Mark, I ask you this please, because nobody is going to give me an answer to a simple question, so you are my last chance to know.
As I see a lot of programs coming from my dish, and these programs are mainly in 4:3 aspect ratio, (in Europe so far, in America I don't know), I need to know what happens to a 4:3 signal.
Because people I know told me their projectors, (for instance the Sharp 21000), are not able to show 4:3 images in their native aspect by HDMI.
The vp "streches" those images in a compulsory 16:9 format with the zoom.
I don't know if this is true or not, what do you think about the HD1?
Would you ask this please, to the JVC staff when at CES?

thank you
Francis

Hi Francis, you should be able to set your Dish STB such that it uses pillarboxes (fills in the sides of a 16x9 with the 4x3 image centered). The HD1/RS1 may do this also, but this is something that source boxes should be doing - although many don't, particularly DVD players. I'll ask JVC at CES although you should pm Jason and ask him to check this in his review because you'll get an answer faster (how's that for passing the buck - sorry Jason! lol).

Projector Central updated their review of the Panny & noted that the SmoothScreen Technology wasn't an issue with the production model. I'm lookinn forward to some more head to head comparisons with the RS1 .. since the Panny seemed to beat out the Pearl according to ProjectorCentral.. I'm going to run a DVDO IScan VP50 anyway ... thus I'm questioning if I will even notice much of a difference .. however 15,000/1 sounds like it is worth waiting for.. I do like the fact that the Panny is reported as being the quieter of the two..
Tom,

To be quite honest, a large percentage of folks around here don't have much faith in Projector Central or their reviews. You seem to be a little too quick in dismissing some very knowledgable posters that are trying to give you some helpful advice. You are new here so it's forgivable but Projector Central is not the Gospel. They are not the be all /end all of review sites or pj info available. Take everything you read with the required grains of salt and do a lot of research. You'll make wiser decisions regarding your gear and be better off in the long run.

Tom,

To be quite honest, a large percentage of folks around here don't have much faith in Projector Central or their reviews. You seem to be a little too quick in dismissing some very knowledgable posters that are trying to give you some helpful advice. You are new here so it's forgivable but Projector Central is not the Gospel. They are not the be all /end all of review sites or pj info available. Take everything you read with the required grains of salt and do a lot of research. You'll make wiser decisions regarding your gear and be better off in the long run.

I am definitely going to have to agree with this post.

If anything, you were, let's say, a little more "politically correct" than I would have been. ;)

If anything, you were, let's say, a little more "politically correct" than I would have been. ;)

....and more patient than I was when replying... :o .

Tom,

To be quite honest, a large percentage of folks around here don't have much faith in Projector Central or their reviews. You seem to be a little too quick in dismissing some very knowledgable posters that are trying to give you some helpful advice. You are new here so it's forgivable but Projector Central is not the Gospel. They are not the be all /end all of review sites or pj info available. Take everything you read with the required grains of salt and do a lot of research. You'll make wiser decisions regarding your gear and be better off in the long run.


Who have I dismissed? 95% of the posters haven't seen the RS1 or the Panny. Why the distain for whoever does the reviews for projector central? R U saying that person doesn't know diddly doo? Just curious. I welcome all input ... I just question someone who makes broad claims like "blowing away" all other Pjs .... when they haven't even seen it yet. Sounds like a JVC rep talking to me. This is also the RS1 thread ..... I'm sure those discussing the Panny on another thread are more pro Panny.

Why the distain for whoever does the reviews for projector central? R U saying that person doesn't know diddly doo?
No distain. Just recognition that "that person" hasn't seen the JVC yet.

I just question someone who makes broad claims like "blowing away" all other Pjs .... when they haven't even seen it yet.
But... but... they HAVE seen it.

Who have I dismissed? 95% of the posters haven't seen the RS1 or the Panny. Why the distain for whoever does the reviews for projector central? R U saying that person doesn't know diddly doo? Just curious. I welcome all input ... I just question someone who makes broad claims like "blowing away" all other Pjs .... when they haven't even seen it yet. Sounds like a JVC rep talking to me. This is also the RS1 thread ..... I'm sure those discussing the Panny on another thread are more pro Panny.

You aren't making any sense. You are the one who keeps quoting Projector Central and their review of the Panny. Have they seen the JVC RS1?

As stated, people in this thread have seen the JVC. If you think you are being fed a bunch of marketing hype ("Sounds like a JVC rep talking to me"), why don't you just stay with what you have read at PJ Central and buy the Panny. It just doesn't sound like you really need or want anyones opinion here.

http://autopia.org/forum/images/smilies/nixweiss.gif

Tom,

To be quite honest, a large percentage of folks around here don't have much faith in Projector Central or their reviews. You seem to be a little too quick in dismissing some very knowledgable posters that are trying to give you some helpful advice. You are new here so it's forgivable but Projector Central is not the Gospel. They are not the be all /end all of review sites or pj info available. Take everything you read with the required grains of salt and do a lot of research. You'll make wiser decisions regarding your gear and be better off in the long run.

here here!

6 posts total, all of them pushing the Panny. Sales must be really slow.

And you're acusing these guys of being JVC reps ? :rolleyes:

6 posts total, all of them pushing the Panny. Sales must be really slow.

And you're acusing these guys of being JVC reps ? :rolleyes:

http://autopia.org/forum/images/smilies/werd.gif

Here is the list which is a mix of questions for Tom as well as my own observations of the RS1 that people asked me to make.



2.35:1 CH Stretch - The RS1 currently doesn't do this, but this is one feature that JVC wants to add before the product ships.




I am currently about a year away from finishing building my new home which will have a dedicated home theatre.

My question is if the RS1 will do the 2:35 stretch, will it still require an anamorphic lens?

Thanks, Eric.

I am currently about a year away from finishing building my new home which will have a dedicated home theatre.

My question is if the RS1 will do the 2:35 stretch, will it still require an anamorphic lens?

Thanks, Eric.


If you want full panel brightness, a lens will be required. Though, I still hope they can add the vertical stretch in their firmware... else it's dealkiller for me.

Who have I dismissed? 95% of the posters haven't seen the RS1 or the Panny. Why the distain for whoever does the reviews for projector central? R U saying that person doesn't know diddly doo? Just curious. I welcome all input ... I just question someone who makes broad claims like "blowing away" all other Pjs .... when they haven't even seen it yet. Sounds like a JVC rep talking to me. This is also the RS1 thread ..... I'm sure those discussing the Panny on another thread are more pro Panny.
Dude, what's your problem? You just joined the forum and come into this thread asking questions and when people take the time to give you an answer you dismiss them and continue regurgitating what you read at Projector Central about the Panny after people have pointed out the flaws of that site to you. That's just rude. Here's some advice, "Go buy the Panny".

In the future, You might show a little deference and have some respect towards those whose knowledge you seek to acquire. But honestly, with the attitude you have, I'd really be surprised if anybody here answers any more of your questions.

6 posts total, all of them pushing the Panny. Sales must be really slow.

And you're acusing these guys of being JVC reps ? :rolleyes:


How am I pushing it? I originally posted a question regarding how it would stack up to the RS1 since I read a favorable review at projector central. All the feedback I have gotten just dismisses their opinion. I was just curious why? I understand they havn't seen the RS1 .. but they seem to claim it beat out the Pearl and others .. which someone dismissed because Sony didn't give them a good unit. I've never seen either.. so don't personally know squat. I was just deciding between these two units simply because I want & need the horizontal lens shift.

I understand those who are awaiting there RS1 don't want any smack talk about their pj that is on its way.. fine. I guess I'll wait for Jason's review... since he seems to give an honest opinion across the board. Thus I appologize for questioning its greatness.

[QUOTE=smithfarmer]Dude, what's your problem? You just joined the forum and come into this thread asking questions and when people take the time to give you an answer you dismiss them and continue regurgitating what you read at Projector Central about the Panny after people have pointed out the flaws of that site to you. That's just rude. Here's some advice, "Go buy the Panny".

WHAT FLAWS?? No one has answered that? I also havn't regurgitated anything.. rather, just stated that they gave a favorable review... Can you point me to some negative review?

OK, am I imagining it and thinking actually of another link or did this one below not used to have an "Images" or similar option on the left column with a really hi resolution blowup of the small picture shown here? Does anyone have a link to "the" or "a" hi rez photo? Or others maybe we haven't seen if they're around on some other link? Black only of course..... :)

http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/features.jsp?model_id=MDL101681&feature_id=01

OK, am I imagining it and thinking actually of another link or did this one below not used to have an "Images" or similar option on the left column with a really hi resolution blowup of the small picture shown here? Does anyone have a link to "the" or "a" hi rez photo? Or others maybe we haven't seen if they're around on some other link? Black only of course..... :)

http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/features.jsp?model_id=MDL101681&feature_id=01

http://pro.jvc.com/pro/attributes/PRESENT/photos/general/dlars1.jpg

I have this as my desktop. :D Enjoy.

OK, am I imagining it and thinking actually of another link or did this one below not used to have an "Images" or similar option on the left column with a really hi resolution blowup of the small picture shown here? Does anyone have a link to "the" or "a" hi rez photo? Or others maybe we haven't seen if they're around on some other link? Black only of course..... :)

http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/features.jsp?model_id=MDL101681&feature_id=01
It's not your imagination. They've also added the letter "U" to the model #.
It's now called the DLA-RS1U

WHAT FLAWS?? No one has answered that? I also havn't regurgitated anything.. rather, just stated that they gave a favorable review... Can you point me to some negative review?[/QUOTE]

Tom, it seems that you only want to believe what PC has to offer. So its best fitted to say to you that you sould just take our word for it, that the RS1 will kick the s--- out of any of the new LCD projectors...including the Panasonic, on #'s alone.

So, call Jason, spend the extra money and purchase the better of the two.

It's not your imagination. They've also added the letter "U" to the model #.
It's now called the DLA-RS1U

I think the RS stand for "reference series" what does the U stand for?

I think the RS stand for "reference series" what does the U stand for?

unequaled :D

http://pro.jvc.com/pro/attributes/PRESENT/photos/general/dlars1.jpg

I have this as my desktop. :D Enjoy.

Thank you! There it is again in large detailed beautiful display!

U= uberprojo

Alex512,

What TomTesch needs to do is slow down, take a deep breath and slowly exhale, then direct his mouse over to the page listing and click on "First" and start reading from there. By the time he gets to the current posts he will have garnered a different perspective, a realization as to why this pj is so higly acclaimed. ;)

U= uberprojo
:D

TomT, you may have noticed that we are all a little excited about our soon-to-be new projector. :D

Some of the folks in this forum have seen the RS1, most (including me) have not. Why are we all so excited? Amazing specs + amazing price + amazing first-hand reviews of practically everyone that has seen the JVC. Those for whom money-is-no-object are literally putting their $30k PJ orders on hold because early reports are that the RS1 might just be among the best PJs available under $40k. Considering its price, that's mind boggling.

The only two projectors I have ever owned have been Pannies (the 300 and my current 700). I was fully planning on grabbing a Panny 1080p when it launched, until I heard about the 15,000:1 native CR of the JVC for very close to the same price (street) of the Panny. So, I paused, scratched my head briefly, and jumped on the AVS pre-order list for the JVC. Will it blow the Panny away? Nobody can guarantee that since the production JVCs have not been received or reviewed yet. However, odds are very good that it will have significant performance advantages over the Panny based on the specs and the pre-production first-hand reports. We'll soon know for sure. I think the other nerve that you struck is that there is a generally low opinion around here of projectorcentral reviews....most AVSers would sooner trust the first-hand reports of other AVSers over the reviews of PJC. I'm not sure why...maybe we're snobs, maybe PJC is genuinely bad, maybe a mix of both...

Either way, welcome to the forum! This is a fun crowd, even if we do tend to get a little passionate about our toys at times. :)

Merry Christmas!

-tony

I am now connecting my Comcast 3416 dvr stb to my present rptv via Component cables because of some earlier bugs in the HDMI connection of the Motorola dvr. When I get the RS1, should I continue to make the connection from the 3416 to the RS1 via Component, or is it 'safe' to use the HDMI connection now? Anybody know?

I doubt you'll get worthwhile answer until February (unless it ships earlier).

TomT, you may have noticed that we are all a little excited about our soon-to-be new projector. :D

Some of the folks in this forum have seen the RS1, most (including me) have not. Why are we all so excited? Amazing specs + amazing price + amazing first-hand reviews of practically everyone that has seen the JVC. Those for whom money-is-no-object are literally putting their $30k PJ orders on hold because early reports are that the RS1 might just be among the best PJs available under $40k. Considering its price, that's mind boggling.

The only two projectors I have ever owned have been Pannies (the 300 and my current 700). I was fully planning on grabbing a Panny 1080p when it launched, until I heard about the 15,000:1 native CR of the JVC for very close to the same price (street) of the Panny. So, I paused, scratched my head briefly, and jumped on the AVS pre-order list for the JVC. Will it blow the Panny away? Nobody can guarantee that since the production JVCs have not been received or reviewed yet. However, odds are very good that it will have significant performance advantages over the Panny based on the specs and the pre-production first-hand reports. We'll soon know for sure. I think the other nerve that you struck is that there is a generally low opinion around here of projectorcentral reviews....most AVSers would sooner trust the first-hand reports of other AVSers over the reviews of PJC. I'm not sure why...maybe we're snobs, maybe PJC is genuinely bad, maybe a mix of both...

Either way, welcome to the forum! This is a fun crowd, even if we do tend to get a little passionate about our toys at times. :)

Merry Christmas!

-tony

Nice post Tony. :)

Just a quick update that Chief received the mounting specs on the RS1 today so we should see a specifically designed bracket for the RS1 sooner than later. I'll keep you posted on the model # and its availability.

Just a quick update that Chief received the mounting specs on the RS1 today so we should see a specifically designed bracket for the RS1 sooner than later. I'll keep you posted on the model # and its availability.

Great! I can't wait!

Any idea on cost of the specific bracket? If it is cheaper than the RPA-U I would definately go for it. However if they are very close in price, I will stick with getting the RPA-U.

Just a quick update that Chief received the mounting specs on the RS1 today so we should see a specifically designed bracket for the RS1 sooner than later. I'll keep you posted on the model # and its availability.

Just how soon is sooner than later?

;)

First preview in english of cine4home is on line now.www.cine4home.com (http://www.cine4home.com)

I gotta stop hangin around with you guys. After reading that review in English, I'm really getting tempted here. That's a baaaaad sign. In the interim, any thoughts about good and bad screens for this PJ?

Good screen - Screen Research CP2 120" 2.35 TheaterCurve with black backing (provided you have light control)... everything else is secondary ;)

I gotta stop hangin around with you guys. After reading that review in English, I'm really getting tempted here. That's a baaaaad sign. In the interim, any thoughts about good and bad screens for this PJ?

Yeah, that was a glowing review, to say the least. I loved the technical explanations - I learned a lot.

Screen-wise, I'm going to be pointing my RS1 at a 106" Dalite highpower. I have my projector mounted on a shelf directly behind me and just over my head, so my set-up is ideal for a highpower.

-tony

http://pro.jvc.com/pro/attributes/PRESENT/photos/general/dlars1.jpg

I have this as my desktop. :D Enjoy.

i prefer the HD1 look :)
http://fotoalbum.web.de/gast/grossbildspezialisten/Vorstellung_JVC_HD1_Projektor

i'm not surprised to hear many people who had planned to go for $20-30K pjs will switch to the RS1/HD1. if JVC does it well, this machine will affect a lot of the other brands pjs sales.
perhaps JVC is indeed planning on a Reference range of projectors with the same chassis. I hear a 4K unit but in the EUR 15,000 range will be released in 2008.
What would be also smart is to release an HD1/RS1 with a 300w lamp and real 1500ansi (sorta power of a CR3X full 250)even if CR drops to say native 8,000:1.
this would be nice:
HD1 700 ansi 15000:1
HD1+ 1500ansi 8000:1 or more
HD2 4K 3840x2160 700 ansi 20000:1
HD2+ 4K 3840x2160 1500ansi 12000:1

anyone knows a scaler that does 4K ? :)

I don't like the silver reflective front which is toward the screen. If the front was changed to black it would be fine. I like the all black RS1 :)

Hi gentlemen. I have not heard any one talk about this projector (DreamBee ... funny name), but the press release 20,000:1 contrast ratio, w/ MSRP in line with the RS1. Must be using the same JVC light engine?

P R E S S R E L E A S E:
DreamVision : New Direct drive Light Amplifier (D-ILA(TM)) projector, the DreamBee

Paris, France - January 2007 – DreamVision announces the introduction of a native 1080p (Full-HD) Home Theater projector, the DreamBee, into its wide range of high-end video products.

Come and discover it for the first time ever at the Hilton Hotel (room # 28115) during the coming CES show in Las Vegas, USA (8-11 January 2007).

DreamBee is a medium sized projector that completes the current high-end D-ILA(TM) projectors series. The suggested price of the DreamBee is 7799 USD.

Features

Display technology
The DreamBee features three Full HD panels (1920x1080 pixels), one per color channel: green, red and blue. The innovative reflective liquid crystal panel is now processed into a 0,7 inches diagonal plate with a pixel pitch of 8.0ìm to match the most exigent HDTV resolution available and to achieve the unsurpassed industry contrast with breakthrough native ratio of 20,000:1.

The DreamBee reproduces without artifice the richest and deepest black level, whichever the movie, whichever the scene. Moreover, choice can be made between five different color presets, two of which being customizable.

Ease of operation
The DreamVision DreamBee projector has been specifically conceived to operate almost anywhere from the screen. Its light weight makes the projector easily transportable. The versatile, large horizontal and vertical optical shift, associated with the new cooling system reduce the DreamBee installation to a minimal space requirement. In addition to this ease-of-installation, the state-of-the-art French design (by Le Porcher) makes this model the ideal choice that would transform any room into a living theater.

The built-in video processor in enhanced by the Visual Excellence Processing (VXP(TM)) technologies.
• Reality Expansion(TM) 10-bit internal video scaler
• TruMotionHD(TM) de-interlacing methods (Inverse telecine processing, film mode detection)
• FineEdge(TM) multi-directional edge adaptive processing
• FidelityEngine(TM) noise reduction and image enhancements.

Customization
Basically in white colour, the DreamBee can be available in Black or Silver, or whatever the colour that you could imagine.

DreamBee Pro version
The DreamBee Pro bundle will please the most exigent home cinema aficionados with its external 10-bit high definition video processor, giving access to advanced video source managements and professional-grade adjustments such as VRS(TM) video processing, film grade de-interlacing methods, dedicated game modes. Thanks to the four extended Plug and Play HDMI inputs (among others) and the 12V screen trigger, the DreamBee Pro features a rich connectivity, enjoyable by the whole family.

Available from mid-February 2007

Good find, Duke. I thought you were kidding.
I wonder if the CR number is true, accurate ?
http://www.projectorcentral.com/news_story_981.htm

Good find, Duke. I thought you were kidding.
I wonder if the CR number is true, accurate ?
http://www.projectorcentral.com/news_story_981.htm

1000 lumen ANSI on a 200W UHP + 20,000:1 contrast tells me I would take these numbers with a grain of salt. Sounds like the JVC engine with someone stretching the specs to me...

exactly

Any idea on cost of the specific bracket? If it is cheaper than the RPA-U I would definately go for it. However if they are very close in price, I will stick with getting the RPA-U.

Not sure but I imagine it will be similar to other SLB brackets perhaps like the one for the Ruby SLB-020.

Just how soon is sooner than later?

;)

My contact is out for the holidays but I'm sure I'll know more and post next week. I can't speak for the company but my guess is that it'll be available by mid to late January at the latest. This assumes they received ALL the specs needed. I'll post something here next week.

Any idea on cost of the specific bracket? If it is cheaper than the RPA-U I would definately go for it. However if they are very close in price, I will stick with getting the RPA-U.

Also I wanted to add that unless price is the primary driver keep in mind that having a custom SLB for the specific pj offers advantages including a cleaner, flusher ceiling mount installation (assuming you are flush mounting).

Dreamvision (http://www.markettis.com/dreamvision/html/produits.aspx) is for real although I've never heard of 'em. Definitely uncheap (http://www.avhifi.com/asp/prodtype.asp?prodtype=227). Anything special about these folks or are these simply re-cased rebranded repriced projectors?

Anyway, I'm just barely starting the DESIGN of my room and was about to snap up a NOS Qualia 004. Glad I saw this thread. I can get this proj, an ISCO III AND the screen for what the Qualia woulda cost me. I don't anticipate even starting construction until May at best. Any reason to buy now?

Dreamvision (http://www.markettis.com/dreamvision/html/produits.aspx) is for real although I've never heard of 'em. Definitely uncheap (http://www.avhifi.com/asp/prodtype.asp?prodtype=227). Anything special about these folks or are these simply re-cased rebranded repriced projectors?

Anyway, I'm just barely starting the DESIGN of my room and was about to snap up a NOS Qualia 004. Glad I saw this thread. I can get this proj, an ISCO III AND the screen for what the Qualia woulda cost me. I don't anticipate even starting construction until May at best. Any reason to buy now?

Absolutely not. Wait as long as you can. Projectors continue to get better and cheaper as time passes, so let time work for you.

Also I wanted to add that unless price is the primary driver keep in mind that having a custom SLB for the specific pj offers advantages including a cleaner, flusher ceiling mount installation (assuming you are flush mounting).


Doesn't the JVC have to be mounted where the lens is within the picture area? If so, I wouldn't think that too many people would be flush mounting this pj, would they?

Doesn't the JVC have to be mounted where the lens is within the picture area? If so, I wouldn't think that too many people would be flush mounting this pj, would they?

Rob, the JVC can be 30% (of the screen ht) above or below the screen.

Good find, Duke. I thought you were kidding.
I wonder if the CR number is true, accurate ?
http://www.projectorcentral.com/news_story_981.htm


Hi, thanks! I knew I'd eventually add some value to this forum.

Any ways, I didn't see how strange this DreamBee projector looked until I clicked on the link (http://www.projectorcentral.com/Dream_Vision-DreamBee.htm) Looks like alien technology. :)

Rob, the JVC can be 30% (of the screen ht) above or below the screen.

Wow, I am embarassed to admit that I did not know that! :o

So the JVC really does have a lot of flexibility in terms of mounting options! Nice.

Hi Everyone ~

I am entirely new to this forum. I have spent the last few years learning the
secrets of what is possible in audio reproduction... a great deal of critical listening
and experimentation... and on the cheap (relatively of course)!!!

I started to get interested in what is possible in home theater reproduction only
a few weeks ago... several hours a day I searched through the nets pathways
and yesterday I found AV Science Forum based on specific searches for
information on the soon to be released JVC DLA-RSI ~

I am thrilled with the high level of participation in this forum!!!! I have learned
more from reading this thread than I have learned from a hundred hours of
looking and reading other sources ~

I wish to thank you all most sincerely for your kindness and help in sharing your
vital and much needed information so generously with everyone who is lucky
enough to stumble into your world ~

My wife Deborah and myself are true film lovers... we used to hang out in the
now vanished theater haunts of New York City when every sort of genre and
foreign films were being shown there ~

I am terribly excited at the prospect of the release of the JVC RSI... I am
just now putting together the gestalt of what is needed to attain a really high
level of home theater experience ~

Thanks again to everyone who is generously contributing to this thread...
I wish you all a wonderful, joyous New Year!!!

Warm Regards ~ Richard

Wow, I am embarassed to admit that I did not know that! :o

So the JVC really does have a lot of flexibility in terms of mounting options! Nice.

And it has +/- 34% (of screen width) horizontal lens shift away from head-on.

Hi Everyone ~

I am entirely new to this forum. I have spent the last few years learning the
secrets of what is possible in audio reproduction... a great deal of critical listening
and experimentation... and on the cheap (relatively of course)!!!

I started to get interested in what is possible in home theater reproduction only
a few weeks ago... several hours a day I searched through the nets pathways
and yesterday I found AV Science Forum based on specific searches for
information on the soon to be released JVC DLA-RSI ~

I am thrilled with the high level of participation in this forum!!!! I have learned
more from reading this thread than I have learned from a hundred hours of
looking and reading other sources ~

I wish to thank you all most sincerely for your kindness and help in sharing your
vital and much needed information so generously with everyone who is lucky
enough to stumble into your world ~

My wife Deborah and myself are true film lovers... we used to hang out in the
now vanished theater haunts of New York City when every sort of genre and
foreign films were being shown there ~

I am terribly excited at the prospect of the release of the JVC RSI... I am
just now putting together the gestalt of what is needed to attain a really high
level of home theater experience ~

Thanks again to everyone who is generously contributing to this thread...
I wish you all a wonderful, joyous New Year!!!

Warm Regards ~ Richard

Welcome to the forum. :)

Jim

Any ways, I didn't see how strange this DreamBee projector looked until I clicked on the link (http://www.projectorcentral.com/Dream_Vision-DreamBee.htm) Looks like alien technology. :)

Judging by the locations of the lense and cooling intake/output, it certainly appears that this could be a lightly disguised version of an RS1...

Yeah, that was a glowing review, to say the least. I loved the technical explanations - I learned a lot.

Screen-wise, I'm going to be pointing my RS1 at a 106" Dalite highpower. I have my projector mounted on a shelf directly behind me and just over my head, so my set-up is ideal for a highpower.

-tony


English version of our 2nd preview ill come soon too

:D

Regards,
Ekkehart

Display technology

The DreamBee features three Full HD panels (1920x1080 pixels), one per color channel: green, red and blue. The innovative reflective liquid crystal panel is now processed into a 0,7 inches diagonal plate with a pixel pitch of 8.0ìm to match the most exigent HDTV resolution available and to achieve the unsurpassed industry contrast with breakthrough native ratio of 20,000:1.


Obviously, they are speaking of native panel contrast here, which is, according to JVC, 20000:1. Has nothing to do with On-Screen Contrast.

Also: Between 7000k and 8000k, our JVC test-sample had around 18,000:1 contrast. Round it a bit up and "voila". Yeah, not every company is as honest as JVC with technical data

:rolleyes:

Regards,
Ekkehart

Ekkehart

Great review of LCOS technology and the wire beam splitter stuff.

you say at the end of the review
"It almost seems as if JVC succeeded in making the "perfect projector", given the present technological possibilities. And after our first impression this is almost true. If one would ask us what we ourselves would wish for with this machine, we can (at present!) only think of an electrical zoom & focus (manually adjustable with the HD1), as well as more inputs. Apart from that, there is nothing to wish for."


We want the anamorphic squeeze on the production unit. If this could be noted in your review that would be awesome. This is VERY important to higher end users.

The VPX chip should have no problem with this. JVC just needs to include it

We want the anamorphic squeeze on the production unit. If this could be noted in your review that would be awesome. This is VERY important to higher end users.

The VPX chip should have no problem with this. JVC just needs to include it


Ok, I can try to mention that, although high end users have externeal scalers for that no? :)

What lens are you planning to use? Anything else except for the ultra expensive ISCO3 is rather a degradtion of the picture than a gain, according to my observations.

Regards,
Ekkehart

yes but there are a lot of new users moving into this projector and trying to use anamorphic lenses. It would be nice to not have to buy a separate processor when the one on board is capable and maybe better.

I wouldn't be still shopping for a 1080p projector if RS1 had anamorphic squeeze!!

Ok, I can try to mention that, although high end users have externeal scalers for that no? :)

What lens are you planning to use? Anything else except for the ultra expensive ISCO3 is rather a degradtion of the picture than a gain, according to my observations.

Regards,
Ekkehart

hi

first, thanks a lot for the superb and detailed review. I'm breathless in anticipation of this pj.

interesting on the ISCO III. no wonder RUNCO SIM2 VIDIKRON etc only use this model. but the ISCO II is really excellent quality for the price.

as for the vertical stretch via the HD1 itself, it'd be great. even if yes, the sales of scalers have been better last few years and the potential market for the HD1 likely includes lots of scalers owners.

The JVC can be 30% (of the screen ht) above or below the screen.

Isn't this also the case for the JVC HD2K? Is 30:1 of the screen height the same thing? Sorry, math was not my best subject. :p

What drives this percentage in projector design? Optics? Electronics?

Mark

I have a hard time beleiving it would cost JVC that much to have the vertical stretch included since the internal processor can already do it. The fact that it would increase the likelihood of people upgrading from lower end projectors buying this one should easily offset the cost. I for one would greatly appreciate that functionality :).

Isn't this also the case for the JVC HD2K?

Hi Mark, unfortunately no, the HD2K doesn't have lens shift so the placement of the projector relative to the screen is critical in order to avoid keystone.

I have a hard time beleiving it would cost JVC that much to have the vertical stretch included since the internal processor can already do it. The fact that it would increase the likelihood of people upgrading from lower end projectors buying this one should easily offset the cost. I for one would greatly appreciate that functionality

Yes, I agree. This is HUGE, and would add a significant amount of value to product for what is "seemingly" a simple implementation (gennum chip) I'm sure (and I hope) JVC is taking a good, hard look at this... even if it would only allow for a few basic, preset vertical stretch scaling options. It would appear there are a good number of us on the fence waiting to pull the trigger.

Yes, this would be a big plus. At the very lest they could make a commitment to do it as an upgrade within a specified time frame. It's just sill not to do it.

Ok, I can try to mention that, although high end users have externeal scalers for that no? :)

What lens are you planning to use? Anything else except for the ultra expensive ISCO3 is rather a degradtion of the picture than a gain, according to my observations.

Regards,
Ekkehart


Thanks for your comments Ekkehart. Anything but an ISCO3 would degrade the PQ? Interesting. That made my decision easier about going CH or 1:78. Think I will stick with 1:78 :)

Where can I get good info the ISCO2 or 3 lens? I went to their website, but it was horrible. I also would rather avoid the 2.35 forum here as the last 3 times I've gone on it Norton has blocked a worm. Although I'm grateful that it was blocked, who knows what it's missing?

I am not sure if anyone have mentioned this but the replacement cost for a DLA-HD1 lamp in Japan is listed as Y$23,100 which is equavalent to USD200.......that's a very reasonable price compared to a Pearl.......BTW anybody knows the est. lamp hour on this pj?

http://www.jvc.co.jp/projector/dla-hd1/accessory.html

Another RS1 question: I know that it can be mounted up to 30% (of screen ht) above the top of the screen, and further that it can be UPRIGHT. My question is, can it also be INVERTED when mounted above the screen, without any negative effects. Anybody know? I assume so, but it would be good to have confirmation.

I have a hard time beleiving it would cost JVC that much to have the vertical stretch included since the internal processor can already do it. The fact that it would increase the likelihood of people upgrading from lower end projectors buying this one should easily offset the cost. I for one would greatly appreciate that functionality :).


I will second this request. I am on the pre order list and would really appreciate vertical stetch as it seems to be a feature of much less expensive projectors like my Hitachi HDPJ52.

John

I will second this request. I am on the pre order list and would really appreciate vertical stetch as it seems to be a feature of much less expensive projectors like my Hitachi HDPJ52.

John
Hell, the Infocus SP4805's does it. Even it's replacement (the IN72) does and it's only $599 MSRP.

I am not sure if anyone have mentioned this but the replacement cost for a DLA-HD1 lamp in Japan is listed as Y$23,100 which is equavalent to USD200.......that's a very reasonable price compared to a Pearl.......BTW anybody knows the est. lamp hour on this pj?

http://www.jvc.co.jp/projector/dla-hd1/accessory.html

Translated version:
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/projector/dla-hd1/index.html&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=1&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dwww.jvc-victor.co.jp/projector/dla-hd1/%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us

Click on the far right Japanese characters immediately below the intro video.

Interesting that JVC's price for their ceiling mount is over 3x the cost of a replacement lamp.

http://www.jvc.co.uk/site/d-ila/img/main.jpg

in Europe and in the US likely the replacement lamp will be aroundEUR 499 $ 499 imho. like the Pearl. it's quite a raisonable price (compared to some DLPs)

Interesting that JVC's price for their ceiling mount is over 3x the cost of a replacement lamp.

That's cause it is hanging from the heavens if you read carefully.

:D

A lot of wind has been taken out of my RS1 sail with the rumors of having no real controls for dialing in a "flat" grayscale. :( I am growing concerned that we will not have access to the LUT and then supposedly from there no such alternative measures for proper grayscale calibration are available...

I hope they ship calibrated similar to the cine4home measurements.

Interesting always is factory-installed measuring of the color temperature: Here many projectors show clear weaknesses, which can be usually corrected however fortunately with the help of the picture menu. In the Preisklasse of a DLA-HD1 we set however higher yardsticks, here expect we a gewissenafte measuring of the color temperature already ex factory. Our expectations were fulfilled thereby, the measuring sensor certified to the projector a outstanding alignment on the D65-Videonorm, without by us had to be readjusted.

D65 precalibrated it is. dont worry. January can't come sooner...

Do not overlook the importance of being able to adjust the grayscale from the factory settings for a number of important reasons. First, hats off to JVC as from cine4home's report it is calibrated very well @ D65 out of the box.

However, it is not a perfect grayscale @ D65. For example the anonymous reviewer mentioned that it was not optimized particularly at the high end. Furthermore cine4home said that he could not measure below 30 IRE where things get more challenging and are likely not as well dialed in as the rest of the grayscale - yet still critical for a proper looking image. Furthermore if you look at his RGB histogram and other charts he posted you can see the grayscale, while good, is not flat and there is some dE error in various spots and especially at the top end.

Most importantly, do not forget that projectors age over time and the grayscale will DRIFT. Therefore we need the ability to tweak the grayscale periodically. Also there is variance with each bulb. Should you need to replace your bulb early (or even after you replace it due to aging) it will need different settings than factory settings.

For those without instrumentation or interest in doing calibration themselves or having it done professionally, then I agree the RS1 is a huge step forward in terms of its factory calibration and probably better than any other pj before it in this regard.

However for those that are used to dialing in perfect grayscales and keeping it on track over time, or for those that like these benefits and used professional ISF services for these purposes, the lack of controls on the RS1 for calibration is a HUGE STEP BACKWARDS compared to the basic RGB gain/bias controls provided by most of pjs for years now.

I am sure hoping that JVC will provide access or tools to the LUT. Otherwise it will be difficult for me to move forward with this pj, especially considering that if I am willing to wait it out a bit more another pj will come along with similar or better specs and pricing plus have these mandatory calibration controls...

Do not overlook the importance of being able to adjust the grayscale from the factory settings for a number of important reasons. First, hats off to JVC as from cine4home's report it is calibrated very well @ D65 out of the box.

However, it is not a perfect grayscale @ D65. For example the anonymous reviewer mentioned that it was not optimized particularly at the high end. Furthermore cine4home said that he could not measure below 30 IRE where things get more challenging and are likely not as well dialed in as the rest of the grayscale - yet still critical for a proper looking image. Furthermore if you look at his RGB histogram and other charts he posted you can see the grayscale, while good, is not flat and there is some dE error in various spots and especially at the top end.

Most importantly, do not forget that projectors age over time and the grayscale will DRIFT. Therefore we need the ability to tweak the grayscale periodically. Also there is variance with each bulb. Should you need to replace your bulb early (or even after you replace it due to aging) it will need different settings than factory settings.

For those without instrumentation or interest in doing calibration themselves or having it done professionally, then I agree the RS1 is a huge step forward in terms of its factory calibration and probably better than any other pj before it in this regard.

However for those that are used to dialing in perfect grayscales and keeping it on track over time, or for those that like these benefits and used professional ISF services for these purposes, the lack of controls on the RS1 for calibration is a HUGE STEP BACKWARDS compared to the basic RGB gain/bias controls provided by most of pjs for years now.

I am sure hoping that JVC will provide access or tools to the LUT. Otherwise it will be difficult for me to move forward with this pj, especially considering that if I am willing to wait it out a bit more another pj will come along with similar or better specs and pricing plus have these mandatory calibration controls...


I wonder if William Phelps is working on something to address your concerns..

I wonder if William Phelps is working on something to address your concerns..

William has recently posted that he recognizes the importance of this for proper calibration and he is interested in providing such a tool if JVC makes this even possible, which at this time he says he does not know if they will.

A lot of wind has been taken out of my RS1 sail with the rumors of having no real controls for dialing in a "flat" grayscale. :( I am growing concerned that we will not have access to the LUT and then supposedly from there no such alternative measures for proper grayscale calibration are available...

I share your concern but it could be addressed through adjusting the signal from a video processor like the lumagen, correct? At least for those using a VP.

I share your concern but it could be addressed through adjusting the signal from a video processor like the lumagen, correct? At least for those using a VP.

I second that question!

I share your concern but it could be addressed through adjusting the signal from a video processor like the lumagen, correct? At least for those using a VP.

Yes, absolutely. But as I posted earlier, spending $1500+ on an external processor and making ones system a bit more complicated (personally I find the Lumagen and other external processors to be a bit of a PITA to operate) just to calibrate grayscale when none of its other processing is needed is ridiculous and destroys the great "value factor" of this pj.

Yes, absolutely. But as I posted earlier, spending $1500+ on an external processor and making ones system a bit more complicated (personally I find the Lumagen and other external processors to be a bit of a PITA to operate) just to calibrate grayscale when none of its other processing is needed is ridiculous and destroys the great "value factor" of this pj.

Agreed assuming that internal processing of RS1 is as good as an external processor (let's hope) and they enable vertical stretching for CH set up. Otherwise, I will need to keep my Lumagen in the path.

Yes, absolutely. But as I posted earlier, spending $1500+ on an external processor and making ones system a bit more complicated (personally I find the Lumagen and other external processors to be a bit of a PITA to operate) just to calibrate grayscale when none of its other processing is needed is ridiculous and destroys the great "value factor" of this pj.

True.

And most of the new VP's are closer to $3000.00 MSRP. :(

We dont know one way or the other about the LUT adjustments as far as if we will have access to them, correct? If so, why is everyone so worried? We will probably have access to these, but the point is why even worry about this when we simply dont know. We will find out soon enough and then we can all rejoice, or be upset, but until then why not focus on the positives :) You guys are probably causing unneeded stress for yourselves as chances are there is a way to access what you need someway :)

We dont know one way or the other about the LUT adjustments as far as if we will have access to them, correct? If so, why is everyone so worried? We will probably have access to these, but the point is why even worry about this when we simply dont know. We will find out soon enough and then we can all rejoice, or be upset, but until then why not focus on the positives :) You guys are probably causing unneeded stress for yourselves as chances are there is a way to access what you need someway :)

One could make the same argument for those asking about the stretch feature. But the point is that people need to express whether a feature is important to them so that the manufacturers have an opportunity to "listen to the people" and make choices with that in mind. Sometimes once a pj ships, that's it. So hearing from us now on this as a proactive measure is better than simply sitting back and hoping for the best when at that point it could be too late to expect anything otherwise.

One could make the same argument for those asking about the stretch feature. But the point is that people need to express whether a feature is important to them so that the manufacturers have an opportunity to "listen to the people" and make choices with that in mind. Sometimes once a pj ships, that's it. So hearing from us now on this as a proactive measure is better than simply sitting back and hoping for the best when at that point it could be too late to expect anything otherwise.


I hear you, and I agree. But lets make our voice heard AND hope for the best instead of make our voice heard and then assume the worst. Chances are that we will have access to these one way or another, and I agree this is important and I am sure JVC is reading these threads still and understands the importance of this.

I do agree with you though, I am just trying to be optomistic while voicing the desire to have the stretch and access to calibrate the projector properly.

[QUOTE=lovingdvd]Do not overlook the importance of being able to adjust the grayscale from the factory settings for a number of important reasons. First, hats off to JVC as from cine4home's report it is calibrated very well @ D65 out of the box.
I believe you have to take Cine4home's report here with a few grains of salt. The RS1 that they took the measurements from was not done in their own lab but rather JVC's German offices with an RS1 already setup in JVC's theater and it was surely already calibrated to perfection by JVC.


Most importantly, do not forget that projectors age over time and the grayscale will DRIFT. Therefore we need the ability to tweak the grayscale periodically. Also there is variance with each bulb. Should you need to replace your bulb early (or even after you replace it due to aging) it will need different settings than factory settings.
Is this true? I was under the impression that the need to recalibrate for grayscale drift was only due to the lamp aging or upon lamp replacement, not the pj itself.


For those without instrumentation or interest in doing calibration themselves or having it done professionally, then I agree the RS1 is a huge step forward in terms of its factory calibration and probably better than any other pj before it in this regard.
Is this view based solely on the Cine4home preview?


However for those that are used to dialing in perfect grayscales and keeping it on track over time, or for those that like these benefits and used professional ISF services for these purposes, the lack of controls on the RS1 for calibration is a HUGE STEP BACKWARDS compared to the basic RGB gain/bias controls provided by most of pjs for years now.

I am sure hoping that JVC will provide access or tools to the LUT. Otherwise it will be difficult for me to move forward with this pj, especially considering that if I am willing to wait it out a bit more another pj will come along with similar or better specs and pricing plus have these mandatory calibration controls...
I agree this is a step backwards.

In this thread http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=767155&page=1&pp=30 Bob Sorel, kras(Kevin), gremmy, Ohlson and a few others discuss with the owner of a Pearl regarding it's difficulty making adjustments with RCP. While the situation with the Pearl was different (choose either wide gamut or proper color decoding, you can't have both), I'd still like to know before hand that the RS1 isn't similarly crippled with a limited ability to adjust for an accurate image.

My hope is that JVC will realize our concerns and provide some kind of access/tools for the RS1 now and not wait to address this issue until the release of the RS2.

Sorry - to clarify where I said that the pjs age over time I meant to refer to the pj's bulb not the pj itself.

No I gathered my concerns about the grayscale based on both cine4home's measurements and that of the anonymous reviewer. For the person who does not have instrumentation or use ISF calibration services, the RS1 factory settings are great news as its about as great of a starting point as one could ask for. However we need the flexibility to dial things in more precisely and tune over time.

We dont know one way or the other about the LUT adjustments as far as if we will have access to them, correct? If so, why is everyone so worried? We will probably have access to these, but the point is why even worry about this when we simply dont know. We will find out soon enough and then we can all rejoice, or be upset, but until then why not focus on the positives :) You guys are probably causing unneeded stress for yourselves as chances are there is a way to access what you need someway :)
The price is too low for the projector to have it all. There have to be some large trade-offs just like with the Pearl's color adjustment. I have to assume this is a cost cutting measure. I would also assume that if your projector is designed to compete with the Pearl, you also have to make the same trade-offs to match the price point.

Another random question re the RS1, for anyone that might know.

With my current Mits rptv, I send the digital audio from the sources (stb and dvd) to the AVR, and the video digitally to the display. But there is an audio/video sync problem that I solve with the Felston audio delay box. I need about 120 to 130 milesec of audio delay to sync the audio with the video.

Does anyone know whether a FP has this same kind of audio-video sync problem (assuming that I send the audio directly to the AVR and the video to the display, as I'm doing now)? I can still deal with any lack of sync with the Felston, but I would prefer to get it out of the loop if it isn't necessary.

The price is too low for the projector to have it all. There have to be some large trade-offs just like with the Pearl's color adjustment. I have to assume this is a cost cutting measure. I would also assume that if your projector is designed to compete with the Pearl, you also have to make the same trade-offs to match the price point.

Are you really suggesting that the lack of RGB gain/bias controls and/or access to the LUT is a cost cutting measure?

Good question... and I'm in the same position. My integrated amp is so old it doesn't have a lip sync feature. Depending on what happens, I may need to get a Felston, too!

Are you really suggesting that the lack of RGB gain/bias controls and/or access to the LUT is a cost cutting measure?

and/or 2.35 stretch, while we're at it with features that should be virtually no cost to implement. It's not like we're asking for motorized focus/shift or anything that would require extra hardware.

Another random question re the RS1, for anyone that might know.

With my current Mits rptv, I send the digital audio from the sources (stb and dvd) to the AVR, and the video digitally to the display. But there is an audio/video sync problem that I solve with the Felston audio delay box. I need about 120 to 130 milesec of audio delay to sync the audio with the video.

Does anyone know whether a FP has this same kind of audio-video sync problem (assuming that I send the audio directly to the AVR and the video to the display, as I'm doing now)? I can still deal with any lack of sync with the Felston, but I would prefer to get it out of the loop if it isn't necessary.

Anytime you have the audio and video trying to arrive at 2 seperate points at the same milisecond, you're going to have a synch risk. My guess you would still need the Felston. How is that thing anyway for AQ?

Are you really suggesting that the lack of RGB gain/bias controls and/or access to the LUT is a cost cutting measure?

I don't know if bulldogger is suggesting that, but I certainly would!

Anytime you have the audio and video trying to arrive at 2 seperate points at the same milisecond, you're going to have a synch risk. My guess you would still need the Felston. How is that thing anyway for AQ?

AQ = audio quality? It has been perfectly fine so far as I can tell. The only trivial complaint I have is not due to the Felston but rather to the fickleness of the Comcast Moto stb/dvr. If one uses HDMI to connect the stb to the display, it is recommended to always leave the stb 'on' (or else bad things can happen). In this case it is not possible to use the 'auto' setting on the Felston; to use 'auto', either the stb or the dvd must be 'on' and the other 'off', so that the Felston can recognize which channel is active. At present I thus use Component cables to connect the stb to the display (so that I can turn it on and off), since I could not see any difference in PQ with it versus HDMI. But I would like to use HDMI with the projector. [And of course one can manually switch the Felston for one channel to the other when changing sources, and always leave the Comcast box 'on'.]

AQ = audio quality? It has been perfectly fine so far as I can tell. The only trivial complaint I have is not due to the Felston but rather to the fickleness of the Comcast Moto stb/dvr. If one uses HDMI to connect the stb to the display, it is recommended to always leave the stb 'on' (or else bad things can happen). In this case it is not possible to use the 'auto' setting on the Felston; to use 'auto', either the stb or the dvd must be 'on' and the other 'off', so that the Felston can recognize which channel is active. At present I thus use Component cables to connect the stb to the display (so that I can turn it on and off), since I could not see any difference in PQ with it versus HDMI. But I would like to use HDMI with the projector. [And of course one can manually switch the Felston for one channel to the other when changing sources, and always leave the Comcast box 'on'.]

Well, in that case, I'm almost sure you would still need the Felston with your PJ. Maybe not to the degree you do now but my guess is you will need it. This is assuming Your AVR does not have an HDMI I/O.

You have me a little curious though about the "bad things can happen" issue. Have you tried just going ahead and turning the STB off using HDMI long enough to dial in the Felston? I can't for the life of me imagin what bad could come from that. It may take a couple of minutes to recapture the Comcast signal but I don't know of anything else. You ought to at least try it and see what happens. The benefit may be worth the burden.

Originally Posted by lovingdvd
Are you really suggesting that the lack of RGB gain/bias controls and/or access to the LUT is a cost cutting measure?
I don't know if bulldogger is suggesting that, but I certainly would!

RGB gain/bias controls and/or access to the LUT's is highly desirable and lack thereof is the only apparent downside so far. Vertical stretch capability for CH setups would be a nice bonus as well. Including these features would make the RS1 more attractive to an even larger audience of prospective buyers. It would seem that JVC would more than make up for the added software development cost with additional sales.

JVC more than likely has hit a Home Run with the RS1 and that is great but a Grand Slam would be even better. :D

Well, in that case, I'm almost sure you would still need the Felston with your PJ. Maybe not to the degree you do now but my guess is you will need it. This is assuming Your AVR does not have an HDMI I/O.

You have me a little curious though about the "bad things can happen" issue. Have you tried just going ahead and turning the STB off using HDMI long enough to dial in the Felston? I can't for the life of me imagin what bad could come from that. It may take a couple of minutes to recapture the Comcast signal but I don't know of anything else. You ought to at least try it and see what happens. The benefit may be worth the burden.

No, my AVR (Pio 1014), which is quite fine in many ways, does not have an HDMI input nor a/v sync. But your suggestion just to TRY the HDMI connection between the Comcast dvr and the JVC RS1(the dvd player will also be connected via HDMI) is a good one. Perhaps the Comcast Moto dvr bugs won't bite me, or maybe they have been resolved since I last worred about them.

Are you really suggesting that the lack of RGB gain/bias controls and/or access to the LUT is a cost cutting measure?
Yes. Once I was giving a company whose products I owned a very hard time about implementing what I though should be a very simple firmware upgrade. I wrote to a couple of magazines and complained. Widescreen Review was one. The product line manager at the company and I exchanged e-mails and spoke on the telephone. I got an inside perspective on what it cost to make product changes. The lesson that I learned is that things often cost many many multiples to implement than what the end user may think. Every thing cost money to implement. How much money does JVC lose by delaying the projector, one week, one month, 2 months? I do not know. My best guess is that the reason these features are not present is cost savings to meet the price point and to get the product to market on time. I remember the product line manager telling me that his engineers could constantly improve the product that I was complaining about literally forever. He told me that his engineers were never happy and always wanted to change something or improve something. To stay in business, at some point you have to just bring the damn thing to market or the competition will. Then you move to the next product model. You can also go back forever making improvements to products already in the market place. It is easier and more profitable to make improvements in the next product generation. That is what your competition is likely doing and those are the "rules of the game."

To stay in business, at some point you have to just bring the damn thing to market or the competition will. Then you move to the next product model. You can also go back forever making improvements to products already in the market place. It is easier and more profitable to make improvements in the next product generation. That is what your competition is likely doing and those are the "rules of the game."

Thanks for this excellent perspective. It makes all the "but, why don't they?" questions less frustrating.

Yes. Once I was giving a company whose products I owned a very hard time about implementing what I though should be a very simple firmware upgrade. I wrote to a couple of magazines and complained. Widescreen Review was one. The product line manager at the company and I exchanged e-mails and spoke on the telephone. I got an inside perspective on what it cost to make product changes. The lesson that I learned is that things often cost many many multiples to implement than what the end user may think. Every thing cost money to implement. How much money does JVC lose by delaying the projector, one week, one month, 2 months? I do not know. My best guess is that the reason these features are not present is cost savings to meet the price point and to get the product to market on time. I remember the product line manager telling me that his engineers could constantly improve the product that I was complaining about literally forever. He told me that his engineers were never happy and always wanted to change something or improve something. To stay in business, at some point you have to just bring the damn thing to market or the competition will. Then you move to the next product model. You can also go back forever making improvements to products already in the market place. It is easier and more profitable to make improvements in the next product generation. That is what your competition is likely doing and those are the "rules of the game."


Thanks. Excellent perspective. By all accounts, JVC is very proud of the RS1, and this gives me a good feeling. Of course it wont be perfect as no projector is at ANY price point, but for the price (especially the preorder) this unit is still to me a no brainer at anything near its price.

No, my AVR (Pio 1014), which is quite fine in many ways, does not have an HDMI input nor a/v sync. But your suggestion just to TRY the HDMI connection between the Comcast dvr and the JVC RS1(the dvd player will also be connected via HDMI) is a good one. Perhaps the Comcast Moto dvr bugs won't bite me, or maybe they have been resolved since I last worred about them.

It may have an effect but I'm really raking my brain to find one. I'd be curious as to how it goes.

Yes. Once I was giving a company whose products I owned a very hard time about implementing what I though should be a very simple firmware upgrade. I wrote to a couple of magazines and complained. Widescreen Review was one. The product line manager at the company and I exchanged e-mails and spoke on the telephone. I got an inside perspective on what it cost to make product changes. The lesson that I learned is that things often cost many many multiples to implement than what the end user may think. Every thing cost money to implement. How much money does JVC lose by delaying the projector, one week, one month, 2 months? I do not know. My best guess is that the reason these features are not present is cost savings to meet the price point and to get the product to market on time. I remember the product line manager telling me that his engineers could constantly improve the product that I was complaining about literally forever. He told me that his engineers were never happy and always wanted to change something or improve something. To stay in business, at some point you have to just bring the damn thing to market or the competition will. Then you move to the next product model. You can also go back forever making improvements to products already in the market place. It is easier and more profitable to make improvements in the next product generation. That is what your competition is likely doing and those are the "rules of the game."

Bulldogger, I continue to appreciate your way with words. I couldn't have said that better in a million years. Thanks for that keen perspective.

A question for Tom (if he is still reading this thread) or anyone else, if this has already been answered:

For those of us considering using an ND filter with the RS1, does the front of the lense have threads, and if so, what are the specifications on the threads and lens diameter, so we can purchase the correct filter?

A question for Tom (if he is still reading this thread) or anyone else, if this has already been answered:

For those of us considering using an ND filter with the RS1, does the front of the lense have threads, and if so, what are the specifications on the threads and lens diameter, so we can purchase the correct filter?

I believe I remember reading that it will not have threads in front of the lens.

Here is a hi res picture that doesn't seem to show any threads:

http://pro.jvc.com/pro/attributes/PRESENT/photos/general/dlars1.jpg

What about a screen trigger, 12v? I do not see one of those http://www.jvc.com/Resources/DocumentImages/00/00/04/09.JPG ? Not a problem if it does not. I'll just make sure to add remote control to my screen. What scalers could solve the color issues if the proper controls turn out not to be in fact included? How about this http://www.lumagen.com/testindex.php?module=news ?

Thanks, it would be good to know the interior diameter of that lense shroud anyway, to be able to get one sized to slide in there.

Tom: Do you have a Suite # yet for where JVC Pro will be showing the RS1 and other items?

Another general question re the RS1: my dvd player (Pio 59 avi) can 'upscale' and send 1080i (or 720p, but that's presumably not of interest) over HDMI, and it can also send the nascent 480i over HDMI. Is it clear which would be better to send to the RS1? I.e., would it be better to send 480i and let the RS1 do all the scaling?

Another general question re the RS1: my dvd player (Pio 59 avi) can 'upscale' and send 1080i (or 720p, but that's presumably not of interest) over HDMI, and it can also send the nascent 480i over HDMI. Is it clear which would be better to send to the RS1? I.e., would it be better to send 480i and let the RS1 do all the scaling?

This is the type of thing where typically you will need to wait to you have the RS1 in hand and try various combinations to know for sure.

Do we know at this point how exactly the lens shift works? For example, does it have two adjustment type wheels on the side of the unit (like a Z3) one for vertical, one for horizontal? I assume the two things on the side of the lens in that picture are for focus and zoom?

This is the type of thing where typically you will need to wait to you have the RS1 in hand and try various combinations to know for sure.

Agreed

This is the type of thing where typically you will need to wait to you have the RS1 in hand and try various combinations to know for sure.

You are certainly correct, just thought someone might have a more educated guess than I could make. It seems that many people that have separate VP's always want to send the 'native' 480i signal out of the dvd player to the VP, and since the RS1 has the Gennum processor in it, I thought it might be the same with it. But as you say, one will have to do the experiment when we have the machine.

You are certainly correct, just thought someone might have a more educated guess than I could make. It seems that many people that have separate VP's always want to send the 'native' 480i signal out of the dvd player to the VP, and since the RS1 has the Gennum processor in it, I thought it might be the same with it. But as you say, one will have to do the experiment when we have the machine.

you're probably correct in your assumption but I think we would be going out on an iffy limb to specifically recommend it at this stage.

Javry and Toe, thanks for the kind words. This projector is really exciting. I think I am finally going to have video worthy of my audio. Happy New Year all!

Did someone mention earlier that you can't do keystone corrections with the RS1?

I think I've read just about every nugget of RS1 info available here, and I don't recall anything indicating there would be no keystone adjustments on the RS1...

That being said, with the generous vertical and horizontal offsets offered by this pj, I can't imagine why anyone would want or need to use a keystone adjustment and take a hit to the PQ.

Regards.

thanks uniits. I'm reading back throuhg the posts right now. My guess is I read on anotherr thread somewhere.

... with the generous vertical and horizontal offsets offered by this pj, I can't imagine why anyone would want or need to use a keystone adjustment and take a hit to the PQ...
Absolutely!

Anyone buying a projector of this caliber should be putting it into a dedicated or semi-dedicated HT environment. Keystone correction is something left over from business projectors with cheap lenses, good riddance!

I'm pretty sure I did read a while ago that there are no keystone adjustments on the RS1 due to its incredibly flexible horizontal and vertical lens shift capabilities.

I'm pretty sure I did read a while ago that there are no keystone adjustments on the RS1 due to its incredibly flexible horizontal and vertical lens shift capabilities.

A very intelligent design decision.

I'm pretty sure I did read a while ago that there are no keystone adjustments on the RS1 due to its incredibly flexible horizontal and vertical lens shift capabilities.

Hi,

it's my first post in this forum, and I'm sorry but I'm not sure its horizontal (and/or, it's the point) vertical lens shift are "incredible".

If you went on JVC UK Web site, you could see a sheet about the lens-shift capabilities.

You will see you can't use at the same time the maximum vertical lens-shift and the maximum horizontal lens-shift .

I apologise, it's my first post and I can't insert links or images, but I'm sure someone can make it in this thread, it's an interesting sheet.

Thebes:

I'm familiar with what you are referring to regarding the RS1's image shift limitations, but even though you can't use the maximum shifts concurrently, and the extremity of one limits the extremity of the opposite, I still literally cannot think of a single other pj that offers more flexibility in lens shift or throw range...if there is one that betters this flexibility, it escapes me at the moment.

Regards.

Thebes:

I'm familiar with what you are referring to regarding the RS1's image shift limitations, but even though you can't use the maximum shifts concurrently, and the extremity of one limits the extremity of the opposite, I still literally cannot think of a single other pj that offers more flexibility in lens shift or throw range...if there is one that betters this flexibility, it escapes me at the moment.

Regards.

Hi,

I agree with you, it's an important point in favour to JVC, in this price range (or more). There are many others projectors, but with lower price and lower quality, (I think especially about cheap TRI LCD), with the same capabilities or more, but in my mind, it's not the question.

I'm not sure than all people on this thread (I didn't read it since the beginning, I was interesting on the thread about "measure by anonymous" ;) ) know exactly the limitation of RS-1 lens-shift.

You can see it on UK JVC web site and this sheet is not on US JVC Web Site or in C4H review. I saw it for the first time three days ago.

If it's a mistake from me, I apologize :o .

I have forgotten : Happy new year to all .

How is analog RGB from a PC or Xbox 360 supported on this? I see it mentioned the component inputs can be used but I only see RGB and a single sync input, my PC RGB breakout cable has 5 lines coming out?

The translation of the www.cine4home.com (http://www.cine4home.com) review of cine4home is on line now.

The translation of the www.cine4home.com (http://www.cine4home.com) review of cine4home is on line now.

Thanks! Ahh, much easier on the eyes... :)

Man, reading that makes the wait even harder. This thing sounds incredible. I can't wait to upgrade my Z4 to this beast. I like the picture my Z4 puts out but it is definitely lacking in the contrast and black level with detail areas. I am so glad that I got in on that Prebuy.

This comment from cine4home should be of interest to those of us who have 16:9 screens but want to watch 2.35:1 movies from time to time.

"The Black Level was so good here that even the typical boxing over and under the Cinemascope image did not disturb."

That pixel shift on each color is such a simple solution to the convergence issue,
excellent!

The only weakness is limited inputs, wish it had a vga and DVI as well...

This comment from cine4home should be of interest to those of us who have 16:9 screens but want to watch 2.35:1 movies from time to time.

"The Black Level was so good here that even the typical boxing over and under the Cinemascope image did not disturb."


I found this comment very exciting as well since I cant do CH in my setup. Should be nice! :)

Would anyone who is on the pre-buy list that cannot or does not wish to complete their purchase please contact me at rrubman@alloysinternational.com or PM me?

Thanks,
Russ

That pixel shift on each color is such a simple solution to the convergence issue,
excellent!



I agree its a MAJOR step forward. However I don't consider it a complete solution because convergence is not always uniform. Hopefully between the rumored tight convergence tolerance and QA JVC will have, nothing more will be needed. However it would certainly be more reassuring if they divided the screen into 4 or 8 quadrants and provided the pixel shift abilities per quadrant.


The only weakness is limited inputs, wish it had a vga and DVI as well...

Cannot speak for VGA however lack of DVI should only be a minor inconvenience - nothing that a DVI to HDMI connector shouldn't take care of.

Cannot speak for VGA however lack of DVI should only be a minor inconvenience - nothing that a DVI to HDMI connector shouldn't take care of.

Except I already have the HDMI's inputs planned full :)
A HTPC could go on a additional DVI and then a 360 on the VGA.

A switcher will have to make due, still not clear on how the projector handles VGA yet.

It's not a show stopper but for such a possible ground breaking projector, more inputs would have been welcome.

Would anyone who is on the pre-buy list that cannot or does not wish to complete their purchase please contact me at rrubman@alloysinternational.com or PM me?

Thanks,
Russ
heck, why not just contact Jason and tell
him you want one.

"For us one thing is certain: after the introduction on the market, the JVC HD-DLA1 will become a lasting component of our HDTV test room. The machine hardly leaves anything to be desired taking the present state of the art into account, and we can only recommend every prospective customer to take your own look at this new wonder of contrast as fast as possible - you will not be disappointed!"


18. December, 2006, Ekkehart Schmitt

Translation: Den Walterfang, December 31st, 2006.



The last 2 months have gone by slow. This month's gonna be even slower. :)

Peter, from your wonderful description of the quality you expect from the Fujinon lens, would it be your informed guess that this glass might be even better than the Zeiss on Qualia 04? How close will the quality between the two be regardless of which you feel gets the nod? Or any of the other posters that confirmed Fujinon's reputation in the industry now, what do you think?

Even though I rarely ever post here, I"ve been lurking around since the early JVC G series...

And I am every bit as excited about the RS1 as everyone else!

Just to add to the excitment, I wanted to add couple of things:

First - we still use one of the old g-1000 at work, and it's been used EVERY single day, for the past four years, for at least 2-4 hrs per day, sometimes for as long as 10 hrs in a day, and the only thing that we needed to do with it was change bulbs. That speaks volumes for JVC's quality. Add to those four years the fact that a few times we had a power outage/problems where the pj didn't have a proper cool down cycle, or newbees switching it off at the main switch, or sometimes very high temperatures (it is ceiling mounted, and it can get quite hot up there!)... and it still performs flawlessly.

Now on to the more important stuff, like the RS1's lens:

I worked as a photographer for many years, and have followed the development of various types of glasses, lenses etc for decades. And as much as photographers are a strange lot who love to believe that only Germans know how to make a good lens (Zeiss and Schneider come to mind) Fujinon has managed to surpass everyone in terms of quality and resolution.

I remember when a dark horse among medium format cameras entered the market some 15 yrs ago - it was the Fuji gx680. The big news was that it used Fujinon lenses; although it was compatible with any other large format lens system.

It was claimed that Fujinon lenses would deliver such unprecedented performance that even though gx680 was a medium format camera it would easily compete with large format! (Hence the camera was built with movements of a large format camera...)

People were sceptical, but, there was already talk of all kinds of new technologies that Fuji came up with to surprise us with their quality - for instance I remember that one of the major improvements was that they deceloped a new technique for their anti-reflection coating; instead of simple exposure of the lens elements to special kinds of vapors, they developed an approach which used electron beams!

This produced a lens with much less light dispersion then any other lens at the time and since then, Fujinon lenses are held in highest regard by those who know!

Even today if you look at gx680 and lenses people buy for it - they always prefer Fujinon lenses. They stood the test of time.

So I am really excited about RS1 using Fujinon lens, as JVC just couldn't have picked a better lens supplier. Fujinon has never dissapointed!

And at almost 2k resolution, lens becomes a very important part of the system.

For those who are still concerned, lens manufacture has changed drastically over the past few years. Years ago one couldn't use certain thickness glass, or certain refraction index, or even plastic elements... which is all used today. So it is very possible that today we can get a lens of a much better quality then a few years ago. Also, if JVC is planning on using an identical lens for different pjs, then Fuji would have a benefit of a large volume manufacture and that influences the price considerably. Just look at price difference of any "specialty" vs. "popular" lens out there, and you'll see what I mean.

Peter, from your wonderful description of the quality you expect from the Fujinon lens, would it be your informed guess that this glass might be even better than the Zeiss on Qualia 04? How close will the quality between the two be regardless of which you feel gets the nod? Or any of the other posters that confirmed Fujinon's reputation in the industry now, what do you think?

Despite Fujinon's excellent reputation, you have to realize that any lens manufacturer has various "grades" of lenses that they can make. I have a Dwin TransVision 3 DLP (720p) that also uses a Zeiss lens for example. Do you think that the Zeiss lens on my Dwin is of the same quality as the one on the Qualia 004? It's pretty good, but not as good as the one on the Qualia.

We will just have to wait and see how the Fujinon lens quality is once the RS1 starts shipping and the reviews start coming in.

In the world of still photography, Cosina and Voigtlander lenses are made by the same company. Cosina is synonymous with some of the crappiest lenses on the face of the Earth, and Voigtlander some of the best.

In this day and age, the brand name is just a commodity that can be bought and sold and doesn't say anything about the design or manufacturing quality of the product. Cheap Sony point-and-shoot digital camera these days have "Zeiss" lenses and cheap Panasonic cameras have "Leica" lenses.

--
Steve

Thebes:

Thank you for your input...you'll have to bear with me, because despite my intentions, I seem to have become a complete RS1 cheerleader, too quick to defend... :o

Also, may sound silly coming from a newbie like me, but welcome to the forum regardless. :)

Regards.

Thebes:

Thank you for your input...you'll have to bear with me, because despite my intentions, I seem to have become a complete RS1 cheerleader, too quick to defend... :o

Also, may sound silly coming from a newbie like me, but welcome to the forum regardless. :)

Regards.


No the concern, I am also a “newbie” and I am also very very interested in this projector ;) .

In France a journalist of "La revue du Son et du Home Cinema" come to test it and I quote:

"I obtain almost 700 lumens AND 13000:1 of report/ratio of contrast, of never considering!

And the remainder is with the endorsement: perfect colorimetry (delta E < 5 on one of the modes machines), zoom x2 with double lens shift, noise of very discrete operation), video treatment impeccable Gennum VXP".

It seems to hold its promises this projector.

Hi,

anothers informations from this journalist :

"In complement:
- for the noise, it is kind of a deaf and serious humming, which is not perceptible if one pays attention to it. Completely inaudible during a film.
- the luminosity varies from 450 to 700 lumens according to the image modes and from lamp (éco or normal). Contrast between 10000:1 (D65 with delta < 5 on the Cinema mode and temperature of color on Means) and 13000:1, and without forcing the adjustments
- not made tests with a scaler, I wait to have the VP50 for that.
One can reproach him a focal distance a hair too long (but the zoom x2 catches up with the blow well), the more so as one can stick it to the back wall, the exit of air being done with the front one. Zoom, developed and lens shift (which could have been mechanically more rigorous) are manual.

2 HDMI (tested OK in 1080p50 and 60, a priori ok also of 24 P) but only one component entry, it is little.

the adjustments of profits RVB act only into negative, BUT there are finally adjustments of offsets, and adjustments of convergences in X, y"

I apologize, it's Systrans translation.

AVS is not taking any more pre-orders. I want to get in if anybody needs to back out. Plain and simple and a favor I will happily repay.

Russ

Maybe AVS could put together a new group buy?

Here is some more encouraging news some not so encouraging news (still subject to some translation/clarification though) from the French HT forum. First the good stuff. There was a post about how it compares the the Ruby, his response was (translated):

"It is better obviously, and not that a little. It has more contrast, no problem of convergence (at least the specimen that I had did not have any), it is more luminous and it has a better internal video treatment. And it is much less expensive. I stop? :) "

This is all great news. In particular I really like how he said that his unit did not have ANY convergence issues (the other parts he mentioned we can assume from the specs so this was good confirmation but not a real surprise). I'm not sure if he meant it was nearly perfect, or if he meant that whatever misconvergence there it was it was insignificant (tiny), but either way this was great to hear!

Then if I am interpreting the below part correctly this is not so good news:
Someone asked: "To have confirmation, the 450 lumens they correspond to the 13.000: 1 of did contrast or you obtain more?"

and the reviewers response was:

"Not I had 450 lumens/10000:1 with D65, and 700 lumens/13000:1 but 8500 K. Me finally 10000/13000 that does not change large thing."

Let's not jump to any conclusions and remember two others (cine4home and the anonymous reviewer) measured > 13,000:1 @ 695+ lumens @ D65.

Maybe AVS could put together a new group buy?

It will drop in price below pre-buy I bet and be available from different vendors. Wait for a production review, then look at your options.

Despite Fujinon's excellent reputation, you have to realize that any lens manufacturer has various "grades" of lenses that they can make. I have a Dwin TransVision 3 DLP (720p) that also uses a Zeiss lens for example. Do you think that the Zeiss lens on my Dwin is of the same quality as the one on the Qualia 004? It's pretty good, but not as good as the one on the Qualia.

We will just have to wait and see how the Fujinon lens quality is once the RS1 starts shipping and the reviews start coming in.

I know nothing about lens quality - but was shocked when I read that Dan Miller mentioned that the cost "to them" for just the lens alone for their VP-11S1, is about the same as the cost of the Sony Pearl!

Additionally - he wrote that the high-quality of their lens (14 element Konica-Minolta) is what gives extreme sharpness and control over stray light for extremely high ANSI contrast as well as uniformity in the high 90's range.

Due to the low cost of the RS1 - guess we just can't expect the lens to be of (extreme) high quality. And could this be part of the reason the ANSI is somewhat on the low side?

It will drop in price below pre-buy I bet and be available from different vendors. Wait for a production review, then look at your options.

If it goes from the MSRP to below what the pre-buy price was at other vendors then I will be really surprised. Hopefully it will though.

If it goes from the MSRP to below what the pre-buy price was at other vendors then I will be really surprised. Hopefully it will though.

I just can't see the RS1 selling below pre-buy price any time soon. Maybe from a grey market dealer (w/ no warranty) or an import sold on e-bay. Pre-buy price was truly amazing. I almost fell out of my chair when I heard it. Wonder how many (hundreds?) of AVS'ers took advantage?

It will drop in price below pre-buy I bet and be available from different vendors. Wait for a production review, then look at your options.

Very unlikely imo.

I know nothing about lens quality - but was shocked when I read that Dan Miller mentioned that the cost "to them" for just the lens alone for their VP-11S1, is about the same as the cost of the Sony Pearl!


Some of that has to do with economies of scale though. There is a large amount of R&D and tooling needed to produce quality optics so selling more units helps to spread and lower the cost per unit. At 4x the cost of a Pearl I can't imagine that Marantz is selling very many units compared to Sony so the component costs will reflect that. As an example, when I worked for Hughes-JVC on the Model 200, Nikon wanted something like $1M just to design and tool the lens so if we had built only one projector the lens cost alone (excluding manufacturing costs) would have been $1M. I'm guessing that we sold ~10k units of this model so this R&D charge dropped to about $100 per unit.

Lon Moss the director of the display division at JVC also mentioned at the Expo that one of the reasons why the MSRP was reduced on the RS1 is because they realized that with this sort of price performance ratio that they would sell a lot more units and their suppliers are going along with it. I would be surprised if the optics quality comes in at a lower quality than what we've come to expect from $10k projectors.

Also, a few people have brought up the point that the name of the lens manufacturer isn't a good predictor of quality and I would have to agree. The name alone doesn't really mean a whole lot even though Fujinon is very well respected. I also hear a lot of people talk about the Zeis lens on the Qualia 004 but I've heard mixed things about it from some respected sources - nothing bad but that it's not the legend that people make it out to be.

Very unlikely imo.

It happened with the Pearl.

--
Steve

[list]
Sharpness - excellent (more on that later)
Brightness - Yes this projector will have 700 lumens not 800 and JVC will be accurate with this spec (700 min at D65 high bulb setting).
ANSI CR - JVC doesn't release ANSI CR specs because most consumers don't understand it and it can cause confusion with on/off specs. Verbally though, they are measuring 300-350:1 although this spec may go higher as has on/off CR.
On/Off CR - 15000:1 and this is a conservative number :)


Any idea whether the calibrated brightness of this projector will be enough for a 12 foot wide 2.35:1 CH screen using a SMX screen 1.16 gain? I assume the desired 12-16FL is the goal.
Thanks
mark

It happened with the Pearl.

--
Steve

True. There's little doubt that the RS1 will be selling below pre-order price at some point within several months after launch. I don't suspect that it will happen as quickly as the Pearl did though, since the JVC seems to be a more significant leap forward in performance than the Pearl was. The big news with the Pearl was really price - basically a Ruby at half the cost. *ducks*

I'm sure Sony will try to keep some RS1 potential customers on the fence with a big announcement at CES, but it will be for a late Q2/early Q3 release of Emerald (totally guessing here). Will that announcement alone put price pressure on JVC? Probably not immediately, but it will increasingly as the Sony release date draws nearer.

So, just like with all consumer electronics, the choice becomes do you want to spend your dollars on the best new product you can afford today, or wait until that product is "on sale" because something better has been released? I usually opt for the latter, but with the RS1 I'm buying it at launch. The AVS deal was just good enough to make me do it, even if I could have waited 6 months and saved a couple hundred bucks or so...

-tony

Interesting, JVC and Panasonic are both subsideries of Matsushita Group...............

.....
So, just like with all consumer electronics, the choice becomes do you want to spend your dollars on the best new product you can afford today, or wait until that product is "on sale" because something better has been released? I usually opt for the latter, but with the RS1 I'm buying it at launch. The AVS deal was just good enough to make me do it, even if I could have waited 6 months and saved a couple hundred bucks or so...

-tony

I also usually wait until what I want is on sale but the pre-order price also made me bite. I figured that it would be at least a year after release before the RS1's price dropped to that level and I did not want to deny my HD-DVD player the chance to get its groove on with this 1080p beast any longer than necessary. :D

Here is some more encouraging news some not so encouraging news (still subject to some translation/clarification though) from the French HT forum. First the good stuff. There was a post about how it compares the the Ruby, his response was (translated):

"It is better obviously, and not that a little. It has more contrast, no problem of convergence (at least the specimen that I had did not have any), it is more luminous and it has a better internal video treatment. And it is much less expensive. I stop? :) "

This is all great news. In particular I really like how he said that his unit did not have ANY convergence issues (the other parts he mentioned we can assume from the specs so this was good confirmation but not a real surprise). I'm not sure if he meant it was nearly perfect, or if he meant that whatever misconvergence there it was it was insignificant (tiny), but either way this was great to hear!

Then if I am interpreting the below part correctly this is not so good news:
Someone asked: "To have confirmation, the 450 lumens they correspond to the 13.000: 1 of did contrast or you obtain more?"

and the reviewers response was:

"Not I had 450 lumens/10000:1 with D65, and 700 lumens/13000:1 but 8500 K. Me finally 10000/13000 that does not change large thing."

Let's not jump to any conclusions and remember two others (cine4home and the anonymous reviewer) measured > 13,000:1 @ 695+ lumens @ D65.


If he was at minimum throw, this would be on par with what the "anonymous" reviewer measured. At mid throw this reviewer got 12000:1 as I remember and at max throw 13,700:1. Sounds great to me as I dont need all the lumens, so my throw will be about 2/3 the way back which means more contrast.

If he was at minimum throw, this would be on par with what the "anonymous" reviewer measured. At mid throw this reviewer got 12000:1 as I remember and at max throw 13,700:1.

Actually I don't think this is on par with the anonymous reviewer or cine4home. What was posted from this other reviewer based on the translation specifically said it only measured 13,000:1 at 8500K. This is a lot different than saying it it measured 13,000:1 @ D65 (at whatever throw). Cine4home said it measured 15,000:1 @ D65, and the anonymous reviewer said he got 13,000:1 @ D65. Whereas this other reviewer made it sounds like he only could get 13,000:1 by raising the CT to 8500K...

Hello,

I have established the mount will be RPA-184 but will not be availible until end of Feb at this point.

Thank you,

Mitchell Pieper
Inside Sales/Customer Service
Chief Manufacturing
Phone: 952-894-6280 x3822
Fax: 952-894-6918
mitch.pieper@chiefmfg.com

Here's the response I got back today about the mount from Chief.

Hello,

I have established the mount will be RPA-184 but will not be availible until end of Feb at this point.

Thank you,

Mitchell Pieper
Inside Sales/Customer Service
Chief Manufacturing
Phone: 952-894-6280 x3822
Fax: 952-894-6918
mitch.pieper@chiefmfg.com

Here's the response I got back today about the mount from Chief.

Yes he is correct that it is the xxx-184. However it will likely be available much sooner than that. The deal is that Chief needs a few more details from JVC. Once they have that it'll be just a couple weeks or so from that point. So its just a matter of how soon JVC provides this additional info. I will keep you posted as I get more info.

Yes he is correct that it is the xxx-184. However it will likely be available much sooner than that. The deal is that Chief needs a few more details from JVC. Once they have that it'll be just a couple weeks or so from that point. So its just a matter of how soon JVC provides this additional info. I will keep you posted as I get more info.
I'm really hoping it will be sooner rather than later. The RS1 is 3x heavier than my current pj. I don't think the Premeir Gyrolock PBL mount I'm now using would be up to the task even if I were able to get a new matching plate for the RS1. Also, I'd prefer a mount that is pj specific rather than one that is universal so I can get the pj as flush to the ceiling as possible. Thanks for posting any news you get regarding the Cheif mount.

OT: This busy server crap is really getting aggravating. I've had to retype more than a few posts lately because of it and since I don't type very fast it's become a PITA to post, not to mention trying to view different threads.

Actually I don't think this is on par with the anonymous reviewer or cine4home. What was posted from this other reviewer based on the translation specifically said it only measured 13,000:1 at 8500K. This is a lot different than saying it it measured 13,000:1 @ D65 (at whatever throw). Cine4home said it measured 15,000:1 @ D65, and the anonymous reviewer said he got 13,000:1 @ D65. Whereas this other reviewer made it sounds like he only could get 13,000:1 by raising the CT to 8500K...


But if he was at minimum throw, this would make sense. The anonymous reviewer measured 10000:1 also at D65, but was at minimum throw. The 13000 was toward the far end of the throw. If he had bumped it up to 8500K he most likely would have got 13000 as well. Is there any way to find out if he was minimum throw? You say he made it sound like he could only get 13000:1 by raising the CT to 8500K, but he may have not adjusted his throw. If he was at minimum, this would make sense with the anonymous report.

OT: This busy server crap is really getting aggravating. I've had to retype more than a few posts lately because of it and since I don't type very fast it's become a PITA to post, not to mention trying to view different threads.

Highlight your text and use <Ctrl-C> before you click the "Submit" button. That way if the damnable happens you can put it back with <Ctrl-V>. This is a free service after all and quite valuable at that!

You can tell that has happened to me a few times...

Yes. Server has been pretty busy all day. Hard to get in. Pre- CES excitement I guess.

Highlight your text and use <Ctrl-C> before you click the "Submit" button. That way if the damnable happens you can put it back with <Ctrl-V>. This is a free service after all and quite valuable at that!

You can tell that has happened to me a few times...
Yeah, that's what I've been doing but sometimes I forget. When it happens with a lengthy post, obscenities can sometimes be heard in the adjoining room. ;)

Yes. Server has been pretty busy all day. Hard to get in. Pre- CES excitement I guess.

A message was posted by AVS yesterday saying that they had to shut down the site due to the "googlebot" or something to that effect.

HD1 MSRP in France 6490 E

I It AI CONSIDERING TURNING
Here has Bangkok, specimen final with the sale.

Good, they is first impressions, not more. Small room, screen surroundings 2 m 25, one sat has 3 meters. Any rule with ognions that this sees… and wait.

First demonstration HD with this good old man D-VHS. A traditional concert. What jumps directly to the eyes, they is natural blacks. The ruby, is good also, but I always have find that they had an artificial “look”. Certain dark scenes, this white light of the projector obstructed me a little too. With the HD1, nothing of that! The black toxido of the musicians are vraiments of a perfect black, contrasts too.

Then a HD-video demonstration, of an Asian feuileton. Good pricks, still this fabulous contaste and this natural effect. Let us not forget that I am not that has less than 3 meters of the screen.

Then only film HD: Batman returns. That to say, veiled a film difficille has to return….Ben, it is perfect! Not only, the blacks are natural and deep, the scenes or there is much difference in contrast, graduate them are returned ala perfection.

Same thing on the dvd' S which take by contrre a blow of old man. All the defaults are very visible. I have the impression that Ruby makes a “pleasant” scaling more!

Does the JVC crush Ruby? Not a priori. The jvc makes a little more think has a cathode ray tube, or 3T. The ruby with the signal of the LCD. Dimension resolution, it is well on the same one, Sony has first access, smoother.

The jvc seems to be rule to perfection, my Ruby is not it! I speak to the retailer a little, and I announce my impression to him. It is very honest. It finds the ruby not really behind the HD 1 (it do not sell Sony). It finds that the great advantage of Jvc is that it is much easier A to gauge than Sony .....

In what relates to me, I find the blacks of the HD 1 more has my taste….The spade is certainly also good on Sony, the scaling too. But I do not find for the remainder any default in Jvc….

If I should buy aujour' today, perhaps I would take the HD1 earlier. But, I nevertheless hesitate to balance Ruby, considering that it rest also a very good projector. I would see can be comparisons direct initially, and I would make regulate Ruby to perfection. But that the sober scenes are meileurs on Jvc, I do not have any doubt…

KEYBOARD THAI EXCUSES!!!!
_________________
I like films, the wine and the pretty girls! But I am not alone, not?

The translation is tough to read but what I think this poster is eluding to is that the JVC is not much better than the Ruby.

I gathered the same impression.

I'd be hesitant to garner anything other than "this person doesn't speak good english" or "that's a crappy translation" from that post. That and the fact I have no idea, with 3 years of college french, what "good pricks" would mean. :)

Did I just miss the discussion about the new (2nd) Cine4Home HD1 review put out on Jan 2nd? I can't imagine no one else on here has seen it?

Lots of detailed info I didn't know...

Sorry if this is a repeat post and you guys talked about all of this already.....

I'd be hesitant to garner anything other than "this person doesn't speak good english" or "that's a crappy translation" from that post. That and the fact I have no idea, with 3 years of college french, what "good pricks" would mean. :)

Heres the link:http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29830229&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=870

I googled that site and read all the following posts and the only other relevant info was from another poster who also had the HD1 for a short time. He said the Ruby scaled SD content better than the RS1, other than that he said the RS1 was better in every other category regarding PQ. And I thought goolgle translation of German were a rough read..................

well you the translation is wrong.
what Indieke says is that:
the blacks are CRT like (he used to have CRT pjs !!! , now a Ruby)
the Ruby blacks are LCD blacks (doesnt feel CRT inky black)
the HD1 is brigther
If he had to choose now between the two and not having the Ruby, he would take the Ruby
also says his Ruby is definitely not well calibrated

well you the translation is wrong.
what Indieke says is that:
the blacks are CRT like (he used to have CRT pjs !!! , now a Ruby)
the Ruby blacks are LCD blacks (doesnt feel CRT inky black)
the HD1 is brigther
If he had to choose now between the two and not having the Ruby, he would take the Ruby
also says his Ruby is definitely not well calibrated

Thanks for clearing that up.

well you the translation is wrong.
what Indieke says is that:
the blacks are CRT like (he used to have CRT pjs !!! , now a Ruby)
the Ruby blacks are LCD blacks (doesnt feel CRT inky black)
the HD1 is brigther
If he had to choose now between the two and not having the Ruby, he would take the Ruby
also says his Ruby is definitely not well calibrated
Edit: I see where your confusion is regarding my post. This is the individual I was refereing to:
Bastien Cluzet wrote:
I have just tested it, and the results are

I obtain almost 700 lumens AND 13000:1 of report/ratio of contrast, of never considering!

And the remainder is with the endorsement: perfect colorimetry (delta E < 5 on one of the modes machines), zoom x2 with double lens shift, noise of very discrete operation), video treatment impeccable Gennum VXP.

I seek the defects to keep some under the foot for the following, but there that will be hard

I wonder which product presented to THESE could compete with it… one will see that the next week

He is a dealer and had the RS1 for in for a review.

He says that if he should buy today, perhaps he would buy the HD1, but he esitates nevertheless to throw the Ruby away as it remains a very good projector.

A few additional posts from the reviewer:



Bastien Cluzet wrote:

In complement:

- for the noise, it is kind of a deaf and serious humming, which is not perceptible if one pays attention to it. Completely inaudible during a film.

- the luminosity varies from 450 to 700 lumens according to the image modes and from lamp (éco or normal). Contrast between 10000:1 (D65 with delta < 5 on the Cinema mode and temperature of color on Means) and 13000:1, and without forcing the adjustments

- not made tests with a scaler, I wait to have the VP50 for that.

One can reproach him a focal distance a hair too long (but the zoom x2 catches up with the blow well), the more so as one can stick it to the back wall, the exit of air being done with the front one. Zoom, developed and lens shift (which could have been mechanically more rigorous ) are manual.

2 HDMI (tested OK in 1080p50 and 60, a priori ok also of 24 P) but only one component entry, it is little.

the adjustments of profits RVB act only into negative, BUT there are finally adjustments of offsets, and adjustments of convergences in X, y

For the price they is 6490 €

Bastien Cluzet wrote:

Thebe wrote:
Pascal, some questions in the disorder:

- if not, it is easy to gauge or not??

Honestly there is nothing to make almost or if one selected the mode Cinéma/temp of color means. Thus yes it is easy to gauge

-Quotation:
you had time to make a standard for the colorimétre?


Not

Quotation:
- you it places where compared to Ruby?

It is better obviously, and not that a little. It has more contrast, no problem of convergence (at least the specimen that I had did not have any), it is more luminous and it has a better internal video treatment. And it is much less expensive. I stop?

Quotation:
and time that I am there, you tested it with what like source? (yes, that made four questions )

A reader HD-DVD, and two readers DVD

Quotation:
To have confirmation, the 450 lumens they correspond to the 13.000: 1 of did contrast or you obtain more?


Not I had 450 lumens/10000:1 with D65, and 700 lumens/13000:1 but 8500 K. Me finally 10000/13000 that does not change large thing

It's that 450 lumens 10k:1 contrast at D65 that has me a little concerned.

It's that 450 lumens 10k:1 contrast at D65 that has me a little concerned.
Agreed. I have been informed via a pm that Bastien Cluzet is a reviewer like Greg Rodgers though I'm not entirely sure if the sender meant Bastien was of the same pedigree as Greg.

Come to think of it, my other concern is the 8500k number. How did he get it? Was that out of the box, or did he calibrate to 8500k to get the higher lumens and contrast? I thought the JVC was supposed to be close to D65 ootb.

Why are these reports so far apart? Cine4home with 15,200 with 695 lumens at D65....The anonymous reviewer with 10,100-13700 at D65 depending on throw...and now this reports with 450 lumens D65 and 10000:1? I still say if this last report was at minimum throw and maybe cinema 1 mode, it would still make sense. Do we know what throw all this was done at yet?

I cant wait for some full legit reviews so we can get some concrete info. Hope Jason gets one soon.

Come to think of it, my other concern is the 8500k number. How did he get it? Was that out of the box, or did he calibrate to 8500k to get the higher lumens and contrast? I thought the JVC was supposed to be close to D65 ootb.
I believe the 8500K is the OOTB high CT preset.

I'd be hesitant to garner anything other than "this person doesn't speak good english" or "that's a crappy translation" from that post. That and the fact I have no idea, with 3 years of college french, what "good pricks" would mean. :)

Hi,

"good sharpness".

Agreed. I have been informed via a pm that Bastien Cluzet is a reviewer like Greg Rodgers though I'm not entirely sure if the sender meant Bastien was of the same pedigree as Greg.

Well,

I'm sure he recognize himself (his pedigree are not the same as Greg Roger) but he is a "good" reviewer (ISF Certified and he has written and tested projectors since many years).

I ask him the question about the projector throw for measurements but I have no answer at this time.

Well,

I'm sure he recognize himself (his pedigree are not the same of Greg Roger) but he is a "good" reviewer (ISF Certified and he has wrote and tested projectors since many years).

I ask him the question about the projector throw for measurements but I have no answer at this time.
Thank you for the clarification. I'm sure everyone would appreciate it if you could post whatever info you receive.

Thank you for the clarification. I'm sure everyone would appreciate it if you could post whatever info you receive.

I'll try, but "Bastien Cluzet" is very busy.

One point : C4H made measurement on pre-product model and I assume Bastien had (or have) a product type. (I have no answer at this question), but it could explain some difference of results.

450 lumens (in low mode) are very good on my screen (near 100 inches wide) I'll obtain between 15 or 16 fL and it's exactly what I want (for the beginning).

Maybe, if "Bastien" try to optimize the projector setting, the figure could be more impressive, but it seems to me he is impressed himself by this projector. When he says he has never seen projector with the same contrast and the same luminosity both, I'm confident.

Well,

I'm sure he recognize himself (his pedigree are not the same as Greg Roger) but he is a "good" reviewer (ISF Certified and he has written and tested projectors since many years).

I ask him the question about the projector throw for measurements but I have no answer at this time.


Thanks very much for all the info! :) Sounds like he likes the projector.

I'll try, but "Bastien Cluzet" is very busy.

One point : C4H made measurement on pre-product model and I assume Bastien had (or have) a product type. (I have no answer at this question), but it could explain some difference of results.

450 lumens (in low mode) are very good on my screen (near 100 inches wide) I'll obtain between 15 or 16 fL and it's exactly what I want (for the beginning).

Maybe, if "Bastien" try to optimize the projector setting, the figure could be more impressive, but it seems to me he is impressed himself by this projector. When he says he has never seen projector with the same contrast and the same luminosity both, I'm confident.

I can assure you that Ekkehart/Cine4Home and Basten Cluzet - LaRevue du Son etc have both reviewed a pre-production sample, (not the same sample) at the time of the review by Cine4Home there were actually only about 11 preprod samples in circulation, all pretty much with identical PQ/performance.

To my knowledge from my German colleagues, Cine4Home has arguable had more time to spend with it, hence the level of detail so far in his 2 report is arguably more detailed then the French review.

Thank you for information about the "sample", I was not sure.

I think there are a "confusion" between C4H et Bastien. Bastien is not a "web reviewer" but a "journalist". He is a member of a french forum, and when he seems interesting to him to give some informations, measures or feeling about a projector, he write on this forum.

Unfortunately, we shall not have his paper (article) before the end of february and it's damage for us.

Thank you for information about the "sample", I was not sure.

I think there are a "confusion" between C4H et Bastien. Bastien is not a "web reviewer" but a "journalist". He is a member of a french forum, and when he seems interesting to him to give some informations, measures or feeling about a projector, he write on this forum.

Unfortunately, we shall not have his paper (article) before the end of february and it's damage for us.

yes i think i know his title, as I was at the press meeting in Germany where in the morning the german journos where there, incl Ekkehart and in the afternoon the following journos from
La Revue du Son & HC (JP Landragin)
Home Cine DVD (F. Ladoire)
Les Annees Laser (F. Geroult
Stereo & Image (J. Valienne)
Cinema Chez Soi (F. Kantor)

but as some of these magazine are bi monthly probably not many have published any reviews yet. Cine4Home is arguably the most detailed one you can see so far. His opinions are pretty highly regarded so I think you can lead on that.

FYI, in case you have access to Swiss-Fr language reviews, a Swiss journalist from Cine Home DVD was also present (Clement Cohen) so maybe you can find some early feedback on his site/swiss forums as well, I have not come across it yet, but have not really had time to look either

The title is in your list, but it's not the same person :) .

When Bastien give some informations about measures, he realised by himself in the same conditions as another projector and in the same room.

But, maybe, we can go back to the subject, can't we ? ;)

Am I the only one who's becoming frustrated by arguments over whether the thing has 10,100 : 1, 12,300:1 or 16,000:1 on/off contrast? The point is that it's not 3000:1, but is better than 10,000 : 1 native. Therefore it kicks the you know what out of present digitals, and until someone comes along with better than 20,000 : 1, game over.

Am I the only one who's becoming frustrated by arguments over whether the thing has 10,100 : 1, 12,300:1 or 16,000:1 on/off contrast? The point is that it's not 3000:1, but is better than 10,000 : 1 native. Therefore it kicks the you know what out of present digitals, and until someone comes along with better than 20,000 : 1, game over.

I'm more concerend with the 450 measured lumens.

Is there any way we can find out the number of hours on the lamp, the lamp setting, and the throw ratio for the 450 lumens figure? The 450 lumens value may not be incosistent with other lumen measurements if the projector is positioned at its long throw, and the lamp has a couple of hundred hours and is set to Normal.

I'm more concerend with the 450 measured lumens.

It could be a problem for someone.

For information he measured the HD 10 K at 440 lumens and a contrast for 2 000 : 1 after calibration.

It seems realistic when you remember that the 450 lumens was in eco mode (If I don't make a mistake) et 700 lumens in normal mode.

Recently , he measured a Pearl between 365 lumens (mode standard eco) and 330 lumens (mode Cinema eco) with a contrast DI off (open) at 2 029 : 1.
9 600 : 1 with DI On (Dynamic Auto 1).
He obtain 618 lumens at maximum in dynamic mode (but it seems to me without calibration).

I have not his figure about the Ruby, but I have the Marantz VP 11 S1, 342 lumens in normal mode (254 lumens eco mode) and 2 460 : 1 after calibration.

It could be interesting for comparison, in my opinion it's the only real signification of figures.

I complete by the optoma HD 81 : 840 lumens in high mode and Iris open (and less 20 % in eco mode), or 309 lumens iris closed. 1275 : 1 iris open, 1 778 : 1 iris closed and 2 200 : 1 in auto mode, always after calibration.

for info
the cine4home test was done on a 1.2 gain screen and 400cm wide 16/9
which is GIGANTIC, we're not talking of a 5000ansi lumens machine here.

balsy and they loved the image.

the Ruby i think Bastien tested was around 350-400ansi and one critic was indeed the lack of brigthness. but hey a sharp or mazantz dont do better, even worse (especially marantz)

so overall the HD1 is "bright" home cinema projector (i said home cinema.)

add some gain (especially with DILA which does NOT add video noise as dlp does (dithering), you can go higher in screen gains. at some pt the bad sce compression however is there too)

Am I the only one who's becoming frustrated by arguments over whether the thing has 10,100 : 1, 12,300:1 or 16,000:1 on/off contrast? The point is that it's not 3000:1, but is better than 10,000 : 1 native. Therefore it kicks the you know what out of present digitals, and until someone comes along with better than 20,000 : 1, game over.


I think it is quite simple and straight forward: JVC quotes clearly that the DLA-HD1 has a NATIVE contrast ratio of 15,000 : 1 - full stop -
(other than the fact that the D-ILA device itself has device contrast of 20,000 : 1 but that is purely a figure of the ILA device itself. The 15,000 : 1 is the one and only official figure you should take



The fact that in Ekkeharts measuremens it even overachieved, great we're happy with that but all official documentation from JVC incl. online/offline docs have all clearly listed the above official figure.

I was told by a JVC rep at the show 2 months ago, that there were pre-production units were testing around 17000:1
If you try and shoot the messenger, I will shoot back.

for info
the cine4home test was done on a 1.2 gain screen and 400cm wide 16/9
which is GIGANTIC, we're not talking of a 5000ansi lumens machine here.

balsy and they loved the image.

the Ruby i think Bastien tested was around 350-400ansi and one critic was indeed the lack of brigthness. but hey a sharp or mazantz dont do better, even worse (especially marantz)

so overall the HD1 is "bright" home cinema projector (i said home cinema.)

add some gain (especially with DILA which does NOT add video noise as dlp does (dithering), you can go higher in screen gains. at some pt the bad sce compression however is there too)

I'm a newbie :o ,but I agree with you. It seems to be a great projector and the comparison with the results of other projector confirm this.

I was told by a JVC rep at the show 2 months ago, that there were pre-production units were testing around 17000:1
If you try and shoot the messenger, I will shoot back.

maybe am not denying the overperformance of our product, but as said the official figure is 15000:1. Often enough manufacturers specs dont measure up in real life, so if the HD1 can actually exceed the official specs in some environment than that is great of course. Fact of the matter is that 15000:1 is contrast ratio of this TruBlack HD1 is already pretty amazing

Did anyone notice that the picture they took of the "HD1" in the 2nd Cine4Home review towards the top of the article was completely black? Aren't the completely black models RS1's? Perhaps the differences we're starting to hear about in contrast levels from all of these reviews are because the HD1's are not quite as good as the RS1's (pure speculation btw, I'm just curious)? Anyone know anything about this, whether there is a performance difference between these models or not other than naming conventions, selling dept within JVC, or country they're being sold in?

Did anyone notice that the picture they took of the "HD1" in the 2nd Cine4Home review towards the top of the article was completely black? Aren't the completely black models RS1's? Perhaps the differences we're starting to hear about in contrast levels from all of these reviews are because the HD1's are not quite as good as the RS1's (pure speculation btw, I'm just curious)? Anyone know anything about this, whether there is a performance difference between these models or not other than naming conventions, selling dept within JVC, or country they're being sold in?


I can assure you that the HD1 in the Cine4Home review (2 samples were used for the comparison HD1 v Pearl and the other in the Cinema were both of the European HD1 (black with silver) variety. I think due to camera and lighting it comes across as total black, but can assure you that model in German demo was black/silver

the all black/RS1 will come to US but not Europe, with no differences in specs thought

Did anyone notice that the picture they took of the "HD1" in the 2nd Cine4Home review towards the top of the article was completely black? Aren't the completely black models RS1's? Perhaps the differences we're starting to hear about in contrast levels from all of these reviews are because the HD1's are not quite as good as the RS1's (pure speculation btw, I'm just curious)? Anyone know anything about this, whether there is a performance difference between these models or not other than naming conventions, selling dept within JVC, or country they're being sold in?

I started writing the same thing yesterday, but didn't want to speculate.
Maybe this is why Preorder was US only. The HD1's might have been the units quoted at 10,000:1 CR. Then realising they could squeeze 15,000:1 D65 out of it. They renamed it the RS1. Receiving a bunch of kudos from us serious critics. :D

HD1/RS1 I don't care. This unit will be fantastic either way, I just want one (bad). Feb. can't come fast enough. :)

I'm more concerend with the 450 measured lumens.


Pair it with the Da-Lite HiPower screen.

Pair it with the Da-Lite HiPower screen.

I view the HP screen much like I do the Optoma HD81 - not a very flexible or workable setup for a lot of people. It gets touted here more than any other screen and it doesn't shine in what most would call a "normal" HT setup. We need a screen manufacturer to take the HP screen concept to the next level where most can use it - one where it has a wider viewing cone, giving ceiling mount PJ's ~2+ gain without the sparklies of screens like the SS. Whomever develops such a screen will sell more than they can make...

Threadjacking over... carry on...

Hi

Can anyone confirm if the RS1/HD1 will accept at 1080/48p signal ? The spec only shows 50/60/24p same as the Peal but I know the Pearl will accept 48p.

Thanks

Dazzer

Pair it with the Da-Lite HiPower screen.

No.

I can assure you that the HD1 in the Cine4Home review (2 samples were used for the comparison HD1 v Pearl and the other in the Cinema were both of the European HD1 (black with silver) variety. I think due to camera and lighting it comes across as total black, but can assure you that model in German demo was black/silver

the all black/RS1 will come to US but not Europe, with no differences in specs thought

Hi BartS

Nice to see you made it to the forums on the otherside of the Atlantic. ;) Will you be at the PJHIFI on the 17th ?

Dazzer

Rob Tomlin, why not use a HP screen with this projector?! Would seem to be an ideal setup (especially if not ceiling mounted). Please elaborate. Thanks.

I am curious why Europe has been getting the pjs before the U.S. or Japan. Was it developed there?



I view the HP screen much like I do the Optoma HD81 - not a very flexible or workable setup for a lot of people. It gets touted here more than any other screen and it doesn't shine in what most would call a "normal" HT setup. We need a screen manufacturer to take the HP screen concept to the next level where most can use it - one where it has a wider viewing cone, giving ceiling mount PJ's ~2+ gain without the sparklies of screens like the SS. Whomever develops such a screen will sell more than they can make...

Threadjacking over... carry on...

I doubt this will ever happen. Any gain angular reflective screen is going to have a hotspot and reduces your viewing cone. There is no way around it. Concentrating the light gives you the gain and therefore the cone. The only alternative that I have heard is the Torus. The Torus owners say the viewing cone is wider than a standard gain screen. I don't believe this has been verified with any measurements. You will just have to live with a unity gain screen.

No.
Exactly. For reasons already stated. Can't ceiling mount the projector. Limited viewing cone. Not to mention that I already have a Firehawk. It seems weird that people are taking in stride that the projector might only put out 450 lumens versus the 600+ the cine4home measured. The brightness of the projector has always been one of the most appealing features for a lot of people. People have been saying how JVC's specs have usually been very accurate if not understated. I hold out hope that this French reviewer had a "defective" unit or doesn't really know what he is doing. I have a lot more faith in Cine4home, but I still worry. :p

Rob Tomlin, why not use a HP screen with this projector?! Would seem to be an ideal setup (especially if not ceiling mounted). Please elaborate. Thanks.

Because of the fact that most people WILL ceiling mount it, as well as the narrow viewing cone, and hotspotting concerns. I'm not saying it is a bad screen. But many of us who have dedicated HT's with full light control prefer to use a reference screen such as the ST130 and do not want to deal with potential issues of a high gain screen in order to compensate for a pj that is lacking in lumens output.

Pair it with the Da-Lite HiPower screen.
Here's a really bad analogy: "They told me my car would go from 0-60 in 6 seconds but it won't go faster than 40mph!" Solution: "Try driving it down hill." :D

Here's a really bad analogy: "They told me my car would go from 0-60 in 6 seconds but it won't go faster than 40mph!" Solution: "Try driving it down hill." :D

Or off a cliff. ;)

How many days to CES??? :D

OK, understood--HP is not the best screen for many on this particular forum. But for those with a similar setup to mine (bookshelf mounted, small room, limited number of viewers) I would think it would work exceptionally well.

Stupid question, but is the relatively inexpensive Optima Grey Wolf Screen going to work well with my new JVC projector? I would hate to upgrade that as well, but if getting something better will make a big difference, maybe I will.

Thanks.

If you have ambient light of any sort, then a grey screen with gain will help more than another screen. If ambient isn't an issue, try the screen with the JVC and see what you think. If it's OK then keep it, if not, then think about changing it.

Gary

I have the same question. How much better would say a $1000 screen look than my $200 light gray Screen Goo screen w/ my RS1? I really don't want to have to change my screen, but I will if I have too...

I have the same question. How much better would say a $1000 screen look than my $200 light gray Screen Goo screen w/ my RS1? I really don't want to have to change my screen, but I will if I have too...
This link was just posted to tryg's HP review thread courtesy of forum member "Free".

http://www.projectorcentral.com/projector_screens_brightness.htm

HP Review thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=773065

This link was just posted to tryg's HP review thread courtesy of forum member "Free".

http://www.projectorcentral.com/projector_screens_brightness.htm

HP Review thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=773065

Thats helpful. Thank you.

Exactly. For reasons already stated. Can't ceiling mount the projector. Limited viewing cone. Not to mention that I already have a Firehawk. It seems weird that people are taking in stride that the projector might only put out 450 lumens versus the 600+ the cine4home measured. The brightness of the projector has always been one of the most appealing features for a lot of people. People have been saying how JVC's specs have usually been very accurate if not understated. I hold out hope that this French reviewer had a "defective" unit or doesn't really know what he is doing. I have a lot more faith in Cine4home, but I still worry. :p

Hi,

Sorry, but I don't understand your point. 450 lumens was in "normal mode" after calibration. It seems to me, he measured 700 lumens in "high mode", (as JVC official specifications) and when you compare the results with other PJ, in the same conditions. (We know the measures could be very differents simply with the throw between the screen and the projector. It's the same thing for the contrast, it could be different for the same reason (throw screen - projector) or when the measures are made in different rooms.

In my opinion, it's a very good result for this PJ in comparison with others projectors (it's the only real signification of theses figures, in my mind).

For information, this sheet is calculated to obtain 12fL (it's SMTPE standard for digital PJ, if I don't make a mistake) with gain 1.1 screen. On the left side, the number of lumens and under the width of the screen (not the diagonal, the width) in meters.

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/4564/12fl3bx.jpg

This PJ is not for slides (data) presentation, but it's logical and normal.

Thebes - are you suggesting the he measured 450 in normal mode and from the same settings then measured 700 just by switching to high lamp mode? This would be highly unlikely. At the absolute most we should expect anything more than a 15-20% increase in lumens in the high lamp mode vs. normal mode...

Thebes - are you suggesting the he measured 450 in normal mode and from the same settings then measured 700 just by switching to high lamp mode? This would be highly unlikely. At the absolute most we should expect anything more than a 15-20% increase in lumens in the high lamp mode vs. normal mode...

I am not sure about the same settings. If I understand his information, it was 450 lumens at D 65 in normal mode and 700 Lumens in high mode but at 8 500 °K (maybe white level higher ? I don't know :confused: )

I have no information about the outdistance between the projector and the screen, (it's an important point) and I repeat, in my mind, figures are only significant in comparison. I know when he publishes figures, he make measures in the same conditions and in the same room.

The results seems realistic when you compare with the HD 10 K (440 lumens at D 65) and I don't remember anyone could find an insufficient luminosity to the HD 10 K.

I'm waiting for measures made by C4H or Jason Turk for comparison, too ;) .

P.S. : He found a difference in 35 % between the normal mode and the economic mode on the "Pearl".

REGARDING THE HIGH POWER SCREEN.
i HAVE A sanyo PLV70 projector in the back of the theater about 20 ft. from screen and a foot from ceiling. ceiling hieght is 9 ft. the back row is perfect for this screen (a 3 seat berk 088 setup centered in a 14.5 width room 20 inches higher than the front row.) now the front row is a different story it is out of the veiwing cone and it is still watchable but not like the back row. I feel for a solution with more than 3 guest is to have a second screen. the high power is fixed right know, behind it is a painted matte white equivelent. i will be removing the high power and getting a electric or manual pull down (high power screen) to have the best of both worlds. the best seat in the house is the lens from the projector. sorry back to the JVC, which also interests me. :D

I am not sure about the same settings. If I understand his information, it was 450 lumens at D 65 in normal mode and 700 Lumens in high mode but at 8 500 °K (maybe white level higher ? I don't know :confused: )

I have no information about the outdistance between the projector and the screen, (it's an important point) and I repeat, in my mind, figures are only significant in comparison. I know when he publishes figures, he make measures in the same conditions and in the same room.

The results seems realistic when you compare with the HD 10 K (440 lumens at D 65) and I don't remember anyone could find an insufficient luminosity to the HD 10 K.

I'm waiting for measures made by C4H or Jason Turk for comparison, too ;) .

P.S. : He found a difference in 35 % between the normal mode and the economic mode on the "Pearl".
C4H measured 600 lumens and 15,200:1 contrast in low mode at D65. This reviewer measured 450 lumens and 10,000:1 at D65. While 450 lumens might be "bright" in comparison to other projectors it is 25% less than 600. And the Contrast is 33% lower as well. My point is: Which is it and why are you trying to defend the French reviewer's findings as exceptional? If the lumen and contrast difference is due to throw, that is a great deal more drop off than we have been led to believe and will influence how people will need to set up their theaters.

edited: percentage down to 25%

C4H measured 600 lumens and 15,200:1 contrast in low mode at D65. This reviewer measured 450 lumens and 10,000:1 at D65. While 450 lumens might be "bright" in comparison to other projectors it is 25% less than 600. And the Contrast is 33% lower as well. My point is: Which is it and why are you trying to defend the French reviewer's findings as exceptional? If the lumen and contrast difference is due to throw, that is a great deal more drop off than we have been led to believe and will influence how people will need to set up their theaters.

edited: percentage down to 25%

Well,

I am not trying to defend the French Reviewer, in my opinion it's exceptional a such contrast and luminosity both.

Maybe, you don't know but there are on a foreign forum somebody who realise measures with long or short throw on PJ and you will be very surprise by the results.

Usually there are between 20 % or 30 % of difference in brightness and it's the same thing in contrast, that the reason why I estimate that the only significance of figures are by comparison.

For confirmation , you can use the projector central calculator and you'll see that brightness is very different when the projector is close or far to the screen.

If you want another example of différence, you see here the differents measures on long or short throw about the pearl (http://www.cine4home.de/Tuning/SonyVPL-VW50/VW50Tuning.htm) (maximaler zoom or minimaler zoom), it's interesting ;)

For the measures, maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong, but if you remember one point in C4H review, there are this "warning":

"We want to expressly stress again that all results published here refer to a pre-production model and can therefore only be regarded as provisional reference point! A detailed test of the final machine will follow at the official introduction on the market!"

At the end of the day, I'm still waiting for the measures of Jason Turk or C4H :)

Hi BartS

Nice to see you made it to the forums on the otherside of the Atlantic. ;) Will you be at the PJHIFI on the 17th ?

Dazzer

I am trying to but am travelling to Athens the next day, as the following week we have the first European dealer show where the HD1 will be presented (as well as the entire European 2007 line up) to a greater (read dealer) audience.

Anyhow, my presence would not add much, Elliot managed to get Mr Kobayashi to come over, and what he does not know about this projector is not worth knowing...

Once you've seen the DA-LITE HP screen you can't go back to anything else period.

Mind you the viewing cone plays a role but it's not anywhere as bad as people make it to be. Also remember that my PJ is table mounted evenly with my screen.

Can't wait for my RS1.

Looks like I'm not going to be able to attend CES. Are there any of you who are going to attend who have and can bring their laptop and CA-6X or similar analyzer and a reference source (generator or Get Gray) to take a quick look at some basic performance parameters (if permited)? Or maybe a light meter to check the foot lamberts?

Once you've seen the DA-LITE HP screen you can't go back to anything else period.

I have a hard time with statements like this. I'm glad you have found the right screen for you & your theatre. :) But it's not he "perfect" screen; it merely represents a very well-implemented choice of design tradeoffs. The HP would be *horrible* in my theatre. I don't think it is helpful to people without a lot of knowledge and experience (many of whom come here for advice) to make glorified & unqualified statements about a product like the HP screen. It can only serve to mislead them into thinking it will be the right screen for *their* theatre, without regard for the necessary critical analysis.



Can't wait for my RS1.

Here, however, we are in complete agreement! :D
paul

where I can find images of the videoproiettore jvc, I do not succeed to find some

http://www.cine4home.com/Specials/JVC_HD1_2/HD1PreviewTwo.htm
http://www.cine4home.com/Specials/JVC_HD1/HD1Preview.htm
http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/features.jsp?feature_id=01&tree=&itempath=null&model_id=MDL101681
http://www.jvc.co.uk/site/d-ila/

Some of these show the HD1 - which as far as we currently know is identical apart from the silver front.

where I can find images of the videoproiettore jvc, I do not succeed to find some
Qui è (http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/features.jsp?model_id=MDL101681).

they are not expressed I said to me well screenshots of film or other those already I know them thanks. :confused:

they are not expressed I said to me well screenshots of film or other those already I know them thanks. :confused:
I think I understand now. You're looking for pictures of the SCREEN with a projected image of a familiar movie? If so. there are none yet. There will be in a few days - maybe tomorrow.

they are not expressed I said to me well screenshots of film or other those already I know them thanks. :confused:

I wish there were some real-world on-screen images of movies. But not yet. Soon, I would imagine though.

On a side note. Can somebody direct ciccio1112 to a good online translator. They one he's using is not very good.

I wish there were some real-world on-screen images of movies. But not yet. Soon, I would imagine though.

On a side note. Can somebody direct ciccio1112 to a good online translator. They one he's using is not very good.
I'm thinking that none is being used. :)

http://www.freetranslation.com

On a side note. Can somebody direct ciccio1112 to a good online translator. The one he's using is not very good.

I think I do a pretty good job at that, I already started translating his posts, see here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9385582#post9385582)

:)

Do we know if the RS1 accepts 1080P/24?

Toshiba announced a new HDDVD player that outputs it.

I also just learned that my embedded-in-conduit HDMI cable may not be up to carrying 1080P/60.

I think I do a pretty good job at that, I already started translating his posts
Translating and embellishing from my analysis. :)

Do we know if the RS1 accepts 1080P/24?

Toshiba announced a new HDDVD player that outputs it.

I also just learned that my embedded-in-conduit HDMI cable may not be up to carrying 1080P/60.
Embedded-in-conduit, or just in conduit? Embedded suggests epoxy or something being poured in after the cable was pulled through.

Input Signals
Analog: 480i/p, 576i/p, 720p 60/50, 1080i 60/50
Digital: 480i/p, 576i/p, 720p 60/50, 1080i 60/50, 1080 24p/60p/50p, VGA 60Hz

Noah,

The RS1 does do 1080p24 via HDMI input.

Cheers,

Tom and co. - can you please see if there is any information as to whether JVC will provide access to the LUT for flat grayscale calibration (beyond the great factory calibration)? And likewise will this same or other software be provided to customize the gamma?

It has already been verified that the HD1 does not have controls to change the R/G/B levels separately for the low end/high end (no traditional gain and offset/bias controls) so it seems LUT is the only way left we may be able to do this short of using an external scaler for this purpose.

Thanks!