You mean the second one? If so, I can't disclose it because the title is not yet released.

There goes amirm teasing us again, 'Lost'-style! At least HD-DVD, unlike BR, delivers the goods at the end of all the teasing. :)

You mean the second one? If so, I can't disclose it because the title is not yet released.

Hmm. Wonder if it involves the return of a guy from the planet Krypton... ;)

Hmm. Wonder if it involves the return of a guy from the planet Krypton... ;)
Was his ship called VC-1? Oh, I forgot. He doesn't use a ship. :D

Da da da DA DA DA! DA DA DA DA DADA!!! SUPERMAN!!!

*Runs around room in a red cape. Stubs toe.* :p

Was his ship called VC-1? Oh, I forgot. He doesn't use a ship. :D

Hum, lets think... ship?

Hum, lets think... ship?

Titanic. Poseidon. Waterworld. King Kong.

Star Trek. Battlestar Galactica.

Miami Vice.

(Yep, I'm reaching...)

Hum, lets think... ship?

I would imagine that Amir is talking about Poseidon.

Matrix?

Or maybe it is even bigger than that and there is more to it (pure speculation here) ... what about POTC : Dead Man's Chest from Disney :D ! Capt. Jack has a ship ;) .

-------- Jason

Can't wait to check out this title.

OK, so I stopped by my local Target, again. Went to that price scanner widget, punched in the number, and it showed they have it in stock. The same snot-nosed redshirt was working that day. He just went into the back, brought it back and gave it to me.

Just got done watching it.

:eek:

This is right up there with Seabiscuit and U-571 for me, although I liked the audio more on BB than on those two titles. The TrueHD track is wonderful. I haven't had the chance to compare it to the DD+ track yet, but I will at some point.

I chapter searched to get the jist of IME, and like others have stated, it's somewhat sparse, but there's still plenty of cool commentary and PIP going on. At some point I'll watch the entire movie with IME, but it seemed like when there'd be some content, it was usually near or at the start of the chapters.

I hope this is a harbinger of things to come for HD-DVD, seriously, this title makes me giddy. Despite incessant whining of how 30 GIG could never be enough storage and 30mbps being a HUGE bandwidth limitation and how there's "not enough studio support" and how there's "not enough hardware" and "no good titles"...etc.....we now have, in our greedy little bit-starved hands (drum roll, please)....a blockbuster title, that's 2.5 hours long, with a lossless audio track, IME, and excellent PQ. While others have harped, and some continue to harp, on why it couldn't be done in HD-DVD... HD-DVD is actually doing it. No more waiting, no more empty promises, no more delays, no more uneasiness that it may not happen. It's happening!! :D

Was his ship called VC-1? Oh, I forgot. He doesn't use a ship. :D

Amirm,

Thank you for making VC-1 possibe and for making us enjoy our hobby to the fullest. I'm off to order Batman Begins from my favorite HDDVD pusher today. This will be my 22nd HDDVD disc and loving it! :)

Was his ship called VC-1? Oh, I forgot. He doesn't use a ship. :D

*Dons nerd hat* Actually, in the beginning of Superman Returns he uses a ship disguised as a meteor to travel back to earth *Removes nerd hat*

Matrix?

Look at the SD disc again and tell me if you'd attempt that at 10Mbits! Especially Revolutions. I can't confirm the title either (especially since Amir and I don't talk directly), but I know we've at least got one in the can that's a little above that 10Mbit BR and it may be what he's talking about and not released yet.

Cjplay.

Went to my local Target this morning, and although the saleslady was very pleasant and willing enough to check out the number I gave her for Batman Begins, she explained that there was an annotation of a specific on-sale date and she couldn't sell it to me. I decided not to push it, so it looks like I wait until next week. :(

Went to my local Target this morning, and although the saleslady was very pleasant and willing enough to check out the number I gave her for Batman Begins, she explained that there was an annotation of a specific on-sale date and she couldn't sell it to me. I decided not to push it, so it looks like I wait until next week. :(

That's too bad. You may want to try another local store or come back at a later time and speak to someone else that may be less vigilant :) In any event, they should start selling them on 10/8, so you would just have to wait a few more days.

Look at the SD disc again and tell me if you'd attempt that at 10Mbits! Especially Revolutions. I can't confirm the title either (especially since Amir and I don't talk directly), but I know we've at least got one in the can that's a little above that 10Mbit BR and it may be what he's talking about and not released yet.

Cjplay.
In terms like that, I wonder if it's V For Vendetta. Lots of dark scenes, which don't eat up bit rates.

Was Batman done from D5 or SR? And that came from the 4K DI for Imax or was it a separate transfer to 1080p?

I GOT THE GOLDEN TICKET!!

oh wait, that's Wonka

I GOT THE BLUE FLOWER!! :) After trying 4 stores, I decided to try one last store. I asked a girl to check stockroom for something I was gonna buy. After verifying stock she asked for a manager to come over and open the stockroom. :( Lucky me they both said nothing and brought it out. The girl says "Looks like you got the last one."
Honey you probably mean the only one... :rolleyes:

Thanks to all for the heads up.

Arrrrrgh, I am aching for this disc! Curse my Canadian blood (and location) !

I dont understand what would be wrong about revealing which titles were created with the enhanced VC-1 encoder.

What resolution is the TrueHD at? Did Warners use their 24/48 master?

Dan

What resolution is the TrueHD at? Did Warners use their 24/48 master?

Dan

16bit/48Khz. You will have to wait till next year to get the first 20bit/24bit TrueHD tracks on HD-DVD (this info comes from some compressionist ;) )

I can only imagine how much better this will sound at 20/24 bit. I may need to upgrade my audio equipment again...

The review is up over at High Def Digest (http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/batmanbegins.html)

"...this one is simply the best sound mix I've yet heard on any home video format, period. "

wasn't lucky to get this one early. Please Amazon, no delays.

http://www.dvdtown.com/review/batmanbeginshd-dvd/19986/3999/

Video 9/10
Audio 10/10
Extras 9/10

Not bad for a two hour twenty minute movie imo.

and here too:
High Def Digest (http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/batmanbegins.html)

"...this one is simply the best sound mix I've yet heard on any home video format, period. "

Here's a link to Robert Harris' review at the HOME THEATER FORUM:

Robert Harris on BATMAN BEGINS (http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/showthread.php?t=243415)


I screened Batman Begins this evening in Dolby Digital TrueHD, and two things are clear.

1. Batman Begins is an extraordinary motion picture.

2. Batman Begins is the most finely crafted piece of home video software yet created in the known universe.

From the reviews linked to above it sounds like it should be Warner using the tagline: The Look And Sound Of Perfect. :p

Can't wait to check this disc out next week. It's the first Batman film I've ever liked and I loved it!

Kate Beckinsale: The Real Look And Sound Of Perfect

nyg , I like that sig , a truly beautiful lady :D


I would agree with dvdtown , Video 9/10 and audio 10/10 . But then that does not leave much room for improvement does it ... ;) . Maybe not THE best HiDef that I have ever seen but it looks darn good and the sound is PHENOM (another shout out for CJ on that one) !

--- Jason

Here's a link to Robert Harris' review at the HOME THEATER FORUM:

Robert Harris on BATMAN BEGINS (http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/showthread.php?t=243415)

2. Batman Begins is the most finely crafted piece of home video software yet created in the known universe.Uh oh! Cjplay's head just swelled about 2 sizes. :)

Seriously, they should be proud.

--Darin

I can only imagine how much better this will sound at 20/24 bit. I may need to upgrade my audio equipment again...
It will pretty much sound the same when the 16 bit is a properly done version of the > 16 bit master and your equipment is high end.

Aarggg, today was my day off, while at the gym got the call that my employee that was going to work today has the flu, go back home to grab some stuff for work, on the way out DHL pulls up and gives me a package, open it, Batman Begins, now I have to wait till t-nite.

Aarggg, today was my day off, while at the gym got the call that my employee that was going to work today has the flu, go back home to grab some stuff for work, on the way out DHL pulls up and gives me a package, open it, Batman Begins, now I have to wait till t-nite.


Where did you order it from? As far as I can see, no etailer is shipping this thing until the 10th(which means I'm gonna have to cancel my order and head to Best Buy on Tuesday).

Wow! From Hi-Def Digest:

Final Thoughts

'Batman Begins' is a no-brainer. Even if you are only casually interested in the film, you should definitely check this one out to see the HD DVD format at the top of its game. Terrific transfer, awesome Dolby TrueHD soundtrack and tons of extras -- including some genuine HD bonus content -- make this one the A-list HD DVD release to beat. Now is a very good time to be an early adopter!"

http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/batmanbegins.html

Can't wait o get it!

Expecting this to be my reference disc for some time to come.

Damn it....I ordered this and Charlie at the same time from amazon....Charlie says its preparing to ship while Batman still says not shipped yet!

Wow! From Hi-Def Digest:

Final Thoughts

'Batman Begins' is a no-brainer. Even if you are only casually interested in the film, you should definitely check this one out to see the HD DVD format at the top of its game. Terrific transfer, awesome Dolby TrueHD soundtrack and tons of extras -- including some genuine HD bonus content -- make this one the A-list HD DVD release to beat. Now is a very good time to be an early adopter!"

http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/batmanbegins.html

Can't wait o get it!
Looks like this is THE new reference disk.

Oh Yeah! Target in Waldorf has 3 in stock! On my way to pick it up now.

Just call your local Target and give them the DCPI # (058270029). I'm guessing there's no violation to sell early because the standard DVD streeted a year ago.

I dont understand what would be wrong about revealing which titles were created with the enhanced VC-1 encoder.

Probably nothing, but NDAs are NDAs and you don't violate them if you ever want to work in the industry again. :eek:

Just picked up my Batman Begins at our new Target, which officially opens Sunday!

Expecting this to be my reference disc for some time to come.


Or at least another month until the big ape hits ;) .

----- Jason

Damn it....I ordered this and Charlie at the same time from amazon....Charlie says its preparing to ship while Batman still says not shipped yet!

Woohoo! BB is preparing for shipment from Amazon!

Picked mine up along with Polar Express at Target in San Jose for all the bay area people here it was at there Oakridge Store. Good Luck

Picked mine up at Target in Highlands Ranch, CO. The one on County Line Rd. They had their HDDVD's on display. Picked up Batman (the only copy) and Polar Express! Batman is definitely top teir, and will be my reference disc for a while.

I went to this exact Target today and did not see the HD-DVD's! I was in a rush though being on my lunch break so I obviously missed them. Where were they exactly?

My Target store told me that the HD-DVD's are all in the back room in boxes. They hope to have them out on display some time next week.

Sweet! Just picked up a copy at the Destin, FL, Target. Might watch some of it tonight.

Got my copy after the first Target I went to told me I had to wait till Oct. 8th. Watched about 5 minutes and its very impressive from the little bit I saw.

Got mine today too! Way cool. Image and sound are stellar as expected! :)

Was Batman done from D5 or SR? And that came from the 4K DI for Imax or was it a separate transfer to 1080p?

All of our releases have been D5.

Cjplay.

Uh oh! Cjplay's head just swelled about 2 sizes. :)

Seriously, they should be proud.

--Darin

I just feel humbled to have appeased the gods of film for which we are so thankful. Thank you again for your kind words, Mr. Harris. Our team appreciates every last word.

Cjplay.

Can't wait to check this disc out next week. It's the first Batman film I've ever liked and I loved it!

Same here. Very different from the other Batman movies....all in a good way! I think Christian Bale is one of the best actors working today.

I'm really looking forward to this one. Being shipped from Amazon along with Polar Express.

Looks like this is THE new reference disk.


Not on my 110 inch screen its not....I would rate this either tier 2 or the bottom of tier 1 for P/Q.
I fired it up to get some quick impressions of P/Q and watched it all the way through because its a fantastic movie imo.

Theres no way this HD DVD rates with Riddick or Seabisquit for P/Q....but its still a must have imo.

:mad: Can't :mad: get :mad: one :mad:still :(

:D :D :D

I went by a Target store tonight and low and behold - they had Batman and Polar Express (exactly two each.) Woo hoo! Good times, noodle salad.

I'm off to check out Batman...

My view of Batman Begins HD-DVD.

Beautiful PQ, almost flawless transfer. There is some chroma noise in the darker areas of some segments, but this could be present even in the original footage so you can't fault the transfer.

Unbelievably boring movie. I don't know what it is about the superhero sequels, but they always go from gems of movie history to completely inane storylines.

Look at the SD disc again and tell me if you'd attempt that at 10Mbits! Especially Revolutions. I can't confirm the title either (especially since Amir and I don't talk directly), but I know we've at least got one in the can that's a little above that 10Mbit BR and it may be what he's talking about and not released yet.

Cjplay.


I don't understand - is Cjplay inferring that certain titles (e.g. Matrix) couldn't fit on HD DVD because it would require a higher bit rate than possible?

There it was at Wal Mart in Winnipeg yesterday! Watched it last night. HOLY cowpokes Batman! 10/10 picture. 10/10 sound. Both blow everyone and everything away. Ran flawlessly on my A-1. Without question if this were demonstrated to people (at least those who like movies) they would run out and get HD DVD. It's that good.

WOOHOO! YES, I GOT ONE!:D I decided to try my local Target again today (being that it's my B-Day I thought, why not try again?) with the DCPI # in hand and the salesgirl went in the back and brought one out! Definitely a great birthday present, I will post later on reflections of the disc!

I don't understand - is Cjplay inferring that certain titles (e.g. Matrix) couldn't fit on HD DVD because it would require a higher bit rate than possible?
No, he is just saying not to expect to be able to encode every disc at 10 Mbit/sec. HD DVD can go well in execess of this rate so his comment is not related to something fitting or not fitting. Even at 15 mbit/sec, we can have 4 hours of HD video with lossless sound....

Basic review of Batman Begins HD DVD-.......wow, just f'ing wow.

By the way, that crappy version of BB that was shown on HBO does not even compare to this, it is a perfect example to what happens to a 2:35 film when it is zoomed to fit a 16x9 screen, a very soft looking picture.

Basic review of Batman Begins HD DVD-.......wow, just f'ing wow.

By the way, that crappy version of BB that was shown on HBO does not even compare to this, it is a perfect example to what happens to a 2:35 film when it is zoomed to fit a 16x9 screen, a very soft looking picture.

Glad to hear that, because the HBO-HD version was definitely soft! But as you say, it was bound to be soft when it was blown up like that.

Ok, I went ot the larger of 2 local targets with the stock number in hand, primarily to see if it was in stock and available for sale Tuesday. There on display with the SD Dvds were 17 HD-DVD titles (including BB and polar express). They also had a few BD titles, but not nearly as many. All HD-DVDs were 19.99, except for the combo disks. I guess they didn't want to wait till the 8th to put them out :D

Oh, they had at least 3 more copies on the shelf.

I just feel humbled to have appeased the gods of film for which we are so thankful. Thank you again for your kind words, Mr. Harris. Our team appreciates every last word.

Cjplay.

Cjplay -

I've been very vocal about how I feel this disc especially epitomizes what HD-DVD can do. Lengthy blockbuster, great IME, superb PQ with superb AQ on a lossless TrueHD track, etc..... and I've always been the "cold capitalist" by saying things like "thank the format/studios with your wallet" (which from a financial bottom-line standpoint is still true)...but I do feel the need to express how remiss I feel in not thanking and congratulating encoders like you in all work done in HD-DVD so far.

Many of us were waiting in great anticipation for this perfect combination of time duration, a blockbuster, amazing PQ, excellent lossless sound, and interactivity, and BB has delivered in spades...but I think while waiting for this wonderful combination, I (and some others) may not have expressed our gratitude enough for the great stuff that came before it.

Just because TrueHD and IME weren't available on the previous titles, it doesn't mean their respective PQ and DD+ AQ didn't kick ass as well. They did, and to not sound like the high def spoiled brat who doesn't appreciate what he's always had, and hasn't counted his blessings....let me say thanks for the incredible work that's gone into great works like Seabiscuit, Serenity, TLS, U-571, Aeon Flux, etc...and the "you" in the "thank you" might be you, but it's meant for all people involved, even if you personally were not. The audio and video in these titles and others are still absolutely incredible.

Like I've said before, with firmware 2.0 and Batman Begins, an exciting milestone has been reached where all marketing bullets can be checked off. Not being an apologist or some of those irrational and irritating fanboys who clamor that beacause not all the marketing promises have been delivered upon, that the format doesn't "exist" yet, I've believed HD-DVD has existed and been shining like a high def star since April, and I wanted to show "you" my appreciation.

Thanks for all of it, and keep it coming! :D

Like I've said before, with firmware 2.0 and Batman Begins, an exciting milestone has been reached where all marketing bullets can be checked off. Not being an apologist or some of those irrational and irritating fanboys who clamor that beacause not all the marketing promises have been delivered upon, that the format doesn't "exist" yet, I've believed HD-DVD has existed and been shining like a high def star since April, and I wanted to show "you" my appreciation.

Well said. I give a big second to your comments. Finally, home theatre as it was mean't to be. But Batman Begins is a seminal title for HD DVD. Bravo!

I had no dice at my Target but I did get a list of all the stores in the Washington DC area and there are about 10 that have then in stock. Some have 1 and some have 3.

...

Unbelievably boring movie. I don't know what it is about the superhero sequels, but they always go from gems of movie history to completely inane storylines.

To say that this is a minority opinion would be a gross understatement.

Not on my 110 inch screen its not....I would rate this either tier 2 or the bottom of tier 1 for P/Q.
I fired it up to get some quick impressions of P/Q and watched it all the way through because its a fantastic movie imo.

Theres no way this HD DVD rates with Riddick or Seabisquit for P/Q....but its still a must have imo.

That's a shame. I guess all of the hype surrounding the eventual release of this movie has clouded the judgement of some. That's quite disappointing as I was expecting a stellar disc.

That's a shame. I guess all of the hype surrounding the eventual release of this movie has clouded the judgement of some. That's quite disappointing as I was expecting a stellar disc.

Don't you want to see it yourself before you conclude the pq is "disappointing"? ;)

Just giving you a hard time. I think you mean that you are disappointed that someone with a 110" screen is disappointed, right?

There are many positive reviews of this disc, so I am looking forward to seeing it with my own eyeballs! :)

Don't you want to see it yourself before you conclude the pq is "disappointing"? ;)

Just giving you a hard time. I think you mean that you are disappointed that someone with a 110" screen is disappointed, right?

Yes that's what I mean. My screen is 55" but I plan on getting a 73" one next year so reviews of discs by those with huge screens are of interest to me.

There are many positive reviews of this disc, so I am looking forward to seeing it with my own eyeballs! :)

I'm well aware of that and I suspect that I'll be very happy with this disc now... but will I be next year when I have that larger screen???

Amir thanks for clearing that up.

I have a 120" screen and I am not disappointed with it (not clouded either) . As I said before it is not THE best HD that I have seen but it is damn nice . The PQ is a top 10 title all the way IMO , plus the AQ is about the best yet .

------- Jason

I have a 120" screen and I am not disappointed with it (not clouded either) . As I said before it is not THE best HD that I have seen but it is damn nice . The PQ is a top 10 title all the way IMO , plus the AQ is about the best yet .

Okay but "top 10" when there's only 100 or so titles available thus far doesn't really scream reference quality to me and that is what I was hoping for from this disc. Guess it's my fault for expecting too much. ;)

Okay but "top 10" when there's only 100 or so titles available thus far doesn't really scream reference quality to me and that is what I was hoping for from this disc. Guess it's my fault for expecting too much. ;)

How does that saying go, 'PQ is in the eye of the beholder...' Anyway, you should check out the disc for yourself first, I try not to be swayed by what anyone says until I experience something for myself. One man's garbage may be another man's treasure.

Hello. First off, I've got a couple questions.

1. According to Dolby's website, TrueHD can only be experienced if your reciever has either an HDMI input or if it has 5.1 analog inputs. They say TrueHD cannot be experienced through toslink. Does this mean that analog 5.1 is better than digital 5.1 via a toslink cable? Does analog 5.1 sound beat digital DTS sound in clarity?

2. Does Batman Begins automatically output TrueHD if you've got the correct connection to hear it or is it something you have to enable from the disc menu?

Thanks in advance. This forum rocks!

Yes, the analog outs deliver better sound than the coax or optical outs on the Toshiba HD-A1. The HD-A1 can decode the TrueHD and DD+ audio and output them to your receiver as 5.1 PCM through the analog connections. The only way to hear the HD audio formats is if you have an HDMI receiver or one with analog inputs.

You have to select the TrueHD soundtrack in the sound options. Otherwise it will default to the DD+ soundtrack.

Thanks for the quick reply, vpn! Good info. I just want to be sure that I'm listening to the TrueHD audio right off the bat (no pun intended).

Does this mean that analog 5.1 is better than digital 5.1 via a toslink cable?

The Toslink output will be a re-encode to 1509kbps dts -- which is very good but still lossy. The idea of using linear PCM via HDMI or the analog 5.1 outputs is that is the pure result of the Dolby TrueHD lossless decode. Yes, you have to select TrueHD via the disc audio selection menu or the remote control's Audio button. Then hit Display on the remote control to bring up a display of what is being used for video and audio codecs.

Bob

I'm not seeing the audio selection with my new Batman disc prior to the movie starting...What gives?

Mac

I'm not seeing the audio selection with my new Batman disc prior to the movie starting...What gives?

Mac


You can change it on the fly. Just hit menu and choose Dolby TrueHD

That's a shame. I guess all of the hype surrounding the eventual release of this movie has clouded the judgement of some. That's quite disappointing as I was expecting a stellar disc.

The PQ is good, but this is film based material, so if there is film grain in low light, this is the nature of film, if you take pictures in low light at high ISO settings, you get similar effects. If you pause the picture you will see some chroma noise on walls, this is probably going to always be the case and is not a problem of the encoding or the transfer. Even with whatever film grain filtering someone employs on the transfer, something will always stay around from the original film grain.

Just because it can't compare against pure CG generated sequences in terms of the clean clinical perfection of Serenity, does not make it a bad transfer.

To say that this is a minority opinion would be a gross understatement.
Apologies. I realized those who follow the comic book history are going to enjoy this one. I missed this movie in the theatre and was expecting something closer to the original Tim Burton rendering of Batman, so the slow pace of the creation angst did not set me in the correct frame of mind to enjoy the movie.

In hindsight, I was thinking of the original Burton version too much to allow me to live through this movie objectively. I was thinking several times of Jack Nicholson's Joker role as the killer of the Wayne parents and forgot that Batman Begins is a separate movie and if there is no continuity here, then so be it.

But I think for pure entertainment value, Nicholson's Joker compared to Neeson's character is clearly a no contest.

I can't help thinking that Neeson is reprising his QuiGon Jin role here, even the facial expressions are exact replicas for the two mentors in both movies when they teach their Padawan the meaning of the Force (or whatever it is this is supposed to be about).

Besides the actors themselves, quality of the writing for dialog was no comparison either. "Got to get me one of these" has got to be the most maligned and unoriginal lines writers put into movies these days to add a light hearted moment when Gordon first experiences the Batmobile, but this only shows the lack of originality on the part of the scriptwriters.

Hence, overall, while the movie itself is not completely inane - there are more meaningless escapism fare, (and truth be told, I thought Jim Carey's riddler was more inane than this one) it is when compared against Nicholson's Joker and DeVito's Penguin that it seems Batman Begins is still an inane retelling of the tale of the caped crusader.

PQ wise, I think it is still worth collecting, but I don't expect to watch it again.

In hindsight, I was thinking of the original Burton version too much to allow me to live through this movie objectively. I was thinking several times of Jack Nicholson's Joker role as the killer of the Wayne parents and forgot that Batman Begins is a separate movie and if there is no continuity here, then so be it.


That's something Burton insisted on when he made Batman. Batman Begins stuck to the comic continuity by having Joe Chill be the killer of Bruce Wayne's parents. Although I'm not so sure about him being caught and later killed.


But I think for pure entertainment value, Nicholson's Joker compared to Neeson's character is clearly a no contest.


I can't help thinking that Neeson is reprising his QuiGon Jin role here, even the facial expressions are exact replicas for the two mentors in both movies when they teach their Padawan the meaning of the Force (or whatever it is this is supposed to be about).


Nicholson's Joker might've been more entertaining, but I thought Neeson's Ra's Al-Ghul was a much more fascinating character.

And he was a lot more interesting in this movie than in The Phantom Menace. Hell, his portrayal of Ra's is what he should've been in the first prequel. That would've launched Anakin down the dark path in a much more believable manner.


Besides the actors themselves, quality of the writing for dialog was no comparison either. "Got to get me one of these" has got to be the most maligned and unoriginal lines writers put into movies these days to add a light hearted moment when Gordon first experiences the Batmobile, but this only shows the lack of originality on the part of the scriptwriters.


No argument here about that line. I didn't like it the first time I saw the movie, and I still think it feels out of place. One of the only missteps(the other being Katie Holmes who was good, but miscast) in an otherwise great film. I will say though that the fact that Gordon ends up driving the Batmobile later in the movie makes the line a little more tolerable.

Neo, I think you're comparing this film to Burton's films way too much. This is a much more psychological film, whereas Burton's films relied more on style than substance. Not that this is a bad thing, as Burton's style is what makes him such a great artist. But the Burton movies and Begins are so different that it isn't even worth comparing them, imo. Just enjoy them both for what they are.

Got 3 titles at Target in Eugene, Or. Woohoo.

I sent my wife after making sure they had BB and PE. When she got there they asked how she knew the numbers :) Thanks all, great sleuth work.

I've watched BB's twice in the last 24 hours. I give the video a 9.5 out of 10. You just can't compare this to Seabiscuit. Totally different look and feel.

Audio is 10++++. Hands down the best mix I've ever heard. It's a long wait until summer 08 for "The Dark Knight".

I just finished watching Batman Begins, and I think the PQ was fantastic. One has to realize that this is a very dark film, in terms of lighting (and content as well :) ) With that in mind one is not going to see as much 3-D 'pop' in every single scene, but you can clearly see in brighter scenes that there is a great amount of detail and clarity. Because BB tends to be a dark film, it begs for a medium like HD-DVD to adequetely reproduce black levels and shadow detail, and IMO it delivered in spades. While I was not able to listen to the Dolby TrueHD soundtrack (I never got the analog outs to reproduce sub frequencies adequetely, plus my receiver needs to be eventually replaced) the DD+ track sounded great. 10 out of 10.

You can change it on the fly. Just hit menu and choose Dolby TrueHD

Nope...it doesn't work...hitting menue only brings up the interactive box...and when I go into settings and audio..it just allows putting a x in or out of the box...nothing else..Perhaps a defective disc? I did change it by hitting audio/display...but not thru the movie settings...My disc doesn't stop prior to starting the movie and allow you to set it up...

Mac

Here's my take on the V/A:

Video - Batman Begins arrives courtesy of Warner Brothers in a 1080p 2:40:1 VC-1 encoded video, <Batman Begins has a lot of it’s shoulders. This title, as it has been demoed, is suppose to be the must title for HD-DVD boasting interactive features and amazing video and audio. Luckily for us all, this film has never, ever looked this good.

The first obvious example here is the usage of colors. The film’s most dominant color, naturally, is black. Mr. Wayne’s suit looks flawless with such intense detail (take a look at the scene where he is painting his suit. Simply amazing). The film’s other colors, like the earlier yellows and blues, the fire sequence’s reds and oranges, look equally as good breathing new life into this transfer. Speaking of the film’s transfer, the film’s very recent life really shows here. The sharpness of the print is truly great with many sequences of extreme detail (One of my favorite scenes in the film has always been where Scarecrow, well, scares his victims showing them their true fears. Do as I did here. Pause the film and walk up to your screen and look at the intense detail in the look of the picture. Trust me, you don’t be disappointed.

With such a dark looking film, I wondered if the used VC1 encoding would allow the film to look this good. Despite a few sequences of minor grain, everything looks fine. No real evidence of pixilation, distortion in the print. I simply must congratulate Warner Brothers here. Not only have they brought this film up to the level we expect out of HD-DVD, but have delivered a film that regardless of what format you spend your money on, must be seen to be believed. Truly great stuff here and certainly one of the best HD discs out there.

Audio - Wow. I don’t even know where on earth I should begin here. Well, I suppose I should tell you what is included here. Presented using the standard Dolby Digital Plus 5.1 in English, Francais or Espanol, <i>Batman Begins</i> also includes one of the best, if not the best, uses of the Dolby TrueHD audio track I’ve ever heard. Due to my high impressions of this, I’m going to speak about three particular scenes (chapter 7, chapter 17, and chapter 28).

Chapter 7 is the film’s real more popular demo sequence (at least the demo scene Toshiba and Warner Brothers have been using). The sequence features Henri and Wayne battling on the ice. I was immediately brought to ears with this scene as these two men fought. As their swords clashed and clanged, I decided to view the sequence first in Dolby Digital Plus 5.1 and then with the Dolby TrueHD track. The provided Plus 5.1 was a lot quieter and more subdued resulting in one having to turn up the volume a bit to hear everything. The same sequence with TrueHD was a totally different experience. Everything, from the film’s surrounds to the bass, sounded completely different and much louder (not louder in a poor way but louder in a ‘WOW’ way).

The next scene at hand is where Lucius Fox is showing Bruce the new and improved ‘Tumbler’. While the scene is a lot shorter than say the first and the last scenes, I was still quite impressed here. As this machine revved and blasted away, my ears, it felt, went with the vehicle. Even when Lucius and Bruce are speaking the vehicle’s loud engine, and the accompanying TrueHD track, really showcase the power of the film’s audio.

Now this is my new demo sequence. From the first uttering of ‘I brought mine’, my brother immediately ran downstairs to view this sequence. Just to show him the power of TrueHD, I first played a bit of the scene with the Plus 5.1 track, which resulted in him commenting that this doesn’t sound all that good. I simply smiled and went back turning on the TrueHD track. There is just so much to comment on here, especially the well placed use of the sequence’s surrounds. Little subtle things like the officer’s speaking to each other, are not compromised here and are well balanced with the rather robust and well-defined audio. As The ‘Tumbler’ crashes and races throughout Gotham City, your complete audio system really keeps up with no evidence of muddled audio or lackluster performance. I particularly enjoyed the first of two sequences where ‘The Tumbler’ jumped over the rooftops. As the rockets flew, I wondered if the rocking (sorry) sound my sub was creating was outside (as did my family). Whoops, guess it was a bit too loud.

Warner has delivered on all fronts here with an incredibly impressive audio track here. Out of the two options here, I don’t really need to tell you what I enjoyed the most. What a breathtaking experience Warner.

Putting the "X" in one of the boxes means you've selected that particular track.

But I think for pure entertainment value, Nicholson's Joker compared to Neeson's character is clearly a no contest.



:) Yeah it will be interesting to see Heath Ledger as the Joker.

I just picked BB up today and thought that I would join the choir of posters already praising the excellent pq! Demo material al the way.

Try the language setting

Putting the "X" in one of the boxes means you've selected that particular track.

Yup...it doesn't change anything


Try the language setting

Changing launguges works..but..still doesn't let me get into the set up normally allowed prior to the movie starting...The only way I can get to see if the audio settings is to hit the audio button and then display...Is this normal?

Mac

Yup...it doesn't change anything




Changing launguges works..but..still doesn't let me get into the set up normally allowed prior to the movie starting...The only way I can get to see if the audio settings is to hit the audio button and then display...Is this normal?

Mac

Warner don't have 'Main Menu' the menu is just the Translucent 'Custom' Bar

Just click AUDIO on the remote Once while playing the movie and confirm with DISPLAY button that you are on the TrueHD track, you have to have Firmware 2.0 too for that..

Neo, I think you're comparing this film to Burton's films way too much. This is a much more psychological film, whereas Burton's films relied more on style than substance. Not that this is a bad thing, as Burton's style is what makes him such a great artist. But the Burton movies and Begins are so different that it isn't even worth comparing them, imo. Just enjoy them both for what they are.

Exactly.

I can understand how someone who was in love with Burton's version would be disappointed in this though....if you insist on comparing them.

Warner don't have 'Main Menu' the menu is just the Translucent 'Custom' Bar

Just click AUDIO on the remote Once while playing the movie and confirm with DISPLAY button that you are on the TrueHD track, you have to have Firmware 2.0 too for that..

Thanks...

Mac

Finally got my copy from Target today along with Polar Express. Kudos to Warner for an outstanding presentation!! This disc was worth the wait!! I noticed so many more details and things going on in the senes that just weren't that noticeable before.
As one review stated earlier I read, the movie is dark but HD-DVD adds pop to even the smallest hint of colors in the scenes and really brings it to life. Very impressive. Every scene was razor sharp and clear. THIS IS the way to watch a movie at home!!
Hopefully Warner gives Superman Returns the same dedicated attention as their beloved Batman. :)

Exactly.

I can understand how someone who was in love with Burton's version would be disappointed in this though....if you insist on comparing them.

Honestly, if someone forced me to compare them, Begins would win in a landslide. Begins feels so much like the best of the Batman comics (Batman: Year One and The Long Halloween especially), and feels so much more REAL. As cool as Burton's Batman is, it's very gothic and over the top. Batman in Begins is dramatic, but Gotham looks like a real city with real people. And that gives the film much more emotional resonance, because it doesn't feel like it's happening in some kind of twisted funhouse.

Easiest to just press the "Audio" button on the remote to cycle through the various soundtracks.

You will need firmware 2.0 to get the 5.1 True HD

Honestly, if someone forced me to compare them, Begins would win in a landslide. Begins feels so much like the best of the Batman comics (Batman: Year One and The Long Halloween especially), and feels so much more REAL. As cool as Burton's Batman is, it's very gothic and over the top. Batman in Begins is dramatic, but Gotham looks like a real city with real people. And that gives the film much more emotional resonance, because it doesn't feel like it's happening in some kind of twisted funhouse.

Again, I completely agree with you.

No, he is just saying not to expect to be able to encode every disc at 10 Mbit/sec. HD DVD can go well in execess of this rate so his comment is not related to something fitting or not fitting. Even at 15 mbit/sec, we can have 4 hours of HD video with lossless sound....

Exactly. Thanks, Amir.

Cjplay.

Just because TrueHD and IME weren't available on the previous titles, it doesn't mean their respective PQ and DD+ AQ didn't kick ass as well. They did, and to not sound like the high def spoiled brat who doesn't appreciate what he's always had, and hasn't counted his blessings....let me say thanks for the incredible work that's gone into great works like Seabiscuit, Serenity, TLS, U-571, Aeon Flux, etc...and the "you" in the "thank you" might be you, but it's meant for all people involved, even if you personally were not. The audio and video in these titles and others are still absolutely incredible.

Like I've said before, with firmware 2.0 and Batman Begins, an exciting milestone has been reached where all marketing bullets can be checked off. Not being an apologist or some of those irrational and irritating fanboys who clamor that beacause not all the marketing promises have been delivered upon, that the format doesn't "exist" yet, I've believed HD-DVD has existed and been shining like a high def star since April, and I wanted to show "you" my appreciation.

Thanks for all of it, and keep it coming! :D

ILJG,

I'm sure every member of the HD DVD compression community thanks you for your comments. The team here at Warner (both Mastering and Compression) work very hard on these discs, but welcome all kinds of comments from HT lovers like yourself. I've got to give a "good job" to Deluxe who's been at this as much as we have and been putting out excellent material (Some of which you mention above) as well.

I hope this trend continues, but fear the old routine of "must keep the schedule" begins to affect HD disc formats' material as well. This normally negatively affects PQ.

Enjoy Batman Begins and the other titles out there and keep hope alive that consumers will choose the "right" format, whichever it may be.

Cjplay.

Has anyone else noticed that the number on the side of BB is one of the lowest of all the Warner titles and that the sticker on the top is one of the old ones that leaves residue? Not that it has any impact on anything, but I think this title has been done, packaged, and ready to ship at the same time as POTO. Why has Warner tortured us like that? :D

Has anyone else noticed that the number on the side of BB is one of the lowest of all the Warner titles and that the sticker on the top is one of the old ones that leaves residue? Not that it has any impact on anything, but I think this title has been done, packaged, and ready to ship at the same time as POTO. Why has Warner tortured us like that? :D

[Me just making a wild guess] They probably wanted to be sure the players could do the IME and TrueHD before releasing it...thus having to wait for firmware 2.0. [/Me just making a wild guess]

Agreed, it was torture waiting for it, but bliss having it now!! :D

Not to mention it's much closer to the Holiday season.

Saw it last night. The PQ is not razor sharp. Still enjoyed it very much. The F&F Tokyo Drift is still a demo/reference PQ and AQ disk for me. I will compare it to SD upconverted BB later.

Saw it last night. The PQ is not razor sharp. Still enjoyed it very much. The F&F Tokyo Drift is still a demo/reference PQ and AQ disk for me. I will compare it to SD upconverted BB later.

The PQ in the theater wasn't razer sharp either. One "drawback" to HD-DVD and other high definition formats is that they will allow you to see how good or bad the original master is. With a good HD-DVD disc you can actually tell when the camera is in or out of focus.

When the camera is out of focus it's going to appear soft no matter how much you try to enhance it in post processing.

Speaking of F&FTD, saw it on Friday night - thought it was not very detailed - nor as colorful as I hoped.... overall a disapointment in PQ - especially for $35.00

I just watched it and boy was the video amazing. There was not one flaw in the picture like my DVD has.

Speaking of F&FTD, saw it on Friday night - thought it was not very detailed - nor as colorful as I hoped.... overall a disapointment in PQ - especially for $35.00
No real sequence will look as clean or detailed as CG generated images. Film is film, and depending on focal length, in some scene, some areas will be out of focus... In fact, it could be a stylistic choice by the director.

Nah, out of focus is out of focus. Very often its left is the scene because redo's are downright expensive. Sometimes the "director's intention" is just he/she having to make that decision to pick the best of the mistakes. In chase scenes multiple cameras of varying PQ levels are used. Quick jump cut edits just utilize the angle of choice be they show some blurryness or not.

I just like F&FTD better for its sharper image , use of color, and awesome effects and music soundtracks for demo purposes.

Argh, I scored BB tonight, but when I start from the beginning, it totally freezes up right around the 3 minute mark. Haven't had anything like this since Van Helsing before the first firmware upgrade!

I need to email or call Amazon and see if I can get them to ship my order for BB and Willy Wonka. I forgot Slither was coming out 2 weeks later when I did all 3 of those for my order. Stupid me said to ship in as few as packages as possible. So now I am worried that they will just hold BB and Willy Wonka until Slither comes out. It would be nice to have BB as soon as possible.

Funny story... I called Target this morning, gave the guy on the phone the DCPI number, and told hime to hold me a copy since they only had three. When I got there I told the clerk that I was the one that called to have the movie held. He says, "Oh...yeah...the ID version of the movie, right?" I replied, "It's HD, not ID." He had absolutely no idea what kind of movie it was, let alone the least bit about the HD-DVD format. Not that it bothered me... I just have to sometimes sit back and realize that those of us on here are up to speed on the latest and greatest in home theater while many people still have not idea what HD is.

I think this will be the first million dollar HD seller.

I finally got around to watching this tonight. Dang that movie was gorgeous! The blacks were incredible I thought. I was concerned on this movie with how dark it was, but everything looked good. This will now be my main Demo disk I think. I still like the look of Chronnicles of Riddick, but I think this tops it. Plus having the Sound on the Sword fight on the Ice is a very good experience with TrueHD.

I'm hoping I can watch Slither on Halloween, but I think my wife is going to boycott that idea :( If she will not do that, I guess I'll have to do Army of Darkness instead. :D

The PQ in the theater wasn't razer sharp either. One "drawback" to HD-DVD and other high definition formats is that they will allow you to see how good or bad the original master is. With a good HD-DVD disc you can actually tell when the camera is in or out of focus.

When the camera is out of focus it's going to appear soft no matter how much you try to enhance it in post processing.

I agree with most commenters that in just about every respect, BB's PQ looks very good. However, as I've said before, throughout, it looks a little soft. That may well be simply the way the movie looks. But I don't understand how some observers apparently do not see this aspect of the PQ.

picked up bb about a week ago and i was very impressed with the true hd soundtrack and thought the picture looked good. I just got my rca dv500 2 weeks ago and only have blazing saddles and apollo 13 to compare with. i put in my sdvd version of bb back to back with the hd version and was a little suprised, the difference was not what i expected. there is a difference but it is slight,could this be due to the darkness of the film. i have read in other posts that these players are great at upconverting but are they that good?

picked up bb about a week ago and i was very impressed with the true hd soundtrack and thought the picture looked good. I just got my rca dv500 2 weeks ago and only have blazing saddles and apollo 13 to compare with. i put in my sdvd version of bb back to back with the hd version and was a little suprised, the difference was not what i expected. there is a difference but it is slight,could this be due to the darkness of the film. i have read in other posts that these players are great at upconverting but are they that good?

What monitor/TV are you using to view it?

Cjplay.

pannasonic 500u projector via dvi

Honestly just need to give another Kudos to the creators of the movie and the transfer of this movie. I just watched the movie again (after reading Batman: Year One) and honestly I don't know how anybody could have done a better movie of translating that book to a movie. My friends think i'm crazy with how much I've spent on my home theater. But movies like this are the reasons that I am obsessive about building out my media space ($15K and counting). Movies like this are the reasons that one day I'm gonna build a dedicated home theater (when i got a couple of hundred grand to spend). Such a good movie.

This is a great film. Great picture an story! A must have for everyone!

This is a great film. Great picture and story! A must have for everyone!

This is a great film. Great picture and story! A must have for everyone!

You can say that again! ;)

I agree. Batman Begins kicks ass. I finally got around to checking out Superman Returns, and while a good movie in it's own right, it's nowhere near as good as BB.

And don't get me started on that overhyped Spider-Man franchise.

And don't get me started on that overhyped Spider-Man franchise.

Spiderman 2 is in my top ten favorite movies, and completely destroys bb. :p :D

I love Spiderman 2 as well, MUCH prefer it over the first one, one of the very few titles I'll be envious of not having on hd, but in no way does it destroy BB - thats comical at best...I've found much more replay value in BB, sorry, just my .02 =)

I agree with most commenters that in just about every respect, BB's PQ looks very good. However, as I've said before, throughout, it looks a little soft. That may well be simply the way the movie looks. But I don't understand how some observers apparently do not see this aspect of the PQ.

Well because the movie is soft but detailed. Just as in was when i watched it in theaters (-hairs of course)

For me, this is the filmlook i love. Other HD tiles ive watched felt good, but BB was the one that gave me the feel of 35mm (-hairs of course)

Well because the movie is soft but detailed. Just as in was when i watched it in theaters (-hairs of course)

For me, this is the filmlook i love. Other HD tiles ive watched felt good, but BB was the one that gave me the feel of 35mm (-hairs of course)

Have you seen The Prestige on BD? Same director, same DP, very similar color scheme. However, where every shot in BB looks soft, that is not true with The Prestige, which is able to deliver sharp images. I personally think The Prestige looks much better than BB.

Well havnt seen the prestige, but that they look different could be that they didnt use the soft filtering for the prestige where the soft filtering they used on BB was to enforce the comic book feel.

As I said BB on HD DVD looked very like the image the 35mm (theater print) So its not the VC1 codec that has done it look soft.

As for movies using different dp and directors etc. just look at different Speilberg films. They use different looks for different types of movies.

Another thing that could have happend on the prestige is that they used edgeenhancemnt along with sharpening filters before encoding. (Havnt seen the movie but its common on DVD) That would make the movie look sharper and better in some people eyes but it doesnt mean its transparent to the master.