The salesperson basically said to me when I asked if he had anymore, "what is that doing out?" It is suppose to be in our warehouse. This could explain why we don't see too many on shelves.?

Not sure of the implication there :confused: .

Will this receiver work for for people who have an antenna rotator? Can I save channels with the antenna pointed one direction, then turn the antenna, and re-scan without losing my original channels?

Jay

The salesperson basically said to me when I asked if he had anymore. "what is that doing out?" It is suppose to be in our warehouse.
-DonB2

Could be it finally occured to someone that if the customer realizes they can get great OTA HD for free they'll sell a lot fewer of those satellite subcriptions. :)

"Will this receiver work for for people who have an antenna rotator? Can I save channels with the antenna pointed one direction, then turn the antenna, and re-scan without losing my original channels?"

You may be able to enter a OTA station manually to your channel list but I am almost postive that if you do a rescan the previous OTA channels will be history.

-DonB2

I just could not figure why he felt the tuner should stay in the warehouse. But at the time I was more focused on asking him if someone could call his store and have this unit shipped to their store for pickup and he said no.

I did not even see a shelf devoted to the Samsung. The old location that was devoted to the SiR t451 is now taken over by Direct TV OTA receivers that of course you need a subscription to enable them.

-DonB2

It is clumbsy Samsung should have provided separate F connectors one for CABLE/QAM input and the other for OTA ATSC in.
The manual is confusing. In the very beginning when they talk about HD they say that this unit will not work with cable but in deed it does. Its the same way for their 79 & 88 series of DLPs' with 8VSB & QAM. The manual doesn't tell you much. It will allow adding channels (if they are actually there) by just entering in the channel number without entering in the sub channel number; say ch 43 by itself as opposed to 43.1.
BTW, since it appears to be the same (which mens the tuners are probably the same ones used in those TV's, the issue I have with OTA overload and poor cable feeds will be the same.

These tuners are the worst I have seen for for thode condidions in spite of what Peter Putman. wrote in his review.

Will this receiver work for for people who have an antenna rotator? Can I save channels with the antenna pointed one direction, then turn the antenna, and re-scan without losing my original channels?

A complete channel scan from the menu wipes out existing channel data. However, you can add channels individually, by entering the physical channel number that the digital signal uses.

For example, if I aim my antenna towards Asheville NC I can add WUNF-DT (virtual ch 33.x, physical ch 25) by entering "25". If the receiver detects an ATSC signal on that channel, it picks up the virtual channel number from the PSIP data, adds it to the channel map, and the display changes from "25" to "33-1".

So in principle, you can first do a full scan to pick up all the stations from one direction, then rotate the antenna and add other channels individually, provided you know their physical channel numbers.

Where you have to be careful is that if the receiver has already found a virtual channel number that matches the one that you're entering, it goes to that channel instead. In my example, if I've already found WOLO-DT in Columbia SC (virtual ch 25.x, physical ch 8), I can't add WUNF-DT, because entering "25" tunes to WOLO-DT.

In situations like this, you have to add channels in the proper sequence. When I re-do my channel list from scratch, I have to make sure to scan for or add WUNF-DT before WOLO-DT.

"
Originally Posted by videobruce


The manual is confusing. In the very beginning when they talk about HD they say that this unit will not work with cable but in deed it does.

-DonB2


So with respect to the above: I pay for digital cable and use a Motto STB for my HDTV monitor. I also have a SD tv with just an analog tuner (NTSC). Can I use the Samsung with the SD TV as a STB for cable. That is, if I plug the cable into the Samsung and then to my SDTV will it work?
Thanks, confused as ever, greg

A complete channel scan from the menu wipes out existing channel data. However, you can add channels individually, by entering the physical channel number that the digital signal uses.

For example, if I aim my antenna towards Asheville NC I can add WUNF-DT (virtual ch 33.x, physical ch 25) by entering "25". If the receiver detects an ATSC signal on that channel, it picks up the virtual channel number from the PSIP data, adds it to the channel map, and the display changes from "25" to "33-1".

So in principle, you can first do a full scan to pick up all the stations from one direction, then rotate the antenna and add other channels individually, provided you know their physical channel numbers.

Where you have to be careful is that if the receiver has already found a virtual channel number that matches the one that you're entering, it goes to that channel instead. In my example, if I've already found WOLO-DT in Columbia SC (virtual ch 25.x, physical ch 8), I can't add WUNF-DT, because entering "25" tunes to WOLO-DT.

In situations like this, you have to add channels in the proper sequence. When I re-do my channel list from scratch, I have to make sure to scan for or add WUNF-DT before WOLO-DT.

Thanks for the info!

"So with respect to the above: I pay for digital cable and use a Motto STB for my HDTV monitor. I also have a SD tv with just an analog tuner (NTSC). Can I use the Samsung with the SD TV as a STB for cable. That is, if I plug the cable into the Samsung and then to my SDTV will it work?
Thanks, confused as ever, greg "


I think it should provide QAM to your SDTV provided your cable provider is supplying Free QAM channels and that is the RUB because some don't.

Also some people pay for very basic cable that basically only gives them the local channels that can be received with an antenna. These people may not get any QAM channels if they hook a Samsung up to their cable- reason being there could be a trap on the cable line coming in that stops the person from getting the higher numbered channels.

There are other people who have cable that can probably speak better of this for you.

Edit:
I just reread your post and see you say you already have digital Cable. If that is the case than there is a pretty good chance you will at least get the Free digital channels via QAM on the Samsung. But the Samsung is not a cable card capable and as such can not decode/receive the paid for Digital channels.

Don

Could be it finally occured to someone that if the customer realizes they can get great OTA HD for free they'll sell a lot fewer of those satellite subcriptions. :)
That is my guess. :)

I can't find one of these anywhere. There are none to be found at the 3 circuit city's in my area. I found a tag for one at Best Buy, but no actual unit. When I showed the salesman the tag and told him I wanted to buy it, he had no idea what it was and wondered what the tag was doing out. He looked it up on their computer but they had none in stock and none available to order in.

I've been monitioring Circuit City for availability had them for on-line ordering last week. Didn't last long. I expect that if you check next week or so they will be back as they have been available on-line several times in the last month. I was hoping they would have them at my local CC but they only had them when I was unable to buy.

Can I use the Samsung with the SD TV as a STB for cable. That is, if I plug the cable into the Samsung and then to my SDTV will it work?

You have to use the HDMI or component-video (red/green/blue) output from the Samsung to the TV in order for this to be usable. The composite-video (yellow) and S-Video outputs don't pass the on-screen displays (menus, program guide, etc.).

Also, the Samsung gives you only the channels that your cable company doesn't encrypt. This usually means just the local broadcast HD stations. You may find that your cableco doesn't even carry all of those because it hasn't made agreements with some of the stations. For example, the cable company here doesn't carry our local ABC and MNT stations in HD, just the analog SD versions.

That is my guess. :)

I can't find one of these anywhere. There are none to be found at the 3 circuit city's in my area. I found a tag for one at Best Buy, but no actual unit. When I showed the salesman the tag and told him I wanted to buy it, he had no idea what it was and wondered what the tag was doing out. He looked it up on their computer but they had none in stock and none available to order in.

Circuit City online now reports that there are units available for purchase and direct shipment with free shipping! Mine should arrive on Monday. :D Yes, all Circuit City and Best Buy stores in the Raleigh/Durham area report no stock.

I had one ordered through Best Buy, but they continue to report that it is back ordered. I canceled the order after ensuring the Circuit City unit has physically headed via free Fed Ex in my direction.

The Best Buy experience regarding trying to buy this thing was terrible! Web said instore only. 888-Best Buy let me order and do in-store pickup, only the stores were out of stock. Another 888-Best Buy call assured me they were shipping directly to me for free, until I saw that it was back-ordered and $9.42 for shipping. :eek:

The next day, they dared to send me a survey asking how was my in-store pickup experience. :mad: I told them exactly how it was.

Well, as I said, CC has 'em online, and mine will be here soon.

Ciao!

Edit: Mine arrived this morning -- early! 23 channels in Chapel Hill / Pittsboro area.

Simply plugged existing Radio Shack flying saucer in attic to STB Ant In, STB's Ant Out on to TV's Ant In. STB Audio Out to TV Audio In. STB Component Out to TV Component In. Since my TV is Toshiba 50A61 SDTV with component inputs, I had to set STB Resolution Select switch on back to 460i (460p didn't work).

Now I just need to figure how to connect my Panasonic DVD-CP67 back up to the TV. I had to unplug the Component connection to connect the STB. Maybe S-Video from the DVD player won't be too bad. I wanna use the Component for the STB so I can use the on-screen Guide for the STB.

Just yesterday had a new Channelmaster antenna installed with rotor/preamp and a new Samsung DTB-H260F. Where we are located we can receive many HD stations from a northwest, east and a southern direction. One thing we have found to be a disappointment with this new receiver is that when it scans for the stations we can only do that from one direction. When scanning from another direction it re-scans and we loose the original ones scanned in. We are completely new to over-air HD and while the quality of reception is astounding we hope there is a way to scan in all the stations from all 3 directions. We hope someone has an answer to this. Thanks

Hello again, Sorry for the redundant post, just found another previous one that answered my question. Thanks for the help!!

I also have a SD tv with just an analog tuner (NTSC). Can I use the Samsung with the SD TV as a STB for cable. That is, if I plug the cable into the Samsung and then to my SDTV will it work? IF the Sammy has the proper aspect ratio choices. That Prime tuner didn't. You couldn't use it on a 4x3 display.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=638769

I got my unit from J&R yesterday (great service, good price) and hookup was a breeze. The unit works well with a really nice picture on all channels. Two quick questions for the gurus out there:
1. I'm using the component cables supplied with the box. Would I get even better picture with an HDMI cable?
2. It seems the sound is quite a bit lower volume than before. I've turned the volume to 100% on the Samsung remote, and have to use the TV volume to adjust the level. If I switch back to regular TV the level is deafening. I've tried both sound modes on the Samsung. Am I doing something wrong here?

That is my guess. :)

I can't find one of these anywhere. There are none to be found at the 3 circuit city's in my area. I found a tag for one at Best Buy, but no actual unit. When I showed the salesman the tag and told him I wanted to buy it, he had no idea what it was and wondered what the tag was doing out. He looked it up on their computer but they had none in stock and none available to order in.Sounds just like the same BS I would get at my local BB. If you even infer that you can get HDTV without getting a subscription through them, they always act stupid. :rolleyes:

Even the salespeople at my local CC aren't that insulting with their tactics. It must be part of BB's training or something. All I know is that I refuse to even deal with them anymore. If they have something I want (that I've already researched), I just grab it and pay. When I catch them in their lies, they act even more stupid and ignorant. At least at CC, they will say something like '"Oh, THAT"S what you meant", and tactfully get out of what they originally said. They have enough sense to just accept that you will ONLY buy that ATSC tuner, and you have NO interest in subscribing to a service they offer, once you've made that clear. In that case, they just want to make the SURE sale. BB's salespeople just get even more adamant and hostile - even to the point that they'd rather not admit something than actually sell you the item. I guess they just can't take actually being caught in their B.S. In fact, they used to be all over me like vultures. Now that they know me, they won't even come near me. At least I can browse there without them constantly bugging me now ;) :) .

Guys,

After a week of searching, I finally was able to find one of these things in a Circuit City 50 miles from my house. Jackpot right? Well I anxiously drove there and back thinking I was going to finally see some HD broadcasts but when I got home and tried to turn the unit on, all I saw was the power LED blink very weakly... When I try to hold the power button on, the blinking power light grew stronger but it still never became a solid light. I thought maybe it was designed that way so I hooked it up to my TV with component cables and my antenna. However as soon as I hooked it up, the power LED stopped flashing entirely. I tried plugging and unplugging the unit a couple of times, even with different wall sockets, but it was no use. I let it sit for awhile unplugged, then came back 15 min later and tried again. It started blinking again like the first time I tried, but when I tried to plug in my cables again, it died again.

Has anyone had this problem before?? Such a frustrating experience, I wouldn't mind driving all the way back to the original store and exchanging for a working unit but that was their last unit as well...

Has anyone had this problem before?? Such a frustrating experience, I wouldn't mind driving all the way back to the original store and exchanging for a working unit but that was their last unit as well...
Yes, two have, me for one. Look back a short way in this thread. I reported my problem to CC, and they are going through a process of deciding whether I can return my tuner, apparently. When I saw this morning they had some tuners back in stock, I called CC and asked them to set one aside for me to exchange mine (in case they run out again), and the CSR agreed to do that.

i have the tuner and im using the qam and what few channels i get they are all black and white with no adio through hdmi,what gives?

Circuit City online now reports that there are units available for purchase and direct shipment with free shipping!
Thanks for the heads up. I had actually filled out the form a couple days ago for them to e-mail me when it was in stock but I've yet to get an e-mail. Maybe they shunned me because I unchecked the box about not wanting to receive e-mails about other Circuit City special offers. :D

Anyways, I ordered it and it should be on its' way. I also found a coupon code to enter at checkout for $15 off.

Samsung HD Tuner (DTB-H260F)
SAM DTBH260F $179.99 -$15.00 1 $164.99
Immediately available Total coupon savings $15.00
Subtotal $164.99
Shipping Free!
Tax $10.89
Total $175.88

If anyone wants the coupon code: HLA49CSAMY ($15 off orders of $100 or more, valid through 2/28/07)

Yes, two have, me for one. Look back a short way in this thread. I reported my problem to CC, and they are going through a process of deciding whether I can return my tuner, apparently. When I saw this morning they had some tuners back in stock, I called CC and asked them to set one aside for me to exchange mine (in case they run out again), and the CSR agreed to do that.

Ok I found the two posts that you mentioned. Let us know of any new developments of getting your exchange. In the time being is there any alternatives out there that are good and in the same price range?

i have the tuner and im using the qam and what few channels i get they are all black and white with no adio through hdmi,what gives?
Your TV's HDMI inputs probably don't have HDCP built-in, and for whatever reason that can cause that sort of thing.

The problem should be gone if you use component video output. Of course the component output won't output sound, but there are your choices of optical 5.1 and stereo RCA jacks to compensate for that. Make sure that a switch on the back is selected to Y/Pb/Pr and not HDMI when using the component output.

yea i did that and it worked it basicly tells me that my hdmi port is useless seeing as most future hdmi devices will use hdcp which is very disheartening,the thing is i only have two component inputs and i have 5-6 and counting devices that all use component,i need some sort of selector. also is there a way to improve the QAM performance,i seem to occasioanly get other channels but only sometimes,does rescanning improve that? maybe there is some sort of filter i can remove,or maybe use a signal booster? im just curious.

Your TV's HDMI inputs probably don't have HDCP built-in, and for whatever reason that can cause that sort of thing.

The problem should be gone if you use component video output. Of course the component output won't output sound, but there are your choices of optical 5.1 and stereo RCA jacks to compensate for that. Make sure that a switch on the back is selected to Y/Pb/Pr and not HDMI when using the component output.

They will or might use HDCP OTA in the future, but as far as I know not now so I think it's something else.

is there a way to improve the QAM performance,i seem to occasioanly get other channels but only sometimes,does rescanning improve that? maybe there is some sort of filter i can remove,or maybe use a signal booster? im just curious.
You're getting OnDemand content on those channels. You can go into the channel list menu, and delete them when you can.

There's a single button you can press to get that menu, the "CH. LIST" button. It's toward the bottom of the remote, directly below the green button. Oh, and if you're colorblind and see two similarly-colored buttons, it's the one on the right.

I'm running a 91XG antenna with CM7777, CM9521A rotor, CM3024 distribution the DTB-H260F and Westinghouse 37w3 for display and thought I'd give my first impressions. :)

I unpacked everything and connected the H260F to the HD monitor via HDMI and turned everything on. It was quick to come up with the display and I then went into the menu. I don't know about other people but I love a very configurable system and this STB is a little disappointing in that aspect. It DOES have quite a few configuration options but no really technical ones that make me feel like I'm tweaking the best performance out of it.

I immediately set my antenna to 107degrees and then set the H260F to doan auto scan for channels. It found *40* channels for just that direction. It's a little surprising actually because the 91XG is pretty directional but the H260F seems to excel at pulling in weak signals and signals with multipath interference. Interestingly, I've noticed VERY LITTLE dropout with this combination. Infact, the channels are generally too weak to show up (maybe 3 out of those 40) or they come in solid. I've noticed that with only 7 bars I'm still getting rock solid content. (I believe each bar represents 10% but I'm not positive there.)

I especially like how fast the H260F is to responding to the remote and in the ability to move through the guide; however, there's 1 thing that people should REALLY make sure the've done... SET YOUR TIME ZONE. If you don't it will drastically slow down your ability to move through the guide.

Overall, my first impression of the H260F is great. I'm getting channels that I didn't even know existed (and don't show up on antennaweb) which is pretty nifty. There are a few things that I wish were different but most of those have been covered before.

I personally am glad I made the purchase!

thanks mike i started to figure that out after awhile myself,its kinda neat too,though im bummed about my hdmi connection it basicly makes that hdmi port useless as most devices will use hdcp from now on,i guess ill have to get a component selector

You're getting OnDemand content on those channels. You can go into the channel list menu, and delete them when you can.

There's a single button you can press to get that menu, the "CH. LIST" button. It's toward the bottom of the remote, directly below the green button. Oh, and if you're colorblind and see two similarly-colored buttons, it's the one on the right.

This afternoon I noticed there are 11 h260f tuners for sale on eBay, mostly from the Circuit City store on the 'Bay

Ok I found the two posts that you mentioned. Let us know of any new developments of getting your exchange.
The exchange is not going well. I called CC to return my defective tuner Wed. Jan 10 and was told I would be called within 72 hours with instructions about how to return the unit -- incident report number was IM529033. I received no call. I called Sat. Jan 13, 72 hours later, and was told I would be called within 24 hours about returning the defective unit. I received no call. I just called again today, Jan 14, and was told they could not tell me anything yet, but I would be called within approximately 2 weeks. Two weeks.

I am really annoyed. For those of you who also bought defective tuners from CC, in case at some point it is useful to you to demonstrate yours is not the only defective unit, my order number was 4420-00302226, and my name is Gregory Lee.

I've got an old Sony KV-32S10 (1994 vintage) that only has composite and S-video connection and I'm considering purchasing the 260 for working on my digital reception with. Later this year we intend to purchase a HDTV (hopefully prices will drop some more), but in the meantime I'd like to work on getting our antenna system squared away(we're 12-68 miles from transmitters).

From what I understand using the menu system will involve switching a cable back and forth. Will having to swap the cables be extremely detrimental to the tuner/television's use? This TV has a very good picture for a standard analog television and I hate to discard it so once we purchase the HDTV we intend to move this set to my mother-in-law's house.

Apparently the reception qualities are much improved over earlier Samsung tuners, but would I possibly be better off purchasing one of the older/used tuners that actually has composite/s-video connections on them? Or, is the improvement in reception worth the "swap the cables" bit?

Being as I really don't know much about digital/HDTV any suggestions/recommendations are greatly appreciated!!!

Thanks,
Ed

From what I understand using the menu system will involve switching a cable back and forth. Will having to swap the cables be extremely detrimental to the tuner/television's use?
Yes, I think swapping cables would be a real problem. Not impossible -- I think I've seen remote controlled A/B antenna switches -- but more hassle than most would care to put up with. But I don't see why you want to switch cables, anyhow, or even why you want this tuner. Since your present TV has only composite and S-video inputs, you wouldn't be able to see the tuner's screen menus, making it only marginally usable. And using CATV cable input only gets you your cable company's unencoded digital channels, which is probably a very small number of channels, mostly just local (which you might be able to get on your antenna). Then also, when you get your HDTV later, it may have its own ATSC tuner, so this Samsung HDTV tuner might not be needed.

I've got an old Sony KV-32S10 (1994 vintage) that only has composite and S-video connection and I'm considering purchasing the 260 for working on my digital reception with. Later this year we intend to purchase a HDTV (hopefully prices will drop some more), but in the meantime I'd like to work on getting our antenna system squared away(we're 12-68 miles from transmitters).

From what I understand using the menu system will involve switching a cable back and forth. Will having to swap the cables be extremely detrimental to the tuner/television's use? This TV has a very good picture for a standard analog television and I hate to discard it so once we purchase the HDTV we intend to move this set to my mother-in-law's house.

Apparently the reception qualities are much improved over earlier Samsung tuners, but would I possibly be better off purchasing one of the older/used tuners that actually has composite/s-video connections on them? Or, is the improvement in reception worth the "swap the cables" bit?

Being as I really don't know much about digital/HDTV any suggestions/recommendations are greatly appreciated!!!

Thanks,
Ed
If you have a spare composite (yellow jack) input on your TV, you could make an additional connection from the green component video jack on the Samsung 260 to the yellow composite video input on your TV.

You could temporarily switch the TV to that input to see the menus and guide, but you would be seeing a black and white picture. Once you have completed your changes (tuning channels, setting options, etc.) in the Samsung, switch the TV back to the S-video input to watch in color.

This is a little clumsy, but if you going to change to an HDTV soon anyway, maybe this would be tolerable.

Good luck!

We need some more defined explaination how to add stations on the DTB-H260F when using an antenna rotor. I scanned all the stations in from our West position but am having ttrouble adding stations from an east and southern position without erasing the original west scan. Thanks note: amazing how many stations this receiver can get

Anyone buy one of these tuners from Circuit City on ebay? I see that it's used, but CC doesn't have any in stock online.

I'm getting channels that I didn't even know existed (and don't show up on antennaweb) which is pretty nifty. No surprise. Should of used 2150 for your reference (in spite of certain forum members who think so much of color charts);
http://www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp

Since this is in short supply and for anyone that is in a 'rush', there is another alternative. Mind you I'm not saying this is better, but it is available and with a return option;
http://epvision.com/

We need some more defined explaination how to add stations on the DTB-H260F when using an antenna rotor. IF this is the same setup as the Samsung DLPs', all you should have to do is enter the actual (physical) channel number in (without the sub channel) and wait for the tuner to ID the station. Of course the signal has to be there so the tuner can ID the PSID data correctly. Mind you, it doesn't have to be strong enough to view a solid image, only enough so the PSID can be detected.

Example; just enter the numbers 4+3, then wait. NOT 43.1

This is how it is on my Samsung. I have a very weak 8VSB station and if reception isn't good enough the image won't be there, but the TV will recognize that the stations channel number is active and will ID the signal properly (even if I can't watch it).

(If this is incorrect, please post)

IF this is the same setup as the Samsung DLPs', all you should have to do is enter the actual (physical) channel number in (without the sub channel) and wait for the tuner to ID the station.

The DTB260F works the same way.

The instructions don't tell you this (or surely aren't clear). All the time I was entering in the actual full number (43.1 was the example) and it didn't find the station. Then I accidently hit just 43 without the sub channel and there it was. :o

Unbelievable on just how many sets won't allow adding channels. I wish I had a dollar for everytime I asked this question (including in these forums over the past couple of years) and either get a pause in the conversation, since they have no idea what I'm talking about, or tell me yes you can add channels in the channel list.

That isn't adding channels It's just adding or removing channels from a existing list. :rolleyes:

foxeng,
This problem, and the fact that antenna selection is more difficult unless you know stations' physical channel numbers, makes OTA DTV reception confusing for the average person.

Post analog, the FCC should force stations to ID using their actual RF channel numbers.

You may disagree, but IMO, you're not looking at the problem from the standpoint of the average OTA viewer.

Post analog, the FCC should force stations to ID using their actual RF channel numbers. Blame that on the whinners at the NAB! :mad: :mad:

We need some more defined explaination how to add stations on the DTB-H260F when using an antenna rotor. I scanned all the stations in from our West position but am having ttrouble adding stations from an east and southern position without erasing the original west scan.

I did it three days ago in this very same thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9445605&&#post9445605

I purchased the samsung tuner from the CC website, and received it on Saturday. It only took a little over a week to receive, so I'm pretty happy with the whole process. Estimate delivery when I placed the order was Jan 22.

Initially, I asked the employees at Best Buy and CC about these. Neither had them in stock. Best Buy couldn't even tell me when I could place an order for one. Apparently, you can't place an order until they have some in their distribution warehouse. CC at least told me they could order one, but they couldn't take a credit card over the phone. Very frustrating. So, I went the web route, and that's what I should have done right from the start.

The tuner is stronger than the other ATSC tuners I've used (I get more channels), but the most important factor to me is the speed at which it can change channels. My other tuners took a few seconds each time you pressed channel up/down. This tuner only takes a second. The remote also works well. The other nice feature is the Favorite Channels list, which can include specific subchannels and not just the primary channels (or whatever you call them). I'm using QAM, by the way. If only I could get Guide information (that's not the receivers fault of course, since the data simply isn't available), this would be perfect.

If anyone is thinking about getting one of these, I would recommend it.

[QUOTE=DonB2]If someone in Raleigh NC is looking for a unit , I saw one at the Circuit City off of 15 501.


The salesperson basically said to me when I asked if he had anymore. "what is that doing out?" It is suppose to be in our warehouse.

This could explain why we don't see too many on shelves.

In fact this unit was piled on top of the Direct TV receivers.

-DonB2[/QUOTE

I got the last one at CC at Crabtree Mall in Raleigh NC on Saturday. I was lucky! One of the sales people knew that there was one in the warehouse. (There was no display.) It works great, but I may end up returning it. I will post again if I do.
It is very fast changing channels. You can go straight from each of the HD channel to the next by pressing the channel button without tuning in all the sub channels that are junk. I wish the menus would show on composite. It would make recording from it easier since my DVD recorder does not have component inputs. One nice feature for recording , or watching, is that you can select shows on the menu, and it will change the channel when it's time for the show. The unit has to be left on though. It will not turn itself on or off. On mine, the menu only fills in about 8 or 9 hours ahead, so for recording, I can only use this channel changing feature to record shows that are on the same evening or that start will start before about 2:00 am. It could be that the broadcasters limit the guide information. My other tuner does about the same thing.

Still hoping someone can clearly explain the Sammsung DTB-H260F about adding stations after scanning a particular direction and then rotating the antenna to another directiion. Thanks

Post analog, the FCC should force stations to ID using their actual RF channel numbers.

You may disagree, but IMO, you're not looking at the problem from the standpoint of the average OTA viewer.

It doesn't matter what I think. The FCC has ruled that stations will use their analog channel number and it will not be changing. Complain all you want but the law is still the law.

Still hoping someone can clearly explain the Sammsung DTB-H260F about adding stations after scanning a particular direction and then rotating the antenna to another directiion. Thanks

Once you have done a scan, you can rotate your antenna in the direction of a station and enter the actual channel the station is transmitting on and when the station is locked, it will automatically be placed in the table as if you had scanned it.

Still hoping someone can clearly explain the Sammsung DTB-H260F about adding stations after scanning a particular direction and then rotating the antenna to another directiion. Thanks

Start by scanning in 5 or 6 directions. As you scan, watch the channel numbers shown toward the right side of the screen. Each station number will blink as red when it is found. Write them down.... AIR 55 AIR 57 AIR59 etc. Redirect the antenna and repeat. Repeat again, and again for as many antenna directions as you want. Each scan takes about three minutes. Now disconnect the antenna and rescan. You will find nothing and wipe the channel list clean. Reconnect the antenna and enter each two digit number that you wrote down one at a time and let the tuner tune it in. As it tunes each channel, write down next to the 55 57 60 etc the station that comes up. Find out if any of the stations are just too weak to get reliably to trim down your guide list. Now rescan with no antenna again (unless you are keeping all the stations, in which case you are done.). No stations will be shown available. Now enter the two digit number for each of the stations that you want to keep one at a time. Rotate your antenna and enter it again if the station does not come up. Check your guide and they will all be there without the stations you did not want cluttering things up.

That's more than what I went through, but I know most of my stations and their designations. I scanned in the direction with most, made sure they're added, then moved the antenna in the direction of other stations, input station, came up on screen then did the rest in the same manner. No additional rescan because it resets the memory. Never disconnected antenna. But you never know.

I appreciate the advice but do you all have specifically the DTB-H260F. I have tried the same but when placing in the new station number it just keeps saying no signal.

You will scan in 5 or 6 directions. As you scan, [COLOR=White]the channel numbers show as red when they are found. Write them down.... 55 57 59 etc. Redirect the antenna and repeat. Repeat again, and again for as many antenna directions as you want. Now disconnect the antenna and rescan.
This is a rather complicated way to get the actual digital channel #s for all the stations. I think the receivers should display this information somewhere on the menu options, but there are much easier ways to get the info. Start with antennaweb.org, enter your zip code, enter a height - say 1000', 1500' - for the antenna under the options link and display digital stations only. Cut and paste the list into a document and print it.

For a complete list of all digital TV stations - although it will take a little work to figure out the corresponding analog channel #s, go to the FCC TV database at http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html. Select Digital TV under Service, enter your long and latitude and show ALL digital stations within a radius, say 120 km. You will get a summary list dump of the station call letters, DT channel, status, broadcast power and antenna height. Click on the link for the details on the station.

http://www.samsung.com/Products/DigitalSetTopBox/HDTVTuners/DTB_H260FXAA.asp
Looks like this. Try inputing the station channel, the actual number from antenna web.org, not the virtual. For me, NBC is 6-1, but is actually 44. I input 44, rotate antenna, might take 2/3 times. Like I said before, it good to know correct direction. Rotate antenna in the known direction for reception. If reception is touchy, might come in better day/night. Sometimes depending on antenna, it's a few rotator clicks at a time.

Does the Samsung not support virtual channel numbers?

Yeah, I input the actual and it maps to the required FCC mandated/analog.

Ah, so you only have to type in channel 44 the first time to find it and then after that you can just use type in 6-1 to tune to NBCHD?

Just 6.

What happens if there are more sub channels?

FOXHD in my area is 13-2... while 13-1 is just a digital SD version of Fox.

PBS has 5 subchannels here. 11-1, 11-2, 11-3, 11-4 and 11-5.

So input numbers directly or use the up /down channel. Same on yours.

For a complete list of all digital TV stations - although it will take a little work to figure out the corresponding analog channel #s, go to the FCC TV database at http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html. Select Digital TV under Service, enter your long and latitude and show ALL digital stations within a radius, say 120 km. You will get a summary list dump of the station call letters, DT channel, status, broadcast power and antenna height. Click on the link for the details on the station.

This list will also tell you the azimuth (direction) of each station from your location, which you obviously need to find out at some point.

If you already know which stations are in which directions, you can use the following lists:

Tentative Digital Channel Designations for Stations Participating in the First and Second Rounds of the DTV Channel Election Process: PDF format (http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-06-1082A2.pdf) or Excel format (http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-06-1082A2.xls)

Third Round of the DTV Channel Election Process: Tentative Channel Designations: PDF format (http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-06-1675A2.pdf) or Excel format (http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-06-1675A2.xls)

The column "Current DTV Channel" is the one you want. The first and second round list contains most stations; the third round list contains the relatively few stations that didn't have their final (post 2009-02-17) channels settled in the first two rounds.

I appreciate the advice but do you all have specifically the DTB-H260F. I have tried the same but when placing in the new station number it just keeps saying no signal.

Did you do it the way I suggested?

That's more than what I went through, but I know most of my stations and their designations. I scanned in the direction with most, made sure they're added, then moved the antenna in the direction of other stations, input station, came up on screen then did the rest in the same manner. No additional rescan because it resets the memory. Never disconnected antenna. But you never know.

Once you have a list of all the stations you can get, you dont need to scan at all! Just enter the 2 digit number. (55 57 59 etc) and the tuner will do the rest. Don't enter 22 trying to get 22-1. Channel 22-1 may show as 53 or 55 while scanning. Enter 53 or 55 or what ever, and the 22-1 station will appear. If you scan without the antenna to erase all the channels, and enter them manually, you have the option of never having the out of range stations or stations in a different language show in your guide.

This is a rather complicated way to get the actual digital channel #s for all the stations. I think the receivers should display this information somewhere on the menu options, but there are much easier ways to get the info. Start with antennaweb.org, enter your zip code, enter a height - say 1000', 1500' - for the antenna under the options link and display digital stations only. Cut and paste the list into a document and print it.

For a complete list of all digital TV stations - although it will take a little work to figure out the corresponding analog channel #s, go to the FCC TV database at http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html. Select Digital TV under Service, enter your long and latitude and show ALL digital stations within a radius, say 120 km. You will get a summary list dump of the station call letters, DT channel, status, broadcast power and antenna height. Click on the link for the details on the station.

I guess my description makes it sound complicated, but it's very easy to do.

I purchased the samsung tuner from the CC website....

The tuner is stronger than the other ATSC tuners I've used (I get more channels), but the most important factor to me is the speed at which it can change channels. My other tuners took a few seconds each time you pressed channel up/down. This tuner only takes a second. The remote also works well. The other nice feature is the Favorite Channels list, which can include specific subchannels and not just the primary channels (or whatever you call them). I'm using QAM, by the way. If only I could get Guide information (that's not the receivers fault of course, since the data simply isn't available), this would be perfect.

If anyone is thinking about getting one of these, I would recommend it.

Thanks for your input wakeupnlive.
I have been looking for a better HDTV tuner out there for about a year. Your review covered the problems I have been experiencing with past tuners. I've tried the Samsung SIRTS360 (very slow) and have the Samsung SIRT451 which is better, but not perfect. My issues was with OTA multipathing and the tuner's response time for changing the channels. I also get a very slight green hue in dark settings on all the channels when using HDMI (not sure if that is a tuner or TV problem). Sounds like the DTB-H260F tuner takes care of both. Thanks again, now I'll have to buy one.

For a complete list of all digital TV stations - although it will take a little work to figure out the corresponding analog channel #s, go to the FCC Be sure to bring your attorney along to figure all the legal mumble jumbo.

In the mean time;
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7625830&&#post7625830

kbgl,

Your yellow post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9476630&&&styleid=12#post9476630) is impossible to read for members who have set the default page style to AVS White (style settings at bottom left of this page).

I will try to change it. I tried to highlight a few words, but ended up changing the font on all of it.

Fixed it ! Thanks for pointing out the style settings arxaw!

Okay, my digital electronics is a bit rusty, but is there some reason I can't use a diplexer to combine the cable and antenna inputs upstream of the tuner instead of using an A/B coax switch? Has anyone tried this? They're different frequencies and diplexers are available for this purpose...

I'd appreciate any input on this--I'd prefer to put on my dunce cap than have another useless electronic component sitting in the basement :p

Frank

You can't easily diplex OTA and cable channels because they use some of the same frequencies. Use and A/B switch.

Some satellite & OTA signals can be diplexed with a sat/ota diplexor.

OK I am a dreamer but what the heck.

My dream is the USB port on the Samsung. Wouldn't it be great if you could just slap a external USB Hardrive on that port and record away.

Ok sorry for the dream, but this is the day after MLK day :)

-DonB2

This is a rather complicated way to get the actual digital channel #s for all the stations. I think the receivers should display this information somewhere on the menu options, but there are much easier ways to get the info. Start with antennaweb.org, enter your zip code, enter a height - say 1000', 1500' - for the antenna under the options link and display digital stations only. Cut and paste the list into a document and print it.

For a complete list of all digital TV stations - although it will take a little work to figure out the corresponding analog channel #s, go to the FCC TV database at http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html. Select Digital TV under Service, enter your long and latitude and show ALL digital stations within a radius, say 120 km. You will get a summary list dump of the station call letters, DT channel, status, broadcast power and antenna height. Click on the link for the details on the station.
1. Because www.antennaweb.org predictions tend to be overly "conservative",
the higher antenna trick is usually needed to find most of the stations you can actually receive.
However, a lower antenna height (100-300 feet) may be a closer approximation to what you actually receive.
Note that antennaweb tends to overlook nearby low power stations--which could prevent the use of a Preamp.

2. The www.2150.com/broadcast query provides a wealth of useful infomation,
but if you click on the four option boxes to include low power, analog and other stations,
you may have to limit the range severely in order to avoid the "excessive time for search" limitation.....
and then do an extended search without the option boxes checked.
PS: It's also a hassle to remember/determine/enter your position in DECIMAL LAT/LONG....

3. The various FCC TVQ "range" queries result in results that are TOO WIDE to print.
Note that you can also use Google (fcc tvq knbc) to quickly access the FCC database.

4. www.fccinfo.com is a much more flexible way to search FCC TVQ database and reports actually fit a page width
and should find those missing low power stations....it's my current favorite....

5. And if all you want is a list of TV/DTV stations in your area, including transmit power
and actual/virtual channel numbers, try the "quick list" feature:
http://radiostationworld.com/north_america.asp
Most (all?) of the low power stations are included in the list.
If you click on "F" for a given (analog) station, it will query the FCC TVQ database.
Since FCC database does not recognize "-DT" suffixes, clicking on digital station's "F" will not yield results.

Once you have a list of all the stations you can get, you dont need to scan at all! Just enter the 2 digit number. (55 57 59 etc) and the tuner will do the rest. Don't enter 22 trying to get 22-1. Channel 22-1 may show as 53 or 55 while scanning. Enter 53 or 55 or what ever, and the 22-1 station will appear. If you scan without the antenna to erase all the channels, and enter them manually, you have the option of never having the out of range stations or stations in a different language show in your guide.
On mine, doesn't matter either way, input actual or virtual. Once it's added it maps to the virtual.

OK I am a dreamer but what the heck.

My dream is the USB port on the Samsung. Wouldn't it be great if you could just slap a external USB Hardrive on that port and record away.

Ok sorry for the dream, but this is the day after MLK day :)

-DonB2
I've been wondering too. Usually service connects are specialized. One weekend I may get brave-especially when they're in stock.

2. The www.2150.com/broadcast query provides a wealth of useful infomation,
but if you click on the four option boxes to include low power, analog and other stations,
you may have to limit the range severely in order to avoid the "excessive time for search" limitation.....
and then do an extended search without the option boxes checked.
PS: It's also a hassle to remember/determine/enter your position in DECIMAL LAT/LONG.... A. I don't check the low power option,
B. I type in my lat. & long. within the bookmark I have for the site. I also have it written elsewhere for reference.

I had slight break up on my PBS channel 4.1 here in Raleigh, NC last night with the Samsung DTB -H260F.

Previous to this issue I was getting around 6 bars steady for this hardest to receive station.

Last night it went between 6 and zero signal strength.

There was a front moving through causing wind and cloudy conditions.

It is possible that I was getting bad multipath "worse than normal" from the wind.

-DonB2

On mine, doesn't matter either way, input actual or virtual. Once it's added it maps to the virtual.

I didn't try it the other way, but I can see that it does work. Bruss55 said that he got the "No Signal message" so I assumed that was the problem.

i am thinking of purchasing this unit and have some questions.

I have cox cable with the set top box and hd service. i want to eliminate the box and the extra monthly costs. I only need the local channels and espn and espn 2 to come in hd. if i go back to expanded basic and use the coax source from the wall to the unit, will i be able to get the channels mentioned above in HD? thanks in advance.

... I have cox cable with the set top box and hd service. i want to eliminate the box and the extra monthly costs. I only need the local channels and espn and espn 2 to come in hd. if i go back to expanded basic and use the coax source from the wall to the unit, will i be able to get the channels mentioned above in HD? You should be able to get the local broadcast HD channels with only cox expanded basic cable (analog), with the cable directly into the tuner. But unless cox has inadvertantly left ESPN/ESPN2 unscrambled in your area, you'll need either a rented HD STB from them, or a cable-card equipped tuner. And you'll have to subscribe to a higher priced tier of channels.

You should be able to get the local broadcast HD channels with only cox expanded basic cable (analog), with the cable directly into the tuner. But unless cox has inadvertantly left ESPN/ESPN2 unscrambled in your area, you'll need either a rented HD STB from them, or a cable-card equipped tuner. And you'll have to subscribe to a higher priced tier of channels.

is there any way to find this out? i know cox's hd channels all start with 7_ _. espn in my area is 35. espn hd with cox service is 735. same goes for all other channels and respective hd channels. does anyone know why they do this?

I was able to order the SAMSUNG DTB-H260F from CIRCUIT CITY on line just about 30 minutes ago. It's worth a try.

New SAMSUNG DTB-H260F inventories have apparently finally hit the shores of the USA. ABT Electronics tells me they received their shipment this morning. I would expect that all of the major internet sites will also have their stock replenished soon. If you've been waiting for this product your wait will soon be over. :) Unless, of course, all of the new stock disappears to those who have been on waiting lists since early December.... :(

One full container crosses the Ocean and empty one is sent back...

-Donb2

One full container crosses the Ocean and empty one is sent back...

-Donb2

Not exactly... it's full of US dollars. :rolleyes:

QUad User,

You are so correct about that!

-DonB2

So I just got the DTB-H260F and I'm a bit confused.

I have regular cable... but I wanted to atleast get my local HD channels.

So I first plugged the box into my cable and did a scan. It found a bunch of channels, however I only received signal from a few and they were really spread out.

76-1 Fox10 (Crappy)
80-1 - Channel 15 WOF (HD)
80-2 Channel 5 (HD)
81-1 Channel 8 (HD)
81-2 Fox12 (HD)
81-3 ??
81-4 (Fox12) (480)


Then I decided to try going with an antenna instead and scanned again and got all my channels together (and the guide worked, it didnt work with the cable connection) however when i use the antenna I only get 2 HD channels.

So.. if I use my cable to get HD channels.. is that the correct way? I currently use cox for my cable.

Then I decided to try going with an antenna instead and scanned again and got all my channels together (and the guide worked, it didnt work with the cable connection) however when i use the antenna I only get 2 HD channels.

So.. if I use my cable to get HD channels.. is that the correct way? I currently use cox for my cable.
What antenna are you using? You need to select an antenna - VHF/UHF or UHF only, short or medium or directional long range, indoor or attic or rooftop - suitable for your situation. But this is off topic for this thread. Post your zip code and situation - house or condo/apartment, terrain - to a new thread or to the antenna help sticky thread in the local HDTV reception thread. Also go to www.antennaweb.org to find out the direction and distances to your local stations and what channels are the digital signals on.

I just got email notification from CC that the Samsung DTB-H260F was in stock so I immediately placed an order. I'm not going to get too excited until it arrives.

I just picked up this box and while I am really happy with most of it I am very disappointed in how low the audio out through the RCA (analog) plugs are. I wanted to use this to feed into my DVD recorder for saving shows (I know its not HD but its the best I can do right now). I thought the audio on my DVR was low, but this makes that seem loud. I am wondering if there is any way to change this, I was hoping changing to PCM audio over DD would do something but it didn't. Any ideas appreciated.

I could make the audio level roughly comparable to the other devices hooked to my TV by increasing the volume setting to maximum (100%) on the Samsung. It might still be a little bit lower than the others, but it's close enough that I can live with it.

I currently use the analog stereo outputs along with component video, but I think it came out pretty much the same over HDMI. I don't use HDMI now because I'm saving that input on the TV for an upconverting DVD player.

jtbell,

Are you talking about the volume setting on your TV? I can't find any volume setting on the SAMSUNG box or the onscreen menus, if there is one can you tell me where it is?

I recently got a Samsung DTB-H260F and a Antenna Direct DB4 (in the attic for now). It appears to be working ok except for a couple FOX channels. One is about 10 miles away with a signal strength of 8 and the other is about 25 miles away with a signal strength of 5. The signal strength for both channels will stay consistant for a minute or two and then it will drop to zero (picture and sound will be lost) from a couple seconds and then return to the orignal strength. It will do this continuously and irratically. Does anyone have an explaination as to why this is happening (and how to fix it)? Thanks.

"Are you talking about the volume setting on your TV? I can't find any volume setting on the SAMSUNG box or the onscreen menus, if there is one can you tell me where it is? "

The only volume control I know of is the one located on the remote.

-DonB2

jtbell,

Are you talking about the volume setting on your TV? I can't find any volume setting on the SAMSUNG box or the onscreen menus, if there is one can you tell me where it is?

I have the volume adjustment on the on-screen menu but it didn't change a thing when adjusted. I played with it a couple of times but didn't pay much attention. But it is there.

I recently got a Samsung DTB-H260F and a Antenna Direct DB4 (in the attic for now). It appears to be working ok except for a couple FOX channels. One is about 10 miles away with a signal strength of 8 and the other is about 25 miles away with a signal strength of 5. The signal strength for both channels will stay consistant for a minute or two and then it will drop to zero (picture and sound will be lost) from a couple seconds and then return to the orignal strength. It will do this continuously and irratically. Does anyone have an explaination as to why this is happening (and how to fix it)? Thanks.
What channels are the Fox stations digitally broadcasting on? Do you have possible terrain issues? Is the antenna aimed at either station? What is the broadcast power for the stations? If you give us your zip code, we can look your local stations up.

What channels are the Fox stations digitally broadcasting on? Do you have possible terrain issues? Is the antenna aimed at either station? What is the broadcast power for the stations? If you give us your zip code, we can look your local stations up.


zip code - 02780

FOX (WNAC - DT) frequency assignment 54, 10 miles away, flat terrain no tall buildings nearby.

FOX (WFXT - DT) frequency assignment 31, 30 miles away, flat terrain no tall buildings nearby.

Antenna: Antenna Direct DB4 which is called multi-directional so I'm under the impression I don't have to aim it.

There are a number of other stations in the same direction and distance as WNAC - DT and I don't appear to have any problem with them.

What seems odd to me is that I'm getting a fairly strong signal that suddenly drops out for a moment and then comes back strong again for a minute or two before dropping out again. (the is no pattern, it appears random)

Because I'm getting a strong signal with the antenna in the attic, I'm reluctant to move it outside until I have some indication that it will help the situation.

Thanks in advance for any help.

DB4 is less directional than a typical UHF yagi design - it is NOT omni-directional, but WNAC at 269 degrees and WFXT at 3 degrees is a real stretch. When you use www.antennaweb.org type in your full address and sort the results for digital only. Go to the "street level map" for a line representation of the azimaths to each station.

The signal variations are probably due to multi-path, picking up a reflection of the original signal off the side of the antenna bounced off a building, etc. - if so, anything that breaks that reflection causes a loss of signal.

You do need to aim the DB4 and if you want multiple stations it would be best outdoors on an antenna rotator like the Channel Master CM 9521A

It sounds like multipath issues to me also. I have lots of trouble with one station "PBS" 4.1 here in the Raleigh, NC area and was hoping that the Samsung which is suppose to handle multipath better would help me out.

It is helping but I am still experiencing same issues as you but just not as frequently.

Try rotating your attic mounted antenna some. Just a little change can make a big difference. Of course it may cause issues with other stations but you won't know until you try.

-DonB2

I just picked up this box and while I am really happy with most of it I am very disappointed in how low the audio out through the RCA (analog) plugs are. I wanted to use this to feed into my DVD recorder for saving shows (I know its not HD but its the best I can do right now). I thought the audio on my DVR was low, but this makes that seem loud. I am wondering if there is any way to change this, I was hoping changing to PCM audio over DD would do something but it didn't. Any ideas appreciated.


Try turning up the volume on the remote. On my Toshiba 46H84 TV, the TV volume is at 50%. With the Samsung at 14% it is plenty loud.

zip code - 02780
Antenna: Antenna Direct DB4 which is called multi-directional so I'm under the impression I don't have to aim it.
No, you do have to aim the antenna. See the beam pattern for the DB-4 at http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/DB4.html. For starters, aim the antenna due north at your more distant set of stations. It may still get your closer stations, although 90 degrees off to the side is not a good angle to work with.

Volume on Samsung 95%, Using TV volume.
Using a 91XG instead of CM 4228, the 91XG brings in the more difficult signals. Where I had virtually no reception, now 50% on Samsung meter. And with rotor, set it to a sweet spot and get all.

I was told by 2 local CC stores that the new CC on Capital Blvd in Raleigh NC had 5 units in stock. I called them and while having to shout on the phone for the guy to hear me over the noise, he said they showed none in the system. The store opened at 6:00pm today. I bet they have them and don't know it ! store # 919-876-6029

I maxed out the volume with the remote, this is certainly better but is not as loud as I had hoped for, but at least in line with the volume from my DVR. When compared to other sources such as analog cable or a standard VCR these are very quiet, but its something I can live with, it just means the volume has to be set higher when watching the DVDs I will create from material recorded through this method.

Well my unit showed up today in a rather tatty external box via UPS from J&R. :rolleyes:

I let it warm up to room temperature for six hours and then fired it up. Worked like a champ. Shows 10 bars on the local HD PBS channel. My two-year old Samsung RPTV's internal tuner only shows 8 bars via the same antenna. So far so good...I'm happy. :cool:

Has anyone ever mentioned before how TINY this box is?

If you have a spare composite (yellow jack) input on your TV, you could make an additional connection from the green component video jack on the Samsung 260 to the yellow composite video input on your TV.

You could temporarily switch the TV to that input to see the menus and guide, but you would be seeing a black and white picture. Once you have completed your changes (tuning channels, setting options, etc.) in the Samsung, switch the TV back to the S-video input to watch in color.

Thanks for the feedback, Dave. I got outbid on a couple of TS360's on eBay and after reading more reports of the 260 being a much more sensitive receiver than most other receivers (360 specifically) and actually one message to me that the 360's had "problems"... I'm glad I got outbid. I pulled the trigger on a 260 today...should arrive middle of next week. I think the green-component to yellow-composite work around should be possible for me.

Thanks for the tip!!!
Ed

Thanks for the feedback, Dave. I got outbid on a couple of TS360's on eBay and after reading more reports of the 260 being a much more sensitive receiver than most other receivers (360 specifically) and actually one message to me that the 360's had "problems"... I'm glad I got outbid. I pulled the trigger on a 260 today...should arrive middle of next week. I think the green-component to yellow-composite work around should be possible for me.

Thanks for the tip!!!
Ed
I have not actually tried that myself since I don't have a 260, but others have reported using the green component out to a yellow composite in.

Let us know how well it works.

Ok I found the two posts that you mentioned. Let us know of any new developments of getting your exchange. In the time being is there any alternatives out there that are good and in the same price range?

I called Samsung support as CC was out of stock. They said units should not be DOA so they emailed me a UPS shipping label. This is ground shipping so it will take 1 week there and 1 week back. The unit just arrived there today. I will keep you posted.

Again, it is extremely dissapointing that a huge company has such poor quality control. I bet there is a whole batch out there with defective units. Maybe the dropped them from the truck or something.

Oh and get this, the first thing the lady from support says is "did you know there are people here that claim this unit does not exist?". WTF!?

...Worked like a champ. Shows 10 bars on the local HD PBS channel. My two-year old Samsung RPTV's internal tuner only shows 8 bars...Signal strength readings vary across different models and brands of tuners. Just because one tuner shows more "bars" than another one doesn't mean it's receiving a station better.

But this receiver nearly always works much better than anything previously available, including previous Samsung tuners.

Ha Ha on the size of the box being small.

Maybe that is why CC and BB have so much trouble locating them.

_DonB2

I let it warm up to room temperature for six hours and then fired it up.


This is not necessary. Commercial electronics should work down to around freezing. If it doesn't work, you want to know about it so you can exchange/repair. By warming it up you defeat the purpose.

Always make sure you test drive something in the worst environmental condition.

Waiting as he did was a good idea, IMO. There's no sense in firing up brand new electronics with condensation covering all the parts inside.

Well yes the bars are arbitrary units, but I just thought that Samsung would use the same arbitrary units across their models.

Commercial electronics should work down to around freezing.

It was about 24 degrees yesterday here in Boise when the UPS guy dropped it off. And the box felt like it had been cold-soaked in their trucks and warehouses. Plus as noted I wanted to let any condensation evaporate first.

I just looked on ebay and found at least 13 dtb-h260f tuners listed, Most are listed from trading circuit entertainment which is a cc business there are several that the bids are still low on them-I almost want to try my hand at getting one at a lower price then the origianal one I tried shipping rate to my area would be around $10 I just might bid on a couple Just thought I'd pass the info along

Just a heads up for anyone interested in getting this tuner. If you can find it at your local Circuit City there is a $40 of $199 coupon you can use. You have to go over $200 before tax. They have it for $179.99 so you have to add some fillers. I just got one with a 10 pack of RW DVD's and 2 packs of gum, ;). And paid $172.

Hooked up the H260F to an 3 yr old 51S700 using HDMI from Samsung to DVI input on Hitachi. Can now use PIP with HD in both screens now and move the smaller one around screen. :D

I noticed that many of the most recently added DTB-H260F tuners listed by Trading Circuit have a "Buy it Now" price of $230.97. Seems odd since they retail for 179.99.

Jay


I just looked on ebay and found at least 13 dtb-h260f tuners listed, Most are listed from trading circuit entertainment which is a cc business there are several that the bids are still low on them-I almost want to try my hand at getting one at a lower price then the origianal one I tried shipping rate to my area would be around $10 I just might bid on a couple Just thought I'd pass the info along

"I noticed that many of the most recently added DTB-H260F tuners listed by Trading Circuit have a "Buy it Now" price of $230.97. Seems odd since they retail for 179.99."

Almost like ticket Scalpers.


-DonB2

"I noticed that many of the most recently added DTB-H260F tuners listed by Trading Circuit have a "Buy it Now" price of $230.97. Seems odd since they retail for 179.99."

Almost like ticket Scalpers.


...probably not too many folks bidding on 'em since they're available again at Circuit City. :rolleyes:

Ed

As of 5:00pm, the new CC off Capital Blvd ( Behind Best Buy) in Raleigh has 2 boxed units on the sales floor!

I have an Olevia 23" LCD, no digital tuner obviously, and I am thinking about getting this STB. OTA reception in my area appears to suck according to antennaweb, but I have Comcast analog cable. I know I can get unencrypted QAM from that, but I wanted to know if I could use the coax out on the STB and use my TV's NTSC tuner for SD cable without unplugging the cable feed. Insight appreciated.

Same here, almost. Got mine yesterday. Tried several power outlets. Sometimes the power light doesn't go on at all -- sometimes there's a feeble irregular winking. No signal coming out the RGB connectors. Aside from the power light, no sign of life at all.

I called Circuit City. Since I can't exchange it (as we know they're out of stock), the CSR told me she'd have to submit an "incident report" and someone would phone me about getting an address label to return the tuner. She gave me a "case number".

Same here. I picked one up at my local CC on Thursday evening and it is DOA. Same symptoms reported by GregLee and Boofster. That's at least three dead units reported in this thread. What kind of shoddy product is Samsung peddling??

Reg

I have Comcast analog cable. I know I can get unencrypted QAM from that

Sorry, but I don't believe you would get anything from Comcast's analog cable. IIRC QAM is a format for encoding signals on digital cable.

I have an Olevia 23" LCD, no digital tuner obviously, and I am thinking about getting this STB. OTA reception in my area appears to suck according to antennaweb, but I have Comcast analog cable. I know I can get unencrypted QAM from that, but I wanted to know if I could use the coax out on the STB and use my TV's NTSC tuner for SD cable without unplugging the cable feed. Insight appreciated.


Don't purely rely on the antennaweb to determine what you can get. I bet that data was calculated based on the first or second generation receivers. IMO, The 5th gen units have better multipath rejection and better sensitivity.

I live 37.5 miles from my Dallas HD towers and it said I would need the biggest antenna to get all my channels. :eek: Well I started with the cheapest and easiest to try and then return if needed. This was a RCA amplified rabbit ear setup from Home Depot ($28) and I get EVERY CHANNEL the Antenna web post plus some others. Of course they are not all broadcasting HD but it's not the antenna or receivers fault, they are all digital and good signal strength. It also worked best with the gain of the amplifier all the way down.

...I have Comcast analog cable. I know I can get unencrypted QAM from that, but I wanted to know if I could use the coax out on the STB and use my TV's NTSC tuner for SD cable without unplugging the cable feed. Insight appreciated.Yes, you can get the unencrypted QAM channels with a QAM tuner and just a subscription to comscat expanded basic analog.

You should be able to get the analog NTSC channels using your TV's internal tuner by looping the coax through the Samsung. If you have problems, just connect a splitter to the coax where it enters the room and run a leg to the Samsung's and TV's ANT/Cable-IN jacks.

You'll have to flip between LINE & tuner inputs on your TV, depending on if you want to watch digital or analog channels.

Thanks for the help guys, I'll be on the lookout for one at my local electronix dealers.

Got one of these at Best Buy in the Kansas City area last week, after reading much of this thread (thanks for all of your inputs).

There was only one available, and it was an open box item, so I got a $20 gift card for free.

I bought a $30 Philips MANT410 amplified indoor antenna from Lowe's, and I'm getting everything I need with good reception with the antenna next to a window in my basement.

ND

So I took the DOA tuner back to Circuit City and got another one (which someone else had returned). Here are my impressions compared to my original considerations earlier in this thread:My current setup is as follows:

I am about 55 miles from Washington DC and about 70 miles from Baltimore with mountains between me and both cities. Since I refuse to put my antenna on the roof, for a variety of reasons, I have ended up with a CM4228A in the attic on a rotator along with a CM777 preamp. (I also currently have an old Yagi antenna feeding VHF into the preamp for NTSC reception.) I use a Hughes HIRD-E86 STB for OTA reception.

This setup works amazingly well, considering the distance and the attic installation! I can typically receive about 10 different digital stations with about 20 channels of digital programming, plus about 20 more NTSC channels.

However, I seem to suffer from the following ATSC reception woes:
1) While three stations in Washington, DC come in clearly, three others are only marginal, working sometimes and not other times. If I buy a new HDTV receiver, it *must* have outstanding sensitivity, which basically means an industry-leading tuner. Based on posts by goldenrod and this one by Hokie (Va Tech?) Jim have convinced me that the Samsung DTB-H260F does not have an outstanding tuner.
Well, I don't seem to receive any stations that are farther away, so I will assume the receiver sensitivity is similar to my old tuner.2) The station which is closest to me (~25 miles) often suffers from terrible multipath distortion (though it occasionally works great??). It seems that the Samsung DTB-H260F would definitely help with reception of this channel.
This station tunes without difficulty on the Samsung!3) I receive an NTSC signal off the back of my antenna at the same frequency as one of the ATSC channels I'm struggling to receive from Washington. I doubt any tuner can help to receive this signal. I'll either have to fiddle with my antenna or simply wait until NTSC is turned off in 2009.
I was wrong! The Samsung handles this problem with aplomb!4) My current tuner does not have the "add" feature mentioned earlier that can be used when scanning for channels. That sounds like a *great* feature for anyone using a rotator or multiple, switched antennas!! Unfortunately, the Samsung DTB-H260F does not help me there, either.
Managing channels is pretty easy with the Samsung tuner, even without this feature.5) My current tuner only reports "Local programming" in the program guide (no actual programming). The detailed program guide on the Samsung DTB-H260F sounds great! Definitely a selling feature! (I would be using either component video or HDMI connections, so this *would* work for me.)
I LOVE the on-screen program guide! The entire user interface for this product is outstanding!6) Another important consideration before the NTSC cutoff is that NTSC can be used when ATSC does not cut it. As such, I will say that any receiver I purchase before 2009 needs to also have an NTSC receiver.I was wrong about this. Since the Samsung addresses my other major issues, I no longer feel I have a need for an NTSC tuner.

If I decide that 3) above is not a receiver issue, I would conclude that the Samsung only has 2 of the 5 features I would require before I would replace my current tuner. Unfortunately, not enough...Something told me to go ahead and give this thing a try. I'm glad I didn't listen to my own advice here!

Thanks to all for this thread, as it has helped me to refine my HDTV STB shopping list and to understand how the new Samsung stacks up (without actually purchasing one).

Thoughts?

Reg

So, I have two complaints with this tuner: The first is that it does not automatically adjust the aspect ration based on the content that is being sent to the display. My old one had this feature. It's an annoying issue for an otherwise very clean design. The second is that my first unit was dead! I hope this one lasts.

Thanks again to all for the information in this thread!

Reg

Has anyone had HDMI problems with this tuner?

I want to hook the STB up via HDMI because all my component inputs are taken on the TV but when I do, I get this:

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/3105/img22470zr.th.jpg (http://img411.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img22470zr.jpg)
(Samsung STB on the left, TV's internal tuner on the right)

I tested it on a component input and the colors are just fine so it's definitely something to do with HDMI. I've never hooked up anything else to the TV with HDMI so it could easily be a TV problem but maybe there is some setting I'm missing on the samsung to adjust the HDMI? I did of course flip the switch on the back over to HDMI but I can't see any other settings to change.

Last Wednesday afternoon, I was emailed by CC that they had these in stock so I immediately ordered one. I opted to upgrade my shipping from the "free" offer to the "3-5 day" option which cost me 4.95. I figured it would take a week to get from Illinois to my home in Northern California. The unit was delivered to my home on Friday, the 19th! Less than 48 hours from when I ordered it. Installation was easy in my case since I was just swapping the Samsung stb into my system where I had a second dvd player with component connections. It was a simple matter of taking out the dvd player and sliding the stb in. Antenna connections were available also. Without any trouble, I was soon pulling in HDTV from OTA stations in Sacramento (30 miles away) Stockton(85 miles away) and even San Francisco (120 miles away). I do have a good site for OTA since Sacramento and San Francisco are pretty much in a straight line from house. The house is high enough and and my old antenna is on a mast about 12 feet high. So far, I haven't used my rotator to see what else is available but without moving it, I'm getting about 20 dtv stations. I am also using a preamp but I'm going to see what happens when I take the preamp out of the loop, just for curiosity. Tonight I watched a PBS show from San Francisco and it was crystal clear.
No wonder the cable and satellite companies are concerned about free OTA HDTV.
I'm paying 55 bucks a month for Dish Network and the picture quality is not as good as the OTA HD. Granted, Dish offers more channels but a hundred of them are music or "paid programming". That 55 bucks a month could buy a nice new TV but with the Samsung stb my 6 year old Toshiba 56H80 is all I need.

I hooked mine up to an Optoma HD72 projector via a cheapie HDMI cable and it worked right the first time. All I did was set the rear panel physical switches to HDMI and 720P. The factory defaults appear proper for HDMI.

After playing with it some more I found out the only output the color is messed up on is HDMI in 1080i. The color looks fine on HDMI when set to 720p output. My TV of course supports both 720p and 1080i, but 1080i is native so I would rather run it at that. It still could be a TV problem though because I've never used the HDMI on my TV before.

The color issue aside, so far, I'm not really impressed with this tuner. It seems kind of cheaply made and the guide and channel change speeds are really not as good as everyone here makes it out to be. The guide is VERY sluggish. Everytime you scroll to a new page it takes a couple seconds to load it up. Maybe I'm just disappointed because I'm use to a satellite box with an awesome guide and super-fast channel change speeds. It's so annoying that this samsung won't even let me try and speed up direct channel changes by hitting the enter button. It insists on waiting around to see if I'm going to press any more numbers before finally tuning.

The remote isn't very good either. It feels so fisher price like and they would have had a hard time making the button placement any worse if they tried. You would think they would have put the guide button in a little more prominent spot instead of hiding it down with a bunch of other buttons that look and feel exactly the same. Also, you can't put the STB up on a shelf too high above where you sit because the IR sensor is angled upwards so you'll be stretching out when you point the remote to get it to see it.

This samsung also can't pick up a digital OTA channel that my TV has no problem with (30-1). The non-virtual station number is 48, so I thought maybe I could tune to it directly but no luck so I scanned again and watched the status... it sticks on it for a few seconds before giving up and not turning it blue.

I was probably just expecting too much out of this STB. I'm sure it is fine if you don't know what you are missing but it's definitely not worth $179.

I just got in this unit to replace my Sammy Sir T 351. So far this one seems to be giving a little better performance than the 351. The channel change is definitely faster. For some reason on both the EPG / time setting function always gives the wrong time, so the EPG is worthless (the EPG on my analog DVR is fine so its something about how it gets xmitted in digital I guess). There's a channel I wsa hoping to pick up that I couldn't get before, and I still can't so it isn't a miracle worker on reception. I have a yagi antenna in the attic and there isn't enough room for it to move, so it is fixed pointing towards the other antennas, which are about 120 degrees from the one I can't get (but it's frustrating because I can see the antenna from my house). i like the smaller size than my 351. I haven't checked the H260F yet, but if I lost power to the 351 it would stay off after power was restored, so I couldn't trust it as a recording source when I was out of town. Right now I have both units connected to my Pioneer EP HD530, the 351 with a straight DVI and the H260F with an HDMI to DVI with 1080i and no problems. also on the 351 I could never get the optical DD to work on my AV receiver, only PCM, but the H260F works in either mode. Now that I get both audio formats, I notice in some broadcast in DD mode most of the audio is loading into my center channel, so I switched to PCM which my receiver will matrix across all channels. I''m going to have to wait for some 5.1 broadcast material to really check it out.

scott s.
.

One question: Does anyone know how to open the mini guide without first opening the guide (or the menu)? In other words, can it be opened with a single click somehow? TIA!

pkdoobie - Where you located at? i was going to find out what channels you were able to get thru OTA. I know i know, i could check antennaweb.org, but then again its different when you actually talkt o someone who maybe in the immediate area.
im in san jose, CA.

I'm very pleased with mine.
i purchased it online from CC on the 18th, received on the 20th.

Setup was easy. After a quick channel scan, I easily get probably close to 30 channels in Santa Monica,CA with a cheap RCA rabbit ear antenna. A lot of channels are junk, but then again so is cable. CBS,NBC,FOX,ABC,PBS, all look great. Can't wait to watch today's NFL playoffs.

The channel guide is slow, but I feel that is a small compromise.

For some reason on both the EPG / time setting function always gives the wrong time, so the EPG is worthless (the EPG on my analog DVR is fine so its something about how it gets xmitted in digital I guess).
scott s.
.

You're correct. Both units are picking up the time from the PSIP info transmitted by your stations. It's your stations, not the unit that is hosing the time.


also on the 351 I could never get the optical DD to work on my AV receiver, only PCM, but the H260F works in either mode.
scott s.
.
You are fortunate that you didn't do what I did. Samsung had a firmware fix for the DD dropouts. After I applied the fix DD worked fine but I couldn't lock on to my stations for more than a few minutes.

pkdoobie - Where you located at? i was going to find out what channels you were able to get thru OTA. I know i know, i could check antennaweb.org, but then again its different when you actually talkt o someone who maybe in the immediate area.
im in san jose, CA.jomari,

Find your local discussion thread HERE (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=453241).

Just received my Samsung DTB-H260F from Circuit City yesterday. When I first plugged it in, it was completely dead and wouldn't power up using the front switch or the remote. :( I removed the two screws at the back and slid the cover off. With my trusty Fluke, I checked that I had power, the fuse was OK, etc. All looked OK, but it still wouldn't power up. I disconnected and re-connected the flex connectors between the circuit boards and that fixed it. I'm pretty sure it was the small connector from the large main circuit board to the front panel that was having a problem, as Samsung used a very cheap, wafer-thin, flex connector for that one.

It also took me a few minutes to figure out why the volume was so low. I didn't realize the Samsung box had a volume control. :confused: Finally, I saw the volume rocker switch on the remote. I pressed it until it read 100, and now the volume level is comparable to my other input sources. :cool:

Now that it's working, I'm very pleased with it.

Well my unit showed up today in a rather tatty external box via UPS from J&R. :rolleyes:


Yeah, mine came last week the same way. Opened it up and everything is fine though. Have it hooked up via HDMI and the Bears/Saints game today looks freaking great. (Set box to 720P the native for my Samsung DLP) I have through my HOA a mdu setup where we get a basic cable feed from dish net (72 channels) through coax coming into the wall. I hooked this up to the unit trying to get channels through QAM, but I am getting them through the air with this. I guess it is using it as an antenna, because all my locals (Orlando) are coming in on 2-1, 6-1, 9-1, 35-1, and 68- 1-4 (pbs).

The signals bars seem to be diffrent every time I use the unit ranging from almost full, to nothing and everywhere in between, but the picture is always there for those channels.

The only channel I'm not getting is CW 18, but that channel is not there on the basic cable (dishnet) we get through the hoa either, so I don't know if that has any reason to do with why I am not receiving it?

It's possible the MDU has an OTA antenna diplexed into the remodulated dish feed.

One question: Does anyone know how to open the mini guide without first opening the guide (or the menu)? In other words, can it be opened with a single click somehow? TIA!
See notes on page 28 of your instruction manual.

Same here. I picked one up at my local CC on Thursday evening and it is DOA. Same symptoms reported by GregLee and Boofster. That's at least three dead units reported in this thread. What kind of shoddy product is Samsung peddling??

Reg

Did you try the right output resolution (1080, 720, 480p, 480i) switch? Mine did not tune to anything first until I ran the auto program...

I called Samsung support as CC was out of stock. They said units should not be DOA so they emailed me a UPS shipping label. This is ground shipping so it will take 1 week there and 1 week back. The unit just arrived there today. I will keep you posted.

Again, it is extremely dissapointing that a huge company has such poor quality control. I bet there is a whole batch out there with defective units. Maybe the dropped them from the truck or something.

Oh and get this, the first thing the lady from support says is "did you know there are people here that claim this unit does not exist?". WTF!?

Well I returned my DOA to CC a few days ago. I first asked to see if they can put me on a list for an exchange, but they said there won't be any more shipments coming in until atleast 2 more weeks so they offered to just refund my money. Deflated I went home and searched if there were any more in stock on any of the online retailers, and sure enough J&R had some in stock. I immediately ordered one, and selected the 2day air ($15) shipping hoping it would get here int time for the NFC/AFC conf game. That was on the 17th and it still have not even shipped yet :mad:

I guess I still got the superbowl to get excited about whenever it gets here... :D

... I removed the two screws at the back and slid the cover off. With my trusty Fluke, I checked that I had power, the fuse was OK, etc. All looked OK, but it still wouldn't power up. I disconnected and re-connected the flex connectors between the circuit boards and that fixed it. I'm pretty sure it was the small connector from the large main circuit board to the front panel that was having a problem, as Samsung used a very cheap, wafer-thin, flex connector for that one. ...
After getting the run around from CC trying to return my defective unit, I decided to try cobo's procedure. I just wiggled the connector going to the front panel at the base of the connector on the main circuit board. It worked. Thanks, cobo.

From 17 years spent as an electrical engineer, I can say it's usually interconnect problems if something is DOA. Unless there are warranty stickers, I'd always open the box and reseat the connectors. I'd also slide those external switches back and forth a few times to remove schmutz before powering up the box.


With my trusty Fluke

If it's accurate, it must be a Fluke! :p

Has anyone had HDMI problems with this tuner?

I want to hook the STB up via HDMI because all my component inputs are taken on the TV but when I do, I get this:

I tested it on a component input and the colors are just fine so it's definitely something to do with HDMI. I've never hooked up anything else to the TV with HDMI so it could easily be a TV problem but maybe there is some setting I'm missing on the samsung to adjust the HDMI? I did of course flip the switch on the back over to HDMI but I can't see any other settings to change.

It's not your TV, it's HDCP. I've got almost the same issue when using a Sony KD34XBR970 via HDMI. Everything looks fine for about 10 seconds, then all the color bleeds out of the picture, and I'm left with a (mostly) black and white image. Using the same HDMI cable, I can hook up a Denon DVD player, and everything is fine. Also, when routing HDMI through my STR-DG1000 Receiver, I still get the same problem. If I hook it up via Component (either directly or through the receiver), everything is fine. I'm positive this is a handshaking issue via HDCP. The question is... what to do? I don't think either the Samsung or the TV's firmware are upgradable by end users. :(

Auburn CA

"It's not your TV, it's HDCP. I've got almost the same issue when using a Sony KD34XBR970 via HDMI. Everything looks fine for about 10 seconds, then all the color bleeds out of the picture, and I'm left with a (mostly) black and white image."

Isn't this a means that the industry came up with to stop the ability to copy HD movies?

I thought I read elsewhere that the industry modified the HDMI interface for copyright issues and this made some of the earlier HDMI devices obsolete.

-DonB2

OK, I've looked through this entire thread & while I see several that state it works on clear QAM, can anyone say with a degree of certainty, that it WILL do QAM256?

My whole reason for wanting this box is the for the clear QAM, but I do not want to spend this kind of $$$ & end up ONLY being able to get QAM64. Thx for any help on this.

From 17 years spent as an electrical engineer, I can say it's usually interconnect problems if something is DOA. Unless there are warranty stickers, I'd always open the box and reseat the connectors. I'd also slide those external switches back and forth a few times to remove schmutz before powering up the box. :p

Ditto. I've got 20 years experience as an EE, and have also found the interconnects are typically the weak link. The small front panel interconnect in the Samsung is a particularly cheap one that's prone to connection issues in my experience. That's because it's the dreaded flat flex cable type. The other connectors between the circuit boards in the unit are the more robust pin-in-socket type. These flat-cable interconnects don't apply much (normal) force to the contact points, and it's easy for invisible levels of corrosion to build up, especially after the vibration due to shipping. Generally, unplugging the connector and re-seating it is all that's needed, because it scrubs off the corrosion and exposes fresh contact material (e.g., copper).

But if it persists, you might want to try some circuit cleaner (available at Radio Shack). Spray it on both the male and female terminals. I wouldn't douse the circuit board with it, but don't worry if the electronics gets a little "wet" with the stuff; it evaporates quickly and is non-conductive after it dries. Do however let it fully evaporate before buttoning it back up and turning it on. Also, avoid placing the unit where it might see constant low-level vibration (e.g., don't place it on a fan-cooled amplifier).

OK, I've looked through this entire thread & while I see several that state it works on clear QAM, can anyone say with a degree of certainty, that it WILL do QAM256?
Yes, it WILL do QAM256.

Dear forum,

I have DTB-H260F connected to IN72. It is connected using a component cable with 480p. I noticed a horizontal scan bars moving from the bottom of the screen to the top of the screen slowly (noise?). It is really noticable on a black screen in a dark room (like just when you change the channel.) The bar will change colors on non-black screen.

Does anyone have similar issue?

Sounds like you have a ground loop problem.

What is IN72?

Sounds like you have a ground loop problem.

What is IN72?

Well, actually the tuner is connected to my Yamaha V2500 and then IN72 is connected. What is the best way to get rid of this ground loop issue?

My Yamaha is connected to a DVD player, a CD changer, a MD player.

IN72 is a projector from Infocus.

It's not your TV, it's HDCP. I've got almost the same issue when using a Sony KD34XBR970 via HDMI. Everything looks fine for about 10 seconds, then all the color bleeds out of the picture, and I'm left with a (mostly) black and white image. Using the same HDMI cable, I can hook up a Denon DVD player, and everything is fine. Also, when routing HDMI through my STR-DG1000 Receiver, I still get the same problem. If I hook it up via Component (either directly or through the receiver), everything is fine. I'm positive this is a handshaking issue via HDCP. The question is... what to do? I don't think either the Samsung or the TV's firmware are upgradable by end users. :(
You are probably right. I didn't think HDCP was enabled in over-the-air broadcasts but they've probably changed that by now.

I actually have another Samsung on the way from Circuit City. I ordered it online over a week ago and then the local Circuit City got them in stock on Friday so I got impatient and picked one up locally. When the one I ordered finally gets shipped here, I'll hook it up and see if I get the same problem.

Did I mention that the current samsung tuner works fine via HDMI if I switch the output from 1080i to 720p? Do you think that could still be a HDCP problem? I could just run it at 720p but, since my TV is 1080i native and doesn't have the best scaler in the world, I would much rather use 1080i output on the stb.

...What is the best way to get rid of this ground loop issue?Start by making sure everything is grounded to your home's main electrical power ground source.

"Everything" includes all equipment and surge suppressors that have 3rd wire ground prongs, plus any outside TV sources you have: satellite, outdoor OTA antenna, cable TV coax.

All outdoor TV sources should all be grounded where they enter the house, with a ground wire run to the main electrical ground point (typically at the meter box).

cbrf4rider,

Is it coming in on your cable line? Try disconnecting your cable line and just use the Samsung via OTA.

-Donb2

See notes on page 28 of your instruction manual.Thanks, Davinleeds! That's just what I was looking for!

Thanks again,

Reg

tpaxadpom had said (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9435295&&#post9435295) that, compared to the component hookup on his TV, the HDMI connection seemed to have 'washed out' colors. It's possible that this is an HDCP issue, but I haven't seen that with my H260F connected to my Syntax Olevia LT32HV. The HDMI-to-DVI connection I'm using works fine; jumping back and forth between component and HDMI doesn't show any obvious difference in the colors. I'm slightly blue-green colorblind, but I still think I'd have noticed such a difference.

As I noted before, the DVI connection on SD content shows some of what's apparently the closed-caption info, some 'static' at the top of the picture. That appears to be an artifact of the 1366x768 native resolution my display. HD content seems unaffected, and (unlike component) fills the entire screen. Via component, there were very small black bars at the top and bottom of the picture.

sorceror,

I think that's line 21 of the vertical blanking interval. Where they put NTSC closed captioning, extended data services and V-chip data.

What is the practical limit for good reception with a rooftop antenna. Are stations 60 to 70 miles away within range?

kbgl,
A lot depends on terrain. That being said, I reliably get digital stations (100% signal strength) from two different cities. One city is 45 mi away and the other one is 70 mi.

I have a Channel Master CM 4228 antenna + CM 7777 V/U preamp, installed on a mast about 25-30 ft above ground, and I live on a hill top. There are other good antennas besides the CM 4228 (example: the Antennas Direct 91XG), but the 4228 works well for a lot of people on this forum.

- When turned on, it takes almost 12 seconds to boot and show a display. Why does it take soooooooooooo long? I wonder if Bill Gates/Microsoft had something to do with it. Is everyone else's like this??? If so, Samsung please fix this, it shouldn't take any electronic device more than 3-4 seconds to turn on, ideally it should take <1 sec.Yep, mine does the same thing. It takes along time to turn on and also it takes along time to turn off (at least 10 seconds or so until the blue light goes off).

Theotherone,

I have just been leaving my Samsung on all the time as I use the pass thru to get to my Pioneer PDP-4340HD atsc and NTSC tuners.

In regards to practical range. On the Raleigh NC post I read where a local station supplied customers as far away as 75 and 100 miles with Antennas and booster to get the OTA ATSC HD broadcast.

-DonB2

Is there a way to see a preview of a program in the program guide? I mean change the channel in the preview image while staying in the guide, not just show you the current channel. My old unit did this but this one seems to jump to the channel you press and close the guide. (I'm using a Harmony 676 remote so I may not have it set up properly.)

Also, the first time you access the guide and scroll down to the next screen, the preview picture and the guide information disappears and there is a delay while it is gathering additional guide information. Why would the preview picture disappear? I love that you can set up programming reminders and that the set will change to those channels according to the schedule.

I'm using component cables with the output set to 720p for my set and the picture looks great otherwise. This set is holding on to a few channels that I had trouble with previously.

Also, has anyone figured out if there are any hidden menus or how to access them on this unit?

There's a station in Greensboro that is about 80 miles away. A lot of their programing appears to be from the mid 70s. I wondered if it was worth any effort to try to pull it in for one or two shows.

There's a station in Greensboro that is about 80 miles away. A lot of their programing appears to be from the mid 70s. I wondered if it was worth any effort to try to pull it in for one or two shows.
Reception at 80 miles depends on many factors. Do you live on a hill top or down in a valley? Are you surrounded by tall trees and dense woods? What is the terrain between you and the station? What is the elevation and broadcast power of the digital station in Greensboro? Is the station digitally broadcasting on VHF, lower end or upper end of UHF? The call letters for the station would help. Enter the station call letters into wikipedia or directly into the FCC database: http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html.

There are many people on avsforum who have reported good reception at 80 miles or even further. But 80 miles puts almost any broadcast tower that is not on a high mountain peak below the nominal horizon, so your elevation matters. However your questions are more appropriate to a new thread or the on-going antenna reception sticky thread in the local HDTV info and reception forum.

kbgl,
You can find the local discussion thread for your town here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=453241):
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=453241

your questions are more appropriate to a new thread or the on-going antenna reception sticky thread in the local HDTV info and reception forum.

I agree, but for this forum: Is there any general agreement about how sensitive this tuner is at long distances relative to others -- for example, the venerable SIR-T451? If its main contribution is dealing with multipath on close-in stations, that's great for people with that problem but not for those trying to haul in distant stations.

Opinions?

wildwillie6,

Well I am not 100 % sure as I am still fiddling, but 3 years ago I had pretty much decided that my Pioneer PDP-4340HD's built in ATSC tuner received stations on the fringe better than my venerable 451.

I now feel pretty good saying that the DTB-H260F picks up fringe stations better than the Pioneer. Keep in mind that sometimes it is difficult to separate fringe issues from multipath issues for distant stations. At least for me it is :)

-DonB2

Has anyone tried recording video out from the DTB-H260F on a DVD recorder and comparing the output from the DTB-H260F to NTSC DVD recorded video? What about timed recordings?

-DonB2

I now feel pretty good saying that the DTB-H260F picks up fringe stations better than the Pioneer. Keep in mind that sometimes it is difficult to separate fringe issues from multipath issues for distant stations. At least for me it is :)


That's useful information, and a point well taken. :) Actually I was thinking about trying out one of these boxes at my brother-in-law's house (He has the close-in multipath problem) and my house too, where I'm trying to pull in a distant station.

But I'm actually more interested in the new Samsung DVD recorder ( http://hometheater.about.com/od/ontheroadatces/ig/CES-2007---Photo-Gallery/Samsung-DVD-Recorder-w--ATSC.htm ) . . . wondering if anyone knows how its tuner compares with the tuner in the DTB-H260F -- same thing, maybe?

wildwillie6,

Don't tell me that Samsung has a ATSC DVD recorder now!!

Two nights ago I was on their site reading about several of their DVD recorders and saw nothing on a ATSC recorder.

I even commented to them at the site that they made it difficult to tell what kind of tuner their DVD recorders had. It was not even obvious when I downloaded the .pdf user manuals.

I will have to check out this URL you just posted.

-DonB2

Looks like it records in standard def. Still, the picture quality might be a small step up from existing DVD recorders.

cbrf4rider,

Is it coming in on your cable line? Try disconnecting your cable line and just use the Samsung via OTA.

-Donb2

Well the ground loop is coming from the OTA antenna cable. Any suggestions?

I am guessing it will be similar to the LG DVD/VCR Tuner models DR787T and RC797T which are slated for a future release and so far I have found very little about.

I will also guess it will have the latest ATSC tuner from Samsung.

But I am happy with Digital Quality with Upscale Capability. It has to be better that NTSC DVD recorders and actually I am pretty impressed even with NTSC DVD recordings over ATSC VCR.

-DonB2

"Well the ground loop is coming from the OTA antenna cable. Any suggestions? "

It could be some interference from a neighbors ham radio or FM interference. These are just guesses though.

Sorry I can not be of more help.

I might add that sometimes it is not productive to ground both ends of a cable as this in itself can cause issues.

-DonB2

That's useful information, and a point well taken. :) Actually I was thinking about trying out one of these boxes at my brother-in-law's house (He has the close-in multipath problem) and my house too, where I'm trying to pull in a distant station.

But I'm actually more interested in the new Samsung DVD recorder ( http://hometheater.about.com/od/ontheroadatces/ig/CES-2007---Photo-Gallery/Samsung-DVD-Recorder-w--ATSC.htm ) . . . wondering if anyone knows how its tuner compares with the tuner in the DTB-H260F -- same thing, maybe?


Now this is what I really wanted! I may take back my tuner and wait for the recorder. I've wondered why no recorders with ATSC tuners were being offered. I figured it was the copyright fanatics keeping them from being sold.

Theotherone,

I have just been leaving my Samsung on all the time as I use the pass thru to get to my Pioneer PDP-4340HD atsc and NTSC tuners.

In regards to practical range. On the Raleigh NC post I read where a local station supplied customers as far away as 75 and 100 miles with Antennas and booster to get the OTA ATSC HD broadcast.

-DonB2


Have you by chance tried to tune in WGPX in Greensboro?

kbgl,
A lot depends on terrain. That being said, I reliably get digital stations (100% signal strength) from two different cities. One city is 45 mi away and the other one is 70 mi.

I have a Channel Master CM 4228 antenna + CM 7777 V/U preamp, installed on a mast about 25-30 ft above ground, and I live on a hill top. There are other good antennas besides the CM 4228 (example: the Antennas Direct 91XG), but the 4228 works well for a lot of people on this forum.

I have a 4228 in my shed that I may try this weekend. My house is in a relatively high area, but my current antenna is only about 25 ft above ground.

"Have you by chance tried to tune in WGPX in Greensboro? " That is on frequency 14?

I will try it tonight. You perked my interest saying it had 70's shows. It is possible I would see a lot more channels if I used a rotator but the better half had enough trouble and so did I with the A/B switch I was using to switch between two antennas.

-DonB2

Also, the first time you access the guide and scroll down to the next screen, the preview picture and the guide information disappears and there is a delay while it is gathering additional guide information. Why would the preview picture disappear? I love that you can set up programming reminders and that the set will change to those channels according to the schedule.

Each channel only transmits guide info for its self so when you bring up the guide the first time the tuner has to change channels and load data.

wildwillie6,

Don't tell me that Samsung has a ATSC DVD recorder now!!
I know that I'm not willie, but somebody missed my AVS thread on this very topic...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=786948

Enjoy!

Has anyone tried recording video out from the DTB-H260F on a DVD recorder and comparing the output from the DTB-H260F to NTSC DVD recorded video? What about timed recordings?

-DonB2

I recorded to a Panasonic ES10 DVD recorder using the s-video connection and 2 hour mode. The picture was very acceptable. I set the channel on the tuner and leave it on. The recorder is programmed to go on and off at the appropriate times, and always looks at input 1 as the source. The H260 will change channels if needed, and the recorder is always set to input 1.

Hook up a composite cable from the H260 to your tv. Fine tune the contrast, brightness and color settings, and that will give you a good idea of what the recording will look like.

mikemikeb and kbgl,

Thanks for the links and thanks for the info on recording off a DTB-H260F

-DonB2

"Have you by chance tried to tune in WGPX in Greensboro? " That is on frequency 14?

I will try it tonight. You perked my interest saying it had 70's shows. It is possible I would see a lot more channels if I used a rotator but the better half had enough trouble and so did I with the A/B switch I was using to switch between two antennas.

-DonB2

Now that you have two tuners, why not set one up with an antenna for channel 4.1 and the other tuner and antenna for everything else? It would be good to see Farrah again ehh!

KBGL,

That would work if I did not have to run another coax line down from the attic and than up thru the crawlspace and into the living room. It was a fun enough job running the first one.

But it is food for thought.

Is WGPX a Pax affiliate?

-DonB2

Each channel only transmits guide info for its self so when you bring up the guide the first time the tuner has to change channels and load data.
I could handle that if it really only did it the first time you load the guide. Mine seems to do this about every 15 minutes or so. I'm guessing it is checking further out in the guide as the half hours pass but I really wish it would just limit itself to only checking once every couple hours or so.

Also, is it normal not to be able to tune to channels with "No Information" from within the guide?

KBGL,

That would work if I did not have to run another coax line down from the attic and than up thru the crawlspace and into the living room. It was a fun enough job running the first one.

But it is food for thought.

Is WGPX a Pax affiliate?

-DonB2

Not sure about PAX. I hooked up my 4228 on the floor inside my house and was able to get 2.1 and 48.1 in addition to the nearby stations. On 48.1 it was showing just one bar, but there was no signal loss, multipath etc. I'm getting all these with the antenna in one fixed position. The local stations are at about 5 or 6 bars. The antenna is pointed almost 180 degrees away from the ch5 tower area. I think I will mount this antenna on the roof and see what else I can get.

Also, is it normal not to be able to tune to channels with "No Information" from within the guide?

Yes for me. This is usually PBS. Sometimes they have TBA and I can tune.

Now this is what I really wanted! I may take back my tuner and wait for the recorder. I've wondered why no recorders with ATSC tuners were being offered. I figured it was the copyright fanatics keeping them from being sold.

kbgl,
Don't take your DTB-H260F ATSC tuner back just yet...remember that the DTB-H260F is a high def tuner and the new dvd recorders will only be a Standard def ATSC tuner.

I too am waiting for a HD DVD recorder with a HD tuner, but we'll probably have to wait 2 years or so until they are out and affordable. Probably by then our tuners will overheat and crap out.

Looks like Music Choice bit the dust for us.

kbgl,
Don't take your DTB-H260F ATSC tuner back just yet...remember that the DTB-H260F is a high def tuner and the new dvd recorders will only be a Standard def ATSC tuner.

I too am waiting for a HD DVD recorder with a HD tuner, but we'll probably have to wait 2 years or so until they are out and affordable. Probably by then our tuners will overheat and crap out.

Good point. I better research a little more. I am assuming it has a HD tuner and will output HD. I realize the recordings will be 480i.

"Good point. I better research a little more. I am assuming it has a HD tuner and will output HD. I realize the recordings will be 480i. "

I am assuming the same thing.


I figure it records in Digital but if you hook up the HDMI to your tv that the ATSC tuner should be capable of displaying directly 16x9 HD on the Plasma.

Of course any material recorded on the DVD using this recorder would only be able to upconvert to the tv.

-DonB2

As far as I can tell, these new DVD recorders will have HD tuners for live content, they just RECORD to SD. So, if you have an older SDTV that doesn't have a digital tuner, but does have a component video input, save the H260F to use for that TV. If you don't have that kind of TV, then you could sell your H260F for above MSRP on eBay :D

"Good point. I better research a little more. I am assuming it has a HD tuner and will output HD. I realize the recordings will be 480i. "

I am assuming the same thing.


I figure it records in Digital but if you hook up the HDMI to your tv that the ATSC tuner should be capable of displaying directly 16x9 HD on the Plasma.

Of course any material recorded on the DVD using this recorder would only be able to upconvert to the tv.

-DonB2

DonB2 and kbgl,
This is a good question to ask any electronics industry expert:
Whether the new DVD recorders with ATSC tuner, that are coming out this spring, be capable of displaying HD content in HD? If it did, wouldn't Samsung be competing with themselves? ...and all of us with the DTB-H260F tuner and an older DVD recorder be ditching these items and just using a single device the Samsung DVD recorder with ATSC tuner to do both. I was assuming that it would only be standard def. (480).

Any electronics industry experts out there that can answer this question?

DonB2 and kbgl,
This is a good question to ask any electronics industry expert:
Whether the new DVD recorders with ATSC tuner, that are coming out this spring, be capable of displaying HD content in HD? If it did, wouldn't Samsung be competing with themselves? ...and all of us with the DTB-H260F tuner and an older DVD recorder be ditching these items and just using a single device the Samsung DVD recorder with ATSC tuner to do both. I was assuming that it would only be standard def. (480).

Any electronics industry experts out there that can answer this question?

I think it would depend on your TV whether or not you would want to ditch the STB in favor of the DVD recorder. If your TV does not have a built in ATSC tuner, then you will still need the STB to watch one show while recording another. Also, the STB may be useful for PIP if you TV supports it but only has one tuner.

I'm also curious if the new ATSC DVD recorders will allow HD content to pass through when being used exclusively as a tuner.

Jay

DonB2 and kbgl,
This is a good question to ask any electronics industry expert:
Whether the new DVD recorders with ATSC tuner, that are coming out this spring, be capable of displaying HD content in HD? If it did, wouldn't Samsung be competing with themselves? ...and all of us with the DTB-H260F tuner and an older DVD recorder be ditching these items and just using a single device the Samsung DVD recorder with ATSC tuner to do both. I was assuming that it would only be standard def. (480).

Any electronics industry experts out there that can answer this question?

Just look how easy it is to schedule a show for playing on the samsung tuner using the guide. This is much easier than scheduling recordings on my DVD recorder. It also would be one less connection to my TV and one less connection to my receiver. How many non-technical type folks can record using 2 units like we do? I think it's too much trouble for most people. For me, the improvement over an analog signal on a VCR is worth the effort even for old SD sitcoms that make up the bulk of my recordings. The tuners we buy today will always be useful on a second TV, or for a second or third HD source, or for when we need to record two overlapping shows. I bought this one specifically to use with my DVD recorder.

. . . whether the new DVD recorders with ATSC tuner, that are coming out this spring, would be capable of displaying HD content in HD? If it did, wouldn't Samsung be competing with themselves? . . .

Yes, Samsung might be "cannibalizing" its own product line, in that the new DVD recorder could offer everything the tuner did, plus DVD-quality recording -- for a modest increase in price. Then the choices would be something like this.

(1) Come out with a really good DVD recorder that will eat into tuner sales.

(2) Come out with a really good DVD recorder, price it high, and cut the price on the tuner to allow room for both.

(3) Allow the DVD recorder only to output SD, to preserve tuner sales.

. . . but always with the worry that someone else would come out with a DVD recorder that would output HD -- really easy to do given off-the shelf solutions (http://www.lsi.com/news/product_news/2005_12_05a.html) -- and run away with the market. Also note: That news release is from December 2005, not December 2006. Whatever the obstacles to releasing a good ATSC DVD recorder, I don't think waiting for key components to be developed was one of them.

I think it was last summer I put out a bunch of posts wondering why no one was making a ATSC DVD recorder.

Of course I got the obvious replies like "You would only be able to fit minutes of a HD show on a DVD and so on."

The replies I got back made it sound like it was an impossibility and just wait for a real HD recorder or get myself a Tivo or DVR recorder.

Well the electronics industy has been mandated by the goverment to sell DVD recorders either with out any tuner or if the recorder has a tuner it has to be capable of ATSC.

So now low and behold several manufactures are producing the same device that a year ago I was getting told was not even physically possible.

I realise they are doing it by downconverting but at least they are doing it.

Now if I could get the goverment to Mandate that are local PBS station to move their transmit tower to the antenna farm as all the other local stations so I would not have to play games receiving from two different directions I would be happy.

-DonB2

Re: Eliminating Ground Loop from your antenna lead

You can buy from Radio Shack two "Matching Transformers" (15-1140) and one 2- Position Barrier Strip (274-656). Use the Barrier Strip to connect the two transformers "back to back".

You will then have two female F-connector jacks that are electrically isolated at 60 Hz (power line frequency) but will pass the television channel radio frequencies. Put this inline with your antenna lead and it will eliminate the hum.

Note that not all matching transformers (also known as baluns) are built the same way and can be used successfully in this way (their input and output windings are not separate). But I have used the Radio Shack baluns successfully to eliminate ground loop hum coming from a CATV system.

Good luck!

Gary

Now if I could get the goverment to Mandate that are local PBS station to move their transmit tower to the antenna farm as all the other local stations so I would not have to play games receiving from two different directions I would be happy.

-DonB2

Were you able to get the PBS broadcast of Peter Frampton last night? I had some problems even with the Samsung tuner, but the show was fantastic! I wonder if it's something on the transmitting end that is causing problems. I've had very good reception from ch 4 until the concert started, and it was virtually unwatchable. Breakups were every 10 or 15 seconds. I switched to my 4228 inside my house, and the breakup problems were reduced to about 3 or 4 an hour.

I will have to try that 60 HZ hum eliminator. BTW - here is the URL to the Barrier Strip:

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103228&cp


-Donb2

I had such bad reception here in Raleigh NC last night that I was ready to throw in the towel on everything especially seeing as today is garbage day it would have been a perfect time to void myself of ever getting PBS in one direction and all the others local's in the opposite direction simultaneously.

It was very windy outside but I don't think that was the real reason I had problems

I had rotated my Attic Mounted 4228 in such away that the Samsung DTB-H260F was pretty much getting Locals and PBS simultaneously and all was right with the ATSC world.

But than last night I went to watch Fox 50.1 here in Raleigh, and instantly got No Signal Found off of the Samsung. I flipped to analog since the better half has no patience for ATSC signal loss.

Later that evening I rotated the antenna slightly to favor the local towers which should have improved everything but PBS.

I than watched Till death on FOX and had no break ups until the last 6 minutes of the show when I go the infamous No Signal Found.

Hey it is bad enough losing the signal, why does Samsung feel they have to throw that huge No Signal Found rectangle on the screen? Is it to let the better half no for sure she is watching ATSC and not NTSC like there was any doubt in her mind?

So than up to the attic one last time to rotate the antenna again slightly to favor the local towers which should have improved everything but PBS.

I than was getting pretty good reception on the Samsung again with decent signal strengths but I can't say as I watched much later to see if breakups remanifested themselves. It was getting late.

I than switched to my Pioneer PDP-4340HD ATSC and just about fell over when I could not receive any station at all!! And the pay off was they were all showing very high signal strengths. I had this happen once before when I first got the Samsung and attempted to do compares between the two receivers. I do not know what is causing this unless it is some kind of multipath issue that the Pioneer can not handle.

Meanwhile this morning I attempted to watch Good Morning America off of the Samsung and was treated with No Signal Found.


So I guess I will be back up in the attic this weekend.


Oh and no I didn't get to watch Mr Frampton last night.

-DonB2

Whatever the obstacles to releasing a good ATSC DVD recorder, I don't think waiting for key components to be developed was one of them.

I think the reason manufacturers are dragging their feet is that they don't want to invest in a ATSC DVD recorders until they have to due to federal mandates. It seems reasonable that consumer demand for such a device would low, given that analog tuner recorders will still record from cable, satellite, VHS, and DV, which is what most people use their DVD recorders for.
So, in reality, the people who will benefit the most from a ATSC DVD recorder will be those who rely solely on OTA broadcasts for TV, which is a small share ot the market.

Jay

You are probably right on this. Recording HD and decoding ATSC are different problems. Now I have a 2d STB, I have one connected to the DVDR so I can record from one and watch the other.

scott s.
.

"I think the reason manufacturers are dragging their feet "

There certainly is a lot of truth to that. You can record 50 plus stations in S Video format from Cable or Dish with a NTSC DVD recorder vs 4 to 5 ATSC SD or HD OTA Stations with a Digital DVD recorder.


DonB2

I think the reason manufacturers are dragging their feet is that they don't want to invest in a ATSC DVD recorders until they have to due to federal mandates. It seems reasonable that consumer demand for such a device would low, given that analog tuner recorders will still record from cable, satellite, VHS, and DV, which is what most people use their DVD recorders for.
So, in reality, the people who will benefit the most from a ATSC DVD recorder will be those who rely solely on OTA broadcasts for TV, which is a small share ot the market.

Jay

I think another reason is the battle on the next generation format is the Blue-Ray and the HD DVD and sound like the battle is still on it just like back in the old days in the 80's :eek: with the Laser Disc and the Beta disc. then the VHS won the battle. If some don't know or had gotten old ;) it was a over size CD disc like the size of old 78 records.

Willie

Don't forget that there are plenty of us, myself included, who have yet to invest in a TV set capable of displaying HD content. So, getting a Blue Ray or HD-DVD recorder would be pointless for me.

Jay

I need a little bit of help.

my h260f is hooked to cable. when I first autoprogramed it, it saw those lower numbered analog channels (like channel 2, 3, 4), as well as those digital channels (like 804) and had all channel call signs (like "WNBC", etc.) next to those channel numbers.

recently, I have lost the analog channels, and I no long have those call signs, and each channel shows up like 80-3456, or something like that.

what gives?

I've got a nice one of these too. I'm in atl and have comcast. I don't get a guide and the channels are all over the place. Anyone have any ideas?

I've got a nice one of these too. I'm in atl and have comcast. I don't get a guide and the channels are all over the place. Anyone have any ideas?
A pen a piece of paper and about a hour of time.
Good luck. :)

For people with a composite jack hooked up to the TV, you can connect the other end to the "green" part of the component output. This will make images display in black and white, with all menus visible on-screen.
For some reason this isn't working for me... :( :(

Ed

A pen a piece of paper and about a hour of time.
Good luck. :)

What does that mean?

Also how do I watch regular cable channels with this?

Unfortunately, you have to do a channel search of the cable channels and then search through the channels it found and make a list of where they are. Channels that are conditional access (encrypted) will only show a black screen when you tune to them. You have to get a cable box to get those.

For some reason this isn't working for me... :( :(
There are two switches on the back. With the unit turned off, switch one of the switches to the Y/Pb/Pr setting, and the other to the resolution of your TV, whether it be 480i (the resolution of all NTSC-only 4x3 screen TVs), 480p, 720p, or 1080i. Then turn the unit on and see if it's working.

Hope this helps.

Also how do I watch regular cable channels with this?

If you mean analog cable channels, you don't. This unit doesn't handle analog TV, whether OTA or cable. Connect the Samsung's coaxial output to the coax input on the TV, if it has a cable-ready analog tuner, or to the coax input on an analog cable box.

There are two switches on the back. With the unit turned off, switch one of the switches to the Y/Pb/Pr setting, and the other to the resolution of your TV, whether it be 480i (the resolution of all NTSC-only 4x3 screen TVs), 480p, 720p, or 1080i. Then turn the unit on and see if it's working.

Hope this helps.
Like a dream!!! :) :)

THANKS!!!

Ed

The DVD recorders with tuners are almost non-existent now: therefore, DVD recorders with ATCS tuners with sell at significant premiums, at least initially.

I live in the center of X between the Chicago, Rockford, Madison and Milwaukee market. I have downloaded the Manual for the DT-H260F but has no answer to my question is for will the unit accept 2 different market as same DT channel. Here a couple station that I will have problem with. I don't want to rescan switching Madison to Chicago market. I have not gotten the unit yet I just need to get my hand one if I ever find one around here. As I am sure I will not only have this issue as other will have same issue as DT are or will be moving to after 2009 I know it will mapout to the right channel but will the unit accept 2 DT channel as 19 will be assign to WMTV 15 and WGN 9. I don't know if anyone thought of this problem yet.

These is the station I watch the most of time and they are the only one I know of that will have with now or after 2009. I do sometime get Grand Rapid station but I don't know of any conflict with thier ch assginment yet.

Station Current Current Tentative
DT CH Analog CH DT CH

WMTV Madison NBC 19 15 19
WGN Chicago CW 19 9 19

WMSN Madison FOX 11 47 11
WBBM Chicago CBS 3 2 11

WISC Madison CBS 50 3 50
WPWR Chicago MY 51 50 50 ??

I don't know for sure but I have the previous model and you can directly tune the RF channel and it will update to the virtual channel on the fly.

Can someone check their Optical Output ?

No matter what I do, I can't seem to "light it up". I tried changing the Settings/SoundOutput to both PCM & Dolby Digital.

I'm receiving OTA digital channels from the Chicago area. Analog works fine.

Plug an optical cable in and let me know "if you see the light" out the other end. I'm just trying to find out if this output is supposed to be "lit-up" all of the time.

My light is on, on either setting. Dolby Dig or PCM.

Can someone check their Optical Output ?

No matter what I do, I can't seem to "light it up". I tried changing the Settings/SoundOutput to both PCM & Dolby Digital.

I'm receiving OTA digital channels from the Chicago area. Analog works fine.

Plug an optical cable in and let me know "if you see the light" out the other end. I'm just trying to find out if this output is supposed to be "lit-up" all of the time.
For QAM, I see the light. Also, it works to get DD output to my receiver. (I can't receive anything OTA.)

Does this unit rely totally on the guide to schedule a recording?
Can you give it a date, time, and channel to program an on time?

There are two switches on the back. With the unit turned off, switch one of the switches to the Y/Pb/Pr setting, and the other to the resolution of your TV, whether it be 480i (the resolution of all NTSC-only 4x3 screen TVs), 480p, 720p, or 1080i. Then turn the unit on and see if it's working.


I didn't need to turn the unit off to make the switch, actually. I was bouncing between component and HDMI video to try to see if there were any major differences, and I didn't have to turn the unit off and on to do so. I'm pretty sure I was able to switch between 720p and 1080i as well without power cycling.

Guess I'm foolhardy. :)

Are the Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner's in stock at all locations now? Or are they still hard to come by?

-DonB2

Check Circuit City availability here (http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Samsung-HD-Tuner-DTB-H260F/sem/rpsm/oid/164855/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do)

Thanks, that confirms that BB and CC do not have them in stock locally here in Raleigh , NC

-DonB2

Thanks, that confirms that BB and CC do not have them in stock locally here in Raleigh , NC

-DonB2

The CC website for stock availability is a good resource, but is not always accurate, based on my experience. I live in the MD/DC/VA metro area and had been tryiing to get it also by checking 7 local CCs in my area, via website. They always showed "out of stock". Last weekend I just happened to stop by CC to get something else and had them check. He looked in his computer and showed one in stock, he went in the back of the store and found it. Whereas, the website had always listed it as out of stock, even on the day I went to the store.

So, if you happen to be in the store, ask them to check, you might get lucky.

Does this unit rely totally on the guide to schedule a recording?
Can you give it a date, time, and channel to program an on time?
It relies on the guide. You cannot input a start time manually. That is unless there is some super secret hidden option I've yet to find. It is annoying because our local ABC station still doesn't send any guide info. So not only can you not schedule a start time but you can't even tune to it from the guide.



Another question for anyone that might know: Is there a way to delete channels out of the guide? I can delete them from the channel list but they still show up in the program guide.

If you mean analog cable channels, you don't. This unit doesn't handle analog TV, whether OTA or cable. Connect the Samsung's coaxial output to the coax input on the TV, if it has a cable-ready analog tuner, or to the coax input on an analog cable box.

That answers my first question. Is there a recommended box that will handle Digital OTA and also manage analog cable?

I'm a Time Warner sub in Southern California. We're not interested in their digital packages, and being in LA, we have plenty of OTA HD choices. I've got a 40" Sony monitor coming in, and looking for a digital tuner that will handle our analog cable subscription. I can use a VCR or TIVO as the analog tuner, but would rather combine my live TV feeds into one device. I haven't seen much on the ViewSonic HD10 or HD12.

If you mean analog cable channels, you don't. This unit doesn't handle analog TV, whether OTA or cable.

that's odd. when i turned it on the first time, it did turn in those lower analog channels (like channels 2 - 25), and correctly showed their call signs.

however, I haven't been able to get them back.

That answers my first question. Is there a recommended box that will handle Digital OTA and also manage analog cable?

I'm a Time Warner sub in Southern California. We're not interested in their digital packages, and being in LA, we have plenty of OTA HD choices. I've got a 40" Sony monitor coming in, and looking for a digital tuner that will handle our analog cable subscription. I can use a VCR or TIVO as the analog tuner, but would rather combine my live TV feeds into one device. I haven't seen much on the ViewSonic HD10 or HD12.Doesn't your new Sony have an analog/digital tuner? Or is it a true "monitor-only?" What's the Sony model number?

Is there a recommended box that will handle Digital OTA and also manage analog cable?

It looks like the new PrimeDTV PHD200 discussed towards the end of this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=638769) does do NTSC as well as ATSC and QAM.

I have the previous Samsung tuner model sir-t451 and last weekend when I was at CC they just happened to have the new DTB-H260F and I bought one to do a side by side comparison. Thanks to everyone on this site for their thoughtful comments which tempted me to buy it.

I use it to get over-the-air local stations and live in an urban setting with tall buildings. Most of the stations are a couple of miles from me. With a roof top antenna I could get most of the DC/MD/VA stations. Two things I definitely didn't like about the older 451 was slow channel changing (2-3 sec. for each channel to change and lock in) and the multipath reception problems. The 260 is an improvement, but still needs some work in other areas.

Here are some of the things I noticed about the DTB-H260F (SAMSUNG reps please take note):

PROS:

- The main strenght in my opinion is much improved reception. It performs great in my urban environment and handles multipath reception issues very well. It locks into all channels, even at 2-3 bars (20-30%) signal strength without any dropouts. Reception with the 451 was also good but I would have to rotate the antenna frequently to get all the channels because of interference and multipath issues. With the 260 no need to use a rotator.

- Faster channel changes. It works a little different than the 451. For surfing it does not lock in the signal for each channel until you stop at the channel, so you can quickly scan over all the channels that you don't want. The 451 wouldn't let you proceed to the next channel until it locked in taking 2-3 sec to get thru each channel. With the 260, when you stop at the channel you want it takes only 1-2 sec to lock in.

- Lets you go thru all the screens in the menu guide easily, whereas with the 451 wouldn't let you change the channels until you exited the menu guide, and if your reception was weak it would not go thru the menu easily.

- Great picture same as the 451

- Good price

- Nice and small

CONS:

- When turned on, it takes almost 12 seconds to boot and show a display. Why does it take soooooooooooo long? I wonder if Bill Gates/Microsoft had something to do with it. Is everyone else's like this??? If so, Samsung please fix this, it shouldn't take any electronic device more than 4 seconds to turn on, ideally it should take <1 sec.

- Has anyone noticed how warm this box gets? I measured the temperature and in a 70 degree F room, the unit would get to 104 degrees on top and about 107 degrees inside the bottom holes. Can this thing last at these temperatures for 5-10 years? I splurged on the 5 year -$35 Circuit City extended warranty just in case.

- The signal strengths tend to be about 20% lower as compared to the 451 based on the signal strength display, but since it locks into the station without any dropouts this is not an issue. I wonder if this will decrease the channel availability for those people who are very far from a station tower (>80 miles)?

- No way to input the date or time. Hence, when I set it to accept Daylight Savings Time the time display for the East coast was incorrect.

- The blue LED power light next to the power button looks cheap. Samsung should get rid of it and put a circular LED light around the power button for a clean look.

- Why is there a small black dot on the center lower faceplate? I assume it's for the IR remote, but why is it angled up? Samsung should put it on upper faceplate where it would blend in with the black background for a cleaner look.

- Samsung remote seems sluggish, it's not always responsive to the commands when pushed. Using a universal remote works better. I guess Samsung doesn't expect most people to use the original remote.

- One last item that I've read about the 260 is that it is not compatible with older TVs using composite input, because it won't display the setup menu guide. This is where the 451 shines it worked on all TVs in my house no matter whatever input used.

That answers my first question. Is there a recommended box that will handle Digital OTA and also manage analog cable?

I'm a Time Warner sub in Southern California. We're not interested in their digital packages, and being in LA, we have plenty of OTA HD choices. I've got a 40" Sony monitor coming in, and looking for a digital tuner that will handle our analog cable subscription. I can use a VCR or TIVO as the analog tuner, but would rather combine my live TV feeds into one device. I haven't seen much on the ViewSonic HD10 or HD12.

I hear you, but one idea is to go with the RCA DRC8052 DVD recorder ($98 at WalMart on sale) and stay with a second device. The upside to this is you get really nice upconversion of your cable/satellite/SD OTA signals and DVDs to 720p or 1080i over HDMI, which you can send to a second HDMI port if your Sony has one(assuming you already use one for the current OTA HD tuner) , or run all of your HDMI inputs into an A/V receiver then to the Sony. You can also send the DTB-H260F's s-video into the RCA DVD recorder this way and record OTA HD as 480P to boot. Not a bad way to go, actually.

I just bought the Samsung a few nights ago and have been happy so far with its performance. One thing I notice though is that the volume on my Hitachi 46" RP tv now has to be on average about 5-8 settings higher, and it's not very crisp sounding. Has anyone else had a problem with the audio sounding a bit muffled (this is through component hook-up)?

I've read through almost all of this post and come away a little confused about something.

If I want to hook up my antenna and my cable to this box, can that be done without a splitter?
My TV has 2 antenna inputs and one loop output if that helps any.

There is just a lot of info in this post.

Oh as for where I got mine, I managed to order one from BB's website. They were listed as available for like 2 days last week.

Audio is low and you have to choose ota or cable OR A/B switch. As far as tv loop, decide if cable/tv/samsung is best route or visa versa. If your tv has mulitiple inputs, it can act as a A/B switch.

If I want to hook up my antenna and my cable to this box, can that be done without a splitter?
My TV has 2 antenna inputs and one loop output if that helps any.You have to use an A/B switch. You can't combine an antenna and cable tv service on one coax.

I just bought the Samsung a few nights ago and have been happy so far with its performance. One thing I notice though is that the volume on my Hitachi 46" RP tv now has to be on average about 5-8 settings higher, and it's not very crisp sounding. Has anyone else had a problem with the audio sounding a bit muffled (this is through component hook-up)?

Same experience on my unit. I believe others have reported the same findings...

Regards,
Ricky

Doesn't your new Sony have an analog/digital tuner? Or is it a true "monitor-only?" What's the Sony model number?

No tuners. True monitor only. KLV40U100M. Got a great deal and will mount it to the wall in the bedroom, but am still figuring out the TV source options.

I hear you, but one idea is to go with the RCA DRC8052 DVD recorder ($98 at WalMart on sale) and stay with a second device. The upside to this is you get really nice upconversion of your cable/satellite/SD OTA signals and DVDs to 720p or 1080i over HDMI, which you can send to a second HDMI port if your Sony has one(assuming you already use one for the current OTA HD tuner) , or run all of your HDMI inputs into an A/V receiver then to the Sony. You can also send the DTB-H260F's s-video into the RCA DVD recorder this way and record OTA HD as 480P to boot. Not a bad way to go, actually.

Thank you. That's the kind of genius I was looking for. ;)

I've looked at the PrimeDTV PHD200 mentioned above, but with a single RF input, it severely limits my ability to do _both_ OTA HD and analog cable. A cheap RCA unit like this -- with the added bonus of upconversion for SD signals may fit the short term bill.

I'm assuming there's a thread on this device, and will check search to find it. Thanks again.

Thank you. That's the kind of genius I was looking for. ;)

I've looked at the PrimeDTV PHD200 mentioned above, but with a single RF input, it severely limits my ability to do _both_ OTA HD and analog cable. A cheap RCA unit like this -- with the added bonus of upconversion for SD signals may fit the short term bill.

I'm assuming there's a thread on this device, and will check search to find it. Thanks again.

Just to be clear, and from his post I'm sure etrojan understands this - this is just a clarification for all forum readers - I'm suggesting having the Samsung OTA HD tuner and the RCA DVD recorder both hooked directly into a monitor with two HDMI ports or through an A/V receiver with HDMI switching capability. Additionally, you can use the RCA unit as an analog SD cable tuner (and recorder...) with the added bonus of upconversion of all the cable channels to 720p or 1080i as long as the output is routed out the HDMI port, and of it being an upconverting DVD player. There is a thread on the RCA here http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=673985

Since the RCA also has an some s-video inputs, you can also connect the DTB-H260F's s-video output to one of the RCA's s-video inputs and record even 16:9 OTA HD channels. I was wrong about 480P, it is 16:9 480i but very high quality and the same channel as whatever the Samsung tuner is currently tuned to. I guess that when you play this kind of recording back, it will get upconverted but I haven't tried that yet so can't comment on the quality.

Hi all,
Please help with choosing an antenna. I would like to buy a good one, and where can I get one. I'm located in the St. Petersburg area. Any information is very much appreciated. It will go with the Samsung DTB-260F. This is
DTV Antenna,

* yellow - uhf WEDU-DT 3.1 PBS TAMPA FL 88° 24.4 54
* yellow - uhf WXPX-DT 66.1 i BRADENTON FL 92° 24.4 42
* yellow - vhf WTVT-DT 13.1 FOX TAMPA FL 92° 25.7 12
* yellow - uhf WTOG-DT 44.1 CW ST. PETERSBURG FL 88° 24.4 59
* yellow - uhf WTTA-DT 38.1 MNT ST. PETERSBURG FL 89° 24.4 57
* yellow - uhf WMOR-DT 32.1 IND LAKELAND FL 92° 24.4 19
* yellow - uhf WFTS-DT 28.1 ABC TAMPA FL 89° 24.4 29
* yellow - vhf WFLA-DT 8.1 NBC TAMPA FL 89° 24.4 7
* yellow - uhf WCLF-DT 22.1 CTN CLEARWATER FL 92° 24.4 21
* yellow - uhf WTSP-DT 10.1 CBS ST. PETERSBURG FL 351° 26.5 24
* green - uhf WUSF-DT 16.1 PBS TAMPA FL 88° 24.4 34
* lt green - uhf WVEA-DT 25.1 UNI VENICE FL 92° 24.4 25
* red - uhf WFTT-DT 50.1 TFA TAMPA FL 89° 24.4 47
* blue - uhf WWSB-DT 52.1 ABC SARASOTA FL 138° 25.3 52
Note:

without a rotor, a UHF antenna pointed 89 or 90 degrees should get all the stations on that magnetic bearing at 25 miles or less. The problem will be the NBC station on VHF digital channel 7 (old analog channel 8).

So, for everything in that direction, try a mid-size VHF/UHF antenna

http://www.warrenelectronics.com/antennas/hd7078p.htm

or

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103085&cp=&sr=1&origkw=uhf%2Fvhf&kw=uhf%2Fvhf&parentPage=search

I'm curious about the ability of this box to save preferences to watch future programs --it does this through the onscreen guide? If a program is set for future watching, will it power up and change to the correct channel when the time comes, or do you have to remember to leave it on?

So this perplexes me. If you can only have one input running into the Samsung without a switch, why in the options for auto tune is there; Air, Cable, Air+Cable.

Why would you want to auto tune both at once if you can only have them through a switch?

It doesn't make much sense, but I suppose what it does is search for both ATSC/8VSB streams and QAM streams, which are vastly different. The only way you'd see both is if you had air and cable combined into one coax, but you'd have to have some sort of bandpass filters to avoid them interfering with each other, and an A/B switch is simpler.

Or, perhaps they designed the interface before the hardware was finalized, and originally there was going to be a separate cable input?

===
I set my parents up with an SIR-T451 last year, and it works reasonably well with their 27" Toshiba SDTV (4:3, has component and S-Video in, but 480i only). These are my main complaints with it, in decreasing order:

No 480i output on component-- apparently when the switch is set to 480i it sends 480p over component. The TV shows an out-of-sync picture on the 480i setting, and the same out-of-sync pattern on 480p, but clearly different out-of-sync patterns on 720p and 1080i. I tested the box with a friend's JVC SDTV and saw the same thing. We returned it but the new unit has the same problem. We ended up just connecting it via S-Video. It's pretty clear for an SDTV, but the TV only has one S-Video input, so that bumped the DVD player down to composite (ugh).
"Zoom" mode stretches horizontally-- with the box configured for 4:3, the "aspect" button switches between "LetterBox", "Full" (stretches the 16:9 picture vertically to fill the screen), and "Zoom" (essentially a 4:3 pan-n-scan mode). This would be great for watching SD content on the HD channels, as it would then perfectly fit the TV, except that it scales too much horizontally -- people look slightly fat and the left/right edges of what should fit into a 4:3 picture get cut off. SD subchannels, however, display correctly, filling the screen, and there's no stretching (the aspect button only allows "full only").
The program info display in the guide is terrible. It breaks lines in the middle of words, goes off the edge of the screen, and there's no way to scroll through it if there's more text than fits in the box.
Slow channel change -- it takes about 3 seconds to change channels.


From what I've read in this thread, the new H260F solves the 480i over component issue, although it has a new problem of not showing the OSD on S-Video or composite. This wouldn't be a problem with their TV, though they may not want to buy a new box, as the current one does work (to a certain extent).

Does it have any of the other problems, especially the zoom one? It's really annoying -- to watch SD content on an HD channel (which is basically anything in reruns), it's either fat-face mode or letterboxed (by the Samsung box) and pillarboxed (by the station) in a tiny square in the middle of the screen.

The DTB-H260F works well as a tuner, locking in a signal in multipath environments, and has pretty good picture quality. The lack of dual RF inputs seems like the biggest negative along with the lack of a NTSC tuner. Software could be better, but looks like it'll do. One nice thing is that it doesn't seem to have any glaring oddball problems like flashing, weird lines, etc etc.
I think this tuner will be selling for half of list in 6-12 months. I think it'll be a better feeling purchase at that price.