hoping for a significant update that adds some missing features and speeds things up a bit. Navigator is basically the only thing I'm unhappy with from all my Time Warner services. If they get it tweaked, it'll would be great.

LOL!!!! Yea!!! But why me first in little rinky dinky Wisconsin? I mean San Diego and Charlotte are always first with this stuff. My guess it's just gonna be the firmware thing.

Yea, watch, I'll get some talking, super fast Gator and be like Abyss when he got his Gator the first day, Remember, how he moved all his stuff in into the kitchen and set his alarm so he wouldn't miss the download? LOL! I wonder what happened to him? He was cool!

Yea, I can see it now............."Welcome to Navigator 5.0" hahahahaha!!!

No, seriously I think this is just the typical PR thing. Notice how they say "new features" but all they mention is Look Back, which we have had on some channels for awhile. It would be cool if this is the missing features that are now on MDN.

It might be more than that, because why would they say Parental Controls may have to be reset, just to add Look Back?

Jack

PS Maybe after tonight, I'll be a Gator Fan like Steve Mehs!!!! LOL!! We shall see!!!

In the future suposedly all of the boxes will be navigator including the famous DCX3400/3200 series except for the DCT series of boxes which are supposedly being phased out eventually.

Navigator is testing on motorola cable systems now with multiroom DVRs being the first have it installed on them oh and they are still using motorola cable cards in the tru2way boxes as well.

I believe that north texas, North County San Diego, and Socal motorola areas are testing Navigator as we speak.

Nothing new to report,

They had a message on VoiceMail that they were doing maintenance in Northern Wisconsin, but the areas that they gave were like 50 miles or more out from me. (I am in the Southern part of Wisconsin.) This might be a node by node thing. It does seem like something is about to hit across divisions though. Like San Diego doing that Middleare update for ODN, might mean something's coming soon. My Statement said "On or after March 8th" so we'll see.

Jack

...My Statement said "On or after March 8th" so we'll see.

Jack

Did it happen to mention a year???:D

Did it happen to mention a year???:D

LOL!!!! Funny JC!!!!

Jack

Looks like Cisco will start rolling out the 8700 Series this summer. However, it appears only Cox is jumping on the bandwagon at this time. They have deployed the Trio Guide. It's HD Optimized and allows for individual users similar to Dish. It amazes me how everyone can develop functional, feature packed guide - but TWC, the second largest cable operation in the country, give us Navigator as their best effort?!?!?

http://www.multichannel.com/article/465086-Cisco_Preps_Linux_Based_Tru2way_Cable_Set_Tops.php

Looks like Cisco will start rolling out the 8700 Series this summer. However, it appears only Cox is jumping on the bandwagon at this time. They have deployed the Trio Guide. It's HD Optimized and allows for individual users similar to Dish. It amazes me how everyone can develop functional, feature packed guide - but TWC, the second largest cable operation in the country, give us Navigator as their best effort?!?!?

http://www.multichannel.com/article/465086-Cisco_Preps_Linux_Based_Tru2way_Cable_Set_Tops.php

Cosign!

Jack

Also, it should be noted that the Trio Guide has filtering, keyword search and advance guide customization such as the Trio Screen or Grid. Everyone always touts that guide filters, keyword search, etc. are not there because the cable companies don't want them there, yet here is a cable op that gives you those features.

It should be noted that Trio was an in house collaboration with NDS doing the programming.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/452387-Cox_Rigs_Trio_Big_Screen_Guide.php

Looks like Cisco will start rolling out the 8700 Series this summer. However, it appears only Cox is jumping on the bandwagon at this time. They have deployed the Trio Guide. It's HD Optimized and allows for individual users similar to Dish. It amazes me how everyone can develop functional, feature packed guide - but TWC, the second largest cable operation in the country, give us Navigator as their best effort?!?!?

http://www.multichannel.com/article/465086-Cisco_Preps_Linux_Based_Tru2way_Cable_Set_Tops.php

Everyone is an overstatement. I have stayed in vacation homes that were on other cable systems. The guide on one had advertisements embedded in the display. Most were vastly inferior to Navigator.
The grass is always greener...

Many guides are still bad. However, many companies are making vast improvements over what Navigator is. Navigator is not much of an improvement over SARA. Other than updated looks, it really doesn't add anything feature-wise. It's slower and less intuitive. It shouldn't be as far behind as it is considering how long they've been working on it.

Everyone is an overstatement. I have stayed in vacation homes that were on other cable systems. The guide on one had advertisements embedded in the display. Most were vastly inferior to Navigator.
The grass is always greener...

Well of course it is. Lots of systems still use older guide versions. However TWC has announced nothing that compares to the IPGs being unveiled by other cable and satcos.

Eventually all Cox systems will be upgraded to the Trio guide. Where is Navigator going? They don't even have a proper HD guide upgrade deployed or testing yet - after seven years! Even if you don't like the approach of the Trio design, visually it's far superior to Navigator and it's only in it's early stages.

Can Navigator show you six screens at a time?

http://www.multichannel.com/photo/252/252627-Cox_s_Trio_news_zone_mosaic.jpg


http://www.multichannel.com/article/452387-Cox_Rigs_Trio_Big_Screen_Guide.php

Plus the Trio guide gives you a Roku/Netflix like screen for VOD content. Also, keep in mind that the Moxi style guide can be set to a grid based one.

That Guide for Cox is awesome!

I found out about six months ago that some areas of Cox got a different guide. It was buggy at first, but I think they are now putting it into more homes. I don't think Cox is developing Trio in house. If they are, they are a hell of lot more knowledgeable than TWC's Navigator developers! Why can Cox do something like this, and TWC can't?

Jack

PS. Sorry! Ben, I missed your post above. You said this is In-House Project?

That Guide for Cox is awesome!

I found out about six months ago that some areas of Cox got a different guide. It was buggy at first, but I think they are now putting it into more homes. I don't think Cox is developing Trio in house. If they are, they are a hell of lot more knowledgeable than TWC's Navigator developers! Why can Cox do something like this, and TWC can't?

Jack

PS. Sorry! Ben, I missed your post above. You said this is In-House Project?

Not "in house", the same way Navigator is. They are working with NDS (http://www.nds.com/) to handle the programming. Cox did studies and focus groups to determine what kind of GUI they wanted and worked with NDS to get it done. They had the wherewithal that Time Warner lacked and knew enough to contract with an experienced team to get this done. It's likely why the Cox 2nd Generation Trio Guide is light years ahead of Navigator's 5th (or better) deployed revision.

The story of Trio (http://www.nds.com/professional_services/pro_services_case_studies_cox-trio.php)

Well of course it is. Lots of systems still use older guide versions. However TWC has announced nothing that compares to the IPGs being unveiled by other cable and satcos.

Eventually all Cox systems will be upgraded to the Trio guide. Where is Navigator going? They don't even have a proper HD guide upgrade deployed or testing yet - after seven years! Even if you don't like the approach of the Trio design, visually it's far superior to Navigator and it's only in it's early stages.

Can Navigator show you six screens at a time?

http://www.multichannel.com/photo/252/252627-Cox_s_Trio_news_zone_mosaic.jpg

http://www.multichannel.com/article/452387-Cox_Rigs_Trio_Big_Screen_Guide.php

The Cox Trio IPG is a Cox/NDS collaboration.

Read some of the customer comments for the Cox Trio IPG, Most will say it is not ready for primetime and it has been plagued with delays and bugs. I cannot comment yet, It has not been released in Phoenix. I will stick with Rovi Passport Echo until the bugs are worked out, Unless I am offered a free beta testing slot. Rovi Passport Echo is a major improvement over SARA, with the exception that the SA8240HDC will no longer Format a New External eSATA HDD. The SA8300HD still will as it runs an older version of the PowerTV OS.

Cox Cable - Trio Whole Home DVR Cisco
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1286642

Some of the feedback:

Slow Guide Response
Random Reboots
Missing and too short guide program descriptions
Missed Recordings
Recordings cutting off 1-2 mins early
eSATA Expansion HDD does not playback on the client, bug with buffing to the client, attempting to do so requires a reboot of both boxes.
Slow Client response from the DVR
Recording Playback issues from the client
New HD channels are available only with Whole Home DVR (you must lease 2 boxes, a DVR, 8642HDC and a Client STB 1642HDC, in order to get the new HD channels.)

Some of the feedback:

Slow Guide Response
Random Reboots
Missing and too short guide program descriptions
Missed Recordings
Recordings cutting off 1-2 mins early
eSATA Expansion HDD does not playback on the client, bug with buffing to the client, attempting to do so requires a reboot of both boxes.
Slow Client response from the DVR
Recording Playback issues from the client
New HD channels are available only with Whole Home DVR (you must lease 2 boxes, a DVR, 8642HDC and a Client STB 1642HDC, in order to get the new HD channels.)


Sure, but it's not even in wide release yet. Most of those issues still plague Navigator and it's going on 7 years in development! It's still lacking half the features Trio has.

We have talked a great length about Navigator's shortcomings, problems, and bugs not being fixed fast enough, along with missing features. However, we have often compared Navigator to U-Verse, Dish, but not enough to other cable systems.

What other cable systems have guides currently running that are worse than Navigator? Better than Navigator? About the same as Navigator?

Jack

We have talked a great length about Navigator's shortcomings, problems, and bugs not being fixed fast enough, along with missing features. However, we have often compared Navigator to U-Verse, Dish, but not enough to other cable systems.

What other cable systems have guides currently running that are worse than Navigator? Better than Navigator? About the same as Navigator?

JackI think a lot depends on what you are used to and, as someone said before, iis the grass greener on the other side of the fence.

We have kids that live in Maryland and in St. Paul, MN.

The daughter in Maryland has FiOS, the guide there is, frankly, a pain in the ass. Their On demand structure makes you scroll through tons of menus before getting to the most recent broadcast of "Blue Blood" (for example). TWs scheme of discrete channels for various types of OD is much more convenient. Speed also seems slow compared to my MDN box. If I key in a channel number too fast, it will drop digits. And those ads, placed strategically in at the bottom of a guide where you might stumble on them scrolling down the screen. Plus there for MDN.

The daughter in St. Paul has Comcrap. Their guide is a little less crazy than FiOS, but I still have a preference for MDN.

I've managed to avoid ODN, so I can't compare performance of that to either FiOS or Comcrap. Also, I never use any search functions there (do use it with the Remote DVR however) - so I can't compare that aspect.

MDN is great compared to ODN. I'd be happy with MDN if they added the following (which I don't think is much to ask for in 2011!): Guide Filter & Keyword Search. They could easily fix the problem of making the guide more intuitive. Navigator has great potential, but the updates are way to far and few.

ODN would be fine if they could simply get it MDN speeds and add said features. If the day comes when that happens, I will praise TWC for it.

MDN is great compared to ODN. I'd be happy with MDN if they added the following (which I don't think is much to ask for in 2011!): Guide Filter & Keyword Search. They could easily fix the problem of making the guide more intuitive. Navigator has great potential, but the updates are way to far and few.

ODN would be fine if they could simply get it MDN speeds and add said features. If the day comes when that happens, I will praise TWC for it.

Well none of the systems I mentioned have Guide Filtering and I personally don't give a crap for Keyword Search. But that is just MY preferences (I also don't care if the guide is 16:9 or what it looks like - though the MDN guide is much more readable than the FiOS one).

My pet peeve is the Guide Stretch Bug introduced in 4.0 where the guide can't decide whether or not to stay in 4:3 or stretch to fill 16:9. I could live without Keyword Search, but a Guide Filter is needed badly. Now, Guide Filter really depends on if your division has a common sense channel alignment. If it does, this isn't an issue. If you have the abysmal channel alignment we have with duplicate and triplicate channels spread all over the place, SD and HD channel numbers that aren't even close, then you might see it more my way. Keyword Search would be a nice extra though.

Now, Guide Filter really depends on if your division has a common sense channel alignment. If it does, this isn't an issue. If you have the abysmal channel alignment we have with duplicate and triplicate channels spread all over the place, SD and HD channel numbers that aren't even close, then you might see it more my way.Oh, I did agree with you on Guide Filtering - I just said that the other systems didn't have it either.

BTW: Our TW system has all the HD channels grouped together (1004 through 1199), as does the FiOS (500-699) and Comcrap (200-399) systems that I am familiar with. I also thought that TW in Syracuse had them grouped together too as does Buffalo. Those within the HD grouping might not be logical, but at least they are in one group. My question is, where is Guide Filtering implemented, and where it is implemented will it let you customize the order that the channels appear?

Oh, I did agree with you on Guide Filtering - I just said that the other systems didn't have it either.

BTW: Our TW system has all the HD channels grouped together (1004 through 1199), as does the FiOS (500-699) and Comcrap (200-399) systems that I am familiar with. I also thought that TW in Syracuse had them grouped together too as does Buffalo. Those within the HD grouping might not be logical, but at least they are in one group. My question is, where is Guide Filtering implemented, and where it is implemented will it let you customize the order that the channels appear?

Our Division has HD channels in the 700,800,900 and 1000 Tiers. Now, they are the same numbers across divisions (IE: Utica, Rome Syracuse) but they are in no logical grouping. The are scattered all over the place.

Our Division has HD channels in the 700,800,900 and 1000 Tiers. Now, they are the same numbers across divisions (IE: Utica, Rome Syracuse) but they are in no logical grouping. The are scattered all over the place.


The same level of confusion reins true here in the Southern Tier (Bignhamton Region). HD scattered all over the place. VOD all over. 3 or 4 networks repeated throughtout the guide - DIY network located in the 70's, 120's, 800's and 1200's. Why ? Very cluttered. And why can't I remove the porn channels from the guide so my kids when channel surfing don't have to read the descriptive details of the MILF next door doing the 15 year old son ?????

The same level of confusion reins true here in the Southern Tier (Bignhamton Region). HD scattered all over the place. VOD all over. 3 or 4 networks repeated throughout the guide - DIY network located in the 70's, 120's, 800's and 1200's. Why ? Very cluttered. And why can't I remove the porn channels from the guide so my kids when channel surfing don't have to read the descriptive details of the MILF next door doing the 15 year old son ?????

One thing about Navigator that I heard is decent, even though I don't use it because we don't have kids is Parental Control functions. You can block by Time, Rating, Channel, or Title: Here is the description on how to use it from my TWC webpage:

Question:

What can I do to control what my child watches?

Answer:

There are many ways you can control or influence what your children watch. For example, you can teach them to find quality programming, and/or you can use digital technology to block out programs you don't want them to watch.

For Navigator On-Screen Guide

To Setup Locks and Parental Controls:

In Settings, use the Right Arrow key on your remote to highlight Parental Control

Highlight the blocking parameter you want and press Select on your remote

Press the C button on your remote control to save your settings

Use the Up Arrow key on your remote to highlight Turn On, then press the Select key on your remote followed by your four digit code to activate Parental Control

You will see a lock icon on channels that are locked.

My understanding is that if you do a Rating Block for example, let's say you block all R-Rated content. (You will need to enter your pin number to view it) In this example, you would also block all ratings about "R" (i.e X, NC-17, Adult.)

This page goes into greater detail on how to use TWC Navigator parental controls: Hint-Parental Controls require setting a Pin Number, and Parental Controls must be turned on before they will work:

https://www.timewarnercable.com/wisconsin/support/navigator/settings.html

Parental Control is an area where TWC is really helpful. If you have trouble setting up your filters for the programs you want to block after seeing the steps above and at the link, call TWC, they are really good with helping people block shows that are not appropriate for all family members.

Jack

http://www.oceanic.com/products/television/digital_cable/navigatorguide

On the Oceanic TWC website they have announced that over the next few weeks and by the second week of may they will be rolling out navigator to STBs and they list that you will lose DVR expander and that they will temporarily discontinue the interactive channels and mosaic channels on boxes that have been upgraded to Navigator until the week of 5/16.

http://www.oceanic.com/products/television/digital_cable/not-available

So it looks like Navigator will support:

Mosaics
HSN Shop by remote
Ordering pizza hut by remote
TV Home Page
Billing

http://www.oceanic.com/products/television/digital_cable/navigatorguide

On the Oceanic TWC website they have announced that over the next few weeks and by the second week of may they will be rolling out navigator to STBs and they list that you will lose DVR expander and that they will temporarily discontinue the interactive channels and mosaic channels on boxes that have been upgraded to Navigator until the week of 5/16.

http://www.oceanic.com/products/television/digital_cable/not-available

So it looks like Navigator will support:

Mosaics
HSN Shop by remote
Ordering pizza hut by remote
TV Home Page
Billing

Thanks for the heads-up Kevin!

Does anyone know what box(es) they are using in Hawaii? (MDN-No C/Not a Samsung) or ODN (C Boxes/Samsungs) or something different? I am pretty sure this is the last of the Navigator TWC transitions.

Jack

TIME WARNER CABLE CAROLINAS OFFERS THE TV JAPAN CHANNEL TO DIGITAL TV CUSTOMERS


In response to the earthquake in Japan, Time Warner Cable is offering a free preview of TV Japan to its Digital TV customers in the Carolinas. Digital customers will have access to TV Japan’s earthquake coverage at no additional cost now through March 31, 2011 on channel 880. TV Japan is a 24/7 Japanese broadcasting channel that is providing first hand coverage of the earthquake and resulting tsunami.

Time Warner Cable announced late last week that all calls placed by its Digital Home Phone customers to Japan will be free through April 15, 2011. The program is retroactive for all calls placed on March 11, 2011.

Thanks for the heads-up Kevin!

Does anyone know what box(es) they are using in Hawaii? (MDN-No C/Not a Samsung) or ODN (C Boxes/Samsungs) or something different? I am pretty sure this is the last of the Navigator TWC transitions.

Jack

Hawaii is SARA, and they use nothing but SA boxes. No sign of Samsung or Cisco boxes in Hawaii, though maybe they are testing them.

Hawaii is SARA, and they use nothing but SA boxes. No sign of Samsung or Cisco boxes in Hawaii, though maybe they are testing them.???? But SA=Cisco (Cisco purchased SA several years ago). Perhaps you meant something else.

They likely have both "C" and "non-C" boxes, as they are subject to the same FCC rules as the mainland (so they could acquire only "C" boxes after July 2007).

Thanks for the heads-up Kevin!

Does anyone know what box(es) they are using in Hawaii? (MDN-No C/Not a Samsung) or ODN (C Boxes/Samsungs) or something different? I am pretty sure this is the last of the Navigator TWC transitions.

Jack

Hawaii is not the last Navigator Transition motorola areas are and then only those with OCAP/tru2way motorola DCH/DCX Boxes will get ODN 4.0 or higher.

Hawaii is not the last Navigator Transition motorola areas are and then only those with OCAP/tru2way motorola DCH/DCX Boxes will get ODN 4.0 or higher.

What divisions have the Motorola STB that will support ODN-Navigator in the future? I think some areas of Los Angeles are a part of this.

Jack

http://www.oceanic.com/products/television/digital_cable/navigatorguide

On the Oceanic TWC website they have announced that over the next few weeks and by the second week of may they will be rolling out navigator to STBs and they list that you will lose DVR expander and that they will temporarily discontinue the interactive channels and mosaic channels on boxes that have been upgraded to Navigator until the week of 5/16.

http://www.oceanic.com/products/television/digital_cable/not-available

So it looks like Navigator will support:

Mosaics
HSN Shop by remote
Ordering pizza hut by remote
TV Home Page
Billing

That's interesting because Oceanic has typically been technologically ahead of other TWC systems, offering features that never appear anywhere else. Do Oceanic still have PhotoShow or Games on Demand?

This could mean Oceanic will permanently lose features like those above as Navigator-areas did with the loss of Passport, cease to receive any cool new features like those above or is being used as a way to test those features that may finally find their way to other systems.

That's interesting because Oceanic has typically been technologically ahead of other TWC systems, offering features that never appear anywhere else. Do Oceanic still have PhotoShow or Games on Demand?

This could mean Oceanic will permanently lose features like those above as Navigator-areas did with the loss of Passport, cease to receive any cool new features like those above or is being used as a way to test those features that may finally find their way to other systems.

We have Photo Show with Navigator in Wisconsin. There was talk of Navigator incorporating it's own video games channel when it first came out in the Fall-Spring of 2006/2007. But the disasters that followed with the guide's piss poor performance and non-existent reliability seemed to trash that idea.

If they could get their act together across divisions and not have these inconsistencies where JC's division is great, my division is above average, and Ben's division with Navigator has been a POS, since the launch of ODN 4.0, maybe we could see the development of some other applets.

But the overall attitude about Navigator at the corporate level seems to be lukewarm at best, because they don't see the guide as a money maker for them. Once again, TWC just sort of cares that if people can find there shows and series, and DVR users can record and manager them, and general populations get a picture and sound on the screen and on their TV and audio systems, it's off and running to spend almost all of their resources on Road Runner, Digital Phone, and Mobile Technology.

Ben says it best, Navigator was designed to be nothing more than a spring board mechanism for TWC to launch other services that the company could call their own. (i.e Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV.) Or those applets that incorporate mobile technology, represented in Remote DVR Manager and now the Mobile I-Pod devices for watching TV on the go.

The one incentive that might make TWC care about Navigator remains that they stand the potential to not acquire enough Signature Home Customers, if they can't get the guide up to quality speed and reliability. Signature Home is a big deal to TWC, and they see it as a money maker. However, if enough customers drop Signature Home because Navigator is not good enough in their division, I think this may make TWC take notice.

Jack

What divisions have the Motorola STB that will support ODN-Navigator in the future? I think some areas of Los Angeles are a part of this.

Jack

Any TWC motorola division that has stuck with the motorola boxes instead of swapping them for cisco.

Anything before the cable card mandate is not getting Navigator and will slowly be phased out at least in North Texas.

The boxes that are likely to get Navigator:
DCH6200
DCH3200
DCH6416
DCH3416
DCX3200
DCX3432

I know for a fact that these system have Navigator Capable motorola boxes:
Ashland Ky/Ironton OH
Western Kentucky
Central Kentucky
North County San Diego
Southern California
North Texas
Mid Ohio
Parts of Maine

And possibly Wichita Falls as they are motorola and announced ESPN3D which means they have to have the DCX series boxes to see the channel as it is MPEG4.

That's interesting because Oceanic has typically been technologically ahead of other TWC systems, offering features that never appear anywhere else. Do Oceanic still have PhotoShow or Games on Demand?

This could mean Oceanic will permanently lose features like those above as Navigator-areas did with the loss of Passport, cease to receive any cool new features like those above or is being used as a way to test those features that may finally find their way to other systems.

There keeping the games channels TAG and TAG2 they will be temporarily unavailable on boxes running Navigator during the transition and will regain them during the week of may 16th.

Ben says it best, Navigator was designed to be nothing more than a spring board mechanism for TWC to launch other services that the company could call their own. (i.e Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV.) I don't dispute most of what you have said, but the specific examples you point out (Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV) had nothing to do with Navigator - they all existed in SARA systems (at least they did here in Rochester).

But OCAP does have the capability for new, and valuable, features such as targeted advertising.

I don't dispute most of what you have said, but the specific examples you point out (Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV) had nothing to do with Navigator - they all existed in SARA systems (at least they did here in Rochester).

But OCAP does have the capability for new, and valuable, features such as targeted advertising.

Yes, but Navigator was implemented to make these features more widespread and expanded. SARA was not going to be able to handle Remote DVR, Whole Home DVR or some other features and options Time Warner wanted to do.

Now, I would like to try and get some discussion going on where and what Navigator can improve on. I know I'm critical of it, but let's face it - we are stuck with it and should want it to evolve to be the GUI it can be. This is mainly to discuss ODN, since MDN hardware is basically updated to the point it will be going forward.

If they can get the speed up to par on the guide it would help. Even speed comparable to MDN. MDN has no guide lag. Other than that and any forthcoming features - I'd like to see some usability tweaks.

I'd really like them to fix the "dump to live" when watching a recorded program.

I'd like to see it behave more like SARA and default back to the list. I'd also like to see the option of fixing the list display to one setting. It always defaults to date. I'd like to be able to set it alphabetic like SARA.

Also, they really need to fix the Priority Scheduling. Make it so you can adjust each episode from the central list. It's a royal pain the way it is now and generally gets ignored until it misses a show and pisses me off. It's way to tedious to have to select each and every show, one at a time from the Series Manager and then place it's Priority.

These small tweaks would make the guide much more intuitive.

Yes, but Navigator was implemented to make these features more widespread and expanded.As I said, these particular features (Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV) had nothing to do with Navigator, and (in fact) Navigator ODN has somewhat crippled these features by slowing response times. SARA was not going to be able to handle Remote DVR, Whole Home DVR or some other features and options Time Warner wanted to do.Actually, Multi-Room DVR did exist in SARA. TW never widely deployed it. And there was no apparent reason that Remote DVR could not have been implemented in SARA either.

As I said, these particular features (Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV) had nothing to do with Navigator, and (in fact) Navigator ODN has somewhat crippled these features by slowing response times. Actually, Multi-Room DVR did exist in SARA. TW never widely deployed it. And there was no apparent reason that Remote DVR could not have been implemented in SARA either.

Multi-Room was crippled under the SARA system which was a reason why it wasn't deployed. Time Warner did internal testing and scrapped it. They wanted a simpler way to do installs and MoCa allowed the current incarnation. The main reason was as mentioned. Navigator allows for easier integration of features by Time Warner. It's there code so they can manipulate it any way they want. They don't have to wait on outside programmers to integrate the middleware.

This allows them to add Start Over/Look Back and any other features more readily to more available channels. Sure, it can be done without Navigator - but it's far more cost effective and timely for them to do it in house.

All that said, we must keep in mind the number one reason Time Warner went in house: Money. This ties in with the above mentioned sub-contracting out programming services, but also the licensing fees. Money and complete control are why we have Navigator.

Now, if the Navigator Development Team is listening and it seems like they are with what is rumored to be forthcoming then Navigator will keep making great stride to be the great guide it can be. The few things I mentioned above would be a great start. Hopefully, they don't get a "this is good enough" mentality.

This allows them to add Start Over/Look Back and any other features more readily to more available channels. Sure, it can be done without Navigator - but it's far more cost effective and timely for them to do it in house.BS in regards to Start Over/Lock Back. Those "features" as well as SDV and On Demand are all functions of the network infrastructure and have little to do with the box software. We had all of those features before Navigator. All that Navigator did was make them harder to access due to the sluggishness of Navigator.

The delay in MR was due more to waiting for the development of the MoCA standard than to the "need" to have their own software (keep in mind that SARA came from the developer of the hardware - CISCO).

BS in regards to Start Over/Lock Back. Those "features" as well as SDV and On Demand are all functions of the network infrastructure and have little to do with the box software.

Sorry, without software support none of the features will work. My point stands and I'm not disagreeing with the fact that it could be added to SARA via the middleware - it was. The point I made was that Time Warner wanted full control over the programming of said features and Navigator gives them that while at the same time eliminating any licensing fees. So, while Cisco supplies the hardware to TWC (as does Samsung and in some cases Motorola) they still need software to interpret the data/commands. I agree the Navigator mucked up some things as I'm currently plagued by slow boxes, but that's due to TWC inexperienced programmers. In time, it should improve (hopefully!)

The problem with TWC enhancing Navigator is that 99+% of their customers are more than content with the product as is. I have talked to several people who have had a DVR for several years and still didn't know that there was a search function.

They should offer a Navigator+ for an extra $1.00 a month for us folks that want extra functions

The problem with TWC enhancing Navigator is that 99+% of their customers are more than content with the product as is. I have talked to several people who have had a DVR for several years and still didn't know that there was a search function.

They should offer a Navigator+ for an extra $1.00 a month for us folks that want extra functions

Agreed and that's because the bulk of the subs are ignorant technophobes (for lack of a better phrase), thus TWC pushes out a "just good enough" piece of software.

I think TWC also believes that no matter what they distribute, there will be individuals who will never be happy.

Agreed and that's because the bulk of the subs are ignorant technophobes (for lack of a better phrase), thus TWC pushes out a "just good enough" piece of software.

Agree,

There's far too many people out there who are ignorant of the technology, don't have time, don't watch much TV, don't care, or any of the combinations of the above.

Now, when Navigator first came out with Lincoln Nebraska as a test market, TWC foolishly pushed ALL of the upgrade on every box in each division all at once. Nothing worked, or it worked so poorly, that there was a call for action where the cable subs of Lincoln tried to get TWC's license with the city revoked. In fact, if you look back in this thread, around late 2006, Lincoln Nebraska subs' complaints were the pioneers of our AVS Navigator forum!

But where are they now? That's the issue here. Over the years, TWC improved Navigator to be "good enough" that to the majority of most subs, they have either been satisfied with the service, moved on to other providers, just have OTA, or just don't care because they may not be strong TV viewers.

The goals that Ben and I have and want to share with the forum are what many of our users here have. We want to watch Navigator develop into a great guide and NOT have TWC contend with just being "good enough." I submit that Road Runner is better than "Good Enough." In fact, it is awesome! I also believe that TWC Digital Phone is MUCH better than "Good Enough." (Although battery back-up routers would be nice in the event of commercial power failure. Digital Phone's only flaw.) It is almost like Digital Phone and Road Runner are put out by two areas of TWC that is absolutely committed to quality and going for the gold in the marathon. But than, in another land of TWC, there's a development team working on Navigator. The Navigator team looks at the runners in the race and says. "Well, we aren't concerned about winning any gold for our guide. As long as we finish this race, that's all that counts. Who cares about winning medals? Just being in the race is good enough."

There is not enough competitive determination by TWC to improve Navigator to put it at the head of the class where Road Runner and Digital Phone currently are. TWC needs more general population subscribers to see this, and still needs more experienced program developers to get Navigator to "Gold Standards."

People like Ben and I call Navigator "The Unfinished." There are future enhancements planned for it based on rumors that we have heard. And I echo what Ben has said. I am not going to complain about the software as much anymore, (unless I have an overt cable service problem related to Navigator where complaining is warranted!) LOL! My interest is more in discussing constructive ideas that can be used to make Navigator great.

And when that greatness is achieved, I will do whatever I can to praise TWC for it.

Jack

I think TWC also believes that no matter what they distribute, there will be individuals who will never be happy.

This is a valid statement. Sure, anyone can always find a place to improve the guide. However, as it stands in our division, it is still unacceptable. I had a poll conducted in our division and among 500 respondents the results were as followed:

78% voted "Hate It"

16% voted "It's OK"

6% voted "Love It"

That's a pretty strong showing for not liking it. Now, Time Warner also knows (as Jack pointed out) that a certain segment already switched providers or left over it. They figure the rest just tolerate it.

Personally, I had been on the fence for awhile and continually comparing competitors. That said, what I hear is forthcoming gives me hope. As I previously mentioned, I'm glad to hear Time Warner continues to work on and advance Navigator. Thus the shift in my attitude and the post above looking for constructive criticism on what users would like to see fixed, tweaked, or otherwise modified.

Sorry, without software support none of the features will work. My point stands and I'm not disagreeing with the fact that it could be added to SARA via the middleware - it was.So why did you question my original reply to SatchMan? These features (Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV) were already there - Navigator was not needed to implement them!

The point I made was that Time Warner wanted full control over the programming of said features and Navigator gives them that while at the same time eliminating any licensing fees.Absolutely true! But you did not make that point when you replied to my reply to Satchman.

I agree the Navigator mucked up some things as I'm currently plagued by slow boxes, but that's due to TWC inexperienced programmers. In time, it should improve (hopefully!)I would hope that you would have realized that the slow boxes are not due to "inexperienced programmers" (BTW, I would challenge you to prove that statement) but rather to the fact that it (the ODN version) complies with OCAP and it is Java based. The current boxes just are not powerful enough to deal with Java effectively.

I think TWC also believes that no matter what they distribute, there will be individuals who will never be happy.

And they are right!

So why did you question my original reply to SatchMan? These features (Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV) were already there - Navigator was not needed to implement them!

Absolutely true! But you did not make that point when you replied to my reply to Satchman.

I would hope that you would have realized that the slow boxes are not due to "inexperienced programmers" (BTW, I would challenge you to prove that statement) but rather to the fact that it (the ODN version) complies with OCAP and it is Java based. The current boxes just are not powerful enough to deal with Java effectively.

Bill Gates was famous for saying that he never worried about software performance, the next generation of hardware would take care of the problem.

Bill Gates was famous for saying that he never worried about software performance, the next generation of hardware would take care of the problem.

Actually you have it backwards. He said -

Bill Gates Quotes

640K ought to be enough for anybody.
Bill Gates

So why did you question my original reply to SatchMan? These features (Start Over, Look Back, Caller ID on TV) were already there - Navigator was not needed to implement them!

I think you are taking this the wrong way. I'm not disputing that said features were able to be added under SARA. I stated quite plainly above that TWC wanted it's own control over the implementation of the features and guide development.

Absolutely true! But you did not make that point when you replied to my reply to Satchman.

Point taken, let's move on with the where I was trying to get input on features and tweaks people would like to see. Let's see what we can constructively put forth that will make Navigator a more user friendly GUI.

I would hope that you would have realized that the slow boxes are not due to "inexperienced programmers" (BTW, I would challenge you to prove that statement) but rather to the fact that it (the ODN version) complies with OCAP and it is Java based. The current boxes just are not powerful enough to deal with Java effectively.

I will submit that the Java based programming is far more complicated and a resource hog. I will concur that it has to do with hardware, but also the inability to efficiently program code for that hardware (mainly the Cisco HDC boxes). They were able to make speed improvements (in some divisions) with later releases of ODN. Also, I submit that they were able to have fast performance on the Samsung boxes. The 8640 has enough horsepower and should be able to run faster than it does. I'll agree that I wish the FCC didn't get involved because the Separable Security they forced upon MSO's was a joke that did absolutely nothing for consumers, other than to make things more difficult. On top of that, Aptiv and the Passport team were able to deliver a functional OCAP guide without the issues and that also speaks to the experience of the programmers.

Now, I'm willing to give TW some credit because starting from scratch must have been a chore. However, almost 7 years in from development to here and there are still many issues. It seems like recently though that they are working things out. Thus why I'm hopeful and want to discuss options, tweaks and features that end users would like to see. Hopefully, some good ideas can come of the discussion and maybe make their way to the dev team.

Point taken, let's move on with the where I was trying to get input on features and tweaks people would like to see. Let's see what we can constructively put forth that will make Navigator a more user friendly GUI.Moving on: It isn't so much the GUI that is the problem (I could care less if it is 16:9, or black & white) it is how the box actually operates:

Sluggishness doesn't hack it
Needs to consistently support external drives
Need to restore manual programming (record specific channel at specific time/day(s) regardless of program name)

In other words: restore all SARA features & have SARA level performance on all boxes!!!
On top of that:

Customizable Guide (only the channels I watch, listed in the order I want)
Program Guide 2 weeks out
Remote DVR app: Show current capacity, allow erasure of specific programs

Actually you have it backwards. He said -

Bill Gates Quotes

640K ought to be enough for anybody.
Bill Gates

Considering the original PC came with 64k and a 320k floppy ....

He also said the 286 processor was brain dead

Moving on: It isn't so much the GUI that is the problem (I could care less if it is 16:9, or black & white) it is how the box actually operates:

Sluggishness doesn't hack it
Needs to consistently support external drives
Need to restore manual programming (record specific channel at specific time/day(s) regardless of program name)

In other words: restore all SARA features & have SARA level performance on all boxes!!!
On top of that:

Customizable Guide (only the channels I watch, listed in the order I want)
Program Guide 2 weeks out
Remote DVR app: Show current capacity, allow erasure of specific programs


i see your ideas, and raise you the ability to store/backup either remotely or locally the recording schedules so that when a box inevitably craps out you dont have to spend half a day re-setting up your recordings (except of course those series that are on hiatus so the box wont let you do it)

i see your ideas, and raise you the ability to store/backup either remotely or locally the recording schedules so that when a box inevitably craps out you dont have to spend half a day re-setting up your recordings (except of course those series that are on hiatus so the box wont let you do it)Of course that is the original TW "Mystro" back in 2003 - Cablevision is just starting that concept up as RS-DVR (Remote Storage). And with that, cablecos get to do things that we won't like too much, such as inhibit FF through commercials or when you try to bypass a commercial, substitute one that they "think" would suit your needs (example: iif I had watched the Victoria secret christmas show they would slip in an ad for a porn service :rolleyes:

All sorts of pluses for cable, not so much for the viewer.

Of course, we could start to cut the cord and get our video via IP - but wait, if many of us do that they will implement usage caps and overage charges! :eek:

Of course that is the original TW "Mystro" back in 2003 - Cablevision is just starting that concept up as RS-DVR (Remote Storage). And with that, cablecos get to do things that we won't like too much, such as inhibit FF through commercials or when you try to bypass a commercial, substitute one that they "think" would suit your needs (example: iif I had watched the Victoria secret christmas show they would slip in an ad for a porn service :rolleyes:

All sorts of pluses for cable, not so much for the viewer.

Of course, we could start to cut the cord and get our video via IP - but wait, if many of us do that they will implement usage caps and overage charges! :eek:

no no no, you misunderstand me dave
i do not want the recordings stored remotely, i was talking about the programing, the 20some odd schedules i have setup in my dvr. the actual recorded programs would still be client side.
i just want some means of backing up and restoring what i WANT to record, not what i actually recorded, the data that is displayed in the 'series manager' and 'scheduled recordings' pages

no no no, you misunderstand me dave
i do not want the recordings stored remotely, i was talking about the programing, the 20some odd schedules i have setup in my dvr. the actual recorded programs would still be client side.
i just want some means of backing up and restoring what i WANT to record, not what i actually recorded, the data that is displayed in the 'series manager' and 'scheduled recordings' pagesGotcha - now that I see what you were saying, it is a good idea.

But I do suspect that the RS-DVR (or whatever TW will call it) is in our future. For one thing, it reduces their capital outlay in customer premises equipment.

CableVision said that RS-DVR could allow them to buy their STB's as little as $50, since there is no HDD, or multiple tuners.

Gotcha - now that I see what you were saying, it is a good idea.

But I do suspect that the RS-DVR (or whatever TW will call it) is in our future. For one thing, it reduces their capital outlay in customer premises equipment.


And the BIG THING for TWC, I'm sure, is making us watch their heavily laden commercial playhouses, with no fast forward button on the DVR. I have tried their time-shifting things like "start over." More like "start over and YOU WILL watch the commercials."

And the BIG THING for TWC, I'm sure, is making us watch their heavily laden commercial playhouses, with no fast forward button on the DVR. I have tried their time-shifting things like "start over." More like "start over and YOU WILL watch the commercials."

Actually,

TWC wanted to develop Start Over and Look back with a FF commercial implement. But the stations sought a court injunction with the FCC and the ruling was was two-fold:

1.) Stations must approve of Start Over/Look Back before TWC can add them.

2.) Commercials with no FF-option were required as a condition to accept the service.

Jack

Does your reply to my post require the word "actually?" Is the scenario somehow not what I said in my post? If you know the inner workings of TWC and the courts, great, somehow I find it very difficult to feel sympathy for TWC. It is what it is - FF disabled, maybe TWC should stop "rolling over" and "get tough" when it wants to innovate. Perhaps I'm wrong but since the DTV cutover the use of terrestrial transmitters is of low importance. Seems like I've read the trend will be to cut out said transmitters. Perhaps then TWC can start making demands. A lot of money changes hands and no FF as a condition to accept the service - wow.

Actually Satch is correct.

Satch is "correct" but in what way does it change what I had to say? Bottom line: we, customers of TWC, paying TWC quite a lot of money, now get to sit through commercials with the new boxless services. So Satch points out that TWC wanted to incorporate FF but was prevented from doing so. I am trying to point out (not a fan of TWC, a CUSTOMER of TWC) that the end result is less than ideal and it's time the broadcasters realized they are nothing without cable companies. I'm sure the programming providers are the ones with the power (roll over or get tough indeed) but my point is that as time goes by perhaps there will be a shift in the power. I hope so.

Satch is "correct" but in what way does it change what I had to say? Bottom line: we, customers of TWC, paying TWC quite a lot of money, now get to sit through commercials with the new boxless services. So Satch points out that TWC wanted to incorporate FF but was prevented from doing so. I am trying to point out (not a fan of TWC, a CUSTOMER of TWC) that the end result is less than ideal and it's time the broadcasters realized they are nothing without cable companies. I'm sure the programming providers are the ones with the power (roll over or get tough indeed) but my point is that as time goes by perhaps there will be a shift in the power. I hope so.

Oh I agree that the current result is less than ideal. Just aboit everything that TWC does on the cable video spectrum is less than ideal. My point was to illustrate that the current commercial requirements for Start Over and Look Back, were not the fault of TWC, but the broadcasters. The broadcasters thought they would lose revenue if Fast Forwarding through commercials was made a part of the Start Over/Look Back services, they mandated that TWC meet the conditions above, and that's why these services are structured in this way.

At least having Start Over and Look Back on the TWC Navigator guide's selected channels is better than not having the options at all. I think it's a cool little feature. But without the broadcaster mandate of commercials and station consent, customers would not have Start Over and Look Back at all. I will reluctantly accept the commercials as opposed to not having the service.

It is absolutely true that the broadcasters need cable, dish, and U-Verse for exposure and revenue in these tough economic times. The hardball blame games, every single time there is a carriage dispute (or it sure seems like most times) are a slap in the face to customers who continue to face higher cable bills.

The issue than becomes, finding a way to strike a balance of power that gives the customers greater choice and flexibility in the services to which they subscribe.

Jack

Here is one of Navigator's stupid little bugs that seems so easy to fix, but probably won't get done. I am using our division as an example, but it has to do with how Navigator displays guide data in it's current searches when there are 5 or more numbers in the station call letters and in the show description. The illustrations are for example only:

If Navigator displays something like WILODHD * 9:30-10:30:Channel 1000

Sometimes the headers will be too wide and the station information will not all fit on the same line. It is hard to describe, but the last letter of the call number, or the last digit in the channel will be bunched on top of each other, instead of the proper spacing. I can't remember exactly how it is. If someone wants to take a screen capture, those who have had this bug know what I am talking about. I have had this issue on both ODN and MDN boxes.

The reason is obvious, TWC does not have enough header spaces to display the program information. You would think in their designs and searches for the lab and in tests, they would just remove one letter to make it fit on the same line. When the data is bunched up together like that, it makes the guide look very amateurish.

It seems I remember that Passport had a similar bug with it's Favorite Channels Menu when the Spanish option was selected on a Passport box.

I can't get a picture, but those who have seen this issue, will know exactly what I am talking about.

Jack

If I remember correctly, the TWC multi-room DVRs use MoCa to stream shows between boxes. My router(Apple Time Capsule) is on one side of my house and I want to extend my wireless network. I just tried using an Apple Airport Express as a wireless repeater, but it didn't really work.

It looks like I need to connect the Apple Airport Express via ethernet to extend my wireless network so I figure I can either run ethernet cable through the attic and crawl space or I can buy a few MoCa adapters which use my existing coax.

Does anyone know if MoCa adapters are compatible with the Cisco 8642 multi-room DVRs? I read that they do work with Fios which also uses MoCa for multi-room DVR.

Does anyone have any other ideas besides using MoCa adapters or running ethernet cable?

Well, for the second time now, Navigator has "forgot" about an entire series. It again had zero episodes scheduled for The Factor (same series as last time). Also, no matter how many times I tell it to ONLY record Stossel at a fixed time, I get multiple episodes showing up from different times. Thus, one of my main improvements I seek among what I mentioned earlier is for more reliable recordings. Heck, it could just be here in our division, but I've had to babysit the DVR since 4.0. I check it once a week, but it'd be nice to not have to.

Also, I'm looking into Whole Home here so new hardware may be in my future.

I'm in the NYC region, but after a couple of weeks with the Whole Home system, I've experienced neither of the problems you mention. Although, now that I think about it, I do not have a fixed time recording, so I could not experience problems in that regard.

-barry

About half the time I want to set a reminder it is in the same list as the record options. the other half the time it is not there at all and if I want a reminder I must set in manually. I have called TW and -- guess what -- they have no idea! Do any of you? It does not seem to matter how far out the show is or what channel, that is just the way it is. I like to use the timers a lot, I am a big sports fan.:eek:

Sup All?

Several people have asked me about E-SATA expander drives for Navigator OCAP model boxes. (SA/Cisco "C" unites and the Samsungs.) Assume that all OCAP divisions have the latest build, which appears to be ODN 4.0.24.

Do drive expanders now work with Navigator OCAP terminals, or not? Also, if they do, what brand does the board recommend? I heard that Western Digital is the best, or at least it was the best on MDN boxes (No-"C") and not a Samsung?

Does ESATA drive performance vary by division, or not so much?

Jack

Sup All?

Several people have asked me about E-SATA expander drives for Navigator OCAP model boxes. (SA/Cisco "C" unites and the Samsungs.) Assume that all OCAP divisions have the latest build, which appears to be ODN 4.0.24.

Do drive expanders now work with Navigator OCAP terminals, or not? Also, if they do, what brand does the board recommend? I heard that Western Digital is the best, or at least it was the best on MDN boxes (No-"C") and not a Samsung?

Does ESATA drive performance vary by division, or not so much?

Jack

Haven't tried it here, but then again I have no need to. Honestly, it was easier doing the drive swap than it was when I did an eSATA enclosure kit for the 8300HD running SARA. Space is the least of my concerns right now as I anxiously await the next release (update) of Navigator and whatever features/upgrades it hopefully brings.

Sup All?

Several people have asked me about E-SATA expander drives for Navigator OCAP model boxes. (SA/Cisco "C" unites and the Samsungs.) Assume that all OCAP divisions have the latest build, which appears to be ODN 4.0.24.

Do drive expanders now work with Navigator OCAP terminals, or not? Also, if they do, what brand does the board recommend? I heard that Western Digital is the best, or at least it was the best on MDN boxes (No-"C") and not a Samsung?

JackIf you didn't know, there is a whole thread devoted to eSata (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=516559&highlight=esata). There is a user success/failure database (http://www.baseportal.com/baseportal/xnappo/navigator) devoted to Navigator users.

Does ESATA drive performance vary by division, or not so much?"Perforrmance" should not vary if it works at all. It may be that some divisions don't have the updates that support eSATA on ODN, but most of the input that I have seen says it does.

I've had an external drive (the same one) since 2005 (early user), but I have my original MDN box.

My HDMI connected Samsung box has a mind of it's own. RTOS v4.5.10 has made the HDMI issues even worse, and I hope TWC releases a new update that fixes all the gremlins of that version. v4.5.10 still has the HDMI E007 issue, but it doesn't show E007 on the box, and that screen disappears rather quickly.

Another request for improvement to Navigator is to make the Search feature usable. That or eliminate it altogether because as it stands it is just useless. Today, I was looking for "The Wedding Singer", so I did a search via the keyboard for "The Wedding Singer". Nothing found. 30 Minutes later, I'm scrolling the guide and there it is on FX - The Wedding Singer. It seems memory could be better put to use if the search can't even search the current guide.

Also, has anyone been updated at all? There are reports here that many boxes rebooted and booted to the default channel. I saw no change in the version number, but Navigator is now even slower than it was prior to this. Hopefully a major update is coming.

Another request for improvement to Navigator is to make the Search feature usable. That or eliminate it altogether because as it stands it is just useless. Today, I was looking for "The Wedding Singer", so I did a search via the keyboard for "The Wedding Singer". Nothing found. 30 Minutes later, I'm scrolling the guide and there it is on FX - The Wedding Singer. It seems memory could be better put to use if the search can't even search the current guide.

Also, has anyone been updated at all? There are reports here that many boxes rebooted and booted to the default channel. I saw no change in the version number, but Navigator is now even slower than it was prior to this. Hopefully a major update is coming.

Yes,

The Keyboard needs more and better search options. My statement now says an update is coming on or after April 12. They talk about Look Back and that there will be a software update, but do not give specifics.

On the Keyboard, it is still that if the show starts with the word "The" or the letter A, the second word of the title is used. I have seen instances of (using Ben's example) various search results, such as "The Wedding Singer" and "Wedding Singer The" in the Search list.

I have seen very, very subtle improvements to the search engine on Navigator's ODN platform concerning accuracy of program information, but nothing to write home about.

As MDN 3.0 is the last main release for the defunct MDN boxes, TWC may be focusing more on improving the speed and reliability of the ODN platform with these next builds. We are in an approximate six month cycle where it is time for a new release. Watch for an ODN 4.xx extension. What is happening in Charlotte, North Carolina and San Diego California? Check those local forms, they are the first with new Navigator updates, with a general roll out within 1-2 months of their time-frame.

It is rumored that this next ODN build will add the missing feature sets from MDN, which should be cool. The speed issues on the SA/Cisco's remain problematic in Ben's area of Rome New York, not so much with me in Metro-Milwaukee Wisconsin. JC's Gators are fast in North Carolina. This speed inconsistency really needs a top priority from TWC to make it uniform.

Everyone keep us posted. Thanks for all your help with Navigator! Let's see what happens next.

Jack

Jack, the keyboard search is OK. My issue is that it just doesn't work half the time. I search for something and it doesn't find it, then I come across it in the guide????

Yes, keyword search with a better algorithm would be great, but it's way down on my list. First and foremost is speed and usability improvements.

I have a slightly off-topic comment here. First, I am not a Tivo lover. I actually replaced my Tivo with a TWC box. But one of the things I really liked about the Tivo interface is the arrangement of the letters on the search page. Their on-screen keyboard is alphabetic (like TW), but organized like this:

ABCDE
FGHIJ
KLMNO
PQRST
UVWXY
Z [clr] [del] [spc] [123]

For some reason, this arrangement is much quicker to use then the TW horizontal arrangement.

-barry

Not off topic at all, we have been discussing ways to improve upon Navigator and I like that idea. Right now, one thing that surprises me most is the vast differences between divisions running the same version. I see where Navigator can be a very good guide if they put the effort into it. If they can get ODN to the speed of MDN, I would be happy with that.

Another request for improvement to Navigator is to make the Search feature usable. That or eliminate it altogether because as it stands it is just useless. Today, I was looking for "The Wedding Singer", so I did a search via the keyboard for "The Wedding Singer". Nothing found. 30 Minutes later, I'm scrolling the guide and there it is on FX - The Wedding Singer. It seems memory could be better put to use if the search can't even search the current guide.

Also, has anyone been updated at all? There are reports here that many boxes rebooted and booted to the default channel. I saw no change in the version number, but Navigator is now even slower than it was prior to this. Hopefully a major update is coming.

With most search programs including Navigator, you ignore words such as THE when it occurs at the beginning. Google spoils us with it's smarts and let's us even misspell words.

With most search programs including Navigator, you ignore words such as THE when it occurs at the beginning. Google spoils us with it's smarts and let's us even misspell words.

True, but Navigator is very picky and it did return many shows with "The" in the title, just not the one I was looking for. It should also have identified the word Wedding and Singer and returned any shows with those. I rarely use search if I have access to my phone or PC as it's far quicker. I just happened to be at a spot where Navigators search option would have been convenient had it actually worked.

Yes,

The Keyboard needs more and better search options. My statement now says an update is coming on or after April 12. They talk about Look Back and that there will be a software update, but do not give specifics.

On the Keyboard, it is still that if the show starts with the word "The" or the letter A, the second word of the title is used. I have seen instances of (using Ben's example) various search results, such as "The Wedding Singer" and "Wedding Singer The" in the Search list.

I have seen very, very subtle improvements to the search engine on Navigator's ODN platform concerning accuracy of program information, but nothing to write home about.

As MDN 3.0 is the last main release for the defunct MDN boxes, TWC may be focusing more on improving the speed and reliability of the ODN platform with these next builds. We are in an approximate six month cycle where it is time for a new release. Watch for an ODN 4.xx extension. What is happening in Charlotte, North Carolina and San Diego California? Check those local forms, they are the first with new Navigator updates, with a general roll out within 1-2 months of their time-frame.

It is rumored that this next ODN build will add the missing feature sets from MDN, which should be cool. The speed issues on the SA/Cisco's remain problematic in Ben's area of Rome New York, not so much with me in Metro-Milwaukee Wisconsin. JC's Gators are fast in North Carolina. This speed inconsistency really needs a top priority from TWC to make it uniform.

Everyone keep us posted. Thanks for all your help with Navigator! Let's see what happens next.

Jack

San Diego is no longer a test platform for ODN, as Rochester was the first to get v4.0.2_4. TWC probably has a new version, but I don't know when that version is coming out. The only recent update in San Diego was the Samsung OS update to v4.5.10 and there hasn't been any plans to update ODN past v4.0.2_4.

Samsung boxes running ODN are quite fast, and maybe it's as fast as MDN, but I don't have an MDN DVR. My Samsung boxes are faster than my Cisco box, but my Cisco box ain't a slouch either.

San Diego is no longer a test platform for ODIN, as Rochester was the first to get v4.0.2_4. TC probably has a new version, but I don't know when that version is coming out. The only recent update in San Diego was the Sam sung OS update to v4.5.10 and there hasn't been any plans to update ODIN past v4.0.2_4.

Sam sung boxes running ODIN are quite fast, and maybe it's as fast as MD, but I don't have an MD DR. My Sam sung boxes are faster than my Disco box, but my Disco box ain't a slouch either.

I can confirm that a new version of ODN is in the pipeline, and has gone through several months of testing, but they haven't yet "flipped the switch" for widespread release . This will bring the features of MD 3.0 to the ODN 4.xx dataset and hopefully another speed boost for the SA/Disco boxes that need it.

What I am trying to find out, is when the Alticast Middleware update is coming? Maybe either this release or the next one. They want to get MDN/ODN features to match as closely as possible. That will be in the next ODN update along with a couple of new features.

Do we have information for any test roll-outs for new Navigator releases? Or are they all going to be general roll-outs within about a three month time frame per division? I can tell you that Navigator ODN 4.0.24 was released in September of 2010, and we had it in mid October 2010. It appears that we are getting more of a consolidation of TWC Navigator releases, where one division quickly follows another division in a more realistic time table than in the past.

Jack

The only recent update in San Diego was the Samsung OS update to v4.5.10

Is it known what that update did or fixed? Was this a cable card issue? I was hoping it was a new version prep.

Jack

JC's Gators are fast in North Carolina.

All things are relative, but I wouldn't exactly call the 8640 fast. Manipulating series takes forever on mine, where it was almost instantaneous on the 3090. The other day I added a new series. After adding it, I moved it to the correct priority level and timed how long it took to perform that priority change and its associated conflict checks... 67 seconds with absolutely no progress feedback.

All things are relative, but I wouldn't exactly call the 8640 fast. Manipulating series takes forever on mine, where it was almost instantaneous on the 3090. The other day I added a new series. After adding it, I moved it to the correct priority level and timed how long it took to perform that priority change and its associated conflict checks... 67 seconds with absolutely no progress feedback.

WOW!

Maybe it's because I only have 1-2 series scheduled at a time, but my recordings schedule within 5-10 seconds of sending them to the DVR on my SA-8300HDC. Although not quite as fast as my old SA-8300 which died, it still does not take up to a minute to confirm a series recording.

JC, do you have a lot of series scheduled? Maybe the logarithm logic in Navigator, for whatever reason, requires longer processing time to find spots on the schedule when a lot of shows are set up for recording.

Jack

WOW!

Maybe it's because I only have 1-2 series scheduled at a time, but my recordings schedule within 5-10 seconds of sending them to the DVR on my SA-8300HDC. Although not quite as fast as my old SA-8300 which died, it still does not take up to a minute to confirm a series recording.

JC, do you have a lot of series scheduled? Maybe the logarithm logic in Navigator, for whatever reason, requires longer processing time to find spots on the schedule when a lot of shows are set up for recording.

Jack

Yes I do... that was the 65th series. But the 3090 with the same kind of loading finished the same task in a few seconds (I'm presuming that its checking the schedules for conflicts, because it reports them immediately after this if it finds them).

Is it known what that update did or fixed? Was this a cable card issue? I was hoping it was a new version prep.

Jack

There was an encryption issue with ODN v4.0.2_4 that would cause black screens. This issue that I'm referring to, is the infamous black screen bug on ODN v4.0.2_4. I've gotten it a few times, but v4.5.10 is rather unknown. I still get the E007 HDMI error screen, and the HDMI picture can get garbled.

There was an encryption issue with ODN v4.0.2_4 that would cause black screens. This issue that I'm referring to, is the infamous black screen bug on ODN v4.0.2_4. I've gotten it a few times, but v4.5.10 is rather unknown. I still get the E007 HDMI error screen, and the HDMI picture can get garbled.

Thanks! Hopefully some division gets an update soon and the rest will follow in a timely fashion!

Jack

Navigator has been released in North Texas only on the DCX3400M and DCX3200M multiroom DVRs regular DCX's have not been Gatored yet.

So tru2way has been released in North texas the boxes are presumably running 4.0.2.4 with firmware 24.07 or higher.

Navigator has been released in North Texas only on the DCX3400M and DCX3200M multiroom DVRs regular DCX's have not been Gatored yet.

So tru2way has been released in North texas the boxes are presumably running 4.0.2.4 with firmware 24.07 or higher.

Please report back with initial impressions. How does it perform there?

It appears that Hawaii has started their Navigator transition. One person said his 4250HDC now has it, and he had to reboot his STB to get the HDMI to work properly.

Please report back with initial impressions. How does it perform there?

Don't have it yet on regular DCX boxes yet but will report back when it does become available to me.

There should be a firmware update to 3.31 or later and possibly a VOD/SDV firmware update these new boxes have the regular DCX boxes do not have.

I believe that they have DSG for signaling so they most likely use the internal cable modem for guide downloads and box updates not 100% sure.

We have wideband which has these frequences that they could be using for box signals:

24.5MHz QAM16
29.5MHz QAM16/QAM64 (needs to be clean upstream)
33MHz QAM16/QAM64 (needs to be clean upstream)
36.5MHz QAM16/QAM64(needs to be clean upstream)

783MHz
789MHz
795MHz
801MHz

It appears that Hawaii has started their Navigator transition. One person said his 4250HDC now has it, and he had to reboot his STB to get the HDMI to work properly.

Can someone provide URL links with the Navigator transitions here for those areas of Texas, and especially Hawaii, so that we can follow the rollouts? Thanks!

Jack

Can someone provide URL links with the Navigator transitions here for those areas of Texas, and especially Hawaii, so that we can follow the rollouts? Thanks!

Jack

there really is no transition starting yet at least no information sent out to customers for current DCX boxes in North Texas and they are only deploying ODN 4.0.2.4 on the Motorola Multiroom DVRs as of now.

We all know that Hawaii's Navigator conversion will end sometime in May. So the transition is going right now starting with the 4250HDC. I think they will go down by box type.

before i get flamed for lack of research, i actually HAVE researched this question for over an hour. what i am wanting to understand whether my definition of SLOW is comparable to that experienced by others.

i have a Samsung smt-h3090 thru TWC in Charlotte.

when changing channels, sometimes it takes up to 10 seconds...that's correct, TEN seconds to tune the next channel. usually it is "only" 5-6. th

the Guide sometimes takes 5 seconds to respond to arrow movements on the remote. the channel banner is often completely different than what i am seeing on the screen.

i have tried HDMI (direct to TV) and component. it's absolutely unacceptable. i can't figure out any pattern of booting, powering etc that has remotely helped.

my SA8300 i've had for 5 years was a TAD slow, but NOTHING compared to this. WAY WAY faster.

is this normal? it's bad enough that i WILL ditch TWC when my contract is up in Sep if this is the best they've got.

before i get flamed for lack of research, i actually HAVE researched this question for over an hour. what i am wanting to understand whether my definition of SLOW is comparable to that experienced by others.

i have a Samsung smt-h3090 thru TWC in Charlotte.

when changing channels, sometimes it takes up to 10 seconds...that's correct, TEN seconds to tune the next channel. usually it is "only" 5-6. th

the Guide sometimes takes 5 seconds to respond to arrow movements on the remote. the channel banner is often completely different than what i am seeing on the screen.

i have tried HDMI (direct to TV) and component. it's absolutely unacceptable. i can't figure out any pattern of booting, powering etc that has remotely helped.

my SA8300 i've had for 5 years was a TAD slow, but NOTHING compared to this. WAY WAY faster.

is this normal? it's bad enough that i WILL ditch TWC when my contract is up in Sep if this is the best they've got.

Normally, complaints of slow channel changes are related to HDMI handshaking when there are resolution changes as you switch channels, but it seems that you have eliminated that by trying component connections with same result. What you are seeing is not normal, ESPECIALLY for the 3090, which is the rocket ship of TWC DVRs. Only the Samsung 3270 is in the same league.

Last night I was watching the end of a hockey game, one goal lead, 30 seconds left. And Navigator decides to reboot for no reason. Took about 6 minutes and the game was long over. This reboot on its own happens about once a week or so. When I call TW about it all they want to do is reboot the box or swap out another one. We have two DVR boxes one SA and one Cisco, they both reboot on their own but not at the same time. A good hockey fan will see the irony in my title! :mad:

So I have been away for a while - in TiVo land.

Thinking about going back to Navigator now that the dust has settled.

Can someone please give me a rundown of the boxes that work with external drive, and boxes where an internal swap works?

Thanks,
xnappo

So I have been away for a while - in TiVo land.

Thinking about going back to Navigator now that the dust has settled.

Can someone please give me a rundown of the boxes that work with external drive, and boxes where an internal swap works?

Thanks,
xnappo

Not much has changed... Legacy MDN 8300HD is still only reliable eSATA option. 1TB works nicely internally with 8640HDC for the new generation boxes.

before i get flamed for lack of research, i actually HAVE researched this question for over an hour. what i am wanting to understand whether my definition of SLOW is comparable to that experienced by others.

i have a Samsung smt-h3090 thru TWC in Charlotte.

when changing channels, sometimes it takes up to 10 seconds...that's correct, TEN seconds to tune the next channel. usually it is "only" 5-6. th

the Guide sometimes takes 5 seconds to respond to arrow movements on the remote. the channel banner is often completely different than what i am seeing on the screen.

i have tried HDMI (direct to TV) and component. it's absolutely unacceptable. i can't figure out any pattern of booting, powering etc that has remotely helped.

my SA8300 I've had for 5 years was a TAD slow, but NOTHING compared to this. WAY WAY faster.

is this normal? it's bad enough that i WILL ditch TWC when my contract is up in Sep if this is the best they've got.

Hi Russian,

No, a 5-10 second pause of channel changes is not normal. My SA-8300 HDC is a little bit slower than my SA-8300HD that died, but not by that much, maybe there is a couple of seconds difference. However, it is absolutely insane how much of a difference there can be with the same boxes, and software, from division to division!

Your options:

1.) Have you switched to Component Cables to see if that makes a difference? Picture and sound settings will need to be adjusted on the box accordingly. That might speed things up, especially if this is an HDMI cable handshaking issue.

2.) Have you tried new fresh batteries in your remote? We have had instances of slow responses from the remotes to the boxes, being improved with fresh batteries.

3.) Have you tried a new HDMI cable, to see if that resolves the slowness issue?

4.) Have you tried a different box, or a different model box?

5.) Are neighbors and friends in your area, experiencing the same issues? If so, this may not be a box problem, but a system node problem.

6.) If you have tried most of these options on the list, you might want to call TWC and Bi-Pass the know-nothing level 1 CSR dolts and specifically request that a "Technical Operations Supervisor" be sent to your home to investigate the issue. You can even say, "I have tried several boxes, new batteries, Component Cables instead of HDMI and nothing has worked."

I just hope you can get some answers, but my friend Ben who posts from Rome New York on here went through all of this ever since they upgraded the Navigator software from ODN 3.2 to ODN 4.0 and all of his boxes are all a slow POS, and he's gone all the way up to Level 3 Supervisory Support, and the best answer that they can give his division is, it's the software.

On the other hand, other people who have gone through the troubleshooting steps have seen improvements. Like I said, it just fluctuates.

Russian, you mentioned that you had a box, (The SA-8300) that was really slow. Did that box have a C in the model number? The C-models run the newer version of Navigator, but can be slower than the non-C boxes. The older SA-8300's (no C) has shown to be very fast. It's the HDC boxes, with the C at the end of the model number, that run the newer version of Navigator, but are slower. In most divisions however, the new Samsungs are pretty fast. The new Samsungs and C boxes run the latest version of Navigator.

Troubleshoot with my list above to see if that makes a difference. If it does not, I would do that supervisor tech call. Your box should not be that slow! I hope you don't have Ben's situation here!

Jack

Normally, complaints of slow channel changes are related to HDMI handshaking when there are resolution changes as you switch channels, but it seems that you have eliminated that by trying component connections with same result. What you are seeing is not normal, ESPECIALLY for the 3090, which is the rocket ship of TWC DVRs. Only the Samsung 3270 is in the same league.

Try a different remote. Some remotes only send the command when the button is released. Subconsciously you might be pressing the button long & hard trying to speed it along :)

I have 2 8642 DVRs. I use a Harmony One with my primary unit, the standard TWC remote with the secondary unit. The primary seems to be a bit faster. Both units are configured the same and connected via HDMI.

Fresh batteries do help. 3270's can still garble the HDMI picture, and this has really happened with SW v4.5.10. I still get the HDMI E007 error with out the box saying E007. The 3270 with v4.5.10 has the worst HDMI implementation of any TWC cable box.

I have a question. I can't access the diagnostic menus anymore on my Samsung 3270. I have TWC Northeast Ohio. I used to be able to do that by pressing select on the remote and holding it for appox. 8 seconds, then pressing the up or down arrow. Now it doesn't work. Can anyone help?

Try to go to channel 1999 with your remote, it won't show on your channel list but that is what we are doing in this area of SC

Try to go to channel 1999 with your remote, it won't show on your channel list but that is what we are doing in this area of SC

Thanks for trying, but that doesn't work in our area.

Try to go to channel 1999 with your remote, it won't show on your channel list but that is what we are doing in this area of SC

That should work (may be on a different channel in Ohio) but it has a very limited amount of information in comparison to the full hardware ([Select] then [Up]) or ODN ([Select] then [Down]) diagnostics pages. It depends what he's looking to access whether the diagnostic "channel" would be helpful.

Both sets of diagnostics pages still work as they always have here on my 3260s... they should still work for Jacko15's 3270 unless NE Ohio has received a recent update that has disabled them.

San Diego recently received an update to their Samsungs... anybody there also lose diagnostics?

Thanks for trying, but that doesn't work in our area.

Unless you've been switched to the new unified channel lineup, it coould be on a different channel. The diagnostics, installer and other hidden/special channels channel don't show up up in the guide and they get skipped over in a regular Up/Dn channel scan. However, they typically do show up in the favorite channel setup list, so you can identify them there. Also, if you make them a favorite they will get tuned in a fav channel scan.

I've tried several times, and never found the diagnostics on any channel in central Ohio.

Unless you've been switched to the new unified channel lineup, it could be on a different channel. The diagnostics, installer and other hidden/special channels channel don't show up up in the guide and they get skipped over in a regular Up/Dn channel scan. However, they typically do show up in the favorite channel setup list, so you can identify them there. Also, if you make them a favorite they will get tuned in a fav channel scan.

Yes,

Unless there has been a system change, you should be able to go to Settings, Favorite Channels, than press Select. Look for your highest numbers on your system, most likely 1000+. Enter any number in the highest range that your system has. Now use the Page+/- button to look for a channel call "Diags."

Remember that number when you Exit out of the guide's Favorite Channels List. You can now manually punch in that number to go to the Diagnostic screen and use the Page+/- button to scroll through about 10 pages of STB data.

To Exit from Diags, just enter another channel number. If you can't get to that channel using this method, your division has hid the Diagnostic station.

Jack

Thanks for the info guys. Here's what I found. I can get to the full hardware, by pressing info & vol+ on the set top box. I can access the abbreviated ODN by going to favorites and locating a channel called "info", which is channel 1612. Channel 1611 is labeled "diag" in the favorites list, but when I go to that channel it says "loading" for a while and then says "cannot read file". ([Select] then [Up]) and ([Select] then [Down]) on my remote no longer works. Why I wanted to find the ODN version was because the box rebooted on its own the other night, and since then the remotes functions have changed. I can no longer scroll through channels on the tuner or guide by holding down the scroll button. I have to press the button once for every move up and down channels and also moving back and forth through the guide,channels and time. This takes a lot longer and is very annoying. I thought maybe the ODN version changed, but it didn't, it's still ODN 4.0.2_4. Maybe the remote is malfunctioning. I replaced the batteries, but no change. I guess I'll take the remote in and swap it out and see if that helps. Thanks again for the info.

Looks like my problems can be attributed to a faulty remote. Swapped it out this morning and everything is back to normal. Thanks for all your input!

The DSL Reports forum states that a user in Austin Texas just got Navigator MDN 3.0. They report a Favorite Channels Sub Menu as initial new features, but also state that all Info in the listings has a Tribune Media Services Copyright notice:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r19588262-TWC-Time-Warner-Navigator~start=1360

Jack

PS. They also report that Guide Filtering by the following is included by:

Favorite Channels
Subscribed Channels
HD Channels
Pay-Per-View


But that this time, settings are not saved permanently.

Had to reboot my box after three months of not rebooting and noticed a different boot-up screen. It was all Cisco related, even though I have an SA-8300 HDC box.

Still on ODN 4.0,24 with no changes in performance.

They have been updating in our node:

Monday night into Tuesday morning they worked on some VOD and digital channels. A voicemal message said that our boxes might reboot, but I checked the Diags channel and mine did not. There was a message on the VOD Preview Channel that they were updating (Channel 1)

Yesterday, we had our Digital Phone out for about five hours.

This morning, only some cable channels were coming in, (why I had to reboot.)

Small changes, different boot screen, I think something's coming, just not sure what?

Jack

Had to reboot my box after three months of not rebooting and noticed a different boot-up screen. It was all Cisco related, even though I have an SA-8300 HDC box.

Still on ODN 4.0,24 with no changes in performance.

They have been updating in our node:

Monday night into Tuesday morning they worked on some VOD and digital channels. A voicemal message said that our boxes might reboot, but I checked the Diags channel and mine did not. There was a message on the VOD Preview Channel that they were updating (Channel 1)

Yesterday, we had our Digital Phone out for about five hours.

This morning, only some cable channels were coming in, (why I had to reboot.)

Small changes, different boot screen, I think something's coming, just not sure what?

Jack

Cisco bought Scientific Atlanta years ago (2005, I think)... no surprise that updates have brought the Cisco logo to your box. More surprised it took this long... Cisco misses no chance to put their logo in front of our eyeballs.

The DSL Reports forum states that a user in Austin Texas just got Navigator MDN 3.0. They report a Favorite Channels Sub Menu as initial new features, but also state that all Info in the listings has a Tribune Media Services Copyright notice:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r19588262-TWC-Time-Warner-Navigator~start=1360

Jack

PS. They also report that Guide Filtering by the following is included by:

Favorite Channels
Subscribed Channels
HD Channels
Pay-Per-View


But that this time, settings are not saved permanently.

I've got ODN 4024 on my cisco 8642 box, don't know when it updated, but it's as slow as it was before and nothing new that I can see. I'm also having problems with weather channel HD (and 2 others) and VOD doesn't work. I'm trying to get TW to come out and check the lines.

Trying to watch the Hockey game on NBC, Emergency Alerts kept running off and on during the game. The box rebooted twice during the Alerts running. These random reboots are a real pain. Any one ever solve them for you? HELP! I don't need the Alerts to cause the reboot but the last three times the alert has been running. Sometimes it just reboots for the hell of it.:mad::mad::mad::mad:

Yeah, those alerts can really be a pain. We seem to get tests repeated for counties well outside our region. But, I've never had it cause a reboot.

I've found though that if you hit pause when the alert begins, the alert will continue while paused. Then you can resume your program without missing any of the action. Just got to remember to go back live during the next commercial.

Trying to watch the Hockey game on NBC, Emergency Alerts kept running off and on during the game. The box rebooted twice during the Alerts running. These random reboots are a real pain. Any one ever solve them for you? HELP! I don't need the Alerts to cause the reboot but the last three times the alert has been running. Sometimes it just reboots for the hell of it.:mad::mad::mad::mad:

Oh yea,

I know what you mean! Unfortunately, Federal Law mandates that the FCC run these Alerts. What is the alert you are getting?

Amber Alert (Missing Child)?

Severe Weather?

Emergency Broadcast Test?

Those things like to embed themselves in the system and can stay for as long as 20 minutes! UGGHH. Generally they are gone by the time the response has rolled around a second time. A warm reboot often will not solve the problem. You often just have to ride out the alerts with time.

I have never tried a cold reboot to get rid of an Emergency Alert, That might work because it will clear the system of any data. This is done by unplugging the system for about a minute, and letting the thing reboot when you plug it back in.

You can always call and complain about the Alerts. If your box does not make the alerts go away within 10 minutes, ask them to submit a bug report to the Engineering Department about the specific issues your box has when dealing with Emergency Response Alerts.

I have actually seen a Navigator specs sheet that talked about a bug fix relating to an Emergency System Response Screen Alert, so TWC will take a bug report, but you must specifically request that the problem that you have be forwarded to the Engineering Department. Those alerts should be gone within 5-10 minutes of initial duration.

Jack

Last Thursday, TWC San Diego updated the Samsung boxes to OS v4.5.13, but it wasn't a major update. Middleware is at v20278, which indicates a minor patch update. It probably fixed some SDV issues, that the Samsung boxes have been having for a while. Doesn't fix the HDMI issues. Build date is on March 31st, so it's a recent update. ODN is still at v4.0.2_4 in San Diego.

TWC must be cooking up something major in regards to ODN. It could be more than just keeping up with MDN.

TWC must be cooking up something major in regards to ODN. It could be more than just keeping up with MDN.

Yea,

I think they are working on something big. Post when you hear anything!

Jack

The DSL Reports forum states that a user in Austin Texas just got Navigator MDN 3.0. They report a Favorite Channels Sub Menu as initial new features, but also state that all Info in the listings has a Tribune Media Services Copyright notice:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r19588262-TWC-Time-Warner-Navigator~start=1360

Jack

PS. They also report that Guide Filtering by the following is included by:

Favorite Channels
Subscribed Channels
HD Channels
Pay-Per-View


But that this time, settings are not saved permanently.We got this version of MDN in Rochester last week. Seems to me that earlier versions also had the "Guide Filtering" mentioned in that DSL Report link. The Favorite Channels may be new (I'm trying that feature out now). I noticed that the menu selection when finished watching a recorded program ("Stop & Save", "Stop & Delete" and so-on) looks different (but no different choices). I've now encountered a couple of bugs with this version that I have not (yet) fully explored:

On one 1080i program, it would only output 480i (over HDMI) - "cured" by deselecting all but 1080i output resolution. Didn't give me a problem later when I reselected all resolutions.
480i 4:3 programs sometimes appear shrunk. As I recall, I had this problem with MDN 2.4.6-19 until I found aspect ratio settings that would work with my set.
Also: someone on our local site has observed that the buffer now appears smaller (15min instead of 30min). I haven't verified this.

TWC north texas has rolled out Navigator confirmed by someone who has whole house DVR and Caller id on TV is enabled.

The only thing under the boot page in the diagnostics is 9.55 and everything else is N/A

but here is the navigator Diagnostics menu for DCX boxes:

Holding down select/ok and pushing the down arrow after the message light starts flashing gets into the Navigator diagnostics.

Holding down select/ok and pushing the up arrow after the message light starts flashing gets into an extended Moto diagnostics menu.

You don't need SH for this service. Dallas is offering stand alone WH-DVR.

You don't need SH for this service. Dallas is offering stand alone WH-DVR.

That is good to know! More TWC divisions are no longer making Signature Home as a requirement for Whole House DVR. What boxes are Texas giving out for Multi-Room DVR service? How does Navigator perform on them?

In fact let's expand these inquires to all TWC Multi-Room DVR enabled divisions:

1.) What box or boxes are being distributed for Multi-Room DVR?

2.) How does Navigator perform on them?

(Make sure you give your division and box model when responding to this question.)

Jack

That is good to know! More TWC divisions are no longer making Signature Home as a requirement for Whole House DVR. What boxes are Texas giving out for Multi-Room DVR service? How does Navigator perform on them?

In fact let's expand these inquires to all TWC Multi-Room DVR enabled divisions:

1.) What box or boxes are being distributed for Multi-Room DVR?

2.) How does Navigator perform on them?

(Make sure you give your division and box model when responding to this question.)

Jack

TWC North Texas:
DCX3400M and
DCX3200M phase 1 or 2 don't know the exact model they are giving out but I would think that it would be the one with the clock on it

Navigator supposedly works great on the DCX series of boxes.

TWC North Texas does not have Start Over or Look back yet.

They are using the cable modem for commuications to the headend in the DCX3400M boxes.

p2 models have the clock.

p2 models have the clock.

I know that the P2 have the clock but most of the DCX3200s in North Texas a phase 1 and dont have the clock.

A nice feature of the new DCX-M boxes is that since they have DOCSIS STB gateway enabled and we have DOCSIS 3.0 enabled the boxes should have plenty of bandwidth for communicating with the headend.

That is good to know! More TWC divisions are no longer making Signature Home as a requirement for Whole House DVR. What boxes are Texas giving out for Multi-Room DVR service? How does Navigator perform on them?

In fact let's expand these inquires to all TWC Multi-Room DVR enabled divisions:

1.) What box or boxes are being distributed for Multi-Room DVR?

2.) How does Navigator perform on them?

(Make sure you give your division and box model when responding to this question.)

Jack

i just received the DCX3400M with ODN 4.02_4 in Austin

Its my first experience with Navigator (Tivo retired). Its functioning OK but some wierd things like when pausing a recorded show you get the channel banner showing what is currently on air.

Wish there was a display dimmer for the clock

Its my first experience with Navigator (Tivo retired). Its functioning OK but some weird things like when pausing a recorded show you get the channel banner showing what is currently on air.

Actually, the above is NOT a bug. TWC designed Navigator to show the Channel Banner during a paused show, because they believed that if a paused show did not show the banner, customers might think there is a cable box or video problem.

You can remove the channel banner at any time by pressing EXIT on the remote. Pressing EXIT on the remote clears any Navigator screen of all Navigator graphics. Another tip is pressing the "C" button takes you back to your previous Menu screen in the Navigation, or Exits Navigator, if there is no previous screen.

TWC is working on a smaller channel banner at customer's request, and this feature will be available in a future update.

Jack

i just received the DCX3400M with ODN 4.02_4 in Austin

Its my first experience with Navigator (Tivo retired). Its functioning OK but some weird things like when pausing a recorded show you get the channel banner showing what is currently on air.

Wish there was a display dimmer for the clock

LOL! I heard that the LCD displays on some of the newer boxes are quite bright. I have an SA-8300 HDC. When you press Settings on your Remote, look for something called Clock Settings. (You might have to scroll to Display in the Horizontal menu.) Press Select when you find clock settings. You MIGHT find. (depending on box type.) a setting that says Off under Clock Settings. If you select off, my understanding is that the clock will not appear when the box is turned off.

The option that I have set on my current box is "Show channel when tuning." But if there is an "Off" button for the clock settings, try that. I suppose the alternative is is to cover the LCD display with a book or something! A dimmer setting would help!

Jack

LOL! I heard that the LCD displays on some of the newer boxes are quite bright. I have an SA-8300 HDC. When you press Settings on your Remote, look for something called Clock Settings. (You might have to scroll to Display in the Horizontal menu.) Press Select when you find clock settings. You MIGHT find. (depending on box type.) a setting that says Off under Clock Settings. If you select off, my understanding is that the clock will not appear when the box is turned off.

The option that I have set on my current box is "Show channel when tuning." But if there is an "Off" button for the clock settings, try that. I suppose the alternative is is to cover the LCD display with a book or something! A dimmer setting would help!

Jack

there is a feature to turn down the brightness in the standby menu on the DCX boxes but it might be disabled due navigator having a lot of these features of that menu in it but he can try by going to:

power of and menu and see if it brings up a menu and it should allow for dolby volue and other things such as power down etc.

Actually, the above is NOT a bug. TWC designed Navigator to show the Channel Banner during a paused show, because they believed that if a paused show did not show the banner, customers might think there is a cable box or video problem.

You can remove the channel banner at any time by pressing EXIT on the remote. Pressing EXIT on the remote clears any Navigator screen of all Navigator graphics. Another tip is pressing the "C" button takes you back to your previous Menu screen in the Navigation, or Exits Navigator, if there is no previous screen.

TWC is working on a smaller channel banner at customer's request, and this feature will be available in a future update.

Jack

I think you may have mis-read his bug. He seems to get the channel banner for the on-air show, not the show he's playing. That's not my experience with ODN Navigator in NYC. When I press pause, I get the channel banner for the show that I am watching.

-barry

I think you may have mis-read his bug. He seems to get the channel banner for the on-air show, not the show he's playing. That's not my experience with ODN Navigator in NYC. When I press pause, I get the channel banner for the show that I am watching.

-barry

no I was responding to the way you can dim the motorola boxes display for the DCX boxes and how to access that menu so he can lower the brightness because the display is bright.

Well, back here in good ole CNY, my father recently downgraded service to save money. He ditched all his premiums, the HD tier and his DVR (8300HD). It was replaced with a 4250 running ODN 4.0.2_4 and he can't stand it. Going from the 8300HD running MDN is night and day different. I really hope they get a significant update out to us soon that addresses these issues.

On that front: those with Signature Home - how is TWC addressing Navigator issues for you? You are suppose to get concierge service, but they still can't really do anything about buggy software. Just wondering.

I'm a Signature Home subscriber in NYC who "upgraded" from an MDN box and a Tivo to Signature Home. So far, I must admit that I am rather satisfied with the new service. Maybe the whole house boxes have different firmware, but I am not suffering from any of the bugs mentioned in this thread. I have not called TW once about my DVR service. [I did have on internet configuration problem that they dealt with quickly and efficiently.]

I do agree with you that the MDN box was definitely better than my current ODN boxes - especially in regards to rewind and FF. I'd love an upgrade, but the ODN boxes are performing adequately for me.

-barry

Thanks for the feedback.

Well, back here in good ole CNY, my father recently downgraded service to save money. He ditched all his premiums, the HD tier and his DVR (8300HD). It was replaced with a 4250 running ODN 4.0.2_4 and he can't stand it. Going from the 8300HD running MDN is night and day different. I really hope they get a significant update out to us soon that addresses these issues.

On that front: those with Signature Home - how is TWC addressing Navigator issues for you? You are suppose to get concierge service, but they still can't really do anything about buggy software. Just wondering.

Hi Ben,

The assessment is now clear that everyone in your division of Rome New York with an ODN box seems to have slow buggy Navigator software since the 4.0.24 change-over. Why do I get the feeling that a change to Signature Home is still going to yield the same experience in your division?

Everyone, Ben has been through everything, and I mean every thing, ranging from box swaps, signal and line checks, testing, level 3 tech support, personalized assistance with level 3 tech support ever since ODN 4.0.24, and no matter what they have done, no matter what box they have tried, no matter what they have done at the head-end, his ODN 4.0.24 has been a POS ever since the update to 4.0.24 in terms of slow, sluggish speed, and unreliable recordings. Everything was OK for Ben before the ODN 4.0.24 update.

And yet, after all this time, no one knows why there is such a difference in Ben's division compared to mine, where my box is just a little bit slower than MDN, but not that much. It might hiccup from time to time, but nothing intolerable. And Ben has done tech work for customers in his node that ALL report slowness and unreliability with ODN 4.0.24 and nothing has been done. And how long have you had ODN 4.0.24 Ben? I got mine downloaded around Mid October, 2010.

I have to agree with Ben that I am pessimistic that a Signature Home set up is going to solve the problem. I don't know if the techs in his division either don't care, don't know what to do, can't do anything because they have tried everything else.

Rome New York needs a speed and reliability patch for Navigator, something, immediately. At least they should be able to get up to the ODN levels experienced by other divisions.

Jack

The only reason I brought it up was because I've been through everything that TWC could do and was wondering how Signature Service would compare based on the "personalized" aspect. We we're updated sometime around Sept or Oct (I think). I'm really hoping the next version helps us out. The only box I haven't tried is the 8642 which can only be had with a multi-room setup or Sig Home. I want to go that route, but finances got a bit tight with gas prices and other factors to justify a $200+ a month cable bill.

They have been some great comments and suggestions that we would all love to see within Navigator. I just hope TWC hears them.

On a side note about MDN. Where I work still has some 3000 Series boxes and MDN runs horribly on those. MDN seems to really shine on the 8300HD.

we received 3.4 i believe around oct14, 4.0 came out approximately 2 weeks later here in cny

Navigator runs quickly and smoothly on the pair of Samsung SMT H3272 boxes that came with my Sig Home subscription here in Syracuse. However, there is a slight delay (about a half to a full second) in response to the remote if I am playing a recording upstairs that I made on the downstairs machine. I have also found that, unlike the SA-Cisco DVR, the Samsung requires a hard reboot every couple of weeks to avoid flakey performance on playback. I'll also mention that the wideband service delivers highly variable download speeds, from a low of 4 mbs to a high of 27 mbs, obviously depending on network traffic. Upload speeds are consistently good. Otherwise, I've been quite satisfied with Sig Home.

The only reason I brought it up was because I've been through everything that TWC could do and was wondering how Signature Service would compare based on the "personalized" aspect. We we're updated sometime around Sept or Oct (I think). I'm really hoping the next version helps us out. The only box I haven't tried is the 8642 which can only be had with a multi-room setup or Sig Home. I want to go that route, but finances got a bit tight with gas prices and other factors to justify a $200+ a month cable bill.

They have been some great comments and suggestions that we would all love to see within Navigator. I just hope TWC hears them.

On a side note about MDN. Where I work still has some 3000 Series boxes and MDN runs horribly on those. MDN seems to really shine on the 8300HD.

Sup Ben?

I was just wondering, and my suggestion probably is not gonna do crap, but have you ever replaced your HDMI cables with Component Cables just to see if that makes a difference? I know that there are some people who have gotten faster responses out of the boxes when using Component Cables. I was just wondering if you have considered testing that?

We had a poster that had a Samsung, who noticed a speed boost on the box when using Component Cables in place of HDMI. Considering all you've done already, it couldn't hurt to try.

Jack

No inside info... just an observation:

Just prior to (at least) the last two updates, the about-to-be-new version of ODN has shown up in the box's application list... but marked as "not running". Recently a new ODN "version in waiting" has shown up on my 8640's app list... 4.1.0_5 (4.1.0_3 is also listed).

Last time, 4.0.2_4 showed up about two weeks prior to being activated, with the old version hanging around on the app list for about a week afterward, then disappearing. Looks like new versions of TWC_SACANH_NETWORK and TWC_MONITOR are also ready to be sprung as well.

Could be any day now...

No inside info... just an observation:

Just prior to (at least) the last two updates, the about-to-be-new version of ODN has shown up in the box's application list... but marked as "not running". Recently a new ODN "version in waiting" has shown up on my 8640's app list... 4.1.0_5 (4.1.0_3 is also listed).

Last time, 4.0.2_4 showed up about two weeks prior to being activated, with the old version hanging around on the app list for about a week afterward, then disappearing. Looks like new versions of TWC_SACANH_NETWORK and TWC_MONITOR are also ready to be sprung as well.

Could be any day now...

Thanks JC!

This could be cool!

Jack

Could be any day now...

For you guys - we are usually 6 months to a year later which is inexcusable. Hopefully if this version does get deployed, we see it right away and it fixes the multitude of issues we are having.

No inside info... just an observation:

Just prior to (at least) the last two updates, the about-to-be-new version of ODN has shown up in the box's application list... but marked as "not running". Recently a new ODN "version in waiting" has shown up on my 8640's app list... 4.1.0_5 (4.1.0_3 is also listed).

Last time, 4.0.2_4 showed up about two weeks prior to being activated, with the old version hanging around on the app list for about a week afterward, then disappearing. Looks like new versions of TWC_SACANH_NETWORK and TWC_MONITOR are also ready to be sprung as well.

Could be any day now...

I wouldn't recommend posting that if I were you. You could get in trouble with TWC.

San Diego will likely get the update a few months.

I wouldn't recommend posting that if I were you. You could get in trouble with TWC.

If I haven't been in trouble yet...

Besides, I haven't disclosed any confidential information. It's just an independent observation of information that every person here can see for themselves on standard diagnostics pages that have been discussed openly and repeatedly here for years. In fact, I learned how to access them here.

We have a channel realignment of just the Basic and Standard Tiers coming about May 24th. (Only about 8-10 stations I think.) Everything else stays the same. I think the only Digital Changes are adding Fearnet to TWC Movie Pass in May, (Which I don't get.)

I'll bet we will get the new Navigator Update in June. We got ODN 4.0.24 about a month after it was released. Maybe the consolidation of divisions is helping!

Jack

We have a channel realignment of just the Basic and Standard Tiers coming about May 24th. (Only about 8-10 stations I think.) Everything else stays the same. I think the only Digital Changes are adding Fearnet to TWC Movie Pass in May, (Which I don't get.)

I'll bet we will get the new Navigator Update in June. We got ODN 4.0.24 about a month after it was released. Maybe the consolidation of divisions is helping!

Jack

Our division just plain refuses to do a channel re-alignment even though I have repeatidly shown that it is one of the worst. The only thing they do is move analogs off basic and into digital only tiers. I talk to so many of my customers who just stopped caring about HD and record SD even when there is an HD available because they don't want to hunt they guide.

Literally every install I've done, the customer has said to me: "Why don't the SD and HD channel numbers line up?' or "Why can't I just block out the SD channels?". One customer made a great point - Why even have duplicate channels? Just put everything out in HD and let older sets see the station letterboxed. I'm all for TWC dropping all analog offerings provided they do what other MSO's have done and offer low or no cost basic (no guide, VOD, PPV,etc.) converters to subs for additional outlets. It would free up ENORMOUS amounts of bandwidth, enough to probably eliminate SDV if they wanted, or at least ramp up the bitrates.

Our division just plain refuses to do a channel re-alignment even though I have repeatidly shown that it is one of the worst. The only thing they do is move analogs off basic and into digital only tiers. I talk to so many of my customers who just stopped caring about HD and record SD even when there is an HD available because they don't want to hunt they guide.

Literally every install I've done, the customer has said to me: "Why don't the SD and HD channel numbers line up?' or "Why can't I just block out the SD channels?". One customer made a great point - Why even have duplicate channels? Just put everything out in HD and let older sets see the station letterboxed. I'm all for TWC dropping all analog offerings provided they do what other MSO's have done and offer low or no cost basic (no guide, VOD, PPV,etc.) converters to subs for additional outlets. It would free up ENORMOUS amounts of bandwidth, enough to probably eliminate SDV if they wanted, or at least ramp up the bitrates.

TWC north texas is some what organized channel lineup wise as they have the SD channels grouped into themes but when it comes to HD they are scatered over the 300s/400s locals, 700s and 800s national.

TWC north texas is killing 8 analogs come june:
CSPAN2
CSPAN3
TXCN
5 local access channels (box will be provided for free for a certain amount of time to customers without a box)

One person on sandiegohdtv.org reported that his 8300HD downloaded a big update and sure enough it was MDN v3.0.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/266273-time-warner-cable-s-ceo-discusses-q1-2011-results-earnings-call-transcript

This article has some interesting things. iPad app to get remoteDVR and the ability to use it as a remote control. TWC is also working on a new cloud based guide probably for high end OCAP boxes (e.g. Samsung, Cisco, Moto DCX). It also mentions improved search features. I guess Keyword search is coming to this guide, not Navigator.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/266273-time-warner-cable-s-ceo-discusses-q1-2011-results-earnings-call-transcript

This article has some interesting things. iPad app to get remoteDVR and the ability to use it as a remote control. TWC is also working on a new cloud based guide probably for high end OCAP boxes (e.g. Samsung, Cisco, Moto DCX). It also mentions improved search features. I guess Keyword search is coming to this guide, not Navigator.

When you move the guide to a server, limits on memory & performance go away. All of a sudden almost anything is possible. Lots of developer tools for server apps, most likely none for a DVR.

One person on sandiegohdtv.org reported that his 8300HD downloaded a big update and sure enough it was MDN v3.0.Reported here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=20301197&postcount=14615) on 4/13. Confirmed by me on 4/15. One downside to this version is that the 15min jump ahead (hold down right arrow) has been eliminated. I hope that is a "bug" and that they bring it back.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/266273-time-warner-cable-s-ceo-discusses-q1-2011-results-earnings-call-transcript

This article has some interesting things. iPad app to get remote DVR and the ability to use it as a remote control. TWC is also working on a new cloud based guide probably for high end OCAP boxes (e.g. Samsung, Cisco, Moto DCX). It also mentions improved search features. I guess Keyword search is coming to this guide, not Navigator.

I could not find where it said that Navigator was not getting the Keyword Search option. Nor where it really said anything about Navigator. Note that I only skimmed it, and could find nothing Navigator specific about Navigator in an IE 8 search for it.

However, it did talk about the Cloud Service in the future. I don't think that will be a STB based feature, but a web or network-based feature. I have proposed something like this for years! In fact, Ben and I both advocate the use of having a back-up system for shows and box settings stored in a "cloud." When the STB craps out and need to be exchanged, settings and services would remain in the "Cloud." So you could bring them back by signing into your account like "My Services" or call up TWC, and verify your account information, and they would copy the services that you had in the cloud, back to the box.

Actually, Ben and I really want the Remote DVR Manager to store shows and box settings as if TWC My Services would become a "Cloud" for storage, rather than relying everything on the current DVR. As the capabilities of the cloud expand, the boxes phase out more and more in proportion to what the Cloud can do, and store.

And maybe in the next 5-10 years more and more data and storage settings will move to a cloud-based and mobile based technology, over time, the box, both as a stand-alone AND as a DVR gets eliminated.

Jack

Reported here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=20301197&postcount=14615) on 4/13. Confirmed by me on 4/15. One downside to this version is that the 15min jump ahead (hold down right arrow) has been eliminated. I hope that is a "bug" and that they bring it back.

Is there a 4x FF function? My sources said the the next Navigator update for MDN/ODN would have this.

Jack

My Sony TV seems to be handling the Samsung boxes over, after I've reset the HDMI. On the V5100 TV's, if you unplug all HDMI connected devices, and plug them back in, it resets the HDMI. This seems to make it handle a little better. I will also try out the new E328 firmware to see if that helps as well.

Is there a 4x FF function? My sources said the the next Navigator update for MDN/ODN would have this.

JackThe 4x FF/RW functions are STILL there on MDN 3.0. (They were there on the previous version of MDN).

Our MDN v.3.0 "RED CLOUD" version only goes out to "3X"...the larger font size was
the FIRST thing I noticed that was "different"....

As of this morning, the "SEARCH" database was finally populated, so I'm hoping the
Guide problems I saw yesterday will settle out today....or perhaps in a few days...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=20373586#post2037358

re. MDN v.3.0:

Guide can be filtered to display (just) High Definition channels...or favorites,
but it takes a SECOND Guide button press and it doesn't "stick"...you have to
do it every time you display the Guide.

As I mentioned above, going into the additional options menu to mark a program
to NEVER DELETE seems to work but doesn't actually set the NEVER DELETE icon
until you EXIT those menus and select LIST again.
[Don't they ever TEST their software????? This is just SSSTTTUUUUPPPIIIDDDDD.....]

The Tribune Corporation Copywright notice takes an ENTIRE LINE away from ALL
of the program displays....yuck!!!!! Surely there is a better way......

Hawaii should finish up it's navigator transition by May 10th. Hawaii will also get MR-DVR in the Navigator page.

re. MDN v.3.0:

Guide can be filtered to display (just) High Definition channels...or favorites,
but it takes a SECOND Guide button press and it doesn't "stick"...you have to
do it every time you display the Guide.

.....

It is just stupid as not only a second push to bring up the fav but a third to select them and as you say it will not stick.

Also when you bring up the guide you cant just push it a second time to go back to the program you were watching if you had scrolled to look at another channel to see what was on you need to scroll back and push sel or hit the exit buton.
They are going backwards here.:mad:

Roy

My Samsung 3270 received a major update last night that took approx. 30 minutes to complete. It first displayed a CableCARD update that took about 10 minutes and then a Navigator update took place which lasted about 20 minutes.


I don't know how to check which version of Navigator I have now but they did ad a few new features including DVR compensation(woohoo!) and new 3D support which means nothing to me. Nothing else appears to be different.


Justin in Oneida, NY

Hold select on the remote for several seconds than press the down key for a few seconds. ODN version should be on the first page.

I also received the update on my 8300C. It moved the "press select for enhancements" down to were mdns is on the channel bar. Speed seems the same. I didn't get a chance to see if this brought 4x ff. I did notice you can change the dvr compensation rate, not sure if that was there before.

I believe the version was 4.1.04 or something like that. Sorry i can't be more specific until i get home from work.

Thanks for the heads-up Justin and Boothmaster! When you get your new version number, if you can, change the signature in your profile so we can all see you have been updated. Did any of you get a phone call from TWC about the Navigator update?

Jack

Thanks for the heads-up Justin and Boothmaster! When you get your new version number, if you can, change the signature in your profile so we can all see you have been updated. Did any of you get a phone call from TWC about the Navigator update?

Jack

I did not get any phone calls or email or anything. When i turned the dvr on this morning it went to channel 01 instead of what it was on when i turned it off so i knew that meant either an update or power failure etc... so i checked the diag page, hoping for an update to fix the horrible speed issues, but it seems more cosmetic, didn't get a real change to test it out though.

For you guys - we are usually 6 months to a year later which is inexcusable. Hopefully if this version does get deployed, we see it right away and it fixes the multitude of issues we are having.

Looks like CNY is going first this time!

My Samsung 3270 received a major update last night that took approx. 30 minutes to complete. It first displayed a CableCARD update that took about 10 minutes and then a Navigator update took place which lasted about 20 minutes.


I don't know how to check which version of Navigator I have now but they did ad a few new features including DVR compensation(woohoo!) and new 3D support which means nothing to me. Nothing else appears to be different.


Justin in Oneida, NY

I also received the update on my 8300C. It moved the "press select for enhancements" down to were mdns is on the channel bar. Speed seems the same. I didn't get a chance to see if this brought 4x ff. I did notice you can change the dvr compensation rate, not sure if that was there before.

I believe the version was 4.1.04 or something like that. Sorry i can't be more specific until i get home from work.

Navigator Update And Other Future Plans for TWC

The preliminary reports are that all the features from the new version of MDN 3.0, just released are on the ODN 4.1 data set:

DVR Compensation (This controls how far you want the DVR to go back when coming out of RR or FF has settings that can be adjusted.)

Guide Filtering: Brings up Show Favorite Channels Only, Show Subscribed Channels Only, Show HD Channels Only, Show PPV Channels Only. Preliminary reports are you must press Guide twice to activate. But at this time, the filtering is only available during a search. Kind of dumb, but better than nothing.

Possible 4x FF on the boxes. I know that some divisions have it, others do not in MDN 3.0. Not sure about ODN 4.1. For those that have the 4x FF, it has been reported that the 15 minute look ahead by holding down the FF arrow has been dropped.

Favorite Channels comes back in a big way! Pressing FAV either takes you from channel to channel like previous versions, or brings up a sub-menu where you can view and adjust all your favorites in a list. This can be changed in settings.

You may or may not have the following in ODN 4.1:

The ability to have Navigator record only to an HD channel, which can be changed in settings. And a setting that adjust the channel banner's lamination. These are two things that TWC is/was working on. I don't know if they made this release or not. But if not, it is supposedly coming.

The ultimate goal for TWC is going to be to take the features that are in the boxes and move them to a "Virtual Cloud" server. They want this to be used for things like back-up data for DVR's and the channels to which you subscribe. What this means is that when you box craps out, the shows/settings of your account would be stored in this "Cloud" and you would be able to get them out of the network when you got a new box.

This is going to allow Navigator to do more things without hardware restrictions, And since the biggest problem that customers have is the boxes dying, this is a great idea! Think of it like "My Services" expanded. The long term goal is to move everything to a virtual cloud environment through a fiber optic network where everything that you subscribe to, such as Digital Cable, Road Runner, and Digital Phone, will be in the cloud. When this happens, all STB boxes and DVR's will be a thing of the past. This long term goal is several years away, but it is what TWC wants to do to improve the quality of its video services on cable.

Jack

Well, what a surprise I found when I turned on my box tonight! ODN 4.1.0_6!!!

Initial impressions:

- the Guide Stretch bug appears to have been fixed!

- The Enhanced Menu has been moved onto the Banner (mimicking MDN)

- 4X FFW!

- Seem to be a bit faster with better response, but still has Guide Lag which MDN doesn't

- Have not noticed any audio stutter on my 4642HDC so hopefully it's taken care of (not fixed, still an issue on non-DVR boxes)

- Noticed a behind the scenes update for 2D/3D functionality as well


I'm glad to see that TWC is rolling out updates in a timely fashion and hope to see future improvements.

I was really, really, hoping for a Guide Filter - but it seems we will have to wait for it. I haven't had a chance to really run it through it's paces yet, but the update seems to move things in the right direction.

Well, what a surprise I found when I turned on my box tonight! ODN 4.1.0_6!!!

Initial impressions:

- the Guide Stretch bug appears to have been fixed!

- The Enhanced Menu has been moved onto the Banner (mimicking MDN)

- 4X FFW!

- Seem to be a bit faster with better response, but still has Guide Lag which MDN doesn't

- Have not noticed any audio stutter on my 4642HDC so hopefully it's taken care of

- Noticed a behind the scenes update for 2D/3D functionality as well


I'm glad to see that TWC is rolling out updates in a timely fashion and hope to see future improvements.

I was really, really, hoping for a Guide Filter - but it seems we will have to wait for it. I haven't had a chance to really run it through it's paces yet, but the update seems to move things in the right direction.

Congrats Ben on your "New Gator!" So when you press the "Guide Button" twice, there is no filtering? That might be coming later. MDN has this feature in their latest update 3.0. But I am glad that your speed is quicker!!! I hope you get consistently reliable recordings!

Jack

For those that have the 4x FF, it has been reported that the 15 minute look ahead by holding down the FF arrow has been dropped.

Well... THAT's NFG. I never felt that 4x FF was missing but, OK, if you've got it, fine. Giving up the 15 minute jump to get it... that scores a big 10 on the suck-o-meter. THAT I use all the time.

Well... THAT's NFG. I never felt that 4x FF was missing but, OK, if you've got it, fine. Giving up the 15 minute jump to get it... that scores a big 10 on the suck-o-meter. THAT I use all the time.

Of course that came from someone who just got MDN 3.0. (As ODN 4.1 has just been released.) Don't know if that option is still in ODN 4.1 We will be getting more information in the coming days, weeks, and months as the ODN 4.1 build populates. I think there are still some MDN boxes/divisions that don't have 3.0, but soon should.

Jack

I will check on 15 Min Skip next time I watch a recorded program. Also, sad to report that the audio stutter is still present. I'm going to try some different cables and such. Another noted worthless waste of space is that the info baner now has Tribune Media Services written in it for the guide info.

I will check on 15 Min Skip next time I watch a recorded program. Also, sad to report that the audio stutter is still present. I'm going to try some different cables and such. Another noted worthless waste of space is that the info banner now has Tribune Media Services written in it for the guide info.

Yup,

MDN 3.0 has that stupid Tribune crap too! You know Ben, now that you have the update, I agree, you should try Component Cables. Make sure that your Audio and Video settings match up if you switch. You MIGHT get a faster Gator too with Component!

I have heard of customers with Audio problems with Navigator over HDMI-rare, but its in the field. They switched to Component Cable, made the necessary settings adjustments in Navigator and the problems went away. Their boxes were more responsive too with Component over HDMI!!! Post if you change to Component Cables. Make sure they are good component cables! And any handshaking problems went away as well. TWC has somewhat improved the boxes with their HDMI reliability, but it's still very touchy and sensitive.

Ben, I think a switch to Component Cable might just close up the small problem gaps that you are still having. I am anxious to see if that helps you!

Jack

You know what else I'm interested in knowing if anyone tries it - Does 4.1 add eSATA support? I really don't have time to mess with it right now - hell, I've barely had time to run 4.1 through it's paces - but I'm sure people would like to know.

I may try component, but I don't feel like rewiring my bedroom wall mount right now. I went with the HDMI in there for simplicity. I will try them at some point and report back.

Is there a way to reboot an 8642 using some combo of front panel switches? My wife has a hard time unplugging and re-plugging the power cord on the back. Thanks

Is there a way to reboot an 8642 using some combo of front panel switches? My wife has a hard time unplugging and re-plugging the power cord on the back. Thanks

Yes, you can access the "Master" Service menu by holding VOL+, VOL- and INFO on the set top for 5 seconds. From that menu, you will see an option for Reboot.

I posted more info about this Menu awhile back, as well as a Service Document I obtained detailing it. HERE (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=19333759#post19333759)is the link to that post.

Yes, you can access the "Master" Service menu by holding VOL+, VOL- and INFO on the set top for 5 seconds. From that menu, you will see an option for Reboot.

I posted more info about this Menu awhile back, as well as a Service Document I obtained detailing it. HERE (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=19333759#post19333759)is the link to that post.

Thanks for the info ...

The 15 minute skip feature still works for me. Just press the FF or RR buttons twice just as before to get to 2X speed and then hold it down to skip forward or backward. It doesn't work for me when I go to 3X and then hold it down.

The 4X FF is very nice, especially for longer shows or movies. The program guide also seems a little bit faster.

I tried using the select+down button but that did not work so I just went to channel 1997 instead. I have ODN 4.1.0_6.

New ODN "Gater" questions for ODN 4.1?

1.) Do you get expanding options when pressing Settings and going to Select to set up Favorite Channels? The new MDN 3.0 has a prompt in settings that allows for Favorites to show up in a pop-up menu, or by going from channel to channel when the FAV button is pressed? This can be changed in Favorite Channel settings if ODN has it.

2.) Some report that MDN 3.0 still only goes out 3x. Maybe this is a division thing? The same with some claiming that MDN 3.0 dropped the 15-minute jump ahead.

3.) MDN 3.0 has temporary guide filtering when the guide button is pressed twice when the screen shows no guide graphics. Users can filter by HD channels, Subscribed Channels, Favorite Channels or PPV. (or set All Channels.) This can only be done during the searching for shows, When exiting after using the filter, it goes back to all channels again. Is this in ODN 4.1? If this did not make 4.1 maybe TWC is looking to improve on the filter for the next release of ODN.

Post any other updates or known differences between MDN 3.0 and ODN 4.1.

Jack

New ODN "Gater" questions for ODN 4.1?

1.) Do you get expanding options when pressing Settings and going to Select to set up Favorite Channels? The new MDN 3.0 has a prompt in settings that allows for Favorites to show up in a pop-up menu, or by going from channel to channel when the FAV button is pressed? This can be changed in Favorite Channel settings if ODN has it.

No, The Favorites Menu has nothing in it and remains a pretty worthless feature. This was the first thing I checked as I was really hoping for the Auto HD option.


2.) Some report that MDN 3.0 still only goes out 3x. Maybe this is a division thing? The same with some claiming that MDN 3.0 dropped the 15-minute jump ahead.

Can't confirm. My father was the last person I know that had an 8300HD running MDN. He ditched his DVR service and now has two ODN boxes.


3.) MDN 3.0 has temporary guide filtering when the guide button is pressed twice when the screen shows no guide graphics. Users can filter by HD channels, Subscribed Channels, Favorite Channels or PPV. (or set All Channels.) This can only be done during the searching for shows, When exiting after using the filter, it goes back to all channels again. Is this in ODN 4.1? If this did not make 4.1 maybe TWC is looking to improve on the filter for the next release of ODN.

No Guide Filter of any kind in ODN 4.1. I wish they would just drop the Favorites list and implement the Auto HD and All Sub Filters.



Post any other updates or known differences between MDN 3.0 and ODN 4.1.

Jack

Will do

I'm a relatively recent convert from MDN to ODN. In addition to most everything ODN seems to do more poorly than MDN...:p... I find that if I schedule a one-time program and need to cancel a multiply-repeated Series recording, ODN seems to interpret the Cancel as meaning I'm not interested in that particular episode and don't want the STB to record it.
I have yet to experience the box picking up a later showing, and always have to manually find and set it to record. Does anyone else experience this, or am I doing something totally wrong here? Thanks.

Dayton, OH/8240HDC/ODN 4.0.2_4

My parents just changed thier box and got a Cisco 8640 box...

What a piece of garbage,its so slow its not funny!!

My parents just changed thier box and got a Cisco 8640 box...

What a piece of garbage,its so slow its not funny!!

I have an 8640HDC and agree that the programmers need to work out the speed issues. The hardware is more than capable of running software applications. If you have 4.1, you should have noticed a slight speed bump - but the guide still lags pages at a time. I may be adding Whole Home soon which would give me an 8642HDC, so I will report on that should I get into it.

Also - What is your location/division? What version of Navigator are you running?

You know what else I'm interested in knowing if anyone tries it - Does 4.1 add eSATA support? I don't understand you question. eSATA works now with 4.0.

Or did you mean does eSATA STILL work with 4.1?

Also - What is your location/division? What version of Navigator are you running?Northeast Division and im unsure what version of Crapigator it is.. (Ill have to look)

New Features and Updates For Navigator Versions ODN/MDN-UPDATED FROM ABOVE

DVR Compensation (This controls how far you want the DVR to go back when coming out of RR or FF has settings that can be adjusted.) On both ODN 4.1 and MDN 3.0. Great feature!

Guide Filtering: (MDN 3.0 only at this time-not in ODN) Brings up Show Favorite Channels Only, Show Subscribed Channels Only, Show HD Channels Only, Show PPV Channels Only. Preliminary reports are you must press Guide twice to activate. But at this time, the filtering is only available during a search. Kind of dumb, but better than nothing.

4x Fast-Forward: Added to ODN 4.1 some MDN 3.0 boxes have it and some do not, reasons why are unknown at this time.

Embedded Menus in Channel Banner: In both ODN 4.1 and MDN 3.0 (instead of the pop-up when channel changing previously.) This looks more polished and professional.

Favorite Channels comes back in a big way! (MDN 3.0 only at this time, not yet in ODN.) Pressing FAV either takes you from channel to channel like previous versions, or brings up a sub-menu where you can view and adjust all your favorites in a list. This can be changed in settings.

Future Navigator Plans Being Developed:

The ability to have Navigator record only to an HD channel, which can be changed in settings. And a setting that adjust the channel banner's lamination. These are two things that TWC is/was working on. I don't know if they made this release or not. But if not, it is supposedly coming.

The ultimate goal for TWC is going to be to take the features that are in the boxes and move them to a "Virtual Cloud" server. They want this to be used for things like back-up data for DVR's and the channels to which you subscribe. What this means is that when you box craps out, the shows/settings of your account would be stored in this "Cloud" and you would be able to get them out of the network when you got a new box.

This is going to allow Navigator to do more things without hardware restrictions, And since the biggest problem that customers have is the boxes dying, this is a great idea! Think of it like "My Services" expanded. The long term goal is to move everything to a virtual cloud environment through a fiber optic network where everything that you subscribe to, such as Digital Cable, Road Runner, and Digital Phone, will be in the cloud. When this happens, all STB boxes and DVR's will be a thing of the past. This long term goal is several years away, but it is what TWC wants to do to improve the quality of its video services on cable.

Jack

I don't understand you question. eSATA works now with 4.0.

Or did you mean does eSATA STILL work with 4.1?

eSATA had been spotty on all versions of ODN, so I was wondering if the latest version fixes it. Of course, with drive swap being relatively straight forward, eSATA really isn't that big of an issue to me anymore.

Well, what a surprise I found when I turned on my box tonight! ODN 4.1.0_6!!!

Initial impressions:

- the Guide Stretch bug appears to have been fixed!

- The Enhanced Menu has been moved onto the Banner (mimicking MDN)

- 4X FFW!

- Seem to be a bit faster with better response, but still has Guide Lag which MDN doesn't

- Have not noticed any audio stutter on my 4642HDC so hopefully it's taken care of (not fixed, still an issue on non-DVR boxes)

- Noticed a behind the scenes update for 2D/3D functionality as well


I'm glad to see that TWC is rolling out updates in a timely fashion and hope to see future improvements.

I was really, really, hoping for a Guide Filter - but it seems we will have to wait for it. I haven't had a chance to really run it through it's paces yet, but the update seems to move things in the right direction.

Sup Ben?

What are your current circumstances of Guide Lag? Now on my ODN 4.0.24, the scroll seems to be OK. Not as fast as MDN but tolerable. The Time Grid's Program Description stays in the show in the left-hand corner as you move through the grid and does not change until you release the button?

I have the above instance, which I think is by design. (Needs a speed bump like you said.) OR-

Do you mean that when you move through the guide, the little indicator lags behind and it takes about 1-2 seconds to catch up? I don't have that problem too much. Sometimes it might hiccup for a second or two in scrolling, but my speed is not too bad.

But you're right. MDN always changed the right-hand description right away as you scrolled and Power Speed Mode just flew by! (Holding down the right-arrow or Page+/- Key would really go fast on MDN.)

If the FCC had not mandated those Integrated Cable Cards, I'll bet that ODN would be just as fast, if not faster than MDN!

Jack

Sup Ben?

What are your current circumstances of Guide Lag? Now on my ODN 4.0.24, the scroll seems to be OK. Not as fast as ODN but tolerable. The Time Grid's Program Description stays in the show in the left-hand corner as you move through the grid and does not change until you release the button?

I have the above instance, which I think is by design. (Needs a speed bump like you said.) OR-

Do you mean that when you move through the guide, the little indicator lags behind and it takes about 1-2 seconds to catch up? I don't have that problem too much. Sometimes it might hiccup for a second or two in scrolling, but my speed is not too bad.

But you're right. MDN always changed the right-hand description right away as you scrolled and Power Speed Mode just flew by! (Holding down the right-arrow or Page+/- Key would really go fast on MDN.)

If the FCC had not mandated those Integrated Cable Cards, I'll bet that ODN would be just as fast, if not faster than MDN!

Jack

4.0 used to be both. It would skip as you scrolled as well as not catch up in the description box. 4.1 seems to scroll a little smoother (still blanks out completely if you hold a button down, but not that big a deal). My issue is that the Info box on the top left doesn't keep with what channel is selected in the grid. MDN always had the channel as I scrolled the guide, but ODN holds the current channel and about two seconds after I stop scrolling catches up and displays the right channel info. Sometimes during scrolling it will populate with a channel I passed, so I don't think it's intentional.

I'm happy to see continued improvement with this and the more I research other guides, the more I see issues with the hardware integration as well (other cable ops using their own or partnered software). I agree the the CableCard mandate was a totally useless mandate which had only negative impact on the industry. It was meant to open the door to third party manufacturers and all it did was cripple the current hardware. Great Government Intervention!

So, now that we have 4.1 and it's slightly improved - here is my wish list for the next release in desired order.

1) Guide Filter (a MUST HAVE)

2) Fix the Dump To Live in the DVR - SARA used to fall back to the DVR List when you exercised the end options (Save, Delete, etc.). Navigator still drops you out of the list upon delete and you then have to go back into list and hunt for the next episode.

3) Allow setting to lock the DVR List - kind of a spinoff of the above. The should add a setting like SARA had to allow the DVR List to be sorted by either date or title and locked as such so I don't have to go through 3 steps to get back to where I was. Make the DVR List default to the next show in the list after I finish the current one.

4) Speed Boost - I can live with the current speed that 4.1 gives me, but it could be better. However, I'd rather see convenience features over a minuscule speed bump.

5) Keyword Search - again, not super important, but a viable and usable feature I'd personally like to have.

6) Is just a bonus feature that would be nice, but I have zero expectation of ever getting. A 16x9 hi-Res guide for set top boxes that support it. Basically all the Cisco (for our division) 4600/8600 Series are capable of displaying a 16x9 Guide. However, with the Guide Stretch bug now fixed I can do without it.

I'd still like to see a way to back up Series Recordings and set top options to transfer to new hardware. All the above said, I'm glad to at least see that Navigator is being worked on.

PS: They need a Remote DVR App for Smartphones

UPDATE:

It appears the update to 4.1 has disabled Remote DVR service. On our local thread, a sub was asking if anyone else was having issues with it. He contacted TWC and they told him his "signal levels were low" (big suprise there!) and set up a service call. However, I checked it out this morning and both via my Smartphone and My Services account, I cannot access Remote DVR.

4.0 used to be both. It would skip as you scrolled as well as not catch up in the description box. 4.1 seems to scroll a little smoother (still blanks out completely if you hold a button down, but not that big a deal). My issue is that the Info box on the top left doesn't keep with what channel is selected in the grid. MDN always had the channel as I scrolled the guide, but ODN holds the current channel and about two seconds after I stop scrolling catches up and displays the right channel info. Sometimes during scrolling it will populate with a channel I passed, so I don't think it's intentional.

I'm happy to see continued improvement with this and the more I research other guides, the more I see issues with the hardware integration as well (other cable ops using their own or partnered software). I agree the the CableCard mandate was a totally useless mandate which had only negative impact on the industry. It was meant to open the door to third party manufacturers and all it did was cripple the current hardware. Great Government Intervention!

So, now that we have 4.1 and it's slightly improved - here is my wish list for the next release in desired order.

1) Guide Filter (a MUST HAVE)

2) Fix the Dump To Live in the DVR - SARA used to fall back to the DVR List when you exercised the end options (Save, Delete, etc.). Navigator still drops you out of the list upon delete and you then have to go back into list and hunt for the next episode.

3) Allow setting to lock the DVR List - kind of a spinoff of the above. The should add a setting like SARA had to allow the DVR List to be sorted by either date or title and locked as such so I don't have to go through 3 steps to get back to where I was. Make the DVR List default to the next show in the list after I finish the current one.

4) Speed Boost - I can live with the current speed that 4.1 gives me, but it could be better. However, I'd rather see convenience features over a minuscule speed bump.

5) Keyword Search - again, not super important, but a viable and usable feature I'd personally like to have.

6) Is just a bonus feature that would be nice, but I have zero expectation of ever getting. A 16x9 hi-Res guide for set top boxes that support it. Basically all the Cisco (for our division) 4600/8600 Series are capable of displaying a 16x9 Guide. However, with the Guide Stretch bug now fixed I can do without it.

I'd still like to see a way to back up Series Recordings and set top options to transfer to new hardware. All the above said, I'm glad to at least see that Navigator is being worked on.

PS: They need a Remote DVR App for Smartphones

UPDATE:

It appears the update to 4.1 has disabled Remote DVR service. On our local thread, a sub was asking if anyone else was having issues with it. He contacted TWC and they told him his "signal levels were low" (big suprise there!) and set up a service call. However, I checked it out this morning and both via my Smartphone and My Services account, I cannot access Remote DVR.

Thanks Ben,

Post when you hear from your local thread, or from your experience yourself that Remote DVR Manager has been fixed.

Jack

Thanks Ben,

Post when you hear from your local thread, or from your experience yourself that Remote DVR Manager has been fixed.

Jack

At least 3 reports that Remote DVR is broken via the latest Navigator update. Probably not as many reports because it's a limited use feature.

At least 3 reports that Remote DVR is broken via the latest Navigator update. Probably not as many reports because it's a limited use feature.

Thanks Ben,

Everyone with this issue should call TWC to report. Ben, did you call? I don't know what Rome/Syracuse NY has for DVR Manager FAQ, but if you don't want to call, there might be a feedback form for Remote DVR Manager in the FAQ. Here in Wisconsin, they are quick to respond to Remote DVR Manager inquiries. (Probably because it's their new toy.) Anyone with trouble, fill that out and just say "I can't get into Remote DVR Manager ever since the Navigator Guide update a few weeks ago." (ODN 4.1.06)

They will need to fix this before widespread roll-out of this Navigator update!

Jack

I intend to. I just didn't feel like waiting on hold this morning. I will call later tonight (off hours) when I can get through.

In regards to accessing Remote DVR Manager, and other "My Services", TW recently merged the login to My Services & PayXpress. This merger caused me all kinds of grief as the password "rules" for PayXpress were more stringent than they had been for MyServices. They did not provide any clear messages as to what was going on - I just could not log-in as if I didn't know my password. After talking quite some time (or trying to talk) with their CSRs in Costa Rica, I discovered that this was the problem. Ultimately, I got it to work after coming up with a new password that met their new "rules".

The reason that I bring this up is that there was no clear messages as to what was going on. I wonder if what you are associating with ODN 4.0 is really this problem. I have MDN 3.0 and after I got by this particular problem had no problem with the Remote DVR.

I am able to login both via Mobile Web and via My Services. We are getting error messages saying it is unable to communicate with the DVR. It's not a login issue.

I am getting the same errors. I tried last night to dvr somethings and it said it couldn't communicate with my dvr.

I used it Sat night to schedule a recording with no problems. Might be a NY issue.

I used it Sat night to schedule a recording with no problems. Might be a NY issue.

Yes,

New Yorkers got a Navigator software update for ODN (4.1.06) and Ben said there are at least three cases of instances where Remote DVR Manager has not worked since the update. As only New York so far has ODN 4.1.06, we have no reports of other state divisions to compare Remote DVR Manager to this new version.

Jack

We have had Navigator since 10 May on our SA 8300HD. I cannot find software version. Used press select for few seconds and then down arrow for few seconds to call up info pages. Software versions are on page 14. It reads:
PTV: v6.14.99.1sp
Res: 2.5.0-49-ptv
DAM: 2.5.0-49-ptv
PE: 3.15 (MDN 2.5 dev) Mini Host
Host: 1.38 MDN 2.4

Annoying quirks - no dates on newly recorded shows only the day of the week
and box seems to stay on all the time (resolution and input type lights stay on)
Any suggestions.

We have had Navigator since 10 May on our SA 8300HD. I cannot find software version. Used press select for few seconds and then down arrow for few seconds to call up info pages. Software versions are on page 14. It reads:
PTV: v6.14.99.1sp
Res: 2.5.0-49-ptv
DAM: 2.5.0-49-ptv
PE: 3.15 (MDN 2.5 dev) Mini Host
Host: 1.38 MDN 2.4

Annoying quirks - no dates on newly recorded shows only the day of the week
and box seems to stay on all the time (resolution and input type lights stay on)
Any suggestions.

Welcome!

You have the older SA-8300 DVR box, which has the older version of Navigator known as MDN and version 2.5.049 (The newer boxes that run ODN are designated by a C in the model number if they are an SA/Cisco model or a Samsung box. Moterolla also runs Navigator, but I am not sure which boxes go to which version.)

I have the newer SA-8300 HDC box, but I remember my old SA-8300HD, which ran Navigator quite well. To the best of my recollection:

1.) Navigator will show the Day of the week for recorded shows up to 7 days out. Anything on the DVR after 7 days WILL convert to a month/date format. Note that in the DVR List should be able to sort by Title or by Date. It would be cool if a future update allowed that choice to be remembered.

Tip: When it shows the day like the poster described, it is always within the past week. Than the month/date format shows after seven days.

2.) On the display settings. I believe this is set by default. Best advice I could say would be go to Settings on your remote and look for Clock Settings. I think their MIGHT be a setting in there that says OFF, mixed in with Show Time of Day Always/Show Channel Always/Show Channel When Tuning/Show Channel Always. If there is an OFF prompt, and you select that, I believe the box will show nothing when turned off.

Jack

Jack,

We will watch the date thing. No OFF choice so we will live with it, I guess.
By the way we are successfully running a 1TB Apricorn DVRExtender drive. Yeah, didn't die when Navigator came on line.

Mahalo (thanks) again from Hawaii.

Reports from our division have the sub who initially reported the problem still down. TWC Tech came out and basically rewired his whole house (he did have crap levels and old crimp connected RG-59 wiring). He didn't know anything about the RemoteDVR outage and left saying that he did his part to address it. The sub seemed pleased that the tech went through and did everything including a new drop from the pole. I concur with him that the tech indeed did his part versus paying lip service. He called TWC back and was pushed up past level 3 support with no resolution.

I just got off the phone with a TWC rep and she confirmed it is a known issue with reports coming in on it. They are looking into it to fix it on their end. It appears to be a bug in the 4.1 update.

Hello,
I have an SA 8300HD running some flavor of Navigator out of TWC Raleigh-Durham. When I was converted to Navigator some time ago, the external 400GB hard drive which was attached and in use converted over and was working fine.

A couple of days ago, the external drive started making noises; I suspect it was failing. I powered both the external drive and the 8300HD off and rebooted. When the hard drive is not attached, the 8300HD boots fine. When either this suspect drive (or another new drive in the same case) is attached and the 8300HD booted, the display spends several minutes displaying various codes including counting backwards from 400 down to zero in hex. Then it finally displays the 'boot' message. But when the 8300HD finally completes the boot, the external HD is not shown.

Are there flavors of Navigator that will not support an external harddrive? What is the procedure for adding a new hard drive? (Best Buy has a WD 1TB My DVR Extender on sale this week which I may pop for if there is a reasonable chance it will work.)

Lastly, what is the procedure to find out which version of Navigator that I am running?

Thank you for your help!

All of your questions are answered in the External eSATA HDD Thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=516559&page=291

Reports from our division have the sub who initially reported the problem still down. TWC Tech came out and basically rewired his whole house (he did have crap levels and old crimp connected RG-59 wiring). He didn't know anything about the RemoteDVR outage and left saying that he did his part to address it. The sub seemed pleased that the tech went through and did everything including a new drop from the pole. I concur with him that the tech indeed did his part versus paying lip service. He called TWC back and was pushed up past level 3 support with no resolution.

I just got off the phone with a TWC rep and she confirmed it is a known issue with reports coming in on it. They are looking into it to fix it on their end. It appears to be a bug in the 4.1 update.

Thanks Ben,

Good to see that the problem has been escalated to corporate. Due to ODN 4.1 only being in New York divisions at this time, this will allow for an easier update/patch situation.

There is one issue and that is, why wasn't this caught in the lab, as it should have been? You would think that the techs, who get the releases for about 1-3 months before deployment would have DVR Managed some programs and said, "This isn't working." However, sometimes bugs don't show until something is out of Beta.

We will watch for future developments.

Jack

Thanks Ben,

Good to see that the problem has been escalated to corporate. Due to ODN 4.1 only being in New York divisions at this time, this will allow for an easier update/patch situation.

There is one issue and that is, why wasn't this caught in the lab, as it should have been? You would think that the techs, who get the releases for about 1-3 months before deployment would have DVR Managed some programs and said, "This isn't working." However, sometimes bugs don't show until something is out of Beta.

We will watch for future developments.

Jack

My other thought is there is some type of headend issue that may not have been present during Beta, but is local to the division. It's good to know they are working on it.

Well, reports are coming in that Remote DVR Service has been restored in our area. I just checked via mobile web and that didn't work. I checked via My Services and that did work. Since Navigator is the same version, it was likely a headend issue.

Also, I made the switch to Signature Home today. My install is scheduled for the 26th (at my request). They had openings as early as two days from now, but my schedule doesn't permit it plus I have some recordings to catch up on. I also want it on a day I have off so I can be around. The Pre-install setup was painless & truly like dealing with a completely different set of CSR's. I requested 2 Cisco 8642's and numerous times I was asked to leave feedback after the install. I will report once the install is complete and I have time to play with everything.

The package cost will be $210 (total with taxes and fees)

Well, reports are coming in that Remote DVR Service has been restored in our area. I just checked via mobile web and that didn't work. I checked via My Services and that did work. Since Navigator is the same version, it was likely a headend issue.

Also, I made the switch to Signature Home today. My install is scheduled for the 26th (at my request). They had openings as early as two days from now, but my schedule doesn't permit it plus I have some recordings to catch up on. I also want it on a day I have off so I can be around. The Pre-install setup was painless & truly like dealing with a completely different set of CSR's. I requested 2 Cisco 8642's and numerous times I was asked to leave feedback after the install. I will report once the install is complete and I have time to play with everything.

The package cost will be $210 (total with taxes and fees)

Great Ben!

Hope this works out! You will have to keep us posted on how good the PSA "Personal Service Agents" are. So, what made you go with the whole Signature Home thing, instead of just going with Whole House DVR? It sounds like ODN 4.1 did resolve a lot of stuff. (Now that they have fixed Remote DVR, LOL!)

So what where you paying before vs. now with Signature Home? Did you drop all your premium channels? Are you doing the one-year no commitment plan? I hope you and your PSA can talk about the features you still want in Navigator!

Jack

Great Ben!

Hope this works out! You will have to keep us posted on how good the PSA "Personal Service Agents" are. So, what made you go with the whole Signature Home thing, instead of just going with Whole House DVR? It sounds like ODN 4.1 did resolve a lot of stuff. (Now that they have fixed Remote DVR, LOL!)

So what where you paying before vs. now with Signature Home? Did you drop all your premium channels? Are you doing the one-year no commitment plan? I hope you and your PSA can talk about the features you still want in Navigator!

Jack

I was paying $170 plus for my Triple Play (with two premiums) and to add Whole Home DVR alone would be another $20 with no second DVR or $20 plus a second DVR fee with a second DVR. That is with a promotional rate of $129 for the base Triple Play package. My premiums were about to go from $6 a month each to $15 a month each at the end of the month because that promo was expiring so I was going to scrap those anyway. I could have kept my base Triple Play for the rate of $129 through November, but after that it would have shot to $154 (plus any taxes and fees). I just made sense to lock into Sig Home now for the rate of $210 (that includes taxes and fees) which is good for one year with no commitment. I end up paying about the same for far more features. Mainly the Wideband Internet, but I wanted Whole Home DVR anyway and this gives it to me with 2 DVR's versus just a DVR and Client.

I look forward to reporting back on the service. In fact, I have to see if there is a dedicated thread for Sig Home because it's not really Navigator related but more of a combined service. I'll post here about Navigator as it relates to the Sig Home product, but don't want people to side track the thread asking about the phone or wideband, etc.

UPDATE: Comfirmed that my Remote DVR is now working via Mobile Web!

I thought Signature Home was priced at $180. How come your bill is going to be $40 more ?

I thought Signature Home was priced at $180. How come your bill is going to be $40 more ?
Note he listed $30 more and his price quote includes fees and taxes. /Dan

I thought Signature Home was priced at $180. How come your bill is going to be $40 more ?

Varies by division - Some divisions offer Sig Home for as little as $170. Are you in the CNY Division?

Well, reports are coming in that Remote DVR Service has been restored in our area. I just checked via mobile web and that didn't work. I checked via My Services and that did work. Since Navigator is the same version, it was likely a headend issue.

Also, I made the switch to Signature Home today. My install is scheduled for the 26th (at my request). They had openings as early as two days from now, but my schedule doesn't permit it plus I have some recordings to catch up on. I also want it on a day I have off so I can be around. The Pre-install setup was painless & truly like dealing with a completely different set of CSR's. I requested 2 Cisco 8642's and numerous times I was asked to leave feedback after the install. I will report once the install is complete and I have time to play with everything.

The package cost will be $210 (total with taxes and fees)

The only bad part when signing up is the 1000 yes's you have utter to the independent agency that verifies that yes you really want to leave your current phone provider and change to TWC digital phone.

The only bad part when signing up is the 1000 yes's you have utter to the independent agency that verifies that yes you really want to leave your current phone provider and change to TWC digital phone.

Already have Digital Phone, so I didn't deal with that. I'm moving from All The Best into Signature Home.

Yes... the speed difference between the Samsungs and the Ciscos, even when comparing to newer Cisco models, is striking. I've had my 8640 for quite some time now and still miss the speed and full 16:9 graphics (albeit stretched) of the 3090 that I had previously.

It's a shame that the 3090 was availabe in so few locations and for such a short time, because it was even better than the 3270... it had a feature set comparable to the 8640 (e.g., PiP and full set of output connections) combined with speed comparable to the 3270. It also had a more robust HDMI implementation than the 3270, whose handshaking is quite sensitive to turn-on order.

Hey there JC, you finally took the plunge. I remember you saying multiple times you didn't want to give up the 3090 for any of the newer boxes.:eek: What happened? Sorry, I've been away from the forum for nearly a year and don't have the time to read a years worth of posts.:o At least I went back to scan since about Feb. I'm asking because our box is starting to get REALLY SLOW, and it acts kind of weird when you change channels. Stereo system sometimes can't pick up audio signal. I even switched back from optical to digital audio to stereo. Should I go ahead and dump it too?
Also, as a side question, what's the status of external HDD? Working yet?

If the 3090 was Samsungs best DVR at least for speed, why did TWC drop them? Or did Samsung just discontinue it for the 3270? How is the speed of the Samsung 3270 compared to the Samsung 3090? Are the Cisco 8640's and 8642's at least getting close to the Samsungs?

Note that the nationwide deployment of ODN Navigator 4.1 SHOULD speed up all ODN Navigator boxes for a better assessment. My SA-8300HDC is slower than my SA-8300 from the MDN days, but nothing intolerable. I might get sometimes a hiccup of about 5 seconds tops in searching or setting scrolls, but usually, Navigation has been good.

I am looking forward to ODN 4.1 for the return of DVR Compensation from the ODN days and 4x FF. (Does that work in RR too?) And the speed boost. At least Ben got up to acceptable levels from the crawls of 4.0!

JC still has the fastest ODN 4.0 that we have seen! Ben, you said you ordered 2 Cisco, 8642 for Signature Home, or what boxes did you request?

Jack

My 3270 is pretty fast, then again my 4640HDC aint no slouch either.

If the 3090 was Samsungs best DVR at least for speed, why did TWC drop them? Or did Samsung just discontinue it for the 3270? How is the speed of the Samsung 3270 compared to the Samsung 3090? Are the Cisco 8640's and 8642's at least getting close to the Samsungs?

Note that the nationwide deployment of ODN Navigator 4.1 SHOULD speed up all ODN Navigator boxes for a better assessment. My SA-8300HDC is slower than my SA-8300 from the MDN days, but nothing intolerable. I might get sometimes a hiccup of about 5 seconds tops in searching or setting scrolls, but usually, Navigation has been good.

I am looking forward to ODN 4.1 for the return of DVR Compensation from the ODN days and 4x FF. (Does that work in RR too?) And the speed boost. At least Ben got up to acceptable levels from the crawls of 4.0!

JC still has the fastest ODN 4.0 that we have seen! Ben, you said you ordered 2 Cisco, 8642 for Signature Home, or what boxes did you request?

Jack

I requested 8642's because I heard the 3090's were no longer available, but if they bring Samsung boxes I will at least try them. Since Sig Home is supposed to have personalized service, I will get a better response to any issues I may have (I hope!). We will see how it goes once the techs get here and everything is done.

If the 3090 was Samsungs best DVR at least for speed, why did TWC drop them? Or did Samsung just discontinue it for the 3270? How is the speed of the Samsung 3270 compared to the Samsung 3090? Are the Cisco 8640's and 8642's at least getting close to the Samsungs?

Note that the nationwide deployment of ODN Navigator 4.1 SHOULD speed up all ODN Navigator boxes for a better assessment. My SA-8300HDC is slower than my SA-8300 from the MDN days, but nothing intolerable. I might get sometimes a hiccup of about 5 seconds tops in searching or setting scrolls, but usually, Navigation has been good.

I am looking forward to ODN 4.1 for the return of DVR Compensation from the ODN days and 4x FF. (Does that work in RR too?) And the speed boost. At least Ben got up to acceptable levels from the crawls of 4.0!

JC still has the fastest ODN 4.0 that we have seen! Ben, you said you ordered 2 Cisco, 8642 for Signature Home, or what boxes did you request?

Jack

I think the 3090 and 3270 are pretty comparable in speed. I've never had a 3270, but I have two 3260s and they operate the guide and other GUI functions quite quickly, despite being a single tuner box - hugely better than the 4250 non-DVR I also have. Of course, the 3260 gives me no feel for the 327x recording management speed.

If my 8640/4.0 setup is the fastest, I feel sorry for the rest of ya... The 8640 I have is reasonably quick in guide and GUI navigation - slower than the 3090 was but not ever annoyingly slow. It's the series recording management functions where the 8640 has always been horribly slow relative to the 3090. I have no reason to expect that the 8642 would be any different in this regard compared to the 8640, being that the differences between them are only the presence of the MoCA modem and a larger hard drive. If anything, my gut tells me that the 8642 might be somewhat slower than the 8640 because it is probably running additional code for the multi-room functionality, but I really don't know that to be the case. Even if it's not slower, I don't see how it would be any faster.

BTW, the installed-but-not-yet-running ODN upgrade software on my box has been updated from 4.1.0_5 to 4.1.0_6 (same as Ben's), but the box is still running on 4.0.2_4. Not really caring much if it gets updated... nothing reported to be in 4.1 is of great significance to me, although I can still hope that the annoying DD audio stream behavior of 4.0.2 gets addressed by the update.

It's the series recording management functions where the 8640 has always been horribly slow relative to the 3090. I have no reason to expect that the 8642 would be any different in this regard compared to the 8640, being that the differences between them are only the presence of the MoCA modem and a larger hard drive. If anything, my gut tells me that the 8642 might be somewhat slower than the 8640 because it is probably running additional code for the multi-room functionality, but I really don't know that to be the case. Even if it's not slower, I don't see how it would be any faster.

I don't have a Series Recording speed issue. BUT, I only have maybe one or two series set up most of the time. I wonder if setting up more series yields slower scheduling times because Navigator has to do more conflict resolution managing? I get about a maximum of a five second wait, maybe once it was ten seconds when Series Manager updates. Sometimes it will say, "Updating your scheduled recordings" and sometimes it will just do it.

I am glad that ODN takes away that message from MDN that appears all the time that said something like "System is updating your recordings, This may take awhile. Press "A" to continue watching television." I am paraphrasing here, but what's the difference between pressing "A" to clear the screen or just letting it do its thing? What's that other message in ODN like "Press Exit to Escape Menu?"

My feeling is that a manual over-ride is more likely to generate a box freeze or reboot than letting Navigator finish its task. However, I haven't had the need to manually over-ride, because responses, while not allows stellar, are above average. If ODN 4.1 gives me another speed boost it will be interesting. Here is what I would say about my SA-8300 HDC for speed:

Scale of 1-10 with 10 being the best on SA-8300 HDC for speed. (ODN) 7

Scale of 1-10 with 10 being the best on SA-8300 HD for speed. (MDN) 9

Hopeful speed after ODN 4.1 update. 8 or better.

So it sounds like the Samsungs are a solid 9 all the way around. Things are getting better.

Jack

Ok, Signature Home is installed. I don't want to hi-jack this thread, so for those interested I started a separate thread dedicated to Signature Home.

You can find it HERE! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=20490674#post20490674)

Note that I got virgin boxes and they had a while to download and update, but they are still running 4.1. Performance of Navigator is the same as on my 4642 and 8640 but I now have Multi-Room.

I've got the 8642 cisco box and a harmony one remote. My current tv lamp died (so waiting on new one to be delivered) so I moved an old 19" crt tv down and attached it to the box and we've been using that for the last 2 days. One of the things I've noticed is how fast the TW remote works with the 8642 compared to my harmony remote. So I am looking at the inter-key delay option so see what I can adjust. Currently it is set to 0 ms, anyone else using this setup? What is your interkey-delay set for with the 8642 cisco box? I thought initially it was just navigator being extremely slow and never bothered to try the actual TW remote that came with the box.

I have a Harmony 900 and the remote works just the same as the OEM Time Warner remote here. You could try resetting and loading the remote over again.

I've got the 8642 cisco box and a harmony one remote. My current tv lamp died (so waiting on new one to be delivered) so I moved an old 19" crt tv down and attached it to the box and we've been using that for the last 2 days. One of the things I've noticed is how fast the TW remote works with the 8642 compared to my harmony remote. So I am looking at the inter-key delay option so see what I can adjust. Currently it is set to 0 ms, anyone else using this setup? What is your interkey-delay set for with the 8642 cisco box? I thought initially it was just navigator being extremely slow and never bothered to try the actual TW remote that came with the box.Inter-key delay of 0ms should be fine. Are you connected to your regular set via HDMI and to your CRT via analog? If so the delays that you are seeing with your regular set might be due to handshaking between the set and the 8642. When you get the lamp replaced see how delays are using both remotes.

Inter-key delay of 0ms should be fine. Are you connected to your regular set via HDMI and to your CRT via analog? If so the delays that you are seeing with your regular set might be due to handshaking between the set and the 8642. When you get the lamp replaced see how delays are using both remotes.

Yeah i'm HDMI to the hd tv and coax to the crt. The delays are not really when changing channels, but just pulling up the guide and scrolling through it. That should have no effect on what connection I'm using I would think. But yeah i'm hoping to put the new lamp in tonight and check each remote individually.

I've got the 8642 cisco box and a harmony one remote. My current tv lamp died (so waiting on new one to be delivered) so I moved an old 19" crt tv down and attached it to the box and we've been using that for the last 2 days. One of the things I've noticed is how fast the TW remote works with the 8642 compared to my harmony remote. So I am looking at the inter-key delay option so see what I can adjust. Currently it is set to 0 ms, anyone else using this setup? What is your interkey-delay set for with the 8642 cisco box? I thought initially it was just navigator being extremely slow and never bothered to try the actual TW remote that came with the box.

My One seems to be faster than TWC remote

Cisco boxes are pretty quick with the "grandma" remote, which has big buttons, but lacks the day buttons.

Cisco boxes are pretty quick with the "grandma" remote, which has big buttons, but lacks the day buttons.

Has there been a GENERAL CONSENSUS about what remotes are the best for what model boxes and DVR in terms of Navigation Speed? Assuming that the batteries are good and the remote itself is not problematic, it might help Navigator customers for the techs of this board to create a simple table showing the box or DVR model and the best remote(s) for it.

Perhaps there is more to the conditions of a reasonably responsive remote to the box or DVR, than just fresh batteries and a straight unobstructed line of site from the remote to the TV or other video equipment?

Jack

Has there been a GENERAL CONSENSUS about what remotes are the best for what model boxes and DVR in terms of Navigation Speed? Assuming that the batteries are good and the remote itself is not problematic, it might help Navigator customers for the techs of this board to create a simple table showing the box or DVR model and the best remote(s) for it.

Perhaps there is more to the conditions of a reasonably responsive remote to the box or DVR, than just fresh batteries and a straight unobstructed line of site from the remote to the TV or other video equipment?

Jack

I can aim my harmony one at at a side wall and the signal still works the 8642 (as well as other ir units ) that are in front of me. The TWC remote won't.

Has anyone gotten the above error with the new Samsung set top boxes? I got it the other night when it failed to record both The Killing and Game of Thrones. Extremely frustrating. Luckily AMC and HBO are good about replaying shows.

I searched the thread for reasons behind this error and if there was any simple fix. I didn't see one (especially in recent posts). A simple reset? Is there a setting I don't know about?

Thanks guys.

Has anyone gotten the above error with the new Samsung set top boxes? I got it the other night when it failed to record both The Killing and Game of Thrones. Extremely frustrating. Luckily AMC and HBO are good about replaying shows.

I searched the thread for reasons behind this error and if there was any simple fix. I didn't see one (especially in recent posts). A simple reset? Is there a setting I don't know about?

Thanks guys.

I commented on this before because the error message is just too generic. TWC needs to have a more specific reason why it missed the recording.

Most likely causes why a box would give that error:

1) SDV Channel was not available/ signal level issue (most likely)

or

2) Power outage

1) SDV Channel was not available (most likely)



Does this occur often? Is there anything I can do about it?

Another thing I considered is that occasionally (but not consistently) I'll get a popup asking me to accept or decline an upcoming recording. Does one have to accept that popup in order for the recording to go forward? If so - how does that work when I'm not there to accept? In settings there is an option to turn on or off an interactive something or other...does that have anything to do with it? Just trying to figure this thing out.

SDV Errors aren't so much a Navigator issue as a node issue. It depends how many people on your node were requesting that channel at that given time. I have had very few SDV issues at my location. Add your location and equipment to your sig as that will help us serve you better. Poor Signal level can be due to many things like old wiring, too many splitters, bad connections, etc.

At this point, the best thing you can do is note when this happened or is happening and report it to TWC. If it is indeed an SDV failure, they will likely have to re-allocate bandwidth on your node. TWC can also poll you box on the network and check the levels. You can also check the Diagnostic Menu for SDV Carousel failures. There should be a count there and the diag menu will tell you the set tops last boot time. You can verify that the set top was up at the time of the failure or not.

Thanks. I'm in lower Manhattan.

How do I access the diagnostic menu?

Thanks. I'm in lower Manhattan.

How do I access the diagnostic menu?

Hold Select until the MAIL indicator flashes and then press the DOWN ARROW. Rule of thumb is if you see alot of settings with red or orange numbers, then you have issues on your line. Green is good.

Also, I forgot to mention (slipped my mind and I'll update the post to reflect it) that another major reason for this could be bad signal levels which blacked out the channel or caused the SDV failure. Take a peek at the diags and let me know what you see. Also, as I updated the other posts, call TWC and have them check you levels. They can poll the box over the network and get a pass/fail reading.

I commented on this before because the error message is just too generic. TWC needs to have a more specific reason why it missed the recording.

Most likely causes why a box would give that error:

1) SDV Channel was not available/ signal level issue (most likely)

or

2) Power outageAnother possible cause that I think bit me once: I had paused a live broadcast and continued it later. I had two programs scheduled to record, but one of them told me it could not record. After thinking about it later, I believe I never went back live on the program I had paused and that it interferred with the second recording. I haven't tested my theory, but it sorta makes sense.

Does this occur often? Is there anything I can do about it?

Another thing I considered is that occasionally (but not consistently) I'll get a popup asking me to accept or decline an upcoming recording. Does one have to accept that popup in order for the recording to go forward? If so - how does that work when I'm not there to accept? In settings there is an option to turn on or off an interactive something or other...does that have anything to do with it? Just trying to figure this thing out.

If you ignore it is the same as accepting. I always ignore because by the time I read it and start thinking about it, it is ready to go. If you have two recordings coming on the same time, the second one will then pop up. You now have about 1/2 minute to decide before what you are watching live (or via buffer) will disappear. Accepting just gets the message off the screen immediately. /Dan

Thanks for the replies guys. So before I got around to checking the diagnostics I unplugged the box to reboot as I'd seen suggested. For whatever reason - this killed the box. After plugging back in - the device failed mid-boot and the dreaded E-13 error came up. This happened about a month ago to a 3+ year SA box. The one I bricked last night was a newer Samsung box. Anybody hip to what happened there? Is there a better way to reboot than to unplug? I picked up a new box this morning....hopefully I don't have any more issues (although it's TWC so i most certainly will).

My Samsung 3270 was working great up until a few weeks ago. There must have been some small update or something because it is slow as heck! Button presses take 2-3 seconds to trigger a response(fresh batteries in remote too) and I am getting serious playback and recording issues.


My biggest problem is that I keep getting "Channel was not available" errors after a show was scheduled to record. This is happening to me at the rate of 1 out of every 4 shows.

I am also getting a strange issue where I select a show to playback and the display stays small and sticks in the top right where the preview window is. Nothing will undo this except a manual reboot which means getting up and unplugging the box.

Another issue happens during the switch between a recording and a live program. The UI will display the wrong channel(usually one I didn't even have it on) and the info bar will be frozen on the screen. Turning off the box doesn't resolve this and again, the only solution is to manually reboot.

The last issue(maybe?:rolleyes:) is missing audio. It happens when changing channels but not all the time.

I know I talked to a tech who said a slipstream update was applied for Multi-Room that added the ability to remotely delete a show, but my 2 8642's have been performing steadily since installation and after my manual reboot to get the banners back. They seem speedier than the old 8640 that was running 4.0.2_4. Still have guide lag, but many other bugs were addressed. If they would just get a decent guide filter it'd be nice.

You problem sounds like a serious signal level problem. IE: SDV dropouts and glitches. Can you get into the diags and check your levels?

My boxes rebooted and it did a cable card update. So far ODN is at v4.0.2_4. I guess v4.1 is just around the corner.

My kitchen 3260 was acting strangely last night... every on-screen display was shrunk to half-size and displayed twice on the screen.

This was true for the guide, banner, menus, popups... even the ODN and Samsung internal diagnostics. The really bizarre thing was that even though the display typically was compressed horizontally and displayed twice side-by-side, a few times the info banner was compressed vertically and displayed as two full width lines going across the screen. While all of this was happening, the program video behind the on-screen displays was completely normal, except that when there were two guides or menus side-by-side, only the left-side copy had the live video inset. The right side-copy just had a black box where the live video should have been.

Turning the box off and on again (just with the power switch, not a hard power cycle/reboot) restored normal operation.

My kitchen 3260 was acting strangely last night... every on-screen display was shrunk to half-size and displayed twice on the screen.

This was true for the guide, banner, menus, popups... even the ODN and Samsung internal diagnostics. The really bizarre thing was that even though the display typically was compressed horizontally and displayed twice side-by-side, a few times the info banner was compressed vertically and displayed as two full width lines going across the screen. While all of this was happening, the program video behind the on-screen displays was completely normal, except that when there were two guides or menus side-by-side, only the left-side copy had the live video inset. The right side-copy just had a black box where the live video should have been.

Turning the box off and on again (just with the power switch, not a hard power cycle/reboot) restored normal operation.

I get this bizarre bug at least once a day with my 3270 hooked up to my Sony TV. This is with HDMI. It's a known bug, but component fixes it. Rebooting does help, but you don't actually have to do that. Just forcing another handshake works.

Cable Card is dated Feb 2011, and it probably fixes the black screen bug found in ODN v4.0.