I am 99% certain from the many RS1/HD1 threads on this forum (and I've been on them all since last September) that the HD1 will frame-double to 48Hz and display natively at 96Hz. I will ask this question of the HD1 chief designer (Alex Kobayashi) tomorrow.

Excellent! Thanks for checking into it.

Also- was I correct in my assumption that the GF9351 will correctly restore 1080p/24 from 1080/60i film-based sources such as the Toshiba HD-A1, etc.? Or will the pj need to be fed a native 1080p/24 signal in order to display a judderless picture?

As title -

http://downloads.jvc.co.uk/ib_dlahd1.pdf

Dazzer

According to JVC's website, the RS1 has the same Gennum chip, (the GF9351) that the Marantz VP-11S1 uses- so it should be able to restore 1080/24 from 1080/60i film-based sources without issue, and we know the JVC will accept 1080p/24 sources directly. The question, as you pose it, is whether or not it will then display the image at a multiple of 24hz, or if it will only do 60hz. I'd like to see that one answered as well.


So does the marantz PJ do vertical stretch? If it does then this may the strongest indicator that the rs1 is capable of doing so. Its just a matter of programming or activation of the appropiate pathway. :confused: Providing this chip is responsible for doing such.

Ben

As title -

http://downloads.jvc.co.uk/ib_dlahd1.pdf

Dazzer

Thanks AVI!

Also- was I correct in my assumption that the GF9351 will correctly restore 1080p/24 from 1080/60i film-based sources such as the Toshiba HD-A1, etc.? Or will the pj need to be fed a native 1080p/24 signal in order to display a judderless picture?Unfortunately the latest information I have is that this is not the case. i.e. External VP or native 24p feed needed. I'm going to try and confirm this too.

Thanks for the link Dazzer!

No need to worry... Watched a HD-DVD the other night via 1080p/24 on the HD1 / RS1, worked fine without judder etc.

Regards,
Ekkehart, Cine4Home

Thanks Ekkehart. When can we expect your review? :)

Unfortunately the latest information I have is that this is not the case. i.e. External VP or native 24p feed needed. I'm going to try and confirm this too.

Thanks again!

I just checked Widescreen Review's review of the Marantz, (which I can't really provide attribution for, since it's a pay site) and the author does say that the pj will perform inverse telecine deinterlacing of film-based 1080i sources- but he doesn't elaborate as to whether or not it is then displayed at 60hz, or a multiple of 24hz. So I guess this is a bit of a grey area until someone can provide further clarification.

Lamp mode doesnt change the life of the bulb...looks like I'll be using high mode.

The remote also offers each input it's own direct button. You don't have to scroll through all of the inputs like on Sony remotes that I have had in the past. That is a very nice convince. Johnathan

Lamp mode doesnt change the life of the bulb...looks like I'll be using high mode.

So using High mode vs Low mode has no impact on lamp life - that's something I didn't know. How about PJ life?

Thanks again!

I just checked Widescreen Review's review of the Marantz, (which I can't really provide attribution for, since it's a pay site) and the author does say that the pj will perform inverse telecine deinterlacing of film-based 1080i sources- but he doesn't elaborate as to whether or not it is then displayed at 60hz, or a multiple of 24hz. So I guess this is a bit of a grey area until someone can provide further clarification.


Hi strawberry; Greg Rogers did make it clear as to how the Gennum processor in the Marantz handles film-based sources.

Greg stated that with Frame Rate Conversion (FRC) turned "On" all input frame rates are converted to 60Hz. With FRC set to "Auto" 48Hz frame rates are displayed natively and at the time of said review it was stated that a firmware update was promised that would convert 1080p24 to 1080p48.

Personally I do not expect the RS1's internal processor to inverse-telecine 60Hz film-based sources and then output at 24p or at a multiple of. I believe if this were going to happen JVC would have been touting this benefit long ago.

Hi strawberry; Greg Rogers did make it clear as to how the Gennum processor in the Marantz handles film-based sources.

Greg stated that with Frame Rate Conversion (FRC) turned "On" all input frame rates are converted to 60Hz. With FRC set to "Auto" 48Hz frame rates are displayed natively and at the time of said review it was stated that a firmware update was promised that would convert 1080p24 to 1080p48.

Thanks for the reply, Kroenen. I did see the FRC section of the review, but it looked to me like he was talking more about 1080p/48 input from an external VP, (and/or, with the firmware upgrade, 1080p/24.) What I really wanted to see was whether or not, with FRC turned "off"- the pj was capable of performing inverse telecine deinterlacing on a 1080i/60 input and then displaying that signal at 48hz.

Is the answer right in front of my face and I'm just missing it?

Wouldn't be the first time.

So using High mode vs Low mode has no impact on lamp life - that's something I didn't know. How about PJ life?

Thats what is says in the manual. usually you get more hours our of a lamp when using it in its lower mode. I dont think it has an effect on the PJ life.

So if i get the same life out of the bulb i will use the high lamp mode (usually i go with the econo mode to get more hours our of my bulb).

For those of you familiar with JVC pro distribution, what percentage discounts off of MSRP are likely to be available for the RS1?

In the menu according to the manual are the following aspects: 4:3, 16:9 and Zoom. Anyone know what the real meaning of Zoom is? Is that the vertical stretch function or something else?

No need to worry... Watched a HD-DVD the other night via 1080p/24 on the HD1 / RS1, worked fine without judder etc.

Regards,
Ekkehart, Cine4Home

Where did you get an HD DVD player that output 1080p/24? As far as I know, until a firmware upgrade for the XA2 is released, none of the players will do this yet.Some secret prototype you can let us in on? ;)

Thanks,
Jason

In the menu according to the manual are the following aspects: 4:3, 16:9 and Zoom. Anyone know what the real meaning of Zoom is? Is that the vertical stretch function or something else?
I heven' t read the manual in detail but this usually means that you can zoom a 4:3 image to fill the 16:9 width while loosing the top and bottom of the 4:3 frame. This is useful if you want to watch a movie or HD show delivered in OAR over a SD channel. The result is a REALLY crappy picture that will make you long for the high quality image of a VHS tape! :rolleyes: :D :D

Thats what is says in the manual. usually you get more hours our of a lamp when using it in its lower mode. I dont think it has an effect on the PJ life.

So if i get the same life out of the bulb i will use the high lamp mode (usually i go with the econo mode to get more hours our of my bulb).

I think that it's always a good idea to use low lamp mode if you can, regardless of the claims of equal life. Unless you need the higher lumen output. I would still use low lamp. It should also produce less heat in low lamp mode, which is a good thing for all concerned. ;)

Where did you get an HD DVD player that output 1080p/24? As far as I know, until a firmware upgrade for the XA2 is released, none of the players will do this yet.Some secret prototype you can let us in on? ;)

Thanks,
Jason

He might have been using an outboard VP to get to 1080p/24.

He might have been using an outboard VP to get to 1080p/24.
Ah, of course. Thanks!

I think that it's always a good idea to use low lamp mode if you can, regardless of the claims of equal life. Unless you need the higher lumen output. I would still use low lamp. It should also produce less heat in low lamp mode, which is a good thing for all concerned. ;)

And low lamp mode will presumably be quieter.

And low lamp mode will presumably be quieter.

With a SS, low lamp mode will be PLENTY bright for my 120" screen. :)

Is the masking function like a overscan function? It will do 1920x1080 pixel for pixel correct? I hope that the deinterlacer is good quality because I'll be going through my receiver with hdmi and it only passes through 1080i.

Ciao,

I've two question for Elliot, Ekkehart or everyone who has the JVC HD-1 in their hands :-)

1) What about 1:1 pixel mapping from HTPC ? It does overscan HDMI signal (I hope not)?

2) And about vision quality with DVD SD material fed by HTPC ? Does it makes any MPEG2 compression artifacts unwatchable ? I have a huge DVD collection so I want to be sure to be able to enjoy it.

Thanks again for all the info you give us !!

bye
Emanuele

For those who might be familiar with JVC menus: From the manual, there are adjustments for RGB brightness (offset), but none for RGB contrast (gain). Is this true? I've never seen that on a projector before. How do you properly calibrate greyscale without both?

"Lamp mode doesnt change the life of the bulb...."

The manual may say that, but I don't believe it.

Higher power means hotter electrodes and and faster erosion.

you would think? Why wouldnt they advertise a longer life for the lower lamp mode?

Maybe it doesnt quite reach 3k hours? Logic tells me higher mode will burn the bulb out more quickly but who knows.

For those who might be familiar with JVC menus: From the manual, there are adjustments for RGB brightness (offset), but none for RGB contrast (gain). Is this true? I've never seen that on a projector before. How do you properly calibrate greyscale without both?

Don't even get me started! :mad: The short answer is, you can't adjust these separate and we have to rely on either a truly excellent flat grayscale from 5-100 IRE (still believe it when I see it) or access to the LUT which we have no reason to believe we will have.

The offset adjustments will address the lower end of the IRE range, but I guess we'll have to live with whatever the high end is. That's very strange. And there's nothing in the service menu to adjust it either?

At least Cine4home's measurements show excellent OOTB settings.

The offset adjustments will address the lower end of the IRE range, but I guess we'll have to live with whatever the high end is. That's very strange. And there's nothing in the service menu to adjust it either?

At least Cine4home's measurements show excellent OOTB settings.

No. That's the kicker. You should certainly think that would be the case, but its not. And this has been confirmed William Phelps through is own experimentation. As I understand it, the controls apply GLOBALLY to the entire range. I am looking for a "shake head" icon to end this message with but don't see one - so I'll just use this :shake:

At least Cine4home's measurements show excellent OOTB settings.

I think that is a safe bet at this point for Joe Average viewer. However I believe it remains to be seen (or at least reported) just how flat the grayscale truly is, especially below 30 IRE. Tell me it has a dE of 0-3 from 5-100 IRE and that if it drifts over time with bulb age/replacement that it will drift universally and I'll be happy.

The offset adjustments will address the lower end of the IRE range, but I guess we'll have to live with whatever the high end is. That's very strange. And there's nothing in the service menu to adjust it either?

At least Cine4home's measurements show excellent OOTB settings.

No don't think so Mike,
I believe that "offset" label in the JVC menu has nothing to do with bias, cut-offs or whatever label we associate with low end gray calibration. They are globel (throughout the lumence range) R, G and B (overlay) color saturation controls.

No. That's the kicker. You should certainly think that would be the case, but its not. And this has been confirmed William Phelps through is own experimentation. As I understand it, the controls apply GLOBALLY to the entire range. I am looking for a "shake head" icon to end this message with but don't see one - so I'll just use this :shake:

WTF? I'll echo your :shake: That might cause me to rethink my potential purchase. :mad:

A full IRE range adjustment is only slightly better than none.

Tell me it has a dE of 0-3 from 5-100 IRE and that if it drifts over time with bulb age/replacement that it will drift universally and I'll be happy.

Amen to that, but it's unlikely.

any chances "we" can influence JVC to have soft upgrade to allow vertical stretch on HD signals ?

otherwise as most here, anxious to get mine too.

I've been reading the manual and have a trivial question: on pg 51, "when mounting to a pedestal": if mounting the pj upright on a shelf ('pedestal'), are they saying that one should remove the 4 'feet', drill 4 holes in the shelf, and put the screws up through the shelf into the 4 locations of the feet? The description is not clear to me.

i think the issue of brightness depending on throw (as with the Pearl btw ! and most pjs)
can be resolved by selecting a screen with our without gain, if size has to remain.
or replacing the lamp a bit sooner.

perhaps we get 700lumens max zoom, 600 mid zoom and 500 mini zoom

mine will be placed around 6.1m away to have 2.85m 1/69 and 4M with the ISCO
(via scaler) but the screen has 1.4 gain, black theater.

As title -

http://downloads.jvc.co.uk/ib_dlahd1.pdf

Dazzer

Nice find, thanks for posting!

So does the marantz PJ do vertical stretch? If it does then this may the strongest indicator that the rs1 is capable of doing so. Its just a matter of programming or activation of the appropiate pathway. :confused: Providing this chip is responsible for doing such.

Ben

The Marantz 11-s1 will do vertical stretch, I see it in my menu and It might also be on my remote but im not sure about that, I can also do FRC frame rate conversion and I believe when activated will output 48hz I dont use this function currently but will in the future once I get the appropriate hd player and source(hddvd or bluray disk)

Strange that the manual shows minimum clearances for all sides except the front, where the intake and exhaust are.

I was also surprised to see that the air filter is on the bottom.

Tom, can you explain the airflow path?

Thanks

air filter also on front bottom of PEARL

if marantz does the v stretch and if it has the VXP chip, there's a chance.

I've been reading the manual and have a trivial question: on pg 51, "when mounting to a pedestal": if mounting the pj upright on a shelf ('pedestal'), are they saying that one should remove the 4 'feet', drill 4 holes in the shelf, and put the screws up through the shelf into the 4 locations of the feet? The description is not clear to me.

That's the way I understood it.

Looking at the illustrations on pages 15 and 51 the bottom surface is absent of any screw holes and only showcases the feet and air inlets. So I'd assume that the screw holes that secure the feet are to also be used for mounting/securing as well.

That's the way I understood it.

Looking at the illustrations on pages 15 and 51 the bottom surface is absent of any screw holes and only showcases the feet and air inlets. So I'd assume that the screw holes that secure the feet are to also be used for mounting/securing as well.

Thats correct.

Also for us anamorphic lens guys the IR reciever on the front of the case is even closer to the lens than I thought. After installation of the mounting brackets on the side of the lens its going to be hell trying to access the RS1 with the remote. Time to start thinking about and RF soultion just to turn the RS1 on and off, let alone constant tinkering:). It has another IR recivever on the back of the case but that doesn't help anyone with a close to the wall installatiion.

http://us.marantz.com/Products/1828.asp
page 16 of the manualof the 11S1 indeed vertical stretch is allowed.
same VXP chip likely

hmmm...For some reason I thought it would have both vga (db15) and component connections (seperately), but it is clear it is vga or component.

On Page 26 of the HD1 manual, it looks like the bottom 4:3 image (with black bars) when using the zoom will vertically stretch? Is this right?

Edit: It says when using HDTV signals, it's limited to 16:9... never mind... :(

hmmm...For some reason I thought it would have both vga (db15) and component connections (seperately), but it is clear it is vga or component.
Where do you see any VGA input? It is HDMI(DVI), YPbPr, RGsB (RGB with sync-on-green), or RGBS (RGB with separate composite sync). I don't see any RGBHV (VGA or PC) input.

correct. RGB with sync on green. I didn't notice it was that.

I am 99% certain from the many RS1/HD1 threads on this forum (and I've been on them all since last September) that the HD1 will frame-double to 48Hz and display natively at 96Hz. I will ask this question of the HD1 chief designer (Alex Kobayashi) tomorrow.


At CES the JVC PRO rep confirmed, it will framedouble to 48Hz and display at 96Hz.

I assume the RS1 can stretch a 4:3 image to 16:9?

JVC-HD1 at $6,800 ???

JVC-HD1 at $6,800 ???
I've seen $6,999 for the HD1 (at ProjectorCentral). I think they're just wrong.
They show the RS1 at $6295... a correct list price. Go figure.
I wouldn't believe the $6800 figure.

"it will framedouble to 48Hz and display at 96Hz. "

Why not just say it framequadruples to 96 Hz?

I've seen $6,999 for the HD1 (at ProjectorCentral). I think they're just wrong.
They show the RS1 at $6295... a correct list price. Go figure.
I wouldn't believe the $6800 figure.

HD1 is the European version of RS1. I've seen suggested price of £4500. Isn't this about the same as $8800 US? I think the $6,999 is closer to their street price or prebuy.

I've seen HD1 $6,800, Japanese version.

It is my understanding that the HD1 will be the consumer model, Metallic gray and silver front, and the RS1 is the Professional model, Gloss Black and flat black front. Both MSRP about $6300. RS1 should be available late February, not sure about the HD1.

About HD1 (http://www.jvc.com/press/index.jsp?item=529&pageID=1)

I've seen $6,999 for the HD1 (at ProjectorCentral). I think they're just wrong.
They show the RS1 at $6295... a correct list price. Go figure.
I wouldn't believe the $6800 figure.

The projected price was lowered by JVC at CES.

I don't really understand the logic behind the naming and different colors. What is the purpose? In Europe, it seems like only the HD1 will be available. In the US, we get the RS1 Pro model and the HD1 Consumer model? As far as we know there are no differences but color.

"it will framedouble to 48Hz and display at 96Hz. "

Why not just say it framequadruples to 96 Hz?

Because according to JVC it's not frame quadrupeling. Panel refresh rate and frame rate are separate but often confused mechanisms that are sometimes done at the same time (CRT and common 60hz LCD implementations for example).

So what they are saying is that it redisplays the frame twice to get 48hz and then it also panel refreshes each frame twice so that the panel refresh rate is 96hz even while the frame rate is at 48hz. Doing it this way prevents flicker at 48hz. With a CRT the refresh and frame rate are basically one in the same because redrawing the frame is the only way to refresh the CRT. With LCD though this is no longer the case and there are various ways to refresh the panel without reloading a frame.

WTF? I'll echo your :shake: That might cause me to rethink my potential purchase. :mad:

A full IRE range adjustment is only slightly better than none.

WTF is right. Mind boggling really. It is going to be a major issue if we do not get access to the LUT, as its highly unlikely its going to track perfectly flat out of the box, and certainly not over time as the bulb ages or is replaced. The tolerances in the bulbs themselves basically assure us of that. Sheesh.

For those of your that care about calibration please speak up so our voices are heard - we need access to the LUT!

WTF is right. Mind boggling really. It is going to be a major issue if we do not get access to the LUT, as its highly unlikely its going to track perfectly flat out of the box, and certainly not over time as the bulb ages or is replaced. The tolerances in the bulbs themselves basically assure us of that. Sheesh.

For those of your that care about calibration please speak up so our voices are heard - we need access to the LUT!

I'll second that. Just to add - As long as they publish the interface so that someone like Wm can write a tool to access the LUT I'm also okay with that.

It is my understanding that the HD1 will be the consumer model, Metallic gray and silver front, and the RS1 is the Professional model, Gloss Black and flat black front. Both MSRP about $6300. RS1 should be available late February, not sure about the HD1.

About HD1 (http://www.jvc.com/press/index.jsp?item=529&pageID=1)

We have it a reversed way around for Australia. I think this whole model naming issue inconjunction with consumer and pro version is creating too much confusion. There isnt at the moment a clear departure from the orgional specs from one model to the next.

Maybe the pro version should have the verticl stretch for CIH or vica versa.

Ben

I don't really understand the logic behind the naming and different colors. What is the purpose? In Europe, it seems like only the HD1 will be available. In the US, we get the RS1 Pro model and the HD1 Consumer model? As far as we know there are no differences but color.

That is correct as questioned before
Ex Work (Yokosuka factory in Japan) the only difference between HD1 and RS1 is a cosmetic one.

RS1 has different distribution channel: JVC Professional Ameria, ie targeted at non consumer retail channels
HD1: JVC Consumer America & Europe

RS1 will only come to US, not Europe

I'll second that. Just to add - As long as they publish the interface so that someone like Wm can write a tool to access the LUT I'm also okay with that.

Agreed. It doesn't matter to me WHO provides access to it, just as long as we get access to it and can make the mods ourselves. I'm all for paying a reasonable software fee to Wm for such a tool. My concern is whether even he will have access. As I believe Wm stated before the RS1 is a completely new design and not even known whether such access is possible in the first place.

WTF is right. Mind boggling really. It is going to be a major issue if we do not get access to the LUT, as its highly unlikely its going to track perfectly flat out of the box, and certainly not over time as the bulb ages or is replaced. The tolerances in the bulbs themselves basically assure us of that. Sheesh.

For those of your that care about calibration please speak up so our voices are heard - we need access to the LUT!

JVC please give us access to the LUT!



...... Just to add - As long as they publish the interface so that someone like Wm can write a tool to access the LUT I'm also okay with that.

I would be content with this as well especially if Wm would market this tool to RS1 owners.

I'll second that. Just to add - As long as they publish the interface so that someone like Wm can write a tool to access the LUT I'm also okay with that.

I am going to strongly third this!

It is quite confusing to me that JVC would come out with a projector with so many great features and specs, and then hamper it like this....especially on what they call their "pro" model.

:confused:

JVC please give us access to the LUT!





I would be content with this as well especially if Wm would market this tool to RS1 owners.

I'm all for this as well...

...especially on what they call their "pro" model.
:confused:

Exactly! Sort of reminds me of how Microsoft said the XBOX 360 was "ushering the next era of HD" and then provided no HDMI output. Just doesn't make sense given the products position - same with having a Professional model pj that cannot be calibrated in the field to adjust for important variances. What gives?

If this is not resolved in the first generation of the projector, is it a sufficiently serious issue to cause one to wait for the second generation (when presumably this will be fixed)?

Might be JVC's marketing plan...,
leave out a few important things OUT on the 1st release then next up, sell another boat load with better color options, more HDMI inputs and VGA too, a quieter fan and a motorized focus and zoom per barrysb request.

If they added a manual IRIS could you imagine the contrast ratios possible.

Given the demand for this one, I can't see them adding any more features at this time but next time around look out?

Agreed. It doesn't matter to me WHO provides access to it, just as long as we get access to it and can make the mods ourselves. I'm all for paying a reasonable software fee to Wm for such a tool.

Same here.

My concern is whether even he will have access. As I believe Wm stated before the RS1 is a completely new design and not even known whether such access is possible in the first place.

That's not good. Our best bet would be through Wm.

Has Tom or any other JVC rep weighed in on this?

Might be JVC's marketing plan...,
leave out a few things OUT on the 1st release then next up, sell another boat load with better color options, more HDMI inputs and VGA too, and a quieter fan.

If they added a manual IRIS could you imagine the contrast ratios possible.

Given the demand for this one, I can't see them adding any more features at this time but next time around look out?

I'd like to see motorized zoom and focus. Certainly much easier to set focus and picture size when you're standing next to the screen.

Exactly! Sort of reminds me of how Microsoft said the XBOX 360 was "ushering the next era of HD" and then provided no HDMI output. Just doesn't make sense given the products position - same with having a Professional model pj that cannot be calibrated in the field to adjust for important variances. What gives?

The Xbox is rumored to be adding an HDMI port model due out later this year.

Perhaps as others have suggested the RS1 is going to be differentiated from the HD10k by this and other features. And maybe down the road the RS2 will bring us an improved RS1 with everything we want?

I'd like to see motorized zoom and focus. Certainly much easier to set focus and picture size when you're standing next to the screen.

It's missing that too? Oh no, does it have motorized lens shift or a way to bring a 2:35 movie down to the bottom of a 16:9 frame using the remote?

I'd like to see motorized zoom and focus. Certainly much easier to set focus and picture size when you're standing next to the screen.
I hope I don't fall off the ladder trying to set the focus with a pair of binoculars! :rolleyes: :p ;)

Lens shift is manual as well.

This has probably been asked already but what connections and quantity of those connections does the projector have? Any DVI?

No DVI. Take a look at this page (http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/specs.jsp?model_id=MDL101681&feature_id=03).

2 HDMI makes not having DVI easier since an HDMI -> DVI cable solves the problem. I would like to have had VGA though...

This love-hate roller coaster is starting to make me nauseous. I'll check back in Feb.

I am going to strongly third this!

It is quite confusing to me that JVC would come out with a projector with so many great features and specs, and then hamper it like this....especially on what they call their "pro" model.

:confused:


I am with you guys on this one. Seems crazy that we would have to push for this as it should be standard to be able to calibrate the projector properly.



Hopefully Tom or someone else from JVC can give us some good news on this? :confused:

By the way does anyone know if you can stetch a 4:3 image to 16:9?

Please explain how you think bulb wear will affect the projector, necessitating LUT adjustments. Seems to me that the only reason to access the LUT would be changing gamma curves and white-field uniformity. Bulb wear will not change those.......... :confused:

I would think, by now, JVC will be able to set the factory tables for "flat" gray-scales, with the need for a possible tweak in color temp.

Please explain how you think bulb wear will affect the projector, necessitating LUT adjustments. Seems to me that the only reason to access the LUT would be changing gamma curves and white-field uniformity. Bulb wear will not change those.......... :confused:


Well for one as a bulb ages I assume that the spectrum of its light can shift. This would cause some areas to fall off sooner than others I suppose. For instance as it begins to run out of red at the top end the CT would rise there while remaining flat below it.

My understanding is that UHP bulbs have a fair amount of tolerance in their spec. Therefore the spectrum of light put out by one bulb can vary somewhat in another bulb, enough so to then be out of sync with the factory settings for grayscale done on the original bulb.

Lastly, without access to the LUT I don't see how we would be able to customize the gamma. As I mentioned, purchasing a $2k+ external VP and the unnecessary complexity it adds to me setup to get the 11 pt calibration would blow the whole "value" of this pj.

Are these valid concerns IYO?


I would think, by now, JVC will be able to set the factory tables for "flat" gray-scales, with the need for a possible tweak in color temp.

I'm sure they can. But I wonder what definition of "flat" we are talking about here. In general consider D65 with a dE of 0-5 to be "flat" especially for a factory calibration. However my definition of flat would be 0-3 dE from 5-100 IRE. If JVC has pulled that off, more power to them, but frankly I'd be a bit surprised if it was THAT good.

IBy the way does anyone know if you can stetch a 4:3 image to 16:9?
Yes.

Does not the Sony Pearl have the same short comings concerning calibration as this projector? Hasn't William already said that this is likely cost cutting measures? I guess I am alone on this one but I think you all really want everything and you want it like yesterday at a budget price. I do not think this is going to be the perfect projector for the price or that is is profitable for JVC to do it. I mean for goodness sake, it doe not even have a 12 volt trigger?! I assume that is another cost savings. I think that we have gotten about as much as we are going to get for 6300.00. I for one and thrilled and can't wait. I suspect there will be higher end models with HIGHER price tags to give you all everything that you want. Some of you guys have projectors that cost twice as much as this projector and that can not beat this projector for the picture quality. Yet still you think that adding a scaler to this projector for another 2k, makes it not a bargain? Wow.

From the UK showing of the projector yestarday going up against the Pearl with both ISF calibrated-

I carried out calibration of the JVC and the Pearl today at PJ. There is just as advanced greyscale calibration in the JVC as in the Pearl. The JVC is in fact more linear in response. Both could be made better, the Sony more so, by using the advanced 11 point gamma in a Lumagen for instance. I got them as close as I could. Depending on what Elliot plays you may or may not note the greyscale error on Sony in the dark part of the image in comparison with the JVC. HAVE FUN!

Gordon

Having posted earlier that I was not impressed with the soft image this machine produced I now find

1. No motorised zoom
2. No motorised focus
3. No CIH stretch
4. No screen trigger
5. No curtain/Maskin trigger
6.No seperate RGB gain and offset

I wanted to buy 2 of these, but despite an impressive claimed CR This has got to be the most severely hobbled and gimped PJ going. Who is it aimed at? What a waste of an opertunity. These features have been standard on some makes for years. So sad that this machine is now no more than a toy.

To each his own I guess: :)

1) Don't want it.
2) Don't want it.
3) This would be nice - however of no use to me at this time.
4) Don't need it.
5) Don't need it.
6) This I need. Or at the very least access to the LUT's so wm can calibrate.

As far as the soft image :eek: - you must have seen different RS1's/HD1's than I. The one at EHX was equal in sharpness to The Sharp 20K sitting next to it, and the CES machines (all of them) were way beyond sharp (IMHO).

Having posted earlier that I was not impressed with the soft image this machine produced I now find

1. No motorised zoom
2. No motorised focus
3. No CIH stretch
4. No screen trigger
5. No curtain/Maskin trigger
6.No seperate RGB gain and offset

I wanted to buy 2 of these, but despite an impressive claimed CR This has got to be the most severely hobbled and gimped PJ going. Who is it aimed at? What a waste of an opertunity. These features have been standard on some makes for years. So sad that this machine is now no more than a toy.

3 would be nice as well as 6 but, I don't want or need the others. Maybe some will get off of the pre-buy and I'll get mine faster since I got on the list a couple days before the pre-buy was over. :)

Having posted earlier that I was not impressed with the soft image this machine produced I now find

1. No motorised zoom
2. No motorised focus
3. No CIH stretch
4. No screen trigger
5. No curtain/Maskin trigger
6.No seperate RGB gain and offset

I wanted to buy 2 of these, but despite an impressive claimed CR This has got to be the most severely hobbled and gimped PJ going. Who is it aimed at? What a waste of an opertunity. These features have been standard on some makes for years. So sad that this machine is now no more than a toy.
You forgot to add #7...

7. No $10,000 price tag like other higher end PJs, which still can't match the PQ of this "hobbled and gimped PJ".

You continue posting negative stuff about this product... yet you keep coming back into these threads. If you don't like this "gimped" PJ, don't buy it, and please stop spamming these threads. The bottom line is this PJ looks to offer the best PQ of any 1080p for the money. In order to do that, it had to be "gimped". I for one would rather NOT pay more for most of those features (like motorized lens) as I set it and leave it... it's certainly not worth it for me to spend hundreds more for luxury features I'll use only one or twice.

If you don't like it, move on... but please stop trolling.

So sad that this machine is now no more than a toy.

I am sooo looking forward to getting my hands on this new toy.

Does not the Sony Pearl have the same short comings concerning calibration as this projector? Hasn't William already said that this is likely cost cutting measures?

No. The Pearl allows full access to the LUTs and Uniformity data via RS232, same as the Ruby (Pearl does not have TCPIP access).

So far JVC is indicating that there is no access to calibration tables via RS232. I am hoping this is incorrect but that's the word right now.

William

From the UK showing of the projector yestarday going up against the Pearl with both ISF calibrated-

I carried out calibration of the JVC and the Pearl today at PJ. There is just as advanced greyscale calibration in the JVC as in the Pearl. The JVC is in fact more linear in response.


If this person is referring to the menu settings accessed via the remote control, I don't understand this statement at all. This must be referring to the factory's (JVC's or Sony's) calibration of this projector.

Having posted earlier that I was not impressed with the soft image this machine produced I now find

1. No motorised zoom
2. No motorised focus
3. No CIH stretch
4. No screen trigger
5. No curtain/Maskin trigger
6.No seperate RGB gain and offset

I wanted to buy 2 of these, but despite an impressive claimed CR This has got to be the most severely hobbled and gimped PJ going. Who is it aimed at? What a waste of an opertunity. These features have been standard on some makes for years. So sad that this machine is now no more than a toy.

Who do you work for? Sales slow? ;)

The supposed "soft" image reported was in a side by side demo in NY that never happened from what we can gather. Funny Tom Stites from JVC has said there never was/is a HD1/RS1 floating around NY :rolleyes:

Even PC made the comment in their CES report that the JVC was noticably sharper than the Pearl.


1. adjust this once and your done, for me at least. So dont care.
2. I would rather have a manual focus personally as it is easier to get precise sharpness
3. Not going to use, so dont care
4. Not going to use, so dont care
5. Not going to use, so dont care
6. Would be nice, but chances are there will be access to the LUT's somehow at some point.

No projector is perfect, but for many including me this one is as close as it gets at anywhere near its price. 1-chip DLP is out of the question due to rainbows, and the rest of the competition cant compete with the JVC overall in this price range or anywhere near it IMO.

If the JVC does not work for you, that is fine as there are many other options out there. To come in here and claim that this is "the most severely hobbled and gimped projector going" stinks of alterior motives :confused:

...... To come in here and claim that this is "the most severely hobbled and gimped projector going" stinks of alterior motives :confused:

That about sums it up. All the great advances that the JVC is reported to have made and still someone comes in to pronounce it soft and "hobbled and gimped". Thankfully I'm on the prebuy and will take the "physically challenged" JVC with pleasure. :)

Having posted earlier that I was not impressed with the soft image this machine produced I now find

1. No motorised zoom
2. No motorised focus
3. No CIH stretch
4. No screen trigger
5. No curtain/Maskin trigger
6.No seperate RGB gain and offset

I wanted to buy 2 of these, but despite an impressive claimed CR This has got to be the most severely hobbled and gimped PJ going. Who is it aimed at? What a waste of an opertunity. These features have been standard on some makes for years. So sad that this machine is now no more than a toy.

What is your problem ?, if you don't like the JVC DON'T BUY IT.......
BTW where in NY you saw the RS-1 ??

I don't want to be rude, but i guess you never really saw the JVC , or you just hate JVC ?

Impressions from UK shoot out are starting to come in! Check it out...

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=460012

That about sums it up. All the great advances that the JVC is reported to have made and still someone comes in to pronounce it soft and "hobbled and gimped". Thankfully I'm on the prebuy and will take the "physically challenged" JVC with pleasure. :)


I hear ya ;) Bring on the physically challenged :)

Atleast we have a bit of intermission entertainment until the next reports flow in. :D

It wouldn't surprise me at all if there were indeed ulterior motives to 'coldmachine's posts. He's only been around since November - it wouldn't surprise me at all if he was a rep for another projector manufacturer. :\

Yet another reason I have a problem with AVS and their allowing people to use 'handles' instead of their real names.

No. The Pearl allows full access to the LUTs and Uniformity data via RS232, same as the Ruby (Pearl does not have TCPIP access).

So far JVC is indicating that there is no access to calibration tables via RS232. I am hoping this is incorrect but that's the word right now.

William
Guess that means there is not going to be a lot that you can do with it then? This projector still is perfect for me but I can see how for die-hard videophiles it is not. Guess they will have to wait for the higher end models surely to come. I would remind everyone that even with these lack of controls this projector still was able to impress nearly everyone that has seen it. That's good enough for me. The scaler option seems to be the best solution if upon getting the projector you find a further need to calibrate and need to stretch for 2:35.

Impressions from UK shoot out are starting to come in! Check it out...

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=460012


Thanks Thunder - good to see the great reviews still piling in for this PJ!

Boy, Coldmachine is a busy little devil! :D over there too.

Yet another reason I have a problem with AVS and their allowing people to use 'handles' instead of their real names.

While I agree with you that there is something fishy about a few recent posters on the HD1, cant really blame or fault AVS for this. Even if they used peoples names short of asking them to fax in a copy of their SS card, passport, or a birth certicicate how could you ensure that people were using their real names?

Even with that information you could never really be certain. 8)

Besides, not everyone wants to take a chance on their coworkers, clients and friends knowing that they spent $50,000 on a 100" plasma or even just $20,000 on a Sony Qualia 004. 8)

Impressions from UK shoot out are starting to come in! Check it out...

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=460012
Ha ha, coldmachine is trolling over there too! :D

Once again, nothing but the highest praise about this new JVC... sounds very impressive by all accounts. :cool:

Ha ha, coldmachine is trolling over there too! :D



He just needs a HUG.... :D

No. The Pearl allows full access to the LUTs and Uniformity data via RS232, same as the Ruby (Pearl does not have TCPIP access).

So far JVC is indicating that there is no access to calibration tables via RS232. I am hoping this is incorrect but that's the word right now.

William

William, could you comment on the flat field uniformity of the HD1/RS1 units you have seen? How do they compare to an optimized HD10K or HD2K?

Thanks.

Mark

solid and consistent are the 2 words that come to mind every time I read new JVC impressions with this unit. The lack of DI seems to make a huge difference from all the comments and especially with this head to head report. Nice to hear about the obvious sharpness difference as well in the JVC's favor. I always personally thought the Pearl was plenty sharp, but I dont mind some improvement :D

Thanks for the UK link. It will be fun to read the impressions as they keep coming in. I got to call Jason and order my screen.......

William, could you comment on the flat field uniformity of the HD1/RS1 units you have seen? How do they compare to an optimized HD10K or HD2K?

Thanks.

Mark

Both units I have seen had serious uniformity issues, but both were likely to be pre-production units. Neither was typical of what I have seen from recent productionn JVC HD10K's, for example.

Exactly what I saw. I posted earlier about terrible uniformity. Why is it that some people seem to hold this unit as some sort of sacred cow that cannot be criticised. Ive seen it and it was great for a budget unit but not some PJ panacea. Not great, just good for the price.

coldmachine - why won't you tell us where/when you saw it and put all this speculation to rest? If you really did see this unit and provided this info you might get someone from here or in Europe to take you more seriously.

Just come back from a Pearl /HD1 shoot out. I can report my personal observations.
Both where calibrated to D65. Convergence on the JVC was accurate to one quarter of a pixel accross the whole screen. The Sony was about one half a pixel off (a good unit by all accounts)
Both firing on to a Microperf Stewart 130 about 8' wide, apparantly throwing at around three quarters max distance for the JVC.
1) The Star Field scene in SW1. Blacks definately a few clicks lower than the Sony removing in my opinion ALL of the haze. More Stars where revealed and where MUCH brighter. A much more convincing scene
2) Bright scenes . In my opinion very little difference here in terms of depth although the JVC has a marginal edge however this is where the JVCs optics shine and you get a much sharper image and a more pleasing image overall
3) Mixed high contrast scenes. Now this is where the differences become more obvious. The JVC is simply more three dimentional. Its obviously sharper, has much more depth, brighter and has more pop.
I guess no surprises for me then but did it live up to the hype ?......... oh yes.

We played around with Standard Def from a high end DVD player, Mediabox and HDAX1 for HD. in everything I saw the new contender was a winner.

In my opinion I recon the extra bucks are worth the JVC but the reality is that both yeild a fantastic image which most will be more than happy with.

If like me you are an EX crt er then its a no brainer, you will need the JVC to get the black base level that we love.

You forgot to add #7...

7. No $10,000 price tag like other higher end PJs, which still can't match the PQ of this "hobbled and gimped PJ".

You continue posting negative stuff about this product... yet you keep coming back into these threads. If you don't like this "gimped" PJ, don't buy it, and please stop spamming these threads. The bottom line is this PJ looks to offer the best PQ of any 1080p for the money. In order to do that, it had to be "gimped". I for one would rather NOT pay more for most of those features (like motorized lens) as I set it and leave it... it's certainly not worth it for me to spend hundreds more for luxury features I'll use only one or twice.

If you don't like it, move on... but please stop trolling.

I don't mind someone posting an alternate position as long as facts are used. What he posted is true. His opinion may differ from others, that's OK. I don't consider his post spam

No. The Pearl allows full access to the LUTs and Uniformity data via RS232, same as the Ruby (Pearl does not have TCPIP access).

So far JVC is indicating that there is no access to calibration tables via RS232. I am hoping this is incorrect but that's the word right now.

WilliamI've found the 3D Gamma in the service menu to be of great help in correcting panel nonuniformity in my Pearl. I hope the RS1 will not have this issue - from early reports it isn't but I'd like to have the option of fixing this on my own if it crops up.

I'd also like to be able to deal with color shifts as the bulb ages, so I'll be following wm's and others' reports about calibration control access.

Dan

I don't mind someone posting an alternate position as long as facts are used. What he posted is true. His opinion may differ from others, that's OK. I don't consider his post spam

I welcome an alternate position, IF it is based on facts like you say. So far, we have no evidence or proof to his claims so at this point these claims are spam. From all indications there was not even a HD1/RS1 in NY at the time or prior :confused:


Thanks for the report 008! Sounds like a nice step up from an already great projector (Pearl).

The points on my list are fact

the sky is blue

water is wet

coldmachine has some sort of beef with JVC

"The points on my list are fact" - you could also add it doesn't come with a $3k rebate or a date with a supermodel - give it a rest man

just answering someone who called me on facts. No beef at all, I wanted this to be great.

The points on my list are fact


Not buying it. You cant even give the name of the shop and where it was located exactly? This could be easily confirmed or denied with a phone call if you would simply give us this info. Until that point, I am calling BS.

Its BS that there is no trigger? No CIH? Only global RGB controls....They are facts dude, facts

Its BS that there is no trigger? No CIH? Only global RGB controls....They are facts dude, facts


"dude" my bad for the misquote, that is a list of facts, but only the calibration issue is worth mentioning for most. You did not answer my question. What was the name of the shop you saw the JVC at supposedly, and where was it located exactly in NY?

No, you said BS because i didnt state where i saw it. The 2 are clearly unrelated.

Cold-
People would give you and your opinions far more credibility if you answer one question. You know the question. If there is a reason why you wish to keep that off the Forum, you ought to provide that explanation instead. As it stands, your silence is deafening.

Just seen the JVC demo here in the UK, I have always been a fan of DLPs image depth but after seeing the RS1 I wouldn't buy a single-chip anything anymore. Outdated technology, its great that you can get DLP 3D like image depth for a decent price now, with NO rainbows. I own a C3X BTW. Believe the hype on this one, only the very best single chippers beat it in terms of sharpness and depth but not by a very perceivable amount. This is the perfect stop-gap before 1080p 3 chip arrives. Given the choice, and if the price was the same, I would take the RS1 over the D80. Single-chip DLP, your days are numbered.
Oh, and just for the sake of clarity - I saw it at PJHifi in Guildford. They showed clips of Harry Potter 4 on HD DVD so you know I am telling the truth. And it looked awesome :D

I have also seen the jvc demo in the uk this evenning and yes after seeing the RS1 running I have ordered one!

I was going to get a Pearl after seeing one awhile ago,but as I had to wait till the new year before I could do anything the Jvc is now the one for me :D

I have gone over from a line doubled crt.

The points on my list are fact

That doesn't matter. Nobody is going to believe anything you say since you refuse to answer a very simple and straightforward question.

Your credibility is severely lacking at this point. :rolleyes:

008,

"We played around with Standard Def from a high end DVD player, Mediabox and HDAX1 for HD. in everything I saw the new contender was a winner."

Thanks for your impressions, I'm especially glad to hear it did well with SD, as that info has been sparse so far.

I have also seen the jvc demo in the uk this evenning and yes after seeing the RS1 running I have ordered one!

I was going to get a Pearl after seeing one awhile ago,but as I had to wait till the new year before I could do anything the Jvc is now the one for me :D

I have gone over from a line doubled crt.

Congrats, I don't blame you. I still can't get over how sharp and pleasingly 3D the picture was. 2.35:1 (if you can't see the black bars who needs a lens), HD DVD, with the possibilty of sitting on top of the screen and no rainbows is going to be a real treat.

Just to put this to rest:

The srp of the RS1 is $6,295. We have (4) units coming 3-4 week in February and have confirmed the srp.

AAahh great! Thanks guys.... That is NOT a remote in my pocket, and after reading these posts, I have to change my shorts again!.... :eek:

Anyone ask the JVC guys about there 2.35 tv? Are they're by chance looking at making a 2.35x1 projector? How about a 2.35 version of the RS1 - that'd save us all from having to worry about the lack of a vertical stretch feature on the RS1. I could get myself to hold off a year on this thing if there's any chance thats in the works for early 2008.

Those are some awesome reports on this baby thanks everyone!

Sounds like the RS1 is all that and more.

if you can't see the black bars who needs a lens

If the black bars really are BLACK all a lens would give you is more lumens.

Now, when will HD DVD makers build the stretch into the SOURCE MATERIAL. Dual layer discs could have two versions, one stretch the other normal. That way we could get full 1080 vertical resolution in a 2.35 setup. I guess it's not really worth having more ppi vertical than horizontal, though.

ok, by all accounts, a real winner here...but someone please explain why the UK folks get a 3 year warranty and we don't?! Sorry, had to find SOMETHING to gripe about. What gives?

If the black bars really are BLACK all a lens would give you is more lumens.

Now, when will HD DVD makers build the stretch into the SOURCE MATERIAL. Dual layer discs could have two versions, one stretch the other normal. That way we could get full 1080 vertical resolution in a 2.35 setup. I guess it's not really worth having more ppi vertical than horizontal, though.

Well, absolute black is a bit of an over statement. Blacker bars than any of the competition and with a little tweaking I bet you could get them to disappear. The funniest thing was that I had read about people saying how incredible full blackouts between adverts were and when the first one happened, I heard a murmoured "It's true!" come from the guy next to me. Obviously reading the same threads as me. Very impressive, if not absolutely perfect.

I'd like to thank all of our friends from the UK for their reviews and input! :cool:

I was excited but reserved over the last couple of months... now I'm just plain giddy : )

Cheers!!
Joey

Any of the UK people, when you asked about the possibility of vertical stretch, did you get warm and fuzzies or think the "we are working on it" is just a nice way to say no?

Any of the UK people, when you asked about the possibility of vertical stretch, did you get warm and fuzzies or think the "we are working on it" is just a nice way to say no?

Someone asked and they said that they are looking into the feasibility of implementing it. So who knows...

I finally got the chance to go read the cine4home review of the HD1. I was completely blown away by the results, especially having been partial to DLP-based projectors for quite some time. My only question is: is this kind of colorspace and D65K accuracy going to be indicative of final production units, or was the pre-production unit calibrated specifically for the reviewers? If we can expect these kinds of results from factory units - 600 lumens at D65K (700 in high mode), >15,000:1 native CR...WOW. I'll jump on this thing as SOON as it is available.

The following quote is an impression from the RS1/Pearl demo done today in the UK and is from the UK based AVForums:

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4143912&postcount=33

Thanks go out to VirusKiller for posting some great info.
OK. I was there for five hours! :eek: :eek: :eek: (Well, I had to avoid the M25 rush hour traffic...).

It is stunning - everything I have been waiting a long time for.

I endorse all of Chris' (UrbanT's) comments. Here are some of my own:

1) The Gennum VXP processing is outstanding. Deinterlacing of SD (PAL) and HD video and film was superb. Scaling was equally impressive - on good quality DVD transfers (e.g. Star Wars Ep. IV, Phantom of the Opera, Robbie Williams Live at the Albert Hall), I detected no ringing.

2) The JVC was considerably sharper than the Pearl. And Elliot considered the Pearl on demo to be amongst the best he has seen. Pretty certain this is primarily down to the lens. When viewing grid patterns, it was clear that the degree of Pearl misconvergence varied across the image. The HD1 misconvergence (1/4 pixel after a single red pixel correction horizonally) appeared to be linear across the panel. i.e. panel misconvergence rather than a lens effect.

3) The differences between Pearl and HD1 were much more apparent on HD-DVD than upscaled DVD. However, the JVC image simply had more depth to it for both types of material.

4) The simulaneous contrast was breathtaking. The droid scene inside the Jawa transported was a revelation in the shadow detail.

5) The colours were glorious and flesh tones were natural.

6) The JVC was simply more colourful and punchy than the Pearl.

7) When fed an 100IRE full screen signal from a Lumagen ProHDP, colour uniformity issues were obvious on the Pearl. The HD1 screen simply looked white!

On the technical side, I spent 20 mins with the HD1's designer, Alex Kobayashi, and can confirm the following:

1) 480i60 and 576i50 are accepted over HDMI.

2) 1080p24 is accepted, frame doubled to 1080p48 and displayed using 96Hz processing at the D-ILA panel.

3) 1080i50 and 1080p50 are accepted and displayed using 100Hz processing at the panel.

4) 1080i60 and 1080p60 are accepted and displayed using 120Hz processing at the panel.

5) 1080p48 is not in the EDID table.

6) JVC are looking to see if the vertical stretch feature is possible.

7) Firmware upgrades are technically possible, but I got the feeling that they would require JVC to do them.

8) The blanked off panel is a factory connection for firmware upgrades (in conjunction with the RS232C).

9) Currently, 60i --> 24p processing for the removal of 3:2 cadence judder has not been implemented. I got the impression we wouldn't get this for the HD1. More of an HD2 feature.

10) User editing of the EDID table is not possible (for 576i out of SkyHD boxes).

11) Settings such as DNR (noise reduction) and Sharpness are global memories per physical input. That means that an HDMI switching solution prior to the HD1 precludes easy per-source calibration.

I put in my order for this on Monday morning. Tonight's demo completely justified my faith in all of the pre-production reports we've been getting. The single thing that prevents 10/10 from my perspective is that 480i60 and 1080i60 film material are displayed with 3:2 cadence judder. That's it and of course this is correctable with an external video processor.

I warmly congratulated Alex on his achievement. He and his team have achieved the "impossible" - a projector with virtually no flaws. This one will sell a lot. :thumbsup:

Joel

Cool! :cool:

11) Settings such as DNR (noise reduction) and Sharpness are global memories per physical input. That means that an HDMI switching solution prior to the HD1 precludes easy per-source calibration.

I put in my order for this on Monday morning. Tonight's demo completely justified my faith in all of the pre-production reports we've been getting. The single thing that prevents 10/10 from my perspective is that 480i60 and 1080i60 film material are displayed with 3:2 cadence judder. That's it and of course this is correctable with an external video processor.

Yep, still looks like there are good reasons for an external VP, despite having Gennum processing built in.

Cool! :cool:
11) Settings such as DNR (noise reduction) and Sharpness are global memories per physical input. That means that an HDMI switching solution prior to the HD1 precludes easy per-source calibration.

I put in my order for this on Monday morning. Tonight's demo completely justified my faith in all of the pre-production reports we've been getting. The single thing that prevents 10/10 from my perspective is that 480i60 and 1080i60 film material are displayed with 3:2 cadence judder. That's it and of course this is correctable with an external video processor.
Yep, still looks like there are good reasons for an external VP, despite having Gennum processing built in.
The only folks who will think this is cool are current VP owners getting additional mileage from their previous purchase. ;)

Those of us without a VP will think this sucks and see it as an unnecessary expense. :(

The only folks who will think this is cool are current VP owners getting additional mileage from their previous purchase. ;)

Those of us without a VP will think this sucks and see it as an unnecessary expense. :(

Oops, guess I didn't make myself clear.

My "cool" comment was directed at all the positive comments regarding the JVC's PQ and other features.

My comment about still having good reasons for a VP even though the JVC has Gennum built in was meant as a negative, though I didn't make that clear. I do not have a VP, so I "feel your pain"! ;)

I do not have a VP, so I "feel your pain"! ;)
Misery loves company. ;)

Don't worry, there's always the RS2. It will have access to the LUT's and will take full advantage of the Gennum chip's capabilities and to top it off, it'll be $1K cheaper :p

Both units I have seen had serious uniformity issues, but both were likely to be pre-production units. Neither was typical of what I have seen from recent productionn JVC HD10K's, for example.

William - That's disappointing to hear about the uniformity issues you saw. Hopefully that is related to pre-production units only.

Can you please comment on just how flat the grayscale was? For instance what was the measured dE from 10-100 IRE, and how well did it hold up under 10 IRE? Thanks.

Cool! :cool:



Yep, still looks like there are good reasons for an external VP, despite having Gennum processing built in.


What projectors in the RS1 price range CAN display 480i and 1080i without 3:2 cadence judder with there own internal processing? Can the Pearl do this?

Any of the UK people, when you asked about the possibility of vertical stretch, did you get warm and fuzzies or think the "we are working on it" is just a nice way to say no?

I cant, wont attempt to pronounce his name but the designer of the RS/HD was in the room at the shoot out. The HD1 DOES NOT do the stretch and I was told that the RS1 would be identical except for cosmetics. Sorry.

What projectors in the RS1 price range CAN display 480i and 1080i without 3:2 cadence judder with there own internal processing?None that I know of...
Can the Pearl do this?No.

Guess that smithfarmer has saved me the trouble of posting over here!

Incidentally, I would highlight the fact that on the demo unit I saw no panel uniformity issues at any IRE level - black was black and white was white. TBH, if this level of uniformity is consistent in production models, I'm not sure what room there is for LUT tweaks. Obviously this was a subjective opinion. YMMV.

The internal Gennum processing is so good, I'm planning on living without a VP for a while.

That makes 1 "possibly" uniform panel reported and at least 3 defective ones. Not a good ratio.

Jagercola.....It sounds like a polite way to say no to me.

coldmachine - has it occured to you that the model seen last night is the most recent of them all and that JVC have been improving the manufacturing and calibration process continually since the first models were seen at CEDIA? That first very-pre-production model is still knocking around at shows in the US.

Yes VK. And if true then this PJ becomes more attractive to me. I am not a hater in any way and am in the market for 2 budget machines for games rooms. If this issue and the softness were addressed I'd far rather buy 2 of these these than 2 D80s or HT3000s. The money saved would pay for the anamorphic lens I will need for my Theatre room.

Im also amazed that there seem only to be 3 overscan values (5,10, 15%) I'm used to total control. Does the crippled aspect ratio selection also mean there is no 1:1 pixel mapping?

The following quote is an impression from the RS1/Pearl demo done today in the UK and is from the UK based AVForums:

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4143912&postcount=33

Thanks go out to VirusKiller for posting some great info.

Geeeze. This is a bold statement: :)

"I warmly congratulated Alex on his achievement. He and his team have achieved the "impossible" - a projector with virtually no flaws. This one will sell a lot."

FWIW, Elliot has just posted that Alex (HD1 designer) considered last night's unit to have relatively poor convergence. And that unit was under 1/2 pixel across the full screen with a 1 horizontal red pixel user adjustment. Encouraging if they really have nailed down the tolerances in the pre-production period.

Geeeze. This is a bold statement: :)

"I warmly congratulated Alex on his achievement. He and his team have achieved the "impossible" - a projector with virtually no flaws. This one will sell a lot."Yes it is and it is a statement obviously from my perspective. The statement should probably have been caveated with "at its price point". I have no doubt though that many people will find in the HD1 a projector that they can live with for a very long time.

...that unit was under 1/2 pixel across the full screen with a 1 horizontal red pixel user adjustment. Encouraging if they really have nailed down the tolerances in the pre-production period.

UPS will always have the last word on convergence.... :)

Hate the thought of a projector being tossed on and off planes and trucks.

Im also amazed that there seem only to be 3 overscan values (5,10, 15%) I'm used to total control. Does the crippled aspect ratio selection also mean there is no 1:1 pixel mapping?

Does the unit not have the ability to display with no overscan? (Someone other than coldmachine answering this question would be appreciated.)

UPS will always have the last word on convergence.... :)

Hate the thought of a projector being tossed on and off planes and trucks.

You jest, but you may have something there. I worked for UPS for a short time many years ago loading trucks. Those damn boxes never stopped coming, and it was either toss them or be buried under them! Add the explosion of internet sales over the years, and I'm sure they haven't slowed down the conveyor belts.

Maybe that's why JVC wants to limit the internet sales, as was previously indicated here. That is IF the panel alignment is that sensitive to being tossed around...who knows.

Mark

Does the unit not have the ability to display with no overscan? (Someone other than coldmachine answering this question would be appreciated.)

Yes, I saw the HD1 manual online and there was an option for no overscan.

You jest, but you may have something there. I worked for UPS for a short time many years ago loading trucks. Those damn boxes never stopped coming, and it was either toss them or be buried under them! Add the explosion of internet sales over the years, and I'm sure they haven't slowed down the conveyor belts.

Maybe that's why JVC wants to limit the internet sales, as was previously indicated here. That is IF the panel alignment is that sensitive to being tossed around...who knows.

Mark

Whether it's internet sales or local dealer sales, someone is still tossing that box around on its way somewhere.

I worked at Fedex for several years loading freight in planes - trust me, same issue there as well.

Maybe Jason can personally drive these units to us? :D

Does the unit not have the ability to display with no overscan? (Someone other than coldmachine answering this question would be appreciated.)They appear to have missed overscan from the manual. I checked all of the menus myself last night and overscan was set to zero or off (can't remember which).

Sorry if this is too basic a question, but what are the advantages and disadvantages to turning overscan off?

yes there is a no overscan option.

VK there is overscan in the manual...I read it last week.

UPS will always have the last word on convergence.... :)

Hate the thought of a projector being tossed on and off planes and trucks.
Air shippments cause the least damage. It may well be worth the extra cost to have these projectors shipped 2nd day air.

No. That's the kicker. You should certainly think that would be the case, but its not. And this has been confirmed William Phelps through is own experimentation. As I understand it, the controls apply GLOBALLY to the entire range. I am looking for a "shake head" icon to end this message with but don't see one - so I'll just use this :shake:


This is true.. Actually there are two RGB options one called Color Temp and one Offset and both influence the entire range. This is unusual.

However, I was able to reach an almost perfect grayscale from 10 IRE on with the RGB options as the HD1 was very linear in response.

Also, Color uniformity was fantastic of that machine. I can not confirm any issues here.

What i miss more are options to influence the color space.

Regards,
Ekkehart

Can someone please elaborate on what constraints, if any, are put on external processor/switcher capabilities such as Lumagen and DVDO by this projector's apparent use of *GLOBAL* memories for HDMI? Evidently this projector requires use of an external processor to enable gray scale calibration in the field and when using anamorphic lense for 2.35. In what ways will the usefulness of the external processor be limited by the global HDMI setting requirements of the projector? I plan to use the external box as both a switcher and a processor. I tentatively plan to have a HD DVD player, a Blu-ray player, a computer, and a hd cable receiver connected to the Lumagen or DVDO.

Quote below is from a JVC related post in the UK AV forum

11) Settings such as DNR (noise reduction) and Sharpness are global memories per physical input. That means that an HDMI switching solution prior to the HD1 precludes easy per-source calibration.

"Settings such as DNR (noise reduction) and Sharpness are global memories per physical input. That means that an HDMI switching solution prior to the HD1 precludes easy per-source calibration."

To quote some long forgotten British writer ;) , I think this is "much ado about nothing".

Maybe I am missing something but, after reading through the manual I can't understand where the idea of "per physical input" is coming from. All the things people seem to be worried about, Contrast, Brightness, Color, Sharpness, DNR, Color Temp., Gamma and Offset are stored in the six image profiles. I don't see any prohibition to using any of them on any input.

Personally, I intend to use a HDMI switcher and set up a profile for each source. My programmable remote will handle setting the correct profile when I select a particular source. BTW, kudos to JVC for giving us discreet IR commands for power ON/OFF, inputs and profiles.

Do I have concerns about several thing on the RS-1? You bet I do! But, despite the calibration and F/W upgradability issues, I am still convinced that it is the best "bang for the bucks" available today.

NOTE TO JASON: If the UK guys got a 3 year warranty for the pre-buy, I hope you guys are pushing for the same thing here!

Can someone please elaborate on what constraints, if any, are put on external processor/switcher capabilities such as Lumagen and DVDO by this projector's apparent use of *GLOBAL* memories for HDMI? Evidently this projector requires use of an external processor to enable gray scale calibration in the field and when using anamorphic lense for 2.35. In what ways will the usefulness of the external processor be limited by the global HDMI setting requirements of the projector? I plan to use the external box as both a switcher and a processor. I tentatively plan to have a HD DVD player, a Blu-ray player, a computer, and a hd cable receiver connected to the Lumagen or DVDO.

Quote below is from a JVC related post in the UK AV forumWith a VP, like the Lumagen, you have four user memories per input. This would mean that the projector is calibrated to a reference signal, then each input device is corrected in the Lumagen for proper output. You have many calibration options at that point even if you have a HD-STB that can output "native", you can calibrate for each input signal, 1080i, 720p, 480p.....

Whether it's internet sales or local dealer sales, someone is still tossing that box around on its way somewhere.

I worked at Fedex for several years loading freight in planes - trust me, same issue there as well.

Agreed. However, in bulk shipment situations, would they not be containerized and/or palletized on the freight plane and therefore moved around by materials handling equipment like forklifts, pallet loaders, etc.?

Sorry, the bulk of my airlift experience is limited to military cargo (go Air Force!), which uses the pallet system. I have seen air freight operations where they use those thin aluminum boxes which are loaded inside the plane.

I think the AVS Pre-buy would be in sufficient numbers to be containerized on the plane and then moved via common carrier freight, which use pallets. Should be a much smoother trip from Japan to AVS Headquarters, I would surmise.

Mark

This is true.. Actually there are two RGB options one called Color Temp and one Offset and both influence the entire range. This is unusual.

However, I was able to reach an almost perfect grayscale from 10 IRE on with the RGB options as the HD1 was very linear in response.

Also, Color uniformity was fantastic of that machine. I can not confirm any issues here.

What i miss more are options to influence the color space.

Regards,
Ekkehart

Thanks for the update. Just out of curiosity did you use the Color Temp or the Offset to dial in the grayscale? Do these controls appear identical or perhaps one has a somewhat different affect than the other?

Glad to hear about how flat it was. What was the dE from 10-100? I'd like to know what the largest (relatively speaking) dE error was in that range.

I'm also quite interested to know how it does at 5 IRE. With the amazing on/off CR and black level this pj has, it may be more important than ever to have these very low IREs dialed in very well...

Can someone explain to me the vertical/horizontal offset formula. I see that it is 34 degrees max horizontal, but how do you calculate how far off center you can place the PJ for a given screen size/throw distance.

Agreed. However, in bulk shipment situations, would they not be containerized and/or palletized on the freight plane and therefore moved around by materials handling equipment like forklifts, pallet loaders, etc.?

Sorry, the bulk of my airlift experience is limited to military cargo (go Air Force!), which uses the pallet system. I have seen air freight operations where they use those thin aluminum boxes which are loaded inside the plane.

I think the AVS Pre-buy would be in sufficient numbers to be containerized on the plane and then moved via common carrier freight, which use pallets. Should be a much smoother trip from Japan to AVS Headquarters, I would surmise.

Mark

Mark - Having worked at Fedex I can tell you that what you describe is correct - but that UPS does something very similar on their end from a trucking standpoint as well. They consolidate their trucks and load them much like you describe with aircraft containers to minimize handling. Both have to break down that consolidation once arriving at the destination station and then load on a delivery truck. They both drive for efficiency in the minimization of handling of individual boxes - so I think it is a moot point regardless.

BTW - UPS does airfreight as well and every PJ that ships from Japan will be going via airfreight so I'm not sure that there will be any difference there either.

Key point is that the people handling our precious PJ's don't care 2 cents what's inside - they handle all the freight the same. And if they are loading a truck or an airfreight can they will be tossing the boxes and they will be "cramming" them into their respective travel location to maximize density. JVC has to package around carrier abuse and I'm sure they've worked that out long ago. Given that, if someone runs over it with a fork lift, throws it 15 feet out of the plane on to the tarmac, stacks a chevy engine block on top of it, etc. there is nothing that is going to prevent damage. (Saw each of those events happen to freight in my course of working in the industry)

This is true.. Actually there are two RGB options one called Color Temp and one Offset and both influence the entire range. This is unusual.

However, I was able to reach an almost perfect grayscale from 10 IRE on with the RGB options as the HD1 was very linear in response.

Also, Color uniformity was fantastic of that machine. I can not confirm any issues here.

What i miss more are options to influence the color space.

Regards,
Ekkehart

Ekkehart, would you please comment on white field uniformity? I believe that is what folks are concerned about when they mention uniformity.

Also, how flat was the grayscale? For instance, what was the measured dE from 10-100 IRE, and how well did it hold up under 10 IRE?

Thanks.

Mark

P.S. - Sorry LovingDVD...beat 'ya to it :p Edit: I guess not...you are too fast for me!

Can someone who has experience with the JVC G-15 and has seen the JVC RS-1 comment on how the RS-1 would stack up as a replacement for the G-15? I have been fairly well satisfied with the light output of the G-15 on my 130" DIY Screen GOO screen, and I have a completely darkened light controlled room with a well masked screen. Although I have been satisfied with the light out put of the G-15 I often wished it could be just a little bit brighter after a few hundred hours on the bulb. I am beginning to plan on a replacement for the G-15 and want to plan for the future.

Thanks, Larry Raulston

Well, it's good to hear that Ekkehart was able to dial in accurate greyscale with the JVC's weird adjustment options. Getting it flat to 10 IRE would satisfy my requirements as I don't trust the probe readings below that. I'll just have to wait and see how a production model performs when I get one.

Cal,

The offset percentages (V-80% and H-34%) do not relate to degrees of offset, they relate to percentage of image height or width, respectively. An example...100" wide screen x 34% =34" offset left or right from center of the screen. Or, 100" high screen x 80% = 80" offset up or down from the center of the screen. So, conceivably you could be 30" above the top or bottom of the image ( center of screen to top or bottom of image=50")

Cheers,

The RGB dials in the Color Temp Menu use the "Hi Bright" (native color Temp) as basis and from there you can reduce R,G and B in many very small steps.

The response is very flat. In a short time I got this result:

http://www.cine4home.de/Specials/JVC_HD1_2/HD1%20RGB%20Levels%20Histogram%20opt.jpg

Please note that in this diagram there is no direct 5IRE measurement, so probably the HD1 is closer at 5IRE than this diagram shows.


The Uniformity in white and grey was superb, there was NO noticable shading.


Regards,
Ekkehart

They appear to have missed overscan from the manual. I checked all of the menus myself last night and overscan was set to zero or off (can't remember which).

Thank you. And is it possible to achieve 1:1 pixel mapping from an external video processor?

Thank you. And is it possible to achieve 1:1 pixel mapping from an external video processor?


1:1 Pixel mapping is possible (No overscan with HDTV), but the HD1 has no overscan option. It has a blanking option instead.

With 576p/i material, it has an overscan which can not be switched off.

Regards,
Ekkehart

The RGB dials in the Color Temp Menu use the "Hi Bright" (native color Temp) as basis and from there you can reduce R,G and B in many very small steps.

Thanks Ekkehart. Sounds like you can get excellent greyscale tracking with the available controls. It's just the labeling of them that's odd.

Looking forward to your full review. :)

The RGB dials in the Color Temp Menu use the "Hi Bright" (native color Temp) as basis and from there you can reduce R,G and B in many very small steps.

The response is very flat. In a short time I got this result:

http://www.cine4home.de/Specials/JVC_HD1_2/HD1%20RGB%20Levels%20Histogram%20opt.jpg

Please note that in this diagram there is no direct 5IRE measurement, so probably the HD1 is closer at 5IRE than this diagram shows.


The Uniformity in white and grey was superb, there was NO noticable shading.


Regards,
Ekkehart


That looks identical to what we saw after calibration :D

Don't know how reliable this is, from our European friends:

Quote: "There will be a public tool for LUT access once the old analogue tool has been re-written for the new digital drive device, its just not ready yet, i have this from the top"

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=460012&page=9
Post #129

Don't know how reliable this is, from our European friends:

Quote: "There will be a public tool for LUT access once the old analogue tool has been re-written for the new digital drive device, its just not ready yet, i have this from the top"

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=460012&page=9
Post #129

That would be sweet! :)

The RGB dials in the Color Temp Menu use the "Hi Bright" (native color Temp) as basis and from there you can reduce R,G and B in many very small steps.

The response is very flat. In a short time I got this result:

http://www.cine4home.de/Specials/JVC_HD1_2/HD1%20RGB%20Levels%20Histogram%20opt.jpg

Please note that in this diagram there is no direct 5IRE measurement, so probably the HD1 is closer at 5IRE than this diagram shows.


The Uniformity in white and grey was superb, there was NO noticable shading.


Regards,
Ekkehart

Excellent news indeed! Thanks for posting. Looks like 0-1 dE from 40 and up - very sweet. Do you recall what the dE was at max from the 10-30 range?

And feel for when your next in depth review will be available? Very much looking forward to your detailed impressions now that you have had some good time to play with the unit.

Very much looking forward to your detailed impressions now that you have had some good time to play with the unit.
Hopefully it will be up by Friday evening. Would make for some great discussions over the weekend. :)

Can someone who has experience with the JVC G-15 and has seen the JVC RS-1 comment on how the RS-1 would stack up as a replacement for the G-15? I have been fairly well satisfied with the light output of the G-15 on my 130" DIY Screen GOO screen, and I have a completely darkened light controlled room with a well masked screen. Although I have been satisfied with the light out put of the G-15 I often wished it could be just a little bit brighter after a few hundred hours on the bulb. I am beginning to plan on a replacement for the G-15 and want to plan for the future.

Thanks, Larry Raulston

The RS1 should be better in every respect. The D65 calibrated lumens should be fairly close, but the RS1 will probably look brighter and punchier because it has much better contrast (800:1 vs 15000:1). It has higher resolution, less visible SDE, better grey scale tracking, shading uniformity, etc, etc. It should be close to a night and day difference.

Hopefully it will be up by Friday evening. Would make for some great discussions over the weekend. :)


LUT's of luck. :)

With 576p/i material, it has an overscan which can not be switched off.With analogue inputs or over HDMI as well?

With 576p/i material, it has an overscan which can not be switched off.

Will the projector sync to 50hz, and if so does this locked-in overscan problem also affect a 1080p50 input?

I would use an external DVDO VP50 for scaling and frame rate conversion. I just want to make sure that the projector can accept 1080p60, 1080p48, and 1080p50 and still achieve 1:1 pixel mapping without overscan on all of them.

Will the projector sync to 50hz, and if so does this locked-in overscan problem also affect a 1080p50 input?

I would use an external DVDO VP50 for scaling and frame rate conversion. I just want to make sure that the projector can accept 1080p60, 1080p48, and 1080p50 and still achieve 1:1 pixel mapping without overscan on all of them.

It will do 60hz and 50hz no problem but not 48hz.

I wonder if you can get a HTPC to output 1080p24?

Edit:
Never mind .. a quick search at the HTPC forum answered the question with a YES.
So I'm no longer bothered by the lack of 1080p48 :)

Ekkehart,

I asked Tom Stites about this, but perhaps when you can get this info easier than he can.

I'd like to build my auxiliary ventilation unit and have it ready to go when the RS1 arrives.

But now I'm uncertain how to proceed after seeing the online manual showing the air filter on the bottom; I assumed it was behind the intake on the front of the unit.

Are there two different airflow paths, one filtered and one not?

Perhaps the unfiltered one is for the lamp and the filtered one is for the panels, and combines downstream with the lamp airstream?

Perhaps you can answer these questions after dissecting the RS1 :)

Thanks very much

Ekkehart,

I asked Tom Stites about this, but perhaps when you can get this info easier than he can.

I'd like to build my auxiliary ventilation unit and have it ready to go when the RS1 arrives.

But now I'm uncertain how to proceed after seeing the online manual showing the air filter on the bottom; I assumed it was behind the intake on the front of the unit.

Are there two different airflow paths, one filtered and one not?

Perhaps the unfiltered one is for the lamp and the filtered one is for the panels, and combines downstream with the lamp airstream?

Perhaps you can answer these questions after dissecting the RS1 :)

Thanks very much
My impression was the exhaust was through the front. I know the left front (looking at the projector, on table) is exhaust, I didn't think to check the right.

It will do 60hz and 50hz no problem but not 48hz.

I thought we already established that it will accept 48hz and display at 96hz?

I'm thinking although it's a bit more $, the Sharp XV-Z20000 will provide a better picture especially in rooms w/ any ambient light.

I thought we already established that it will accept 48hz and display at 96hz?

not quite (at least according to threads here) ... accepts 24hz, frame-doubles to 48hz, then displays at 96hz. But it won't accept a 48hz input directly.

paul

I'm thinking although it's a bit more $, the Sharp XV-Z20000 will provide a better picture especially in rooms w/ any ambient light.

Sharp does look nice, I've had 2 demos now.

My only concern is the louder fan noise (and price :) ) with our seating right below and in front of the projector. After hearing the near silence of the Pearl and then the silent Mits HC5000, I just wish a similar sounding 1080P DLP was available.

If I had a longer room, the Sharp would be in it already.

not quite (at least according to threads here) ... accepts 24hz, frame-doubles to 48hz, then displays at 96hz. But it won't accept a 48hz input directly.

That could still work for me. My VP will output 24hz.

That RS1 looks very interesting. I love my Ruby, but don't like the Iris trick they use to get the cont ratio they brag about, makes the image to dark, especially for a 120" screen. So if I get it right the RS1 will do the 15-1 cont but not loose it's brightness to do it?

That RS1 looks very interesting. I love my Ruby, but don't like the Iris trick they use to get the cont ratio they brag about, makes the image to dark, especially for a 120" screen. So if I get it right the RS1 will do the 15-1 cont but not loose it's brightness to do it?You won't be the first to replace their Ruby with a RS1

Edit

The third review (http://www.cine4home.de) of cine4home is on line now.

Thank You! :)

No, sorry it's a mistake.
It's not a review.

Ekkehart,

I asked Tom Stites about this, but perhaps when you can get this info easier than he can.

I'd like to build my auxiliary ventilation unit and have it ready to go when the RS1 arrives.

But now I'm uncertain how to proceed after seeing the online manual showing the air filter on the bottom; I assumed it was behind the intake on the front of the unit.

Are there two different airflow paths, one filtered and one not?

Perhaps the unfiltered one is for the lamp and the filtered one is for the panels, and combines downstream with the lamp airstream?

Perhaps you can answer these questions after dissecting the RS1 :)

Thanks very much


Hi there,


Of course we already dissected the machine :-)

Yes, the HD1 actually has a second air intake on the bottom for the light engine. The filter is reachable from the side though.


Regards,
Ekkehart

Ekkehart, when do you expect to post your detailed review of the HD1?

"Yes, the HD1 actually has a second air intake on the bottom for the light engine. "

Thanks. I guess since there's only one exhaust, the filtered and unfiltered air must combine somewhere inside.

Yes, the HD1 actually has a second air intake on the bottom for the light engine. The filter is reachable from the side though.

Regards,
Ekkehart
With the release of the RS1 owners manual and a certain instruction stressing the necessity of cleaning this filter to prevent dust blobs, there have been a few posts regarding these types of filters and that they are of low quality. I have no first hand experience with any LCD/SXRD/LCOS pj's, only DLP. Can anyone expound on the inherent quality/performance of this type of filtering?

Also, with this filtered air intake residing on the bottom of the pj, I'd imagine that for those who choose to do an inverted ceiling mount that this will require a much shorter cleaning cycle as it would then be on the top where it will be more susceptible to dust accumulation.

Ekkehart, when do you expect to post your detailed review of the HD1?
The message in German:

Und auch Cine4Home ist mit dabei: In der letzten Wochen hatten wir das erste Gerät in unserem Studio und konnten den HD1 an mehreren Tagen ausführlich auf Herz und Nieren prüfen. Dazu veröffentlichen wir einen wie gewohnt ausführlichen Test. Doch wer vorab schon unsere Ergebnisse bzgl. Vor- und Nachteile dieses neuen High-End Beamers von uns erfahren und diese mit uns diskutieren möchte, der ist herzlich eingeladen: Wir werden ebenfalls am 27. Januar persönlich vor Ort sein und unsere Eindrücke ausführlich erläutern.

seems to be something like:
Also Cine4Home will be there: In the last weeks we have had the first device in our studio and were able to test it thouroughly. Like always we will publish a complete test.. But who in advance wants to know our findings/impressions on the weak and strong points of this new high end projector and wants to discuss it is invited. We will be at the event 27 Januar and explain our point of view.


This sort of indicates we will have the test not before the 27th.

(translated from my head, and neither German or English is my natural language, so it might contain some translation 'issues')

The message in German:

seems to be something like:
Also Cine4Home will be there: In the last weeks we have had the first device in our studio and were able to test it thouroughly. Like always we will publish a complete test.. But who in advance wants to know our findings/impressions on the weak and strong points of this new high end projector and wants to discuss it is invited. We will be at the event 27 Januar and explain our point of view.


This sort of indicates we will have the test not before the 27th.

(translated from my head, and neither German or English is my natural language, so it might contain some translation 'issues')

Thanks for the translation. As a marketer, I would think that posting the review ahead of the actual event would in fact generate more interest/traffic around the event, not less. The real star of the event should be the projector demo, not words. Review should be the "lure".

Hopefully, they'll reconsider and post sooner.

We will be at the event 27 Januar and explain our point of view.
I would think this statement means that their review will be released before hand and people will have questions about certain performance factors/measurements and they will further "explain their point of view" at the event.

Do dealers accept exchanges for units that have panel misconvergence or do you have to fix those issues yourself? Also, can you converge the panel yourself if you so wish (convergence issues seemed uniform and manageable)?

Do dealers accept exchanges for units that have panel misconvergence or do you have to fix those issues yourself? Also, can you converge the panel yourself if you so wish (convergence issues seemed uniform and manageable)?

It's user adjustable.

Does anyone know whether or not the 4 'feet' on the botton of the pj have screw holes in the bottom of them? (I know, of course, that the feet screw off.) I.e., can one drill holes in a shelf and bolt the pj down to it (up-right) with screws through the shelf and into the 'feet'?

Does anyone know whether or not the 4 'feet' on the botton of the pj have screw holes in the bottom of them?

They do. You need M5 screws.

They do. You need M5 screws.

Great, thanks Gary. So for up-right mount on a shelf one can just drill holes in the shelf and put the screws through right up into the 'feet'. I wonder if the RS1--since it's for the US market--will use the metric M5 screws or an 'inches' equivalent?

I don't know about JVC, but every other projector I've seen that used metric screws has used them worldwide. They're easy to get at the chain hardware stores like Ace or True Value.

Just wondering if your shelf mounting right side up, why use screws at all?

Just wondering if your shelf mounting right side up, why use screws at all?

I cant speak for millerwill, but the attraction of this for me, if I decide to shelf mount (which I am leaning toward now), is my sub wont rattle the projector out of place on my shelf. Obviously there are other solutions for this, but to mount the projector to the shelf sounds ideal.

Just wondering if your shelf mounting right side up, why use screws at all?

Good question. But in reading pg 51 of the manual, it suggests screwing the pj down to a shelf even if it is mounted up-right (or at least that's how I interpreted what is written there). Maybe they are just being extra cautious. In my case it will be quite easy to do--and since it is a close fit on the shelf, without much room to spare (this pj is BIG!)--I think I will indeed put screws through the bottom of the shelf to secure it.

millerwill,

It looks like you have the same reason to bolt it down as I do - earthquake. I have my G11 hushbox bolted to a shelf and I will do the same with this one...

Jay

millerwill,

It looks like you have the same reason to bolt it down as I do - earthquake. I have my G11 hushbox bolted to a shelf and I will do the same with this one...

Jay

Great point!

Since the HD1 manual doesn't label itself as 'HD1/RS1', I presume that there will be a separate manual for the RS1, right? Has it appeared ahywhere yet?

Can the RS1 accept a 1080p signal via component input?

Can the RS1 accept a 1080p signal via component input?

According to the RS1 Spec Page (http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/specs.jsp?model_id=MDL101681&feature_id=03), no.

This may or may have not been discussed already, but I saw this on the JVC website RS1 specs:

Lamp Power: Normal (170W), High (200W)
* Changing the lamp power will not change the lamp time (lamp life).

This seems to stand in contrast to most other manufacturer's claims on UHP bulbs - high power mode seems to decrease the bulb life. If this is true, why would anyone use eco mode except for on a smaller, high gain screen where 700 lumens might be too bright early in the bulb's life?

This may or may have not been discussed already, but I saw this on the JVC website RS1 specs:

Lamp Power: Normal (170W), High (200W)
* Changing the lamp power will not change the lamp time (lamp life).

This seems to stand in contrast to most other manufacturer's claims on UHP bulbs - high power mode seems to decrease the bulb life. If this is true, why would anyone use eco mode except for on a smaller, high gain screen where 700 lumens might be too bright early in the bulb's life?
Infocus has come out and said the same thing with their latest Play Big series of pj's ( IN72, IN76, IN78). It's not possible and I can't see how any manufacturer can make this claim. I honestly think it's just a way to sell more lamps in order to generate extra profit.

Higher wattage to the electrodes causes them to burn more intensely which in turn gives you more lumens. The electrodes pay a price for this and they will deteriorate at a faster pace. As they burn away, they reach a point where they are too far apart for the arc to bridge the gap and the lamp will fail to ignite.

In my communication with JVC techs in the past couple of days, they tell me that UHP technology has made some big strides regarding color drift with age and life verses power. I'm taking that one on faith, as it may be a field that has factors that I cannot know about. It's kind of like seeing an F-117 fly; even when you see it, you don't believe the thing can possibly fly. Turns out it couldn't without its fly-by-wire flight control system. Okay, that's a stretch... :rolleyes: but you get the idea.

Hopefully, they'll reconsider and post sooner.
Not there yet.. (but only 23rd right now)

Holy crap do I want this thing. It's got the placement flexibility of a Panasonic with countless other benefits.

I haven't been able to read every post, but it looks like Cine4Home measured a 27% decrease in brightness at maximum throw (mine would be about 18 feet from the screen). That's rather good, no? I thought I read that the Mitsubishi HC5000, for example, gets cut by 45% or so at max throw.

Granted I'm a n00b, but I find it astonishing that they could claim no decrease in brightness at all throw distances, and still impressed that real-world measurements only show a 27% decrease. I thought the nature of optics just dictated that one would have to live with certain compromises if one wanted flexible mounting options.

Do you think I'd be OK 18 feet away with a 102" Carada Brilliant White screen?

I haven't been able to read every post, but it looks like Cine4Home measured a 27% decrease in brightness at maximum throw.


Please excuse my non-conforming nature, but I'm going to use different terminology in this question. Think projection angle (PA) instead of throw and therefore narrowest PA = maximum throw. Also, instead of using projector brightness, I'll be using projector lumens.

Assuming the 27% figure is the drop in projector lumens from the widest PA to the narrowest, my question is what does a plot of PA vs. lumens look like for this projector? Is the curve linear or is there a substantial change in slope near the narrowest PA?

Inquiring minds....

In my communication with JVC techs in the past couple of days, they tell me that UHP technology has made some big strides regarding color drift with age and life verses power. I'm taking that one on faith, as it may be a field that has factors that I cannot know about. It's kind of like seeing an F-117 fly; even when you see it, you don't believe the thing can possibly fly. Turns out it couldn't without its fly-by-wire flight control system. Okay, that's a stretch... :rolleyes: but you get the idea.

I would have to agree with this. I see very little change in color over 1000 hours on the current UHP lamps (JVC rates them at 2000 but I think that's a big stretch). Better still, we've replaced a lamp and re-measured and found virtually no difference (after a short "burn in" on the new lamp - 20 hours or so).

I can work on this but would any Chicago people like a private showing of the RS-1 on Feb. 5th or 6th????

I should be able to have Tom Stites there also to answer questions. This would be at a distributor location with one in Elk Grove and one in Chicago.

I have asked and they said yes but would only do it if people would commit.

If there is interest I will make a new thread on this.

Larry

I can work on this but would any Chicago people like a private showing of the RS-1 on Feb. 5th or 6th????

I should be able to have Tom Stites there also to answer questions. This would be at a distributor location with one in Elk Grove and one in Chicago.

I have asked and they said yes but would only do it if people would commit.

If there is interest I will make a new thread on this.

Larry

Larry, where in Chicago? Elk Grove Village is too far for me. I work downtown and live near Joliet, so spend three hours a day commuting.

Mark

Chicago and Sacremento area

Larry

I can work on this but would any Chicago people like a private showing of the RS-1 on Feb. 5th or 6th????

I should be able to have Tom Stites there also to answer questions. This would be at a distributor location with one in Elk Grove and one in Chicago...

Larry

I would be very much interested. Please PM me. Downtown next to one of my favorite restaurants would be the best.

Is there any information on what software and what features will be available for controlling the DLA-RS1 via RS232 serial connections ?

I have much preferred that to using the remote control on my JVC G10.

I realize we won't have motorised focus, zoom, etc. as on previous JVCs, but at least being able to power on and off, switch inputs, adjust brightness, RGB, etc. would be nice. It has been so convenient in the past using the JVC serial control software.

Will the projectors ship with control software for Windows, or will it be downloadable somewhere ?

I am disappointed with the lack of a 12v trigger.

For my current G-15, I use a smallo Sears powerbox that senses current in one 110v line (to the PJ) which then supplies voltage to the other (power the screen). Works pretty well; once the PJ cools off, screen goes up.

Is there a better way to use the RS1 to control a screen, absent a 12v trigger?

MH

originally posted by lkosova
Chicago and Sacremento area

I would be VERY interested in a private showing of the RS-1 in the Sacramento area. Please let me know the place & time.

Thanks!
John

I used the same Sears power switch for my hush box blower. It seems like the most straight forward solution.

Big John,

The showing is in Chicago and the cross street is Sacremeto....sorry for the confusion.

Larry

Is there any information on what software and what features will be available for controlling the DLA-RS1 via RS232 serial connections ?

I have much preferred that to using the remote control on my JVC G10.

I realize we won't have motorised focus, zoom, etc. as on previous JVCs, but at least being able to power on and off, switch inputs, adjust brightness, RGB, etc. would be nice. It has been so convenient in the past using the JVC serial control software.

Will the projectors ship with control software for Windows, or will it be downloadable somewhere ?

According to the HD1 manual, there are RS232 control codes for pretty much every button that is on the remote control, including discrete codes for on/off and sources (sorry, I don't have the link handy, it was posted on the UK forum).

I doubt there will be any kind of control software shipped with Windows, but pretty much any software that lets you send strings across the RS232 line should work.

For my JVC G10, there is software from JVC that not only sends codes to the projector, but gets feedback from the projector to show all the current settings. I think it is called "PSA Ctrl" or something.

This is different than the remote control would do -- where the current settings and menus would overlay your image. It is tough to get a good adjustment on brightness, contrast, RGB, etc. when your movie or test material is almost hidden behind the menus. This is a clear advantage to using RS232 control -- you can see the levels you are setting on a separate screen, the PC's, while watching the effect on the projector.

I live in Sac and would love to come down to Elk Grove on the 4th... will we be able to watch the superbowl on the screen? :) :) :)

Edit: Damn... after reading further up the thread I see you're speaking of Chicago only. The confusion comes from the fact that a suburb of Sacramento, CA, is named Elk Grove.

I was thinking of starting a new thread for this question, but since there are several RS1 related threads, I'm just adding it here. Hopefully it would help others who are in a similar position.

I am on the list to get a RS1, and am planning the wiring for it. Up to now, I've used my trusty Dwin HD-700 and TranScanner combo, hooked via the RGB cable... the only port which was available on the projector. The RS1 on the other hand offers 2 HDMI ports, Component Video, S-Video and Composite video ports.

The sources I am planning to use are: HD Signal via Cable box for local stations, HD signal from DirecTV, FIOS HD (would replace DirecTV when it becomes available in our area later in the year), Playstation 3 for 1080P BluRay and DVD via an upconverting DVD player. I would like to use my Denon AVR-4806 for switching sources, but I'm not sure if it can handle the job yet.

In the mean time, I would like to get the in-wall wiring done, so I have to ask the following questions:


Should I just run one HDMI cable, or should I run a complete set of wires for each of the RS1 connectors?
What if I decide to use a Video Processor?


Thanks for your advise!

-- Mehdi

I was thinking of starting a new thread for this question, but since there are several RS1 related threads, I'm just adding it here. Hopefully it would help others who are in a similar position.

I am on the list to get a RS1, and am planning the wiring for it. Up to now, I've used my trusty Dwin HD-700 and TranScanner combo, hooked via the RGB cable... the only port which was available on the projector. The RS1 on the other hand offers 2 HDMI ports, Component Video, S-Video and Composite video ports.

The sources I am planning to use are: HD Signal via Cable box for local stations, HD signal from DirecTV, FIOS HD (would replace DirecTV when it becomes available in our area later in the year), Playstation 3 for 1080P BluRay and DVD via an upconverting DVD player. I would like to use my Denon AVR-4806 for switching sources, but I'm not sure if it can handle the job yet.

In the mean time, I would like to get the in-wall wiring done, so I have to ask the following questions:


Should I just run one HDMI cable, or should I run a complete set of wires for each of the RS1 connectors?
What if I decide to use a Video Processor?



This is unrelated to the RS1, so you should start a different thread. But do some searches in the Dedicated Theater building forum, and the general forum, because these questions come up all the time.

My recommendation is to run conduit, and worry about the wires later.

-- aaron

I assume that most of you are aware that cine4home will be hosting a public display of the HD1 in Germany on January 27. The HD1 is to be displayed on a 350 cm (140") wide Screen Research screen. This is really interesting, because assuming that the screen material is CP2, this screen has a 0.95 gain. Hopefully observers will comment on adequate brightness despite whatever Ft-L values this HD1/Screen Research combination provides.

I can work on this but would any Chicago people like a private showing of the RS-1 on Feb. 5th or 6th????

I work in Elk Grove Village and if you held it there, I would be very interested. :)

This is really interesting, because assuming that the screen material is CP2, this screen has a 0.95 gain. Hopefully observers will comment on adequate brightness despite whatever Ft-L values this HD1/Screen Research combination provides.VERY interesting - I have a 130" wide SMX that is 1.16 gain. As you mention, it will be interesting to hear the first-hand reports of brightness. If it can light that 140"er up on a CP2, then I will consider my lumen concerns largely satisfied.

The RS1 should behave like a higher lumen output DI equipped projector which has its light output crippled in the majority of scenes due to the DI. Couple this with the very high on-off contrast and I think that the RS1 will look fine even down in the 6-8 Ft-L range provided that the viewing room has excellent control of ambient light and dark walls/ceiling/floor.

But do some searches in the Dedicated Theater building forum, and the general forum, because these questions come up all the time.

My recommendation is to run conduit, and worry about the wires later.

Aaron, I like your recommendation and will do more research in the other section too.

Thanks!

-- Mehdi