A1 and A2 annoying gurgling speech via optical

[ABHD]

When I connect the A1 or A2 to my Sony str-de925 receiver via optical, I get annoying gurgling speech on certain movies( only HD-Dvd format, reg dvd no problems)... the worst case and my test case is The Last Samurai where many areas the distorted dialog makes it unbearable to watch, but other movies have this problem as well but not as bad, including a couple spots I noticed last night on King Kong.

At first I thought it was my A1, then with a firmware upgrade the problem wasn't resolved... Now I picked up an A2 and have the same problem. So I've determined it is my receiver that must be the problem. I figure my receiver is getting old...I got it in 1998 or 99 I beleive, but was trying to hold off on upgrading til HDMI 1.3 receivers came out. Overall the receiver has worked great, and I don't have any problems with audio using regular Dvd format, and even some HD disks works fine, like Corpse Bride and a few others had no audio problems.

Note: this sound problem only happens sparatically with speech dialog as far as I can tell. All the other surround audio sounds amazing. My receiver decodes it as dts. Also, I have tried turning on and off dialog enhancement... no help.

Has anyone else had problems with this? Anybody have any recomendations how to fix this annoying problem? Since I've upgraded to the A2, I'm stuck with optical for now.

Thanks for your help.

[bfdtv]

ABHD,

Does your Sony receiver have 5.1 analog inputs?

[Robert D]

The player converts all the audio to dts (via optical and coax outs) so maybe your receiver has a poor dts decoder. I would hook up the audio via analog inputs to the receiver assuming you have those.

OK I looked and you don't have analog inputs. Seems others have had center channel problems with this receiver http://forumz.tomshardware.com/ce/STR-DE925-Center-ftopict38619.html

Could be a good time to upgrade to a better receiver. I use the Panasonic SA-XR57 a great economical receiver with HDMI in/out. http://products.howstuffworks.com/panasonic-sa-xr57s-seven-channel-digital-receiver-review.htm

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=RetrieveSku&IC=PASAXR57S&kw=PASAXR57S&Q=&O=

http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/productDetail.do?oid=153244&WT.mc_n=67&WT.mc_t=U&cm_ven=COMPARISON%20SHOPPING&cm_cat=PRICEGRABBER&cm_pla=DATAFEED->PRODUCTS&cm_ite=1%20PRODUCT&cm_keycode=67

[ABHD]

Thanks for the help and links!

Yeah, no 5.1 inputs or HDMI, so I guess it's time for an upgrade.

I don't seem to have any problems with the center channel like others mentioned in that forum. Probably the dts decoder like you mentioned. For the most part the audio is fine but every once in a while people suddenly start sounding like robots... distracting and destroys the mood completely.

[Innerloop]

Do you have any similar problems with other sources on your setup? Like Satellite or CableTV feeding stuff to the center?

Have you checked to make sure your speaker isn't blown? Usually dialog is the loudest thing sent to the center channel so if you have a failing speaker cone or something it might start to clip when high volumes hit that channel, which sounds like a "buzzing" sound on louder sounds, so if every time a line of dialog hits a sharp "S" or "P" or something you get a buzzing, take off the grill and make sure the speaker isn't rotting or something.

I had that happen once, speakers don't necessarily last eternally.

But if its HD-DVD only, then that's less likely.

[ABHD]

Nope, doesn't appear to be the speakers. I have a comcast motorola 3412 box using the optical out and it sound great. Also my old sony dvd player, and any thing with DD 5.1 and DTS on reg dvd's sounds great. It only happens on some HD-DVD's, but other HD-dvd's are fine.

What I'm going to try next is switching the optical cable and optical input to make sure it's not just that input that is hosed, or the cable. I'll post back my findings.

[boxwes]

I have the same problem with my Sony DA-555 ES. There was a thread several months ago here on this and several of us with Sony receivers from the 98/99 era all had the gurgling audio issues. I am lucky enough to have analog inputs to get around it, but am planning on doing the upgrade after Christmas.

Don't waste your time or money on the optical cable.

[chucky08016]

Here's a link to the thread that boxwes was referring to.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=734266

Most of us including myself that were having issues concluded that it was the Sony receiver that we were using.

[billymerritt]

I had this problem on my A2 a couple of times already. I had A2 going through Monoprice 5x1 HDMI switcher, will try directly to receiver to see if that could cause it.

[ABHD]

This forum is fantastic! Thanks for all the info everyone! Well at least I know now it's not just my reciever thats having the problem.... looks like a more common problem from the Sony receivers made at that time, and I'll have to replace it.

Now I guess my next step will be to decide what receiver I should upgrade too.

[jxo]

Add me to the list. I have an older sony AVR as well and am experiencing the exact same problems with my new HD A2. No problems at all with standard DVDs. I understand that audio on all HD dvds is sent a higher bit rates and the older Sonys may be choking on it.
I quickly hooked the Tosh up to my son's Onkyo receiver and the problem was gone.
I had problems with MI III, the old Christmas Vacation and the new Eagles Farewell concert. The latter did not have garbeld/distorted dialog but background rumblings and other odd distortions.
This is very valuable information for me. I have the Toshiba connected to a new Zektor switch and it would be a major pain to try to isolate the problem to a particular cable, the Tosh, the Zektor or the sony.
I may bite the bullet and invest in a new receiver but hope it will fix the problem. I don't want to drop 1k or more and have the same issue.

[khwiggins2]

I had the sony str-da55es. I believe the consensus was that Sony did not support the full DTS 1.5Mb data stream. If you use optical out from the HD-DVD player, it encodes the DD+ and TRUE-HD as 1.5MB DTS. You shouldn't notice any problems on SD DVDs with DD or DTS.

Luckily, mine had a mysterious accident, so my wife agreed that we needed a new receiver. We got a Denon AVR-2807 and I have no further issues. I tried both optical and HDMI, with the HDMI sounding much nicer, but the optical did not display the stuttering the Sony did.

[dlhoppe]

"mysterious accident"??? LOL!

[jxo]

....Luckily, mine had a mysterious accident, so my wife agreed that we needed a new receiver. ...

These accidents can be contagious; my Sony is about to suffer the same fate.

[muzz]

These accidents can be contagious; my Sony is about to suffer the same fate.

LMAO

" Oh shiot, man wt!!......... O man, please NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...... arrrrrrrrgggggggggggh.... O no.... I tripped and my drink landed on the AVR..... arrrrrrrrrggggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhh!!!"

That should do it!!

bahahahaha

GL Guys,

EDIT: BTW it sure is funny that the issues described relate to a SONY product!! bahahahah
How convincing!!

m

[Lord Humungus]

When I connect the A1 or A2 to my Sony str-de925 receiver via optical, I get annoying gurgling speech on certain movies( only HD-Dvd format, reg dvd no problems)...

I have exactly the same problem when connection my Toshiba E1 (European version of the A2) to my 8 year old Sony STR-DB-925 receiver. Most HD-DVD's I tested so far suffer more or less of this problem. There's always one or two scenes with garbled dialogue. Always reproducable, even with different audiotracks (i.e. TrueHD or DTS on Batman Begins) and output settings (Bitstream, PCM or PCM downmixed). Funny enough only dialogue sems to be affected. Music, sound effects, etc, all seem fine. My version of the Sony does have analogue inputs, yet the E1 lacks those....(DoH)

I don't doubt the Sony is to blame here so I'm now wondering what to do. Swap the E1 for the the oncoming XE1 (XA2), buy a new receiver, or just put up with it. As it doesn't occur to often (often only one or two line in the whole movie) I'm leaning to the latter option, but only untill I get fed up with it....

[Schlotkins]

My Sony DA-555ES did the same thing. I think we should sue sony... I mean, it clearly says it supports DTS! :)

Anyway, I borrowed my parents Onkyo 502 and the problem went away. Now I'm debating between a Denon 2807, 3806 and an Onky0 for a replacement. Purchasing in 8 days so I better figure it out! :)

Chris

[Mr. Cinema]

I had a similar problem with my old JVC dts receiver. Every sound was distorted. The problem was my receiver couldn't handle the full DTS bitrate. Once I get a new Denon receiver, that problem was solved.

[Sky042]

I'm actually having a similar problem of low/not clear audio from the center chan.
I'm using a HD-A2
Optical connection
and a Kenwood VR-4900 which in it's day was a $2200 reciever only 5 years ago.
it does have 5.1 inputs but my A2 doesn't have the outputs.
I'm actually considering a yamaha RX-V2700 as a replacement.

[tcp100]

I've got the exact same problem with the 555ES and my A2.. Watching Batman Begins tonight, and the scene where he's in the bedroom and the butler wakes him up - sounded almost robotic.

Would be great if anyone found some sort of workaround, but it looks like the ol' 555ES workhorse is on its way out to pasture finally..

[Sky042]

My Sony DA-555ES did the same thing. I think we should sue sony... I mean, it clearly says it supports DTS! :)

Anyway, I borrowed my parents Onkyo 502 and the problem went away. Now I'm debating between a Denon 2807, 3806 and an Onky0 for a replacement. Purchasing in 8 days so I better figure it out! :)

Chris

Was in the same boat trying to decide.
Wound up likely the 3806 better(and it's price was better)
Though I wound up with a deal on a pio elite 82 that I couldn't pass up.

[thebland]

Is the 'gurgling' occuring over coax digital as well?

[mortgagepanic]

I've got the intermittent distorted dialogue problem as well. Feeding my Onkyo HT-R500 Revceiver via TOSLink from the Tosh A2

[chucky08016]

Is the 'gurgling' occuring over coax digital as well?

Yes it is. Back in Oct.2006 I tried both coax and optical and same problem. Since then I bought a cheap Pioneer receiver to hold me over until a Preamp or Receiver that can decode all of the new audio formats are available... which should be this year.

[DavidHir]

I have the HD-A2 connected via digital optical to a Yamaha HTR-5890 receiver. I'm experiencing no gurgling, but the volume on every HD DVD is much lower than it is with SD DVD. I have to turn up the volume at 10 db or more to get it loud enough. I still haven't done the firmware update.

[Paul Logan]

Firmware update 1.2 on the A2 does not correct this problem unfortunately. I downloaded yesterday and still have this issue on several hd dvds.

[LoStrings]

I have the same issues with the center channel dialog gurgling. I've updated to 1.3 firmware (Robert from VE said that this might fix the problem) but no go...I'm using an older Technics DD, DTS processor. Has anyone figured out a fix for this problem?

[Glenn54]

My Sunfire TheaterGrand did the same thing via both Coax and Toslink digital. I wound up Ebaying it and moved up to the TG-2 for 5.1 analog inputs.

[grif32]

I had the same problem until I realized I had the sound from my TV turned up and with the sound out of the Onkyo Reciever on as well. Once i turned the sound on the TV off all was better :). There was an echo as well.

I know sad but didnt even think about what could have caused it until it hit me.

Chris

[khwiggins2]

With analog connections, you need to watch the LFE channel. You will probably need to increase it 10db.

[Vern Dias]

Has anyone figured out a fix for this problem? This is receiver problem with the receiver messing up on full rate DTS. The only way you are going to fix it is to replace the receiver or use analog connections.

Vern

[Tim Sly]

My 8 year old AVR65 Harman Kardon receiver has the same problem with the garbled dialog. That is what happens when they make new technology. Looks like we have some more upgrading in the future.

If you have the analog inputs, like the HK, You could go with the HD-A20 HD DVD player which has 5.1 analog outputs and it is around $459 at Amazon.com

Thanks to this forum I found out why I have garbled sound on this new HD DVD format. I thought I had a defective player. :eek:

[gamerheaven]

The only way you are going to fix it is to replace the receiver or use analog connections.

5.1 analog? Is this where it simulates 5.1, or is it actually accepting/outputting 5.1? And, will a Denon AVR-487 do this?

[ChrisFB]

Damn. So what do I have - a 555ES. And just to make sure I have absolutely no doubt there's not one or two but many people in this 2 page thread with my receiver dealing with the same issue. Analog ins, here we go. To bad that kills me on the A2. Stupid Sony budget DTS.

[parkds]

Sad to see that my good old Sony str-de925 is approaching the end of its life. I am having the same issue as everyone else here with garbled audio. I am also finding it mainly affecting dialog, but recently found one HD-DVD (One Six Right) where the music and dialog are garbled. Oh well, time to save LOTS more pennies.

[JLatko]

Wow. Thanks everyone for saving me more debugging time. I too have a late 90's Sony receiver and a Toshiba HD-A2, connected via optical cable. I notice the same distorted, echo-filled spoken audio problems on most HD-DVDs (Road Warrior, Matrix Trilogy), especially evident on commentary tracks (Blade Runner). I have no problem with the optical output from my Comcast cable box connected to the same receiver, so it points to the HD-DVD DTS signal being too complex for my older DTS receiver. Looks like I have no choice but to upgrade to a newer Home Theater receiver for the 21st century. Have any of you upgraded with success yet? What affordable receivers are out there with True-HD and DTS decoders that work well with next-gen players, but also have plenty of digital inputs to support 4 or 5 digital devices? Thanks,
J

[JOHNnDENVER]

You could just get an A3 which puts out DD for advanced audio tracks.

[levansoft]

I have the same problem with my Sony DA-333 ES. I tried two A2 players that I have. Both had the same problem. I updated to the latest firmware. It didn't help. Thanks to this thread, I know that I am not alone. It's time to upgrade the Amp.

[Poolrad]

It's the Sony receivers, they do a very poor job with a 1.5mb DTS core feed. They gurgle the vocals a lot. I replaced my 333ES with an Onkyo 805 and haven't looked back..

Time to replace those P.O.S Sony's..

[Tim Sly]

It is not just Sony. My 8 year old Harman Kardon had the same issue. I bought the Onkyo 705 which has 3 HDMI inputs and decodes all the new sound formats.
I may have to get an A3 so I could use the old receiver in the family room as a secondary system.

[mike350]

Does anyone know if this is a Blu-Ray issue as well? Don't want to buy a new reciever and a Blu-ray disc player if just switching DVD players will fix the problem. I have exactly the same problem with my Sony DA-333ES and the HD-A2,

Mike

[hovbuild]

I have a Rotel that has the same problem with my A2.

[virusc]

Have Citation 5.0 preamp with problem. This sucks. I have no plans on upgrading this yet. What a stupid idea that was obviously untested as most older DTS decoders can't handle that bitrate. Why can't they have a firmware update to knock it down to 1.4 or something. I'm sure thats all it would take to fix the issue.

[JOHNnDENVER]

Your AVR's and your Processors suck at 1.5mb DTS and some are gripe'n about the player needing to be fixed?

Not sure what else to say on the issue really.

[angelo913]

With analog connections, you need to watch the LFE channel. You will probably need to increase it 10db.

LFE needing 10dB increase depends on so many factors and this general rule-of-thumb may work for some as a "lazy" fix.

I have both Optical and 5.1 Analog connects from the A1 to my HTR-5960 receiver. Both audio connections are both calibrated to the same dB levels, so when I switch on-the-fly between Optical and 5.1 Analog loudness is the same but, 5.1 Analog aways sounds fuller and clearer compared to Optical.

...Angelo

[Tim Sly]

Does anyone know if this is a Blu-Ray issue as well? Don't want to buy a new reciever and a Blu-ray disc player if just switching DVD players will fix the problem. I have exactly the same problem with my Sony DA-333ES and the HD-A2,

Mike

The newer Toshiba HD DVD players (like the A3) convert the high res audio to Dolby Digital which would work fine in your legacy receivers. The A1 and A2 players convert it to high bitrate DTS which is a problem with these receivers.
I don't know how the Blu-ray players make this conversion.