For a shortcut to the decision and all followup posts, click HERE (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9286978&&#post9286978)!

Updates:
12/27/2006 - Carada CCW Wins! Carada 16:9 Criterion 118" CCW (http://www.carada.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=PROJECTION-SCREEN-H118C) Stay tuned for install photos & notes!
12/13/2006 - Grey Diamond Vein eliminated.
12/11/2006 - Grey Diamond Vein Magic Fabric sample arrives from projectionwholesale.com
12/07/2006 - Carada CCW brought back into testing!
11/27/2006 - Cinema Vision brought back in!
11/27/2006 - Dark greys eliminated *See suggestions below
11/15/2006 - Super high gain (1.5+) samples eliminated!
11/10/2006 - Vutec samples arrive!
11/06/2006 - Severtson samples arrive!
10/30/2006 - Official Testing Starts! Several brand's samples arrive, including DaLite, Carada, Stewart, Draper, Elite, and some DIY materials provided by WilsonArt Laminates!


Screen Sample Requests Never Answered or Received:
(Multiple attempts made to manufacturers & retailers)
DragonFly (snapav.com)
EluneVision (eastporters.com)


Screen Sample Finalists:
(Sorted lightest to darkest)
Carada CCW (carada.com (http://www.carada.com)) WINNER!
DaLite HCMW (dalite.com (http://www.dalite.com/dalitehometheater/index.php))
DaLite CV (dalite.com (http://www.dalite.com/dalitehometheater/index.php))


Screen Sample Eliminations:
(I want to make it clear that all reviewed screens are very good products, and will work in numerous types of setups and environments, they all have their purpose. Their eliminations from my testing are solely based on my opinions, setup, and environment)
-All Whites reviewed - *See suggestions below
-All Bright Whites reviewed - *See suggestions below
-All Bright Silvers reviewed - Too much gain, brightness fall off (narrow viewing angle), dirty whites
-DaLite HCDM - Too dark, dirty whites
-Optoma GrayWolf II - Too much gain, brightness fall off (narrow viewing angle)
-Stewart FireHawk - Narrow viewing angle, and requires ceiling mounted PJ for consistent brightness, dirty whites
-Draper HCG - Too dark, dirty whites
-Severtson HCG & Ultra - Too dark, dirty whites
-DaLite Pearlescent - Tad bit too dark, dirty whites, brightness fall off (narrow viewing angle)
-WilsonArt Grey (DIY) - Too dark, dirty whites
-WilsonArt Fashion Grey (DIY) - Too dark, dirty whites
-Elite HCG - Dark Grey *See suggestions below
-Draper HiDef Grey - Dark Grey *See suggestions below
-Carada HCG - Dark Grey *See suggestions below
-Stewart GreyHawk - Dark Grey *See suggestions below
-Grey Diamond Vein Magic Fabric - Too dark, dirty whites
-DaLite HCCV - Too dark, dirty whites, brightness fall off (narrow viewing angle)
-DaLite HCMW - Very nice colors & contrast, but pull down material only, not available in fixed frame
-DaLite CV - Tad bit too dark, dirty whites, tad too much brightness fall off

Most super high gain (1.5+) screens have been eliminated, due to their narrow viewing angles. I have a wide seating area. For a detailed review and to read into this in depth, check out this awesome review: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=228371 A big big thank you to Tryg for all the hard work! Much appreciated!


*Suggestions:
For Grey Screens: These are typically used with projectors having low contrast (5000:1 or less) and/or in rooms with ambient light. For this reason the best match would be 2000+ advertised lumens and/or 96" or smaller screen size and/or a short throw (8-10ft). Otherwise you're going to experience a dimmed image and/or see dirty looking whites.

For White Screens: 6,000+ advertised contrast ratio with very good grey scaling and/or complete light control. Otherwise you're going to see greys instead of blacks.

For Bright White Screens: These are typically used with low lumen projectors and/or in rooms with ambient light. The best match would be 6,000+ advertised contrast ratio with very good grey scaling and more importantly you'll want your seating narrower than the projected image. Otherwise you're going to see brightness falloff when viewing from the sides (outside the viewing cone).

*Please remember, these are only my personal opinions, based soley on the below detailed environment, and many many many hours of testing 25+ screen samples :)


Comparison Photos:
(Shortcuts to all posts containing relevent pics gathered from throughout this thread)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8841160&&#post8841160
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8847844&&#post8847844
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8848268&&#post8848268
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8856289&&#post8856289
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9014046&&#post9014046
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9014060&&#post9014060
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9024750&&#post9024750


Original Post:
The Environment: The room is not light controlled, and does have substantial ambient light from one rear lamp, an adjoined room, and two large windows. All walls are glossy off-white, the ceiling is rough textured white.

The Projector & Details: I have a Panasonic PT-AE900U (advertised 1100 lumens, 5500:1 contrast ratio). It's shelf mounted 14ft back, about 1ft above eye level, using no horizontal lens shift, it's centered. Seating distance is at about 13ft from the screen, and the projected image size is exactly 100" diag. The seating is centered with the image area, but is about 3ft wider than the image to either side. The projector is in low lamp, testing is done in both Normal and Cinema1 modes. Testing to date (12/14/06) has spanned through 0 to 500 hours on the bulb.

The Disclaimer: This testing was to find the absolute best screen material based on my personal opinions and in this environment only! I'm looking for the darkest black levels, the brightest whites, and all with the most natural colors! (Aren't we all?!) ;) Also, because of my wide seating arrangement brightness uniformity is very important.


So, if you're in the same type of environment and looking for a screen, or just interested in reading my opinions...

By all means read on...
I started all this testing with about 40+ screen samples, however some were not even considered due to their nature, for example: audio transparent screens and/or extremely high gain screens for churches/bars, etc.

So it was roughly 25+ samples to begin the quest. Currently it's now narrowed down to about 8 (although this number is constantly changing as more screen samples arive, and others get eliminated. See above updates or follow this thread closely for all details and the actual remaining samples).

I used double sided tape on the back of all the samples to stick them all over the wall, within the image area obviously ;) I put them up in various locations, cycling them all around every couple of days, eliminating as I went as some screen materials are completely out of the question for this set up.

This testing procedure's accuracy is based on real watching habbits. Daytime television, Nighttime movies, Sunday Football, etc. You can imagine all the stand-up's and sit-downs right? How many times do you think I switch couches, lay down, stand up, move around, on a daily basis? haha! It's all in fun though :D

I'm keeping a tally sheet, every time myself or another viewer has to say "wow, that one really looks the best", then it gets a tic on the score card! The highest tally count at the end wins! (All viewers are completely made aware that their eyes may play tricks on them, and not to easily focus on the brightest image. But rather, pay attention to the contrast between black & white, also the overall image quality/color purity).

Trust me, I'm very meticulous, and I make sure my viewers are as well :D


Here are some results: (Much more to come)
I just elminated my samples of Gray Wolf II (they sent two sheets). I have to be completely honest here, I was disappointed. Perhabs because I let myself get so excited about the possibility of a perfect screen! Go figure! ;) Anyhow, I had already eliminated angular reflective materials such as the FireHawk, because of gain/reflection issues. I was stoked about the Gray Wolf being retro-reflective.

More on the Gray Wolf II...
From one end of the couch to the other there are DRASTIC image brightness changes. The gain is VERY strong in the center (bright scenes completely overpower the whole image), but move to either end of the couch and it's a blacked out image. My couch is only a few inches wider than the image size!

The sweet spot is about 1-2 feet off to either side of the lens. That really is the only watchable position (depending on where I stuck the samples of coarse).

Anyhow, I was really hoping to go with this screen, but testing shows that it just wont work in my set up, there is no uniformity from side to side, nor from top to bottom. I had to eliminate the DaLite Silver Matte, High Power, and the FireHawk for these same reasons.

I still have some major players up on the wall, like the GreyHawk, HCCV, and Elite HCG (along with several others like WilsonArt Grey & Fashion Grey, Carada HCG, DaLite HCMW, HCDM, and Pearlescent). I'm also waiting on samples from many other manufacturers! Can't wait to get those!

I'm keeping all these samples around, so if anyone wants to see pics, I'd be more than happy to take some. I will continue to test and update as needed :)

looking forward to your results! Elite HC Grey, Carada White, Da-Lite CV and HCCV all on short list.

looking forward to your results! Elite HC Grey, Carada White, Da-Lite CV and HCCV all on short list. In my environment the Carada Brilliant White doesnt work because I have abnormally wide seating :) Plus, with my very bright white walls, reflections wash out my image so I need a screen material that will improve the black levels. The Carada CCW on the other hand does in fact improve the black levels slightly, and it has a very wide viewing angle. So we'll see what happens...

A good test for all this is to watch a DVD with 2.35 aspect ratio, place those samples so they are half on the image and half on the black aspect fill bar.

Most all the white's I've tested yield horrible black levels, not any better than my high gloss textured white wall. Of coarse this is my projectors weakness, not the screen :)

My goal is to find the material that yields the darkest aspect fill bars, with also the brightest whites (Best Contrast).

I learned right away on my first day of testing that for screens that have a gain of 1.2 or higher, it is very important to move the samples around! Top, bottom, left, and right... and to make sure to view each of them in each location from each seating position. Over & over, before deciding to keep them in the running, or eliminate them.

Screens with gain are not going to be unifmorm(brightness)! It's just a matter of viewing angles and how much uniformity you can give up for a brighter *center* of your image ;)

I look forward to your results. I am going to buy the AX100 and was planning to pair it with a Carada BW but now I'll wait to see what you come up with.

I look forward to your results. I am going to buy the AX100 and was planning to pair it with a Carada BW but now I'll wait to see what you come up with. You may want to look into a grey screen to get some better black levels. Even the CCW gives better blacks than a pure white screen. That projector is really bright, so you have a lot of options :) You probably dont need a high gain screen, depends on your room though...

Looking forward to results. Have Infocus 7205, light controlled room, want 106" diag. Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Elliot

Looking forward to results. Have Infocus 7205, light controlled room, want 106" diag. Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Elliot


Well, I'm by no means an expert (although, getting close with all these samples! LOL) but it's been said that the white screens with 1.0-1.3 gain always give the best PQ when you have complete darkness available ;)

However, even with no ambient light my LCD projector STILL doesnt give me dark enough blacks (for my taste anyhow) on my white wall.

I too am aiming for 106"dia.

Tell me more about your projector, and I'll make recomendations based on my findings. I've sampled other projectors as well, including DLP, so I have a pretty good idea of the lumens and contrast differences. Remember though, it'll be strictly my opinion! But my opinion is a good opinion, in my opinion, if ya ask me! :eek: :D

I have 450 hours into this testing/sampling. My quest continues :D

From my findings, I have a stong feeling that the BW will hotspot pretty bad with the AX100. Even with a screen size of up to 120"

I truly feel you should go with a dark grey screen with that projector, it's really bright, so you'll get very good contrast :)

Thanks for the info. Are you testing any of the EluneVision screens?

Mike

Screens with gain are not going to be unifmorm! It's just a matter of viewing angles and how much uniformity you can give up for a brighter *center* of your image ;)

Not true in the case of the HP. You will have excellent uniformity at any location you view from but you will just have a different gain.

Not true in the case of the HP. You will have excellent uniformity at any location you view from but you will just have a different gain.

I eliminated the HP because of exactly that. To me, different gain = not uniform!
The PQ may still be uniform, but the brightness is not. Unacceptable to me and my environment.

Just my .02

Thanks for the info. Are you testing any of the EluneVision screens?

Mike

Never heard of them! If they give samples I'll be all over it. I'm trying to test every sample I can. I have all the time in the world, I'll spend a month or more on this if I have to :D

Links?

If you would not mind testing a sample - please (!) check out www.projectionwholesale.com - They have fixed frame, 106" HC Grey screens for $245. Unless you find that it is horrible, that is what someone on a budget (including me!)should put on their short list.

Never heard of them! If they give samples I'll be all over it. I'm trying to test every sample I can. I have all the time in the world, I'll spend a month or more on this if I have to :D

Links?

Have a look here: http://www.eastporters.com/estore/cart.php?page=screens

Price is good, those are in Canadian Dollars. Link to US prices in the upper left. The 1.1 gain grey was my next choice after the Carada BW.

I haven't seen anyone review the new generation of screens. There are several reviews of the old screens.

Mike

I eliminated the HP because of exactly that. To me, different gain = not uniform!
The PQ may still be uniform, but the brightness is not. Unacceptable to me and my environment.

Just my .02

It's not for everyone that's for sure, but some discount the screen before seeing it. I passed it up the first time around for the same reasons and bought a SS. The fact is though that even in suboptimal setups the HP has some great attributes and might even work in your situation due to good light rejection. You might be surprised. YMMV.

It's not for everyone that's for sure, but some discount the screen before seeing it. I passed it up the first time around for the same reasons and bought a SS. The fact is though that even in suboptimal setups the HP has some great attributes and might even work in your situation due to good light rejection. You might be surprised. YMMV.

Understood :)
I don't eliminate any screen without vigorously testing it in all spots, from all seats. Unfortunetly the HP doesnt work in my set up.

To give an example:
When seated 3 feet left of the PJ and placing the HP sample 3 feet left of center on the image, and at the bottom, this yields a VERY bright image, it "pop"s!

Now, same seating position but with the sample moved over 6 feet, so now it's 3 feet right of the center of the image, the image loses the brightness and is now about the same gain as the white wall.

Can you image how the entire screen would look with those brightness changes across it? So again, while I'm not saying the HP is bad, it's just not right for my set up :)

I've put some screen shots in my gallery, link is in signature.

Also, as I said when I first got the AE900U, I am very open to showing it and all these screen samples in person if you're in my area ;)

It's all about helping others :D I'll keep all samples in case anyone wants to see specific side by side comparisons.

Have a look here: http://www.eastporters.com/estore/cart.php?page=screens

Price is good, those are in Canadian Dollars. Link to US prices in the upper left. The 1.1 gain grey was my next choice after the Carada BW.
I haven't seen anyone review the new generation of screens. There are several reviews of the old screens.
Mike

I have a request in for samples of all 4 materials from EluneVision. We'll see :)

If you would not mind testing a sample - please (!) check out www.projectionwholesale.com - They have fixed frame, 106" HC Grey screens for $245. Unless you find that it is horrible, that is what someone on a budget (including me!)should put on their short list.

Those screens look interesting. I have a request in for fabric samples. So we'll see :)

Ok, just received the 6 Draper samples! They'll join the testing tonight. At first sight they look great. Each should bring a new element to the test ;)

New camera ariving tomorrow! :D

Also, I have the above mentioned 'Grey Diamond Vein' screen sample and the Severtson samples all on their way!!

Severtson samples arrive! They look good :) Will put them up today for comparison!

I'm on the verge of eliminating the Elite HCG, it's darker and with less gain than the Draper HiDef Grey and the Stewart Greyhawk (both of which give nearly identical black levels as the Elite, and both show better whites than the Elite).

However, for those on a budget and can live with greyer whites might want to seriously consider the Elite HCG. I love it's image quality and black levels :)

I am looking at the Da-lite High Contrast Cinema Vision 106" screen. How do you like it? Thanks

I am looking at the Da-lite High Contrast Cinema Vision 106" screen. How do you like it? Thanks

HCCV might be a little too dark for my setup. However, the CV is probably my number one choice so far... simply because my projector (1100 lumens) has a hard time making bright whites on any darker of a screen.

However, my line of thinking is that projectors come and go, they get better with time, the next generation projectors are already coming out at 2000 lumens, and I suspect they'll only get brighter.

The screen will be around far longer than the projector will... so I'm tempted to plan ahead and go for one of the darker screens such as the Greyhawk, Draper, or Elite for better blacks than the CV.

We'll see how it pans out. I'm not in any rush, gonna take my time and make a very edumacated choice :)

Thanks for all the hard work here. Expecting my AX100 to arrive in the next short while so my focus is on screen selection. Look forward to your final choice / choices.

The HCCV screen is probably my number one choice so far... simply because my projector (1100 lumens) has a hard time making bright whites on any darker of a screen.

However, my line of thinking is that projectors come and go, they get better with time, the next generation projectors are already coming out at 2000 lumens, and I suspect they'll only get brighter.

The screen will be around far longer than the projector will... so I'm tempted to plan ahead and go for one of the darker screens such as the Greyhawk, Draper, or Elite for better blacks than the HCCV (I'm not even considering screens as dark as Carada HCG or DaLite HCDM).

We'll see how it pans out. I'm not in any rush, gonna take my time and make a very edumacated choice :)


Hi jberylec

How does the Da-lite HCMW compare with the HCCV ? I'll be using a drop down screen and the HCCV is TAB only so more expensive.

Dazzer

Thanks for all the hard work here. Expecting my AX100 to arrive in the next short while so my focus is on screen selection. Look forward to your final choice / choices.
With that bright projector you should be just fine using one of the darker screens, Draper or Elite, for awesome blacks and still have decent whites! I'm jealous! If you're on a serious budget then the DIY WilsonArt Laminate option would be perfect if you set up a throw 14' or longer and use a 100"+ screen size. If money is no object, go with the Stewart GreyHawk :)


Hi jberylec
How does the Da-lite HCMW compare with the HCCV ? I'll be using a drop down screen and the HCCV is TAB only so more expensive.
Dazzer
The HCMW gives slightly better blacks that my glossy white wall and regular matte white screens. However, it's not as dark as the HCCV. Your situation is a sticky one, because I've yet to come across a light grey material that's used in a pull-down.

From my findings, I have a stong feeling that the BW will hotspot pretty bad with the AX100. Even with a screen size of up to 120"

I truly feel you should go with a dark grey screen with that projector, it's really bright, so you'll get very good contrast :)

Have you confirmed your feelings?

I was also thinking about pairing the ax100 with a carada BW at 114" diag. I didn't think hotspoting was an issue with those screens. I was avoiding the grey screens because I do plan to upgrade to a likely less bright 1080p in a couple years and because I don't want to lose the bright whites at all. Your thoughts?

edit: I'll also being running the PJ in econo-mode most of the time.

Have you confirmed your feelings?
I was also thinking about pairing the ax100 with a carada BW at 114" diag. I didn't think hotspoting was an issue with those screens. I was avoiding the grey screens because I do plan to upgrade to a likely less bright 1080p in a couple years and because I don't want to lose the bright whites at all. Your thoughts?
edit: I'll also being running the PJ in econo-mode most of the time.
For my set up with only a 14' throw, the BW is way too bright even with my 900U. I do think it would hotspot. But more importantly, when seated within the viewing cone obviously it looks great (setting aside the overkill on brightness). But how wide is you're viewing area? For those viewers seated outside the angle, the screen area closest to them will be much brighter than the screen area furthest away. This is what I now refer to correctly as "brightness uniformity".

And yes, I still find that high gain screens have this problem, including the BW. I'm thinking the only way around it with these high lumen PJs is to go with 1.3 or less gain.

Just my .02

I was told by carada that the viewing cone was 45 degrees and my seats should be within that (probably with 25 degrees). My throw will be 15 to 15.5 feet. I was planning on a 114" diag screen sitting back about 13'. I was also assuming that after calibrating it some and running it in econo-mode that it might not be overly bright but allow me the option of xbox and sports viewing with some ambient light.

What screen would you recommend given that I'll probably get a "less bright" 1080p at some point for use with whatever screen I get now.

I'm new to all this and so appreciate your two cents.

I was told by carada that the viewing cone was 45 degrees and my seats should be within that (probably with 25 degrees). My throw will be 15 to 15.5 feet. I was planning on a 114" diag screen sitting back about 13'. I was also assuming that after calibrating it some and running it in econo-mode that it might not be overly bright but allow me the option of xbox and sports viewing with some ambient light.
What screen would you recommend given that I'll probably get a "less bright" 1080p at some point for use with whatever screen I get now.
I'm new to all this and so appreciate your two cents.
Actually, now that you explained your planned setup, I think you'd be happy with the BW. Because with a long throw like that, and a huge screen size, I dont think the brightness will be overkill.

But remember, your blacks will be grey! To put it into perspective... turn off all the lights in a glossy white room, the white walls become pitch black. Now... the black aspect fill bars from these projectors are no where near as black as the surrounding unlit white walls! Horrible if you ask me.

But if you dont mind that, then great. To some people a very bright image is more important than black levels. But for me, the black levels are so very important. I cannot stand seeing grey aspect fill bars.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the viewing angle supplied by the manufacturers is from the center of the screen. Which means the center of the screen will have the same gain out to 45deg. However, the opposit side of the screen will have much much less gain at that same 45deg seating position. Resulting in less than acceptable brightness uniformity for my taste. That's why I've chosen to stay below 1.2 gain.

But again, if you dont mind that, then great :) Maybe your LazyBoy will be in the sweet spot and no one else gets to sit there but you ;) hehe

It's all a give and take. Take the good with the bad, as they say :D
The best thing for you to do is get the free samples from Carada, and do like I did :) Move them around and view them from different seating positions.

Take a look, this should hold true of any high gain screen surface (unless it's curved):
http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/gainvscone.JPG

Thanks.

I don't suppose you have any screen shots that might show the difference between the blacks I'd get with a white versus with a grey screen? I'm not a videophile at all so if the blacks are a fairly dark grey I'd probably not notice but I have nothing to base my decision on given that I can't see anything until I purchase it. My only frame of reference is a 3 year old 56" DLP RPTV and the blacks are fine IMO.

Are there any white screens with gains around 1.2 that you'd recommend if I decided the BW was too much?

Thanks.
I don't suppose you have any screen shots that might show the difference between the blacks I'd get with a white versus with a grey screen? I'm not a videophile at all so if the blacks are a fairly dark grey I'd probably not notice but I have nothing to base my decision on given that I can't see anything until I purchase it. My only frame of reference is a 3 year old 56" DLP RPTV and the blacks are fine IMO.
Are there any white screens with gains around 1.2 that you'd recommend if I decided the BW was too much?
Take a look at my previous post, I was editing a bunch more info into it while you were replying ;) I do have some screen shots in my gallery. Take a look. I'll put the BW back up tonight and take a pic for you ;)

I was told by carada that the viewing cone was 45 degrees and my seats should be within that (probably with 25 degrees). My throw will be 15 to 15.5 feet. I was planning on a 114" diag screen sitting back about 13'. I was also assuming that after calibrating it some and running it in econo-mode that it might not be overly bright but allow me the option of xbox and sports viewing with some ambient light.

What screen would you recommend given that I'll probably get a "less bright" 1080p at some point for use with whatever screen I get now.

I'm new to all this and so appreciate your two cents.

Da-lite HP.

uh...Isn't that "more bright" with a smaller viewing cone? That's kinda the opposite direction...

uh...Isn't that "more bright" with a smaller viewing cone? That's kinda the opposite direction...

If you do the math you can calculate the gain from each seat. You might be surprised at the results when you realize this screen is probably an option for your based on you throw distance and seating. Gain will of course vary depending on where you sit but the screen offers good light rejection, a uniform image, and you cannot see the screen material. The latter of which is the BIGGEST plus for me. There are so many screens out there where you can see the optical coating or screen material. Ultimately, you need to choose and if a dim pj is in the future a high gain screen is a good choice.

BTW, I have a SS and HP. The SS would be a super screen for you but some feel the screen sheen unacceptable.

The HCMW gives slightly better blacks that my glossy white wall and regular matte white screens. However, it's not as dark as the HCCV. Your situation is a sticky one, because I've yet to come across a light grey material that's used in a pull-down.

Thanks jberylec

What affect does the Da-lite HCMW have on white levels ?

dazzer

Thanks jberylec
What affect does the Da-lite HCMW have on white levels ?
dazzer
Not much really, they're still a beautiful white. Bottom row, 2nd in from the left (not counting the HP on far left) :D


And CSB, here are those screen shots comparing the whites:
(Sorry for the wrinkles, had to dig these back out, double sided tape doesn't have much forgiveness! LOL)

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/31114014587.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3942103) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/31114014478.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3942102) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/31114014495.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3942101)

Obviously the PQ of my camera sucks, still waiting on that new one!
Also, these screen shots should only be used to judge the viewing angles on these materials.

Notice how the Draper M2500 and the DaLite HP are BRIGHT when viewed from center... but when you move out 3 to 4 feet left or right of the PJ lens look what you get.

Someone mentioned above about "seeing the screen surface", this doesnt bother me, as I like a little grain, like film. But the comment was well needed because seeing the screen surface might bother some people. You'll see this on textured screens like the GrayWolf, and most pull downs, because they have a canvas like texture that the tensioned screens dont have (they're made out of a very smooth vinyl).

And CSB, here are those screen shots comparing the whites:
(Sorry for the wrinkles, had to dig these back out, double sided tape doesn't have much forgiveness! LOL)

Thanks for the pictures and all your effort. Without going to anymore effort can you show or characterize how the blacks would be different between the Carada BW and various grey screens?

I'm still thinking AX-100 with the BW and as long as my blacks are fairly dark grey I think I can live with it. Understanding that they're grey, will they be pretty dark?

How does the Carada BW do with regard to "seeing the screen"?

jberylec,

I have found this thread to be very interesting and look forward to your final selection

Up until a month ago I had the Panny 900 with the Carada "96" high Contast Gey material. Although I generally liked the results I felt that the HCG imposed its signature by noticeably dimming the image and muting colors and whites. Since that time I have upgraded to the AX100 which can look spectacular but I am still bothered a liitle bit by the dimming and the effect on colors that this screen has. On the other hand like you I really don't care for gray aspect bars when viewing 2:35 movies. With the Carada HCG my blacks (and the bars) are more than acceptable, my only problem is the dimming.

Let me know from your testing which screen(s) you feel would give me the blacks of the HCG but with brighter whites and colors.

Thanks
Erniec

Thanks for the pictures and all your effort. Without going to anymore effort can you show or characterize how the blacks would be different between the Carada BW and various grey screens?
I'm still thinking AX-100 with the BW and as long as my blacks are fairly dark grey I think I can live with it. Understanding that they're grey, will they be pretty dark?
How does the Carada BW do with regard to "seeing the screen"?
The Carada screens are very smooth vinyl, you wont "see the screen" at all on the BW :)

But the black levels will definately be less than desireable. Take a look at this pic for example, see how much better the contrast ratio is on the grey screen samples across the top when compared to the washed out light grey specs that the white wall generates?

http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/IMAGE_00056.jpg

And I'm not worried about going to more effort, it's no problem. In fact, tonight I'll put the GreyHawk and the BW side by side and find a nice black part of a bright image. Then you'll see exactly what I mean :)

jberylec,
I have found this thread to be very interesting and look forward to your final selection
Up until a month ago I had the Panny 900 with the Carada "96" high Contast Gey material. Although I generally liked the results I felt that the HCG imposed its signature by noticeably dimming the image and muting colors and whites. Since that time I have upgraded to the AX100 which can look spectacular but I am still bothered a liitle bit by the dimming and the effect on colors that this screen has. On the other hand like you I really don't care for gray aspect bars when viewing 2:35 movies. With the Carada HCG my blacks (and the bars) are more than acceptable, my only problem is the dimming.
Let me know from your testing which screen(s) you feel would give me the blacks of the HCG but with brighter whites and colors.
Thanks
Erniec That's exactly why I eliminated the Carada HCG, it's just too dark for my PJ. You need a lot of lumens to get good whites on a screen that dark. But it's really hard to beat it's black levels! I think the Stewart GreyHawk would be great for your situation. Get a sample! Also, the Elite HCG will be just slightly darker than the GreyHawk, but much cheaper. Both of these screens are a lighter shade of grey than the Carada.

I cant wait until affordable projectors reach 2500-3000 lumens! Then the Carada will be king of the greys :D
(That's the Carada second from the right at the top in the image above)

But the black levels will definately be less than desireable. Take a look at this pic for example, see how much better the contrast ratio is on the grey screen samples across the top when compared to the washed out light grey specs that the white wall generates?


Crap! That's much more drastic than I was expecting. Just when I think I know what I'm going to get... :eek: :confused:


And I'm not worried about going to more effort, it's no problem. In fact, tonight I'll put the GreyHawk and the BW side by side and find a nice black part of a bright image. Then you'll see exactly what I mean :)
[/QUOTE]

Do you have anything you could put on those screens from an actual movie that would make the point? It might help me a little more to see real world impact over a test pattern.

Thanks again - this is great information that may help me avoid an expensive mistake!

this is a great thread jberylec. even more so because i too have the Panny 900 and a similar environment. i am sure you will do this in your reviews anyway, but i would like to suggest you give your suggestions based on various budgets as well. For example..."if I was working on a $500 budget this is the screen I would go with" and "if I was working on a $500-700 budget this gets my vote" and so on. thanks again!

Crap! That's much more drastic than I was expecting. Just when I think I know what I'm going to get... :eek: :confused:
Do you have anything you could put on those screens from an actual movie that would make the point? It might help me a little more to see real world impact over a test pattern.
Thanks again - this is great information that may help me avoid an expensive mistake!
Yes, I'll look for a scene from a popular tv show or movie tonight. It's just hard to find the right scene because it can't be too dark overall or this cheap 1.3mp camera just cant hang! I'll find something that is bright enough to light up the room a bit, but still have a dark black part of the image. Like a suit on a lawyer or somethin' ;)

this is a great thread jberylec. even more so because i too have the Panny 900 and a similar environment. i am sure you will do this in your reviews anyway, but i would like to suggest you give your suggestions based on various budgets as well. For example..."if I was working on a $500 budget this is the screen I would go with" and "if I was working on a $500-700 budget this gets my vote" and so on. thanks again!
Noted :D

Here's the thoughts so far: (from memory, ir's been a while since I checked prices)
Best Bang: WilsonArt Fashion Grey
Budget King: Elite HCG
Wallet On The Fence: DaLite HCCV or Draper Hi Def Grey
Money Is No Object: Stewart GreyHawk

I think I've ruled out Draper HCG, it's a tad too dark, getting very close to Carada darkness.

Where did you get your Dalite samples. I did not see anything on their website about samples.

Noted :D

Here's the thoughts so far: (from memory, ir's been a while since I checked prices)
Best Bang: WilsonArt Fashion Grey
Budget King: Elite HCG
Wallet On The Fence: DaLite HCCV or Draper Hi Def Grey
Money Is No Object: Stewart GreyHawk

I think I've ruled out Draper HCG, it's a tad too dark, getting very close to Carada darkness.

How do you like the WilsonArt Fashion Grey overall compared to the other contenders?

Noted :D

Here's the thoughts so far: (from memory, ir's been a while since I checked prices)
Best Bang: WilsonArt Fashion Grey
Budget King: Elite HCG
Wallet On The Fence: DaLite HCCV or Draper Hi Def Grey
Money Is No Object: Stewart GreyHawk

I think I've ruled out Draper HCG, it's a tad too dark, getting very close to Carada darkness.

Given my budget I'm probably looking at the Elite HCG given these choices. How bad are my whites/colors going to suffer with the grey screen and an AX-100? How does this screen do with some ambient light for football games and xbox usage? Any issues with the viewing angle?

Hi Jberylec,
I recently purchased Optoma H31 ( 3000:1 contrast and 850 Lumen). I have controlled light in basement but walls are light yellow. I plan to use 90 inches diagonal screen. How will Fashion Gray perform under these conditions?
I am debating between WilsonartFashion Gray and DW
Thanks for help

very useful thread! Thanks for your work!

Where did you get your Dalite samples. I did not see anything on their website about samples.
Call or email them :)

How do you like the WilsonArt Fashion Grey overall compared to the other contenders?
Awesome! About the same as the Stewart GreyHawk. Maybe half a shade darker grey, but not quite as dark as the Elite HCG or Draper Hi Def. I am still very much considering Fashion Grey! I'm just not looking forward to framing it! But it can't be beaten for around $100!!

Given my budget I'm probably looking at the Elite HCG given these choices. How bad are my whites/colors going to suffer with the grey screen and an AX-100? How does this screen do with some ambient light for football games and xbox usage? Any issues with the viewing angle?
XBox and Football are both pretty bright, so no worries there. The only suffering might be with watching dark movies during the day. But that's always a problem no matter what screen color you get. Don't make a decision yet! I still have a few more to sample :D

Here's another pic to compare contrast ratios between white and grey screens:

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/31213450996.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3948664)

Directly left of the scores you'll see much blacker blacks, then grey, then black again. The grey blacks in the middle are from a white sample, Severtson White. The dark blacks to either side are Severtson HCG and Severtson Ultra.

Same story down below with different brand samples. Also, let me tell you that the difference between the whites and greys is probably close to twice as much as shown in these pictures. This camera is horrible.

I've eliminated Severtson's HCG & Ultra samples, along with the Draper HCG. These are right along side the Carada HCG and DaLite HCDM as far as darkness. Your PJ would have to have major lumens (think 2000+) to overcome the dimmed colors and grey whites of these very dark materials.

For all remaining contenders I'm going to split them into two categories: Light Grey and Dark Grey
Light greys are the screens that would work great with lower lumen PJs, and still improve black levels moderately.
Dark greys are the screens that would work great with higher lumen PJs, and improve the black levels greatly.
Splitting these out will help me (and others, hopefully) make a decision based on possible future PJ upgrades.

*Light Grey Remaining Contenders:
(As requested these are sorted by budget)
DaLite Pearl
DaLite CV
DaLite HCMW
DaLite HCCV

*Dark Grey Remaining Contenders: (Suggest 1200+ advertised lumens)(EDITED 11/27/2006: I have now changed my recomendation! For these darker greys plan on using a PJ with 2000+ advertised lumens. Unless dirty whites don't bother you.)
(As requested these are sorted by budget)
WilsonArt Grey (DIY)
WilsonArt Fashion Grey (DIY)
Elite HCG
Draper HiDef Grey
Stewart GreyHawk

*Remember, these are only my personal opinions, based soley on my described environment :)

I'm still waiting on many more samples! I've updated the first post with all this info :) And, as you can see from my suggestions I'm kind of stuck here. My Panny AE900U is only advertised at 1100 lumens, and it's not quite bright enough for use on the Darker Greys. But there's always upgrades to come :D

The question is though, will the upgrade to be a brighter PJ? Or one with superior contrast? :confused: Which screen to go with now that will work best with any future PJs? We shall see. The testing continues...

Thanks for the pics, but I am having a hard time looking at which screen is which from how it is set up. :confused:

Thanks for the pics, but I am having a hard time looking at which screen is which from how it is set up. :confused:
Which pics are you talking about? The ones in "My Gallery" are labelled. And the links to PutFile are simply just to show the contrast difference between white and grey samples.

None of these pics should be used to compare PQ, because of the poor quality of the camera. Only use these pics as a general reference for contrast differences please :)

I'm still expecting a way better camera any day now...

the ones in your gallery. For example, I have no idea which picture is the Fashion Grey.

Directly left of the scores you'll see much blacker blacks, then grey, then black again. The grey blacks in the middle are from a white sample, Severtson White. The dark blacks to either side are Severtson HCG and Severtson Ultra.

Same story down below with different brand samples. Also, let me tell you that the difference between the whites and greys is probably close to twice as much as shown in these pictures. This camera is horrible.

Wow. You're convincing me that I probably need a grey screen. My only concern now is regarding how grey my whites will look. Will I ever see anything that looks "whiter" than the screen color? Any of that scoreboard in white on a grey screen?

the ones in your gallery. For example, I have no idea which picture is the Fashion Grey.
The WilsonArt Grey(left) and Fashion Grey(right) Laminates are the little 2"x3" samples towards the right. You'd have to see them in person, they're way too small to even look at from these pictures. But atleast you can see what their general shade of color is :)


Wow. You're convincing me that I probably need a grey screen. My only concern now is regarding how grey my whites will look. Will I ever see anything that looks "whiter" than the screen color? Any of that scoreboard in white on a grey screen?
Yes that is possible. It depends on how much sheen a screen has, and how bright your projector is. I've seen a projector put out bright whites on a BLACK screen. Of coarse this was a very small image size in order to get enough brightness to do so.

Anyhow, your concern is a very valid one, and this is why I split the remaining contenders into two groups :) You'll have an easier time with this if you're getting the AX100... I'm jealous ;)

Just remember that ALL the screens I'm reviewing will improve blacks, those are the only ones I'm interested in. So you dont have to go with a darker grey. You'd be happy with any of the lighter greys as well. They'll produce better blacks than a white screen any day. The HCCV or WilsonArt Grey (DIY) should be at the top of your list if you're concerned about having bright whites too. This also depends on what screen size and throw distance you choose.

The smaller the image, the brighter it is! The shorter the throw, the brighter it is.

On another note, I just received the Vutec Samples! So these will get put up tonight and viewed all weekend, possibly longer if any end up being valid contenders in my environment :)

Man, You are anal. ;)

Man, You are anal. ;)
And proud of it :D hehe

I'm eagerly anticipating your impressions of the screens from EluneVision and the "diamond vein" screen from projectionwholesale...

I've eliminated Severtson's HCG & Ultra samples, along with the Draper HCG. These are right along side the Carada HCG and DaLite HCDM as far as darkness. Your PJ would have to have major lumens (think 2000+) to overcome the dimmed colors and grey whites of these very dark materials.

For all remaining contenders I'm going to split them into two categories: Light Grey and Dark Grey
Light greys are the screens that would work great with lower lumen PJs, and still improve black levels moderately.
Dark greys are the screens that would work great with higher lumen PJs, and improve the black levels greatly.
Splitting these out will help me (and others, hopefully) make a decision based on possible future PJ upgrades.

*Light Grey Remaining Contenders:
(As requested these are sorted by budget)
WilsonArt Grey (DIY)
DaLite Pearl
DaLite HCMW
DaLite HCCV

*Dark Grey Remaining Contenders: (Suggest 1200+ advertised lumens)
(As requested these are sorted by budget)
WilsonArt Fashion Grey (DIY)
Elite HCG
Draper HiDef Grey
Stewart GreyHawk

*Remember, these are only my personal opinions, based soley on my described environment :)

I'm still waiting on many more samples! I've updated the first post with all this info :) And, as you can see from my suggestions I'm kind of stuck here. My Panny AE900U is only advertised at 1100 lumens, and it's not quite bright enough for use on the Darker Greys. But there's always upgrades to come :D

The question is though, will the upgrade to be a brighter PJ? Or one with superior contrast? :confused: Which screen to go with now that will work best with any future PJs? We shall see. The testing continues...


Of the remaining contenders, only the Stewart Greyhawk would be available in a 2.35:1 format?

Of the remaining contenders, only the Stewart Greyhawk would be available in a 2.35:1 format?
I think most companies offer that now a days. You'd have to check their websites :)
And with WilsonArt Laminates, you make it yourself, so the aspect is what ever you want :D

I'm eagerly anticipating your impressions of the screens from EluneVision and the "diamond vein" screen from projectionwholesale...
I'm still waiting for them both to respond to my request for samples...

I have not received my grey diamond fabric either. I made another request from projection wholesale today, just in case. He was very nice about it, apologized, and said he would send out another sample today. I made a request from Elite that same day (10/26), and checked with them today as well, as I have not received their HCG sample either. They said to wait a few more days and then they would resend as well. Does it usually take 3+ weeks?

I have not received my grey diamond fabric either. I made another request from projection wholesale today, just in case. He was very nice about it, apologized, and said he would send out another sample today. I made a request from Elite that same day (10/26), and checked with them today as well, as I have not received their HCG sample either. They said to wait a few more days and then they would resend as well. Does it usually take 3+ weeks?
EDITED: I got all my samples within one week from all the manufacturers. Except I still haven't received the grey diamond vein "magic fabric" or the EluneVision samples. I never even got a response from DragonFly. Maybe I'll send more emails :)

Another update:
I've eliminated the DaLite Pearlescent. This material just doesnt improve the black levels enough. Plus it may have just a tad too much gain for wide viewing setups such as mine.

I've also moved WilsonArt Grey into the dark greys. While it's lighter than the Fashion Grey, it still isn't light enough to use with a PJ with advertised lumens less than 1200. In my opinion of coarse ;)

I'm starting to lean towards the HCCV very heavily! My thoughts are now that when it comes time to upgrade the PJ, technology will have gotten better as for lumens AND contrast! Therefore a darker grey wont be needed! :D

I still have a bunch more samples to test, as soon as they arrive. So we'll see what happens :)

Awesome stuff J. Much respect for such anality :)

Just a question, why didn't you consider the Screen Innovations Visage? I remember it got rave reviews because it owns ambient light. Not sure about viewing angles with it though.

Will continue watching this thread with interest..

PS Im getting AX100 next week (upgrade from AE900), so in the market for a new screen too.

Awesome stuff J. Much respect for such anality :)
Just a question, why didn't you consider the Screen Innovations Visage? I remember it got rave reviews because it owns ambient light. Not sure about viewing angles with it though.
Will continue watching this thread with interest..
PS Im getting AX100 next week (upgrade from AE900), so in the market for a new screen too.
Visage is beyond my budget. Plus if I remember correctly, all the reading I did on it led me to believe that it wouldn't work in my set up because you have to hit it at a certain angle for the image to enter it's surface. Also, I dont know about the viewing angles either...

I may check it out some more...

Visage is beyond my budget. Plus if I remember correctly, all the reading I did on it led me to believe that it wouldn't work in my set up because you have to hit it at a certain angle for the image to enter it's surface. Also, I dont know about the viewing angles either...

I may check it out some more...

Outside my budget too, however worth testing anyway. If you like me, I want to know what the ultimate setup would be regardless of price.

Great info here, thanks for all your testing!

I just jumped on the JVC RS1 pre-buy list and am looking forward to getting my new PJ in Feb. If you don't know anything about this d-ila PJ, it's advertised lumens are ~700-800 and 15,000:1 CR (no iris). I'm going to be using this in a medium colored room, fair light control, fairly wide seating angle, 96" screen, seating at about 10' with the PJ mounted about the same, and I don't want to see screen texture as this drives me nuts as the image is panned across the screen.

Any recommendations for screen materials? I really don't want to spend over $750 for a screen (fixed mount). I was thinking about the Carada BW before I read your thread, now I'm not so sure. Do you think my PJ will have good enough CR to pull off the BW screen? What is the lightest of the grey screens in my price range?

Thanks again! :)

BTW Did you actually test the Vutec Silverstar?

Great info here, thanks for all your testing!

I just jumped on the JVC RS1 pre-buy list and am looking forward to getting my new PJ in Feb. If you don't know anything about this d-ila PJ, it's advertised lumens are ~700-800 and 15,000:1 CR (no iris). I'm going to be using this in a medium colored room, fair light control, fairly wide seating angle, 96" screen, seating at about 10' with the PJ mounted about the same, and I don't want to see screen texture as this drives me nuts as the image is panned across the screen.

Any recommendations for screen materials? I really don't want to spend over $750 for a screen (fixed mount). I was thinking about the Carada BW before I read your thread, now I'm not so sure. Do you think my PJ will have good enough CR to pull off the BW screen? What is the lightest of the grey screens in my price range?

Thanks again! :)
It sounds like your PJ has enough contrast that you might not need a grey screen. Since you dislike texture, you'll have to go with one of the smooth vinyls, such as Carada CCW, which would work great for wide seating. I'd stay away from anything over 1.2 gain if your seating is even close to as wide(er) than the screen. Otherwise people that sit at the sides will see very un-uniform brightness across the image. Also, you're in a bit of a pinch here because of having low lumen output, which usually means it's best matched with a higher gain screen. But good thing you have good light control, that'll help :)

EDIT: A little bit of texture is good you know... it gives the image depth, rather than being flat and fake looking. The question is, how much texture is acceptable. Out of all these screen samples there are at least half a dozen different textures.

BTW Did you actually test the Vutec Silverstar?I just looked through all the samples again, they didnt send it! Maybe they've stopped including it in the home theater options? It really isn't workable for smaller home theaters from what I've read/seen. It's got way too much gain to be practical, IMO.


Outside my budget too, however worth testing anyway. If you like me, I want to know what the ultimate setup would be regardless of price. I'd love to test it, but I dont think they have samples available :confused:

Ok well I found out that SI Visage is really just a rebranded DNP screen called Supernova. There are a couple of resellers on the forum including Jason from AVS or Eric (egcarter) who is helpful. DNP screens are bit pricey but all depends on size.

I think the panacea would be the new Supernova they working on that's low gain (<1.3) but still has the same filtering properties. So basically cuts out ambient light but doesn't hotspot.

I'm gonna hold off buying a screen for a month to see what hits the market.

Great thread going here jberylec. anyways I've got the panny 900U w/ a 106" GW1 and after demoing a few home theaters yesterday I now know that I am missing out on sooooo much more and I've concluded its my screen.

Anyways for a $300 - $400 budget, fixed frame, or just fabric for a home made setup can you list a few screens I should try and get samples for? Since you seem to be the king of samples here and that we have the same projector I though I'd pick your brain a little.

so far I think I am gonna get samples of the following:

Da-Lite HCC
Elite HCG
Carda CCW
Draper HG

anything else you'd recommend me take a look at? maybe the wilson gray fabrics? where would I get those samples at?

thanks in advance for the help.

- Josh

How do you have your PJ mounted? and how far back from screen?
EDIT: I just looked at your pics. Looks like your seating is way too wide for any screen with a gain higher than 1.3 Also, your screen looks like the white GrayWolf, not the grey GrayWolf?

If you want to stay at 100+ inches then you should probably stay away from the darker greys, our projector isn't bright enough to over come the greyish whites.

Here are some thoughts on what you've listed:
DaLite HCCV - Yes Yes Yes ;)
Elite HCG - Too dark for large screen sizes and/or long throw distances
Carada CCW - Very nice image! However, black levels suck
Draper - Draper has two greys, the "Hi Def Grey" is possible with this projector, but it's a tad darker (less gain) than the popular Stewart GreyHawk. Their other is "High Contrast Grey" which in my opinion is way too dark for this projector.

You might want to add DaLite HCMW to your list. If you don't mind a film like texture/depth image. This is the lightest grey screen I've seen. Which means it improves black levels, but still retains the brightest whites.

Now, for WilsonArt. These are not fabrics, but rather laminates. Counter tops basically. These have been proven! Fashion Grey might be a tad too dark for use with our projector. Grey might still be a tad too dark. They have a couple different white's too! This just all depends on if you like bright whites or darker blacks better. Everything you need to know is here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=708240
You can get small WilsonArt samples from Home Depot or Lowe's.
Hope this helps ;)

How do you have your PJ mounted? and how far back from screen?

Ceiling Mount. About 10 feet for seating distance.


EDIT: I just looked at your pics. Looks like your seating is way too wide for any screen with a gain higher than 1.3 Also, your screen looks like the white GrayWolf, not the grey GrayWolf?

The pictures are deceiving, it is the grey one, not the white one. Also I don't care about the quality of the side chairs, I only care about the important seat, Mine ;)



If you want to stay at 100+ inches then you should probably stay away from the darker greys, our projector isn't bright enough to over come the greyish whites.[/quotes]

I guess im not that picky, really what I am lookin for is a screen with a clean, crisp image, more so than bright whites or vivid colors. The screen that I saw with the same projector I have is the SMX screen http://www.smxscreen.com/ its a DIY setup as well.

and Man did it look way better than my setup. Thats why I am now lookin for a different screen. the GW has too much texture in it and makes it look almost washed out. I am now a true believer in the screen makes or breaks the setup.

[quote]
Here are some thoughts on what you've listed:
DaLite HCCV - Yes Yes Yes ;)
Elite HCG - Too dark for large screen sizes and/or long throw distances
Carada CCW - Very nice image! However, black levels suck
Draper - Draper has two greys, the "Hi Def Grey" is possible with this projector, but it's a tad darker (less gain) than the popular Stewart GreyHawk. Their other is "High Contrast Grey" which in my opinion is way too dark for this projector.

You might want to add DaLite HCMW to your list. If you don't mind a film like texture/depth image. This is the lightest grey screen I've seen. Which means it improves black levels, but still retains the brightest whites.

[quote]
Now, for WilsonArt. These are not fabrics, but rather laminates. Counter tops basically. These have been proven! Fashion Grey might be a tad too dark for use with our projector. Grey might still be a tad too dark. They have a couple different white's too! This just all depends on if you like bright whites or darker blacks better. Everything you need to know is here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=708240
You can get small WilsonArt samples from Home Depot or Lowe's.
Hope this helps ;)

Thank I'll take a look at the samples. I just contacted Elite and they are sending out a few samples for me to look at. Also emailed Da-lite, and smx guy for samples. I'll wait to see when Da-lite emails me back and have them send me a few different screen samples and go from there.

But like I said really darker whites might be fine for me as I want more of a cleaner image and better black levels.

thanks,
Josh

You're gonna love the HCCV. It's very smooth, no texture, no hotspotting, uniform brightness from wide seating, crisp gorgeous image, improved blacks, and all this while still maintaining decent whites! :)

Same with the HCMW. Except it offers even better whites, while still improving blacks over a white screen. Although it has a tad bit of texture. No where near as much as the graywolf though ;)

It sounds like your PJ has enough contrast that you might not need a grey screen. Since you dislike texture, you'll have to go with one of the smooth vinyls, such as Carada CCW, which would work great for wide seating. I'd stay away from anything over 1.2 gain if your seating is even close to as wide(er) than the screen. Otherwise people that sit at the sides will see very un-uniform brightness across the image. Also, you're in a bit of a pinch here because of having low lumen output, which usually means it's best matched with a higher gain screen. But good thing you have good light control, that'll help :)

EDIT: A little bit of texture is good you know... it gives the image depth, rather than being flat and fake looking. The question is, how much texture is acceptable. Out of all these screen samples there are at least a dozen different textures.
Thanks for your input!

After reading your comments, I'm now starting to think a simple (and cheap) Designer White WilsonArt screen might be my best solution. I also like the idea of the highly durable laminate as well over a fragile vinyl. Do you think I'd be okay with the white screen, or should I look for something with a touch of grey?

half you taken a look at www.smxscreen.com and the material they sell there? I was able to demo a AX100U and the SMX screen and man did that look extreamly impressive. I realize the AX100 is brighter than the 900 but man did the picture look so much cleaner and crisp compared to to what I have now.

I really would love to do a fixed frame setup, but the Da-lite HCCV in a fixed frame is way out of my budget i think. I haven't confirmed it yet but does $1k-ish for the HCCV in a fixed frame for 106" sound right?

So if thats the case right now its either between the Elite here: http://www.visualapex.com/accessories/accessory_details.asp?chPartNumber=R106H1&MFR=Elite&Type=Screens

or the SMXscreen diy setup.

Any other reco's for sub $500 ?

- Josh

Thanks for your input!

After reading your comments, I'm now starting to think a simple (and cheap) Designer White WilsonArt screen might be my best solution. I also like the idea of the highly durable laminate as well over a fragile vinyl. Do you think I'd be okay with the white screen, or should I look for something with a touch of grey? With the high CR of your PJ I think that's a great choice! Frame it with some velvet wraped beveled baseboard and you've got a screen as good or better than a manufactured one! And way more durable!

And as far as grey goes, I don't think there's a laminate with just a hint of grey. DW should be just fine for your set up :)

Any hotspotting/sheen issues with the Wilsonart DW or Grey?

half you taken a look at www.smxscreen.com and the material they sell there? I was able to demo a AX100U and the SMX screen and man did that look extreamly impressive. I realize the AX100 is brighter than the 900 but man did the picture look so much cleaner and crisp compared to to what I have now.
I really would love to do a fixed frame setup, but the Da-lite HCCV in a fixed frame is way out of my budget i think. I haven't confirmed it yet but does $1k-ish for the HCCV in a fixed frame for 106" sound right?
So if thats the case right now its either between the Elite here: http://www.visualapex.com/accessories/accessory_details.asp?chPartNumber=R106H1&MFR=Elite&Type=Screens

or the SMXscreen diy setup.
Any other reco's for sub $500 ?
- Josh The SmX is an audio transparent screen. Do you plan on putting your center channel behind the screen? Cause that's what it's used for.

Here, this is well within your budget: http://projectionwholesale.com/viewdetail.asp?idProduct=279 I'm still waiting for a sample.

These are also well within your budget: http://www.eastporters.com/estore/cart.php?page=screens I'm still waiting for samples from them too.

There are probably others out there within your budget as well ;)

Any hotspotting/sheen issues with the Wilsonart DW or Grey? Depends on throw distance, lumens, and screen size. If your PJ has 1100+ advertised lumens you'll probably want to go 96" or larger, with a throw distance of 12ft or greater. The laminates are just gorgeous from what I've seen and read. Very strong contenders! :)

The SmX is an audio transparent screen. Do you plan on putting your center channel behind the screen? Cause that's what it's used for.

Yes I do know its a audio trans. screen but I just thought the PQ was just amazing compared to the GW1.



Here, this is well within your budget: http://projectionwholesale.com/viewdetail.asp?idProduct=279 I'm still waiting for a sample.

These are also well within your budget: http://www.eastporters.com/estore/cart.php?page=screens I'm still waiting for samples from them too.

There are probably others out there within your budget as well ;)

Da-lite is sending me some samples as well as Elite so i'll see how those look. I just want to get the "cleanest" "crisp" picture I can. I just can't stand my screen now that i've seen what the SMX screen as well as the Stewart Studiotek screen can do.

I know I could do the diy screen with the wilson art material but I guess Im not sure how i'll like the setup as im not sure how exactly you'd do the frame or what not.

anyways any other recommendations to check out would be great.

- Josh

With the high CR of your PJ I think that's a great choice! Frame it with some velvet wraped beveled baseboard and you've got a screen as good or better than a manufactured one! And way more durable!

And as far as grey goes, I don't think there's a laminate with just a hint of grey. DW should be just fine for your set up :)
Great! It's rare that the cheapest and most durable product is the best fit. The sad reality is I'd be willing to pay a lot more for the durability of the laminate alone, but if I can make a top notch screen myself for under $200 I'm a damn happy man! :)

I'll be watching your thread to see what you finally decide to go with...


BTW, I'll give you feedback regarding the DW WA screen in Feb. when I receive the new PJ. Thanks again for your help!!!

A turn of events!

After watching so many greys, I've concluded that even though I LOVE the better contrast ratio they produce, I cannot bring myself to ignore the dirty whites, they are just unacceptable :(

Anyhow, I've still got the Da-Lite CV, HCMW, and HCCV up on the wall. And I'm still waiting for more samples as well. So we'll see where this goes. But it's looking like an off-white is gonna win it. Even the lighter grey screens are just too grey.

When it comes time to upgrade the PJ, I'm relying on the fact that it'll have better brightness AND contrast (Think Panny's new one, with 1080p, 11,000:1 CR, and 1100 Lumens! Wish that was in the budget right now!).

The Cinema Vision is looking like a really nice investment :D

How much darker is the HCCV than the HCMW ?

How much darker is the HCCV than the HCMW ?
HCCV is much darker than the off-white CV or HCMW. But at the same time, HCCV is the lightest grey out there (that I've seen).

The CV and HCMW compare nicely, difference being that the HCMW is textured (and I think it's only used for pull-downs), while the CV isnt textured (and is used fixed frames, which is what I want).

These are my 3 remaining screens right now, so we'll see how the testing stacks up over the next few days of moving them around and watching all different sources.

I still can't believe that after all this time, all these manufactures, all this testing, all the effort... the top 3 screens are all Da-Lite!

Another update:
I've eliminated the DaLite Pearlescent. This material just doesnt improve the black levels enough. Plus it may have just a tad too much gain for wide viewing setups such as mine.

I've also moved WilsonArt Grey into the dark greys. While it's lighter than the Fashion Grey, it still isn't light enough to use with a PJ with advertised lumens less than 1200. In my opinion of coarse ;)

I'm starting to lean towards the HCCV very heavily! My thoughts are now that when it comes time to upgrade the PJ, technology will have gotten better as for lumens AND contrast! Therefore a darker grey wont be needed! :D

I still have a bunch more samples to test, as soon as they arrive. So we'll see what happens :)


Thank you so much for all of your work on the quest for a screen material that fits your projector. To my knowledge you are the only one to comment on the Da-Lite "pearlescent" screen material. Two forum members have recommended this material for it's 1.5 gain. I am on the RS1 prebuy list and really would appreciate your continued thoughts on this material if possible. The JVC is reported to have outstanding blacks as well as incredible contrast numbers, but only 700-800 lumens with a new lamp. As I plan a 120" wide 2.35 X 1 aspect screen I really need some gain. How well did the "pearlescent" handle some ambient light as well as the viewing cone?

If you can help by re-testing this material and either post or pm me with your opinions I would greatly appreciate it.

Thanks,

Glenn

HCCV is much darker than the off-white CV or HCMW. But at the same time, HCCV is the lightest grey out there (that I've seen).

The CV and HCMW compare nicely, difference being that the HCMW is textured (and I think it's only used for pull-downs), while the CV isnt textured (and is used fixed frames, which is what I want).

These are my 3 remaining screens right now, so we'll see how the testing stacks up over the next few days of moving them around and watching all different sources.

I still can't believe that after all this time, all these manufactures, all this testing, all the effort... the top 3 screens are all Da-Lite!

Jberylec,

One comment on the above. You say that the HCCV is much darker than the HCMW. In looking at your screen shots it appears to me that what you had labelled as HCMW (sample 5) appears darker than HCCV (sample 6). Is the camera image showing something different from what you are seeing in real life or is it possible that you got your labels reversed for the screen shot images? The HCCV always seems very bright with the HCMW being dimmer.

Sorry if I've missed something. Thanks again for all the work.

Thank you so much for all of your work on the quest for a screen material that fits your projector. To my knowledge you are the only one to comment on the Da-Lite "pearlescent" screen material. Two forum members have recommended this material for it's 1.5 gain. I am on the RS1 prebuy list and really would appreciate your continued thoughts on this material if possible. The JVC is reported to have outstanding blacks as well as incredible contrast numbers, but only 700-800 lumens with a new lamp. As I plan a 120" wide 2.35 X 1 aspect screen I really need some gain. How well did the "pearlescent" handle some ambient light as well as the viewing cone?
If you can help by re-testing this material and either post or pm me with your opinions I would greatly appreciate it.
Thanks,
Glenn No problem! I read your post last night from my mobile, and got on it right away. Pearlescent should work out great for you, but I'd only go with that high of gain if your seating is narrower than your screen. Anyhow, here are some new pics:

There are 4 samples total
Top: CV 1.3g, HCMW 1.1g, HCCV 1.1g
Bottom: Pearlescent 1.5g (half & half below CV & HCMW)

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415580.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119844) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415569.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119845) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415581.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119843)

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415441.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119842) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415469.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119840) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415424.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119841)

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415341.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119837) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415356.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119839) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415357.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119838)

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415298.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119834) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415214.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119836) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415242.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119835)

Jberylec, One comment on the above. You say that the HCCV is much darker than the HCMW. In looking at your screen shots it appears to me that what you had labelled as HCMW (sample 5) appears darker than HCCV (sample 6). Is the camera image showing something different from what you are seeing in real life or is it possible that you got your labels reversed for the screen shot images? The HCCV always seems very bright with the HCMW being dimmer.
Sorry if I've missed something. Thanks again for all the work. Which pic are you looking at? I just went and looked at them again, I did label them correctly. And to my eyes the HCCV still appears darker than the HCMW, lit or unlit. Look at this one http://gallery.avsforum.com/showphoto.php/photo/22876/cat/500/ppuser/7635084 and you can tell that it's just a couple shades darker grey :)

They have the same gain, however the HCCV has more "pop" or "sheen" to it because of it's smoother reflective surface. So when viewed from angles the brightness changes, that's why sometimes pictures can be deceiving ;)

But anyhow, when not lit or lit with pure white it's clear that HCCV is darker drey than HCMW.

The HCMW is a good compromise between CV and HCCV, as far as shades of grey are concerned.

jberylec to help simplify your choice hcmw is only rollup and hccv is only fixed frame so depending what you style screen you want there will be only one choice i have a ae900 originally was going to get hccv ended up with high power and i am very happy a full screen of a material will look different then a small sample. the black level of my high power is just fine as the rest of the screen is so bright the blacks look dark. i was worried before i ordered but was happy with the result

jberylec to help simplify your choice hcmw is only rollup and hccv is only fixed frame so depending what you style screen you want there will be only one choice i have a ae900 originally was going to get hccv ended up with high power and i am very happy a full screen of a material will look different then a small sample. the black level of my high power is just fine as the rest of the screen is so bright the blacks look dark. i was worried before i ordered but was happy with the result Thank you for the input :) As stated above, I'm aware of the rollup vs. fixed frame materials ;) Who's to say a little DIY isn't an option? lol

Anyhow, I'm not and wont ever be comparing how dark the blacks look compared to the rest of the image, I will however always be comparing the blacks to the frame and/or surrounding walls! The goal here is to get my black levels darker than the white wall (surrounding the screen) with all the lights off. Make sense?

I'm aware that a full screen will look different than samples, that is why I spend a lot of time with each sample, positioning each strategically. As stated, I have a lot of thought into my testing :) And along the way I have viewed many full size versions of a lot of these :D

The HP really has a hot image, but the blacks are horrible, and the viewing cone is even worse! Granted, these opinions are only valid in my set up. I have seating 3ft wider than image.

Anyhow, I'll find the winner. It's just a matter of time ;)

Long story short...
Perceived contrast ratio doesnt mean squat (to me atleast) when the WHITE wall that the screen is hung on is darker black, when the lights are off, than the blacks in the image!

Now to add to the long story...
So for those of you in the same or similar boats, and interested, all 3 of the remaining contenders offer the same as and/or blacker image blacks than the unlit white wall behind them ;) This means that your aspect fill bars will be very close to as dark or even darker than the white walls around them (with lights very dimmed or off of coarse)!

That's the reason they're "remaining contenders" :D

I'm on the verge of finding the perfect balance between daytime viewing brightness and dark enough aspect fill bars for night time movies!

We await the results......... :)

It's just a matter of what do I want to give up more? Blacker blacks or brighter whites? :eek: And the qwest continues...

These other samples need to hurry up and get here! :D

No problem! I read your post last night from my mobile, and got on it right away. Pearlescent should work out great for you, but I'd only go with that high of gain if your seating is narrower than your screen. Anyhow, here are some new pics:

There are 4 samples total
Top: CV 1.3g, HCMW 1.1g, HCCV 1.1g
Bottom: Pearlescent 1.5g (half & half below CV & HCMW)

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415580.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119844) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415569.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119845) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415581.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119843)

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415441.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119842) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415469.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119840) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33113415424.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4119841)

jberylec,

Thanks for the pictures. Unless I am retarded the Pearlescent is on the bottom row by itself? If so it looks very similar in color to the Cinemavision sample on top row left? If my assumptions are correct how similar are these two materials other than the difference in gain? Any "sparklies" or texture issues with the pearlescent, is it "as white" as the cinemavision?

My screen will be 120" wide 2.35 x 1 with masking for 16 x 9 at 92" wide. The front row is 14' from the screen with the second row at 20' from the screen. Two rows of Berkline's with four (4) seats in each row. The "head to head" dimension for each row when seated in seat 1 & 4 would be 100" apart, so narrower than the 2.35 image at 120" if I understand your comments correctly.

If you could provide your opinion on screen angles to seating positions with the higher gain of the pearlescent I would appreciate it. Your pictures look great and I truly appreciate all the work you have put into this project.

Thanks,

Glenn

jberylec,
Thanks for the pictures. Unless I am retarded the Pearlescent is on the bottom row by itself? If so it looks very similar in color to the Cinemavision sample on top row left? If my assumptions are correct how similar are these two materials other than the difference in gain? Any "sparklies" or texture issues with the pearlescent, is it "as white" as the cinemavision?
My screen will be 120" wide 2.35 x 1 with masking for 16 x 9 at 92" wide. The front row is 14' from the screen with the second row at 20' from the screen. Two rows of Berkline's with four (4) seats in each row. The "head to head" dimension for each row when seated in seat 1 & 4 would be 100" apart, so narrower than the 2.35 image at 120" if I understand your comments correctly.
If you could provide your opinion on screen angles to seating positions with the higher gain of the pearlescent I would appreciate it. Your pictures look great and I truly appreciate all the work you have put into this project.
Thanks,
Glenn Glenn, from everything you've explained I think you should be just fine with a high gain screen :) What is that projector's advertised lumens and contrast ratio? The CR is important because I dont want to recommend a greyish screen like the CV or Pealescent if you have good enough CR to use something like the Carada BW or the HighPower.

I'm almost thinking that you might be better off with the HP, it has way more gain. Night and Day! The HP is brighter than any image I've ever seen, including the most expensive, brightest plasma's and lcd's. You'll need gain like that with such a wide image anyhow, and your set up sounds perfect for it. Narrow seating really helps with screen selection!

Anyhow, let me know the answers to the questions I asked, and then I'll take some pics for you again, this time including the HP and taken from your exact viewing angles ;)

Oh yeah, and to answer your question about the properties of CV vs. Pearlescent... Both have "pop" because of reflective coatings, and both have a smooth surface, so there is no texture to worry about. Also, you're sitting far enough away from the screen that you wouldn't see the material during motion pans anyhow ;) I do not see any sparklies from either sample, in any position. So thats good news too!

The Pearlescent has a bit more "pop" due to it's higher gain. But at the same time it has better blacks because it's a darker shade. Both display the same shade of bright white (within their viewing cone). The Pearlescent is the best of both worlds really. Too bad I have such wide seating :( But like I said, your home theater sounds like a good canidate.

jberylec dont forget after a few hundred hours your bulb will dim and what may originally looked good ie high contrast may later on be dark. also yes you could move samples all over screen to see all angles but its still no substitute for how a whole screen will react to light reflected off it to walls and back

Jberylec,
Did you try out the Studiotek 130 screen? I currently have a Firehawk G1 and I concur on the viewing cone, it's just too narrow in many applications. I'm thinking about replacing it with ST130 G3 fabric.

beware of Quality Control issues with Da-lite screen products. There were numerous threads awhile back on the HCCV material and others. Numerous complaints of sparklies and streaking on the HCCV material. I personally went through 3 samples of the HCCV material and all 3 exhibitied various amount of visible streaking in the material. it was not projector related and could be seen with normal lighting by looking at the sides of the screen. It is very noticeable during pans. I also have a friend with the DaMat material and he has streaks as well. Sparklies are noticeable also and while not objectionable to me, it has been to others. sparklies can be seen in very white backgrounds. the streaking will probably not be noticeable on your small samples but the sparklies should be.

Based on my frustrations above I think it's important to find a neutral or accurate material that does not make itself visible during normal viewing. i think that's why you see alot of recommendations for Carada BW or other basic white screens. While trying to maximize black level or Contrast is important to some, it has now moved down the list for me. Give me a neutral screen and then lower the brightness if necessary and that should get you close to all of these various 'Grey screens'.

jberylec dont forget after a few hundred hours your bulb will dim and what may originally looked good ie high contrast may later on be dark. also yes you could move samples all over screen to see all angles but its still no substitute for how a whole screen will react to light reflected off it to walls and back Aware of that, and already at 500 hours :)

Jberylec, Did you try out the Studiotek 130 screen? I currently have a Firehawk G1 and I concur on the viewing cone, it's just too narrow in many applications. I'm thinking about replacing it with ST130 G3 fabric. Yes I did try it, but it had worse black levels than my wall, so it was eliminated. I'll get it back out and evaluate for you ;)

Beware of Quality Control issues with Da-lite screen products. There were numerous threads awhile back on the HCCV material and others. Numerous complaints of sparklies and streaking on the HCCV material. I personally went through 3 samples of the HCCV material and all 3 exhibitied various amount of visible streaking in the material. it was not projector related and could be seen with normal lighting by looking at the sides of the screen. It is very noticeable during pans. I also have a friend with the DaMat material and he has streaks as well. Sparklies are noticeable also and while not objectionable to me, it has been to others. sparklies can be seen in very white backgrounds. the streaking will probably not be noticeable on your small samples but the sparklies should be.

Based on my frustrations above I think it's important to find a neutral or accurate material that does not make itself visible during normal viewing. i think that's why you see alot of recommendations for Carada BW or other basic white screens. While trying to maximize black level or Contrast is important to some, it has now moved down the list for me. Give me a neutral screen and then lower the brightness if necessary and that should get you close to all of these various 'Grey screens'. Thank you. I am aware of this, and if I choose DaLite, I'll be sure to look it over very meticulously when received.

gmanhdtv, I took some more pics last night to show you how HP compares...
Top to bottom: HP, CV, Pearl, HCMW, HCCV

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33214424546.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4127972) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33214424649.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4127974) http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/11/33214424641.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4127973)

Notice the higher the gain, the narrower viewing angle!

for a dark greyish which one would be your choice?

I've got four samples, Da lite HCCV, and HCMW, Elite HCG, and MW and I just can't figure out which one I like more, the HCCV or the HCG.

- Josh

For a dark greyish which one would be your choice?
I've got four samples, Da lite HCCV, and HCMW, Elite HCG, and MW and I just can't figure out which one I like more, the HCCV or the HCG.
- Josh The Elite HCG gives better blacks than HCCV, but also dirtier whites :( As I'm sure you've noticed. It all depends on how much blacks or whites you're willing to give up.

That's why I changed my thinking a couple days ago and now only considering the lighter greys (HCCV being the darkest of my choices). The Elite HCG is too dark for me.

The one thing I can suggest is that if you have the time, just wait it out... keep viewing both samples for as long as you can before buying one or the other. There will come a time when you decide if you want brighter whites or darker blacks ;)

The only thing thats hard to wait because the Elite 106" fixed frame is soo damn cheap right now over at visualapex.

- Josh

Hey all,

Just starting my research on a screen. Think I will be getting the Sharp DT-500, still debating a bit with the Panasonic Ax100. The Sharp is rated at 1200 Lumens, and a 4000:1 contrast ratio. I have a 20x25 room that is light controlled. I want to go as big as possible, somewhere between 100-120" across.

I was first thinking about a pulldown, but now might consider the fixed frame, the DaLite HCCV has been sounding great so far.

I am concerned(do i need to be?) about a fixed screen sitting on the wall over time, will dust do anything to stop its reflective properties? Would a pull down be better?

I am a real newbie at this, all this equipment is our family xmas present, so want to make sure I get the best in our budge.

Any screen suggestions are appreciated. Oh while you guys are at it, any suggestions dt-500 vs ax100?

Go with the Panny all the way! The lumens are important to fill the large screen your planning. Also important because you can fill such a large screen without relying on a high gain material! Which means you get to have a super wide viewing cone!

I'd really like to have 2000 lumens! And that Panny has much better CR than your other choice! What's your dilema in choosing? I don't see any comparison :)

Get the AX100 and a very light grey or dull white screen, at 120+ inches, and you're set :)

Just from the top of my head, without digging them all out, I'm thinking the Carada CCW, DaLite Da Mat, pretty much any white that's not higher gain than 1.1 (unless you're not concerned about narrow viewing cone).

Oh yeah, and don't worry about dust. You can dust these materials off with a feather duster, and even wipe them down with a wet wash cloth.

The only screens you can't clean are the glass beaded varieties, which I don't think you need anyhow (if you choose the Panny) ;)

Thanks for the update, I read a couple more reviews on the AX100 today, seems like everybody loves it. And whadya know today is the last day for the $200 rebate and $300 worth of free movies from Blockuster deal that Panasonic is doing.

Ordered it today :-).

Now, need to go read about the screens you suggested. I read an article at work today some guy had done a review on it and had suggested a couple of screens, firehawk??? and I think there was a DaLite and an Elite, I'll look it up and let you know.

Thanks a ton for the help. Good to know about the wall mount no dust issue. I like the way it looks, probalby go that route too once I can figure out what to buy.

Whadya think about me possibly mounting the projector on the back wall. It's 25', is that going to be to far, am I going to loose to much brightness since I will have to zoom in? Makes install convienent, but very long cables too, unless of ocurse I put all the dvd/stereo equipment behind me. Kinda inconvienent though.....

...Whadya think about me possibly mounting the projector on the back wall. It's 25', is that going to be to far, am I going to loose to much brightness since I will have to zoom in? Makes install convienent, but very long cables too, unless of ocurse I put all the dvd/stereo equipment behind me. Kinda inconvienent though... I think 25ft is too far away, my opinion. On top of a book/media shelf right behind your seating would work better. Either that or ceiling mount it. Stay around 12-18 ft if posisible :)

Also, I have all my A/V equipment behind me, it was a little inconvenient at first, but then I got an IR repeater. That worked wonders. However, I'm now going to get a big fancy all-in-one touch screen digital RF remote control :D

This thread is great ... thank you for all the effort

WOW, what a great resource, thanks!!!

2 more to add to the list, Supernova and Planar Xscreen, both advertised as ambient light absorbing screens.

I have an AE700 and a home made screen using the Budget Blackout fabric from a fabric store. I was really only using it to test different screen sizes and now I have determined 100" is my choice (or the closest depending on manufacturers options.)

jberylec,

Ok, need to pull the trigger on my screen for my AX100 so I can have it in place for Xmas. Been with you all the way up till now, but have to step up to the plate. Your setup is similar to mine and I agree with your criteria which has driven your shortlist. Given that I need a pulldown for my setup that eliminates the CV. I'm leaning toward the HCMW over the HCCV just because I have a light grey based BOC which I have to say creates a dimming effect that personally I'm not thrilled about.

So tell me why I would be making a mistake with the HCMW at 106"? The only one I can gather from all the threads I've read (and I've looked far and wide) is some comments about texture. Is the texture on the HCMW distracting to you?

Thanks again for your 2 cents (even though all your work is worth a thousand times this amount). :)

I still think the work here is worth more than the $20.00 mentioned... :cool:

jberylec, first of all, thanks for the great info. I am hoping for your sage advice.

I have a panasonic ax100. I will be throwing a 100" picture from about 11 feet. I will have some room lighting most of the time, although not during serious movie watching.

I am very interested in the elite HCG, due to the price. I have read a few posts from users of this screen, and I am looking for a tie breaker if you will.

vvbox says that this material is too dark for his use, but states that he is projecting from the back of the possible range, whereas I will be throwing the image a much shorter distance.

HD Theater is it has been using the screen and is very happy with it.

You mentioned not long ago that it is too dark for your tastes, compared to other choices.

I guess I really want your blessing that this is a good choice for me (no money back guarantee required :) )

I would like to have the powered tensioned screen, and this fits my budget, but I do nto want to sacrifice too much in the way of image quality. A lot of my use will be family viewing (SD kids shows, etc w/ some lights on)

Thank you very much for your opinions, and anyone else who has this combination or similar, please chime in.

ar

WOW, what a great resource, thanks!!!
2 more to add to the list, Supernova and Planar Xscreen, both advertised as ambient light absorbing screens.
I have an AE700 and a home made screen using the Budget Blackout fabric from a fabric store. I was really only using it to test different screen sizes and now I have determined 100" is my choice (or the closest depending on manufacturers options.) Thank you much :) If I'm not mistaken, the supernova amd xscreen are the same product, no? Anyhow, neither supply samples, and both are out of my budget, so it's kind of hard to include them in this testing.

jberylec,
Ok, need to pull the trigger on my screen for my AX100 so I can have it in place for Xmas. Been with you all the way up till now, but have to step up to the plate. Your setup is similar to mine and I agree with your criteria which has driven your shortlist. Given that I need a pulldown for my setup that eliminates the CV. I'm leaning toward the HCMW over the HCCV just because I have a light grey based BOC which I have to say creates a dimming effect that personally I'm not thrilled about.
So tell me why I would be making a mistake with the HCMW at 106"? The only one I can gather from all the threads I've read (and I've looked far and wide) is some comments about texture. Is the texture on the HCMW distracting to you?
Thanks again for your 2 cents (even though all your work is worth a thousand times this amount). The HCMW is a great compromise on greyness and white! I love the color of it, but I am going with a fixed fame, so I'm outta luck unless I build it myself. Anyhow, it does have a bit of texture, but no more than the Elite materials or other matte screens. Plus it's really think, so your pull down shouldn't have wave problems! Good choice :) I personally don't have a problem with a little bit of texture. I feel that it gives a film like movie theater appearence. And I don't think the HCMW has enough texture to notice it in image pans. I think you'll like it, but just in case, always buy from somewhere that has a good return policy.

jberylec, first of all, thanks for the great info. I am hoping for your sage advice.
I have a panasonic ax100. I will be throwing a 100" picture from about 11 feet. I will have some room lighting most of the time, although not during serious movie watching.
I am very interested in the elite HCG, due to the price. I have read a few posts from users of this screen, and I am looking for a tie breaker if you will.
vvbox says that this material is too dark for his use, but states that he is projecting from the back of the possible range, whereas I will be throwing the image a much shorter distance.
HD Theater is it has been using the screen and is very happy with it.
You mentioned not long ago that it is too dark for your tastes, compared to other choices.
I guess I really want your blessing that this is a good choice for me (no money back guarantee required :) )
I would like to have the powered tensioned screen, and this fits my budget, but I do nto want to sacrifice too much in the way of image quality. A lot of my use will be family viewing (SD kids shows, etc w/ some lights on)
Thank you very much for your opinions, and anyone else who has this combination or similar, please chime in.
ar Well, your PJ certainly has the lumens, and it only helps that you're projecting from only 11 feet. I think the darkness of the Elite HCG can be overcome by your set up. Long story short, you should end up with great black levels and acceptable whites. You probably wont want to have the Dynamic Iris turned on. It dims the lamp to make better blacks, which you wont need with that screen. What you'll need is better whites. So leaving DI off should do it for you, even in low lamp mode. Also, as a final thought... the Elite materials are very thin (probably why they're so inexpensive) so with a pulldown, you'll probably end up with waves of some sort in the material. Even with a tentioned set up, I still feel this might be a problem. So make sure you buy from somewhere with a good return policy :) Or maybe rethink your set up and consider a perfectly flat fixed frame with a nice velvet border :D

Also, sorry for the slow responces guys. I had a long weekend trying to prepare for yesterdays dental surgery. All 4 wisdoms pulled, plus one molar! Ouch! Doing ok now though :) Back to the screen research and testing :D

jberylec, first of all, thanks for the great info. I am hoping for your sage advice.

I have a panasonic ax100. I will be throwing a 100" picture from about 11 feet. I will have some room lighting most of the time, although not during serious movie watching.

I am very interested in the elite HCG, due to the price. I have read a few posts from users of this screen, and I am looking for a tie breaker if you will.

vvbox says that this material is too dark for his use, but states that he is projecting from the back of the possible range, whereas I will be throwing the image a much shorter distance.

HD Theater is it has been using the screen and is very happy with it.

You mentioned not long ago that it is too dark for your tastes, compared to other choices.

I guess I really want your blessing that this is a good choice for me (no money back guarantee required :) )

I would like to have the powered tensioned screen, and this fits my budget, but I do nto want to sacrifice too much in the way of image quality. A lot of my use will be family viewing (SD kids shows, etc w/ some lights on)

Thank you very much for your opinions, and anyone else who has this combination or similar, please chime in.

ar

Given the Fact that your projector is 2000 lumens, and mine is 1100 (I've got the AE900) and I too have a throw distance of 11 feet, more like 10.6 or so.

I got several samples from various vendors (based mostly off of this thread) I demo'd the following materials:

Da Lite High Contrast Cinema Vision
Da Lite High Contrast Matt White
Da Lite Da Matt

Elite High Contrast Gray

and SMX Acoustic Transparent screen

and guess which one I chose?

The Elite for two reasons, It has the same colors and black level performace that the Optoma Graywolf screen I have, and was cheap to boot.

For me personally It was a tie between the Elite HCG, and the Da Lite Da Matt. Both gave me the black levels I wanted, I am more concerned about black levels and colors and can sacrifice a dirty white, for me too bright of whites distract me from the image.

The one thing the Elite HCG doesn't have is any gain. The Gain is 1.0 where as the Optoma Gray wolf has 1.8, but granted I wasn't seeing much of the gain, the one thing I LOVE about the Elite is the smooth images, the Optoma is a glass beaded screen and because of that I was getting way too much texture in the image which was distracting me more than the dirty whites were.

So I guess the only thing is will you have ambient light from the Sun or Ambient light from your light fixtures? The 1.0 gain won't help out with that but because of the higher lumen's of the AX100 it might be bright enough to sit down and watch regular tv and still have the wife in the room reading a book with the lights on.

I watch every day tv with both the optoma and Elite screens, I kept the optoma and run both screens at the same time, I ended up buying the Elite manual pull down screen instead of the fixed frame, but they both have the same screen material, only difference is that the fixed frame will be more resistant to waves, were after a while the manual pull down I got will get waves.


Also have you gone to projector Central and used their projector calculator at all?

- Josh

Also, as a final thought... the Elite materials are very thin (probably why they're so inexpensive) so with a pulldown, you'll probably end up with waves of some sort in the material. Even with a tentioned set up, I still feel this might be a problem. So make sure you buy from somewhere with a good return policy :) Or maybe rethink your set up and consider a perfectly flat fixed frame with a nice velvet border :D

FYI is that the sample material Elite sends you is just the reflective part, its not the actual fabric they attach it to. The manual pulldown its a lot thicker than the sample they send you.

And the Fixed frame material, which I havn't seen, but what Elite told me the difference between the two is that the fixed frame material is on a streatch cloth so that you can stretch it over the frame and re-adjust it over the years to keep the material taught to prevent the waves.

For $100 shipped to your door (from one of the forum sponsors) the Elite manual pull down is a steal, but again this is my opinion.

- Josh

First, I would like to thank you guys for your input.

My projector arrived today, so it is time to pull the trigger on a screen. I think that I am going to give the elite a try. For the price (a big concern) I don't think I can come close to doing better.

I will post pics in a few weeks when it is all assembled.


Thanks again,

ar

AR: are you going with Fixed frame or manual pull down? check out VisualApex they are a forum sponsor (look at the very top) and have great customer service.

- Josh

I am going with the tensioned electric. This setup is going in our den, and I think that being able to close it up will go a long way toward making this wife friendly. I masked out the outline of the screen with painters tape, as well as the projector location. (this is a tip I recommend for all first time projector owners. It really gives you an idea about just how large some of these screens can get, and prevented me from over-ordering). This was already enough to make her anxious about how this will fit in to our lives.

ar

...FYI is that the sample material Elite sends you is just the reflective part, its not the actual fabric they attach it to. The manual pulldown its a lot thicker than the sample they send you.

And the Fixed frame material, which I havn't seen, but what Elite told me the difference between the two is that the fixed frame material is on a streatch cloth so that you can stretch it over the frame and re-adjust it over the years to keep the material taught to prevent the waves... Very good to know! Thank you much :)

jberlyec,
Great thread, I like seeing all your comments and recs. Hope you don't mind another ask for a recommendation.

I'm working on setting up my media room in new house. I'd like to have at least 106" screen and have my AE900. I also want to ceiling mount the projector. The room is 17' long (about 15' wide) and has 8' ceilings. Due to the way its laid out, I need to put the screen right in front of a large window (8' wide), so I think my only option is a retractable screen. I will be getting light blocking cellular blinds for the room so it will be pretty light controlled.

The catch is that right now the budget is a bit tight due to other 'upgrades' to the house that were not originally planned for. So, although my ideal setup would be to get an electic screen mounted in the ceiling I think for now about all I can budget is $300, maybe $400 for a screen.

With those restrictions, any recommendations for a screen?

jberlyec,
Great thread, I like seeing all your comments and recs. Hope you don't mind another ask for a recommendation.
I'm working on setting up my media room in new house. I'd like to have at least 106" screen and have my AE900. I also want to ceiling mount the projector. The room is 17' long (about 15' wide) and has 8' ceilings. Due to the way its laid out, I need to put the screen right in front of a large window (8' wide), so I think my only option is a retractable screen. I will be getting light blocking cellular blinds for the room so it will be pretty light controlled.
The catch is that right now the budget is a bit tight due to other 'upgrades' to the house that were not originally planned for. So, although my ideal setup would be to get an electic screen mounted in the ceiling I think for now about all I can budget is $300, maybe $400 for a screen.
With those restrictions, any recommendations for a screen? Well I haven't dug into pricing all that much yet, so I don't know for sure, but I think most all manual pulldowns are right in or near your budget. DaLite might be too expensive, but just in case it isn't you should look into the HCMW. It has nice whites and blacks :)

On another note...

I've brought the Carada CCW material back into the testing. It's kind of an off-white color that slightly improves the black levels compared to my wall. It also has very acceptable whites :)

Well I haven't dug into pricing all that much yet, so I don't know for sure, but I think most all manual pulldowns are right in or near your budget. DaLite might be too expensive, but just in case it isn't you should look into the HCMW. It has nice whites and blacks :)

Thanks. Looks like Buy.Com offers a 106" HCMW for only $174 but its out of stock. Hopefully it come back in soon and I can also use the Google Check out $20 discount on it.

Thanks. Looks like Buy.Com offers a 106" HCMW for only $174 but its out of stock. Hopefully it come back in soon and I can also use the Google Check out $20 discount on it.

I'd got with a more customer friendly reseller. I personally would recommend Visual Apex. www.visualapex.com I've done all my business with them in terms of my projector and screens.

I too would recommend the HCMW any day of the week, http://www.visualapex.com/accessories/accessory_details.asp?chPartNumber=93166&MFR=Da-Lite&Type=Screens

however the black levels aren't where I want them to be so its not a choice for me. Based off of this thread I too started contacting manufactures and getting samples, its really interesting comparing all the different materials, and seeing how they vary.

- Josh

hi i am finally going to pull the trigger on a hd1000u and i want to get a 135 inch screen. it needs to be electric and i do want it to be tensioned. by looking at the projection calculator on projector central it will need to be 19.5 feet away from the screen. the room has a 12 feet ceiling. i will be sitting about 18feet back. there is a sliding glass door on the side near the front where the screen will be. the room is open to the kitchen on the other side. with all of the testing you have done what would you suggest to use. one being budget priced and one being cost no option. by everything i have read the elite TE135HC1 might be a good option and that is what i am leaning tward getting. and does any one know a place to get the best price on that screen?
Thank you for any help you can be!!

hi i am finally going to pull the trigger on a hd1000u and i want to get a 135 inch screen. it needs to be electric and i do want it to be tensioned. by looking at the projection calculator on projector central it will need to be 19.5 feet away from the screen. the room has a 12 feet ceiling. i will be sitting about 18feet back. there is a sliding glass door on the side near the front where the screen will be. the room is open to the kitchen on the other side. with all of the testing you have done what would you suggest to use. one being budget priced and one being cost no option. by everything i have read the elite TE135HC1 might be a good option and that is what i am leaning tward getting. and does any one know a place to get the best price on that screen?
Thank you for any help you can be!!

Visualapex (forum sponsor) has always been my first recommendation. Their sales reps actually know that they are talking about which is nice, because you can actually talk the lingo with them, and they know what your talking about, which for me has always been a rarity, plus they bend over backwards for you.

In terms of your setup, I guess its kind of hard to visualize the setup for me but it sounds like you will, even with black out shades might have some substantial ambient light issues, and with that large of a screen and throw distance you might have some issues there.

First with a room that has ambient light issues you'll want to look into a high gain screen, the problem with this is that most high gain screens are retro-reflective and the issue with those is that ceiling mount setups are counter productive to retro-reflective screens.

But in order to retain a good quality image in an ambient lighted room you'll want higher lumens and/or higher gain screen.

The problem with the Elite screen is A.) its not a high gain screen, and B.) the darker gray screen will give you even poorer whites with the ambient light.

Finally its hard for us to recommend a screen for your setup as we (jberylec and myself) are running the Panny 900U which is totally different in terms of numbers to the HD1000U.

- Josh

thank you for your input i will take all i can get

I'd got with a more customer friendly reseller. I personally would recommend Visual Apex. www.visualapex.com I've done all my business with them in terms of my projector and screens.

I too would recommend the HCMW any day of the week, http://www.visualapex.com/accessories/accessory_details.asp?chPartNumber=93166&MFR=Da-Lite&Type=Screens

however the black levels aren't where I want them to be so its not a choice for me. Based off of this thread I too started contacting manufactures and getting samples, its really interesting comparing all the different materials, and seeing how they vary.

- Josh
Thanks for the rec Josh. Unfortunately, the Visual Apex price ends up being about $100 more than Buy.Com (about a 66% increase over the Buy.Com price with Google check-out) due to the shipping charges and the fact I am in WA state and subject to tax. I've purchased from them before with their Seattle pick up options but those arent' available on screens. I went ahead and ordered the screen from Buy.com this evening when it was in stock briefly.

Looked at your pics Josh - nice setup. I think I should start taking some pics of mine as its coming together. Tonight I couldn't stand it any more and went ahead and setup my Paradigm speakers just to get them out of the box :) They sound as good or better than my old house

jberylec,

I came across this thread and see you have an almost exact setup as I do for projector, throw distance and seating distance. I am currently using a Parkland DIY screen but I'm looking of a manual screen that will give me what you are also looking for; better blacks and not crushing the whites. The current location is a temporary location with light color walls and light control. My plan is to build a theater room in the basement.

I tested a few of the the Da Lite and Draper samples but after reading this thread I think maybe I should include some I did think I would like. From what I have tested I was thinking a light gray screen with gain would be a possibility for the AE900U to give better blacks but not crush the whites. I didn't like the HCMW as it crushed the whites too much for my taste.

I was surprise to see in my testing that the Pearlescent and Cinema Vision had more light drop off to the side at the same seating position than Video Spectra. Strange since Da Lite specs on the Video Spectra is a lower viewing angle than the other two. The Pearlescent and Cinema Vision got pretty dark while the Video Spectra didn't. The Video Spectra is an off white and I was leaning towards it out of the samples I have. I also didn't like the sparkles I saw in the other two. So Pearlescent and Cinema Vision were ruled out by my tastes based on light drop off to the side in my seating angles and sparkles. Maybe I should look at some more off white samples.

I don't think the company that sells EluneVision screens supplys samples but I would sure like to see the HD Pro Cinema Gray 1.8 gain and 50 degrees. There was a post on this forum of someone who had this in a fixed frame and the photo with flash didn't look gray, but he said it was a light gray, http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9129426#post9129426 .

Any comments?

On another note...

I've brought the Carada CCW material back into the testing. It's kind of an off-white color that slightly improves the black levels compared to my wall. It also has very acceptable whites :)

Any updates? I am trying to pick a screen for my Mits HD1000. I have the Carada samples and of the three, the CCW is the best. I would like slightly better blacks but I am not sure how to get there. A very light grey screen might work but the Carada grey to too dark for my tastes.

...I didn't like the HCMW as it crushed the whites too much for my taste...

...I don't think the company that sells EluneVision screens supplys samples but I would sure like to see the HD Pro Cinema Gray 1.8 gain and 50 degrees... Are you sure about your thoughts on the HCMW? I think you may be thinking of the HCCV. Because the HCMW is much much lighter than the Cinema Vision and/or the Pearl. Too bad it's only for pull-downs, otherwise it'd be my choice.

I've read many times that the HD Pro Cinema Gray is just a Graywolf with different branding. All the pics I've seen back that up. I eliminated the Graywolf very fast. The viewing angle is the worst I've ever seen! I have wide seating, so there's no way it would work for me. Plus, I dont need that much gain.

Any updates? I am trying to pick a screen for my Mits HD1000. I have the Carada samples and of the three, the CCW is the best. I would like slightly better blacks but I am not sure how to get there. A very light grey screen might work but the Carada grey to too dark for my tastes. The DaLite HCMW is the lightest grey screen there is. But if you want a fixed frame screen that's not an option (unless you build it yourself).

On to the Carada CCW...
It's color is between a white screen and the lightest grey screen out there (HCMW). I'll call it an off-white. Kinda like a glass of milk with only half a spoon of NesQuick mixed in, rather than the usual of 4+ spoon fulls! haha

Anyhow, I'm loving it! In fact I almost pulled the trigger this weekend, even before receiving the many pending samples! However, I talked myself out of it. I just want to make sure to see and test everything I can :D

Good thing I waited, because sitting on the desk at the office this morning was finally the elusive "grey diamond vein magic fabric"! At first glance it looks to be very light grey, and with a tad bit of gain! I'm excited to get it up on the wall with the others tonight! It just might be a contender :)

Are you sure about your thoughts on the HCMW? I think you may be thinking of the HCCV. Because the HCMW is much much lighter than the Cinema Vision and/or the Pearl. Too bad it's only for pull-downs, otherwise it'd be my choice.

I've read many times that the HD Pro Cinema Gray is just a Graywolf with different branding. All the pics I've seen back that up. I eliminated the Graywolf very fast. The viewing angle is the worst I've ever seen! I have wide seating, so there's no way it would work for me. Plus, I dont need that much gain.

Viewing angle probably won't work for me.

The HCMW is darker than the pearl or the Cinema Vision in the samples I have. I'd post a photo if I knew how. If it was lighter I might like it but it grays the whites too much for me. I'd like something a little lighter than what I see in my sample.

Looks like anything in a gain screen is too narrow in angle for my widest seats. 40-45 degrees is too narrow. The pearl and Cinema turn pretty dark on the widest seats. Not useable. At least the when the Video Spectra lost it's gain it looked like the DYI screen and would still be useable even though it was dimmer outside it's gain area. I may not find what I am looking for in a roll up screen and have to pick one on one side or the other of what I want.

You mentioned a grey diamond vein magic fabric screen which is unknow to me. You said it was a very light grey. I may have to keep it in mind for when I can use a fixed screen. Until then I'll have to keep hunting while using my DYI.

Any screen I replace the DYI with is a temporary solution until I can build a home theater room. I am looking to see if I can find something to impove my viewing pleasure, better blacks without crushing the whites, until I have more choices in a fixed screen for a HT room.

I appreciate hearing input on my screen search.

To my eyes the HCMW is by far the lightest shade of grey for off-axis viewing. In other words, the whites are whiter than the others (HCCV, Pearl, HC DaMat) when sitting off to either side.

Anyhow, scratch the diamond vein magic fabric! It looked like a light grey, but ohhh no! Once I got it next to the remaining contenders it was night and day. Very dark! It's eliminated.

jberylec,

I ask for your opinion:

I have an AE700 on a wall mount 6' high and 12' from the 100" screen. The room is fairly well light controlled, but there is some light during the day. I usually watch HD sports so I don't think I need the blackest blacks, but I do need a large viewing angle.

Thanks for your tremendous research!

Sounds like a similar set up. Although I probably have much more ambient light.

Anyhow, what are you projecting onto now? And what are you trying to improve upon? Brightness? Blacks? Viewing angle? Simply put... what do you dislike about your set up now?

Sounds like a similar set up. Although I probably have much more ambient light.

Anyhow, what are you projecting onto now? And what are you trying to improve upon? Brightness? Blacks? Viewing angle? Simply put... what do you dislike about your set up now?

I currently have a home made screen using the budget blackout drapery fabric. Overall it's not too bad (sure beats projecting on the dark red wall) but I really only put it together to test screen sizes. I was hoping to primarily get a little more brightness AND if possible improved contrast (blacks). My thought was that a commercial screen should be able to improve both without sacrificing angle.

If I cant get both, then I will just fancy up the existing screen with a nice black border, make it perfectly square etc.

I currently have a home made screen using the budget blackout drapery fabric. Overall it's not too bad (sure beats projecting on the dark red wall) but I really only put it together to test screen sizes. I was hoping to primarily get a little more brightness AND if possible improved contrast (blacks). My thought was that a commercial screen should be able to improve both without sacrificing angle.

If I cant get both, then I will just fancy up the existing screen with a nice black border, make it perfectly square etc. Well, I know how popular JoAnns black out curtain cloth is, but unfortunetly I've never seen it. If I recall correctly it doesnt have any gain at all right? And maybe even has a little bit of negative gain. :confused:

I suggest you contact Carada and get a sample of their CCW. Tape it up to your cloth and view it from all angles for a few days, see what you think. I'm guessing it will be brighter, but I dont know about the contrast because like I said I haven't seen what shade of color the cloth is. Check it out though, it's a free sample, cant hurt :)

I think I've made my decision, Carada CCW. Unless something crazy comes along in the next few weeks while I'm saving up the $$ :D

I'm working on getting another sample of the Carada CCW (mine is wrinkled from all the moving around and double sided tape). If/When I receive it, I'll be posting more comparison pics :)

I'm excited. Getting really close to the final decision! It'll be very nice finally having a velvet fixed frame screen hanging on the wall! :D

It's really come down to just the CV or the CCW. I just have to decide if I want slightly better blacks, or slightly better whites.... hmmm.... :confused:

I'm looking at the HCMW and the Elite HCG. Using the 900 with throw distance somewhere from 13-18 feet on a 106" screen. Room is light controlled due to light blocking shades, but because of a window, I'll need to use a pull down screen. I'll be watching movies 80%.

I'm temporarily projecting on a tan wall. Still looks great with AR bars not too light and color good. Of course I may not be as discerning as some.

Any other thoughts about these two screens (Dalite HCMW and Elite HCG) with my setup?

Thanks for the help. I've really enjoyed following jberylec's quest for the ultimate screen! You are amazingly thorough! :)

Wow, my wife thinks I obsess about stuff..what till I show her your thread! :)

Wow, my wife thinks I obsess about stuff..wait till I show her your thread! :) LOL :D So, if you're already happy with your black levels then you don't need to go with something as dark as the Elite HCG.

Out of those two options I'd think the pull-down HCMW would be a better choice, it's a lighter shade of grey. But still probably darker than your tan wall. Wouldn't hurt to get samples and compare :)

Out of those two options I'd think the pull-down HCMW would be a better choice, it's a lighter shade of grey. But still probably darker than your tan wall. Wouldn't hurt to get samples and compare :)

Samples of both should be here soon and I'll definitely do some testing. Just wanted to get some sage advice from the 'Screen Oracle'. :)

Got a high-power sample as well just for comparison purposes. But from reading your posts and some others I'm not feeling like that will work.

Good luck with choosing btw the CV and CCW...I'll be looking for the pictures to be posted when you finally pull the trigger. I've heard only good things about Carada and I'll be considering them if I ever need a fixed frame. Thanks!!

You could always black out that window and come up with a clever way to mount a fixed frame Carada! Maybe if you contact them they might just have some ideas or solutions for that :)

The fixed frames add so much to the look of the theater. Like a huge plasma hanging on the wall :D

I'm lovin' the CCW!

Another CCW sample is on the way. This time I'm not going to use the double sided tape method. Instead, I'm going to build/buy some type of small mock-up frame and tension the material, then hang it like a picture :)

This decision is getting rough. I really wish Carada had a "High Contrast CCW" that would be slightly more greyish than the CCW. Or DaLite having something that was a couple shades lighter than the CV. Either that or some other manufacturer with the "perfect" shade of very light grey. I don't think it exists. Yet.

Anyhow, I'm still leaning more towards the CCW. Can't wait to get a new sample. I'll keep everyone posted :)

For screens that are pull down only (like the HCMW), have you thought about making your own fixed frame and just buying the screen material or cutting it out of a pull down?

BTW awesome thread, thanks for sharing.

For screens that are pull down only (like the HCMW), have you thought about making your own fixed frame and just buying the screen material or cutting it out of a pull down?

BTW awesome thread, thanks for sharing. Yes I've thought of that. But if I was going to build a frame, I'd just go with a WilsonArt Laminate. Much much cheaper, just as good of image quality, and best of all - VERY durable! It'll last forever.

but the laminates have zero ambient light tolerance.

but the laminates have zero ambient light tolerance. Actually, I think you can overcome some ambient light with laminates like the grey or platinum colors simply because the base color is darker. The WilsonArt samples always had better contrast than my white wall with all the lights on (or off for that matter). They just didnt have a bright enough image over all for my liking. I might actually look into some other laminate colors before this is all over :)

I have started a test on nine different samples for my HT use.

Right now "Cloud" appears to offer a nice split between Designer White and Fashion Grey. I will do more thorough testing after Christmas break. See initial screenshots at:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=772920

-Paul

Good luck on your search :) This testing is fun, but gets a little frustrating. LOL

The decision has been made!! The screen has been ordered!

A brand spankin' new Carada 16:9 Criterion 118" CCW (http://www.carada.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=PROJECTION-SCREEN-H118C) is on it's way home! (My Home!) :D

I chose the CCW because it improves blacks just enough while not affecting whites too much. I chose the Criterion because I love the large borders and beveled edge, this gives the eye a better conceived contrast ratio. I chose the large 118" size to plan ahead for moving out of the apartment and into a larger family room or dedicated entertainment room. I chose Carada because of their EXCELLENT customer service! They can't be beat.

I settled on a very light grey / off-white screen material relying on the fact that projectors will always get better, in regards to both lumens and contrast. The key here is that this screen material is perfect for my current projector and will STILL be perfect for any future projector with more lumens and better contrast. I should be set for a really long time!

Stay tuned for install photos & notes :D

Pics & and install write-up coming soon!
Meanwhile, I'm dealing with vertical banding from my 900U! :eek:

I thought this PJ wasn't supposed to have this problem! Well, anyhow, I'll be working with warranty to get it repaired/replaced.

Then waiting for a 1080p 2000 Lumen PJ to be released :D

How is it going with your Carada CCW? I'll be placing an order for my screen in the next few weeks (using an AE900), and I'm anxious to hear your thoughts on after having lived with the CCW for a month.

Well to be honest I was only able to watch the screen a few times before my AE900U developed severe vertical banding. I had to send it in for warranty repair/replacement.

I got the run around for a while, 'vb is normal' blah blah, but finally they agreed to replace the optical block, or replace the unit if that doesn't fix it.

I've been with out the projector for a month, ridiculous! But anyhow, the screen is perfect, I love it. at this point I wouldn't change my decision at all.

I'll definitely post back more details as soon as I get the pj back (which better be soon!) Supposedly they're having trouble finding parts or a replacement unit. At this point they should offer me a free upgrade to the AX100!

All of this just months into ownership. Sad.

jberylec, great thread. don't know if you can help me, i just bought a PLV-Z5, rated at 1100 lumens. I'm going to project a 92" screen at a distance of about 16 feet, although I am contemplating doing a ceiling mount, around 10-11 ft if i need to. do you think the Elite HCG would be too dark for this set up? i have light tan colored walls and white ceilings, and i am a bit concerned about light reflection off the walls and ceilings washing out the blacks if I go with an Elite Matte White screen (i'm considering Elite since they seem to be the only ones that make a budget tensioned screen). i know you mentioned with a smaller screen the low rated lumens shouldn't be a problem. any suggestions would be great, thanks!

great thread!
i'm in the same boat as stickyman... i just ordered the Elite Cinetension Matte White 120" screen for my ax100u.
any thoughts on this screen? 19' throw, light controlled room, 15-17' seating.
thanks!

jberylec-
Glad to hear you are enjoying your CCW. Very sorry to hear about the VB issues and I hope you get the PJ back soon. After testing a few screens based on your results, I finally settled on the Dalite HCMW - pulldown 106". I'm lovin' it.

Thanks and be sure to post some pics when you get the pj and screen back together.

Also looking to purchase screen sometime soon. What I have now is a Panny 900 in a light controlled room that is 12' x 21' - projecting on the 12' section. Throw dist 15' (could change), Seating dist 13' to 18'. Currently testing what screen size I want to stick with. Viewing angle not really an issue I think? I am projecting on the wall painted off-white. I want the best picture I can get. Do I need to sacrifice whites for blacks with my setup?

Thanks for your opinion.

Tim

i'm also considering Da-Lite HCMW to go with my Epson TW700

light is not controlled daytime but have shades to cover and it almost totally black at night.
throw will be 15 ft and seating is 11ft and thinking on 92'' screen. so is it a go?

Epson TW700
92'' Da-Lite HCMW
throw 15ft
seating 11ft
light moderately controlled

jberylec, great thread. don't know if you can help me, i just bought a PLV-Z5, rated at 1100 lumens. I'm going to project a 92" screen at a distance of about 16 feet, although I am contemplating doing a ceiling mount, around 10-11 ft if i need to. do you think the Elite HCG would be too dark for this set up? i have light tan colored walls and white ceilings, and i am a bit concerned about light reflection off the walls and ceilings washing out the blacks if I go with an Elite Matte White screen (i'm considering Elite since they seem to be the only ones that make a budget tensioned screen). i know you mentioned with a smaller screen the low rated lumens shouldn't be a problem. any suggestions would be great, thanks! I think that should work, especially if you use the ceiling mount idea at 10ft rather than the 16ft. The Elite HCG is pretty dark though, 1100 lumen pj might have a hard time giving you a bright image. Keeping it to 92" helps :)

great thread!
i'm in the same boat as stickyman... i just ordered the Elite Cinetension Matte White 120" screen for my ax100u.
any thoughts on this screen? 19' throw, light controlled room, 15-17' seating.
thanks! That should be a nice image! Bright! :) That screen material has a slight blue push in bright white scenes, so you'll want to adjust for that.

jberylec- Glad to hear you are enjoying your CCW. Very sorry to hear about the VB issues and I hope you get the PJ back soon. After testing a few screens based on your results, I finally settled on the Dalite HCMW - pulldown 106". I'm lovin' it.
Thanks and be sure to post some pics when you get the pj and screen back together. Glad I could help :D

Also looking to purchase screen sometime soon. What I have now is a Panny 900 in a light controlled room that is 12' x 21' - projecting on the 12' section. Throw dist 15' (could change), Seating dist 13' to 18'. Currently testing what screen size I want to stick with. Viewing angle not really an issue I think? I am projecting on the wall painted off-white. I want the best picture I can get. Do I need to sacrifice whites for blacks with my setup?
Thanks for your opinion.
Tim Yes, you'll have to sacrifice one for the other. How's your light control? That'll decipher how much you'll have to sacrifice :) That's the battle I had going on. So I settled for the best compromise: Carada CCW

i'm also considering Da-Lite HCMW to go with my Epson TW700
light is not controlled daytime but have shades to cover and it almost totally black at night. throw will be 15 ft and seating is 11ft and thinking on 92'' screen. so is it a go? Sounds like a good set up, however I dont know the specs on that pj. If it's less than 2000 lumens, then keep the throw as short as you can, and the screen size small as well. 92" should be nice for that throw and seating distance.

jberylec, thanks for your input. i've decided i not to go with a ceiling mount at 10 feet... too much work involved in getting an outlet installed on the ceiling, and it's pretty hard to cover it back up later on since the ceiling has that stucco(?, it's that bumpy stuff) white paint, potential homebuyers may cringe at that when i decide to sell my place.... , from the sounds of it, i'll need to go with the matte white instead since you've noted that the HCG is pretty dark, and it doesn't sound like the Z5 has enough lumens at 16 ft throw distance.

jberylec, thanks for your input. i've decided i not to go with a ceiling mount at 10 feet... too much work involved in getting an outlet installed on the ceiling, and it's pretty hard to cover it back up later on since the ceiling has that stucco(?, it's that bumpy stuff) white paint, potential homebuyers may cringe at that when i decide to sell my place.... , from the sounds of it, i'll need to go with the matte white instead since you've noted that the HCG is pretty dark, and it doesn't sound like the Z5 has enough lumens at 16 ft throw distance. But I think if you stick to 92"-96" and only watch in total darkness (so the image will seem brighter) then you might be ok with the HCG.

On the other hand, you can go with a larger size or longer throw if you choose the matte white because it'll be much brighter, but you'll still want to watch in total darkness because the black levels will suffer from ambient light.

That's why I was on such a mission to find something right in the middle that would allow a large screen size, be bright enough for some daytime viewing, and all while still upholding decent black levels. Gotta love the CCW :D

I am working on installing a wall at the back of the room and this will enclose it, so the final product I will not have to worry about ambient light at all.

But I think if you stick to 92"-96" and only watch in total darkness (so the image will seem brighter) then you might be ok with the HCG.

On the other hand, you can go with a larger size or longer throw if you choose the matte white because it'll be much brighter, but you'll still want to watch in total darkness because the black levels will suffer from ambient light.

That's why I was on such a mission to find something right in the middle that would allow a large screen size, be bright enough for some daytime viewing, and all while still upholding decent black levels. Gotta love the CCW :D


jberylec, i got a couple of screen samples from elite, they're quite small... so it's pretty hard to determine which would be the better choice.... although i can see the gray does provide better blacks... but i also found that it dulls the colors... so definately a tough decision...

Wow, so much info it's hard to decipher whats right for me. So could you please tell me what your pick would be for this setup.

Panny AE900U
Throw distance 15'
The room is painted eggshell black, It will have almost total light control.
I want a 110" fixed screen
The seating area will be just as wide as the screen, but the entrance is off the side of the screen and I would like decent PQ for the occasional visitor.

I have had the projector mounted in a different room for about 6 months while I finish the theater room. I have it projecting on a DIY 70" screen. Silver screen paint on MDF. While I like the texture and whites. The black levels are bad even in complete darkness. So I definitely want a better screen when it comes to black levels.

Thanks.

Wow, so much info it's hard to decipher whats right for me. So could you please tell me what your pick would be for this setup.

Panny AE900U
Throw distance 15'
The room is painted eggshell black, It will have almost total light control.
I want a 110" fixed screen
The seating area will be just as wide as the screen, but the entrance is off the side of the screen and I would like decent PQ for the occasional visitor.

I have had the projector mounted in a different room for about 6 months while I finish the theater room. I have it projecting on a DIY 70" screen. Silver screen paint on MDF. While I like the texture and whites. The black levels are bad even in complete darkness. So I definitely want a better screen when it comes to black levels.

Thanks. Sounds like you definately want an off-white or grey screen then. Most the greys are too dark for this projector in my opinion. If I had to choose a grey screen it would be the Cinema Vision. But like I keep saying, the off-white CCW is pretty much the best 'meet-in-the-middle' there is out there, because the white screens dont have good enough black levels, and the grey screens dont have bright whites.

Dont get me wrong, the CCW is in fact a white screen, but it's just a tad greyish... just enough to give better black levels as opposed to some of the bright white screens out there.

This is all in my opinion, and only based on my environment though ;)

jberylec,
your thread is so informative!!! thank you.

i just recieved word from elite that they are replacing my newly recieved defective screen (2" cut in the material and dimensions off by a few inches) with the newer version TE120HW2. this is supposed to replace the ~HW1. not sure how the newer version differs from the previous.

this is the 120" matte white cinetension.

has anyone seen this newer version of the screen? any comments on it? how does it differ from the previous version (TE120HW1)?

Wow, so much info it's hard to decipher whats right for me. So could you please tell me what your pick would be for this setup.

Panny AE900U
Throw distance 15'
The room is painted eggshell black, It will have almost total light control.
I want a 110" fixed screen
The seating area will be just as wide as the screen, but the entrance is off the side of the screen and I would like decent PQ for the occasional visitor.

I have had the projector mounted in a different room for about 6 months while I finish the theater room. I have it projecting on a DIY 70" screen. Silver screen paint on MDF. While I like the texture and whites. The black levels are bad even in complete darkness. So I definitely want a better screen when it comes to black levels.

Thanks.

Will your PJ be ceiling mounted? On a shelf?

i also would like to know whats is different about the newer elites...

Frances at Elite wrote me an email regarding the newer TE120HW2...

"The TE120HW2 is no difference in size or screen material than the TE120HW1, it is just newer."

i guess there is no difference. hopefully the HW2 will come as the correct size and be of high quality.

i'll post after recieving from them.

i read some where on these forums that the newer elite screen is a little lighter grey because the older one was way too dark in color... dont remeber where i read it, probably in the elite thread....

Will your PJ be ceiling mounted? On a shelf?

Right now, in it's temporary setup it's ceiling mounted. But when it's installed in the theater it will sit on shelf in a room behind the backwall. Projecting through some optical glass in the wall.

Sounds like you definately want an off-white or grey screen then. Most the greys are too dark for this projector in my opinion. If I had to choose a grey screen it would be the Cinema Vision. But like I keep saying, the off-white CCW is pretty much the best 'meet-in-the-middle' there is out there, because the white screens dont have good enough black levels, and the grey screens dont have bright whites.

Dont get me wrong, the CCW is in fact a white screen, but it's just a tad greyish... just enough to give better black levels as opposed to some of the bright white screens out there.

This is all in my opinion, and only based on my environment though ;)

Thanks for the suggestion jberylec. I think I will pull the trigger on the Carada CCW. Once I get over how much more I will be spending compared to the DIY screen I did.

Right now, in it's temporary setup it's ceiling mounted. But when it's installed in the theater it will sit on shelf in a room behind the backwall. Projecting through some optical glass in the wall.

I went with the Da-Lite High Power and my configuration is very similair to yours. Read up all you can on the postive results people are getting with High Power. Please check out http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=773065

But I think if you stick to 92"-96" and only watch in total darkness (so the image will seem brighter) then you might be ok with the HCG.

On the other hand, you can go with a larger size or longer throw if you choose the matte white because it'll be much brighter, but you'll still want to watch in total darkness because the black levels will suffer from ambient light.

That's why I was on such a mission to find something right in the middle that would allow a large screen size, be bright enough for some daytime viewing, and all while still upholding decent black levels. Gotta love the CCW :D

hi jberylec, i ended up with the hcg... i find the colours a bit muted... but i can't tell if it's the material i'm watching (watched miami vice... i personally thought it was a horrible movie...)... i haven't had a chance to run DVE and get my projector calibrated to the screen... otherwise i'm fine with the brightness... we watch mostly in the dark... and it's more than bright enough... and when we have some lights on we run the projector in dynamic or vivid mode.. (colours are off and over saturated, but the lights wash out the colours.. so it actually works quite well). i'm sure the matte white would have had punchier colours... but i'm happy overall with the hcg.... sure beats watching movies on my tan coloured walls....

hi jberylec, i ended up with the hcg... i find the colours a bit muted... but i can't tell if it's the material i'm watching (watched miami vice... i personally thought it was a horrible movie...)... i haven't had a chance to run DVE and get my projector calibrated to the screen... otherwise i'm fine with the brightness... we watch mostly in the dark... and it's more than bright enough... and when we have some lights on we run the projector in dynamic or vivid mode.. (colours are off and over saturated, but the lights wash out the colours.. so it actually works quite well). i'm sure the matte white would have had punchier colours... but i'm happy overall with the hcg.... sure beats watching movies on my tan coloured walls.... Cool. Thanks for checking back in :) It's nice hearing others thoughts on screens too. I love this hobby :D

did anyone get the elite matt white yet? i am curious on there opinions. i know i want to get the mitsubishi hd1000 but i still cant figure out if i want hcg or mw cinetension. did you try watching any bright movies? did you calibrate yet? did it make a difference with the muted colors? i am coming from a dalite hp and still would like puchy colors...

david,
i have the matte white in my dedicated HT room. i have tan walls and a white ceiling. the PQ is amazing out of the box with my ax100u. i couldn't be happier. the blacks are acceptable for me watching SD movies thru my oppo 970. colors are punchy and bright.
i had to return the first screen tho (cinetension 120" matte white) because the screen had a tear in it upon arrival. it also didn't measure the correct dimensions vertically and horizontally. still waiting to recieve the updated one.

The Elite Matte White has a noticeable blush push, meaning bright white colors have a baby-blue glow to them, so you'll want to calibrate for that.

But other than that, I thought it was an ok screen :) Perfect for budgets

The replacement projector finally came!

Woohoo! I'll be watching Idol tonight on 118" instead of the 27" TV I've been having to use!

:D

Congrats on the replacement!! Let us know how the CCW treats you...especially since my 104" CCW will be arriving on Friday. It'll paired w/my AE900. That decision was made based on what I read on this thread, and from what I saw after looking at many samples myself. I can't wait.

Congrats! I should be getting my SMX screen material today, I am using Goo System now and am hoping for more lumens. I also have an AE900.

Thanks :) I no longer have a 900U, they had to give me a AX100. Which should be ok, but the only thing I dont like is that it doesn't have the 2nd component input.

So on my lunch break I ran home to hook it up and see at least the blue screen and test pattern (didn't have time to plug in all the goodies).

Looks a lot brighter than the 900U. But I have an issue already! There is what looks like a smudge or dust spot on the right hand edge of the image. I cleaned the lens, no help :(

Must be inside, damn! Any suggestions?

how does the hcg do with an all white screen, does it also push blue?
how about posting some pics guys of the hcg and htw elites screens...

how does the hcg do with an all white screen, does it also push blue?
how about posting some pics guys of the hcg and htw elites screens... If I remember correctly, I liked the colors of the hcg, but it just wasn't bright enough with the 900u in my environment.

So just to add to everything I broke down and bought the Elite HCG 106" screen from Visual Apex, it arrived Thursday last week, spent the weekend putting it up, and re-calibrating my projector, and I have to say I am extremely happy with the results.

Not sure I am as "picky" as jberylec is ;) but for the money its a great upgrade over the 106" Optoma GWI screen I was running before.

I'm also running the 900U, throw distance is about 10 feet, seating is the same (projector is ceiling mounted just above the seating area see signature for pics)

Anyways if you have a shorter throw distance like I do, the HCG screen has some clean (or what I think is clean) whites, and absolutely stunning colors. Now I am not an expert here by any means but for what I have even my wife noticed a huge difference which is as many of you know is the hardest person to actually get notice things like that, if a non-techy person like my wife can actually see a difference and comment that it looks a lot better than I am happy.

- Josh

I had some discussions a while ago here on screen choices. I went with the Da-Lite Cinema Vision in a 92" roll up with the tensioning rod. I choose it after looking at a number of samples in the area I am currently using the Panasonic 900u. Looks good with nice whites and the blacks are better than I thought they would be. The slight gain is good since I am currently using it in a room with light walls.

I have notice one problem with the roll up screen in this size. Seems to be prone to bending of the roller in shipping. I am now waiting for my 5th screen to be shipped from Da-Lite. Problem is angled V shaped waves on the end or ends of the screen. Da-Lite says they are from the roller getting slightly bent, most likely from a hard drop in shipping. I got the model B. Maybe the model C wouldn't have been as easily bent as the model B since I believe it has a larger roller.

I have made my decision with Carada CCW while reading this thread. My theater is completely light controlled, with the CCW I run my PJ WD2000U on low setting and its still too bright for my taste, I would say twice brighter than the real movie theater. My screen size is 136" 235:1. I just ordered a carada HCG material and will run the PJ a little brighter. I had 3 samples from carada before and I cant tell by just looking at them. What's makes me order the HCG is that when I painted my theater with a flat maroon color the PJ still puts out a bright image. I think the wd2000u is advertised at 3000 lumens and with the carada CCW its hard to bring the setting low enough so I cant see the screen in total darkness, what I mean by this is that when your PJ is on without a video feed you can still see the screen no matter how dark your room is because the light that emits from a projector is bright enough for a white screen. The carada HCG will solve this problem and gives me a more theater like experience...

Thanks for jberylec for an intensive review..

Great thread. Before reading this thread, I would have said the Draper HCG was the best material, now I am unsure. My situation: family room is 13 foot wide, 25 plus long, seating 12-15 feet from screen (14 prime positions). One long wall is floor to ceiling windows, with light filtering shades (WAF would allow light blocking). So room has lots of light. I will have a LCD on the wall, and screen will drop down over it. Critical movie watching will be at night, but I would like to be able to see for SuperBowl, kids afternoon movies etc.. during the day. Planning on 106" screen size (electric, tensioned control) and either the Epson 1080p or the Panny 1080p (wife prefers white since it will be mounted on the ceiling). Draper or Da-Lite fits budget better than Stewart, and had been planning on the Access Series V in High Contrast Grey, but the posts have me second guessing. Admittedly, I am new to this. Any advice you gurus can offer will be appreciated.

The best advice is to get some samples! :-)
They all give out free sample packs, you can't go wrong getting as many as possible ;)

But for what it's worth, I found that most high contrast grey screen materials are too dark for projectors rated less than 2000 lumens in (especially in living room set ups). And even now that I have the 2000 lumen Panny, I dont even think it'd be bright enough for those screens (in my environment anyhow)

The samples will help you big time :D

High contrast Grey is my choice for your situation, 106" is good enough for the projector you choose..This really comes down to your taste, samples are nice to have. Different people have different taste, some like it very bright some dont..When I contacted carada they recommend brilliant White for my room situation but I am certain that this is not my choice, I prefer blacker blacks...

After a year with my CCW on both the AE900 and the AX100, I couldn't be happier! Same with my viewers :-D

I'm still working on upgrading some audio stuff, and about to buy a Samsung Duo HD player! :) Working on putting some pics together of the finished room!...

I have samples from Carada of their HCG, CCW and BW material. I'm attracted to the Carad screens for their lack of visible screen structure, excellent uniformity and lack of hot-spotting.

(BTW jberylec, I notice in your earlier posts that you thought the Carada BW material would likely hotspot given it has gain. However, it has been reported subjectively and measured objectively to be among the most uniform screens you can buy, of any type.
In my case, living with the virtually perfect image uniformity of a plasma for over 5 years has made me quite picky about a uniform image from varying viewing angles).

I've used some borrowed projectors (e.g. Panasonic AE700, new Sony LCD projector) to play around with, including look at the screen samples. Right now my room has light carpet, light walls, light ceiling. In that environment, with the projectors I used, the HCG had wonderful black levels but sacrificed too much in image brightness.

The Brilliant White material dazzled with it's brightness and punch, but elevated the black levels more than I would like. The CCW sample seemed to be a really nice in between, maintaining decent black levels while still having some "pop" in the brighter areas. So I was pretty sure I'd go with the CCW.

However...I am planning on substantially changing the decor of the room: dark ceiling, dark carpet, dark walls, full light control. Also, I plan on using the new JVC RS2 projector which has industry leading black levels. And it's a bit dimmer than the previous RS1 model I'd been looking at. I also want to have a large screen image.

So I'm thinking some extra gain could be beneficial and I might roll the dice and go with the Brilliant White material. Hopefully
my set up will allow me to still get very good black levels while benefiting from the extra gain of the BW material. I also base this off the fact that many of the pro reviews (and some user reports) lauding the black levels of the RS1 and RS2 are done using the Stewart Studiotek 130 screen, which has a very similar gain to the Carada BW. So I figure if people are raving about the black levels while using a Studiotek, I should get much the same performance from the Brilliant white, with good light control.

Yeah I loved the brightness of the BW!! But I have no chance with darkening my room (WAF). It sounds like you've got a perfect plan, and it should work out nicely for ya ;-) Post back some results...