Audio warbling in Troy

[geko29]

Just picked up my HD-A1 from BB yesterday (last one!) and a number of movies today. Sat down to watch Troy, and I'm having audio problems right from the first scene. The sound effects and music sound fantastic, but most of the dialog has a bit of warbling in it, as if the actors had strep throat. I tried switching the player to output PCM instead of DTS, and it sounds fine, but of course, is stereo. Tried to select the TrueHD soundtrack, and it says that my hardware does not support it.

I didn't notice this problem in the 5 minutes or so of Terminator 3 I watched yesterday as a quick demo, but there wasn't too much dialog (crane chase sequence).

This is an HD-A1 (firmware is 1.4/1.09/2.0R) connected to an old Sony STR-DE925 via coaxial cable. I unfortunately don't have an analog 5.1 to test (though the stone cold dead STR-DA555ES in the closet does). A new receiver is next on my list, but not till next year.

Anybody have any ideas?

[geko29]

Updated the firmware to 2.0/1.0A/2.0S, Troy still has the same problem. TrueHD is now selectable, but it still has the same problem. Re-tested Terminator 3 in a half-dozen scenes with various actors and dialog, didn't notice any problems.

[Capek]

Try this; go to the setup menue, and select the last selection, I think it's called Maintenance, and select the reinitialize. This will switch to default all the audio settings, but for me it also fixed a tinniness I was experience with dialogue.

[Robert D]

The player will down convert the TrueHD to dts output via coax. Maybe your receiver has problems with high bit-rate dts.

[JOHNnDENVER]

Make sure dialog enhancement is off. Set the player to PCM, use the 6 analog multi-channel outputs instead if possible so you can actually hear TrueHD when it is available.

[geko29]

First off, thanks everybody for your suggestions.

Try this; go to the setup menue, and select the last selection, I think it's called Maintenance, and select the reinitialize. This will switch to default all the audio settings, but for me it also fixed a tinniness I was experience with dialogue.

Tried that, no change unfortunately.

Make sure dialog enhancement is off. Set the player to PCM, use the 6 analog multi-channel outputs instead if possible so you can actually hear TrueHD when it is available.

Dialog Enhancement is off. As I noted in my initial post, I DID try PCM, and the sound was fine, but in stereo. As I also noted in my initial post, I have no 5.1 analog inputs on my receiver to test. I suppose I could try just hooking up just the center to one of the L/R inputs, but that's about all I can do.

The player will down convert the TrueHD to dts output via coax. Maybe your receiver has problems with high bit-rate dts.

I'm beginning to fear this is the case. Couple of followups, if you don't mind. I imagine the optical will be the same as the coax, as it's the same signal and processors, just a different media? Should I expect to see this on a lot of movies (I have 3 more I haven't opened and a few more on order), or could it be limited to just one/a few? If I can't watch Troy until I can afford a new (likely Denon or Onkyo) receiver in April, that's not the end of the world, but if I can't watch better than half of my collection as it grows, that would definitely be a problem. Any guesses?

[JOHNnDENVER]

Could be a disc problem too ya know....

[chucky08016]

Could be a disc problem too ya know....

Definitely not a disc problem. I have the same problem with Syriana. I'm using a Sony STR-DA30ES receiver with optical and it too does not have 5.1 analog in.

What I found interesting is that I had a newer Pioneer receiver (about 4 years old now) connected via 5.1 analog and optical and had no problems with Syriana. I switched out the Pioneer receiver for the older Sony ES receiver because the Sony truly outclasses the Pioneer in sound quality and can quite brutal (in a very good way) on loud passages even though it's 80w per ch. I can live with 1 movie sounding bad for now. It won't be that long before someone releases a receiver or preamp that decodes all of the next gen sound formats.

I'm going to wait til someone releases a receiver or preamp that decodes all of the next gen sound formats before replacing the current Sony receiver. That should do the trick.

[geko29]

I was relieved to watch Swordfish this morning and find the audio during the film absolutely perfect. The alternate endings had the warbling issue, but the video on those didn't look too great anyway, so maybe they just didn't spend too much time on them.

Thanks chucky08016 for chiming in, seems likely that our receivers have the same or similar DTS processors, so we're probably both experiencing the same exact bandwidth-related artifacts. I'll now avoid Syriana until I replace my receiver next year, maybe we can keep one another aprised of any other titles that exhibit these issues. So far it's just Troy for me, but I've only tried 3 so far. I'll probably be watching Goodfellas and Batman Begins in the next week, so I'll report back.

Thanks again everybody.

[khwiggins2]

I have a Sony DA55ES and have the exact same problem. I've had the HD-A1 since May and have problems with almost all of my HD-DVD movies. Definitely an issue with the Sony Receiver.

Edit - Sorry, meant DA50ES

[chucky08016]

I was relieved to watch Swordfish this morning and find the audio during the film absolutely perfect. The alternate endings had the warbling issue, but the video on those didn't look too great anyway, so maybe they just didn't spend too much time on them.

Thanks chucky08016 for chiming in, seems likely that our receivers have the same or similar DTS processors, so we're probably both experiencing the same exact bandwidth-related artifacts. I'll now avoid Syriana until I replace my receiver next year, maybe we can keep one another aprised of any other titles that exhibit these issues. So far it's just Troy for me, but I've only tried 3 so far. I'll probably be watching Goodfellas and Batman Begins in the next week, so I'll report back.

Thanks again everybody.

No problem... I'll keep you posted. So far I have 7 HD DVD's and only Syriana has the issue. Being that my birthday is this weekend, everyone is going to give me HD DVD's... about 25 so far will be here by this Sunday (10-15-2006). I'll let you know how it goes with them also.

[Robert D]

If anyone is interested this low cost HDMI receiver works well with the Toshiba/RCA HD DVD players. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=423149&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

[geko29]

Here's what I've found so far. The warbling seems to affect about 2% of the dialog, from adult male actors only. It's been present on "rough cut" special features like alternate endings, even when the main movie was perfect. I'll update as I get and watch more discs, but here's the results with 4 watched and another two sampled (skipped around checking various scenes of dialog):

Warbling:

Troy
Training Day
Goodfellas (mild)
Sahara (mild)
Serenity (one scene only)


Perfect:

Swordfish
Unleashed
Batman Begins (sampled)
Terminator 3 (sampled)

Hope this helps.

[mishmosh]

A few of us reported center channel dialog "distortion/garbling" with our A1's using optical and coax digital connection. Analog 5.1 is fine. May be related to the older receivers we have but no resolution was mentioned. I have since scrapped the optical/digital coax connection in favor of 5.1 analog... a temporizing measure until I am ready to purchase an HDMI receiver/preamp.

[chucky08016]

Ok geko29, here's the update...

All of the new discs are having the same issue with the over 6 years old Sony STR-DA30ES receiver... even the ones that don't have a "big" soundtrack. I now have 20 HD DVD's and all are now sounding the same. I've given up on the older receiver and now I'm in the process of replacing the receiver with a cheap $200 Pioneer (model VSX-516-K) 7.1 with analog in receiver. That will take care of the problem on a temp basis until someone releases a receiver or preamp that decodes all of the next gen formats. Hopefully someone does soon because I really want to complete my theater!!!

On a side note, when I had the 4 yr old Pioneer receiver with the 5.1 analog in connected, the audio on the receiver was perfect with analog in, coax, and optical but it just doesn't sound as good as the Sony ES receiver. Hopefully, the newer Pioneer will.

[khwiggins2]

As luck would have it, my Sony receiver started to die this weekend. Was watching a movie with my wife and the sound started to cut out. I guess that I started getting a little red in the face because she suggested that we get a new receiver. :) I really do love her!

Anyway, we bought a Denon AVR-2807. Man, after setting up the speakers it sounds awesome. And...No more dialog distortion!!!!

One odd thing with the Denon however. I hooked up the speakers the same as I disconnected them from the Sony and after using the Auto speaker setup, it told me that my Mains and center channels were having polarity issues. I had used the wire with writing on it for negative on all of them, so I don't know why this was incorrect, but after swapping the leads, I was in buisiness. I'm using Paradigm Monitors for the front, Atoms in the back and an Energy Center speaker.

You know, there was a time when I only bought Sony, since then, I've replaced every piece of sony equipment I've ever had. Maybe it goes in cycles. There was a time when I used to avoid Toshiba equipment too. Now I have their HD-DVD player and a 72HM195 rear projection display.

[Weebedna]

I had the same problem with my A2. Had to return it for an XA1(nice!) so I could use the 5.1 analog outputs. Here is the thread I posted:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=788963

[gordong11]

I have Troy but use an XA2, no sound issues at all. If I had to guess though it's the DVD itself or the reciever. I got a bad Unforgiven HD DVD, thought it was the player at first, but exchanged it and it solved the problem. The problem is there are so many different variables, so many different things that can cause an error, it's hard to diagnose inconsistient errors.

[chucky08016]

I have Troy but use an XA2, no sound issues at all. If I had to guess though it's the DVD itself or the reciever. I got a bad Unforgiven HD DVD, thought it was the player at first, but exchanged it and it solved the problem. The problem is there are so many different variables, so many different things that can cause an error, it's hard to diagnose inconsistient errors.

Thanks for the input but we have already figured out the issue. Older receivers that have old dts decoders are to blame. The A1, XA1, A2, XA2 all encode the DD+ and TrueHD streams as 1.5mb dts when using optical or coax. The older dts decoders in the older receivers that some of us were using can not handle the 1.5mb bitrate. Your Yamaha YSP-800 Digital Sound Projector would not suffer from the same issue because it's MUCH newer.

The discs are not to blame.