Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner [Text View] - Page 12

k2500x

04-13-08, 09:40 AM

Check the Binghamton thread in the local reception forum anyway. That forum isn't just for OTA, it also discusses local cable and satellite issues. Most of the discussion on my two nearest "local" forums is about cable and satellite.

If you know the actual physical channel number, you can scan it directly by entering that number, even if the unit hasn't found it in a channel scan yet. If the unit finds a usable signal, it extracts the virtual channel number, stores it in the channel list, and changes the on-screen display to reflect it. I use this technique for scanning in OTA channels that the initial channel scan doesn't pick up because my antenna wasn't aimed quite right.

However, to be able to do this, you have to know the physical channel number, which is almost always not the familiar analog channel number for OTA stations, nor the channel number that you enter on a digital cable box.

When I try to enter a station in CABLE mode, it doesn't even try to tune that channel. It just either says on the current channel, or jumps to the nearest one that it found during the autoscan.

nandoal28

04-13-08, 04:34 PM

Newbie to OTA question Hook up advice

I bought this

HD reciever: Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner

TV: Samsung 19" LCD HDTV Model #: SAM LNT1953H

Antenna: Radio Shack Amplified VHF/UHF/FM Indoor Antenna Model: 15-1878

Cable from spliced wire. No box.

TIVO series 2 also in the mix

I hooked everything up (HDMI) from the diagram in the manual. I get very few HD stations. But I don't think the HD reciever is helping with anything. How should there all be hooked up to take advantage of the Samsung HD box?

Can anyone offer me any set-up HELP?

jtbell

04-13-08, 05:53 PM

First let's get an idea of how many digital stations you can realistically expect to get with an indoor antenna. Go to tvfool.com, enter your address and get a table showing your stations and information about the signal they produce at your location. It's an image in PNG format. Save it to your computer, then attach it to a posting (use the Manage Attachments button in the posting window).

jeff2631

04-13-08, 06:03 PM

The Samsung 19" LCD HDTV Model #: SAM LNT1953H has a built-in tuner for NTSC, ATSC, and QAM. You can use the Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner as a second tuner for picture-in-picture.

nandoal28

04-13-08, 07:53 PM

sofunkingcool

04-13-08, 11:35 PM

Rammitinski

04-14-08, 12:49 AM

Is there any way I could get this thing to recieve analog stations? some of our stations are not all digital and may not be for a while (canadian) I have pretty good signal but a little dissapointed I can't get everything. Does your TV have an analog tuner? Just hook a coax to the RF out on the Samsung tuner to your RF TV's input. The Sammy will pass the antenna signal through and you can just switch inputs to the TV's NTSC tuner and use that for the analogs.

It's best to leave the Samsung turned on, because when it's off it will attenuate the signal some.

dbsc

04-14-08, 01:36 AM

Is there any way I could get this thing to recieve analog stations?

Rammitinski meant "no". The 260 is digital only, either ATSC from an antenna or unencrypted QAM from cable. There is no NTSC (analog) tuner in it.

Rammitinski

04-14-08, 01:54 AM

Rammitinski meant "no"."No - but...", actually. :)

nandoal28

04-14-08, 07:18 AM

107442

I am very close to two of those. NBC and CBS.

My question is Do I really NEED the Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner? What will the tuner give me that I can't already get just with an antenna and TV?

How do I hoook it up? What goes where?

toby10

04-14-08, 07:43 AM

My question is Do I really NEED the Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner? What will the tuner give me that I can't already get just with an antenna and TV?

How do I hoook it up? What goes where?

TV Hookup = HDMI or Component from H260f to TV

If all you want is OTA HD and you have an ATSC tuner in your tv then you do not "need" it. But there are other advantages to having a STB Digital HD tuner, if you need/desire these benefits:

- Some TV's do not have any tuners (like HD Monitors)
- Better OTA reception (varies)
- Selectable Resolution Output to better match TV's native resolution
- QAM tuner
- SD output to DVR
- Digital Audio (surround DD 5.1 & PLII) to your AVR
- TV lacking digital audio output to AVR (surround)
- STB location convenience: if your tv and AV gear are not right next to each other then (even if your TV has digital audio output) it may not be easy to run audio back to your AVR from your TV. This comes in very handy if your AV gear is on one wall and your TV is on another wall. All AV inputs (cable, sat, OTA, DVD player, VCR, DVR, etc...) can all be connected to a single AVR then run ONE set of cables to TV (component or HDMI). :)

sparky109

04-14-08, 12:16 PM

toby10

04-14-08, 05:11 PM

I know this would be the wrong thread to mention this but if you want, check out the Winegard RC-1010 at

http://www.winegard.com/mobile/dig_receiver.htm

I use a Winegard antenna for my OTA feed and I always here good things about their products.

But for only $20 less this Winegard is lacking HDMI output, QAM, and coax pass through compared to the H260f.

jjeff

04-15-08, 04:30 PM

I'm receiving OTA signal with rooftop antenna and i split the signal between my DTBH260F upstairs powering a 50in 720 tv and an old analog downstair with the wal-mart $49 magnovox converter box. I've found the magnovox tuner to hold the chanels much better than the samsung which drops some of them out every few minutes. the magnovox also picks up more channels. I'm actually thinking of switching the boxes out but that would give me 480i where i'm capable of 720. Does anyone know of another box that perhaps has the same tuner the mag does but was capable of hdtv out? I'm very disappointed in the samsung.
Have you tried physically swapping the Sammy and your Mag? The reason I ask is because maybe the reception differences lie in the cable going to each device. If you actually swapped the 2 boxes you'd know for sure if it was the boxes or maybe cabling. I believe the Sammy is supposed to have a good tuner so I'd be suprised that a CECB would have a better one, but I guess it could:confused:

sparky109

04-15-08, 09:01 PM

Yes, i ended up swapping the sammy out. Amazingly, the tuner is better in the new mag converter box. I'm now using the composite cables with it with a pretty nice picture.

Rammitinski

04-15-08, 09:14 PM

Wow. Something can't be right here.

dbsc

04-15-08, 09:51 PM

Wow. Something can't be right here.

The 260 is getting long in the tooth. Also the CECBs probably have newer gen chips in them and the reception requirements for them are pretty strict.

Davinleeds

04-15-08, 10:13 PM

Is the better research ending up in the analog boxes?

I have the same attitude, sparky109 about the sammy after more than two years of use.

dbsc

04-15-08, 10:48 PM

Is the better research ending up in the analog boxes?

When was the last known revision of the 260? I think it's been a while. There was rumor of a successor to the 260 earlier in the thread, it's pretty obvious it's vapor though.

It's not "better research" so much as "newer technology". The CECBs were and currently are getting cobbled together by a bunch of manufacturers who didn't make them ahead of time. They claim it was because retailers weren't ordering them. Whatever the reason they've been caught with their pants down and are scrambling to get product out, that product has newer hardware than the 260 does.

One thing I'd sure like to know is if someone with a steady hand could use a CECB with a compatible chip to "upgrade" the 260. The (probably) only reason the CECBs don't output HD is the peripheral hardware inside the box isn't there to do so. The chips inside are capable of it.

Whidbey

04-16-08, 02:12 PM

Yes, i ended up swapping the sammy out. Amazingly, the tuner is better in the new mag converter box. I'm now using the composite cables with it with a pretty nice picture.

Wow. Something can't be right here.

I have both the Insignia and Sammy and notice now difference in the picture break-ups when it comes to reception. With a weak signal, both break up at the same time, I use PIP to watch both. However, the signal meters showed different levels. The Sammy could display a picture with "1/10", but the Insignia signal bar displayed 1/3 signal. Anything less than 1/3 and the Insignia would not show the picture. So, when comparing the two, the Insignia can appear to have a more sensitive tuner, when in reality it's just that the signal meter follows a different curve.

smintn

04-16-08, 07:24 PM

So, when comparing the two, the Insignia can appear to have a more sensitive tuner, when in reality it's just that the signal meter follows a different curve.

I had one of these Samsung tuners and took it back because on some stations it did not "believe it or not" pickup as well as My Hisense DB-2010. I was disapointed in it.

I also tried one of the Samsung DVD-AR650 the tuner was ok but the epg record got to where you couldn't see if it was set to record or not.....It recorded well but I took it back

Now have a Panasonic DMR-EZ27 the first one I had was very flaky with error U99,Took it back got another It has worked well ever since I upgraded the firmware

I also have a Magnavox ZV450MW8A DVD/VCR RECORDER the tuner is as good as the pany and channel changing is very quick I like the magnavox better than any of the other tuners(except for the Hisense)

COEX-Pilot

04-17-08, 09:56 AM

I had one of these Samsung tuners and took it back because on some stations it did not "believe it or not" pickup as well as My Hisense DB-2010. I was disapointed in it.

I also have a Magnavox ZV450MW8A DVD/VCR RECORDER the tuner is as good as the pany and channel changing is very quick I like the magnavox better than any of the other tuners(except for the Hisense)

That is an interesting observation. My experience is exactly the opposite! With the 2010 I suffered a lot of problems with stable reception except for a few channels. With the Sammy, it's rock stable and has found additional channels the 2010 did not.

Always someone who will have different experiences with a given setup!

Rammitinski

04-18-08, 04:20 AM

I also found the H260F to be a lot better than the 2010 as far as both sensitivity and multipath. In fact my Accurian, Sony and Pioneer 4th gen. tuners all pick up more channels. The one I had in a Panny 600u plasma last year sucked compared to all of them. I didn't even use it, it was so worthless. It was like it was a total afterthought in the display.

The one I had in the latest Magnavox HDD/DVD recorder was about equal to to my best 4th gen. boxes, and the one in the Philips DVDR-3575H was about as good as the H260F's, but I believe it was also slightly amped.

PQ-wise though, there are not too many boxes that can beat the 2010. And the zoom function has to be the best I've ever seen. As far as PQ, only my Sony DVR rivals it. I hear the LG HD tuners are right up there, too.

seatacboy

04-29-08, 09:12 AM

Samsung showed their new ATSC tuner.... Short general overview of the H260F at the Consumer Reports Blog (http://blogs.consumerreports.org/electronics/2008/03/a-high-def-box.html). At $170, the Samsung isn't cheap, and it's not eligible for the coupon program. But it will get you free HD, with great picture quality. In our tests, picture quality for both 720p and 1080i HD signals we pulled in via a rooftop antenna was excellent, rivaling if not surpassing what we've seen with the typical cable feed.

PinkSplice

05-02-08, 01:53 AM

dbsc

05-02-08, 03:54 AM

The only reason for the 260 is to drive a monitor. And that need will decrease quite rapidly.

You're only looking at it from your own point of view which I'm certain is 100% correct - for you. The 260 also does clear QAM remember, not to mention being able to tune and pass 480p/720p/1080i whereas the CECBs downconvert by design and mandate to 480i. The CECBs are pretty limited by design to make sure they don't fit in to the same category as the 260.

I've said it before, what I really want to know is if a CECB can be harvested for a newer gen chip to retrofit a 260. Anyone?

toby10

05-02-08, 05:47 AM

With the advent of CECB's the market for the Samsung 260 is getting a lot smaller. If you are a TV DX'r like me, the $200 is better spent towards a new HDTV set, since the CECB's have better receivers for DX. The only reason for the 260 is to drive a monitor. And that need will decrease quite rapidly.

CECB's and H260f's are two completely different boxes designed for two completely different markets. It would be similar to comparing std. def. DVD's to Blu-ray/HD-DVD, not even in the same ball park. ;)

bcarlsen

05-02-08, 08:58 AM

With the advent of CECB's the market for the Samsung 260 is getting a lot smaller. If you are a TV DX'r like me, the $200 is better spent towards a new HDTV set, since the CECB's have better receivers for DX. The only reason for the 260 is to drive a monitor. And that need will decrease quite rapidly.

Don't forget home theater projectors. HD projector prices have been coming way down and they have no tuners.

rchris

05-02-08, 08:04 PM

Don't forget home theater projectors. HD projector prices have been coming way down and they have no tuners.

Exactly. I'm currently torn between the H260 for my HD projector which would pass through true HDTV, or a DVDR with digital tuner which has the convenience of the DVD player/recorder, but downscales the HD signal (and then upconverts, I think, to a lesser-quality picture). :confused:

Rammitinski

05-03-08, 12:49 AM

Why don't you get the H260F AND a tunerless DVD recorder? That way you can at least watch live in HD. (The Toshiba's are inexpensive.)

jjeff

05-03-08, 09:01 AM

Ramm's idea is good, but if you do decide to go the DVDR w/tuner route I'd suggest the panasonic EZ-28. It's $229 at BB, $208 if you can find a 10% off coupon. In my case anyway 720p broadcasts look basically the same as my HD tuner built into my 32" LCD. 1080i broadcasts aren't as good as the true HD tuner though.
I didn't have nearly as good PQ on either 720p or 1080i broadcasts with a Philips DVDR though. Can't specifically comment on other brands since I havent't tried any others. I can also say the 2 CECB's that I've tried were similar to the Philips but not nearly as good as the Panny on HD sources of either resolution. You can't go wrong with the Sammy 260 for true HD, I'm just trying to give you some other alternatives.

rchris

05-03-08, 10:43 AM

Why don't you get the H260F AND a tunerless DVD recorder? That way you can at least watch live in HD. (The Toshiba's are inexpensive.)

That's probably the option I'll eventually pursue. My hesitation is because I have an old AV receiver in the mix with limited connections and also limited space for components. But, hey, a great excuse to upgrade, right?!

And, thanks jjef, I have recently been looking hard at the EZ-28 option. That would be a good compromise and cheaper than upgrading right now.

louie826

05-06-08, 12:48 PM

I just bought this box yesterday to replace the glitchy SIR-T451 that I suffered with for a year for a big-screen HD monitor with no HD tuner.

Everything about the H260F works great. The T451 had visual glitches every other second when I used it as a QAM tuner. The H260F displayed everything perfectly from the same cable line.

I ran into two odd problems. First, I think the unit that I bought was used but marked as new. There were channels already saved on the unit and no manuel was in the box. Everything worked fine, so I got lucky with that.

Second, no video over composite. :confused: I don't know if it was the small TV I tested it with or some video setting that I didn't catch that caused the video to not show up. I double checked to see that it was set to 480i and tried both composite outputs, yet the picture was still all black. Everything looks great over component 1080i on the big screen, so the composite problem is no big deal for now. I'll test is again later to see what's going on.

Does anyone know why nothing would display over composite 480i?

foxeng

05-06-08, 01:06 PM

Does anyone know why nothing would display over composite 480i?

You only get the menu through the component connection. If I had one complaint about the box, this would be it.

toby10

05-06-08, 01:14 PM

.........Second, no video over composite. :confused: I don't know if it was the small TV I tested it with or some video setting that I didn't catch that caused the video to not show up. I double checked to see that it was set to 480i and tried both composite outputs, yet the picture was still all black. Everything looks great over component 1080i on the big screen, so the composite problem is no big deal for now. I'll test is again later to see what's going on.

Does anyone know why nothing would display over composite 480i?

You shouldn't have to switch to 480i to get video output via analog (composite or s-video) as the H260f already downconverts it to analog.

Try temporarily disconnecting you component video out and see if composite then works. Are you connecting to two different tv's?

louie826

05-06-08, 02:43 PM

I just did some more tests with composite.

Just like I suspected, it was the small TV that didn't like the composite signal for whatever reason. Maybe I did hook it up wrong somehow. :p It showed up just fine on composite on the big screen.

You shouldn't have to switch to 480i to get video output via analog (composite or s-video) as the H260f already downconverts it to analog.I didn't know that until now. :cool: The composite picture was the same on all 4 resolution settings.

Now another little problem appeared. If I slide the resolution switch to 480i, the composite picture will look okay, but the component picture will be all blue and violet. :eek: This doesn't happen on 480p, 720p, or 1080i, as the component picture for those resolutions are perfect. I'll just ignore that 480i problem and keep it at 1080i.

Maybe this problem is somehow related to some people getting blue/violet picture over HDMI?

jigwatts

05-06-08, 02:48 PM

Sorry if this has been covered before, but my eyes can't handle reading through 94 pages in trying to find an answer.

Although the DTB-H260F manual says you can, I can't figure out how to add channels after I scanned. Is this even possible?:confused:

I live near Youngstown, OH, and can receive channels from Pittsburgh to Cleveland. Only problem is I have to re-scan every time I move the antenna in opposite directions.:mad:

Also, while I'm here, can you use direct tv with this?

toby10

05-06-08, 02:52 PM

I just did some more tests with composite.

Just like I suspected, it was the small TV that didn't like the composite signal for whatever reason. Maybe I did hook it up wrong somehow. :p It showed up just fine on composite on the big screen.

I didn't know that until now. :cool: The composite picture was the same on all 4 resolution settings.

Now another little problem appeared. If I slide the resolution switch to 480i, the composite picture will look okay, but the component picture will be all blue and violet. :eek: This doesn't happen on 480p, 720p, or 1080i, as the component picture for those resolutions are perfect. I'll just ignore that 480i problem and keep it at 1080i.

Maybe this problem is somehow related to some people getting blue/violet picture over HDMI?

So you are running two seperate TV's off of the one H260f, correct?

Can both TV's be displaying video from the H260f at the same time?

I dunno about the HDMI blue issue.

Scooper

05-06-08, 02:58 PM

louie826

05-06-08, 04:14 PM

So you are running two seperate TV's off of the one H260f, correct?

No no. After I bought it, I tested it out on the small TV in my bedroom to see if there were any glitching problems like the old box had. After that, I moved the box to the living room with the big screen. Sorry for the confusion.

jigwatts

05-06-08, 05:00 PM

TO add channels on the 260F - use the RF (real) channel number. If there's an ATSC signal there that it can pickup - you're golden.

No on the direct TV. This box is strictly ATSC / Clear QAM only.

Thank you, I'll give it a try when I get home.

dattier

05-06-08, 05:07 PM

To add channels on the 260F - use the RF (real) channel number. If there's an ATSC signal there that it can pickup - you're golden.

What happens if a different channel, already known to the H260F, is using that same number as its virtual channel? How can you add the other channel then?

Rammitinski

05-06-08, 07:50 PM

What happens if a different channel, already known to the H260F, is using that same number as its virtual channel?* How can you add the other channel then?Then you'll have to re-scan.

I have never been able to add over an existing channel number - maybe someone else has - but as far as I know it won't work.

Davinleeds

05-06-08, 08:12 PM

What happens if a different channel, already known to the H260F, is using that same number as its virtual channel? How can you add the other channel then?

That's confusing. Delete then add. In my area, FoX transmits analog 23 and their digital assignment is 23, they can't transmit digital till the changeover. ABC is using 46 until Feb 09 when they return to current analog 8 for digital.

dbsc

05-06-08, 10:22 PM

What happens if a different channel, already known to the H260F, is using that same number as its virtual channel?* How can you add the other channel then?

If your channels are that messed up your best bet might be to tune them all yourself, don't autoscan at all. Figure out which channels you have to tune via RF # first, say RF 33 is sending out PSIP 30, but RF 30 is already occupied by PSIP 25, you'd have to tune in RF 30 first then RF 33 to get both channels in your channel list.

If you want to clear your channel info first just unhook the antenna and autoscan, should come up with nothing.

It sounds like a pain but it's really not that bad. I don't have overlapping stations like that but every couple weeks or so I go over my list of all the channels that my area even *might* get by tuning their RF channel numbers to see what comes in. They've slowly been lighting up -- I've got 11 channels right now.

dattier

05-06-08, 10:51 PM

If your channels are that messed upThey will be after 2009-02-17, but not as badly as some other parts of the country, from what I've read here. We'll have only two such conflicts in Chicago. Two stations that I don't watch except to check for reception will have physical channels that are in use as virtual channels by two other local stations, one of which I likewise watch only to check on reception.
... your best bet might be to tune them all yourself, don't autoscan at all. Figure out which channels you have to tune via RF # first, say RF 33 is sending out PSIP 30, but RF 30 is already occupied by PSIP 25, you'd have to tune in RF 30 first then RF 33 to get both channels in your channel list.

If you want to clear your channel info first just unhook the antenna and autoscan, should come up with nothing.

It sounds like a pain but it's really not that bad.No, it doesn't sound like much of a pain at all, though it would be confusing to someone who doesn't understand exactly what's in conflict. For me actually doing it will be much easier than explaining it to other people.

dsehulster

05-07-08, 07:27 AM

I am new a member here at AVS. I recently purchase the Samsung unit and hooked it up to my Fujitsu Plasmavision using HDMI to DVI. Except for the overly saturated blacks through HDMI, the unit is a vast improvement over the 1st Gen. RCA DTC-100 that I pulled from the trash 5 months ago. :rolleyes:

Anyway, my modus operandi is to improve things and I do that with every component I purchase for my home system; that is, replace cheap internal components (i.e. capacitors, diodes, etc...) with higher quality and better performing ones. My sights have now turned to the Samsung DTB-H260F and the only thing that I can find "moddable" is the power supply as the video board is populated with surface mount components which are difficult to replace. Basically, I am thinking of replacing all electrolytic capacitors and the diodes in the power supply section with Panasonic FC/FM and HEXFRED's respectively. I believe this will provide me with what Robert McNiece says in Tweaks for Geeks more vibrant and more sharply defined" colors and better contrasts, "especially against black backgrounds." This last improvement in contrast is what I am hoping will add more definition and detail to the DTB black issue. I'll report back with my findings after I perform the mods. In the mean time, I've attached a pic of the insides of the DTB.

jjeff

05-07-08, 08:18 AM

Whew, seems over my head:eek: good luck. I can't see how replacing capacitors in the power supply will give you better PQ but if it does more power to you. I have enough problems keeping my stuff working in the first place, let alone trying to make it better but maybe you'll have luck:) Keep us informed, nice photo.

jhe

05-07-08, 09:20 AM

I want a real tuner like my Zenith converter box. I can hardly wait.

1 It seems to be more sensitive.
2 It doesn't have any of the overlapped mapping issues. The channel edit add page uses the rf numbers to add a channel, not the phony numbers.
3 It seems more stable. Today my Samsung got confused due to an airplane flying by. It corrupted the code so I got a blue screen and message saying there was no signal on every channel! Had to reboot to get it working again. This thing is junk even though it is a step forward compared to my other HDTV tuners.

jjeff

05-07-08, 10:42 AM

Second one down.
http://www.tivax.com/converter.htm

dbsc

05-07-08, 03:31 PM

Second one down.
http://www.tivax.com/converter.htm

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=179095

No QAM, and it isn't even for sale on their own site.

100/40

05-07-08, 04:16 PM

"Basically, I am thinking of replacing all electrolytic capacitors and the diodes in the power supply section with Panasonic FC/FM and HEXFRED's respectively. I believe this will provide me with what Robert McNiece says in Tweaks for Geeks more vibrant and more sharply defined" colors and better contrasts, "especially against black backgrounds." "

I really think this will do zero. [I]'d like to know what display will be able show a difference.

jjeff

05-07-08, 05:15 PM

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=179095

No QAM, and it isn't even for sale on their own site.
I think:confused:it has QAM. It says "Decodes all 36 ATSC DTV standard video formats." whatever the heck that means. Their cheaper non HD box does QAM so I assumed this one might also. Personally I don't have cable so it doesn't matter to me, but I ordered one yesterday. I'll post in it's own thread when it comes in, and let you know if it's QAM or not. I wasn't able to get much from the company but was able to order one via phone, not website.
The cheaper non HD one specifically states QAM and is available here.
http://www.diamondhdtv.com/tivaxdigi...ivertuner.aspx

dbsc

05-07-08, 09:55 PM

I think:confused:it has QAM. It says "Decodes all 36 ATSC DTV standard video formats." whatever the heck that means. Their cheaper non HD box does QAM so I assumed this one might also. Personally I don't have cable so it doesn't matter to me, but I ordered one yesterday. I'll post in it's own thread when it comes in, and let you know if it's QAM or not. I wasn't able to get much from the company but was able to order one via phone, not website.
The cheaper non HD one specifically states QAM and is available here.
http://www.diamondhdtv.com/tivaxdigi...ivertuner.aspx

The STB-T1 isn't what was referenced earlier, and the STB-T9 is a CECB so QAM is forbidden.

The LX1000 does say it decodes "all 36 ATSC DTV standard video formats". ATSC is the signal sent over the airwaves which you receive with an antenna. QAM is what's used over cable. The LX1000 does not do QAM.

pkballr

05-08-08, 01:02 AM

dbsc

05-08-08, 02:16 AM

I tried hooking up my cable tv cable to the set-top box but when I tried the channel search, it said everything was scrambled.

The answers have been covered a few times actually, but here you go:

1. There are 3 modes for cable, STD HRC and IRC I think they're called. If one doesn't work try another.

2. If you have any splitters in your cable line they could be reducing the signal quality. Try removing them if possible, or if not get an amplifier that works with digital cable.

3. It's possible that your cable company simply isn't sending out clear (unencrypted) QAM. Find your local reception thread here at AVS Forum and read it to find out.

4. It's also possible that your cable lines are so old and/or screwed up that the signal is too degraded. It's probably one of the other 3 though.

pkballr

05-08-08, 03:11 AM

Thanks. I've tried number one but I didn't think about number two. Number three is a possibility because I tried hooking the box up to another tv and just got 350+ channels of black picture. The way that my setup is in my apartment, I'm forced to use a splitter because of how the wiring works. I guess I'll do some more research. Thanks.

dbsc

05-08-08, 11:19 AM

Number three is a possibility because I tried hooking the box up to another tv and just got 350+ channels of black picture.

Reports from users indicate that there is no signal quality meter for QAM like there is for OTA so it doesn't say anything for sure. :(

Alan G.

05-08-08, 12:23 PM

I'm using component cables. The 260 often loses "blue" (the TV turns reddish-green) and I can knock on the top of the 260's case and get blue back, only to lose it again. Anybody else with a similar problem?

jjeff

05-08-08, 01:10 PM

Have you tried swapping one set of the cables to verify it's not a bad cable vs. the Sammy?

dbsc

05-08-08, 01:25 PM

I can knock on the top of the 260's case and get blue back, only to lose it again

Sounds like an intermittent connection. I would first blame stressed component cable ends, try another cable set.

Alan G.

05-08-08, 02:14 PM

I'll try the cable swap. Thanks! Rather that than the unit.

Lobo777

05-08-08, 05:31 PM

I'm hoping someone can guide me in the right direction. I have been searching and reading for a few weeks now. I currently have D* with a R15 300 rcvr, a Toshiba D-R4 DVD video recorder, a Samsung HTB-260F and my TV set is a 52" Sony wide screen HDTV ready. As of now I do not have an outside antenna for OTA signal but an RCA amplified indoor antenna, would someone please tell me how to hook all this up...I'm a bit confused and tired. Hope I have explained enough to figure this out cause I sure can't. Thanks in advance.

Whidbey

05-08-08, 11:59 PM

Quentin2

05-09-08, 08:25 PM

Well it depends on your TV which you don't fully ID but assuming it has plenty of HDMI inputs, plug the 260F into the TV with a HDMI male to male cable and hook up the rabbit ears to the 260F and set the TV to the proper video input. Then scan for channels and enjoy.

If you don't get acceptable OTA reception you may need an extenal antenna or a better location for the internal one. Look in the Sammy's manual for displaying signal strength meters if reception is poor. You may be able to increase the signal with a little effort. When you've exhausted all possible solutions with the internal antenna then you'd turn your attention to an external. Internals do surprisingly well as long as reception is good in your community.

I assume your other components have already been hooked up. If not, check your manuals and get the proper cables to connect to other TV inputs.

manekineko

05-11-08, 10:43 AM

I just picked one of these things up, overall I'm thrilled with it.

However, I just can't get over the bizarre design decision to include only one input for both the antenna and cable. Is it true that the only solution to this is to get an A/B switch for the input?

It just doesn't make any sense though, why is there even a button on the remote to switch between antenna and cable mode then?

I know that it's probably a horrible idea for a variety of reasons, such as interference, etc. but has anyone actually tried putting the cable and antenna through a combiner and inputing that into the box and seeing what happens?

S88XJ

05-11-08, 12:41 PM

I know that it's probably a horrible idea for a variety of reasons, such as interference, etc. but has anyone actually tried putting the cable and antenna through a combiner and inputing that into the box and seeing what happens?

I know that would be the first thing I'd try, if you do try it please report your results :)

dbsc

05-11-08, 11:41 PM

I know that it's probably a horrible idea for a variety of reasons, such as interference, etc. but has anyone actually tried putting the cable and antenna through a combiner and inputing that into the box and seeing what happens?

What happens is you wind up with OTA and cable frequencies competing with one another, plus you'd be transmitting the cable co signal out your antenna. They don't like that.

dattier

05-12-08, 02:20 AM

It just doesn't make any sense though, why is there even a button on the remote to switch between antenna and cable mode then?The button is to tell the unit whether to interpret the RF-in signal as antenna or as cable. Yes, two separate jacks would make life easier, but most converters, like most televisions, have only one under the notion that a consumer hooks up either an antenna or a cable feed and then almost never changes it.

S88XJ

05-12-08, 03:54 AM

plus you'd be transmitting the cable co signal out your antenna. They don't like that.

:eek:

ota.dt.man

05-17-08, 10:41 PM

Can the DTB-H260F be programed through the USB port or modified to provide menus & CC on the S-video output for SD (480i) TVs that do not have component video inputs?

Thanks!

Whidbey

05-18-08, 12:52 AM

Can the DTB-H260F be programed through the USB port

No.

or modified to provide menus & CC on the S-video output for SD (480i) TVs that do not have component video inputs?

Sorta. If you connect the green (I think) component out to the yellow composite in on your TV, you can view the menus, but they are black and white. This makes the signal meter useless, since it needs color. Also, if you only use the composite or RF coax sources to watch content from the DTB-H260F, you cannot change the aspect ratio. For most programs, things will never look quite right.

spanky28

05-28-08, 05:31 PM

I don't know if this has been answered in here before, but I tried searching and couldn't find the exact answer.

Well anyways, I tried hooking up my cable tv cable to the set-top box but when I tried the channel search, it said everything was scrambled. I don't have digital Comcast or any of that. Just regular cable. But when I tried hooking it up, its just a black picture. OTA HD works, but my normal cable doesn't seem to like it. Maybe I misinterpreted what this box can do.

After many years, I canceled my analog cable tv service last week with Time Warner Cable.

In the past, I wasn't able to receive any channels with the DTB-260HF's QAM tuner.

Out of curiosity yesterday, I plugged in my cable line, did another scan in STD mode & am now able to receive a glorious selection of channels via QAM! I guess they removed the analog "filter" on my line.

dbsc

05-28-08, 10:18 PM

I guess they removed the analog "filter" on my line.

It's not an analog filter though that's the end effect. It is a filter which only passes a fixed range of frequencies, blocking all others.

I still have a Charter cable drop to the house but didn't have any luck the way you did. I suspect they either disconnected me at the pole or put on a block that stops everything. Might have something to do with what I told them they could do with their crappy service.

S88XJ

05-28-08, 10:21 PM

I went from having digital cable to only Internet with Cox... I think they installed two filters and I can't get ANYTHING down the wire except Internet.

I was hoping to luck out and get the locals but nope!

Lucky you, spanky! I put a rooftop antenna on my house....

400306

05-29-08, 05:21 AM

mlmahon

05-29-08, 09:46 AM

I recently purchased the H260F and have one question. Is there any way to limit the EPG to the currently enabled channels? I did a channel scan when I first set up the box and then deleted a number of stations that I wasn't interested in. However, the guide displays all the channels from the original scan which really slows down browsing through the guide. Thanks.
Yes.

Make a note of all the channels (real actual rf channel) you want to keep. Then rescan with the antenna unplugged to erase all saved channels. Reattach antenna, exit the menus, and manually enter in your wanted rf channels. The tuner will automatically lock in, rename to the virtual channel number, and add only those channels to your list.

mlmahon

05-29-08, 12:23 PM

The H260F has another feature which I haven't seen discussed in this forum.

When scanning for channels, it is possible to do what is called a 'bracket scan'. You don't have to scan the entire channel list.

For example: Manually tune to RF channel 18 (active or not-it doesn't matter). Then go to the menu and start a channel scan. The tuner starts scanning at channel 18. Press the 'Enter' key to stop the scan after channel 25. The tuner will then display how many channels it detected. Enter ok and exit menus. Now the overall channel list will be unchanged except for the addition of any channels detected from 18 to 25 (but the changes will display virtual channel #) and the deletion of any previously listed channels that were not detected from 18 to 25 in this scan. In other words, the tuner only replaces the section in your channel list that was scanned without affecting the rest of the list.

This is a handy feature if you have the same virtual and actual channel numbers when aiming your antenna in different directions.

Also, on another subject, I have a Samsung HL-S5087W DLP set that came with a multi-function remote. It will operate the H260F tuner with the STB code setting of 013. It doesn't operate all of the 'short cut' functions but everything is accessible from the menus.

Enjoy!:)

Whidbey

05-29-08, 02:13 PM

Also, on another subject, I have a Samsung HL-S5087W DLP set that came with a multi-function remote. It will operate the H260F tuner with the STB code setting of 013. It doesn't operate all of the 'short cut' functions but everything is accessible from the menus.

Thanks! That's good to know for when I start shopping for a new TV.

mtbdudex

05-29-08, 04:12 PM

A guy at work placed an ad for this on our internal for sale page, he wants $100.

This model is now 1+ year old, I'm willing to offer him $85 + $15 to ship it to me (He's in our southern US manuf facility, I'm in SE Michigan)

I will use this in my basement HT with my Sony VW60, I have HD Cable down there already, but also like to have OTA HDTV.

Question:
Seems like decent deal, is there some other competitor/newer model I should consider?

FWIW, I already get OTA via outdoor antenna for my family room HDTV and like that better than Comcast HD.

SAMSUNG DIGITAL HDTV RECEIVER

Date Ad Placed: 5/29/08

Samsung Digital HDTV Receiver DTB-H260F Receiver receives both ATSC (Antenna) and QAM (Cable) HDTV signals, and has the following outputs: HDMI, Component, Composite (2), S-Video, RCA Audio L/R (2), and Optical Audio/Toslink. Resolution is user selectable for 1080i, 720p, 480p, or 480i. Remote control is included. Receiver also has signal strength indicator for each channel received, and does pick up or receive better than many tuners built into HDTV. This is a great way to receive HDTV signals with an antenna if you don't have an HD tuner. $100.

dbsc

05-29-08, 04:43 PM

Seems like decent deal, is there some other competitor/newer model I should consider?

Many of the new non-HD CECBs seem to have better tuners but then they're not HD. The 260 is still pretty much the best unit of it's kind out there.

mtbdudex

05-29-08, 04:45 PM

Many of the new non-HD CECBs seem to have better tuners but then they're not HD. The 260 is still pretty much the best unit of it's kind out there.

Thx for fast feedback, I'll try and grab that one before someone else does.

mlmahon

05-29-08, 05:26 PM

khm_vu

05-30-08, 03:31 AM

hi, i have the samsung h260f for awhile and it just broke. for some reason it will not power on anymore. if i unplug it for a several minutes and plug it back in, then press power, it will power on for 10 seconds and shut off. any ideas what happen?

dbsc

05-30-08, 01:44 PM

By "power on" do you mean it tunes and displays a channel or that just the front LED lights up?

khm_vu

05-30-08, 05:03 PM

By "power on" do you mean it tunes and displays a channel or that just the front LED lights up?

the led lights up, no channels display. it shuts off before the channels can show up. i did hear strange pop during time tuner broke, could have came from tuner, not certain.

dbsc

05-30-08, 05:24 PM

Sounds like it's failing it's POST. When did you buy it? That is, is it possible to return as defective?

khm_vu

05-30-08, 05:50 PM

thanks for reply, i'll see if i can return.

giper

05-31-08, 10:17 PM

Budget_HT

05-31-08, 11:50 PM

Right now I have basic cable and a non HDTV. Next week I will receiving my Samsung PN50A650 plasma TV. Currently I use a Panasonic DMR-EH75 V to record SD to the HDD.

When I get the new TV I want to be able to record Broadcast HD to the Panasonic. I was told to purchase the Samsung H260F to make this work. My questions is can I plug my cable directly into the Samsung and hook the H260F to the Panasonic to record Broadcast TV or does the H260F only use antennas?

Right now I have the H260F with my basic cable and I tried hooking it up to my old Zenith TV from 1996 and I could not get the H260F to work. I hooked the Cable to the H260F and than sent a coaxial cable to my TV and I could not receive any of the QAM channels.

Does the H260F act as a QAM tuner for basic cable? My parents live in the same town and they have a Samsung CRT that has a QAM tuner built in and they can receive local HD Broadcast channels. We use the same cable provider Time Warner.

Any advice to get this to work I would appreciate.

IIRC, this STB does not output a digital video channel over the RF output. You must use one of the non-RF outputs to watch channels tuned in by this box. The RF is used only for pass-through to allow a downstream TV or VCR or DVD recorder to tune in the analog channels without the need for a separate splitter.

If you analog TV has component or s-video or composite video (yellow RCA jack), you can watch the output from this STB.

There is one unfortunate limitation: the menus and channel number display, etc., are not displayed unless you are using the component video or HDMI output (again, IIRC).

All that said, with your new HDTV coming you can use HDMI or component video connections and everything will work fine.

Yes, this box does include a QAM tuner for HD and digital channels (non-encrypted/non-premium channels) from cable.

giper

06-01-08, 10:40 PM

IIRC, this STB does not output a digital video channel over the RF output. You must use one of the non-RF outputs to watch channels tuned in by this box. The RF is used only for pass-through to allow a downstream TV or VCR or DVD recorder to tune in the analog channels without the need for a separate splitter.

If you analog TV has component or s-video or composite video (yellow RCA jack), you can watch the output from this STB.

There is one unfortunate limitation: the menus and channel number display, etc., are not displayed unless you are using the component video or HDMI output (again, IIRC).

All that said, with your new HDTV coming you can use HDMI or component video connections and everything will work fine.

Yes, this box does include a QAM tuner for HD and digital channels (non-encrypted/non-premium channels) from cable.

I got it to work. It is a much better picture. I figured out the mistake I was making. I had the Samsung 260 on 1080i. Once I put the setting down to 480i it finally worked and now I have DVD like quality picture which is better than before.

Now I just have to wait for the my new HDTV and see if I can record off of my Panasonic DMR-75H.

mlmahon

06-02-08, 12:43 AM

....and also all of their subchannels - some of which he may not want in the guide.
True, but any other unwanted independent or foreign language channels would not be on the new channel list which would unclutter it considerably.:)

Rammitinski

06-02-08, 12:59 AM

Yes.

Make a note of all the channels (real actual rf channel) you want to keep. Then rescan with the antenna unplugged to erase all saved channels. Reattach antenna, exit the menus, and manually enter in your wanted rf channels. The tuner will automatically lock in, rename to the virtual channel number, and add only those channels to your list.....along with all of their subchannels - which will also show up in the guide and can't be deleted from it once they're in there.

mtbdudex

06-02-08, 01:24 PM

Regarding my post a few days ago, here is the H260F tuner my work collague has for sale, Nov-2006 build date, too old a model or "good to buy".
(I asked him to email this to me for verification purposes)

I'm ready to plunk down $100 total ($85 unit + $15 shipping), just making sure this is not old/obsolete model.

http://lh3.ggpht.com/mtbdudex/SEPq38TcnZI/AAAAAAAACCA/aC4Ngeke-5g/s800/DTB-H260F%20Receiver.JPG

a) what is the USB port for?
b) firmware upgradeable or not? If so how to do?

211655

06-03-08, 11:15 PM

Alright. I just bought the hd tuner. I have a 50 inch plasma monitor which i was use dto use with my time warner cable hd box. Now I only have local 100 channel (not digital cable) from twc. My channels in regualr tv are from channel 2 till 100. Now this is my problem.

- I see only few channels, Not All
- The numbers are like 112-3456, 112-03, 90-7 etc.... very wierd. Also has a lot of channels where it says "weak signal or scrambled". Channel no. screwed up.

Currently I have this setup:
I have HD cable going into Plasma.
Resolution set to 1080i on tuner. I searched the channels with STD signal type

Cant i use this tuner as a simple tv tuner. I dont care baout hd channels coming from twc.

Also, Second questions.

I have also bought a terk hd antenna. How can i have both antenna and the cable go together as it has only one coax in.

Whidbey

06-03-08, 11:47 PM

a) what is the USB port for?

No one is really sure. Possibly Samsung uses it to flash the firmware in the factory?

b) firmware upgradeable or not? If so how to do?

Not upgradeable. I spoke with Samsung "3rd level" CS and they said they have no plans of releasing any upgraded firmware.

mlmahon

06-04-08, 01:34 AM

No one is really sure. Possibly Samsung uses it to flash the firmware in the factory?

Not upgradeable. I spoke with Samsung "3rd level" CS and they said they have no plans of releasing any upgraded firmware.

As you say, it is a fairly standard port on a lot of Samsung gear used to upgrade the firmware. My Samsung DLP TV has a USB port, also. I've upgraded it myself by getting the upgrade emailed to me by a friend who's a Samsung tech.

Give me a day or two and I'll check with him to see if there is one available for the 260f and let you guys know.

toby10

06-04-08, 06:07 AM

ota.dt.man

06-04-08, 10:13 AM

To: All DTB-H260F Owners that use the Component Video Output

Have you have upgraded from the the stock component cables that were included with the DTB-H260F?

If yes, which component cables did you purchase?

Belden/Blue Jeans Cable (http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/component/index.htm)
Canare/Markertek (http://www.markertek.com/Product.asp?baseItem=3RCA%2D1%2E5&cat=CABLESCONN&subcat=VIDEOCAB&prodClass=RGBCAB&mfg=&search=0&off=)
Lenexpo (http://www.lenexpo-electronics.com/Component-Video-Cables-p-1-c-275.html)
MonoPrice (http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10235)
Monster Cable (http://www.monstercable.com/home_av/video_cables/component.asp)
RAM (http://www.ramelectronics.net/audio-video/video-cables/component-video-cables/c10000-c12000-c12003.html?sorter=productname-en-asc)
Tartan Cable (http://www.tartancable.com/component-video-cables/index.htm)
Another brand

Did you see an obvious PQ improvement compared to the stock cables?

Thanks

Scooper

06-04-08, 10:53 AM

I've used both the in-the-box component, and an in-the-box HDMI cable from my TV, and an HDMI cable from Monoprice. Same great PQ on all of them.

One quirk of using HDMI cables with the Samsung and my TV (Olevia 232T) - If I try to set the Sammy to 1080i, I get "blue people". There is NOT this problem with the component cables. Since my TV only does 1366x768 pixels, leaving the Sammy at 720p is not a problem.

211655

06-04-08, 09:28 PM

Thanks!
I found out that as this tuner cannot get the scrambled channel from TWC, I had no option. I found my old VCR which had a tv tuner. Hurray. All working great! HD on Tuner, Rest of the cable on VCR. I love my self :)
THanks

toby10

06-05-08, 06:27 AM

I always use Monoprice cables myself. I've tried both Component and HDMI out of the H260f with equal PQ results. I now just use HDMI for video output.

I'm not sure what the problem is with the HDMI output giving *off* colors with some of the posters in here, mine works flawlessly.
Some possible causes:
- bad HDMI port on H260f
- HDMI incompatibility between H260f and the TV
- TV's HDMI input needs to be calibrated separately from the other TV inputs

mtbdudex

06-05-08, 12:26 PM

As you say, it is a fairly standard port on a lot of Samsung gear used to upgrade the firmware. My Samsung DLP TV has a USB port, also. I've upgraded it myself by getting the upgrade emailed to me by a friend who's a Samsung tech.

Give me a day or two and I'll check with him to see if there is one available for the 260f and let you guys know.

Thx, I went ahead and bought the unit from my co-worker, so I should have it in a few days (he's in Canton, MS area).
Looking fwd to it's usage in my HT.

If there is a firmware upgrade I'd like to join that process/method.

toby10

06-05-08, 02:56 PM

Thx, I went ahead and bought the unit from my co-worker, so I should have it in a few days (he's in Canton, MS area).
Looking fwd to it's usage in my HT.

If there is a firmware upgrade I'd like to join that process/method.

I don't recall any mention of a consumer FW update for these units.
It may be only doable by/at Samsung authorized service centers.

If you find out different, do share. :)

Whidbey

06-05-08, 05:45 PM

I don't recall any mention of a consumer FW update for these units.
It may be only doable by/at Samsung authorized service centers.

If you find out different, do share. :)

Even if someone can come up with a firmware upgrade, what would it do? I've not heard of any differences in the boxes regarding build dates.

DigitalPlayer

06-05-08, 06:07 PM

Samsung H250F connected to a Sony KD34XBR970. I've used both the included cable and the Walmart brand component with L/R audio cable. I have not noticed any difference with either of them. However, when I use the HDMI connection between the two devices, I get a B/W picture with a little bit of red and blue mixed in on the Sony when the Samsung is set to 720p and 1080i output. I have since been sticking with the component connections.

Oh my gosh same thing is happenning with me! Component looks great but when I tried HDMI on 720p or 1080i settings & all I get is a black/white picture that shakes alot & some colored bars across top of screen. No problem with sound. I replaced the HDMI cable with a differrent one with no success. Anybody replace their unit & find it was a defective receiver?

By the way I have a SONY WEGA KLV-S19A10 has 15:9 HD-resolution panel; 1280x768 Resolution

toby10

06-05-08, 06:21 PM

Even if someone can come up with a firmware upgrade, what would it do? I've not heard of any differences in the boxes regarding build dates.

I know there is at least two FW versions to the H260f. I don't know what the difference is, but some people look specifically for the older FW version.

*shrug*

DigitalPlayer

06-05-08, 07:20 PM

Oh my gosh same thing is happenning with me! Component looks great but when I tried HDMI on 720p or 1080i settings & all I get is a black/white picture that shakes alot & some colored bars across top of screen. No problem with sound. I replaced the HDMI cable with a differrent one with no success. Anybody replace their unit & find it was a defective receiver?

By the way I have a SONY WEGA KLV-S19A10 has 15:9 HD-resolution panel; 1280x768 Resolution

In reply to my own issue. After some reading it appears many Sony HD-ready tv models around the same time as mine aren't HDCP compatable & wont work with Sammy HDMI at 720p or 1080i as far as I can understand. I can live with component video which looks fantastic!

n2ubp

06-07-08, 08:17 AM

eBay is loaded with returned DTB-H260F receivers. Where are they getting these boxes for resale ?

Steve

Big Lag

06-07-08, 01:28 PM

My local Best Buy had two on the shelf. Both were "open box" units, returned by a customer for some reason or other.

jjeff

06-07-08, 07:13 PM

My local BB had a open box for the first time that I saw. It was marked down to $160.....
Big woop, I'd spend the extra $19 if I wanted to go that high and get a new one. I'll check ebay. I'd like to pay closer to $100 if not NIB.

Don Bouldrey

06-07-08, 07:51 PM

I watched a used one on ebay go for $72.

Scooper

06-07-08, 08:53 PM

Just make sure it includes the remote. The box is all but useless without it.

mlmahon

06-07-08, 11:50 PM

Just make sure it includes the remote. The box is all but useless without it.

The remote is available from partstore.com for $17.82 plus shipping. Here's the link.

http://www.partstore.com/GetModel.aspx?MfgName=Samsung&BrandName=Samsung&ModelNumber=DTBH260F&PartCategoryName=&Keywords=remote+control&x=22&y=5

toby10

06-08-08, 06:45 AM

My local Best Buy had two on the shelf. Both were "open box" units, returned by a customer for some reason or other.

These could be truly defective/malfunctioning units. But I'd bet many were returned (or on ebay) for most of the same reasons we see posted in here as "problems".

- Output to analog TV (aspect ratio miss-match)
- Trying a splitter for both OTA & QAM (not knowing any better I tried this myself :eek:)
- HDMI incompatibility
- Not realizing their local ch 8 is actually on QAM 307
- Thinking they are buying a "cable box" and can now get all premium cable ch's free in HD

Tip for any purchases at a big retailer: MAKE AN OFFER! :)
You'd be surprised how many retail mgr's will listen to reasonable offers for items (new, used, open box).

If you try the haggling route, here's a great trick that makes the mgr much more receptive to listening to your offer: Before you ask for the mgr go around the store and pick up some items, particularly high markup items like cables and accessories. While you are "bargaining" with the mgr for the open box item he sees you holding three Monster brand HDMI cables and four Blu-ray discs. He now sees you as one big DOLLAR sign (esp with cables, their single biggest markup item) and figures why not drop $40 on the open box item cuz they will make three times that on your HDMI cable purchase.

Of course, the cables & Blu-rays are going back on the shelf prior to you checking out with your reduced price open box item. Or just return the extra items later. ;)

lotc

06-09-08, 08:16 PM

Please if anyone can answer my question, it would be greatly apperciated?

I just heard of this device but i dont have alot of knowledge on ATSC tuners. I just recently bought a Samsung LNA650 which already has a built in HDTV-tuner. My tv is running off a coax spilt from my cable box in the living room, so my source of cable is through that coax. I get all the cable channels from 1-99 and the regular channels in HD above the 99 channel being picked up from what I believe is the built in HDTV-tuner.

So my question is, if I buy this unit and plug my coax cable source coming from my cable box in the main living room for the antenna in and using HDMI as the output into my tv, well my picture quality improve for the channels 1 to 99? and will I be able to more HD channels using this device other than the ones my tv is picking up?

Thank you guys.

Rammitinski

06-09-08, 08:26 PM

You won't pick up much with the H260F except the digital locals. It doesn't have an analog tuner like your Samsung TV does - so you won't get those extended basic channels with it. And the PQ won't improve with the few channels that you do get with the H260F over the internal tuner in the TV.

The only way to possibly get those extended basic channels with better picture quality would be to order all-digital service from the cable company and use their digital tuner, because those channels are scrambled on your line, and you have to have their tuner to decode them. The H260F won't do that - it only picks up the digital channels which are "in the clear" (which is usually just the locals, like I said). The digital versions should look noticably better on your display than those analogs coming in straight through the cable to the TV's analog tuner (which is what the TV's tuner is picking up - the analogs, that is, along with the local digital HD and SD channels).

But to keep getting the HD locals, you'll have to either rent their HD-capable tuner, or split the signal between their standard def digital box and your TV's tuner, and switch to the TV's tuner everytime you want to watch the HD locals.

ota.dt.man

06-10-08, 01:16 AM

I wish someone would hack the Samsung DTB-H260F. Figure out if anything can be updated or modified through the USB port.

Agreed! I would like to see this model:

Also display menus & CC on S-video output for TVs that lack component inputs.
Have additional aspect ratio choices for 4:3 analog SDTVs

And since the DTB-H260F is not a inexpensive CECB, it may be more worth the effort to modify it.

Thanks!

toby10

06-10-08, 05:34 AM

Agreed! I would like to see this model:

Also display menus & CC on S-video output for TVs that lack component inputs.
Have additional aspect ratio choices for 4:3 analog SDTVs

And since the DTB-H260F is not a inexpensive CECB, it may be more worth the effort to modify it.

Thanks!

I know the official Samsung web site has a service manual for the H260f that can be downloaded. I dunno how much this manual would help in "hacking" but it would probably be a good start.

The downside is that they want $28 to download it! :eek:

mlmahon

06-10-08, 08:52 PM

As you say, it is a fairly standard port on a lot of Samsung gear used to upgrade the firmware. My Samsung DLP TV has a USB port, also. I've upgraded it myself by getting the upgrade emailed to me by a friend who's a Samsung tech.

Give me a day or two and I'll check with him to see if there is one available for the 260f and let you guys know.

I checked. Yes, the USB port is for firmware upgrades.

Bad news is that there are NO firmware upgrades available from Samsung. My box was built in November, 2007 and has firmware dated 060928 (Sept 28, 2006) which, I believe, is the original and only version.

I guess they built it right the first time, huh?:rolleyes:

Don Bouldrey

06-15-08, 06:48 PM

I'm looking for specific info from Samsung 260 owners who use 480i with internal screen ratio set to 4:3 while feeding a 4:3 display with component cables.

I know this box has a problem with badly distorted/poorly cropped pictures when using various screen formats other than the default formats.

What I want to verify is if aspect and picture are undistorted when:

1) a 4:3 source received over a SD channel is displayed full screen.
2) a 4:3 source received over HD channel is displayed in a postage stamp window.
3) 16:9 source received over HD channel is displayed letterboxed.

I don't much care about zooming but before I buy one of these things, I want to verify I I can view these particular sources and modes without seeing fat heads, skinny heads or chopped off heads.

I also don't find anything on the actual size of the filler bars the Samsung puts around the picture. Would they be similar to what any other dtv tuner outputting 480i would use?

For instance, with the Tivax STB-T1 I want to replace, I get a 32" diagonal picture when viewing full-screen 4:3 source broadcast on a SD channel, 30½" picture when viewing letterboxed HD broadcast on a HD channel and a 27½" diagonal "postage stamp" picture when viewing 4:3 source transmitted by a HD channel.

bdfox18doe

06-15-08, 06:52 PM

I guess they built it right the first time, huh?:rolleyes:

Well, duh.. yea.. I mean, who would want OSD on the composite outputs anyway? :)

Whidbey

06-16-08, 02:37 PM

What I want to verify is if aspect and picture are undistorted when:

1) a 4:3 source received over a SD channel is displayed full screen.
2) a 4:3 source received over HD channel is displayed in a postage stamp window.
3) 16:9 source received over HD channel is displayed letterboxed.

I use this box with a SDTV via component inputs, so I'll take a shot at explaining how the various transmitted aspect ratios look according to the STB selectable aspect ratios.

For reference, first I'll list the STB setting, then how it looks. Example Letterbox / Short fat people

If the station is broadcasting a 4:3 show on a HD (16:9) channel:
Letterbox / Image is postage stamped, borders on all four sides. Best Choice
4:3 Full / Image is stretched vertically, tall skinny people, sidebars
Zoom / Image is zoomed way in, chops off sides, top and bottom.

If the station is broadcasting a 16:9 show on a HD (16:9) channel:
Letterbox / Image is viewed in full, has bars on top and bottom. Best Choice
4:3 Full / Image fill screen, tall skinny people, no sidebars
Zoom / Image is zoomed way in, chops off sides, top and bottom.

If the station is broadcasting a 4:3 show on a SD (4:3) channel:
Letterbox / Image is squished vertically, short fat people, bars on top and bottom.
4:3 Full / Image is displayed correctly, no bars. Best Choice.
Zoom / Image is zoomed way in, chops off sides, top and bottom.

Hope this helps!

Rammitinski

06-17-08, 01:14 AM

If the station is broadcasting a 4:3 show on a HD (16:9) channel:

Zoom / Image is zoomed way in, chops off sides, top and bottom.If the proportions were OK on that mode I could live with it, but even with the box's zoom mode and the picture being cropped on all sides, the people are still tall and skinny.

At least they are on my set. If my analog set had a zoom mode of it's own, I'd just use that, but it doesn't.

So in that situation I just leave it in the postage stamp mode. It's only a 32" screen, so the picture is pretty small then, but at least it's "normal" (and is plenty sharp).

Don Bouldrey

06-17-08, 07:35 AM

So in that situation I just leave it in the postage stamp mode. It's only a 32" screen, so the picture is pretty small then, but at least it's "normal" (and is plenty sharp).

Rammitinski, will you please estimate the size of your postage stamped picture?

I'm wondering if I'd get the same size stamp with the Samsung that I get with a Tivax which is 27½" diagonal on my 32".

gbmannc

06-17-08, 11:09 AM

I just bought this box for $61 last week on ebay! Im using primarily for its QAM abality. Im having trouble tuning to 2 channels (fox and cbs). They'll come in for a second or 2 and screen will go to no/weak signal than come on for a second or 2 again... The interesting thing both the channels have in common is that they both reside on the same physical channel (113.1, 113.4).Im not exactley sure how QAM functions so anyone have an idea about the problem? Could it have something to do with having 2 hd channels on the same physical channel?

Rammitinski

06-17-08, 02:10 PM

Rammitinski, will you please estimate the size of your postage stamped picture?

I'm wondering if I'd get the same size stamp with the Samsung that I get with a Tivax which is 27½" diagonal on my 32".I'd imagine it would be right around the same size as what the Tivax gives you (27 1/2" seems about right to my eyes). Most boxes display a 16:9 picture around the same size, give or take a hair on the top and bottom.

One exception to this would be my RS Accurian, which is noticably a little wider than average from top to bottom, although I kinda like it. In 16:9 mode it doesn't leave a lot of the screen uncovered, and doesn't really seem to (noticably, at least) cut any of the sides off to do so, yet it still looks entirely in proportion. I always watch it in zoom mode anyway though on the 480i 32" set, which is where it's at right now. It's giving me a sharper PQ than the Zenith CECB box was, although not quite as sharp and rich in color as the Samsung, which truly does appear almost HD-like on it. The last HD Digital Stream tuner, which was the same box under a different name, was like that, also (very sensitive boxes too, I must say, for having 4th gen. chips) - the Samsung's picture is average in height as far as comparing it to any of my other receivers. The only CECB box I've tried so far is the Zenith, and that was "normal", too.

I'm not good enough at math to really give you an exact per square inch figure (it was far and away my worst subject in school), and I don't have the H260F hooked up so I can't really tape measure it. It's boxed up and stashed away right now.

Really though, I'd say the Accurian/Digital Stream HD model was probably designed more with SD in mind unlike the Samsung. The Samsung is OK though if you've got an SDTV with component inputs and a zoom mode of it's own. If you didn't need a tuner with a newer chip design, and you could find one somewhere, I'd recommend the RS/DS over the Samsung for SD. The only negative is, you can't use the component out for 480I - only up to s-video. Decent guide, though. The Hisense USDTV tuner would also be a good choice, but it's a bit less sensitive, if that would matter to you (PQ's as good as or even better than the Samsung - although it can be buggier than the other two - but you can use the component out, if I remember right). The Accurian was $80.-$90. new on clearance, and the Hisense could be found new for $33.00 (by someone advertising a load of them in the Hisense thread here) last I knew of (don't think the Digital Stream version ever got down that low, though). I don't know what the going rate for any of them used would be at this point in time, though.

I know that certain used tuners (like all of the LG's and the Sony DVR's, etc.) command a real premium, so I'm not suggesting those. But there are also Sylvania's that are supposed to be good that might be found cheap that could fit the bill (Sears, and then BB in the end, mainly sold them). I don't really know too much about the features on those, though - I just remember reading that they were pretty good tuners. Funai's, I believe.

The Hisense thread is currently still very active here, but you'd probably have to search back a little bit for the RS/DS one(s) - if you're interested at all in reading about them. The Sylvania's would probably be found way back - maybe in the archives by now, even though the tuners are not really that old themselves (they're all 4th gen.). Then there's the older Samsung models, too - but I personally don't know how any of those handle aspect modes. But sensitivity-wise, I'm pretty certain that the RS/DS beats all of the pre-H260F Samsungs, the Hisense, and the Sylvania's.

Whidbey

06-17-08, 02:50 PM

I'm no math whiz, so someone point me in the right direction if I'm wrong.

4:3 = 16:12

A 4:3 screen the same width as a 16:9 screen would be 3/12 higher (25%)

So, for example, if a 16:9 image is displayed centered vertically on a 4:3 screen in full width, the black bars on top and bottom should each be 12.5% of the screens height.

So, (if my math is correct...) a 27" diagonal 4:3 screen is 16.2" tall. 12.5% of 16.2" is 2.025".
4:3 "postage stamp" images should have 2.7" sidebars, based on a 21.6" screen width.

I typed "full width" in bold because I think alot of tuners chop off a little on the sides of 16:9 images, therefore the black bars may be slightly smaller in height.

Similar formula should work for predicting sidebar widths when viewing 4:3 content on a 16:9 broadcast, whether on a 16:9 or 4:3 display.

Don Bouldrey

06-17-08, 04:31 PM

Thanks Rammitinski. I've learned that tuner sensitivity and strength is much more of a issue for me than I originally estimated it would be. As I struggled with various antenna reconstructions, I assumed I was banging my head against a limitation of DTV... until I picked up an Insignia box for the bedroom TV. I did various A/B comparisons between this and the Tivax and found there is absolutely no comparison between 6th generation and what I assume is 4th generation.

I understand there's a world of difference between 4th and 5th generations and best I can tell, the Samsung is the only game in town with at least a 5th generation tuner and component video/ digital audio.

Investment in old tech doesn't seem too profitable. My reception with the Tivax is great on most channels, okay on two more and borderline adequate (62-67%) on the rough one. After the transition, one of the important channels (now coming in at 75-77%) will cut power aimed at my azimuth by half. Reception becomes problematic below 60%.

Whidbey, your math makes my head hurt but my postage stamp is 16½ x 22½ when watching a 4:3 source broadcast on a 1920x1080 channel. Actual diagonal is a fuzz under 28".

Guys, the take-home message I'm getting from your lessons today is picture size should be relatively close between tuners.

Rammitinski

06-18-08, 01:28 AM

The Accurian really isn't any less sensitive than the DTB-H260F. It's pretty exceptional for a 4th gen. model. The Sammy's just better with multipath. That's really the biggest improvement between the 4th and 5th gens. - not so much the sensitivity. But the new Zenith I had surely did best either.

Actually, the Accurian is getting in one VHF-lo channel better than the Samsung was (the infamous WBBM-DT).

Maybe you've heard more about the former Samsungs, or some other models that were not all that exceptional, even for 4th gen. boxes.

If you're borderline though, I can see why you'd want to get the newest technology possible. I'm kind of in that same situation myself for everything but my primary market (although the Accurian and the 4th gen. Sony I'm currently using are handling things very well right now, getting me many channels from over 60 miles away solidly, at least at night - even the Zenith couldn't get all of them dependably during the day).

Don Bouldrey

06-18-08, 09:32 AM

That's great info on the Accurian.

What I read about the difference between the 5th gen Samsung and 4th gen receivers came from a HDTVExpert review that said "There really is magic in the 5th generation 8VSB receiver chips". Revisiting that page now, I see that most of that magic has to do with multipath. I don't totally understand multipath but since I live in a remote area, a long way from any cities or towns and nothing but mildly rolling terrain between me and the towers, I probably don't have that problem.

Perhaps my big problem is simply a fundamental weakness in the Tivax receivers I've tried. They are both on par with each other but neither compare with the Insignia. My assumption was the problem is difference between generations. In an A/B test with rabbit ears, the Insignia pulls a very strong signal with almost constant tone on my weakest channel while the Tivax may only grab a frame every ten seconds or just stay dark.

Unfortunately, even if I could find one, the DS/RS won't work for me as it would require downgrading my entire system to composite video. Same deal with the PHD-205. It appears to be a prime suspect with a tuner that supposedly rivals the Samsung but no 480i over component.

The Hisense has always interested me but I moved on after reading that it was a weaker tuner along with proprietary USDTV and lockup issues. Of course, what's weaker by someone else's standards may be very strong when compared to the Tivax. I just don't have the experience to know. All I have for empirical knowledge is what I've gathered with Tivax and the Insignia. I'll do more studying on the Hisense. I know those are readily available and quite inexpensive.

Thanks Rammitinski.

Scooper

06-18-08, 09:57 AM

What makes the difference in "remote" areas is more a function of the antenna system, with the tuner playing a much smaller role. And by "antenna system", I mean the antenna, wiring, any pre-amps, rotors, and internal distribution.

And your right - in general, the newer the design of the ATSC tuner chip, the better it is at handling multipath (the big killer in more urban situations). In the analog reception world, you see multipath as "ghosts" . But you gotta get a signal TO the tuner before that comes into play.

Don Bouldrey

06-18-08, 10:29 AM

bdfox18doe

06-18-08, 10:41 AM

<<to the Insignia, I get a completely filled signal meter with constant tone on all channels>>

My contact at LG has confirmed to me that the DTT900/901 and it's Insignia
clones have the 6th gen chipset.

Scooper

06-18-08, 10:50 AM

Scooper, looking at a different A/B test, when connecting my outdoor CM 4221 clone to the Insignia, I get a completely filled signal meter with constant tone on all channels, even the weakest one. When the Tivax is connected, it gets a signal of 62-67% percent on that weak channel.

Different scales on the tuner software is the best explanation I have. Unfortunately, there is no real "standard" on what the scales measure, nor their range of values. So, comparing values from one tuner to another is just as likely to be comparing apples and oranges.

Don Bouldrey

06-18-08, 11:04 AM

Agreed but the bottom line is the Insignia runs the bedroom TV perfectly well, with no viewed errors to date, using rabbit ears while the Tivax, operating the HT system off the outdoor antenna, suffers from occasional dropouts and pixellation errors on the weaker channels. There are two interior walls, a double-bricked 2x6 framed exterior wall and a whole bunch of vegetation between the rabbit ears and the transmission towers while there is very little between the outdoor antenna and the towers except distant trees (which are also in the line of the rabbit ears). By process of elimination and a variety of criteria, my reception problem sure appears to be tuner related.

toby10

06-18-08, 11:15 AM

Don Bouldrey

06-18-08, 11:24 AM

Toby, I have. See the middle of my post 2901, directly above.

krholmberg

06-18-08, 04:57 PM

I have a couple quick questions (with a little background info for context)...

I have the 260 and use it to get QAM stations in the clear. I've been using the HDMI out along with a 3 in 1 out HMDI switch. Audio is taken care of with Toslink. I recently ordered a new VP to tame my PJ; it will now act as the switch until I get a new receiver capable of handling HDMI video/audio. The problem is the VP doesn't have HDMI inputs/outputs; instead, it has 2 DVI & 2 component inputs and 1 DVI & 1 component output. I planned on getting 3 HDMI/DVI adapters. The PS3 and HD-A3 will use the two DVI inputs and the 260 will use the component input. The one output will be the DVI output from which I'll use the third DVI/HDMI adapter (and then use the HDMI cable I already have to go to the PJ). All audio will be sent via Toslink.

So, knowing that, should I expect a change in image quality going from HDMI output to component output? Also, is there anyway to set the STB so 720p images are sent out as 720p images and 1080i images are sent out as 1080i? I don't care to much for the internal de-interlacer. Thanks!

jjeff

06-18-08, 05:26 PM

So, knowing that, should I expect a change in image quality going from HDMI output to component output? Also, is there anyway to set the STB so 720p images are sent out as 720p images and 1080i images are sent out as 1080i? I don't care to much for the internal de-interlacer. Thanks!
I did not notice a difference using either component or HDMI output. I also got better PQ setting my Sammy to output 1080i even though my TV is a 720p(768 native). On your second question, no their is not a native passthru resolution. The output is either 480i 720p or 1080i, it doesn't matter what the input is.

krholmberg

06-18-08, 06:07 PM

Thanks Jeff...

Your first answer was the answer I hoped I'd get. The second condfirmed my understanding. I think it's pretty hard to expect more in such a reasonably priced piece of equipment. Overall I've been happy with it.

wildgoose

06-18-08, 06:53 PM

1) a 4:3 source received over a SD channel is displayed full screen.

Yes, it's displayed full screen, but there are extra cropping on SD materials that makes the Samsung unsuitable to watch 480i SD material. I use my Zenith DTT900 for this purpose and it displays a more proper picture. When you toggle the output setting switch in the back of the unit, the SD channel resets, and will show you a proper picture, let's call this 100%. But as soon as you flip to a different channel and flip back, you lose about 10% on each side. The right side gets cropped more than the left side.

Basically if you only care or watch HD channels, then my personal experience has been the Samsung is excellent (driving my 16:9 plasma screen via HDMI). Images are centered properly and no inappropriate cropping. However, if you care and watch 480i SD channels, then the samsung is a POS. I wonder if their QA group did any real testing on 480i receptions.

I will upload some pictures showing this annoying bug soon.

Scooper

06-18-08, 07:59 PM

480i shows OK when the screen format is set to 16:9, pillorbox when your screen is 720p or greater screen.

wildgoose

06-18-08, 08:43 PM

480i shows OK when the screen format is set to 16:9, pillorbox when your screen is 720p or greater screen.

It may look fine, but the images are cropped, even in the pillorbox mode. You are loosing the side of the image (with the right side being the most noticible one)

This is an indication that the cropping is not due to the TV's over scan, but the internal processing of the samsung.

Whidbey

06-18-08, 11:14 PM

Yes, it's displayed full screen, but there are extra cropping on SD materials that makes the Samsung unsuitable to watch 480i SD material. I use my Zenith DTT900 for this purpose and it displays a more proper picture. When you toggle the output setting switch in the back of the unit, the SD channel resets, and will show you a proper picture, let's call this 100%. But as soon as you flip to a different channel and flip back, you lose about 10% on each side. The right side gets cropped more than the left side.

Basically if you only care or watch HD channels, then my personal experience has been the Samsung is excellent (driving my 16:9 plasma screen via HDMI). Images are centered properly and no inappropriate cropping. However, if you care and watch 480i SD channels, then the samsung is a POS. I wonder if their QA group did any real testing on 480i receptions.

I will upload some pictures showing this annoying bug soon.

WG - that is strange, and the first I've heard of that happening. Just so we have all the facts and so someone may be able to help you diagnose your situation, could you share some info? If the questions seem pointless, sorry, just have to ask anyway...

Is your Samsung set to output 16:9?
Is your Zenith set to output 16:9?
How is your plasma HDTV configured to adjust to 480i signals? Any possibility one of it's settings could be conflicting with the Sammy, which might explain why it changes when you change channels, and why the Sammy takes over again when you reset the switch in the back of the Sammy.
Have you tried using component video cables instead to see if the problem still exists?

wildgoose

06-19-08, 02:44 AM

The samsung DTB-H260F tuner, when receiving a 480i signal, will drop 10-20% of the frame on all side of the picture on component/hdmi output. There are more cropping on the side than at the top and bottom. The cropping however does NOT occur for composite, and s-video output.

Here are the steps to reproduce the problem:

0) Tune to a 480i station.

1) Change the output setting in the back of the unit <480i, 480p, ...> (If your TV only supports one mode, simply change it to something else, and immediately change it back).

The screen resets, and a proper 480i image is shown. 100% of the picture IS shown because the output setting was just changed.

2) Change the channel away, and then back. (or press the aspect ratio button)

As soon as the channel is changed, or the aspect ratio button is pressed, the cropping occurs. Because a proper 100% 480i image is shown in step #1, it should be easy to see the cropping on step 2.

Here are some pictures I took today that clearly demonstrates the problem. I used the ABC weather channel because it has a consistent layout which makes it easier to see the image dropping. I am using a Panasonic wide-screen plasma set to 'full' mode, connected to the Samsung using HDMI (the result is the same for Component and composite)

1) The first picture shows what I call the "reference picture" from a Zenith DTT900 box. This is what the station should look like. Pay attention to the edge of the screen, how much spacing is around the ABC logo, etc.

http://csua.berkeley.edu/~chiry/dtv/dtt900_reference.jpg

2) The 2nd picture shows a proper 480i image from the Samsung, after the output setting in the back of the unit is changed to something else, causing the unit to 'reset'.

http://csua.berkeley.edu/~chiry/dtv/samsung_1_afterreset.JPG

notice that it more or less matches the DTT900 output.

3) The 3rd picture shows what happens to the Samsung after the channel was changed to something else, and back.

http://csua.berkeley.edu/~chiry/dtv/samsung_2_after_channel_change.JPG

notice how much the image was cropped off on the side. The ABC logo no longer shows completely, the picture frame below the logo is clearly cut off from the left. Actually the clipping on the right side is more severe, but due to the way this channel is setup, it doesn't show it as well.

4) The 4th picture is the Samsung in piller mode. You can see the cropping is exactly the same, an indication that it is due to the samsung's processing and not the output stage or the TV's overscan.

http://csua.berkeley.edu/~chiry/dtv/samsung_3_piller_mode.JPG

5) The 5th picture shows the menu from the Samsung, indicating it is set to 16:9 mode.

http://csua.berkeley.edu/~chiry/dtv/samsung_4_screen.JPG

Has anyone else noticed this problem? This only happens with 480i signals. On HD signals, the image is centered and displayed correctly.

This just sad coming from a 5th generation product designed to send an image to a display device. :( I have tried 2 different DTB-260F and both exhibits the same problem. I tried Samsung tech support but didn't get anywhere when I said I want to file a bug report.

Thankfully, the cropping does not occur on the composite and s-video output, the same outputs Samsung decided to omit the on screen display.

Edited to add composite/s-video non-cropping info.

wildgoose

06-19-08, 02:45 AM

I have posted the pictures under a new thread, see

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14114338#post14114338

Don Bouldrey

06-19-08, 08:35 AM

wildgoose, sorry to divert from your topic. Will you please compare the reception of your Samsung with your Zenith on your weakest channel?

Don Bouldrey

06-19-08, 10:41 AM

Paul, I have very similar problems with a different unit that appear to be caused by excessive heat.

Does your Samsung have clear ventilation all the way around, not sitting on another heat producing component, etc.?

jtbell

06-19-08, 12:27 PM

When I set the output switch on the back of the unit to 720p or 1080i, the unit displays a 480i channel properly on my Panasonic LCD HDTV, which can accept 720p and 1080i. provided that I set the aspect ratio to NORMAL on the Panasonic and to PILLAR on the Samsung. When I set both the Samsung and the Panasonic to WIDE, the picture is stretched to fill the screen, but little or no material is cropped.

(I used an NBC Weather Plus channel for this test.)

The cropping problem shows up only when I set the switch on the back of the Samsung to 480i. That setting has another major problem in that it does not show on-screen displays or menus through the composite or S-video outputs. This unit is apparently intended mainly for use with HD TVs or monitors that can accept 720p or 1080i signals, and the 480i output is basically an afterthought.

I'm pretty sure this cropping problem has been mentioned in the main DTB-H260F thread, by the way, but it's good to have pictures that show it explicitly.

Ken H

06-19-08, 12:36 PM

Topics merged.

wildgoose

06-19-08, 01:48 PM

wildgoose, sorry to divert from your topic. Will you please compare the reception of your Samsung with your Zenith on your weakest channel?

This is not a scientific test, but I feel the Zenith is better. My local channel 4 freezes up a bit on the Samsung, but never does so on the Zenith. They are both fed from an outdoor antenna using a GE 2-way splitter.

wildgoose

06-19-08, 01:56 PM

When I set the output switch on the back of the unit to 720p or 1080i, the unit displays a 480i channel properly on my Panasonic LCD HDTV, which can accept 720p and 1080i. provided that I set the aspect ratio to NORMAL on the Panasonic and to PILLAR on the Samsung. When I set both the Samsung and the Panasonic to WIDE, the picture is stretched to fill the screen, but little or no material is cropped.

(I used an NBC Weather Plus channel for this test.)

I used the full mode on the Panasonic. It accepts 480i, 480p, 720p, and 1080i. When the output switch on the back of the Samsung is changed, the unit resets, and a proper image is displayed. But the key is, as soon as you change channel, it is cropped, and will remain cropped until you changes the output setting again, which the unit resets.

This is the same regardless of whether the Samsung is set to 1080i, 720p, 480p, or 480i. It's interesting that the amount of cropping differs slightly between these modes.

The cropping is also triggered if the user changes the aspect ratio, without flipping channel. My 4th picture shows it.

I see that this has been mentioned by AVSnewB on 2007-02, I guess there's little hope that it'll be fixed... :(

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9789345#post9789345

Whidbey

06-19-08, 02:15 PM

Will you please compare the reception of your Samsung with your Zenith on your weakest channel?

I have compared the two. To be fair my CECB is an Insignia, but it's the exact same LG box as the Zenith.

Using PIP, I ran both boxes at the same time and tuned to a weak channel. The picture break-ups occurred pretty much simultaneously. There was not enough difference to make one box superior to the other in terms of tuner performance.

Whidbey

06-19-08, 02:26 PM

wildgoose:

I compared the cropping of both my tuners (Insignia CECB, s/a your Zenith, and my Samsung 260). I think I can see what you are referring to now. The Samsung does clip a little off the sides when I view a 4:3 broadcast in 4:3 full on my SDTV. On your 16:9 TV, maybe the clipping is more exaggerated since your image is stretched horizontally. For me it's really only apparent on stations like the ones you showed pictures of, I have the same station locally. I think most other stations leave a wide enough margin at the edges of the image to account for clipping.

ota.dt.man

06-20-08, 07:37 PM

To all Samsung DTB-H260F owners have their DTB-H260F connected to an SDTV via component video inputs, please check out this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1041428). Thanks!

wildgoose

06-26-08, 03:21 PM

The guide on the Samsung shows channels that I have "deleted". How do I remove this from the guide info? I only want to see the guide from HD channels, not their sub channels, but can't seem to find a way to remove it from the guide...

Thanks!

ota.dt.man

06-26-08, 03:45 PM

Can the DTB-H260F be updated through the USB port to provide other 4:3 aspect ratio options?

Thanks

bcarlsen

06-26-08, 04:00 PM

Big Lag

06-26-08, 04:49 PM

Is anyone here having HDMI handshake issues when the tuner interfaces with an AV receiver prior to interfacing with the display both connections are made via an HDMI connection?

toby10

06-26-08, 05:31 PM

Is anyone here having HDMI handshake issues when the tuner interfaces with an AV receiver prior to interfacing with the display both connections are made via an HDMI connection?

Nope. In fact, just the opposite. My H260f didn't have enough *umph* to output the audio & video over a 50' HDMI cable. Problem solved by going through my AVR with the same 50' HDMI cable.

Are you having both audio & video handshake issues? How long is your HDMI cable? Known good HDMI cable? i.e. both cables independently properly deliver audio & video to TV when not going through your AVR?

Rammitinski

06-26-08, 05:34 PM

That was covered here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13968634#post13968634).Yes, but you can't delete any subchannels from the guide without deleting the main one, using that method, or any other one.

There's just no way to do it.

Big Lag

06-26-08, 05:49 PM

Nope. In fact, just the opposite. My H260f didn't have enough *umph* to output the audio & video over a 50' HDMI cable. Problem solved by going through my AVR with the same 50' HDMI cable.

Are you having both audio & video handshake issues? How long is your HDMI cable? Known good HDMI cable? i.e. both cables independently properly deliver audio & video to TV when not going through your AVR?

It is only a video issue as the audio is always present. The problem is an intermittent condition. Sometimes you get video and audio at system start up, othertimes audio only. When there is no video, the fix is to turn just the Samsung unit off and then back on again using its dedicated remote to obtain both video and audio.

toby10

06-26-08, 06:00 PM

It is only a video issue as the audio is always present. The problem is an intermittent condition. Sometimes you get video and audio at system start up, othertimes audio only. When there is no video, the fix is to turn just the Samsung unit off and then back on again using its dedicated remote to obtain both video and audio.

Yeah, that may just be your only solution. Or figure out which device ON sequence gives you the proper handshake. HDMI is still in it's *glichy* stage, unfortunately. :(

fajitamosaic

06-27-08, 01:10 PM

Just bought an H260F off of eBay.... my impressions...

Unit's manufacture date on the sticker is 01-08, but I don't notice any new or changed features based on the screen captures I've seen of "older" units. Tuner isn't as broadly sensitive as the one in our Zenith DTT900. The Zenith pulls in our local PBS, as well as a couple fringe stations. The Samsung doesn't even notice these. However, of the channels the Samsung does pull in, it pulls them in with zero dropouts (unlike the Zenith, which hiccups on strong signals).

I wish it was easier to add channels manually. The fringe OTA stations come in better at night. I'll have to re-run the auto scan after midnight to see if I can add them to the line-up *grin*

Hooked it up to the cable line just for kicks, since we're cancelling Comcast soon. Pulls in a weird mix of stations (local HDs, local SDs, two shopping channels, CBC in SD, and what looks like some PPV movies?!?!). Comcast obviously didn't figure on folks using this box in our area, as some channels have insane numbers: 87-905, for example. Stations coming in from the Comcast feed aren't as sharp as those coming in OTA, even the local HD stations.

Can't see menu overlays when using RCA outputs, but that's okay because the bedroom TV this is for will be connected via Component. Menu overlays work fine over component, as expected.

I've been futzing with the different output resolutions and output types (RCA, Component, S-video) to see if I experience the "cropping" issues with 480i broadcasts that jtbell and wildgoose have mentioned. Short answer: yes. Long answer: the unit chops off more screen information the lower you set the resolution. When set to 1080i, I don't notice any cropping. At 720p, just a little. At 480p and 480i, it's like a full inch of border is cut away (on a 22" TV). 1080i via component is just peachy for me, thankfully. Most of our watchable locals are throwing out 1080i or 720p signals anyway.

My main gripe is the remote. Not even a button to control the TV. WTF? And the guide buttons are tiny and uncomfortably placed.

Whidbey

06-27-08, 01:24 PM

Just bought an H260F off of eBay.... my impressions...

Unit's manufacture date on the sticker is 01-08, but I don't notice any new or changed features based on the screen captures I've seen of "older" units. Tuner isn't as broadly sensitive as the one in our Zenith DTT900, but of the channels it does pull in, it pulls them in with zero dropouts (unlike the Zenith).

I wish it was easier to add channels manually. We have a couple fringe OTA stations that come in better at night. I'll have to re-run the auto scan after midnight *grin*

Hooked it up to the cable line just for kicks, since we're cancelling Comcast soon. Pulls in a weird mix of stations (local HDs, local SDs, two shopping channels, CBC in SD, and what looks like some PPV movies?!?!). Comcast obviously didn't figure on folks using this box in our area, as some channels have insane numbers: 75-10114, for example. Stations coming in from the Comcast feed aren't as sharp as those coming in OTA, even the local HD stations.

My main gripe is the remote. Not even a button to control the TV. WTF?

Manual tuning can be a pain. But once the box is set up, you shouldn't have to do it often. One tip, in case you didn't already figure it out: Take note of the stations that highlight in orange when you run the scan. Those are the physical channel numbers. That way, if you re-orient your antenna and run a second scan, which may omit some of the channels in your initial scan, you can easily tune to the lost channels and add them to the memory, even though you can't receive them with the current antenna orientation.

The remote - Someone claimed success controlling the box with their Samsung TV remote, set to treat the box like a satellite receiver. IIRC, the code was 731. So, if you have a Samsung TV.... Another option would be to get a good programmable universal remote.

One more thing - if you are getting odd-ball PPV stuff from your Comcast feed, your watching what your neighbors are watching.

toby10

06-27-08, 01:27 PM

Just bought an H260F off of eBay.... my impressions...

Unit's manufacture date on the sticker is 01-08, but I don't notice any new or changed features based on the screen captures I've seen of "older" units. Tuner isn't as broadly sensitive as the one in our Zenith DTT900, but of the channels it does pull in, it pulls them in with zero dropouts (unlike the Zenith).

I wish it was easier to add channels manually. We have a couple fringe OTA stations that come in better at night. I'll have to re-run the auto scan after midnight *grin*

Hooked it up to the cable line just for kicks, since we're cancelling Comcast soon. Pulls in a weird mix of stations (local HDs, local SDs, two shopping channels, CBC in SD, and what looks like some PPV movies?!?!). Comcast obviously didn't figure on folks using this box in our area, as some channels have insane numbers: 75-10114, for example. Stations coming in from the Comcast feed aren't as sharp as those coming in OTA, even the local HD stations.

My main gripe is the remote. Not even a button to control the TV. WTF?

I don't think QAM requires the cable operators to properly "map" the stations, so you will get some oddball station #'s.

Sharper PQ OTA is quite common as there is usually far less compression used in the OTA signal vs the cable signal.

You may want to think about programming your H260f's more common remote buttons into a universal remote. I did this using my AVR remote and it works fine, one less remote needed for casual viewing. :)

Big Lag

06-27-08, 02:52 PM

Yeah, that may just be your only solution. Or figure out which device ON sequence gives you the proper handshake. HDMI is still in it's *glichy* stage, unfortunately. :(

This is pathetic. Not your response, but the lack of performance.

I ordered another tuner to try it out thinking that the tuner I have might be defective in some way. The new tuner has the same behavior - audio but no video on startup, power cycle required to obtain video.

BTW, I am on my second copy of the SONY AV receiver, too (STR-DA5300ES).

HDMI connectors that all but unplug themselves and have no locking feature.

I am on my second Harmony "universal" remote, too. Neither has done the job properly. I still need to keep my array of dedicated remotes at hand, so why bother with the "universal" remote?

To the AV professionals out there from tech-savvy consumer:
The state of affairs in this industry is just pathetic. Get your acts together. You need standards and systems and interfaces that work.

toby10

06-27-08, 04:50 PM

This is pathetic. Not your response but the performance.

I ordered another tuner to try it out thinking that the tuner I have might be defective in some way. The new tuner has the same behavior - audio but no video on startup, power cycle required to obtain video.

BTW, I am on my second copy of the SONY AV receiver, too.

HDMI connectors that all but unplug themselves and have no locking feature.

I am on my second Harmony "universal" remote, too. Neither has done the job properly. I still need to keep my array of dedicated remotes at hand, so why bother with the "universal" remote?

To the AV professionals out there from tech-savvy consumer:
The state of affairs in this industry is just pathetic. Get your acts together. You need standards and systems and interfaces that work.

I couldn't agree more with your assessment of the AV industry these days. Sad and pathetic indeed! :eek:

HDMI compatibility and handshaking issues are numerous and industry wide. :(

My Yamaha AVR remote works flawlessly with my H260f. To be fair though I don't try to enter a particular station to tune in.
I only get 5 local OTA stations so I simply do the "ch+" and "ch-".

Big Lag

06-27-08, 06:02 PM

Thanks for listening, toby10.

Brandson

06-29-08, 10:31 AM

Whidbey

06-29-08, 11:28 AM

Does anyone know if there is any retailer in Toronto that sells the Samsung DTB-H260F or an equivalent OTA HD tuner? Or is there any internet retailer in Canada that sells it? I'd rather buy a new unit than take my chances with used ones on Ebay.

Try here: http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=22992&page=25 . There's is a community of users in your area, they can probably help.

Big Lag

06-29-08, 07:02 PM

Buy it from Amazon.com. They have a 30 day warranty with a pre-paid return program if you're not happy.

Brandson

06-30-08, 11:39 AM

Buy it from Amazon.com. They have a 30 day warranty with a pre-paid return program if you're not happy.

Amazon.com won't ship electronics to Canada, including this tuner. I just tried.

mlmahon

06-30-08, 07:58 PM

Amazon.com won't ship electronics to Canada, including this tuner. I just tried.
I bought 1 on ebay from the seller OCEANSNO.1 which is located in Vaughn, Ontario. They ship to Canada and the US. It worked perfectly. They were tested and guaranteed under their return policy.

nguyej1

07-01-08, 11:31 AM

Can we setup H260F timer do repetition (weekday or one day each week)?

Scooper

07-01-08, 01:00 PM

I don't think that is an option.

mlmahon

07-01-08, 08:06 PM

Can we setup H260F timer do repetition (weekday or one day each week)?
The timer function allows you to select which programs you wish to watch in advance on a one time basis. The future time selection is limited by the currently displayed program guide for each channel.

emuman100

07-01-08, 10:38 PM

I run my own private QAM system. I use commercial IRDs that I connect to my QAM modulators. I pass transport streams from C band satellite transponders right to a cable channel QAM modulated. On the specific transport stream I'm transmodulating on QAM, it contains DW-TV, which has a video stream, ac3 stream, and mp3 stream. It also contains DW Radio 1 and 2, which are mp2 audio only. Also, it contains a channel, CDM, which has an mpeg2 video stream and an mp2 audio stream. This channel the mp2 audio plays fine. On DW Radio 1 and 2, the audio stream is decoded for a second, silent for 3 or 4, decoded for a second, silent for 3 or 4 seconds, etc. Does anyone know why?

This has been driving me crazy because I tried every interleave setting my QAM modulator has.

Thanks.

Jonathan

toby10

07-02-08, 07:49 AM

About every six months my H260f has a tantrum. It's an easy fix but I'm just curious if others experience the issue.

H260f ==> HDMI ==> AVR ==> HDMI ==> TV

While flipping through ch's (ch+, ch-) the unit just freezes and will not respond to any remote commands (both factory remote and AVR universal remote). The image & audio are fine, just can't change ch or power off unit via remote.

I then switch to a different input on my AVR, then back to the H260f. Image and audio are there but the image is now *pink* :eek: I think the *pink* is actually my AVR not getting proper picture info from the H260f. My original guess was HDMI handshake/compatibility, but I don't see where this would effect the units remote control issue (not recognizing or responding to ANY IR command).

I do a manual power cycle (OFF/ON) on the H260, image & audio are fine (image is back to normal), and all works as expected till it's next six month checkup.

Like clockwork this issue will return in about six months. If everything I owned only needed a six month power cycle to fix all hiccups I'd be very happy. ;) Anyone else have this issue?

Big Lag

07-02-08, 02:24 PM

I couldn't agree more with your assessment of the AV industry these days. Sad and pathetic indeed! :eek:

HDMI compatibility and handshaking issues are numerous and industry wide. :(

My Yamaha AVR remote works flawlessly with my H260f. To be fair though I don't try to enter a particular station to tune in.
I only get 5 local OTA stations so I simply do the "ch+" and "ch-".

I did manage to get the receiver and tuner to work together. You have to turn on the display first and wait for it to boot up (>2 sec), then turn on the receiver and wait for it to boot up (>15 seconds), then you can turn on the tuner and it will negotiate the HDMI handshake with the receiver successfully. So far, this process has worked 100% for me (keeping finger crossed).

Big Lag

07-02-08, 02:27 PM

My tuner has a quirk, too. Every now and then it freezes, just like yours (but no pinkness). It also occaisionally addds channels that I have previously deleted. I then have to go back and manually delete them (again).

Whidbey

07-02-08, 02:49 PM

Anyone try to get the Archos TV+ to control the DTB-H260F? I'm interested in the TV+ and was wondering if anyone here uses it.

toby10

07-02-08, 05:59 PM

I did manage to get the receiver and tuner to work together. You have to turn on the display first and wait for it to boot up (>2 sec), then turn on the receiver and wait for it to boot up (>15 seconds), then you can turn on the tuner and it will negotiate the HDMI handshake with the receiver successfully. So far, this process has worked 100% for me (keeping finger crossed).

Glad you found the magical *sequence* for your HDMI issue. Luckily I've not had to do any particular sequencing for any of my HDMI AV gear "yet". :)

I've heard of a few others with the H260f automatically adding previously deleted ch's but I have not experienced this. I get 7 stations OTA, plus 4 *bulls--t* sub weather weather ch's. But I only use 5 stations and deleted all others including subs and the deleted ch's have never come back. :cool:

DJSloan

07-03-08, 09:43 PM

I just bought a 260 to go along with a DVDO VP processor. It is hooked up with optical out then coax digital from VP to receiver. Everytime I change channels its sends a loud static pop to my speakers. Worried I may damage them. I need to either mute it or really turn down the volume. Has anyone else experienced this? Is there a way to stop it?

toby10

07-04-08, 05:57 AM

DJSloan

07-08-08, 02:29 AM

Have you tried the 260 direct to the TV or AVR bypassing the VP? Still get the same pop's?

I finally had a chance to try it without the VP. Problem is not present on either the optical out to AVR or HDMI out to TV. Got to chalk it up to another VP quirk.

toby10

07-08-08, 12:17 PM

I finally had a chance to try it without the VP. Problem is not present on either the optical out to AVR or HDMI out to TV. Got to chalk it up to another VP quirk.

I had suspected as much. You may want to ask on the VP forum why it is not functioning properly with the H260f, might just be settings in the VP.

I have a iScan VP50 but I never hooked it up to the H260f. My VP50 is currently not even in use and is boxed up (I plan on selling it) otherwise I'd plug my H260f into it and see if I could duplicate your issues.

waldenlima

07-09-08, 04:43 AM

does anybody know how much the DTB-H260F is?

toby10

07-09-08, 07:06 AM

does anybody know how much the DTB-H260F is?

Google & ebay.

Big Lag

07-09-08, 01:47 PM

egnlsn

07-09-08, 02:02 PM

does anybody know how much the DTB-H260F is?
I bought mine from Circuit City for ~180

toby10

07-09-08, 06:39 PM

Amazon = $160

ebay = a little less but the unit may not be a new one. Be careful you're not buying else's problem. Watch out when purchasing from foreign countries (even Canada). Review the seller's feedback and rating.

..... and make certain you are getting a remote via ebay. It's another $20 to $30 to buy a remote seperately. :eek:

Whidbey

07-09-08, 07:34 PM

Got mine for $155 plus tax at BB. CC was having a sale and they price matched.

tloder

07-09-08, 11:31 PM

mlmahon

07-10-08, 08:52 PM

I bought this hoping it would solve a problem. I live in a building with crappy Dtv service (no HD locals). I have a Westinghouse LCD with a built in QAM tuner. I can plug the cable directly into to ant in and get locals in SD and HD, and some other basic cable analog stations. I was hoping to do the same with this box. However, it doesn't pick up any cable stations. If I try to add the Air stations it only picks up CBS, NBC, ABC - in HD and SD. No PBS or FOX. I think I can probably add an antenna and get the local, but I'd like to try and do it this way.

Is there something I am missing?

Thanks,

Tom
I assume you did a channel scan for cable on the H260F.

Your TV has an analog and digital tuner built in. The H260F is a digital only tuner that will receive OTA broadcasts and unscrambled QAM cable. Without knowing your location and reception conditions all I can suggest is a couple of rules of thumb.

It always helps to have a good antenna, preferably outside.

For digital, higher is always better.

Hope this helps.:)

tloder

07-10-08, 10:21 PM

sbliftmachine

07-11-08, 05:30 AM

Sorry I'm a little confused...since it doesn't have an analog tuner...can you still hook up coax cable line from the wall into this and still use it on a monitor (w/out any tuners)? Thanks.

toby10

07-11-08, 07:02 AM

Sorry I'm a little confused...since it doesn't have an analog tuner...can you still hook up coax cable line from the wall into this and still use it on a monitor (w/out any tuners)? Thanks.

Yes. Standard RG6 or RG59 coax to the H260f will get you:
- local OTA DTV broadcasts via antenna
- QAM DTV ch's. via cable line (note: you will only get the free clear QAM ch's)

But to use both OTA & QAM requires an A/B switch.

toby10

07-11-08, 07:41 AM

I'm in Philadelphia. I get the fact that it doesn't have an NTSC tuner. That makes sense. What I don't understand is the fact the I can't get Fox or PBS or CW 29, 12, 17 respectively. Those should be OTA channels. I should be getting them right through the cable - like on the TV with tuner... right? Is there a setting I am missing somewhere?

maybe I need to manually add those channels. I'm going to try rabbit ears as well. That way I could ditch the basic cable and save some money.

Are you currently getting OTA ch's via antenna to your TV? Does your TV have an ATSC tuner? If it does, why do you need this box?

To use the H260f via OTA you need to set the unit to ANT and do a full ch scan. Then you will see what local OTA's you are getting.

tloder

07-11-08, 09:05 AM

Yes. But right now I can only get ABC, NBC, CBS.

toby10

07-11-08, 09:14 AM

Yes. But right now I can only get ABC, NBC, CBS.

I'm not clear which question you are answering (use the QUOTE button to reply) so here goes:

Different tuners get different results in what ch's it will properly tune in. It's a crap shoot as the H260f may well improve your OTA reception or it may be no better or even worse.

I'd suggest looking into a better antenna, preferably an outdoor antenna. ;)

mlmahon

07-11-08, 09:20 AM

Yes. But right now I can only get ABC, NBC, CBS.
Give us your zip code so we can go to TVfool.com and see where you are in relation to the local tv transmitters. Then we can give a more intelligent and informed response.

Thanks,

ml

tloder

07-11-08, 09:22 AM

Are you currently getting OTA ch's via antenna to your TV? Does your TV have an ATSC tuner? If it does, why do you need this box?

To use the H260f via OTA you need to set the unit to ANT and do a full ch scan. Then you will see what local OTA's you are getting.

I am getting 3 HD local channels via ANT but from the RG6 cable from the wall. I don't have an actually antenna connected. I'm planning to use this on a projector which doesn't have a tuner. I was just comparing it to my TV to see what the differences are.

tloder

07-11-08, 09:24 AM

Give us your zip code so we can go to TVfool.com and see where you are in relation to the local tv transmitters. Then we can give a more intelligent and informed response.

Thanks,

ml

19106. Thanks.

toby10

07-11-08, 09:56 AM

I am getting 3 HD local channels via ANT but from the RG6 cable from the wall. I don't have an actually antenna connected. I'm planning to use this on a projector which doesn't have a tuner. I was just comparing it to my TV to see what the differences are.

Ok.....so.....you are doing a complete ch scan in the CBL mode (clear QAM) and you are only seeing 3 ch's, correct?

If so you may need to page through many ch's to find all of your clear QAM ch's. Usually the locals are all grouped together, but not always.

Also keep in mind:
- remaining ch's might only be availible via clear QAM in analog. The cable co's must offer all local ch's for free but I don't think they are mandated to provide these in digital. ex: my cable co's clear QAM does not offer the local PBS in digital, only analog, so the H260f is blind to these analogs.

- finding ch's via clear QAM can be a chore as the clear QAM ch #'s may be very different than what you are used too. ex: a local ch 7 OTA might be ch 502 on clear QAM. You may need to page/scroll through hundreds of empty ch's to find your few local OTA ch's.

sbliftmachine

07-11-08, 12:25 PM

Yes. Standard RG6 or RG59 coax to the H260f will get you:
- local OTA DTV broadcasts via antenna
- QAM DTV ch's. via cable line (note: you will only get the free clear QAM ch's)

But to use both OTA & QAM requires an A/B switch.

So it won't show none digital channels through the cable line if the monitor I hook the H260f into also doesn't have an analog tuner?

Scooper

07-11-08, 12:47 PM

There is no analog tuner in the Samsung DTB-H260F. Only ATSC (OTA) and clear QAM (cable) tuners.

toby10

07-11-08, 01:02 PM

So it won't show none digital channels through the cable line if the monitor I hook the H260f into also doesn't have an analog tuner?

As Scooper said, no analog tuner. H260f is a digital only tuner and will receive/tune only digital freq's/ch's.

I use my H260f on a plasma monitor (no tuners) but you will ONLY get OTA and/or the very few FREE clear QAM ch's via cable. I'd suggest you do a little research on clear QAM (in general and specifically for your cable co.).

Generally for the FREE clear QAM ch's you can get your locals, shopping ch's, maybe govt. and public access ch's, music ch's, assuming these are offered in digital (not analog) clear QAM. Most other ch's would be encrypted or scrambled requiring a converter box supplied by your cable co. for $$$.

The H260f does not replace a cable box/converter.

If ya want FREE, this is what you get. You get what you pay for. :)

sbliftmachine

07-11-08, 05:41 PM

As Scooper said, no analog tuner. H260f is a digital only tuner and will receive/tune only digital freq's/ch's.

I use my H260f on a plasma monitor (no tuners) but you will ONLY get OTA and/or the very few FREE clear QAM ch's via cable. I'd suggest you do a little research on clear QAM (in general and specifically for your cable co.).

Generally for the FREE clear QAM ch's you can get your locals, shopping ch's, maybe govt. and public access ch's, music ch's, assuming these are offered in digital (not analog) clear QAM. Most other ch's would be encrypted or scrambled requiring a converter box supplied by your cable co. for $$$.

The H260f does not replace a cable box/converter.

If ya want FREE, this is what you get. You get what you pay for. :)

Thanks for the clarification. So is there any way to use the h260f and an analog tv tuner at the same time? Basically, I have a spare 24 lcd monitor w/ hdmi and no tv tuners of any type. And I was hoping to use the monitor as a bedroom tv. The monitor as multiple inputs but I was hoping to not switch inputs each time I go from DTV and regular analog cable tv because the monitor does not have a remote. Is there a way to connect the cable line from the wall into an analog tuner and then connect the analog tuner into the h260f and then into the monitor. So I can watch both analog and QAM on the same input from the monitor? Thanks.

Scooper

07-11-08, 05:52 PM

sbliftmachine

07-11-08, 06:37 PM

Analog tuner being a VCR - this should be an option if your monitor can accept composite or S-Video and analog audio inputs.

The Samsung doesnot work too well as a CECB - all menu options are only available on the component / HDMI outputs.

My monitor does have a HDMI input. Is it possible to connect the analog cable line into the VCR and then connect the VCR into the Samsung and the Samsung into the Monitor via HDMI? Would that allow me to watch both analog cable (from the VCR tuner) and QAM channels (from the h260f tuner) on the HDMI input? Or would I have to put the VCR on one input and the Samsung on another, and have to switch inputs on the monitor if I want to go from analog cable channels to QAM channels.

Scooper

07-11-08, 07:10 PM

You have to do the switching on your monitor. I suppose you could hookup the A/V outputs of the Samsung and feed them into the VCR if you don't mind watching that way.

Whidbey

07-11-08, 07:43 PM

My monitor does have a HDMI input. Is it possible to connect the analog cable line into the VCR and then connect the VCR into the Samsung and the Samsung into the Monitor via HDMI? Would that allow me to watch both analog cable (from the VCR tuner) and QAM channels (from the h260f tuner) on the HDMI input? Or would I have to put the VCR on one input and the Samsung on another, and have to switch inputs on the monitor if I want to go from analog cable channels to QAM channels.

Scooper's right. You have to use your monitor as the switch between sources. The Samsung will not pass the VCR's signal on through the HDMI out.

Best way to hook everything up is like this:
Cable to 2 way splitter.
One cable to Samsung, one cable to VCR.
Samsung HDMI out to monitor.
VCR composite video and L/R audio out to monitor.

If you want to record from the Samsung, use it's composite video and L/R audio to feed the VCR.

mlmahon

07-12-08, 01:18 AM

mlmahon

07-12-08, 01:38 AM

19106. Thanks.

OK, You're in east Philly. You are within 10 miles of all the major station transmitters. You can use an unamplified desktop antenna (like a silver sensor yagi) and point it due Northwest. You should be able to get 11 or 12 stations plus their subchannels easy, but you'll need to re-aim to the Southeast to pull in PBS.

Here is your TV Fool page showing the vital stats for your local DTV stations.

Good Luck!

jjeff

07-12-08, 09:03 AM

My monitor does have a HDMI input. Is it possible to connect the analog cable line into the VCR and then connect the VCR into the Samsung and the Samsung into the Monitor via HDMI? Would that allow me to watch both analog cable (from the VCR tuner) and QAM channels (from the h260f tuner) on the HDMI input? Or would I have to put the VCR on one input and the Samsung on another, and have to switch inputs on the monitor if I want to go from analog cable channels to QAM channels.
In your case I might actually suggest something like a Panasonic EZ-28 DVDR. With that you'll get both a digital and analog tuner as well as HDMI "upconverted" output. Yes I said upconverted because the output is not true HD output all the way through but I've had one and I got quite good results on a 32" 720p display. Since you have even a smaller display I think you'll be more than happy. Plus you'll have the added benefit of being able to play and record DVDs. The cost is a bit more at ~$229 at BB but that's what I'd suggest in your case anyway. Not knocking the Sammy but in your case if you wanted analog too it just makes more sense. There's a EZ-28 thread in the DVDR forum here at AVS.

toby10

07-12-08, 09:09 AM

Scooper's right. You have to use your monitor as the switch between sources. The Samsung will not pass the VCR's signal on through the HDMI out.

Best way to hook everything up is like this:
Cable to 2 way splitter.
One cable to Samsung, one cable to VCR.
Samsung HDMI out to monitor.
VCR composite video and L/R audio out to monitor.

If you want to record from the Samsung, use it's composite video and L/R audio to feed the VCR.

.....and you can buy a simple universal remote for $10 (or less) to replace your Samsung TV remote. This should give you your input selection options as well as other basic TV functions.

But, as suggested, the H260f seems a bit overkill for your application if your only goal is analog & QAM cable . I don't know if one exists but you might want to try and find a cheaper QAM tuner box with HD output. If you want all three (OTA, QAM, analog cable) then the H260f would be a nice solution but would require an A/B switch to go from OTA to QAM and/or analog cable.

Samsung's only real *stumble* with the H260f was not incorporating two separate RF inputs for OTA and QAM. :confused:

jjeff

07-12-08, 09:50 AM

I was going to mention the Tivax LX1000, HD ATSC/QAM. It's not as sensitive as the 260 but since he has cable that's probably not that big a deal. Another problem with that box, unless they've changed it is no audio over HDMI. Not sure if his monitor has a separate audio input to go along with it's HDMI input.
The Tivax goes for ~$100. If interested check out a thread I started:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1030266&highlight=tivax+lx1000

Whidbey

07-12-08, 12:27 PM

You don't need to use a splitter. Run the cable to the 260f first and use its cable out (pass-through) as input to the VCR tuner.

True, but then you have to have the Samsung on to enable the pass through.

Whidbey

07-12-08, 12:28 PM

Samsung's only real *stumble* with the H260f was not incorporating two separate RF inputs for OTA and QAM. :confused:

Confuses me to since the Samsung has the option of scanning for both Air and Cable at the same time.

sbliftmachine

07-12-08, 01:53 PM

In your case I might actually suggest something like a Panasonic EZ-28 DVDR. With that you'll get both a digital and analog tuner as well as HDMI "upconverted" output. Yes I said upconverted because the output is not true HD output all the way through but I've had one and I got quite good results on a 32" 720p display. Since you have even a smaller display I think you'll be more than happy. Plus you'll have the added benefit of being able to play and record DVDs. The cost is a bit more at ~$229 at BB but that's what I'd suggest in your case anyway. Not knocking the Sammy but in your case if you wanted analog too it just makes more sense. There's a EZ-28 thread in the DVDR forum here at AVS.

Hey jjeff, thanks for the suggestion. I read the official thread for the dvdr player and also check it out on the panasonic website. You mentioned on the thread that you returned the player due to issue with recording. I'm unlikely to use its recording functions but will take advantage of the dvd player and the analog and digital tuners. Would you say that those functions all work pretty well? It does seem like the EZ-28 is perfect for what I'm trying to do, especially since CC has it on sale for $199.

Rammitinski

07-12-08, 02:01 PM

The tuner is a bit slow at changing channels compared to most newer standalone tuners, but that's about the only thing.

I've seen recordings of HD material from the Panny, and they really look surprisingly better than I would've even expected. And they should look very good on a display smaller than 32", for sure. They even looked good on my 50" HD display.

jjeff

07-12-08, 03:24 PM

I tend to really use my DVDRs and have gotten used to older Panasonic ES series machines. While the new EZ's do make great recordings they are a little quirky. By that I mean they occasionally do odd things that the ES series do not. If I had to guess I'd say 98 or 99% of my EZ recordings went well, it's just the 1 or 2% I had issues with. For most people that would probably not be a issue, but for me I get almost 100% success with my ES machines so I'm willing to take a small hit on PQ.
As Ramm said most any DVDR tends to be rather slow to channel surf. It probably only takes a second or 2 to switch channels but if you're used to a faster TV it may bother you.
$199 sounds like a great deal for a new EZ-28. I haven't really seen them advertised for much less than the $229 I mentioned. Of course used or internet may be less.
Lastly if looking at DVDRs with digital tuners not all are created equal. Funia units tend to have more issues with PQ relating to their tuners. Also I had even worse luck with last years Pannys, the EZ-x7 series. For $199 I wouldn't even consider one of the x7 series machines.

buiyahkah

07-12-08, 07:52 PM

divyaraja

07-12-08, 11:11 PM

I have Comcast basic cable. When I connect DTB-H260F it did not pick-up any digital channels. Tried all the settings,removed splitters, no luck.

But when I connect Philips DVDR3576H, it's ATSC\QAM tuner did pick many digital channels. Not sure why DTB-H260F did not work. Any help will be appriciated.

mlmahon

07-12-08, 11:52 PM

True, but then you have to have the Samsung on to enable the pass through.
When the 260F is turned off, the pass-through rf output is unamplified and the level is the same as if you had run the cable through a splitter. Anyway, it doesn't hurt to leave the tuner on. It uses a small amount of current.

toby10

07-13-08, 08:32 AM

i wish i had read this thread before wasting about an hour of my time trying to get the h260f to recognize cable channels where the cable was coming straight from the wall. so if i got this right, plugging a cable from the wall to get cable tv thru the h260f will not work? i tried doing the channel scan with the "cable" option but it would not work. i recently sold my panny 9uk and the h260f to someone and was trying to set it up for him but it did not work. so i finally ended up just plugging the cable into his vcr and used composite cables from the vcr and plugged it into the display.

Again, I'd *strongly* recomend you read up on what QAM is and what QAM is not. ;)

QAM TV Explained (be sure to read the posted replies to gain some knowledge of QAM limitations and issues from people using QAM tuners):
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fasterforward/2008/03/revisiting_digital_tv_a_qam_qu.html

QAM explanation II (article geared towards HTPC/PC HDTV QAM tuner card, but the same QAM limitations apply to the H260f or any QAM tuner):
http://www.hdtvtunerinfo.com/hdtvpctunerqam.html

Help in finding what free clear QAM ch’s might be available in your area:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=45

Personally I find QAM more bother than it’s worth, which is why I don’t use it. My H260f was purchased specifically for OTA local HD ch’s.
I’ll *play* with QAM twice a year on a rainy day when I’m bored.

My QAM ch scan found over 130 digital ch’s but most of these are encrypted/scrambled by the cable co. requiring the cable co's converter box to view them.

My QAM lineup (viewable via QAM tuner, last time I scanned). I’m guessing it’s a typical QAM lineup:

My Local OTA ch’s on QAM:
- Major Networks = 4 (ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX)
- Minor Networks = 2 (WB, CW)
- Local Weather Sub-Channels = 3
- PBS = 1 (not currently available as a digital QAM ch)

My Non-Local ch’s on QAM:
- PPV = 2 (but you need the cable co’s converter box to view the offering)
- Shopping ch’s = 2
- Digital Music ch’s = 38

QAM ch’s are often moved, added, deleted. I had HDNet and HDNet-Movies via QAM for a while, but they were removed.
To quote Forest Gump: "QAM is like a box of chocolates..........." :)

buiyahkah

07-13-08, 10:30 AM

thanks for your help. i guess i'll just take the h260f back and sell it. anyone interested in buying one? :)

jjeff

07-13-08, 01:51 PM

Again, I'd *strongly* recomend you read up on what QAM is and what QAM is not. ;)

QAM TV Explained (be sure to read the posted replies to gain some knowledge of QAM limitations and issues from people using QAM tuners):
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fasterforward/2008/03/revisiting_digital_tv_a_qam_qu.html

QAM explanation II (article geared towards HTPC/PC HDTV QAM tuner card, but the same QAM limitations apply to the H260f or any QAM tuner):
http://www.hdtvtunerinfo.com/hdtvpctunerqam.html

Help in finding what free clear QAM ch’s might be available in your area:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=45

Personally I find QAM more bother than it’s worth, which is why I don’t use it. My H260f was purchased specifically for OTA local HD ch’s.
I’ll *play* with QAM twice a year on a rainy day when I’m bored.

My QAM ch scan found over 130 digital ch’s but most of these are encrypted/scrambled by the cable co. requiring the cable co's converter box to view them.

My QAM lineup (viewable via QAM tuner, last time I scanned). I’m guessing it’s a typical QAM lineup:

My Local OTA ch’s on QAM:
- Major Networks = 4 (ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX)
- Minor Networks = 2 (WB, CW)
- Local Weather Sub-Channels = 3
- PBS = 1 (not currently available as a digital QAM ch)

My Non-Local ch’s on QAM:
- PPV = 2 (but you need the cable co’s converter box to view the offering)
- Shopping ch’s = 2
- Digital Music ch’s = 38

QAM ch’s are often moved, added, deleted. I had HDNet and HDNet-Movies via QAM for a while, but they were removed.
To quote Forest Gump: "QAM is like a box of chocolates..........." :)

I totally agree with Toby10. Comcast in my area has basically the same QAM lineup with the exception of Bravo SD. For whatever reason that channel is not scrambled. It would be nice if it was the HD version though since Bravo analog is already available to anyone with a cable ready TV.
In my area anyone buying a box like the Sammy with the purpose of getting extra "free" channels will be disappointed and may just end up returning the box.

buiyahkah

07-13-08, 03:05 PM

Yeah I see what you mean, my original use for it was to pick up OTA HD channels on my Panny 9UK since my apartment complex had a contract with satellite and required like $50k in liability insurance to mount a dish. Since then, I've moved and sold my 9UK and the H260F and tried to get it to work for the guy who bought it from me with his analog cable.

Whidbey

07-13-08, 06:59 PM

When the 260F is turned off, the pass-through rf output is unamplified and the level is the same as if you had run the cable through a splitter. Anyway, it doesn't hurt to leave the tuner on. It uses a small amount of current.

?? If a splitter did to my signal what the "unamplified" 260F does, it would be a pretty crappy splitter and on it's way back to Radio Shack.

tloder

07-13-08, 08:32 PM

Success! Plugged in a $10 set of rabbit ears, and I get about 15 good channels. Bye bye basic cable. This will do me just fine on my projector.

Thanks for everyone's help. It would've been nice if the Samsung box had and analog tuner, but oh well. This will be cheaper in the long run.

Scrumhalf

07-14-08, 01:51 AM

Does the 260F allows simultaneous output of 1080i signal on the component video outputs as well as 480i on the composite video output? I would like to watch programming at 1080i while simultaneously recording on a VCR in SD. Is this possible or does the 260F cut off the composite video output when it is set for 1080i output on the component video pins?

Scooper

07-14-08, 09:34 AM

Yes - all outputs (except both HD) are active at once.

2 composite video, 1 S-Video (both of these are on all the time)
1 HDMI, 1 component (only one of these is active at once)
2 sets analog RCA audio, 1 TOSLINK (All active at all times).

Whidbey

07-23-08, 07:08 PM

I picked these up on another forum. Might be useful for someone here.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

I was able to program my DTB-H260F remote codes into my slingbox by using the file below. Not sure if this will help for your case, but I hope it does ...

Name:,Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner,,,,v9.06,,,,,,,CURRENT DATA
Devices:,Manual Settings,0,1,0,40,,,,,,,
Manual:,01 FF,0 = 1-byte,LSB,58,NO,,,,,,,
Setup:,2000,27 = URC-9910 / 8910 / UEI HTPro,02 - TV,OBC,USE,00 80 00 40,1,No,,,,
URC-9910 / 8910 / UEI HTPro Device Upgrade Code:,,,,,,,,,,,,
Upgrade Code 0 = 0F D0 (TV/2000) Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner (KM v9.06),,,,,,,,,,,,
FF 08 7E FA 8D 00 80 00 40 50 D0 04 30 B0 78 A4 9C 0C 08 88 48 C8 28 84 A8 F0 DC,,,,,,,,,,,,
End,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,
Protocol Code: (Upgrade Req'd),,,,,,,,,,,,
Upgrade Protocol 0 = 01 FF (S3C8+) Custom Protocol for TV/2000 Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner (KM v9.06),,,,,,,,,,,,
42 8D 41 8B 16 8F 45 05 08 00 FA 02 DA 00 FA 00 E6 73 6E 08 CA 08 B6 00 00 00 11 20 11 E4 07 08 60 08 8D 01 61,,,,,,,,,,,,
End,,,,,,,,,,,,
Key Move Code:,,,198,,,,,,,,,
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fFunctions,fOBC,fByte2,bButtons,bFunctions,fNotes,Device Combiner,,kFunctions,kBoundDev,kBoundKey,kShift,b$Functions
num 0,009,,0,00 - num 0,,Protocol ID,Fixed Data,,,,,
num 1,000,,1,01 - num 1,,,,,,,,
num 2,001,,2,02 - num 2,,,,,,,,
num 3,002,,3,03 - num 3,,,,,,,,
num 4,003,,4,04 - num 4,,,,,,,,
num 5,004,,5,05 - num 5,,,,,,,,
num 6,005,,6,06 - num 6,,,,,,,,
num 7,006,,7,07 - num 7,,,,,,,,
num 8,007,,8,08 - num 8,,,,,,,,
num 9,008,,9,09 - num 9,,,,,,,,
vol up,010,,vol up,10 - vol up,,,,,,,,
vol down,011,,vol down,11 - vol down,,,,,,,,
mute,032,,mute,12 - mute,,,,,,,,
channel up,012,,channel up,13 - channel up,,,,,,,,
channel down,013,,channel down,14 - channel down,,,,,,,,
up arrow,016,,power,38 - power,,,,,,,,
down arrow,017,,enter,27 - - (dash),,,,,,,,
left arrow,018,,tv/vid,20 - ANTENNA,,,,,,,,
right arrow,019,,prev,28 - PRE CH,,,,,,,,
enter,020,,menu,22 - MENU,,,,,,,,
ANTENNA,057,,guide,29 - GUIDE,,,,,,,,
FAV CH,027,,up arrow,15 - up arrow,,,,,,,,
MENU,037,,down arrow,16 - down arrow,,,,,,,,
RED BUTTON,038,,left arrow,17 - left arrow,,,,,,,,
GREEN BUTTON,034,,right arrow,18 - right arrow,,,,,,,,
ORANGE BUTTON,035,,select,19 - enter,,,,,,,,
BLUE BUTTON,036,,sleep,,,,,,,,,
- (dash),059,,pip,,,,,,,,,
PRE CH,048,,info,36 - INFO,,,,,,,,
GUIDE,015,,swap,,,,,,,,,
CH LIST,054,,move,,,,,,,,,
FREEZE,050,,play,,,,,,,,,
ASPECT,058,,pause,,,,,,,,,
TIMER,055,,rewind,,,,,,,,,
MTS,049,,fwd,,,,,,,,,
EXIT,021,,stop,,,,,,,,,
INFO,033,,record,,,,,,,,,
CAPTION,052,,exit,35 - EXIT,,,,,,,,
power,030,,surround,,,,,,,,,
,,,input,,,,,,,,,
,,,+100,,,,,,,,,
,,,fav/scan,,,,,,,,,
,,,device button,,,,,,,,,
,,,f fwd,,,,,,,,,
,,,f rew,,,,,,,,,
,,,com/skip,,,,,,,,,
,,,shift-right,,,,,,,,,
,,,pip freeze,,,,,,,,,
,,,slow,,,,,,,,,
,,,eject,,,,,,,,,
,,,slow+,,,,,,,,,
,,,slow-,,,,,,,,,
,,,x2,,,,,,,,,
,,,center,,,,,,,,,
,,,rear,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom1,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom2,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom3,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom4,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom5,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom6,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom7,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom8,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom9,,,,,,,,,
,,,phantom10,,,,,,,,,
,,,setup,,,,,,,,,
,,,light,,,,,,,,,
,,,home theater,,,,,,,,,
,,,M1,,,,,,,,,
,,,M2,,,,,,,,,
,,,M3,,,,,,,,,
,,,macro4,,,,,,,,,
,,,L1,,,,,,,,,
,,,L2,,,,,,,,,
,,,L3,,,,,,,,,
,,,L4,,,,,,,,,
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Line Notes:,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Upgrade protocol 0 = 01 FF (S3C8+) Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner (PB v4.00),,,,,,,,,,,,,
42 8D 41 8B 16 8F 45 05 08 00 FA 02 DA 00 FA 00 ,,,,,,,,,,,,,
E6 73 6E 08 CA 08 B6 00 00 00 11 20 11 E4 07 08 ,,,,,,,,,,,,,
60 08 8D 01 61,,,,,,,,,,,,,
End,,,,,,,,,,,,,
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,,,,,,,,,,,,EOF Marker - DO NOT DELETE,