Xbox 360 as HD DVD Player: One and Only thread Here [Text View] - Page 11

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FilmMixer

11-12-06, 11:36 PM

HDMI cables are not 100$+, monoprice have them for 10$+ (depending on lenght). HDMI is nice for reducing cable and such (with a HDMI AMP) but it doesn't really change the picture unless the player and the display have piss poor DA converters witch are rarely the case now a day...

I agree that it is hard to see a huge differnce between HDMI/DVI and Component... For me, it's the audio that is the thing.

Uptown193

11-12-06, 11:43 PM

LiftedTacoma

11-12-06, 11:46 PM

my circuit citys out til mid week, the good reviews and the $40 coupon have swayed me to buy the player.

Robert D

11-12-06, 11:48 PM

ok fine, be happy with you $16 HDMI cable. Im not goin to argue.

Actually one can buy a six foot hdmi cable from monoprice for under $5 and they work just fine.

ckong

11-12-06, 11:51 PM

Do you need the 20GB HDD to play HD DVD?

lymzy

11-12-06, 11:57 PM

Do you need the 20GB HDD to play HD DVD?

NO.

Uptown193

11-13-06, 12:12 AM

Actually one can buy a six foot hdmi cable from monoprice for under $5 and they work just fine.

LOL, OK IF U THINK AND SAY SO. HAVE FUN WITH YOU LOW PICTURE QUALITY, ME MYSELF I FEEL GOOD WITH THE BEST OF THE BEST

nataraj

11-13-06, 12:13 AM

LOL, OK IF U THINK AND SAY SO. HAVE FUN WITH YOU LOW PICTURE QUALITY, ME MYSELF I FEEL GOOD WITH THE BEST OF THE BEST

Oh man ... why are you shouting. I guess you are using best of the best keyboard and thus your posts are great ... ;)

Uptown193

11-13-06, 12:15 AM

Oh man ... why are you shouting. I guess you are using best of the best keyboard and thus your posts are great ... ;)

i got carried away

rsmith4321

11-13-06, 12:18 AM

Wow, this is insane. I came to this forum thinking I would get the normal intellegent, adult conversations that are usually on Avsforum. Basically it looks like something over at gamespot. "Hdmi is the best! I have no idea what I'm taking about but $160 hdmi cables are better because they cost more! etc etc". These people don't belong at avsforum, take it back over to gamespot or ign. I can't even do typical avsforum research with all the 12 year old fanboys that must have found this forum somehow.

Edit, this whole thread might not be so bad, I just got upset looking at this last page.

jeri534

11-13-06, 12:21 AM

how big of a difference is there from 1080i/720p to 1080p?

jwv651

11-13-06, 12:24 AM

Yes HDMI cables do vary in quality. Some are specially sheilded and some arent which will give a better picture, im very sure there is a difference with a cable that costs $160 with one that costs $20 and its not just the size. Please do some research. its not goin to be 100% difference but there is a difference.If you’re talking about digital cable like HDMI those Monoprice premiums are the best for the money. I compared them to my overprized Better Cables and after testing them there was no reason to spend what I did...for 40 years I was always anal with my cable purchases...always had to have the best...even had some custom made for me...I finally got smart... Your right, you can get better sheilding and they might look pretty...but they still do the same thing. XOXOXOXO throughout. Take a leason out of my book and save your hard earned money and buy a Monoprice HDMI or DVI cable at a reasonable price. Save you money for other things. :)

MidnightWatcher

11-13-06, 12:27 AM

how big of a difference is there from 1080i/720p to 1080p?

Not as much as you think. In fact, a lot of people have trouble telling the difference, unless you're REALLY close to the screen.

Here is some good reading (http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6449_7-6661274-1.html).

swanlee

11-13-06, 12:28 AM

"Hdmi Produces A Sharper Image Then Component"

There is nothing inherent in HDMI that would technically give you a sharper picture. Until HDMI 1.3 comes out HDMI gives you nothing over current analog connections.

Also if you wanted the best quality you'd ditch your Sony receiver and move to Lexicon seperates.

Uptown193

11-13-06, 12:37 AM

If you’re talking about digital cable like HDMI those Monoprice premiums are the best for the money. I compared them to my overprized Better Cables and after testing them there was no reason to spend what I did...for 40 years I was always anal with my cable purchases...always had to have the best...even had some custom made for me...I finally got smart... Your right, you can get better sheilding and they might look pretty...but they still do the same thing. XOXOXOXO throughout. Take a leason out of my book and save your hard earned money and buy a Monoprice HDMI or DVI cable at a reasonable price. Save you money for other things. :)

So just to get this str8 in my head, everyone here in this forum even rsmith4321 thinks that the cable i seen in BB for $160 thats has 24k, and thicker wire and etc & etc. will produce the same PQ as a say $25 cable? please everyone comment on this because this will save myself and 100's of others a lot of revenue?????

Giants lost, omg

Dave Mack

11-13-06, 12:41 AM

Yes, because it's carrying a digital signal. It's either there or it isn't. You got rooked...
Listen to your elders here. And guess what? Bose is not the best speaker in the world either!

Uptown193

11-13-06, 12:43 AM

Yes, because it's carrying a digital signal. It's either there or it isn't. You got rooked...
Listen to your elders here. And guess what? Bose is not the best speaker in the world either!

this is the cable im talkin about if you can click this link or cut and paste it. thanks

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7857599&type=product&id=1158317793970

twak

11-13-06, 12:44 AM

What if we got back on topic, which I believe was the 360 hd-dvd add-on. Take the hdmi (including size, length, and price) vs component elsewhere.

Uptown193

11-13-06, 12:47 AM

What if we got back on topic, which I believe was the 360 hd-dvd add-on. Take the hdmi (including size, length, and price) vs component elsewhere.

Dude come on, this all has to do with the 360 HD DVD in a way, MS says they are coming out with a cable to enable HDMI connection.

Anyway i bought Chronicles of Riddick on HD DVD today, you hav any comments on that movie?

jwv651

11-13-06, 12:51 AM

So just to get this str8 in my head, everyone here in this forum even rsmith4321 thinks that the cable i seen in BB for $160 thats has 24k, and thicker wire and etc & etc. will produce the same PQ as a say $25 cable? please everyone comment on this because this will save myself and 100's of others a lot of revenue?????

Giants lost, omg If we are talking HDMI or DVI...Yes! Lots of us hobbyist learn the hard way dumping our hard earned dough because we didn't know any better. Digital either works or it doesn't....Now on other cables like component, speaker and sub cables I will spend quite a bit more. I hope this helps. Save your dough and buy some good HD-DVD's. ;)

jwv651

11-13-06, 12:55 AM

this is the cable im talkin about if you can click this link or cut and paste it. thanks

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7857599&type=product&id=1158317793970Please save your money...(Monster) they are so overpriced. You can get the same ar Ram electronics for less than 1/3 of those and even those are no better than the Monoprice premium cables. :)

Uptown193

11-13-06, 12:59 AM

Yes, because it's carrying a digital signal. It's either there or it isn't. You got rooked...
Listen to your elders here. And guess what? Bose is not the best speaker in the world either!

lol, ok then in that case i guess i wasted my money on a $120 HDMI cable from monster. lesson learned. Yea i know Bose is not the best, I saw some great Definitive speakers. but anyway back to 360 HD Dvd talk.

How can we update our HD dvd drives with the lastest firmware updates. I seen a sticker that came with the addon or the Hd DVD which said go to www.thelookandsoundofperfect.com. wat u guys think?

JodyL

11-13-06, 01:03 AM

What if we got back on topic, which I believe was the 360 hd-dvd add-on. Take the hdmi (including size, length, and price) vs component elsewhere.

Right on neighbour! ;)

Dude come on, this all has to do with the 360 HD DVD in a way, MS says they are coming out with a cable to enable HDMI connection.

Anyway i bought Chronicles of Riddick on HD DVD today, you hav any comments on that movie?

Dude, this is a thread about the player NOT cables and NOT movie reviews...take it next door!

GMan4911

11-13-06, 01:05 AM

So just to get this str8 in my head, everyone here in this forum even rsmith4321 thinks that the cable i seen in BB for $160 thats has 24k, and thicker wire and etc & etc. will produce the same PQ as a say $25 cable? please everyone comment on this because this will save myself and 100's of others a lot of revenue?????
As long as the $25 cable is well constructed with good quality materials, then yes, you won't see a difference in PQ. With a digital cable, it's all or nothing. That's not to say that Monster Cable makes bad cables - they're good cables, just overpriced. And yes, this particular discussion should be in another thread.

Uptown193

11-13-06, 01:07 AM

Uptown193

11-13-06, 01:13 AM

Yes.. you have this straight...

Wait a minute.. why am I arguing with someone who has Bose speakers?

Once agian, you have given no evidence that you have checked a "$16" HDMI cable from Blue Jeans Cable (which are 24 AWG wire silver plated copper, BTW) from your Best Buy $160 wonder... and then you dismiss my post with a "whatever" response...

I would just like to give people who might not have a unlimited budget an educated opinion about spending their hard earned money on cables that won't make a difference...

I have a Sony Ruby, and Anthem D2, a Panny BR player, a Toshiba HD DVD player, 2 other 1080p displays, etc..... you think I am going to cheap out on cables? Hardly, and I can state that I have seen no difference from my made to order, 24 AWG BJC $20 HDMI cables against the more expensive cables I have tried.... just trying to help others out..

BTW.. you say "better than the cable i seen"... so you don't even have one to compare? Oh, and it's "I've seen" :)

ok buddy im moving on this room dont want to discuss cables, lets move on. my mistake to change the subject.

JodyL

11-13-06, 01:15 AM

Just an aside....

All this noob interest in HD fueled by the 360 drive got me to thinking...

There is one significant thing that the HD-DVD side has going for it in this format war...

Something that Sony may never be able to catch up to...

Something that the engineers and marketing teams could never create...

It's what King Kong is all about...

Monster-sized boat loads of...

Passion! :D

jwv651

11-13-06, 01:16 AM

Agreed...cable subject over!!!!!!!!!!!

FilmMixer

11-13-06, 01:24 AM

Uptown... subject debate over...

Just a word of advice.. you've only been here 2 days... you will find a lot of helpful advice and get all of your questions answered if you look before you leap, think before you speak, do your research first instead of getting ignored or debated by senior members....

That being said... welcome to AVS :)

jwv651

11-13-06, 01:26 AM

OK thanks everyone so far who has commented.

I just signed up for Netflix, $15.000 a month with 2 HD-DVD rental at a time for an unlimited amount of rentals a month. i think its well worth the money. they have a good selection. Anyone else join? or comments.Check this thread out...if you live near a BlockBuster this deal is the best.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=743368

Uptown193

11-13-06, 01:40 AM

oleus

11-13-06, 02:04 AM

have a couple of questions...

i have a 720p infocus projector - am i likely to see any improvement in sharpness if i go VGA instead of component? i'd prefer my projector doing the downconverting from 1080p video of the 360 for movies.........

is there any way to open the dvd drive other than pushing the button on the actual drive? no remote function?

the conversion to 5.1 DD for all tracks....does this mean if an hd-dvd has a DTS or DD+ soundtrack, we are losing all benefits of those tracks??

thanks
oleus

Category 5

11-13-06, 02:18 AM

Please do tell us what the difference is... with under 20 posts and a few weeks here, you can't just come in here spouting off "facts" without some back up... your post saying "expensive=better" with no facts to back that up is the same as saying that "cheaper=the same or better..."

I have a complete HDMI setup using Blue Jeans Cables.... all under $25 a cable...

I'm running Ture 1080p to a projector 20 feet away from an Anthem D2... I've tried more expensive cables in this setup, and there was no difference in video quality (resolution patterns and color reproduction were the same) and absolutely no differnce in audio quality.. and I made the masters for some of the source I checked, so I know of what I speak...

With HDMI cables there will not be a difference between properly working cables, regardless of price. Using twisted pairs eliminates the need for additional shielding, just like in cat5/6 network wires. I have seen poor cables in use, and the symptoms are jumping picture, picture or audio going in and out, and digital artifacting. Working cables look the same.

As for HDMI being better because it's all digital, that's just silly. It's like saying MP3 is better than Analog reel-to-reel because it's digital. Unless there is significant interference received between the source and inputs, component and VGA are as good, and in many instances better. Some sources have yet to figure out HDMI color tables and their usage, which will result in reduced color gamut over HDMi when compared to component.

With cable boxes this is extremely common. You can use HD-Net's test patterns to illustrate this. On my Sharp Aquos sets, my cable boxes look better on component, but for the convenience of a single cable I run 2 of the 3 using HDMI. THe one using component achieves the best picture.

Saying "HDMI is a better piucture because it's all digital" is the same as saying "I am an average consumer who believes what the BB salesman tells me" to someone who knows what they are talking about.

Saying a $120 HDMI cable will outperform a properly working $25 cable is the same thing.

Category 5

11-13-06, 02:23 AM

So just to get this str8 in my head, everyone here in this forum even rsmith4321 thinks that the cable i seen in BB for $160 thats has 24k, and thicker wire and etc & etc. will produce the same PQ as a say $25 cable? please everyone comment on this because this will save myself and 100's of others a lot of revenue?????

Giants lost, omg

That cable might have better QC...but no other advantage other than making you feel superior, and warm & fuzzy. You will know if you got a bad cable...the symptoms are obvious. I have ordered plenty of HDMI cables off of ebay and had one bad one. It was replaced for free. There is no difference in PQ between any of them.

Some cables have a tighter connector which may help if you have stress on the wire and it keeps pulling loose. On the other hand, if you have stress on the wire you need to take care of that.

Uptown193

11-13-06, 02:25 AM

With HDMI cables there will not be a difference between properly working cables, regardless of price. Using twisted pairs eliminates the need for additional shielding, just like in cat5/6 network wires. I have seen poor cables in use, and the symptoms are jumping picture, picture or audio going in and out, and digital artifacting. Working cables look the same.

As for HDMI being better because it's all digital, that's just silly. It's like saying MP3 is better than Analog reel-to-reel because it's digital. Unless there is significant interference received between the source and inputs, component and VGA are as good, and in many instances better. Some sources have yet to figure out HDMI color tables and their usage, which will result in reduced color gamut over HDMi when compared to component.

With cable boxes this is extremely common. You can use HD-Net's test patterns to illustrate this. On my Sharp Aquos sets, my cable boxes look better on component, but for the convenience of a single cable I run 2 of the 3 using HDMI. THe one using component achieves the best picture.

Saying "HDMI is a better piucture because it's all digital" is the same as saying "I am an average consumer who believes what the BB salesman tells me" to someone who knows what they are talking about.

Saying a $120 HDMI cable will outperform a properly working $25 cable is the same thing.

ok thanks for breakin that down for me, it was helpful and appreciated. To bad i can return this $120 HDMI cable i got from BB, it looks very good though. lol

Doctor Krypton

11-13-06, 02:27 AM

Hey Gang,

Would someone please tell mw how to disable friend notifications while watching a HD DVD movie? Thanks!
Even better is to sign out from your gamertag OR turn off automatic sign in when your 360 boots up.

Uptown193

11-13-06, 02:30 AM

That cable might have better QC...but no other advantage other than making you feel superior, and warm & fuzzy. You will know if you got a bad cable...the symptoms are obvious. I have ordered plenty of HDMI cables off of ebay and had one bad one. It was replaced for free. There is no difference in PQ between any of them.

Some cables have a tighter connector which may help if you have stress on the wire and it keeps pulling loose. On the other hand, if you have stress on the wire you need to take care of that.

ok thanks for the response. Well from everyones responses I belive there is no difference in a cable thats $120 and $20 and since no one objected i guess its true. But its robbery that Monster is gettin away with sellin these cable from between $75 and $250. something should be done about that. Well im not buying from them anymore. Thats the only thing that can be done, wat a rip off.

madshi

11-13-06, 02:41 AM

But really.. how much detail do I need for movies like Little Man? The DVD thru the upscaling player looked excellent.

The transferring and compression authoring quality of regular DVD's now is just amazing.

Also HD-DVD almost has a bit of an artificial sharpness to it. Like an over sharpened digital image from photoshop.
I can only conclude that there must be some kind of problem with your setup, as your results seems to greatly differ from most others. Have you made sure that your Xbox output is set to 1080i/p? Are you aware that most displays can't do Inverse Telecine for HD content yet? So most probably your display is throwing away half of the resolution of the signal, if you're using 1080i. Anyway, even with "only" 1920x540 you should still see noticably cleaner and more detailed (and not artificially sharpened!) images. If you're not seeing that, then maybe your display is just bad. Maybe it's optimized for SD content and not HD? Can you turn off that DNIe stuff (which most videophiles consider very bad, btw)? Can you also please turn off all noise reduction and sharpening features of your display? Noise reduction usually also reduces details/resolution. Sharpening should not be necessary and will rather make the image worse with HD-DVD.

What is your opinion about why your results seems to differ from most other people here?

Dave Mack

11-13-06, 03:58 AM

Uptown, it's marketing hype. Trust me. Do a websearch...

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/5/6238.html

http://episteme.arstechnica.com/6/ubb.x?q=Y&a=tpc&s=50009562&f=67909965&m=9130980661

back on topic...

:)

Nox

11-13-06, 04:26 AM

HDMI cables...

Fellas, I'd hate to see this thread get closed because no one can stay on subject. Let's keep it to the HD-DVD addon, please.

Open another thread about the HDMI cables in the Tweaks forum and chat to your heart's content there: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=28

MalcolmMeng

11-13-06, 05:09 AM

watsonusn

11-13-06, 06:58 AM

I have a question about outputting a VGA cable vs. component cables from my Xbox 360 for use with the HD DVD drive. I have a HP Pavilion LCD with a native resolution of 1366 x 768. Would it be adventageous for me to use the VGA cable since my TV can't reach a resolution of 1080p?

Has anyone else compared at that resolution?

Thanks in advance.

On my 56" 1080P sammy, going from 720P component, to 1080P vga, noticable difference. Doing the same on my 27" 720P Sammy LCD, no difference unless you are 2 feet away or less the whole time you are viewing.

new04quest

11-13-06, 08:38 AM

LOL, OK IF U THINK AND SAY SO. HAVE FUN WITH YOU LOW PICTURE QUALITY, ME MYSELF I FEEL GOOD WITH THE BEST OF THE BESTIf you're going for the look of the cable, I agreed. As far as PQ and AQ, you'll not be able to tell the difference w/ you naked eyes/ears. You need to connect it to NWA tester to see these differences.

By looking at your components and some of the wiring in the rear at higher magnification, you are not using the best of the best. I'm sorry bud..!

new04quest

11-13-06, 08:43 AM

union1411

11-13-06, 09:36 AM

does the add-on allow me to set speaker size/apply bass management? or is that done through my receiver only?

jblank74

11-13-06, 10:04 AM

LOL, OK IF U THINK AND SAY SO. HAVE FUN WITH YOU LOW PICTURE QUALITY, ME MYSELF I FEEL GOOD WITH THE BEST OF THE BEST

Horseexcrement. Listen bro, you might wanna bash Monoprice cables because they don't cost $100.00, but I will guarandamntee you that my MP cables do just as good a job as whatever you have.

jblank74

11-13-06, 10:12 AM

does the add-on allow me to set speaker size/apply bass management? or is that done through my receiver only?

Receiver only. As far as I could tell, the add-on enables no additional audio or video options.

slicecom

11-13-06, 10:17 AM

Horseexcrement. Listen bro, you might wanna bash Monoprice cables because they don't cost $100.00, but I will guarandamntee you that my MP cables do just as good a job as whatever you have.

He already learned his lesson and now regrets that he wasted his money on overpriced cables that do not provide any benefit other than looking more beefy. We moved on from the cable discussion.

jblank74

11-13-06, 10:18 AM

Apologies. I posted that from a few pages back. I suppose I should have read on more before posting.

Rhegaana

11-13-06, 11:25 AM

I have a question about outputting a VGA cable vs. component cables from my Xbox 360 for use with the HD DVD drive. I have a HP Pavilion LCD with a native resolution of 1366 x 768. Would it be adventageous for me to use the VGA cable since my TV can't reach a resolution of 1080p?

Has anyone else compared at that resolution?

Thanks in advance.
I have the player and a samsung 768p LCD (4092d). I will say this... in vga with the samsung the picture quality is the best Ive ever seen in anything HD with the KK hddvd. This includes InHD shows and Discovery channels. The only gripe I have is that the movie and game settings wil have to be the same, and I prefer my games darker with higher contrast and movies with extra brightness.

lastxbr960

11-13-06, 11:46 AM

On my 56" 1080P sammy, going from 720P component, to 1080P vga, noticable difference. Doing the same on my 27" 720P Sammy LCD, no difference unless you are 2 feet away or less the whole time you are viewing.
Have you tried 1080i component on your Sammy vs 1080P VGA.
If so what are the differences? :confused:

joe221

11-13-06, 11:46 AM

ok fine, be happy with you $16 HDMI cable. Im not goin to argue.

Hey Uptown! Why don't you and Manamal get together and discuss your theories! Then again, like Clark & Superman, I don't tink Ive ever saw yu to in da sam room?

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Fox Mulder87

11-13-06, 12:21 PM

I have ordered an xbox 360 hddvd drive from the US but because I live in Switzerland I need to know what I exactly need to get this drive work here in Switzerland without en explosion of my xbox 360 :D

Spooksta

11-13-06, 12:24 PM

This seems to have worked fine! :)
I've been watching the movie for almost an hour now, and the "perform maintenance" trick seems to have gotten rid of all the studdering and freezing!
Thanks for the tip, Spooksta! ;)

Glad to help (if it was the problem)
When i done mine it only took about 1 second to "perform Maintenance" Did yours take longer out of curiosity??

BuGsArEtAsTy

11-13-06, 01:11 PM

The first units in Canada are finally trickling in. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8886257&&#post8886257)

Nox

11-13-06, 01:11 PM

Here's a review of the HD-DVD drive. There's even a little YouTube video of it in action:
http://www.krunker.com/2006/11/12/xbox-360-hd-dvd-player-review/

VegasFlyby

11-13-06, 02:10 PM

Here's a review of the HD-DVD drive. There's even a little YouTube video of it in action:
http://www.krunker.com/2006/11/12/xbox-360-hd-dvd-player-review/

Is it ok to stack the dvd drive like in the pictures? I'd like to to that for more space but I thought it was a no no to stack equiptment like that.

Category 5

11-13-06, 02:33 PM

ok thanks for the response. Well from everyones responses I belive there is no difference in a cable thats $120 and $20 and since no one objected i guess its true. But its robbery that Monster is gettin away with sellin these cable from between $75 and $250. something should be done about that. Well im not buying from them anymore. Thats the only thing that can be done, wat a rip off.

Don't feel bad. Most of us have learned that lesson the hard way. The good nes is that you probably have a lifetime warranty on that cable, good QC, and it will probably serve you until long after the spec is outdated. Hey, just one less thing to worry about.

joe221

11-13-06, 02:35 PM

Is it ok to stack the dvd drive like in the pictures? I'd like to to that for more space but I thought it was a no no to stack equiptment like that.

Only if you're blocking top vents. It's fine for this. It's pictured that way on the back of the box!

jlatham

11-13-06, 02:35 PM

Does anybody know how the bookmark feature works?

See-Fu

11-13-06, 02:47 PM

Only if you're blocking top vents. It's fine for this. It's pictured that way on the back of the box!

i actually stacked the xbox and hd dvd drive horizontally on top of each other. I didn't want the HD DVD drive right on top of the Xbox so I purchased some rubber spacers from a local hardware store to give a little space between the two units.

Fox Mulder87

11-13-06, 03:53 PM

how many watt does the xbox 360 drive consume?

vikajakub

11-13-06, 05:13 PM

The 37D90u has a DVI-I jack not have a VGA jack. Several posters have confirmed analog 1080p via the DVI-I jack (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8793992#post8793992 post 697). However, there may be a problem with the 360 on both the Sharp 37D90U and Sony XBR2 sets (posts 696 and 698, same page) for 1080p via the VGA. Some have suggested that these sets anticipate 1080p/60 and that the Xbox 360 VGA is 1080p/24 or /30 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8816444#post8816444 post 742). Category 5, from your other posts, it would appear that you may have worked around a similar problem on your current Sharp. I’m not sure if your experience would extrapolate to the 37D90. All I can say is that the 37d90 will accept 1080p analog over the DVI-I port.

Hi, I have the issue: I tried to hook up my lop to Acer Aspire 3500 to 37D90U, VGA converting to DVI, "Analog" input it is the only way signal gets thru. The desktop seems to be cut off on that display. Sharp was not very familiar with settings, suggested 640x480 what makes whole desktop blown very huge. Dot by dot displayes only a small envelope in the middle of the screen (while loptop shows on its own screen perfect size) Anybody can share their XP settings for their loptops when hooked up to Aquos?

vikajakub

11-13-06, 05:36 PM

VGA is sharper, some report washed-out colors, others say beautful picture in games and video. The last dashboard update was supposed to address the washed-out look in VGA (I think it was sending PC levels in error) and enable upconverting DVDs in VGA. There are threads in the xbox forum with several voicing opinnions on it.

So, yes you could use it for both if desired.

Hi- here is my problem: I hooked up my laptop Acer Aspire 3500 to 37D90U via VGA to DVI converter. The signal gets thru only in "Analog" Input but desktop looks like it is cut off about 20% on both sides. Sharp did not know much about settings for Windows XP, they suggested changing resolution to 640x480 but that blows everything to the huge unreadable size. "Dot by Dot" makes desktop show as a small envelope in the middle of the screen. "Normal" looks better, but still not full desktop is displayed ( although laptop shows it fine). Any suggestion what the best resolution settings are if anybody uses that display with notebook VGA ? I put the latest video driver already.

bembol

11-13-06, 06:16 PM

Picked it up because Microsoft/Universal included Kong and the Media Remote...figured it's a great bargain, upgrade!

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c251/LouDiamonds/HPIM0683.jpg

DouglasCleary

11-13-06, 06:39 PM

lol, ok then in that case i guess i wasted my money on a $120 HDMI cable from monster. lesson learned. Yea i know Bose is not the best, I saw some great Definitive speakers. but anyway back to 360 HD Dvd talk.

How can we update our HD dvd drives with the lastest firmware updates. I seen a sticker that came with the addon or the Hd DVD which said go to www.thelookandsoundofperfect.com. wat u guys think?

I recommend the forum sponsor RAM. I have an HDMI cable from them and it was reasonable and very high quality. Plus, they support the forum which we all enjoy.

Monty22001

11-13-06, 07:02 PM

I'm going to have to stick to component I guess. I bought a VGA adapter, and it ended up putting the image into a box on my HLS5687, about 2 inches on each side. The picture also didn't look as clear as the component.

Robert Clark

11-13-06, 08:53 PM

DVDoctor

11-13-06, 09:15 PM

DVDoctor

11-13-06, 09:18 PM

starwarstrek

11-13-06, 09:28 PM

Glad to help (if it was the problem)
When i done mine it only took about 1 second to "perform Maintenance" Did yours take longer out of curiosity??

Nope, mine took about as long as yours!

knownzero

11-13-06, 09:29 PM

After reading the last 1000 posts or so (!) I was on the fence about getting a 360 in the first place but with the HD-DVD drive, dang it's getting tough to say no. The *only* thing holding me back is the no upsampling over component, that's a killer for me. I'm using my old Xbox as my DVD player (chipped) and I run all my dvd's off the hard drive and the PQ is really good. Really, really good, almost too good to be true good. The Xbox Media Center does a great job upconverting (much much better than the TV) and has a ton of options to get the picture just right. I have a VGA port on the back of the tv but I've never used it and have no idea if it'll even work right with the Xbox. I gotta go dig the manual off of an old hard drive, it seems to have disappeared off of LG's website. Argh! Decisisions, decisions... :confused:

Nox

11-13-06, 09:58 PM

The *only* thing holding me back is the no upsampling over component, that's a killer for me.

I wouldn't let that stop you. Upscaling over component video is against Macrovision. So practically every upscaling player will NOT do so over component (I say practically, because there are a couple out there that do). Microsoft is only following the law in this respect.

Nox

11-13-06, 10:05 PM

Has anyone tried a VGA to component converter? or a component to HDMI converter, this might be a way to get dvd upscaling to still work on Component only displays or HDMI displays

Gefen has one http://www.opentip.com/products/Gefen_Component_Video_Or_Vga_Audio_To_Hdmi_Converter_AV_Ampl ifiersExtendersConverters_Audio_and_Video-151892.html

Thanks
John

VGA to component sounds interesting. Curious to know if there woud be any picture degradation.

I don't see how component to HDMI would work though...the output from the 360 is still over component, so no upscaling would be allowed.

joe221

11-13-06, 10:28 PM

rob316

11-13-06, 10:35 PM

Anyone hear anything new about the possible HDMI cable from MS? This is a deal breaker for me in purchasing the addon.

Rob

knownzero

11-13-06, 10:37 PM

I wouldn't let that stop you. Upscaling over component video is against Macrovision. So practically every upscaling player will NOT do so over component (I say practically, because there are a couple out there that do). Microsoft is only following the law in this respect.

The problem is that my original Xbox already does it with the mods, and I use the Xbox on the component input (my cable box is on the DVI) so I'm pretty much stuck using the component input unless I can get the VGA port to work. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to get one, I just need to make sure it works the way I want it to before I get it. If it can replace the old Xbox and do what it does, it's a no brainer, if it can't upscale DVD's, my DVD collection is worthless. The lack of inputs on my TV is starting to get annoying as well. :(

Monty22001

11-13-06, 10:37 PM

Was this using a component to vga converter, or just vga cable?

John

Just the VGA cable, no conversion.

JRad

11-13-06, 10:41 PM

So if one inserts an HD-DVD disc into the player, it automatically plays the movie?
This would certainly help user friendliness with the family.

I'm tempted- I could combine the A1 and my XBox into 1 1/2 boxes...

Robert,

If you go to the system blade and go to start-up options and change it from dashboard to disc, it will play the disc upon insertion. I believe it only works if there is not a disc in the drive of the X-Box.

Cheers,
JRad

knownzero

11-13-06, 10:43 PM

Post what your TV is. Maybe someone here can help you or point you in the right direction!

Found it:

RU-52SZ51D 2 Comp/1 RGB/1 DVI

Those are the HD capable inputs. The question becomes, will the RGB work, and I'm thinking it will. Hmmm...that makes things very interesting indeed.

oleus

11-13-06, 10:44 PM

so, is anyone here using VGA to a 720p projector? i am pretty happy with this player so far over component but other than MI:3 i have seen nothing that looks better than HD over my comcast HD (via DVI).....so if i could get a little sharper with VGA that would be great but since my projector is only 720p i am not sure if this would be worth it (although i am watching on a 110" screen and even the smallest upgrade in sharpness would be welcome)

HomerJay

11-13-06, 11:05 PM

I take it NO Best Buy's have them yet? I know a CC that is sorta close to me (15 miles) has one, but the two 5 miles away do not. I may just go and check....we'll see.

I apologize if this was answered in the several pages that followed this post. I didn't read through everything that followed.

Both Best Buys in my area have quoted dates either later this week (16th) or next Tuesday (21st).

It definitely appears that CC is the place to get one. I picked one up after work today at the Landover, MD CC (near FedEx Field). I wonder what CC did to get in MS's good graces... :p

Kadath

11-13-06, 11:33 PM

cnickersonjr

11-13-06, 11:37 PM

I just hooked up mine. The video is WAY WAY WAY soft compared to the Toshiba A1 and the sound if completely all borked up. I was hoping to cut out one DVD deck cause the A1 has a ton of issues too, but this is going back in the morning till MS can get it worked out.What did you watch? King Kong? I've seen the RCA player and the addon, and I can't tell a difference. The addon looks good to me. Guess it's not for everyone.

cnickersonjr

11-13-06, 11:37 PM

U sure the res wasn't reset to 480p? Ive heard of this happening on the first run!

Kadath

11-13-06, 11:44 PM

It sets the whole 360 to 480P?

cnickersonjr

11-13-06, 11:46 PM

It sets the whole 360 to 480P?
Yep weird ha? The guy was using a VGA cable.

Kadath

11-13-06, 11:51 PM

Lemme go into the living room and fire it up again.

Sam

cnickersonjr

11-13-06, 11:54 PM

Lemme go into the living room and fire it up again.

Sam
Cool, I'm checking out your pics over @ Flickr Nice projector. ae900u! what size screen are u using?

Platoface

11-13-06, 11:54 PM

Mine comes wednesday from Amazon. I am also getting the VGA cable to go along with the component cable from MS.

Question is... The HD DVD player does not really support 1080P native but is upscaled to get near that resolution. WHY? Isn't that what HD is all about? I am so confused anymore about all this. the more i read the more confused I get.

I have a Samsung 1080P DLP tv and am disappointed that MS did not make the VGA capable to go native 1080P (1920 x 1080) but rather the highest is 1280 x 1024 which is dramatically lower than what the TV can do and what the xbox gu can do. Approximately 37% lower actually. That is quite a difference. I am really disappointed about this. Hopefully a software update will take care of this later. I hope, I hope.

Any info on the above would be appreciated.

cnickersonjr

11-13-06, 11:58 PM

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:02 AM

Platoface

11-14-06, 12:03 AM

Platoface

11-14-06, 12:04 AM

Platoface,
Ignore all of the technical crap. It will drive you nuts. I saw this player running King Kong at my friends house last night, and man the PQ was great. If the best HD you've seen so far is cable or Dish then you're in for a supprise. once you see HD-dvd broadcast will look like compressed crap!

Actually that was all I was wanting to hear. Don't want to throw good money down the toilet.

Thanks. Can't wait for wednesday then.

One quick question. Keep the component or switch to VGA?

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:08 AM

Actually that was all I was wanting to hear. Don't want to throw good money down the toilet.

Thanks. Can't wait for wednesday then.

One quick question. Keep the component or switch to VGA?
Sorry, I can't comment on VGA. My friend was using component. I say keep it! But that's because, to me, the picture was perfect. But hey, if it doesn't look better on the VGA. Return it! Did you read the HD res stuff? Here is the part I want you to see:

No actual information is lost—the entire normal film frame is still present, it has just been transferred to the display with 12 repeated fields. A modern display can remove those 12 fields and recover the original 24 FPS signal. In other words, with a proper display, a 1080i picture will look identical to a 1080p picture when you begin with film material source like that from HD DVD.

Deathbear

11-14-06, 12:12 AM

Maybe i should be more to the point. My fault. I am tired.

The best the VGA can output is 1280 x 1024 but my TV can do 1920 x 1080. So my question is why doesn't the xbox allow 1920 x 1080 over vga. The gu in the 360 I am sure can output this res.

I am off to bed...

Good night all.

VGA is outputting at 1920 x 1080 on my Samsung 6168.

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:13 AM

VGA is outputting at 1920 x 1080 on my Samsung 6168.
Thanks. I was searching for a post on this!

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:17 AM

VGA is outputting at 1920 x 1080 on my Samsung 6168.
So is their a "noticeable" difference in 1080p VGA over 1081i/720p component?

Kadath

11-14-06, 12:21 AM

Nope, still set to 720p, just did a direct A/V with the Toshiba. On the 360 it sure looks soft and the audio is ALL dorked up, sound is totally muted on most channels. Kong isnt the greatest looking HD on the toshiba either, which is kinda shocking, but its still night and day better than on the 360, and the sound is great. So far it seems that something is not up to par with the 360drive.

I'm running an AE900U to a 96" greywolf screen. On the Toshiba I am running 6 channel direct, on the 360 I am obviously going with the optical output....

Sam

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:25 AM

Nope, still set to 720p, about to actually direct A/V with the Toshiba, but it sure looks soft and the audio is ALL dorked up, sound is totally muted on most channels. Kong isnt the greatest looking HD on the toshiba either, which is kinda shocking, but its still night and day better than on the 360
Man. I thought kong looked great. Do u have any other disc? HD DVD?

EDIT: What type of display r u using?

EDIT2: Ops. I see it in the previos post now.

Kadath

11-14-06, 12:27 AM

I have every disk Universal has released. And a lot of others from Warner and Paramount. Will put Riddick or something in in a few mins.

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:31 AM

Kadath

11-14-06, 12:38 AM

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:43 AM

No, I only have DVD essentials for SD which I ran on the A1 but havent run it off the 360, but the games have been fine looking. Putting in Batman Begins now, that should tell one way or the other.

Sam
I find that my TV settings for my games, are not optimal for my movies. On my games I set my TV to Vivid, and on my movies I set it to Standard. But if you have the Toshiba why buy the 360 player? Sorry just curious.

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:45 AM

Tried 1080i for the 360?

Yumbo

11-14-06, 12:49 AM

if it can't upscale DVD's, my DVD collection is worthless.

How so?

Kadath

11-14-06, 12:54 AM

Confirmed with Batman Begins. The sound mix is completely dorked up, cranking the sound level up only makes the effect worse. The video is definitly softer than the A1, it's obviously better than SD but not what I would expect from a true HD disk.

As I said, the Audio/video from 360 games is nothing short of breathtaking, something has got to be screwed up with the software for movie playback.

Sam

cnickersonjr

11-14-06, 12:57 AM

Kadath

11-14-06, 12:58 AM

But if you have the Toshiba why buy the 360 player?

A. To consolidate the HD deck and the 360 in order
B. To make room for the PS3.
C. Cause I hate the A1s remote, slow startup times, slow disk loading speed, lack of SACD/DVDA playback, any of which may or may not (likely) be fixed by the 360 deck.
D. If the above were the case I would sell off the A1 in a heartbeat. Doesnt look likely at this time. Hoping its a simple firmware fix.

I've got 30 days at Circuit City to make my decision actually, so it wont be going back tomorrow dont think.

Sam

oleus

11-14-06, 01:11 AM

Kadath

11-14-06, 01:21 AM

shilex

11-14-06, 01:23 AM

vexum

11-14-06, 01:39 AM

this is my first look at hd optical discs of any kind. i'm pretty impressed with the picture quality. i am disapointed there are no picture adjustments, though.

rodmar

11-14-06, 01:43 AM

Got the last one from one of the gamestop stores here in Chicago.Sweeeeeeet!
Way better than my Oppo.

Deathbear

11-14-06, 01:52 AM

So is their a "noticeable" difference in 1080p VGA over 1081i/720p component?

I haven't gotten a chance to switch back to component. I'll do that tomorrow and post the results.

Uptown193

11-14-06, 01:54 AM

If you're going for the look of the cable, I agreed. As far as PQ and AQ, you'll not be able to tell the difference w/ you naked eyes/ears. You need to connect it to NWA tester to see these differences.

By looking at your components and some of the wiring in the rear at higher magnification, you are not using the best of the best. I'm sorry bud..!

are you on drugs buddy, my setup looks a whole lot better then urs, u just jealous, keep the stupid comments to urself, thats so dumb wat u said u cant even see wats behind my tv or wat wiring im using, think be u talk ok and dont hate on other people equipment b/c u dont have it

the3rdpower

11-14-06, 01:58 AM

I have been thinking about buying the 360 now for a while and was planning on buying it as soon as Halo 3 comes out. With the HD-DVD drive coming out soon(at least in the US, France, Germany and the UK) I am strongly considering buying the 360 when the HD-DVD drive becomes available in Scandinavia; it's a cheap way of having HD "now" - with the uncertainty surrounding the future of the formats I believe buying an inexpensive add-on could prove to be a wise decision.
.

Buy the 360 for the HD-DVD and Gears of War - :-o The game is bloody brilliant!!
BTW - who has a good listing on what 1080p Plasmas are available at 50" with VGA input that accepts 1080p? Obviously I'm trying to buy a plasma with the ability to support the 360 HD-DVD with 1080p native on VGA out of teh box.

TMSKILZ

11-14-06, 02:02 AM

Batman Begins is a really bad disc to use as reference - it's one of the softer hd-dvd titles. Try MI:3 to see if your 360 is putting out a good image...

You're kidding right? Batman Begins is one of the sharpest/better HD-DVD movies out now. It looks awesome on my HP 58'' HDTV! Better than the Cable HD version I saw it on HBO-HD couple months back & that's a very good version as well.

oleus

11-14-06, 02:29 AM

You're kidding right? Batman Begins is one of the sharpest/better HD-DVD movies out now. It looks awesome on my HP 58'' HDTV! Better than the Cable HD version I saw it on HBO-HD couple months back & that's a very good version as well.

first off, you are saying that the HBO version is very good when it was cropped to 16:9. a transfer that is cropped can't be very good....

but as for this HD-DVD...on a 110" screen it's much softer than titles like MI3 and THE SEARCHERS.....

there are numerous reports of this title's relative softness in the "HD DVD TIER" thread. i'm not crazy!

it's not a BAD transfer by any means though!! much better than the sd dvd, it's just on very large displays it doesn't retain the sharpness that some other titles have.

bkilian

11-14-06, 03:09 AM

Whats the difference? If I've seen two disks already that are worse on the 360 than the A1, it doesnt matter what the source is. I've got the MI trilogy tho, will pop it in tomorrow if you want, going to bed now doubt it will be any different.
What are you using to connect? VGA or Component?
Also, switch the 360 into 1080i or 1080p, I'll bet money you have the Toshiba at 1080i and doing a 1080i/720p comparison is probably not all that useful.

oleus

11-14-06, 03:31 AM

What are you using to connect? VGA or Component?
Also, switch the 360 into 1080i or 1080p, I'll bet money you have the Toshiba at 1080i and doing a 1080i/720p comparison is probably not all that useful.

agreed, i switched to 1080i on the xbox and the picture quality was noticeably better. even on a 720p display.

i'd believe that the Toshiba could be a better player but claims that it is WAY softer are a little harder to believe.

Nox

11-14-06, 05:06 AM

The problem is that my original Xbox already does it with the mods, and I use the Xbox on the component input (my cable box is on the DVI) so I'm pretty much stuck using the component input unless I can get the VGA port to work. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to get one, I just need to make sure it works the way I want it to before I get it. If it can replace the old Xbox and do what it does, it's a no brainer, if it can't upscale DVD's, my DVD collection is worthless. The lack of inputs on my TV is starting to get annoying as well. :(

I was at Wal Mart the other day and stumbled across a component video switcher. It allows you to plug in 3 component video devices and switch between them. I believe it was under $20 too. Yeah, at Wal Mart of all places.

I'm not sure if it passes through a progressive signal or if the quality of the product is any good, but something like this could be a viable option.

BUT, for the same price you could use the VGA cable. Again, at Wal Mart (not to sound like a Wal Mart advertisement) I found the Pelican VGA cable for $20 ( http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4324617 ). It's a low price to check out if you like VGA or not. Return it if you don't. :)

mboojigga

11-14-06, 06:20 AM

Buy the 360 for the HD-DVD and Gears of War - :-o The game is bloody brilliant!!
BTW - who has a good listing on what 1080p Plasmas are available at 50" with VGA input that accepts 1080p? Obviously I'm trying to buy a plasma with the ability to support the 360 HD-DVD with 1080p native on VGA out of teh box.

I think there is a few but the one I know about is Pioneer's and it runs around 8K.

mboojigga

11-14-06, 06:30 AM

cewolcott

11-14-06, 07:01 AM

Cancelled my order with Amazon. My local CC had 4 in stock. $199.99 - $40 .00 coupon + $8.00 tax. Saved $32. Thanks for the coupon info.

Reviews to follow after I buy an XBOX 360 next week.

govschmo

11-14-06, 07:03 AM

Got mine yesterday. I plan to use it between my 2 360s. So far so good. No regrets.

pospower

11-14-06, 07:27 AM

Maybe i should be more to the point. My fault. I am tired.

The best the VGA can output is 1280 x 1024 but my TV can do 1920 x 1080. So my question is why doesn't the xbox allow 1920 x 1080 over vga. The gu in the 360 I am sure can output this res.

I am off to bed...

Good night all.

Not sure what is going on with your setup. I have a TV that only goes up to 1366x768 and I still get the option for 1920x 1080.

phantomhitman

11-14-06, 07:32 AM

you will always have the option for it, you just cannot use it.

scherer326

11-14-06, 07:37 AM

pospower, since your tv has a native resolution of 1366x768. what are you setting the 360 to? I am in the same boat as you.

Nox

11-14-06, 07:50 AM

http://uneasysilence.com/archive/2006/11/8303/

Pictures of HD-DVD drive working in Windows and also taken apart. Check out the first picture recognize that website in the browser??

EDIT: actually, this blog was taken from a post in AVS. Blippy. mentioned in the blog, confirmed the HD-DVD drive works in Windows:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8880622&&#post8880622

pcaulfie

11-14-06, 08:04 AM

No, I only have DVD essentials for SD which I ran on the A1 but havent run it off the 360, but the games have been fine looking. Sam

I calibrated with the SD version DVE and it made a big difference in picture quality.

pospower

11-14-06, 08:08 AM

pospower, since your tv has a native resolution of 1366x768. what are you setting the 360 to? I am in the same boat as you.

I am using the component set at 720p.
I have the Vizio 46 LCD which I love.
I tried the VGA and it was indeed softer. I like the Component picture much better.

hardballpete

11-14-06, 08:10 AM

theroys88

11-14-06, 08:14 AM

Just bought this puppy yesterday and enjoyed King Kong and I am looking forward to more moviies soon. PQ is great. Its smoother yet sharper then the SD version. Colors are more saturated. I qued up my SD version and flipped back between both to compare. I will say that the improvement in PQ is not the jump that I saw from VHS to DVD but it is an improvement. I also have a great upconverting SD player.

BuGsArEtAsTy

11-14-06, 08:40 AM

I will say that the improvement in PQ is not the jump that I saw from VHS to DVD but it is an improvement.
I agree of course, but strangely enough, last time when I said that, people jumped down my throat.

Still, I am VERY impressed with HD DVD, except the fact that most discs can't resume. How stupid is that? Very!

new04quest

11-14-06, 08:54 AM

are you on drugs buddy, my setup looks a whole lot better then urs, u just jealous, keep the stupid comments to urself, thats so dumb wat u said u cant even see wats behind my tv or wat wiring im using, think be u talk ok and dont hate on other people equipment b/c u dont have itExcuse me bud..! You babbled at your previous posts “ HAVE FUN WITH YOU LOW PICTURE QUALITY, ME MYSELF I FEEL GOOD WITH THE BEST OF THE BEST", and I never incur that my HTPC and HT is better than your. You’re probably right that your system is better than mine, and that is okay w/ me. I am not constructing my system to compare to others. I'm glad that you like your component, cables and setup. I'm glad that you're recognized the price of HDMI cable makes no difference in PQ/AQ. Let just leave it at that, and enjoy it.

theroys88

11-14-06, 09:07 AM

I agree of course, but strangely enough, last time when I said that, people jumped down my throat.

Still, I am VERY impressed with HD DVD, except the fact that most discs can't resume. How stupid is that? Very!

People must understand that a good display plus a very good upconverting player with a great deinterlacer is going to narrow the gap. If you took a cheap progressive player with a marginal deinterlacer then the difference is going to be greater. My
upconverted images have been better the the crap I see on Directv HD movies. I will say that I can justify the add on since it only cost 160 dollars but cannot justify the cost of a stand alone player for 400-500 dollars.

new04quest

11-14-06, 09:16 AM

tsb

11-14-06, 09:29 AM

no problem on PCs

http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEyFuVlZuADeQBqmdW.php

Nox

11-14-06, 10:18 AM

Have anyone see this: HD DVD PLAYER (http://geekswithblogs.net/lorint/archive/2006/04/21/75795.aspx) It appears that all A1 HD-DVD players are the same as Xbox, and the new HP external HD-DVD player for PC. HP is more likely to release it at the end of this year: HP HD100 (http://www.everythingusb.com/hp_hd100_external_hd_dvd-rom.html)

That link to Geekswithblogs was very interesting. The video shows them taking the drive right out of A1 which is indeed a PC drive.

It wouldn't surprise me that the 360 HD-DVD, the HP and the A1 are the same.

timick1

11-14-06, 10:25 AM

My local CC had 4 in stock. $199.99 - $40 .00 coupon + $8.00 tax. Saved $32. Thanks for the coupon info.

Where can I get a coupon??

Thanks

edit: found it

bmel

11-14-06, 11:25 AM

Quick question: those of you with Panny Ae700 or Ae900, are you using 720p or 1080i through component or VGA cable. For some reason, I think that 720p looks better than 1080i through component (haven't tried VGA yet) for the 360. Will I notice an improvement through a VGA cable?

I have the Panny 700. I have the xbox output at 1080i based on my experience with my upconverting DVD player and my cable box, both of which look better at 1080i than 720p. Using component cable.

I've only had a chance to briefly look at kong. I find the pq to be a definite step up from the upconverting dvd player on my 106" screen. It does not, howver, have the wow factor that I get with my toshiba hda1 and my sony 46" xbr2 1080p tv. Still very nice though. An excellent use of $200.

Kadath

11-14-06, 11:28 AM

I'll bet money you have the Toshiba at 1080i and doing a 1080i/720p comparison is probably not all that useful.

You know what? You are RIGHT. I have the toshiba at 1080i output as (surprisingly/amazingly) it did seem that the 1080p->1080i internally in the toshiba and 1080i->720p in the 900u looked better than 1080p->720p internally in the toshiba. I wonder if the same thing is happening here on the 360. What would suck tho is having to change that every time I swapped between gaming and movies. Will check it tonight.

If that turns out to be the issue, I wonder if MS would consider a firmware change that allowed movies to be output at 1080i and keep the games outputting 720p native....

Sam

Nox

11-14-06, 11:55 AM

Where can I get a coupon??

Thanks

edit: found it

For anyone else:
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/2546/editedym4.jpg

efjay

11-14-06, 12:03 PM

That link to Geekswithblogs was very interesting. The video shows them taking the drive right out of A1 which is indeed a PC drive.

It wouldn't surprise me that the 360 HD-DVD, the HP and the A1 are the same.

Dont know about the HP but the A1 has an NEC drive and the 360 addon has a Toshiba drive.

vurbano

11-14-06, 12:13 PM

Batman Begins is a really bad disc to use as reference - it's one of the softer hd-dvd titles.
you couldnt be more wrong.

new04quest

11-14-06, 01:03 PM

no problem on PCs

http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEyFuVlZuADeQBqmdW.phpThank you for the link. It gave me an idea for this weekend. These people are hilarious. I'm glad that somebody is doing the dirty works for us.

It is a crazy world. Toshiba is using NEC drive in their product and Sony is using Toshiba drive in their Xbox, and they are fighting the format war against Toshiba. I guess it is good for the customer. It'll bring out the best of their design to win us over.

Mr Bigins

11-14-06, 01:03 PM

teknower

11-14-06, 01:07 PM

I have the Panny 700. I have the xbox output at 1080i based on my experience with my upconverting DVD player and my cable box, both of which look better at 1080i than 720p. Using component cable.

I've only had a chance to briefly look at kong. I find the pq to be a definite step up from the upconverting dvd player on my 106" screen. It does not, howver, have the wow factor that I get with my toshiba hda1 and my sony 46" xbr2 1080p tv. Still very nice though. An excellent use of $200.

i have a 40 xbr2 and you cant even compare it to an upconverting dvd player, and in reviews i have read, professional reviewers have said the pict on the a1 is only slightly better than the 360 add-on.

trent3

11-14-06, 01:21 PM

You know what? You are RIGHT. I have the toshiba at 1080i output as (surprisingly/amazingly) it did seem that the 1080p->1080i internally in the toshiba and 1080i->720p in the 900u looked better than 1080p->720p internally in the toshiba. I wonder if the same thing is happening here on the 360. What would suck tho is having to change that every time I swapped between gaming and movies. Will check it tonight.

If that turns out to be the issue, I wonder if MS would consider a firmware change that allowed movies to be output at 1080i and keep the games outputting 720p native....

Sam

I am kind of wondering the same thing. I've got the Xbox 360 HD and a Sony XBR2 with 1080p. When I go into Xbox settings and change from 1080i to 1080p, I do not get a picture. Do I need to set the Sony instead to 1080p and leave the Xbox at 1080i? Any help would be appreciated, as my guess is I am seeing King Kong demo at 1080i instead of 1080p.

GMan4911

11-14-06, 01:54 PM

Anybody want to give these files a try and report back?

Toshiba HD-DVD Player (http://cdgenp01.csd.toshiba.com/content/support/downloads/toshibahddvdplayer_v20108_os2006251a.exe)

Toshiba UDF 2.5 Drivers for WinXP (http://cdgenp01.csd.toshiba.com/content/support/downloads/udf_driver_hddvd_25074A.exe)

Kilroy

11-14-06, 02:06 PM

Ok, so take what I'm going to say as hear say, but it's from a reliable source. I was talking with someone that works at MS game studios last night, and he told me that there's an XP download that allows you to use the 360 HD-DVD player with a PC.

I thought this news would be rampant around here today but I'm not seeing anything. Any info on it?

There was a post or two about its ability to work on a PC a few pages back. There's also this dvdtown article that is interesting, to say the least:

http://www.dvdtown.com/news/xboxhddvddrivewillworkonpc/4188

pgvozdas

11-14-06, 02:19 PM

timick1

11-14-06, 04:10 PM

I have a Sony LCD rear projection. Its resolution is 720p. I set my Xbox to output 720p when playing games. Should I use this setting for HD-DVD too? I'm connected via Component cables. Would 1080i be a better choice?

I have a Sony LCD-RP (KDF-XS55 which is 768P I think). I watched part of King Kong with the Xbox set to 720P and I watched the same part with it set to 1080i. I think the 1080i picture looks better, so I am keeping it on that setting. I have the xbox hooked up to the TV with Microsofts Component cables.

maverick0716

11-14-06, 04:21 PM

I have a Sony LCD rear projection. Its resolution is 720p. I set my Xbox to output 720p when playing games. Should I use this setting for HD-DVD too? I'm connected via Component cables. Would 1080i be a better choice?

Normally, you would want to keep the setting at 720p because that is the resolution of your display......but with HD DVD it can get a bit tricky. The resolution on HD DVD discs is actually 1080p, so the Xbox 360 is downscaling the image to either 1080i or 720p. The question is, is the Xbox 360 better at downscaling the 1080p or is your TV? What does the Xbox do when you pick 1080i? Does it take the 1080p, downscale it to 720p, and then scale it back up to 1080i (only to be scaled back down to 720p by your tv)? That's the tricky question.

maverick0716

11-14-06, 04:26 PM

I may be opening up an funky can of worms, but...

Has anyone replaced the stock HD AV xbox 360 cable with a monster gamelink or other replacement and observed an improvement in PQ?

Generally I don't believe more expensive upgrade wiring produces an improvement, but I never say never, and have an open mind.

Anyone?

I bought the Monster Component cables with full intention of returning them if I didn't see a picture quality. Well, I don't really see a picture quality increase enough to justify the price difference.

Big_Nate

11-14-06, 05:00 PM

Ok, I'm a bit confused and would like to ask a question. First of all, I have a Hitachi Ultravision 51S500 rear-projection CRT HDTV that outputs in 1080i and accepts all others lower than that. It has component and DVI inputs. I'm currently using my 360 and HD-DVD drive via component.

My question is this: Would I be able to get a VGA->DVI cable and attach it via the VGA adapter for the 360 to the DVI input on my tv in order to watch movies in 1080i? Specifially I am interested in this for the upconverting capabilities.

Thanks in advance!

Nathan

Capfacsurf

11-14-06, 05:40 PM

Freakin' Amazing! What a big difference in PQ! I recieved my HD DVD drive last night from EB Games, hooked it up and put in the accompanying Kong Hong HD DVD and was blown away. The detail in the scenes is so crisp and sharp, it has a nearly 3D feel. The details are in such sharp relief, that is easy to see the special effects and the movie makers magic. I am a convert!

I am running my Xbox signal directly to the back of my HLN series 50" Sammy, and have selected 720p in the XBox set up menu.

Capfacsurf

11-14-06, 05:43 PM

LiftedTacoma

11-14-06, 06:19 PM

thanks to whoever posted the $40 circuit city coupon, i just got my hd-dvd player for $170 with tax.

giantchicken

11-14-06, 06:55 PM

yipchunyu

11-14-06, 08:04 PM

gotspeed6

11-14-06, 08:09 PM

I am kind of wondering the same thing. I've got the Xbox 360 HD and a Sony XBR2 with 1080p. When I go into Xbox settings and change from 1080i to 1080p, I do not get a picture. Do I need to set the Sony instead to 1080p and leave the Xbox at 1080i? Any help would be appreciated, as my guess is I am seeing King Kong demo at 1080i instead of 1080p.
I guess 1080i through component is all we can get

Lylepdx

11-14-06, 08:16 PM

Here is an article I believe posted by Microsoft about how to get the best picture from the HD-DVD drive. Surprisingly it recommends using the 1080I or P resolution even if you have a 720P display for the reasons I've highlighted. Unfortunately the VGA cable does not support 1080i and my projector does not support 1080P so I'm stuck with the 720P resolution, but that still is a terrific picture!
I also picked up one of those add on fans for the 360,Nyko Intercooler 360 (86020) . It's loud but has stopped the 360 from freezing up or stuttering.

"Xbox 360
Understanding HD DVD Resolutions
At A Glance
• Understand high-definition resolutions as they relate to HD DVD video playback.
With HD DVD players already on the market and the HD DVD accessory set to ship for Xbox 360™ this fall, it is more important than ever to understand how this hi-def thing works. How exactly do the movies you want to watch, the HD DVD player, and your HDTV all relate to each other?
Many questions and much confusion surround which resolution and frame rate are best suited for viewing HD DVDs, but this basic primer should at least give you a proper understanding of the situation as it relates to you, the viewer.
Film First
Unlike games or television programs, movies are filmed at 24 frames per second (FPS), including digital movies. For example, the special digital cameras used to film Star Wars Episodes II and III were built to utilize a standard 24 FPS rate.

Standing alone, in all its glory.
Native Resolution
HD DVD discs contain the movie as it was meant to be viewed, maintaining the original FPS in which they were filmed. As such, the film can be shown on your TV or monitor in what is referred to as its 'native' format. It is when this image is transmitted from the player, and then received, translated, and projected onto your screen that the different resolutions begin to get involved.
1080i-30 Resolution
First of all, the "i" at the end of the 1080 stands for interlace, and it's important to understand what that means. Imagine the following:
• Take a picture and cut it into 1080 lines, with each line being numbered.
• The first thing you do, is to draw all the even numbered lines on the screen. The collection of all the even-numbered lines is called a "field".
• In the next sixtieth of a second, you then go back to the top and draw all the odd-numbered lines. This is the second field.
• Two fields make one frame, so the process has to happen twice as fast as the number of frames shown per second.
• Repeat the process indefinitely and you'll understand exactly how your TV handles projecting a 1080 interlace image.
Historically, interlacing was first used in TV signals because CRT displays built in the 1940s could simply not work fast enough to draw every line in one-sixtieth of a second.
Understanding exactly what each resolution
means to your HD DVD experience
is an important foundation to have.
This technique—while still maintaining a great picture—creates problems because of the frame rate conversion.
3:2 Pulldown
The number 30 after 1080i reflects the number of frames being shown per second. Note that this doesn't match the 24 FPS your movies are being filmed in. This signal format causes the film to be transferred to your display in an artificial sequence as the DVD player needs to translate a 24 FPS source into a 30 FPS video signal. This process is called "3:2 pulldown," which repeats 12 fields of the 24 FPS source to generate a 30 FPS signal. Pulldown causes an odd "judder" movement in the image as it shows one frame for two fields, then three fields for the next frame, and so on and so forth.
No actual information is lost—the entire normal film frame is still present, it has just been transferred to the display with 12 repeated fields. A modern display can remove those 12 fields and recover the original 24 FPS signal. In other words, with a proper display, a 1080i picture will look identical to a 1080p picture when you begin with film material source like that from HD DVD.

The hottest team in video entertainment.
Incidentally, the 1080i input resolution is one you find on all HDTVs, and it is the most common HD broadcast format. For example, if you watch a movie or show broadcast in HD, it's usually presented in 1080i30. Look for the HD logo at the beginning of the show to be sure.
1080p-60 Resolution
The "p" at the end of 1080 stands for progressive, and the distinction between it and an interlaced image is important to understand, if only to know that it makes little difference to films on HD DVD that start at 24 frames per second.
Instead of capturing only half the lines at a time, like an interlace image, a progressive image captures the whole picture—all 1080 lines—at once. This allows for a much sharper image, because all pixels are present in every frame. This 60p signal can be beneficial to a display, but only when starting with something filmed in 60p. Film material, which is shot in 24p, will not show any advantage on a modern display.
A modern display can perform an operation on the video called "inverse telecine" or "inverse 3:2 pulldown." It recognizes and removes the 12 extra fields, reassembles the remaining 48 fields into the original 24 frames, and then repeats those frames at whatever frequency the display selects (60 Hz, 72 Hz, etc.).
However, there is still a problem if a display updates at 60 FPS because it doesn't match the native 24 FPS of film—a 60 Hz refresh in the display will produce "judder" just as a 1080p-60 interconnect signal does because it also employs the 3:2 pulldown technique by showing two copies of the first frame, three copies of the next, etc.
1080p-24 Resolution
Here we have the optimum resolution, so it's valuable to note just how it works. Though called 1080p-24, it is typically displayed at 1080p-72 since this frame rate takes the 24 FPS native to the film and the HD DVD and shows each frame three times. Incidentally, this is also how most theatre projectors work using three-bladed shutters.
This resolution is progressive so you don't have to worry about visual artifacts appearing, and because 72 is a multiple of 24, you also don't have to worry about 3:2 pulldown causing an unnatural judder in movement. This is therefore the ideal framerate to display movies. PC playback can typically provide this frame rate, but today very few displays support this, though we expect to see more in the near future.
If you have a 720p TV, a 1080i30 or 1080p24 input is also optimal because the display can use the original 1080P images to resample to its display resolution (usually something like 768 lines, not 720), and repeat those frames at one of its available refresh rates (most often 60Hz). Internal scalers and filters in the display can do the best job of downscaling from 1080 to native resolution while matching the characteristics of the particular display technology.
When the input arrives as 24p or 30i with 3:2, the display knows the actual capture rate was 24p and can refresh frames accordingly. If it gets a 720p60 signal, it is less likely to detect that it was a 24p film that was somehow format converted, and probably won't be able to restore it to 24P before processing it for display.
Since HD DVD is stored on the disc at the natural frame rate of 24 frames per second, it can be displayed at any of these rates (1080i30, 1080p60, 1080p24). As you upgrade your HD display, you can take full advantage of your new display with all the HD DVDs in your collection. [I]
There is no doubt that HD DVD will provide a significantly better viewing experience over standard DVDs, but understanding exactly what resolution means to your HD DVD experience can help you cut through the nonsense.
Article by Ryan Treit"

milkham

11-14-06, 08:27 PM

I've got a question about using the xbox360 hd-dvd drive and vga cable on a 42" plasma. Do any of you guys have your setup with a vga cable on a 1024x768 resolution plasma? how do you reconcile the non wide screen resolution? I've tried connecting a computer to the vga and i get a 4:3 display with black bars on the side. What resolution would you set on the xbox?

Aetherhole

11-14-06, 08:50 PM

okay is anyone else having this problem...

I've been searching for answers on this but can't find much information on it...

So when I have the default Dolby Digital Plus track selected the dynamic range is a lot worse than even that of even normal DVDs. Like when loud parts of the movie occur, it isn't really much louder than the normal speaking. Like it's pretty nocticeable.

This is JUST for the Dolby Digital Plus audio portion. If I choose Dolby TrueHD it works perfectly fine and it sounds a lot more robust and the dynamic range is incredibly broader than the DD+. But, like I said, the DD+ track (for example Tokyo Drift) is very limited even compared to the DD portion on the regular DVD side of the disk.

I never had that problem with the Toshiba HD-A1 and it seems only specific to the HD-DVD Add-on... and like I said before, just for DD+ and not Dolby TrueHD...

Anyone?!?

grant7311

11-14-06, 09:10 PM

I have not updated my Xbox 360 with any new releases from MS since I bought it last year. I just bought the HD DVD add-on and loaded the HD software which came with it. Do I need to update my Xbox 360 with the latest release from MS or was it included with the HD DVD software release?

ryoohki

11-14-06, 09:19 PM

pernar

11-14-06, 09:23 PM

It's not surprising that some are seeing some relatively minor issues with the software, being version 1.0 and all. I would expect the 360's next update to have a WHOLE lot of work done for the HD-DVD player.

Personally, I'm blown away with the 1.0 product, and can't wait to see how they improve the software over time.

wuffzack

11-14-06, 09:35 PM

Yeah as far as upconverting DVD's it will upconvert to 720p already over the VGA output, and it looks really good.
It does for NTSC DVDs, yes. But for PAL DVDs it is horrible, because the VGA output will remain at 60 Hz refresh rate - it will not drop down to 50 Hz.

amirm

11-14-06, 09:42 PM

Reem

11-14-06, 09:49 PM

sorry guys, I will travel to JP later this month. I may buy the HD DVD add-on from there
(the place I am living have no release schedule for this unit)

So, I would like to ask:
1. the voltage of power suppy. is it 100~220v?
2. any regional lock for the unit?

I'd like to know this too. What voltage can the drive handle? Can someone please look at the specs on his unit.

Oops, I see this just got answered while I was typing this post, thanks.

Reem

11-14-06, 10:00 PM

It does for NTSC DVDs, yes. But for PAL DVDs it is horrible, because the VGA output will remain at 60 Hz refresh rate - it will not drop down to 50 Hz.

So is this something Microsoft should update to make it work better or is it just a difference that will exist between American en European models of this hd-dvd drive?

If American models only do 60Hz and European 50Hz that is kind of a region coding because it makes imported discs useless (/unpleasant to watch), right?

yipchunyu

11-14-06, 10:09 PM

Yes.

No region lock on the drive.

Thx a lot. Will look for it during my trip to JP.

Yumbo

11-14-06, 10:18 PM

"input 100-240v - 47-63Hz 0.7 A max

output 12 V 2.5A"

Reem

11-14-06, 10:23 PM

So is this something Microsoft should update to make it work better or is it just a difference that will exist between American en European models of this hd-dvd drive?

If American models only do 60Hz and European 50Hz that is kind of a region coding because it makes imported discs useless (/unpleasant to watch), right?

To quote myself, I now see in the recent 1080p update from Microsoft that they also added this:

-Xbox 360 will support 50hz HDTV display modes, providing viewers greater choice in how they watch DVD and HD DVD content.

So wuffzack, did you have this update installed when you tested PAL dvd's?

Can someone confirm my thoughts that this means the HD-dvd drive sold in America can be used in Europe with no problems?

wuffzack

11-14-06, 10:50 PM

-Xbox 360 will support 50hz HDTV display modes, providing viewers greater choice in how they watch DVD and HD DVD content.

So wuffzack, did you have this update installed when you tested PAL dvd's?

Yes. The problem is, that this update only affects the component output. But the component output cannot be used to upscale DVDs, only the VGA output can. But the VGA output seems to be fixed at 60Hz (understandable, as a lot of VGA displays won't work with 50Hz).
As a result, the DVD upscaling of the XBOX360 is not usable on PAL DVDs.

A related problem with NTSC DVDs: They look great when using VGA output, but horrible using component (I have a European "PAL" unit), because the Component output always runs at 50 Hz when playing back DVDs, even NTSC!

wuffzack

11-14-06, 10:53 PM

No region lock on the drive.
Does this include standard DVD playback?

vanilla rice

11-14-06, 10:56 PM

anyone with Xbox Live will find the installation super-easy. i didn't even touch the install disc; i connected up everything, popped in Batman Begins, the drive read the disc and asked for an update on Live. i said yes, it updated in about 10 seconds, then played the movie - i didn't even need to reset.

efjay

11-14-06, 10:56 PM

amirm, can you comment on the sound issues described in this thread?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=749463

Thanks

Juiced

11-14-06, 10:58 PM

I have the samsung 61" 1080p DLP TV and I am planning to get one of these HD-DVD Players for my 360. One of my friends says that the component cables that my xbox came with didnt output true 1080p with the hd-dvd player and that I needed VGA Cables to output true 1080p? Is this true? I dont think my TV even HAS a VGA Input

protovision

11-14-06, 11:33 PM

I also picked up one of those add on fans for the 360,Nyko Intercooler 360 (86020) . It's loud but has stopped the 360 from freezing up or stuttering.

You might want to rethink that cooler purchase:

http://kotaku.com/gaming/nyko/intercoolers-cruel-irony-214213.php

of course, YMMV.

protovision

nitro1max1

11-14-06, 11:45 PM

Could someone tell me were I could get the 40 coupon from CC? Thanks

yipchunyu

11-15-06, 12:53 AM

Yes.

No region lock on the drive.

forgot to ask, I read some info about the subtitle can be dl to HD DVD players. Is it ok for the xbox's HD DVD ROM?
e.g. with no region lock, it can play disk from other zone e.g. Japan. But, can I dl subtitle (Chinese) from the internet?

kermit24

11-15-06, 01:23 AM

Has anyone used the Sony KDL-46XBR2 through VGA to watch HD DVD movies in 1080P on the 360? I have heard that the 1080P update to the 360 didn't support all TVs through VGA.

Anyone?

lymzy

11-15-06, 01:58 AM

Has anyone used the Sony KDL-46XBR2 through VGA to watch HD DVD movies in 1080P on the 360? I have heard that the 1080P update to the 360 didn't support all TVs through VGA.

Anyone?

It has nothing to do with 360 addon. Not all TV accept 1080p on VGA input.

kermit24

11-15-06, 02:01 AM

It has nothing to do with 360 addon. Not all TV accept 1080p on VGA input.

Does the Sony KDL46 XBR2 accept 1080P through VGA?

teknower

11-15-06, 02:49 AM

Does the Sony KDL46 XBR2 accept 1080P through VGA?
yes it does. but it does not work with the fall xbox 360 update. hopefully (suposedly) MS is workin on a fix... but as stated above this fix may only be for issues with component which would be useless with a 46xbr2 because it does not accept 1080p via component.

Clarence

11-15-06, 08:15 AM

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/support/systemsetup/xbox360/accessories/universalmediaremote.htm
The remote's Open/Close button will open and close the console's disc tray.

The Universal Media Remote works only with TVs, the Xbox 360 console, and a connected Microsoft Windows Media Center–based PC. It does not control VCRs, stand-alone DVRs and DVD players, or audio equipment.
So the OPEN/CLOSE buttons on the remote bundled with the HDDVD drive doesn't open/close the HDDVD drive :rolleyes:

And VOL on the remote won't control volume on a HT receiver, only a TV :rolleyes:

I tried the Pioneer codes and a quick scan. No Luck. If anyone has a remote code that can control the volume on a Pioneer VSX-816, please let me know.

Jigga Moog

11-15-06, 09:00 AM

1. Has anybody tried those cheap VGA to component adapters that are like $6 from monoprice. If so how is the picture quality compared to just component?

The reason is my HDTV does not have VGA but I would really like to upconvert my extensive DVD collection with the HD DVD drive.

2. Is the picture quality of a 720p,1080i SD DVD upconverted signal via VGA notecibly better then 480p SD DVD signal through component. Otherwise is it worth $40.

scotty144

11-15-06, 09:23 AM

yanksno1

11-15-06, 09:57 AM

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/support/systemsetup/xbox360/accessories/universalmediaremote.htm

So the OPEN/CLOSE buttons on the remote bundled with the HDDVD drive doesn't open/close the HDDVD drive :rolleyes:
I'm planning on setting up my Harmony remote control to use this drive and would like to assign the eject button to the hd-dvd drive. Is there anyway to do that, or like the bundled remote we're SOL? Hopefully MS/Harmony will update in the future.

timick1

11-15-06, 10:15 AM

I have the Harmony 880 and am hoping to assign an activity to control the HDDVD add-on (instead of using the Xbox remote).

PackFan

11-15-06, 11:26 AM

Do you see Microsoft allowing any way to get the new audio formats like TrueHD or DD+ eventually?

joe221

11-15-06, 11:29 AM

I have the Harmony 880 and am hoping to assign an activity to control the HDDVD add-on (instead of using the Xbox remote).

Just add Xbox 360 as your device. It has all the Media Center keystrokes already inside. You may want to do a little juggling, but they're all there. But no discrete HDDVD eject. :( On the other hand 30 sec skip and replay ARE there!
BTW those keys are the triggers on the joystick which is way cool!

Jigga Moog

11-15-06, 12:04 PM

Those adapters won't work...you would need something like this....

http://www.lenexpo-electronics.com/KEY-DIGITAL-VGA-TO-COMPONENT-VIDEO-CONVERTER-p-16308.html

WOW!!!! Those things are crazy expensive.Scratch that idea.

Jigga Moog

11-15-06, 12:06 PM

msu89dawgs

11-15-06, 12:10 PM

Do you see Microsoft allowing any way to get the new audio formats like TrueHD or DD+ eventually?

I wouldn't hold my breath for a multichannel analog audio output adapter, or HDMI, to appear. This is one of the main reasons I chose to go with a standalone player (HD-A1) vs. the 360 drive, as well as the upconversion of standard DVDs through the HDMI output on the Toshiba. I doubt there would be enough interest in the enhanced audio from the masses for MS to include the necessary audio outputs. I think the HD DVD drive serves its purpose as a low-cost alternative for those who already own a 360, but the low cost nets you a low feature set as well. You get what you pay for, as the old saying goes....

analog8

11-15-06, 12:26 PM

FWIW, I received the Xbox 360 HD-DVD on launch day, and have watched King Kong and V for Vendetta with it. I'm viewing it at 1080i over component to a Fujitsu 5002 50 inch plasma (1366x768). Picture quality looks excellent to me, and certainly kicks my upscaling Panasonic S97 DVD player to the curb. I previously had Comcast HD and the HD-DVD is comparable if not better. The WAF is sky high for the price.

I thought the sound on King Kong was excellent. Am I imagining any improvement over standard Dolby 5.1? I thought HD-DVD was lossless compression for audio? My Yamaha receiver is a couple of years old and doesn't support anything fancy like TrueHD.

For my money, $199 is a great deal to get a hi-def player with a free movie. I will probably try and restrict myself to Netflix until the HD-DVD/Blu-ray war sorts itself out. Until then, the 360 is an ideal platform for HD content. I read that the HD-DVD drive also works with PC's which is an interesting development.

I should note I don't have HDMI on my plasma (thanks Fujitsu!) and I can only view my S97 upscaling DVD via a hack so there was no value in a standalone HD-DVD player for me. Also, the likely success of the Xbox HD-DVD will force huge pressure on the studios to keep image constraint via component switched off, which is an added bonus.

I think it is highly unlikely that MS will release a 360 HDMI cable despite the rumors. I've read a detailed analysis that shows the Xbox 360 does not have the silicon onboard to support HDMI, and there is no obvious way to do it via expansion. Anyone who has read the HDMI spec knows the licensing requirements are very tight. MS could of course do a v2 of the 360 but that is also unlikely IMHO.

I still haven't got the HD-DVD remote integrated with my new RTI T3 but the installer should be taking care of that tomorrow. :D

the3rdpower

11-15-06, 12:54 PM

I think there is a few but the one I know about is Pioneer's and it runs around 8K.

Yeah this is really sad. I found out the Samsung LN-S5296D LCD panel also does 1080p, works on VGA, and is optimized for the 360 out of the box :D

I would love plasma, however, for price, performance, the Samsung may be my option. I'd love to snag a Panny as well if they had it @ 50" 1080p :(

The Pioneer is probably the best, however, the price is obviously the worse. I'm going to see if I can see the Samsung & Pioneer in action today :D

the3rdpower

11-15-06, 12:55 PM

bill0527

11-15-06, 02:10 PM

I just got mine today and I'm having a big problem with it.

This is supposed to be my Christmas present from my wife and 2 year-old. The deal is, I can buy it now, but have to wait to open it at Christmas so that my 2 year old can see daddy opening presents. I was cool with that even though its hard to wait.

I ordered it from CircuitCity.com and it arrived today. My wife is at work and I'm at home all day, so guess what I did... yeah I opened it and hooked it up and planned on watching King Kong this afternoon, then repackaging it.

Well... this movie is unwatchable. Its stuttering very badly. I went to the scene selection menu and its moving very slowly, it takes forever to scroll between the scenes. If it was a game, I'd say its moving at about 2 fps.

So now what? I have no other movies to test it out and I can't just run out and buy one real quick.

bkilian

11-15-06, 02:23 PM

Vasim Pathan

11-15-06, 02:26 PM

Bill, are you using the USB cable that came with the drive? i have heard some cables were causing stuttering issues.

DecoyMilk

11-15-06, 02:27 PM

deadrody

11-15-06, 04:01 PM

im very sure there is a difference with a cable that costs $160 with one that costs $20 and its not just the size.
Oh definitely. It's called profit margin.

SolidSnake526

11-15-06, 04:21 PM

Oh definitely. It's called profit margin.
Haha come on, they aren't all created equally...
For example, MadCatz can't make a cable for their lives... :)
But I get what you mean, Monster is overpriced crap...I think we can all agree on that.

stanger89

11-15-06, 04:26 PM

Anybody try a "home made" HD DVD in the 360 yet?

I've burned two copies of the HD DVD test pattern disc (posted in the software forum) so far, but can't get it to work in my 360. I'm trying to figure out if it's the 360, or if it's a coaster.

Clarence

11-15-06, 05:00 PM

Anybody try a "home made" HD DVD in the 360 yet?Yep... several. Playback is fine.

Except the X360's HD-DVD ignores the MovieFactory's auto-repeat flag. The same disc repeats as intended when played in my HD-A1.

Instead of returning to the start, the X360 just shows a static image of the last scene.

The X360 also seems to hang if you put a chapter mark near the end of a clip.

Spooksta

11-15-06, 05:36 PM

I just got mine today and I'm having a big problem with it.

Try this m8. Its worked for someone on here already. So could be the problem.
Note that this method removes all software updates and cache files for all games, not just a specific title.

Go to the "System" section of the Xbox Dashboard
Select "Memory", and then press the A
Choose a the HDD or a memory unit but do not press A - press Y to view "Device Options" which shows two options, "Rename" and "Format".
Press X, X, LB, RB, X, X.
Once you do this a blade will pop up saying: "This will perform maintenance on your Xbox 360 storage devices. Do you want to continue?"
Choose yes to clear the cache and update files, or choose no to cancel

bbdivo

11-15-06, 06:00 PM

So the OPEN/CLOSE buttons on the remote bundled with the HDDVD drive doesn't open/close the HDDVD drive :rolleyes:

And VOL on the remote won't control volume on a HT receiver, only a TV :rolleyes:

I tried the Pioneer codes and a quick scan. No Luck. If anyone has a remote code that can control the volume on a Pioneer VSX-816, please let me know.

Is it not possible to teach the remote the codes? I've got my regular (microsoft) media center remote controlling my home theater volume control. (I'm not at home so can't play with the 360 remote! :( )

bbdivo

11-15-06, 06:02 PM

Sorry cant link to the AVSForums FAQ on Windows MCE, so copied and pasted this:

Q. How do you program the Windows MCE remote to control other equipment. like your TV or amplifier?
A. To program buttons on the remote control using the learning feature
1. Place the remote control for Media Center PC head to head (2 to 3 inches apart) with the remote from which it is learning.
2. On the remote control for Media Center PC, press and hold the DVD MENU and OK buttons at the same time until the remote control lights turn off (2 seconds).
3. On the remote control for Media Center PC, press and release the TV, VOL+, or VOL- button, depending on which command you want it to learn.
4. On the remote control that is teaching the command, press and hold the button that you want the corresponding button on the remote control for Media Center PC to learn.
The remote control for Media Center PC lights blink twice to confirm the selection.
If the remote did not learn the command, the lights blink quickly four times. To try again, repeat steps 1 through 4.
To restore the default remote control settings:
1. Press and hold the DVD MENU button and the LEFT navigation button at the same time until the remote control for Media Center PC lights turn off.
2. Press the OK button.
The remote control for Media Center PC lights blink twice to confirm that the buttons have been reset. The TV button will have no command assigned to it and the VOL+ and VOL- buttons will adjust the Media Center PC volume

Does this not work on the Universal Media Remote?

Clarence

11-15-06, 07:23 PM

Sorry cant link to the AVSForums FAQ on Windows MCE, so copied and pasted this:

Q. How do you program the Windows MCE remote to control other equipment. like your TV or amplifier?
A. To program buttons on the remote control using the learning feature
1. Place the remote control for Media Center PC head to head (2 to 3 inches apart) with the remote from which it is learning.
2. On the remote control for Media Center PC, press and hold the DVD MENU and OK buttons at the same time until the remote control lights turn off (2 seconds).
3. On the remote control for Media Center PC, press and release the TV, VOL+, or VOL- button, depending on which command you want it to learn.
4. On the remote control that is teaching the command, press and hold the button that you want the corresponding button on the remote control for Media Center PC to learn.
The remote control for Media Center PC lights blink twice to confirm the selection.
If the remote did not learn the command, the lights blink quickly four times.

Does this not work on the Universal Media Remote?

I tried it.

In step 2 (hold DVDMENU+OK), the lights only go out after the normal backlight time. I never get a double-blink success response or a 4-blink failure response.

But I do have the wireless remote that came with my MCE PC... I'll try that with the Xbox HD-DVD. It's on a shelf somewhere. I always just used a game controller to navigate through MCE.

Clarence

11-15-06, 07:35 PM

Well, my other remote was from an old MCE machine, not from MCE2005.

It isn't backlit and doesn't seem to be responding to DVDMENU+OK either.

t_tringle

11-15-06, 08:04 PM

Do you see Microsoft allowing any way to get the new audio formats like TrueHD or DD+ eventually?

There are supposedly a number of announcements that are going to be made by Microsoft on the 22nd.

Destructoid.com said they have a mole they trust that stated one of the announcements is that Microsoft is finally going to admit developing an HDMI adapter for the XBOX 360. If they are smart it will allow full 1080p over HDMI including outputting the uncompressed audio for the DD+ and TrueHD formats, along with the DTS HD audio formats as well.

This is all speculation mind you, but I highly doubt microsoft painted themselves into a corner and did not allow for a true digital output of audio and video from their "NEXT GEN" trojan horse. They took quite a while developing all of the options they have released over the past year, and so far they have done a pretty damn good job with XBox live, the media streaming, and now the HD-DVD addon. If they can get HDMI and future proof the HD-DVD format, they might just pull off a real coup in helping HD-DVD become the dominant format. Especially if it's as easy as it seems to add this HD-DVD add on to HTPC's.

TimT

Category 5

11-15-06, 08:04 PM

It does for NTSC DVDs, yes. But for PAL DVDs it is horrible, because the VGA output will remain at 60 Hz refresh rate - it will not drop down to 50 Hz.

Not sure what the problem is with your setup[, but PAL discs play better on my 360 than any other player I have tried. It gets rid of the motion artifacts and plays without jaggies. It upsamples beautifully over VGA. I suspect it is doing inverse telecine to the PAL material, and then reassembling it for NTSC. PAL DVDs look justr like NTSC DVDs on my setup.

bill0527

11-15-06, 08:18 PM

Thanks for the advice everyone posted above regarding my stuttering issue.

Turns out I've got a dud unit and I'm shipping it back to Circuit City tomorrow.

I cleared the cache and then put in a regular DVD - Star Wars Episode III and it played fine at first - the FBI warnings scrolled by and then the Star Wars title screen popped at the menu, faded in for about 5 seconds, then I heard a loud click. Then a bunch of red, blue,and green squiggly lines started running down my screen, then the unit powered itself off ... permanently.

Category 5

11-15-06, 08:22 PM

sid369

11-15-06, 08:53 PM

Guys,
Here is my dilemma. I don't have a HD DVD player nor do I have the Xbox 360. However I would lik eto have both of them. So since now the Xbox 360 has a HD DVD addon. What would you guys recommend. Buying the Xbox 360 with the addon or just buying the toshiba HD DVD player. I have heard some people saying that buying the Tosiba player is good since it is dedicated to only playing the HD DVD's and some people say that the XBox 360 addon player is comparable to the Toshiba player.

I am a student and I don't have a lot of money to afford both of them. When I compare the price the Xbox 360 and the addon will cost me somehwere around $560 and the Toshiba will cost me $400. But with the Xbox 360 I will also be able to play games and watcg Hd Dvd. So I am in a situation where I can't decide. So all you guys out there who own any one of these or both please help me decide.

Also I am novice to all the technical Jargons so if you would be able to answer in laymans terms that would be great

Cheers!!!

gotspeed6

11-15-06, 09:13 PM

My wife went shopping tonight to my surprise she brings home Batman returns, Ray and Training day all hdvd

LiftedTacoma

11-15-06, 09:29 PM

tofo17

11-15-06, 10:08 PM

stanger89

11-15-06, 11:04 PM

Got a link to that? Can't seem to find it.
Try this:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=707769&highlight=hd+dvd+test+patterns

trgraphics

11-15-06, 11:08 PM

I just brought one home and it's great!

I have two copies of Kong and compared the two with the xbox and the A1. The A1 is connected by HDMI to my receiver and the xbox is component into the Pioneer Elite but then converted to HDMI and then run into the Samsung HL-S5687.

I can't see any difference in the two at all. They both look exactly the same to my eyes. Even on upclose inspection of about 1 ft they look the same.

I'm going to run a few test with a test disk later to see how they measure up.

If they come out with HDMI for the audio, this will be one hell of a machine!

nataraj

11-15-06, 11:09 PM

Haha come on, they aren't all created equally...
For example, MadCatz can't make a cable for their lives... :)
But I get what you mean, Monster is overpriced crap...I think we can all agree on that.

They are not all created equally - but they all permorf the same (for smaller lengths). Afterall its all digital ...

stanger89

11-15-06, 11:09 PM

Spooksta

11-16-06, 12:37 AM

My wife went shopping tonight to my surprise she brings home Batman returns, Ray and Training day all hdvd

Is your wife forsale :) she sounds just my cup of tea (English saying :p )

oleus

11-16-06, 12:41 AM

BuGsArEtAsTy

11-16-06, 12:56 AM

Batman Begins + TrueHD track = noticeable loss of audio sync.

Damn. :(

trgraphics

11-16-06, 01:16 AM

thanks for the test! what resolution are you outputting the 360 at? what screen size?

1080i from the xbox. 56" Samsung HL-S5687 dlp. Normal seating distance is 7 ft.

AuroraProject

11-16-06, 01:28 AM

Batman Begins + TrueHD track = noticeable loss of audio sync.

Damn. :(

I picked up on that as well, it's the only disc I've had an issue with so far.

bill0527

11-16-06, 02:01 AM

That's no good mate, but you failed to tell us how you explained your early unpacking to the wife?! :)

I had to make a full confession :)

She wasn't upset. She actually thought it was a smart thing to do because had I waited until Christmas day to test it out, it would have been well past the return period at Circuit City and I would have had to ship it to Microsoft and wait 2-3 weeks to get a new one back.

BuGsArEtAsTy

11-16-06, 02:13 AM

I picked up on that as well, it's the only disc I've had an issue with so far.
What other discs with TrueHD do you have? Batman Begins is the only one I have with TrueHD, and that TrueHD track is where I really notice the lip sync issue.

Is it because the Xbox 360 can't keep up with the decode/encode for audio? Maybe I'm out to lunch, buy it seems to me that the audio is lagging, not the video.

If that's the case, as I understand it that would be the opposite of lip sync issues on other machines. I was under the impression that lip sync problems were usually related to internal image processing in TVs being too slow, so that the video lagged behind the audio. To correct this all you'd need is a delay circuit for the audio.

If indeed the audio is already lagging behind the video with the Xbox 360, then there's nothing you can really do about, unless Microsoft were to add a patch to delay the video (or reduce the audio lag).

Mind you I'm not 100% percent sure yet that it is the audio that is lagging. All I can say for sure in the brief testing I've done, is that the audio sync is somehow off with TrueHD.

Why do I care? It seems the mix with TrueHD when reencoded to DD sounds different than the DD+ reencoded to DD. Not sure if it's better, but it's definitely different and I'd like to compare the two. However, with the audio lag with TrueHD, it's too distracting to watch.

TMSKILZ

11-16-06, 03:32 AM

Order 2 for 2 buddies. 1 through Amazon.com & yesteray went to Circuit City & used the $40 off coupon & bought it there. Saved my friend $25 off the regular price after NYC taxes (NYC taxes hurt) :(

cubbiechris

11-16-06, 09:12 AM

My Wife bought mine at Circuit City with the coupon. They at first told her that the coupon isn't for gaming. She said no where on this coupon does it say that. The sales person said lets see if it scans, and sure enough it did. Got the HD-DVD for 160 bucks, plus King Kong. What a steal!

BTW - Kong on the Empire State building, with the sun rising, is prolly the most beautiful HD image I've ever seen....

Anyone else sound low?

mattbugz

11-16-06, 10:03 AM

Used the Circuit City coupon as well. I played King Kong and did a comparison with my Denon 3910. It's going to be difficult for me to watch another DVD again!!

I have Netflix and modified my account for HD-DVD. I can't wait for the selection to expand.

jthomaslambert

11-16-06, 10:41 AM

Mind you I'm not 100% percent sure yet that it is the audio that is lagging. All I can say for sure in the brief testing I've done, is that the audio sync is somehow off with TrueHD.

I saw it last night too (quite disappointed) and I think the audio is lagging. It's easier to tell in the fight scenes than in the talking scenes--the punches happen before the sound. It's not wildly off but it's definitely off.

DarkKnight2k4

11-16-06, 11:09 AM

May I ask, withouth HDMI or analog out, how are you getting TrueHD from the 360-HD ? That does not compute from my understand.

May this be the reason for your lip-sync issue ?

jthomaslambert

11-16-06, 11:12 AM

May I ask, withouth HDMI or analog out, how are you getting TrueHD from the 360-HD ? That does not compute from my understand.

May this be the reason for your lip-sync issue ?

A lot of people mistakenly think the 360 only supports Dolby Digital. In fact, the 360 can accept TrueHD as an input audio source (and virtually all other HD DVD audio formats). It then converts via software and outputs as Dolby Digital. You'll likely see better audio results from TrueHD than you will from DD+ because there's more information to work with during conversion. Check out this note from Microsoft.

http://blogs.msdn.com/xboxteam/archive/2006/11/03/emergence-day.aspx

DarkKnight2k4

11-16-06, 11:32 AM

But coverting via Dolby Digital is not True HD audio. The bitrate is reduced to allow for what the connection being used. Hence in my eyes some of the synch issues encountered.

The Toslink connection is not sufficient to carry such data. So it is not trueHD.

BuGsArEtAsTy

11-16-06, 11:45 AM

Somebody has reported the same TrueHD audio sync issue Xbox.com. (http://forums.xbox.com/8181232/ShowPost.aspx)
(I also started a thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=751752) on it in the AVS Xbox forum.)

I saw it last night too (quite disappointed) and I think the audio is lagging. It's easier to tell in the fight scenes than in the talking scenes--the punches happen before the sound. It's not wildly off but it's definitely off.
I confirmed it is indeed the audio lagging later, in the scene where he knocks on the door. The sound comes after the knock, not at the same time.

But coverting via Dolby Digital is not True HD audio. The bitrate is reduced to allow for what the connection being used. Hence in my eyes some of the synch issues encountered.

The Toslink connection is not sufficient to carry such data. So it is not trueHD.
Yes, we're aware of that, but nonetheless we can still select the track. Now why would we do that? Because it seems the mix, or at least the audio levels, is different. Is it better? I dunno, but it's different, and somebody might prefer the TrueHD transcoding.

However, it looks now like for many of us, TrueHD on the Xbox 360 is unusable. We'll stick to Dolby Digital Plus. Note that while there is not a significant sync issue from what I've seen with DD+, I still wonder if there may be a very slight sync issue there. It may not be big enough for most of us to hear consistently, but I wondered about that even before I tried the TrueHD track.

Any comments Amir?

bpmurr

11-16-06, 11:48 AM

I hooked my 360 HD DVD player up last night to my 46" Sharp Aquos last night via component. I watched King Kong and Blazing Saddles. They both looked great to me. Of course with Blazing Saddles being an old move there was a little trash now and then in the pic but it was very clear.

Ghent

11-16-06, 12:26 PM

Batman Begins + TrueHD track = noticeable loss of audio sync.(

Can you give more details on your setup please? We are trying to repro the problem.

Thanks

jthomaslambert

11-16-06, 12:36 PM

Can you give more details on your setup please? We are trying to repro the problem.

Thanks

I'm running the audio through my Denon receiver via toslink and my video directly to my Sony 1080i RP via component. Selecting TrueHD as the audio track gives me slight audio lag while selecting DD+ does not. I've only really tested the first scene (in the prison) before it started to irritate me so then I switched over to DD+.

BuGsArEtAsTy

11-16-06, 12:37 PM

Can you give more details on your setup please? We are trying to repro the problem.

Thanks
Details here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=751752) regarding my setup and the TrueHD audio sync (lag) issue.

Thanks.

efjay

11-16-06, 12:50 PM

Can you give more details on your setup please? We are trying to repro the problem.

Thanks

I have V4V, Batman and Constantine and will test tonight and post in the other thread.

Can you also look at this issue? http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=749463&page=1&pp=30

Thanks.

teknower

11-16-06, 03:19 PM

funny that the ad n this page is for true hd..... ;)

smokey982

11-16-06, 06:48 PM

I'm watching a 57" CRT RPT through component and it looks great. But I'm wondering if the upconverting of SD DVD is worth the $39.99 price tag for the VGA cable. Will I get that much of an improvement?

Arutha_conDoin

11-16-06, 07:19 PM

If I'm not mistaken you are still only getting Dolby Digital instead of DD+. I think the throughput is still to high on DD+ for the Toslink. I have the HD-A1 and only way to get DD+ or TrueHD you have to have either HDMI or use the Analog outputs. I to was confused at first since even if you use the Toslink it will show TrueHD or DD+ in the Display, but its still only DD. Once I went through the Analog I could hear the difference with TrueHD.

Frohlich

11-16-06, 07:50 PM

Well, count me as a happy new customer. I have done a couple of HD DVD demos at my local HT store (pretty nice one) and was not wowed by either the HD DVD or Blu Ray demo they had. It had me worried. My brother in Columbus said he loved his HD DVD (Toshiba unit) and to just get home a try it and that I could always return it if I was not hapy.

So i get the $160 deal with the Circuit City coupon and bring it home with fairly low expectations based on the demos I saw at the store. I was impressed, not blown away like when I first got the SXRD tv and watched hi def, but was nicer then I was expecting. Not planning on it being my long term solution for HD DVD/Blue ray, but plenty to keep me happy for a while.

The biggest draw back to me is not the picture quality or sound but the ease of use for the rest of my family. A little bit of a hassle to turn on the XBOX 360 and go to the menu and tell it activate the HD DVD player (I have two younger kids and wife who probably will need detail instruction on how to use it correctly).